Speaker 1: Welcome to Had of Money. I'm Joel and I am Matt.
Speaker 1: Today we're talking how to make money without having any
Speaker 1: with Sierra Rodgers.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: So this is the episode for everyone out there who
Speaker 3: doesn't want to work like a soul crushing nine to
Speaker 3: five job, specifically where you're being told what you can
Speaker 3: and can't do by someone else. This is an episode
Speaker 3: about entrepreneurship, about starting your own business, which I will
Speaker 3: readily admit, like, even that phrase is potentially problematic because like,
Speaker 3: what do some folks think of when they hear launching
Speaker 3: a business. Well, maybe they're thinking of like a shark tank, right,
Speaker 3: They're thinking of like the different rounds of funding, proposing
Speaker 3: a business plan, all that kind of stuff. And while
Speaker 3: that is how some businesses, again, I think the vast
Speaker 3: majority of small business owners they're not going to be
Speaker 3: running a fortunate fufuner company, right, They didn't go to
Speaker 3: business school. But they do have a great idea for
Speaker 3: a new product, or they do have a way that
Speaker 3: they think they can serve folks who are willing to pay.
Speaker 3: And our guest today, Sierra Rodgers, is here to share
Speaker 3: how she started her business Babes, which is a woman's
Speaker 3: wear line, which she also recounts in her new book,
Speaker 3: The Outsider Advantage. It comes out next week June eighteenth,
Speaker 3: And Sierra, we're excited for you to share your story
Speaker 3: with our listeners, and thank you for joining us today
Speaker 3: on the podcast.
Speaker 2: Thank you for having me me too.
Speaker 1: Yeah. No, we're glad to have you along Sierra for
Speaker 1: today's episode. And the first question we got to ask
Speaker 1: everybody who comes on is what's your craft beer equivalent?
Speaker 1: Because Matt and I we spend potentially outrageous sums of
Speaker 1: money on craft beer at times, but we're still saving
Speaker 1: and investing for our future, so it's not like, you know,
Speaker 1: it's not too much, right, what's that thing for you?
Speaker 1: What do you like to splurge on.
Speaker 2: I splurge on travel. I'm going to travel in the
Speaker 2: best and biggest uber that I can, and I'm going
Speaker 2: to fly first whenever I can. I just, I mean,
Speaker 2: that's just where it makes it most sense to me.
Speaker 3: Okay, do you remember the first time that you flew
Speaker 3: first class? Because I do, and it was only once,
Speaker 3: so I literally odally ever flow business class one time,
Speaker 3: and man, I really did enjoy that cocktail, I will say,
Speaker 3: But other than that it's normally like Southwest cattle call.
Speaker 3: But what about you, what was your first your first
Speaker 3: first class experience.
Speaker 2: Honestly, when I when I came out here, I started
Speaker 2: dating this guy who who made money and he flew
Speaker 2: first class, so I was like, you know what, I
Speaker 2: can do this too, Like I could afford this. So
Speaker 2: I was really proving something to him and myself and
Speaker 2: I had the best time, and yeah, I've been addicted
Speaker 2: ever since.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's funny. It makes me think that we used
Speaker 1: to have this airline here based out of Atlanta called
Speaker 1: air Tran, which I believe Southwest bought AirTran. But AirTran
Speaker 1: was so great because they had a really inexpensive business
Speaker 1: class and so you could feel like a baller, you
Speaker 1: could feel like a high roller, but you didn't have
Speaker 1: to fork over much money to do. So when you
Speaker 1: talking about some of those like trains, Atlantic flights first
Speaker 1: class and stuff like that, sirih, I hope you're budgeting
Speaker 1: for that, because those be expensive tickets.
Speaker 2: I mean they are expensive. They sometimes they make zero
Speaker 2: sense because it's like, Okay, this is probably not the
Speaker 2: smartest I shouldn't do this all the time. But I
Speaker 2: mean plan ahead. I mean it's what's important to you. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if that's exactly, If that's what you're gonna splurge on,
Speaker 3: more power to you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just make it make sense everywhere else. Don't splurge
Speaker 2: on everything.
Speaker 3: Yes, exactly.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you can't splurge everywhere, and when your book you're
Speaker 1: gonna end up broke. We know you're not splurged on everything.
Speaker 1: Like we know you've got prougal jeens in there.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah for sure.
Speaker 3: Okay, speaking of your books, Sarah, it starts off with
Speaker 3: you sleeping on a friend's couch. You're you're out in La.
Speaker 3: How did you end up end up there? What were
Speaker 3: you feeling at that point in your life.
Speaker 2: I had recently graduated from college. Things weren't going as expected.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I'm just a terrible interview Lee,
Speaker 2: but I just could not find a job in Houston,
Speaker 2: not from Houston. I just kept getting nose left and right.
Speaker 2: My sister had moved out to LA and I kind
Speaker 2: of follow her out here and I found a house
Speaker 2: to sleep on and that's how it started.
Speaker 3: I mean, okay, so I want you to actually share
Speaker 3: even more of your childhood because I know it involves.
Speaker 3: It wasn't an ideal upbringing that you and your sister
Speaker 3: and your your mom experienced.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we hopped around a lot. We lived in cars.
Speaker 2: I was always trying to my mom was always trying
Speaker 2: to find somewhere for us to stay, whether it be
Speaker 2: with family or friends. Yeah, I didn't have a typical chata.
Speaker 2: I technically didn't have a room or a door to
Speaker 2: close until I got into high school. So it was
Speaker 2: definitely a rocky upbringing for sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Used to moving around and adapting and making things work.
Speaker 1: So Sarah, my wife, is becoming a marriage and family therapist.
Speaker 1: And one thing I know, and I don't know much
Speaker 1: based on what she's learned, but I I've absorbed a
Speaker 1: little through osmosis, and I realized that like some of
Speaker 1: those things that happened in childhood, of course influence who
Speaker 1: become who we become, sometimes subconsciously, sometimes consciously, And that's
Speaker 1: what therapy is often about. It's like bringing those things
Speaker 1: to the conscious surface. So tell me about that. For you, then,
Speaker 1: at your childhood, some of those awful, difficult things you
Speaker 1: went through, how did your childhood how did those events
Speaker 1: impact who you've become?
Speaker 2: I'm kind of able to survive anything like, I don't
Speaker 2: really I'm not really phased by a lot. I'm used
Speaker 2: to adapting and moving and making something work out of nothing.
Speaker 2: There's obviously those bad triggers, like being an entrepreneur is
Speaker 2: really rocky, So on those lower sales days or lower
Speaker 2: sales months, I am triggered to thinking, hey, like I'm
Speaker 2: gonna be homeless again, or hey, maybe the jig is up.
Speaker 2: But on the other hand, it's pushed me to be
Speaker 2: a really hard worker. I'm one of the hardest working
Speaker 2: for people that I know, and I feel like I
Speaker 2: could build this all over again if it didn't work.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know. There's something about I guess I
Speaker 3: want to hear your thoughts. Do you think that someone
Speaker 3: from you know, with your kind of background is more
Speaker 3: willing to take risks given the fact that they don't
Speaker 3: have this perfect sort of storybook life or childhood to protect,
Speaker 3: Because it seems like a lot of times if you
Speaker 3: have a whole lot to protect, you are less willing
Speaker 3: to take risks because it's all about preservation as opposed
Speaker 3: to kind of getting out there and trying something new
Speaker 3: and seeing something that's going to be interesting. And something
Speaker 3: that's going to be successful. What are your thoughts on that.
