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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hello, welcome back to the show. My name is Matt,

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Speaker 2: my name is Noah.

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Speaker 3: They call me Ben. We are joined as always with

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Speaker 3: our super producer Andrew the try Force Howard. Most importantly,

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Speaker 3: you are you. You are here. That makes this the

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Speaker 3: stuff they don't want you to know. Previously, on Stuff

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Speaker 3: they don't want you to know, you had a bunch

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Speaker 3: of leos digging into astrology. True story, folks, we just

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Speaker 3: learned that our producer and one of our hosts share

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Speaker 3: a birthday.

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Speaker 4: What does it mean?

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Speaker 3: What does it mean.

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Speaker 2: That that's a really good day to be born on?

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Speaker 4: Your shots are aligned?

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Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, we consulted our constellations. Some of our astute

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Speaker 3: listeners may have predicted that we would return to the

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Speaker 3: concept of astrology and government.

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Speaker 4: Folks.

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Speaker 3: Please check out our first episode.

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Speaker 4: We had a.

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Speaker 3: I think we had a pretty good exploration of the

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Speaker 3: nation of Meammar, which, in a plot twist, according to

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Speaker 3: the advice of soothsayers, decided to move their capital to

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Speaker 3: a place that was like three hundred clicks north and

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Speaker 3: hadn't been built. And we also just had a great

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Speaker 3: interview about me and Mar following up on another episode we.

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Speaker 2: Did by the spoiler alert if you haven't listened to

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Speaker 2: the first episode yet, they moved that capital and then

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Speaker 2: there was a devastating storm that rolled through right in

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Speaker 2: the area a couple of years later, which is you know,

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Speaker 2: it can either it can lead you towards a lot

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Speaker 2: like the way a strology in general can towards believing

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Speaker 2: that it had full merit right right, Yeah, we move

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Speaker 2: our capital, say the generals of Memmr.

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Speaker 3: We move it north to avoid a disaster in two

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Speaker 3: thousand and five two thousand and eight cyclone hits. So

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Speaker 3: have we predicted the future or was that statistically inevitable?

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Speaker 3: Please do check out our exploration of Meammar with Denise

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Speaker 3: Chan from Scam Factory. Check out our earlier episodes on

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Speaker 3: astrology in the government. And by the way, we did

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Speaker 3: a little bit of a cliffhanger in our last episode

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Speaker 3: because we're talking about a place that a lot of

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Speaker 3: people in the audience have not visited. But Noel Matt

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Speaker 3: as we teased earlier in chapter one astrology, and the

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Speaker 3: government gets a little bit closer to home than a

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Speaker 3: lot of people would assume.

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Speaker 2: Wait, you're talking about in these United States.

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Speaker 5: Sixteen hundred Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 2: No, hey, think on that. We'll be right back after

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Speaker 2: a few words from our sponsors.

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Speaker 3: Here are the facts in the first chapter of our

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Speaker 3: exploration regarding astrology in the government. We spent a lot

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Speaker 3: of time on a brief history of astrology. Right, it's

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Speaker 3: a type of divination. We did what I think is

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Speaker 3: a pretty fun experiment with another type of divination, bibliomancy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. That's where you open a book to a random page,

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Speaker 2: pick out a passage, and that passage is going to

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Speaker 2: somehow apply to whatever question you asked or situation you're

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Speaker 2: currently in. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And it was full disclosure. It was easier for

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Speaker 3: us to do that versus other forms of divination like

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Speaker 3: reading introls.

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Speaker 4: Or reading leaves. Yeah, yeah, tea leaves as well.

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Speaker 2: Yes, we are actively scrying every time we record one

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Speaker 2: of these episodes.

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Speaker 4: Coffee spills, you know that'll also do it.

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Speaker 6: Also the thing, yes, well, we're being silly, but we

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Speaker 6: really as we've mentioned before, and not to backpedal or anything,

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Speaker 6: we're not here to criticize anyone who really, you know,

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Speaker 6: put sand into this stuff, and there are many folks

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Speaker 6: that very much do. I look at it as another

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Speaker 6: form of faith, another form of religion in many ways.

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Speaker 6: So I don't think we're here to poopoo anybody's belief,

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Speaker 6: make anybody feel dumb in any form or fashion.

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Speaker 4: We're just being silly guys.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, we all enjoy Gallows humor, especially here

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty five, and we were exploring some key

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Speaker 3: facts about astrology overall.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 3: We talked about how Western astrology is likely statistically the

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Speaker 3: most familiar to many of us in the audience tonight,

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Speaker 3: but there are varied other forms of astrological beliefs. Mesoamerican

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Speaker 3: Asiatic civilizations all created their own systems. For instance, you

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Speaker 3: guys are probably if I had to guess, you're probably

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Speaker 3: roosters in Chinese horoscopes.

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Speaker 2: I believe I'm a rat.

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Speaker 4: You're a rat, a fire rat, or a metal rat

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Speaker 4: or the other.

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Speaker 2: Electric Hey, I love that Hyseillo have to put the yellow.

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Speaker 4: Yellow elect me nice?

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Speaker 3: Noel, do you have one? Do you know your Chinese horoscope?

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Speaker 4: I do not. I think you know. I think I'm

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Speaker 4: a rat. I do believe that I am a rat.

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Speaker 3: Okay, all right, I.

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Speaker 6: Could be wrong, though, I could be wrong, but I

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Speaker 6: think that I am a metal rat.

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Speaker 4: Tight.

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Speaker 3: That's a weird response. But yes, I don't know.

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Speaker 6: Metal rat sounds kind of scary, like some sort of

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Speaker 6: like robo rat that comes for you.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: We also found that people leverage astrology for different reasons. Right,

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Speaker 3: In most casual horoscopes you encounter today, you will see

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Speaker 3: less of an emphasis on predicting the future. Instead, you'll see,

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Speaker 3: like you were saying earlier, a sort of diagnostic tool

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Speaker 3: for psychology. Right, tell me more about why I make decisions?

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Speaker 4: Right?

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Speaker 3: Is this so sagittarius of me?

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Speaker 4: You know?

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Speaker 3: Is this so virgo?

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Speaker 2: Uh?

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Speaker 3: It's it's not attempting to uh tell you what to

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Speaker 3: do with an empire. It's attempting to teach you more

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Speaker 3: about yourself.

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Speaker 2: Mouser, that's the that's the name Mouser. Do you guys

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Speaker 2: remember that from teenage m I was thinking there was

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Speaker 2: a metal rat.

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Speaker 4: He like sort of like a bizarro splinter.

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Speaker 6: Isn't he sort of meant to be like the antithesis

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Speaker 6: to like evil splinter?

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Speaker 2: I thought they were just a little tiny.

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Speaker 4: The little guys.

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Speaker 3: Yes, yes, yes, under we're keeping all of chomping jaws.

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Speaker 4: Don't they have chompy jaws? They have jaws? Do they

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Speaker 4: got chompies? Okay, thank you for that nostalgia. Bam, Matt,

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Speaker 4: I appreciate it very much.

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Speaker 3: Important, important, Uh, this is why we're here together tonight. Third,

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Speaker 3: we have to emphasize there is no universally accepted scientific

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Speaker 3: basis supporting the claims of astrology. And that's a bummer

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Speaker 3: for a lot of people.

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Speaker 2: Right, Oh, yeah, pretty big bummer. But you know what else,

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Speaker 2: that's why it gets into the belief system thing. Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Even though modern science does not assign any quantitative truth

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Speaker 3: to astrology, a lot of people practice it, right, And

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Speaker 3: it is, in the opinion of this show, a matter

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Speaker 3: of belief or a matter of faith. You may have

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Speaker 3: read your own horoscope as you tuned in tonight. If so, congratulations,

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Speaker 3: We hope it was a good one. And I think

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Speaker 3: in our previous episode we talked a little bit about this,

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Speaker 3: like they're not really bad news horoscopes in the West, right, No.

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Speaker 4: Just like there aren't really bad news fortune cookies.

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Speaker 3: Usually I got one fortune cookie true story, one time

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Speaker 3: that said turn around.

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Speaker 4: What was someone there?

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Speaker 3: Yes, and they say boo, they actually they actually put

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Speaker 3: the fortune cookie there. It was a weird situation.

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Speaker 6: Oh that makes sense. That tracks Ye, I've never had

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Speaker 6: a sinister fortune cookie before. But yeah, I mean, you know, again,

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Speaker 6: these things are meant to be super accessible, at least

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Speaker 6: the ones that are way more editorialized and like published

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Speaker 6: and more universally kind of read magazines and periodicals and stuff.

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Speaker 6: But as we mentioned in the last episode, if you

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Speaker 6: really go out for the more specific and complex types

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Speaker 6: of astrological readings, then you know you were going to get.

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Speaker 6: Your results may vary, right, You're not necessarily always going

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Speaker 6: to get some sort of like life affirming thumbs up.

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Speaker 2: So I guys it in my world, which is highly

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Speaker 2: limited right when it comes to my perspective and experience,

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Speaker 2: astrology has been a lot on the fringes that maybe

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Speaker 2: that has a lot to do with where I grew up,

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Speaker 2: you know, who my parents were, geographically where I am

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Speaker 2: in all that stuff. Astrology was like a thing that

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Speaker 2: I didn't encounter very often, especially growing up. Not until

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Speaker 2: I got older did I see it more. I do

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Speaker 2: not encounter it a lot when it comes to maybe

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Speaker 2: the people who are in charge in the systems and

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Speaker 2: organizations I interact with on a regular basis, at least

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Speaker 2: I don't they aren't openly talking about it, the people

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Speaker 2: that run those things. Maybe it just doesn't feel like

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Speaker 2: something that I associate with a boss or something like that.

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Speaker 2: Do you guys have that same I don't know experience.

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Speaker 6: Oh, you mean sort of like in more day to

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Speaker 6: day leadership roles. Folks that put a lot of stock

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Speaker 6: into this kind of stuff.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, a principal at a school or a I don't know,

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Speaker 2: an owner operator of a local store, or the CEO

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Speaker 2: of a company.

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Speaker 6: Well, was to say, they're not into it privately, but

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Speaker 6: our culture definitely, you know, in those types of roles

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Speaker 6: would not be something that folks would maybe make super known, right.

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Speaker 3: Especially in a increasingly secular Western civilization. You know, there

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Speaker 3: are largely dismissive scientific attitudes toward belief systems of astrology.

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Speaker 3: So it's easy to that point to assume our vaunted

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Speaker 3: leaders of modern society, our nascent nations, would be likewise

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Speaker 3: dismissive of these ideas.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 3: The science says hello, so we say goodbye to the religion. However,

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Speaker 3: as we learn in our earlier episode and the current episode,

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Speaker 3: this assumption could not be further from the truth. Here's

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Speaker 3: where it gets crazy. Astrology the White House. What's your sign,

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Speaker 3: mister president. Statistically, your dude, and statistically you're also an aquarius. Weird.

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Speaker 3: You also have a tendency higher than average to be

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Speaker 3: left handed. We're going to leave that that they are

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Speaker 3: tune into ridiculous history. It is no secret that the

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Speaker 3: founding fathers of the United States considered themselves learned men.

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Speaker 3: They had a deep appreciation of science as they understood

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Speaker 3: it at the time. Also to be objective. Beat me here, Andrew.

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Speaker 3: They were super wrong about a bunch of shit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you can imagine why someone who is running

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Speaker 2: such an intricate and complicated system as a country, you

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Speaker 2: would want to be science first, at least in some respect.

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Speaker 2: You want to have an understanding of the sciences that

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Speaker 2: govern a lot of the stuff, the choices you're making, Right,

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Speaker 2: it does seem weird that you might consult something that

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Speaker 2: is the stars to make decisions, does it though?

