1 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:14,760 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Whenever I get my twins 2 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:19,560 Speaker 1: ready for one of their games, be it soccer or basketball, 3 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:25,520 Speaker 1: or my daughter plays volleyball, and I'm getting their uniform 4 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:29,920 Speaker 1: ready for them, very often I think of another little 5 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:34,800 Speaker 1: boy in his uniform, because that's how I will forever 6 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: envision Chucky Mack. He had a little little league outfit. 7 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:44,080 Speaker 1: It was red and white with the white pants and 8 00:00:44,159 --> 00:00:46,680 Speaker 1: the red shirt and the red white cap. And he's 9 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 1: holding a glove today and a highly unusual program. We 10 00:00:54,760 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 1: have gathered friends of his before he was murdered. The 11 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 1: Cold Case of Chucky Mack. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. 12 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:25,279 Speaker 1: Chucky Mack a little boy, a little leaguer, gunned down 13 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 1: riding his bike. What happened? We want justice with me, 14 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:39,240 Speaker 1: a panel unlike any other I have ever seen, with 15 00:01:39,280 --> 00:01:43,320 Speaker 1: me to put this cold case back together again. Chucky's 16 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 1: mother now my friend, Kathy Miller. Cheryl McCollum, director of 17 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:54,560 Speaker 1: the Cold Case Research Institute, Chris Pate Robillard, a neighborhood 18 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 1: girl that saw Chucky the day he was gunned down 19 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:05,400 Speaker 1: riding his bike. Still unsolved. Jason Cranford, Chucky's friend who 20 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:10,280 Speaker 1: has put up a hundred thousand dollars reward. Shanda Birch, 21 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 1: Chucky's girlfriend. He asked his mom could he give Shonda 22 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 1: her emerald ring to save it for him for their engagement. 23 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:25,440 Speaker 1: Chris Panacheck joining me. Chris at a red light in 24 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:29,360 Speaker 1: a car with his sister when he saw Chucky just 25 00:02:29,600 --> 00:02:35,679 Speaker 1: before Chucky was murdered with me, Doctor Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst 26 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 1: to the Stars and Crime Online dot Com investigative reporter 27 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:43,000 Speaker 1: Levi Paige. First, I want you to take a listen 28 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:48,799 Speaker 1: to our friends at forty one NBCWMGT is Skyler Henry So. 29 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: He lived right behind the Bowling Alley on Burns Drive. 30 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 1: He'd ride his bike to a nearby convenience store all 31 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:58,520 Speaker 1: the time to buy candy. But one February night was different. 32 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: Sometime when in those suing minutes someone heard a loud pop. 33 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:05,760 Speaker 1: One witness that I've talked to actually described or just 34 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:09,160 Speaker 1: thinking it was a firecracker and kids playing. This is 35 00:03:09,200 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 1: where Chucky's body was found. He lived in the neighborhood 36 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:15,120 Speaker 1: just beyond this fence post. Witnesses say they saw him 37 00:03:15,160 --> 00:03:18,200 Speaker 1: talking as someone in a light colored car, but they 38 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:20,960 Speaker 1: don't know who We had a lot of witnesses. A 39 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 1: lot of people saw things. They see a vehicle speeding 40 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 1: away as they approached. Within the next two minutes, Chucky's 41 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 1: found deceased. What happened? You were hearing our friend at 42 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: w MGT NBC Skyler Henry speaking to the House and 43 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:41,720 Speaker 1: County Sheriff Captain John Holland. Let me go straight out 44 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 1: to Chucky's mother, Kathy Miller joining me. Now, Kathy, I'm 45 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 1: going to hold on this to this case as long 46 00:03:53,120 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: as we have to, and I want you to tell 47 00:03:55,800 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 1: our listeners, our viewers, now, what happened the evening you 48 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:06,480 Speaker 1: last saw Chucky. The last evening I saw Chuckie, it 49 00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 1: was a Monday evening. We had just finished supper, and 50 00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 1: you know, I'm cleaning, cleaning up the table and everything, 51 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:19,080 Speaker 1: and Chucky asked me if he could go to Giant 52 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:23,159 Speaker 1: to buy candy for the next day at school, which 53 00:04:23,279 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 1: I heard later that he would sell to make money 54 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,799 Speaker 1: to buy more candy to sell at recess or whatever 55 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 1: it was. And I'm thinking, you know, no, you really 56 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 1: shouldn't go, but I said yes, I said yes, you 57 00:04:39,520 --> 00:04:42,880 Speaker 1: can go. Not looking at it is just cleaning up, 58 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:47,839 Speaker 1: and I didn't look at him, and he walked out 59 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:53,560 Speaker 1: the door. And that was it. What happened next. The 60 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:57,640 Speaker 1: next thing I know is about thirty minutes later, a 61 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:00,279 Speaker 1: friend in the neighborhood came and knocked on my door 62 00:05:00,920 --> 00:05:05,160 Speaker 1: and said, Jackie's hurt. I can see him laying up 63 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:09,760 Speaker 1: here by Giant, you know, And I thought, oh my god, 64 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 1: he's fallen off his bike. He's hurt his leg or something. 