1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:01,680 Speaker 1: Hey, Elon Inc. Listeners. 2 00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:05,240 Speaker 2: Max Chafkin here, I know you and I and everybody 3 00:00:05,240 --> 00:00:09,400 Speaker 2: else are still sort of recovering from that monster episode 4 00:00:09,400 --> 00:00:12,600 Speaker 2: that we published on Tuesday. I wanted to just record 5 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 2: a little introduction to the latest episode of Everybody's Business, 6 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:19,279 Speaker 2: which we just taped and which is really interesting. It 7 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 2: is about salary cap and sports. Really awesome conversation there, 8 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:26,840 Speaker 2: as well as a conversation with Rohit Chopra about the 9 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:30,960 Speaker 2: future of the FED, and there is a little Elon 10 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:36,200 Speaker 2: related Easter egg. It is a unique branding story involving SpaceX. 11 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 2: I'll just leave it there, but it's a pretty funny segment. 12 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:40,879 Speaker 2: I think you'll like it, and we, of course will 13 00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:44,360 Speaker 2: be back talking about Elon Musk on the Everybody's Business 14 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:48,080 Speaker 2: Podcast with Dana and Kurt and all the people that 15 00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:49,800 Speaker 2: you've been hearing on Elon Inc. 16 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:52,680 Speaker 1: Very soon. Hope you enjoyed the episode and talk to 17 00:00:52,720 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: you later. 18 00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:03,280 Speaker 3: Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcast Radio News. 19 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:08,640 Speaker 1: This is Everybody's Business from Bloomberg BusinessWeek. 20 00:01:08,640 --> 00:01:11,520 Speaker 4: I'm Max Shafton and I'm Stacy Vannick Smith and. 21 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 2: Stacy we have a big conversation coming up about your 22 00:01:14,720 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 2: favorite topic, the Federal Reserve. Our guest is Rohitschopra. He 23 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:21,399 Speaker 2: was a big deal guy in the Biden administration and 24 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:24,080 Speaker 2: he has provocative things to say about Jerome Powell. 25 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 5: We're also talking about salary caps in professional sports leagues. 26 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 5: Teams and players have been finding some pretty interesting ways 27 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:32,400 Speaker 5: around those limitations. 28 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:36,840 Speaker 2: And our underrated story, Stacy, I have a idea, a 29 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:38,480 Speaker 2: brand idea for Elon Musk. 30 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:40,880 Speaker 1: Warning may not be leaked. 31 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 4: I will keep that in mind. 32 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:45,919 Speaker 1: Okay. 33 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:49,640 Speaker 5: Obviously, the big economic news this week was the Federal Reserve, 34 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:54,560 Speaker 5: but we also got some pretty big business news last night. 35 00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 4: We're recording Thursday morning. 36 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,240 Speaker 2: We should say, yeah, another late night host is down, 37 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:05,160 Speaker 2: Stacy amid some political pressure from the Trump administration. Disney 38 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:08,799 Speaker 2: essentially pulled Jimmy Kimmel, who is the ABC late night host, 39 00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 2: a competitor to Stephen Colbert, off the air, amid political 40 00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:16,040 Speaker 2: pressure from the Trump administration. For me, this story really 41 00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 2: has echoes of the one that we talked about with 42 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:21,519 Speaker 2: Felix Gillette a couple weeks ago with Stephen Colbert, where 43 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 2: you have a combination of factors. One is the threat 44 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:28,720 Speaker 2: of regulation of not approving mergers, and the other is 45 00:02:28,760 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 2: like this format the late night format is basically failing, 46 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 2: and all of these late night shows are not doing well. 47 00:02:35,480 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 2: So Trump is giving these networks essentially an excuse to 48 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:41,639 Speaker 2: kill a product that is not working super well. 49 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:44,440 Speaker 5: I would argue the bigger story in a certain way, 50 00:02:44,520 --> 00:02:47,800 Speaker 5: could be a potential threat to free speech and news 51 00:02:47,880 --> 00:02:52,399 Speaker 5: organizations feeling like if one of their hosts or commentators 52 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:55,360 Speaker 5: says something or does something that the administration disagrees with, 53 00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:58,920 Speaker 5: they might end up facing the very real wrath of 54 00:02:58,919 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 5: like governmental regularly. 55 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. 56 00:03:01,639 --> 00:03:04,880 Speaker 2: And we have another story related to political pressure that 57 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:06,360 Speaker 2: just so happens to me going. 58 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:06,720 Speaker 1: On right now. 59 00:03:06,760 --> 00:03:09,240 Speaker 5: We have another story related to political pressure, which is 60 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:12,360 Speaker 5: the Federal Reserve. For the first time this year, the 61 00:03:12,400 --> 00:03:14,600 Speaker 5: Federal Reserve cut interest rates, which we were all kind 62 00:03:14,600 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 5: of expecting. 63 00:03:15,120 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 2: But there was a cut it by three hundred percent, 64 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:18,239 Speaker 2: right as Donald Trump want. 65 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 5: Yeah, a quarter of a percentagey, which was like what 66 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 5: was expected but by economists. 67 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 4: Yes, well, there there was a lot of drama around this. 68 00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:28,160 Speaker 5: We will get into kind of what was going on 69 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:31,359 Speaker 5: behind the scenes with Row hitch Chopra in just a minute. 70 00:03:31,639 --> 00:03:34,320 Speaker 5: But the Fetchair did say something that I thought was 71 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 5: kind of interesting for the rest of us, us in 72 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 5: the economy, which is he he started to talk about stagflation, 73 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 5: how prices are going up, how the economy is slowing down, 74 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:48,040 Speaker 5: and this is a really dangerous combination. And so I 75 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 5: thought I would like ask people how they were feeling 76 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 5: about the economy right now. How do you feel about 77 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:55,560 Speaker 5: the economy right now? 78 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:58,280 Speaker 6: I'm not good. All the prices are going up, and 79 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:01,720 Speaker 6: not especially food shopping. Before you could just put everything 80 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:04,440 Speaker 6: in your cart, and now you have to start cutting 81 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:05,240 Speaker 6: back on things. 82 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 1: It's a real have and have not economy. And you know, 83 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:11,360 Speaker 1: you look around, people are making a lot of money, 84 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:15,480 Speaker 1: and some professions and the champagne's flowing and in others, 85 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:17,599 Speaker 1: you know, things are definitely a lot tighter. 86 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 5: I kim here because this is the only not. 87 00:04:19,680 --> 00:04:20,760 Speaker 1: Going to fall right now. 88 00:04:21,000 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 5: The pizza the dogphis to slice. Yeah. 89 00:04:23,920 --> 00:04:25,760 Speaker 7: Yeah, when I got the job, I think I'm going 90 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:28,279 Speaker 7: to go back to like chicken and eggs. 91 00:04:28,520 --> 00:04:31,560 Speaker 5: Eggs are like a luxury a little bit exactly. Is 92 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:33,919 Speaker 5: there something that like, if you had more money or 93 00:04:33,920 --> 00:04:35,720 Speaker 5: felt better about the economy, something. 