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Speaker 3: Because the stars are constant, you can you know, we

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Speaker 3: referenced fivel earlier, right, You.

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Speaker 4: Can share experience for sure.

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Speaker 3: Right, you can look up and you can see the

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Speaker 3: same thing pauper prints alike. There is a passage predictable

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Speaker 3: to the heavens well.

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Speaker 6: And the beautiful part about that in terms of what

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Speaker 6: a functional you know, use of the stars might be

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Speaker 6: to this day, it's still a way you can find

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Speaker 6: your your literal north star if you're like lost in

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Speaker 6: the woods and you can get pointed in the right direction.

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Speaker 6: And I think that's universally accepted as a way of

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Speaker 6: using the stars for navigation purposes for example, even though

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Speaker 6: of course we have you know, technology for that kind

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Speaker 6: of stuff now, it's still a good go to if

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Speaker 6: you don't have those things. But when you start to

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Speaker 6: impart meaning beyond just geographical positioning, you know, into the stars,

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Speaker 6: it does start to feel like that is maybe looked

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Speaker 6: at more askance these days.

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Speaker 2: I think it's because we're so programmed and primed to

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Speaker 2: imagine the president of the United States as consulting God. Right,

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Speaker 2: even though it is a secular nation, right, there is

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Speaker 2: no one God and there's no one religion for this nation,

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Speaker 2: we still watch each president who gets indocurated to put

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Speaker 2: their hand on a Christian Bible. Right, we still hear

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Speaker 2: them give speeches and announcements where they reference God directly,

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Speaker 2: and we sing songs about the nation directly tied to

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Speaker 2: g dash T. And it's just when then you imagine

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Speaker 2: astrology is something othered from I don't know some of

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Speaker 2: the dogmatic beliefs those religions.

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Speaker 4: I don't know if I even buy that.

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Speaker 6: A lot of politicians that are very forward with that

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Speaker 6: kind of stuff are maybe even true believers. It seems

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Speaker 6: like they're just trying to appeal to a particular voting base.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, most of the time.

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Speaker 6: And the and astrology maybe would be on the table

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Speaker 6: too if it were practiced and accepted by a larger

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Speaker 6: swath of Americans.

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Speaker 4: Mhm.

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Speaker 3: That's so leo of you.

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Speaker 6: From a standpoint of rhetoric and like campaigning and stuff,

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Speaker 6: I think any belief system that was used, then accepted

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Speaker 6: and believed in widely enough would be something that would

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Speaker 6: have to be addressed by politicians to make sure that

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Speaker 6: they're not aliening people and they're making people feel seen,

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Speaker 6: if not outright claiming that belief system for themselves.

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Speaker 4: Look.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, A great case study here, and I don't want

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Speaker 3: to ruffle feathers, would be the LDS Church in Utah.

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Speaker 3: You know what I mean that that is a case

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Speaker 3: study in how a politician will attempt to move with

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Speaker 3: a demographic in public democracy representative democracy. It's crucial to

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Speaker 3: remember when we're talking about the Founding Fathers, their perceptions

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Speaker 3: of science were very much the result of the environment

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Speaker 3: and the age in which they lived. So a lot

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Speaker 3: of the stuff that they super hardcore, fundamentally believed it

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Speaker 3: no matter what they were saying to the public. A

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Speaker 3: lot of what they can considered hard science was later

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Speaker 3: proven to be partially or entirely incorrect. Some notable examples

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Speaker 3: in this Hall of shame or this hall of learning opportunities,

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Speaker 3: if we want to be positive, would be anything regarding

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Speaker 3: eugenics or racial theory. A lot of phrenology fans amid

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Speaker 3: the Founding Fathers super wrong and dumb.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and a lot of members of the Free and

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Speaker 2: Accepted Masons, right which have That group has their own

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Speaker 2: set of symbols and in seat of beliefs and ideas

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Speaker 2: and at which they.

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Speaker 4: Have made it into currency.

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Speaker 3: Even you know, I mean shout out my boy herme's tea.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well some of them extend to the stars exactly.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, very much a great architect. All human minds, we

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Speaker 3: can say, do enjoy the idea of a great creator, right,

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Speaker 3: some sort of structure, some sort of guy force, because

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Speaker 3: the alternative is simply damning philosophically, that no one would

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Speaker 3: be at the wheel, that all of this occurred via accident.

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Speaker 3: That's a scary thought. So of course people look toward pattern,

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Speaker 3: people look toward meaning. With all this in mind, it

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Speaker 3: should not be surprising to realize many former US politicians

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Speaker 3: placed at least some amount of credence in the ancient

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Speaker 3: science slash spiritual exploration of divination and astrology. You guy's

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Speaker 3: true story, Our buddy, Benjamin Franklin, you remember him from earlier.

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Speaker 3: Definitely not a serial killer, Yeah, most most.

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Speaker 4: Likely, most likely some experience.

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Speaker 3: Good note, No, not proven serial killer. He relied on

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Speaker 3: astrology to select the signing date of the Declaration of Independence,

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Speaker 3: which was you know, it's a piece of paper the

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Speaker 3: US has and was a pretty big deal up until recently.

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Speaker 2: Because now we're dependent. Oh never mind. Yeah, the the

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Speaker 2: recent actions are well in a line with our actions.

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Speaker 2: Did anybody see that little quotation?

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Speaker 4: Every action he gets an equal and opposite reaction. Now, sure,

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Speaker 4: that's us.

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Speaker 2: If you don't know what I'm talking about.

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Speaker 3: Search shout out article five. Oh gosh, buddy, look our

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Speaker 3: buddy bed Despite not being a proven serial killer, check

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Speaker 3: out our earlier episode. He's a fascinating sort of weird dude.

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Speaker 3: He adhered to astrology, and it might sound crazy until

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Speaker 3: we realized that he published a best selling book, Poor

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Speaker 3: Richard's Almanac. Remember that one. Were you guys there.

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Speaker 4: There?

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Speaker 6: I was there, Yeah at the first can show Sorry

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Speaker 6: if I'm doing a losing my edge thing, No, but

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Speaker 6: I do.

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Speaker 3: I've heard Tell, heard tell, uh herd tell. Poor Richard's

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Speaker 3: Almanac is this approachable sort of like Uncle John's Bathroom

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Speaker 3: Guide to the Seasons of the United States, And it

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Speaker 3: follows in great deal, you know, the passage of harvest

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Speaker 3: and planting and fallow times, and then it also tells

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Speaker 3: you a lot about the North Star and predictions of

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Speaker 3: the heavens. Ben Franklin, in addition to be a pretty

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Speaker 3: naughty boy and a libertine and a renaissance man, he

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Speaker 3: was super into astrology. He thought it made sense, and

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Speaker 3: he even disc is Isaac Newton from earlier in Poor

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Speaker 3: Richard's Almanac. Can we go to Who's got a good

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Speaker 3: Ben Franklin voice. I'm too close to it.

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Speaker 2: No, come on, you've got to do it, you know you, No,

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Speaker 2: you gotta do it.

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Speaker 3: You gotta one of you guys.

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Speaker 4: I refuse Maddie, you're the voice master. Come on, give it.

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Speaker 4: Here we go, all right, This.

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Speaker 3: Is poor Richard's almanac, Ben Franklin's defense of astrology Curt

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Speaker 3: hist Rader.

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Speaker 2: Astrology is one of the most ancient sciences, held in

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Speaker 2: high esteem of old by the wise and great. Formerly,

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Speaker 2: no prince would make war peace, nor any general fight

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Speaker 2: or battle. In short, no important affair was taken without

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Speaker 2: first consulting an astrology who examined the aspects and configurations

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Speaker 2: of the heavenly bodies and market the lucky hour. Now

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Speaker 2: the noble art machhae to the age we live in

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Speaker 2: is dwindled into contempt.

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Speaker 4: Perfect. Wow, that was great, well done, sir.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Now let's unpact this. What we're seeing here is

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Speaker 3: a founding father Ben Franklin, presented by our brother Matt Frederick,

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Speaker 3: saying essentially that he considers astrology one of the oldest

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Speaker 3: actual sciences, actual fact science, as our pal Lauren would say.

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Speaker 3: And he is also acknowledging that a lot of more

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Speaker 3: secular people don't vibe with.

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Speaker 4: It, not a bit.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but Manajamin Franklin, this guy is massively important. He

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Speaker 2: started the CIA, just kidding. He was just a founding member.

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Speaker 2: As we talked about.

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Speaker 4: He was definitely there, guys.

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Speaker 3: He was middle management on some operations.

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Speaker 2: He was a muse for the CIA. But he didn't

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Speaker 2: run the place, right, he was just he was on

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Speaker 2: the sidelines whispering into people's ears.

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Speaker 3: All right, all right, we're all having fun with Ben.

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Speaker 4: That's right.

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Speaker 3: He did a lot of stuff. And he also is

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Speaker 3: clearly a fan of astrology. And he continues on if

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Speaker 3: you want to read more of his work on the Almanac,

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Speaker 3: he continues to talk about how he feels the sh

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Speaker 3: as you would say in the modern world has lost

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Speaker 3: its way when it comes to ancient science. And he

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Speaker 3: factored in the passage of heavenly bodies when he was

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Speaker 3: choosing times for policy to be signed up to and

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Speaker 3: including the Declaration of Independence. We're not saying he's right.

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Speaker 3: We're not saying he genuinely believed it. We are saying

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Speaker 3: he's kind of the first internetural in America. Amazing and

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Speaker 3: with this. We are are attempting to prove the case

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Speaker 3: that the US government has always held a somewhat secret

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Speaker 3: affinity for astrology. We hope that you will join us

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Speaker 3: after the outbreak, we're diving into even weirder stuff. Shout

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Speaker 3: out to Ben Franklin. I'm so scared of that guy.

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Speaker 3: You know he took air baths.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, who's a bit of a newtist.

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Speaker 3: Well, right back, and we've returned. Before we get to

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Speaker 3: the present day, or the more present day, we're going

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Speaker 3: to we're gonna share a couple stories about other founding

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Speaker 3: fathers or other heads of US state who were involved

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Speaker 3: with astrology, often by proxy.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh yeah. Hey, let's jump to a president

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Speaker 2: that everybody remembers, President Franklin Pierce. Boo, did that ring

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Speaker 2: all the bells? No? No, Well, President Pierce was in

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Speaker 2: office from March fourth, eighteen fifty three until March fourth,

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Speaker 2: eighteen fifty seven. Very exciting time in the United States

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Speaker 2: that we all remember. But the reason we're going to

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Speaker 2: talking about Franklin Pierce is because when we're talking about astrology,

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Speaker 2: there's a loose connection, and I say that a very

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Speaker 2: loose connection to other parts of spiritualism that we've discussed

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Speaker 2: on this show before, the concept that there is some

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Speaker 2: kind of veil between us and the experience we have

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Speaker 2: on this planet and some other worldly plane, some spiritual plane,

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Speaker 2: whether that is even the heavens, because it could extend

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Speaker 2: to the heavens itself, or maybe it's just between life

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Speaker 2: and death and things like that. We're bringing up Franklin

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Speaker 2: Pierce because he is His time in office was specifically

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Speaker 2: marked by some of the beliefs and actions of his spouse,

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Speaker 2: Jane Pierce, and the two of them, together while in

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Speaker 2: the White House, attempted to do things like contact dead

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Speaker 2: love ones, so like actually having seances inside the White

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Speaker 2: House walls, which to me, guys, feels like something that

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Speaker 2: just doesn't happen unless you're in some kind of you know,

404
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:45,720
Speaker 2: conspiracy movie or some movie about I don't know, I'm

405
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Speaker 2: just it's just a seance in the White House feels

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Speaker 2: so wrong to me, and I think it's because of

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Speaker 2: how I've been programmed over the years. Yes, it seems

408
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Speaker 2: like a bron thing. You don't have a seance in

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Speaker 2: the White House. Yeah, it's unheard of, it's uncou and

410
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Speaker 2: maybe it's just because it feels The White House feels

411
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Speaker 2: like a country club to me or something where just

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00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:09,959
Speaker 2: only super wealthy people are allowed to go into. And

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Speaker 2: I don't know, super No, you guys don't like anything

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Speaker 2: I'm saying here.

