1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:02,920 Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:10,000 Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to stump Mom Never told you? 3 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:17,560 Speaker 1: From House Step Works dot Com. Hello, and welcome to 4 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:21,079 Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Kristen and I'm Molly Molly. Now that 5 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:27,639 Speaker 1: Halloween has come and gone, we're officially in the holiday season. 6 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:30,440 Speaker 1: I'm going to refuse to admit that. I know, I 7 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:33,760 Speaker 1: hate to say it, but we are. It's coming. It's inevitable. 8 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:36,520 Speaker 1: Christmas trees are already up in stores. I know, I've seen. 9 00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:42,560 Speaker 1: I've seen Christmas displays in stores, which is horrific. However, 10 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:44,640 Speaker 1: I figured would be a good time since we are 11 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:46,959 Speaker 1: in the holiday season now, we're not going to talk 12 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:52,360 Speaker 1: about presents or anything like that. We're gonna talk about booze, 13 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:57,480 Speaker 1: right because with the holiday season comes holiday parties, holiday parties, drinking, 14 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 1: all that office parties, which is really I mean, that's 15 00:01:01,960 --> 00:01:05,759 Speaker 1: just another podcast. Oh yeah, that's a minefield right there. 16 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 1: I just generally choose to avoid them at all costs. Um, 17 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 1: But we wanted to talk about women and drinking because 18 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: over the past couple of years, there have been a 19 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 1: lot of stories about how women in particular are drinking 20 00:01:23,080 --> 00:01:26,400 Speaker 1: more than ever before, and especially a couple of years ago, 21 00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 1: around two thousand and eight, there was there were all 22 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 1: of these discussions about women drinking more and what does 23 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 1: that mean? What is that saying about who we are? 24 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 1: Are we just drinking? Is a sign of our empowerment? 25 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: All this kind of stuff. So why don't we get 26 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 1: down to the stats about, you know, our women drinking, 27 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 1: who's drinking more? And why this might be? I don't 28 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:52,560 Speaker 1: know a cause for concern or not a cause for 29 00:01:52,600 --> 00:01:55,040 Speaker 1: concern at all. And I think this serves two purposes 30 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:58,600 Speaker 1: at once. Not only we will investigate this association of 31 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:01,320 Speaker 1: women alcohol, but when you are at these holiday parties 32 00:02:01,840 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: enjoying you know, a lovely mold cider or smegnog, you 33 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:09,520 Speaker 1: will have conversation tidbits to throw out. They might label 34 00:02:09,560 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 1: you as a debbute downer. People might feel like, oh, 35 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:15,639 Speaker 1: don't talk to that girl or guy. But yeah, we're 36 00:02:15,639 --> 00:02:19,119 Speaker 1: gonna do what we can do. Yes, So why don't 37 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:23,400 Speaker 1: we start with this trend of women drinking more? Shall we? So? 38 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,760 Speaker 1: In two thousand eight there was an article in New 39 00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: York Magazine that we're going to reference a lot throughout 40 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:33,320 Speaker 1: the podcast and One of the statistics that throughout was 41 00:02:33,360 --> 00:02:36,320 Speaker 1: that the number of women who identifies moderate to heavy 42 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:39,239 Speaker 1: drinkers has gone up in the last ten years, while 43 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 1: the number of women who are light drinkers has declined, 44 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:46,600 Speaker 1: and at the same time, the number of men who 45 00:02:46,639 --> 00:02:50,120 Speaker 1: are drinking pretty much just staying at the same rate. 46 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:54,000 Speaker 1: So while men's drinking seems to have plateaued, they're not 47 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 1: only more women drinking, but more women who are reporting 48 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:00,919 Speaker 1: bins drinking. And there was another their study that came 49 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,079 Speaker 1: out not too long ago. This was from the British 50 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:09,240 Speaker 1: Liver Trust I wouldn't want to work um that found 51 00:03:09,280 --> 00:03:12,359 Speaker 1: that more than one in three women over thirty five 52 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:14,960 Speaker 1: years old drinks more than they did in their teens. 