1 00:00:01,400 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: On this week's episode of Cultivating her Space. 2 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:07,960 Speaker 2: Remember, even if you are a therapist, it is not 3 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 2: your job to be the therapist for your friends and family. Hey, lady, 4 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:17,040 Speaker 2: have you ever felt like the world just doesn't get you? 5 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,000 Speaker 2: Well we do. 6 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:24,919 Speaker 1: Welcome to Cultivating her Space, the podcast dedicated to uplifting 7 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:26,600 Speaker 1: and empowering women like you. 8 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:33,600 Speaker 2: We're your hosts, doctor Dominique Brussard, and educator and psychologists. 9 00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 1: And Terry Lomax, a techie and transformational speaker. 10 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 2: Join us every week for authentic conversations about everything from 11 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 2: fibroids to fake friends as we create space for black 12 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:49,480 Speaker 2: women to just be. 13 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:51,560 Speaker 1: Before we dive in, make sure you hit that follow 14 00:00:51,560 --> 00:00:54,320 Speaker 1: button and leave us a quick five star review. Lady, 15 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: we are black founded and black owned, and your support 16 00:00:57,480 --> 00:00:59,639 Speaker 1: will help us reach even more women like you. 17 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 2: Now, let's get into this week's episode of Cultivating her Space. 18 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,200 Speaker 2: It's doctor Do'm here from the Cultivating her Space podcast. 19 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:14,080 Speaker 2: Are you currently a resident of the state of California 20 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:19,840 Speaker 2: and contemplating starting your therapy journey? Well, if so, please 21 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:23,759 Speaker 2: reach out to me at doctor Dominique Brusard dot com. 22 00:01:24,200 --> 00:01:29,080 Speaker 2: That's d R D O M I N I Q. 23 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,840 Speaker 2: U E b r O U S s ar d 24 00:01:34,440 --> 00:01:39,480 Speaker 2: dot com to schedule a free fifteen minute consultation. I 25 00:01:39,520 --> 00:01:44,480 Speaker 2: look forward to hearing from you, all right. Our quote 26 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:51,560 Speaker 2: of the day of love is you creating and keeping 27 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 2: healthy boundaries. And that quote comes to us from therapists 28 00:01:56,520 --> 00:02:00,000 Speaker 2: Nader twelve. I'm gonna say that quote one more time 29 00:02:00,360 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 2: for the folks in the back to make sure you 30 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 2: heard it and you really let this one think in 31 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:15,839 Speaker 2: heuff love is you creating and keeping healthy boundaries? 32 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:18,200 Speaker 1: All right? 33 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 2: So see when you hear that quote and you think 34 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 2: about our topic for today, what comes up for you? 35 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 1: Okay, So when I hear this quote, let me just 36 00:02:29,639 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: say this first, I agree with this quote wholeheartedly. I'm like, 37 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,560 Speaker 1: hands up, I'm clapping, I'm stomping. This is the quote. 38 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:41,359 Speaker 1: But thinking about what we're talking about today, it makes 39 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: me think about just my upbringing, and it's like boundaries. 40 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: What is a boundary? What you're setting a boundary? You're 41 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:49,960 Speaker 1: creating and keeping healthy boundaries? Like what is that? Why 42 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 1: are you doing that? That is not love? So that's 43 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:54,000 Speaker 1: what's coming up for me as far as what it 44 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:56,880 Speaker 1: means in the context of my past and what my 45 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 1: family may have thought about a boundary. If that makes sense. 46 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:07,040 Speaker 2: Yep, yep, it okay does for you, I think your 47 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 2: experience isn't that far off from what other people's experience 48 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 2: may be. And so for me, I think when I 49 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:23,240 Speaker 2: hear this quote, it's giving a more accurate definition on 50 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 2: what tough love looks like, right, because I think about 51 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:33,280 Speaker 2: how people have typically said tough love and may you, 52 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 2: and it's often used when you may be implementing something 53 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:47,960 Speaker 2: harsh or maybe even aggressive or very punitive and calling 54 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 2: it love. And for me, oftentimes those things that people 55 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 2: those behaviors, so usually I'm like, more specifically, what I'm 56 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:03,480 Speaker 2: actually thinking about is like corporal punishments, thanking, that's not 57 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:08,080 Speaker 2: tough love to me. In some instances that can actually 58 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 2: be abused, and so tough love is not about abuse. 59 00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 2: Tough love to me, this definition feels like, or this 60 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 2: quote feels like the definition of tough love is it's 61 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 2: when you're able to create and keep boundaries. Because we 62 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:38,040 Speaker 2: know that boundaries are for you and protecting your engagement 63 00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:42,039 Speaker 2: in relationships to other people, and that can be hard 64 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:44,320 Speaker 2: to do. Hence the word tough. 65 00:04:45,400 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 1: Hell, yes, it can, Oh my gosh, all right, well, 66 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 1: I guess it's time for us to dive into it. So, lady, 67 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:56,760 Speaker 1: if you've ever found yourself emotionally drained while trying to 68 00:04:56,800 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 1: support someone you love through a mental health challenge, this 69 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 1: episode is for you. 70 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:07,160 Speaker 2: Yes, And so today what we're talking about is something 71 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:12,560 Speaker 2: that doesn't often get discussed in our community, and it's 72 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:18,680 Speaker 2: what is it like to care for someone who's navigating 73 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:23,039 Speaker 2: a mental health challenge? And how do you show up 74 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:28,360 Speaker 2: for them without losing yourself in the process. 75 00:05:29,760 --> 00:05:32,760 Speaker 1: Oh, heavy on the losing yourself in the process, because 76 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 1: let's be real, lady, society has conditioned black women to 77 00:05:37,839 --> 00:05:43,240 Speaker 1: be righted, eyes, right strong, all the time caretakers. But 78 00:05:43,560 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 1: what happens when your cup is empty and you're still 79 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:48,840 Speaker 1: expected to pour? 80 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 2: Yes, that's a real question. That is a real question, 81 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:56,360 Speaker 2: and today we're going to talk about what that can 82 00:05:56,440 --> 00:06:01,920 Speaker 2: look like and also give you some tools on how 83 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:08,479 Speaker 2: to show up with love, care, compassion, and boundaries. So, 84 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:12,839 Speaker 2: whether it's your mama, your partner, or your best friend, 85 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:19,360 Speaker 2: mental health challenges we know don't only affect the person 86 00:06:19,440 --> 00:06:26,920 Speaker 2: who's experiencing them. It affects everyone around them. And before 87 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:30,080 Speaker 2: we go further into the conversation, I do want to 88 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:36,559 Speaker 2: put the caveat out there that in today's episode we're 89 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 2: talking about mental health challenges like anxiety, depression, bipolar disorder. 