Speaker 1: Episode three seventy four, How to Change your Money Mindset
Speaker 1: with Paco Deli On.
Speaker 2: Welcome to the Brugal Friends podcast, where you'll learn to
Speaker 2: save money, embrace simplicity, and liver your life. Here your
Speaker 2: hosts Jen and Jill.
Speaker 1: Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast. My name is Jen,
Speaker 1: my name is Jill, and we are sharing with you
Speaker 1: a fantastic interview today with Paco deli On about, yes,
Speaker 1: changing your money mindset, but like so much about how
Speaker 1: we can still stick with our financial goals, still stick
Speaker 1: with frugality, even through things that we cannot control, things
Speaker 1: that would normally have us quote unquote falling off the wagon.
Speaker 1: How do we work through those things and stick with this?
Speaker 1: And so this is a fantastic interview.
Speaker 3: I'm still all riled up because we're recording this now
Speaker 3: after having talked with Paco, and I think the way
Speaker 3: that they describe this concept and break it down and
Speaker 3: give us new insight even on things that you and
Speaker 3: I Jen have talked about for so long, but giving
Speaker 3: different ways of thinking about it is so helpful for me.
Speaker 3: I gotta imagine it's going to be helpful for you
Speaker 3: and the listener. So glad you're here. But first, this
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Speaker 1: All right, So we in the front letter did a
Speaker 1: poll for y'all and about talking about what are the
Speaker 1: money how do you view your money mindset?
Speaker 4: Uh?
Speaker 1: And a lot of you were not didn't have a
Speaker 1: great view about it. So I just want to go
Speaker 1: through and look a little bit into your answers. So
Speaker 1: most of you said it was decent or that meth
Speaker 1: there's room for improvement, so you're focus. I think you're
Speaker 1: focused on the mindset, but not a lot of people
Speaker 1: said it was great. So we are going to work
Speaker 1: off of that and say, like, how can what's the
Speaker 1: little things that we can do to improve get it
Speaker 1: from decent to the best, and we know all you
Speaker 1: people that say the best it's been, thank you for
Speaker 1: listening to for a go frond so and then if
Speaker 1: it's met, how do we get it to decent?
Speaker 3: And I think even defining some of what those metrics are,
Speaker 3: how do I even know if my money mindset is
Speaker 3: stellar or if it's not great? And I think some
Speaker 3: of that is even going to be covered in this
Speaker 3: conversation with Paco. And again side note, if you want
Speaker 3: to be a part of these polls that help inform
Speaker 3: these podcast episodes, get the front letter for friendspodcast dot com.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so some of your some of your responses to
Speaker 1: the poll was like, it's been tough to pass up
Speaker 1: all the good after Christmas deals, which is something that's
Speaker 1: like a deal is so hard to pass up, especially
Speaker 1: for a frugal person, because it puts that scarcity in
Speaker 1: there right like it's timely. We need to you know,
Speaker 1: this is the most money I'll ever say I need
Speaker 1: to get this deal, which we know logically is wrong,
Speaker 1: but we still give into. And then we had another
Speaker 1: person say I need to be in quote unquote earning mode.
Speaker 1: So you know, something that happened that whacked my life,
Speaker 1: and then now I feel like I just have to
Speaker 1: take every everything it took out my emergency fund, and
Speaker 1: now I have to do everything to earn money to
Speaker 1: get it back instead of just realizing like it will come,
Speaker 1: it will come. But this person got back on the
Speaker 1: right track four days ago, hopefully.
Speaker 4: Listening to Frugal Friend.
Speaker 1: Yeah so yeah, so definitely get the front letter because
Speaker 1: we use your responses to kind of tailor our interviews
Speaker 1: and our episodes. So if mindset is something you're intoted
Speaker 1: in listening more of, maybe you said you had like
Speaker 1: a meh mindset. Episode three thirty seven How to Adopt
Speaker 1: a Frugal Mindset, and episode two forty four how to
Speaker 1: Improve your Money Mindset. Those are are going to be
Speaker 1: all about mindset. But all three, those two and this
Speaker 1: one all different, all worth listening to. So let's get
Speaker 1: into it with Poco. Paco's and I is an author illustrator.
Speaker 1: Her book is Finance for the People. They're the host
Speaker 1: of Weird Finance and the founder of the hell Yah Group,
Speaker 1: a financial firm dedicated to inspiring creatives to engage with
Speaker 1: their personal and business finances. Also a bookkeeper, she has
Speaker 1: a bookkeeping agency for creative businesses. So she is a
Speaker 1: ted X speaker. She's been featured in The New York Times, Blueberg, Time,
Speaker 1: and NPR. So we were so excited that she had
Speaker 1: some time to spend with us today and we hope
Speaker 1: you enjoy the conversation as much as we did. Let's
Speaker 1: do it, Paco, Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast. We're
Speaker 1: excited to continue this conversation because we were just on
Speaker 1: your show and we're literally heading right into this interview.
Speaker 1: So we've just been like talking for an hour and yeah,
Speaker 1: we're just like down at coffee just hanging out.
Speaker 5: Still, thank you for having me. I feel like I'm
Speaker 5: a frugal friend now, so I'm really excited to keep chatting.
Speaker 4: Yes, welcome, Paco.
Speaker 3: That was one of the things we talked about in
Speaker 3: your episode, which we should probably link to in our
Speaker 3: show notes so people can hear that conversation because it
Speaker 3: will be different from this conversation, but through that you
Speaker 3: learned you were frugal and we're here for it.
Speaker 4: Yes, I love it.
Speaker 5: It's kind of like when you take an online test
Speaker 5: or you're like do I have ADHD or something, and
Speaker 5: then you start to look up the symptoms and you're like, oh,
Speaker 5: I think you're describing me. That's exactly what it was like.
Speaker 5: I was like, you know, I like fancy vacations and
Speaker 5: nice hotel room and quality things, and I like spending
Speaker 5: money and I like making money. I'm not frugal. And
Speaker 5: then we went through the misconceptions. I guess I'm just
Speaker 5: doing it how I do it, but I am, but
Speaker 5: I'm still very much you know, I think about where
Speaker 5: my money goes, how it has a larger impact on
Speaker 5: the world, and I just try to do the right thing.
Speaker 3: That's that's the best diagnosis. I think if you're gonna
Speaker 3: web MD that thing coming out with a frugality answer
Speaker 3: is great.
