1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,440 Speaker 1: Still living in manually taking notes. There is a better 2 00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 1: way to start the new year with auto dot ai 3 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:09,000 Speaker 1: automatically get meeting notes. Auto dot ai works for virtual 4 00:00:09,039 --> 00:00:11,680 Speaker 1: meetings like Zoom, Microsoft Teams, and Google Meet. Sign up 5 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:13,680 Speaker 1: on the web for free or downloading the up stores 6 00:00:13,720 --> 00:00:16,680 Speaker 1: auto dot ai. That's O T T E R dot Ai. 7 00:00:19,320 --> 00:00:22,040 Speaker 1: The moment you realized you were mistaking your kids for 8 00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:29,560 Speaker 1: co workers? Okay, team, I'm taking my fifteen now. What 9 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 1: was the moment you knew it was time to get 10 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 1: back to work? Let's job it up at career Builder. 11 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:39,160 Speaker 1: Are simple, customizable search tool let you search for part time, 12 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:41,960 Speaker 1: full time, and even work from home jobs so you 13 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: can find a job that fits your lifestyle. Get started 14 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 1: now at career builder dot com. That time you got 15 00:00:51,680 --> 00:00:55,280 Speaker 1: home from a week of double shifts and your dog 16 00:00:55,360 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 1: didn't recognize you. He hates me? Hates me? Do you 17 00:00:58,680 --> 00:01:01,520 Speaker 1: want to treat? You want to treat? You knew it 18 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:05,840 Speaker 1: was time for something new, Let's drop it up. At 19 00:01:05,880 --> 00:01:08,800 Speaker 1: career builder. You can find jobs with the work life 20 00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: balance and salary you want, Plus build a resume and 21 00:01:12,240 --> 00:01:15,479 Speaker 1: apply to multiple jobs in just one click. Start your 22 00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:21,080 Speaker 1: search at career builder dot com. Hi everyone. I'm Katie 23 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:23,880 Speaker 1: Couric and I'm bozemas St. John and this is Back 24 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:27,479 Speaker 1: to Biz with Katie and Bows. We had a very 25 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:29,959 Speaker 1: different episode plan for this week. We're going to talk 26 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:35,000 Speaker 1: about the future of education, specifically college education, with the 27 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,720 Speaker 1: president of Wesleyan where Bows went to college, and the 28 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:40,280 Speaker 1: president of U b A, where I went to college. 29 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:44,960 Speaker 1: But we couldn't stand by and watch what was transpiring 30 00:01:45,080 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 1: in cities all across the country following the brutal killing 31 00:01:50,800 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 1: of George Floyd in Minneapolis without addressing this issue. Bows. Yes, 32 00:01:56,840 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 1: it's all compounded, you know. I think with even the 33 00:01:59,480 --> 00:02:03,640 Speaker 1: killings of Brianna Taylor and ah Mod Aubrey, they've all 34 00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:07,240 Speaker 1: fired up a need in this country for not just 35 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:10,799 Speaker 1: conversation but action. And I think it's the right thing 36 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 1: for us to also act in getting a conversation with 37 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:18,519 Speaker 1: two really influential people who have a lot to say 38 00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 1: about this very moment in time, and you can help 39 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 1: us to not just understand what is happening, but give 40 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:27,960 Speaker 1: us the history of what has happened and also help 41 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:31,840 Speaker 1: us feel hopeful for the future. So we decided to 42 00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: invite Bishop T. D. Jake's on the show He's just 43 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 1: an extraordinary man, a good friend of yours, bows and 44 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:42,640 Speaker 1: someone I've interviewed through the years. How do you know 45 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:48,560 Speaker 1: Bishop Jake's Bishop Jake's legendary. You know his words from 46 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,760 Speaker 1: the Potter's House are ones that not only I listened to, 47 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 1: but my mother listens to. I don't think the Sunday 48 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:57,360 Speaker 1: goes by without hearing Bishop Jake's booming voice in our home. 49 00:02:58,240 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 1: But also I had him at house in January. We 50 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:06,359 Speaker 1: held a dinner um with Hillary Clinton for vital Voices, 51 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:10,240 Speaker 1: and he came and gave a beautiful prayer at the start. 52 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:12,960 Speaker 1: And I decided then and there we should be best friends. 53 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:16,760 Speaker 1: And so I'm enforcing that now by calling in this favor. 54 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:20,679 Speaker 1: And also Opal to Mattie, who I had not met 55 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:26,400 Speaker 1: until today, and she was quite extraordinary. Again, she's a 56 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 1: friend of yours. All roads lead to bows, by the way. 57 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:32,800 Speaker 1: But tell us how you know Opal Opel. I've always 58 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: been impressed by from Afar until a few years ago, UM, 59 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:39,800 Speaker 1: when I met her in person. She had been one 60 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:41,880 Speaker 1: of the co founders, as you said, of Black Lives 61 00:03:41,920 --> 00:03:46,040 Speaker 1: Matter UM, an organization started seven years ago. But we 62 00:03:46,160 --> 00:03:49,480 Speaker 1: are both of West African descent. She is Nigerian and 63 00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:52,480 Speaker 1: I am gane In, and we find ourselves in many 64 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 1: of the same conversations and now part of the same group. 65 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 1: We call ourselves the West African voltron Waves for short. 66 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 1: And so there's a group of about seventeen of us 67 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 1: who all hail from different parts of West Africa, and 68 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:09,200 Speaker 1: we have conversations around so many things. But Opal certainly 69 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:11,520 Speaker 1: has a powerful voice in this space, and it just 70 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:14,360 Speaker 1: made sense that if she's my sister in the group, 71 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:16,600 Speaker 1: then we might as well also invite to hear her 72 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:21,120 Speaker 1: voice in public. Well, the conversation was amazing, and we 73 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:24,680 Speaker 1: began by just really asking people to share how they 74 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 1: were feeling after this very trying, upsetting, disturbing, weak and 75 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:35,600 Speaker 1: Bishop Jake said he had never cried so hard for 76 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:39,440 Speaker 1: someone he didn't know, and began by sharing with us 77 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:47,040 Speaker 1: where his head and heart are right now. The raw bar, 78 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:54,920 Speaker 1: very tortuous, relentless and merciful behavior of it all was overwhelming. Uh, 79 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:57,480 Speaker 1: to see that, to view that, and to understand that 80 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:04,599 Speaker 1: there but for a camera, uh, a phone camera, we 81 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:09,080 Speaker 1: would never have gotten the truth about what happened, and 82 00:05:09,120 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 1: that truth is still being challenged by every legal trick imaginable. 83 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:20,279 Speaker 1: But somehow, in a way, when I heard uh George 84 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:25,320 Speaker 1: Floyd on the ground screaming for his deceased mother and 85 00:05:25,360 --> 00:05:29,359 Speaker 1: saying I can't breathe, I thought he became emblematic of 86 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:40,240 Speaker 1: an oppressed society that cannot breathe economically, socially, educationally. Uh, 87 00:05:40,279 --> 00:05:47,040 Speaker 1: so many areas where the oxygen that would cause underserved 88 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:51,680 Speaker 1: communities to serve has been with hell and uh we've 89 00:05:51,720 --> 00:05:54,920 Speaker 1: been pressed down on some more than others, but we've 90 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 1: been pressed down on in a way that he becomes 91 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 1: an emblem of a of a group of people that 92 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:07,240 Speaker 1: are suffering. And it's not just like it's Brown's, it's 93 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:11,320 Speaker 1: it's uh poor whites, it's Middle America. It's so many 94 00:06:11,400 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 1: people now that fit within that context of of not 95 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:21,919 Speaker 1: having access to the oxygen of opportunities. Yes, yes, yes, 96 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:26,080 Speaker 1: I mean that says it's so poetically. In fact, I 97 00:06:26,160 --> 00:06:28,600 Speaker 1: have felt very much the same, you know, in that 98 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 1: this idea of or this image of being suffocated, you know, 99 00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:38,919 Speaker 1: by a system that is not built to allow you 100 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:44,080 Speaker 1: to flourish or even simply to live, is what is 101 00:06:44,120 --> 00:06:50,000 Speaker 1: probably most viscerally felt right now. Although it happens again 102 00:06:50,000 --> 00:06:53,119 Speaker 1: and again and again. Um, Opal, we know that. Of course, 103 00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:56,159 Speaker 1: you've also been in the conversation for quite some time, 104 00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:00,360 Speaker 1: you know, having founded co founded Black Lives Matter. Um, 105 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: what are your thoughts? How are you feeling currently? You know, 106 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:11,840 Speaker 1: to be honest, um, I'm feeling really deeply pained. I 107 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 1: am grieving for people. UM. I am scared about what 108 00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 1: the future holds, and I know that that is what 109 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 1: so many of our siblings across the country are experiencing 110 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 1: in this moment. Um, I feel similar to what you will. 111 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 1: We're both just sharing, just witnessing another life being taken 112 00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:43,440 Speaker 1: in front of you for everybody to see in broad daylight, 113 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 1: in such a barbaric and unconscionable manner. Um My, it's 114 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 1: so deeply disturbing. It's so deeply disturbing, and I, um, 115 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 1: I'm sad for us that this continues to happen. You know, 116 00:08:03,080 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 1: it's been happening for generations. So we know we didn't 117 00:08:06,360 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: get to this moment overnight. We know that there's been 118 00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 1: a build up. We know that it's been seven years 119 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: since Black Lives Matter was first created. It's been so 120 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:19,000 Speaker 1: many years, and even in the midst of a pandemic 121 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:24,560 Speaker 1: we see that anti black racism continues to persist in 122 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 1: such a violent manner, and it's disturbing, it's enraging. You 123 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:34,400 Speaker 1: see that there are people across the country who have 124 00:08:34,559 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 1: just had enough, They have had enough, and so my 125 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:41,320 Speaker 1: heart is really with with them, with with all of 126 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:44,599 Speaker 1: us who are are sitting and looking and thinking. And 127 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:49,360 Speaker 1: my next is my daughter, Next is my son, Next 128 00:08:49,480 --> 00:08:53,199 Speaker 1: is my auntie, my uncle. It is so real, and 129 00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:56,320 Speaker 1: despite where we even might be on the socio economic 130 00:08:57,080 --> 00:09:00,360 Speaker 1: you know, we still see that it's happening to so 131 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:03,720 Speaker 1: many of us. And we're always you know, one step removed, 132 00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:07,760 Speaker 1: or one relationship or neighborhood could have removed from these 133 00:09:07,840 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: kinds of stories and cases. And you know, I am, 134 00:09:13,040 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 1: I am, I know that it's not just this one 135 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:21,480 Speaker 1: case either, right, So, we more recently heard about the 136 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:25,520 Speaker 1: story of Brianna Taylor, an e M T and essential 137 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:32,760 Speaker 1: worker who was gunned down in her own home in Louisville, Kentucky, 138 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:37,240 Speaker 1: and I'm just thinking about her, I'm thinking about a 139 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 1: mont Verry are very I'm thinking about so many other 140 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: people and so many names that we may not even 141 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 1: know because it wasn't captured people weren't able to get 142 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:49,840 Speaker 1: to kind of use attention that we see happening in 143 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 1: these other cases. But the reality is that people in 144 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:56,680 Speaker 1: their neighborhoods and their local communities are aware of these stories, 145 00:09:57,200 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 1: and so they're out for the for the people, and 146 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:03,600 Speaker 1: the voy says that weren't heard at the larger discussion. 