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Speaker 1: Stone's Touring Party is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hello everyone, and welcome back to Stone's Touring Party. I'm

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Speaker 2: your host Jordan run tug Well. We've hit the midpoint

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Speaker 2: of our series this week and we truly hope you've

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Speaker 2: been enjoying it so far. To mark the occasion, we're

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Speaker 2: going to take a little pit stop from the road

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Speaker 2: and catch up with one of the key members of

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Speaker 2: the STP tour squad. So far on the show, we've

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Speaker 2: heard from legendary rock journalist Robert Greenfield, who was covering

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Speaker 2: the trek for Rolling Stone magazine, and also Gary Stromberg,

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Speaker 2: the Stones pr chief. Now we're going to hear from

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Speaker 2: the third member of the Little Tour Triumvirate, Chris O'Dell

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Speaker 2: Tanny Rock Scholars listening. She needs no introduction, but we're

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Speaker 2: going to give her one anyway, because darn it, she

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Speaker 2: deserves it. Back in nineteen sixty eight, she uprooted herself

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Speaker 2: from the West Coast to settle in London, where she

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Speaker 2: went to work for the Beatles at Apple Records. There,

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Speaker 2: her duties ranged from singing on the chorus to Hey Jude,

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Speaker 2: to living with George and Patty Harrison as their trusted

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Speaker 2: friend in Pa. With the Fab four in her resume,

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Speaker 2: her life would never be ordinary again. Since then, she's

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Speaker 2: been a confidant and indispensable associate to some of the

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Speaker 2: greatest artists in history. The New York Times described her

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Speaker 2: as Nick Carraway to rock's egotistical Gatsby. In other words,

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Speaker 2: a conscientious observer, an occasional participant in the wild decadence

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Speaker 2: only found in the seventies music world. George Harrison, her

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Speaker 2: one time boss, immortalized her in the song miss O'Dell.

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Speaker 2: Leon Russell wooed her by writing Pisse's Apple Lady in

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Speaker 2: her honor. She's the woman down the Hall in Joni

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Speaker 2: Mitchell's Coyote, and was pictured on the back cover of

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Speaker 2: The Rolling Stones Exile on Main Street. More than a muse,

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Speaker 2: she held a groundbreaking role as one of just a

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Speaker 2: handful of professional women in rock, managing Gargante Win globe

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Speaker 2: trotting tours for the likes of Crosby, Stills, Nash and

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Speaker 2: Young Bob Dylan, Lynda Ronstadt, Santana, Phil Collins, Earthwin in

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Speaker 2: fire Fleetwood mac Queen and the Electric Light Orchestra, just

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Speaker 2: to name a few. But she first earned her stripes

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Speaker 2: on the SDP tour with the Stones. After retiring from

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Speaker 2: the road in the eighties, she began a new career

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Speaker 2: as a therapist, helping counsel an untold number of people

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Speaker 2: through their addictions. Chris detailed their extraordinary experiences in her

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Speaker 2: twenty ten memoir Miss O'Dell. Hard Days and Long Nights

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Speaker 2: with the Beatles, The Stones, Bob Dylan, and Eric Clapton.

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Speaker 2: I can't recommend it highly enough. When David Crosby learned

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Speaker 2: that Chris O'Dell was writing a book, his response was instantaneous,

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Speaker 2: Oh shit, because she saw it all. To quote the

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Speaker 2: opening lines in her book, I wasn't famous, I wasn't

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Speaker 2: even almost famous, but I was there. A documentary on

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Speaker 2: her life is currently in the works and due to

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Speaker 2: premiere later this year, but consider this chat a small sample.

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Speaker 2: Though she remained in touch with Robert Greenfield and Gary Stromberg,

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Speaker 2: this was the first time the three of them have

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Speaker 2: talked since the STP tour wrapped in the summer of

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Speaker 2: seventy two, after more than half a century and a

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Speaker 2: few camera problems. At the start of the zoom Call,

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Speaker 2: the memories came flooding back. Chris was having some repair

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Speaker 2: work done in her home, so she called in from

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Speaker 2: the office of a congressman. We had so much to

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Speaker 2: talk about that I didn't even get to ask her

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Speaker 2: about this connection, But somehow it seems fitting the talented

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Speaker 2: and insightful Chris O'Dell as many friends in high places.

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Speaker 2: I hope you enjoy our conversation. Is this the first

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Speaker 2: time the three of you have all spoken since nineteen

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Speaker 2: seventy two?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, together in one group. We've talked separately.

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Speaker 3: Yes, I am.

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Speaker 2: I am honored.

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Speaker 5: Chris bikes to keep Gary and I apart and how

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Speaker 5: it works.

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Speaker 4: I think it's so rotten that you wouldn't show USh

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Speaker 4: your face today.

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Speaker 2: I don't believe for a minute you can't figure it out.

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Speaker 4: He just doesn't want to show me how old he's got.

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Speaker 5: Richard, I'm not going to ever look better than you do.

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Speaker 5: So what's the point?

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Speaker 4: Okay, oh god, you're going to get out of that?

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Speaker 2: I guess the start. We opened the show with a

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Speaker 2: question to Bob and Gary, and it was actually the

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Speaker 2: first question I asked on the day of interviews, and

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Speaker 2: I showed up with sixteen pages of questions because I'm

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Speaker 2: a lunatic and The first question wasn't actually one that

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Speaker 2: I wrote down, and I love their response so much

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Speaker 2: that it's the first sound you hear on the show,

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Speaker 2: and I wanted to put the question to you the

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Speaker 2: STP tour. Was it fun?

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Speaker 4: Well, that would be one word I would use.

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Speaker 2: I'm not sure that.

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Speaker 4: It wouldn't be followed by other things. And I did

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Speaker 4: actually listen to your first segment last night. I was

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Speaker 4: listening to it, and I think they had many more

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Speaker 4: adjectives than I have. It was fun, It was unprecedented.

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Speaker 4: I felt so lucky to be on that tour because

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Speaker 4: I wasn't supposed to be And it was also hard.

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Speaker 4: It was really hard to be on that tour. It

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Speaker 4: was hard because there were a lot of drugs and

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Speaker 4: there was a lot of no sleeping, and we were

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Speaker 4: moving all the time, and it was chaotic at times.

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Speaker 4: It was like, what was it? Organized chaos? I think

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Speaker 4: it would be the way to describe it. It was

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Speaker 4: organized chaos. So but for me, it was definitely. I

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Speaker 4: think the drugs I came off with that, I walked

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Speaker 4: away with that one. But that had on I mean, I.

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Speaker 2: Guess, just to take it back a little ways that

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Speaker 2: you obviously you got your start in the rock world

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Speaker 2: at Dot Records and then went to work for the Beatles.

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Speaker 2: Can you talk a little bit about making that jump

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Speaker 2: to the Stones camp? What was that like?

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Speaker 5: Well?

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Speaker 4: I had met Mick in London when I was still

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Speaker 4: working at Apple, and not that we were friends or anything,

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Speaker 4: but when they were moving to LA to finish Exile

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Speaker 4: on Main Street, Marshall Chess, who was the head of

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Speaker 4: their rolling Stone Records at that time, needed an assistant

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Speaker 4: and I had come back to LA to work for

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Speaker 4: Peter Asher. So I was told about that position and

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Speaker 4: I thought, yeah, I'd rather be working for a band

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Speaker 4: and sitting in a management office. So I got the job.

