WEBVTT - False Positive ft. Steve Deace 0:00:00.240 --> 0:00:03.760 It has been one hundred seventy days since fifteen days 0:00:03.800 --> 0:00:05.920 to slow the spread, So it seems like good at 0:00:05.960 --> 0:00:08.520 time as any to take stock where we are now, 0:00:08.760 --> 0:00:13.200 how the coronavirus pandemic stands, and most importantly, when we 0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:16.400 will be able to reopen our country. This is Verdict 0:00:16.440 --> 0:00:25.320 with Ted Cruz. Welcome back to Verdict with Ted Cruz. 0:00:25.400 --> 0:00:28.479 I'm Michael Knowles, joined as ever by the Senator and 0:00:28.880 --> 0:00:33.040 a very special guest, Steve Dace of the Steve Dace 0:00:33.280 --> 0:00:36.360 Show over at the Blaze. I'm sure you've seen him 0:00:36.400 --> 0:00:39.680 everywhere and he's a longtime friend, not just of the show, 0:00:39.920 --> 0:00:43.120 but of Senator Cruz as well. Steve, Welcome, It's good 0:00:43.120 --> 0:00:45.159 to have you. You know, Steve and I have spent 0:00:45.840 --> 0:00:50.040 thousands of hours together on the road traveling. I gotta 0:00:50.080 --> 0:00:55.720 tell you if Steve is brilliant, he is a passionate conservative. 0:00:56.280 --> 0:00:58.400 But I gotta tell y'all so there may be no 0:00:58.440 --> 0:01:01.080 one in the country who is my phone up with 0:01:01.160 --> 0:01:06.680 more texts during this whole pandemic than Steve at every stage, 0:01:06.760 --> 0:01:11.319 because because he has been diving in from the beginning 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:14.400 of this pandemic to the numbers to what the numbers 0:01:14.480 --> 0:01:18.319 mean to what the testing tells us, to what the 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:21.080 antibody numbers tell us, to what the impacts of the 0:01:21.120 --> 0:01:24.400 shutdown tell us. And so Steve and I have talked 0:01:24.400 --> 0:01:28.000 about many, many issues at great length, but but I 0:01:28.040 --> 0:01:31.960 think this pod in particular, it's it's it's valuable to 0:01:32.319 --> 0:01:35.760 get in to what's going on with the pandemic and 0:01:36.120 --> 0:01:39.319 the country right now. So I know that there are lies, 0:01:39.840 --> 0:01:43.320 damned lies and statistics, and everybody seems to have their 0:01:43.360 --> 0:01:46.480 own statistics on this pandemic. And even I try to 0:01:46.560 --> 0:01:48.880 keep my head into it, I can't really make heads 0:01:48.920 --> 0:01:51.080 or tails of it. I don't know what to believe. So, Steve, 0:01:51.560 --> 0:01:54.560 where do we stand on the coronavirus? I think if 0:01:54.640 --> 0:01:57.400 I could choose one point for us to center the 0:01:57.440 --> 0:02:01.160 conversation on, it would really come down to what we've 0:02:01.240 --> 0:02:04.680 learned about our testing metric guys, because it goes to 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:06.520 the heart of why we You know, none of us 0:02:06.560 --> 0:02:09.800 are epidemiologists. We're all fairly intelligent guys, but it's not 0:02:09.880 --> 0:02:12.840 our field of expertise. And so I like to keep 0:02:12.880 --> 0:02:17.280 the conversation where it impacts public policy as much as possible, 0:02:17.320 --> 0:02:20.040 because that is each of our areas of expertise. And 0:02:20.120 --> 0:02:22.239 if you look at the number one concern for why 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:25.400 we did these shutdowns across the country, it's because we 0:02:25.400 --> 0:02:28.640 were concerned about masses of asymptomatic spread that all kinds 0:02:28.639 --> 0:02:32.280 of people who were otherwise healthy would get the virus, 0:02:32.320 --> 0:02:36.080 go home, infect grandma, grandpa, and or have these mass 0:02:36.280 --> 0:02:38.600 spread or events and then go home. And then we 0:02:38.639 --> 0:02:41.200 get to an R two R three situation. Right now, 0:02:41.280 --> 0:02:44.239 let me stop, stop you right there and just ask 0:02:44.320 --> 0:02:47.040 for folks listening, what is an R two R three 0:02:47.120 --> 0:02:49.840 What does what does that mean? It means the rate 0:02:49.919 --> 0:02:53.000 of who's infected or how many people you infect based 0:02:53.040 --> 0:02:56.440 on who's infected. Right, So does two people get infected 0:02:56.480 --> 0:02:59.480 for every person that's