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Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media, Hello, and welcome to Cool People Did

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Speaker 1: Cool Stuff, your weekly reminder that not everything that people

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Speaker 1: have done in history is bad. Sometimes people do good things,

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Speaker 1: usually against the bad things. I'm your host, Margaret Kildoy,

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Speaker 1: and with me today is my guest Samantha McVay.

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Speaker 2: Hello.

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Speaker 1: Hi, you're host of the also stuff related podcast Stuff

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Speaker 1: Mom never told you. Very good.

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Speaker 3: I am a host of that show. How are you?

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Speaker 3: It's been so long?

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Speaker 1: I know it has been way too long. I'm okay.

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Speaker 1: I had a lot. Everyone's like, this bitch hasn't been

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Speaker 1: on me. I'm this bitch hasn't been on the show

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Speaker 1: for like weeks because I took a vacation, and so

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Speaker 1: now I'm back and I love it.

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Speaker 3: I feel like I've been at the beginning. I was

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Speaker 3: at your first episode, which wasn't supposed to happen because

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Speaker 3: but then we had that whole like the world is

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Speaker 3: awful and Rob Wade shot down essentially, and I was on,

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Speaker 3: and then I felt like I came back on not

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Speaker 3: too long after. I feel like it's a yearly thing,

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Speaker 3: and I loved that tradition because I get to see

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Speaker 3: you at least once a year, which is not enough.

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Speaker 1: But it's I'm I'm glad I get to see you

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Speaker 1: at all, and that is Zoom is the main way

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Speaker 1: I came with my friends. I have a totally normal

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Speaker 1: social life on the mountain that I live on. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you know.

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Speaker 3: What, I'm in Atlanta and I don't get out either,

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Speaker 3: so it's okay, yeah, fair, I'm with you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I like having the excuse. You know. It's like

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Speaker 1: I used to like traveling in countries where I didn't

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Speaker 1: speak the language, partly because I could just like sit

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Speaker 1: at dinner with like ten people around and have no

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Speaker 1: idea what NAMEE was talking about. But I like understood

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Speaker 1: why I felt left out. Whereas when I go sit

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Speaker 1: at a table with like ten people and everyone speaking

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Speaker 1: this language I speak, I'm like, it's cool, I don't

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Speaker 1: know how to socialize this.

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Speaker 3: Fine, Yes, that's the awkwardness of being at either situation

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Speaker 3: gives me anxiety either way, So I'm like, why why

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Speaker 3: just stay at home? Just stay at home?

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Speaker 1: That's fair? Well, also with us on this Zoom call

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Speaker 1: is the one and only producer I've ever had on

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Speaker 1: this show, and I won't hear any word otherwise. Scharene

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Speaker 1: sure y, Hi Markt Hi, Samantha.

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Speaker 2: Wow, I love this trio.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Sarine, It's been also a very long time, and

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Speaker 3: I feel like we're also on a timeline because I

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Speaker 3: believe the first time we met it was around February before,

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Speaker 3: right before the pandemic.

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Speaker 2: You're not wrong. It was in twenty nineteen. I'm pretty

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Speaker 2: sure it was twenty nineteen, but I'm not sure what

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Speaker 2: the month was. Yeah, it's a pretty yearly interaction. You'll

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Speaker 2: only exist once a year.

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Speaker 3: That's okay, that's the way I like it. Please don't know.

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Speaker 3: I'm a year except for that one time a year,

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Speaker 3: and hopefully it's for good shows like these.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you'll like this this week's episode.

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Speaker 2: I think I think this is a Samantha episode.

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Speaker 1: I'm excited. I'm excited.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm so excited. Whenever you say that, I get

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Speaker 3: so excited because I know, first of all, you know me,

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Speaker 3: and I love that bit of me. And then also

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Speaker 3: because with all the world being awful, I loved to

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Speaker 3: hear what you're going to tell me because I know

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Speaker 3: there's some badass people, but I'm going to be so

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Speaker 3: excited about that.

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Speaker 1: Is the main thing that I hold on to with

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Speaker 1: the fact that everything is awful is that the types

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Speaker 1: of people that I talk about on the show are

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Speaker 1: still here, and people become those people when bad things happen.

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Speaker 1: One of our cool people is Danel, our audio engineer.

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Speaker 1: I nice Hi Hi Daniel. Everyone's to say hi to Danel.

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Speaker 2: Sorry for cat raises.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry for all they editing. Our theme music was

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Speaker 1: written for us by unwoman, So saman the last time

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Speaker 1: we had you, not last time, the first time we

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Speaker 1: had you on. We talked about abortion access and it

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Speaker 1: was right before the house of cards called Roe v.

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Speaker 1: Wade fell down. That should not have been a house

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Speaker 1: of cards because the Democratic Party never did anything to

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Speaker 1: short up since it's precarity has been and continues to

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Speaker 1: be one of the only ways they can get anyone

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Speaker 1: to vote for an outdated capitalist party that essentially no

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Speaker 1: one under the age of forty actually supports true story.

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Speaker 1: That's my I like it.

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Speaker 3: I'm over forty, but I also am.

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Speaker 1: Too, honestly.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: We talked about the Jain Collective, primarily a group of

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Speaker 1: women in Chicago who, coming out of socialist feminist traditions,

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Speaker 1: set up a network that provided illegal abortions safely for years.

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Speaker 1: We talked about a bunch of other abortionists. During the

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Speaker 1: era of illegality in the United States, no one writes

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Speaker 1: the word abortionists. I have a feeling I'm using like

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Speaker 1: a word that people aren't supposed to use. I think

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Speaker 1: you're supposed to say abortion providers, because like abortionists is

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Speaker 1: like a bad word. But I'm kind of like, whatever,

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Speaker 1: it shouldn't be a bad word. It's people who provide. Like,

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Speaker 1: that's great.

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Speaker 3: Exactly you say. I don't know if I've ever heard it,

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Speaker 3: but I like that you're saying it. Okay, great, it

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Speaker 3: might be maybe it's just old timey. I hope it's

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Speaker 3: just old timey. If you're listening and you are an

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Speaker 3: abortion provider and don't want to be called an abortionist,

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Speaker 3: I'm kind of sorry. I actually am sorry, because I

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Speaker 3: think you're doing something incredibly brave and important. Anyway, this week,

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Speaker 3: I've got two more stories for you about two different

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Speaker 3: places and times. Vymar Germany, which was the brief period

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Speaker 3: where Germany was a republic between World War One and

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Speaker 3: the rise of the Nazis, and then those decades in

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Speaker 3: the US, the brief golden era of the US when

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Speaker 3: the US is a republic, you know, when when abortion

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Speaker 3: was legal in all fifty states in.

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Speaker 1: The United States.

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Speaker 3: Oh got cha. I was like that what when? Oh?

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Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, I like it between Roe v. Wade and

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Speaker 1: the now Yeah the now. Yeah. So we're gonna talk

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Speaker 1: about vymar Germany. We're gonna talk about California, two places

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Speaker 1: that punk's write songs about. I have no other connections

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Speaker 1: to draw between these two places. Good connection, both have

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Speaker 1: punk No. Vymar Germany, well, they were pretty punk anyway whatever.

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Speaker 1: Bymar Germany Okay, okay, bymar Germany was a wild place,

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Speaker 1: like do you know much about I don't know how

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Speaker 1: cultural zeitgeist vymar Germany is.

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Speaker 3: Like, yeah, I would not know. I do not know,

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Speaker 3: And I'm right for those because I'm like who win when?

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Speaker 1: Okay, okay, let's go. So this is the era of

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Speaker 1: like Cabaret, like that movie. This is the era of

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Speaker 1: like Weimar. Germany was a really wild place in one

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Speaker 1: of the most interesting times and places in history. It

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Speaker 1: was incredibly progressive and incredibly politically engaged in all kinds

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Speaker 1: of directions, and it is, you know, basically nineteen twenties Germany.

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Speaker 1: It's nineteen eighteen to nineteen thirty three. Okay, everyone was

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Speaker 1: fucking starving, and everyone was fucking traumatized. They had just

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Speaker 1: lost this war that they shouldn't have been in, and

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Speaker 1: it's kind of their fault, but wasn't What wasn't like

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Speaker 1: the random german on the street's fault, you know, right right,

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Speaker 1: and during the nineteen twenties, so it's like famous for

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Speaker 1: all the like well cabaret culture and all the like

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Speaker 1: decadent art type stuff that's happening in a collapsing society, right,

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Speaker 1: But there's also this wild political fighting going on between

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Speaker 1: anarchist communists, social democrats, monarchists, and fascists. Like all of

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Speaker 1: these different groups are like, no, I'm going to be

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Speaker 1: in charge. Now, I'm gonna be in charge, and they're

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Speaker 1: all getting into fights in the street about it. Culture

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Speaker 1: was blooming. You have the first LGBT research center and

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Speaker 1: gender affirming care facility in Western history, including like the

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Speaker 1: first gender a firming surgeries for trans women and things

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Speaker 1: like that which happened at the Institute for Sex Research,

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Speaker 1: which if people want to hear more about, they can

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Speaker 1: go and listen to our episode about gay resistance to Nazis.