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Speaker 4: But it turned out I really didn't see Marshall very often.

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Speaker 4: He was doing his own things. So basically I was

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Speaker 4: mostly assisting Mick and Keith during the times that they

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Speaker 4: lived in LA. So I started off by finding them

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Speaker 4: places to live. For three of them Mick Taylor also

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Speaker 4: stayed in LA. The other two they would just come

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Speaker 4: over when they were needed. So I worked every day

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Speaker 4: at mix House basically, and I helped them all. Prior

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Speaker 4: to the tour, I was still assisting them, but I

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Speaker 4: wasn't included in the tour because I didn't really have

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Speaker 4: a job. Now that I've done a lot more tours,

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Speaker 4: I can totally understand that, but at the time I

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Speaker 4: felt still left out. So Mick said, don't worry, I'll

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Speaker 4: get you there. So I missed the first what was

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Speaker 4: at Vancouver, Seattle, San Francisco. I missed those shows, But

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Speaker 4: when they got down to the southern part of California,

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Speaker 4: then I got on them and Nick said, look, don't worry,

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Speaker 4: I'll figure out a way, and he did. I think

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Speaker 4: after they were in Chicago. Right before they were in Chicago,

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Speaker 4: he called and said, would you go to the airport

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Speaker 4: and pick up some things that have been sent from

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Speaker 4: Ozzie Clark in London, so meet the costumes And I said, okay,

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Speaker 4: what do you want me to do with them me?

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Speaker 4: He said, bring them to Chicago. So that's how I

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Speaker 4: ended up in the madness. Other that I was doing

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Speaker 4: quite sanely in La b.

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Speaker 5: I forgot this. Chris, you were in the Playboy mansion

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Speaker 5: with us? Yes, you didn't stay there, did you?

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Speaker 4: Well? I think that we all pretty much stayed there

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Speaker 4: the whole night. No, I was I had a hotel

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Speaker 4: room all right right, Yeah, I came to Bill an Astro.

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Speaker 4: I came and was staying with them and visiting with

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Speaker 4: them at the mansion. But it was a long I mean,

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Speaker 4: I don't even remember going back to the hotel.

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Speaker 2: I can't even imagine what the Playboy Mansion was like

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Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy two, what Hugh Hefner was like in

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Speaker 2: seventy two. What was your feeling on that scene?

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Speaker 4: Like, you know, I thought it was pretty weird for

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Speaker 4: a kickoff to be. Hugh Hefner was wearing a bathrobe.

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Speaker 4: Stevie Wonder did a set. He came in and he

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Speaker 4: and his band set up and they did a set

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Speaker 4: for Hugh in the main room. It was the funniest

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Speaker 4: thing is it was like Astro told me right off

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Speaker 4: the bat, if you need anything to eat, don't worry.

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Speaker 4: You can get it anytime you want. Just tell them

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Speaker 4: what you want and it can be anything. That was

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Speaker 4: pretty bizarre, but we you know, it was just fun.

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Speaker 4: I mean, people were laughing. There was a game room,

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Speaker 4: there was a pool, it was a play it was

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Speaker 4: it was Disneyland on speed.

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Speaker 5: So just to clarify, Chris is talking about Bill Wyman

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Speaker 5: and his companion at the time Astrad.

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Speaker 4: Lindstrom and Lundstrom.

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Speaker 5: It was one of the few other women on tour,

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Speaker 5: right Chris.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, they didn't bring their wives out. No one

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Speaker 4: brought their wives out at that period of time. But

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Speaker 4: that was part of Bill's deal with the Stones is

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Speaker 4: I won't come if I can't bring her. So she

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Speaker 4: was actually about the only woman.

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Speaker 2: Wow, I mean, thinking about the whole Playboy Aura in

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Speaker 2: nineteen seventy two, it feels like such a I mean,

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Speaker 2: I know this is from the vantage point of fifty

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Speaker 2: years later, but seems like such a culture shock to

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Speaker 2: you know, the burgeoning women's liberation movement, and you know,

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Speaker 2: you were a professional woman in rock and roll, Like

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Speaker 2: was that? How did those two worlds coexist?

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Speaker 4: I don't, honestly. I was thinking about it this morning

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Speaker 4: and I thought, well, first of all, you know I

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Speaker 4: always say when your resume starts with the Beatles, you

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Speaker 4: pretty much can it's kind of easier to get a

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Speaker 4: job after that. So then the Rolling Stones were unnatural,

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Speaker 4: you know, here I go to them. But it didn't

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Speaker 4: ever occur to me. I did realize I was the

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Speaker 4: only woman mostly on the tour except when girlfriends came

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Speaker 4: and everything, But I was busy. I had a job

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Speaker 4: to do, so I just felt in a lot of

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Speaker 4: ways like I was one of the guys just doing

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Speaker 4: my job. And I was thinking about it today and

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Speaker 4: I thought, you know, it is kind of interesting that

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Speaker 4: I did all that and I never thought about making money.

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Speaker 4: I was, I mean, two good at a time, so

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Speaker 4: I didn't think about, jeez, I should probably figure out

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Speaker 4: how to make some money out of this.

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Speaker 5: Chris, hadn't you come off an extended tour with Santana

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Speaker 5: right before the.

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Speaker 4: Crosby Stills, Nash and Young was the tour? No? I

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Speaker 4: did that afterwards. The Stones was the first tour I did. Wow,

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Speaker 4: that was my initiation tour.

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Speaker 2: That's just the heck of an initiation. I mean, I

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Speaker 2: I guess the thing that's always interesting to me is

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Speaker 2: at what point did the star struck feeling wear off?

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Speaker 2: And I know, I'm sure you were acclimated to this

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Speaker 2: with the Beatles too, But at what point did the

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Speaker 2: Stones just become you know, the guys or did that

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Speaker 2: ever happen?

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Speaker 4: Well? It did because I saw them every day, and

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Speaker 4: you know it started with you know, probably earlier when

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Speaker 4: I went to work with the Beatles. Because it was

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Speaker 4: my first time being around that level of celebrity fame.

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Speaker 4: But I think after a while you just get used

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Speaker 4: to it and you become They become friends, you get

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Speaker 4: to know who they are. You know, you like them,

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Speaker 4: you don't like them, you like things about them, you

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Speaker 4: don't like things about them. So they lose that that glow,

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Speaker 4: that luster fairly quickly and just become people. And that's

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Speaker 4: what they are. They're just people who play music really well.

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Speaker 2: The really good music.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, even with the Beatles, wasn't it different being in

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Speaker 5: England with them than what it was like being with

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Speaker 5: the Stones in America?

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Speaker 4: Well, it was different, And yes, for one thing. When

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Speaker 4: I lived in England and worked for the Beatles, which

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Speaker 4: was way back in sixty eight sixty nine, the culture

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Speaker 4: was so different. It's like one of the things that

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Speaker 4: I continue to repeat is I went there with this

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Speaker 4: American attitude and said I want things right now. In

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Speaker 4: America that meant tomorrow. In England met next week. So

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Speaker 4: it was a lot easier to get things done in

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Speaker 4: the States. But I mean, I know you guys have

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Speaker 4: talked about this. It is amazing when you think about it.

