1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:08,239 Speaker 1: Welcome back once again. This is the crew from It's 2 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:11,080 Speaker 1: Going Down, squatting the air waves of it could happen here. 3 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: On today's show, we're going to look at the growing 4 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,079 Speaker 1: crisis around homelessness and how the state has moved to 5 00:00:17,120 --> 00:00:20,759 Speaker 1: address it with brutal sweeps and new laws that target 6 00:00:20,840 --> 00:00:24,919 Speaker 1: the poor. In the wake of the global COVID nineteen pandemic, 7 00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:29,680 Speaker 1: the US housing crisis deepened and homelessness grew Following the 8 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:33,760 Speaker 1: George Floyd rebellion. Republicans pointed to a rising murderate during 9 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:38,080 Speaker 1: the election cycle, along with growing encampments of the houseless, 10 00:00:38,080 --> 00:00:42,159 Speaker 1: as examples of rampant democratic mismanagement and the supposed in 11 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 1: result of defunding the police. In reality, two years after 12 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:50,440 Speaker 1: the uprising, both funding for the police has only increased 13 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:53,159 Speaker 1: along with the number of people killed per year by 14 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:57,280 Speaker 1: law enforcement, while growing police budgets have had no impact 15 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 1: on crime. Meanwhile, both party have embraced a draconian crackdown 16 00:01:02,040 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 1: on the houseless as a slew of new laws targets 17 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:09,399 Speaker 1: sleeping outside and police move against encampments even in the 18 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 1: midst of extreme weather. But a new wave of resistance 19 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: is awesome materializing as communities mobilized to provide mutual aid, 20 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:21,440 Speaker 1: fight for access to housing, and resist sweeps of encampments. 21 00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:25,160 Speaker 1: On today's episode, we investigate the history of these struggles 22 00:01:25,200 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 1: and how these tactics, ranging from squatting to a canmet defense, 23 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,720 Speaker 1: are spreading across the social terrain as the current crisis deepens, 24 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:36,319 Speaker 1: can more people find themselves out in the cold. But 25 00:01:36,440 --> 00:01:39,280 Speaker 1: to kick things off, let's talk about state strategy. Just 26 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 1: why are they carrying out these sweeps? I think one 27 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:44,679 Speaker 1: of the first thing that comes to mind for me 28 00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 1: is how this behavior from like the Democrats or like 29 00:01:47,600 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: liberals or progressives isn't an anomaly that they are you know, 30 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: that their role is facilitating a capitalist state, just with 31 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: slightly different tactics than the Republicans. But basically they're trying 32 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: to do that they're doing, which is basically demonizing unhoused 33 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:08,320 Speaker 1: people and sort of pushes the blame of um, what's 34 00:02:08,360 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 1: going on, of the failings basically of our culture onto 35 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 1: these individuals that are unhoused, rather than on their failures 36 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:20,440 Speaker 1: as like mayors of democratic cities or whatever. UM and 37 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:24,960 Speaker 1: the kind of logical outcome of class based capitalists extract 38 00:02:25,040 --> 00:02:27,960 Speaker 1: of society and when they can just make it that 39 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:30,640 Speaker 1: instead of it being like a social problem that people 40 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 1: around house, they can make it these bad homeless people 41 00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:37,519 Speaker 1: and they're dirty and crime or whatever, and just kind 42 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:40,320 Speaker 1: of trying eliminate that to protect their image. But I 43 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:43,120 Speaker 1: think it's just a way of scapegoating a built in 44 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 1: problem with how they operate. And actually it's something that 45 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:49,520 Speaker 1: makes me think, especially thinking about San Francisco in terms 46 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: of like precedence for this. It makes me think about 47 00:02:51,480 --> 00:02:54,560 Speaker 1: the Ugly Laws, which, for anyone who doesn't know, that 48 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 1: was something kind of in the eight hundred San Francisco 49 00:02:57,280 --> 00:03:00,320 Speaker 1: implemented in eighteen sixty seven, which was a law or 50 00:03:00,800 --> 00:03:03,680 Speaker 1: forbidding people who were kind of like unsightly. According to 51 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:06,600 Speaker 1: this law, um to not be seen in the streets. 52 00:03:06,600 --> 00:03:10,200 Speaker 1: So if people were physically disabled or they were begging 53 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:13,520 Speaker 1: or even limping, there were laws targeting them. And part 54 00:03:13,560 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 1: of it even says that anything that's triggering like disgust 55 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:19,280 Speaker 1: or guilt like to not be seen. And I feel 56 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: like it's a really similar thing that's happening now, and 57 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:25,880 Speaker 1: so yeah, progressive that they do this. I'm glad that 58 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 1: you brought up able is M because I think that 59 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 1: this ties in real role well into that. So we 60 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:32,480 Speaker 1: live in essentially like an extremely able society that says 61 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 1: if you don't work, you die. And I think criminalizing 62 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 1: homeless people is a huge part of that. I mean, 63 00:03:38,640 --> 00:03:41,360 Speaker 1: really think about it. We have to rent our bodies 64 00:03:41,680 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 1: to corporations so we can get money to pay rent 65 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:49,120 Speaker 1: to landlords. Essentially we're being paid at tax to live. 66 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:52,240 Speaker 1: But how do you enforce people? How else can we 67 00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 1: get people to do the drudgery that we have to 68 00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,200 Speaker 1: do at work if you don't like show them the 69 00:03:56,240 --> 00:03:58,520 Speaker 1: consequences of that. So like if they were nice to 70 00:03:58,600 --> 00:04:01,200 Speaker 1: hold with people, if they were oh, here's a free home, 71 00:04:01,200 --> 00:04:04,480 Speaker 1: they not create the presidents of like, oh you cannot 72 00:04:04,520 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 1: work and have a home, So like they don't want 73 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:08,120 Speaker 1: to do that. So I mean, I think one thing 74 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:10,680 Speaker 1: that people don't talk about, like homelessness is existing. I 75 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 1: think it's like a way to like scare us into 76 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 1: essentially doing these things that we don't want to do 77 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 1: to live, because you're constantly reminding us of like, oh 78 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:21,320 Speaker 1: you want to quiet Quinn, you want to go on 79 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:24,560 Speaker 1: a strike, this is what your life could be. You're 80 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:27,360 Speaker 1: gonna be homeless. And not only that, we're gonna make 81 00:04:27,400 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: it so that you can't exist as a homeless person 82 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 1: in this society because if people like, if you go 83 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:34,720 Speaker 1: to New York right now, all these brunchy folks they 84 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:37,320 Speaker 1: eat on the sidewalk, they have all these like houses 85 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 1: build up on the sidewalk, people drinking mimosas, But you 86 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:42,640 Speaker 1: can't have a tan. But what are these makeshift things? 87 00:04:42,680 --> 00:04:44,160 Speaker 1: So I mean it goes to show you like it's 88 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:46,719 Speaker 1: not even like the idea of taking public space. It's like, 89 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:49,080 Speaker 1: who's taking public space? And if it's somebody who's not 90 00:04:49,120 --> 00:04:53,039 Speaker 1: serving capitalism, you can't take up public space. The housing question. 91 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:57,600 Speaker 1: To really understand the connection with democrats and capitalists understandings 92 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 1: of housing, we have to think about housing, property, structure, space, right, 93 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: how capitalism structures space. And so you know, when I 94 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 1: was thinking about this before we're recording, I keep going 95 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 1: back to um James Scott Seeing Like a State, which is, 96 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:12,840 Speaker 1: you know, an amazing book. If people haven't read it, 97 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:16,359 Speaker 1: absolutely pick up a copy. But in the first, you know, 98 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 1: couple of chapters, one of the things he talks about 99 00:05:18,320 --> 00:05:21,880 Speaker 1: his land enclosure, and he's talking about this structure specifically 100 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:25,760 Speaker 1: in France, in which sort of towards the end of monarchism, 101 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 1: there was an attempt to actually create a tax regime 102 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:31,480 Speaker 1: where individuals were taxed, and to do that, individuals had 103 00:05:31,520 --> 00:05:34,960 Speaker 1: to exist legally, but they didn't at that point. They 104 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 1: existed as communities within feudalism. They pay taxes as communities 105 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:41,760 Speaker 1: that held land as communities. When the French government went 106 00:05:41,839 --> 00:05:44,920 Speaker 1: to these towns to figure out who owned what, but 107 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:47,960 Speaker 1: they found was that every single community broke up their 108 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 1: understanding of land differently and that it wasn't really based 109 00:05:51,120 --> 00:05:53,600 Speaker 1: on ownership, is based on use. And so they had 110 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:55,560 Speaker 1: to standardize all of that. To do that, they had 111 00:05:55,560 --> 00:05:57,600 Speaker 1: to fragment the comments. They had