WEBVTT - Ep 42: Fischerspooner 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:13.800 Loud and Quiet presents Midnight Chats. 0:00:24.400 --> 0:00:28.600 Evening everyone, and welcome to this new episode of Midnight Chats. 0:00:29.280 --> 0:00:33.279 Not just a new episode, but a sneaky bonus episode. 0:00:34.400 --> 0:00:36.720 Regular listeners will know that we put one of these 0:00:36.800 --> 0:00:42.440 out at midnight on a Thursday every fortnight, but well 0:00:42.840 --> 0:00:46.120 we were feeling generous, so we've thrown in an extra one. 0:00:46.760 --> 0:00:49.760 Think of it as a late Christmas present or something. 0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:54.880 Last week was Stuart's conversation with Welsh artist Gueno. Check 0:00:54.920 --> 0:00:58.120 that one out if you haven't already. Fascinating hearing about 0:00:58.120 --> 0:01:02.800 her experience of leaving home at seventeen, leaving Cardiff and 0:01:02.800 --> 0:01:06.080 going to Vegas to start in Michael Flatley's Lord of 0:01:06.120 --> 0:01:09.679 the Dance, amongst other things. Some great stories from Gueno, 0:01:09.760 --> 0:01:12.560 so do check that one out. We will have another 0:01:12.600 --> 0:01:16.440 podcast next week as well, so loads of Midnight Chats 0:01:16.440 --> 0:01:19.800 for you at the moment. But onto my guest tonight, 0:01:20.120 --> 0:01:23.920 someone who has seen a lot of life, as they say. 0:01:24.680 --> 0:01:28.080 Back in the late nineties, Casey Spooner, an artist and 0:01:28.280 --> 0:01:32.440 photography assistant at the time, got together with the classically 0:01:32.560 --> 0:01:36.480 trained songwriter Warren Fisher in New York and formed the 0:01:36.640 --> 0:01:42.400 art pop duo Fisher Spooner. Unbelievably, that's two decades ago now, 0:01:42.720 --> 0:01:45.840 and as Casey says in the conversation, You're about to hear, 0:01:46.360 --> 0:01:50.800 it was never designed as a career band. The group 0:01:50.880 --> 0:01:56.080 was supposed to be this conceptual, outlandish of the moment 0:01:56.280 --> 0:02:00.320 electro clash project that was deliberately timed with the turn 0:02:00.360 --> 0:02:03.080 of the millennium and all of the hedonism and the 0:02:03.200 --> 0:02:09.240 hysteria that accompanied that weird period. Fisher Spooner famously played 0:02:09.280 --> 0:02:12.960 their first show in a Starbucks in the East Village 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:16.080 and were signed by the label Ministry of Sound for 0:02:16.160 --> 0:02:18.520 a fee that at the time was rumored to be 0:02:18.560 --> 0:02:21.920 around a million pounds. Now, you've got to remember this 0:02:21.960 --> 0:02:25.959 was happening in an era when the newly connected world 0:02:26.040 --> 0:02:30.359 was getting very excited about the New York indie rock scene, 0:02:30.800 --> 0:02:36.960 The Strokes, YAA Yeahs, Interpol. Fisher Spooner were the flamboyant 0:02:37.040 --> 0:02:40.080 alternative to all that, both in the way they looked 0:02:40.160 --> 0:02:43.760 and the way they sounded, with tracks like Emerge and 0:02:43.919 --> 0:02:48.080 their debut album Number One. So it's easy to forget 0:02:48.280 --> 0:02:53.320 their influence too on the likes of Scissor Sisters a 0:02:53.360 --> 0:02:56.320 few years later, and then much later the likes of 0:02:56.600 --> 0:03:01.079 Lady Gaga and Kati Perry. Two albums came after number one, 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:04.480 Odyssey in two thousand and five and two thousand and 0:03:04.560 --> 0:03:09.880 Nine's Entertainment. That album in particular struggled to make an impact, 0:03:10.480 --> 0:03:14.079 and Casey goes into the reasons for that. But there 0:03:14.120 --> 0:03:16.800 is a new album. It's called Sir, and it's out now, 0:03:17.400 --> 0:03:21.280 and while it's taken almost a decade, there is good 0:03:21.320 --> 0:03:24.760 reason for that, all of which Casey goes into, it's 0:03:25.160 --> 0:03:29.200 kind of extraordinary what's happened in between this and their 0:03:29.320 --> 0:03:35.280 last release. Interestingly as well, Sir is produced by Michael Stipe, 