53 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:18,280 Speaker 1: So they think there's just there there has been this 54 00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:20,920 Speaker 1: upward spike. And then also in the teen years, we 55 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:24,960 Speaker 1: have more girls drinking than ever before. It's roughly a 56 00:03:25,120 --> 00:03:27,640 Speaker 1: third of girls who have already had a drink before 57 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 1: they enter high school. Around half of girls in high 58 00:03:30,160 --> 00:03:32,280 Speaker 1: school say that they drink regularly, and about a quarter 59 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:35,440 Speaker 1: of those girls say that they've bench drink regularly. Now 60 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:38,480 Speaker 1: I'm like, I don't know about you, but that was 61 00:03:38,520 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 1: not a mind boggling statistic to hear as someone who 62 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:46,200 Speaker 1: has been in high school not too terribly long ago. 63 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:48,560 Speaker 1: Not to say that I went to school with, you know, 64 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 1: with a bunch of raging alcoholics, but but you know, 65 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 1: when those homeschoolers get a little taste of freedom, oh man, crazy. 66 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 1: Well I also think I think, um, first thing we 67 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:00,840 Speaker 1: should say is that maybe these girls just more comfortable 68 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,320 Speaker 1: talking about their drinking. You know, we've also had sex 69 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:06,040 Speaker 1: in the city come up in the past decade, and 70 00:04:06,080 --> 00:04:10,200 Speaker 1: you see these girls just very comfortable with drinking cocktails. It's, 71 00:04:10,280 --> 00:04:12,360 Speaker 1: you know, something you do every time you go out 72 00:04:12,600 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 1: that maybe a lot of people just learned it's okay 73 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 1: to say that they drink. Yeah, I mean, but I 74 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 1: will say though, on the flip side of that argument, 75 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 1: if you watch old movies, people are always drinking and smoking. 76 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:24,120 Speaker 1: A lot of women always have a cocktail in their hands. 77 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 1: So I don't, yeah, I don't. I don't know necessarily 78 00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 1: if it is just pop culture making it more acceptable. 79 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 1: But maybe it has something to do though, with women 80 00:04:34,839 --> 00:04:39,159 Speaker 1: being more educated and being uh and holding um, higher 81 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:42,320 Speaker 1: paying jobs. That's possible. That's um sort of the cusp 82 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:45,040 Speaker 1: of this argument. We'll get into that drinking is a 83 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: very empowering feminist action. But let's talk a little more 84 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:51,120 Speaker 1: about other factors that might account for these rise. A 85 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 1: big thing that a lot of these articles talk about 86 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:57,920 Speaker 1: is the way that advertisers are now targeting these young 87 00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:03,040 Speaker 1: girls as potential customers. You mean, think about um all 88 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:04,920 Speaker 1: the flavored buck because you've seen come up in the 89 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,480 Speaker 1: past few years. You've seen um Alco pops coming up 90 00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,080 Speaker 1: where it's like a smart officer and Mike, Mike har lemonade, 91 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:15,920 Speaker 1: something that's not um, something that's tasty. Yeah, these sweet, 92 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 1: non non beer types of alcohol. And the New York 93 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:24,840 Speaker 1: Magazine article linked that to this statistic that found the 94 00:05:25,240 --> 00:05:29,080 Speaker 1: rate of frequent binge drinking is up by or went 95 00:05:29,200 --> 00:05:33,520 Speaker 1: up I should say, by between and two thousand one. 96 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:35,880 Speaker 1: And it was around the early two thousand's when all 97 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:39,880 Speaker 1: of these Alco pops as they call them, became really popular. 98 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 1: So I think that those could be two factors. The 99 00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:44,760 Speaker 1: fact that, you know, drinking is front and center with 100 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:47,040 Speaker 1: the sex and the city thing. We've we've attributed everything 101 00:05:47,080 --> 00:05:50,600 Speaker 1: from pantyhose to you know, god knows what else, just 102 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 1: a sex and the city. So I do think that 103 00:05:52,160 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: maybe girls would feel more comfortable telling our researcher, hey, 104 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 1: I'm drinking more. And I also think that there's more 105 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:00,279 Speaker 1: of a market for these girls. But just ignore those 106 