147 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:06,960 Speaker 1: They're out for their very neighbors and people within their 148 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 1: own community and cities that we're also harmed by this 149 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 1: extrajudicial violence that we're seeing in our communities. So I'm 150 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:24,600 Speaker 1: I'm pained, and then i also feel so hopeful because 151 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:28,000 Speaker 1: I'm looking around and I see that people have had 152 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:32,200 Speaker 1: enough and as they've sat through and you know, try 153 00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:35,320 Speaker 1: to manage their time and their lives in the midst 154 00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:40,760 Speaker 1: of this pandemic, they're they're taking stock of what's to come, 155 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 1: and they're looking around and they're hearing these stories and 156 00:10:43,520 --> 00:10:47,120 Speaker 1: they're saying, enough is enough. It's my duty to be 157 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 1: out there and demanding justice. It's my duty to work 158 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:53,440 Speaker 1: and to ensure that we have a multiracial democracy that 159 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:56,280 Speaker 1: works for all of us. It's my duty to affirm 160 00:10:56,600 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 1: and to work for a world where black lives matter. 161 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:04,200 Speaker 1: And in that I'm I'm very hopeful because we see 162 00:11:04,320 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 1: a very vibrant multiracial movement for black lives. Bose, I 163 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:14,240 Speaker 1: know that you told me that your heart hurt and 164 00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:18,920 Speaker 1: your spirit is tired, and you can hear the pain 165 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:22,680 Speaker 1: and Opal's voice. You can hear the pain and Bishop 166 00:11:22,760 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 1: Jakes's voice, And I know that that you feel the 167 00:11:27,280 --> 00:11:31,440 Speaker 1: same way. Yeah, yeah, I mean we you and I, UM, 168 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:35,760 Speaker 1: when we were talking about, you know, even having this episode, 169 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:38,720 Speaker 1: which of course we felt both felt that it was 170 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:41,320 Speaker 1: necessary to have the conversation and for us to have 171 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:47,079 Speaker 1: the conversation. UM, I felt tired. You know, I'm tired, 172 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:50,480 Speaker 1: and my spirit feels tired. And I think even in 173 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 1: part of this conversation, UM, in talking about what we 174 00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 1: are seeing, maybe the lessons we can learn out of it, 175 00:11:58,640 --> 00:12:03,120 Speaker 1: the ways that we can and move forward in it. Uh, 176 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:05,240 Speaker 1: if it's not too much to ask, I'm I'm also 177 00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:09,280 Speaker 1: looking for some inspiration and some motivation, you know, because 178 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 1: leadership requires a lot, It requires a lot of your heart, 179 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 1: it requires a lot of your head, It requires a 180 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:21,800 Speaker 1: lot of innovation. And I was already tired from COVID 181 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:25,280 Speaker 1: and being inside and trying to figure out how to 182 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:30,000 Speaker 1: make businesses run and keep uh, you know, employees happy 183 00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: and motivated and all of that, and myself my own 184 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:38,080 Speaker 1: spirit and uh, with these incidents and as you said, 185 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:40,960 Speaker 1: open you know, those that are not captured, I think 186 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:45,800 Speaker 1: it has been. It has been. It just hurts. It hurts, 187 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 1: and it's tiring. I also recognize the implications to all 188 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 1: of us, you know. Certainly I am very much focused 189 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:57,200 Speaker 1: on blackness, you know, and my shirt today says I 190 00:12:57,240 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 1: love black people, because I wanted everybody to remember that. 191 00:12:59,679 --> 00:13:02,440 Speaker 1: You know, I have a love of black people, and 192 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:04,719 Speaker 1: we should have a love of black people. But I'm 193 00:13:04,760 --> 00:13:09,199 Speaker 1: also aware as I interact with my colleagues that endeavor 194 00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:12,880 Speaker 1: and in other spaces who are non black, um, that 195 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 1: they are feeling things too right uh and and trying 196 00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 1: to also navigate their emotions. And Katie, I know that 197 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 1: you and I had a conversation about these things, and 198 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:24,600 Speaker 1: certainly we're going to get to it in some of 199 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:27,760 Speaker 1: these conversations here. But I think you probably feel a 200 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:31,720 Speaker 1: lot of questions from um, non black people as well, 201 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:34,839 Speaker 1: and since you're a human being as well, you know, 202 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:38,360 Speaker 1: it would be good to understand how you feel. Well, 203 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 1: I feel similar feelings that you all feel and some 204 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:48,000 Speaker 1: different feelings because of my life experience. I feel repulsed 205 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:56,480 Speaker 1: and and infuriated by the cavalier lack of humanity that 206 00:13:56,520 --> 00:14:04,560 Speaker 1: we witnessed in the murder of George Floyd. And I 207 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:14,840 Speaker 1: feel embarrassed and ashamed and guilty, uh, because of all 208 00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 1: the benefits I've enjoyed and appreciated because of my skin color. 209 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 1: And I think I've been thinking about that a lot. 210 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:30,560 Speaker 1: I think, like many people, I've had a a quiet 211 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 1: evolution in my thought in probably the last decade or so, 212 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:44,360 Speaker 1: an appreciation of what white privilege actually means and in 213 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 1: all its incarnations. And um, you know, I've been covering 214 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 1: these stories for some time. First of all, Bishop Jake's 215 00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:58,240 Speaker 1: you know you You and I had many conversations through 216 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 1: the years on the Today Show. I started there in 217 00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: n and shortly after that Rodney King happened, you know. 218 00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:12,600 Speaker 1: And I think I'm incredulous that this keeps happening and 219 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 1: happening and happening. And some of it is an indictment 220 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:18,240 Speaker 1: of the news cycle because it gets a lot of 221 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: attention and then it fades away and it gets a 222 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 1: lot a lot of attention. But the accumulated pain, particularly 223 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:33,200 Speaker 1: for the Black community is something that I don't think 224 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:37,800 Speaker 1: i've I've appreciated enough. I think I've been a bystander, 225 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:41,200 Speaker 1: and I think I have a high degree of empathy 226 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:44,800 Speaker 1: in general as a person. But your empathy can only 227 00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:48,160 Speaker 1: get you so far if your life experience is so 228 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:53,760 Speaker 1: dramatically different. So I'm trying to understand how I can 229 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 1: be less of a bystander or less of a witness 230 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:03,640 Speaker 1: and help be a change agent. And because I think 231 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:06,720 Speaker 1: I am in a position where I can do that 232 00:16:07,320 --> 00:16:12,480 Speaker 1: in my own way, with my own people who respect 233 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:16,160 Speaker 1: me or or think of me in a positive way. 234 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:20,800 Speaker 1: So I think it's been a tremendous wake up call. 235 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:25,160 Speaker 1: I think that you know what Opal was saying, how 236 00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:29,480 Speaker 1: she's also hopeful. It does feel like this is different, 237 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:34,480 Speaker 1: This time is different. It's a watershed moment, and that 238 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 1: it's an opportunity hopefully, I say, prayerfully that progress can 239 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 1: actually be made and that we can start grappling with 240 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:52,240 Speaker 1: some of these insidious problems, seemingly intractable problems that are 241 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:59,640 Speaker 1: the product of generations of attitudes and an oppression, and 242 00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 1: finally began to figure out a way that we can 243 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 1: make things right. And you know I wanted to jump 244 00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:12,360 Speaker 1: in and say something, um if if we look at 245 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:17,840 Speaker 1: the murder in isolation, um and and the series of 246 00:17:17,880 --> 00:17:21,959 Speaker 1: barbaric behaviors done to individuals, and the isolation of the 247 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:27,440 Speaker 1: system that empowers the behavior to continue, well, we will not. 248 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:32,080 Speaker 1: We will we will not really do George Floyd or 249 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:36,159 Speaker 1: mud or both of them, John or any of the 250 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:39,199 Speaker 1: many other days we could call any favors. If we 251 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:43,679 Speaker 1: don't acknowledge the fact that the police report had to 252 00:17:43,760 --> 00:17:47,800 Speaker 1: be changed when the video came out, If we don't 253 00:17:47,840 --> 00:17:52,880 Speaker 1: acknowledge that the autopsies differ depending upon who did them, 254 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:56,560 Speaker 1: If we don't take the deeper dive into a criminal 255 00:17:56,760 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: justice system that in the ables this behavior and supports 256 00:18:03,119 --> 00:18:08,840 Speaker 1: its own in this barbaric behavior. If we don't address that, 257 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,880 Speaker 1: then then it will remain a murder, whether it's tried 258 00:18:12,960 --> 00:18:15,920 Speaker 1: as a murder or not, and it won't at least 259 00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:21,280 Speaker 1: become a martyr to a bigger understanding of a system 260 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:25,919 Speaker 1: that seeks to correct itself. I am hardened and encouraged 261 00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,159 Speaker 1: at the fact that this does not feel like a 262 00:18:29,359 --> 00:18:33,240 Speaker 1: black people's problem this time. When I see flights in 263 00:18:33,320 --> 00:18:35,880 Speaker 1: the street and brown people in the street, and young 264 00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:38,760 Speaker 1: people in the street, and and old people. When I 265 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:44,120 Speaker 1: see behind the scenes executives and elected officials having deeper conversations, 266 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,240 Speaker 1: I'm kind of encouraged. I have been on the phone 267 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:53,000 Speaker 1: with a series of influential pastors, uh, black and white, 268 00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:56,919 Speaker 1: a huge amount of white pastors, trying to come to 269 00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:58,920 Speaker 1: grips with this, and what I tried to make people 270 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:01,840 Speaker 1: understand it's that being black is a lot like being 271 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:04,879 Speaker 1: a molested child. When somebody has power over you and 272 00:19:04,920 --> 00:19:08,960 Speaker 1: they abuse that power over you. The same symptomatic conditions 273 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:12,160 Speaker 1: exist in our community that would exist in a molested child. 