1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:05,920 Speaker 1: Fellow ridiculous historians, Welcome to our classic episode for this week. 2 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:12,640 Speaker 1: We like music, We like presidential history dancing. 3 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:16,439 Speaker 2: We also like to like dancing. We like it dance. Sure, No, 4 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 2: I'm sorry, I just music and dancing go hand in hand. 5 00:00:20,239 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: Now there's Max Williams. You're Noel Brown. I've been bowler. Yeah, yeah, 6 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:32,839 Speaker 1: we're here, are you right? You guys remember Richard Nixon? 7 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:35,199 Speaker 2: Yeah, that guy was a bit of a pill. Huh, 8 00:00:35,400 --> 00:00:38,440 Speaker 2: don't think very finally, not great. Actually, when I think 9 00:00:38,440 --> 00:00:41,000 Speaker 2: of him, I think of the terrifying Richard Nixon masks 10 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:43,920 Speaker 2: that were worn. I believe in the movie Point Break 11 00:00:44,120 --> 00:00:46,240 Speaker 2: there was a Ronald Reagan mask and a Richard Nixon 12 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:50,000 Speaker 2: mass those groovy surfers used when they were like doing crimes. 13 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 2: I only think of Futurama. Also fair good, superior Nixon 14 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:57,279 Speaker 2: in Futurama to the actual Nixon. But I'll tell you, though, 15 00:00:57,440 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 2: when you mentioned music, one thing that comes to mind 16 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 2: immediately is old Louis Armstrong, Old Satchmo blowing that horn 17 00:01:03,440 --> 00:01:06,960 Speaker 2: with those big old puffy cheeks. Excellent trumpet player and 18 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:11,039 Speaker 2: really iconic gravelly singing voice, and apparently quite fond of 19 00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 2: the weed. 20 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 1: Yes, the marijuana, the canna bus right. This episode is 21 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 1: about how Richard Nixon may or may not have unwittingly 22 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 1: smuggled cannabis on behalf of Louis. 23 00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:33,240 Speaker 2: Armstrong roll that footage. 24 00:01:36,640 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Oh man, oh man, 25 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 1: oh man. It's been a while. We are finally cool 26 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:11,960 Speaker 1: enough cats that we can have a little bit of 27 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: intro music for today's episode, Friends and Neighbors. That was Muggles. 28 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:31,920 Speaker 1: That's performed by Louis Armstrong. 29 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:34,399 Speaker 2: And co Hi. My name is Ben, my name is Nola. 30 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 2: So we're doing a Harry Potter episode today, right, one 31 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 2: would think, one would think, but in fact we are 32 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:48,519 Speaker 2: doing something that involves what some people would call magic. Yeah, 33 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:53,519 Speaker 2: we're talking about the reefer right left, the jazz cigarette, 34 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:59,520 Speaker 2: the gauge, the gauge which was mister Armstrong's personal favorite 35 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:02,600 Speaker 2: slang for marijuana. 36 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 1: And we were we have had so much fun researching 37 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 1: this legend that we were worried our you know, our 38 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:17,399 Speaker 1: better third and saving Grace. Super producer Casey Pegrim might 39 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 1: actually get tired of us. But while we while we 40 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:24,520 Speaker 1: have them in the studio still, we are going to 41 00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:26,280 Speaker 1: take advantage of that precious time. 42 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:28,960 Speaker 2: It's really cloudy and it's should we open a door? 43 00:03:29,919 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 1: No, okay, don't don't engage with drugs, kids, don't engage 44 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 1: with the gauge. Yes, don't gauge, don't get you got there? 45 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, we're here, we're here. 46 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:42,839 Speaker 3: Oh. Man. 47 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:46,520 Speaker 2: But our research was strictly academic for this, absolutely, yeah, 48 00:03:46,520 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 2: one hundred percent. But man, this is a cool story. 49 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:51,680 Speaker 2: It's a lot wrapped up and uh, part of it 50 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 2: is a bit of kind of an urban legend, apocryphal. Yeah. 51 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:59,200 Speaker 1: So we are exploring the life and times of one 52 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 1: of the great So someone that I really enjoy and 53 00:04:02,720 --> 00:04:06,960 Speaker 1: I think you do as well. Knowl that is Louis Armstrong. 54 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:08,840 Speaker 2: Pops, Yes, Satchmo. 55 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 1: And Louis Armstrong is known and loved the world over. 56 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 1: He is one of those people you could rightly call 57 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:18,239 Speaker 1: an icon. 58 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,200 Speaker 2: That's right. Born in nineteen hundred August fourth, to be precise, 59 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 2: in New Orleans, Louis as wella. 60 00:04:23,800 --> 00:04:27,039 Speaker 1: He lied about his age though too. Oh he's he's 61 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:28,719 Speaker 1: a very layered man. 62 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:31,680 Speaker 2: Very much so cloaked in mystery. But one thing we 63 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 2: do know is true. He grew up in a very 64 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:37,000 Speaker 2: tough neighborhood in New Orleans called the Battlefield. His father 65 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 2: left the family when he was just a little boy, 66 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 2: and he kind of had defend for himself taking ant jobs. 67 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:46,160 Speaker 2: His mother apparently was only able to pay the bills 68 00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:51,120 Speaker 2: through sex work, and he had kind of a wild 69 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:54,080 Speaker 2: upbringing in the court sort of ceed underbelly of New 70 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:58,280 Speaker 2: Orleans included dance clubs and women of the evening, and 71 00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 2: of course a lot of jazz musicians right right. 72 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:09,520 Speaker 1: His first exposure to music in a learning environment was 73 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:12,599 Speaker 1: at the Fisk School for Boys when he was about 74 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 1: six years old. But he ended up putting in his 75 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 1: time when it came to listening to music at brothels 76 00:05:19,360 --> 00:05:22,279 Speaker 1: and dance halls, because he had a gig selling coal 77 00:05:22,440 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: for a nickel per bucket in these you know, in 78 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:29,600 Speaker 1: these houses of prostitution in an area called Storyville. And 79 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:32,600 Speaker 1: then as he was as he was making his rounds 80 00:05:32,600 --> 00:05:37,080 Speaker 1: delivering coal, he ran into these house musicians and he 81 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:39,839 Speaker 1: ran into something called spasm bands. 82 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:42,400 Speaker 2: Well, I don't know about spasm bands. Tell me more. 83 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 2: I'm so glad you asked. 