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Speaker 1: We talk all about that place and time. It's real

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Speaker 1: neat except for the fact that I think this is

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Speaker 1: a little bit more commonly known. You know how like

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Speaker 1: all the famous photos of Nazis burning books, all of

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Speaker 1: those photos are of them burning books about transness basically,

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Speaker 1: and like LGBT stuff because they torched the world's first

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Speaker 1: LGBT resource center. Anyway. Yeah, that's the fun part of

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Speaker 1: like all of histories, is a dance between action and

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Speaker 1: reaction and like positive and negative forces, and like I

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Speaker 1: hate to think of things dualistically, but there's like bad

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Speaker 1: stuff and there's people who fight the bad stuff.

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Speaker 2: It's almost like they went too far to the left

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Speaker 2: or to good and they had to ricochet all the

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Speaker 2: way to bad, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: Which is what I'm afraid is what's happening right now

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Speaker 1: in the units.

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Speaker 3: I just want to say, I feel like we're playing

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Speaker 3: we're playing that out they play out right now.

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Speaker 1: In the US. So yeah, basically, they're like and everywhere,

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Speaker 1: what do you mean gay people can get married and

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Speaker 1: we let like people of other you know, races and

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Speaker 1: ethnicities like co exist peacefully. Can't have that? How dare you?

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Speaker 1: It was in its way, The Viimar Republic was in

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Speaker 1: its way, very progressive society, but the laws hadn't necessarily

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Speaker 1: caught up yet with society's viewpoints. Birth control and abortion

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Speaker 1: were both illegal. Abortion was illegal everywhere in the Western

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Speaker 1: world at this point except for the USSR. The Revolution

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Speaker 1: legalized abortion, and then Stalin was like just kidding and

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Speaker 1: got rid of it. But during this period abortion is

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Speaker 1: legal in the USSR. And so you've always awesome folks

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Speaker 1: living in Germany. You also have clearly less awesome folks

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Speaker 1: who are going to take power in about ten years

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Speaker 1: and they're like, well, how do we have abortions and

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Speaker 1: talk about birth control when it's illegal? Who will do

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Speaker 1: these crimes with and for us? Elsewhere in the Western world,

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Speaker 1: at least in the US, where I've done more research

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Speaker 1: about it, the answer to who will organize crime is

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Speaker 1: usually organized crime right kind of famously in the US

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Speaker 1: for decades, probably at least a century, if you wanted

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Speaker 1: an abortion, you went to a mafia doctor. Even the

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Speaker 1: Jain collective, who we all love as heroes, their first

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Speaker 1: doctors were almost certainly mafia. And don't want to conjecture

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Speaker 1: too hard with people who are still alive. Also, we

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Speaker 1: talked about on our Stonewall episode and this is really

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Speaker 1: just this whole episode is just to like go back

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Speaker 1: and listen all these other episodes. We talk on the

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Speaker 1: Stonewall episode about how the old gay clubs were mafia

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Speaker 1: run back in the day. So like most places, the

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Speaker 1: mafia was the one providing the services that people needed

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Speaker 1: and were not available legally. Right, there's another group that's

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Speaker 1: really good at organizing crime. You ever heard of a

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Speaker 1: narco syndicalism?

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Speaker 3: No, please explain?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, like one time, when I first became an anarchist,

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Speaker 1: I went and I was like hanging out with my

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Speaker 1: family and they're like, well, what do you believe? And

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Speaker 1: I was like, well, have you ever heard of syndicalism?

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Speaker 1: And everyone like turns to my grandfather, who's like the

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Speaker 1: like wise old man or whatever you know, and he

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Speaker 1: like looks really deep in thought and he rubs his

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Speaker 1: chin and he goes, Now, there's a word I haven't

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Speaker 1: heard in a very long time.

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Speaker 3: Real ominous.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So syndicalism, it's a worker's movement. It still exists.

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Speaker 1: Syndicalism is a worker's movement that believes in forming workers'

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Speaker 1: power through unionism, through forming unions, right, and it's as

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Speaker 1: a way to build a better society. It's like not

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Speaker 1: reformist unionism and arcosyndicalism, which is a very large branch

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Speaker 1: of the syndicalist movement in many countries, is the majority

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Speaker 1: of it many countries. It's not many countries, syndicalism is

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Speaker 1: more communist and arcosyndicalism believes in doing syndicalism in order

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Speaker 1: to create a society without capitalism in the state, where

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Speaker 1: like workers' councils collectively create society and fit form all

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Speaker 1: of our needs and things like that, and arcosyndicalists have

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Speaker 1: this like from a labor movement point of view, they

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Speaker 1: have this reputation as like the wild radicals, right, who

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Speaker 1: are a little too into direct action and they all

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Speaker 1: hate voting and shit, you know. For the rest of

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Speaker 1: the anarchist movement, they're like kind of bureaucratic and boring,

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Speaker 1: is the sort of reputation that they have because they're

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Speaker 1: very organized. Okay, so they're perfect for this role. The

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Speaker 1: union part gives them the organizational skills, the anarchist part

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Speaker 1: gives them the affinity for crime. So in Weimar Germany,

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Speaker 1: abortions were done by lay organizations, that is, they were

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Speaker 1: done by not doctors, not even like clinics necessarily, and

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Speaker 1: these organizations, they weren't branded as an arcosyndicalist, but their

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Speaker 1: leadership and their organizing principles came from that part of

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Speaker 1: the labor movement. Basically, the women and sometimes men of

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Speaker 1: the anarchosyndicalist movement were like, well, here's a need, we

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Speaker 1: know how to organize crime at large scale. That's what

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Speaker 1: we do usually it strikes and sabotage and things like that.

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Speaker 1: And then they left off the branding of like anarchism

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Speaker 1: and syndicalism because this was about reproductive health first and foremost.

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Speaker 1: And so they set up all these organizations and I'm

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Speaker 1: just like, I'm now off script. I'm so fucking interested

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Speaker 1: by this because there's like, well, I'll just okay, I'll

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Speaker 1: just get into it. This organization was done on a

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Speaker 1: fucking massive scale, Like I'm not I love Jaane Collective

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Speaker 1: right right, that's like one city and one clinic right.

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Speaker 1: In nineteen thirty alone, these lay organizations performed a million

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Speaker 1: abortions in Germany in one year.

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Speaker 3: Damn.

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Speaker 1: There was roughly one hundred and fifty thousand people in

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Speaker 1: these organizations. They worked out of two hundred locations. Wow,

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Speaker 1: there was two hundred Jane collectives right right that were

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Speaker 1: syndicated together. They were unionized together. About fifteen thousand people

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Speaker 1: were like the really active participants. I ran across both

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Speaker 1: the one hundred and fifty and the fifteen thousand numbers. I'm

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Speaker 1: under the impression one hundred and fifty thousand is the like

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Speaker 1: the broader overall activist support, and fifteen thousand would be

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Speaker 1: like people who are like more directly like, this is

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Speaker 1: what they do, you know, they're very active.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, they I'm a still high number, I know.

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Speaker 1: And what they did they weren't just like, hey were

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Speaker 1: the abortion organization, right. What they did was that they

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Speaker 1: were like, hey, we're the following minor crime organization. We

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Speaker 1: are the sex education and birth control organization. We pass

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Speaker 1: out contraceptives, We hold meetings where we talk about birth control,

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Speaker 1: which is all like illegal and shit, but it's it's

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Speaker 1: like kind of illegal. It's like, ah, ah, you caught me.

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Speaker 1: I was given out condoms again. Ah, I'm not bad. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but it's not really a secret that this above ground

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Speaker 1: but still a llegal organization was where people went when

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Speaker 1: they needed abortions. They also didn't charge money for abortions.

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Speaker 1: Oh wow, a million fucking I just for ten years,

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Speaker 1: one hundred and fifty thousand people came together to organize

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Speaker 1: the entire country's abortion service illegally, safely and free. Theyized

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Speaker 1: they used anarchist organizing principles and anarchist organizers, but they

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Speaker 1: didn't label their organization as an anarchist thing, and not

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Speaker 1: everyone engaged with it would have identified as an anarchist right,

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Speaker 1: And it's fucking like unknown it at least in English language.

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Speaker 3: Shit.

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Speaker 1: I learned about this a year and a half ago

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Speaker 1: when I was actually doing research for the episode that

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Speaker 1: I did with you last time. I found the like

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Speaker 1: one sentence version that was like, oh, and by the way,

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Speaker 1: there was like two hundred clinics doing a million abortions

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Speaker 1: a year in Germany that the syndicalists were running. And

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Speaker 1: I'm like, can you can you tell me more about

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Speaker 1: this thing? That's more impressive than anything I've ever read

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Speaker 1: in history?

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Speaker 3: That it performed over a million abortions? Yeah, how long

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Speaker 3: did they exist?

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Speaker 1: So we'll talk a little bit about but it's like

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Speaker 1: I think that they ebbed and flowed. We're talking about

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Speaker 1: roughly nineteen twenty four to nineteen thirty three.