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:02,600 Speaker 1: Let's just say that, yes, these statistics are showing that 107 00:06:02,640 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: women are drinking more independent of these other factors. The 108 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:09,120 Speaker 1: question then becomes for all these writers, is this something 109 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:11,720 Speaker 1: to worry about? Where is this no big deal in 110 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 1: terms of whether or not alcohol should be something that 111 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:17,839 Speaker 1: women should worry about. I think that this whole you know, 112 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 1: idea of whether or not it's empowering and all of 113 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 1: the social and cultural implications or something that to me, 114 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 1: the friend center issue when it comes to women in 115 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:28,320 Speaker 1: alcohol is how it affects our bodies and how it 116 00:06:28,320 --> 00:06:30,960 Speaker 1: affects our bodies differently from men. Because I don't know 117 00:06:31,000 --> 00:06:34,279 Speaker 1: about you, Molly, but when you started getting the anti 118 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 1: drinking lectures in high school and college, it was always 119 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 1: emphasized that women cannot drink as much or should not 120 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:46,680 Speaker 1: drink as much as men because alcohol affects our bodies differently. 121 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:49,960 Speaker 1: I think that it's pretty common knowledge. And the three 122 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:54,520 Speaker 1: main reasons why booze affects us differently as women is 123 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:58,000 Speaker 1: because we have a more body fat that just soaks 124 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:02,279 Speaker 1: it up like a sponge body that loves booth. And 125 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: then we also have less water in our bodies that 126 00:07:05,200 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 1: dilutes the alcohol. We also have less of an enzyme 127 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 1: that helps metabolize alcohol. So if you have one drink 128 00:07:12,880 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 1: and the guy next to you has wane to drink, 129 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 1: that drink is gonna affect your body much more profoundly 130 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:19,360 Speaker 1: than it's ever going to affect his. Right. In fact, 131 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:23,640 Speaker 1: heavy drinkers increase their risk of death by stroke just 132 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 1: across the board, male or female, but for women compared 133 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 1: to men, their risk is twice as high. And then 134 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:33,920 Speaker 1: there are other types of health implications, such as a 135 00:07:33,960 --> 00:07:37,480 Speaker 1: study released by the American Heart Association reporting that men 136 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: who drink four more alcoholic beverages a day may in 137 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: fact lower their risk of dying from heart disease, whereas 138 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 1: women who are drinking the same amount well quadruple their risk. 139 00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:50,320 Speaker 1: Even in the womb, alcohol seems to affect girls a 140 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:53,960 Speaker 1: little bit more than boys. Um, there's been research finding 141 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 1: that UH family children with UH or I should say, 142 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 1: daughters from a family history of alcoholism produce more of 143 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:06,560 Speaker 1: saliva when exposed to alcohol, indicating more of a predisposed 144 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 1: craving for it um. Teenage girls whose moms drink during 145 00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:13,400 Speaker 1: pregnancy were six times more likely to drink, whereas there 146 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 1: was very little correlation between teenage boys and drinking if 147 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 1: their mother was an alcoholic. So there does seem to 148 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 1: be some sort of big health gap between men and 149 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: women in terms of how alcohol or affects our bodies 150 00:08:29,640 --> 00:08:32,880 Speaker 1: for the long term. And that's men versus women. When 151 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:36,080 Speaker 1: you take women versus women, the Harvard Health Letter writes 152 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:38,080 Speaker 1: that compared with women who don't drink or who drink 153 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 1: in moderation, women who drink heavily have an increased risk 154 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:47,680 Speaker 1: frostel porosis, falls hip fractures, premature menopause, infertility, miscarriages, hypertension, 155 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:52,800 Speaker 1: and cardiovascular diseases including coronary artery disease, rhythmias, and cardiomyopathy. 