0:03:35.560 --> 0:03:39.040 formerly of Rim of course, but on a personal level, 0:03:39.120 --> 0:03:43.800 he was Casey's first boyfriend, his first gay relationship, So 0:03:43.840 --> 0:03:46.080 he talks about that and what it was like going 0:03:46.120 --> 0:03:50.760 to Michael's studio in Athens, Georgia to make the album 0:03:50.880 --> 0:03:54.120 during a period where a lot of other things in 0:03:54.160 --> 0:03:58.480 his life were not necessarily going to plan. So for 0:03:58.520 --> 0:04:01.920 all of the delays and the challenges, though, it does 0:04:02.040 --> 0:04:05.880 feel like all of that happened for a reason, and 0:04:06.280 --> 0:04:08.240 I've got the impression that this is very much the 0:04:08.240 --> 0:04:12.320 beginning of a new chapter. Thank you again to Casey 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:17.359 He was great company, really entertaining. When he arrived for 0:04:17.440 --> 0:04:21.920 our conversation, he was wearing a spectacular bushy coat and 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:27.239 some very cool aviators, great mustache as well. An amazing life, 0:04:27.320 --> 0:04:31.359 an amazing character. This is Casey from Fisher Spooner on 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:53.479 Midnight Chats. Casey, welcome to our Midnight Chats podcast. Thank 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:56.320 you very much, thanks for joining us. You've pretty much 0:04:56.400 --> 0:04:58.479 just got into London, cold old London. 0:04:59.080 --> 0:05:00.599 I just got down last night. 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:02.480 Am I right in thinking it was your birthday a 0:05:02.480 --> 0:05:03.200 couple of days ago. 0:05:03.400 --> 0:05:07.160 It was my birthday on Friday, February second, And how 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:11.440 did you celebrate? Oh? My god. I had an incredible birthday. 0:05:11.480 --> 0:05:14.520 It started on Thursday night, at midnight. I was at 0:05:14.520 --> 0:05:20.040 this little bar called Lapel in Paris and just had 0:05:20.040 --> 0:05:23.279 some drinks, hung out, got a great birthday kiss. It 0:05:23.360 --> 0:05:27.679 was a blue moon. My day started super early, lots 0:05:27.680 --> 0:05:32.039 of phone calls, lots of friends. Went to the Esadine 0:05:32.040 --> 0:05:35.440 Aliyah show, which was incredible with a friend of my Jerome, 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:39.359 and then I had a kind of a There was 0:05:39.400 --> 0:05:41.560 a photographer I met at the bar the night before 0:05:41.680 --> 0:05:45.360 and we did a photo shoot in the afternoon. So 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:47.760 we did this great fun photo shoot. One of the 0:05:47.760 --> 0:05:51.080 photos just went live on Vogue dot com today three 0:05:51.160 --> 0:05:56.560 days later. And then went had an amazing dinner this 0:05:56.960 --> 0:06:00.920 really cool little brasserie down by the river, and then 0:06:01.120 --> 0:06:04.760 I went to this cabaret in Paris that I love 0:06:04.839 --> 0:06:09.880 called the Manco, and had birthday cake and drank way 0:06:09.920 --> 0:06:15.080 too much vodka, and you know, ran home and passed 0:06:15.080 --> 0:06:16.160 out at four am. 0:06:16.400 --> 0:06:18.240 I was gonna say, what's time to do with that? Finish? 0:06:18.680 --> 0:06:19.320 That's great? 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:21.719 And people wanted to keep going, and I was like, 0:06:22.960 --> 0:06:26.159 I got I'm you know. And then I recovered a 0:06:26.200 --> 0:06:31.520 little bit on Saturday and went to my favorite cafe 0:06:32.000 --> 0:06:34.599 in my neighborhood, La pro Gray and had to croak 0:06:34.640 --> 0:06:37.680 my dam. And then I went to the Cartier Foundation 0:06:38.080 --> 0:06:40.119 and saw the Malik Citabey show. 0:06:40.640 --> 0:06:44.080 You've just recently moved to Paris from New York, So 0:06:44.680 --> 0:06:46.840 was part of the attraction of moving to Paris just 0:06:46.920 --> 0:06:50.920 all of the cultural options You've been able to kind 0:06:50.920 --> 0:06:52.680 of dip in to see things like that. 0:06:52.880 --> 0:06:55.800 Yeah, I mean, I feel like in Paris, I'm constantly 0:06:56.080 --> 0:07:00.480 seeing art and around culture and music, and you know, 0:07:00.600 --> 0:07:02.680 it's such a beautiful city and it has such a 0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:06.680 long history of culture that you know. I didn't plan 0:07:06.760 --> 0:07:09.880 to go see the Aliyah show. I just ran into 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:11.920 a friend and all of a sudden, I'm in this 0:07:12.360 --> 0:07:15.960 beautiful exhibition. And then I had been trying to go 0:07:16.040 --> 0:07:19.560 to the Malik Citabey show for a long time because 0:07:19.560 --> 0:07:21.640 I love the Cartier Foundation. They've done a lot of 0:07:21.680 --> 0:07:25.320 great shows over the years that I love. I went 0:07:25.360 --> 0:07:27.200 to Paris and I just I've never felt like I've 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:30.120 been able to see everything, and now even living there, 0:07:30.200 --> 0:07:34.960 I'm constantly you know, I've missed the Forsyth show, I 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:38.800 got the Irving Pin show, and I still haven't been 0:07:38.960 --> 0:07:44.200 to the Oh my god, what's the museum. I'm Gustave Moreau. 0:07:44.520 --> 0:07:46.360 It was one of my favorite painters and he has 0:07:46.400 --> 0:07:48.600 a museum that I didn't even know about. And I 0:07:48.640 --> 0:07:51.320 finally made it to the Rodain Museum, but it was 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:53.240 during the Dior Ball, so I kind of have to 0:07:53.280 --> 0:07:53.800 go back. 0:07:54.520 --> 0:07:57.760 So there's like it's busy, diary not a lot. 0:07:57.960 --> 0:08:00.880 And I made it to Peril Chazz finally, but I 0:08:00.920 --> 0:08:03.000 never made it to Jim Morrison's grave. I only made 0:08:03.000 --> 0:08:06.600 it to Oscar Wilde's grave. I need to find Maria 0:08:06.680 --> 0:08:09.440 Colossus Gray, you know, so I need to. I mean, 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:10.560 I love per La Chez. 0:08:10.680 --> 0:08:12.680 So what prompted the move to Paris was it? Is 0:08:12.720 --> 0:08:14.920 it like a kind of a fresh start thing, just 0:08:15.000 --> 0:08:15.880 once to do something different. 0:08:16.320 --> 0:08:20.480 It was really it was an accident, honestly. I finished 0:08:20.520 --> 0:08:25.440 shooting two music big music videos, one for Top Brazil 0:08:25.560 --> 0:08:29.080 and one for Butterscotch Goddamn, and then the next day 0:08:29.680 --> 0:08:32.679 I went to Brazil for two weeks with a friend 0:08:32.800 --> 0:08:36.600 with some friends of mine, this promoter from New York, Ricardo, 0:08:36.720 --> 0:08:39.560 who does a particle Harder and so he was doing 0:08:39.640 --> 0:08:43.080 Harder parties in Brazil. And because it was like a 0:08:43.080 --> 0:08:45.320 Brazilian theme too, a couple of songs on the record, 0:08:45.520 --> 0:08:48.959 I thought it was good strategy to go and also 0:08:49.040 --> 0:08:52.600 a nice way to recover from work. So a group 0:08:52.640 --> 0:08:56.000 of us went down and I did two like little 0:08:56.080 --> 0:09:01.520 nightclub performances and DJed one night and did a fashion editorial, 0:09:01.600 --> 0:09:05.240 shot a music video for the song oh Rio, and 0:09:05.320 --> 0:09:09.160 then I raced back to New York. I packed a 0:09:09.480 --> 0:09:14.720 carry on for two days and flew to Paris to 0:09:15.040 --> 0:09:18.280 just comfort two days to see a premiere a friend 0:09:18.280 --> 0:09:21.800 of mine, Alex Eckman. It's a big choreographer and he 0:09:21.920 --> 0:09:24.800 had a peace premiering at the Gardnier, so I came 0:09:24.840 --> 0:09:27.000 in to go see his piece premiere at the Garnier. 0:09:27.960 --> 0:09:30.480 You know, I had these incredible two days. I came in, 0:09:30.559 --> 0:09:34.120 I went and recorded with Mere Way. I you know, 0:09:34.240 --> 0:09:38.160 had this amazing fitting with this new designer Ludwick, who 0:09:38.679 --> 0:09:41.400 made an evening gown for me to wear to the opera. 