WEBVTT - Claude Silver - Chief Heart Officer of VaynerX

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<v Speaker 1>Rube.

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<v Speaker 2>When I think about empathy, which is such an overused

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<v Speaker 2>word today, to me, it's not putting on your shoes.

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<v Speaker 2>It's not stepping into your shoes. I could never do that.

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<v Speaker 2>I think about empathy as being a passenger with you

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<v Speaker 2>on your journey, if you let me, putting my hand

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<v Speaker 2>on your shoulder and being like I got you, I

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<v Speaker 2>got you, Like, let's do this. There's no friction we

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<v Speaker 2>cannot solve. But it takes the right culture. It takes

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<v Speaker 2>a willingness to be transparent and to have communication. I

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<v Speaker 2>firmly believe.

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<v Speaker 3>That that's Claude Silver offering up a new way to

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<v Speaker 3>think about empathy, not as stepping into someone else's shoes,

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<v Speaker 3>but as writing shotgun on their journey. And as you'll hear,

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<v Speaker 3>that's not just a personal philosophy, it's her job. Claude

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<v Speaker 3>is the Chief Heart Officer at Vaynermedia. Yeah, Heart officer.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a real c suite role at one of the

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<v Speaker 3>most talked about media companies in the world, and Claude's

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<v Speaker 3>mission is to scale emotional intelligence inside the workplace. In

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<v Speaker 3>this conversation, she breaks down what that actually means and

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<v Speaker 3>how empathy, when done right isn't soft, it's strategic. Claude

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<v Speaker 3>and I go way back, but this was the first

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<v Speaker 3>time I had the chance to really dig into her

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<v Speaker 3>leadership style, how it was shaped by her childhood, her

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<v Speaker 3>nana who literally called her heart, her experience in therapy,

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<v Speaker 3>and her early years navigating corporate culture as a sensitive,

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<v Speaker 3>intuitive person. We also get into hybrid work, difficult conversations, parenting, burnout,

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<v Speaker 3>and why kindness at work is having a long overdue moment.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm furnished to RAVI and this is leading by example,

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<v Speaker 3>executives making an impact. Claude Silver, Welcome. It's so nice

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<v Speaker 3>to see you, and we're in person. Let's just announce

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<v Speaker 3>that because that's a special treat.

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<v Speaker 2>It's awesome. It's great to see you. Thanks for having me.

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<v Speaker 2>I've known you for many years.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know if I've ever had this opportunity to

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<v Speaker 3>really understand your leadership style. Where sourced and so let's

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<v Speaker 3>go to childhood. As we're both moms, we know our kids.

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<v Speaker 3>When we look back on their childhoods, it won't be

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<v Speaker 3>a coincidence. Maybe who they become or their talents. But

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<v Speaker 3>as a child, you were repeatedly told Claude that you

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<v Speaker 3>think too much with the heart, and now you're the

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<v Speaker 3>chief heart officer at Vayner Media. Was there a moment

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<v Speaker 3>in your life or your career where you realize that

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<v Speaker 3>leading with heart was actually your greatest strength?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there absolutely was, And it took me a long

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<v Speaker 2>time to get there because I actually felt like something

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<v Speaker 2>was wrong with me.

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<v Speaker 3>Really.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I thought when my parents would love in

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<v Speaker 2>their hearts, would say to me, Claude, you think too

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<v Speaker 2>much with your heart. You have to learn how to

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<v Speaker 2>think with your head. And sometimes they would compare me

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<v Speaker 2>to my brother Caleb, who is much more analytical than

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<v Speaker 2>I am. But I thought, oh gosh, I must have

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<v Speaker 2>a missing chip, like what's going on? What's happening? And

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<v Speaker 2>so it took a lot of years, a lot of therapy,

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of different things to finally understand, Oh, being

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<v Speaker 2>an EmPATH actually is my superpower? Why don't I lean

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<v Speaker 2>in to it? And it really was my Nana, who

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<v Speaker 2>we called each other heart. That's like the crazy thing.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh she called me heart and I called her heart.

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<v Speaker 2>She basically was the kindest, most generous person I had

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<v Speaker 2>ever known in my life, and I really credit her

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<v Speaker 2>for emotionally raising me in many ways for kind of

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<v Speaker 2>shining the light on Hey, it's okay, it's good, like,

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<v Speaker 2>this is who you are. Don't hide it, don't try

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<v Speaker 2>to change it, because you can't. I really can't.

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<v Speaker 3>You studied it too before this became kind of your

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<v Speaker 3>professional identity. You have a background in human psychology. How

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<v Speaker 3>did that inform your brand so to speak? Today?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so I do have a background in human behavior,

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<v Speaker 2>human psychology, spirituality, and what that showed me, What that

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<v Speaker 2>gave me was that, Wow, we're all so similar and

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<v Speaker 2>we have different lived experiences, but we all go through

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<v Speaker 2>very similar emotions. It just happens to be we're triggered

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<v Speaker 2>by different things because of our background. So what that

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<v Speaker 2>gave me was pattern recognition. Being dyslexic, I had to

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<v Speaker 2>learn really early on how to find my way in

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<v Speaker 2>the world and how to navigate my way, and I

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<v Speaker 2>think patterns was how I got there. When people are

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<v Speaker 2>in pain, when people are expressing joy, when people are

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<v Speaker 2>expressing surprise or astonishment, this is how people usually behave.

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<v Speaker 2>And so for me, patterns became a shortcut in a

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<v Speaker 2>way that I could figure things out quicker. And that

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<v Speaker 2>was important to me because I really did feel slow

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<v Speaker 2>slower than the average bear, which was never a great feeling.

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<v Speaker 2>I think leaning into emotional intelligence, which I didn't even

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<v Speaker 2>know the name for it, I think I really put

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<v Speaker 2>myself through an incredible education called life. I didn't graduate

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<v Speaker 2>college until I was twenty eight, so I did a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of this extracurricular studying on my own because I

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<v Speaker 2>was passionate about it, not because someone told me I

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<v Speaker 2>had to in order to get a degree, which is

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<v Speaker 2>a big difference.

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<v Speaker 3>Were you concerned about finding your way through corporate as

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<v Speaker 3>an empact?

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<v Speaker 2>I was concerned that I wouldn't find my way period

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<v Speaker 2>anywhere for a long time until it seemed like the

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<v Speaker 2>skill sets I have seemed to match what this job needs,

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<v Speaker 2>and what those first early jobs were were client relations.

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<v Speaker 2>So okay, you know, I like people, and I'm curious

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<v Speaker 2>about people, and I'm a good question asker, and I

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<v Speaker 2>think that opened the door to furthering my career, and

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<v Speaker 2>I've always done agency work. I landed in advertising agencies.

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<v Speaker 2>It was right after the dot com boom, the first one.

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<v Speaker 3>What was that like? I wanted to ask you about

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<v Speaker 3>that your early days in advertising being in like the

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<v Speaker 3>right place at the right time, that, of course in

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<v Speaker 3>part shaped your digital career.

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<v Speaker 2>One thousand percent. Living in San Francisco. I moved there

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<v Speaker 2>in nineteen ninety five, so I was there for some

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<v Speaker 2>of the greatest moments, saddest moments, AIDS crisis also, but

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<v Speaker 2>also technology. All of a sudden, it was like, Oh,

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<v Speaker 2>what is modem? Oh what does that sound?

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<v Speaker 4>Oh?

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<v Speaker 2>What is Yahoo? You know this is all before Google

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<v Speaker 2>or Facebook, but really, what is Yahoo?

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<v Speaker 4>Still?

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<v Speaker 3>We're asking that question? Does Yahooh?

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<v Speaker 2>And it was the wild, wild wild West. And I

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<v Speaker 2>didn't feel like I had to be a certain way,

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<v Speaker 2>as I think probably the younger generations, generations that came

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<v Speaker 2>after me, probably felt like they had to fit more

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<v Speaker 2>of a mold. I didn't feel like I needed to

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<v Speaker 2>wear pumps. I didn't feel like I needed to wear

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<v Speaker 2>some kind of business suit. These were great days of

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<v Speaker 2>curiosity and wonder and let's try this and overspend here

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<v Speaker 2>and overspend here. So it was a big joy ride

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<v Speaker 2>and an adventure. But we knew we were trying to

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<v Speaker 2>do things. And all of the companies that I worked with,

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<v Speaker 2>even before I got into advertising, were all community based,

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<v Speaker 2>and that's where we are today. Every platform is community based.

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<v Speaker 2>I believe somewhere we're trying to bring people together and

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<v Speaker 2>to bring people closer, even though you know, we could

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<v Speaker 2>have another conversation on does that work or does it

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<v Speaker 2>not work.

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<v Speaker 3>You also spend time abroad, yes I did. What did

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<v Speaker 3>international life teach you about patterns or human psychology? What

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<v Speaker 3>did you take from those experiences?

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<v Speaker 2>The first thing I took is that as an American,

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<v Speaker 2>we think the world revolves around US and America, and

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<v Speaker 2>it just doesn't. One of the first things I recognized

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<v Speaker 2>was watching the news over there and seeing things about

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<v Speaker 2>places that I had never heard about, and in America,

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<v Speaker 2>our news is very centered in what's happening here. So

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<v Speaker 2>it showed me a that the world is much bigger.

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<v Speaker 2>Being in London is very different than when I would

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<v Speaker 2>travel other places. I mean London, they're very polite and

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<v Speaker 2>they don't like confrontation, so everything comes with a sorry first,

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<v Speaker 2>and you're like, but what are you really trying to

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<v Speaker 2>say to me? Where are we going here? And again

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<v Speaker 2>it showed me that we are all so similar. It

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<v Speaker 2>just depends on how we came up in the world

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<v Speaker 2>and what we were taught or what we wanted to

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<v Speaker 2>run away from, or you know, just that everyone went

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<v Speaker 2>through adolescence. And I'm speaking more for the Western world.

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<v Speaker 2>We all went through a very similar adolescence. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>know what some of the other people in third world

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<v Speaker 2>countries and people that are more impoverished and less privileged

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<v Speaker 2>than I am have gone through in those stages, but

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<v Speaker 2>what I can say is there's such a similarity, and

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<v Speaker 2>so when we start to fight with one another, it

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<v Speaker 2>hurts because it's like, hey, wait a second, we have

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<v Speaker 2>no idea how that person just started their day. We

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<v Speaker 2>have no idea what happened to that person from the

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<v Speaker 2>hours of six to nine before they opened their laptop

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<v Speaker 2>and got online. We have no idea that their dog

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<v Speaker 2>was sick, their child was in the hospital, they got

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<v Speaker 2>engaged last night, all kinds of things. But that happens

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<v Speaker 2>all over the world. And so that's one of the

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<v Speaker 2>things that taught me is that you know, not to

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<v Speaker 2>quote depeche Mode, but I will oh any time. Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, well, are people? People?

