1 00:00:04,280 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: Ronanian, you can't assume or believe that you're the only 2 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:09,320 Speaker 1: guy to ever see that problem. 3 00:00:09,320 --> 00:00:11,280 Speaker 2: It's a big world out there, and somebody else has 4 00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 2: seen it, and the value of community is really coming 5 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 2: full circle. And you can see it in a lot 6 00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 2: of the organizations that are being set up for mechanics 7 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:28,400 Speaker 2: to help mechanics the Car Doctor. 8 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:32,000 Speaker 3: I'm not afraid to drive it from Des Moines to Omaha. 9 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:36,120 Speaker 3: I stay off of Interstate eighty system because when the 10 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 3: semi passes you at seventy mile an hour and you're 11 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:43,360 Speaker 3: doing fifty, it has a tendency to stuck you off 12 00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 3: the road. 13 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:45,400 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, it's got to look pretty cool to a 14 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:48,080 Speaker 2: thirty eight Chevy on Rude. That's got to be pretty meat, 15 00:00:48,159 --> 00:00:48,320 Speaker 2: you know. 16 00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to the radio home of Ronanania, The Car Doctor. 17 00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 1: Since nineteen ninety one, this is where car owners the 18 00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:59,920 Speaker 1: world overturned to for their definitive opinion on automotive repair. 19 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 1: If you're a mechanics giving you a busy signal, pick 20 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 1: up the phone and call in. 21 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:07,560 Speaker 2: The garage doors are open, but I am here to 22 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:10,319 Speaker 2: take your call at eight five five five six ninety 23 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 2: nine hundred and now running and look at that another 24 00:01:16,600 --> 00:01:16,880 Speaker 2: week of. 25 00:01:16,920 --> 00:01:18,280 Speaker 4: Voter repairs, you know this one. 26 00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 2: We're here ready to launch and talk about cars and 27 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 2: fixing cars. But in a way, we're going to change 28 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:25,959 Speaker 2: it up this hour because we're going to be talking 29 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:27,600 Speaker 2: to a gentleman. Well, I'll tell you what. Let's just 30 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 2: bring them right in Jared Wilson. Jared, thanks for taking 31 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 2: the time and spending some time here with us on 32 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:33,880 Speaker 2: the Car Doctors. So we're very happy to have you. 33 00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:35,919 Speaker 5: Yeah, thanks a loll for the invite. 34 00:01:35,959 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 2: Ron Jared you are. Let me introduce you this way, 35 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:40,560 Speaker 2: if you could tell us about it. You're a farmer 36 00:01:40,959 --> 00:01:45,640 Speaker 2: in Missouri, right, yeah, yeah, and how big is your farm? 37 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 5: We're down here in Bates County, Missouri and road crop 38 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:51,800 Speaker 5: right at four thousand acres and have a couple hundred 39 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:53,040 Speaker 5: cowcaf bears. 40 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:55,720 Speaker 2: Right. We're going to talk about that, those those cowcaf 41 00:01:55,760 --> 00:01:57,800 Speaker 2: things later on because we were talking about it before 42 00:01:57,840 --> 00:02:00,560 Speaker 2: the interview today and it's it's kind of a fact fascinating. 43 00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:04,240 Speaker 2: But what led me to Jared Jared was recently in 44 00:02:04,320 --> 00:02:07,440 Speaker 2: the news as a result of and you're ready for this, listeners, 45 00:02:07,480 --> 00:02:09,960 Speaker 2: where have you heard this before? The Right to Repair? 46 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:13,600 Speaker 2: Jared is helping the charge down there out of Missouri 47 00:02:13,680 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 2: Way talking about the right to repair and fixing his 48 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,679 Speaker 2: John Deere tractor. Right, Jared tell us about it. I mean, 49 00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:22,080 Speaker 2: this is this is a big deal. 50 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:22,359 Speaker 5: Now. 51 00:02:22,520 --> 00:02:25,239 Speaker 2: People complain because they can't get their sixty thousand dollars 52 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:28,160 Speaker 2: car fixed. You've got what at one point was a 53 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 2: six hundred thousand dollars tractor and you can't get that fixed. 54 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 5: Yeah, it's wild trip. You know. It kind of goes 55 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:41,639 Speaker 5: back to the Digital Millennium Copyright Act, as we've seen 56 00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:46,239 Speaker 5: these systems go from purely mechanical to so much software 57 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:50,919 Speaker 5: integrated into the machine. You know, these companies have taken 58 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 5: the line that the software is theirs and we just 59 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 5: have an implied use license to use it. And so 60 00:02:56,919 --> 00:03:00,120 Speaker 5: with that, you know, they're maintaining that they have some 61 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:03,359 Speaker 5: control over all of the software on the controllers of 62 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 5: these machines. And in twenty fifteen, through a process called 63 00:03:07,919 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 5: the Section twelve oh one Act, the Librarian of Congress 64 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 5: was allowed to give us an exemption so that we 65 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:18,959 Speaker 5: can repair, diagnose, and even modify the software on these 66 00:03:19,000 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 5: machines because they're ours. Right, if you own a book, 67 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 5: you have the right to scroll in the margins of 68 00:03:25,080 --> 00:03:27,840 Speaker 5: the book. You have the right to highlight portions of 69 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:32,080 Speaker 5: the book. And essentially these manufacturers are stating that we 70 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:34,519 Speaker 5: don't have any of that right, and you know, with 71 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:38,480 Speaker 5: that there's a whole bunch of legal ease. But essentially, 72 00:03:38,520 --> 00:03:44,400 Speaker 5: these corporations are hiding behind you know, copyright infringement to 73 00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:48,760 Speaker 5: create these giant repair monopolies where they make it so 74 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 5: that only dealership technicians have the ability to plug into 75 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 5: these machines. They actually sell some really expensive software now 76 00:03:57,360 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 5: that you can lease from them to do that, but 77 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:03,200 Speaker 5: they still don't give us the right to the software. 78 00:04:03,440 --> 00:04:07,040 Speaker 5: So let's say I have even a mechanical component that 79 00:04:07,120 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 5: I need to replace on the device, specifically with the 80 00:04:10,040 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 5: emissions right like an exhaust gas for circulation VAPP. If 81 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 5: I need to replace that, you know I can unbolt 82 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:18,839 Speaker 5: it and bolt it back on, but in many instances 83 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:21,520 Speaker 5: you actually have to flash the engine control unit with 84 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:24,799 Speaker 5: new software to get the machine to accept that part 85 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:28,680 Speaker 5: and function properly, and only the dealership technicians can do that. 86 00:04:28,920 --> 00:04:32,360 Speaker 2: Well, now wait a minute, now, wait a minute. So 87 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:35,280 Speaker 2: you're driving your your your tractor and this isn't attractor 88 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 2: you called it something else in our pre interview. This 89 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 2: is remember the soybean crop story. 