Speaker 2: I think so I think yes and no, because sometimes
Speaker 2: when I've seen it work different on both ends. I
Speaker 2: feel like sometimes when people are used to having a
Speaker 2: lot and used to things working out, they're more inclined
Speaker 2: to take risks. And then on the other end, if
Speaker 2: you've never had anything, and once you get hold of something,
Speaker 2: it's hard to like let that go. You're kind of
Speaker 2: grabbing a hold to it, and you can be a
Speaker 2: little less risky. It really depends on the person and
Speaker 2: the situation.
Speaker 1: Yeah, one of the things that's very very telling about
Speaker 1: your story in reading your new book, the Outsider Advantage.
Speaker 1: You could have at so many different points along the way.
Speaker 1: You could have focused on what you didn't have. You
Speaker 1: could have adopted a victim mindset, and you could have
Speaker 1: kind of said, hey, life's not fair. But you seem
Speaker 1: to push through that and have a positive mentality and
Speaker 1: approach to your life, to your business ventures along the way.
Speaker 1: Why do you think it is that you were able
Speaker 1: to avoid something that is so common for people who
Speaker 1: do have a tumultuous childhood or come from, you know,
Speaker 1: a socioeconomic background that lacks really any sort of stability
Speaker 1: or security. How are you able to overcome that and
Speaker 1: have a different approach.
Speaker 2: That's a tough question to answer. It's just my instinct
Speaker 2: is we don't have time for that. Like I don't
Speaker 2: have time to wallow in my sorrow and say woe
Speaker 2: is me? I have like bills and I have to
Speaker 2: get off my friend's couch and I have to make
Speaker 2: something of myself. I don't. You just don't have time.
Speaker 2: That's just that's the easiest answer I can give you.
Speaker 2: It's like when you're like a hustler and you're you,
Speaker 2: you have a goal that you're trying to reach, like
Speaker 2: being a victim, Like you don't really have time for that. Yes,
Speaker 2: like things suck and it doesn't feel good when you're
Speaker 2: in it, but if you want to get out of it,
Speaker 2: like adding on top of your already sucky situation with
Speaker 2: your sorrow isn't going to be helpful. And I'm all
Speaker 2: about being helpful to myself.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not like you're saying that's unproductive. It's time
Speaker 1: not well spent.
Speaker 2: It's not going to do anything. Literally, is like going
Speaker 2: to waste your own time make you feel sucky it's
Speaker 2: really not correct.
Speaker 3: So tell us about you kind of starting out with
Speaker 3: your business and how it is basically that you got
Speaker 3: the ball rolling what made you go in that direction,
Speaker 3: I guess, versus maybe you know, maybe trying to go
Speaker 3: to take more of a traditional corporate sort of path
Speaker 3: route as opposed to you saying, hey, I want to
Speaker 3: be my own boss, I want to start my own thing,
Speaker 3: I want to call the shots.
Speaker 2: I did try. I did try to go the typical route.
Speaker 2: It wasn't for me. And I also, as I said,
Speaker 2: I didn't have time to keep nelling that in and
Speaker 2: it wasn't working. I had a problem, I find. I
Speaker 2: mean everyone says this, but the best way to start
Speaker 2: a business is to find a problem that you can
Speaker 2: solve and also match it with like an open market,
Speaker 2: open space in the market. So I had a problem
Speaker 2: I wanted to fix, Like there weren't many curvy brands
Speaker 2: that offered affordable basics for people like me, and I
Speaker 2: had access and I knew how to do it, and
Speaker 2: that was the first step.
Speaker 1: So, okay, tell me more about the market, because it
Speaker 1: seems like there are more players in that space now,
Speaker 1: not that I'm an expert, but like.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, but like, oh, Joe's like the opposite of
Speaker 3: a curvy woman.
Speaker 1: Right, I'm a stick like man. I look like a
Speaker 1: stick bug in version six or five zero proves to me,
Speaker 1: so like, yeah, it was.
Speaker 2: It was.
Speaker 1: It just like a failing, a failing, a lack of
Speaker 1: foresight by a lot of the bigger retailers, the bigger
Speaker 1: brands out there, the bigger clothing brands, that they just
Speaker 1: didn't really this was a market they could sell to,
Speaker 1: because it certainly seems like it's a market that's exploded
Speaker 1: in recent years.
Speaker 2: I don't know if they didn't realize or they just
Speaker 2: didn't care like they're I mean, of course, I mean
Speaker 2: if you look at the world, if you pay attention
Speaker 2: at the time, if you look at women, they don't
Speaker 2: look like what they have like back in twenty twelve,
Speaker 2: what they were trying to make us feel like they
Speaker 2: look like. I don't know if it was just yeah,
Speaker 2: I feel like they didn't care. I think they cared
Speaker 2: about the plus community, but there was a missing like
Speaker 2: gap in the middle of like the average woman, and
Speaker 2: no one was catering to that or cared to It's.
Speaker 1: Like, not everybody looked like Kate Moss or whatever that
Speaker 1: was like the it was in vogue aesthetic, I guess
Speaker 1: back in the day, especially with the Victoria's Secret Angels
Speaker 1: and stuff like that, and so yeah, but all of
Speaker 1: those brands were kind of catering to a certain look
Speaker 1: and styling their closer, certain look and they were missing
Speaker 1: out on a large percentage of people who look more regular. Yeah, right,
Speaker 1: I could say that way.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's tough because it was our fault too, Like
Speaker 2: we liked looking at those Kate Moss and I mean
Speaker 2: I still like looking at k Moss, but we like,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, we liked looking at that
Speaker 2: image on in the media and we were accepting it.
Speaker 2: So it really, it really came to us it was
Speaker 2: partially our fault. Like now it's a lot more you know,
Speaker 2: embrace your body and embrace your natural and what you have.
Speaker 2: But back then that's not how it was. So it
Speaker 2: was it was their problem and it was our problem,
Speaker 2: and we needed to fix it.
Speaker 3: Okay, So you said that, you know, and it's often
Speaker 3: quoted as the typical response of like how you start
Speaker 3: a business by solving a problem, but it also, like
Speaker 3: the way you write about it, it seems a bit
Speaker 3: more organic than that, because like you started selling first
Speaker 3: store clothes on Instagram. But it's like, at the same
Speaker 3: time you were doing that, it seemed like that's how
Speaker 3: you were kind of identifying the need. Can you kind
Speaker 3: of explain that entire process when you first got started.
Speaker 2: It kind of just fell out of me. I mean,
Speaker 2: that's kind of what the gist of the book is about.
Speaker 2: I kind of already have these skills, like all along,
Speaker 2: skills that I wasn't like not embarrassed of, but we
Speaker 2: thrift it my entire life, Like most of my clothes
Speaker 2: were old like growing up, or you know, I had
Speaker 2: a knock for it because I was forced to do it,
Speaker 2: but I didn't. I had no idea that that was
Speaker 2: going to be like something I would end up making
Speaker 2: money from. I kind of, you know, I had it
Speaker 2: all along. And that's what I'm trying to say, is like,
Speaker 2: if you're you kind of already have what you need
Speaker 2: to succeed, you really just have to dig in to yourself.
Speaker 1: So is that just like an assessment of your skills?
Speaker 1: Is it sitting down and saying what skills do I
Speaker 1: have that maybe I don't think of as marketable right now?
Speaker 1: And wait, this, this, this, and this package together. Wait
Speaker 1: a second, I'm actually because you were like you weren't
Speaker 1: just selling Thirstorc clock. You were like you were tailoring them.
