WEBVTT - How did North Korea become such a Scary Place? 0:00:02.320 --> 0:00:04.760 I guess what will what's that? So some years ago 0:00:04.800 --> 0:00:07.480 I watched this movie at Rooftop Films and it was 0:00:07.520 --> 0:00:10.520 about this guy who defected from the American army during 0:00:10.520 --> 0:00:12.879 the Korean War. He was just kind of like fed 0:00:13.000 --> 0:00:15.480 up with being yelled at by his sergeants, so he 0:00:15.560 --> 0:00:18.520 put his hands up and then just walked across the border. 0:00:19.040 --> 0:00:20.840 And it was all about how he'd lived the rest 0:00:20.880 --> 0:00:23.000 of his life in North Korea. Right, you can do that, 0:00:23.040 --> 0:00:25.360 You can just walk over the border like that, I guess. So. 0:00:25.480 --> 0:00:28.280 I mean he's lived there and learned Korean. He smokes 0:00:28.320 --> 0:00:31.040 a lot of cigarettes and drinks and and he's treated 0:00:31.120 --> 0:00:33.440 like this elite there. But the thing is he's had 0:00:33.479 --> 0:00:36.120 to work for that status. And one of the things 0:00:36.200 --> 0:00:39.040 he's been doing is acting. So he is one of 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:41.440 the few white guys in North Korea. I think he's 0:00:41.440 --> 0:00:44.960 one of four defectors. So he was tasked with playing 0:00:45.000 --> 0:00:48.000 the villain in every single propaganda movie they've done. Little 0:00:48.040 --> 0:00:51.400 tast fifty years or something. But the weirdest thing to 0:00:51.400 --> 0:00:53.600 me is that Kim Jong ill thought that he could 0:00:53.640 --> 0:00:57.320 make this guy's kids spies since they're, you know, basically 0:00:57.320 --> 0:01:00.560 white looking. So he thought they'd lend into American society, 0:01:00.680 --> 0:01:03.640 But the footage of these kids is so sad, Like, 0:01:03.760 --> 0:01:06.280 first of all, they're on camera, so everyone knows what 0:01:06.319 --> 0:01:09.000 they look like. And it's also kind of hard to 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:11.240 train as a spy and pick up a perfect English 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:14.920 language when you're studying at North Korean schools. So there's 0:01:14.959 --> 0:01:17.360 just a lot of unrealistic hope that was pinned to 0:01:17.400 --> 0:01:19.959 their success. But watching that movie made me wonder, like, 0:01:20.200 --> 0:01:22.880 what is life really like in North Korea? How did 0:01:22.880 --> 0:01:25.400 the country get to be so isolated? And has it 0:01:25.480 --> 0:01:27.760 always kept a distance from the world or is this 0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:51.840 a new phenomena. So that's what we're discussing today day 0:01:51.880 --> 0:01:54.280 their podcast listeners, Welcome to Part Time Genius. I'm Will 0:01:54.320 --> 0:01:56.400 Pearson and as always I'm joined by my good friend 0:01:56.440 --> 0:01:58.440 man guest show Ticketer and on the other side of 0:01:58.480 --> 0:02:02.200 the soundproof glass. Just ativated by this terrible monster movie, 0:02:02.200 --> 0:02:06.160 I mean it is terrible called Pulga Sorry, he's watching 0:02:06.160 --> 0:02:08.360 this on his laptop. Tristan pay Ant, engineer, that's our 0:02:08.400 --> 0:02:12.760 attention and producer Tristan McNeil. And if you've never heard 0:02:12.760 --> 0:02:15.920 of Pulgasari, it's definitely worth checking out. So the monster is. 0:02:16.320 --> 0:02:20.399 It's basically North Korea's answered to Godzilla, right, and it's 0:02:20.400 --> 0:02:24.600 produced by Kim Jong Ill back in the mid nineteen eighties. Yeah, 0:02:24.600 --> 0:02:26.760 it's a pretty well story. So when Kim John Iill 0:02:26.840 --> 0:02:29.160 was in charge of North Korea, he had this nasty 0:02:29.240 --> 0:02:32.360 habit of, you know, kidnapping people from the surrounding countries 0:02:32.400 --> 0:02:35.240 to do his bidding. And in nineteen eight he snatched 0:02:35.240 --> 0:02:38.359 a famous South Korean film director, this guy named Shin 0:02:38.480 --> 0:02:41.919 sang ok and his actress ex wife, and Kim was 0:02:41.960 --> 0:02:44.440 supposedly this big movie buff and he wanted his captives 0:02:44.440 --> 0:02:47.760 to help him create this North Korean film industry. But thankfully, 0:02:47.840 --> 0:02:50.119 Shin and his ex were eventually able to escape while 0:02:50.120 --> 0:02:52.480 they were attending a film festival in Vienna. But that 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:56.080 was actually after eight years of captivity, and during that time, 0:02:56.120 --> 0:02:58.480 Shin was forced to direct a total of seven films 0:02:58.520 --> 0:03:01.000 for Kim, and Pulgasari was actually the last of those. 