90 00:06:44,160 --> 00:06:46,279 Speaker 2: We can have a different episode. We will have a 91 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:52,080 Speaker 2: different episode where we speak specifically about neuro divergence or 92 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:57,360 Speaker 2: navigating mental health challenges with young children, because those things 93 00:06:57,400 --> 00:07:01,640 Speaker 2: are different and we want to ignite knowledge that. And 94 00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:06,800 Speaker 2: so let me just reiterate that this episode is about 95 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 2: supporting someone with anxiety, depression, bipolar and similar things. 96 00:07:16,040 --> 00:07:19,480 Speaker 1: Thank you for that distinction. I think that's super important. 97 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:22,640 Speaker 1: And I guess it might make sense to start with 98 00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:27,680 Speaker 1: caregiving first, right before we dive deeper into the conversation. 99 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: And don I just want to I want to ask 100 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:33,960 Speaker 1: you what why do you think caregiving is an important 101 00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 1: place to begin this conversation. So I'm sure there's some 102 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:39,320 Speaker 1: you know, backstory behind that. So what is the importance 103 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 1: of that, because I think many of us can relate 104 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 1: to that role. 105 00:07:43,480 --> 00:07:46,559 Speaker 2: Well, I think that is exactly that, right, is that 106 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 2: a lot of a lot of us And when I 107 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 2: say us, you know, I mean I'm speaking about Black 108 00:07:51,880 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 2: women often find ourselves in caregiving roles. And so whether 109 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:05,760 Speaker 2: that is like I mentioned, before your parents, your partner, 110 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 2: your friends, your children, your coworkers, your neighbors, your church members, 111 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 2: the lady in Learne at the grocery store. There are 112 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 2: lots of ways in which black women often find themselves 113 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 2: and spaces where people are leaning on them and expecting 114 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:35,080 Speaker 2: them to show up and take care of the situation, 115 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 2: to fix things right. And let's be honest, some of 116 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:49,520 Speaker 2: us thrive in that. Some of us think it out interesting. 117 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:55,800 Speaker 2: Now that's a whole different topic for another day. What 118 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:02,800 Speaker 2: I think that we are in this role over caregiver. 119 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 2: What that then means is that we are often the 120 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:12,000 Speaker 2: ones who are noticing the changes and who are expected 121 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 2: to address any issues that may come up. And so 122 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:24,640 Speaker 2: when it comes to understanding supporting someone who is navigating 123 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:29,319 Speaker 2: mental health challenges, if you're the caregiver, then that means 124 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:32,280 Speaker 2: you are the person who's noticing the changes that that person, 125 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:38,400 Speaker 2: that this person is experiencing. Yeah, and you may be 126 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:42,439 Speaker 2: tasked with addressing those changes. 127 00:09:43,240 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 1: Okay, So I think we need to dig a bit 128 00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:48,160 Speaker 1: deeper into this because as I heard, as I was 129 00:09:48,280 --> 00:09:50,839 Speaker 1: looking at the word caregiver, I'm thinking about both of 130 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 1: our experiences as like a perventified children. I'm thinking about 131 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 1: when I was raising my younger siblings and like taking 132 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 1: on that mother figure role. But I know we're not 133 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:03,040 Speaker 1: talking necessarily talking about caregiving in that sense, So it 134 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 1: sounds to me like caregiving here is like this unofficial 135 00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:12,400 Speaker 1: title that we get in I'm thinking about what it 136 00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:13,880 Speaker 1: looks like in action, and so I'm just going to 137 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: give an example, Dom and I'd love to hear your 138 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:20,840 Speaker 1: perspective on this, but I'm thinking about me growing up 139 00:10:20,880 --> 00:10:27,120 Speaker 1: in this very tense, toxic, unction dysfunctional environment where I 140 00:10:27,160 --> 00:10:32,080 Speaker 1: was definitely an observer. So I'm like, I'm peeping everyone's energy, 141 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:35,520 Speaker 1: the mood. I'm also the peacemaker, so I'm like figuring out, Okay, wait, 142 00:10:35,520 --> 00:10:37,160 Speaker 1: what's the mood? Like let me show up in this 143 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:39,319 Speaker 1: way because this is what the dynamic looks like, and 144 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:41,320 Speaker 1: I want to make it more comfortable. And I'm thinking 145 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:45,040 Speaker 1: about the relationship with my mom, in particular with a 146 00:10:45,120 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 1: very strong personality, someone who you know, was abusive when 147 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:54,719 Speaker 1: I was younger, and me navigating the I'm trying to 148 00:10:54,720 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 1: figure out even how to explain, and me navigating the 149 00:10:57,200 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: unexpected behaviors that she showed up with. That's what that's 150 00:11:01,080 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 1: what you were kind of referring to a scenario similar 151 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 1: to that. 152 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:08,200 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, and that and I think and thank you 153 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:12,280 Speaker 2: for providing that example because we can look like that, right. 154 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 2: And what I love about you sharing that example is 155 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,160 Speaker 2: that that is the example that go that might go unnoticed. 156 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:23,679 Speaker 2: We might not label them as being a caregiver in 157 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:31,520 Speaker 2: the traditional sense of caregiver, right, because another example of 158 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:38,080 Speaker 2: the more traditional sense of caregiver is someone who is 159 00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:43,520 Speaker 2: expected to, oh, who takes on the role of their 160 00:11:43,559 --> 00:11:52,560 Speaker 2: parent is aging or their parent is experiencing physical challenges, right. 161 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 2: And I'm intentional about using that word physical, right, because 162 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 2: I want to make the distinction here. And and so 163 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 2: that person then becomes the one who shows up to 164 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:09,360 Speaker 2: make sure that their parents takes care of all their 165 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:15,000 Speaker 2: is at their medical appointments, right, might work with them 166 00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:22,079 Speaker 2: on changing their living situation. And so they're tending to 167 00:12:22,120 --> 00:12:28,360 Speaker 2: the financial, the emotional, the physical needs of that aging parent. 168 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:31,840 Speaker 1: Yeah. 169 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:35,600 Speaker 2: And so that's so that caregiver role is one that 170 00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:41,680 Speaker 2: we are more easily able to identify. As such, the 171 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:47,360 Speaker 2: example that you gave is caregiving, but we might not 172 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:50,320 Speaker 2: label it in this We might not give it that 173 00:12:50,400 --> 00:12:52,240 Speaker 2: specific label, but it is the same. 174 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:55,240 Speaker 1: Okay, that's really important. I'm glad. I'm glad that you 175 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 1: said that because I think that I'm assuming lady, as 176 00:12:57,280 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 1: you listen to the episode, you're probably putting yourself in 177 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: a different box or multiple boxes based on how we're 178 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:06,920 Speaker 1: framing the definitions and the conversation. So should we talk 179 00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:10,200 Speaker 1: about signs that someone you love maybe dealing with the 180 00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 1: mental health challenge? 