to sit there and go, 112 00:05:58,080 --> 00:05:59,720 Speaker 1: you owned this piece of land, and you own this 113 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 1: piece of planned. They did that, they made maps and 114 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:04,599 Speaker 1: they went back two years later they realized nobody was 115 00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: following the maps. But what they did was they started 116 00:06:06,839 --> 00:06:09,600 Speaker 1: charging taxes based on the maps, and so people had 117 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:11,760 Speaker 1: to start making money on the land to pay the 118 00:06:11,800 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: taxes based on the maps that have nothing to do 119 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 1: with their lives, right, And what that was was the 120 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:20,920 Speaker 1: creation of property. Right, because when we think about property, 121 00:06:21,320 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 1: you know, there's this fiction of you know, stateless capitalism, right, 122 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 1: you have like Murray Rothbard guying grand types. So we're 123 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:29,760 Speaker 1: talking about capitalism can exist without the state. But really 124 00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: we can see the fallacy of that when we look 125 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:34,919 Speaker 1: at the at the question a property right, the question 126 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:38,840 Speaker 1: of exclusion from property or exclusion from space. Um. Not 127 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:41,039 Speaker 1: only is it fragmenting public space, but we start to 128 00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:44,719 Speaker 1: look at um the way that all of a sudden 129 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:48,279 Speaker 1: property has to exist. Right. And so in the Rust Belt, 130 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:52,760 Speaker 1: for example, after the financial crisis, cities Cleveland, Buffalo, Detroit 131 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:54,800 Speaker 1: got all this money from the federal government to tear 132 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: houses down, and they were tearing down like fifty houses 133 00:06:57,920 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 1: a day in these cities, right for years on end. 134 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:03,559 Speaker 1: And these are cities that have people that don't have housing. 135 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:06,440 Speaker 1: And so you you sit there and you go, well, 136 00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:09,360 Speaker 1: why are they tearing houses down when there are people 137 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 1: that don't have houses, right, When there's more vacant houses 138 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 1: than there are people without housing, How can you justify 139 00:07:15,960 --> 00:07:18,400 Speaker 1: tearing the houses down? And the answer was, we need 140 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: to create a real estate market again, because if you 141 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:23,600 Speaker 1: allow people to just squat, there's no reason to pay 142 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:25,640 Speaker 1: for housing. If there's a reason to pay for housing, 143 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:28,840 Speaker 1: housing seasons to be a commodity, right, Like, this is 144 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 1: actually the important part that capitalism has to function through 145 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:36,440 Speaker 1: that exclusion of access. Otherwise commodities can't have the scarcity 146 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:40,160 Speaker 1: necessary to allow them to be priced. Right. There can't 147 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 1: be a supply that is lower than in demand, for example, 148 00:07:44,160 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 1: unless you artificially limit supply. Right. And so when we 149 00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 1: really see this, we can really see not just the 150 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 1: way that capitalism sort of atomizes us, right, creates us 151 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 1: as people who live in individual housing units as opposed 152 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,480 Speaker 1: to as people who can see ourselves as living unities. 153 00:08:01,080 --> 00:08:03,800 Speaker 1: But it also really comes to highlight the relationship between 154 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:06,200 Speaker 1: the state and the police at capital and how we 155 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 1: have to understand capital as a content of the state. 156 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:13,000 Speaker 1: It is a definition of life that is imposed through 157 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:16,680 Speaker 1: policing purity and can't exist outside of that. Right. It's 158 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:19,800 Speaker 1: the fallacy of quote unquote anarcho capitalism, which isn't the 159 00:08:19,840 --> 00:08:22,880 Speaker 1: thing that really exists for this exact reason. Right. And 160 00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: so when we're looking at why are democrats engaging in 161 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 1: techniques that involve pushing people off the streets, this is 162 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:32,240 Speaker 1: exactly why it's a capitalist political party. They're trying to 163 00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:35,720 Speaker 1: maintain property, they're trying to maintain property value right, And 164 00:08:35,720 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 1: this is why you see this happen in cities where 165 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 1: gentrification is really horrible at a much much faster clip 166 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:45,080 Speaker 1: than you see it in cities where there's like open 167 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:48,120 Speaker 1: housing stock. That really makes me think about the beginning 168 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:52,079 Speaker 1: of like work houses in England in the eighteen thirties 169 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:53,880 Speaker 1: and the polar reforms, and it goes back to what 170 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:57,320 Speaker 1: you were saying more about just that making it really 171 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:01,520 Speaker 1: undesirable to be poor in needing a group of people 172 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 1: who are in that position, and the work houses was 173 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:07,640 Speaker 1: something that were introduced by liberals, progressives, you know, like 174 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 1: this as a form of like changing the sort of 175 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: poor release system. So instead of giving people money so 176 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,280 Speaker 1: they could be supported and stay with their families or whatever, 177 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:18,319 Speaker 1: people would put into these institutions where they're separated from 178 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:21,440 Speaker 1: their kids, from their husbands and wives or whatever. And 179 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 1: it's meant to be so undesirable that you would only 180 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:26,960 Speaker 1: seek it if you was desperately needed it or whatever. 181 00:09:27,720 --> 00:09:29,960 Speaker 1: Um as a way to like save on taxes for 182 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:32,720 Speaker 1: like money to people. Basically it's really sucked up and 183 00:09:32,760 --> 00:09:34,560 Speaker 1: it's like this was part of the sort of social 184 00:09:34,600 --> 00:09:37,480 Speaker 1: reform progressive like project and I think we could see 185 00:09:37,480 --> 00:09:39,280 Speaker 1: echoes of that in this The other thing that I 186 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:41,359 Speaker 1: wanted to bring up is, like you talked about atomizing 187 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 1: and isolating and like how capitalism does that. One thing 188 00:09:44,120 --> 00:09:46,880 Speaker 1: that I think about specifically New York is that homeless 189 00:09:46,880 --> 00:09:49,840 Speaker 1: and campings do offer this radical idea of like what 190 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 1: it looks like to take back a public space and 191 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:54,280 Speaker 1: to collectively like meet together, you know, And like that's 192 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:55,960 Speaker 1: the other thing that I was thinking about last night 193 00:09:55,960 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 1: when I was high, this whole idea of what happens 194 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,240 Speaker 1: if we just allow homeless encampments to spread and take over. 195 00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:05,319 Speaker 1: Then people who are not homeless start interacting with homeless 196 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 1: people as we do, like people in the city do. 197 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 1: Then you form these connections and these relationships, and then 198 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:14,320 Speaker 1: it becomes perfectly normal for people to take over public spaces. 199 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: And then what does that mean? Then we have to 200 00:10:16,160 --> 00:10:19,200 Speaker 1: provide services in public spaces like bathrooms and showers, because 201 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 1: the public would start requesting and like asking for these things, 202 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 1: the more of a relationship they form with homeless folks. 203 00:10:25,080 --> 00:10:27,719 Speaker 1: So I think part of the cleaning, which is what 204 00:10:27,800 --> 00:10:30,880 Speaker 1: the term Eric Adams is used, which is absolutely disgusting 205 00:10:30,920 --> 00:10:33,520 Speaker 1: in terms of like moving homeless people the whole. I 206 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 1: think a huge part of it is also just like 207 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 1: destroying the notion that we own public spaces, like you 208 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:41,240 Speaker 1: do not own a public space, and we want to 209 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:43,200 Speaker 1: let you know that and we want you out. Um 210 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:45,680 Speaker 1: so I think that really And and the additional aspect 211 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:46,960 Speaker 1: of that too is like when you look at homeless 212 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:48,160 Speaker 1: is in New York, like a huge chunk of it 213 00:10:48,559 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 1: like black people too, So there's like a racial component 214 00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:52,400 Speaker 1: of it too. When you really want to add it 215 00:10:52,440 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 1: for this whole idea of like black people are not 216 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:56,680 Speaker 1: allowed to take up space, and then specifically you're homeless, 217 00:10:56,679 --> 00:10:58,400 Speaker 1: you're not allowed to take up public space. I wanted 218 00:10:58,440 --> 00:11:00,720 Speaker 1: to bring that in. It's like very much related to work, 219 00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:02,640 Speaker 1: but also just related to the idea that the government 220 00:11:02,679 --> 00:11:05,719 Speaker 1: owns everything and corporations own everything, including the spaces that 221 00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:10,079 Speaker 1: we exist in. Well, speaking of corporations owning