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Speaker 6: I was talking about, no no, but that's true. But

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Speaker 6: also we know about a lot of these kind of

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Speaker 6: clandestine gatherings and you know, secret organizations Book and Snake

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Speaker 6: and all of that where the members you know, publicly

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Speaker 6: are very often evangelical at the very least, like good Christian,

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Speaker 6: patriotic Americans, but behind closed doors, all kinds of stuff

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Speaker 6: is on the table.

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Speaker 4: And I was always.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, we got your back man. Also, nol Matt

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Speaker 3: and I have been to the White House together. It's

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Speaker 3: a very weird place.

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Speaker 4: It's super weird.

427
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Speaker 6: Washington, d C. Is super weird. I just remember the

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Speaker 6: first time I went there. The people kind of some

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Speaker 6: people who are you know, likely not psychologically well and

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Speaker 6: are unhoused, et cetera. They have a very different vibe

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00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:03,560
Speaker 6: there than they do in another part of the country.

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Speaker 6: The kinds of things that they're you know, screaming from

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Speaker 6: the street corners, very conspiratorial, and there's just a certain

434
00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:11,960
Speaker 6: energy there that is very different than anywhere else I've.

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Speaker 2: Ever been to.

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Speaker 3: And before we continue here, let's set the stage. Let's

437
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:22,440
Speaker 3: get in front of the emails. Franklin Pierce is often

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Speaker 3: regarded as one of the not best US presidents, and

439
00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:30,080
Speaker 3: I think enough time has passed that historians have done

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Speaker 3: their bit. We can point out that folks like Teddy

441
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:41,400
Speaker 3: Roosevelt said mean things about former Potus Pierce. He said, specifically,

442
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:46,520
Speaker 3: quote Franklin Pierce is a servile tool of men, worse

443
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:50,440
Speaker 3: than himself ever ready to do any work. The oh

444
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:55,639
Speaker 3: geez slavery leaders set him. So this guy, like like

445
00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:59,920
Speaker 3: you're saying, Matt, he he's not president for a very

446
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 3: long time. He is also very much a product of

447
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:09,040
Speaker 3: his time. We're talking about the spiritualism movement, yeah, talking

448
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:14,800
Speaker 3: about the idea of science, addressing that great gnostic veil

449
00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:16,360
Speaker 3: that you're talking about.

450
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:17,960
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, exactly.

451
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:19,360
Speaker 4: And just.

452
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:23,560
Speaker 2: Did you give a minor backstory here. Franklin Pierce and

453
00:28:23,640 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 2: his wife Jane were on a box car. They had

454
00:28:27,359 --> 00:28:29,000
Speaker 2: their eleven year old son, I think he was eleven

455
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:30,919
Speaker 2: at the time. They had their young son with them

456
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 2: at the time. The boxcar overturned and the sun was

457
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:39,360
Speaker 2: crushed essentially horrifically. Both parents witnessed this and saw this,

458
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 2: and they, you know, Jane, just like right before the inauguration,

459
00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,240
Speaker 2: pretty soon before the inauguration, and then once they got

460
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 2: to the White House, they made attempts. I mean, they're

461
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 2: at the seat of power. If there is a way

462
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:58,320
Speaker 2: to contact your dead loved one, perhaps being in that place,

463
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:00,920
Speaker 2: maybe there's power to that right ending on your beliefs,

464
00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:04,880
Speaker 2: maybe there's power to holding that position in general. There

465
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 2: were numerous attempts made to contact this dead child, you know,

466
00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:13,920
Speaker 2: through various means and methods, and I think maybe just

467
00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 2: it's not something that I imagined would have ever.

468
00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 4: Happened, Matt. Was there a sense that you got.

469
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:24,440
Speaker 6: In looking into this, that maybe this type of thing

470
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 6: was seen as something that women would be more interested in,

471
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:33,840
Speaker 6: and that maybe, you know, the mother, this is something

472
00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:36,840
Speaker 6: that she wanted, but perhaps she was maybe being kind

473
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 6: of allowed to do it by her husband. I'm sorry,

474
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 6: I know that there were men that were interested in

475
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,120
Speaker 6: this stuff too. I'm just wondering if the historical context

476
00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:46,280
Speaker 6: is something to talk about, because I guess I think

477
00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:50,320
Speaker 6: of many of the folks, the practitioners of seances historically

478
00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:51,320
Speaker 6: being women.

479
00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:55,760
Speaker 2: Well, I can't really speak to that. I mean, there's

480
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:59,320
Speaker 2: lots you could get into with you know, think about

481
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:05,720
Speaker 2: historical depictions and thoughts on witchcraft and all that stuff,

482
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 2: getting long and show. Yeah, you just go way way.

483
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:12,600
Speaker 3: Back in society always seeks to show on women.

484
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, precisely. In this case, you're also talking about the

485
00:30:17,800 --> 00:30:20,719
Speaker 2: historical context of the Fox sisters who were alive, who

486
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 2: actually visited the White House to attempt to contact Jane's

487
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:25,680
Speaker 2: dead loved ones.

488
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:29,720
Speaker 3: So you know, to attempt to attempt to look like

489
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:31,920
Speaker 3: they were attempting to contact.

490
00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 2: I think, yes, that is correct then. But in the

491
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:37,800
Speaker 2: case of Jane, right, if you go to hint to

492
00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 2: her personal perspective, she believes that potentially they can, right.

493
00:30:42,160 --> 00:30:44,560
Speaker 2: So that's all occurring, and you know you can get

494
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 2: into other presidents and spouses as well. Mary Lincoln did

495
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 2: the same kinds of spiritual spiritualism, things like seances to

496
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 2: contact her dead children.

497
00:30:57,520 --> 00:30:59,640
Speaker 6: And you all might comment about this being maybe something

498
00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 6: that women and we're more interested and certainly not meant

499
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 6: to be dismissive in any way or gendering anything. It

500
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:06,960
Speaker 6: just was I think I wanted to take a minute

501
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,240
Speaker 6: to talk about exactly what you guys mentioned, which was

502
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 6: the context and the maybe gender roles and politics of

503
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:13,520
Speaker 6: the time.

504
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 3: Well, I would to that agreed. I would also call

505
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 3: our collective attention to our previous episode on the Screaming

506
00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:28,080
Speaker 3: Girls of Malaysia, right, remember that one. Look, I'm going

507
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 3: in a million directions here. It's amazing that I've never

508
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:34,800
Speaker 3: tried adderall. Can you guys imagine how insufferable I.

509
00:31:34,760 --> 00:31:38,840
Speaker 4: Would Be'd be like the Tasmanian devil, beIN jeez.

510
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:44,800
Speaker 3: To take bring it back, bring it back, taking.

511
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:47,280
Speaker 2: It back to the White House and Mary Lincoln there. Yeah,

512
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,560
Speaker 2: because there's a specific room in the White House called

513
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,880
Speaker 2: the Red Room, which already freaks me out. Sounds like

514
00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:56,600
Speaker 2: a place where you either get murdered or murder. It's

515
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:57,200
Speaker 2: a weird day.

516
00:31:57,720 --> 00:31:58,479
Speaker 4: It's a weird day.

517
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,280
Speaker 2: It was the Red Room as it was red and

518
00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:04,560
Speaker 2: has been designed red by various interior designers over the

519
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 2: years and redesign and redesign. I'm gonna share an image

520
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:09,480
Speaker 2: with you guys that I found on the White House

521
00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:13,520
Speaker 2: website of the Red Room of a particular time when

522
00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 2: it was redone. Uh And if you look at this

523
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:23,520
Speaker 2: image that I just said, it feels like an astrology room.

524
00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:27,280
Speaker 2: It's got stars all along the ceiling. The way the

525
00:32:27,320 --> 00:32:30,600
Speaker 2: red is laid out in that room, it feels as

526
00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 2: though you would go there and consult the stars. Sure,

527
00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:38,240
Speaker 2: this is this was a redesign after the time of

528
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 2: Mary Lincoln when she's in the in the white House's

529
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:45,560
Speaker 2: first Lady. After the time of Pierce, obviously, But this.

530
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:47,640
Speaker 6: Table in the middle on Matt would have been sort

531
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 6: of where this seance would have been conducted.

532
00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:52,560
Speaker 2: No, you could set the room up with the tables

533
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:56,040
Speaker 2: and chairs however you want, just because again this is

534
00:32:56,160 --> 00:32:59,480
Speaker 2: this is a redesign after those seances were got it,

535
00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:04,080
Speaker 2: got it, But that's just a show. The White House

536
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:07,800
Speaker 2: is a place where this kind of stuff can happen,

537
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 2: and has happened.

538
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 6: M but much more recently than that, right, Ben, This

539
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:17,000
Speaker 6: is the part of the episode that really blew my mind.

540
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 6: Like this era that you're talking about, Matt, it all

541
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:23,640
Speaker 6: makes sense. This stuff was trendy even, right, and it

542
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 6: would make sense this would be employed. But I would

543
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:29,240
Speaker 6: have thought this would have gone out the window in

544
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:32,000
Speaker 6: more modern times, not the case.

545
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 4: Out the red room window.

546
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:36,960
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, this is the one we were teasing

547
00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 3: as well, like we have built a pretty solid case

548
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 3: that astrology divination has always existed low key as a

549
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 3: part of US policy. Cast your memory back and not

550
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 3: to date anyone you know too far, but some of

551
00:33:56,120 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 3: us in the audience tonight might remember a fairly famous

552
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:06,240
Speaker 3: actor named Ronald Reagan, who is also you know, sort

553
00:34:06,280 --> 00:34:08,960
Speaker 3: of famous for a couple of other things, right.

554
00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:11,440
Speaker 4: A line of Western civilization.

555
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 3: Oh, it's trickling down Horse and sparrow. Look, we can

556
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:22,520
Speaker 3: learn about dictators a world away, and we can immediately

557
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:27,480
Speaker 3: exoticize or as you guys were saying, other their actions.

558
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:31,880
Speaker 3: Surely not us, obviously, we in America have our priority.

559
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:32,360
Speaker 4: Straight.

560
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:37,040
Speaker 3: Horoscopes are fun. But science, God's our civilization. I got

561
00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:38,879
Speaker 3: increasingly Texas on that one.

562
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:42,759
Speaker 2: And I'm sorry, guys, Okay, science or God and or

563
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:46,320
Speaker 2: both and or you know, it's just they're really closely linked.

564
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 4: Okay.

565
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:50,319
Speaker 3: So while it is still legal for us to talk

566
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:55,400
Speaker 3: about this on air, please remember, folks, the US White

567
00:34:55,440 --> 00:35:03,240
Speaker 3: House very recently was influenced by astrology. The Ronald Reagan

568
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:08,520
Speaker 3: administration had some stuff to deal with. And it gets

569
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,960
Speaker 3: a little confusing because one of our primary sources for

570
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:16,400
Speaker 3: this is a former chief of Staff for Ronald Reagan,

571
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 3: and his name is Don Reagan r E g A

572
00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:27,440
Speaker 3: n SO Reagan Reagan nominative determinism. I kind of think

573
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:28,640
Speaker 3: that's why I got the job.

