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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on

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Speaker 1: iHeart Radio and welcome back to Coast to Coast George

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Speaker 1: Norri with you. Brian Kenno as a featured analyst for

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Speaker 1: the Travel Channel's Paranormal Cot on Camera. He's a guest

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Speaker 1: on the History channels The Curse of Oak Island, Drilling

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Speaker 1: Down and The Unexplained with William Shatner, as well as

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Speaker 1: a tech specialist for sci Fi's Haunted Collector Team. Now

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Speaker 1: when not the lighting fans with his on screen presence,

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Speaker 1: the nineteen year investigative veteran can be found sharing his

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Speaker 1: wit and wisdom at top notch events and elite universities

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Speaker 1: throughout the United States and abroad. Most recently, Brian debuted

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Speaker 1: his interactive History of the Paranormal Mobile exhibit at Historical

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Speaker 1: Landmarks in New Jersey, Pennsylvania, New York, Connecticut. His goal

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Speaker 1: is to hit all fifty states. Brian, welcome to the program.

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Speaker 1: Good evening, George, thanks for having me on. Looking forward

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Speaker 1: to this and how did you get started in this field?

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Speaker 1: This is fantastic spend some time. It's crazy to look

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Speaker 1: back now it's been twenty years since I've been actually

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Speaker 1: actively investigating the paranormal. And I always tell people that

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Speaker 1: when you're a child, you believe. It's easy to believe,

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Speaker 1: but as you get older and you become an adult,

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Speaker 1: your beliefs are often thrown into question, and all the

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Speaker 1: things that you had when you were young, Santa Claus,

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Speaker 1: the Eastern Bunning, tooth ferry, etc. You start losing those

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Speaker 1: things and you're left wondering, well, what is real? And

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Speaker 1: how I got started, it was very much a simple beginning.

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Speaker 1: In two thousand and two, some friends of mine and

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Speaker 1: I started a cable access show here on Staten Island,

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Speaker 1: New York called Scared on Staten Island, and it was

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Speaker 1: more urban exploration than paranormal investigation at the time, because

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Speaker 1: this was two thousand and two, the big explosion of

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Speaker 1: TV shows hadn't begun for another two years with ghost Hunters,

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Speaker 1: and we were just kind of figuring out what we

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Speaker 1: were doing. And we decided that we can go into

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Speaker 1: some of the haunted places, rather the reportedly haunted places

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Speaker 1: here on Staten Island, and if it was as haunted

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Speaker 1: as everyone says it was, we should be able to

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Speaker 1: go in with ourselves, our wits and some cameras and

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Speaker 1: documents some activity, and you did, and you were way

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Speaker 1: ahead of the curve art you it seems that way.

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Speaker 1: Ironically enough, the station manager for the cable Axis at

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Speaker 1: the time said, Wow, this is some crazy stuff you

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Speaker 1: guys have going on here. I would never do it,

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Speaker 1: but don't be surprised if you start seeing programming like

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Speaker 1: this popping up everywhere. And we looked at each other

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Speaker 1: shrugged and laughter, like, yeah, no one's going to do this,

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Speaker 1: because the most common comment that we got for our

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Speaker 1: programming was you guys are crazy. I would never do that.

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Speaker 1: And look where we are now. And you could tell

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Speaker 1: that you like doing what you're doing, Brian, and you

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Speaker 1: take it seriously. I do. I've always enjoyed it. And

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Speaker 1: like I said, when one is young, you have all

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Speaker 1: these beliefs and the world and the universe is a magical,

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Speaker 1: wonderful place filled with possibilities. And when you get older,

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Speaker 1: a lot of people feel robbed, a lot of people

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Speaker 1: feel frustrated with all, Right, well, if life is just

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Speaker 1: about commuting and bills and taxes, what's the point. And

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Speaker 1: for me, I very much felt that way coming out

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Speaker 1: of college and getting into the paranormal officially, the way

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Speaker 1: I did allowed me to rediscover wonder. It gave me

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Speaker 1: back some of those things that I lost in growing

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Speaker 1: up in that of getting older, and I really feel

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Speaker 1: that for a lot of people in the paranormal it's

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Speaker 1: the same thing. They're getting something back that might be intangible,

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Speaker 1: but is very important. It's amazing too what we have

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Speaker 1: all learned by working in the paranormal field. In your opinion,

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Speaker 1: what's the biggest thing you've learned about the paranormal. Wow,

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Speaker 1: working in the paranormal, the biggest thing that I've learned

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Speaker 1: is that as much as you think you know, you

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Speaker 1: really don't know anything. And it's a constant learning experience. Now.