0:03:01.400 --> 0:03:04.560 So it's a standard Godzilla movie or what I mean. 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:07.400 There's a rumor that the director secretly intended the monster 0:03:07.440 --> 0:03:10.000 to be a metaphor for Kim Jong il, and uh, 0:03:10.160 --> 0:03:12.000 that's pretty easy to take away when you look at 0:03:12.000 --> 0:03:15.080 the movies plot, which is all about this oppressed feudal society. 0:03:15.120 --> 0:03:18.000 It's eventually liberated thanks to the help of this monster, 0:03:18.240 --> 0:03:20.880 who the citizen's view is their benign hero. But in 0:03:20.960 --> 0:03:23.480 the end, the monster betrays the people. He goes on 0:03:23.520 --> 0:03:26.560 a rampage and the peasants he once protected. Then I 0:03:26.600 --> 0:03:29.400 have to rise up and destroy him. You kind of 0:03:29.400 --> 0:03:31.560 just spoil the movie for me, Mega and and for 0:03:31.600 --> 0:03:33.720 all of our listeners. You might need to put a 0:03:33.760 --> 0:03:36.600 warning at the beginning of this Christan But obviously there's 0:03:36.600 --> 0:03:39.400 a lot of hardship in North Korea, and for years 0:03:39.440 --> 0:03:41.800 now we've heard these rumblings of what life was like 0:03:41.960 --> 0:03:44.600 under Kim Jong ill and then under his son, Kim 0:03:44.680 --> 0:03:46.800 Jong Un. But you know, you think about things from 0:03:46.840 --> 0:03:51.720 food shortages to power outages, military conscription, slave labor camps. 0:03:51.800 --> 0:03:55.040 But despite the severity of these claims, many of us 0:03:55.080 --> 0:03:58.280 really don't know the first thing about North Korea, and 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:01.000 for many of us, including exactly where to find it 0:04:01.040 --> 0:04:03.440 on a map. And so you can think of today's 0:04:03.480 --> 0:04:06.240 episode as a bit of a primer on the country. 0:04:06.600 --> 0:04:08.880 So we'll be looking at why the Korean peninsula split 0:04:08.920 --> 0:04:12.240 and arrival nations and how the Kim family use that 0:04:12.320 --> 0:04:15.120 to secure its enduring power. But we'll also take a 0:04:15.120 --> 0:04:18.159 closer look at everyday life in North Korea, including a 0:04:18.200 --> 0:04:21.279 few faint glimmers of hope for the future. But what 0:04:21.320 --> 0:04:23.800 do you want to start with, Mango, Well, I thought 0:04:23.839 --> 0:04:26.080 we could start with some of those basics you mentioned, 0:04:26.120 --> 0:04:28.839 like what and where North Korea is, So for starters, 0:04:28.880 --> 0:04:31.800 the country is officially known as the Democratic People's Republic 0:04:31.839 --> 0:04:35.600 of Korea, so d P R K and I think 0:04:35.600 --> 0:04:38.120 we'll still call it North Korea for the today's episode. 0:04:39.440 --> 0:04:42.960 Geographically speaking, North Korea is a relatively small country. The 0:04:43.000 --> 0:04:46.000 whole thing is roughly the size of Mississippi, and if 0:04:46.000 --> 0:04:47.599 you bust out your world map, you can look to 0:04:47.640 --> 0:04:49.920 either the left of Japan or the right of China 0:04:50.000 --> 0:04:52.480 and you'll spot the Korean Peninsula, which is made up 0:04:52.560 --> 0:04:54.479 of as you might expect, you know, North Korea on 0:04:54.520 --> 0:04:56.600 the top in South Korea on the bottom. And the 0:04:56.680 --> 0:04:58.719 last thing to know about North Koreas layout is that 0:04:58.760 --> 0:05:01.599 it's capital, the South, a city of Pyongyang, is the 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:04.480 most developed and densely populated region of what is an 0:05:04.480 --> 0:05:07.799 otherwise largely rural country. So North Korea has about twenty 0:05:07.800 --> 0:05:11.320 five million citizens, and three million of them live in Pyongyang. Yeah, 0:05:11.320 --> 0:05:13.680 I was actually reading where most of the country's government 0:05:13.720 --> 0:05:17.240 buildings and shopping districts are are located there, and as 0:05:17.240 --> 0:05:20.080 you might expect, most North Koreans of any kind of 0:05:20.120 --> 0:05:22.960 wealth or influence tend to live there in the capital. 