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Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha.

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Speaker 2: All the stuff I never told you, procure if I

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Speaker 2: hurt you, and welcome to a very special stuff we

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Speaker 2: never told you. We were so excited to be joined

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Speaker 2: once again by the very well read, the very well

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Speaker 2: missed Bridget Todd. We have missed you so much, Bridget.

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Speaker 2: We're so glad to have you.

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Speaker 3: Oh, you were very well missed. I missed you all

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Speaker 3: so much. Thanks for having me here, Like, uh, yeah,

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Speaker 3: I used to kind of rely on shooting the shooting

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Speaker 3: with y'all. I'm nice to have that outlet. I've missed

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Speaker 3: it so much. Thank you for having me here.

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Speaker 4: Then it took us twenty minutes to get to the

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Speaker 4: recording part because we were in such conversation. I was like, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 4: we actually need to do things, but I missed talking

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Speaker 4: so with Bridget.

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Speaker 1: So we need to know all the details.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, and you, I mean you always. There's so

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Speaker 2: much going on right now, and so much in the

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Speaker 2: technology sector and so much in so many sectors that

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Speaker 2: I just have a lot of trust in you, Bridget.

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Speaker 2: So you have been very well missed. Which is the Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I think something I just made up right then, But

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Speaker 2: I know this is a loaded question, how have you been?

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Speaker 2: What's been going on?

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Speaker 3: If anyone watches Real Housewives of New York, there's a

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Speaker 3: meme of Derenda saying, how have I been? Not well,

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Speaker 3: that's that question. Not well, I mean I have I

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Speaker 3: have gone. I had the worst year of my life

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Speaker 3: last year, and I do want to say, like a

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Speaker 3: big part of that was Annie and Samantha, you both

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Speaker 3: really being such good friends and good collaborators and like

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Speaker 3: really giving me a lot of space, and so I

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Speaker 3: want to say, like, thank you for all the support.

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Speaker 3: And so I've had a personally rough go and then

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Speaker 3: on top of that everything else that's happening. It feels

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Speaker 3: like I went offline and when I came back, the

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Speaker 3: world was spiraling, and so, yeah, I have been experiencing

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Speaker 3: despair personally, and then I feel like everybody else kind

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Speaker 3: of also met me in despair, and it's like, oh,

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Speaker 3: we're all in despair together.

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Speaker 4: Welcome, which is essentially crying in each other's arms for

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Speaker 4: different reasons, but it all meshes together because the world's

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Speaker 4: on fire.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, and here we are, like, yay, Bridget,

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Speaker 2: tell us about it.

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Speaker 1: Come talk to us about this stuff.

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Speaker 2: Please, just make say some things.

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Speaker 3: Well, we were talking off Mike about how complicated it

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Speaker 3: is as people who make podcasts and make contact. It's

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Speaker 3: like you have to find this balance of like not

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Speaker 3: wanting to severely bum everybody out. And you know, we're

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Speaker 3: not just people who make podcasts, Like I listen to

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Speaker 3: podcasts for fun, and I find myself being like, you know,

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Speaker 3: I can't handle anything real right now, I need to

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Speaker 3: just distract myself with some fluff. I think. I think

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Speaker 3: we're all both as content creators and as people who

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Speaker 3: take in content and appreciate media, we're all trying to

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Speaker 3: find this like sweet spot. I don't know if y'all

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Speaker 3: listening can identify with this, but I've really been struggling

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Speaker 3: with how much to take in to not have me

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Speaker 3: completely be spiraling, and how much to take in to

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Speaker 3: keep me informed. So trying to find that balance.

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Speaker 4: Right I think the big conversation is like knowing that

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Speaker 4: we have a responsibility and making sure like we're not

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Speaker 4: the complete like we're we can't stop everything, but we

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Speaker 4: do have a responsibility in witnessing it and making sure

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Speaker 4: we're calling it out.

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Speaker 1: But at the same time.

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Speaker 4: Sometimes that means that our well being is out the

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Speaker 4: window when we see too much?

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Speaker 1: What do we see way too much?

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Speaker 4: And so having that balance of being like, yes, I'm

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Speaker 4: ready to be refreshed and fight again is so hard

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Speaker 4: to do what it feels like it's a constant.

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Speaker 5: New fight exactly.

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Speaker 3: I saw this post that I feel like really summed

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Speaker 3: up where I'm at, where it was like, certainly, if

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Speaker 3: I read one more piece of content or one more

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Speaker 3: news article instead of going to sleep, I will feel

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Speaker 3: totally in control of what is happening. I yes, that

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Speaker 3: could have been written by me.

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Speaker 2: Oh my goodness. Yes, Well, okay, speaking of we were

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Speaker 2: discussing a friend of mine who every day is sending

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Speaker 2: me these texts where I can tell she feels she

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Speaker 2: has no control and I'm kind of like, you need

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Speaker 2: to you need to find something else. I don't not

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Speaker 2: all day, not all the time. This is not good

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Speaker 2: for you. But where we are going to talk about

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Speaker 2: one of the things she used to do to distract herself,

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Speaker 2: which was go to target the store. Target that was

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Speaker 2: like one of her favorite things, and now she's very

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Speaker 2: conflicted about all of it. And I know that we're

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Speaker 2: going to talk about that.

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Speaker 3: Brigitte, Yes, yes, and so I have to say, like,

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Speaker 3: shout out to Annie's friend because her and me both

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Speaker 3: I there's a Target that is very close to my apartment.

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Speaker 3: It's walking distance to my apartment. I will just like

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Speaker 3: walk around Target just for like a scenery change, like

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Speaker 3: the same way people will be like, oh, take a

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Speaker 3: walk in the park. I'm like, oh, let me see

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Speaker 3: what Target has. It's a terrible habit. Y'all can call

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Speaker 3: me out, like totally totally own that it's not good behavior.

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Speaker 3: But I heretofore have loved Target, Like there's just something

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Speaker 3: about walking around like they really like get the people

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Speaker 3: who are chopping there. And I think that's one of

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Speaker 3: the reasons why the whole thing with Target and DEI

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Speaker 3: is it feels personal to me. It feels kind of

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Speaker 3: heartbreaking because listen, Walmart stores like that.

