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Speaker 1: This is me eat your podcast coming at you shirtless, severely,

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Speaker 1: bug bitten and in my case, underwear listening hunt, don't

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Speaker 1: eat podcast. You can't predict anything presented by first, like

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Speaker 1: creating proven versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to

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Speaker 1: technical outerwear for every hunt first like go farther, stay longer. Hey,

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Speaker 1: this is Steve. This sounds weird is because I'm using

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Speaker 1: the voice memo function on my phone and fills passionate

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Speaker 1: into the show. It's a very important message I have

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Speaker 1: for you. Unmay three, We're doing a live show in Billings,

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Speaker 1: Montana at the Alberta Bear Theater. So Alberta like you

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Speaker 1: know Canada and bear not like a bear that you'd

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Speaker 1: go hunting for it, but be a I r Berta

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Speaker 1: Bear Theater. Get tickets through them live show May three.

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna be there, uh j honest, But tell Us

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Speaker 1: will be there old Cow for the entire show. The

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Speaker 1: flip Flop flesher seth Morris will be fleshing beaver and

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Speaker 1: raccoon hides off on I believe what's called stage left

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Speaker 1: in a beautiful spotlight Chester. The Divester will be there

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Speaker 1: and everyone that buys a ticket gets a signed copy

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Speaker 1: of my new book, Outdoor Kids in an Inside World.

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Speaker 1: Get your tickets now. Go to Alberta Bear Theater website.

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Speaker 1: May three billings, Montana. Can't wait to see you guys.

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Speaker 1: Love y'all. All right, everybody, Uh, here's the deal. Normally,

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Speaker 1: the way the show works as we do, Um, like

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Speaker 1: what kind of intro? I don't know if anybody out

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Speaker 1: there actually listens that carefully enough to notice this, but

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Speaker 1: you guys probably don't even realize this they're in here.

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Speaker 1: I think we do. We'll do like a light intro

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Speaker 1: of a gas right, like a light intro, a little banter.

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Speaker 1: Are you explaining to us how this works? And listeners,

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Speaker 1: I think we got it, but okay, tell me then

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Speaker 1: what happens? Do light intro? Light intro? Then we introduce everybody,

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Speaker 1: if you remember, and then what happens? And then we

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Speaker 1: go into talking about ship that either people wrote in

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Speaker 1: about or stuff that we did that week, or a

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Speaker 1: couple of rabbit holes maybe yeh, go on a few tangents,

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Speaker 1: and then we sometimes argue about ship, and then we

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Speaker 1: go to the guests and talk about that that's been

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Speaker 1: paying attention. We're gonna change things up because we're gonna

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Speaker 1: do a light I'm gonna do a couple of talking points,

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Speaker 1: then the light intro. Cool Um. This is going to

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Speaker 1: further test people's ability to pay attention because just because

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Speaker 1: of a weird issue, I don't want to get into

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Speaker 1: where we we recorded a show that we're gonna release

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Speaker 1: after this show. It's It's it's features are beloved, your

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Speaker 1: honest to tell us who's sitting here right now? Uh?

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Speaker 1: And I don't want to miss it. In it, I

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Speaker 1: allude to a fleet at the end, I allude to

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Speaker 1: a flee story that I wanted to tell but ran

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Speaker 1: out of time. So now people are going to in

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Speaker 1: the future hear me allude to a flee story that

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Speaker 1: I want to tell, but I have already told it.

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Speaker 1: Can I can? I can? I tee it up for you?

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Speaker 1: So Steve had me come over and put a rack

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Speaker 1: on his canam the other day. Well I would I

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Speaker 1: wouldn't put it that way. Well, we we worked out. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: And I just want to run in the project. Though

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Speaker 1: I was I was happy that I was happy to

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Speaker 1: do it. But I show up, Steve comes out of

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Speaker 1: his garage and he's hold on you can't just say

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Speaker 1: I just he has me to come over to put

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Speaker 1: a rock installing installing a cargo rack. Chester was Jester

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Speaker 1: came over to help me install a cargo right, but

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Speaker 1: I wasn't able to give it my full attention because

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Speaker 1: of my problem. Yeah, so I show up, you know,

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Speaker 1: and Steve kind of comes out of the garage and

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Speaker 1: he's like, oh man, guys. He's kind of frantically moving

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Speaker 1: around a little bit. He's like, I'm in deep trouble

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Speaker 1: right now, guys, I'm in big trouble. Just hold on,

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Speaker 1: Just do your thing. And this is why I had

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Speaker 1: brought a kyo at home at night. And my dog

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Speaker 1: hates kyle and hates kyote fur skin, hates kyles, won't

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Speaker 1: go near it. If you come in with a kyote hide,

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Speaker 1: even a pelt, she goes the other end of the house.

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Speaker 1: She can tell she loves dogs, but she knows that

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Speaker 1: that dog never met a dog she didn't like. But

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Speaker 1: she can smell something on that that like that son

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Speaker 1: of a bitch is not a right. She just knows.

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Speaker 1: So I laid on the floor of the garage and think,

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Speaker 1: you well, she'll never go into that. Then I'm down

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Speaker 1: here in the studio and I'm looking at my text

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Speaker 1: messages in my wife and our babysit are having this

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Speaker 1: like ongoing thing about holy shit, the fleas on the dog.

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Speaker 1: And they're like, is it from the dog park? How

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Speaker 1: could it be? They're like they're all over I mean,

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Speaker 1: her head's crawling and fleas, And I'm thinking, no one

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Speaker 1: knows about the thing in the garage except me. I

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Speaker 1: gotta be like, I think I might have a little

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Speaker 1: something to add here. You wouldn't have believed you should

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Speaker 1: have had just Chester roll over there and grabbed that

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Speaker 1: coyote and just hide it. Oh and it just played dumb. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I really should. It's like she went, you know, like

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Speaker 1: when something's body tamp gets to like there's a point

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Speaker 1: at which fleas they're on a sink and ship they're

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Speaker 1: on a sink and ship. It's like she laid down

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Speaker 1: and spooned with that thing. There's no way to explain

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Speaker 1: the number of fleas on that dog. I've heard um

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Speaker 1: like trappers that have a have something that's got fleas

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Speaker 1: will put like a warm rabbit next it, so they

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Speaker 1: like a like a cold that something they trapped that's cold,

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Speaker 1: it's got fleas, they'll put a warm rabbit next to it,

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Speaker 1: so all the fleas get on there. Who told you that?

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Speaker 1: I don't know where I heard it and then put it?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm saying I heard it, and then

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Speaker 1: you burn the mouse the on it didn't make a

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Speaker 1: warm rabbit? Is that like forty five seconds on medium high?

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I look, I'm just saying it's a

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Speaker 1: funny story. I hear all kinds of stuff. I don't talk.

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Speaker 1: You had a warm dog next to a cold Oh? Really? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: give me an example of something funny. You heard that,

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Speaker 1: then you decided not to talk about something like that. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you want another good, real quick flee story. Yeah, but okay,

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Speaker 1: go ahead, because I'm gonna finish my fleet story up.

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Speaker 1: But go ahead, holdout. Fitter I worked for. He used

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Speaker 1: to collect rabbits for a mink farm in Colorado. That's

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Speaker 1: how I put himself through college, partially anyway. And he

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Speaker 1: would load up the trunk of his car with jack

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Speaker 1: rabbits every night, and his roommate was like, hey, man,

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Speaker 1: can I borrow his car? He used he did this

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Speaker 1: business in a car with a trunk. Yeah, and the

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Speaker 1: fields at night and and just thump rabbits with with

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Speaker 1: his front bumper. You know, maink farmer wasn't real particular

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Speaker 1: about how the meat showed up field care um, and

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Speaker 1: so he didn't get a chance to drop the rabbits

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Speaker 1: off to the mink farm. Lets his buddy take his vehicle,

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Speaker 1: and his buddy and his date seemed to really hit

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Speaker 1: it off, and they were using the backseat up until

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Speaker 1: point where they neither one of them could concentrate due

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Speaker 1: to the itching involved. And apparently these two were just coated.

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Speaker 1: Had to tail in uh in fleece. That was me

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Speaker 1: this day I'm talking about. I went to the gym.

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Speaker 1: So I got in the morning and took the kyle

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Speaker 1: out of my truck and I almost a bear hugged

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Speaker 1: that some bitch without thinking about it. I'm at the

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Speaker 1: gym just itching like blue blazes. I'm sitting here itching

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Speaker 1: like blue blazes and not like man, I gotta freeze

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Speaker 1: these clothes, which I did. I gotta go home and

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Speaker 1: put these clothes in the freezer and take a shower.

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Speaker 1: But I thought it was like I wasn't even think

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Speaker 1: about the damn dog. I'm still got, I got, I'm

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Speaker 1: still itchy. Is that I got a question. Is that

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Speaker 1: the coyote that's sitting by my desk right now? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I froze it, alright, I froze the hide. Garrett's

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Speaker 1: using it as a wall he wants, he's keeping it

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Speaker 1: as a wall hanger, Dude, that I'm surprised that you

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Speaker 1: didn't get in trouble. You probably did. Actually, No, the

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Speaker 1: smell of that thing was you know, they don't they know.

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Speaker 1: I'm not even I don't even care to hear about

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Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. That was. Yeah, it was. It

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Speaker 1: was a really fecund odor. Uh oh a another pre

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Speaker 1: talking I was getting checked by a game warden in

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Speaker 1: Arizona a couple of weeks ago, and he said, oh,

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Speaker 1: after you checked my license and realized that I was cool,

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Speaker 1: he goes. He says, oh, you were talking on the

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Speaker 1: podcast and why we do grip and grin's with confiscated material,

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Speaker 1: He goes. It's not like a grip and grin he

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Speaker 1: said later in court, it's to demonstrate the magnetude. It's

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Speaker 1: to later in court for a jury. It's just to

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Speaker 1: like demonstrate the magnitude of something. Because you can tell

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Speaker 1: people all day long about X pounds of whatever, And

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Speaker 1: it's kind of in one year and out the other.

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Speaker 1: But when you're like out, you the same thing with

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Speaker 1: when they lay all the narcotics out. It's just so

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Speaker 1: people can be like, my goodness, and you weren't like

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Speaker 1: and so it's not because you guys are a little

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Speaker 1: bit proud that you guys, he said. It's it's just

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Speaker 1: a it's just a thing to present in the courtroom.

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Speaker 1: Just too, he said, saynything with drugs, like you tell

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Speaker 1: people like key lows or whatever, and then they see it,

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Speaker 1: they're like, holy cow, look at all that stuff. So

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Speaker 1: that's why he does that. Uh Oh. Another funny thing

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Speaker 1: is I on Sunday was ice fishing and stood up

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Speaker 1: my phone iPhone twelve right down the ice hole of

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Speaker 1: water and we had a flasher going and you could

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Speaker 1: watch that phone not if you call his phone a

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Speaker 1: perch pick. So yeah, I wouldn't stood over the whole yesterday.

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Speaker 1: And it was like, it's so like Chester was off

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Speaker 1: doing something twenty roughly thirty ft away, and I'd like

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Speaker 1: to think Chester that my phone that I'm as close

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Speaker 1: to you as I and my phone, but it's so

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Speaker 1: far away. So you guys were fishing yesterday, which was

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Speaker 1: a Monday, kind of took picture. We were it was

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Speaker 1: Sunday after this Monday, and Monday was worse than Sunday. Um,

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Speaker 1: you know, it was worse than fishing. I was sitting

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Speaker 1: friend the computer all day about that, it's day day

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Speaker 1: of fishing is better than a bad day work. Uh.

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Speaker 1: That was me saying I have a pretty good quote

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Speaker 1: on that. Actually, we're not ready for you yet. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna get into you hardcore in a minute here. Uh oh,

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Speaker 1: another thing people need to start. I want people need

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Speaker 1: to start. Uh go go on Clay Nucombe so like

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Speaker 1: Newcomb Clay underscore NUKEM and start pressuring Clay for Beargreas podcast.

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Speaker 1: I've been trying to get Clay to do a deep

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Speaker 1: dive on the Wetzel brothers. Lou Wetzel and the Wetzel brothers.

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Speaker 1: They won't do it. Start to piss me off. Can

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Speaker 1: you tell us why? What's interesting about the Wetzel brothers

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Speaker 1: very controversial frontier figures um and very controversial frontier figures

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Speaker 1: from the Indian Wars along the Ohio River. Why don't

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Speaker 1: you just do something on them? Because the Clay should

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Speaker 1: do something to them. If you're so interesting. I used

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Speaker 1: to call him the death Wind. There bringing it up,

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Speaker 1: and we're all interested to death Wind. There were sociopaths, Um,

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Speaker 1: you could like they were psychopathic killers who were sort

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Speaker 1: of tangled up in the Indian Wars. They haven't made

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Speaker 1: a movie about those guys. Fascinating, blood thirsty little bastards. Um.

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Speaker 1: He should really do a dive on the Wessels. But

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Speaker 1: he's like, he likes to do things that have redemption,

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Speaker 1: and there's no redemption. With lou Wessel it sounds like

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Speaker 1: a Tarantino movie. Yeah, I mean his family was like

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Speaker 1: his family was mostly killed off by the tribes. He

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Speaker 1: didn't like to do vengeance through the military. They just

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Speaker 1: like to go with their go their own, go with

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Speaker 1: their own. They would cross the Ohio and just go on.

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Speaker 1: He's like murderous trips. Fascinating dudes, Horrible people, but fascinating

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Speaker 1: And and he won't do it because there's no redemption.

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Speaker 1: So you could just put a comment on everything that

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Speaker 1: Clay posts, just start writing the death Wind. Last quick

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Speaker 1: note before we get to our guests is if anyone

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Speaker 1: knows if someone could write in there's gotta be like

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Speaker 1: a like a ten twenty two experts out there? Who

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Speaker 1: does souped up ten twenty two? Mm hmm, Well then

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Speaker 1: you guys cover all the buy afflon and shoot stuff

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Speaker 1: and all that. I mean, no, but but but I

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Speaker 1: bought my boy a Ruger ten twenty two for his birthday.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't like it because it's not a tack driver.

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Speaker 1: I an't got to do a lot, like a lot

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Speaker 1: of money making those things. And they spent a lot

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Speaker 1: of money. Yeah, the Olympic ten twenty target, right, A

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Speaker 1: lot of guys use it for dialing in big game

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Speaker 1: rifles too. But you know, so, why is it a

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Speaker 1: ten twenty two target. It's not just a target, it's

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Speaker 1: it's the target that they use for like competition twenty two.

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Speaker 1: It's not ten twenty two. You just said, yeah, I did.

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Speaker 1: Oh I'm trying to find someone who get a bunch

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Speaker 1: of Amma all as many manufacturers you can dig up,

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Speaker 1: get that target and little Jimmy and try to solve

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Speaker 1: the problem that way. I think there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: tweak and that goes on with those. That's what I'm

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Speaker 1: curious about, because it's got like I'm just curious, like

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Speaker 1: what people do the competition you do yourself a CZ

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Speaker 1: The only you need to do is tume and re

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Speaker 1: barrel them and what you're saying. But as far as

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Speaker 1: the the ammunition to like, we had one of the

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Speaker 1: like the top tier twenty two manufacturers up in Kallus

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Speaker 1: Bell I'm not sure if they're still there. Um, but

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Speaker 1: even even those rounds like competitive shooters, we'll go through

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Speaker 1: and look for flaws and deformities and and then go

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Speaker 1: with like the most uniform batches and and set them

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Speaker 1: aside and batches and yeah, there's a big, big deal. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: Barbara was running I think, but pretty much just had

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Speaker 1: a bull barrel? What else you had done with it? Alright, Brent,

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Speaker 1: you're ready, I'm ready. Okay, Brent West is here from

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Speaker 1: High Peaks Alliance. Tell us what High Peace Alliances and

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Speaker 1: Karrent thinks you might be the first Native maner. What

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Speaker 1: do you guys call each other maners? Not a few

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Speaker 1: of us montane each other by name Mainers. Yeah that's

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Speaker 1: the actual thing, ye mainers. Huh. Okay, High Peaks Alliance, Yeah.

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Speaker 1: High High Peaks Alliance is a conservation and recreational nonprofit

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Speaker 1: in Franklin County, Maine. So our major goals are to

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Speaker 1: conserve land and access for our communities, and we do

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Speaker 1: that through a number of different projects, whether it's trail

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Speaker 1: projects or land conservation projects. UM. But the real thread

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Speaker 1: is that everyone who grew up here, lives here, visits here,

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Speaker 1: have a lot of things in common. We all have

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Speaker 1: a woodpile, a garden out back, a little buck meat

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Speaker 1: in the freezer. All these things kind of tie us

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Speaker 1: together as people who love to live in rural Maine

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Speaker 1: and visit rural Maine. It's not enough hassle up there,

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Speaker 1: and it's a really great place to live because you

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Speaker 1: just have this freedom to rome. You want to keep

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Speaker 1: it that way? Yeah, absolutely, tell us what's in that

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Speaker 1: bag right there? I brought you some new Portland wood fired,

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Speaker 1: hand tapped. I used an old hand drill, buckets, spiles,

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Speaker 1: maple sugar, not syrup, mind you. Well, so this got

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Speaker 1: me in some trouble at the airport. UM had a

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Speaker 1: big bag of brown cocaine. I got pulled out a

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Speaker 1: line and the lady tested it and sniffed it. No,

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Speaker 1: but she was She did stick her pinky out a

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Speaker 1: little bit. She didn't do like in the movies where

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Speaker 1: she rubbed it into her lip. It turned blue. I

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Speaker 1: imagine in class, like when you're training for that job,

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Speaker 1: they're like, if you come across powder, don't sniff it. Well,

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Speaker 1: I was thinking away, how how we could give you

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Speaker 1: something a piece of maine here that kind of in

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Speaker 1: line with um your values and cal actually has had

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Speaker 1: some of this already, but this is the first time

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Speaker 1: I've ever uh came into physical contact. I think, with

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Speaker 1: plenty of the syrup, which is maple syrup. But tell

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Speaker 1: me how you got it down, Like how do you

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Speaker 1: get down to crystal form and real paint and the

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Speaker 1: ass Well what I what I do is you make

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Speaker 1: an abundance of this. So like my father boils a

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Speaker 1: lot of it, I tap a lot of the trees.

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Speaker 1: We kind of do that together. He has an old

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Speaker 1: um oil tank cut in half that we put a

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Speaker 1: pan on top, and we burned wood under it to

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Speaker 1: boil it off. So it takes about forty two gallons

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Speaker 1: of sap to make one gallon of syrup. One gallon

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Speaker 1: of syrup will probably reduce again by or so when

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Speaker 1: you boil it to I forget the temperature, but it's

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Speaker 1: like threefty two degrees or something like that that you

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Speaker 1: have to boil the syrup to and then starts stirring

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Speaker 1: the crap out of it, and it just starts crystallizing

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Speaker 1: and then most of it is fine. But you can

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Speaker 1: run it through a few food processor to break up

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Speaker 1: the big pieces. But you you could put that in

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Speaker 1: water and make it back to syrup if you got

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Speaker 1: the right amount. But ye, snorting some right now off

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Speaker 1: a key. My. We pretty much only use maple sugar

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Speaker 1: now for we don't really buy any sugar anymore. Do

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Speaker 1: you guys call it? It's really good. You guys call

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Speaker 1: it a up in Maine too, like your little operations. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of people do maple syrup right now.

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Speaker 1: Like literally, my father sent me a picture he's boiling today. Um. So,

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Speaker 1: what what you want is sugar. Maples are the best,

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Speaker 1: but pretty much any maple species will work. Um. And

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Speaker 1: you want freezing at night and about high thirties low

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Speaker 1: forties during the day. And what that happens is the

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Speaker 1: ends of the branches will freeze and when they thought

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Speaker 1: during the day, they create a vacuum and that's what

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Speaker 1: makes the saffron. That's what's going on in there. Yeah exactly, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and all you have to do is tap. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I knew it ram, but I didn't know it was

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Speaker 1: related to that. SE's probably do that because he's trained

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Speaker 1: up in forestry. My family's got a little sugar bush

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Speaker 1: back home, cousin Jake. So yeah, Yanni's ordered some of

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Speaker 1: this era. But it's pretty fascinating, that whole whole scene.

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Speaker 1: It's fun. Guys nowadays do it very technically. You know,

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Speaker 1: it's it's reverse osmosis oil fired. We do it pretty

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Speaker 1: old school. So that what we got here is we

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Speaker 1: got a court size ziplock that's good, probably full, and

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Speaker 1: that's the result of what volume of sap. I'm unshare

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Speaker 1: had a huge, like two gallon bag that I just

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Speaker 1: scooped that out and through it to my carry on,

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Speaker 1: So that I mean, they say it really doesn't reduce

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Speaker 1: that much from liquid because it's already very viscous as syrup,

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Speaker 1: so you're really not taking that much more water out

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Speaker 1: of it. Um, so you could take a quart of

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Speaker 1: maple syrup and maybe get you know of that in

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Speaker 1: volume and sugar. Do you bake with it? I don't

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Speaker 1: do much baking. My wife loves to use it, but

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Speaker 1: you're married, Um sick going on six years. All right,

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Speaker 1: it's going really good. Now, she's actually I got one. Yeah, well,

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Speaker 1: I think we all need to get get strapped down

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Speaker 1: as good American men. She actually is. Well, if you

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Speaker 1: are into population dynamics, we're going towards a pretty uh

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Speaker 1: crazy cliff of not many young people and a whole

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Speaker 1: lot of old people like main for instance, will have

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Speaker 1: from there will be increase in our population of plus

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Speaker 1: anywhere from an eight to twelve decrease in all of

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Speaker 1: the age groups. Short term net sounds scary. Long term

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Speaker 1: I like it, yeah, I mean it might be difficult.

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Speaker 1: I'm just in a global sense, like globally, I don't

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Speaker 1: think there's anyone out there thinking that globally we need

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Speaker 1: a higher human population. I don't know. I think a

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Speaker 1: lot of people think, in conservation and land and natural

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Speaker 1: resources that human are the scourge of the earth. I

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Speaker 1: think that's a poor way to look at people. I

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Speaker 1: think I did say that. Well, I think have you

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Speaker 1: heard anyone on the global level. Have you heard do

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Speaker 1: you know of any global thinker or like on the

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Speaker 1: global level someone saying what this earth needs is more

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Speaker 1: billions of people? Anyone? Jordan Peterson talks about that dynamic

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Speaker 1: of that more people isn't a bad thing. Does he

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Speaker 1: hunt and fish a lot? He doesn't look like, well,

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Speaker 1: that's that's the that's the biggest roblin. When I look

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Speaker 1: at Jordan Pearson, I don't see I'm not like there's

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Speaker 1: a there's a hard hitting outdoorsman. No. I think he's

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Speaker 1: a you know, questioning change and stuff like that too,

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Speaker 1: So now he's a thinker. Um, I'm coming at this

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Speaker 1: from a hunting and fishing perspective kind of thing. Just

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Speaker 1: global population. Listen, man, you guys are starting to make

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Speaker 1: you act like I'm saying something crazy. I don't think

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Speaker 1: that says what we really need is nine billion human

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Speaker 1: global citizens. It just like no one is saying this

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Speaker 1: if you relate it to the amount of piles of

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Speaker 1: human feces at a trailhead, like the relationship to the

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Speaker 1: population to the relationship of human piles of feces at

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Speaker 1: a popular trailhead. Yeah, I mean less people is just

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Speaker 1: from a poop perspective. Well, that's a conund vest. When

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Speaker 1: you're losing more access by default, you're going to get

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Speaker 1: more of those piles at your public access points. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's true. So if I don't. I don't want to

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Speaker 1: dwell in this bonus case. Like if I if someone

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Speaker 1: said to you, you can, you can. You're you're not

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Speaker 1: causing any pain and suffering. But someone said to you,

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Speaker 1: you can choose that in a decade the earth. What

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Speaker 1: are you right now? Seven billion, seven something billion? Okay,

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Speaker 1: someone says you you can choose there's no you're not

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Speaker 1: making pain and suffering. You can choose it. In a decade,

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Speaker 1: there's six billion global citizens, or there's eight billion global citizens.

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Speaker 1: Up to you, no pain and suffering. But what do

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Speaker 1: you choose? What would you choose? I I think I

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Speaker 1: get your point. The point I'm trying to look at

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Speaker 1: So you have a number of kids too, right, three

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Speaker 1: of them? Three of them. So in the last twenty

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Speaker 1: so years, though, we've had a big decline in families

398
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Speaker 1: having four kids, three kids and to deal with well.

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Speaker 1: But it's also you know, all these guys are getting

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Speaker 1: married later and they're having kids later, and that also

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Speaker 1: affects you know, more people getting into the outdoors liking

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Speaker 1: these things. So it's just, uh, the original point I'm

403
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Speaker 1: trying to make is you shouldn't look at people as

404
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Speaker 1: necessarily the problem because there's a lot of good that

405
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Speaker 1: comes with people having kids, having families. Uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: having those relationships in your community. You know, I think

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Speaker 1: those things lead to better outcomes for the land in general. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you're allring new guy who has three kids. Yeah, you're

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Speaker 1: part of the problem. And it's a new guy who

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Speaker 1: I think the dudes should be married. Yeah, exactly, because

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Speaker 1: I think it allows them to focus on a was

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Speaker 1: in the focus on productivity, well house chores. Yeah, for sure.

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Speaker 1: Before I was married, I focus a lot of time.

414
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Speaker 1: I'm just drinking alcohol. That was my focus and shooting pool. Really,

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Speaker 1: Oh dude. When I was a graduate school man, we'd

416
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Speaker 1: sometimes finish up and if like whatever, I got good

417
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Speaker 1: at it, we'd sometimes go down there to get we'd

418
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Speaker 1: like finish up doing something or another and go down

419
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Speaker 1: like at noon or one down to the Dinosaur Cafe

420
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Speaker 1: to get like a poll boy. Then the the next thing,

421
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Speaker 1: you he was last call. But man ship, it's like

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Speaker 1: we just shot poop for twelve hours. Well, I think

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Speaker 1: that's the attraction of going so long. You know, all

424
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:50,320
Speaker 1: your twenties being free, hunting fish, do whatever. All right, Uh,

425
00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:53,880
Speaker 1: Chrins said you had some some main factoris who generated

426
00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:58,600
Speaker 1: these factoids? They're facts? Did you generate them? I reached

427
00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:02,639
Speaker 1: out to many. Actually we enlisted a Jeopardy champion to

428
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:05,199
Speaker 1: come up with some of these. Are you playing tribute

429
00:26:05,200 --> 00:26:08,400
Speaker 1: with us later? I would love to. Are you intimidated?

430
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:10,000
Speaker 1: Do you think you're gonna do what? I'm not scared

431
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:13,639
Speaker 1: a bit. See Kela tell me you were like a

432
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:17,600
Speaker 1: contraryan in uh, like a real fact based contrarian. Well,

433
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:22,960
Speaker 1: I am from New England. You know, we we liked it.

434
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:26,560
Speaker 1: That's one thing I noticed in the Westerners. You guys

435
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 1: take offense fairly quickly. What do you think of that?

436
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:35,320
Speaker 1: Ye from Michigan? You know you notice where we're just

437
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:39,920
Speaker 1: out and about, you know, just like a level of play.

438
00:26:39,960 --> 00:26:42,080
Speaker 1: You gotta talk to Cal because Kell's from the area.

439
00:26:43,600 --> 00:26:47,600
Speaker 1: Brent Canvas, the town yesterday talking with that. Everybody talked

440
00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 1: to you was offended. There must be the town. Yeah,

441
00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:53,239
Speaker 1: But nobody that lives here is from here. You know,

442
00:26:53,320 --> 00:26:56,320
Speaker 1: everyone's really nice. I actually got a pretty good low

443
00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:59,640
Speaker 1: down on what's happening on the Madison River. The damn blowout.

444
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 1: I hear that's fairly contained. Contentious round here, just gonna

445
00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:09,119
Speaker 1: make bigger trout listen. Okay, we covered that, Okay, but

446
00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:11,240
Speaker 1: him here some main factories. We gotta get the show

447
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 1: rolling here. Well, I would just want to tell you

448
00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:17,160
Speaker 1: more about, you know, Maine as a place that kind

449
00:27:17,160 --> 00:27:22,840
Speaker 1: of steeped in sporting heritage. Seven Henry David Throw you know,

450
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:25,040
Speaker 1: wrote his book on the main Woods, went up to

451
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:32,640
Speaker 1: He's a candy. He did inspire Teddy Roosevelt falls. Well,

452
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,000
Speaker 1: he's like obsessed with his mom. Even when he was

453
00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 1: doing that stuff about living in that cab, he's still

454
00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:39,480
Speaker 1: walking home to his mos every other day. Well, I

455
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:41,960
Speaker 1: mean he had it a little harder than you and us,

456
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:45,159
Speaker 1: right like hour he didn't help. I think he was.

457
00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:47,960
Speaker 1: I think he Wasn't he like running off someone else's

458
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:53,240
Speaker 1: money and stuff. Well, probably he was dabbling. He's a dabbler.

459
00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 1: You go on though. Well, anyways, my point was that

460
00:27:56,359 --> 00:28:02,200
Speaker 1: kind of started Maine as a tourist, uh do nation um,

461
00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:07,080
Speaker 1: and I went to the woods to live deliberately kind

462
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:10,639
Speaker 1: of at my mom's though I actually haven't read The

463
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 1: main Woods. It's a fact toy that was brought up

464
00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:17,720
Speaker 1: to me that they thought would be important to say.