Speaker 1: I would not take any of our other diagnoses seriously,
Speaker 1: but that one I would take to the bank that you, yeah,
Speaker 1: diagnose you with frugal. So we want to talk about
Speaker 1: an assortment of things today, But I think first I
Speaker 1: kind of want to start out with you have you
Speaker 1: talk a lot, like in your work, with not as
Speaker 1: much about like do this do that, but like getting
Speaker 1: down to people's like money mindsets and like why they
Speaker 1: do this and that, So like what what kind of
Speaker 1: makes up somebody's mindset and gets them to do what
Speaker 1: they do financially.
Speaker 5: So the way that I think about money mindset is
Speaker 5: it's kind of like having a song stuck in your head.
Speaker 5: You know, you'll hear a song, You'll hear the hook
Speaker 5: and you're like, that's a catchy hook, and then you'll
Speaker 5: be washing the dishes and the song will be playing.
Speaker 5: You'll be doing the laundry and the song will be playing.
Speaker 5: You're just like walking down the street and you hear
Speaker 5: the song. And a lot of our money mindsets are
Speaker 5: like this song, where it's like, how did that song
Speaker 5: even get in there?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 5: We weren't. Oftentimes we're not like seeking it out. We're
Speaker 5: not like today, I really want to never stop hearing
Speaker 5: Justin Bieber in my head. It's not something we're seeking out.
Speaker 5: It just happens. And that's also what happens with our
Speaker 5: money mindsets. We pick up these songs, these phrases, these
Speaker 5: sticky things that we believe are true, Like, you know,
Speaker 5: people like us, people like us don't go on vacation,
Speaker 5: or people like us can't afford to go on vacation,
Speaker 5: or people like us. Maybe you hear a grandparents say
Speaker 5: something like the people like us. We're just hard working,
Speaker 5: and hard work is the only way you know to
Speaker 5: make money in the world. You hear a song from
Speaker 5: generally your upbringing, sometimes we get it from the media
Speaker 5: society at large. A really popular one is we should
Speaker 5: never talk about money. It is ghosh, it is rude,
Speaker 5: it is improper. And those songs they get stuck in
Speaker 5: our head and they just play, and they might not
Speaker 5: play on repeat all the time, but they play enough.
Speaker 5: You hear it enough times and you start to believe, Yeah,
Speaker 5: this is exactly how the world works. This is my
Speaker 5: place in the world, this is my place in the
Speaker 5: world of money. This is what I deserve, this is
Speaker 5: what I don't deserve, this is what I'm capable of,
Speaker 5: this is what I'm not capable of. And your behaviors
Speaker 5: start to reflect that song that's going on and on
Speaker 5: and on, and while that's not the only thing right
Speaker 5: your beliefs and your mindset and how you think about
Speaker 5: money in the world, it's not the only thing that's
Speaker 5: going to impact your financial reality. It's a big one
Speaker 5: that you have some control and some agency over, which
Speaker 5: is why I am clearly so excited about helping people
Speaker 5: recognize the songs playing in their heads.
Speaker 3: I've never heard someone describe it in such a relatable
Speaker 3: way of like that song that gets suck in your
Speaker 3: head and sometimes you chose it and sometimes it just
Speaker 3: comes out of nowhere. Where did that even come from?
Speaker 3: I can't remember the last time I heard it. But
Speaker 3: also your whole person perspective on what might shape a
Speaker 3: money mindset that some of it is going back to
Speaker 3: what were the common phrases, what was some of the
Speaker 3: storytelling around money as a kid, whether in observance or
Speaker 3: being told to me? And then what are my current
Speaker 3: experiences that might affirm or deny or what money mindsets
Speaker 3: have I what songs about money have I picked up
Speaker 3: along the way. It's such a helpful way to think
Speaker 3: about it and recognize, oh, what might mind be?
Speaker 5: Yeah, there's also like why I like that Noogies because
Speaker 5: when you hear when you have a song stuck in
Speaker 5: your head, you're not like, I'm that song, right, If
Speaker 5: you're you got a Tailor Swift song stuck in your head,
Speaker 5: you're not like, ah, that's who I am. But with
Speaker 5: these beliefs, we get really attached to it. So I
Speaker 5: think looking at it through this analogy allows us to
Speaker 5: have that one layer of like, oh, it's just playing,
Speaker 5: it's clouds floating across the sky. It's not who I am.
Speaker 5: And therefore, if I can, if I could take that
Speaker 5: first step and not fully identify and attached to it, okay,
Speaker 5: then I have a dog in the fight here, or
Speaker 5: I have a chance. I can I can try to
Speaker 5: change the song playing. I can kind of change what's
Speaker 5: happening in my head and therefore then change my reality
Speaker 5: from outside of my head.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I think what you're describing links so well with what
Speaker 3: we talk about with curiosity and asking ourselves these questions
Speaker 3: that that's a really tangible helpful one. Oh yeah, what's
Speaker 3: what's the song playing in my head? What's on repeat?
Speaker 3: I'm curious. I don't know if there's an intersection here,
Speaker 3: maybe you could tie it together. But you also so
Speaker 3: talk about these circles of control, which it's really cool
Speaker 3: to see on your blog and website. It's definitely very
Speaker 3: similar to some of the things that I've seen in
Speaker 3: the mental health world. But I'm curious your perspective as
Speaker 3: it comes to finances, how you've integrated this circle of
Speaker 3: control with money, mindset and an understanding about personal finance.
Speaker 5: I mean, I definitely think that there's a through line
Speaker 5: with this concept called the circle of control, and is
Speaker 5: originally talked about by Stephen Covey. I believe he's the
Speaker 5: creator of it, and he references it in his book
Speaker 5: Old Book that a lot of people recommend seven habits
Speaker 5: of highly effective people. And basically, the circle of control
Speaker 5: is an exercise or a way for you to look
Speaker 5: at all the things happening in the world and you
Speaker 5: can break them down into things you can control and
Speaker 5: things you can influence, and then things that you're generally
Speaker 5: concerned about but you cannot change. So we'll start from
Speaker 5: the top. What are things I'm generally concerned about that
Speaker 5: I cannot change. Definitely, interest rates. I definitely care if
Speaker 5: the stock market is up or down. I definitely care
Speaker 5: whether or not run in a recession. That's going to
Speaker 5: affect sentiment, right, But there's nothing I can do to
Speaker 5: impact those things, right, So I'm concerned about it. But
Speaker 5: you know, I'm not gonna I'm not going to get
Speaker 5: too worked up about market going up, market going down.