181 00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:15,480 Speaker 2: Yes? And I think it's important to talk about what 182 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:18,480 Speaker 2: it to be able to identify what it looks like. Yeah, 183 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:23,840 Speaker 2: because we can't get help if we don't know that 184 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:32,880 Speaker 2: help is needed. So quick, feel simple things, right, changes 185 00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 2: in communication or behavior, and I'll give I'll run through, 186 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 2: and then I'll come back with some examples. Right, So 187 00:13:38,800 --> 00:13:43,240 Speaker 2: changes in communication, our behavior, gifts in their daily functioning, 188 00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:49,960 Speaker 2: physical or emotional red flags. Those are usually like the 189 00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:56,360 Speaker 2: broad category, right, examples of changes in communicate in communication 190 00:13:56,520 --> 00:14:02,319 Speaker 2: or behavior, you notice that that person is withdrawing or 191 00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:07,040 Speaker 2: isolating themselves from the people that are around them. So 192 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 2: this person is usually ready to engage with everybody. Doesn't 193 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 2: mean that they're trying to have hours long conversation, but 194 00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:21,880 Speaker 2: they can readily engage. And now you see that they 195 00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:26,240 Speaker 2: like you're observing that they're not trying to even do 196 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 2: the basic engagement of oh, how is your day to day. 197 00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 2: Another sign of changes in communication is this person is 198 00:14:36,360 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 2: mapping or like having what feel like big emotional reactions 199 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:48,320 Speaker 2: to things that normally would not garner such a reaction, 200 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:56,360 Speaker 2: right or the opposite, that they all of a sudden 201 00:14:56,360 --> 00:15:02,320 Speaker 2: are silent. So things that typically might go oner some 202 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:09,120 Speaker 2: level of response, they're saying nothing about it. Words they 203 00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:13,200 Speaker 2: may use or phrases I'm tired of all of this. 204 00:15:14,520 --> 00:15:17,440 Speaker 2: It would be better if I weren't here, and we'll 205 00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 2: circle back to what you can do to phrases like that. 206 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:25,640 Speaker 2: But things like that, that's a change in communication or behavior. 207 00:15:25,640 --> 00:15:30,880 Speaker 2: That's something that you're noticing that they weren't doing before. 208 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:37,040 Speaker 2: Some of the shifts in their daily functioning. Their sleep 209 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 2: has changed, so either they're sleeping way too much or 210 00:15:42,320 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 2: way too little, and it's not related to a specific 211 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 2: change in overall circumstances. Right I think about right now 212 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:54,320 Speaker 2: at the time that we're recording this episode, it's the summer. 213 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:59,680 Speaker 2: Teenagers like to sleep a lot in the summer, especially 214 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:03,200 Speaker 2: when they don't have to beat up at like six 215 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:07,640 Speaker 2: or seven am. That in and of itself is not 216 00:16:07,680 --> 00:16:12,720 Speaker 2: a concern. But fast forward to we're in October and 217 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:20,360 Speaker 2: that teenager consistently leaps through their alarm, frequently late for 218 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 2: school because they have this need to fleep for ten 219 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:28,920 Speaker 2: or twelve hours. Or maybe it's the opposite. Maybe you 220 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:33,520 Speaker 2: notice someone who normally leaps seven to eight hours, all 221 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:35,720 Speaker 2: of a sudden sleeping only three or four hours. So 222 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:40,440 Speaker 2: you're noticing a change, right. They're no longer interested in 223 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 2: the things that they typically engage in, things that you 224 00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:47,600 Speaker 2: know they get excited about. They're no longer trying to 225 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:55,600 Speaker 2: do those things. Poor hygiene, so they stop doing things 226 00:16:55,680 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 2: like taking a shower. If you know that. If you 227 00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:03,880 Speaker 2: notice that this is someone who regularly keeps their hair done, 228 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,679 Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, they're no longer tending to 229 00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:11,719 Speaker 2: their hair. That person who had the bi weekly male appointment, 230 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:15,639 Speaker 2: it's been months since they've been to the nail salon, 231 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:20,480 Speaker 2: and it's not for financial reasons. You notice an increased 232 00:17:20,600 --> 00:17:32,960 Speaker 2: use of substances as a coping mechanism. So whether that's alcohol, marijuana, caffeine, nicotine, 233 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:38,480 Speaker 2: or tobacco, they're increasing the use in substance to cope 234 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:44,960 Speaker 2: with changes in their in their life, and then the 235 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:50,520 Speaker 2: other thing that we might not pay attention to. If 236 00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:55,879 Speaker 2: they have physical symptoms that go on there are unexplainable, 237 00:17:55,960 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 2: so they have certain apes in their body, frequent headache, 238 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:04,880 Speaker 2: con set fatigue, so they're getting enough sleep, but they 239 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 2: still feel fatigued. They express feelings of deep sadness or hopelessness, 240 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 2: or you find them apologizing for saying, oh, I'm sorry, 241 00:18:17,359 --> 00:18:19,680 Speaker 2: I feel like this might be too much. I hope 242 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:23,080 Speaker 2: I'm not being a burden, or maybe even they start 243 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 2: expressing signs of paranoia or fear that feel irrational for 244 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,719 Speaker 2: us as black people, because I want to point out 245 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 2: and acknowledge that as Black people, there is a certain 246 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 2: level of cultural paranoia that exists within our community. When 247 00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:47,320 Speaker 2: you find that it's beyond that, then those are signs 248 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 2: that someone is experiencing some mental health challenges. 249 00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 1: Gotcha, this is very helpful. I'm processing. I'm taking notes 250 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:59,560 Speaker 1: and like writing questions as we discussed this, because a 251 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: couple of are coming up for me and I as 252 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 1: the therapist, I am like looking to you for this 253 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:08,760 Speaker 1: conversation because I know this is your world, this is 254 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:10,879 Speaker 1: this is your life's work right now, right this is 255 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 1: what you are, This is what you deal with, right, 256 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:15,200 Speaker 1: And so when as you were sharing those, a couple 257 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:17,960 Speaker 1: of things came up for me. One, I was thinking 258 00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:19,960 Speaker 1: about the fact that, okay, now that we're going over 259 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:21,960 Speaker 1: the signs, it sounds like this is the first step. 260 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:25,119 Speaker 1: It's acknowledgment. So you realize the signs and someone and 261 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 1: you're sitting to yourself and like, okay, you're kind of 262 00:19:27,600 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 1: like making the mental no, or maybe you're writing it 263 00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:30,920 Speaker 1: down and you're like, okay, I'm noticing this, this and this. 264 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:33,920 Speaker 1: So the first step is acknowledgment. Now let me know 265 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,880 Speaker 1: if I'm jumping too much ahead, because now I'm trying 266 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,080 Speaker 1: to categorize this. I'm thinking about people in my life 267 00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 1: who've experienced where I've seen some of these signs, and 268 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:46,880 Speaker 1: there's like one group where it feels more like a season. 