65 00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:18,760 Speaker 1: So Pete, Chucky stepfather, and Greg, his little brother, and myself, 66 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:20,920 Speaker 1: you know, we just ran up there to get him. 67 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:23,920 Speaker 1: I thought I'd just see him sitting there, and as 68 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:29,159 Speaker 1: I'm running, I can see that it is so much worse, 69 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:33,279 Speaker 1: and it's like I can't get there. I'm I'm running 70 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:38,599 Speaker 1: in slow motion, and um Pete stopped me and told 71 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: me that it was Chucky and that he was dead 72 00:05:43,400 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 1: and that somebody had hit him with the cars. What 73 00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:53,919 Speaker 1: they thought at first, and then it's a lot of 74 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 1: things aren't clear after that, but that was it. So 75 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 1: I never I never really got but he was not 76 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 1: he was not hit by a car. No, this little boy, 77 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:14,520 Speaker 1: this little leaguer, was shot dead, this little boy riding 78 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:19,360 Speaker 1: his bike. It was no more than three blocks as 79 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:23,400 Speaker 1: the crow flies from home to the little convenience store, 80 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:25,719 Speaker 1: because I could that was him where he was laying, 81 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:30,800 Speaker 1: and um, I mean it wasn't. It was a shot 82 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:34,039 Speaker 1: at close up. It was a close up shot, not 83 00:06:34,279 --> 00:06:40,600 Speaker 1: from far away, and um yeah. And when they rolled 84 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:44,279 Speaker 1: him over, they saw where the bullet had exited his face, 85 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:51,480 Speaker 1: and that was they didn't want me to see him, 86 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:53,960 Speaker 1: so they were trying to keep me out of by 87 00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:59,040 Speaker 1: this fence that was right there. And I never saw 88 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 1: him again, Kathy, these years later, how has your grief 89 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:14,160 Speaker 1: changed over time? Or has it? It's just so hard 90 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 1: to explain. It's just always it's always there. It's like 91 00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 1: about you know, it's on the back Bernard's simmering. It's 92 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 1: always cooking. I'm always thinking. And you know I promised Chucky. 93 00:07:28,080 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: I promised him I will find what happened to you. 94 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 1: I'll never ever let this go. And I just it's 95 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 1: still you know, you have good days and bad days, 96 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: and like this is really a good day because I'm 97 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: here from all his friends that have not forgotten him, 98 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:56,280 Speaker 1: and it means so much to me. Speaking of his friends, 99 00:07:56,320 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 1: I want to go straight to you, Chris Panachek. Chris 100 00:07:59,760 --> 00:08:01,640 Speaker 1: was had a red light in the car with his 101 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:06,680 Speaker 1: sister when he saw Chucky speaking to someone in a 102 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:10,520 Speaker 1: white car. Chuckie was talking to the galley never handle 103 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:14,240 Speaker 1: bars on his mike with me and came past him 104 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:18,360 Speaker 1: and stop. In real life, guys, this the last time 105 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:21,360 Speaker 1: that we spoke to you about Chucky Mark's case. And 106 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:26,720 Speaker 1: then I appeared on Fox one afternoon and put out 107 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:32,960 Speaker 1: information friends, fellow classmates, his girlfriend at the time, his 108 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 1: little girlfriend saw that, and we have all gotten together 109 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:41,440 Speaker 1: to help try and solve the case of Chucky Mark, 110 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:46,200 Speaker 1: this little boy's murder. To Chris Panacheck, thank you so 111 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:48,960 Speaker 1: much for being with us. I want to hear from 112 00:08:49,000 --> 00:08:55,120 Speaker 1: you and I witness. Did you ever speak to police? Yes, ma'am. 113 00:08:53,960 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 1: I come up here after I got home and learned 114 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 1: and learned that Chuckie was behind the roy and Roses 115 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 1: here on on Burns Drive by the friend of mine 116 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 1: and his dad worked at the convenience store across the street, Bobby's. 117 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:12,840 Speaker 1: A minute Mark and me and my sister had just 118 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:15,880 Speaker 1: got home. Land closed out for school the next day 119 00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:20,600 Speaker 1: and a friend tried. A friend of mine called me 120 00:09:20,640 --> 00:09:22,720 Speaker 1: and said, hey, you know, buddy, we ride bikes with 121 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:24,560 Speaker 1: all the time with good jumped ramps and stuff with 122 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:27,320 Speaker 1: He said he just got shot. Like what I just 123 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: I just seen, I mean I just seen him talking 124 00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:32,440 Speaker 1: to the car behind the roar and roses. Tell me 125 00:09:32,600 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 1: exactly what happened. Let's just start. You and your sister 126 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:37,360 Speaker 1: are in the car. Tell me what happened. Don't leave 127 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: anything out, all right? We come up Burns Drive and 128 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:44,760 Speaker 1: we passed. We get past the right here and cheke. 129 00:09:44,800 --> 00:09:48,199 Speaker 1: He's talking to a white tie in a white view 130 00:09:48,240 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: a Caree rules type. Whoa, whoa right there. I'm getting 131 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:56,280 Speaker 1: information I've never heard before. So the purp is a 132 00:09:56,400 --> 00:10:00,959 Speaker 1: white male in what kind of car? It's Buick Goes 133 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:05,719 Speaker 1: seventy nine eighty one Buick Regal type of tyme of 134 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:13,440 Speaker 1: vehicle Utah white, oh, solid white car could have been 135 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:19,360 Speaker 1: a Regal or a Pontiac Granddam Grand Prix Grand right 136 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:23,640 Speaker 1: right grand Prix, a little will cut of Supreme, that 137 00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 1: type of body style two or four door, two door. 138 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:32,000 Speaker 1: Do you think there was another man in the car, 139 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:34,680 Speaker 1: No man, There was this one guy in that car. 140 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:37,960 Speaker 1: One guy, one guy and a fo. I ever knew that. 141 