Speaker 1: You were making adjustments to those clothes. You were spicing
Speaker 1: them up right, So you were doing something. You were
Speaker 1: taking something that might have seemed ordinary. And let's be honest,
Speaker 1: like it's funny. I have a good friend who had
Speaker 1: a similar well not a similar business, but he would
Speaker 1: go buy Yes, it was similar. So what you would
Speaker 1: do was he would go buy thirst Star clothes and
Speaker 1: then he would just sell them straight up on eBay.
Speaker 1: But you were making changes, you were turning them into
Speaker 1: something boutique. But he made a living doing that with
Speaker 1: for his family for years. But you were doing something
Speaker 1: like you were adding on and creating another layer to
Speaker 1: make it even more inventive and unique.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and I didn't. And I wasn't great at it.
Speaker 2: I'm not a great seller. I was doing what I like,
Speaker 2: you want your backs up against the wall. You'll become
Speaker 2: a basketball player if you have to, like like you're gonna.
Speaker 2: I had to teach myself to get better at that.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I just kind of used what I already.
Speaker 3: Knew really, Like, I want to hear your thoughts on
Speaker 3: folks who might want to start a business but they
Speaker 3: don't have a ton of money. That's kind of how
Speaker 3: we were gonna latch in this episode, kind of like
Speaker 3: with that in mind. Like there's a lot of folks
Speaker 3: who think they can't actually do it because they don't
Speaker 3: have a ton of money saved up. They don't have
Speaker 3: a massive nest egg to kind of launch the business.
Speaker 3: What would you say to those folks.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of free resources. I mean we all
Speaker 2: google everything all of the time, even like to start
Speaker 2: a website. You don't need a lot of money. I
Speaker 2: don't know where everyone got this idea that you need
Speaker 2: a lot of money to start a business, because you don't.
Speaker 2: I started on big Cartel. There was like five products
Speaker 2: that I got for free, and then I thrifted clothes,
Speaker 2: and then with each sell I would profit, and then
Speaker 2: they'ft more clothes and then profit. That's how you build
Speaker 2: a business. You start, you make ten dollars, you turn
Speaker 2: that into twenty dollars, then you turn that into fifty dollars,
Speaker 2: and so on and so on. You don't need much
Speaker 2: to start a business. The hardest part is starting. Like
Speaker 2: a lot of people have ideas and they use that
Speaker 2: as an excuse to never start, But you really just
Speaker 2: have to start and make that first sell and then
Speaker 2: keep moving from there.
Speaker 1: You write in your book, and this is a quote,
Speaker 1: you say your business needed me, not money. How does
Speaker 1: a lack of money maybe fuel your creativity and your
Speaker 1: drive to start your business. It seems like sometimes money
Speaker 1: can be like a compensation factor once starting a business.
Speaker 1: It's like, oh, you don't have to be as creative.
Speaker 1: You can try to follow the path that somebody else
Speaker 1: has where you don't have much, Like you've got to
Speaker 1: be more resourceful.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you definitely to be more source. And I find
Speaker 2: that people with money when they start businesses, they waste
Speaker 2: a lot of it. Like I've seen a lot of
Speaker 2: people start brands spend so much money on the samples
Speaker 2: and the photo shoots and the models and getting everything
Speaker 2: started that you're not really paying attention to one. Is
Speaker 2: this a good idea? Of Two? Is it making any money?
Speaker 2: Am I spending too much on this to make profit?
Speaker 2: It definitely can be a distraction. Now money is great,
Speaker 2: Like it needed me and money. I just didn't have
Speaker 2: the money so instead of focusing on what I didn't have,
Speaker 2: I was forced to get creative.
Speaker 1: All right, So you said they were those brands were
Speaker 1: often wasting it, and I think, when you don't have
Speaker 1: money and tell me if I'm wrong on this, the
Speaker 1: immediate customer feedback, like, you take that the heart a
Speaker 1: whole lot more because at first, maybe you're like with
Speaker 1: You've got some money in the bank and you're like, okay, cool,
Speaker 1: let's test this out. I don't know if that worked well.
Speaker 1: We're going to keep trying to plot along our path.
Speaker 1: You're more sensitive to the customer and what they want,
Speaker 1: because like, hey, you got to start making.
Speaker 3: Sales, right.
Speaker 2: You're paying a lot more attention because you don't have
Speaker 2: the time. You don't have the money to waste, and
Speaker 2: people who have money they have it to waste. Like
Speaker 2: a lot of people dump a lot of money in ads.
Speaker 2: They don't ever look at them because they're like, Okay,
Speaker 2: let me try like a thousand more. Maybe that didn't
Speaker 2: work out. Yeah, you're definitely paying more intention you have
Speaker 2: a more personal relationship with your customers. It's just a
Speaker 2: it would have been easier if I would have had money,
Speaker 2: but me not having money forced to move me creative.
Speaker 3: And one of the other things you say in the
Speaker 3: book that instead of money, if you have a whole
Speaker 3: lot of grit on hand, is that that can overcome
Speaker 3: that lack of funding. But it seems like you've got
Speaker 3: you've got tenacity, you've got work ethic in spades, and
Speaker 3: it certainly showed even in tough times. What do you
Speaker 3: attribute that to? Or maybe I should ask who you
Speaker 3: attribute that to? Given your history.
Speaker 2: I saw my mom hustle my entire life, the different
Speaker 2: between her and me, and she had two kids at
Speaker 2: the time, So I don't know how she did it.
Speaker 2: I just there's a lot of things that I think
Speaker 2: are my personality that I look back and I'm like, dang,
Speaker 2: that's from her. This isn't me at all, Like I'm
Speaker 2: not just a natural hustler, because that's just how I am,
Speaker 2: It's how I grew up. She always had to make
Speaker 2: a way out of nothing, So yeah, it definitely came
Speaker 2: from her.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: At one point in the book, you write about like
Speaker 1: finding helpful resources online to help you get that business
Speaker 1: off the ground, things that existed for entrepreneurs that didn't have,
Speaker 1: you know, bookoos of funding. You know they didn't have
Speaker 1: investors trying to help them grow their business. What sort
Speaker 1: of resources did you stumble upon? What helped the most?
Speaker 2: YouTube? Really, Okay, I taught myself. I mean I didn't
Speaker 2: teach myself. You tube taught me photoshop, you know, like
Speaker 2: how to set up an ad, how to set up
Speaker 2: a store, how to sew. Literally like that was my
Speaker 2: resource for everything.
Speaker 3: That's awesome. It's been a minute since we've done an
Speaker 3: episode like this, but we like to invest in real
Speaker 3: estate as well, and I feel like one of our
Speaker 3: early early episodes we just talked about how there's so
Speaker 3: much stuff that you can diy yourself. And we think that,
Speaker 3: especially if you're gonna be kind of a small time
Speaker 3: like MoMA Pop kind of landlord, that it really pays
Speaker 3: to know how to do some of those things. And truly,
Speaker 3: you watch two or three YouTube videos on how to
Speaker 3: do a decently difficult task to repair something's just like.
Speaker 2: All right, I feel like I've got it.
Speaker 4: Time to change that toilet now that someone's just shared
Speaker 4: with me, Like, I mean, I do it perfectly just
Speaker 4: like they did, but over time you get better at it,
Speaker 4: and you're right like YouTube before YouTube, those resources like
Speaker 4: it was harder to come by.
Speaker 1: You had to ask a friend, you had to hire
Speaker 1: a professional. And now it's like someone showing you.
Speaker 3: There's somebody showing you exactly. Yeah, how it is it
Speaker 3: You can go about doing that. But we've actually we
Speaker 3: got more to get to because one of the other
Speaker 3: things you talk about that you need when it comes
Speaker 3: to starting a business is passion, and you've got a
Speaker 3: lot to say about that. We'll get to that more
Speaker 3: right after this.