94 00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 1: That you would buy. 95 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 4: It's a new car. What's your car like now? 96 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,400 Speaker 6: It's a terrible Nissan that keeps having one hundred problems 97 00:04:42,400 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 6: because it's almost at ninety thousand. 98 00:04:44,040 --> 00:04:50,400 Speaker 2: Miles, Prices going up, economic opportunities stagnating. There's a word 99 00:04:50,440 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 2: for that stacy that is that's Stagflation's stagulation. 100 00:04:53,880 --> 00:04:57,520 Speaker 4: It's the worst of all the plations, I think. And 101 00:04:57,600 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 4: it's like kind of a. 102 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 5: Trap for the Federal Reserve because if they cut interest rates, 103 00:05:02,160 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 5: it does help grow the economy, but it can also 104 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:08,159 Speaker 5: make inflation worse, so it puts everybody in tough position. 105 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:11,239 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's not clear to me what the fix 106 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:13,159 Speaker 2: is at this point. I mean, we are we've got 107 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:16,800 Speaker 2: economic challenges that I don't know, you know, whatever you 108 00:05:16,839 --> 00:05:19,359 Speaker 2: feel about Jerome Powell or whoever's running the Fed, Like, 109 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,200 Speaker 2: I don't know how fixable it is at this point. 110 00:05:22,480 --> 00:05:25,440 Speaker 5: Well, I agree, and like prices are going up and 111 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:27,599 Speaker 5: with tariffs are going to go up more, at least 112 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 5: a little bit more. It could be a one time thing, 113 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:33,760 Speaker 5: but it is a really tough position, Like it's not 114 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 5: obvious what they should do. But the Federal Reserve yesterday 115 00:05:36,920 --> 00:05:39,640 Speaker 5: said jobs right now are the most important, and I 116 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:42,240 Speaker 5: think most of us would probably agree. Although if inflation 117 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:42,920 Speaker 5: gets out of control. 118 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:48,680 Speaker 4: That could be really bad. 119 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:53,000 Speaker 5: So Max, we talked earlier in the show about the 120 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:55,440 Speaker 5: big economic news of the week, which is the Federal 121 00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 5: Reserve and interest rate cuts, and somehow everyone in the 122 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:01,719 Speaker 5: country like knows about out the Federal Reserve and interest rates. 123 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:03,839 Speaker 4: Now it has become huge news. 124 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, And we've also been talking about this question of 125 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 2: like FED independence and the sense that Trump and members 126 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:15,640 Speaker 2: of his administration are doing things to kind of attack 127 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,280 Speaker 2: the FED or to push them in various directions. And 128 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 2: I was excited about the conversation we're going to have 129 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 2: because we've been sort of talking about the FED. And 130 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 2: I know this is kind of partly how you feel, 131 00:06:26,040 --> 00:06:28,480 Speaker 2: but some of it has to do with conventional was whatever, 132 00:06:28,800 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 2: like that there is this beautiful jewel of public policy 133 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 2: that is the US Federal Reserve. 134 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 1: I am a. 135 00:06:34,520 --> 00:06:37,200 Speaker 5: Huge fan of the central Bank and like the structure 136 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:38,600 Speaker 5: of it and the system. 137 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 2: And I appreciate that, but I also thought it'd be 138 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 2: fun to have a guest who would kind of challenge 139 00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 2: that a little bit. 140 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:48,280 Speaker 4: Fair enough, Yes, I mean, I think it's good to 141 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:50,480 Speaker 4: challenge these things. That's what they're there for, all right. 142 00:06:50,520 --> 00:06:54,400 Speaker 2: So we have Rohit Chopra, who was the director of 143 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:58,160 Speaker 2: the Consumer Financial Production Bureau under Joe Biden. He served 144 00:06:58,160 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 2: on the FTC under Trump, helped actually set up the 145 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:05,839 Speaker 2: CFPB as its assistant director. Basically, he is a heavyweight 146 00:07:06,360 --> 00:07:10,040 Speaker 2: on the kind of like progressive left, and he has 147 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 2: kind of an interesting perspective on these issues, and I 148 00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 2: thought it'd be fun to kind of hash it out here. 149 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:16,040 Speaker 1: Roha, thanks for being here, Thanks. 150 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 8: So much for having me. 151 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 5: So we got the rate cut, that was the big 152 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 5: headline quarter of a percentage point rate cut, but there 153 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:24,840 Speaker 5: was a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes 154 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:27,720 Speaker 5: that was also making news. Do you mind just kind 155 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:31,320 Speaker 5: of laying out some of the things happening in the 156 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 5: FED right now, which has always loomed very large in 157 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 5: my world, but is somehow also looming large in the 158 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 5: regular world now. 159 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:39,200 Speaker 4: Very strange, Yes, Stacy. 160 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 3: There had these sets of meetings to determine what to 161 00:07:42,200 --> 00:07:45,080 Speaker 3: do with those interest rates, and it had to have 162 00:07:45,120 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 3: been a really awkward meeting because one of the governors 163 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 3: who was going to vote there sitting deliberating and voting, 164 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 3: was actually the target of an attempted firing by President Trump. 165 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 3: That's Lisa Cook, who is battling in court. She has 166 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:05,160 Speaker 3: won many rounds of that court room battle and cast 167 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 3: to vote. Another person sitting in that room is newly 168 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 3: confirmed Governor Stephen Myron, who is currently the chair of 169 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 3: the Council of Economic Advisors and is in some ways 170 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:25,160 Speaker 3: dual hatting taking both jobs, which is unusual. 171 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 1: Now anyway, just in general in the work for economy. 172 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:30,320 Speaker 4: It's for everybody now. 173 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:33,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, And this comes after, of course, months and months 174 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:38,559 Speaker 3: of the President targeting J. Powell, essentially trolling him online 175 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:42,200 Speaker 3: and infamously showing up in hard hats to do a 176 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 3: site inspection of a construction project. So right now there 177 00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:49,680 Speaker 3: is a lot of debate about what's the right role 178 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 3: for the President and Congress in the Federal Reserve, and 179 00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:58,120 Speaker 3: a lot of people are fiercely defending the status quot 180 00:08:58,160 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 3: But I think the story is sometimes triggier than that. 181 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 5: Well, also we should say that Stephen Myron, who was 182 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 5: in his new role this is his first time voting 183 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:13,199 Speaker 5: on interest rates, was the loan dissenter and very much 184 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 5: in line with what the President has said he wanted. 185 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:18,920 Speaker 5: Myron said he wanted like a bigger cut, bigger cutt Yes, 186 00:09:19,000 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 5: bigger cut. 187 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:21,080 Speaker 1: So Rohit. 