Speaker 5: What I am going to do is I'm going to
Speaker 5: focus on the things within my control. So the things
Speaker 5: within my control as it relates to like the market,
Speaker 5: are going to be am I invested in a way
Speaker 5: that is appropriate for the amount of risk that I
Speaker 5: should be taking on, based on my comfort level and
Speaker 5: based on when I need the money. Right, So I've
Speaker 5: taken the action and I've done the thing that I
Speaker 5: can control that makes me feel like, Okay, I'm moving
Speaker 5: the needle and I have agency, but I'm playing in
Speaker 5: this game in this market that I don't have control over.
Speaker 5: So I think being able to shift your focus right,
Speaker 5: being able to understand what the real concern is and
Speaker 5: then where you can take action is going to help
Speaker 5: people feel a lot less worried about their finances, even
Speaker 5: though we live in uncertain times, even though there's so
Speaker 5: much outside of our control. Once you really hone in
Speaker 5: on what are the things you can control right, how
Speaker 5: much you're spending your efforts towards earning more. That could
Speaker 5: look like making a side hustle, starting a business, learning
Speaker 5: about negotiation, taking the steps to talking to your boss
Speaker 5: about getting a raise, getting more education, to see if
Speaker 5: you can make some lateral moves. All of those things
Speaker 5: are within our circle of control. And then one big
Speaker 5: one which we've been talking about, is your own relationship
Speaker 5: with money, and again that starts with how you think
Speaker 5: about money, how you feel about money, and those two
Speaker 5: things are going to lead into what you think is
Speaker 5: possible and how you're going to behave based on those
Speaker 5: ideas of possibility.
Speaker 3: I think this is such a helpful concept and one
Speaker 3: of the things that we've talked about as it relates
Speaker 3: to what's in our control what's outside of our control,
Speaker 3: is then how that informs the way that we then
Speaker 3: spend our emotional, relational, mental currency. That unfortunately, a lot
Speaker 3: of times that outer circle, the things outside my control,
Speaker 3: is what gets the most of my time, energy, and attention.
Speaker 3: And then I feel really depleted because truly there wasn't
Speaker 3: anything I could do about it. But instead not that
Speaker 3: we can't look at them, be informed about them, and
Speaker 3: have opinions and emotions attached to it, but what's getting
Speaker 3: the majority of my time, energy and attention, and it's
Speaker 3: that innermost circle. The thing that really grinds my gears
Speaker 3: about this though, is if you look at this chart,
Speaker 3: which will reference to your blog page, but you've got
Speaker 3: this outer circle, inner circle, and even smaller circle in
Speaker 3: the middle all kind of nestled like little Russian nesting dolls.
Speaker 3: And unfortunately, it's also indicative of how much is.
Speaker 4: Actually in our control.
Speaker 3: I think, like the visual is helpful in so many
Speaker 3: ways and then also a little bit discouraging. It's like, yeah,
Speaker 3: there's so much more outside of my control than what's
Speaker 3: inside of my control. And that's one of the reasons
Speaker 3: why most of our attention goes to the outer circle.
Speaker 3: But moving to the inner circle, I'm curious for you, Paco,
Speaker 3: when you're talking about this and you've utilize this yourself,
Speaker 3: are you encouraging people to actually use it as like
Speaker 3: a writing prompt, like you could actually draw this out
Speaker 3: and put the things down that are concerning you. How
Speaker 3: do you encourage people to utilize this when thinking about
Speaker 3: money mindset?
Speaker 5: You know, I've actually never asked people to draw it.
Speaker 5: But that's a brilliant idea. So thank you for that
Speaker 5: brilliant idea.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, because then Jill loves pencil and paper.
Speaker 5: There we go, a tactile person.
Speaker 4: That's why she doesn't let me in on the computer thing. Technology.
Speaker 5: No, go there, you're like drying sharpie on the screen there. Yeah,
Speaker 5: I think that would be a really helpful exercise because
Speaker 5: it will force you to take a moment and say,
Speaker 5: like crawl into your brain and say, hey, little mushy brain,
Speaker 5: what are you worried about? Let's put it all on
Speaker 5: paper and let's honor it, right, Let's recognize that the
Speaker 5: world is a scary place. You know, like forgive me
Speaker 5: for getting weird here, but you know, we're all just
Speaker 5: like these flesh bags with our skeletons on the inside,
Speaker 5: and like, you know, there's the cartoon where like a
Speaker 5: giant piano comes and crushes the cartoon person and they die.
Speaker 5: Like that's what we're doing, and we're all just walking
Speaker 5: around like things are great. I want a latte, but yeah,
Speaker 5: the world is uncertain, and I think taking a moment
Speaker 5: to recognize that that we live in a risky place,
Speaker 5: that we're where world is uncertain, and that our brains
Speaker 5: really orient towards focusing on the danger, focusing on bad things,
Speaker 5: because that's what's allowed the human race to survive for
Speaker 5: thousands of years is being able to look at danger
Speaker 5: like oh no, sabertooth tiger should probably run away, or hey,
Speaker 5: it looks like that water we were all drinking is
Speaker 5: like pretty dirty. And contaminated. Maybe we should, you know,
Speaker 5: pay attention to the dangerous things, right, recognizing that that's
Speaker 5: what our brain does. Honoring it, I think can help
Speaker 5: us reorient and understand. Okay, some of these things feel
Speaker 5: really dangerous. They feel in my body like a saber
Speaker 5: tooth tiger is about to chomp on my neck. But
Speaker 5: the reality is I should probably just you know, reality,
Speaker 5: make sure that my allocation for my four to one
Speaker 5: K is proper.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's I mean, this is a perfect time to
Speaker 1: kind of be talking about this because I think when
Speaker 1: New Year's resolutions kind of break down around this time,
Speaker 1: and a lot of it is because we're focusing on
Speaker 1: the goal or the greater like the destination, and we
Speaker 1: don't set these goals that are action control base, Like
Speaker 1: I can't control Like my goal is to make you know,
Speaker 1: one hundred thousand dollars in my business in the year. Ultimately,
Speaker 1: I don't have control over that, but I have control
Speaker 1: over the actions that would result in that. Or I
Speaker 1: want to pay off this much debt in this year.