274 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:16,119 Speaker 1: In my forty three years of ministry working with molestation, 275 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:19,080 Speaker 1: one of the horrific things about it is to not 276 00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:25,560 Speaker 1: be believed. And there's something about this time that that 277 00:19:25,680 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 1: we're starting to feel like maybe somebody believed us this time. 278 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 1: Because historically, if you bring it up your race baiting, uh, 279 00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:37,840 Speaker 1: you're you rushed to judgment too soon. All the evidence 280 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:40,600 Speaker 1: is not in. We're waiting on due process. There were 281 00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:43,640 Speaker 1: all of these little things that were said to thwart 282 00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: your voice out and to shut you up, and then 283 00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:51,119 Speaker 1: the system chewed you up and spit you out in 284 00:19:51,200 --> 00:19:56,160 Speaker 1: a barbaric way. Uh, with coarter pointed attorneys and and 285 00:19:56,160 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 1: and and crafty judicial switches. Uh. There's something about this 286 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:06,680 Speaker 1: time that I'm starting to feel like maybe somebody's hearing us, 287 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:10,840 Speaker 1: Maybe somebody is believing us that we don't. It's bad 288 00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 1: enough to be mauled in the process, and it's worse 289 00:20:14,119 --> 00:20:19,919 Speaker 1: to not be believed. And Uh, the the real, the 290 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: real abuse is to be traumatized by the event and 291 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:27,520 Speaker 1: then be traumatized by the fact that you have to validate, 292 00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:31,000 Speaker 1: you have to prove that this ugly, horrible thing is 293 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:35,119 Speaker 1: real and nothing that you present is accepted as legitimate. 294 00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:39,280 Speaker 1: And on the heels of COVID nineteen and what that 295 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:42,879 Speaker 1: has done to us as a community, black, white, and brown, 296 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 1: to be in isolation for all of these weeks and 297 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:49,199 Speaker 1: still not be safe, and still not be free to 298 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:52,440 Speaker 1: cover our mouths and our nose and our ears, and 299 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:54,840 Speaker 1: and to every time you go out the door sneeze 300 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 1: or get a scratchy throat, you wonder are you next? 301 00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 1: For all of the hundred thousand people who died on ventilators, 302 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:06,560 Speaker 1: we have not recovered from from that. We we we 303 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:10,920 Speaker 1: have not recovered from medgar evidence. We've not recovered from 304 00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:14,960 Speaker 1: Dr King. We've not recovered from Jim Crower slavery, only 305 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:19,879 Speaker 1: because the moment you're you're trying to get better, something 306 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 1: else comes and takes you back and triggers you right 307 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:27,200 Speaker 1: back to that same spot again, like an abused child. 308 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:31,360 Speaker 1: There are triggers, and these triggers keep shooting into us 309 00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:35,720 Speaker 1: until there's almost nothing left. I feel like the headboard 310 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:38,879 Speaker 1: of winning Mandela's bed post shut through with holes. In 311 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:44,040 Speaker 1: South Africa, I feel like, Uh, we have had to 312 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 1: be silent because we have not been believed, and we've 313 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:51,000 Speaker 1: murmured amongst ourselves until all of a sudden, the murmuring 314 00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:56,480 Speaker 1: has become a scream, a scream so loud and so piercing, 315 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:00,119 Speaker 1: uh that it has become inconvenient. And I'm listen, hang 316 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:02,920 Speaker 1: out in America, who wants to shut up the screen 317 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:06,520 Speaker 1: more than than they want to stop the abuse that 318 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 1: was so powerful? And what you name Bishop? This kind 319 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 1: of repeated abuse, this repeated violence over generations, historical trauma, 320 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:22,960 Speaker 1: current traumas, current abuse and affliction. Uh, these types of 321 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:28,439 Speaker 1: endemic hardships and our communities, and this is all why 322 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:32,240 Speaker 1: Black Lives Matter was created seven years ago. We knew 323 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:36,400 Speaker 1: we had to name that anti black racism, and our 324 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: society was quite literally killing us, not only in the streets, 325 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:44,640 Speaker 1: not only at the hands of police, but we're looking 326 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,920 Speaker 1: at our economic system, the health care system, the education system. 327 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 1: Um just abysmal impact when you look at our communities 328 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:59,200 Speaker 1: and how it's racialized, and how racism is quite literally 329 00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: cutting our life short. And it was because there was 330 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:10,480 Speaker 1: this deafening silence around how just how vastly different the 331 00:23:10,560 --> 00:23:15,439 Speaker 1: black experiences in this country compared to our counterparts. And 332 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: we had to name it because for far too long 333 00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 1: there was a silence. And what we say now is 334 00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:26,520 Speaker 1: that to be silent is to be complicit. To be 335 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: silent is to stand on the sidelines and act as 336 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:33,920 Speaker 1: if you have no power or agency to make a difference. 337 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:38,560 Speaker 1: And we can no longer have that. The status quo 338 00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:42,960 Speaker 1: of a black pain and black death is it is intolerable. 339 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:47,080 Speaker 1: We can't live like this anymore. It's it's not only 340 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:53,320 Speaker 1: a symbolic death, but it's real material consequences in our lives. 341 00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:56,240 Speaker 1: And so it's important for us to recognize that we 342 00:23:56,320 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 1: have actually been flexing our muscle over the last seven 343 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 1: been the years I and I say that I want 344 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 1: to name it because I think it's important for us 345 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:08,200 Speaker 1: to understand that there have been people who've been speaking out. 346 00:24:09,280 --> 00:24:12,160 Speaker 1: People have been speaking out ever since they were taken 347 00:24:12,400 --> 00:24:16,680 Speaker 1: and slave ships and kidnapped. They've always resisted, We've always 348 00:24:17,119 --> 00:24:21,800 Speaker 1: tried to fight um, We've always advocated for ourselves. We've 349 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,880 Speaker 1: always taken care of our people in our own communities. 350 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:28,919 Speaker 1: We've always done that. And I'm really looking at people 351 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:33,680 Speaker 1: like Sabrina Fulton, Trayvon Martin's mother, who also speaking out 352 00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:36,199 Speaker 1: a lot in this moment, and it's just naming the 353 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:39,840 Speaker 1: fact that they are tired. We're all fed up. We 354 00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,800 Speaker 1: don't want to see this happen again. I think what's 355 00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:46,280 Speaker 1: important now to also recognize is that in this particular case, right, so, 356 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:49,400 Speaker 1: we've been talking so much about George Floyd, but it's 357 00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:53,280 Speaker 1: not just one police officer. There were four involved. But 358 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:57,320 Speaker 1: not only the four involved, but you have entire precincts, 359 00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:02,600 Speaker 1: you have entire budgets that are allocated to policing of 360 00:25:02,600 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: our neighborhoods in this way, to allowing for the abuse 361 00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:10,200 Speaker 1: to continue, and so our community members, the organizations that 362 00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:14,119 Speaker 1: I work with, the movement that is growing every single day, 363 00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:18,400 Speaker 1: is demanding that we defund the police that we take 364 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:23,919 Speaker 1: from their budgets that are already over overblown. They have 365 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:28,400 Speaker 1: so much at their disposal. As you're seeing even now, 366 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: we see that there are militarized police presence all across 367 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:36,680 Speaker 1: the country. We see tanks, we've seen grenades, we've seen 368 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 1: um all rubber bullets being used. We've seen a lot 369 00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 1: of military equipment within our local police force. And so 370 00:25:46,320 --> 00:25:49,240 Speaker 1: I think we just have to reconcile with the fact 371 00:25:49,240 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 1: that they are very armed, they're overly resourced, and it's 372 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 1: high time that we begin to resource differently. We begin 373 00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:01,719 Speaker 1: to adjust the budget to support communities being safe on 374 00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:04,880 Speaker 1: their own terms. And the communities that I've worked with 375 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,880 Speaker 1: from New York to Atlanta to l A. Folks are 376 00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: demanding that they have the resources to seek job opportunities, 377 00:26:14,560 --> 00:26:16,960 Speaker 1: that they're able to ride this subway for without fear 378 00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 1: of harassment, that they can jump the turnstyle if they 379 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:22,800 Speaker 1: don't have the resources, they can still take the train. Um. 380 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: People are are looking for our education system to be 381 00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:30,280 Speaker 1: well funded, social workers and mental health care workers to 382 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:33,159 Speaker 1: finally have the budgets that they deserve to deal with 383 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: real crises in our communities, and that's what safety really 384 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 1: looks like to us, and I think it's important that 385 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:44,159 Speaker 1: we name that, that we begin to collectively reimagine what 386 00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:47,439 Speaker 1: safety looks like when we look at one another with 387 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 1: eyes of dignity and respect um and we look to 388 00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:59,440 Speaker 1: restore now versus punished and take away. So, in terms 389 00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 1: of UH actionable results coming out of this, I think 390 00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:08,760 Speaker 1: the federal government has an opportunity, whether they use it 391 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:14,320 Speaker 1: or not, to penalize UH police departments that do not 392 00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:20,720 Speaker 1: provide policing of themselves by denying funding to them as 393 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:25,880 Speaker 1: a way of incentivizing them to become more effective at 394 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:30,240 Speaker 1: respecting the law that they impose upon us. But where 395 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,800 Speaker 1: I but where I do think we need to raise 396 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 1: their financial UH fluidity is in terms of the compensation 397 00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:42,320 Speaker 1: that we pay the good police officers so that we 398 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:47,200 Speaker 1: can get more quality people into these positions and pay 399 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 1: them on a level that requires a certain intellectualism about them, 400 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:55,160 Speaker 1: because I think one of the problems is the low 401 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:59,720 Speaker 1: pay scale and the low quality of police officers that 402 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:06,320 Speaker 1: are permeating the the police establishment that we're getting people 403 00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:13,240 Speaker 1: some of everybody, poor training, poor background, poor compensation, long hours, uh, 404 00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:17,399 Speaker 1: little respect on their side. And I think instead of 405 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:22,600 Speaker 1: buying more machine guns and and weapons and turning it 406 00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:27,560 Speaker 1: into a military military state, maybe we could get more 407 00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 1: benefits and more compensations for the widows, for the wives 408 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,240 Speaker 1: of people who died in fires, pulling our babies out 409 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:37,560 Speaker 1: of burning buildings. I don't have a problem with police 410 00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:41,120 Speaker 1: officers in general. I pastor many of them black and white, 411 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 1: and I just just left the precinct where there there 412 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:48,520 Speaker 1: are good people. I have a problem with the silence 413 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,719 Speaker 1: of good people who will not speak out against the 414 00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,160 Speaker 1: ones that are corrupt. I have a problem with the 415 00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:58,120 Speaker 1: fraternity that is imposed in that society where value are 416 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,440 Speaker 1: required to be born to each other than you are 417 00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,720 Speaker 1: to the law that you pledged and gave an those 418 00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:06,840 Speaker 1: two uh. And I think that if we raise the pay, 419 00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:09,640 Speaker 1: and raise the bar, and raise the standards until we 420 00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,920 Speaker 1: had professional, more professional people in that position and showed 421 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:22,160 Speaker 1: more appreciation, and then then segregated those viral, infectious individuals 422 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 1: that hide behind blue in such a way that we 423 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,040 Speaker 1: can lift the burden because the police officer, it's a 424 00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:30,320 Speaker 1: bad time to be a police officer right now, and 425 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:34,280 Speaker 1: the police officers are bearing the shame of of of 426 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:37,080 Speaker 1: of some of them. Uh and and we have to 427 00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,960 Speaker 1: find a way to restore the dignity to that office 428 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:46,080 Speaker 1: as well. We're going to take a short break, but 429 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 1: when we come back, we'll talk about how to find 430 00:29:48,880 --> 00:30:03,400 Speaker 1: a strategy for the struggle. Whether your event needed one 431 00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 1: room or an entire conference center, hoppin has revolutionized the 432 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:10,280 Speaker 1: way people come together. With hoppin, you can host a 433 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 1: fully fledged digital meet up, complete with one on one meetings, 434 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:17,520 Speaker 1: hands on sessions, and expo booths. 