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Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways. I don't know. You never know stories of

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Speaker 1: things we simply don't know the answer too. Well. Hey there,

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Speaker 1: and welcome to Thinking Sideways the podcast. As always it's

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Speaker 1: my Turn, which means I am Steve, as always, it's

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Speaker 1: your turn, as this time it's my yeas, I'm always Steve,

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Speaker 1: you are always ste except that week I was Joe,

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Speaker 1: which was weird. It was really weird. I didn't like

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Speaker 1: it very much. I don't think the fans like they

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Speaker 1: got a lot of heil over that way. But I

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Speaker 1: am Steve as always, joined by Devin and Joe, and

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Speaker 1: once again we have another mystery to look into. This

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Speaker 1: is a listener suggestion. We've been trying to work through

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Speaker 1: the backlog, which but we have a big one. We

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Speaker 1: have a lot of suggestions, which is great, but that

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Speaker 1: list has gotten huge. This particular story that we're going

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Speaker 1: to talk about was suggested by Todd quite a long

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Speaker 1: time ago. So sorry that it took us a while, Todd,

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Speaker 1: But sorry, man, I hope you're still listening. Todd. Oh,

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Speaker 1: I'm curious. I didn't get angry that we've never used

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Speaker 1: his suggestion. Stopped listening to us. Well, it was a

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Speaker 1: great suggestion, because what Todd suggested was that we look

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Speaker 1: at Stanley Kubrick's The Shining because it turns out there

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Speaker 1: are a ton of theories on the interpretation of what

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Speaker 1: the movie is all about. It's surprising actually have many

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Speaker 1: weird hidden meetings people seemed to find in the movie.

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Speaker 1: And I hadn't seen it in like twenty years. So

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Speaker 1: I I remember several years ago I watched there's a

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Speaker 1: documentary which is going to come up, so we'll just

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Speaker 1: talk about it now, Room two thirty seven. Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: several times now. But I remember watching it before and

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Speaker 1: thinking I don't remember any of this stuff. I've since

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Speaker 1: watched The Shining about two and a half times in

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Speaker 1: a week and a half, so my house is shining

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Speaker 1: no longer allowed. I got into a lot of trouble

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Speaker 1: for continually watching that. Well, I I've not I had

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Speaker 1: never seen it before. Um, because it may or may

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Speaker 1: not shock our listeners to know that I hate horror

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Speaker 1: movie like, I don't watch them at all. Um. In fact,

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Speaker 1: if there's like even a remotely scary tense soundtrack to something,

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Speaker 1: I probably won't watch it. This goes back to legitimately,

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Speaker 1: I think I was a year and a half old.

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Speaker 1: My mom tried to show me Bamby. She had never

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Speaker 1: seen it before. Well, and you know, the moms and

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Speaker 1: her group said, oh, don't worry, the kids don't know that.

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Speaker 1: Spoiler alert. The mom dies, you know, the kids don't

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Speaker 1: realize that, and you know, the music kind of comes

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Speaker 1: up and I stand up on the couch. I'm a

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Speaker 1: year and a half old. I stand up on the

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Speaker 1: couch as the music is just like you know, and

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Speaker 1: Bambi gets out of the fire, and I just turned

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Speaker 1: to my mom and go, Mama, where's his mama? Mama, Mama, Mama,

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Speaker 1: says mama. And my mom just like just gently took

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Speaker 1: through mote and turned it off and said she comes

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Speaker 1: back at the end. Let's go do something else. And

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Speaker 1: I think that that moment with the music is the

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Speaker 1: very good representation of I can't. And this one was

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Speaker 1: so I mean, I texted you about it. In the

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Speaker 1: middle of it. I was like, do I really have

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Speaker 1: to do this? Because what is this movie about? Why

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Speaker 1: are we watching it? And I just cleaned up that

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Speaker 1: was super clean. There were yeah, I did not. I

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Speaker 1: was not not excited about watching it. It was the soundtrack.

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Speaker 1: I think that if it had a different soundtrack, if

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Speaker 1: it had wacky Sacks in it. But see that's the

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Speaker 1: thing that that's it's a very it's totally cubriic. That

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Speaker 1: movie is absolutely cubic. And smoiler alert for everybody. If

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Speaker 1: you haven't seen The Shining, I know you were going

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Speaker 1: to get around to it, and it's only like thirty

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Speaker 1: five years old. We're going to talk about this movie

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Speaker 1: and you might want to go wrap the movie first,

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Speaker 1: come back in a couple of hours when you finished

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Speaker 1: The Shining. Yeah, it's a good movie. I know that

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Speaker 1: Vin didn't like it. No, No, I liked it. I

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Speaker 1: just don't like movies like that. I And the thing is,

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Speaker 1: is like I like all of the other Kubrick movies

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Speaker 1: I've ever seen, So it was just this this was

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Speaker 1: kind of an outlier because he always wanted to do horror,

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Speaker 1: so this was a bit of an outlier for his catalog. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: He uh, he actually has a he did a little

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Speaker 1: bit of everything. He did warror movies and horror movies.

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Speaker 1: I mean you've seen like, well it's obviously Doctor Strange

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Speaker 1: Love is that's one of my favorite movies of all times.

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Speaker 1: You guys know that because I like I title all

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Speaker 1: of the names of my scripts in that fashion. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if you guys have picked up on that,

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Speaker 1: to stop that and love the bomb, Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: how I learned to stop worrying and love the toy

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Speaker 1: tiles and you know whatever. And one of my faves

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Speaker 1: is Clockwork Orange. I like that one, which is another

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Speaker 1: darkly humorous movie. It's really it's really very funny, but

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Speaker 1: it's it's in a very dark way. Yeah, he's he's

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Speaker 1: a very unit he was very unique director. Yeah, absolutely

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Speaker 1: very talented, absolutely talented. But let's let's go ahead and

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Speaker 1: kind of step into what we're going to talk about here.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk more about how much I hate

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Speaker 1: horror movies. We we could do a whole episode on that.

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Speaker 1: Let's do that one later. You might turn our listeners off, okay, um,

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Speaker 1: But now, what I was gonna say when we were

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Speaker 1: talking about all the theories is some of these theories

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Speaker 1: you kind of gotta stand on one leg, hold your

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Speaker 1: mouth in just the right way, and then maybe see it.

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Speaker 1: And some of them are based on the evidence they

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Speaker 1: give you are really really obvious. Yeah, And I when

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Speaker 1: I watched Room two three seven, I was having a

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Speaker 1: really hard time not doing that thing that people do

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Speaker 1: sometimes when you sit in front of the TV and

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Speaker 1: you're like, yeah, that's true, Yeah, that thing is the

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Speaker 1: real thing. Oh no, wait, I know you said that contract.

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Speaker 1: Oh that contradicts it. You know, just accepting the facts

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Speaker 1: as they were given, and I know that. We'll talk

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Speaker 1: about that a little bit too, yes, because you cannot

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Speaker 1: do that. But are you too ready? You're ready for

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Speaker 1: movie time? All right, who's got the popcorn? Okay, sweet,

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Speaker 1: first bit of business. Let's talk about The Shining not

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Speaker 1: the movie but the book by Stephen King. By Stephen King.

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Speaker 1: It's a little different. It is. King wrote the book

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Speaker 1: and it came out in ninety seven, and the baseline

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Speaker 1: story is the same, and I'm gonna give you a

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Speaker 1: baseline version. It's not exact because they do diverge from

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Speaker 1: each other so much. Ye. Essentially, they're going to spend

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Speaker 1: the winter and it's the Torrance family the Overlook Hotel

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Speaker 1: that it's in the mountains of Colorado. They're gonna watch

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Speaker 1: the hotel and maintain it over the course of the winter,

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Speaker 1: and they're going to be snowed in. There's three main

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Speaker 1: characters at that point. We've got the father who is Jack,

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Speaker 1: the mother who is Wendy, and the son who is

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Speaker 1: five year old Danny. That's our main characters. And Danny

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Speaker 1: has telepathy. Yes, it turns out Danny can see things.

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Speaker 1: He can shine, he can shine as it is called.

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Speaker 1: So you can not only read minds communicate telepathically, but

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Speaker 1: I also can see things that happened in the past

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Speaker 1: and in the future or are going to happen. And

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Speaker 1: he has the what's his name in the movie, tom

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Speaker 1: Tommy Tommy, but that's but that's only in the movie.

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Speaker 1: In the movie he has Tony. But in the book

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Speaker 1: Tony is there. I didn't read the book. Sorry, and

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Speaker 1: you gotta okay what Devon is doing, by the way, everybody,

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Speaker 1: and she is imitating Danny with a little the pointer

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Speaker 1: finger up and down to talk, so right now, my yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's yeah, up and down conversation that is not present

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Speaker 1: in the book. He talks to Tony in his head.

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Speaker 1: So the finger thing is a way to visualize it

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Speaker 1: for film. Yeah, you know, in interior monologue is really

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Speaker 1: hard to do. It is, so what happens of course Danny,

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Speaker 1: these things, those things are affecting his father his father

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Speaker 1: goes nuts, he tries to kill the family. The father dies,

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Speaker 1: and Wendy and Danny escaped the overlook. That's the short version.

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Speaker 1: That's a very even out because again they died. But

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Speaker 1: the hotel is like haunted. I guess you could say

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Speaker 1: it's inhabited by very evil a very evil presence. I

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Speaker 1: would say evil presence is the right way to go

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Speaker 1: about it. Yeah. So, like I said, King published the

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Speaker 1: book in seventy seven. Cuber got ahold of it, decided

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Speaker 1: he wanted to make it into a movie, but of

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Speaker 1: course he needed to make changes for because, as we

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Speaker 1: just said, internal monologues don't work on film. Well, you

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Speaker 1: can do it if you're going to have the narrator. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but that's a bad format for hormone. A movie that

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Speaker 1: was very faithful to the book was very loathing in

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Speaker 1: Las Vegas, and it really really sucked. It didn't work

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Speaker 1: in his book. The book was hilarious and the movie

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Speaker 1: just sucked. Yeah, it didn't make it. Well. So Cubert no,

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Speaker 1: just so he gets ahole of King and he says,

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Speaker 1: I want to make this into a movie, but I

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Speaker 1: need to make changes. And King, being flattered that Stanley

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Speaker 1: Cubrick is asking to turn his book into a movie, says,

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Speaker 1: go ahead, change what you want, not realizing quite how

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Speaker 1: much was gonna get changed. Pretty much everything. King hates

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Speaker 1: this movie. Ye absolutely hates the movie. And and it's

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Speaker 1: because of the fact that Kubrick went in and slashed

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Speaker 1: so much out and then changed so many things that

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Speaker 1: he had to change. But it's it's really interesting. Came

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Speaker 1: out to be. It turned out to be a good story,

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Speaker 1: which is not the same story, not quite the same,

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Speaker 1: quite the same story. Now we're going to focus on

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Speaker 1: the movie, so we're going to talk about the actors briefly.

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Speaker 1: Here we have four actors we're gonna talk about. So

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Speaker 1: Jack Torrence, the father was played by Jack Nicholson. Very

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Speaker 1: young Jack, very and yet already balding. Jack Nicholson Warning

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Speaker 1: to you people, I guess it's too late because you've

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Speaker 1: already shut off the podcast and you're running the movie

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Speaker 1: right now streaming on Netflix. But Jack Nicholson's hair is

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Speaker 1: kind of wild in this movie. It's not on Netflix.

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Speaker 1: It's no, you can't scream it. I think Amazon Prime

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Speaker 1: is where I watched it. Is it sounding like an ad?

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Our next character is going to be Wendy Torrence,

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Speaker 1: the mother. She was played by Shelley Duval. She's a

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Speaker 1: great character. She's yeah, yeah, we're leave it at that.

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Speaker 1: We have the son Danny, who is played by a

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Speaker 1: five year old boy named Danny Lloyd, who fun fact,

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Speaker 1: didn't know that they were filming a horror movie and

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Speaker 1: in fact didn't even see the movie or like find

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Speaker 1: out anything about it until he was like fourteen. It's

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Speaker 1: like nine years later. His parents finally said, yeah, alright, fine,

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Speaker 1: you can see this movie. And apparently he was like horrified.

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Speaker 1: He had no idea it was a drama. Did you

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Speaker 1: watch the making of that's out there? And one there's

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Speaker 1: one guy I cannot remember his name, but he was

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Speaker 1: basically Danny's handler. He hung out with Danny, he did everything.

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Speaker 1: So as soon as the scene was done, Hey Danny,

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Speaker 1: let's go do this, he grabbed his hand. He run

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Speaker 1: down the hall like they were totally keeping him sheltered.

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Speaker 1: They do this with children with child actors a lot. Um.

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Speaker 1: There's this movie called The Fall and one of the

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Speaker 1: characters is a little girl who only speaks Spanish um,

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Speaker 1: and they actually had to film all of her scenes

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Speaker 1: in sequence as she learned English so her English would

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Speaker 1: get better. And the um, one of the other characters

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Speaker 1: is a paraplegic. He can't walk, and she literally thought

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Speaker 1: that he was paralyzed until the premiere of the movie

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Speaker 1: when she saw him walking down the carpet and she

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Speaker 1: was horrified. I think they do that a lot with kids,

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Speaker 1: right right, I mean, not sorry, not like the worst,

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Speaker 1: but she was. She was shocked. Yeah, but we have

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry tangent. Okay, not on this tangent. They were

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Speaker 1: on this one last thing. I guess I need to

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Speaker 1: go back and watch the movie a game, because I'm

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Speaker 1: trying to remember if they found a way to keep

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Speaker 1: the kid out of the frames. In the scenes when

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Speaker 1: they're in the bathroom and Jack Nicholson is chopping the

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Speaker 1: door down, he wasn't in there, and he was already

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Speaker 1: escaped the bathroom. No, no, he started to head. He

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Speaker 1: already got he was already out. He was already out.

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Speaker 1: But then when when Jack Nicholson is chopping at the

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Speaker 1: door of the apartment, was he was he not? They

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Speaker 1: find a way to keep him out of those scenes?

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Speaker 1: The chopping only happens on the bathroom door. Your way

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Speaker 1: Ahead sir, No, No, he chopped. He chopped his way

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Speaker 1: through the apartment door too, and then opened and then

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Speaker 1: turned the doorknob. They yeah, but they have him in

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Speaker 1: the bathroom and they do cut. It's all cut scenes

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Speaker 1: in it. So they managed that they managed to actually

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Speaker 1: keep him off the set for those Well I don't

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Speaker 1: know if he wasn't off of the but I imagine

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Speaker 1: they had him somewhere else. Yeah, I imagine he was

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Speaker 1: in the cafeteria. Anyway. Sorry, we have one another act

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Speaker 1: actor that we need to talk about, and that is

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Speaker 1: the guy who played the character of Dick Halleran, and

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Speaker 1: he was Scatman Cruthers and he was a great He

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Speaker 1: was my favorite. I agree. He did a phenomenal job.

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Speaker 1: Was really good. So he was really interesting. But but

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Speaker 1: those are are four characters. And that character does or

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Speaker 1: does it not exist in the book because he does,

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Speaker 1: he does, he does. He does not experience the same

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Speaker 1: fate in the book. That is a complete diversion in

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Speaker 1: the movie. And that's actually the one thing about about

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Speaker 1: the movie that's very King asked, very very Stephen King,

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Speaker 1: like he has a way of having this, you know,

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Speaker 1: because he comes all the way across country and comes

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Speaker 1: in and immediately it gets murdered. Just like that, You

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Speaker 1: no chance to do much of anything. Yeah, that's the

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Speaker 1: kind of thing that Stephen King would do. Yes, in

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Speaker 1: the book, that wasn't it. He made the hero in

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Speaker 1: the book. But let's go ahead and move away from

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Speaker 1: the story for a moment before we because we've got

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Speaker 1: what is it? We got just a little bit more,

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Speaker 1: and then we're gonna start talking about theories. The last

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Speaker 1: thing I want to talk about is Stanley cubric himself.

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Speaker 1: He If you're not familiar with him, you need to

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Speaker 1: go watch his movies. I wouldn't say that I'm not

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Speaker 1: a huge Cubic fan, but I appreciate them. But I

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Speaker 1: also do you guys, I know you remember this to

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Speaker 1: have a couple of years ago, I went I watched

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Speaker 1: two thousand one of Space on he for the first time.

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Speaker 1: I hated it. I hated. I was like, I don't

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Speaker 1: get that movie. We talked it with Toynb Tiles. You know,

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Speaker 1: we were talking about Cubic idea resurrects on dead on

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Speaker 1: planet Jupiter, and you were just like, I hate that

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Speaker 1: thing and hate it and now that I don't understand

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Speaker 1: search on it I started to get it. But that's

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Speaker 1: what that's the way Cuber movies. Absolutely, he didn't believe

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Speaker 1: in just giving it all up front. He would make

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Speaker 1: you think about, well, you know what. I think that

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Speaker 1: his style was so the best way I can describe

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Speaker 1: it is that he intentionally wanted you to leave the

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Speaker 1: theater thinking that you had missed some grander point, because

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Speaker 1: usually you had right but even if you hadn't, even

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Speaker 1: if it was kind of straightforward. And that's why there's

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Speaker 1: all these theories about all these different movies, is that

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Speaker 1: you always end his movies thinking you've missed some huge point,

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Speaker 1: even if there's not. It's just his way of show

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Speaker 1: giving you the story. That's just the way that he

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Speaker 1: tells stories. I guess. I mean, I didn't let in.

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Speaker 1: I didn't leave the theater after the clock recordings thinking

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Speaker 1: I missed the point. But maybe I did. I don't know. Well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean I think for me, you know, as you

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Speaker 1: read a little bit about him and you you start

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Speaker 1: to actually kind of intellectualize about the movies, you realize like, oh,

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Speaker 1: there's so much of this kind of ethos around him

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Speaker 1: that there must have been some bigger message there. It

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Speaker 1: wasn't just about this one thing, even with you know,

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Speaker 1: Doctor Strangelove. The more you start to watch his movies,

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Speaker 1: the more you're like, Wow, did I miss something? Did

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Speaker 1: I like, was there some really poignant thing there that

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Speaker 1: I totally missed? And I think that even right though,

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Speaker 1: even if there wasn't something, because I don't think there

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Speaker 1: always is, but that's the way I would describe it. No,

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Speaker 1: I would say, that's that's not that's an app description. Absolutely. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And all one last thing before you run off to

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Speaker 1: him to watch his entire catalog. If you're not going

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Speaker 1: to do that, another one I would recommend his Paths

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Speaker 1: of Glory with Kirk Douglas. Have you guys ever seen

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Speaker 1: that one? No? No, I don't know that I've ever

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Speaker 1: seen that one. Yeah, that's good movie. Okay, Well, let's

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Speaker 1: let's give the a little bit of bio data here on.