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<v Speaker 3>Are people? Are people?

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<v Speaker 2>Oh? What kiss it?

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<v Speaker 3>But I'm also learning about Uclaude is that in addition

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<v Speaker 3>to your knack for identifying patterns, you're also quite the translator.

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<v Speaker 3>You have a code that's like built in you, like

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<v Speaker 3>you know the code. You meet people from all walks

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<v Speaker 3>of life, and you're able to understand them in a

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<v Speaker 3>way that maybe they are not even aware that that's

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<v Speaker 3>how they're presenting themselves, but you're seeing them at the

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<v Speaker 3>end of the day. I think really important, especially in

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<v Speaker 3>the context of work.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know if it's a code, but I take

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<v Speaker 2>that as an incredible compliment, so thank you. But I

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<v Speaker 2>do see them. I do know that there's something going

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<v Speaker 2>on behind someone's eyes, and that could be a surprise

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<v Speaker 2>to them or surprise to me. But I like going

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<v Speaker 2>with them on the journey. So for me, when I

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<v Speaker 2>think about empathy, which is such an overused word today,

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<v Speaker 2>to me, it's not putting on your shoes. It's not

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<v Speaker 2>stepping into your shoes. I could never do that. I

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<v Speaker 2>think about empathy as being a passenger with you on

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<v Speaker 2>your journey, if you let me just writing shotgun with you,

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<v Speaker 2>putting my hand on your shoulder and being like I

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<v Speaker 2>got you, I got you, Like let's do this. There's nothing,

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<v Speaker 2>especially the workplace, that we cannot solve unless it's something

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<v Speaker 2>to do with a person's health. There's no friction we

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<v Speaker 2>cannot solve I firmly believe that. But it takes the

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<v Speaker 2>right culture. It takes a willingness to be transparent and

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<v Speaker 2>to have communication and to learn. Like people for the

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<v Speaker 2>most part have good intentions, right, It's not one hundred

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<v Speaker 2>percent all the time, But I don't think we go

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<v Speaker 2>into work to go and try to collaborate people. Yes

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<v Speaker 2>it's political, and yes there's games and all that junk

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<v Speaker 2>that we've lived through. I think they get triggered. I

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<v Speaker 2>get triggered just like the next person. So my code

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<v Speaker 2>is really figuring out what's going on, what's preventing you

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<v Speaker 2>from shining? Why do you have that imposter syndrome? What's

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<v Speaker 2>holding you back? Were you told that you needed to

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<v Speaker 2>be perfect? Is that why you go and you look

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<v Speaker 2>at that person's PowerPoint presentation and you find errors first

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<v Speaker 2>before you read the entire story. Just tell me why.

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<v Speaker 2>Let's walk through that and then let's reframe that and

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<v Speaker 2>think of something different. Like, I wonder what would happen

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<v Speaker 2>if you look at that PowerPoint presentation from start to

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<v Speaker 2>finish and read it before criticizing it fair?

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<v Speaker 3>Would that be?

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<v Speaker 1>Like?

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<v Speaker 3>I think we can all take that advance. It's human nature.

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<v Speaker 3>We look for what's working what's not working? First?

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<v Speaker 2>Exactly? You almost said, we look for what's working first

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<v Speaker 2>and let's get there one day. Please.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I want to transition to vayner Media. You joined

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<v Speaker 3>in twenty fourteen and then you resigned three months later,

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<v Speaker 3>you returned as the chief heart officer. I want to

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<v Speaker 3>know what happened during those three months, What were you doing,

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<v Speaker 3>what were you reflecting on? Why did you leave?

0:11:32.160 --> 0:11:35.439
<v Speaker 2>So I was hired by Gary Vaynerchuk, my boss, who's

0:11:35.559 --> 0:11:39.200
<v Speaker 2>just a phenomenal guy, phenomenal entrepreneur. I was the first

0:11:39.240 --> 0:11:41.280
<v Speaker 2>SVP that he hired, and I was probably the third

0:11:41.320 --> 0:11:45.400
<v Speaker 2>oldest person in vayner and I ran Unilever, which was

0:11:45.440 --> 0:11:48.320
<v Speaker 2>our largest book of business every time. And about a

0:11:48.400 --> 0:11:50.480
<v Speaker 2>year into it, I started to get that feeling that

0:11:50.559 --> 0:11:53.560
<v Speaker 2>I had earlier when I was living in London, which

0:11:53.640 --> 0:11:56.640
<v Speaker 2>was it's not that important to me if it's red

0:11:56.840 --> 0:11:59.920
<v Speaker 2>or brown or blue, or if the copy is incursive

0:12:00.240 --> 0:12:03.360
<v Speaker 2>or the grammar is right. That doesn't light me up

0:12:03.440 --> 0:12:06.320
<v Speaker 2>at all. And these conversations don't excite me. But what

0:12:06.440 --> 0:12:09.280
<v Speaker 2>excites me is the people that are bringing it to fruition,

0:12:10.040 --> 0:12:13.400
<v Speaker 2>bringing creative ideas to life. That's what excites me. So

0:12:13.480 --> 0:12:15.920
<v Speaker 2>I went to Gary and I said, hey, I love

0:12:15.920 --> 0:12:18.560
<v Speaker 2>it here. You're the best. This is the greatest place ever.

0:12:19.040 --> 0:12:21.320
<v Speaker 2>But I no longer want to work in advertising. And

0:12:21.360 --> 0:12:22.560
<v Speaker 2>then he said, what do you want to do? And

0:12:22.559 --> 0:12:24.320
<v Speaker 2>I said, I only care about the people here. I

0:12:24.360 --> 0:12:27.439
<v Speaker 2>care about the heart beat. Really heartbeat, is what I said.

0:12:28.080 --> 0:12:29.800
<v Speaker 2>And he said, one day we're going to write a

0:12:29.800 --> 0:12:31.880
<v Speaker 2>book on heart but I need you to stay for

0:12:31.960 --> 0:12:35.520
<v Speaker 2>eighteen more months, and I remember saying, I'll give you six.

0:12:35.600 --> 0:12:37.920
<v Speaker 2>He doesn't remember that part of the story. But I

0:12:37.960 --> 0:12:42.559
<v Speaker 2>found my backfill and I resign. And during those three months,

0:12:42.600 --> 0:12:46.199
<v Speaker 2>I worked out, I walked the dog, I went snowboarding,

0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:51.199
<v Speaker 2>I visited my friends. I just freed myself from, quite frankly,

0:12:51.240 --> 0:12:54.880
<v Speaker 2>the bondage of a phone and my emails and text messages.

0:12:55.920 --> 0:12:58.160
<v Speaker 2>And I just kind of like, I dreamed, what do

0:12:58.200 --> 0:12:59.599
<v Speaker 2>I want to do? I know, I don't want to

0:12:59.640 --> 0:13:02.480
<v Speaker 2>go back to doing what is going to be very

0:13:02.480 --> 0:13:04.960
<v Speaker 2>shiny for me. Any job offer that comes my way

0:13:05.000 --> 0:13:07.680
<v Speaker 2>would be very shiny at that point, What do I

0:13:07.720 --> 0:13:09.360
<v Speaker 2>want to do? And I thought, okay, well, I'll start

0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:12.480
<v Speaker 2>a coaching practice. That seems like something I really enjoy doing.

0:13:12.520 --> 0:13:14.520
<v Speaker 2>I want to work with people, and so he called

0:13:14.559 --> 0:13:16.760
<v Speaker 2>me back. We had breakfast, we sat down, he said,

0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:18.240
<v Speaker 2>that's it, you're coming back. You're going to be chief

0:13:18.240 --> 0:13:21.959
<v Speaker 2>Heeart officer. And I knew exactly what that meant, maybe

0:13:21.960 --> 0:13:24.400
<v Speaker 2>because he and I speak a very similar code, but

0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:26.839
<v Speaker 2>it just made sense to me. We didn't have HR.

0:13:27.160 --> 0:13:29.439
<v Speaker 2>I have never been in HR. Now I can tell

0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:31.120
<v Speaker 2>you that I am and I've done that.

0:13:31.600 --> 0:13:32.079
<v Speaker 4>I have a.

0:13:32.080 --> 0:13:35.240
<v Speaker 2>New appreciation for people in HR. I don't call it that,

0:13:35.320 --> 0:13:38.760
<v Speaker 2>I call it people and experience. But when I was

0:13:38.840 --> 0:13:41.200
<v Speaker 2>there for those first sixteen months, being one of the

0:13:41.240 --> 0:13:43.600
<v Speaker 2>oldest and the OG, I was doing a lot of hiring,

0:13:43.640 --> 0:13:45.400
<v Speaker 2>I was doing a lot of terminations. I was that

0:13:45.480 --> 0:13:48.280
<v Speaker 2>person that people would come to. I was tenured in

0:13:48.320 --> 0:13:50.880
<v Speaker 2>all of those things that you really need in a

0:13:50.920 --> 0:13:52.800
<v Speaker 2>fast paced, growing company when you have a lot of

0:13:52.880 --> 0:13:56.320
<v Speaker 2>youth there. And so I immediately said to him what are

0:13:56.360 --> 0:13:58.640
<v Speaker 2>we doing? And he said, we're building the single greatest

0:13:58.679 --> 0:14:01.000
<v Speaker 2>human organization in the history of time. And I said,

0:14:01.000 --> 0:14:04.480
<v Speaker 2>sign me up. That's aspirational. And I said, cool, how

0:14:04.480 --> 0:14:07.200
<v Speaker 2>do we know if I'm successful? And he said, you

0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:11.440
<v Speaker 2>will touch every single human being and deploy empathy throughout

0:14:11.440 --> 0:14:14.520
<v Speaker 2>the halls, okay, And then I said I don't want

0:14:14.559 --> 0:14:16.040
<v Speaker 2>to do HR and he said, great, You'll hire a

0:14:16.080 --> 0:14:19.600
<v Speaker 2>team around you and ret one of Gary's strength, which

0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:21.440
<v Speaker 2>is something that he's really taught me, which is you

0:14:21.440 --> 0:14:24.360
<v Speaker 2>put people in position to succeed, You set them up

0:14:24.360 --> 0:14:28.800
<v Speaker 2>for success, and you dive in on your strengths. And

0:14:29.040 --> 0:14:32.120
<v Speaker 2>if I go back to Nana seeing emotional intelligence as

0:14:32.160 --> 0:14:34.880
<v Speaker 2>a superpower, and I go, that's what Gary recognized, and

0:14:34.920 --> 0:14:37.120
<v Speaker 2>he was like, I need this person to be me

0:14:37.360 --> 0:14:39.920
<v Speaker 2>in those rooms that I can't be in. I need

0:14:39.960 --> 0:14:42.800
<v Speaker 2>this person to go and figure out all that michig

0:14:42.800 --> 0:14:45.280
<v Speaker 2>go as over there, or what the chaos is or

0:14:45.280 --> 0:14:48.280
<v Speaker 2>the cynicism over there, and scale that out. And so

0:14:49.080 --> 0:14:51.480
<v Speaker 2>I've been with Gary. It'll be eleven years in May,

0:14:51.720 --> 0:14:54.000
<v Speaker 2>and I've been chief our officer for nine years almost

0:14:54.000 --> 0:14:55.840
<v Speaker 2>to the day. And so that's what I do every

0:14:55.840 --> 0:14:58.680
<v Speaker 2>single day. Figure that out on a bigger playing field

0:14:58.720 --> 0:14:59.960
<v Speaker 2>now that we've grown so much.

