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Speaker 1: I guess I grew up on an all day. Hey everybody,

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Speaker 1: welcome to another episode of The Hunting Collective. I'm Ben O'Brien.

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Speaker 1: I'm talking to you from the past, well in the past.

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Speaker 1: This is the best of part two. I'm talking to

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Speaker 1: you before the Christmas break. You're listening to this in

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Speaker 1: the New Year. Hopefully nothing is frozen over. Hell especially

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Speaker 1: it's not frozen over, and we're still moving forward in time.

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Speaker 1: Phil and I are are still hungover from conceptually hungover

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Speaker 1: from New Year's Eve, and so this is gonna be

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Speaker 1: a slower show and that's why it's best. Up. Phil,

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Speaker 1: Are you feeling okay over there? But yeah, I'm doing okay. Well,

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Speaker 1: Like like you said, this is we're recording this in

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Speaker 1: the past. Um, but I I'm just gonna imagine my

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Speaker 1: elf his future fill right now. Um. I'm sure I

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Speaker 1: just took several tums after drinking way too much eggnog

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Speaker 1: the night the night before, leftover eggnog from Christmas because

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Speaker 1: I'm the only one in the family who drinks the eggnog.

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Speaker 1: But I make a large batch anyway. Um, and I'm

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Speaker 1: happy with that decision. Good. I'm glad I will have

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Speaker 1: I'll still have that chapain headache about three days later.

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Speaker 1: It's probably where I'll be at and the kids will

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Speaker 1: still be screaming and running around, and I'll still be

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Speaker 1: laying on the floor, face down, put my putting my

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Speaker 1: face in the cool, cool rug, hoping no one jumps

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Speaker 1: on my back and starts to try to wrestle me,

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Speaker 1: especially a little little people. So anyway, that's where we

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Speaker 1: are right now, in the future, but where we're gonna

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Speaker 1: be in the present, which is also in the future.

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Speaker 1: Does that make sense, Hill? Yeah? Perfect, in the future,

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Speaker 1: but in the present also in the future. Is we're

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Speaker 1: gonna I'm sorry, I was gonna say it's a Christopher

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Speaker 1: Nolan movie. Yeah, this is an inception. You're about to

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Speaker 1: get incepted cult You're going back in time to go

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Speaker 1: forward in time. Uh, in the future. So what we're

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Speaker 1: gonna do and this beautiful episode is we're gonna go

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Speaker 1: through some of our favorite moments in the field and

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Speaker 1: we're gonna listen to some moments we love and we're

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Speaker 1: gonna talk about them, examine them, and um, we're gonna

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Speaker 1: get you through a nice, easy going post holiday podcast.

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Speaker 1: Is gonna be a year of change for us, isn't it.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna be a hunter? Uh? Not so sharp moments

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Speaker 1: are probably gonna be gone. We've heard enough of those.

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Speaker 1: We might even I think we might even pick some

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Speaker 1: new music, h new segments. We got Clay Newcomb coming

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Speaker 1: on for a segment. We've got asked the Eagle with

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Speaker 1: the honest tell us, we're gonna be sprucing up your

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Speaker 1: thh C this beautiful new year. In an effort to

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Speaker 1: to keep you excited and keep you in the Cult're

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Speaker 1: gonna give you some fresh, cool aid, ice down, refreshing,

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Speaker 1: fill anything you're looking forward to this year. But a

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Speaker 1: vaccine in both going hunting, going hunt thing is the answer. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: going hunting specifically. Yes, we want to announce in this

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Speaker 1: episode that Phil is gonna go hunting next this year,

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Speaker 1: and we're gonna go turkey hunting. Okay, Phil ready for that?

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Speaker 1: Yes I am. It's like the sixth time on air

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Speaker 1: we've made a plan. At this time, we're sticking to it.

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Speaker 1: I mean, if it doesn't happen now, people, no one's

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Speaker 1: going to believe the thing you say. I don't know

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Speaker 1: why they do at this point anyway. But what we're

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Speaker 1: gonna do is we're gonna reintroduce you to some of

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Speaker 1: the characters we love so much from last year. We're

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Speaker 1: gonna take you in the field for some moments that

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Speaker 1: I enjoyed and hope you enjoyed listening to, and we

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Speaker 1: did last year. You know, Phil it fills a sound engineer,

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Speaker 1: he's the master of the audio arts, and I gave him,

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Speaker 1: you know, a lot of a lot of water colors

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Speaker 1: to paint with. You know, he's Bob Ross and that

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Speaker 1: ship last year. And so the first thing we're gonna

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Speaker 1: do is run you through some of the moments in

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Speaker 1: the field where we captured some of the audio of

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Speaker 1: me hunting in the field or going out in the

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Speaker 1: field someone. And we got a good lineup. We got

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Speaker 1: rabbit hunting with Charles, Roddy and Maryland from last February.

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Speaker 1: We got gator hunting with the Landry crew from last September,

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Speaker 1: and then from August we have Yellowstone tracking around Yellowstone

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Speaker 1: hunting for predators. Dr Dan Staylor over there east of Bowsman,

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Speaker 1: not too far. So we went out in the field

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Speaker 1: for these three big episodes of the show, and it

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Speaker 1: was a it was a chance for Phil, a man

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Speaker 1: of the audio Master of the universe to flex his

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Speaker 1: muscle fields. Did you feel like you did a good

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Speaker 1: job on these episodes? You're feeling really good about the

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Speaker 1: audio mastery that you've you've turned in here. I don't

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Speaker 1: know why you're turning this into the Phil Show. And

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Speaker 1: it was you who traveled to all these places and

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Speaker 1: did the work. But you know, I appreciate it. I

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Speaker 1: just I did my job, and you you did all

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Speaker 1: the You did all the stuff that matters. Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: I got some good victuals out of it. I got

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Speaker 1: some good adventures, some good memories, and all you had

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Speaker 1: to do was your up. So next year we're gonna

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Speaker 1: get you out in the field with us to experience

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Speaker 1: some of this cool stuff. So first off, we're gonna

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Speaker 1: return to chester Town, Maryland with my buddy Charles the

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Speaker 1: rabbit Man Rodney. One of the most pleasing hunts to

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Speaker 1: the years. You're ever gonna go on barking dogs, Charles Rodney,

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Speaker 1: yelling at his dogs, me yelling at Charles Rodney, him

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Speaker 1: saying dead rabbit, and all the other beautiful things that

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Speaker 1: come out of that man's mouth. You're gonna hear him

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Speaker 1: because we're gonna join our hunt on the Eastern Shore

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Speaker 1: of Maryland with Charles the Rabbit Man Rodney relive some

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Speaker 1: rabbit hunt a book shot rabbit up, Bozo this blue.

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Speaker 1: This is Hank the beat so and it's just Sam.

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Speaker 1: Hey everybody, and welcome to another episode of the Hunting Collective.

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Speaker 1: I've been O'Brien and I'm out hunting in the field

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Speaker 1: right now with Charles Roddy and walking through an open

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Speaker 1: field and the eastern shore of Maryland behind some six

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Speaker 1: beagles looking for rabbits. You hear Charles in the background

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Speaker 1: imploring his dogs to find him. We might have one

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Speaker 1: right here. That's a pretty looking thicket right there. How

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Speaker 1: many We got three rabbits, Charles. We've been hunting for

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Speaker 1: about an hour and a half. We got three, so

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Speaker 1: that ain't bad. So you're gonna hear the sounds of

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Speaker 1: sights and sounds of rabbit hunting from the field. It's

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Speaker 1: so stay tuned. We're going after him. We got one up,

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Speaker 1: We got one up. What you got him? I got

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Speaker 1: dead rabbit, dead rabbit. Yeah, it's shooting right here. Dead rabbit.

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Speaker 1: Come on, boys, come only get him. I saw a leaf, Loue,

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Speaker 1: and I look and I saw him move again, but

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Speaker 1: he went back in. It wasn't the dog because I

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Speaker 1: did that. And then all of a sudden the third

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Speaker 1: time he come on all of day. You shot him

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Speaker 1: right here, didn't you, Sir? They give me a dead rabbit.

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Speaker 1: You want to picture of him, Jeffrey, bring him up

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Speaker 1: has so we can get a picture. Yeah, he was

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Speaker 1: sitting right on the edge. So I was just interviewing

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Speaker 1: Charles a little bit filming on my phone, and a

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Speaker 1: rabbit jump pretty much right from out under Charles's feet.

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Speaker 1: Didn't he about two feet away while we were talking?

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Speaker 1: You just never know he was sitting here. I was

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Speaker 1: just telling being what kind of cover we need in

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Speaker 1: this one sitting in the open. Once you start making

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Speaker 1: some noise with the shots and the dogs running, these

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Speaker 1: rabbits gets spooked up. So they could be sitting anywhere.

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Speaker 1: This must be the motel for rabbits. Yeah, we can

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Speaker 1: just we could have somebody to stand here and block Charles,

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Speaker 1: what kind of uh bark are you listening for? These dogs?

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Speaker 1: A certain type of bark, certain type of expression. I'm

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Speaker 1: kind of looking for a continuous bark, kind of a

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Speaker 1: little bit more exciting when the scent get real hot,

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Speaker 1: they get more excited. All of them are not barking now,

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Speaker 1: So that means that that rabbit could have gotten up earlier.

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Speaker 1: It could have been an older scent that still can

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Speaker 1: They can still smell. So I'm looking for an intense

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Speaker 1: clothes barking. When you get up and they get hot

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Speaker 1: on him, they get really excited. Cold trail now a

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Speaker 1: little bit cool. Yeah, it's they're on cold trail. But

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Speaker 1: that rabbit got up earlier. I'm gonna call him back

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Speaker 1: this way so we can go on that side of

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Speaker 1: the creek brush. Yeah yeah, come on there, Yeah, come

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Speaker 1: on there, Yeah, come on, Hank, come on, blue rattler.

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Speaker 1: Let's Sam, come on, balls out buck shot. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: come on there, come on there. Yeah yeah yeah, it's

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Speaker 1: r out here hunting. Phil. This is your grandfather's place,

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Speaker 1: your family's place. But as you were a kid, this

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Speaker 1: is where your grandfather lived, and you spent a lot

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Speaker 1: of time kicking rabbits out of the brush out here,

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Speaker 1: didn't You did not like this, but we did. We

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Speaker 1: killed a few rabbits. We were saying earlier and four

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Speaker 1: we were talking last night over some bud lights that

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Speaker 1: uh there's rabbit hunting, then there's rabbit hunt with Charles Rodney.

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Speaker 1: Wholly different, wholly different experience, different experience. When we were

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Speaker 1: running with him. And how many dogs we have, Charles,

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Speaker 1: how many we have out here? Dogs? Six dogs? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this is a completely different program. He's right in here.

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Speaker 1: You out the top bend, Come boys there, see him.

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Speaker 1: I took two shots out him. I was behind and

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Speaker 1: though he's in here, got him, dad rabbit. He must

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Speaker 1: have been wounded, thank god. Yeah, where was he here? Boys? Hey? Boys,

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Speaker 1: come out here, boys, you missed it? See you miss you?

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Speaker 1: Who slam right? Give me your boys here, boys, come

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Speaker 1: to your boys. Stop. He just stopped. He could jump

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Speaker 1: right out from under my feet and ran right through

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Speaker 1: some brush. Come here. Let him know that my shot

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Speaker 1: was only for a warning. Good rabbit, Good boys, good boys,

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Speaker 1: good shooting. Grabbing number four on the ground. Yeah, that guy,

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Speaker 1: he jumped right from under my feet. Come on, I

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Speaker 1: chased him. He came. He came pretty fast. He ran here,

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Speaker 1: stopped and then took off again. He jumped right under here,

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Speaker 1: and I smoked him. My shot was only for appearances, Charles.

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Speaker 1: I basically shot a I shot a bush. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: It was a good bush. It's one of the better

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Speaker 1: looking bush I've ever shot. Boone and Crockett bush. All right, Charles,

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Speaker 1: do you give us a hunt update? How are we doing?

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Speaker 1: How do you feel like we're doing? I think we're

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Speaker 1: doing pretty good. We got three right quick. It slowed

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Speaker 1: down a little bit and we had our best run

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Speaker 1: of the day. A long circlar eggshall rout and he

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Speaker 1: was about thirty yards from where he got up. And

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Speaker 1: all the time rabbits make that circle and they go

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Speaker 1: back to where they get up. This one was heading

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Speaker 1: back that way. But brother phield won made one shot

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Speaker 1: and in the death they call him one shot. Whon, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: for a good reason. Now we're getting it, Charles. Why

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Speaker 1: is there something like the deep like the deep sound

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Speaker 1: the dogs respond to? Or is it loud and assertive?

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Speaker 1: What's is there a type of tone they like better

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Speaker 1: than another? No, they know which dog gets the true bar.

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Speaker 1: They know each other's bar. Dog rattling, They got that

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Speaker 1: deep voice. But they know when each when each voice

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Speaker 1: is true, and that rabbit is rolling. And because as

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Speaker 1: you know, a couple of times and one dog might

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Speaker 1: give one or two little barks they don't go to it,

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Speaker 1: but when they give a certain bark, they know the

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Speaker 1: sin is hotting it up and it's time to join in. Well,

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Speaker 1: what about you when you're commanding him, do you use

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Speaker 1: the deep voice? I just whatever voice I feel it's necessary. Now,

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Speaker 1: when I'm just telling to get in, I'll just tell

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Speaker 1: him find them, get in there. But if I see

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Speaker 1: the rabbit like that and calling them where Jeffrey, just

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Speaker 1: call him. Yeah, I need to call him with yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I got fast like that fast. And sometimes I run

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Speaker 1: a little bit. They see me running, they run, and

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Speaker 1: when I get close to where the sin is, I

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Speaker 1: point down and they put their nose down and they

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Speaker 1: pick it up. See Blue picked it up first. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: When I went down to hill, Lew was on the

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Speaker 1: on the rabbit. Well, here's Charles Rodney, who how he's

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Speaker 1: hunted this far many times? Right? He couldn't count that

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Speaker 1: he's hunted this far many times. And if you're active, right,

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Speaker 1: and you're seeing the landscape every couple of times a year,

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Speaker 1: at the same time of year, right, the same seasonality,

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Speaker 1: he could probably call out every little corner of this

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Speaker 1: and what's changed. He's like this used to be a

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Speaker 1: lot of but you know some of other worries. I've

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Speaker 1: gotten the thick where it's got enough. But yeah, I mean,

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Speaker 1: who else would notice that a little intricate detail like

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Speaker 1: that used to be a lot thicker now, Charles Rodney,

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Speaker 1: tell me you tell everybody out there about that shot.

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Speaker 1: I just made like, what kind of sporting man am I? Well, folks,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna give it to the man from Montana. He

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Speaker 1: was standing there. The dogs was pushing. They pushed him

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Speaker 1: in the bars in the bottom. Jeffer and I were standing.

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Speaker 1: He turned, he went back in some weeds, some brown

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Speaker 1: weeds which makes it hard to see, and I could

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Speaker 1: see Ben and he moved over about oh about maybe

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Speaker 1: ten ft. He said, I'm gonna cover this area. And

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Speaker 1: the dogs was pushing him straight and he peeled off

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Speaker 1: one shot head shot, cut, cut the head right in half. Good, good,

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Speaker 1: safe shot. So we ended that long. It was a

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Speaker 1: long chase. They jumped him on the other side of

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Speaker 1: a of what we call a sloop way. It kind

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Speaker 1: of the land, kind of slopes with some water running

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Speaker 1: in it, a deep ravine with water, and they ran

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Speaker 1: him around and around, and he went in the weeds

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Speaker 1: and that's where we killed. Dogs stayed on him, and

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Speaker 1: about three deer got up in front of the dogs.

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Speaker 1: These dogs do not chase the deer. They will not.

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Speaker 1: They stayed right on that rabbit. They went back. They live.

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Speaker 1: That rabbit must across this road three or four times. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: come on, yeah, yeah, come on. She going out here,

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Speaker 1: you go, here, you go here. Couple of them grabbing

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Speaker 1: number six, grabbing number six, Charles. That's it. Tell us

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Speaker 1: a story. You got he got us, We escaped, kicked

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Speaker 1: him up, he ran, we shot, We thought we had him.

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Speaker 1: He got up, ran in some high brown grass and

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Speaker 1: made a turn to come back, and I was waiting

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Speaker 1: on him, and the dog pushed him hard and fast

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Speaker 1: and put him on a nice size, big rab That's

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Speaker 1: a good rather when we go number six, Charles, Well,

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Speaker 1: wrap up the morning hunt. What do you think? I

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Speaker 1: think this was an excellent hunt. We got eight eight rabbits. Uh.

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Speaker 1: We had some real nice long runs through thick briars,

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Speaker 1: up and downhill, in a gully and uh, in a

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Speaker 1: little bit of water and marsh. The dogs come back

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Speaker 1: all the money, but they still they still gave that

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Speaker 1: extra and uh, it's warm and they'll hunt some more.

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Speaker 1: So I think eight is excellent. I do. I'm a

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Speaker 1: little tired after that last run there. Yeah, that last

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Speaker 1: run worked us. We had to make some long shots,

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Speaker 1: but he wouldn't quit. He ran with two back broke legs.

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Speaker 1: He ran under some cut timbers on the ground and

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Speaker 1: the dog pulled him up. That was good. Well, we're

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Speaker 1: done in the field for this morning. So next time

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Speaker 1: we're gonna hear from us, probably we're gonna be in

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Speaker 1: the kitchen, maybe cooking, drinking, podcasting. So uh, we'll see

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Speaker 1: you right in a minute, Phil, Maybe that could that

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Speaker 1: be your first time? If do you want to go

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Speaker 1: on a rabbit hunt with Charles Rodney for your first

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Speaker 1: ever adventure outside? Not particularly. I don't think that would

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Speaker 1: be a good first time, do you? I think it would?

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Speaker 1: I think it would. What what what turns you off

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Speaker 1: about it? I don't know. I mean, I guess there's

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Speaker 1: no reason for it to turn me off. It just

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Speaker 1: seems kind of out of left field for a first

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Speaker 1: time at least, I don't know. Maybe maybe I'm way

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Speaker 1: off base here. I think you might be delicious, table fair,

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Speaker 1: wonderful company, you know, a casual, but but you know,

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Speaker 1: athletic hunt, you still gotta get up and down a

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Speaker 1: little bit, but it's not like you only have one tag.

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Speaker 1: The dogs are fun to watch do their job. You

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Speaker 1: get to bust some brush, you get to wear a

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Speaker 1: cool vest with a pouch in the back, all the things.

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Speaker 1: It's a wheeled, a shotgun, all the things you'd ever

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Speaker 1: want to do. So I do want to our friend

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Speaker 1: Charles rodney Man. He is one of the best. One

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Speaker 1: of the things about this show that I have loved

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Speaker 1: the most is highlighting guys like Charles Um. He really

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Speaker 1: is one of my favorite people on the on the

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Speaker 1: planet Earth. I probably said that a bunch of times

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Speaker 1: on the show, and so I thank Charles, his wife

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Speaker 1: Judy and their family for letting me come rab a

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Speaker 1: Hunton and up next little gator hunting Phil. This is

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Speaker 1: definitely not the first time you're gonna want to go

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Speaker 1: on this gator hunt with the Landry crew is gnarly

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Speaker 1: to them. It's normal to to Jacob Landry, Troy Landry

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Speaker 1: and their family, this is very normal and it's kind

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Speaker 1: of like a family affair, you know, you like you

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Speaker 1: take your family out to do things. You know, maybe

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Speaker 1: you go to the store. Maybe you go to church,

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Speaker 1: maybe you go on a hike, maybe you go whatever,

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Speaker 1: a kind of normal fanfare family things that you do.

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Speaker 1: If that's what the Landrys do. But they pulled giant

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Speaker 1: twelve foot gators out of the water on a hook

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Speaker 1: with rotten chicken and then throw the shoot those gators

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Speaker 1: between the eyes and throw them in the boat. And

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Speaker 1: I've been out multiple times where it's father, sons and

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Speaker 1: not in these these kids are like three and six

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Speaker 1: maybe oh husband, wife and two sons in a boat

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Speaker 1: traveling around to buy you shooting gators between the eyes.

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Speaker 1: And that's like the nice Sunday day as a family.

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Speaker 1: So um so, Phil, that's it's a little bit different

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Speaker 1: than what your Sunday family traditions probably are. You'd ship

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Speaker 1: you got some you got some secrets over there. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: let's travel. You know, this is the best of when

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Speaker 1: me and Phil are just like packing it in. Man,

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Speaker 1: We're just trying to get this done for you, doing

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Speaker 1: our best. We're just doing our best. So now enjoy

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Speaker 1: a little time with the Landry crew and the gators.

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Speaker 1: Jacob war and what Lake Verrette we said outside of

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Speaker 1: Pier Park, Louisiana with the Swamp People themselves, Jacob Ridge, Moose, Lindsay,

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Speaker 1: Troy Landry, and we're after gators. I don't have much

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Speaker 1: say other than it's exciting, so you're gonna have to

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Speaker 1: stay tuned. But Jacob, here what twelfth season of the

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Speaker 1: History Channels Swamp People twelve. That's gotta be the longest

336
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Speaker 1: running show on that channel or maybe any cable channel,

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Speaker 1: millions of people watching you guys on gators for over

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Speaker 1: a decade. So we're gonna talk about that. We're gonna

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Speaker 1: try to get some gators in the boat everything and

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Speaker 1: then some here to buy. We're not gonna try, We're

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Speaker 1: gonna no trying. We're gonna get a wet at all. Right,

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Speaker 1: Jacob tell us where we are right now. Right now,

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Speaker 1: we're fishing on Lake Barette, just close to our hometown.

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Speaker 1: It's a pretty big lake, a lot of big alligators

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Speaker 1: and you can't ask for a better scenery it in

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Speaker 1: This is nothing but big cypress trees for the Spanish

347
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Speaker 1: moss all along the edges of it, and it's been

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Speaker 1: known to produce the big alligators. But as you can hear,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of stumps, so you gotta be careful

350
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Speaker 1: as you're passing on the edge. I don't know if

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Speaker 1: we got one here. Now take the next ones up.

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Speaker 1: You remember, do you remember the first time you got

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Speaker 1: your son Rich here? He's nine, Rich, say hi, Hi?

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Speaker 1: Remember the first time you went out of your dad's Troy.

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Speaker 1: I probably don't remember exactly the first time I would

356
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Speaker 1: look at that nice one swimming straight acro away from

357
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Speaker 1: our beat. Yeah, that's a good one. I really don't remember,

358
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Speaker 1: because I was probably too young to remember. My dad

359
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:39,359
Speaker 1: used to put me on his shoulders and take me

360
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Speaker 1: in the woods and take me in the boat and

361
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Speaker 1: out a little bitty But uh, I do remember being

362
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Speaker 1: little and going out there, that's for sure. I had

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Speaker 1: a lot of good times. We used to rabbit hunt

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Speaker 1: a lot. He just to always take me rabbit hunting

365
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Speaker 1: and carry me on the shoulders and sitting there on

366
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Speaker 1: a stump, coming up on a bait that we hung yesterday.

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Speaker 1: I do not see the line. Why I see lines

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Speaker 1: straight in the water. Yeah, it looks like slack. There's

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Speaker 1: plenty of gators around, but not on our hooks. Got one, Troy?

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Speaker 1: Oh God, get him? What I'm talking a bud? Good night?

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Speaker 1: Good right there? Oh yeah, I think you Gator number

372
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Speaker 1: two of the day. Gator number two, number two. We

373
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Speaker 1: want to look all were sure about it? Line put

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Speaker 1: the end of the women when we got back down,

375
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Speaker 1: but now were on the line moose, You got any comments? Right?

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Speaker 1: Do you have any commentary? No? Okay, we'll come back

377
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Speaker 1: to you later. What color is an alligator? Wow? Oh

378
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Speaker 1: I don't know. There girl, you got there? A band

379
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Speaker 1: of may in. He felt big when he's dropped them.

380
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Speaker 1: He's a vegetarian. Movie salt, Yeah, a little slack it

381
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Speaker 1: a little shack, yeahs hard, body goes pretty. Yeah. Shoot

382
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Speaker 1: like this, Troy, it feels like old times. I'm just waiting.

383
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Speaker 1: I might jump in right. That's the hardest part where

384
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Speaker 1: Troy makes funny. If you can't get the gator in

385
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Speaker 1: the right over, it's the big gator boat. We got

386
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Speaker 1: all the big gators in this boat. No wonder you're bob,

387
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:20,399
Speaker 1: because every road has all the weight by alliator. It's

388
00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 1: gonna fight us a recorder. Yeah, yeah, why don't you

389
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Speaker 1: hold this? Lindsey's gonna hold the microphone while I try

390
00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:35,760
Speaker 1: to kill But I got just pointed towards us foot Atnjamin. Hey,

391
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Speaker 1: are you gonna be all right, my rich from fighting him.

392
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Speaker 1: You want to go and fight him, bron come home

393
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:51,680
Speaker 1: from Mr bend down on that day the whole rich

394
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Speaker 1: old him, bro hold him, let me go, Bubba you

395
00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:10,480
Speaker 1: got Bubba on, let me go right at me A

396
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:17,920
Speaker 1: good shock, that's a doz got him. I'm all wet.

397
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Speaker 1: Take that, buddies on save Oh yeah, what they don't

398
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:30,480
Speaker 1: tell you about gator hunting? As the gators come into

399
00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:33,800
Speaker 1: boat with you when you're done with them, they don't

400
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:37,560
Speaker 1: there's nowhere else to put them. What do you think, rich?

401
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:41,760
Speaker 1: How big is this one? About? Seven? What do you

402
00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:47,920
Speaker 1: think most? Five? Five f So now, Jacob, we're gonna

403
00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:54,840
Speaker 1: tag him, tagging and make him legal beagle Bubba cutter

404
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:59,360
Speaker 1: read and do you all right? What do we got

405
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 1: got one? He's tangled up in six footer's tangled up.

406
00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 1: You gotta grab this rope. You're gonna help me, Ridge

407
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,800
Speaker 1: Redge gonna shoot him. Jacob's gonna fight him. You're all

408
00:28:13,840 --> 00:28:18,480
Speaker 1: wrapped up in a stick. I mean the number. That's

409
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 1: what's bad about the little ones over the right safety

410
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 1: busting Gussin got him, bust them a little gustin watch

411
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:38,520
Speaker 1: us on? Fine, but I don't safe. I'm safe. Keep

412
00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 1: the barrel pointed up. We'll done straight up. Not at

413
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Speaker 1: Mr Bere He's good. Just go at them all right,

414
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Speaker 1: Dy John, I'm gonna put another hook and another bait. Ridge.

415
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Speaker 1: You don't like the bait, you don't like the rotten chicken.

416
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Speaker 1: I don't blame you. I don't blame you. It's not great.

417
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Speaker 1: How many gators do you think, like you had to

418
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 1: count in Lake for ret, why do you think gator

419
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 1: numbers would be hundreds? Hundreds? I really don't know what

420
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:18,560
Speaker 1: the thing is like right now. You see, the water

421
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:21,800
Speaker 1: just came up close to two ft, so now all

422
00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: the little slips that go back into the swamp, the

423
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:27,680
Speaker 1: gators go back in there. Now, right before the hurricane,

424
00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 1: the water was super low, so everything that all the

425
00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 1: swamps was all drained out dry, so everything was in

426
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:37,240
Speaker 1: the lake feeding that people were seeing big alligators left

427
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 1: and right now, if they're still out here, I don't know,

428
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:43,320
Speaker 1: you know, they might they might be, but a lot

429
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: of them will go back in that swamping how get

430
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 1: away from the boat traffic. I imagine, i'mlike, you know,

431
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:51,600
Speaker 1: elk dear, it's impossible to know how many gators are

432
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:57,960
Speaker 1: in them that little simple vibration of the boat. They'll

433
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,840
Speaker 1: going and how you do nothing like to stick around?

434
00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:05,360
Speaker 1: All right, Jacob, how many gators we got so far?

435
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 1: We gotta count them up. It looks like we got

436
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:10,240
Speaker 1: about six decent ones in the boat, all around six

437
00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:14,360
Speaker 1: seven eight foot good average. But we're looking for that granddaddy.

438
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:17,680
Speaker 1: You're gonna make it all worthwhile. Yeah, you think if

439
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 1: you feel like you're doing, we're doing better than your dad.

440
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:23,240
Speaker 1: Are we losing out? Ah, we're doing pretty decent for

441
00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:26,040
Speaker 1: the few lines we ran so far. This line looks

442
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:29,080
Speaker 1: kind of tight going towards the bank. So those the

443
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 1: lines we said yesterday, and all our lines have either

444
00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 1: had a gate or at some point. Yeah, nothing's left

445
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 1: left hanging. So that's a good challenge. And it takes

446
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 1: a couple of days. You know, you catch a couple

447
00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 1: of small ones and get them out the way before

448
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,320
Speaker 1: you catch them big ones. So not too bad. Let's

449
00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:55,200
Speaker 1: check it out. What happened, Jacob, the table about half

450
00:30:55,920 --> 00:31:01,000
Speaker 1: the lines we said yesterday and we got a little Yeah, unfortunately,

451
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:03,200
Speaker 1: this is a really good area of alligators. It's a

452
00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:05,920
Speaker 1: little nub right off the lake and he's big alligators

453
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:07,640
Speaker 1: love to come hot in here, get away from the

454
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 1: boat traffic and all. And we've been here in reports

455
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:12,680
Speaker 1: of a good gate in here, and so we put

456
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 1: one to four lines right here in one little bit

457
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: of circle, hoping that we'd get them. And sure enough

458
00:31:18,960 --> 00:31:22,080
Speaker 1: we got here, our branches broke. The rope is burned

459
00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: into the tree, and the into the line is popped.

460
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 1: He got off and then he was on a tree

461
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:31,680
Speaker 1: that gills that flexus. So that just goes to show

462
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,200
Speaker 1: you how big and powerful he actually hugged that rope

463
00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 1: into the branch and it is currently imbedded into into

464
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 1: that branch. You can tell he was fighting hard, ready

465
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:44,440
Speaker 1: to go kill the motor, and then he just popped

466
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 1: up in the middle of the boy. Let's see how

467
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:53,640
Speaker 1: if he comes back up. I don't know. Can you

468
00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:57,000
Speaker 1: get shots at him just an open water like that? Yeah,

469
00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:59,360
Speaker 1: if we got a big gun, we'll bring like a

470
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:03,239
Speaker 1: only three or I'm seventy or something like that too

471
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 1: to shoot them on open water. I don't I don't

472
00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 1: typically like to try to shoot him with just a

473
00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 1: twenty two mag or seventeen, because you've got to hit them,

474
00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:13,880
Speaker 1: I mean pretty much dead in Ida. Put him to

475
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,760
Speaker 1: stop put with that type of gun. There's such a

476
00:32:17,840 --> 00:32:20,720
Speaker 1: difference once you see these things up close. There's such

477
00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 1: a difference between a six ft or eight ft or

478
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 1: ten ft or twelve foot or I mean there. Once

479
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:28,240
Speaker 1: they get to be eleven feet ten ft, they're just

480
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:32,400
Speaker 1: a completely different animal. Yeah, And unfortunately the big ones

481
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:35,080
Speaker 1: be smart. They just like gear and everything else. Once

482
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:37,320
Speaker 1: you get them once, they kind of get smart to it,

483
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:41,040
Speaker 1: and the chances of catching them again, it's it's always possible.

484
00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 1: We've called them again, but they just know now, they

485
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:49,160
Speaker 1: know what chicken tastes like. It just goes to show

486
00:32:49,240 --> 00:32:54,440
Speaker 1: you it might be fishing, but it's not always catching,

487
00:32:55,040 --> 00:33:03,480
Speaker 1: that's for sure. We're pushing through last couple of lines

488
00:33:03,520 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 1: a check and you just briefly stop and take in

489
00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 1: a lot of this. Man. There's osprays and egrets and pelicans,

490
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:18,400
Speaker 1: Spanish moss and cypress trees, gators everywhere. It is a

491
00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 1: wild place. And to buy here what we got on here,

492
00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:26,160
Speaker 1: that's the biggest one of the days, A big one,

493
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 1: big daddy do right here, buddy, Yeah, boy, yeah, that's

494
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:41,680
Speaker 1: a big h Yeah. You don't want to come up

495
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:45,960
Speaker 1: and knows he's in troubles. He's in trouble. Read John him.

496
00:33:47,000 --> 00:34:00,360
Speaker 1: Watch your fingers through big boy him. Whenever you read budding,

497
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:05,920
Speaker 1: I'm ready perfect. I don't get a note one, you know,

498
00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:12,359
Speaker 1: hold on, what's a big one? I'm telling it. He's beenna.

499
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:20,080
Speaker 1: Get ready the job, I shoot job buddy. All right, now,

500
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:22,200
Speaker 1: we gotta get him in the boat. We're gonna pull

501
00:34:22,239 --> 00:34:25,440
Speaker 1: that off. Fig that out. We'll fig that out of

502
00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:31,400
Speaker 1: b biggest gator of the day. Ridge, alright, Ridge and Jacob,

503
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 1: we how big alligat do you think that is? Ah,

504
00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:38,880
Speaker 1: he's gonna be coached. Eleven foot he's long, but he's skinny,

505
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:41,480
Speaker 1: but he's a big one. Look his teeth, how big

506
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:45,600
Speaker 1: and blunt. You can test the old alligator. We're talking

507
00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,080
Speaker 1: about this before he said they can get up to

508
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:51,279
Speaker 1: hundred years old. I mean it's hard to say. It's

509
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:53,319
Speaker 1: hard to know, but Asian by their teeth, I'm sure.

510
00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:56,719
Speaker 1: But you figure that one's been around quite some time. Oh,

511
00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:59,239
Speaker 1: that one's been around a good fifty sixty years for sure.

512
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:01,680
Speaker 1: I mean you can just look at him. He's old.

513
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 1: He's by looking at the slime on his back. He's

514
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:06,360
Speaker 1: been in the swamp for quite a while he just

515
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,359
Speaker 1: came out because the water got so low, and he's

516
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:11,719
Speaker 1: a good one. I didn't think we had anything here either,

517
00:35:11,880 --> 00:35:14,040
Speaker 1: so that was a that was a nice little surprise

518
00:35:14,080 --> 00:35:17,600
Speaker 1: when he pulled back. Well, we're gonna call it for

519
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 1: the morning and we're gonna go back. What are we

520
00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:24,080
Speaker 1: having for for lunch over there? We got a little

521
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 1: crawfish do fried alligator, fried frogs. Ridge is gonna bake

522
00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:34,759
Speaker 1: us some brownies and cookies when we get back. It's

523
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:36,879
Speaker 1: gonna be good. Thanks for joining us in the field.