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Speaker 5: It's like they're not stores where.

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Speaker 3: I would imagine there are people who see me and like,

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Speaker 3: you know, get me as a shopper. Target feels occupies

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Speaker 3: a very different space in my consciousness. So when I

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Speaker 3: hear that some effery is happening with Target, I really

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Speaker 3: don't like it. Does that make sense?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you definitely have to go through your list of like, well,

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Speaker 4: all that, I can't go there anymore.

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Speaker 1: I can't, and your list starts.

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Speaker 4: Dwindling, especially when you like, for the longest time, we

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Speaker 4: kind of not champion because there's still a corporation at

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Speaker 4: the end.

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Speaker 1: But for a while they were doing some things that were.

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Speaker 4: Like, Yay, finally you're doing some good initiatives at least

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Speaker 4: bringing on great products for a diverse group of people,

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Speaker 4: which is apparently the problem, and actually standing up for it.

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Speaker 1: So it seemed so to come back and be like,

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Speaker 1: what the.

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Speaker 3: Hell exactly that? So I want to get into all

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Speaker 3: of that. But for folks who don't know what's going on,

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Speaker 3: the Trump administration kicked off with a grip of executive

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Speaker 3: orders I guess, like targeting wokeness through things like overhauling

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Speaker 3: DEI initiative. So this happened in the federal government. Like

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Speaker 3: currently right now, folks who work on anything even tangentially

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Speaker 3: DEI related within the federal government have been placed on leave.

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Speaker 3: I live in DC, and that that is like what's

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Speaker 3: happening with federal workers, both in the District of Columbia

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Speaker 3: and nationally is like a whole other conversation. It really

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Speaker 3: is horrible, and I think it will effect impact all

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Speaker 3: of us. I think we will all be less safe

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Speaker 3: because of it. So I wanted to name that. But

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Speaker 3: when it comes to DEI, it is not just the

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Speaker 3: public sector, because Trump also issued executive orders meant to

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Speaker 3: quash DEI programs in the private sector as well. He

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Speaker 3: directed agency heads to drop list of publicly traded companies

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Speaker 3: to investigate their DEI programs.

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Speaker 5: So this is not a totally new thing.

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Speaker 3: I know that. When I was on stuff I've ever

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Speaker 3: told you a while ago, we were talking about the

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Speaker 3: Supreme Court decision back in twenty twenty three about affirmative action.

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Speaker 3: So another sort of side effect of that Supreme Court

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Speaker 3: ruling was that some of these big private companies started

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Speaker 3: reassessing the legality of their programs after that ruling. So

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Speaker 3: it's not totally new. But Trump being in the White

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Speaker 3: House and sort of starting off his administration with, you know,

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Speaker 3: signaling all of this pressure on DEI programs really has

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Speaker 3: taken it to a new level.

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Speaker 2: Yes, And I feel like a lot of companies have

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Speaker 2: come out of the woodwork, not just companies but other

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Speaker 2: like universities and all this, and they're like, yeah, we'll

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Speaker 2: just get rid of that as quickly as possible. It's

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Speaker 2: so ready to be like yep, okay, did want it? Gone?

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Speaker 5: Yes?

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Speaker 3: So like I mean so like as somebody who covers technology,

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Speaker 3: I have really I'll say, not shocked, but disappointed when

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Speaker 3: it comes to tech companies, how quickly they were like, look, gone,

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Speaker 3: gone gone. After having to sit through years of listing

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Speaker 3: to these companies talk about or maybe even lie about

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Speaker 3: the way that support women, LGBTQ people, black people like,

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Speaker 3: and I think with technology they have the power to

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Speaker 3: shape so much of our world and so much of

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Speaker 3: our culture that what they do really can set the tone.

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Speaker 3: And so yeah, it just sucks that we spent any

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Speaker 3: time at all pretending that these companies gave a crap

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Speaker 3: about any of us, And then how quickly they're like, oh,

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Speaker 3: just kidding. So I'll run through a little bit of

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Speaker 3: where we're at with some of these companies. So Facebook

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Speaker 3: just immediately went along with Trump like we'd be here

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Speaker 3: all day if I listed all the ways, but just

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Speaker 3: a taste, you know. Obviously, they rolled back their DII programs,

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Speaker 3: they rolled back fact checking immediately, they lifted restrictions on

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Speaker 3: saying things like quote women are property on their platforms,

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Speaker 3: and so if that is an attitude that you happen

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Speaker 3: to hold, that women are property, you can say that

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Speaker 3: on Facebook all day long and it is not a problem.

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Speaker 3: You also saw Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg doing things like

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Speaker 3: ordering the removal of tampons from all men's bathrooms in

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Speaker 3: company offices.

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Speaker 5: So these weird things.

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Speaker 3: Where as Mashville put it, this decision was not about

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Speaker 3: cost cutting or efficiency. It took effort and served no

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Speaker 3: practical purpose and sent a clear message about the company's

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Speaker 3: shifting priority. So these things that are clearly like they're

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Speaker 3: not about cost cutting, they're not about, you know, making

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Speaker 3: the company more efficient. They're just about making it clear

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Speaker 3: where they're at, which mission accomplished, because I really have

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Speaker 3: a very clear understanding of where Facebook is at. Zuckerberg,

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Speaker 3: of course, went on a bunch of podcasts dressed like

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Speaker 3: a recently divorced nightclub promoter and talked about how Facebook

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Speaker 3: needs more quote masculine energy at their companies. Now. Now, again,

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Speaker 3: keep in mind, this is not a company that Time

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Speaker 3: magazine describes their current workforce as almost seventy percent mail.

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Speaker 5: So I guess that's like not mail enough. We need

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Speaker 5: it to be more male.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. I don't know how much more mail

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Speaker 3: you can get other than like one hundred percent.

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Speaker 4: But okay, which is kind of like the opposite once

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Speaker 4: again of being like, you want to be really masculine,

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Speaker 4: but a part of your masculinity is like being impressive

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Speaker 4: to women. So will you being so impressive towards each other?

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Speaker 4: Like bro okay, which I kind of missed the days

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Speaker 4: where we were talking about him and fighting with Elon.