infected, three people, etc. The goal 0:02:59.480 --> 0:03:01.040 in a paid MC is to get to R one 0:03:01.080 --> 0:03:04.080 and then hopefully to R zero. Okay. And so if 0:03:04.120 --> 0:03:07.080 you go way back to March twenty sixth, there's a 0:03:07.080 --> 0:03:09.639 guy that we used to think was brilliant named Didier 0:03:09.880 --> 0:03:13.960 Rayalt was considered the leading infectious disease expert in the 0:03:14.000 --> 0:03:17.000 world until March twelfth, and that's when he had the 0:03:17.080 --> 0:03:22.360 unfortunate circumstance of having President Trump site positively and affirmatively 0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:26.520 his research on hydroxy chloroquin as a treatment for COVID nineteen. 0:03:26.560 --> 0:03:29.360 So all over the world, yes, well it was for 0:03:29.480 --> 0:03:31.600 him at the time. All over the world. We were 0:03:31.639 --> 0:03:34.880 beginning to use hydroxy chloroquin until it was orange man 0:03:34.920 --> 0:03:37.440 bad and now suddenly we could not write well. On 0:03:37.520 --> 0:03:41.840 March twenty sixth, he issued a piece on PCR testing 0:03:42.240 --> 0:03:44.400 for COVID nineteen and if you go back to the 0:03:44.440 --> 0:03:47.920 first stars, the World Health Organization was very concerned about 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:51.320 the amount of false positives with PCR testing because of 0:03:51.320 --> 0:03:54.560 how sensitive they were, and they wanted two positives before 0:03:54.600 --> 0:03:59.120 they would report. And so a PCR test is the 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:02.960 test that's the it's used most frequently. It's the one 0:04:03.000 --> 0:04:05.000 where they stick the thing way up your nose and 0:04:05.040 --> 0:04:06.720 it feels like it's in the back of your brain, 0:04:06.840 --> 0:04:11.280 and it takes often a couple of days or even 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:14.000 a week or two in some circumstances to get the 0:04:14.040 --> 0:04:18.640 result back correct. It's a great testing module. They're very sensitive, 0:04:18.880 --> 0:04:21.920 they're very accurate, but like any other algorithm, it comes 0:04:21.960 --> 0:04:24.040 down to what do you program it for the setting 0:04:24.080 --> 0:04:26.719 that you want. And so back on March twenty sixth, 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:30.680 Rail put out a paper in France saying, hey, what 0:04:30.880 --> 0:04:35.640 we're finding is when we get beyond thirty cts, all right, 0:04:35.720 --> 0:04:39.000 which is cycle thresholds, all right, meaning how many times 0:04:39.000 --> 0:04:41.760 they have to zero in on a sample before they 0:04:41.760 --> 0:04:43.680 detect a virus, like when you're zooming in on something 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:47.039 on your phone or your computer. Okay, when we have 0:04:47.120 --> 0:04:50.400 to zoom zoom beyond thirty times, these people are not 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:54.320 they're not contagious, they're probably not infected. He even in 0:04:54.360 --> 0:04:57.120 his papery refers to them as quote viral artifacts. And 0:04:57.120 --> 0:04:59.520 we all know what an artifact is. It's something that's 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:02.200 long since gone. It's a remnant of something that's long 0:05:02.240 --> 0:05:05.840 since dead. Right, And so he recommended that no one 0:05:06.000 --> 0:05:08.680 set their PCR tests above a cycle threshold or a 0:05:08.720 --> 0:05:12.440 CT of thirty three, and recommended thirty for whatever reasons. 0:05:12.480 --> 0:05:14.120 And we don't know the answer to this, and this 0:05:14.200 --> 0:05:16.120 is probably where it becomes your job as a senator 0:05:16.160 --> 0:05:19.839 to help us find out our CDC and CDC like 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:24.840 institutions across the world decided to set their sensitivity levels 0:05:25.000 --> 0:05:28.599 anywhere from thirty five to forty. In our country, it's 0:05:28.680 --> 0:05:31.120 thirty seven to forty. And so what the New York 0:05:31.160 --> 0:05:33.760 Times found when they did this survey across the country 0:05:34.000 --> 0:05:36.400 is that if your state is at a thirty seven 0:05:36.520 --> 0:05:40.000 or at a forty, anywhere