1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: I've heard a lot of different theories about my biological father. 2 00:00:03,040 --> 00:00:05,640 Speaker 1: I have heard that he was a reporter. I heard 3 00:00:05,760 --> 00:00:08,640 Speaker 1: that he was somebody that worked with her at the 4 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:12,560 Speaker 1: post office. I heard that it was another inmate's husband. 5 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:14,520 Speaker 1: I've heard that it was just some guy off the street. 6 00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:16,759 Speaker 1: She knew she was going to get pregnant, and she 7 00:00:16,800 --> 00:00:18,480 Speaker 1: wanted to get pregnant, and just picked up the first 8 00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 1: guy she saw, So you know, I don't know. 9 00:00:22,079 --> 00:00:25,480 Speaker 2: In nineteen eighty three, Diane Downs shot her three children, 10 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 2: killing her daughter Cheryl and forever altering the lives of 11 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:32,360 Speaker 2: not only her two surviving children, but the other people 12 00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:36,279 Speaker 2: in her life. Before her imprisonment, she purposely set out 13 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 2: to give birth to another child, who would incidentally become 14 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:43,920 Speaker 2: another life permanently changed by Diane's actions. There's a tired 15 00:00:43,960 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 2: old idiom that people often use when confronting the things 16 00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 2: they've buried and hidden. The truth will set you free. 17 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 2: The fact is, sometimes the truth is its own prison, 18 00:00:53,920 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 2: like when the truth of who your father is becomes 19 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:59,440 Speaker 2: a dark shadow that follows you and suffocates you until 20 00:00:59,480 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 2: you finally are forced to confront it. When eleven year 21 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 2: old Becky found out her biological mother was Diane Downs. 22 00:01:05,880 --> 00:01:08,640 Speaker 2: It disrupted her identity and changed the course of her 23 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:12,400 Speaker 2: behavior and her life. Now she's seeking the other half 24 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:16,600 Speaker 2: of that puzzle, the identity of her biological father, someone 25 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:19,800 Speaker 2: who may or may not even know she exists. Will 26 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:22,120 Speaker 2: that truth help bring balance to the way of her 27 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:24,600 Speaker 2: own truth or will it only further add to the 28 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:37,640 Speaker 2: chaos of her self image. Without knowing for sure the 29 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:40,520 Speaker 2: identity of Becky's father, one has to wonder if he 30 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 2: himself is even aware that Becky is his. 31 00:01:43,760 --> 00:01:45,319 Speaker 3: It crosses in my mind sometimes. 32 00:01:45,360 --> 00:01:49,400 Speaker 1: I mean, maybe he just doesn't want to believe that 33 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:51,360 Speaker 1: I could be that child, or that he could be 34 00:01:51,360 --> 00:01:54,880 Speaker 1: that father, because I've been public now for ten years 35 00:01:54,920 --> 00:01:58,520 Speaker 1: with my story, and if my biological father wanted to 36 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:00,880 Speaker 1: find me, he would have the only things I can 37 00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:03,960 Speaker 1: come up with. Or he doesn't know he's my biological father, 38 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 1: he doesn't want to be my biological father, or is deceased. 39 00:02:08,520 --> 00:02:10,840 Speaker 1: I mean, if you are intimate with somebody in nine 40 00:02:10,880 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 1: months later there's a baby, I would question that. 41 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 2: There was very little physical description of the father given, 42 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:20,359 Speaker 2: and what's there didn't help narrow down the possibilities. 43 00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 1: My adopted mom, she told me that on my adoption 44 00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 1: paperwork that he was listed as being like six', two blonde, 45 00:02:28,120 --> 00:02:30,840 Speaker 1: hair blue. Eyes that's ALL i. KNOW i think that 46 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:35,120 Speaker 1: He's german Or, danish and that's. IT i don't know anything. 47 00:02:35,120 --> 00:02:43,959 Speaker 2: Else there's a certain piece To becky's current. Situation she's 48 00:02:44,040 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 2: lived her entire life up to this point not knowing 49 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:49,880 Speaker 2: the identity of her biological, father and as far as she, 50 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 2: knows he could be, anyone someone, good someone, interesting someone, 51 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:58,079 Speaker 2: loving someone ready to embrace his long lost daughter with open. 52 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:01,520 Speaker 2: Arms he could fit any Temple becky wants or needs him. 53 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:05,440 Speaker 1: TO i can decide who he, is AND i, can you, 54 00:03:05,440 --> 00:03:10,519 Speaker 1: know think that he's an amazing. Person and even if he's, 55 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 1: not as long as he's a decent human, Being i'd be. 56 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: Happy But i'm scared to go on this journey because 57 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:19,600 Speaker 1: what if he is, Deceased what if he doesn't want 58 00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:22,240 Speaker 1: me in his. Life it's, very very scary to open this. 59 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 1: Door BUT i am very lucky to have the parents 60 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:25,919 Speaker 1: THAT i do. 61 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:29,480 Speaker 2: Have it's not Just becky's biological, father who isn't a 62 00:03:29,480 --> 00:03:32,640 Speaker 2: part of her, life but her two half, Siblings christy And, 63 00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:37,000 Speaker 2: danny survivors Of diane's attack also live their own private 64 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:39,720 Speaker 2: lives independent of any real relationship With. 65 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 1: BECKY i did reach out to them back in two 66 00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: thousand and. SIX i Found christy. Online we had a 67 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 1: little bit of a conversation. Going we spoke every couple of. 68 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 1: Days she told me a little bit about. HERSELF i 69 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 1: told her about, myself and one DAY i got a 70 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:55,680 Speaker 1: message that or And danny don't want anything to do with, 71 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:58,600 Speaker 1: me that so much time would, pass they don't want 72 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:00,360 Speaker 1: to get to know me more. 73 00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:04,200 Speaker 2: Rejection christy And danny knew About, becky that they were, 74 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:07,680 Speaker 2: related that they shared the similar, link and still wanted 75 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 2: nothing to do with. 76 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:11,720 Speaker 1: Her and it's understandable what they went. THROUGH i could 77 00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:15,720 Speaker 1: never even, imagine and maybe being in my life or 78 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:17,600 Speaker 1: meeting me would bring up some of that for. 79 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:18,160 Speaker 4: Them i'm not. 80 00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:21,080 Speaker 3: Sure becky also reached out To diane's. 81 00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:24,480 Speaker 1: Father i've spoken with Diane downs's, Father. 