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Speaker 1: I know you would go back to those days.

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Speaker 4: How that?

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Speaker 3: So he had a window where people didn't hate him.

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Speaker 3: And what's funny is that I was just reading this

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Speaker 3: study that was like, oh, remember when Mark Zuckerberg like

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Speaker 3: changed his look and was trying to go for like

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Speaker 3: a softer, gentler approach. Turns out everybody still hates him.

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Speaker 3: And I was like, oh, who even did who even

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Speaker 3: did this study? You're like, what, what's this's the study?

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Speaker 3: But there is a study that apparently that little window

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Speaker 3: where people didn't hate his guts did not last and

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Speaker 3: had no lasting impact. So he really squandered that tiny

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Speaker 3: sliver of goodwill that he got from people from that

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Speaker 3: like one week or whatever, people didn't completely hate his guts.

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Speaker 4: Right, I think the whistle blowers in his life just

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Speaker 4: really was not having it. So I also missed them

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Speaker 4: me too.

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Speaker 3: Francis Hogan, where are you at?

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Speaker 2: Met you? I hope you're okay.

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Speaker 4: Speaking of big companies, we know, like there were several

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Speaker 4: big CEOs and executives that were aligned and excited to

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Speaker 4: do exactly what Trump has been wanted to do, including Amazon, right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, they scaled back their DEI programs pretty quickly. Google,

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Speaker 3: I will say two companies that did not immediately scale

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Speaker 3: back to EI or Apple and Microsoft. Both of those

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Speaker 3: companies kind of reaffirmed their commitment to DEI. Companies are

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Speaker 3: so companies. So I don't want to be like giving

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Speaker 3: them too much rav rock credit. Microsoft has been very

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Speaker 3: chummy with Trump. But I do want to give credit

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Speaker 3: where credit is due on DEI specifically because I do

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Speaker 3: think like it's a choice. You know that one of

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Speaker 3: the big companies that did not scale back TOI that

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Speaker 3: we'll talk more about in a bit is Costco, Right,

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Speaker 3: and so these companies, even despite these executive orders, these

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Speaker 3: companies don't have to immediately comply. Immediately complying with these

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Speaker 3: executive orders is a choice, right, And so I wouldn't

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Speaker 3: even Like a lot of people have described this moment

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Speaker 3: as sort of a mask off moment, especially when it

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Speaker 3: comes to tech companies, I wouldn't even say I agree

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Speaker 3: with this. I don't think that these companies have like

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Speaker 3: necessarily not wanted to do inclusion work all along. I

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Speaker 3: don't think that that. I think the people who run

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Speaker 3: these companies will just align themselves with whoever is in

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Speaker 3: power and whatever is the favorable position at the moment,

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Speaker 3: and so I don't even think it's a mask off moment.

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Speaker 3: Like I don't think Mark Zuckerberg is showing his true colors.

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Speaker 3: I don't think he has true colors. These are people

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Speaker 3: who not who don't have genuine values or backbone. And

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Speaker 3: so if you don't really have if you don't really

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Speaker 3: value anything, it's not really a mask off moment because

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Speaker 3: your value is just power and money, right.

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Speaker 1: And it's interesting because we've had so many.

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Speaker 4: Conversations about places like Google and tech companies like them,

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Speaker 4: and how their initial setup was kind of like we're

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Speaker 4: the cool nerds that you want to come work for.

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Speaker 4: We're the ones that's offering you know, unlimited PTO, but

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Speaker 4: we really don't think you should take it we're the

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Speaker 4: ones that's bringing in women of color to be leaders,

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Speaker 4: but not really because if we want to fire them

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Speaker 4: because they're talking too much and giving too many suggestions, Like,

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Speaker 4: it's interesting to see how quickly that they were like, oh,

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Speaker 4: finally we don't have to pretend to be the cool

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Speaker 4: nerds and just be uh at the alpha males that

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Speaker 4: we've been training to be essentially.

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Speaker 3: So I actually think you're spot on, and I do

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Speaker 3: think we really need to have more conversations about the

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Speaker 3: cultural dynamic of some of these tech leaders and some

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Speaker 3: of these tech companies, because I think it is how

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Speaker 3: we sort of got into this mess in some ways,

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Speaker 3: because you know, if you think back to like, you know,

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Speaker 3: think back to the day the early days of platforms

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Speaker 3: like Instagram, the early days of iPhone technology and the

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Speaker 3: people made it occupied a very specific place in our

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Speaker 3: cultural popular imagination. Right, it was Google offices that looked

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Speaker 3: really cool, that had pinball machines and open offices. Right.

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Speaker 3: Google's motto used to be don't be evil until they

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Speaker 3: dropped that motto officially in twenty eighteen. I think they

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Speaker 3: might have just taken off the don't right. Maybe it's

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Speaker 3: now like a little bit evil for a treat is fine.

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Speaker 3: I think that we gave them so much space and

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Speaker 3: so much runway to be these cool nerds who we're

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Speaker 3: going to be using technology to improve all of our lives,

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Speaker 3: and we kind of trusted that that's what they were doing.

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Speaker 3: And I think that because of that trust, now when

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Speaker 3: we check back in and it's like, wait, are you

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Speaker 3: guys actually still invested in building a better future, and

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Speaker 3: they're like, now, we're invested in making money through exploiting you. Actually,

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Speaker 3: I think that's where we're at, And so I think

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Speaker 3: it's really you're so right.

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Speaker 5: To bring up that sort of cultural.

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Speaker 3: Dynamics that are running some of these companies and in

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Speaker 3: tune shaping our understanding and attitude around them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, I'm not gonna lie.

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Speaker 4: One of the best, most like immediate examples was TikTok

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Speaker 4: TikTok with that's like trying to fight the government. I'm

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Speaker 4: here for you, We're here for your voice and where

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Speaker 4: we want to represent for your First Amendment rights, and

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Speaker 4: then being like, oh, we love Donald Trump. He's gonna

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Speaker 4: save us. Let's give money to him. Like it's such

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Speaker 4: a switch quick turnaround. We were all like oh, we

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Speaker 4: were rooting for you for a split second, like we

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Speaker 4: were kind of doubting you and a few things. But

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Speaker 4: now like, oh, they were such a quick turnaround of

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Speaker 4: exactly what we saw play out, except it took a

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Speaker 4: little while longer.