524
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:38,799
Speaker 1: We're gonna go have some food and then we're gonna

525
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,600
Speaker 1: sit down with Jacob and Mr Troy Landry. Keep this

526
00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:48,560
Speaker 1: podcast going. We'll see you then. Now we're back at

527
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:55,200
Speaker 1: Duffy's Gas Station. Here Pierre part the famous Duffies where

528
00:35:55,320 --> 00:36:00,480
Speaker 1: each time Troy Landry Jacob Landry return from gator trip,

529
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 1: especially on Sundays, people gather locals, people all the way

530
00:36:05,040 --> 00:36:09,320
Speaker 1: from Canada, people from around this country gather at a tiny,

531
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:12,879
Speaker 1: little rusty gas station in the middle of nowhere to Louisiana.

532
00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:18,320
Speaker 1: Right now, those about thirty five forty people, babies, infants,

533
00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:22,080
Speaker 1: eighty year olds, mom's, dad's, little kids, all lined up

534
00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:24,480
Speaker 1: to shake Troy Landrew's hand and to see the gators

535
00:36:24,520 --> 00:36:28,520
Speaker 1: they brought in. So we got about sixteen gators and

536
00:36:28,840 --> 00:36:32,320
Speaker 1: Troy's boat, ten gators in our boat, in all of

537
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,160
Speaker 1: the six hundred some tags they'll fill this year. And

538
00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 1: it's a bit of a party here right now. Six

539
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:46,239
Speaker 1: ft six one good rich one to six to six

540
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:59,879
Speaker 1: two zero three six five. He was, how long you've

541
00:36:59,880 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 1: been bringing gators back to Duffy's. No, then I want

542
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 1: to remember I'm getting Conna get go boys that I

543
00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:13,239
Speaker 1: agreed right there when we would first started. Brain do

544
00:37:13,320 --> 00:37:14,960
Speaker 1: you ever think that this many people would come and

545
00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:18,400
Speaker 1: see this everything? And Jane, I think we're that virus

546
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 1: this year. You really have got weird, more people than dish.

547
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:23,360
Speaker 1: But I think people are character come around with that

548
00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:27,759
Speaker 1: Corona bolish. How many gas you guys go through? I

549
00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:30,759
Speaker 1: don't know it. I really don't do it, but I

550
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:34,480
Speaker 1: guess fifteen you're pointing, you poundered him, cap your camp

551
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,560
Speaker 1: with your calm, pointing five, we're gone. And then we

552
00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 1: had about a dozen more long, but I was scared,

553
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:43,920
Speaker 1: just still in your league. It was getting rough, getting

554
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:48,000
Speaker 1: rough out there. There are people here from all over

555
00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:51,359
Speaker 1: the country. There's even a mother that wants to get

556
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 1: her newborn babies picture taken with a gator. They're setting

557
00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:59,120
Speaker 1: up a photo right now that says when the baby

558
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 1: was born, and the baby's maybe three or four weeks old.

559
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:10,560
Speaker 1: As everybody gets. Everybody gathering at Duffy's. It's crazy. An

560
00:38:10,600 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 1: our inside a giant, probably eight hundred square foot freezer

561
00:38:20,239 --> 00:38:24,439
Speaker 1: with bins full of gators. Jacob Landry, you're driving a skit,

562
00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:32,000
Speaker 1: st your palette, jack Onto into the freezer, gets a

563
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:36,920
Speaker 1: big scoop and then scoops ice into the bins of

564
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 1: gators to keep them for sales later on. Giant giant

565
00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:50,120
Speaker 1: pile of ice that will keep these gators cool until

566
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:54,359
Speaker 1: a buyer comes or a distributor combs to get them.

567
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:58,879
Speaker 1: It is a operation. It's not a hunting operation. It's

568
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:02,920
Speaker 1: not a guiding operation. It is an industrial operation. It

569
00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:05,800
Speaker 1: looks like a fish market, smells like a fish market.

570
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:10,200
Speaker 1: This is definitely not North American model of wildlife conservation.

571
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:14,920
Speaker 1: This is definitely not hunting. This is market selling of

572
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:19,960
Speaker 1: gators by some people I really respect, and it is

573
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:32,359
Speaker 1: a full fledged operation. All right here we are. We're

574
00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:35,040
Speaker 1: like a couple of substitute teachers playing old movies for

575
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:37,160
Speaker 1: you guys. We hungover, we went out to the club

576
00:39:37,280 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 1: last night, and then this is what we're doing. This

577
00:39:39,360 --> 00:39:41,319
Speaker 1: is what the Best Of is, and we are self

578
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:43,560
Speaker 1: aware here in the cult and we're willing to tell

579
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:46,920
Speaker 1: you the truth, unlike other podcasts that are controlled by

580
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:53,080
Speaker 1: the leftist media and Donald Trump. Right. Phil, Yes, sir, WHOA,

581
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 1: We're really I love this show. Best of love it.

582
00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:58,600
Speaker 1: Now we know where're gonna go next. You probably won't

583
00:39:58,640 --> 00:40:01,239
Speaker 1: even believe where we're gonna go next, because we've already

584
00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:03,600
Speaker 1: been in Louisiana, We've already been to Maryland. You're like,

585
00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:06,000
Speaker 1: where could we go next? What could we do? How

586
00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 1: could this be more exciting? I know you're asking yourself that. Well,

587
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:11,600
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you. We're gonna go to Yellowstone National Park,

588
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:13,560
Speaker 1: the Jewel of the West, and we're going to go

589
00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:17,320
Speaker 1: inside the belly of the Beast with Dr Dan Staylor.

590
00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:20,000
Speaker 1: And you know what we're gonna do, Phil, We're gonna

591
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:24,879
Speaker 1: track down a marauding, murderous cougar that has killed seventeen

592
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:28,799
Speaker 1: uncults in the past two months. We're gonna figure out

593
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:31,640
Speaker 1: what the hell he's doing over there. And why with

594
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:34,880
Speaker 1: Dr Dan is that better? Feels that more exciting? Am

595
00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:37,520
Speaker 1: I give him more intrigue for the listeners shaking in

596
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 1: my boots, boom, go to Yellowstone. So Dan, we're overlooking

597
00:40:45,080 --> 00:40:48,960
Speaker 1: gardener right, garden gardener montin. I always wonder if I'm

598
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:53,719
Speaker 1: in Wyoming. We are right now actually at straight down

599
00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:55,719
Speaker 1: to our right, so we're hard to say if we're

600
00:40:55,719 --> 00:41:02,319
Speaker 1: in right. Um Yea quickly describes it's like what we're

601
00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:04,600
Speaker 1: looking at here, so we're looking at what we do

602
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:08,239
Speaker 1: is the gardener basin, Uh, the northern range of of

603
00:41:08,400 --> 00:41:11,960
Speaker 1: yellow Stone, and uh it is one of the premier

604
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:16,759
Speaker 1: wintering areas for uh A large a lot of Yellowstone ungulates,

605
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,040
Speaker 1: um elk, you know, the hoofed animals, yelk, the prong horn,

606
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:23,320
Speaker 1: big corn, sheet mule deer, some white tailed deer, bison,

607
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:26,279
Speaker 1: of course. UH. And you're looking at it right here.

608
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:27,920
Speaker 1: We're in the heart and soul of it. And UH

609
00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:31,520
Speaker 1: it's incredibly important part of this system. UH sustains a

610
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:34,239
Speaker 1: lot of the migratory herds that use this area and

611
00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:36,400
Speaker 1: depend upon it on winter because of its lower elevation,

612
00:41:36,520 --> 00:41:40,719
Speaker 1: less snowpack forage availability. UM. Of course, We're here in July,

613
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:43,839
Speaker 1: so we're looking at summer range starting to dry out.

614
00:41:43,960 --> 00:41:46,000
Speaker 1: We've had some wet you know, pretty wet spring, but

615
00:41:46,760 --> 00:41:48,879
Speaker 1: in early summer, but starting to get brown as it does.

616
00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 1: You know, got this little band of prong horn here,

617
00:41:51,239 --> 00:41:53,200
Speaker 1: and this is you know where you see a lot

618
00:41:53,239 --> 00:41:55,879
Speaker 1: of the prong horn summering in the wintertime, they'll also

619
00:41:55,920 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 1: settle into these lowlands right here in front of us.

620
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 1: But um, Yellowstone River of course cuts out of the

621
00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:03,920
Speaker 1: park right there. Um, and that's the court of that

622
00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:07,360
Speaker 1: migratory funnel for a lot of those uh les, particularly

623
00:42:07,440 --> 00:42:09,640
Speaker 1: elk herd, the Northern elk herd kind of one of

624
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:15,880
Speaker 1: the most uh controversial, culturally significant elk herds in the region.

625
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,480
Speaker 1: Really always has been. It's always been a big source

626
00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:22,200
Speaker 1: of debate. We'll talk about that later. But um, but yeah,

627
00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 1: it's quite a quite an area, is you know. I

628
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 1: always think of this area sort of our you know,

629
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 1: our American Serengetti. I live just across the way there.

630
00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:31,040
Speaker 1: You can kind of see my house on the other

631
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:33,239
Speaker 1: side the valley above the town of Gardener there and uh,

632
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:36,080
Speaker 1: you know, it's not uncommon to look down and see

633
00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:39,239
Speaker 1: you know, everything bison, prong horn, big horn, sheet deer,

634
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:42,839
Speaker 1: alcohol within your have you shed packs of wolves? Use

635
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 1: these uh cougars? It's all cougar country. Do you ever

636
00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 1: feel like you're in a time machine? Absolutely? I mean

637
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:51,360
Speaker 1: childhood dream living in a place like this where you

638
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:54,040
Speaker 1: could go back in time and see what the landscape

639
00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:57,880
Speaker 1: looked across our great country. Um, we've got a vignette

640
00:42:57,880 --> 00:42:59,680
Speaker 1: of it right here. Yeah, this river just kind of

641
00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:03,120
Speaker 1: can acts everything and brings everything together to stand here.

642
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:05,759
Speaker 1: And no, we're headed to a possible kill site for

643
00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:09,360
Speaker 1: a mountain lion and see a fawn antelope and a

644
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,640
Speaker 1: couple of a couple of doughs by the looks of it. Um,

645
00:43:13,160 --> 00:43:15,120
Speaker 1: this is you know, you never know what you're gonna

646
00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:18,879
Speaker 1: see in Yellowstone, and you've kind of got back door

647
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:22,120
Speaker 1: pass I imagine. Absolutely feel very lucky to live here.

648
00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:26,040
Speaker 1: Let's go see what we can find. We've got a

649
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:30,160
Speaker 1: coyote about what seventy yards He didn't even seem like

650
00:43:30,239 --> 00:43:33,399
Speaker 1: he cares much about us. What's he doing? It looks

651
00:43:33,440 --> 00:43:36,200
Speaker 1: like a younger coy out, maybe a yearling or something.

652
00:43:36,280 --> 00:43:38,400
Speaker 1: He's a could be in this area because there's a

653
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:40,360
Speaker 1: carcass here we're not. We've got sixty yards from that

654
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:43,759
Speaker 1: cluster of that cougars kill site, and so he might

655
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:46,719
Speaker 1: be um lingering around. It could be just a good

656
00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:48,160
Speaker 1: spot for him. But I just do them do a

657
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:51,719
Speaker 1: little scrape scent mark there not that far away, So

658
00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:54,279
Speaker 1: he probably sees us, and maybe he's just curious. Of course,

659
00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 1: these guys in the park are and getting bullets lobbed

660
00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:58,640
Speaker 1: at him, so a little bit more curious and a

661
00:43:58,680 --> 00:44:00,759
Speaker 1: little more curious that he's get a little bit of

662
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:03,359
Speaker 1: a scrappy tail. There's summer coat and he goes trotting off.

663
00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:06,960
Speaker 1: It looks like a young one. I mean, I know

664
00:44:07,080 --> 00:44:11,279
Speaker 1: that there's an adversary relationship between wolves and yeah, if

665
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:13,920
Speaker 1: there's a mountain and kill site today, they will they

666
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:16,840
Speaker 1: will kill coyotes and they'll eat them. Unlike wolves, wolves

667
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:18,160
Speaker 1: just kill him to kind of get him out of

668
00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:21,359
Speaker 1: the picture. Cougars will actually feed on him and it's

669
00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:23,480
Speaker 1: typically is a round to kill site. They're not actively

670
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:26,480
Speaker 1: hunting him, but they're opportunistic. Of course, you can hear

671
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 1: ground squirrels right now around us, so he's probably hunting

672
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:32,279
Speaker 1: ground squirrels. Yeah, he does. It's so interesting to be

673
00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:33,960
Speaker 1: in a place like this and to see a cayer

674
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:36,400
Speaker 1: that normally if he was living on a ranch down

675
00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:40,080
Speaker 1: in the valley be gone, gone, be gone, or he'd

676
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:46,840
Speaker 1: be gone it is yeah, yeah, exactly, you know site

677
00:44:46,880 --> 00:44:51,200
Speaker 1: that is so what we're doing here, Ben is we've

678
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:56,040
Speaker 1: got um oh maybe ten or so GPS points that

679
00:44:56,160 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 1: were logged by the caller that this male lion wears

680
00:44:59,600 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 1: his number M two twenty. We collared him this winner. Um.

681
00:45:03,800 --> 00:45:05,920
Speaker 1: We actually called him out by tower falls. So it's

682
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:09,480
Speaker 1: a good twenty someone miles um to the south of

683
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:12,320
Speaker 1: us here, and uh, that was probably the core of

684
00:45:12,400 --> 00:45:15,239
Speaker 1: his winter range. It was about I think we aged

685
00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:17,000
Speaker 1: him about three and a half four years of age.

686
00:45:17,160 --> 00:45:20,080
Speaker 1: It's been a hundred and forty pounds um. And you

687
00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:22,880
Speaker 1: know that's a younger Tom here. He's stuck around this summer.

688
00:45:23,000 --> 00:45:26,799
Speaker 1: So we've seen too in our population have right now, um,

689
00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 1: a bunch of younger males coming into this area. We

690
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:31,800
Speaker 1: did catch just the other day over on that cliff

691
00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:34,400
Speaker 1: band and back of us a big, old, gnarly scarred

692
00:45:34,440 --> 00:45:37,560
Speaker 1: up um mature Tom and one of our remote cameras.

693
00:45:37,640 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 1: So he's probably the king around here. But these younger

694
00:45:40,239 --> 00:45:42,239
Speaker 1: males are coming in and sorting out where they might

695
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 1: slip in and establish a territory. And this male cougar

696
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:47,840
Speaker 1: we've been following the last sixty some odd days for

697
00:45:47,920 --> 00:45:53,120
Speaker 1: predation work. Um, he's ranged everywhere from here out to

698
00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:56,839
Speaker 1: about fifteen twenty miles that way down into the Yellowstone

699
00:45:56,920 --> 00:45:59,040
Speaker 1: River quarter and the Black Canyon of the Yellowstone which

700
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:01,960
Speaker 1: is up and over that right behind us. UM, and

701
00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:05,520
Speaker 1: he's just been looping around here for summer, making his kills,

702
00:46:05,600 --> 00:46:09,520
Speaker 1: making his living, and established maybe his territory. Um. And

703
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:13,480
Speaker 1: this is the last cluster of our predation sequence. So uh,

704
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:17,080
Speaker 1: Ultimately the objective of this work has been to understand

705
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:21,239
Speaker 1: cougar food habits and predation patterns and kill rate. You know,

706
00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 1: how often are they killing? What are they feeding on? Uh?

707
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:29,640
Speaker 1: And that feeds into our long term monitoring. That then

708
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:33,399
Speaker 1: we can more accurately understand what role do cougars play

709
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 1: here and Nilo Stone Well, I mean too, you know

710
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:40,239
Speaker 1: how many cluster sites like this will you visit on

711
00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:42,480
Speaker 1: a single line in that time? Yeah? And over that

712
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:45,120
Speaker 1: sixty days? This is a guess without looking at the numbers,

713
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:48,719
Speaker 1: I think a couple of hundred clusters we've searched some clusters.

714
00:46:48,840 --> 00:46:50,839
Speaker 1: You know, we run the data that Basically the way

715
00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:54,600
Speaker 1: these GPS callers work is they um last about two

716
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:57,040
Speaker 1: years based on how we have a programmed that's dictated

717
00:46:57,080 --> 00:47:00,400
Speaker 1: by the battery life of the caller. It is getting

718
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:05,960
Speaker 1: a fix every hour UM, around the clock UM and

719
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:09,480
Speaker 1: it uploads the data via a satellite that we can

720
00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:11,879
Speaker 1: access on the computer so we can check in. It's

721
00:47:11,920 --> 00:47:14,040
Speaker 1: not real time, but it's usually lags by twelve to

722
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:16,200
Speaker 1: twenty four hours. What we do is we wait for

723
00:47:16,200 --> 00:47:20,160
Speaker 1: a better week's worth of data to to accumulate. Then

724
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:23,360
Speaker 1: we run it through a uh what we call a

725
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:26,880
Speaker 1: cluster model that basically identifies any cluster where you have

726
00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:31,400
Speaker 1: two points GPS points within two of one another and

727
00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 1: within six days. So what's beautiful about this technology to

728
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:38,839
Speaker 1: study predation cougars is when a cougar makes a kill,

729
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:41,200
Speaker 1: you know that you tend to cash it and if

730
00:47:41,200 --> 00:47:44,160
Speaker 1: they're not displaced by a bear pack of wolves, they

731
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:46,160
Speaker 1: will tend to stay on it for several days until

732
00:47:46,200 --> 00:47:48,040
Speaker 1: it's used up. Of course, that depends on the size.

733
00:47:48,080 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 1: If it's a small newborn faun, they might only be

734
00:47:50,239 --> 00:47:52,920
Speaker 1: there for half a day before it's gone. If it's

735
00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:54,840
Speaker 1: a you know, an adult cow out, they might be

736
00:47:54,920 --> 00:47:58,760
Speaker 1: there for four or five days. And but cougar clusters

737
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:01,440
Speaker 1: are usually really or kills are easy to identify with

738
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:03,600
Speaker 1: cougars because once they make a cluster, they really kind

739
00:48:03,640 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 1: of hone in on it once in a while, and

740
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:08,239
Speaker 1: particularly with males, they tend to be a little bit

741
00:48:08,320 --> 00:48:12,239
Speaker 1: more exploratory and travel during kill events where they'll make

742
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,480
Speaker 1: a kill. For example, this male killed a couple of

743
00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:18,399
Speaker 1: weeks ago an adult cow elk down below us here um,

744
00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:20,680
Speaker 1: and he would go all the way during the day,

745
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:23,880
Speaker 1: travel all the way up oh a mile and a

746
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,800
Speaker 1: half that way to bed up in the cliffs, I

747
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:30,680
Speaker 1: mean just and for cougar there, they're all about concealing

748
00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:32,800
Speaker 1: and being secretive, and that's a big part of their success,

749
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:35,359
Speaker 1: particularly in a lansk like a landscape like Yellowstone whe

750
00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:37,560
Speaker 1: you get grizzly bears, black bears and wolves that are

751
00:48:37,560 --> 00:48:40,719
Speaker 1: always trying to find food and they're easily easily can

752
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:44,040
Speaker 1: display cougars, and so he is, you know, his m

753
00:48:44,200 --> 00:48:46,919
Speaker 1: has to get somewhere safe and secure out of sight

754
00:48:47,560 --> 00:48:49,719
Speaker 1: um and males tend to do that. Sometimes males will

755
00:48:49,719 --> 00:48:51,879
Speaker 1: also feed for a day and then do a big

756
00:48:52,239 --> 00:48:54,040
Speaker 1: you know, travel for a day and then come back

757
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:57,000
Speaker 1: to a kill site. Females that make kills, female cougars

758
00:48:57,040 --> 00:48:59,960
Speaker 1: tend to stick right there. Um. They also can get

759
00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:01,960
Speaker 1: displaced of course too, and they have the whole risk

760
00:49:02,000 --> 00:49:04,600
Speaker 1: if they've got kittens where there's a risk of mortality

761
00:49:04,680 --> 00:49:07,359
Speaker 1: there if a pack of wolves or another cougar even

762
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 1: or a black bear grizzly beer comes in. But um.

763
00:49:10,960 --> 00:49:13,560
Speaker 1: But yeah, so a couple hundred clusters over the last

764
00:49:13,560 --> 00:49:16,439
Speaker 1: sixty days. Uh, you know, I don't know how many kills. Again,

765
00:49:16,480 --> 00:49:17,880
Speaker 1: I'd have to look and see how many of that is.

766
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,640
Speaker 1: But this male has been killing primarily elk um. Of course,

767
00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:25,000
Speaker 1: this study was set up designed during the peak having

768
00:49:25,120 --> 00:49:27,799
Speaker 1: period June first and Yelson. It's thought to be sort

769
00:49:27,800 --> 00:49:30,399
Speaker 1: of our our major you know, pulse of of elk

770
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:33,520
Speaker 1: calves average um caving date. Some are born late May,

771
00:49:33,600 --> 00:49:35,359
Speaker 1: some are you know, born the last couple of weeks

772
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:38,120
Speaker 1: even um, but usually around June one, and so we

773
00:49:38,280 --> 00:49:40,560
Speaker 1: kind of set this up to understand what, you know,

774
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:43,000
Speaker 1: how many elk calves are getting. Um. So his diet

775
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:46,160
Speaker 1: has been i would say, primarily elk calves. But he's

776
00:49:46,200 --> 00:49:50,080
Speaker 1: killed a couple of spike bowls, yearlings um bull elk

777
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:53,480
Speaker 1: he uh killed the mule deer phone last week newborn

778
00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:57,720
Speaker 1: muleer phon um. You know, cougar diets pretty pretty varied.

779
00:49:57,840 --> 00:50:00,200
Speaker 1: He really kind of depends what's available to them. But

780
00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:02,319
Speaker 1: this time of the year, young of the year. Uh,

781
00:50:02,480 --> 00:50:06,239
Speaker 1: fawns and calves are they're just easy, they're safer pray

782
00:50:06,280 --> 00:50:08,960
Speaker 1: package for them to take down and handle and um

783
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:12,279
Speaker 1: and uh so yeah, that's kind of what we tend

784
00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:14,719
Speaker 1: to find. It's not a bad place for cougar to live, No,

785
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:17,880
Speaker 1: not at all. It's gorgeous right here, and they have

786
00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:20,359
Speaker 1: access to good hunting grounds, but also you know, good

787
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:31,120
Speaker 1: escape train very much part of it. So we're so

788
00:50:31,239 --> 00:50:34,800
Speaker 1: you think that it's possible from here, and we're in

789
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 1: this patch of juniper and this looks like probably a

790
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:42,080
Speaker 1: bedsite up in here, and what we'll do and usually

791
00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:45,200
Speaker 1: we can find hair where they bed. Um, there's enough

792
00:50:45,239 --> 00:50:47,640
Speaker 1: points here and I don't just look at the map

793
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:49,160
Speaker 1: because they're kind of scattered. You get little bit of

794
00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:52,279
Speaker 1: error from the GPS caller, but it looks like bulk

795
00:50:52,320 --> 00:50:54,759
Speaker 1: of the points are just through here. But well, I

796
00:50:54,840 --> 00:50:56,319
Speaker 1: think that's the beach light there will come to something

797
00:50:56,360 --> 00:51:10,120
Speaker 1: that out. Yea. So here we have elk calf. Yeah, um,

798
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:13,239
Speaker 1: imagine that newborn. You know, that's just what you would

799
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:17,439
Speaker 1: predict here. And this is pretty classic. I mean there's

800
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:19,839
Speaker 1: not much left right. You got what we're looking at

801
00:51:19,920 --> 00:51:22,839
Speaker 1: here is the lower mandible and of course you can

802
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:25,120
Speaker 1: easily identify it's a calf because you don't have the

803
00:51:25,160 --> 00:51:28,600
Speaker 1: teeth eruption. Um. Of course it's small too. It's only

804
00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:31,560
Speaker 1: about four and a half inches long from the tip

805
00:51:31,800 --> 00:51:33,279
Speaker 1: down through the mandible. And you can see where they

806
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:36,960
Speaker 1: they don't um, you know, they won't crunch up the teeth.

807
00:51:37,000 --> 00:51:40,880
Speaker 1: That's just an indigestible, hard to chew and crunch up. Um.

808
00:51:41,640 --> 00:51:44,239
Speaker 1: But and then we see the skull cap here, So

809
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 1: that crunched right into the skull cap. Of course, the

810
00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:49,640
Speaker 1: brain would be a you know, nutrient rich source of

811
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:54,680
Speaker 1: food for any meat eater. Um. And so they were

812
00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:57,000
Speaker 1: quick to coot. Lion was quick to feed on that.

813
00:51:57,520 --> 00:52:01,120
Speaker 1: And then we've got a front leg, the huff, the

814
00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:04,560
Speaker 1: lower leg. But you can see, um, you know they've

815
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:06,759
Speaker 1: crunched through it. You know, cougar's jaw. I mean, they

816
00:52:06,800 --> 00:52:09,160
Speaker 1: have a really powerful bite. Force. Uh. They have a

817
00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:13,600
Speaker 1: short rosstrum, short jaw, big powerful muscles, master muscles that

818
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:15,960
Speaker 1: wrap around the outside of their fet heads and attached

819
00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:19,399
Speaker 1: to the top of their skull and their teeth of course,

820
00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:22,520
Speaker 1: their carnassial teeth or mowlers premolars top and bottom make

821
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:26,000
Speaker 1: that really powerful bite force. So they're pretty big bone

822
00:52:26,040 --> 00:52:27,640
Speaker 1: crunchers and eaters. And they do get a lot of

823
00:52:27,719 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 1: nutrients from that, both from the bone itself and from

824
00:52:30,239 --> 00:52:34,920
Speaker 1: the marrow inside um. And this is pretty classic. You mean,

825
00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 1: you know, a cougar that kills an elk calf will

826
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:41,200
Speaker 1: leave typically about this behind, which is just a bunch

827
00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:47,120
Speaker 1: of bone shards, the teeth, top, the skull, lower leg, everything.

828
00:52:48,040 --> 00:52:49,600
Speaker 1: And what we'll do here is we'll look around and

829
00:52:49,640 --> 00:52:53,920
Speaker 1: see if we see uh bear scott um my guesses,

830
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:56,840
Speaker 1: you know, with a smaller prey package like this. You know,

831
00:52:56,920 --> 00:52:58,960
Speaker 1: this is an elk calf, probably born in the first

832
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 1: couple of weeks of June or early June. And this

833
00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:04,879
Speaker 1: was kill was made on June July six, so maybe

834
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:08,480
Speaker 1: it was about a month old. It was probably you know,

835
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:10,239
Speaker 1: bet it could have been at that stage where it

836
00:53:10,280 --> 00:53:12,400
Speaker 1: was hiding and mom was off grazing and coming back

837
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 1: to nurse. Or it could have just been taken down

838
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:18,160
Speaker 1: right here with this lion watching as a group of

839
00:53:18,239 --> 00:53:20,520
Speaker 1: cows maybe filtered through in the evening or at night

840
00:53:20,600 --> 00:53:23,160
Speaker 1: feeding through here. I'll look at the data. I think

841
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:25,319
Speaker 1: this cluster started in the middle of the night, which

842
00:53:25,360 --> 00:53:27,560
Speaker 1: is more typical when cougars are out in the landscape hunting.

843
00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:30,759
Speaker 1: They're active at night hunting, so you imagine that the

844
00:53:31,239 --> 00:53:33,840
Speaker 1: calving grounds are here. It's like, maybe this helk was

845
00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:36,360
Speaker 1: born in this little in this general area. Yeah, I

846
00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:38,360
Speaker 1: mean a month old. It could have been born, you know,

847
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:40,960
Speaker 1: within a mile here, I would say, in this at

848
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:43,719
Speaker 1: this area. But um you know, at that first month

849
00:53:43,800 --> 00:53:46,279
Speaker 1: of life, they're pretty they're pretty staying pretty close to

850
00:53:46,320 --> 00:53:48,080
Speaker 1: where they were born unless mom wants to get up

851
00:53:48,080 --> 00:53:51,600
Speaker 1: and move to summer range with it. Um uh. This

852
00:53:51,719 --> 00:53:54,839
Speaker 1: gardener basin area is important cabin grounds for cow for sure.

853
00:53:55,239 --> 00:53:56,520
Speaker 1: But what we'll do here is take a look and

854
00:53:56,560 --> 00:53:58,399
Speaker 1: see if we see any saw. What I always trying

855
00:53:58,440 --> 00:54:00,680
Speaker 1: to do is we try to determine is this cougar

856
00:54:00,960 --> 00:54:03,759
Speaker 1: displaced by a larger carnivore and that would either be

857
00:54:03,840 --> 00:54:05,960
Speaker 1: a black bear, grizzly or a Brett pack of wolves.

858
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:08,640
Speaker 1: Based on how long he was here in the size

859
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:10,560
Speaker 1: of this, I would say he probably got most of this.

860
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:14,120
Speaker 1: You'll get ravens and magpies, eagles sometimes that come in.

861
00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:17,480
Speaker 1: But you know the specialty of cougars of of what

862
00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:19,759
Speaker 1: they're known for his cashing and concealing their prey. And

863
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:23,000
Speaker 1: that's a real uh. It's an adaptation to really protect

864
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:25,719
Speaker 1: the food harder and food resources. You can see here

865
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 1: on the edge of this thick patch of conifer. My

866
00:54:28,280 --> 00:54:30,759
Speaker 1: guess is usually see a pile of grass where it

867
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:33,400
Speaker 1: was buried, and right here behind us um in the

868
00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:37,359
Speaker 1: shaded area. Probably it was doubt it was back in here,

869
00:54:37,400 --> 00:54:40,400
Speaker 1: I would guess maybe fed in right here. Plenty of

870
00:54:40,480 --> 00:54:44,600
Speaker 1: shape concealment bone shards in here, so this is probably

871
00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:47,719
Speaker 1: where he dragged it to feed on. And you can

872
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:50,560
Speaker 1: see where it perfectly concealed. You know, ravens and magpies

873
00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:53,600
Speaker 1: will have a hard time finding this um. A little

874
00:54:53,600 --> 00:54:55,400
Speaker 1: bit of tufts of hair there. This is the end

875
00:54:55,440 --> 00:54:58,879
Speaker 1: of the scapula he chewed up. Um, so he would

876
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:02,160
Speaker 1: pull that cat back to here cash, Yeah, he might

877
00:55:02,239 --> 00:55:04,200
Speaker 1: bury it. You know what we find with with calves

878
00:55:04,320 --> 00:55:06,560
Speaker 1: is they it's a small enough a newborn calf is

879
00:55:06,560 --> 00:55:08,959
Speaker 1: small enough that they might not necessarily cash it. They'll

880
00:55:09,000 --> 00:55:11,880
Speaker 1: just start feeding on it. Certainly, with anything larger than

881
00:55:11,880 --> 00:55:15,000
Speaker 1: an elk calf, they almost automatically begin cashing even before

882
00:55:15,040 --> 00:55:18,840
Speaker 1: they feed, at least dragging to cover. So that's what

883
00:55:19,040 --> 00:55:21,480
Speaker 1: that's what he did here. I don't see any Scott

884
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:23,560
Speaker 1: you know, this area could have a black guy there.

885
00:55:23,960 --> 00:55:26,120
Speaker 1: I'm guessing he got most of the bottle math on

886
00:55:26,239 --> 00:55:29,160
Speaker 1: this calf, which would be I don't know, a newborn

887
00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:34,839
Speaker 1: elk calf is gonna you know, be twenty some off meat.

888
00:55:35,719 --> 00:55:39,120
Speaker 1: Um so, good meal, good meal. Well how long would

889
00:55:39,120 --> 00:55:40,920
Speaker 1: that satiate him for? Is he going to go, like

890
00:55:41,000 --> 00:55:44,680
Speaker 1: you said, go off a couple of miles? Typically we fine,

891
00:55:44,719 --> 00:55:46,959
Speaker 1: And this is again long term. I'm kind of giving

892
00:55:47,000 --> 00:55:49,279
Speaker 1: you averages here, but just give you an idea an

893
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:52,360
Speaker 1: adult male cougar. Of course, with cougar life history, they

894
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:54,880
Speaker 1: don't play any role in feeding young. They're off on

895
00:55:54,920 --> 00:55:57,000
Speaker 1: their own and they only associate with females to breed.

896
00:55:57,719 --> 00:56:00,600
Speaker 1: Females are the caretaker, they're the hard working single mom.

897
00:56:01,320 --> 00:56:04,960
Speaker 1: The males breathe the female. Usually in late and yellowstone

898
00:56:05,000 --> 00:56:07,439
Speaker 1: in late winter, although female cougars could get bread any

899
00:56:07,440 --> 00:56:09,919
Speaker 1: time of the year. They they cycle extracycle once every

900
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:13,279
Speaker 1: twenty eight days or so. UM. But we see a

901
00:56:13,360 --> 00:56:15,359
Speaker 1: birthing pulse in May, June, and July in a place

902
00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:17,359
Speaker 1: like Yellowstone because that's when a lot of foods out

903
00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:19,799
Speaker 1: for moms. But a male like this typically will make

904
00:56:19,840 --> 00:56:23,200
Speaker 1: a kill on average every seven to ten days. Of course,

905
00:56:23,239 --> 00:56:25,440
Speaker 1: at all is dictated by the size of the prey package,

906
00:56:25,480 --> 00:56:28,399
Speaker 1: as small el cap will sustain him for less time

907
00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:32,640
Speaker 1: than a large animal. UM. I forget exactly when his

908
00:56:33,080 --> 00:56:36,200
Speaker 1: last kill was. Oh, I do remembers. Yesterday we searched it.

909
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:39,080
Speaker 1: It was about four miles that way. It was a

910
00:56:39,239 --> 00:56:42,960
Speaker 1: syealing bull elk and there was a lot of black

911
00:56:43,000 --> 00:56:44,800
Speaker 1: bear scout around it. And he was only at that

912
00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:46,840
Speaker 1: site for about fifteen hours. So my guess is what

913
00:56:46,920 --> 00:56:49,160
Speaker 1: happened is he killed that was kicked off by a bear,

914
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:51,960
Speaker 1: came down here, made this kill a little more time here.

915
00:56:52,440 --> 00:56:56,080
Speaker 1: So you're like c S. I most very much, very much.