0:15:00.640 --> 0:15:02.960
<v Speaker 3>Walk me through a typical day. I would love to

0:15:03.080 --> 0:15:06.560
<v Speaker 3>understand how your work and your insights manifest in somebody

0:15:06.560 --> 0:15:07.920
<v Speaker 3>else's success.

0:15:08.320 --> 0:15:10.400
<v Speaker 2>I love that because at the end of the day,

0:15:10.480 --> 0:15:13.600
<v Speaker 2>it is really about ROI, right or it's roe return

0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:15.400
<v Speaker 2>on energy. Someone told me that the other day.

0:15:15.440 --> 0:15:15.680
<v Speaker 1>I like that.

0:15:15.680 --> 0:15:17.760
<v Speaker 2>I like that. I'll take that. It's actually one of

0:15:17.760 --> 0:15:21.640
<v Speaker 2>the architects of Google's project, Aristotle, who said ROE, and

0:15:21.680 --> 0:15:23.640
<v Speaker 2>I was like, yes, I will steal anything you give me.

0:15:23.720 --> 0:15:24.200
<v Speaker 2>Thank you.

0:15:24.280 --> 0:15:25.400
<v Speaker 3>Put that in my pocket.

0:15:26.440 --> 0:15:29.880
<v Speaker 2>A typical day will be having one on one so

0:15:29.920 --> 0:15:32.480
<v Speaker 2>people have set up time with me because they heard

0:15:32.640 --> 0:15:34.600
<v Speaker 2>I might be a good person to help them connect

0:15:34.640 --> 0:15:36.920
<v Speaker 2>with other people, or they want to know about my journey,

0:15:37.040 --> 0:15:39.960
<v Speaker 2>or they had a funny meeting with a manager, or

0:15:40.040 --> 0:15:41.880
<v Speaker 2>not quite sure if they're up for a raise or

0:15:41.960 --> 0:15:44.960
<v Speaker 2>so whatever. People will just come and talk, so we'll

0:15:45.080 --> 0:15:48.200
<v Speaker 2>travel through those conversations. It's fifteen minute conversation. I got

0:15:48.200 --> 0:15:50.040
<v Speaker 2>pretty quick at figuring out how to get to where

0:15:50.080 --> 0:15:52.680
<v Speaker 2>I need to get to and to leave them feeling

0:15:52.720 --> 0:15:55.200
<v Speaker 2>better than they did. They felt great, then I'm going

0:15:55.240 --> 0:15:57.120
<v Speaker 2>to make them feel even greater. If I can or

0:15:57.120 --> 0:16:00.600
<v Speaker 2>at least acknowledge that they are awesome, then I'm going

0:16:00.640 --> 0:16:03.360
<v Speaker 2>to have strategy meetings with either people that are across

0:16:03.400 --> 0:16:07.040
<v Speaker 2>the globe and our other offices figuring out One of

0:16:07.080 --> 0:16:10.000
<v Speaker 2>the things I'm helping people do is where is their smoke?

0:16:10.200 --> 0:16:13.800
<v Speaker 2>Where are people unhappy? Where are people happy? Where are

0:16:13.800 --> 0:16:15.720
<v Speaker 2>their roses? Where are their thorns? What are we going

0:16:15.760 --> 0:16:17.720
<v Speaker 2>to do about that? How are we going to continue

0:16:17.760 --> 0:16:22.359
<v Speaker 2>recognizing our people? And where there is cynicism or yuckiness,

0:16:22.400 --> 0:16:23.640
<v Speaker 2>what are we going to do it? Like, we have

0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:25.440
<v Speaker 2>to get to the root of that, because if we

0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:29.400
<v Speaker 2>want to retain rockstar people, then that's our job. And

0:16:29.440 --> 0:16:31.560
<v Speaker 2>I work with senior leadership, and I work with all

0:16:31.600 --> 0:16:36.640
<v Speaker 2>of our pod leads so SVPs EVPs to figure out

0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:40.600
<v Speaker 2>how their people are doing and how are they leading.

0:16:40.640 --> 0:16:43.360
<v Speaker 2>So I spend also a lot of time doing leadership training,

0:16:43.400 --> 0:16:46.840
<v Speaker 2>like senior leadership high performance training. How do you know

0:16:47.440 --> 0:16:49.760
<v Speaker 2>how people feel when you enter a room? How do

0:16:49.800 --> 0:16:51.640
<v Speaker 2>you know that if you enter a room with your

0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:53.920
<v Speaker 2>head and your phone, you have no clue And actually

0:16:54.000 --> 0:16:56.040
<v Speaker 2>that's the energy you just brought into the room. So

0:16:56.200 --> 0:16:58.600
<v Speaker 2>the energy is you don't really care, you don't have time,

0:16:58.720 --> 0:17:03.000
<v Speaker 2>or you're distracted. So let's reverse that. Let's walk into

0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:04.960
<v Speaker 2>a room saying, hey, everyone, how are you doing? How's

0:17:05.000 --> 0:17:07.840
<v Speaker 2>your weekend? Those types of things. I talk about new

0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:11.600
<v Speaker 2>offices we're opening. I talk about how we can expand

0:17:11.680 --> 0:17:15.080
<v Speaker 2>our culture what we call honey empire into those other

0:17:15.119 --> 0:17:17.920
<v Speaker 2>offices and places where I don't speak the language. Are

0:17:17.920 --> 0:17:20.879
<v Speaker 2>we making sure that in Mexico City we're doing the

0:17:20.920 --> 0:17:24.000
<v Speaker 2>trainings in their native language. I do a lot of

0:17:24.000 --> 0:17:26.879
<v Speaker 2>financial meetings also, which is crazy because I'm not a

0:17:26.920 --> 0:17:30.359
<v Speaker 2>financier at all, but trying to figure out how we

0:17:30.400 --> 0:17:33.240
<v Speaker 2>can become more profitable. Where do we have bulk, what

0:17:33.320 --> 0:17:36.200
<v Speaker 2>are we doing there? Talent planning, where are high performers?

0:17:36.240 --> 0:17:38.960
<v Speaker 2>Where we plotting people? And this is all happening throughout

0:17:39.000 --> 0:17:41.600
<v Speaker 2>the day. There's not a wasted meeting, That's what I'll say.

0:17:42.040 --> 0:17:44.160
<v Speaker 3>Well, on that, I wanted to go back to those

0:17:44.200 --> 0:17:47.600
<v Speaker 3>one on ones that you have. How do you hold

0:17:47.680 --> 0:17:51.280
<v Speaker 3>in balance being there for them, having that empathy, but

0:17:51.400 --> 0:17:55.000
<v Speaker 3>also being efficient because I think, especially for someone who

0:17:55.040 --> 0:17:56.960
<v Speaker 3>may not be familiar with how the meetings get run,

0:17:57.400 --> 0:17:59.840
<v Speaker 3>it's a sort of a dump, so to speak, of

0:18:00.200 --> 0:18:04.040
<v Speaker 3>all their emotions. Or they are looking for you just

0:18:04.080 --> 0:18:07.359
<v Speaker 3>supposide it as a therapist, So how do you sort

0:18:07.359 --> 0:18:10.360
<v Speaker 3>of walk the line and be both empathetic and efficient.

0:18:10.880 --> 0:18:12.679
<v Speaker 2>I would say they're probably looking for me more to

0:18:12.720 --> 0:18:15.000
<v Speaker 2>be a coach, because I put that into the water

0:18:15.080 --> 0:18:17.359
<v Speaker 2>that we're not therapists and I'm not a therapist, so

0:18:17.400 --> 0:18:19.640
<v Speaker 2>I can't help you there. So I would say we're

0:18:19.680 --> 0:18:22.159
<v Speaker 2>coaches and guides for sure, and that is something that

0:18:22.400 --> 0:18:26.040
<v Speaker 2>we feed the system constantly. I had a resident that

0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:27.919
<v Speaker 2>came and spoke to me yesterday and she asked me

0:18:27.960 --> 0:18:31.800
<v Speaker 2>the exact same question. She said, I'm an EmPATH. I

0:18:31.800 --> 0:18:33.640
<v Speaker 2>don't know how to be an EmPATH and not take

0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:35.760
<v Speaker 2>on people's feelings. And I don't know how to be

0:18:35.800 --> 0:18:38.520
<v Speaker 2>an EmPATH and be very successful at my job. And

0:18:38.600 --> 0:18:40.320
<v Speaker 2>so one of the things I shared with her and

0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:42.639
<v Speaker 2>you brought up the word, which is called efficient, is

0:18:43.440 --> 0:18:45.200
<v Speaker 2>You're not going to change your stripes. It's who you are.

0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:47.159
<v Speaker 2>Be proud of that. What you need to do is

0:18:47.240 --> 0:18:50.560
<v Speaker 2>learn how to create space for another person to have

0:18:50.720 --> 0:18:55.240
<v Speaker 2>their stuff, but constantly be pushing self awareness and self

0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:58.560
<v Speaker 2>regulation to them, Like, Okay, if this person is sitting

0:18:58.600 --> 0:19:01.639
<v Speaker 2>there with Bob or Sally, Oh, Sally, it's really amazing.

0:19:01.640 --> 0:19:03.679
<v Speaker 2>You're so self aware. That's really awesome. How do you

0:19:03.680 --> 0:19:05.280
<v Speaker 2>handle it when you have a bad day? Oh, I

0:19:05.320 --> 0:19:07.400
<v Speaker 2>go into the bathroom and have a cry. Okay, how

0:19:07.400 --> 0:19:09.000
<v Speaker 2>else do you handle it when you have a bad day?