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Speaker 3: I had the exact same feeling, Like I remember thinking, oh,

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Speaker 3: TikTok Ceo is like this young guy, he's so savvy

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Speaker 3: blah blah blah. How quickly he turned heel right, So like,

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Speaker 3: don't trust any of these leaders. I don't care how

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Speaker 3: savvy they look. I don't care how young they are.

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Speaker 3: Like tech, a tech company will break your heart. A

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Speaker 3: tech company will exploit you get rich off of it,

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Speaker 3: and then expect you to champion them like a damn

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Speaker 3: luminary because it absolutely.

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Speaker 1: I mean again Target.

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Speaker 4: For a split secondly, we really were like, oh, they're

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Speaker 4: bringing in black women own products, and we want to

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Speaker 4: cheer that on. They're standing up for the LGBTQ plus community.

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Speaker 4: We love that, you know, really seeming like their pain

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Speaker 4: beyond their minimum wage and people are being like, we're excited,

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Speaker 4: and then it turned to this.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, so let's get into it.

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Speaker 3: So on January twenty fourth, Target announced they were going

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Speaker 3: to be rolling back their DEI initiatives, including programs to

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Speaker 3: foster and promote black owned businesses in its stores. This

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Speaker 3: is following Trump's signing of the executive order ending DEI

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Speaker 3: programs federally. So they sent around a memo by staff

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Speaker 3: member Kira Fernandez, Target's chief Community Impact and Equity officer

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Speaker 3: and a black woman herself. In this memo, the company

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Speaker 3: said they were going to stop conducting external diversity surveys

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Speaker 3: and submitting information to the Human Rights Campaign Corporate Equality Index,

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Speaker 3: which evaluates corporate policies on LGBTQ plus inclusion. The memo said,

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Speaker 3: quote twenty twenty five will be accelerating action in key

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Speaker 3: areas and implementing changes with the goal of driving growth

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Speaker 3: and staying in step with the evolving external landscape. And so,

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Speaker 3: just like what you were saying, Sam, this is particularly

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Speaker 3: notable because Target really did seem like one of those

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Speaker 3: retailers that was making and signaling investment in things like inclusion,

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Speaker 3: especially after twenty twenty. So Target their headquarters is based

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Speaker 3: in Minneapolis, where George Floyd was killed. So in twenty twenty,

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Speaker 3: Target reiterated its racial Equity Action and Change initiative, which

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Speaker 3: involves things like anti racism training for employees and prioritize

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Speaker 3: hiring and promoting black staff, and they really look to

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Speaker 3: grow the number of black owned businesses at Target. In

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty one, Target pledged to invest two billion in

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Speaker 3: black owned businesses by the end of twenty twenty five

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Speaker 3: as part of this program. And so here's the thing

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Speaker 3: that I always like to talk about when it comes

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Speaker 3: to things like DEI and inclusion. These programs don't just

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Speaker 3: exist because they're like the nice thing to do, which

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Speaker 3: they are. They're good business. They make companies money. These

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Speaker 3: companies exist to make money, and it turns out that

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Speaker 3: inclusion is good for business. Target's chief executive officer Brian

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Speaker 3: Cornell told Fortunes Leadership Next podcast in twenty twenty three

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Speaker 3: that all of these like inclusion and diversity focused initiatives quote,

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Speaker 3: fueled so much of our growth over the last nine years.

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Speaker 3: So they are definitely cashing in and making money off

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Speaker 3: of traditionally marginalized people as a consumer block.

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Speaker 4: I wonder how close to that goal were they when

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Speaker 4: five happened, like to giving those billions in investments, Like,

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Speaker 4: were they actually that closed or maybe I wonder conspiracy

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Speaker 4: theories like they were nowhere near something like let's just

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Speaker 4: roll it back and pretend like it never happened because

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Speaker 4: we're not going to meet this.

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Speaker 3: I mean, that wouldn't surprise me whenever. So this is

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Speaker 3: like like a hot tip for listeners. Whenever our company

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Speaker 3: is like we pledge to do xyz thing, right, it's

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Speaker 3: always good have just to follow up because half the

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Speaker 3: time they've done nothing and they're just like not counting

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Speaker 3: on anybody following up. So it's like they can say anything.

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Speaker 5: They could say we.

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Speaker 3: Pledged to do whatever, and it's like if if no

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Speaker 3: one's following up, they can just get all the good

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Speaker 3: pr and goodwill without actually doing the thing that they

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Speaker 3: voluntarily said they were gonna do.

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Speaker 1: Right, no one asked for these numbers.

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Speaker 2: You brought this up this I'm sure you've run into

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Speaker 2: this before. Bridget as a medium that depends on advertisers sometimes,

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Speaker 2: like during like Pride Month, they'll be like this company

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Speaker 2: is gonna do this and do this and do this,

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Speaker 2: and I'll be like, okay, tell me how silence. I

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Speaker 2: never hear from them again, Like.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I wasn't expecting I wouldn't have said that up.

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Speaker 5: I thought you were gonna like ask the follow up.

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Speaker 2: Asking basically people to donate to your companies that you're

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Speaker 2: gonna donate, like, well, what are you gonna do though?

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Speaker 4: What you to those organizations and then write it off

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Speaker 4: as their taxes as if they donated the money and

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Speaker 4: not the customers obviously any come.

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Speaker 2: On, so naive.

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Speaker 4: I am honestly like that whole rolling up of like

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Speaker 4: the change and then everybody's like, don't do that because

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Speaker 4: they're using this as a tax break.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, yeah, that's sell bug. Oh damn it.

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Speaker 1: Yeahy so evil.

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Speaker 3: I mean, like that's the thing. Like I want to

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Speaker 3: be clear, it's not like I'm it's not like like

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Speaker 3: I ask someone who is very critical of things like capitalism.