everything, here's 222 00:11:10,080 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: some words from our sponsors. Across the US, in large 223 00:11:23,400 --> 00:11:26,600 Speaker 1: cities often controlled by Democrats, a war on the poor, 224 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:30,559 Speaker 1: and specifically on encampments of houses people has been increasingly 225 00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 1: ways over the past year. In San Francisco, the city's mayor, 226 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:37,440 Speaker 1: London Breed, recently declared it was time to quote be 227 00:11:37,600 --> 00:11:40,480 Speaker 1: less tolerant of all the bullshit that has destroyed our city. 228 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 1: An effort to ramp up police harassment of the poor 229 00:11:43,400 --> 00:11:46,840 Speaker 1: and un housed in Portland's city officials openly toyed with 230 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:50,000 Speaker 1: the idea of forcing quote up to three thousand homeless 231 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:53,560 Speaker 1: people in the massive temporary shelters staff by the Oregon 232 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:58,880 Speaker 1: National Guard. On California, the Democratic governor Gavin Newsom has 233 00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:02,199 Speaker 1: pushed for quote courts, which threatened to place those who 234 00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:07,160 Speaker 1: do not complete state directives under involuntary hospitalization of policy, 235 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:12,600 Speaker 1: which mirrors efforts already underway in New York. Bands against camping, panhandling, 236 00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:16,880 Speaker 1: sleeping in one's car have also proliferated last spring. For instance, 237 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:19,920 Speaker 1: Tennessee made it a felony to camp on public owned land. 238 00:12:20,160 --> 00:12:23,319 Speaker 1: In Missouri, those caught sleeping on state property could now 239 00:12:23,360 --> 00:12:26,200 Speaker 1: get jail time and fines under a new law that 240 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:29,360 Speaker 1: just went into effect on January one. Other new laws 241 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:32,880 Speaker 1: outlawed campton l a next to schools and forbid houses 242 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 1: folks from sleeping on public transit in New York. In 243 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:39,680 Speaker 1: the progressive bashion of Asheville, North Carolina, over a dozen 244 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 1: Mutual Aid organizers also now faced trumped up charges of 245 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:48,080 Speaker 1: felony littering for supporting protest against sweeps of encampments. This 246 00:12:48,200 --> 00:12:51,200 Speaker 1: shift in many liberal cities to criminalize attack and band 247 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 1: encampments shows just how much the Democratic Party has continued 248 00:12:54,800 --> 00:12:57,640 Speaker 1: to move to the right while embracing Republicans line on 249 00:12:57,720 --> 00:13:01,679 Speaker 1: combating rising crime. Instead of mobilizing the state's forces to 250 00:13:01,760 --> 00:13:04,199 Speaker 1: house people need their most basic needs in a period 251 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: of mass pandemic and a growing housing crisis, liberal governments 252 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:11,200 Speaker 1: across the country have instead mobilized their forces to attack 253 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:13,600 Speaker 1: some of the most vulnerable. When you know more about 254 00:13:13,640 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 1: what's driving these ongoing attacks on the houses and how 255 00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:19,360 Speaker 1: it relates to the housing crisis itself, we sat down 256 00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 1: with Gifford Hartman, a long time radical organizer in the 257 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:26,760 Speaker 1: Bay Area. In a former squatter movements arise, like say 258 00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:31,040 Speaker 1: the George Floyd uprising, and there's some changes, There's some 259 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 1: movement towards reforms the police brutality and things like that, 260 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:37,439 Speaker 1: but then there's kind of a backlash. And I think 261 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:39,680 Speaker 1: right now we're kind of suffering through a backlash, and 262 00:13:39,760 --> 00:13:42,040 Speaker 1: I think that's kind of a pattern that happens is 263 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:45,960 Speaker 1: there's pushback kind of penal reform, trying to ring the 264 00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:47,920 Speaker 1: pelisse in a little bit, and then the kind of 265 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:51,680 Speaker 1: the backlash means just the police have more power, and 266 00:13:51,720 --> 00:13:53,920 Speaker 1: they have more power to really kind of brutalize on 267 00:13:54,000 --> 00:13:56,520 Speaker 1: house people. And I think we're living through that right now. 268 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,839 Speaker 1: I think the trends go, you know, like back in 269 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,440 Speaker 1: fourth and the pendulum has swung in the direction where 270 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:06,840 Speaker 1: right now in San Francisco there's constant sweeps of tents 271 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:09,439 Speaker 1: and how and how's people living on the streets. There's 272 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:12,040 Speaker 1: a lot of media support given to that, and it's 273 00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 1: kind of like, as I said, the tail lags the dog, 274 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:16,600 Speaker 1: and then they start doing all this stuff, and the 275 00:14:16,640 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 1: pushback hasn't really Activism hasn't really been able to kind 276 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:22,360 Speaker 1: of stand up to that and stop it or even 277 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 1: challenge it. Right now, at least what I see, booms 278 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,480 Speaker 1: happen and property values go up and vacancies go to 279 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: almost zero, the cops cracked down harder. And I think 280 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:35,480 Speaker 1: there have been periods, at least in my lifetime here 281 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:37,560 Speaker 1: in the Bay Area where there's kind of a lull 282 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 1: and there's the bottom of the trough when maybe there's 283 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:42,520 Speaker 1: more vacancies a little bit more wiggle room. The cops 284 00:14:42,560 --> 00:14:45,680 Speaker 1: quite aren't quite so brutal. But when things are peaking, 285 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: or when the economies, you know, it's dynamic kind of 286 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:52,320 Speaker 1: high points, that's where I see the repression is the 287 00:14:52,360 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 1: worst because there's more people to complain. There's more people 288 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:59,160 Speaker 1: whose you know, values are tied to property and who 289 00:14:59,240 --> 00:15:01,920 Speaker 1: are more will to push the cops to brutalize on 290 00:15:01,960 --> 00:15:05,120 Speaker 1: house people and um. But you know, right now it's 291 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,359 Speaker 1: kind of framed because there's a lot of tech layoffs, 292 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 1: Yet the agenda of sweeping tens and none house people 293 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 1: off the streets is kind of still kind of a 294 00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 1: rapid pace. So I don't know how much longer it 295 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:21,080 Speaker 1: to last, but right now it's that are pretty high 296 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:24,320 Speaker 1: point as we speak. The weather is awful and the 297 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,280 Speaker 1: sweeps haven't really stopped, and there aren't enough shelter beds 298 00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 1: to house although on the house folks. So it's really 299 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 1: a crisis. It's not only just a you know, a 300 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: human crisis, but it's a health crisis because people out 301 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:39,200 Speaker 1: in the cold rain are more vulnerable to getting sick 302 00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:41,640 Speaker 1: and dying. And it's it should be the time where 303 00:15:41,640 --> 00:15:44,440 Speaker 1: we're doing the opposite. We're making sure everybody's housed, and 304 00:15:44,560 --> 00:15:48,400 Speaker 1: it just certainly isn't happening. Even though San Francisco the 305 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:52,240 Speaker 1: merits have been Democrats, I believe since the mid sixties. 306 00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 1: The Democrats aren't a monolith, and they're not all progressive, 307 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,560 Speaker 1: and even the progressive ones aren't that good. But the 308 00:15:58,560 --> 00:16:02,520 Speaker 1: ones that are in power now, like mayor London Breed 309 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:06,240 Speaker 1: are moderates, and um they really are more believe in 310 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:08,640 Speaker 1: the police more, and they believe in using police for 311 00:16:08,760 --> 00:16:12,200 Speaker 1: social crimes. And when they're not moderate, it's a little 312 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:14,560 Speaker 1: less bad, but it's not better, it's just less bad. 313 00:16:14,600 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 1: And I don't know if that really makes sense, because 314 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:18,640 Speaker 1: I don't think there's ever been a political regime in 315 00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:21,720 Speaker 1: San Francisco that was in pro cop. You know, everybody 316 00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:25,200 Speaker 1: loves the cops. Everybody sees the cops is um ways 317 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:27,800 Speaker 1: to enforce the social values of society, which a private 318 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:30,360 Speaker 1: property and all that, and it just never stops. It 319 00:16:30,400 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: just depends how brutal they are. And again less I 320 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:35,840 Speaker 1: said earlier, it goes through waves, and presently we're in 321 00:16:35,880 --> 00:16:39,280 Speaker 1: a brutal way, and the only alternative that is a 322 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:42,240 Speaker 1: less brutal wave, and so my opinion, there's never a 323 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:44,960 Speaker 1: time when the cops don't, you know, run rapid, but 324 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:46,920 Speaker 1: just right now. But right now they're actually at the 325 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 1: high point that they've been in a long time. And 326 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:52,240 Speaker 1: now we speak with Javier from the National Coalition on 327 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:55,400 Speaker 1: Homelessness in San Francisco. We talked about the current wave 328 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 1: of attacks against house those people in big cities and 329 00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 1: how they mirror historic attempts to policing and repressing the poor. 330 00:17:02,600 --> 00:17:05,840 Speaker 1: The income that you need to rent a two bedroom