916
00:56:56,120 --> 00:56:59,000
Speaker 1: I mean, it's really the fun to come to these sites,

917
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:00,680
Speaker 1: look for the clues, look for the evidence, try to

918
00:57:00,719 --> 00:57:04,200
Speaker 1: piece the story together. Of course, we have the old

919
00:57:04,239 --> 00:57:06,560
Speaker 1: school field biology. I mean, biologists have been doing this

920
00:57:06,640 --> 00:57:10,200
Speaker 1: with carnival research for uh, you know, fifty sixty seventy years.

921
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:13,239
Speaker 1: I mean you can go back to you know, our ancestors,

922
00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:15,200
Speaker 1: you know, out there using the same techniques to try

923
00:57:15,239 --> 00:57:18,480
Speaker 1: to piece together where prey was or where competitors like

924
00:57:18,560 --> 00:57:22,760
Speaker 1: carnivores were. So we emplay those same tactics today, but

925
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:24,960
Speaker 1: we also benefit from the technology. I mean you see

926
00:57:24,960 --> 00:57:26,560
Speaker 1: me I locked in here with the GPS in it,

927
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:29,000
Speaker 1: I had as GPS data loaded in here, we can

928
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:32,200
Speaker 1: come right to the site. Uh. It's a really powerful

929
00:57:32,280 --> 00:57:35,520
Speaker 1: tool to get accurate data on what these animals are doing.

930
00:57:35,880 --> 00:57:38,920
Speaker 1: And as you said it, to imagine it's from some

931
00:57:39,160 --> 00:57:44,000
Speaker 1: people not as not as exciting as hunting, but incredibly

932
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:48,680
Speaker 1: important to our our general knowledge base on how predation happens,

933
00:57:48,800 --> 00:57:54,480
Speaker 1: right absolutely. I mean there's so uh so many opinions

934
00:57:54,520 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 1: and thoughts about what carnivores are doing and how they

935
00:57:57,240 --> 00:57:59,360
Speaker 1: hunt and how they feed and what inpics they have,

936
00:58:00,160 --> 00:58:04,200
Speaker 1: and we all have those opinions, um and I think

937
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:09,160
Speaker 1: what we as scientists really cherish is having you know,

938
00:58:09,640 --> 00:58:13,640
Speaker 1: data right to to really critically evaluate it and truly

939
00:58:13,720 --> 00:58:18,640
Speaker 1: understand what's going on, um, you know, without without you know,

940
00:58:18,720 --> 00:58:20,440
Speaker 1: cougars are a great example in Yellowstone. You know, in

941
00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:23,400
Speaker 1: the last twenty five years wolves have come back, right,

942
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:27,800
Speaker 1: and that was a huge UH conservation success story. It

943
00:58:27,920 --> 00:58:31,800
Speaker 1: was very controversial it is to this day. Um. And

944
00:58:32,360 --> 00:58:34,760
Speaker 1: and but I think what we've really learned is having

945
00:58:34,840 --> 00:58:37,800
Speaker 1: really good information about what role and animal like a

946
00:58:37,800 --> 00:58:40,480
Speaker 1: wolf or cougar has helps us better understand how to

947
00:58:40,560 --> 00:58:42,600
Speaker 1: either whether we want to manage them, whether we don't

948
00:58:42,640 --> 00:58:44,160
Speaker 1: want to manage them, like in a place like Yellowstone,

949
00:58:44,160 --> 00:58:46,080
Speaker 1: where we just step back and let nature take its course.

950
00:58:47,000 --> 00:58:49,800
Speaker 1: We don't have the luxury of having protective preserves around

951
00:58:49,840 --> 00:58:52,960
Speaker 1: our country like Yellowstone. So those of us that live

952
00:58:53,040 --> 00:58:56,280
Speaker 1: in this area and hunt and fish and enjoy the

953
00:58:56,360 --> 00:59:00,120
Speaker 1: landscape and our public lands and and um, we to

954
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:02,720
Speaker 1: coexist with all these animals, whether they're elk or cougars,

955
00:59:02,800 --> 00:59:06,080
Speaker 1: and and you know, the more understanding we have of them,

956
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:09,480
Speaker 1: the better we are at living with them and protecting them,

957
00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:14,240
Speaker 1: and um, understanding what impacts we have on them and

958
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:17,520
Speaker 1: what our activities as humans have. So it's saft feeds

959
00:59:17,560 --> 00:59:20,560
Speaker 1: into that. It's really incredibly important. And you're definitely kind

960
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:22,880
Speaker 1: of at the you know kind of the nexus of

961
00:59:24,320 --> 00:59:29,280
Speaker 1: we as Americans are drawn to these charismatic predators. We

962
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:31,960
Speaker 1: can explore that all day long, but we're definitely drawn

963
00:59:32,080 --> 00:59:33,840
Speaker 1: to them. Some people are drawn to them in a

964
00:59:33,920 --> 00:59:37,640
Speaker 1: more sympathetic way, some people in a more logical way,

965
00:59:37,720 --> 00:59:41,280
Speaker 1: and more pragmatic way. Some people um based on you know,

966
00:59:41,280 --> 00:59:42,880
Speaker 1: a lot of hunters. As we were talking about walking

967
00:59:42,920 --> 00:59:45,680
Speaker 1: up here, a lot of hunters are drawn to them

968
00:59:46,280 --> 00:59:49,720
Speaker 1: from the propaganda of you know, the last century where

969
00:59:49,720 --> 00:59:51,320
Speaker 1: we needed to kill them all and displace them so

970
00:59:51,400 --> 00:59:55,200
Speaker 1: we could ranch and live in relative without you know,

971
00:59:55,920 --> 00:59:59,680
Speaker 1: bears and cougars killing our killing our calves and killing

972
00:59:59,680 --> 01:00:02,880
Speaker 1: our holes and killing our profits. So it's you kind

973
01:00:02,920 --> 01:00:06,320
Speaker 1: of sit at this strange you know nexus of all

974
01:00:06,400 --> 01:00:12,840
Speaker 1: those things happening together and they all have influence. Hey,

975
01:00:12,960 --> 01:00:16,160
Speaker 1: we're back from Yellowstone. What a lovely trip, Phil. It's

976
01:00:16,280 --> 01:00:18,880
Speaker 1: nice this time of the year. Dead, the dead cold,

977
01:00:19,400 --> 01:00:22,800
Speaker 1: you can't even breathe. Um. We got a lot of

978
01:00:22,840 --> 01:00:24,520
Speaker 1: other things to do. So that's that wraps up our

979
01:00:24,560 --> 01:00:26,640
Speaker 1: in the field segment. But we really look forward to

980
01:00:26,720 --> 01:00:30,080
Speaker 1: doing more in the field stuff next year, specifically Turkey season.

981
01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:32,280
Speaker 1: I got a lot of plans for Turkey season. Wanted

982
01:00:32,320 --> 01:00:33,600
Speaker 1: to take he has in the field with us and

983
01:00:33,640 --> 01:00:37,040
Speaker 1: shoots them some Godlers in the face and hopefully we

984
01:00:37,120 --> 01:00:40,640
Speaker 1: can coax fill the engineer and other friends along the

985
01:00:40,720 --> 01:00:45,400
Speaker 1: way for that. In one. Now, there's some important moments

986
01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:47,640
Speaker 1: in our lives that we will never forget. Some things

987
01:00:47,720 --> 01:00:50,040
Speaker 1: that we did in one that will move us along

988
01:00:50,080 --> 01:00:53,479
Speaker 1: into the future. And one of those things was Phil

989
01:00:53,560 --> 01:00:55,720
Speaker 1: ready for this. And this was a controversy between Phil

990
01:00:55,760 --> 01:00:57,720
Speaker 1: and I. We had a big argument about this. We

991
01:00:57,800 --> 01:01:00,600
Speaker 1: almost came to fisticuffs, camels, came to lows over this,

992
01:01:01,360 --> 01:01:04,600
Speaker 1: and it was burying the hatchet with Dr Barry Gilbert,

993
01:01:05,000 --> 01:01:10,120
Speaker 1: burying the hatchet with our buddy Dr Barry Gilbert and Phil,

994
01:01:10,640 --> 01:01:12,840
Speaker 1: can you just tell people, just recap that you really

995
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:16,000
Speaker 1: didn't want this to happen. You're pushing it kind of far,

996
01:01:16,200 --> 01:01:19,720
Speaker 1: I think, Uh. I mean, Barry sent us a book afterwards.

997
01:01:20,160 --> 01:01:24,760
Speaker 1: He's he's been he's been very generous. Um. I At

998
01:01:24,840 --> 01:01:28,280
Speaker 1: the time, I just said that I didn't think we

999
01:01:28,360 --> 01:01:31,640
Speaker 1: would be making we would make any headway, any progress. Um.

1000
01:01:31,840 --> 01:01:35,000
Speaker 1: But I think I think I was mostly wrong. Do

1001
01:01:35,120 --> 01:01:38,600
Speaker 1: you mostly wrong? Mostly wrong? I mean, we we knew

1002
01:01:38,640 --> 01:01:42,800
Speaker 1: the the ultimate argument to kill bears or not kill

1003
01:01:42,840 --> 01:01:45,200
Speaker 1: bears with Barry was never going to be solved, but

1004
01:01:45,440 --> 01:01:47,840
Speaker 1: we could we could inch closer to just being friends

1005
01:01:47,920 --> 01:01:50,720
Speaker 1: with the guy now. And if people don't remember, Barry

1006
01:01:50,840 --> 01:01:55,160
Speaker 1: came on in twenty nineteen and it was the most

1007
01:01:55,160 --> 01:01:57,560
Speaker 1: contentious interview we've ever done. He yelled at me, he

1008
01:01:58,160 --> 01:02:00,840
Speaker 1: got mad because I didn't give him a hat uh.

1009
01:02:00,920 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 1: He wanted to storm out of the studio and we

1010
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:07,400
Speaker 1: had an argument of sorts about whether or not the

1011
01:02:07,480 --> 01:02:10,360
Speaker 1: North American model of conservation was appropriate in terms of

1012
01:02:10,520 --> 01:02:14,200
Speaker 1: enacting it and killing and hunting bears of all of

1013
01:02:14,280 --> 01:02:17,280
Speaker 1: all shapes of size. So he it was. It was

1014
01:02:17,400 --> 01:02:19,640
Speaker 1: probably the most talked about episode of the show ever,

1015
01:02:20,120 --> 01:02:22,120
Speaker 1: and this year we felt the need to follow it

1016
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:25,840
Speaker 1: up by giving Barry a call and talking it through

1017
01:02:25,920 --> 01:02:29,480
Speaker 1: with him. And so here is us baring the hatchet

1018
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:36,600
Speaker 1: with Dr bear Berry. How are you, sir, doing okay?

1019
01:02:37,200 --> 01:02:42,440
Speaker 1: Enjoying summer or isolated on an island which is kind

1020
01:02:42,480 --> 01:02:44,720
Speaker 1: of nice. I'm doing a lot of swimming and sailing.

1021
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:50,520
Speaker 1: So you tell me, people, tell us how the pandemic

1022
01:02:50,600 --> 01:02:52,600
Speaker 1: has been, How how the last few months has been

1023
01:02:52,680 --> 01:02:57,680
Speaker 1: for you and your family? Up there. Oh, pretty good.

1024
01:02:57,800 --> 01:03:02,920
Speaker 1: Actually we're at the low and the of the pandemic.

1025
01:03:03,520 --> 01:03:07,840
Speaker 1: Everybody's going around with masks on and h including going

1026
01:03:07,920 --> 01:03:12,000
Speaker 1: on our ferry or island. But I don't know anybody

1027
01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:16,440
Speaker 1: that's been positive how things. I noticed Montana's in pretty

1028
01:03:16,480 --> 01:03:19,920
Speaker 1: good shape. And going down to Yeah, it's been good.

1029
01:03:20,000 --> 01:03:22,080
Speaker 1: Were We were in the office for a while and

1030
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:25,320
Speaker 1: then got shuffled out because things are on the rise.

1031
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:28,240
Speaker 1: But now it seems like things are leveling out. So um,

1032
01:03:28,680 --> 01:03:30,920
Speaker 1: yeah we feel good in Montana, Phil, you feel pretty good.

1033
01:03:31,000 --> 01:03:33,080
Speaker 1: We got fill our engineer here. Say hi, say hi

1034
01:03:33,160 --> 01:03:36,640
Speaker 1: to Barry Hey Berry. How's it going? Yeah, I m hi.

1035
01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:41,120
Speaker 1: I Yeah, it's definitely. It's good to see a lot

1036
01:03:41,120 --> 01:03:44,040
Speaker 1: of people out out in masks around here. And um,

1037
01:03:44,600 --> 01:03:46,920
Speaker 1: it's a little less anxious than it used to be,

1038
01:03:47,040 --> 01:03:48,960
Speaker 1: which I think is good. People are just just moving

1039
01:03:49,160 --> 01:03:51,959
Speaker 1: moving on with their lives like they have to. So yeah,

1040
01:03:53,280 --> 01:03:56,760
Speaker 1: the border dan closed to stopped all chances of me

1041
01:03:57,280 --> 01:03:59,960
Speaker 1: going in Montana. I like to get down the Yellowstone

1042
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:02,480
Speaker 1: and you know, I got a lot of friends sound

1043
01:04:02,600 --> 01:04:06,800
Speaker 1: that way. But well we can fly and if I

1044
01:04:06,880 --> 01:04:10,720
Speaker 1: want to go to Ottawa and fly to Bozeman, I

1045
01:04:10,840 --> 01:04:13,360
Speaker 1: can do that, but I'm I'm not sure I'll get

1046
01:04:13,400 --> 01:04:17,400
Speaker 1: back into Canada. We've had a few people come down

1047
01:04:17,440 --> 01:04:19,880
Speaker 1: from Canada, but it's a sketchy experience, one that you

1048
01:04:19,960 --> 01:04:22,360
Speaker 1: really want to have to come to Montana for. So

1049
01:04:22,880 --> 01:04:25,280
Speaker 1: we all, we definitely understand that. Well, are we glad

1050
01:04:25,320 --> 01:04:27,919
Speaker 1: we got you? Man um? As as I was saying

1051
01:04:27,960 --> 01:04:32,000
Speaker 1: over email, we there. There's there's not been a conversation

1052
01:04:32,040 --> 01:04:34,360
Speaker 1: that we've had on this show, and we've had hundreds,

1053
01:04:34,480 --> 01:04:37,720
Speaker 1: I mean hundreds of conversations over time that got as

1054
01:04:37,800 --> 01:04:41,320
Speaker 1: much commentary, as much conversation going as what we called

1055
01:04:41,360 --> 01:04:45,080
Speaker 1: a contentious interview with you back last year, and we

1056
01:04:45,160 --> 01:04:47,600
Speaker 1: talked about you all the time, you know, we it's

1057
01:04:47,680 --> 01:04:50,880
Speaker 1: it's such a the thing that we talked about, predation

1058
01:04:51,080 --> 01:04:53,400
Speaker 1: and bears is such an important thing. We've been talking

1059
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:56,439
Speaker 1: to a lot of individuals about it. Um But also

1060
01:04:56,520 --> 01:05:00,120
Speaker 1: I think just how you know, what was said, how

1061
01:05:00,200 --> 01:05:03,000
Speaker 1: it was said, how everything ended up, everybody had a

1062
01:05:03,080 --> 01:05:06,720
Speaker 1: reaction to it, and so time has passed. Time has passed,

1063
01:05:07,400 --> 01:05:09,240
Speaker 1: and I all I wanted to do is have you

1064
01:05:09,360 --> 01:05:12,960
Speaker 1: on and chat about you know, what had happened. And yeah,

1065
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:15,760
Speaker 1: I guess my first question is what was after you

1066
01:05:15,840 --> 01:05:18,120
Speaker 1: came in and we did the interview. What happened in

1067
01:05:18,240 --> 01:05:23,800
Speaker 1: your world? Um after we aired that thing? Uh not,

1068
01:05:24,080 --> 01:05:27,440
Speaker 1: not a whole lot. I had a couple of trolls

1069
01:05:27,640 --> 01:05:33,479
Speaker 1: that went on Amazon and dump shit on my book

1070
01:05:33,920 --> 01:05:36,760
Speaker 1: without you know, having seen it at all. They clearly

1071
01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:40,600
Speaker 1: were offended by me. One of the guys said, you know,

1072
01:05:40,760 --> 01:05:45,360
Speaker 1: I was old man that I didn't get enough attention

1073
01:05:45,440 --> 01:05:49,480
Speaker 1: and I wanted more attention. And he said, you can

1074
01:05:49,560 --> 01:05:52,160
Speaker 1: believe this, he said, so we get it. You had

1075
01:05:52,200 --> 01:05:54,800
Speaker 1: a bad day. Well, shift, I had a bad life

1076
01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:57,439
Speaker 1: after that there nailed me and I had two months

1077
01:05:57,480 --> 01:06:00,520
Speaker 1: in the hospital on my back, so it was little

1078
01:06:00,560 --> 01:06:03,320
Speaker 1: more in the bad day. But you know, I can

1079
01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:07,720
Speaker 1: see why people get cranked up. My My knowledge is

1080
01:06:07,880 --> 01:06:12,560
Speaker 1: limited to, you know, observing bears. I've had thousands of

1081
01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:17,840
Speaker 1: hours of doing it, and I challenge anybody that wants

1082
01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:22,040
Speaker 1: to take me on, say they've done more watching of theirs.

1083
01:06:22,240 --> 01:06:27,680
Speaker 1: But I'm kind of like an anthropologist watching a culture

1084
01:06:28,120 --> 01:06:32,240
Speaker 1: do its thing, so when it comes to you know,

1085
01:06:32,480 --> 01:06:35,080
Speaker 1: their attacks, and not an expert when it comes to

1086
01:06:35,720 --> 01:06:40,360
Speaker 1: population biology and modeling and how many bears there are. Uh,

1087
01:06:40,720 --> 01:06:44,920
Speaker 1: I only know what I read and and what's in

1088
01:06:45,040 --> 01:06:48,640
Speaker 1: the press. You know, I try to follow the Grizzly

1089
01:06:48,720 --> 01:06:52,560
Speaker 1: Bear Advisory Committee that your governor put up, but apparently

1090
01:06:52,640 --> 01:06:56,760
Speaker 1: it hasn't come out with any recommendationship. But they've got

1091
01:06:56,880 --> 01:07:00,640
Speaker 1: eighteen people on there. I imagine they got twenty two opinions.

1092
01:07:02,080 --> 01:07:04,120
Speaker 1: That's well. That's the beautiful thing about what we talked

1093
01:07:04,160 --> 01:07:07,640
Speaker 1: about is that it it does bring in so many

1094
01:07:07,760 --> 01:07:12,919
Speaker 1: different opinions. We went recently and visited Yellowstone Park National

1095
01:07:13,000 --> 01:07:15,240
Speaker 1: Park and we tracked some mountain lions with a predator

1096
01:07:15,240 --> 01:07:18,520
Speaker 1: biologist by the name of Dr Daniel Staylor. His perspective

1097
01:07:18,600 --> 01:07:20,920
Speaker 1: was was a beautiful one, a very tangible one. We

1098
01:07:21,040 --> 01:07:23,919
Speaker 1: just had a Dr Various skyst on last episode talked

1099
01:07:23,960 --> 01:07:26,240
Speaker 1: to him about his perspective. So we've been just trying

1100
01:07:26,280 --> 01:07:28,520
Speaker 1: to mind as many of these perspectives as we can,

1101
01:07:28,920 --> 01:07:31,920
Speaker 1: and they're it just I think it all shows that

1102
01:07:32,040 --> 01:07:34,400
Speaker 1: this is a complex issue. There's a lot going on,

1103
01:07:34,920 --> 01:07:37,160
Speaker 1: and it really gets people's tackles up. And we've also

1104
01:07:37,240 --> 01:07:41,520
Speaker 1: I'll tell you, Barry had a neurologist on neuroscientist on

1105
01:07:41,640 --> 01:07:45,040
Speaker 1: and talked about kind of you know, our brains are

1106
01:07:45,400 --> 01:07:50,360
Speaker 1: the psychology of why some people really loved predators or

1107
01:07:50,400 --> 01:07:53,560
Speaker 1: love grizzly bearris particularly, and why some people have of

1108
01:07:53,680 --> 01:07:56,000
Speaker 1: such a negative reaction to them. And so it's been

1109
01:07:56,040 --> 01:07:59,160
Speaker 1: interesting to learn over time how these things come about.

1110
01:07:59,360 --> 01:08:01,880
Speaker 1: So it's it's good to do that. Do you do

1111
01:08:01,960 --> 01:08:07,160
Speaker 1: you feel like the sociology of people's values and whether

1112
01:08:07,160 --> 01:08:09,880
Speaker 1: they're going to change? You know? I try pretty much.

1113
01:08:09,920 --> 01:08:12,600
Speaker 1: I've read enough to stay away from that because I

1114
01:08:12,720 --> 01:08:19,920
Speaker 1: don't have any illusions about or delusions about changing people's minds.

1115
01:08:20,200 --> 01:08:22,759
Speaker 1: I just had my experience, and that's what my book

1116
01:08:22,840 --> 01:08:27,799
Speaker 1: was about my thirty five or forty years experience with theirs.

1117
01:08:28,360 --> 01:08:31,920
Speaker 1: And at the end I try to take on some

1118
01:08:32,080 --> 01:08:37,400
Speaker 1: of politics and management because I'm offended that the conservation

1119
01:08:37,479 --> 01:08:41,000
Speaker 1: of theirs gets a dollar sign on it and the

1120
01:08:41,080 --> 01:08:46,519
Speaker 1: bears generally lose. But that's uh, that's just something that

1121
01:08:46,720 --> 01:08:49,920
Speaker 1: I've learned from experience in a national park. We all

1122
01:08:50,000 --> 01:08:54,680
Speaker 1: think that national parks are total protection for bears, but

1123
01:08:56,000 --> 01:08:59,920
Speaker 1: they're not protected from fast vehicles or trains, and nor

1124
01:09:00,080 --> 01:09:02,880
Speaker 1: than Montana and a whole bunch of things. In fact,

1125
01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:06,599
Speaker 1: if you look at national parks, I looked at them,

1126
01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:10,280
Speaker 1: and Jasper in Canada at one time and and Yellowstone

1127
01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:16,439
Speaker 1: and the death of bears from humans is equivalent to

1128
01:09:16,520 --> 01:09:20,080
Speaker 1: a hunting season. I mean, it's not like they're totally protected.

1129
01:09:20,960 --> 01:09:24,559
Speaker 1: And the same goes for wolves in UH in Denali Park.

1130
01:09:24,680 --> 01:09:27,400
Speaker 1: And then swered this in my book that one of

1131
01:09:27,439 --> 01:09:30,280
Speaker 1: the research biol is just there back in the guess

1132
01:09:30,360 --> 01:09:33,720
Speaker 1: was in the seventies told me every wolf pack in

1133
01:09:33,840 --> 01:09:40,320
Speaker 1: Denali Park UH is subjected to trapping because they reigned

1134
01:09:40,400 --> 01:09:43,679
Speaker 1: so widely, you know, and when they go outside the park,

1135
01:09:43,800 --> 01:09:50,000
Speaker 1: of course they get nailed. So so much for conservational wolves. Yeah,

1136
01:09:50,000 --> 01:09:52,800
Speaker 1: we were talking to Dr Geys last week. We talked

1137
01:09:52,840 --> 01:09:56,479
Speaker 1: a little. He his his ideas, Like the two competing

1138
01:09:56,520 --> 01:10:00,080
Speaker 1: ideas he presented were this idea of protectionism and you

1139
01:10:00,120 --> 01:10:02,599
Speaker 1: know that was connected to environmentalism, and then this idea

1140
01:10:02,640 --> 01:10:06,320
Speaker 1: of intelligent intervention on the wildlife management side, which which

1141
01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:10,320
Speaker 1: meant hunting other tools for managing predator populations. Be interested

1142
01:10:10,360 --> 01:10:12,080
Speaker 1: to hear you, you know what you think about that

1143
01:10:12,200 --> 01:10:14,120
Speaker 1: as we because like I said, we've do four or

1144
01:10:14,160 --> 01:10:17,560
Speaker 1: five shows or I've tried to present as many varying opinions.

1145
01:10:17,880 --> 01:10:21,519
Speaker 1: We have Chris derreman on later who also who tends

1146
01:10:21,560 --> 01:10:23,679
Speaker 1: to be on your side of things when it comes

1147
01:10:23,720 --> 01:10:25,400
Speaker 1: to bears. But can you do you have any thoughts

1148
01:10:25,400 --> 01:10:30,760
Speaker 1: about this protectionism versus intelligent intervention? Oh? Yeah. One of

1149
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:35,120
Speaker 1: the one of the conundrums I think about is why

1150
01:10:35,320 --> 01:10:40,800
Speaker 1: we went some endangered status to desire to have a

1151
01:10:40,880 --> 01:10:45,240
Speaker 1: hunting season in the three three states around Yellowstone. It

1152
01:10:45,400 --> 01:10:48,720
Speaker 1: just seems to me a transition. Once you've got to

1153
01:10:48,880 --> 01:10:53,639
Speaker 1: the number small as it is, say seven hundred, eight hundred,

1154
01:10:53,760 --> 01:10:56,800
Speaker 1: six hundred bears, all of a sudden you have a

1155
01:10:57,040 --> 01:11:00,400
Speaker 1: hunting season on them. I mean, my impression from the

1156
01:11:00,560 --> 01:11:03,840
Speaker 1: media was that people couldn't wait to kill them, whether

1157
01:11:03,920 --> 01:11:06,600
Speaker 1: it's by hunting or let the ranchers nail them or

1158
01:11:07,240 --> 01:11:12,920
Speaker 1: shoot them from helicopters. So I I don't have much

1159
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:17,920
Speaker 1: truck with trophy hunting. It isn't there isn't something to eat,

1160
01:11:18,040 --> 01:11:22,960
Speaker 1: although British Columbia tried to have a season in which

1161
01:11:23,080 --> 01:11:25,120
Speaker 1: you could kill a grizzly bear if you took the

1162
01:11:25,240 --> 01:11:31,160
Speaker 1: meat home, and to me, that's a backdoor approach to conservation.

1163
01:11:31,680 --> 01:11:35,560
Speaker 1: I just think there's so much interest. You know, Yellowstone

1164
01:11:35,640 --> 01:11:39,160
Speaker 1: isn't the only place that people go to observed. There's

1165
01:11:39,960 --> 01:11:43,479
Speaker 1: photographs and all those sort of things, you know, Teetohn Park,

1166
01:11:43,560 --> 01:11:45,639
Speaker 1: and then you go up the coast of British Columbia.

1167
01:11:46,240 --> 01:11:51,520
Speaker 1: There are thirty businesses on the coast alone that emphasize

1168
01:11:52,280 --> 01:11:55,519
Speaker 1: they're viewing as part of their trips, whether whale watching

1169
01:11:55,760 --> 01:12:01,240
Speaker 1: or you know, learning mammals in general. So I could

1170
01:12:01,280 --> 01:12:06,839
Speaker 1: see uh going to uh they're viewing. Now it's trickier

1171
01:12:06,880 --> 01:12:09,479
Speaker 1: and rockies. You have to find a you know, a

1172
01:12:09,640 --> 01:12:12,880
Speaker 1: burn with a big berry patch where there's are concentrating.

1173
01:12:12,960 --> 01:12:16,080
Speaker 1: If you're trying to run a business taking people to

1174
01:12:16,160 --> 01:12:20,800
Speaker 1: see grizzly there's Uh, it's tough to go and say

1175
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:23,920
Speaker 1: South un we're gonna go and look at grizzly bears

1176
01:12:24,360 --> 01:12:27,559
Speaker 1: even in Yellowstone. That doesn't work. Yeah, that's the that's

1177
01:12:27,600 --> 01:12:30,800
Speaker 1: the problem with animal wild viewing in general. They don't

1178
01:12:30,840 --> 01:12:33,840
Speaker 1: they necessarily know they're being viewed or that somebody wants

1179
01:12:33,880 --> 01:12:37,120
Speaker 1: to view them. Can I ask you, um. Another thing

1180
01:12:37,200 --> 01:12:39,120
Speaker 1: that happened from the last show is people want to

1181
01:12:39,720 --> 01:12:42,120
Speaker 1: jump to the conclusion that you're fully anti hunting, that

1182
01:12:42,200 --> 01:12:44,680
Speaker 1: all hunting in your mind doesn't work. Can you kind

1183
01:12:44,680 --> 01:12:48,479
Speaker 1: of describe your your thoughts on maybe unglet hunting, hunting

1184
01:12:48,520 --> 01:12:51,040
Speaker 1: of deer and elk, and then hunting of a grizzly bear.

1185
01:12:51,200 --> 01:12:53,280
Speaker 1: Like what you just kind of throw that out there

1186
01:12:53,320 --> 01:12:58,080
Speaker 1: for everybody. Oh, I'm not anti hunting at all. Uh.

1187
01:12:59,360 --> 01:13:02,280
Speaker 1: I taught like management. I wouldn't have a job if

1188
01:13:02,439 --> 01:13:05,439
Speaker 1: I was andy hunting. I think half my students had

1189
01:13:06,120 --> 01:13:09,519
Speaker 1: rifles in their half tons. And one guy asked me

1190
01:13:09,760 --> 01:13:11,920
Speaker 1: we were going to Yellowstone in the winter. He says,

1191
01:13:12,200 --> 01:13:15,200
Speaker 1: it's okay if I bring my thirty thirty and my

1192
01:13:15,760 --> 01:13:18,400
Speaker 1: half tongue, I might see a deer on the way.

1193
01:13:18,840 --> 01:13:23,960
Speaker 1: I said, I don't think that's gonna work. But uh no,

1194
01:13:24,200 --> 01:13:30,160
Speaker 1: I think hunting is important to help. Dear you name

1195
01:13:30,240 --> 01:13:33,479
Speaker 1: the caraboo moose. That that gets a lot of people,

1196
01:13:34,560 --> 01:13:39,200
Speaker 1: uh interested in wildlife management. It's what how our country started.

1197
01:13:39,479 --> 01:13:45,160
Speaker 1: You know. Lewis and Clark shot just just under over

1198
01:13:45,439 --> 01:13:51,120
Speaker 1: a thousand antelope crossing crossing the country, so they couldn't

1199
01:13:51,160 --> 01:13:55,160
Speaker 1: have made it without granted that isn't permitted hunting, but

1200
01:13:55,760 --> 01:14:00,960
Speaker 1: they lived off the land, and there's still people Alaska

1201
01:14:01,120 --> 01:14:04,439
Speaker 1: that basically they're only protein is what they shoot or

1202
01:14:04,479 --> 01:14:11,120
Speaker 1: trapped or whatever. So I'm not I think hunting um

1203
01:14:12,439 --> 01:14:20,679
Speaker 1: pray Ungulus m is absolutely traditional, and I have nothing

1204
01:14:20,760 --> 01:14:25,000
Speaker 1: against it. When it comes to carnivores, I sometimes wonder

1205
01:14:26,080 --> 01:14:30,559
Speaker 1: um people with high powered rifles that sit in trees

1206
01:14:30,760 --> 01:14:34,519
Speaker 1: over sand and streams and shoot their twelve hundred yards.

1207
01:14:36,240 --> 01:14:39,160
Speaker 1: My daughter read something in my book and she says

1208
01:14:39,240 --> 01:14:43,000
Speaker 1: that it sounds like a search and destroying mission because

1209
01:14:43,080 --> 01:14:46,439
Speaker 1: the hunter isn't risking anything by sitting in a tree

1210
01:14:46,520 --> 01:14:49,519
Speaker 1: with a guide and some of them if the hunters jumping,

1211
01:14:49,600 --> 01:14:54,080
Speaker 1: the guide will shoot the there. So I I just

1212
01:14:54,200 --> 01:15:00,320
Speaker 1: don't see shooting grizzly. There go either the tel or

1213
01:15:00,600 --> 01:15:04,160
Speaker 1: a skull if you can keep the skull um. And

1214
01:15:04,360 --> 01:15:08,760
Speaker 1: my impression is both people don't have much use for

1215
01:15:09,000 --> 01:15:13,800
Speaker 1: learning about the bears, that is following and photographing them

1216
01:15:13,880 --> 01:15:18,280
Speaker 1: and spending time observing them. They want to and the

1217
01:15:18,400 --> 01:15:21,920
Speaker 1: coast of DC, you know, they fly in an aircraft.

1218
01:15:22,080 --> 01:15:24,960
Speaker 1: The guide out that takes them up for the half

1219
01:15:25,040 --> 01:15:27,160
Speaker 1: time on the logging road, takes them up to the

1220
01:15:29,000 --> 01:15:31,120
Speaker 1: stand and if they're lucky, they can shoot it there

1221
01:15:31,120 --> 01:15:33,599
Speaker 1: and he can be back watching potball and drinking there

1222
01:15:33,640 --> 01:15:38,240
Speaker 1: in the afternoon. Now that's hardly a wilderness trip. Hunting

1223
01:15:38,280 --> 01:15:41,400
Speaker 1: there is just to be a matter of going out

1224
01:15:41,439 --> 01:15:43,960
Speaker 1: for two weeks and doing a lot of trumping up

1225
01:15:44,040 --> 01:15:47,760
Speaker 1: and down mountains or up and down streams. Whatever it is.

1226
01:15:48,000 --> 01:15:52,960
Speaker 1: So here where I'm going, it's the technology that it

1227
01:15:53,120 --> 01:15:58,760
Speaker 1: takes it a bit out of the Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1228
01:15:58,800 --> 01:16:00,760
Speaker 1: I think that's what we and we talk about that

1229
01:16:00,960 --> 01:16:04,360
Speaker 1: those ethics a lot here, fair chase, fair kill, different

1230
01:16:04,400 --> 01:16:06,760
Speaker 1: ideas I think, you know, especially in that last narvie too,

1231
01:16:07,200 --> 01:16:09,840
Speaker 1: people take umbrage to this idea that you know, we

1232
01:16:09,880 --> 01:16:12,840
Speaker 1: would generalize hunters or use a straw man of Yeah,

1233
01:16:12,880 --> 01:16:14,880
Speaker 1: maybe there there are plenty of asshole hunters out there.