82 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:26,120 Speaker 4: Wes he was a sweet. 83 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: Man he wanted to tell me a lot of the family, 84 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:33,080 Speaker 1: history but he also wanted to tell me About diane 85 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:35,039 Speaker 1: and about her case and how she's. 86 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:38,440 Speaker 2: Innocent becky didn't set out with the intention of speaking 87 00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:41,479 Speaker 2: To diane's father about the, crime but to some extent 88 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 2: it was. 89 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: UNAVOIDABLE i asked Both diane and her father when we 90 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:48,920 Speaker 1: first spoke all those years, ago THAT i didn't want 91 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:52,080 Speaker 1: to hear about her guilt or her. INNOCENCE i just 92 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 1: want to hear about. HER i just want to know 93 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 1: about the. FAMILY i just want to know about my biological. 94 00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 1: FATHER i wanted to leave the case out of it 95 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:01,000 Speaker 1: BECAUSE i knew all they were going to do is 96 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:04,279 Speaker 1: try and convince me that she's. INNOCENT i just wanted 97 00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: to know them that side of my. 98 00:05:06,279 --> 00:05:09,360 Speaker 3: Family is there a part of you that questions whether she's? 99 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 1: Innocent diane's innocence has been a question for a lot 100 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:16,520 Speaker 1: of people for a long. TIME i don't believe she's, innocent, 101 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:18,880 Speaker 1: no BUT i know that people. 102 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 2: Do there are some, people Like diane, herself who champion 103 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:32,719 Speaker 2: her innocence to this. Day her, Brother James, frederickson. 104 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:32,800 Speaker 3: Is one of. 105 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:35,799 Speaker 2: Them james was one of the only family members willing 106 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:38,480 Speaker 2: to talk To becky and me About diane and their family. 107 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:42,279 Speaker 2: History he believes that part of understanding Who diane was 108 00:05:42,640 --> 00:05:46,200 Speaker 2: is understanding her relationship with her ex, Husband, steve who 109 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:49,279 Speaker 2: she blames for much of what she. Became she Sent 110 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:52,760 Speaker 2: james a letter detailing her marriage and relationships leading up 111 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:56,239 Speaker 2: to the, shooting which is oddly written mostly in third. 112 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:58,400 Speaker 2: Person james shares a bit of that. 113 00:05:58,480 --> 00:06:02,279 Speaker 5: Here Bass steve came into our lives in nineteen seventy. 114 00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 5: One we'd Moved chandler to a farm And steve was 115 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:09,040 Speaker 5: a farm hand for the. Neighbors my mom and dad 116 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 5: wanted my sister to date other, boys but you, know 117 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 5: she was head over heels For, steve and Obviously steve 118 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 5: was head over heels for. Her judge married them On november, 119 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:22,040 Speaker 5: thirteenth nineteen seventy, three with Only Greg roach and the 120 00:06:22,160 --> 00:06:25,560 Speaker 5: judge's secretary as, witnesses Because diane had no friends of 121 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 5: her own at that. Time she said that she got 122 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 5: married and whatever the date was. Right but the reality 123 00:06:31,839 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 5: is that you know she got married because my dad 124 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:36,240 Speaker 5: went over to their house where they were out of the, 125 00:06:36,279 --> 00:06:40,360 Speaker 5: apartment and, said you will marry my. Daughter we were 126 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 5: At baptist's, house you know WHAT i. Mean it's like 127 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:45,280 Speaker 5: you didn't want things to be bad or look, bad 128 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:47,640 Speaker 5: and so you know you will marry my. Daughter well 129 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:49,760 Speaker 5: it happened fast because my dad was, there you, know 130 00:06:49,880 --> 00:06:51,279 Speaker 5: And it's Like i'm going to use the term it 131 00:06:51,320 --> 00:06:53,560 Speaker 5: was a shotgun, wedding you know WHAT i. Mean steve 132 00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 5: didn't want problems with my. Dad my dad was really 133 00:06:58,320 --> 00:07:01,040 Speaker 5: he didn't physically Scarre steve that he intimidated. 134 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:04,479 Speaker 2: Him there is a theory in domestic violence cases known 135 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:07,560 Speaker 2: as a cycle of, abuse which often begins with rising 136 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 2: tension and the need to placate the. Abuser according To, 137 00:07:10,960 --> 00:07:14,000 Speaker 2: Diane steve began this cycle early into his And diane's. 138 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:17,880 Speaker 5: Relationship steve controlled everyone she talked, to and he didn't 139 00:07:17,920 --> 00:07:21,320 Speaker 5: let her talk to anyone she was. Working then when they, 140 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 5: married she was talking to other guys at, lunchtime and 141 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 5: so he made her. Quit he didn't permit a phone 142 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 5: in her. Apartment the grocery store was a three minute 143 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 5: walk from where they lived at one Hundred West Ray, 144 00:07:33,840 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 5: road but she wasn't even permitted to go shopping without. 145 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 5: Him my sister was barely eighteen and in her own 146 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:43,240 Speaker 5: mind going on, twelve and had never given her new. 147 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:47,320 Speaker 5: Husband caused suspector of, infidelity but he was just sick 148 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 5: with suspicion and. 149 00:07:49,040 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 2: Jealousy soon after they, Married steve was openly unfaithful To. 150 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:56,560 Speaker 5: Diane two weeks after their, Marriage steve came home from 151 00:07:56,600 --> 00:07:59,000 Speaker 5: work at the Entire company where he worked In mesa 152 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:02,200 Speaker 5: and announced he was going out With janet the. Receptionists 153 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:06,119 Speaker 5: diane was a bit confused by that they were married after. 