269 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:51,040 Speaker 1: I'm going to call it, like a season of signs, 270 00:19:51,080 --> 00:19:53,280 Speaker 1: where like it's a friend I can support them through it. 271 00:19:53,480 --> 00:19:55,679 Speaker 1: And then there's another category of people where it's like 272 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,240 Speaker 1: it's been like ten plus years, this is a pattern 273 00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 1: of signs. This is like who you are. This is 274 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:03,679 Speaker 1: not necessarily I'm going through a rough passion, but like 275 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:06,000 Speaker 1: this is who you are. And I have found that 276 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 1: I've navigated those two sort of buckets of people differently. 277 00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 2: Yes, And I also want to be careful about saying 278 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:22,680 Speaker 2: this is who you are. I would rephrase that to 279 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 2: this is persistent and pervasive, because I think that there 280 00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:32,720 Speaker 2: are some people who can go their whole life experiencing 281 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:38,959 Speaker 2: certain mental health challenges and never get help. Yes, and 282 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,360 Speaker 2: it still doesn't mean that that is who they are 283 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 2: at their core. 284 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good point. It's like it's more having 285 00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:49,480 Speaker 1: more compassion and understanding that they aren't necessarily their diagnosis, 286 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:52,680 Speaker 1: but like they're showing up in this way right because 287 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:54,879 Speaker 1: they may not be getting the help that they need. 288 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 1: I like that. That makes sense, That makes perfect sense. 289 00:20:58,280 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 1: I appreciate that. 290 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:05,240 Speaker 2: And I also I also want to distinguish between someone 291 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:10,200 Speaker 2: who is experiencing what we would call severe mental illness 292 00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:16,520 Speaker 2: versus someone who may be experiencing something seasonally or for 293 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:21,439 Speaker 2: a short period of time. Yeah, and so or what 294 00:21:21,640 --> 00:21:24,360 Speaker 2: might be functional mental health challenges. 295 00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:30,639 Speaker 3: Right, So, typically someone who is experent thing like severe 296 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:34,960 Speaker 3: mental illness is it's a what we would consider like 297 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:42,280 Speaker 3: a chronic psychiatric condition, so it significantly impairs that person's 298 00:21:42,320 --> 00:21:48,840 Speaker 3: ability to think, their overall behavior, their mood, and most importantly, their. 299 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:53,600 Speaker 2: Ability to function in day to day life. Someone with 300 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:59,400 Speaker 2: severe mental illness is usually someone who requires like ongoing support. 301 00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:05,360 Speaker 2: Sometime of it might involve hospitalization. It may often involve 302 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:11,640 Speaker 2: theory of medications. And so that might look that might 303 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:18,360 Speaker 2: be schizophrenia or someone's experiencing like hallucination, delusion and disorganized thinking. 304 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:24,160 Speaker 2: It could be someone with severe bipolar one disorder, where 305 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 2: they're experiencing extreme like mood swings so and then finding 306 00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:34,200 Speaker 2: themselves engaging in like risky behavior, having a whole lot 307 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:39,880 Speaker 2: of energy and grandiose thinking and engagement, and then going 308 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:43,440 Speaker 2: into deep depression. And then there may be people who 309 00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:47,720 Speaker 2: have like get so effective disorder, which is kind of 310 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:52,760 Speaker 2: a combination of schizophrenia and bipolar. And then someone who 311 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:59,560 Speaker 2: may be have severe major depressive disorder with frequent suicidal 312 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:06,360 Speaker 2: ideation and attempts or psychotic features. And when we say 313 00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:11,440 Speaker 2: psychotic features, things that kind of resemble diisophrenice, those hallucinations 314 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:17,119 Speaker 2: and delusions, and so again, the thing to remember is 315 00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:22,439 Speaker 2: out how much is this disrupting this person's ability to 316 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:25,800 Speaker 2: function in their day to day life. If this person. 317 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:29,840 Speaker 2: Is this person still able to go to work, to socialize, 318 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:34,359 Speaker 2: to take care of themselves. Right. If the answer is yes, 319 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,919 Speaker 2: then they may be anxious or depressed. If not, it 320 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 2: may be something else. And again I want to also 321 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 2: emphasize that it is not your job as the caregiver 322 00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:56,560 Speaker 2: or the loved one to diate notes what might be 323 00:23:56,640 --> 00:24:00,560 Speaker 2: going on. Now. Your jobs identify, well, I think you 324 00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:05,840 Speaker 2: may be schizoprenic, and even labeling it like that, right, 325 00:24:05,920 --> 00:24:09,600 Speaker 2: saying I think you may be schizophrenic could be a 326 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 2: sensive right, yeah, And so it's not your job to 327 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,600 Speaker 2: do that, even if you are a training and a 328 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:21,480 Speaker 2: health provider, not your job to do that. But if 329 00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:25,200 Speaker 2: you are noticing some of these changes, we'll talk a 330 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,640 Speaker 2: little bit later about what you can do. 331 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:31,119 Speaker 1: I'm taking it all in dollars. I'm processing because there 332 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:32,800 Speaker 1: are so many thoughts coming up. One of the things 333 00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: I'm thinking about is the fact that one, I'm grateful 334 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:37,320 Speaker 1: that we're going over the signs because even as we 335 00:24:37,359 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 1: went over the signs, I'm trying to like put it 336 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 1: into the context of my life to get a better understanding. 337 00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: And I'm like, oh, I've had I've experienced some of 338 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:45,960 Speaker 1: these signs when I was going through you know, seasons 339 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,320 Speaker 1: of depression and things of that nature. Right, So I'm 340 00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:51,320 Speaker 1: seeing that. But it's also really helpful to see the 341 00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:55,520 Speaker 1: distinction between severe mental illness and then the general signs 342 00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:58,879 Speaker 1: that we went over before, because we can't you can't 343 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:01,440 Speaker 1: see this on someone, right, Like, so you may see 344 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:04,080 Speaker 1: someone and we assume, oh this people, I'm going to 345 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,359 Speaker 1: use air quotes, Okay, you look normal, but it's like, 346 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:08,359 Speaker 1: what is normal really? 