574
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:35,320
Speaker 2: And there's a Yes, there's a series of I think three,

575
00:35:35,640 --> 00:35:39,319
Speaker 2: maybe even four books. They go over everything we're going

576
00:35:39,360 --> 00:35:42,680
Speaker 2: to be talking about from from this moment forward, where

577
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:46,000
Speaker 2: it's like the different perspectives of all the people involved,

578
00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:51,120
Speaker 2: and I think Don has one of them. I think, okay, yeah, yeah.

579
00:35:51,320 --> 00:35:55,560
Speaker 3: Don has a memoir called for the Record, From Wall

580
00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:58,680
Speaker 3: Street to the White House. Here's how he depicts the

581
00:35:58,719 --> 00:36:03,239
Speaker 3: interaction of ESTROLA with the Reagan administration. Now, Matt, you

582
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:08,000
Speaker 3: did an excellent job with Ben Franklin. I suggest or

583
00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:11,279
Speaker 3: I vote that we go to none other than Nol

584
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:18,520
Speaker 3: the Bagman Brown for a for a dramatic recreation of

585
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:21,680
Speaker 3: Don Reagan, a recreational recreation.

586
00:36:22,040 --> 00:36:24,279
Speaker 4: I'm going to do my best, Ben, to do my

587
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 4: duty and to God in my country, to impersonate Don Reagan.

588
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 6: And this is what he writes in For the Record,

589
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,879
Speaker 6: his memoir. As he said, Ben, virtually every major move

590
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:39,360
Speaker 6: and decision the Reagan's made during my time as White

591
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:42,520
Speaker 6: House Chief of staff was cleared in advance with this

592
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 6: woman in San Francisco who drew up horoscopes to make

593
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:50,920
Speaker 6: certain that the planets were in a favorable alignment for

594
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,640
Speaker 6: the enterprise, like the stars not the starship Enterprise, the

595
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:57,880
Speaker 6: enterprise of what the thing they were doing?

596
00:36:58,040 --> 00:36:58,239
Speaker 4: Right?

597
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:03,600
Speaker 3: Amazing, Andrews, Let's make sure we have applause cues.

598
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:05,680
Speaker 4: It was great.

599
00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:08,840
Speaker 2: You know what I got from? Then a little New York.

600
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:13,280
Speaker 4: That's my guy. That's my guy. There's no one better

601
00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:19,600
Speaker 4: to copy than the Barry. You shake your jowls with it.

602
00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:24,280
Speaker 3: Man, I like how San Francisco was five very angry syllables.

603
00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:25,120
Speaker 2: It was amazing.

604
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:26,840
Speaker 4: It was amazing.

605
00:37:27,360 --> 00:37:31,640
Speaker 3: Also, uh, our guy Don goes on to say he

606
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 3: is required by the President and the First Lady to

607
00:37:37,320 --> 00:37:41,440
Speaker 3: keep a color coded calendar on his desk. Like if

608
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:46,279
Speaker 3: you've ever seen a desk calendar? God, I'm dating myself here.

609
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:51,719
Speaker 3: He had these little like post its, essentially and highlighter

610
00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:57,560
Speaker 3: things where good days astrologically were highlighted in green and

611
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:02,440
Speaker 3: bad days were highlighted in red. If we go, If

612
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 3: we go to Jessica Weisberg, writing an excellent, relatively short

613
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:12,279
Speaker 3: article for The Paris Review in June twenty eighteen. We

614
00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:15,360
Speaker 3: can actually see the way this calendar is mapped out.

615
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:21,000
Speaker 2: From January sixteenth to the twenty third, very bad. January

616
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:25,000
Speaker 2: twentieth nothing outside the White House, possible attempt.

617
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:28,680
Speaker 3: Hey, Haye, point of order, Matt, I believe that just

618
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:33,760
Speaker 3: says nothing outside the wh could have been waffle house.

619
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:36,080
Speaker 4: Yeah, true, we just don't know. We don't know.

620
00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:39,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, but into history, stuff goes down inside the waffle

621
00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:41,480
Speaker 2: house all the time, So you've got to be careful

622
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 2: inside outside who knows of February twentieth through the twenty sixth,

623
00:38:46,320 --> 00:38:51,439
Speaker 2: be careful. March seventh through the fourteenth, bad period. March

624
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 2: tenth through fourteenth, no outside activity, March sixteenth, very bad.

625
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 4: What is this outside activity referring to a second time?

626
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:02,360
Speaker 4: We've seen that way with nothing outside the waffle house

627
00:39:02,520 --> 00:39:04,279
Speaker 4: and now no outside Actually.

628
00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:09,160
Speaker 2: It's referring to President Reagan's movements. Where can he go?

629
00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:14,719
Speaker 2: And because remember there was an attempt on his life, right,

630
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:18,919
Speaker 2: and that is one of the things that pushed all

631
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:19,239
Speaker 2: of this.

632
00:39:20,440 --> 00:39:23,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, the Hinckley situation, it was real.

633
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:25,840
Speaker 4: Hankykley was real Hinkley.

634
00:39:26,600 --> 00:39:30,800
Speaker 3: This is this list goes on and you will notice

635
00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:36,239
Speaker 3: astute conspiracy realist that there's never any note of a

636
00:39:36,320 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 3: positive day in this calendar. You know what I mean?

637
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:48,440
Speaker 3: You need an addabley of newspaper horoscopes. Yeah, tenth, March

638
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:53,280
Speaker 3: tenth to fourteenth, no outside activity, March sixteenth, very bad,

639
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:58,759
Speaker 3: March fifteenth the IDEs of March. By the way, why

640
00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:01,000
Speaker 3: is that not a good day? Or did they just

641
00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:02,279
Speaker 3: skip that part?

642
00:40:03,120 --> 00:40:07,280
Speaker 2: Who knows? I do. I can't remember if there's tarot

643
00:40:07,320 --> 00:40:11,600
Speaker 2: reading and other specific divination things occurring here, or if

644
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:15,480
Speaker 2: it is just an astrological chart that's being interpreted by somebody.

645
00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:17,480
Speaker 4: Ah, yeah, I.

646
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 2: Just I can't remember. In all the reporting, there is

647
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:24,399
Speaker 2: so much written about this, you guys that Yeah, well,

648
00:40:24,719 --> 00:40:27,960
Speaker 2: at least I personally had no idea it existed out there.

649
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:34,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, and in that kind of experience or surprise, our

650
00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:41,200
Speaker 3: buddy Don Reagan is he's super irritated, right Like he's

651
00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:44,440
Speaker 3: the chief of staff. That is a very stressful job,

652
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:50,200
Speaker 3: and he's asking himself continually, why can this one individual

653
00:40:50,560 --> 00:40:54,400
Speaker 3: who has never been elected, why can they hold such

654
00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:59,280
Speaker 3: influence over the day to day actions of the most

655
00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:03,919
Speaker 3: dangerous human being alive? Spoiler, The most dangerous human being

656
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:07,120
Speaker 3: alive is in recent history, always going to be the

657
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:07,960
Speaker 3: US president.

658
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,840
Speaker 4: This is very precient. Then the question that you just asked,

659
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:12,600
Speaker 4: it seems like we're going through something a little bit

660
00:41:12,640 --> 00:41:13,439
Speaker 4: similar right now.

661
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:20,080
Speaker 3: Weird ah, I mean, so, the most dangerous human being

662
00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:25,839
Speaker 3: un planet Earth is not like the dictators, the generals,

663
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:31,280
Speaker 3: the Lunda runners of Myanmar. They have a rotating staff

664
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:34,960
Speaker 3: of fortune tellers. They have like a think tank of

665
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:37,839
Speaker 3: people who tell you good and bad days. Check out

666
00:41:37,920 --> 00:41:42,319
Speaker 3: our earlier episode. In this case, the White House has

667
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:47,680
Speaker 3: just one astrologer, a little bit off the books, a

668
00:41:47,719 --> 00:41:50,239
Speaker 3: little bit on the books. We're gonna pause for a

669
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:53,080
Speaker 3: word from our sponsor, and we're gonna tell you about

670
00:41:53,120 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 3: this person from Nola. Can you say San Francisco again?

671
00:41:57,120 --> 00:41:59,120
Speaker 4: And San Francisco.

672
00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:25,520
Speaker 3: Her name is Joan Quickly. We've returned. Let's meet Joan Quickly.

673
00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:32,839
Speaker 3: Joan Quickly is from no Just one more time, let's

674
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:38,359
Speaker 3: just go. I love it all right. Joe Quickly is

675
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:41,760
Speaker 3: the closest you can get to old money out west,

676
00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:46,680
Speaker 3: out in San Francisco, the Quickly family. They own a

677
00:42:46,680 --> 00:42:50,520
Speaker 3: lot of hotels. We're telling you this not to judge

678
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 3: the person, just to let you know she's not hard up.

679
00:42:54,480 --> 00:42:55,200
Speaker 4: For money.

680
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:59,840
Speaker 3: She is a San Franciscan socialite, and she is not

681
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:06,480
Speaker 3: directly connected to Ronald Reagan, who will later become US

682
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:12,040
Speaker 3: President for a time. Instead, she's connected to a lady

683
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:17,640
Speaker 3: named Nancy Reagan, who later becomes the First Lady. And

684
00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:23,160
Speaker 3: we're gonna cut. We're gonna cut that parenthetical about our

685
00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:25,920
Speaker 3: sexual exploits. Let's keep that way.

686
00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:27,760
Speaker 2: Nancy's or Jones.

687
00:43:28,320 --> 00:43:28,840
Speaker 4: Nancy?

688
00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 2: Okay, wait Nancy? Yeah? Oh, I really thought it was

689
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:34,440
Speaker 2: gonna be Jones.

690
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:40,359
Speaker 3: We're keeping it in all right. Fine, So do you

691
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 3: guys remember MERV Griffin? Why do I sound so old?

692
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:44,279
Speaker 4: Yeah?

693
00:43:44,280 --> 00:43:46,000
Speaker 3: I was in this episode, you were there.

694
00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:51,000
Speaker 2: I'm aware of the name, and I don't know why

695
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:54,279
Speaker 2: I have salacious in my mind when I think of

696
00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:56,080
Speaker 2: MERV Griffin. But maybe it was just more of a

697
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:57,760
Speaker 2: talk show in the seventies.

698
00:43:57,840 --> 00:43:59,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was very popular talk show. No, it was

699
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:02,040
Speaker 4: earlier in the seventies when he.

700
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:02,959
Speaker 3: Was around for a while.

701
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:04,520
Speaker 4: He was school there.

702
00:44:04,600 --> 00:44:08,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, he he did have a talk show. He

703
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:14,200
Speaker 3: had a number of like TV hosting things, and in

704
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:20,680
Speaker 3: the early seventies nineteen seventies, he introduces Nancy Reagan and

705
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:28,080
Speaker 3: Joan quickly, and when he introduces them. Nancy Reagan and

706
00:44:28,200 --> 00:44:32,600
Speaker 3: Ronald Reagan are still like very much Hollywood exploring, you know,

707
00:44:32,719 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 3: the political scene, and quickly is a frequent guest on

708
00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:45,600
Speaker 3: MERV Griffin's talk show. So she, as a Republican, volunteers

709
00:44:45,800 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 3: to sort of lend her astrological expertise to the Reagan campaigns.