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:41,679 Speaker 1: Nancy me either and I have talked about this case. 142 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:43,960 Speaker 1: I've talked to cops about the case. I've talked to 143 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 1: investigators about the case. This is the first time it's 144 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 1: being defined as definitely a white male. I mean we, 145 00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 1: Seryl McCallum, you and I have gone round and round 146 00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:55,960 Speaker 1: and said we think it was a white male, either 147 00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 1: one or two, but it could have been a Hispanic 148 00:10:58,440 --> 00:11:01,720 Speaker 1: mail it could have been an Asian man. But we 149 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: are now hearing definitively, Cheryl McCollum, it is a white male. 150 00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:09,199 Speaker 1: We think alone seventy nine to eighty one all white 151 00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:12,760 Speaker 1: vehicle in the two doors. Nancy, this is a game changer, period. 152 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:17,560 Speaker 1: It is overwhelming to me that Lord Borson has not 153 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:34,680 Speaker 1: put this out correctly. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, we 154 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:37,199 Speaker 1: are talking about the murder of a little boy who 155 00:11:37,200 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 1: has grown dear to my heart tip line four seven 156 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 1: eight five four two two zero eight zero, and we 157 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:49,240 Speaker 1: are learning information we've never known before. With me many 158 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:53,160 Speaker 1: of Chucky's friends that he knew at the time, one 159 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 1: of them an eyewitness. Also with me, Chucky's mom and 160 00:11:56,880 --> 00:12:00,600 Speaker 1: his little girlfriend at the time, Chandra Birch to Chris 161 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:02,800 Speaker 1: panta Check, let me get back to where we were. 162 00:12:03,040 --> 00:12:05,120 Speaker 1: You're in a car with sister. You look over, you 163 00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:08,880 Speaker 1: see Chucky speaking to the guys. What was their interaction. 164 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:11,920 Speaker 1: Ucky was just had his arms folded in there talking 165 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:14,040 Speaker 1: to the guy who would laugh. He was like laughing 166 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 1: and talking to this gay and the next thing, you know, 167 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:19,319 Speaker 1: the lights the lights from his from the from this 168 00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:23,920 Speaker 1: man's car. You know, kind of I guess my vision 169 00:12:23,960 --> 00:12:26,000 Speaker 1: and nything, but but I kept on looking back, and 170 00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:29,319 Speaker 1: my FIXTU was driving, was stopping. They were able to 171 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:31,320 Speaker 1: stop signing. I don't think this convenient store was there 172 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:34,920 Speaker 1: at the end, but were sitting there. And if we 173 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:38,120 Speaker 1: hadn't had the radio up so loud when I sat 174 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:41,680 Speaker 1: back down, Chucky was talking, you know, would had picked 175 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:44,080 Speaker 1: his front tire up on his bike and turned turned 176 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:46,840 Speaker 1: to turn away from this day. And if I hadn't, 177 00:12:46,880 --> 00:12:49,440 Speaker 1: we hadn't had the radio up so loud, we would 178 00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 1: have heard the shot because when he picked his front 179 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:54,600 Speaker 1: tire up, I turned around and sat down and stopped 180 00:12:54,600 --> 00:12:56,760 Speaker 1: looking back, and then Nason it was shot in the 181 00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:01,040 Speaker 1: back of the head. That's very very interesting to me 182 00:13:01,960 --> 00:13:05,480 Speaker 1: that you watched for that length of time that he 183 00:13:05,559 --> 00:13:09,120 Speaker 1: actually turned around and you look back. Something told you 184 00:13:09,160 --> 00:13:13,640 Speaker 1: to turn around and look back you saw Chucky. He was, 185 00:13:13,720 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 1: I guess, still on his bike with his feet on 186 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 1: the ground, but his arms were folded. Did I hear 187 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 1: that correctly, Yes, ma'am. He was talking to the guy 188 00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:25,679 Speaker 1: with his arms folded like he did so he was 189 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:28,640 Speaker 1: hunched over, arms folded. I wrote, bikes with Chucky forever. 190 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 1: His arms were actually touching the handlebar, yes, ma'am. And 191 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:37,880 Speaker 1: did you say he was laughing? Yeah, it was like 192 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:40,760 Speaker 1: they were had that conversation with each other. They were 193 00:13:40,800 --> 00:13:43,840 Speaker 1: conversating with each other and checking, checking, made a lot 194 00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 1: of hand gesters when he talked, what's he doing that? Yes, 195 00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:52,160 Speaker 1: the whole time. The whole time went went to walk 196 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:54,600 Speaker 1: right out the window into the car and you know, 197 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 1: kee level we're going so like well, I blame myself 198 00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:00,760 Speaker 1: because I could get run on the ring and say 199 00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:06,199 Speaker 1: hey Chucky, and just maybe something would have been different. Chris, 200 00:14:06,840 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 1: the guy in the car, how close was he too? 201 00:14:10,880 --> 00:14:14,960 Speaker 1: Chucky probably two foot foot the most of them two 202 00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 1: foot frolly two feet. I was sitting in his car. 203 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:23,120 Speaker 1: So was the car closer to the to the parking 204 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:27,560 Speaker 1: lot or was Chucky closer to the road. I'm probably 205 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:30,520 Speaker 1: five foot from the curb it Burns Drive right now, 206 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:33,680 Speaker 1: And now I'm sitting exactly where I remember, well, not exactly, 207 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:36,760 Speaker 1: but where I remember the car sitting, and I'm looking 208 00:14:36,800 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 1: towards the fence down Burners Drive. So how close was 209 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:44,080 Speaker 1: Chucky to the actual street? Was he on the sidewalk? 