465
00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:23,240
Speaker 1: He was a missing thrope. What a missing thrope? What's

466
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:27,280
Speaker 1: that hated people like Steve Well and you're like pro people,

467
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:30,119
Speaker 1: go on pro people is good man. Yeah, we're to

468
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:37,080
Speaker 1: showdown now. But I was gonna reach its climax during this.

469
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:41,080
Speaker 1: I noticed in the trivia he's very competitive, and I

470
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 1: like that about someone. So, um, he's already playing hardball.

471
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 1: I see. But anyways, I brought you a book to peruse.

472
00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:55,520
Speaker 1: It's called Becoming Teddy Rosevelt. I thought you'd like this, Um,

473
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:58,200
Speaker 1: and that's just buying bookmark. It's not. That's gonna be

474
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:00,760
Speaker 1: the only Teddy Roosevelt photo I've never seen. There you go.

475
00:29:00,840 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 1: Have you seen that picture before? Yeah? I own the book.

476
00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:07,640
Speaker 1: Besides his book, look at that and let me see it.

477
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,280
Speaker 1: Talk about having a weird relationship with your mom, this

478
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:16,000
Speaker 1: guy and running off of somebody else's money. That's true.

479
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:21,920
Speaker 1: But I still like something well that books about his

480
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 1: time in the main Woods and how Bill Sewell in Wilmo.

481
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: Now two main guides kind of had a big impact

482
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:33,440
Speaker 1: on his life. Um, so he went up in Hyke

483
00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 1: Todd and and Moccasins. He did all sorts of crazy stuff. Um.

484
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:40,720
Speaker 1: Is a great book because it gives you, at the

485
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:42,240
Speaker 1: time a lot of people are going to main because

486
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:44,640
Speaker 1: it was so accessible to New York and Boston, and

487
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,360
Speaker 1: it was a wild country. Get some wild ass wilderness

488
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,280
Speaker 1: on a train, Yeah, exactly, And that's what kind of

489
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:52,720
Speaker 1: drove a lot of things, Like in our neck of

490
00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 1: the woods. The train came through late eighteen hundreds. Um,

491
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 1: same time. Fly Rod Crosby was the first ever main

492
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:03,840
Speaker 1: guy I licensed, and she was pretty interesting. Lady fly

493
00:30:04,000 --> 00:30:08,760
Speaker 1: Rod Crosby was a woman. Correct not her birth name

494
00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: Cornelia Thursda Crosby. And um, this is what she said

495
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 1: about herself. I am a plain woman of uncertain age,

496
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:23,000
Speaker 1: standing six ft tall in my stockings. I scribble a

497
00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,400
Speaker 1: bit for various sporting journals, and I would rather fish

498
00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,880
Speaker 1: any day than go to heaven. You have took me

499
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,240
Speaker 1: with her? Yeah, yeah, she's awesome. She's passed way now.

500
00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: I was like, I'll find a feller for it, but

501
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,520
Speaker 1: she would. She went to like the first Sportsman's expositions

502
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 1: in New York, and she brought like a whole log

503
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 1: cabin down there, and it was the main Woods, and

504
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 1: she wore a scantily short doe skin skirt which showed

505
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:55,680
Speaker 1: her calf. Um. That was scandalous. Back then friends with

506
00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:59,600
Speaker 1: Annie Oakley and yeah, so very interesting. She catched a

507
00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:02,960
Speaker 1: ton of this is the same area. Um, I don't

508
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:05,800
Speaker 1: know if anyone's fly fisherman, but really a lot of

509
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 1: history there. You have, um Kerry Stevens inventing a ton

510
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 1: of different flies, four of these people in his room

511
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:15,520
Speaker 1: or fly fishing guides. Good. Well do you guys know,

512
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:20,560
Speaker 1: uh great ghost, the old black black Ghost. Those are

513
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:26,000
Speaker 1: all invented in high peaks of main. Well, so that

514
00:31:26,080 --> 00:31:35,240
Speaker 1: was that was like what like in the twenties ten Well,

515
00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 1: so what was interesting The rail companies hired fly rod

516
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: in these people, and uh they said, don't talk about

517
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:44,800
Speaker 1: how good our trains are, talking about how good the

518
00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 1: fishing is. And so people be by default taking the

519
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 1: main Central Railway up to range le and and catch

520
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,120
Speaker 1: these huge brook trout. Um. The railroads used to host

521
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:59,080
Speaker 1: like big fish competitions too, right, so they'd like give

522
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 1: away cash to whoever gets the biggest fish. But it

523
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 1: was based off of like these gotta get on the train,

524
00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 1: go a long way to go fish. And there you know,

525
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:11,320
Speaker 1: there's a lot of history out west of like people

526
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:14,320
Speaker 1: going out to Alaska catching big salmon. But you couldn't

527
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:16,480
Speaker 1: get there back then in a reasonable amount of time.

528
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 1: So you even have accounts of some of the ponds

529
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:21,000
Speaker 1: in this neck of the the woods getting stocked with like

530
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:24,360
Speaker 1: soaki salmon and stuff like that, Like just really bizarre

531
00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:29,440
Speaker 1: histories of uh sporting camps. America's longest running sporting camp

532
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 1: ever is in this Franklin County Tympon Camps. But there's

533
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:36,080
Speaker 1: a bunch of old logging camps that turn sporting camps,

534
00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:38,640
Speaker 1: and so there's a big tradition of that in this

535
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 1: neck of the woods where people would come up from

536
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:43,000
Speaker 1: the smog of the city to get some fresh air

537
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 1: and stay for two weeks a month. Are you gonna

538
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: hit on how fly Rod Crosby ended up being the

539
00:32:48,280 --> 00:32:51,000
Speaker 1: last person to legally harvest the Caribean Maine. What year

540
00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:56,640
Speaker 1: was at that was? I think it was around um

541
00:32:56,720 --> 00:33:01,320
Speaker 1: but I think that also that was I I couldn't

542
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,920
Speaker 1: drill down on exactly what year that happened. I know,

543
00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 1: like was like the last time they saw them up

544
00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 1: in northern Maine, like so it was in that time

545
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,320
Speaker 1: period where she had shot the last legally one, so

546
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 1: I think the population was declining. They probably stopped hunting

547
00:33:16,200 --> 00:33:19,040
Speaker 1: him Yeah, is there ever any that that you've been

548
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:21,719
Speaker 1: privy to, Like we just in our own lifetimes watched

549
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:26,960
Speaker 1: caribou blink out in Idaho and Washington. Um, is there

550
00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 1: any serious conversation ever in Maine about trying to uh

551
00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 1: restore caribou herds in Maine? Or is that just ships sailed?

552
00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:38,960
Speaker 1: They did that, They tried hard for a number of

553
00:33:39,040 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 1: years and it didn't didn't work out as well. I

554
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:44,400
Speaker 1: think there's probably too many land changes in northern main

555
00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 1: forestry wise too to support them. And I think you're

556
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:51,280
Speaker 1: already coming in on a radically receding environment anyways. I mean,

557
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: if you go back to like the tail end of

558
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 1: the place of scene they were down in Ohio and Indiana,

559
00:33:55,760 --> 00:33:57,440
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. I think you're sort of

560
00:33:57,480 --> 00:33:59,959
Speaker 1: like we kind of arrived in time to watch them

561
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:03,320
Speaker 1: blink out. Anyway. Well, I think like they have records

562
00:34:03,320 --> 00:34:05,440
Speaker 1: of the red paint people in our neck was twelve

563
00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 1: thirteen thousand years ago, and so I'm guessing that's when

564
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: it would have been more tundra. Like that's probably you know,

565
00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,200
Speaker 1: more when a lot of those were running around. Tell

566
00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:21,920
Speaker 1: me about how Eisenhower, Um, I I understand that Eisenhower

567
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 1: Dwight Eisenhower. He there's a famous picture of him like

568
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:28,719
Speaker 1: holding up his hand two paratroopers on D Day, and

569
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:31,879
Speaker 1: they've used this picture a lot. But apparently the backstory

570
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,839
Speaker 1: is that he found out some of the troopers there

571
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 1: were fly fishermen, so they all just started talking about

572
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,919
Speaker 1: their favorite fly fish. And that's what he's doing his hand. Yeah,

573
00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 1: he's hold the fly. Really. I heard a story I've

574
00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:46,920
Speaker 1: heard us a couple of times that after he addressed

575
00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 1: the airborne that he went and he gave him like

576
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:54,919
Speaker 1: a rousing speech, but went and wept because he knew

577
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:57,799
Speaker 1: it was a death sentence. Yeah. I couldn't imagine all

578
00:34:57,800 --> 00:35:00,680
Speaker 1: the guys coming on gliders. He knew that I'll be

579
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:05,600
Speaker 1: down in the morning and so many more imagine that. No,

580
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:10,120
Speaker 1: I can't imagine anything like that. And they had like

581
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:13,480
Speaker 1: all these calculations like they're all gone. Well, you can

582
00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:15,760
Speaker 1: imagine why he needed to go do some fly fishing.

583
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:18,880
Speaker 1: His favorite fly was old dry fly called the H

584
00:35:18,920 --> 00:35:25,040
Speaker 1: and L variant House and lot. The hell of a flytor?

585
00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:28,080
Speaker 1: You ever fished that one? Yeah, it's crazy how you're

586
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 1: still like flies invented so long ago are like still

587
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 1: some of the best fliers today. Uh, federal ammunition. This

588
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:43,560
Speaker 1: is interesting because it's just interesting for a bunch of reasons.

589
00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:50,320
Speaker 1: Federal ammunition so like a part of a publicly traded company.

590
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 1: Vist outdoors on federal ammunition. It's a publicly traded company.

591
00:35:55,760 --> 00:36:03,680
Speaker 1: Federal ammunition is itself sending um a million rounds of

592
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:09,720
Speaker 1: ammunition to Ukraine? Like the president was offered the President

593
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:15,799
Speaker 1: of Ukraine. It's it's weird, like speaking of this, how

594
00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 1: do you Zelenski is how he pronounced his name. This

595
00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:19,960
Speaker 1: guy used to be a comedian. He's like a commentator,

596
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:21,879
Speaker 1: would be like a John Stewart. I mean, I don't

597
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:23,040
Speaker 1: know if it'd be like that, but he used to

598
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:26,640
Speaker 1: be like a like an entertainer or comedian. The President

599
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:32,719
Speaker 1: of Ukraine he's emerging as this kind of Churchill figure. Yeah,

600
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:37,279
Speaker 1: we're freusing to leave the capitol um rousing speeches, which

601
00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:41,240
Speaker 1: is like total defiance. He's been putting out all these offers,

602
00:36:41,280 --> 00:36:44,040
Speaker 1: like uh, not offers. He's putting out like requests. We

603
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:46,680
Speaker 1: need this, we need that, we need this. Yeah. When

604
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,759
Speaker 1: the US offered to get him out of there, he

605
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:54,279
Speaker 1: replied with, I don't know what he doesn't need a ride,

606
00:36:54,280 --> 00:36:59,520
Speaker 1: he needs ammunition. Um, that's a hell of a line.

607
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:03,960
Speaker 1: I need an I need ammunition, not a ride. Hell

608
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:08,760
Speaker 1: of a leader. Uh. Federal Premium's parent company, vist Outdoor,

609
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:11,640
Speaker 1: has committed to donating one million rounds of ammunition to

610
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:16,360
Speaker 1: Ukrainian forces. They're also launching a fundraiser to raise money

611
00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:22,560
Speaker 1: to help Ukrainian refugees. When on a spokesman, I want

612
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:25,759
Speaker 1: to say, there are some callings in life we just

613
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:27,640
Speaker 1: have to answer. This is one of those callings. We

614
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:30,520
Speaker 1: think it's the right call to help our allies defend themselves.

615
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:35,719
Speaker 1: That's bold. But I wonder if I just don want

616
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:38,080
Speaker 1: to know, I would be curious how all this I

617
00:37:38,120 --> 00:37:40,160
Speaker 1: need to We have an article about this on the

618
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:43,280
Speaker 1: meat eater dot com um with a bunch of quotes

619
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:44,960
Speaker 1: and people and kind of give some of the background.

620
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:47,400
Speaker 1: But it's just not something I would have thought. What

621
00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:49,879
Speaker 1: I got to read about how uh something I would

622
00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:55,359
Speaker 1: have thought would be possible. Well, they already have contracts

623
00:37:55,400 --> 00:37:59,520
Speaker 1: with military people all across the world. That's what I think.

624
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 1: It's easy and quick to do it. Well, yeah, and

625
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:06,960
Speaker 1: you know, obviously, like the announcement of the amount, like

626
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:11,400
Speaker 1: the sheer amount dollar amount of aid that the um

627
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:16,560
Speaker 1: beds have authorized, right, Like, I imagine this has to

628
00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 1: stand aside from contracts. If you're gonna say we're gonna

629
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:23,920
Speaker 1: send out a million rounds, right, otherwise the press release

630
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:26,280
Speaker 1: would be like, hey, we just got paid our normal

631
00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 1: rate to send out a bunch of rounds. So I

632
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:40,000
Speaker 1: did see that the lotbying government issued um a statement

633
00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 1: saying like, you know, because there's that call for aid

634
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:48,560
Speaker 1: that Zelensky set out for a foreign legion, uh and

635
00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: and uh, you know, different countries are saying, yeah, like

636
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:57,440
Speaker 1: if you go, don't fight, you know, there's lots of

637
00:38:57,440 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 1: ways to help or stay here. There's lots of way

638
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 1: ways to help. But I saw the lobbying government issued

639
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,439
Speaker 1: a statement saying like, if you feel like it's your duty,

640
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:11,960
Speaker 1: go for it, and they're gonna let people cross. What

641
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,440
Speaker 1: was that saying? Honest, that Latvian saying that you said

642
00:39:14,600 --> 00:39:21,759
Speaker 1: is getting revived these days, not uh yet yet Soviet.

643
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:23,880
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it's just what used to be on T

644
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:26,759
Speaker 1: shirts and placards and everything when we were kids going

645
00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:29,400
Speaker 1: to protests, when we when Latin was still in too

646
00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:31,600
Speaker 1: the USSR. We used to walk around. Now they're using

647
00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 1: it again. Get yet, Sylviet that mean it's just mean.

648
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 1: It's in Russian it just means no, no yet does know?

649
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:43,840
Speaker 1: And in Russian here's one great I got with America.

650
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:49,759
Speaker 1: This thing that like people now complain about turkeys. Do

651
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:52,280
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying. It's like just like municipalities

652
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:54,840
Speaker 1: that are like at war with turkeys because the turkeys

653
00:39:54,840 --> 00:39:59,840
Speaker 1: are two mean. So there's a there's like this this

654
00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 1: huge dispute in Sacramento between mail carriers and wild turkeys.

655
00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:13,000
Speaker 1: Like it's come to blows. There's an article out in

656
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:17,839
Speaker 1: the l A Times mail carrier accused of killing aggressive

657
00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:23,760
Speaker 1: wild turkey. This guy Sacramento County, UM. The mail carriers

658
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:29,040
Speaker 1: have been quote terrorized by wild turkeys, at times disrupting deliveries.

659
00:40:30,760 --> 00:40:33,960
Speaker 1: This week, tensions between the foul and one US Postal

660
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,439
Speaker 1: Service worker reach a violent climax. Do they use the joke?

661
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,120
Speaker 1: Went postal in here when the carrier killed a turkey

662
00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:44,480
Speaker 1: while on duty, prompting an investigation by the California Department

663
00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:49,200
Speaker 1: of Fishing Wildlife. The mail carrier was carrying a stick

664
00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:53,960
Speaker 1: of some kind quote a some kind of a stick

665
00:40:54,160 --> 00:41:00,919
Speaker 1: unquote in his mail carrier vehicle. Im an aggressive male

666
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:04,439
Speaker 1: turkey attacked him. He retaliated and killed it with a stick,

667
00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:10,440
Speaker 1: which is no small feat. Yeah, like, you don't unless

668
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:13,280
Speaker 1: you got a full on baseball bat and really cocked

669
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:15,799
Speaker 1: back and had that turkey stand still. It ain't a

670
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:20,120
Speaker 1: one strike, No, it's it's not a swing and beyond

671
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:25,000
Speaker 1: your way scenario. Yeah, they don't. There was. It wouldn't

672
00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: be like whacking a grouse like they fall over death.

673
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,279
Speaker 1: Oh but I do you think if you like had

674
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:34,320
Speaker 1: the right velocity and the right stick, you could wind

675
00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:36,959
Speaker 1: up on him. I don't even know how much. I mean, yeah,

676
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 1: just like a you in the head, Yeah, in the

677
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:43,600
Speaker 1: head or in the neck and you break it, snack

678
00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:46,480
Speaker 1: or smash his brain with the whack he's gonna go.

679
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:49,080
Speaker 1: The best thing about this is the This is the

680
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:54,320
Speaker 1: actual headline, Steve. A feud between mail carriers wild turkeys

681
00:41:54,440 --> 00:42:03,160
Speaker 1: comes to a deadly climax near Sacramento. I was like

682
00:42:03,560 --> 00:42:08,360
Speaker 1: a turkey killed him. Yeah, there's these turkeys are getting serious.

683
00:42:08,520 --> 00:42:10,719
Speaker 1: It's gonna be on the serial podcast. I'll be like

684
00:42:10,760 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 1: a couple episodes of like the Turkey's Life prior to

685
00:42:14,480 --> 00:42:18,480
Speaker 1: How I grew up. Other turkeys when he was a

686
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,839
Speaker 1: little kid. That Jake's the other Jake's always beat him

687
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 1: up and it like really impacted him psychologically. So they

688
00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:26,640
Speaker 1: don't know if they're gonna press charges on the dude.

689
00:42:26,880 --> 00:42:28,920
Speaker 1: A guy from Fishing Game was like, our job is

690
00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:31,359
Speaker 1: to determine what exactly happened, and then we fill out

691
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:35,360
Speaker 1: of report. We might send it to the district attorney,

692
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 1: and the district attorney decides whether or not a crime

693
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:41,719
Speaker 1: has been committed. The Postal Service that is an investigating

694
00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 1: the incident, noting in a statement that employees quote have

695
00:42:46,320 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 1: had several altercations with aggressive turkeys in the area, including

696
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:56,200
Speaker 1: a recent attack on a letter carrier. Then they go

697
00:42:56,200 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 1: on to say, however, this allegation is alarming and if true,

698
00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:03,839
Speaker 1: is inexcusable and does not reflect the efforts of our

699
00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:07,320
Speaker 1: more than six hundred and fifty thousand employees who faithfully

700
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:12,280
Speaker 1: serve and deliver for America every day, so pointing out

701
00:43:12,960 --> 00:43:15,480
Speaker 1: that all six hundred and fifty thousand employees of the

702
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:21,759
Speaker 1: Postal Service are not stick wielding turkey killers. Lest one

703
00:43:21,800 --> 00:43:25,000
Speaker 1: start stereotyping, what would be their response if it was

704
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:29,040
Speaker 1: a domestic dog, an unchained, unfenced domestic dog and he

705
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:34,480
Speaker 1: whacked it with a stick. Well, and they don't stand

706
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:37,560
Speaker 1: with their employees and defend themselves. Well, the plot thick

707
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 1: it self defense the illegal means of take Well. Attention

708
00:43:42,160 --> 00:43:47,719
Speaker 1: is turning to area residents as the plot thickens here. Uh.

709
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:52,319
Speaker 1: So far, the Department of Fishing Wildlife's investigation into the

710
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:58,840
Speaker 1: incident has revealed strange details about the area's turkeys and

711
00:43:58,920 --> 00:44:02,600
Speaker 1: their behavior and treat it. Investigators found that some residents

712
00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:10,160
Speaker 1: had been feeding the turkeys quote copious quantities of food unquote.

713
00:44:10,239 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 1: I thought you were gonna go math. Turkeys on us

714
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 1: had pen feeding turkeys math. They're saying it probably contributed

715
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:20,600
Speaker 1: to the massive size of the turkey in question. This

716
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:24,839
Speaker 1: is a quote, because it was eating just an unlimited

717
00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:30,440
Speaker 1: amount of food every day from this particular household. The

718
00:44:30,520 --> 00:44:36,799
Speaker 1: turkeys seem to have been targeting delivery workers. Really, the

719
00:44:36,840 --> 00:44:42,480
Speaker 1: attacks had also disrupted deliveries. They're indiscriminate in their delivery attacks.

720
00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:47,720
Speaker 1: These turkeys had also disrupted deliveries from FedEx and ups,

721
00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:52,439
Speaker 1: So the private sector, I ain't there's something to that.

722
00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 1: Do you ever remember Popeye and Jimmy Miller's house, The

723
00:44:55,600 --> 00:45:00,040
Speaker 1: one eyed turkey. Well that's own bitch, was not. This

724
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 1: can be for years to me. Come up strut for you,

725
00:45:03,719 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 1: you can, Millwood, No Popeye has one eyed turkey, Like

726
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 1: I know you guys had something like that going on. Okay,

727
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:15,160
Speaker 1: go on, now we're still cool and uh never was aggressive.

728
00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 1: Then one day I roll over get out of my

729
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:20,040
Speaker 1: truck and I can see him coming for him and

730
00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:22,200
Speaker 1: I could see the look in his one eye. I'm like,

731
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:28,279
Speaker 1: something has changed, and like I'm just foolishly, I'm I'm

732
00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 1: hanging out just like to see and I mean it

733
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 1: didn't really have time to think about it. And he

734
00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:37,200
Speaker 1: was on me like the full on, like breasts kind

735
00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:39,440
Speaker 1: of pointed towards the sky, feet coming at me and

736
00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:45,360
Speaker 1: wings trying to beat you. Oh yeah, And uh so

737
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 1: I run around the truck. I'm like, really, what's up,

738
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:49,480
Speaker 1: pop out, you know, and I look around the corner

739
00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:51,840
Speaker 1: He's coming against I quickly boog it into the house.

740
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:56,920
Speaker 1: Well lo and behold, someone else very similar in stature

741
00:45:57,040 --> 00:46:01,880
Speaker 1: to me had recently been a finale Popeye and kicking

742
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 1: him and booting him and whatever. Since then whatever, that

743
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:10,759
Speaker 1: person just like wasn't into having like farm pets, be

744
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:15,760
Speaker 1: like pets, right, so he's he's like probably just shooting

745
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: it off, but like in in a more aggressive way

746
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:21,120
Speaker 1: than I ever had. And from that moment on, it

747
00:46:21,160 --> 00:46:25,879
Speaker 1: didn't matter if you were roughly a two pounds six

748
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:30,279
Speaker 1: ft plus dude. Popeye was coming after you. Yeah, and

749
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 1: the kids would get out of the car. Nobody would

750
00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 1: bother them. M Uh. They've been suggesting that these mail

751
00:46:37,239 --> 00:46:41,560
Speaker 1: carriers start holding these turkeys with pepper spray. They're allowed

752
00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:45,640
Speaker 1: to carry pepper spray, but they've been to finish my point.

753
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:47,400
Speaker 1: I thought that I thought you wrapped it up nicely. No.

754
00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 1: The point is I think that the turkeys can can

755
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 1: if that had happened from one delivery driver like some

756
00:46:54,080 --> 00:47:00,719
Speaker 1: aggressive they see a truck roll up and they're like yeah, yeah,

757
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:03,800
Speaker 1: anybody that rolls out of a truck that's not normally

758
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 1: around her and it's wearing a uniform like hitting boys,

759
00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:12,040
Speaker 1: I got what. Yeah, you didn't bring it full circle. Yeah,

760
00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:15,279
Speaker 1: they learned to be like watch out for that. They're

761
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:18,080
Speaker 1: they've been telling them to shoot him with pepper spray,

762
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 1: and they've been also beating them with their mail bags.

763
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:28,520
Speaker 1: Brent here has sixteen turkeys on order, and uh, he

764
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:35,560
Speaker 1: happens to know what the maximum butterball turkey waste. We

765
00:47:35,600 --> 00:47:37,680
Speaker 1: grew turkeys for the first time a few years ago,

766
00:47:38,080 --> 00:47:40,560
Speaker 1: and we didn't know how many weeks to let them grow.

767
00:47:41,239 --> 00:47:45,600
Speaker 1: So when we slaughtered them ourselves, we weighed them and

768
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:54,840
Speaker 1: we had pound to two pound dressed turkeys, dressed tressed.

769
00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:57,920
Speaker 1: These were big because I was gonna I thought I

770
00:47:57,960 --> 00:48:01,919
Speaker 1: was gonna be I was gonna one up you. What

771
00:48:01,920 --> 00:48:04,960
Speaker 1: what what branded turkey did you get? They were? I

772
00:48:05,000 --> 00:48:08,120
Speaker 1: think the broad breasted. I was gonna one up. But

773
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:11,200
Speaker 1: I can't one up that. Well, that's a big turkey, steve. Um.

774
00:48:12,680 --> 00:48:15,720
Speaker 1: So anyways, I we didn't know how to cook these turkeys.

775
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:17,520
Speaker 1: We gave him out his presence due to like all

776
00:48:17,520 --> 00:48:20,480
Speaker 1: the in laws like for their thanksgivings, like turkey for you,

777
00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:22,600
Speaker 1: turkey for you. How long did it take for him

778
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:27,359
Speaker 1: to get to forty pounds? Uh, twenty two weeks something

779
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:31,000
Speaker 1: like that. Maybe maybe a few more weeks. Yeah, um,

780
00:48:31,040 --> 00:48:33,120
Speaker 1: but they had open they could eat as much as

781
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:36,600
Speaker 1: they want. Um. But anyways, I call a butter ball

782
00:48:36,719 --> 00:48:40,560
Speaker 1: has a hotline and you can call this and get

783
00:48:40,600 --> 00:48:46,120
Speaker 1: any turkey question answered that. Yeah, And so I was like, why, Well,

784
00:48:46,160 --> 00:48:48,719
Speaker 1: why not. They well, I gonna have We're gonna call

785
00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:51,479
Speaker 1: we should get a do a live called butter Ball.

786
00:48:52,120 --> 00:48:53,960
Speaker 1: I heard about it because on the radio they were

787
00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:57,399
Speaker 1: talking about all the funny calls they've had, Like does

788
00:48:57,440 --> 00:49:00,839
Speaker 1: bar and chain oil? Is that okay to cook your

789
00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:03,560
Speaker 1: turkey with barn chain oil? Because like obviously someone people

790
00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:06,080
Speaker 1: deep frying them in barn. No, they like cut the

791
00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:10,680
Speaker 1: turkey in half with their chainsaw. But anyway, so I

792
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:12,040
Speaker 1: call him up because this is a big bird. I

793
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:14,040
Speaker 1: didn't want to dry it out. I wanted he's gonna

794
00:49:14,040 --> 00:49:17,960
Speaker 1: fry it barn chain. I think they just got a

795
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 1: little bit on it. But um, anyways, I call him

796
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:23,840
Speaker 1: up and I said, you know, is there any recommendations

797
00:49:23,920 --> 00:49:28,399
Speaker 1: for a thirty eight pound turkey? And she said, well, sir,

798
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 1: that's not a butterball turkey. We only grew up to

799
00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:35,920
Speaker 1: thirty pound turkeys. And so they told me just based

800
00:49:35,960 --> 00:49:40,280
Speaker 1: it in twenty minutes pound. They helped me out anyways,

801
00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:43,399
Speaker 1: even though they called me out. And I can't want

802
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:46,120
Speaker 1: up you with this, but I can back you up good.

803
00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:49,680
Speaker 1: That's that's the relationship on my boys. My boy's body

804
00:49:49,760 --> 00:49:51,960
Speaker 1: raised turkeys and we went over there and we took

805
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:56,920
Speaker 1: a twenty two over there to get our two, and

806
00:49:56,960 --> 00:49:58,759
Speaker 1: my kids shot it with a twenty two just in

807
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:01,239
Speaker 1: a little pen there, you know, and I'm like, grab it,

808
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:03,840
Speaker 1: grab it because it's jumping all over place. And he

809
00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:07,040
Speaker 1: couldn't get ahold of its neck. They're very strong. Yeah,

810
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 1: I couldn't get ahold of his his neck. I took that

811
00:50:09,920 --> 00:50:13,200
Speaker 1: turkey on a on an actual like like digital luggage scale,

812
00:50:13,600 --> 00:50:17,520
Speaker 1: and the turkey was fifty pounds on the hoof. I

813
00:50:17,520 --> 00:50:19,720
Speaker 1: didn't know they guy like that. Well, have you huge

814
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:22,520
Speaker 1: presidential pardon turkey every year? They're like a fifty pound bird.

815
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:27,000
Speaker 1: It's incredible. Yeah, they're big. One of our guys, Garrett Long,

816
00:50:27,160 --> 00:50:30,640
Speaker 1: he claims to have raised the seventy five pound turkey.

817
00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:35,480
Speaker 1: I believe that because these things quably kept growing, these

818
00:50:35,560 --> 00:50:37,799
Speaker 1: for stale juveniles. I caught it. I had to cut

819
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:40,279
Speaker 1: the ones I had in half. You couldn't even like,

820
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:41,959
Speaker 1: you couldn't have put that some bitch in your oven,

821
00:50:42,040 --> 00:50:48,239
Speaker 1: No way did Yeah, just barely had about a half

822
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:51,480
Speaker 1: inch touch on the roof. I did some butcher twine,

823
00:50:51,480 --> 00:50:53,800
Speaker 1: for sure. Yeah. I want to give one last quote,

824
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:56,920
Speaker 1: my favorite quote from this article about these man eating turkeys.