1234
01:16:14,920 --> 01:16:18,280
Speaker 1: I'm sure plenty of people that do it. Um And

1235
01:16:18,800 --> 01:16:21,000
Speaker 1: you know, I've run into some people that in hunting

1236
01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:24,080
Speaker 1: camp where I I wasn't necessarily didn't necessarily feel like

1237
01:16:24,080 --> 01:16:26,240
Speaker 1: they had the same value system as I do. And

1238
01:16:26,479 --> 01:16:28,679
Speaker 1: you know, so there's no one here that's gonna say

1239
01:16:28,760 --> 01:16:32,040
Speaker 1: that it's a completely pure thing. But at the same time,

1240
01:16:32,800 --> 01:16:37,400
Speaker 1: those examples I feel are you know, rare and extreme,

1241
01:16:38,000 --> 01:16:40,400
Speaker 1: but they do happen, and so that's that's the balance.

1242
01:16:40,400 --> 01:16:42,120
Speaker 1: I think people that listen to the podcast would like

1243
01:16:42,240 --> 01:16:46,880
Speaker 1: to hear like, hey, look, conservation is complicated. Um, let's

1244
01:16:46,920 --> 01:16:49,040
Speaker 1: talk about what what are the examples of of this

1245
01:16:49,240 --> 01:16:51,559
Speaker 1: where this hunt works from a conservation element and then

1246
01:16:51,600 --> 01:16:53,760
Speaker 1: you can boil down kind of like the personal motivation

1247
01:16:54,120 --> 01:16:58,040
Speaker 1: because that's so varied and so impossible to nail down. Yeah, well,

1248
01:16:58,160 --> 01:17:02,759
Speaker 1: the gold standard is fair chase. You put out some effort,

1249
01:17:02,880 --> 01:17:08,400
Speaker 1: you take some risk yourself what you're hunting. Uh. Now,

1250
01:17:09,000 --> 01:17:11,200
Speaker 1: there isn't too much risk to a person at your

1251
01:17:11,240 --> 01:17:17,320
Speaker 1: hunting antelope on the prairies prong horn, but there's still

1252
01:17:18,240 --> 01:17:20,280
Speaker 1: you have to know a lot about the animal to

1253
01:17:20,360 --> 01:17:23,760
Speaker 1: get up on a prong horn, and even if you

1254
01:17:23,840 --> 01:17:25,880
Speaker 1: shoot it in the distance, it takes a whole lot

1255
01:17:25,960 --> 01:17:30,080
Speaker 1: of stocking to get within range. And you know, the

1256
01:17:30,320 --> 01:17:34,000
Speaker 1: nonfair chase. So they are the jerks that go out

1257
01:17:34,080 --> 01:17:39,040
Speaker 1: and see a herd of elk and start, uh you know,

1258
01:17:39,560 --> 01:17:43,240
Speaker 1: flock hunting or herd hunting. They just fire lead into

1259
01:17:43,280 --> 01:17:45,400
Speaker 1: the middle of a bunch of alc and hope that

1260
01:17:45,560 --> 01:17:48,920
Speaker 1: something clicks. To me, that's uh, you know, that's a

1261
01:17:49,000 --> 01:17:51,840
Speaker 1: matter of ethics and morality. Yeah, I mean, that's not

1262
01:17:52,000 --> 01:17:55,960
Speaker 1: something we except to promote here and and again I

1263
01:17:56,000 --> 01:17:58,800
Speaker 1: always people say those things to me. I've had other

1264
01:17:58,960 --> 01:18:02,280
Speaker 1: out a vegan, my friend of vegan philosopher by the

1265
01:18:02,360 --> 01:18:04,400
Speaker 1: name of Robert C. Jones, and he said, well, you're

1266
01:18:04,600 --> 01:18:07,240
Speaker 1: pretty thoughtful hunter. You feel like that's a rarity or

1267
01:18:07,280 --> 01:18:09,720
Speaker 1: the exception. I said, there's no way for for me

1268
01:18:09,840 --> 01:18:12,839
Speaker 1: to know. But I assume if I was a hardcore

1269
01:18:12,960 --> 01:18:15,360
Speaker 1: camper and somebody said, well, campers litter, I'd be like, yeah,

1270
01:18:15,439 --> 01:18:18,040
Speaker 1: those are not my campers. Those are you know, if

1271
01:18:18,040 --> 01:18:22,320
Speaker 1: there's somebody who's doing something illegal or extremely unethical, um,

1272
01:18:22,520 --> 01:18:26,000
Speaker 1: you know, no hunter or no hunting organization would would

1273
01:18:26,040 --> 01:18:28,640
Speaker 1: promote or accept that. So it's a that's a tough thing.

1274
01:18:28,640 --> 01:18:30,160
Speaker 1: I think that's a tough thing for listeners of this

1275
01:18:30,200 --> 01:18:33,160
Speaker 1: show to here, because we all know that that's that's

1276
01:18:33,160 --> 01:18:37,360
Speaker 1: just not a great thing reaction to received. Was that

1277
01:18:37,520 --> 01:18:39,880
Speaker 1: on your blog or was that just people calling you

1278
01:18:40,120 --> 01:18:42,280
Speaker 1: and you didn't record it. I had luck at the

1279
01:18:42,439 --> 01:18:46,599
Speaker 1: number of your blog sites and went on meat Eater,

1280
01:18:47,200 --> 01:18:51,760
Speaker 1: and I couldn't find any commentary about Oh, well, the

1281
01:18:51,880 --> 01:18:56,160
Speaker 1: post interview. I want to go over that a little bit.

1282
01:18:56,160 --> 01:18:59,320
Speaker 1: But the post on the instagram has hundred three or

1283
01:18:59,360 --> 01:19:02,439
Speaker 1: four hundred comments. Um, not that we need to revisit

1284
01:19:02,520 --> 01:19:04,559
Speaker 1: that right now. The post had a bunch of comments,

1285
01:19:04,600 --> 01:19:07,760
Speaker 1: and we get emails all the time, um about you know,

1286
01:19:07,840 --> 01:19:10,240
Speaker 1: emails of the place where I like to get most

1287
01:19:10,280 --> 01:19:12,839
Speaker 1: of my commentary because it seems to be the most rational,

1288
01:19:13,280 --> 01:19:16,200
Speaker 1: the most less free thumbing it as it would be

1289
01:19:16,280 --> 01:19:19,920
Speaker 1: a commentary online. But it was one of like that conversation.

1290
01:19:20,000 --> 01:19:22,960
Speaker 1: I think it was because of the contentious nature of it,

1291
01:19:23,120 --> 01:19:25,439
Speaker 1: because you know, there was upset moments in it. I

1292
01:19:25,479 --> 01:19:28,679
Speaker 1: think that's what drew people in. But they, like I said,

1293
01:19:28,680 --> 01:19:31,200
Speaker 1: the reason number one you said in this show. I

1294
01:19:31,240 --> 01:19:32,479
Speaker 1: don't know if you remember this. You said that you

1295
01:19:32,520 --> 01:19:34,720
Speaker 1: didn't get a hat. Remember that you didn't get it.

1296
01:19:35,000 --> 01:19:37,080
Speaker 1: You didn't get a hat for me. So I'm gonna

1297
01:19:37,120 --> 01:19:39,240
Speaker 1: send you. Me and Phil are gonna Me and Phil

1298
01:19:39,240 --> 01:19:40,600
Speaker 1: are going to sign a hat and send you a

1299
01:19:40,680 --> 01:19:44,479
Speaker 1: hat because we're burying the damn hatchet Burry Gilbert and

1300
01:19:44,680 --> 01:19:48,880
Speaker 1: send me the recipe for the salty Gilbert. Yes, and

1301
01:19:48,920 --> 01:19:52,479
Speaker 1: we're gonna send you that. But I should have called

1302
01:19:52,560 --> 01:19:54,840
Speaker 1: my jets earlier on. I think what happened with me

1303
01:19:55,080 --> 01:19:58,000
Speaker 1: is I I liked your set up there. I talked

1304
01:19:58,040 --> 01:20:00,320
Speaker 1: to the gals going in the front door, and I thought,

1305
01:20:00,360 --> 01:20:03,519
Speaker 1: doesn't be really neat to talk about my book on

1306
01:20:03,640 --> 01:20:07,000
Speaker 1: some of the issues in my book, and somehow we

1307
01:20:07,160 --> 01:20:11,200
Speaker 1: got off the rail in fact, hit the third rail,

1308
01:20:11,280 --> 01:20:15,120
Speaker 1: it seems, and uh, I just got pissed, and I

1309
01:20:15,200 --> 01:20:20,160
Speaker 1: apologize for that. But so there the hatchet is buried,

1310
01:20:20,200 --> 01:20:23,360
Speaker 1: No need to apologize it. I think it in the end,

1311
01:20:23,479 --> 01:20:25,840
Speaker 1: like in the end for me as I thought about that,

1312
01:20:26,000 --> 01:20:27,760
Speaker 1: and I said, we we talked about you a lot

1313
01:20:27,800 --> 01:20:30,920
Speaker 1: on this show. We we talked about you know, those moments,

1314
01:20:31,560 --> 01:20:34,120
Speaker 1: and it's it's essential to learn from them, and it's

1315
01:20:34,200 --> 01:20:37,560
Speaker 1: essential to say, Okay, what happened there? Was it? Was it?

1316
01:20:37,640 --> 01:20:40,759
Speaker 1: The conversation? Was it kind of just did it happen randomly?

1317
01:20:41,280 --> 01:20:44,440
Speaker 1: How can we make sure that when we have a disagreement,

1318
01:20:44,520 --> 01:20:46,599
Speaker 1: a conversation where we we know we're going to disagree,

1319
01:20:46,680 --> 01:20:49,040
Speaker 1: that we can work through and maybe we don't even

1320
01:20:49,080 --> 01:20:52,040
Speaker 1: find common ground, but maybe we still can can work

1321
01:20:52,160 --> 01:20:54,240
Speaker 1: through those you know, the feelings and emotions and try

1322
01:20:54,320 --> 01:20:57,599
Speaker 1: to get people to a point where some objective reasoning

1323
01:20:57,680 --> 01:21:00,599
Speaker 1: happened and people can walk away now. And there there

1324
01:21:00,680 --> 01:21:03,080
Speaker 1: can be a disagreement where people say we're just never

1325
01:21:03,160 --> 01:21:05,519
Speaker 1: going to agree on this, and we can move on

1326
01:21:05,720 --> 01:21:08,960
Speaker 1: from it and still learn something or other. Um, Well,

1327
01:21:09,160 --> 01:21:12,360
Speaker 1: and and the other point that I try to make

1328
01:21:12,479 --> 01:21:15,680
Speaker 1: with people is that your conversation has to be as

1329
01:21:15,800 --> 01:21:18,680
Speaker 1: complex as the issue is. A lot of people want

1330
01:21:18,720 --> 01:21:22,479
Speaker 1: to simplify it. And uh, you know, speaking of all guys,

1331
01:21:22,720 --> 01:21:28,640
Speaker 1: he has a a straightforward, uh wildlife management model that

1332
01:21:29,080 --> 01:21:35,519
Speaker 1: he likes to work everything. And to me, that's a

1333
01:21:35,640 --> 01:21:39,040
Speaker 1: little too simple. Now. It works for vow because he's

1334
01:21:39,200 --> 01:21:43,719
Speaker 1: always been a a goat and sheep and belk under.

1335
01:21:43,840 --> 01:21:46,200
Speaker 1: He knows a lot about them. He's written books on

1336
01:21:46,360 --> 01:21:51,880
Speaker 1: pronghorn and help and new Lease. But I just think

1337
01:21:53,080 --> 01:21:56,080
Speaker 1: I have a problem with that model being applied to

1338
01:21:56,160 --> 01:22:00,799
Speaker 1: all the carn bores. We if this isn't too hartial statement,

1339
01:22:00,920 --> 01:22:05,200
Speaker 1: we have the war going on against carnivores and some

1340
01:22:05,439 --> 01:22:08,920
Speaker 1: people anyway you kill them, Like look at Alaska. Now

1341
01:22:10,080 --> 01:22:13,720
Speaker 1: there they've just decided that they want to get rid

1342
01:22:13,760 --> 01:22:17,880
Speaker 1: of more carnivores with the wrong notion that they're going

1343
01:22:17,920 --> 01:22:21,560
Speaker 1: to get more caribou and moose hunting out of that.

1344
01:22:22,479 --> 01:22:28,400
Speaker 1: And that has both scientific basis whatsoever. I think um

1345
01:22:29,520 --> 01:22:31,800
Speaker 1: that kind of thinking by the board of game. And

1346
01:22:32,200 --> 01:22:36,080
Speaker 1: these aren't trolls, you know, these are people that clearly

1347
01:22:36,160 --> 01:22:40,600
Speaker 1: they're political, but they're responding, I think to the majority

1348
01:22:40,680 --> 01:22:44,639
Speaker 1: of hunters who believe that if you have every day

1349
01:22:44,640 --> 01:22:48,360
Speaker 1: you killed, you saved all of game that they're going

1350
01:22:48,439 --> 01:22:52,280
Speaker 1: to eat. And we tried that with salmon at one time.

1351
01:22:53,200 --> 01:22:57,600
Speaker 1: The first Clonedia government in the fifties have people with

1352
01:22:57,800 --> 01:23:02,839
Speaker 1: high powered guns on government boats out shooting sea lions

1353
01:23:03,080 --> 01:23:06,839
Speaker 1: because they believed the sea lions were reducing the salmon.

1354
01:23:07,080 --> 01:23:10,400
Speaker 1: And of course it was over fishing and too many

1355
01:23:10,520 --> 01:23:13,800
Speaker 1: canaries and all that, and they decimated the salmon for

1356
01:23:13,920 --> 01:23:16,720
Speaker 1: a long time, but they decided to take it out

1357
01:23:16,800 --> 01:23:20,000
Speaker 1: on the carnivore. Yeah, I think I think that's like

1358
01:23:20,200 --> 01:23:25,519
Speaker 1: that's a key sea lines. I can remember the paper

1359
01:23:25,640 --> 01:23:29,439
Speaker 1: that I read decades ago, and they didn't have salmon

1360
01:23:29,520 --> 01:23:31,599
Speaker 1: and there gouts at all. They or how that are

1361
01:23:32,080 --> 01:23:35,160
Speaker 1: a whole bunch of fish that had no commercial value.

1362
01:23:35,360 --> 01:23:43,040
Speaker 1: So that was almost hate the carnival or the flavor. Yeah,

1363
01:23:43,080 --> 01:23:45,200
Speaker 1: we definitely we talked. I talked about that with val

1364
01:23:45,280 --> 01:23:48,200
Speaker 1: guys and some other things. And when just this thing

1365
01:23:48,360 --> 01:23:50,800
Speaker 1: came up, and I like what you said about like

1366
01:23:50,920 --> 01:23:53,200
Speaker 1: the conversation has to be as complex as the topic,

1367
01:23:53,280 --> 01:23:55,439
Speaker 1: and that that just goes to show I mean something

1368
01:23:55,479 --> 01:23:57,799
Speaker 1: that I've learned through talking to people on all sides

1369
01:23:57,840 --> 01:24:01,840
Speaker 1: of this issue is and you articulated, well, there there's

1370
01:24:01,960 --> 01:24:04,280
Speaker 1: some people that there's a protectionist idea, and then there's

1371
01:24:04,320 --> 01:24:07,880
Speaker 1: this idea that, um, every for every wolf you kill,

1372
01:24:07,920 --> 01:24:10,280
Speaker 1: every bear you kill, you're saving x number of unglits

1373
01:24:10,320 --> 01:24:12,040
Speaker 1: or x number of deer and elk. And it's just

1374
01:24:12,160 --> 01:24:15,280
Speaker 1: not that simple on either side. Um. You know, there's

1375
01:24:15,400 --> 01:24:20,240
Speaker 1: there's cohabitation, there's population dynamics, there's so many things, and

1376
01:24:20,400 --> 01:24:23,560
Speaker 1: so you know, luckily we can have these these conversations

1377
01:24:23,600 --> 01:24:25,840
Speaker 1: that people can hear you know what essentially I think

1378
01:24:25,960 --> 01:24:27,920
Speaker 1: is your view on one side maybe vows on another,

1379
01:24:28,040 --> 01:24:30,240
Speaker 1: although both of your views I think have nuance to them.

1380
01:24:30,280 --> 01:24:33,760
Speaker 1: So that's what I wanted to make sure that people

1381
01:24:33,800 --> 01:24:36,880
Speaker 1: could hear from you again and we can laugh. Have

1382
01:24:37,000 --> 01:24:40,280
Speaker 1: a salty Gilbert. Salty Yilbert. By the way, Phil, you

1383
01:24:40,320 --> 01:24:44,120
Speaker 1: can detest Phil can a test is delicious. I was skeptical,

1384
01:24:44,200 --> 01:24:46,120
Speaker 1: and I was I was proven wrong. It is a

1385
01:24:46,240 --> 01:24:50,559
Speaker 1: very tell berry. What what it's what's all about? Well,

1386
01:24:50,960 --> 01:24:53,080
Speaker 1: it's it's it's got a it's got a packet of

1387
01:24:53,600 --> 01:24:57,880
Speaker 1: of element hydration electrolyte drink mix to keep it to

1388
01:24:58,160 --> 01:25:01,320
Speaker 1: keep you hydrated. Um, it's got some some hard seltzer

1389
01:25:01,479 --> 01:25:05,800
Speaker 1: water uh and and and vodka and it's uh, it's

1390
01:25:05,880 --> 01:25:10,880
Speaker 1: it's surprisingly balanced and smooth it is. But it is

1391
01:25:10,960 --> 01:25:18,040
Speaker 1: smooth and salty, salty like you were last year. Delight.

1392
01:25:18,439 --> 01:25:21,559
Speaker 1: So yes, we we hopefully we'll send you. We're gonna

1393
01:25:21,560 --> 01:25:24,839
Speaker 1: send you some packets of Element, which title sponsors this program,

1394
01:25:25,000 --> 01:25:28,320
Speaker 1: and uh, some white and stuff to celebrate and a hat.

1395
01:25:28,439 --> 01:25:30,840
Speaker 1: So we're gonna all you gotta do, Barry, We're gonna

1396
01:25:30,840 --> 01:25:32,200
Speaker 1: send all that stuff to you. All you have to

1397
01:25:32,280 --> 01:25:34,280
Speaker 1: do is send me a picture of you wearing the

1398
01:25:34,320 --> 01:25:36,880
Speaker 1: hat and drinking your salty Yielbert if you don't mind, Okay,

1399
01:25:37,200 --> 01:25:43,240
Speaker 1: I'll do that for sure, so we can consider. I

1400
01:25:43,280 --> 01:25:45,200
Speaker 1: don't have a copy here. No, you brought one, but

1401
01:25:45,240 --> 01:25:46,600
Speaker 1: I think you took it with you. You're mad at me.

1402
01:25:49,560 --> 01:25:54,839
Speaker 1: That was my day of niveness. I guess I'll that's beautiful.

1403
01:25:54,840 --> 01:25:56,960
Speaker 1: I will will trade you. I will. I'll get your

1404
01:25:57,080 --> 01:25:59,799
Speaker 1: address and we will mail you a THHD care package.

1405
01:26:00,520 --> 01:26:05,240
Speaker 1: And you mailed me some books. Okay. Getting back to

1406
01:26:05,360 --> 01:26:08,760
Speaker 1: Grizzly Bears. Uh. In the last couple of days, I

1407
01:26:09,400 --> 01:26:13,120
Speaker 1: go on my thinking captain. I thought, you know, what

1408
01:26:13,240 --> 01:26:14,760
Speaker 1: do you want to talk about? Do you want to

1409
01:26:14,840 --> 01:26:18,720
Speaker 1: talk about their behavior with with you? Then? And felt, are,

1410
01:26:19,439 --> 01:26:24,000
Speaker 1: let's ignore the trolls and their values. But what I

1411
01:26:24,120 --> 01:26:30,200
Speaker 1: came to think about was our relationship with theirs and

1412
01:26:30,640 --> 01:26:36,240
Speaker 1: relationship of theirs to their foods. Like the behavior theirs

1413
01:26:36,280 --> 01:26:41,559
Speaker 1: on salmon streams is totally related to the surplus of food.

1414
01:26:41,960 --> 01:26:44,760
Speaker 1: And the bears they're like black bears. I mean, they're

1415
01:26:44,840 --> 01:26:49,960
Speaker 1: real pussycats. Uh. I almost stepped on a seven pounder

1416
01:26:50,040 --> 01:26:53,479
Speaker 1: one day. I was moving too fast through books camp

1417
01:26:53,960 --> 01:26:55,880
Speaker 1: and the bear jumps out and he looks at me

1418
01:26:55,920 --> 01:26:58,519
Speaker 1: and said, like as to say, I thought we had

1419
01:26:58,560 --> 01:27:01,080
Speaker 1: an agreement. You'd stay in your damn trails and you

1420
01:27:01,280 --> 01:27:03,960
Speaker 1: leave the woods to us. And the thing could have

1421
01:27:04,720 --> 01:27:07,120
Speaker 1: a luck charge for me. It could have swatted at me.

1422
01:27:07,439 --> 01:27:10,360
Speaker 1: It just jumped away, and it was a dominant nail.

1423
01:27:10,800 --> 01:27:13,759
Speaker 1: And I thought, you know, there's gotta be a story there.

1424
01:27:14,400 --> 01:27:18,759
Speaker 1: H when grizzly bears are super hungry or their jaws

1425
01:27:18,800 --> 01:27:21,880
Speaker 1: are damaged in the real old like the one that

1426
01:27:23,439 --> 01:27:29,519
Speaker 1: killed Treadwell. Tim Treadwell, Um, that's a real exception in

1427
01:27:29,640 --> 01:27:32,920
Speaker 1: that country because all of those bears and Tim spent

1428
01:27:33,040 --> 01:27:39,200
Speaker 1: thirteen years almost close enough the pet those coastal brown there.

1429
01:27:39,720 --> 01:27:45,920
Speaker 1: So getting back the relationship, our relationship to salmon bears

1430
01:27:46,560 --> 01:27:51,160
Speaker 1: um is a function of the bears, uh, surplus of

1431
01:27:51,240 --> 01:27:54,840
Speaker 1: food that's available, and they don't even challenge each other.

1432
01:27:55,360 --> 01:27:57,799
Speaker 1: That's like you and I with a room full of steaks.

1433
01:27:57,920 --> 01:28:00,599
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna fight you for a steak when all

1434
01:28:00,640 --> 01:28:02,639
Speaker 1: I have to do is gobble the rest of them

1435
01:28:02,720 --> 01:28:06,280
Speaker 1: around the room. So that there's in the same way

1436
01:28:06,640 --> 01:28:11,599
Speaker 1: and um our relationship to them. In Yellowstone, of course,

1437
01:28:11,640 --> 01:28:15,880
Speaker 1: it's very different. They're North food stressed. There likely to

1438
01:28:16,000 --> 01:28:19,680
Speaker 1: be food conditioned if we habituate them too much. But

1439
01:28:20,400 --> 01:28:25,360
Speaker 1: food conditioning is never a problem on salmon streams. I've

1440
01:28:25,400 --> 01:28:30,800
Speaker 1: had watch situations where a person illegally had food and

1441
01:28:30,880 --> 01:28:34,160
Speaker 1: attack and they're got to it on the stream. It

1442
01:28:34,280 --> 01:28:37,880
Speaker 1: didn't bother with the food at all. Uh, they're not

1443
01:28:38,120 --> 01:28:42,120
Speaker 1: interested in our food if they've got a natural food.

1444
01:28:42,439 --> 01:28:45,559
Speaker 1: But that isn't true of you know, send me starved

1445
01:28:45,640 --> 01:28:51,759
Speaker 1: there and Glacier Park or Yellowstone or Teton or anything

1446
01:28:51,880 --> 01:28:56,880
Speaker 1: like that there. If they're super hungry, you better watch

1447
01:28:56,960 --> 01:28:59,320
Speaker 1: out because they're going to come as close as they

1448
01:28:59,439 --> 01:29:04,120
Speaker 1: can to dellyball. You know, it's it's either you steal

1449
01:29:04,240 --> 01:29:07,840
Speaker 1: food or you die. It's a cohabitation thing. To write

1450
01:29:07,880 --> 01:29:10,720
Speaker 1: garbage cans and rural areas where bears don't have a

1451
01:29:10,760 --> 01:29:13,519
Speaker 1: lot of food. You know, there's lots of examples even

1452
01:29:13,560 --> 01:29:16,160
Speaker 1: here in Montana of those type of things. Um. Well,

1453
01:29:16,240 --> 01:29:18,320
Speaker 1: and it's the same with raccoons. If you want a

1454
01:29:18,439 --> 01:29:23,200
Speaker 1: problem in some cities, just leave some good old fashioned

1455
01:29:23,280 --> 01:29:27,400
Speaker 1: garbage around. Perfect. He let me ask you, let a

1456
01:29:27,600 --> 01:29:30,200
Speaker 1: say this question is popped in my mind. Um, and

1457
01:29:30,600 --> 01:29:33,320
Speaker 1: we gotta run here. Some make us our last last

1458
01:29:33,400 --> 01:29:36,840
Speaker 1: question because I try to narrow narrow down where you know,

1459
01:29:36,880 --> 01:29:39,160
Speaker 1: where in the spectrum we are in terms of of

1460
01:29:39,320 --> 01:29:42,679
Speaker 1: grizzly bears and and if how the win they're killed.

1461
01:29:43,200 --> 01:29:47,360
Speaker 1: If if we ate grizzly bears, would that change I'm

1462
01:29:47,400 --> 01:29:49,800
Speaker 1: not saying this is a fully hypothetical, but if we

1463
01:29:50,000 --> 01:29:52,639
Speaker 1: ate grizzly bears after we hunted them, would that change

1464
01:29:52,680 --> 01:29:58,320
Speaker 1: your feelings at all? Well? Uh, you might convince me

1465
01:29:58,680 --> 01:30:04,519
Speaker 1: if the person needed the meat to feed his family

1466
01:30:04,680 --> 01:30:08,200
Speaker 1: or whatever. It gets back to basic motivations. Why do

1467
01:30:08,320 --> 01:30:12,600
Speaker 1: you why do you want to shoot an animal like

1468
01:30:12,760 --> 01:30:16,800
Speaker 1: that and if somebody says to me, well, there's nothing

1469
01:30:16,840 --> 01:30:20,040
Speaker 1: else in my area, and if I'm going to put

1470
01:30:20,120 --> 01:30:23,519
Speaker 1: something in the freezer from my family, I'll take it bear.

1471
01:30:23,680 --> 01:30:27,560
Speaker 1: And I'm sure a lot of Native Americans, Native Canadians

1472
01:30:28,040 --> 01:30:31,479
Speaker 1: have done this in the past, but by and large, Mum,

1473
01:30:33,520 --> 01:30:38,120
Speaker 1: I would say it's unlikely that that's that's going to occur. Um,

1474
01:30:38,960 --> 01:30:42,519
Speaker 1: I guess I'm saying I don't. I don't agree with

1475
01:30:42,680 --> 01:30:48,800
Speaker 1: that because I don't think it's very likely. I'm not

1476
01:30:48,960 --> 01:30:53,560
Speaker 1: objecting because people don't eat that they're That's what I

1477
01:30:53,680 --> 01:30:56,200
Speaker 1: was asking. I was asking the backwards way. But yeah,

1478
01:30:56,680 --> 01:30:59,519
Speaker 1: I think that's what If we can understand again understand

1479
01:30:59,520 --> 01:31:01,439
Speaker 1: each other's a objections to the activity, then we can

1480
01:31:01,479 --> 01:31:03,439
Speaker 1: start to suss out ways where maybe we can find

1481
01:31:03,520 --> 01:31:06,360
Speaker 1: common ground. And I imagine you would agree that conservation

1482
01:31:06,920 --> 01:31:09,920
Speaker 1: and wildlife management is finding this common ground because there

1483
01:31:09,960 --> 01:31:12,439
Speaker 1: are these divergent views that aren't going to go away,

1484
01:31:13,120 --> 01:31:15,360
Speaker 1: and finding some way to come in the middle is

1485
01:31:16,000 --> 01:31:19,000
Speaker 1: you know, is one of the liar. You know, I

1486
01:31:19,360 --> 01:31:22,680
Speaker 1: look up there and know theirs and I think of

1487
01:31:22,760 --> 01:31:26,240
Speaker 1: them as a big dog. They're closely related to dogs,

1488
01:31:26,840 --> 01:31:30,599
Speaker 1: and we don't Um, yet shoot dogs to eat them.

1489
01:31:30,680 --> 01:31:34,520
Speaker 1: Now they do in Asian countries. Dog is a delicacy,

1490
01:31:35,080 --> 01:31:38,200
Speaker 1: and God knows Lewis and Clark ate a few dogs

1491
01:31:38,640 --> 01:31:43,680
Speaker 1: on their way to and horses. Uh but uh, I

1492
01:31:43,840 --> 01:31:47,200
Speaker 1: just I know so much about theirs and their culture

1493
01:31:47,920 --> 01:31:52,120
Speaker 1: that I don't think of them as a target. I

1494
01:31:52,280 --> 01:31:55,680
Speaker 1: just think there's so much that we haven't learned. Now.

1495
01:31:56,160 --> 01:31:58,240
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to say that, you know, I'm the

1496
01:31:58,320 --> 01:32:03,880
Speaker 1: advanced uh thought process on this, but there we come

1497
01:32:03,920 --> 01:32:09,240
Speaker 1: to realize that that killer whales are variable and have

1498
01:32:09,400 --> 01:32:13,240
Speaker 1: cultures around the world, that they've tracked their vocalizations, and

1499
01:32:13,320 --> 01:32:16,120
Speaker 1: there are numbers a species. Of course, chimpanzee's with Jane

1500
01:32:16,160 --> 01:32:19,000
Speaker 1: Goodall is a good example too. We used to shoot

1501
01:32:20,200 --> 01:32:24,800
Speaker 1: mountain grillas as a sport, and so once we uh,

1502
01:32:25,040 --> 01:32:28,439
Speaker 1: you know, George Shaller studied mountain girls and found out

1503
01:32:28,439 --> 01:32:31,559
Speaker 1: a lot about them, and all of a sudden, nobody

1504
01:32:31,640 --> 01:32:37,800
Speaker 1: wants to kill him anymore, except you know, starving vocals. Well, Barry,

1505
01:32:37,800 --> 01:32:40,320
Speaker 1: we're gonna leave. We're gonna leave it right there. We

1506
01:32:40,360 --> 01:32:42,439
Speaker 1: can talk about this for hours and hours, as I

1507
01:32:42,520 --> 01:32:45,600
Speaker 1: know we could, but I'm over Moreover, I'm glad that

1508
01:32:45,760 --> 01:32:48,160
Speaker 1: we have buried the hatchet. You're gonna get a hat

1509
01:32:48,800 --> 01:32:53,360
Speaker 1: a salty Gilbert recipe mix from us, and we hope,

1510
01:32:53,760 --> 01:32:56,760
Speaker 1: we hope you guys stay well up there. I'm very

1511
01:32:56,840 --> 01:32:59,680
Speaker 1: impressed that you've contacted me again and I'm glad we

1512
01:32:59,800 --> 01:33:01,719
Speaker 1: did this. So let's do it again in a couple

1513
01:33:01,720 --> 01:33:04,320
Speaker 1: of months. Hell yeah, let's do it again. And um, hey,

1514
01:33:04,400 --> 01:33:06,679
Speaker 1: you stay well and best your family and your wife

1515
01:33:06,760 --> 01:33:08,600
Speaker 1: up there, and and we'll talk real soon. Look for

1516
01:33:08,640 --> 01:33:16,000
Speaker 1: that package in the mail. Alright, thank you, alright, Phil,

1517
01:33:16,040 --> 01:33:18,800
Speaker 1: that was Barry Gilbert. That was cool man. Yeah it

1518
01:33:18,960 --> 01:33:23,720
Speaker 1: was you feel better now, yes, yeah, I think it

1519
01:33:23,840 --> 01:33:32,960
Speaker 1: was worth it, Catharsis. Yeah, okay, So next up as

1520
01:33:33,040 --> 01:33:36,240
Speaker 1: we wind down here on the best of and we

1521
01:33:36,320 --> 01:33:39,960
Speaker 1: look forward to next year. Um, we certainly thank Barry Gilbert.

1522
01:33:40,000 --> 01:33:42,840
Speaker 1: He did send us a book, as Phil said, signed

1523
01:33:42,880 --> 01:33:45,240
Speaker 1: a book for Phil and I I think that was

1524
01:33:45,400 --> 01:33:49,639
Speaker 1: literally the hatchet getting buried under twenty feet of dirt.

1525
01:33:50,080 --> 01:33:51,760
Speaker 1: And now Barry is a friend of ours and we

1526
01:33:51,840 --> 01:33:54,360
Speaker 1: love him. He loves us. Just goes to show you

1527
01:33:54,479 --> 01:33:57,560
Speaker 1: you can come together around th HC. Let us be

1528
01:33:57,680 --> 01:33:59,880
Speaker 1: the glue that holds us all together in the new year.

1529
01:34:01,240 --> 01:34:04,000
Speaker 1: Here's another time where I was. I was really proud

1530
01:34:04,080 --> 01:34:06,280
Speaker 1: of the show and proud of what we put together,

1531
01:34:06,400 --> 01:34:10,240
Speaker 1: and happy to have told a story. We told a

1532
01:34:10,280 --> 01:34:15,639
Speaker 1: story of Mark Carter, professional snowboarder, complete badass. I kind

1533
01:34:15,640 --> 01:34:17,320
Speaker 1: of have a man crush on him. I'm not gonna lie.

1534
01:34:17,400 --> 01:34:21,479
Speaker 1: He's a wonderful human. I spent time with him and

1535
01:34:21,560 --> 01:34:24,240
Speaker 1: Joe Ferronado bear hunting in Montana, and then we sat

1536
01:34:24,320 --> 01:34:27,360
Speaker 1: down in the studio to tell his story and to

1537
01:34:27,439 --> 01:34:29,560
Speaker 1: interview him like we would anyone else. But what we

1538
01:34:29,640 --> 01:34:33,880
Speaker 1: got at the end was was expected. But the way

1539
01:34:33,920 --> 01:34:35,439
Speaker 1: that we got it, I think in the detail we

1540
01:34:35,479 --> 01:34:38,240
Speaker 1: got was unexpected on my end. So Mark was involved

1541
01:34:38,280 --> 01:34:42,160
Speaker 1: in a felony poaching incident in his hometown, intensely Wyoming.

1542
01:34:42,640 --> 01:34:45,160
Speaker 1: He does have felonies on his record. He is a poacher.