84 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:48,280 Speaker 1: A spasm band is a musical group that plays Dixie Land, 85 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:51,680 Speaker 1: traditional jazz, jug band or skiffle music. 86 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 2: Skiffle like, that's sort of what the Beatles were considered. 87 00:05:54,600 --> 00:05:57,279 Speaker 2: They were part of the skiffle scene. Apparently in the 88 00:05:57,360 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 2: UK the skiffle was sort of like a folk pop 89 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:01,000 Speaker 2: kind of form of. 90 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:04,600 Speaker 1: Music, right, Yeah, nailed it, nailed it, jazz, blues, folk 91 00:06:04,960 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 1: and American folk, known for some improvised instruments. So he, 92 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:14,599 Speaker 1: as as you said, began hanging out there, spending serious 93 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 1: time in these halls, and it was pretty apparent early 94 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:24,960 Speaker 1: on that he had a gift, a calling, a compulsion 95 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:28,719 Speaker 1: to play music, to sing, and to play the horn. 96 00:06:28,920 --> 00:06:31,960 Speaker 2: And he was taken under the wing of a professor, 97 00:06:32,040 --> 00:06:36,000 Speaker 2: Peter Davis, who taught Armstrong to play the cornet, which 98 00:06:36,000 --> 00:06:38,600 Speaker 2: I believe is kind of a like a smaller trumpet. 99 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,000 Speaker 1: A trumpet is a little bit longer and more slender 100 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:45,599 Speaker 1: than a cornet, but in reality they both play the 101 00:06:45,600 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 1: same notes and they sound more or less the same. 102 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:50,200 Speaker 2: I got so easy one to one transition from the 103 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:51,680 Speaker 2: cornet to a trumpet. 104 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:53,760 Speaker 1: If you want to get nerdy about it, O course. Idea, 105 00:06:53,839 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 1: the difference is mainly the way the tubing of the 106 00:06:57,320 --> 00:07:01,359 Speaker 1: instrument flares. A cornet is more cone shaped or conical 107 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: than a trumpet. 108 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:05,719 Speaker 2: So as a cornet kind of considered more bite sized portable. 109 00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 2: I don't know, I don't see the point. 110 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, let us know we are not a cornetician's. 111 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 2: No, it's true. But I am fond of some hot jazz. 112 00:07:14,280 --> 00:07:18,119 Speaker 1: Ah, yes, hot jazz, which in its day would be 113 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 1: considered often as controversial. 114 00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. 115 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 1: Perhaps as the use of drugs and Louis Armstrong's jazz 116 00:07:27,480 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: career is worthy of not just an episode, but an 117 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:35,600 Speaker 1: entire podcast. We just spent exploring this guy and exploring 118 00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 1: the personal struggles that he endured. I have some great 119 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 1: Louis Armstrong facts at the end of this. But before 120 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 1: you and I go too far down the fanboy rabbit hole, 121 00:07:49,160 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 1: should we set the scene for today's encounter? 122 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 2: I think we should, Ben, I think we should please 123 00:07:55,520 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 2: do the honors. Today's episode centers around an apocryphal tale. 124 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 2: I believe you weren't used that word earlier, Ben, A 125 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:10,320 Speaker 2: pot full tale. Not good. It's fine, We're keeping it it. Yeah. 126 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:13,760 Speaker 2: Where So Louis Armstrong during the Cold War, he was 127 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:18,720 Speaker 2: made a US ambassador, a good will ambassador, excuse me. 128 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 2: He was sent abroad, as were many African American musicians 129 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:28,400 Speaker 2: and actors and writers. I don't know, to preach equality. 130 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 2: I guess during the era of integration. 131 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 1: Well, yeah, so a good will ambassador isn't just relegated 132 00:08:34,600 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 1: to this period in time, like Angelina Jolie is a 133 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:38,839 Speaker 1: good will ambassador, that's right. 134 00:08:38,880 --> 00:08:39,360 Speaker 2: That's right. 135 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:43,520 Speaker 1: They're a person who advocates for They are person who 136 00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 1: advocates typically for a country or maybe for a specific cause, 137 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:50,560 Speaker 1: based on the fact that everyone knows who they are. 138 00:08:50,640 --> 00:08:53,760 Speaker 2: That's right. So Louis Armstrong had this distinction straight from 139 00:08:53,760 --> 00:08:57,960 Speaker 2: the US State Department, who actually also paid for or 140 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:01,960 Speaker 2: in part financed a tour that he did in Europe 141 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:05,000 Speaker 2: and Asia. And while there are a few versions of 142 00:09:05,040 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 2: this story that sort of change where he was coming from, uh, 143 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:12,920 Speaker 2: the one common little thread is that Louis Armstrong was 144 00:09:13,320 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 2: at the airport on after getting off a plane from 145 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:21,880 Speaker 2: from one of these trips, and he was led out 146 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 2: of line into a customs line. 147 00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:27,120 Speaker 1: Which was unusual for it because, according to the story, 148 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:31,760 Speaker 1: as a goodwill ambassador, he was traveling to different areas 149 00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:34,880 Speaker 1: of the world and never having to enter custom. 150 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:37,199 Speaker 2: They waved him on through. Sure, but he was supposedly 151 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,680 Speaker 2: coming back from Japan. That's that's the most consistent version 152 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 2: of the story that I've read. And so, yeah, he's 153 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:46,280 Speaker 2: in this line and he starts to sweat. Why is 154 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:48,360 Speaker 2: he sweating? He's not. He's not sweating because of the 155 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 2: because of the sound of a hot trumpet. 156 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:54,439 Speaker 1: Right, He's not sweating because of the heat in the airport. 157 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:59,640 Speaker 1: He is sweating because his trumpet case contains more than 158 00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:04,200 Speaker 1: a beautiful musical instrument. He is, in our parlance today 159 00:10:04,360 --> 00:10:09,360 Speaker 1: writing dirty riding, dirty packing. Yeah, he has a gauge 160 00:10:09,400 --> 00:10:12,680 Speaker 1: on him. Yep, he's gauged up. Yeah, he's got his 161 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:16,680 Speaker 1: muggles slaying for marijuana at the time. His left hand 162 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 1: cigarettes in a pretty substantial amount. Yeah, three pounds. Right, 163 00:10:22,040 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 1: that's what we hear with the story. And there's something 164 00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 1: important we want you to be aware of. As we're 165 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:31,199 Speaker 1: telling this story. You may hear us switching between different 166 00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:32,640 Speaker 1: versions and different sources. 