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Speaker 1: Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: What's up, y'all? This is Questlove And in our recent

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Speaker 2: finale episode of Team Supreme, I mentioned that one of

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Speaker 2: my most underrated episodes of QLs is this particular one

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Speaker 2: right here, This QLs classic conversation with doctor Matthew Knowles,

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Speaker 2: father too, Beyonce and Solange, and oh I love this

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty one episode for so many reasons. You know,

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Speaker 2: doctor Knowles got incredibly real, speaking openly about the trauma

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Speaker 2: he's faced and how therapy helped him and heal and grow.

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Speaker 2: He also shared very powerful moments about physical, mental, emotional health,

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Speaker 2: and this one kind of resonated with me a little

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Speaker 2: too much. Got emotional, which is nothing wrong with that,

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Speaker 2: and I believe it's going to help you too. So

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Speaker 2: here's an encore and recap redo of the Doctor Matthew

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Speaker 2: Knowles episode of Question Love Supreme.

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Speaker 3: Enjoy, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another episode of Quest

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Speaker 3: Love Supreme.

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Speaker 2: I'm your host, Quest Love. We have Teams Supreme with

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Speaker 2: us right now. Uh fanto, how are you? I?

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Speaker 4: I'm Ernest and Juliaglo's brother. That's exactly now.

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Speaker 2: I'm good Man I'm good.

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Speaker 4: I'm chilling. I'm still still down stills down thirty one.

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Speaker 5: I kind of hit like a plateau, so I think

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Speaker 5: I'm kind of like I wait in the same thing

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Speaker 5: like every week.

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Speaker 4: But normally when I do that, the next week is

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Speaker 4: like I have a big drop. So I'm seeing but

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Speaker 4: I'm still on it.

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Speaker 2: Man. Yeah, I'm there with you, bro. I'm doing a

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Speaker 2: quarter pounds a week, so that's all. Really, That's what

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Speaker 2: I'm hitting up Flatfield right now. I'm trying to hit

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Speaker 2: the last sixty.

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Speaker 4: So but you down like, should you love them there?

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Speaker 4: A hundred though?

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Speaker 2: Right, like, yeah, one, I'm going I'm going for in

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Speaker 2: total one eight. I'm trying to get two hundred.

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Speaker 4: You're trying to come out of the house looking like

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Speaker 4: it's just chestnut nigga?

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Speaker 2: Yes? Is that why? Burn's just that's trending today? Office

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Speaker 2: sudden alcoh Blue. Anyway, Steve, how are you hello? Everybody?

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Speaker 2: Nice to be here. That's good.

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Speaker 6: I'm doing fine.

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Speaker 2: You know, I gotta ask you how you're doing.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm doing good. I'm just waiting for people to

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Speaker 6: applaud after you say my name.

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Speaker 2: But that didn't happen, right, that's that's your golf clap

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Speaker 2: right there. Uh layah, Yeah, you're fine.

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Speaker 7: I'm good and I'm necative. I'm good as yet last year.

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Speaker 2: Yeah you.

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Speaker 7: Still, Yeah, because I visited a couple of places last

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Speaker 7: week and I was, like I was in Nashville.

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Speaker 2: He's a little nervous. Yeah, you know, I I'm one

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Speaker 2: of those people that fell I'm one of those people

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Speaker 2: that fall asleep, and I'm too lazy to change the

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Speaker 2: air conditioning situation. And you know, if you're a couple

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Speaker 2: that really doesn't agree on the proper temperature of a

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Speaker 2: particular room, you know, I'll go to sleep, sneak and

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Speaker 2: put it on air, and then I'll sneak and put

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Speaker 2: it on heat and whatnot. Yeah. So last week I

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Speaker 2: woke up with the flu, and you know, I was

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Speaker 2: out of my mind, right like I got it. But

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Speaker 2: you know, basically.

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Speaker 7: Old and you're still blaming the flu and stuff.

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Speaker 2: Like that, Okay, or maybe I got it. I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I took like six no, I took six steps. I

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Speaker 2: definitely don't have it. Ladies and gentlemen, I will say

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Speaker 2: that we've been on the air. What this this is

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Speaker 2: our fifth anniversary almost Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's that's kind

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Speaker 2: of weird that we've been doing this for five years.

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Speaker 2: I still feel like we're on our second or third year. Anyway,

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Speaker 2: we've been We've been on the air for about five seasons.

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Speaker 2: And I'll say that the seed, uh, the seed of

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Speaker 2: this episode was probably Planet I know that Salon's was

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Speaker 2: definitely one of the first twenty episodes. I think she

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Speaker 2: was like episode fifteen or early yeah, yeah, And she

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Speaker 2: planted the seeds in that episode basically that her her

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Speaker 2: dad wasn't just some random backstage dad, but rather an

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Speaker 2: accomplished gentleman with both his his his NBA and his

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Speaker 2: and his PhD and business like doctor that yeah, doctor

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Speaker 2: and master. But she also let us down the rabbit

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Speaker 2: hole of his involvement in the Civil rights movement and

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Speaker 2: basically just told us other struggle and the sacrifice that

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Speaker 2: it took to ensure that the Knowle's legacy lived on

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Speaker 2: forever in the history books, not only with her sister,

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Speaker 2: but yeahs as in her father and the rest of

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Speaker 2: the family. I'm beyond certain that they are in mission

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Speaker 2: accomplished land right now. One hundredfold as far as being

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Speaker 2: in the history books. He is the creator of music, world, entertainment.

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Speaker 2: He's a movie producer, a college professor, a successful kids

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Speaker 2: label in print exec recording studio mogul, real estate tycoon,

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Speaker 2: cannabis company owner, Oh.

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Speaker 4: Wow podcast, did everything a president exactly.

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Speaker 2: He even has his own podcast. Like our first conversation

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Speaker 2: was me being a guest on his podcast. Not to mention,

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Speaker 2: you know, he is a cancer survivor, breast cancer survivor

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Speaker 2: and you know, yeah, incidentally father of two of the

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Speaker 2: most dauntless, indomitable artists recording music today. Whoever those two

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Speaker 2: people are, I don't know. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome

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Speaker 2: finally to Course Love Supreme Doctor Matthew Knowles, Sir, Hey

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Speaker 2: quest Love.

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Speaker 8: Thank you for the introduction. Brother. I have much respect

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Speaker 8: for you, so thank you for allow me having this opportunity.

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Speaker 8: It was a little tough. We had a little start

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Speaker 8: to stop, but that's like.

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Speaker 4: We do the best you can in the pandemic.

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Speaker 2: Bro. Yeah, it was a commitment. I will say that

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Speaker 2: you you made the introduction easy because sometimes I have

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Speaker 2: to add a lot more broth to the to the

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Speaker 2: to the soup than you know deserve. You know, you

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Speaker 2: can became well stocked, you know, I didn't. I didn't

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Speaker 2: have to add any more flourishing words to your tier

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Speaker 2: and pressed a resume. Where are you speaking to us

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Speaker 2: right now?

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Speaker 8: From You're California in my office. We have a corporate

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Speaker 8: home here as well as in Houston. But I'm just

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Speaker 8: I love here because I get to you know, when

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Speaker 8: I was I was just shared this story today. Fifteen

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Speaker 8: years ago, I was in my office at Sony at

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Speaker 8: five fifty Madison, you guys know where that is. And

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Speaker 8: the president told me they had just hired head of

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Speaker 8: an R paid them five million dollars a year. And

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Speaker 8: I asked him, I said, why the hell did you

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Speaker 8: hire this guy? And he said to look out the window.

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Speaker 8: And it took me five about seven years to understand

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Speaker 8: truly what he meant by looking out of the window.

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Speaker 8: That creative space we all get into. And here it

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Speaker 8: allows me to just look out the window.

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Speaker 2: And you're saying that that that sort of environment of

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Speaker 2: looking out the window and that's where the ideas come

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Speaker 2: into play, or.

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Speaker 8: Just absolutely that's what the ideas come. That's where you know.

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Speaker 8: I work now, my biggest thing that I work on.

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Speaker 8: I'm very grateful the success of my kids and the

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Speaker 8: success I had in corporate America and the music industry.

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Speaker 8: But I work. I work on happiness. That's the number

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Speaker 8: one thing I work. I work on each and every

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Speaker 8: day is happiness.

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Speaker 7: How long it take you to figure that out?

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Speaker 8: It took me, Dawn near sixty some years to figure

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Speaker 8: that out.

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Speaker 7: Uh.

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Speaker 8: You know, we work so hard to get plaques and

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Speaker 8: b number one, and then we find ourselves in a

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Speaker 8: space that we lack happiness. And that's what I work on.

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Speaker 8: How can I be happy? And part of that is

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Speaker 8: gratitude and not doing a damn thing I don't want

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Speaker 8: to do.

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Speaker 4: Man, listen, Oh wow, that's Mantra.

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Speaker 2: That's the episode right there. Thank you very much that.

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Speaker 4: I remember.

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Speaker 2: Man.

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Speaker 5: I remember watching your interview you when you were on

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Speaker 5: Breakfast Club, and you know, you were talking with Charlamagne

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Speaker 5: and you were saying the way it was when you

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Speaker 5: just put out your book, which I really enjoyed, The

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Speaker 5: DNA of Achievers, the one did you and you were

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Speaker 5: talking about how, you know, people compare Beyonce versus Slange

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Speaker 5: or whatever, and you were saying how every artist has

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Speaker 5: to develop success on their own terms for what they

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Speaker 5: mean to be successful. And I was curious, like how

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Speaker 5: did you learn that lesson in your career? Like, how

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Speaker 5: did you you know, how did you make that realization?

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Speaker 8: Well? I have really great parents and they were poor,

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Speaker 8: but I never knew we were poor until I got

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Speaker 8: older in life, and they instilled in me the same

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Speaker 8: thing that I instilled in my kids, and that is

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Speaker 8: you can dream and dream big because the same efforts

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Speaker 8: and energy on a little small idea, it's the same

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Speaker 8: energy and efforts on the big idea. So my parents,

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Speaker 8: you know, I watched them work their day job but

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Speaker 8: yet be entrepreneurs on the weekends and at night. My

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Speaker 8: daddy was a truck driver by day, working for white folks,

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Speaker 8: and by night he convinced the white folks to let

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Speaker 8: him use the truck all the time, and he would

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Speaker 8: tear down houses and sell the metals and sell the woods,

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Speaker 8: scrap and yeah, scrap metals. Yeah, I see. You know that. Man.

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Speaker 4: I'm from North Carolina, so this is home for me.

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Speaker 4: The gall well, we make wine. So now I'm familiar.

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Speaker 7: What did your mother what was her gig? You said

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Speaker 7: your dad, Well.

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Speaker 8: My mother was a color a colored maid. My dad

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Speaker 8: made thirty dollars a week as a truck driver. My

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Speaker 8: mom made fifteen dollars a week as a colored maid.

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Speaker 8: She convinced the white woman she worked for to give

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Speaker 8: her all of her hand me down clothes and own

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Speaker 8: and convinced her to ask her her friends to give

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Speaker 8: her the hand me down clothes. And on the weekend,

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Speaker 8: my mom and a couple of her best friends would

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Speaker 8: make these beautiful quotes and sell them. So I saw entrepreneurship.

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Speaker 8: My grandfather was on both sides and grandmother on both

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Speaker 8: sides were entrepreneurs. So entrepreneurship is part of our tradition

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Speaker 8: and our family.

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Speaker 4: And where did you grow up?

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Speaker 7: What?

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Speaker 4: Where's this?

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Speaker 8: Gaston, Alabama?

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Speaker 4: It's Alabama.

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Speaker 8: Got a little small town, you know. I grew up

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Speaker 8: on a dirt road with an outside bathroom until I

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Speaker 8: was about thirteen, fourteen years old.

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Speaker 2: An outhouse outhouse. Wow, Okay, yeah, I have a question.

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Speaker 2: You said something really crucial at the top. Well, you

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Speaker 2: said two crucial things. One to fine happiness, which you're right.

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Speaker 2: That's that's something that we learned later in life. I

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Speaker 2: noticed I think last week I forgot what I was watching.

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Speaker 2: But I will say that one of the biggest mistakes

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Speaker 2: that I think the average black household instills. And you

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Speaker 2: know this is not strictly just black households. I know

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Speaker 2: this is a universal thought. Is oftentimes parents will tell

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Speaker 2: their kids, you know, it's better to be safe than sorry.

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Speaker 2: Are you know, have have a plan, B, have a

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Speaker 2: bland C. But you know, oftentimes when you said that,

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Speaker 2: you know, following your dreams, especially when you're living kind

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Speaker 2: of in a poverty level or at least below what

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Speaker 2: the what the average what the average income is for

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Speaker 2: survival for whatever time period you're speaking of. I know

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Speaker 2: that oftentimes when people are in fight or flight modes

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Speaker 2: for survival, they often think that daydreaming is kind of

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Speaker 2: a waste of time. I sort of, I sort of

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Speaker 2: grew up in my family structure was definitely more about

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Speaker 2: survival than anything. My actual inner family, like my mother

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Speaker 2: and my father, of course they were like the dreamers

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Speaker 2: of My father was like one of nine kids, so

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Speaker 2: you know, kind of like I'll say that his family

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Speaker 2: was more or less about survival and in terms of

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Speaker 2: getting a good job, making good money, surviving, and he

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Speaker 2: pursued his dream. So how much of a risk is

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Speaker 2: it when you are living in a situation in which

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Speaker 2: you might not know where your next meal is coming

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Speaker 2: from or that sort of thing. Yeah, like most people

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Speaker 2: can't or it feel as though they can't afford to

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Speaker 2: daydream when they have bills to pay, that sort of thing.

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Speaker 2: So how do you like how what was different about

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Speaker 2: your situation than the average household?

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Speaker 8: Well, I share what my parents did. I like to

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Speaker 8: use the word rather than survival survival determination. Uh, they

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Speaker 8: were determined. They weren't passionate about doing their day job.

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Speaker 8: That was more determination to provide just like you just said, it.

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Speaker 4: Was a means to an end.

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Speaker 8: Right. But but my parents, you know, I think in

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Speaker 8: the day daydreaming process, at least for me with my kids,

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Speaker 8: it was always about finding that thing you were passionate

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Speaker 8: about and how soon and how early you can find

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Speaker 8: that passion. And if you think about when we think

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Speaker 8: about the Williams sisters or Michael Jordan or Michael Jackson

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Speaker 8: or Tiger Woods, they found their passion very very early.

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Speaker 8: And so my parents gave me that that space, gave

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Speaker 8: me that that ability to daydream and supported it, just

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Speaker 8: like I supported my kids with whatever their passion. And

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Speaker 8: I always say, you know, had Beyonce or Clanche both

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Speaker 8: said Daddy, I want to I want to be a doctor.

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Speaker 8: I would have supported that. I would have sent them

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Speaker 8: to a school of that had science. I would have

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Speaker 8: gone to the you know library, let them read about

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Speaker 8: science and medicine and surround them with that. But I

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Speaker 8: would have said, though, once you get your your your

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Speaker 8: license and graduate from med school, your daddy would will

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Speaker 8: have a hospital. Think about that. It was never you

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Speaker 8: gonna work for somebody. It was you're gonna be in

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Speaker 8: a position of entrepreneurship and wealth, which black people we don't.

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Speaker 8: We always hesitate and are shy about talking about building wealth.

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Speaker 2: Not even.

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Speaker 8: Right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I you know, I meant that in my

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Speaker 2: personal situation, like you know, and even now I still

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Speaker 2: wrestle with that because you know, I come from West Philadelphia,

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Speaker 2: and I mean, like you can attest to this, like

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Speaker 2: I'm when I'm in Philadelphia, I still feel the need

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Speaker 2: to drive my first raggedy car. I have sentimental value

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Speaker 2: to it. But of course, you know, I also have

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Speaker 2: a grown man's car. I have a may Bat, but.

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Speaker 5: And you have an Oscar winning documentary puts right.

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Speaker 4: We're trying to play broke, nigga.

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Speaker 7: Trying to play broke and also break us down. How

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Speaker 7: you diversify because some of us are trying to get

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Speaker 7: there because it's dope the way that you do the

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Speaker 7: way you do with the product job.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, he got it, Matthew.

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Speaker 2: Here's the thing though, here's okay, So again, you two

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Speaker 2: have been following me the last year, so you know,

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Speaker 2: I kind of been running the same narrative on the show.

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Speaker 2: I'm now learning that, Okay. When I when I was

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Speaker 2: doing the nineteen job thing where I said yes to everything,

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Speaker 2: Ye'll do that, I'll produce that. No, no, no. According

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Speaker 2: to someone nameless, she said that that was me being

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Speaker 2: the mayor. She's like, you enjoy being the mayor, Like

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Speaker 2: the mayor is the person that is sort of like

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Speaker 2: the super of the apartment, you know, like bookmen like

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Speaker 2: fixing the pipes and I'll fix your electricity d D.

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Speaker 2: And she's like, first of all, you know, because you're

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Speaker 2: in fight or flight mood, you know, that's why you

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Speaker 2: keep saying yes to everything. And she's like, it's the

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Speaker 2: moment you let those things go and give yourself a

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Speaker 2: chance to breathe and look out the window. Which is

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Speaker 2: why when he said looking out the window, I knew

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Speaker 2: exactly resonate because you know, I finally discovered that lookout

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Speaker 2: the window moment during the pandemic.

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Speaker 5: You know, not a person who said this was this

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Speaker 5: that their names start with G and rhyme with race.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it was race.

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Speaker 7: So why didn't we pick up on this looking out

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Speaker 7: the window thing when Good Times came on? Because we

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Speaker 7: knew that what they were motivator. Yeah, that was depressing

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Speaker 7: just looking out of the window watching the as far.

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Speaker 2: It's daydreaming. You know what, there's a really interesting episode

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Speaker 2: of Soul Train in seventy five, Don Cornelius asks, you

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Speaker 2: know this point, Michael Jackson's like seventeen, and you know,

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Speaker 2: it's like his senior year of high school. So you know,

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Speaker 2: Donn is joking with Michael Jackson about like him and

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Speaker 2: Danny Botten JUGI in the same high school and how

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Speaker 2: Danny always gets in trouble and Mike doesn't get in trouble.

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Speaker 2: And you know, he asked Mike, like, what are you

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Speaker 2: doing in your spare time like as a seventeen year old,

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Speaker 2: And Mike had a very very interesting answer that he

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Speaker 2: used to always laugh at until now. Mike's first answer was,

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Speaker 2: you know, I'd just like to sit in daydream, which right,

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Speaker 2: that sounded silly, but I didn't realize the importance of

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Speaker 2: day dreaming. That that puts your mind space in the

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Speaker 2: space of achievement. And if you you know, if you

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Speaker 2: follow Michael Jackson's career, especially in the Spike Lee documentaries,

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Speaker 2: like he was world famous for like documenting his day dreams.

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Speaker 2: One day, I want to achieve the Internet and then

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Speaker 2: I want to be the dinner. So I'm realizing that now,

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Speaker 2: you know, in this late stage of my life. But

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Speaker 2: you know, I I really wish I could I could

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Speaker 2: hone in and tell people at least listen to this

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Speaker 2: episode how it's so important to encourage your kids to dream,

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Speaker 2: to you know, really really take the time out to

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Speaker 2: sit in silence into to daydream, because you know, I

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Speaker 2: kind of came from a school where it was like,

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Speaker 2: you know, burn the hand, be's doing the bush and

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Speaker 2: you know, you know, if you don't work, you can't eat,

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Speaker 2: like all those idioms that my grandmom used to stay

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Speaker 2: like wait, how boy, you know it ain't gonna feed itself,

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Speaker 2: that sort of thing. Like I grew up in that

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Speaker 2: sort of household when my parents were on the road,

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Speaker 2: and you know, I always thought, like you can't afford

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Speaker 2: to daydream, like you gotta work to survive, and now

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Speaker 2: I'm realizing it's the the opposite.

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Speaker 8: So and daydreaming allows us also to visualize, to visualize

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Speaker 8: where we can be in the future, because if we don't,

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Speaker 8: if we don't visualize and see it, like people ask

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Speaker 8: me all the time, like did you ever think I

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Speaker 8: think that you know, Deskin y'all or Beyonce or Solange

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Speaker 8: would be as successful. Absolutely, I used to visualize it.

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Speaker 8: I actually used to see it. And that's one of

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Speaker 8: the things that daydreaming and just taking time out sometimes,

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Speaker 8: just like you just said, quest love just to take

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Speaker 8: time out. And the older I get, and I think

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Speaker 8: it also has to do as you get older and

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Speaker 8: experience life more, you begin to see life differently. I'm

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Speaker 8: you know, I'll be seventy years old than five months,

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Speaker 8: and so I'm a reality I'm in reality mode that

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Speaker 8: you know, time is my window is getting short, and

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Speaker 8: so I see life differently as well. So that's part

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Speaker 8: of it.

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Speaker 2: Well, you just reminded me that it's going to be

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty two in five months. In my mind, right,

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Speaker 2: it might be made I was doing minute now you

360
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Speaker 2: was born in January, that's like next year. And now

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Speaker 2: I'm realizing that.

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Speaker 4: January is next year exactly.

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Speaker 7: Can I ask a question about your upbringing a little bit,

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Speaker 7: because I know that one of the things that brought

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Speaker 7: folks to the attention of how kind of dope you

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Speaker 7: are for lack of a better term, was the Solange

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Speaker 7: album And when you do the piece, yeah it's got

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Speaker 7: the right to be mad, which she wrote, but it's

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Speaker 7: your story and it made me think about you talking

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Speaker 7: about fantasy and how you basically were raised and yeah,

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Speaker 7: you can fantasize, but you also have this reality in

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Speaker 7: your face of being like a first Can you just

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Speaker 7: talk about like that piece?