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Speaker 3: Wow, that long. That's pretty impressive. I know that's not

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Speaker 3: that long in real time, but in my head, for

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Speaker 3: an organization like this, with an issue like that, it

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Speaker 3: seemingly is a little longer than I would have assumed

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Speaker 3: for underground or aimation.

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Speaker 1: Like this totally, and so I spent the past year

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Speaker 1: and a half trying to find out more information about

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Speaker 1: this fucking thing. There is one seven page paper written

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Speaker 1: about it in English by Deeter Nell's called it does

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Speaker 1: not have a very entertaining name. It's called anarcho syndicalism

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Speaker 1: in the sexual reform movement in the Weimar Republic.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's on the nose, right right to the point.

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Speaker 1: Let's go. Yeah, Germans tend to be very literal namors.

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Speaker 3: I like it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, okay. So we talk a lot about abortion and

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Speaker 1: birth control in this show, about people fighting for the

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Speaker 1: right to control their own bodies and their own reproduction.

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Speaker 1: What's interesting that we have to wrap our heads around

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Speaker 1: every single time we try and cover any of these issues, Like,

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Speaker 1: for example, when we try and cover like trans issues,

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Speaker 1: you can't just be like, oh, in eighteen eighty there's

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Speaker 1: this translating and mean the same thing that you mean

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Speaker 1: when you say in twenty twenty four, right, because our

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Speaker 1: social conceptions around these things, around sex and gender and

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Speaker 1: all kinds of things are constantly shifting, and people are

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Speaker 1: fighting for bodily autonomy, but how people frame that fight

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Speaker 1: changes over time, and it hasn't always been the same.

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Speaker 1: I'm kind of curious when in your work with like

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Speaker 1: because you all did, I mean, you all did a

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Speaker 1: Jane episode, And I'm just kind of curious, like how

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Speaker 1: much you when you talk about like old feminism, how

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Speaker 1: often do you have to engage in and talk about

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Speaker 1: eugenics and like how big of a problem this was

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Speaker 1: in the old feminist movement.

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Speaker 3: Right in general, when we talk about intersectionality and we

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Speaker 3: have to talk about the ugly parts of this, especially

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Speaker 3: today when we talk about white feminism and what that

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Speaker 3: looks like, and of course eugenics can be under that

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Speaker 3: as well. We kind of understand the background of planned

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Speaker 3: parenthood and the conversations we have about that because we

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Speaker 3: praise planned parenthood, but we also know that there's some ugliness,

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Speaker 3: as we talked about previously, yeah as well, So overall, like, yes,

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Speaker 3: we talk about the dark side of all of it,

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Speaker 3: which makes us kind of bad guys to everyone. And

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Speaker 3: I say we Annie and I who is the other

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Speaker 3: co host, because I have been called out for saying

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Speaker 3: things that they feel are offensive because they don't want

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Speaker 3: to be associated with that type of feminism when in

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Speaker 3: actuality it still is so when we talk about like

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Speaker 3: abortion rights, but then when we talk about sterilization against

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Speaker 3: the people women of color specifically, and what that looks

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Speaker 3: like and why they did it, people don't really want

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Speaker 3: to hear that truth because they don't want to face

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Speaker 3: the fact that, yes, this is an argument against abortion

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Speaker 3: rights in a way, not really, but it can be

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Speaker 3: turned to that point that we've had this many conversation,

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Speaker 3: but we have to be understanding and sensitive to the

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Speaker 3: fact that when it comes to reproductive rights, we're talking

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Speaker 3: about every part of it being right, whether it is

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Speaker 3: choosing to have a child or choosing to abort a fetus,

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Speaker 3: like those are two different things, but the same side

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Speaker 3: of the coin type of thing, I guess, so we

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Speaker 3: talk about it in realms of yes, we're uncomfortable because

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Speaker 3: for me, even though I'm a woman of color, I'm

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Speaker 3: also you know, very headonormative sis gender in that level.

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Speaker 3: So I have to talk about being uncomfortable when it

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Speaker 3: comes to talking about LGBTQ rights in general or any

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Speaker 3: queer rights in general. But like I'm now just having

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Speaker 3: this long dip about this, but because it's not simple.

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Speaker 3: It is simple, and it isn't simple when it comes

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Speaker 3: to the fact that people want to bend what they

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Speaker 3: think is their true rights or true beliefs. And now

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Speaker 3: oftentimes sometimes if you're a person who have any type

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Speaker 3: of privilege, then that means that you are taking advantage

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Speaker 3: you could be you're probably taking advantage of someone else

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Speaker 3: who are in the marginalized community when you do these things.

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Speaker 1: Does that make sense that yeah, no, no, no, it

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Speaker 1: makes sense because like you think that your frame with

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Speaker 1: which you understand things is the correct one and the

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Speaker 1: only one, the universal frame, especially when you are in

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Speaker 1: the like when you are in the privileged position you

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Speaker 1: are presented when you are the default of something, right

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Speaker 1: as like a as like a white person, I am

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Speaker 1: the default, but as a trans woman I am not

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Speaker 1: the default of that. You know. But you know what

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Speaker 1: else is really uncomfortable being supported by advertisers on an

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Speaker 1: anti capitalist show. So that thank you, Transition So here's

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Speaker 1: some of those unless you have cooler zone media, in

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Speaker 1: which case your money went directly into my dog's football

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Speaker 1: and you don't have to hear ads. But here they

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Speaker 1: are anyway, and we're back.

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Speaker 3: I'm still laughing at that transition, thank you.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay. So one of the things that I really

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Speaker 1: struggle with talking about kind of what you're talking about

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Speaker 1: is is that we have to talk about the unfortunate

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Speaker 1: opinions that many early birth control pioneers had about eugenics.

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Speaker 1: And we also have to talk about how eugenics wasn't

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Speaker 1: necessarily always a right wing talking point. It was an

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Speaker 1: everyone talking point for decades, which doesn't make it okay.

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Speaker 1: Is the thing that we you basically have this dark

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Speaker 1: half a century between Darwin is like, evolution is real,

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Speaker 1: and then people realize watching the nazis just like hammer

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Speaker 1: home what eugenics is like really about At the end

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Speaker 1: right the day, you know, that space in between is

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Speaker 1: full of people in the right, left and center being like,

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Speaker 1: wouldn't it be cool if we could kind of use

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Speaker 1: evolution to like make everything better? You know? And there's

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Speaker 1: this thing that happens that I've ran across while researching

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Speaker 1: this episode where people try to distance the historical eugenics movement,

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Speaker 1: which they will call the part that believes that only

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Speaker 1: the fittest should reproduce, and then the population control movement,

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Speaker 1: which aims to bring down the overall population through birth control,

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Speaker 1: but not in a targeted way as much as I've

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Speaker 1: ever read, and I think that that, Okay, this difference

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Speaker 1: comes after World War Two and people start making that difference.

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Speaker 1: But before then, everyone, including the people who don't want

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Speaker 1: to believe that they're acting racistly or ablistically or whatever,

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Speaker 1: are using the word eugenics to describe what they want,

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Speaker 1: and they meant it in a very positive way for

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Speaker 1: whatever thing that they were trying to do. And the

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Speaker 1: reason I want to talk about it is because, Okay,

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Speaker 1: so over the years, states feudal, capitalist and socialist have

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Speaker 1: all gone to great lengths to control our bodies and

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Speaker 1: our reproduction in whatever direction that they want. At that time,

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Speaker 1: when the USSR legalized abortion, they were the first Western

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Speaker 1: state to do so in nineteen twenty, and it was

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Speaker 1: in part because they were like, hell, yeah, we believe

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Speaker 1: in communism, inequality, and everyone's going to be able to

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Speaker 1: make their own choices, right. But a lot of it

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Speaker 1: was because everyone was fucking starving, so choosing to not

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Speaker 1: have kids was seen as something that you would do

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Speaker 1: in solidarity with society at large. So they wanted to

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Speaker 1: make it possible to act in solidarity with society at large.

433
00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,240
Speaker 1: And if that is your own decision, If someone listening

434
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:10,760
Speaker 1: is like, I think that's too many people in the

435
00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:12,840
Speaker 1: world and they decided not to have kids, that's great.

436
00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:15,320
Speaker 1: Deciding that other people shouldn't get to have kids because

437
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:16,879
Speaker 1: you think there's too many people in the world, or

438
00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,840
Speaker 1: the state mandates it, that's when it gets real fucking bad.

439
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:23,679
Speaker 1: Right by the time Stalin got his claws into it,

440
00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:27,000
Speaker 1: it's not quite just like early Bolsheviks were kind of okay,

441
00:23:27,040 --> 00:23:30,640
Speaker 1: and then Stalin was a man of evil even though whatever. Anyway,

442
00:23:31,200 --> 00:23:33,680
Speaker 1: people can hear my opinion, my negative opinions about even

443
00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:36,960
Speaker 1: the regular Bolsheviks that are but whatever. By this time

444
00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:40,760
Speaker 1: Stalin gets his hands into things. Abortion was not only outlawed,

445
00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:42,840
Speaker 1: but incentives were put into place to encourage people to

446
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:46,439
Speaker 1: have large families, because having lots of kids was something

447
00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:50,919
Speaker 1: you should do in solidarity with society at large, and

448
00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:53,520
Speaker 1: so the state wants to control whether people do or

449
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:58,520
Speaker 1: don't have kids. But the lever it's using is class solidarity.