154 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 5: All steve blew up and he, said, HEY i Promised 155 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 5: janet they'd go. Out the marriage vows came so quickly 156 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:16,240 Speaker 5: he forgot to call off their. Date he Said diane 157 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:18,480 Speaker 5: just needed to iron his shirt and not make things 158 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:21,680 Speaker 5: harder for. Him one month, Later steve went out with 159 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 5: his buddies For New. Year diane was told to wait 160 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:27,200 Speaker 5: at home until eleven forty. Five she, said got tired 161 00:08:27,240 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 5: of waiting and she walked to his friend's. House she 162 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:33,240 Speaker 5: did what she was, told But steve wasn't. There then 163 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:35,959 Speaker 5: they Told diane she'd have to wait in the line Behind. 164 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 5: Debbie So steve was at the party with other. 165 00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:43,320 Speaker 2: Women diane was pregnant With, christy her oldest, daughter and 166 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 2: Allegedly steve saw this as an inconvenience and didn't want 167 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:47,080 Speaker 2: to deal with. 168 00:08:47,120 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 5: Her two months, Later diane got. Pregnant she had morning 169 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:54,720 Speaker 5: sickness like most women, do but instead Of steve's hanging 170 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 5: around and supporting. Her steve took her to his parents' 171 00:08:57,280 --> 00:08:59,800 Speaker 5: home In gilbert because he wasn't ready to live with 172 00:08:59,840 --> 00:09:02,800 Speaker 5: the sick. Wife While diane was at his parents', House 173 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:07,080 Speaker 5: steve moved in With. Jackie When jackie's, Husband dale returned From, 174 00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 5: California steve Drew dale from. Exile these are just the 175 00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 5: little parts about the, Infidelity so then we start talking 176 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:14,680 Speaker 5: about the abuse. 177 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 2: Man according To, Diane steve wasn't only controlling and, unfaithful 178 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:29,200 Speaker 2: but his abuse crossed the threshold into. Physical in the, 179 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,679 Speaker 2: Meantime diane had a second, Child, danny and another, Daughter. 180 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:36,280 Speaker 5: Cheryl in nineteen eighty, Two diane was talking on the. 181 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:38,840 Speaker 5: Phone steve came. HOME i heard talking on the. Phone 182 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:40,840 Speaker 5: he thought she was talking to a man on the, 183 00:09:40,880 --> 00:09:42,880 Speaker 5: phone so he picked up the phone and slammed it. 184 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:46,600 Speaker 5: Down they argued and he slapped and punched, her and 185 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:49,599 Speaker 5: the phone rang And diane obviously answered, it and it 186 00:09:49,679 --> 00:09:52,319 Speaker 5: was Actually holly on the phone saying That karen was 187 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:55,080 Speaker 5: Afraid steve was hitting. Her diane looked At steve and 188 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:58,720 Speaker 5: said To, holly yes he. Is he's still. Here so 189 00:09:58,800 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 5: he grabbed the phone and he Hit diane with. It 190 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 5: she rested the phone From, hungue hung it up and engaged. 191 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,320 Speaker 2: Him diane And steve were divorced at this, point but 192 00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 2: he still lived with her and the. Kids, eventually the 193 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 2: abuse reached a breaking point and she started to fight. 194 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:17,280 Speaker 2: BACK a judge issued a restraining, order But steve didn't stay. 195 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:20,360 Speaker 2: Away in the, Meantime diane had bought a gun in 196 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:23,760 Speaker 2: an effort to protect, herself and then one Day steve 197 00:10:23,840 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 2: had her cornered in a bathroom. 198 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:28,280 Speaker 5: When he was kicking the door. Open she fired a 199 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 5: warning shot into the. Floor the next, week he moved 200 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 5: his furniture out of her home as a stealthy as 201 00:10:33,520 --> 00:10:37,199 Speaker 5: he moved. In that Was september, fourteenth nineteen eighty. 202 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 2: Two In october of that, Year diane's four month old 203 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 2: mobile home burned, down and she sent her kids to 204 00:10:43,679 --> 00:10:46,840 Speaker 2: live With steve so they wouldn't be. Homeless she eventually 205 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 2: found another place to, live But steve wouldn't allow her. 206 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:50,400 Speaker 3: To have the children. 207 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 2: Back during this, Time diane saw affection from other. 208 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:56,320 Speaker 5: Men yeah she was Seeing nick that. 209 00:10:56,480 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 2: Time nick Is Robert, knickerbacker a married man who supposedly 210 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 2: didn't like. Children the fact that some believe may have 211 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:06,240 Speaker 2: later played Into diane's motivation for the. 212 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:11,000 Speaker 5: Shooting married men showed her the most affection because married 213 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:15,120 Speaker 5: men were safe to, her because married men didn't want 214 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:19,200 Speaker 5: to leave their. Wives they just wanted some. Affection and 215 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:22,319 Speaker 5: really that's All diane ever really. Wanted she was still 216 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:25,880 Speaker 5: that twelve year old little girl striving for that, affection 217 00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:29,480 Speaker 5: and she went out and she got that affection from married. 218 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:45,240 Speaker 2: Men diane's attention from other men is what led to 219 00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:49,320 Speaker 2: her earlier divorce From. Steve despite his own, unfaithfulness he 220 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:50,960 Speaker 2: believed she'd actually become. 