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Speaker 8: And yeah, I tell you, people just don't know Solange. Solange.

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Speaker 8: You know, we made a big, big mistake on her

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Speaker 8: first album. You know, Solanche was fifteen.

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Speaker 4: Was that the Hadley Street Dreams record.

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Speaker 8: No No, No, that was a great record, solo star.

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Speaker 8: You know, I made a big mistake. Columbia Records made

380
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Speaker 8: a big mistake of trying to make her something she

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Speaker 8: really wasn't and trying to make her a pop artist. Uh,

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Speaker 8: and that's not really who she is. And it was

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Speaker 8: with Hadley Street Dreamed dreams that she really took a

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Speaker 8: stand about her artistry and she was right, and she

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Speaker 8: wrote her way and performed her way out of the

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Speaker 8: shadow of her sister. You know, we used to say

387
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Speaker 8: and Beyonce the little sister Solange. People don't say that anymore.

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Speaker 8: And people don't even know that Kelly Rowland's first album,

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Speaker 8: which people don't know Kelly Rowland either. Most people don't

390
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Speaker 8: know Kelly Rowland's album. First album sold four million records

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Speaker 8: outside of America, four a million, and that album half

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Speaker 8: of it Solange wrote, right, or the songs she wrote

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Speaker 8: for Beyonce or Destiny's Child or all the other mini artists.

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Speaker 8: So you know, I really, uh look back. You know,

395
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Speaker 8: it's crazy because the next book I'm doing is called

396
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Speaker 8: When I Look Back. But when I look Back. That's

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Speaker 8: the one thing I'm proud is that Solange stood up

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Speaker 8: for her artists, her artistic expression and to become part

399
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Speaker 8: of the process. Because you know, when you're small, you're young,

400
00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:45,120
Speaker 8: rather you don't become you don't really get an opportunity

401
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Speaker 8: to be part of the process. So I'm proud of Solunge.

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Speaker 7: I still wanted you to just talk about the interlude, though,

403
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Speaker 7: with you got the right to be mad, and how

404
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Speaker 7: you felt.

405
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Speaker 8: When she came Oh that well, it was it was

406
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Speaker 8: really an interesting moment. What you don't know is Solons orchestrated.

407
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Speaker 8: I had never seen my former wife from since our divorce,

408
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:18,040
Speaker 8: and we actually didn't know it, but we walked into

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Speaker 8: a room in New Orleans and so that that was

410
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Speaker 8: a special moment in itself. You know. You know Solane

411
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Speaker 8: with her creativity, she knew how to I think she

412
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Speaker 8: knew also how to bring something out of me. Uh

413
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Speaker 8: and took me back to my childhood, which as a child,

414
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Speaker 8: I never went to a black school growing up in Gaston, Alabama.

415
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Speaker 8: George Wallace l the governor al Lingo my my age

416
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Speaker 8: from Alabama. You know that name, because this guy was

417
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Speaker 8: over the state. True, you know, it was really tough

418
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Speaker 8: for me being the very first one of the first

419
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Speaker 8: and going to a Catholic elementary school in Gaston, Alabama.

420
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Speaker 8: Who does that? I mean, who does that? And then

421
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Speaker 8: going to a junior high school with a thousand white

422
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Speaker 8: kids and first days. You know, George Wallace had this

423
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Speaker 8: thing about freedom of choice. You can go to any

424
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Speaker 8: school you want to, but you own your damn own

425
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:38,959
Speaker 8: don't ask me to save, you support tect you protect you,

426
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Speaker 8: You own your own, So that those were tough times,

427
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Speaker 8: being one of the first. And my mother was so

428
00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:48,800
Speaker 8: frightened in my junior high that she actually took a

429
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Speaker 8: job in the UH at the school, in the elect

430
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Speaker 8: room so that she could be there as a cook,

431
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Speaker 8: so she could be there with her. Because we never

432
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Speaker 8: knew what was going to happen. We got in fights,

433
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 8: you know, the white kids would circle us and here

434
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Speaker 8: we are in the middle of a fight. We didn't

435
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Speaker 8: know what was going to happen that day.

436
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 4: And mister Nosle, you're only child at the time. You

437
00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 4: have any brothers and sisters?

438
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:19,560
Speaker 8: Well, you know, I have my brother, it has passed on.

439
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 8: He was nine years older, and my sister, who my

440
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:29,879
Speaker 8: parents adopted, is nine years younger. So we all in

441
00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 8: a way we're the only child.

442
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:35,120
Speaker 4: There's always experiencing stuff by ourself.

443
00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:43,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, right, when do you consider Solons made a lot

444
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:48,119
Speaker 2: about your involvement in the civil rights period? Of course,

445
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:52,400
Speaker 2: you know, when if you're in Gatsa in Alabama as

446
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:56,480
Speaker 2: a elementary school student, I'm certain that every day was

447
00:27:57,359 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 2: a day for civil rights. But when do you con

448
00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:07,159
Speaker 2: your actual entry into participating in the civil rights period.

449
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,919
Speaker 8: It would be my first demonstration. You know, most people,

450
00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:15,440
Speaker 8: of course love don't realize how young we were as

451
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:21,960
Speaker 8: kids participating in demonstrations. And when the state troopers were beating,

452
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:27,680
Speaker 8: they didn't care of you a woman, a man, or child.

453
00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 8: And so that period of leaving your church, going to

454
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 8: a Penny's store and sitting at the counter there in

455
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:47,880
Speaker 8: the cafeteria and state troopers companying people running screaming, those

456
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 8: were the experiences. I've been beaten, I've been spit on,

457
00:28:52,320 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 8: I've been electric pride, and those of you that don't

458
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 8: know what that is, it's like a tool of the battle. Yeah,

459
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 8: that's you for cattle. And they used that a lot,

460
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:10,200
Speaker 8: that electric product on us, and it was really time.

461
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:13,560
Speaker 8: I remember one time I was demonstrating and they made

462
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 8: the older men take off their shoes and walk barefoot,

463
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 8: and it was like a hundred degrees, so you can

464
00:29:22,040 --> 00:29:26,640
Speaker 8: imagine that. Or when we would demonstrate, I remember many

465
00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:30,360
Speaker 8: times at night we would demonstrate at the courtroom and

466
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:35,680
Speaker 8: we had no outside facilities. The ladies had to surround,

467
00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:40,600
Speaker 8: the men had to dig holes in the dirt. We

468
00:29:40,640 --> 00:29:43,480
Speaker 8: did what we had to do. To survive. People don't

469
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:48,800
Speaker 8: realize what really went through that civil rights movement and

470
00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 8: how people risked their lives to get us to where

471
00:29:53,200 --> 00:29:55,880
Speaker 8: we are today. That's why I get I still hold

472
00:29:55,920 --> 00:30:00,920
Speaker 8: people accountable because COVID and a lot of what's happened

473
00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 8: is because when Donald Trump ran for president, black folks

474
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 8: we didn't vote like we did eight years previous. And

475
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 8: I'm most always hope and remind black folks the accountability

476
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:14,920
Speaker 8: of that.

477
00:30:16,920 --> 00:30:18,600
Speaker 2: I had to take it more more of Sunce just

478
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:23,760
Speaker 2: to just to iggest that in terms of, well, when

479
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:27,280
Speaker 2: you were knee deep in these protests or whatever, like,

480
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 2: did you you're saying you did this at a young age? Correct?

481
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 8: Yes, I'm talking twelve years old around that age.

482
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:39,520
Speaker 2: So even then you had the wherewithal to even comprehend

483
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:42,960
Speaker 2: what you were doing and why you were doing it.

484
00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:46,200
Speaker 2: Did you, and you're at twelve, did you feel as

485
00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:50,239
Speaker 2: though there was going to be an endgame or a

486
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 2: time period in which you wouldn't have to do this anymore?

487
00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:56,480
Speaker 2: Or I just feel I just.

488
00:30:56,440 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 8: Knew it was wrong. I was a child. My mother

489
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:05,720
Speaker 8: was an activist. My mother grew up in Maryon, Alabama.

490
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:10,320
Speaker 8: My mother went to high school with Coreta King and

491
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:13,479
Speaker 8: Andrew Young's wife. They all went to high school the

492
00:31:13,560 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 8: same grade, Lincoln Memorial High School and Marion and Alabama.

493
00:31:18,560 --> 00:31:21,760
Speaker 8: By the way, we don't know the proper story now

494
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:27,400
Speaker 8: Martin Luther King and Andrew Young married these two women

495
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 8: from Marion, which is about eight nine miles from Selma.

496
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 8: We don't know about brother Jackson who got hung and

497
00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:43,800
Speaker 8: Marian because of what you know, we talked about Selma.

498
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 8: It really started at Marion. But not to get on that,

499
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:52,360
Speaker 8: but my mother was really engraved in the civil rights movement,

500
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:56,160
Speaker 8: so I understood a lot. We're a kid, you don't

501
00:31:56,200 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 8: totally understand it, but you know wrong and you know

502
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,920
Speaker 8: you're being treated differently. And I had to go to therapy,

503
00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 8: years of therapy, years of therapy for racial trauma. And

504
00:32:11,680 --> 00:32:17,479
Speaker 8: if today women can talk about things that happened thirty

505
00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:21,840
Speaker 8: forty fifty years ago and sexual trauma, then we have

506
00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:27,320
Speaker 8: to acknowledge that also racial trauma impacts us.

507
00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 5: When would you When did you start that journey of

508
00:32:29,840 --> 00:32:31,480
Speaker 5: going to therapy and addressing that boy?

509
00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 4: How old were you?

510
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 8: Well, this was my adult I'm talking in two thousand

511
00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 8: and four or five.

512
00:32:40,560 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 7: Yeah, definitely a new trend for black men to talk

513
00:32:42,720 --> 00:32:44,959
Speaker 7: about going to therapy.

514
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 8: I was in therapy for I mean back to back

515
00:32:49,880 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 8: weekly therapy for almost ten years, and at the beginning

516
00:32:56,280 --> 00:33:00,120
Speaker 8: didn't quite understand it because I had this personality and

517
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:02,120
Speaker 8: still have to work on it, still have to work

518
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 8: on it, this compulsive, compulsive personality, you know, Uh, I love.

519
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 8: I don't know if that impacted cranes in the sky,

520
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 8: but when line say I drank too much, dance too much,

521
00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 8: a party too much, that was me. You know, I

522
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:24,920
Speaker 8: did everything to damn much.

523
00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 4: Try to drink it.

524
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:33,040
Speaker 8: Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, And so that that was me

525
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:36,800
Speaker 8: and doing that period just compulsive, gotta do more, gotta

526
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:40,360
Speaker 8: do more, gotta do more, got to do more, not enough,

527
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 8: And so I had to come to grips of that.

528
00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 8: It actually cost me my marriage, uh that that behavior,

529
00:33:47,400 --> 00:33:52,479
Speaker 8: and I hold I take responsibility and accountability for that.

530
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:56,080
Speaker 8: I don't run a high from that, but you know

531
00:33:56,240 --> 00:34:00,160
Speaker 8: it was up. When I finally met and got a

532
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 8: black male therapist, things change for me.

533
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:14,680
Speaker 5: You find one of them, Oh my god.

534
00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:16,160
Speaker 8: Yeah, that's that's one in Dallas, Texas. A brother there

535
00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:20,959
Speaker 8: that uh really really impacted because I had been going

536
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:25,720
Speaker 8: to a Jewish, white woman from New York who was traditional. Uh,

537
00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:32,759
Speaker 8: you know all the acromyms. Uh. And and this brother said, no, no,

538
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:36,759
Speaker 8: let's go back to your childhood from a different perspective.

539
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:41,200
Speaker 8: Let's what was the trauma. And the trauma was you

540
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:45,279
Speaker 8: were a kid fearful of your life. The trauma was,

541
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:50,360
Speaker 8: you know, you were taught to feel not as as

542
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:54,440
Speaker 8: as equal, less than that. You had to do all

543
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:58,480
Speaker 8: of this stuff to get acknowledgment. Uh. And it's when

544
00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:01,960
Speaker 8: I began to understand that better. And I still have

545
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:05,840
Speaker 8: to work on it. I can see up touches up touching.

546
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:11,440
Speaker 2: I'm gonna tell y'all, this is almost I want you

547
00:35:11,440 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 2: to to take over this interview because, like you don't know,

548
00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:17,279
Speaker 2: in my head, in my head right now, I'm like

549
00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:21,720
Speaker 2: really trying to hold back the team, like this is ship.

550
00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:27,480
Speaker 2: I wish, like my my main regret was like right now,

551
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:33,320
Speaker 2: I'm just really overwhelmed talking to hear an older black

552
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 2: man talk this way, because like I'm in my head,

553
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:40,759
Speaker 2: I'm like, damn man, like this is ship. This is

554
00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:44,760
Speaker 2: the evolution I wish my dad had went through before

555
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:47,760
Speaker 2: he passed away, Like he kinda he kind of landed

556
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 2: the plane nicely maybe in like the last sort of

557
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 2: like the last year of his life when he knew

558
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 2: he was gonna leave, you know, and then we finally

559
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:57,799
Speaker 2: like you know, because like black men just didn't talk

560
00:35:57,840 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 2: about feelings.

561
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 7: Boomers, especially boomers, like I have math, doctor Knowles is

562
00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:04,479
Speaker 7: the exception to the rule.

563
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:08,680
Speaker 2: But yeah, like this is really I really have no

564
00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:09,920
Speaker 2: questions left, Like I'm just.

565
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:14,120
Speaker 7: And I just asked, Okay, so this is my question

566
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:16,600
Speaker 7: because you said you did some racial therapy, and it's

567
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:18,680
Speaker 7: interesting because I thought about something when a mir said

568
00:36:18,719 --> 00:36:21,640
Speaker 7: said something about the way his parents raised him about

569
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:24,200
Speaker 7: not being daydreamers and stuff, and it seems like the

570
00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 7: reason to go toward the racial part is because and

571
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 7: the reason sometimes for a black therapist is because it's

572
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,279
Speaker 7: so the trauma is so deep and generational that you

573
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:37,319
Speaker 7: need to understand why that generation before didn't allow for

574
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:39,320
Speaker 7: day dreaming because they didn't feel like it was allowed.

575
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:40,840
Speaker 4: That was how to protect themselves.

576
00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:44,440
Speaker 7: Everything that we do has such a cause, and a

577
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 7: lot of us just don't even we think that it's

578
00:36:46,200 --> 00:36:48,320
Speaker 7: just something fresh and new and something wrong with us,

579
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,800
Speaker 7: but it's so generational and generational trauma.

580
00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:55,200
Speaker 4: It's just and every generation is Oh, I'm sorry, go ahead.

581
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 8: No, no, no, no, you're all on the right path here.

582
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:03,160
Speaker 8: And again I I I learned and and and learned

583
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 8: so much. I mean, there was a part of me,

584
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:09,560
Speaker 8: a chaotic part of me, and I think we all

585
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:13,359
Speaker 8: have a chaotic part of ourselves that we have come

586
00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:17,080
Speaker 8: to come to grips with. And in that process was

587
00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:21,000
Speaker 8: just a lot I learned, Uh, like a rotticized rage.

588
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:22,720
Speaker 8: Probably a word you never heard before.

589
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:27,719
Speaker 4: Rage, Yes, okay, got it?

590
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 8: Okay, sure, he's a therapeutic term. I because I was

591
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:37,919
Speaker 8: the skinny black kid. The coaching junior high school asked

592
00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:40,920
Speaker 8: me to play basketball. And I was always the last

593
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:43,080
Speaker 8: kid to get picked on the sand loot with the

594
00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:45,800
Speaker 8: black kids. But he thought I could play, but I couldn't.

595
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:52,359
Speaker 4: Uh, but you looked the part.

596
00:37:52,560 --> 00:38:01,520
Speaker 5: But yeah, like.

597
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:01,920
Speaker 8: Black talk of must playing basketball. But you know, I

598
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:06,760
Speaker 8: picked up kind of quickly and and and then something happened.

599
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:13,200
Speaker 8: I understood quickly that by being a basketball star, it

600
00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 8: gave me privileges, and so I started dating white girls,

601
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:25,399
Speaker 8: and started dating white girls only in Alabama. But it

602
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:29,680
Speaker 8: was you know, it wasn't over. You couldn't just be

603
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:34,640
Speaker 8: out there with it you know, but it made me

604
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:38,640
Speaker 8: and my mother was a good mom, but some things

605
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:42,120
Speaker 8: as all of us. She used to tell me, and

606
00:38:42,160 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 8: it was embedded, don't you ever bring no black napping

607
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:48,360
Speaker 8: head girl in my house? Trauma?

608
00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:53,480
Speaker 5: So from so hearing it from your and you were

609
00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:56,279
Speaker 5: hearing that from your mother. Your mother told you not

610
00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:58,319
Speaker 5: to bring no not to bring no black girls home.

611
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:03,960
Speaker 8: Right, no nappy, But she would have been okay if

612
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:05,400
Speaker 8: she was light complexion.

613
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:08,520
Speaker 2: She passed the paperbag test.

614
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 7: Then right, mister knows you're making me so happy with

615
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:12,919
Speaker 7: this conversation right now.

616
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:17,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, this is the first. I didn't even think conversations

617
00:39:17,920 --> 00:39:22,480
Speaker 2: like this could happen with any black person, at least

618
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,719
Speaker 2: not born before nineteen seventy five.

619
00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:30,120
Speaker 7: Because are you basically admitting that she had an effect

620
00:39:30,160 --> 00:39:34,080
Speaker 7: on your choices in that way too, like subconsciously, because yeah.

621
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:34,080
Speaker 2: She.

622
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 8: Understood that, you know she, but a lot happened, a

623
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:46,680
Speaker 8: lot happened to black folks that we don't understand those impacts.

624
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:51,200
Speaker 8: And I'll just let you guys ask the question, because

625
00:39:51,239 --> 00:39:54,200
Speaker 8: this is is going to a place, this conversation that

626
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:56,640
Speaker 8: I think the universe wanted it to go.

627
00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:57,919
Speaker 7: I think so.

628
00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:04,240
Speaker 2: For it serious question.

629
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,960
Speaker 4: I got, so how did you okay?

630
00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,759
Speaker 5: So in this and throughout this journey, one thing that

631
00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:15,880
Speaker 5: came to mind was once you got to the point

632
00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 5: where you were successful and you know, you got your

633
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:21,080
Speaker 5: girls careers kind of off the ground, and Deston Strode

634
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,680
Speaker 5: was pointing everything, how did you fight against that? I

635
00:40:24,680 --> 00:40:27,960
Speaker 5: guess that survivor's guilt or that survivors were more kind

636
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:31,000
Speaker 5: of like seeing how far you've come and realizing like,

637
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:33,920
Speaker 5: oh my god, like I actually made it, so to speak,

638
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:37,040
Speaker 5: you know, how did you fight against when you talk

639
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:41,080
Speaker 5: about just those old traumas, old uh no, bad behaviors.

640
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:44,680
Speaker 5: How did you stop from I guess self sabotaging yourself

641
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:47,040
Speaker 5: in that way or were you able to you know.

642
00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:51,160
Speaker 8: I had to go through this process of understanding why.

643
00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:56,000
Speaker 8: Like I said, it cost me dearly. But to your

644
00:40:56,120 --> 00:41:02,200
Speaker 8: question of feeling guilty about success, you know, my dad

645
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 8: again my parents, My dad was a volunteer fireman. He

646
00:41:06,760 --> 00:41:09,520
Speaker 8: wanted to be that was his dream, was to be

647
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:14,879
Speaker 8: a fireman. But you couldn't be a fireman in Alabama, Gaston, Alabama.

648
00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 8: We're talking the sixties if you were black. So my

649
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:25,759
Speaker 8: dad used to my dad was six or four hundred pounds.

650
00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:27,120
Speaker 8: Call him big mac.

651
00:41:29,239 --> 00:41:29,479
Speaker 2: Oh.

652
00:41:30,120 --> 00:41:36,320
Speaker 8: And there's one word to describe my dad gentle. Gentle.

653
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:41,279
Speaker 8: All he did was help people. So this whole thing

654
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:45,280
Speaker 8: about giving back, I don't feel guilty about success because

655
00:41:46,760 --> 00:41:49,719
Speaker 8: I learned as a kid watching my parents give back

656
00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 8: to their communities and giving back to help people. So

657
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 8: I can I can say I never felt guilt guilt

658
00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:01,759
Speaker 8: from success because I worked very hard for it and

659
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:09,880
Speaker 8: was fortunate to find my passion early in life, which

660
00:42:10,080 --> 00:42:15,440
Speaker 8: was the ability to communicate effectively.

661
00:42:14,239 --> 00:42:16,399
Speaker 5: In the early days when y'all were when you were

662
00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:18,680
Speaker 5: when you were misnos and y'all were working with the

663
00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 5: girls and doing Justin's Child. How did you learn, I guess,

664
00:42:23,120 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 5: to kind of differentiate between being the dad and being

665
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:30,120
Speaker 5: the manager, being the coach. You know what I'm saying, like,

666
00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 5: how did you know? How did you kind of, I

667
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:33,760
Speaker 5: guess compartmentalize all those roles.

668
00:42:33,880 --> 00:42:35,680
Speaker 8: Well, that was That's a good question, you know. I

669
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:40,880
Speaker 8: have to say I'm guilty of last night watching Jermaine Dupries,

670
00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:44,080
Speaker 8: the show called something.

671
00:42:43,800 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 4: Rap the Kids, the one with the Kids.