450
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 1: The lever it's using is like be you know, care

451
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:06,560
Speaker 1: about the rest of the world right to me? You

452
00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:08,600
Speaker 1: can just cut through all this bullshit by being like, hey,

453
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:10,919
Speaker 1: a person who's pregnant gets to decide if that's a

454
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,040
Speaker 1: condition that they want to continue to have. Like that

455
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:17,040
Speaker 1: is just the larger social conditions can influence it one

456
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:18,520
Speaker 1: way or the other. But at the end of the day,

457
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:20,640
Speaker 1: our bodies are choice. It's a good slogan, we can

458
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:25,119
Speaker 1: stick with it. But the thing that in order to

459
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:33,280
Speaker 1: understand these German abortion providers, and also to understand folks

460
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:34,960
Speaker 1: were going to talk about in the sixties and seventies

461
00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:36,840
Speaker 1: coming out of like Black Power movement and all these

462
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:40,680
Speaker 1: other kind of places, people weren't thinking about it necessarily

463
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:44,080
Speaker 1: in the same frame. We have to look at things

464
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:48,400
Speaker 1: through people's own framing, own lenses in order to understand them.

465
00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,160
Speaker 1: Two influences on people's framing about how they feel about

466
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:56,520
Speaker 1: abortion are religion, which we'll talk about later, and class consciousness.

467
00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:00,879
Speaker 1: So in Weimar, Germany as its famous hedonism and all

468
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:05,399
Speaker 1: this shit, but culture wasn't a political People were thinking

469
00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:10,159
Speaker 1: very consciously about what they do as it relates to

470
00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:15,280
Speaker 1: these political questions, and specifically, the question of class struggle

471
00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 1: was like the fucking question in Europe and like the

472
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 1: I don't know nineteen oughts to the nazis fucking changing

473
00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:32,520
Speaker 1: everything in a real negative way. That's my rant. So

474
00:25:32,600 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 1: people tended not to see themselves solely as individuals, but

475
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:38,439
Speaker 1: also as actors within larger social frameworks like the working

476
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:41,040
Speaker 1: class or the communist party, or the anarchist movement, or

477
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:44,720
Speaker 1: the fascist movement or the monarchy, whatever the fuck right.

478
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 1: People thought of themselves as part of a whole in

479
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 1: a lot of ways. And I'm going to quote this

480
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:55,480
Speaker 1: German anarchist synthelist Max Winkler, who wrote in a pamphlet

481
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,280
Speaker 1: as a birth control pamphlet that a union was distributing

482
00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:03,840
Speaker 1: all workers. Organizations are concerned almost exclusively with economic and

483
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,720
Speaker 1: political issues. Both the parties and the unions view the

484
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:11,879
Speaker 1: issue of sex as being insignificant, irrelevant. There once was

485
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:14,959
Speaker 1: a time when it was considered unrespectable to publicly address

486
00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:18,879
Speaker 1: problems concerning sexual relations, and yet it is so tremendously

487
00:26:18,880 --> 00:26:21,680
Speaker 1: important that the sexual issue be addressed without any trace

488
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,359
Speaker 1: of reticence, just as the hunger issue for hunger and

489
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,640
Speaker 1: love are the two polls around which all human life

490
00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 1: and drive revolve. These two issues are so closely entwined

491
00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:35,440
Speaker 1: that it is hardly possible to discuss one without considering

492
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 1: the other. And so this was an introduction to a

493
00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:40,760
Speaker 1: birth control pamphule that has union, the Free Workers' Unions

494
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:44,760
Speaker 1: of Germany, was publishing in the nineteen twenties. More prominent

495
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,879
Speaker 1: still than that union was a SYNDICALUS union called the

496
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:52,719
Speaker 1: Syndicalless Women's Union, which again very literal namers. That's what

497
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:54,399
Speaker 1: it was a union of You.

498
00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:55,160
Speaker 3: Knew they were.

499
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, that's true. I will give them that. Like

500
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:02,320
Speaker 1: not everything should be like Prairie Fire or whatever.

501
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:04,679
Speaker 3: That's the writer in you.

502
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:08,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, I know, which is funny because I

503
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:10,679
Speaker 1: ended up naming my podcast cool People did cool stuff.

504
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 1: But I you know, I like that name too. I

505
00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:16,560
Speaker 1: feel like as it's a good name. Yeah, you're your

506
00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:18,399
Speaker 1: podcast name is similar enough that I think you know

507
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:19,480
Speaker 1: where I'm coming from. You know.

508
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:21,440
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I think it's perfect.

509
00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:22,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a saint.

510
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:26,440
Speaker 3: I like it. It's cold things, cold people, let's go.

511
00:27:26,720 --> 00:27:31,679
Speaker 1: Yeah. So the Cynicalist Women's Union. Their primary social issue

512
00:27:31,760 --> 00:27:35,240
Speaker 1: was sexual health and reproductive rights. As Milli wick Top

513
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 1: put it, the advancement of the intellectual development of women

514
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 1: could not be possible without the liberation from the slavery

515
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,119
Speaker 1: of child bearing. And so how this ties into the

516
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:47,600
Speaker 1: like this larger class consciousness question is that they were

517
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:50,639
Speaker 1: pushing for a child bearing strike. They were basically it

518
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:52,359
Speaker 1: was like a way, it was an attempt at like

519
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 1: a women's strike. It was attempt at I don't know,

520
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:56,879
Speaker 1: it's complicated, and we'll get into it more in a

521
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,920
Speaker 1: little bit. But first, someone to talk about Millie, because

522
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:02,400
Speaker 1: Millie's really cool. And also I think the first person

523
00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:05,639
Speaker 1: named Millie that we've featured on this show, I like it.

524
00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 1: This is a nice name. Goody. Milli was cool as shit.

525
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:13,640
Speaker 1: She and her siblings, including another anarchist feminist birth control

526
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:18,000
Speaker 1: activist named Rose Witcop, They made the mistake of being

527
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:22,360
Speaker 1: born in Ukraine in the eighteen seventies and eighteen eighties

528
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:26,400
Speaker 1: as Jews. So they were like, this isn't the best

529
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,520
Speaker 1: time and place to be us. We don't want to

530
00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:34,680
Speaker 1: be here anymore. So when Milly was sixteen years old,

531
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 1: she moves by herself to London, worked in a sweatshop

532
00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 1: to save enough money to get her three sisters and

533
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 1: her parents to London away from the pograms that were

534
00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:50,040
Speaker 1: happening in Ukraine. Like, I can't imagine me at sixteen

535
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:56,520
Speaker 1: doing any of those things successfully. She could have quit

536
00:28:56,840 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 1: right then and been a fucking hero as far as

537
00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,280
Speaker 1: I'm concerned. And there's so many, you know, I mean,

538
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:03,360
Speaker 1: obviously the world is full of these stories, but they're

539
00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 1: all fucking amazing stories. There's people who help their families

540
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:08,840
Speaker 1: escape from very bad situations and that is an amazing

541
00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 1: thing to do. But she kept going. She joined a

542
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:16,160
Speaker 1: Jewish anarchist newspaper, The Worker's Friend, which was the widest

543
00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:18,960
Speaker 1: circulation Yiddish language newspaper in England at that time, at

544
00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:21,719
Speaker 1: least according to one thing I read another thing. Whatever. Anyway,

545
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:24,640
Speaker 1: I had this problem when everything's like, oh this is

546
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:26,440
Speaker 1: the biggest, or this was the first, or this.

547
00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,560
Speaker 3: Was oh yeah, I'm like, That's something that we talk

548
00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 3: about on our show a lot, because we actually have

549
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:35,360
Speaker 3: a series about a female first type of episodes, but

550
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,080
Speaker 3: we always have to put the caveat it's you don't

551
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,640
Speaker 3: know who's controlling the narrative. You don't know what's been hidden,

552
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 3: what's not been discovered yet, and so everything's under a

553
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 3: caveat of what seems like a first but that could

554
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 3: change at any moment, and they are most likely other

555
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,080
Speaker 3: people who've already done it, and probably people who are

556
00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:54,360
Speaker 3: marginalized and are not going to ever get credit.