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Speaker 3: I didn't think Target was really my friend or really

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Speaker 3: my ally even when they did this stuff. So it's

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Speaker 3: not I'm not expecting any corporation or any company to

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Speaker 3: like truly meaningfully be an ally. But I do think

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Speaker 3: these companies that go out of their way to signal

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Speaker 3: to me, you know, as a black woman consumer, that

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Speaker 3: like we care about you, we we like understand that

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Speaker 3: you are fueling our profit margins, or like let's try

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Speaker 3: to be aligned with like give you the customer experience

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Speaker 3: that you want. I do think that matters, and so

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Speaker 3: especially a company like Target, I don't know if folks

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Speaker 3: really understand the role that Target plays, especially for Black women,

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Speaker 3: like you know, back in the day. So look, if

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Speaker 3: you like, back in the day when I first grew

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Speaker 3: my hair out natural, there were not a lot of

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Speaker 3: mainstream stores where you could walk in and find a

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Speaker 3: well stocked natural hair care aisle. Target was one of

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Speaker 3: the first, right, and so it really I think went

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Speaker 3: another way to curry a lot of favor with Black

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Speaker 3: women as a consumer base because of that kind of thing,

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Speaker 3: being like, oh, what is it that you actually use,

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Speaker 3: What is it that you're actually looking for? How can

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Speaker 3: we fill the niches in your you know, shopping situation.

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Speaker 3: I think Target did that very well, and I think

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Speaker 3: it really positioned them as a place where they were

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Speaker 3: signaling to the people who actually give them money, like, Hey,

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Speaker 3: we see y'all, we know what y'all need, we know

437
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:00,600
Speaker 3: what we're listening to you. As the cup points out,

438
00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:04,720
Speaker 3: the retailers. Black owned brands span categories from home to

439
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:09,119
Speaker 3: apparel and beauty, including hair care brands The Dough Camille, Rose,

440
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:11,960
Speaker 3: and the viral mel and beauty brand the lip Bar.

441
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,199
Speaker 3: These brands fill avoid in the market, making products for

442
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:18,520
Speaker 3: various skin tones and hair textures available. For example, the

443
00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:21,280
Speaker 3: dough has its viral curl defining moves beloved by the

444
00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:22,280
Speaker 3: natural hair community.

445
00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:25,640
Speaker 5: So it really did.

446
00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:28,199
Speaker 3: Play a particular role I think in a lot of

447
00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,000
Speaker 3: black women's shopping diets.

448
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and it was like you said, a

449
00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:42,159
Speaker 2: mainstream store to do it, and it felt I don't know,

450
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:46,920
Speaker 2: we like you said, we have said their companies they're

451
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:49,760
Speaker 2: not allies, but it felt nice to be like, Okay,

452
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:54,560
Speaker 2: I can go here and this place is with me.

453
00:23:55,000 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 2: Kind of gets me. This seems like a it doesn't

454
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:02,560
Speaker 2: feel as bad that I'm going here, you know, I

455
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:05,200
Speaker 2: don't feel the same guilt maybe right else.

456
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,199
Speaker 4: I think this also brings into the conversation about the

457
00:24:09,280 --> 00:24:14,320
Speaker 4: fact that they need to like erase this as in

458
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 4: like take this out because of why so this is

459
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 4: obviously a bigger conversation and trying to make a publicity

460
00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:28,280
Speaker 4: stunt essentially just like bringing off products and bringing saying

461
00:24:28,320 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 4: like okay, so diversity in equity and inclusion in these

462
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:35,240
Speaker 4: being what does that mean exactly? And in this conversation.

463
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:39,720
Speaker 4: It's pretty much saying, Okay, we will now exclude a

464
00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:44,639
Speaker 4: certain group of people that were excluded previously before this time,

465
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:48,959
Speaker 4: and by doing so, we're going to make white supremacists

466
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:54,399
Speaker 4: feel more comfortable because they were uncomfortable with I don't know,

467
00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 4: shopping with people of color, like such a conversation like

468
00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 4: they but why why is this so important that Target

469
00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:02,640
Speaker 4: needs to do this, Like they were making money off

470
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:05,760
Speaker 4: of this and they're so afraid of or I guess

471
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:08,000
Speaker 4: maybe they are just white supremus one of those two

472
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:12,840
Speaker 4: things in order to satisfy a group of people who

473
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:16,879
Speaker 4: didn't even know it was a thing. For like the

474
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:18,679
Speaker 4: longest time. People were just like, oh what is this

475
00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:21,760
Speaker 4: new stuff? Okay, moved on, except when people finally said

476
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:23,240
Speaker 4: this is black oman, They're like, oh my god.

477
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 3: What. Yeah. I mean, that's a really good question. I

478
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:30,600
Speaker 3: honestly think that in this moment, it's just about signaling

479
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,119
Speaker 3: alignment with Trump and the new administration. I think that, like,

480
00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 3: you know, Target has been making good money off of

481
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:45,120
Speaker 3: marketing toward marginalized people, right, I mean, y'all remember when

482
00:25:45,840 --> 00:25:48,800
Speaker 3: the last time that Target was in the crosshairs of

483
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:53,040
Speaker 3: a lot of extremists because they had a well stocked,

484
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:56,440
Speaker 3: robust pride section for pride things like that, like and

485
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:59,199
Speaker 3: Target caved on that. Like I will say, like, so,

486
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:04,520
Speaker 3: I think it really just illustrates that these companies, whatever

487
00:26:05,320 --> 00:26:09,000
Speaker 3: is in power, whatever is the like, they don't actually

488
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:12,919
Speaker 3: have values or backbones, and we shouldn't necessarily even be

489
00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:15,560
Speaker 3: expecting them to. They'll they'll just cave and bend to

490
00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:17,879
Speaker 3: whoever is in power. And what makes it even more

491
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:23,520
Speaker 3: frustrating is like after they they will do that, after

492
00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:26,560
Speaker 3: they signaled that they want to be more aligned with

493
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:29,680
Speaker 3: these communities. So Chantel Powell, who is a black entrepreneur

494
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 3: who makes a deodorant for kids called play Pits, which

495
00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:35,639
Speaker 3: was stocked at Target, she put it really well. She said, quote,

496
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:39,440
Speaker 3: it's frustrating corporations jumped on the bandwagon to support black

497
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 3: businesses when it was trendy. Now that it's easier to

498
00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:45,199
Speaker 3: discard us, that's what they're doing. And so yeah, I

499
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 3: just don't think that these companies give a crap. Really,

500
00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:52,200
Speaker 3: they it's all posturing, it's all signaling, like they don't

501
00:26:52,240 --> 00:26:55,520
Speaker 3: really have any kind of like values to genuinely stick

502
00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:59,960
Speaker 3: to or a firm like in moments of you know, upheaval.