Speaker 1: Ultimately I can't control if maybe I have a health scare,
Speaker 1: or maybe I lose my job, or all these things
Speaker 1: are there are so many things that can cause us
Speaker 1: to want to opt out completely because they're out of
Speaker 1: our control. But when we're focusing even in those seasons
Speaker 1: on the things that are in our control and honoring
Speaker 1: the season, like you said, like knowing that you will
Speaker 1: have control over different things in different seasons. When we
Speaker 1: do that, I think it really is a path defining,
Speaker 1: like our radical middle in pursuing like financial goals and
Speaker 1: pursuing frugality. So I love that. I also it kept
Speaker 1: things thinking like the song, the song thing just like
Speaker 1: stuck with me with money mindsets, and I'm realizing, like
Speaker 1: I'm seeing all these tiktoks that say that are people
Speaker 1: realizing the songs they listened to when they were teenagers,
Speaker 1: finally realizing what the actual lyrics are and realizing what
Speaker 1: they mean. And I was like, it's the same, Like
Speaker 1: when we grow up and we experience all these things
Speaker 1: and we start to learn about money and frugality and
Speaker 1: all these things, and we realize like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: that's what they were saying, that's why they were saying it. Uh,
Speaker 1: it's the same TikTok, It's the same video.
Speaker 3: I remember a friend trying a friend's mom trying to
Speaker 3: tell me what ignition was.
Speaker 1: About that song when you were when.
Speaker 4: I was, cause I loved it in middle school. I
Speaker 4: love ignition.
Speaker 3: I just thought we were talking about driving in cars
Speaker 3: and the mom was like, do you know what that's about?
Speaker 3: Blah blah blah, and I'm like, you nasty, though, that
Speaker 3: is not what this is about. She even tried to
Speaker 3: open my eyes to it. I wasn't having it. And
Speaker 3: good thing, I'm living in my own naive era over there.
Speaker 1: How do you feel about the song?
Speaker 5: Oh?
Speaker 1: No, Like she's so right?
Speaker 4: How did I How did I see it another way? Hey?
Speaker 1: Now I just love it even more.
Speaker 4: It's not repeat. It's maybe a song that repeat.
Speaker 1: So pago when things are out of our control. And
Speaker 1: I would love like more examples too, of like influence
Speaker 1: versus concern, but like when things are in those categories,
Speaker 1: like what's the first thing we can do to I
Speaker 1: know in your book you like say like what can
Speaker 1: you do to get a grip? But like also maybe
Speaker 1: like what do you just do to maybe decipher them?
Speaker 1: You know, what's you like your best advice for dealing
Speaker 1: with those things?
Speaker 5: I think understanding what what you can do that will
Speaker 5: move the needle the most, right, Like a lot of
Speaker 5: a lot of entrepreneurs talk about this Peretto principle right,
Speaker 5: where the Paretto principle states that you know eighty percent
Speaker 5: of your outcomes are going to be a result of
Speaker 5: twenty percent of your efforts, and so if you think
Speaker 5: about what you can do like hower ways you can
Speaker 5: leverage your energy to have the most impact.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 5: I'm a self identified lazy person, which my friends hate
Speaker 5: when I say that, because externally I have a lot
Speaker 5: of output, right, like podcasting and newsletters and running a
Speaker 5: company and doing all this stuff, but being an entrepreneur,
Speaker 5: but all of that is in service of being lazy.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 5: The other side of that coin is like I'm energy efficient, right,
Speaker 5: or I'm frugal with my time resource and my energy resource.
Speaker 5: And so that's how I look at what are the
Speaker 5: things I'm going to invest my energy into that I
Speaker 5: can impact?
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 5: We can spend so much time spinning our wheels. I
Speaker 5: could just sit here and be worried. Oh no, A
Speaker 5: lot of people are talking about twenty twenty four. They're
Speaker 5: worried about the economy, whether or not we're going to
Speaker 5: have a soft landing. I'm worried about the residual impacts
Speaker 5: of the hollywo strike here in LA. I'm worried about
Speaker 5: why is it so expensive to live in this city?
Speaker 5: And it keeps getting worse? Right, I can spin my
Speaker 5: wheels and tucker myself out on a daily basis being
Speaker 5: really focused on that. But what I encourage people to do,
Speaker 5: what I urge them to do is look at the
Speaker 5: ways that they can actually have an impact on the
Speaker 5: things that they're very concerned about. And then where do
Speaker 5: you have leverage?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 5: And so I also think, you know, I hate being
Speaker 5: such a fangirl of entrepreneurship because I know it's not
Speaker 5: right for everyone, but to me, that's where I also
Speaker 5: see where leverage is the greatest right, because then I'm
Speaker 5: able to stay within my zone of genius. I figure
Speaker 5: out what am I really great at, What does the
Speaker 5: world want from me? Where can I add the most value?
Speaker 5: And once I figure out those pieces, then I know
Speaker 5: for sure that if I'm giving the most value, I'll
Speaker 5: be getting the most value in return, which is income
Speaker 5: and a paycheck. So thinking about leverage, thinking about the
Speaker 5: Peretto principle, thinking about how you can put in your
Speaker 5: energy and kind of compound it and multiply it. I
Speaker 5: think that's going to be like the most sustainable way
Speaker 5: to manage our finances rather than spinning our wheels with
Speaker 5: everything the media is putting upon us, because more eyeballs
Speaker 5: and more scared and bad feelings equals more attention, which
Speaker 5: equals more profit. You know, being even critical of some
Speaker 5: of the messages that we're getting outside and how that
Speaker 5: like impacts our feelings and what we're thinking about and
Speaker 5: how we behave I think is also another you know,
Speaker 5: way to be that can have a good impact, have
Speaker 5: a positive impact on your finances.
