1 00:00:01,280 --> 00:00:04,320 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You missed in History Class. A production 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:14,000 Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio Happy Friday. I'm Tracy B. Wilson 3 00:00:14,160 --> 00:00:17,800 Speaker 1: and I'm Holly Fry. We talked about the Rum Rebellion. 4 00:00:18,920 --> 00:00:21,239 Speaker 1: I don't I don't know why I had it in 5 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:24,360 Speaker 1: my head so solidly that we had talked about this before, 6 00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 1: and I even looked through, like I did a search 7 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,920 Speaker 1: for the words rum rebellion in my giant folder of 8 00:00:31,960 --> 00:00:34,239 Speaker 1: old scripts for the show, trying to be like, did 9 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:36,360 Speaker 1: we just mention it in passing in one of our 10 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:41,280 Speaker 1: other related to Australia episodes, like maybe the Catalpa Mutiny 11 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 1: or maybe the Lady Julianna, like either of the NOE. 12 00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:47,960 Speaker 1: It just seems like, not, is there any chance your 13 00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:50,959 Speaker 1: brain is subbing it in for whiskey rebellion since it's 14 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 1: a spirit related It's no, definitely not definitely not. Uh 15 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 1: So yeah, um, this is definitely one of the more 16 00:01:02,760 --> 00:01:08,199 Speaker 1: ridiculous coups we've talked about, maybe the most ridiculous coup, 17 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:10,360 Speaker 1: because most of the coups that we have talked about 18 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:14,200 Speaker 1: on the show have been just horrifying and violent, and 19 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: this has, you know, horrifying context. We're talking about a 20 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:23,240 Speaker 1: prison colony in Australia, But the actual circumstances of the 21 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:28,200 Speaker 1: rebellion really seemed to be Bly did not go to 22 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:32,200 Speaker 1: Australia to make friends, and there were people there who 23 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:37,160 Speaker 1: had some really strong personalities already, and the actual coup 24 00:01:37,240 --> 00:01:41,760 Speaker 1: itself was minimally violence. There was only one person that 25 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 1: got hurt. And then you know, although Bly and his 26 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,480 Speaker 1: daughter were kept on house arrest, they were also on 27 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:52,080 Speaker 1: house arrest and what was effectively the governor's mansion. Right, 28 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:58,000 Speaker 1: So on the spectrum of cous it's like, on the goofier, 29 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 1: less violent end of the it's less harrowing than many 30 00:02:02,240 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 1: that we've talked about. Yeah, it also is, I think 31 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:08,320 Speaker 1: because so much of it boils down to kind of 32 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:11,440 Speaker 1: petty bickering that gets out of control because of egos, 33 00:02:12,639 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 1: it just lends itself to a more jocular tone. Yeah. Yeah, 34 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:21,519 Speaker 1: it's like he really liked rules. I mean, it's kind 35 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:26,200 Speaker 1: of a sitcom, right, Like he really liked rules but 36 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:29,640 Speaker 1: had a temper. He's like the boss that wants to 37 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: fix a very jumbled and messed up situation but doesn't 38 00:02:33,639 --> 00:02:37,239 Speaker 1: know how to do it in terms of interpersonal communications. 39 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:39,680 Speaker 1: So they just sweep in and like erase all that 40 00:02:39,760 --> 00:02:43,840 Speaker 1: has gone before to institute new things, which never ever works. 41 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 1: No No. I also I was kind of fascinated by 42 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 1: the descriptions of his um his sort of harangue that 43 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:57,200 Speaker 1: he would assault people with with the torrent of insults 44 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:01,960 Speaker 1: and um I wish I had written down or or 45 00:03:02,040 --> 00:03:04,600 Speaker 1: bookmarked one of the things that it would just sort 46 00:03:04,600 --> 00:03:07,639 Speaker 1: of described what these were like, and it they just 47 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:13,520 Speaker 1: in some ways just seemed like random, almost nonsensical torrents 48 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 1: of insults that were really demoralizing to the people who 49 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:20,359 Speaker 1: were hearing them, in part because they just didn't they 50 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:23,359 Speaker 1: didn't make sense, and they didn't fit with the way 51 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 1: people thought that officers should be disciplining anybody, oh humans 52 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:37,240 Speaker 1: in their piccadillos. Yeah, if you look at pictures of 53 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 1: of William Bly, he also doesn't look like you might 54 00:03:42,280 --> 00:03:47,360 Speaker 1: imagine if your familiarity with with him is like fictional 55 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 1: depictions of the Mutiny on the Bounty, where he's kind 56 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,760 Speaker 1: of this red faced, screaming tyrant. He looks like a 57 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:57,840 Speaker 1: very pale person who somehow has managed to stay in 58 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 1: the shade his whole life, in spite of being the 59 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: captain of a ship and then living in Australia. Uh, 60 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 1: maybe he always had a really lovely umbrella or Paris 61 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 1: Hall said, uh yeah, I have a think a lot 62 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:16,480 Speaker 1: about still tess of late, because I have been, you know, 63 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:20,440 Speaker 1: studying how various spirits get made, and there's part of 64 00:04:20,480 --> 00:04:22,600 Speaker 1: me that just wants to go, like you guys, it's 65 00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:28,120 Speaker 1: not that hard. You could have made more. Um well, 66 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:30,000 Speaker 1: and that was part of the thing was stills had 67 00:04:30,040 --> 00:04:33,159 Speaker 1: been outlawed and so they weren't supposed to have skills 68 00:04:33,200 --> 00:04:37,920 Speaker 1: at all. But you know, there's a whole long tradition 69 00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:41,719 Speaker 1: of the same classes of people who were transported to 70 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:47,520 Speaker 1: Australia also knowing how to keep their still secret. Um. 71 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:52,000 Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, they probably had something there that would 72 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:57,159 Speaker 1: have worked as a a base grain, yeah, to start 73 00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:03,680 Speaker 1: the whole process. Um, I don't know. I don't know 74 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:07,039 Speaker 1: if sugarcane grows there, I don't know. Um, but you 75 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 1: don't need you can. You can make lots of other 76 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:12,040 Speaker 1: spirits with other grains, any of which would have been 77 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:16,159 Speaker 1: known to anybody that came from England. So right, and 78 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:19,240 Speaker 1: we know that they we had previously talked about people 79 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:23,560 Speaker 1: having io used that used tweet as currency, right, so 80 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:27,320 Speaker 1: you can, man, I'm just imagining a whole now very 81 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:31,679 Speaker 1: complicated monetary system for the colony of New South Wales, 82 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:38,919 Speaker 1: overlapping between wheat and alcohol. Yes, So anyway, now you 83 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 1: know what's kind of weird connections. My brain will go 84 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:46,599 Speaker 1: down these kinds of episode of So Tracy. This week 85 00:05:46,640 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 1: we had as a guest the wonderful and very charming 86 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 1: Jeremy Kat's show, which is just so delightful to get 87 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:57,720 Speaker 1: to spend time with him and talk. Um. I was 88 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:00,600 Speaker 1: so excited because it was kind of happening at the 89 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 1: same time we were getting that episode ready that he 90 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:07,119 Speaker 1: got to talk about having picked up the Hebrew Bible 91 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:10,400 Speaker 1: that John Assof had been sworn in on them, right, um, 92 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:14,600 Speaker 1: And he mentioned that that that Bible had belonged to 93 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:18,800 Speaker 1: Rabbi Rothschild. I don't remember if we connected the dots 94 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 1: really that like he was a civil rights leader, he 95 00:06:21,560 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 1: was the rabbi at the temple when it was bombed 96 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:28,160 Speaker 1: in nine So it is a really interesting piece of 97 00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 1: history for a number of reasons. And that they now 98 00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:33,560 Speaker 1: get to have it in their collection and share it 99 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 1: with people as this this monumental you know, prop sounds 100 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 1: demeaning to it. But this item, that's that's part of 101 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 1: the props of the world stage of like these very 102 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: vital moments in Jewish history and Atlanta. I don't know, 103 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 1: it's just very cool. History is still alive. We're making 104 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:54,720 Speaker 1: it all the time. Um So, I went to that 105 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 1: museum once when I lived in Atlanta. I went there 106 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:02,680 Speaker 1: with my friend Aaron, and they have an exhibit that is, 107 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:05,520 Speaker 1: um like a history of the Jewish community in Atlanta 108 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:08,920 Speaker 1: through a set of I think eighteen artifacts. There's a 109 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:13,480 Speaker 1: number of artifacts, and then the temporary exhibit was on 110 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:18,920 Speaker 1: Murray Sendec. Loved it so much. The other thing I 111 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:20,720 Speaker 1: got really excited about when you told me you were 112 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:25,280 Speaker 1: doing this interview is I am so fascinated by these 113 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:28,560 Speaker 1: Images of America books that this book is part of. 114 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:33,720 Speaker 1: Like anytime I walk into some random in the middle 115 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:37,000 Speaker 1: of nowhere place that has a gift shop and the 116 00:07:37,120 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: gift shop has an Images of America book that is 117 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:45,000 Speaker 1: about that specific places history, I'm just deeply fascinated by 118 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 1: I have. I have one of them on my desk 119 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,800 Speaker 1: right now, which is about a place called break Heart Reservation, 120 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: