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Speaker 1: A high profile Texas attorney in hot Water accused of

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Speaker 1: sneaking an abortion medication into his wife's water for weeks.

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Speaker 1: But why because he's having an affair and he didn't

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Speaker 1: want to quote, look like a jerk. Guess what, You

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Speaker 1: look like a jerk and you're gonna go to jail.

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Speaker 1: I mean, see, Grace, this is Crime Stories. Thank you

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Speaker 1: for being with us here at Fox Nation and Serious

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Speaker 1: N one eleven letting those words just so Ken, a

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Speaker 1: lawyer obviously knows better, sneaks abortion inducing drugs into his

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Speaker 1: wife's at beverages for weeks? Why because he is having

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Speaker 1: a sex affair and he didn't want to look like

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Speaker 1: a jerk to his girlfriend, to his mistress by leaving

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Speaker 1: his wife when she's pregnant. Guys, let's just kick it

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Speaker 1: off with this from our friends at Crime Online. Mason

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Speaker 1: Herring and his wife Katherine seemed to have it all.

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Speaker 1: Mason Herring, thirty eight, is the founder and managing partner

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Speaker 1: of Herring Law Firm, which specializes in oil rig litigation.

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Speaker 1: Katherine Herring, also thirty eight, is an artist and founder

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Speaker 1: of the online shop Old Southern Charm. The couple have

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Speaker 1: two children, but Katherine Herring suspects that her husband is

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Speaker 1: lying about where he's going and what he's doing. Katherine

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Speaker 1: believes Mason is continuing an affair with a woman who

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Speaker 1: had worked for him. Trying to reconcile, the couple begin

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Speaker 1: going to marriage therapy, and that's where Mason Herring learns

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Speaker 1: he will be a father for the third time. Okay,

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Speaker 1: before I go any further, let me just go straight

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Speaker 1: out to doctor Angela Arnold, renowned psychiatrists joining us from

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Speaker 1: the Atlanta Juristic, and she's at angela Arnold MD dot com.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Angie, Is it true that even after your spouse

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Speaker 1: cheats like h E double L have sex like a

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Speaker 1: bunny everywhere he can, people actually work through that and

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Speaker 1: they stay together. It's very rare, Nancy. So is that

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Speaker 1: a yes? People actually work through it and stay together.

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Speaker 1: It's barely a yes, Nancy. It's barely a yes. Is

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Speaker 1: it a yes or a no? Do people stay in

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Speaker 1: it even when the others cheated? I don't mean just once.

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Speaker 1: I mean like bunny's breeding in the backyard. It's very unlikely, Nancy.

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Speaker 1: Can't believe they even went to therapy. Okay, let's just

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Speaker 1: start it right there. Nancy, the therapy is a rusee

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Speaker 1: usually a ruse for what it's a rude to buy

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Speaker 1: him a little tom. He thinks he's going to get

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Speaker 1: away with that. I was like those people that claim

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Speaker 1: they are sex addicts in what way? Nancy? Well, I

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Speaker 1: mean every time a Hollywood start gets busted at something,

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Speaker 1: they claim busted cheating, they claim their sex addict, and

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Speaker 1: they go into therapy, then they get out, then they

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Speaker 1: do it again. Right, everybody has to put a name

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Speaker 1: on everything, don't they. Well, I guess they do it

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Speaker 1: because they want to. Does that equal being an addict? Yes? Okay,

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Speaker 1: So if I just misbehave because I want to, that

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Speaker 1: means I'm an addict. Well, it depends on how much

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Speaker 1: you misbehave everything. Everything's sort of on a continuum, Nancy. Okay, Well,

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Speaker 1: he is definitely at one far end of the spectrum

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Speaker 1: here because not only is he having an affair, he

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Speaker 1: says he's going to stop the affair, but the wife

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Speaker 1: thinks he does it, you know. To Daryl Cohen joining me,

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Speaker 1: a high profile lawyer out of the Atlanta jurisdiction as well,

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Speaker 1: former prosecutor, felony prosecutor, now defense attorney, Daryl Cohen. Did

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Speaker 1: you hear that he is into oil rig litigation? You know, law,

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Speaker 1: any type of law, can be very, very challenging. That's

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Speaker 1: why they make movies about law school. It's really hard.

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Speaker 1: But the people that specialize that, for instance, oil and

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Speaker 1: gas rights, water rights. But I've always been intrigued by

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Speaker 1: people that specialize in oil and gas rights. That's very

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Speaker 1: complicated law. You know that, right, Well, Nancy is complicated.

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Speaker 1: But the problem with him is I suspect as he

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Speaker 1: thinks he's so bright that he forgets the little things

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Speaker 1: like it's against the law. Hey, why would I be

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Speaker 1: separated from my wife? Oh? I am having an affair? Oh,

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Speaker 1: I got it. But it's okay, it's me because it's

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Speaker 1: all about me, and I can't like a jerk to

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Speaker 1: my girlfriend who I shouldn't be seeing. Okay, I just

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Speaker 1: said all of that. I asked you about oil rig litigation,

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Speaker 1: how difficult it was? Yeah, well it is difficult, and

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Speaker 1: then you go off and you're everything I said in

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Speaker 1: the open. Well I did that, Nancy, because your new

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Speaker 1: nickname Darryl ec Cohen Echo Chamber. What I'm asking about

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Speaker 1: is how difficult is the oil and gas litigation. The

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Speaker 1: oil rig litigation is really complicated. It's very complicated, and

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Speaker 1: it's so specialized. There are very few lawyers that engage

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Speaker 1: in oil and gas litigation because it is so specialized.