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Speaker 1: Stanley made his first movie in nineteen fifty one, which

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Speaker 1: was a It was a really short documentary. He acquired

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Speaker 1: funding for it himself. I mean, in fifty one, it

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Speaker 1: cost a thousand bucks and he had to raise that

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Speaker 1: cash on his own. His last movie was in nine

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Speaker 1: Eyes Wide Shut, which I believe didn't Spielberg finish that movie?

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Speaker 1: You know, I swear I saw something that said that

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Speaker 1: he wasn't involved in them, like an interview. Yeah. I

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Speaker 1: remember reading aim at it somewhere because apparently the movie

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Speaker 1: wasn't completed, but maybe it wasn't Spielberg. It feels like

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Speaker 1: this is the sort of thing that like like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's kind kind of cool lore if it is, but

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Speaker 1: I don't think we'll probably ever confirm it. Yeah. Um, well,

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Speaker 1: I I think we've talked. We've talked a lot. I mean,

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Speaker 1: so far we told you about Stanley, and the last

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Speaker 1: thing I want to tell you is that, including the

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Speaker 1: short documentaries or the short films he made in the beginning,

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Speaker 1: he did a total of sixteen movies in forty years.

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Speaker 1: A lot. No, but but you also need to remember

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Speaker 1: that his movies took anywhere from one to two years

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Speaker 1: to complete, after which point he was exhausted because he

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Speaker 1: did everything. He did all of he you know, he's

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Speaker 1: involved in our direction, in the cinematography and the soundtracks.

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Speaker 1: He did all of the editing. He had cutting it

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Speaker 1: wasn't he Yeah, well yeah, and he had he had

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Speaker 1: it all sent to his home and he he did

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Speaker 1: all of the edits, and and the thing about it

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Speaker 1: is is he would take some scenes over, he would

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Speaker 1: take many, many takes. Well, we're going to talk about

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Speaker 1: this later. It's like that a lot. Yeah it is. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: well I think that might be one of the shortest

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Speaker 1: descriptions we've ever done on the show. But we're done

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Speaker 1: talking about all those things. We're gonna jump right into theories. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's not really theories, is it. Theories and interpretations. These

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Speaker 1: are just or just not our theories, but theories that

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Speaker 1: other people have. Oh yeah, well most of times theories

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Speaker 1: aren't our theories. But but yeah, I guess, yeah, interpret

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Speaker 1: how would you describe it? No, I guess theories about

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Speaker 1: because it's not really like theories of how this thing happened, right,

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Speaker 1: it's theories of what mean okay, and also why perhaps

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Speaker 1: Kuber did it? There we go meanings and reasons this

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Speaker 1: week on Thinking Side Wins. Okay, well, we're going to

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Speaker 1: start out with my favorite one. Yes, we're gonna start

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Speaker 1: out with the first meaning slash reason, which is the

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Speaker 1: moon landing. Because it was fake let's talk about Well, no, no,

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Speaker 1: these theorists starn't saying that it was faked. They're saying

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Speaker 1: we made it to the moon, just that we didn't

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Speaker 1: make it to the moon at this particular moment where

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Speaker 1: the footage isn't right. So let's yeah here, let me

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Speaker 1: let me get this. There's actually more. It's more than that, right,

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Speaker 1: It's more than just saying, oh, you didn't make it

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Speaker 1: to the moon and we did it on a sound stage.

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Speaker 1: Because they're not saying we didn't make it to the moon.

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Speaker 1: They're saying that the footage that was sent of Neil

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Speaker 1: Armstrong and buzz Aldren hopping around on the moon for

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Speaker 1: twenty some odd minutes was fake. Was fake? Right, that's

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Speaker 1: what it said. Yeah, I do. I think it's important

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Speaker 1: to clear that. That is a good point. But why

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Speaker 1: if we made it to the moon, because we have

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Speaker 1: let me get into this first and then we'll cover

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Speaker 1: that at the end. You are you are just for

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Speaker 1: the end of everyone tonight, all right. According to this,

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Speaker 1: Cubrick was the one who did all of the filming

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Speaker 1: of the Astronauts on the Moon. He directed it, and

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Speaker 1: he then had remorse over it, and so he's explaining

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Speaker 1: that through things in the movie The Shining. Officially, according

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Speaker 1: to history, the United States landed on the Moon and

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Speaker 1: a manned mission in nineteen sixty nine, that's when we

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Speaker 1: talked about buzz Aldrin and Neil Armstrong certainly lost that name.

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Speaker 1: You would think I'm the one who's been working crazy hours.

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Speaker 1: But in nineteen sixty eight, which was the year before

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Speaker 1: that happened, Cubrick released two thousand one of Space Odyssey,

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Speaker 1: and that had some really elaborate space scenes in it,

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Speaker 1: on the Moon and guys floating around in space, and

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Speaker 1: that was all done with a technique that is called

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Speaker 1: front projection. The simple version of what front projection is

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Speaker 1: is you have your actors. They're standing in front of

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Speaker 1: a camera. You have some kind of plane behind them

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Speaker 1: so that the ground doesn't just continue to go flat,

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Speaker 1: something rises up and they're physically on. Right behind that

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Speaker 1: is a reflective surface, which I'm just gonna call a

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Speaker 1: mirror because it basically is a mirror. But that mirror

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Speaker 1: is big and turned at an angle, and from the

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Speaker 1: side another camera is projecting something on it. It's so

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Speaker 1: that they look like they're in front of what's being projected,

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Speaker 1: whether it's still or motion film. Right, So it's like

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Speaker 1: pre good green screen. Absolutely, there was technology at the

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Speaker 1: time where you could fake the backgrounds, but it was

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Speaker 1: really bad. My favorite I always think of that old

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Speaker 1: these movies Sinbad in the seven scenes where the guy is,

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Speaker 1: you know, the genie is is going around and you

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Speaker 1: can tell that they're they're showing it on a movie

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Speaker 1: screen from the other side. So he didn't want that

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Speaker 1: because he looked like crap. So he used this technique

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00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:21,440
Speaker 1: and therefore what and therefore it was very realistic. And

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Speaker 1: there's a there's a very easy scene in two thousand

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Speaker 1: one that I think shows this, where I think it's

403
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Speaker 1: three people are standing on lunar surface and they're on

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Speaker 1: a bit of a ridge, and I even noticed that

405
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Speaker 1: part of the bottom of the scene was taken up

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Speaker 1: by lunar rock and it seemed odd to me. But

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Speaker 1: that's a very easy example of how it worked. So

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Speaker 1: what they are then saying is that this is how

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Speaker 1: he made the footage that we all saw or that

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Speaker 1: everyone saw in the and in fairness, when you watched

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Speaker 1: two thousand one Space Odessey or you look at the

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Speaker 1: pictures of them on on the quote unquote moon, it

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Speaker 1: looks really good for that time. It actually looks pretty

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Speaker 1: dang good for this time with our CJ C G

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Speaker 1: I technology. Yeah, you know, I mean except for the

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Speaker 1: footage of like you know, of spaceships and that. And

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Speaker 1: I'm right, I'm admitting the Discovery. Discovery was a huge

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Speaker 1: model if they filmed on sound stage that. But you

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Speaker 1: see this, you see, like early on you see a

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Speaker 1: satellite going around the Earth and it looks like they

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00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,320
Speaker 1: drew it on cardboard. Yeah. But that's the only thing

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Speaker 1: about the movie that doesn't look great today support of

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Speaker 1: this theory. Right, you look at the images of these

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Speaker 1: actors on a sound stage with this front projection on

425
00:23:44,880 --> 00:23:49,040
Speaker 1: the quote unquote moon, it looks real good. And if

426
00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:52,080
Speaker 1: you think about front projection. And then I went back

427
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 1: and watched some of the footage of the landing the

428
00:23:56,880 --> 00:24:00,679
Speaker 1: camera the lunar surface takes up about half of the

429
00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:04,200
Speaker 1: left frame and then slope so that it's taking up

430
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 1: about a quarter of the right hand side of the frame.

431
00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 1: So that is, of course for this more ammunition to

432
00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 1: prove that it was fake. And it's grainy, you know,

433
00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:19,080
Speaker 1: it's not you know, I think there are some points

434
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:21,080
Speaker 1: to be made about this, whether or not I totally

435
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:24,480
Speaker 1: believe it. Yeah, and we're going to move away from

436
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,480
Speaker 1: front screen or front projection. He wanted to call it

437
00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:30,560
Speaker 1: front screen for some reason, but it's not. We're now

438
00:24:30,680 --> 00:24:34,760
Speaker 1: going to move to the Overlook Hotel in the Shining

439
00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:37,600
Speaker 1: and we're going to go to the second floor. You,

440
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:39,960
Speaker 1: if you've seen the movie, you know this because it's

441
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:45,359
Speaker 1: the red yellow or red and orange brown hexagonal carpet. Yeah,

442
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 1: and this is this is towards why right, this is

443
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:52,720
Speaker 1: evidence of him telling the story. Yes, it's saying that

444
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:56,280
Speaker 1: he used that carpet as a way to make a

445
00:24:56,440 --> 00:25:00,400
Speaker 1: very obvious clue that he had faked the Moonland. Yes,

446
00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:02,919
Speaker 1: that we're no longer on the This is how he

447
00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:05,000
Speaker 1: faked the moon Land. Correct, not how, but this is

448
00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:09,479
Speaker 1: his way of tells and and exactly how does that revealed?

449
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:14,560
Speaker 1: If you if you look at launch pads at Cape Carnaveral,

450
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:21,399
Speaker 1: Cape carnaval suddenly can't say that word either, Cornaveral, putting

451
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 1: the R in a weird place. Steve, It's it's fine.

452
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:27,680
Speaker 1: It's like when I said cavalry instead of cavalry. Both

453
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: of those are wrong. Wrong. Well, yeah, there's there's the

454
00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:35,360
Speaker 1: cape the Cape Carnaveral pattern. But if they're saying that

455
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 1: because those those launch pads are in heck shapes, but

456
00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 1: they're not perfect hexes because it'll land around them. You

457
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:47,880
Speaker 1: can see, and I've seen images superimposed when the cameras

458
00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 1: at just the right angle, so the perspective is stretching

459
00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:55,840
Speaker 1: things out. It's almost a perfect match to a couple

460
00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,880
Speaker 1: of those launch pads. So he uh Kubrick then had

461
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 1: that carpet made. I think it would have gone on

462
00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:06,960
Speaker 1: bottle roll carpet, and he chose the carpet. I don't know,

463
00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:08,800
Speaker 1: but this is the same scene where something else a

464
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:12,320
Speaker 1: little suspicious happens, right, like the this is the scene

465
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:16,120
Speaker 1: where Danny happens to be wearing that sweater. Yes, yes,

466
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 1: So that's the other clue in here, is that Danny

467
00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:21,800
Speaker 1: is wearing the Apollo eleven sweater. So I think it's

468
00:26:21,840 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 1: part of it is that these things coincide that makes

469
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:28,240
Speaker 1: people suspicious, right, It's not just because you can kind

470
00:26:28,280 --> 00:26:31,200
Speaker 1: of make the hexagonal thing fit. It's also because Danny

471
00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:34,679
Speaker 1: happens to be wearing Apollo eleven sweater. That is another

472
00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 1: key piece. Am I jumping? No? No, No, it's it's

473
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:42,560
Speaker 1: absolutely an important important thing there. I think this is

474
00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: what you guys were Joe was kind of getting into

475
00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:47,119
Speaker 1: a little bit, which is why would this footage, the

476
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:51,240
Speaker 1: lunar landing footage around. Yeah, a little bit in this theory,

477
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:54,879
Speaker 1: But why did the footage get faked? There was a

478
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:59,080
Speaker 1: space race. We had to get to the moon, and

479
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:02,639
Speaker 1: of course the Russians were wanting to get to the moon.

480
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:07,080
Speaker 1: So according to this we couldn't get there. We couldn't

481
00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:11,760
Speaker 1: get there first, so we faked it. That's why it happened,

482
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:15,439
Speaker 1: so that we could have supremacy in that that manner,

483
00:27:15,560 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 1: even if it wasn't real, they would think it was real,

484
00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:21,840
Speaker 1: so we would win, and history remember us as being

485
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 1: there first, okay, and then uh so sore they saying

486
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:29,199
Speaker 1: that eventually one of the Apollo eventually we got we

487
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:31,840
Speaker 1: got men on the moon. Which Apollo mission was it?

488
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:36,439
Speaker 1: They don't say, conveniently, Yeah, yeah. The in and in

489
00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:39,439
Speaker 1: the readings for this particular theory, you'll also come across

490
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 1: some stuff that talks about a strange light in the

491
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,840
Speaker 1: night sky that shouldn't be there according to the stars,

492
00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:49,399
Speaker 1: and there's a million reasons why that is. But the

493
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,280
Speaker 1: theory says that there was a random light on in

494
00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 1: the studio that that mirror picked up. Oh, it's interesting.

495
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,760
Speaker 1: That's not what I what what I had read about it.

496
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:00,800
Speaker 1: It was that it was the light of the projector.

497
00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:05,520
Speaker 1: That's where the projector was like pinhole hitting. That's what

498
00:28:05,640 --> 00:28:09,760
Speaker 1: I read the talking about some some light was left on,

499
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:17,080
Speaker 1: was what I got. I mean, either way, it's it's yeah,

500
00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 1: yeah again. Um so now there's there's other ways that

501
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:25,080
Speaker 1: According to this, Kubrick tells us that it is the

502
00:28:25,160 --> 00:28:29,120
Speaker 1: lunar landing and he's sorry. That is. When Dick Halleran

503
00:28:29,240 --> 00:28:34,760
Speaker 1: takes Wendy and Danny into the pantry, there's Tang cans

504
00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:38,160
Speaker 1: on the wall, which, of course the astronauts drank Tang,

505
00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: so did everybody else. I know, I had Tang in

506
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 1: my earthquake kit when I was a kid, and I

507
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:48,840
Speaker 1: was in the nineties. Like, come on, guys. The other clue,

508
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:53,160
Speaker 1: another clue we have is that room, the room where

509
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 1: the spirits are, where the scary naked old lady is

510
00:28:56,840 --> 00:29:04,480
Speaker 1: at is room to the moon even figures two seven

511
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:07,560
Speaker 1: thousand miles away from the Earth. The other one that

512
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:10,239
Speaker 1: they had in that one, right was the key. Are

513
00:29:10,280 --> 00:29:13,360
Speaker 1: you're gonna talk about that? No? I hadn't the cow

514
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 1: at it because I really was so dumb to me,

515
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:19,800
Speaker 1: it's super dumb. Yeah, but I like to talk about that.

516
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 1: The key has a little tag on it right to

517
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:26,400
Speaker 1: label what room it is for, and it says room

518
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:31,479
Speaker 1: no like number and then yeah but end. Oh and

519
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: it's a capital end and a tiny little oh. So

520
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 1: people say, well, you can only have it say room,

521
00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 1: or if you add the end it can be moon.

522
00:29:44,200 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 1: You switch it around. So obviously Cubrick was trying to

523
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 1: say that it was the Moon Room and everything was

524
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 1: fake in there, and that that's he was. He faked it. Yeah,

525
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:57,680
Speaker 1: that's exactly it. So smart. Okay, so there's the last thing.

526
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 1: Actually I'm jumping ahead. Um, yeah, you're forgetting about the twins.

527
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:06,760
Speaker 1: I am grady girls girls. Okay. You hear him referred

528
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:10,320
Speaker 1: to as the twins because the girls who played the

529
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 1: characters of the Girls in the Blue Dress are twins.

530
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,040
Speaker 1: Super creepy, super creepy. Yeah yeah, well you know, I've

531
00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:21,960
Speaker 1: seen him as adults and they still look really didn't

532
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,280
Speaker 1: look that alike. Yeah, I got that too. But people

533
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 1: point out the fact that Allman, the manager of the

534
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 1: Overlook Hotel, says that they were the greedy girls about

535
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 1: eight and ten years old. And in the book they're

536
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 1: not twins. So people say, well, obviously this is a

537
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,520
Speaker 1: reference to the Gemini space program as you were heading too,

538
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:47,640
Speaker 1: because he's using twins and when they didn't need to

539
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:53,239
Speaker 1: be twins. And you know, we've talked, but Gemini was

540
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 1: the space program that was in effect before we started

541
00:30:57,080 --> 00:30:59,840
Speaker 1: sending men to the Moon. That's when we're doing all

542
00:30:59,840 --> 00:31:03,400
Speaker 1: of research because the orbital missions, it was two astronauts

543
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,120
Speaker 1: and a capsule. In a capsule, actually they did some

544
00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:08,720
Speaker 1: interesting stuff and it was all leading your research and

545
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:12,120
Speaker 1: techniques leading up to the success of apology astronauts get

546
00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:15,720
Speaker 1: into a popcad basically. But actually that the Gemini missions.

547
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: We did our first spacewalk from a Gemini capsule, and

548
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,280
Speaker 1: then there was one cool mission where they launched they

549
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:23,520
Speaker 1: launched one capsule, and then a couple of days later

550
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:26,680
Speaker 1: they launched the second one and they actually rendevouted orbit

551
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:28,600
Speaker 1: and connected up and stuff and so all kinds of

552
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:31,040
Speaker 1: really kind of cool stuff and it was important to

553
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 1: the Apollo mission. Lad But but according to this theory,

554
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:38,160
Speaker 1: the girls are the direct layer to Gemini. They were

555
00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 1: the predecess I mean, I get it right. They were

556
00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 1: the predecessor to Danny. They were the last kid that

557
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:46,480
Speaker 1: lived there, but they were the Gemini. And well, no,

558
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:48,479
Speaker 1: because you can't do that, because I say, well, then

559
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 1: the Torrents family is three, which would then be a

560
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:54,600
Speaker 1: reference to Apollo, but that that takes away the caretaker

561
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 1: grading and his wife who were already there, so that

562
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,840
Speaker 1: doesn't actually work. But but you could spend the theory

563
00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:04,920
Speaker 1: that way. But Danny was what's tony and also could

564
00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:10,480
Speaker 1: shine to what was his name? Yeah, so he was three?