90 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 5: Problem combines tractor. 91 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:47,440 Speaker 2: Anything, right, right, and this doesn't necessarily have to be emission. 92 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:50,160 Speaker 2: Just to backtrack a quick second, right, I think one 93 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:52,080 Speaker 2: of the stories you told me was that the air 94 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:56,400 Speaker 2: conditioning cut out and it got it got real hot 95 00:04:56,440 --> 00:04:58,559 Speaker 2: in the cab because you're out there in the middle 96 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 2: of well, this was the three one hundred acre portion 97 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:04,279 Speaker 2: of the four thousand acre farm, and you're trying to, 98 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:08,360 Speaker 2: you know, do your farming thing. And now it's broken 99 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 2: in the middle of the field and it's yet bringing in. 100 00:05:10,680 --> 00:05:12,360 Speaker 2: It will be four weeks before we look at it. 101 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 5: Well, So that was interesting because that was part of 102 00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:21,279 Speaker 5: my retribution from my dealership for speaking out. I had 103 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 5: a couple of agricultural journalists on hand, and my compressor 104 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:28,200 Speaker 5: had quit in my tractor, so I couldn't there was 105 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 5: no air conditioning. So since John Deere has consolidated all 106 00:05:32,040 --> 00:05:34,000 Speaker 5: of their dealership networks and made a lot of this 107 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:37,960 Speaker 5: information proprietary, there's a lot less options for repair. So 108 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:41,480 Speaker 5: when I have something fail, you know, like a compressor, 109 00:05:41,560 --> 00:05:45,280 Speaker 5: I don't have any recycling capability to extract the coolant 110 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 5: from the AC system, and there's not a lot of 111 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:50,360 Speaker 5: independent mechanics out there, so I'm forced to rely on 112 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:52,960 Speaker 5: my dealership for that. And so when I called in, 113 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:55,919 Speaker 5: the guy at the dealership made me speak to the 114 00:05:55,960 --> 00:06:00,279 Speaker 5: store manager, who threatened not to repair my tractor. Said, 115 00:06:00,320 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 5: you know, you've been causing quite a few issues with us. 116 00:06:02,800 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 5: I had just testified, you know, in the Missouri House 117 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:08,559 Speaker 5: on behalf of a Riker repair bill, and the same 118 00:06:08,600 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 5: manager had tried to hire a couple of my employees 119 00:06:11,960 --> 00:06:14,200 Speaker 5: away from me while they were at the store buying 120 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 5: proprietary parts for this stuff. So my advocacy has certainly 121 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:20,919 Speaker 5: came at a cost, and you know, even if it 122 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:23,000 Speaker 5: is something that we can repair. And by the way, 123 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 5: Jamie Hyman is the chief technology officer of John Deere. 124 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:30,560 Speaker 5: He did an interview with Verge magazine twenty seventeen or 125 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:32,440 Speaker 5: twenty eighteen, I think it might have been later than that, 126 00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:35,000 Speaker 5: and he stated that, you know, farmers can already make 127 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 5: ninety eight percent of the repairs on their own equipment. 128 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:40,200 Speaker 5: And we found, you know, in court filings, and these 129 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:43,279 Speaker 5: are publicly available that John Deere claims that it would 130 00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 5: take them thousands of hours for their engineering teams to 131 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:50,000 Speaker 5: figure out what repairs within their network can only be 132 00:06:50,080 --> 00:06:53,200 Speaker 5: performed by dealers and what can be performed by farmers. 133 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:56,159 Speaker 5: So John Deeer's claiming that they don't even know. So 134 00:06:56,400 --> 00:06:59,320 Speaker 5: the reality is that there's probably a significant number of 135 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,160 Speaker 5: these repairs that that you can't make. But back to 136 00:07:02,240 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 5: this air conditioning thing. Even if this is something that 137 00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 5: I could do, which I mean, I could have pulled 138 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 5: the compressor, put a new compressor on, pulled the vacuum 139 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 5: and put coolan in the or put refrigerate in the system, right, 140 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 5: I could have done that. Sure, anything anything trapped in 141 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,640 Speaker 5: the system. I didn't have a recycling uh you know, 142 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 5: device to to store that. So and those are really 143 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:24,200 Speaker 5: expensive systems, right, So, uh, there's a limited number of 144 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 5: people who can do that, and even less because of 145 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:30,760 Speaker 5: this this highly monopolized business model that John Deere has 146 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:34,280 Speaker 5: invested in that has really called the independent mechanics out 147 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 5: in the countryside with the know how or the infrastructure 148 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 5: to do some of these repairs. 149 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 2: So let's just play this back a second. Now, you're 150 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,480 Speaker 2: you're you're you're combine tractor or whatever. The big green thing. 151 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:48,440 Speaker 2: There was a lot of money that you know, keeps 152 00:07:48,480 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 2: the crops coming breaks down in the middle of three 153 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:54,880 Speaker 2: hundred acres if it if it doesn't move in the 154 00:07:54,920 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 2: case of the ac it would move, but in the 155 00:07:56,880 --> 00:08:00,800 Speaker 2: case of a mechanical breakdown, and it's four weeks to 156 00:08:00,840 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 2: get it to the dealership because they can't look at 157 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:06,840 Speaker 2: it till then. And just like an automobile, manufacturers have 158 00:08:06,960 --> 00:08:10,559 Speaker 2: made a proprietary that you know, the local John Deere 159 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:15,400 Speaker 2: independent repair shop can't work on it necessarily. How do 160 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:16,720 Speaker 2: you get it out of the middle of the three 161 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 2: hundred acres without removing you know, if we tow it out, 162 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:22,640 Speaker 2: don't we ruin part of the crops. 163 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:27,360 Speaker 5: Sometimes that happens. Yeah, you're you're generally not really worried 164 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:29,520 Speaker 5: about running over crops. If it gets to the point 165 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 5: where you've got to extract the machine from the field 166 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:35,040 Speaker 5: because it doesn't have any hydraulic power or there's an 167 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:40,120 Speaker 5: electronic issue. You know, there's procedures for taking steering cylinders loose, 168 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 5: and you know, attaching another hydraulic pump to be able 169 00:08:44,040 --> 00:08:46,480 Speaker 5: to get an articulated tractor to move, you've got to 170 00:08:46,480 --> 00:08:48,520 Speaker 5: toe it. I mean, there's a you know, it takes 171 00:08:48,559 --> 00:08:50,760 Speaker 5: half a day sometimes to get one of these machines 172 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 5: loaded up on a semi and extracted from a field 173 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 5: when they go down. So always trying to do field 174 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:58,720 Speaker 5: repairs if you can to get it, to get it, 175 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 5: you know, movable. But some times that just it's not enough, 176 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 5: especially if you have to you know, overhaul a major 177 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:06,960 Speaker 5: component or something. It's just too big to do some 178 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:08,080 Speaker 5: of that stuff out in the field. 