188 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 2: You have thoughts about the FED, and and we've talked, 189 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:27,960 Speaker 2: you know, off off this podcast about this a little bit. 190 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:30,120 Speaker 2: But I'd love for you to just explain when you 191 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:33,520 Speaker 2: say like they're sort of assuming everything's great or whatever, 192 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:36,120 Speaker 2: like what you mean or like at a high level, 193 00:09:36,240 --> 00:09:38,880 Speaker 2: like what is wrong with the FED today? 194 00:09:38,960 --> 00:09:40,680 Speaker 8: Yeah, Well, I would put it this way. 195 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:45,640 Speaker 3: There's lots of reasons why in a democratic society we 196 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 3: create some anti democratic features in certain parts of our government. 197 00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 3: For example, we make sure the judges are confirmed for life, 198 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 3: the idea being this should stand for election all the time. 199 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:00,680 Speaker 8: Be subjected to the political process. 200 00:10:01,240 --> 00:10:06,560 Speaker 3: And we also cordon off some of our regulators to 201 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 3: make sure that they're not put in the middle of 202 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:14,320 Speaker 3: a total political slugfest. That's some of the agencies I've 203 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:17,880 Speaker 3: served at, the CFPB, the FTC, others. And then you 204 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 3: really have the Federal Reserve System, which has in many 205 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 3: ways an enormous amount of power. We talk about it 206 00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 3: as a central bank, but another way to put it, 207 00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 3: it's a price control agency. It sets the price and 208 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:37,960 Speaker 3: supply of money that has so much effect throughout the 209 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:39,160 Speaker 3: entire economy. 210 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 8: And one of the things that is important to me 211 00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:44,439 Speaker 8: is that even. 212 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:49,560 Speaker 3: If an agency is independent, it can't be unaccountable. And 213 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:53,319 Speaker 3: I think there is questions about whether the FED has 214 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:57,520 Speaker 3: always been accountable to the public or if it's often 215 00:10:57,640 --> 00:11:02,000 Speaker 3: serving the interests of a narrow set of financial stakeholders 216 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 3: and really prime Among those examples is the Fed's lack 217 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:14,200 Speaker 3: of preparation when it came to an epidemic of subprime 218 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:17,520 Speaker 3: mortgage lending, for which the Federal Reserve had an enormous 219 00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 3: amount of authority to crack down on, chose not to, 220 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:23,960 Speaker 3: and the results were really catastrophic. 221 00:11:25,080 --> 00:11:28,640 Speaker 5: So what would your vision be for a FED going forward? 222 00:11:28,840 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 5: If it's not a politicized FED, but it's not the 223 00:11:32,160 --> 00:11:35,839 Speaker 5: FED it is? Now Like, what if you were designing. 224 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 4: It and the CFPB is part of the funded? 225 00:11:39,120 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 5: Is it technically part of the bed? Or Okay, yeah, 226 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 5: so you've been in the I don't want. 227 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:44,839 Speaker 4: To say the belly of the beast, but I'll just 228 00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:45,920 Speaker 4: say it, belly of the beast. 229 00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 8: How would I want it? 230 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:50,600 Speaker 3: I actually do think it's really important for us to 231 00:11:50,679 --> 00:11:56,000 Speaker 3: think what is the role of these Federal Reserve banks. 232 00:11:56,200 --> 00:12:00,200 Speaker 3: Remember it's not just a Federal Reserve Board appointed by 233 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:00,840 Speaker 3: the President. 234 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 8: There are also federal reserve banks. We're sitting some of 235 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:06,920 Speaker 8: them all over the est. We're sitting uptown. 236 00:12:06,559 --> 00:12:10,360 Speaker 3: From an extremely powerful one at the Federal Reserve Board 237 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:13,440 Speaker 3: of New York. I think we also have to make 238 00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 3: sure that do we have the right structure in terms 239 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:21,280 Speaker 3: of allocating what powers the FED should use as to 240 00:12:21,360 --> 00:12:25,240 Speaker 3: what powers should be located elsewhere. I think there are 241 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:31,240 Speaker 3: some legitimate criticisms about the Fed's expansive view of its 242 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:37,520 Speaker 3: interpretation of law, including its interventions in money markets and 243 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:42,439 Speaker 3: other actions that have moved the flow of credit away 244 00:12:43,160 --> 00:12:47,040 Speaker 3: from local banks toward the global money markets that has 245 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:48,840 Speaker 3: a real impact on our economy. 246 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 2: I mean, one thing that I find really interesting is 247 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:54,960 Speaker 2: on some level, Stephen Meran, the new governor, is like 248 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 2: a total He's like a trunk guy, right, He's a 249 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 2: white house economic He seems like a loyalist. On the 250 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 2: other hand, he in addition to being those things, he 251 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:09,560 Speaker 2: has advocated for some of the very things that you're 252 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:13,200 Speaker 2: talking about right now. And like reading there was an 253 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 2: Elizabeth Warren op ed that you pointed me to back 254 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:19,280 Speaker 2: in August essentially bring up some of these issues that 255 00:13:19,320 --> 00:13:22,079 Speaker 2: you're talking about right now. And there was an op 256 00:13:22,200 --> 00:13:25,120 Speaker 2: ed by Scott Besson in the Journal just a couple 257 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:27,480 Speaker 2: of weeks later that has kind of a very similar, 258 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 2: very different words Like Bessen is using kind of conservative buzzwords. 259 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:34,280 Speaker 1: He accuses the FED of like gain of function. 260 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:39,360 Speaker 2: Monetary policy, little little COVID hat tip there, but kind 261 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:41,160 Speaker 2: of ultimately pointing in the same direction. 262 00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah. 263 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:46,079 Speaker 3: I think what you're seeing is not a political debate 264 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:49,080 Speaker 3: about it, but what's the right place for this institution. 265 00:13:50,679 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 3: When the financial crisis occurred, there was a lot of 266 00:13:55,360 --> 00:14:01,960 Speaker 3: discussion about whether core consumer regulation should ever be at 267 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:05,960 Speaker 3: the FED. Every FED governor I have spoken to you 268 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:09,800 Speaker 3: likes to say I'm glad the Fed's powers were stripped 269 00:14:09,800 --> 00:14:13,280 Speaker 3: and a CFPB was created because that was last on 270 00:14:13,400 --> 00:14:14,840 Speaker 3: our list of attention. 271 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 5: Well, yeah, you've got inflation, you've got unemployment numbers like those. 272 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:22,320 Speaker 3: Are two big I mean the dual manda totally, it's 273 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:25,360 Speaker 3: a big deal. And I think that there's there we 274 00:14:25,480 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 3: got to ask ourselves what do we want them doing. 275 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:31,480 Speaker 3: I think what we want them doing is stewarding the 276 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 3: money supply in ways that creates stability, that still create 277 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 3: the conditions for growth. And I would also argue trying 278 00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:46,000 Speaker 3: to ensure that the United States has a currency that 279 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:50,000 Speaker 3: a payment system that is working. But there's a lot 280 00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 3: of things that they do, including on the regulatory front, 281 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 3: where there's long been concern that they are captured by 282 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 3: big Wall Street interest rather than representing the borrowers and 283 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:06,960 Speaker 3: the business owners that are really affected by their decisions. 