565
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:20,120
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe, Well, let's I'm sorry. Here's the last thing

566
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:23,920
Speaker 1: that I found everywhere about this, which is in the

567
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:29,480
Speaker 1: Colorado room. We see Jack on his typewriter. Wendy comes

568
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:33,600
Speaker 1: in and interrupts him, and he pitches a fit and

569
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 1: choose her out about his responsibilities and his work. The

570
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 1: all the proponents of this say, well, that's a word

571
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:48,280
Speaker 1: for word representation of a conversation that Stanley had with

572
00:32:48,360 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 1: his wife about his regrets and the money for doing

573
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:59,200
Speaker 1: the moon landing footage. The problem is that is outright wrong.

574
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 1: Be because thank you New York Times. There their stuff

575
00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:06,280
Speaker 1: is archived and on the net, and there is an

576
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:11,400
Speaker 1: interview with Jack Nicholson talking about the fact that he

577
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 1: and Cubrick had initially looked at the scene, he had

578
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 1: talked to him about the fact how it reminded him

579
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,320
Speaker 1: of what had happened with him and his then ex

580
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:25,320
Speaker 1: ex wife just before and then during their divorce. Nicholson

581
00:33:26,200 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 1: h Nicholson's Okay, Nicholson's divorce. Sorry, they both were married

582
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:33,640
Speaker 1: several times, I think which one we were at that point.

583
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 1: But but then so they wrote the scene together, which

584
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 1: means that it couldn't be a direct representation of a

585
00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:47,600
Speaker 1: conversation that Stanley had with his wife. So that I mean,

586
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 1: we've shot this one full of holes planet in their apartment. Anyway,

587
00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:56,920
Speaker 1: you know that it would have been that Cubrick wrote it.

588
00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:01,720
Speaker 1: But that's one of the one other fork to stick

589
00:34:01,760 --> 00:34:06,640
Speaker 1: in this thing is that the represent to thirty seven,

590
00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:10,400
Speaker 1: representing the two thirty seven thousand mile distance between the

591
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: Earth and the Moon, is the room number was not

592
00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:16,839
Speaker 1: actually two thirty seven to begin with. It was to seventeen,

593
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,200
Speaker 1: and they're thinking that they changed to to thirty seven.

594
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:22,759
Speaker 1: The reason they did that is when they film exteriors

595
00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:26,280
Speaker 1: a timberline lodge up on Mount Hood, the lodge asked

596
00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:29,040
Speaker 1: them to use a different room number and not room

597
00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:31,279
Speaker 1: two seventeen because they were afraid that people would be

598
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:33,799
Speaker 1: afraid to stay in room two seventeen. But Joe, they

599
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:38,680
Speaker 1: don't actually have a two seventeen. No, they do. Sorry,

600
00:34:39,239 --> 00:34:41,480
Speaker 1: I've heard it said about this. They're like, but if

601
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:44,279
Speaker 1: you call Timberline Lodge, they don't they don't have a

602
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:47,120
Speaker 1: room number two seventeen. I've been there, as have you.

603
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:49,640
Speaker 1: I'm sure you know they have a room to seventeen

604
00:34:50,239 --> 00:34:53,600
Speaker 1: and at it's their most popular room. They don't have

605
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:56,759
Speaker 1: a room to thirty seven. Yeah, so what you're saying

606
00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:59,520
Speaker 1: is right. But I just wanted to bring up that

607
00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 1: that's a thing that people say, people do push that.

608
00:35:03,160 --> 00:35:06,839
Speaker 1: Shall we move on to the next one? Yeah? Wow,

609
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:11,520
Speaker 1: we beat that one? Or horse? Um, okay, let's talk

610
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 1: more about horses, well a little bit. Not really, We're

611
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:18,400
Speaker 1: going to go to our next one, which is that

612
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:22,800
Speaker 1: this was all about the massacre of the American Indians.

613
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 1: Here's how it goes. When the Torrances first get to

614
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:31,040
Speaker 1: the hotel and Stewart Alman is showing them around. He's

615
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 1: the manager. He takes tells them that the hotel is

616
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 1: built on an Indian burial ground and that during construction

617
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:42,200
Speaker 1: they had to fight off Indians, so there's probably some

618
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:46,680
Speaker 1: buried there. And then as you see the scenes as

619
00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 1: they're panning around the hotel, and if you watch, there's

620
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:54,759
Speaker 1: a lot of Native American artwork and there are photos

621
00:35:55,239 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 1: that there's at least one very prominent one that is

622
00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:00,799
Speaker 1: a man. It's just a headshot of a man in

623
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:04,720
Speaker 1: a headdress. Then we talked about, yeah, the artwork which

624
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:07,279
Speaker 1: is going to be the tapestry in the Colorado room,

625
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:12,040
Speaker 1: which is a huge tapestry, giant thing. So again there's

626
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:15,000
Speaker 1: this this this movie has a lot of giant things

627
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:16,920
Speaker 1: and a lot of a lot of huge rooms. In

628
00:36:16,920 --> 00:36:21,320
Speaker 1: this huge rooms, the huge rugs. All the rugs are themed.

629
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:24,320
Speaker 1: They're kind of a Native American themes. Some of the

630
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 1: floors have inlays that are the Native American themes. So

631
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,919
Speaker 1: it's everywhere. But they are saying that that's because he's

632
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:36,520
Speaker 1: trying to tell us that this is about the American Indians.

633
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:40,239
Speaker 1: Were any pictures of dead Indians? No, but there were

634
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 1: Besides that, there is We're going to talk about the

635
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:46,920
Speaker 1: pantry a number of times, and we're gonna go back

636
00:36:46,920 --> 00:36:51,080
Speaker 1: to the pantry right now because when Dick Hallerin shows

637
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:57,200
Speaker 1: Wendy and Danny the pantry. There are cans again, big

638
00:36:57,320 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 1: cans there, big Calumet baking soda cans. It's not surprisingly're

639
00:37:03,520 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 1: there because it's part of the that was a major

640
00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:10,080
Speaker 1: brand at the time, and it's stockpiling a giant hotel

641
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:14,160
Speaker 1: that feeds gads of people. But that can part of

642
00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:16,720
Speaker 1: it is it's a bright red can and it's got

643
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:20,520
Speaker 1: a reverse image of a face with a headdress on,

644
00:37:21,640 --> 00:37:24,319
Speaker 1: so it's it's a Calcum American Indian. Yeah. I think

645
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:26,840
Speaker 1: that stuff is still sold, right, it is. I it

646
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:33,560
Speaker 1: was like, I don't know, we have like four cans, okay,

647
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 1: but you know, so there's that time when the cans

648
00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:41,000
Speaker 1: show up and they're all nice and neat and orderly

649
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:43,400
Speaker 1: and all facing forward, and then we're going to flip

650
00:37:43,400 --> 00:37:48,759
Speaker 1: ahead to win. Wendy locks Jack in the pantry after

651
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:51,680
Speaker 1: she clubs him in the head with a baseball back spoilers.

652
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:57,120
Speaker 1: I told you that's a good thing. You watched this. Yeah, Well,

653
00:37:57,239 --> 00:37:59,799
Speaker 1: at that time, when Jack is leaning against the door

654
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:03,680
Speaker 1: talking to Wendy trying to open it, you can see

655
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 1: all of these cans on the edge of the shelf

656
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:09,880
Speaker 1: except they're now no longer square, they're slightly turned. You

657
00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:14,799
Speaker 1: can't see everything. So what this says is that that

658
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 1: is representative of the way we can. The American government

659
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 1: came to the American Indians and said, we're gonna make

660
00:38:22,200 --> 00:38:24,840
Speaker 1: all these treaties and we're gonna be very honest upfront

661
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:26,840
Speaker 1: with you, which is why all the cans are facing

662
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:30,920
Speaker 1: forward at first, and then we changed our mind The

663
00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 1: American government changes their minds. They do all these things,

664
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:36,960
Speaker 1: and they basically break all their promises, which is why

665
00:38:37,000 --> 00:38:44,000
Speaker 1: the cans are turned to represent that breaking of the promise. Yeah,

666
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 1: I don't know that I really go into that. That

667
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:49,560
Speaker 1: doesn't make sense, how the twist of a prop. But

668
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 1: I have seen photos of of Stanley there very specifically

669
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:57,640
Speaker 1: adjusting the cans. Could have been for lighting reasons or

670
00:38:57,719 --> 00:39:00,120
Speaker 1: too much detail or not enough. I don't know, you.

671
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:06,840
Speaker 1: I was just gonna say that I I think that uh, Stanley,

672
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:09,520
Speaker 1: if nothing else, was really good at setting the mood.

673
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:13,360
Speaker 1: And I know that there's been a lot of talk

674
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 1: about his really great ability in the shining to create

675
00:39:17,760 --> 00:39:23,600
Speaker 1: this sense of disjointed reality. And I I I personally

676
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:26,279
Speaker 1: just coming from a theater background and having experience in

677
00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:30,000
Speaker 1: set dressing and things like that, understand that you're supposed

678
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,880
Speaker 1: to feel uncomfortable in a very regimented way in the beginning,

679
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:36,759
Speaker 1: and then things start to fall apart and they get

680
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:39,319
Speaker 1: crazier and crazier, and that that's a great way to

681
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:43,879
Speaker 1: make people unconsciously realize it. The fact that people have

682
00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:46,839
Speaker 1: taken it and analyzed it and all that, that's it's

683
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 1: a maybe reading a little too deep in something that

684
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:53,120
Speaker 1: he was just trying to make people feel subconsciously. That

685
00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 1: would be. That's my general reading of that whole thing.

686
00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:58,000
Speaker 1: You know that he's it is it's supposed to feel

687
00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 1: like everything's falling apart, so of worse he's going to

688
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:03,560
Speaker 1: adjust it and it's not. I don't know. Yeah, I

689
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:06,799
Speaker 1: think that's a linear I guess, yeah, yeah. I think

690
00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:09,080
Speaker 1: if Cuber could really wanted to make a movie about

691
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:12,320
Speaker 1: the massacre of the Indians and the white Man's broken promises,

692
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:14,919
Speaker 1: he probably would have just made a western. He would

693
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:18,400
Speaker 1: have made an actual movie about it. Again, it's kind

694
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:19,680
Speaker 1: of sad that he died as young as he did

695
00:40:19,719 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 1: and he didn't have a chance to make a Western.

696
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:26,279
Speaker 1: It's true he didn't, did He never made a Western. Yeah, well,

697
00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:28,880
Speaker 1: let's let's keep going with the more of the metaphors

698
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:32,239
Speaker 1: that we're going to find in this there's more Indian stuff, Oh,

699
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:35,279
Speaker 1: there's there's more so than the next one that we've

700
00:40:35,320 --> 00:40:38,880
Speaker 1: got is the fact that in the very in sequence,

701
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:44,200
Speaker 1: the camera zooms in to the framed photos on the wall,

702
00:40:44,239 --> 00:40:47,920
Speaker 1: and then the very center one shows Jack Nicholson. They're

703
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:53,320
Speaker 1: underneath it. It says Overlook Hotel, July fourth of July.

704
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: Fourth of July to most Americans is the celebration of independence.

705
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:03,720
Speaker 1: But according to this metaphor, it's emphasizing the fact that

706
00:41:03,719 --> 00:41:07,240
Speaker 1: that's not necessarily the case for the American Indians because

707
00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:10,919
Speaker 1: we screwed them a whole bunch and they don't have

708
00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 1: what they used to have. You know, this isn't again,

709
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:17,759
Speaker 1: incredibly weak, because I mean seeing that, seeing that, like

710
00:41:17,760 --> 00:41:20,040
Speaker 1: the date of July four doesn't make me think of

711
00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:22,919
Speaker 1: the the Indians, because the Indians this is not really

712
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 1: their celebration of the independent Salmon. Would you ever would

713
00:41:26,120 --> 00:41:29,799
Speaker 1: looking at July fourth ever make you think Indians? No?

714
00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:31,800
Speaker 1: But you know again, I'm not part of that culture,

715
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:34,200
Speaker 1: so I of course it wouldn't. You know, I'm a

716
00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 1: normal white guy in middle class America. So that's I'm

717
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:40,560
Speaker 1: gonna know it as that thing that it is meant

718
00:41:40,600 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: to represent to our class. That's that's where this metaphor

719
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:47,439
Speaker 1: is going. I I I'm on board with you. I

720
00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:50,359
Speaker 1: think that it is a tell of a leap. It's

721
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:53,399
Speaker 1: a big old stretch. It's a big stretch, like a Mr.

722
00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:57,080
Speaker 1: Incredible stretch. And by the way, just as an aside,

723
00:41:57,160 --> 00:42:00,360
Speaker 1: that particular shot is really cool. It's a really cool shots.

724
00:42:00,520 --> 00:42:05,319
Speaker 1: So when it zooms in and slowly moves forward and

725
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:07,360
Speaker 1: closes in on these nine pictures on the wall, and

726
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:09,440
Speaker 1: then it closes in on the middle picture, and then

727
00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:12,879
Speaker 1: it closes in further and further and further to Jack

728
00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:17,440
Speaker 1: Nicholson standing there part. It's very it's very indicative with

729
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:20,399
Speaker 1: his style where it's just so slow, but it's very

730
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:23,879
Speaker 1: directed in some instance isn't and others you don't really

731
00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:25,680
Speaker 1: know what he was going after and he was doing

732
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:29,360
Speaker 1: it on purpose. Uh. We have a couple of bits

733
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:33,880
Speaker 1: more here. So we have the death of Dick Hallerin.

734
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:36,920
Speaker 1: So we know that Dick gets to the Overlook Hotel,

735
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,799
Speaker 1: he comes in, Jack pops out from around the side

736
00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:43,879
Speaker 1: of a column, and hits him in the heart with

737
00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:47,880
Speaker 1: an axe, drops him to the floor and he dies.

738
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:51,560
Speaker 1: Should have brought it gun with him? Yeah, probably he

739
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:54,359
Speaker 1: knew it was going on. Yeah, well, of course when

740
00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:58,520
Speaker 1: we've seen him next, he is laid splayed out and

741
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 1: bleeding an According to a lot of the reading on this,

742
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,759
Speaker 1: he is laying on a rug that has an American

743
00:43:05,880 --> 00:43:09,920
Speaker 1: Indian design. Well, I'm gonna point out he's not laying

744
00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:14,120
Speaker 1: on a rug. He's actually laying on the floor. It's

745
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:19,000
Speaker 1: the little lium tile floor I guess would be linoleum. Yeah,

746
00:43:19,200 --> 00:43:22,799
Speaker 1: when he's not tile, it's in late so it's got

747
00:43:22,800 --> 00:43:26,600
Speaker 1: to be little Regardless, he's laying on a shiny floor

748
00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:29,719
Speaker 1: bleeding on it. I will admit it's got some inlays

749
00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:33,319
Speaker 1: that could be rather you know, interpreted, but mostly they're

750
00:43:33,360 --> 00:43:36,120
Speaker 1: just kind of half Chevron's in in the corners. So

751
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:38,400
Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's okay. It's fair to say

752
00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:41,319
Speaker 1: that almost every other scene of the Shining either takes

753
00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:44,360
Speaker 1: place in a kitchen which is clearly tiled, slash linoleum,

754
00:43:44,800 --> 00:43:49,839
Speaker 1: or very carpeted. So okay, fine, Yeah, there's something weird

755
00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:53,120
Speaker 1: happening there. Is it explainable by not wanting to stay

756
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:57,160
Speaker 1: in a set carpet with big blood. Sure, why not?

757
00:43:57,400 --> 00:43:59,839
Speaker 1: I mean if I feel like that's stretching even less

758
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:02,400
Speaker 1: and this explanation, Oh well, I've got one more stretch

759
00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:05,719
Speaker 1: for you, and that's the elevator. We're gonna go back

760
00:44:05,760 --> 00:44:07,360
Speaker 1: to the beginning of this one when I talked about

761
00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 1: Allman saying it was a burial ground. Okay, Well, if

762
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:14,480
Speaker 1: you think about the way an elevator is constructed, the

763
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,160
Speaker 1: first floor is not where it ends. It's shaft and

764
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:20,040
Speaker 1: its machinery or farther down and below some of it

765
00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:22,480
Speaker 1: at least hotel how the basement, that's what they had

766
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:26,480
Speaker 1: their boilers. But they're saying there's a shaft going down

767
00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:30,600
Speaker 1: and that's burrowing into that Indian burial ground, which is

768
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:34,360
Speaker 1: why do we have the blood scene where all the

769
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:38,719
Speaker 1: blood comes pouring out of the elevator. It's like a

770
00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 1: splash mountain. Add I splash mountain was covered in blood

771
00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:45,719
Speaker 1: and gore and it's just it's it flows everywhere and

772
00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:48,239
Speaker 1: it's insane. And they're saying that's the release of the

773
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:52,319
Speaker 1: spirits of all of these Indians because this thing is

774
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:57,960
Speaker 1: plunging into their heart. Yeah, it's releasing them, none of it.

775
00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 1: None of it. That's melodramatic. I'd the fact that the

776
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:05,719
Speaker 1: hotel was built on an Indian burial ground. I mean,

777
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:09,080
Speaker 1: Stephen King actually used that particular plot device and numerous

778
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 1: books of his. Uh, you know, there was like in

779
00:45:11,719 --> 00:45:15,440
Speaker 1: pet cemetery. Wasn't there like the mcmac Indian burial ground

780
00:45:15,560 --> 00:45:18,640
Speaker 1: where all the evil mojo came from that reanimated the pets.

781
00:45:18,960 --> 00:45:20,719
Speaker 1: You know, it's so long since I've seen that movie,

782
00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:23,719
Speaker 1: I don't even remember. But also, this is America. What

783
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:27,319
Speaker 1: isn't built on an Indian burial ground? Very true? There's

784
00:45:27,360 --> 00:45:30,560
Speaker 1: probably there's probably white people too, buried under my house.