179 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:11,480 Speaker 2: Jared, is this a Jared Wilson problem, you know, Jared 180 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:15,760 Speaker 2: Wilson's farm, Missouri Way Or are farmers across the country 181 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 2: going through this? 182 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:21,200 Speaker 5: No, Yeah, it's it's endemic. You know. The FTC is 183 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:24,120 Speaker 5: also filed suit in this matter with attorneys general from 184 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:27,880 Speaker 5: several states. They had tons of comments come in from 185 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:31,160 Speaker 5: farmers regarding this issue. We've got, you know, over a 186 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 5: dozen people on this class action suit in federal court 187 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:38,240 Speaker 5: that I'm a part of. So no, and you know, 188 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 5: I have neighbors and see the trials and problems that 189 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 5: they have. But it's really complicated, and there's some really 190 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:48,480 Speaker 5: smart people that have set in their suits and boardrooms 191 00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:51,480 Speaker 5: and they thought about how to extract the most money 192 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:54,160 Speaker 5: out of consumers that they can. And so when you 193 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:57,800 Speaker 5: talk about the complexity of this. It really takes some 194 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:00,959 Speaker 5: attention and some research to figure out because the problem 195 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:04,199 Speaker 5: is it's not a surface level thing. And one of 196 00:10:04,240 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 5: the things that I've noticed is that people say, well, 197 00:10:07,120 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 5: just buy a different brand, right. Well, the truth is, 198 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,839 Speaker 5: at the scale that I'm doing things, there's only three 199 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 5: manufacturers in the country that make the products that I need, 200 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,800 Speaker 5: and that's John Deere, ad Co and c Inach Industrial. 201 00:10:19,600 --> 00:10:23,320 Speaker 5: And it's a classic oligopoly. John Deeer has by far 202 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:26,880 Speaker 5: the highest market share of this equipment in North America, 203 00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:31,280 Speaker 5: and these other companies, rather than expand their repair policies 204 00:10:31,280 --> 00:10:35,079 Speaker 5: to try to gain market share, seem content to adopt 205 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 5: and mirror the oligopoly leader John Deear's market practices and 206 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 5: extract money in the same way because apparently they think 207 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:46,080 Speaker 5: that's more profitable for them for gaining market share. And 208 00:10:46,360 --> 00:10:48,200 Speaker 5: you know, it's really hard for somebody to wake up 209 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,080 Speaker 5: and say, well, I'm going to start an agricultural company 210 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:53,959 Speaker 5: to build equipment and compete with these people, because the 211 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:57,120 Speaker 5: barriers the entry are just so high, not only in 212 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:00,360 Speaker 5: creating the factory to build the machines, but also in 213 00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:04,040 Speaker 5: creating the network of dealerships to sell and supply carts. 214 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 2: It would be like creating a car company, like like 215 00:11:09,559 --> 00:11:11,880 Speaker 2: Tucker right back in the forties, just trying to come 216 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:14,120 Speaker 2: up with his own brand of cars and owned plants 217 00:11:14,160 --> 00:11:17,480 Speaker 2: and uh, you know, to bring an independent car to market. Hey, 218 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:19,920 Speaker 2: we're talking with Jared Wilson. He's a farmer out of Missouri, 219 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:22,080 Speaker 2: and we're talking about the Right to Repair in some 220 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:25,640 Speaker 2: of the problems that have extended into Jared's life as 221 00:11:25,679 --> 00:11:28,320 Speaker 2: a result of, you know, lack of being able to 222 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 2: fix the equipment he uses to harvest this crop. I'm 223 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 2: run an Ady in the car Doctor. We'll be back 224 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:32,840 Speaker 2: right after this. 225 00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:43,160 Speaker 4: Don't go anywhere, that's right. 226 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 5: If you call and we're not live, you can leave 227 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:47,120 Speaker 5: a message and we'll call you back to get you 228 00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:50,079 Speaker 5: on the air with Ron eight five five five six 229 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:53,559 Speaker 5: zero nine nine zero zero. Speaking of Ron here, he. 230 00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:55,480 Speaker 2: Is run an Ady in the Car Doctor. Here, we're 231 00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:58,080 Speaker 2: talking with Jared Wilson. He's a farmer out of Missouri, 232 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 2: recently in the news with about the Right to Repair 233 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:03,240 Speaker 2: Act and how it's affecting him and everybody, all his 234 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:05,880 Speaker 2: farmers around him and across the country with regard to 235 00:12:05,920 --> 00:12:09,400 Speaker 2: their tractors and combines and it's it's issues like this. Jared, 236 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:11,840 Speaker 2: thanks for sticking with me during the break. You know, 237 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:17,520 Speaker 2: you recently had your combine John Deere tractor, i'll call 238 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:20,960 Speaker 2: it break down in the middle of a soybean harvest, 239 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:24,480 Speaker 2: right three hundred acres of soybean crop that you were harvesting, 240 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:26,959 Speaker 2: and tell us that story, you know, because because now 241 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:29,920 Speaker 2: this is becoming it's not just hey my tractor broke. 242 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 2: Now it's I'm losing the crop and I can't feed 243 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:34,520 Speaker 2: America anymore. 244 00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:36,240 Speaker 4: That's a problem. 245 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:36,679 Speaker 3: Yeah. 246 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,719 Speaker 5: No, I had over three Holland acres of soybeans at 247 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 5: that point. We just we just switched over from corn 248 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:46,080 Speaker 5: to soybeans. My machine wasn't running properly. My combine. So 249 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:48,160 Speaker 5: this is a big five hundred and forty three horse 250 00:12:48,200 --> 00:12:50,640 Speaker 5: combine with a forty five foot draper head on it 251 00:12:50,679 --> 00:12:53,880 Speaker 5: that you harvest soybeans with. And I didn't get any 252 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:56,600 Speaker 5: error codes to start it. Just the machine didn't have 253 00:12:56,720 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 5: the power that it should. So I turned it off 254 00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 5: and on against several times because it turns out that works. 