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You know 468 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: a lot of people on my social media channels were 469 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:21,400 Speaker 1: saying unions and arbitration, not to mention what Bishop Jake's 470 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,680 Speaker 1: was saying, this thin blue line where they protect each 471 00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:28,000 Speaker 1: other at all costs, and there are good police officers. 472 00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:30,440 Speaker 1: But how does the culture need to change, How does 473 00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:34,280 Speaker 1: the process need to change so that we can separate 474 00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 1: the bad, bad police officers and get them out of there. 475 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:43,280 Speaker 1: It's not that there's just one you know, police officer 476 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:46,440 Speaker 1: that's you know, bad apple, or one good three good three. 477 00:32:46,760 --> 00:32:48,600 Speaker 1: I don't it's I don't think it works like that. 478 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:58,640 Speaker 1: We have deeply entrenched cultures, and we have deeply entrenched histories, um, 479 00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:03,280 Speaker 1: and we have laws continue to change to protect this institution. 480 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:08,480 Speaker 1: And as we look back in our history, policing actually 481 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 1: what began as slave patrols. You know, I'm gonna be 482 00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:13,560 Speaker 1: really honest and prank with you all because I think 483 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: this is a time for us to to have these 484 00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:19,360 Speaker 1: types of you know, radically real conversation where we don't 485 00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:22,520 Speaker 1: hold back. But the history of of of law enforcement 486 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:26,920 Speaker 1: really is rooted and the capturing of people who were 487 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:30,760 Speaker 1: trying to just get free. And we have years later, 488 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 1: this law enforcement that continues to exhibit such lethal racial bias. Listen, 489 00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:47,760 Speaker 1: Racism is rampant and it runs throughout our society period. 490 00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:51,160 Speaker 1: You know, it's it's the corporate if it's the education system, 491 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:55,440 Speaker 1: it's a healthcare system. Is there And the problem is 492 00:33:55,480 --> 00:34:02,240 Speaker 1: that we have racist policies, racist values, racist ideologies that 493 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:06,760 Speaker 1: operate in less than a second. And there are reports 494 00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:07,960 Speaker 1: that show this. There is a lot of data that 495 00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:12,480 Speaker 1: shows is and it's happening. You know, law enforcement are 496 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:16,840 Speaker 1: making decisions based on these entrenched biaces that they can't 497 00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:20,560 Speaker 1: even conceive of themselves. They're not processing it, they're not 498 00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:24,239 Speaker 1: conscious of it. It's called implicit bias because it's this 499 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:30,680 Speaker 1: unconscious dehumanization that is happening. And so when you're empowered 500 00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:34,400 Speaker 1: to use lethal force and you have these types of 501 00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:38,759 Speaker 1: biases that are pervasive throughout the society, then we do 502 00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:41,720 Speaker 1: see these types of outcomes. We do see that black 503 00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 1: people are the are experiencing the acute impact of racial 504 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:50,560 Speaker 1: bias when it comes to policing. This is just a fact, 505 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:53,440 Speaker 1: and I think we just have to get honest about 506 00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:57,000 Speaker 1: that we have this history and that racism is not 507 00:34:57,160 --> 00:35:02,359 Speaker 1: only in this particular profession field. But the problem is 508 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:05,400 Speaker 1: they're able to use these guns. These people are not 509 00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:08,359 Speaker 1: you know, they're not trained social workers or mental health 510 00:35:08,360 --> 00:35:12,160 Speaker 1: care workers, and so they're coming into various situations and 511 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,839 Speaker 1: operating with the main tool that they know to use, 512 00:35:16,600 --> 00:35:20,840 Speaker 1: and that's forced and that's violence. And so we're seeing 513 00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:25,960 Speaker 1: the lethal impact of that. Hopeful it's exactly correct. The 514 00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:30,920 Speaker 1: other thing that makes it so damning is as an executive, 515 00:35:31,000 --> 00:35:34,080 Speaker 1: as a CEO, as a leader, as a pastor, when 516 00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:37,040 Speaker 1: you have masses of people, I'll re see thousands and 517 00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:40,040 Speaker 1: thousands of people. You're going to have people who go rogue. 518 00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:42,680 Speaker 1: You're gonna have people who have mental health issues. You're 519 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:45,799 Speaker 1: gonna have people who do things that are reprehensible. But 520 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:48,560 Speaker 1: if you don't judge that, if you don't, it's not 521 00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:51,120 Speaker 1: what happens, it's how you handle it. If you don't 522 00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:53,479 Speaker 1: handle it, If if you've got a d A that's 523 00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:56,840 Speaker 1: in the pocket with the police department, if if you've 524 00:35:57,160 --> 00:36:00,560 Speaker 1: got a plea bargaining deal going on with somebody who's broke, 525 00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,319 Speaker 1: that makes a plea bargaining deal that makes him locked 526 00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,360 Speaker 1: up for life. We've got people in jail waiting to 527 00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,880 Speaker 1: to to to even see a judge, sometimes a year, 528 00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:14,520 Speaker 1: two years through the misappropriation of the criminal justice system. 529 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:18,040 Speaker 1: We all know it's wrong. It's about partisan issue. It's 530 00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:20,040 Speaker 1: not like the Democrats are the only ones who are 531 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 1: saying it's wrong, where the Republicans are the only ones 532 00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:26,400 Speaker 1: who said. Both parties are admitting the criminal justice is flawed. 533 00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:29,080 Speaker 1: Even the President is admitting that the that the criminal 534 00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:33,920 Speaker 1: justice system is flawed. The problem is nobody wants to 535 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,239 Speaker 1: fix it. And it is a system. It's not just 536 00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:40,000 Speaker 1: a person, and it's not just the case. It is 537 00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:42,319 Speaker 1: a system. And I think that's what my sister is 538 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:46,480 Speaker 1: pointing to is this is what we mean by systemic racism. 539 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,680 Speaker 1: The fact that two men who previously had been involved 540 00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:56,200 Speaker 1: with the police department could shoot to death a black 541 00:36:56,239 --> 00:37:00,040 Speaker 1: boy who is jogging and go for months walking in 542 00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:04,160 Speaker 1: the street, whereas we can't take a cigar from a 543 00:37:04,239 --> 00:37:07,520 Speaker 1: cigar shop without being thrown down in the floor and 544 00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:12,160 Speaker 1: arrested immediately. This misappropriation of justice where you can go 545 00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:16,200 Speaker 1: in and murder people having a Bible class in a 546 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:20,080 Speaker 1: church service, and the police officers take you out to 547 00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,640 Speaker 1: get a sandwich at Burger King, not shove your face 548 00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:28,680 Speaker 1: down into a pavement, into your your mouthless bleeding. This 549 00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:32,560 Speaker 1: is not done in a fair and equitable way. And you, you, 550 00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:36,319 Speaker 1: I mean anybody, You could be blind and see the 551 00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:39,640 Speaker 1: difference and the distinctions between the two. But there is 552 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:44,200 Speaker 1: a comfortable blindness that comes with privilege, because when you 553 00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:47,680 Speaker 1: are a privileged person, you can choose the community you 554 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:51,720 Speaker 1: want to see. But when you are an underprivileged person, 555 00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:55,680 Speaker 1: you have to exist in two realities, the reality that 556 00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,759 Speaker 1: you're born into and the reality that you bank with, 557 00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:02,480 Speaker 1: the reality that you live in, and the reality of 558 00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:05,880 Speaker 1: the community you hope to climb into. And so you 559 00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:09,719 Speaker 1: can you cannot. You cannot be a black person with 560 00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:13,120 Speaker 1: the g e d and not understand white culture. But 561 00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:15,799 Speaker 1: you can be a white person with a PhD and 562 00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:21,040 Speaker 1: not understand Black culture. That's what a press. That's brilliant. 563 00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:24,760 Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm gonna quote you on that, Bishop Jakes, 564 00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:27,440 Speaker 1: because I think you're so right. But you know, I 565 00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:31,919 Speaker 1: wanted to ask you because you said Democrats know that 566 00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:36,480 Speaker 1: they're the system is broken. Republicans know the system is broken. 567 00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:40,760 Speaker 1: You said, even the President knows the system is broken 568 00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:46,800 Speaker 1: and needs to be fixed. So why isn't it being fixed? 569 00:38:47,280 --> 00:38:53,759 Speaker 1: What are the obstacles that keep impeding progress? That's a 570 00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:56,000 Speaker 1: great question. I wish I was smart enough to have 571 00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:58,760 Speaker 1: the answer to that one. I can say that there's 572 00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,560 Speaker 1: been some small rides beginning stress made on a federal 573 00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:07,080 Speaker 1: level as it relates to the criminal justice system. I 574 00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:11,440 Speaker 1: oversee the Texas Offenders Reentry Initiative, of which we've taken 575 00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:14,759 Speaker 1: almost forty thou people through our programs. So I live 576 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:17,439 Speaker 1: in this reality, and there has been some work done 577 00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:20,319 Speaker 1: on a federal level, it has not been enforced on 578 00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:24,080 Speaker 1: a state level, where the vast majority of African Americans 579 00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:28,040 Speaker 1: are incarcerated, seventy percent of which are incarcerated for non 580 00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:31,560 Speaker 1: valid crimes, many of which are incarcerated for laws that 581 00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:34,680 Speaker 1: have now changed and have now been legalized, but they're 582 00:39:34,719 --> 00:39:39,200 Speaker 1: still incarcerated. Uh, it's it's justice can be bought in 583 00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:42,759 Speaker 1: this country. It's not whether you're guilty or innocent. It's 584 00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:46,799 Speaker 1: it's the type of attorney and the investigation and all 585 00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:49,520 Speaker 1: of that. So if you don't have access to capital, 586 00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:52,759 Speaker 1: you don't have access to justice. And those All of 587 00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:55,000 Speaker 1: these things are problems that need to be fixing. It's 588 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,280 Speaker 1: a tangled way, and I'm not absolving us of all responsibility. 