1 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:10,400 Speaker 1: Hi, and welcome back to the Carol Markowitz Show. On iHeartRadio. 2 00:00:10,760 --> 00:00:15,400 Speaker 1: Last episode, I talked about taking advice from people who 3 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 1: don't know what they're talking about. The example that I 4 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:23,800 Speaker 1: used was this perpetually single young woman on the Internet 5 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: who offers advice about relationships to men. She has no 6 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:33,640 Speaker 1: idea about anything, not even the basics, and I don't 7 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:38,080 Speaker 1: recommend listening to her. I was thinking about this as 8 00:00:38,360 --> 00:00:42,440 Speaker 1: Greta Thunberg hit the news again. Greta, of course, is 9 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:46,120 Speaker 1: the Swedish girl who quit school to travel around the 10 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 1: world and lecture us about climate change, and now she's 11 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:54,320 Speaker 1: on to the latest cause, the Warren Gaza, and she's 12 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: wearing a cafea and protesting a Jewish singer performing at 13 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:03,880 Speaker 1: the Eurovision Company Titian in Malmo. Greta had this childlike 14 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 1: understanding of the environment. She had these insane demands like 15 00:01:08,840 --> 00:01:12,600 Speaker 1: end oil, you know, which would have caused hardship and 16 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 1: poverty and pain for people all over the world, and 17 00:01:16,319 --> 00:01:20,600 Speaker 1: yet she was taken seriously. And now she's on to 18 00:01:21,120 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 1: anti Israel demonstrations, which I'm also sure she knows nothing about. 19 00:01:27,959 --> 00:01:32,039 Speaker 1: She was turned into a child activist by adults and 20 00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:37,040 Speaker 1: now she's this empty adult going through the motions, tagging 21 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 1: on to whatever demonstration will have her. And part of it, 22 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:44,400 Speaker 1: I think is that we're drawn to atypical advice givers. 23 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,640 Speaker 1: Here's this little girl from Sweden telling us we need 24 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: to end oil, or here's this single woman on the 25 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 1: internet giving advice to men. This isn't a political show, 26 00:01:56,520 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: but it's important to be able to ignore ignorant voice 27 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:04,400 Speaker 1: is like Greta's, and societally we really failed to do that. 28 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:08,520 Speaker 1: I've mentioned on my Twitter, et cetera that for a 29 00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:11,079 Speaker 1: long time, and I actually mentioned this in my book 30 00:02:11,560 --> 00:02:15,240 Speaker 1: Stolen Youth as well. My son in first grade in 31 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:19,720 Speaker 1: school in Brooklyn when we lived there, had months where 32 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:21,639 Speaker 1: I would ask him what are you learning in school? 33 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:25,679 Speaker 1: And he'd come back and say Greta. And so societally 34 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 1: we failed to ignore her. We have failed to ignore 35 00:02:29,120 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 1: this ignorant voice. And I think that the personal changes 36 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 1: that we talk about on this show, like not listening 37 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:41,519 Speaker 1: to people who don't know anything, can translate to society 38 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 1: being better about this kind of thing too. If in 39 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: our own lives we know to dismiss people giving bad advice, 40 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:53,679 Speaker 1: maybe that can trickle down to our culture recognizing a 41 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: Greta when they next see her. Coming up next, an 42 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:59,639 Speaker 1: interview with Jordan Shaftel. Join us after the break. 43 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:06,720 Speaker 2: Welcome back to the Carol Marcowitz Show on iHeartRadio. My 44 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 2: guest today is Jordan Shackdal. Jordan is publisher of the 45 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:13,400 Speaker 2: Dossier on Substack. Hi, Jordan, so nice to have you. 46 00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 3: Hey, Carol, It's good to be here. Appreciate you having 47 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:16,640 Speaker 3: me on. 48 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 2: So, Jordan's also part of our Florida crew. 49 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:23,919 Speaker 4: And you also moved here from where did you move 50 00:03:23,919 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 4: here from? DC? 51 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:26,200 Speaker 3: Yeah? 52 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:29,680 Speaker 5: I was in d C for far too long. I 53 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:32,160 Speaker 5: went to graduate school there. I grew up in Jersey 54 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:37,040 Speaker 5: across from New York City and ended up in DC 55 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 5: for graduate school. Stayed for a while. You know, I 56 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:42,560 Speaker 5: had a pretty decent time until the COVID era and 57 00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 5: then all hell broke loose and I just couldn't take 58 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 5: it anymore. And you know, had a good network of 59 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:52,200 Speaker 5: friends and family down in Florida. So I was just 60 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,240 Speaker 5: you know, I think it was like somewhere around mid 61 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:57,400 Speaker 5: twenty twenty where I was just like I'm out of here, 62 00:03:57,520 --> 00:03:58,760 Speaker 5: like I've just got enough. 63 00:03:59,440 --> 00:04:00,880 Speaker 2: I don't think I I knew you got here mid 64 00:04:00,920 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 2: twenty twenty. That makes you one of the earlier people. 65 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 2: I mean, I think only John Cardillo beats you. 66 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:10,360 Speaker 4: Yeah, and David Reboy. Both of them were pre COVID. 67 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:10,960 Speaker 3: Yeah. 68 00:04:11,040 --> 00:04:15,640 Speaker 5: John is like the unofficial ambassador from Florida to the 69 00:04:15,760 --> 00:04:21,040 Speaker 5: United States, and Reboy is the Miami local who's been 70 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:21,800 Speaker 5: here for a while. 