557
00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 1: Just to a reminder, no, totally. Like I've started making

558
00:29:57,440 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 1: the joke of every time I'm like the first time

559
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:02,880
Speaker 1: this happened in the world, I'm like the Western world,

560
00:30:03,760 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 1: specifically Europe. It was the first time it happened in

561
00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:10,719
Speaker 1: Europe that we know about, that we know about, but anyway, whatever,

562
00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:14,160
Speaker 1: this wide circulation Yiddish language newspaper in England called The

563
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 1: Worker's Friend and it was built around a larger group

564
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 1: called the Worker's Friend Group, which was basically just people

565
00:30:20,040 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 1: working together to provide mutual aid and care for like

566
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 1: this poor immigrant, you know, anarchist worker population. She meets

567
00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:31,000
Speaker 1: this fellow named Rudolph Rocker and they hook up. They

568
00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:34,680
Speaker 1: get fake hitched, common law hitched in leftist feminist tradition

569
00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:38,640
Speaker 1: at the time, they refused to get legally married. And

570
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:41,520
Speaker 1: I was very excited as soon as whenever I hear

571
00:30:41,560 --> 00:30:44,040
Speaker 1: someone like Rudolf Rocker is more famous than her, normally

572
00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:46,560
Speaker 1: other he's going to live in her shadow. During this episode,

573
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:48,800
Speaker 1: I was very excited to notice that he's only like

574
00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:51,600
Speaker 1: three years older than her, because whenever I hear about

575
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 1: like oh and then this man with a beard, I'm.

576
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:58,760
Speaker 3: Like, ah, fuck, twenty years Oh okay, no.

577
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:02,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, she's like nineteen, he's like twenty two or whatever,

578
00:31:02,360 --> 00:31:07,720
Speaker 1: like except it's completely fine. I have nothing. I've learned

579
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 1: nothing negative about this man through his relationship with her.

580
00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 1: He's going to be a main character of one of

581
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,120
Speaker 1: these days. He's going to be mostly in the shadow

582
00:31:16,200 --> 00:31:18,720
Speaker 1: of his partner and his sister in common in law today.

583
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:22,120
Speaker 1: But the time that we brought him up before was

584
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 1: his speeches and the anarchist unionism in the early twentieth

585
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 1: century in London that he promoted led to the connection

586
00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,240
Speaker 1: between the Irish, Catholic and Jewish working class that about

587
00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 1: twenty years later came together to smash the ever loving

588
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 1: shit out of British Fascism at the Battle of Cable Street.

589
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:43,360
Speaker 1: And it was directly just to retell like one of

590
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:48,320
Speaker 1: my favorite stories in history. Basically, like, while the Irish

591
00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 1: stock workers were starving because they were on strike, and

592
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:55,440
Speaker 1: the Jewish textile workers had just resolved their strike. The

593
00:31:55,520 --> 00:32:00,080
Speaker 1: Jewish textile workers took in the poor starving Irish kid

594
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:03,520
Speaker 1: who couldn't afford food at home, and like watched them

595
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 1: for like five years or like however long for the

596
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,800
Speaker 1: strike to resolve. I don't I don't have this script

597
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,320
Speaker 1: in front of me. And so then later when the

598
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:14,640
Speaker 1: fascists were like, hey, Irish, you're like basically white unlike

599
00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:18,000
Speaker 1: those Jews, am I right? The Irish were like fuck you.

600
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,520
Speaker 1: They fed me when I was twelve, you know, and

601
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:23,200
Speaker 1: then they had like just organized together and beat the

602
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:25,280
Speaker 1: shit out of these fascists. Anyway, I love it. And

603
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 1: that's how Rudolph Rocker came up last time, and it's

604
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 1: just one of my favorite stories. I want to tell

605
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:29,200
Speaker 1: it every chance again.

606
00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:32,040
Speaker 3: It's a good name to go with it too.

607
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:36,200
Speaker 1: I know. Rocker is like a fucking yeah, yeah, yeah,

608
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,120
Speaker 1: it really is. And so he was this German dude.

609
00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:41,240
Speaker 1: He had been raised Catholic, but he learned Yiddish because

610
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:43,320
Speaker 1: he wanted to organize as an anarchist and a lot

611
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,280
Speaker 1: of places in the early twentieth century, in late late

612
00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 1: nineteenth century and meant you learned Yiddish. I think he

613
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:52,840
Speaker 1: did it to impress Millie, is my best guess. Yes, yes,

614
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: the two tried to move to New York City in

615
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:58,840
Speaker 1: eighteen ninety eight, but they were turned away and deported

616
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 1: like literally back on the same ship that they came

617
00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 1: in on, because they weren't married and refused to get married,

618
00:33:04,440 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 1: and they since they didn't let the state sanction their love,

619
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:10,320
Speaker 1: they were deported. And this became this like the newspapers

620
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,680
Speaker 1: and shit covered it, not in this like what the

621
00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:15,040
Speaker 1: fuck why didn't we let these people in? But instead

622
00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:18,520
Speaker 1: this like scandal about those fucking leftists who won't get married.

623
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:22,400
Speaker 3: Yees living in sin, Yeah, trying to pollute the states.

624
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:26,240
Speaker 1: What I know, I know would their sin? How care

625
00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:28,920
Speaker 1: they The main tie into Milly with this whole thing

626
00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:30,800
Speaker 1: is that later she's going to go start these unions

627
00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 1: in Germany, the Women's Cyneclist Union and stuff. But she

628
00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:36,680
Speaker 1: lived this wild ass life. She goes back to London,

629
00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 1: right because she's not allowed to move to the US.

630
00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 1: She and her partner edited two Yiddish newspapers. There's The

631
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 1: Political Worker's Friend and then there's a more cultural one

632
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:46,960
Speaker 1: called Germinal and during World War One they ran a

633
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,800
Speaker 1: soup kitchen together because everyone's like just fucked and starving,

634
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:52,360
Speaker 1: and basically anner because I've been doing food out bombs forever.

635
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:56,120
Speaker 1: And then first her partner and then she got locked

636
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:59,600
Speaker 1: up for opposing the war World War One. When they

637
00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 1: got out, they were like, all right, fuck London, let's

638
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 1: go to Berlin. That seems kind of cool right now.

639
00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:08,200
Speaker 1: Right it's nineteen eighteen or so, and they're like, Berlin's

640
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,360
Speaker 1: suddenly the Weimar Republic and it's really cool. They're like

641
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:14,640
Speaker 1: they get invited to help go start in arcosiniclist unions

642
00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:18,080
Speaker 1: and they're like, that sounds like our jam. So they

643
00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 1: do and they helped form the FOUD the Workers whatever,

644
00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:27,080
Speaker 1: blah blah blah, and Millie helped start not only Berlin

645
00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:30,440
Speaker 1: Women's Union but also the Syndicalists Women's Union to unite

646
00:34:30,480 --> 00:34:33,840
Speaker 1: all of the local and arcos Syndicalists women's unions. She

647
00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:36,920
Speaker 1: hung out there until nineteen thirty three when the Reichstag

648
00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:40,480
Speaker 1: fire happened, and she was like, I like, really shouldn't

649
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 1: be in Germany right now. It seems like a really

650
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:48,879
Speaker 1: bad idea for me as a very prominent Jewish anarchist, right,

651
00:34:50,239 --> 00:34:52,880
Speaker 1: so she dipped. Her husband comes with her. I mean

652
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 1: it probably wasn't good for him either, but you know

653
00:34:55,120 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 1: he was German at least, or I mean whatever anyway,

654
00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 1: And so they moved to an anarchist commune in upstate

655
00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:05,360
Speaker 1: New York, where they continued to be cool for decades

656
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 1: and just organize. After World War II, the whole commune

657
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 1: constantly put together aid packets for the anarchists in Germany

658
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:16,359
Speaker 1: who had somehow survived the fucking war. And she lived

659
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:18,600
Speaker 1: to be seventy eight. She died in nineteen fifty five,

660
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:23,440
Speaker 1: and just did so fucking much. Her sister Rose stayed

661
00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:26,520
Speaker 1: in London and published anarchist feminist text about birth control

662
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:29,600
Speaker 1: and kept getting interested for it and was cool too.

663
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:33,319
Speaker 1: But back to Germany and the Weimar Crime ring, and

664
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:39,200
Speaker 1: by that I mean back to ad break time. Now

665
00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:55,359
Speaker 1: go and we're back. We're talking about vymar Germany, all right.

666
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:58,759
Speaker 1: So you have these syndicluss unions. They're distributing information about

667
00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:02,200
Speaker 1: birth control, pushing for this child burying strike basically, we

668
00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:05,800
Speaker 1: won't have kids until conditions approve. And the social Democrats

669
00:36:05,840 --> 00:36:08,640
Speaker 1: were on this too, just credit where it's due. Radicals

670
00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:11,760
Speaker 1: would write pamphlets with names like how can we promote

671
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 1: to the cultural decline of births as far back as

672
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:18,840
Speaker 1: nineteen thirteen, and this pamphlet sold thirty one thousand copies.