347 00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:08,560 Speaker 2: Right? 348 00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:12,159 Speaker 1: What is that? And we all watch stuff, but what 349 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,639 Speaker 1: is that? We all have stuff below the surface. So 350 00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 1: I'm just like processing and taking it in because it's 351 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,080 Speaker 1: also giving me more compassion for people who have a 352 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:26,160 Speaker 1: chemical imbalance that they often cannot control. But because I've 353 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:30,159 Speaker 1: interacted and loved people who experience some of this, it 354 00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:33,919 Speaker 1: can be challenging to navigate on a day to day 355 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 1: basis when you have your own shit going on. You're like, 356 00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:37,639 Speaker 1: I got my own mental hook stuff going on, and 357 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,240 Speaker 1: then they have theirs. How do I, where do I 358 00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:42,760 Speaker 1: fit in? How can I support when you're going through that? 359 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 1: And how to also not take it personally? So that's 360 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:47,960 Speaker 1: all like, those are all the things that are processing. 361 00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:51,160 Speaker 2: Did you share, yes, yes, And so I think that's 362 00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:54,359 Speaker 2: important to point out, right, And so what do we 363 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:59,560 Speaker 2: do when we start to notice the signs? Well, to me, 364 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 2: it's like you mentioned, like you mentioned a moment ago. 365 00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:07,520 Speaker 2: It's it's about having compassion and grace, right, And it's 366 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:12,280 Speaker 2: approaching them from a space of care and concern without 367 00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:14,959 Speaker 2: making the person feel judged or ashamed. 368 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:15,560 Speaker 1: Right. 369 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:22,400 Speaker 2: And if this is someone that you love and care 370 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 2: about and they love and care about you, they consense 371 00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:32,960 Speaker 2: when you're coming from a place of genuine concern versus 372 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:39,800 Speaker 2: trying to control them or control the situation. Right. So 373 00:26:41,240 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 2: we have a few, a few ways, a few tips 374 00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:48,800 Speaker 2: on how to approach when, how to broach that conversation 375 00:26:49,080 --> 00:26:54,280 Speaker 2: when you are noticing a change in your loved one. 376 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 2: All right, So that first one, yes, that first one 377 00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 2: is to lead with love and not labels. So you 378 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:08,000 Speaker 2: can say something like, hey, I notice you've been a 379 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 2: little bit more quiet lately, and I just want to 380 00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:15,520 Speaker 2: check in, like how were you really doing? And don't 381 00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:19,560 Speaker 2: and not the oh I'm fine or I'm good. No, 382 00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:21,840 Speaker 2: how are you really doing? 383 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:24,040 Speaker 1: So that goes back to what you said earlier. We're 384 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:26,639 Speaker 1: not diagnosing people, even if you see someone you're like, listen, 385 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:28,560 Speaker 1: I think this is what's going on. We're not diagnosing 386 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 1: lead with love, not labels, and just get curious. I 387 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 1: like that. And that takes us to number two, which 388 00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:38,840 Speaker 1: is ask open ended questions that are non pressuring. So 389 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:41,159 Speaker 1: instead of like, what's wrong with you? Why are you 390 00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:42,800 Speaker 1: acting like that? Why are you acting fundy? Why are 391 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:45,359 Speaker 1: you being different? It's like, how have things been feeling 392 00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:48,240 Speaker 1: for you lately? What's been going on in your world lately? 393 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:49,200 Speaker 3: Right? 394 00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:51,240 Speaker 1: So that's a yeah, that's a good one too. 395 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:55,240 Speaker 2: Yes, And I know our temptation to go like, what's 396 00:27:55,240 --> 00:28:00,480 Speaker 2: wrong with you exactly? That's not that's going to put 397 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:07,159 Speaker 2: someone's guard up, right, So there's next for him avoid 398 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:13,000 Speaker 2: minimizing their feeling. This is the common one that I 399 00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:18,840 Speaker 2: hear about. Yeah, the well, at least you're not dealing 400 00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:24,919 Speaker 2: with ABC and D, right, or oh you'll be fine. 401 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:29,280 Speaker 2: That's all when you say when you respond in that way, 402 00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:31,639 Speaker 2: when an after a person has opened up to you 403 00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:37,200 Speaker 2: about what they're experiencing, even if for you, and oftentimes 404 00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:39,160 Speaker 2: it's coming from a place it could be coming from 405 00:28:39,200 --> 00:28:43,200 Speaker 2: a place of you're comparing it to your own current 406 00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:46,360 Speaker 2: experiences and maybe you're going through more. You're going through 407 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:51,680 Speaker 2: a lot right now. I drop to compare apples and oranges. 408 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,600 Speaker 2: What feels like a hundred for that person may only 409 00:28:56,640 --> 00:29:00,520 Speaker 2: feel like ten to you. But if you but you 410 00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 2: don't want to come across a dismissive because what feels 411 00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 2: like one hundred to you might only feel like five 412 00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:06,640 Speaker 2: to them. 413 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:11,160 Speaker 1: Mm hmm. Now what does that look like in action? 414 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 1: Cause I'm thinking about if a friend comes, you know, like, girl, 415 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:16,280 Speaker 1: my gosh, I'm so forwhelmed. I got this going on, 416 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:19,080 Speaker 1: I got this thing to pay, I'm you know, this 417 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:22,560 Speaker 1: situation over here, Like what what would be a good 418 00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:26,080 Speaker 1: response where it isn't dismissive where you're like, oh, well 419 00:29:26,160 --> 00:29:28,200 Speaker 1: somebody else has it worse than you, or oh I'm 420 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:30,320 Speaker 1: going through it too, Like what would be an ideal 421 00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:32,680 Speaker 1: response to make them feel heard? 422 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:35,800 Speaker 2: You know, it sounds like you're going through a lot 423 00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:41,200 Speaker 2: right now. It sounds like you are navigating more than 424 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:42,080 Speaker 2: what you're used to. 425 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,480 Speaker 1: Mm hm, that's good. 426 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:47,400 Speaker 2: Keep it as simple as that. 427 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, I love it, and that takes its number four. 428 00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 1: Number four is probably my favorite because I'm like, oh, 429 00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:57,360 Speaker 1: I don't go I don't have no solutions, right offer support, 430 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:01,400 Speaker 1: not solutions, right, and I have all the answers, but 431 00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:06,160 Speaker 1: you can be there. Your presence oftentimes can be a gift. 432 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: And I found you. I'm just listening, just listening to someone, 433 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:13,360 Speaker 1: letting them vent and sometimes you know what else? I 434 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:16,880 Speaker 1: think we've talked about this as well, one of your favorites, 435 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 1: Dom It's like, how can I support you? Yes? On 436 00:30:19,680 --> 00:30:21,600 Speaker 1: in there. Yes, I received that, and I know we've 437 00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:23,239 Speaker 1: talked about it on the show as well, which I 438 00:30:23,280 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 1: love because it opens the door if someone does know 439 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:27,360 Speaker 1: how they can be supported. 