71 00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 4: Yeah, he's the mayor. 72 00:04:25,040 --> 00:04:29,280 Speaker 2: I definitely credit Reboy with some level of making me 73 00:04:29,360 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 2: consider Florida. 74 00:04:30,360 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 4: I mean, obviously there were larger. 75 00:04:32,640 --> 00:04:34,839 Speaker 2: Things at play, but he, you know, he definitely played 76 00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:37,839 Speaker 2: a role being the mayor of Miami and telling me 77 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:39,960 Speaker 2: how great my social life was going to be when 78 00:04:39,960 --> 00:04:43,279 Speaker 2: I got here. And you know, he wasn't wrong. But 79 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 2: I had John on here a few weeks ago and 80 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 2: we talked about how he came here for like sleepy Florida, 81 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:54,400 Speaker 2: and I don't feel like that's what we got at all, 82 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 2: do you think that? 83 00:04:57,640 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 3: Yeah? 84 00:04:57,960 --> 00:04:59,719 Speaker 5: You know, like I kind of like the mix that 85 00:04:59,760 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 5: we have in Florida. I grew up coming down here 86 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:06,280 Speaker 5: because you know, a lot of my family with snowbirds 87 00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 5: and those in the Northeast. 88 00:05:07,400 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 4: Can you understand that snowbirds to Florida weird? 89 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:15,799 Speaker 5: Yeah, there's a whole. There should be many books written 90 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:20,600 Speaker 5: about it. But basically, you know, you you spend the 91 00:05:20,720 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 5: winter months in Florida or at least have a place 92 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:26,440 Speaker 5: or rent a place for the holidays. But yeah, so 93 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:28,080 Speaker 5: I spend a lot of time in Florida growing up, 94 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:31,120 Speaker 5: and you're right, it was like old sleepy Florida, which 95 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:34,600 Speaker 5: I wasn't particularly fond of, but you know, now in 96 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 5: my mid thirties as as an old sleepy person, No, 97 00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:42,839 Speaker 5: but it was interesting because, like, you know, you you 98 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,000 Speaker 5: come to appreciate more of that stuff. 99 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 3: But also Florida is. 100 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:47,960 Speaker 5: So much more lively now than it used to be. 101 00:05:48,560 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 5: You know, even the architecture, the neighborhoods. It's just a 102 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:55,200 Speaker 5: whole different ballgame down here, and you know, I so 103 00:05:55,279 --> 00:05:59,000 Speaker 5: much appreciate that that it's not, you know, just the 104 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:02,039 Speaker 5: reputation that it used to have, just as like basically 105 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 5: Heaven's uh, you know, waiting room is definitely you know, 106 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:12,159 Speaker 5: there's still that element. But I think Florida is so 107 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 5: you know, diverse, the demographics now in a good way, 108 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:18,960 Speaker 5: and it's. 109 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 4: Like such a happening place. 110 00:06:20,040 --> 00:06:23,560 Speaker 2: I feel like everything is happening here and like people 111 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:24,880 Speaker 2: are constantly coming here. 112 00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:26,039 Speaker 4: I mean, I guess they always were. 113 00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 2: Florida was always a vacation destination, but now there's so 114 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 2: many events and like political stuff and like a lot 115 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 2: of our world plays out here. I think more than ever, 116 00:06:35,080 --> 00:06:37,160 Speaker 2: I I don't feel like I have to leave here 117 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:39,160 Speaker 2: to get the full experience. 118 00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 5: Yeah. Absolutely, Like, you know, I think about my time 119 00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 5: in d C, and you know, we had a lot 120 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:48,520 Speaker 5: of good times with fellow right leaning people down there, 121 00:06:48,839 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 5: but are up there? And I say down there because 122 00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:58,600 Speaker 5: I'm from New Jersey, so but it's you know, I 123 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 5: think back at like get togethers and whatnot. Basically everyone 124 00:07:02,120 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 5: has left, so you know, there's probably no cool get 125 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 5: togethers in DC anyway anymore, or if that applies, could 126 00:07:08,960 --> 00:07:09,360 Speaker 5: there be? 127 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:09,920 Speaker 4: Yeah? 128 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:15,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, gone, Yeah, I've never lived in DC, I mean briefly, 129 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:18,880 Speaker 2: like during an internship, But yeah, how could there possibly 130 00:07:18,880 --> 00:07:23,760 Speaker 2: be when everybody's in Florida exactly? So you published the 131 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:28,640 Speaker 2: Dot and you have a wide, wide following. What kind 132 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 2: of stuff do you cover in your subject? 133 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:34,280 Speaker 3: Yeah? So we basically cover everything. 134 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 5: And the only rule, you know, it's it's coming from 135 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:42,040 Speaker 5: a right of center conservative slash libertarian slash you know, 136 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 5: freedom oriented whatever you want to call it perspective. But 137 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:47,160 Speaker 5: you know, the only thing that I think that our 138 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 5: audience looks for consistently is the analysis or journalism needs 139 00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 5: to be independent. I'm trying to get away far as 140 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 5: far away from possible as possible from like the aggregation, 141 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:00,880 Speaker 5: the clickbait that you know, you see a story somewhere 142 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:02,520 Speaker 5: and you just kind of repeat it in your own 143 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:08,280 Speaker 5: words elsewhere. I did that when I was in you know, 144 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:10,720 Speaker 5: other parts of the right of center media. 