1543
01:34:45,760 --> 01:34:50,000
Speaker 1: Ah he cannot own firearms or be in possession of

1544
01:34:50,080 --> 01:34:52,960
Speaker 1: firearms the rest of his life unless the conviction is

1545
01:34:53,000 --> 01:34:57,679
Speaker 1: overturned and he's been punished as a poacher. And normally

1546
01:34:57,800 --> 01:35:00,880
Speaker 1: we wouldn't have poachers on this program. But Mark is

1547
01:35:00,920 --> 01:35:05,000
Speaker 1: an exceptional story, an exceptional human, and it's it's the

1548
01:35:05,120 --> 01:35:08,160
Speaker 1: story of learning, it's a story of loss, it's a

1549
01:35:08,240 --> 01:35:12,960
Speaker 1: story of depression. It's a story of redemption. It's a

1550
01:35:13,000 --> 01:35:15,720
Speaker 1: story of somebody that you need to listen to. Um,

1551
01:35:15,800 --> 01:35:18,000
Speaker 1: whether you like what he did or not, he has

1552
01:35:18,080 --> 01:35:21,400
Speaker 1: something to impart to you. So listen a little bit

1553
01:35:21,600 --> 01:35:28,160
Speaker 1: to Mark Carter. We've swept through like all the badass

1554
01:35:28,200 --> 01:35:31,240
Speaker 1: ship but we got to talk about the one. Like

1555
01:35:31,320 --> 01:35:33,120
Speaker 1: it's not prominent that the one thing in your life

1556
01:35:33,200 --> 01:35:38,080
Speaker 1: that completely sucked, but it's a thing that I think, Ah,

1557
01:35:38,840 --> 01:35:40,479
Speaker 1: I'm glad we can talk about it because not a

1558
01:35:40,560 --> 01:35:42,479
Speaker 1: lot of people can talk about it. Yeah, I mean

1559
01:35:43,120 --> 01:35:45,200
Speaker 1: it was a defining moment, man, Like, it was a

1560
01:35:45,280 --> 01:35:48,960
Speaker 1: defining moment, you know, like, yeah, a lot of people

1561
01:35:49,760 --> 01:35:52,320
Speaker 1: I don't know. You know, I have I have three felonies,

1562
01:35:52,439 --> 01:35:54,559
Speaker 1: you know, hanging out with a felon. I'm a felon, man,

1563
01:35:54,680 --> 01:35:57,600
Speaker 1: I'm a felon. I got we got cross ways, you know,

1564
01:35:57,760 --> 01:36:00,679
Speaker 1: it was it was a it was a crazy, crazy

1565
01:36:00,760 --> 01:36:03,479
Speaker 1: time of my life. You know, got crossways with the

1566
01:36:03,520 --> 01:36:06,320
Speaker 1: federal government and they spanked us pretty hard. You know.

1567
01:36:06,439 --> 01:36:09,479
Speaker 1: It was a Yeah, I mean a little backstory was

1568
01:36:10,080 --> 01:36:13,320
Speaker 1: you know, growing up hunting my whole life, you know, Um,

1569
01:36:14,240 --> 01:36:17,160
Speaker 1: that was that was my passion, Like my whole family's passion,

1570
01:36:17,200 --> 01:36:19,800
Speaker 1: my grandpa, like everybody this was, you know, and really

1571
01:36:19,880 --> 01:36:23,760
Speaker 1: like growing up respecting the animals and understanding how the

1572
01:36:24,080 --> 01:36:28,280
Speaker 1: whole system works and being being a poor rancher, you know.

1573
01:36:28,880 --> 01:36:30,880
Speaker 1: And then so when I was about twenty years old,

1574
01:36:31,560 --> 01:36:33,280
Speaker 1: and we were great elk hunters, you know, I shot

1575
01:36:33,320 --> 01:36:34,920
Speaker 1: my my first elk when I was twelve years old

1576
01:36:34,920 --> 01:36:37,080
Speaker 1: and it was a proud moment and just hunted all

1577
01:36:37,120 --> 01:36:39,640
Speaker 1: the way through high school. Loved hunting, guns, everything that

1578
01:36:39,720 --> 01:36:41,840
Speaker 1: was my That was my passion, man, that was my life.

1579
01:36:42,360 --> 01:36:45,880
Speaker 1: And then I started pursuing the snow burning thing, still ranching,

1580
01:36:46,240 --> 01:36:49,479
Speaker 1: doing some other things. And my brother he graduated college,

1581
01:36:49,520 --> 01:36:51,599
Speaker 1: so he came back to the ranch and I mean

1582
01:36:51,640 --> 01:36:53,680
Speaker 1: the ranch, Like, dude, you don't make any money, like

1583
01:36:53,920 --> 01:36:56,800
Speaker 1: he was poor, and so we're an opportunities, like hey,

1584
01:36:56,840 --> 01:36:59,080
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna be an outfitter, Like we're good

1585
01:36:59,120 --> 01:37:01,519
Speaker 1: at hunting, like, let's do some outfitting on the ranch.

1586
01:37:01,600 --> 01:37:03,800
Speaker 1: And like the elk that we had amazing elk hunting,

1587
01:37:03,880 --> 01:37:07,639
Speaker 1: like let's do this. And so obviously I was like, wow,

1588
01:37:07,680 --> 01:37:09,080
Speaker 1: that sounds like a pretty good idea, Like I can

1589
01:37:09,120 --> 01:37:11,320
Speaker 1: make a little cash in the in the in the fall,

1590
01:37:12,200 --> 01:37:15,080
Speaker 1: and so we started out, you know, he was the

1591
01:37:15,120 --> 01:37:17,519
Speaker 1: outfitter and I got my guide license and and the

1592
01:37:17,560 --> 01:37:19,360
Speaker 1: first couple of years, you know, it's pretty tough, like

1593
01:37:20,160 --> 01:37:22,080
Speaker 1: because it's a draw, you know, and so we'd have

1594
01:37:22,120 --> 01:37:25,320
Speaker 1: a couple hunters and like it was like it just

1595
01:37:25,560 --> 01:37:28,760
Speaker 1: wasn't what you know, it needed to be more. Well

1596
01:37:28,840 --> 01:37:32,240
Speaker 1: then you know, obviously he met this these guys from

1597
01:37:32,280 --> 01:37:36,680
Speaker 1: Oregon and they were like, hey, guys, like, who can

1598
01:37:36,760 --> 01:37:38,880
Speaker 1: we buy your landowner tacks? Like we'll pay you and

1599
01:37:38,920 --> 01:37:40,800
Speaker 1: then we'll just come out and we'll do the hunt.

1600
01:37:40,880 --> 01:37:42,600
Speaker 1: And like they're gonna pay him. It wasn't crazy. I

1601
01:37:42,640 --> 01:37:44,000
Speaker 1: don't even know how much money it was, but I

1602
01:37:44,080 --> 01:37:47,000
Speaker 1: was getting like a cup of grand fall cash to

1603
01:37:47,080 --> 01:37:50,280
Speaker 1: go work for like you know, a month guiding. And

1604
01:37:50,360 --> 01:37:52,479
Speaker 1: then they'd have a few guys come out and and

1605
01:37:52,880 --> 01:37:55,559
Speaker 1: so the deal was if they didn't draw, they could

1606
01:37:55,640 --> 01:37:57,280
Speaker 1: use one of her landowner tacks because since we had

1607
01:37:57,320 --> 01:38:01,439
Speaker 1: all that land, and if nobody knows about landing, it's

1608
01:38:01,479 --> 01:38:04,920
Speaker 1: like in Wyoming that you cannot sell your land under tags,

1609
01:38:05,000 --> 01:38:07,760
Speaker 1: and we knew that, you know, but like growing up

1610
01:38:07,760 --> 01:38:09,360
Speaker 1: in a small community, like we grew up and it

1611
01:38:09,520 --> 01:38:12,360
Speaker 1: wasn't like I'm not gonna say it wasn't done. It

1612
01:38:12,520 --> 01:38:16,400
Speaker 1: wasn't done. You know, like people subsidize their ranch and

1613
01:38:16,560 --> 01:38:20,519
Speaker 1: certain things like during those times too, maybe southern land

1614
01:38:20,600 --> 01:38:23,320
Speaker 1: under tags. So but we had become an outfitter and

1615
01:38:23,439 --> 01:38:26,040
Speaker 1: we're like, well, let's try to do it almost by

1616
01:38:26,080 --> 01:38:29,280
Speaker 1: the book. So we'll we'll do these hunts and website

1617
01:38:29,320 --> 01:38:32,240
Speaker 1: and we'll do a few land under tags. So that's

1618
01:38:32,280 --> 01:38:34,680
Speaker 1: what we did. We were you know, I think you

1619
01:38:34,760 --> 01:38:36,960
Speaker 1: know over because it was your brother, it was my

1620
01:38:37,080 --> 01:38:39,720
Speaker 1: brother and myself. Well my dad wasn't even involved. My

1621
01:38:39,800 --> 01:38:42,120
Speaker 1: dad was like it was his ranch. But so my dad,

1622
01:38:42,160 --> 01:38:43,639
Speaker 1: you know, he'd come up to hunting camp the ground.

1623
01:38:43,640 --> 01:38:45,120
Speaker 1: He he didn't know what was going on. My brother

1624
01:38:45,240 --> 01:38:47,439
Speaker 1: was like the outfitter. He dealt with it. I was

1625
01:38:47,479 --> 01:38:49,640
Speaker 1: the guide. I did a lot of cooking, ARC did

1626
01:38:49,680 --> 01:38:52,000
Speaker 1: mostly guiding as well. So we had this kind of

1627
01:38:52,080 --> 01:38:54,840
Speaker 1: like this idea that like the land owner tags, it

1628
01:38:54,960 --> 01:38:57,120
Speaker 1: was like kind of a misdemeanor and like, I'm not

1629
01:38:57,160 --> 01:38:59,360
Speaker 1: gonna say I never broke the law. We weren't super

1630
01:38:59,400 --> 01:39:01,840
Speaker 1: concerned about just in the environment we were in. You

1631
01:39:01,880 --> 01:39:04,280
Speaker 1: had a comparison to it like having a couple of

1632
01:39:04,320 --> 01:39:05,760
Speaker 1: beers on the way home from work. Is that how

1633
01:39:05,840 --> 01:39:08,519
Speaker 1: you thought. Yeah, it wasn't like it wasn't like a

1634
01:39:08,600 --> 01:39:10,640
Speaker 1: huge deal. Like it wasn't something that was really on

1635
01:39:10,760 --> 01:39:12,559
Speaker 1: my mind. But I knew I was breaking the law.

1636
01:39:13,240 --> 01:39:16,479
Speaker 1: But like in that environment, like that's it. We were.

1637
01:39:16,560 --> 01:39:19,240
Speaker 1: We kind of I wouldn't say lived in a lawless land,

1638
01:39:19,360 --> 01:39:22,960
Speaker 1: but I mean my growing up, my deputy, the deputy

1639
01:39:23,000 --> 01:39:25,200
Speaker 1: sheriff was our football coach, So we were we got

1640
01:39:25,280 --> 01:39:27,240
Speaker 1: had a lot of reins. Man Like, it wasn't like

1641
01:39:27,320 --> 01:39:30,519
Speaker 1: this super regulated area where they're like, you're breaking the law,

1642
01:39:30,600 --> 01:39:32,200
Speaker 1: you're going to jail. And there was like, man, I

1643
01:39:32,720 --> 01:39:34,400
Speaker 1: you know, I did my share of drinking and getting

1644
01:39:34,400 --> 01:39:36,479
Speaker 1: in trouble as a kid, but there was a lot

1645
01:39:36,760 --> 01:39:40,200
Speaker 1: of just like understanding that these ranch kids are kind

1646
01:39:40,200 --> 01:39:42,040
Speaker 1: of wild and like, well just let him go, you know,

1647
01:39:42,160 --> 01:39:44,000
Speaker 1: like kind of good old boy, let him do his thing.

1648
01:39:44,520 --> 01:39:46,720
Speaker 1: Not that that's any excuse for what we did, but

1649
01:39:47,000 --> 01:39:48,519
Speaker 1: that's how we got in there. I was gonna make

1650
01:39:48,560 --> 01:39:50,599
Speaker 1: it clear that nobody's asking for excuses, just like what's

1651
01:39:50,600 --> 01:39:52,680
Speaker 1: your mindset? Well that was it wasn't a big deal.

1652
01:39:52,760 --> 01:39:54,960
Speaker 1: So this wasn't a big deal in my mind, but

1653
01:39:55,080 --> 01:39:58,439
Speaker 1: I did know it was against the law. How much

1654
01:39:58,479 --> 01:40:01,240
Speaker 1: against the law that was, I did not know. So

1655
01:40:01,520 --> 01:40:03,559
Speaker 1: we go through. You know, we were probably a guide.

1656
01:40:03,640 --> 01:40:05,760
Speaker 1: You know, we guided these dudes for like four or

1657
01:40:05,800 --> 01:40:08,439
Speaker 1: five years, and then they had some friends come out

1658
01:40:08,680 --> 01:40:10,400
Speaker 1: and you know, if they couldn't make the hunt. And

1659
01:40:11,080 --> 01:40:13,320
Speaker 1: granted some of these guys were drawing tags, it wasn't

1660
01:40:13,400 --> 01:40:16,120
Speaker 1: just all landowner stuff. I think over the course of

1661
01:40:16,400 --> 01:40:19,240
Speaker 1: eight years, maybe I don't know how the numbers, but

1662
01:40:19,320 --> 01:40:21,559
Speaker 1: it was it was less than eight tags got used,

1663
01:40:21,600 --> 01:40:26,400
Speaker 1: I think. Um. And so in like two thousand and ten,

1664
01:40:26,640 --> 01:40:28,599
Speaker 1: you know, I'm at the top of my my career.

1665
01:40:29,240 --> 01:40:32,760
Speaker 1: I'm traveling the world, I'm I'm riding. I'm like, I'm like,

1666
01:40:33,040 --> 01:40:34,720
Speaker 1: but there was this weird thing in my life. I

1667
01:40:34,840 --> 01:40:38,040
Speaker 1: was like, I wasn't I was happy, but I was

1668
01:40:38,120 --> 01:40:40,120
Speaker 1: like a little unfulfilled, and I was really burnt out

1669
01:40:40,160 --> 01:40:42,840
Speaker 1: on like guiding hunters. I was really burnt out on,

1670
01:40:43,000 --> 01:40:45,760
Speaker 1: Like that wasn't mine anymore, that wasn't for me. That

1671
01:40:45,840 --> 01:40:48,080
Speaker 1: was like hunting seasons coming and now it was it

1672
01:40:48,160 --> 01:40:50,719
Speaker 1: was like I gotta go guide these guys like okay, whatever,

1673
01:40:51,479 --> 01:40:54,960
Speaker 1: because they can be kind of you know difficult, you know,

1674
01:40:57,360 --> 01:40:59,120
Speaker 1: and then the client servicing. I'm not, like, I'm not

1675
01:40:59,200 --> 01:41:02,360
Speaker 1: a client service guy. So in about two I'll never forget.

1676
01:41:02,400 --> 01:41:07,240
Speaker 1: It was like in in June. June. I mean, yeah,

1677
01:41:07,280 --> 01:41:09,200
Speaker 1: I woke up one morning and there's like six or

1678
01:41:09,520 --> 01:41:13,080
Speaker 1: four federal agents in my my front door, and I

1679
01:41:13,160 --> 01:41:15,760
Speaker 1: was like, whoa, Like what do we do? And my

1680
01:41:15,840 --> 01:41:18,240
Speaker 1: brother he was out in any inkling and all that.

1681
01:41:21,479 --> 01:41:23,200
Speaker 1: I'm like, but I saw a game of fish. I

1682
01:41:23,280 --> 01:41:26,600
Speaker 1: was like, oh, like what do we do? Like we

1683
01:41:26,680 --> 01:41:29,200
Speaker 1: did something like something, something's really bad. I just had

1684
01:41:29,240 --> 01:41:33,320
Speaker 1: this Like its six and six am. So my brother said,

1685
01:41:33,320 --> 01:41:34,960
Speaker 1: he's out on the tractor at six am out like

1686
01:41:35,000 --> 01:41:38,599
Speaker 1: in the field and he sees like four suburbans, maybe

1687
01:41:38,680 --> 01:41:41,400
Speaker 1: four or five suburbans coming down the road bumper to bumper,

1688
01:41:41,760 --> 01:41:43,720
Speaker 1: black come in and he has like this ditch in

1689
01:41:43,800 --> 01:41:45,479
Speaker 1: his driveway and he said, these things hit this thing

1690
01:41:45,560 --> 01:41:48,120
Speaker 1: so hard, like they're bouncing like they jumped. And then

1691
01:41:48,160 --> 01:41:50,920
Speaker 1: all these dude jump out with you know, like federal agents,

1692
01:41:50,960 --> 01:41:53,519
Speaker 1: guns drawn, boom all over his property. And he's way

1693
01:41:53,560 --> 01:41:55,400
Speaker 1: out in the field and he's just starts cruising over

1694
01:41:55,479 --> 01:41:57,439
Speaker 1: in his tractor. He's like what is going on here.

1695
01:41:57,880 --> 01:41:59,680
Speaker 1: It was like a full on raid. Like it was

1696
01:42:00,120 --> 01:42:02,880
Speaker 1: they had sixty They had sixty agents across the nation,

1697
01:42:03,439 --> 01:42:05,920
Speaker 1: Like they rated every hunter we had ever hunted with.

1698
01:42:06,840 --> 01:42:09,080
Speaker 1: So it was a coordinated Yeah, I was a coordinated effort.

1699
01:42:09,120 --> 01:42:12,040
Speaker 1: They had their you know, they had it dialed. So

1700
01:42:12,120 --> 01:42:14,120
Speaker 1: they came in hot Um and they sat down with

1701
01:42:14,200 --> 01:42:15,519
Speaker 1: me and they're like, what do you know about these

1702
01:42:15,680 --> 01:42:17,479
Speaker 1: you know, start talking to me. I can't remember exactly

1703
01:42:17,520 --> 01:42:19,840
Speaker 1: what the conversation was, but the guys that came in

1704
01:42:19,920 --> 01:42:21,760
Speaker 1: were nice to me. Like these dudes were pretty nice,

1705
01:42:21,800 --> 01:42:23,240
Speaker 1: you know. And they started to ask me questions and

1706
01:42:23,840 --> 01:42:25,560
Speaker 1: and I was like, yeah, man, like we have this

1707
01:42:25,640 --> 01:42:28,840
Speaker 1: hunting outfitting. He's like showing me pictures. So basically had

1708
01:42:28,880 --> 01:42:31,599
Speaker 1: a website and these animals that were legal they were

1709
01:42:31,640 --> 01:42:36,880
Speaker 1: on our website. So that's how much we knew. Yeah,

1710
01:42:37,160 --> 01:42:39,040
Speaker 1: so we had the website, we had the animal the

1711
01:42:39,120 --> 01:42:40,840
Speaker 1: legal animals some of them were on there. And they're like,

1712
01:42:40,880 --> 01:42:42,760
Speaker 1: you know what about about those guys? And I was like, oh, yeah,

1713
01:42:43,720 --> 01:42:45,800
Speaker 1: you know, I was so freaked out. I didn't know

1714
01:42:45,840 --> 01:42:49,320
Speaker 1: what to say, you know, like I kind of admitted

1715
01:42:49,360 --> 01:42:51,519
Speaker 1: to some stuff, but I knew that I just kind

1716
01:42:51,560 --> 01:42:52,960
Speaker 1: of played dumb a little bit too. I was like,

1717
01:42:53,040 --> 01:42:56,280
Speaker 1: I don't know, because I didn't. I knew we were fucked,

1718
01:42:56,680 --> 01:43:00,840
Speaker 1: Like it's some capacity here. So they do their thing

1719
01:43:00,960 --> 01:43:02,360
Speaker 1: and they take my cell phone and they take some

1720
01:43:02,439 --> 01:43:04,200
Speaker 1: stuff from me. And then I was like, whoa, that

1721
01:43:04,320 --> 01:43:06,760
Speaker 1: was crazy. I call my brother, I'm like, dude, what

1722
01:43:07,000 --> 01:43:09,880
Speaker 1: is going on? He's like, and he tells me his story.

1723
01:43:10,000 --> 01:43:12,280
Speaker 1: These guys come in. They dude like he just had

1724
01:43:12,320 --> 01:43:14,280
Speaker 1: two babies in his house, and they walk all over

1725
01:43:14,360 --> 01:43:16,320
Speaker 1: and they take all the and they could do anything

1726
01:43:16,400 --> 01:43:18,960
Speaker 1: they want, right, And they walked over his carpet with

1727
01:43:19,160 --> 01:43:22,479
Speaker 1: muddy boots and took his laptop, took everything, cameras, everything,

1728
01:43:24,560 --> 01:43:26,360
Speaker 1: And I was like, man, I don't know what's going on.

1729
01:43:26,560 --> 01:43:28,719
Speaker 1: Like they told us what's going on. It was illegal hunting,

1730
01:43:28,760 --> 01:43:30,080
Speaker 1: and but I didn't know how much of what the

1731
01:43:30,120 --> 01:43:33,400
Speaker 1: capacity was. And then and then they mentioned felony, and

1732
01:43:33,479 --> 01:43:35,760
Speaker 1: I was like, what do you mean felony? Man? Like,

1733
01:43:36,960 --> 01:43:39,559
Speaker 1: what's like a felon? Like you're talking about me being

1734
01:43:39,600 --> 01:43:44,400
Speaker 1: a felon? Okay, that's crazy. And uh So it went

1735
01:43:44,439 --> 01:43:45,760
Speaker 1: on for like a year, and I didn't even know

1736
01:43:45,800 --> 01:43:47,840
Speaker 1: whether to get a lawyer or not house, Like am

1737
01:43:47,880 --> 01:43:50,439
Speaker 1: I in trouble? Did they just continue to contact? You know?

1738
01:43:50,640 --> 01:43:52,640
Speaker 1: It was kind of silence, but I knew something was

1739
01:43:52,720 --> 01:43:55,200
Speaker 1: like going bad, And like r C lawyered up. I

1740
01:43:55,200 --> 01:43:57,040
Speaker 1: didn't lawyer up. I didn't really know, Like if I

1741
01:43:57,120 --> 01:43:59,200
Speaker 1: was in trouble, I didn't know, but they're building a

1742
01:43:59,280 --> 01:44:03,160
Speaker 1: case and then and I was like I had these sponsors, dude,

1743
01:44:03,200 --> 01:44:05,519
Speaker 1: and like I didn't tell anybody because nobody knew. But

1744
01:44:05,640 --> 01:44:07,120
Speaker 1: I had this in the back of my head, you know,

1745
01:44:07,200 --> 01:44:10,479
Speaker 1: I was I was I knew something was coming down

1746
01:44:10,520 --> 01:44:13,120
Speaker 1: the pipe. Like I wasn't dumb, Like I'm pretty wise.

1747
01:44:13,560 --> 01:44:15,360
Speaker 1: Like do you remember the days during that where you're

1748
01:44:15,360 --> 01:44:17,800
Speaker 1: like getting up in the morning. Man, I didn't sleep

1749
01:44:18,240 --> 01:44:20,360
Speaker 1: and didn't sleep. There was two years, right, I didn't sleep,

1750
01:44:20,439 --> 01:44:22,120
Speaker 1: you know, but I I it was it was an

1751
01:44:22,120 --> 01:44:24,960
Speaker 1: amazing experience in the way that I just, man, I

1752
01:44:25,040 --> 01:44:28,120
Speaker 1: had no control, Like I had lost all control of

1753
01:44:28,200 --> 01:44:31,080
Speaker 1: my life. But all I could control was my emotion

1754
01:44:31,160 --> 01:44:32,760
Speaker 1: how I racted, and so I just kind of like

1755
01:44:33,000 --> 01:44:35,280
Speaker 1: went on living man Like it took me a long

1756
01:44:35,360 --> 01:44:37,920
Speaker 1: time to settle into that. So we go for like

1757
01:44:38,000 --> 01:44:40,280
Speaker 1: a year, you know, I'm killing it at life. I

1758
01:44:40,479 --> 01:44:44,519
Speaker 1: think and then were you like, would you was there

1759
01:44:44,520 --> 01:44:46,680
Speaker 1: a guilt there? Do you think? Do you think like you?

1760
01:44:47,560 --> 01:44:49,000
Speaker 1: Because you know, like I said, you know you did

1761
01:44:49,080 --> 01:44:52,559
Speaker 1: something wrong. There's nobody out there that hasn't done something.

1762
01:44:52,680 --> 01:44:55,880
Speaker 1: There was there was never an animal that was shot

1763
01:44:56,000 --> 01:44:59,240
Speaker 1: without a tag. That's all I can say. Everything at

1764
01:44:59,240 --> 01:45:03,439
Speaker 1: a tag. And there was less animals shot because the

1765
01:45:03,479 --> 01:45:05,400
Speaker 1: way we were hunting was like, dude, if you had

1766
01:45:05,400 --> 01:45:08,559
Speaker 1: an opportunity at a mature animal, and if you didn't,

1767
01:45:08,760 --> 01:45:10,760
Speaker 1: you know, if you blew that chance. Like there was

1768
01:45:10,760 --> 01:45:13,439
Speaker 1: a lot of guys went home empty handed. But we did,

1769
01:45:13,640 --> 01:45:17,200
Speaker 1: you know, I think we did get some beautiful animals. Um.

1770
01:45:19,840 --> 01:45:22,840
Speaker 1: But so that went on and I just like it

1771
01:45:22,960 --> 01:45:26,280
Speaker 1: was trying to live my life and trying to be normal.

1772
01:45:26,439 --> 01:45:30,000
Speaker 1: I was dating a really amazing person, and you know

1773
01:45:30,160 --> 01:45:31,600
Speaker 1: it was like there was a lot of stress, you know,

1774
01:45:31,840 --> 01:45:33,720
Speaker 1: but on our relationship or whatever. And but well then

1775
01:45:36,560 --> 01:45:40,599
Speaker 1: it was like August the next year, we get indicted.

1776
01:45:40,840 --> 01:45:43,280
Speaker 1: I get a letter like they're like indictment, You've got

1777
01:45:43,360 --> 01:45:45,880
Speaker 1: to be at the federal court and this is this

1778
01:45:46,040 --> 01:45:47,519
Speaker 1: is the deal, all right. I was like, okay, so

1779
01:45:47,640 --> 01:45:51,120
Speaker 1: we did this landowner. I know there's some tags. This

1780
01:45:51,240 --> 01:45:52,519
Speaker 1: is just a bad deal. Like I don't, I have

1781
01:45:52,640 --> 01:45:54,320
Speaker 1: no idea what's going to happen. We go into court

1782
01:45:54,640 --> 01:45:56,360
Speaker 1: and they and they indicted my dad too, which was

1783
01:45:56,479 --> 01:46:00,519
Speaker 1: really it was that really hurt because he he wasn't

1784
01:46:00,560 --> 01:46:02,920
Speaker 1: involved in the hunting operation, you know, but like one

1785
01:46:03,160 --> 01:46:04,720
Speaker 1: one day he had come down like we've gotten this

1786
01:46:05,000 --> 01:46:07,320
Speaker 1: beautiful bull, and he was there and he would helped

1787
01:46:07,320 --> 01:46:10,000
Speaker 1: his pack pack it out, so I guess he was involved,

1788
01:46:10,080 --> 01:46:11,960
Speaker 1: you know, and he got a photo with the animal,

1789
01:46:12,120 --> 01:46:13,600
Speaker 1: like you know, he's like, oh, take a photo of

1790
01:46:13,640 --> 01:46:16,720
Speaker 1: you know. So anyways, he's involved, he's an accessory. We

1791
01:46:16,760 --> 01:46:19,720
Speaker 1: go to federal court and they're like they they just

1792
01:46:19,720 --> 01:46:21,599
Speaker 1: start reading, like we stand up and they just start

1793
01:46:21,760 --> 01:46:26,760
Speaker 1: reading these charges off man. And so what it was

1794
01:46:26,800 --> 01:46:28,680
Speaker 1: all said and done are my brother and myself were

1795
01:46:28,720 --> 01:46:32,559
Speaker 1: indicted on eleven felonies a piece. My dad was indicted

1796
01:46:32,680 --> 01:46:36,960
Speaker 1: on three. I was facing fifty five years in prison

1797
01:46:37,280 --> 01:46:39,400
Speaker 1: arc and each we're facing fifty five years in prison

1798
01:46:39,720 --> 01:46:41,920
Speaker 1: and four point five million dollars and finds a piece

1799
01:46:42,640 --> 01:46:45,320
Speaker 1: And I was like it wasn't even real, man, Like

1800
01:46:45,320 --> 01:46:47,000
Speaker 1: I remember cutting a check that was one. I was like,

1801
01:46:47,000 --> 01:46:49,120
Speaker 1: I should probably get a lawyer before this indictment. So

1802
01:46:49,160 --> 01:46:51,439
Speaker 1: I kind of check for twenty this like my whole savings.

1803
01:46:51,520 --> 01:46:53,120
Speaker 1: To this lawyer, I was like, here you go, man like,

1804
01:46:53,439 --> 01:46:55,520
Speaker 1: I don't know what's going to happen. He's like, you're

1805
01:46:56,120 --> 01:46:58,160
Speaker 1: this is not good. You guys are looking you guys

1806
01:46:58,200 --> 01:47:00,720
Speaker 1: are gonna go to prison. I was like, man like,

1807
01:47:01,320 --> 01:47:03,360
Speaker 1: I'm going to prison for this, like this is crazy.

1808
01:47:03,560 --> 01:47:06,719
Speaker 1: Not like I had no idea that this was a felony.

1809
01:47:07,760 --> 01:47:12,360
Speaker 1: So they indict us on to be clear, the felony

1810
01:47:12,479 --> 01:47:15,840
Speaker 1: comes in Lacey Act violation. Yeah, yeah, so it was

1811
01:47:15,880 --> 01:47:18,280
Speaker 1: all you guys taken these illegals. So a couple of

1812
01:47:18,320 --> 01:47:20,880
Speaker 1: the hunters, a couple of hunters had taken animals back

1813
01:47:20,920 --> 01:47:23,519
Speaker 1: across state lines, violating the Lacy Act. And that's where

1814
01:47:23,680 --> 01:47:25,800
Speaker 1: that's where the fans became involved, because if they had

1815
01:47:25,880 --> 01:47:28,840
Speaker 1: never crossed in the state lines, it wouldn't have been

1816
01:47:28,880 --> 01:47:31,760
Speaker 1: a felony. So that's where it got really cloudy. And

1817
01:47:31,840 --> 01:47:33,280
Speaker 1: I was like, well like yeah, man, like we are

1818
01:47:33,400 --> 01:47:37,479
Speaker 1: in trouble. I'm facing fifty five years in prison, and

1819
01:47:37,600 --> 01:47:39,280
Speaker 1: so like that was that was the game, man Like.

1820
01:47:39,360 --> 01:47:41,400
Speaker 1: I lived with that and then but the thing was like,

1821
01:47:41,479 --> 01:47:45,120
Speaker 1: once that came out then and then it was public knowledge.

1822
01:47:45,479 --> 01:47:48,640
Speaker 1: Then the media got ahold of it, and then they

1823
01:47:48,680 --> 01:47:50,439
Speaker 1: started writing things about it. You know, it's a huge

1824
01:47:50,479 --> 01:47:53,400
Speaker 1: poaching ring like all these things. And I don't know

1825
01:47:53,439 --> 01:47:57,559
Speaker 1: how you define poaching, like maybe I did. Maybe that's

1826
01:47:57,600 --> 01:47:59,759
Speaker 1: what it was. Maybe that's the definition in legal animal

1827
01:47:59,840 --> 01:48:02,519
Speaker 1: take and um, I I didn't feel like it was,

1828
01:48:03,360 --> 01:48:08,160
Speaker 1: but yeah I did that, and the media butchered us, man,

1829
01:48:08,400 --> 01:48:13,360
Speaker 1: Like it was like this Casper Star Tribune. They were relentless, Joe.

1830
01:48:13,479 --> 01:48:15,479
Speaker 1: I mean it was. It was relentless. And I had

1831
01:48:15,520 --> 01:48:17,000
Speaker 1: a bit of a name in snowboarding, so I mean

1832
01:48:17,040 --> 01:48:19,360
Speaker 1: they were like, look at this guy. And then some

1833
01:48:19,520 --> 01:48:23,880
Speaker 1: asshole in snowboarding like Leasa in the snowboarding media, and

1834
01:48:23,920 --> 01:48:26,200
Speaker 1: then it just blew up. And so I get a

1835
01:48:26,240 --> 01:48:29,280
Speaker 1: call from like one of my huge sponsors. They're like, yo, dude,

1836
01:48:30,120 --> 01:48:34,120
Speaker 1: what is going on? Like I don't know, man, Like,

1837
01:48:35,320 --> 01:48:37,000
Speaker 1: you know, I did some things and I'm in a

1838
01:48:37,080 --> 01:48:38,680
Speaker 1: lot of trouble. Like that's all I can tell you,

1839
01:48:38,800 --> 01:48:41,000
Speaker 1: Like I'm I'm going to continue to do this snowboarding thing,

1840
01:48:41,080 --> 01:48:43,720
Speaker 1: like with or without you guys, Like I understand that,

1841
01:48:44,040 --> 01:48:46,200
Speaker 1: um this does not look good in it on paper,

1842
01:48:46,320 --> 01:48:52,400
Speaker 1: it is horrible, horrible, um. And so that was something

1843
01:48:52,479 --> 01:48:54,679
Speaker 1: I had to navigate and that was a very humbling.