503
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:01,720
Speaker 5: Well, the thing that you can.

504
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,440
Speaker 3: Always go back to as your north star is values.

505
00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:06,040
Speaker 3: Like as a contact creator, I had to have a

506
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 3: whole conversation when Trump took power of like, well, what

507
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:11,480
Speaker 3: are my values and what am I doing in this

508
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 3: moment to actually serve the people that I want to

509
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 3: be in community with you. When you have values, that

510
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:19,199
Speaker 3: is always your north star. These companies do not have

511
00:27:19,240 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 3: any value, so of course they're going to blow wherever

512
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:22,080
Speaker 3: the wind.

513
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:25,119
Speaker 4: Blows, right, They're going to do the bottom line, which

514
00:27:26,520 --> 00:27:29,320
Speaker 4: there's so much again, like in this conversation about how

515
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:32,920
Speaker 4: who was easily discarded first? And this is all about

516
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:36,240
Speaker 4: the virtue signaling, as they want to say, because as

517
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 4: robust as their like stock was, it wasn't you still

518
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:44,120
Speaker 4: have to like purposely find it. And it was a

519
00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 4: shock to see it, like it's I remember the many

520
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 4: times we're like, oh that's cute. Oh look it's you

521
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:51,879
Speaker 4: know a black owner or a black creator who did this.

522
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:55,119
Speaker 4: That's amazing because it's one out of one hundred, you know,

523
00:27:55,520 --> 00:27:58,440
Speaker 4: to see it was notable because there wasn't that many.

524
00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:00,360
Speaker 1: So even the most like.

525
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:04,920
Speaker 4: Diverse products were just literally one out of fifty one

526
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 4: out of one hundred, Like, it still wasn't.

527
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:10,159
Speaker 3: I remember back when extremists were targeting Target because of

528
00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:13,439
Speaker 3: the pride stuff and the LGBTQ stuff, people would get

529
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:18,480
Speaker 3: upset because Target sold chest binders right for trans folks,

530
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:21,280
Speaker 3: and it's like, okay, so you don't need a chest binder.

531
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:24,880
Speaker 3: Why is it so horrible that like, out of out

532
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:26,720
Speaker 3: of what one hundred, It's like when you go into

533
00:28:26,760 --> 00:28:31,280
Speaker 3: the underpant section of Target, ninety nine point nine percent

534
00:28:31,320 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 3: of garments are designed for SIS people and they have

535
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:36,199
Speaker 3: one product for trans people, and it's the end of

536
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:40,360
Speaker 3: the world. Like, how is that really the biggest complaint

537
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:41,560
Speaker 3: that you can make right now?

538
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 1: Right?

539
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:47,160
Speaker 4: I mean our sports bras alone, yes, are just as

540
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:51,840
Speaker 4: offensive to me sometimes, But anyway, why would you uh no,

541
00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:55,280
Speaker 4: in all of those statements. It really like, as much

542
00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:57,640
Speaker 4: as we want to tell that they were inclusive, they weren't.

543
00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:00,480
Speaker 1: And the amount of.

544
00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,720
Speaker 4: Hate that people will give in order to make a

545
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:07,479
Speaker 4: sleep again, we know that haters in general want to

546
00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 4: want to create controversy, so they would go out trying

547
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 4: to look for anything that they're like, this is controversial,

548
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:16,160
Speaker 4: this is this? Why does this have to be this

549
00:29:16,440 --> 00:29:18,960
Speaker 4: and half the time again it was misinformation or disinformation

550
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,680
Speaker 4: and being like, uh, this black product for the black

551
00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:25,840
Speaker 4: community was often created by white corporations.

552
00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:27,680
Speaker 1: Like we saw that many times.

553
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:32,880
Speaker 3: Absolutely absolutely so when Target announced their intention to pull

554
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 3: back from these initiatives, people were not happy. Some like

555
00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 3: Minneapolis Council Member Jason Chavez and Strike for All, which

556
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,320
Speaker 3: is an advocacy organization run by former Senator Nita Turner,

557
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,440
Speaker 3: called for a boycott of Target in response, which is

558
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 3: currently still going on. This was a little bit tricky

559
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:54,040
Speaker 3: in that Target backing away from DEI does not mean

560
00:29:54,120 --> 00:29:56,520
Speaker 3: that like black and brown owned companies are going to

561
00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 3: be you know, pulled from the shelves. And so you

562
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,200
Speaker 3: saw a lot of black creators and black entrepreneurs being like, well, wait,

563
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 3: if you boycott Target and you're not going to go

564
00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:07,160
Speaker 3: to Target, it will hurt us even more because that's

565
00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:10,160
Speaker 3: less people who are buying our items from the shelves.

566
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:13,640
Speaker 3: Maya Smith, who is a black woman and the founder

567
00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:17,320
Speaker 3: of the Dough the haircare brand, shared the statement on Instagram,

568
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,720
Speaker 3: saying pulling black dollars from these retailers doesn't hurt the

569
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 3: corporations as much as it hurts the brands you love.

570
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:26,040
Speaker 3: It also feeds into false narratives that we're only here

571
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 3: because of DEI initiatives, not because of the countless sacrifices

572
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 3: and creativity we've poured into creating a lasting impact on

573
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:36,960
Speaker 3: the textured hair category. Through the dough you might say like, oh, well,

574
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:40,440
Speaker 3: I'll just buy directly from this brand rather than buying

575
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:43,719
Speaker 3: it from Target. But Powell, the founder of Playpits That

576
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:47,640
Speaker 3: Kids deodorant company, said that buying directly online might not

577
00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 3: actually be so helpful for some of these black owned brands.