825
00:50:58,239 --> 00:51:00,239
Speaker 1: One of these guys says, I've been around about only

826
00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:03,719
Speaker 1: five years, so I kind of know what turkeys. And

827
00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:06,200
Speaker 1: I just looked at it and I'm like, oh, this

828
00:51:06,239 --> 00:51:18,040
Speaker 1: is the biggest turkey I've ever seen. All right, seth,

829
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:21,879
Speaker 1: tell the give us, tell us your your bear story.

830
00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:24,160
Speaker 1: Don't name names, just tell your bear story. All right?

831
00:51:24,400 --> 00:51:31,439
Speaker 1: So was it gone wrong? It was at least three,

832
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:33,560
Speaker 1: three or four years ago. Chat was with me when

833
00:51:33,600 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 1: I killed the bear. I killed a bear hunt. It

834
00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:38,600
Speaker 1: sat in my freeze. The hide sat in my freezer

835
00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:41,640
Speaker 1: for a year because I didn't know what to do

836
00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:43,640
Speaker 1: with it. We all shot a turkey right before you

837
00:51:43,640 --> 00:51:48,040
Speaker 1: shot your bear. Yeah, it was a great spot. Um.

838
00:51:48,080 --> 00:51:52,720
Speaker 1: So fast forward a year after I killed the bear,

839
00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:59,600
Speaker 1: I got talking with Steve and uh, he recommended really well,

840
00:52:00,239 --> 00:52:03,919
Speaker 1: was that really the deciding factor? Oh? He just told

841
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:06,080
Speaker 1: you to take it to this guy. I don't know.

842
00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:10,839
Speaker 1: I asked around. I asked around. I don't know if

843
00:52:10,840 --> 00:52:15,880
Speaker 1: it's a recommendation, but you said there there's someone that Yeah, yeah,

844
00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:21,600
Speaker 1: I know you didn't want to take ownership to. You

845
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:27,040
Speaker 1: would have known if I hadn't sent you there. Yeah,

846
00:52:27,080 --> 00:52:29,839
Speaker 1: I'm not blaming anyone. I'm just this is just part

847
00:52:29,840 --> 00:52:34,839
Speaker 1: of the story. UM, take my meet up. So this

848
00:52:34,840 --> 00:52:37,719
Speaker 1: guy actually sent someone that was working for him at

849
00:52:37,719 --> 00:52:39,840
Speaker 1: the time to pick up my bear here in the

850
00:52:39,880 --> 00:52:43,360
Speaker 1: parking lot at work, and I wrote a check in

851
00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:50,040
Speaker 1: full for this guy to um paying the hide for me. Um.

852
00:52:50,120 --> 00:52:55,880
Speaker 1: So this was two years ago when that exchange happened,

853
00:52:57,040 --> 00:53:04,640
Speaker 1: and I waited roughly I don't probably tendered tanned a year.

854
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:08,520
Speaker 1: So he was just tanning it, just just flashing it

855
00:53:08,560 --> 00:53:11,960
Speaker 1: and having it sent off to get tanned. Yeah. I

856
00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:16,560
Speaker 1: waited probably about a year before I started bugging him, um,

857
00:53:16,560 --> 00:53:19,879
Speaker 1: wondering where my bear is. And you probably didn't even

858
00:53:19,920 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 1: bug him originally. You probably just like, hey man, Yeah,

859
00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:27,239
Speaker 1: originally it was just questioning when it might be done.

860
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:31,799
Speaker 1: And I think this this was like right around the

861
00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:36,360
Speaker 1: time when COVID hit, So I got like the COVID excuse,

862
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:40,080
Speaker 1: like tanneries are backed up because of COVID or whatever, so,

863
00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:43,160
Speaker 1: you know, thinking nothing of it, just let it go

864
00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:48,480
Speaker 1: and then waited roughly another year and then I started

865
00:53:48,480 --> 00:53:52,160
Speaker 1: bugging him. Like for a while, there was like once

866
00:53:52,200 --> 00:53:55,319
Speaker 1: a week, um or no, it was like once every

867
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:57,120
Speaker 1: other week, once every three weeks. Something like that, and

868
00:53:57,160 --> 00:54:01,719
Speaker 1: then it got to like once a week. Finally, Um,

869
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:05,440
Speaker 1: you know, there was a lot of like, um, like

870
00:54:05,480 --> 00:54:07,880
Speaker 1: I'd say, hey, man, like can I get my bear

871
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:10,160
Speaker 1: this week? And He'll be like yeah. He'd be like, yeah,

872
00:54:10,239 --> 00:54:13,640
Speaker 1: let's meet whatever day and I'll hand it off to you.

873
00:54:14,360 --> 00:54:16,640
Speaker 1: And then that day would calm, I text him, be

874
00:54:16,800 --> 00:54:19,600
Speaker 1: like we're still good to meet up and get you know,

875
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:22,399
Speaker 1: I can get my bear, and it would there would

876
00:54:22,440 --> 00:54:27,920
Speaker 1: always be some excuse um to why he couldn't meet. Um.

877
00:54:28,120 --> 00:54:33,040
Speaker 1: Finally the day comes where he can actually meet up

878
00:54:33,040 --> 00:54:35,439
Speaker 1: with me to give me my bear. So we meet

879
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:39,400
Speaker 1: at a local gas station here. He pulls in hops

880
00:54:39,400 --> 00:54:44,879
Speaker 1: out of his truck and hands me a black bear. Hi,

881
00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:50,000
Speaker 1: black face black bear. Um. And the bear that I

882
00:54:50,040 --> 00:54:53,719
Speaker 1: had shot was not black. It was a chocolate face

883
00:54:53,880 --> 00:54:58,560
Speaker 1: black bear. So I told him that that's not my bear,

884
00:54:59,560 --> 00:55:02,280
Speaker 1: and he gave me like, oh I was in a rush,

885
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:06,319
Speaker 1: must have just grabbed the wrong bear. Um, my bad.

886
00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:10,759
Speaker 1: I'll go grab I'll go grab your bear and meet

887
00:55:10,800 --> 00:55:13,360
Speaker 1: you back here. I had to go to a meeting

888
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:15,440
Speaker 1: network here, so I was like, let's meet back up

889
00:55:15,520 --> 00:55:19,960
Speaker 1: later in the day. So what was going through your mind? Yeah,

890
00:55:20,320 --> 00:55:23,360
Speaker 1: I want to know too. Were you excited? You're like sweet?

891
00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:25,799
Speaker 1: Tried to get he tried to get Chester to go

892
00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:28,400
Speaker 1: to the meet up, and Chester chickened out, would go,

893
00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:31,839
Speaker 1: mat Seth go alone. I went. I went the second time,

894
00:55:33,360 --> 00:55:36,320
Speaker 1: second time because because of the brow beating I gave you.

895
00:55:38,040 --> 00:55:40,200
Speaker 1: Did you think there was gonna be something gonna go

896
00:55:40,320 --> 00:55:44,880
Speaker 1: down or well? I just kind of just seems like,

897
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:48,680
Speaker 1: I don't know Chester should have been there. Old fishing

898
00:55:48,719 --> 00:55:56,000
Speaker 1: buddies go on, um So, and I should say there's

899
00:55:56,040 --> 00:55:59,360
Speaker 1: been lots of rumors going around town about this particular

900
00:55:59,400 --> 00:56:01,719
Speaker 1: text them. He tried to give a he tried. My

901
00:56:01,719 --> 00:56:04,600
Speaker 1: buddy had a black Phase full amount, paid full price

902
00:56:04,640 --> 00:56:07,000
Speaker 1: for a full amount black bear, and he tried to

903
00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:10,840
Speaker 1: give him a blond Phase, a small blond Phase full amount.

904
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:16,160
Speaker 1: So I kind of went into this meet up knowing

905
00:56:16,200 --> 00:56:20,799
Speaker 1: that I most likely wasn't going to get the bear

906
00:56:20,880 --> 00:56:24,799
Speaker 1: that I had given him two years prior. Um So

907
00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:27,960
Speaker 1: he tries to give me the black bear. I tell

908
00:56:28,040 --> 00:56:31,239
Speaker 1: him it's not mine. He leaves. UM meet back with

909
00:56:31,360 --> 00:56:34,840
Speaker 1: him a couple hours later and he pulls out of

910
00:56:34,840 --> 00:56:40,719
Speaker 1: the out of his truck chocolate phase bear and I

911
00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:42,920
Speaker 1: take one look at it and immediately, no, it's not

912
00:56:42,960 --> 00:56:47,080
Speaker 1: my bear. But I'm thinking to myself in my head,

913
00:56:48,239 --> 00:56:53,200
Speaker 1: I am never getting my bear, and like, I'm just

914
00:56:53,200 --> 00:56:57,919
Speaker 1: gonna take this one so I have something to show

915
00:56:57,960 --> 00:56:59,640
Speaker 1: for it. Because I could have been like, listen, this

916
00:56:59,719 --> 00:57:03,640
Speaker 1: is not my bear, um, and it wouldn't like who

917
00:57:03,640 --> 00:57:06,359
Speaker 1: knows what had happened. He probably would have gone back

918
00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 1: to his shop and grabbed a different bear, or I

919
00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:13,080
Speaker 1: never seen him again. Yeah. So, and I know this

920
00:57:13,160 --> 00:57:18,480
Speaker 1: is not my bear because my bear when I um

921
00:57:18,680 --> 00:57:21,560
Speaker 1: skinned in the field, I didn't take the time to

922
00:57:21,640 --> 00:57:23,960
Speaker 1: like skin the palls out. I just cut the palls.

923
00:57:24,120 --> 00:57:25,880
Speaker 1: Just wanted to Yeah, I just wanted to hide it.

924
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:28,920
Speaker 1: I wasn't I don't need all shriveled up Paul's hanging

925
00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:32,120
Speaker 1: off my my bear hide. It wasn't interested. And this

926
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:38,280
Speaker 1: bear he gave me has paws on it. I went

927
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:46,800
Speaker 1: him man. Yeah. Another indicator was when you know, for

928
00:57:46,840 --> 00:57:49,439
Speaker 1: people that have gotten stuff tanned before, when you get

929
00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:51,720
Speaker 1: something back from the tannery, it has like that nice

930
00:57:51,760 --> 00:58:00,880
Speaker 1: soft white, white leathery. Yeah, this thing was like yellow, dirty,

931
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:07,520
Speaker 1: like something that had obviously been sitting around for many years. Um.

932
00:58:07,560 --> 00:58:11,840
Speaker 1: So he handed to me like thinking that I know

933
00:58:12,000 --> 00:58:14,240
Speaker 1: that you're thinking that he you know, he thinks that

934
00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:17,280
Speaker 1: I think it's my bear. I just said to him, like,

935
00:58:17,320 --> 00:58:19,560
Speaker 1: you know that'll do and grab it and top my vehicle.

936
00:58:19,600 --> 00:58:22,080
Speaker 1: And but what about the person whose bear? It was

937
00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:28,240
Speaker 1: so old? It's like, do you think that that would

938
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:31,919
Speaker 1: have wound up in the right guy's hands? No, but

939
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:34,400
Speaker 1: it's just something he had laying around. Yeah, asked for cash,

940
00:58:34,680 --> 00:58:36,480
Speaker 1: be like, all right, let's just follow you to the

941
00:58:36,520 --> 00:58:39,080
Speaker 1: bank and you can pull out a couple hundred bucks

942
00:58:39,120 --> 00:58:42,240
Speaker 1: that I already paid. Yet did that hide have like

943
00:58:42,320 --> 00:58:44,520
Speaker 1: did you see like the stamp they gotta put on

944
00:58:44,560 --> 00:58:46,840
Speaker 1: it or like any you know there was there is

945
00:58:47,560 --> 00:58:51,080
Speaker 1: some sort of stamping on it. Um, I didn't really

946
00:58:51,120 --> 00:58:52,960
Speaker 1: look into it. And they yeah, they hit him with

947
00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:55,560
Speaker 1: those little turn or stamp. I'd literally just bowlted up.

948
00:58:55,600 --> 00:58:58,640
Speaker 1: And do you have any advice for people for people

949
00:58:58,680 --> 00:59:00,480
Speaker 1: that might in the future be look going to get

950
00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:07,280
Speaker 1: a deposits and right, man, I guess just do your research,

951
00:59:07,960 --> 00:59:14,840
Speaker 1: don't listen to Steve or um. But if the guy

952
00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:18,200
Speaker 1: is such a mess too, like I mean, we know

953
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:22,000
Speaker 1: from our previous podcast gas like good record keeping. Yeah,

954
00:59:22,040 --> 00:59:24,960
Speaker 1: I guess just do your research on your taking your

955
00:59:24,960 --> 00:59:27,800
Speaker 1: stuff to. Um, if you're in Montana, take your stuff

956
00:59:27,800 --> 00:59:31,160
Speaker 1: in John Hayes because he's, yeah, go to like an

957
00:59:31,400 --> 00:59:35,800
Speaker 1: established that's some dude that's working out of his garage.

958
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:38,600
Speaker 1: If you're going to someone that's like if you hear

959
00:59:38,640 --> 00:59:41,920
Speaker 1: through the Greek grapevine that like, oh, this dude's cheaper

960
00:59:41,920 --> 00:59:45,800
Speaker 1: than everyone else, Like that's that should be a red flag.

961
00:59:46,440 --> 00:59:48,520
Speaker 1: I'm biting my tongue so bad on a contract or

962
00:59:48,560 --> 00:59:50,640
Speaker 1: just be I feel like piling on. Not about that,

963
00:59:50,680 --> 00:59:51,960
Speaker 1: but I feel like being like, oh, man, I got

964
00:59:52,040 --> 00:59:53,640
Speaker 1: a story for you. I'm not gonna tell it right now,

965
00:59:53,680 --> 00:59:56,880
Speaker 1: but you know what I'm talking about. Um, not you,

966
00:59:57,000 --> 01:00:02,000
Speaker 1: but uh yeah, so yeah. And then I I ended

967
01:00:02,080 --> 01:00:04,760
Speaker 1: up texting them later, UM, just to let him know

968
01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:08,480
Speaker 1: that he didn't pull the wool over my eyes. UM.

969
01:00:08,520 --> 01:00:10,640
Speaker 1: I just wanted to make sure you knew that I

970
01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:15,400
Speaker 1: knew it's not my bear. No reply, no reply. UM.

971
01:00:15,440 --> 01:00:17,960
Speaker 1: I sent you a text on this last week. Brent.

972
01:00:18,080 --> 01:00:20,040
Speaker 1: I'm sure you can. You can weigh in on this

973
01:00:20,040 --> 01:00:26,640
Speaker 1: this too, but um, and so, the Wyoming legislature just

974
01:00:27,600 --> 01:00:33,000
Speaker 1: past a bill that would extend the ability for people

975
01:00:33,040 --> 01:00:37,960
Speaker 1: to raise this very controversial sage grouse program. Right, that

976
01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:43,360
Speaker 1: starts with people going out and stealing the eggs from

977
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:49,320
Speaker 1: free ranging, live huntable populations of sage grouse, so game birds,

978
01:00:50,200 --> 01:00:56,120
Speaker 1: taking those eggs, rearing them to adult sizes. Um, you

979
01:00:56,160 --> 01:00:58,200
Speaker 1: know there's a lot of a lot of eggs don't

980
01:00:58,200 --> 01:01:01,960
Speaker 1: make it, and then taking those birds and releasing them

981
01:01:01,960 --> 01:01:08,640
Speaker 1: back out onto uh the landscape. And you know, for

982
01:01:08,640 --> 01:01:11,160
Speaker 1: folks who don't know, like birds that are raised in

983
01:01:11,200 --> 01:01:16,480
Speaker 1: captivity don't have any sort of awareness of predators. Um,

984
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:19,840
Speaker 1: the studies that exist are pretty hand in hand and

985
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:24,720
Speaker 1: they're pretty much for pheasants, um, chucker quail, you know,

986
01:01:24,800 --> 01:01:28,360
Speaker 1: birds that are are very commonly raised in captivity for putting.

987
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:33,040
Speaker 1: And it used to be um, I thought that that

988
01:01:33,080 --> 01:01:38,080
Speaker 1: these pen raised populations would like help build wild populations.

989
01:01:38,520 --> 01:01:42,480
Speaker 1: But if you believe in math, there's like a mortality

990
01:01:42,560 --> 01:01:50,080
Speaker 1: typically within the first twenty four hours. Um. Yeah, they're

991
01:01:50,080 --> 01:01:54,120
Speaker 1: just standing there like the yeah, kell, do do you

992
01:01:54,160 --> 01:01:58,200
Speaker 1: think these people, these folks know when they're raising them

993
01:01:58,240 --> 01:02:00,520
Speaker 1: that they're going to basically release these birds and they're

994
01:02:00,520 --> 01:02:03,040
Speaker 1: gonna die. Do you think they're releasing them for their

995
01:02:03,080 --> 01:02:09,880
Speaker 1: own personal hunting? Like he's for the Yeah, there's a

996
01:02:09,960 --> 01:02:14,560
Speaker 1: huge like bird dog training type of deal around this,

997
01:02:14,640 --> 01:02:17,760
Speaker 1: and there's there's lots of like our three stuff around this,

998
01:02:17,880 --> 01:02:23,120
Speaker 1: but not for sage grouse. Um. And what this is,

999
01:02:23,240 --> 01:02:29,240
Speaker 1: this is like this test period that was suggested that said, hey,

1000
01:02:29,320 --> 01:02:34,280
Speaker 1: let's let's try this avenue that would allow um, folks

1001
01:02:34,320 --> 01:02:38,800
Speaker 1: who are buying up this prime habitat, this keystone habitat

1002
01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:43,560
Speaker 1: for this species in order to develop it and maybe

1003
01:02:43,640 --> 01:02:48,920
Speaker 1: we'll get lucky. And instead of them having to purchase

1004
01:02:49,960 --> 01:02:53,560
Speaker 1: other habitat that would replace this habitat that they destroyed,

1005
01:02:54,040 --> 01:03:01,720
Speaker 1: they could instead invest in this rearing population and just replace,

1006
01:03:01,960 --> 01:03:06,120
Speaker 1: like physically replace the birds. So there would be you know,

1007
01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:07,960
Speaker 1: a study that goes out and says, okay, well, the

1008
01:03:08,080 --> 01:03:12,040
Speaker 1: amount of habitat that you guys destroyed, uh, would have

1009
01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:14,680
Speaker 1: produced x amount of birds, so you guys need to

1010
01:03:14,680 --> 01:03:21,160
Speaker 1: replace x amount of birds elsewhere. Um. However, it just doesn't.

1011
01:03:22,480 --> 01:03:25,560
Speaker 1: You're not replacing any birds. You're just net net losing birds.

1012
01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:31,560
Speaker 1: And on top of that, you're stealing birds that could

1013
01:03:31,760 --> 01:03:35,760
Speaker 1: grow up to make more birds at the egg stage.

1014
01:03:36,320 --> 01:03:38,520
Speaker 1: And that's what's going on wyoming right now. Um. The

1015
01:03:38,640 --> 01:03:41,040
Speaker 1: governor over there has already said that he's in support

1016
01:03:41,120 --> 01:03:46,960
Speaker 1: of this. Prior to the state legislature UM voting yes

1017
01:03:47,120 --> 01:03:52,240
Speaker 1: to extend the it was supposed to sunset. I mean,

1018
01:03:52,280 --> 01:03:54,560
Speaker 1: it was supposed to stop this year, but they voted

1019
01:03:54,600 --> 01:04:01,800
Speaker 1: to extend it. And there's no good science supporting this. So, UM,

1020
01:04:01,880 --> 01:04:03,760
Speaker 1: if you don't like your game birds to be stolen

1021
01:04:05,000 --> 01:04:09,360
Speaker 1: and you'd like responsible development to go out and be

1022
01:04:09,480 --> 01:04:13,520
Speaker 1: responsible with our wildlife as well, Uh, let's make sure

1023
01:04:13,560 --> 01:04:15,919
Speaker 1: they do so. Call the governor a whyleming and tell

1024
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:20,400
Speaker 1: them to uh, not only not signed this bill, but

1025
01:04:20,560 --> 01:04:23,840
Speaker 1: veto if you were, you're a dumb this down as

1026
01:04:23,880 --> 01:04:26,680
Speaker 1: much as possible. Let me let me say a statement asked,

1027
01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:31,240
Speaker 1: this is a fair statement. Um. The greater stage grouse

1028
01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:36,800
Speaker 1: has been flirting with Endangered Species Act protection, like there's

1029
01:04:36,840 --> 01:04:41,040
Speaker 1: a case be made that it should be listed. Yes,

1030
01:04:41,080 --> 01:04:46,520
Speaker 1: a listed. UM years ago, they struck a deal that

1031
01:04:46,680 --> 01:04:50,360
Speaker 1: people thought was gonna be very impactful on stage grouse recovery.

1032
01:04:51,120 --> 01:04:54,320
Speaker 1: A lot of that stuff wasn't implemented. It became highly politicized.

1033
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:58,960
Speaker 1: That's failing. And so they're suggesting that to hit the

1034
01:04:59,040 --> 01:05:02,040
Speaker 1: numbers they need to hit it, they just pen raise

1035
01:05:02,120 --> 01:05:06,440
Speaker 1: them and then periodically release pen raised birds, count them

1036
01:05:06,520 --> 01:05:10,720
Speaker 1: up and be like, oh, see it does enough. Is

1037
01:05:10,760 --> 01:05:12,680
Speaker 1: it not as simple as that? Well, I mean that's

1038
01:05:13,360 --> 01:05:15,960
Speaker 1: that Yeah we could say sure, yeah, yeah, I mean

1039
01:05:15,960 --> 01:05:20,840
Speaker 1: they're they're saying, nope, we in theory destroyed this amount

1040
01:05:20,880 --> 01:05:22,800
Speaker 1: of land which would have produced this amount of birds.

1041
01:05:23,120 --> 01:05:28,840
Speaker 1: Here are the birds without a place for them to be. Um, well,

1042
01:05:28,880 --> 01:05:32,080
Speaker 1: they would they would then be released into a into

1043
01:05:32,080 --> 01:05:36,360
Speaker 1: suitable habitat. However, they're they're just not built at that

1044
01:05:36,440 --> 01:05:40,760
Speaker 1: stage to survive in anything outside of a cage. For

1045
01:05:41,280 --> 01:05:45,520
Speaker 1: is the rationale viable period they'll get like, they'll get

1046
01:05:45,560 --> 01:05:48,720
Speaker 1: them because there there's like a lot of attrition and

1047
01:05:49,200 --> 01:05:52,760
Speaker 1: you know, a wild brood like maybe survives or something

1048
01:05:52,800 --> 01:05:56,680
Speaker 1: like that. They're getting them like passed the vulnerable stage

1049
01:05:56,720 --> 01:05:59,240
Speaker 1: and then letting them go. And yeah, with the with

1050
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:01,360
Speaker 1: the idea that then they're gonna run around to eat

1051
01:06:01,360 --> 01:06:03,680
Speaker 1: a bunch of food, bump into another sage grouse and

1052
01:06:03,760 --> 01:06:08,240
Speaker 1: mate and make more sage grouse um. And and there's

1053
01:06:07,640 --> 01:06:10,880
Speaker 1: a great study out of South Dakota again on pheasants

1054
01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:16,440
Speaker 1: um where they took a couple of different release points

1055
01:06:16,440 --> 01:06:20,680
Speaker 1: and did like severe predator suppression um and they were

1056
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:26,959
Speaker 1: able to get some hen pheasants two survive long enough

1057
01:06:27,360 --> 01:06:32,560
Speaker 1: to mate and nest, and but you know, like their

1058
01:06:32,680 --> 01:06:39,600
Speaker 1: nesting ability was low. However, when they were able to breed,

1059
01:06:41,280 --> 01:06:46,880
Speaker 1: they could have the same like a viable, competitively viable

1060
01:06:46,920 --> 01:06:51,200
Speaker 1: amount of eggs as a wild as an actually wild

1061
01:06:51,240 --> 01:06:56,680
Speaker 1: hen pheasant salvaging is a real long term practice. So

1062
01:06:57,000 --> 01:07:01,320
Speaker 1: like when I was banning ducks and uh um San

1063
01:07:01,360 --> 01:07:07,320
Speaker 1: Francisco area, Fairfield area, California, with California waterfowl, they had

1064
01:07:07,360 --> 01:07:11,959
Speaker 1: a practice of egg salvage with ducks and so out there.

1065
01:07:12,040 --> 01:07:17,760
Speaker 1: I think it was partially trying to get more opportunity UM.

1066
01:07:19,640 --> 01:07:22,880
Speaker 1: I guess because because it's pretty contentious as far as

1067
01:07:23,960 --> 01:07:27,360
Speaker 1: a lot of people believe if that egg didn't hatch,

1068
01:07:27,840 --> 01:07:30,600
Speaker 1: maybe there was a genetic defect that you would not

1069
01:07:30,760 --> 01:07:35,520
Speaker 1: want to introduce into the population. The other side of

1070
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:40,200
Speaker 1: it is that it's such a difficult thing hatch eggs

1071
01:07:40,200 --> 01:07:44,280
Speaker 1: out in the wild. You know, you water conditions, predation,

1072
01:07:45,000 --> 01:07:48,800
Speaker 1: that egg salvaging takes away a lot of those variables.

1073
01:07:48,840 --> 01:07:52,040
Speaker 1: I think that's the case for it UM, and I

1074
01:07:52,080 --> 01:07:54,800
Speaker 1: think in when they've tried to re establish populations of

1075
01:07:54,840 --> 01:07:58,960
Speaker 1: game birds elsewhere, more successful model is to go where

1076
01:07:59,000 --> 01:08:01,840
Speaker 1: they have a lot of um and take some of

1077
01:08:01,840 --> 01:08:07,000
Speaker 1: those and put them in another place, versus this sounds

1078
01:08:07,040 --> 01:08:09,240
Speaker 1: more like I don't know this situation at all. But

1079
01:08:09,280 --> 01:08:15,200
Speaker 1: this sounds more like there's no previous knowledge of life.

1080
01:08:15,240 --> 01:08:17,840
Speaker 1: They're just throwing them out there. So I don't know

1081
01:08:17,880 --> 01:08:20,120
Speaker 1: if that would be successful. If there was, if this

1082
01:08:20,320 --> 01:08:26,120
Speaker 1: was a tool in the toolbox, right, I wouldn't instinctively

1083
01:08:27,080 --> 01:08:29,640
Speaker 1: be against it. I mean, if we're doing everything we

1084
01:08:29,680 --> 01:08:32,400
Speaker 1: can to preserve habitat right, and that wasn't even on

1085
01:08:32,439 --> 01:08:34,680
Speaker 1: the table, like we're preserving habitat doing all things we

1086
01:08:34,720 --> 01:08:37,360
Speaker 1: need to do, and then someone proposed it like, in

1087
01:08:37,400 --> 01:08:41,559
Speaker 1: addition to doing all the right things, uh, we're gonna

1088
01:08:41,600 --> 01:08:43,040
Speaker 1: attempt to do some of this to see what the

1089
01:08:43,040 --> 01:08:46,559
Speaker 1: efficacy is. I wouldn't be like no. But if you're

1090
01:08:46,560 --> 01:08:49,880
Speaker 1: taking and saying like, oh, no, we're gonna allow people

1091
01:08:49,960 --> 01:08:56,120
Speaker 1: to develop sage gross habitat, we're excusing them from from mitigation.

1092
01:08:56,600 --> 01:08:58,600
Speaker 1: As long as they can turn out x number of

1093
01:08:58,680 --> 01:09:01,400
Speaker 1: chicks on the ground somewhere which will have no long

1094
01:09:01,560 --> 01:09:05,559
Speaker 1: term they won't solve the problem. The problem is habitat

1095
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:09,080
Speaker 1: loss in a handful of other factors. Um, it just

1096
01:09:09,080 --> 01:09:12,599
Speaker 1: seems like a bunch of mental masturbation. Yeah, it's it's

1097
01:09:12,640 --> 01:09:15,320
Speaker 1: a It's just it's a waste of time when we

1098
01:09:15,439 --> 01:09:20,680
Speaker 1: know what the answer is, and you know, it's like

1099
01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:26,360
Speaker 1: gas prices are climbing up. I get it, But I

1100
01:09:26,920 --> 01:09:31,320
Speaker 1: think responsible energy is something that like everybody can get behind.