210 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:46,360 Speaker 1: It was played my ten foot ticking foot from the 211 00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:48,080 Speaker 1: side front of the from the edge of the term 212 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 1: fifteen feet from the curb. Was he in the parking 213 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 1: lot of the gas station the seven to eleven? No, 214 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 1: the gas stations up towards Russell Park were a little 215 00:14:57,160 --> 00:14:59,880 Speaker 1: bit one. We were we were actually he was a 216 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:04,600 Speaker 1: right beside the bowling Alley and behind Roy and Roses theories. 217 00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:10,600 Speaker 1: So had he had he already left the convenience store? Yeah, Okay, 218 00:15:10,680 --> 00:15:13,000 Speaker 1: that's important to me because I always pictured that he 219 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 1: was in the parking lot of the convenience store. But 220 00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:19,200 Speaker 1: he had left the convenience store with the candy. Correct, 221 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:22,760 Speaker 1: m it looked like he was on the way home 222 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:26,600 Speaker 1: back bay. I mean, yeah, well I looked at it now, 223 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: I'm like he was heading back home. It's like this 224 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:33,360 Speaker 1: guy had to be driving, but he had to be leaning, 225 00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:37,720 Speaker 1: like talk to Chucky. Was the car stopped, Chris, had 226 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 1: he totally stopped his car? Wasnt in park? Yes, it 227 00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 1: was just sitting here talking Chucky like I'm sitting here 228 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 1: now facing the exact thing, kind to face the exact directions. 229 00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:49,440 Speaker 1: Was he had an intersection or pulled over on the 230 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:51,880 Speaker 1: side of the road. No, he's in the parking lot 231 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:54,800 Speaker 1: in the park. There's a big parking lot in front 232 00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:58,040 Speaker 1: of the bowling alley and beside the bowling alley. It's 233 00:15:58,080 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 1: like one of those Anny shopping center. Gotcha, I understand now. 234 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 1: So he's not on the street, he's in the parking lot. Yes, 235 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 1: I just wonder. I guess at that time there was 236 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:12,920 Speaker 1: no surveillance VideA or anything like that. And you're sure 237 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:16,360 Speaker 1: there was only one white male in the car, Chris. 238 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:20,280 Speaker 1: One person. That's all. That's I mean that I remember 239 00:16:20,320 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: this night like it was I mean, I remember this 240 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:24,520 Speaker 1: night like it was yesterday. It played over and over 241 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 1: and over in my mind. I just it's never gone away, 242 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:30,560 Speaker 1: and he will never go away. And when you turned 243 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: around and you look back at Chucky, you saw him 244 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:37,600 Speaker 1: turn his wheel like he was leaving. Yeah, he picked 245 00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:39,840 Speaker 1: the front tire up like you know guys would and 246 00:16:39,880 --> 00:16:42,080 Speaker 1: when we got to go somewhere and we're close, Funny, 247 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:43,840 Speaker 1: pick your front tire up. You got your foot on, 248 00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:45,400 Speaker 1: one foot on the pedal, one foot on the ground. 249 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:48,440 Speaker 1: You picked that front at back up and turn in turn, 250 00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:52,080 Speaker 1: but the front wheel back down and go where you're going, Jason, 251 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 1: you don't want talk about Yeah, I to see Chuck 252 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:57,080 Speaker 1: to do that all the time, Chris, kind of check. 253 00:16:57,200 --> 00:17:00,480 Speaker 1: One more question, did you what can you tell me 254 00:17:00,520 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 1: about the guy you looked back? Could you see his face? 255 00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:05,480 Speaker 1: What color was his hair? Did he have a mustache? 256 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:09,359 Speaker 1: Anything I gave I got, they've better sketch. Uh, you 257 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:11,359 Speaker 1: think I got a sketch? I mean, and what me 258 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:13,600 Speaker 1: and my sister did. And the guy was just the 259 00:17:13,680 --> 00:17:18,360 Speaker 1: white male, you know, pale skin, acne like raded red 260 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:23,719 Speaker 1: or brown hair, brown hair. You know, I'm looking at 261 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:26,920 Speaker 1: the sketch right now, and it looks like he's got 262 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,840 Speaker 1: a little bit of a mustache going. And he's wearing 263 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: an open collar shirt and his hair is parted on 264 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 1: his left and kangs. Can I say something here? How 265 00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:41,560 Speaker 1: well did he look to you? Yeah? One last question? 266 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:43,760 Speaker 1: How old did he look to you? Chris? In his 267 00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:49,800 Speaker 1: twenties twenty? I say twenty five, twenty six. Understand I 268 00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:53,120 Speaker 1: think I hear Jason Cranford, Is that you Jason? Yeah, 269 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:55,160 Speaker 1: I just jump in, Jason. I just wanted to say 270 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:57,000 Speaker 1: that that sketch that you're talking about, the guy with 271 00:17:57,040 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 1: a mustache, I was told by Houston County Homicide that 272 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:03,600 Speaker 1: that sketch looks nothing like the sketch that Chris Pnoxi 273 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:06,359 Speaker 1: did the night of the or his sister did the 274 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:10,439 Speaker 1: night of the murder. Chris, Yeah, I heard that was 275 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:13,760 Speaker 1: that aged him? They did that, The FBI did that 276 00:18:13,800 --> 00:18:17,960 Speaker 1: at Quantico where they aged him. But it was doctor 277 00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:35,960 Speaker 1: sketch that was shown to UH that night Prime Stories 278 00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace join me. Also, is Chris Pate Robolard 279 00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:45,760 Speaker 1: a little neighborhood girls saw Chucky the day he was killed, 280 00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:49,960 Speaker 1: riding his bike after