710
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:56,640
Speaker 3: He had an unsuccessful foray, as we remember in nineteen

711
00:44:56,719 --> 00:45:02,200
Speaker 3: seventy six, towards the presidency. She said, Joan quickly said

712
00:45:02,360 --> 00:45:04,719
Speaker 3: she knew it wouldn't work out. She saw it in

713
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 3: the stars. And then later, of course, he becomes president

714
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:12,480
Speaker 3: and people start calling him the Gipper.

715
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:15,560
Speaker 6: Yeah, win one for the Gipper because he was in

716
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:19,719
Speaker 6: a baseball related film, the name of which is Escaping Me,

717
00:45:19,840 --> 00:45:22,800
Speaker 6: and he's a spoiler alert I guess on his deathbed

718
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:26,080
Speaker 6: and someone speaking to him and he says, win one

719
00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:27,120
Speaker 6: for the Gipper.

720
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:31,120
Speaker 3: That's where it comes from. That's the etymology. Oh thank

721
00:45:31,160 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 3: you dude.

722
00:45:31,880 --> 00:45:34,759
Speaker 4: When he was an actor, yes, yeah, all right.

723
00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:41,040
Speaker 3: So early on, the Gipper catches some guff from political

724
00:45:41,080 --> 00:45:45,280
Speaker 3: opponents and from the media because people are saying he's

725
00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:52,480
Speaker 3: consulting astrologers. This is very much not nineteen eighties Republican America. Right,

726
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:54,520
Speaker 3: you're supposed to be on Wall Street. You're supposed to

727
00:45:54,600 --> 00:45:58,399
Speaker 3: be like doing their type of Black Monday murders kind

728
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:02,920
Speaker 3: of divination, right, reading stocks and trades and doing a

729
00:46:03,239 --> 00:46:04,839
Speaker 3: what do you call it futures.

730
00:46:05,160 --> 00:46:07,919
Speaker 2: Yeah, but if you're reading those stocks and trades, there's

731
00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:10,839
Speaker 2: a little section in the same publication that has your

732
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:15,000
Speaker 2: daily horoscope, and sometimes your eyes just glanced past it

733
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:17,560
Speaker 2: and you may take a thing or two in two account.

734
00:46:18,000 --> 00:46:20,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was drifted. I was drifted. I was looking

735
00:46:20,760 --> 00:46:24,200
Speaker 3: at Nasdak and then I, you know, I I I

736
00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:25,840
Speaker 3: saw some Taurus.

737
00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:28,560
Speaker 4: I don't know if that.

738
00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:34,720
Speaker 2: Were some Fords. Is that what we're talking about?

739
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:37,520
Speaker 3: Oh geez, as long as it's not a Honda Odyssey.

740
00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 6: Uh, I respectfully did not purchase out of respect for you.

741
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:45,680
Speaker 3: Ben, I appreciate that, you know, thank you for your service,

742
00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:47,479
Speaker 3: and of.

743
00:46:47,400 --> 00:46:49,359
Speaker 6: Course you know you're welcome out here for And by

744
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:52,320
Speaker 6: the way, the character that he's playing in that film

745
00:46:52,400 --> 00:46:57,319
Speaker 6: is not youre dame football player George Gipp. He is

746
00:46:57,440 --> 00:47:00,759
Speaker 6: at his deathbed speaking to uh the I think one

747
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:04,320
Speaker 6: of the main characters in the film, uh Knute Rockney.

748
00:47:04,719 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 6: When you see he requests that he win one for

749
00:47:07,600 --> 00:47:08,680
Speaker 6: the Gipper, just one.

750
00:47:08,719 --> 00:47:11,480
Speaker 3: He says, can you spell Canute for the gang?

751
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:13,720
Speaker 4: K n Ute?

752
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:17,879
Speaker 6: And the film is called Knute Rockney All American from

753
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 6: the year nineteen forty.

754
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:22,640
Speaker 3: That's the name of the film.

755
00:47:22,719 --> 00:47:26,840
Speaker 4: Yep, Canute Rockney All American nineteen forty. Maybe it's the

756
00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 4: K is silent, but I like I like Canute.

757
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:30,320
Speaker 3: It was a different time.

758
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 4: Geez.

759
00:47:31,480 --> 00:47:35,800
Speaker 3: Well, as you were saying earlier, they're met in nineteen eighty,

760
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 3: our buddy the Gipper publicly mentions that he checks out

761
00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:44,360
Speaker 3: his daily horoscope. And he's not being you know, a

762
00:47:44,440 --> 00:47:47,920
Speaker 3: demagogue about it. He's not telling everybody else that they

763
00:47:47,960 --> 00:47:51,680
Speaker 3: have to check their horoscopes. He essentially says what you

764
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:55,320
Speaker 3: said earlier, you know, Yeah, I read the paper sometimes

765
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:58,480
Speaker 3: I passed through a column, you know, and I'm like, hey,

766
00:47:58,520 --> 00:47:59,239
Speaker 3: what's up with me?

767
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:03,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, And then the Federation of American Scientists shines and

768
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:06,879
Speaker 2: he goes, oh, oh, really, well, how about this.

769
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:12,160
Speaker 3: They were so pissed, they were so pissed off they

770
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:15,160
Speaker 3: wrote a letter to the White House open letter, clear

771
00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:19,880
Speaker 3: pr character assassination thing, and they said.

772
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:24,040
Speaker 5: In our opinion, no person whose decisions are based even

773
00:48:24,080 --> 00:48:28,279
Speaker 5: in part on such evident fantasies can be trusted to

774
00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:32,759
Speaker 5: make the many serious and even life and death decisions

775
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 5: required of American President.

776
00:48:37,960 --> 00:48:39,919
Speaker 4: Deepid fingers and a silly laugh.

777
00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:43,879
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, they actually wrote out he he ha ha,

778
00:48:44,760 --> 00:48:45,319
Speaker 3: they really did.

779
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:50,000
Speaker 2: You got to take into account the weight of that position.

780
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:54,960
Speaker 2: And you know, we've talked before about that nuclear football situation,

781
00:48:55,120 --> 00:49:00,320
Speaker 2: that the president has those nukes at hand at all times.

782
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:03,920
Speaker 2: You don't want that person making decisions based on anything

783
00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:07,560
Speaker 2: but the best intelligence available, right, Which.

784
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 3: That's a great point because, Okay, as dumb as it sounds,

785
00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:18,440
Speaker 3: picture this be one day away, one horoscope column away

786
00:49:18,520 --> 00:49:23,040
Speaker 3: from nuclear disaster. That is the criticism and the concern

787
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:27,200
Speaker 3: levied by the Federation of American Scientists. They're saying, what

788
00:49:27,280 --> 00:49:31,600
Speaker 3: if the Gipper, right, God bless in shalah, whatever, what

789
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:35,600
Speaker 3: if the Gipper picks up the wrong column of the

790
00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:40,319
Speaker 3: wrong newspaper and reads something that says Russia is.

791
00:49:40,239 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 4: Coming after you? Well, isn't that a little hyperbolic? I mean,

792
00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:44,880
Speaker 4: it's super hyperbolic.

793
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:48,319
Speaker 6: Sect He was just kind of, you know, using it

794
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,560
Speaker 6: as a way to I don't know, man, like the

795
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:54,560
Speaker 6: way certain baseball players don't ever change their socks.

796
00:49:54,760 --> 00:49:57,200
Speaker 3: You know, dude, I am so caught up on like

797
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:02,120
Speaker 3: Balder's Gate three lore and Skyrim lore that it doesn't

798
00:50:02,160 --> 00:50:03,920
Speaker 3: inform my actions of the.

799
00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:05,120
Speaker 4: Real world one hundred percent.

800
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:08,440
Speaker 6: But it also, like you bring it up often, it

801
00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:13,000
Speaker 6: clearly is on your mind. It can't not have some

802
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:17,080
Speaker 6: effect on the way you think about the world. And

803
00:50:17,120 --> 00:50:18,879
Speaker 6: I'm just using that as an example, But I don't

804
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 6: know that to be true for you in particular. But

805
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:24,000
Speaker 6: I think, you know, much like a Bible passage or

806
00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:28,200
Speaker 6: any kind of aphorism, you can glean what you want

807
00:50:28,360 --> 00:50:32,200
Speaker 6: from these kind of small little pieces of writing. And

808
00:50:32,800 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 6: if it's something that works for you and it feels

809
00:50:34,600 --> 00:50:36,640
Speaker 6: like it's guiding your path in a positive.

810
00:50:36,239 --> 00:50:38,520
Speaker 4: Way, then by all means right.

811
00:50:38,920 --> 00:50:40,520
Speaker 6: But I certainly don't think he was going to be

812
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:44,920
Speaker 6: compelled to push the nuclear button by a horoscope again hyperbolic.

813
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:46,759
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, no, No, we have the same page, agreed, But

814
00:50:47,120 --> 00:50:50,160
Speaker 2: let's really paint the picture here. That's nineteen eighty Ronald

815
00:50:50,239 --> 00:50:53,760
Speaker 2: Reagan states that publicly, we already know that his spouse

816
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:57,759
Speaker 2: has direct connections to this Joan Quickly person Now. In

817
00:50:57,840 --> 00:51:01,839
Speaker 2: nineteen eighty one, the attempt on Reagan's life is made.

818
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:06,960
Speaker 2: Now all of that coincides, and the first Lady reaches

819
00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:10,839
Speaker 2: out directly to Joan quickly and says, Hey, we've got

820
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:13,200
Speaker 2: some stuff going on. Is there any way you can

821
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:18,319
Speaker 2: come on in some kind of you know, unofficial official

822
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:21,719
Speaker 2: capacity to help us figure things out up here and

823
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:23,000
Speaker 2: protect the president.

824
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:30,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, can we seek any potential hedge against a possible disaster?

825
00:51:30,920 --> 00:51:31,120
Speaker 4: Right?

826
00:51:32,200 --> 00:51:36,279
Speaker 3: Specifically, and this is referenced in multiple books that don't

827
00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:42,160
Speaker 3: always agree on their narratives. Specifically, the conversation goes the

828
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:47,240
Speaker 3: first Lady asked quickly, could you have told us about

829
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:51,799
Speaker 3: the assassination attempt? And Joan, quickly, by the way, with

830
00:51:51,880 --> 00:51:55,839
Speaker 3: the benefit of retrospect, says yeah, I could have.

831
00:51:56,800 --> 00:52:00,279
Speaker 6: But it's like, is it that much different than and

832
00:52:00,480 --> 00:52:03,440
Speaker 6: you know, the Russell targ situation, or like the idea

833
00:52:03,480 --> 00:52:08,360
Speaker 6: of CIA using remote viewing as a way of solving

834
00:52:08,400 --> 00:52:10,520
Speaker 6: crimes or finding hostages or what have you.

835
00:52:10,560 --> 00:52:11,600
Speaker 4: I mean, it's sort of.

836
00:52:11,600 --> 00:52:15,160
Speaker 6: Like whatever works, you know in a pinch, right. I

837
00:52:15,200 --> 00:52:17,480
Speaker 6: don't know, it just it seems very aligned with that.

838
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:19,440
Speaker 6: And I guess it's all about who's in charge as

839
00:52:19,440 --> 00:52:21,520
Speaker 6: to who sanctions this kind of stuff and then gives

840
00:52:21,560 --> 00:52:22,280
Speaker 6: it air.

841
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 3: Yes, beautiful. Let us also consider. Let us also consider

842
00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:34,279
Speaker 3: sort of the three card Monte of information management. Right,

843
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:35,720
Speaker 3: do we have radar?

844
00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:36,239
Speaker 2: No?