156 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 1: And then the big one is breast cancer. With an 157 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: average of one drink a day, according to Harvard, the 158 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:03,360 Speaker 1: risk of breast cancer for WOE increases about ten percent, 159 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:07,800 Speaker 1: and that's excluding any other genetic factors. But it does 160 00:09:07,840 --> 00:09:10,040 Speaker 1: seem like a lot of this, uh, a lot of 161 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:11,920 Speaker 1: we do get a lot of mixed messages when it 162 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 1: comes to alcohol, because we do hear about how having 163 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:17,600 Speaker 1: a glass of red wine might be good for your heart, 164 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:20,199 Speaker 1: whereas that glass of red wine might be raising a 165 00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:22,200 Speaker 1: risk of breast cancer. And I think there's also a 166 00:09:22,200 --> 00:09:27,280 Speaker 1: difference in how um talking about alcoholism is different between 167 00:09:27,280 --> 00:09:29,240 Speaker 1: men and women, because a lot of these studies you 168 00:09:29,320 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 1: read said that women are at risk of telescoping, which 169 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 1: means that they become addicted to alcohol much faster than 170 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:38,720 Speaker 1: the men do. But what they're saying is that the 171 00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:42,000 Speaker 1: men have an easier time disguising the problems of their 172 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:45,520 Speaker 1: alcoholism than the women do. And women often suffer from 173 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:48,720 Speaker 1: alcoholism in conjunction with a lot of other mental disorders 174 00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:51,600 Speaker 1: like depression and bipolar disorder. And they're saying that that 175 00:09:51,640 --> 00:09:53,240 Speaker 1: means that a lot of these women are not getting 176 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:55,600 Speaker 1: the treatment that they need. And that's on an extreme scale. 177 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:57,559 Speaker 1: We're gonna take it back down to just you know, 178 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:00,560 Speaker 1: a casual drinker. But I think that a lot of 179 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,240 Speaker 1: these studies may have come about just because they're where 180 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 1: they weren't targeting these female alcoholics, right. But then when 181 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:09,440 Speaker 1: we're talking about telescoping, kind of like that, uh, the 182 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:13,840 Speaker 1: conflicting information about breast cancer and the heart benefits, heart 183 00:10:13,840 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 1: health benefits of red wine. There was another study that 184 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:20,240 Speaker 1: came out not too long ago saying that finding no 185 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:25,320 Speaker 1: evidence of telescoping and women. So maybe the big question is, 186 00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 1: you know whether or not all these surveys about alcohol 187 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 1: are even that accurate. If you are doubting, you know, 188 00:10:32,240 --> 00:10:34,520 Speaker 1: six eight, ten drinks a day, are you really going 189 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:36,880 Speaker 1: to tell someone about that? Are you gonna be honest 190 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:40,600 Speaker 1: about it? Maybe these statistics are skewed, But I will 191 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 1: say that when it comes to conflicting ideas and debates 192 00:10:44,960 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 1: about women and alcohol, yes, the health information can be 193 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: pretty confusing, but not quite as confusing as the debate 194 00:10:54,760 --> 00:10:59,440 Speaker 1: over alcohol and feminism. Right, and you go back to 195 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:02,200 Speaker 1: this M York magazine article that Kristen is talking about. 196 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:05,440 Speaker 1: The writer makes this case that the reason that women 197 00:11:05,480 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: are drinking more, which is what these statistics are showing, 198 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:11,559 Speaker 1: it is because of feminism that in time and trying 199 00:11:11,600 --> 00:11:15,600 Speaker 1: to become equals with men, Uh, they are taking the 200 00:11:15,640 --> 00:11:20,319 Speaker 1: men's cues on social alcohol use and um. She talks 201 00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:23,680 Speaker 1: a lot about this paradox of how women are drinking 202 00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:27,760 Speaker 1: to become more empowered and to feel more equal. But 203 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:30,400 Speaker 1: it's a it's a hobby that if you abuse it 204 00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:35,040 Speaker 1: can leave you sort of incapacitated and uh, stupid for 205 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 1: lack of a better word. Now, when we're talking about 206 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:40,119 Speaker 1: these women who are her drinking quote unquote for empowerment, 207 00:11:40,120 --> 00:11:42,559 Speaker 1: a lot of times this is in reference to female 208 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:48,119 Speaker 1: college students and young professionals. And