785
00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:33,840
Speaker 1: I mean, well, no, it's more likely Indians. But I

786
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:37,480
Speaker 1: mean there's probably a lot of dead white people everywhere.

787
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:41,879
Speaker 1: There's people everywhere, regardless of nationality, and they're all over

788
00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:45,239
Speaker 1: the place. Yeah, the I guess this is what The

789
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:51,040
Speaker 1: third one, well, wow, we're gonna to start talking fast. Yeah,

790
00:45:51,640 --> 00:45:57,719
Speaker 1: as Job says, talking really fast, let's talk real. This one.

791
00:45:58,719 --> 00:46:03,319
Speaker 1: This one says is that it's about the Holocaust. That's

792
00:46:03,360 --> 00:46:06,000
Speaker 1: not the one I found rather tendentious. Sorry, we're hitting

793
00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 1: that point in the theories where I'm just gonna start

794
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:11,520
Speaker 1: saying no. Al right, Well, before you start shouting no,

795
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:15,080
Speaker 1: let me explain that saying not shouting. Oh, okay, well

796
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:18,200
Speaker 1: before you start saying no, devonka, let me let me

797
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:22,319
Speaker 1: go through it. The first part of this is that

798
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:26,239
Speaker 1: it's all based on Nazi symbolism. The Nazis, of course

799
00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:28,840
Speaker 1: love the Eagle had that on a bunch of their stuff,

800
00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:34,520
Speaker 1: on their paraphernalia. Our first item that is a Holocaust

801
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:39,960
Speaker 1: representation is Jack's Adler typewriter, and that thing seth Holocaust.

802
00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:43,200
Speaker 1: More of the typewriter, well, it's German brand and it's

803
00:46:43,239 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 1: got a giant eagle spread across the front um. It

804
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:51,279
Speaker 1: doesn't actually explain why the typewriter changes color midway through

805
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:53,719
Speaker 1: the film, but believe that it goes from kind of

806
00:46:53,719 --> 00:46:55,799
Speaker 1: a white cream color to a light blue. But I

807
00:46:55,800 --> 00:46:59,560
Speaker 1: almost wonder if that's a lighting issue. But it changes color,

808
00:46:59,600 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 1: but it's away they had two types. No, it just

809
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:07,320
Speaker 1: seems really I don't know. Maybe um. But there's also

810
00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 1: the fact that the name Adler, translated from German to

811
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:16,399
Speaker 1: English is eagle. It is I even tested that app

812
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:18,799
Speaker 1: because I wasn't. I did too, I really did it.

813
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 1: Three times to make sure Google wasn't messing with me. Um,

814
00:47:23,160 --> 00:47:26,000
Speaker 1: and uh, let's see what else. Oh, there's more symbolism.

815
00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:29,200
Speaker 1: There is one of the early scenes where Jack is

816
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:32,040
Speaker 1: in bed and he wakes up. He's being filmed in

817
00:47:32,080 --> 00:47:34,520
Speaker 1: the mirror. Wendy brings him breakfast. He wakes up at

818
00:47:34,520 --> 00:47:36,799
Speaker 1: like eleven o'clock and I love that scene. But for

819
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 1: something else, Yeah, Well, if you look, he's wearing a

820
00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:45,960
Speaker 1: shirt that says Stovington and it's got the eagle on it.

821
00:47:46,080 --> 00:47:50,560
Speaker 1: They're saying the eagle is another representation a Nazi symbolism.

822
00:47:50,680 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 1: So pretty much they're saying that it's Nazis because eagles.

823
00:47:53,600 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 1: That's part of it. You want to point out. It's

824
00:47:56,239 --> 00:47:58,880
Speaker 1: one of the few times I saw Cuber really hold

825
00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:01,320
Speaker 1: to something in the script, which is are in the book.

826
00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:04,800
Speaker 1: The name of that school is the school that Jack

827
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:06,600
Speaker 1: used to work at, because if you remember the beginning,

828
00:48:06,680 --> 00:48:08,480
Speaker 1: City used to be a school teacher, and that's the

829
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:10,440
Speaker 1: name of the school they worked at. But back to

830
00:48:10,480 --> 00:48:15,960
Speaker 1: the Holocaust. Okay, this this one, what is the phrase

831
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:18,839
Speaker 1: you used earlier? A bit of a stretch. This one's

832
00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:21,160
Speaker 1: a bit of a stretch. It's saying that the music

833
00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 1: that was used in the film. All of those composers

834
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:28,839
Speaker 1: were post World War two composers, and that they were

835
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:34,520
Speaker 1: all influenced by the war. Ye that's yeah, yeah, there's

836
00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:37,000
Speaker 1: just no they're just they're just dating nothing. There. The

837
00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:40,960
Speaker 1: last thing that they do is math if you take

838
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,000
Speaker 1: because even even the people who are proponents of this

839
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:50,520
Speaker 1: theory say, I know it's a bit of a stretch,

840
00:48:50,760 --> 00:48:57,120
Speaker 1: but if you multiply two times three times seven, you

841
00:48:57,200 --> 00:49:03,160
Speaker 1: get which is repre editive of to win. The Germans

842
00:49:03,560 --> 00:49:09,640
Speaker 1: really took their their plans against the Jews and really

843
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:13,640
Speaker 1: ramped it up and started all of the atrocity. Yeah,

844
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:15,799
Speaker 1: but but the better in order to accomplish this, what

845
00:49:15,880 --> 00:49:19,680
Speaker 1: Cooper had to do was he had to to bribe

846
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:22,960
Speaker 1: the people a timberline lodge or it was a convenience

847
00:49:23,200 --> 00:49:25,600
Speaker 1: to ask for. It was a convenience. But but that's

848
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:29,359
Speaker 1: not the only place they're saying it's at. There are

849
00:49:29,640 --> 00:49:32,239
Speaker 1: forty two vehicles in the parking lot. When we did

850
00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 1: see the parking lot, did that I did not count

851
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:37,640
Speaker 1: them because it was so hard. In that movie they

852
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:43,200
Speaker 1: do actually count it. The gh in the doc room.

853
00:49:43,880 --> 00:49:48,200
Speaker 1: But also, you guys, seriously, like seriously Danny's wearing a

854
00:49:48,239 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 1: short shirt that has the number forty two on it.

855
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:56,279
Speaker 1: There is the number forty two in the license plate

856
00:49:56,440 --> 00:50:01,000
Speaker 1: of Dick Halloran's rental car. And do you remember when

857
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:06,080
Speaker 1: Wendy and Danny you're watching TV and before Danny goes

858
00:50:06,200 --> 00:50:08,839
Speaker 1: upstairs to get something out of their room, but they're

859
00:50:08,840 --> 00:50:11,520
Speaker 1: watching a show and it turns out it's the summer

860
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:15,319
Speaker 1: of forty two. Also a funny side note, there's no

861
00:50:15,560 --> 00:50:19,960
Speaker 1: plug on that television. There's no cord. I'm sorry, I

862
00:50:20,040 --> 00:50:24,560
Speaker 1: just like forty two. You know what else is forty

863
00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:26,879
Speaker 1: two is the answer to life in The Hitchhiker's Guide

864
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:30,000
Speaker 1: to the Galaxy. If we're going there, we're going there,

865
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:33,799
Speaker 1: right right, I mean the Hitchhiker's Guide came out. When

866
00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:36,160
Speaker 1: did that come out? You know, I don't remember. That

867
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:38,719
Speaker 1: would have been a seventies sometime. I would have been

868
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:41,960
Speaker 1: before the movie, right, Oh yeah, yeah, Well, I don't know,

869
00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:46,360
Speaker 1: was it. And they filmed this movie in what nine?

870
00:50:47,080 --> 00:50:50,920
Speaker 1: I believe it was seventy late seventy eight, finished up

871
00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:54,280
Speaker 1: in late seventy nine, and came out in eighty I believe,

872
00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 1: is how that came Yeah, I mean, I don't know

873
00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:00,120
Speaker 1: how old Kubrick was. Maybe he was forty two, you,

874
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:02,920
Speaker 1: I mean, it could have been his forty second birthday

875
00:51:02,920 --> 00:51:06,200
Speaker 1: present to him. So yeah, it could have been. Let's see, okay.

876
00:51:06,239 --> 00:51:10,879
Speaker 1: According to Wikipedia, uh, the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

877
00:51:11,160 --> 00:51:15,879
Speaker 1: came out in nineteen seventy nine, so then I would

878
00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:19,239
Speaker 1: have come out at the same time as filming. I'm

879
00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:23,280
Speaker 1: just staying, if we're going there, we're going there. Meaning

880
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:26,480
Speaker 1: of life somewhere else. I just actually, one thing about

881
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:28,839
Speaker 1: the Holocaust that this that this movie is a little

882
00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:32,600
Speaker 1: reminiscent of, is that at the time, you know, leading

883
00:51:32,600 --> 00:51:34,760
Speaker 1: at the time leading up to and in the early

884
00:51:34,880 --> 00:51:37,719
Speaker 1: days of World War Two, Europe's Jews were desperate to

885
00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:41,560
Speaker 1: get out, and of course they found the exits closed

886
00:51:41,560 --> 00:51:44,440
Speaker 1: to them. Yeah, I mean, and seriously, you know, if

887
00:51:44,440 --> 00:51:46,080
Speaker 1: you're the Nazis and you hate the Jews and the

888
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:48,880
Speaker 1: Jews are perfectly happy to leave, you know, why not

889
00:51:48,920 --> 00:51:51,839
Speaker 1: just let let him leave? Instead they closed off the exit, yeah,

890
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:54,239
Speaker 1: which is what Jack Nicholson did in the movie. But

891
00:51:54,440 --> 00:51:57,239
Speaker 1: he sabotage the radio and he sabotaged the snow cat

892
00:51:57,520 --> 00:52:01,200
Speaker 1: in the same way though that we said, if Kubrick

893
00:52:01,280 --> 00:52:04,520
Speaker 1: wanted to make a movie about the Holocaust, would have

894
00:52:04,520 --> 00:52:08,200
Speaker 1: made Schindler's List. He wanted to he wanted to make

895
00:52:08,239 --> 00:52:11,960
Speaker 1: a movie about the Hold, and he did. According to this,

896
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:15,239
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know. I mean, yeah, I was

897
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:17,719
Speaker 1: gonna make one, and then Schindler's List came out, and

898
00:52:17,760 --> 00:52:21,480
Speaker 1: he was actually relieved because he could never get it

899
00:52:21,520 --> 00:52:24,040
Speaker 1: was gonna be called the Aryan Papers, but he could.

900
00:52:24,120 --> 00:52:27,719
Speaker 1: He never could quite get it together to have to

901
00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:30,080
Speaker 1: make that movie, and then was relieved when he didn't

902
00:52:30,080 --> 00:52:32,160
Speaker 1: have to do it. Right, So he would have done that.

903
00:52:32,200 --> 00:52:33,759
Speaker 1: He was trying to do that for years. So why

904
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:36,279
Speaker 1: is it shoehorned in here? I don't know, I mean,

905
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:39,200
Speaker 1: but I guess my my feeling is right, is that Okay,

906
00:52:39,239 --> 00:52:41,759
Speaker 1: Schindler's List came out like find so you wait for

907
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:45,400
Speaker 1: your next movie, right, Because if he wanted to make

908
00:52:45,400 --> 00:52:47,120
Speaker 1: a Western, he would have made a Western. If he

909
00:52:47,160 --> 00:52:49,760
Speaker 1: wanted to make something about the you know, the slaughter

910
00:52:49,840 --> 00:52:51,920
Speaker 1: of the American Indians, he would have made that western.

911
00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:53,640
Speaker 1: If he wanted to make a movie about the Holocast,

912
00:52:53,680 --> 00:52:55,839
Speaker 1: he would have done it, regardless of what was out

913
00:52:55,840 --> 00:52:59,440
Speaker 1: at the time. He According to the next one, he

914
00:52:59,520 --> 00:53:04,719
Speaker 1: also made this movie about the minotaur. Yeah, I want

915
00:53:04,719 --> 00:53:06,200
Speaker 1: to hate more than any of them. I'm going to

916
00:53:06,320 --> 00:53:09,719
Speaker 1: make this really brief because it is really simple, and

917
00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:11,560
Speaker 1: then I'm gonna blow it out of the water a

918
00:53:11,560 --> 00:53:15,640
Speaker 1: little bit. So if you don't know what the minotaur is,

919
00:53:16,000 --> 00:53:19,520
Speaker 1: he is from Greek mythology, and it's the body of

920
00:53:19,560 --> 00:53:21,440
Speaker 1: a man with the head of a bull and a

921
00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:24,319
Speaker 1: really bad attitude and has a penchant for a living

922
00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:30,120
Speaker 1: in mazes. The Shining is about the minotaur because we

923
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:32,879
Speaker 1: have the Hedge maze, even though in the book it's

924
00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:36,520
Speaker 1: actually hedge animals that are down by the playground. That's

925
00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:41,360
Speaker 1: that's a change. Yeah, the topiary is it topiary to Pietrie,

926
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:49,319
Speaker 1: I never know, okay um. But the fact that, like

927
00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:51,640
Speaker 1: you were talking about earlier, Devin, how things are so

928
00:53:51,760 --> 00:53:55,319
Speaker 1: disjointed when you move around in that hotel in the movie,

929
00:53:55,680 --> 00:53:57,759
Speaker 1: that's because it's supposed to be maze like. So that's

930
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:02,919
Speaker 1: another representation of the maze we have. Jack Nicholson, there

931
00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:06,440
Speaker 1: are quite a few times where he's looking at the camera.

932
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:09,439
Speaker 1: He's kind of got his head tipped forward. He's got

933
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:13,000
Speaker 1: that kind of blank look or almost semi angry look.

934
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:19,440
Speaker 1: But and his widows peak, almost like the same stance

935
00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:22,280
Speaker 1: or the head angle that you see on a bowl

936
00:54:22,400 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 1: that is about to charge. So again, that's a reference

937
00:54:25,920 --> 00:54:29,120
Speaker 1: to it. The last one that I really love, which

938
00:54:29,160 --> 00:54:32,680
Speaker 1: is the representation of it, is in the beginning of

939
00:54:32,680 --> 00:54:34,799
Speaker 1: the movie when they go to the hotel, Danny is

940
00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:37,520
Speaker 1: in the game room and then he meets the Grady girls,

941
00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:40,560
Speaker 1: the Grady Twins. When the girls are there, on the

942
00:54:40,680 --> 00:54:43,880
Speaker 1: left hand side on the wall, there is a poster

943
00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:48,960
Speaker 1: that says Monarch, and then it's got this strange looking

944
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:52,040
Speaker 1: blacked out figure with light coming from behind it that

945
00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:55,960
Speaker 1: they say is supposed to be a representation of the minotaur,

946
00:54:56,080 --> 00:55:00,200
Speaker 1: but it's actually got curved legs more like a oat,

947
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:02,239
Speaker 1: which would make me think it should be a satyr.

948
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:06,080
Speaker 1: You know what, actually though, because this is you're talking about,

949
00:55:06,120 --> 00:55:09,399
Speaker 1: they talked about this in that movie room to that's

950
00:55:09,600 --> 00:55:13,120
Speaker 1: that's one of the places. Yeah, as they were describing it,

951
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:15,160
Speaker 1: I was like, I don't see it's a skier. It's

952
00:55:15,160 --> 00:55:17,720
Speaker 1: a skier. It's a skier. And then at one moment

953
00:55:17,800 --> 00:55:21,160
Speaker 1: it was like, oh my god, it's I see it

954
00:55:21,239 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 1: with the hook like pointed in the opposite direction, the

955
00:55:24,200 --> 00:55:27,040
Speaker 1: way that a Hamal's knees would be I I see it.

956
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:29,200
Speaker 1: It was like that dress, but like is it black

957
00:55:29,280 --> 00:55:31,640
Speaker 1: or blue or a goal? It was it was like

958
00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:34,759
Speaker 1: the moment that I saw it, I can't like, I

959
00:55:34,800 --> 00:55:37,840
Speaker 1: can't un see it. That's all I see now is

960
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:41,160
Speaker 1: a menator, So I guess well, And and they also

961
00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:44,040
Speaker 1: they take it farther by saying on the opposite wall

962
00:55:44,480 --> 00:55:47,799
Speaker 1: there is a it's a piece of art that is

963
00:55:48,040 --> 00:55:51,480
Speaker 1: a guy on a bucking bronco. So that's the combination

964
00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:55,800
Speaker 1: of man and beasts. So it's another another metaphor for it.

965
00:55:56,120 --> 00:56:01,000
Speaker 1: I guess for me, uh see, as I might these

966
00:56:01,120 --> 00:56:04,440
Speaker 1: kind of imagery things. I still don't understand why he

967
00:56:04,440 --> 00:56:09,200
Speaker 1: would be making a movie about him like some weird subtext.

968
00:56:09,280 --> 00:56:15,799
Speaker 1: It's dumb. I'm sorry, but here's the problem. Here's the

969
00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:19,359
Speaker 1: problem with this. That's actually a minotaur because we we

970
00:56:19,440 --> 00:56:21,360
Speaker 1: all know it's a skier. But even if it is

971
00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:24,359
Speaker 1: a mentor, why but if you pause the movie and

972
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:27,680
Speaker 1: you start reading the post or it doesn't say Monarch.

973
00:56:28,080 --> 00:56:33,880
Speaker 1: It says ski Monarch as in the Monarch recreational Ski area,

974
00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:36,960
Speaker 1: because that is a real place and it's been existing

975
00:56:37,120 --> 00:56:41,000
Speaker 1: since like the thirties or something. It's a local area prop.