672
00:42:49,760 --> 00:42:54,560
Speaker 8: I mean I watched six or seven episodes. In every

673
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:56,920
Speaker 8: episode had about five or six I mean, I was

674
00:42:57,040 --> 00:43:00,960
Speaker 8: up about four hours. I couldn't and they had the

675
00:43:01,080 --> 00:43:05,480
Speaker 8: parents and the kids. They were all between twelve and sixteen.

676
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:09,040
Speaker 8: You know. Fortunate for me again, I did twenty years

677
00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:13,880
Speaker 8: of corporate America, so I brought a different skill set

678
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 8: to the music industry than most. And you know, most

679
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 8: people and media would have what I call the Jedi

680
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 8: mind trick. Have you to believe that I left corporate

681
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:32,200
Speaker 8: America to be Beyonces manager and that's not true. I

682
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:36,080
Speaker 8: left and they always say Xerox. Well, I left Xerox

683
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:38,719
Speaker 8: in nineteen eighty eight, and then I was one of

684
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 8: the first blacks, and in my life have followed this

685
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 8: pattern of one of the first blacks, So listen to

686
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 8: me through I was fortunately and grateful to work at

687
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:54,200
Speaker 8: Xerox Corporation in the eighties, which was a number one

688
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:59,200
Speaker 8: corporation for blacks, and I was the president of Minorities

689
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:04,040
Speaker 8: United and othern Region, which was about four hundred black employees.

690
00:44:04,160 --> 00:44:06,920
Speaker 8: I was a president of that organization for three years.

691
00:44:08,280 --> 00:44:11,760
Speaker 8: I was fortunate to be the number one sells rep

692
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:17,760
Speaker 8: worldwide at Xerox Medical Systems three out of four years.

693
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:22,640
Speaker 8: To be the first or one of the first blacks,

694
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:27,719
Speaker 8: I'm not sure to sell mri CT scanners in America

695
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:33,560
Speaker 8: what and to be a neural surgical specialist with Johnson

696
00:44:33,600 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 8: and Johnson. That's how I ended my career. People don't

697
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:45,000
Speaker 8: know my career is a neurosurgical specialists. I would work

698
00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:51,640
Speaker 8: with neurosurgeons and implants and certain surgical procedures dealing with

699
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:52,439
Speaker 8: the head and neck.

700
00:44:57,480 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 2: Okay, we kind of went way eep into the future

701
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:06,759
Speaker 2: of the eighties. But one question I had one When

702
00:45:06,800 --> 00:45:10,439
Speaker 2: did you leave Gaston, Alabama? And how did you wind

703
00:45:10,520 --> 00:45:11,280
Speaker 2: up in Houston.

704
00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:18,440
Speaker 8: I left Gaston, Alabama in nineteen seventy. I was fortunate

705
00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:22,360
Speaker 8: to have a number of scholarships and my mother wanted

706
00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:25,280
Speaker 8: me to stay close to home, so I accepted University

707
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:30,800
Speaker 8: of Tennessee. That's where I played basketball for two years

708
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:35,279
Speaker 8: and then transferred because I had never been to a

709
00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:38,880
Speaker 8: black school. And we had scrimmage. You know how major

710
00:45:39,239 --> 00:45:43,120
Speaker 8: white school scrimmage a little small black schools. We had scrimmage

711
00:45:43,200 --> 00:45:49,080
Speaker 8: Fisk University in Nashville, and coach Ronald Lawson, when he

712
00:45:49,200 --> 00:45:53,040
Speaker 8: was leaving the floor, whispered in my ear knows if

713
00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:56,680
Speaker 8: you ever want to come to black school, you have

714
00:45:56,719 --> 00:46:00,759
Speaker 8: a full scholarship, and so I ended up ansferring to

715
00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:06,720
Speaker 8: Fist University, uh and and graduated there in seventy four.

716
00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:11,240
Speaker 8: Worked at AT and T for a year and a half,

717
00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:14,160
Speaker 8: and then me and my frat brothers a Miliga five

718
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:15,080
Speaker 8: for Turner.

719
00:46:14,840 --> 00:46:21,000
Speaker 4: T blowing up. What was amazing before we go? What

720
00:46:21,040 --> 00:46:22,600
Speaker 4: was what did you study in this?

721
00:46:23,080 --> 00:46:25,920
Speaker 8: I had a degree in economics and one in business okay,

722
00:46:26,000 --> 00:46:30,200
Speaker 8: got business administration. Uh and we we actually, me and

723
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 8: three frat brothers got in my ninety eight ozamobile at

724
00:46:34,120 --> 00:46:37,279
Speaker 8: the University of Tennessee. Gave me you know, used to

725
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,799
Speaker 8: get cars and stuff. It was legal work there back

726
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:44,839
Speaker 8: back in the seventies. You know, you can do that. Uh.

727
00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:51,759
Speaker 8: And we Tennessee State played Texas Southern and we got

728
00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:55,480
Speaker 8: to Houston and we were like, man, wait a minute,

729
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:58,799
Speaker 8: something's wrong. These frat brothers got these good jobs, man,

730
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:04,200
Speaker 8: and they weren't even smart as us. So I just

731
00:47:04,239 --> 00:47:08,680
Speaker 8: got in the car December sixth, nineteen seventy six and

732
00:47:09,680 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 8: made one stop, which was a crazy stop, but got

733
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:19,440
Speaker 8: to Houston and had a job. I mean I literally

734
00:47:19,520 --> 00:47:22,960
Speaker 8: worked at the Near Business Products and Pidney Bowls at

735
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:27,320
Speaker 8: the same time for a month for the same at

736
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:30,319
Speaker 8: the same time for a month. Because what they used

737
00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:33,440
Speaker 8: to do was to give you a big book and

738
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,120
Speaker 8: you would go and study at your apartment and then

739
00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:38,520
Speaker 8: they would send you to training. So I wouldn't. I

740
00:47:38,520 --> 00:47:41,279
Speaker 8: would say, wait a minute, I could do that at

741
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:44,040
Speaker 8: my apartment and get paid by both of them. So

742
00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:46,359
Speaker 8: I got paid by both of them, and then I

743
00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:48,399
Speaker 8: ended up taking the Pitney bowls job.

744
00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:56,759
Speaker 9: They used to be the leader, and you used to

745
00:47:56,840 --> 00:47:59,799
Speaker 9: have to if you were in a business, you had

746
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 9: to machine that did the mailing and postage.

747
00:48:03,719 --> 00:48:09,040
Speaker 8: It was still envelopes and stamp stamp envelopes. It was

748
00:48:09,120 --> 00:48:12,640
Speaker 8: like the number one leader in that area, but it

749
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:14,360
Speaker 8: was I was. I was in sales and marketing.

750
00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:17,719
Speaker 7: You're telling us you're like the ultimate salesperson, and I

751
00:48:17,719 --> 00:48:21,359
Speaker 7: think oftentimes people don't realize the talent that it takes

752
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:25,000
Speaker 7: to be a sales person like that, like especially on

753
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:27,680
Speaker 7: equipment and things of that nature, Like that's a whole

754
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:31,360
Speaker 7: nother talent that now I see the transitions well into management.

755
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:34,520
Speaker 4: Now you're selling yourself. You ain't selling the product. You

756
00:48:34,640 --> 00:48:34,960
Speaker 4: hit it.

757
00:48:35,120 --> 00:48:39,359
Speaker 8: You hit it on the head. People by you then

758
00:48:39,440 --> 00:48:43,200
Speaker 8: your product. And in the music industry always tell my

759
00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:47,279
Speaker 8: artists you. I call it the three second rule. When

760
00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:50,279
Speaker 8: you see a new person for the first time, in

761
00:48:50,440 --> 00:48:54,399
Speaker 8: three seconds, your brain comes up with what you think

762
00:48:54,440 --> 00:48:58,720
Speaker 8: about them. You say they're attracted, they're not so smart,

763
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:03,359
Speaker 8: or whatever. It is your brain in three seconds, and

764
00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:07,400
Speaker 8: it's hard to change that opinion once someone has opinion

765
00:49:07,480 --> 00:49:10,680
Speaker 8: of you. Hmm, three seconds.

766
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:16,600
Speaker 2: Okay, So okay, if you apply that, I'm certain that

767
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:19,600
Speaker 2: you well, you're at least in a field in which

768
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:22,800
Speaker 2: you know you have to make an impression. It's okay

769
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:26,160
Speaker 2: now that you say that. Now I really regret a

770
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:30,200
Speaker 2: lot of life decisions because in my profession, now, I'll

771
00:49:30,239 --> 00:49:34,239
Speaker 2: be honest with you. In my profession, I thought our

772
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:39,560
Speaker 2: advantage was if you underestimated me. And that's a lesson

773
00:49:39,600 --> 00:49:44,120
Speaker 2: that Richard taught me. Because here's the thing. My late manager, Richard,

774
00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:47,920
Speaker 2: who passed away from leukemia. He rich rich was a

775
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:52,080
Speaker 2: guy who's I mean to say mensa. To say mensa

776
00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:55,600
Speaker 2: level genius would be an understatement when it comes to

777
00:49:55,719 --> 00:50:00,080
Speaker 2: rich But because of rich also taught me the value

778
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:05,920
Speaker 2: of what he would call primitive exotica, which was he

779
00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:11,960
Speaker 2: knew that there was a sort of curious fetishize factor

780
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:19,880
Speaker 2: about him that interest certain prominent white people. Here's a

781
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:23,160
Speaker 2: great example, Norman Lear creator.

782
00:50:23,800 --> 00:50:26,120
Speaker 8: I mean I met him and yeah.

783
00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:29,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, Norman is actually ninety nine now, like he's still alive.

784
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:33,239
Speaker 2: We happen to be at an event in la and

785
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:36,239
Speaker 2: Rich is the kind of guy that, you know, like

786
00:50:36,320 --> 00:50:39,360
Speaker 2: when white people discover like that smart black guy that

787
00:50:39,480 --> 00:50:41,799
Speaker 2: really impresses them, almost like it's like their new toy,

788
00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:43,920
Speaker 2: that sort of thing, like that's the person that Rich was.

789
00:50:44,040 --> 00:50:47,560
Speaker 2: Rich was the guy that read science books and all

790
00:50:47,560 --> 00:50:50,040
Speaker 2: these things, and so you know, he would sort of

791
00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:54,680
Speaker 2: just work his stick, knowing that people were underestimating him

792
00:50:55,400 --> 00:50:59,320
Speaker 2: as he spoke, but realizing like wow, how amazingly smart

793
00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:01,319
Speaker 2: he is. And next thing, you know, like Norman Lear

794
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:04,640
Speaker 2: literally said, can you go on tour with me? And

795
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:07,200
Speaker 2: Rich trying to explain like no, I'm actually a manager

796
00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:09,439
Speaker 2: of like a band and I have a real job,

797
00:51:09,480 --> 00:51:11,960
Speaker 2: but Norman's like, no, I just I want you to.

798
00:51:12,680 --> 00:51:15,000
Speaker 2: And Rich actually spent two weeks with Norman Lear in

799
00:51:15,080 --> 00:51:18,680
Speaker 2: Beverly Hills and Norman just took him to every all

800
00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:21,200
Speaker 2: this friends, like look at my new I know this

801
00:51:21,280 --> 00:51:23,960
Speaker 2: sounds really weird, like it's the update of the toy.

802
00:51:24,320 --> 00:51:26,719
Speaker 7: But I know Richard looks like and rich is a

803
00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:30,520
Speaker 7: nice chocolate brother with locks, and it's very right.

804
00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:34,000
Speaker 2: But Rich also knew that the scary factor, like the

805
00:51:34,040 --> 00:51:36,560
Speaker 2: fact that if you see rich in the first three seconds,

806
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:39,920
Speaker 2: you're thinking of the scariest thing, and then you know,

807
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:44,000
Speaker 2: he starts with this Harvard you know, intelligency a thing,

808
00:51:44,239 --> 00:51:48,920
Speaker 2: and that just totally throws you off. And I don't know,

809
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:53,200
Speaker 2: like I think in our service, I'm now trying to

810
00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:57,479
Speaker 2: unlearn everything that rich taught me. And because the way

811
00:51:57,520 --> 00:51:59,719
Speaker 2: that we entered through the gates was to always be

812
00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:02,759
Speaker 2: under estimated. Like people see the roots and like, oh

813
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:05,280
Speaker 2: my god, what are you all like arrest development PM

814
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:09,640
Speaker 2: doing like yellow whack wearing birkenstocks and all those things.

815
00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:12,400
Speaker 2: But then we start playing and be like, you know,

816
00:52:12,440 --> 00:52:15,799
Speaker 2: it's like when when Dame Dash shit on Kanye's Westing, like,

817
00:52:15,800 --> 00:52:18,800
Speaker 2: oh shit, it's not whack, Like, oh, these guys are good.

818
00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:23,320
Speaker 2: We I sort of used that factor for the longest.

819
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:26,680
Speaker 2: Instead of trying to make a good impression, I would

820
00:52:26,680 --> 00:52:27,320
Speaker 2: always try.

821
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,719
Speaker 4: To go through the door to make lower the expectation.

822
00:52:31,480 --> 00:52:35,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I lived life trying to lower expectations and

823
00:52:35,160 --> 00:52:39,520
Speaker 2: then I'm now noticing now thirty years later that maybe

824
00:52:39,600 --> 00:52:41,240
Speaker 2: that didn't serve me too well.

825
00:52:42,160 --> 00:52:45,719
Speaker 8: Well, you know, we all learned and and I'm sure

826
00:52:45,719 --> 00:52:49,120
Speaker 8: he was a really really good manager, but we have

827
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:54,040
Speaker 8: different perspectives. I think for me, it's the reveal, just

828
00:52:54,080 --> 00:52:57,160
Speaker 8: similar to when you see an artist for the first

829
00:52:57,200 --> 00:53:00,200
Speaker 8: time come out on stage. You know, we have use

830
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:04,120
Speaker 8: the world we work on that reveal those first three seconds.

831
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:06,880
Speaker 8: Think about it for a second when you see Solange

832
00:53:06,880 --> 00:53:10,400
Speaker 8: and Beyonce, what happens in the first three seconds of

833
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:10,960
Speaker 8: their show.

834
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:14,359
Speaker 2: Dude, you don't even have to tell me. Matter of fact,

835
00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:17,480
Speaker 2: the first time I ever met you, the first time

836
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:22,520
Speaker 2: I met you, you know, Beyonce was starting her uh

837
00:53:23,600 --> 00:53:25,920
Speaker 2: her first solo tour, the one that she did with

838
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:31,399
Speaker 2: Missy and Alicia and my first yeah, first tour.

839
00:53:31,719 --> 00:53:31,919
Speaker 8: Yeah.

840
00:53:32,000 --> 00:53:37,239
Speaker 2: And by that point I had seen maybe three of

841
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:39,279
Speaker 2: her shows, in which you know, I always told her

842
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:41,640
Speaker 2: like I was, really, I'm really impressed with your interests,

843
00:53:41,760 --> 00:53:46,080
Speaker 2: like you do these amazing The way that you enter

844
00:53:46,160 --> 00:53:50,840
Speaker 2: the stage is really, you know, crazy, like I So,

845
00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:53,759
Speaker 2: so when they came to town to Phi, I'm from Philadelphia,

846
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:56,520
Speaker 2: right before she goes on, I was like, Okay, so

847
00:53:56,640 --> 00:53:58,719
Speaker 2: what's the interest, Like, She's like, you're gonna see run

848
00:53:58,719 --> 00:54:02,120
Speaker 2: in the audience, stay stay by the soundboards. I didn't realize. Okay,

849
00:54:02,160 --> 00:54:04,680
Speaker 2: So she did the thing where she entered from the

850
00:54:04,719 --> 00:54:09,520
Speaker 2: back of the stadium with the gentleman carrying her on

851
00:54:09,560 --> 00:54:17,160
Speaker 2: the right. And the thing was is that I came

852
00:54:17,480 --> 00:54:19,920
Speaker 2: just to see how she was going to enter the stage,

853
00:54:19,960 --> 00:54:24,799
Speaker 2: because by that point, next to Michael Jackson, I've never

854
00:54:24,840 --> 00:54:31,160
Speaker 2: met anyone that really really concentrated hard on making a

855
00:54:31,239 --> 00:54:34,920
Speaker 2: first one, like a good impression on the first minute.

856
00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:39,279
Speaker 2: And I also I learned another thing that show at

857
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:42,279
Speaker 2: least five minutes later. Okay, So the way that the

858
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:46,200
Speaker 2: stage is set up at one point, if you if

859
00:54:46,360 --> 00:54:49,240
Speaker 2: those who were listening to the podcast, if you remember

860
00:54:49,280 --> 00:54:52,360
Speaker 2: like those old like sort of like Vegas review shows

861
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:55,680
Speaker 2: where the person's name would be spelled out in lights

862
00:54:55,719 --> 00:54:58,680
Speaker 2: like a bunch of light bulbs. There was one light

863
00:54:58,719 --> 00:55:05,160
Speaker 2: bulb out on the letter oh of Beyonce, and I

864
00:55:05,239 --> 00:55:09,839
Speaker 2: saw you lose your mind in the sound and then

865
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:13,640
Speaker 2: suddenly I stopped watching her show for like twenty minutes,

866
00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:17,360
Speaker 2: and suddenly I'd never seen like this is my Malcolm

867
00:55:17,600 --> 00:55:20,080
Speaker 2: X moment where the guy goes up to him in

868
00:55:20,080 --> 00:55:21,200
Speaker 2: the cafeteria.

869
00:55:21,520 --> 00:55:26,600
Speaker 1: Talk police like that exactly, like I've.

870
00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:33,680
Speaker 2: Never seen one person bark in order and sent twelve

871
00:55:33,719 --> 00:55:36,520
Speaker 2: people absolutely running to the hills for their lives to

872
00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:40,400
Speaker 2: fix one light bulb on stage. I've never seen that

873
00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:40,960
Speaker 2: in my life.

874
00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:46,840
Speaker 8: And and you know why, because that light bulb was blinking,

875
00:55:47,360 --> 00:55:49,919
Speaker 8: which could affected Beyonce's concentration.

876
00:55:50,320 --> 00:55:53,560
Speaker 4: Oh yes, hit at the show.

877
00:55:53,760 --> 00:55:58,520
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, I watched you for the next twenty minutes

878
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:03,160
Speaker 2: because you know, normally, Matt Setting, I'm on stage, and

879
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:07,839
Speaker 2: I'd never get to see, you know, the running by show,

880
00:56:07,880 --> 00:56:10,240
Speaker 2: because if I'm at a concert, I'm watching the show

881
00:56:10,840 --> 00:56:13,000
Speaker 2: or I'm on stage. So this is one of the

882
00:56:13,080 --> 00:56:16,480
Speaker 2: rare moments where I'm watching someone run the show in

883
00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:17,920
Speaker 2: a way that I never ever.

884
00:56:17,800 --> 00:56:25,520
Speaker 8: Ever And most people don't realize Destiny's Child entire performance

885
00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:33,200
Speaker 8: career Beyonce's first three or four world tours, so lunge

886
00:56:33,719 --> 00:56:37,160
Speaker 8: first tours, I did the front of the house sound,

887
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:42,880
Speaker 8: Oh wow, And I did that because Destiny's Child did

888
00:56:43,280 --> 00:56:47,560
Speaker 8: if their first tour was with Boys to Men, And

889
00:56:47,600 --> 00:56:53,200
Speaker 8: when you have four ladies singing and everyone played a

890
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:57,319
Speaker 8: role one person in between songs, that's who talk to

891
00:56:57,360 --> 00:57:01,080
Speaker 8: the audience, and so I would in and out, punch

892
00:57:01,160 --> 00:57:03,600
Speaker 8: in and out vocals, and we had the back ground

893
00:57:03,680 --> 00:57:10,200
Speaker 8: tracks on the tape. And so the engineer back then

894
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:13,920
Speaker 8: you paid the junior engineer fifty dollars a show, but

895
00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:17,160
Speaker 8: he didn't know who was singing and when he didn't

896
00:57:17,200 --> 00:57:22,919
Speaker 8: know the show, and so it sounded awful. And I said, hey,

897
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:27,240
Speaker 8: teach me, teach me. And so from that point when

898
00:57:27,280 --> 00:57:29,880
Speaker 8: we're doing TV tracks, and then when we got to

899
00:57:30,320 --> 00:57:33,680
Speaker 8: when Beyonce was doing band, I didn't do the band,

900
00:57:33,880 --> 00:57:37,720
Speaker 8: but I always did Beyonce's and vocals.

901
00:57:37,920 --> 00:57:39,880
Speaker 7: How long did it take for you to master that?

902
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:45,200
Speaker 8: I mastered it quick. I mastered like two or three

903
00:57:45,240 --> 00:57:50,560
Speaker 8: shows because I just knew when to put the delays,

904
00:57:50,760 --> 00:57:52,840
Speaker 8: when to punch in, punch out. I mean, these are

905
00:57:52,920 --> 00:58:01,760
Speaker 8: things people don't know about mequest Love. You know, they

906
00:58:01,760 --> 00:58:02,720
Speaker 8: don't know this at all.

907
00:58:03,440 --> 00:58:07,479
Speaker 2: Okay. So the thing is is that, Okay, so when

908
00:58:07,520 --> 00:58:10,360
Speaker 2: you when you get to Houston, I don't know the

909
00:58:10,400 --> 00:58:11,960
Speaker 2: exact year that you moved.

910
00:58:11,920 --> 00:58:17,160
Speaker 8: But December sixteen, sixty seventy six, okay, all right, nineteen

911
00:58:17,160 --> 00:58:17,720
Speaker 8: seventy six.