145 00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 3: Working under you know, a big. 146 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 5: Company, not corporate media, but you know, kind of like 147 00:08:16,960 --> 00:08:19,680 Speaker 5: anti establishment media, and I found that kind of boring, 148 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 5: so I definitely didn't want to bring that work into 149 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:25,720 Speaker 5: my own publication. So I think that's what we try 150 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:27,960 Speaker 5: to do, is you know, we we try to give 151 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:33,040 Speaker 5: our audience a unique set of facts and circumstances on 152 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:37,079 Speaker 5: every story, or a unique perspective, and try to engage 153 00:08:37,520 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 5: with it from you know, our open bias. 154 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 2: So I feel like I started reading you early COVID, 155 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:47,319 Speaker 2: and you were one of the early voices, i mean 156 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:51,360 Speaker 2: against lockdowns and you know, later on against vaccines, but 157 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 2: the lockdown stuff specifically, how did you know, like what 158 00:08:56,520 --> 00:08:59,200 Speaker 2: made you think like this is the wrong path and 159 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:00,800 Speaker 2: we can be doing this. 160 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:01,680 Speaker 4: Because I have to admit. 161 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,440 Speaker 2: I mean I was like, I'm in April twenty twenty, 162 00:09:04,600 --> 00:09:07,640 Speaker 2: we shouldn't lock down anymore, which you know is considered early, 163 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:11,840 Speaker 2: but you were before that. So what made you kind 164 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:14,199 Speaker 2: of see the light earlier than everybody else? 165 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:18,040 Speaker 5: Yeah, I've kind of always had this like anti authority 166 00:09:18,080 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 5: streak from from not from like an antifa perspective, but 167 00:09:21,960 --> 00:09:25,760 Speaker 5: from a right wing perspective. So you know, super early on, 168 00:09:26,360 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 5: I remember because you know, I read the news every 169 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:29,800 Speaker 5: day and like that's what like a lot of people 170 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:32,520 Speaker 5: are our industry do, Like we're just reading all day 171 00:09:32,559 --> 00:09:35,440 Speaker 5: on the internet all day. I was going to social 172 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:39,320 Speaker 5: events with non political people and like in very early 173 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,319 Speaker 5: twenty twenty, like January February, and I was like wow, 174 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:43,880 Speaker 5: Like I was the one that was freaked out in 175 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:45,640 Speaker 5: the beginning because I was like, wow, I can't believe 176 00:09:45,679 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 5: this is going on, Like don't these people know that 177 00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:51,240 Speaker 5: all these scientists are saying these awful things? And then it, 178 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:55,400 Speaker 5: you know, the way the waves started coming to the US, 179 00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 5: and you know, the more and more reading I did, 180 00:09:57,760 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 5: the more and more I realized that like none of 181 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:03,800 Speaker 5: this was based in any evidentiary standard, and that what 182 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 5: happened basically was that there was this consensus formed I 183 00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 5: think among the academics and you know, science class in 184 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:16,440 Speaker 5: which it kind of like frowze so many people into 185 00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:19,520 Speaker 5: this state of like dysfunction and being afraid to say 186 00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 5: something because like, I think a lot of people were 187 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,760 Speaker 5: thinking what I was thinking, but they just weren't willing 188 00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:27,800 Speaker 5: to put themselves out there because of the repercussions, because 189 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:30,800 Speaker 5: of the group think, you know, very similar to any 190 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:33,440 Speaker 5: type of like you know, I cover foreign policy too 191 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:35,360 Speaker 5: a lot, and like how the right got caught so 192 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,760 Speaker 5: off guard with like a war like Iraq, or you know, 193 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:44,240 Speaker 5: finally agreeing that we needed to leave Afghanistan eventually. So 194 00:10:44,400 --> 00:10:46,560 Speaker 5: like that stuff is just hard. When there's so much 195 00:10:46,600 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 5: consensus among people who are your peers, you never really want. 196 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:53,080 Speaker 5: That's I think what one of the lessons of the 197 00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:57,040 Speaker 5: COVID hysteria era is that, you know, it's very difficult 198 00:10:57,120 --> 00:11:00,320 Speaker 5: to show to really truly be an end of kind 199 00:11:00,320 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 5: of thinker and to be outspoken about issues like that. 200 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 5: I think it's just it showed that human nature is 201 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:09,760 Speaker 5: kind of just like get along with the crowd, and 202 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 5: that really came to harm us during the COVID era. 203 00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:16,000 Speaker 2: It's interesting because I you know, I admit I was 204 00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:19,880 Speaker 2: for the Iraq War, and that was an extremely popular position. 