1101
01:09:31,760 --> 01:09:33,599
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if it's a wind farm, a solar

1102
01:09:33,640 --> 01:09:37,559
Speaker 1: farmer pumping crewed out of the ground. Right, It's like

1103
01:09:38,400 --> 01:09:44,640
Speaker 1: if those companies do it in a responsible way, then

1104
01:09:45,560 --> 01:09:49,599
Speaker 1: you know people will buy responsibly. Even more so, Like

1105
01:09:49,680 --> 01:09:54,439
Speaker 1: I don't understand why it's like necessary to give them

1106
01:09:54,600 --> 01:10:00,280
Speaker 1: this end around situation, like a workaround. Yeah, to reach

1107
01:10:00,280 --> 01:10:03,439
Speaker 1: around with a work around isn't part of the issue

1108
01:10:03,600 --> 01:10:09,240
Speaker 1: with the e s A listening that, um, the states

1109
01:10:09,280 --> 01:10:13,320
Speaker 1: haven't listed it yet, Like is that a state managed species? No,

1110
01:10:13,840 --> 01:10:17,639
Speaker 1: the listing is federal, The listings federal, but these are

1111
01:10:17,720 --> 01:10:21,600
Speaker 1: being managed state by state? Correct correct right now? And

1112
01:10:21,680 --> 01:10:27,360
Speaker 1: that almost changed. It almost changed during UM, I guess

1113
01:10:27,320 --> 01:10:30,000
Speaker 1: I was during the Obama administration. They were very considered

1114
01:10:30,040 --> 01:10:32,840
Speaker 1: it and decided not to based on this like deal

1115
01:10:33,040 --> 01:10:35,360
Speaker 1: that have been put together by Matt Mead and govern

1116
01:10:35,479 --> 01:10:38,720
Speaker 1: Hicke Looper and the interior, and it's a big deal,

1117
01:10:38,800 --> 01:10:41,559
Speaker 1: like you doing the work on the front end instead

1118
01:10:41,560 --> 01:10:43,519
Speaker 1: of being like we Brent and I just talked about

1119
01:10:43,520 --> 01:10:48,080
Speaker 1: this last night, Right, It's like nobody wants to fight

1120
01:10:49,320 --> 01:10:53,519
Speaker 1: unless something's getting taken away from him. Right, So our

1121
01:10:53,560 --> 01:10:56,280
Speaker 1: ability to be proactive on this stuff and prevent the

1122
01:10:56,280 --> 01:10:59,599
Speaker 1: bird from going on the list is severely diminished by

1123
01:10:59,600 --> 01:11:02,000
Speaker 1: people who were like, well, let's just see how it

1124
01:11:02,000 --> 01:11:04,800
Speaker 1: works out. Yeah, And once they go on the list,

1125
01:11:04,840 --> 01:11:07,800
Speaker 1: then these people are immediately going to have to do

1126
01:11:07,880 --> 01:11:11,440
Speaker 1: some Oh all these cattlemen out there and in Wyoming

1127
01:11:11,520 --> 01:11:15,439
Speaker 1: with public land grazing a lotments and stuff, It's like,

1128
01:11:15,520 --> 01:11:18,120
Speaker 1: that's that's gonna hurt. Yeah, it's like, oh, there's an

1129
01:11:18,160 --> 01:11:21,360
Speaker 1: endangered species out there. Yeah. That was when we had

1130
01:11:21,400 --> 01:11:23,680
Speaker 1: got Wyoming's Governor Matt Meat on the show to talk

1131
01:11:23,680 --> 01:11:26,920
Speaker 1: about stage grouse before he at that time felt that

1132
01:11:26,960 --> 01:11:29,640
Speaker 1: the energy companies saw the writing on the wall and

1133
01:11:29,720 --> 01:11:33,639
Speaker 1: knew they needed to get with it, because he because

1134
01:11:33,640 --> 01:11:36,680
Speaker 1: their ability to operate on the landscape was gonna be

1135
01:11:36,760 --> 01:11:39,960
Speaker 1: dependent on their ability to recover that bird. I don't

1136
01:11:39,960 --> 01:11:41,040
Speaker 1: know if that's I don't know if he'd tell you

1137
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:42,880
Speaker 1: the same thing right now, that was many years ago

1138
01:11:43,400 --> 01:11:46,040
Speaker 1: that he he was feeling optimistic about that that like

1139
01:11:46,120 --> 01:11:47,800
Speaker 1: they were going to be that he felt that they

1140
01:11:47,800 --> 01:11:50,000
Speaker 1: were taking the driver's seat on it because they wanted

1141
01:11:50,040 --> 01:11:51,920
Speaker 1: to stay in business and they knew that when that

1142
01:11:51,960 --> 01:11:55,439
Speaker 1: bird hit, the endangered species listing business is going to

1143
01:11:55,520 --> 01:12:00,719
Speaker 1: be crippled. You know, Brody makes every mad all time

1144
01:12:02,320 --> 01:12:04,559
Speaker 1: about dogs. I'm at it. What's what's the breed of

1145
01:12:04,560 --> 01:12:06,960
Speaker 1: the week. I'm at at him? Now? Why what did

1146
01:12:07,000 --> 01:12:10,840
Speaker 1: I do? First? Tell what happened Brody to this R

1147
01:12:10,920 --> 01:12:14,120
Speaker 1: one oh nine? Oh? Yeah, while back we talked about O.

1148
01:12:14,400 --> 01:12:19,200
Speaker 1: R the one that the one what the wolf that

1149
01:12:19,400 --> 01:12:22,759
Speaker 1: wandered from Oregon way down in the southern California corne

1150
01:12:22,840 --> 01:12:25,639
Speaker 1: and got hit by a car is a collared wolf.

1151
01:12:26,360 --> 01:12:30,080
Speaker 1: Another collared wolf in Oregon just got killed. But it

1152
01:12:30,120 --> 01:12:35,479
Speaker 1: wasn't an accident. Um this this wolf O R one

1153
01:12:35,479 --> 01:12:40,120
Speaker 1: oh nine, a collared female was shot and killed the

1154
01:12:40,200 --> 01:12:45,120
Speaker 1: morning of February. And there's been a series of killings

1155
01:12:45,160 --> 01:12:49,320
Speaker 1: of wolves in the state. Legally, no, they're they're federally

1156
01:12:49,360 --> 01:12:53,200
Speaker 1: protected and shooting him and shooting him and leaving him land. Yeah,

1157
01:12:53,760 --> 01:12:59,160
Speaker 1: Brody's condemnation is very weak. What you're like, you do

1158
01:12:59,240 --> 01:13:01,760
Speaker 1: that little thing people do where you're like, no, of

1159
01:13:01,800 --> 01:13:04,320
Speaker 1: course we know that no one should. This just a

1160
01:13:04,400 --> 01:13:08,519
Speaker 1: note to myself. Like here I'm saying, if you're the

1161
01:13:08,640 --> 01:13:13,920
Speaker 1: kind of person that like hates wolves and you're gonna

1162
01:13:13,960 --> 01:13:17,320
Speaker 1: go out and kill a federally protected wolf with a collar,

1163
01:13:18,439 --> 01:13:22,320
Speaker 1: like you're shooting yourself in the foot. So okay, so

1164
01:13:22,400 --> 01:13:26,240
Speaker 1: you're offering advice, Yeah, don't do it. So you're you're

1165
01:13:26,280 --> 01:13:30,640
Speaker 1: offering advice to the kind of paters. Okay, so this

1166
01:13:30,720 --> 01:13:34,759
Speaker 1: is Brody's advice to shooting yourself in the foot, because

1167
01:13:34,800 --> 01:13:38,400
Speaker 1: this is the kind of thing that like just draws

1168
01:13:38,479 --> 01:13:42,599
Speaker 1: more attentions to keep keeping wolves protected, like in the

1169
01:13:42,680 --> 01:13:46,400
Speaker 1: long run, It's like, that's what you're saying. Yeah, I

1170
01:13:46,439 --> 01:13:47,880
Speaker 1: thought you were doing. I thought you were had a

1171
01:13:47,920 --> 01:13:50,479
Speaker 1: tip pretty tepid. No, no, no, At the end of

1172
01:13:50,479 --> 01:13:53,920
Speaker 1: the day, it's a wildlife violation. It's yeah, broke off

1173
01:13:55,160 --> 01:13:57,719
Speaker 1: federal wildlife and I thought you were being a little tepid.

1174
01:13:57,920 --> 01:14:00,240
Speaker 1: No no, no, whatever that word on this ship. It's

1175
01:14:00,280 --> 01:14:04,800
Speaker 1: like's gonna backfire on you in the long run, is

1176
01:14:04,840 --> 01:14:06,320
Speaker 1: what I'm saying. Do you have a lot of other

1177
01:14:06,360 --> 01:14:12,559
Speaker 1: advice for wolf haters not really smoke a pack a day.

1178
01:14:13,400 --> 01:14:18,120
Speaker 1: That that was your second. This just in from the

1179
01:14:18,120 --> 01:14:24,599
Speaker 1: wolf desk. Um. This one. This one's great because it's

1180
01:14:24,600 --> 01:14:27,920
Speaker 1: a it's a great example of a bipartisan you know,

1181
01:14:28,200 --> 01:14:33,520
Speaker 1: reaching across the aisle for the greater good. Um. In Wisconsin.

1182
01:14:33,640 --> 01:14:36,080
Speaker 1: Who knows if it will result in anything, but in Wisconsin,

1183
01:14:36,160 --> 01:14:41,280
Speaker 1: Republican Ron Johnson and Democrat Tammy Baldwin introduced a bill

1184
01:14:42,240 --> 01:14:45,880
Speaker 1: to remove protections for the wolf in the state of Wyoming.

1185
01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:54,920
Speaker 1: I misspoke in the state of Wisconsin. Correct. Um. They

1186
01:14:54,920 --> 01:14:59,280
Speaker 1: were backed up by some some Republicans and uh and

1187
01:14:59,520 --> 01:15:04,280
Speaker 1: uh Wyoming. Um. Johnson said that Wisconsin resident should have

1188
01:15:04,280 --> 01:15:07,559
Speaker 1: a say in wolf management. Baldwin issued a statement saying

1189
01:15:07,560 --> 01:15:11,520
Speaker 1: she believes the wolf population is strong and federal officials

1190
01:15:11,520 --> 01:15:15,519
Speaker 1: should let the state manage wolves. Um. And this is

1191
01:15:15,560 --> 01:15:19,280
Speaker 1: the reason they're doing this is is a federal judge

1192
01:15:19,479 --> 01:15:25,640
Speaker 1: in California last month ordered federal protections to be restored

1193
01:15:25,680 --> 01:15:29,240
Speaker 1: for wolves after they were lifted. What just last year

1194
01:15:30,000 --> 01:15:34,639
Speaker 1: they were the wolves were delisted, now they're listed again. Um.

1195
01:15:34,680 --> 01:15:40,160
Speaker 1: This keeps going on like constantly. Um, you know the

1196
01:15:40,400 --> 01:15:44,320
Speaker 1: wolves here up and down. Oh God, yes. Since the

1197
01:15:44,400 --> 01:15:47,320
Speaker 1: crazy thing is that the wolves in the Upper Great Lakes,

1198
01:15:47,360 --> 01:15:51,240
Speaker 1: the Western Great Lakes, they've been met recovery goals for

1199
01:15:51,360 --> 01:15:55,639
Speaker 1: I think over twenty years. Um, there's over four thousand

1200
01:15:55,760 --> 01:15:57,439
Speaker 1: of them up there. Now, Yeah, that's what that's the

1201
01:15:57,439 --> 01:15:59,920
Speaker 1: thing people lose sight of. There's more wolves in the

1202
01:16:00,040 --> 01:16:02,439
Speaker 1: Northern Great Lakes then in the Northern Rockies right and

1203
01:16:02,600 --> 01:16:07,759
Speaker 1: here the state's Wyoming, Montana, Idaho. They all have state

1204
01:16:07,800 --> 01:16:13,920
Speaker 1: management of these wolves. If these wolf protectionists would stop

1205
01:16:14,520 --> 01:16:16,920
Speaker 1: spend all this money on lawyers and making fishing, game

1206
01:16:16,920 --> 01:16:19,200
Speaker 1: agencies and other people spend all this money on lawyers,

1207
01:16:19,920 --> 01:16:21,800
Speaker 1: imagine what you could do with take all that money

1208
01:16:21,800 --> 01:16:24,679
Speaker 1: you put into stage grouse. Yeah, or when one's gonna

1209
01:16:24,680 --> 01:16:28,120
Speaker 1: fight over sage grouse, yeah exactly. Um. You know it's

1210
01:16:28,160 --> 01:16:30,400
Speaker 1: been on again, off again, like they were. You were

1211
01:16:30,479 --> 01:16:34,680
Speaker 1: able to the states had management in Minnesota for like

1212
01:16:34,720 --> 01:16:37,240
Speaker 1: a year, maybe you could hunt them, and the same

1213
01:16:37,280 --> 01:16:42,080
Speaker 1: thing happened in Wisconsin recently. Um, but now they're back

1214
01:16:42,120 --> 01:16:45,640
Speaker 1: to being that that whole Upper Great Lakes population is

1215
01:16:46,000 --> 01:16:49,400
Speaker 1: back to being federally protected. Well it's funny too, because

1216
01:16:49,400 --> 01:16:52,960
Speaker 1: it's like, if you're really into wolves, why don't you

1217
01:16:53,439 --> 01:16:56,080
Speaker 1: leave these ones alone and talk about the Mexican wolf

1218
01:16:56,160 --> 01:16:59,400
Speaker 1: or the red wolf, the ones that are really hurting. Yeah,

1219
01:16:59,680 --> 01:17:01,840
Speaker 1: or are the wolves that used to be running around

1220
01:17:01,840 --> 01:17:05,759
Speaker 1: in Kentucky. Yeah. I mean if you use Montana, Idaho,

1221
01:17:05,800 --> 01:17:09,519
Speaker 1: Wyoming as an example, like, it's a great example of

1222
01:17:09,560 --> 01:17:13,280
Speaker 1: state management of wolves, right, Like why can't Wisconsin, Michigan,

1223
01:17:14,120 --> 01:17:18,679
Speaker 1: Minnesota manage them the same way? Well? It's it's interesting

1224
01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:21,320
Speaker 1: here too because like some of the language is if

1225
01:17:21,360 --> 01:17:24,800
Speaker 1: you break it down, is like very it does make sense,

1226
01:17:24,840 --> 01:17:28,160
Speaker 1: it's agreeable. It's like you're you're talking about populations that

1227
01:17:28,240 --> 01:17:34,479
Speaker 1: don't see individual state borders. Right, So it's like, Okay, well,

1228
01:17:36,040 --> 01:17:39,439
Speaker 1: if we are concerned with the overall population, isn't right

1229
01:17:39,520 --> 01:17:44,800
Speaker 1: to segment off these populations making it out a Wisconsin population,

1230
01:17:44,920 --> 01:17:48,599
Speaker 1: let's say, like a Michigan population. Can we do that

1231
01:17:48,680 --> 01:17:52,439
Speaker 1: and then still take into context the overall population recovery

1232
01:17:52,479 --> 01:17:56,240
Speaker 1: goals um and thinking about it that way, It's like, yeah,

1233
01:17:56,280 --> 01:17:58,960
Speaker 1: I do get that, But everything we've done that with

1234
01:18:00,240 --> 01:18:05,599
Speaker 1: elk are only recovered across of their historic range. Yeah,

1235
01:18:06,040 --> 01:18:12,120
Speaker 1: big horn sheet. So black bears a fraction of the

1236
01:18:12,200 --> 01:18:14,920
Speaker 1: historic range. Yet in states they have a bunch of

1237
01:18:14,920 --> 01:18:16,599
Speaker 1: a loud of hunt them. No one says like, well

1238
01:18:16,600 --> 01:18:20,479
Speaker 1: we can't. You shouldn't hunt elk in Utah, because what

1239
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:23,519
Speaker 1: does that mean for outcovery in Illinois. No one makes

1240
01:18:23,560 --> 01:18:27,760
Speaker 1: that case. That's very true, that's very true. Um. The

1241
01:18:27,880 --> 01:18:33,280
Speaker 1: difference being though, right is elk in Illinois aren't on

1242
01:18:33,320 --> 01:18:37,000
Speaker 1: the endangered species list, right because all that stuff predated

1243
01:18:37,040 --> 01:18:41,000
Speaker 1: the endangered Species list, And we're dealing with the Endangered

1244
01:18:41,040 --> 01:18:45,400
Speaker 1: Species Act and this is the language that we're miring through.

1245
01:18:45,600 --> 01:18:48,879
Speaker 1: And yeah, it is just like this horrid, crappy political

1246
01:18:48,880 --> 01:18:51,080
Speaker 1: football that goes back and forth. I want to give

1247
01:18:51,120 --> 01:18:53,439
Speaker 1: people a little context here. It's the thing we've talked about.

1248
01:18:53,439 --> 01:18:55,320
Speaker 1: I was going to retalk about it real quick. There's

1249
01:18:55,360 --> 01:18:57,439
Speaker 1: a thing and anytime you hear about wolves, anytime you

1250
01:18:57,479 --> 01:18:59,320
Speaker 1: hearing about grizzly bears, you're gonna hear a thing called

1251
01:18:59,400 --> 01:19:05,040
Speaker 1: dps um. You take something like like so people know,

1252
01:19:05,120 --> 01:19:07,920
Speaker 1: like everything in the lower forty like everything was wolf habitat.

1253
01:19:07,960 --> 01:19:10,320
Speaker 1: There are wolves all over the damn place. When wolves

1254
01:19:10,320 --> 01:19:12,840
Speaker 1: got listed by the the endangers under the Endangerous b Sect,

1255
01:19:12,880 --> 01:19:17,720
Speaker 1: they got listed across the Lower forty eight. Later, someone said,

1256
01:19:17,760 --> 01:19:20,960
Speaker 1: that's not a very good management decision. Um, like, we're

1257
01:19:21,000 --> 01:19:26,200
Speaker 1: not gonna recover wolves, uh in downtown Nashville. Okay, I'm

1258
01:19:26,240 --> 01:19:29,000
Speaker 1: just pointing that out because people wouldn't be surprised when

1259
01:19:29,000 --> 01:19:32,040
Speaker 1: you read about the market hunters like Daniel Boone and

1260
01:19:32,080 --> 01:19:34,320
Speaker 1: his cronies, I mean when they're running around Kentucky, Tennessee

1261
01:19:34,320 --> 01:19:37,479
Speaker 1: either interacting wolves all time. Right. So some of the

1262
01:19:37,720 --> 01:19:40,040
Speaker 1: later said, you're not gonna recover wolves in downtown Nashville.

1263
01:19:40,080 --> 01:19:41,720
Speaker 1: So let's do this thing where we look at like

1264
01:19:41,800 --> 01:19:46,200
Speaker 1: where could you actually have them and create these things

1265
01:19:46,240 --> 01:19:50,519
Speaker 1: called distinct population segments, and let's manage these distinct population segments.

1266
01:19:50,520 --> 01:19:53,960
Speaker 1: And everybody thought this was a good idea at the time, right,

1267
01:19:54,000 --> 01:19:57,160
Speaker 1: So we made how many other for grizzy bears six seven,

1268
01:19:57,200 --> 01:20:03,679
Speaker 1: five or six? Northern Cascades, Northern Continental Divide stone cabinet

1269
01:20:03,720 --> 01:20:10,360
Speaker 1: yack um would be Alaska, right, No, that's lower forty

1270
01:20:10,439 --> 01:20:13,120
Speaker 1: eight dps. So they made a bunch of these dps

1271
01:20:13,240 --> 01:20:17,000
Speaker 1: is um with wolves. Okay, Northern Great Lakes. They made

1272
01:20:17,000 --> 01:20:19,280
Speaker 1: these like and they're like, let's manage this. So the

1273
01:20:19,320 --> 01:20:22,400
Speaker 1: cruxities arguments keeps coming down to you could point and

1274
01:20:22,400 --> 01:20:26,080
Speaker 1: say the Northern Great Lakes. Distinct population segment of wolves

1275
01:20:26,840 --> 01:20:30,320
Speaker 1: looks strong, it looks great. But someone who wants to

1276
01:20:30,680 --> 01:20:33,280
Speaker 1: block any kind of state management wolves is always gonna

1277
01:20:33,320 --> 01:20:37,559
Speaker 1: go like, yeah, but what about the neighboring area and

1278
01:20:37,560 --> 01:20:39,879
Speaker 1: and so they're sort of rehashing this thing that everybody

1279
01:20:39,880 --> 01:20:43,759
Speaker 1: agreed on is to manage these distinct population segments. Um,

1280
01:20:43,960 --> 01:20:48,439
Speaker 1: like you're never gonna recover the grizzly bear in Golden

1281
01:20:48,439 --> 01:20:50,640
Speaker 1: Gate Park. You're not gonna recover the grizzy bear and

1282
01:20:50,640 --> 01:20:52,800
Speaker 1: Golden Gate Parks, which it's part of its historic range

1283
01:20:52,840 --> 01:20:56,799
Speaker 1: parvasy storage range. Absolutely, So let's stop talking about areas

1284
01:20:56,800 --> 01:20:59,040
Speaker 1: that aren't gonna have them, and let's start talking about

1285
01:20:59,120 --> 01:21:02,680
Speaker 1: these areas that have the possibility of having a population,

1286
01:21:03,680 --> 01:21:08,839
Speaker 1: have a population, had that do or could possibly again

1287
01:21:08,920 --> 01:21:12,439
Speaker 1: like your your point of like all this crap and

1288
01:21:12,479 --> 01:21:16,599
Speaker 1: the billboards and the pr firms and the legal firms,

1289
01:21:16,640 --> 01:21:24,480
Speaker 1: like had that money been put uh into like a

1290
01:21:24,520 --> 01:21:28,640
Speaker 1: big wildlife easements on the Rocky Mountain Front, what that

1291
01:21:28,680 --> 01:21:36,520
Speaker 1: would do for grizzly bears and wolves would would outweigh

1292
01:21:36,880 --> 01:21:39,080
Speaker 1: all the back and forth bowl crap that they're going

1293
01:21:39,120 --> 01:21:42,760
Speaker 1: through right now, like like prevent this stuff from turning

1294
01:21:42,800 --> 01:21:46,440
Speaker 1: into condos. You're gonna you're gonna do more for wildlife

1295
01:21:46,439 --> 01:21:54,400
Speaker 1: than than all your back padding enriching lawyers. Um, you know,

1296
01:21:54,439 --> 01:21:55,800
Speaker 1: I don't want to hit in this real quick. It's

1297
01:21:55,880 --> 01:21:58,400
Speaker 1: kind of this just came home for us in Montana.

1298
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:01,200
Speaker 1: Get rid of tag man, Like remember the old days

1299
01:22:01,200 --> 01:22:02,519
Speaker 1: you had to have a back You had to wear

1300
01:22:02,560 --> 01:22:04,240
Speaker 1: a back tag on your back. And there's a couple

1301
01:22:04,240 --> 01:22:05,800
Speaker 1: of states still gotta do that. Like you're hunting, you

1302
01:22:05,800 --> 01:22:07,240
Speaker 1: have to wear like a thing on your back with

1303
01:22:07,280 --> 01:22:08,880
Speaker 1: your license in it. Col you ever had to do

1304
01:22:08,920 --> 01:22:11,920
Speaker 1: that out west here? Not ever a thing Wisconsin. Ship man.

1305
01:22:12,120 --> 01:22:14,840
Speaker 1: If you don't anymore, you only recently didn't need to

1306
01:22:15,360 --> 01:22:18,960
Speaker 1: when we started uh kicking around like our tree gear

1307
01:22:19,360 --> 01:22:21,479
Speaker 1: or you know like tree stand ar tree gear. At

1308
01:22:21,479 --> 01:22:24,960
Speaker 1: first light, Um, they had the back tag hangers probably

1309
01:22:25,000 --> 01:22:28,720
Speaker 1: like eleven, yeah, two thousand and eleven, two twelve. He

1310
01:22:28,800 --> 01:22:32,080
Speaker 1: was like, it's gotta have this, you know, a couple

1311
01:22:32,080 --> 01:22:34,879
Speaker 1: of little metal groments that you can stick this giant

1312
01:22:34,960 --> 01:22:39,200
Speaker 1: safety pan crew for your for your and the last

1313
01:22:39,240 --> 01:22:41,160
Speaker 1: time I hunted deer in Wisconsin you still had to

1314
01:22:41,160 --> 01:22:43,479
Speaker 1: have that sun bitch and thing. How many years ago

1315
01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:45,439
Speaker 1: was that the last time I hunt a deer there,

1316
01:22:45,439 --> 01:22:47,320
Speaker 1: I don't know, five six years ago. Yeah, I think

1317
01:22:47,400 --> 01:22:50,240
Speaker 1: I don't think you have to wear him anymore. Yeah yeah,

1318
01:22:50,280 --> 01:22:52,120
Speaker 1: And you had like you couldn't obscure it, like I

1319
01:22:52,160 --> 01:22:55,959
Speaker 1: had a backpack on. And so all the armchair experts

1320
01:22:55,960 --> 01:22:58,120
Speaker 1: are writing in like he's actually a violation because his

1321
01:22:58,200 --> 01:23:02,200
Speaker 1: back tags obscured by his backpack. Can you know what

1322
01:23:02,320 --> 01:23:04,360
Speaker 1: I was? It dougs too. He still he was telling

1323
01:23:04,360 --> 01:23:08,280
Speaker 1: me about those regulation changes, and he he said that

1324
01:23:08,320 --> 01:23:11,160
Speaker 1: the regulations read that if you choose to wear a hat,

1325
01:23:11,960 --> 01:23:16,320
Speaker 1: it has to be orange or just go nothing. Right.

1326
01:23:16,520 --> 01:23:22,400
Speaker 1: It was like, so, my bald, highly reflective head. The

1327
01:23:22,439 --> 01:23:25,200
Speaker 1: way these apps so are are here in Montana, they

1328
01:23:25,240 --> 01:23:27,400
Speaker 1: just went to an app it's called the e tag.

1329
01:23:28,800 --> 01:23:30,400
Speaker 1: In your future, you're not going to carry a tag

1330
01:23:30,439 --> 01:23:33,160
Speaker 1: around anymore. You might still, you might be in a

1331
01:23:33,160 --> 01:23:35,240
Speaker 1: state where you still do, but just gonna be all

1332
01:23:35,280 --> 01:23:37,280
Speaker 1: app based. Now here's the weird thing about the apps.

1333
01:23:39,640 --> 01:23:41,920
Speaker 1: I heard through the grape vine. A little birdie was

1334
01:23:41,960 --> 01:23:45,200
Speaker 1: telling me that in designing the app, they were wondering

1335
01:23:45,200 --> 01:23:50,799
Speaker 1: about the ability that when you were when you were tagged,

1336
01:23:50,800 --> 01:23:53,000
Speaker 1: when you were E tagging, So you're using an app

1337
01:23:53,080 --> 01:23:55,479
Speaker 1: that works offline, you don't need to have a cell signal,

1338
01:23:56,640 --> 01:23:59,920
Speaker 1: and you fill out information mail right, right, date of kill,

1339
01:24:00,360 --> 01:24:05,200
Speaker 1: method of kill, male, female, how many times on each side, right, whatever,

1340
01:24:05,280 --> 01:24:08,400
Speaker 1: biometric information thereafter. You just do this all on your

1341
01:24:08,400 --> 01:24:15,439
Speaker 1: app and it files it um. There was talk about

1342
01:24:15,680 --> 01:24:20,840
Speaker 1: why not have it also pulled a location since if

1343
01:24:20,880 --> 01:24:24,400
Speaker 1: you read your rag any Reagan the Planet, a game

1344
01:24:24,400 --> 01:24:26,880
Speaker 1: warden can ask you take me to the kill site,

1345
01:24:26,920 --> 01:24:28,320
Speaker 1: and you have to take them to the kill site.

1346
01:24:28,800 --> 01:24:33,000
Speaker 1: It's just a thing. Any warden, anytime can make you

1347
01:24:33,280 --> 01:24:35,040
Speaker 1: take them to the kill side of where he killed

1348
01:24:35,040 --> 01:24:39,200
Speaker 1: an animal. Also, when you do your surveys, like if

1349
01:24:39,200 --> 01:24:45,320
Speaker 1: you trap and you trap h Martin's otters, you hunt

1350
01:24:45,320 --> 01:24:47,600
Speaker 1: black bears, you hunt wolves, there's a part and the

1351
01:24:47,680 --> 01:24:52,519
Speaker 1: thing where you say where it was right. They had

1352
01:24:52,560 --> 01:24:56,080
Speaker 1: this chance where you could have captured that for every

1353
01:24:56,120 --> 01:24:58,439
Speaker 1: tagged animal in the state and you would not need

1354
01:24:58,479 --> 01:25:03,000
Speaker 1: to do surveys right, just be that, you know, imagine

1355
01:25:03,040 --> 01:25:06,599
Speaker 1: like the detailed look you'd have on harvest. But they

1356
01:25:06,960 --> 01:25:09,960
Speaker 1: felt that it was a privacy issue. When you download

1357
01:25:10,000 --> 01:25:14,160
Speaker 1: the app, it asks you if you want to have

1358
01:25:14,680 --> 01:25:19,760
Speaker 1: location services turned on while you're using that app, and

1359
01:25:19,800 --> 01:25:21,760
Speaker 1: it'll take when you don't know the app. I didn't

1360
01:25:21,800 --> 01:25:24,160
Speaker 1: notice that I ask you the question. And also you

1361
01:25:24,200 --> 01:25:26,560
Speaker 1: can opt in. You can opt in, and when you

1362
01:25:26,680 --> 01:25:29,799
Speaker 1: validate that tag, it's gonna record right where you're staying.

1363
01:25:29,840 --> 01:25:33,120
Speaker 1: I didn't know you could opt in. Yeah, I didn't know,

1364
01:25:33,400 --> 01:25:36,200
Speaker 1: because it's like, like I said, they can go they have.