976
00:56:41,520 --> 00:56:44,800
Speaker 1: Although what they talk about in that movie in the

977
00:56:45,440 --> 00:56:48,799
Speaker 1: room two three seven whatever, I think it is a

978
00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:53,000
Speaker 1: little bit fair, just given that there is a very

979
00:56:53,040 --> 00:56:57,600
Speaker 1: explicit discussion between the characters about the fact that the

980
00:56:57,680 --> 00:57:01,080
Speaker 1: hotel resort should be a ski resort. Yeah, that it

981
00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:03,759
Speaker 1: should be in there, like, well, no, it's just no, no,

982
00:57:04,239 --> 00:57:06,200
Speaker 1: it's too hard to keep the roads open. Right, But

983
00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:10,719
Speaker 1: so I get that, right, that they're reasoning behind, well,

984
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:12,759
Speaker 1: it's not a ski resort, but then they have this

985
00:57:12,840 --> 00:57:18,800
Speaker 1: advertisement for skiing. Okay, fine, but also why like why

986
00:57:19,320 --> 00:57:23,520
Speaker 1: also that the mintor lived in a maze? Nicholson didn't

987
00:57:23,520 --> 00:57:25,720
Speaker 1: live in a maze. He died in the maze. Well,

988
00:57:25,720 --> 00:57:28,400
Speaker 1: but he was living in the maze. He he lived

989
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:32,400
Speaker 1: in a maze until somebody broke the maze, right, somebody

990
00:57:32,400 --> 00:57:36,280
Speaker 1: broke the maze. I mean Danny essentially Hallerin and Danny

991
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:38,960
Speaker 1: would have broken the maze by bringing someone up there

992
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 1: in the winter. That's a that's a great point. I

993
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:43,600
Speaker 1: hadn't I had made that connection. But it's still dumb. Okay,

994
00:57:44,400 --> 00:57:47,960
Speaker 1: let's let's keep sticking with that particular poster as we

995
00:57:48,040 --> 00:57:51,360
Speaker 1: go to the next in line, which is that this

996
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:56,960
Speaker 1: whole movie was about the CIA's mind control program. Of course,

997
00:57:57,240 --> 00:58:01,280
Speaker 1: as is everything, Yes, well evident A monarch is a

998
00:58:01,360 --> 00:58:06,320
Speaker 1: reference to the program mk Ultra, which was a program

999
00:58:06,360 --> 00:58:08,320
Speaker 1: for like twenty or thirty years where the c i

1000
00:58:08,400 --> 00:58:12,160
Speaker 1: A gave people loads of drugs sometimes they knew it,

1001
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:15,560
Speaker 1: sometimes they didn't to try and figure out a really

1002
00:58:15,560 --> 00:58:20,120
Speaker 1: good way to get people to confess, basically a truth drug. Also,

1003
00:58:20,240 --> 00:58:27,040
Speaker 1: the super villain in the Venture Brothers is it the yeah,

1004
00:58:27,560 --> 00:58:30,040
Speaker 1: I thought was the successor to mk Ultra, though right

1005
00:58:30,560 --> 00:58:32,880
Speaker 1: that I'm not positive of. I mean, I just did this.

1006
00:58:32,960 --> 00:58:35,400
Speaker 1: I looked at this and I went through some of it,

1007
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 1: and it's just it's such a stretch. I mean, they're

1008
00:58:38,080 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 1: saying that it's basically you're on LSD and that's why

1009
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:44,040
Speaker 1: this place is so crazy, and it's a representation of

1010
00:58:44,080 --> 00:58:48,720
Speaker 1: you being broken down by the man who's questioning you.

1011
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:52,560
Speaker 1: So that's why Jack is breaking down under the weight

1012
00:58:52,720 --> 00:58:56,240
Speaker 1: of the hotel. Is Jack the one that's breaking down,

1013
00:58:56,800 --> 00:59:00,439
Speaker 1: not Wendy. Jack is the one who clearly breaks down.

1014
00:59:00,520 --> 00:59:05,240
Speaker 1: He goes from a very clear minded person two In

1015
00:59:05,320 --> 00:59:09,280
Speaker 1: the end, when he is in the maze, he is

1016
00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:14,479
Speaker 1: not speaking English. He is just speaking gibberish. That's that's

1017
00:59:14,520 --> 00:59:19,360
Speaker 1: the slide that. Okay, yeah, but yeah, any of mind

1018
00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:25,040
Speaker 1: control the themes here, I think you just I Okay,

1019
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:28,960
Speaker 1: we we have our Holy cow, we're on our last one.

1020
00:59:29,040 --> 00:59:32,600
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, our last official our last official one,

1021
00:59:32,600 --> 00:59:36,880
Speaker 1: and then we've got a present for everybody who holds out. Okay.

1022
00:59:37,080 --> 00:59:40,560
Speaker 1: The last theory that we have here is that this

1023
00:59:40,680 --> 00:59:44,040
Speaker 1: is all about a dream. The whole thing is a dream,

1024
00:59:44,080 --> 00:59:47,200
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of summarize these into

1025
00:59:47,240 --> 00:59:49,880
Speaker 1: little bits and then we can take him apart further

1026
00:59:49,960 --> 00:59:55,120
Speaker 1: if you want. There is the idea that this whole

1027
00:59:55,200 --> 01:00:00,280
Speaker 1: thing is a dream had by Jack as he is

1028
01:00:00,400 --> 01:00:04,000
Speaker 1: suffering the d t S detox because he's an alcoholic

1029
01:00:04,040 --> 01:00:07,880
Speaker 1: who's dried out, and he's also suffering from Rider's block,

1030
01:00:07,920 --> 01:00:10,400
Speaker 1: and so this whole thing is this weird, crazy dream

1031
01:00:10,440 --> 01:00:12,320
Speaker 1: in his head. Yeah. But I mean, and they said

1032
01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:14,880
Speaker 1: in the movie that Shelley, you've all said at the

1033
01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:16,360
Speaker 1: beginning of the movie that he've been on the wagon

1034
01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:18,600
Speaker 1: for like six months. You don't have the d t

1035
01:00:18,800 --> 01:00:20,880
Speaker 1: S at six months out. No, that's true. But but

1036
01:00:21,120 --> 01:00:23,680
Speaker 1: he's also I guess the dts were the wrong the

1037
01:00:23,720 --> 01:00:25,880
Speaker 1: wrong thing to call it. But he he's wants to drink.

1038
01:00:26,480 --> 01:00:30,120
Speaker 1: He's resisting, but the urge is still there, the craving.

1039
01:00:30,160 --> 01:00:31,960
Speaker 1: So that's what he's fighting, and luckily there was a

1040
01:00:32,000 --> 01:00:35,120
Speaker 1: virtual drink ready for him. There was. And some of

1041
01:00:35,160 --> 01:00:37,320
Speaker 1: the stuff that I've seen that says that their support

1042
01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:41,120
Speaker 1: of this is, you know the fact that weird things

1043
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:45,920
Speaker 1: only really seemed to happen around Jack, the ghosts only

1044
01:00:45,960 --> 01:00:50,520
Speaker 1: appear around Jack, if indeed there were ghosts. I mean,

1045
01:00:50,760 --> 01:00:53,280
Speaker 1: everybody saw ghosts, and oh, you're right. In the very

1046
01:00:53,480 --> 01:00:58,920
Speaker 1: very end, Wendy saw the butler, or the not the butler,

1047
01:00:59,160 --> 01:01:03,840
Speaker 1: um Grady, she saw Grady l w And the skeletons,

1048
01:01:03,880 --> 01:01:06,880
Speaker 1: she saw the skeletons of all the corpses in the ballroom,

1049
01:01:06,960 --> 01:01:11,240
Speaker 1: and then she's and then of course he saw it all.

1050
01:01:11,400 --> 01:01:14,280
Speaker 1: Danny saw all kinds of stuff sneak peak, so everybody's

1051
01:01:14,360 --> 01:01:16,960
Speaker 1: everybody saw ghosts and some stuff like that. Remind me

1052
01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:20,680
Speaker 1: not to go to this place? What Timberlin, Yeah, exactly.

1053
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:22,800
Speaker 1: Well that's a great that's a great way to segue

1054
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:25,280
Speaker 1: into our next bit of is this is dream? The

1055
01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:28,880
Speaker 1: part about Danny is that maybe the whole thing is

1056
01:01:28,920 --> 01:01:32,760
Speaker 1: actually in Danny's head. So it's Danny having a dream

1057
01:01:32,800 --> 01:01:35,040
Speaker 1: and it's from his point of view, and it's all

1058
01:01:35,080 --> 01:01:38,840
Speaker 1: in his imagination. It's not really happening the way we

1059
01:01:38,960 --> 01:01:43,480
Speaker 1: are shown on screen it happens. It's interesting as as

1060
01:01:43,520 --> 01:01:48,480
Speaker 1: we talk about Jacket being Jack Stream being Danny's dream,

1061
01:01:48,840 --> 01:01:52,760
Speaker 1: they talk about there's only one actual supernatural thing that

1062
01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:56,200
Speaker 1: happens in this movie, right, pantry. It's Jack getting out

1063
01:01:56,240 --> 01:01:58,800
Speaker 1: of the pantry because he's locked in there by Wendy.

1064
01:01:58,960 --> 01:02:03,840
Speaker 1: Actually he's knocked out out. Yeah, but according and we

1065
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:07,480
Speaker 1: that's what we're led to, right. But I actually do

1066
01:02:07,600 --> 01:02:10,480
Speaker 1: like the theory that is brought up in a lot

1067
01:02:10,560 --> 01:02:14,040
Speaker 1: of different places that it's actually Danny, Yeah, that Danny

1068
01:02:14,120 --> 01:02:16,480
Speaker 1: lets him lose, because we don't see Danny, right, We

1069
01:02:16,520 --> 01:02:19,360
Speaker 1: don't know where Danny is at that point, right, he's

1070
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:22,560
Speaker 1: because he's not anywhere. I mean, there's no documentation of

1071
01:02:22,600 --> 01:02:24,640
Speaker 1: him being anywhere. And I do like that theory a lot.

1072
01:02:24,680 --> 01:02:27,720
Speaker 1: And I also think that it lends credence to it

1073
01:02:27,800 --> 01:02:32,440
Speaker 1: being Danny's dream or there's another version of it that

1074
01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:38,160
Speaker 1: it's all Danny's fault, Danny with his shining is actually

1075
01:02:38,440 --> 01:02:43,720
Speaker 1: causing all of the things that are happening. Brain, right,

1076
01:02:43,720 --> 01:02:45,960
Speaker 1: are you even to talk about that that he takes

1077
01:02:45,960 --> 01:02:50,200
Speaker 1: over Wendy when she's when she's um fighting jack Off.

1078
01:02:50,480 --> 01:02:54,200
Speaker 1: I don't, I haven't. Yeah, I think they're they're there.

1079
01:02:54,200 --> 01:02:59,040
Speaker 1: Actually was another supernatural thing that happened that was a

1080
01:02:59,040 --> 01:03:01,240
Speaker 1: little bit earlier in the mod me when he's playing

1081
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:05,200
Speaker 1: with a little toy cars and and the ball comes

1082
01:03:05,280 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 1: rolling up and he happens to be right down the

1083
01:03:07,080 --> 01:03:11,840
Speaker 1: corridor from good Old Room to seven. Right, yeah, yeah,

1084
01:03:11,880 --> 01:03:14,360
Speaker 1: so there were so there were two things that physically

1085
01:03:14,520 --> 01:03:17,160
Speaker 1: couldn't possibly have happened, and then they were caused. But

1086
01:03:17,240 --> 01:03:20,440
Speaker 1: where the ghost stick over? Of course maybe Jack Nicholson

1087
01:03:20,480 --> 01:03:22,880
Speaker 1: was down the corridor and he rolled the ball at him,

1088
01:03:23,440 --> 01:03:28,480
Speaker 1: did throw the ball, and that brings up the tennis ball,

1089
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:31,680
Speaker 1: and that brings up the weird sense of space, right

1090
01:03:31,840 --> 01:03:34,400
Speaker 1: that you don't totally know where everything is in relation

1091
01:03:34,480 --> 01:03:36,880
Speaker 1: to each other in this hotel that they live in.

1092
01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:39,520
Speaker 1: So it's possibly right, he's like throwing the ball and

1093
01:03:39,600 --> 01:03:42,000
Speaker 1: if everything lines up the way your brain wants it

1094
01:03:42,040 --> 01:03:44,160
Speaker 1: to line up, he's tarning the ball. It hits a

1095
01:03:44,160 --> 01:03:46,560
Speaker 1: weird angle and it just rolls down the hall to Danny,

1096
01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:49,480
Speaker 1: but you don't know that, like there's no way to

1097
01:03:49,520 --> 01:03:53,040
Speaker 1: know where it actually lines up. And actually when that happened,

1098
01:03:53,840 --> 01:03:57,480
Speaker 1: when he was playing with the toys, that was right

1099
01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:00,280
Speaker 1: about the same time that Jack Nicholson was was passed

1100
01:04:00,320 --> 01:04:03,200
Speaker 1: out of sleep over his typewriter in that room. He

1101
01:04:03,240 --> 01:04:05,640
Speaker 1: wasn't throwing the ball, and then he he starts having

1102
01:04:05,640 --> 01:04:08,840
Speaker 1: a hideous stream and starts screaming to sleep and everything, right,

1103
01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:11,160
Speaker 1: and so that's not all about happened at the same time,

1104
01:04:11,520 --> 01:04:13,360
Speaker 1: there's a lot of there's a lot of weird stuff

1105
01:04:13,360 --> 01:04:16,840
Speaker 1: around that specific supernatural moment, right, because that's also when

1106
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:21,360
Speaker 1: the continuity gets weird of the hotel, yeah, of the

1107
01:04:21,440 --> 01:04:24,200
Speaker 1: layout of the hotel, of even just the carpet, the

1108
01:04:24,200 --> 01:04:29,479
Speaker 1: physical carpet below Danny that because it flips, Yeah, it rolled,

1109
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:32,600
Speaker 1: the ball rolls up to him in this like kind

1110
01:04:32,640 --> 01:04:36,240
Speaker 1: of pathway in the carpet ing that leads into the

1111
01:04:36,280 --> 01:04:38,720
Speaker 1: geometric shape that he's been playing in. And he stands

1112
01:04:38,800 --> 01:04:43,000
Speaker 1: up and it's flipped. He's standing a degree, he's facing

1113
01:04:43,000 --> 01:04:45,440
Speaker 1: the other direction, which is the same thing actually happens

1114
01:04:45,520 --> 01:04:50,280
Speaker 1: when Hallerin is showing Wendy and Danny the pantries, and

1115
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:53,120
Speaker 1: they go in the pantry one way and then they

1116
01:04:53,120 --> 01:04:56,919
Speaker 1: walk out. It's a completely different areas. So, but those

1117
01:04:56,920 --> 01:04:59,760
Speaker 1: things happen all the time, and those are big questions

1118
01:04:59,800 --> 01:05:04,160
Speaker 1: I think for me about the movie. Whatever theories I

1119
01:05:04,200 --> 01:05:07,560
Speaker 1: believe it's a dream, it's you know, the Holocaust, whatever,

1120
01:05:07,880 --> 01:05:12,480
Speaker 1: they're big questions because it seems like given the rest

1121
01:05:12,520 --> 01:05:20,680
Speaker 1: of Cubrick's filmology film allocology, I guess that works filmology. Yeah,

1122
01:05:20,720 --> 01:05:23,880
Speaker 1: his catalog of films that he was really big on

1123
01:05:24,000 --> 01:05:27,720
Speaker 1: details and continuity, and so for him to kind of

1124
01:05:27,800 --> 01:05:32,240
Speaker 1: overlook those things seems significant, I think a lot of times.

1125
01:05:32,240 --> 01:05:35,240
Speaker 1: But but there's also the fact of the sheer volume

1126
01:05:35,360 --> 01:05:39,280
Speaker 1: they shot for a year, There's the sheer number of takes.

1127
01:05:39,320 --> 01:05:42,600
Speaker 1: He then edits it all himself. I see details disappearing.

1128
01:05:42,680 --> 01:05:44,840
Speaker 1: But you want to talk about the sheer number of takes,

1129
01:05:45,880 --> 01:05:47,840
Speaker 1: which particular one do we want to go into the

1130
01:05:49,720 --> 01:05:52,680
Speaker 1: fact that Shelley Duval was admitted to the hospital like

1131
01:05:52,760 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 1: a couple of times during the filming because she was

1132
01:05:55,520 --> 01:06:00,120
Speaker 1: in a constant state of um exhaustion and mentally, he

1133
01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:04,400
Speaker 1: was under a lot of and that one seventeen takes

1134
01:06:05,240 --> 01:06:08,720
Speaker 1: seventeen takes. Yeah, that must have taken a couple of days. Well,

1135
01:06:08,760 --> 01:06:12,320
Speaker 1: I have before we get into the final thing that

1136
01:06:12,400 --> 01:06:15,040
Speaker 1: we got for all of our listeners, I have one

1137
01:06:15,200 --> 01:06:17,520
Speaker 1: final thing that I want to throw out there that

1138
01:06:17,600 --> 01:06:21,640
Speaker 1: I am surprised never came up in any of the research,

1139
01:06:21,680 --> 01:06:24,600
Speaker 1: and I've never read anywhere else. Do you remember Jack

1140
01:06:24,720 --> 01:06:28,440
Speaker 1: is in the Colorado room on his typewriter typing All

1141
01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:32,200
Speaker 1: Work and No Play makes Jack adult boy? That Cubrick

1142
01:06:32,880 --> 01:06:36,600
Speaker 1: wrote you know that right now? No, he didn't, he did,

1143
01:06:36,880 --> 01:06:41,400
Speaker 1: He did not. I thought secretaries hated Cubrick because he

1144
01:06:41,520 --> 01:06:44,720
Speaker 1: made them type it up and he wouldn't let them xerox.

1145
01:06:44,800 --> 01:06:48,480
Speaker 1: It's so the secretaries actually wrote it, because there's all

1146
01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:50,840
Speaker 1: that behind the scenes footage of him typing away on

1147
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:53,919
Speaker 1: that orange typewriter, right, but he's typing on little itty

1148
01:06:53,960 --> 01:06:57,800
Speaker 1: bitty sheets. It turns out he's rewriting the script right right. Yeah, no,

1149
01:06:58,160 --> 01:07:02,280
Speaker 1: um our our our. I got that bit of information

1150
01:07:02,480 --> 01:07:05,280
Speaker 1: from an inside source, and it turns out that no,

1151
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:09,360
Speaker 1: cubric didn't write any of that. So that's that's buccus. Okay, sorry,

1152
01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:12,000
Speaker 1: but All work and No Play makes Jack dull Boy

1153
01:07:12,560 --> 01:07:17,840
Speaker 1: is thirty three characters I counted. When we see Jack

1154
01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:23,080
Speaker 1: in the Colorado room and he resets the carriage and

1155
01:07:23,160 --> 01:07:27,960
Speaker 1: he starts typing. If you listen, twenty six key strokes

1156
01:07:28,440 --> 01:07:32,480
Speaker 1: before he resets the carriage again. Go a little farther.