205 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 2: But looking back at it, I think like the people 206 00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:26,680 Speaker 2: that were arguing against it were making such terrible arguments, 207 00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:29,719 Speaker 2: Like there were so few. I remember the libertarians were 208 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:33,840 Speaker 2: making like good anti war you know, arguments, but on 209 00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 2: the left in general, it was like Irish is just 210 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 2: doing this because he wants their oil or he's trying 211 00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:40,200 Speaker 2: to avenge his daddy. 212 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:42,559 Speaker 3: Like it was not very. 213 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:45,200 Speaker 2: Serious, and it seemed like the pro war side. I 214 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 2: mean I was, I was young, I was in my 215 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:49,480 Speaker 2: early twenties. I mean, I don't I don't feel particularly 216 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:51,839 Speaker 2: responsible for the opinians I had at the time. 217 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:54,200 Speaker 4: But but I remember reading all about. 218 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,200 Speaker 2: It and it was like the pro war side was 219 00:11:56,559 --> 00:12:00,320 Speaker 2: like just more serious, And I think that's really what 220 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 2: lured me into thinking that it was a good idea, 221 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:06,719 Speaker 2: because the anti war side was just ridiculous. 222 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:09,719 Speaker 5: Yeah, no, I agree, like that the neo conservatives were 223 00:12:09,720 --> 00:12:11,920 Speaker 5: true intellectuals. I thought that that just you know, their 224 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 5: policy ideas were were atrocious, but you know, they were 225 00:12:16,720 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 5: very well educated and they had you know, basically taken 226 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:21,720 Speaker 5: over the Republican Party. 227 00:12:21,720 --> 00:12:23,880 Speaker 3: I mean I was, I think I was. 228 00:12:25,160 --> 00:12:27,360 Speaker 5: The first time I voted, I was eighteen, freshman year 229 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 5: of college. I voted for John McCain. Right, So we all, 230 00:12:29,640 --> 00:12:31,960 Speaker 5: we all make mistakes, but you're right, like, what's the alternative? 231 00:12:32,160 --> 00:12:33,200 Speaker 3: It was Barack Obama? 232 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 2: Right, So it's like sometimes, no, that's an easy I 233 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,080 Speaker 2: feel like that's an easier choice. 234 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:42,040 Speaker 5: Yeah, But it's just you know, sometimes like we're just 235 00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:47,320 Speaker 5: faced with two competing groups that don't want to facilitate 236 00:12:47,320 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 5: our interests, and I think, like that's you know, that's 237 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 5: the that's the reality of our system right now. But 238 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:55,160 Speaker 5: like I would still prefer that system to like, you know, 239 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:56,840 Speaker 5: we see what's going on in Israel with the canesset 240 00:12:56,960 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 5: or in Europe with these you know, the parliamentary system 241 00:12:59,480 --> 00:13:01,640 Speaker 5: where you have thousand different parties and then you know 242 00:13:01,679 --> 00:13:03,920 Speaker 5: you really can't get anything done. So you know, there's 243 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:05,719 Speaker 5: positives and negatives. 244 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:08,280 Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, So what would you be doing if it 245 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 2: weren't this, If you weren't a writer? 246 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:12,040 Speaker 4: What would be Plan B for Jordan? 247 00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:13,400 Speaker 3: Yeah? 248 00:13:13,520 --> 00:13:15,760 Speaker 5: I don't know, Like I wanted to have a real 249 00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:17,520 Speaker 5: job my whole life, and then when I was in 250 00:13:17,559 --> 00:13:21,080 Speaker 5: grad school, you know, I just started like I. 251 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:22,520 Speaker 3: Wanted to have a real job. 252 00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:28,599 Speaker 5: So when I was in graduate school for international affairs, 253 00:13:28,760 --> 00:13:32,439 Speaker 5: I wanted to be basically like a deep state fed. 254 00:13:33,080 --> 00:13:38,320 Speaker 5: And I think I was too maybe open in that 255 00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:42,920 Speaker 5: interview process and they didn't want to move my applications forward, 256 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:46,240 Speaker 5: which ended up being a blessing. But you know, and 257 00:13:46,280 --> 00:13:48,439 Speaker 5: then before that, you know, growing up, I just wanted 258 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:51,400 Speaker 5: to be you know, pro baseball player, pro basketball player, 259 00:13:51,520 --> 00:13:55,120 Speaker 5: pro ball you know, makes some I don't work out. Yeah, 260 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:57,440 Speaker 5: like probably, I'm sure that's what your kids are looking 261 00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:00,839 Speaker 5: at right now, but it's yeah, you. 262 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 3: Know, like I kind of just fell into this. 263 00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:05,040 Speaker 5: I was in grad school and one of my professors 264 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:07,000 Speaker 5: was like, hey, that paper was kind of interesting. You 265 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:09,079 Speaker 5: want to submit that, And I submitted it, I think 266 00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 5: to like Breitbart or something, and then I started working 267 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 5: at Breitbart, and then you know, from there, it's been 268 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 5: it's been like twelve years in this space now, so 269 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:19,240 Speaker 5: I know for a lot of people that's not too long, 270 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:22,600 Speaker 5: but you know, it just became more and more interesting, 271 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:25,080 Speaker 5: and I think, you know, the best way to become 272 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:27,160 Speaker 5: a better writer is just to write more and read 273 00:14:27,200 --> 00:14:32,040 Speaker 5: more too, So as I became yeah, as my skills improved, 274 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 5: I think that like more people became interested in my work, 275 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:36,840 Speaker 5: so you know, kind of had this effect of encouraging 276 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:39,040 Speaker 5: me to continue pressing on. 277 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:41,000 Speaker 3: But never would I have imagined. 