the New York Magazine 209 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:52,520 Speaker 1: article points out statistics saying that as a result of 210 00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:55,320 Speaker 1: all of this drinking, this what it seems to be 211 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:59,760 Speaker 1: portrayed as misguided drinking. Um are statistics showing that on 212 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:03,440 Speaker 1: a lot of college campuses there have been a rise 213 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:09,800 Speaker 1: in girls reporting sexual assault related to drinking, uh, saying 214 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:14,559 Speaker 1: that they regret having sex with someone while they were drinking. Whereas, 215 00:12:14,640 --> 00:12:15,960 Speaker 1: at the same time, when you talk to the girls 216 00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:19,560 Speaker 1: when they're sober before they go out, they're drinking specifically 217 00:12:19,640 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: because they want to get sexy, you know, they say, 218 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:27,360 Speaker 1: you know, it loosens inhibitions. And if I'm just trying 219 00:12:27,400 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 1: to be as free as a guy, what better than 220 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:33,400 Speaker 1: this equalizer that will help me feel you know, but loosen, 221 00:12:33,440 --> 00:12:36,320 Speaker 1: fancy free, right. And I think that that's a product 222 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 1: of a lot of these mixed cultural messages that we're 223 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:41,199 Speaker 1: having I'm not saying that at all, and I don't 224 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:43,640 Speaker 1: think you're saying it either, Molly, that the girls in 225 00:12:43,679 --> 00:12:45,839 Speaker 1: college shouldn't drink and shouldn't go and have a good 226 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:48,520 Speaker 1: time and should be held to some different type of 227 00:12:48,600 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: standard as guys are, because while they are all of 228 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:54,319 Speaker 1: these alarmists studies saying, oh dear god, you know, women 229 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:57,320 Speaker 1: who are educated are two point one time is more 230 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: likely to have a drink every day. What does this mean? Um, 231 00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: we're not talking at all about how guys are still 232 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 1: drinking as much as they used to. And when you 233 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:09,920 Speaker 1: look at all those surveys, who are the people overall 234 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:12,640 Speaker 1: in the total population who are drinking the most, it 235 00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:15,199 Speaker 1: is men, right, And you brought up a really good 236 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:17,880 Speaker 1: point we were talking earlier about how in some ways 237 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,400 Speaker 1: it's just, you know, it's just shaming these girls, like 238 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,560 Speaker 1: you said, into keeping this different standard while there are 239 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:27,199 Speaker 1: plenty of girls who can you know, handle their alcohol 240 00:13:27,280 --> 00:13:31,120 Speaker 1: responsibly drink and moderation, Um aren't bene drinking, And it 241 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 1: kind of just paints a really broad picture. Some of 242 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:36,680 Speaker 1: these trund pieces do of you know, there's no difference 243 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 1: between someone who enjoys, you know, a few glasses of 244 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:42,200 Speaker 1: why I'm like dinner and someone who is blacking out 245 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:44,760 Speaker 1: every night because they're doing you know, fifty six shots, 246 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:49,120 Speaker 1: which you should never ever do. Know. And there's an epidemiologist, 247 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:53,920 Speaker 1: Dr Richard Gruska who is studied this um, this rise 248 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:58,200 Speaker 1: and drinking pretty extensively, and he links it back at 249 00:13:58,240 --> 00:14:02,040 Speaker 1: least this trend among women to second wave feminism, you know, 250 00:14:02,080 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 1: in this whole idea of empowerment. But with their arguments 251 00:14:06,160 --> 00:14:09,120 Speaker 1: on both sides of the table, with older feminists saying, 252 00:14:09,280 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: you know, looking at people of our generation, Molly, and 253 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:15,560 Speaker 1: saying that you guys are distorting um the ideals that 254 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:18,480 Speaker 1: we fought for by just getting drunk and having sex 255 00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:22,880 Speaker 1: and calling that empowerment, whereas you have younger feminists, you know, 256 00:14:23,640 --> 00:14:27,720 Speaker 1: arguing the opposite. I think that we need to eliminate 257 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 1: feminism completely from this discussion about alcohol and and just 258 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 1: own up to our behaviors. It's an adult behavior. You 259 00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:40,320 