0:09:42.240 --> 0:09:44.120 And then I just had this like kind of magical 0:09:44.200 --> 0:09:46.640 night where we had the run of the Garnier. We 0:09:46.760 --> 0:09:48.640 drank way too much champagne. We took all of our 0:09:48.679 --> 0:09:52.600 clothes off. It was a scandal. I was hungover. I 0:09:52.640 --> 0:09:55.200 had a bit of a romance, and I just woke 0:09:55.240 --> 0:09:57.960 up the next day and I didn't feel like leaving. 0:09:58.440 --> 0:10:01.600 I knew I also didn't want to be in New 0:10:01.679 --> 0:10:04.719 York for the winter, and so it was a lot 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:07.439 of things. It was also being outside of the political 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:11.800 climate of America felt really nice. I was out of 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:16.200 kind of the crazy zone, not hearing about American politics 0:10:16.280 --> 0:10:19.559 all the time, and so I sort of relaxed a 0:10:19.600 --> 0:10:24.119 little bit. And my lease was coming up on my apartment, 0:10:24.400 --> 0:10:30.840 and you know, I'm single and didn't work. Was kind 0:10:30.840 --> 0:10:34.760 of done, so it just weirdly was this moment where. 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:37.000 It sounds like the planets kind of aligned and we're 0:10:37.040 --> 0:10:37.600 telling you something. 0:10:37.800 --> 0:10:41.600 Yeah. And then a week later, I had decided that 0:10:41.720 --> 0:10:45.200 I was going to leave New York and I was 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:48.040 going to sublet my apartment and I thought I was 0:10:48.080 --> 0:10:50.280 going to move to Madrid because I have a real 0:10:50.360 --> 0:10:54.080 strong connection to Madrid. I went to the airport and 0:10:54.160 --> 0:10:58.640 I missed my return flight right before the holidays by 0:10:58.679 --> 0:11:02.120 five minutes, and you know, I had to carry on. 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:04.559 It was fifty five minutes before the flight. They still 0:11:04.559 --> 0:11:07.360 wouldn't let me on. So I knew when I missed 0:11:07.360 --> 0:11:11.320 that flight because I had scavenged to find a return 0:11:11.360 --> 0:11:14.280 flight and everything was sold out and extremely expensive because 0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:17.840 it was a week before Christmas. So then I missed 0:11:17.880 --> 0:11:22.880 that flight. I went back into the city and I ran. 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:26.360 I went to an opening at a gallery Bleiche Hurtling 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:29.360 and Danielle like Bleiche's an old friend of mine. And 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:31.840 when I got there, he was like, what what are 0:11:31.880 --> 0:11:33.880 you doing here? And I, you know, I was like, well, 0:11:33.960 --> 0:11:36.480 I just missed my flight. And he was like, where 0:11:36.480 --> 0:11:38.040 are you staying? And I was like I don't know, 0:11:38.360 --> 0:11:39.800 and he was like, well, you're moving in with me 0:11:40.320 --> 0:11:41.520 and I was like okay, and he's like, what are 0:11:41.520 --> 0:11:42.800 you doing for dinner? And I was like, I don't 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:44.320 have any plans. And he was like, well, you're coming 0:11:44.320 --> 0:11:46.960 to dinner and I was like okay. And then he 0:11:47.040 --> 0:11:51.079 said and you're moving to Paris. And when he said it, 0:11:51.080 --> 0:11:53.640 it was like one of those moments where you're just like. 0:11:53.600 --> 0:11:56.120 Oh, I think I am shit. 0:11:56.400 --> 0:12:01.280 I think wow, you just articulated what I didn't really realize. 