Speaker 1: All right, we're back. We're still talking with Sierra Rogers.
Speaker 1: We're talking about making money starting a business essentially without
Speaker 1: having a lot of money to get the ball rolling, Siarah.
Speaker 1: I want to specifically go back to the beginning of
Speaker 1: your business. You mentioned in the book you talk about
Speaker 1: how you know Instagram was your main platform for trying
Speaker 1: to find followers who are interested in what you had
Speaker 1: to sell, and you got a reply from the user
Speaker 1: name Jazzy Girl eighty two and you say that that
Speaker 1: changed your life.
Speaker 2: How so, yeah, she's shown me that I actually had
Speaker 2: a business, like I could. I think when you first
Speaker 2: get that first sell, you're like, oh wait, I'm onto
Speaker 2: something like and how can I replicate this? Over and over?
Speaker 1: Again, So what was it that she said in when
Speaker 1: she reached out.
Speaker 2: I think she just wanted to buy it.
Speaker 1: How much can I get that?
Speaker 2: You know, because back then Instagram wasn't really like like
Speaker 2: now you go on there and everyone's selling something, yes,
Speaker 2: but back then it was it was just like, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm posting my friends, I mean posting my pictures and
Speaker 2: I'm gonna love off, you know, like a Facebook.
Speaker 1: It was more organic, didn't grassroots back then.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Oh I missed. It was in the good old days. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so I didn't know, like I you know, there was Etsy.
Speaker 2: I think I remember like I had it Etsy at
Speaker 2: the time. I had the big cartel, but I didn't
Speaker 2: think like this was going to be the way that
Speaker 2: I would build my client base for sure.
Speaker 3: I alluded to passion before the break. I love how
Speaker 3: you encourage folks to focus on like what it is
Speaker 3: that they have, not what they don't have. We kind
Speaker 3: of talked about that with your upbringing, and you know,
Speaker 3: you seem to mean that from a material perspective, but
Speaker 3: also from a personal one, like how should folks think
Speaker 3: about exploring the relationship between what they're good at and
Speaker 3: what it is that they're passionate about, especially when it
Speaker 3: comes to business, because I think, yeah, there's a whole
Speaker 3: lot of folks out there talking about, oh, you need it,
Speaker 3: you need to chase your passion. But maybe that's disconnected
Speaker 3: with reality. Maybe that's disconnected from the market. Maybe that's
Speaker 3: disconnected from what it is they're actually good at. But
Speaker 3: I would love for you to talk about even the
Speaker 3: process that you went through as you're trying to figure
Speaker 3: out what it is that you're going to pursue.
Speaker 2: With me, I'm a realist, I am if I'm like,
Speaker 2: there's a lot of people that are passionate about things
Speaker 2: that they're not great at, you kind of want them
Speaker 2: to meet. If you're trying to make money, unless you
Speaker 2: just make a whole ton of money and you want
Speaker 2: to do a bunch of things that you're passionate about,
Speaker 2: that's not where I was at at the time. I
Speaker 2: got lucky. The thing that I was passionate about I
Speaker 2: was actually good at. I have a knack for sizing women.
Speaker 2: I look at women's bodies all the time. I love
Speaker 2: fashion and I'm really good at it. So that's where
Speaker 2: that met. So for other people, I say, make a list,
Speaker 2: what are you really good at Are you passionate about it?
Speaker 2: Sometimes you're not. Sometimes you're in a field where you're
Speaker 2: actually good at something and you're not passionate about And
Speaker 2: that's okay, it's not like ideal, but I'd prefer that
Speaker 2: then you dive into something you're really passionate about and
Speaker 2: you're not good at and you don't make any money.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's nice to be able to I don't know,
Speaker 1: pay the bills, sustain your lifestyle, make building wealth and
Speaker 1: that helps, and that can cover a multitude of sins,
Speaker 1: including it you not being.
Speaker 3: Passionate about it. I mean, I think what I'm hearing
Speaker 3: you say, Siera, though, is that like if you start
Speaker 3: doing the thing that you're good at, that maybe there's
Speaker 3: a way for you to cultivate that passion for something right.
Speaker 3: And I think for so many folks that's kind of
Speaker 3: what it comes down to. It comes down to them
Speaker 3: kind of connecting the dots and being like, wait a minute,
Speaker 3: this is something I'm really good at, and actually like
Speaker 3: they need to look at it through a different lens
Speaker 3: because maybe like I'm I'll speak to like my childhood
Speaker 3: and like I was told to like you got to
Speaker 3: be a doctor, like that's how you help people, Like
Speaker 3: like that's how you're able to change individuals' lives, and
Speaker 3: like literally you're saving people.
Speaker 1: But like and then five year old Matt was like, no,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna become a podcaster. That's not a real job.
Speaker 1: It doesn't even exist yet.
Speaker 3: But but yeah, talk to us about that, because I
Speaker 3: think a lot of folks might sort of fall back
Speaker 3: on the crush and they're like, well, yeah, I'm good
Speaker 3: at these things over here, but like nobody really cares
Speaker 3: about that, or how is that actually going to lead
Speaker 3: to a successful business. When I think that you could
Speaker 3: encourage folks to be like no, no, no, no, lean into that.
Speaker 2: Honestly, if you're anything like me, if you're good at it,
Speaker 2: I'm going to become passionate about it because I'm good
Speaker 2: at this and that feels good. Yeah, it feels good
Speaker 2: to be good at something. It feels good to be
Speaker 2: like an expert at something. So I don't understand when
Speaker 2: someone's really good at something and they're like, no, I
Speaker 2: don't want to do it. I want to do something else.
Speaker 2: That's just not smart. I say, lean into it. It
Speaker 2: should be good, Like you're you're really good at something
Speaker 2: that's awesome and that's amazing and you can make money
Speaker 2: at it. Yeah, definitely lean into it. That would just
Speaker 2: be the smartest thing.
Speaker 1: I think that's a good a good point. When you're
Speaker 1: really confident in something, you can turn into greatness, and
Speaker 1: that greatness is in and of itself, can be fulfilling.
Speaker 1: You talk about in your book the power of saying
Speaker 1: what you want out loud, especially in front of others.
Speaker 1: So not just even like saying it to yourself in
Speaker 1: a mirror, but saying this is what I'm gonna do,
Speaker 1: this is what I want, this is where I'm heading.
Speaker 1: What does What's why?
Speaker 3: Is that powerful?
Speaker 2: It holds you accountable, It holds it. It's something about
Speaker 2: saying it out loud and it makes you. It's a
Speaker 2: very vulnerable experience, especially for someone like me, because now
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, I have to do it. I mentioned
Speaker 2: it to this person and now there's like someone else
Speaker 2: holding me accountable for it, and sometimes that's the push
Speaker 2: you need.
Speaker 1: It's Yeah, it's like publicizing, Hey, I'm if you're in
Speaker 1: your mind, you're like, I'm gonna try to run a
Speaker 1: marathon next year. But if you tell five friends and
Speaker 1: you know, maybe post that on Facebook or something like that.
Speaker 2: They're and be like, so what about that marathon that
Speaker 2: you said someone.
Speaker 1: And you're gonna be like still on the couch. You
Speaker 1: raped that thing up quick.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like don't keep everything inside, Like yeah, we all
Speaker 2: have our little like you know, like I want to
Speaker 2: write a movie, Like one day I'll write a movie,
Speaker 2: but saying it out loud and holding yeah, and I
Speaker 2: like the idea of like holding it up multiple people accountable,
Speaker 2: Like this is what I want to do. Because your
Speaker 2: friends will help you, your circle will help you, will
Speaker 2: help you hopefully. So yeah, things a good idea.