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Speaker 4: We had no cell phones, no computers. We had to

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Speaker 4: go look for phones a lot of the time, so

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Speaker 4: it's amazing that we even got through that whole period

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Speaker 4: without modern technology.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I was in the midst of writing an

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Speaker 2: introduction for you for this episode, and I was struggling

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Speaker 2: to find the proper term for what you were on

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Speaker 2: the tour and for the Stones, because you just seemed

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Speaker 2: to do everything. An assistant didn't seem to do justice

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Speaker 2: to what you did. And to think of all that

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Speaker 2: you did without the aid of the Internet or cell phones,

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Speaker 2: it's absolutely mind boggling. I mean, just can you talk

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Speaker 2: a little more about just the variety of the thing

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Speaker 2: that I mean, every day must have been anything could

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Speaker 2: happened today in terms of what was on your agenda.

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Speaker 4: Well, during the Stones, when I was working for them

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Speaker 4: in La, of course, every day was different. It would

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Speaker 4: be helping to get lyrics typed up. It would type

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Speaker 4: up lyrics, give them back to make I had to

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Speaker 4: sit and listen to the recordings they would bring in

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Speaker 4: or the acetates and get the words they didn't write

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Speaker 4: them down, and then Mick would come back and correct

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Speaker 4: them or Keith would And then on the other hand,

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Speaker 4: I could be looking for someone to come and clean

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Speaker 4: their house, or a babysit, a nanny over here, or

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Speaker 4: go to the bank and get money for them. You know,

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Speaker 4: it just varied. It was everyday occurrence, but on the

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Speaker 4: tour my job was a lot more limited because everybody

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Speaker 4: else was doing so much, so I work directly for them.

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Speaker 4: Mick would say, would you fly to New York and

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Speaker 4: get my camera fixed? Take it to Kodak and get

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Speaker 4: the camera fixed. Or Keith would say, would you fly

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Speaker 4: to LA and pick up some stuff and bring it back,

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Speaker 4: Or you know, can you get my cleaning in. Can

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Speaker 4: you make sure these clothes get cleaned overnight. It was

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Speaker 4: it's just so many things. You never knew what was

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Speaker 4: coming next.

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Speaker 2: I wanted to ask you. I know, when your book

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Speaker 2: came out, every journalist seemed to ask you about going

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Speaker 2: on a drug run for Keith Richards. That was always

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Speaker 2: the craze that they would use, and it always cracked

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Speaker 2: me up reading your interviews, and even in your book

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Speaker 2: you'd say you didn't really see it that way. It

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Speaker 2: was just a job to do that day.

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Speaker 4: It was part of the job. It's like, you know,

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Speaker 4: he says, go to LA and so I get they

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Speaker 4: get me a ticket, I'd fly to LA Remember, no security,

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Speaker 4: no airport security. There was nothing to cause any interruption.

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Speaker 4: To this time, I didn't see it as a drug run.

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Speaker 4: The only time it was a little weird was when

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Speaker 4: I had to go and meet this guy at his

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Speaker 4: house to pick up this stuff. And I was a

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Speaker 4: little nervous about that. But at that point, in those days,

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Speaker 4: I didn't think about that. We didn't think about those

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Speaker 4: kind of things.

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Speaker 2: It's a great line in your book. I had no

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Speaker 2: idea how much money I handed over, figuring that if

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Speaker 2: I didn't look, I didn't know, and if I didn't know,

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Speaker 2: I'd be Okay, that's beautiful. And then he I think,

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Speaker 2: I forget if it was Mick or Keith. I think

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Speaker 2: it was probably Keith handed you his his mobile pharmacy

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Speaker 2: bag in Rhode Island when the arrest was going down.

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Speaker 2: I mean, in a sense that must have made you

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Speaker 2: feel honored.

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Speaker 4: Or just nearby. It was his medical bag. He carried

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Speaker 4: the doctor's medical bag with all his stuff in it.

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Speaker 4: And all I remember is I was I was close.

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Speaker 4: I was standing close to him, and we were all

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Speaker 4: just kind of who Gary, were you guys there? Gary?

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Speaker 4: You were there?

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Speaker 6: Right.

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Speaker 4: Remember, it was just like, what the heck, what is

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Speaker 4: going on here? And Keith just knew he was next,

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Speaker 4: so he just handed me the bag and said, Keith,

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Speaker 4: this for me. And it never occurred to me it

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Speaker 4: could have gotten me in trouble. None, Listen, I think

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Speaker 4: I also carried drugs across the border at one time

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Speaker 4: for CS and Y. You just it wasn't that scary

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Speaker 4: back then.

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Speaker 5: Right, No coincidence that the only woman on the tour

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Speaker 5: would be left holding the bag exactly.

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Speaker 2: The tour just insulars the word that Bob Gary used

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Speaker 2: so many times when we interviewed them. I mean, that

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Speaker 2: must have been such a rude intrusion to this very

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Speaker 2: tour bubble when all of a sudden the cops are

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Speaker 2: taken away, making Keith and Marshall and Robert Frank and yeah,

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Speaker 2: what was that like?

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Speaker 4: Well, you know, I think that we had an attitude of, well,

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Speaker 4: how dare you that is shown to do? How can

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Speaker 4: you interrupt this great organization we've got going with this

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Speaker 4: petty little stuff. You shouldn't have been here anyway, And

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Speaker 4: so there was a feeling of entitlement. It's kind of

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Speaker 4: like we are the royal family you know, just piss off,

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Speaker 4: am I right? Guys.

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Speaker 3: One of the things I loved about Chris is she

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Speaker 3: just said it a minute ago. It never occurred to me.

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Speaker 7: Most of the things that we experienced never occurred to

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Speaker 7: Chris because she lived in the moment and it was

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Speaker 7: all okay with her, and she handled whatever it was

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Speaker 7: it had to be done, she handled it. And the

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Speaker 7: consequences that all that just never occurred to her as

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Speaker 7: to many of us.

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Speaker 4: That's true. We just went with it, didn't We went

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Speaker 4: with it.

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Speaker 2: Yes.

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Speaker 5: Well.

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Speaker 4: The installation of all of that is that we it's

347
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Speaker 4: this way on every tour is that when you're on

348
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Speaker 4: the tour, all you know is what's going on in

349
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Speaker 4: the tour, and anything outside in the world just isn't

350
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Speaker 4: a part of your life. It has nothing to do

351
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Speaker 4: with it. You're like a little village that just travels around.

352
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Speaker 4: Keep it moving, keep it moving. Even people who would

353
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Speaker 4: come to see a show, you guys know this. You

354
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Speaker 4: get tickets for a friend or something, it's like, I

355
00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,760
Speaker 4: really can't talk to you because you're not in mind.

356
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Speaker 4: You just aren't there. You're not on my wavelength. So

357
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Speaker 4: it was it was pretty strange that one particularly.