221 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:51,960 Speaker 3: Pregnant With danny due to an. 222 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:55,600 Speaker 2: Affair he ended their marriage believing the pregnancy shouldn't have 223 00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:59,800 Speaker 2: been possible due to. Vasectomy, diane it, seemed enjoyed being. 224 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 2: Pregnant she had a fourth child Before, becky but this 225 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:03,839 Speaker 2: time as a. 226 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:07,719 Speaker 5: Surrogate so, yeah it was just basically she went through 227 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 5: the surrogacy, program delivered a, baby gave it to a. 228 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 5: Family she got ten thousand dollars for, that and that 229 00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:15,760 Speaker 5: helped her in her. Life. 230 00:12:16,160 --> 00:12:19,840 Speaker 2: Right When diane became pregnant With, Becky james dismissed it 231 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:23,040 Speaker 2: as if it were almost like another surrogacy AND i. 232 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:25,800 Speaker 5: Wasn't going to have another niece and. NEPHEW i was 233 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 5: basically having another surrogate. CHILD i wasn't attached to. IT 234 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:32,679 Speaker 5: i wasn't bonded with. IT i wasn't any of. 235 00:12:32,679 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 2: That After diane's trial And becky's, Birth james didn't give 236 00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:40,200 Speaker 2: the baby much. 237 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:43,400 Speaker 5: Thought, yeah they took her away AND i knew that she, 238 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 5: existed BUT i didn't know anything about. 239 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 2: Her and that was that out of, sight out of. 240 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 2: Mind and then one Day becky appeared on twenty. Twenty 241 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:55,600 Speaker 2: james first impression was not a great. 242 00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 6: One what did you think when you first saw her 243 00:12:58,280 --> 00:12:58,760 Speaker 6: on a news? 244 00:12:58,760 --> 00:13:03,680 Speaker 5: Program honesty's. SURE i didn't understand why she was making 245 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:06,160 Speaker 5: a fuss out of something if she had two perfectly, 246 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:09,560 Speaker 5: wonderful loving. PARENTS i don't remember what exactly she. Said 247 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:12,160 Speaker 5: she basically said that she's going to make sure That 248 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 5: diane doesn't gain. PAROLE i didn't like her at. 249 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 2: All james had made an earlier attempt to Contact becky 250 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:22,600 Speaker 2: and tried to convert her to his version of the. 251 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 5: TRUTH i reached out to her on social media and we, 252 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:30,120 Speaker 5: talked AND i tried talking to her about WHAT i 253 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:33,960 Speaker 5: know is truth and the story that she knows is 254 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:38,360 Speaker 5: the public, story The Anne rules. Story she really wasn't 255 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:42,520 Speaker 5: willing to. Listen did that frustrate? You it's always, Frustrating, 256 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 5: yeah every single. 257 00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 2: Time watching twenty, Twenty james grew increasingly frustrated With Anne, 258 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 2: ruhle author of the Book becky first discovered in the 259 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:52,400 Speaker 2: bookstore as. 260 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:54,760 Speaker 3: An eleven year. Old he believed that she had. 261 00:13:54,679 --> 00:13:57,720 Speaker 2: Many things About diane's story and the crime, wrong and 262 00:13:57,760 --> 00:14:00,400 Speaker 2: That becky's view of her biological mother's guilt had been 263 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:03,160 Speaker 2: colored by that. Book he also doesn't believe That anne 264 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:05,800 Speaker 2: knew the identity Of becky's, father despite her. 265 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:11,160 Speaker 5: Claims so people that are, adopted some of them have 266 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:14,400 Speaker 5: a desire to find out who they come, from whether 267 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 5: it's Be diane the murderer Or diane the. Victim she 268 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 5: still knows that she comes From, diane and she doesn't 269 00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:26,600 Speaker 5: know who her father, is and unfortunately there's only two 270 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:29,560 Speaker 5: people that. Do the author didn't know who the father 271 00:14:29,840 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 5: was because she wasn't there during conception and has never 272 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:38,160 Speaker 5: been told by my sister who the person. Is the 273 00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:41,200 Speaker 5: only people that know are the mother and the father Of. 274 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:45,600 Speaker 5: Becky it was some guy in her, rout you know 275 00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 5: WHAT i? Mean it wasn't even a Cowork it was 276 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 5: just some guy on her, route you. KNOW i, MEAN 277 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:55,080 Speaker 5: i DON'T i don't have any idea who it. 278 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 3: Is he, knows or maybe he, DOESN'T. 279 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 5: I would, Imagine SO i don't. Know, Yeah diane's never told, 280 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 5: him so maybe he, doesn't you, know BECAUSE i mean it's, 281 00:15:05,320 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 5: like you, know she got a reputation of sleeping around 282 00:15:08,200 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 5: you know WHAT i, mean she, didn't but that was her. 283 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:14,640 Speaker 5: Reputation SO i, mean as a, guy if you are 284 00:15:14,720 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 5: just you, know sleeping with somebody just once or, twice 285 00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:20,840 Speaker 5: then you, know it's like you're not really concerned whether 286 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:23,160 Speaker 5: that person gets pregnant or not until they come knock 287 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:26,120 Speaker 5: on your. Door and, so, no he may not. Know 288 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 5: he may not. 289 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 2: Know despite the fact That james And becky didn't see 290 00:15:34,360 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 2: eye to eye in his earlier attempts to contact, her 291 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 2: he wants another chance to, explain which may be his 292 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:42,800 Speaker 2: primary reason for his willingness to meet with her. 293 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 5: Again ten years ago on the social media and then via. 294 00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:49,720 Speaker 5: Phone and then she didn't really want anything to do 295 00:15:49,840 --> 00:15:52,840 Speaker 5: with the, truth as we've stayed. Earlier you, know it's 296 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:55,040 Speaker 5: like talking about some of the letters That diane wrote 297 00:15:55,040 --> 00:15:59,160 Speaker 5: her after being in. Solitary you need to believe that she's. 298 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:03,200 Speaker 5: Psychotic you need to believe that she's a deviant sociopath 299 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 5: or whatever those words are that they're throwing out. There 300 00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 5: but she wasn't willing to. Listen as my whole, POINT 301 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:12,760 Speaker 5: i talked to, her then she did not, listen And 302 00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 5: i'm hoping today she. Listens And i'm always willing to 303 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 5: talk to anybody who's willing to, listen because the truth 304 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 5: needs to be out. There. 