from forty to ninety percent 0:05:40.520 --> 0:05:44.239 of our positive test are false positives because these people 0:05:44.240 --> 0:05:47.440 are either asymptomatic to the point they're not contagious, they're 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:50.599 not contagious at all, or it's a viral artifact. We're 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:52.960 picking up a remnant of an exposure that just is 0:05:53.000 --> 0:05:56.120 no longer any kind of a live culture. Well, I 0:05:56.160 --> 0:05:58.599 can't begin to express what that means from a public 0:05:58.960 --> 0:06:01.880 is Steve Steven Let me let me stop you for 0:06:01.880 --> 0:06:04.320 a second, because I want to underscore something that you 0:06:04.400 --> 0:06:06.640 mentioned there, but that a lot of folks listening and 0:06:06.680 --> 0:06:11.400 watching may not know. It would be easy for some 0:06:11.520 --> 0:06:15.520 skeptics perhaps to dismiss the three of us as crazy 0:06:15.600 --> 0:06:19.560 right wingers. But but but you mentioned The New York Times, 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:22.280 which I think it's fair to say, whether or not 0:06:22.360 --> 0:06:25.200 we're crazy right wingers, the New York Times is not 0:06:25.320 --> 0:06:27.800 a crazy right wing institution. I don't think that's going 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:31.080 too far out on a limb to say that. And 0:06:31.160 --> 0:06:35.039 The New York Times wrote a stunning article just a 0:06:35.080 --> 0:06:39.360 few days ago that that lays out exactly what you're saying. So, 0:06:39.360 --> 0:06:43.120 so if you're skeptical of what you're hearing right now, 0:06:43.160 --> 0:06:45.400 I'm going to say something I have never said before 0:06:45.440 --> 0:06:47.760 and probably will never say again. Go look up the 0:06:47.760 --> 0:06:50.600 New York Times. Go read the article from the New 0:06:50.680 --> 0:06:55.520 York Times. And by the way, if the New York 0:06:55.520 --> 0:06:59.120 Times and Steve Dace and Cruise and Knolls are all agreeing, 0:06:59.800 --> 0:07:02.800 that may actually be in the Book of Revelations a 0:07:02.880 --> 0:07:07.720 sign of the end times, I think so. And by 0:07:07.760 --> 0:07:09.840 the way, the way it was reported in the New 0:07:09.920 --> 0:07:12.760 York Times seemed to be this kind of stunning revelation 0:07:12.960 --> 0:07:14.760 that you could have up to ninety percent of people 0:07:14.880 --> 0:07:16.560 who are not contagious. And I think that's how a 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:18.000 lot of people took it. It's how I took it. 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:19.960 But Steve, it seems to me what you're saying is 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:22.960 this was built into the testing from the beginning, that 0:07:23.080 --> 0:07:27.120 by making the tests so hyper sensitive beyond what would 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:30.320 be the usual convention, that you were setting yourself up 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:33.120 for this kind of scenario. Now, this is where from 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:35.480 a public policy standpoint, we have to get into what 0:07:35.560 --> 0:07:37.640 was the motivation for this And if you want to 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:40.119 give everyone the maximum benefited it out back in March. 0:07:40.160 --> 0:07:43.720 It is a novel coronavirus. Now, it's not a novel virus. 0:07:43.760 --> 0:07:47.280 We have been studying coronaviruses for seventy years. The common 0:07:47.320 --> 0:07:50.120 cold is one of the coronaviruses, for example. But it 0:07:50.200 --> 0:07:51.680 was the first time we had seen one of these 0:07:51.760 --> 0:07:54.480 mutate from animal to animal to animal to human and 0:07:54.600 --> 0:07:57.280 behave like this. And we also understood that we couldn't 0:07:57.320 --> 0:07:59.880 trust China's data. So if we all went into this saying, 0:08:00.240 --> 0:08:03.040 let's be hyper cautious, We're still in the cold flu 0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:05.360 season anyway. There's not a lot going on in this 0:08:05.400 --> 0:08:09.680 country in March anyway, except for spring breakers, so let's 0:08:09.720 --> 0:08:13.000 be hyper sensitive about this. Fine, But why we have 0:08:13.080 --> 0:08:16.160 continued to do this now for five for six months? 