Speaker 1: know that it has effects on our body, So why 260 00:14:40,320 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 1: don't we stop debating whether or not it's empowering or 261 00:14:43,440 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 1: not and just fess up to the fact that we 262 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:48,160 Speaker 1: want to have a drink. Well, And I think it's 263 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 1: interesting Christen you consider like how they're talking about women 264 00:14:51,280 --> 00:14:54,640 Speaker 1: using alcohol versus how they're talking about women who use cigarettes, 265 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 1: And you know, syriotes can cause a lot of these 266 00:14:57,200 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 1: same problems. And I think that women probably smoke for 267 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 1: sometimes the same reason in terms of keeping up with 268 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:04,960 Speaker 1: the guys. But it's just because this is a little 269 00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:07,760 Speaker 1: bit more acceptable, it's coming down harder. It's almost like 270 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:10,840 Speaker 1: the women who are drinking in moderation are dealing with 271 00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:13,600 Speaker 1: more of a stigma sometimes and just these women who 272 00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 1: are smoking, Whereas I think, you know, when you look 273 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 1: at what it does to your body, the smoking can 274 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:20,200 Speaker 1: be far worse than a few drinks with dinner. So, 275 00:15:20,280 --> 00:15:22,680 Speaker 1: like you said, I think that it's, um, it's so 276 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:24,840 Speaker 1: weird that it has gotten wrapped up in feminism because 277 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:28,800 Speaker 1: it makes it so much more loaded than uh, just 278 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:30,960 Speaker 1: having a glass of wine with dinner. Should be right, 279 00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:34,040 Speaker 1: because it's interesting because on the one hand, you have, um, 280 00:15:34,080 --> 00:15:38,000 Speaker 1: you know, the argument of linking second wave feminism empowerment 281 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:42,120 Speaker 1: to drinking like a man. And then you also have, um, 282 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 1: the argument of saying, hey, remember the feminist before us 283 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:49,800 Speaker 1: who fought for the temperance movement. You know, it's that's 284 00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:54,040 Speaker 1: not getting us anywhere. So, so we want to know 285 00:15:54,080 --> 00:15:56,640 Speaker 1: what you guys think. Do you, ladies, when you drink 286 00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:59,680 Speaker 1: you feel empowered? Do you feel a kinship with with 287 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 1: Glora A steinem and and the freedoms that you're great? 288 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 1: Because in some ways, yes, it is a step forward. 289 00:16:05,600 --> 00:16:07,080 Speaker 1: I suppose that a girl can go out to a 290 00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:09,520 Speaker 1: bar and have have a few drinks and did you 291 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,560 Speaker 1: say so and it's been drinking healthy? Absolutely No, we're 292 00:16:12,600 --> 00:16:15,720 Speaker 1: not advocating that either. And I do think that women 293 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:20,320 Speaker 1: need to, above all else, simply take into account the 294 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 1: potential long term health of us. Right, So what do 295 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:25,280 Speaker 1: you guys think? Do you even uh, does any of 296 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:27,160 Speaker 1: this even cross your mind when you have a drink? 297 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 1: And will it now? Will you go to those holiday 298 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 1: parties and just become um feminist spokespeople? For what what 299 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 1: you think? You're active drinking implies? We want to hear 300 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 1: from you. It's mom stuff at house stuff works dot 301 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:43,000 Speaker 1: com and christ and I believe we have time for 302 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:49,520 Speaker 1: some listener mills. I have one from Anna and she writes, 303 00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 1: I just got done listening to your podcast about Halloween 304 00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,680 Speaker 1: costum costumes, which was timely since Trick or Treat was tonight, 305 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:58,520 Speaker 1: my three kids dressed as one a vampire to Scooby Doo, 306 00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 1: and three a dragon. Everyone kept referring to my three 307 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 1: year old drag daughter who dresses a dragon as a boy, 308 00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:06,520 Speaker 1: even though she has long hair and had it in pigtails. 