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Speaker 1: When I first started my jaunt into the paranormal in

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Speaker 1: two thousand and two, I labeled myself a skeptic. I

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Speaker 1: really didn't believe. I was going through a crisis of faith.

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Speaker 1: And every time someone would come to me and report, oh,

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Speaker 1: well I had an activity or I saw this, or

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Speaker 1: oh I believe in that, I kind of scoffed at

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Speaker 1: the report and I thought, well, there has to be

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Speaker 1: a logical explanation. There's got to be something, a mundane

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Speaker 1: reason for what's going on. Here and I don't think

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Speaker 1: you're seeing ghost, but I'm going to get to the

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Speaker 1: bottom of it. And ironically, so much of things that

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Speaker 1: I've learned, I didn't learn immediately. It took years of reflection,

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Speaker 1: it took the expanse of time. And funny enough, George,

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Speaker 1: you were there at one of the key lynchpin moments

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Speaker 1: that took me a long time to get and it

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Speaker 1: was at Darkness Radio events in two thousand and twelve

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Speaker 1: at Eastern State Penitentiary. I remember that. What a great

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Speaker 1: place too, by the way, Oh amazing beautiful, and it was.

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Speaker 1: It was a location that I loved anyway, But that

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Speaker 1: night something happened that really brought a lesson in focus

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Speaker 1: for me that had been dormant for a very long time.

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Speaker 1: And I always tell people by itself, for me, at

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Speaker 1: least for me, each experience in the paranormal that I

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Speaker 1: went through is like a grain of sand, and individually

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Speaker 1: by itself, when you look at a single grain of sand,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't seem like much, so you'll throw it to

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Speaker 1: the floor, You'll cast it away. And I did that

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Speaker 1: with every report, with every experience, I just shrugged it

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Speaker 1: off and threw it on the ground. But as time

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Speaker 1: went on and enough of those grains of sands passed

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Speaker 1: through my hands, I looked down at the floor and

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Speaker 1: figuratively speaking, I was standing on a beach of all

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Speaker 1: those collected experiences, and I really had to address what

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Speaker 1: that meant for me, and it really did chaining me

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Speaker 1: enhanced the name of the book Grains of Sand. Grains

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Speaker 1: of Sand, Yes, Tales of a Paranormal Life. And I

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Speaker 1: really sometimes with me when it comes to branding, maybe

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Speaker 1: a better title for the book would be something scarier

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Speaker 1: or more nail on the head paranormal. But for me,

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Speaker 1: Grains of Sand says it all. Now, you've been doing

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Speaker 1: Paranormal Caught on Camera for what four or five seasons.

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Speaker 1: We just finished our fifth season and we are about

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Speaker 1: to roll into season six. That's fantastic. I mean, that's

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Speaker 1: longevity for that kind of program. And tell me some

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Speaker 1: of the things that you have his people submit video

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Speaker 1: submissions and things like that. What has been one of

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Speaker 1: the most outstanding things that you have seen caught on camera?

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Speaker 1: That's a that's a good question, George. I mean, having

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Speaker 1: watched the video submissions for the past five seasons, you

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Speaker 1: get your mix and some of them again, I look

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Speaker 1: through a skeptic lens. Sure you got to see if

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Speaker 1: they made it up or directed it or something like that. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I'm really skeptically. Sometimes sometimes I will beg the producers, guys,

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Speaker 1: we can't show this, please, please, let's not show this.