school. Chris, thank you for being 281 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:55,080 Speaker 1: with us. Yes, thank you, Nancy, thank you, Chris, thank you. 282 00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:59,400 Speaker 1: Don't don't anybody move, don't anybody go anywhere. Chris, pat 283 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:03,439 Speaker 1: robol Hard, tell me what you saw that day. Well, 284 00:19:03,680 --> 00:19:07,360 Speaker 1: m it just breaks my heart even going through all 285 00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:10,760 Speaker 1: of it right now, it all is, it's surreal. The 286 00:19:10,880 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: day of I'm around, it was we got out of 287 00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:17,359 Speaker 1: school at three fifteen, and around four fifteen, four thirty, 288 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:21,840 Speaker 1: Chuck came over to my house. I lived a couple 289 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:24,640 Speaker 1: of blocks away from him, and he just came over 290 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: to It's funny. He actually had candy and he just 291 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 1: came over to talk and we sat in my driveway. 292 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:34,679 Speaker 1: I vividly remember we sat in the driveway and we 293 00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:38,320 Speaker 1: talked about Shanda's a girlfriend, which he adored, and I 294 00:19:38,359 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 1: was a good friend to her. And we ate all 295 00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: the candy he had. I'm sorry, miss Miller. There was 296 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:50,879 Speaker 1: a lot of candy that day. And I remember we 297 00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:54,360 Speaker 1: just sat and talked and hung out just like thirteen 298 00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:58,240 Speaker 1: year old kids do. And he was off to go jump. 299 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: I think they were jumping ran some stuff with they 300 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:06,080 Speaker 1: had built that ramp. Yeah, And but he just came 301 00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:08,280 Speaker 1: by and we hung out like we always did, and 302 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:13,760 Speaker 1: ate candy, of course, and just you know, just doing 303 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:16,359 Speaker 1: with thirteen year old. And he didn't act like he 304 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 1: was scared about anything. Did he Absolutely not, not okay anything. 305 00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:25,919 Speaker 1: I always wondered that, no, ma'am, not at all, you know. 306 00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 1: To Dodgor Bethany Marshall, Psychoana was joining me out of 307 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:31,879 Speaker 1: Beverly Hills at doctor Bethany Marshall dot com. What I 308 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:37,400 Speaker 1: just heard Chris pate robel arts saying how innocent they were, 309 00:20:38,359 --> 00:20:41,159 Speaker 1: these little kids twelve or thirteen years old. You know, 310 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:43,080 Speaker 1: the big thrill was to go to the seven to 311 00:20:43,119 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 1: eleven and get some candy. And you know, he's twelve 312 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:49,919 Speaker 1: USh years old. He goes, hey, mom, she finds him 313 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 1: going through her jewelry and he goes save that emerald 314 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:55,119 Speaker 1: ring for me because you know, I'm going to ask 315 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,439 Speaker 1: Sean did and marry me one day. I'm just thinking 316 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:02,960 Speaker 1: about the dichotomy of their their innocence and then what happened. 317 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,359 Speaker 1: I mean, and you don't you didn't think anything about 318 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:09,600 Speaker 1: letting them go out like because it was just like 319 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: right around the corner, you know, because I've always blamed myself. 320 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:18,119 Speaker 1: I've always blamed myself for saying yes to him, you know. 321 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:24,119 Speaker 1: And doctor Bethany Marshall is with us analyzing a cold 322 00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:27,760 Speaker 1: case which we are reading heating up today Chucky. Doctor Bethany, 323 00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 1: I know you just heard Chucky's mom say she's always 324 00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:33,840 Speaker 1: felt guilty about just letting him go out on his bike. 325 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:37,280 Speaker 1: But missus, Mark, you can't say no to everything. Because 326 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:39,359 Speaker 1: if you say no to everything, then you have an 327 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:43,200 Speaker 1: imprisoned child and a child who cannot develop and grow 328 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:47,520 Speaker 1: and be inquisitive and learn about the world. These stories 329 00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:49,840 Speaker 1: are so moving and profound to me, and I want 330 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:53,920 Speaker 1: to say something that sticks out is Chucky's friend who 331 00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:57,199 Speaker 1: looked back through the car from the rear window and 332 00:21:57,320 --> 00:22:01,800 Speaker 1: saw that Chucky's arms were folded over the handlebar of 333 00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:04,640 Speaker 1: his bike, and that he seemed to be leading forward 334 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:08,080 Speaker 1: and deep in a conversation. And that speaks to the 335 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 1: innocence you're talking about, Nancy, that some perps stopped him 336 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:15,840 Speaker 1: and engaged him in a conversation. And how many times 337 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:18,679 Speaker 1: has that happened to every single person on this panel. 338 00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:22,520 Speaker 1: In childhood to our own children are relatives that it 339 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:27,000 Speaker 1: always starts with something innocent. The adult says, Hey, can 340 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:28,919 Speaker 1: I have a piece of your candy? Or oh I 341 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:32,199 Speaker 1: love that bike? Or oh you know what I'm lost? 342 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:35,199 Speaker 1: Can I do you know where the nearest gas station is? 343 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:38,400 Speaker 1: It's always so something like that, and Chucky leaning over 344 00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:42,440 Speaker 1: the handles. He thought nothing was wrong, but at some 345 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:45,800 Speaker 1: point something must have crossed his mind, even at his 346 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,800 Speaker 1: young age, that he was in trouble think and think 347 00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:54,800 Speaker 1: and think what they were talking about. Because