apartment, 331 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,560 Speaker 1: by the city's own estimation, you need an hourly wage 332 00:17:09,600 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 1: of about six fifty to have an apartment like that. 333 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:18,480 Speaker 1: So the income gap is becoming more evident than ever. Nowadays, 334 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:22,240 Speaker 1: there's a nine percent increase in homelessness for every hundred 335 00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:25,440 Speaker 1: dollar increase in rents. So it's like if healthcare, housing, 336 00:17:25,760 --> 00:17:29,560 Speaker 1: education all gets more expensive but wages don't go up, 337 00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:32,880 Speaker 1: people are gonna lose their housing. Um. So I think 338 00:17:33,080 --> 00:17:37,199 Speaker 1: people need to understand and how similar we are to 339 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:40,560 Speaker 1: the unhoused population, and how important it is to recognize 340 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:43,400 Speaker 1: that we should have solidarity with each other, because if 341 00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:46,080 Speaker 1: we're fighting against each other, then guests was when the 342 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:51,480 Speaker 1: millionaires in the building we're suing the city because when 343 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:55,159 Speaker 1: they do these sweeps, they're taking people's belongings, which is 344 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:58,080 Speaker 1: the legal search and sdure and cruel and unusual punishment 345 00:17:58,119 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 1: because the shelter that they're offering and a lot of 346 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:05,199 Speaker 1: times it isn't adequate for the folks who are being sweat. 347 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 1: We're looking for permanent supportive haasm for folks and it's 348 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:12,280 Speaker 1: not there. And if you're telling people that they have 349 00:18:12,359 --> 00:18:15,439 Speaker 1: to move across the street every day in the morning, 350 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: then it kind of shows, I think, a social and 351 00:18:19,119 --> 00:18:24,200 Speaker 1: kind of cultural understanding that mirrors the other laws people 352 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:27,720 Speaker 1: have had in place, especially in America for a long time, 353 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: which is homeless people are not supposed to be seen 354 00:18:31,840 --> 00:18:35,920 Speaker 1: and they're supposed to be criminalized, and speaking of things 355 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:39,520 Speaker 1: that probably shouldn't be seen again some words from our sponsors, 356 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:52,919 Speaker 1: from resisting sweeps, studying up autonomous warming centers, to taking 357 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:56,560 Speaker 1: over vacant buildings. Over the past few years, there's been 358 00:18:56,560 --> 00:19:00,280 Speaker 1: a wide array of expressions of solidarity, direct action, and 359 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:02,639 Speaker 1: mutual aid in the face of attempts by the state 360 00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:06,120 Speaker 1: to displace and destroy the lives of houses people across 361 00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:09,360 Speaker 1: the US. But these projects and actions haven't come out 362 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:12,480 Speaker 1: of nowhere, building on the radical history of groups in 363 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:15,760 Speaker 1: the Bay Area, such as the Diggers and the White Panthers, 364 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 1: who set up free stores, grocery programs, and squatted buildings. 365 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:22,959 Speaker 1: Starting in the nineteen eighties, out of the anti nuclear movement, 366 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 1: peace activists began sharing free vegan food in a protest 367 00:19:26,520 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 1: of the U. S War budget under the banner Food 368 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 1: not Bombs. In the late nineteen eighties, Food Not Bombs 369 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:35,959 Speaker 1: in San Francisco faced over one thousand arrest for sharing 370 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:40,320 Speaker 1: free food publicly and taking part in demonstrations. Soon, another group, 371 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,680 Speaker 1: Homes Not Jails, evolved out the same scene and began 372 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,399 Speaker 1: to open up and squat vacant housing, part of a 373 00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:50,560 Speaker 1: wave of other houses activist groups that sprouted nationwide following 374 00:19:50,600 --> 00:19:54,160 Speaker 1: the economic recession of the nineteen eighties. Chapters of Homes 375 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:58,119 Speaker 1: Not Jail's work to open squats weekly to covertly housed people, 376 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:02,720 Speaker 1: also organizing public housing takeovers, which thrust squatting into the 377 00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:06,440 Speaker 1: spotlight of the mass media. Again. Here's Gifford Hartman talking 378 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 1: about squatting. In the nine nineties. There have been a 379 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:13,960 Speaker 1: wave of I'm really successful to squats. In the nineteen seventies. 380 00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:16,359 Speaker 1: One group was called the White Panthers that did it 381 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 1: in the Lower Hate neighborhood, and they were modeled on 382 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:22,560 Speaker 1: the Black Panthers. So they actually squatted, but actually created 383 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 1: community programs for things like we distribution. They defended their squads, 384 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,720 Speaker 1: they fortified their squads, and that was a tradition that 385 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:32,840 Speaker 1: kind of preceded my period of squatting. But so there 386 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 1: we're both looking at the squatting in Europe but also 387 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:38,800 Speaker 1: the previous generations doing it here in San Francisco. Um 388 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:40,920 Speaker 1: I moved to the Bay Area in nineteen eight six. 389 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:43,280 Speaker 1: I have been Berkeley for most of the beginning of 390 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:45,680 Speaker 1: the years I was here, from the end of World 391 00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 1: War Two in the nineteen forties. The population in San 392 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:53,320 Speaker 1: Francisco peak in the mid twentieth century, and then it 393 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:56,680 Speaker 1: went down. Population decreased by a hundred thousand in the 394 00:20:56,760 --> 00:20:59,159 Speaker 1: late eighties. There were still a lot of cracks in 395 00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 1: the surface some housing, and there was a lot of 396 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:05,600 Speaker 1: empty units. There's a lot of abandoned units, and there's 397 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:07,320 Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of ability to people to 398 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,119 Speaker 1: find squads, and I was part of that. And there 399 00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:12,679 Speaker 1: were various times where I either wasn't working or had 400 00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:15,480 Speaker 1: a part time job, and I chose as a political 401 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:18,199 Speaker 1: act of squad and I began doing that in late eighties, 402 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:21,040 Speaker 1: but most of my success in squatting was in their 403 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 1: early nineties. But then I kind of ran up against 404 00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:27,399 Speaker 1: the contradiction and groups like homesunte Jails were founded in 405 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:31,360 Speaker 1: nineteen two. I had already been squatting UM, but then 406 00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:36,320 Speaker 1: there was another wave of repression. So in n to UM, 407 00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 1: the former chief of police in San Francisco, Frank Jordan, 408 00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 1: got elected mayor and by nine three he was doing 409 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: something called the Matrix program. And the Matrix program was 410 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:50,120 Speaker 1: very much like what Juliani did in New York with 411 00:21:50,280 --> 00:21:53,560 Speaker 1: his zero tolerance for broken windows, which just cops would 412 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:56,800 Speaker 1: get tough on quality of life crimes which means like 413 00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:01,120 Speaker 1: broken windows and graffiti, but it also included food, not bombs. 414 00:22:01,160 --> 00:22:04,800 Speaker 1: Feedings were attacked by the police, and squatters were even 415 00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,320 Speaker 1: myself included, were attacked and cleared out, even in a 416 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:12,119 Speaker 1: way that was not legal. When I succeeded, we squatted covertly, 417 00:22:12,240 --> 00:22:14,800 Speaker 1: and when we didn't succeed often we were aligned with 418 00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:18,200 Speaker 1: groups like HOMESI Jails, where they were a high profile 419 00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:21,920 Speaker 1: group or a media savvy, well, media savvy might be 420 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:24,840 Speaker 1: an overstatement. They were kind of had a media focus, 421 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:27,879 Speaker 1: and the media focus was often a double edged sword. 422 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:32,760 Speaker 1: It brought popular understanding of the conditions of the housing stock, 423 00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:35,119 Speaker 1: but also it was a way for the police to 424 00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:37,520 Speaker 1: be telegraphed exactly what we were doing in to come 425 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:40,760 Speaker 1: down and crack down on our squads. Homes on Jails 426 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:43,159 Speaker 1: wouldn't be the last group to take over vacant homes 427 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:46,320 Speaker 1: for housing. In mid two thousand's Take Back the Land, 428 00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:49,639 Speaker 1: based out of Miami, Florida, work to block evictions and 429 00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:53,439 Speaker 1: move un housed families into foreclosed homes. In the present period, 430 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,680 Speaker 1: various grassroots groups have organized to stop the sweeping of 431 00:22:56,760 --> 00:23:00,480 Speaker 1: houses and caments cruise in Olympia, Washington, and Austin, Texas. 432 00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 1: I've been successful in organizing broad campaigns in Minneapolis groups 433 00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:08,399 Speaker 1: of mobilized mass numbers two at times all divictions. In 434 00:23:08,440 --> 00:23:10,919 Speaker 1: the following interview, we speak with Christian and Post from 435 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:13,960 Speaker 1: Minnieappolis on the ongoing battle with the city government and 436 00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:17,440 Speaker 1: police to stop at tax and sweeps on their houses neighbors. 