0:05:23.360 --> 0:05:26.760 That's particularly in the fancy downtown area that's been nicknamed 0:05:26.839 --> 0:05:30.360 pyeong Hatton. And of course the residents they're enjoy all 0:05:30.440 --> 0:05:33.360 kinds of luxuries that the vast majority of citizens never 0:05:33.440 --> 0:05:36.039 really get to experience. And I'm not just talking about 0:05:36.080 --> 0:05:39.320 gourmet restaurants and fancy clothes either. I mean that's definitely 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:43.680 part of it, but even something as basic as reliable electricity, 0:05:43.720 --> 0:05:47.000 I mean that that's really only reserved for the upper class. 0:05:47.520 --> 0:05:49.280 In fact, this is pretty interesting to look at. You 0:05:49.320 --> 0:05:52.200 can find pictures of this, but astronauts aboard the International 0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:55.400 Space Station have taken images of the Earth at night, 0:05:55.760 --> 0:05:58.040 and if you look at them, Pyongyang is the only 0:05:58.160 --> 0:06:00.480 part of North Korea that's really live it up, and 0:06:00.520 --> 0:06:03.440 it's it's really eerie to look at. But you see 0:06:03.440 --> 0:06:06.240 South Korea and China, they're both super bright, and then 0:06:06.279 --> 0:06:08.760 there's just this dark gap that blends right in with 0:06:08.839 --> 0:06:11.200 the Yellow Sea and the Sea of Japan, and you 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:14.400 really can't even tell where the country's coastlines are, you know. 0:06:14.440 --> 0:06:17.120 Even that small patch of light that emerges from Pyongyang 0:06:17.279 --> 0:06:19.159 is it's kind of pitiful when you compare it to 0:06:19.240 --> 0:06:22.760 other places. According to NASA, that light emission from North 0:06:22.839 --> 0:06:25.640 Korea's capital city is really kind of the equivalent to 0:06:25.680 --> 0:06:28.840 that of small towns in South Korea, So it kind 0:06:28.839 --> 0:06:31.800 of gives you an idea of how technologically behind North 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:35.000 Korea really is. Well, what's strange is that it's not 0:06:35.040 --> 0:06:37.039 really anything new to the region, right, Like, Korea has 0:06:37.080 --> 0:06:39.120 been called the Hermit Kingdom going back to as far 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:42.000 as the eighties, and that was well before the nation 0:06:42.040 --> 0:06:44.360 split into a North and South. So the nation has 0:06:44.400 --> 0:06:47.120 always had a little interaction with its immediate neighbors like 0:06:47.200 --> 0:06:50.239 China and Japan, But otherwise Korea has kept to itself 0:06:50.320 --> 0:06:53.159 for the better part of a thousand years. And that 0:06:53.240 --> 0:06:55.240 really only started to change towards the end of the 0:06:55.279 --> 0:07:00.560 nineteenth century in Japan invaded and rudely took control of Korea, 0:07:00.760 --> 0:07:03.400 which it continued to subjugate and terrorize all the way 0:07:03.440 --> 0:07:05.960 through World War Two and just to make sure that 0:07:06.000 --> 0:07:07.960 we're all clear on our history here. Like, it was 0:07:08.040 --> 0:07:11.400 only after World War Two that the country split in two, right, 0:07:11.440 --> 0:07:13.080 I mean it was sort of like what happened with 0:07:13.120 --> 0:07:15.720 East and West Germany. Yeah, So the Allies had pushed 0:07:15.760 --> 0:07:18.480 hard for the entire Korean peninsula to go democratic after 0:07:18.480 --> 0:07:21.240 the war, but the Soviets opposed this because they thought 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:23.320 I would reduce their influence in the region. So, just 0:07:23.360 --> 0:07:25.840 like with Germany, one half of Korea fell under the 0:07:25.880 --> 0:07:28.240 communist rule, that's the North, and the other half became 0:07:28.240 --> 0:07:33.040 a democracy. In South Korea elected its first president, and 0:07:33.160 --> 0:07:35.920 something different took place in North Korea. So that year, 0:07:35.960 --> 0:07:39.440 instead of a freely elected president, the former monarchy got 0:07:39.440 --> 0:07:42.960 its first totalitarian dictator. His name was Kim Il Sung, 0:07:43.480 --> 0:07:46.080 and he was a Korean Communist. He had strong ties 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:48.320 