Speaker 3: As you're talking, it's reminding me of or bringing to
Speaker 3: light that a lot of times when we are going
Speaker 3: through this process of understanding our mindset around money and
Speaker 3: what's within my control and really embracing that, it is
Speaker 3: leading a lot of our listeners to that side hustle
Speaker 3: side business. What can I do to increase my earnings
Speaker 3: in a way that feels really congruent with me and
Speaker 3: connects with my passions? And I know you were saying
Speaker 3: that this is an area that you're definitely diving into
Speaker 3: more and more for creatives people starting their own businesses,
Speaker 3: what do you want to share with us, whether it
Speaker 3: be about money mindset as a person who's starting a
Speaker 3: business or creative who might feel like I don't understand
Speaker 3: money really, and that's one of my hang ups for
Speaker 3: even starting my own thing, because that feels like a
Speaker 3: business mind that I don't necessarily have. What are you
Speaker 3: How are you helping people who are kind of at
Speaker 3: that cusp once they're beginning to shift money mindset and
Speaker 3: wanting this thing.
Speaker 5: I think the thing that I'm the biggest champion of
Speaker 5: when it comes to creative professionals, freelancers, people who are
Speaker 5: flirting with self employment, the thing I want them to realize,
Speaker 5: and really the thing I want everybody to realize is
Speaker 5: I understand that the world of money is scary. Right
Speaker 5: before people like Jen and Jill and me had platforms
Speaker 5: and you know, we're out here screaming at the top
Speaker 5: of our lungs that the world is for you. Right
Speaker 5: the generation before us, that wasn't the messaging. The messaging
Speaker 5: was the world of money is for a certain amount
Speaker 5: of people and for everybody else, even women, get out here.
Speaker 5: Not for you, it's for you, and there's so many
Speaker 5: different people who can help you understand. So many different
Speaker 5: facets of the world of finance, and I think the
Speaker 5: very first thing that you need to understand is this
Speaker 5: is for you, and it's you can learn everything that
Speaker 5: you need to learn about, you know, managing your income,
Speaker 5: how to save for taxes, what are the first few
Speaker 5: steps when it comes to going off your own and
Speaker 5: how do you know set up your bank accounts. All
Speaker 5: of that is out there and I just need you
Speaker 5: to hear this that it's for you.
Speaker 3: That's something that I need to hear too, because we
Speaker 3: talked about in your podcast Pocoh. You know, you pointed
Speaker 3: out very succinctly, Oh, Jen's got this kind of like
Speaker 3: brass tacks, get down to the research.
Speaker 4: And I'm a little bit more of this.
Speaker 3: Like feeling thinking, embracing personhood and money. And that's one
Speaker 3: of the things that I think has made this podcast,
Speaker 3: that brought it to where it is. It's one of
Speaker 3: the reasons we're friends and enjoy talking about this together.
Speaker 3: But I would definitely fall into that category of I'd
Speaker 3: love to do my own thing, but finances. Thankfully, I
Speaker 3: found a partner who's helpful in that. But it's good
Speaker 3: to know now I can also say one hundred percent
Speaker 3: agreed with what you're describing that it doesn't have to
Speaker 3: be that complicated. It has been this kind of gait,
Speaker 3: kept lots of acronyms attached to it, complicated, complex thing.
Speaker 3: But we can break it down into a more simplified
Speaker 3: form and it doesn't have to be the barrier to
Speaker 3: doing the thing that you really love that you're feeling
Speaker 3: inspired to do that when you're identifying, oh, here's my money,
Speaker 3: mindset is here's the things within my control. I want
Speaker 3: to go for it, you can.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 5: It's the same way that you guys approach helping people
Speaker 5: with reality.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 5: It's not let's change nineteen million things on the first day,
Speaker 5: because that's a recipe for failure. It's all about you know,
Speaker 5: understanding what direction you want to go towards and then
Speaker 5: figuring out how you're going to take those steps, and
Speaker 5: you know who's going to help you on your on
Speaker 5: your hero's journey.
Speaker 4: Do you want to know what direction I want to
Speaker 4: go in?
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is a essential part of the Heroes.
Speaker 4: It's not nineteen steps. It's one one thing.
Speaker 3: First step to get a grip always the direction we're settle.
Speaker 1: The bill of the weed.
Speaker 6: That's right, it's time for the best minute of your
Speaker 6: entire week. Maybe a baby was born and his name
Speaker 6: is Williams. Maybe you've paid off your mortgage, maybe your
Speaker 6: car died, and you're happy to not have to pay
Speaker 6: that bill anymore. Bus bills, Buffalo bills, Bill clon, this
Speaker 6: is the.
Speaker 4: Bill of the week, Paco.
Speaker 1: Every week we yell at our guests to invite them
Speaker 1: to share their bill for the week, and we would
Speaker 1: love to hear yours.
Speaker 5: So my bill of the week stands at a staggering
Speaker 5: six seven. He's an elderly gentleman and he has been
Speaker 5: a lifelong Clippers fan, which is what a Los Angeles
Speaker 5: Clippers have been up until very recently just garbage. So
Speaker 5: to be a Clippers fan when nobody was a Clippers
Speaker 5: fan showed sports.
Speaker 1: I don't know that is what is that?
Speaker 4: Sports?
Speaker 5: Basketball?
Speaker 2: See?
Speaker 5: That's how bad the Clippers are.
Speaker 4: They were.
Speaker 5: They were last in the league for like a whole generation.
Speaker 5: Bill is I was introduced to Bill through his name
Speaker 5: is Bill. Of course his name is Bill because it's
Speaker 5: Bill of the week.
Speaker 4: I know, I know, I was hoping that.
Speaker 3: I just thought that would be a little bit more
Speaker 3: like climactic when you were like, oh, sorry, I announced it.
Speaker 5: Okay.
Speaker 1: First thing she was like, my Bill stands at what?
Speaker 5: Okay?
Speaker 4: It was?
Speaker 3: It was there, Okay, okay, I'm here for it. I
Speaker 3: just heard it different, okay, Okay.
Speaker 5: I met this Bill through my partner. She runs an
Speaker 5: interior design firm, and so she has a lot of
Speaker 5: different builders and contractors and furniture makers in her life.
Speaker 5: And Bill is a sweet handyman. And I love Bill
Speaker 5: because he will help me put up these lovely shelves
Speaker 5: and he'll help us paint and he's just the sweetest Bill.
Speaker 5: He's Bill of the week. That Bill, Thank you Bill.
Speaker 4: Oh Bill, Bill.
Speaker 1: Yes, I love a Bill that will build a bookshelf.
Speaker 1: H oh.
Speaker 4: I never realized how close build is to Bill.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: How many puns we could We've been missing out on
Speaker 4: all this time.
Speaker 3: A lot? Whoa six foot seven? That's my favorite thing
Speaker 3: about Bill.