255 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:06,040 Speaker 5: And finally I got it to give me a code 256 00:13:06,040 --> 00:13:08,600 Speaker 5: that said I was de rated and the delta pressure 257 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 5: sensor needed attention. So you know, on the emissions of 258 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:14,960 Speaker 5: these you have a couple delta pressure sensors that show 259 00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:18,840 Speaker 5: the differences in pressure on the exhaust whenever it's performing 260 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 5: regenerations on the soot canister. So, long story short, we 261 00:13:26,760 --> 00:13:29,120 Speaker 5: called John Dear said, you know, do we just replace 262 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:32,320 Speaker 5: the sensor. Yeah, you can do that, So we did, 263 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 5: but they didn't realize there were two sensors on it, 264 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 5: so we had to drive like two hours to get 265 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:40,800 Speaker 5: the second sensor. That didn't solve the problem. Then it's 266 00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:42,680 Speaker 5: out of my hands. Those are about the only things 267 00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 5: I could do without a John Deere dealer. So the 268 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 5: dealer came out and there was something called a PIT, 269 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:51,959 Speaker 5: which is a product improvement program, And essentially these machines 270 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 5: all have flaws when they come out from the factory, 271 00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:58,120 Speaker 5: and as you know, customers run these machines. John Gear 272 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 5: is able to see flaws across a product line and 273 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:04,559 Speaker 5: in some cases, rather than issuing in general recall, they'll 274 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:07,559 Speaker 5: issue what's called a fixes fail PIT, And what that 275 00:14:07,600 --> 00:14:10,480 Speaker 5: means is you don't get it fixed until you're out 276 00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:12,719 Speaker 5: in the field and it fails on you. And they 277 00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:15,720 Speaker 5: don't tell you about these until the pips are completed. 278 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 5: I've tried to ask my local dealership about what potential 279 00:14:18,960 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 5: pips are on my machines, just so I can get 280 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:24,240 Speaker 5: a head start, you know, in off season work, and 281 00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:27,880 Speaker 5: they won't tell you what those are. So the PIPS 282 00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 5: said that my ECU might be bad, the engine control unit. 283 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:33,760 Speaker 5: So the technician took four he took It took three 284 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 5: or four days for an ECU to come in for 285 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,320 Speaker 5: the technician to come out and put on the machine. 286 00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:41,479 Speaker 5: I could have physically put the ECU on the machine, 287 00:14:41,680 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 5: but he had to upload the payload file the software. 288 00:14:44,680 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 2: Right, you can't flash it standing in the middle of 289 00:14:47,120 --> 00:14:48,600 Speaker 2: a field. You don't have the tool it. 290 00:14:49,120 --> 00:14:51,560 Speaker 5: Yeah, exactly, well I can't. I can't do it at all. 291 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 5: I don't have the tooling in any place. Only the 292 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:57,560 Speaker 5: dealership technician does. So he flashes the ECU and it's 293 00:14:57,600 --> 00:15:02,320 Speaker 5: not that wasn't the problem. The next thing in his toolkit, 294 00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,000 Speaker 5: his dichotomy tree of the diagnostic software he was using, 295 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 5: was to put a new exhaust gas for circulation valve 296 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:11,720 Speaker 5: on it, which he did, and then he had to 297 00:15:11,720 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 5: flash the ECU again because that's you know, that's a 298 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:17,120 Speaker 5: part that you have to pair with the ECU, I guess, 299 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 5: and that fixed the problem. And so this is just 300 00:15:21,960 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 5: an intersection of so many things. Michael Reagan, the former 301 00:15:25,920 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 5: administrator for the EPA, said to the National Farmers Union 302 00:15:29,760 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 5: in a letter in twenty twenty three. But according to 303 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:35,160 Speaker 5: the Clean Air Act, manufacturers are supposed to provide us 304 00:15:35,240 --> 00:15:39,240 Speaker 5: all of the diagnostic software and tools necessary to fix 305 00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 5: the emissions systems on these machines, because what happens if 306 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 5: you don't allow people to fix them, well, you had 307 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:48,600 Speaker 5: delete them. And I'm tempted to delete mind, because it 308 00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 5: took four days to get this thing fixed and I 309 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:54,120 Speaker 5: couldn't do anything about it. And so what that means 310 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 5: is that as my soybean pods were drying out, I 311 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 5: had pods just opening and being shattering and falling on 312 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 5: the ground and there's there's no way to get that 313 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:07,400 Speaker 5: product back. So the cost to me was tremendous. And 314 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:10,240 Speaker 5: even knowing that there was a pip out regarding the 315 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:14,520 Speaker 5: engine controller. Luckily, mine isn't the components that failed on me. 316 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 5: But I've got to wonder how many people that did 317 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 5: fail on and what the time was for them to 318 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 5: get that part fixed out in the field that no 319 00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:25,200 Speaker 5: one had told them was a potential failure point. And 320 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,760 Speaker 5: what was it? Was it a manufacturing defect, was it 321 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:31,560 Speaker 5: a software defect. We're not getting any explanations from the 322 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 5: manufacturers or third parties that get to evaluate some of 323 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 5: these problems. And you know, the manufacturer is a bad actor, 324 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 5: and they don't really care because they get to make 325 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:43,760 Speaker 5: more money repairing this stuff than if they came up 326 00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:46,320 Speaker 5: and figured out what the actual cause of some of 327 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:48,000 Speaker 5: these problems were trying. 328 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:50,280 Speaker 2: Or trying or trying to fix this stuff, which it 329 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:51,920 Speaker 2: doesn't sound like they're doing too well. 330 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 5: No, that's exactly right. And you know, the time it 331 00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:58,560 Speaker 5: takes to do this is enormous, and the economic loss 332 00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:01,320 Speaker 5: is enormous, and I lose money, me and John gar profits. 333 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:03,680 Speaker 5: And there's so many scenarios where that's true. 334 00:17:03,800 --> 00:17:06,119 Speaker 2: You know, Jared, we're talking with Jared Wilson, he's a 335 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:09,600 Speaker 2: farmer at in Missouri. We're talking about the right to repair. Okay, Jared, 336 00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:11,440 Speaker 2: So when we come back, I want to talk about 337 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 2: a couple of things. Number One, I want to do 338 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:16,360 Speaker 2: a little bit of a deeper dive into the economics 339 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 2: of all this because I think what everybody has to 340 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:24,880 Speaker 2: understand is you know, when your tractor is down and 341 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 2: you know you're not harvesting your crops, there's an economic 342 00:17:29,359 --> 00:17:32,320 Speaker 2: loss on your side, all right. And that's on top 343 00:17:32,400 --> 00:17:35,680 Speaker 2: of yeah, the mechanical loss of the tractor, the cost 344 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,800 Speaker 2: to repair the tractor and what that takes. That's that's 345 00:17:38,920 --> 00:17:41,840 Speaker 2: number one. And then number two if the tractor is 346 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:43,919 Speaker 2: laid up