1157
01:07:33,080 --> 01:07:36,160
Speaker 1: Wendy when she first discovers what Jack has been typing,

1158
01:07:36,200 --> 01:07:40,720
Speaker 1: and she's spinning through the pages. They show twenty six

1159
01:07:40,960 --> 01:07:43,920
Speaker 1: different pages with that text on it. So what does

1160
01:07:43,960 --> 01:07:49,960
Speaker 1: that mean? Well, probably nothing, but have the question like

1161
01:07:50,280 --> 01:07:53,160
Speaker 1: under the heading, you know this is all a dream.

1162
01:07:53,600 --> 01:07:57,600
Speaker 1: I've only ever heard it's Jack or it's Danny. I've

1163
01:07:57,680 --> 01:08:02,320
Speaker 1: never heard it's Wendy. Have a nightmare or a breakdown

1164
01:08:02,960 --> 01:08:06,880
Speaker 1: or a breakdown. Right. Her character in this movie is

1165
01:08:07,080 --> 01:08:11,840
Speaker 1: very um bird like in her mannerisms and her her

1166
01:08:11,880 --> 01:08:16,000
Speaker 1: actions and her attitude. She's very timid and scared. But

1167
01:08:16,040 --> 01:08:19,120
Speaker 1: I get for me, you know. She even kind of

1168
01:08:19,160 --> 01:08:22,000
Speaker 1: says in the very beginning, as Jack is saying, Hey,

1169
01:08:22,040 --> 01:08:24,040
Speaker 1: we're going to go do this thing for our family,

1170
01:08:24,240 --> 01:08:26,479
Speaker 1: She's like, well, I don't really want to go do

1171
01:08:26,520 --> 01:08:30,120
Speaker 1: that thing, and so for it to be a nightmare

1172
01:08:30,160 --> 01:08:32,400
Speaker 1: of hers of this is how it could turn out.

1173
01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:39,720
Speaker 1: The inconsistencies, by and large, happen when she's involved, right

1174
01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:44,439
Speaker 1: some most not all though, but so like, okay, the

1175
01:08:44,479 --> 01:08:47,040
Speaker 1: other things that happened right like okay, So Jack cheats

1176
01:08:47,080 --> 01:08:49,680
Speaker 1: on her with an attractive lady who turns out to

1177
01:08:49,680 --> 01:08:55,040
Speaker 1: be like a bog monster. Right, her son is like

1178
01:08:55,120 --> 01:08:59,840
Speaker 1: super injured by weird supernatural things. She has a breakdown

1179
01:09:00,439 --> 01:09:04,200
Speaker 1: over Jack, saying like, hey, nothing's going on, the fact

1180
01:09:04,240 --> 01:09:07,280
Speaker 1: that it could just be a movie about her mental

1181
01:09:07,320 --> 01:09:12,479
Speaker 1: breakdown in isolation, that's compelling to me. I know people,

1182
01:09:12,560 --> 01:09:15,479
Speaker 1: I know a couple of people honestly currently who could

1183
01:09:15,479 --> 01:09:18,280
Speaker 1: have imagined something like that. I wouldn't be surprised if

1184
01:09:18,400 --> 01:09:23,640
Speaker 1: that's how they're experiencing life currently. To be honest, you know,

1185
01:09:23,680 --> 01:09:26,600
Speaker 1: I always hate that, you know, whatever a movie or

1186
01:09:26,600 --> 01:09:28,479
Speaker 1: anything like that, I was in the end, the guy

1187
01:09:28,479 --> 01:09:31,800
Speaker 1: always just wakes up, you know. I hate that crap.

1188
01:09:31,880 --> 01:09:35,720
Speaker 1: So I'm not buying this crap at all the way

1189
01:09:35,760 --> 01:09:38,320
Speaker 1: out Now, nobody was dreaming, can we give our gift?

1190
01:09:38,320 --> 01:09:42,120
Speaker 1: Now we can give our gift. At the last minute,

1191
01:09:43,000 --> 01:09:46,519
Speaker 1: we got a lucky break. Um. There's a producer friend

1192
01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:50,400
Speaker 1: that we know who's involved in Hollywood Lucas, and he

1193
01:09:50,600 --> 01:09:53,840
Speaker 1: happens to know the guys, a couple of folks who

1194
01:09:53,840 --> 01:09:57,760
Speaker 1: were evolved with filming of The Shining, like more than

1195
01:09:57,800 --> 01:10:00,760
Speaker 1: a little involved. It was it was a last minute Yeah,

1196
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:06,400
Speaker 1: I mean absolutely, I wasn't even was It was just me. Okay,

1197
01:10:06,400 --> 01:10:10,680
Speaker 1: So we got to talk to uh, Brian Cook. He

1198
01:10:10,920 --> 01:10:15,400
Speaker 1: was the assistant director on The Shining. He worked with

1199
01:10:15,680 --> 01:10:19,439
Speaker 1: Sanley on almost every one of his credit on literally

1200
01:10:19,479 --> 01:10:24,800
Speaker 1: every single movie. Yeah seven, and he didn't like it. Yeah,

1201
01:10:24,880 --> 01:10:27,800
Speaker 1: and so we've we've got. I was able to get

1202
01:10:27,840 --> 01:10:30,000
Speaker 1: an interview with him, and he's given us some great

1203
01:10:30,040 --> 01:10:33,840
Speaker 1: stuff and his impression and his thoughts on this. I'm

1204
01:10:33,880 --> 01:10:36,800
Speaker 1: gonna tell you now. It was done by Skype, and

1205
01:10:36,920 --> 01:10:39,320
Speaker 1: because it was such a last minute thing, audio is

1206
01:10:39,360 --> 01:10:42,320
Speaker 1: not the best. I stopped hearing the audio issues after

1207
01:10:42,360 --> 01:10:44,760
Speaker 1: a minute or two, but you probably will too. He's

1208
01:10:44,760 --> 01:10:47,599
Speaker 1: super interesting, he is. It's so interesting that that just

1209
01:10:47,720 --> 01:10:52,240
Speaker 1: does become a problem. So without further ado, we're gonna

1210
01:10:52,280 --> 01:10:54,720
Speaker 1: I'm gonna talk to Brian and then we'll come back

1211
01:10:54,720 --> 01:10:58,920
Speaker 1: to you. So it sounds like to me, and and

1212
01:10:58,960 --> 01:11:02,360
Speaker 1: tell me if I'm wrong here, is that things were

1213
01:11:02,960 --> 01:11:05,840
Speaker 1: set in stone. I mean it sounded like things were

1214
01:11:06,439 --> 01:11:09,320
Speaker 1: you had so much going on that it was always

1215
01:11:09,360 --> 01:11:13,000
Speaker 1: a little bit flexible as as you work through scenes

1216
01:11:13,040 --> 01:11:17,439
Speaker 1: and shots and how much of that would you say? Oh, definitely,

1217
01:11:17,479 --> 01:11:20,599
Speaker 1: I mean always with Stanley, you'd like the scene first,

1218
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:25,240
Speaker 1: get all the art directions, set on addressing, and then

1219
01:11:25,240 --> 01:11:28,080
Speaker 1: he's bringing the actors into rehearsed and rewrite the scene

1220
01:11:28,120 --> 01:11:30,000
Speaker 1: and sit down with them. That would take a day,

1221
01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:33,360
Speaker 1: send him away to learn the lines, then come back

1222
01:11:33,400 --> 01:11:37,479
Speaker 1: and then we'd carry on lighting and then start shooting. Okay,

1223
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:40,280
Speaker 1: the whole process was like that with him. I mean

1224
01:11:40,360 --> 01:11:43,479
Speaker 1: not exterios on Barry Lindland, for instance, because it was

1225
01:11:43,520 --> 01:11:46,160
Speaker 1: so difficult in Ireland islands, very difficult, you know, with

1226
01:11:46,240 --> 01:11:49,200
Speaker 1: the weather changing. I think probably you know, we would

1227
01:11:49,200 --> 01:11:51,760
Speaker 1: have Grant recast Ryan O'Neil when we closed down after

1228
01:11:51,800 --> 01:11:54,280
Speaker 1: six weeks on Barry Lindon. To be honest with you,

1229
01:11:54,640 --> 01:11:56,439
Speaker 1: he certainly thought about it. But if we hadn't had

1230
01:11:56,439 --> 01:11:58,640
Speaker 1: to go back to the South and we shoot all

1231
01:11:58,680 --> 01:12:01,840
Speaker 1: the exteriors. But anyway, you know, of course, that's why

1232
01:12:01,880 --> 01:12:05,360
Speaker 1: guys like Stanley like to shoot interiors so they can

1233
01:12:05,360 --> 01:12:08,599
Speaker 1: control the light, they can control everything when you're out

1234
01:12:08,680 --> 01:12:11,160
Speaker 1: something in the laugh of the guards, you know, Yeah,

1235
01:12:11,280 --> 01:12:14,280
Speaker 1: and some of the stuff that I over in is that,

1236
01:12:14,360 --> 01:12:16,920
Speaker 1: you know, Stanley like to take a lot of shots

1237
01:12:16,920 --> 01:12:21,400
Speaker 1: of the same scene. Yeah, and sometimes what I've pretty

1238
01:12:21,400 --> 01:12:25,160
Speaker 1: described it's excessive before and I don't know, yeah, I mean,

1239
01:12:25,280 --> 01:12:27,639
Speaker 1: I'm sure a lot of a lot of the final

1240
01:12:27,680 --> 01:12:31,120
Speaker 1: shapes that use weren't, you know, take six teams. But

1241
01:12:31,200 --> 01:12:33,840
Speaker 1: Jack got the message and you know, he learned. You know,

1242
01:12:34,080 --> 01:12:37,320
Speaker 1: I don't really wind up until that. Don't put too

1243
01:12:37,400 --> 01:12:41,360
Speaker 1: much in early on with It took him a little while,

1244
01:12:41,520 --> 01:12:44,000
Speaker 1: you know, but the first month, but once we saw

1245
01:12:44,320 --> 01:12:46,679
Speaker 1: his working hours and everything out, there was no problem

1246
01:12:46,680 --> 01:12:49,439
Speaker 1: with Jack. Yeah, you know, because as I said, he

1247
01:12:49,439 --> 01:12:51,760
Speaker 1: didn't even have a standing. I mean, can you believe that?

1248
01:12:52,439 --> 01:12:54,680
Speaker 1: But Stanley, you know, the crew used to stand in

1249
01:12:54,720 --> 01:12:56,439
Speaker 1: and then of course you'd bring in the actors to

1250
01:12:56,520 --> 01:13:00,679
Speaker 1: life properly. Yeah, I mean, but that's the way it worked.

1251
01:13:00,720 --> 01:13:03,120
Speaker 1: I mean, no one else would work like that. But

1252
01:13:03,200 --> 01:13:05,800
Speaker 1: I mean it was a wonderful. Uh. It's such a

1253
01:13:05,840 --> 01:13:08,720
Speaker 1: holiday after working with Stanley when you go to work

1254
01:13:08,760 --> 01:13:14,200
Speaker 1: with other people, because you don't get along with app

1255
01:13:15,400 --> 01:13:19,120
Speaker 1: you just get do it automatically. You know, it doesn't

1256
01:13:19,160 --> 01:13:22,400
Speaker 1: get questions. But you know, once you get used to it.

1257
01:13:22,400 --> 01:13:23,960
Speaker 1: I used to have a lot, spend a lot of

1258
01:13:24,040 --> 01:13:27,800
Speaker 1: time telling new people, like, for instance, we had two

1259
01:13:27,880 --> 01:13:29,760
Speaker 1: or three art directors we got rid of early on

1260
01:13:29,960 --> 01:13:33,920
Speaker 1: before Roy came back on ice weight chart. They used

1261
01:13:33,920 --> 01:13:35,400
Speaker 1: to say to me, Brian, but you know you've got

1262
01:13:35,400 --> 01:13:37,400
Speaker 1: to build the said, I said, I know all that.

1263
01:13:37,840 --> 01:13:40,439
Speaker 1: We've got people for thirteen weeks daring around London every

1264
01:13:40,560 --> 01:13:43,000
Speaker 1: night taking photographs of New York streets. And I said,

1265
01:13:43,240 --> 01:13:44,840
Speaker 1: of course we aren't going to shoot. We did shoot

1266
01:13:44,880 --> 01:13:46,639
Speaker 1: for two nights, I think on the street in London,

1267
01:13:46,680 --> 01:13:49,520
Speaker 1: a side street. I said, we'd be building all this eventually.

1268
01:13:50,000 --> 01:13:51,880
Speaker 1: I said, but you've got to go through this stuff

1269
01:13:51,880 --> 01:13:53,880
Speaker 1: with Stanley. You know, if you told him a warning

1270
01:13:54,000 --> 01:13:57,120
Speaker 1: rather sold Terry saml But hell, you know, shoot it

1271
01:13:57,120 --> 01:13:59,240
Speaker 1: all in London who looks just like New York and say,

1272
01:13:59,600 --> 01:14:04,160
Speaker 1: I don't so was we do not bad? I mean

1273
01:14:04,240 --> 01:14:07,040
Speaker 1: you know that. That's that's saying what the rules are

1274
01:14:07,080 --> 01:14:09,479
Speaker 1: with Stanley. I mean they're all very well aware of that.

1275
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:13,280
Speaker 1: These guys are smart. Guys are Warner Brothers are all smart,

1276
01:14:13,360 --> 01:14:19,200
Speaker 1: John Galli, Um, Bob Daily, Terry Samuel, you know Ted

1277
01:14:19,280 --> 01:14:23,600
Speaker 1: Ashley in the old days, you know they're not mugs.

1278
01:14:24,160 --> 01:14:28,240
Speaker 1: These guys were very very smart, successful people, um, and

1279
01:14:28,280 --> 01:14:31,320
Speaker 1: they didn't interfere with him at all, you know, and

1280
01:14:31,479 --> 01:14:33,400
Speaker 1: going on with him. But he had a winning track record.

1281
01:14:33,439 --> 01:14:35,760
Speaker 1: He made them money so over the years, you know,

1282
01:14:36,280 --> 01:14:38,479
Speaker 1: and of course he was an imposing person to be

1283
01:14:38,600 --> 01:14:41,080
Speaker 1: on the payroll. I mean, you know, he was a

1284
01:14:41,200 --> 01:14:44,439
Speaker 1: great a director, and studios have got to add that.

1285
01:14:44,760 --> 01:14:46,840
Speaker 1: And Robert Benton, who was a very good director and

1286
01:14:46,880 --> 01:14:50,280
Speaker 1: writer anyway, on Billy Basket all that was a flock film,

1287
01:14:50,320 --> 01:14:54,240
Speaker 1: and so was Seller actually, but I certainly worked on

1288
01:14:54,280 --> 01:15:00,439
Speaker 1: some blocks over the years. Expensive One had a few

1289
01:15:00,439 --> 01:15:04,200
Speaker 1: of those out there in general. Yeah, yeah, yeah, amazing

1290
01:15:04,200 --> 01:15:07,360
Speaker 1: when you think about it. But what else can I

1291
01:15:07,400 --> 01:15:12,120
Speaker 1: help you with in terms of well, so, actually, here's

1292
01:15:12,160 --> 01:15:16,280
Speaker 1: the reason that we're conspiracy stuff. Yeah, that's I was

1293
01:15:16,320 --> 01:15:18,040
Speaker 1: gonna get. That's where I was headed here, is that

1294
01:15:18,560 --> 01:15:20,679
Speaker 1: I've read a lot of this stuff, and just through

1295
01:15:21,000 --> 01:15:23,680
Speaker 1: interviews and research with other people, I found things that

1296
01:15:23,680 --> 01:15:25,800
Speaker 1: are wrong with these But what in general, I mean,

1297
01:15:26,160 --> 01:15:28,320
Speaker 1: what is your take on all of this conspiracy stuff?

1298
01:15:29,120 --> 01:15:32,800
Speaker 1: Like all these great guys, He'll moved continuity things out

1299
01:15:32,840 --> 01:15:34,920
Speaker 1: because if it's something in the frame, no matter how

1300
01:15:34,960 --> 01:15:38,519
Speaker 1: continuity is. If if it affects the frame being what

1301
01:15:38,680 --> 01:15:40,479
Speaker 1: he thought was a perfect frame, it would go and

1302
01:15:40,479 --> 01:15:42,200
Speaker 1: then it would come back in on the next thing.

1303
01:15:42,560 --> 01:15:44,920
Speaker 1: All that sort of stuff. But I mean, I went

1304
01:15:45,000 --> 01:15:48,479
Speaker 1: to see that awful film with my son and his partner,

1305
01:15:48,520 --> 01:15:56,280
Speaker 1: business partner, and we went to what we went to

1306
01:15:56,400 --> 01:15:59,439
Speaker 1: see it, and we left halfway through while we retired

1307
01:15:59,479 --> 01:16:03,680
Speaker 1: to the bar halfway through. So embarrassing. How they got

1308
01:16:03,760 --> 01:16:11,080
Speaker 1: away with making that and getting it distributed is amazing. Rubbish,

1309
01:16:11,560 --> 01:16:16,800
Speaker 1: absolute rubbish. But of course there are many different things

1310
01:16:16,800 --> 01:16:18,800
Speaker 1: that happened over when do you think where you've shot

1311
01:16:18,840 --> 01:16:20,960
Speaker 1: for nearly a year on the Shining and even the

1312
01:16:21,000 --> 01:16:23,400
Speaker 1: Little Boy, I mean, if you want to figure out things,

1313
01:16:23,760 --> 01:16:26,240
Speaker 1: there's a million mistakes which you can go backwards and

1314
01:16:26,280 --> 01:16:29,759
Speaker 1: forwards to the scenes months later. And also the actors change,

1315
01:16:29,800 --> 01:16:32,160
Speaker 1: I mean, the Little Boy changes in look to be

1316
01:16:32,240 --> 01:16:35,520
Speaker 1: honest with you, you know, all those sort of things.