845
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:41,240
Speaker 3: People just eat carrots. That is the milieu in which

846
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:45,240
Speaker 3: this story occurs. So I would also add a little

847
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:49,479
Speaker 3: bit off the books, just between just between us and

848
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:53,520
Speaker 3: everyone listening and the NSA and five eyes, I would

849
00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:59,799
Speaker 3: just add that at this time big data aggregation and

850
00:53:00,120 --> 00:53:04,759
Speaker 3: agnostication is already occurring. We're in the nineteen eighties. We

851
00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:10,200
Speaker 3: are very very deeply invested in the idea of leveraging

852
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:14,400
Speaker 3: numbers to predict patterns. So there may be a little

853
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:19,359
Speaker 3: bit of embellishment to hide actual technology here. I don't

854
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:24,719
Speaker 3: think quickly nor the First Lady Reagan are aware of this.

855
00:53:25,080 --> 00:53:28,799
Speaker 3: It does sound by all accounts, it does sound like

856
00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:34,880
Speaker 3: the first Lady in particular, is quite traumatized by Hinckley

857
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:40,920
Speaker 3: almost killing her husband. Like, you know, picture the person

858
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:44,720
Speaker 3: you love most in the world. Picture that person almost dying.

859
00:53:45,200 --> 00:53:47,480
Speaker 3: What would you do to make sure they don't die?

860
00:53:47,719 --> 00:53:50,640
Speaker 3: It's a fair question. I'm sorry, I raised my voice.

861
00:53:51,560 --> 00:53:52,520
Speaker 4: It's okay. Started.

862
00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:56,359
Speaker 2: But so the situation they find themselves in, and this

863
00:53:56,480 --> 00:53:59,759
Speaker 2: is again the perspective changes a little bit depending on

864
00:53:59,760 --> 00:54:02,480
Speaker 2: who's memoir you're reading. You can read the memoirs of

865
00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:06,080
Speaker 2: Don Reagan. You can read the same types of stories

866
00:54:06,239 --> 00:54:09,560
Speaker 2: written by Nancy Reagan right her perspective from the whole thing.

867
00:54:09,760 --> 00:54:12,920
Speaker 2: You can read, you know, memoirs about Ronald Reagan and

868
00:54:12,920 --> 00:54:14,520
Speaker 2: what it states in there and how it's kind of

869
00:54:14,560 --> 00:54:17,400
Speaker 2: downplayed a little bit. Or you can read Joan Quigley's

870
00:54:17,600 --> 00:54:20,920
Speaker 2: memoir because she wrote one about her perspective too. But

871
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:25,160
Speaker 2: what we do find is that on a literal daily basis,

872
00:54:25,640 --> 00:54:28,439
Speaker 2: the first Lady Nancy Reagan is in communication with Joan

873
00:54:28,520 --> 00:54:34,000
Speaker 2: Quigley about the movements, the meetings, the places, the flights,

874
00:54:34,719 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 2: everything that Ronald Reagan is going to take. But she

875
00:54:38,239 --> 00:54:42,440
Speaker 2: Joan Quickly, is not in direct communication with President Reagan.

876
00:54:43,200 --> 00:54:46,879
Speaker 2: It's like it's almost like it is like those advisors, Right,

877
00:54:46,880 --> 00:54:49,400
Speaker 2: You've had a series of advisors. They're in the background

878
00:54:49,520 --> 00:54:52,080
Speaker 2: doing all this work and planning, and then it ends

879
00:54:52,160 --> 00:54:53,920
Speaker 2: up getting to the president and this is where you

880
00:54:53,960 --> 00:54:58,520
Speaker 2: need to go. And sometimes even this group of advisors

881
00:54:58,520 --> 00:55:02,359
Speaker 2: would make cancelations on major events and meetings that were

882
00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:06,319
Speaker 2: supposed to occur because of whatever astrological reading that Joan

883
00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:07,600
Speaker 2: Quickley was getting.

884
00:55:08,000 --> 00:55:12,200
Speaker 3: Right, which again the president, well, depending on the narrative,

885
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:16,160
Speaker 3: the President would say at this time that they did

886
00:55:16,200 --> 00:55:19,400
Speaker 3: not know right. I'm not in charge of the schedule.

887
00:55:19,560 --> 00:55:24,640
Speaker 3: I got people for that. You know, it's plausible deniability, right,

888
00:55:24,680 --> 00:55:30,160
Speaker 3: because you don't want to look like you are practicing magic,

889
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:35,680
Speaker 3: especially in the environment in which this occurs. And you're

890
00:55:35,760 --> 00:55:41,839
Speaker 3: absolutely correct. Quickly often stresses, and her story changes back

891
00:55:41,880 --> 00:55:46,120
Speaker 3: and forth, but she often stresses that she herself was

892
00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:51,719
Speaker 3: not directly connected with the potus, which reminds me a

893
00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:55,920
Speaker 3: little bit of a ron contra, But that's a different story. Instead,

894
00:55:56,160 --> 00:55:58,840
Speaker 3: she says, you guys like how I walk down the

895
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:03,000
Speaker 3: street for that one, just to tag around contra real quick. Instead,

896
00:56:03,560 --> 00:56:08,880
Speaker 3: she says, quickly says that she delved into the astrological

897
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:14,400
Speaker 3: reading of President Ronald Reagan, and then she would consult,

898
00:56:14,719 --> 00:56:19,719
Speaker 3: as we mentioned, on a semi professional basis paid position

899
00:56:20,160 --> 00:56:24,720
Speaker 3: with the first Lady, Nancy Reagan, and then Nancy Reagan

900
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:30,239
Speaker 3: would be the one who threw a proxy modified the

901
00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:36,720
Speaker 3: schedule to function in accordance with the stars. Sounds weird,

902
00:56:38,280 --> 00:56:38,800
Speaker 3: is true?

903
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:43,920
Speaker 2: It sounds super super weird. Gosh, man, I keep thinking

904
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:46,520
Speaker 2: about the quotes that I've seen from Joan. Some of

905
00:56:46,520 --> 00:56:49,640
Speaker 2: it's from her memoir, some of it's from like People Magazine,

906
00:56:49,680 --> 00:56:52,640
Speaker 2: some of it's from other places. You can see where

907
00:56:52,680 --> 00:56:55,560
Speaker 2: she almost boasts about it in a couple of places,

908
00:56:56,719 --> 00:57:00,520
Speaker 2: but then also super downplays it in other places. Yeah.

909
00:57:00,600 --> 00:57:05,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, She's talking with People Magazine in the late nineteen

910
00:57:05,760 --> 00:57:09,440
Speaker 3: nineties and she says, look, there are summits that are

911
00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:13,560
Speaker 3: arranged by the State Department and Reagan and some of

912
00:57:13,560 --> 00:57:16,360
Speaker 3: his staff. And she says, I had nothing to do

913
00:57:16,480 --> 00:57:22,520
Speaker 3: with the scheduling. I think people are over emphasizing my role. However,

914
00:57:22,840 --> 00:57:27,440
Speaker 3: when Don Reagan's book goes into the public eye, he

915
00:57:27,720 --> 00:57:30,920
Speaker 3: calls it, let's see who do we? Oh, Noel, you

916
00:57:30,960 --> 00:57:34,640
Speaker 3: did the Reagan voice earlier. Can you can't bless us

917
00:57:34,680 --> 00:57:39,120
Speaker 3: with bless us with some of the invections from our

918
00:57:39,160 --> 00:57:40,120
Speaker 3: buddy Don Reagan?

919
00:57:40,440 --> 00:57:42,480
Speaker 6: Of course I can't. I don't know if I I'll

920
00:57:42,520 --> 00:57:44,400
Speaker 6: do it the same. It's sort of a crap.

921
00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:48,440
Speaker 4: She will see the most closely guarded domestic secret of

922
00:57:48,480 --> 00:57:53,200
Speaker 4: the Reagan White House. Every major move and decisions the

923
00:57:53,240 --> 00:57:56,600
Speaker 4: Reagan's made during my time as the White House Chief

924
00:57:56,600 --> 00:57:59,840
Speaker 4: of Staff was cleared and advanced with a woman in

925
00:58:00,840 --> 00:58:05,400
Speaker 4: San Francisco who drew up horoscopes to make certain that

926
00:58:05,440 --> 00:58:08,280
Speaker 4: the planets were in a favorable alignment of the enterprise.

927
00:58:09,080 --> 00:58:12,720
Speaker 2: And remember that quote comes from his book in nineteen

928
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:15,920
Speaker 2: eighty eight. Now and the quote we just read from

929
00:58:16,040 --> 00:58:19,280
Speaker 2: Joan is almost ten years later, after all this has

930
00:58:19,280 --> 00:58:23,280
Speaker 2: happened in her memoir, kind of going against the stuff

931
00:58:23,320 --> 00:58:25,959
Speaker 2: that Dawn originally said in his book from nineteen eighty

932
00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:29,320
Speaker 2: eight came out in nineteen ninety. So it was this

933
00:58:29,440 --> 00:58:33,280
Speaker 2: whole like MERV Griffin show of a series of books.

934
00:58:33,720 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 4: The MERV Griffis Show. Am I right? That was really good? Yeah?

935
00:58:38,120 --> 00:58:38,680
Speaker 4: I like that?

936
00:58:39,600 --> 00:58:45,440
Speaker 3: So, yeah, you're absolutely right. Media insiders already knew well

937
00:58:45,720 --> 00:58:52,200
Speaker 3: the ties between astrology and Hollywood being we're saying, Hollywood

938
00:58:52,280 --> 00:58:58,560
Speaker 3: is sort of a metonymy for the US entertainment industry, right,

939
00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:02,920
Speaker 3: it's big soft power to play. And way before the

940
00:59:03,040 --> 00:59:07,840
Speaker 3: Gipper ever became the most dangerous human being on the planet,

941
00:59:08,240 --> 00:59:11,600
Speaker 3: he and his spouse, like anybody else who was cool

942
00:59:11,640 --> 00:59:17,000
Speaker 3: in Los Angeles, they openly consulted with astrologers. They probably

943
00:59:17,000 --> 00:59:20,040
Speaker 3: did yoga, you know, stuff like that, like the cool

944
00:59:20,120 --> 00:59:26,400
Speaker 3: celebrity thing. And they also spoke with folks like Carol

945
00:59:26,520 --> 00:59:32,480
Speaker 3: ryder R, I g hte R the most famous astrologer

946
00:59:32,680 --> 00:59:38,080
Speaker 3: for the stars. That's a redundant phrase to the stars, what.

947
00:59:38,040 --> 00:59:39,600
Speaker 4: They would have said in old Hollywood.

948
00:59:40,160 --> 00:59:44,000
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, the astrologer for the stars to the stars.

949
00:59:44,360 --> 00:59:48,160
Speaker 3: What a weird language. Anyway, this guy is nationally syndicated.

950
00:59:48,720 --> 00:59:51,640
Speaker 3: He's the one that you're hanging out with all the time.

951
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:55,680
Speaker 3: Sort of how like people who are celebrities will go

952
00:59:55,800 --> 00:59:59,880
Speaker 3: speak with our coworker Jay Shetty, right, or they'll talk

953
01:00:00,080 --> 01:00:03,320
Speaker 3: with Deepak Chopra or the Dolly Laba right.

954
01:00:03,560 --> 01:00:05,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, people love those guys.

955
01:00:05,280 --> 01:00:09,760
Speaker 3: It was just fashionable for Hollywood celebrities to shout out

956
01:00:09,800 --> 01:00:11,040
Speaker 3: their astrologers.

957
01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:14,960
Speaker 6: Well and now like especially maybe definitely still in Hollywood,

958
01:00:15,000 --> 01:00:15,240
Speaker 6: but it was.

959
01:00:15,320 --> 01:00:17,760
Speaker 4: I thought it was very well parodied.