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Speaker 1: In in order to develop that specialty, you have to

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Speaker 1: develop an expertise and at the same time also obtain

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Speaker 1: the clients. We're going to pay you as you continue

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Speaker 1: to develop your expertise, like five hundred two thousand dollars

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Speaker 1: in hours what we're talking about. But you know what, Daryl,

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Speaker 1: I'm going to go to doctor Moroney on this as well.

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Speaker 1: Darryl Cohen. It's just like you know, a will and

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Speaker 1: probate lawyer or oil rig lawyer. They could not go

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Speaker 1: into court and try a murder case. So they may

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Speaker 1: think that's complicated. But to me, when I hear somebody

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Speaker 1: is an oil regul litigation, you got to really know

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Speaker 1: your stuff to go. You can't fake your way through that.

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Speaker 1: It's incredibly complex. My point is this guy's got to

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Speaker 1: be super smart. Hey, doctor Moroney with me, and I'm

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Speaker 1: going to go off point here. Doctor Moroney, longtime colleague

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Speaker 1: and friend, Renowned chief medical examiner in Bay County, Michigan,

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Speaker 1: author of American Narken and you can find at Recovery

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Speaker 1: Pathways LLC dot com. But this guy, doctor Moroney, my friend,

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Speaker 1: believes so much in helping others and healing the sick.

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Speaker 1: He has created in Man's a mobile unit to help

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Speaker 1: people that are addicted to drugs and save their lives.

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Speaker 1: I just wanted to tell you that about him, doctor Moroney.

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Speaker 1: My question to you, as I'm sure being a medical doctor,

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Speaker 1: you fraternize with a lot of other doctors, and the

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Speaker 1: rest of the world looks that doctors as being almost omniscient.

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Speaker 1: They know everything and they're super brilliant. Same thing here.

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Speaker 1: Do you see doctors that are so smart and so

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Speaker 1: accomplished shading and running around and just doing the most

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Speaker 1: stupid things all the time. They have too much money,

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Speaker 1: their egos get in the way, and whether it's a

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Speaker 1: doctor or a lawyer, they think they can get excused

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Speaker 1: with bad behavior, and that marital counseling is very specific.

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Speaker 1: Doctors and lawyers they think if they can medicalize deviance,

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Speaker 1: they're a medicalization of deviance, then they're not doing something

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Speaker 1: that's like really wrong clinically. Maybe they're depressed and there's

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Speaker 1: an outlet there they're looking for something. The medicalization of

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Speaker 1: deviance has been rolling out in American culture for the

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Speaker 1: last thirty forty years, trying to expose somewhat bad behavior

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Speaker 1: is not that bad. If you can medicalize, you may

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Speaker 1: know when you're saying. I'm just sitting here trying to

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Speaker 1: figure this out, and with all my degrees, it took

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Speaker 1: me a minute to figure out what you're saying. You're

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Speaker 1: saying medicalizing deviant behavior. Is that what he just said? Okay,

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Speaker 1: now let me translate, let me dumb me down. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so even I can understand it. You're saying that people's

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Speaker 1: bad behavior is given a diagnosis, like sex addiction, so

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Speaker 1: that somehow goes, oh, it's not their fault, right, Is

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Speaker 1: that what you're saying? Yeah, because okay, I got you.

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Speaker 1: You treat sex addiction with counseling, and then you and

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Speaker 1: then you're supposed to get better. What we what we

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Speaker 1: want to do with addiction, whether it's a sex addiction

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Speaker 1: or anything else. It's trying to look at a medical model.

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Speaker 1: It's not to help people, but other people use that

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Speaker 1: medical model to explain how they made bad decisions. Okay,

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Speaker 1: you know what my husband could explain to all he

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Speaker 1: wanted to, but it'd be over because you know what, Maroni,

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Speaker 1: You've known me long before I got married and had

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Speaker 1: the children. And now I've got him, and I can

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Speaker 1: tell you this much, it will be a cold day

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Speaker 1: in h E double l that I missed this up

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Speaker 1: because I had the jackpot, I've got the twins. I've

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Speaker 1: got a husband. He's fairly smart, and he has full

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Speaker 1: insurance and all of his teeth. I mean, he's I

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Speaker 1: got it, okay, and I Am not gonna go cheat

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Speaker 1: with somebody and lose all that, no way. And he's

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Speaker 1: tall and handsome, you know I think he is. And

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Speaker 1: another thing, he puts up with my mother who lives

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Speaker 1: with us, Okay, which was all my idea. But my

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Speaker 1: point is, I'm working up to a point. Dander Angie Arnold.

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Speaker 1: Here's this guy, a lawyer, an old oil rig litigation lawyer,

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Speaker 1: so smart, all that money, beautiful, Why she's pregnant and

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Speaker 1: what does he do? He cheats? Do cheaters ever think, wow,

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Speaker 1: if I got taught, I'm gonna lose everything? Or do

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Speaker 1: they just follow their pepe wherever it leads them. They don't.

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Speaker 1: They don't think that, Nancy, because they're the severest of

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Speaker 1: narcissists and they need cuttstant they need cut stant input

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Speaker 1: from other people. So the fact that she has two

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Speaker 1: children and she's gotten pregnant with the third means that

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Speaker 1: she's not paying as much attention to him as he

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Speaker 1: think as he thinks he requires. Wow, can you imagine

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Speaker 1: that taking care of a home and a family and working,

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Speaker 1: and you don't have enough time for your husband. Plus

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Speaker 1: she's pregnant and Nancy, they don't look, why does he

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Speaker 1: think you should have all that time? She's obviously doing

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Speaker 1: the yeoman share of work. I mean, somebody battened their

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Speaker 1: eyes at him because they knew how much money he was.