305 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:23,840 Speaker 2: WELL i spoke To. James becky was waiting in the 306 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:27,120 Speaker 2: studio to speak with him before bringing her. IN i 307 00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:29,360 Speaker 2: spoke to her alone for a few minutes to gauge 308 00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:32,400 Speaker 2: her feelings on the situation and brief her on what to. 309 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:36,520 Speaker 6: Expect i've been talking To james, here asking him about 310 00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:40,360 Speaker 6: his feelings today about meeting, you finding out his. Intentions 311 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 6: when we first got in the, studio he was quite 312 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 6: overwhelmed because there's so much he wanted to. Share and 313 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:51,240 Speaker 6: then WHAT i found, interesting, though is that he really 314 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 6: really cared about today and wanted to come today with 315 00:16:56,720 --> 00:17:02,520 Speaker 6: something sort of as an offer of information that he could. 316 00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:06,880 Speaker 6: Provide first of, all he has a letter From diane 317 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:11,640 Speaker 6: and it's written To amy to, you and it's going 318 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:15,239 Speaker 6: to talk about her time being pregnant with. 319 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 4: You. Yeah one thing THAT i. 320 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:22,919 Speaker 1: Am concerned about Is diane still denies That i'm her biological, 321 00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:27,080 Speaker 1: daughter and so this letter is written To, amy who 322 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:30,639 Speaker 1: WILL i GUESS i don't identify with because she doesn't 323 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:33,480 Speaker 1: claim to be my biological. Mother so there's been like 324 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:37,680 Speaker 1: a disconnect. There i'm not sure how to respond When 325 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:41,919 Speaker 1: james reads that, letter because my initial knee jerk reaction 326 00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:44,199 Speaker 1: would be uncomfortable and. 327 00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 6: Upset the truth is is, that regardless of the Name 328 00:17:49,160 --> 00:17:52,200 Speaker 6: amy Or, rebecca you were that. 329 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:56,359 Speaker 1: Baby it doesn't feel like, that you, know it feels 330 00:17:56,359 --> 00:18:00,960 Speaker 1: like almost a separate person, completely especially because she doesn't 331 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 1: believe that it's. 332 00:18:02,359 --> 00:18:07,000 Speaker 7: Me she may not believe it's, you but your physical 333 00:18:07,160 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 7: being had that experience as a, newborn as a, child 334 00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:16,919 Speaker 7: as a baby girl coming into this, world and regardless of, 335 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 7: name it was your. 336 00:18:19,119 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 1: EXPERIENCE i wrote her back in two thousand and six 337 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:25,760 Speaker 1: WHEN i put my son up for, adoption wanting to 338 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:28,879 Speaker 1: connect with. Her it feels like this letter that you 339 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: guys have been talking about is almost going to be 340 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:35,119 Speaker 1: that connection THAT i needed back then and after we 341 00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:38,640 Speaker 1: had such a meltdown with her in the last letter 342 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,639 Speaker 1: where she was very. CRUEL i don't want that connection with, 343 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:45,159 Speaker 1: Her So i'm nervous about hearing this, letter and i 344 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 1: don't know How i'll. Feel If i'm being completely transparent and, 345 00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:53,879 Speaker 1: Honest i'm almost scared THAT i want to have that 346 00:18:53,920 --> 00:18:57,879 Speaker 1: connection Like diyre's that conflict of being the adopted child 347 00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:02,919 Speaker 1: that you want that connection with your biological. Parents but 348 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 1: it's it's a battle in my, heart in my head 349 00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:07,119 Speaker 1: BECAUSE i don't want to be connected to. 350 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:21,879 Speaker 4: Her mm, hmmm all, Right so how are we going 351 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:25,439 Speaker 4: to do? This because he's gonna want to say? Hi 352 00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:27,760 Speaker 4: then we let he walks through the. Door it's fine 353 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 4: where she's bringing it right now? Recording oh, Yeah i'm, 354 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 4: ready all, Right, james this Is. Becky, hi good to see. You, 355 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:45,239 Speaker 4: yeah where's your? 356 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 5: Chip that's? Good? Yeah how are you? 357 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 4: Nervous getting through? 358 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:56,280 Speaker 8: It it's a little, different like we were, mentioning is the 359 00:19:56,280 --> 00:20:00,920 Speaker 8: first Time i've actually met anybody from the bi, family 360 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:02,360 Speaker 8: so it's it's. 361 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:05,480 Speaker 5: Different so this is all different. 