912
00:58:18,880 --> 00:58:22,480
Speaker 2: When you are developing, first of all, how do you

913
00:58:22,600 --> 00:58:27,240
Speaker 2: know that the talent that your kids have, how do

914
00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:31,840
Speaker 2: you know that? It's it's beyond just like performing at

915
00:58:31,840 --> 00:58:35,919
Speaker 2: family functions and Thanksgiving Like I used to be called

916
00:58:35,920 --> 00:58:37,560
Speaker 2: to the table all the time to do the robot.

917
00:58:37,640 --> 00:58:41,439
Speaker 2: I mean, do the Michael Jackson real quick. That's where

918
00:58:41,480 --> 00:58:44,440
Speaker 2: it comes from. Every parent has that story where they

919
00:58:44,520 --> 00:58:47,160
Speaker 2: you know, they wake up the kid from sleep and

920
00:58:47,280 --> 00:58:49,040
Speaker 2: you know they're having a party downstairs. All right, A right,

921
00:58:49,120 --> 00:58:54,600
Speaker 2: go singing reatha Franklin. Right, Wait what you.

922
00:58:54,480 --> 00:59:02,080
Speaker 7: Saying, Teddy? You My parents was good parents.

923
00:59:02,520 --> 00:59:03,280
Speaker 4: I know what I'm saying.

924
00:59:03,320 --> 00:59:05,520
Speaker 5: What I'm cur I'm just trying what song did you sing?

925
00:59:05,560 --> 00:59:07,720
Speaker 5: I'm trying to hear what keys like? What he've been singing?

926
00:59:09,480 --> 00:59:11,120
Speaker 5: Oh you would sing close the door.

927
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:16,200
Speaker 4: I don't know what I'm saying, close the door. You

928
00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:18,600
Speaker 4: would get that load, you could get that deep. That

929
00:59:18,680 --> 00:59:20,520
Speaker 4: was I was waiting all day long.

930
00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:22,680
Speaker 8: That was your point. You would have to know what

931
00:59:22,880 --> 00:59:24,120
Speaker 8: Keitt did she say? That is.

932
00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:26,880
Speaker 2: What?

933
00:59:27,160 --> 00:59:30,000
Speaker 7: Did I knew the words? It's that I knew the words.

934
00:59:32,360 --> 00:59:35,800
Speaker 5: I think you just might have won the animated the

935
00:59:35,960 --> 00:59:38,920
Speaker 5: real like you're seeing closed the door and ship.

936
00:59:41,280 --> 00:59:44,440
Speaker 8: That wasn't that was Teddy made pendograss.

937
00:59:46,480 --> 00:59:52,080
Speaker 2: You I have jokes.

938
00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:56,640
Speaker 8: I'm quick if I jokes man, what's your sign? I'm sorry,

939
00:59:56,680 --> 00:59:57,800
Speaker 8: I'm just coppricoid.

940
00:59:59,040 --> 01:00:02,440
Speaker 4: Indeed, yes, indeed, where's your birthday?

941
01:00:02,560 --> 01:00:03,280
Speaker 8: January night?

942
01:00:03,800 --> 01:00:05,720
Speaker 4: Okay German, I'm December twenty eighth.

943
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:11,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, Capricorn. Sorry, Steve, we are, yeah, we are. Steven's

944
01:00:11,720 --> 01:00:14,120
Speaker 2: your birthday soon? Right? Yeah?

945
01:00:14,560 --> 01:00:19,280
Speaker 6: September sixth, Virgos, We're amazing people. We just can't figure

946
01:00:19,280 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 6: out what to order in a restaurant. But other than that,

947
01:00:21,360 --> 01:00:23,320
Speaker 6: it's pretty great.

948
01:00:23,840 --> 01:00:26,480
Speaker 8: You are amazing people. Beyonce September fourth.

949
01:00:27,080 --> 01:00:30,440
Speaker 1: Damn ye, what's there?

950
01:00:30,480 --> 01:00:38,640
Speaker 2: You go? All right? So when how do you know

951
01:00:38,960 --> 01:00:43,280
Speaker 2: that this is much more than yeah, just you know,

952
01:00:43,680 --> 01:00:45,800
Speaker 2: good for good for the church choir? How do you

953
01:00:45,920 --> 01:00:50,040
Speaker 2: know that? Okay, my my daughter might have something.

954
01:00:50,600 --> 01:00:55,800
Speaker 8: So parenting, you know, my I think the role of

955
01:00:55,880 --> 01:01:01,240
Speaker 8: a parent with their kids is to surround them with

956
01:01:01,560 --> 01:01:04,640
Speaker 8: as much as they can. I would take the girls,

957
01:01:04,920 --> 01:01:07,240
Speaker 8: and me and my former wife, who would take the

958
01:01:07,280 --> 01:01:10,240
Speaker 8: girls to, like I said, to the library. We would

959
01:01:10,240 --> 01:01:15,200
Speaker 8: take them and support their science fairs. We would get

960
01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:19,640
Speaker 8: them in dance lessons and so that they could figure

961
01:01:19,800 --> 01:01:24,200
Speaker 8: out and we could see what they gravitated towards and

962
01:01:24,640 --> 01:01:29,280
Speaker 8: both Solange and Beyonce gravitated towards music, and so then

963
01:01:29,440 --> 01:01:34,040
Speaker 8: we surrounded them even more with support. So for Beyonce,

964
01:01:35,080 --> 01:01:39,560
Speaker 8: she was in the she was eight years old. She

965
01:01:40,200 --> 01:01:43,840
Speaker 8: was in a talent show against twelve thirteen year old

966
01:01:43,960 --> 01:01:47,320
Speaker 8: kids and we were sitting there. It was her first

967
01:01:47,320 --> 01:01:52,400
Speaker 8: time performing, and she said, mom, dad, I'm ready to go,

968
01:01:52,600 --> 01:01:55,200
Speaker 8: so we can go eat because I need to win

969
01:01:55,240 --> 01:01:58,880
Speaker 8: one hundred dollars and get my trophy. And we said, well,

970
01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:01,920
Speaker 8: how do you know gonna win this talent show? And

971
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:06,800
Speaker 8: we weren't paying attention to a practicing or anything, and

972
01:02:06,880 --> 01:02:09,160
Speaker 8: she said, I just know, I just know, And sure

973
01:02:09,280 --> 01:02:13,120
Speaker 8: enough she got a stand innovation. Well, after she won

974
01:02:13,680 --> 01:02:21,080
Speaker 8: thirty one consecutive talent shows, we then start thinking, huh,

975
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:25,880
Speaker 8: maybe maybe this is what she really likes and maybe

976
01:02:25,920 --> 01:02:31,280
Speaker 8: this is what she might be one day entertainer. And

977
01:02:31,280 --> 01:02:35,440
Speaker 8: the same with Solon's, the same kind of story. I

978
01:02:35,440 --> 01:02:40,840
Speaker 8: gotta say this, Solon's did something really different. Solons when

979
01:02:40,920 --> 01:02:45,920
Speaker 8: she was about nine. One day we came home, she

980
01:02:46,040 --> 01:02:50,120
Speaker 8: was with the maids. She dismantled about twelve of Beyonce's

981
01:02:50,120 --> 01:02:56,080
Speaker 8: trophies totally completely dismantled them. I understand it now as

982
01:02:56,120 --> 01:02:57,800
Speaker 8: a parent, she would say, what about me?

983
01:02:58,160 --> 01:02:58,840
Speaker 2: What about me?

984
01:03:00,160 --> 01:03:00,200
Speaker 5: What?

985
01:03:00,600 --> 01:03:01,920
Speaker 7: Trophies don't mean nothing?

986
01:03:02,680 --> 01:03:04,520
Speaker 1: Wow?

987
01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:10,680
Speaker 2: Okay, so I know that and and sort of that,

988
01:03:10,960 --> 01:03:17,760
Speaker 2: uh what's his name? Blink? And the tipping point, Oh,

989
01:03:17,840 --> 01:03:22,720
Speaker 2: Malcolm Gladwell, Malcolm Gladwell out yeah, and outliers that you know,

990
01:03:22,760 --> 01:03:27,720
Speaker 2: he says that ten thousand hours of preparation equals genius.

991
01:03:28,400 --> 01:03:32,040
Speaker 2: I've seen, you know, some clips about you know, camp

992
01:03:32,120 --> 01:03:37,600
Speaker 2: Knowles or whatever, how you would train them how? Okay?

993
01:03:37,640 --> 01:03:42,840
Speaker 2: First of all, can you explain about the decision to

994
01:03:43,040 --> 01:03:49,680
Speaker 2: leave your cushy comfort job as as a salesman.

995
01:03:50,960 --> 01:03:52,439
Speaker 4: How your wife worked that out? Yeah?

996
01:03:52,800 --> 01:03:57,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, and yeah, what's the what was the decision to

997
01:03:57,560 --> 01:04:01,400
Speaker 2: really make the leap into Okay, I'm going to now

998
01:04:02,120 --> 01:04:06,200
Speaker 2: steer this, steer this empire to where it should go

999
01:04:06,400 --> 01:04:07,800
Speaker 2: so that we can have a legacy.

1000
01:04:08,040 --> 01:04:11,840
Speaker 8: So you know, when I was at Xerox Medical Systems,

1001
01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:15,680
Speaker 8: I told you I was highly successful there, highly successful

1002
01:04:15,720 --> 01:04:19,880
Speaker 8: at Phillips, not so much successful at Johnson and Johnson

1003
01:04:19,920 --> 01:04:26,440
Speaker 8: and that neurosurgic position. I didn't like it because you know,

1004
01:04:26,720 --> 01:04:30,440
Speaker 8: I came from selling a five million dollar piece of

1005
01:04:30,480 --> 01:04:36,280
Speaker 8: equipment to selling a whole bunch of thousand dollars instruments.

1006
01:04:36,960 --> 01:04:39,600
Speaker 8: And I didn't like that. I didn't like on the

1007
01:04:39,640 --> 01:04:43,160
Speaker 8: weekends going to the operating room and having a pager

1008
01:04:43,720 --> 01:04:46,760
Speaker 8: every other weekend. I just didn't like getting up at

1009
01:04:46,880 --> 01:04:48,840
Speaker 8: four in the morning going to surgery.

1010
01:04:49,800 --> 01:04:50,160
Speaker 2: And so.

1011
01:04:51,600 --> 01:04:55,560
Speaker 8: One of the hospitals in the medical system center after

1012
01:04:55,600 --> 01:05:00,280
Speaker 8: a procedure, I got paid. So I thought, did the

1013
01:05:00,280 --> 01:05:03,800
Speaker 8: patient die? Did I say something wrong? Did I do

1014
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:08,160
Speaker 8: something wrong? So I run up to the neurosurgeon's office

1015
01:05:08,200 --> 01:05:10,760
Speaker 8: and he tells me, miss knows, I can't use your

1016
01:05:10,800 --> 01:05:14,520
Speaker 8: instruments anymore. And I asked him why. He said, showed

1017
01:05:14,560 --> 01:05:18,640
Speaker 8: me the letter that if he didn't reduce his cost

1018
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:22,720
Speaker 8: per procedure. If he didn't reduce that he was not

1019
01:05:23,000 --> 01:05:27,320
Speaker 8: he was going to lose his privileges at that hospital. Wow,

1020
01:05:27,560 --> 01:05:33,600
Speaker 8: And no surgeon wants that because that's their livelihood. At

1021
01:05:33,640 --> 01:05:38,439
Speaker 8: that point, I call Tina, my former wife, and said,

1022
01:05:38,480 --> 01:05:41,360
Speaker 8: I can't do this shit anymore. Quote That's exactly what

1023
01:05:41,440 --> 01:05:45,840
Speaker 8: I said, because I was like, I'm not selling quality,

1024
01:05:45,880 --> 01:05:49,200
Speaker 8: I'm selling costs, and I just can't do that. I'm

1025
01:05:49,240 --> 01:05:51,960
Speaker 8: not really ready selling a whole bunch of little stuff,

1026
01:05:53,160 --> 01:05:56,080
Speaker 8: and I just didn't like what I was doing. So

1027
01:05:56,240 --> 01:05:58,960
Speaker 8: I realized at that moment that was a defining moment,

1028
01:05:59,000 --> 01:06:01,400
Speaker 8: and we all have the any moments in our lives

1029
01:06:01,880 --> 01:06:03,800
Speaker 8: that I had to do something else. I was gonna

1030
01:06:03,800 --> 01:06:08,120
Speaker 8: get fired anyway. So I knew I had to do

1031
01:06:08,160 --> 01:06:11,440
Speaker 8: something else, and I decided I wanted to change my career.

1032
01:06:12,480 --> 01:06:14,800
Speaker 8: What people don't know is when I was a kid,

1033
01:06:15,720 --> 01:06:19,439
Speaker 8: my dad had four hundred pounds, could dance his butt off.

1034
01:06:19,880 --> 01:06:23,400
Speaker 8: And they would go, my mom and dad on Sundays

1035
01:06:23,800 --> 01:06:26,160
Speaker 8: into the living room that had that plastic on it.

1036
01:06:26,240 --> 01:06:27,520
Speaker 8: Y'all too young to understand.

1037
01:06:27,680 --> 01:06:34,320
Speaker 4: Oh no, we're talking about my grandma still got plastic

1038
01:06:34,360 --> 01:06:35,240
Speaker 4: on the couch now.

1039
01:06:35,480 --> 01:06:39,480
Speaker 8: So they would go in there. Man, they started dancing,

1040
01:06:40,000 --> 01:06:43,240
Speaker 8: and my job was to put. I had a nickel

1041
01:06:43,280 --> 01:06:46,640
Speaker 8: of diamond a quarter, and we had vinyl, and my

1042
01:06:46,800 --> 01:06:50,440
Speaker 8: job was to put and look at that vinyl and finally,

1043
01:06:50,680 --> 01:06:53,280
Speaker 8: you know more, I heard it. I knew so it

1044
01:06:53,280 --> 01:06:56,439
Speaker 8: went scratched because my dad would get really mad when

1045
01:06:56,440 --> 01:07:00,520
Speaker 8: he was dancing if the record scratched. And so I

1046
01:07:00,600 --> 01:07:05,120
Speaker 8: then start reading the line of notes and I didn't realize,

1047
01:07:05,160 --> 01:07:08,680
Speaker 8: but I became a DJ every Sunday. They did this

1048
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:13,040
Speaker 8: every Sunday, you know they I knew I could tell

1049
01:07:13,080 --> 01:07:17,760
Speaker 8: by my dad's emotions what songs to play, and that's

1050
01:07:17,840 --> 01:07:21,640
Speaker 8: really what the DJ does. Anyway. I knew peaches and earths,

1051
01:07:21,760 --> 01:07:26,120
Speaker 8: closed my you know I do. I better put close

1052
01:07:26,240 --> 01:07:29,920
Speaker 8: my eyes on right now. Fast, fast dumbino. You know

1053
01:07:30,280 --> 01:07:32,960
Speaker 8: that was one of his jams. I knew if he

1054
01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:36,560
Speaker 8: wanted to do some tempo, I better do fast dumbino.

1055
01:07:37,040 --> 01:07:41,520
Speaker 8: But and most people not mostly hardly anybody knows that.

1056
01:07:42,240 --> 01:07:46,320
Speaker 8: In high school, I was actually we had a boy group.

1057
01:07:46,600 --> 01:07:49,400
Speaker 8: You know, back in the day, talent shows was a

1058
01:07:49,440 --> 01:07:52,440
Speaker 8: big thing in the black community. Uh but at our

1059
01:07:52,520 --> 01:07:56,080
Speaker 8: high school, we had a talent you know. We we won.

1060
01:07:56,240 --> 01:08:00,600
Speaker 8: Actually we did Psychedelic Shock by the tim Taste Temptations.

1061
01:08:02,920 --> 01:08:03,560
Speaker 4: That's where it's at.

1062
01:08:03,760 --> 01:08:07,720
Speaker 8: Yeah. And I just love music. I always love love

1063
01:08:07,800 --> 01:08:12,080
Speaker 8: the music. And so I decided. And at the same time,

1064
01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:18,160
Speaker 8: Beyonce was in this girl group called Girls Time. All

1065
01:08:18,240 --> 01:08:21,160
Speaker 8: I did because my former wife was we owned a

1066
01:08:21,240 --> 01:08:25,080
Speaker 8: hair salon and so on the weekends was her big days,

1067
01:08:25,120 --> 01:08:29,559
Speaker 8: and that's when the girls would practice Fridays and Saturdays. Uh,

1068
01:08:29,680 --> 01:08:32,960
Speaker 8: So I would drop her off at practice, go play basketball,

1069
01:08:33,400 --> 01:08:37,040
Speaker 8: come back and pick her up. Uh. And then they

1070
01:08:37,080 --> 01:08:40,280
Speaker 8: got to Star Search, which is like American Idol, and

1071
01:08:40,320 --> 01:08:43,000
Speaker 8: they lost, and I'm there. They asked me to come

1072
01:08:43,080 --> 01:08:46,960
Speaker 8: to bring all the wardrobe because the then managers thought

1073
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:49,479
Speaker 8: they were gonna win for a month and had a

1074
01:08:49,520 --> 01:08:53,120
Speaker 8: whole room just for the wardrobe. And then when they lost,

1075
01:08:53,360 --> 01:08:56,080
Speaker 8: I came up. I went up to air McMahon. I said, well,

1076
01:08:56,160 --> 01:08:59,760
Speaker 8: these kids are crying their hearts out. What what do

1077
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:03,519
Speaker 8: I do? And he said, I don't know why, mister know,

1078
01:09:04,400 --> 01:09:08,200
Speaker 8: Actually I don't know why. He had a Don Conelia's voice.

1079
01:09:08,520 --> 01:09:11,960
Speaker 8: He said, but everyone that consistently win on the show

1080
01:09:12,720 --> 01:09:17,040
Speaker 8: professionally go on to do nothing. It's the people that

1081
01:09:17,360 --> 01:09:24,519
Speaker 8: lose Aliyah justin timberlay Usser Alanas Marce said, I can

1082
01:09:24,600 --> 01:09:26,840
Speaker 8: go on and on that lost, they went on to

1083
01:09:26,880 --> 01:09:34,040
Speaker 8: be successful because they recommitted, rededicated, changed their organization. And

1084
01:09:34,120 --> 01:09:37,880
Speaker 8: I never forgot those words, and that.

1085
01:09:37,520 --> 01:09:40,040
Speaker 5: That makes sense because people that win think they want

1086
01:09:40,120 --> 01:09:42,920
Speaker 5: they think, oh I made it, and right, you didn't.

1087
01:09:42,920 --> 01:09:50,439
Speaker 8: Ray and so it's so it's interesting. It's like eighteen

1088
01:09:50,520 --> 01:09:53,800
Speaker 8: A list artists google it. Sometimes you'd be surprised all

1089
01:09:53,840 --> 01:09:59,240
Speaker 8: the people. But but, but I actually ended up because

1090
01:09:59,280 --> 01:10:02,320
Speaker 8: I have always believe in knowledge is power. So I

1091
01:10:02,400 --> 01:10:08,040
Speaker 8: went back to junior college, Houston Community College here in Houston,

1092
01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:13,639
Speaker 8: and on the weekends I took artist management, music production,

1093
01:10:14,400 --> 01:10:19,640
Speaker 8: and I took publishing on the weekends on Saturdays, and

1094
01:10:20,600 --> 01:10:25,040
Speaker 8: over a year period and went to every seminar I could,

1095
01:10:26,840 --> 01:10:29,439
Speaker 8: and I would be the guy you want to shut

1096
01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:33,080
Speaker 8: up because I keep asking every question. Everybody's shy and quiet.

1097
01:10:33,439 --> 01:10:35,120
Speaker 8: I'd be like, oh well how about this? And why

1098
01:10:35,120 --> 01:10:39,439
Speaker 8: do you do this? And and I understood relationships. Now

1099
01:10:39,520 --> 01:10:44,200
Speaker 8: this is what's going to surprise you. The first artists

1100
01:10:45,560 --> 01:10:51,480
Speaker 8: and Google is the first artist that I ever signed

1101
01:10:51,800 --> 01:10:55,760
Speaker 8: to a major record deal. And the first artist that

1102
01:10:55,960 --> 01:11:00,639
Speaker 8: I signed as a manager was not Destiny's Child who

1103
01:11:00,760 --> 01:11:06,120
Speaker 8: was it Little Old? His single is Can't Stop. He

1104
01:11:06,280 --> 01:11:09,679
Speaker 8: was signed to m c A Records in the peak

1105
01:11:10,320 --> 01:11:14,720
Speaker 8: when they had Mary J. Blige, Joessy P. Diddy. I

1106
01:11:14,760 --> 01:11:20,120
Speaker 8: can go on and on, little, oh, little Little, and

1107
01:11:20,200 --> 01:11:24,160
Speaker 8: the single is called can't Stop and it features Destiny.

1108
01:11:24,760 --> 01:11:28,000
Speaker 8: How the hell did I convince m c A Records

1109
01:11:28,320 --> 01:11:31,360
Speaker 8: to put a Columbia Records artist that didn't even have

1110
01:11:31,479 --> 01:11:36,720
Speaker 8: a record on his first single, but I did, but

1111
01:11:36,880 --> 01:11:41,640
Speaker 8: Little Oh was my first artist, a rap artist. The

1112
01:11:41,680 --> 01:11:43,080
Speaker 8: sample is loose ends.

1113
01:11:44,280 --> 01:11:46,240
Speaker 4: Wow, yeah, you can't stop the rain.

1114
01:11:48,160 --> 01:11:51,439
Speaker 2: Wait question, okay, because I didn't ask this about your

1115
01:11:51,520 --> 01:11:57,920
Speaker 2: Xerox thing, But who is is your communications expertise? Is

1116
01:11:57,960 --> 01:12:02,519
Speaker 2: that self taught or is this something you learned in college?