1365
01:25:36,360 --> 01:25:37,840
Speaker 1: It just is weird because they have the right to

1366
01:25:37,880 --> 01:25:41,920
Speaker 1: make you take them there anyways, but that doesn't violent privacy. Yeah,

1367
01:25:41,920 --> 01:25:44,920
Speaker 1: that's just like a given. But they like, I think

1368
01:25:44,960 --> 01:25:47,519
Speaker 1: a lot of people are going to be leery of saying, yeah,

1369
01:25:47,640 --> 01:25:50,160
Speaker 1: go ahead and track me while I'm oh, yeah, no

1370
01:25:50,200 --> 01:25:52,800
Speaker 1: one was. Um, but what's so funny is everybody's like,

1371
01:25:52,920 --> 01:25:55,200
Speaker 1: you know, open arms about being tracked. But like, dude,

1372
01:25:55,200 --> 01:25:57,439
Speaker 1: what do you think your phone is doing? I thought

1373
01:25:57,439 --> 01:26:00,640
Speaker 1: your phone monitors when you talk about and serves you

1374
01:26:00,760 --> 01:26:03,320
Speaker 1: ads about it an articles. Yeah, but I posted about

1375
01:26:03,320 --> 01:26:05,479
Speaker 1: how much I like the idea of not carrying around

1376
01:26:05,479 --> 01:26:10,760
Speaker 1: ten pages of paper in my backpack. Um, and a

1377
01:26:10,840 --> 01:26:14,240
Speaker 1: game warden sent me a message and he said that

1378
01:26:14,280 --> 01:26:17,200
Speaker 1: these apps, you know, they sound great, but there are

1379
01:26:17,240 --> 01:26:23,599
Speaker 1: like cons to them too. Um, there's like he believes

1380
01:26:23,640 --> 01:26:28,600
Speaker 1: there's gonna be issues with officers inspecting people's phones, perhaps

1381
01:26:28,640 --> 01:26:34,120
Speaker 1: like privacy batteries. Yeah, yeah, and it'd be like I

1382
01:26:34,560 --> 01:26:37,559
Speaker 1: left it at home, I forgot it. Yeah, I don't

1383
01:26:37,560 --> 01:26:42,120
Speaker 1: know how to do it, but I get his concerns.

1384
01:26:41,960 --> 01:26:44,479
Speaker 1: It's just that ain't gonna stop anything. This is gonna

1385
01:26:44,479 --> 01:26:46,600
Speaker 1: be how it's gonna be in ten years. I don't know.

1386
01:26:46,680 --> 01:26:52,040
Speaker 1: Five years, you're gonna be like, remember tags. I bet

1387
01:26:52,080 --> 01:26:57,519
Speaker 1: you I already feel that way now, remember tags, because

1388
01:26:57,560 --> 01:27:00,519
Speaker 1: they've gotten this chantzier and like it used to be,

1389
01:27:00,920 --> 01:27:06,800
Speaker 1: like a substantial tag was printed on fancy papers like indestructible,

1390
01:27:07,280 --> 01:27:09,680
Speaker 1: and now for years, like you know, Montana, you just

1391
01:27:09,760 --> 01:27:13,080
Speaker 1: print him at home, Nebraska for probably fifteen years, and

1392
01:27:13,080 --> 01:27:16,280
Speaker 1: when it gets wet, you watched it dissolved. Yeah, exactly.

1393
01:27:16,720 --> 01:27:20,679
Speaker 1: And um, I kind of like the heavy duty tags.

1394
01:27:20,720 --> 01:27:22,840
Speaker 1: It's kind of like a little collectible thing at the

1395
01:27:22,920 --> 01:27:25,400
Speaker 1: end of Oh yeah. I have a folder that's you know,

1396
01:27:25,600 --> 01:27:29,160
Speaker 1: two inches thick now of you know, twenty years plus

1397
01:27:29,160 --> 01:27:31,240
Speaker 1: of tags. And when I started doing a while back,

1398
01:27:31,400 --> 01:27:34,479
Speaker 1: I just take a sharpie and after a hunt, I

1399
01:27:34,600 --> 01:27:37,400
Speaker 1: just make a few notes on it. With Chester, we

1400
01:27:37,520 --> 01:27:43,080
Speaker 1: hunted Link Creek didn't get nothing. You know, never punched

1401
01:27:43,080 --> 01:27:44,960
Speaker 1: this one. But if I did, you know who may

1402
01:27:45,000 --> 01:27:47,519
Speaker 1: be helping? You know? I figured, as an old manuals

1403
01:27:47,520 --> 01:27:51,439
Speaker 1: will be nice memories to flip through. Yep, enough enough

1404
01:27:51,560 --> 01:27:54,280
Speaker 1: unpunched tags to stuff a pillow case. Kind of what

1405
01:27:54,320 --> 01:27:57,960
Speaker 1: I'm working on right now. Does anybody understand this conservation

1406
01:27:58,000 --> 01:28:01,240
Speaker 1: easement tax for AU deal? I don't understand it well enough.

1407
01:28:01,560 --> 01:28:05,720
Speaker 1: It's pretty confusing because it's eloquently. Can you speak to it?

1408
01:28:07,520 --> 01:28:10,000
Speaker 1: I can bring up some questions about it? Tell me

1409
01:28:10,280 --> 01:28:13,160
Speaker 1: how do you use? How do people? How would people

1410
01:28:13,280 --> 01:28:15,800
Speaker 1: use something where they hear like conservation easements? Like? Who

1411
01:28:15,800 --> 01:28:19,200
Speaker 1: would be opposed to that? That sounds fantastic. So what

1412
01:28:19,360 --> 01:28:23,120
Speaker 1: you're referring to is syndicate conservation easements. I don't know

1413
01:28:23,120 --> 01:28:29,240
Speaker 1: what that is. So there's two types of transactions when

1414
01:28:29,240 --> 01:28:32,160
Speaker 1: you talk to conservation easement. Can you go real high level?

1415
01:28:32,439 --> 01:28:34,120
Speaker 1: Can you back up one step and tell people what

1416
01:28:34,120 --> 01:28:36,519
Speaker 1: the hell conservation easement is? You hear about it a

1417
01:28:36,520 --> 01:28:38,280
Speaker 1: lot in some areas, and like, growing up, I've never

1418
01:28:38,320 --> 01:28:41,639
Speaker 1: heard anybody talking about a conservation easement into West Michigan. Well,

1419
01:28:41,760 --> 01:28:46,040
Speaker 1: they've been pioneered last thirty plus years that explain that

1420
01:28:46,080 --> 01:28:50,800
Speaker 1: wouldn't um. The land trust movement has really caught a

1421
01:28:50,840 --> 01:28:53,920
Speaker 1: lot of excitement last thirty years, like the main For instance,

1422
01:28:53,920 --> 01:28:56,320
Speaker 1: we have eighty land trusts because we don't have much

1423
01:28:56,320 --> 01:28:59,360
Speaker 1: public land. So it's been responsive to that. And so

1424
01:29:00,080 --> 01:29:03,320
Speaker 1: when you can serve a land, there's fee simple, which

1425
01:29:03,320 --> 01:29:05,360
Speaker 1: is you're buying all of the land. I own all

1426
01:29:05,400 --> 01:29:09,040
Speaker 1: this land, it's my land. And then a conservation easement

1427
01:29:10,680 --> 01:29:16,559
Speaker 1: is a type of easeman that restricts um certain uses

1428
01:29:16,560 --> 01:29:19,840
Speaker 1: of the property. So most of it is development rights,

1429
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:24,439
Speaker 1: and so like a land trust would buy the development

1430
01:29:24,520 --> 01:29:26,080
Speaker 1: rights on this piece of property because you want to

1431
01:29:26,080 --> 01:29:30,360
Speaker 1: stay wild. There can be a bunch of other prescriptions

1432
01:29:30,360 --> 01:29:32,639
Speaker 1: in an Eastman like no two easements are the same.

1433
01:29:33,560 --> 01:29:37,080
Speaker 1: Some allow public access, a lot of them don't. UM.

1434
01:29:37,160 --> 01:29:41,040
Speaker 1: That's one big misconception as you see, conservations meant does

1435
01:29:41,080 --> 01:29:44,880
Speaker 1: not imply access no now. And there's actually you know,

1436
01:29:45,520 --> 01:29:48,400
Speaker 1: with federal funds like Force Legacy other things like that

1437
01:29:48,439 --> 01:29:53,000
Speaker 1: they've actually required that to happen as part of that

1438
01:29:53,680 --> 01:29:57,200
Speaker 1: program is that that Eastman has to have public access.

1439
01:29:57,200 --> 01:30:00,559
Speaker 1: And public access isn't necessarily vehicular acts this or anything

1440
01:30:00,600 --> 01:30:04,680
Speaker 1: like that. It's foot access, like just the legal terminology

1441
01:30:04,680 --> 01:30:11,120
Speaker 1: of public access UM. So the thing corencent um is

1442
01:30:12,960 --> 01:30:16,800
Speaker 1: less interesting from a conservation and our standpoint and more

1443
01:30:16,880 --> 01:30:21,479
Speaker 1: interesting from tax law I guess. And so when you

1444
01:30:21,600 --> 01:30:26,880
Speaker 1: donate a conservation easeman, there's in tax code UM if

1445
01:30:26,880 --> 01:30:30,760
Speaker 1: you're donating it to a charitable organization, the value. Like

1446
01:30:30,840 --> 01:30:33,839
Speaker 1: let's say you donate a chunk of swamp two ducks unlimited.

1447
01:30:33,840 --> 01:30:35,840
Speaker 1: I don't know, is that a good example. Well, let's

1448
01:30:35,880 --> 01:30:39,400
Speaker 1: say you you in Maine. This is this happens. You've

1449
01:30:39,439 --> 01:30:41,519
Speaker 1: owned a hundred acres for your whole life, and you

1450
01:30:41,560 --> 01:30:45,200
Speaker 1: want to donate that hundred acres of woodland um to

1451
01:30:45,280 --> 01:30:49,280
Speaker 1: a university or a land trust, and you want them

1452
01:30:49,320 --> 01:30:51,880
Speaker 1: to keep it for the public good. And the public

1453
01:30:51,880 --> 01:30:56,879
Speaker 1: good can be defined through scenic resources, natural resources, a

1454
01:30:56,920 --> 01:31:01,360
Speaker 1: public access. A bunch of different metrics apply under that

1455
01:31:02,320 --> 01:31:05,080
Speaker 1: public good. Even a certain amount of income, like you

1456
01:31:05,120 --> 01:31:08,640
Speaker 1: can have it defined as needs to be managed in

1457
01:31:08,640 --> 01:31:12,679
Speaker 1: a certain way. So if it's an active wood lot, right, well,

1458
01:31:12,720 --> 01:31:17,479
Speaker 1: like forever wild easements are very popular now, which means

1459
01:31:17,479 --> 01:31:19,519
Speaker 1: like you can't do anything to it, let nature take

1460
01:31:19,560 --> 01:31:24,679
Speaker 1: its course um and working forest easements or another example

1461
01:31:24,760 --> 01:31:27,920
Speaker 1: where they allow for that commercial use like you can

1462
01:31:27,960 --> 01:31:32,960
Speaker 1: log it, you can have roads anything associated with that use. Um.

1463
01:31:33,000 --> 01:31:37,559
Speaker 1: But when there's a donation of fee land or easement land,

1464
01:31:38,080 --> 01:31:41,720
Speaker 1: there's a value associated with that, so you can get

1465
01:31:41,760 --> 01:31:44,320
Speaker 1: an appraisal for just like a fee land. So the

1466
01:31:44,400 --> 01:31:48,160
Speaker 1: total land donation, how much does this land worth? That's

1467
01:31:48,200 --> 01:31:50,840
Speaker 1: what the person could deduct as a tax right off,

1468
01:31:51,040 --> 01:31:54,559
Speaker 1: like a charitable donation tax. Yeah, and there's a number

1469
01:31:54,560 --> 01:31:57,439
Speaker 1: of ways they can do that. And that's like literally

1470
01:31:57,520 --> 01:32:01,400
Speaker 1: as a land trust, you say, we can't you could

1471
01:32:01,479 --> 01:32:03,599
Speaker 1: qualify for this, but we can't give you advice on

1472
01:32:03,640 --> 01:32:06,760
Speaker 1: this um. So they have to do all this so

1473
01:32:06,800 --> 01:32:09,240
Speaker 1: they have to go give me Like you know what's

1474
01:32:09,360 --> 01:32:13,920
Speaker 1: so confused about land, Like a land trust has always

1475
01:32:13,920 --> 01:32:18,000
Speaker 1: mean like a plethora of organizations in this country that

1476
01:32:19,840 --> 01:32:23,599
Speaker 1: by help preserve land. There's now an airbnb for hunting

1477
01:32:23,640 --> 01:32:30,160
Speaker 1: called land trust, which is like kind of made it.

1478
01:32:30,160 --> 01:32:34,760
Speaker 1: It's like makes a lot of name confusion because it's like, well,

1479
01:32:34,760 --> 01:32:37,519
Speaker 1: there's also a community land trust where for affordable housing.

1480
01:32:37,560 --> 01:32:39,920
Speaker 1: That's a big terminology issue too, So there is a

1481
01:32:39,960 --> 01:32:41,720
Speaker 1: lot of it like that you have to like go

1482
01:32:41,800 --> 01:32:44,719
Speaker 1: think of another term now. Yeah, so I'm a land

1483
01:32:44,720 --> 01:32:52,200
Speaker 1: trust so conservancy you know, UM, these are mostly not

1484
01:32:52,640 --> 01:32:55,000
Speaker 1: what that article is talking about. But when you say that,

1485
01:32:55,240 --> 01:32:57,040
Speaker 1: when you talk about the tax right off part, like

1486
01:32:57,080 --> 01:33:00,000
Speaker 1: let's say I don'tate my hunter acres and I say

1487
01:33:00,080 --> 01:33:01,519
Speaker 1: to you, hey, man, I need to know the value

1488
01:33:01,520 --> 01:33:03,120
Speaker 1: so I can do a tax right off, you're saying

1489
01:33:03,160 --> 01:33:05,360
Speaker 1: that you don't. You You're like figure that out on

1490
01:33:05,360 --> 01:33:06,519
Speaker 1: your own. Like, I'm not going to give you what

1491
01:33:06,640 --> 01:33:10,519
Speaker 1: we would have to say, give you an acknowledgement. We'd

1492
01:33:10,520 --> 01:33:16,599
Speaker 1: have to substantiate that it is a charitable um within

1493
01:33:16,720 --> 01:33:20,320
Speaker 1: that our mission, you know, and it falls within those

1494
01:33:20,400 --> 01:33:24,080
Speaker 1: values that we're protecting, and we have to substantiate those values.

1495
01:33:24,120 --> 01:33:28,240
Speaker 1: And most reputable land trusts either go by the standards

1496
01:33:28,280 --> 01:33:31,400
Speaker 1: and practices or are accredited by the Land Trust Alliance

1497
01:33:31,680 --> 01:33:36,559
Speaker 1: UM and they have, you know, very long list of

1498
01:33:36,600 --> 01:33:41,040
Speaker 1: standards and practices UM, like getting an appraisal before you

1499
01:33:41,080 --> 01:33:44,640
Speaker 1: buy any land UM. And for conservation easements, this is

1500
01:33:44,720 --> 01:33:47,080
Speaker 1: kind of a sub sect. These have come in favor

1501
01:33:47,160 --> 01:33:50,840
Speaker 1: because the private landowner can continue to own the land,

1502
01:33:51,640 --> 01:33:54,880
Speaker 1: but their development rights are restricted. So this is very

1503
01:33:54,880 --> 01:33:58,439
Speaker 1: popular main forest land because the forest owners can get

1504
01:33:58,479 --> 01:34:02,200
Speaker 1: income from the Eastman purchase us. It's not really in

1505
01:34:02,280 --> 01:34:06,519
Speaker 1: conflict with their current use i e. Forestry and um,

1506
01:34:07,560 --> 01:34:11,080
Speaker 1: you know they can continue to cut the forest after

1507
01:34:11,200 --> 01:34:14,960
Speaker 1: that in place, but they're ruling out that it will

1508
01:34:15,000 --> 01:34:19,760
Speaker 1: be turned into a subdivision. Yeah, exactly, we can't subdivide it.

1509
01:34:19,840 --> 01:34:23,880
Speaker 1: You can't. There's limits on structures and commercial use and

1510
01:34:24,080 --> 01:34:27,760
Speaker 1: those are all defined differently. Um. But what's happening in

1511
01:34:27,800 --> 01:34:32,720
Speaker 1: that syndicate conservation ease meant there's a loophole where um,

1512
01:34:32,800 --> 01:34:40,720
Speaker 1: as a business you can buy land and in this situation, UM,

1513
01:34:40,960 --> 01:34:43,840
Speaker 1: simply put, you get investors to invest. Let's say you're

1514
01:34:43,840 --> 01:34:49,240
Speaker 1: buying a two d dollar piece of property. Um, you

1515
01:34:49,360 --> 01:34:56,960
Speaker 1: get everyone four guys to invest. The issue is you can,

1516
01:34:57,040 --> 01:35:03,200
Speaker 1: through in agreement, say any charitable donation by donating an

1517
01:35:03,200 --> 01:35:06,720
Speaker 1: Eastman can go to those people in this agreement. So

1518
01:35:06,760 --> 01:35:09,479
Speaker 1: at that point they found a lot of people in

1519
01:35:09,600 --> 01:35:12,640
Speaker 1: violation of this where they go get an appraisal that's inflated.

1520
01:35:13,720 --> 01:35:17,120
Speaker 1: So say you get your body Jim, you pay him

1521
01:35:17,160 --> 01:35:19,520
Speaker 1: on the side to say, hey, can you do an appraisal.

1522
01:35:20,040 --> 01:35:23,200
Speaker 1: Can you make this praisal come out to be food dollars?

1523
01:35:24,000 --> 01:35:27,840
Speaker 1: And then you donate the value and so all those

1524
01:35:27,840 --> 01:35:31,000
Speaker 1: guys who are part of the syndicate get a hundred

1525
01:35:31,000 --> 01:35:36,400
Speaker 1: thousand dollars each UM tax deduction. So it's that it's

1526
01:35:36,479 --> 01:35:41,000
Speaker 1: to me that's the crime at place, Well, it's there's

1527
01:35:41,040 --> 01:35:44,439
Speaker 1: a legal way to do it now as a tax shelter,

1528
01:35:45,120 --> 01:35:50,519
Speaker 1: but most likely UM. A lot of these these deals,

1529
01:35:50,520 --> 01:35:54,880
Speaker 1: which I'm not an expert on UM, are taking advantage

1530
01:35:54,880 --> 01:35:58,080
Speaker 1: by getting inflated estimates of value and stuff like that

1531
01:35:58,400 --> 01:36:00,640
Speaker 1: UM and put it in perspect active. I think the

1532
01:36:00,760 --> 01:36:05,320
Speaker 1: article cre incident was nine billion dollars a year in

1533
01:36:05,360 --> 01:36:10,799
Speaker 1: the syndicate. Organizations are getting UM put in for tax

1534
01:36:10,800 --> 01:36:15,479
Speaker 1: write offs, whereas the Land Trust Alliance says out of

1535
01:36:15,520 --> 01:36:18,880
Speaker 1: all the ones just within their organizations that they deal

1536
01:36:18,920 --> 01:36:25,840
Speaker 1: with is one billion. So it's being used pretty much. Well.

1537
01:36:25,880 --> 01:36:28,439
Speaker 1: At the center of all these deals is usually a

1538
01:36:29,680 --> 01:36:34,160
Speaker 1: law firm, so they're kind of figuring out, you know,

1539
01:36:34,200 --> 01:36:38,280
Speaker 1: when you do a development, when you do land purchases,

1540
01:36:38,320 --> 01:36:42,160
Speaker 1: asset transfers, this could be a tool in their toolbox

1541
01:36:43,120 --> 01:36:49,160
Speaker 1: where they can give people higher value tax deductions than

1542
01:36:49,240 --> 01:36:51,320
Speaker 1: the investment they're putting in. That's the kind of the

1543
01:36:51,360 --> 01:36:55,479
Speaker 1: basic of two cents of it. I'm not familiar with

1544
01:36:55,479 --> 01:36:58,760
Speaker 1: it because literally, anyone with a logo that says land

1545
01:36:58,760 --> 01:37:00,640
Speaker 1: trust or anything like that is not a party to

1546
01:37:00,680 --> 01:37:04,120
Speaker 1: these deals at all. Like, that's not that's the confusing

1547
01:37:04,160 --> 01:37:05,920
Speaker 1: part about this. Well, that's why you were trying to

1548
01:37:06,000 --> 01:37:08,760
Speaker 1: create a distance between yourself and these fraudulent activities because

1549
01:37:08,760 --> 01:37:11,120
Speaker 1: you're just not involved in it. There's not there's no

1550
01:37:11,160 --> 01:37:13,360
Speaker 1: one who really does these. Back in the day, there

1551
01:37:13,360 --> 01:37:17,080
Speaker 1: were some of the bigger organizations that before the Land

1552
01:37:17,080 --> 01:37:20,639
Speaker 1: Trust Alliance started, did stuff like conservation easements on golf

1553
01:37:20,680 --> 01:37:26,440
Speaker 1: courses um and you know, obviously that's kind of outside

1554
01:37:26,560 --> 01:37:31,400
Speaker 1: the point of a conservation easemen, but golf course could

1555
01:37:31,439 --> 01:37:36,120
Speaker 1: have a tremendous value, so you would get that donation receipt.

1556
01:37:36,200 --> 01:37:40,559
Speaker 1: And so that's like the Land Trust Alliance came came

1557
01:37:40,600 --> 01:37:44,280
Speaker 1: around because there's a lot of us that are very

1558
01:37:44,320 --> 01:37:48,680
Speaker 1: passionate and integrity. Like it says trust right in the name, right, so, like,

1559
01:37:49,520 --> 01:37:52,519
Speaker 1: you know, your integrity is very important, and so to

1560
01:37:52,600 --> 01:37:58,880
Speaker 1: have companies lobbying for this tax shelter, uh, it's kind

1561
01:37:58,920 --> 01:38:01,680
Speaker 1: of adverse to what we want to do, which is

1562
01:38:01,720 --> 01:38:05,439
Speaker 1: build trust and not undermined it through you know, just

1563
01:38:05,680 --> 01:38:08,840
Speaker 1: doing backdoor deals. And that's A big misconception when you're

1564
01:38:08,840 --> 01:38:11,760
Speaker 1: doing land trust work is that everyone's doing it for

1565
01:38:11,880 --> 01:38:15,400
Speaker 1: a charitable deduction. And in my experience working with a

1566
01:38:15,400 --> 01:38:18,439
Speaker 1: couple of different land trust most, I would say a

1567
01:38:18,479 --> 01:38:20,800
Speaker 1: majority of the people who donate the properties do not

1568
01:38:20,960 --> 01:38:24,840
Speaker 1: take that deduction. That's a shrewd trick. You can imagine

1569
01:38:24,840 --> 01:38:26,960
Speaker 1: the golf course or a ski hill or something being like,

1570
01:38:27,000 --> 01:38:29,519
Speaker 1: we're gonna come in, we're gonna develop the piss out

1571
01:38:29,520 --> 01:38:31,800
Speaker 1: of it. Then we're gonna take the parts that are

1572
01:38:31,800 --> 01:38:34,599
Speaker 1: meant to be skied on and say that they'll never

1573
01:38:34,640 --> 01:38:36,960
Speaker 1: be used for anything but skiing, and get a tax

1574
01:38:36,960 --> 01:38:39,599
Speaker 1: deduction off it and hand it back to people as

1575
01:38:39,640 --> 01:38:42,559
Speaker 1: a conservation easement. Well, and there's two two issues. Is

1576
01:38:42,600 --> 01:38:48,240
Speaker 1: that they can create charitable nonprofits that may not be

1577
01:38:48,400 --> 01:38:53,160
Speaker 1: that um true blue, so they that's a legal process

1578
01:38:53,240 --> 01:38:56,120
Speaker 1: to create that, and so they can create a fake

1579
01:38:56,240 --> 01:38:59,040
Speaker 1: nonprofit so to speak to act is that conservation. He's

1580
01:38:59,080 --> 01:39:04,720
Speaker 1: been holder man, so that you know that's where I

1581
01:39:04,760 --> 01:39:06,920
Speaker 1: don't you know, I think it's an issue that the

1582
01:39:07,000 --> 01:39:09,320
Speaker 1: Lantrust Alliance is right now they're lobbying to try to

1583
01:39:09,520 --> 01:39:11,759
Speaker 1: close that going. So that's the point you were saying earlier,

1584
01:39:11,760 --> 01:39:14,840
Speaker 1: you're saying that they're showing these like nine billion dollars

1585
01:39:15,400 --> 01:39:18,720
Speaker 1: of land trust conservations some activity. But then when you

1586
01:39:18,760 --> 01:39:21,280
Speaker 1: go and ask the actual groups they're doing like legitimate

1587
01:39:21,439 --> 01:39:25,120
Speaker 1: land trust work, they can only show a billion bucks. No, specifically,

1588
01:39:25,200 --> 01:39:30,200
Speaker 1: that nine billion is syndicate conservation easements where it's a

1589
01:39:30,240 --> 01:39:35,360
Speaker 1: company who's passing the charitable gift down to investors, so

1590
01:39:35,720 --> 01:39:39,759
Speaker 1: versus a nonprofit who may be getting a donation from

1591
01:39:39,800 --> 01:39:44,720
Speaker 1: a individual or you know, even a business, but not

1592
01:39:45,320 --> 01:39:48,240
Speaker 1: in that situation where they're passing on the charitable gift

1593
01:39:48,280 --> 01:39:53,240
Speaker 1: through some investor agreement. And and these are it's important

1594
01:39:53,280 --> 01:39:56,559
Speaker 1: to make the distinction because these are incredible tools for

1595
01:39:56,800 --> 01:40:01,400
Speaker 1: you know, mon paw rancher out there who uh want

1596
01:40:01,439 --> 01:40:03,600
Speaker 1: to stay on the way and they want to be

1597
01:40:03,640 --> 01:40:07,519
Speaker 1: able to pass it down and they need to like

1598
01:40:07,680 --> 01:40:12,240
Speaker 1: be competitive right with like rising tax costs like Gallatin

1599
01:40:12,320 --> 01:40:15,919
Speaker 1: Valley is a great example, right, Like you have property

1600
01:40:15,920 --> 01:40:21,280
Speaker 1: tax values that are are outweighing um the value of

1601
01:40:21,479 --> 01:40:26,280
Speaker 1: farming of agriculture here. But you could work with a

1602
01:40:26,400 --> 01:40:30,920
Speaker 1: number of trusts and the UH federal government to figure

1603
01:40:30,960 --> 01:40:34,639
Speaker 1: out ways to put wildlife ease months on that property

1604
01:40:34,720 --> 01:40:39,400
Speaker 1: that that do pay something. Um Wells Main Farmland Trust

1605
01:40:39,479 --> 01:40:45,720
Speaker 1: has a program called by restrict and resell and agriculture

1606
01:40:45,960 --> 01:40:50,920
Speaker 1: is a charitable um use of the land public good

1607
01:40:51,120 --> 01:40:53,400
Speaker 1: and so you don't necessarily have to link it to

1608
01:40:54,600 --> 01:40:58,200
Speaker 1: other wildlife resources. Um SO their easements are quite different

1609
01:40:58,200 --> 01:41:00,920
Speaker 1: than the ones we've worked with because there sole goal

1610
01:41:01,560 --> 01:41:04,799
Speaker 1: is to keep farmland at a price point that farmers

1611
01:41:04,800 --> 01:41:09,000
Speaker 1: could have um buy them at. So they'll buy the property,

1612
01:41:09,040 --> 01:41:13,400
Speaker 1: they'll put a conservation easement on it, which reduces the

1613
01:41:13,479 --> 01:41:15,879
Speaker 1: value of the property because you're taking away those development

1614
01:41:15,960 --> 01:41:19,680
Speaker 1: rights and when you appraise land, mostly you're appraising on

1615
01:41:19,760 --> 01:41:22,640
Speaker 1: development rights, unless you're talking about large swaths of like

1616
01:41:22,760 --> 01:41:25,880
Speaker 1: forest land. They would then you know, value those based

1617
01:41:25,920 --> 01:41:29,879
Speaker 1: on like timber receipts and stuff like that. But um

1618
01:41:29,920 --> 01:41:33,280
Speaker 1: SO that their hope is that will allow farmers to

1619
01:41:33,280 --> 01:41:37,240
Speaker 1: stay on these properties productive farm soils. Um So that's

1620
01:41:37,400 --> 01:41:42,240
Speaker 1: the easement is to me for public access an imperfect

1621
01:41:42,240 --> 01:41:46,040
Speaker 1: tool because you still have that private landowner issue. So

1622
01:41:46,120 --> 01:41:47,920
Speaker 1: like if you want to build trails and stuff like that,

1623
01:41:48,280 --> 01:41:51,719
Speaker 1: you have to be very explicit with what you're trying

1624
01:41:51,760 --> 01:41:55,240
Speaker 1: to preserve with an easement because you still have the

1625
01:41:55,280 --> 01:41:59,320
Speaker 1: burden of going to court if that said landowner or

1626
01:41:59,320 --> 01:42:03,760
Speaker 1: even a third party violates your easement terms, you have

1627
01:42:03,920 --> 01:42:07,640
Speaker 1: to be ready to then go defend that in the courtroom,

1628
01:42:07,640 --> 01:42:12,160
Speaker 1: which can be extremely expensive. Um So because of that,

1629
01:42:12,200 --> 01:42:15,320
Speaker 1: most land trusts have legal endowments, that's one of the

1630
01:42:15,360 --> 01:42:19,600
Speaker 1: standards and practices stuff like that to help ensure against

1631
01:42:19,640 --> 01:42:32,040
Speaker 1: those inevitable costs. I want it get a little bit

1632
01:42:32,040 --> 01:42:34,280
Speaker 1: into your organization, High Peaks Alliance. Can you tell the

1633
01:42:34,320 --> 01:42:36,920
Speaker 1: story of just we can be talking about like how

1634
01:42:36,920 --> 01:42:40,599
Speaker 1: people sort of abuse the system. Can you tell can

1635
01:42:40,640 --> 01:42:43,000
Speaker 1: we talk about the Shiloh Pond project, you guys ran,

1636
01:42:43,200 --> 01:42:45,439
Speaker 1: can you talk about can you explain to people how

1637
01:42:45,760 --> 01:42:47,960
Speaker 1: your organization and what you did and how that worked

1638
01:42:47,960 --> 01:42:50,439
Speaker 1: out to demonstrate sort of like what we're talking about

1639
01:42:50,439 --> 01:42:54,840
Speaker 1: when we talk about like these sort of access projects. Well,

1640
01:42:54,880 --> 01:42:58,479
Speaker 1: so Shilo was interesting because High Peaks Alliance has been

1641
01:42:58,520 --> 01:43:01,960
Speaker 1: board driven for the past ten fifteen years, and so

1642
01:43:02,520 --> 01:43:05,479
Speaker 1: we finally got to a point, uh, through the good

1643
01:43:05,479 --> 01:43:07,640
Speaker 1: work of our board, to be able to hire me

1644
01:43:07,720 --> 01:43:11,320
Speaker 1: full time. So when we started the Shiloh Pond project,

1645
01:43:11,360 --> 01:43:15,439
Speaker 1: it literally started with a Facebook post from a god

1646
01:43:15,680 --> 01:43:19,519
Speaker 1: whose local lady, she's a teacher too, who said, how

1647
01:43:19,560 --> 01:43:22,680
Speaker 1: do we preserve our you know, redneck yacht club. Here

1648
01:43:22,720 --> 01:43:25,479
Speaker 1: are a small pond the place we love. I had

1649
01:43:25,520 --> 01:43:27,760
Speaker 1: grown up fishing this pond because I grew up in

1650
01:43:27,800 --> 01:43:30,280
Speaker 1: this area. I pretty much fished any pond up there

1651
01:43:30,280 --> 01:43:33,720
Speaker 1: at fish, so it kind of doesn't limit it. But um,

1652
01:43:33,760 --> 01:43:37,200
Speaker 1: you know, it's this small pond and it does have

1653
01:43:37,280 --> 01:43:40,400
Speaker 1: some natural occurrence trout and some stock trout. But it's

1654
01:43:40,439 --> 01:43:43,679
Speaker 1: close to town and it's completely undeveloped, which is rare.