the mom, 348 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:58,040 Speaker 1: Kathy Miller, has wrecked her mind. She doesn't know a 349 00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:00,960 Speaker 1: family friend with that kind of car. The description doesn't 350 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 1: match anyone they know. Take a listen now to our 351 00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:10,000 Speaker 1: friends at WMGT. The call first came in as a 352 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,640 Speaker 1: hidden run. It was soon determined that he was actually 353 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:16,320 Speaker 1: died as a result of a single gunshot one and 354 00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:19,320 Speaker 1: I single gunshot one through the head. But who would 355 00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:21,840 Speaker 1: shoot a thirteen year old boy. We don't expect our 356 00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:25,359 Speaker 1: children to be shot and killed in House and County 357 00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 1: in this matter. People during that time quit letting the 358 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:31,520 Speaker 1: kids ride their bikes, They quit letting them go up 359 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 1: the street on the bibles. Captain John Holland, like the 360 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,360 Speaker 1: House and County Sheriff's Office, says he had investigators interviewed 361 00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,160 Speaker 1: dozens of people trying to find that answer. They turned 362 00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: the neighborhood inside out. They camped the neighborhood. I think 363 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 1: they set up road chicks during that time just to 364 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:48,640 Speaker 1: find people that had seen things. And even to this day, 365 00:23:48,680 --> 00:23:51,879 Speaker 1: we do get calls with people that either have some 366 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 1: information or have an idea about who may have been involved. 367 00:23:55,400 --> 00:24:00,119 Speaker 1: There is still no suspect. It's a tough conversation. He 368 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:04,440 Speaker 1: still has some hope that one day showed it some resolution, 369 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,640 Speaker 1: but it's difficult, don't you know it. That was our friend, 370 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:14,800 Speaker 1: scholar Henry Henry at WMGT speaking to the Captain John 371 00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:19,439 Speaker 1: Holland joining me now. Is in addition to Kathy Miller, 372 00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:24,120 Speaker 1: Chucky's mother, his friends Cheryl McCollum, Levi Page, and doctor 373 00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:31,600 Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall, Shanda Burch this is Chucky's then girlfriend who 374 00:24:31,640 --> 00:24:38,760 Speaker 1: to this day is haunted by his death. Shanda Birch. 375 00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:43,360 Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us. Thank you, Nancy. Shanna. 376 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:48,679 Speaker 1: Tell me about the day that Chucky was murdered. Um, 377 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:58,359 Speaker 1: it's hard to talk about. Actually, my brother's friend gave 378 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 1: my brother a call and my brother that's something had 379 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:03,439 Speaker 1: happened to Chuck and that he was heard or he 380 00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:06,920 Speaker 1: was shot. And I totally didn't believe him. I just 381 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,120 Speaker 1: I thought, well, that's not that's that can't be true. 382 00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:12,160 Speaker 1: I don't I don't believe this. And I was just 383 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:16,280 Speaker 1: in a state of shock. And I stayed up that 384 00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 1: night so I could watched the eleven o'clock news to 385 00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:23,040 Speaker 1: see if if this was true, if this happened, and 386 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,400 Speaker 1: I stayed up and I watched it, and it happened, 387 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:33,400 Speaker 1: and I just remember not believing it. Shanda, you say 388 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:41,520 Speaker 1: that to this day, Chuck, He's murder still haunts you. Explained, Well, Nancy, 389 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 1: when you're twelve years old, you don't really know how 390 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:48,440 Speaker 1: to handle, you know, something so huge like that, and 391 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:51,479 Speaker 1: it was something that you didn't know what to do. 392 00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:53,600 Speaker 1: You didn't know how to help, you didn't know who 393 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:57,240 Speaker 1: to talk to, and so it took a long long 394 00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:01,639 Speaker 1: time to process that information, and you know, way into adulthood. 395 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 1: And UM, to this day, it's still it's still difficult 396 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: to talk about. UM. You know, it makes you not 397 00:26:08,800 --> 00:26:12,280 Speaker 1: trust people, and it makes you feel this is still 398 00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: going on and there's no answers. I love you, Shana. 399 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:40,639 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Shanda, how do you believe 400 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:49,160 Speaker 1: this has affected your life? Um, It's affected my life tremendously. UM. 401 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:53,520 Speaker 1: He was my best friend and we loved each other, 402 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 1: we really did. And UM, and I think if he 403 00:26:57,040 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: would have lived, I really do think that we would 404 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:03,440 Speaker 1: have been together, or I at least have been best 405 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:07,440 Speaker 1: friends and been in our life. You know, I think 406 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:09,639 Speaker 1: he would still be a part of my life, and 407 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:13,879 Speaker 1: I've always felt like there was something missing in my 408 00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:20,800 Speaker 1: life and you just can't replace that. Well, he really 409 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:24,480 Speaker 1: cared so much for you, and I'm so glad that 410 00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:27,720 Speaker 1: he had a chance in his early years to to 411 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:31,840 Speaker 1: fall in love, to be able to experience that, and 412 00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:36,879 Speaker 1: he did love you. Kathy. Please tell the story about 413 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: him finding your emerald ring. Oh yeah, we were going 414 00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:44,800 Speaker 1: through my jewelry and it was just an emerald, an 415 