284 00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 2: It feels like what you're saying partly is like, hey, 285 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:11,480 Speaker 2: there's there's a lot at play right now. It's kind 286 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:14,600 Speaker 2: of an opportunity to think about where where should the 287 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:15,000 Speaker 2: FED go? 288 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:16,800 Speaker 8: Like what what what what should the. 289 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 4: FED look like? 290 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:20,680 Speaker 2: And part of me wonders if like we're just sort 291 00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:23,880 Speaker 2: of playing fantasy politics here, because like the CFPB is 292 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 2: gone basic. I mean CFPP is still technically. 293 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:27,960 Speaker 1: Exists there, but it's not doing anything. 294 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 2: And and Trump, you know, maybe like there are there 295 00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 2: are a bunch of these like populist ideas that are 296 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:36,920 Speaker 2: are floating around the Trump administration, but he's actually doing 297 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:40,240 Speaker 2: is like goosing the stock market. And it's like this 298 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:44,120 Speaker 2: conversation we're having feels very far away from what's actually happening. 299 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 2: And I was wondering, like, do you see opportunities for 300 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:48,760 Speaker 2: for change that that could actually happen in this direction 301 00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:51,440 Speaker 2: during you know, the next whatever three years. 302 00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 8: So Max I would I would push. 303 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 3: Back a little on that, which is that, of course 304 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 3: it's idiotic to to defund and defang the CFPB. That's 305 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:06,480 Speaker 3: just stupid, and I agree with that. But the truth 306 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:10,400 Speaker 3: is is that the FED has changed dramatically over the 307 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 3: years without any legal change. It happens because of those 308 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 3: governors and chairs who sit in those seats. 309 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 8: The concept of federal reserve independence actually is relatively new. 310 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:28,240 Speaker 3: It's from the last generation where there was acceptance around 311 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:31,960 Speaker 3: the world that some insulation from politics was beneficial to 312 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:37,280 Speaker 3: achieving stable prices. But you'll start seeing with people who 313 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 3: are now sitting in those seats, many of them who 314 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:45,880 Speaker 3: want to salute the president rather than really focus on 315 00:16:46,120 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 3: their mandate. That's going to change this FED. There are 316 00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 3: going to also be people who really are thinking differently 317 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 3: about what those tools are, and I think we have 318 00:16:58,080 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 3: to pay attention to that. There's a ready rumblings what's 319 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 3: going to be the Fed's role in stable coin and crypto? 320 00:17:07,080 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 3: Would the FED potentially not just target one interest rate 321 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:14,359 Speaker 3: but intervene in the market with their balance sheet in 322 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:17,919 Speaker 3: other ways. I don't think you need a law change 323 00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:21,240 Speaker 3: on some of that's fort to witness that change occurring. 324 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:25,520 Speaker 3: And frankly, a great example is that Donald Trump has 325 00:17:25,560 --> 00:17:28,480 Speaker 3: not changed a lot of laws in this country, but 326 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:32,880 Speaker 3: he has changed a lot of agencies pretty dramatically. And 327 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:36,639 Speaker 3: we need to really think and debate what is it 328 00:17:36,680 --> 00:17:39,240 Speaker 3: that we want our FED to be doing, because again, 329 00:17:39,800 --> 00:17:43,560 Speaker 3: I just don't think independence should ever mean unaccountable. 330 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 4: I mean, obviously things are changing a lot right now. 331 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:49,840 Speaker 5: If you kind of project forward, looking at some of 332 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:53,280 Speaker 5: the changes that are possibly going to happen, and some 333 00:17:53,359 --> 00:17:55,680 Speaker 5: of the changes that have already happened, like what does 334 00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:59,720 Speaker 5: the Federal Reserve look like in five years? 335 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 3: I think there should be quite less power when it 336 00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:10,119 Speaker 3: comes to bailouts and backdoor bailouts. Especially Congress did was 337 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 3: very angry about the FEDS backdoor bailouts and frankly, front 338 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:17,240 Speaker 3: door bailouts during the financial crisis curtailed that. 339 00:18:18,280 --> 00:18:20,640 Speaker 8: I do think it is important. 340 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:26,119 Speaker 3: To really limit the power to backstop and pick and 341 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:30,400 Speaker 3: choose winners and losers in the financial sector. I think 342 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,480 Speaker 3: we have to do things that give them less ability 343 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:38,680 Speaker 3: to subsidize certain types of activities. Borrowing by hedge funds, 344 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:43,520 Speaker 3: borrowing by some other financial institutions and get them focused 345 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:47,840 Speaker 3: on their core mandate, especially when it comes to making 346 00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:50,359 Speaker 3: sure that they are a lender of last resort for 347 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:56,200 Speaker 3: local banks, running a stable monetary policy, and not being 348 00:18:56,320 --> 00:19:00,600 Speaker 3: seen by presidents as a cure all to nacked their 349 00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 3: agendas with no consent from the governed. 350 00:19:04,640 --> 00:19:05,440 Speaker 1: Have you converted? 351 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 8: I mean, I. 352 00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:10,440 Speaker 4: Still am I this is quite a look. 353 00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:11,240 Speaker 1: I'm I'm sorry. 354 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:14,680 Speaker 4: I mean, I don't. I'm not sure. I like, totally, 355 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:16,159 Speaker 4: I'm not sure. 356 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:20,160 Speaker 3: I really think a good central bank is like really 357 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:23,560 Speaker 3: good for democracy and really good for people. But I 358 00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:26,399 Speaker 3: think it has to also change with the time so 359 00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 3: that it is responsive and that it is not seen 360 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:34,560 Speaker 3: as a group of priests and priestesses who make determinations 361 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 3: about our lives without really understanding how the economy is 362 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 3: working on the ground. 363 00:19:39,200 --> 00:19:43,040 Speaker 5: There is something of an ecclesiastical vibe around the FED, 364 00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:44,040 Speaker 5: that is true. 365 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:47,159 Speaker 3: Yeah, I worry about this, Actually, I worry about that 366 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:50,399 Speaker 3: many of them spend their time traveling around the world 367 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:54,560 Speaker 3: to economics conferences. In reality, Stacy, back in the day, 368 00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:58,120 Speaker 3: there was actually a FED governor who was a hog farmer. 369 00:19:58,280 --> 00:20:02,240 Speaker 3: They really represented a broader swaff of America, and I 370 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:04,120 Speaker 3: don't think that's a bad thing. 