0:19:09.080 --> 0:19:11.479
<v Speaker 2>I go for a walk? How would you handle it.

0:19:11.520 --> 0:19:13.760
<v Speaker 2>If your coworker came to you and had a bad day,

0:19:13.800 --> 0:19:15.800
<v Speaker 2>I would say, let's go for a walk. Or if

0:19:15.840 --> 0:19:18.000
<v Speaker 2>they say, I don't know, I don't know what I

0:19:18.000 --> 0:19:19.880
<v Speaker 2>would do. If I saw someone having a bad day,

0:19:20.000 --> 0:19:23.720
<v Speaker 2>That's when I say, actually, you're just as responsible for

0:19:23.800 --> 0:19:25.760
<v Speaker 2>this culture as I am. And so what you would

0:19:25.760 --> 0:19:28.600
<v Speaker 2>do is say, hey, I notice that you're having a

0:19:28.640 --> 0:19:30.600
<v Speaker 2>bad day. You want to go talk? Is there someone

0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:32.760
<v Speaker 2>I can connect you with? Those are like just the

0:19:32.760 --> 0:19:35.160
<v Speaker 2>little bits that I'm trying to infuse in the system,

0:19:35.280 --> 0:19:38.760
<v Speaker 2>which I call emotional efficiency. Quite frankly, this is something

0:19:38.840 --> 0:19:40.280
<v Speaker 2>I talk quite a bit about and I have a

0:19:40.280 --> 0:19:43.240
<v Speaker 2>book coming out and I really talk about it, emotional optimism,

0:19:43.280 --> 0:19:46.200
<v Speaker 2>emotional bravery, and emotional efficiency. And this is a flywheel

0:19:46.280 --> 0:19:50.040
<v Speaker 2>that's happening constantly. Emotional optimism is the fact that we

0:19:50.119 --> 0:19:52.159
<v Speaker 2>all have bad days, we all go through emotions, We

0:19:52.200 --> 0:19:54.080
<v Speaker 2>go through highs, we go through lows. You know, our

0:19:54.119 --> 0:19:55.679
<v Speaker 2>dog got sick this morning and then I had to

0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:57.600
<v Speaker 2>get on a screen and deal with something that was crying.

0:19:57.640 --> 0:20:00.800
<v Speaker 2>Whatever it is, right, So okay, what can I do

0:20:00.880 --> 0:20:02.720
<v Speaker 2>with that? I can have faith and hope that it's

0:20:02.760 --> 0:20:04.840
<v Speaker 2>going to turn around. Tomorrow. I can have faith and

0:20:04.840 --> 0:20:06.840
<v Speaker 2>hope that I can call my best friend, I can

0:20:06.880 --> 0:20:09.040
<v Speaker 2>call my brother, I can call someone at work and

0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:10.720
<v Speaker 2>they can talk me out of this slump. But I

0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:13.480
<v Speaker 2>have to believe in that. That's the optimism. The next

0:20:13.480 --> 0:20:16.720
<v Speaker 2>step is emotional bravery. What do I do? What actions

0:20:16.760 --> 0:20:20.520
<v Speaker 2>do I take? Knowing that I'm supported, knowing that I'm good?

0:20:20.680 --> 0:20:23.480
<v Speaker 2>How can I be braver in this situation? Oh gosh,

0:20:23.520 --> 0:20:25.480
<v Speaker 2>I have to have a hard conversation with my boss.

0:20:25.480 --> 0:20:25.760
<v Speaker 4>All right.

0:20:25.800 --> 0:20:28.879
<v Speaker 2>That's up to me to bring my self awareness and

0:20:28.920 --> 0:20:31.520
<v Speaker 2>my ability to regulate my own emotions and bring that

0:20:31.640 --> 0:20:35.280
<v Speaker 2>conversation to my boss and be brave and it's okay

0:20:35.320 --> 0:20:38.520
<v Speaker 2>if my emotions come out, I'm not spilling anywhere. The

0:20:38.520 --> 0:20:40.199
<v Speaker 2>more I do that, and the more you do that

0:20:40.240 --> 0:20:44.560
<v Speaker 2>within teams, you create efficiency. Efficiency is a shorthand. So

0:20:44.960 --> 0:20:48.480
<v Speaker 2>back to this ROI, which is the question, it's how

0:20:48.520 --> 0:20:52.240
<v Speaker 2>can we help one another within the workplace of understanding

0:20:52.280 --> 0:20:54.760
<v Speaker 2>that emotions are allowed. We are not in a time

0:20:54.800 --> 0:20:57.040
<v Speaker 2>and place where we are going to go armor up anymore.

0:20:57.080 --> 0:20:59.240
<v Speaker 2>That's not going to work, certainly not going to work

0:20:59.240 --> 0:21:01.879
<v Speaker 2>for this generation or Generation Alpha that's going to come

0:21:01.920 --> 0:21:05.119
<v Speaker 2>up soon that's the first thing. So how can we

0:21:05.240 --> 0:21:08.760
<v Speaker 2>be in a workplace and be feelers and have our

0:21:08.800 --> 0:21:11.480
<v Speaker 2>own feelings and still keep our eye on the prize.

0:21:11.800 --> 0:21:14.840
<v Speaker 2>We need the entire organization to be rowing in the

0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:18.000
<v Speaker 2>same direction, and that means we need to spend a

0:21:18.040 --> 0:21:22.160
<v Speaker 2>lot of time with one another having these conversations of like, hey,

0:21:22.200 --> 0:21:24.840
<v Speaker 2>your emotions are totally fine. I need you to keep

0:21:24.840 --> 0:21:27.520
<v Speaker 2>that in check, though, because when you have an outburst

0:21:27.560 --> 0:21:31.040
<v Speaker 2>like that, you've just destroyed the productivity for the rest

0:21:31.080 --> 0:21:32.639
<v Speaker 2>of the day for that team. Like, if you're going

0:21:32.720 --> 0:21:35.360
<v Speaker 2>to have an outburst, that's cool, go out to the bathroom.

0:21:35.400 --> 0:21:37.080
<v Speaker 2>I'll meet you there in five minutes, or I'll have

0:21:37.119 --> 0:21:39.280
<v Speaker 2>your you know what I mean? Like, yes, So much

0:21:39.320 --> 0:21:41.199
<v Speaker 2>of what I talk about is common sense, and I

0:21:41.280 --> 0:21:44.400
<v Speaker 2>recognize it's not common for everyone, But I don't think

0:21:44.440 --> 0:21:48.080
<v Speaker 2>it's difficult to be kind and to be effective. I

0:21:48.200 --> 0:21:50.520
<v Speaker 2>do think there's a marriage there and those things can

0:21:50.560 --> 0:21:53.280
<v Speaker 2>happen if you have the right support around you and

0:21:53.320 --> 0:21:57.080
<v Speaker 2>your culture says it's okay, And I don't mean it's

0:21:57.080 --> 0:22:00.359
<v Speaker 2>okay because they have banners on the walls. Are like

0:22:00.840 --> 0:22:05.119
<v Speaker 2>sore fly, Hi, you can do it. Aspire for greatness

0:22:05.840 --> 0:22:09.200
<v Speaker 2>you need to have your values in the water stream.

0:22:09.240 --> 0:22:12.280
<v Speaker 2>People need to act on them, and then they become habits.

0:22:12.800 --> 0:22:14.879
<v Speaker 2>And this is something that Gary talks about and he

0:22:15.000 --> 0:22:17.919
<v Speaker 2>uses the word osmosis, which is something that is very

0:22:17.920 --> 0:22:21.879
<v Speaker 2>difficult to teach. You have to experience over and over

0:22:22.280 --> 0:22:24.600
<v Speaker 2>over and over. And so what did we start talking

0:22:24.640 --> 0:22:29.119
<v Speaker 2>about in the beginning patterns. It's the same exact thing, consistency.

0:22:29.920 --> 0:22:33.760
<v Speaker 2>And so when someone consistently behaves a certain way, I

0:22:33.800 --> 0:22:36.320
<v Speaker 2>can trust that they're always going to behave that way.

0:22:36.880 --> 0:22:39.800
<v Speaker 2>When a person is inconsistent or wobbles, or one day

0:22:39.800 --> 0:22:42.119
<v Speaker 2>they're like this, everyone's going to have a little bit

0:22:42.119 --> 0:22:45.440
<v Speaker 2>of distrust around that person. What our job is as

0:22:45.520 --> 0:22:47.520
<v Speaker 2>leaders is to be able to point that out in

0:22:47.520 --> 0:22:51.479
<v Speaker 2>a kind, compassionate but very candorous way to that person

0:22:51.680 --> 0:22:54.720
<v Speaker 2>and helping and facilitating other people to do their best

0:22:54.760 --> 0:22:58.520
<v Speaker 2>on dealing with it. I didn't say exterminate it, deal

0:22:58.600 --> 0:23:02.800
<v Speaker 2>with it. So I shouldn't or the people an experienced

0:23:02.800 --> 0:23:05.359
<v Speaker 2>team shouldn't be the people dealing with all of this.

0:23:05.520 --> 0:23:09.199
<v Speaker 2>Your managers need to be dealing with some of the

0:23:09.240 --> 0:23:11.080
<v Speaker 2>angst or some of the turmoil, or some of the

0:23:11.119 --> 0:23:12.280
<v Speaker 2>whatever on your teams.

0:23:13.760 --> 0:23:15.960
<v Speaker 3>When we come back. Claude gets into what it really

0:23:16.040 --> 0:23:18.600
<v Speaker 3>looks like to lead with heart in the hard moments

0:23:18.760 --> 0:23:22.600
<v Speaker 3>like layoffs, hybrid work tensions, and the emotional weight that

0:23:22.680 --> 0:23:26.000
<v Speaker 3>caregivers bring to the office every day. She also shares

0:23:26.040 --> 0:23:28.840
<v Speaker 3>why she finally wrote her new book, Be Yourself at Work,

0:23:29.080 --> 0:23:31.320
<v Speaker 3>and what she sees on the horizon for the future

0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:32.040
<v Speaker 3>of leadership.