358
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Speaker 5: So the thing about that tour was that even within

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Speaker 5: that small, tight community, there are subgroups. And I will

360
00:19:21,920 --> 00:19:25,239
Speaker 5: just for the record happily that Gary and I and

361
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Speaker 5: Chris were like the three Musketeers. We hung out together

362
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Speaker 5: before after enduring wonderful any Leebwood's photograph that I wish

363
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Speaker 5: I had sent Chris where we're back with Madison Square

364
00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:43,960
Speaker 5: Garden and we're both wiped out, and I Chris is

365
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Speaker 5: wearing these incredible spangled rock and roll pants and she

366
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Speaker 5: has extended her legs across my lap and I'm basically

367
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Speaker 5: half asleep, and so is she. You know what I mean.

368
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Speaker 5: But we were such good friends on the tour, and

369
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Speaker 5: the thing about Chris and you hear it is that

370
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Speaker 5: there is this amazing innocence no matter what kind of

371
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Speaker 5: insanity she's involved in.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think that's very sweetly said. I appreciate that.

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Speaker 4: Thank you. Naive A little naive I can remember, and

374
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Speaker 4: I'm pretty sure I got this memory right, but I

375
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Speaker 4: remember standing on the roof of the hotel in New

376
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Speaker 4: Orleans or something like that, and all of us going,

377
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Speaker 4: what are we doing? What are we doing here?

378
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Speaker 2: Describe all of these moments in your incredible book, I

379
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Speaker 2: mean just the Beatles, James Taylor for with Mac, I mean,

380
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:02,480
Speaker 2: it just goes. The names go on and on and on.

381
00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:06,719
Speaker 2: For the STP tour, is there a magical moment for

382
00:21:06,800 --> 00:21:09,080
Speaker 2: you that really stands out? I know Bob and Gary

383
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Speaker 2: have been using the phrase peak experience a lot when

384
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Speaker 2: describing various moments. Was there a peak experience on the

385
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Speaker 2: STP tour for you?

386
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Speaker 4: Well, there were more than a few, but I think

387
00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,720
Speaker 4: one of them was the night they decided that they

388
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Speaker 4: were going to have a meeting in Detroit and get

389
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Speaker 4: rid of people because the tour had become so there

390
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:37,000
Speaker 4: were so many people on it, and you know, Peter

391
00:21:37,119 --> 00:21:41,320
Speaker 4: Rudge and Joe Bergman, they all, you know, they got

392
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Speaker 4: together and somehow the word came out and so they

393
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Speaker 4: had a meeting the Stones and the execs on the tour.

394
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Speaker 4: And that was a pretty hairy night because I figured

395
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Speaker 4: I was pretty much on the list to go because

396
00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:56,959
Speaker 4: I was working for the Stones. I wasn't working for

397
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Speaker 4: the tour, and I remember Bill and came out and said,

398
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:07,360
Speaker 4: you're You're fine, You're okay, you get to stay. But

399
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:10,720
Speaker 4: that was Harry. I mean, though later I did actually

400
00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:13,800
Speaker 4: leave the tour because I just felt it was too much.

401
00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:15,520
Speaker 5: Did you leave the tour.

402
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:20,199
Speaker 4: After Nashville? We played Nashville.

403
00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:22,160
Speaker 5: And then yeah, I.

404
00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:26,639
Speaker 4: Went to Memphis with Bill and Astrid and Duck Dunne,

405
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:29,080
Speaker 4: and it was at that point that I just thought,

406
00:22:29,119 --> 00:22:31,160
Speaker 4: I can't bear it. I can't deal with this anymore.

407
00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:36,200
Speaker 4: Everybody's so angry. So I flew back to LA and

408
00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:38,639
Speaker 4: decided I wasn't going back on the tour. It was

409
00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:41,800
Speaker 4: during a break, it was an official break time.

410
00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:43,600
Speaker 5: And then why did you go back?

411
00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:48,719
Speaker 4: Because Keith called me? I figured I called me after

412
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,640
Speaker 4: the first show, I think, and said why aren't you here?

413
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:55,240
Speaker 4: And I said because I I don't have anything to do?

414
00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:58,200
Speaker 4: And he said, yes, you do, you better get back here.

415
00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:01,520
Speaker 2: That must have made you feel amazing. How did that feel?

416
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:05,320
Speaker 4: Well, it made me feel like they appreciated me. I

417
00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:08,520
Speaker 4: felt appreciated because I certainly didn't feel like that. It

418
00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:12,040
Speaker 4: was easy to get lost in all of that chaos

419
00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:14,960
Speaker 4: and not feel like you really had a job to do.

420
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Speaker 4: And I didn't want to be a.

421
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Speaker 5: Liguor always hard to say no to Keith.

422
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,440
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, there's no saying no to Keith.

423
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Speaker 2: One of the things that we touch on on the

424
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Speaker 2: show is just sort of the politics of being around

425
00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:38,760
Speaker 2: the Stones and the stress of keeping your spot in

426
00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:41,800
Speaker 2: the inner circle, and the mind games that it entails,

427
00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:44,080
Speaker 2: and how crushing it can be if you don't make

428
00:23:44,119 --> 00:23:46,640
Speaker 2: it into the limo with one of the principal players.

429
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:48,720
Speaker 2: And I think that Bob is a great line in

430
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,919
Speaker 2: the stp book about how people avoid eye contact with

431
00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:55,359
Speaker 2: the untouchable for fear of contagion, I think is the phrase.

432
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:58,639
Speaker 2: I was just wondering about that, because I know you

433
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:01,760
Speaker 2: write about that in your book also about just being

434
00:24:01,760 --> 00:24:03,639
Speaker 2: around the Stones. It's got to be addictive in a

435
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:06,600
Speaker 2: way too, that kind of attention, and it's adrenaline.

436
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:10,560
Speaker 4: It's an addiction to adrenaline. And you know, it was

437
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,960
Speaker 4: the same with the Beatles. I mean, you know, but

438
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 4: the Stones, especially on tour. Yeah, it's like in a

439
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:20,879
Speaker 4: drenaline rush. That's what I found out was that you

440
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,119
Speaker 4: could really work, you could live on very little sleep.

441
00:24:24,160 --> 00:24:27,360
Speaker 4: At that time. I didn't know that until after I'd

442
00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:28,679
Speaker 4: done it for a few days.

443
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:32,840
Speaker 2: I mean from my vantage point, I mean, going on

444
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 2: tour with the Rolling Stones or any one of the

445
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:38,119
Speaker 2: lists of many artists that you a tour manager for

446
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:42,200
Speaker 2: I mean, it just seems so romantic and so incredible

447
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:44,240
Speaker 2: and fun. But you know, we see in books and

448
00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,119
Speaker 2: documentaries and I'm hearing it from you now. I mean,

449
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,320
Speaker 2: it can get grueling. I think I remember reading I

450
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:51,439
Speaker 2: think Gary lost thirty pounds on the SDP tour or something.

451
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:55,439
Speaker 2: I mean, it's curious about the day to day, like

452
00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,679
Speaker 2: actually going through it is always interesting to hear about,

453
00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 2: like kind of the stuff that I don't think about

454
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:04,680
Speaker 2: the stuff that isn't all, you know, being backstage while

455
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 2: they do brown Sugar and all the highlights of it,

456
00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:10,000
Speaker 2: Like how would you pass the time? Like what first

457
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:11,199
Speaker 2: drew the three of you together?

458
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:17,600
Speaker 4: The three of us? Yeah, two guys and me. Well, Garry,

459
00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:21,080
Speaker 4: did I tell you? I don't remember if I knew

460
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:22,760
Speaker 4: you before the tour. Gary.