167 00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:37,320 Speaker 2: Again, quite apocryphal, bordering on urban legend, very hard to 168 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:40,560 Speaker 2: confirm or deny the story. But there are several versions 169 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:44,280 Speaker 2: in Louis Armstrong biographies that are floating out there. So 170 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:46,480 Speaker 2: we'll give you we'll give you the kind of the 171 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 2: Barmones version. So we got off the first class flight. 172 00:10:51,840 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 2: He's going into a customs line, and then who does 173 00:10:56,640 --> 00:11:00,800 Speaker 2: he see but Richard Nixon, who was on the way 174 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:03,400 Speaker 2: to becoming president or serving as a vice president. Tricky 175 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:04,440 Speaker 2: Dicky yep. 176 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:07,920 Speaker 1: Himself the one of the men who would go on 177 00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:10,840 Speaker 1: to become a huge advocate of what we call the 178 00:11:10,920 --> 00:11:11,440 Speaker 1: drug war. 179 00:11:11,559 --> 00:11:13,080 Speaker 2: Yes, the war on drugs, the. 180 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:16,760 Speaker 1: War on drugs, and so in a panic and thinking 181 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 1: quickly Louis Armstrong, who is talking with Nixon, who turns 182 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:22,480 Speaker 1: out to be a huge. 183 00:11:22,320 --> 00:11:24,200 Speaker 2: Fan of well the way I've read it too, and 184 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:28,000 Speaker 2: there's a couple of versions. But Nixon sees Louis and 185 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:30,840 Speaker 2: comes running at him with open arms. I think he's 186 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 2: going to get a sweet press photo, y Armstrong Satchmo. 187 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 2: He says, he says trash mal doing so. 188 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 1: Louis Armstrong thinks this is a sign and Nixon's like, oh, 189 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:56,080 Speaker 1: you know, one fan anything, don't help you, And he says, actually, yes, 190 00:11:56,320 --> 00:11:59,800 Speaker 1: you see, I'm I'm old. And this trumpet is heavy. 191 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:01,360 Speaker 1: Do you think he could carry it for me? 192 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:04,120 Speaker 2: Give me a hand. That was an amazing Louis Armstrong impression. 193 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 1: I feel like it would be racist for either of 194 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 1: us to attempt to absolute yes, but next to work 195 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,400 Speaker 1: on Yeah, we could do we could do our muppet 196 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 1: level Nixon's back and forth. Write in and let us 197 00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 1: know if you want us to do a show where 198 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:22,439 Speaker 1: both of us are Richard Nixon. We're ridiculous at HowStuffWorks 199 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 1: dot com. Oh man, what if people write in, We'll 200 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:29,119 Speaker 1: do it if only if the episode has nothing. 201 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:29,960 Speaker 2: To do with Richard Nixon. 202 00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:33,199 Speaker 1: That's fine, Okay, you're agreed to this, sure, all right. 203 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:37,240 Speaker 1: So what happens when Armstrong asked him to give him 204 00:12:37,240 --> 00:12:37,600 Speaker 1: a hand. 205 00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:41,200 Speaker 2: Well, first of all, one version one. One difference in 206 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:45,560 Speaker 2: various accounts is whether he was carrying one case or 207 00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:47,520 Speaker 2: two cases. I think he would make the most sense 208 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:49,760 Speaker 2: for him to have been carrying two cases, because yeah, 209 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:52,319 Speaker 2: three pounds of weed is not going to fit into 210 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:53,960 Speaker 2: a single trumpet case. 211 00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:57,320 Speaker 1: Right, And then also asking someone to carry something for 212 00:12:57,480 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 1: you when you have nothing else to carry. 213 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:02,679 Speaker 2: See shady again. Several versions. The one that we're kind 214 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 2: of talking about here is Nixon demands that he handed 215 00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:08,720 Speaker 2: him his cases because he says, a good world ambassador 216 00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:11,880 Speaker 2: doesn't have to go through customs, and the vice president 217 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:15,319 Speaker 2: of the United States will carry your suitcases, sash Ma. 218 00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:20,240 Speaker 1: And then Again, this story, depending on when you hear it, 219 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:25,240 Speaker 1: describes a different point in Richard Nixon's career. But according 220 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:28,360 Speaker 1: to the story, according to the legend, what happens is 221 00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:31,560 Speaker 1: with the maybe not the best of intentions, because he 222 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:35,120 Speaker 1: clearly wanted the photo. The man who would later become 223 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 1: Richard Nixon, a very anti drug president. Yeah, carries marijuana 224 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 1: through customs for Louis Armstrong hands it back to Louis Armstrong, 225 00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 1: who somehow must have been keeping a straight face through 226 00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:56,520 Speaker 1: the whole thing. And later Louis and some of his 227 00:13:57,480 --> 00:14:00,440 Speaker 1: accompanists will swear by this story. But the thing is, 228 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:04,520 Speaker 1: depending on who you ask, the story differs in a 229 00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 1: multitude of ways. 230 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 2: Right. 231 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:13,840 Speaker 1: First off, Armstrong was only about twelve years older than Nixon. 232 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 1: Because he got his he would tell people who was 233 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:20,520 Speaker 1: born on August fourth, nineteen hundred, but it was more 234 00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:23,560 Speaker 1: like nineteen oh one, because it was a thirteen month 235 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 1: or so different. 236 00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, man, and that particular account is credited. This is 237 00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 2: getting in a murky territory here, real someone named Miles 238 00:14:32,160 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 2: So Miles Davis. Oh sure, I don't know. It's hard 239 00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 2: to say, but yeah, as it turns out, though, that 240 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 2: keyboardist that's mentioned in that version of the story never 241 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 2: played with Louis Armstrong, right, so yeah, there's shock full of. 242 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:48,920 Speaker 1: Holes that there's no record of any session where they 243 00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:55,040 Speaker 1: played together. And so in that version he Armstrong was 244 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:57,760 Speaker 1: not necessarily an ambassador. He was just on a good 245 00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 1: will tour and he was going to I think they 246 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 1: were all on the same planet, and they were headed 247 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:10,200 Speaker 1: to Moscow in this thing, So the directions and the locations. 