589 00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,240 Speaker 1: We need to be more engaged send the political process. 590 00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:04,080 Speaker 1: We need to be voting more in the mid term elections, 591 00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:07,160 Speaker 1: and we have a tendency to focus on the presidential 592 00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:09,279 Speaker 1: elections and not the mid terms where the d as 593 00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:11,759 Speaker 1: are chosen and the people who are making these kinds 594 00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:15,200 Speaker 1: of decisions and holding them accountable. We don't tend to 595 00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:19,800 Speaker 1: know who to hold accountable, and we need desperately white 596 00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:24,360 Speaker 1: people and brown people to hold them equally accountable. I 597 00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:26,719 Speaker 1: don't think there is a notion in our community that 598 00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:28,680 Speaker 1: in order to get a good lawyer has to be 599 00:40:28,719 --> 00:40:31,120 Speaker 1: black and in order to get something done you have 600 00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:33,960 Speaker 1: to be black. But I think America needs to dispel 601 00:40:34,080 --> 00:40:37,640 Speaker 1: that myth by white, black and brown all screaming out, 602 00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:40,040 Speaker 1: what is your agenda for the black community? How are 603 00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:43,960 Speaker 1: you handling the trials? Because historically we have rewarded das 604 00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:47,640 Speaker 1: based on how many people they locked up. So when 605 00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:50,680 Speaker 1: you start talking about cultures that are existing, the tougher 606 00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,320 Speaker 1: you are on crime, the more likely you are to 607 00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:56,759 Speaker 1: be elected. Instead of rewarding people for using a more 608 00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:01,799 Speaker 1: reason or balanced approach. One other quick footnote. If I 609 00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:04,800 Speaker 1: am White in America and I have a drug problem, 610 00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:07,879 Speaker 1: it's a sickness and I go to rehab. If I'm 611 00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:10,600 Speaker 1: Black in America and I have a drug problem, I'm 612 00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:14,560 Speaker 1: a criminal and I go to jail. It totally is 613 00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:16,759 Speaker 1: a matter of which side of the city you live in, 614 00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:24,120 Speaker 1: how it is perceived or handled. That's atrocious, that's utterly atrocious. 615 00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:27,480 Speaker 1: It can be the same drug. And on one side 616 00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:30,720 Speaker 1: of the street, I get mercy and compassion and oh, 617 00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:33,680 Speaker 1: our present thoughts are with you, and you're going into 618 00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:36,440 Speaker 1: a treatment center and all the curies that you have, 619 00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:38,720 Speaker 1: And the other one, oh my god, you're a criminal. 620 00:41:38,840 --> 00:41:41,640 Speaker 1: Dragon into jail and lock them away as long as possible. 621 00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:47,000 Speaker 1: Sevent for nonvalent crimes, incarcerated. So when our women are 622 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,480 Speaker 1: looking saying where are the men, I know exactly where 623 00:41:49,480 --> 00:41:51,720 Speaker 1: they are. They're locked up. When our children are asking 624 00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:54,400 Speaker 1: where are the fathers, a huge majority of them are 625 00:41:54,400 --> 00:41:57,600 Speaker 1: locked up for things that we don't do. We don't 626 00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:02,080 Speaker 1: commit crimes more readily more frequently than our white counterparts, 627 00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:05,360 Speaker 1: but we are seven times more likely to be incarcerated 628 00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:09,520 Speaker 1: when we commit the same crime. That's a real problem. 629 00:42:09,600 --> 00:42:13,120 Speaker 1: So when you try to get us to to trust, 630 00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:17,520 Speaker 1: it's hard to trust. Going back to Opal's point, the 631 00:42:17,640 --> 00:42:20,640 Speaker 1: same people who in forced slavery, the same people who 632 00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:23,960 Speaker 1: turned water hoses on us during Jim Crow and the 633 00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:27,520 Speaker 1: civil rights movement, the same people that pressed our next 634 00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,520 Speaker 1: into the ground. It's hard to feel safe. When you 635 00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:34,120 Speaker 1: see a police officer patrolling your community. You feel, oh 636 00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:36,879 Speaker 1: my god, thank god, they're watching out for me. I'm 637 00:42:36,960 --> 00:42:39,880 Speaker 1: good when we see blue lights flash behind us. I 638 00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:42,680 Speaker 1: don't care how much money we have, how many degrees 639 00:42:42,719 --> 00:42:46,080 Speaker 1: we have, or what university we matriculated from. There is 640 00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:52,200 Speaker 1: an anxiety that inherently comes upon us, both physically and ancestrally, 641 00:42:52,239 --> 00:42:57,800 Speaker 1: because we feel the threat that anything could happen. Wow, 642 00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:00,960 Speaker 1: that was that was just Oh, I don't I don't 643 00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:03,680 Speaker 1: even think I can continue to articulate because I'm feeling 644 00:43:04,239 --> 00:43:07,760 Speaker 1: very emotional and all the things that you're saying, um 645 00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:11,640 Speaker 1: and certainly even you know on social media, I've been 646 00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:15,279 Speaker 1: saying that I don't want the responsibility of fixing this, 647 00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:20,040 Speaker 1: you know anymore. I've been I've been so tired of 648 00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:24,120 Speaker 1: the question, and I do recognize what you're saying bishop about, 649 00:43:24,640 --> 00:43:28,759 Speaker 1: you know, participating in that. There are certain responsibilities that 650 00:43:29,120 --> 00:43:32,640 Speaker 1: black people have in order to make sure that the 651 00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:37,200 Speaker 1: oppression that we're feeling systematically does not continue. But it 652 00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:41,040 Speaker 1: is so tiring to continue to have to answer the question, 653 00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:43,319 Speaker 1: but what do I do? You know, how do I 654 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:46,640 Speaker 1: do it? From those who are not necessarily feeling this 655 00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:49,440 Speaker 1: every day and not fielding those questions every day, and 656 00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:52,880 Speaker 1: perhaps not even feeling the responsibility of having to answer 657 00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:55,440 Speaker 1: the question, but rather push it off on the people 658 00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:59,200 Speaker 1: who are being affected disproportionately by it. And I know 659 00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:01,600 Speaker 1: that opal they're of probably thoughts that you have around 660 00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:04,520 Speaker 1: that too, But I would love to also talk about, 661 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:09,320 Speaker 1: you know, what happens next. You know, in our conversations 662 00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:12,960 Speaker 1: around this issue, there are many I mean, Katie and 663 00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:16,280 Speaker 1: I have had so many conversations around what happens next 664 00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:19,120 Speaker 1: and what people can do, because we certainly understand the 665 00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:21,480 Speaker 1: fact that these are conversations that need to be had, 666 00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:25,719 Speaker 1: but they're difficult to have, you know, especially if you 667 00:44:25,760 --> 00:44:29,640 Speaker 1: are non black and you want to have a voice 668 00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:34,239 Speaker 1: in the conversation, perhaps you say things that will take 669 00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:38,600 Speaker 1: you out. You know, there's the danger of that, certainly 670 00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:41,080 Speaker 1: There have been many colleagues of mine over the past 671 00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:43,279 Speaker 1: few days who have asked, what can I do? What 672 00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:45,600 Speaker 1: can I say? I want to say something. I don't 673 00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:48,520 Speaker 1: just want to sit by, you know, as Katie was saying, 674 00:44:49,680 --> 00:44:52,399 Speaker 1: but but what what are the solutions? You know? How 675 00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:54,640 Speaker 1: do how how do we help? I guess as my 676 00:44:54,719 --> 00:44:59,040 Speaker 1: question um, because there are certainly people who want to 677 00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:02,080 Speaker 1: have a voice, who want to participate in the dialogue, 678 00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:06,560 Speaker 1: and who have good intentions, but will not do it 679 00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:10,200 Speaker 1: out of fear that they will also miss step. The 680 00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:13,880 Speaker 1: greatest justice is the will of the people themselves. And 681 00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:16,359 Speaker 1: I am not just talking about black people, and I'm 682 00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:18,760 Speaker 1: not just talking about black people in the midterm elections, 683 00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:21,319 Speaker 1: so I certainly think we need to be represented there. 684 00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:25,600 Speaker 1: This is not a black people's problem. This is an 685 00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:29,640 Speaker 1: American crisis. And we are standing right on the edge 686 00:45:30,040 --> 00:45:34,440 Speaker 1: of going back into visuals of bringing in the armies 687 00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:38,040 Speaker 1: and shooting down people in march and things that that 688 00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:41,280 Speaker 1: are so reprehensible they're scary, or on the other extreme 689 00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:45,120 Speaker 1: of burning down cities and town We're teetering with violence 690 00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:49,879 Speaker 1: against violence, wicked against wicked, evil against evil, and all 691 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:54,960 Speaker 1: we really want there's a cheaper, easier, calmer solution, the 692 00:45:55,080 --> 00:45:58,120 Speaker 1: easier thing than all of the expensive things that we're 693 00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:02,719 Speaker 1: getting ready to do to EA, to other It's just justice. 694 00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:07,480 Speaker 1: Justice is free. It would cost less, It would be 695 00:46:07,480 --> 00:46:09,879 Speaker 1: better for the budget. It would be the right thing 696 00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,080 Speaker 1: to do, to call right right and wrong wrong. Then 697 00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:16,920 Speaker 1: it would be to spend millions and billions of dollars 698 00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:20,280 Speaker 1: so that we can dramatize and exacerbate what is already 699 00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:24,160 Speaker 1: a horrific situation. And I am concerned right now because 700 00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:26,520 Speaker 1: I really don't know what tomorrow is going to bring. 701 00:46:26,560 --> 00:46:28,320 Speaker 1: I don't know when I wake up in the morning 702 00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:30,799 Speaker 1: what I'm gonna see on the screen. I don't know 703 00:46:30,840 --> 00:46:32,480 Speaker 1: whether it's going to be safe to come out of 704 00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,600 Speaker 1: my house. I don't know whether I need to call 705 00:46:34,719 --> 00:46:38,080 Speaker 1: all of my grown children back home and huddle together 706 00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:41,800 Speaker 1: for fear of our lives. I don't know. Because there's 707 00:46:41,960 --> 00:46:45,359 Speaker 1: such a feeling of powerlessness, I don't know what's going 708 00:46:45,400 --> 00:46:48,040 Speaker 1: to happen. To understand, the people who are concerned about 709 00:46:48,080 --> 00:46:51,040 Speaker 1: the burnings and and and and and the rioting and 710 00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:53,080 Speaker 1: the looting and all of that, and that needs to 711 00:46:53,120 --> 00:46:56,520 Speaker 1: be stopped. On the other hand, that if we keep 712 00:46:56,600 --> 00:47:00,640 Speaker 1: treating that which is a symptom rather than treating that 713 00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:04,920 Speaker 1: which caused the symptom. We're going to continue to treat 714 00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:08,879 Speaker 1: symptoms without cure. We have a cure for this. It's 715 00:47:09,040 --> 00:47:13,239 Speaker 1: just justice. It's just right. It's already been written, it's 716 00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:16,040 Speaker 1: just not being applied. We don't have to recreate it. 717 00:47:16,200 --> 00:47:18,120 Speaker 1: We just have to follow through on it in a 718 00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:25,239 Speaker 1: blind fashion, irrespective of race, colored, gender, or orientation. That's right. 