1655
01:43:44,000 --> 01:43:48,320
Speaker 1: Who owned it. So that's what's kind of really gets

1656
01:43:48,360 --> 01:43:52,439
Speaker 1: my passion going because Maine in general has switched from

1657
01:43:52,479 --> 01:43:56,759
Speaker 1: forest landowners to investment owners. And so the Winter family

1658
01:43:57,640 --> 01:43:59,920
Speaker 1: own this and they also ran the H. G Win

1659
01:44:00,000 --> 01:44:02,120
Speaker 1: Your Mill in Kingfield, Maine. So they had owned a

1660
01:44:02,120 --> 01:44:04,960
Speaker 1: lot of a lot of land across the landscape. And

1661
01:44:05,000 --> 01:44:08,519
Speaker 1: so when you know exactly saw mill, they ran a

1662
01:44:08,520 --> 01:44:12,360
Speaker 1: sawmill um And this story could replay a million times

1663
01:44:12,360 --> 01:44:15,799
Speaker 1: over Maine where it's a pulp and paper sawmill company

1664
01:44:15,800 --> 01:44:21,160
Speaker 1: owns the large tracts of land um and through technology

1665
01:44:21,920 --> 01:44:28,800
Speaker 1: advances and changes in markets and uh, you know this

1666
01:44:29,560 --> 01:44:32,920
Speaker 1: Wall Street asking these companies to divest these properties, meaning

1667
01:44:33,320 --> 01:44:35,720
Speaker 1: they used to run these as zero assets on their

1668
01:44:35,720 --> 01:44:37,920
Speaker 1: balance sheet to say, wait, there has a lot of money.

1669
01:44:37,960 --> 01:44:40,400
Speaker 1: Let's bring back more money to our shareholders. Let's sell this.

1670
01:44:41,160 --> 01:44:46,080
Speaker 1: So we've gone from I think from two thousand five

1671
01:44:47,400 --> 01:44:51,479
Speaker 1: of mains forest land change hands. Um, I'll give me

1672
01:44:51,479 --> 01:44:55,439
Speaker 1: that figure again. If from and this has happened before,

1673
01:44:55,720 --> 01:44:57,479
Speaker 1: if you, if you took a bigger window would be

1674
01:44:57,920 --> 01:45:02,599
Speaker 1: even larger. But for to mid two thousand, two thousand

1675
01:45:02,640 --> 01:45:06,920
Speaker 1: five of mains forest lands change hands. So not just

1676
01:45:07,080 --> 01:45:09,360
Speaker 1: land mass, but forest lands. You know ac count like

1677
01:45:09,400 --> 01:45:11,680
Speaker 1: every house that's sold and stuff like that. Now we're

1678
01:45:11,720 --> 01:45:16,600
Speaker 1: talking about the twelve million acres of northern Maine. Huh

1679
01:45:16,720 --> 01:45:20,839
Speaker 1: So and these I mean these have but huge tracks

1680
01:45:20,920 --> 01:45:24,720
Speaker 1: probably well some of them can be really massive. Um,

1681
01:45:24,760 --> 01:45:27,000
Speaker 1: you know, hundreds of thousands acres. I mean John Malone,

1682
01:45:27,120 --> 01:45:30,080
Speaker 1: he's the number one landowner in the US, owns over

1683
01:45:30,120 --> 01:45:32,960
Speaker 1: a million acres in our neck of the woods as

1684
01:45:33,040 --> 01:45:36,640
Speaker 1: one individual. Um, he's the guy bartender that cheers you

1685
01:45:36,680 --> 01:45:41,360
Speaker 1: remember that. No, but did he pass up? He passed

1686
01:45:41,439 --> 01:45:46,080
Speaker 1: up ted turner No, yeah, left him in the dust. Yeah.

1687
01:45:46,080 --> 01:45:48,280
Speaker 1: It was mean, Well it's got a hurt. Peter back.

1688
01:45:48,680 --> 01:45:52,719
Speaker 1: Big Owners was like a subway founder. You know Apple,

1689
01:45:53,080 --> 01:45:58,160
Speaker 1: like main Forest. I mean there's foreign ownerships, there's Yale's

1690
01:45:58,200 --> 01:46:02,760
Speaker 1: en Dowmond owns a big portion of the main woods. Um.

1691
01:46:02,800 --> 01:46:05,679
Speaker 1: You know, these these are all investment owners. So they're

1692
01:46:05,680 --> 01:46:11,200
Speaker 1: looking to extract as much value for their purposes investments. UM.

1693
01:46:11,240 --> 01:46:16,760
Speaker 1: And all of us are semi um responsible if you

1694
01:46:16,840 --> 01:46:19,120
Speaker 1: think about like we all have four one ks and

1695
01:46:19,120 --> 01:46:22,000
Speaker 1: stuff like that, and in those you will have a

1696
01:46:22,080 --> 01:46:27,120
Speaker 1: line called natural resources, and so you know their forest

1697
01:46:27,200 --> 01:46:30,760
Speaker 1: lands of one of the mechanisms that would go into that. UM.

1698
01:46:30,880 --> 01:46:35,200
Speaker 1: So getting back on topic, UM, this parcel of land

1699
01:46:35,240 --> 01:46:38,040
Speaker 1: was the last piece this family owned. There's five siblings.

1700
01:46:38,960 --> 01:46:41,559
Speaker 1: They had always let people use the property. That's kind

1701
01:46:41,560 --> 01:46:45,280
Speaker 1: of the tradition because everyone worked. There was a social

1702
01:46:45,320 --> 01:46:47,960
Speaker 1: contract that like you worked at the mill, you knew

1703
01:46:48,000 --> 01:46:52,639
Speaker 1: the landowner. It was that um. You know, you got power.

1704
01:46:52,840 --> 01:46:55,840
Speaker 1: The forest companies got a lot of influence at the

1705
01:46:55,840 --> 01:47:01,160
Speaker 1: Statehouse and otherwise in the communities, and they got employees.

1706
01:47:01,520 --> 01:47:05,920
Speaker 1: And in exchange for that, you know, we got access

1707
01:47:05,920 --> 01:47:09,080
Speaker 1: to the land, We got good relationships. And so that

1708
01:47:09,080 --> 01:47:13,559
Speaker 1: that culture has evaporated in Maine to where the best

1709
01:47:13,640 --> 01:47:16,120
Speaker 1: you can do now is work with a local forrester

1710
01:47:16,880 --> 01:47:23,040
Speaker 1: of said investment group. UM, So that that social contracts

1711
01:47:23,080 --> 01:47:25,360
Speaker 1: kind of evaporating. That's what High Peaks Alliance is kind

1712
01:47:25,360 --> 01:47:30,240
Speaker 1: of focused on creating, so that much access is evaporated. Well,

1713
01:47:30,320 --> 01:47:34,080
Speaker 1: some of the access, Like let's take Warehouser for example,

1714
01:47:34,120 --> 01:47:38,200
Speaker 1: in Maine. UM, they have all their land open. You

1715
01:47:38,200 --> 01:47:40,799
Speaker 1: can camp on their land. Heck, I even got a

1716
01:47:40,920 --> 01:47:45,120
Speaker 1: Christmas tree permit from them this year. UM. But if

1717
01:47:45,160 --> 01:47:48,320
Speaker 1: you look at their practices and other states, I don't

1718
01:47:48,320 --> 01:47:51,400
Speaker 1: think they've allowed that much access like that West stuff

1719
01:47:51,439 --> 01:47:55,800
Speaker 1: like that. So there's still some of that goodwill by

1720
01:47:55,840 --> 01:47:58,240
Speaker 1: some of the companies in Maine because of our landowner

1721
01:47:58,280 --> 01:48:03,479
Speaker 1: liability protections and such like that. UM, but you know,

1722
01:48:03,600 --> 01:48:06,519
Speaker 1: there has been a lot of trail closures, like we

1723
01:48:06,560 --> 01:48:08,639
Speaker 1: don't want four wheelers on our land, we don't want

1724
01:48:08,640 --> 01:48:11,920
Speaker 1: you to camp on our land. And because of the

1725
01:48:11,960 --> 01:48:16,519
Speaker 1: reduction and staffing, you're getting more gates. So they start

1726
01:48:16,560 --> 01:48:19,320
Speaker 1: out at seasonal gates like let's protect our road during

1727
01:48:19,360 --> 01:48:22,040
Speaker 1: mud season. That's a reasonable thing to do, but you're

1728
01:48:22,040 --> 01:48:24,400
Speaker 1: not going to spend the staff time or build a

1729
01:48:24,400 --> 01:48:28,120
Speaker 1: relationship locally to give anyone access to open those gates.

1730
01:48:28,120 --> 01:48:32,719
Speaker 1: Back up, and so you know, for instance, an area

1731
01:48:33,040 --> 01:48:35,120
Speaker 1: I used to go swimming in as a kid, brook

1732
01:48:35,160 --> 01:48:38,960
Speaker 1: Trout Fish. Um, I wanted to bring my whole wedding

1733
01:48:38,960 --> 01:48:42,519
Speaker 1: party there and uh like have a wedding picture of

1734
01:48:42,600 --> 01:48:46,400
Speaker 1: us jumping off the cliffs, and just thought it'd be

1735
01:48:46,439 --> 01:48:50,120
Speaker 1: a cool picture. Had everyone from Maryland, Florida, all these

1736
01:48:50,160 --> 01:48:53,120
Speaker 1: family friends got them back of the trucks. We had

1737
01:48:53,120 --> 01:48:55,960
Speaker 1: our beers in hand, we roll up the dirt road.

1738
01:48:56,520 --> 01:48:58,920
Speaker 1: Within a week of my wife and I scouting this

1739
01:48:59,840 --> 01:49:02,680
Speaker 1: and bringing up my entire wedding party, there was a

1740
01:49:02,680 --> 01:49:06,280
Speaker 1: gate and people it was a real bummer because it's

1741
01:49:06,320 --> 01:49:09,840
Speaker 1: like a mile from where the swimming hole was that

1742
01:49:09,880 --> 01:49:11,680
Speaker 1: we went and did something else. But it kind of

1743
01:49:11,760 --> 01:49:16,919
Speaker 1: underscores how it's just this slow erosion of loss of access.

1744
01:49:17,320 --> 01:49:23,000
Speaker 1: You couldn't point to one thing. So Shilo Pawn, you know,

1745
01:49:23,200 --> 01:49:27,720
Speaker 1: people love it. People tend to love the ideas of landscapes,

1746
01:49:27,800 --> 01:49:30,760
Speaker 1: but specifically gems on the landscape, like this is the

1747
01:49:30,840 --> 01:49:33,400
Speaker 1: viewpoint I love the most, this pond I love the most.

1748
01:49:33,439 --> 01:49:35,000
Speaker 1: And so this is one of those places that a

1749
01:49:35,080 --> 01:49:40,760
Speaker 1: lot of people loved. Um. We wanted to get the

1750
01:49:40,800 --> 01:49:44,160
Speaker 1: town to own it because I was still part time

1751
01:49:44,160 --> 01:49:46,840
Speaker 1: at the time. Um. And so we talked to them,

1752
01:49:46,840 --> 01:49:48,599
Speaker 1: would this be something you would own if we could

1753
01:49:48,600 --> 01:49:51,479
Speaker 1: figure out how to fundraise for it? They said, yeah, people,

1754
01:49:51,520 --> 01:49:53,519
Speaker 1: see you have to go to a town boat. You know,

1755
01:49:54,000 --> 01:49:56,479
Speaker 1: there's some interests. So we asked the Trust republic Land,

1756
01:49:56,560 --> 01:50:01,200
Speaker 1: who explicitly just does transactions um in our neck of

1757
01:50:01,240 --> 01:50:03,519
Speaker 1: the woods. They don't hold any land. So they said

1758
01:50:03,520 --> 01:50:06,080
Speaker 1: they would come on and help us because I laid out,

1759
01:50:06,920 --> 01:50:10,160
Speaker 1: here's the property, here's some potential funding sources we could

1760
01:50:10,160 --> 01:50:14,160
Speaker 1: apply for. This is my case. Can you guys help us?

1761
01:50:14,200 --> 01:50:17,280
Speaker 1: And so I put Betsy Cook, she's the state director

1762
01:50:17,320 --> 01:50:20,320
Speaker 1: there in a boat in Shiloh, like. I convinced her

1763
01:50:20,400 --> 01:50:23,559
Speaker 1: to come up to Shilo Pond and uh, it wouldn't

1764
01:50:23,640 --> 01:50:27,360
Speaker 1: let her out until she said yes. Um. But yeah,

1765
01:50:27,439 --> 01:50:30,920
Speaker 1: So then we a very Kennedy move. Yeah. Well you know,

1766
01:50:31,040 --> 01:50:33,439
Speaker 1: I mean you get to this pond and it's completely undeveloped,

1767
01:50:33,439 --> 01:50:36,519
Speaker 1: and I hope you never visit it to all your listeners. Um.

1768
01:50:37,560 --> 01:50:40,160
Speaker 1: But you know, because this is a community project, right,

1769
01:50:40,240 --> 01:50:45,080
Speaker 1: and so the idea is people like, where the money

1770
01:50:45,160 --> 01:50:48,960
Speaker 1: come from? How do we do this? This is impossible? Um?

1771
01:50:49,040 --> 01:50:51,200
Speaker 1: And so that's one of our goals, high peaks, a lines,

1772
01:50:51,320 --> 01:50:54,360
Speaker 1: just showing our communities that things are possible. So we

1773
01:50:54,360 --> 01:50:57,200
Speaker 1: we have to get the landowners on board. You have

1774
01:50:57,240 --> 01:50:58,960
Speaker 1: to sign a purchase and sale agreement, you have to

1775
01:50:58,960 --> 01:51:03,760
Speaker 1: get an appraisal, you have to do due diligence hazards assessments, surveys,

1776
01:51:04,840 --> 01:51:08,280
Speaker 1: look at land access rights like going over the right

1777
01:51:08,280 --> 01:51:10,720
Speaker 1: of ways into the road. So it's not simple. We

1778
01:51:11,000 --> 01:51:13,439
Speaker 1: I got Betsy out there to talk about when it

1779
01:51:13,520 --> 01:51:15,960
Speaker 1: was listed in two thousand eighteen, we closed on the

1780
01:51:15,960 --> 01:51:21,439
Speaker 1: property in So it's a saga sometimes to conserve land.

1781
01:51:21,479 --> 01:51:25,080
Speaker 1: Like the quickest you ever do land conservation would be

1782
01:51:25,120 --> 01:51:27,160
Speaker 1: like six months, and that's if you have the money

1783
01:51:27,280 --> 01:51:29,760
Speaker 1: right like so you it's a slow process. So the

1784
01:51:29,840 --> 01:51:34,320
Speaker 1: landowner has to be okay with um that fundraising period

1785
01:51:34,520 --> 01:51:36,360
Speaker 1: and you have to have an agreement to that with

1786
01:51:36,400 --> 01:51:40,080
Speaker 1: my with my minimal involvement to watching these transactions occur

1787
01:51:40,800 --> 01:51:45,120
Speaker 1: here again and again of conservation groups, they just can't

1788
01:51:45,760 --> 01:51:48,880
Speaker 1: conservation groups or federal agencies, state agencies, they can't move

1789
01:51:48,960 --> 01:51:52,040
Speaker 1: quick enough. No, it's and like a sweet property will

1790
01:51:52,080 --> 01:51:53,439
Speaker 1: come up and it's like people want to do it

1791
01:51:53,439 --> 01:51:57,280
Speaker 1: as a habitat thing, but for the owner the owners

1792
01:51:57,320 --> 01:51:58,759
Speaker 1: like I could sell the thing to borrow for cash,

1793
01:51:58,920 --> 01:52:00,240
Speaker 1: Like I can't sit around a way for you guys

1794
01:52:00,240 --> 01:52:02,720
Speaker 1: that pull all this ship together, especially now with the

1795
01:52:02,760 --> 01:52:06,000
Speaker 1: market as we locked out in that I think the

1796
01:52:06,000 --> 01:52:09,640
Speaker 1: family had some sentimental care that this could be a

1797
01:52:09,640 --> 01:52:12,080
Speaker 1: conservation property, so they're willing to work with you over

1798
01:52:12,120 --> 01:52:15,120
Speaker 1: the course of three years. But we well, I mean

1799
01:52:15,320 --> 01:52:19,720
Speaker 1: it was more more like late to very early a

1800
01:52:19,720 --> 01:52:22,559
Speaker 1: couple of years. But um, and that's about as long

1801
01:52:22,600 --> 01:52:24,400
Speaker 1: as you ever want to draw one of these things out.

1802
01:52:24,479 --> 01:52:28,080
Speaker 1: It's just, um, you know, you have fundraising hiccups. We

1803
01:52:28,120 --> 01:52:30,400
Speaker 1: had a right It turns out there was a gap

1804
01:52:30,439 --> 01:52:32,800
Speaker 1: in the right of way because these owners had sold

1805
01:52:32,840 --> 01:52:35,000
Speaker 1: a piece of property but didn't retain a right away

1806
01:52:35,040 --> 01:52:37,679
Speaker 1: on it. So we I had to go get five

1807
01:52:37,720 --> 01:52:42,360
Speaker 1: different landowners on a zoom call. I read Chris Boss

1808
01:52:42,400 --> 01:52:47,040
Speaker 1: Never Split the Difference FBI Tactics to negotiation, like like

1809
01:52:47,160 --> 01:52:49,639
Speaker 1: the day before, because I'm like, not screwing this up.

1810
01:52:49,680 --> 01:52:52,000
Speaker 1: I mean like we already were in bed with you guys,

1811
01:52:52,000 --> 01:52:56,040
Speaker 1: you had already sent you Chris Boss Never Split the Difference.

1812
01:52:56,080 --> 01:52:59,000
Speaker 1: It's one of the best books you can read. FBI

1813
01:52:59,360 --> 01:53:02,479
Speaker 1: negotiate or I mean, his point is you really got

1814
01:53:02,479 --> 01:53:05,280
Speaker 1: to understand your counterpart to then have them care about

1815
01:53:05,360 --> 01:53:07,479
Speaker 1: what you care about. He said, the guy that did

1816
01:53:07,520 --> 01:53:11,320
Speaker 1: that master class on negotiation. I haven't taken that in there,

1817
01:53:11,680 --> 01:53:16,840
Speaker 1: but he's really good. Lost interest. Did you take the class? No?

1818
01:53:16,960 --> 01:53:19,519
Speaker 1: But I was kind of interested in master class, just

1819
01:53:19,600 --> 01:53:21,759
Speaker 1: like I don't want to explain why I was interested

1820
01:53:21,760 --> 01:53:24,439
Speaker 1: in that whole world. And I happen to watch this

1821
01:53:24,560 --> 01:53:28,000
Speaker 1: one and I thought it was like, uh, that was pointless.

1822
01:53:29,240 --> 01:53:30,760
Speaker 1: It was he had good tips on small How to

1823
01:53:30,800 --> 01:53:37,800
Speaker 1: small talk is we got five We got five landowners

1824
01:53:37,840 --> 01:53:41,519
Speaker 1: to sign the conservation, the right away access deal, so

1825
01:53:41,600 --> 01:53:43,960
Speaker 1: you've got to have something working right for him. But yeah,

1826
01:53:43,960 --> 01:53:46,320
Speaker 1: well no, I just want to just for listeners, I

1827
01:53:46,360 --> 01:53:48,960
Speaker 1: want to just digress real quick. So let's say you

1828
01:53:49,040 --> 01:53:51,360
Speaker 1: got a small talk with someone but you don't feel

1829
01:53:51,400 --> 01:53:53,600
Speaker 1: like it, but your whatever, your wife makes you go

1830
01:53:53,640 --> 01:53:57,200
Speaker 1: to something. UM say something to me, calic, just say whatever.

1831
01:53:57,520 --> 01:54:00,120
Speaker 1: Say I got a new laptop. Hey, it's good to

1832
01:54:00,160 --> 01:54:03,720
Speaker 1: see you here. I don't know. UM say let me

1833
01:54:03,880 --> 01:54:06,360
Speaker 1: let me adad Let me show you a picture of

1834
01:54:06,360 --> 01:54:09,720
Speaker 1: a buck I killed. A book you killed? Yeah, a

1835
01:54:09,800 --> 01:54:15,519
Speaker 1: nice one a nice one. Yeah. Here it is just

1836
01:54:15,600 --> 01:54:17,200
Speaker 1: whatever they say, you just say it back to him

1837
01:54:17,200 --> 01:54:20,280
Speaker 1: with an inquisitive tone. And like people that just want

1838
01:54:20,280 --> 01:54:22,320
Speaker 1: to talk about themselves, it will go for hours. So

1839
01:54:22,439 --> 01:54:24,400
Speaker 1: Cay'll be like say, yeah, I got a new laptop. Hey,

1840
01:54:24,479 --> 01:54:27,360
Speaker 1: I got a new laptop. A new laptop. Yep, it's

1841
01:54:27,920 --> 01:54:33,160
Speaker 1: silver and uh big screen, big screen. Now you like that?

1842
01:54:34,040 --> 01:54:36,200
Speaker 1: What if? What if you? What if you come across

1843
01:54:36,240 --> 01:54:39,400
Speaker 1: someone that wants to talk more about you than themselves,

1844
01:54:40,200 --> 01:54:47,040
Speaker 1: that's usually not a problem. Go on, Well, I think

1845
01:54:47,040 --> 01:54:50,560
Speaker 1: the intent is to actually try to understand the person.

1846
01:54:50,880 --> 01:54:53,400
Speaker 1: I read the book. Yeah you should. I'm telling you,

1847
01:54:53,560 --> 01:54:55,760
Speaker 1: I'm sold on just for this one. TRANSI you got

1848
01:54:55,760 --> 01:54:57,600
Speaker 1: the deal done. I got the deal done well. And

1849
01:54:57,680 --> 01:55:02,280
Speaker 1: we had to raise funds for road maintenance fun because

1850
01:55:02,280 --> 01:55:04,400
Speaker 1: they had been maintaining all the road for all these years.

1851
01:55:04,400 --> 01:55:08,600
Speaker 1: So it's just complex and so anyways, um, you know

1852
01:55:08,640 --> 01:55:10,760
Speaker 1: what was cool. We had a town boat on this

1853
01:55:10,840 --> 01:55:13,920
Speaker 1: to see if they would accept the property. And that

1854
01:55:14,040 --> 01:55:17,320
Speaker 1: was really heartening because you can't get town boats that

1855
01:55:17,360 --> 01:55:21,000
Speaker 1: are landslides usually, but this was two to one in favor. Uh.

1856
01:55:21,120 --> 01:55:23,360
Speaker 1: You know, I couldn't imagine there'd be anyone against it.

1857
01:55:23,480 --> 01:55:26,440
Speaker 1: But that ship blows my mind to call you remember

1858
01:55:26,480 --> 01:55:31,600
Speaker 1: when they did that, they did the Savanosa and they're like, no, no,

1859
01:55:31,720 --> 01:55:34,240
Speaker 1: we're gonna we're trying to give you the ranch. I

1860
01:55:34,280 --> 01:55:36,280
Speaker 1: want to give you the ranch, and like, well, I

1861
01:55:36,280 --> 01:55:39,920
Speaker 1: don't know if you take that ranch. Yeah exactly. There's

1862
01:55:39,920 --> 01:55:42,760
Speaker 1: even like people in the political sphere like to make

1863
01:55:42,800 --> 01:55:46,280
Speaker 1: a point, we're saying like nope, I'm not gonna take it.

1864
01:55:47,640 --> 01:55:50,400
Speaker 1: Come again now what like why and de elaborate on this.

1865
01:55:50,800 --> 01:55:54,040
Speaker 1: The sabinos So Wilderness area was our I think our

1866
01:55:54,160 --> 01:56:00,400
Speaker 1: only at the time completely landlocked, inaccessible other than through

1867
01:56:00,880 --> 01:56:05,960
Speaker 1: permission crossing private land. So it was a wilderness area

1868
01:56:06,000 --> 01:56:10,000
Speaker 1: you couldn't get to. Yeah, seventeen thousand acres I think, um.

1869
01:56:10,040 --> 01:56:14,360
Speaker 1: I think it grew to twenty three thousand acres with um. Shoot,

1870
01:56:14,360 --> 01:56:17,760
Speaker 1: I can't remember that. Anyway, these folks had put together

1871
01:56:17,840 --> 01:56:23,240
Speaker 1: this ranch that bordered the wilderness their kids. Unfortunately for them, like,

1872
01:56:23,320 --> 01:56:26,400
Speaker 1: let's let it be known that they had intended to

1873
01:56:26,400 --> 01:56:29,720
Speaker 1: sell the ranch when mom and Pap passed away, and

1874
01:56:29,960 --> 01:56:34,280
Speaker 1: uh mon, Paul were like, we're not seeing this thing

1875
01:56:35,320 --> 01:56:38,400
Speaker 1: gets sold off to whoever, and so they kind of

1876
01:56:38,400 --> 01:56:45,000
Speaker 1: deal with the wilderness LAMB wilderness trust. Yeah, and remember

1877
01:56:45,120 --> 01:56:48,120
Speaker 1: being a sticking point where they the BLM right had

1878
01:56:48,120 --> 01:56:50,960
Speaker 1: to accept it. The BLM we're not in the public

1879
01:56:51,040 --> 01:56:53,640
Speaker 1: land business anymore and we won't accept I mean they did,

1880
01:56:53,760 --> 01:56:56,480
Speaker 1: but it was like, how could people not want it?