371 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:04,400 Speaker 1: See. 372 00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:06,640 Speaker 2: I think if they're going to be so above the fray, 373 00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:10,720 Speaker 2: they should wear cool outfits like the Catholic Church. They 374 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:14,160 Speaker 2: should have rogues and ceremonies and just either really lean 375 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 2: into it or bring back the hot. 376 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:19,440 Speaker 5: It would make the press conferences a lot more exciting 377 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:21,240 Speaker 5: to kind of. 378 00:20:20,560 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 1: Like a purple gown that he had to wear like 379 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:23,560 Speaker 1: whenever he. 380 00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:26,160 Speaker 4: In said it just the tie he went full down. 381 00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 3: And by the way, you know, I'm not sure that 382 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:33,719 Speaker 3: we should be happy that usually they take unanimous votes 383 00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:36,680 Speaker 3: and usually that everything is scripted. 384 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,360 Speaker 8: We should probably want a degree of. 385 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 3: Debate when it comes to issues that are so important 386 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:43,560 Speaker 3: to our economy. 387 00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:46,240 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's true. There should be descent, especially to a 388 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 4: moment like now when. 389 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:50,480 Speaker 5: The path forward is really is unclear and it seems 390 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 5: like there are valid reasons to go in a bunch 391 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:53,200 Speaker 5: of directions. 392 00:20:53,680 --> 00:21:03,360 Speaker 1: Ro hitch Opra, thank you for being here. Thanks again, Stacey. 393 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:05,240 Speaker 2: I don't know if you've been following this, but there 394 00:21:05,359 --> 00:21:08,840 Speaker 2: is a huge story in the world of sports happening 395 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:12,720 Speaker 2: right now, a sports business in particular involving one of 396 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:17,159 Speaker 2: the biggest stars in basketball, Kawhi Leonard one of the 397 00:21:17,240 --> 00:21:20,200 Speaker 2: richest people in the world, Steve Bamber, the longtime executive 398 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:22,600 Speaker 2: of Microsoft. I think he's the seventh richest person in 399 00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 2: the world and a massive tech company that the Justice 400 00:21:26,840 --> 00:21:29,439 Speaker 2: Department described as a quote two hundred and forty eight 401 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:32,800 Speaker 2: million dollar scheme to defraud investors and lenders. In brief, 402 00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:36,000 Speaker 2: the NBA is investigating whether Bamber, the owner of the 403 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 2: La Clippers, funnel payments through this weird tech company, which 404 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:43,639 Speaker 2: is called Aspiration to Kawhi Leonard, and in so doing 405 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:47,040 Speaker 2: circumvented the salary cap. I know it sounds like really complicated, 406 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:49,560 Speaker 2: but like I'm telling you, this is everyone is. 407 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 1: Talking about this, and so I thought we would have to. 408 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 2: Talk about it, okay, okay, And to do that we 409 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:58,760 Speaker 2: have Randall Williams here, Bloomberg, BusinessWeek, sports columnists, Everybody's business regular. 410 00:21:58,960 --> 00:21:59,960 Speaker 1: Randall, how are you. 411 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:01,879 Speaker 9: I'm doing all right, doing all right? Thank you for 412 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:02,440 Speaker 9: having me. 413 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 2: So, Randald, what can you just give us the kind 414 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:08,200 Speaker 2: of like quick the one oh one on what this 415 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:09,600 Speaker 2: controversy is about? 416 00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:10,960 Speaker 1: What is accusation here? 417 00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:11,440 Speaker 9: Sure? 418 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:15,080 Speaker 2: And like why why is it like causing people to 419 00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 2: sort of lose their minds? 420 00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:16,880 Speaker 9: It's a big deal. 421 00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 7: Because sports leagues like the NFL and the NBA have 422 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:22,760 Speaker 7: something called a salary cap. A salary cap is set 423 00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:25,919 Speaker 7: up so that players are paid a specific amount and 424 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,720 Speaker 7: teams can only play players a specific amount. And so 425 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:32,719 Speaker 7: what Balmber is accused of doing is going outside of 426 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:36,399 Speaker 7: that through this company called Aspiration, and then paying Kawhi 427 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:39,000 Speaker 7: Leonard even more than what he's already paid. And I'm 428 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:41,600 Speaker 7: sure if we looked up Kawhi Leonard turnings, he's probably 429 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 7: made close to half a billion dollars and he's making 430 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:46,040 Speaker 7: even more because of these accusations. 431 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:48,439 Speaker 2: And this we should say this was originally reported on 432 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:50,520 Speaker 2: a podcast Pablo Torre Finds. 433 00:22:50,240 --> 00:22:51,800 Speaker 9: Out Right, the Great Pablotori. 434 00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:57,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, but the basic allegation is that Balmer, a rich 435 00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,480 Speaker 2: guy who like he has more money than he knows 436 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,320 Speaker 2: what to he could do with, is like using his 437 00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 2: personal wealth to funnel money. 438 00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:07,679 Speaker 1: And essentially cheat. All right, right, like this is this 439 00:23:07,760 --> 00:23:09,360 Speaker 1: is this would be like a cheating thing. 440 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:10,119 Speaker 9: In some ways. 441 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:13,879 Speaker 7: Yes, I mean that salary cap issue is very fundamental 442 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,719 Speaker 7: to all the leagues because if you are able to 443 00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:19,440 Speaker 7: pay someone outside of the salary cap, then then what 444 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,880 Speaker 7: could happen is that an owner could persuade a player, hey, 445 00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:25,080 Speaker 7: don't go play here, because on top of the money 446 00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:26,720 Speaker 7: that I'm already going to be paying you through the 447 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 7: salary cap system, I'll get you a deal on the side. 448 00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:32,560 Speaker 7: And so why this is against the rules is that 449 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:36,320 Speaker 7: what happens is a sponsor can go to an owner 450 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,080 Speaker 7: and say, hey, I want to do a deal with 451 00:23:38,240 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 7: let's just say Smow Joe from California, and the owner 452 00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:45,880 Speaker 7: is then supposed to be like, Okay, that's fine, I'll 453 00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:48,199 Speaker 7: connect you to and the owner's supposed to move out 454 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 7: of the way. In this case, that's not what's happening. 455 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:54,879 Speaker 7: There's three parties involved. Allegedly it's Bamber, it's Aspiration, and 456 00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:57,240 Speaker 7: Kawhi Leonard, all working together to make sure that Kawhi 457 00:23:57,359 --> 00:23:59,840 Speaker 7: Leonard gets paid. And that's against the rule. If Bomber 458 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,960 Speaker 7: had said, hey, here is Aspiration, you two make a deal, 459 00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:05,000 Speaker 7: I think this will be perfectly fine. But that's not 460 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:05,760 Speaker 7: what's being alleged. 461 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:09,640 Speaker 5: So essentially, this player was hired by this company Aspiration, 462 00:24:10,119 --> 00:24:12,879 Speaker 5: Like what what is this company supposed to do? 463 00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 1: Saying like, what was he paid twenty eight million dollars to? Yeah, yeah, 464 00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:16,879 Speaker 1: what exactly was he? 465 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:18,840 Speaker 4: What does the company do and what's he supposed to 466 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:19,400 Speaker 4: be endorsing. 