1844
01:48:55,640 --> 01:48:56,960
Speaker 1: I mean I was so vulnerable. I mean I just

1845
01:48:57,000 --> 01:48:59,599
Speaker 1: had my hands out. And then so throughout the next year,

1846
01:49:01,439 --> 01:49:03,559
Speaker 1: you know, I did everything I could. Man like if

1847
01:49:03,800 --> 01:49:06,680
Speaker 1: if they asked me for something like the prosecutors that,

1848
01:49:06,800 --> 01:49:08,840
Speaker 1: I was like, man, what do you guys need for me? Like,

1849
01:49:08,920 --> 01:49:11,160
Speaker 1: I will tell you everything, Like there's I have nothing

1850
01:49:11,240 --> 01:49:13,439
Speaker 1: to hide, am open book here. And my whole family

1851
01:49:13,560 --> 01:49:16,200
Speaker 1: was that way. So we sat down and we went

1852
01:49:16,240 --> 01:49:18,960
Speaker 1: through this whole process for a year of what they

1853
01:49:19,000 --> 01:49:20,320
Speaker 1: were going to do with us. And I'm still trying

1854
01:49:20,360 --> 01:49:22,720
Speaker 1: to like juggle my my professional career where it's like

1855
01:49:22,840 --> 01:49:25,240
Speaker 1: I can see it falling apart. My relationship at home

1856
01:49:25,320 --> 01:49:28,479
Speaker 1: is falling apart. Everything is falling apart around me, and

1857
01:49:28,600 --> 01:49:30,960
Speaker 1: I'm and I just kept thinking to myself. I was

1858
01:49:31,000 --> 01:49:34,600
Speaker 1: like mad, I was like, it may be really prioritize

1859
01:49:34,640 --> 01:49:36,120
Speaker 1: and live in the present because I didn't know if

1860
01:49:36,120 --> 01:49:38,320
Speaker 1: I had a future, because I really thought like I

1861
01:49:38,360 --> 01:49:41,040
Speaker 1: was going to do some prisons. Yeah, did you talk

1862
01:49:41,160 --> 01:49:45,519
Speaker 1: your lawyer And he was basically like, You're like, I

1863
01:49:45,600 --> 01:49:48,519
Speaker 1: would be really surprised if you don't do time, and

1864
01:49:48,640 --> 01:49:50,200
Speaker 1: I just like it was really hard for me to

1865
01:49:50,240 --> 01:49:52,560
Speaker 1: get comprehend that because I had never I had I

1866
01:49:52,600 --> 01:49:54,960
Speaker 1: didn't have a record, like I've never done anything to

1867
01:49:55,040 --> 01:49:56,760
Speaker 1: be in jail. I'd never gotten thrown to jail. I

1868
01:49:56,920 --> 01:49:59,719
Speaker 1: had some minor and fractions as a kid is drinking,

1869
01:50:00,720 --> 01:50:03,519
Speaker 1: but um, it's like, so to go from nothing to

1870
01:50:03,640 --> 01:50:06,720
Speaker 1: like the worst I was, I was it was like

1871
01:50:07,000 --> 01:50:10,040
Speaker 1: my mind did not compute what was happening. Like I

1872
01:50:10,240 --> 01:50:11,880
Speaker 1: was kind of not in denial, but I was like

1873
01:50:12,560 --> 01:50:14,240
Speaker 1: I was just really optimistic. Man, I'm like, I'm not

1874
01:50:14,240 --> 01:50:16,040
Speaker 1: gonna get felonies, dude, I'm just gonna like keep doing

1875
01:50:16,120 --> 01:50:18,840
Speaker 1: this like life's good. But it made me really prioritize

1876
01:50:18,840 --> 01:50:21,400
Speaker 1: my family because during this whole process, they were really

1877
01:50:21,479 --> 01:50:23,320
Speaker 1: trying to turn us against each other, like they're like

1878
01:50:23,439 --> 01:50:27,240
Speaker 1: your brother said. I was like, no, he didn't like that,

1879
01:50:27,520 --> 01:50:29,479
Speaker 1: you know, But I get it. I get why they

1880
01:50:29,560 --> 01:50:32,840
Speaker 1: do that in too, like some bad guys they turn

1881
01:50:32,960 --> 01:50:35,800
Speaker 1: them against each other. But I mean, maybe it's just

1882
01:50:35,920 --> 01:50:38,559
Speaker 1: me and it's my introspect. But like I didn't feel

1883
01:50:38,560 --> 01:50:39,640
Speaker 1: like I was a bad guy. I didn't feel like

1884
01:50:39,640 --> 01:50:41,000
Speaker 1: we were bad guys. You know, I didn't like we

1885
01:50:41,400 --> 01:50:43,920
Speaker 1: you know, it was what it was. Um, that was

1886
01:50:43,960 --> 01:50:45,519
Speaker 1: the most interesting point you said to me. You're like

1887
01:50:45,800 --> 01:50:48,240
Speaker 1: I felt they were doing they were using the tactics

1888
01:50:48,280 --> 01:50:51,040
Speaker 1: that you would want them to use, You want them

1889
01:50:51,080 --> 01:50:53,240
Speaker 1: to use you, And you felt like I'm a good guy,

1890
01:50:53,680 --> 01:50:56,120
Speaker 1: but maybe the bad guys feel that the problem, you know.

1891
01:50:56,240 --> 01:50:57,920
Speaker 1: I mean it's just I mean, poor Mia, It's just

1892
01:50:58,000 --> 01:51:01,200
Speaker 1: just a selfish outlook on it. But um, it was.

1893
01:51:01,560 --> 01:51:03,840
Speaker 1: It was crazy, dude. Like I didn't sleep, but it

1894
01:51:03,880 --> 01:51:07,280
Speaker 1: really got me to this place of of of of

1895
01:51:07,439 --> 01:51:11,479
Speaker 1: calm and patience and just like letting things go and

1896
01:51:11,680 --> 01:51:15,160
Speaker 1: things are gonna happen and there's nothing I can do

1897
01:51:15,280 --> 01:51:17,760
Speaker 1: to control this, and I just let it go. Man.

1898
01:51:17,840 --> 01:51:19,760
Speaker 1: I was like, here we go, Like I'm along for

1899
01:51:19,840 --> 01:51:21,120
Speaker 1: the ride on this one. Man. I was like getting

1900
01:51:21,120 --> 01:51:23,320
Speaker 1: on a plane in turbulent weather flying to South America

1901
01:51:23,400 --> 01:51:26,280
Speaker 1: is like, dude, you have no control, just like sit

1902
01:51:26,400 --> 01:51:29,040
Speaker 1: back and just like take it. And so that's what

1903
01:51:29,160 --> 01:51:30,720
Speaker 1: I did, and I took it, took it. And I

1904
01:51:30,760 --> 01:51:34,360
Speaker 1: think the hardest part was watching the local the local media,

1905
01:51:34,720 --> 01:51:38,120
Speaker 1: the Whirland News, like these guys that that I had

1906
01:51:38,160 --> 01:51:40,719
Speaker 1: all these accomplishments in my career that was like pretty

1907
01:51:41,200 --> 01:51:45,479
Speaker 1: um exceptable, exceptional for that area, Like a snowboarder coming

1908
01:51:45,520 --> 01:51:47,840
Speaker 1: out and they would never do anything in the in

1909
01:51:47,960 --> 01:51:50,240
Speaker 1: the paper about me, like I'd reached out and like

1910
01:51:50,320 --> 01:51:51,840
Speaker 1: kind man, it would be cool to do local things.

1911
01:51:52,120 --> 01:51:54,719
Speaker 1: Never reached out. But the minute I am in trouble

1912
01:51:54,800 --> 01:51:57,720
Speaker 1: and this negative news man, they were all up on

1913
01:51:57,880 --> 01:52:01,400
Speaker 1: that and they just just hammered it weakly about my

1914
01:52:01,560 --> 01:52:03,320
Speaker 1: dad and my That was hard to seeing my dad,

1915
01:52:03,360 --> 01:52:05,200
Speaker 1: like I had a thick skin, but like he's like

1916
01:52:05,320 --> 01:52:07,839
Speaker 1: sixty three years old and like grewing up in this community.

1917
01:52:07,880 --> 01:52:09,840
Speaker 1: And they're like, you're a felon, you're a poacher, you're

1918
01:52:09,880 --> 01:52:12,120
Speaker 1: like doing all this stuff, and like yeah, we're charged

1919
01:52:12,160 --> 01:52:14,560
Speaker 1: with that, and I understand, like that's what it looks like.

1920
01:52:15,600 --> 01:52:18,720
Speaker 1: But that was really hard to watch. And then you know,

1921
01:52:19,000 --> 01:52:22,160
Speaker 1: just navigating that, watching him, watching it hurt him, watching

1922
01:52:22,200 --> 01:52:24,880
Speaker 1: it hurt my mother. And that's just the people around me.

1923
01:52:24,920 --> 01:52:26,880
Speaker 1: But like there's one thing, man, like I learned who

1924
01:52:26,960 --> 01:52:30,439
Speaker 1: my friends were. Like people distanced themselves. Man, Like I

1925
01:52:30,479 --> 01:52:32,320
Speaker 1: had contracts coming down the pipe, like I was about

1926
01:52:32,320 --> 01:52:33,800
Speaker 1: to sign with the snowboard company and they were like,

1927
01:52:34,520 --> 01:52:39,360
Speaker 1: yeah that budgets tapped. I understand, I understand, But there

1928
01:52:39,400 --> 01:52:41,519
Speaker 1: were the companies that stook by, like stood behind me.

1929
01:52:41,560 --> 01:52:46,000
Speaker 1: They knew my integrity. People are gonna make mistakes, man Like,

1930
01:52:46,080 --> 01:52:48,840
Speaker 1: people are gonna make mistakes, and as long as you

1931
01:52:49,960 --> 01:52:54,679
Speaker 1: are are accountable for yourself and you admit and you'd

1932
01:52:54,720 --> 01:52:58,280
Speaker 1: move on like everybody else should too. It's like, forgiveness

1933
01:52:58,360 --> 01:53:00,720
Speaker 1: is a beautiful thing in the human nature, and I

1934
01:53:00,760 --> 01:53:04,360
Speaker 1: think we're losing that. But so we went through this

1935
01:53:04,520 --> 01:53:07,040
Speaker 1: year of just hell. Man, Like I'm traveling the world

1936
01:53:07,160 --> 01:53:09,800
Speaker 1: and like trying to produce video parts. I have this

1937
01:53:09,920 --> 01:53:11,920
Speaker 1: dangerous job where my mind is not in it. My

1938
01:53:12,000 --> 01:53:14,920
Speaker 1: girlfriend's leaving me, Like I have these opportunities that I

1939
01:53:14,960 --> 01:53:19,000
Speaker 1: can't even like I can't even go after because I'm

1940
01:53:19,080 --> 01:53:22,880
Speaker 1: like so mentally like scrambled and and and then I'm

1941
01:53:22,920 --> 01:53:25,479
Speaker 1: in Japan. I'm like on this amazing trip in Japan

1942
01:53:25,640 --> 01:53:27,720
Speaker 1: with like my best friend and my one of my

1943
01:53:27,760 --> 01:53:30,360
Speaker 1: best friends from Norway, where we're snowboarding and doing this

1944
01:53:30,439 --> 01:53:34,120
Speaker 1: project that winner. Everybody's backing me. I know this thing

1945
01:53:34,200 --> 01:53:36,120
Speaker 1: is coming down the pipe, and so we're like going

1946
01:53:36,200 --> 01:53:38,160
Speaker 1: back and forth with the with the Feds, and like

1947
01:53:38,240 --> 01:53:39,600
Speaker 1: I would sit down with these guys, like I was

1948
01:53:39,680 --> 01:53:42,920
Speaker 1: driving from tents or from Jackson to Casper to go

1949
01:53:43,160 --> 01:53:44,840
Speaker 1: meet with these guys because trials were coming up for

1950
01:53:44,880 --> 01:53:47,880
Speaker 1: all the other uh, the other hunters and all this

1951
01:53:47,960 --> 01:53:49,920
Speaker 1: crazy ship was going on. It wasn't just my life, man,

1952
01:53:50,000 --> 01:53:52,400
Speaker 1: They turned like a lot of people's lives upside down.

1953
01:53:53,720 --> 01:53:57,640
Speaker 1: And and I mean maybe, I mean we deserved it,

1954
01:53:57,720 --> 01:53:59,640
Speaker 1: like we I broke the law man, like it was

1955
01:53:59,720 --> 01:54:03,760
Speaker 1: what it was. And I'm in Japan and I still

1956
01:54:03,880 --> 01:54:05,559
Speaker 1: think that there's a chance. And I'm not getting any

1957
01:54:05,600 --> 01:54:08,000
Speaker 1: felonies because felonies to me are like, man, i I'm

1958
01:54:08,080 --> 01:54:10,960
Speaker 1: like thinking all these like things in my head. I'm like,

1959
01:54:11,000 --> 01:54:12,960
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna ever be able to have a gun again,

1960
01:54:13,439 --> 01:54:15,439
Speaker 1: something that I loved so dearly. It's something I grew

1961
01:54:15,520 --> 01:54:18,320
Speaker 1: up with. It's a tool for a rancher. And I'm

1962
01:54:18,360 --> 01:54:20,960
Speaker 1: in Japan doing this project and I just never forget.

1963
01:54:21,000 --> 01:54:22,599
Speaker 1: I was writing then Elevator one morning and I get

1964
01:54:22,640 --> 01:54:24,120
Speaker 1: the email from my lawyer and he's like, here's the

1965
01:54:24,120 --> 01:54:29,360
Speaker 1: poleae bargain, dude, And it was like three felonies, Like

1966
01:54:29,600 --> 01:54:33,160
Speaker 1: all the I got, I was getting three felonies. Um, uh,

1967
01:54:33,360 --> 01:54:35,960
Speaker 1: seventy five thousand dollar donation to the why i'man gaming

1968
01:54:36,040 --> 01:54:40,000
Speaker 1: fish and um, yeah. Then I had to go to court.

1969
01:54:40,200 --> 01:54:43,280
Speaker 1: Then I had to go get sentenced, and I was like, wow,

1970
01:54:43,680 --> 01:54:45,800
Speaker 1: I guess this is this is this is what's happening. Man,

1971
01:54:45,840 --> 01:54:48,280
Speaker 1: there's no like you don't once a police bargain the

1972
01:54:48,440 --> 01:54:52,320
Speaker 1: like here you go. What was the felonies? Uh, conspiracy

1973
01:54:52,360 --> 01:54:56,280
Speaker 1: to traffic in illegal wildlife, trafficking in illegal wildlife, and

1974
01:54:56,600 --> 01:54:59,080
Speaker 1: falsifying government documents because I signed my name to a

1975
01:54:59,160 --> 01:55:03,800
Speaker 1: landowner tag one time, and so I didn't understand the falsifying,

1976
01:55:03,880 --> 01:55:06,080
Speaker 1: but I get it, like it's on the tag and

1977
01:55:06,160 --> 01:55:09,120
Speaker 1: it says if you sign this illegally, that's a felony.

1978
01:55:09,440 --> 01:55:11,600
Speaker 1: I committed that felony. Dude, I signed that ship. You

1979
01:55:11,640 --> 01:55:14,040
Speaker 1: know I didn't. Who reads a fine print? I tell

1980
01:55:14,040 --> 01:55:17,320
Speaker 1: you what I read fine print? Now, So then you

1981
01:55:17,400 --> 01:55:19,680
Speaker 1: know my brother is sentting he plead the same thing.

1982
01:55:19,800 --> 01:55:22,000
Speaker 1: My dad got like a plea with one felony, and

1983
01:55:22,200 --> 01:55:25,320
Speaker 1: like I don't remember exactly his his donation finds. So

1984
01:55:25,480 --> 01:55:27,960
Speaker 1: then and I'm like, okay, well at least we got

1985
01:55:28,040 --> 01:55:30,680
Speaker 1: that over. Okay, We're gonna move on. Like but now

1986
01:55:30,760 --> 01:55:32,640
Speaker 1: we go to court our next step, and that was

1987
01:55:32,680 --> 01:55:34,800
Speaker 1: the thing. It is like I found out I got

1988
01:55:34,840 --> 01:55:38,280
Speaker 1: felonies and my girlfriend left me like within like two weeks.

1989
01:55:38,800 --> 01:55:40,440
Speaker 1: And and I don't blame her for leaving me. Dude,

1990
01:55:40,440 --> 01:55:41,920
Speaker 1: I was a dick. I was so stressed out, like

1991
01:55:41,960 --> 01:55:44,040
Speaker 1: I was trying to like juggle all these things. Sponsors

1992
01:55:44,080 --> 01:55:46,720
Speaker 1: were leaving like it was what it was. I was

1993
01:55:46,760 --> 01:55:48,400
Speaker 1: just I was just like way in the storm. I

1994
01:55:48,440 --> 01:55:51,480
Speaker 1: came back from Japan. I had like some crazy sickness

1995
01:55:51,560 --> 01:55:53,960
Speaker 1: that I was an apartment with no TV. Like every

1996
01:55:54,000 --> 01:55:56,760
Speaker 1: shoot I showed up, she was gone. Everything was turned

1997
01:55:56,760 --> 01:55:58,200
Speaker 1: off and I got sick and laid in my bed

1998
01:55:58,280 --> 01:56:00,200
Speaker 1: for three days with like almost died. There was a

1999
01:56:00,280 --> 01:56:01,640
Speaker 1: quote that Joe has just showed me that I said,

2000
01:56:01,640 --> 01:56:03,880
Speaker 1: it's like this ruined my life up to this point

2001
01:56:04,280 --> 01:56:06,800
Speaker 1: because I have obviously felt that way at that point.

2002
01:56:06,840 --> 01:56:09,200
Speaker 1: I did at that point, man, And that was when

2003
01:56:09,240 --> 01:56:12,760
Speaker 1: I we went to the dude I and when when

2004
01:56:12,760 --> 01:56:14,600
Speaker 1: they rated us, I just earned thirty. That was my

2005
01:56:14,640 --> 01:56:17,400
Speaker 1: thirtieth birthday. It was right before my thirties. Like hey, man,

2006
01:56:17,560 --> 01:56:20,840
Speaker 1: like dude, it's something like they say thirty, like something

2007
01:56:20,960 --> 01:56:22,920
Speaker 1: changes in your life, like either way. I was like

2008
01:56:23,720 --> 01:56:27,560
Speaker 1: thirty suck. But it changed, man, Like it changed me

2009
01:56:27,840 --> 01:56:32,000
Speaker 1: and I wouldn't take it back, you know, like I

2010
01:56:32,040 --> 01:56:35,360
Speaker 1: wouldn't like that experience and that those hardships, like they

2011
01:56:35,480 --> 01:56:39,800
Speaker 1: molded everything that I am right now. And so we

2012
01:56:39,920 --> 01:56:42,000
Speaker 1: go to court and that's the scariest thing, Like we

2013
01:56:42,080 --> 01:56:44,760
Speaker 1: got a chyenne man. Like here we are in court

2014
01:56:44,920 --> 01:56:48,560
Speaker 1: getting sentenced. I'm still facing fifteen years maximum, fifteen years

2015
01:56:48,640 --> 01:56:52,760
Speaker 1: and seven fifty thousand dollars and finals. I'm like, dude, like,

2016
01:56:52,880 --> 01:56:55,800
Speaker 1: I hope the judge is cool. And so I go

2017
01:56:55,920 --> 01:56:57,240
Speaker 1: up there and you're going into that and you don't

2018
01:56:57,320 --> 01:57:00,120
Speaker 1: you have now I still like they got me by

2019
01:57:00,200 --> 01:57:02,600
Speaker 1: the balls. I got nothing, dude, I have no control

2020
01:57:02,640 --> 01:57:06,160
Speaker 1: of the lawyers. Like, dude, like you, I hope we

2021
01:57:06,200 --> 01:57:09,560
Speaker 1: can get you out. And I've just given it all up,

2022
01:57:10,000 --> 01:57:12,440
Speaker 1: you know. I'm like, man, like my life, I've lived

2023
01:57:12,440 --> 01:57:15,240
Speaker 1: an amazing life. If this is what's happening, Like this

2024
01:57:15,400 --> 01:57:17,280
Speaker 1: is what it is, dude, But I can't, like I

2025
01:57:17,440 --> 01:57:19,800
Speaker 1: understand when people get backed into a corner, you know,

2026
01:57:19,920 --> 01:57:25,920
Speaker 1: I understand like that feeling of helplessness and you maybe

2027
01:57:26,000 --> 01:57:28,440
Speaker 1: want to just like act out a little bit. Towards

2028
01:57:28,600 --> 01:57:30,880
Speaker 1: like whatever is pushing you want to push back, dude,

2029
01:57:31,200 --> 01:57:34,320
Speaker 1: you want to push back. But I didn't push back.

2030
01:57:34,480 --> 01:57:36,200
Speaker 1: You know, I went and I stood in front of

2031
01:57:36,200 --> 01:57:42,280
Speaker 1: the judge and and uh, you know I I think

2032
01:57:42,320 --> 01:57:43,880
Speaker 1: one of the quotes was, you know, it's ruined all

2033
01:57:43,920 --> 01:57:45,720
Speaker 1: my life and that was like a quote from the court.

2034
01:57:45,800 --> 01:57:49,280
Speaker 1: And my whole family's already like my whole family and

2035
01:57:49,400 --> 01:57:52,240
Speaker 1: my friends that showed up, Louis and Justin and Dowell

2036
01:57:52,320 --> 01:57:54,400
Speaker 1: and Johnny, they showed up like you do. They didn't

2037
01:57:54,400 --> 01:57:56,040
Speaker 1: have to show up. They showed up in my behalf

2038
01:57:56,080 --> 01:57:59,000
Speaker 1: and my family's behalf. And you know, she she looked

2039
01:57:59,040 --> 01:58:00,960
Speaker 1: at this. I was like, you know, she told me,

2040
01:58:01,040 --> 01:58:06,000
Speaker 1: She's like, I've never I've never seeing anyone facing what

2041
01:58:06,080 --> 01:58:08,000
Speaker 1: you're facing with the record you have in the life

2042
01:58:08,040 --> 01:58:11,240
Speaker 1: you've lived. But at that point you have a plea bargain,

2043
01:58:11,280 --> 01:58:13,600
Speaker 1: you know, like it's done. But she's just like, this

2044
01:58:13,720 --> 01:58:16,000
Speaker 1: is what your sentences and she just like, dude, she

2045
01:58:16,040 --> 01:58:18,200
Speaker 1: didn't give me ship. You know, she was like she

2046
01:58:18,360 --> 01:58:20,760
Speaker 1: understood a little bit, I think, and she had empathy

2047
01:58:20,840 --> 01:58:23,760
Speaker 1: for the situation, not that she was like, you didn't

2048
01:58:23,760 --> 01:58:25,520
Speaker 1: break the law. And she's like you broke you broke

2049
01:58:25,560 --> 01:58:27,920
Speaker 1: the law. Mr Carter, like this is this is the consequences.

2050
01:58:28,240 --> 01:58:30,240
Speaker 1: And I was like, oh, I accepted anything you give me.

2051
01:58:30,360 --> 01:58:34,040
Speaker 1: This is it. And I got three years unsupervised probation

2052
01:58:34,080 --> 01:58:36,879
Speaker 1: because she was empathetic towards my my job and traveling

2053
01:58:36,920 --> 01:58:41,320
Speaker 1: in all his career and so that was like a

2054
01:58:41,480 --> 01:58:43,240
Speaker 1: huge relief. I was like, oh my god, I'm not

2055
01:58:43,320 --> 01:58:46,920
Speaker 1: going to prison, dude, but I'm like, it wasn't. And

2056
01:58:47,000 --> 01:58:49,920
Speaker 1: then I realized, like, my my anxiety wasn't about me

2057
01:58:50,040 --> 01:58:52,120
Speaker 1: going to prison. It was about my brother, Like what

2058
01:58:52,200 --> 01:58:55,440
Speaker 1: are they going to do to him? And dude, he

2059
01:58:55,600 --> 01:58:58,880
Speaker 1: they got up there and uh do they sentenced him

2060
01:58:58,920 --> 01:59:00,560
Speaker 1: to like a year and a half of in prison

2061
01:59:01,320 --> 01:59:03,880
Speaker 1: and like his wife's there and like crying. I was

2062
01:59:03,960 --> 01:59:07,720
Speaker 1: like this this heavy moment, and I was like alright,

2063
01:59:07,920 --> 01:59:10,440
Speaker 1: like okay, a year and a half, Like what's my

2064
01:59:10,560 --> 01:59:14,560
Speaker 1: solution here? Like hopefully that doesn't happen. And walking out

2065
01:59:14,600 --> 01:59:16,160
Speaker 1: of that court room is very sobering. It was in

2066
01:59:16,240 --> 01:59:19,040
Speaker 1: this way of like, Okay, I think you're going to jail.

2067
01:59:19,040 --> 01:59:20,680
Speaker 1: I'm not going to jail, which I'd rather be going

2068
01:59:20,720 --> 01:59:23,080
Speaker 1: to jail. You have the family, but we're done. Now

2069
01:59:23,120 --> 01:59:26,040
Speaker 1: we're moving forward. We're like we know what's going to happen.

2070
01:59:26,800 --> 01:59:28,520
Speaker 1: I have to some control. I'm like okay, man, like

2071
01:59:28,640 --> 01:59:30,640
Speaker 1: let's like we'll figure us out. Like you know, I

2072
01:59:30,760 --> 01:59:32,720
Speaker 1: was eveything. I quit the snowboarding, like I'll come back

2073
01:59:32,720 --> 01:59:34,120
Speaker 1: to the ranch like whatever I gotta do to like

2074
01:59:34,200 --> 01:59:36,960
Speaker 1: hell my family and like make us work. Thank god

2075
01:59:37,080 --> 01:59:38,400
Speaker 1: he didn't have to do a year and a half.

2076
01:59:38,440 --> 01:59:41,560
Speaker 1: They want to do some ship and he did end

2077
01:59:41,640 --> 01:59:44,280
Speaker 1: up having to do like two months in federal which

2078
01:59:44,400 --> 01:59:47,520
Speaker 1: was crazy, but he was like, man, that was a

2079
01:59:47,560 --> 01:59:50,360
Speaker 1: great that was that was that was an experience, man,

2080
01:59:50,520 --> 01:59:53,240
Speaker 1: Like that was something that I needed, you know. And

2081
01:59:54,280 --> 01:59:57,080
Speaker 1: I don't know the reasoning behind everything that went down.

2082
01:59:57,160 --> 02:00:00,640
Speaker 1: I always felt like you know, I when you're always

2083
02:00:00,680 --> 02:00:02,520
Speaker 1: in a situation like yeah, you feel like poor me,

2084
02:00:03,440 --> 02:00:06,720
Speaker 1: poor me, and like they're going at me so hard

2085
02:00:06,880 --> 02:00:10,560
Speaker 1: and like I just but I I just it was

2086
02:00:10,640 --> 02:00:12,400
Speaker 1: what it was, and I just like to take your

2087
02:00:12,440 --> 02:00:15,520
Speaker 1: licking here you go, man, first wreck like wreck, get up,

2088
02:00:15,720 --> 02:00:17,960
Speaker 1: Like are you going to let this define you as

2089
02:00:18,000 --> 02:00:20,880
Speaker 1: a person? Are you gonna like hold resentment against the

2090
02:00:21,960 --> 02:00:24,560
Speaker 1: the people? And it was my choice. It was our choice, man,

2091
02:00:24,680 --> 02:00:26,800
Speaker 1: Like I accepted the choice that we had made to

2092
02:00:26,840 --> 02:00:29,560
Speaker 1: get us in this position. That was us, man, it

2093
02:00:29,640 --> 02:00:31,960
Speaker 1: wasn't them. They didn't have we put them in that

2094
02:00:32,080 --> 02:00:36,560
Speaker 1: position to hammer us. You know, they did go by

2095
02:00:36,600 --> 02:00:38,680
Speaker 1: the law. We did break the law. It was what

2096
02:00:38,840 --> 02:00:41,320
Speaker 1: it was. But I think you're always in that position.

2097
02:00:41,360 --> 02:00:43,600
Speaker 1: You're like, poor me. But I got over that, and

2098
02:00:43,720 --> 02:00:46,920
Speaker 1: I like, you know, Arcy did his prison time. But

2099
02:00:47,040 --> 02:00:49,920
Speaker 1: after that, I really it prioritized my life in a

2100
02:00:49,960 --> 02:00:53,440
Speaker 1: way of like, am I snowboarding for money? Because I

2101
02:00:53,520 --> 02:00:55,560
Speaker 1: lost everything? Man? Like I didn't have ship, I had

2102
02:00:55,600 --> 02:00:57,680
Speaker 1: like one sponsor left. And I was like, am I

2103
02:00:57,800 --> 02:00:59,480
Speaker 1: doing this for money? Or am I doing it because

2104
02:00:59,520 --> 02:01:01,360
Speaker 1: I love o boarding? I love being in the mountains.

2105
02:01:01,520 --> 02:01:03,600
Speaker 1: This is my life, this is this is what I do.

2106
02:01:05,200 --> 02:01:07,240
Speaker 1: And Goose gave me some amazing advice. He's like, man,

2107
02:01:07,280 --> 02:01:09,760
Speaker 1: don't worry about what everybody else is doing. He's like,

2108
02:01:09,960 --> 02:01:12,520
Speaker 1: just focus on your own program. And man, I I

2109
02:01:12,680 --> 02:01:16,160
Speaker 1: quit traveling the world. I focused on being home. I

2110
02:01:16,200 --> 02:01:19,520
Speaker 1: focused on being in Jackson and not leaving Jackson and

2111
02:01:19,680 --> 02:01:21,960
Speaker 1: just like making that my home and saving money because

2112
02:01:21,960 --> 02:01:23,760
Speaker 1: I didn't have the budget to travel anymore. Man. I

2113
02:01:23,840 --> 02:01:25,960
Speaker 1: have like, dude, I go to Alaska twenty g s

2114
02:01:26,000 --> 02:01:30,240
Speaker 1: to like burn on helicopters, which is so like it's crazy,

2115
02:01:31,960 --> 02:01:34,280
Speaker 1: check me out. I'm rich, rich checking out. But I

2116
02:01:34,320 --> 02:01:36,920
Speaker 1: didn't appreciate it, man, until I lost all that stuff,

2117
02:01:36,960 --> 02:01:38,480
Speaker 1: And it was the best thing that ever happened in

2118
02:01:38,560 --> 02:01:42,360
Speaker 1: my career was losing all that and then really appreciating

2119
02:01:42,480 --> 02:01:44,680
Speaker 1: everything I've curated up back to this point, like getting

2120
02:01:44,720 --> 02:01:48,720
Speaker 1: the sponsors. People that signed me understood my past, and

2121
02:01:48,760 --> 02:01:51,280
Speaker 1: I was always been transparent about like yo, like I

2122
02:01:51,360 --> 02:01:54,880
Speaker 1: gotta check her past, Like this is the deal. Understanding

2123
02:01:55,320 --> 02:01:57,480
Speaker 1: being in a position of being of judgment, like people

2124
02:01:57,680 --> 02:01:59,760
Speaker 1: like they see your record, man, Like you see three

2125
02:01:59,760 --> 02:02:02,400
Speaker 1: fell things on somebody's record and you're like, what did this? Dude? Dude,

2126
02:02:02,480 --> 02:02:05,880
Speaker 1: Like you can't have guns, you can't vote, Like I'm

2127
02:02:05,880 --> 02:02:09,280
Speaker 1: not even a citizen, you know, but I think the

2128
02:02:09,360 --> 02:02:11,720
Speaker 1: gun thing hurts me more than anything. You know that,

2129
02:02:11,840 --> 02:02:14,680
Speaker 1: Like that hurts my soul, just not being able to

2130
02:02:14,760 --> 02:02:18,120
Speaker 1: like do something I love. You know, Well, let let

2131
02:02:18,160 --> 02:02:19,680
Speaker 1: me just say this, like you're the first person I've

2132
02:02:19,720 --> 02:02:21,680
Speaker 1: ever met, and I have to think about this and

2133
02:02:21,760 --> 02:02:27,760
Speaker 1: make sure I'm not being hyperbolic. I'm at this moment,

2134
02:02:27,840 --> 02:02:29,720
Speaker 1: You're the first person I've ever met that had their

2135
02:02:30,080 --> 02:02:33,960
Speaker 1: their second a moment rights stripped away and I earned it.

2136
02:02:34,480 --> 02:02:36,160
Speaker 1: I earned it, you know I did that. That was me.

2137
02:02:36,840 --> 02:02:42,320
Speaker 1: But it hurts. And more than it hurting me, it's

2138
02:02:42,360 --> 02:02:44,400
Speaker 1: like watching how it affects our ranch, you know, like

2139
02:02:45,840 --> 02:02:48,080
Speaker 1: like watching like if you ever have been around a

2140
02:02:48,120 --> 02:02:49,960
Speaker 1: big ranch and a lot of livestock, like things need

2141
02:02:50,640 --> 02:02:53,680
Speaker 1: put down and and and shot. And to not have

2142
02:02:53,840 --> 02:02:56,360
Speaker 1: that tool as a ranchers like a doctor not having

2143
02:02:56,400 --> 02:02:59,320
Speaker 1: a scalpel, and the things I see my brother have

2144
02:02:59,440 --> 02:03:02,960
Speaker 1: to do. Um it, man, it kills me. That hurts

2145
02:03:02,960 --> 02:03:05,520
Speaker 1: my heart because like those he cares about his animals

2146
02:03:05,560 --> 02:03:08,640
Speaker 1: more than anybody I know and like to look something

2147
02:03:08,720 --> 02:03:11,640
Speaker 1: in the eye and cut its throat with a knife. Dude,

2148
02:03:11,680 --> 02:03:15,520
Speaker 1: that's personal. Man, Like that hurts. And for one instance,

2149
02:03:15,640 --> 02:03:18,520
Speaker 1: like he had this pig he loved, man, he loved

2150
02:03:18,520 --> 02:03:21,160
Speaker 1: this pig, Peaches. It was Peach's mom. We have Peaches

2151
02:03:21,200 --> 02:03:23,360
Speaker 1: two or three now, but Peach's mom. She was she

2152
02:03:23,480 --> 02:03:26,280
Speaker 1: was just like a family pet. Lived under the little

2153
02:03:26,360 --> 02:03:29,920
Speaker 1: shelter out there under the by the house. And he

2154
02:03:30,040 --> 02:03:32,760
Speaker 1: had a bunch of little piglets, cute little piglets. A

2155
02:03:32,840 --> 02:03:37,120
Speaker 1: bunch of straw is in the winter, and uh, all

2156
02:03:37,160 --> 02:03:40,160
Speaker 1: then little piglets were under there is cold. Well, get

2157
02:03:40,200 --> 02:03:43,120
Speaker 1: a heat lamp in there, and somehow a bunch of

2158
02:03:43,240 --> 02:03:45,560
Speaker 1: some straw got pushed up against that lamp started on fire,

2159
02:03:47,960 --> 02:03:52,680
Speaker 1: and that fire started and he's like he didn't you know,

2160
02:03:52,760 --> 02:03:54,000
Speaker 1: he had to go out there. He saved a couple

2161
02:03:54,040 --> 02:03:56,880
Speaker 1: of the piglets, but he had to like sit there

2162
02:03:56,920 --> 02:03:59,800
Speaker 1: and watch that pig burn and hear it burns. Something

2163
02:04:00,200 --> 02:04:04,080
Speaker 1: that he loved burned because he couldn't put a bullet

2164
02:04:04,120 --> 02:04:09,640
Speaker 1: in it, you know, and like, man, that was tough. Yeah,

2165
02:04:09,880 --> 02:04:13,800
Speaker 1: I mean I don't have all that to say, yeah,

2166
02:04:13,920 --> 02:04:17,040
Speaker 1: but I mean it's just like I just I one.