1881
01:56:56,960 --> 01:56:58,840
Speaker 1: I think it's like to prove a point. Well, I

1882
01:56:58,880 --> 01:57:02,240
Speaker 1: mean there's also small towns you have, like the worry

1883
01:57:02,280 --> 01:57:05,040
Speaker 1: of long term maintenance and you know, fixing up the

1884
01:57:05,120 --> 01:57:08,120
Speaker 1: road and you know you're talking about it's like, what's

1885
01:57:08,120 --> 01:57:11,640
Speaker 1: it gonna do the tax bases. Well, yeah, exactly, it

1886
01:57:11,680 --> 01:57:16,600
Speaker 1: costs land. Yeah, and I mean that's all dependent on

1887
01:57:17,240 --> 01:57:21,600
Speaker 1: the level of investment in development you want on your

1888
01:57:21,640 --> 01:57:25,040
Speaker 1: recreation lands like ball fields obviously or not cost a

1889
01:57:25,040 --> 01:57:28,560
Speaker 1: lot more than undeveloped force land, you know, so I

1890
01:57:28,560 --> 01:57:31,920
Speaker 1: don't think there'll be a tremendous cost. And you know,

1891
01:57:32,520 --> 01:57:34,720
Speaker 1: when you're thinking about these projects, you always want to

1892
01:57:35,080 --> 01:57:37,760
Speaker 1: think about those costs when you're fundraising. So like we

1893
01:57:37,840 --> 01:57:40,920
Speaker 1: have a fund to help them with some of their

1894
01:57:40,960 --> 01:57:44,200
Speaker 1: startup costs. Oh that's good idea. Well, like you know,

1895
01:57:44,280 --> 01:57:46,320
Speaker 1: the bridge needs to be redact, the road needs a

1896
01:57:46,320 --> 01:57:48,480
Speaker 1: little fixing up, and and yes, so you're not handing

1897
01:57:48,520 --> 01:57:51,600
Speaker 1: them a total pile of headache without some way to

1898
01:57:51,640 --> 01:57:55,160
Speaker 1: mitigate it. Well, not only that is we've helped them

1899
01:57:55,240 --> 01:57:59,720
Speaker 1: develop a town committee and they actually uh we tapped

1900
01:57:59,720 --> 01:58:04,040
Speaker 1: it in I members. There was more applicants than available slots,

1901
01:58:04,080 --> 01:58:06,880
Speaker 1: and so this like board actually had to interview some

1902
01:58:06,920 --> 01:58:08,960
Speaker 1: of these people. So we got a really good mix

1903
01:58:09,160 --> 01:58:13,080
Speaker 1: of passionate people and most of them all had some

1904
01:58:13,320 --> 01:58:17,600
Speaker 1: personal connection to them loving Shiloa Pond. So that's one

1905
01:58:17,600 --> 01:58:20,000
Speaker 1: of the big benefits I find of local conservation is

1906
01:58:20,040 --> 01:58:23,480
Speaker 1: you're building some of that self governance across the landscape.

1907
01:58:23,680 --> 01:58:26,280
Speaker 1: Is like you have a say in the land. So

1908
01:58:26,320 --> 01:58:31,120
Speaker 1: that's important. You guys. What was interesting, um, you know,

1909
01:58:31,240 --> 01:58:34,200
Speaker 1: part of the part of the fundraising was your help,

1910
01:58:34,400 --> 01:58:36,680
Speaker 1: you know with the land Access initiative and that was

1911
01:58:36,760 --> 01:58:42,280
Speaker 1: really um fun grant so to speak for me, because

1912
01:58:42,280 --> 01:58:45,600
Speaker 1: it was so different than everything else we do. What

1913
01:58:45,640 --> 01:58:47,920
Speaker 1: was the normal way you were getting the money? Well,

1914
01:58:47,920 --> 01:58:50,000
Speaker 1: like you a lot of these deals, you try to

1915
01:58:50,080 --> 01:58:53,840
Speaker 1: structure it around. One had large grant so far as

1916
01:58:53,920 --> 01:58:57,360
Speaker 1: was this main natural resource conservation program. It's a mitigation

1917
01:58:57,400 --> 01:59:02,640
Speaker 1: fund um and then you have trust for public lands costs.

1918
01:59:02,680 --> 01:59:08,280
Speaker 1: The survey costs, other land costs, all these deals and um,

1919
01:59:08,320 --> 01:59:13,240
Speaker 1: you know, so you have a number of private philanthropies

1920
01:59:13,320 --> 01:59:18,440
Speaker 1: that solicit grants and individuals and so you you know,

1921
01:59:18,560 --> 01:59:21,200
Speaker 1: you guys were a little different on that. I saw

1922
01:59:21,320 --> 01:59:24,360
Speaker 1: the the posting and I said, well, what what the

1923
01:59:24,360 --> 01:59:27,880
Speaker 1: heck all put in something? I don't know? Why not?

1924
01:59:28,000 --> 01:59:29,920
Speaker 1: I do a lot of these, So it's not like,

1925
01:59:29,960 --> 01:59:34,200
Speaker 1: explain the cal explain the posting. So yeah, it's our

1926
01:59:34,440 --> 01:59:37,640
Speaker 1: our the meat Eater Land Access initiative, which started around

1927
01:59:38,360 --> 01:59:44,560
Speaker 1: the Ronnella Who tell Us campaign merchandise that we built

1928
01:59:44,640 --> 01:59:46,200
Speaker 1: up and then we got it. We're like, oh, we

1929
01:59:46,200 --> 01:59:50,280
Speaker 1: should do something good with this money, and it became

1930
01:59:50,320 --> 01:59:54,560
Speaker 1: like the campaign promise, which was provide more hunting and

1931
01:59:54,560 --> 02:00:00,560
Speaker 1: fishing like and so we decided to fun to raise

1932
02:00:00,640 --> 02:00:06,960
Speaker 1: fundraise through merch fundraise through some auctions and uh even

1933
02:00:07,040 --> 02:00:10,120
Speaker 1: got a couple of direct donations that that we were

1934
02:00:10,160 --> 02:00:13,680
Speaker 1: able to funnel to Brent the High Peaks Alliance there

1935
02:00:13,680 --> 02:00:22,320
Speaker 1: at the end, but our ask was for anyone who

1936
02:00:22,360 --> 02:00:26,240
Speaker 1: listens to our shows, goes to our website, watches our

1937
02:00:26,280 --> 02:00:30,120
Speaker 1: stuff on on Netflix, if you know of a place

1938
02:00:30,160 --> 02:00:34,560
Speaker 1: that could use more access, ideally, like you know, granny's

1939
02:00:34,600 --> 02:00:38,120
Speaker 1: passing away and doesn't want to see the farm go

1940
02:00:38,240 --> 02:00:40,240
Speaker 1: to just anybody. So you guys can buy it. And

1941
02:00:40,240 --> 02:00:43,800
Speaker 1: it provides like a a pathway to a hundred thousand

1942
02:00:43,840 --> 02:00:45,960
Speaker 1: acres of landlocked public land, the only way to get

1943
02:00:45,960 --> 02:00:48,120
Speaker 1: down the river, or the only way to get on

1944
02:00:48,160 --> 02:00:51,720
Speaker 1: the river, or an easement that we could help pay

1945
02:00:51,840 --> 02:00:56,040
Speaker 1: for that goes through a new subdivision into the National Forest.

1946
02:00:56,320 --> 02:00:59,879
Speaker 1: There's a bunch of different things that we'd be interested.

1947
02:01:00,000 --> 02:01:01,640
Speaker 1: And so he kind of put out that call to

1948
02:01:01,720 --> 02:01:07,040
Speaker 1: action a couple of times, and we have a If

1949
02:01:07,080 --> 02:01:11,000
Speaker 1: you go underneath the conservation tab at the meteor dot com,

1950
02:01:11,200 --> 02:01:14,920
Speaker 1: you will see our land Access Initiative. Through there, you

1951
02:01:14,920 --> 02:01:19,560
Speaker 1: can go in there and click the button that uh

1952
02:01:19,800 --> 02:01:24,600
Speaker 1: says you submit submit a property. We have it on

1953
02:01:24,640 --> 02:01:26,480
Speaker 1: there twice just in case you miss it the first

1954
02:01:26,480 --> 02:01:29,480
Speaker 1: time and you just found it like that. I saw

1955
02:01:29,720 --> 02:01:36,560
Speaker 1: the um runella tell us and I gotta kick out

1956
02:01:36,560 --> 02:01:37,920
Speaker 1: of that, and I said, I'll go look at it

1957
02:01:38,200 --> 02:01:43,320
Speaker 1: by campaign. Hat are you guys running in? We gotta

1958
02:01:43,360 --> 02:01:46,080
Speaker 1: wait and see, wait and see how how the field

1959
02:01:46,080 --> 02:01:49,920
Speaker 1: shakes out. Um Yeah, no, So I checked out. Most

1960
02:01:50,440 --> 02:01:58,120
Speaker 1: programs from companies are really horribly executed in that they're

1961
02:01:58,320 --> 02:02:03,200
Speaker 1: normally worried about how it's going to look for them.

1962
02:02:03,240 --> 02:02:06,080
Speaker 1: And when I saw your program the questions you're asking,

1963
02:02:06,600 --> 02:02:09,280
Speaker 1: I could tell you actually wanted to do a project

1964
02:02:09,400 --> 02:02:12,920
Speaker 1: and help a project. So most of these things I

1965
02:02:13,000 --> 02:02:15,320
Speaker 1: just cut off, like I don't attempt them, because you

1966
02:02:15,360 --> 02:02:19,320
Speaker 1: can when their first question is what's your social media following?

1967
02:02:20,280 --> 02:02:24,160
Speaker 1: You know you know that their intent is not the project.

1968
02:02:24,560 --> 02:02:27,080
Speaker 1: Their intent is to do cause marketing, which can be

1969
02:02:27,120 --> 02:02:30,080
Speaker 1: a benefit. But it's hard for me to put in

1970
02:02:30,120 --> 02:02:32,840
Speaker 1: a lot of effort into a grand application when you

1971
02:02:32,920 --> 02:02:36,480
Speaker 1: know it's just going to be an extractive process. Because

1972
02:02:36,480 --> 02:02:40,160
Speaker 1: these these are pretty difficult, and you have to respect

1973
02:02:40,200 --> 02:02:43,760
Speaker 1: the donors and respect the granters, but you know you

1974
02:02:43,800 --> 02:02:45,640
Speaker 1: want to work with people who want to do the work.

1975
02:02:46,160 --> 02:02:48,880
Speaker 1: And so the questions we just used cause what cause?

1976
02:02:49,080 --> 02:02:54,160
Speaker 1: Cause marketing? That's interesting, Uh, it's been a lot. It's

1977
02:02:54,160 --> 02:02:59,320
Speaker 1: been uh an exciting term for nonprofits, I guess um.

1978
02:02:59,360 --> 02:03:02,000
Speaker 1: But also you think of like tom Shoes, that would

1979
02:03:02,040 --> 02:03:04,200
Speaker 1: be an example of cause market It wouldn't be like that,

1980
02:03:04,240 --> 02:03:11,240
Speaker 1: we're gonna name the sports arena Kinko's stadium well cause

1981
02:03:11,320 --> 02:03:14,960
Speaker 1: marketing that you know that I wouldn't call that cause marketing.

1982
02:03:15,000 --> 02:03:18,760
Speaker 1: I call it like, these companies are showing as part

1983
02:03:18,840 --> 02:03:23,600
Speaker 1: of their business model. Um, it's not about profits, it's

1984
02:03:23,640 --> 02:03:27,560
Speaker 1: about like mission, and so a lot of times they

1985
02:03:27,640 --> 02:03:31,080
Speaker 1: use a nonprofit to align that way. Um, Whereas like

1986
02:03:31,440 --> 02:03:33,360
Speaker 1: I keep thinking of tom shoes, like you buy a

1987
02:03:33,400 --> 02:03:36,360
Speaker 1: shoe and they don'tate a shoe how to go? But

1988
02:03:36,520 --> 02:03:38,520
Speaker 1: homet But I don't get where where? Why is that bad?

1989
02:03:39,240 --> 02:03:43,760
Speaker 1: It's not bad. It's that when I am a nonprofit

1990
02:03:43,800 --> 02:03:49,000
Speaker 1: trying to get this project done, it's expensive money. I

1991
02:03:49,120 --> 02:03:51,960
Speaker 1: see where you might be in a situation where like

1992
02:03:52,160 --> 02:03:54,040
Speaker 1: that's all good and fun, but I gotta move and

1993
02:03:54,040 --> 02:03:56,600
Speaker 1: I don't want to bog this down with well, how

1994
02:03:56,760 --> 02:03:59,840
Speaker 1: you know, it's more like a job, right, So I

1995
02:04:00,000 --> 02:04:03,080
Speaker 1: would call that fee for service, like sometimes we do

1996
02:04:03,160 --> 02:04:06,400
Speaker 1: work for other organizations like writing management plan stuff like that.

1997
02:04:07,200 --> 02:04:10,080
Speaker 1: But I would consider that a fee for service or

1998
02:04:10,080 --> 02:04:16,200
Speaker 1: a sponsorship versus a grant or yeah, just how it

1999
02:04:16,280 --> 02:04:20,240
Speaker 1: will it's and it's there's legal terminology obviously, but then

2000
02:04:20,240 --> 02:04:25,720
Speaker 1: there's just the reality of limited capacity to work and

2001
02:04:25,960 --> 02:04:29,480
Speaker 1: please a business to the fullest extent that they want

2002
02:04:29,920 --> 02:04:34,280
Speaker 1: because they have an outcome in their head versus Um,

2003
02:04:34,320 --> 02:04:36,280
Speaker 1: you know, we're trying to get this this deal done?

2004
02:04:37,160 --> 02:04:39,960
Speaker 1: What so how do how do we do be? I mean,

2005
02:04:40,040 --> 02:04:44,560
Speaker 1: be honest, it was our first year, so well, I

2006
02:04:44,560 --> 02:04:47,400
Speaker 1: I think we can do a crass course on conservation

2007
02:04:48,400 --> 02:04:53,040
Speaker 1: just because um, you know, like the examples you're using

2008
02:04:53,760 --> 02:04:56,800
Speaker 1: of like hopefully your grandmother has access to this. It

2009
02:04:56,960 --> 02:05:03,800
Speaker 1: simplifies a pretty complex process of finding opportunities, vetting opportunities,

2010
02:05:03,920 --> 02:05:09,440
Speaker 1: vetting funding sources. You know. So I think with us

2011
02:05:09,480 --> 02:05:14,560
Speaker 1: it's worked. We had a benefit because most conservation organizations

2012
02:05:14,600 --> 02:05:18,920
Speaker 1: are so put together in their approach to projects that

2013
02:05:19,800 --> 02:05:21,560
Speaker 1: something like this might have been hard to fit in.

2014
02:05:21,600 --> 02:05:24,680
Speaker 1: I don't know what you've got for applications, Um, how

2015
02:05:24,680 --> 02:05:29,520
Speaker 1: many applications? How many things did you get? Caliber? Serious? Oh?

2016
02:05:29,600 --> 02:05:31,560
Speaker 1: I think we ended up with close to like four

2017
02:05:31,640 --> 02:05:36,880
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty submissions, and of those I would I

2018
02:05:36,920 --> 02:05:39,520
Speaker 1: would only consider like a hundred and fifty to be

2019
02:05:39,800 --> 02:05:45,360
Speaker 1: like worth a second look, and of that one fifty, uh,

2020
02:05:46,560 --> 02:05:51,040
Speaker 1: twenty three, and then got down to eight where you're like, oh, yeah,

2021
02:05:51,080 --> 02:05:57,760
Speaker 1: this is real, real deal stuff. Yeah, you know, And

2022
02:05:57,800 --> 02:06:01,040
Speaker 1: that's I mean, when you're working with reputable organizations, we're

2023
02:06:01,120 --> 02:06:05,960
Speaker 1: doing the research to highlight through our strategies, what are

2024
02:06:06,000 --> 02:06:09,880
Speaker 1: the best opportunities, what what are the most bang for

2025
02:06:09,920 --> 02:06:13,480
Speaker 1: your buck? Because there's not a single nonprofit that's not

2026
02:06:13,640 --> 02:06:18,440
Speaker 1: working under restricted funds, and so you know, there's a

2027
02:06:18,520 --> 02:06:22,840
Speaker 1: lot of effort going into looking across the landscape. What

2028
02:06:22,880 --> 02:06:28,040
Speaker 1: are the landowner willingness, what are the ecological values, what

2029
02:06:28,160 --> 02:06:31,560
Speaker 1: are the constituents values that want to donate to such things?

2030
02:06:32,200 --> 02:06:36,240
Speaker 1: And so you get to a point of a lot

2031
02:06:36,240 --> 02:06:37,840
Speaker 1: of people who call you up and say, hey, you

2032
02:06:37,920 --> 02:06:41,640
Speaker 1: want to conserve my land. Uh, there's this idea that

2033
02:06:41,680 --> 02:06:44,960
Speaker 1: there's this endless amount of money and conservation because there's

2034
02:06:44,960 --> 02:06:47,680
Speaker 1: some people that donate lots of money, but it's not

2035
02:06:47,800 --> 02:06:52,480
Speaker 1: like compared to what land costs. It's a difficult thing. Um.

2036
02:06:52,520 --> 02:06:55,760
Speaker 1: So when I applied, the questions were pretty straightforward, you know,

2037
02:06:55,880 --> 02:06:59,280
Speaker 1: like what's the opportunity, Uh, what do you guys need

2038
02:06:59,400 --> 02:07:02,360
Speaker 1: help with? How do you see meat eat or helping

2039
02:07:02,400 --> 02:07:06,200
Speaker 1: There's a few others, um. And what was exciting to

2040
02:07:06,240 --> 02:07:10,480
Speaker 1: me is, you know, I've really enjoyed the Mediator series

2041
02:07:10,480 --> 02:07:13,960
Speaker 1: on Netflix. I have not consumed as much on everything

2042
02:07:14,000 --> 02:07:19,680
Speaker 1: else just because of time. Um, But your ability to

2043
02:07:20,120 --> 02:07:25,040
Speaker 1: describe what hunting is beyond the kill is you know

2044
02:07:25,080 --> 02:07:28,920
Speaker 1: what I've reflected with, and so that's like why I'm

2045
02:07:28,960 --> 02:07:34,880
Speaker 1: in conservation is that you get uh to see people's

2046
02:07:34,960 --> 02:07:37,560
Speaker 1: love of the land and you get to describe that

2047
02:07:37,640 --> 02:07:42,080
Speaker 1: in different ways. And so you know, in real terms,

2048
02:07:44,080 --> 02:07:46,320
Speaker 1: everyone in Kingfield loved that piece of property for a

2049
02:07:46,360 --> 02:07:48,960
Speaker 1: different reason. Like one guy talked about ice skating there

2050
02:07:49,000 --> 02:07:52,000
Speaker 1: as a kid. You know, Um, you know trout fishing,

2051
02:07:52,040 --> 02:07:55,480
Speaker 1: caught my first trout there, used to camp there, used

2052
02:07:55,520 --> 02:07:57,720
Speaker 1: to throw parties there, you know. Like so people have

2053
02:07:58,520 --> 02:08:00,840
Speaker 1: different ways to relate to the land. So we used

2054
02:08:00,840 --> 02:08:03,680
Speaker 1: to burn tires and have keggers out there. Yeah they're

2055
02:08:03,720 --> 02:08:07,280
Speaker 1: still letting high school kids have keggers. No, No, while

2056
02:08:07,360 --> 02:08:09,880
Speaker 1: it's not kids these days don't have the same fire

2057
02:08:09,920 --> 02:08:14,400
Speaker 1: in their guts. So yeah, I don't want to pack

2058
02:08:14,480 --> 02:08:18,200
Speaker 1: tractor tires a mile back in the woods. I think

2059
02:08:18,280 --> 02:08:23,240
Speaker 1: that died my generation maybe when that died. Um, but yeah,

2060
02:08:23,400 --> 02:08:26,560
Speaker 1: so we applied cal reached out. Um. That's that was

2061
02:08:26,640 --> 02:08:29,680
Speaker 1: refreshing to me because usually as these things unroll, your

2062
02:08:29,720 --> 02:08:33,280
Speaker 1: first few opportunities or your best opportunities, and then people

2063
02:08:33,920 --> 02:08:39,360
Speaker 1: encumber these things with process and make them more cumbersome.

2064
02:08:39,400 --> 02:08:42,720
Speaker 1: It's just the way you apply um. Because you get

2065
02:08:42,720 --> 02:08:46,240
Speaker 1: more committees involved, you get more people involved and becomes

2066
02:08:46,240 --> 02:08:49,600
Speaker 1: more difficult to you know, grants in general are like

2067
02:08:49,640 --> 02:08:53,000
Speaker 1: those foundations in general are like this. Um. But I

2068
02:08:53,040 --> 02:08:55,200
Speaker 1: think I don't know if Cal remembers the email, but

2069
02:08:55,800 --> 02:08:59,080
Speaker 1: I got an email from Ryan Cal Calhan. I got

2070
02:08:59,120 --> 02:09:02,360
Speaker 1: a big kick out of that, and um, I woke

2071
02:09:02,440 --> 02:09:04,720
Speaker 1: up four thirty in the morning because you have to

2072
02:09:04,720 --> 02:09:07,560
Speaker 1: get in your tree stand early. And uh, I think

2073
02:09:07,640 --> 02:09:09,880
Speaker 1: I wrote that in the email, Like I'm writing this

2074
02:09:10,160 --> 02:09:13,200
Speaker 1: in the golden hours, so I'm most focused, meaning like

2075
02:09:13,720 --> 02:09:15,240
Speaker 1: if I was to be hunting, this would be the

2076
02:09:15,240 --> 02:09:18,080
Speaker 1: best time to hunt. And that's why I'm writing you

2077
02:09:18,160 --> 02:09:22,480
Speaker 1: back at this time, so I'm like super focused. Um.

2078
02:09:22,520 --> 02:09:26,400
Speaker 1: So your goal is just to present the best case possible.

2079
02:09:26,800 --> 02:09:30,320
Speaker 1: And Cal did a great job. He flew out very

2080
02:09:30,360 --> 02:09:33,400
Speaker 1: soon after to make sure I wasn't full crap. Got

2081
02:09:33,400 --> 02:09:38,120
Speaker 1: a famous red main hot dog great like a lot

2082
02:09:38,160 --> 02:09:40,840
Speaker 1: of extra phost fates. Well, I don't know what makes

2083
02:09:40,840 --> 02:09:45,520
Speaker 1: it red, but makes it taste better. If you read

2084
02:09:45,520 --> 02:09:51,040
Speaker 1: so much about dog, have you ever had a red hot?

2085
02:09:52,000 --> 02:09:54,520
Speaker 1: You don't have to read about it. I'm talking to

2086
02:09:54,520 --> 02:09:57,800
Speaker 1: the listener, took a paddle around, took a paddle around

2087
02:09:57,800 --> 02:10:01,320
Speaker 1: the lake, checked out the waterfall. So did cal seem

2088
02:10:01,360 --> 02:10:04,760
Speaker 1: like a shrewd negotiator when he came out. I think

2089
02:10:04,760 --> 02:10:07,240
Speaker 1: he just wanted to find out if what I was

2090
02:10:07,280 --> 02:10:11,240
Speaker 1: saying was the truth, and that you know, it was

2091
02:10:11,280 --> 02:10:14,960
Speaker 1: easy too. UM. I was excited to show him around

2092
02:10:14,960 --> 02:10:17,760
Speaker 1: the area because the the area in this area of Maine,

2093
02:10:17,800 --> 02:10:20,480
Speaker 1: it's we call it the High Peaks, which is puny

2094
02:10:20,560 --> 02:10:22,840
Speaker 1: compared to your mountains, but it's the ten of the

2095
02:10:22,840 --> 02:10:27,640
Speaker 1: fourteen tallest peaks Maine. And it's that aggregation. UM, it's headwaters,

2096
02:10:27,680 --> 02:10:30,200
Speaker 1: a lot of the river's main and so you know,

2097
02:10:30,280 --> 02:10:35,520
Speaker 1: there's a lot of big landscape conservation happening now to UM.

2098
02:10:35,560 --> 02:10:38,160
Speaker 1: You know, Boston University put out a study of looking

2099
02:10:38,200 --> 02:10:42,080
Speaker 1: at Biden's thirty by thirty goals and if you look

2100
02:10:42,120 --> 02:10:49,640
Speaker 1: at like species diversity, carbon storage, ability to protect large landscapes, UM,

2101
02:10:49,720 --> 02:10:53,320
Speaker 1: all those things on their own. UM have different areas

2102
02:10:53,360 --> 02:10:56,080
Speaker 1: of the US that those could be the highest values.

2103
02:10:56,240 --> 02:10:59,320
Speaker 1: But like Maine really lights up when you start laying

2104
02:10:59,360 --> 02:11:01,720
Speaker 1: all those value was on top of each other. People

2105
02:11:01,760 --> 02:11:04,240
Speaker 1: that talk about you know, people on talking about thirty

2106
02:11:04,240 --> 02:11:07,760
Speaker 1: by thirty by thirty for a while, and uh, and

2107
02:11:08,040 --> 02:11:11,080
Speaker 1: they point out the necessity to sort of like uncoupled

2108
02:11:11,080 --> 02:11:15,080
Speaker 1: that with the Biden administration. Yeah, you know, we because

2109
02:11:15,200 --> 02:11:17,240
Speaker 1: now you're going to fall into this thing where the

2110
02:11:17,280 --> 02:11:21,840
Speaker 1: next administration they'll jett is in it because it was

2111
02:11:21,880 --> 02:11:25,200
Speaker 1: the Biden thing, or vice versa would be like, you know,

2112
02:11:25,400 --> 02:11:27,480
Speaker 1: throwing out whatever anybody had the head you did. Do

2113
02:11:27,600 --> 02:11:33,080
Speaker 1: you know, I think it out of like E O. Wilson,

2114
02:11:33,760 --> 02:11:37,200
Speaker 1: is that okay called the Wilson thirty thirty. Yeah, and uh,

2115
02:11:37,400 --> 02:11:41,160
Speaker 1: I think he wanted fifty by fifty exactly to your point,

2116
02:11:41,280 --> 02:11:44,600
Speaker 1: is that the landscape by two thousand fifty that I

2117
02:11:44,640 --> 02:11:48,200
Speaker 1: think E O. Wilson that was what he wanted. The

2118
02:11:48,480 --> 02:11:53,640
Speaker 1: Arizona legislature, you had a bill um that I can't

2119
02:11:53,680 --> 02:11:56,120
Speaker 1: I don't know if it passed or not, but said

2120
02:11:57,120 --> 02:11:59,320
Speaker 1: it was just a flat out no to the thirty

2121
02:11:59,320 --> 02:12:02,800
Speaker 1: by thirty plan, which isn't actually a plan yet. It's

2122
02:12:02,840 --> 02:12:07,760
Speaker 1: just like it's a concept right now. But no, you

2123
02:12:07,800 --> 02:12:12,800
Speaker 1: can't hold that concept in your head exactly. Yeah, that's

2124
02:12:12,800 --> 02:12:15,560
Speaker 1: a little polar as Yeah, and I guess the they

2125
02:12:15,640 --> 02:12:19,240
Speaker 1: just latched onto it as like a good marketing piece.

2126
02:12:19,440 --> 02:12:22,520
Speaker 1: A lot of people have pointed that out, um where

2127
02:12:22,560 --> 02:12:26,720
Speaker 1: you put those lands, Like, for instance, I think Montana

2128
02:12:27,120 --> 02:12:31,600
Speaker 1: is something like thirty seven percent um publicly owned state

2129
02:12:31,640 --> 02:12:33,760
Speaker 1: and federal something. I had thirty to thirty. I got

2130
02:12:33,760 --> 02:12:35,720
Speaker 1: two different numbers. One's thirty. I think that was the

2131
02:12:35,760 --> 02:12:38,880
Speaker 1: federal land. So it's like maybe Montana already has their

2132
02:12:38,960 --> 02:12:43,360
Speaker 1: job done right, But Maine mains conservation land is um

2133
02:12:43,520 --> 02:12:48,040
Speaker 1: easman and otherwise it's land, whereas all of other all

2134
02:12:48,160 --> 02:12:50,760
Speaker 1: the other New England states combined is twenty seven percent land.

2135
02:12:50,800 --> 02:12:54,760
Speaker 1: So that's four point two million acres of conserved land

2136
02:12:54,800 --> 02:12:57,400
Speaker 1: and Maine versus five point eight in the rest of

2137
02:12:57,800 --> 02:13:02,200
Speaker 1: New England. So like Maine has cheaper, cheaper land which

2138
02:13:02,240 --> 02:13:05,480
Speaker 1: is changing rapidly in large landscape. So it's like a

2139
02:13:05,520 --> 02:13:08,680
Speaker 1: place where you have a lot of opportunity that is

2140
02:13:09,760 --> 02:13:14,800
Speaker 1: us more easily executed on because it's all privately owned already.