tied up for too long a period of 347 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:45,439 Speaker 2: time and they have to come out and get it, 348 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:47,880 Speaker 2: the amount of crops that get ruined in the course 349 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 2: of the field. And then you know, number three I'm 350 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 2: thinking about, you know, if I lose a piece of 351 00:17:52,800 --> 00:17:55,920 Speaker 2: equipment in the shop, what do I do next when 352 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:58,480 Speaker 2: I need it the next day? And the subsequent losses 353 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:00,600 Speaker 2: of dat occur. So there's a lot of economic impact 354 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:02,600 Speaker 2: here that I want to cover and talk about. We'll 355 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 2: do that on the return on Ronini and the card 356 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:07,240 Speaker 2: Ockera here with Jared Wilson, and we'll both return right 357 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:21,600 Speaker 2: after this. Don't go anyere. Having a great conversation this 358 00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:23,919 Speaker 2: hour with Jared Wilson. He's a farm from Missouri, is 359 00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:27,240 Speaker 2: involved in the National Right to Repair as it applies 360 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:31,560 Speaker 2: to tractors, combines, you know, the agricultural equipment that we 361 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:33,679 Speaker 2: we Americans, we get, we get to eat because of 362 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:37,320 Speaker 2: gentlemen like this Jared. When we pulled away, we were 363 00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 2: getting into the economics of this right you've had. You 364 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 2: were telling us about a couple of instances where you know, 365 00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:45,720 Speaker 2: your combine, your tract or your various equipment breaks down 366 00:18:45,720 --> 00:18:49,680 Speaker 2: and it takes it takes hours, days, sometimes longer. Sometimes 367 00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:50,720 Speaker 2: you've lost crops. 368 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:51,560 Speaker 4: You've had a. 369 00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 2: Big economic impact. That economic impact that affects us. I mean, 370 00:18:57,359 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 2: it affects you obviously firsthand, but that kind of wheedles 371 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,920 Speaker 2: down to the American taxpayer right because of the lack 372 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:06,159 Speaker 2: of right to repair support for farmers. How is that 373 00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:07,640 Speaker 2: affecting you and then us? 374 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 5: Well, I mean, at my level, I'm trying to at 375 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 5: least break even every year. Would we'd like to do 376 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:17,840 Speaker 5: more than that, but sometimes it doesn't work out that way. 377 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:21,359 Speaker 5: And you know, the American people is invested in the 378 00:19:21,400 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 5: American farmer continuing to produce a crop every year. And 379 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,000 Speaker 5: one of the biggest things that we do as a 380 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 5: country is the Federal Crop Insurance program. So we have 381 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:36,440 Speaker 5: these insurance companies that provide crop insurance to farmers for 382 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 5: a variety of road crops. And you know what that 383 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:43,439 Speaker 5: does is it spreads risk. So you know, if we 384 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:48,399 Speaker 5: have people that are planting in Missouri and Iowa and Illinois, 385 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:52,040 Speaker 5: maybe people and some of those more marginal plots of 386 00:19:52,119 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 5: ground wouldn't be planting there if we didn't have an 387 00:19:55,400 --> 00:19:58,520 Speaker 5: insurance program backing them. And you say, well, you know, 388 00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 5: is that good for the American public? And I would 389 00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:03,719 Speaker 5: say that it is because we have so many different 390 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:06,760 Speaker 5: factors that can you know, cause a loss of a harvest, 391 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:09,200 Speaker 5: and so we want to spread production wherever we can 392 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:12,480 Speaker 5: throughout the country. But in the end, if I'm not profitable, 393 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:16,280 Speaker 5: the American taxpayer is you know, still paying some of 394 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:20,000 Speaker 5: those subsidy dollars into the into these insurance programs. For me, 395 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:23,840 Speaker 5: we get direct direct payment assistance if we have a 396 00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:26,639 Speaker 5: disaster year where it's clear that we had, you know, 397 00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:30,720 Speaker 5: a regional event where everyone didn't make any money, and 398 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:34,160 Speaker 5: the taxpayer's paying for that, you know, billions of dollars 399 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:36,920 Speaker 5: a year, sometimes thirty forty billion dollars. 400 00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:40,520 Speaker 2: And so wait a minute, so you're telling me, and 401 00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 2: I'm just going to paint the scenario here. Your tractor 402 00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 2: breaks down. Your tractor broke down in the middle of 403 00:20:45,560 --> 00:20:49,320 Speaker 2: the three thousand acres of soybeans, right, and you couldn't 404 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 2: You couldn't get it fixed quick enough, and it took 405 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:55,560 Speaker 2: a while as a result of lack of right to 406 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 2: repair as a lack as a result of you not 407 00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 2: getting the proper information the way an independent repair shop. 408 00:21:02,119 --> 00:21:05,199 Speaker 2: I'm thinking about this listening to you talk. I as 409 00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:07,560 Speaker 2: an independent repair shop, I think I have access to 410 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:09,000 Speaker 2: more repair information than you do. 411 00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:13,280 Speaker 5: I'm certain you do for the things that you work on. 412 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:15,520 Speaker 5: I mean, at any price point, I can't get the 413 00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:17,320 Speaker 5: software for my machines. 414 00:21:17,119 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 2: Right, So you the guy who's feeding me, to be 415 00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:25,879 Speaker 2: as direct as I can for the guy who's feeding 416 00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:29,199 Speaker 2: me and everybody else. You can't fix your tractor. You 417 00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:31,840 Speaker 2: have a bad year financially because of the lack of 418 00:21:31,960 --> 00:21:34,800 Speaker 2: right to repair. Correct me where I'm wrong. I'm just 419 00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:38,720 Speaker 2: trying to understand this and make everybody aware where you 420 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,400 Speaker 2: can't feed me. You have a bad year. That's costing 421 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:46,520 Speaker 2: me the American taxpayer more money, right it is. 422 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:51,000 Speaker 5: And you know the companies that are maintaining this equipment, 423 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:54,000 Speaker 5: they're getting to make even more repair dollars on the 424 00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:56,120 Speaker 5: back end of that, and they get to keep their 425 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:59,760 Speaker 5: prices high because I'm receiving subsidy money that keeps me going, 426 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,679 Speaker 5: and so it justifies this high price and high costs 427 00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:06,399 Speaker 5: for all of these repair tools that they're selling me. 428 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:09,560 Speaker 5: So it's just a big it's a scam, that is 429 00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:12,560 Speaker 5: what it is, right, and no one is looking into 430 00:22:12,600 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 5: it or doing anything about it. I mean, we've got 431 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,400 Speaker 5: several cases in the federal courts now, but those take years, 432 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 5: and we really need legislation that enshrine some of these 433 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:25,240 Speaker 5: rights in law and deals with these thorny, you know, 434 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:28,520 Speaker 5: copyright arguments that are going to take some doing and 435 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 5: they're going to take some legislation to sort this stuff out. 436 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:36,400 Speaker 2: So this is actually a monopoly, if you think about it. 437 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 5: Which is it? It is, and that's that's one of 438 00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:41,439 Speaker 5: the tenets of these lawsuits is that it's it's a 439 00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:46,680 Speaker 5: very direct monopoly on the repair of the agricultural equipment. 