467 00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:22,160 Speaker 7: So I'll read straight from ESPN because I think they 468 00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:25,399 Speaker 7: summarize it the best. Okay, this is think of Aspiration 469 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:29,320 Speaker 7: as a digital bank, but environmentally conscious. The company's product 470 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:32,680 Speaker 7: includes savings accounts and debit cards with cash back from 471 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:36,240 Speaker 7: a select number of businesses who were quote doing the 472 00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:39,119 Speaker 7: right thing, plus an option to plant a tree with 473 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:42,920 Speaker 7: every purchase roundup. The company also offered access to investment 474 00:24:42,920 --> 00:24:46,680 Speaker 7: funds that are one hundred percent fossil fuel free, so they. 475 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,359 Speaker 2: Were essentially as iron or stand it, getting paid to 476 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,639 Speaker 2: plant trees for businesses that wanted to like see like 477 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:56,560 Speaker 2: an online bank do good or something sounds good? Right? 478 00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:59,120 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and this is where I should say Balmer 479 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,639 Speaker 2: has denied wrong doing. Of course, Kawhi has said nothing, 480 00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:05,080 Speaker 2: but I don't think anyone that's kind of his thing, 481 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 2: right saying nothing. But I don't even know if anyone's 482 00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,520 Speaker 2: accused him of wrongdoing in this case because he just 483 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:15,800 Speaker 2: signed a sweetheart deal. Also, Andre Cherney, who is the 484 00:25:15,880 --> 00:25:20,399 Speaker 2: other co founder of Aspiration, has essentially disputed the story 485 00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:24,119 Speaker 2: as well, saying this contract, which has been characterized as 486 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:25,879 Speaker 2: a no show job was not, in fact, a no 487 00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 2: show job, just getting all that stuff out of the way. 488 00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:29,160 Speaker 1: Go ahead, Stacy. 489 00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:33,320 Speaker 5: So I guess my question is why is this such 490 00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:33,880 Speaker 5: a big deal. 491 00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:36,040 Speaker 4: First of all, why are their salary caps in place? 492 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:39,440 Speaker 5: And why is it a like, why is it a 493 00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:41,520 Speaker 5: big deal that they're going over the salary Sure. 494 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:42,880 Speaker 9: Salary caps are fairness. 495 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:45,040 Speaker 7: I mean, if you look at baseball in particular, there 496 00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:48,000 Speaker 7: are baseball teams that just can afford to Baseball does 497 00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 7: not have a salary cap, to MLB does not, and 498 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:54,240 Speaker 7: so moneyball right, Yes, I mean that's a good example. 499 00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:55,959 Speaker 7: But if you look at the Yankees, if you look 500 00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:57,920 Speaker 7: at the Dodgers, there are two of the highest spending 501 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 7: teams in the MLB. Now do they always win, No, 502 00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:03,879 Speaker 7: but they give they win a lot, and it is 503 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,520 Speaker 7: in some ways some people say it is an advantage 504 00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:08,560 Speaker 7: in the NFL and the NBA not so much. There 505 00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 7: is a salary cap, so everybody has the exact same 506 00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:15,800 Speaker 7: money to spend. Now you'll have owners who some fans 507 00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 7: would argue are not in the business of winning because 508 00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:21,160 Speaker 7: the leagues are naturally profitable. But at the same time, 509 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:24,080 Speaker 7: as it pertains to the salary cap, yes, the players 510 00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:24,880 Speaker 7: are being paid. 511 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:25,080 Speaker 9: A lot more. 512 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:27,040 Speaker 7: But for the owners who really want to win, who 513 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:29,520 Speaker 7: this is their pride and joy. If you find out 514 00:26:29,560 --> 00:26:31,840 Speaker 7: that someone is manipulating the system and you were in 515 00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:35,160 Speaker 7: the running to sign Kawhi Leonard, and Kawhi Leonard went 516 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:37,080 Speaker 7: to the Clippers because of the fact that he was 517 00:26:37,119 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 7: offered an extra twenty eight million dollars to not show up, 518 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:42,240 Speaker 7: that's a problem. 519 00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 4: And it's like a dummy job exactly. 520 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:46,560 Speaker 7: And another thing about this is it is a no 521 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:49,800 Speaker 7: show job I have never seen. And as Pabulatory reported, 522 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,560 Speaker 7: there are no tweets about from Kawhi Leonard about aspiration. 523 00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:56,680 Speaker 4: There was job supposed to be he was in. 524 00:26:56,640 --> 00:26:58,400 Speaker 9: This company, right, it was an endorsement. 525 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,520 Speaker 2: Basically, there are all these things that Kawhi could or 526 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,440 Speaker 2: could not do, depending on how he felt about it. 527 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:08,160 Speaker 2: So it's like some autographs he could tweet, but there 528 00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:10,600 Speaker 2: are no there were no mechanisms in the contract essentially 529 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 2: forcing him to do it, whereas in I think in 530 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:15,480 Speaker 2: most endorsement contracts. 531 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:16,600 Speaker 1: You're required you've got to do something. 532 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 7: So an example of this, like a big endorsement deal, 533 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:21,840 Speaker 7: would be Nike with Lebron James. He's everywhere that they 534 00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:24,399 Speaker 7: ask him to be a smaller one is like nil 535 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 7: deals in college name image and likeness deals in college 536 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:28,960 Speaker 7: was often are just like post on Instagram a couple 537 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,360 Speaker 7: of times and then we'll pay you out and that's that. 538 00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:33,720 Speaker 9: But Kawhi is not on social media. 539 00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:36,439 Speaker 7: I mean even in his new balanced advertisements, he's he 540 00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 7: doesn't say a lot, and even in press conference like 541 00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:41,199 Speaker 7: no one has heard from him because outside of his 542 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:45,800 Speaker 7: media obligations, he does not speak. To be clear, athletes 543 00:27:45,840 --> 00:27:49,000 Speaker 7: are allowed to do endorsement deals. It's just that your 544 00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:51,960 Speaker 7: owner cannot be paying them outright. 545 00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:53,600 Speaker 1: To you without counting it against the right. 546 00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:55,800 Speaker 7: Without counting it against against the cap. And there are 547 00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:59,439 Speaker 7: there have been plenty of deals with teams, players and 548 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:02,480 Speaker 7: owners where again an owner will introduce someone to a 549 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:04,359 Speaker 7: sponsor and they go and do a deal, and then 550 00:28:04,760 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 7: there's a billboard outside of a stadium with said sponsor 551 00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,719 Speaker 7: and an athlete. There's no NBA rules to prohibit that. 552 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:14,080 Speaker 7: It's just in what Pabablatory reports is like, Balmer has 553 00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:16,240 Speaker 7: invested in this company, some of his co owners have 554 00:28:16,280 --> 00:28:19,000 Speaker 7: also invested in this company, and so the NBA has 555 00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 7: to do some due diligence and they're taking us very seriously. 