248 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:11,640 Speaker 2: Changed, that's right. And this is in what year are 249 00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:12,240 Speaker 2: we talking here? 250 00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 1: This particular the Moscow story would date it to nineteen 251 00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:19,000 Speaker 1: fifty nine, and that has its problems as well. 252 00:15:18,760 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 2: Right, But in general, like if we're looking at a 253 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:23,440 Speaker 2: rough estimate for when this meeting was supposed to take place, 254 00:15:23,480 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 2: it would have been late fifties, early sixties, right, Yeah, 255 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 2: that's about right, Yeah, exactly. So the goodwill tours, I 256 00:15:30,920 --> 00:15:33,880 Speaker 2: think the part of it was about integration because a 257 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:35,640 Speaker 2: lot of the people they sent on these tours were 258 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 2: African American luminaries, and it was meant, I think, to show, hey, 259 00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:42,600 Speaker 2: we're doing good work. 260 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 1: Well because one of the tenets of the Soviet ideology 261 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:51,120 Speaker 1: at the time was that communism provides much more equality 262 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:55,520 Speaker 1: than capitalism. So this is sort of a foray against. 263 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:58,640 Speaker 2: Exactly, and so it's also tied to the Cold War 264 00:15:58,920 --> 00:16:00,080 Speaker 2: as well, right. 265 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:06,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely, at least ideologically. And so this 266 00:16:07,280 --> 00:16:11,359 Speaker 1: story continues through some other iterations. 267 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 2: Right. 268 00:16:12,120 --> 00:16:15,600 Speaker 1: The problem with the idea of the vice president of 269 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:19,160 Speaker 1: the US taking a flight on official business to Moscow 270 00:16:19,320 --> 00:16:22,240 Speaker 1: in nineteen fifty nine is that there would be some 271 00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 1: sort of record of it, right, well, sure, although it 272 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 1: is true that apparently in those days the vice president 273 00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 1: would have taken commercial flights, which I thought was fascinating 274 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 1: big time. 275 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:36,280 Speaker 4: I had no idea, Well, what a kick in the 276 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:40,080 Speaker 4: pants man? Seriously, man, is the president hops on air 277 00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:43,640 Speaker 4: Force one and what do you just fist bump and 278 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 4: then say all right, I gotta go get in line 279 00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:51,160 Speaker 4: catch my flight. And customs, of course, was a lot 280 00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:52,520 Speaker 4: easier in those days. 281 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:56,320 Speaker 2: Everything, I mean, yeah, yeah, Going to the airport today 282 00:16:56,440 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 2: just stresses me out so much it's not fun. 283 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 1: Further, there had only been three trips by jazz musicians 284 00:17:03,800 --> 00:17:08,480 Speaker 1: to Russia by nineteen seventy one, at least that are documented, 285 00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: and Louis Armstrong was not one of those consitions. 286 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,840 Speaker 2: So I'm leaning towards this is if this did happen? 287 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:19,440 Speaker 2: Probably coming back from his I've seen this version of 288 00:17:19,480 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 2: the story enough times that it seems to stick. Coming 289 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:26,520 Speaker 2: back from one of his tours in Asia in Japan. Yes, 290 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:34,920 Speaker 2: this is one of those stories though, where it's it's 291 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:37,639 Speaker 2: you want to believe it because it's just so funny 292 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:39,760 Speaker 2: to think that Satchmo kind of put one over on 293 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:42,320 Speaker 2: tricky Dick Nixon before he was even well known as 294 00:17:42,359 --> 00:17:47,000 Speaker 2: being such a vehement anti drug force. You know. But 295 00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,960 Speaker 2: can we talk a little bit about Satchmo's lifelong love 296 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 2: of the Mary Jane. Yeah, let's set it up with 297 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:55,280 Speaker 2: a clip. What do you say? Yeah, so this is 298 00:17:55,320 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 2: a clip from Louis Armstrong on some sort of television 299 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:01,720 Speaker 2: an appearance looks like an interview show. First I thought 300 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:03,280 Speaker 2: it was like Steve Allen or something. But the guy's 301 00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 2: name place says mister Daily, and I couldn't figure out 302 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 2: what show it was. But from nineteen sixty three, that's right. Yes, 303 00:18:09,640 --> 00:18:10,640 Speaker 2: so let's give that a lesson. 304 00:18:12,119 --> 00:18:16,080 Speaker 3: Actually, I haven't had a chance to talk to for 305 00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:18,080 Speaker 3: the show, but we had a great discussion about it. 306 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:20,440 Speaker 3: I just asked one of the folks on the show, 307 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:22,879 Speaker 3: Bob Beckers, well, what is What is Louis Armstrong going 308 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:24,560 Speaker 3: to do? How is he going to disguise as voice 309 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:25,600 Speaker 3: as always going way up? 310 00:18:28,040 --> 00:18:29,159 Speaker 2: That's the way he sings. 311 00:18:29,160 --> 00:18:33,560 Speaker 3: Is is that the highest you could get? Well, I 312 00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:37,800 Speaker 3: don't know what I'm saying. 313 00:18:39,400 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 5: Actually, I'm that it was high for you, but it 314 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:48,359 Speaker 5: high for the rest of them, just about a lot 315 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:52,760 Speaker 5: of Rickons. 316 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:58,480 Speaker 1: This is worth looking up on YouTube because without being 317 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:04,919 Speaker 1: without being like experts in assessing someone's mental condition or 318 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: their level of intoxication, Louis Armstrong looks like he is 319 00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:14,280 Speaker 1: mildly amused by this guy, or maybe smoked some pot 320 00:19:14,359 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: before the show. 321 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:18,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, the gauge, the gauge what he called it. In fact, 322 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 2: this clip is called Pops Loves His Pot because Pops 323 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 2: was another nickname, and apparently also Louis Armstrong called everybody 324 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:29,400 Speaker 2: else Pops, which is kind of neat. Yeah, I think 325 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:32,400 Speaker 2: that's cool. If I started calling everybody by my own nickname, 326 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:35,000 Speaker 2: that'd be pretty presumptuous. Also kind of badass. 327 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:39,080 Speaker 1: Well, he probably started it before it was his nickname 328 00:19:39,160 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 1: and people gave him that nickname. 