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:48,800 Speaker 1: emerald cut emerald playing to you know ring. It wasn't 416 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:53,439 Speaker 1: really fancy, but he fell in love with that. He says, Mama, 417 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:56,119 Speaker 1: keep that ring because I'm going to give that to 418 00:27:56,160 --> 00:27:59,680 Speaker 1: Shando one day. And I said, okay, Darling, I will. 419 00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:05,040 Speaker 1: In fact, I buried him with that. Oh. I put 420 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:08,399 Speaker 1: it on his little finger because that was one of 421 00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 1: the things that was so important to him. And he 422 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,080 Speaker 1: would go on my jewelry box every once in a 423 00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:16,760 Speaker 1: while and look at it, you know, and I knew 424 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:20,040 Speaker 1: how important it was, and I knew how important she 425 00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:25,040 Speaker 1: was to him, So I thought, then that's where it 426 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:28,879 Speaker 1: needs to be with him. Guys, Chucky Mark a little 427 00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 1: boy who just goes to a convenience store to get candy. 428 00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:36,600 Speaker 1: It's part of a strip mall Water Robins, Georgia. We 429 00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:39,680 Speaker 1: still don't have answers, but today we're learning a lot 430 00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:43,760 Speaker 1: of clues. I want to circle back to Chris Panacheck 431 00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:46,480 Speaker 1: at a red light in a car with his sister, 432 00:28:46,600 --> 00:28:51,080 Speaker 1: Seize Chucky talking to his killer. Sitting in a solid 433 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 1: white car outside the convenience store. Seize Chucky started to 434 00:28:55,800 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 1: drive off white mail Buick Hype car seventy nine eighty 435 00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 1: one Regal or Grand Prix two door. I want you 436 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 1: to think, Chris, is there anything rack your brain? Did 437 00:29:12,320 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 1: the guy have his arm hanging out? Did he have 438 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,760 Speaker 1: a tattoo? Was he wearing a watch? Is there anything 439 00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,520 Speaker 1: the tires on the car? Anything you can tell us. 440 00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:24,280 Speaker 1: I was under hypnoticed by by mister Ankler with the 441 00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:27,920 Speaker 1: house Kang share department. I think two or three times, 442 00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:32,680 Speaker 1: and I'm My memory of this car is so the 443 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:34,840 Speaker 1: emblem on the on the vehicle, it's beating on the 444 00:29:34,960 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 1: fender behind the front tire of that car. That's why 445 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:38,960 Speaker 1: I say it's a beauty. It's like a beautic Regal 446 00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:41,200 Speaker 1: because it was a it's like a night symbol. It's 447 00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 1: crest the or you know, like over in England that 448 00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:47,640 Speaker 1: family family crest and it's a red, white and blue crest. 449 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:51,240 Speaker 1: And that just I mean, I just always stuck red 450 00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:56,800 Speaker 1: white and blue type crest on the back fender front. 451 00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:58,400 Speaker 1: Did you say, the front fender to the car, right 452 00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:03,400 Speaker 1: on the front car fender, right behind the front tire, 453 00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:07,040 Speaker 1: on which side driver side? It's an emblem on the 454 00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:09,400 Speaker 1: on the vehicle. It's like the It's on both sides 455 00:30:09,400 --> 00:30:11,120 Speaker 1: of right and lift. But I know I've seen it 456 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:12,960 Speaker 1: on the left side of the vehicle when I was 457 00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:16,360 Speaker 1: coming to the vehicle. Oh, you mean not on the 458 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,040 Speaker 1: fender but on the body of the carr itself. No, 459 00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:20,760 Speaker 1: on the fender of the car, right behind the right 460 00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:23,760 Speaker 1: behind the fender wheel of the front tire. I understand 461 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:25,440 Speaker 1: it a lot of a lot of card better had 462 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 1: a little crest is like grigles. I do believe, Chyl. 463 00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:32,560 Speaker 1: I've never heard that, Cheryl McCollum, I've never heard that 464 00:30:33,080 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 1: that should limit what kind of car it is. And 465 00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: answer That's why I was trying to say earlier, this 466 00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:40,880 Speaker 1: is such a money tree. We now know there was 467 00:30:40,920 --> 00:30:44,120 Speaker 1: only one person in the car. He was white. The 468 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:47,560 Speaker 1: type of the car, something is detailed as that crest 469 00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:52,000 Speaker 1: being behind the wheel and all to me, this is 470 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 1: such a visual there's gonna be somebody from making to 471 00:30:56,320 --> 00:31:01,160 Speaker 1: Warner Robins tips and even that car are is significant. 472 00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:04,560 Speaker 1: This is not the first crime that person committed, and 473 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:07,400 Speaker 1: it's not the first crime they committed in that vehicle. 474 00:31:08,000 --> 00:31:11,320 Speaker 1: To Cathy's mom, wait, let me ask us to Levi 475 00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:14,400 Speaker 1: Pay's joining me crime online dot com. Levi. I just 476 00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:18,680 Speaker 1: did a Google search and the Buick logo, Nancy, there 477 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:20,960 Speaker 1: was a Buick logo and it was in red, white 478 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:24,080 Speaker 1: and blue back in the day, the former logo of Buick, 479 00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:27,640 Speaker 1: So that could be what Chris saw when he was 480 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:30,720 Speaker 1: examining the car. And what's interesting, Nancy, what we know 481 00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,200 Speaker 1: about the evidence in this case is that when Chucky 482 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:36,640 Speaker 1: was found, he was still gripping the receipt to the 483 00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:39,040 Speaker 1: store and the bubble gum in his hand, which means 484 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:41,640 