to the Soviet Union, and during the build up to 0:07:48.320 --> 0:07:51.000 World War two, Kimen worked closely with the Soviets to 0:07:51.040 --> 0:07:54.320 wage all this guerilla warfare against the Japanese. And once 0:07:54.320 --> 0:07:56.240 the war was over, the Soviets knew they needed to 0:07:56.280 --> 0:07:59.360 install a puppet leader to you know, uphold their interests, 0:07:59.600 --> 0:08:01.680 and they're old friend Kimmel Sung just seemed like the 0:08:01.680 --> 0:08:04.480 perfect choice. It made total sense. You know, not only 0:08:04.480 --> 0:08:07.000 does this guy have communist leanings, but he could be 0:08:07.040 --> 0:08:10.760 portrayed as this authentic national hero because of his military service. 0:08:11.680 --> 0:08:13.440 All right, so we obviously lived through some of Kim 0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:15.920 Jong il, his son's reign. But but what was his 0:08:16.000 --> 0:08:19.120 dad like as a leader. He was also a dictator. 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:22.160 So I was looking at the timeline here, and the 0:08:22.320 --> 0:08:25.120 very same year he took power, Kimmel Sung set to 0:08:25.160 --> 0:08:27.760 work building this ruling political party as well as a 0:08:27.800 --> 0:08:30.680 standing army with all his old pals from the guerrilla 0:08:30.720 --> 0:08:33.680 squads that he ran. And it wasn't enough for Kim 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:36.839 to just have total control of the political and military might. 0:08:37.080 --> 0:08:40.439 He also wanted to control his culture, so he created 0:08:40.440 --> 0:08:43.880 this thing called the North Korean Federation of Literature and Art, 0:08:44.160 --> 0:08:46.800 and this was basically his propaganda arm You see this 0:08:46.920 --> 0:08:49.160 used in other places too, but he used this to 0:08:49.200 --> 0:08:51.800 put out state control media and art and to build 0:08:51.880 --> 0:08:55.880 his cult of personality and the propaganda it really portrayed 0:08:55.960 --> 0:08:59.760 him as this godlike figure throughout he was almost destined to, 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:03.400 uh you know, transformed this abused nation into the socialist utopia. 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:06.360 That's how it's depicted. And of course, in reality, Kim 0:09:06.440 --> 0:09:08.600 was doing just the opposite. But one thing we do 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:10.559 know about Kim Il sung is that he invaded South 0:09:10.640 --> 0:09:13.720 Korea nineteen fifty and this wasn't an attempt to unify 0:09:13.840 --> 0:09:16.679 these two Koreas. Of course, he wanted to rule them 0:09:16.679 --> 0:09:19.120 both himself, that's right, and he didn't have the backing 0:09:19.120 --> 0:09:22.199 of Stalin and the Soviet forces, and that's what actually 0:09:22.280 --> 0:09:25.319 spiraled into the Korean War. The US jointed South Korea 0:09:25.320 --> 0:09:27.679 in the fight, and when the fighting finally ceased in 0:09:27.760 --> 0:09:31.559 nineteen fifty three, this was about after five million soldiers 0:09:31.559 --> 0:09:34.280 and civilian lives have been lost, there was no exchange 0:09:34.280 --> 0:09:37.280 of territory. There was no clear victor. Instead, the two 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:41.559 Koreas signed this armistice agreement and they established this demilitarized 0:09:41.640 --> 0:09:45.120 zone between their borders. And since this basically amounted to 0:09:45.160 --> 0:09:48.560 a truce, there was no formal peace treaty between the nations. 0:09:48.600 --> 0:09:52.240 So the two Korea's they're still technically at war with 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:54.560 one another even to this day. Oh, I didn't, I 0:09:54.559 --> 0:09:57.200 didn't realize that. Actually, it's kind of wild to just 0:09:57.200 --> 0:09:59.880 speaking of weird facts around this, because not only has 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:03.000 North Korea held onto the same war, for nearly seventy years. 