578
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:54,200
Speaker 3: She said, big box retailers are a predictable revenue stream.

579
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:57,320
Speaker 3: Online I might make two thousand dollars one day and

580
00:30:57,360 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 3: two hundred the XT but with Target, I have a

581
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,800
Speaker 3: consistent flow of income. It's also a convenient opportunity for

582
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:06,480
Speaker 3: my customers to shot my products. For moms, convenience is key,

583
00:31:07,360 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 3: and so I get where these creators are coming from.

584
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:13,760
Speaker 3: I do want a spotlight that one of my favorite

585
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:17,520
Speaker 3: black creators who has the brand Oh Happy Danny, immediately

586
00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:20,120
Speaker 3: announced that she was cutting ties with Target and like

587
00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:22,520
Speaker 3: phasing her stuff off the shelves as soon as Target

588
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 3: made this announcement.

589
00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:28,120
Speaker 5: But you know, I do understand the.

590
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:33,120
Speaker 3: Complexities here because it is not a clear cut situation,

591
00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 3: and I don't want to say that I have the answer,

592
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 3: but I understand that people want solidarity from some of

593
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:43,000
Speaker 3: these black creators that they see on the shelves at Target.

594
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 3: But I also understand that, hey, if you're a black

595
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 3: creator and a black entrepreneur, you do have a harder

596
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 3: time compared to your non black counterparts, right, And so

597
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:54,720
Speaker 3: you know, people are basically saying, like, well, why should

598
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 3: I be expected to miss out even more because of

599
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:58,160
Speaker 3: a decision that Target made.

600
00:31:58,200 --> 00:31:59,920
Speaker 5: I can really understand both Bosi.

601
00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 4: Right, It's one thing to say we're gonna boycott McDonald's

602
00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:08,760
Speaker 4: and Starbucks and the such, but doing specific things with

603
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:13,120
Speaker 4: these creators who have brands, it's it is hard. Like

604
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:15,120
Speaker 4: we talked about the fact that also it's really hard

605
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 4: for individuals in general, uh to try to figure out

606
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 4: what's a good company, because all these grocery stores or

607
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,160
Speaker 4: all these stores they have something, whether it's anti union,

608
00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:26,960
Speaker 4: whether they don't pay their employees enough, or whether they're

609
00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:30,200
Speaker 4: rolling back DEI, or whether they you know, gave to

610
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 4: the Republican Party or Donald Trump themselves. It's really hard

611
00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:38,760
Speaker 4: to try to do conscientious buying when you are stuck.

612
00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 4: And again, we talked about disabilities previously, about how it's

613
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:45,840
Speaker 4: also impossible, uh to not do delivery service for a

614
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 4: lot of disabled people, even though like corporations like Amazon

615
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 4: is awful, however they give access to those who can't

616
00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,960
Speaker 4: go well, Like, it's such a hard conversation about what

617
00:32:56,120 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 4: to do and how to truly support without hurting the

618
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 4: people you're t find a support.

619
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've really been struggling with this in my personal

620
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 3: life as well, Like I am trying to boycott Target

621
00:33:12,320 --> 00:33:16,880
Speaker 3: and Amazon. But you know, easy for me to say

622
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:21,800
Speaker 3: as an able bodied person with discretionary income and no kids, right, Like,

623
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:24,840
Speaker 3: if you're a busy new parent or somebody with a disability,

624
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:26,360
Speaker 3: I don't regard to you anything that you got to

625
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:28,040
Speaker 3: do to get through the day. But I know that

626
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 3: I personally do have some wiggle room, right, And so

627
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 3: what's been interesting to me is I'm I wouldn't say

628
00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:39,160
Speaker 3: I'm boycotting any particular company for any particular stance. However,

629
00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:43,240
Speaker 3: I'm really just reassessing the role that these companies play

630
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 3: in my habits more generally, right, Like Amazon is a

631
00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:50,800
Speaker 3: terrible company. They are terrible for the world in so

632
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:55,280
Speaker 3: many reasons. And Amazon's owner Jeff Bezos is incredibly buddy

633
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,160
Speaker 3: buddy with Trump. When Trump was inaugurated, you saw the

634
00:33:58,320 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 3: whole line of tech, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos. I live

635
00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:08,040
Speaker 3: in DC, Jeff Bezos owns Amazon. Jeff Bezos owns where

636
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:11,120
Speaker 3: I get my healthcare, one medical he bought that. Jeff

637
00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:14,640
Speaker 3: Bezos owns my local newspaper, The Washington Post. He owns that.

638
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,640
Speaker 3: Jeff Bezos owns where I do my grocery shopping, Whole Foods,

639
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 3: he owns that. Like how much of my life does

640
00:34:20,600 --> 00:34:24,839
Speaker 3: one billionaire get to control? And so it's not even

641
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:28,280
Speaker 3: about one specific policy, It's more that I am trying

642
00:34:28,320 --> 00:34:31,279
Speaker 3: to reject that entire dynamic. And one way that I'm

643
00:34:31,320 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 3: doing that on a small personal level is just trying

644
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:39,960
Speaker 3: to buy shop small, shop local, my local places when

645
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:42,719
Speaker 3: I can, and shop less in general, Like do I

646
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:45,320
Speaker 3: need to be consuming so much? Who is this supporting?

647
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:48,040
Speaker 3: Who am I empowering with my dollar when I go

648
00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 3: in and mindlessly buy something I don't even really need.

649
00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:53,960
Speaker 3: And so I don't think it has to be some

650
00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:58,399
Speaker 3: kind of a big boycott necessarily you can just through

651
00:34:58,480 --> 00:35:02,200
Speaker 3: small ways decide to know, I want to participate in

652
00:35:02,200 --> 00:35:03,960
Speaker 3: this kind of like an economy less and less, and

653
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:06,040
Speaker 3: I just think that's true for so many people.

654
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 4: Right, But yeah, we still have to keep in consideration

655
00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 4: and like as a whole who has the privilege to

656
00:35:12,360 --> 00:35:14,319
Speaker 4: do that? You know, we talked about you and I

657
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:18,880
Speaker 4: and Annie have reliable cars that can take us places.