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Speaker 1: But another thing I learned from being on the show.

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Speaker 1: It's not about necessarily proof, it's not about ironclad evidence.

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Speaker 1: The show is called paranormal caught on camera, not you

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Speaker 1: must believe this or else. And for me looking at

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Speaker 1: the clips and sometimes I'm talking it over, discussing it

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Speaker 1: with the other panelists. Sometimes I'm slaved. And it is

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Speaker 1: something that I might not have believed when I first

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Speaker 1: started watching, I'll later be convinced, and vice versa. And

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Speaker 1: the one big takeaway from me is that when I

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Speaker 1: first got onto the show, I was very much a

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Speaker 1: ghosts and spirits guy. Now, because of the different topics,

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Speaker 1: the different subjects, I know a lot more about uphology, cryptozoology.

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Speaker 1: I'm better versed to be able to give an educated

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Speaker 1: opinion in several different fields under the umbrella of the paranormal,

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Speaker 1: and the show forced me to do that as I

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Speaker 1: did research for each clip. Have you ever been hurt

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Speaker 1: on that kind of a show, You mean, the way

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Speaker 1: producers and the paranormal have a temporary alliance but then

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Speaker 1: sometimes go awry. Sometimes it goes awry, it does well.

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Speaker 1: I will say that after being on Haunted Collector in

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Speaker 1: the early twenty tens, that was a great experience. Working

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Speaker 1: with John Zaphie was well, he's a great guy, isn't

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Speaker 1: he Being on the road. He also worked with Rosemary

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Speaker 1: Ellen Guiley on the Paranormal Caught on Camera. I miss her,

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Speaker 1: God rest her soul. She is actually, you know, George,

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Speaker 1: She's the reason that I said yes to the show,

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Speaker 1: because after on a Collector, all the pitches I was

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Speaker 1: given from producers were Okay, okay, here it is. There's

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Speaker 1: this guy and he does this by day, but by

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Speaker 1: night he's a paranormal investigator, and you'll be his tech guy.

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Speaker 1: And I'm thinking, m I kind of did that already.

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Speaker 1: John wants to go back out on the road. I'll

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Speaker 1: do it seven ways to Sunday. But I'm not going

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Speaker 1: to do that for just anybody. He's earned it. I

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Speaker 1: will follow John anywhere. But when I saw the casting

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Speaker 1: list for Paranormal Caught on Camera and I saw Rosemary

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Speaker 1: Ellen guy who's name. I immediately I said, okay, I mean,

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Speaker 1: if Rosemary said yes to this, I will do it.

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Speaker 1: Back in nineteen ninety six, Bran, I'm doing my low

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Speaker 1: cool show in Saint Louis. I'm called the Nighthawk, but

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Speaker 1: I'm doing similar things that we're doing now on Coast

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Speaker 1: to Coast, same kind of guests. And I was looking

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Speaker 1: for someone unusual. So I went to the bookstore and

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Speaker 1: I'm in the occult section and I see a book

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Speaker 1: called The Encyclopedia of Dreams by Rosemary Ellen Guiley. So

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Speaker 1: we put her on the air back in nineteen ninety

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Speaker 1: six locally, and she was an instant success. I mean,

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Speaker 1: she was just perfect. And when I started doing Coast

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Speaker 1: to Coast on a regular basis in two thousand and three,

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Speaker 1: we brought her aboard as a regular guest, and she

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Speaker 1: became a friend to all of us. And I can't

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Speaker 1: tell you how much we miss her. Yeah, she was

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Speaker 1: a fountain of knowledge. She's a mentor of mine, a

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Speaker 1: good friend. And I've said this a lot that I

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Speaker 1: hope that in continuing to do the show, in being

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Speaker 1: out there on the road teaching everything that she's taught

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Speaker 1: me that some more people will be introduced to her

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Speaker 1: and her books. And literally, every time I go into

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Speaker 1: a bookstore, I will go to the supernatural section and

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Speaker 1: I'll look for one of her encyclopedias. Yeah. Absolutely, she

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Speaker 1: was in her husband Joe, great guy. Yeah, I'm a

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Speaker 1: big loss to the paranormal. Oh huge, ye huge. And

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Speaker 1: then heck, we had another one, Stanton Friedman, who oh yeah.