556 00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:23,879 Speaker 5: I mean, do are CAP's a good idea or is 557 00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:26,199 Speaker 5: it a better idea to just not have them, to 558 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 5: not try to end up with like a baseball model. 559 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:33,800 Speaker 7: I think cap systems are great because they stabilize things, 560 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:37,280 Speaker 7: like everyone can a team can spend a certain amount 561 00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:39,840 Speaker 7: of money, and that's what it should be in my opinion. 562 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 9: I think that when you have different. 563 00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:45,200 Speaker 7: Markets like New York, like Los Angeles, like let's say Houston, 564 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:47,880 Speaker 7: some of the bigger markets who have big billionaires who 565 00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 7: are ready to spend on this because this is their business, 566 00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:53,720 Speaker 7: then that can create some sort of inequality. Now, at 567 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:56,239 Speaker 7: the same time, the players still have to get out 568 00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:58,760 Speaker 7: on the field and perform all the same, but I 569 00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:02,640 Speaker 7: think that it it creates more more stability when you 570 00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:05,719 Speaker 7: have a cap system where this player is making this 571 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:07,040 Speaker 7: and this player is making that. 572 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 1: It's funny. 573 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,920 Speaker 2: Stacy's reaction to this, I think we were talking earlier, 574 00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:14,200 Speaker 2: is like these are such big numbers, you know, and like, wow, 575 00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:17,040 Speaker 2: like seven million dollars for a no show job or 576 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:19,000 Speaker 2: an alleged no so job, Like that seems crazy. 577 00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:20,120 Speaker 1: The whole thing seems crazy. 578 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:24,320 Speaker 2: My reaction was actually like it like I guess Kawhi 579 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:28,160 Speaker 2: Leonard is underpaid and like and and like didn't this 580 00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 2: to me feels like a evidence that the players negotiated 581 00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:34,480 Speaker 2: a bad deal with the owners, Like that the salary 582 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 2: cap should be a lot higher if there's just like 583 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:40,560 Speaker 2: twenty eight million dollars slashing around and you're probably lots 584 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 2: more like like the players should just get just get 585 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,160 Speaker 2: paid more money, because clearly they're worth more money. 586 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:47,920 Speaker 9: I hear you. 587 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:52,160 Speaker 7: But I think in what various outlets ESPN the Athletic 588 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:54,440 Speaker 7: have reported over the years is that Kawhi Leonard was 589 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,160 Speaker 7: searching for money outside of the cap system even before this, 590 00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 7: when his free agency happened after he won the title 591 00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:03,160 Speaker 7: in Toronto, there was there was reports that he was 592 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:06,720 Speaker 7: asking for private jet, a private jet access, and he 593 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 7: was asking for deals outside of the salary. 594 00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:11,080 Speaker 1: I'm saying he's worth it. I don't know. 595 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:13,400 Speaker 7: I would argue that he isn't because of the fact 596 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:15,640 Speaker 7: that he's been injured a lot. He doesn't play a lot, 597 00:30:15,680 --> 00:30:18,720 Speaker 7: he's not the brand ambassador. And when you have someone 598 00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:22,239 Speaker 7: that you're spending I mean, look, that's putting a lot 599 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:24,560 Speaker 7: and being kind here, I'm being kind, But when you 600 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:27,280 Speaker 7: have someone that you're paying, let's say, three hundred million 601 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:29,760 Speaker 7: dollars to. You do want them on the billboards. You 602 00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:32,760 Speaker 7: do want them to have some sort of a personality 603 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,320 Speaker 7: that isn't just a claw or or they're not just 604 00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:38,800 Speaker 7: going to be like showing up to the press conference 605 00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:40,600 Speaker 7: and say five words and then go home and you 606 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 7: don't hear from them. You want them to promote this brand. 607 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:46,840 Speaker 5: So, Wendle, if we back up from this particular amazing 608 00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:49,120 Speaker 5: case a little bit, does this say anything? Do you 609 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,800 Speaker 5: think about the state of sports right now and pay 610 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:55,719 Speaker 5: and pay caps And I don't know what is your 611 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:56,440 Speaker 5: takeaway from this. 612 00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:00,600 Speaker 7: I don't think there's anything that huge that takeaway. The 613 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:02,320 Speaker 7: only thing is that there's always going to be money 614 00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 7: under the table always, whether it be at the high 615 00:31:05,000 --> 00:31:07,480 Speaker 7: school level, the college level, and at the pro sports level, 616 00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:10,080 Speaker 7: that there are people who are willing finds a way 617 00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:13,360 Speaker 7: exactly exactly. There's always going to be people who are 618 00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,040 Speaker 7: willing to pay you more should you not show up 619 00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:20,000 Speaker 7: for a job and you know, play thirty percent of 620 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 7: the games that you're required to. 621 00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 9: That's my biggest takeaway. 622 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 7: If there was a player that was worth there are 623 00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:27,720 Speaker 7: players who might be worth a no show job. I 624 00:31:27,800 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 7: just don't think Kawhi Leonard is the guy. 625 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:33,000 Speaker 4: So that's why I made I want to not do anything. 626 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:36,520 Speaker 5: You think the person should be more qualified, exactly exactly. 627 00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:39,880 Speaker 7: I don't look Kawhi Leonard's tenure at the Clippers hasn't 628 00:31:39,920 --> 00:31:42,239 Speaker 7: been great, but all seriousness, I think there's always going 629 00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:45,160 Speaker 7: to be money under the table, and this, allegedly is 630 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:46,440 Speaker 7: is another example of that. 631 00:31:52,280 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 5: We are too the part of the show where we 632 00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:58,680 Speaker 5: talk about underrated stories. Randall, thank you for sticking around 633 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 5: because you don't know what the I also do not 634 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 5: know what it is. Apparently Max brought us something. I 635 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,160 Speaker 5: am also a little nervous. I don't know what is happening. 636 00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:10,440 Speaker 2: This is a story that gets at the future of technology, 637 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 2: the future of branding, and also the future of cocaine. 638 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 1: Shoes of cocaine. 639 00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:21,040 Speaker 2: All right, So there were some news reports earlier this 640 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:25,840 Speaker 2: week about a plane crash in eastern Brazil. These are 641 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:28,440 Speaker 2: news reports that are coming to us by way of 642 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 2: the UK's Independent, by way of El Globo, the Brazilian newspaper, 643 00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:37,400 Speaker 2: and essentially, a plane, a small aircraft crashed in Brazil, 644 00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:43,680 Speaker 2: killing the pilot and authorities recovered two hundred kilos of cocaine, 645 00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:49,240 Speaker 2: and the cocaine had branding for SpaceX, Elon Musk's rocket company. 