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Speaker 1: Don't tell a man the woman only wants him for

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Speaker 1: his money. Do not do that? Well, I would never

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Speaker 1: tell Darryl Cohen that in no way. Ego crime stories

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Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. Okay, back to this woman, you know, moroney,

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Speaker 1: I don't know why you got off on this topic,

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Speaker 1: but I want to get back to this woman. Katherine

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Speaker 1: Herring and this husband, the lawyer, Mason Herring, take a

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Speaker 1: list of our friends a crime online. At their counselor's suggestion,

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Speaker 1: Mason and Katherine Herring spend Spring break with their children

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Speaker 1: in West Texas. Mason Herring reportedly takes an interest in

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Speaker 1: his wife's nutrition, encouraging her to stay hydrated. Telling Katherine

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Speaker 1: she needs to drink more. Herring brings her water. Just

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Speaker 1: thirty minutes later, Katherine becomes very ill with diarrhea and crimp.

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Speaker 1: Within hours, she is severely bleeding. At a local hospital,

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Speaker 1: she provides a urine sample that is nearly black in color. Okay,

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Speaker 1: urine that is black in color. Doctor William Maroney joining me,

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Speaker 1: chief medical examiner, Please do not start using Latin terms

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Speaker 1: or medical terms. Okay, and tell me anybody's urine would

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Speaker 1: be black. Her urine's black because she's bleeding internally and

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Speaker 1: the blood is oxidizing. You said oxidizing. Okay, Oh, I'm sorry,

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Speaker 1: it's getting urine. Yes. Because one of the effects of

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Speaker 1: minds of Prospal, this abortion drug that they're using, is

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Speaker 1: it creates cramping, cramping in the kidneys, cramping in the bowels, cramping, spasms.

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Speaker 1: That's one of the reasons why she went to the

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Speaker 1: hospital bleeding and with diarrhea, because the drug causes cramping,

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Speaker 1: so that cramping in the kidney's squeezing, squeezing down is

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Speaker 1: squeezing blood into the urine, and that's causing her diarrhea.

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Speaker 1: And that's how this works in an abortive patient way.

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Speaker 1: It causes cramping in the uterus and dilation of the

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Speaker 1: cervix and gravity and cramping then past the fetus. And

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Speaker 1: that's how it works. You know, doctor Moroney, I would

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Speaker 1: put you on the witness stand in a New York

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Speaker 1: minute because when you were describing that, and you were

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Speaker 1: saying squeezing, squeezing, I thought, Jackie here in the studio,

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Speaker 1: I mean, her face contorted in a way I've never

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Speaker 1: seen when you were describing why this woman's urine was black.

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Speaker 1: So she takes a sip of water that the lawyer

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Speaker 1: husband gives her and immediately thirty minutes horrible, horrible cramps, diarrhea,

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Speaker 1: and she urinates urine black in color. Well that's not all.

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Speaker 1: First of all, why see he's so interested in her hydration? Okay,

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Speaker 1: right there, that's a red flag to me. But that said,

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Speaker 1: maybe other people couples are interested in each other's hydration.

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Speaker 1: We don't really talk about it very much in our home,

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Speaker 1: but take a listen to this. Back at home, Mason

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Speaker 1: Herring's attentiveness continues. One day, Mason stops by the home

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Speaker 1: to bring Katherine breakfast in bed and offers her some water.

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Speaker 1: Katherine Herring thought it was odd that the water was cloudy,

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Speaker 1: but Mason allegedly tells her that the discoloration is a

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Speaker 1: result of the cup of water or pipes being dirty.

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Speaker 1: Katherine again becomes severely ill, experiencing cramps and bleeding, again,

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Speaker 1: ending up in the hospital, but doctors could not figure

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Speaker 1: out what was wrong. Katherine Herring becomes suspicious, refusing other drinks,

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Speaker 1: including a bottle of orange juice with a broken seal.

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Speaker 1: According to published reports, Matt Crime online dot Com investigative reporter,

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Speaker 1: let me understand this. He keeps bring bringing her cloudy

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Speaker 1: water and blames it on bad pipes. Why would she

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Speaker 1: drink it anyway? Why would you give your pregnant wife

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Speaker 1: dirty water to drink? I mean that was the very

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Speaker 1: first time. So when you realize that he is actually

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Speaker 1: doing what the marriage counselors suggested, he's being attentive. He's

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Speaker 1: bringing her some water. Now, this is the first time, okay,

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Speaker 1: and he has a legitimate Maybe the cup's dirty, maybe

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Speaker 1: the pist of dirty. You know she grants it. Wait

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Speaker 1: a minute, Dave Mac, you know your wife seems like

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Speaker 1: a wonderful person. I find it really hard to believe

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Speaker 1: that if you took her glass of water that was dirty,

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Speaker 1: that she just drink it. I'd say, you go take

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Speaker 1: that wash to glass or just bring me another glass.

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Speaker 1: You know what, forget it, bring me a bottle of water.