362 00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:08,280 Speaker 2: Too after some setup and light chit, chat they get 363 00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:11,560 Speaker 2: right into. It james immediately begins to read the letter 364 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:12,320 Speaker 2: he received From. 365 00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:14,560 Speaker 5: Diane he, SAYS i was four and a half months 366 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:17,680 Speaker 5: pregnant WHEN i was. Arrested amy AND i were locked 367 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:20,800 Speaker 5: in a jail cell alone for nearly four months before 368 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:23,200 Speaker 5: she was. Born she gave me the strength to keep 369 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:26,919 Speaker 5: calm during the. Trial every Day i'd tell her that 370 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:29,879 Speaker 5: she was going to be. Okay i'd pat her bottom 371 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:33,959 Speaker 5: and rubb her back and. CAMBER i didn't let myself 372 00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:37,119 Speaker 5: get consumed with worry for her. Sake, then when we 373 00:20:37,160 --> 00:20:39,399 Speaker 5: returned to our jail cell after my first day on 374 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:42,520 Speaker 5: the witness, stand there was a court order waiting in 375 00:20:42,600 --> 00:20:46,639 Speaker 5: our concrete slab. Bed the state had seems custody Of 376 00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:51,040 Speaker 5: amy even before she was. Born the trial wasn't even over, 377 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:54,679 Speaker 5: yet and the state was taking. HER i was physically, 378 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:57,560 Speaker 5: ill but couldn't dwell on it BECAUSE i didn't Want 379 00:20:57,600 --> 00:21:00,240 Speaker 5: amy to feel my. Pain it was a difference. Story 380 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:04,040 Speaker 5: after she was, GONE i cried and cried and felt 381 00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:06,360 Speaker 5: Like i'd lost a friend as much as a. Child 382 00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:10,040 Speaker 5: that's a loss from Which i'll never. Recover that's what 383 00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:13,960 Speaker 5: my sister said about. You, Wow SO. 384 00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:17,919 Speaker 4: I didn't realized that she felt that. 385 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:23,240 Speaker 5: Way there's been pictures painted of my, sisters being a callous, 386 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:26,120 Speaker 5: person not a good. Mother that's the way she felt 387 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,159 Speaker 5: about all of her. Kids that's not the way she 388 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:31,160 Speaker 5: felt about the surrogate. Child you're not a surrogate. 389 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:35,239 Speaker 1: CHILD i struggle with her connection with me because of 390 00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:38,960 Speaker 1: the fact that she got pregnant with me on, purpose 391 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:42,360 Speaker 1: because she knew she could and she wanted to Replace, 392 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:45,879 Speaker 1: cheryl and she knew that she would get sympathy from the. 393 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:50,760 Speaker 5: Courts and those Are rules, words those are writer's. Words 394 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:52,920 Speaker 5: those aren't, True. 395 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:56,520 Speaker 1: Okay isn't. IT i saw something about. It i've never 396 00:21:56,520 --> 00:21:59,040 Speaker 1: read An rule's. Book there was one of her recordings 397 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 1: or something THAT i. THOUGHT i don't know, ANYWAYS i 398 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:03,440 Speaker 1: never knew she felt that. 399 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 2: Way james shifts almost immediately into defensive mode with regards To. 400 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:11,159 Speaker 2: Diane there's a bit of tension Between james And, becky 401 00:22:11,359 --> 00:22:13,800 Speaker 2: And james is eager to push through his agenda for. 402 00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 4: Meeting so when did she write? 403 00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:19,520 Speaker 5: That about two weeks? Ago? WOW i asked her to 404 00:22:19,560 --> 00:22:23,800 Speaker 5: share something with me because she doesn't. WANT i, said 405 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:26,320 Speaker 5: the world needs to understand what she felt like when 406 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:28,840 Speaker 5: you were having the baby teeth a, way she says 407 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:31,000 Speaker 5: she can't really talk about when the baby was taken, 408 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,080 Speaker 5: away because it's just. Crying you, know she cried and. 409 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:37,119 Speaker 5: Cried what else is there to? Say she was, Induced 410 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:41,680 Speaker 5: she didn't have it. Natural they told the court before 411 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:45,720 Speaker 5: she was convicted that they're going to take the baby. 412 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:49,120 Speaker 5: Away they told the jerors that already finding her guilty 413 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 5: before The jersey was started. 414 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 6: Deliberating it is really, interesting it's very, interesting and she. 415 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:01,840 Speaker 5: DID i don't think the word replace it's a good 416 00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:06,040 Speaker 5: word to, say because you can never replace, you right 417 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:11,440 Speaker 5: with another. Baby she can't Replace cheryl with another. Baby 418 00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:15,200 Speaker 5: she can't Replace christie with another. Baby you're her, daughter 419 00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:19,240 Speaker 5: and you were very much. Loved the state did not 420 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 5: want you to be raised by her or see the, 421 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 5: family so you were given to another. Family SO i. 422 00:23:25,720 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 4: Feel a sort of a. DISCONNECT i reached out To. 423 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:31,800 Speaker 1: DIANE i think it was in two thousand and, six 424 00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:34,840 Speaker 1: and her first couple letters, were you, know oh my, 425 00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:37,240 Speaker 1: Gosh i've always known where you, were and you'd write me. 426 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:38,560 Speaker 4: Someday they were excited and. 427 00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 1: Happy but now to this, day you, know she denies 428 00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 1: That i'm her biological. 429 00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:50,040 Speaker 5: Child there in between two, right, yeah crazy, letters we might, say. 430 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:51,639 Speaker 4: Right they're pretty. 