Speaker 1: You missed?
Speaker 3: No, well, I wrote that down six and seven, elderly
Speaker 3: man clippers fan.
Speaker 4: I'm here for it all.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that is fantastic. We are always here
Speaker 1: for an actual Bill uppercase, and I'm so glad you
Speaker 1: you brought one. I hope that maybe you will tell
Speaker 1: Bill about this and that he has been immortalized in
Speaker 1: the world of podcasting.
Speaker 4: I don't.
Speaker 3: I don't think I know any bills, but it's it
Speaker 3: thrills me when I meet other people who thrill of
Speaker 3: the bill, who know bills, and he sounds like a
Speaker 3: good one. You know what, I've never heard about a
Speaker 3: bad person named Bill. They're always amazing solid air.
Speaker 1: People have opinions on that stage.
Speaker 4: Well, it's just my experience.
Speaker 3: If you all listening have a bill, whether they they're great,
Speaker 3: you think that they're so lovely, or if you want
Speaker 3: to prove me wrong, you want to debunk this notion
Speaker 3: that all bills are great you why not?
Speaker 1: Why not the bill you don't like? As long as
Speaker 1: it's a lower.
Speaker 3: Case listen, it's half my podcast too for overenspodcast dot com,
Speaker 3: slash bill, whatever bill you want to talk about.
Speaker 5: I like the controversy here.
Speaker 4: I like it.
Speaker 1: We can't agree on everything all the time. It would
Speaker 1: be inauthentic.
Speaker 4: And now it's time for the lightning round.
Speaker 1: Help us renovate that intro. One day.
Speaker 3: We have more and more unhinged the further along we
Speaker 3: get in the podcast, but we are glad that you're here. Paco,
Speaker 3: We're glad.
Speaker 1: What she's saying is, we're glad you haven't left yet.
Speaker 1: So for our Lightning Round today, for our vulnerability Round,
Speaker 1: we'd like all to share what's the weirdest I would say,
Speaker 1: what's the weirdest money advice You've ever been told? You
Speaker 1: host a podcast called Weird Finance. We all talk about
Speaker 1: weird money stuff. We're all weirdos. So like, what's the
Speaker 1: weirdest money advice somebody has told you?
Speaker 5: Well, you I studied finance and economics and I've been
Speaker 5: in financial services my whole career. So there's not a
Speaker 5: lot of people who are like coming at me with, like,
Speaker 5: you know, bad advice. But I'm sure, I'm sure there's
Speaker 5: some bad advice out there.
Speaker 1: Not even bad, maybe true, but weird, okay, weird, weird.
Speaker 5: I would say, some of the weird.
Speaker 1: Bad, Paco, my bad, bad.
Speaker 5: Weird advice. Some of the weird advice I've gotten actually
Speaker 5: is from the messaging I got from my folks growing up,
Speaker 5: and kind of the the working class messaging that I got,
Speaker 5: which I thought was weird, was like, uh, just get
Speaker 5: a secure job and everything will be okay. And it's
Speaker 5: just that's weird in the context of like things are
Speaker 5: really uncertain one and two I've learned that that's that's
Speaker 5: like a surefire away to kind of stay small, or
Speaker 5: it's a sure fire away to not find ways that
Speaker 5: you can expand your income if you just give all
Speaker 5: your time to this sure thing. I feel like, oh,
Speaker 5: I feel like the opportunity cost is really great, And
Speaker 5: I think that's weird advice. The other weird advice that
Speaker 5: I that I've gotten actually quite a few times is
Speaker 5: like using insurance for investment purposes, So using insurance as
Speaker 5: a tool for gain as opposed to use, you know,
Speaker 5: as opposed to what it's actually for, which is to
Speaker 5: protect you against losses. And sure, there's like a sliver
Speaker 5: of society where it's appropriate to try to use insurance
Speaker 5: for gain because you've maxed out all these other things
Speaker 5: and you just have a ton of money, so you know,
Speaker 5: we'll do it. But the insurance for gain is weird advice,
Speaker 5: and I would love to shine a bright light on it.
Speaker 1: M h, that was mine, you actually took mine.
Speaker 4: But say more?
Speaker 1: Is I.
Speaker 4: Just say more for multiple reasons.
Speaker 1: Say I mean that people are saying you should use
Speaker 1: like whole life insurance that gains four percent year over year,
Speaker 1: that it's a better safer I mean, it's probably safer,
Speaker 1: but it's a better investment than the stock market. People
Speaker 1: will say that.
Speaker 3: This is reminding me that, Oh man, there's how much
Speaker 3: to say about people that probably do listen to this podcast.
Speaker 3: This isn't mine. I've got a different one, but I
Speaker 3: have heard I'll say it this way. I have heard
Speaker 3: of businesses who going through lawsuits have had like it
Speaker 3: has been ruled in the legal process that the one
Speaker 3: person's life insurance policy would now go to this person
Speaker 3: who was suing them. So now when that person passes,
Speaker 3: the family is not going to the life insurance policy.
Speaker 3: The person who sued them is going to get the
Speaker 3: life insurance policy. And maybe some of that backs up
Speaker 3: to putting that life insurance policy on the line in
Speaker 3: the past. I don't know how that in any way
Speaker 3: can be legal. It is what happened. That's weird and
Speaker 3: wild to me and wrong. Weird and wrong, I think
Speaker 3: in my in my estimation, Yeah, it's kind of dark, very.
Speaker 1: Really the vulnerability rounds really here. I'd like to lighten
Speaker 1: the mood. I had a second I had to back
Speaker 1: up okay, And for me, the weirdest maybe not find
Speaker 1: money advice, but the weirdest concept in money is compound interest.
Speaker 1: Because in my brain, if I'm investing every month when
Speaker 1: I am in time halfway to retirement, and if I'm
Speaker 1: like planning to invest a million dollars, right, i should
Speaker 1: be at the halfway mark at half a million, but
Speaker 1: I'm not. I'm at like three hundred or something. And
Speaker 1: once i get like three quarters the way there, I'm
Speaker 1: halfway there. And then like three years later I met
Speaker 1: a million. Like compound interest is fantastic, and then it
Speaker 1: just like doubles every ten years and it's beautiful. And
Speaker 1: I it's so weird and I love it.
Speaker 4: I love it.
Speaker 1: It's but it's so weird. That makes sense.