461
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:26,160
Speaker 8: You were the one who got me the job, Chris, Oh,

462
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:33,240
Speaker 8: I was, yes, old the one who got me a

463
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:33,880
Speaker 8: meeting with.

464
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 3: Nick that he needed a PR. They needed PR and

465
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:39,600
Speaker 3: you called me.

466
00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:42,159
Speaker 6: I don't remember exactly why you you know, picked me,

467
00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:43,320
Speaker 6: but you did.

468
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:45,359
Speaker 3: And you set up the meeting for me at Marion

469
00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 3: Davies's house.

470
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:47,320
Speaker 5: Wow.

471
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 4: Oh up at the Yeah, at the house. Oh, that's interesting. Well, oh, okay,

472
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:53,080
Speaker 4: you're welcome.

473
00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 5: So at the point, my point here would be Chris

474
00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:03,000
Speaker 5: as a list of accomplishments that even she is not aware.

475
00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:08,119
Speaker 4: Thank you. Oh well, I must have known of you

476
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:11,560
Speaker 4: before that then, definitely, because you were definitely on my radar.

477
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 4: So working with Peter Asher.

478
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:15,600
Speaker 3: I was going to say, it must have been Peter Asher.

479
00:26:15,840 --> 00:26:19,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, definitely, yeah, because we were friends.

480
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,879
Speaker 3: We were friends, yes, yeah.

481
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:24,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, and Bob I didn't even know who he was

482
00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:30,000
Speaker 4: until he showed up, but I was so impressed that

483
00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 4: Rolling Stone sent him that it didn't matter.

484
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 5: Well, I'd like to say that after that tour, Chris

485
00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:40,160
Speaker 5: was constantly on the road. Am I wrong?

486
00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:45,360
Speaker 4: Yeah, it took a year off just to kind of well,

487
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:47,640
Speaker 4: first of all, I had to finish up with the Stones,

488
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:50,240
Speaker 4: and then I took a year off because it was

489
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:52,800
Speaker 4: my first attempt to really get off of drugs and

490
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:58,040
Speaker 4: alcohol and everything. But then in nineteen seventy four I

491
00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:01,560
Speaker 4: started touring with csnyon and then it didn't stop throughout

492
00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:03,920
Speaker 4: the next probably ten years or more.

493
00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:05,639
Speaker 5: Wow was this?

494
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:08,080
Speaker 2: I mean, I know this was your first time out

495
00:27:08,119 --> 00:27:10,520
Speaker 2: on tour, but I know you were aware of rock

496
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:13,840
Speaker 2: and roll tours. Was there something about the Stones tour

497
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 2: in seventy two, even in the lead up to it,

498
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:19,119
Speaker 2: that felt like this is different, The scope of this

499
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:22,000
Speaker 2: is different, scale, this is different. Was that a parent

500
00:27:22,280 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 2: even in the lead up and when you were on it.

501
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:26,399
Speaker 4: That's a hard one because I don't have a real

502
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,159
Speaker 4: good perspective on that. But I had gone to the

503
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 4: sixty nine tour. I went to their concert in LA

504
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:37,800
Speaker 4: with Leon Russell as it happens, and then I was

505
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:40,960
Speaker 4: hanging out with Ethan Russell while they were in LA

506
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 4: during that period of time, so I saw them, and

507
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:48,119
Speaker 4: I think by the time Exile came out, I was

508
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:51,000
Speaker 4: so involved in it it didn't really occur to me

509
00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:53,720
Speaker 4: that it was going to be what it turned out

510
00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:58,240
Speaker 4: to be. And you know, it just seemed like, Okay,

511
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:01,680
Speaker 4: they're going on tour, a new double album out, So

512
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:04,240
Speaker 4: I don't really think I thought about the fact that

513
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:05,840
Speaker 4: we'd be talking about it today.

514
00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 2: Well, speaking of the double album, you were on the

515
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:10,199
Speaker 2: double album, I wanted to ask you about that. How

516
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 2: did you come to uh to grace the cover.

517
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:16,240
Speaker 4: Robert Frank I guess because he took my picture in

518
00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:20,640
Speaker 4: the garden of Marshall Chess House rental house and then

519
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:22,200
Speaker 4: it was on the cover. I had no idea it

520
00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:24,400
Speaker 4: was going to be on the cover until I saw

521
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:25,480
Speaker 4: the mock up of it.

522
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:29,520
Speaker 2: Mortalize. Let's let's do a quick count. You've been more

523
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:34,720
Speaker 2: lies by George Harrison, Rolling Stones, Joni Mitchell and.

524
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:38,000
Speaker 5: Coyote, Jordan's Apple Lady, Leon.

525
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:40,000
Speaker 2: Roussey and Russell of course, yeah, oh my god.

526
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,560
Speaker 5: The track is miss O'Dell and.

527
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:45,360
Speaker 3: That Arizona congressman who is she's sitting his office.

528
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:52,160
Speaker 2: Now. Call it too much history, too much unbelievable.

529
00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:54,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm lucky.

530
00:28:56,120 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 2: One of the things that we really hope to do

531
00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,280
Speaker 2: with this STP show not only had it be a

532
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:04,440
Speaker 2: history of the Stones at this moment in rock and roll,

533
00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:08,360
Speaker 2: but history of this really pivotal moment in America in

534
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,280
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy two. I mean, I think that the Watergate

535
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:13,960
Speaker 2: breaking occurred, I think a week into the tour, and

536
00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:17,440
Speaker 2: Governor Wallace in Alabama when he was running for president,

537
00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 2: was shot I think a week or two before the

538
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:23,200
Speaker 2: tour began, and just it's such a fraught time in America.

539
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 2: I mean, a big through line, at least in the

540
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:27,840
Speaker 2: show that we're putting together is the Hell's Angels the

541
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 2: fear of repercussions from them for the disaster at Altamont.

542
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 2: Was there a sense of danger prevalent that you noticed

543
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:36,960
Speaker 2: on the road or is that not really something that

544
00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 2: was on your radar.

545
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 4: Well, first of all, I just want to say, and

546
00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 4: I'll come back to that, that one of the Hell's

547
00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 4: Angels who was involved in the Ultimont think Sweet William

548
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 4: was one of the two that came to app. I

549
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 4: was gonna ask wee William pretty well? I knew him

550
00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,240
Speaker 4: pretty well. In fact, he died a couple of years

551
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,800
Speaker 4: ago and his girlfriend told me about it, told me

552
00:29:57,920 --> 00:30:01,400
Speaker 4: he passed on. But well, that was one thing, is

553
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:04,200
Speaker 4: that I knew someone who had actually been a part

554
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:09,560
Speaker 4: of it. But you know, we had bodyguards, and I

555
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:13,560
Speaker 4: think just the idea of having bodyguards at that point

556
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 4: took away any fear of anything happening. And of course

557
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:21,000
Speaker 4: we hadn't had the awful knowledge that people could shoot

558
00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 4: a gun while you were on stage. We didn't think

559
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 4: about that. In fact, actually it's interesting that back at

560
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,200
Speaker 4: that time, when Nick had the house in bell Air,

561
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:33,400
Speaker 4: there's no wall around it. There was no security at

562
00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:37,720
Speaker 4: that house. Today that wouldn't you couldn't even do that, so,

563
00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,600
Speaker 4: you know, and Keith same thing. There was no protection

564
00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:44,320
Speaker 4: in LA during that period of time because nobody thought

565
00:30:44,360 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 4: about it. So my memory is I felt okay that

566
00:30:49,120 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 4: there were bodyguards.