0:23:32.960 --> 0:23:34.760
<v Speaker 2>The eye has to be on the prize, and the

0:23:34.800 --> 0:23:37.680
<v Speaker 2>prize is yes, having a healthy culture and having people

0:23:37.680 --> 0:23:39.800
<v Speaker 2>that want to work and that make friends that I'm

0:23:39.840 --> 0:23:43.080
<v Speaker 2>devoted to in a place that's kind in this camaraderie,

0:23:43.160 --> 0:23:46.400
<v Speaker 2>but I'm also devoted to being successful. I want everyone

0:23:46.440 --> 0:23:48.359
<v Speaker 2>to be able to get the raise that they're looking

0:23:48.400 --> 0:23:51.200
<v Speaker 2>for and to get the promotion. But that only happens

0:23:51.240 --> 0:23:54.560
<v Speaker 2>when the organism is working together. It takes a village.

0:23:55.520 --> 0:24:09.440
<v Speaker 3>Stay with us. So when you experience resistance or skepticism

0:24:09.480 --> 0:24:14.040
<v Speaker 3>from culture about your ideologies around empathy in the workplace,

0:24:14.359 --> 0:24:16.880
<v Speaker 3>what are the most common things that you hear.

0:24:17.680 --> 0:24:20.320
<v Speaker 2>So we're a workplace, and we're a business, and we

0:24:20.400 --> 0:24:24.400
<v Speaker 2>have to make money, and so sometimes we are going

0:24:24.440 --> 0:24:28.200
<v Speaker 2>to be more empire than honey. So our culture is

0:24:28.240 --> 0:24:30.879
<v Speaker 2>called honey empire. I'd like to say we're fifty one

0:24:30.920 --> 0:24:33.840
<v Speaker 2>percent honey, forty nine percent empire. Some days we're going

0:24:33.880 --> 0:24:36.359
<v Speaker 2>to be fifty one percent empire. And so what I

0:24:36.480 --> 0:24:40.040
<v Speaker 2>hear about our culture at times is we're just so

0:24:40.160 --> 0:24:42.760
<v Speaker 2>focused on the bottom line. We're so focused on sales.

0:24:43.000 --> 0:24:45.840
<v Speaker 2>We're so focused on being the best or being the first, Like,

0:24:46.240 --> 0:24:49.600
<v Speaker 2>where's the softness, where's the empathy in that clot And

0:24:49.640 --> 0:24:51.800
<v Speaker 2>that's a tough one, because yes, I can spend time

0:24:51.840 --> 0:24:53.439
<v Speaker 2>with you and show you how we got to that

0:24:53.520 --> 0:24:57.080
<v Speaker 2>place or why it's so necessary. Because of the financial

0:24:57.160 --> 0:24:59.560
<v Speaker 2>environment that we're all in right now, or certainly the

0:24:59.600 --> 0:25:03.840
<v Speaker 2>financial environment that advertising agencies are in today, we have

0:25:03.920 --> 0:25:05.840
<v Speaker 2>to be serious about our work, and we have to

0:25:05.880 --> 0:25:09.440
<v Speaker 2>be serious about being exceptional with our clients and delivering

0:25:09.440 --> 0:25:12.200
<v Speaker 2>on what we said we would deliver on time. Yeah,

0:25:12.200 --> 0:25:14.560
<v Speaker 2>and if that goes against your idea of empathy, well

0:25:14.600 --> 0:25:18.159
<v Speaker 2>then we can have that talk once you're finished. The

0:25:18.280 --> 0:25:21.000
<v Speaker 2>eye has to be on the prize, and the prize is, yes,

0:25:21.080 --> 0:25:23.240
<v Speaker 2>having a healthy culture and having people that want to

0:25:23.280 --> 0:25:26.040
<v Speaker 2>work and that make friends that I'm devoted to in

0:25:26.080 --> 0:25:28.840
<v Speaker 2>a place that's kind and there's camaraderie, but I'm also

0:25:29.000 --> 0:25:32.320
<v Speaker 2>devoted to being successful. I want everyone to be able

0:25:32.359 --> 0:25:34.280
<v Speaker 2>to get the raise that they're looking for and to

0:25:34.280 --> 0:25:37.560
<v Speaker 2>get the promotion. But that only happens when the organism

0:25:37.640 --> 0:25:40.480
<v Speaker 2>is working together. It takes a village. And so we

0:25:40.520 --> 0:25:43.080
<v Speaker 2>have orientation every other week and I meet every single

0:25:43.119 --> 0:25:46.080
<v Speaker 2>new joiner and that can be a C suite employee

0:25:46.119 --> 0:25:48.080
<v Speaker 2>sitting with an art director, it doesn't matter. It's all

0:25:48.080 --> 0:25:50.240
<v Speaker 2>on zoom. But I love that because it flattens the

0:25:50.280 --> 0:25:52.520
<v Speaker 2>organization right then and there. But the first thing I'll

0:25:52.560 --> 0:25:57.000
<v Speaker 2>say to them is culture is everyone's responsibility, and wonderful

0:25:57.040 --> 0:25:59.800
<v Speaker 2>this screen. You are all now just as responsible for

0:25:59.840 --> 0:26:02.440
<v Speaker 2>the culture as I am. And that's a great thing

0:26:02.680 --> 0:26:06.040
<v Speaker 2>because you were chosen for a reason. We chose you.

0:26:06.040 --> 0:26:08.159
<v Speaker 2>You have the right skill sets and you are going

0:26:08.200 --> 0:26:10.640
<v Speaker 2>to bring such wonderful additions to this culture.

0:26:11.200 --> 0:26:13.920
<v Speaker 3>I want to talk a little bit about difficult conversations

0:26:14.160 --> 0:26:17.800
<v Speaker 3>that you have with your employees around issues of like

0:26:17.920 --> 0:26:20.280
<v Speaker 3>coming into a meeting and not looking like you're fully there,

0:26:20.880 --> 0:26:24.919
<v Speaker 3>but also harder ones like your positions being eliminated. How

0:26:24.920 --> 0:26:25.440
<v Speaker 3>do you do it?

0:26:26.040 --> 0:26:27.879
<v Speaker 2>So I'm going to put a heading on top of

0:26:27.920 --> 0:26:32.159
<v Speaker 2>this topic, which is called accountability. And I believe that

0:26:32.520 --> 0:26:35.640
<v Speaker 2>for a culture to be healthy and thriving, there needs

0:26:35.680 --> 0:26:37.760
<v Speaker 2>to be accountability and people need to know what they

0:26:37.800 --> 0:26:41.679
<v Speaker 2>are accountable and responsible for. That is our job as

0:26:42.160 --> 0:26:44.159
<v Speaker 2>the leaders of this company to make sure people know

0:26:44.240 --> 0:26:46.199
<v Speaker 2>that and to make sure leadership knows that. That's the

0:26:46.200 --> 0:26:49.200
<v Speaker 2>first thing I want to say when it comes time

0:26:49.920 --> 0:26:54.000
<v Speaker 2>for that person to be exited. My hope and my prayer,

0:26:54.240 --> 0:26:56.280
<v Speaker 2>and I'm like a hawk with this, is that we

0:26:56.520 --> 0:27:01.199
<v Speaker 2>have documented and had those conversations along the way. That

0:27:01.359 --> 0:27:03.760
<v Speaker 2>is a must. And I'm not talking about waiting for

0:27:03.960 --> 0:27:07.920
<v Speaker 2>quarterly reviews. I'm talking about frequent feedback. As a manager,

0:27:07.960 --> 0:27:10.280
<v Speaker 2>as a leader, that is your job to make sure

0:27:10.920 --> 0:27:15.560
<v Speaker 2>John knows where he is anytime he asks you, right,

0:27:15.920 --> 0:27:18.160
<v Speaker 2>what does he need to do? What is he not doing?

0:27:18.240 --> 0:27:20.520
<v Speaker 2>Where is he excelling all of those things. By the

0:27:20.600 --> 0:27:23.560
<v Speaker 2>time that conversation of an exit comes my way or

0:27:23.600 --> 0:27:27.080
<v Speaker 2>comes to the team's way, what I'm expecting is that

0:27:27.200 --> 0:27:29.640
<v Speaker 2>it is not going to come as a big surprise.

0:27:30.160 --> 0:27:32.400
<v Speaker 2>And that is something we need to get a lot

0:27:32.440 --> 0:27:35.480
<v Speaker 2>better at, which is called clarity and communication and making

0:27:35.520 --> 0:27:39.960
<v Speaker 2>sure we are holding ourselves accountable as we're holding him accountable.

0:27:40.119 --> 0:27:42.239
<v Speaker 2>It has to be a two Way Street. So in

0:27:42.280 --> 0:27:46.679
<v Speaker 2>those conversations, I will often sit down and say, I'm sorry,

0:27:46.680 --> 0:27:49.360
<v Speaker 2>this is going to be a really challenging conversation. And

0:27:49.760 --> 0:27:52.840
<v Speaker 2>based on the conversations, or based on the last reviews,

0:27:52.920 --> 0:27:55.960
<v Speaker 2>or based on your behavior last week, or based on

0:27:56.040 --> 0:27:59.480
<v Speaker 2>what we've talked about several times now, it's been documented

0:27:59.600 --> 0:28:03.600
<v Speaker 2>on how you gossip constantly about a person's appearance or

0:28:03.600 --> 0:28:06.399
<v Speaker 2>whatever it is fill in the blank. Today is going

0:28:06.400 --> 0:28:09.280
<v Speaker 2>to be your last day. I'm really sorry that we

0:28:09.280 --> 0:28:11.760
<v Speaker 2>weren't able to work this out together. Something like that.

0:28:12.080 --> 0:28:15.680
<v Speaker 2>What I will say, and this is not to make

0:28:15.720 --> 0:28:17.240
<v Speaker 2>it like, oh yeah, I got this down.

0:28:17.320 --> 0:28:17.680
<v Speaker 4>I don't.

0:28:17.800 --> 0:28:22.440
<v Speaker 2>These are hard conversations someone's livelihood. We have an exceptional

0:28:22.480 --> 0:28:26.480
<v Speaker 2>alumni program that we created three years ago. So let

0:28:26.520 --> 0:28:28.960
<v Speaker 2>me just explain that really quickly. A lot of people

0:28:29.000 --> 0:28:31.919
<v Speaker 2>come to Gary, a lot of companies, a lot of cmos,

0:28:32.040 --> 0:28:34.560
<v Speaker 2>Hey do you have a social media marketer for my

0:28:34.800 --> 0:28:37.400
<v Speaker 2>ex company or my Y company? And we put all

0:28:37.440 --> 0:28:40.520
<v Speaker 2>of those jobs into our own database, and we reach

0:28:40.560 --> 0:28:44.239
<v Speaker 2>out to people that have either left Vanner Media or

0:28:44.280 --> 0:28:48.080
<v Speaker 2>we know we will be exiting. We promise that within

0:28:48.200 --> 0:28:52.000
<v Speaker 2>three days, this gentleman, Justin Novello will reach out to you.