278 00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:43,720 Speaker 5: You know, in my first twenty years of life, that 279 00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:46,040 Speaker 5: I would be doing this right now. You know, I'm 280 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 5: not a particularly extroverted person, so being like in the 281 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:53,320 Speaker 5: media space is kind of weird. For it's still kind 282 00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:56,080 Speaker 5: of weird, but I very much enjoy it now were 283 00:14:56,080 --> 00:14:56,720 Speaker 5: you're doing great. 284 00:14:56,760 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 4: I think. 285 00:14:57,120 --> 00:15:01,920 Speaker 2: I think this interview is going really well. So you 286 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:06,000 Speaker 2: have the substack where you support yourself on it, and 287 00:15:06,040 --> 00:15:09,120 Speaker 2: you have you know, your your own publication, and that's 288 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:11,200 Speaker 2: really dazzling to me. I mean, you know, you and 289 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 2: I have had conversations and you've encouraged me to start 290 00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:15,600 Speaker 2: a substack, and I'm like, I'm just too old for this. 291 00:15:15,640 --> 00:15:17,920 Speaker 4: I don't understand how it works, but. 292 00:15:17,880 --> 00:15:21,520 Speaker 2: You're doing it, and I think that's really impressive. Do 293 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 2: you feel like you've made it, like you get to do. 294 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:23,960 Speaker 4: Whatever you want. 295 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 5: I think that it's great to have that kind of flexibility. 296 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 5: I don't like phrasing it as if I've made it because, 297 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 5: like you, I'm sure you encounter these people all the 298 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:39,400 Speaker 5: time who have internalized this idea that they've made it, 299 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:42,440 Speaker 5: and you're having a conversation with them, and you just 300 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 5: feel like it's a one way conversation from them to 301 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:47,640 Speaker 5: you because they've decided that there's nothing more that they 302 00:15:47,720 --> 00:15:52,920 Speaker 5: can learn. So that's why I would never say that 303 00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 5: I've made it. But I think, like you know, kind 304 00:15:56,480 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 5: of growing older and maturing, you start to kind of 305 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:04,160 Speaker 5: shift priorities from material possessions and goods to like, what 306 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:07,200 Speaker 5: is making it really mean? I think it would means, like, 307 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:11,120 Speaker 5: from my perspective, maybe having a big family and a 308 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 5: cool legacy and to be remembered for doing something positive. 309 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 5: And I think that would mean that I've made it. 310 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 5: But I think like it like an Andrew Taate, like figure, 311 00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 5: I think that guy probably goes to sleep and he's 312 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:26,200 Speaker 5: absolutely miserable every night, although he probably is worth a 313 00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:29,160 Speaker 5: billion dollars and might be the most influential thirty something 314 00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 5: on the planet. So, you know, making it it's you know, 315 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:36,040 Speaker 5: there's a wide variety of answers, but I think, like 316 00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:38,800 Speaker 5: definitely making it to me would mean being like super 317 00:16:38,800 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 5: content with how you're living your life, how you lived 318 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 5: your life and the legacy that you left. 319 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:45,640 Speaker 4: Yeah. 320 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:48,400 Speaker 2: Absolutely, I mean I asked that question of all my guests, 321 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:51,520 Speaker 2: and I've gotten a real range of answers, and you have, 322 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:54,480 Speaker 2: you know, multimillionaires who say that they haven't made it 323 00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:57,480 Speaker 2: and people who make, you know, much more modest livings 324 00:16:57,600 --> 00:16:59,440 Speaker 2: than saying that they have. And so I think it's 325 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 2: it's really you know, obviously it's objective, but I love 326 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 2: to hear what people. 327 00:17:04,800 --> 00:17:08,120 Speaker 4: Think made it means. And so that's, you know, why 328 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:12,320 Speaker 4: why I keep that question in the roster. So one 329 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,359 Speaker 4: other question that I ask all of my guests, and. 330 00:17:14,280 --> 00:17:17,359 Speaker 2: I feel like you probably are well poised to answer 331 00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:19,199 Speaker 2: this because you write about this kind of stuff all 332 00:17:19,240 --> 00:17:22,400 Speaker 2: the time. But what would you say is our largest 333 00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:26,240 Speaker 2: cultural issue, like or societal issue in America? 334 00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:33,679 Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, I remember seeing this question, and I don't, like, 335 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:37,160 Speaker 5: I think that I am not qualified to give. 336 00:17:39,359 --> 00:17:47,400 Speaker 3: Qualified But I know this show isn't political. However, It's okay. 337 00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 4: It could be it could be something. 338 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:51,120 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, it fears into politics. I've had 339 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:55,479 Speaker 2: lots of guests who automatically just go go political because 340 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:58,200 Speaker 2: you know that that's what feels comfortable and it's it's okay, 341 00:17:58,359 --> 00:17:59,400 Speaker 2: we accept it. 342 00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:00,400 Speaker 4: Yeah. 343 00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 5: I think that there's an incredible detachment between the elected 344 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:12,600 Speaker 5: representatives and you know, the average American person. And while 345 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:15,200 Speaker 5: there's many people who claim to have the perfect system 346 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:20,960 Speaker 5: to resolve that issue, particularly like the fiscal status of 347 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 5: the United States, you know, I've very much, i guess, 348 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 5: evolved on this issue. Like I come from a very 349 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 5: free market perspective and coming and similarly over the COVID years, 350 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 5: I came to realize. 