Speaker 3: Uh, talk to us about your story specifically. I mean
Speaker 3: you started out there on Instagram, but then I mean
Speaker 3: you you still are all on Instagram and you've got
Speaker 3: like millions of followers. I'm on there, but you you
Speaker 3: scaled beyond that. Can you kind of explain how that
Speaker 3: all worked out?
Speaker 2: I got. I mean, with Instagram, you're of course getting exposure.
Speaker 2: That's where everyone's finding you. I mean, that's the great
Speaker 2: thing about the Internet. So I was lucky to have
Speaker 2: Kim Kardashian and Lizzo and Beyonce make me feel seen.
Speaker 2: So I've been able to get exposure outside of it,
Speaker 2: which is smart because the algorithm sucks these days, so
Speaker 2: it'd be it's great to get exposure outside of social
Speaker 2: media and Instagram, which I've been able to do.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, so what does that look like then? Because
Speaker 1: you were doing some deep directed consumer on Instagram? Well,
Speaker 1: how do you sell products mostly these days and are
Speaker 1: using that mostly as just marketing now?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's important to always stay active on there. I'm
Speaker 2: I'm hosted through Shopify, though I'm not just selling on Instagram.
Speaker 2: That would be terrible, but yeah, it's important for exposure
Speaker 2: and just all different types of not just Instagram, like
Speaker 2: I am not. I don't lean on any things specifically,
Speaker 2: Like I was on LinkedIn the other day, like were
Speaker 2: how can I advertise on here so everybody can get it?
Speaker 2: Everybody can get this these ads in this exposure.
Speaker 3: Yeah. So okay, so you mentioned Kim Kardashian Ki you
Speaker 3: want to share that story. I'm sure you're happy that
Speaker 3: it happened, but oh yeah, yeah, kind of walk us
Speaker 3: through that entire story.
Speaker 2: You know, I saw her in a dress that looked
Speaker 2: like mine. See, I sell basics. If you go to
Speaker 2: my site, it's it's tough because my stuff is basics,
Speaker 2: it's like just a plain white dress, so it's hard
Speaker 2: for me to tell if someone's wearing my stuff. So
Speaker 2: when I saw it, I was like, wait a minute,
Speaker 2: either this lady took my dress or she's wearing my dress.
Speaker 3: It's like it kind of looks like mine, but I'm
Speaker 3: not totally sure.
Speaker 2: Let me make sure.
Speaker 1: So and I've heard this she influences a lot of
Speaker 1: people that I don't know, Maybe she gets a lot
Speaker 1: of follows, she might be kind of famous.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like maybe like this could probably be a big deal,
Speaker 2: So let me do my research first, and I did,
Speaker 2: and she actually at that time, she just was purchasing herself,
Speaker 2: like she she bought that dress and she wore it,
Speaker 2: and that just kind of took babes to a whole
Speaker 2: different other level. At first, I was caught in denial,
Speaker 2: because that's what happens if you've been through a lot
Speaker 2: of trauma and you feel like, you know, the jig
Speaker 2: is up, like no way, no way, that's my dress.
Speaker 2: But after it was yeah, definitely was an exciting moment.
Speaker 3: You said you're in denial, Like essentially, was that like
Speaker 3: self preservation? Like was that you basically not trying to
Speaker 3: get your hopes up.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, because I didn't want that was gonna be
Speaker 2: too much like like is at some point, I'm like,
Speaker 2: let me just not get my hopes up, let me
Speaker 2: do all of my research, because there was like a
Speaker 2: little nervous feeling because what if I announce that this
Speaker 2: is my dress and she comes out and she's like,
Speaker 2: it's not your dress, You're stupid, Like how embarrassing would
Speaker 2: that be? So yeah, I did. I didn't want to
Speaker 2: get my hopes up. I definitely did all of my research.
Speaker 2: And she confirmed that she bought it, and she bought
Speaker 2: a bunch of other things after that. So that's a
Speaker 2: great moment.
Speaker 1: I feel like that'd be the equivalent of like Warren
Speaker 1: Buffett listening to our podcast. You know, if we found
Speaker 1: that out, we would tout that listen to these two guys. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, he never will, that will never happen, but
Speaker 1: if it did, that would be great. One of the
Speaker 1: And you've got all these gems in this book when
Speaker 1: it comes to kind of how people should think about
Speaker 1: getting a business off the ground. You're right about focusing
Speaker 1: on effectiveness not efficiency, and I think sometimes business owners
Speaker 1: it's like, let me be as efficient as possible, and
Speaker 1: maybe we miss out on thinking about that all important
Speaker 1: necessity of being effective in our mission. So yeah, help
Speaker 1: me think through that dichotomy and how people should pursue
Speaker 1: being effective when they launch a business.
Speaker 2: People overthink the more I think that people over overthink
Speaker 2: a lot of things when it comes to business. It's
Speaker 2: just really it's as simple as do you have a
Speaker 2: product that other people want? And can you make a sell?
Speaker 2: There's like a lot of I don't know if this
Speaker 2: is answering your question, but this is just like my
Speaker 2: just my initial response to what you're saying, is it working?
Speaker 2: Can you? Like I always go back to Charck tank
Speaker 2: w or Kevin is like, do you need to take
Speaker 2: it to the back and shoot it? Like? Is it
Speaker 2: a product that's going to sell? Or is it not?
Speaker 2: Are we going to continue to like put a bunch
Speaker 2: of time in it or can we alter or adapt
Speaker 2: or sell this thing? Differently? I think there's a lot
Speaker 2: of overthinking involved when it comes to business, and I
Speaker 2: wish there was less of it.
Speaker 3: That kind of makes sense so too, because you know
Speaker 3: a lot of folks who think that they can start
Speaker 3: a successful business they're pretty smart folks, which means they're
Speaker 3: probably pretty good at analyzing things, but maybe they're over analyzing.
Speaker 1: How do you know if you have a seat of
Speaker 1: a good idea by the way, Sierra, and you're like
Speaker 1: it just needs iteration to be effective, or or if
Speaker 1: you do need to take it back to the back
Speaker 1: and shoot it. If you're like this is just trash.
Speaker 2: It's tough because a lot of people are selling products
Speaker 2: on the internet right and sometimes you can be seen
Speaker 2: or not seen, and sometimes that can affect your confidence.
Speaker 2: It can make you feel like you're doing something wrong
Speaker 2: and that is completely incorrect. And sometimes you're right. No
Speaker 2: one wants it, and I think that you just have
Speaker 2: to if you are a smart individual and you're asking
Speaker 2: people besides the people that love you then that support
Speaker 2: everything that you do, is this a good idea? Would
Speaker 2: you buy it? Are you actually getting a sell I say,
Speaker 2: within the first year, or is this just something that
Speaker 2: you're going to continue to you know, put a lot
Speaker 2: of money in, a lot of time in and it's
Speaker 2: never gonna work. It's a tricky thing. I would never
Speaker 2: tell anybody to just like quit, but you definitely need
Speaker 2: to be more aware and see if there's an actual
Speaker 2: customer for what you're trying to do.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think there's a balance to strike there, because
Speaker 3: if you know you've got good taste and something's maybe
Speaker 3: not catching right away, you want to continue to fund it,
Speaker 3: right like, you're going to keep pumping money into it
Speaker 3: even though it might be a struggling small business. But
Speaker 3: at a certain point you might have to throw in
Speaker 3: the towel. How does someone try to figure out where
Speaker 3: they are within that like on that time continuum.