329 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:42,639 Speaker 2: That's a good point. That's a good point, But. 330 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:44,800 Speaker 1: You know, I don't think that's a way to get 331 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: ahead in life, you gotta be a Louis Armstrong for 332 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:47,600 Speaker 1: that to work. 333 00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:51,840 Speaker 2: Did you get a sense that this very white hosts 334 00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:53,480 Speaker 2: being a little bit of a dick? 335 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:56,720 Speaker 1: You know, as we were watching a lot of these interviews. 336 00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:59,399 Speaker 1: One thing that bothered me and that we talked a 337 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:03,439 Speaker 1: little bit of about off air, is that in this time, 338 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:08,800 Speaker 1: many of the interviews that he has, especially with white interviewers, 339 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 1: are exercises in condescension, and they're consistently talking over him 340 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 1: and talking too much. 341 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:20,119 Speaker 2: It's strange. Yeah, it's not cool, it's gross because the 342 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:23,119 Speaker 2: thing like, okay, so in the company of Louis Armstrong, 343 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:28,199 Speaker 2: as African American artists who had crossover appeal, you know, 344 00:20:28,280 --> 00:20:32,639 Speaker 2: to a largely white audience, where people like Cab Callaway 345 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:37,880 Speaker 2: Sure and Fat Swaller for example, they they all kind 346 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:40,840 Speaker 2: of had in common that they came from this kind 347 00:20:40,840 --> 00:20:44,920 Speaker 2: of underground scene Louis Armstrong in New Orleans, like we 348 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 2: talked about the top of the show, but they managed 349 00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 2: to break through and be very successful with white audiences. 350 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,640 Speaker 2: But that also they kind of had to like what's 351 00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:57,679 Speaker 2: the word I'm looking for. I don't know if I 352 00:20:57,680 --> 00:21:00,240 Speaker 2: felt like they had they had to play by their 353 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:01,120 Speaker 2: rules a little bit. 354 00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:04,280 Speaker 1: They had to sort of bow and scrape a little bit. 355 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 1: And while this may have given them success or maybe 356 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:14,680 Speaker 1: even to some degree sanitized them or made them less 357 00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 1: dangerous to the very racist white community, it was contentious 358 00:21:19,560 --> 00:21:22,679 Speaker 1: and considered offensive in the black community in the States 359 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:26,360 Speaker 1: at the time. And this is something we know now 360 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:31,280 Speaker 1: deeply troubled many of these artists, Louis Armstrong included, because 361 00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 1: he would have he would have people in the movement, 362 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:40,879 Speaker 1: the civil rights movement accuse him of being and Uncle Tom. 363 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:44,520 Speaker 1: The idea be that he was selling out his own 364 00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:48,959 Speaker 1: identity for some measure of personal profit from people who 365 00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:53,440 Speaker 1: would never respect him right, which is a shame because 366 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:58,120 Speaker 1: once you see his letters and his correspondence, he did 367 00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:01,960 Speaker 1: have a public persona for sure, that's true. Everybody does. Yeah, no, no, no, 368 00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:05,160 Speaker 1: no doubt about it. But he was an activist. He 369 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 1: came to activism. In his letters, you can see him angry, 370 00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:14,600 Speaker 1: ferociously angry, and righteously fed up with the state of 371 00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:20,359 Speaker 1: race relations in America, as well as the policies toward marijuana. 372 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:25,400 Speaker 1: His wife actually got arrested one time in nineteen fifty 373 00:22:25,440 --> 00:22:29,960 Speaker 1: four for carrying marijuana that was allegedly his. 374 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:31,840 Speaker 2: Yeah. It was like something in the neighborhood of like 375 00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:38,199 Speaker 2: fourteen grams. It was like a rolled up marijuana cigarette. 376 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:38,600 Speaker 3: Yeah. 377 00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 2: It was sounded like a grandpa a joint. 378 00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:46,919 Speaker 1: It was in an eyeglass case and a couple of roaches. 379 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:50,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, I call them half smoked joint. 380 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:53,720 Speaker 1: And we have an excerpt because he wrote a letter 381 00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 1: about this. He almost got banned from Hawaii for life, yeah, because. 382 00:22:58,359 --> 00:23:01,240 Speaker 2: That was on Waikiki. Yeah, and this is a letter 383 00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:05,240 Speaker 2: to his then manager, who also I believe had ties 384 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:08,879 Speaker 2: to the al Capone crime syndicate. Yeah. 385 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:14,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a very strange part of it. So Joe Glasser, 386 00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: it was his manager at the time. And because he 387 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:25,960 Speaker 1: was so incensed about this huge what he called rigamaru regard. 388 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:30,119 Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that, Matt Rigamarole, mind you rigamaroo riga marou. 389 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:33,159 Speaker 1: Because he was so angry about this, he wrote to 390 00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:36,960 Speaker 1: his manager Joe And we won't read the whole letter, 391 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 1: but we have some choice excerpts here, and one of 392 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 1: our favorites was when he said, straight out, mister Glasser, 393 00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:46,520 Speaker 1: you must see to it that I have special permission 394 00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 1: to smoke all the reefers that I want to when 395 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:50,960 Speaker 1: I want, or I will just have to put this 396 00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:51,720 Speaker 1: horn down. 397 00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:55,199 Speaker 2: That is all. That is all. He refers to the 398 00:23:55,280 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 2: gauge as more of a medicine than a dope, he says, 399 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,879 Speaker 2: but he's just fed up with the penalty surrounding it. 400 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:04,440 Speaker 2: And this was not his first run in with the law. 401 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,320 Speaker 2: He's actually kind of credited as the right word but 402 00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 2: as being I've seen it written, is the first celebrity 403 00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 2: arrested for marijuana possession, right. 404 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:19,040 Speaker 1: And he you know, he did have his addictions. I 405 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:24,639 Speaker 1: believe he smoked three cigar sized blunts right a day, 406 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:29,719 Speaker 1: eight day. Yeah, and that's that sounds like just a 407 00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:32,480 Speaker 1: maintenance thing, you know. He never had a drinking problem. 