673
00:36:19,320 --> 00:36:20,759
Speaker 1: And this is kind of what I'm talking about, that

674
00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:23,000
Speaker 1: framing and how it's so important to understand it from

675
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:27,640
Speaker 1: their perspective. You know, it's sketchy and all of the

676
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 1: like trying to control who gets to have kids goes

677
00:36:32,040 --> 00:36:37,000
Speaker 1: really badly, but it's like worth seeing where they're coming

678
00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,200
Speaker 1: from about it. The ideas that birth control can be

679
00:36:40,239 --> 00:36:44,200
Speaker 1: a proletarian weapon because the sheer replaceability of workers and

680
00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 1: soldiers was part of why conditions were so bad. In

681
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:51,719
Speaker 1: a very similar way as it also was a feminist

682
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:55,759
Speaker 1: move in which like this is like in the same

683
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:57,839
Speaker 1: way that like workers will, the one thing we can

684
00:36:57,840 --> 00:37:01,640
Speaker 1: withhold is our labor right from the class, A lot

685
00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 1: of different feminist perspectives are like, well, the thing that

686
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:11,080
Speaker 1: we can withhold is well, reproductive labor is the most

687
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:16,279
Speaker 1: annoying misidea mislabeled Marxist term of all times. But they

688
00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 1: can withhold having children, which doesn't count as reproducive labor

689
00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:24,640
Speaker 1: because anyway, whatever fucking complicated as terms not written by women.

690
00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:28,640
Speaker 1: Clearly maybe it was I don't know, Fewer workers meant

691
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:31,120
Speaker 1: less competition for the same jobs, and it also meant

692
00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 1: that both women and workers felt like they had more

693
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:38,440
Speaker 1: control if they pushed this line. I also think that

694
00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:39,880
Speaker 1: they mostly just were like, I don't want to have

695
00:37:39,960 --> 00:37:41,840
Speaker 1: kids right now, and like I kind of want a fuck,

696
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:44,000
Speaker 1: but like, so what if we just find a way

697
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:46,040
Speaker 1: to make that happen. And then we're like, yeah, it's

698
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:48,360
Speaker 1: like for the revolution or something, am I right? And

699
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:52,359
Speaker 1: they're like, yeah, totally, you're cute, Hans, get over here

700
00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 1: with your mustache. And so they started getting talks left

701
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,600
Speaker 1: and right, these like women's unions, right, and they're finding

702
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:01,719
Speaker 1: that sometimes women would come and like they would join

703
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:03,799
Speaker 1: the union just long enough to get I think you

704
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:05,920
Speaker 1: have to be a member to come to them. So

705
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:07,760
Speaker 1: they joined long enough to get like the free condoms

706
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:09,480
Speaker 1: and the advice about how to not get kids, and

707
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:12,760
Speaker 1: then they would dip, which is like, yeah, fair, whatever

708
00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 1: what do you expect.

709
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:16,960
Speaker 3: For there for the party favors? And then they're gonna

710
00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:19,480
Speaker 3: exactly get what they need. Let me get those thanks.

711
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:22,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, like it hasn't gone to an activist meeting for

712
00:38:22,040 --> 00:38:25,040
Speaker 1: the snacks, I mean.

713
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:25,760
Speaker 3: Also the snacks.

714
00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:30,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, and at the beginning, there's one other group distributing

715
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:32,360
Speaker 1: birth control, and they're not doing it for free, the

716
00:38:32,400 --> 00:38:36,240
Speaker 1: condom manufacturers or the I don't specifically know that it's condoms,

717
00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: but I believe it's condoms, because again there's not a

718
00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:43,520
Speaker 1: lot of information the birth control implements or whatever, which

719
00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:45,920
Speaker 1: I assume by this point because the I have like

720
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 1: eight times because of the show, like looked up when

721
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:49,960
Speaker 1: the condom came into common use, and it was a

722
00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:54,440
Speaker 1: while before this anyway, there were clever loopholes and laws

723
00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,360
Speaker 1: that said birth control could be discussed behind closed doors,

724
00:38:57,440 --> 00:38:59,960
Speaker 1: and so they would have like these closed door meetings.

725
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 1: But by nineteen twenty three, in nineteen twenty four, it's

726
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:09,400
Speaker 1: no longer the businesses, and it's no longer the unions.

727
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: It is now these lay organizations that I was talking about.

728
00:39:13,360 --> 00:39:16,399
Speaker 1: They take over as the companies back off. They don't

729
00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:19,960
Speaker 1: actually the unions don't back off. The unions become these

730
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:25,280
Speaker 1: lay organizations. The Free Workers of Germany founded a group

731
00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:28,640
Speaker 1: called the vsl or Association for Sexual Hygiene and Life

732
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:31,760
Speaker 1: Reform and they were like, we swear it's a totally

733
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:35,440
Speaker 1: separate group. It's totally not just our union, like we promise,

734
00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:39,839
Speaker 1: And the cops were like, no, this is quote an

735
00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 1: association closely connected with the Syndicalists, which recruited its members

736
00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:48,640
Speaker 1: primarily from such circles, so they're not fool in anyone.

737
00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:52,040
Speaker 1: In nineteen twenty eight, the VSL and other lay organizations

738
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:56,560
Speaker 1: come together and form a union of lay organizations called

739
00:39:56,600 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 1: the Reich Association of Birth Control and Sexual Hygiene. I

740
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:04,080
Speaker 1: think Reich in this case doesn't mean anything sketchy, and

741
00:40:04,120 --> 00:40:06,640
Speaker 1: it stands for r V, or rather r V is

742
00:40:06,680 --> 00:40:11,200
Speaker 1: what it is abbreviated as. And this group is strictly

743
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:14,719
Speaker 1: neutral in regards to politics and religion. But we all

744
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:16,719
Speaker 1: know where it came from. And the elected chairman was

745
00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:19,920
Speaker 1: a member of the Synthicalist Union, and they ran sexual

746
00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:22,120
Speaker 1: counseling centers all over the country in more than two

747
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:27,440
Speaker 1: hundred locations, teaching sex education, distributing contraceptives, and performing abortions.

748
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:31,040
Speaker 1: Very few physicians in Germany at the time would fuck

749
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:34,200
Speaker 1: with abortions. So this is why, like in a lot

750
00:40:34,239 --> 00:40:38,760
Speaker 1: of other places, it's like crime doctors, but they're like doctors,

751
00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:41,960
Speaker 1: or they're pretending to be doctors, or they perform the

752
00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:44,320
Speaker 1: role of doctors, but that's not there. They're not licensed

753
00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:48,440
Speaker 1: or whatever, you know. But overall in Germany, the physicians

754
00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:50,759
Speaker 1: weren't fucking with it. Either they were anti choice or

755
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:54,480
Speaker 1: they were anti I go to jail now. And so

756
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:58,560
Speaker 1: lay people trained in the performance of abortions. To quote

757
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:01,279
Speaker 1: Hans Schmidtz whose parents were anarchists, and he's just like

758
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:05,360
Speaker 1: describing what he saw as a kid, father was active

759
00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:07,880
Speaker 1: in the League, the local lay organization, the League for

760
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:11,759
Speaker 1: the Protection of Mothers and Social Family Hygiene, because why

761
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:15,160
Speaker 1: would you name your group anything other than that? Back

762
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:17,680
Speaker 1: to the quote, Secretly the League also aided women in

763
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:20,239
Speaker 1: getting abortions. There were several women who could be called

764
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:22,880
Speaker 1: upon when abortion was to be performed. My mother had

765
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 1: quite a bit of experience in this and was one

766
00:41:24,640 --> 00:41:27,360
Speaker 1: of these women. Naturally, we were not allowed to be around,

767
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:29,239
Speaker 1: but the apartment was so small and it could not

768
00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:32,000
Speaker 1: be concealed from us. A couple of times my mother

769
00:41:32,040 --> 00:41:34,080
Speaker 1: sent me to fetch doctor b. He came when there

770
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:40,560
Speaker 1: were complications, and unfortunately for any listeners who are considering this,

771
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:44,280
Speaker 1: running a massive crime ring does have some negative consequences.

772
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:49,960
Speaker 1: Oh no, I would argue overall, it's worth I'm not

773
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:55,440
Speaker 1: doing it anyone listening. I'm not doing it.

774
00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:56,040
Speaker 3: Says Margaret on a major podcast.

775
00:41:56,200 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, but anyway. A woman whose name is only given

776
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:06,280
Speaker 1: as Albrecht so I'm guessing last name, from the Anarcho

777
00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:09,400
Speaker 1: Syndicalist Union was sentenced to three years in nineteen thirty

778
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: after this big national scandal show trial. She'd performed more

779
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:16,920
Speaker 1: than one hundred abortions for the local chapter of the league.

780
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 1: Luis Witch got eighteen months in nineteen thirty three. I

781
00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:24,040
Speaker 1: suppose you could call it a witch trial, unless I'm

782
00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:28,840
Speaker 1: mispronouncing that name, in which case you shouldn't. The chairman

783
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:31,400
Speaker 1: of the RV was sentenced to prison at one point.

784
00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:34,799
Speaker 1: I'm not sure how long he went to prison. And

785
00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:38,640
Speaker 1: you ever heard that depressing thing where? Okay, so like

786
00:42:40,320 --> 00:42:42,640
Speaker 1: the Nazis came to power, this is the main depressing thing.