Speaker 2: If it were me and I was starting a whole
Speaker 2: other business now that I wasn't completely sure about I,
Speaker 2: I try to sell it every way possible before I quit,
Speaker 2: because I'm not a quitter. I'm like, you know what,
Speaker 2: this is a good idea. Let me. I'm not going
Speaker 2: to put loads of money into it if it's not working,
Speaker 2: but I'm going to try my best to either. Also,
Speaker 2: how I'm selling, how I'm presenting it to the world.
Speaker 2: Maybe they don't like it this price point, maybe they
Speaker 2: don't like it with this color. I would try any
Speaker 2: and everything before I'd given a chout. It's hard for
Speaker 2: me to quit, and it's hard for me to tell
Speaker 2: someone to quit. But you know, you know, deep down
Speaker 2: if this is just good to you or good to
Speaker 2: other people. So that's like we all know.
Speaker 1: Okay, so you are your CEO, you found out a business.
Speaker 1: The one thing though, that's just inevitably true about humans
Speaker 1: and success is that we need other people to help
Speaker 1: launch us to success, right, whether it is somebody wearing
Speaker 1: your line, customer supporting you, you know, other people getting
Speaker 1: the word out. We typically think of the phrase using
Speaker 1: people as a bad thing, but you've got a whole
Speaker 1: chapter on the benefits of using people, like kind of
Speaker 1: like the way you talk about it, can you kind
Speaker 1: of what you mean by that?
Speaker 2: Uh? At face value? I mean, yeah, using people sounds bad,
Speaker 2: but it's it's necessary. I didn't really know how necessary
Speaker 2: it was until the first time I got used. You know,
Speaker 2: I'm in La It's like what can you do for me?
Speaker 2: Type city? Like what do you do? And what do
Speaker 2: you do? And it can come off in a bad
Speaker 2: way to some people that don't live here, but I've
Speaker 2: learned that that's just the way that you succeed. You
Speaker 2: have to use people to get ahead. They're a part
Speaker 2: of your resources. So using people but not being an
Speaker 2: a whole about it like letting them know first of all,
Speaker 2: these are my intentions, Like let's trade, Like what can
Speaker 2: you do for me? Well, I can do this for you.
Speaker 2: So I think we just need to take the badness
Speaker 2: out of that and make it work for us.
Speaker 3: That sounds like bartering or yeah, or I mean it
Speaker 3: sounds like it's like business. I mean like more of
Speaker 3: like a is that more of taken like a business
Speaker 3: mindset towards Yeah, if you don't.
Speaker 2: Have yeah, if you don't have resources, but you have
Speaker 2: friends or people around you, those are your resources, You're
Speaker 2: I mean, it's not it's just about not being a
Speaker 2: whole about it and making it mutually beneficial.
Speaker 1: Sounds just resourceful too, right, because if I like this
Speaker 1: and you've got that, like, hey, let's make a trade.
Speaker 1: And that's how before the invention of money, that's how
Speaker 1: the world used to work. Like you've got a cow,
Speaker 1: I've got four pigs. Yeah literally, yeah, I'd love some bacon.
Speaker 2: Like that's like I love that.
Speaker 1: That's just how things function, and so let's do that
Speaker 1: in business. You've got this skill and that's another great
Speaker 1: way with very little money to help get your thing
Speaker 1: off the you know, the drawing room floor to say, oh, listen, hey,
Speaker 1: you've you're great at social media. I'm great at this.
Speaker 1: What if we like swap talents for a second. I
Speaker 1: help you build your business and you help me build mine,
Speaker 1: and then and you just never know that network can
Speaker 1: be so invaluable and could kick in at a later
Speaker 1: date as well.
Speaker 2: People are really willing to like other people that are
Speaker 2: struggling if you just talk to them, like, hey, if
Speaker 2: you're just open about it, because I've been I've been
Speaker 2: used in a way that the person wasn't open and
Speaker 2: I'm like, wait a minute, I didn't get anything out
Speaker 2: of this. That doesn't feel good. But if you talk
Speaker 2: to someone and say hey, like I'm struggling, like I
Speaker 2: see that you have a following. I don't have a following,
Speaker 2: but this is what I can do to help you.
Speaker 2: Or you know, I could teach you graphic design, or
Speaker 2: I feel like you could have better photoshopping skills and
Speaker 2: I have those skills. So it's just about being upfront.
Speaker 1: It's like just another way to provide value, but to
Speaker 1: gain some value at the same time. Or we've got
Speaker 1: a few more questions we want to get to with you, Sira,
Speaker 1: and in particularly You've got like an interesting thought process
Speaker 1: on documenting your failures. We'll talk about that and more
Speaker 1: right after this.
Speaker 3: We are back from the break and again we're talking
Speaker 3: with founder and CEO of Babes, Sierra Rogers, and Sirah.
Speaker 3: Like I'm thinking back to earlier on you're talking about
Speaker 3: how like you know what I'm gonna fly for his class,
Speaker 3: But you can't spend in all the different areas of life.
Speaker 3: You got to you kind of have to be smart
Speaker 3: with your money. You say that you're addicted to getting
Speaker 3: things for free. This is the point from your book.
Speaker 3: You say that spending money is like rubbing sandpaper on
Speaker 3: your skin. And so I guess I'm curious if running
Speaker 3: a successful business is made spending money a little bit easier,
Speaker 3: Like do you are you able to kind of see
Speaker 3: it through more of that you know, business sort of
Speaker 3: lens where you're like, okay, this is going to allow
Speaker 3: me to experience this. Do you look at it more methodically?
Speaker 3: Do you look at it more just as numbers? Or
Speaker 3: do you still feel kind of the Is it still
Speaker 3: painful for you to spend some money?
Speaker 2: Sometimes it's painful. I don't I don't love it, so
Speaker 2: it has to make sense. Even my my assistant, she's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: you have to, like we have to like get better
Speaker 2: this or like better ink, And I'm like, yeah, but
Speaker 2: like but this ink is working. Uh, it just has
Speaker 2: to make sense. I pay a lot of attention to it.
Speaker 2: I pay a lot of attention to my money and
Speaker 2: what goes in and out. That's just like how I'm
Speaker 2: built because I didn't have money for so long, so
Speaker 2: it's still a very uncomfortable thing in order for me
Speaker 2: to spend money. It just has to make sense.
Speaker 1: That's as an individual and as a business. Are you
Speaker 1: paying attention to like the incoming and outgoing all the time.
Speaker 1: Do you feel like maybe you're too focused on that
Speaker 1: or do you feel like it's a it's a healthy balance.
Speaker 2: I think it's a healthy balance. My sister would disagree
Speaker 2: with you. She's like, Cere, you made it stop being cheap,
Speaker 2: And I'm like, yeah, but we don't have to, you know,
Speaker 2: Like I'm always like what can I get? What can
Speaker 2: I get a discut on? Like where's where are the coupons?
Speaker 2: I love the coupons. Where are the deals? So it's
Speaker 2: hard for me to pay, like when it comes to
Speaker 2: full price, it has to be freaking worth it. For me,
Speaker 2: I'm always going to try to look for either a
Speaker 2: way to save money or it needs to make complete sense.
Speaker 1: Well, I like that even after you've made it, you're
Speaker 1: still a woman after our own heart. You're still trying
Speaker 1: to send money wherever you can. One of the things
Speaker 1: you mentioned or you recommend folks in the book is
Speaker 1: to write down a list of their failures, which sounds
Speaker 1: really masochistic, like it sounds like something I don't want
Speaker 1: to do, not really interested in, but you told me
Speaker 1: to do it, so maybe I have to Why Why
Speaker 1: is that a helpful exercise for people, especially people who
Speaker 1: want to build a business.