0:10:03.040 --> 0:10:06.319 It's actually kept the same president as well. So how 0:10:06.320 --> 0:10:08.480 do you mean, because Kim Il sung died in four 0:10:09.000 --> 0:10:11.000 and then uh, Kim John Ill took over, and then 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:14.319 he died in two thousand eleven. And I mean, now 0:10:14.360 --> 0:10:17.000 there's Kim Jong un in there, but they dress alike 0:10:17.040 --> 0:10:20.080 and they act like but those are different people. Yeah, 0:10:20.120 --> 0:10:22.480 I mean, of course that's true. I'm not not getting 0:10:22.480 --> 0:10:24.800 weird here with all of that. But after Kim Il 0:10:24.880 --> 0:10:27.920 sung died in the nineteen nineties, the North Korean constitution 0:10:28.000 --> 0:10:30.760 was amended, and they amended it so that they could 0:10:30.760 --> 0:10:34.880 declare him the eternal president. And actually this happened again 0:10:34.920 --> 0:10:37.719 after Kim Jong ill passed away, So both of them 0:10:37.720 --> 0:10:41.440 are now considered the eternal leaders of North Korea, you know, 0:10:41.480 --> 0:10:43.520 and poor Kim Jong un has to settle for just 0:10:43.600 --> 0:10:46.760 being the first secretary. And there's a term for this 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:49.559 kind of setup. It's called a necrocracy, and that that's 0:10:49.559 --> 0:10:52.440 when a country still operates under the rules of a 0:10:52.520 --> 0:10:55.240 dead leader. And as you might guess, North Korea is 0:10:55.280 --> 0:10:57.240 the only one of those in the world. Well, it's 0:10:57.240 --> 0:10:59.800 a good term for scrabble, I guess. But you know, 0:10:59.800 --> 0:11:01.640 it's since you brought up funny titles, I do have 0:11:01.679 --> 0:11:03.679 to mention some of the really ridiculous ones that Kim 0:11:03.760 --> 0:11:06.320 Jong ill used to be called. So the state press 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:08.440 typically referred to him as dear Leader, as he might 0:11:08.480 --> 0:11:10.520 have heard, and that's what it also called his father. 0:11:10.840 --> 0:11:13.600 But these are what some North Korean journalists have also 0:11:13.640 --> 0:11:17.920 called him, the Guiding Sun Ray, the ever victorious, iron 0:11:17.920 --> 0:11:21.480 willed commander, and probably my favorite dear Leader, who is 0:11:21.520 --> 0:11:25.120 a perfect incarnation of the appearance that a leader should have. Yeah, 0:11:25.280 --> 0:11:27.760 they really covered all their all their bases with that one. 0:11:28.160 --> 0:11:29.640 You know, things like that are why so many of 0:11:29.720 --> 0:11:34.160 us on the outside holds such contradictory ideas about North Korea. Like, 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:37.000 on the one hand, we know it's this highly militaristic 0:11:37.080 --> 0:11:40.920 nation that absolutely tramples on human rights, but then on 0:11:40.960 --> 0:11:43.400 the other hand, they are all these examples of really 0:11:43.440 --> 0:11:48.320 kind of over the top propaganda, these absurdly transparent posturing moves, 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:52.440 and it just really makes its leaders seem somewhat cartoonish, 0:11:52.480 --> 0:11:54.880 to be honest. And for instance, I was reading about 0:11:54.920 --> 0:11:57.920 this fake village that North Korea built and the demilitarized zone. 0:11:58.000 --> 0:12:00.320 This was back in the nineteen fifties and it was 0:12:00.360 --> 0:12:03.800 just called Peace Village. Now, on the surface it seems 0:12:03.840 --> 0:12:07.280 pretty legit, but they're a bunch of well cared for buildings. 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:10.480 You know, there's a school and a hospital, and according 0:12:10.480 --> 0:12:13.240 to the North Korean government, some two hundred families called 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:16.280 the village home. But in reality, the whole thing is 0:12:16.320 --> 0:12:19.960 just this elaborate propaganda displayment to convince outsiders of the 0:12:19.960 --> 0:12:23.800 country's economic success, and its main purpose is really just 0:12:23.880 --> 0:12:26.800 to try to lure defectors from South Korea. And so 0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:30.079 there's actually this interesting right up that was in Slate. 0:12:30.160 --> 0:12:32.800 I'll just read this piece from it. It It says, viewed 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:35.920 from a distance, Peace Village is unremarkable if a little drab. 0:12:36.400 --> 0:12:40.560 Look closer, however, and the trickery is revealed. Residential buildings 0:12:40.559 --> 0:12:43.920 have no glass in their windows, electric lights and unheard 0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:47.600 of luxury for rural North Koreans, operate on an automatic timer. 