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:04.840 I was already thinking. And so then from there, I 0:12:04.880 --> 0:12:07.920 spent the holidays in Paris by myself, which was kind 0:12:07.960 --> 0:12:12.320 of a little lonely but kind of amazing. Yeah. I 0:12:12.360 --> 0:12:15.960 found a room in the Marae and I called my 0:12:16.000 --> 0:12:18.240 assistant in New York and I had him pack up 0:12:18.240 --> 0:12:20.760 the New York apartment and I put everything in storage 0:12:20.800 --> 0:12:23.840 and I never I'm still you know, I came with 0:12:23.880 --> 0:12:27.640 a carry on and. 0:12:26.320 --> 0:12:29.240 That's it sounds like you've been too busy to miss 0:12:29.280 --> 0:12:30.240 New York in any way. 0:12:30.880 --> 0:12:32.840 Yeah, I'm going back. I'm going back to New York, 0:12:32.960 --> 0:12:35.240 you know, this week for album release, so we have 0:12:35.320 --> 0:12:38.360 two release parties and there's you know a lot of 0:12:38.760 --> 0:12:41.439 stuff going on, so I'll go. I miss my friends, 0:12:41.840 --> 0:12:46.120 you know. Of course, but it feels good, and I've 0:12:46.200 --> 0:12:50.320 you know, I really have always wanted to speak another 0:12:50.360 --> 0:12:53.319 I'm terrible. I don't speak any language other than English, 0:12:53.920 --> 0:12:56.800 and I've studied, you know, I've taken classes, but it 0:12:56.920 --> 0:12:59.720 never really sinks in. So I know, the only way 0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:03.200 I'm really going to learn French or Spanish or you know, 0:13:03.480 --> 0:13:06.040 any of these Romance languages is I have to be 0:13:06.040 --> 0:13:08.160 immersed in it. So this is a way for me 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:09.959 to not be xenophobic. 0:13:10.240 --> 0:13:14.480 You mentioned the effect that politics can have on your life. 0:13:14.960 --> 0:13:16.960 How did you feel that person when you're in America? 0:13:17.000 --> 0:13:19.040 Did it just feel a bit claustrophobic, like you couldn't 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:21.640 get away from it? We explain that part. 0:13:21.480 --> 0:13:24.320 Of this, well, I mean, the night of the election 0:13:25.400 --> 0:13:29.080 was and I don't say I don't say his name 0:13:29.320 --> 0:13:31.199 because I don't I feel like it gives it power, 0:13:31.440 --> 0:13:34.200 so I just don't say the name. But the night 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:43.800 of the election was so traumatizing, and I was you know, 0:13:43.880 --> 0:13:46.920 you couldn't sleep. Yes, I felt claustrophobic. I felt like 0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:48.720 I was living in some kind of a nightmare, like 0:13:48.760 --> 0:13:56.719 I couldn't believe this is possible. And so like panic, claustrophobic, denial, 0:13:57.960 --> 0:14:01.920 and so I was going to leave New York. Basically, 0:14:02.000 --> 0:14:07.120 I was looking for an apartment in New York last 0:14:07.520 --> 0:14:11.440 November and I kind of decided that I was gonna 0:14:11.800 --> 0:14:14.760 leave New York because it was too difficult and too expensive. 0:14:14.880 --> 0:14:19.160 And I kind of reluctantly went to look at an 0:14:19.200 --> 0:14:25.640 apartment and it was a great apartment, and my friends 0:14:25.640 --> 0:14:28.240 were like, you really should take it. I had an 0:14:28.280 --> 0:14:32.960 appointment to meet the landlord, the landlady, and it was 0:14:32.960 --> 0:14:35.600 supposed to be on the Tuesday of the election, and 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:39.560 she slid the meeting to eleven o'clock on the Wednesday 0:14:40.640 --> 0:14:45.680 after the election, and so I was up all night 0:14:45.720 --> 0:14:50.440 long from the election, and I went to meet her. 0:14:50.560 --> 0:14:52.120 And when I went to meet the landlady to talk 0:14:52.160 --> 0:14:54.920 about the apartment, you know, I was like, listen, I 0:14:54.920 --> 0:14:57.080 don't know why I'm meeting you. I don't know why 0:14:57.120 --> 0:14:58.880 I would rent an apartment. I don't know why I 0:14:58.880 --> 0:15:00.720 would stay in the United States. I don't know why 0:15:00.720 --> 0:15:04.280 I would stay in New York. You know, I'm I'm 0:15:04.600 --> 0:15:07.440 I'm out. I got money in the bank, I can 0:15:07.480 --> 0:15:11.040 go anywhere. I'm I was like, I'm I'm leaving, and 0:15:11.080 --> 0:15:14.120 the landlady was very aggressive