Speaker 2: I think because you're gonna I don't want to say
Speaker 2: you're gonna fall at some point. Entrepreneurship is tricky, you know,
Speaker 2: life tricky. There's going to be a lot of ups
Speaker 2: and downs. But we need to we need to find
Speaker 2: things to learn from and that's what that is. Those
Speaker 2: are cheekos like that's like what I'm not going to
Speaker 2: do again, and it's a reminder all the time, and
Speaker 2: I'm never going to go that route because that didn't work.
Speaker 2: And I think that's important not to ignore them. But
Speaker 2: to see like why did I do that? And if
Speaker 2: I did, how can I avoid doing it again.
Speaker 3: I think there are a lot of folks might be listening,
Speaker 3: and they're hopefully they're they've been inspired by our conversation
Speaker 3: with you, Sierra, and maybe they're thinking like, Okay, I
Speaker 3: know I want to start something, not really sure what,
Speaker 3: but they know they just know that they don't want
Speaker 3: to keep doing what they're doing now. And you one
Speaker 3: of the things you've seen in your book is that
Speaker 3: you don't need much to build success if you have
Speaker 3: imagination and determination. We've talked a lot about determination. You're
Speaker 3: a realist. You're talking about the different goals, financial goals
Speaker 3: that you had. You know, it's different points in time.
Speaker 3: You're kind of backed up against the wall. But let's
Speaker 3: talk about imagination because I feel like for a lot
Speaker 3: of folks that feels like something that they may be
Speaker 3: exhausted in childhood. They don't have that maybe that creative
Speaker 3: spark or maybe it's all but snuffed out. Do you
Speaker 3: have any tips for folks to kind of tap into
Speaker 3: that creative side as fully grown adults.
Speaker 2: I think you have your unique point of view in
Speaker 2: the world, like I wish I could talk to everyone
Speaker 2: and get all the business ideas because I know they're
Speaker 2: in you. I think about like, dang, I should have
Speaker 2: came up with Uber, I should have come up with
Speaker 2: like postmates. You know, these ideas were simple in the beginning,
Speaker 2: like oh, like we just need transportation, like easier transportation,
Speaker 2: or we need a way to get our food, Like
Speaker 2: you really have it in you, if you have a
Speaker 2: unique point of view in the world, you really just
Speaker 2: have to dig in there and grab it out. Make
Speaker 2: sure there's an open space in the market, make sure
Speaker 2: it's something that you can sell, and boom, you have
Speaker 2: a business. Please tell me about it because I want
Speaker 2: to help you do it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Are you actively kind of coming up with ideas
Speaker 1: for new businesses? Are you writing things down or are you
Speaker 1: bouncing ideas off other people? Like what does that look
Speaker 1: like for you? And if someone's out there like trying
Speaker 1: to figure out, oh what is that? What is that spark?
Speaker 1: What is that seed of an idea that might make sense?
Speaker 1: Is there any like trick to unearthing it from your brain?
Speaker 2: Problems like Hey, I don't like this, I don't like
Speaker 2: how this is going, and there needs to be a
Speaker 2: better way of doing it. Yeah, and which we run
Speaker 2: into all the time, and people just we don't have
Speaker 2: that extra step of like me being the one that
Speaker 2: fixes it instead of saying I wish this were fixed.
Speaker 2: That's really what it is.
Speaker 1: So you want somebody else out there to do it.
Speaker 1: But if you see the problem, you can be the
Speaker 1: person to help fix that problem and make some money
Speaker 1: at the same time.
Speaker 2: Right, And it can look crappy at first, as long
Speaker 2: as you come up with the idea like be first,
Speaker 2: don't tell too many people about it because somebody may
Speaker 2: still try to patent it the best that you can.
Speaker 2: But yeah, you can be the fixer. That's really what
Speaker 2: it's all about, is you taking a step and fixing
Speaker 2: the problems that you see.
Speaker 1: Last thing, you tell people to ask themselves, what are
Speaker 1: you passively convincing yourself you're not capable of? And I
Speaker 1: think that is like one of the most interesting lines
Speaker 1: because I think you're right. I think it is. It's
Speaker 1: not even this active thing like where we're telling ourselves
Speaker 1: that we can't do it, or we don't have any
Speaker 1: good ideas, or we can't build a business, and so
Speaker 1: we never even get up off the mat to start
Speaker 1: to think about what we could do, what we could build.
Speaker 1: How do we overcome that? Like what how can we
Speaker 1: stop being our own worst enemy in kind of this
Speaker 1: uh everyday way that we do it where we just
Speaker 1: fail to even go there practice.
Speaker 2: I still struggle with it. I don't know if it
Speaker 2: ever really goes away. It hasn't gone away like completely
Speaker 2: for me, but constantly reminding myself that you you can
Speaker 2: be your worst your own worst enemy and adding that
Speaker 2: on top of life already being hard doesn't make sense.
Speaker 2: You know yourself, You know that you know what you're
Speaker 2: doing to, like if it's fear based, if you're just insecure,
Speaker 2: or you feel like, uh, you're watching a lot of
Speaker 2: other people, you're comparing yourself to, like whatever the situation
Speaker 2: may be. Yeah, it definitely can become a passive thing
Speaker 2: and you're doing it to yourself. Once you realize you're
Speaker 2: doing it to yourself, then just change it because you're
Speaker 2: you're the one doing it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think And what you said there too about
Speaker 3: practicing it makes me think back to when you first
Speaker 3: started and you made your first twenty dollars and so
Speaker 3: then you were able to kind of reinvest that, like
Speaker 3: it builds on itself. It makes me think about how
Speaker 3: we talk about investing and how it's like a snowball.
Speaker 3: It just it compounds, it builds, and so does your
Speaker 3: experience as well as you. As you have some of
Speaker 3: these wins, you can add to those wins and continue
Speaker 3: to grow it. But Sierra, this is it's been a
Speaker 3: fun cond of working folks. Learn more about the outsider
Speaker 3: advantage and learn more about you and your brains.
Speaker 2: Oh, you can go to Sierra Rodgers dot com and
Speaker 2: everything's there.
Speaker 3: Awesome.
Speaker 1: Great, we'll link to that in the show notes as well. Sierra,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us today on the show.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 3: All Right, well, Joe, I think this is the first
Speaker 3: time we've ever had a fashion designer on the show,
Speaker 3: someone who you considers themselves themselves a stylist. Do you
Speaker 3: consider your style yourself a stylist?
Speaker 1: Joe, I'm well styled that I'll.
Speaker 3: Go that far. Yeah, this is a great conversation with we,
Speaker 3: Sierra Rogers, as we talked about entrepreneurship basically, but uh, yeah,
Speaker 3: what was Do you have a big takeaway from our conversation.
Speaker 1: I feel like there's a lot of kind of avenues
Speaker 1: we could explore here. There's just a lot of little
Speaker 1: things that just are really big things ultimately, but the
Speaker 1: way she talks about them sometimes it feels like so
Speaker 1: down to earth and approachable. I think one of the
Speaker 1: things she said, and I think it's true, like lots
Speaker 1: of times we over complicate starting a business. I like
Speaker 1: how she talked about being able to do it with
Speaker 1: a little money and how that breaths creativity. But one
Speaker 1: of the things she said was she said, people overthink this,
Speaker 1: like do you have a product that people want? And
Speaker 1: I think that is ultimately the heart of starting a business.