0:28:52.400 --> 0:28:54.440
<v Speaker 2>He's going to help you with your resume and your

0:28:54.440 --> 0:28:57.960
<v Speaker 2>LinkedIn profile, and we will connect you. We can't guarantee

0:28:58.000 --> 0:29:01.120
<v Speaker 2>a conversation or a job. Are many times that Gary

0:29:01.160 --> 0:29:03.680
<v Speaker 2>will say, I will talk to whomever I know at

0:29:03.680 --> 0:29:06.040
<v Speaker 2>that company and I will at least get you a conversation.

0:29:06.720 --> 0:29:09.720
<v Speaker 2>So we promise that to every single person, and we've

0:29:09.760 --> 0:29:12.560
<v Speaker 2>been really successful. We also have a lot of boomerangs

0:29:12.560 --> 0:29:15.520
<v Speaker 2>that come back three years later, five years later, seven

0:29:15.600 --> 0:29:19.600
<v Speaker 2>years later. So that's all to say. These conversations are

0:29:19.640 --> 0:29:24.160
<v Speaker 2>painful for everyone, and my hope is that we continue

0:29:24.200 --> 0:29:28.040
<v Speaker 2>to get better at our communication and get clearer and

0:29:28.080 --> 0:29:30.840
<v Speaker 2>more specific so that it is not a surprise when

0:29:30.840 --> 0:29:32.840
<v Speaker 2>that person comes in, because that's the worst thing.

0:29:33.240 --> 0:29:36.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, that's quite generous, I think, and I think speaks

0:29:36.320 --> 0:29:39.600
<v Speaker 3>for itself when people come back. I think that speaks volumes.

0:29:40.160 --> 0:29:42.120
<v Speaker 3>One more question about the workplace, and then I want

0:29:42.120 --> 0:29:44.960
<v Speaker 3>to get into your advice for those who want to

0:29:45.200 --> 0:29:50.080
<v Speaker 3>maybe take on some of your leadership or like you

0:29:50.120 --> 0:29:52.680
<v Speaker 3>have changed your career multiple times, they want to do that,

0:29:53.160 --> 0:29:56.840
<v Speaker 3>But I have to ask you about hybrid work. You

0:29:56.920 --> 0:29:58.720
<v Speaker 3>have said no one will stand for five days a

0:29:58.720 --> 0:30:01.760
<v Speaker 3>week in office Why is it so important to have

0:30:01.880 --> 0:30:05.520
<v Speaker 3>flexible work as it speaks to your values as chief

0:30:05.560 --> 0:30:06.160
<v Speaker 3>heard officer.

0:30:06.840 --> 0:30:09.600
<v Speaker 2>My values as a chief Heart officer are based around

0:30:09.680 --> 0:30:12.760
<v Speaker 2>being human. Yeah, they're really based around common sense things

0:30:12.760 --> 0:30:16.360
<v Speaker 2>as we've talked about. It's just it's the basics, and

0:30:16.440 --> 0:30:19.600
<v Speaker 2>I really believe our workplaces need to meet us there.

0:30:20.440 --> 0:30:24.560
<v Speaker 2>We need time for our own personal health, for our family,

0:30:24.680 --> 0:30:28.240
<v Speaker 2>for our friends, for just doing a day to day appointments.

0:30:28.240 --> 0:30:31.560
<v Speaker 2>That we just need time to live as free people

0:30:31.600 --> 0:30:35.520
<v Speaker 2>as freely as we possibly can, with the commitment that

0:30:35.600 --> 0:30:38.800
<v Speaker 2>we will be accountable to our job. I don't think

0:30:38.840 --> 0:30:42.000
<v Speaker 2>we need to big brother people. I believe that big

0:30:42.040 --> 0:30:44.479
<v Speaker 2>brothering people is the antithesis of what I'm about. It

0:30:44.480 --> 0:30:47.440
<v Speaker 2>feels like there's a scarcity in the world, a fear.

0:30:48.040 --> 0:30:50.840
<v Speaker 2>You know, why can't we trust people to do the

0:30:50.880 --> 0:30:54.840
<v Speaker 2>work that we hire them to do. I understand that

0:30:54.880 --> 0:30:57.160
<v Speaker 2>there are times in which we need people in the

0:30:57.200 --> 0:31:00.000
<v Speaker 2>office one thousand percent and we want people to look

0:31:00.120 --> 0:31:02.120
<v Speaker 2>over someone's shoulder and say, oh, yeah, no, I would

0:31:02.120 --> 0:31:04.440
<v Speaker 2>put a little more rust color in there or whatever

0:31:04.480 --> 0:31:07.760
<v Speaker 2>it is. But I want people to feel like they

0:31:07.800 --> 0:31:10.680
<v Speaker 2>can live their lives and not have to balance this

0:31:10.840 --> 0:31:14.920
<v Speaker 2>work life balance that we put in place a century

0:31:14.960 --> 0:31:18.520
<v Speaker 2>ago during the factory age when it was eight hours,

0:31:18.560 --> 0:31:19.560
<v Speaker 2>eight hours, eight hours.

0:31:19.960 --> 0:31:24.320
<v Speaker 3>Has your leadership adjusted in a hybrid model world at

0:31:24.320 --> 0:31:27.640
<v Speaker 3>all in terms of, let's say, after someone who's working

0:31:27.640 --> 0:31:30.160
<v Speaker 3>remotely from home, what is that person's future in terms

0:31:30.200 --> 0:31:33.600
<v Speaker 3>of leading a team? Actually, at right there is the

0:31:33.640 --> 0:31:36.520
<v Speaker 3>million dollar question. As a leader, you have an enormous

0:31:36.560 --> 0:31:41.680
<v Speaker 3>responsibility to grow and nurture people. So three day in office,

0:31:41.920 --> 0:31:43.920
<v Speaker 3>I think is great. If we can do that, I

0:31:44.000 --> 0:31:47.280
<v Speaker 3>think we would accomplish a ton, a ton of closeness

0:31:47.280 --> 0:31:51.560
<v Speaker 3>and camaraderie and collaboration and curiosity together and then also

0:31:51.760 --> 0:31:53.960
<v Speaker 3>being able to go to the dentist at ten o'clock

0:31:54.000 --> 0:31:56.520
<v Speaker 3>in the morning. So I really do think hybrid is

0:31:56.520 --> 0:31:59.959
<v Speaker 3>the way to go. I believe in flexibility, I believe

0:32:00.080 --> 0:32:02.800
<v Speaker 3>and freedom. I believe in giving people the opportunity to

0:32:02.880 --> 0:32:05.880
<v Speaker 3>show us what they can do, and if they can't, well,

0:32:05.880 --> 0:32:07.920
<v Speaker 3>then we have to have those harder conversations.

0:32:08.320 --> 0:32:10.440
<v Speaker 2>We need you in the office this amount of time.

0:32:11.120 --> 0:32:13.239
<v Speaker 2>I will say that what has changed for me the

0:32:13.280 --> 0:32:16.800
<v Speaker 2>most is being a mom, you know, and really understanding

0:32:16.960 --> 0:32:19.880
<v Speaker 2>what that takes to be a parent or a caregiver.

0:32:20.040 --> 0:32:23.959
<v Speaker 2>The emotional package that you wear that I wear as

0:32:24.000 --> 0:32:27.120
<v Speaker 2>a parent every day is it's invisible, but it's there.

0:32:27.360 --> 0:32:29.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, And that's one of the things that I'm

0:32:29.880 --> 0:32:32.400
<v Speaker 2>really big on right now. We just kicked off a

0:32:32.440 --> 0:32:36.000
<v Speaker 2>brand new parents Caregivers group rate a banner to really

0:32:36.040 --> 0:32:38.880
<v Speaker 2>have these hard conversations. Not about benefits, That's not what

0:32:38.920 --> 0:32:43.800
<v Speaker 2>I'm talking about, but just having the courageous conversations of like, yeah,

0:32:43.920 --> 0:32:46.080
<v Speaker 2>my kid has special needs, or my kid has to

0:32:46.160 --> 0:32:48.800
<v Speaker 2>have an operation, or I need to be there to

0:32:49.080 --> 0:32:50.480
<v Speaker 2>have dinner with my children.

0:32:51.960 --> 0:32:55.479
<v Speaker 3>All right, let's pick your brain and get some advice

0:32:55.560 --> 0:32:59.440
<v Speaker 3>for our listeners on reinvention. Career reinvention, you're not shy

0:32:59.520 --> 0:33:02.880
<v Speaker 3>to this. What advice would you give to mid career professionals,

0:33:02.960 --> 0:33:07.200
<v Speaker 3>especially who feel stagnant in their careers. They want to

0:33:07.200 --> 0:33:09.080
<v Speaker 3>do a pivot, but they're afraid.

0:33:10.400 --> 0:33:12.480
<v Speaker 2>So what I would say is work with a coach.

0:33:12.840 --> 0:33:15.360
<v Speaker 2>Don't do this alone. I would really say, find someone

0:33:15.360 --> 0:33:17.120
<v Speaker 2>that you can talk to about what it is your

0:33:17.160 --> 0:33:19.960
<v Speaker 2>passionate about, what your values are, what are you great at?

0:33:20.200 --> 0:33:23.360
<v Speaker 2>What do you just great at? And you hate doing

0:33:23.400 --> 0:33:25.400
<v Speaker 2>because you don't want to get into that box and

0:33:25.560 --> 0:33:27.720
<v Speaker 2>dream big, Like, if you feel like you really want

0:33:27.760 --> 0:33:29.720
<v Speaker 2>to open up your own flower boutique, then you have

0:33:29.800 --> 0:33:32.600
<v Speaker 2>to put that out there and understand it's not going

0:33:32.640 --> 0:33:35.160
<v Speaker 2>to happen tomorrow. There are steps that you need to take.

0:33:35.840 --> 0:33:38.160
<v Speaker 2>I used to think that you could get from point

0:33:38.240 --> 0:33:41.600
<v Speaker 2>A to Z overnight, but I realized you have to

0:33:41.600 --> 0:33:46.280
<v Speaker 2>do some planning. So my best advice is to a

0:33:46.800 --> 0:33:49.640
<v Speaker 2>go for it and talk to someone about it. Find

0:33:49.680 --> 0:33:52.480
<v Speaker 2>someone that is a career coach or a life coach

0:33:52.520 --> 0:33:56.120
<v Speaker 2>that you trust that can really help you step by step,

0:33:56.480 --> 0:33:59.080
<v Speaker 2>figure out what your dreams are and figure out what

0:33:59.120 --> 0:34:01.000
<v Speaker 2>those sprints are to get to the marathon.