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Speaker 1: He was such a such a sweet such a nice guy.

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Speaker 1: And here's another great story there. He was my first

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Speaker 1: radio interview when I was twenty one years old, back

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Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy one. My first radio interview was Stanton Friedman,

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Speaker 1: and I just remembered him all along the line, and

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Speaker 1: then all of a sudden, I'm doing this program. I'm

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Speaker 1: doing a live show in Columbus, Ohio, and he's one

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Speaker 1: of the guests. And he looked fine, he felt fine,

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Speaker 1: and on the way home through the airport, on his

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Speaker 1: way through Toronto, he drops dead of a heart attack.

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Speaker 1: And so ironically he was my first radio interview. I

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Speaker 1: was his last interview when he died. Oh wow, gosh,

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Speaker 1: I remember hearing about that. And I only had the

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Speaker 1: chance to appear at a convention with Stan just once.

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Speaker 1: We kept in contact over the years, but my first

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Speaker 1: impression was, oh, it's a UFO guy, and he must

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Speaker 1: be serious and stuffy. But he was just funny and personable.

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Speaker 1: And you never would have if we didn't stop to

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Speaker 1: talk about the paranormal. We could have just had a beer,

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Speaker 1: had a regular conversation and it would have been great.

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Speaker 1: Great man, great guy. Now this is your first time

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Speaker 1: on this program, isn't it? It is, George? And what

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Speaker 1: took us so long? You know, it's been an aspiration.

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Speaker 1: I've wanted to do it for a very long time,

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Speaker 1: but I thought, if I'm going to go on coast

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Speaker 1: to coast, am I wanted to be for a really

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Speaker 1: special reason, not just oh yeah, I'm investigating this weekend

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Speaker 1: for me the book, this is my first book, that

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Speaker 1: was it? How did you come up with the title

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Speaker 1: of Grains of Sand? Grains of Sands? All the experiences

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Speaker 1: that I've had throughout my time in the paranormal, really

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Speaker 1: I would dismiss them when they would first be presented

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Speaker 1: to me, And I don't know. I guess I could

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Speaker 1: chalk it up to being a little closed minded at first,

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Speaker 1: or a little hard headed. Sometimes being skeptical blocks you

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Speaker 1: off to things. But I always tell people, yes, it's

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Speaker 1: important to remain skeptical because the opposite of which is

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Speaker 1: to be naive. You don't wish to be. But every

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Speaker 1: experience that I had, I can I called the grain

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Speaker 1: of sand. And when it came time to write the book,

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Speaker 1: just to write any book, this is This has been

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Speaker 1: also a dream of mine for many years since college,

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Speaker 1: that why am I going to write about? Is it

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Speaker 1: going to be a tech manual? Is it going to

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Speaker 1: be maybe about my time on the road with Haunt,

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Speaker 1: a collector. I couldn't get out of my own way.

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Speaker 1: And two people really had influence over me. Rosemary was

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Speaker 1: one of them because she says that the anecdote is

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Speaker 1: just as important as a hard piece of evidence. And

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Speaker 1: my manager, Linda, she said, Brian, you you've got a

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Speaker 1: lot of experiences, You've got a lot of stories. People

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Speaker 1: love hearing your stories. Just tell them. And I said, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I guess ow. So I went home, got a bunch

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Speaker 1: of post at notes and just started writing out the tales.