437 00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:22,800 Speaker 1: In the summer of George Floyd was murdered by Minneapolis police. 438 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,080 Speaker 1: It raised a lot of people's awareness as to the 439 00:23:26,080 --> 00:23:29,439 Speaker 1: way that our systems and practices in our city aren't 440 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:32,480 Speaker 1: really serving us UM. I think there was there was 441 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:36,160 Speaker 1: a lot of work happening in Minneapolis in particular before 442 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:39,000 Speaker 1: that in regard to policing and the way that our 443 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:42,560 Speaker 1: systems do or do not serve people UM. And then 444 00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:48,680 Speaker 1: in the awareness just grew exponentially, and because that foundational 445 00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:53,000 Speaker 1: path had been laid already, we had something to go 446 00:23:53,160 --> 00:23:57,360 Speaker 1: with UM. And we can see the direct line between 447 00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:01,880 Speaker 1: what happened to George Floyd and to the community at 448 00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 1: George Floyd Square and the way that that also shows 449 00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:08,400 Speaker 1: up in other spaces in our communities, such as with 450 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:12,080 Speaker 1: our own house neighbors. We know that the majority of 451 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:16,359 Speaker 1: people that are living at encampments in Minneapolis are indigenous 452 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:22,480 Speaker 1: UM immigrant populations or UM black Americans, and so we 453 00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:26,160 Speaker 1: can see that there is you know, a specific need 454 00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:30,640 Speaker 1: and also a real um a you know, a disparity 455 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:35,640 Speaker 1: between and a direct through line to all of the 456 00:24:35,800 --> 00:24:41,160 Speaker 1: oppression that that d through in the face of every 457 00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:44,520 Speaker 1: you know, I mean person with a heart. Absolutely, and 458 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,280 Speaker 1: I think she started practicing a lot of mutual aid 459 00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 1: UM more like much bigger than we ever have his historically. 460 00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:55,479 Speaker 1: In the summer, we saw lots of people getting involved 461 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 1: that were encampments UM throughout the city as there was 462 00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 1: for some time because covid Um people were able to 463 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 1: stay outside and couldn't be evicted as easily UM at 464 00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:09,680 Speaker 1: that time. And we saw lots of community getting involved 465 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 1: and doing mutual aid UM and that really helped build 466 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 1: I think, UH, a movement that is, you know, sort 467 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,679 Speaker 1: of beautifully disorganized in many ways because lots of people 468 00:25:20,760 --> 00:25:23,359 Speaker 1: from lots of different walks of life coming together and 469 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:25,800 Speaker 1: showing up for each other. I mean, I think people 470 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:27,920 Speaker 1: started to become aware of the way that we are 471 00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:31,240 Speaker 1: all connected to each other, and that when when we're 472 00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:34,720 Speaker 1: taking care of each other, we're all happier, we're all safer, 473 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 1: we're actually able to meet needs and the resources are there. 474 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: It's a matter of the will. I cannot over emphasize 475 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 1: enough how terrible the boy Mayor Fray has been since 476 00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 1: he took power here and so called Minneapolis. You know, 477 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:53,960 Speaker 1: he ran on ending houselessness and was in the majority 478 00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:58,560 Speaker 1: funded by developers during his campaign, and we've seen what 479 00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 1: ending houselessness means to democrats. It basically means ending visible 480 00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: poverty and ending the lives of houseless people. But frankly, 481 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:11,359 Speaker 1: I mean the number of evictions over the course of 482 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,960 Speaker 1: the last few years has just skyrocketed. And you know, 483 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:18,960 Speaker 1: our so called progressive politicians love to give some money 484 00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:23,159 Speaker 1: to the nonprofit industrial complex and do their private public partnership, 485 00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 1: and then when there are people who are quote unquote 486 00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:28,680 Speaker 1: resistant to service, that's the that's the phrase they love 487 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 1: to use. They have all of their excuses lined ups 488 00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:34,760 Speaker 1: that they can just build those people's houses and kick 489 00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:36,440 Speaker 1: them out of the roofs that are keeping them warm 490 00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:41,040 Speaker 1: and dry. And it's just been a really eye opening 491 00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 1: thing for a lot of people, I think, to see 492 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:47,919 Speaker 1: how our progressive quote unquote establishment here has just fully 493 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,840 Speaker 1: committed to jack boot thuggery all in the name of 494 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:53,359 Speaker 1: clearing the streets and making it so that people in 495 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:57,280 Speaker 1: their kind of four story mixed use of condos can 496 00:26:57,440 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: can have a beautiful view without having to see the 497 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:04,359 Speaker 1: poverty that that lifestyle. You know, in the summer, there 498 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,360 Speaker 1: were several council at the time, council members who committed 499 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,240 Speaker 1: to um defunding the police. However, that did not contro 500 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:15,679 Speaker 1: fruition um. Since that time, there's been um increases in 501 00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,959 Speaker 1: the budget to policing in Minneapolis, no decreases, only increases 502 00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:22,960 Speaker 1: that police haven't been able to spend their whole budget, 503 00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 1: and yet the city continues to pour more money into them. 504 00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,960 Speaker 1: And what we're seeing happen is unhoused people come together 505 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:33,119 Speaker 1: to keep one another safe and also so community is 506 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:36,520 Speaker 1: able to stay connected with them and you know, will 507 00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 1: be in an encampment and then various levels of discovery 508 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 1: of government will come in and displace them, and so 509 00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 1: the people don't have anywhere else to go, so they 510 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,240 Speaker 1: need to move to a new space together. So what's 511 00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 1: happening is not housing. What's happening is not even laying 512 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,040 Speaker 1: a foundation for somebody to be able to get the 513 00:27:56,760 --> 00:27:59,680 Speaker 1: services or support that they may want or need. What's 514 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:04,080 Speaker 1: happened ing is displacement. When somebody hears about an eviction 515 00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:09,199 Speaker 1: potentially happening, it becomes a situation that's it's almost it's 516 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: almost kind of magical that people come together and it 517 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:17,439 Speaker 1: is kind of chaotic, but it always comes together and 518 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:20,520 Speaker 1: we end up having whether it's people they're doing copwatch 519 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,400 Speaker 1: or are just neighbors like we had neighbors show up 520 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:25,639 Speaker 1: on the first day, the day that the Corey was 521 00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: planned to be evicted on December UM. I can't tell 522 00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,359 Speaker 1: you how many different people that just live in that area. 523 00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:36,160 Speaker 1: We're coming up and asking questions, and we're appalled at 524 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 1: the response from the city because really that the Corey 525 00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:43,640 Speaker 1: encampment was in a space that you could barely see it. 526 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 1: You wouldn't know it was there. If you didn't know 527 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:48,080 Speaker 1: it was there, you know. And we're talking about by 528 00:28:48,080 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 1: the last day, the day that it was evicted, there 529 00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:54,160 Speaker 1: were eight people there and over a hundred and fifty 530 00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 1: police officers. It was bonkers. And that extreme response is 531 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,440 Speaker 1: something that when you see it, can't unsee it. And 532 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 1: so we come together in what you know, You get 533 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: in where you fit in, with whatever skills you have, 534 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:09,080 Speaker 1: whatever gifts you have, whatever time you have, you know, 535 00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:11,200 Speaker 1: and a lot of us show up because we are 536 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:14,280 Speaker 1: people who have experienced other forms of trauma or have 537 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 1: seen and experienced other forms of oppression too. You can't 538 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 1: unsee it once you do. In the last few years, 539 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:25,560 Speaker 1: mutual aid and autonomous disaster relief efforts have informed projects 540 00:29:25,600 --> 00:29:28,160 Speaker 1: like heat or Block, the squatting of land for people 541 00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:31,440 Speaker 1: displaced by climate change, field fires and the setting up 542 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,720 Speaker 1: of autonomous warming centers in the middle of winter. In 543 00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:39,480 Speaker 1: the winter of autonomous groups across Texas also mobilized when 544 00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:42,720 Speaker 1: the state's electrical grid failed and hundreds of people tragically 545 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 1: die due to lack of heat. Autonomous groups have also 546 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,160 Speaker 1: worked to directly house people in the Los Angeles area. 547 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:51,720 Speaker 1: This has looked like House of Folks taking over homes 548 00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:55,160 Speaker 1: owned by Caltrans and various groups in the Pacific Northwest, 549 00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:58,600 Speaker 1: occupying in domaining access to hotels, and the dead of winter. 