567
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:52,960
Speaker 2: I remember. I think in your book you said something

568
00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:55,640
Speaker 2: about how Leon Russell said something like, you know, someday

569
00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:58,520
Speaker 2: we're all going to be living in houses with gates,

570
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 2: and you think, thinking, oh what, you know, that's a

571
00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:02,040
Speaker 2: real bummer thought.

572
00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:03,400
Speaker 5: But yeah, you're right.

573
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:09,520
Speaker 2: That's surprising, that's surprising relatively soon after the Manson murders

574
00:31:10,120 --> 00:31:12,320
Speaker 2: that things were still as open as they were, And

575
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:14,640
Speaker 2: I guess that's beautiful in a way that people still were.

576
00:31:15,360 --> 00:31:18,600
Speaker 4: It was. Listen, when I lived at George Harrison's house

577
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,320
Speaker 4: at Friar Park, a guy climbed in the top window

578
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:25,600
Speaker 4: one night and eventually someone climbed in or came in

579
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:27,960
Speaker 4: through his kitchen window, and we all know what happened

580
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:32,520
Speaker 4: with that. But you know, no one really took it

581
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:36,600
Speaker 4: seriously back then that anything could possibly happen until John

582
00:31:36,680 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 4: Lennon was shot, and I think that changed things dramatically,

583
00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:43,960
Speaker 4: would you agree, Bobby, Yeah, Yeah.

584
00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:46,960
Speaker 2: The Hell's Angels arriving at Apple in what was it

585
00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:50,080
Speaker 2: Christmas sixty eight. I would love to know more about that.

586
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:51,600
Speaker 2: I mean, you you must be one of the only

587
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:55,040
Speaker 2: people on the SDP tour that had first hand relations

588
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,360
Speaker 2: with the Hell's Angels. That's incredible.

589
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:58,080
Speaker 5: What was that like?

590
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,880
Speaker 4: Oh, it was just another crazy thing. It was like,

591
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:05,920
Speaker 4: everything's just another little movie. I mean, you know, I

592
00:32:06,000 --> 00:32:08,800
Speaker 4: mean I figured I'd rather be friends with them than enemies,

593
00:32:09,040 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 4: so you know, I made an effort to get along

594
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,800
Speaker 4: with them, and we became friends during the time they

595
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:18,080
Speaker 4: were there. I didn't keep in touch with them afterwards,

596
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,440
Speaker 4: but they were just, you know, people who had this

597
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:25,520
Speaker 4: crazy way about them. I had to ride on a

598
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 4: motor cycle with them, so I did. Sweet William took

599
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 4: me out on his motorcycle after we had dropped acid

600
00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:36,040
Speaker 4: him too, and it was snowing, and we got around

601
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,600
Speaker 4: Herod's and he started to turn around and the bike

602
00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,160
Speaker 4: just kind of slid. Now maybe he thought he was

603
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 4: in control, but I didn't, and I thought, oh my god,

604
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:47,400
Speaker 4: I'm dying with the helsing.

605
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:52,760
Speaker 5: Ladies and gentlemen. Chris O'Dell.

606
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 2: It was a great I can't remember for his Neil

607
00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:59,000
Speaker 2: Aspinall or who it was, He tells the story about

608
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:03,719
Speaker 2: how the Apple Christmas Party then bringing out this huge

609
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:06,479
Speaker 2: the biggest turkey or duck or something that anyone had

610
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:09,640
Speaker 2: ever seen, and then just the Hell's Angels just descending

611
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 2: on it like a cartoon and then backing away and

612
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:14,720
Speaker 2: there's nothing but like a bone picked clean, and that

613
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:16,280
Speaker 2: was that was all it was left.

614
00:33:16,920 --> 00:33:19,239
Speaker 4: Oh and the other side of it. While they were

615
00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:24,120
Speaker 4: doing that, knocking people out, John was Father Christmas and

616
00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:28,959
Speaker 4: was what's your name, Mama Christmas? Or so they were

617
00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:31,320
Speaker 4: wandering around in their little red and white suits and

618
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:40,120
Speaker 4: their beards and the Hell's Angels knocking people out. You

619
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:42,480
Speaker 4: got to say, how did anybody not have a good

620
00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:44,720
Speaker 4: time with all of this kind of drama going on?

621
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:45,120
Speaker 2: Right?

622
00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:47,720
Speaker 4: It's not boring?

623
00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:10,719
Speaker 2: I'm reminded. Now there's a moment in your book I

624
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,680
Speaker 2: think you're I believe you're speaking too. I want to say,

625
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 2: you're hypnotherapist. And you said, do you think I would

626
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:18,440
Speaker 2: make a good therapist? I'm thinking of doing that? And

627
00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:23,320
Speaker 2: he said, well why not? You've seen it all? And

628
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:26,799
Speaker 2: which I mean, speaking to you now, that that really

629
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:30,080
Speaker 2: that that holds true. I mean, I'm I'm curious now

630
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:33,400
Speaker 2: since you've you know, gone on to helping an untold

631
00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:35,800
Speaker 2: number of people through your your new career as a

632
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:40,840
Speaker 2: counselor and hypnotherapists. I believe specializing in addiction has that

633
00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:45,359
Speaker 2: changed how you view some of the behavior or your

634
00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:47,319
Speaker 2: experiences on the STP tour at all.

635
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 4: No, I don't think so. I think they're very they're

636
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 4: very separate. But what it has taught me is, I mean,

637
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:55,840
Speaker 4: the one thing that I've thought about is just my

638
00:34:56,040 --> 00:34:59,520
Speaker 4: own role in all of that. And you know, would

639
00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:01,719
Speaker 4: I have done and some of the things I did

640
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:07,200
Speaker 4: if I hadn't been using, Probably not. But at the

641
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,920
Speaker 4: same time, would I've been able to keep it? I mean,

642
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 4: you know, I got to admit that drugs helped. Keith

643
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:16,440
Speaker 4: told me once you can keep up with the guys. Now,

644
00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:23,840
Speaker 4: is that a compliment or what kept me in drugs

645
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:28,360
Speaker 4: for a long time? Keith? Thank you? So, you know,

646
00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:31,840
Speaker 4: I think what's real is that back then that was

647
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 4: just part of what the culture was doing. We were

648
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:37,279
Speaker 4: all in our twenties or early thirties and we were

649
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:40,440
Speaker 4: doing drugs. That was part of what we did. And

650
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:43,640
Speaker 4: some of us didn't make it, as you guys said,

651
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:47,080
Speaker 4: you know, they dropped by the wayside, and some of

652
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:50,359
Speaker 4: us did, and thank god we did.

653
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:56,000
Speaker 2: You've all in your respective books and in speaking to

654
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 2: me all kind of mentioned that it's not something that

655
00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:02,080
Speaker 2: you can really understand if you didn't live through it.