960
01:00:17,800 --> 01:00:20,880
Speaker 6: I guess in the TV show Silicon Valley the idea

961
01:00:20,920 --> 01:00:23,880
Speaker 6: of mega mega high level executives to the kind of

962
01:00:23,880 --> 01:00:26,360
Speaker 6: point of this conversation, in a way, maybe things are shifting.

963
01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:30,640
Speaker 6: The Gavin Belston character, who is the you know, CEO

964
01:00:30,800 --> 01:00:32,760
Speaker 6: of Huli or whatever it was called. That was what

965
01:00:32,800 --> 01:00:36,080
Speaker 6: it was, sort of a Google esque Facebook kind of hybrid.

966
01:00:36,400 --> 01:00:38,000
Speaker 4: He had a guru that was.

967
01:00:38,000 --> 01:00:41,960
Speaker 6: Always around and was giving him, you know, business advice,

968
01:00:42,240 --> 01:00:44,560
Speaker 6: and I think that's parody kind of based on reality.

969
01:00:44,920 --> 01:00:47,880
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Spiritual advisors are a thing and have been

970
01:00:48,040 --> 01:00:50,480
Speaker 2: a thing always, right.

971
01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:55,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, Can I Matt, Matt? Can I ask or Noel

972
01:00:55,320 --> 01:00:55,920
Speaker 3: and Matt?

973
01:00:55,960 --> 01:00:56,360
Speaker 4: Of course?

974
01:00:56,440 --> 01:00:59,960
Speaker 3: And you listening at home? Can I get a spiritual advisor?

975
01:01:00,320 --> 01:01:02,600
Speaker 3: You guys know, I don't really have like, just.

976
01:01:02,840 --> 01:01:06,600
Speaker 4: Go on task, grab it. You'll find somebody my task,

977
01:01:06,600 --> 01:01:09,479
Speaker 4: grabb it, guru, drop the beat. This sounds like something

978
01:01:09,480 --> 01:01:10,320
Speaker 4: we could rap about.

979
01:01:11,080 --> 01:01:14,040
Speaker 2: But a shaman is a really popular thing right now.

980
01:01:14,160 --> 01:01:19,480
Speaker 4: To have a shaman like on a retainer. Yeah, like seriously,

981
01:01:19,840 --> 01:01:20,600
Speaker 4: all right.

982
01:01:21,040 --> 01:01:23,480
Speaker 3: Cool, we're gonna follow up on that one.

983
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:26,600
Speaker 2: Yeah. If they don't make you sit beneath a golden

984
01:01:26,640 --> 01:01:29,000
Speaker 2: pyramid for a lengthy period of time, they're not worth

985
01:01:29,040 --> 01:01:29,480
Speaker 2: your money.

986
01:01:29,960 --> 01:01:34,720
Speaker 3: Oh you know, Derek. Yeah, So, uh, we see the

987
01:01:34,840 --> 01:01:39,000
Speaker 3: narrative bifurcate right divide. We were talking about this earlier

988
01:01:39,080 --> 01:01:43,560
Speaker 3: and foreshadowing it during her career, both in and out

989
01:01:43,880 --> 01:01:49,360
Speaker 3: of Washington, d C. The First Lady consistently portrays her

990
01:01:49,560 --> 01:01:53,960
Speaker 3: interest in astrology as sort of a harmless hobby, a

991
01:01:54,040 --> 01:01:58,200
Speaker 3: matter of personal fascination, right, Yeah.

992
01:01:57,960 --> 01:02:02,520
Speaker 4: In fact, John quickly mayins that she preferred secrecy to

993
01:02:02,560 --> 01:02:06,040
Speaker 4: be out of the public eye and as a self

994
01:02:06,080 --> 01:02:09,160
Speaker 4: proclaimed patriot and a friend to the first Lady, she

995
01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:12,920
Speaker 4: didn't really go out for you know, notoriety. You know,

996
01:02:13,120 --> 01:02:16,400
Speaker 4: she wasn't seeking the limelight. She sort of shied away

997
01:02:16,440 --> 01:02:22,520
Speaker 4: from public attention for these consultations, so show she claimed, Yeah.

998
01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:24,200
Speaker 2: If you go back to the eighteen hundreds as well,

999
01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:29,840
Speaker 2: this there is a tradition of spiritual advisors like this,

1000
01:02:30,240 --> 01:02:34,640
Speaker 2: you know who who tend towards the spiritualism side, to

1001
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:37,600
Speaker 2: be led into the White House on a frequent basis

1002
01:02:37,680 --> 01:02:41,720
Speaker 2: to be an important part of you know, daily life

1003
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:45,880
Speaker 2: and some of the decisions about scheduling. But those human beings,

1004
01:02:45,880 --> 01:02:49,720
Speaker 2: those individuals would often be let in through the South entrance,

1005
01:02:50,240 --> 01:02:53,360
Speaker 2: you know, or through the East wing or the West wing,

1006
01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:56,240
Speaker 2: a specific place where you can get past security and

1007
01:02:56,280 --> 01:02:58,040
Speaker 2: you don't have to sign the logbook in the same

1008
01:02:58,040 --> 01:03:01,680
Speaker 2: way if you're ushered in with somebody. It's again, it's

1009
01:03:01,720 --> 01:03:05,360
Speaker 2: interesting that it's been kept such a secretive thing over

1010
01:03:05,560 --> 01:03:07,720
Speaker 2: the course of you know, one hundred something years.

1011
01:03:07,760 --> 01:03:11,720
Speaker 6: Well, and Joan didn't take kindly to maybe the revisionist

1012
01:03:11,840 --> 01:03:14,720
Speaker 6: history of the way she was talked about after the fact,

1013
01:03:14,800 --> 01:03:17,680
Speaker 6: when this relationship kind of became a little more known

1014
01:03:17,920 --> 01:03:20,640
Speaker 6: to the public and especially to biographers, et cetera.

1015
01:03:21,280 --> 01:03:25,240
Speaker 3: Yeah again, she does not need money, She does not

1016
01:03:25,440 --> 01:03:32,080
Speaker 3: need financial support. This is a personal blow. The statements

1017
01:03:32,120 --> 01:03:35,080
Speaker 3: of the First Lady former First Lady at this point,

1018
01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:41,120
Speaker 3: they sour the relationship between Quickly and Reagan, and it

1019
01:03:41,200 --> 01:03:44,200
Speaker 3: sounds like she was hoping Quickly, I mean, was hoping

1020
01:03:44,320 --> 01:03:47,480
Speaker 3: for some sort of public.

1021
01:03:47,240 --> 01:03:52,640
Speaker 6: Acknowledge validation event like right again, this might mainstream something

1022
01:03:52,640 --> 01:03:56,000
Speaker 6: that she was very passionate about and believed in very deeply.

1023
01:03:56,680 --> 01:04:01,120
Speaker 3: Here's what pis Quickly off. In nineteen eighty nine, Nancy

1024
01:04:01,200 --> 01:04:05,919
Speaker 3: Reagan has her memoir My Turn Good Name.

1025
01:04:06,080 --> 01:04:09,439
Speaker 2: Honestly, Well, it's a direct response to for the record.

1026
01:04:09,640 --> 01:04:13,280
Speaker 3: Right from Dawn right, and that's that's why it's a

1027
01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:18,920
Speaker 3: good name. And so Nancy Reagan says, astrology was simply

1028
01:04:19,000 --> 01:04:21,280
Speaker 3: one of the ways I coped with the fear I

1029
01:04:21,360 --> 01:04:26,560
Speaker 3: felt after my husband almost died. Understandable, she continues my

1030
01:04:26,720 --> 01:04:30,760
Speaker 3: relationship with Joan, that being Joan Quickly the astrologer began

1031
01:04:30,840 --> 01:04:34,040
Speaker 3: as a crutch one of several ways I tried to

1032
01:04:34,120 --> 01:04:39,000
Speaker 3: alleviate my concern about Ronnie. It's a passing fancy, right, right,

1033
01:04:39,080 --> 01:04:44,600
Speaker 3: a harmless hobby. Joan quickly, you guys, is super pissed off.

1034
01:04:44,680 --> 01:04:49,360
Speaker 3: She is offended. She is like, imagine that you have

1035
01:04:49,680 --> 01:04:54,320
Speaker 3: ever encountered some sort of human interaction where you think

1036
01:04:54,360 --> 01:04:58,440
Speaker 3: you're deeper in a friendship than your partner does.

1037
01:04:58,360 --> 01:05:03,080
Speaker 6: Well, righteously indignant, perhaps because she believed that this relationship

1038
01:05:03,160 --> 01:05:06,720
Speaker 6: was based on a mutual admiration and respect. And she

1039
01:05:06,880 --> 01:05:10,440
Speaker 6: goes on in her own memoir, what does Jones say

1040
01:05:11,040 --> 01:05:14,520
Speaker 6: in nineteen ninety to describe just that, and how this

1041
01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:17,160
Speaker 6: was not just a relationship between her and the first lady,

1042
01:05:17,160 --> 01:05:20,320
Speaker 6: It was very much a relationship between her and the president,

1043
01:05:20,400 --> 01:05:22,880
Speaker 6: who would again, according to her, this is a bit

1044
01:05:22,880 --> 01:05:26,360
Speaker 6: of a she said, she said, he said, memoir off.

1045
01:05:26,680 --> 01:05:30,320
Speaker 6: But she did claim that she was very frequently consulted

1046
01:05:30,360 --> 01:05:32,440
Speaker 6: by the president. That's where the title comes from, because

1047
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:35,360
Speaker 6: the President would, according to her, ask what does Jones

1048
01:05:35,400 --> 01:05:37,880
Speaker 6: say in terms of when a call would be scheduled

1049
01:05:37,880 --> 01:05:39,440
Speaker 6: her whether to take a meeting or not?

1050
01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:44,040
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, and that is that is President Reagan speaking

1051
01:05:44,080 --> 01:05:47,880
Speaker 2: to his spouse, right, That is not President Reagan calling

1052
01:05:47,960 --> 01:05:49,160
Speaker 2: Joan and saying, hey.

1053
01:05:49,040 --> 01:05:53,160
Speaker 6: No, no, but still he's putting credence in this stuff. It's

1054
01:05:53,360 --> 01:05:54,880
Speaker 6: almost like he believes.

1055
01:05:54,480 --> 01:05:57,000
Speaker 4: It more than just as much, if not maybe more

1056
01:05:57,040 --> 01:05:57,840
Speaker 4: than the first lady.

1057
01:05:58,880 --> 01:06:03,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, and Quick says. This is where Quigley's story changes.

1058
01:06:04,240 --> 01:06:08,480
Speaker 3: She argues, despite her earlier statements downplaying her role, she

1059
01:06:08,720 --> 01:06:15,880
Speaker 3: argues that she did assist with mission critical trade negotiations,

1060
01:06:15,920 --> 01:06:20,480
Speaker 3: She made sure that public addresses went well. She helped

1061
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:24,680
Speaker 3: save the president's life. That is the argument, make no mistake,

1062
01:06:25,120 --> 01:06:29,200
Speaker 3: and she also says that she saw the betrayal coming.

1063
01:06:29,400 --> 01:06:33,360
Speaker 3: In later statements, she writes, struggle has been in my charts.

1064
01:06:33,640 --> 01:06:38,400
Speaker 3: I expect no gratitude from the Reagans, and it's her

1065
01:06:38,560 --> 01:06:44,040
Speaker 3: duty as an astrologer and an American patriot to hold

1066
01:06:44,080 --> 01:06:47,800
Speaker 3: the course right, to stay steady. But it still doesn't

1067
01:06:47,880 --> 01:06:50,840
Speaker 3: lessen the pain of the betrayal. I have to ask,

1068
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:54,240
Speaker 3: what do you guys think? You know, do you think

1069
01:06:54,280 --> 01:06:56,560
Speaker 3: an astrologer saved Reagan?