351 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:41,080 Speaker 3: That you know, there's there there's very much like. 352 00:18:41,040 --> 00:18:45,119 Speaker 5: A uniparty system in the United States, because you know, 353 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:47,360 Speaker 5: there were there were very there's always been arguments from 354 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:49,199 Speaker 5: the right that the GOP is kind of like this 355 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:52,080 Speaker 5: party of big business, and the and the Democrat parties 356 00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:55,040 Speaker 5: just like the insane party. And it's kind of true 357 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:59,520 Speaker 5: because like you know, if you look at income over 358 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:03,160 Speaker 5: time and like purchasing power of the dollar, like everybody's 359 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 5: getting screwed at the expense of the very powerful interests 360 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,639 Speaker 5: in Washington, d c. And on Wall Street, and the 361 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:17,320 Speaker 5: capital just flows to people who are closest to the 362 00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:20,080 Speaker 5: money printer today. And that's an issue that I think 363 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:22,600 Speaker 5: about a lot is like, how do we resolve that 364 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 5: through you know, free market principles, because like I feel like, 365 00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:30,360 Speaker 5: for a very long time under like you know, the Bush, McCain, 366 00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:34,160 Speaker 5: Romney era of Republicanism and even some Trump stuff, Trump 367 00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:37,560 Speaker 5: printed trillions of dollars too, like, and that did not 368 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:41,639 Speaker 5: do anything to resolve the issues of the income disparity 369 00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:43,080 Speaker 5: in the United States. And I think it's a very 370 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:46,720 Speaker 5: real thing. And I think people are right, no matter 371 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:50,480 Speaker 5: what their ideology is, that this is a very troubling 372 00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:52,560 Speaker 5: issue in the United States that people are saddled with 373 00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 5: so much debt today. Like I think about like my 374 00:19:56,080 --> 00:20:01,119 Speaker 5: future children, God willing, like how going to be able 375 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 5: to make sure that they have no debt because once 376 00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:08,879 Speaker 5: the debt, you're basically begging the government, you know, you 377 00:20:08,920 --> 00:20:11,720 Speaker 5: see with Biden right now, you're begging the government to 378 00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:14,680 Speaker 5: bail out people who were saddled with student loans for 379 00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:18,480 Speaker 5: many years prior. And there's really no way today. Like 380 00:20:18,520 --> 00:20:20,840 Speaker 5: I know that the boomers and whatnot say that, oh, 381 00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 5: you know, I was washing cars pay through college. Well 382 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:28,040 Speaker 5: now college costs go to good school, and you don't 383 00:20:28,080 --> 00:20:30,280 Speaker 5: you know, you don't have a you know, some type 384 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 5: of wealth or scholarship. You know, you might be paying 385 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:37,520 Speaker 5: eighty thousand dollars a year to go to a top 386 00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:39,800 Speaker 5: tier school. So it's like, how are you going to 387 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,800 Speaker 5: how are you going to get out of that debt hole? 388 00:20:43,800 --> 00:20:47,160 Speaker 5: It's very difficult. So it's something that's always on my mind. 389 00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 5: It's like, how are we going to deal with this 390 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 5: crisis of people being like if you're not working at 391 00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:56,800 Speaker 5: a top pedge fund or private equity firm out of 392 00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:59,640 Speaker 5: college like you have, and you don't have any support, 393 00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:01,879 Speaker 5: Like this is very much an uphill battle that so 394 00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:03,880 Speaker 5: many American states, right. 395 00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:06,240 Speaker 2: I mean, I think that there's a lot of answers 396 00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:09,920 Speaker 2: to this, but like, for one thing, I think people 397 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,760 Speaker 2: need to start either not going to college. And I 398 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:14,760 Speaker 2: know this is like an unpopular thing to say, but 399 00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:17,480 Speaker 2: I'm not necessarily encouraging my kids to go to college. 400 00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:20,040 Speaker 2: Like I think that they will because it's the path 401 00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:21,600 Speaker 2: that everybody around them is taking. 402 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:23,480 Speaker 4: But I'm not saying to them like. 403 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:27,119 Speaker 2: You know, how you must or this is what you 404 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:30,480 Speaker 2: have to do if they want to pursue something else, 405 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:32,760 Speaker 2: I'm going to be completely open to it. But also 406 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:35,639 Speaker 2: the idea of state schools and community colleges like, we 407 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:40,480 Speaker 2: just don't. Everybody goes to these insanely expensive private Not everybody, 408 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:42,920 Speaker 2: but a lot of people go to these insanely expensive 409 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,320 Speaker 2: private schools, and I do amass this insane debt. 410 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:48,840 Speaker 4: Debt I called graduate school the most expensive mistake I've 411 00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:50,880 Speaker 4: ever made. That was the first time in my life 412 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:51,399 Speaker 4: I had. 413 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:54,160 Speaker 2: Debt, and it was crippling and it was really scary, 414 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 2: and it was unnecessary. I wish somebody had been there 415 00:21:57,800 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 2: to be like this, you know, you want to go 416 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:00,960 Speaker 2: into politics, you don't. 417 00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:01,919 Speaker 4: Need a graduate degree. 