0:08:16.520 --> 0:08:18.680 You know, there was an interesting there's an interesting situation 0:08:18.720 --> 0:08:21.240 happening at the University of Alabama as we speak. Last 0:08:21.280 --> 0:08:25.119 I heard they have reported twelve hundred positive cases since 0:08:25.120 --> 0:08:27.640 the students returned. But news we went and did a 0:08:27.720 --> 0:08:30.360 survey of these cases and found almost all of them 0:08:30.360 --> 0:08:34.640 were asymptomatic and there were zero hospitalizations. LSU and Clemson, 0:08:34.679 --> 0:08:37.160 the top two teams in college football last year, when 0:08:37.160 --> 0:08:39.680 they brought the student athletes back to campus in June 0:08:39.679 --> 0:08:44.080 and started testing, they had fifty four combined positives, all 0:08:44.120 --> 0:08:49.440 almost all asymptomatic, zero hospitalizations. So how so that actually 0:08:49.480 --> 0:08:52.920 dovetails with the New York Times report, meaning that because 0:08:52.960 --> 0:08:55.439 we have this case demit going on right now and 0:08:55.760 --> 0:08:58.840 which we're creating so many cases, that's not we're doing 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:01.520 too much testing. I love the fact we're doing too 0:09:01.600 --> 0:09:04.240 much testing because it shows that the virus is actually 0:09:04.280 --> 0:09:07.040 not as strong or as lethal as we originally feared 0:09:07.040 --> 0:09:09.720 back in March. But there's a difference between too much 0:09:09.840 --> 0:09:13.959 testing and too many cases. We had sixty million cases 0:09:14.000 --> 0:09:16.839 of H one N one guys when the Obama administration 0:09:16.920 --> 0:09:20.040 finally decided to cut off the testing because they it 0:09:20.160 --> 0:09:22.920 wasn't going anywhere. This is what we're doing now, and 0:09:23.520 --> 0:09:26.240 we've got to realize what is our ultimate metric to 0:09:26.280 --> 0:09:29.840 reopen the country. When deaths plummeted around Memorial Day weekend, 0:09:29.880 --> 0:09:31.840 we were told, yeah, but then the cases we're too high. 0:09:32.120 --> 0:09:34.840 Well now we've had six straight weeks of cases going down, 0:09:35.040 --> 0:09:37.400 and we're being told, well, now now it's about deaths. 0:09:37.480 --> 0:09:40.560 We need a defined metric of what it is that 0:09:40.640 --> 0:09:43.920 actually says we're beating this thing, and I'll leap more. 0:09:44.160 --> 0:09:46.960 Go ahead, Well, Steve, you know I'm here in Los 0:09:46.960 --> 0:09:50.880 Angeles and in California. The new metric for reopening, to 0:09:50.960 --> 0:09:53.680 be almost fully reopened, is that you've got to get 0:09:53.679 --> 0:09:57.440 down to a two percent rate of positive tests. So 0:09:57.559 --> 0:09:59.920 if we have this issue of the tests that you're 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:02.480 describing and that the New York Times is describing, then 0:10:02.640 --> 0:10:04.520 then you're in a situation where it looks it looks 0:10:04.520 --> 0:10:07.440 like we're never gonna right. Last week, Los Angeles County 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:11.160 was at its lowest rate for hospitalizations since April second. 0:10:11.840 --> 0:10:15.199 Nationwide for COVID symptoms, we are at the lowest rate 0:10:15.200 --> 0:10:19.319 of hospitalization since March twenty first. Nationwide, we are below 0:10:19.360 --> 0:10:23.199 two percent of er visits are for COVID like symptoms. Now, guys, 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:27.160 I ask you without not a therapeutic, a meaningful vaccine, 0:10:27.600 --> 0:10:30.880 Without a meaningful vaccine, and since we all since now 0:10:30.920 --> 0:10:34.200 apparently the natural herd immunity that saved human civilization from 0:10:34.240 --> 0:10:37.319 plagues for six thousand years is now suddenly voodoo. So 0:10:37.400 --> 0:10:40.560 without without herd immunity and without a meaningful vaccine, in 0:10:40.640 --> 0:10:43.160 a nation of three hundred and thirty one million. How 0:10:43.160 --> 0:10:45.360 do we do better than less than two percent of 0:10:45.640 --> 0:10:48.480 er visits for COVID? Wh When are the numbers low enough? 