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Speaker 1: I brought her cloudy water. She throws the water in

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Speaker 1: the cup at me and made me go back and

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Speaker 1: do it again exactly, you know. Yeah. Justin Boordman is

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Speaker 1: with us former Specialvictims Unit detective in West Valley, Utah,

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Speaker 1: author I Was Wrong, Investigator's Battlecry for Change and the

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Speaker 1: Special Victims Unit, and you can find him at Justin

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Speaker 1: Bourman dot com. Justin thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 1: Have you noticed in all of your work that so

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Speaker 1: often crime victims have a relationship, a trusting and they

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Speaker 1: think loving relationship with the perpetrator. Yeah, they do have

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Speaker 1: this kind of relationship with the offender, in this case

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Speaker 1: their husband. It gets back to a lot of psychology.

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Speaker 1: But what you can tell with this person is we

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Speaker 1: can break it down and feel back the onion. It

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Speaker 1: gets down to power and control, and he has so

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Speaker 1: much confidence in his power and control that he will

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Speaker 1: give her a cloudy glass of water. He's not thinking

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Speaker 1: about this crime very well. I mean really want to

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Speaker 1: cover that up with some sort of colored, just clear water.

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Speaker 1: He's just very narcissistic. He can he's not afraid of

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Speaker 1: any of these of himself getting caught. He was extremely

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Speaker 1: stupid through this whole entire thing, which luckily enough, most

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Speaker 1: criminals are, and they make a lot of mistakes. But yes,

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Speaker 1: love and danger can coexist, and you can look through

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Speaker 1: their history. They're already having problems. He's controlling or even

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Speaker 1: having sex while he's having sex with somebody else and

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Speaker 1: they are trying to work on their marriage and impregnacer,

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Speaker 1: and they goes back to not wanting to look like

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Speaker 1: a jerk in front of his girlfriend. Guys, so far,

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Speaker 1: we've had orange juice that were that was suspicious. We

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Speaker 1: have had water that was suspicious. Take a listen to this.

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Speaker 1: Take it back to be rate. When the couple was

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Speaker 1: separated and it came out that she was pregnant with

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Speaker 1: his child, that wasn't well received by him. From there,

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Speaker 1: Hearing's wife recalled several instances when he provided her with

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Speaker 1: glasses of water that appeared suspicious. The first time, she

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Speaker 1: became violently ill after drinking it and went to the hospital.

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Speaker 1: You were hearing our friends at Katie r K. So

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Speaker 1: she becomes so suspicious she invites friends over as witnesses.

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Speaker 1: You know what this reminds me of Daryl Cohen. It

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Speaker 1: reminds me of so many married women or women in

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Speaker 1: relationships that would actually tell their friends, if anything happens

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Speaker 1: to me, he did it. If anything happens to me,

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Speaker 1: the key to the house is in my secret compartment

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Speaker 1: and the back of my car. They know something, but

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Speaker 1: they don't know what they know. Have you ever encountered that? Oh? Absolutely, Nancy.

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Speaker 1: Look I tell my daughters keep your head on the swivel.

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Speaker 1: And that doesn't mean looking for the obvious physical threats.

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Speaker 1: It means look at people around you who may do

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Speaker 1: something other than just attack you physically, And in this case,

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Speaker 1: he attacked her with adulterated water, trying to have her

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Speaker 1: have an abortion. So yeah, I see it happen all

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Speaker 1: of the time. But what I don't understand, and because

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Speaker 1: I'm not a woman, I never will if I saw

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Speaker 1: this type of thing happening, get the heck away say goodbye,

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Speaker 1: be gone, be gone, focus pocus, you're out of here,

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Speaker 1: you know, doctor Angie Arnold. That's a really good point.

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Speaker 1: And I always think that people in this case, this

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Speaker 1: woman wants to believe and the fairy tale. They want

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Speaker 1: the Hallmark card, they want the happy family, the husband

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Speaker 1: to love her and be a great dad. They're invested

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Speaker 1: in it. She's been married for all these years, although

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Speaker 1: they're both fairly young. You already got two children, a

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Speaker 1: third on the way, and she wants it desperately, so

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Speaker 1: desperately that she doesn't want to see what's really happening. Nancy.

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Speaker 1: It happens all the time, and people are blinded by that.

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Speaker 1: And Nancy, I'm going to tell you it is so

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Speaker 1: hard to convince people. You and I can see it.

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Speaker 1: You and I could see that someone is dealing with

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Speaker 1: a narcissist, or there the victim of intimate partner violence,

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Speaker 1: which I have to wonder if there was something like

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Speaker 1: that going on. It's so very hard to talk about it.

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Speaker 1: And then the woman is even more vulnerable because now

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Speaker 1: she is pregnant again. And you know what, Nancy, let's

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Speaker 1: point out this fact. Does anybody know what The number

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Speaker 1: one killer of women who are pregnant to one year

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Speaker 1: postpartum is homicide. That is a scary spectic, isn't it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: a significant other Japan, it's always yeah, I intimate partners. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Is women are at a high risk before the pregnancy.

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Speaker 1: They're consumed with the hormones of pregnancy that make them

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Speaker 1: could care about the baby, think about themselves. But then

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Speaker 1: their risk with violent partners accelerates after the babies are

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Speaker 1: delivered because that it's almost three times normal in violent relationships,

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Speaker 1: and the hormones of pregnancy will actually affect the brain

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Speaker 1: and cause the pregnant patient to want to continue the

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Speaker 1: pregnancy and thoughts of the baby and things like that,

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Speaker 1: so they're not thinking about how evil or distracted this

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Speaker 1: other person is or how toxic they are, and they're

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Speaker 1: likely to be more forgiving. You know what, doctor Moroney,

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Speaker 1: You're really hitting the nail on the head here, because

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Speaker 1: she's the nailness pregnancy with two other children to take

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Speaker 1: care of, the husband's gone all the time, so it's

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Speaker 1: all on her. She may not have been thinking because

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Speaker 1: of what you're saying the hormonal issues, but what doctor

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Speaker 1: Angie is saying as well, She doesn't want to know

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Speaker 1: that anything's bad. She wants to believe desperately that everything's

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Speaker 1: going to quote be okay. But you're giving me a

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Speaker 1: physiological reason that she is not paying attention to other details.