550 00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 1: In Philadelphia, in housing activists squatted and then won the 551 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:07,120 Speaker 1: keys to homes for upwards of fifty unhoused families in 552 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:09,720 Speaker 1: the midst of the George Floyd Rebellion, and there have 553 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:13,400 Speaker 1: been other success stories as well. In Boise, Idaho, after 554 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,600 Speaker 1: months of ongoing protests by Houses Folks and their supporters, 555 00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:18,760 Speaker 1: the city was pushed to green light the building of 556 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: hundreds of housing units. In Berkeley, California, last summer, people 557 00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,640 Speaker 1: once again tore down the fences surrounding People's Park and 558 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:30,000 Speaker 1: destroyed machines, stopping the destruction of the autonomous enclave once again. 559 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:34,720 Speaker 1: In Sacramento, California, households. People and their supporters beat back 560 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:38,280 Speaker 1: in eviction attempt at Camp Resolution, a parking lot which 561 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,160 Speaker 1: is home to people living in their vehicles and r vs. 562 00:30:41,200 --> 00:30:45,240 Speaker 1: Here's two Camp Resolution residents, Sharon and Satara, who speak 563 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:48,400 Speaker 1: on the deadly impact of sweeps. I think that the 564 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:52,280 Speaker 1: biggest thing is like being treated inhumanely, you know what 565 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,800 Speaker 1: I mean, or rudely or like you're an animals. They're 566 00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 1: very mean to people, you know what I mean, when 567 00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:01,080 Speaker 1: they sweep you they take people stuff and just throw 568 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:03,720 Speaker 1: it out, no don't matter if it matters to them 569 00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 1: or you know what I mean, or you know which 570 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:09,280 Speaker 1: you know creates mental health issues for some people, because 571 00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:12,040 Speaker 1: people get traumatized from stuff like that, you know what 572 00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:14,600 Speaker 1: I mean. You just coming in and the only place 573 00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,160 Speaker 1: that they have that they can call home or a 574 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:20,360 Speaker 1: place of shelter, and you know, stormy times like this, 575 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:24,120 Speaker 1: you know, they come and even now while it's raining, 576 00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:26,600 Speaker 1: and make them move and tell them, you know, they 577 00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:28,720 Speaker 1: gotta go throw their things out or you know what 578 00:31:28,800 --> 00:31:32,480 Speaker 1: I mean, make them leave without whatever they you know 579 00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 1: what I mean, whatever, no matter if it's important to 580 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 1: them or not, you know what I mean. Like, I 581 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:39,800 Speaker 1: think that's the most messed up part because like I 582 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:42,239 Speaker 1: have a friend out here who who lost you know, 583 00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:45,240 Speaker 1: her child's ashes. You know what I mean, half to 584 00:31:45,640 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 1: half of the people that were at the we lose 585 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:50,080 Speaker 1: contact with us. And and every time they sweep that 586 00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:53,200 Speaker 1: for another half. And they're just dimnitioning people. Where people 587 00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:56,920 Speaker 1: are good, where are people going? They're just disappearing. And 588 00:31:57,040 --> 00:32:01,240 Speaker 1: before the you know, people who do need like other 589 00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:03,880 Speaker 1: help with other things, help things and stuff like that, 590 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 1: the harm reduction people and stuff like that that come 591 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:08,960 Speaker 1: out and you know, give people things their needs. You 592 00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,240 Speaker 1: know what I mean, they'll they'll they move you around, 593 00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:16,080 Speaker 1: they can't be found. People can die and people will 594 00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:19,240 Speaker 1: die like that all the time, especially you know when 595 00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,000 Speaker 1: they move us around. Sometimes we gotta go to areas 596 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 1: that are not necessarily safe, especially the women. You know 597 00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:26,560 Speaker 1: what I mean, women die out here all the time. 598 00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:31,520 Speaker 1: It separated. Calp Resolutions was formed because, uh, this lot 599 00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:34,120 Speaker 1: that we're on, it was part of the original sighting 600 00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,360 Speaker 1: plan and they spent six hundred seventeen thousand dollars on 601 00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,640 Speaker 1: this for a fence in a parking lot and promised 602 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,040 Speaker 1: folks that they would that they were going to get 603 00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:46,640 Speaker 1: them into little tidy houses or trailers so they can 604 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 1: get back on their feet and get housing. They swept 605 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,160 Speaker 1: them off the lot as soon as they were finished 606 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:54,960 Speaker 1: with this. They just came up. They came and viciously 607 00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:57,040 Speaker 1: swept them off, as the property the other side of 608 00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:00,640 Speaker 1: the property were on and could have fend to and 609 00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:03,760 Speaker 1: problems with people, and they got nothing and then didn't 610 00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,400 Speaker 1: even want to contact them or anything, and just left 611 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:09,520 Speaker 1: those people hanging after they signed up for all those services, 612 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:12,560 Speaker 1: and we're denied. And my sister in law was one 613 00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:16,040 Speaker 1: of those people, and she's a quadriplegic and she's still 614 00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,760 Speaker 1: waiting for housing, and we weren't gonna have another winter 615 00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:21,360 Speaker 1: of her being down on the countyside in the weather, 616 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:24,200 Speaker 1: in the water. So that's why we started it. And 617 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: if we're here for safety so we can get back 618 00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:29,360 Speaker 1: up on our feet, were human beings, not to mention, 619 00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:32,240 Speaker 1: like half more than half the camp, you know, the 620 00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:35,080 Speaker 1: majority of the camp. There are males that live here, 621 00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:36,800 Speaker 1: so please don't get me wrong, but this is the 622 00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:40,200 Speaker 1: camp of majority women. You know what I mean? Who 623 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:42,640 Speaker 1: out here, who live out here, and you know a 624 00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 1: lot of us, you know we're homeless, but we're not 625 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:47,680 Speaker 1: We're not bummed, you know what I mean. Like, we're not. Um. 626 00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:50,240 Speaker 1: We have regular lives like everyone else. We have family, 627 00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,680 Speaker 1: we have friends, you know what. We're like. We and 628 00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:54,719 Speaker 1: we take care of each other, you know what I'm saying. Like, 629 00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: And a lot of us have been campting right here 630 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:01,440 Speaker 1: for this last for years, some of us years up 631 00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:04,960 Speaker 1: against the county ends, you know what I'm saying. But 632 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:08,680 Speaker 1: for every success, sweeps remain a daily constant United States. 633 00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:11,440 Speaker 1: In many attempts to push back by houses folks and 634 00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:14,960 Speaker 1: their supporters are met with extreme resistance from law enforcement. 635 00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:17,880 Speaker 1: So I'm curious what you all think our game communities 636 00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:21,200 Speaker 1: continue to organize for change in the face of his brutality. 637 00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:23,919 Speaker 1: Something that comes to mind is just kind of more 638 00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:26,960 Speaker 1: of some things that have already been happening basically. Um. 639 00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:30,120 Speaker 1: And I'm thinking of Echo Park that you brought up, um. 640 00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:34,239 Speaker 1: And the Encama Park was really interesting to me because, um, 641 00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:39,360 Speaker 1: it was that that's a neighborhood in l A. And 642 00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:42,320 Speaker 1: it grew to maybe sort of two to three hundred 643 00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:45,560 Speaker 1: people living there. Um And as it went on, it 644 00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:48,240 Speaker 1: kind of like a sense of community developed pretty strongly 645 00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:51,680 Speaker 1: there with support from people in the neighborhood to UM 646 00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 1: and people had set up like a garden, a community kitchen. 