440 00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:30,720 Speaker 2: And so to add on to that, because I've heard 441 00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,520 Speaker 2: people say, well, what do I do if I if 442 00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:36,680 Speaker 2: someone asks me how they can support me and I 443 00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:41,479 Speaker 2: don't know, you can say that, you can say I 444 00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:47,200 Speaker 2: appreciate you checking in. Yes, I really don't know what 445 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:52,880 Speaker 2: how I need, what support I need right now? When 446 00:30:52,880 --> 00:30:56,720 Speaker 2: I'm able to identify it, I'll let you know. Or 447 00:30:56,760 --> 00:31:01,600 Speaker 2: you can say I don't know what help I need 448 00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:05,280 Speaker 2: right now? Can you help me? Can I explain more 449 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:08,560 Speaker 2: of what's going on and you can help me think 450 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:11,760 Speaker 2: through what may be supportive And I'm not asking you 451 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 2: to volunteer for that, but if you could help me 452 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,360 Speaker 2: generate what may be supportive. 453 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:21,080 Speaker 1: That is excellent, that is a great one. And so 454 00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:23,920 Speaker 1: what I was going to say is it kind of 455 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:26,920 Speaker 1: piggybacks off of that. So something I'll usually ask is 456 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:29,680 Speaker 1: do you want after they ask, you know, I ask 457 00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:31,520 Speaker 1: about support, do you want advice? Or do you want 458 00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 1: me to just listen? And I think sometimes that can 459 00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:35,959 Speaker 1: be helpful because sometimes the answer is give me some advice. 460 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:36,400 Speaker 2: I need. 461 00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:39,360 Speaker 1: I need a voice of reasoning right now. Sometimes it's like, 462 00:31:39,360 --> 00:31:42,120 Speaker 1: don't say shit, just listen, just let me vent. And 463 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 1: that's cool too, yes, And. 464 00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:50,400 Speaker 2: I think then that takes us to our last stip, 465 00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:55,760 Speaker 2: and it's no when to encourage professional help. Know your limits. Remember, 466 00:31:56,080 --> 00:31:58,600 Speaker 2: even if you are a therapist, it is not your 467 00:31:58,680 --> 00:32:01,160 Speaker 2: job to be the therapist for your friends and family. 468 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:06,320 Speaker 2: And so if someone is so, whether they're showing signs 469 00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:11,400 Speaker 2: of like significant distress, if they're doing that, if they're 470 00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:16,040 Speaker 2: showing signs of significant distress or suicidal thoughts, it's time 471 00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:20,800 Speaker 2: to intervene with professional health and you can offer to 472 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:26,080 Speaker 2: help them find someone. If someone's immediately expressing suiticidal thoughts, 473 00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:30,120 Speaker 2: then you can reach out to a crisis line or 474 00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:36,600 Speaker 2: take them to urgent care. If someone is not in 475 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:39,920 Speaker 2: that level of distress, but it's clear that they could 476 00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:45,600 Speaker 2: benefit from professional health. You can offer that suggestion. You 477 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:48,280 Speaker 2: can say, you know, I think it may be helpful 478 00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:54,960 Speaker 2: to seek some additional support. So maybe a therapist or 479 00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:59,320 Speaker 2: whatever other support might be beneficial to that person. That 480 00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:03,680 Speaker 2: person might be or open to love it, and so, 481 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:10,320 Speaker 2: you know, I think the thing that is really important 482 00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:14,239 Speaker 2: throughout all of this is what we talked about at 483 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:19,920 Speaker 2: the beginning, about setting boundaries that as we mentioned, it 484 00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:25,120 Speaker 2: is not your job to be that person's therapist. And 485 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:30,760 Speaker 2: I know that for some people there may come a 486 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:35,920 Speaker 2: point where you are not able to provide any level 487 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:42,000 Speaker 2: of support. And that's important to acknowledge. You have to 488 00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:47,000 Speaker 2: understand and identify your own capacity and then be able 489 00:33:47,040 --> 00:33:50,360 Speaker 2: to set boundaries based on your capacity. 490 00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:53,080 Speaker 1: I'm going to see my hand. Okay, listen, because when 491 00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:55,480 Speaker 1: you said this, all right, what does it look like 492 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,920 Speaker 1: in action to set the boundary? Because I'm thinking about 493 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:04,000 Speaker 1: a couple of situations where there were friends who we're 494 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,080 Speaker 1: going through a rough season, and I've gone through my 495 00:34:06,120 --> 00:34:08,200 Speaker 1: own seasons as well, and we support one another, right, 496 00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:11,320 Speaker 1: but I think that I'm thinking about the more I 497 00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:14,480 Speaker 1: want to say drastic situations where the season is prolonged 498 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:19,400 Speaker 1: and the support becomes it starts to impact you know, 499 00:34:19,440 --> 00:34:21,279 Speaker 1: you as a person because you're trying to support that 500 00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:23,960 Speaker 1: person and it feels like dumbing. I was talking to 501 00:34:24,000 --> 00:34:25,799 Speaker 1: a friend and they were saying like, oh my gosh, 502 00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:27,520 Speaker 1: this person calls and they just want to dump and 503 00:34:27,560 --> 00:34:29,520 Speaker 1: I don't have the capacity to do that. I got 504 00:34:29,560 --> 00:34:31,600 Speaker 1: my own stuff going, And so what does it look 505 00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,160 Speaker 1: like to want to be there for someone but to 506 00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:36,560 Speaker 1: set a boundary of like, I can't just I can't 507 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,279 Speaker 1: be on the phone for hours and just listen, you know, 508 00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:41,480 Speaker 1: like I can't. I'm unable to do that. What does 509 00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 1: that look like? 510 00:34:43,680 --> 00:34:46,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, so what that can look like is identifying. So 511 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:48,959 Speaker 2: let's say if you're saying that you know you want, 512 00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,920 Speaker 2: what you have capacity to do is to listen, but 513 00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:57,960 Speaker 2: you don't have capacity to listen every day for hours. 