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Speaker 1: But at some point she becomes so suspicious she invites

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Speaker 1: witnesses over take a listen to this. Catherine Herring sets

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Speaker 1: up a camera in the home. She also invites friends

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Speaker 1: over to be witnesses during Mason's visits. During this occasion,

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Speaker 1: Mason allegedly tries to give his wife a drink, even

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Speaker 1: though she already has two beverages. Catherine tells investigators that

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Speaker 1: she and her guests saw an unknown substance floating in

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Speaker 1: the drink given to her. Back to the home camera.

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Speaker 1: Two days later, surveillance video captures Mason pulling out a

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Speaker 1: ziplock from his pocket and mixing a powdered substance into

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Speaker 1: the glass of cranberry juice. Catherine Herring checks the garbage

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Speaker 1: kens and finds a pharmaceutical called Cyrix, which contains miss prostal.

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Speaker 1: Miss Prostal is a drug used to induce abortions. This

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Speaker 1: guy is really worried about her hydration. Did you hear

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Speaker 1: that she's got witnesses over and she has put in

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Speaker 1: a video recorder, and even though she already has two drinks,

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Speaker 1: he insists that she drinks some cranberry juice. You know,

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Speaker 1: you know what's interesting. Do you see Dave Mack how

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Speaker 1: he's switching ms in that he brought water and she

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Speaker 1: could look at it until it was cloudy. Then he

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Speaker 1: tried orange juice. Now he's trying cranberry juice. I guess

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Speaker 1: to cover up the taste of the drug. He's trying

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Speaker 1: to do everything he can to learn from his previous mistakes.

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Speaker 1: And the thing is, Nancy, I was looking this over

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Speaker 1: and wanted to ask you. It seemed to me based

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Speaker 1: on the fact that he tries to put it in

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Speaker 1: with the water, okay, and she catches out the cloudy water,

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Speaker 1: dirty last whatever it is. But it happened at a

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Speaker 1: time when their marriage counselor said, why don't you two

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Speaker 1: spend Spring break together with the kids and try to

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Speaker 1: work on things. And you know, he doesn't want to

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Speaker 1: be there. He's already mad she's pregnant because she told

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Speaker 1: him during a counseling session. So he picked this time

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Speaker 1: when everybody thinks we're Lovey Dovey getting back together to

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Speaker 1: try to poison her the first time. He realizes that

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Speaker 1: he gets busted. So now he's covering up from orange

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Speaker 1: juice to cranberry juice. But he does something else out

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Speaker 1: of character Nancy. He cleaned up after himself and threw

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Speaker 1: away what would be considered evidence to a police officer,

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Speaker 1: the stuff containing this mesa postoff, but it was out

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Speaker 1: of character his wife that he never cleaned up anything,

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Speaker 1: He didn't take the garbage out. Justin, boardman, did you

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Speaker 1: know what Dave Magus pointed out? Justin? Have you ever

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Speaker 1: noticed how often people become meat Nick's after they commit

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Speaker 1: a crime. You got Jodi Arius doing Travis Alexander's lot

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Speaker 1: after she stabs him to death in the fridge. You've

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Speaker 1: got Scott Peterson cleaning up the house after Lacy goes missing.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I could give you a million examples. Have

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Speaker 1: you When I see a guy start cleaning the house,

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Speaker 1: he did it right, absolutely, and you know, again it's

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Speaker 1: out of his character. Which she was smart enough to

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Speaker 1: get a camera out towards the bridge Can area and

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Speaker 1: see him take garbage from the truck, which you probably

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Speaker 1: rarely cleaned out and take that to the garbage can.

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Speaker 1: She's that she certainly outsmarted him in evidence gathering, catching

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Speaker 1: him empty in the garbage, caught you being good again

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Speaker 1: taking out the trash. But that's not the whole story.

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Speaker 1: Justin Boorman is right. Take a listen to McKay Hatfield

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Speaker 1: Katie r. K. It was later tested and a charging

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Speaker 1: document alleges that miso prostall, an abortion inducing drug, was

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Speaker 1: found in the water. The prosecutor says Herring's wife set

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Speaker 1: up cameras which led to more damning evidence. From the

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Speaker 1: camera inside the kitchen, you see him pull out a

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Speaker 1: powdered substance, make a drink and then mix the powder

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Speaker 1: into the drink. And then she obviously said that he

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Speaker 1: then brought her that drink. The woman turned the evidence

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Speaker 1: over to police, and Harring was soon after arrested in

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Speaker 1: the airport after returning from Las Vegas. This is the

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Speaker 1: first time I've seen something like this. Wow, the first

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Speaker 1: time that that type of behavior has been saying. Let's

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Speaker 1: go to doctor William Moroney, Chief medical Examiner. What is

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Speaker 1: miss a prostall or cyrix? What is that? It's like

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Speaker 1: a synthetic hormone and it worked by causing the uterus

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Speaker 1: to contract. The uterus contracts, the bowels contract, and it

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Speaker 1: restricts blood flow to the baby. That's so you restrict

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Speaker 1: blood flow to the placenta. You restrict blood flow to

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Speaker 1: the baby, and then you force the uter to contracts.