656
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 2: What the relationship to drugs was. I think it was

657
00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:06,760
Speaker 2: Gary said that that was just kind of the currency,

658
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 2: especially in the rock and roll world of the time.

659
00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:13,239
Speaker 2: And you know, drugs weren't drugs weren't bad, drugs were fun.

660
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:15,760
Speaker 2: I believe it was a quote from Gary.

661
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:17,880
Speaker 3: It just that was we certainly weren't aware of the

662
00:36:17,960 --> 00:36:18,879
Speaker 3: consequence as well.

663
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:19,279
Speaker 5: We were.

664
00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:23,879
Speaker 4: Not at all. If anyone died from what we just said,

665
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:30,279
Speaker 4: they overdid it. But actually there was some insight that

666
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:33,399
Speaker 4: I'd like to share with you, which is that after

667
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:36,360
Speaker 4: working with a lot of drug addicts and being in

668
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:39,800
Speaker 4: my own sobriety and everything, it did make sense that

669
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 4: there was a lot of drugs in that culture and

670
00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:46,480
Speaker 4: that music culture, because I really believed that the people

671
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,080
Speaker 4: who used drugs it's a way to escape the harshness

672
00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:54,560
Speaker 4: of reality and have fun. But it also kind of

673
00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,239
Speaker 4: helps you not look at all the crap that's going

674
00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 4: on around you, and that typically the alcoholics and drug addicts.

675
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:03,960
Speaker 4: I've worked with her sensitive people, and the people in

676
00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:07,279
Speaker 4: the music business and the music world are typically not

677
00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:12,200
Speaker 4: one hundred percent you know, pretty sensitive people with feelings

678
00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 4: that have feelings. So if there's anything that I've sort

679
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:18,319
Speaker 4: of thought about since then, it would be that.

680
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:24,920
Speaker 6: I have the view that these artists that we worked

681
00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:29,600
Speaker 6: with were, like Chris describes, very sensitive people, and no

682
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:33,120
Speaker 6: one really has the appreciation of what it's like working

683
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 6: out there without a net. People take our big risk takers,

684
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:40,880
Speaker 6: and it's extraordinary that they're capable of doing it. Drugs

685
00:37:41,000 --> 00:37:44,920
Speaker 6: provided that safety net and the appearance of the safety net.

686
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:47,600
Speaker 6: It allows you to go out there on that stage

687
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 6: and risk it because you felt, you know, so powerful.

688
00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:55,640
Speaker 3: But what we all came to believe later was that

689
00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 3: that was a false god.

690
00:37:57,200 --> 00:37:57,560
Speaker 5: You know that.

691
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,799
Speaker 6: Exactly, strength that we have, the talent that we had,

692
00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 6: was inside of us.

693
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 3: It wasn't the chemicals that provided it for us.

694
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:10,680
Speaker 5: Listen, the the intersection of drugs and art goes all

695
00:38:10,719 --> 00:38:14,240
Speaker 5: the way back to the Quincy and Samuel Taylor Coleridge,

696
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 5: and it's a different kind of Did you ever see

697
00:38:21,680 --> 00:38:24,719
Speaker 5: him on stage? Coleridge could really rock, man, you know,

698
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:28,800
Speaker 5: so Wordsworth not nearly as good I saw him, and

699
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,759
Speaker 5: you know he's just he was acoustic. You know, who

700
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:37,120
Speaker 5: cares too pastoral? But the point is that what listen,

701
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:41,360
Speaker 5: My point here is and I celebrate both Gary and Chris.

702
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:45,400
Speaker 5: I have some sense of what they lived through and

703
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:49,400
Speaker 5: how they overcame what they lived through, and more to

704
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:54,000
Speaker 5: the point, they have helped more people than two people

705
00:38:54,080 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 5: I know, Okay, And so that's why we're all talking

706
00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,120
Speaker 5: together to and you know, I really respect and I

707
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:05,359
Speaker 5: honored them for having done what they did. Thank you all.

708
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:07,800
Speaker 2: I took the words right out of my mouth. I

709
00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:10,319
Speaker 2: was about to say that both of you are rock

710
00:39:10,360 --> 00:39:13,239
Speaker 2: stars in the field of helping people through addiction. And

711
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 2: it's just astonishing what you've done. And you've spoken so

712
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:20,680
Speaker 2: movingly and poignantly, not only about you know, there's beautiful

713
00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 2: descriptions of Keith in your book, Chris, about being I

714
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:26,640
Speaker 2: think the word you use was softy, I mean, but

715
00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:32,240
Speaker 2: the very sweet portrait of him. And also you speak

716
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:34,800
Speaker 2: of the people and Bob does this too in the

717
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:40,719
Speaker 2: stp book about the people who weren't the superstars, and

718
00:39:41,120 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 2: he said words to the effect of these are the

719
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,239
Speaker 2: people who would have the toughest time adjusting back into

720
00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:50,360
Speaker 2: normal life after being swept up in the stp hurricane.

721
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:53,320
Speaker 2: The adjustment after the show was over, Like, what is

722
00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:55,879
Speaker 2: that like for somebody who's never been through the tour.

723
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:57,840
Speaker 2: I can only imagine what it was like to suddenly not.

724
00:39:57,920 --> 00:39:59,600
Speaker 5: Have that Well.

725
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,719
Speaker 4: I think he've talked about it even in his book,

726
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:06,920
Speaker 4: that it's so hard to I can't remember his exact words,

727
00:40:07,040 --> 00:40:10,359
Speaker 4: but something about how difficult it was to get out

728
00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:14,479
Speaker 4: of that and go back into normal life, his normal life,

729
00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:18,080
Speaker 4: which was real different than my normal life. It happened

730
00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 4: on that tour. It happened on every tour I did. That.

731
00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:24,480
Speaker 4: When it's over, it's like the end of a relationship.

732
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:29,759
Speaker 4: It's very sad, it's lonely. Suddenly you're back in your

733
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:33,319
Speaker 4: own little world and they're not all there. The one

734
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:37,000
Speaker 4: thing I noticed is I would go around doing different

735
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:39,759
Speaker 4: things in town and I would think I saw people

736
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:43,359
Speaker 4: from the tour, because people would remind me of them,

737
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:47,080
Speaker 4: and I'd have gone, oh no, So it takes a while.

738
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:51,879
Speaker 4: It's kind of like withdrawing. It's like withdrawal in a way,

739
00:40:52,080 --> 00:40:52,880
Speaker 4: you kind of withdraw.

740
00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:57,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know you've said the several times on here.

741
00:40:57,960 --> 00:41:00,759
Speaker 2: I mean you manage tours for CSO and why Bob

742
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:02,880
Speaker 2: Dylan Fleetwood Mac, I mean, did you cross pass with

743
00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 2: the Stones again when you were out on the road

744
00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:05,920
Speaker 2: in the seventies and eighties.

745
00:41:06,440 --> 00:41:10,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, I did know at the Fleetwood Mac tour in Europe,

746
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:13,080
Speaker 4: I did came in was staying in the same hotel

747
00:41:13,160 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 4: we were, and uh, and I know that they's one

748
00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 4: of the Lindsay what was his name, Lindsay from Fleetwood Mac.