0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:51.559 The only people in sight are maintenance workers occasionally dispatched 0:12:51.559 --> 0:12:53.719 to sweep the streets in order to give the impression 0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:57.199 of ongoing activity. It's so crazy that they even bothered 0:12:57.240 --> 0:12:59.720 to keep up this shrade, right, I mean, North Koreans 0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:01.920 have to know it's like a prop town and that 0:13:02.000 --> 0:13:04.280 nobody actually lives there. Yeah, I mean, I kind of 0:13:04.280 --> 0:13:07.600 doubt anybody's falling for it, whether they're inside North Korea 0:13:07.720 --> 0:13:10.080 or outside North Korea. And you know, it's tough to 0:13:10.080 --> 0:13:12.880 say that with certainty since most North Koreans don't have 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:16.000 access to journalists and likely wouldn't feel safe enough to 0:13:16.040 --> 0:13:18.959 speak freely even if they did. But we do have 0:13:19.000 --> 0:13:21.480 some estimates from North Korean defectors, and they claim that 0:13:21.520 --> 0:13:25.720 only around of the current population actually believes what the 0:13:25.760 --> 0:13:28.839 regime tells them. Oh, that's pretty wild. So we should 0:13:28.840 --> 0:13:31.600 definitely talk about what's driving that sea change. But before 0:13:31.600 --> 0:13:33.400 we do, why don't we spend some time on what 0:13:33.400 --> 0:13:36.080 it's actually like to live in North Korea? All right, Well, first, 0:13:36.120 --> 0:13:53.520 let's take a quick break. If you're listening to Part 0:13:53.520 --> 0:13:55.680 Time Genius and we're talking about the hidden secrets of 0:13:55.760 --> 0:13:58.360 life and the Hermit Kingdom, all right, mango, So we 0:13:58.480 --> 0:14:01.480 just discussed the propaganda village that North Korean officials used 0:14:01.480 --> 0:14:04.360 to try and pretend that all is well in their country, 0:14:04.400 --> 0:14:06.400 and now we want to give the flip side and 0:14:06.640 --> 0:14:10.000 talk about what life there is really like. But full 0:14:10.000 --> 0:14:12.520 disclosure on this I mean, it's not such an easy 0:14:12.640 --> 0:14:15.600 thing to do. The North Korean government goes to a 0:14:15.640 --> 0:14:18.160 lot of trouble to make sure that visiting journalists and 0:14:18.280 --> 0:14:21.520 curious tourists only see what it wants them to see. 0:14:21.600 --> 0:14:24.000 And you know, when you add to that that culture 0:14:24.000 --> 0:14:27.920 of silence that's been cultivated among North Korean citizens, you know, 0:14:27.960 --> 0:14:30.360 getting that clear picture of what life is like there, 0:14:30.440 --> 0:14:33.680 it really starts to look impossible. Yeah, that's definitely true. 0:14:33.680 --> 0:14:35.560 And I was reading a few accounts from people who 0:14:35.640 --> 0:14:38.120 have actually visited North Korea, and it was wild to 0:14:38.160 --> 0:14:41.720 see how controlled the experience is for Western tourists. Like 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:43.520 when you first get to the country, you have to 0:14:43.600 --> 0:14:47.040 temporarily surrender all your personal electronics except for cameras, so 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:51.600 cell phones, tablets, laptops, video games, all that gets turned 0:14:51.600 --> 0:14:53.600 over to border agents and then returned at the end 0:14:53.640 --> 0:14:56.280 of your trip. It's not just electronics, like books and 0:14:56.320 --> 0:14:58.960 magazines are another thing that also got confiscated at the border. 