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Speaker 1: So that drives the medical processes to an abortion. And

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Speaker 1: if it happens what we actually use this right before

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Speaker 1: women go to the hospital, but then they don't progress.

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Speaker 1: So it's applied to sin the uterus and start contractions

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Speaker 1: to help. But while you're full and healthy and you're pregnant,

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Speaker 1: you're not supposed to take it. And when we give

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Speaker 1: this at the hospital, it's supervised. It's a certain milligram.

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Speaker 1: Nurses are watching you. You have baby monitors, you have

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Speaker 1: a contractile monitor monitoring everything else. And if you begin

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Speaker 1: to tract too much contraction, then we take you to

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Speaker 1: sin there insection so in a healthy way, just for

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Speaker 1: a few minutes the day you're supposed to deliver, this

424
00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:56,560
Speaker 1: medicine helps you deliver vaginally. Can I say a giant

425
00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:02,120
Speaker 1: on the radio? Yeah? But you you so it's helpful

426
00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 1: and we apply it to the cervix and then you

427
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,959
Speaker 1: get a natural glimmery but if you take this before

428
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: you go into deliver it, it's damning and she could

429
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:16,959
Speaker 1: bleed to death. Guys, we're talking about a drug hidden

430
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:23,440
Speaker 1: in this woman's various beverages. It's called misoprostal or cyrex.

431
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:27,720
Speaker 1: And the kicker is he didn't try it just once.

432
00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:31,960
Speaker 1: Take a list now, france KTRK at least six times

433
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:34,440
Speaker 1: over the course of just over a month. The woman

434
00:28:34,440 --> 00:28:37,040
Speaker 1: says her husband brought her drinks that he encouraged her

435
00:28:37,040 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 1: to drink, gave her a bottle of orange juice, and

436
00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:42,880
Speaker 1: she observed that the seal of the bottle was broken.

437
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:46,600
Speaker 1: Surveillance cameras inside their home caught hearing putting a powdered

438
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 1: substance from a bag in his pocket into a drink

439
00:28:49,600 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 1: that he gave her. According to the prosecutor, she also

440
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 1: found opened blister packs that contained Cyrex, the Mexican pharmaceutical

441
00:28:57,240 --> 00:29:01,360
Speaker 1: that contains the drug misoprostal, in their trash. Yeah, sir,

442
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: the defendant cleaned out his truck and took the trash

443
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: out to the curb. She stated this was out of

444
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 1: character for the defendant and she does not do chores

445
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: around the house. Oh yeah, he started. He turned into

446
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:30,800
Speaker 1: a neat knick suddenly, and that raised her suspicion. Time

447
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:37,600
Speaker 1: stories with Nancy Grace. It's not the first time a

448
00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: husband has tried to poison his wife around the time

449
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:44,760
Speaker 1: of pregnancy. Take a little to our friend Karen Drew Wdvy.

450
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 1: When do you start thinking about her breast milk and

451
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:50,160
Speaker 1: how that can come to play in solving her murder.

452
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 1: Being a mom who breastfed, it came to my mind

453
00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 1: within a couple of days, and I know how breastmilk works,

454
00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: so it would be in there. Arnold says. The family

455
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:04,920
Speaker 1: told police about having Christie's breast milk and asking it

456
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:07,520
Speaker 1: to be tested. She had a small house, she had

457
00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:10,640
Speaker 1: a small freezer. She kept backups at her parents' house

458
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:14,720
Speaker 1: and at her uncle's house. Five years would pass. Then recently,

459
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:19,080
Speaker 1: the Genesee County Prosecutor announced charges against Jason Harris for

460
00:30:19,280 --> 00:30:23,560
Speaker 1: murdering his wife. We believe he put heroine into her

461
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 1: cereal and milk the night that she died. In that case,

462
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:32,080
Speaker 1: Christie Harris died of a heroine overdose and it was

463
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 1: deemed an accidental overdose. Now this is while she was

464
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:39,520
Speaker 1: breastfeeding her new baby. The inflam was just weeks old.

465
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:44,640
Speaker 1: Her sisters. Christie's sisters could not believe that she a

466
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:51,760
Speaker 1: used drugs and bodd just impossible. Years pass. They know

467
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,520
Speaker 1: the husband did this to her, but they can't prove it.

468
00:30:54,560 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: And they remember her breast milk that she had saved

469
00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:02,280
Speaker 1: was still in a fridge. They have the breast milk,

470
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:07,040
Speaker 1: they analyze it and proved that she had not been

471
00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:10,239
Speaker 1: using drugs, that she was poison at the time of

472
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:15,120
Speaker 1: her death. So to you, doctor Moroney, how could heroin

473
00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:19,160
Speaker 1: kill you? How does an od work with heroine? Opiates

474
00:31:19,200 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 1: at a high dose are a very simple, fast death.