514 00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:00,960 Speaker 2: You can set you set lip it's with that person 515 00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:08,040 Speaker 2: and you say, Okay, I want I'm here to support 516 00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:12,480 Speaker 2: you within limit because I have things that I have 517 00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:17,520 Speaker 2: to do for myself and I cannot. I'm not at 518 00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 2: this point. I am not a trained professional. And even 519 00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:22,840 Speaker 2: if I was a trained professional, it's not it's not 520 00:35:23,080 --> 00:35:26,759 Speaker 2: my job to be your therapist. It sounds like in 521 00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:31,719 Speaker 2: this it sounds like it seems like, based on your 522 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,920 Speaker 2: current need that you're expressing to me, that therapy may 523 00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:41,279 Speaker 2: be a beneficial option. What I'm available to do. I 524 00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:43,719 Speaker 2: can do a quick five minute check in every day 525 00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:49,399 Speaker 2: via text, and once a week or once every two 526 00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:56,239 Speaker 2: weeks or whatever cadence feels right for you. I can 527 00:35:56,400 --> 00:36:01,560 Speaker 2: set aside time to listen. But for you, as the 528 00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,680 Speaker 2: loved one, you have to determine what your capacity is, 529 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:07,960 Speaker 2: what your real capacity is. And I think that's the 530 00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:11,720 Speaker 2: thing that I want to distinguish, right, what your real 531 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:17,560 Speaker 2: capacity is. Just because you have five hours you got 532 00:36:17,600 --> 00:36:19,839 Speaker 2: off work early and you have five hours that are 533 00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:24,440 Speaker 2: now free in your evening doesn't mean that those five 534 00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:32,040 Speaker 2: hours are available for you to listen or problem solve 535 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:40,360 Speaker 2: or get involved in someone's mental health challenges. That's not 536 00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:44,880 Speaker 2: helpful to you or to them. And so you have 537 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:50,799 Speaker 2: those five hours, you say, okay, I have about an hour, 538 00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:54,800 Speaker 2: because my guess is that person who's experiencing those mental 539 00:36:54,840 --> 00:37:00,839 Speaker 2: health challenges, by the time you finished supporting them, you 540 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:05,279 Speaker 2: may be feeling emotionally drained. And if five hours of 541 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:07,520 Speaker 2: free time is what you have, and you give them 542 00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:13,160 Speaker 2: those full five hours. Now where is your energy to 543 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,319 Speaker 2: finish the rest of your day? And so you set 544 00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:22,040 Speaker 2: up on an hour, support them within that hour, and 545 00:37:22,080 --> 00:37:26,239 Speaker 2: then you take some time for your own self care. 546 00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:30,560 Speaker 2: So maybe you go on a walk, maybe you meditate, 547 00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:36,160 Speaker 2: maybe you journal, you do something to pour back into yourself, 548 00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:41,160 Speaker 2: because you've poured out now, right, so do something to 549 00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:44,000 Speaker 2: pour back into yourself so that you can continue with 550 00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:44,799 Speaker 2: the rest of your day. 551 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:48,800 Speaker 1: I love it. Okay, let's get into these practical tips 552 00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:52,640 Speaker 1: on how to show up with boundaries. So number one, 553 00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:54,360 Speaker 1: it feels like a little bit of a recap is 554 00:37:54,360 --> 00:37:56,400 Speaker 1: like validate their experience, which we talked a little bit 555 00:37:56,440 --> 00:37:59,200 Speaker 1: about before, but don't try to fix them, right, so 556 00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,439 Speaker 1: have bearing back what they said or just being there 557 00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: to support and listen. And like you said earlier time, 558 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:07,040 Speaker 1: I love the statement that you that you shared when 559 00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:08,680 Speaker 1: I asked you what is what does that look like 560 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,000 Speaker 1: in action? And you said it sounds like you're going through. 561 00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:12,839 Speaker 1: You have a lot on your plate right now, more 562 00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:15,800 Speaker 1: than usual, and so being able to validate the experiences 563 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:16,840 Speaker 1: is really helpful. 564 00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,399 Speaker 2: Yes. And the key there is it's not your job 565 00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:24,800 Speaker 2: to solve the problem. Yes, So the next the next 566 00:38:24,880 --> 00:38:30,759 Speaker 2: boundary is learning the basics of their diagnosis, right, and 567 00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:36,279 Speaker 2: and so you look for trusted sources and you identify 568 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 2: what are trusted sources that can offer diagnoses or helping 569 00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:44,400 Speaker 2: you to understand the basics of their diagnoses. And again, 570 00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:47,959 Speaker 2: it's not your job to diagnose them, it's to help 571 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:50,439 Speaker 2: you once they've received the diagnosis. This is to help 572 00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:54,600 Speaker 2: you understand what that really looks like and how how 573 00:38:54,640 --> 00:39:01,400 Speaker 2: you can support them with their specific diagnosis. So resources 574 00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:07,120 Speaker 2: like NAMI SO the National Institute, and mental illness resources 575 00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:11,239 Speaker 2: such as maybe Therapy for Black Girls Psychology Today. There 576 00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:13,239 Speaker 2: are a number of resources and we'll put more of 577 00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:16,719 Speaker 2: them in the show notes so that you can understand 578 00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:20,600 Speaker 2: the basics of how to show up and support based 579 00:39:20,640 --> 00:39:22,680 Speaker 2: on that person's specific diagnosis. 580 00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:25,120 Speaker 1: I love that one, too, done because it can really 581 00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:27,880 Speaker 1: help to not again not take things personally, because sometimes 582 00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:30,360 Speaker 1: if you don't know what's going on beneath the surface, 583 00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:32,080 Speaker 1: you just like, why are you acting like this? Or 584 00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:33,759 Speaker 1: why they do this to me? But it can be 585 00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:37,040 Speaker 1: really helpful when you have that you understand the diagnosis 586 00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:39,520 Speaker 1: and it allows you to show up in a supportive way. 587 00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:44,719 Speaker 1: Number three is communicate clearly. So again going back to 588 00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:48,200 Speaker 1: those statements, those questions, those open ended questions, what you 589 00:39:48,280 --> 00:39:50,640 Speaker 1: need from me right now? How can I support you? 590 00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:54,239 Speaker 1: Or you know what? I don't have the capacity right 591 00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:57,120 Speaker 1: now to do that, but checking in to see if 592 00:39:57,160 --> 00:40:00,040 Speaker 1: they have other support, you know, methods, and there's. 593 00:40:01,640 --> 00:40:06,040 Speaker 2: Yes. I think that's that the communication is key being 594 00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:08,920 Speaker 2: And so I really want to emphasize that importance of 595 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:13,600 Speaker 2: being very clear and specific, Yeah, what do you need 596 00:40:13,640 --> 00:40:18,520 Speaker 2: from me right down? I have ten minutes, and then 597 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:22,239 Speaker 2: you stick to those ten minutes, right, So you have 598 00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:27,600 Speaker 2: to be clear exactly exactly. So Number four is to 599 00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:33,319 Speaker 2: create air plans and safety plans if needed, and so 600 00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:36,120 Speaker 2: particularly for some if you have a loved one who 601 00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:44,680 Speaker 2: may have suicidal thoughts or may have aaronoia, you want 602 00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:51,680 Speaker 2: to create help them create safety plans that if they 603 00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:56,399 Speaker 2: find themselves having suicidal thoughts, when do they reach out 604 00:40:56,480 --> 00:41:00,200 Speaker 2: to you? Versus when do they need to reach out 605 00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:06,040 Speaker 2: to emergency services right or christ of popline? Are they 606 00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:08,560 Speaker 2: feeling low? What do they need to do? So a 607 00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:12,799 Speaker 2: care plan might be more of like, so today I 608 00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:17,200 Speaker 2: woke up and I'm not feeling well, what do I 609 00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:20,239 Speaker 2: need to do? When can I call Terry when I'm 610 00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:23,200 Speaker 2: feeling low? At what point is it okay for me 611 00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:26,239 Speaker 2: to call Terry? And if I can't call Terry, who 612 00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:31,600 Speaker 2: do I call? And identifying what are the various support systems? 