431 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,520 Speaker 1: Intense, yeah and, threatening and you, know saying that there's 432 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,680 Speaker 1: been somebody watching me my whole life and trying to kill, 433 00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,640 Speaker 1: me and and scary stuff she did. 434 00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:02,800 Speaker 5: That did you feel like you were watching a movie 435 00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:05,680 Speaker 5: and that she was threatening you from in the jail 436 00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:09,159 Speaker 5: or did you feel like that she was being Sincere 437 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:14,600 Speaker 5: she was truly worried for, you because, again she didn't 438 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:17,399 Speaker 5: commit this, crime. Right whoever did this to her is 439 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:20,080 Speaker 5: still out there and if you are her, child in her, 440 00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:21,920 Speaker 5: opinion then you're in. 441 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 3: Danger things With james start to grow a bit. 442 00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:28,600 Speaker 5: Tense there's not a single person THAT i know that 443 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:33,480 Speaker 5: is backing me and doing this because the media has 444 00:24:33,520 --> 00:24:38,200 Speaker 5: been very, violent very, vile and the media is one 445 00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,119 Speaker 5: of the reasons WHY i don't want to use the 446 00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:44,359 Speaker 5: word fearful to meet, you BUT i wasn't looking forward to. 447 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 2: Meeting they go back and forth about the details Surrounding 448 00:24:47,800 --> 00:24:50,679 Speaker 2: diane's public behavior at the time of the shooting and 449 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,600 Speaker 2: her seeming lack of emotion when re enacting the. Scene 450 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 2: becky pokestoles in james argument For diane's, innocence which he repeatedly. 451 00:24:58,400 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 5: DEFENDS i can tell tell you that for many Years 452 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:05,239 Speaker 5: i've been very angry at, you mainly because WHEN i 453 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 5: tried to talk to, you didn't want to talk to. 454 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 5: Me one of the things that you said was the 455 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:11,360 Speaker 5: purpose of doing what you're doing is so you can 456 00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:15,679 Speaker 5: be sure That diane does not get. Parole right. NOW 457 00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 5: i don't want to be a part of. THAT i 458 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:19,240 Speaker 5: don't want to be a part of somebody that's trying 459 00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:22,399 Speaker 5: to keep my sister in, prison because how she acts 460 00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:26,439 Speaker 5: is Just i've never been, Shot i've never had my 461 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:29,240 Speaker 5: child killed in front of, me you know WHAT i, 462 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 5: Mean AND i just it's, just how are you supposed to? Act, 463 00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:40,480 Speaker 5: well you're wrong because you don't know, right you know 464 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:40,720 Speaker 5: WHAT i. 465 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:44,520 Speaker 3: Mean at this, point the tension is, palpable. 466 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:47,800 Speaker 5: Straight out In english. LANGUAGE i could, not in any, 467 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 5: way shape or, form be a part of somebody's life 468 00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:51,240 Speaker 5: that thought my sister was. 469 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:52,880 Speaker 4: GUILTY i understand. 470 00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:57,679 Speaker 5: That and really my life is now consumed with my, 471 00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 5: sister which is Why i'm sitting, here and WHAT i. 472 00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:09,040 Speaker 5: Want WHAT i believe is that if you looked at 473 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:12,320 Speaker 5: not actions and, evidence that there would be no doubt 474 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:14,120 Speaker 5: that she would believe that she's. 475 00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:18,760 Speaker 1: INNOCENT i understand that you came here solely to speak 476 00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:23,119 Speaker 1: of her innocence and not to meet. ME i wanted 477 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 1: to reach out to, you to give you your voice 478 00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:29,240 Speaker 1: and to get to know. You so dad just really. 479 00:26:29,320 --> 00:26:32,120 Speaker 1: HURTS i talked to your dad for. YEARS i don't 480 00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:34,560 Speaker 1: want to be just some, person AND i understand that you're. 481 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:37,280 Speaker 1: ANGRY i would need, Too but why are you. 482 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:42,199 Speaker 5: Here my sister's in. Person she doesn't belong, there AND 483 00:26:42,240 --> 00:26:45,480 Speaker 5: i want you to be her. MOUTHPIECE i want you 484 00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:47,800 Speaker 5: to go out there and tell the world as she 485 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:48,400 Speaker 5: didn't do. 486 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 2: This it becomes clear That james Believes diane when she 487 00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:57,840 Speaker 2: says that whoever she claims is the actual shooter is 488 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:00,399 Speaker 2: still out, there a theory he has also. 489 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,680 Speaker 1: Adopted you want me to be an advocate for, her that's, 490 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:07,920 Speaker 1: right but that would require me to believe she's. 491 00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 4: Innocent that's. 492 00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 5: Right and why DO i? Why? Why? Why? Why why 493 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:15,880 Speaker 5: WOULD i even say that to? You IF i didn't believe, 494 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:19,080 Speaker 5: that if you stopped and you looked at what happened, 495 00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:21,119 Speaker 5: here and if you looked at everything That i've gotten 496 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:24,400 Speaker 5: to show, you if you really had an open, mind 497 00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 5: you weren't thinking about how crazy she. Was there is 498 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:30,320 Speaker 5: no doubt in my mind that you would be and 499 00:27:30,359 --> 00:27:32,280 Speaker 5: then you could use your voice to help get her. 500 00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:36,119 Speaker 5: Out is she your, Mother she's my biological. Mother you. 501 00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:40,679 Speaker 1: GO i don't constantly say mean things about. HER i 502 00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:43,879 Speaker 1: defend her even when people you, know say horrible. THINGS i, 503 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 1: say she was in solitary for so long even a 504 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:47,840 Speaker 1: sane person would go. 505 00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:50,639 Speaker 4: Crazy you. Know it's those letters that she. 506 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:55,640 Speaker 5: WROTE i she also believed she was protecting you those. 