1117
01:12:02,560 --> 01:12:06,160
Speaker 2: Because yes, I do know that the key to a

1118
01:12:06,160 --> 01:12:12,000
Speaker 2: successful business person is one that remembers names and you know,

1119
01:12:12,040 --> 01:12:15,800
Speaker 2: it's personable as a people person, all things I kind

1120
01:12:15,800 --> 01:12:18,960
Speaker 2: of don't like about this industry. But I realized that

1121
01:12:19,120 --> 01:12:25,040
Speaker 2: I have to jump in the pool someone begrudgingly, but like,

1122
01:12:25,120 --> 01:12:29,200
Speaker 2: who taught you the art of communication? You know?

1123
01:12:29,320 --> 01:12:35,040
Speaker 8: My foundation is and was from Xerox Corporation. And if

1124
01:12:35,080 --> 01:12:41,519
Speaker 8: you reach the search, there's been so many presidents of corporations,

1125
01:12:42,040 --> 01:12:48,559
Speaker 8: black men and women that in the eighties talking back

1126
01:12:48,600 --> 01:12:51,479
Speaker 8: in the day seventies and eighties that worked at Xerox

1127
01:12:51,760 --> 01:12:55,920
Speaker 8: in Leedsburg, Virginia. There was actually a college that we

1128
01:12:55,960 --> 01:13:01,360
Speaker 8: would go to. I credit Xerox Corporation or all of

1129
01:13:01,400 --> 01:13:07,960
Speaker 8: my success and communications and understanding people and understanding how

1130
01:13:08,000 --> 01:13:13,439
Speaker 8: to sell myself build relationships. I always will credit them

1131
01:13:13,520 --> 01:13:19,719
Speaker 8: because they taught me and many others foundation that is unparallel.

1132
01:13:19,840 --> 01:13:24,200
Speaker 2: But it doesn't get exhausting like remembering names and terrible

1133
01:13:24,240 --> 01:13:25,920
Speaker 2: with that have have to.

1134
01:13:28,320 --> 01:13:30,840
Speaker 4: I remember faces faces I would never face.

1135
01:13:31,200 --> 01:13:35,519
Speaker 8: I remember sales calls, and I would have everybody come

1136
01:13:35,560 --> 01:13:39,040
Speaker 8: into the to the to the meeting in a comforence

1137
01:13:39,120 --> 01:13:41,840
Speaker 8: room and I have on a piece of paper a chart.

1138
01:13:42,240 --> 01:13:44,880
Speaker 8: Well I had everybody's names. I can remember their name.

1139
01:13:45,640 --> 01:13:48,760
Speaker 8: See thea art. I'm terrible with names. I'm still bad

1140
01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:50,000
Speaker 8: at names. That's what it is.

1141
01:13:50,600 --> 01:13:52,600
Speaker 2: Some people get the joy out of you don't remember me,

1142
01:13:52,680 --> 01:13:55,160
Speaker 2: do you? And I just now I'm just blatant, like

1143
01:13:55,439 --> 01:13:56,160
Speaker 2: absolutely not.

1144
01:13:56,280 --> 01:13:57,000
Speaker 4: I don't remember.

1145
01:13:57,240 --> 01:14:01,880
Speaker 8: Yeah, absolutely terrible with names. But you know that's where

1146
01:14:01,880 --> 01:14:04,600
Speaker 8: I learned it. I learned from Zeros Corporation.

1147
01:14:06,400 --> 01:14:09,760
Speaker 2: Can you talk about pounding the pavement actually landing a

1148
01:14:09,800 --> 01:14:10,360
Speaker 2: record deal?

1149
01:14:11,200 --> 01:14:15,799
Speaker 8: Yeah, I can, because uh were I got a number

1150
01:14:15,800 --> 01:14:20,599
Speaker 8: of letters that said we formerly passed on your group

1151
01:14:20,800 --> 01:14:24,880
Speaker 8: called Destiny Stahl. Uh. Then you know the group went

1152
01:14:24,920 --> 01:14:28,880
Speaker 8: from Girls Time, then they signed with Darryl Simmons l

1153
01:14:28,960 --> 01:14:31,800
Speaker 8: A and Baby Face Partner still to the day in

1154
01:14:31,880 --> 01:14:37,200
Speaker 8: writing UH and Solid Partner production. They got dropped by

1155
01:14:37,280 --> 01:14:41,200
Speaker 8: Electra Records. Sylvia was the president. Then she hates when

1156
01:14:41,200 --> 01:14:45,800
Speaker 8: I say that. He hates when I say that. But

1157
01:14:46,040 --> 01:14:52,840
Speaker 8: but it was she she literally Daryl had a new

1158
01:14:52,880 --> 01:14:56,759
Speaker 8: production deal and he had three artists. H the girls

1159
01:14:56,840 --> 01:15:01,160
Speaker 8: were called the Dolls, a name I really dislike then,

1160
01:15:01,840 --> 01:15:05,600
Speaker 8: and she ended up ending the production deal. But she

1161
01:15:05,680 --> 01:15:08,080
Speaker 8: had the right to continue with the girls. But I

1162
01:15:08,160 --> 01:15:11,840
Speaker 8: understood that she had this girl group called InVogue, and

1163
01:15:12,040 --> 01:15:16,120
Speaker 8: so why the hell would you want another girls group

1164
01:15:16,160 --> 01:15:19,800
Speaker 8: and a bunch of parents. I get it, So I

1165
01:15:20,400 --> 01:15:25,040
Speaker 8: understand that now. But yes, the girls, you know, I

1166
01:15:25,640 --> 01:15:28,320
Speaker 8: came up with this idea when they came back from Atlanta.

1167
01:15:29,040 --> 01:15:31,639
Speaker 8: I changed the name to something fresh, and then we

1168
01:15:32,040 --> 01:15:35,240
Speaker 8: did a photo shoot and I sent out packages. I

1169
01:15:35,320 --> 01:15:38,759
Speaker 8: used to spend a lot of time way I didn't

1170
01:15:38,760 --> 01:15:41,439
Speaker 8: have a clue. Then I would have a package with

1171
01:15:41,640 --> 01:15:46,960
Speaker 8: maybe twenty pages, photos and all kind of stuff, not

1172
01:15:47,160 --> 01:15:51,080
Speaker 8: understanding less was more, uh, And then I would get

1173
01:15:51,240 --> 01:15:54,360
Speaker 8: these past letters. And then I came up with another

1174
01:15:54,520 --> 01:15:57,120
Speaker 8: name of the girls. And then we came up with

1175
01:15:57,160 --> 01:16:01,720
Speaker 8: the name Destiny, and then Destiny came Destiny's child. So

1176
01:16:02,400 --> 01:16:07,200
Speaker 8: this this started, this journey started when Beyonce was eight

1177
01:16:07,360 --> 01:16:11,480
Speaker 8: years old and she got signed. When she was fifteen also.

1178
01:16:11,760 --> 01:16:15,000
Speaker 2: So you're telling me that you would get a round

1179
01:16:15,040 --> 01:16:19,160
Speaker 2: of news and then your idea was, Okay, we're going

1180
01:16:19,240 --> 01:16:21,559
Speaker 2: to come back as another name, Like how do you

1181
01:16:21,600 --> 01:16:25,720
Speaker 2: convince them? Like, okay, let's let's regroup and this time

1182
01:16:25,720 --> 01:16:28,000
Speaker 2: we're going to call ourselves this and do it all

1183
01:16:28,040 --> 01:16:28,599
Speaker 2: over again.

1184
01:16:28,920 --> 01:16:32,600
Speaker 8: Yeah, it was a bad idea.

1185
01:16:33,280 --> 01:16:36,680
Speaker 2: And I would assume that you would also try to

1186
01:16:36,720 --> 01:16:39,919
Speaker 2: do the usual pavement pounding at the jack the Rappers

1187
01:16:39,920 --> 01:16:45,320
Speaker 2: of the world and all those commissions.

1188
01:16:43,240 --> 01:16:46,360
Speaker 8: All of those, all of them. I was there. I

1189
01:16:46,560 --> 01:16:50,479
Speaker 8: was there with a whole stack of business cards, you know,

1190
01:16:51,080 --> 01:16:56,040
Speaker 8: but a whole stack of CDs. So who actually had then?

1191
01:17:01,439 --> 01:17:06,200
Speaker 2: I'm amazed that you never gave up, because from the

1192
01:17:06,240 --> 01:17:09,280
Speaker 2: story that I'm hearing is that you have to make

1193
01:17:09,320 --> 01:17:13,160
Speaker 2: a few rounds to the same labels over and over

1194
01:17:13,200 --> 01:17:17,760
Speaker 2: again with new names or you know, like a new

1195
01:17:17,800 --> 01:17:22,479
Speaker 2: an R that fits. And I mean you never once

1196
01:17:22,520 --> 01:17:28,200
Speaker 2: worried about like the proverbial eye roll of whoever is

1197
01:17:28,240 --> 01:17:31,120
Speaker 2: at you know this particular Oh god, Matthew, no matt

1198
01:17:31,160 --> 01:17:33,360
Speaker 2: Noles again. Okay, I'll take the car.

1199
01:17:33,320 --> 01:17:35,439
Speaker 8: Y, But you gotta remember about my background. I was

1200
01:17:35,479 --> 01:17:38,839
Speaker 8: the number one sales up in the world. It sells

1201
01:17:38,880 --> 01:17:42,679
Speaker 8: you're gonna hear No, No, it's just I didn't present

1202
01:17:42,720 --> 01:17:46,919
Speaker 8: it correctly. That's when I get to know. It's like, Okay,

1203
01:17:47,120 --> 01:17:48,320
Speaker 8: I didn't present that right.

1204
01:17:48,240 --> 01:17:51,360
Speaker 2: And there was and the girls weren't taking this person

1205
01:17:51,479 --> 01:17:54,720
Speaker 2: or any of those things like you just like, how

1206
01:17:54,720 --> 01:17:57,800
Speaker 2: do you break it to them that it didn't work

1207
01:17:57,800 --> 01:17:59,720
Speaker 2: out or it's not our time that like, how how

1208
01:17:59,720 --> 01:18:03,120
Speaker 2: do you break bad news to them that doesn't break

1209
01:18:03,160 --> 01:18:03,679
Speaker 2: their spirit?

1210
01:18:04,600 --> 01:18:08,320
Speaker 8: Well, it was being honest, first of all, and they

1211
01:18:08,400 --> 01:18:14,559
Speaker 8: weren't I mean, in reality, they weren't ready. They really

1212
01:18:14,600 --> 01:18:18,839
Speaker 8: weren't ready. And they accepted the fact that they weren't ready,

1213
01:18:19,040 --> 01:18:22,840
Speaker 8: that they had to improve, they had to grow, they

1214
01:18:22,960 --> 01:18:26,000
Speaker 8: had to practice, they had to get more focals. This

1215
01:18:26,240 --> 01:18:31,120
Speaker 8: was their passion and they accepted that and they did

1216
01:18:31,200 --> 01:18:34,599
Speaker 8: the things because they also were best friends and they

1217
01:18:34,640 --> 01:18:37,360
Speaker 8: got to spend time and had a lot of fun

1218
01:18:37,520 --> 01:18:39,120
Speaker 8: as little girls do together.

1219
01:18:39,680 --> 01:18:42,360
Speaker 2: Can I ask, because I'm now realizing I have a

1220
01:18:42,439 --> 01:18:45,599
Speaker 2: rare chance to ask a question of this manner that

1221
01:18:46,320 --> 01:18:49,280
Speaker 2: I probably wouldn't have. You know, it comes into twenty

1222
01:18:49,360 --> 01:18:51,960
Speaker 2: years ago to ask you, and I'm kind of jumping

1223
01:18:52,120 --> 01:18:59,720
Speaker 2: ahead a little bit, but that that period between like

1224
01:19:00,640 --> 01:19:05,559
Speaker 2: nineteen ninety nine in two thousand and one where you're

1225
01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:10,639
Speaker 2: making personnel changes and whatnot. And I know, you know,

1226
01:19:10,720 --> 01:19:12,840
Speaker 2: just from the line of work that I come in,

1227
01:19:13,000 --> 01:19:16,599
Speaker 2: how discipline, rigorous discipline.

1228
01:19:16,439 --> 01:19:16,839
Speaker 8: And.

1229
01:19:18,320 --> 01:19:19,840
Speaker 2: You know, you kind of have to be on your

1230
01:19:19,920 --> 01:19:22,920
Speaker 2: p's and q's in this business and oftentimes you might

1231
01:19:23,000 --> 01:19:27,120
Speaker 2: have weak links. I mean not to just dismiss people

1232
01:19:27,120 --> 01:19:29,920
Speaker 2: as weak links or whatnot, but you know, I know

1233
01:19:30,040 --> 01:19:34,160
Speaker 2: that especially pre or the beginning stages of the Internet,

1234
01:19:35,600 --> 01:19:38,520
Speaker 2: a lot has been said of your sort of backstage

1235
01:19:38,640 --> 01:19:43,599
Speaker 2: dad control of the group. But what is the biggest

1236
01:19:43,640 --> 01:19:49,519
Speaker 2: miss perception of your role during that period in which

1237
01:19:50,479 --> 01:19:54,439
Speaker 2: you're changing personnel, like right before Michelle Williams came into

1238
01:19:54,479 --> 01:19:59,639
Speaker 2: the group, what do you feel the of course, now

1239
01:20:00,080 --> 01:20:03,280
Speaker 2: you know post two thousand and one and two thousand

1240
01:20:03,280 --> 01:20:05,479
Speaker 2: and two, two thousand and three, like post Survivor then

1241
01:20:05,600 --> 01:20:08,760
Speaker 2: you know, now it's like, you know, your dad of

1242
01:20:08,800 --> 01:20:12,759
Speaker 2: the century. But there was that period where we didn't

1243
01:20:12,840 --> 01:20:16,080
Speaker 2: know what was happening, like was was this going to

1244
01:20:16,120 --> 01:20:19,840
Speaker 2: be a dream girl's supreme situation or was it going

1245
01:20:19,920 --> 01:20:23,880
Speaker 2: to be a destiny fulfilled situation? But what did you

1246
01:20:23,960 --> 01:20:28,520
Speaker 2: feel during that period was a major sort of misconception

1247
01:20:28,720 --> 01:20:34,120
Speaker 2: of just like how that situation went down.

1248
01:20:34,840 --> 01:20:40,599
Speaker 8: Yeah, I just never I just never really cared what

1249
01:20:40,800 --> 01:20:47,520
Speaker 8: people said about me. I understood again from Xerox's leadership

1250
01:20:48,000 --> 01:20:53,439
Speaker 8: and what true leadership really means. People aren't gonna and

1251
01:20:53,479 --> 01:20:57,080
Speaker 8: when you're a visionary, people aren't gonna get that most people.

1252
01:20:57,920 --> 01:21:01,360
Speaker 8: Matter of fact, I'm glad most people don't get it,

1253
01:21:01,680 --> 01:21:05,840
Speaker 8: because for those of us that are visionaries, if everybody

1254
01:21:05,920 --> 01:21:10,720
Speaker 8: got it, to make it really tough to be successful.

1255
01:21:10,960 --> 01:21:14,680
Speaker 8: So I had a vision, I had leadership, I had

1256
01:21:14,720 --> 01:21:19,800
Speaker 8: amazing team, and I just said earlier, the team has

1257
01:21:19,840 --> 01:21:24,280
Speaker 8: been together for a long time, from road manager to

1258
01:21:25,360 --> 01:21:33,759
Speaker 8: accountants to you know, music directly publicist Yvette Noel Shore

1259
01:21:34,320 --> 01:21:38,680
Speaker 8: twenty plus years. These guys have been together, and so

1260
01:21:38,720 --> 01:21:42,360
Speaker 8: I built a really good team. It wasn't just me,

1261
01:21:42,520 --> 01:21:46,120
Speaker 8: but we had our own vision. You know, Tina, my

1262
01:21:46,200 --> 01:21:50,280
Speaker 8: former wife, did an exceptional job on the imaging. You know,

1263
01:21:50,360 --> 01:21:56,519
Speaker 8: back then those girl groups were in boots and baggy jeans,

1264
01:21:56,560 --> 01:22:02,920
Speaker 8: and we wanted to do glamour and bring back the Supremes.

1265
01:22:04,680 --> 01:22:08,120
Speaker 8: We always had a vision that we had and we

1266
01:22:08,200 --> 01:22:12,280
Speaker 8: didn't stray from that. And if you know, anyone quest

1267
01:22:12,360 --> 01:22:15,880
Speaker 8: Love that actually really worked in the record label and

1268
01:22:16,200 --> 01:22:19,559
Speaker 8: really was there, I think you would get a totally

1269
01:22:19,720 --> 01:22:25,919
Speaker 8: different perspective of the role I played and what really happened.

1270
01:22:26,800 --> 01:22:29,759
Speaker 8: I mean, fans, you know, we are in the industry,

1271
01:22:30,040 --> 01:22:33,360
Speaker 8: fans are you know, fans are gonna have their perspective,

1272
01:22:34,040 --> 01:22:37,400
Speaker 8: but they don't really know. Fans don't really know what's happening.

1273
01:22:38,280 --> 01:22:38,479
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1274
01:22:38,479 --> 01:22:42,080
Speaker 5: From an outsider's perspective, I my I think my kind

1275
01:22:42,120 --> 01:22:44,840
Speaker 5: of Matthew knows moment. I had heard like all the

1276
01:22:44,880 --> 01:22:46,760
Speaker 5: Desert Child stuff and you know, I were going through

1277
01:22:46,800 --> 01:22:50,680
Speaker 5: the group change and everything. For me, I understood the

1278
01:22:50,720 --> 01:22:52,880
Speaker 5: type of businessman you were when I saw you signed

1279
01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:55,760
Speaker 5: Daylight Soul. When when you signed them, I was like,

1280
01:22:55,920 --> 01:22:57,120
Speaker 5: word the fuck up?

1281
01:22:57,280 --> 01:22:59,880
Speaker 4: Yes, like you get it, you know what I'm saying.

1282
01:23:00,360 --> 01:23:01,559
Speaker 4: I was so happy to see.

1283
01:23:01,400 --> 01:23:05,719
Speaker 8: You like that first single shopping Bags. Yeah, people don't

1284
01:23:05,760 --> 01:23:08,400
Speaker 8: know this about me. You know that, we mean.

1285
01:23:08,560 --> 01:23:12,639
Speaker 4: Me, We don't know, we know, we know everybody else

1286
01:23:12,640 --> 01:23:14,120
Speaker 4: about to know, we don't know.

1287
01:23:14,200 --> 01:23:17,160
Speaker 8: In two thousand and two, I sold music well it's

1288
01:23:17,280 --> 01:23:21,160
Speaker 8: you can google it for ten million dollars and thirty

1289
01:23:21,200 --> 01:23:25,679
Speaker 8: million in stock and we Sanctuary was at that time,

1290
01:23:25,720 --> 01:23:29,439
Speaker 8: in two thousand and two, the largest independent record label.

1291
01:23:30,360 --> 01:23:33,160
Speaker 8: Rock was their thing. They had all the major Rocks.

1292
01:23:33,160 --> 01:23:35,640
Speaker 8: And we formed the Urban Division and I was the

1293
01:23:35,640 --> 01:23:38,679
Speaker 8: president of it, and we had the Urban Record Label,

1294
01:23:39,439 --> 01:23:43,439
Speaker 8: the largest urban management company in the world. You know,

1295
01:23:44,680 --> 01:23:48,000
Speaker 8: we had Nelly young men. I made all these these

1296
01:23:48,080 --> 01:23:50,759
Speaker 8: kids were all in their twenties. The men, I shouldn't

1297
01:23:50,760 --> 01:23:54,320
Speaker 8: say kids. These young men were all in their twenties

1298
01:23:54,360 --> 01:23:58,960
Speaker 8: and became millionaires. And when I look back and I

1299
01:23:59,600 --> 01:24:02,920
Speaker 8: see at you know, can do Isaac's you know, we

1300
01:24:02,960 --> 01:24:06,200
Speaker 8: brought him on board. He was at that time producing

1301
01:24:06,240 --> 01:24:12,599
Speaker 8: for Mary j Uh. We brought in from Philadelphia. Uh,

1302
01:24:12,680 --> 01:24:17,240
Speaker 8: doctor doctor, God's basketball player. I just had a mental.

1303
01:24:18,240 --> 01:24:26,760
Speaker 8: Julius Irving the third Yeah, they had Floor Tree and

1304
01:24:26,479 --> 01:24:32,439
Speaker 8: they had Eve. I brought those guys only Carter and

1305
01:24:32,560 --> 01:24:36,800
Speaker 8: Troy Carter, who was my number one draft pick. When

1306
01:24:36,840 --> 01:24:41,880
Speaker 8: I tell you this young man, absolutely And just the

1307
01:24:41,920 --> 01:24:45,120
Speaker 8: other day I heard on one of the social media

1308
01:24:45,160 --> 01:24:50,080
Speaker 8: platforms he talked about it. Uh, where Troy was my

1309
01:24:50,280 --> 01:24:53,720
Speaker 8: number one The first person I brought on board. I

1310
01:24:53,760 --> 01:24:57,920
Speaker 8: didn't know Jay Irving at that time, but I had

1311
01:24:58,400 --> 01:25:02,000
Speaker 8: really followed this kid with Eve and he had a rapper.

1312
01:25:02,040 --> 01:25:04,360
Speaker 8: They had a rapper also, I can't.

1313
01:25:04,120 --> 01:25:11,719
Speaker 10: Remember his name, but journalists, Yes, that's a journalist when

1314
01:25:12,200 --> 01:25:14,160
Speaker 10: he was journalist.