2141
02:13:16,560 --> 02:13:19,200
Speaker 1: Did kel Uh ever make a suggestion that you change

2142
02:13:19,240 --> 02:13:22,600
Speaker 1: the pond to okale OCALI pon. Yeah, Well there is

2143
02:13:24,920 --> 02:13:28,480
Speaker 1: the sulation here. I forgot to mention, yeah, your checks

2144
02:13:28,480 --> 02:13:33,440
Speaker 1: are spent um. There was a debate and I have

2145
02:13:33,560 --> 02:13:36,160
Speaker 1: never solved it, but on the older maps it's called

2146
02:13:36,240 --> 02:13:41,120
Speaker 1: Dutton Pond, and sometime it was renamed Shiloh. And I've

2147
02:13:41,520 --> 02:13:45,160
Speaker 1: debated whether this was because of the biblical references that

2148
02:13:45,240 --> 02:13:48,560
Speaker 1: sounds very old Testament or was it like Battle of Shiloh,

2149
02:13:48,680 --> 02:13:52,680
Speaker 1: like did they change it after you know those wars

2150
02:13:52,800 --> 02:13:54,800
Speaker 1: this so you know, I don't know. I haven't been

2151
02:13:54,840 --> 02:13:57,720
Speaker 1: able to find it. I did find a cool Forest

2152
02:13:57,800 --> 02:14:01,720
Speaker 1: and Stream article, which is um the precursor to Field

2153
02:14:01,720 --> 02:14:04,360
Speaker 1: and Stream, and they talked about how they brought up

2154
02:14:04,520 --> 02:14:06,720
Speaker 1: a guided group to the three ponds up there and

2155
02:14:06,720 --> 02:14:08,960
Speaker 1: they caught five hundred trout over the three days. And

2156
02:14:09,000 --> 02:14:11,280
Speaker 1: they're not start bringing up more and more people. They

2157
02:14:11,280 --> 02:14:16,480
Speaker 1: had them all stinger. So since the since the you

2158
02:14:16,520 --> 02:14:20,520
Speaker 1: guys finished the pond deal, done got all the money

2159
02:14:20,800 --> 02:14:24,240
Speaker 1: I bought the thing. Um, has there been any uh,

2160
02:14:24,440 --> 02:14:25,960
Speaker 1: have there been any cons to come out of the

2161
02:14:25,960 --> 02:14:32,880
Speaker 1: whole thing. It's been interesting, has been heavily visited. There's

2162
02:14:32,920 --> 02:14:39,720
Speaker 1: been increased visitation for sure. Um mostly non. I don't

2163
02:14:39,720 --> 02:14:42,680
Speaker 1: think it's hunting fishing crowd really. I think a lot

2164
02:14:42,720 --> 02:14:45,600
Speaker 1: of the local press brought some of the resort people

2165
02:14:45,640 --> 02:14:49,040
Speaker 1: down to check it out. Um, there's definitely an interesting

2166
02:14:49,400 --> 02:14:52,480
Speaker 1: um study we could do on canoe storage. So we've

2167
02:14:52,480 --> 02:14:55,000
Speaker 1: been debating because in Maine there's a tradition that you

2168
02:14:55,120 --> 02:14:58,160
Speaker 1: dragon old canoe uh to a body water and you

2169
02:14:58,280 --> 02:15:00,360
Speaker 1: just leave it there for any one to you case

2170
02:15:00,360 --> 02:15:02,800
Speaker 1: you ever need again. It's the way to get a

2171
02:15:02,840 --> 02:15:07,760
Speaker 1: canoe out of your yard exactly. And the problem was

2172
02:15:07,920 --> 02:15:11,240
Speaker 1: people sometime in my lifetime started locking their canoes. They

2173
02:15:11,240 --> 02:15:13,160
Speaker 1: put nicer canoes out there and locked them, and so

2174
02:15:13,240 --> 02:15:16,600
Speaker 1: that's led to like way too many canoes. When everyone

2175
02:15:16,680 --> 02:15:20,760
Speaker 1: just used some old, beat up, you know, aluminum canoe,

2176
02:15:20,880 --> 02:15:23,040
Speaker 1: it was fine. You know, you got wet, but that

2177
02:15:23,160 --> 02:15:24,600
Speaker 1: was the deal is, like there was a canoe there,

2178
02:15:24,600 --> 02:15:27,000
Speaker 1: you didn't need to bring another one. But what was

2179
02:15:27,080 --> 02:15:33,240
Speaker 1: interesting is we've had old canoes leave a new canoes

2180
02:15:33,240 --> 02:15:36,520
Speaker 1: show up, but it's uh net negative. So we've set

2181
02:15:36,560 --> 02:15:41,680
Speaker 1: a policy of thresholds of canoes that if it reaches

2182
02:15:41,720 --> 02:15:45,280
Speaker 1: this specific threshold, that will consider it an issue. But

2183
02:15:45,360 --> 02:15:48,080
Speaker 1: for now we're gonna keep it as is like traditional

2184
02:15:48,120 --> 02:15:50,480
Speaker 1: main like you leave your canoe because we're gonna keep

2185
02:15:50,600 --> 02:15:53,240
Speaker 1: the parking lot out where it is. And yeah, it's

2186
02:15:53,240 --> 02:15:56,840
Speaker 1: on to be a walk in pond um So that's

2187
02:15:57,160 --> 02:15:58,960
Speaker 1: the idea. Is what we've heard from everyone on the

2188
02:15:59,000 --> 02:16:02,920
Speaker 1: committee is that they want to keep it primitive. They

2189
02:16:02,920 --> 02:16:05,120
Speaker 1: don't want to build it up too much. They want

2190
02:16:05,160 --> 02:16:09,800
Speaker 1: to do more traditional signage um and have it because

2191
02:16:09,800 --> 02:16:12,080
Speaker 1: it's just so rare to have something with that feeling

2192
02:16:12,120 --> 02:16:16,720
Speaker 1: of wilderness be so close to you know town. Yeah,

2193
02:16:16,800 --> 02:16:20,840
Speaker 1: I know a spot that the people's stage boats and

2194
02:16:21,000 --> 02:16:24,640
Speaker 1: there's they've brought three up over the years. Two of

2195
02:16:24,680 --> 02:16:27,080
Speaker 1: them are unusable now. One of them is huge and

2196
02:16:27,120 --> 02:16:30,560
Speaker 1: bright blue. It's hard to get him in there. Well,

2197
02:16:30,600 --> 02:16:32,720
Speaker 1: you're not bringing them out, are you? Just? I want

2198
02:16:32,800 --> 02:16:35,039
Speaker 1: you so bad though, because it's so beautiful to give

2199
02:16:35,040 --> 02:16:37,440
Speaker 1: the like, oh there's that stupid things. Well, like in

2200
02:16:37,920 --> 02:16:42,439
Speaker 1: Northern Maine Major Conservancy MC, they do programs, they have volunteers,

2201
02:16:42,440 --> 02:16:45,200
Speaker 1: they go out and drag out these broken up let's

2202
02:16:45,240 --> 02:16:47,440
Speaker 1: call those guys, you know, see what the budget is.

2203
02:16:48,400 --> 02:16:51,840
Speaker 1: It's pretty funny though, like the you get underneath, like

2204
02:16:51,879 --> 02:16:54,880
Speaker 1: the canopy of the trees right on the pond shore

2205
02:16:55,640 --> 02:17:01,680
Speaker 1: Molo and it's just like a long hist of paddling

2206
02:17:01,720 --> 02:17:04,200
Speaker 1: on that lake laid out right there. It's like and

2207
02:17:04,280 --> 02:17:06,760
Speaker 1: that those people on the end or debt, well we

2208
02:17:06,959 --> 02:17:10,360
Speaker 1: joked that, like is there are some of these boats

2209
02:17:11,400 --> 02:17:16,280
Speaker 1: here like past their owner's demise, Like you know, we

2210
02:17:16,560 --> 02:17:19,120
Speaker 1: I don't know if we'll ever find out. You need

2211
02:17:19,160 --> 02:17:20,400
Speaker 1: to do like you gotta do when you leave an

2212
02:17:20,400 --> 02:17:23,240
Speaker 1: ice shaney um out on the lake. If you leave

2213
02:17:23,280 --> 02:17:25,120
Speaker 1: it there, you gotta put your name in address on it. Well,

2214
02:17:25,160 --> 02:17:27,920
Speaker 1: there's been debates about the boat registry, and that doesn't

2215
02:17:27,920 --> 02:17:30,760
Speaker 1: sit well with some people, imagine, but I'm just trying

2216
02:17:30,800 --> 02:17:32,920
Speaker 1: to get rid of this whole boat. Well while you're

2217
02:17:32,959 --> 02:17:38,120
Speaker 1: registering your guns and oh yeah, I firmly I stay

2218
02:17:38,160 --> 02:17:41,680
Speaker 1: in firmly against canoe register exactly. But I can see

2219
02:17:41,720 --> 02:17:43,920
Speaker 1: in the case of something like that, it might be

2220
02:17:44,000 --> 02:17:46,720
Speaker 1: that if you're gonna ditch your canoe at this pond,

2221
02:17:47,040 --> 02:17:49,520
Speaker 1: since we own the pond, we would like you to

2222
02:17:49,600 --> 02:17:51,840
Speaker 1: leave your name on it. That's not big government telling

2223
02:17:51,840 --> 02:17:54,720
Speaker 1: you to register your canoe. Well, so we have a

2224
02:17:54,840 --> 02:17:58,240
Speaker 1: system worked out. There's one boat that's irritating me. They

2225
02:17:58,600 --> 02:18:01,560
Speaker 1: most everyone's respectful, bring us to back up into the forest,

2226
02:18:01,959 --> 02:18:06,600
Speaker 1: like in this area that's been culturally appropriated here, just uh,

2227
02:18:06,600 --> 02:18:09,120
Speaker 1: there's one guy that keeps leaving it on the sand

2228
02:18:09,160 --> 02:18:13,720
Speaker 1: gravel bank, and you know, it's just being lazy. And

2229
02:18:13,800 --> 02:18:16,640
Speaker 1: so I've dragged this canoe three times. Now my new

2230
02:18:16,680 --> 02:18:19,080
Speaker 1: approach is going to be dragged back to the parking

2231
02:18:19,080 --> 02:18:22,320
Speaker 1: lot with the note. So like every time they want

2232
02:18:22,360 --> 02:18:23,800
Speaker 1: to leave it on the shore, they have to bring

2233
02:18:23,800 --> 02:18:26,880
Speaker 1: it all the way back into the ponds. Big Woods

2234
02:18:26,920 --> 02:18:32,600
Speaker 1: Canoe politics. I was gonna ask Brent if he would

2235
02:18:32,600 --> 02:18:36,560
Speaker 1: be excited to know how much funding we have in

2236
02:18:36,600 --> 02:18:40,080
Speaker 1: the land of Access right now? Yeah, you gotta that's what.

2237
02:18:40,200 --> 02:18:41,800
Speaker 1: That's what now. You gotta lay it out with cal

2238
02:18:42,720 --> 02:18:49,400
Speaker 1: So year one when we I don't even know what

2239
02:18:49,760 --> 02:18:52,680
Speaker 1: we really started with like five grand or something after

2240
02:18:52,720 --> 02:18:55,480
Speaker 1: our initial kind of push, and then we started forming

2241
02:18:55,520 --> 02:18:59,680
Speaker 1: this thing up and eventually, um, we cut you guys

2242
02:18:59,680 --> 02:19:04,320
Speaker 1: at chet for like thirty five grand, is that right? Uh? Well,

2243
02:19:04,360 --> 02:19:07,840
Speaker 1: with the donors you helped link us up with, it

2244
02:19:07,959 --> 02:19:12,920
Speaker 1: was all said and done and then um yeah, so

2245
02:19:13,000 --> 02:19:16,280
Speaker 1: that was like cash on hand fund raising and then

2246
02:19:16,760 --> 02:19:20,720
Speaker 1: uh some some last minute donors. I want to thank

2247
02:19:20,760 --> 02:19:22,800
Speaker 1: you guys, because I was pretty blown away with like

2248
02:19:22,840 --> 02:19:26,760
Speaker 1: the doss boat and um, your rifle. You know, I've

2249
02:19:26,800 --> 02:19:29,600
Speaker 1: never considered ever putting my rifle up for anything, so

2250
02:19:29,680 --> 02:19:32,000
Speaker 1: I thought that was I got a bunch more up fixed.

2251
02:19:33,120 --> 02:19:36,760
Speaker 1: So we auctioned off the original Doss Boat from our

2252
02:19:36,800 --> 02:19:42,560
Speaker 1: series Doss Boat, Lefty rifle from Steve Janice through in

2253
02:19:43,360 --> 02:19:48,520
Speaker 1: at least backpack and some things. I think we had

2254
02:19:48,720 --> 02:19:51,240
Speaker 1: some really good donations. I got a steel chainsaw on

2255
02:19:51,280 --> 02:19:56,920
Speaker 1: the mix and some some good conservation books and UM

2256
02:19:56,959 --> 02:19:59,480
Speaker 1: and that. That was a fun, fun thing and we

2257
02:19:59,560 --> 02:20:03,360
Speaker 1: are obviously it's live on the website right now. The

2258
02:20:03,480 --> 02:20:09,960
Speaker 1: Land Access Initiative lives again. We're taking um both donations

2259
02:20:10,240 --> 02:20:12,280
Speaker 1: if you make a purchase at the store and and

2260
02:20:12,720 --> 02:20:14,879
Speaker 1: round up you can choose to round up into the

2261
02:20:14,959 --> 02:20:19,120
Speaker 1: Land Access Initiative. Uh. The Auction House of Oddities is

2262
02:20:19,160 --> 02:20:22,200
Speaker 1: going to come back in mid April that soon with

2263
02:20:22,280 --> 02:20:26,840
Speaker 1: a bunch of awesome stuff, uh in including we're working

2264
02:20:26,879 --> 02:20:30,920
Speaker 1: on the makeo the Doss Boat three, which I honestly

2265
02:20:30,920 --> 02:20:34,200
Speaker 1: want a bid on, so you got some competition if

2266
02:20:34,240 --> 02:20:37,280
Speaker 1: you see that boat three. Boat will be an auction item,

2267
02:20:37,280 --> 02:20:39,600
Speaker 1: not a raffle item because it's some legal thing. You

2268
02:20:39,600 --> 02:20:43,080
Speaker 1: can't paying the butt and we're trying to do good

2269
02:20:43,080 --> 02:20:45,480
Speaker 1: stuff with it. Like is somebody really gonna get you

2270
02:20:45,600 --> 02:20:51,240
Speaker 1: guys like that? It's so cliche, like dog on lawyers.

2271
02:20:51,240 --> 02:20:53,480
Speaker 1: But holy cow, those guys up just make stuff just

2272
02:20:53,560 --> 02:20:58,240
Speaker 1: so complicated. So yeah, you can you can contribute that way,

2273
02:20:58,400 --> 02:21:03,080
Speaker 1: or we would ab slutely love And I know Brent

2274
02:21:03,520 --> 02:21:04,880
Speaker 1: has a bunch of good ideas. He's going to be

2275
02:21:04,920 --> 02:21:10,600
Speaker 1: one of your competitors. Suggest a property, Submit a property

2276
02:21:10,640 --> 02:21:15,920
Speaker 1: that we can explore and hopefully help fundraise and and

2277
02:21:16,520 --> 02:21:20,119
Speaker 1: secure to provide more access to hunting and fishing. You'll

2278
02:21:20,120 --> 02:21:22,920
Speaker 1: know you're getting close with Callahan shows up and paddles around.

2279
02:21:24,160 --> 02:21:28,800
Speaker 1: That's right, no water, water whatever, He's still kind of paddle. Yeah,

2280
02:21:28,800 --> 02:21:30,959
Speaker 1: that was the tip off. And they're not they're not

2281
02:21:31,240 --> 02:21:32,920
Speaker 1: sent him out here on a flight. Right, if you're

2282
02:21:32,959 --> 02:21:36,840
Speaker 1: not interested, how do people like like give it a

2283
02:21:36,840 --> 02:21:38,760
Speaker 1: give a snapshot of what kind of stuff people should

2284
02:21:38,760 --> 02:21:42,080
Speaker 1: be keeping their eyes out for. Well, you know, Brent

2285
02:21:42,640 --> 02:21:47,240
Speaker 1: had something that really was like a beautiful situation. Right,

2286
02:21:47,320 --> 02:21:52,160
Speaker 1: They've done a lot of the legwork. The property that

2287
02:21:52,200 --> 02:21:55,760
Speaker 1: they wanted to secure was going to be held in

2288
02:21:55,959 --> 02:22:00,240
Speaker 1: perpetuity for public access, two things that we hold near

2289
02:22:00,240 --> 02:22:02,840
Speaker 1: and dear, which is just like going out and experiencing

2290
02:22:02,840 --> 02:22:06,400
Speaker 1: and enjoying nature plus fishing. Um, I think if you

2291
02:22:06,640 --> 02:22:08,320
Speaker 1: if you drew a moose tag, you might be able

2292
02:22:08,360 --> 02:22:13,000
Speaker 1: to get a moose out there. Yeah, we have some pictures. Um.

2293
02:22:13,080 --> 02:22:17,200
Speaker 1: And again they had like a goal line like we

2294
02:22:17,360 --> 02:22:20,879
Speaker 1: got to have these funds by this closing date. Here

2295
02:22:20,920 --> 02:22:23,360
Speaker 1: we go come in and help. And so that that

2296
02:22:23,440 --> 02:22:29,119
Speaker 1: was a great one. But funds for let's say, phishing

2297
02:22:29,160 --> 02:22:35,880
Speaker 1: access sites, funds for uh public ease months through private ground.

2298
02:22:36,920 --> 02:22:42,920
Speaker 1: Um is something as simple as you know, canoe or

2299
02:22:43,120 --> 02:22:48,439
Speaker 1: kayak launches into rivers. There's anything that provides more access

2300
02:22:48,480 --> 02:22:51,200
Speaker 1: to a place that doesn't have it. Yeah, I think

2301
02:22:51,240 --> 02:22:53,640
Speaker 1: the best case scenario, like if you imagine, if you

2302
02:22:53,640 --> 02:22:56,360
Speaker 1: want to imagine, like the extreme good one, it would

2303
02:22:56,400 --> 02:23:00,680
Speaker 1: be let's say there's some five section I'm stowing the

2304
02:23:00,760 --> 02:23:03,480
Speaker 1: number out. There's five sections of landlocked public land. There's

2305
02:23:03,480 --> 02:23:06,440
Speaker 1: no legal access to it, but all of a sudden

2306
02:23:06,480 --> 02:23:09,840
Speaker 1: they knew about their granny had an acre of land,

2307
02:23:11,440 --> 02:23:14,560
Speaker 1: and if someone owned that acre land and made it

2308
02:23:14,600 --> 02:23:17,200
Speaker 1: a trailhead, people would be able to screw around on

2309
02:23:17,320 --> 02:23:22,600
Speaker 1: all that landlocked land. That would be well, sweet deal.

2310
02:23:22,800 --> 02:23:29,039
Speaker 1: I would say some practical tips people suppressed, so I

2311
02:23:29,080 --> 02:23:32,200
Speaker 1: do a lot of what's wrong with that? Well that,

2312
02:23:32,320 --> 02:23:34,840
Speaker 1: I mean, there's a few good things there. If someone

2313
02:23:34,920 --> 02:23:37,360
Speaker 1: finds that piece of properis that is granny owned it

2314
02:23:37,400 --> 02:23:40,440
Speaker 1: well perfect, then that guy one has to figure out

2315
02:23:40,480 --> 02:23:43,360
Speaker 1: if Granny is willing to sell. But that that a

2316
02:23:43,400 --> 02:23:45,120
Speaker 1: lot of times would be your best bet is to

2317
02:23:45,160 --> 02:23:49,760
Speaker 1: get a group organization in your area involved. So like

2318
02:23:49,840 --> 02:23:52,400
Speaker 1: let's say you find that one acre piece you've been

2319
02:23:52,440 --> 02:23:55,520
Speaker 1: cruising on X, you've been on your tax rolls, which

2320
02:23:55,720 --> 02:23:58,440
Speaker 1: most towns have public tax roles. You can find pretty

2321
02:23:58,520 --> 02:24:01,680
Speaker 1: much where a one you know, any piece of property

2322
02:24:01,720 --> 02:24:04,920
Speaker 1: exists on earth. Uh, you can find who owns that.

2323
02:24:05,080 --> 02:24:09,199
Speaker 1: You can start compiling that information um and then figure

2324
02:24:09,240 --> 02:24:11,840
Speaker 1: out who are the players in your area. So state

2325
02:24:12,200 --> 02:24:16,800
Speaker 1: states usually have boat launch um, you know departments, and

2326
02:24:17,160 --> 02:24:19,840
Speaker 1: there's I F and W there, which is inland Fisheries

2327
02:24:19,920 --> 02:24:23,640
Speaker 1: wild Life Maine, there's federals. So you would look at

2328
02:24:24,320 --> 02:24:28,119
Speaker 1: in your area who has done work before and reach

2329
02:24:28,160 --> 02:24:30,280
Speaker 1: out to them with this opportunity to say, not only

2330
02:24:30,800 --> 02:24:33,439
Speaker 1: do I think this would be awesome for all these reasons,

2331
02:24:33,480 --> 02:24:37,760
Speaker 1: like it connects to your conservation land, it protects this stream,

2332
02:24:37,959 --> 02:24:41,440
Speaker 1: blah blah blah blah blah, um that there's also this

2333
02:24:41,520 --> 02:24:43,720
Speaker 1: group that I think would help fund it, there's this

2334
02:24:43,760 --> 02:24:47,680
Speaker 1: opportunity through the Land Access Initiative that we could suggest

2335
02:24:47,720 --> 02:24:49,360
Speaker 1: this because it would be right up their alley. And

2336
02:24:49,400 --> 02:24:52,720
Speaker 1: so your goal is always to link good projects with

2337
02:24:52,800 --> 02:24:56,720
Speaker 1: donor interests. So your donor interests here as I would

2338
02:24:56,920 --> 02:24:58,720
Speaker 1: describe it as like it has to be something to

2339
02:24:58,760 --> 02:25:01,360
Speaker 1: do with hunting, fishing. I know you you casted a

2340
02:25:01,400 --> 02:25:05,279
Speaker 1: wider net as far as other access. But my understanding

2341
02:25:05,320 --> 02:25:08,199
Speaker 1: of you guys, which you lay it out there fairly obviously,

2342
02:25:08,959 --> 02:25:11,720
Speaker 1: is the project probably should have some fishing and hunting

2343
02:25:12,600 --> 02:25:16,120
Speaker 1: values added. Yeah. I mean if there's a river, assuming

2344
02:25:16,160 --> 02:25:18,920
Speaker 1: there's a fish in that river, which is the safest thing,

2345
02:25:19,200 --> 02:25:22,080
Speaker 1: but not uh you know, a mild multi use trail

2346
02:25:22,160 --> 02:25:25,959
Speaker 1: or something like that. Um so yeah, that that is

2347
02:25:26,000 --> 02:25:28,520
Speaker 1: the big thing. Go to the Meteor dot com you'll

2348
02:25:28,560 --> 02:25:32,480
Speaker 1: see our land Access initiative and this this is our

2349
02:25:32,600 --> 02:25:36,720
Speaker 1: big conservation push. So we've raised and you're gonna assess

2350
02:25:36,800 --> 02:25:41,359
Speaker 1: the stuff that comes in. Yep, assess stuff that comes in. Ideally,

2351
02:25:41,920 --> 02:25:46,200
Speaker 1: we're gonna have so much good stuff that I'll need

2352
02:25:46,280 --> 02:25:48,400
Speaker 1: some help to and we got that lined up. So

2353
02:25:48,600 --> 02:25:51,640
Speaker 1: and when when we fire up the auction house of odities,

2354
02:25:51,640 --> 02:25:53,240
Speaker 1: how long we gonna run it for this time. I

2355
02:25:53,240 --> 02:25:57,039
Speaker 1: think we're gonna run it for two weeks only, so

2356
02:25:57,320 --> 02:26:02,280
Speaker 1: lots of good stuff, high turnover. Uh, you know, this

2357
02:26:02,320 --> 02:26:06,080
Speaker 1: is your chance to make a big impact to access

2358
02:26:07,160 --> 02:26:10,720
Speaker 1: and get something awesome. So that's great. And then Brent,

2359
02:26:10,760 --> 02:26:13,400
Speaker 1: are you gonna send in some submissions to OCALE. Yeah,

2360
02:26:13,560 --> 02:26:17,280
Speaker 1: oh yeah, we got we have one right now. The

2361
02:26:17,360 --> 02:26:20,320
Speaker 1: Nature Conservancy is trying to purchase seven thousand acres for

2362
02:26:20,320 --> 02:26:23,520
Speaker 1: the state, and our role into it is to try

2363
02:26:23,600 --> 02:26:28,600
Speaker 1: to keep the road open that for a length to

2364
02:26:28,760 --> 02:26:31,640
Speaker 1: be determined because this area, like the book I gave you,

2365
02:26:32,360 --> 02:26:37,160
Speaker 1: that moose hunting book, the Great Main Moose Hunt. Um,

2366
02:26:37,200 --> 02:26:38,520
Speaker 1: you know, a lot of those balls in there were

2367
02:26:38,520 --> 02:26:41,400
Speaker 1: shot up in that land and so you know a

2368
02:26:41,400 --> 02:26:43,240
Speaker 1: lot of that lands on going to a forever while

2369
02:26:43,920 --> 02:26:48,080
Speaker 1: management scenario. And uh, it's good. We wanted to be conserved,

2370
02:26:48,160 --> 02:26:51,199
Speaker 1: but we want to keep road access into this area,

2371
02:26:52,000 --> 02:26:53,920
Speaker 1: so we have to raise some money to help out

2372
02:26:53,920 --> 02:26:56,879
Speaker 1: with that. I see, you know, it's a good one.

2373
02:26:57,240 --> 02:26:59,000
Speaker 1: That's a great example. But then we have two in

2374
02:26:59,080 --> 02:27:01,600
Speaker 1: Maine in a row. Yeah, but this is landscape. You

2375
02:27:01,600 --> 02:27:06,360
Speaker 1: can show the progression Steve, a small project leading to

2376
02:27:06,440 --> 02:27:10,240
Speaker 1: larger project right, send your thing and keep that in mind. Folks,

2377
02:27:10,640 --> 02:27:12,640
Speaker 1: send your thing, and everybody send your pitching and also

2378
02:27:12,720 --> 02:27:14,720
Speaker 1: do stuff like well, we'll have various ways coming up

2379
02:27:14,800 --> 02:27:16,720
Speaker 1: or you can support the Land Access Initiative, and people

2380
02:27:16,760 --> 02:27:18,959
Speaker 1: done a lot of support already. But just like you

2381
02:27:19,000 --> 02:27:22,080
Speaker 1: know auction house roundups when you go on to meetia

2382
02:27:22,160 --> 02:27:24,000
Speaker 1: dot com and you buy something to the roundup, we're

2383
02:27:24,000 --> 02:27:26,320
Speaker 1: gonna have some round up matching stuff coming into play.

2384
02:27:26,680 --> 02:27:28,720
Speaker 1: So stay tuned and all that send ideas. We're trying

2385
02:27:28,720 --> 02:27:32,280
Speaker 1: to find a really cool freaking project. Man. Absolutely, and

2386
02:27:32,320 --> 02:27:34,640
Speaker 1: if you're in Maine, you can always reach out to

2387
02:27:34,840 --> 02:27:37,840
Speaker 1: Brent West the High Peaks Alliance. Talk to him about,

2388
02:27:38,000 --> 02:27:41,360
Speaker 1: you know, being our first ever recipient of the Land

2389
02:27:41,400 --> 02:27:45,640
Speaker 1: Access Initiative grant. Let's call it and see where you

2390
02:27:45,680 --> 02:27:47,800
Speaker 1: can help out in your home state of Maine. If

2391
02:27:47,840 --> 02:27:49,520
Speaker 1: you're listening at home and you've been meaning to go

2392
02:27:49,560 --> 02:27:51,480
Speaker 1: get that old canoe you got tied to a tree

2393
02:27:51,560 --> 02:27:54,000
Speaker 1: up at Shiloh Pond, look forward to the parking lot

2394
02:27:56,480 --> 02:27:59,000
Speaker 1: Brent West, High Peaks Alliance find them if you're If

2395
02:27:59,000 --> 02:28:02,920
Speaker 1: you're a maner, that's maners. If you're a mainer um,

2396
02:28:03,040 --> 02:28:05,160
Speaker 1: jump on and do support there because they're obviously doing

2397
02:28:05,200 --> 02:28:07,200
Speaker 1: real work on the ground to give people places the

2398
02:28:07,200 --> 02:28:11,440
Speaker 1: recreate outside, including but not limited to hunting and fishing.

2399
02:28:12,200 --> 02:28:15,760
Speaker 1: Fair Yeah, definitely, And I would say, you know, anyone

2400
02:28:15,840 --> 02:28:19,520
Speaker 1: who visits or loves this neck of wood should reach

2401
02:28:19,560 --> 02:28:24,560
Speaker 1: out because we have a a tremendous seasonal population. You know,

2402
02:28:24,640 --> 02:28:28,000
Speaker 1: in this area is the recreation basket for the Northeast.

2403
02:28:28,240 --> 02:28:31,960
Speaker 1: You know, there's sixty million people within a twelve hour drive,

2404
02:28:32,440 --> 02:28:35,080
Speaker 1: and you know this might be our last opportunity to

2405
02:28:35,240 --> 02:28:37,840
Speaker 1: keep an area that you can drive to with your family,

2406
02:28:38,040 --> 02:28:41,640
Speaker 1: for your kids, that's within striking distance of those big

2407
02:28:41,680 --> 02:28:45,720
Speaker 1: Eastern cities. Keep this big landscape intact before it's all

2408
02:28:45,760 --> 02:28:49,080
Speaker 1: bought up, locked up exactly, all right, man, Thanks a lot,

2409
02:28:49,160 --> 02:28:51,960
Speaker 1: stay too for trivia. Got trivia coming up? I know

2410
02:28:52,080 --> 02:28:55,040
Speaker 1: smoke brnt West, bring it. Thanks Brett,