and she was like, no, 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:17.800 you're staying. You should stay. And I don't know if 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:20.600 it's because she was a Polish immigrant and she had 0:15:20.640 --> 0:15:25.560 feelings about the United States or but she really was 0:15:25.720 --> 0:15:28.200 very aggressive with me, and I did everything I could 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:29.960 to not take the apartment. I was like, look, i'm 0:15:30.000 --> 0:15:31.960 an artist, I have terrible credit. I'm not going to 0:15:31.960 --> 0:15:35.040 get approved. She was like, no problem, we'll figure it out. 0:15:35.280 --> 0:15:39.520 Someone will make someone else sign something. And then she 0:15:39.640 --> 0:15:41.400 was like, the rent is X amount of dollars. I 0:15:41.440 --> 0:15:43.880 was like, I can't forward that. She's like, fine, I'll 0:15:43.920 --> 0:15:46.960 lower it, you know, six hundred, I'll lower the rent. 0:15:47.120 --> 0:15:49.160 She lowered the rent. No one does that in New York. 0:15:49.200 --> 0:15:53.280 She lowered the rent, and then I even avoided I 0:15:53.320 --> 0:15:56.040 was busy in rehearsals getting ready for show Mexico City. 0:15:56.400 --> 0:15:59.680 I avoided filing the application for the apartment, and she 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:03.920 asked me to file applications. So finally, you know, this sweet, 0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:06.880 sweet Polish woman kind of forced me to stay in 0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:11.720 New York and rent this gorgeous apartment for one more year. 0:16:12.560 --> 0:16:17.640 And I think it was good because it well, I 0:16:17.680 --> 0:16:21.200 needed to finish the album. I needed to finish mixing. 0:16:21.240 --> 0:16:24.080 I needed to kind of finish everything that had been 0:16:24.160 --> 0:16:28.640 in process. But you know, it also gave me the 0:16:28.680 --> 0:16:31.760 opportunity to I don't know. I mean, I felt bad 0:16:31.800 --> 0:16:35.640 about leaving New York. And the thing that I deliberated was, 0:16:35.640 --> 0:16:39.840 was I being you know, disloyal or unpatriotic because I'm 0:16:39.840 --> 0:16:44.120 not there kind of fighting for the nation that I 0:16:44.120 --> 0:16:45.720 believe America that I believe in. 0:16:47.120 --> 0:16:50.480 Did you feel yourself and presumably yourself and other people 0:16:50.520 --> 0:16:54.600 around you really wrestling with your identity as an American 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:57.520 post that action result? 0:16:59.000 --> 0:17:02.720 No, because I don't think that represents America. I mean, 0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:05.640 you know, he didn't win by the popular vote. There's 0:17:05.680 --> 0:17:08.520 a whole electoral college thing, and so the actual numbers 0:17:08.640 --> 0:17:11.640 are the majority of the United States did not vote 0:17:11.640 --> 0:17:14.919 for him, So the majority of the country is sane. 0:17:15.560 --> 0:17:17.320 You know. I live in New York also, so New 0:17:17.400 --> 0:17:23.520 York is kind of you know, the more exceptional kind 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:28.920 of land, very you know, mixing of cultures and there's 0:17:29.000 --> 0:17:32.520 a lot of tolerance. And New York is such a 0:17:32.600 --> 0:17:37.000 magical place because it's this you know, all these extremes 0:17:37.000 --> 0:17:41.720 of like wealth and power, but also this kind of earthiness. 