646 00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:50,240 Speaker 4: Wow. 647 00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,240 Speaker 2: Now, okay, I want to say, first of all, it's 648 00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:55,440 Speaker 2: not what you think. This does not prove that Elon 649 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 2: Musk has, you know, put aside rockets and cars and 650 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 2: brand implants and all. 651 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,160 Speaker 4: Relation is not to answer. 652 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:06,720 Speaker 2: The under the drug business, although as we know he's 653 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 2: not like totally averse to recreational drugs. 654 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:10,240 Speaker 1: I don't think. 655 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:12,600 Speaker 4: Yes. 656 00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 2: But what I will say is what's interesting here is 657 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,320 Speaker 2: and this came out of a report I read advice. 658 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:23,320 Speaker 2: You know, ilicit drug sellers have basically branded drugs with 659 00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:25,240 Speaker 2: tech companies for a really long time, Like. 660 00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:29,160 Speaker 4: Is that true, like used to cocaine there, or like Skype? 661 00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:32,320 Speaker 1: The article ia that Skype had been used like like 662 00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:35,120 Speaker 1: maybe ten years ago. I guess, back when Skype was cooler. 663 00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 2: I think it's actually kind of a way to see 664 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:39,720 Speaker 2: how cool your tech company is. 665 00:33:39,760 --> 00:33:42,480 Speaker 9: It's like if you have a under the table cocaine deal. 666 00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 2: If like drug dealers are like this thing is so cool, 667 00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:46,640 Speaker 2: I'm gonna stick it on. 668 00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:50,080 Speaker 4: That it makes cocaine even cooler than it already is. 669 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:51,120 Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. 670 00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:54,000 Speaker 4: Yeah, I thought cocaine kind of sold itself. 671 00:33:54,080 --> 00:33:54,880 Speaker 1: It's an achievement. 672 00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:58,719 Speaker 5: Are you going to branding like, oh, I don't I 673 00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:01,920 Speaker 5: only I only snore SPAACEX cocaine. 674 00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:02,880 Speaker 4: I would never do. 675 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,640 Speaker 7: I don't even feel comfortable if, first of all, never 676 00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:09,479 Speaker 7: done cocaine ever. Mean what if I were, I would 677 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,040 Speaker 7: not be doing Elon Musk branded cocaine. 678 00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:14,440 Speaker 2: Now, Randall, is that because you have questions about Elon 679 00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:17,560 Speaker 2: Musk's capacity to like achieve things? Or is it because 680 00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:19,840 Speaker 2: you have questions about the kind of person who would 681 00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:21,360 Speaker 2: stamp a SpaceX? 682 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:21,720 Speaker 1: Oh? 683 00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:23,040 Speaker 9: God both. 684 00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:25,960 Speaker 7: I think that any person who has the time to 685 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:28,520 Speaker 7: brand something like this, I look, that's. 686 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:31,840 Speaker 1: Just not me looks as Elon ink listeners. 687 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,560 Speaker 2: If you've come over to the Everybody's business feed by now, 688 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,800 Speaker 2: well know I am deep in the lore. And I 689 00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:40,239 Speaker 2: will say, looking at the pictures of the cocaine that 690 00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:42,799 Speaker 2: was stamped with the SpaceX branding, they didn't do. 691 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:43,600 Speaker 1: Like a very good job. 692 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:45,600 Speaker 2: The colors aren't quite right, like it's kind of like 693 00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:46,520 Speaker 2: a light blue. 694 00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:48,359 Speaker 1: It just it just looks a little grainy. Look. 695 00:34:48,400 --> 00:34:51,279 Speaker 2: It really looks like someone took an inkjet printer that 696 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:52,799 Speaker 2: was like a little low on this is like. 697 00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:53,760 Speaker 4: A discerning client. 698 00:34:53,920 --> 00:34:57,279 Speaker 2: Is it cyan or whatever the blue color was, and 699 00:34:57,320 --> 00:34:59,399 Speaker 2: like the toner just it doesn't quite look right. 700 00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:04,960 Speaker 7: I just don't I think anyone who would be buying 701 00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:06,520 Speaker 7: SpaceX cocaine. 702 00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:10,680 Speaker 9: Should just go to rehab. That's just what I think. 703 00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:14,880 Speaker 7: I don't think that branding something like this. It's not 704 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:17,239 Speaker 7: appealing to me. If I was doing to be doing 705 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:18,279 Speaker 7: it elon musk. 706 00:35:18,880 --> 00:35:21,000 Speaker 2: No, it's also funny to me because like I don't 707 00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:22,719 Speaker 2: even know the reason you do this, Like is it 708 00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:26,120 Speaker 2: because if the authorities like poking the plane, You're like, no, no, no, 709 00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,320 Speaker 2: we got SpaceX stuff. 710 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:30,600 Speaker 1: In the plane. Like it's just like bricks of cocaine. 711 00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:32,680 Speaker 4: Got to be people trying to get a marketing edge. 712 00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:33,880 Speaker 4: That's got to be what it is. 713 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:36,600 Speaker 5: People feel like they're their cocaine will stand out in 714 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:37,840 Speaker 5: the marketplace of cocaine. 715 00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:41,040 Speaker 7: I get with SpaceX branding, but I just can't see 716 00:35:41,040 --> 00:35:45,360 Speaker 7: someone being like, nah, man, I don't want the raw stuff. 717 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:47,560 Speaker 9: I need the SpaceX. 718 00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:49,879 Speaker 7: Merrik exactly like this, this is this isn't what I'm 719 00:35:49,880 --> 00:35:50,279 Speaker 7: looking for. 720 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:53,320 Speaker 9: This is great value versus. 721 00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:55,040 Speaker 4: A brand markup right, I don't. 722 00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:57,800 Speaker 1: I just think this is significant because we've been talking. 723 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:00,759 Speaker 2: I've been talking and writing stories about the way that 724 00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,520 Speaker 2: Elon Musk has harmed his brand, his personal brand, as 725 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:05,880 Speaker 2: well as the brands of his companies. You know, Tesla 726 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:09,960 Speaker 2: sales are in the toilet, but in the marketplace, obviously, 727 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:12,680 Speaker 2: some people still think that that brand is very strong. 728 00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 9: He's winning somewhere. 729 00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:22,000 Speaker 5: This show is produced by Stacy Wong. Magnus Hendrickson is 730 00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:25,520 Speaker 5: our supervising producer, and Amy Kean is our executive Producerlake 731 00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:29,160 Speaker 5: Maples is our engineer, and Dave Purcell factchecks. Sage Bauman 732 00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:33,080 Speaker 5: heads Bloomberg Podcasts Special thanks to Jeff Muscus, Julia Rubin 733 00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:33,839 Speaker 5: and Maria Ling. 734 00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:36,040 Speaker 4: If you have a minute, please rate and review the show. 735 00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:37,399 Speaker 4: It means a lot to us. 736 00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:39,800 Speaker 5: And if you have a story that should be our business, 737 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:43,440 Speaker 5: email us at Everybody's at Bloomberg dot net. That is 738 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:46,759 Speaker 5: Everybody's with an s at Bloomberg dot net. Thank you 739 00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:49,239 Speaker 5: for listening and see you next week.