408 00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:37,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, he says he smoked the reefers instead because he 409 00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:38,959 Speaker 2: said there was no hangover, and you know, he had 410 00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:40,200 Speaker 2: he had a lot of reasons. He had a lot 411 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:43,240 Speaker 2: of feelings about this stuff, right, and he was very 412 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:44,720 Speaker 2: open and about about it in a way that you 413 00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:47,400 Speaker 2: would not expect one to be. But I guess even 414 00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:49,080 Speaker 2: in those days, if you get to a level of 415 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 2: that kind of sacred status, you know, as an American treasure, 416 00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:55,360 Speaker 2: you'd probably say what you want. 417 00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:57,880 Speaker 1: I mean, this is like Snoop Dogg Willie Nelson level 418 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,440 Speaker 1: big time, and those are those are two very prominent 419 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,199 Speaker 1: advocates of marijuana today. 420 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:07,280 Speaker 2: So that first run in was in nineteen thirty where 421 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:09,480 Speaker 2: he was hanging out with his drummer, a guy by 422 00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 2: the name of Vic Burton, outside the Cotton Club in 423 00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:16,800 Speaker 2: Culver City, California. And lordy, lordy, Lordie, this quote is 424 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:20,879 Speaker 2: a delight. I'm going to read this again, not going 425 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:24,159 Speaker 2: to do Louis Armstrong voice. He says, Vic and I 426 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,440 Speaker 2: were blasting this joint, having lots of laughs and feeling good, 427 00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:31,199 Speaker 2: enjoying each other's company. Just then two big healthy dicks 428 00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,600 Speaker 2: that means detectives came from behind a car nonchalantly and 429 00:25:34,600 --> 00:25:37,720 Speaker 2: said to us, well take the roach boyz yep. 430 00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:44,560 Speaker 1: And that that is a true statement. But as we 431 00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:49,359 Speaker 1: have seen, it did not discourage him one bit because 432 00:25:49,359 --> 00:25:51,560 Speaker 1: one thing Louis Armstrong had was dry. 433 00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:54,440 Speaker 2: That's true. He did get put away for a handful 434 00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:57,679 Speaker 2: of days. He could have gotten six months. But he 435 00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:00,679 Speaker 2: and the drummer where I think find a thousand dollars 436 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,680 Speaker 2: apiece in nineteen thirty, which is insane. Shall we inflation 437 00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:05,880 Speaker 2: calculator that bad boy. 438 00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 1: Yes, let's one thousand dollars in nineteen thirty is worth 439 00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:18,720 Speaker 1: in twenty eighteen approximately. May have a drum roll, please, casey, Oh, it's. 440 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:24,000 Speaker 2: Gonna be It's gonna be crazy. 441 00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:30,280 Speaker 1: Fourteen thousand, five hundred and ninety three dollars and eighty 442 00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:35,160 Speaker 1: sent mm. Whenever I read a fine of that sort, 443 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:38,080 Speaker 1: you know what always drinds my gears the most. 444 00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 2: It's the it's the change. Yeah, come on, insult to injury. 445 00:26:41,560 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 1: Just add twenty cents, right, Why are you doing this? 446 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:47,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's it's ridiculous. But like you said, it 447 00:26:47,840 --> 00:26:51,560 Speaker 2: did not diminish his love of the herb. He A 448 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:54,359 Speaker 2: lot of these quotes are coming from excerpts from a 449 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,800 Speaker 2: biography that I believe, Correct me if I'm wrong, but 450 00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:02,120 Speaker 2: I believe there was one biography where he talked very 451 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:06,320 Speaker 2: openly about his love of marijuana and you know, his 452 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:10,720 Speaker 2: belief in marijuana law reform very openly. But this manager, 453 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 2: that manager we talked about with the mob ties had 454 00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:18,240 Speaker 2: a lot of that stuff redacted pulled out because he 455 00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:20,600 Speaker 2: thought it would be a bad look, I guess for 456 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 2: his client. And Louis Armstrong swore that he would have 457 00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:29,280 Speaker 2: a sequel released that only contained the stuff about his 458 00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:34,000 Speaker 2: beloved gauge. But yeah, so he got out. They pulled 459 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:36,399 Speaker 2: some strings. Some of the club owners, I guess in 460 00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:39,639 Speaker 2: California in the Los Angeles area got him out and 461 00:27:39,680 --> 00:27:43,679 Speaker 2: he returned to the bandstand post haste. And then he 462 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,680 Speaker 2: said when he was performing on the bandstand as a 463 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:49,159 Speaker 2: quote where he says, I laughed real hard when several 464 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:51,479 Speaker 2: movie stars came up to the bandstand while we played 465 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,000 Speaker 2: a dance set and told me when they heard about 466 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,800 Speaker 2: me getting caught with marijuana, they thought marijuana was a 467 00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:59,359 Speaker 2: chick whoo boy. That really fractured me. 468 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:04,359 Speaker 1: Yes, this is strange because you'll hear a lot of 469 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:09,160 Speaker 1: marijuana advocates today and in more recent years describe Louis 470 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:13,919 Speaker 1: Armstrong as one of the first public policy advocates for marijuana, 471 00:28:14,320 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 1: and granted, a lot of these outfits will be a 472 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:21,040 Speaker 1: little biased, like you can read an article that takes 473 00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:24,919 Speaker 1: this stint on a website called guess what nol marijuana 474 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 1: dot com. 475 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:29,440 Speaker 2: Wow bye, someone had to snap up that url of right. 