418 00:22:01,960 --> 00:22:05,800 Speaker 2: This is like not at all necessary graduate degree? 419 00:22:06,560 --> 00:22:09,440 Speaker 3: You don't I already have one. 420 00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:12,320 Speaker 4: I already had one. I already had an undergraduate degree. 421 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:15,159 Speaker 2: And then I was working as a paralegal and I 422 00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:17,399 Speaker 2: decided to switch fields, and I felt like I needed 423 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:18,080 Speaker 2: to go get. 424 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:20,440 Speaker 4: The graduate degree in order to switch fields. 425 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:23,959 Speaker 2: And what I learned is a nobody has ever asked 426 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:26,760 Speaker 2: to see the graduate degree or my grades or any 427 00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:30,159 Speaker 2: of that. And I'm not sure I learned anything. I mean, 428 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:34,320 Speaker 2: I had some interesting teachers. I know, some like famous teachers. 429 00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:38,879 Speaker 2: Dick Morris is one of my teachers. But it's ultimately 430 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:40,639 Speaker 2: I was so in the world already and I was 431 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:42,439 Speaker 2: so immersed in it that I didn't need to go 432 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:43,280 Speaker 2: to graduate school. 433 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:45,240 Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break and be right 434 00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:46,800 Speaker 1: back on the Carol Marcowitch Show. 435 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:52,040 Speaker 2: But what I wanted to say about the money printing, 436 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 2: I like to say, you know, real capitalism has never 437 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:55,399 Speaker 2: been tried. 438 00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:58,280 Speaker 4: But how do we fix that? How do we fix 439 00:22:58,359 --> 00:22:59,080 Speaker 4: that flow? 440 00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:02,120 Speaker 2: I think that you really it's a very interesting point, 441 00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 2: and it is political point, but it is also a 442 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,720 Speaker 2: cultural point that people are suffering and they're in debt, 443 00:23:07,840 --> 00:23:11,840 Speaker 2: and this money printing situation that we've gotten ourselves into 444 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:16,280 Speaker 2: is so harmful. Like what what would Jordan Shaft tell 445 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:17,680 Speaker 2: them to do to fix this? 446 00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:21,399 Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, I think the solution is a multi 447 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,760 Speaker 5: generational approach. Obviously, you know, I'm very public about the 448 00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:27,359 Speaker 5: fact that I'm a big bitcoiner, but other than bitcoin, 449 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 5: will keep that aside because it's a very niche issue. 450 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:35,480 Speaker 5: You know, from very early on, people are indoctrinated in 451 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:40,360 Speaker 5: public schools and through college to accept premises that are 452 00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 5: that are ridiculous, and it creates a system in which 453 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:50,440 Speaker 5: the government, you know, Congress specifically and the FED are 454 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:54,199 Speaker 5: empowered to basically do whatever they want. And we've created 455 00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 5: this entire system in which, like you have all the 456 00:23:57,040 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 5: top minds on Wall Street just you know, tuning into 457 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:04,280 Speaker 5: every FED press conference and then Congress, you know, every 458 00:24:04,280 --> 00:24:08,199 Speaker 5: time there's a crisis, Prince trillions of dollars. And I 459 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:11,720 Speaker 5: think that there's not a lot of pushback because there's 460 00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:18,800 Speaker 5: not a lot of people aren't really tuned into having 461 00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:23,639 Speaker 5: solid economic principles, and until that changes, Congress is going 462 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:26,560 Speaker 5: to continue to get away with it. But if tens 463 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:31,240 Speaker 5: of millions of people understood that the people in Congress 464 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:36,040 Speaker 5: are basically robbing you and your family's future blind to 465 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:40,200 Speaker 5: pay for the priorities of the thousands of lobbyists who 466 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:43,479 Speaker 5: spend billions of dollars in DC to get, you know, 467 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:47,120 Speaker 5: whatever they want out of these legislatures, I think that, 468 00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:49,640 Speaker 5: you know, at least through the democratic process, you could 469 00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:52,520 Speaker 5: hold these people accountable. But there just doesn't seem to 470 00:24:52,560 --> 00:24:57,040 Speaker 5: be enough of a wealth of knowledge right now about 471 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:01,359 Speaker 5: how much we're being screwed on this issue. Really, you know, 472 00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:03,240 Speaker 5: the simplest thing to do is just to run the 473 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:06,200 Speaker 5: numbers and show people, like, you know, I've pretty much 474 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:08,400 Speaker 5: written off the idea that I'm going to be able 475 00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:12,240 Speaker 5: to be collecting any type of you know, government welfare 476 00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 5: or social security checks in thirty years, so I think, 477 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:22,640 Speaker 5: you know, it's just something needs to be done. Unfortunately, 478 00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:24,679 Speaker 