475
00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:29,720
Speaker 1: It tells the brain to stop breathing. All drug overdoses

476
00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:35,240
Speaker 1: have a specific action, but heroin or opioid pharmaceuticals are

477
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: very simple. They go to a certain place in the

478
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:43,320
Speaker 1: brain and they say stop breathing. And there's absolutely no

479
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:46,680
Speaker 1: way you should be exposed to heroine. If you're a

480
00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:50,240
Speaker 1: normal person at home and you have babies, you have

481
00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:55,440
Speaker 1: a job, you're breastfeeding, that just doesn't happen. That was

482
00:31:55,480 --> 00:32:00,440
Speaker 1: an excellent example of forensic medicine and heroin overdose. From

483
00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:04,719
Speaker 1: the fast you go down fast. He stopped breathing really

484
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:07,800
Speaker 1: fast when they found her, Doctor Moroney, she was already

485
00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:10,480
Speaker 1: cold to the touch. A neighbor looked in the window

486
00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:13,400
Speaker 1: and saw her lying in bed, thought she was asleep.

487
00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 1: Several hours pass they go back, She's still there. That's

488
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:22,240
Speaker 1: when they find out mommy is dead. Here is another

489
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:26,920
Speaker 1: example where the spouse was smart enough to use a

490
00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:30,720
Speaker 1: video cam now a way to hear our cuts nine

491
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:36,160
Speaker 1: and ten our friends at ABC radiologists. Jack Chen says

492
00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 1: he noticed a chemical taste in his drinks in March,

493
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 1: he set up a hidden camera in their kitchen, capturing

494
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:46,160
Speaker 1: video evidence of his wife you you allegedly taking draino

495
00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:49,200
Speaker 1: from under the sink and pouring it into his lemonade

496
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:53,520
Speaker 1: in three separate instances. In July, a doctor diagnosed Chen

497
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 1: with two stomachless gastritis esophagus inflammation. These surveillance images show

498
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:02,640
Speaker 1: the moments of California man says he was secretly poisoned

499
00:33:02,640 --> 00:33:05,720
Speaker 1: by his wife. The images part of a restraining order

500
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:09,000
Speaker 1: filing by doctor Jack Chen against his wife of ten years,

501
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:12,200
Speaker 1: doctor Emily Yu. This poisoning occurred over a period of

502
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:15,280
Speaker 1: time that caused him, in part, to suspect his wife

503
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:19,760
Speaker 1: was poisoning him, and so he placed surreptitious recording devices

504
00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:23,080
Speaker 1: in the homy. The forty five year old dermatologist was

505
00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 1: placed under arrest and later released on thirty thousand dollars bail. Yeah,

506
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: I find it really interesting. Doctor Angie Arnold, psychiatra, was

507
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:35,440
Speaker 1: joining us from Atlanta that the spouse is so suspicious

508
00:33:35,760 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 1: they actually put in a recording video device to prove

509
00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:44,160
Speaker 1: what they know inside is the truth. Well, they also know,

510
00:33:44,320 --> 00:33:46,680
Speaker 1: Nancy that they had to get hard evidence to prove it.

511
00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:50,360
Speaker 1: Who's going to believe that it's so unbelievable that someone

512
00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:53,600
Speaker 1: would kill their wife this way, isn't it? In this case,

513
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 1: it was a female doctor poisoning her husband, doctor with

514
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:05,720
Speaker 1: draino and he catches on video Doctor Moroni her the

515
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 1: wife with a big bottle and it says draino on

516
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: the front of it, pouring it into his drink. He

517
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,920
Speaker 1: had some kind of a morning concoction that he would drink.

518
00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:18,279
Speaker 1: She was pouring it right in there. He had the

519
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 1: camera under the sink. Yeah, it was like six inches

520
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:24,839
Speaker 1: away from the drain and she would reach in there.

521
00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 1: It was time and date stamped. I remember this. He

522
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:30,160
Speaker 1: had dual cameras. The one in the cabinet where you

523
00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:32,160
Speaker 1: see your hand come in there and get the drain Oh.

524
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,000
Speaker 1: And then the other camera was a long shot of

525
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:38,000
Speaker 1: her pouring it in the drink. And he went to

526
00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:42,719
Speaker 1: the doctor and his inside were totally torn up. Doctor Moroni, Yeah,

527
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:46,200
Speaker 1: drain ol will eat you away like acid. It's lie

528
00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:50,320
Speaker 1: and it'll look like you're having a natural stomach problem,

529
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:54,360
Speaker 1: a gastritis or anastophagitis that you would have from excess

530
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: of acid. But it eats you fast and then you

531
00:34:57,280 --> 00:35:01,480
Speaker 1: perforate and bleed and die. Just like that. That guy lived,

532
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:05,440
Speaker 1: He managed to live, and this video is supporting his case. Now.

533
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 1: Earlier we were talking about I think it was Daryl

534
00:35:07,680 --> 00:35:11,720
Speaker 1: Cohen brought up, but I think Justin Boorman said it too, Guys,

535
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:17,000
Speaker 1: the arrogance of the killer, the arrogance of the husband

536
00:35:17,040 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 1: trying to poison his wife to induce an abortion so

537
00:35:19,800 --> 00:35:22,839
Speaker 1: he wouldn't look like a quote jerk to his girlfriend

538
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 1: leaving his wife with a newborn baby. She's going to

539
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:29,920
Speaker 1: get rid of the baby and then leave her. Speaking

540
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:33,239
Speaker 1: of arrogance, the case I just told you about where

541
00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:37,360
Speaker 1: the female doctor poisons her husband. Doctor listened to the

542
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:40,200
Speaker 1: arrogance of this woman take a list of our cut

543
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:43,720
Speaker 1: twelve case al. When I was looking through the court papers.