Speaker 1: Is the thing you plan on creating. Is it something
Speaker 1: other people like? Is it going to fix the problem
Speaker 1: they have? Is it going to be something that people
Speaker 1: want to pay money for, will line up for, want
Speaker 1: to gladly joyfully hand over their time or their money
Speaker 1: or whatever to partake in. Makes you think about when
Speaker 1: we started talking about launching this podcast, or like, oh,
Speaker 1: there's a lot of money podcasts, and there's a lot
Speaker 1: of podcasts, and guess what, there's more podcasts than ever
Speaker 1: out there. Hopefully what we're creating is different and it's
Speaker 1: providing enough value. I mean, I think it is for
Speaker 1: our listeners, so they want to stick around and partake.
Speaker 1: And I think that is at the crux of what
Speaker 1: makes any business successful is making sure you know your
Speaker 1: customer and you're giving them what is good for them,
Speaker 1: what they're what they're.
Speaker 3: Interested in, Yeah, and going with what works, like is
Speaker 3: this a good product and at the end of the day,
Speaker 3: like that ultimately decides whether or not folks are willing
Speaker 3: to pay for it.
Speaker 1: Also doesn't have to be complex. She was selling thristore
Speaker 1: clothes there were jazzed uff a little and turned it
Speaker 1: into a fairly big business.
Speaker 3: So yeah, the other part of her story that was
Speaker 3: compelling to me was the fact that she was just
Speaker 3: a realist. She even said that at one point, she's like,
Speaker 3: I'm a realist. It was necessary for me to make
Speaker 3: this thing work because I had different financial goals that
Speaker 3: I wanted to achieve. And even it comes to like
Speaker 3: her spending money, whether it's in her personal life or
Speaker 3: on the business, she said that it's got to make sense.
Speaker 3: And so I just like that practical approach to how
Speaker 3: it is that she sees life, because like for someone
Speaker 3: that doesn't know her or they're you know, as you're
Speaker 3: looking at someone from Afar, you were thinking, Oh, my gosh,
Speaker 3: they have it all figured out, or oh, there's such
Speaker 3: a dreamer. Whoever thought that you could be someone that
Speaker 3: creates a line of women's clothing like that? But at
Speaker 3: the end of the day, she's just like you said.
Speaker 3: It kind of dovetails with what you said, but she's
Speaker 3: just making something that's good and she's trying to pay
Speaker 3: the bills. And I don't know, there's a simplicity to
Speaker 3: starting your own business, and oftentimes it kind of comes
Speaker 3: down to the practical, like am I able to pay
Speaker 3: the bills? Am I able to pay rent? Can I
Speaker 3: support my family by creating by embarking on this endeavor?
Speaker 3: That sort of thing.
Speaker 1: I think the other thing, too, is when you aren't
Speaker 1: having to allocate a ton of financial resources to the
Speaker 1: business that you're trying to launch, the stakes are low, right,
Speaker 1: And so she talks about documenting your failures, but hey,
Speaker 1: guess what, You might fail, but you fail small, and
Speaker 1: so you fail in a way that it's not going
Speaker 1: to break the bank and it's not going to ruin
Speaker 1: your family. It could be something that you launch on
Speaker 1: the side while you're doing something else, And I think
Speaker 1: that's part of the brilliant too, of kind of starting
Speaker 1: a small business and doing it while you've got your
Speaker 1: main gig still intact.
Speaker 3: That's the way to do it, man.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a great way to try to.
Speaker 3: Yeah, let's introduce the beer that you and I enjoyed
Speaker 3: during this episode. This was a I don't know how
Speaker 3: to say this because this is a Ukrainian beer, but
Speaker 3: it's fit lay or spiddle. Yeah, I think it's fiddle.
Speaker 3: The I t l e. It's fiddle. This is a
Speaker 3: beer by Obolon Brewery. Well your what are your thoughts?
Speaker 1: No, I don't have great thoughts, Matt. This so this
Speaker 1: beer we're drinking the last of our not so great beers,
Speaker 1: our crap beers, not craft beers, because of how things
Speaker 1: ended with our daffy challenge to raise money for some
Speaker 1: of our favorite nonprofits. And it's it's to me this
Speaker 1: had a really metallic vibe. I feel for the people
Speaker 1: of Ukraine, not because they have to drink this beer,
Speaker 1: because everything else is going on over there, of course,
Speaker 1: but this beer. Saying this beer doesn't help, No, it
Speaker 1: doesn't help it.
Speaker 3: I didn't think it was all that bad. This it's
Speaker 3: funny because some of the quote unquote crap beers.
Speaker 1: Carlsberg was better than this.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, because Karlsburg was nice and clean. This
Speaker 3: did drink a little bit more like what was the
Speaker 3: one from from Aldi? The other? Oh yeah, Pilsner. It
Speaker 3: was bad that the I don't know, but both of them,
Speaker 3: I mean, they're not terrible, but they're the kind of
Speaker 3: beer that you could enjoy after kind of mowing the
Speaker 3: law and working out in the working out in the
Speaker 3: sun a Saturday afternoon, that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: All right, yeah, it might be all it's qualified for.
Speaker 3: Okay, that being said, this is the last of these beers,
Speaker 3: so I'm looking forward to getting back to the really
Speaker 3: good stuff come next Monday. Buddy me too.
Speaker 1: All right, that's gonna do it for this episode. We'll
Speaker 1: we'll put all the necessary links up in our show
Speaker 1: notes up at howdmoney dot com, including a link to
Speaker 1: Sierra's new book. But Matt, until next time, best Friends
Speaker 1: Out and best Friends Out.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 3: I don't know, maybe we'll kind of slide this into
Speaker 3: at the end of the episodes here, but you talking
Speaker 3: about your story and kind of how the book shifted
Speaker 3: to kind of more of like a memoir. How important
Speaker 3: do you think that is to kind of have like
Speaker 3: an interesting narrative, like a like a compelling personal story
Speaker 3: like that, because it makes me think about like artists,
Speaker 3: because you might have, on one hand, an artist that's
Speaker 3: just like the most proficient excellent at their craft, Like
Speaker 3: nobody has ever created art as good as this person,
Speaker 3: whether it's painting or ceramics or whatever. But if there's
Speaker 3: no story behind it, it can be difficult sometimes to
Speaker 3: gain traction, as opposed to like some street folk artists
Speaker 3: that I'm drawn to that has a really cool story.
Speaker 3: Is he the most accomplished? I don't know if you
Speaker 3: could you could say that, but he's a really interesting person. Yeah,
Speaker 3: what are your thoughts there on kind of like that
Speaker 3: personal narrative and art or even just a business and
Speaker 3: where we were selling products or a service.
Speaker 2: I think you want to there's so many people selling
Speaker 2: things all the time, so it's nice to clear the room.
Speaker 2: You really want to root for someone, was what I've learned.
Speaker 2: I would have loved to do a business book because
Speaker 2: I love businessook like just give me the tips, But
Speaker 2: people it's like why trust me, like just looking at me,
Speaker 2: like why would you buy a business book for me.
Speaker 2: So the story was was needed for you to root
Speaker 2: for me and see where I came from and then
Speaker 2: trust what I'm saying. That's more important these days because
Speaker 2: we're just getting sold to so many there's so many
Speaker 2: of everything, so we have to like clear the.
Speaker 1: Air a little bit and people want to buy a story.
Speaker 1: People want to whether it's a book, whether it's clothing items,
Speaker 1: whatever it is. It's it's that's what made like Tom
Speaker 1: so successful early on, Right, it was like to buy
Speaker 1: one get one shoe thing and people were.
Speaker 3: Like, oh, this has never heard of that before.
Speaker 1: It's just a shoe. It's a mission, right, And I
Speaker 1: think people really gravitate towards that. They're attracted to that,
Speaker 1: and so yeah, I think that kind of story combined
Speaker 1: with you know, the practical business tactics is that's a
Speaker 1: good combo