2167
02:04:17,160 --> 02:04:19,520
Speaker 1: Here's one thing I will say is that this story,

2168
02:04:20,040 --> 02:04:21,360
Speaker 1: you can't find a lot of people that are willing

2169
02:04:21,360 --> 02:04:23,560
Speaker 1: to talk like you're talking right now, man, Like, so

2170
02:04:23,680 --> 02:04:25,560
Speaker 1: you've got a lot of courage, even in this moment

2171
02:04:26,280 --> 02:04:29,200
Speaker 1: in front of a microphone with headphones on, to talk

2172
02:04:29,240 --> 02:04:31,280
Speaker 1: about it. So like it's it's so folks that are

2173
02:04:31,360 --> 02:04:33,400
Speaker 1: listening to this, you take what you want from it.

2174
02:04:33,840 --> 02:04:37,200
Speaker 1: Marx lived it, so it doesn't matter. But like, at

2175
02:04:37,280 --> 02:04:41,240
Speaker 1: some level, there's I don't think I could find another

2176
02:04:41,280 --> 02:04:43,320
Speaker 1: person that's willing to sit here say I got a

2177
02:04:43,360 --> 02:04:45,160
Speaker 1: felony and this is what the story was, and this

2178
02:04:45,280 --> 02:04:47,120
Speaker 1: is how I feel, and this is how I got

2179
02:04:47,200 --> 02:04:52,040
Speaker 1: up off the mat. Yeah, it's it's been something that

2180
02:04:52,160 --> 02:04:54,080
Speaker 1: I've been ashamed of. You know. It's like it's like

2181
02:04:54,120 --> 02:04:56,800
Speaker 1: the elephant in the room, right, Like people are like,

2182
02:04:57,160 --> 02:05:01,360
Speaker 1: what about Carter? Like, but it is what it is,

2183
02:05:01,480 --> 02:05:05,760
Speaker 1: man Like, that's look at where your life is, man,

2184
02:05:06,400 --> 02:05:08,680
Speaker 1: I mean I look at where you are. And that's

2185
02:05:08,720 --> 02:05:11,960
Speaker 1: the thing about this experience is I wouldn't take it back.

2186
02:05:12,520 --> 02:05:15,160
Speaker 1: As as hard as messed up as it was, Like,

2187
02:05:15,240 --> 02:05:17,560
Speaker 1: I would not take that back because I wouldn't be

2188
02:05:17,600 --> 02:05:18,800
Speaker 1: where I am. I don't even think i'd be a

2189
02:05:18,880 --> 02:05:21,960
Speaker 1: pro snowboarder. Dude. This experience lit a fire in me

2190
02:05:22,160 --> 02:05:25,480
Speaker 1: like I've never I never felt. I was like, oh,

2191
02:05:26,880 --> 02:05:30,240
Speaker 1: prioritize my life and got my ship together and like

2192
02:05:30,440 --> 02:05:32,040
Speaker 1: went after it because I was like, dude, it can

2193
02:05:32,120 --> 02:05:35,360
Speaker 1: be over. Like boom, I have my freedom. Like I

2194
02:05:35,440 --> 02:05:37,760
Speaker 1: had all these problems before this, and then there was

2195
02:05:37,880 --> 02:05:40,120
Speaker 1: one problem I was worried about, and that was my freedom.

2196
02:05:40,160 --> 02:05:42,480
Speaker 1: Man Like, when you have your freedom stripped, when you're

2197
02:05:42,520 --> 02:05:46,280
Speaker 1: like I don't. I'm not free to roam anymore. Like, man,

2198
02:05:46,560 --> 02:05:48,640
Speaker 1: I was like, this is crazy, and I was like,

2199
02:05:48,720 --> 02:05:51,200
Speaker 1: yet busy living and dude, I chased it, but I

2200
02:05:51,240 --> 02:05:53,360
Speaker 1: did it on my terms. I was like, I'm not

2201
02:05:53,480 --> 02:05:57,520
Speaker 1: listening to anybody. I have thicker skin now from digging

2202
02:05:57,560 --> 02:06:01,280
Speaker 1: a beating from those newspapers constantly, can only constantly seeing

2203
02:06:01,360 --> 02:06:03,040
Speaker 1: that back and forth. And I just look at these

2204
02:06:03,080 --> 02:06:04,960
Speaker 1: I mean they painted you in like a bad light,

2205
02:06:05,040 --> 02:06:07,760
Speaker 1: and a lot of them man like, well, this's the media.

2206
02:06:07,880 --> 02:06:10,280
Speaker 1: But we talked about the media and the names largest

2207
02:06:10,360 --> 02:06:13,080
Speaker 1: poaching case and like they even used a quote in

2208
02:06:13,160 --> 02:06:15,960
Speaker 1: this one. Um you get down here from one of

2209
02:06:16,120 --> 02:06:19,920
Speaker 1: the uh investigators and he's like he says, I don't worry,

2210
02:06:20,000 --> 02:06:23,120
Speaker 1: but statistically it's a pretty dangerous job. Everybody we deal

2211
02:06:23,240 --> 02:06:26,560
Speaker 1: with has a gun. And it's like it's just they're

2212
02:06:26,560 --> 02:06:28,960
Speaker 1: trying to paint you in a way. That's this man,

2213
02:06:29,000 --> 02:06:33,000
Speaker 1: they painted it. And uh, yeah, I appreciate you know,

2214
02:06:33,160 --> 02:06:35,400
Speaker 1: being on this on this this platform, be able to

2215
02:06:35,440 --> 02:06:37,360
Speaker 1: talk about because I honestly I've never talked about it.

2216
02:06:37,600 --> 02:06:39,840
Speaker 1: Yeah you know, well listen, like I said, I think

2217
02:06:40,480 --> 02:06:44,360
Speaker 1: when when there's there's a symptom which a lot of

2218
02:06:44,400 --> 02:06:46,320
Speaker 1: times is very justified. Like the way you're poaching it

2219
02:06:46,360 --> 02:06:50,760
Speaker 1: to me is is understandable anything. You know your family,

2220
02:06:50,840 --> 02:06:52,960
Speaker 1: you know the people that you are, and when you're

2221
02:06:52,960 --> 02:06:55,240
Speaker 1: telling me the story, I know that you know in

2222
02:06:55,320 --> 02:06:58,200
Speaker 1: your heart like, these are good people and they did

2223
02:06:58,240 --> 02:07:01,240
Speaker 1: a thing they shouldn't have done. And to be constantly

2224
02:07:01,320 --> 02:07:05,760
Speaker 1: forced to rationalize good people being punished in the way

2225
02:07:05,840 --> 02:07:07,880
Speaker 1: that they were is. I know that's a tough thing.

2226
02:07:07,920 --> 02:07:09,920
Speaker 1: And I know you have you want to, you have

2227
02:07:10,160 --> 02:07:12,760
Speaker 1: to say we deserved it because you broke the law

2228
02:07:13,200 --> 02:07:16,440
Speaker 1: I did. But it's not that simple. There's layers. There's

2229
02:07:16,520 --> 02:07:18,680
Speaker 1: layers too, and I think that's something that I've seen

2230
02:07:18,760 --> 02:07:22,240
Speaker 1: through other folks I've known that have had issues UM

2231
02:07:22,520 --> 02:07:25,360
Speaker 1: and the public's fear. People want to they want to

2232
02:07:25,400 --> 02:07:27,280
Speaker 1: knock you down, they want to take you down, and

2233
02:07:27,400 --> 02:07:29,640
Speaker 1: and and again, I would say, look, if I do

2234
02:07:29,800 --> 02:07:32,400
Speaker 1: something wrong, I'll I hope I approach it the way

2235
02:07:32,480 --> 02:07:35,760
Speaker 1: you did and say, hey, I knew this was wrong

2236
02:07:35,880 --> 02:07:37,720
Speaker 1: and I did it anyway, and now I have to

2237
02:07:37,800 --> 02:07:40,480
Speaker 1: face the consequences and learn from it. You know, hopefully

2238
02:07:40,520 --> 02:07:44,400
Speaker 1: the consequences are leveled. Actually need to be held accountable.

2239
02:07:45,240 --> 02:07:48,040
Speaker 1: You know, I think it's important, but I think we

2240
02:07:48,160 --> 02:07:50,960
Speaker 1: need to hold our peers accountable, like our friends accountable,

2241
02:07:51,480 --> 02:07:55,120
Speaker 1: and I think nothing ever changes when somebody you don't

2242
02:07:55,160 --> 02:07:58,680
Speaker 1: respect or care about is like attacking you, but when

2243
02:07:58,720 --> 02:08:01,440
Speaker 1: your friends are like speaking to you with honestly, like yo, dude,

2244
02:08:01,480 --> 02:08:03,200
Speaker 1: that was kind of messed up, Like you shouldn't do that,

2245
02:08:03,200 --> 02:08:06,120
Speaker 1: ship like calling you out, like whether it be in

2246
02:08:06,200 --> 02:08:09,280
Speaker 1: your work environment or your personal environment, Like I really

2247
02:08:09,360 --> 02:08:11,200
Speaker 1: respect somebody that comes up to me. It's like, dude,

2248
02:08:11,240 --> 02:08:13,760
Speaker 1: you like that's how to that's out of line. Man,

2249
02:08:13,840 --> 02:08:15,080
Speaker 1: Like I'm just gonna call you out on that, and

2250
02:08:15,120 --> 02:08:16,840
Speaker 1: then you're gonna be like think about that because you

2251
02:08:16,920 --> 02:08:19,440
Speaker 1: respect that personally. I think there needs to be more

2252
02:08:19,520 --> 02:08:23,520
Speaker 1: of that and not afraid to like cross that line,

2253
02:08:23,520 --> 02:08:25,320
Speaker 1: because I think that's a line that needs to be crossed.

2254
02:08:25,400 --> 02:08:28,640
Speaker 1: If somebody's out of line, man, like put the core

2255
02:08:28,720 --> 02:08:32,480
Speaker 1: tenet of of my lifestyle, like respecting wildlife, respecting the land,

2256
02:08:33,040 --> 02:08:36,320
Speaker 1: and anybody crosses that line, and they're gonna hear it,

2257
02:08:36,640 --> 02:08:39,720
Speaker 1: right and they need to. But as long as they

2258
02:08:39,840 --> 02:08:43,440
Speaker 1: like acknowledge and are accountable, I mean, man, there's room

2259
02:08:43,520 --> 02:08:46,200
Speaker 1: for forgiveness too. That's a beautiful thing about humans. Well

2260
02:08:46,200 --> 02:08:48,200
Speaker 1: you've earned it, Like you're sponsored by the north Face,

2261
02:08:48,600 --> 02:08:50,960
Speaker 1: sponsored by Yeddie, You're sponsored by these companies that have

2262
02:08:51,080 --> 02:08:53,720
Speaker 1: everything to lose by bringing a fellon onto their team.

2263
02:08:54,480 --> 02:08:57,680
Speaker 1: And listen, I was there, I worked there. I understand

2264
02:08:59,000 --> 02:09:02,360
Speaker 1: those relationships. Those relationships. It's it's either it's a zero

2265
02:09:02,440 --> 02:09:04,520
Speaker 1: some game. It's very much either it's all good for

2266
02:09:04,600 --> 02:09:08,640
Speaker 1: the company, or it's not going to happen, it doesn't continue.

2267
02:09:08,760 --> 02:09:11,480
Speaker 1: I mean, man, it was like it was crazy, the hate,

2268
02:09:11,600 --> 02:09:14,600
Speaker 1: Like you couldn't read the comments, like people just like, oh,

2269
02:09:14,720 --> 02:09:17,400
Speaker 1: they should all be killed, Like I mean crazy, I

2270
02:09:17,440 --> 02:09:21,840
Speaker 1: don't read the comments because it's just this this no

2271
02:09:22,040 --> 02:09:25,880
Speaker 1: consequence for your actions, like if you say that online,

2272
02:09:26,240 --> 02:09:30,120
Speaker 1: this cowardly platform where there's no consequences. And I think

2273
02:09:30,160 --> 02:09:32,360
Speaker 1: that's the problem today is people can just say things

2274
02:09:32,480 --> 02:09:34,680
Speaker 1: Like where I grew up, man, like if you said

2275
02:09:34,760 --> 02:09:36,920
Speaker 1: something to somebody like there was consequences, there was no

2276
02:09:37,040 --> 02:09:38,720
Speaker 1: running from it, like you had to stand toe to

2277
02:09:38,800 --> 02:09:41,680
Speaker 1: toe and you're like did you say that? And that

2278
02:09:41,800 --> 02:09:44,600
Speaker 1: just doesn't happen anymore. Like, man, I had, you know,

2279
02:09:44,640 --> 02:09:46,360
Speaker 1: a couple of projects come out and I had people

2280
02:09:46,440 --> 02:09:51,800
Speaker 1: calling my sponsors, government agencies calling my sponsors telling them

2281
02:09:52,640 --> 02:09:55,600
Speaker 1: after I had paid my dues done everything that they

2282
02:09:55,640 --> 02:09:59,080
Speaker 1: wanted me to do. I got these guys calling my

2283
02:09:59,200 --> 02:10:01,800
Speaker 1: sponsors and tell own them how bad of a guy

2284
02:10:01,920 --> 02:10:06,800
Speaker 1: I am, and getting cut from sponsors because these guys

2285
02:10:06,840 --> 02:10:09,720
Speaker 1: that I just bowed down to and did any everything

2286
02:10:09,800 --> 02:10:12,640
Speaker 1: they wanted me to do, I still had the power

2287
02:10:12,840 --> 02:10:16,120
Speaker 1: and control over my career and that that pissed me off.

2288
02:10:16,360 --> 02:10:19,320
Speaker 1: I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, We're not done here,

2289
02:10:19,520 --> 02:10:21,200
Speaker 1: Like we're still We're gonna still gonna do this, like

2290
02:10:21,800 --> 02:10:23,760
Speaker 1: I have no leverage and there was nothing I could do,

2291
02:10:24,400 --> 02:10:26,320
Speaker 1: but I just took it. Man. I just watched these

2292
02:10:26,360 --> 02:10:29,000
Speaker 1: sponsors fall off. There's like there, oh, there go some

2293
02:10:29,040 --> 02:10:31,920
Speaker 1: more revenue. Awesome, thank you, thank you? What more do

2294
02:10:31,960 --> 02:10:33,680
Speaker 1: you want for me? You know? Did you feel at

2295
02:10:33,680 --> 02:10:36,440
Speaker 1: any moment that that maybe this wasn't redeemable, like maybe

2296
02:10:36,520 --> 02:10:39,000
Speaker 1: you couldn't get it back? Was there everybody like a

2297
02:10:39,120 --> 02:10:41,480
Speaker 1: low moment where you're like, dude, that I may never

2298
02:10:42,480 --> 02:10:44,800
Speaker 1: I got I guess if I didn't. It got to

2299
02:10:44,880 --> 02:10:46,960
Speaker 1: where I didn't care if I got all that back.

2300
02:10:47,440 --> 02:10:49,240
Speaker 1: I just wanted to continue to live the life that

2301
02:10:49,320 --> 02:10:52,839
Speaker 1: I believed in and that was where I found freedom.

2302
02:10:53,480 --> 02:10:55,360
Speaker 1: And then it all came kind of back around. You know.

2303
02:10:55,480 --> 02:10:58,040
Speaker 1: I just I gave up the paychecks. I gave up

2304
02:10:58,160 --> 02:11:02,640
Speaker 1: like carrying chase, whatever the industry told me I needed

2305
02:11:02,680 --> 02:11:05,120
Speaker 1: to do. Because I was a controversial subject within the

2306
02:11:05,120 --> 02:11:08,680
Speaker 1: snowboard industry. Everybody's kind of like Carter over, Carter over here,

2307
02:11:08,720 --> 02:11:12,120
Speaker 1: you is some poaching redneck from from Wyoming, And of

2308
02:11:12,200 --> 02:11:14,720
Speaker 1: course they would like generalize me into that, into that box.

2309
02:11:14,840 --> 02:11:18,120
Speaker 1: They didn't know that, you know, my past, you know,

2310
02:11:18,200 --> 02:11:20,680
Speaker 1: and I think that's a dangerous thing. So when all

2311
02:11:20,720 --> 02:11:22,880
Speaker 1: these things are going down in our society and all

2312
02:11:22,920 --> 02:11:25,520
Speaker 1: these things, like I can really like I can kind

2313
02:11:25,560 --> 02:11:27,440
Speaker 1: of relate to some things. You know. I know what

2314
02:11:27,560 --> 02:11:30,000
Speaker 1: it's like to be stripped of your freedoms. I know

2315
02:11:30,080 --> 02:11:35,320
Speaker 1: what it's like to be just no control, just zero control.

2316
02:11:35,360 --> 02:11:38,080
Speaker 1: But it's like how you respond to this, Like are

2317
02:11:38,160 --> 02:11:40,640
Speaker 1: you are am I gonna make this my identity gonna

2318
02:11:40,680 --> 02:11:42,880
Speaker 1: Am I gonna be a victim here? Or am I

2319
02:11:43,040 --> 02:11:45,480
Speaker 1: just be like I'm gonna use that ship as fuel. Man,

2320
02:11:45,560 --> 02:11:48,120
Speaker 1: I'm gonna like stand up, I'm gonna work my ass off,

2321
02:11:48,120 --> 02:11:52,080
Speaker 1: I'm gonna like my my mentality was like I want

2322
02:11:52,080 --> 02:11:55,640
Speaker 1: to anybody that hated and like called me and tried

2323
02:11:55,720 --> 02:11:57,640
Speaker 1: to like hold me down, I'm gonna show them in

2324
02:11:57,720 --> 02:12:00,560
Speaker 1: like five years that like they were all wrong here.

2325
02:12:00,560 --> 02:12:03,800
Speaker 1: I am like everybody's like Carde Cardridge, temporary man, like

2326
02:12:03,840 --> 02:12:06,960
Speaker 1: snowboard industry. I was already like an underdog with like

2327
02:12:07,120 --> 02:12:09,480
Speaker 1: my background. Nobody has a rancher in snowboarding. Like it

2328
02:12:09,600 --> 02:12:13,080
Speaker 1: wasn't cool, dude, Like it was not cool. They're like this, dude,

2329
02:12:13,360 --> 02:12:15,600
Speaker 1: let's this cook over here. And I was like, listen,

2330
02:12:15,920 --> 02:12:17,240
Speaker 1: I grew up in the mountains. I grew up in

2331
02:12:17,480 --> 02:12:20,360
Speaker 1: the nature, Like this is this is my this is

2332
02:12:20,480 --> 02:12:22,800
Speaker 1: my ship, and I'm gonna show you guys, this is

2333
02:12:22,840 --> 02:12:25,400
Speaker 1: my ship and I live it every day. I live

2334
02:12:25,440 --> 02:12:26,840
Speaker 1: in the dirt, I live in the mounds, I live

2335
02:12:26,880 --> 02:12:30,000
Speaker 1: in the winter, and um yeah, man, I just trying

2336
02:12:30,040 --> 02:12:33,720
Speaker 1: to like keep that, keep that going. Look Like, in

2337
02:12:33,800 --> 02:12:37,440
Speaker 1: a lot of ways, our society functions on stories, right,

2338
02:12:37,720 --> 02:12:40,600
Speaker 1: and and as somebody who writes stories and thinks about

2339
02:12:40,680 --> 02:12:42,680
Speaker 1: stories and how to tell stories, you don't tell a

2340
02:12:42,720 --> 02:12:45,880
Speaker 1: story that doesn't have it doesn't have a triumph, and

2341
02:12:46,080 --> 02:12:49,400
Speaker 1: it doesn't have an ultimate challenge doesn't have a protagonist

2342
02:12:49,480 --> 02:12:51,680
Speaker 1: and an antagonist. You don't tell a good story. You

2343
02:12:51,720 --> 02:12:55,000
Speaker 1: don't tell a flat, happy story to people to compel them.

2344
02:12:55,040 --> 02:12:58,080
Speaker 1: You don't turn on Netflix and watch somebody's happy life.

2345
02:12:58,640 --> 02:13:01,160
Speaker 1: You watch people go through ship and being perfect and

2346
02:13:01,600 --> 02:13:05,720
Speaker 1: come out of it. And that's what makes life compelling, right,

2347
02:13:06,000 --> 02:13:11,680
Speaker 1: I mean, man, like that that that's suffering and just

2348
02:13:11,840 --> 02:13:15,160
Speaker 1: that hurt and like that's so it sucks at the time,

2349
02:13:15,240 --> 02:13:17,480
Speaker 1: but man, that's the best thing for you. That builds character.

2350
02:13:18,840 --> 02:13:21,080
Speaker 1: I got a lot of character. I was gonna say, yeah,

2351
02:13:21,120 --> 02:13:26,360
Speaker 1: you're not You're not gonna beating, like, but my dad, like,

2352
02:13:26,520 --> 02:13:28,600
Speaker 1: you know, I think it comes back to the ranch. Man. Like,

2353
02:13:29,280 --> 02:13:31,800
Speaker 1: it wasn't my first beating. Maybe it was like that

2354
02:13:32,000 --> 02:13:34,120
Speaker 1: and it was like traumatic, but it was not my

2355
02:13:34,200 --> 02:13:36,360
Speaker 1: first beating. I was like, okay, so what we do.

2356
02:13:37,040 --> 02:13:39,040
Speaker 1: But I mean it prioritizes my family and made me

2357
02:13:39,080 --> 02:13:41,120
Speaker 1: appreciate everything I have. I was like, listen, I could

2358
02:13:41,160 --> 02:13:42,920
Speaker 1: lose all this ship tomorrow. As long as I do

2359
02:13:43,160 --> 02:13:45,240
Speaker 1: lose my freedom and as long as I have my family,

2360
02:13:45,720 --> 02:13:48,920
Speaker 1: it's gonna be all good. You know. So everything passed

2361
02:13:48,960 --> 02:13:51,520
Speaker 1: that's been a bonus. So it's like it's a good dude. Well,

2362
02:13:51,600 --> 02:13:54,360
Speaker 1: it's like after taking all that time trying to battle

2363
02:13:54,480 --> 02:13:57,040
Speaker 1: just to understand, like am I going to have freedom?

2364
02:13:57,680 --> 02:14:00,760
Speaker 1: And then like maybe achieving the ultimate freedom towards knowing that,

2365
02:14:00,880 --> 02:14:03,280
Speaker 1: like here's the real priority, Like I had to I

2366
02:14:03,360 --> 02:14:08,480
Speaker 1: had to face certain prison. That's a weird thought, dude.

2367
02:14:08,800 --> 02:14:10,480
Speaker 1: I would just say, like, I know, I've been hanging

2368
02:14:10,520 --> 02:14:12,880
Speaker 1: out with you, dude, You're normal, dude, you're good dude, Like,

2369
02:14:14,160 --> 02:14:16,880
Speaker 1: and you were facing prison time from the federal government. Man,

2370
02:14:17,000 --> 02:14:20,280
Speaker 1: you know, and they're passed. Man, they're pissed. And look again,

2371
02:14:20,720 --> 02:14:22,200
Speaker 1: I know how it is in our commutey and the

2372
02:14:22,240 --> 02:14:26,840
Speaker 1: hunting community. People people are rightly stripped of things when

2373
02:14:26,880 --> 02:14:29,040
Speaker 1: they do things wrong. They're right at least. So if I,

2374
02:14:29,200 --> 02:14:31,440
Speaker 1: you know, if I did if I did what you did,

2375
02:14:31,480 --> 02:14:33,160
Speaker 1: I'd be stripped of a lot of things right and

2376
02:14:33,280 --> 02:14:36,200
Speaker 1: rightly rightfully so and as well as you were. Um,

2377
02:14:36,680 --> 02:14:39,960
Speaker 1: but there's there's there's always a butt to People don't

2378
02:14:40,000 --> 02:14:42,320
Speaker 1: deserve to get a race from the plan. No, we

2379
02:14:42,400 --> 02:14:44,800
Speaker 1: can move on. Like if people are like I say,

2380
02:14:44,840 --> 02:14:49,800
Speaker 1: accountable and and understand, like they admit their guilt, they

2381
02:14:49,880 --> 02:14:53,880
Speaker 1: stand up and they stand there like that's what I did. Man, Like, well,

2382
02:14:54,000 --> 02:14:56,240
Speaker 1: why not forgive like I want to here you are

2383
02:14:56,360 --> 02:14:57,800
Speaker 1: right now, sit here in this one how many years?

2384
02:14:57,920 --> 02:15:00,120
Speaker 1: How many years are going by? Not that? Man's like

2385
02:15:00,680 --> 02:15:02,320
Speaker 1: I think I had sentenced in two thousand and twelve,

2386
02:15:03,240 --> 02:15:08,680
Speaker 1: eight years, eight years. Man sucks not having guns bullshit,

2387
02:15:09,080 --> 02:15:11,840
Speaker 1: And that's you have to get a presidential pardon, correct too,

2388
02:15:13,080 --> 02:15:15,640
Speaker 1: I think so. I mean, I just you know, I

2389
02:15:15,720 --> 02:15:19,760
Speaker 1: just I don't know, man, Like I can't even vote, dude,

2390
02:15:20,360 --> 02:15:24,720
Speaker 1: I can talk to the president. You just feel like

2391
02:15:24,760 --> 02:15:28,280
Speaker 1: that's it. Man, that's well. I I've accepted it, you know,

2392
02:15:28,520 --> 02:15:30,560
Speaker 1: and if like something changed, that would be amazing. I

2393
02:15:30,600 --> 02:15:32,520
Speaker 1: would love to see my my my old man as

2394
02:15:32,680 --> 02:15:37,040
Speaker 1: my brother get our guns back. But dude, like honestly archery,

2395
02:15:37,320 --> 02:15:39,640
Speaker 1: like being able to hunt like that was the first

2396
02:15:39,680 --> 02:15:42,800
Speaker 1: time when Dudley took me out last spring with that

2397
02:15:42,920 --> 02:15:44,760
Speaker 1: new bow he built me and took me to Oklahoma

2398
02:15:44,920 --> 02:15:47,480
Speaker 1: and I hunted hogs with him, and I shot a

2399
02:15:47,560 --> 02:15:50,240
Speaker 1: bore Like I didn't realize how much I missed that

2400
02:15:50,280 --> 02:15:52,040
Speaker 1: and how much that meant to me. And and he

2401
02:15:52,200 --> 02:15:54,200
Speaker 1: never judged me, he didn't look at me like I

2402
02:15:54,400 --> 02:15:59,320
Speaker 1: was just like this, like tarnished human being. He's just like,

2403
02:15:59,440 --> 02:16:02,400
Speaker 1: oh yeah, man, I think you're cool. Like it's just

2404
02:16:02,640 --> 02:16:05,160
Speaker 1: you know, it was like to go and get back

2405
02:16:05,240 --> 02:16:07,240
Speaker 1: into hunting and be out there. It was like such

2406
02:16:07,360 --> 02:16:10,600
Speaker 1: kind of like a rejuvenating thing for me. Was that

2407
02:16:10,720 --> 02:16:12,720
Speaker 1: something you were kind of worried about, dude, I was

2408
02:16:12,880 --> 02:16:15,600
Speaker 1: so worried about that, Like even after your your rights

2409
02:16:15,640 --> 02:16:17,680
Speaker 1: came back and you could go hunting again. Where was

2410
02:16:17,680 --> 02:16:20,520
Speaker 1: it something you just avoided because judgment? Man, Like, who

2411
02:16:20,600 --> 02:16:23,600
Speaker 1: wants to be judged? Let's be especially in the hunting community.

2412
02:16:23,600 --> 02:16:27,560
Speaker 1: I mean, this is like a controversial topic, and I'm

2413
02:16:27,600 --> 02:16:30,120
Speaker 1: sure there's a lot of people are like that guy sucks.

2414
02:16:30,280 --> 02:16:32,000
Speaker 1: There's a lot of people get mad at me. But

2415
02:16:32,680 --> 02:16:34,840
Speaker 1: I get and I get that, and I like I've

2416
02:16:34,879 --> 02:16:36,960
Speaker 1: had like I've had experiences and when we were talking

2417
02:16:36,959 --> 02:16:39,440
Speaker 1: about this, we were hunting. Man, It's just like people,

2418
02:16:41,360 --> 02:16:43,720
Speaker 1: I hate to generalize like this, but like there is

2419
02:16:43,760 --> 02:16:45,920
Speaker 1: this there is a portion of people that want to

2420
02:16:46,000 --> 02:16:50,879
Speaker 1: knock folks down and keep them down and and listen,

2421
02:16:50,920 --> 02:16:52,880
Speaker 1: I get the anger. I get that I'm doing it

2422
02:16:52,959 --> 02:16:55,560
Speaker 1: the right way and this guy didn't. How we just

2423
02:16:55,560 --> 02:16:59,080
Speaker 1: should never celebrate him again. I get that feeling. But

2424
02:16:59,240 --> 02:17:00,920
Speaker 1: I met you, and I know you what I'm talking

2425
02:17:00,959 --> 02:17:02,720
Speaker 1: to you, and I'm seeing you sit across from me

2426
02:17:02,840 --> 02:17:06,280
Speaker 1: like bearing everything for for what you know. There's nothing

2427
02:17:06,320 --> 02:17:07,760
Speaker 1: for you to game from sitting here talking to me.

2428
02:17:09,640 --> 02:17:12,560
Speaker 1: There's nothing and so but yet you're doing it right

2429
02:17:13,120 --> 02:17:16,520
Speaker 1: And so that show's character. Yeah, I mean I got

2430
02:17:16,640 --> 02:17:19,520
Speaker 1: lots of it. I can look at it like no

2431
02:17:19,640 --> 02:17:21,840
Speaker 1: matter what you've done, or what I've done, or definitely

2432
02:17:21,879 --> 02:17:23,560
Speaker 1: what Joe has done for guard holding us this week,

2433
02:17:23,760 --> 02:17:27,920
Speaker 1: like we're not going to judge him kicking rocks, kicking rocks.

2434
02:17:28,040 --> 02:17:30,360
Speaker 1: But but I think like when you can look at

2435
02:17:30,400 --> 02:17:32,880
Speaker 1: somebody and they can say to you, listen, man, this

2436
02:17:33,080 --> 02:17:34,760
Speaker 1: is my story, this is my life, this is what

2437
02:17:34,920 --> 02:17:38,240
Speaker 1: I did. I fucked up. It's it's it's awful. But

2438
02:17:38,320 --> 02:17:40,240
Speaker 1: then you can laugh with them and learn about their

2439
02:17:40,320 --> 02:17:42,760
Speaker 1: life and their successes and the other things in their

2440
02:17:42,800 --> 02:17:46,480
Speaker 1: life that balance out the ship. What's more, what's more

2441
02:17:46,600 --> 02:17:49,880
Speaker 1: like human? What's more man? It's it's relatable and in

2442
02:17:50,000 --> 02:17:52,879
Speaker 1: some sense I agree, I agree. I mean, everybody's faced

2443
02:17:52,920 --> 02:17:57,199
Speaker 1: their hardships whatever degree that maybe, but it's like stand

2444
02:17:57,280 --> 02:17:59,560
Speaker 1: up man, like, don't let them keep you down. They

2445
02:17:59,600 --> 02:18:01,720
Speaker 1: want to keep down. It's the easiest thing to do. Like,

2446
02:18:01,800 --> 02:18:05,320
Speaker 1: but people I understand, man, Like people are pissed. People

2447
02:18:05,320 --> 02:18:07,520
Speaker 1: are pissed, like what's going on? People want to like

2448
02:18:08,160 --> 02:18:10,920
Speaker 1: they want to they don't know what to do. It's

2449
02:18:10,959 --> 02:18:14,200
Speaker 1: like lost, man, It's like, you know, what you could

2450
02:18:14,200 --> 02:18:16,040
Speaker 1: do is just like be kind, put yourself in other

2451
02:18:16,080 --> 02:18:19,800
Speaker 1: people's shoes, think about what they're thinking, why they think

2452
02:18:19,879 --> 02:18:24,360
Speaker 1: that way, Respect one another, you know, like help your neighbor.

2453
02:18:24,440 --> 02:18:27,440
Speaker 1: Like if somebody doesn't you know, if there's a complete

2454
02:18:27,480 --> 02:18:31,440
Speaker 1: opposite so diverse in this world, like help them if

2455
02:18:31,440 --> 02:18:33,000
Speaker 1: you don't think they'd like you, that's more of the

2456
02:18:33,040 --> 02:18:34,640
Speaker 1: reason to go up and be like, hey, man, how

2457
02:18:34,720 --> 02:18:37,520
Speaker 1: you donna smile? How are you doing day? Man? Like, yeah,

2458
02:18:37,720 --> 02:18:40,760
Speaker 1: it doesn't cost a penny to be nice, dude, I

2459
02:18:40,800 --> 02:18:42,520
Speaker 1: don't know. Well for you to go through all that,

2460
02:18:42,800 --> 02:18:44,800
Speaker 1: you know, and again it's like going through it as

2461
02:18:44,840 --> 02:18:47,080
Speaker 1: a turn. You went through it, happen, you did something wrong,

2462
02:18:47,280 --> 02:18:49,480
Speaker 1: you got pinched, took it, you took it. Here you

2463
02:18:49,520 --> 02:18:52,600
Speaker 1: go and then come out on the other edge of page.

2464
02:18:52,600 --> 02:18:54,000
Speaker 1: You do. Come out on the other end like hey,

2465
02:18:54,200 --> 02:18:57,720
Speaker 1: positivities the way and not like funk the government. You know, like, hey, man,

2466
02:18:57,800 --> 02:19:00,560
Speaker 1: I don't hear you're saying that. What are you gonna do? Man?

2467
02:19:00,600 --> 02:19:04,240
Speaker 1: It's positivity, you know, And like I generalizing things like

2468
02:19:05,000 --> 02:19:10,920
Speaker 1: is dangerous, Like there's bad there's bad eggs and every carton.