787
00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:44,279
Speaker 1: They killed a fuck ton of people, right, and they

788
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:46,000
Speaker 1: put a lot of people in these camps right famously,

789
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:47,719
Speaker 1: and some of the people they put in were in

790
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:51,400
Speaker 1: for being gay. And then after everyone was liberated, the

791
00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:56,080
Speaker 1: gay prisoners had to stay in jail because what they

792
00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,560
Speaker 1: had done was illegal before the Nazis too. You ever

793
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 1: heard that it's a terrible fun thing.

794
00:43:02,040 --> 00:43:02,480
Speaker 3: Mm hmm.

795
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:05,759
Speaker 2: I had never heard that. Wait, they stayed in the

796
00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:08,239
Speaker 2: camps or they just went to a different place. I

797
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:10,440
Speaker 2: think some people were like literally in the same place.

798
00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:14,439
Speaker 2: But they did not get free. The gay prisoners did

799
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,680
Speaker 2: not get free after the liberation of And this was

800
00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:22,879
Speaker 2: true for both Soviet controlled and allied or Western wow

801
00:43:23,360 --> 00:43:26,520
Speaker 2: US controlled I don't know the word for the Allies,

802
00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:32,160
Speaker 2: who aren't the Soviets the capitalist powers, well they're all

803
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:32,840
Speaker 2: capital anyway.

804
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:40,279
Speaker 1: Whatever. So one of these abortion rights activists, these three

805
00:43:40,320 --> 00:43:41,759
Speaker 1: that I've mentioned, have gone to jay or just a

806
00:43:41,800 --> 00:43:44,400
Speaker 1: tiny percentage of it. They're the ones that this paper

807
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:46,640
Speaker 1: is specifically. The only thing I found about it was like,

808
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:48,920
Speaker 1: here's what the syndicalists were doing. So this is like

809
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:53,160
Speaker 1: the three syndicalists that this guy knew. But at least

810
00:43:53,239 --> 00:43:57,120
Speaker 1: one of the other abortion providers or activists spent time

811
00:43:57,160 --> 00:44:00,640
Speaker 1: in Nuremberg after the war, charged with abortion and was

812
00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:04,440
Speaker 1: not freed because see what he had done, whether she

813
00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 1: or what they had done, was a crime. But again,

814
00:44:10,560 --> 00:44:15,480
Speaker 1: million abortions a year, saving so many lives, just countless lives.

815
00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:19,839
Speaker 1: These women performing these abortions. They were quote no Bunglers,

816
00:44:19,880 --> 00:44:24,279
Speaker 1: according to the paper, or the paper is quoting a

817
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:28,080
Speaker 1: person who saw it happen. They knew what the fuck

818
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:32,359
Speaker 1: they were doing, and they did it for free and

819
00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:33,839
Speaker 1: go ahead.

820
00:44:33,840 --> 00:44:36,680
Speaker 3: I feel like that was just like a phrase, you know,

821
00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:38,719
Speaker 3: like how he like a cool phrase they had to

822
00:44:38,719 --> 00:44:40,439
Speaker 3: say during the time. They're like, no, no, they're for real,

823
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:41,000
Speaker 3: They're for real.

824
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:44,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally, totally. I can't wait till it swings back

825
00:44:44,719 --> 00:44:47,720
Speaker 1: around again and someone is like listening and they're.

826
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 3: Like, no, they weren't bungling.

827
00:44:49,560 --> 00:44:51,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're like. Man in early twenty first centuryone was

828
00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:53,120
Speaker 1: like that person's for real, But what they meant is

829
00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:55,719
Speaker 1: they weren't a Bungler exactly.

830
00:44:57,800 --> 00:44:59,840
Speaker 3: I want that happened quickly.

831
00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:02,960
Speaker 1: I feel like culture moves fast enough that it will

832
00:45:02,960 --> 00:45:05,279
Speaker 1: happen while we're alive and we'll be like, what the

833
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 1: fuck is happening, Get off my lawn exactly.

834
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:11,560
Speaker 3: Like I feel that way in general. When I'm like

835
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 3: watching the fashions, I'm like I definitely had that dress, yeah,

836
00:45:15,160 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 3: absolutely in eighth grade and they're wearing that Yeah, am

837
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:18,480
Speaker 3: I gonna do with myself.

838
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:22,400
Speaker 1: Well, who they're already past the nostalgia for when I

839
00:45:22,560 --> 00:45:27,319
Speaker 1: as a kid, Like, they're already past nineties nostalgia, right

840
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:30,319
Speaker 1: they are? Anyway, Like it's if anyone's listening and they're

841
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:35,920
Speaker 1: on my own, get off it here, you damn kids.

842
00:45:36,040 --> 00:45:40,440
Speaker 1: Maybe that phrase is outdated. Who fucking knows? Probably?

843
00:45:40,640 --> 00:45:42,719
Speaker 3: All right, wait, can't we control that says we're the

844
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:43,680
Speaker 3: ones calling anyway?

845
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:46,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, we create the culture now we're anyway we

846
00:45:47,000 --> 00:45:49,960
Speaker 1: do not. Yeah, but speaking of the culture, this isn't

847
00:45:49,960 --> 00:45:53,960
Speaker 1: an ad transition. Uh. The culture that they were building

848
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:56,160
Speaker 1: is a fascinating one. And it's one of these things

849
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,759
Speaker 1: where things people are like our generation acts like it

850
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:05,240
Speaker 1: in vented polyamory. Right. For the German and archosyndicalists, women's

851
00:46:05,239 --> 00:46:08,959
Speaker 1: liberation and sexual autonomy was not just a theory. They

852
00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:12,520
Speaker 1: had vivid conversations all the time, and they were also

853
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:17,400
Speaker 1: just fucking And there were plenty of women who were like,

854
00:46:17,600 --> 00:46:19,600
Speaker 1: we believe in free love, but it actually needs to

855
00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:22,080
Speaker 1: be love. All these fucking shitty, horny men are trying

856
00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:24,520
Speaker 1: to use these political put points just to fucking run,

857
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:27,719
Speaker 1: and we think that sucks. There were, of course also

858
00:46:27,800 --> 00:46:31,439
Speaker 1: women who were doing the same thing too. But it's

859
00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:34,160
Speaker 1: interesting to me because it mirrors these discussions I've read

860
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:38,080
Speaker 1: about late sixties discourse and how HIPPI men were like

861
00:46:38,120 --> 00:46:41,760
Speaker 1: one hundred percent down with women's liberation on two specific issues,

862
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:47,240
Speaker 1: abortion access and birth control, anything that reduced their responsibility

863
00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:53,240
Speaker 1: and to increase their access sexual access to women. Hippi

864
00:46:53,280 --> 00:46:55,520
Speaker 1: men were a lot less consistent about their support of

865
00:46:55,560 --> 00:47:01,759
Speaker 1: other feminist causes for some weird person surprise. So it's

866
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:04,400
Speaker 1: just enoughing ever changes moment for me.

867
00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:06,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was gonna say a lot of these things

868
00:47:06,360 --> 00:47:10,600
Speaker 3: are happening today as we've seen, well, new organizations pop

869
00:47:10,680 --> 00:47:14,920
Speaker 3: up as well, but the whole like going on strike

870
00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:19,920
Speaker 3: from giving birth is actually familiar as well. But Korea

871
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:22,600
Speaker 3: and Japan have been doing that as of late too.

872
00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:25,120
Speaker 3: That's why the birth rate and everybody's really really coodert

873
00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:27,719
Speaker 3: because the women have had enough. They're like, fuck this,

874
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:29,960
Speaker 3: I don't want children, y'all don't give us enough pay,

875
00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:32,240
Speaker 3: and all you want to do is make us suffer.

876
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:35,680
Speaker 3: We're not doing this anymore. But it's very similar to

877
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:38,600
Speaker 3: that level. I'm like, interesting, and the government's like, please,

878
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:40,320
Speaker 3: for the love of Jesus, will give you more money,

879
00:47:40,880 --> 00:47:41,600
Speaker 3: have a baby.

880
00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:44,160
Speaker 1: I mean it makes sense to me. Like, I remember

881
00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:48,920
Speaker 1: my older sister is a very strong feminist. I'm very lucky.

882
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:52,280
Speaker 1: My whole family is very very feminist. And I remember

883
00:47:52,360 --> 00:47:54,120
Speaker 1: my older sister kind of like sitting down. I was like,

884
00:47:54,200 --> 00:47:56,000
Speaker 1: I was like a young radical or something, and I

885
00:47:56,040 --> 00:48:00,719
Speaker 1: was like overpopulation. And my sister was like, did you

886
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:05,560
Speaker 1: know that every single time you give women control of

887
00:48:05,600 --> 00:48:08,719
Speaker 1: their own reproductive health, the birth rate drops to a

888
00:48:08,719 --> 00:48:13,000
Speaker 1: sustainable amount. And I'm like, oh, that's cool. Like you

889
00:48:13,040 --> 00:48:15,000
Speaker 1: don't have to make laws around it. You don't got

890
00:48:15,000 --> 00:48:18,280
Speaker 1: to do shit. All you gotta do is give people

891
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 1: the right to choose about whether or not they get

892
00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 1: to stay or get pregnant. Right. Problem solves itself, it does.