0:34:01.320 --> 0:34:03.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, the finish line. The zone of genius work is fun.

0:34:03.920 --> 0:34:04.240
<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

0:34:04.280 --> 0:34:04.920
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely.

0:34:05.560 --> 0:34:07.240
<v Speaker 3>What are some of the trends you think are going

0:34:07.320 --> 0:34:10.719
<v Speaker 3>to shape the workplace in the next five years?

0:34:11.040 --> 0:34:15.080
<v Speaker 2>AI, AI, AI, and AI all over the place. You know,

0:34:15.120 --> 0:34:17.840
<v Speaker 2>I work in a creative agency, that's all there. We

0:34:17.960 --> 0:34:21.760
<v Speaker 2>work in HRIS systems, it's already there. Anything that gives

0:34:21.800 --> 0:34:25.800
<v Speaker 2>us more efficiency, I think, and smart to some extent.

0:34:26.000 --> 0:34:27.880
<v Speaker 2>We know that there's all these different chat you know,

0:34:28.000 --> 0:34:31.440
<v Speaker 2>chatchipt or Claude, which is very just strange to say,

0:34:33.040 --> 0:34:35.279
<v Speaker 2>and they're getting more intelligent. The more we use them

0:34:35.320 --> 0:34:37.080
<v Speaker 2>and the more you prompt them, and I, for one,

0:34:37.360 --> 0:34:39.839
<v Speaker 2>love playing with them. It's like a hobby for me now,

0:34:39.920 --> 0:34:43.480
<v Speaker 2>just to see how far I can go. And quite frankly,

0:34:43.640 --> 0:34:45.720
<v Speaker 2>they make me smarter. They make me sound smarter.

0:34:46.239 --> 0:34:49.919
<v Speaker 3>Do you think it can threaten workforce at Vynermedia? Even

0:34:50.520 --> 0:34:51.319
<v Speaker 3>I don't think it.

0:34:51.280 --> 0:34:53.919
<v Speaker 2>Can threaten workforce at Vaynermedia. I think we are going

0:34:53.960 --> 0:34:57.839
<v Speaker 2>to use it to provide more efficiency and to be

0:34:57.840 --> 0:35:00.640
<v Speaker 2>better at our craft. That's what I think, being a

0:35:00.680 --> 0:35:03.320
<v Speaker 2>company that is rooted in people, and we're very proud

0:35:03.320 --> 0:35:04.880
<v Speaker 2>of that. I don't think that there's going to be

0:35:04.920 --> 0:35:08.120
<v Speaker 2>a time where we're going to eliminate twenty jobs because

0:35:08.480 --> 0:35:10.799
<v Speaker 2>Claude Chatchpt can do it better. But I think we

0:35:10.840 --> 0:35:13.040
<v Speaker 2>are going to use it much more frequently.

0:35:13.680 --> 0:35:16.680
<v Speaker 3>You mentioned your book that's coming out soon, Be Yourself

0:35:16.800 --> 0:35:19.800
<v Speaker 3>at Work. Tell us a little about the genesis of

0:35:19.840 --> 0:35:22.719
<v Speaker 3>this As an author, it's not a small feat when

0:35:22.760 --> 0:35:24.879
<v Speaker 3>you take this on, especially you have a big job,

0:35:25.000 --> 0:35:26.959
<v Speaker 3>you have a big personal life, and then you add

0:35:26.960 --> 0:35:27.520
<v Speaker 3>this to it.

0:35:28.040 --> 0:35:30.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was a challenge that I set for myself

0:35:30.440 --> 0:35:33.400
<v Speaker 2>about ten years ago. I don't know why. It's literally

0:35:33.400 --> 0:35:34.799
<v Speaker 2>like some people said, I'm on a round a Maska

0:35:35.000 --> 0:35:39.880
<v Speaker 2>calling calling. I went through so much imposter syndrome, so

0:35:40.040 --> 0:35:42.239
<v Speaker 2>many days, so many weeks and months, that I put

0:35:42.239 --> 0:35:44.040
<v Speaker 2>it on hold. What do I have to say? That's

0:35:44.040 --> 0:35:46.760
<v Speaker 2>so new. Everyone's talking about vulnerability in the workplace, Everyone's

0:35:46.760 --> 0:35:48.400
<v Speaker 2>saying that stuff. What do I have to say? And

0:35:48.440 --> 0:35:52.239
<v Speaker 2>I realized I live it. It's very different. I'm not

0:35:52.480 --> 0:35:56.160
<v Speaker 2>a philosopher talking about it. I'm not an academic talking

0:35:56.200 --> 0:35:59.480
<v Speaker 2>about it. I'm actually doing it every day and watching

0:35:59.520 --> 0:36:03.400
<v Speaker 2>people be themselves at work and certainly promoting that. So

0:36:04.200 --> 0:36:06.239
<v Speaker 2>that's what it was about for me, which was literally like,

0:36:06.320 --> 0:36:07.600
<v Speaker 2>this is who I am, this is what I have

0:36:07.680 --> 0:36:10.640
<v Speaker 2>to offer. I'm not looking to win any Nobil Peace Prize.

0:36:10.640 --> 0:36:12.640
<v Speaker 2>I just wanted to see if I could do it.

0:36:12.680 --> 0:36:16.040
<v Speaker 2>And it took me five years to do it. It

0:36:16.160 --> 0:36:18.239
<v Speaker 2>was a labor of love, That's all I can say.

0:36:18.360 --> 0:36:21.160
<v Speaker 2>And thank god I had a supportive partner who could

0:36:21.200 --> 0:36:23.120
<v Speaker 2>help and take on the way to the kids and

0:36:23.200 --> 0:36:23.920
<v Speaker 2>all of those things.

0:36:24.080 --> 0:36:26.279
<v Speaker 3>I wish more people knew about what it takes to

0:36:26.320 --> 0:36:29.800
<v Speaker 3>actually write a book. You know, I sacrifices the trade offs,

0:36:29.800 --> 0:36:31.920
<v Speaker 3>the imposter syndrome, the loneliness.

0:36:32.719 --> 0:36:35.359
<v Speaker 2>It's like leadership in many ways. It can be very

0:36:35.400 --> 0:36:38.520
<v Speaker 2>lonely and just doing something that you know is a

0:36:38.560 --> 0:36:41.239
<v Speaker 2>calling to your point and you just have to do it.

0:36:41.480 --> 0:36:43.919
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, yeah, you just get her done, get or done.

0:36:44.760 --> 0:36:47.600
<v Speaker 3>The title of this podcast is leading by Example, So

0:36:47.640 --> 0:36:49.360
<v Speaker 3>we want to ask you, as we do all of

0:36:49.400 --> 0:36:53.120
<v Speaker 3>our wonderful guests, with your title as Chief Heart Officer.

0:36:53.760 --> 0:36:57.160
<v Speaker 3>This is a significant innovation in executive leadership. We think,

0:36:57.360 --> 0:37:01.280
<v Speaker 3>how does cho embody the idea of leading by example?

0:37:02.040 --> 0:37:05.440
<v Speaker 2>Walking the walk every single day, being accountable for how

0:37:05.480 --> 0:37:07.160
<v Speaker 2>I say I'm going to show up and show up

0:37:07.200 --> 0:37:10.520
<v Speaker 2>that way when I say earlier in this podcast, how

0:37:10.560 --> 0:37:12.520
<v Speaker 2>are you walking into a room? How are you showing

0:37:12.600 --> 0:37:14.960
<v Speaker 2>up every single day? If I show up looking at

0:37:14.960 --> 0:37:17.839
<v Speaker 2>my phone walking into that room, then I should not

0:37:17.880 --> 0:37:18.200
<v Speaker 2>be here.

0:37:19.360 --> 0:37:22.040
<v Speaker 3>Listen. If I've learned anything is I'm never walking into

0:37:22.120 --> 0:37:24.799
<v Speaker 3>a room with my phone in my face, especially if

0:37:24.840 --> 0:37:27.719
<v Speaker 3>you are garrier and thank you. Thank you for that reminder.

0:37:27.920 --> 0:37:32.399
<v Speaker 3>We all need it sometimes. Clode Silver, thank you so much.

0:37:32.560 --> 0:37:37.200
<v Speaker 1>Thank you partnersh All right, so here we are post

0:37:37.280 --> 0:37:42.000
<v Speaker 1>Claude Silver interview, and I have my producer here, Ryan,

0:37:42.360 --> 0:37:44.960
<v Speaker 1>who had been listening in the whole time helped us

0:37:44.960 --> 0:37:46.160
<v Speaker 1>actually produce this segment.

0:37:46.400 --> 0:37:49.920
<v Speaker 3>Wonderful questions you had given me for Claude. Thanks so much, Ryan.

0:37:50.719 --> 0:37:51.319
<v Speaker 3>What'd you think?

0:37:51.920 --> 0:37:55.440
<v Speaker 4>I mean, it's impressive having a company as big as

0:37:55.480 --> 0:37:58.719
<v Speaker 4>Vyner and having a role like Claude's. I've never heard

0:37:58.719 --> 0:38:02.440
<v Speaker 4>of anything like it, and yet hearing her explain it,

0:38:02.440 --> 0:38:05.480
<v Speaker 4>it just feels so obvious that you need something, especially

0:38:06.080 --> 0:38:09.759
<v Speaker 4>in sort of a post pandemic world where folks are

0:38:09.880 --> 0:38:13.080
<v Speaker 4>experiencing new things and new ways of working every day

0:38:13.239 --> 0:38:15.840
<v Speaker 4>and things are changing constantly, and to have someone looking

0:38:15.880 --> 0:38:18.600
<v Speaker 4>out for you in a company like that is really impressive.

0:38:19.239 --> 0:38:22.520
<v Speaker 3>It's not an easy job at all, you know. I mean,

0:38:22.600 --> 0:38:25.640
<v Speaker 3>she said she didn't want to do hr. She wanted

0:38:25.680 --> 0:38:27.920
<v Speaker 3>I think a harder job, like she said not to

0:38:28.120 --> 0:38:30.920
<v Speaker 3>be disrespectful to people in human resources. It's an incredibly

0:38:30.960 --> 0:38:33.319
<v Speaker 3>important job. And she would even call it something like

0:38:33.360 --> 0:38:37.480
<v Speaker 3>people and experiences, but that she is taking on so

0:38:37.719 --> 0:38:41.640
<v Speaker 3>much heaviness every day. She may not characterize it as that,

0:38:41.719 --> 0:38:43.839
<v Speaker 3>but I think for the average person, she has a

0:38:43.880 --> 0:38:48.040
<v Speaker 3>skill at empathy and having empathy. It's her superpower, is

0:38:48.080 --> 0:38:50.839
<v Speaker 3>a reason she's in that role, and she's spearheaded that role,

0:38:51.280 --> 0:38:53.959
<v Speaker 3>but man I can help, but think these are big,

0:38:54.000 --> 0:38:55.720
<v Speaker 3>heavy days sometimes for her.