440 00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:49,679 Speaker 2: You know, And that's why you know, I, as an independent, 441 00:22:50,119 --> 00:22:52,399 Speaker 2: I'm supposed to and I do. Now for me, it 442 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 2: comes at a price, and it's it's more money than 443 00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:57,240 Speaker 2: I care to think about some days. But at least 444 00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 2: I have access to the software to the OE software 445 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,119 Speaker 2: where to the manufacturer software to be able to repair 446 00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:06,880 Speaker 2: these vehicles. And you know, the service information, it's out there, 447 00:23:06,960 --> 00:23:09,639 Speaker 2: it's been made available to me, and now it becomes 448 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:13,440 Speaker 2: a business decision. But I mean, I don't necessarily see 449 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:18,719 Speaker 2: Jared Wilson farmer becoming his own repair shop. But you know, 450 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:22,240 Speaker 2: maybe there's a John Smith in is it Butler, Missouri? 451 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:23,800 Speaker 5: Yeah? 452 00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:26,879 Speaker 2: No, absolutely right, And maybe maybe John Smith becomes the 453 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:31,880 Speaker 2: independent John Deere tractor repair guy and he buys the 454 00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:34,959 Speaker 2: five thousand dollars scan tool and he buys the annual 455 00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:38,200 Speaker 2: software subscription just sort of like the same thing independent 456 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 2: repair shops do, but for farm equipment. And that's that's 457 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:44,400 Speaker 2: really what you guys are asking for, right to get 458 00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:46,359 Speaker 2: to that level, and you don't even have that. 459 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 5: No, we don't have that. And it comes with an 460 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,960 Speaker 5: onorous set of conditions when you think about it. I 461 00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 5: think it was in twenty twenty two or twenty twenty 462 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:58,639 Speaker 5: three when I don't know if you read about the 463 00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 5: Russians stolen a bunch of Ukrainian tractors when they invaded Ukraine, 464 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:08,400 Speaker 5: and John Deear actually remotely operated a kill switch and 465 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:12,120 Speaker 5: made those machines inoperable. Well, the reality is John Dear 466 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:14,919 Speaker 5: didn't know that those tractors were going to end up 467 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 5: in Russian hands when they produced them. But they had 468 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:20,400 Speaker 5: a kill switch on all of our machines that would 469 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:23,600 Speaker 5: enable them to remotely disconnect them. And so you can 470 00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:27,520 Speaker 5: think about the security implications of that. Who's monitoring John 471 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:30,119 Speaker 5: Deere's network security to make sure that a bad actor 472 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:34,120 Speaker 5: doesn't switch off all of our machines one, Well, yeah, 473 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:35,800 Speaker 5: what if they no external check them? 474 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:38,840 Speaker 2: What if they get hacked? I mean in twenty exactly 475 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:42,439 Speaker 2: in twenty sixteen, I think it was Chrysler got hacked. 476 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,000 Speaker 2: Two guys showed how you could hack a Chrysler, a 477 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:49,440 Speaker 2: Jeep Grand Cherokee and take over the actual operation of 478 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 2: the vehicle. And as a result, that's why now when 479 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:56,120 Speaker 2: I log into a Chrysler product, I have to have 480 00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 2: an authentication protocol where my scan tool shakes hands with 481 00:24:59,880 --> 00:25:03,600 Speaker 2: the cloud. The cloud recognizes that it's wrong and they 482 00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:05,359 Speaker 2: give me access to the vehicle to go in and 483 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 2: diagnose it. So, if Chrysler can get hacked, John Deer 484 00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:12,480 Speaker 2: can get hacked, and now we've got a bigger problem. 485 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:14,479 Speaker 2: You know, this is a matter of national security. I 486 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:16,159 Speaker 2: think my two cents. 487 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:19,679 Speaker 5: Well, the magnitude a bunch of Chrysler cars going offline 488 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:23,200 Speaker 5: is pretty indescribable, But the magnitude of what we grow 489 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,760 Speaker 5: our food with going offline at the wrong time of 490 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,400 Speaker 5: year is catastrophic to think about. 491 00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:32,359 Speaker 2: You know, it's it's it is catastrophic. You are telling 492 00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:33,680 Speaker 2: me a story and I don't know if we'll finish 493 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:36,080 Speaker 2: it in this segment, Jared, So watch the clock. But 494 00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:38,480 Speaker 2: you were telling me a story beginning of the show 495 00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,040 Speaker 2: about I'm going to use the wrong words, So the 496 00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:47,159 Speaker 2: cow thing, right, I want everybody to understand what it 497 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:52,800 Speaker 2: is that Jared Wilson does. So Jared does he's the 498 00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 2: first guy in the line of producing a cow where 499 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,480 Speaker 2: we can get stakes from. Is that a fair statement. 500 00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 5: Yeah, So, I mean we have cows or heifers that 501 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,639 Speaker 5: get bread to bulls, and then they'll have calves, and 502 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 5: then those calves whenever they're weaned, you know, from the 503 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:11,760 Speaker 5: mama cows, they'll go to either a backgrounder to put 504 00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:15,119 Speaker 5: weight on on you know, the front hill grasslands, or 505 00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:17,359 Speaker 5: they may go straight to a finishing yard. You know, 506 00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 5: think about a big confined animal feeding operation. Where they 507 00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:24,320 Speaker 5: get fed out and then eventually slaughtered. So I'm the 508 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:27,159 Speaker 5: guy that breeds the cows or the heippers and then 509 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:29,720 Speaker 5: has the calves that go on down the production line. 510 00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:34,160 Speaker 2: So if you go out of business, we're not getting 511 00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:37,600 Speaker 2: vegetables and we're not getting steak in its simple ast form. 512 00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 5: Yeah right, Or you know, we have continued consolidation within 513 00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:47,679 Speaker 5: my market segment, and we just have bigger and bigger 514 00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,800 Speaker 5: farms with all of the known problems that that creates. 