2469
02:19:11,680 --> 02:19:15,400
Speaker 1: But to say one carton is bad just because of

2470
02:19:15,480 --> 02:19:18,800
Speaker 1: what they are, like, that's that's not right. And I

2471
02:19:18,879 --> 02:19:21,039
Speaker 1: think there's great people in the government. You know, there's

2472
02:19:21,040 --> 02:19:23,040
Speaker 1: people that care in the government. Are there people that

2473
02:19:23,160 --> 02:19:26,800
Speaker 1: don't care? And are all there some duds? Yeah, lots

2474
02:19:26,840 --> 02:19:31,720
Speaker 1: of them. But like, man, we're all human, dude, Like

2475
02:19:31,800 --> 02:19:34,120
Speaker 1: whatever pistons you are, it's just like seeing each other

2476
02:19:34,200 --> 02:19:36,760
Speaker 1: as humans, you know. I'm just like acknowledging that we're

2477
02:19:36,800 --> 02:19:39,800
Speaker 1: all on the same team. Dude. Yeah, I mean, listen,

2478
02:19:41,360 --> 02:19:44,680
Speaker 1: no matter what it's it, no matter what else it is,

2479
02:19:44,840 --> 02:19:46,920
Speaker 1: no wonder what else your like life and story is

2480
02:19:47,400 --> 02:19:50,240
Speaker 1: what you just told is powerful, Like, no matter what

2481
02:19:50,400 --> 02:19:53,200
Speaker 1: it is other than that, powerful people if you really

2482
02:19:53,280 --> 02:19:56,520
Speaker 1: listen to it and take it in. Mark sitting here

2483
02:19:56,560 --> 02:19:59,200
Speaker 1: just bearing all this and laying all this out there, man,

2484
02:20:00,160 --> 02:20:03,560
Speaker 1: But which Peaches I had a better end? Yeah? Yeah,

2485
02:20:03,680 --> 02:20:06,200
Speaker 1: she has a bad deal. A bad deal. But I

2486
02:20:06,280 --> 02:20:08,440
Speaker 1: mean that's one thing to back about to the ranch.

2487
02:20:08,520 --> 02:20:13,600
Speaker 1: It's like, man, like nothing new about death. My death

2488
02:20:13,720 --> 02:20:17,560
Speaker 1: is that's the only guarantee. Like we're all gonna die,

2489
02:20:17,800 --> 02:20:21,240
Speaker 1: like animals die, like being on the branch, like understanding that,

2490
02:20:22,000 --> 02:20:24,680
Speaker 1: and that's really like what made me. I don't want

2491
02:20:24,720 --> 02:20:27,080
Speaker 1: to die, man, but I ain't afraid of it. I

2492
02:20:27,160 --> 02:20:30,080
Speaker 1: do not fear that, you know, I will like do things.

2493
02:20:30,160 --> 02:20:34,279
Speaker 1: I don't ever make any decisions based upon is it dangerous.

2494
02:20:34,680 --> 02:20:36,360
Speaker 1: I was like, yeah, it's dangerous. It kind of makes

2495
02:20:36,400 --> 02:20:39,400
Speaker 1: it fun. But I don't have a death wish and

2496
02:20:39,480 --> 02:20:41,040
Speaker 1: I don't want to die. But I mean, I'm not

2497
02:20:41,120 --> 02:20:45,120
Speaker 1: gonna like go around scared of dying because dude, hopefully

2498
02:20:45,200 --> 02:20:49,080
Speaker 1: happens quick like lights out that I mean, it is

2499
02:20:49,200 --> 02:20:51,480
Speaker 1: what it is, you know. Yeah, man, I don't know.

2500
02:20:52,720 --> 02:20:54,400
Speaker 1: Like I said this, this is one of those times

2501
02:20:54,480 --> 02:20:59,040
Speaker 1: where you know, it's not that I can say other

2502
02:20:59,120 --> 02:21:02,640
Speaker 1: than thanks for sharing that stuff. Hey, man, pleasure, thanks

2503
02:21:02,680 --> 02:21:05,920
Speaker 1: for choosing this, thanks for choosing this place, and thanks

2504
02:21:05,959 --> 02:21:10,080
Speaker 1: for taking me bear hunting. Any time, dude you come about.

2505
02:21:10,080 --> 02:21:11,320
Speaker 1: You still have a bear tag for this one too.

2506
02:21:11,720 --> 02:21:13,600
Speaker 1: We know that I'd love to come back, man, gets

2507
02:21:13,600 --> 02:21:16,440
Speaker 1: some meat. You're welcome anytime, man, because it is U

2508
02:21:16,800 --> 02:21:19,240
Speaker 1: don't have to be bears either, could be anything, do something,

2509
02:21:19,320 --> 02:21:21,920
Speaker 1: something will happen, Something will happened. But yeah, we had

2510
02:21:22,000 --> 02:21:26,320
Speaker 1: fucking blast. That was blast. That was fun, like when

2511
02:21:26,360 --> 02:21:29,520
Speaker 1: you can. We just hiked and sat around. We met

2512
02:21:30,240 --> 02:21:33,640
Speaker 1: a little older couple that were so nice to us.

2513
02:21:33,680 --> 02:21:35,600
Speaker 1: They were asked us all kinds of crazy questions. Hey,

2514
02:21:36,320 --> 02:21:38,840
Speaker 1: there was an older guy who was a hunter, like

2515
02:21:39,080 --> 02:21:41,520
Speaker 1: quote unquote hunter had hunted before with guys and things.

2516
02:21:41,600 --> 02:21:44,560
Speaker 1: And then his wife it was completely and utterly clueless

2517
02:21:44,640 --> 02:21:47,480
Speaker 1: too what was going on? And she's like, how do

2518
02:21:47,520 --> 02:21:50,520
Speaker 1: you get a bear out? If you how do you

2519
02:21:51,320 --> 02:21:53,360
Speaker 1: shoot it with a bow more than one? I love

2520
02:21:53,400 --> 02:21:55,760
Speaker 1: when people are interested in something they know nothing about,

2521
02:21:55,920 --> 02:21:58,680
Speaker 1: and I think that's how that's how we should be. Man.

2522
02:21:58,720 --> 02:22:01,000
Speaker 1: We just like, you know, answer them with a smile.

2523
02:22:01,320 --> 02:22:05,560
Speaker 1: Don't look at him like this pretentious look like you're dumb, Like, hey,

2524
02:22:05,680 --> 02:22:08,440
Speaker 1: oh yeah you're interested. Here you go. That's the first step,

2525
02:22:08,959 --> 02:22:12,000
Speaker 1: like understanding. She wants to understand man, and appreciate it. Great.

2526
02:22:12,120 --> 02:22:14,720
Speaker 1: And I'll tell you what, man, flat out totally honest

2527
02:22:15,520 --> 02:22:20,520
Speaker 1: looking the eye you appreciate for lices is infectious. Joe

2528
02:22:20,560 --> 02:22:24,760
Speaker 1: would agree. Tell you when you look at when you've

2529
02:22:24,800 --> 02:22:29,120
Speaker 1: seen death a lot like you appreciate that life and

2530
02:22:29,280 --> 02:22:31,840
Speaker 1: especially like the existential, like your social life and the

2531
02:22:31,879 --> 02:22:33,640
Speaker 1: way you're seeing in your industry and how hard you

2532
02:22:33,720 --> 02:22:36,640
Speaker 1: work to gain a standing and having that you know

2533
02:22:36,800 --> 02:22:39,920
Speaker 1: just wrecked for for you know, for reasons that you cause.

2534
02:22:40,760 --> 02:22:50,720
Speaker 1: It's it's a appreciate life is good. Life is good. Okay, Phil,

2535
02:22:50,760 --> 02:22:52,960
Speaker 1: What did you think about Mark Carter? There was a

2536
02:22:53,040 --> 02:22:55,360
Speaker 1: little bit of controversy around us running Man. There's some

2537
02:22:55,440 --> 02:22:57,240
Speaker 1: people around that didn't think we should have had him

2538
02:22:57,320 --> 02:22:59,280
Speaker 1: on or be friends with him, or know him or

2539
02:22:59,320 --> 02:23:02,360
Speaker 1: talk to him. Did you have any such feelings around this?

2540
02:23:03,280 --> 02:23:04,800
Speaker 1: Do you want me to give you the honest answer

2541
02:23:04,959 --> 02:23:07,200
Speaker 1: the answer that you want to err I want to get.

2542
02:23:07,720 --> 02:23:10,360
Speaker 1: I want to give you the honest answer, honest answer.

2543
02:23:11,720 --> 02:23:14,840
Speaker 1: I didn't think because I feel like you framed it

2544
02:23:14,959 --> 02:23:19,480
Speaker 1: around the whole cancel culture thing that that is. I

2545
02:23:19,560 --> 02:23:22,160
Speaker 1: think that is something that happens. I don't think his

2546
02:23:22,320 --> 02:23:26,080
Speaker 1: story should have been filed under that um because I

2547
02:23:26,120 --> 02:23:28,600
Speaker 1: don't think he got quote unquote canceled in any way.

2548
02:23:28,640 --> 02:23:35,880
Speaker 1: I think um he admittedly committed a felony and and

2549
02:23:36,480 --> 02:23:39,800
Speaker 1: is paying for it in a way, but he's still

2550
02:23:39,879 --> 02:23:42,240
Speaker 1: able to like make a living and it didn't destroy

2551
02:23:42,440 --> 02:23:47,959
Speaker 1: his reputation in any like i'd say significant way. Um

2552
02:23:49,640 --> 02:23:52,640
Speaker 1: So those are my honest feelings about it. Yeah. I

2553
02:23:52,640 --> 02:23:54,920
Speaker 1: mean it's complicated because he had a lot of his

2554
02:23:55,160 --> 02:23:58,040
Speaker 1: His career was destroyed in a lot of ways, his

2555
02:23:58,200 --> 02:24:00,080
Speaker 1: life was destroyed in a lot of ways, and he

2556
02:24:00,640 --> 02:24:04,480
Speaker 1: he was punished in many tangible and intangible ways for

2557
02:24:04,640 --> 02:24:06,840
Speaker 1: what he did. And and I don't want to be

2558
02:24:07,000 --> 02:24:08,640
Speaker 1: I don't and and this isn't me saying that like

2559
02:24:08,760 --> 02:24:12,760
Speaker 1: someone can't be redeemed or or can't make or can't

2560
02:24:12,800 --> 02:24:16,880
Speaker 1: attempt to make up for past wrong doings. I I

2561
02:24:17,240 --> 02:24:20,120
Speaker 1: absolutely think that that is something that we should that

2562
02:24:20,160 --> 02:24:23,600
Speaker 1: people should strive for and we should support. Um. I

2563
02:24:23,840 --> 02:24:26,400
Speaker 1: I guess I just don't feel I don't feel bad

2564
02:24:26,520 --> 02:24:28,560
Speaker 1: for the guy. I guess that's like the best way

2565
02:24:28,600 --> 02:24:31,280
Speaker 1: to sum it up. Yeah. Now, I don't think he

2566
02:24:31,280 --> 02:24:32,800
Speaker 1: would want you to feel bad for him. I think

2567
02:24:32,840 --> 02:24:35,800
Speaker 1: he is. He knows that he has to own it

2568
02:24:35,920 --> 02:24:39,520
Speaker 1: and live it, and that's that's his story. And he

2569
02:24:39,600 --> 02:24:41,880
Speaker 1: doesn't shy away from it. He doesn't try to hide it,

2570
02:24:42,440 --> 02:24:44,800
Speaker 1: he wears it. On its sleeve, that's for sure. Um.

2571
02:24:45,240 --> 02:24:47,080
Speaker 1: And so yeah, I mean since we've ran that podcast,

2572
02:24:47,160 --> 02:24:51,360
Speaker 1: I've I've pretty regularly got an emails from people questioning

2573
02:24:51,400 --> 02:24:54,000
Speaker 1: why I would even you know, talk to him, would

2574
02:24:54,040 --> 02:24:57,520
Speaker 1: call him a friend, or I want to relate to

2575
02:24:57,560 --> 02:24:59,240
Speaker 1: him in any way, And I just tell people, you know,

2576
02:25:00,200 --> 02:25:02,240
Speaker 1: in a time of cancel culture, I'm not saying he's

2577
02:25:02,240 --> 02:25:03,959
Speaker 1: part of cancel culture, but I'm saying, in a time

2578
02:25:03,959 --> 02:25:07,480
Speaker 1: of cancer culture, you know, hearing people's stories and being

2579
02:25:07,520 --> 02:25:11,560
Speaker 1: able to explore redemption is an important thing. You know,

2580
02:25:12,000 --> 02:25:14,440
Speaker 1: not redemption isn't always there for people, and they're not

2581
02:25:14,480 --> 02:25:18,240
Speaker 1: always deserving of it, but certainly, um, it's it's it's

2582
02:25:18,360 --> 02:25:21,080
Speaker 1: it's interesting to consider. And in Marks case, man, I

2583
02:25:21,440 --> 02:25:24,720
Speaker 1: I've found him to be nothing but honest. So to

2584
02:25:24,959 --> 02:25:27,560
Speaker 1: to you know, to wrap it up, Mark Carter, we

2585
02:25:27,680 --> 02:25:31,040
Speaker 1: love you and we're glad you shared your story. You know,

2586
02:25:31,680 --> 02:25:33,560
Speaker 1: everybody can have their opinion, but least it's out there,

2587
02:25:33,600 --> 02:25:34,840
Speaker 1: at least you shared it. I think it was a

2588
02:25:34,879 --> 02:25:38,960
Speaker 1: big moment for us for this podcast in but to

2589
02:25:39,040 --> 02:25:40,879
Speaker 1: wrap this all up and to get into next year,

2590
02:25:40,959 --> 02:25:46,360
Speaker 1: we have to absolutely have to talk about one shining

2591
02:25:46,440 --> 02:25:48,320
Speaker 1: moment in all of our lives, and that is the

2592
02:25:48,520 --> 02:25:54,039
Speaker 1: Sizzler promotional commercial from It was our favorite thing this year,

2593
02:25:54,200 --> 02:25:57,680
Speaker 1: was it not the Scisslor commercial. It's just uplifted us

2594
02:25:57,760 --> 02:26:00,240
Speaker 1: so much. Yeah, yeah, I mean it was the best

2595
02:26:00,280 --> 02:26:03,120
Speaker 1: thing that happened on the podcast this year. Uh, you know,

2596
02:26:03,240 --> 02:26:04,920
Speaker 1: I don't I don't mean to be rude to you.

2597
02:26:05,240 --> 02:26:07,920
Speaker 1: I think you're very you know, like smart and talented

2598
02:26:08,040 --> 02:26:10,560
Speaker 1: and YadA, YadA YadA, but you just you couldn't bring

2599
02:26:11,600 --> 02:26:16,600
Speaker 1: what Sizzler could. And it's freedom, it's choices, it's everything

2600
02:26:16,680 --> 02:26:19,600
Speaker 1: we ever needed. So as we look forward into one

2601
02:26:19,640 --> 02:26:22,960
Speaker 1: here at the th HC, we're gonna be guided by

2602
02:26:23,000 --> 02:26:27,000
Speaker 1: the gentle hand of the Sizzler and the buffet and

2603
02:26:27,240 --> 02:26:30,440
Speaker 1: the choices and the freedom. So we're gonna leave you

2604
02:26:31,160 --> 02:26:34,680
Speaker 1: to ponder that and we'll see you next week for

2605
02:26:34,760 --> 02:26:39,760
Speaker 1: a brand new year, brand new season of THC. Phil

2606
02:26:40,160 --> 02:26:47,840
Speaker 1: Play The Sizzler. Now, I have obsession right now, and

2607
02:26:48,360 --> 02:26:51,000
Speaker 1: it is something that both of you. I sent for

2608
02:26:51,080 --> 02:26:54,040
Speaker 1: both of you to watch. I've watched it maybe a

2609
02:26:54,160 --> 02:26:58,440
Speaker 1: thousand times in the last week. It is sublime. It

2610
02:26:58,520 --> 02:27:02,680
Speaker 1: has gotten me through some tough day. It is everything

2611
02:27:03,280 --> 02:27:06,000
Speaker 1: that I needed in my life. Now, Phil, you have

2612
02:27:06,440 --> 02:27:09,640
Speaker 1: watched this video? Have you not? Oh? Yes I have.

2613
02:27:10,840 --> 02:27:13,720
Speaker 1: Would you just describe not the contents, but how it

2614
02:27:13,800 --> 02:27:15,760
Speaker 1: made you feel this video We're gonna play a little

2615
02:27:15,760 --> 02:27:18,680
Speaker 1: bit of it here in a second, But this video

2616
02:27:18,760 --> 02:27:21,920
Speaker 1: make you feel I I absolutely I love it. I

2617
02:27:21,959 --> 02:27:25,840
Speaker 1: mean it's it really does transport you to not even

2618
02:27:25,920 --> 02:27:28,279
Speaker 1: just a different time and place, but like a different

2619
02:27:29,000 --> 02:27:32,600
Speaker 1: like plane of existence. It's like taking it's like taking

2620
02:27:32,680 --> 02:27:40,360
Speaker 1: d M T. See. God, you just Danielle, you've watched it.

2621
02:27:40,400 --> 02:27:44,640
Speaker 1: Do you have any like emotional feelings? Do you? A

2622
02:27:44,680 --> 02:27:50,400
Speaker 1: part of me is like very annoyed and impatient because

2623
02:27:50,480 --> 02:27:54,480
Speaker 1: it's probably the longest video I've ever seen of nothing.

2624
02:27:57,560 --> 02:27:59,760
Speaker 1: It's it's it's not long enough in my opinion. I

2625
02:28:00,080 --> 02:28:01,840
Speaker 1: just gotta get you gotta get in the right head.

2626
02:28:04,440 --> 02:28:08,680
Speaker 1: It definitely takes you back in time to like just

2627
02:28:10,480 --> 02:28:12,440
Speaker 1: I don't know what, I don't know what it reminds

2628
02:28:12,480 --> 02:28:16,320
Speaker 1: me of exactly, Like it's like I've been there, but

2629
02:28:16,440 --> 02:28:21,280
Speaker 1: I'm not there. Yes, so it really at some level

2630
02:28:21,680 --> 02:28:25,400
Speaker 1: it Uh, it's changed me in a way that I

2631
02:28:25,720 --> 02:28:29,120
Speaker 1: really can't describe. And and what is it? You might ask? Well, Uh,

2632
02:28:29,440 --> 02:28:33,600
Speaker 1: my buddy Bill roadin listener podcast. Uh works for Modern

2633
02:28:33,680 --> 02:28:37,640
Speaker 1: Huntsman now Exceptional Human. He's been on the show with

2634
02:28:37,760 --> 02:28:41,880
Speaker 1: Andy Anderson last year. He just posted this. He's and

2635
02:28:41,920 --> 02:28:45,080
Speaker 1: he's a marketing guy. He's in the marketing world. Um.

2636
02:28:45,520 --> 02:28:48,920
Speaker 1: He posted this and with more of like a kind

2637
02:28:48,959 --> 02:28:53,560
Speaker 1: of dystopian like, look, look how screwed up America is.

2638
02:28:54,280 --> 02:28:57,400
Speaker 1: But when I watched it, I thought, look how beautiful

2639
02:28:57,440 --> 02:29:04,439
Speaker 1: America is and look how you know, how how united

2640
02:29:04,520 --> 02:29:08,480
Speaker 1: we are? And it's a commercial for Is it a

2641
02:29:08,520 --> 02:29:10,800
Speaker 1: commercial film or is it just a what would you

2642
02:29:10,840 --> 02:29:14,160
Speaker 1: call it? I mean, yeah, it really is just like

2643
02:29:14,200 --> 02:29:17,360
Speaker 1: a marketing video for They describe it as like for

2644
02:29:18,240 --> 02:29:20,440
Speaker 1: it was like not a training video, but like an

2645
02:29:20,520 --> 02:29:25,280
Speaker 1: introductory welcome to working here video for employees and also

2646
02:29:25,400 --> 02:29:29,640
Speaker 1: for investors of this company. Now, before we get started,

2647
02:29:29,720 --> 02:29:31,920
Speaker 1: this is a it's a it's it's entitled to YouTube

2648
02:29:31,959 --> 02:29:37,440
Speaker 1: video entitled Sizzler promotional commercial. So we'll if you want

2649
02:29:37,480 --> 02:29:39,600
Speaker 1: to google that or go to YouTube and search it out,

2650
02:29:40,400 --> 02:29:41,920
Speaker 1: we'll let you in and we'll pause for a moment

2651
02:29:41,959 --> 02:29:47,160
Speaker 1: so you can watch it and we're back. Um, Danielle,

2652
02:29:47,200 --> 02:29:50,200
Speaker 1: have you ever been to a Sizzler? No? In fact,

2653
02:29:50,320 --> 02:29:54,879
Speaker 1: I thought that was either a very old Las Vegas

2654
02:29:55,040 --> 02:30:02,880
Speaker 1: casino or Golden So, Phil, you're you've been to a

2655
02:30:02,920 --> 02:30:06,000
Speaker 1: sizzle or before? Man I was telling you, yes, I have,

2656
02:30:06,320 --> 02:30:09,040
Speaker 1: but not since the mid nineties. And that's what that

2657
02:30:09,280 --> 02:30:13,800
Speaker 1: helps this video exactly. So this is so like because

2658
02:30:14,200 --> 02:30:17,800
Speaker 1: it had been that long. The way the restaurant looks

2659
02:30:17,840 --> 02:30:22,760
Speaker 1: in this video is exactly what I remember. So they

2660
02:30:22,800 --> 02:30:26,080
Speaker 1: actually just filed for bankruptcy because of COVID I think

2661
02:30:26,120 --> 02:30:29,040
Speaker 1: like a couple of months ago. So they are still around,

2662
02:30:29,120 --> 02:30:32,160
Speaker 1: but but barely barely. And this this might bring them back,

2663
02:30:32,320 --> 02:30:37,160
Speaker 1: maybe if they sponsor the Hunting Collective, this could bring

2664
02:30:37,280 --> 02:30:40,160
Speaker 1: them back the listeners of this show. But I wouldn't

2665
02:30:40,160 --> 02:30:42,040
Speaker 1: do that to the listeners of this show because you're like,

2666
02:30:42,280 --> 02:30:44,199
Speaker 1: at the very least, you're gonna get an upset stomach.

2667
02:30:44,280 --> 02:30:46,280
Speaker 1: At the worst, you're gonna get bostil is um if

2668
02:30:46,320 --> 02:30:48,040
Speaker 1: you go to the system. And that's how just how

2669
02:30:48,080 --> 02:30:51,920
Speaker 1: it is. It's not I'm not making any fun a sizzler.

2670
02:30:52,040 --> 02:30:55,520
Speaker 1: I'm just stating facts. Um. So, Phil, do you want

2671
02:30:55,560 --> 02:30:58,680
Speaker 1: to describe in some detail to to Daniel what a

2672
02:30:58,760 --> 02:31:03,960
Speaker 1: sizzler is and what you're like, it's it's it's a

2673
02:31:04,040 --> 02:31:06,760
Speaker 1: buffet restaurant. And that's what I mean. It's just boiling

2674
02:31:06,800 --> 02:31:10,520
Speaker 1: it down to to the the essential idea of what

2675
02:31:10,680 --> 02:31:14,120
Speaker 1: it is. The food is not good. I mean it

2676
02:31:14,240 --> 02:31:17,400
Speaker 1: sits under hot lamps for hours. Uh. I think it

2677
02:31:17,600 --> 02:31:20,960
Speaker 1: used to be kind of an all encompassing kind of buffet,

2678
02:31:21,360 --> 02:31:23,800
Speaker 1: like just everything. I mean, if you watch that video,

2679
02:31:23,879 --> 02:31:29,880
Speaker 1: they're touting like salad and seafood and sneaks and yeah

2680
02:31:30,040 --> 02:31:33,400
Speaker 1: exactly and like and it looks like a yeah, I

2681
02:31:33,440 --> 02:31:35,880
Speaker 1: mean you got the idea of a Sizzler. It's like

2682
02:31:35,920 --> 02:31:39,040
Speaker 1: a very cheap, like like five blocks off the strip,

2683
02:31:39,360 --> 02:31:44,720
Speaker 1: like Las Vegas buffet like um, like yeah, if if

2684
02:31:44,879 --> 02:31:47,560
Speaker 1: you can't afford to go to the you know, Flamingo

2685
02:31:47,760 --> 02:31:51,560
Speaker 1: or whatever. Uh so yeah, And but I think they

2686
02:31:51,600 --> 02:31:53,840
Speaker 1: started leaning towards pizza at some point. But I might

2687
02:31:53,920 --> 02:31:55,920
Speaker 1: be making that up, but I don't know. It's hard

2688
02:31:56,000 --> 02:31:58,959
Speaker 1: to know. Yeah, they've leaned. I think Sizzler lean. They

2689
02:31:59,240 --> 02:32:01,959
Speaker 1: probably lean with the wind whatever was happening socially. They

2690
02:32:02,000 --> 02:32:03,840
Speaker 1: would just throw it in a bucket and put it out.

2691
02:32:05,160 --> 02:32:08,080
Speaker 1: I just remember there being seafood and I remember avoiding

2692
02:32:08,160 --> 02:32:12,000
Speaker 1: that um. And also remember like the the the bright

2693
02:32:12,200 --> 02:32:15,560
Speaker 1: is hell Neon Sizzler sign that I would drive past

2694
02:32:15,680 --> 02:32:18,360
Speaker 1: often in my hometown of Haggerstown, Maryland. So if you're

2695
02:32:18,400 --> 02:32:20,720
Speaker 1: if you're listening from Haggerstown, Maryland and the Sizzler and

2696
02:32:20,840 --> 02:32:23,119
Speaker 1: you like know about the Sizzler and it's still open,

2697
02:32:23,200 --> 02:32:25,720
Speaker 1: please let me know because when I come home from Thanksgiving,

2698
02:32:25,760 --> 02:32:28,800
Speaker 1: I'm going there. Then I'm gonna play this commercial for everybody.

2699
02:32:29,160 --> 02:32:31,280
Speaker 1: But like the first minute and a half of this video,

2700
02:32:31,320 --> 02:32:33,440
Speaker 1: you would have no idea that it's a promotional video

2701
02:32:33,520 --> 02:32:36,920
Speaker 1: for Sizzler. It's just like it's like nineties families just

2702
02:32:37,160 --> 02:32:41,400
Speaker 1: like hanging out. Like there's a there's a girl, there's

2703
02:32:41,400 --> 02:32:44,400
Speaker 1: a girl, there's a girl playing baseball. There's like a

2704
02:32:44,560 --> 02:32:48,360
Speaker 1: there's like an old Gordon's fisherman looking mf like like

2705
02:32:48,560 --> 02:32:51,240
Speaker 1: on a boat. There's like a sailor, like I guess

2706
02:32:51,400 --> 02:32:54,200
Speaker 1: there's a man in a sailor costume that looks like

2707
02:32:55,800 --> 02:33:00,200
Speaker 1: the sailor looks like it looks like the sailor from

2708
02:33:00,200 --> 02:33:03,240
Speaker 1: the village. People like, not actually a sailor, like just

2709
02:33:03,320 --> 02:33:05,240
Speaker 1: hanging out on a dot. And then all of a sudden,

2710
02:33:05,240 --> 02:33:09,640
Speaker 1: it's like says, Lari is the way, and they went

2711
02:33:09,800 --> 02:33:13,600
Speaker 1: to like a theater and took all the costumes and

2712
02:33:15,720 --> 02:33:19,400
Speaker 1: they went to the prop closet of San Diego State University. Yet,

2713
02:33:20,320 --> 02:33:23,040
Speaker 1: just say we were going to do a fundraiser, be

2714
02:33:23,120 --> 02:33:25,960
Speaker 1: a cameo for like a for like a charity or

2715
02:33:26,240 --> 02:33:28,160
Speaker 1: something like that. I think maybe if we do the

2716
02:33:28,240 --> 02:33:31,240
Speaker 1: cameo and raise money, we should recreate this video with

2717
02:33:31,320 --> 02:33:35,400
Speaker 1: that money. I would love that. I would so I

2718
02:33:35,720 --> 02:33:38,560
Speaker 1: think we might. I gotta again get permission from the

2719
02:33:38,640 --> 02:33:41,320
Speaker 1: people that pulled the strings here, but if they would

2720
02:33:41,320 --> 02:33:43,320
Speaker 1: allow me to raise about ten grand to put this

2721
02:33:43,959 --> 02:33:46,720
Speaker 1: to do this, it could change lives. I'm reading the

2722
02:33:46,760 --> 02:33:49,520
Speaker 1: YouTube comments right now. It has to two plus million

2723
02:33:49,600 --> 02:33:52,720
Speaker 1: views on YouTube, because why not. The best comment is

2724
02:33:53,080 --> 02:33:59,200
Speaker 1: directed by Michael Scott from the office I Have I have.

2725
02:34:00,000 --> 02:34:02,280
Speaker 1: I'm not even from America, but damn I do feel

2726
02:34:02,320 --> 02:34:06,080
Speaker 1: proud to be American. I don't know whether to eat

2727
02:34:06,120 --> 02:34:11,440
Speaker 1: it sizzler or to enlist in the military. Better do both. Yeah, yeah,

2728
02:34:11,560 --> 02:34:13,400
Speaker 1: and there's there. Yeah, there's about a four minute long

2729
02:34:13,560 --> 02:34:17,520
Speaker 1: song that it's just singing that's singing about about the

2730
02:34:17,560 --> 02:34:20,560
Speaker 1: sizzler and then like and then at some point a

2731
02:34:20,680 --> 02:34:27,280
Speaker 1: narrator breaks in is like America, Americans decided. They love to,

2732
02:34:27,840 --> 02:34:30,880
Speaker 1: they love choice, and they love freedom. Sizzler play that,

2733
02:34:30,959 --> 02:34:33,040
Speaker 1: somebody says, plays at my funeral. It'll cheer up my

2734
02:34:33,120 --> 02:34:39,040
Speaker 1: family as they remember my love. And then at some

2735
02:34:39,160 --> 02:34:42,680
Speaker 1: point they bust out their slogan, which is Sizzler a

2736
02:34:42,840 --> 02:34:49,840
Speaker 1: restaurant within a restaurant, a Russian nesting doll of restaurants,

2737
02:34:51,720 --> 02:34:55,480
Speaker 1: somebody writes. And sometimes when we touch the salad bars

2738
02:34:55,560 --> 02:34:58,400
Speaker 1: too much, I want to hold you until they bring

2739
02:34:58,520 --> 02:35:03,360
Speaker 1: us our fries. It's yeah, all right, Well let me play.

2740
02:35:03,440 --> 02:35:05,280
Speaker 1: Should I play all four minutes of it? Phil and

2741
02:35:05,360 --> 02:35:10,119
Speaker 1: just have like, No matter how much I personally would

2742
02:35:10,160 --> 02:35:12,119
Speaker 1: love that, I'm trying to think about your audience. I'm

2743
02:35:12,120 --> 02:35:14,400
Speaker 1: gonna I'm gonna play like the first little bit and

2744
02:35:14,400 --> 02:35:17,440
Speaker 1: then we'll record till the end. Uh and just and

2745
02:35:17,680 --> 02:35:19,880
Speaker 1: I'm not even I don't know what to say, so

2746
02:35:19,959 --> 02:35:22,959
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna be laughing, um, and maybe I'll giggle

2747
02:35:23,160 --> 02:35:28,800
Speaker 1: like a schoolgirl here. So let let's go. Oh, this

2748
02:35:28,879 --> 02:35:31,720
Speaker 1: guy starting a frisbee to a dog and that dog

2749
02:35:31,800 --> 02:35:35,439
Speaker 1: catches it with such beauty. There's a guy to construction

2750
02:35:35,520 --> 02:35:39,440
Speaker 1: had looking at you creepily, half smiling. There's a little

2751
02:35:39,480 --> 02:35:43,320
Speaker 1: girl on a tree with a baseball back. You don't

2752
02:35:43,320 --> 02:35:47,240
Speaker 1: play baseball and trees, little girl. There's the Gordon's fisherman

2753
02:35:47,320 --> 02:35:54,280
Speaker 1: man seagulls in the background. Oh oh man, a little

2754
02:35:54,320 --> 02:35:59,200
Speaker 1: girl on a sailor at riding a bike on the dock. Yeah. Oh,

2755
02:35:59,320 --> 02:36:01,040
Speaker 1: that little girl got out of the tree and hit

2756
02:36:01,080 --> 02:36:04,720
Speaker 1: a baseball. Oh it must be a good one. She's excited.

2757
02:36:05,320 --> 02:36:08,040
Speaker 1: She jumped in the air slow motion. Half of this

2758
02:36:08,200 --> 02:36:10,840
Speaker 1: video is in very bad looking slow motion too, which

2759
02:36:10,920 --> 02:36:18,600
Speaker 1: is another great part. Sissler. Oh, this guy puts his

2760
02:36:18,720 --> 02:36:23,959
Speaker 1: cowboy hat on another lady. Oh, all right, I'm gonna

2761
02:36:24,040 --> 02:36:28,240
Speaker 1: play the end. I can't, I can't. There's nothing I

2762
02:36:28,320 --> 02:36:31,560
Speaker 1: can do. Sizzler is the one that brings us choices.

2763
02:36:31,959 --> 02:36:36,039
Speaker 1: Is is probably the new slogan of this podcast. Um

2764
02:36:36,440 --> 02:36:39,080
Speaker 1: fill any commentary before we continue. I just know, I know.

2765
02:36:39,240 --> 02:36:41,440
Speaker 1: I mean I said something before we start recording, which

2766
02:36:41,600 --> 02:36:43,360
Speaker 1: was this is this is the last thing you see

2767
02:36:43,400 --> 02:36:47,000
Speaker 1: before you die? And I honestly hope it is because

2768
02:36:47,040 --> 02:36:49,840
Speaker 1: that would be incredible. All right, Well, let's close it

2769
02:36:49,879 --> 02:36:53,440
Speaker 1: out here. We're gonna start with the two sailors kissing

2770
02:36:53,920 --> 02:36:57,440
Speaker 1: and then looking weirdly at the camera, and then continuing on.

2771
02:36:58,600 --> 02:37:04,039
Speaker 1: They are kissing, make it as they're not kidding, are

2772
02:37:04,080 --> 02:37:07,039
Speaker 1: like smooching, lanking the high they're making out and then

2773
02:37:07,080 --> 02:37:10,240
Speaker 1: they look and they see the camera and then continue

2774
02:37:10,320 --> 02:37:12,800
Speaker 1: making out as if they know where this video is

2775
02:37:12,800 --> 02:37:25,160
Speaker 1: gonna gonna be. There goes to kiss. Oh, the little

2776
02:37:25,200 --> 02:37:33,640
Speaker 1: girl is dancing. She hit that ball so far, sizzler.