0:14:59.560 --> 0:15:02.240 I mean, I get that taking all the electronics is 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:05.400 a way to prevent visitors from sharing information within the country, 0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:08.120 but but why would they take away books. I mean, 0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:10.880 the government isn't just worried about Westerners leaking secrets to 0:15:10.920 --> 0:15:14.280 the outside world. They're also worried about tourists sharing information 0:15:14.320 --> 0:15:16.920 with North Korean's it's in the government's best interest to 0:15:16.960 --> 0:15:19.840 keep the citizens as clueless as possible when it comes 0:15:19.880 --> 0:15:22.080 to what they're missing out on, as well as how 0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:24.640 the rest of the world views their country. I mean, 0:15:24.680 --> 0:15:27.560 in that case, I'm surprised they let people keep their cameras. Actually, 0:15:28.400 --> 0:15:30.880 I mean, the government is also pretty desperate to convince 0:15:30.920 --> 0:15:33.680 people that North Korea is normal, and I guess coming 0:15:33.680 --> 0:15:36.880 back from vacation without a single picture kind of undercuts 0:15:36.880 --> 0:15:40.360 that idea. But photography is still restricted, just like everything else. 0:15:40.400 --> 0:15:43.200 So tourists are actually a signed state approved tour guides 0:15:43.200 --> 0:15:45.840 reminders whose job it is to show you, like the 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:48.680 authorized sites, they avert your gaze from the stuff you 0:15:48.720 --> 0:15:50.280 aren't supposed to see. I had a friend who went 0:15:50.320 --> 0:15:52.480 to North Korea and was told only to point his 0:15:52.520 --> 0:15:55.600 camera in certain directions. And these guys really stay on 0:15:55.640 --> 0:15:57.440 top of you pretty much the whole time, Like they 0:15:57.480 --> 0:15:59.920 even get their own rooms in whatever hotel you're staying in. 0:16:00.520 --> 0:16:02.560 I mean, so you basically have a babysitter the whole 0:16:02.600 --> 0:16:05.600 time you're in the country. There, and are you not 0:16:05.640 --> 0:16:08.200 allowed to explore on your own at all? No, your 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:10.600 your itinerary has to be completely planned out and improved 0:16:10.640 --> 0:16:13.000 in advance, and you aren't allowed to deviate from the 0:16:13.000 --> 0:16:15.560 plan or even leave your hotel without the guide say so. 0:16:16.080 --> 0:16:17.960 This way, they can be sure that you only see 0:16:18.000 --> 0:16:20.440 what they want you to see, and there's no chance 0:16:20.480 --> 0:16:22.960 for you to like wander the countryside, or check out 0:16:22.960 --> 0:16:25.760 a rural town, or or even investigate how an average 0:16:25.760 --> 0:16:29.160 person lives. Instead, you're loaded on these buses and trucked 0:16:29.160 --> 0:16:32.640 around Pyongyang to all the tourist friendly landmarks and museums 0:16:32.640 --> 0:16:34.960 and monuments, and and those are the things that the 0:16:35.040 --> 0:16:37.560 nation's leadership really wants you to see and what they 0:16:37.600 --> 0:16:40.080 find agreeable. And while you're free to take photos of 0:16:40.120 --> 0:16:42.920 these attractions once you're on site, you aren't allowed to 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:46.160 take pictures during bus rides between locations. And that's just 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:48.920 because they don't want any evidence gathering about how poor 0:16:49.040 --> 0:16:51.800 and underdeveloped so much of the country is. I'm gonna 0:16:51.800 --> 0:16:54.520 have to say, this does not sound like a fun vacation. 0:16:54.600 --> 0:16:57.320 I feel like I'd be stressed out the entire time. 0:16:58.280 --> 0:17:01.200 I'm curious what kinds of places are allowed on these 0:17:01.240 --> 0:17:04.679 government approved tours. So one common stuff is called the 0:17:04.720 --> 0:17:08.200 Grand People's Study House. It's this pagoda style library is 0:17:08.240 --> 0:17:11.120 at the university in Pyongyang, and it's included on the tour. 0:17:11.440 --> 0:17:14.680 Not only is this impressive example of architecture, but also 0:17:14.720 --> 0:17:17.239 as a way to show how modern North Korean life is. 0:17:17.640 --> 0:17:20.399 Like there's this massive bank of computer terminals that the 0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:23.440 guides always point out, but the illusion doesn't always work. 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:25.520 Like I was reading about the one time when all 0:17:25.560 --> 0:17:27.760 the lights suddenly went out in the library and there 0:17:27.840 --> 0:17:30.160 was all this panic effort to like kind of say 0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:32.200 face and get them back on as fast as possible, 0:17:32.480 --> 0:17:34.240 and for the people visiting, they said it seemed like 0:17:34.280 --> 0:17:37.000 the electricity was only used when the Westerners were there 0:17:37.040 --> 0:17:39.639 to see it. It's so creepy and just so strange. 