719 00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:29,480 Speaker 1: That is absolutely right. And I'm I'm so happy to 720 00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:35,560 Speaker 1: hear you name that so plainly and so simply. Um. 721 00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:39,000 Speaker 1: Why we created Black Lives Matter in the first place 722 00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:43,440 Speaker 1: was in essence to demand justice. But like capital j 723 00:47:43,719 --> 00:47:48,520 Speaker 1: justice not just one person um has a case or 724 00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:53,080 Speaker 1: there's one indictment or one jury case or what. No, no, no, 725 00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:58,680 Speaker 1: no no. We need wholesale, systemic justice. We need a 726 00:47:58,719 --> 00:48:03,719 Speaker 1: transformation of our society and that requires embedding justice all 727 00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:08,560 Speaker 1: across the board, embedding equity all across the board. Um, 728 00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:13,400 Speaker 1: repairing the years and years of damage that's been caused. 729 00:48:14,200 --> 00:48:16,759 Speaker 1: You know, so much of what we're seeing even now, 730 00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:20,719 Speaker 1: and why the the process are so large and why 731 00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:25,520 Speaker 1: it's more of a rebellion is because people have been 732 00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:30,719 Speaker 1: living in destitution. People have been living and dealing with 733 00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:35,160 Speaker 1: so much hardship. The pandemic was really and the pandemic 734 00:48:35,200 --> 00:48:36,839 Speaker 1: is still going on. Let me just say it like that, 735 00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:43,000 Speaker 1: but it really symbolizes that the bottom has fallen out 736 00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:48,959 Speaker 1: for so many people. This country is not working for them. 737 00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:51,680 Speaker 1: The way that is currently set up is not working. 738 00:48:52,080 --> 00:48:55,280 Speaker 1: When you have within a month, month and a half, 739 00:48:55,640 --> 00:48:59,920 Speaker 1: thirty forty million people um calling and meeting on an 740 00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:04,680 Speaker 1: employment when you have people who are without healthcare overnight, 741 00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:08,880 Speaker 1: when you have entire you know, communities, and you have 742 00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:11,719 Speaker 1: tens and thousands of people needing to use the soup 743 00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:15,000 Speaker 1: kitchen with an amount of of a week losing their job. 744 00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:19,000 Speaker 1: You know, people are are struggling, and that means that 745 00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:24,040 Speaker 1: they were already living handsome mouth. I think this pandemic 746 00:49:24,160 --> 00:49:31,279 Speaker 1: has so exposed and laid bare such inequities that existed 747 00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:37,319 Speaker 1: that that coupled with situations like Ahmad are Very or 748 00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:44,239 Speaker 1: George Floyd, it just it almost just poured gasoline on 749 00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:50,360 Speaker 1: this simmering problem. And I think in some ways it 750 00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:56,960 Speaker 1: just it's undeniable, just as that video is undeniable about 751 00:49:57,000 --> 00:50:01,600 Speaker 1: what happened to this man at the police officer with 752 00:50:01,719 --> 00:50:05,400 Speaker 1: his hand in his pocket as this man is crying 753 00:50:05,520 --> 00:50:09,840 Speaker 1: for his life. There's just there's there's no way to 754 00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:13,560 Speaker 1: explain it except for to see it as it is. 755 00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:19,640 Speaker 1: And you know, when when you all talk about justice, 756 00:50:20,200 --> 00:50:23,799 Speaker 1: Bishop Jakeson and Opal and Bows, you know, I hear 757 00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:27,360 Speaker 1: this and I say yes, And as a white American, 758 00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:31,040 Speaker 1: I think, what can I do? What can I do? 759 00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:36,880 Speaker 1: Because I feel it's such an overwhelming problem, and you 760 00:50:36,920 --> 00:50:42,080 Speaker 1: think systemic racism, you have to change the systems. How 761 00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:45,080 Speaker 1: in the world do we go about doing that? How 762 00:50:45,360 --> 00:50:49,759 Speaker 1: can I be not just an ally but joined forces 763 00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:53,279 Speaker 1: with you and for other people listening who do have 764 00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:58,040 Speaker 1: different life experiences than you do. How can how can 765 00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:01,960 Speaker 1: we be there? And I know disposes what you don't want, 766 00:51:02,600 --> 00:51:06,399 Speaker 1: but I need guidance, I need help, and I need 767 00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:10,160 Speaker 1: your wisdom that I don't think that you have to 768 00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:14,439 Speaker 1: be a woman to speak up against rape. I don't 769 00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:16,160 Speaker 1: think you have to be a child to speak up 770 00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:18,920 Speaker 1: against child abuse. And I don't think you have to 771 00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:22,560 Speaker 1: be black to speak up against racism. And I think 772 00:51:22,600 --> 00:51:27,040 Speaker 1: we need your voice, we need your vote, we need 773 00:51:27,080 --> 00:51:30,800 Speaker 1: your outrage. That one of the things that has blessed 774 00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:34,600 Speaker 1: my soul was to see somebody angry that didn't look 775 00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:40,120 Speaker 1: like me. I cannot tell you how therapeutic sometimes two tears. 776 00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:44,680 Speaker 1: To see the moments in this process where police officers 777 00:51:44,680 --> 00:51:47,760 Speaker 1: have taken off their guns and joined in the march. 778 00:51:48,280 --> 00:51:51,040 Speaker 1: To see the moments in this process where lines of 779 00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:53,960 Speaker 1: white people have stood in between the police and the 780 00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:57,759 Speaker 1: black marchers are just glimmers of hope. Where you want 781 00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:00,920 Speaker 1: to say black lives matter, That's how you show black 782 00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:04,000 Speaker 1: lives matter by joining in and lifting your voice. You 783 00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:06,960 Speaker 1: don't the notion that you have to have the same 784 00:52:07,000 --> 00:52:10,280 Speaker 1: experience in order to have the same outrageous not true. 785 00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:13,120 Speaker 1: You do not have to have the same experience to 786 00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:16,080 Speaker 1: speak up when a child as abused. We have laws 787 00:52:16,120 --> 00:52:19,720 Speaker 1: in place that are clear and detailed about what happens 788 00:52:19,760 --> 00:52:22,719 Speaker 1: when a child even mentions that they're being abused in 789 00:52:22,760 --> 00:52:25,759 Speaker 1: this country, and child protective services and this and that, 790 00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:28,960 Speaker 1: and we all know exactly what you do immediately. And 791 00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:31,719 Speaker 1: I don't want you to feel a foreigner from this 792 00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:34,920 Speaker 1: pain any longer. I want you to come and sup 793 00:52:34,960 --> 00:52:37,880 Speaker 1: and sit down at the table and and feel the 794 00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:41,239 Speaker 1: pain and join in it. I regardless to whether that 795 00:52:41,400 --> 00:52:44,040 Speaker 1: is your background or not like I sat with you 796 00:52:44,400 --> 00:52:47,120 Speaker 1: when when women were being abused in the workplace, like 797 00:52:47,200 --> 00:52:50,040 Speaker 1: I sat with children who were being molested in the home. 798 00:52:50,400 --> 00:52:54,279 Speaker 1: I don't want the wall to be built around the 799 00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:57,719 Speaker 1: color of our skin. I wanted to be around the 800 00:52:57,760 --> 00:53:02,880 Speaker 1: ideology for which we want our country to represent. We have, 801 00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:07,640 Speaker 1: at this present moment, a decision to make as it 802 00:53:07,719 --> 00:53:12,120 Speaker 1: relates to what does it mean to be an American? 803 00:53:13,239 --> 00:53:16,600 Speaker 1: And if it is going to be inclusive, then we 804 00:53:16,600 --> 00:53:18,680 Speaker 1: we live up to the red, white, and blue. And 805 00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:21,880 Speaker 1: if it's not, let's just make the flag one color 806 00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:24,680 Speaker 1: and take all of the different colors out of it. 807 00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:27,520 Speaker 1: We have a decision to make it this moment, and 808 00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:29,879 Speaker 1: I'm sixty some years old. It doesn't make a whole 809 00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:33,560 Speaker 1: lot of difference for me, but for my grandchildren, for 810 00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:36,560 Speaker 1: my little grandchildren who are driving me crazy and leaving 811 00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:38,960 Speaker 1: toys all over the place that I step on in 812 00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:41,120 Speaker 1: the middle of the night. I would like to go 813 00:53:41,200 --> 00:53:43,760 Speaker 1: to sleep one day and lay down in my grave 814 00:53:43,880 --> 00:53:46,480 Speaker 1: knowing that I left this world better than I found it. 815 00:53:46,480 --> 00:53:48,200 Speaker 1: And I don't think you have to be black to 816 00:53:48,239 --> 00:53:50,640 Speaker 1: feel that way. I don't think you have to live 817 00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:54,400 Speaker 1: in South Chicago to feel that Way or Watts or Harlem. 818 00:53:54,880 --> 00:53:58,080 Speaker 1: You just have to We aren't asking white people to 819 00:53:58,160 --> 00:54:01,680 Speaker 1: be black. We are as king Americans to be human. 820 00:54:02,680 --> 00:54:05,319 Speaker 1: And I think that's something within our grasp that we 821 00:54:05,400 --> 00:54:08,120 Speaker 1: all can do. And use your voice and your connections 822 00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:11,520 Speaker 1: and your associations and your connections with the CEOs and 823 00:54:11,560 --> 00:54:15,320 Speaker 1: go to your country club and demand better and demand 824 00:54:15,440 --> 00:54:19,359 Speaker 1: better of your elected officials, not because you're black, not 825 00:54:19,480 --> 00:54:23,960 Speaker 1: because you understand blackness, but because you are a human. Yeah, 826 00:54:24,160 --> 00:54:27,959 Speaker 1: let me pick up on the conficients point because I'm 827 00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:33,520 Speaker 1: so moved by this, like, demand better, and we need 828 00:54:33,560 --> 00:54:36,440 Speaker 1: to demand better, and we do need all hands on 829 00:54:36,560 --> 00:54:41,680 Speaker 1: deck right now. Um, this is clearly bigger than any 830 00:54:41,719 --> 00:54:46,160 Speaker 1: one of us. Uh. We have a movement that is vibrant, 831 00:54:46,760 --> 00:54:49,680 Speaker 1: it is very leaderful. So you'll see people from you know, 832 00:54:49,680 --> 00:54:52,960 Speaker 1: all walks of life, all identities and tenders and so on, 833 00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:55,799 Speaker 1: all walks of life all over. So we are a 834 00:54:55,920 --> 00:54:59,759 Speaker 1: very leaderful movement. But what we're calling for and what 835 00:55:00,160 --> 00:55:04,479 Speaker 1: better looks like for us, is stop the harm. First 836 00:55:04,480 --> 00:55:07,359 Speaker 1: of all, stop the harm, right. We need to be 837 00:55:07,520 --> 00:55:13,440 Speaker 1: demanding that. That's basic, basic, basic minimum, and then we 838 00:55:13,520 --> 00:55:17,040 Speaker 1: need a repair of the damage. Right. So it's not 839 00:55:17,120 --> 00:55:19,799 Speaker 1: just enough to say, Okay, where the law enforcement is, 840 00:55:20,080 --> 00:55:22,520 Speaker 1: you know, stop doing this, stop doing that. No, there 841 00:55:22,520 --> 00:55:25,200 Speaker 1: have been families who have lost loved ones, There are 842 00:55:25,200 --> 00:55:28,080 Speaker 1: people who are wrongfully locked up, There are there are 843 00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:33,480 Speaker 1: families that have been torn apart for decades, and we're 844 00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:37,120 Speaker 1: tired of it. And to repair the damage and the 845 00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:39,959 Speaker 1: pain and the hurt is the only way to make 846 00:55:40,040 --> 00:55:44,080 Speaker 1: things quote unquote better. That is justice, not just to 847 00:55:44,200 --> 00:55:47,280 Speaker 1: stop the violence. But no, okay, you've you've harmed somebody, 848 00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:49,680 Speaker 1: So what is the compensation? How do you repair it? 849 00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:52,719 Speaker 1: How do we make sure the neighborhood is rebuilt? Those 850 00:55:52,719 --> 00:55:54,799 Speaker 1: are the kinds of conversations I believe that we need 851 00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:59,920 Speaker 1: to be having because real safety for our communities is 852 00:56:00,120 --> 00:56:03,800 Speaker 1: the ability for people to to live, the the ability 853 00:56:03,840 --> 00:56:06,879 Speaker 1: for people to love the people, the ability for people 854 00:56:06,920 --> 00:56:08,839 Speaker 1: to be able to work and go to and fro 855 00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:13,040 Speaker 1: without fear of violence and fear for their lives. I 856 00:56:13,120 --> 00:56:16,279 Speaker 1: just want to say this one little point. Marching in 857 00:56:16,320 --> 00:56:21,640 Speaker 1: the streets and and and exercising our Amendment rights to 858 00:56:21,680 --> 00:56:23,879 Speaker 1: be able to speak up and to to to lift 859 00:56:23,920 --> 00:56:27,759 Speaker 1: our voice is important and it draws attention, but everybody 860 00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:30,160 Speaker 1: on here knows that real decisions are not made on 861 00:56:30,239 --> 00:56:33,600 Speaker 1: sidewalks in the street. They are made in boardrooms, in 862 00:56:33,719 --> 00:56:36,719 Speaker 1: business rooms, behind the scenes where a lot of our 863 00:56:36,880 --> 00:56:40,240 Speaker 1: voices don't get to be heard. And so to those 864 00:56:40,320 --> 00:56:44,839 Speaker 1: influential people white, black or brown who make it into 865 00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:49,680 Speaker 1: the room where decisions are made. Because decisions are not 866 00:56:49,840 --> 00:56:54,440 Speaker 1: made in marches, attention is drown in a march. And 867 00:56:54,600 --> 00:56:57,319 Speaker 1: what happens is we've seen a lot of marches. We've 868 00:56:57,320 --> 00:56:59,960 Speaker 1: seen the women march right after the election, We've seen 869 00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:02,880 Speaker 1: the Latinos march, We've seen black people march. Now we're 870 00:57:02,880 --> 00:57:05,640 Speaker 1: saying to everybody, march and it draws attention and it 871 00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:08,560 Speaker 1: gets pressed, and that's good. But if it doesn't go 872 00:57:08,719 --> 00:57:13,600 Speaker 1: beyond the public display of volumeless activity and headlines and 873 00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:17,440 Speaker 1: ratings and pay skills that are based on ratings, down 874 00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:21,360 Speaker 1: to the boardrooms and the country clubs where real decisions 875 00:57:21,400 --> 00:57:25,040 Speaker 1: are made, that's where we need a revolution. Thank god 876 00:57:25,080 --> 00:57:27,440 Speaker 1: for what you're doing on the street, but where we 877 00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:31,040 Speaker 1: really need a revolution is in the room where it happens. 