0:10:48.520 --> 0:10:51.080 I think that's the question instant. And let me drill 0:10:51.160 --> 0:10:54.760 down a little bit in the testing information you're talking about, 0:10:54.760 --> 0:10:57.720 and what's in this New York Times article, which is 0:10:58.400 --> 0:11:04.000 we're not saying that COVID isn't real, that it isn't serious, 0:11:04.120 --> 0:11:07.679 and and if you're very elderly, if you've got serious 0:11:08.400 --> 0:11:15.160 other health conditions, COVID can be lethal. But for a 0:11:15.160 --> 0:11:18.400 great many people who are not elderly, a great many 0:11:18.440 --> 0:11:23.640 people who don't have other serious health ailments, the fatality 0:11:23.760 --> 0:11:27.520 rate for COVID is much much much lower. And the 0:11:27.640 --> 0:11:30.840 point you're emphasizing here, and it's actually something as you 0:11:30.880 --> 0:11:32.920 read the New York Times article that was really stunning, 0:11:33.760 --> 0:11:38.480 is the testing is producing a massive number of false positives, 0:11:38.480 --> 0:11:44.480 over ninety percent. And these false positives are people. You know, 0:11:44.520 --> 0:11:46.520 it's worth drilling down a little bit at what it 0:11:46.559 --> 0:11:49.320 means if the test is said at thirty seven or 0:11:49.360 --> 0:11:52.520 at forty, that's that. I like the analogy of sort 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:55.400 of zooming in, zooming in zooming in So that's super 0:11:55.520 --> 0:11:59.560 zoomed in, so it detects a little bit of virus 0:11:59.559 --> 0:12:03.120 in you, but not much, not enough virus typically to 0:12:03.160 --> 0:12:09.840 make you sick. And interestingly, and really importantly, not enough 0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:13.480 virus probably, although we're still learning how this operates, but 0:12:13.600 --> 0:12:16.440 not enough virus very possibly, let me put it that way, 0:12:16.960 --> 0:12:21.600 not enough virus very possibly to be contagious. And this 0:12:21.800 --> 0:12:24.880 insight is important because if you want to stop a pandemic, 0:12:24.920 --> 0:12:28.160 what you want to focus on is people who are contagious. 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:30.760 You want to stop someone, even if they're healthy, from 0:12:30.840 --> 0:12:34.400 giving it to someone else who's very vulnerable. And if 0:12:34.400 --> 0:12:38.240 the vast majority of these false positives are not having 0:12:38.240 --> 0:12:41.520 symptoms and not contagious, it means we're focusing our energy 0:12:41.559 --> 0:12:45.840 the wrong place rather than directly on the people that 0:12:45.920 --> 0:12:51.240 actually have a significant amount of virus, a significant viral 0:12:51.280 --> 0:12:56.440 loading their body where they could well be symptomatic and 0:12:56.520 --> 0:12:58.760 getting sick and they could well be contagious. Is that 0:12:58.800 --> 0:13:04.240 am I characterizing that fairly? Steve, you nailed it. You 0:13:04.320 --> 0:13:05.959 nailed its, Senator. And then this goes back to the 0:13:06.040 --> 0:13:10.280 beginning of the lockdowns, where we didn't secure America's nursing 0:13:10.280 --> 0:13:12.880 homes up until about the end of July, something like 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:16.280 forty five percent of all COVID deaths in America had 0:13:16.320 --> 0:13:19.640 taken place in a long term care facility. Gentlemen, only 0:13:19.720 --> 0:13:22.439 zero point six percent of Americans live in a long 0:13:22.559 --> 0:13:26.520 term healthcare facility. So we didn't lock down the vulnerable 0:13:27.000 --> 0:13:30.319 because we put in this incredible effort to lock everybody 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:33.800 else down, and it was over the sphere of asymptomatic spread. 0:13:34.000 --> 0:13:36.520 The largest contact tracing study that was done in this 0:13:36.559 --> 0:13:40.720 world so far was about two weeks ago, over five cases. 