1317
01:16:35,520 --> 01:16:38,400
Speaker 1: So there's certainly no conspiracy that I know with Stanley,

1318
01:16:38,520 --> 01:16:43,160
Speaker 1: I mean, even worse than ones about the moon landings

1319
01:16:43,160 --> 01:16:49,280
Speaker 1: and all that. I mean, where do these guys come from?

1320
01:16:49,400 --> 01:16:54,400
Speaker 1: It's unbelievable, what a lot of morons there are so

1321
01:16:54,479 --> 01:17:00,200
Speaker 1: many fruitcakes out there in this world. It's unbelievable. The

1322
01:17:00,240 --> 01:17:03,639
Speaker 1: boot learning is a pretty big stress to me. Oh,

1323
01:17:03,800 --> 01:17:08,479
Speaker 1: it's absolute joke. But he was. He was a very

1324
01:17:08,560 --> 01:17:11,439
Speaker 1: very good director Stanley. You know, a lot of people

1325
01:17:11,520 --> 01:17:14,080
Speaker 1: used to say they didn't think he was good with actors.

1326
01:17:14,120 --> 01:17:15,720
Speaker 1: I thought he was very good with actors. He gave

1327
01:17:15,800 --> 01:17:18,720
Speaker 1: them every opportunity to do whatever they wanted. And I

1328
01:17:18,800 --> 01:17:21,080
Speaker 1: know for a fact because I've worked three times with Jack.

1329
01:17:21,120 --> 01:17:22,960
Speaker 1: I've been lucky enough to work with him three times,

1330
01:17:23,560 --> 01:17:26,719
Speaker 1: two of them with Sean Penn directing. He was excellent director.

1331
01:17:26,760 --> 01:17:28,320
Speaker 1: By the way. I just did a film with him

1332
01:17:28,400 --> 01:17:29,800
Speaker 1: last year which I think is going to be a

1333
01:17:29,880 --> 01:17:33,280
Speaker 1: very good film, recalled The Last Face Shall You Throw On?

1334
01:17:33,360 --> 01:17:36,559
Speaker 1: And Javier Bardam, which we shot in Africa, so all

1335
01:17:36,600 --> 01:17:43,240
Speaker 1: set in the refugee counts in Serially Sudan and very

1336
01:17:43,240 --> 01:17:46,080
Speaker 1: interesting and a little bit in the United Nations. In

1337
01:17:46,120 --> 01:17:50,639
Speaker 1: Switzerland we've got Serially and a Liberia, So a big film.

1338
01:17:50,680 --> 01:17:52,559
Speaker 1: I think it would be a very good movie. He's

1339
01:17:52,600 --> 01:17:58,200
Speaker 1: a good director. Um, but no, all those conspiracies is

1340
01:17:58,280 --> 01:18:00,559
Speaker 1: absolute crap. I mean, order Starry used to say to

1341
01:18:00,560 --> 01:18:02,839
Speaker 1: me when we didn't know what we're doing. He said, well,

1342
01:18:02,640 --> 01:18:05,040
Speaker 1: we're the French film critics. Tell us what this was

1343
01:18:05,080 --> 01:18:14,960
Speaker 1: supposed to be about those sorts of things. Very very

1344
01:18:15,120 --> 01:18:19,679
Speaker 1: very funny man, I mean, you know, very humorous guy standing,

1345
01:18:19,840 --> 01:18:24,000
Speaker 1: very dry and had a very good sense of dry

1346
01:18:24,040 --> 01:18:26,200
Speaker 1: cent of humor about people in the film industry. That's

1347
01:18:26,200 --> 01:18:31,760
Speaker 1: for sure. I love talking to that guy. Interesting, man,

1348
01:18:31,880 --> 01:18:33,800
Speaker 1: I know the word. The hard part is it was

1349
01:18:33,840 --> 01:18:36,479
Speaker 1: an hour and a half conversation, Like we talked for

1350
01:18:36,560 --> 01:18:38,840
Speaker 1: so long about so much he gave me. He's the

1351
01:18:38,840 --> 01:18:42,439
Speaker 1: one who told me about the typewriter, the pages. Yeah,

1352
01:18:43,080 --> 01:18:45,040
Speaker 1: so that's how I know. Well, he also had that

1353
01:18:45,120 --> 01:18:46,840
Speaker 1: to say about the continuity thing. He said, you know,

1354
01:18:46,920 --> 01:18:49,160
Speaker 1: that's not a conspiracy. It's just that sometimes he would

1355
01:18:49,200 --> 01:18:51,120
Speaker 1: look at it and say, you know, that chair just

1356
01:18:51,200 --> 01:18:54,599
Speaker 1: does doesn't it really kind of it's kind of changes

1357
01:18:54,680 --> 01:18:56,880
Speaker 1: to balance the scene. So let's put that chair out.

1358
01:18:56,960 --> 01:18:58,640
Speaker 1: Then the next scene the chairs back in, you know.

1359
01:18:59,560 --> 01:19:04,720
Speaker 1: Was yeah, and that's it was really nice of him

1360
01:19:04,720 --> 01:19:12,519
Speaker 1: to actually make the time everything and ran and everybody

1361
01:19:12,520 --> 01:19:15,479
Speaker 1: who helped us get that. That was fantastic. I think

1362
01:19:15,840 --> 01:19:18,400
Speaker 1: you know, Steve said, listen to this interview so that

1363
01:19:18,439 --> 01:19:20,960
Speaker 1: we can talk about it a little bit, and I

1364
01:19:21,040 --> 01:19:25,519
Speaker 1: just responded with, how did you get that? In? Oh

1365
01:19:25,560 --> 01:19:28,760
Speaker 1: my gosh, that is so cool. But I think he

1366
01:19:28,840 --> 01:19:33,439
Speaker 1: makes some really really good pointstatic because in fairness, right,

1367
01:19:33,600 --> 01:19:36,800
Speaker 1: like you want to believe there's so much lower around

1368
01:19:36,880 --> 01:19:39,599
Speaker 1: Stanley Kubrick, right, people say like, oh, he had an

1369
01:19:39,600 --> 01:19:43,200
Speaker 1: IQ of two hundred, which is bunk. I mean maybe

1370
01:19:43,200 --> 01:19:44,840
Speaker 1: he did. He seemed like he was like a really

1371
01:19:44,880 --> 01:19:48,720
Speaker 1: really smart guy. I don't know if anybody has, but

1372
01:19:48,800 --> 01:19:53,360
Speaker 1: I think that to make claims that the shining of

1373
01:19:53,400 --> 01:19:56,080
Speaker 1: all of his movies had all of this subtext, I

1374
01:19:56,120 --> 01:19:58,360
Speaker 1: think he wanted to make a horror movie. He did

1375
01:19:58,760 --> 01:20:02,720
Speaker 1: and and yeah, like he you know, like it says

1376
01:20:02,760 --> 01:20:06,200
Speaker 1: in the interview like Jack Nicholson realized real quick, like hey,

1377
01:20:06,200 --> 01:20:08,840
Speaker 1: maybe you don't give a on your first take, like

1378
01:20:09,439 --> 01:20:12,360
Speaker 1: it's never going to be perfect. And I think that

1379
01:20:12,360 --> 01:20:16,160
Speaker 1: that explains so much of the movie, like, especially since

1380
01:20:16,200 --> 01:20:19,000
Speaker 1: you're working with an actual five year old, when you

1381
01:20:19,040 --> 01:20:22,400
Speaker 1: get into the continuity of the carpet was different, like

1382
01:20:22,479 --> 01:20:24,120
Speaker 1: well he was a five year old. Like they took

1383
01:20:24,120 --> 01:20:26,559
Speaker 1: it from different angles, but they came back the next

1384
01:20:26,600 --> 01:20:29,280
Speaker 1: day and they didn't check their their their polaroids to

1385
01:20:29,360 --> 01:20:31,960
Speaker 1: know what the scene exactly was said up that, I mean,

1386
01:20:32,000 --> 01:20:35,360
Speaker 1: all these things happened, of course. So my personal take

1387
01:20:35,560 --> 01:20:40,760
Speaker 1: is that Stanley was a great director and a great filmmaker,

1388
01:20:41,320 --> 01:20:45,120
Speaker 1: and he had a fantastic eye for detail for what

1389
01:20:45,320 --> 01:20:48,120
Speaker 1: should and shouldn't be in the shot. His use of

1390
01:20:48,200 --> 01:20:52,599
Speaker 1: one point perspective is I've never seen anybody else pull

1391
01:20:52,640 --> 01:20:54,240
Speaker 1: it off like he does. He was great at what

1392
01:20:54,280 --> 01:21:00,240
Speaker 1: he did. Was he making all of these over or

1393
01:21:00,360 --> 01:21:04,320
Speaker 1: not are not overt things? I don't I don't think so.

1394
01:21:04,400 --> 01:21:07,120
Speaker 1: I think that he left so much up open to

1395
01:21:07,240 --> 01:21:11,320
Speaker 1: interpretation on purpose, not knowing that people were going to

1396
01:21:11,400 --> 01:21:14,280
Speaker 1: go nuts, and it drove him crazy because there there

1397
01:21:14,320 --> 01:21:19,040
Speaker 1: are statements from him saying some whack job makes something up,

1398
01:21:19,200 --> 01:21:22,880
Speaker 1: but then it sticks and it won't go with I

1399
01:21:22,880 --> 01:21:27,080
Speaker 1: can't say enough that it's not right. Yeah, so the

1400
01:21:27,160 --> 01:21:29,640
Speaker 1: genie got out of the bottle. Yeah, much more than

1401
01:21:29,680 --> 01:21:32,000
Speaker 1: I think he intended. As Devin and I had both

1402
01:21:32,000 --> 01:21:34,160
Speaker 1: said repeatedly, if he wanted to make him movie about

1403
01:21:34,160 --> 01:21:37,960
Speaker 1: the end or you know whatever, he would have just

1404
01:21:38,080 --> 01:21:41,800
Speaker 1: done it. Yeah. It was, you know, it was, you know,

1405
01:21:41,840 --> 01:21:44,120
Speaker 1: that big question mark on all of his movies. Sure,

1406
01:21:44,520 --> 01:21:46,320
Speaker 1: but he made movies about what he wanted to make

1407
01:21:46,360 --> 01:21:48,800
Speaker 1: movies about. And sometimes you just have to set a

1408
01:21:48,840 --> 01:21:51,840
Speaker 1: sense of place where like a kid happens to wear

1409
01:21:52,000 --> 01:21:57,160
Speaker 1: a good well sweater of Apollo eleven or things that

1410
01:21:57,200 --> 01:21:58,880
Speaker 1: a boy of that age at that time would wear,

1411
01:21:58,920 --> 01:22:00,360
Speaker 1: is what he was looking for. You know, back in

1412
01:22:00,360 --> 01:22:02,280
Speaker 1: those days, you know, the Space Program was still a

1413
01:22:02,280 --> 01:22:05,160
Speaker 1: big thing for kids. When I was a kid, you know,

1414
01:22:05,320 --> 01:22:07,240
Speaker 1: I was that was all nuts about the Space Program.

1415
01:22:07,280 --> 01:22:09,800
Speaker 1: I thought it was really awesome. You still are? You

1416
01:22:09,880 --> 01:22:11,679
Speaker 1: got that helmet that we have to make a take

1417
01:22:11,720 --> 01:22:21,280
Speaker 1: off because we can't hear you. I think, I don't know.

1418
01:22:21,320 --> 01:22:23,680
Speaker 1: I think it's it's fair to say that, you know,

1419
01:22:23,720 --> 01:22:25,760
Speaker 1: there were just a lot of takes that happened with

1420
01:22:25,840 --> 01:22:29,360
Speaker 1: this movie, and it's not a whole lot deeper than

1421
01:22:29,400 --> 01:22:35,280
Speaker 1: it should have been. I would I would agree, wholeheartedly absolutely. Okay, well, everybody,

1422
01:22:35,560 --> 01:22:37,800
Speaker 1: we are going to go ahead and put a bow

1423
01:22:37,880 --> 01:22:40,920
Speaker 1: on this one. Finally, finally, this is a longer one

1424
01:22:40,960 --> 01:22:44,360
Speaker 1: than I realized it was gonna be. We will have

1425
01:22:44,760 --> 01:22:48,480
Speaker 1: links and this episode, of course, as always on our website,

1426
01:22:48,680 --> 01:22:53,240
Speaker 1: which is Thinking Sideways podcast dot com, and you can

1427
01:22:53,520 --> 01:22:56,680
Speaker 1: streen the show from there or downloaded. A lot of

1428
01:22:56,720 --> 01:23:00,679
Speaker 1: folks use iTunes and a lot of folks stream through

1429
01:23:00,800 --> 01:23:04,639
Speaker 1: other services. If you're on iTunes, do take the time

1430
01:23:04,680 --> 01:23:08,439
Speaker 1: to leave a rating and a comment. We have been

1431
01:23:08,479 --> 01:23:12,000
Speaker 1: moving up the charts, which is absolutely great. We're really

1432
01:23:12,080 --> 01:23:15,320
Speaker 1: enjoying that we are on a couple of places for

1433
01:23:15,360 --> 01:23:18,200
Speaker 1: social media. We're gonna be on Twitter. We're gonna be

1434
01:23:18,240 --> 01:23:21,120
Speaker 1: we are on Twitter. We are on Twitter, and we

1435
01:23:21,160 --> 01:23:24,280
Speaker 1: are at thinking Sideways without the G in the middle.

1436
01:23:24,479 --> 01:23:27,479
Speaker 1: We do tweet on a sort of regular semi maybe

1437
01:23:27,479 --> 01:23:33,280
Speaker 1: happened at basis, I'm tweeting right now. We are on Facebook.

1438
01:23:33,320 --> 01:23:36,479
Speaker 1: We have the Facebook group and the Facebook page, both

1439
01:23:36,479 --> 01:23:39,559
Speaker 1: of which are a lot of fun. And if you

1440
01:23:39,720 --> 01:23:42,880
Speaker 1: have any thoughts about what we've talked about or the

1441
01:23:42,880 --> 01:23:45,400
Speaker 1: things that we've missed, and I apologize, this episode is

1442
01:23:45,439 --> 01:23:49,519
Speaker 1: long already and there's so much lore and little facts

1443
01:23:49,560 --> 01:23:52,160
Speaker 1: in details that we had to cut we couldn't bring in.

1444
01:23:52,520 --> 01:23:54,960
Speaker 1: Be aware that we didn't not know a lot of

1445
01:23:54,960 --> 01:23:57,720
Speaker 1: these hubric things. It just takes a lotle. I'll talk

1446
01:23:57,760 --> 01:23:59,479
Speaker 1: about it, yeah, and then you know, we have the

1447
01:23:59,600 --> 01:24:04,120
Speaker 1: interview who but like basically, but if you have if

1448
01:24:04,120 --> 01:24:06,920
Speaker 1: you've got something great to share, about Kubrick and you

1449
01:24:06,960 --> 01:24:09,839
Speaker 1: want to, you can send us an email at Thinking

1450
01:24:09,920 --> 01:24:15,040
Speaker 1: Sideways podcast at gmail dot com. Apologize to folks in

1451
01:24:15,080 --> 01:24:18,240
Speaker 1: advance because I know that we've been okay about it,

1452
01:24:18,280 --> 01:24:20,680
Speaker 1: but there's a big event that is coming that is

1453
01:24:20,680 --> 01:24:23,360
Speaker 1: going to be around the time that this episode drops,

1454
01:24:23,360 --> 01:24:28,000
Speaker 1: so we might be a little bit delinquent. Yeah, sorry,

1455
01:24:28,400 --> 01:24:32,800
Speaker 1: it took all of us away. Uh. And last, but

1456
01:24:32,960 --> 01:24:35,920
Speaker 1: certainly not least. If you like what we do here

1457
01:24:35,920 --> 01:24:39,160
Speaker 1: at the show and you're enjoying it, uh, you do

1458
01:24:39,360 --> 01:24:43,280
Speaker 1: consider helping support the show to to put up more

1459
01:24:43,320 --> 01:24:48,519
Speaker 1: episodes like this. We're on Patreon, so it's Patreon slash

1460
01:24:48,680 --> 01:24:53,479
Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways patreon dot com. Yeah, slash Thinking Sideways. You

1461
01:24:53,560 --> 01:24:56,760
Speaker 1: can go there. You can set an amount that you

1462
01:24:56,760 --> 01:25:00,760
Speaker 1: would like to donate to the show per episode, completely voluntary,

1463
01:25:01,120 --> 01:25:03,720
Speaker 1: absolutely voluntary. You know, if you decide you don't want

1464
01:25:03,760 --> 01:25:05,280
Speaker 1: to do anymore, you can quit or it's just not

1465
01:25:05,360 --> 01:25:08,000
Speaker 1: your bag. We're going to keep doing this, but we

1466
01:25:08,040 --> 01:25:11,120
Speaker 1: do appreciate all of that help. No no pressure, because

1467
01:25:11,120 --> 01:25:13,960
Speaker 1: I certainly don't hit the tip chart every blog that

1468
01:25:14,080 --> 01:25:16,719
Speaker 1: I go to. So now we try. I know I try,

1469
01:25:16,760 --> 01:25:18,559
Speaker 1: but it's hard because there are so many out there.

1470
01:25:18,600 --> 01:25:22,080
Speaker 1: We understand that there are that. I think that's enough.

1471
01:25:22,160 --> 01:25:25,439
Speaker 1: So ladies and gentlemen, we're gonna go ahead and sign off,

1472
01:25:25,560 --> 01:25:36,479
Speaker 1: and we will talk to you next week. Oh bye, guys. Yeah,

1473
01:25:36,720 --> 01:25:40,439
Speaker 1: oh hey, hey guys. So we actually didn't leave yet.

1474
01:25:41,840 --> 01:25:45,720
Speaker 1: It listened. There was so much great audio in our

1475
01:25:46,000 --> 01:25:49,160
Speaker 1: in my conversation with Brian, that I wanted to share

1476
01:25:49,200 --> 01:25:50,920
Speaker 1: a little bit more of it with you. It didn't

1477
01:25:50,960 --> 01:25:54,320
Speaker 1: fit in the path of the podcast in terms of

1478
01:25:54,320 --> 01:25:56,759
Speaker 1: where we were in the story and in the theories.