878 00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:35,480 Speaker 1: And most of the time we don't get in that room. 879 00:57:35,560 --> 00:57:40,040 Speaker 1: It's easy to do something wrong when you try to 880 00:57:40,080 --> 00:57:44,600 Speaker 1: do it for us without us. You cannot do it 881 00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:48,360 Speaker 1: for us without us. That means that we can't have 882 00:57:48,560 --> 00:57:52,240 Speaker 1: men making decisions about women, and women are not sitting 883 00:57:52,280 --> 00:57:54,920 Speaker 1: at the table, and you can't have white people making 884 00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:57,960 Speaker 1: decisions about what you think are to happen in black 885 00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:01,000 Speaker 1: communities if you don't bring in black thought leaders and 886 00:58:01,080 --> 00:58:04,560 Speaker 1: bring us around the table. And there are plenty of them. 887 00:58:04,600 --> 00:58:09,200 Speaker 1: It's not like we don't have smart, bright, black influential 888 00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:13,080 Speaker 1: people who can really address this. It's just that they 889 00:58:13,080 --> 00:58:17,800 Speaker 1: are never invited into the room because we want we 890 00:58:17,840 --> 00:58:20,760 Speaker 1: want calm more than we want right, and we're not 891 00:58:20,880 --> 00:58:25,360 Speaker 1: willing to be uncomfortable and we're not willing to have disruption. 892 00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:28,240 Speaker 1: But any CEO will tell you that if a company 893 00:58:28,320 --> 00:58:32,920 Speaker 1: never has disruption, it never grows. And so the challenge 894 00:58:32,960 --> 00:58:36,320 Speaker 1: today is to stop saying that there there are no 895 00:58:36,480 --> 00:58:40,040 Speaker 1: black leaders. They are absolutely They're graduating every day with 896 00:58:40,160 --> 00:58:44,040 Speaker 1: doctorate degrees who are articulate and intelligent and well spoken, 897 00:58:44,040 --> 00:58:46,560 Speaker 1: who can speak to issues, and there's influence, and then 898 00:58:46,560 --> 00:58:49,800 Speaker 1: there's influence that they're not the same thing. Let's stop 899 00:58:49,880 --> 00:58:52,120 Speaker 1: just calling on people because they have a lot of 900 00:58:52,160 --> 00:58:57,200 Speaker 1: followers and start getting thought leaders in who have a 901 00:58:57,200 --> 00:59:02,440 Speaker 1: a a sere yeah, a strategy. I was find the 902 00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:07,000 Speaker 1: word a strategy for the struggle, and they are here 903 00:59:07,160 --> 00:59:10,120 Speaker 1: and they are waiting to be ushered into the room. 904 00:59:10,280 --> 00:59:12,959 Speaker 1: The baton needs to pass. I'm not saying that black 905 00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:15,480 Speaker 1: list matters is over, but it needs to pass because 906 00:59:15,560 --> 00:59:19,520 Speaker 1: even black people only think you're doing something if you're 907 00:59:19,520 --> 00:59:24,240 Speaker 1: holding up a sign. But real power is behind closed doors. 908 00:59:24,600 --> 00:59:27,960 Speaker 1: And we need both things going on, not one or 909 00:59:27,960 --> 00:59:30,960 Speaker 1: the other. We need both things going on, the public 910 00:59:31,040 --> 00:59:34,880 Speaker 1: display and the private discussion, and that will bring about 911 00:59:34,880 --> 00:59:38,840 Speaker 1: a change when we come back. Bishop Jake's and Opal 912 00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:43,240 Speaker 1: to Matty and Bozma St. John on the fierce urgency 913 00:59:43,520 --> 00:59:53,280 Speaker 1: of now still living in and manually taking notes. 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That time you got home from 924 01:00:26,120 --> 01:00:30,440 Speaker 1: a week of double shifts and your dog didn't recognize you. 925 01:00:30,760 --> 01:00:32,880 Speaker 1: Let's go. He hates me, hates me? Do you want 926 01:00:32,880 --> 01:00:35,760 Speaker 1: to treat? You want to treat? You knew it was 927 01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:40,600 Speaker 1: time for something new. Let's drop it up at career builder. 928 01:00:41,000 --> 01:00:43,360 Speaker 1: You can find jobs with the work life balance and 929 01:00:43,400 --> 01:00:46,640 Speaker 1: salary you want, plus, build a resume and apply to 930 01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:50,080 Speaker 1: multiple jobs in just one click. Start your search at 931 01:00:50,120 --> 01:00:57,480 Speaker 1: career builder dot com. Now back to our conversation with Obel, 932 01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:01,080 Speaker 1: to Madi and Bishop Jake's who share their glimmers of 933 01:01:01,160 --> 01:01:05,160 Speaker 1: hope for the future. I am encouraged that we are 934 01:01:05,200 --> 01:01:08,919 Speaker 1: talking like we have for for a long time, been 935 01:01:08,960 --> 01:01:12,240 Speaker 1: like a bad marriage where nobody said anything and as 936 01:01:12,240 --> 01:01:16,080 Speaker 1: long as the house was quiet, at least we weren't fighting. Uh. 937 01:01:16,360 --> 01:01:19,120 Speaker 1: In spite of the disruption of the conversation, I think 938 01:01:19,120 --> 01:01:22,439 Speaker 1: this is very healthy. Even if you say the wrong thing, 939 01:01:22,480 --> 01:01:27,480 Speaker 1: and even if you get uh, Jack did the conversation 940 01:01:27,600 --> 01:01:30,920 Speaker 1: so to speak, uh, to let your voice be heard. 941 01:01:31,000 --> 01:01:35,240 Speaker 1: America is trying to heal itself, less to destroy itself. 942 01:01:35,440 --> 01:01:38,120 Speaker 1: So I'm encouraged that we're having a conversation. It is 943 01:01:38,200 --> 01:01:41,600 Speaker 1: far healthier to have a debate even if we don't 944 01:01:41,680 --> 01:01:45,080 Speaker 1: agree than it is for us to have political correctness 945 01:01:45,400 --> 01:01:49,560 Speaker 1: and be silent about suffering. Secondly, I am encouraged by 946 01:01:49,600 --> 01:01:52,960 Speaker 1: the fact that both parties are starting to think that 947 01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:55,960 Speaker 1: the black vote is within their reach. I think it 948 01:01:56,120 --> 01:01:59,720 Speaker 1: is bad when we when we sell ourselves completely out 949 01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:03,680 Speaker 1: to a party and not a policy, and hold both 950 01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:08,880 Speaker 1: sides accountable to policies, not parties, but policies that benefit 951 01:02:08,920 --> 01:02:13,240 Speaker 1: our communities in a way that spawns creativity on both sides. 952 01:02:13,280 --> 01:02:16,600 Speaker 1: To compete for this volume of votes that we have 953 01:02:16,840 --> 01:02:19,080 Speaker 1: and then get out there and vote to make a change. 954 01:02:19,160 --> 01:02:22,320 Speaker 1: I'm encouraged by that. I'm encouraged by some of the 955 01:02:22,400 --> 01:02:25,520 Speaker 1: things that I have seen happening in terms of government 956 01:02:25,520 --> 01:02:29,560 Speaker 1: trying to find itself and fix itself. It's not there yet, 957 01:02:29,840 --> 01:02:34,560 Speaker 1: but the conversations are emerging between Democrats and Republicans. Some 958 01:02:34,640 --> 01:02:37,880 Speaker 1: of the most important fields have passed because they joined 959 01:02:37,880 --> 01:02:40,840 Speaker 1: together and stopped fighting for a few days and decided 960 01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:43,640 Speaker 1: to make some decisions. All of those things are really 961 01:02:43,760 --> 01:02:46,760 Speaker 1: encouraging to me that we can get through this, and 962 01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:50,520 Speaker 1: if we do it now, the fierce urgency of now 963 01:02:51,120 --> 01:02:53,560 Speaker 1: has never been more appropriate to be said than at 964 01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:57,640 Speaker 1: this moment, because we stand we're dealing with a pandemic 965 01:02:58,040 --> 01:03:02,280 Speaker 1: and economic collapse and a sociological collapse all at the 966 01:03:02,360 --> 01:03:07,160 Speaker 1: same time, and we cannot wait to fix this months 967 01:03:07,240 --> 01:03:10,720 Speaker 1: and months away. Our economy won't do it, the pandemic 968 01:03:10,760 --> 01:03:14,320 Speaker 1: won't do it, and the sociological construct of our community 969 01:03:14,680 --> 01:03:19,040 Speaker 1: demands that we fix it now and that needs to 970 01:03:19,120 --> 01:03:26,840 Speaker 1: happen right early. Wow. Ohful hard act to follow, although 971 01:03:26,920 --> 01:03:33,800 Speaker 1: something tells me you'll do it. To be honest, you know, 972 01:03:33,880 --> 01:03:37,480 Speaker 1: what makes me hopeful is that we are actually having 973 01:03:38,160 --> 01:03:41,960 Speaker 1: this discussion, that we are in the midst of this challenge, 974 01:03:42,040 --> 01:03:45,680 Speaker 1: that we see that there is an obstacle, and within 975 01:03:45,720 --> 01:03:48,960 Speaker 1: that obstacle, I believe there's an opportunity. M We have 976 01:03:49,000 --> 01:03:56,760 Speaker 1: an opportunity to really address generations upon generations of injustice. 977 01:03:57,440 --> 01:04:01,560 Speaker 1: We have an opportunity right now to defy uh the 978 01:04:01,640 --> 01:04:05,760 Speaker 1: skills of justice. And I think what we're seeing is 979 01:04:05,800 --> 01:04:08,439 Speaker 1: that there are people who have said, enough is enough. 980 01:04:09,160 --> 01:04:12,439 Speaker 1: Let's have that conversation right now. We're demanding it take 981 01:04:12,480 --> 01:04:17,200 Speaker 1: place because for too long, our lives were lived as 982 01:04:17,200 --> 01:04:20,640 Speaker 1: though we were we were a secret right we were 983 01:04:20,680 --> 01:04:23,960 Speaker 1: living in the shadows of injustice, having to tolerate the 984 01:04:24,040 --> 01:04:28,880 Speaker 1: injustice um time and time again. And so folks forced 985 01:04:28,920 --> 01:04:32,960 Speaker 1: the conversation. They've forced not only the conversation, but they're 986 01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:37,200 Speaker 1: forcing a course of action to take place. I think 987 01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:39,680 Speaker 1: the reason that we do see the corporations, the reasons 988 01:04:39,720 --> 01:04:42,520 Speaker 1: we do see elected officials and other people engaging in 989 01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:45,840 Speaker 1: these discussions right now, is because people said, you know, 990 01:04:46,000 --> 01:04:48,520 Speaker 1: enough is enough. We're fed up, and we need to 991 01:04:48,560 --> 01:04:54,400 Speaker 1: have this discussion now because my life matters, and pandemic 992 01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:58,480 Speaker 1: or not, people were already living on the brink. And 993 01:04:58,520 --> 01:05:02,440 Speaker 1: then you see the ways in when the pandemic also 994 01:05:03,080 --> 01:05:06,320 Speaker 1: demonstrates how racism is playing out in our society. When 995 01:05:06,320 --> 01:05:09,680 Speaker 1: you have one third of the pen the people who've 996 01:05:09,760 --> 01:05:14,160 Speaker 1: died of COVID DITEAM are African Americans, it just tells 997 01:05:14,160 --> 01:05:18,760 Speaker 1: you that we've already been living with such dire concerns 998 01:05:18,920 --> 01:05:22,200 Speaker 1: and dire needs. And it's not just black people, it's 999 01:05:22,320 --> 01:05:25,320 Speaker 1: people of all hues. And so what I see now 1000 01:05:25,440 --> 01:05:28,880 Speaker 1: is as my moment of hope, is that I think 1001 01:05:29,080 --> 01:05:33,800 Speaker 1: the obstacle itself shows us the way it shows us 1002 01:05:33,840 --> 01:05:36,280 Speaker 1: that we have these various entry points to deal with 1003 01:05:36,640 --> 01:05:39,200 Speaker 1: the injustice. You know, we see people who aren't able 1004 01:05:39,240 --> 01:05:42,720 Speaker 1: to pay their rent or their mortgages. Okay, moratorium, let's 1005 01:05:42,760 --> 01:05:45,960 Speaker 1: call for the moratorium. We see people who don't have 1006 01:05:46,040 --> 01:05:49,280 Speaker 1: money for their food and day to day expects. Okay, 1007 01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:52,560 Speaker 1: let's have this discussion and a plan of action around 1008 01:05:52,600 --> 01:05:56,360 Speaker 1: a universal basic income. Let's have these real, frank and 1009 01:05:56,440 --> 01:05:59,960 Speaker 1: honest conversations about what it's going to take to keep 1010 01:06:00,120 --> 01:06:03,000 Speaker 1: people safe and living in their homes and with their 1011 01:06:03,040 --> 01:06:07,480 Speaker 1: families together and without the violence that we're experiencing as 1012 01:06:07,520 --> 01:06:09,480 Speaker 1: we walk down the street or re engage in every 1013 01:06:09,560 --> 01:06:14,080 Speaker 1: day forms of life. So I think that the fact 1014 01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:16,760 Speaker 1: that we're in this and that we're in this moment 1015 01:06:17,000 --> 01:06:19,680 Speaker 1: where there are massive rallies and protests and so on, 1016 01:06:20,600 --> 01:06:24,000 Speaker 1: is actually an opportunity for us to look ourselves, you know, 1017 01:06:24,080 --> 01:06:28,120 Speaker 1: in the eyes for the nation and are elected officials 1018 01:06:28,160 --> 01:06:31,000 Speaker 1: to hold up a mirror and say, what can I 1019 01:06:31,040 --> 01:06:36,880 Speaker 1: actually do? How can I make a just solution right now? 1020 01:06:37,240 --> 01:06:40,680 Speaker 1: How can I partner with local community groups and community 1021 01:06:40,680 --> 01:06:44,600 Speaker 1: members who have actually been devising plans around these injustices 1022 01:06:44,840 --> 01:06:48,200 Speaker 1: for many, many years. So many people have already done 1023 01:06:48,200 --> 01:06:50,560 Speaker 1: all the reports, They know the numbers, they know exactly 1024 01:06:50,600 --> 01:06:54,480 Speaker 1: what kinds of checks and balances are needed for accountability 1025 01:06:54,520 --> 01:06:58,200 Speaker 1: to take place. And then everyday people also have an opportunity, 1026 01:06:58,280 --> 01:07:01,640 Speaker 1: so our allies who really should be co conspirators for 1027 01:07:01,760 --> 01:07:06,040 Speaker 1: justice alongside us, They have opportunities to donate, to have 1028 01:07:06,160 --> 01:07:10,440 Speaker 1: courageous conversations with their family members, to understand what the 1029 01:07:10,560 --> 01:07:14,160 Speaker 1: power and the privilege they have within their jobs, and 1030 01:07:14,200 --> 01:07:18,720 Speaker 1: to make demands of change within the spaces that they occupy. 1031 01:07:19,000 --> 01:07:22,840 Speaker 1: I think everybody has an opportunity to use their power 1032 01:07:22,960 --> 01:07:25,640 Speaker 1: and their privilege, and not even just an opportunity, but 1033 01:07:25,680 --> 01:07:28,800 Speaker 1: an obligation. At this point, when you see this level 1034 01:07:28,800 --> 01:07:32,560 Speaker 1: of injustice taking place, there becomes a point where it's 1035 01:07:32,560 --> 01:07:34,080 Speaker 1: like no, no, no, you don't have a you have 1036 01:07:34,200 --> 01:07:37,520 Speaker 1: you don't have a choice now you the only choice 1037 01:07:37,560 --> 01:07:40,640 Speaker 1: you really have is to be a part of justice 1038 01:07:41,280 --> 01:07:45,720 Speaker 1: or know that you're impeding justice. And what I'm hoping 1039 01:07:45,800 --> 01:07:48,320 Speaker 1: is that people will want to know that they are 1040 01:07:48,360 --> 01:07:51,640 Speaker 1: found on the right side of history and that they'll 1041 01:07:51,680 --> 01:07:58,600 Speaker 1: be with us in this pursuit for justice. Amen. Amen, Amen, 1042 01:07:58,680 --> 01:08:02,760 Speaker 1: and amen, Thank you both. You know this was such 1043 01:08:02,760 --> 01:08:07,960 Speaker 1: a such a moving and important conversation and I'm so 1044 01:08:08,040 --> 01:08:11,520 Speaker 1: grateful to just be on the receiving end, and I 1045 01:08:11,560 --> 01:08:13,800 Speaker 1: just want to jump to what Bows was saying about 1046 01:08:13,880 --> 01:08:18,240 Speaker 1: people feeling nervous about being part of the conversation, and 1047 01:08:19,680 --> 01:08:23,680 Speaker 1: to that end, I realized that sometimes words can be 1048 01:08:23,760 --> 01:08:27,280 Speaker 1: insensitive and triggering. And I had a situation not too 1049 01:08:27,320 --> 01:08:30,160 Speaker 1: long ago when I was discussing an interview I had 1050 01:08:30,200 --> 01:08:35,760 Speaker 1: done with Denzel Washington, who I said, I deeply admired 1051 01:08:36,160 --> 01:08:40,439 Speaker 1: and but he um We had an awkward, kind of 1052 01:08:40,520 --> 01:08:44,559 Speaker 1: uncomfortable interview, and I mentioned how I felt a little. 