0:13:40.880 --> 0:13:43.880 Eight percent of them they could trace back to some 0:13:44.000 --> 0:13:47.640 form of asymptomatic spread, eight percent out of over three 0:13:47.720 --> 0:13:52.680 thousand cases. So we made this huge investment. We went essentially, 0:13:52.679 --> 0:13:54.719 we went out were like it, We went honey with 0:13:54.760 --> 0:13:57.960 mice with an elephant gun. We made this huge investment 0:13:58.000 --> 0:14:02.120 in locking everyone down over the canarative asymptomatic spread and 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:04.720 didn't protect the most of vulnerable among us. If I'm 0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:07.600 elderly in Alabama, why are we testing all these students 0:14:07.600 --> 0:14:10.240 at Alabama? What are we why are we protecting well 0:14:10.280 --> 0:14:14.320 and Steve? You know, you know it's interesting that I 0:14:14.360 --> 0:14:18.120 can tell you firsthand. I've seen how the understanding of 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:23.640 doctors and scientists and epidimimologists about this disease has changed 0:14:23.720 --> 0:14:26.480 and been uncertain, which is Michael and I were observing 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.880 earlier today that it was back in March, actually on 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:34.000 the Verdict podcast where we did a podcast from the 0:14:34.040 --> 0:14:37.440 stage at Sepack with Ronald McDaniel, the head of the RNC, 0:14:38.280 --> 0:14:40.640 and we did it live. It was a fun episode 0:14:40.720 --> 0:14:45.280 at Spack, and you'll recall at Spack Michael and I 0:14:45.360 --> 0:14:50.400 both encountered an individual who subsequently tested positive and was symptomatic. 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:55.000 He got he got ill. And in the wake of 0:14:55.040 --> 0:14:58.680 that that that's when I decided initially to self quarantine. 0:14:59.080 --> 0:15:02.760 And this is right the beginning of when COVID was 0:15:02.840 --> 0:15:07.280 starting to become a meaningful issue in the US, and 0:15:07.400 --> 0:15:12.720 the physicians all told me, if you're asymptomatic, and if 0:15:12.760 --> 0:15:15.360 the person was not actively sick when you encountered him, 0:15:15.960 --> 0:15:18.640 you don't have a concern, you don't need to quarantine, 0:15:18.880 --> 0:15:22.080 You're fine. And I ended up decide I'm going to 0:15:22.160 --> 0:15:27.320 stay home to protect everyone else around. But what's interesting is, 0:15:27.360 --> 0:15:29.600 having seen the months that have gone on, I have 0:15:29.720 --> 0:15:35.400 seen the experts at CDC say categorically, asymptomatic people cannot 0:15:35.440 --> 0:15:38.000 transmit it, which is what they told me in March. 0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:41.200 Categorically too, there was a period of time where they 0:15:41.200 --> 0:15:44.440 were focused on, Okay, the whole worry is asymptomatic, and 0:15:44.480 --> 0:15:47.160 I have to admit that felt a little weird, a 0:15:47.240 --> 0:15:51.600 weird focus. And then we seem to be moving back 0:15:51.640 --> 0:15:55.480 into an area of a greater common sense that we 0:15:55.560 --> 0:16:00.760 need to focus on who's actually seriously contagious. And you know, 0:16:00.840 --> 0:16:04.840 as you were talking about nursing homes, here's a question 0:16:04.880 --> 0:16:09.480 for you, Steve. Can you think of a more catastrophically 0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:14.320 damaging public health decision than the public policy of the 0:16:14.320 --> 0:16:17.680 New York State government and Governor Cuomo, who was just 0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:22.880 lionized at the DNC then his policies of sending people 0:16:22.880 --> 0:16:28.040 into nursing homes who were who were sick with COVID 0:16:28.120 --> 0:16:31.120 and were contagious, and the incredible death told that that 0:16:31.440 --> 0:16:35.080 resulted from that. I cannot, And Ted, I gotta tell you, 0:16:35.440 --> 0:16:38.080 I'm pretty cynical, as you well know, this is the 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:41.200 worst gas lighting I've ever seen. I mean, this is 0:16:41.600 --> 0:16:45.640 what the retconning of Cuomo's record where this is concerned. 