647 00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:59,239 Speaker 1: They were like meetings, even showers near the end. Like 648 00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:02,640 Speaker 1: UM was actually kind of thriving. I guess it's like 649 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:07,360 Speaker 1: doing well and people are like pretty like uh politicized, 650 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:09,239 Speaker 1: are like aware of like what's going on and talking 651 00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:12,080 Speaker 1: about it and sharing with each other. UM and yeah, 652 00:35:12,120 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 1: people coming together to resist sweeps and like threats of 653 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:20,359 Speaker 1: sweeps of the park UM and the response to it 654 00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:22,360 Speaker 1: was one of the most like heavy handed, sort of 655 00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:27,319 Speaker 1: disproportionate seeming things that I've ever seen, where they had 656 00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:29,200 Speaker 1: been threatening the city had been threatening that they were 657 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 1: going to do a sweep, and they were saying they 658 00:35:30,640 --> 00:35:32,640 Speaker 1: were going to get everyone into housing. It's like this 659 00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:37,920 Speaker 1: humanitarian offer of secure housing to people, UM that they 660 00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,960 Speaker 1: came with like four hundred cops and like all the 661 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:42,840 Speaker 1: rest of like l A p D S four forcing 662 00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:46,919 Speaker 1: the helicopters and just like everything. They blocked entrances into 663 00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:49,200 Speaker 1: Echo Park to stop supporters coming from out of the 664 00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:54,280 Speaker 1: neighborhood UM and basically yeah, evicted people, fought with people 665 00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,920 Speaker 1: resisting UM and then put a fence up very quickly, 666 00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:01,200 Speaker 1: like during this whole thing and closed the park off 667 00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,120 Speaker 1: and that fence is still up, and that's like and 668 00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:05,439 Speaker 1: then what is it now a year and a half 669 00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:07,680 Speaker 1: or something these years that that fence has been up. 670 00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:10,800 Speaker 1: And something I think is like interesting about this example 671 00:36:11,160 --> 00:36:13,279 Speaker 1: is I really think that the reason that response was 672 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:16,440 Speaker 1: so heavy handed is because the very existence of it 673 00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:20,320 Speaker 1: was disrupting this logic of like rent and landlord in 674 00:36:20,480 --> 00:36:23,680 Speaker 1: terms of like people were reclaiming the comments, basically reclaiming 675 00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:26,399 Speaker 1: public space using it to meet their needs, and this 676 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:29,279 Speaker 1: was incredibly threatening to the city and they needed to 677 00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:32,000 Speaker 1: shut it down and sort of turn the park back 678 00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:36,560 Speaker 1: into recreation for middle class people basically. Um. And I 679 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:39,640 Speaker 1: think you know what we've talked about already, like um, Tom, 680 00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:41,880 Speaker 1: what you were talking about with like enclosure and stuff like, 681 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,200 Speaker 1: I really see that these sweeps like this is such 682 00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:46,839 Speaker 1: a just a continuation of this in Echo Park um 683 00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:48,799 Speaker 1: in a really big way. And what you were saying 684 00:36:48,840 --> 00:36:50,960 Speaker 1: more about just like what happens when we challenge that 685 00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:54,000 Speaker 1: logic being the most like threatening thing to them, you know, 686 00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:55,799 Speaker 1: of just like what happens if it was just like 687 00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:59,160 Speaker 1: this home was camp survived and then another encampment, another encampment, 688 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:02,239 Speaker 1: and it basically disrupts everything we know about property and 689 00:37:02,239 --> 00:37:06,839 Speaker 1: rents and everything. Anyway, So I think just more of that, Yeah, 690 00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:08,279 Speaker 1: I mean I would, Yeah, I agree with you. So 691 00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:10,240 Speaker 1: I think it's like more of what's happened. Like currently 692 00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:13,480 Speaker 1: New York there's still sweets happening, like um DTAs Department 693 00:37:13,520 --> 00:37:15,880 Speaker 1: of Home of Services puts up these like UM sweet 694 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,160 Speaker 1: notices UM. And the way it works is that when 695 00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:20,879 Speaker 1: these two TEPS notices go up, like there's a group 696 00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:22,560 Speaker 1: of people who let each other know that sweet is 697 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:24,880 Speaker 1: about to happen. People show up to the people who 698 00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:27,080 Speaker 1: are about to be swept. I hate that word swept. 699 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:28,920 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that's so disgusting. What can we use 700 00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:31,920 Speaker 1: instead of swept um treated badly by evil air adoms? 701 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:34,080 Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe we could do that, um. But anyway, 702 00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:36,600 Speaker 1: so like UM, so people will go and talk to 703 00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:38,040 Speaker 1: the people who are in the encampment we're going to 704 00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:39,680 Speaker 1: be swept and asked them like what type of support 705 00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:41,399 Speaker 1: would you like? Like do you want us to help 706 00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:43,000 Speaker 1: you us move your stuff? Do you want us to 707 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:45,400 Speaker 1: stand you know when the cops and like so, the 708 00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,360 Speaker 1: sanitation department comes usually during these cleanups and like throws 709 00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:51,839 Speaker 1: away people's things. And because you don't if you don't 710 00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:55,640 Speaker 1: serve capitalism, your stuff you don't matter. So definitely your 711 00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:58,360 Speaker 1: stuff doesn't matter. One thing that has been happening is 712 00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:00,440 Speaker 1: that people have been showing up for people who are 713 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 1: about to be how their things drown out and either 714 00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,760 Speaker 1: moving the things for them or supporting them, or standing 715 00:38:05,760 --> 00:38:07,400 Speaker 1: in the way from in front of the police, or 716 00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:09,600 Speaker 1: like documenting it. And I think that's like a huge 717 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:11,560 Speaker 1: way to just like show up right now if you can, 718 00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:14,480 Speaker 1: you sickly block out time on your calendar at work, 719 00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:16,719 Speaker 1: if you know something happening down the state, like this 720 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:18,600 Speaker 1: is like something like you could do now. And I 721 00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:20,759 Speaker 1: think that's really important. Like this is solidarity that we 722 00:38:20,800 --> 00:38:23,400 Speaker 1: should show and which show up for our comrades because 723 00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:26,080 Speaker 1: they are on the ground of fighting for us having 724 00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:28,000 Speaker 1: housing as a human right, and that's why we should 725 00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:30,680 Speaker 1: show up for them and to support them. Another item 726 00:38:30,719 --> 00:38:31,880 Speaker 1: that I wanted to bring up, I don't know if 727 00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:35,280 Speaker 1: y'all heard about anarchy rope which happened last year, where 728 00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:38,960 Speaker 1: like s RG, which is the Strategic Response Group, showed up. 729 00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:42,239 Speaker 1: This is a counter terrorism group, y'all showed up to 730 00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:46,759 Speaker 1: get people out of an encampment in Tompkins Square, which 731 00:38:46,760 --> 00:38:48,680 Speaker 1: was deemed anarchy. Right. I think it was like five people. 732 00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:52,759 Speaker 1: Five people brought in SRG or counter terrorism groups. It 733 00:38:52,840 --> 00:38:56,160 Speaker 1: just goes to show you the extent to which like houses, 734 00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:58,839 Speaker 1: people taking a public space is a threat to ide, 735 00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 1: the idea of property as we know it is a 736 00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:04,080 Speaker 1: threat to capitalist and there's a threat to landlords like 737 00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:06,480 Speaker 1: Eric Adams. Eric Adams is a landlord. I don't know 738 00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:08,000 Speaker 1: if you all know that this the New York the 739 00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:09,759 Speaker 1: New York City mayors a landlord. If you need to 740 00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:12,920 Speaker 1: know anything as to why they're sweeping homeless people. Landlords 741 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:16,240 Speaker 1: run everything and they have rats like Eric Adams because 742 00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,120 Speaker 1: he had racks and he was supposed to pay a 743 00:39:18,120 --> 00:39:20,120 Speaker 1: fine and he didn't pay a fine because he's the landlord. 744 00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:21,879 Speaker 1: I guess just going back to that is like, yeah, 745 00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,120 Speaker 1: show up for people now, like the need now is 746 00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:26,439 Speaker 1: like when steeps are happening, is for people to show 747 00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:28,799 Speaker 1: up in place with people. And the other part of it. 748 00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:31,000 Speaker 1: I want to say this, and this is a wild idea, 749 00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:32,840 Speaker 1: but I've been thinking about it for a while. What 750 00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:35,759 Speaker 1: do we all stop paying rent? What if we all did. 751 00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:37,880 Speaker 1: What if we got together with all our friends and 752 00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:39,840 Speaker 1: stop paying rent? And I know this is wild, and 753 00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:42,040 Speaker 1: I know some people might be like, oh no, Marcella, 754 00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:43,760 Speaker 1: we're gonna get a victim. But what have we paid rents? 