1053 01:08:44,840 --> 01:08:49,439 Speaker 1: I felt a little shaken by that interview, and I 1054 01:08:49,560 --> 01:08:55,040 Speaker 1: understand that the way I used language was, as I said, 1055 01:08:55,080 --> 01:08:58,240 Speaker 1: triggering for some people. That received was received in a 1056 01:08:58,280 --> 01:09:03,479 Speaker 1: way that I did not intend to to sound. And 1057 01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:07,640 Speaker 1: I'm curious for your perspective on the importance of language 1058 01:09:07,760 --> 01:09:13,519 Speaker 1: as we navigate this trauma that people have endured, and 1059 01:09:13,680 --> 01:09:19,880 Speaker 1: to be respectful of that, but also forgiving for people 1060 01:09:20,360 --> 01:09:28,919 Speaker 1: who are unintentionally hurtful. I think it all begins with 1061 01:09:28,920 --> 01:09:34,479 Speaker 1: with mutual respect and real relationships. Relationships that are only 1062 01:09:34,560 --> 01:09:40,320 Speaker 1: done in public are always a deficient. You can't use 1063 01:09:40,600 --> 01:09:43,400 Speaker 1: a black or white or brown person as a prop. 1064 01:09:44,120 --> 01:09:46,920 Speaker 1: You have to have real relationships and eat with us 1065 01:09:47,000 --> 01:09:49,200 Speaker 1: and talk with us, and eat with you and laugh 1066 01:09:49,240 --> 01:09:51,920 Speaker 1: and talk with you. We have a saying in the church, 1067 01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:56,439 Speaker 1: the Kingdom of God advances amongst friends, And I think 1068 01:09:56,520 --> 01:10:01,640 Speaker 1: that's where the conversations begins, when you actually befriend somebody 1069 01:10:01,920 --> 01:10:06,240 Speaker 1: who's perspective or racial hue is different from yours, because 1070 01:10:06,280 --> 01:10:11,360 Speaker 1: friends are forgiving and friends are confrontational, and and friends 1071 01:10:11,400 --> 01:10:15,280 Speaker 1: will kind of prep you for the larger conversations with 1072 01:10:15,360 --> 01:10:19,120 Speaker 1: people who don't get you, because friends understand your heart 1073 01:10:19,200 --> 01:10:25,320 Speaker 1: even when your mouth goes self and a beautiful way 1074 01:10:25,360 --> 01:10:29,080 Speaker 1: to put it, you know. I think if there's one 1075 01:10:29,120 --> 01:10:32,760 Speaker 1: takeaway that I would challenge everybody that's listening at us 1076 01:10:32,800 --> 01:10:37,879 Speaker 1: today is to go beyond being polite and actually develop 1077 01:10:37,960 --> 01:10:41,040 Speaker 1: a friendship with somebody that's different from you and go 1078 01:10:41,240 --> 01:10:44,640 Speaker 1: eat and have lunch and talk and laugh and play 1079 01:10:44,920 --> 01:10:49,360 Speaker 1: and take the risk of being reprimanded because your friendship 1080 01:10:49,400 --> 01:10:53,560 Speaker 1: should be strong enough to handle it, and then go mainstream. 1081 01:10:53,840 --> 01:10:57,280 Speaker 1: Don't hide behind Twitter and say things that that and 1082 01:10:57,520 --> 01:11:03,919 Speaker 1: become a bully. Take the risk. The Kingdom advances amongst friends, 1083 01:11:04,600 --> 01:11:10,880 Speaker 1: and we are we are family on this planet. COVID 1084 01:11:11,080 --> 01:11:16,080 Speaker 1: nineteen teaches us that we are family, The whole family 1085 01:11:16,200 --> 01:11:21,000 Speaker 1: got infected, the whole world got shut down. Nine eleven 1086 01:11:21,040 --> 01:11:28,200 Speaker 1: taught us what Americans were, black, Republican, white, Muslims, Jews, gay, straight. 1087 01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:34,160 Speaker 1: Everybody died together, burned up together. Let's stop allowing our 1088 01:11:34,280 --> 01:11:38,439 Speaker 1: enemies to be smarter than us. If our enemies know 1089 01:11:38,560 --> 01:11:41,599 Speaker 1: we are one, then we should know we are one. 1090 01:11:42,040 --> 01:11:47,080 Speaker 1: And let's broach the conversation by building a relationship strong 1091 01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:54,360 Speaker 1: enough to accommodate a mistake. I love all of that, 1092 01:11:55,000 --> 01:11:59,120 Speaker 1: and I love that question that you asked. Um. I'll 1093 01:11:59,160 --> 01:12:06,599 Speaker 1: say this that words do matter, right, um. And obviously 1094 01:12:06,640 --> 01:12:09,679 Speaker 1: I know that from personal experience, knowing that these three 1095 01:12:09,760 --> 01:12:14,040 Speaker 1: simple words that we put out into the world made 1096 01:12:14,120 --> 01:12:20,120 Speaker 1: such um impact and resonated so deeply with people from 1097 01:12:20,120 --> 01:12:22,920 Speaker 1: all walks of life around the world. And so we 1098 01:12:23,000 --> 01:12:26,920 Speaker 1: know that words have meaning. And you know, I'm here 1099 01:12:26,920 --> 01:12:28,519 Speaker 1: with the bishop, and so I want to get a 1100 01:12:28,560 --> 01:12:33,200 Speaker 1: little bit into my my own, my own faith. My 1101 01:12:33,280 --> 01:12:36,120 Speaker 1: dad's a pastor, and I grew up around a lot 1102 01:12:36,120 --> 01:12:38,800 Speaker 1: of ministers, and I can't help but think of the 1103 01:12:39,120 --> 01:12:43,640 Speaker 1: Scripture when they say that that life and death is 1104 01:12:43,640 --> 01:12:47,000 Speaker 1: in the tongue, right, So there's a lot of power 1105 01:12:48,040 --> 01:12:52,760 Speaker 1: in our words, and we have to be mindful of 1106 01:12:52,840 --> 01:12:55,600 Speaker 1: what we are sharing, what we're saying. We have to 1107 01:12:55,600 --> 01:12:58,880 Speaker 1: be not mindful to name when there's an injustice going 1108 01:12:58,920 --> 01:13:01,599 Speaker 1: on in the land. We have to be mindful because 1109 01:13:01,840 --> 01:13:08,120 Speaker 1: we need to bring life to the situation. And quite literally, 1110 01:13:08,280 --> 01:13:14,000 Speaker 1: Black Lives Matter was a love note for black people 1111 01:13:14,760 --> 01:13:20,040 Speaker 1: to remind ourselves that we matter, even if the society 1112 01:13:20,240 --> 01:13:23,439 Speaker 1: or the systems are saying negative things or doing negative 1113 01:13:23,479 --> 01:13:26,360 Speaker 1: things to us. We used it as a message to 1114 01:13:26,439 --> 01:13:31,160 Speaker 1: remind ourselves of our own power, of our own beauty, 1115 01:13:31,200 --> 01:13:36,000 Speaker 1: of our agency, of our worthiness, whether we have money 1116 01:13:36,080 --> 01:13:38,559 Speaker 1: or we don't, whether we're from one country or another. 1117 01:13:39,120 --> 01:13:41,559 Speaker 1: We use it as a reminder of all of that. 1118 01:13:42,400 --> 01:13:46,960 Speaker 1: And it was quite you know, simple, quite literally, both 1119 01:13:47,840 --> 01:13:52,200 Speaker 1: a message of love but also a demand on our society. 1120 01:13:52,240 --> 01:13:54,599 Speaker 1: And so now I'll say that, you know, words matter, 1121 01:13:55,520 --> 01:13:59,839 Speaker 1: and while we're engaged in this longer journey to justice, 1122 01:14:00,439 --> 01:14:03,479 Speaker 1: there will be mistakes and no one's going to get 1123 01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:07,840 Speaker 1: up perfect. But what is so powerful about the age 1124 01:14:07,880 --> 01:14:10,960 Speaker 1: that we're living in is that we have all sorts 1125 01:14:10,960 --> 01:14:14,840 Speaker 1: of resources and tools to educate ourselves, you know, to 1126 01:14:14,960 --> 01:14:17,720 Speaker 1: do the deep work. There are all sorts of programs 1127 01:14:17,720 --> 01:14:21,719 Speaker 1: and anti racists, you know, books and working in clue 1128 01:14:21,720 --> 01:14:25,040 Speaker 1: groups and clubs, and you know even you know, different 1129 01:14:25,080 --> 01:14:29,000 Speaker 1: departments and companies and governments, and so I think there's 1130 01:14:29,000 --> 01:14:34,559 Speaker 1: a lot of opportunities to engage in the practice of justice, right, 1131 01:14:34,680 --> 01:14:39,120 Speaker 1: both theory and the actual live practice, which is not 1132 01:14:39,240 --> 01:14:43,120 Speaker 1: always pretty. Right, it's not always pretty, but because we're 1133 01:14:43,120 --> 01:14:47,439 Speaker 1: committed to building a world where all of us have 1134 01:14:47,560 --> 01:14:51,400 Speaker 1: a chance to to thrive, a world where we're all 1135 01:14:51,680 --> 01:14:56,040 Speaker 1: respected and given the opportunity to tap into who we 1136 01:14:56,160 --> 01:14:58,040 Speaker 1: are and the best of ourselves, and we want to 1137 01:14:58,080 --> 01:15:01,439 Speaker 1: live up to that. So we have a duty to 1138 01:15:01,560 --> 01:15:05,480 Speaker 1: engage in those tough conversations, to to hear the hard truths, 1139 01:15:06,000 --> 01:15:08,800 Speaker 1: to name it, to own it, and to show up 1140 01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:11,519 Speaker 1: and keep on showing up, because that's what it is. 1141 01:15:11,560 --> 01:15:14,719 Speaker 1: This is life, and just like everything else, we live, 1142 01:15:15,000 --> 01:15:18,760 Speaker 1: we learn, we grow, we keep on. You're still part 1143 01:15:19,080 --> 01:15:22,519 Speaker 1: of this community, You're still part of this world. Making 1144 01:15:22,560 --> 01:15:27,120 Speaker 1: a mistake doesn't um negate your presence or your contribution. 1145 01:15:27,840 --> 01:15:29,840 Speaker 1: We need people to learn, and we need people to 1146 01:15:29,960 --> 01:15:35,040 Speaker 1: model their learnings and continue. And I think it's you know, 1147 01:15:35,080 --> 01:15:38,040 Speaker 1: a powerful example when I see you know, folks own 1148 01:15:38,120 --> 01:15:44,400 Speaker 1: it and and just continue going and continue going. I 1149 01:15:44,479 --> 01:15:47,080 Speaker 1: love that, love all of that. I know that you 1150 01:15:47,160 --> 01:15:52,599 Speaker 1: guys are so awesome. Really, um, I think that's I mean, gosh, 1151 01:15:52,840 --> 01:15:55,320 Speaker 1: this this is great. And I hope people will really 1152 01:15:56,240 --> 01:15:59,280 Speaker 1: really learn as much as I did from just Uh. 1153 01:15:59,720 --> 01:16:02,400 Speaker 1: Let's need to what you all have to say and 1154 01:16:02,640 --> 01:16:05,439 Speaker 1: give your giving me a lot to think about and Bose, 1155 01:16:05,520 --> 01:16:08,360 Speaker 1: I think probably they're giving you a lot to think about. 1156 01:16:08,400 --> 01:16:12,240 Speaker 1: Two right. Well, Listen, I came into this very tired, 1157 01:16:12,520 --> 01:16:17,840 Speaker 1: I am leaving very motivated. So I certainly appreciate the 1158 01:16:17,880 --> 01:16:22,839 Speaker 1: words of the bishop and of course, my sister opal Um, 1159 01:16:22,880 --> 01:16:28,400 Speaker 1: I can't thank you enough for this very honest conversation. Um. 1160 01:16:28,479 --> 01:16:29,920 Speaker 1: And I think that a lot of people are going 1161 01:16:29,960 --> 01:16:31,880 Speaker 1: to really take a lot out of it. I mean, 1162 01:16:31,920 --> 01:16:35,120 Speaker 1: we certainly are at a place where my hope is 1163 01:16:35,160 --> 01:16:37,880 Speaker 1: that this is a turning point in that we will 1164 01:16:37,960 --> 01:16:42,160 Speaker 1: find new ways of being that will evolve our culture 1165 01:16:42,160 --> 01:16:45,120 Speaker 1: and our communities, and that people will find inspiration in 1166 01:16:45,200 --> 01:16:48,040 Speaker 1: what you have said, whether they are black or white 1167 01:16:48,240 --> 01:16:51,320 Speaker 1: or brown. Uh, that we will all find ways to 1168 01:16:51,360 --> 01:16:54,280 Speaker 1: make our societies better. So thank you again so much 1169 01:16:54,360 --> 01:16:58,320 Speaker 1: for the conversation. Let me just close with one thing 1170 01:16:58,400 --> 01:17:01,439 Speaker 1: to both of my new the in sistors of what 1171 01:17:01,560 --> 01:17:04,360 Speaker 1: a privilege in and honor it is uh to hear 1172 01:17:04,400 --> 01:17:07,639 Speaker 1: your wisdom and see your smiles and and hear your 1173 01:17:07,680 --> 01:17:12,040 Speaker 1: perspectives and and learn and grow. And I have been inspired. Uh. 1174 01:17:12,400 --> 01:17:17,040 Speaker 1: And to Katie Curic, who is is absolutely a journalistic legend, 1175 01:17:17,720 --> 01:17:21,400 Speaker 1: thank you for propelling our voice beyond the border so 1176 01:17:21,600 --> 01:17:27,200 Speaker 1: where anyone else amongst us could carry it. Uh. Your influence, 1177 01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:34,160 Speaker 1: your background, your massive journalistic career enables our thoughts to 1178 01:17:34,240 --> 01:17:37,639 Speaker 1: be propelled onto platforms that none of us could reach 1179 01:17:37,720 --> 01:17:40,280 Speaker 1: without you. And when you ask what can you do, 1180 01:17:41,040 --> 01:17:45,479 Speaker 1: You're doing it right now. Thank you so much. Bishop, 1181 01:17:45,560 --> 01:17:48,920 Speaker 1: You're making me cry. I wish I could go go 1182 01:17:49,080 --> 01:17:51,840 Speaker 1: through this computer screen and give you a hug, but 1183 01:17:51,920 --> 01:17:54,880 Speaker 1: I know I'm not allowed to do that anyway, So 1184 01:17:56,520 --> 01:17:59,840 Speaker 1: I'll send you a virtual hug and Opal, such a 1185 01:18:00,160 --> 01:18:04,360 Speaker 1: such a privilege to meet you. Likewise, this is great. 1186 01:18:04,439 --> 01:18:10,240 Speaker 1: Thank you all so much. This is such an important conversation, truly, truly, 1187 01:18:10,320 --> 01:18:15,599 Speaker 1: thank you. Wow Bows, those two really delivered. I am 1188 01:18:15,720 --> 01:18:19,599 Speaker 1: so moved and inspired from that conversation. I cannot thank 1189 01:18:19,640 --> 01:18:23,640 Speaker 1: you enough for inviting both of them to the podcast. 1190 01:18:24,400 --> 01:18:27,360 Speaker 1: I think It's been such an important conversation and I'm 1191 01:18:27,360 --> 01:18:30,960 Speaker 1: really proud of the way that you even asked questions 1192 01:18:31,040 --> 01:18:33,640 Speaker 1: that perhaps made you feel uncomfortable, and I hope that 1193 01:18:33,680 --> 01:18:37,679 Speaker 1: you are more comfortable now. And for anyone who's interested 1194 01:18:37,680 --> 01:18:41,200 Speaker 1: in reading or understanding more, We've put together a detailed 1195 01:18:41,240 --> 01:18:44,600 Speaker 1: list of anti racist resources, which you can find in 1196 01:18:44,680 --> 01:18:47,960 Speaker 1: the podcast description and on our social media channels too. 1197 01:18:48,479 --> 01:18:51,720 Speaker 1: Until next time, I'm Katie Couric and I'm bosmas St 1198 01:18:51,800 --> 01:18:54,799 Speaker 1: John and this is Back to Biz with Katie and Bows. 1199 01:18:55,240 --> 01:18:58,840 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for listening everyone, and Bows, thank 1200 01:18:58,880 --> 01:19:01,960 Speaker 1: you for being here. Thank you so much. I love you, Katie, 1201 01:19:02,240 --> 01:19:10,840 Speaker 1: love you too. Back to Biz with Katie and Bows 1202 01:19:10,960 --> 01:19:13,679 Speaker 1: is a production of I Heart Radio and Katie Curk Media. 1203 01:19:14,160 --> 01:19:17,640 Speaker 1: The executive producers are Katie Kurrik, bosmas St John, and 1204 01:19:17,720 --> 01:19:21,959 Speaker 1: Courtney Litz. The supervising producer is Lauren Hansen. The associate 1205 01:19:22,000 --> 01:19:26,679 Speaker 1: producers are Derek Clements, Eliza Costas, and Emily Pinto. Editing 1206 01:19:26,720 --> 01:19:31,000 Speaker 1: by Derrek Clements and Lauren Hansen. Mixing by Derrek Clements. 1207 01:19:31,040 --> 01:19:35,519 Speaker 1: Special thanks to Adriana Fasio. For more information about today's episode, 1208 01:19:35,520 --> 01:19:38,160 Speaker 1: go to Katie Kirk dot com. You can also follow 1209 01:19:38,240 --> 01:19:42,400 Speaker 1: Katie Kirk and bozmas st John on Twitter and Instagram. 1210 01:19:42,439 --> 01:19:44,840 Speaker 1: For more podcasts. For my Heart Radio, visit the I 1211 01:19:44,960 --> 01:19:48,000 Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to 1212 01:19:48,040 --> 01:19:59,559 Speaker 1: your favorite shows. If you design, engineer, build, or maintain 1213 01:19:59,640 --> 01:20:03,320 Speaker 1: building in California, you can get free technical training, continuing 1214 01:20:03,439 --> 01:20:06,760 Speaker 1: education credits, and prepare for a range of certifications through 1215 01:20:06,800 --> 01:20:10,280 Speaker 1: pg n S online classes. Enroll at PGE dot com 1216 01:20:10,360 --> 01:20:11,120 Speaker 1: slash Training