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Speaker 1: I call that. There's the Eastern State story, just a

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Speaker 1: grand Midway story. Oh I got to tell them about

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Speaker 1: this and as I sat there with a desk filled

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Speaker 1: with post at notes, each one of them with a

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Speaker 1: different tale, I just would pick a post a note

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Speaker 1: and start writing. Was there ever a time in your

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Speaker 1: career where you were skeptical to the point where you're saying,

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Speaker 1: these don't exist, ghosts aren't real, the afterli life might

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Speaker 1: not be real, it doesn't happen. Did that ever hit

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Speaker 1: you like that? Absolutely, George. I mean, in the beginning,

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Speaker 1: at the beginning of the paranormal journey with Scared on

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Speaker 1: Staten Island, I was the skeptic capitalists underlying bold italic skeptic. Yes,

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Speaker 1: all of you guys are crazy. You're imagining things, You're

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Speaker 1: making things up. Is this can't be real? And as

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Speaker 1: time went on, as I went about doing cases and investigations,

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Speaker 1: learning from people, getting mentored, and reading, I had a

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Speaker 1: lot of moments that really blew my mind. And I

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Speaker 1: equate them very much like the phases of loss. You know,

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Speaker 1: when something stressful happens, there's denial, there's anger, there's bargaining,

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Speaker 1: and then eventually you get to acceptance. And with the paranormal,

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Speaker 1: when I first discovered what an EPP was, boom, it

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Speaker 1: blew my mind went through those phases that I learned

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Speaker 1: about it TC in real time investigating and other notable

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Speaker 1: historical figures and organizations, and with each one I felt

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Speaker 1: like my mind got blown and it took me some

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Speaker 1: time to wrestle with it and struggle with it. And

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Speaker 1: my immediate reaction was skepticism that this couldn't be real,

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Speaker 1: this can't happen. But kicking and screaming, I eventually settled

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Speaker 1: into each thing and then on to the next. And

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Speaker 1: now I feel myself sometimes getting pulled back into skeptical

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Speaker 1: territory again when certain videos on paranormal caught on camera

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Speaker 1: get presented to me and I'm thinking, I have to

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Speaker 1: look at this from many different angles. But my knee

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Speaker 1: jerk reaction still sometimes will be skepticism, and again that's healthy,

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Speaker 1: it has to be. I definitely don't want to be

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Speaker 1: someone who believes everything they see, and especially now here

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Speaker 1: is the catch twenty two with evidence these days on

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Speaker 1: the show, we see clips from many different time periods

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Speaker 1: from the present, sometimes going back to the seventies, the eighties,

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Speaker 1: and you're talking about VHS tapes, high eights, Super eight even,

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Speaker 1: and the people will look at and their old classic

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Speaker 1: Bigfoot tape and they go, oh, this is so blurry,

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Speaker 1: I can't tell any detail. Oh, don't we have any

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Speaker 1: better evidence. Okay, we'll show something that was shot last

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Speaker 1: week in four K and it's clear and it's perfect,

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Speaker 1: and it's in focus, that it's centered, and say, oh,

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Speaker 1: this is fake. It's cgi And I myself fall into

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Speaker 1: that trap a lot that when we don't have enough,

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Speaker 1: I'm skeptical, but when it looks too good, I'm skeptical.

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Speaker 1: So I often wondering I can sympathize with the audience

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Speaker 1: what would it take exactly. You've looked at big the

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Speaker 1: Lockness Monster, You've looked at all of them, and there's

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Speaker 1: got to be some reality to everything somewhere out there.

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Speaker 1: I really dog and this again, the show has opened

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Speaker 1: my mind to different facets of the paranormal realm that

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Speaker 1: whatever avenue you're introduced into it, sometimes you'll stay in

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Speaker 1: that safe little cocoon for the beginning, but then you

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Speaker 1: realize that the paranormal really is an umbrella term that

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Speaker 1: encompasses all the mysteries of our world, and there's so

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Speaker 1: many things that we don't yet understand, and it's only

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Speaker 1: paranormal because it's not understood. Once we have the facts,

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Speaker 1: once we learn more about it, it just becomes science.

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Speaker 1: It becomes Tuesday Night, that's nothing to be amazed about it,

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Speaker 1: and it just gets introduced into what we already know

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Speaker 1: and throughout history, this is how it's gone. Listen to

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Speaker 1: more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at one am

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Speaker 1: Eastern and go to Coast to Coast a m dot

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Speaker 1: com for more