Speaker 1: he's left the store. He was also shot in the 485 00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:44,920 Speaker 1: back of the head, which means that his back was 486 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: to the perpetrator when the perpetrator shot him, which means 487 00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,760 Speaker 1: that something could have happened, Nancy, that scared Chucky. This 488 00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 1: guy could have creeped him out, and he tried to 489 00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:55,720 Speaker 1: get away, and that's when the guy shot him to 490 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:59,120 Speaker 1: keep him from talking about their conversation or what he 491 00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:02,720 Speaker 1: tried to do to Chuck LEVI, if you' don't mind, 492 00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:04,880 Speaker 1: please send me the photo that you manage to get 493 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 1: a red, white and blue. I guarantee it's going to 494 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 1: be in the shape of an old English coat of 495 00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:18,000 Speaker 1: arms light which is a shield of sorts. Wow, okay, 496 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,320 Speaker 1: you know with me? Is Chris Panachek, who was at 497 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:25,280 Speaker 1: the red light and saw Chucky just moments, literally seconds 498 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,200 Speaker 1: before he was murdered. Shanda Birch, his little girlfriend who 499 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: was still dealing with the fallout of his murder. Jason Cranford, 500 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:35,560 Speaker 1: his friend joining us in Colorado who has put up 501 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:41,080 Speaker 1: a one hundred thousand dollar reward. Jason question for anyone 502 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 1: that can give you a call or a tip, how 503 00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:48,320 Speaker 1: do we reach you regarding that reward? Oh? Well, everybody 504 00:32:48,320 --> 00:32:50,560 Speaker 1: on this call has myself phone number, in my email, 505 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,840 Speaker 1: my Facebook. If there's any other type of contact you 506 00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,760 Speaker 1: want me provided, I can provide it and the tipline 507 00:32:57,800 --> 00:33:00,920 Speaker 1: that we have for seven eight five four two zero 508 00:33:01,040 --> 00:33:06,520 Speaker 1: eight zero. Chris pet Robillard neighborhood that saw Chucky the 509 00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:10,080 Speaker 1: afternoon before he was killed. Cheryl McCollum, Director Coal Case 510 00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:14,680 Speaker 1: Research Institute, doctor Bethany Marshall, and Kathy Miller Chucky's mom 511 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:20,320 Speaker 1: question out to you, Let me go to Jason Cranford 512 00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 1: putting up one hundred thousand dollar reward. How did you 513 00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:28,960 Speaker 1: guys all get together to join me today? Oh so 514 00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 1: that every year there's a Chuck Mark Facebook support group 515 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:37,560 Speaker 1: of some memorial page, and every year around the anniversary, 516 00:33:37,600 --> 00:33:41,640 Speaker 1: people start posting in there. This year's Shanda Birch made 517 00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:43,760 Speaker 1: a post that you know, really got to me and 518 00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:47,040 Speaker 1: started reminding me of what happened. And I have a 519 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:51,240 Speaker 1: thirteen year old son now, and so it really get 520 00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:53,560 Speaker 1: home this year because of the age of my son 521 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: and the age of Chucky when he died. And you know, 522 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:01,479 Speaker 1: I've been very successful in my business adventures, and you know, 523 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:04,480 Speaker 1: the reward is something I feel as the least that 524 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,080 Speaker 1: I could do to help Miss Miller get some peace 525 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:09,439 Speaker 1: with this. You know, she's getting old and I would 526 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:12,440 Speaker 1: like to see this happened in her lifetime. I had 527 00:34:12,520 --> 00:34:15,960 Speaker 1: the money. Chuck was a dear friend of mine. You know, 528 00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:18,439 Speaker 1: I hung out in Miss Miller's garage. Me and Chuck 529 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,239 Speaker 1: worked on bicycles in there. We jumped the ramp that 530 00:34:21,239 --> 00:34:23,879 Speaker 1: everybody keeps talking about. I sent pictures of that ramp. Then, 531 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:28,560 Speaker 1: you know, I think that after he left Chris Pete's house, 532 00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:30,440 Speaker 1: he came over to the ramp that we all built 533 00:34:30,480 --> 00:34:32,520 Speaker 1: and we were all jumping that ramp, and that was 534 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:34,279 Speaker 1: the last time I saw him. But you know, this 535 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:36,680 Speaker 1: was my first experience with death in my life, and 536 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:39,640 Speaker 1: it's haunted me my whole life, just like it's haunted 537 00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:41,360 Speaker 1: the rest of the people on this guys. I pulled 538 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:44,200 Speaker 1: up that ambulance Levi sent me, and it is red, 539 00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:47,120 Speaker 1: white and blue, and it looks like a coat of arms. 540 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:53,560 Speaker 1: It's amazing, and right now I am sending it Levi. 541 00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:56,120 Speaker 1: I pass it on to Brett really quickly so he 542 00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:59,040 Speaker 1: can pass it on to Chris Panacheck and see if 543 00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:03,440 Speaker 1: that's even remote what he saw. Guys. Tip line regarding 544 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:07,040 Speaker 1: the reward is three zero three eight four two zero 545 00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 1: one seven nine repeat three zero three eight four two 546 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:16,960 Speaker 1: zero one seven nine. Could this emblem on the side 547 00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:20,600 Speaker 1: of that vehicle be the tip that cracks this case 548 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:27,479 Speaker 1: wide open? Guys, the search for Chucky Mack's killer goes on. 549 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:33,279 Speaker 1: Please help us hit the case up and put it 550 00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:37,439 Speaker 1: to rest. The tip line four seven eight five four 551 00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:42,720 Speaker 1: two two zero eight zero. Nancy Grace Crime Stories, signing 552 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:44,400 Speaker 1: off good bye friend,