Speaker 4: Math is weird.
Speaker 1: Math is weird.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's glorious, And yeah, I don't think our brains
Speaker 5: can understand it because it's not just like arithmetic, right,
Speaker 5: It's it's geometric.
Speaker 4: In a way.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love it.
Speaker 3: I mean, gosh, this is becoming the majority of the
Speaker 3: podcast at this point, but I mean I'm here for it.
Speaker 3: There's a lot of weird stuff happening. I don't know
Speaker 3: if this is advice. You know how when people say
Speaker 3: what they do with their money, but and it is
Speaker 3: kind of like, look at me, how I've hacked it,
Speaker 3: and so it is kind of like you should be
Speaker 3: doing it if you even had half a brain and
Speaker 3: could figure out how I implement this, like that kind
Speaker 3: of thing. I know plenty of those people. It doesn't
Speaker 3: even matter that I'm in personal finance. People just spout off.
Speaker 3: I was in an interaction. Really it wasn't quite in exchange.
Speaker 3: It was more this was happening to me and coming
Speaker 3: at me. But this person was saying wild things about
Speaker 3: their taxes and they are on the wealthier side, and
Speaker 3: just all that they're doing. I mean, there's a lot
Speaker 3: of tax evasion happening. But also some of the advice
Speaker 3: that's being given is like just bye bye bye bye bye.
Speaker 3: With the business counted as a business expense, you can
Speaker 3: write it off. And in my mind, I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 3: but that only to a certain point, and you are
Speaker 3: still spending money. But they're just getting boats and jet
Speaker 3: skis and houses and more and more.
Speaker 4: So, thankfully, I know enough.
Speaker 3: People in that category that even if they did listen
Speaker 3: to this podcast, which they're not, they it may or
Speaker 3: may not be about them, because I know a lot
Speaker 3: of people like this.
Speaker 4: I just and I might need to take a look
Speaker 4: at my community.
Speaker 5: I can't imagine somebody who's like frantically spending for tax
Speaker 5: deduction reasons being like frugal friends. That's for me.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah yeah.
Speaker 5: Two, the phrase that comes to mind is letting the
Speaker 5: tax tail wag the dog, right, like when you, yeah,
Speaker 5: when you're using taxes as an excuse.
Speaker 4: Right.
Speaker 5: And then the other thing it makes me think about
Speaker 5: is have you guys seen this Instagram account called Ballerbusters? Okay,
Speaker 5: sounds weird and dirty now out of context, but okay,
Speaker 5: So what they do is they call out like online
Speaker 5: scammers like the guy who's like by ten airban bees
Speaker 5: and my course and I'll show you how, and people
Speaker 5: who are like posing in front of lambos and trying
Speaker 5: to like sell their drop shipping course. You know, you know,
Speaker 5: you know the type online scammers who flaunt their wealth
Speaker 5: and try to get people to buy their course or
Speaker 5: buy their coaching or whatever. And they just ruthlessly go
Speaker 5: in and so hearing Jill talk about like, uh, I'm
Speaker 5: buying the boat and I'm writing it off, they call
Speaker 5: out a lot of those guys who are like, I
Speaker 5: bought a jet and here's how I'm saving money because
Speaker 5: I bought a jet and I love that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that account.
Speaker 1: That's I mean, Jill can't use that asn't like write
Speaker 1: off anymore. She's gonna buy us a frugal friends jet.
Speaker 4: I mean, someday you could.
Speaker 3: But I fear for these people who will inevitably one
Speaker 3: day be audited. But this is helpful to bring us
Speaker 3: full circle. Pack out Instagram Accounts like that I think
Speaker 3: are really important and beneficial for our money mindset because
Speaker 3: we can be on social media and come up with
Speaker 3: these money songs, money narratives that we begin to believe
Speaker 3: about how other people are doing their business, living their lives.
Speaker 3: We just don't have the secret code, the secret sauce.
Speaker 3: We're not understanding things accurately, and it can be so
Speaker 3: inhibitive and such a barrier to us. And then we
Speaker 3: can find these other accounts that are debunking, demystifying, helping
Speaker 3: us to see the real, authentic, genuine side of this.
Speaker 4: And so I am.
Speaker 3: Grateful for resources like that, So thank you for sharing.
Speaker 3: I just follow them just of course it is helpful
Speaker 3: to bring a tethering, because sometimes it can seem like
Speaker 3: these people are just out there doing extreme things that
Speaker 3: they want to say you can do too, and we've
Speaker 3: got to tether it because otherwise people are just feeling
Speaker 3: so discouraged.
Speaker 5: Totally. Yeah, and you know what, I just watched a
Speaker 5: comedy special. I don't remember the comedian is, so forgive
Speaker 5: me for not reference them. But the whole concept was like,
Speaker 5: as adults, so many of us are still doing the
Speaker 5: thing where we're saying, look at me, mom, mom, look
Speaker 5: what I can do. And as you're you know, as
Speaker 5: I'm thinking about the Ballerbuster account and all the like
Speaker 5: flexing online, I think it is important to think that, yeah,
Speaker 5: why are these people doing this, and maybe deep down
Speaker 5: inside they're just saying, look at me, mom, look what
Speaker 5: I did.
Speaker 4: Yes, I love that. I love that reframe. There we're
Speaker 4: going with that.
Speaker 3: Goodness, Paca, You've got so so much encouragement, wisdom, approachability,
Speaker 3: personal finance understanding.
Speaker 4: Where can people get more from you?
Speaker 5: Well, you can listen to my podcast Weird Finance. Wherever
Speaker 5: you listen to this podcast, and if you'd like to
Speaker 5: stay in touch on the internet, the best way is
Speaker 5: to sign up for my email newsletter. You can just
Speaker 5: go to the helligroup dot com and sign on up
Speaker 5: and we'll be pen pals.
Speaker 1: Amazing. I love pen pals. Thank you, Paca. So this
Speaker 1: has been a fantastic morning of conversation, so fun and
Speaker 1: so glad we got to wrap it up by yelling
Speaker 1: at you and finding out your deep money weird secrets.
Speaker 5: I love every moment of it, yelling included, and I
Speaker 5: look forward to being yelled at again. So thank you.
Speaker 4: Too, amazing, Thanks Baco, of course.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, it's so nice when interviews are just
Speaker 3: really I forget that the MIC's in front of me
Speaker 3: and we're just chatting it up and sharing like mindedness.