749
00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:27,520
Speaker 4: I remember he looked at me and thought, who are you? Yeah,

750
00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:31,040
Speaker 4: well I could read him, he just didn't kind of

751
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:33,400
Speaker 4: connect with me. And then he saw Mick and it

752
00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:35,719
Speaker 4: was like I just knew. He was going like, well,

753
00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:37,719
Speaker 4: who are you that you are?

754
00:41:37,800 --> 00:41:38,719
Speaker 5: Not that you know him?

755
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:41,880
Speaker 4: He came over to talk to you. But yeah, I

756
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:46,239
Speaker 4: ran into them. You know, over the years a number

757
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:49,600
Speaker 4: of times, even after I had married into the aristocratic

758
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:53,160
Speaker 4: English world, he would show up be at some of

759
00:41:53,239 --> 00:41:56,840
Speaker 4: the parties that we would go to with the aristocracy.

760
00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:02,120
Speaker 2: It's just one of them are married into the aristocracy.

761
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:06,800
Speaker 2: Currently speaking to us from a former congressman's office, the

762
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:10,600
Speaker 2: the rarefied error in which you which you breathe the

763
00:42:10,680 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 2: circles in which you travel. Yeah.

764
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:15,000
Speaker 4: Meanwhile, I don't have a bathroom or a sink at

765
00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:15,439
Speaker 4: my house.

766
00:42:15,520 --> 00:42:19,840
Speaker 5: So there, wait on the dose. What's it? You know?

767
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:21,680
Speaker 3: So I never stopped you.

768
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:25,480
Speaker 4: I'm sure Gary, I have to ask this. It's a

769
00:42:25,560 --> 00:42:29,080
Speaker 4: burning question. Have you talked about the prophylactic?

770
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:31,920
Speaker 5: Oh my god, I brought it up.

771
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:34,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, it is.

772
00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:39,080
Speaker 5: To hear you discuss it. Tell us your memory of

773
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:41,000
Speaker 5: the prophylactic.

774
00:42:41,960 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 4: That is one of the huge most the hugest is

775
00:42:46,520 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 4: that the right English. The hugest memory of was I

776
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:54,200
Speaker 4: remember getting on the plane somewhere and coming up because

777
00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:56,720
Speaker 4: you guys would you'd sit with Astard in the area.

778
00:42:56,800 --> 00:43:00,359
Speaker 4: Asterd and Bill would sit in and the Rockers we're

779
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:03,319
Speaker 4: back in the bag going crazy and I come up

780
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:06,080
Speaker 4: front and I look down and there's this big rubber

781
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:11,600
Speaker 4: hanging there, white stuff, and I'm like, what is that?

782
00:43:12,239 --> 00:43:14,960
Speaker 4: I thought that was ingenious, thank you.

783
00:43:18,560 --> 00:43:21,960
Speaker 5: I remember getting dangling it from between his fingers, not

784
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:26,759
Speaker 5: to just like like casual like hanging out. I'm hoping

785
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 5: these are my worried beads, That's what exactly.

786
00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 4: And it was so sad when they got smaller and smaller.

787
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:39,200
Speaker 5: Oh my god.

788
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:43,759
Speaker 4: Okay, sorry, you know, I.

789
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:46,120
Speaker 2: Had I had a whole, you know, meaningful question I

790
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:48,120
Speaker 2: wanted to end on. But you know what, that might

791
00:43:48,280 --> 00:43:48,640
Speaker 2: just do it.

792
00:43:50,160 --> 00:43:53,880
Speaker 5: That might be the perfect listen to the sadness of

793
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:58,600
Speaker 5: the prophilectic getting smaller. That's a Crystan O'Dell concept. You

794
00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:03,000
Speaker 5: can't who else will think about that? You're like, oh,

795
00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:04,880
Speaker 5: it's not as big as it was.

796
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:09,680
Speaker 2: It's sort of it's a beautiful it's like the flip side.

797
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:11,160
Speaker 3: Of the drugs either anymore.

798
00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:17,000
Speaker 4: Well, I abided in that prophylactic, so I was paying attention.

799
00:44:20,040 --> 00:44:21,600
Speaker 2: It's the flip side of the I think it was

800
00:44:21,640 --> 00:44:24,439
Speaker 2: the chipmunks story about how he passed one hundred dollars

801
00:44:24,480 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 2: bill around with the plate of cocaine and then he

802
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:28,080
Speaker 2: got it back at the end when it made it

803
00:44:28,120 --> 00:44:30,280
Speaker 2: through the circle and one hundred dollar bill and replaced

804
00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:32,320
Speaker 2: with a one dollar bill. So that was that to

805
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 2: fined the curdling of the sort of the openness.

806
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 5: Yeah, sure, it was the end of the sixties.

807
00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:42,919
Speaker 4: Can we do this every week?

808
00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:46,760
Speaker 5: I'd be honored.

809
00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:52,680
Speaker 2: Oh I just I am. I am so honored to

810
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 2: speak with you. I'm honored to be a part of

811
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:59,640
Speaker 2: an honorary part of your your your triumvirate right now.

812
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:02,120
Speaker 2: I'm this thank you. This has been such a joy

813
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,000
Speaker 2: and I'm just it so makes me so happy to

814
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:07,560
Speaker 2: see you all speaking for the first time since the

815
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,920
Speaker 2: Ahtfeet tour. That's just that's just really, I feel like

816
00:45:11,000 --> 00:45:13,200
Speaker 2: it makes the whole project worthwhile. Just bringing the three

817
00:45:13,239 --> 00:45:15,720
Speaker 2: of you together again, it makes me happy.

818
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:17,440
Speaker 4: I love those guys, both of them.

819
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:19,600
Speaker 5: Love you, Chris, Howris, thank you.

820
00:45:20,239 --> 00:45:20,439
Speaker 4: Yeah.

821
00:45:27,120 --> 00:45:29,920
Speaker 2: We hope you enjoyed this episode of Stones Touring Party,

822
00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:33,640
Speaker 2: reuniting these three stp vets. We'll be back on the

823
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:36,479
Speaker 2: road next week because the Stones arrive and a Los

824
00:45:36,520 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 2: Angeles still reeling from the Manson murders. Though Charlie himself

825
00:45:40,719 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 2: was in prison, members of the family still roamed the

826
00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:46,320
Speaker 2: streets and hills of Hollywood and left one member of

827
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:48,960
Speaker 2: the tour fearing for his life. So join us back

828
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:50,719
Speaker 2: here again next week. We'll see you then.

829
00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:03,120
Speaker 1: Stone's Touring Party is written and hosted by Jordan Runtalk

830
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:06,880
Speaker 1: co executive produced by Noel Brown and Jordan Runtalk, Edited

831
00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:09,399
Speaker 1: in sound designed by Noel Brown and Michael Alder June.

832
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:13,080
Speaker 1: Original music composed and performed by Michael Alder June and

833
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:16,600
Speaker 1: Noel Brown, with additional instruments performed by Chris Suarez, Nick

834
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:20,640
Speaker 1: Johns Cooper and Josh Thain. Vintage Rolling Stones audio courtesy

835
00:46:20,680 --> 00:46:23,800
Speaker 1: of the Robert Greenfield Archive at the Charles Deering McCormick

836
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:28,839
Speaker 1: Library of Special Collections in Northwestern University Libraries. Stone's Touring

837
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: Party is a production of iHeartRadio