1070
01:06:57,200 --> 01:06:59,040
Speaker 6: I don't know, man, I just think that whenever it

1071
01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:02,480
Speaker 6: comes to memoir, there's there's a lot of revisionist history

1072
01:07:02,520 --> 01:07:05,200
Speaker 6: on all sides, you know, and the fact that that

1073
01:07:05,320 --> 01:07:09,400
Speaker 6: quickly sort of course corrected, you know, after the fact,

1074
01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:11,920
Speaker 6: and sort of just wanted to claim more credit than

1075
01:07:11,960 --> 01:07:15,160
Speaker 6: she ever had wanted to, you know in the first place.

1076
01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:18,920
Speaker 4: It just makes it not quite ring true. But I

1077
01:07:18,920 --> 01:07:19,320
Speaker 4: don't know.

1078
01:07:20,120 --> 01:07:23,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, can you real quick question, can you make sure

1079
01:07:24,040 --> 01:07:29,680
Speaker 3: to describe Matt and Matt myself as sexual dynamos?

1080
01:07:29,760 --> 01:07:33,600
Speaker 4: Of course I always do. Just just talk about our

1081
01:07:34,040 --> 01:07:36,680
Speaker 4: regular were very handsome boys, and I always say that

1082
01:07:36,720 --> 01:07:38,920
Speaker 4: to anyone who will who will have me, And it's

1083
01:07:38,920 --> 01:07:40,200
Speaker 4: definitely going in the memoir.

1084
01:07:42,160 --> 01:07:45,520
Speaker 2: Imagine being in that position though. There are two huge

1085
01:07:45,640 --> 01:07:49,120
Speaker 2: selling memoirs that come out where you are talked.

1086
01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:53,800
Speaker 3: About you were raw dogged like you are a drug

1087
01:07:54,400 --> 01:07:58,280
Speaker 3: drigging that's a word. Yeah, yeah, it is. You're you're

1088
01:07:58,280 --> 01:07:59,760
Speaker 3: onto something there, Matt.

1089
01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:06,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, getting ragged around in these old memoirs. Yeah, It's

1090
01:08:06,200 --> 01:08:08,480
Speaker 2: just it's a weird situation and it's very strange, and

1091
01:08:08,520 --> 01:08:11,800
Speaker 2: it does make me wonder just how little we know

1092
01:08:11,880 --> 01:08:15,480
Speaker 2: about other spiritual advisors that have held, you know, some

1093
01:08:15,560 --> 01:08:18,400
Speaker 2: kind of place in the upper echelons of the White

1094
01:08:18,400 --> 01:08:21,439
Speaker 2: House or maybe even in the Senate right where it's

1095
01:08:21,479 --> 01:08:26,679
Speaker 2: just who else has this elected official's ear that has

1096
01:08:26,760 --> 01:08:29,800
Speaker 2: a lot of influence on them that maybe coming from

1097
01:08:30,120 --> 01:08:34,000
Speaker 2: no matter what religion, It's just it does make me

1098
01:08:34,040 --> 01:08:37,840
Speaker 2: wonder like what Obama's get get at us? Who were

1099
01:08:37,840 --> 01:08:39,080
Speaker 2: your spiritual advisors?

1100
01:08:39,280 --> 01:08:39,479
Speaker 4: Well?

1101
01:08:39,640 --> 01:08:42,360
Speaker 6: I mean, you know, it's also I think it begs

1102
01:08:42,360 --> 01:08:47,000
Speaker 6: the question of just in general, like how a non

1103
01:08:47,040 --> 01:08:53,360
Speaker 6: elected person hanging around whispering in ears is inherently a

1104
01:08:53,360 --> 01:08:56,080
Speaker 6: little problematic. And I was, you know, being a little

1105
01:08:56,160 --> 01:08:59,280
Speaker 6: choy earlier just talking about the Elon Musk situation. He's

1106
01:08:59,320 --> 01:09:03,559
Speaker 6: not a side scientist, he's not an expert in his field.

1107
01:09:03,760 --> 01:09:06,639
Speaker 6: He's not even necessarily a programmer. I mean, he's got

1108
01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:09,920
Speaker 6: these this gang of young upstarts to do.

1109
01:09:09,880 --> 01:09:12,439
Speaker 4: All that stuff for him out big balls, big balls.

1110
01:09:12,520 --> 01:09:15,360
Speaker 6: But what I'm saying is like, what makes him in

1111
01:09:15,560 --> 01:09:18,680
Speaker 6: any different than a spiritual advisor in the capacity that

1112
01:09:18,720 --> 01:09:19,920
Speaker 6: he's acting right now?

1113
01:09:20,800 --> 01:09:21,040
Speaker 3: Yeah?

1114
01:09:21,240 --> 01:09:24,679
Speaker 4: Is AI or religion? Well, we certainly could get there.

1115
01:09:25,080 --> 01:09:27,479
Speaker 6: I just mean, can you imagine this seems like the

1116
01:09:27,520 --> 01:09:29,200
Speaker 6: kind of thing you'd see in a video game where

1117
01:09:29,200 --> 01:09:32,080
Speaker 6: it's like, you know, the cults that would emerge around worshiping,

1118
01:09:32,400 --> 01:09:34,880
Speaker 6: you know, artificial intelligence people.

1119
01:09:35,000 --> 01:09:37,759
Speaker 3: Look, I've known a lot of people not the flex

1120
01:09:38,280 --> 01:09:40,639
Speaker 3: they'll worship anything more than seven.

1121
01:09:42,439 --> 01:09:44,519
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm sorry, but.

1122
01:09:44,479 --> 01:09:46,800
Speaker 6: I mean the idea, can you, especially with things like

1123
01:09:47,320 --> 01:09:49,840
Speaker 6: the what was it the basilisk experiment? Not to get

1124
01:09:49,840 --> 01:09:53,160
Speaker 6: too off course here, but just the idea of maybe

1125
01:09:53,760 --> 01:09:59,080
Speaker 6: being deferential to our fut potential future artificial intelligence slash

1126
01:09:59,200 --> 01:10:01,400
Speaker 6: robot overlord. I could definitely see.

1127
01:10:01,160 --> 01:10:01,760
Speaker 4: That kind of thing.

1128
01:10:02,160 --> 01:10:04,640
Speaker 3: I can't even discuss this because I feel like the

1129
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:08,240
Speaker 3: term artificial intelligence is inherently philosophically.

1130
01:10:08,560 --> 01:10:10,920
Speaker 6: Of course, of course it is, but I'm just saying

1131
01:10:11,439 --> 01:10:14,519
Speaker 6: I agree with you that it could very well fill

1132
01:10:14,560 --> 01:10:15,920
Speaker 6: that kind of religious space.

1133
01:10:15,960 --> 01:10:18,559
Speaker 3: I know we are going, of course, a little bit perfect.

1134
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:20,599
Speaker 4: It's very interesting. This is perfect.

1135
01:10:20,720 --> 01:10:23,000
Speaker 3: We don't have time to get into it tonight. But

1136
01:10:24,479 --> 01:10:28,639
Speaker 3: I sent us in our research for this, I sent

1137
01:10:28,760 --> 01:10:35,240
Speaker 3: us my unethical theory on how we could possibly prove

1138
01:10:35,320 --> 01:10:41,480
Speaker 3: the existence or scientific basis if such exist for astrology. Spoiler,

1139
01:10:41,520 --> 01:10:44,280
Speaker 3: We're not going to do it on air because it

1140
01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:48,080
Speaker 3: is a step by step pretty unclean thing to figuring

1141
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:51,000
Speaker 3: out the answer, and I sent it to you guys.

1142
01:10:51,840 --> 01:10:55,960
Speaker 3: We can talk about it offline. What we're looking at

1143
01:10:56,000 --> 01:11:03,080
Speaker 3: now is the following. Have the these conversations with unelected

1144
01:11:03,720 --> 01:11:09,960
Speaker 3: astrological experts, have they reached true results, Like, how do

1145
01:11:10,000 --> 01:11:14,000
Speaker 3: we measure that? Is there something to the story. The

1146
01:11:14,160 --> 01:11:19,200
Speaker 3: choice really depends on your perspective, and like everybody else listening,

1147
01:11:19,680 --> 01:11:24,360
Speaker 3: we're an audience of the stars that we're here before

1148
01:11:24,400 --> 01:11:27,160
Speaker 3: you got here and are going to be around after

1149
01:11:27,160 --> 01:11:29,880
Speaker 3: you're gone. Not to be a bummer about it, but

1150
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:33,000
Speaker 3: it's one of the constant things humans can look at

1151
01:11:33,520 --> 01:11:37,639
Speaker 3: as the attempt to glean meaning out there in the ink.

1152
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:44,599
Speaker 3: So the question is there something astrology can teach the humans,

1153
01:11:46,640 --> 01:11:49,120
Speaker 3: and if so, what we'd love to hear from you

1154
01:11:49,400 --> 01:11:52,080
Speaker 3: before we get into too much trouble.

1155
01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:55,200
Speaker 6: We do try to make it easy for you to

1156
01:11:55,320 --> 01:11:58,439
Speaker 6: find us all over the internet on your social media

1157
01:11:58,439 --> 01:12:00,240
Speaker 6: platform of choice if you wish you can. Is it

1158
01:12:00,280 --> 01:12:01,400
Speaker 6: the handle Conspiracy Stuff.

1159
01:12:01,439 --> 01:12:05,120
Speaker 4: We exist on xfka, Twitter, on YouTube or we have

1160
01:12:05,240 --> 01:12:09,479
Speaker 4: video content for your enjoyment as well as on Facebook.

1161
01:12:09,520 --> 01:12:09,960
Speaker 3: We have our.

1162
01:12:09,840 --> 01:12:13,000
Speaker 4: Facebook group Here's where it gets Crazy, on Instagram and

1163
01:12:13,080 --> 01:12:15,759
Speaker 4: tiktoc we are Conspiracy Stuff Show.

1164
01:12:17,520 --> 01:12:20,120
Speaker 2: We also have a phone number. That number is one

1165
01:12:20,240 --> 01:12:25,360
Speaker 2: eight three three st d WYTK. Call in and tell

1166
01:12:25,439 --> 01:12:28,479
Speaker 2: us why you think it is that all four human

1167
01:12:28,560 --> 01:12:32,040
Speaker 2: beings on this recording session right now are leos, How

1168
01:12:32,080 --> 01:12:35,240
Speaker 2: did that happen? What stars aligned? What do you think?

1169
01:12:35,720 --> 01:12:37,600
Speaker 2: Give yourself a cool nickname and let us know in

1170
01:12:37,640 --> 01:12:39,479
Speaker 2: the message if we can use your name and message

1171
01:12:39,520 --> 01:12:41,120
Speaker 2: on the air. If you've got more to say than

1172
01:12:41,200 --> 01:12:43,320
Speaker 2: can fit in a three minute voicemail, why not instead

1173
01:12:43,400 --> 01:12:45,559
Speaker 2: send us a good old fashioned email. We are.

1174
01:12:46,960 --> 01:12:50,400
Speaker 3: Zero one one zero zero zero one one zero zero

1175
01:12:50,560 --> 01:13:14,840
Speaker 3: one one zero praise conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1176
01:13:15,000 --> 01:13:17,080
Speaker 2: Stuff they Don't want you to Know is a production

1177
01:13:17,160 --> 01:13:21,719
Speaker 2: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1178
01:13:21,800 --> 01:13:24,639
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.