1479
01:25:57,080 --> 01:25:59,880
Speaker 1: But this is great stuff about the things that he did,

1480
01:26:00,160 --> 01:26:02,360
Speaker 1: and so we're going to bring that to you right now.

1481
01:26:02,760 --> 01:26:05,760
Speaker 1: And so much bleeping, you guys, I'm so exor yeah,

1482
01:26:05,920 --> 01:26:08,160
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of bleeping. There's a good number

1483
01:26:08,240 --> 01:26:12,000
Speaker 1: of bleping. If we didn't edit our show, this is

1484
01:26:12,040 --> 01:26:15,320
Speaker 1: what it would sound like to Yeah, I'm not putting

1485
01:26:15,360 --> 01:26:19,840
Speaker 1: Brian down because I certainly say those words too. It

1486
01:26:19,960 --> 01:26:23,800
Speaker 1: absolutely enjoy you guys. Okay, goodbye for reels. Yeah, we

1487
01:26:23,840 --> 01:26:28,920
Speaker 1: meet at this time. But I think that conspiracy stuff,

1488
01:26:28,960 --> 01:26:31,880
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just nonsense. That's all you can say

1489
01:26:31,880 --> 01:26:34,479
Speaker 1: about it. To be honest, it's hard to sort of

1490
01:26:34,520 --> 01:26:37,559
Speaker 1: make a program on it because you know, it's difficult.

1491
01:26:38,200 --> 01:26:40,240
Speaker 1: I didn't know quite how you do it. Just you

1492
01:26:40,240 --> 01:26:42,680
Speaker 1: look at all the things and so well, this is

1493
01:26:42,720 --> 01:26:45,439
Speaker 1: not true. Well that's that's kind of what we do,

1494
01:26:45,520 --> 01:26:47,640
Speaker 1: is we find what we can to pull apart, and

1495
01:26:47,680 --> 01:26:49,640
Speaker 1: then we just give everything else and say this is

1496
01:26:49,680 --> 01:26:53,679
Speaker 1: what they say. Yeah, and you know I can assure

1497
01:26:53,720 --> 01:26:55,800
Speaker 1: you that none of that ever came into play. I

1498
01:26:55,800 --> 01:26:58,599
Speaker 1: mean you could. You can feel from what I've been

1499
01:26:58,720 --> 01:27:03,360
Speaker 1: talking to you about the tiny minu shirt detailed trivia

1500
01:27:03,840 --> 01:27:09,840
Speaker 1: that we used to play with it on everything. Yeah, everything,

1501
01:27:09,880 --> 01:27:12,439
Speaker 1: no matter what you ordered. You know, Stanley would want

1502
01:27:12,479 --> 01:27:15,200
Speaker 1: to know. And you know Stanley used to print the

1503
01:27:15,280 --> 01:27:19,040
Speaker 1: phat the payroll printed out every week. You'd look at

1504
01:27:19,479 --> 01:27:22,360
Speaker 1: the petty cash everything. I mean, you know, you don't

1505
01:27:22,360 --> 01:27:25,360
Speaker 1: know how standing a time of doing and even think

1506
01:27:25,400 --> 01:27:27,600
Speaker 1: about directing the film. That was the last thing that

1507
01:27:29,680 --> 01:27:33,280
Speaker 1: get around for doing it, you know, But you get

1508
01:27:33,360 --> 01:27:35,599
Speaker 1: used to it, and you get used to working his way,

1509
01:27:35,920 --> 01:27:39,040
Speaker 1: and he is very loyal and you find all these

1510
01:27:39,479 --> 01:27:42,920
Speaker 1: what I call big good directors. You look at the

1511
01:27:42,920 --> 01:27:48,920
Speaker 1: credits over the years, same old cameramains, same old production designers,

1512
01:27:48,920 --> 01:27:52,880
Speaker 1: same old editors, same old assistant directors when they get

1513
01:27:52,920 --> 01:27:55,960
Speaker 1: somebody who they can also get on with, because if

1514
01:27:55,960 --> 01:27:58,599
Speaker 1: you're working with someone like Stanley, I mean, obviously there's

1515
01:27:58,600 --> 01:28:00,439
Speaker 1: a two and a half years on the last picture.

1516
01:28:00,840 --> 01:28:03,559
Speaker 1: That's a lot. Yeah. Well we shot for a year

1517
01:28:03,560 --> 01:28:06,080
Speaker 1: and a half nearly or something with a lot of stops,

1518
01:28:06,120 --> 01:28:10,080
Speaker 1: so that I mean we shot the nearly three hundred days. Um,

1519
01:28:10,200 --> 01:28:12,400
Speaker 1: you know you need to have people that you can

1520
01:28:12,439 --> 01:28:16,240
Speaker 1: get on with. I mean it's not and I must say,

1521
01:28:16,320 --> 01:28:19,120
Speaker 1: you know, in fairness, someone like Tom I mean he

1522
01:28:19,160 --> 01:28:21,240
Speaker 1: was incredible on the last time I thought. I mean,

1523
01:28:21,240 --> 01:28:23,880
Speaker 1: he's a very easy guy to get on with and

1524
01:28:24,040 --> 01:28:27,000
Speaker 1: was of course. I used to say to him, I

1525
01:28:27,000 --> 01:28:29,680
Speaker 1: can't understand. You better get a new agent. I mean,

1526
01:28:29,920 --> 01:28:31,800
Speaker 1: you're here for a team, but I can't believe you've

1527
01:28:31,800 --> 01:28:33,760
Speaker 1: got an open ended deal. You much should have talked

1528
01:28:33,800 --> 01:28:39,360
Speaker 1: to Jack. You know. He used to keep coming to

1529
01:28:39,400 --> 01:28:41,280
Speaker 1: me and saying, Brian, I've got three other films to make.

1530
01:28:41,320 --> 01:28:43,400
Speaker 1: I said, if we haven't need to start, I said,

1531
01:28:43,400 --> 01:28:44,800
Speaker 1: don't worry back. Can you see the light at the

1532
01:28:44,840 --> 01:28:46,240
Speaker 1: end of the tunnel? I said, you only left the

1533
01:28:46,280 --> 01:28:48,479
Speaker 1: hotel to go to the stage to get on the train. Yet,

1534
01:28:48,720 --> 01:28:53,280
Speaker 1: don't find a tunnel. I mean, nice guy though, and

1535
01:28:53,400 --> 01:28:56,280
Speaker 1: got on very well with Stanley. I remember only two

1536
01:28:56,280 --> 01:29:01,080
Speaker 1: occasions in eighteen months when he lost his rag a bit,

1537
01:29:01,200 --> 01:29:03,559
Speaker 1: and that was only during rehearsal when there was no

1538
01:29:03,600 --> 01:29:05,880
Speaker 1: one there. I have to be outside the door where

1539
01:29:05,920 --> 01:29:07,920
Speaker 1: I used to be when these was just with two

1540
01:29:08,000 --> 01:29:11,080
Speaker 1: three actors and Stanley, and he comes straight back after

1541
01:29:11,160 --> 01:29:14,479
Speaker 1: five minutes and apologize. You know, yeah, nice guy. I

1542
01:29:14,520 --> 01:29:16,280
Speaker 1: liked him very much, and I've worked with Nicole quite

1543
01:29:16,320 --> 01:29:19,479
Speaker 1: a bit, so you know, I knew them very well. Really, yeah,

1544
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:25,479
Speaker 1: so so that that they were fine. Strange movie, strange

1545
01:29:25,520 --> 01:29:29,200
Speaker 1: choice of the movie. I was very surprised when I

1546
01:29:29,280 --> 01:29:31,160
Speaker 1: read the script that that's what we were going to make,

1547
01:29:32,400 --> 01:29:35,120
Speaker 1: because really Stanley wanted to do AI, you know, that's

1548
01:29:35,120 --> 01:29:38,040
Speaker 1: what he planned on doing. But I think the studio

1549
01:29:38,120 --> 01:29:41,280
Speaker 1: were a little who knows whether it's true or not.

1550
01:29:41,479 --> 01:29:44,360
Speaker 1: My guess was that they were very you know, it

1551
01:29:44,400 --> 01:29:48,040
Speaker 1: would have been a very very expensive film with Stanley

1552
01:29:48,120 --> 01:29:50,480
Speaker 1: doing it would have been very different films to Spielberg's

1553
01:29:50,760 --> 01:29:54,080
Speaker 1: efforts on It would have been a very different film.

1554
01:29:54,120 --> 01:29:55,479
Speaker 1: But he spent a lot of such a lot of

1555
01:29:55,520 --> 01:29:59,439
Speaker 1: time preparing it, you know, Um, I think they wanted

1556
01:29:59,560 --> 01:30:01,000
Speaker 1: to make a all the film, and I think the

1557
01:30:01,040 --> 01:30:03,240
Speaker 1: idea was that warners, we're going to split it with

1558
01:30:03,640 --> 01:30:08,439
Speaker 1: Steven Spielberg in terms of financing. You understanding that was

1559
01:30:08,479 --> 01:30:10,080
Speaker 1: the idea. But I mean there's no the thing as

1560
01:30:10,120 --> 01:30:14,519
Speaker 1: making a small film is you know that what doesn't exist,

1561
01:30:14,920 --> 01:30:17,200
Speaker 1: and it's very difficult for these sort of guys because

1562
01:30:17,760 --> 01:30:19,639
Speaker 1: you've got to try and do something better than you've

1563
01:30:19,640 --> 01:30:21,639
Speaker 1: done before. It was the same problem for David Lean.

1564
01:30:21,800 --> 01:30:23,960
Speaker 1: You know, my father did six films with David Lee.

1565
01:30:25,320 --> 01:30:28,920
Speaker 1: Where are you based. We're based out of Portland, Organs.

1566
01:30:29,200 --> 01:30:33,599
Speaker 1: All right, well, of course should that to the Overlook Hotel? Yeah, yeah,

1567
01:30:33,640 --> 01:30:35,880
Speaker 1: we I have not been, but I know Joe has

1568
01:30:35,920 --> 01:30:38,080
Speaker 1: been to the Timberline one of the other co hosts,

1569
01:30:38,640 --> 01:30:41,959
Speaker 1: of course, but yeah, we saw a lot of that footage.

1570
01:30:42,200 --> 01:30:46,200
Speaker 1: It's very familiar. Yeah, of course, I'm sure. And of

1571
01:30:46,240 --> 01:30:48,559
Speaker 1: course the opening sequence which I got Greg to do

1572
01:30:48,640 --> 01:30:51,800
Speaker 1: in the end was in Heaven's Gate Country of course,

1573
01:30:51,800 --> 01:30:55,880
Speaker 1: where we were in Glacier National Park. I mean that

1574
01:30:56,320 --> 01:30:58,080
Speaker 1: he did a great job for us, Greg, you know,

1575
01:30:58,520 --> 01:31:03,160
Speaker 1: they were he was the chop man and very good. Um,

1576
01:31:03,200 --> 01:31:06,920
Speaker 1: I'd work with him in Greece many years ago on

1577
01:31:06,960 --> 01:31:09,800
Speaker 1: a film with James Koburn called The sky Riders and

1578
01:31:09,840 --> 01:31:12,839
Speaker 1: they were really terrific Jim and he got killed unfortunately

1579
01:31:12,880 --> 01:31:18,840
Speaker 1: on the scouting trip for a commercial that chopper came down. Jim. Yeah,

1580
01:31:18,960 --> 01:31:22,879
Speaker 1: very sad, but yeah, he's a good guy. Greg mcgilby

1581
01:31:22,960 --> 01:31:27,519
Speaker 1: did a great job on that opening sequence. Yes, atlastic. Yeah,

1582
01:31:27,640 --> 01:31:30,160
Speaker 1: never worked by car. We spent three months they've been

1583
01:31:30,240 --> 01:31:35,280
Speaker 1: around doing it from front bank again with cars. Yeah, yeah,

1584
01:31:35,560 --> 01:31:38,439
Speaker 1: at all I knew that would be but you know,

1585
01:31:38,640 --> 01:31:40,800
Speaker 1: use your staff were standing that you start you on

1586
01:31:40,880 --> 01:31:44,080
Speaker 1: the cheep and then I had to spend the money.

1587
01:31:45,280 --> 01:31:47,040
Speaker 1: But you know, he wasn't white about the schedule stand

1588
01:31:47,080 --> 01:31:49,320
Speaker 1: He was more interested in the weekly running costs. He

1589
01:31:49,360 --> 01:31:52,639
Speaker 1: would keep those as low as possible, small screw apart

1590
01:31:52,640 --> 01:31:56,760
Speaker 1: from when you needed them, you know, to keep because

1591
01:31:56,800 --> 01:31:58,240
Speaker 1: he knew he was going to shoot for a long time,

1592
01:31:59,360 --> 01:32:03,719
Speaker 1: you know. And um, but he certainly was a unique guy,

1593
01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:07,240
Speaker 1: no question about that. I mean, a true visionary. My

1594
01:32:07,280 --> 01:32:09,920
Speaker 1: father did a lot of stuff six films with David

1595
01:32:09,960 --> 01:32:14,320
Speaker 1: Lean and also worked with Stanley said that for him,

1596
01:32:14,520 --> 01:32:17,320
Speaker 1: David Lean was the best storyteller of all of the

1597
01:32:17,360 --> 01:32:20,240
Speaker 1: big directors, and he'd worked with Houston a lot, and

1598
01:32:21,439 --> 01:32:24,280
Speaker 1: he thought David Lean was the best storyteller of a

1599
01:32:24,320 --> 01:32:27,839
Speaker 1: major novel bringing it to the screen, and that Stanley

1600
01:32:28,000 --> 01:32:32,120
Speaker 1: was more of a visionary who had terrific vision for movies.

1601
01:32:32,320 --> 01:32:35,800
Speaker 1: You know. I think that was a pretty good description

1602
01:32:35,840 --> 01:32:38,680
Speaker 1: of it from the old man, actually, because I think

1603
01:32:38,720 --> 01:32:40,839
Speaker 1: that's the case. I mean, David Lean was a wonderful

1604
01:32:40,880 --> 01:32:43,920
Speaker 1: director of math. And of course all these guys, these

1605
01:32:43,960 --> 01:32:47,639
Speaker 1: big guys, they can work on a big canvas, which

1606
01:32:47,640 --> 01:32:49,559
Speaker 1: a lot of them can't do. I mean I did

1607
01:32:49,600 --> 01:32:51,720
Speaker 1: a lot of films with Michael Jamino, I know, not

1608
01:32:52,120 --> 01:32:54,720
Speaker 1: that successfully in the last few years from Heaven's Gate,

1609
01:32:55,240 --> 01:32:58,479
Speaker 1: but Michael could work on a big canvas, you know,

1610
01:32:58,720 --> 01:33:03,400
Speaker 1: A Coupler can Ridley can, Michael Mann, Cameron. You know,

1611
01:33:03,479 --> 01:33:07,080
Speaker 1: these guys can many many directors can't. They're very good

1612
01:33:07,360 --> 01:33:11,960
Speaker 1: on a smaller canvas um and make them very good films.

1613
01:33:12,000 --> 01:33:14,360
Speaker 1: Of course they did, I mean excellent films. But you know,

1614
01:33:14,439 --> 01:33:17,360
Speaker 1: that big canvas thing is it's something you've either got

1615
01:33:17,479 --> 01:33:22,880
Speaker 1: you haven't. Yeah, absolutely, that's another world out there doing that.

1616
01:33:22,960 --> 01:33:26,240
Speaker 1: And also you know the costs that go with that

1617
01:33:26,360 --> 01:33:29,320
Speaker 1: on those sort of movies, they all escalated. I mean

1618
01:33:29,640 --> 01:33:34,160
Speaker 1: particular period films. You know, I've never understood anyone who

1619
01:33:34,200 --> 01:33:37,000
Speaker 1: ever thinks that they can make a big period film

1620
01:33:38,000 --> 01:33:40,320
Speaker 1: for the money that started you start out with. Its

1621
01:33:40,320 --> 01:33:42,880
Speaker 1: just impossibility. I mean, you only ever get the leading

1622
01:33:42,960 --> 01:33:47,880
Speaker 1: ladies on the period film for six seven hours a day,

1623
01:33:48,280 --> 01:33:50,320
Speaker 1: because you know, time to get them there in the morning,

1624
01:33:50,400 --> 01:33:52,719
Speaker 1: to get them ready, couple of hours at least, getting

1625
01:33:52,760 --> 01:33:56,599
Speaker 1: them ready, dressing them, lunch, chack all the gear off,

1626
01:33:56,640 --> 01:34:00,320
Speaker 1: get them back after lunch, remake up, the travel time,

1627
01:34:00,400 --> 01:34:05,360
Speaker 1: all of you know, I think you know my experiences.

1628
01:34:05,400 --> 01:34:08,519
Speaker 1: You get six seven hours working day off of the

1629
01:34:08,600 --> 01:34:11,320
Speaker 1: leading lady on a big period movie, well, I mean

1630
01:34:11,360 --> 01:34:14,400
Speaker 1: everyone schedules these things for the twelve our days. Well,

1631
01:34:15,040 --> 01:34:19,639
Speaker 1: it's not existent. I don't know one's ever worked that out. Yeah,

1632
01:34:19,960 --> 01:34:25,000
Speaker 1: it amazes me every time we talk about it. It's

1633
01:34:25,200 --> 01:34:31,280
Speaker 1: very Yeah, of course, the thing is, you know, much

1634
01:34:31,280 --> 01:34:33,120
Speaker 1: of your style on those big films. It's like a

1635
01:34:33,960 --> 01:34:36,719
Speaker 1: great big tanker at sea, and stopping them and turning

1636
01:34:36,720 --> 01:34:40,240
Speaker 1: them around is a whole different ballgame in it. Yeah,

1637
01:34:40,680 --> 01:34:43,000
Speaker 1: it doesn't happen. I mean you just got to hope

1638
01:34:43,000 --> 01:34:45,559
Speaker 1: that you know, you get Lucky heard a free the

1639
01:34:45,560 --> 01:34:48,679
Speaker 1: other day trying to turn the Titanic with the canoe paddle,

1640
01:34:48,960 --> 01:34:51,920
Speaker 1: and that sounds like that's appropriate. I've been on a

1641
01:34:51,920 --> 01:34:58,280
Speaker 1: few of those, yeah,