515 00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:53,680 Speaker 2: Right right, Hey, Jared, We're gonna we're gonna pull over, 516 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:55,960 Speaker 2: take a pause. When we come back, we're going to 517 00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:57,560 Speaker 2: conclude and wrap all this up, and I want to 518 00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:59,639 Speaker 2: thank everybody for being staying with us this hour. I 519 00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:01,800 Speaker 2: know this is a different type of car doctor what 520 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:05,120 Speaker 2: you guys normally expect, but you know, the key here 521 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,399 Speaker 2: is right to repair for independent repair shops, right to 522 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:11,720 Speaker 2: repair for farmers. It is a critical thing and it's 523 00:27:11,720 --> 00:27:13,920 Speaker 2: a matter of national security, and we're just gonna finish 524 00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:15,880 Speaker 2: talking about that in our next segment. I'm running Naming 525 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:17,960 Speaker 2: of the Car Doctor. I'm here with Jared Wilson. He's 526 00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:20,239 Speaker 2: been very kind and generous with his time today, and 527 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:33,679 Speaker 2: we'll both return right after this don't go away closing 528 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 2: argument time run a naming the car doctor here with 529 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:39,199 Speaker 2: Jared Wilson or Missouri farmer right to repair as it 530 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:41,600 Speaker 2: affects farmers like him and everywhere else in this great 531 00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:44,119 Speaker 2: country of ours. Jared, I had a fuck. You know 532 00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:45,520 Speaker 2: how long you been a farmer? 533 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:48,879 Speaker 5: I pretty well my whole life. I mean, I started 534 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,000 Speaker 5: writing on the tractor when I was two or three 535 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:54,680 Speaker 5: years old, and I first remember driving a tractor when 536 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,280 Speaker 5: I was ten or eleven. But for this NBC thing 537 00:27:57,280 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 5: we did, my mom got some old photographs out of 538 00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:01,879 Speaker 5: I was pictured in front of this big three hundred 539 00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:04,400 Speaker 5: and twenty five horse Steiger when I was like four 540 00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:06,439 Speaker 5: or five, and she said, a couple of years after that, 541 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:10,359 Speaker 5: I was actually running that tractors right, well, longer than 542 00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:10,879 Speaker 5: I remember. 543 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:14,760 Speaker 2: And how long has the family been, you know, farmers generation? 544 00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,120 Speaker 5: I've yeah, at least five. I'm at least the fifth generation. 545 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 2: Wow, that's crazy. That goes back to the mid eighteen hundreds. 546 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:28,679 Speaker 5: Longer than that, No, probably late eighteen hundreds into the 547 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,879 Speaker 5: early twentieth century, but it could have been before that. 548 00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:34,920 Speaker 5: But that's just all I've got any records or family 549 00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 5: you know, word of mouth sport still. 550 00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:40,360 Speaker 2: A little further back than yesterday, you know, and they 551 00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:44,280 Speaker 2: didn't have half these problems, right, So you know, what 552 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:46,880 Speaker 2: can we tell the listeners in our closing couple of minutes, 553 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 2: you know, is it is is this just one guy 554 00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,640 Speaker 2: complaining or is this a real problem? 555 00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:56,080 Speaker 5: No, this is an endemic problem, and it's not just 556 00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 5: in my industry. But you can see how, you know, 557 00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:01,440 Speaker 5: think about a guy who gets up in a blizzard 558 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 5: to go feed his cattle lets the tractor doesn't work, 559 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,920 Speaker 5: and he can't fix his tractor, his cattle die, and 560 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,840 Speaker 5: that raises the price of your food at the grocery store. 561 00:29:09,920 --> 00:29:13,320 Speaker 5: So it affects him, it affects you. And you know, 562 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:15,240 Speaker 5: when it comes to our food, it's not the same 563 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:18,760 Speaker 5: thing as your iPhone dying. It's a different level of importance. 564 00:29:19,360 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 5: And I just want people to be aware of that. 565 00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:24,360 Speaker 5: But also your iPhone dying is important too, and we 566 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,840 Speaker 5: should just make it so that manufacturers are incentivized to 567 00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:30,040 Speaker 5: let us repair our own things, and maybe as a 568 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,120 Speaker 5: product of that, they'll make things more durable so they last. 569 00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:35,320 Speaker 2: You know how big of a problem this is the 570 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:40,880 Speaker 2: right to repair and well for Jared, I'm directing this 571 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 2: is Jared, and then I'm directing this at you, the listener. 572 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 2: I ask Jared, you know, normally we close our segments 573 00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 2: with where can the listeners go get information? And out 574 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,360 Speaker 2: of all the questions I've posed to Jared in our 575 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:55,080 Speaker 2: in our short two week relationship, here I'm culminating here 576 00:29:55,160 --> 00:30:00,000 Speaker 2: but not ending here, Jared said, there isn't one there. 577 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:04,920 Speaker 2: There isn't a website specifically geared to help the American 578 00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 2: farmer about right to repair. Now, there's there's there's one 579 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 2: for general right to repair. Right, there's there's a right 580 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:14,200 Speaker 2: to repair website. Is it right to repair dot org? 581 00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:14,720 Speaker 3: Well? 582 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:18,440 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I would direct people to iFixit dot com, 583 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:22,040 Speaker 5: the Electronic Frontier Foundation, or repair dot org. These are 584 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:23,840 Speaker 5: all really good groups, and I'm sure that there are 585 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 5: others out there, but you know, I know the three 586 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:28,920 Speaker 5: of those. And the reality is it costs money. It 587 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:32,080 Speaker 5: costs money to do these twelve oh one filings. It 588 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:37,320 Speaker 5: costs money to file against these big you know, multinational corporations. 589 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:40,479 Speaker 5: Everything in our society takes money. But hopefully we can 590 00:30:40,480 --> 00:30:44,040 Speaker 5: get some legislation pass that you know, can circumvent some 591 00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:46,520 Speaker 5: of that but they still have lots of lobbyists, and 592 00:30:46,600 --> 00:30:50,600 Speaker 5: so you know, calling your local elected representatives and officials, 593 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:55,080 Speaker 5: you know, proclaiming how you want right to repair legislation 594 00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:57,440 Speaker 5: passed is one of the most important things that you can. 595 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,440 Speaker 2: Do, because it's not just affecting cars, it's affecting everything. 