893
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:28,480
Speaker 3: That's why there are so many of us that are childless.

894
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:31,520
Speaker 3: Instead we get dogs, yeah or cats.

895
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:34,600
Speaker 1: Yeah. I put that in for you.

896
00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:34,919
Speaker 3: Sure.

897
00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:40,640
Speaker 1: So that's like what I know about this movement. I

898
00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:43,799
Speaker 1: want there to be more. I know the sources. They

899
00:48:43,800 --> 00:48:46,319
Speaker 1: are all in German. Maybe one day I'll be able

900
00:48:46,360 --> 00:48:49,360
Speaker 1: to return to it. But all I can say is

901
00:48:49,360 --> 00:48:51,560
Speaker 1: I'm proud as fuck of the German radicals who held

902
00:48:51,600 --> 00:48:54,680
Speaker 1: down a million abortions a year, seemingly all for free

903
00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:59,359
Speaker 1: through horizontal organizing, and they didn't get preachy about it.

904
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:01,000
Speaker 1: Like one of the reason is that it's hard to

905
00:49:01,080 --> 00:49:04,160
Speaker 1: know about it. It didn't people didn't even know it

906
00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:07,640
Speaker 1: was tied into the radical labor movement because they didn't

907
00:49:08,760 --> 00:49:11,440
Speaker 1: talk about it, or at least I mean, I don't know.

908
00:49:11,440 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 1: Maybe they didn't. They're probably insuffer maybe like German radicals.

909
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:19,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think we. I do want a documentary on

910
00:49:19,880 --> 00:49:24,520
Speaker 3: this because, Yeah, a million abortiones that is phenomenal. And

911
00:49:24,600 --> 00:49:28,000
Speaker 3: the fact that they were able to be that organized

912
00:49:28,440 --> 00:49:32,719
Speaker 3: for so long with that many members, that's amazing.

913
00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:36,719
Speaker 1: Yeah. And you know, also, I'm proud of I'm proud

914
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 1: of all the feminist, black radicals, communists and anarchists who

915
00:49:39,120 --> 00:49:41,800
Speaker 1: came together in the Bay Area to organize abortion clinics

916
00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:44,080
Speaker 1: and then defend them from organized right wing violence, which

917
00:49:44,080 --> 00:49:46,400
Speaker 1: we're going to talk about on Wednesday.

918
00:49:47,400 --> 00:49:47,880
Speaker 2: I love it.

919
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,960
Speaker 1: I'm so excited. Hell yeah, but before we talk about that,

920
00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:55,319
Speaker 1: we should talk about you and your show me.

921
00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:59,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, I yes, so I am on a show called

922
00:49:59,840 --> 00:50:02,279
Speaker 3: us Stuff Mom never told you, which we do talk

923
00:50:02,280 --> 00:50:05,680
Speaker 3: about things like this, not the in depth history of this,

924
00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:09,160
Speaker 3: only like you cool zone media people are that cool.

925
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:12,719
Speaker 3: We do very research based, very like nerdy based things,

926
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:16,160
Speaker 3: including talking about Star Wars or for me, lately it

927
00:50:16,200 --> 00:50:18,319
Speaker 3: has been about k drama. No, I don't don't ask

928
00:50:18,360 --> 00:50:20,600
Speaker 3: why because I'm Korean and I'm trying to find myself.

929
00:50:20,920 --> 00:50:25,080
Speaker 3: But anyway, we also have a book that we published.

930
00:50:25,600 --> 00:50:28,040
Speaker 3: It was released this year. Nope, last year? Oh god,

931
00:50:28,040 --> 00:50:31,920
Speaker 3: what year is it? Twenty twenty three? Goddamn y'all. This

932
00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 3: is where I'm like, still twenty twenty three? Yeah, no, okay, anyway,

933
00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:39,440
Speaker 3: last year we publish published.

934
00:50:39,640 --> 00:50:40,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, there you go.

935
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,280
Speaker 3: The future. We had published a book you can find

936
00:50:44,320 --> 00:50:46,960
Speaker 3: any of your bookstores. Is also on audible if you

937
00:50:47,000 --> 00:50:50,120
Speaker 3: want to hear Annie and myself read out a book,

938
00:50:50,160 --> 00:50:53,480
Speaker 3: which was a completely different process than podcasting that we

939
00:50:53,640 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 3: have learned.

940
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:55,960
Speaker 1: What's difficult.

941
00:50:56,320 --> 00:50:58,480
Speaker 3: But yes, you should come and listen if you like

942
00:50:58,520 --> 00:51:01,440
Speaker 3: to hear things about intersectional femine, some nerd things, all

943
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:02,640
Speaker 3: the good things.

944
00:51:02,960 --> 00:51:10,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, stream plugs nice, Nope, that's it. I want to

945
00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:16,719
Speaker 1: plug things. Uh, I have a god. Okay, by the

946
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:19,239
Speaker 1: time you hear this, no, like a couple of days

947
00:51:19,239 --> 00:51:21,840
Speaker 1: after you hear this, sometime around when you hear it,

948
00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:26,719
Speaker 1: February one, twenty twenty four, we're releasing Number City, the

949
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 1: tabletop role playing game that I helped write that I've

950
00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:32,080
Speaker 1: been working on for ten goddamn years. We kickstarted it

951
00:51:32,200 --> 00:51:34,719
Speaker 1: last summer. Thanks for your help, we raise enough money

952
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:37,840
Speaker 1: to put together a beautiful hardcover book with like embossed

953
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:41,440
Speaker 1: silver inlay on the cover and all that stuff. And

954
00:51:41,480 --> 00:51:43,160
Speaker 1: so if you want to play a tabletop role playing

955
00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:44,600
Speaker 1: game or do what I did when I didn't have

956
00:51:44,600 --> 00:51:49,200
Speaker 1: any kids as friends as a kid, you can just

957
00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:51,840
Speaker 1: read it and imagine you live in that fantasy world.

958
00:51:53,600 --> 00:51:56,360
Speaker 1: But it's called pan Number City. It's published by Strangers

959
00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:58,960
Speaker 1: in the Tangled Wilderness, and it is available if you

960
00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:01,959
Speaker 1: type in Number City or Strangers in a Tangle don't.

961
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:03,200
Speaker 1: I'm not going to give you a U are l.

962
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:06,239
Speaker 1: No one types in URLs. Although now that Google is

963
00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:09,680
Speaker 1: turning into an abyss machine that doesn't provide useful search information,

964
00:52:09,719 --> 00:52:11,240
Speaker 1: maybe you are ls are going to make a comeback.

965
00:52:11,840 --> 00:52:17,600
Speaker 1: That's my plug. I'm also on substack and Twitter and

966
00:52:17,719 --> 00:52:20,920
Speaker 1: on Twitter and Instagram, and.

967
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:22,520
Speaker 2: Samantha, did you put your handles in?

968
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:26,319
Speaker 3: I didn't, Yeah, I didn't. You can tell you, you

969
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:29,680
Speaker 3: can say no, sure, you can follow our not so

970
00:52:29,960 --> 00:52:32,879
Speaker 3: active Instagram with stuff mom never told you.

971
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:34,000
Speaker 1: Uh.

972
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:37,240
Speaker 3: Also on Twitter as well. We are very not active

973
00:52:37,239 --> 00:52:39,480
Speaker 3: on there. We kind of just let that die out

974
00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:42,239
Speaker 3: as it should have. We're also on TikTok. You can

975
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:44,960
Speaker 3: see nerdy things on that uh stuff mom never told

976
00:52:45,000 --> 00:52:47,680
Speaker 3: you as well. I am on as McBay dot sam

977
00:52:47,760 --> 00:52:51,560
Speaker 3: on both Instagram and Twitter. Again, I'm not really active

978
00:52:51,600 --> 00:52:53,399
Speaker 3: active on there, but hey, if you want to see

979
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:55,200
Speaker 3: pictures of my dog, come to the Instagram.

980
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:57,480
Speaker 1: Okay, but if you make Instagram, you can make memes

981
00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:00,000
Speaker 1: that are like of your dog, and it could be

982
00:53:00,239 --> 00:53:02,840
Speaker 1: like Mom never told me not to jump up on

983
00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:06,160
Speaker 1: the counter. Oh my god, you get all the stuff

984
00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:09,080
Speaker 1: that your mom didn't. Oh that's right, I see, is

985
00:53:09,080 --> 00:53:11,200
Speaker 1: what I'm trying to Okay anyway, all right, Well I'm

986
00:53:11,239 --> 00:53:12,839
Speaker 1: clearly at the bottom of the barrel. So I'll see

987
00:53:12,840 --> 00:53:17,400
Speaker 1: you all on Wednesday. Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff

988
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:20,480
Speaker 1: is a production of cool Zone Media. For more podcasts on.

989
00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:24,080
Speaker 2: Cool Zone Media, visit our website Coolzonemedia dot com, or

990
00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:25,879
Speaker 2: check us out on the iHeartRadio

991
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:29,400
Speaker 3: App, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.