1315
01:25:14,680 --> 01:25:18,000
Speaker 8: And then I brought in the management for D twelve

1316
01:25:18,680 --> 01:25:22,080
Speaker 8: and so this is who what I management roster was.

1317
01:25:22,560 --> 01:25:27,320
Speaker 8: Now you'll understand when they had the MTV tour and

1318
01:25:27,400 --> 01:25:32,400
Speaker 8: Destiny's Child Nelly and Eve was only now you understand

1319
01:25:32,479 --> 01:25:35,920
Speaker 8: why now you understand Kelly and Kelly, Well I was.

1320
01:25:37,520 --> 01:25:40,559
Speaker 8: I was just about to say, now you understand that

1321
01:25:40,720 --> 01:25:43,840
Speaker 8: just wasn't happenstance. That was because they were part of

1322
01:25:43,960 --> 01:25:50,040
Speaker 8: music World, I mean Sanctuary Music World, Sanctuary Urban Management. Uh.

1323
01:25:50,120 --> 01:25:54,599
Speaker 8: And then on the record labels side, we I signed

1324
01:25:54,640 --> 01:25:55,479
Speaker 8: earth Winner Fire.

1325
01:25:55,760 --> 01:25:57,600
Speaker 4: I say, you did the Illumination record.

1326
01:25:57,400 --> 01:26:03,280
Speaker 8: Right, Illumination ray J's biggest hit one wish you know.

1327
01:26:04,439 --> 01:26:07,439
Speaker 8: I did a deal with ray J and his mother.

1328
01:26:08,600 --> 01:26:13,439
Speaker 8: We did the Ojays cooling the game. I convinced Shaka

1329
01:26:13,520 --> 01:26:17,040
Speaker 8: Khan to go to London and do a standards records

1330
01:26:17,800 --> 01:26:24,320
Speaker 8: with the London Symphony. You know, we did a whole

1331
01:26:24,400 --> 01:26:28,880
Speaker 8: lot there. Now, as the media on the record label side,

1332
01:26:28,920 --> 01:26:33,679
Speaker 8: they gave me the black eye because Sanctuary ended up

1333
01:26:33,880 --> 01:26:38,960
Speaker 8: going downhill. Obviously they always looked for Who's going to

1334
01:26:38,960 --> 01:26:41,720
Speaker 8: be Escapegoat? But on the record label, on the management side,

1335
01:26:41,760 --> 01:26:44,400
Speaker 8: we made plenty of money. On the record label side.

1336
01:26:44,479 --> 01:26:48,000
Speaker 8: You know, it takes time to recoup those you know,

1337
01:26:48,160 --> 01:26:52,000
Speaker 8: I spent money with these artists. I believe in spending

1338
01:26:52,080 --> 01:26:54,600
Speaker 8: money with my artists, and it takes a minute to

1339
01:26:54,640 --> 01:26:59,040
Speaker 8: recoup those investments. But it was a great, great time,

1340
01:27:00,040 --> 01:27:04,920
Speaker 8: wonderful time that I had got a little too a

1341
01:27:05,040 --> 01:27:08,960
Speaker 8: little too, like we talked earlier, questlove had too much

1342
01:27:09,000 --> 01:27:14,040
Speaker 8: going on uh at the time. UH. And during this

1343
01:27:14,200 --> 01:27:19,479
Speaker 8: period is where I began to unravel, when the stress

1344
01:27:19,560 --> 01:27:22,960
Speaker 8: came with all the travel. Because I had an office

1345
01:27:23,000 --> 01:27:27,080
Speaker 8: on Sunset Boulevard, I had an office in New York.

1346
01:27:27,280 --> 01:27:29,680
Speaker 8: I had two offices in New York. I had an

1347
01:27:29,680 --> 01:27:33,320
Speaker 8: office of Sony at five fifty Medisine. I had an

1348
01:27:33,360 --> 01:27:37,320
Speaker 8: office downtown in New York. My corporate office was in London.

1349
01:27:37,360 --> 01:27:40,519
Speaker 8: I was in London then near every other week. We

1350
01:27:40,560 --> 01:27:44,080
Speaker 8: had an office my fifteen oh five Hatley, which is

1351
01:27:44,120 --> 01:27:48,600
Speaker 8: where Hatley Street dreams, because that's where we own the

1352
01:27:48,640 --> 01:27:53,599
Speaker 8: whole block with records, labels, studios, rehearsal. You were there,

1353
01:27:53,760 --> 01:27:55,400
Speaker 8: you been there, You've been there.

1354
01:27:55,520 --> 01:27:56,759
Speaker 2: How did you know I was there. I was about

1355
01:27:56,800 --> 01:28:02,320
Speaker 2: to say compound. I went there for some reason. I

1356
01:28:02,360 --> 01:28:05,200
Speaker 2: forget why I went down there, And it wasn't even

1357
01:28:05,240 --> 01:28:06,200
Speaker 2: to work with your daughters.

1358
01:28:06,240 --> 01:28:09,080
Speaker 8: But yeah, it was something we did with one of

1359
01:28:09,320 --> 01:28:12,719
Speaker 8: you know, we used to rent it out to different good.

1360
01:28:12,880 --> 01:28:14,640
Speaker 2: That's right, because when you were saying that, I was like,

1361
01:28:14,680 --> 01:28:18,000
Speaker 2: wait a minute, did not visit music worlds.

1362
01:28:18,080 --> 01:28:19,599
Speaker 8: It was one of those power drinks.

1363
01:28:23,000 --> 01:28:27,559
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, right now, that was like to see that

1364
01:28:27,680 --> 01:28:31,400
Speaker 2: was that was important for me to also see the development.

1365
01:28:31,840 --> 01:28:34,080
Speaker 2: Like when I went inside Music world I was really

1366
01:28:34,840 --> 01:28:39,200
Speaker 2: impressed because the only other oh god, okay, I'm gonna

1367
01:28:39,240 --> 01:28:42,240
Speaker 2: I'm a prince basis about to come down on me

1368
01:28:42,280 --> 01:28:44,320
Speaker 2: for this statement. I mean, the last time I went

1369
01:28:44,360 --> 01:28:47,040
Speaker 2: to something as close to that was Paisley Park, and

1370
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:52,679
Speaker 2: during that time period, you know, it wasn't that well kept,

1371
01:28:52,760 --> 01:28:56,280
Speaker 2: and you know, it was basically just by that point

1372
01:28:56,439 --> 01:29:02,679
Speaker 2: just his vanity studio, Like it was far from the utopia. Yeah,

1373
01:29:02,680 --> 01:29:05,120
Speaker 2: it as far from the utopian vision that I think

1374
01:29:05,160 --> 01:29:07,960
Speaker 2: that he envisioned where it was like a full scale

1375
01:29:08,000 --> 01:29:11,200
Speaker 2: video in a Latinot video like a arsal spot and

1376
01:29:11,280 --> 01:29:14,240
Speaker 2: a club and all those things. But like to see

1377
01:29:14,240 --> 01:29:18,920
Speaker 2: it in real time, like in full operation. I was

1378
01:29:19,080 --> 01:29:23,880
Speaker 2: very I was really impressed with how that that operation was,

1379
01:29:23,920 --> 01:29:25,360
Speaker 2: what was running down there.

1380
01:29:25,680 --> 01:29:28,920
Speaker 8: Yeah, and then we had you know, we had not

1381
01:29:29,040 --> 01:29:34,799
Speaker 8: only we had the we built the largest gospel label

1382
01:29:35,040 --> 01:29:38,160
Speaker 8: only Sony. Sony beat us out one year by like

1383
01:29:38,720 --> 01:29:44,280
Speaker 8: ten and market share. You know. We did a partnership

1384
01:29:44,320 --> 01:29:49,360
Speaker 8: with B. E. T. Sunday best Leandrea Johnson, Grammy Award

1385
01:29:49,400 --> 01:29:55,639
Speaker 8: winner number one Female Gospel Trinity five seven, six six

1386
01:29:55,800 --> 01:30:03,320
Speaker 8: records on them. That's I'm soft, I'm strong. I can

1387
01:30:03,360 --> 01:30:08,120
Speaker 8: go on and on. We had a real burgering gospel label.

1388
01:30:09,840 --> 01:30:13,040
Speaker 8: Most people don't know this stuff, you know, they just trophy.

1389
01:30:13,720 --> 01:30:19,719
Speaker 8: They just know I'm Beyonce. That's not a bad thing. Yeah,

1390
01:30:20,280 --> 01:30:22,680
Speaker 8: that's not a bad thing at all. But but I

1391
01:30:22,880 --> 01:30:24,640
Speaker 8: you know, at one point we had one hundred and

1392
01:30:24,680 --> 01:30:28,360
Speaker 8: forty employees. At one point, my overhead was three hundred

1393
01:30:28,439 --> 01:30:33,880
Speaker 8: thousand dollars a month's business a month. And as you know,

1394
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:37,200
Speaker 8: Ques Love, Uh, you know, I'm very proud as a

1395
01:30:37,240 --> 01:30:40,960
Speaker 8: black man we own the city block. Let me change

1396
01:30:40,960 --> 01:30:43,639
Speaker 8: that when I say when I say we, people think

1397
01:30:43,680 --> 01:30:52,000
Speaker 8: Beyonce and sluntch I fucking own a city block. In

1398
01:30:52,200 --> 01:30:53,559
Speaker 8: downtown Houston.

1399
01:30:54,120 --> 01:30:57,439
Speaker 7: Yes, look and the land that it says on too

1400
01:30:58,000 --> 01:31:03,920
Speaker 7: grow right. People don't understand about that lane heavy land

1401
01:31:03,920 --> 01:31:06,040
Speaker 7: from Alabama owning his land in the corner.

1402
01:31:10,760 --> 01:31:15,960
Speaker 2: I'll ask how hard or how easy was it for

1403
01:31:16,240 --> 01:31:21,679
Speaker 2: you to let Beyonce, in the last stages of her

1404
01:31:22,160 --> 01:31:27,839
Speaker 2: caterpillar period, blossom into a butterfly and basically go handle

1405
01:31:28,840 --> 01:31:31,479
Speaker 2: her business on her own, which, well, I.

1406
01:31:31,360 --> 01:31:35,920
Speaker 8: Think it was the same for Beyoncelunge and even some

1407
01:31:36,040 --> 01:31:36,960
Speaker 8: other artists.

1408
01:31:38,400 --> 01:31:41,080
Speaker 2: Well, I'll ask how hard was it to not walk

1409
01:31:41,120 --> 01:31:43,040
Speaker 2: away but to let your artists fly?

1410
01:31:43,479 --> 01:31:48,840
Speaker 8: Yeah, I always say we forget that most artists I

1411
01:31:48,880 --> 01:31:53,200
Speaker 8: worked with, not most, I would say half of them

1412
01:31:53,280 --> 01:31:58,320
Speaker 8: were teenagers. You know, how you manage a fifteen year

1413
01:31:58,400 --> 01:32:02,400
Speaker 8: old in the business is different than how you manage

1414
01:32:02,400 --> 01:32:05,479
Speaker 8: her thirty five year old or a thirty year old

1415
01:32:05,479 --> 01:32:08,640
Speaker 8: in the business. As you know, I always say this,

1416
01:32:09,720 --> 01:32:14,080
Speaker 8: We don't in the industry let fourteen fifteen year olds

1417
01:32:14,560 --> 01:32:19,200
Speaker 8: make million dollar decisions at all on the business side.

1418
01:32:19,960 --> 01:32:25,160
Speaker 8: So I managed them differently. But my kids got to

1419
01:32:25,160 --> 01:32:28,000
Speaker 8: see their mother on the business, their dad own the

1420
01:32:28,080 --> 01:32:33,599
Speaker 8: business be in corporate America. They got to grow as

1421
01:32:33,640 --> 01:32:37,120
Speaker 8: they got older, and I hope, and I've seen them

1422
01:32:37,160 --> 01:32:40,000
Speaker 8: say it now and I'm very proud of even Beyonce's

1423
01:32:40,040 --> 01:32:43,439
Speaker 8: on the cover of magazine. She just just recently said

1424
01:32:43,479 --> 01:32:47,760
Speaker 8: that it was me that instilled in her to be

1425
01:32:47,840 --> 01:32:50,840
Speaker 8: a writer, to be a producer, not just to be

1426
01:32:51,560 --> 01:32:56,120
Speaker 8: a singer artist, but to be an entertainer. But to

1427
01:32:56,240 --> 01:33:00,880
Speaker 8: watch them grow and as they got older they got

1428
01:33:00,960 --> 01:33:05,360
Speaker 8: more information. When they were younger, wanted them to focus

1429
01:33:05,479 --> 01:33:09,559
Speaker 8: on their artistry, not on the music business, because the

1430
01:33:09,680 --> 01:33:13,200
Speaker 8: music business is most of this stuff, and if you're

1431
01:33:13,240 --> 01:33:19,000
Speaker 8: trying to do both at eighteen nineteen twenty two, it's

1432
01:33:19,080 --> 01:33:22,000
Speaker 8: gonna fail. It's just too much. At the level of

1433
01:33:22,080 --> 01:33:24,759
Speaker 8: success that they had. That's why we had one hundred

1434
01:33:24,760 --> 01:33:29,000
Speaker 8: and fifty employees. How does one person who understand marketing,

1435
01:33:29,400 --> 01:33:37,080
Speaker 8: understand the international marketplace, understand all the financial nook One

1436
01:33:37,200 --> 01:33:40,880
Speaker 8: artist at seventeen, eighteen years old can do that. So

1437
01:33:40,920 --> 01:33:46,600
Speaker 8: it's ludicrous when people say that, well, he was controlling.

1438
01:33:47,280 --> 01:33:51,680
Speaker 8: That's what you do when you manage teenagers. You control

1439
01:33:51,760 --> 01:33:55,759
Speaker 8: their business, and as they get older, they get involved

1440
01:33:55,760 --> 01:33:59,000
Speaker 8: as they understand it. That's why I teach this in class.

1441
01:34:00,120 --> 01:34:02,519
Speaker 8: I have a in my classes. I've been doing this

1442
01:34:03,200 --> 01:34:06,360
Speaker 8: in a classroom for fifteen years. There's one hundred and

1443
01:34:06,479 --> 01:34:11,200
Speaker 8: ninety three definitions starting with A and R going all

1444
01:34:11,240 --> 01:34:15,839
Speaker 8: the way through. Like a lot of people, ninety percent

1445
01:34:15,880 --> 01:34:18,520
Speaker 8: of all the people in the industry don't know it.

1446
01:34:18,520 --> 01:34:21,759
Speaker 8: It's a lot to know on the business side.

1447
01:34:22,520 --> 01:34:25,040
Speaker 5: So they so when they kind of went and when

1448
01:34:25,080 --> 01:34:27,719
Speaker 5: beyond sat Silan's gotten to that point where they wanted

1449
01:34:27,760 --> 01:34:30,280
Speaker 5: to control their careers or have more of a say,

1450
01:34:30,560 --> 01:34:31,479
Speaker 5: or however you look at it.

1451
01:34:31,840 --> 01:34:32,840
Speaker 4: You just saw that.

1452
01:34:33,120 --> 01:34:35,720
Speaker 5: As like a natural progression, like you kind of anticipated

1453
01:34:35,720 --> 01:34:36,520
Speaker 5: that coming.

1454
01:34:36,240 --> 01:34:39,320
Speaker 8: To It was a combination. It was a combination of that.

1455
01:34:39,840 --> 01:34:44,880
Speaker 8: And it also, as I spoke candidly earlier, there was

1456
01:34:44,920 --> 01:34:49,040
Speaker 8: a period in those mid two thousand that I unraveled

1457
01:34:50,280 --> 01:34:54,760
Speaker 8: as a father, as a husband, and that impacted it.

1458
01:34:55,320 --> 01:34:57,479
Speaker 8: You know, when you when you're a father and you

1459
01:34:57,520 --> 01:35:00,519
Speaker 8: have daughters, they look at you way more than just

1460
01:35:00,560 --> 01:35:01,479
Speaker 8: as their manager.

1461
01:35:02,080 --> 01:35:03,760
Speaker 7: That's why I felt so full circle. I feel like

1462
01:35:03,800 --> 01:35:06,840
Speaker 7: at a certain part of their careers Beyonce with Lemonade

1463
01:35:06,960 --> 01:35:11,280
Speaker 7: and the songs and Solange with Cranes, it felt like

1464
01:35:11,320 --> 01:35:13,960
Speaker 7: such a full circle moment for y'all family. Just as

1465
01:35:14,000 --> 01:35:16,040
Speaker 7: a person who don't know y'all, but just kind of

1466
01:35:16,040 --> 01:35:18,320
Speaker 7: been watching for a long way, but it just felt

1467
01:35:18,360 --> 01:35:20,439
Speaker 7: like a like you said, that moment of you being

1468
01:35:20,400 --> 01:35:22,640
Speaker 7: in the studio with Miss Tina and just hearing your

1469
01:35:22,680 --> 01:35:26,160
Speaker 7: words and hearing your story and them now embracing those

1470
01:35:26,200 --> 01:35:27,880
Speaker 7: stories as a part of their art form. It just

1471
01:35:27,880 --> 01:35:31,320
Speaker 7: felt like such a full circle like moment, right.

1472
01:35:32,080 --> 01:35:35,800
Speaker 8: And you know, I always say that when we make mistakes,

1473
01:35:36,800 --> 01:35:41,360
Speaker 8: we have failures, it's an opportunity to grow, not a

1474
01:35:41,400 --> 01:35:46,040
Speaker 8: reason to quit. And most of us we first don't

1475
01:35:46,120 --> 01:35:48,519
Speaker 8: face up in the knowledge that we made a mistake.

1476
01:35:50,240 --> 01:35:52,519
Speaker 8: That's the only way we grow is first of all

1477
01:35:52,520 --> 01:35:56,719
Speaker 8: saying hey, I fucked up, and then go get help

1478
01:35:56,760 --> 01:36:00,439
Speaker 8: and grow from it. And I'm fortunate that I'm, you know,

1479
01:36:00,720 --> 01:36:06,360
Speaker 8: my eighth year married to an amazing woman that has

1480
01:36:06,479 --> 01:36:09,960
Speaker 8: impacted my life, Gina. I would marry Tina and a Gina.

1481
01:36:10,479 --> 01:36:16,080
Speaker 8: Sometimes I sometimes get confused.

1482
01:36:17,439 --> 01:36:22,960
Speaker 7: Man, you knows me like my former wife, so I

1483
01:36:22,960 --> 01:36:24,519
Speaker 7: don't have to even say the names, right.

1484
01:36:27,600 --> 01:36:32,599
Speaker 8: But you know, Tenda and I are really friends. She's

1485
01:36:32,600 --> 01:36:37,160
Speaker 8: an amazing woman and I will always honor her. I

1486
01:36:37,240 --> 01:36:41,680
Speaker 8: never use that word X because I think that diminishes

1487
01:36:41,800 --> 01:36:44,920
Speaker 8: and it's a negative uh, and out of respect, I

1488
01:36:44,960 --> 01:36:48,160
Speaker 8: don't use that word. Just say my former wife and

1489
01:36:48,320 --> 01:36:54,479
Speaker 8: Gina Jena was Vanessa Williams assistant and international road manager

1490
01:36:54,520 --> 01:37:00,439
Speaker 8: for ten years. Uh, my former real model, So she

1491
01:37:00,600 --> 01:37:05,439
Speaker 8: has experience in entertainment. And our co key is we

1492
01:37:05,479 --> 01:37:11,960
Speaker 8: don't talk business unless unless I need a sounding board.

1493
01:37:12,160 --> 01:37:16,800
Speaker 8: But we don't talk business. And that can really devastate

1494
01:37:16,800 --> 01:37:21,320
Speaker 8: a family when you you can be talking about dinner

1495
01:37:21,360 --> 01:37:24,559
Speaker 8: and that becomes yeah, but what about this song? What

1496
01:37:24,600 --> 01:37:27,080
Speaker 8: if we did this? Yeah?

1497
01:37:27,800 --> 01:37:29,439
Speaker 4: And that's what I was asking earlier. I'm like, Yo,

1498
01:37:29,479 --> 01:37:30,679
Speaker 4: how do you draw that line?

1499
01:37:30,760 --> 01:37:36,719
Speaker 5: Because it's so work with business? Yo, I just working

1500
01:37:36,760 --> 01:37:39,639
Speaker 5: with family, Like Yo, that is so oh my god,

1501
01:37:39,680 --> 01:37:40,559
Speaker 5: that's such a.

1502
01:37:42,280 --> 01:37:47,599
Speaker 8: And that that became a real challenging and our family

1503
01:37:47,720 --> 01:37:52,679
Speaker 8: dynamics is separating the two. When are you a dad

1504
01:37:53,280 --> 01:37:58,280
Speaker 8: and when are you a manager? And especially it's easy

1505
01:37:58,400 --> 01:38:00,879
Speaker 8: with all my other artists because I was their manager,

1506
01:38:01,200 --> 01:38:04,879
Speaker 8: or actually I was, most people think I was the manager.

1507
01:38:05,040 --> 01:38:08,920
Speaker 8: I did more record label stuff than the management. But

1508
01:38:09,840 --> 01:38:13,320
Speaker 8: which you're with Destiny's Child. It was difficult because I

1509
01:38:13,360 --> 01:38:18,559
Speaker 8: have a fiduciatory duty to all four of the ladies

1510
01:38:18,640 --> 01:38:23,719
Speaker 8: or three of the ladies and actually Beyonce actually probably

1511
01:38:23,720 --> 01:38:28,120
Speaker 8: got hurt more than anybody because I was tougher on

1512
01:38:28,320 --> 01:38:30,040
Speaker 8: her than the others.