Speaker 3: And that's the beautiful thing of it that our concepts,
Speaker 3: the way we look at money and approach finances and
Speaker 3: mindset around money is so congruent.
Speaker 4: And yet she brought.
Speaker 3: Such a helpful new way of defining looking at it.
Speaker 4: I love the song.
Speaker 3: Way of understanding what even is a money mindset? How
Speaker 3: can we know what our money mindsets are? I personally
Speaker 3: have a lot of takeaways and ponderings from this, So
Speaker 3: I'm thrilled.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Now I love Paco really emphasizes the things that
Speaker 1: are outside of our control that do impact how we
Speaker 1: think about and manage our money. So much of the
Speaker 1: advice out there does tell you to ignore the things
Speaker 1: out of your control. But we know that managing money
Speaker 1: is emotional and it's personal first, and so we have
Speaker 1: to take into consideration these things that are scary, these
Speaker 1: things that are stressful, these things that are unknown, and
Speaker 1: how they impact the decisions we make, how it impacts
Speaker 1: how we think about money. And so the idea of
Speaker 1: those circles of control, the things that are immediately in
Speaker 1: my control, which are the actions that I do, the
Speaker 1: things that are I have influence over but no control,
Speaker 1: and the things I have no control or influence over
Speaker 1: or barely any but I am concerned about, like thinking
Speaker 1: about things that happened to you and identifying writing them down,
Speaker 1: what area of control is it in, and what can
Speaker 1: I be focusing on. What's the next right thing that
Speaker 1: I can do that I have control over?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, So thank you so much for listening. Many of
Speaker 1: you know we have the friend letter and we love
Speaker 1: getting your replies. If you ever get a friend letter
Speaker 1: that was that you liked, please hit reply and just
Speaker 1: say yay loved it or Boo did not like it,
Speaker 1: because that helps us figure out what you want more of.
Speaker 1: And so this was a sweet message we got from
Speaker 1: Wendy Avid listener, reader and supporter. She said, I don't
Speaker 1: even know if you guys see these responses. We do,
Speaker 1: but if you do, I want you both to know
Speaker 1: how wonderful this email is. All your emails are wonderful,
Speaker 1: but this you shared the most important message and scinctly
Speaker 1: told us how to do it. I've read whole books
Speaker 1: on boundaries that didn't get to the point like this email.
Speaker 1: Thank you so very much. You do so much good,
Speaker 1: not just for our bank accounts, but for our mental
Speaker 1: and emotional health. Blessings to you both.
Speaker 3: Amazing Wendy, when you sent this, it really was so
Speaker 3: so encouraging because we're not a massive business over here.
Speaker 3: It really is Jen and I seeing and reading these
Speaker 3: emails and responding. So that was so encouraging and helps
Speaker 3: us to know what's resonating, what to do more of,
Speaker 3: what to do less of. So banks, Wendy, and thank
Speaker 3: you all for listening, forgetting the newsletter, for just engaging,
Speaker 3: and for the work you're doing for yourselves. It's benefiting you,
Speaker 3: it's benefiting the.
Speaker 4: Rest of us.
Speaker 1: Yes, thank you so much for listening. If you want freebies,
Speaker 1: saving tips, values based spending hacks, succinct explanations on how
Speaker 1: to build boundaries, then head to Frugal Friends podcast dot
Speaker 1: com get the friend letter and all the goodies. And
Speaker 1: if you're already getting the friend letter and you know
Speaker 1: of somebody who could use more friend lettering in their life,
Speaker 1: use your referral link at the bottom of your email
Speaker 1: and share it.
Speaker 4: See you next time.
Speaker 1: Gorugle Friends is produced by Eric Sirianni.
Speaker 4: Jill I.
Speaker 1: When you just so many Googles. When we were exiting
Speaker 1: out of your Googles this morning and you were googling
Speaker 1: what is a sticker or no, things that are stickers,
Speaker 1: things that are stickers, I didn't know where or why.
Speaker 1: I didn't know where it was going.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because I remembered earring stickers. And then I was thinking, man,
Speaker 3: there are so many things that you can stick on you,
Speaker 3: like eyelashes, like undergarments. And then it got me thinking,
Speaker 3: there's got to be other types of stickers I'm not
Speaker 3: thinking of. There weren't really You've got your command, You've
Speaker 3: got your command strips which are wild. You can hang
Speaker 3: so much on that. But something else I want to
Speaker 3: talk about, Jen is that there's been a lot of
Speaker 3: rain lately around here. It's been raining a lot here
Speaker 3: in Saint Petersburg. I know all of you listening think
Speaker 3: that Saint Petersburg is just absolute pure paradise, and it
Speaker 3: is most of the time, but then it also rains.
Speaker 3: And speaking of getting songs stuck in your head, this
Speaker 3: made me think of it, but I saved it for
Speaker 3: the post show, the post post show, for our true listeners.
Speaker 3: It's been raining, and I've been getting this song stuck
Speaker 3: in my head because I see the rain and then
Speaker 3: music starts playing in my head. Every time it rains.
Speaker 3: It rains, and He's from heaven. But instead that's the song,
Speaker 3: that's the one right now currently, That's what happens in
Speaker 3: my head. I will come up with songs I haven't
Speaker 3: heard in forever. I don't even know where that came from.
Speaker 1: Man, I was hoping you'd say, Rihanna.
Speaker 4: That would be nice.
Speaker 3: But here's what's salacious about that is I for a
Speaker 3: while thought that they were saying panties from heaven. It
Speaker 3: sounds exactly like that. So now that's what I sang,
Speaker 3: and it's fun.
Speaker 1: That sounds more like you. Actually, that makes more sense
Speaker 1: in my head. I was like Jill singing Pennies from Heaven.
Speaker 3: Try to listen to that song though, and not hear
Speaker 3: panties from heaven.
Speaker 4: Every time it rains, it rains, panties from heaven. Who knows?
Speaker 4: Did I say panties or pennies? Who knows?
Speaker 1: You for sure said panty?
Speaker 3: No, I don't know. You don't know what my intention was.
Speaker 3: So it's one of those like is the dressed gray
Speaker 3: or is it pink?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 4: Did I say panty panty? Or did I say penny?
Speaker 4: Who knows? Who knows? Who knows?
Speaker 1: We'll never know,