5: I don't think that it's going to be done, you know, 479 00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:27,199 Speaker 5: anytime soon. So that's why, you know, I became a 480 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,480 Speaker 5: big bitcointerer. It's like, you know, try to find a 481 00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:33,600 Speaker 5: system that's detached from the money printer because I think 482 00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:36,399 Speaker 5: like we're kind of just in this uh, you know, 483 00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:41,480 Speaker 5: monetary death spiral that's just contributing to the likes of 484 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,960 Speaker 5: you know, Blackrock and JP Morgan while harming everyone else. 485 00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:50,520 Speaker 5: So I still hold out hope that enough people can 486 00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:53,840 Speaker 5: be fired up to make change, but if not, that's 487 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:55,919 Speaker 5: what I kind of view as the escape hatch to 488 00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 5: all the madness, you know. 489 00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:00,600 Speaker 2: And Culture has this point where she says that the 490 00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:04,760 Speaker 2: national debt is to Republicans as climate change is to Democrats, 491 00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:07,320 Speaker 2: Like we keep saying it's the scary thing when nothing 492 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 2: ever happens. And I think that's the concern. People don't 493 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 2: understand the connection. They don't understand that, like how much 494 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 2: money is printed and all of that, that it affects 495 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:16,880 Speaker 2: them every day. 496 00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:18,439 Speaker 4: I'm not sure how to solve that. 497 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:22,120 Speaker 5: So answer the culture question, I think like the best 498 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,720 Speaker 5: example of what we were talking about is like, can. 499 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,760 Speaker 3: You pay your way through college today? Can you do 500 00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:29,160 Speaker 3: what your grandparents said? Can you? Can you work? 501 00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:31,760 Speaker 5: Can you wait tables and wash cars to pay for 502 00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:34,520 Speaker 5: your tuition? The answer is obviously not, So what happened 503 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 5: in between? 504 00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:39,320 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's exactly. I think that's what Republicans are. 505 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,680 Speaker 2: You know, maybe not Republicans because they're just as culpable 506 00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 2: in this, but that's what people who care. 507 00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:46,560 Speaker 4: About this should be saying. 508 00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:49,080 Speaker 2: I guess is the all right, We've solved it. I 509 00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:53,359 Speaker 2: think we did so good. So for my last question, Jordan, 510 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:56,359 Speaker 2: I like to end with if you could offer a 511 00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:58,520 Speaker 2: life tip to my listeners. 512 00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 4: Yeah. 513 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,440 Speaker 5: I was looking at that question earlier and I was like, man, 514 00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:03,840 Speaker 5: I got to put my Jordan. 515 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:04,480 Speaker 3: Peterson hat on. 516 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:10,119 Speaker 5: But you know, it's kind of similar themes to the 517 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:14,600 Speaker 5: question of having made it. What I find is that, 518 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:16,560 Speaker 5: you know, I'm always trying to work on keeping an 519 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 5: open mind and listening to people, because although I thought 520 00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:21,800 Speaker 5: I used to have an open mind and listen to people, 521 00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:23,800 Speaker 5: I wasn't really listening to people. I was kind of 522 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:27,359 Speaker 5: just set in my ways. But in terms of Like 523 00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 5: you know, I think physical and mental fitness are very 524 00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:38,280 Speaker 5: much connected. But you know, I'll leave the guru stuff 525 00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:40,600 Speaker 5: to Jordan Peterson because, like you know, I don't really 526 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:44,080 Speaker 5: have I don't want to fall into the trap like 527 00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:49,400 Speaker 5: I much rather would learn from people than to offer advice. 528 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 5: And I think maybe I'm capable of giving some advice, 529 00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:56,720 Speaker 5: but it's it's a difficult question for me because, like 530 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:59,400 Speaker 5: you know, everyone has their own set of circumstances. 531 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 3: But I think that. 532 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:05,120 Speaker 5: Just to continue learning, like you know, the best thing 533 00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,200 Speaker 5: that I think I'm doing is that I'm really trying 534 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:09,600 Speaker 5: to focus on continuing to learn and continuing to keep 535 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 5: an open mind and hopefully. 536 00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:12,960 Speaker 3: Keeps a great tip. 537 00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,960 Speaker 2: I mean, you know, I feel like you undersold yourself. 538 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 2: Buck Sexton was like read before bed. I mean, it 539 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,959 Speaker 2: doesn't have to be, you know, Jordan Peterson esk. But 540 00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:24,720 Speaker 2: I think continue learning is a great tip. Thank you 541 00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 2: so much for coming on, Jordan. 542 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:28,880 Speaker 3: No, thanks so much, Carol appreciate it. 543 00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:31,920 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for joining us on the Carol Marcowitch Show. 544 00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:34,120 Speaker 1: Subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.