613 00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:35,480 Speaker 1: Yes, and also maybe even like key like not even 614 00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:37,879 Speaker 1: not a keyword, but like a not a cold word. 615 00:41:37,880 --> 00:41:40,640 Speaker 1: I'm trying to think of a certain you know what 616 00:41:40,680 --> 00:41:44,040 Speaker 1: I'm trying that might be. That might be a cold word, 617 00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:46,160 Speaker 1: like if you're busy and it's like I can't get 618 00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:47,560 Speaker 1: to the phone, but like I need to talk to 619 00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:50,239 Speaker 1: someone right now, you send that cold word so that 620 00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:51,840 Speaker 1: when I see that on the phone, I know I 621 00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:54,160 Speaker 1: need to call you immediately. If I'm part of that 622 00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:58,279 Speaker 1: you know, safety plan and the sports system. Yes, I 623 00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:00,440 Speaker 1: think that could be important because we're so many of 624 00:42:00,520 --> 00:42:03,319 Speaker 1: us are so busy. Right And number five here is 625 00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:07,960 Speaker 1: leverage professional help, so therapy support groups, hotlines down. This 626 00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:11,239 Speaker 1: makes me think about there were various rough patches in 627 00:42:11,280 --> 00:42:14,319 Speaker 1: life where family was going through certain things, and I 628 00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:16,760 Speaker 1: found that my therapy sessions kind of became like family 629 00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:19,200 Speaker 1: sessions where I was talking to my therapist about what 630 00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:22,759 Speaker 1: my family member or loved one was going through because 631 00:42:22,800 --> 00:42:24,880 Speaker 1: I was like, shit, I need I need support because I' 632 00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:27,480 Speaker 1: supporting this person. So I need support now to help 633 00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:30,759 Speaker 1: fill my cup and help me process this and do 634 00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:33,400 Speaker 1: it in a way that's going to allow me to 635 00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:36,480 Speaker 1: have my mental health intact. But then also kind of 636 00:42:37,080 --> 00:42:40,120 Speaker 1: blending steps four and five here tips four and five 637 00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:43,920 Speaker 1: is I found myself also referring my therapist to certain 638 00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:46,359 Speaker 1: family members because it was like, all right, I love 639 00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:47,919 Speaker 1: you and I want to support you, and I also 640 00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:49,520 Speaker 1: got I have my own mental I need to make 641 00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:51,560 Speaker 1: sure my mental health is good because I'm going through stuff. 642 00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:53,520 Speaker 1: So let me give you this therapist that you can 643 00:42:53,560 --> 00:42:56,840 Speaker 1: now work with to process what you're going through as well. 644 00:42:57,040 --> 00:43:01,200 Speaker 2: Yes, and I think that's important and that can be 645 00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:05,360 Speaker 2: key in setting those boundaries right of like here's my 646 00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:09,560 Speaker 2: limit on how I can support you. Now it's time 647 00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:14,200 Speaker 2: to bring in the profession. And so a quick wrap 648 00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:17,640 Speaker 2: up of these boundaries of setting tips on boundary setting. 649 00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:24,640 Speaker 2: With supporting someone with mental health challenges, you validate their experience, 650 00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:31,160 Speaker 2: You learn the basics of their diagnosis, You communicate clearly, 651 00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:36,560 Speaker 2: you can help them create care and safety plans, and 652 00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:42,400 Speaker 2: then you leverage professional health. I know that today's episode 653 00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:47,239 Speaker 2: today's topic may have felt insense, or it may have 654 00:43:47,239 --> 00:43:50,960 Speaker 2: felt like it only scratches the surface of the questions 655 00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:55,200 Speaker 2: that you have on supporting a loved one with mental 656 00:43:55,239 --> 00:43:59,640 Speaker 2: health challenges, and so in our show notes will include 657 00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:04,240 Speaker 2: links to various resources that we think will be helpful 658 00:44:04,320 --> 00:44:11,160 Speaker 2: for you in navigating because, as this episode demonstrates, it's 659 00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:15,960 Speaker 2: a parallel in terms of what we're able to do 660 00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:18,040 Speaker 2: in this episode, what we're able to offer in this 661 00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:22,879 Speaker 2: episode versus what you are able to offer to your 662 00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:29,560 Speaker 2: friends and family. We can't do it all. And when 663 00:44:29,600 --> 00:44:31,799 Speaker 2: we know we can't do it all, we also bring 664 00:44:31,840 --> 00:44:35,360 Speaker 2: in reinforcements, So check our show notes for those reinforcements. 665 00:44:36,760 --> 00:44:40,320 Speaker 1: If you're feeling stuck, overwhelmed, or unsure if your next steps, 666 00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:44,319 Speaker 1: this is for you. Hey, lady, is Tea here and 667 00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:46,319 Speaker 1: I just want to invite you to my free goal 668 00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:49,160 Speaker 1: map like a pro coaching workshop, where I'll share the 669 00:44:49,239 --> 00:44:53,000 Speaker 1: five proven steps to get unstuck and achieve your goals. 670 00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:57,880 Speaker 1: Whether you're feeling overwhelmed by all your ideas, juggling scattered ideas, 671 00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:01,480 Speaker 1: or maybe you just need confidence, start this workshot will 672 00:45:01,480 --> 00:45:04,799 Speaker 1: give you the clarity, tools and the motivation to take 673 00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:08,319 Speaker 1: back control. Reserve your spot for free by visiting her 674 00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:12,480 Speaker 1: spacepodcast dot com and clicking on the goal map like 675 00:45:12,520 --> 00:45:15,360 Speaker 1: a pro webinar link. Lady, don't miss this chance to 676 00:45:15,360 --> 00:45:17,400 Speaker 1: build a roadmap that fits your life and set you 677 00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:19,560 Speaker 1: up for success. I hope to see you there. 678 00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:26,000 Speaker 2: Thanks for tuning into Cultivating her Space. Remember that while 679 00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:30,799 Speaker 2: this podcast is all about healing, empowerment, and resilience, it's 680 00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:34,799 Speaker 2: not a substitute for therapy. If you are someone you 681 00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:38,920 Speaker 2: know need support, check out resources like Therapy for Black 682 00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:43,600 Speaker 2: Girls or Psychology Today. If you love today's episode, do 683 00:45:43,719 --> 00:45:45,719 Speaker 2: us a favor and share it with a friend who 684 00:45:45,760 --> 00:45:50,240 Speaker 2: needs some inspiration or leave us a quick five star review. 685 00:45:50,920 --> 00:45:53,839 Speaker 2: Your support means the world to us and helps keep 686 00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:55,080 Speaker 2: this space thriving. 687 00:45:55,600 --> 00:46:00,400 Speaker 1: And before we meet again, repeat after me under my 688 00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:05,760 Speaker 1: journey by balancing effort and rest to achieve my goals. 689 00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:10,279 Speaker 1: Keep thriving, Lady, and tune in next Friday for more 690 00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:14,959 Speaker 1: inspiration from Cultivating her Space. In the meantime, be sure 691 00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:18,560 Speaker 1: to connect with us on Instagram at her Space Podcast.