0:38:56.000 --> 0:38:58.520
<v Speaker 4>And I appreciate that a company like that has someone

0:38:58.640 --> 0:39:01.319
<v Speaker 4>in that role who can carry that burden. I think

0:39:01.360 --> 0:39:05.759
<v Speaker 4>that you have to have an extraordinary amount of like

0:39:05.840 --> 0:39:09.400
<v Speaker 4>she's a super power level of emotional intelligence, and to

0:39:09.440 --> 0:39:12.000
<v Speaker 4>be able to share that with the employees in not

0:39:12.080 --> 0:39:14.600
<v Speaker 4>only just share it and carry that burden, but model

0:39:14.640 --> 0:39:16.719
<v Speaker 4>that behavior, I think is going to rub off on

0:39:16.920 --> 0:39:19.280
<v Speaker 4>all the leaders and leaders to be at a place

0:39:19.320 --> 0:39:19.800
<v Speaker 4>like Vayner.

0:39:20.160 --> 0:39:23.239
<v Speaker 3>She had a really cool definition of empathy, which I

0:39:23.320 --> 0:39:26.120
<v Speaker 3>felt was like breaking news a little bit right, because

0:39:26.640 --> 0:39:30.560
<v Speaker 3>she believes it's not just simply stepping into someone else's shoes,

0:39:31.200 --> 0:39:33.000
<v Speaker 3>as though anyone could really.

0:39:33.360 --> 0:39:36.120
<v Speaker 4>It's being a passenger on their journey, which I thought

0:39:36.160 --> 0:39:38.319
<v Speaker 4>was an extraordinary way to put it. I think that

0:39:38.880 --> 0:39:42.680
<v Speaker 4>a lot of times folks confuse empathy for literally feeling

0:39:42.680 --> 0:39:46.360
<v Speaker 4>someone else's feelings, and in this case, it's about awareness,

0:39:46.400 --> 0:39:49.719
<v Speaker 4>and it's about being cognizant of what people are going

0:39:49.719 --> 0:39:53.360
<v Speaker 4>through around you and being able to make changes or

0:39:53.400 --> 0:39:56.319
<v Speaker 4>at least help guide them through those feelings. In a

0:39:56.400 --> 0:39:59.040
<v Speaker 4>complex place like a corporate environment, I mean to be

0:39:59.080 --> 0:40:01.480
<v Speaker 4>able to have these kind of a emotional conversations and

0:40:01.520 --> 0:40:04.759
<v Speaker 4>speak on emotional intelligence, and I really appreciated the way

0:40:04.880 --> 0:40:07.920
<v Speaker 4>she connected it to the idea of Honey versus Empire

0:40:08.000 --> 0:40:10.440
<v Speaker 4>in terms of how they think about Vayner and the

0:40:10.440 --> 0:40:15.160
<v Speaker 4>fact that they can balance these lofty, emotional intelligent conversations

0:40:15.560 --> 0:40:17.360
<v Speaker 4>with still having to make money.

0:40:17.640 --> 0:40:20.319
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you can hold those two things together as you

0:40:20.360 --> 0:40:24.200
<v Speaker 3>are running a company. I think this theme around kindness

0:40:24.239 --> 0:40:28.120
<v Speaker 3>and empathy as someone who is observing what's coming out

0:40:28.160 --> 0:40:31.200
<v Speaker 3>from the publishing world and the thought leadership world, there's

0:40:31.200 --> 0:40:34.920
<v Speaker 3>a growing momentum. This is not a new territory foreclaud

0:40:35.160 --> 0:40:38.600
<v Speaker 3>but I'm hopeful that her philosophies are going to sort

0:40:38.640 --> 0:40:41.719
<v Speaker 3>of catch a tailwind in this moment. There's definitely a

0:40:41.760 --> 0:40:45.239
<v Speaker 3>lot of interest, and she coming at it from the

0:40:45.320 --> 0:40:48.279
<v Speaker 3>perspective of someone, as she described, who walks the walk,

0:40:48.320 --> 0:40:51.879
<v Speaker 3>who's living it. In addition, there are academics, there are

0:40:52.400 --> 0:40:56.839
<v Speaker 3>psychologists and scientists who can add to this and give

0:40:56.880 --> 0:40:59.680
<v Speaker 3>credibility to this. But I'm hopeful that it's just going

0:40:59.719 --> 0:41:00.359
<v Speaker 3>to be I'm a.

0:41:00.320 --> 0:41:03.239
<v Speaker 4>Bigger trend, and I think walking the Walk is so

0:41:03.320 --> 0:41:06.680
<v Speaker 4>important because she talked a lot about culture and the

0:41:06.719 --> 0:41:09.319
<v Speaker 4>fact that culture is created through consistency, and so it's

0:41:09.320 --> 0:41:12.239
<v Speaker 4>not like other companies can just hire a chief Heart

0:41:12.280 --> 0:41:16.319
<v Speaker 4>officer tomorrow and implement these kinds of things. It's a

0:41:16.320 --> 0:41:19.160
<v Speaker 4>culture that was created through consistency and was allowed to

0:41:19.200 --> 0:41:23.640
<v Speaker 4>grow and flourish with someone in leadership a position like Claude.

0:41:23.760 --> 0:41:28.759
<v Speaker 4>And I think that it's about the earnest cultivation of

0:41:28.840 --> 0:41:32.319
<v Speaker 4>this conversation about how we treat our employees and how

0:41:32.320 --> 0:41:34.879
<v Speaker 4>we treat our team members and how we think about

0:41:34.880 --> 0:41:37.040
<v Speaker 4>the people around us, and can grow that in a

0:41:37.080 --> 0:41:39.080
<v Speaker 4>company so it becomes part of their core.

0:41:39.400 --> 0:41:43.319
<v Speaker 3>I also think it's important her background. It wasn't like

0:41:43.400 --> 0:41:45.680
<v Speaker 3>she always knew right that this was going to be

0:41:45.800 --> 0:41:48.600
<v Speaker 3>her role. And she was very candid and said I

0:41:48.760 --> 0:41:52.440
<v Speaker 3>didn't know what was going to happen chief Heart officer aside,

0:41:52.440 --> 0:41:54.160
<v Speaker 3>like I didn't even know what was going to be

0:41:54.239 --> 0:41:55.960
<v Speaker 3>there for me or what I was aspiring to. And

0:41:56.000 --> 0:41:58.879
<v Speaker 3>I kind of love that she was open about that.

0:41:59.040 --> 0:42:01.080
<v Speaker 3>It's a lesson for the those of us who feel

0:42:01.120 --> 0:42:03.799
<v Speaker 3>a little like we're still trying to figure things out,

0:42:03.880 --> 0:42:06.920
<v Speaker 3>we're getting afraid, we're getting nervous, we're getting impatient with

0:42:06.960 --> 0:42:10.840
<v Speaker 3>ourselves that things take time to unfold. You need that

0:42:10.920 --> 0:42:13.640
<v Speaker 3>time for reflection. But she didn't waste time either, right,

0:42:13.719 --> 0:42:17.200
<v Speaker 3>She really invested in her learning. She invested in her experiences,

0:42:17.400 --> 0:42:21.880
<v Speaker 3>travel education. I think that was really important that I

0:42:21.920 --> 0:42:24.400
<v Speaker 3>don't think was just of her time. You know, we

0:42:24.440 --> 0:42:27.200
<v Speaker 3>didn't just do that twenty years ago to figure things out.

0:42:27.200 --> 0:42:30.239
<v Speaker 3>I think that it's still very much applicable today, that

0:42:30.320 --> 0:42:33.359
<v Speaker 3>there is value in slowing your role a little bit

0:42:33.760 --> 0:42:37.120
<v Speaker 3>and investing in yourself and in your community to get

0:42:37.160 --> 0:42:39.600
<v Speaker 3>to where you want to be. Absolutely, it's not a race.

0:42:39.640 --> 0:42:42.160
<v Speaker 3>It's not a rat race, and if you do think

0:42:42.160 --> 0:42:45.120
<v Speaker 3>that way, it's just a race to the bottom, often.

0:42:45.040 --> 0:42:47.239
<v Speaker 4>Completely and I think that shows in the success of

0:42:47.680 --> 0:42:50.400
<v Speaker 4>her work as the chief Heart Officer over there.

0:42:50.719 --> 0:42:52.879
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, audience in fact check us. Are there any other

0:42:52.960 --> 0:42:56.240
<v Speaker 3>Chief Heart officers in companies, at least in the US.

0:42:56.440 --> 0:42:58.440
<v Speaker 3>I don't know. Maybe they're called something different.

0:42:58.640 --> 0:42:59.879
<v Speaker 4>Send them in we'll find out.

0:43:00.160 --> 0:43:02.520
<v Speaker 3>Let us know. Thanks Ryan, that's fun.

0:43:02.680 --> 0:43:03.600
<v Speaker 4>This is a great time.

0:43:05.640 --> 0:43:08.040
<v Speaker 3>Well listeners, I hope you enjoyed this episode as much

0:43:08.040 --> 0:43:10.120
<v Speaker 3>as we did. If you like what you're hearing, please

0:43:10.160 --> 0:43:12.279
<v Speaker 3>follow and subscribes you don't miss out on any new

0:43:12.320 --> 0:43:14.880
<v Speaker 3>episodes and As always, we want to hear your thoughts

0:43:14.880 --> 0:43:17.640
<v Speaker 3>to make this the best show possible, so please leave

0:43:17.719 --> 0:43:19.759
<v Speaker 3>us a review. In the meantime, you can find me

0:43:19.880 --> 0:43:23.080
<v Speaker 3>at Farnoosh Charabi on Instagram and I'm always on the

0:43:23.080 --> 0:43:27.040
<v Speaker 3>So Money podcast. I'll see you next time. This podcast

0:43:27.080 --> 0:43:31.160
<v Speaker 3>is a production of iHeartRadio's Ruby Studio. Our executive producer

0:43:31.239 --> 0:43:34.800
<v Speaker 3>is Matt Stillo and our supervising producer is Nikiah Swinton.

0:43:35.120 --> 0:43:37.560
<v Speaker 3>This podcast was edited by Sierra Spreen.