596 00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:03,479 Speaker 2: It's affecting the food we eat, the cars we ride in, 597 00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,840 Speaker 2: as you say, our iPhones not being able to repair them. 598 00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 2: You know, it becomes it becomes a big issue. You 599 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:11,920 Speaker 2: buy a new tractor next year, Jared. 600 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 5: We don't buy a lot of new things here. 601 00:31:14,520 --> 00:31:17,000 Speaker 2: Well, well, a replacement tractor. 602 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:20,720 Speaker 5: I'm just no, things are not very good in this 603 00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:23,440 Speaker 5: pharm economy. So I think we're probably just gonna run 604 00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 5: what we have. 605 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:27,320 Speaker 2: What's a used combine cost these days? A new one 606 00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:28,960 Speaker 2: six hundred grand. You told me that. 607 00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:32,400 Speaker 5: Six to eight hundred. The big ones are over a million. 608 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 5: Could use one, it'd be three four hundred thousand dollars. 609 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:37,040 Speaker 2: So we're just going to go out and buy a 610 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:39,880 Speaker 2: used four hundred thousand dollar piece of equipment and try 611 00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:44,920 Speaker 2: and make it work with software and manufacturing information that 612 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:49,040 Speaker 2: you can't get access to to grow soybeans to feed 613 00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:50,000 Speaker 2: the American public. 614 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:52,360 Speaker 5: It gives you the warm food, doesn't it. 615 00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:54,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, I tell you what, God bless your brother. You're 616 00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:55,680 Speaker 2: doing a heck of a job. 617 00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:57,080 Speaker 5: You know. 618 00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:59,960 Speaker 2: I'm just curious for my own information, probably nothing to 619 00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:02,400 Speaker 2: do with this interview. What time does the average American 620 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:03,480 Speaker 2: farmer get up in the morning. 621 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:06,720 Speaker 5: I'd say it depends on what time of year, what 622 00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:10,720 Speaker 5: kind of farmer they are. I generally am up seven 623 00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:13,840 Speaker 5: eight o'clock, but sometimes I run late. Sometimes I'll run 624 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 5: till three or four in the morning if I'm in 625 00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:16,160 Speaker 5: the field. 626 00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:20,160 Speaker 2: Right right, Well, it's real dedication, Jared. It's been a pleasure, sir, 627 00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:23,400 Speaker 2: And uh, thanks a lot. You know, you'll we'll have 628 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 2: you back again, and you got to keep us updated 629 00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:26,880 Speaker 2: and let us know what's going on. But it's been 630 00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,560 Speaker 2: an absolute pleasure. Thank you for all you do. I'll 631 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:31,360 Speaker 2: ron An Ady and the car doctor. We are back 632 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:44,320 Speaker 2: right after this, and of course, once again I want 633 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:46,320 Speaker 2: to say thank you to my special guests this hour, 634 00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:49,480 Speaker 2: Jared Wilson. You know there's there's a man right he's 635 00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:51,440 Speaker 2: out there plowing the fields every day, trying to make 636 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:53,280 Speaker 2: a living and feed us and take care of us. 637 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,760 Speaker 2: Like so many of the other American farmers, and yet 638 00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:01,240 Speaker 2: they can't. They're six hundred one thousand or four hundred 639 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,400 Speaker 2: thousand used or three hundred thousand used, whatever breaks, and 640 00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:08,280 Speaker 2: they can't get support from a manufacturer. And you know, 641 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 2: they have to either leave it out in the field 642 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:13,560 Speaker 2: and hope somebody shows up to fix it, or they've 643 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 2: got to get it out of the field and take 644 00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:17,400 Speaker 2: it somewhere. And I can tell you from the pre 645 00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:19,480 Speaker 2: interview conversation I had with Jared, you know, we're not 646 00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:21,920 Speaker 2: talking about towing it out of the field on the 647 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,560 Speaker 2: back of a flatbed. We're talking about, as he said it, 648 00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:26,160 Speaker 2: I believe he said it in the interview, that it's 649 00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:27,800 Speaker 2: you know, it can be a half a day thing 650 00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:31,480 Speaker 2: to get a vehicle out of the field and take 651 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,240 Speaker 2: it somewhere. And then taking it somewhere it could be 652 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:36,000 Speaker 2: a half hour away, it could be an hour away. 653 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,120 Speaker 2: It's not it's not like they're local. It's not that 654 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 2: it's it's so quick and easy, and then they don't 655 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 2: even look at it for another two or three weeks 656 00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:45,720 Speaker 2: or four weeks, or you know, whatever mood besets them. 657 00:33:45,760 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 2: Because it doesn't sound like Jared's too popular with John 658 00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:52,520 Speaker 2: Deer folks anyway, unfortunately for him. So there's a guy 659 00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:54,400 Speaker 2: who's baring the brunt. By the way, I should also 660 00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:56,440 Speaker 2: say that, you know, if John Deere wants John Deere 661 00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,920 Speaker 2: is welcome to come on board. I'd like to hear 662 00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:00,760 Speaker 2: their side of it. I'm sure the listener would like 663 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 2: to hear their side of it too, But I don't 664 00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:04,320 Speaker 2: think there's a big case for them to stand on here. 665 00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:08,520 Speaker 2: You know, it's a monopoly being created. It is in 666 00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:11,960 Speaker 2: violation of right to repair. From my perspective as a mechanic, 667 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,040 Speaker 2: having dealt with right to repair for so many years, 668 00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:17,080 Speaker 2: that you can't do what they're doing. You're making it. 669 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:21,360 Speaker 2: You're making it difficult, if not impossible, for something that 670 00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,320 Speaker 2: you want to be serviced and taking care of. So anyway, 671 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:27,240 Speaker 2: I appreciate everybody's time this hour. I appreciate your patience 672 00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:29,600 Speaker 2: and a little different kind of a car doctor. Next 673 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:31,799 Speaker 2: week we'll go back to the usual stuff, the phone calls, 674 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,839 Speaker 2: the questions, the comments. But till then, as always, I'm 675 00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 2: here for you. I am Ron and Andy and the 676 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:39,040 Speaker 2: car doctor, reminding each and every one of you good 677 00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:41,800 Speaker 2: mechanics aren't expensive, they're priceless. 678 00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:49,799 Speaker 4: See it