0:17:42.080 --> 0:17:44.560 It's I mean, my life in New York. I really 0:17:44.880 --> 0:17:47.920 mix with a lot of people, and so you feel 0:17:48.560 --> 0:17:53.600 that is the best kind of America. And so I 0:17:53.640 --> 0:17:55.760 have a lot of faith in the kind of the 0:17:55.800 --> 0:18:01.760 ideals of democracy and American values. But a friend of mine, 0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:04.639 Kate Hardy, an artist, said something that's really stuck with me, 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:06.520 and it's something that I'm trying to put into practice, 0:18:07.119 --> 0:18:08.960 is that I come from the South. I come from 0:18:09.000 --> 0:18:11.760 a very conservative family. They're all Trump supporters. They all 0:18:11.840 --> 0:18:17.359 voted for Trump. I said the name, let's see, it's bad. 0:18:19.080 --> 0:18:24.680 And my friend Kate, her mother is a judge in Texas, 0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:28.280 and Kate said to me, she said, you know, if 0:18:28.600 --> 0:18:31.960 we can't convince our families not to vote for this person, 0:18:32.400 --> 0:18:36.120 who can we convince. So now as we go into 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:39.159 midterm elections, I've sort of taken it upon myself to 0:18:39.280 --> 0:18:44.520 try to figure out how to engage with my family 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:50.040 and to have political discussions and how to convince them 0:18:50.520 --> 0:18:56.560 that when they support this administration, they're actually working against 0:18:56.640 --> 0:18:58.080 me on a very personal level. 0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:01.320 You managed to do that without wanting to run out 0:19:01.359 --> 0:19:03.679 of the house screaming on Thanksgiving, then. 0:19:03.720 --> 0:19:07.480 Well, I mean that is definitely you know something I 0:19:08.240 --> 0:19:13.160 have done, and I have to deal with. But I'm 0:19:13.359 --> 0:19:17.720 trying to change the way I connect with people who 0:19:17.720 --> 0:19:21.359 disagree with me, and so I think that's really the 0:19:21.359 --> 0:19:24.200 big lesson for me, is that to not come at 0:19:24.200 --> 0:19:28.200 it with anger and not to come with I mean, 0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:33.320 anger is awesome, and I've been enjoying being angry and 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:38.919 you know, combative and aggressive. But also if I want 0:19:38.960 --> 0:19:44.760 to have an impact on people like my family, you know, 0:19:44.840 --> 0:19:49.240 anger isn't the way. And so I'm trying to grow 0:19:49.680 --> 0:19:55.760 because of this situation and use this horrible experience as 0:19:55.800 --> 0:20:01.080 a way to change the way I talk about politics 0:20:01.080 --> 0:20:03.920 and change the way I relate to people that disagree 0:20:03.960 --> 0:20:04.199 with me. 0:20:04.880 --> 0:20:08.199 Sounds like you've taken some personal positives from a not 0:20:08.400 --> 0:20:12.040 great experience, obviously, but do you think I mean, it's 0:20:12.160 --> 0:20:15.920 very hard to talk about whether America as a whole 0:20:15.960 --> 0:20:17.840 because you can't really speak for America, But do you 0:20:17.920 --> 0:20:20.480 think there are bigger lessons that have been learned from 0:20:20.520 --> 0:20:23.040 this or could be learned. Do you think there's a positive, 0:20:23.200 --> 0:20:24.879 any positives there in the future, or are you just 0:20:25.000 --> 0:20:29.360 still in the anger stage. 0:20:31.040 --> 0:20:34.560 I mean, it's been exciting. I was never big into 0:20:35.000 --> 0:20:40.919 protest and I was very passive politically the day after 0:20:40.960 --> 0:20:44.480 the election, I went and protested and it was the 0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:49.080 only thing that made me feel good. And it was beautiful. Actually, 0:20:49.400 --> 0:20:55.359 everyone marched up Fifth Avenue and everyone gathered around you 0:20:55.400 --> 0:21:02.000 know Who's hideous building. The energy was intoxicating and incredible. 0:21:02.040 --> 0:21:04.800 I had never experienced like being in that kind of 0:21:04.840 --> 0:21:08.160 a space with that kind of energy kind of gave 0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:12.560 me a different perspective and a renewed faith on protest. 0:21:13.000 --> 0:21:15.440 I always kind of looked at it. It's like, I 0:21:15.480 --> 0:21:19.680 don't know, like drudgery or like work or an obligation. 