476 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:32,399 Speaker 1: And what we also found in what we would be 477 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:37,240 Speaker 1: remiss not to mention, is that later in life Armstrong 478 00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:41,680 Speaker 1: developed significant lung problems, and he died before he even 479 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 1: reached his seventieth birthday. You can find this in Louis Armstrong, 480 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:48,960 Speaker 1: Genius and Drugs by Stanton Peel, a PhD, writing for 481 00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,719 Speaker 1: Psychology Today. The marijuana use had to have something to 482 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:53,040 Speaker 1: do with. 483 00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:55,600 Speaker 2: Oh, of course, yeah, no, no, no, no, no, no question about it. 484 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:57,640 Speaker 2: And I want to be clear, we are certainly not 485 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 2: advocating the use of marija wanna. This is just an 486 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 2: interesting story and it's it's obviously part of the culture, 487 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:09,320 Speaker 2: and especially when it comes to you know, creative types 488 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 2: and musicians. And clearly Louis Armstrong was a highly functional, 489 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:20,080 Speaker 2: successful creative person and this was something he chose to do. 490 00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:22,840 Speaker 2: And you can't deny that it may have had an 491 00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 2: impact on the music that he made. 492 00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:31,040 Speaker 1: Absolutely, Yeah, there was this idea that it opened up 493 00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:36,280 Speaker 1: people's improvisational chops. And Armstrong, when he writes about it, 494 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 1: also mentions that there was a bit of escapism, you know, 495 00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:40,760 Speaker 1: and it made it. 496 00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 2: Easier to. 497 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 1: Not feel like you lived in a country that was 498 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:48,240 Speaker 1: constantly kicking the crap out of you. 499 00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:51,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, and we and. 500 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:53,640 Speaker 1: We can say one of the reasons we're laughing so 501 00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:58,720 Speaker 1: much about this is because Louis Armstrong's personality shines through 502 00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:04,960 Speaker 1: so vibrantly and at times comedically in the interviews, in 503 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 1: his written works, And we didn't even mention the cartoonish 504 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:16,640 Speaker 1: anti marijuana propaganda that was around in the twenties and thirties, right, 505 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:21,960 Speaker 1: a lot of it which was race based, primarily discriminating 506 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:28,200 Speaker 1: against people of color. So he's rebelling against an authoritarian effort, 507 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:31,840 Speaker 1: which in principle is admirable. 508 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 2: Absolutely, And I'm just to clarify some of those quotes 509 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:45,160 Speaker 2: of Louis Armstrong talking about his experiences with weed were 510 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:47,479 Speaker 2: not from that original book which came out in nineteen 511 00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:50,520 Speaker 2: fifty four called Satchmo My Life in New Orleans, because 512 00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 2: he did talk about it in those sessions, but his 513 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:55,960 Speaker 2: manager did have those pulled out and that you cannot 514 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 2: find them. But it was near the end of his 515 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 2: life in nineteen seventy one he sat down with two biographers, 516 00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:07,720 Speaker 2: Max Jones and John Chilton, where he decided he was 517 00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:10,400 Speaker 2: going to quote tell it like it was. And this 518 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:13,560 Speaker 2: comes from a fantastic article by Lisa Ruff from Lefley 519 00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:17,960 Speaker 2: called Lewis Armstrong and Cannabis, The Jazz Legends Lifelong Love 520 00:31:18,080 --> 00:31:21,360 Speaker 2: of the gauge, and when he sat down with these biographers, 521 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:25,920 Speaker 2: he admitted that he did eventually have to put down 522 00:31:26,760 --> 00:31:30,920 Speaker 2: the Mary Jane right because the penalties were just too 523 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:33,360 Speaker 2: steep for him to deal with. You know, he talks 524 00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:35,520 Speaker 2: about as it's a young man's game. You know you're 525 00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:37,880 Speaker 2: going to skirt the law and live life on the edge. 526 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,960 Speaker 2: But you get older and it just stops being functional. 527 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:45,479 Speaker 1: Yeah, and he's still. My favorite part about that quote 528 00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:49,200 Speaker 1: is that he's still found a playful way to refer 529 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:51,520 Speaker 1: to the substance. You want to read this quote, it's 530 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: it's a delight, Sure it be an honor. Well that 531 00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:57,200 Speaker 1: was my life and I don't feel ashamed at all. 532 00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 1: Mary Warner, Honey, you sure was good. Enjoyed your heap much, 533 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:03,760 Speaker 1: but the price got a little too high to pay. 534 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:06,800 Speaker 1: At first, you was a misdemeanor, but as the years 535 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 1: rolled on, you lost your misdue and got meaner and meaner. 536 00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:14,200 Speaker 1: Jail Houselee speaking, so bye bye, I'll have to put 537 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 1: you down, dearest, beautiful, beautiful sad. 538 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 2: All at once. 539 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 1: It's like Kurt Vonnegut is kind of writing, There's there's 540 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,520 Speaker 1: one other thing I do want to point out. I 541 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:28,280 Speaker 1: thought you would enjoy this, nol. It has little to 542 00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:31,440 Speaker 1: do with it has little to do with Barrijuaa, but 543 00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: a lot to do with Louis Armstrong. He was an 544 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:41,840 Speaker 1: amazing trumpet player, right, and he was an amazing singer. 545 00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:48,800 Speaker 1: He was a forthright advocate for marijuana. He was also 546 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:55,800 Speaker 1: a laxative advocate. I'm sorry, a laxative advocate, Okay, yeah, 547 00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:58,520 Speaker 1: sort of like a like a John Harvey Kellogg kind 548 00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:05,200 Speaker 1: of guy. Uh, kind of hopefully not that into animals. Yeah, 549 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 1: but he was an advocate of losing weight through laxatives, 550 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:13,200 Speaker 1: which is tremendously unhealthy. Nobody do it. But he was 551 00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:16,240 Speaker 1: such a proponent of it. People would ask him how 552 00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:19,280 Speaker 1: he lost so much weight because his weight would fluctuate. Yeah, 553 00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:21,520 Speaker 1: and he was very open about it. He was like, 554 00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:24,120 Speaker 1: I used laxatives. He pooped it all out, and he 555 00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:26,960 Speaker 1: would name a brand of it. He even wrote a 556 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,000 Speaker 1: book called Lose Weight The Satchmo Way. 557 00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:31,440 Speaker 2: Was he sponsored did he have a was was he 558 00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:35,800 Speaker 2: sponsored by a what's a popular laxative? X lax that's 559 00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:37,080 Speaker 2: like a legacy brand? 560 00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:42,560 Speaker 1: Well, his initial favorite laxative was something called Pluto water. 561 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,480 Speaker 1: Oh my god, it was banned in nineteen seventy one 562 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,160 Speaker 1: because it contained lithium. 563 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 2: Oh boy, so not only did it make you poop 564 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,840 Speaker 2: your brains out, it probably made you feel real mellow. 