0:16:45.800 --> 0:16:49.320 I mean, we're sitting here the early September and right 0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:51.520 now if New York was its own country, it would 0:16:51.520 --> 0:16:54.400 still be a sixth worst country in the world for 0:16:54.520 --> 0:16:57.840 COVID nineteen death like the seventh worst country in the 0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:01.080 world for COVID cases per one million. Still about one 0:17:01.120 --> 0:17:04.159 out of every five deaths in America from COVID occurred 0:17:04.560 --> 0:17:08.240 in New York or New Jersey. And and so the 0:17:08.600 --> 0:17:11.000 way that this has been retcon and we've been gas 0:17:11.119 --> 0:17:13.119 lighted that he's some kind of hero. And you look 0:17:13.160 --> 0:17:15.440 at a guy like Ron DeSantis in Florida, for example, 0:17:15.680 --> 0:17:18.359 where he's got a larger population, he's got a larger 0:17:18.440 --> 0:17:23.520 elderly population, and his CFR is lower than the countries 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:26.560 a case fatality rate which is easy to divide, which 0:17:26.680 --> 0:17:28.800 is just simply the amount of cases divided by the 0:17:28.840 --> 0:17:32.159 amount of people who who sadly died, and it's one 0:17:32.200 --> 0:17:35.639 point nine percent in Florida, below the national average, and 0:17:36.080 --> 0:17:38.680 the one in New York is seven point one percent. 0:17:38.760 --> 0:17:41.320 So he's almost seven times lower than the one in 0:17:41.359 --> 0:17:44.720 New York, with the second largest elderly population per capita 0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:47.359 in the country. And he gets ripped as some kind 0:17:47.400 --> 0:17:50.520 of a grim raper and Cuomo gets elevated. So what 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:53.399 did New York do wrong, and what did New Jersey 0:17:53.480 --> 0:17:55.560 do wrong? What New York did wrong? He is there, 0:17:55.680 --> 0:17:58.080 and there is a debate about whether this came from 0:17:58.080 --> 0:18:02.159 the fence. There is a bureau that did recommend that 0:18:02.440 --> 0:18:05.359 nursing homes because they were concerned coming off the Imperial 0:18:05.480 --> 0:18:08.520 College and especially the IHMME surveys, that we were going 0:18:08.560 --> 0:18:12.320 to overload the hospitals. There was a memo that suggested 0:18:12.359 --> 0:18:15.960 that states could take a look. Some minor bureaucracy you've 0:18:15.960 --> 0:18:18.639 probably never heard of, did put out a memo suggesting 0:18:18.680 --> 0:18:21.880 that states take a look at the possibility of reinserting 0:18:22.000 --> 0:18:25.600 COVID infected patients back into nursing homes if they weren't 0:18:25.640 --> 0:18:30.280 immediately in danger of perishing, because they were concerned about 0:18:30.520 --> 0:18:33.520 ICU overload, all right. And so six states took the 0:18:33.600 --> 0:18:36.119 lead on this. Five of them were governed by Democrats, 0:18:36.359 --> 0:18:39.200 and then there was Massachusetts, which as a Republican governor 0:18:39.280 --> 0:18:42.440 who's basically a Democrat. All right. New York was the 0:18:42.520 --> 0:18:44.200 one that took the lead out of these six states. 0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:46.200 And if you look at the death rate in these 0:18:46.280 --> 0:18:49.480 six states that made made this decision compared to the 0:18:49.560 --> 0:18:52.960 rest of the country, it's really just not even close. 0:18:53.040 --> 0:18:55.880 And what they did is they brought a bomb into 0:18:55.920 --> 0:18:59.000 their nursing homes. And if nursing homes or anything they are, 0:18:59.400 --> 0:19:03.320 they are gets of autoimmune deficiencies. Yeah, you're talking about 0:19:03.320 --> 0:19:05.720 the elderly obviously, And so they brought them in and 0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:09.080 re exposed them to COVID with these reinsertions of these 0:19:09.160 --> 0:19:12.240 COVID patients. And there are some estimate. Phil Kirpin's a 0:19:12.280 --> 0:19:15.159 phenomenal researcher out there. He estimates that it could be 0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:18.239 twenty thousand people in New York died in New York 0:19:18.359 --> 0:19:20.840 nursing homes. The AP has been passed pointed out on 0:19:20.960 --> 0:19:23.880 numerous occasions that the numbers that Cuomo and his stand 0:19:23.920 --> 0:19:26.480 are putting out are false and inaccurate. And the other 0:19:26.600 --> 0:19:28.919 day Cuomo said, well, you know, it's probably gonna take 0:19:28.920 --> 0:19:31.359 tim arow November fifth or so thrust to get an 0:19:31.359 --> 0:19:34.440 accurate account. Gee, I wonder why we