755 00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:45,400 Speaker 1: And we all thought the cops and they're trying to 756 00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:47,520 Speaker 1: pay us when when when they're trying to evict all 757 00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:49,279 Speaker 1: of us? So like that's another part of it, is 758 00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:51,880 Speaker 1: like showing up to people's evictions, trying to come up together, 759 00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:54,200 Speaker 1: to come up with a long strategy. Because houses people 760 00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:56,360 Speaker 1: right now are fighting for us to like have housing 761 00:39:56,400 --> 00:39:57,840 Speaker 1: as a human right. We can meet them on the 762 00:39:57,880 --> 00:39:59,480 Speaker 1: other end and say, actually, we're not going to pay 763 00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:01,799 Speaker 1: rent as long as we're doing this because we're That's 764 00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:06,359 Speaker 1: like solidarity. When I'm thinking about how to resist displacement, 765 00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:09,520 Speaker 1: you know, what I go back to is squatter movements 766 00:40:09,520 --> 00:40:12,520 Speaker 1: that existed in Europe, right, like the social center movements 767 00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:15,160 Speaker 1: in the seventies and eighties, um, but also squatting that 768 00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:17,080 Speaker 1: happened in the Rust Belt in the two thousand's, right, 769 00:40:17,120 --> 00:40:20,360 Speaker 1: And like what was unique about those situations, Like others 770 00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:23,960 Speaker 1: have have existed, obviously, but what was unique about those 771 00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,800 Speaker 1: situations is that squatting became about more than just space. 772 00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:30,080 Speaker 1: It also became about autonomy and self defense. Right. So 773 00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:33,040 Speaker 1: in those situations, what would happen is in these Rust 774 00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:35,640 Speaker 1: Belt squads, people would like lock down a whole street 775 00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:37,880 Speaker 1: and take over a house and then just that was 776 00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,880 Speaker 1: just their space, you know, and the cops just couldn't 777 00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:44,080 Speaker 1: get back there or didn't want to get back there, um. 778 00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:46,880 Speaker 1: And some of those squads held out for years, like 779 00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:49,480 Speaker 1: years and years and years um. And we see that 780 00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:51,840 Speaker 1: in Europe too. And so what that does, though, is 781 00:40:51,880 --> 00:40:56,120 Speaker 1: it it accomplishes something really important which I think we 782 00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:59,880 Speaker 1: have to sort of shift in our discussions of this question, 783 00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,719 Speaker 1: which is that the question isn't just about housing. The 784 00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:08,480 Speaker 1: questions about space, right, and very specifically, how we understand space. 785 00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:12,240 Speaker 1: So currently we talked about a neighborhood, or when city 786 00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:15,120 Speaker 1: politicians talked about a neighborhood, they don't mean what I 787 00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:16,799 Speaker 1: think a lot of us mean. Like a lot of 788 00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:19,759 Speaker 1: us we talked about our neighborhoods. I mean, like our neighbors, right, 789 00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:22,279 Speaker 1: the people that live around the corner, the old lady 790 00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:24,080 Speaker 1: up the street that feeds the cats, like whatever it 791 00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:26,719 Speaker 1: happens to be, you know, like you have a community 792 00:41:26,719 --> 00:41:28,560 Speaker 1: that you live in, at least where I live. When 793 00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:31,759 Speaker 1: city politicians talk about a neighborhood, what they mean is 794 00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:37,360 Speaker 1: real estate. They mean this fragmented space of commodified housing 795 00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:41,680 Speaker 1: where individual houses can just be slotted in and slotted out. 796 00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:44,080 Speaker 1: New residents could just be slatted in and slotted out, 797 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,919 Speaker 1: and the space becomes reduced down to its physical form, right, 798 00:41:48,560 --> 00:41:51,680 Speaker 1: and within all capitalists understanding some space, that is what happens. 799 00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:55,680 Speaker 1: Space gets reduced down to the commodification of that space, right. 800 00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:59,600 Speaker 1: And so when we're talking about that inscription into our spaces, 801 00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:02,279 Speaker 1: you know, it's saying earlier that doesn't occur without the 802 00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:06,560 Speaker 1: ability to get arrested for trustpassing. And so this becomes 803 00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:08,920 Speaker 1: a fight against the police as much as it's a 804 00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:11,879 Speaker 1: fight against housing, because at the end of the day, 805 00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:16,120 Speaker 1: the enforcements of that structuring of space comes through the 806 00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:18,959 Speaker 1: projection of police force into that space, right, whether that's 807 00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:22,480 Speaker 1: passive things like surveillance, with those active things like sending 808 00:42:22,480 --> 00:42:24,960 Speaker 1: a counter terrorism team to evict five people from a 809 00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:28,000 Speaker 1: park in Manhattan. And so as we're kind of like 810 00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:33,120 Speaker 1: looking through this, we can take some interesting sort of examples. 811 00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:36,160 Speaker 1: I mean, the Paris Commune had a whole discourse that 812 00:42:36,200 --> 00:42:38,920 Speaker 1: talked just about how they were going to rebuild the city, 813 00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:41,840 Speaker 1: like what is the city going to look like without property? 814 00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:44,320 Speaker 1: How are we going to restructure our use of space? 815 00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:48,279 Speaker 1: Who gets to decide how to use these big public spaces? Right? 816 00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:50,960 Speaker 1: These were the big discussions that were happening. The Situations 817 00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:54,799 Speaker 1: International had a whole discourse on building conceptual cities and 818 00:42:54,840 --> 00:42:57,319 Speaker 1: avant garde cities, and you know, graffiti was a big 819 00:42:57,400 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: part of that because what is graffiti. Graffiti is the 820 00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:03,160 Speaker 1: market of people's presence in space. Why do you cities 821 00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:05,640 Speaker 1: cracked down under feeding so hard every single time? So 822 00:43:05,680 --> 00:43:07,800 Speaker 1: it puts a tag up, that's a gap in police coverage, 823 00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:11,680 Speaker 1: is being marked literally every single time. Right, And so 824 00:43:11,840 --> 00:43:14,720 Speaker 1: when we're talking about these questions, we have to push 825 00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:18,560 Speaker 1: this into a question of capitalism in general, but that 826 00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:20,920 Speaker 1: makes it a question of the state. We can't talk 827 00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:23,279 Speaker 1: about capitalism and isolation from that, and so we have 828 00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:27,239 Speaker 1: to really talk about how our spaces are fragmented and 829 00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:30,799 Speaker 1: the ways that things like even encampments or squats or 830 00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:33,759 Speaker 1: things like this that are defended that are able to 831 00:43:33,800 --> 00:43:36,919 Speaker 1: be sort of preserved asn't the right word are able 832 00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:40,040 Speaker 1: to maintain their autonomy. Those becomes sort of the models 833 00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:42,439 Speaker 1: of different ways to live in some ways, right, these 834 00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:45,400 Speaker 1: become the places where people are experimenting with different types 835 00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:48,919 Speaker 1: of living, whether it's my choice or not. But these 836 00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:52,400 Speaker 1: are the spaces that get eliminated because of that specific 837 00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:57,800 Speaker 1: dynamic right that they are fundamentally violating the entire concept 838 00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:00,440 Speaker 1: of property in their very exist and that's why we 839 00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:02,040 Speaker 1: see the crackdown is happening. The way that they are. 840 00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:05,400 Speaker 1: Democrats are just as you know, complicit in that as 841 00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:10,520 Speaker 1: Republicans are. It's it's functionally no different, especially after the 842 00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:12,719 Speaker 1: George Floyd uprising, where you really seeing a lot of 843 00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:15,719 Speaker 1: democratic cities them hiring a lot more cops, giving them 844 00:44:15,719 --> 00:44:17,640 Speaker 1: a lot more guns, like doing the same stuff that 845 00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:20,400 Speaker 1: happened in more conservative cities. Right, the gap is almost 846 00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:23,280 Speaker 1: non existent. That's going to do it for us. Once again, 847 00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:25,440 Speaker 1: this has been the It's going down cruise squatting the 848 00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:28,400 Speaker 1: offices of it could happen here. Thanks again for listening, 849 00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:35,279 Speaker 1: and we will see you soon. It could happen here 850 00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:38,000 Speaker 1: as a production of poo Zone Media and more podcasts 851 00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:40,600 Speaker 1: and cool Zone Media, visit our website cool Zone Media 852 00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:42,439 Speaker 1: dot com or check us out on the I Heart 853 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:45,560 Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts, 854 00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:48,240 Speaker 1: you can find sources for It could happen here, Updated 855 00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:51,800 Speaker 1: monthly at cool Zone media dot com, slash sources. Thanks 856 00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:52,320 Speaker 1: for listening.