507 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:58,720 Speaker 5: Letters when she was saying to keep, quiet quit, talking 508 00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:02,160 Speaker 5: as he's still out, there she was protecting. It that's 509 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:05,800 Speaker 5: part of her theory about what happened to. Her, okay 510 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:10,320 Speaker 5: and she believes that she's being, watched so she believes 511 00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:12,280 Speaker 5: that we're all still in. 512 00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:16,520 Speaker 1: Danger do you believe that if she was released she 513 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:18,399 Speaker 1: could get help for her mental issues as? 514 00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,639 Speaker 4: Is do you think she would be? SAFE i know 515 00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:22,239 Speaker 4: she would be. 516 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:24,960 Speaker 5: Safe it's a really strange talking to her at, times 517 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:30,840 Speaker 5: because as incoherent about man watching and things like, that 518 00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:35,359 Speaker 5: she is so incredibly coherent About if she doesn't talk about, 519 00:28:35,359 --> 00:28:39,200 Speaker 5: that she's incredibly, coherent incredibly. 520 00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:43,000 Speaker 2: Normal there was finally an, opening And becky decides to 521 00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:45,800 Speaker 2: ask what she believes is the most important question she 522 00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:47,000 Speaker 2: has For, James. 523 00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 4: Yeah do you know who my biological father? 524 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 5: Is? SORRY i do know that he was guy on 525 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,400 Speaker 5: her impulsed rite is ALL i. Know there's only one 526 00:28:55,440 --> 00:28:58,160 Speaker 5: person that knows we were talking. Earlier and it's like 527 00:28:58,200 --> 00:28:59,720 Speaker 5: the father may not even know he's a. 528 00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:01,040 Speaker 4: File and that's What i'm. 529 00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:04,400 Speaker 1: Thinking it's either he's passed, away he doesn't, know or 530 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:05,160 Speaker 1: he doesn't want to. 531 00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 5: Know she didn't tell. Him she didn't tell him she was. 532 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:11,480 Speaker 2: Pregnant james And becky finally both have their respective agendas 533 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:15,240 Speaker 2: for the conversation out in the. Open For James diane's 534 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:20,000 Speaker 2: innocence and For becky her biological father's. Identity james agrees 535 00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,040 Speaker 2: to take A dna test to help her in her. 536 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,440 Speaker 1: QUEST i, MEAN i think that would be. Wonderful it 537 00:29:24,520 --> 00:29:27,680 Speaker 1: might Settle diane a little, bit to know for. Real 538 00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:32,320 Speaker 1: it might help me find my biological. Father oh, NO 539 00:29:33,760 --> 00:29:34,520 Speaker 1: i will let you know your. 540 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 5: Heritage, yeah that's what they say From denmark about two 541 00:29:42,280 --> 00:29:45,440 Speaker 5: or three years. Ago my dad probably told, you, Right, yeah, 542 00:29:45,560 --> 00:29:52,400 Speaker 5: yeah From, Denmark Denmark. ROYALTY i don't feel. COMPLETE i 543 00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:56,000 Speaker 5: don't feel complete talking to. YOU i want TO i 544 00:29:56,040 --> 00:30:00,240 Speaker 5: feel like you've judged her because of how she yeahs 545 00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 5: believe that if you need to open you're looking for. 546 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 5: Things And i'm not saying you're looking in the wrong, 547 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:15,720 Speaker 5: area because nowhere you look is. Wrong but maybe you 548 00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:18,600 Speaker 5: need to look at what was done to, her what 549 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:23,040 Speaker 5: was done to her so you couldn't be with her 550 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:26,040 Speaker 5: even they stopped you from being with. Her she didn't stop, 551 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:27,600 Speaker 5: It they stopped. 552 00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:30,760 Speaker 2: It james calms a bit and sort of seems to 553 00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 2: regret being so outwardly, aggressive but still can't help pushing his. 554 00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,480 Speaker 5: AGENDA i, MEAN i understand that you have a lot of, emotion, 555 00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:41,920 Speaker 5: right And i'm sorry IF i just your. EMOTION i 556 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 5: just need you to really think about you didn't send 557 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:48,000 Speaker 5: it to me an? Email? Why this is WHY i 558 00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:49,520 Speaker 5: Think diane did. 559 00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:54,080 Speaker 6: This, okay, okay all, right thank you. GUYS i think 560 00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:58,760 Speaker 6: that's a wrap for. Today that was a lot for 561 00:30:58,920 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 6: both of. 562 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,840 Speaker 4: You no, Apologies, NO i really really do, care. 563 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 5: RIGHT i don't want you to be. SAD i don't 564 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:10,480 Speaker 5: want anybody to be sad for any. Reason, yeah and 565 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,520 Speaker 5: believe me WHEN i said, THAT i mean that with 566 00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:16,680 Speaker 5: my heart THAT i believe that you're going to beat her, voice. 567 00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 5: DON'T i didn't see it in, envision un or. Anything 568 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:25,160 Speaker 5: it's just my. Heart, yeah we can definitely talk. 569 00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:27,320 Speaker 4: More we'll follow up on. 570 00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 2: This it's hard to say If becky got what she 571 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,880 Speaker 2: wanted from the interaction With. James it's the first member 572 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,240 Speaker 2: of The frederickson side of the family who's agreed to 573 00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:42,400 Speaker 2: meet with her and have a real conversation About. Diane 574 00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:44,959 Speaker 2: so in many, ways it's as close As becky has 575 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:47,720 Speaker 2: ever been to the maternal side of her family. Line 576 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:51,520 Speaker 2: despite the tension between, Them james agreed to Give becky 577 00:31:51,600 --> 00:31:53,800 Speaker 2: a key piece of the puzzle to help confirm her 578 00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:58,800 Speaker 2: genetic identity HIS. Dna with, This becky will hopefully finally 579 00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 2: be able to confirm what and for all that she's 580 00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:09,680 Speaker 2: in fact the biological daughter Of Diane. Downes on the 581 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 2: next episode Of Happy Face presents To, face we unpack 582 00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:16,760 Speaker 2: the details of exactly what happened on that faithful night 583 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,720 Speaker 2: In may of nineteen eighty three When diane downs and 584 00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:23,640 Speaker 2: her three children arrived at That, Springfield oregon, hospital all 585 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:24,320 Speaker 2: with gunshot. 586 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:34,760 Speaker 3: Wounds