565 00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:59,040 Speaker 1: Yes, he was so convinced that laxatives were a great 566 00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,120 Speaker 1: curative thing that he gave bottles of them to his 567 00:34:02,120 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 1: friends his presence, and he also, you know, he produced 568 00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:11,480 Speaker 1: flyers that depicted him sitting on a toilet smiling. 569 00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:12,480 Speaker 2: Wow. 570 00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:15,719 Speaker 1: He told the British family when he met them during 571 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:19,400 Speaker 1: the nineteen fifty six Great Britain Tour about how awesome 572 00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:20,319 Speaker 1: laxatives were. 573 00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:21,560 Speaker 2: True. 574 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:27,319 Speaker 1: Story, that's pretty fascinating. But I just I wanted to 575 00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:32,839 Speaker 1: end on something a little little upbeat, because it is 576 00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:37,480 Speaker 1: a shame that he was driven, you know, to say 577 00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:38,920 Speaker 1: goodbye to things that he loved. 578 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 2: It's true. And speaking of saying goodbye, Richard Nixon himself, 579 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:47,319 Speaker 2: whether or not he served as Satchmo's drug mule, he 580 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:49,800 Speaker 2: did have some very kind words to share. On the 581 00:34:49,920 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 2: day of his passing, that was July sixth, nineteen seventy one. 582 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:56,920 Speaker 2: He says, Missus Nixon and I share the sorrow of 583 00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:59,600 Speaker 2: millions of Americans at the death of Louis Armstrong. One 584 00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:01,880 Speaker 2: of the art text of an American art form, a 585 00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:05,080 Speaker 2: free and individual spirit, and an artist of worldwide fame. 586 00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,000 Speaker 2: His great talents and magnificent spirit added richness and pleasure 587 00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:12,560 Speaker 2: to all our lives. And to steal a line from this, 588 00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:16,680 Speaker 2: really cool but by far the most off the mark 589 00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:19,400 Speaker 2: version of the story, but it's animated in this series 590 00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:22,800 Speaker 2: called Drawn and Recorded Louis Armstrong, Sachimo and Nixon, you 591 00:35:22,800 --> 00:35:25,200 Speaker 2: can check out on Spotify. At the very end, it 592 00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:28,799 Speaker 2: quotes this this statement from Nixon as well and ends 593 00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:33,360 Speaker 2: by saying that Richard Nixon also added richness and pleasure 594 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:40,800 Speaker 2: to Louis Armstrong's life by smuggling his gage stash. 595 00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:45,040 Speaker 1: And this is just touching on a single anecdote from 596 00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:50,080 Speaker 1: the strange and rich history of drugs and public policy 597 00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:53,440 Speaker 1: in the United States. You know, we can also recommend, 598 00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:56,000 Speaker 1: if you'd like to learn more about the history of marijuana, 599 00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:59,040 Speaker 1: specifically in the United States, that you check out our 600 00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,040 Speaker 1: friends over its stuff. You should know and check out 601 00:36:02,080 --> 00:36:06,359 Speaker 1: the article from NPR The Mysterious History of Marijuana by 602 00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:10,360 Speaker 1: Matt Thompson, which comes via code Switch. 603 00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:12,600 Speaker 2: That's a that's a great show, really really good show. 604 00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:16,720 Speaker 1: And that's all for today, folks, thank you so much 605 00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:19,720 Speaker 1: for giving us a listener. As always, thanks to Casey 606 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:24,279 Speaker 1: Pegram our super producer, big thanks. Maybe the first time 607 00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:27,799 Speaker 1: we mentioned on the show to Christopher hasiotis man. He 608 00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:31,560 Speaker 1: is a mensh This guy is our this This guy 609 00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:34,200 Speaker 1: is a top notch researcher who's been working with us 610 00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:38,120 Speaker 1: and we're hoping that one day we can cajole him 611 00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:41,839 Speaker 1: or you know, sweet talk him into peering on the show. 612 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,759 Speaker 2: He seemed game. But yeah, we're collaborating with him on 613 00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:48,319 Speaker 2: research for new episodes from here on out, which is 614 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:51,720 Speaker 2: really exciting. So look for some really cool fun topics 615 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,520 Speaker 2: coming up, one of which is coming up next where 616 00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:59,320 Speaker 2: we talk about how a James Bond film essentially created 617 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:06,200 Speaker 2: Ada de las Muertos tradition parade event festival in a 618 00:37:06,200 --> 00:37:08,560 Speaker 2: city where that wasn't a thing. So tune in check 619 00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:08,799 Speaker 2: it out. 620 00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:11,680 Speaker 1: Yes, and in the meantime, you can find us on Instagram, 621 00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:14,400 Speaker 1: you can find us on Facebook, you can find us 622 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:17,439 Speaker 1: on Twitter. We'd love to hear from you. Also, drop 623 00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:21,560 Speaker 1: by Ridiculous Historians. I don't know if it'll be up 624 00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,120 Speaker 1: by the time this this comes out, but based on 625 00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:29,680 Speaker 1: a previous episode, one of you. Dear listeners started a 626 00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:32,440 Speaker 1: poll and the people have spoken, so I'm gonna have 627 00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:33,880 Speaker 1: to post that opuland picture. 628 00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:34,640 Speaker 2: Oh cool. 629 00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:38,399 Speaker 1: I hope it's not underwhelming. It's it's from far away then, 630 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:40,600 Speaker 1: how could it be? You can mainly see a tiny, 631 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,280 Speaker 1: a tiny boy, a gigantic cat. 632 00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:45,680 Speaker 2: But it'll be spoilers. Yeah, I can't wait to see it. 633 00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:48,439 Speaker 2: That's going to be really exciting. Do we thank Alex 634 00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:49,640 Speaker 2: Williams who composed our theme? 635 00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:52,160 Speaker 1: You know what, even if we did, let's thank him again, right, 636 00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:52,840 Speaker 1: he deserves it. 637 00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:55,439 Speaker 2: Thanks Alex Williams who composed our theme, and most partly 638 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:57,680 Speaker 2: thanks to you for listening to ano episod of Ridiculous History. 639 00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:08,800 Speaker 2: Can't wait to see you next time. For more podcasts 640 00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:12,320 Speaker 2: from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 641 00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:14,000 Speaker 2: you listen to your favorite shows.