which today is like a um a park with lots 121 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 1: of walking trails and a playground and and hiking in 122 00:07:58,880 --> 00:08:01,960 Speaker 1: that kind of thing. Um, having the whole history of it. 123 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:04,280 Speaker 1: And as soon as you told me, I was like, 124 00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 1: I'm incredibly just like I want to note number one, 125 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:16,160 Speaker 1: Like I have this imagined world of like how how 126 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:19,280 Speaker 1: it becomes, how these books come into existence in so 127 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 1: many places, um, And then anytime I see one, I 128 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 1: just want to look through it and take it home. 129 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:28,480 Speaker 1: I would have a whole library of just imagism of 130 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:32,640 Speaker 1: America books random places. They're really really good. And I 131 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:35,040 Speaker 1: was glad that Jeremy shared with us kind of the 132 00:08:35,120 --> 00:08:37,079 Speaker 1: process of how that came to be a thing, and 133 00:08:37,880 --> 00:08:40,079 Speaker 1: and you know, he of course kind of had a 134 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:42,320 Speaker 1: similar project in mind already, so he was a little 135 00:08:42,360 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 1: ahead of the game. But yeah, I mean it's one 136 00:08:44,520 --> 00:08:46,680 Speaker 1: of those things too, right. I have lived in Atlanta 137 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:50,400 Speaker 1: for a long time now, with like thirty years, and 138 00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: just flipping through it, you know, is an interesting walk, 139 00:08:55,320 --> 00:08:57,920 Speaker 1: not quite down memory lane, because many of these things 140 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:01,400 Speaker 1: certainly predated my time here, but you see the things 141 00:09:01,559 --> 00:09:06,000 Speaker 1: that that continue to persist as part of Atlanta culture. Um. 142 00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:08,360 Speaker 1: One of the things that really kind of struck me. 143 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:12,320 Speaker 1: It does not exist any longer. It has been absorbed 144 00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 1: by a larger conglomerate. But Riches department store for the 145 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 1: very longest time was like and icon of Atlantic culture. Yeah. 146 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:25,200 Speaker 1: And I worked in the Riches for years. I worked 147 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:28,120 Speaker 1: in the salons there, and so to see pictures of 148 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:32,120 Speaker 1: the original Riches, yeah, it just did something to my heart. 149 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 1: It's so wonderful. One of the other, like previous temporary 150 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:40,840 Speaker 1: exhibits at the museum, like, was a history of Riches, 151 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 1: which I thought was really like. I didn't personally see 152 00:09:43,000 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 1: that one, but I thought it was really cool. It's 153 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:47,840 Speaker 1: very very cool. Um. Yeah, you do sort of realize 154 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: how much how much Atlanta has been shaped by its 155 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,880 Speaker 1: Jewish community in ways that we don't always appreciate. So 156 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: I was really happy to have him on with us. 157 00:09:56,559 --> 00:09:58,719 Speaker 1: We also made a deal after we finished recording that 158 00:09:58,800 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 1: once we are both vaccinated, I'm gonna go visit the 159 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 1: Freeman and he's going to give me a tour, which 160 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:08,319 Speaker 1: I was private tour of a museum my my dream, 161 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:11,599 Speaker 1: my dream scenarios. So we are going to go do 162 00:10:11,720 --> 00:10:13,559 Speaker 1: that and hopefully he'll let me take him to lunch 163 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:16,920 Speaker 1: or something. But I hope people, I mean like you, 164 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:20,319 Speaker 1: I love these books. I just think visually they offer 165 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:23,760 Speaker 1: such an easy entry point to history and in ways 166 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 1: that they're all also always so well written, even though 167 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:31,319 Speaker 1: there's limited text space. It's like whoever edits them to 168 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:35,920 Speaker 1: be concise but also really clear and very um good 169 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:39,640 Speaker 1: at conveying you know, really the importance and the significance 170 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:41,840 Speaker 1: of what you're seeing is doing an a plus job. 171 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 1: Whoever the editors are on this series, kudos you so so. 172 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:49,560 Speaker 1: Wherever you are and run into these, I highly recommend them. 173 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:52,640 Speaker 1: And again, I'm just super grateful I had that conversation. 174 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:57,000 Speaker 1: We hope that whatever the weekend has in store for you, 175 00:10:57,200 --> 00:11:00,200 Speaker 1: that it is delightful and enjoyable, and that you as 176 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 1: good a time as possible, and we will see you 177 00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 1: right back here, starting tomorrow with a classic and then 178 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: next week with new episodes. Stuff you Missed in History 179 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 1: Class is a production of I Heart Radio. For more 180 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 1: podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, 181 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.