544
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:46,600
Speaker 1: What it said was that at one point she called

545
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 1: her husband and asked if he would bail her out,

546
00:35:48,920 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 1: but he refused. The district attorney has not filed charges

547
00:35:53,160 --> 00:35:57,680
Speaker 1: against her yet. I also learned today that jack Chen's

548
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,920
Speaker 1: lawyer went to the jail when you was still in

549
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:05,520
Speaker 1: jail and presented her with this restraining order. She seemed

550
00:36:05,520 --> 00:36:08,160
Speaker 1: to be confused about all of it, and he said

551
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:11,480
Speaker 1: to her, well, you've been poisoning your husband. That's why

552
00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:15,959
Speaker 1: we're getting a restraining order. So she can't imagine DARIALD Cohen. Wow,

553
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 1: they're following in as training order against me. Does this

554
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:22,120
Speaker 1: mean I can't see my children? Why? And then calls

555
00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:24,879
Speaker 1: the husband she tried to poison did with Draino and

556
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,239
Speaker 1: ask him to post her bond. They need to have

557
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:29,920
Speaker 1: her picture beside the definition of arrogance in the dictionary,

558
00:36:30,080 --> 00:36:34,160
Speaker 1: it's arrogance. It's I am cool, It's all about me.

559
00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:37,200
Speaker 1: How could I possibly do that? I am a physician,

560
00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 1: you're a physician. It's strictly a mistake. Draino has nothing

561
00:36:42,080 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 1: to do with what was in your beverage. I mean, Nancy,

562
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,799
Speaker 1: this is what happens when people think they're above the

563
00:36:48,880 --> 00:36:52,920
Speaker 1: law and they know more than everyone else combined. That's

564
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:58,320
Speaker 1: why so many criminals are apprehended, prosecuted, and convicted because

565
00:36:58,320 --> 00:37:00,840
Speaker 1: they know more than all all of us, or at

566
00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:04,480
Speaker 1: least they think they do, Daryl Cohen and just In Boardman,

567
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,600
Speaker 1: Isn't that true in your experience working with so many

568
00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:11,320
Speaker 1: crime victims. Very often the defendant's caught because they're smarter

569
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,840
Speaker 1: than everybody in the room, or so they think. Correct.

570
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:17,440
Speaker 1: A lot of them do get caught and believe that

571
00:37:17,480 --> 00:37:20,760
Speaker 1: they are smarter than everyone in the room. And sadly,

572
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:25,600
Speaker 1: in my specialty on the sexual sault side, more suspects

573
00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:28,400
Speaker 1: do get away with that than do get caught. But

574
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 1: in domestic violence, on that pattern, they're going to keep

575
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:34,520
Speaker 1: on doing it and it's going to keep escalating until

576
00:37:34,520 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 1: they eventually kill. Well, I've got a news flash for everybody.

577
00:37:37,120 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 1: I'm running out of things to drink. Okay, there's water,

578
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:43,239
Speaker 1: there's orange juice, there's cranberry juice. There's my morning cocoction

579
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:45,279
Speaker 1: of whatever that doctor was drinking. All kinds of fruit

580
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,960
Speaker 1: juices and veggie juices put together. Now coffee's out. Take

581
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,239
Speaker 1: a listen Hour Cut thirteen my friend Jim Murray an

582
00:37:52,239 --> 00:37:55,560
Speaker 1: inside edition chilling video from a camera hidden in a

583
00:37:55,600 --> 00:38:00,160
Speaker 1: family's kitchen. It catches a husband poisoning his wife's coffee.

584
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:03,960
Speaker 1: Brian Kauzlowski put the equivalent of eight sleeping pills in

585
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:06,640
Speaker 1: the pot, swishing it around to make sure it was

586
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:09,800
Speaker 1: mixed in. The camera was placed there by his wife,

587
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:13,520
Speaker 1: who'd grown suspicious when she started feeling tired the days

588
00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 1: he made her coffee. The couple was divorcing but still

589
00:38:17,160 --> 00:38:20,440
Speaker 1: lived together. So Dave mac there is no shortage of

590
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:23,439
Speaker 1: spouses poisoning each other. It seems to be happening every

591
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:27,920
Speaker 1: other day. What's the status of this case against this lawyer,

592
00:38:28,000 --> 00:38:32,680
Speaker 1: this oil rig litigator, Mason Harring. Oh, believe it or not,

593
00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:34,960
Speaker 1: This one is new, okay, so it is still winding

594
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,280
Speaker 1: through the process. He will be in court day after tomorrow,

595
00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:43,279
Speaker 1: and I apologize. He'll be in court in the next

596
00:38:43,320 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 1: few days, and he's facing assaulting a pregnant person, assault

597
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:52,759
Speaker 1: forced induction to have an abortion. That second charge came

598
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:56,440
Speaker 1: into play based on what's happened in Texas with regard

599
00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:59,400
Speaker 1: to abortion. We're talking about a sentence of two to

600
00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:01,719
Speaker 1: ten years behind bars in a fine of about ten

601
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 1: grant two to ten And this is this could have

602
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:09,160
Speaker 1: killed her? Moroney, dodger, maroney. Couldn't this have killed her?

603
00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 1: This would have killed her by causing her to bleed

604
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 1: uncontrollably with overcontracted bowels and uterus. I think they should

605
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:21,640
Speaker 1: add an at Tipton murder charge to this. And wow,

606
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:25,319
Speaker 1: it looks like his plan to avoid looking like a

607
00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:29,960
Speaker 1: jerk didn't work out. I hope his girlfriend's drinking all

608
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 1: this in pardon the pun, we wait as justice and falls.

609
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:37,800
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace Crime Story, signing off, goodbye friend,