1513
01:38:30,880 --> 01:38:32,679
Speaker 7: I appreciate you all this evolution.

1514
01:38:33,960 --> 01:38:38,479
Speaker 8: You can tell when somebody's lying. Man, I'm just giving

1515
01:38:38,479 --> 01:38:38,960
Speaker 8: you truth.

1516
01:38:40,120 --> 01:38:40,320
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1517
01:38:40,360 --> 01:38:42,800
Speaker 7: It sounds so easy, but it's not easy for everybody.

1518
01:38:43,200 --> 01:38:55,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, hey, doctor knows. Can you talk about your your

1519
01:38:55,520 --> 01:39:00,240
Speaker 2: battle with cancer and how you've handled it and you know,

1520
01:39:00,280 --> 01:39:02,439
Speaker 2: to be honest with you, it's it's very rare that

1521
01:39:02,479 --> 01:39:05,040
Speaker 2: I hear men speak of breast cancer. I didn't even kind.

1522
01:39:05,080 --> 01:39:08,000
Speaker 2: I didn't know that was a thing. Mm hm, Can

1523
01:39:08,040 --> 01:39:11,439
Speaker 2: you and I most of us didn't even know that

1524
01:39:11,479 --> 01:39:13,920
Speaker 2: you were going through this. Can you walk us through

1525
01:39:13,920 --> 01:39:17,639
Speaker 2: the process of your discovery of it? And how? Yeah?

1526
01:39:18,000 --> 01:39:21,280
Speaker 8: I love to I love to you know. Oddly enough,

1527
01:39:21,320 --> 01:39:23,679
Speaker 8: when I was the number one sales rep at Xerox

1528
01:39:23,760 --> 01:39:28,760
Speaker 8: Medical System, oddly enough, what I sold was zero radiography,

1529
01:39:29,240 --> 01:39:32,120
Speaker 8: which in the eighties was the leading modality for breast

1530
01:39:32,200 --> 01:39:39,840
Speaker 8: cancer detection. Go figure, wow wow, Okay, And even back

1531
01:39:39,840 --> 01:39:43,920
Speaker 8: in the eighties we realized and talked about men and

1532
01:39:44,000 --> 01:39:48,920
Speaker 8: breast cancer. I'm really about messaging, so I chose not

1533
01:39:49,080 --> 01:39:55,360
Speaker 8: to message as male breast cancer but mail chest cancer.

1534
01:39:56,320 --> 01:39:59,120
Speaker 8: And I've gotten support but from the medical communities and

1535
01:40:00,560 --> 01:40:04,120
Speaker 8: every man that I've talked to, because a lot of

1536
01:40:04,160 --> 01:40:08,880
Speaker 8: the stigma and it brings the embarrassment for men to

1537
01:40:09,000 --> 01:40:13,040
Speaker 8: use that word breast and also in respect to women,

1538
01:40:13,720 --> 01:40:19,360
Speaker 8: because it's three four guys now and one woman. None

1539
01:40:19,360 --> 01:40:22,920
Speaker 8: of us would be other guys would think hardly twice

1540
01:40:22,960 --> 01:40:26,360
Speaker 8: to take our shirt off. A woman's not gonna do that.

1541
01:40:26,360 --> 01:40:30,439
Speaker 8: That's a special sanctuary place for a woman. So I

1542
01:40:30,560 --> 01:40:35,040
Speaker 8: choose to say male chest cancer and a lot of

1543
01:40:35,040 --> 01:40:37,759
Speaker 8: that stigma, And the way I make it really come

1544
01:40:37,840 --> 01:40:43,599
Speaker 8: home is for women, if you are going to have

1545
01:40:43,680 --> 01:40:48,800
Speaker 8: to open a door that said male prostate exam, I

1546
01:40:48,840 --> 01:40:53,320
Speaker 8: think you'll be quite embarrassed. And for men, when we

1547
01:40:53,439 --> 01:40:57,439
Speaker 8: have to open a door that says female breast center,

1548
01:40:58,160 --> 01:41:02,240
Speaker 8: a women's breast center, that's quite embarrassing. That's not something

1549
01:41:02,280 --> 01:41:05,080
Speaker 8: you feel good about. So first of all, I like

1550
01:41:05,200 --> 01:41:10,680
Speaker 8: to just really on the messaging of how we say it.

1551
01:41:11,040 --> 01:41:15,080
Speaker 8: The second thing for me, I knew because I sold

1552
01:41:15,160 --> 01:41:20,360
Speaker 8: the equipment and I had I used to wear I

1553
01:41:20,400 --> 01:41:23,439
Speaker 8: still do white T shirts a lot under my shirts,

1554
01:41:23,960 --> 01:41:28,320
Speaker 8: and I noticed one day a dot. So imagine you

1555
01:41:28,400 --> 01:41:31,280
Speaker 8: had a white sheet of paper and you had a dot.

1556
01:41:31,520 --> 01:41:34,160
Speaker 8: I didn't think anything. I actually thought my wife had

1557
01:41:34,160 --> 01:41:35,960
Speaker 8: bought some new T shirts and maybe it was just

1558
01:41:36,320 --> 01:41:41,200
Speaker 8: a little manufacturing malfunction. The next day I noticed five

1559
01:41:41,280 --> 01:41:44,800
Speaker 8: or six dots. Then I the next day I said

1560
01:41:45,240 --> 01:41:48,360
Speaker 8: to my wife. I was like, Hugh, did you buy

1561
01:41:48,360 --> 01:41:50,880
Speaker 8: some new T shirts? I see these little red dots.

1562
01:41:51,439 --> 01:41:54,599
Speaker 8: And she was like, that's interesting because when I cleaned

1563
01:41:54,600 --> 01:41:57,719
Speaker 8: your sheets today there was a bunch of red dots

1564
01:41:57,720 --> 01:42:02,559
Speaker 8: of blood on your side of the bed. Again, just

1565
01:42:02,680 --> 01:42:06,519
Speaker 8: imagine several dots, like on a white sheet of paper. Well,

1566
01:42:06,560 --> 01:42:11,280
Speaker 8: through my training of selling zero radiography, that is a

1567
01:42:11,439 --> 01:42:16,360
Speaker 8: very common sign for men, and so I knew that.

1568
01:42:16,840 --> 01:42:22,040
Speaker 8: And when immediately got a mammogram, then got a biopsy,

1569
01:42:22,560 --> 01:42:27,600
Speaker 8: and then literally a week later, had surgery. That's not

1570
01:42:27,680 --> 01:42:31,320
Speaker 8: the end of the story, that's just the beginning doing surgery.

1571
01:42:32,920 --> 01:42:35,919
Speaker 8: And there was a delay. We should have done this before,

1572
01:42:36,040 --> 01:42:39,800
Speaker 8: but we didn't. I won't get into that. But when

1573
01:42:39,800 --> 01:42:45,679
Speaker 8: we did the pathology, it turned out that genetically, which

1574
01:42:45,720 --> 01:42:49,840
Speaker 8: is where medicine is going, that I had a genetic

1575
01:42:49,960 --> 01:42:57,720
Speaker 8: malfunction and because of that genetic malfunction, called BRAKA two

1576
01:42:58,000 --> 01:43:02,479
Speaker 8: mutation means that for men that we have a higher

1577
01:43:02,560 --> 01:43:11,400
Speaker 8: risk of prostate cancer, mal chest cancer, cancer, pancreatic cancer,

1578
01:43:12,320 --> 01:43:17,360
Speaker 8: and melanoma from a genetic standpoint. And so a lot

1579
01:43:17,400 --> 01:43:21,800
Speaker 8: of men are walking around thinking prostate when the real

1580
01:43:21,960 --> 01:43:26,760
Speaker 8: cost of it, real cause of it rather is because

1581
01:43:27,240 --> 01:43:31,439
Speaker 8: they have mal chest cancer. And we're finding this out.

1582
01:43:33,120 --> 01:43:37,280
Speaker 8: And I'm part of research at the University of Pennsylvania.

1583
01:43:37,400 --> 01:43:43,040
Speaker 8: Actually I've come been there. That's where I'm part of

1584
01:43:43,040 --> 01:43:46,720
Speaker 8: the research there. This is my second year of recovery.

1585
01:43:47,800 --> 01:43:51,400
Speaker 8: I always say today I'm cancer free, but it also

1586
01:43:51,600 --> 01:43:54,679
Speaker 8: meant a lifestyle change, and I get really excited quest

1587
01:43:54,720 --> 01:43:58,280
Speaker 8: love when I hear you talk about weight loss. It's

1588
01:43:58,320 --> 01:44:02,200
Speaker 8: a sensitive subject in a Black cammunity. My dad was obese.

1589
01:44:02,760 --> 01:44:08,559
Speaker 8: I've been obese myself. I was up to to sixty eight.

1590
01:44:09,520 --> 01:44:12,360
Speaker 8: I'm now at two thirty five. My goal is to

1591
01:44:12,400 --> 01:44:16,240
Speaker 8: get to to thirty, which is easy, you know, should

1592
01:44:16,280 --> 01:44:19,760
Speaker 8: be something that I can obtain. It meant also in

1593
01:44:19,800 --> 01:44:27,040
Speaker 8: that lifestyle change stopping drinking alcohol. It also meant in

1594
01:44:27,160 --> 01:44:30,320
Speaker 8: that life because of the sugar and because also just

1595
01:44:30,360 --> 01:44:33,480
Speaker 8: the effect of being crazy on alcohol.

1596
01:44:33,640 --> 01:44:35,200
Speaker 4: So you're a big drinker. Was that was that a

1597
01:44:35,200 --> 01:44:36,320
Speaker 4: thing for you, A big drink.

1598
01:44:37,120 --> 01:44:41,120
Speaker 8: I wouldn't say a big but celebratory drinker. But when

1599
01:44:41,160 --> 01:44:45,720
Speaker 8: I did drink, I drank. You know it meant it

1600
01:44:45,880 --> 01:44:51,760
Speaker 8: meant changing my diet. I don't sell them. I eat meat,

1601
01:44:51,800 --> 01:44:56,160
Speaker 8: and what I do is only chicken, a fish this week,

1602
01:44:57,240 --> 01:45:02,400
Speaker 8: most weeks is many vegetables. So I changed my eating habits.

1603
01:45:03,479 --> 01:45:06,760
Speaker 8: I exercised. I just got a knee replacement four and

1604
01:45:06,800 --> 01:45:10,519
Speaker 8: a half months ago, which is doing really good. Just

1605
01:45:10,600 --> 01:45:14,639
Speaker 8: my basketball days. But I was up to jogging two

1606
01:45:14,680 --> 01:45:17,600
Speaker 8: miles a day and I'm getting there. I'm on the

1607
01:45:17,640 --> 01:45:19,320
Speaker 8: bike five miles on the bike.

1608
01:45:19,640 --> 01:45:23,280
Speaker 4: Back peloton, a peloton only.

1609
01:45:23,040 --> 01:45:28,920
Speaker 8: If it's the Beyonce version. You know, you know.

1610
01:45:29,160 --> 01:45:31,080
Speaker 4: The one thing I'm selling, the one.

1611
01:45:30,880 --> 01:45:33,559
Speaker 8: Thing I brought to the music industry was branding an

1612
01:45:33,640 --> 01:45:39,400
Speaker 8: endorsement which the industry was selling records. I was selling

1613
01:45:39,439 --> 01:45:42,160
Speaker 8: a brand which is totally different. But to get back,

1614
01:45:42,800 --> 01:45:47,200
Speaker 8: so admit the lifestyle change for me, and I've accepted that.

1615
01:45:48,240 --> 01:45:52,559
Speaker 8: I've seen the results. Every six months I've been getting

1616
01:45:52,680 --> 01:45:55,679
Speaker 8: a mammogram MRI. I sold MRI.

1617
01:45:55,920 --> 01:45:58,080
Speaker 7: So is it more painful for you? Doctor knows? Because

1618
01:45:58,080 --> 01:46:00,800
Speaker 7: I was wondering for men and a mammogram. I'm gonna

1619
01:46:00,840 --> 01:46:03,240
Speaker 7: just have a truthful moment. I'm having my first one.

1620
01:46:03,280 --> 01:46:05,559
Speaker 7: I'm having my first one this year, and my biggest

1621
01:46:05,560 --> 01:46:07,960
Speaker 7: fear is just how painful I've heard that it is,

1622
01:46:08,000 --> 01:46:10,400
Speaker 7: but especially maybe if you don't have a lot of

1623
01:46:10,439 --> 01:46:12,640
Speaker 7: tissue up there. So I imagine that.

1624
01:46:13,320 --> 01:46:17,599
Speaker 8: Well, I put things in perspective. If I can save

1625
01:46:17,680 --> 01:46:23,640
Speaker 8: my life because of two minutes of fucking pain.

1626
01:46:23,479 --> 01:46:28,559
Speaker 7: Okay, you and get tested.

1627
01:46:31,160 --> 01:46:31,920
Speaker 8: I don't want it.

1628
01:46:32,680 --> 01:46:33,439
Speaker 7: I just don't want it.

1629
01:46:33,720 --> 01:46:40,559
Speaker 2: Bus it ain't gonna it's not gonna bunutes.

1630
01:46:39,600 --> 01:46:47,679
Speaker 8: Two minutes, two minutes each one, I mean at most,

1631
01:46:47,720 --> 01:46:51,479
Speaker 8: but it's based on the different angles. Well overall it'll

1632
01:46:51,520 --> 01:46:55,040
Speaker 8: be about twenty minutes. But that's about it. But we

1633
01:46:55,120 --> 01:46:59,879
Speaker 8: put it in perspective, just the rewards and early detection

1634
01:47:01,320 --> 01:47:04,679
Speaker 8: and and this is for men and women. As medicine

1635
01:47:04,720 --> 01:47:08,680
Speaker 8: is changing, we'll understand I say we. I'm not a

1636
01:47:08,720 --> 01:47:12,760
Speaker 8: medical doctor. I just say we, as I'm a cancer survivor.

1637
01:47:13,880 --> 01:47:19,600
Speaker 8: Are understanding family history? We know black people. We don't

1638
01:47:19,960 --> 01:47:23,519
Speaker 8: pay attention to our family history. It's right there in

1639
01:47:23,520 --> 01:47:26,240
Speaker 8: front of you. If you just take a moment to

1640
01:47:26,520 --> 01:47:29,200
Speaker 8: ask what the mom and them and uncle nem and

1641
01:47:29,240 --> 01:47:32,960
Speaker 8: Grandma and them died of You might see you might

1642
01:47:33,120 --> 01:47:34,519
Speaker 8: see a common thread.

1643
01:47:36,320 --> 01:47:39,920
Speaker 2: Sugar Steve, how you doing in your uh your journey.

1644
01:47:41,000 --> 01:47:42,519
Speaker 2: There's a reason we call him sugar Steve.

1645
01:47:42,960 --> 01:47:49,120
Speaker 6: Oh yeah, yeah, everything as long as you manage stuff,

1646
01:47:49,640 --> 01:47:51,920
Speaker 6: you know you can. It's something you can live with.

1647
01:47:52,200 --> 01:47:54,599
Speaker 2: I got the diabetes doctor.

1648
01:47:55,280 --> 01:47:59,360
Speaker 8: Well, well you understand weight loss and diet and you

1649
01:47:59,720 --> 01:48:01,360
Speaker 8: under standing the exercise.

1650
01:48:01,880 --> 01:48:03,960
Speaker 6: Yeah, try and trying to be good.

1651
01:48:04,640 --> 01:48:06,559
Speaker 8: No, we don't try, ship Sugar Street.

1652
01:48:07,160 --> 01:48:07,800
Speaker 4: We don't talk.

1653
01:48:08,880 --> 01:48:13,480
Speaker 8: We don't use trying our vocabulary. We fucking do.

1654
01:48:12,640 --> 01:48:14,240
Speaker 4: Do or do not? There is no trying.

1655
01:48:14,439 --> 01:48:17,240
Speaker 8: Yes, you don't try.

1656
01:48:17,439 --> 01:48:19,920
Speaker 2: Your daughters? Can Can I get adopted in this family?

1657
01:48:20,080 --> 01:48:20,160
Speaker 8: Like?

1658
01:48:24,880 --> 01:48:25,960
Speaker 4: Don't? There is no.

1659
01:48:26,240 --> 01:48:29,360
Speaker 8: I always thank you. I I can't begin to tell

1660
01:48:29,439 --> 01:48:33,000
Speaker 8: you how grateful I was to see that time when you,

1661
01:48:33,400 --> 01:48:36,360
Speaker 8: out of all the people in the world, you say

1662
01:48:36,400 --> 01:48:38,680
Speaker 8: the ten people you like to have dinner with, and

1663
01:48:38,720 --> 01:48:43,760
Speaker 8: you said me, I was like, what why you.

1664
01:48:43,880 --> 01:48:48,719
Speaker 2: Just the backstories? Basically I did this thing, and oh

1665
01:48:48,720 --> 01:48:51,360
Speaker 2: when I did, uh when I when I did my

1666
01:48:51,120 --> 01:48:55,840
Speaker 2: my my food book, uh up mixtape and New York

1667
01:48:55,880 --> 01:49:00,200
Speaker 2: Times asked me to name. I'm known up here for

1668
01:49:00,320 --> 01:49:04,439
Speaker 2: my dinner parties, and uh so they asked me, you

1669
01:49:04,479 --> 01:49:07,040
Speaker 2: know who who that I think would make an interesting,

1670
01:49:07,760 --> 01:49:10,479
Speaker 2: uh dinner guest. And you know, at the time when

1671
01:49:11,560 --> 01:49:15,000
Speaker 2: Solons really really sold us on you, it was doing

1672
01:49:15,040 --> 01:49:18,439
Speaker 2: that period. And then I just really went down a

1673
01:49:18,520 --> 01:49:21,080
Speaker 2: rabbit hole of like all of your interviews and I

1674
01:49:21,120 --> 01:49:24,360
Speaker 2: was just like, yo, like he really he has a

1675
01:49:24,400 --> 01:49:28,800
Speaker 2: story to tell that I really wasn't expecting because I

1676
01:49:28,840 --> 01:49:32,120
Speaker 2: think men in your position, like we we've been sold

1677
01:49:32,880 --> 01:49:35,439
Speaker 2: all of our lives. We've been sold the hustler, you

1678
01:49:35,439 --> 01:49:38,559
Speaker 2: know what I mean, the hustler that you know, even

1679
01:49:38,640 --> 01:49:41,800
Speaker 2: even the hustler like wins the game and that sort

1680
01:49:41,840 --> 01:49:45,080
Speaker 2: of thing. But we we haven't been sold like the strategist,

1681
01:49:45,640 --> 01:49:50,960
Speaker 2: visionary or yeah, that sort of thing. And and that's why.

1682
01:49:50,000 --> 01:49:52,439
Speaker 7: Because black people can't vision, they can't do that, right.

1683
01:49:54,000 --> 01:49:57,040
Speaker 8: That's the media, you know, that's the Jedi man trick.

1684
01:49:57,280 --> 01:50:01,160
Speaker 8: That's you know, behind the decision and making a TV

1685
01:50:01,479 --> 01:50:05,760
Speaker 8: and you know it's typically a white person. Uh you know,

1686
01:50:05,800 --> 01:50:09,439
Speaker 8: I just uh, this summer, this is my second summer

1687
01:50:10,760 --> 01:50:14,680
Speaker 8: going to Harvard and taking professional development, and so I

1688
01:50:15,040 --> 01:50:22,280
Speaker 8: took this summer cultural Intelligence, which really increased my awareness

1689
01:50:22,560 --> 01:50:24,960
Speaker 8: of how culturally different that we are.

1690
01:50:25,600 --> 01:50:27,599
Speaker 4: And these are classes that you're taking that you're.

1691
01:50:28,040 --> 01:50:33,040
Speaker 8: That I took ethical leadership last summer. You know, you

1692
01:50:33,120 --> 01:50:35,080
Speaker 8: get to know me. I'm not the guy that they

1693
01:50:35,200 --> 01:50:43,000
Speaker 8: picture at all. We know I I see I played

1694
01:50:43,040 --> 01:50:45,040
Speaker 8: the media like they play us.

1695
01:50:46,160 --> 01:50:48,559
Speaker 4: Okay, okay, talk about it.

1696
01:50:48,960 --> 01:50:57,240
Speaker 8: I won't get into that one. But you know, they

1697
01:50:57,360 --> 01:51:01,840
Speaker 8: want to always paint a picture of who we are

1698
01:51:02,320 --> 01:51:05,679
Speaker 8: and success that it can't be because as you said,

1699
01:51:06,680 --> 01:51:11,600
Speaker 8: that we're strategists or that we're smart. It has to

1700
01:51:11,640 --> 01:51:14,360
Speaker 8: be or we had a vision. It has to be

1701
01:51:14,439 --> 01:51:18,519
Speaker 8: with swing. Golly, you know, We've got to always be that,

1702
01:51:18,960 --> 01:51:24,479
Speaker 8: you know, and that was always Black radio. My challenge,

1703
01:51:24,520 --> 01:51:27,400
Speaker 8: the Black radio and when they used to have like

1704
01:51:27,600 --> 01:51:32,320
Speaker 8: an entertainers segment and and it would always be negativity

1705
01:51:32,760 --> 01:51:36,960
Speaker 8: on black artists. That look, guys, we need you to

1706
01:51:37,000 --> 01:51:42,760
Speaker 8: do the reverse. But unfortunately, how social media has impacted

1707
01:51:43,240 --> 01:51:48,160
Speaker 8: our young people negativity and the Jedi mind trick is

1708
01:51:49,120 --> 01:51:51,320
Speaker 8: how they're played every day. You know, I've sat in

1709
01:51:51,400 --> 01:51:54,960
Speaker 8: meetings our young people have no idea how and when

1710
01:51:54,960 --> 01:51:59,160
Speaker 8: we learned through the last election Russia, we found who

1711
01:51:59,200 --> 01:52:02,479
Speaker 8: did they go to Black people on social media?