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:23.520 I never thought of it as like therapeutic and a 0:21:23.600 --> 0:21:28.080 release and community and connection and kind of spiritual and 0:21:28.320 --> 0:21:32.680 so you know, that's a positive. I think it's made 0:21:32.760 --> 0:21:37.160 people really think about how to make changes and how 0:21:37.240 --> 0:21:42.760 to People are being more thoughtful now, I think because 0:21:43.400 --> 0:21:48.399 if you if we're lazy and we're not vigilant, you 0:21:48.600 --> 0:21:52.639 end up with, you know, a situation like this. So 0:21:52.800 --> 0:21:54.960 now it feels like, oh, we've got work to do. 0:21:55.160 --> 0:21:58.000 I'll ask you about how that feeling, that kind of 0:21:58.000 --> 0:22:02.000 proactivity that came into my mind the new album sir, 0:22:02.320 --> 0:22:05.680 But before we do that, it's been a while since 0:22:05.720 --> 0:22:08.280 you've done you've promoted a new album. Since you've done 0:22:08.280 --> 0:22:10.400 all this come and done the interviews and yeah, talked 0:22:10.440 --> 0:22:13.159 about yourself, et cetera, et cetera. So how does it 0:22:13.200 --> 0:22:16.679 feel to be back on that in the in the 0:22:16.720 --> 0:22:17.720 promotional trail? 0:22:17.800 --> 0:22:21.280 If you like, I guess you're right. I haven't done 0:22:21.440 --> 0:22:25.720 pr in a while. I mean, it feels fine. I mean, 0:22:25.800 --> 0:22:30.600 I'm a storyteller and so I like talking to people, 0:22:30.720 --> 0:22:34.639 and I'm not opposed to publicity, you know, and I 0:22:34.720 --> 0:22:37.320 treat it as kind of like a theater. It's also 0:22:37.800 --> 0:22:42.040 like theater and performance. So to me, press is kind 0:22:42.040 --> 0:22:47.000 of an extension of already my craft. But also I've 0:22:47.080 --> 0:22:50.600 learned a lot, you know. I didn't know how to 0:22:50.640 --> 0:22:53.919 create boundaries before. I didn't know how to maintain a 0:22:54.080 --> 0:22:59.119 kind of personal balance when I've gone through press before 0:22:59.280 --> 0:23:00.960 I was actually thinking about it reasons. It's one of 0:23:01.000 --> 0:23:03.160 the reasons why it's I chose to stay in Europe. 0:23:03.240 --> 0:23:06.479 Also is because in the past, whenever I had to 0:23:06.520 --> 0:23:08.920 do European publicity, I would have to cram it all 0:23:08.960 --> 0:23:13.120 into like a week, and it would be really difficult, 0:23:13.600 --> 0:23:17.760 and I would sort of allow publicists and managers to 0:23:17.840 --> 0:23:21.920 book up schedules, not really knowing that I could turn 0:23:21.960 --> 0:23:25.240 things down or I didn't have to do ten interviews 0:23:25.280 --> 0:23:28.200 a day in a different city every day for two weeks. 0:23:29.000 --> 0:23:31.800 I thought that I had to in order to be successful. 0:23:32.119 --> 0:23:36.080 You know, the more I did what I was told, 0:23:36.200 --> 0:23:39.919 the better things would go. And I've kind of learned, 0:23:40.480 --> 0:23:44.160 you know, I don't know, I'd feel like I don't 0:23:44.240 --> 0:23:47.480 work that way anymore. I'm and I'm determined to enjoy 0:23:47.520 --> 0:23:49.480 success because in the past I've had a lot of 0:23:49.520 --> 0:23:51.200 success and I didn't enjoy it at all. 0:23:51.400 --> 0:23:53.159 You didn't allow yourself the time to do that. 0:23:53.359 --> 0:23:56.560 Cool, I guess, you know, I just was I get 0:23:57.320 --> 0:23:59.120 I don't know. It's like, sometimes I have a hard 0:23:59.160 --> 0:24:03.159 time taking care of my self, and I love my work, 0:24:03.720 --> 0:24:06.800 and so I'll do anything in order to be a 0:24:06.840 --> 0:24:12.840 working artist. But I found that if I don't kind 0:24:12.840 --> 0:24:17.080 of create very specific boundaries, I end up losing myself. 0:24:17.160 --> 0:24:19.600 I end up losing a personal life, I lose I 0:24:19.680 --> 0:24:24.800 end up kind of getting too absorbed in work in 0:24:24.840 --> 0:24:26.879 a way that I don't think happens for other people 0:24:26.880 --> 0:24:29.800 that have like, quote unquote real jobs. You know, when 0:24:29.840 --> 0:24:33.480 you're an artist, it's a job that can completely you know, 0:24:34.680 --> 0:24:39.320