309 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:08,800 Speaker 1: She's too young to care if people think she's a boy, 310 00:17:08,840 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: but it bothered my oldest daughter a lot that they 311 00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:12,879 Speaker 1: kept getting it wrong. Last year, my then three year 312 00:17:12,880 --> 00:17:15,360 Speaker 1: old son wanted to dress as a purple princess for Halloween, 313 00:17:15,359 --> 00:17:17,040 Speaker 1: and I got some strange looks for letting my three 314 00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:19,360 Speaker 1: year old dress and drag, but no one mistook him 315 00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 1: for a girl. I found it interesting that a preschool 316 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:23,439 Speaker 1: boy dressed as a girl would still be recognized as 317 00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:25,680 Speaker 1: a boy, but a girl in a fairly neutral costume 318 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:28,840 Speaker 1: would be assumed to be a boy. My eight year 319 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 1: old daughter and I went shopping from my Halloween costume together. 320 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:33,560 Speaker 1: I was going to host a homeschool Halloween party for 321 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:35,240 Speaker 1: her friends, so I thought I should dress up. But 322 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:37,119 Speaker 1: this would be the first time in her memory that 323 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:39,640 Speaker 1: I'd be dressing up for Halloween. It seemed like every 324 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:41,640 Speaker 1: costume we looked at was of the sexy variety, which 325 00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:44,080 Speaker 1: I didn't think would be appropriate for hosting a children's party, 326 00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 1: but were never again. She would pick out a costume 327 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:47,520 Speaker 1: for me that would have been not safe for work 328 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:49,639 Speaker 1: on me, and I would explain to her that it 329 00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:52,680 Speaker 1: wouldn't be appropriate to our sexy costume to a children's party. 330 00:17:53,080 --> 00:17:55,000 Speaker 1: Finally we found a witch costume which meant all of 331 00:17:55,000 --> 00:17:57,159 Speaker 1: my requirements for covering body parts, and we loved the 332 00:17:57,200 --> 00:17:59,320 Speaker 1: store and the parking lot of the story ran into 333 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:01,280 Speaker 1: my work, supervir and the first words out of her 334 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: mouth where my mom's a witch because she's not sexy 335 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 1: to which, and it says sometimes as a mom, you 336 00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:09,720 Speaker 1: get the message across, and sometimes you don't. Well, I've 337 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 1: got another Halloween email here, and Lachlin writes, I just 338 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:18,359 Speaker 1: finished listening to your Sexy Halloween Costumes podcast, and I 339 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: kept hoping you would bring up Dan savages theory on Halloween, 340 00:18:22,359 --> 00:18:25,000 Speaker 1: which is that it's turning into the straight people version 341 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:28,800 Speaker 1: of Pride. I like that idea because everyone going out 342 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:33,080 Speaker 1: to celebrate their heterosexuality by wearing revealing costumes and breaking 343 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:36,399 Speaker 1: some social taboos sounds a lot nicer than just calling 344 00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:40,280 Speaker 1: it slutterween. All right, so thanks for pointing that out. 345 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:43,639 Speaker 1: I actually had not heard about Dan savages Halloween theory, 346 00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:46,960 Speaker 1: but is it mix makes sense. So if you have 347 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:49,680 Speaker 1: anything you'd like to write us about, you can shoot 348 00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:52,600 Speaker 1: us an email Mom Stuff at how stuff works dot com. 349 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:55,679 Speaker 1: You can also head over to our Facebook page and 350 00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:57,800 Speaker 1: like us love us right on our wall. We'd love 351 00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:00,199 Speaker 1: to see you there, and you can also follow us 352 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:04,320 Speaker 1: on Twitter at mom Stuff Podcasts. Then, finally, you can 353 00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 1: read our blog during the week. It's stuff Mom Never 354 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:13,439 Speaker 1: Told You, and It's how Stuff Works dot com for 355 00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 1: moralness and thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff 356 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:19,119 Speaker 1: works dot com the how Stuff Works dot Com. My 357 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:22,000 Speaker 1: phone app is coming soon. Get access to our content 358 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 1: in a new way, articles, videos, and more all on 359 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:28,560 Speaker 1: the go. Check out the latest podcasts and blog posts, 360 00:19:28,800 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 1: and see what we're saying on Facebook and Twitter. Coming 361 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:39,200 Speaker 1: soon to iTunes. Brought to you by the reinvented two 362 00:19:39,200 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 1: thousand twelve camera. It's ready, are you