1712
01:52:03,000 --> 01:52:03,160
Speaker 2: Right?

1713
01:52:03,360 --> 01:52:06,160
Speaker 8: You know, we get played on this social media stuff.

1714
01:52:06,280 --> 01:52:11,080
Speaker 8: It's not news anymore, It's it's social conversation.

1715
01:52:12,640 --> 01:52:17,600
Speaker 2: I gotta know, I mean really like, you know, I

1716
01:52:17,880 --> 01:52:21,479
Speaker 2: haven't I haven't had goosebunk moments like this from someone

1717
01:52:21,520 --> 01:52:25,639
Speaker 2: talking since like my mom used to religiously like watch

1718
01:52:25,720 --> 01:52:30,960
Speaker 2: less brown talk less brown boy, and that's brown. Yeah.

1719
01:52:31,000 --> 01:52:31,639
Speaker 2: I like less.

1720
01:52:31,720 --> 01:52:32,720
Speaker 8: I like less a lot.

1721
01:52:33,680 --> 01:52:37,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I know my well, yeah, I do know

1722
01:52:37,760 --> 01:52:41,599
Speaker 2: that you've done TED talks and you're teaching universities and whatnot.

1723
01:52:42,600 --> 01:52:47,240
Speaker 2: But I mean, have you really considered like motivational speaking.

1724
01:52:47,760 --> 01:52:48,600
Speaker 8: I do a lot of that.

1725
01:52:48,920 --> 01:52:53,439
Speaker 2: I'm about to say, where can we see you? Because yeah, even.

1726
01:52:54,120 --> 01:52:56,439
Speaker 8: Talk my TED talk is a motivational is on the

1727
01:52:56,560 --> 01:53:02,439
Speaker 8: DNA of achievers and what is that? I mean I talked.

1728
01:53:02,479 --> 01:53:08,680
Speaker 8: I do a lot of motivational stuff on even in entrepreneurship,

1729
01:53:08,960 --> 01:53:13,880
Speaker 8: you know, and motivating our people and understanding the who,

1730
01:53:14,000 --> 01:53:16,600
Speaker 8: the what, the why, who is the customer, what is

1731
01:53:16,640 --> 01:53:18,720
Speaker 8: the product and why does somebody should buy it? And

1732
01:53:18,880 --> 01:53:24,799
Speaker 8: motivating them to understanding that process. You know, we've been gosh,

1733
01:53:24,920 --> 01:53:27,320
Speaker 8: we go back to the culture of black people and

1734
01:53:27,360 --> 01:53:31,200
Speaker 8: slavery and how it still impacts us in a negative way.

1735
01:53:31,760 --> 01:53:36,280
Speaker 8: You know, policing came about through slavery. If you go back,

1736
01:53:36,360 --> 01:53:42,679
Speaker 8: you see in eighteen hundreds, just post slavery, BAM policing started.

1737
01:53:43,080 --> 01:53:47,240
Speaker 8: You know, this whole thing of colorism started in slavery.

1738
01:53:48,120 --> 01:53:50,920
Speaker 8: When it got off the ship. There was babies that

1739
01:53:51,040 --> 01:53:56,760
Speaker 8: came out looking white. It's just such a cultural conditioning

1740
01:53:57,320 --> 01:54:01,800
Speaker 8: that we have to overcome as black people, cultural conditioning.

1741
01:54:02,800 --> 01:54:05,000
Speaker 7: You we're speaking on that colorism too, because I know

1742
01:54:05,040 --> 01:54:07,639
Speaker 7: that you in the media even try to speak on that.

1743
01:54:07,720 --> 01:54:12,800
Speaker 7: But it's things that we need to talk about and don't.

1744
01:54:13,479 --> 01:54:19,599
Speaker 8: We don't grow without being uncomfortable. My job in life

1745
01:54:19,680 --> 01:54:24,560
Speaker 8: is to make people uncomfortable. And I had fun with Charlemagne.

1746
01:54:24,640 --> 01:54:27,880
Speaker 8: I kicked his ass. You did, you spanked his ass,

1747
01:54:27,960 --> 01:54:31,160
Speaker 8: actually just spanked his ass all over the room.

1748
01:54:34,080 --> 01:54:37,480
Speaker 4: That Charlamaine episode was because it was the moment, the

1749
01:54:37,520 --> 01:54:40,600
Speaker 4: moment where it went left, like the moment I saw. Listen,

1750
01:54:40,640 --> 01:54:41,920
Speaker 4: I'm telling you the moment.

1751
01:54:42,560 --> 01:54:44,920
Speaker 5: You know the recap so like Charlamagne is doing and

1752
01:54:44,960 --> 01:54:47,520
Speaker 5: it's a piece of Charlemagne. He in Carolina, He's South Carolina.

1753
01:54:47,520 --> 01:54:50,160
Speaker 5: But you know all of that, you know what I'm saying.

1754
01:54:50,200 --> 01:54:52,840
Speaker 5: So it's all whatever but listen though, now. So they're

1755
01:54:52,880 --> 01:54:55,200
Speaker 5: going for whatever, and Charlemagne is kind of trying to

1756
01:54:55,200 --> 01:54:58,040
Speaker 5: get at him. So mister Knowles just stops and he's like,

1757
01:54:59,400 --> 01:55:02,920
Speaker 5: you really sad? Why are you so sad?

1758
01:55:03,600 --> 01:55:07,480
Speaker 4: And Yo, the look on Charlomagne, she was like, oh ship,

1759
01:55:07,520 --> 01:55:10,920
Speaker 4: I wouldn't expected like it was so it was. It was,

1760
01:55:11,320 --> 01:55:12,879
Speaker 4: Oh god, it was so brilliant.

1761
01:55:12,920 --> 01:55:16,560
Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, Jabs and yeah he was.

1762
01:55:17,480 --> 01:55:21,880
Speaker 8: He was left and left and left and yeah. And

1763
01:55:21,920 --> 01:55:24,560
Speaker 8: I asked him, I said, you know, Charlemagne, this mama,

1764
01:55:25,280 --> 01:55:27,040
Speaker 8: what feelings are coming up for you?

1765
01:55:27,360 --> 01:55:28,560
Speaker 7: That's a black man in therapy.

1766
01:55:28,640 --> 01:55:32,440
Speaker 8: So he already know and that's a black man at therapy.

1767
01:55:33,280 --> 01:55:37,480
Speaker 8: And we continue to talk and I said, Charlemagne, you're

1768
01:55:37,560 --> 01:55:40,560
Speaker 8: on that short bus, brother. And by the way, you

1769
01:55:40,640 --> 01:55:42,040
Speaker 8: got too much fucking makeup on.

1770
01:55:45,840 --> 01:55:49,320
Speaker 4: Lazy Get your dad.

1771
01:55:51,280 --> 01:55:52,920
Speaker 5: Come here, come here, come get your daddy out of

1772
01:55:52,920 --> 01:55:59,400
Speaker 5: the paint. Huh No, okay, So why are we talking

1773
01:55:59,400 --> 01:56:01,880
Speaker 5: about it? So being that you, you know, you manage

1774
01:56:01,960 --> 01:56:02,440
Speaker 5: your daughters.

1775
01:56:02,440 --> 01:56:03,560
Speaker 4: You were over their careers.

1776
01:56:03,960 --> 01:56:06,520
Speaker 5: You know you're going they're gonna write songs that are

1777
01:56:06,560 --> 01:56:09,200
Speaker 5: personal and you know, may talk about family stuff and

1778
01:56:09,360 --> 01:56:12,640
Speaker 5: all that. How what was your response to Eliminade and

1779
01:56:12,680 --> 01:56:14,240
Speaker 5: hearing that record, what was your thought on it?

1780
01:56:14,920 --> 01:56:18,840
Speaker 8: Well, I think everybody should occasionally have a glass of

1781
01:56:18,920 --> 01:56:22,000
Speaker 8: lemonade and have a seat and have a seat at

1782
01:56:22,000 --> 01:56:22,440
Speaker 8: the table.

1783
01:56:24,080 --> 01:56:26,400
Speaker 7: Always marketing. It's about the brand.

1784
01:56:27,000 --> 01:56:28,520
Speaker 2: It's about the brand.

1785
01:56:30,080 --> 01:56:32,960
Speaker 5: Okay, Well, I ain't got to eliminade. I got me

1786
01:56:33,000 --> 01:56:34,440
Speaker 5: some ging a.

1787
01:56:34,880 --> 01:56:37,320
Speaker 8: You should have a seat at the table there.

1788
01:56:38,200 --> 01:56:40,640
Speaker 7: I want you, thank you, thank you.

1789
01:56:41,080 --> 01:56:46,760
Speaker 8: This has been fun. You just got me unapologetically.

1790
01:56:46,840 --> 01:56:48,600
Speaker 4: You know, I knew what it was gonna be.

1791
01:56:48,720 --> 01:56:50,920
Speaker 7: Take all this appreciation, and it represents at least a

1792
01:56:50,960 --> 01:56:53,760
Speaker 7: million black folks that have been appreciating you, like for real.

1793
01:56:53,680 --> 01:56:58,880
Speaker 8: Like I know, and I thank you for acknowledging.

1794
01:56:58,240 --> 01:57:03,600
Speaker 2: That the work, your rigorous, honesty, your your your messaging.

1795
01:57:04,480 --> 01:57:07,880
Speaker 2: You know we should, we should, you know, happiness and

1796
01:57:07,880 --> 01:57:09,600
Speaker 2: and enjoy.

1797
01:57:10,360 --> 01:57:13,480
Speaker 5: Just the work you've done on yourself. Man, the work. Yes,

1798
01:57:13,560 --> 01:57:14,520
Speaker 5: it's very common.

1799
01:57:15,200 --> 01:57:19,400
Speaker 2: I'm really this was not the phone call the conversation

1800
01:57:19,560 --> 01:57:21,400
Speaker 2: that I did.

1801
01:57:22,960 --> 01:57:25,360
Speaker 7: Right here.

1802
01:57:26,320 --> 01:57:30,160
Speaker 2: I'm just you know, thank you. This was me watching

1803
01:57:30,160 --> 01:57:32,360
Speaker 2: this episode. I don't even feel like I participated.

1804
01:57:35,040 --> 01:57:39,320
Speaker 8: Happened when you know, when you interviewed with me. I

1805
01:57:39,360 --> 01:57:42,760
Speaker 8: got to listen to your journey, and it was similar

1806
01:57:42,800 --> 01:57:45,720
Speaker 8: because you shared your journey well. And I think the

1807
01:57:45,840 --> 01:57:49,640
Speaker 8: more we share our journeys with people and let them

1808
01:57:49,720 --> 01:57:53,640
Speaker 8: know the challenges that we have to overcome, that we're

1809
01:57:53,720 --> 01:57:58,160
Speaker 8: no different than anybody else, no better, none of that.

1810
01:57:59,320 --> 01:58:01,280
Speaker 8: We wake up in the morning and we go to

1811
01:58:01,320 --> 01:58:06,200
Speaker 8: bed at night hoping for another day. And the beauty

1812
01:58:06,240 --> 01:58:10,480
Speaker 8: about that is I like to always leave you know.

1813
01:58:10,560 --> 01:58:12,320
Speaker 8: I travel, as you know, a lot. And I was

1814
01:58:12,360 --> 01:58:14,520
Speaker 8: in La back in the two thousands and I was

1815
01:58:14,560 --> 01:58:17,800
Speaker 8: going down an escalator at lax and there was a

1816
01:58:17,880 --> 01:58:22,200
Speaker 8: non for Mexico who gave had a jar that said

1817
01:58:22,240 --> 01:58:27,040
Speaker 8: please give to the missionary. And I learned not to

1818
01:58:27,280 --> 01:58:32,880
Speaker 8: be judgmental. I give when people ask. And she gave

1819
01:58:32,920 --> 01:58:36,760
Speaker 8: me a card and literally because I used to have.

1820
01:58:37,040 --> 01:58:39,960
Speaker 8: You know, you can imagine in the heyday how many

1821
01:58:40,000 --> 01:58:43,600
Speaker 8: business cards and CDs people were giving me. And I

1822
01:58:43,720 --> 01:58:46,240
Speaker 8: finally looked at that card. It might have been a

1823
01:58:46,280 --> 01:58:50,000
Speaker 8: month later. And that's what I like to leave you with.

1824
01:58:50,160 --> 01:58:54,480
Speaker 8: It said, pray not for a life free from trouble,

1825
01:58:55,480 --> 01:59:02,280
Speaker 8: Pray for triumph over trouble. For what you and I

1826
01:59:02,320 --> 01:59:11,280
Speaker 8: call adversity, the universe, God, whatever name calls opportunity for

1827
01:59:11,400 --> 01:59:16,959
Speaker 8: what you and I call adversity the universe God Allah

1828
01:59:17,440 --> 01:59:21,000
Speaker 8: calls opportunity. We pray too much that bad shit ain't

1829
01:59:21,040 --> 01:59:26,920
Speaker 8: gonna happen. It is. Look when it happened, what is

1830
01:59:26,960 --> 01:59:30,280
Speaker 8: the opportunity. When I came with mel chest cancer, it

1831
01:59:30,400 --> 01:59:35,360
Speaker 8: gave me the opportunity to share that with other people,

1832
01:59:35,760 --> 01:59:40,000
Speaker 8: hopefully save some lives just by being honest about it

1833
01:59:40,040 --> 01:59:43,800
Speaker 8: and open and for everybody. When bad stuff happened, look

1834
01:59:43,840 --> 01:59:46,360
Speaker 8: at it as an opportunity rather than oh, I man,

1835
01:59:46,560 --> 01:59:47,680
Speaker 8: and bad shit happened.

1836
01:59:48,800 --> 01:59:50,760
Speaker 5: Listen those how do you in the artists that you

1837
01:59:50,800 --> 01:59:53,600
Speaker 5: work with when you're working with younger guys. Because I'm

1838
01:59:53,640 --> 01:59:55,640
Speaker 5: just sitting there listening to this conversation now, and I

1839
01:59:55,680 --> 01:59:58,000
Speaker 5: mean I'm forty two now, so now a lot of

1840
01:59:58,000 --> 02:00:00,480
Speaker 5: this shit is resonating with me. But had I heard

1841
02:00:00,520 --> 02:00:02,960
Speaker 5: it at twenty two, you know, maybe not so much.

1842
02:00:03,320 --> 02:00:06,160
Speaker 5: So with all just the experience and knowledge and game

1843
02:00:06,200 --> 02:00:08,640
Speaker 5: that you have, when you're working with younger artists, how

1844
02:00:08,640 --> 02:00:10,959
Speaker 5: do you make that knowledge palatable to them?

1845
02:00:11,480 --> 02:00:14,000
Speaker 8: Well, you know, I don't know. I'm done with that

1846
02:00:14,080 --> 02:00:19,360
Speaker 8: side with that. I'm quickly eager excited to say I'm

1847
02:00:19,400 --> 02:00:22,160
Speaker 8: done on the music site. I do have three or

1848
02:00:22,200 --> 02:00:26,640
Speaker 8: four film and TV projects that we're working on. You know,

1849
02:00:26,800 --> 02:00:29,200
Speaker 8: when I was in the business, it used to really

1850
02:00:29,240 --> 02:00:32,360
Speaker 8: surprise the artists. They come to music World and ready

1851
02:00:32,400 --> 02:00:37,000
Speaker 8: to sing rap, have their band, and I wouldn't do that.

1852
02:00:37,240 --> 02:00:39,720
Speaker 8: I would want them to sit down on the sofa

1853
02:00:39,760 --> 02:00:42,400
Speaker 8: in my office and I wanted to talk to them.

1854
02:00:42,920 --> 02:00:46,320
Speaker 8: I wanted to get to know and understand is this

1855
02:00:46,680 --> 02:00:52,879
Speaker 8: really truly your passion or a hobby? And for most people,

1856
02:00:52,880 --> 02:00:57,280
Speaker 8: poor boy, it's hobbies. And that's what I always look

1857
02:00:57,400 --> 02:01:01,880
Speaker 8: for if they were passionate. If they were passionate, then

1858
02:01:02,560 --> 02:01:06,240
Speaker 8: I could work with that. But most people really aren't

1859
02:01:06,280 --> 02:01:10,040
Speaker 8: passionate because they don't know what their passion. They don't

1860
02:01:10,160 --> 02:01:13,120
Speaker 8: understand when you live this thing called passion that you

1861
02:01:13,240 --> 02:01:16,160
Speaker 8: never work a day in your life. They don't know

1862
02:01:16,680 --> 02:01:21,120
Speaker 8: what coexists with passion. It's work ethics. You find somebody

1863
02:01:21,160 --> 02:01:25,480
Speaker 8: that passionate, they work their butts are because they love it.

1864
02:01:25,600 --> 02:01:28,720
Speaker 8: And when even quest love when you said it earlier

1865
02:01:29,720 --> 02:01:32,120
Speaker 8: about all the things you were doing, I was asking,

1866
02:01:32,280 --> 02:01:35,280
Speaker 8: but was he passionate about that? Because if you were,

1867
02:01:35,600 --> 02:01:40,440
Speaker 8: it wouldn't work. To you it was fun and I

1868
02:01:40,520 --> 02:01:45,760
Speaker 8: see my girls and Beyonce and Salons, and they work hard,

1869
02:01:45,800 --> 02:01:49,320
Speaker 8: but they actually love to the core. What they do

1870
02:01:50,000 --> 02:01:50,919
Speaker 8: to the core.

1871
02:01:52,720 --> 02:01:55,400
Speaker 7: What a blessing through your journey. That's what your babies

1872
02:01:55,400 --> 02:01:56,640
Speaker 7: can do. That's what a blessing.

1873
02:01:57,280 --> 02:02:01,280
Speaker 2: Yeoh, just thank you, Doctor knows that appreciate it. I

1874
02:02:01,320 --> 02:02:02,800
Speaker 2: gotta wreck this episode up, man.

1875
02:02:03,240 --> 02:02:05,800
Speaker 5: Now, this is this is service. This, this is this

1876
02:02:05,880 --> 02:02:06,840
Speaker 5: is sermon right here.

1877
02:02:07,240 --> 02:02:09,920
Speaker 2: I say this a lot. I'm definitely sticking to it.

1878
02:02:10,000 --> 02:02:12,560
Speaker 2: This is in my top five episodes of this five year.

1879
02:02:13,440 --> 02:02:15,520
Speaker 2: I don't know, maybe since today I don't know the

1880
02:02:15,520 --> 02:02:17,880
Speaker 2: moon whatever I needed.

1881
02:02:18,720 --> 02:02:19,520
Speaker 8: Thank you.

1882
02:02:19,600 --> 02:02:21,560
Speaker 2: I needed to hear this today for real.

1883
02:02:21,600 --> 02:02:22,440
Speaker 4: This is necessary.

1884
02:02:22,600 --> 02:02:26,640
Speaker 2: I'm gonna call my mom and my girlfriend right now.

1885
02:02:29,120 --> 02:02:31,760
Speaker 8: So he's not gonna cry old Air.

1886
02:02:33,280 --> 02:02:36,400
Speaker 4: He's gonna cry in the car he was. He's gonna

1887
02:02:36,400 --> 02:02:39,120
Speaker 4: try the car.

1888
02:02:42,000 --> 02:02:45,040
Speaker 2: Won't sugar Steven Finiclo.

1889
02:02:45,160 --> 02:02:47,360
Speaker 8: And when you come this way, we gotta get together.

1890
02:02:47,600 --> 02:02:49,920
Speaker 8: And if I come your way, let's promise we go.

1891
02:02:50,120 --> 02:02:51,480
Speaker 8: Let's promise we're gonna have a mill.

1892
02:02:52,240 --> 02:02:55,600
Speaker 2: Yes, I will contact you through like I promised. I

1893
02:02:56,120 --> 02:02:59,200
Speaker 2: really needed this conversation. Thank you very much, Doctor Knowles.

1894
02:02:59,240 --> 02:03:01,840
Speaker 2: This is quest Low. We will see I don't even

1895
02:03:01,880 --> 02:03:04,000
Speaker 2: think we need to do no more episodes.

1896
02:03:03,520 --> 02:03:04,440
Speaker 4: Like this might be.

1897
02:03:05,920 --> 02:03:07,760
Speaker 8: Right, No, no no.

1898
02:03:08,160 --> 02:03:11,120
Speaker 4: On the series finale, West Love Supreme starting about to know.

1899
02:03:11,680 --> 02:03:15,000
Speaker 2: Yes exactly all right, Thank you guys. We'll see you

1900
02:03:15,040 --> 02:03:15,800
Speaker 2: on the next go around.

1901
02:03:15,880 --> 02:03:22,480
Speaker 4: Thank you, yo. What's up? This is Fonte.

1902
02:03:22,800 --> 02:03:25,040
Speaker 5: Make sure you keep up with us on Instagram at

1903
02:03:25,160 --> 02:03:27,120
Speaker 5: QLs and let us know what you think and.

1904
02:03:27,080 --> 02:03:29,040
Speaker 4: Who should be next to sit down with us. Don't

1905
02:03:29,040 --> 02:03:31,920
Speaker 4: forget to subscribe to our podcast, all right peace.

1906
02:03:40,480 --> 02:03:46,120
Speaker 1: West Love Supreme is a production of iHeart Radio. For

1907
02:03:46,200 --> 02:03:49,320
Speaker 1: more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app,

1908
02:03:49,520 --> 02:03:52,560
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.