0:17:39.640 --> 0:17:42.240 And I'm guessing the computers are likely just for show 0:17:42.280 --> 0:17:44.239 in that case. But what about the books. I mean, 0:17:44.240 --> 0:17:47.280 if they confiscate knowledge at the border, I'm guessing the 0:17:47.280 --> 0:17:51.359 library shelves aren't exactly packed with good stuff. There's supposedly 0:17:51.480 --> 0:17:54.800 room for about thirty million books, but the actual collection 0:17:55.000 --> 0:17:57.639 seems to be much smaller than that, and most of 0:17:57.680 --> 0:18:00.480 us there is propaganda and North Korean literature, But there's 0:18:00.520 --> 0:18:04.080 also a decent stock of government approved foreign publications, just 0:18:04.119 --> 0:18:06.560 nothing too recent. So you can find like a whole 0:18:06.600 --> 0:18:10.320 shelf of Jane Austin books apparently, but very little from 0:18:10.359 --> 0:18:13.119 the last fifty years or so of Western literature. Plus 0:18:13.200 --> 0:18:15.040 you have to get special permission to check out foreign 0:18:15.040 --> 0:18:18.359 books anyway, Yeah, that's not not surprising. It sounds like 0:18:18.400 --> 0:18:20.600 a trip to North Korea mostly means a trip to 0:18:20.680 --> 0:18:23.080 the capital city, But do tours ever get a chance 0:18:23.119 --> 0:18:25.800 to visit some of the more rural areas well. It 0:18:25.920 --> 0:18:27.680 used to be that pyong Young was pretty much the 0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:30.000 only stop for tourists, but in recent years the guides 0:18:30.040 --> 0:18:31.639 have been allowed to take visitors to some of the 0:18:31.680 --> 0:18:35.240 more pleasant parts of the countryside. But even in those cases, 0:18:35.520 --> 0:18:37.399 you still get the sense that you're part of some 0:18:37.520 --> 0:18:40.479 elaborate hoax, or that things aren't quite as they appear. 0:18:41.040 --> 0:18:44.160 For example, I was reading about this trip on Atlas 0:18:44.160 --> 0:18:46.920 Obscura and and the author talks about the day when 0:18:46.960 --> 0:18:49.200 his tour group was bust into one of the rural 0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:53.800 provinces in the afternoon, and just listen to what happened. Quote, 0:18:54.080 --> 0:18:57.440 I visited a waterfall one time near case Song, where 0:18:57.440 --> 0:19:00.280 our group ran into a horde of uniformed school children 0:19:00.320 --> 0:19:03.760 on a day trip. Nearby, several families sang karaoke and 0:19:03.840 --> 0:19:06.280 danced beside a barbecue in the woods. It was an 0:19:06.280 --> 0:19:09.800 idyllic scene until I remember that it was the school holidays. 0:19:09.960 --> 0:19:12.359 The families were still there when we left. As we 0:19:12.440 --> 0:19:15.360 boarded our coach, the only other transportation insight was another 0:19:15.400 --> 0:19:18.960 bus featuring government issued number plates. It was hard not 0:19:19.000 --> 0:19:23.160 to conclude that we had been surrounded by actors all afternoon. Yeah, 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:25.240 I said, the last thing was creepy, like this gets 0:19:25.280 --> 0:19:29.400 even creepier and performance art. It's so weird. I mean, 0:19:29.400 --> 0:19:32.520 it feels like the Twilight Zone episode where everybody has 0:19:32.560 --> 0:19:35.040 to smile and think happy thoughts or else they'll get 0:19:35.040 --> 0:19:38.040 banished to this corn field. But I mean, it really 0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:40.200 makes me wish we could hear directly from the North 0:19:40.280 --> 0:19:43.400 Koreans and get a better sense of what they're going through, 0:19:43.440 --> 0:19:46.879 you know, beyond the tourist perspective here in the meantime 0:19:46.880 --> 0:19:49.199 that I think we'll have to settle for foreign intelligence 0:19:49.200 --> 0:19:52.040 and the word of North Korean defectors. Just as an 0:19:52.080 --> 0:19:53.760 example of this, I mean, we know that life in 0:19:53.800 --> 0:19:57.200 Pyongyang and a few other cities is increasingly modern, but 0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:01.000