might take until 0:19:34.480 --> 0:19:37.040 November fifth. Anybody know why that's a magic date. What's 0:19:37.040 --> 0:19:40.679 going on in thirds? Just coincidence? I would say, Steve, Well, 0:19:40.840 --> 0:19:43.320 I think this is the point. You put it so well, 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:46.280 it's this gas lighting, it's it's some of the greatest 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:50.240 gaslighting we've ever seen, and that isn't even coming from 0:19:50.320 --> 0:19:52.200 you know, the scientists or people looking at the data. 0:19:52.440 --> 0:19:55.119 That is coming from the politicians and you, miy I. 0:19:55.200 --> 0:19:58.000 I want to ask him two questions. Number one, for 0:19:58.119 --> 0:20:01.920 people listening, if you want to understand more about the numbers, 0:20:01.960 --> 0:20:05.240 if you want to dig down more deeply, are their names? 0:20:05.359 --> 0:20:09.159 Are their people? Are their scientists? Are their researchers that 0:20:09.720 --> 0:20:13.080 folks to look for and read what they're saying. I 0:20:13.119 --> 0:20:15.560 would urge people to go back to Johnny and Eades 0:20:15.600 --> 0:20:19.919 at Stanford University his very first white paper on March seventeenth, 0:20:20.280 --> 0:20:22.399 which all he did, He's the head of their public 0:20:22.480 --> 0:20:25.119 health department at Stanford, which is a top five medical 0:20:25.440 --> 0:20:27.840 school in the country. All he did was break down 0:20:27.920 --> 0:20:30.560 the i FR and the CFAR from our original guinea pig, 0:20:30.640 --> 0:20:33.440 the Diamond Princess cruise ship, and project out what that 0:20:33.520 --> 0:20:36.720 would be for our American population. And he nailed those 0:20:36.840 --> 0:20:41.000 numbers back on March seventeenth exactly. He was considered a quack, 0:20:41.400 --> 0:20:44.520 but he's turned out to be exactly right. Oxford University, 0:20:44.600 --> 0:20:47.840 the number one university in the world. Numerous epidemiologist at 0:20:47.840 --> 0:20:51.280 Oxford had been calling bs on this all along. So 0:20:51.600 --> 0:20:53.439 I mean I would look at a doctor. Tony Katz 0:20:53.560 --> 0:20:56.480 at Yale University is another one. I mean, there's a 0:20:56.600 --> 0:20:59.239 long list. That's what's been fascinating about this guy's from 0:20:59.280 --> 0:21:02.400 the very beginning. When I started poking at the Imperial 0:21:02.480 --> 0:21:04.960 College model and realized that their math did not add up, 0:21:05.240 --> 0:21:06.480 I was like, you know, this is going to be 0:21:06.680 --> 0:21:10.080 like a climate change debate. It's gonna be Steve days Breitbart, 0:21:10.240 --> 0:21:14.159 Michael Knowles against academia. Right. What blew me away is 0:21:14.240 --> 0:21:17.719 how much of academia all over the world has been 0:21:17.800 --> 0:21:20.879 pushing back on the It's Steve, let me let me 0:21:20.920 --> 0:21:26.520 ask you. I mean, look the institutions you mentioned, Stanford, Oxford, Yale. 0:21:26.680 --> 0:21:29.480 I mean those are not fly by night institutions. Okay, 0:21:29.560 --> 0:21:32.440 Yale is, but but the other two are not. I 0:21:32.560 --> 0:21:35.320 knew that was coming. You can't give me a hagging 0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:38.680 curveball like that and not expect me to swing. But like, like, 0:21:38.920 --> 0:21:44.320 how do you get researchers and physicians and doctors at 0:21:45.280 --> 0:21:48.399 the most esteemed academic institutions on the face of the planet. 0:21:48.800 --> 0:21:51.640 How do you get them dismissed over and over again 0:21:51.680 --> 0:21:55.400 as quacks that seems an odd, an odd dynamic. What's 0:21:55.400 --> 0:21:58.240 going on? I wish I knew? Now I will tell 0:21:58.240 --> 0:22:00.239 you this. You mentioned the whole thing that you were 0:22:00.280 --> 0:22:03.399 told at Sepack about asymptomatic spread. Guys, when somebody in 0:22:03.480 --> 0:22:05.800 your office is come ins and says, you know, my 0:22:05.920 --> 0:22:08.199 kid at home, I think has the flu. If they 0:22:08.320 --> 0:22:10.720 have no fever, no cough, no symptoms, do you make 0:22:10.760 --> 0:22:13.720 them go home? No? Nobody does that, right, Okay, So 0:22:13.920 --> 0:22:16.240 why did we do that with this? You know? Doctor 0:22:16.280 --> 0:22:18.919