658
00:35:19,360 --> 00:35:21,640
Speaker 4: I said, Annie has a dot dot dot because her

659
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 4: car's getting there.

660
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:29,760
Speaker 1: Annie questioned, Mark, her handa is still running. Not a sponsor.

661
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,359
Speaker 4: This is kind of going off topic, and I do

662
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,040
Speaker 4: want to ask what your thoughts are because I've seen

663
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 4: a few posts saying like February twenty eighth is a

664
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 4: blackout day where people being told don't buy anything, don't

665
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:55,000
Speaker 4: consume anything. Let that be the day that no one

666
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:57,719
Speaker 4: buys things. If you can, are those things like are

667
00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 4: those things effective? Does that do where one day a

668
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:03,040
Speaker 4: lot more people do not consume and so therefore like

669
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:05,919
Speaker 4: kind of make a dip in that day? Are things

670
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:09,319
Speaker 4: like that a viable way of protesting some of these

671
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:10,400
Speaker 4: evil corporations?

672
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 5: Oh?

673
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:12,640
Speaker 3: I think absolutely.

674
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:13,080
Speaker 5: So.

675
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:14,880
Speaker 3: It's funny that you bring this up because I was

676
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:19,760
Speaker 3: just reading a post on Reddit by that witchy lady

677
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:23,279
Speaker 3: was like three why's and they said the title of

678
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 3: the post is to those saying boycotts won't work. From

679
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:29,520
Speaker 3: a former retail worker, and they write, I keep seeing

680
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:32,439
Speaker 3: misinformation being spread to the tune of boycotts don't work,

681
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:34,399
Speaker 3: No one cares, They'll be back at Target and no time.

682
00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 3: I'm here to share my experience as a retail worker.

683
00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:38,960
Speaker 3: I've worked retail at four different chains, and I asked

684
00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:41,759
Speaker 3: with other retail workers chime in. They absolutely have the

685
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,760
Speaker 3: ability to work because these businesses care way more about

686
00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:47,640
Speaker 3: their numbers than the average consumer who has never worked

687
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:50,480
Speaker 3: retail realizes. When I was working for corporate owned women's

688
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:53,520
Speaker 3: clothing store, we could hourly updates about meeting our goals

689
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,920
Speaker 3: literally piped into our ears. Numbers got reported to the

690
00:36:56,920 --> 00:36:59,200
Speaker 3: team daily. Everyone knew when we were hitting our goals

691
00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:01,439
Speaker 3: and when we weren't. When we were pushed to sell, sell, sell,

692
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:04,040
Speaker 3: I was just a tiny little cog in the machine.

693
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 3: But if that's what's being said and pressured onto me,

694
00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,160
Speaker 3: imagine what these big wigs and their boardrooms are talking about.

695
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:12,080
Speaker 3: I think that the February twenty eight economic boycott has

696
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,480
Speaker 3: the power to scare them. Why because I saw my

697
00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:17,960
Speaker 3: direct managers upset over these numbers on an hourly basis.

698
00:37:18,239 --> 00:37:21,239
Speaker 3: Please join the economic boycott on February twenty eighth. You know,

699
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:23,480
Speaker 3: money talks, which is why they are trying so hard

700
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:25,400
Speaker 3: to tell you that it doesn't matter. They're doing it

701
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:29,880
Speaker 3: because it does matter. So that's just one retail worker's opinion.

702
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:31,720
Speaker 3: But I got to think that they're on the money

703
00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:35,439
Speaker 3: with something because you know, especially in a time where

704
00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 3: we don't feel like we have a lot of power

705
00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:39,160
Speaker 3: or a lot of agency or a lot of voice,

706
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:44,000
Speaker 3: our money, our spending power, our economic power really does

707
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 3: have weight. Like that is power.

708
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:46,880
Speaker 2: Right.

709
00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:49,799
Speaker 4: I'm glad you read that because I go back and

710
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 4: forth on again understanding what is effective on what isn't,

711
00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:56,640
Speaker 4: whether a boycott is or isn't effective, Who is able

712
00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 4: to do what and participate in who is being hurt

713
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 4: by some of these protests of cause I don't give

714
00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:05,080
Speaker 4: a about the corporation who know they're evil, I'm not

715
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 4: talking about them in general, but like again, like the

716
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 4: entrepreneurs who have products in these different companies that I've.

717
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:12,719
Speaker 1: Also seen them talk about Amazon, like.

718
00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:15,600
Speaker 4: That does help with cells, It gives me money, like

719
00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:18,799
Speaker 4: it gives us whatever ratings or whatnot, which again I'm

720
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:19,680
Speaker 4: not touting Amazon.

721
00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:21,560
Speaker 1: I've paused my membership and all of that. I've done

722
00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:22,360
Speaker 1: it because I.

723
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:24,200
Speaker 4: Was, like, I feel too dirty because I was depending

724
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:25,799
Speaker 4: on it so much, because I didn't want to go

725
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:28,880
Speaker 4: out to target and actually walk about and see people.

726
00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 4: But all of that in conversation of like, if this

727
00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 4: does work, then we need to be shouting it louder,

728
00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:39,279
Speaker 4: because yeah, we want to at least be effective and

729
00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:43,160
Speaker 4: doing the things as effectively as possible if we are

730
00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:45,920
Speaker 4: able to do so, and being prepared for it. And honestly,

731
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,399
Speaker 4: outside of a couple of TikTok posts, I haven't seen

732
00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 4: much about it.

733
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:56,080
Speaker 3: Have y'all the economic blockout? Yeah I have, But I

734
00:38:56,120 --> 00:38:58,879
Speaker 3: am like pretty deep into a lot of like buy

735
00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:03,360
Speaker 3: nothing jam the cogs of capitalism in these small ways

736
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 3: online spaces. But I guess I'm curious if my friends

737
00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:09,720
Speaker 3: who were like not in those spaces, if they're seeing

738
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:11,560
Speaker 3: any of it at all. People listening might be like,

739
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:13,680
Speaker 3: there's an economic boycott on February twenty.

740
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:14,160
Speaker 5: Eighth being planned.

741
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:16,319
Speaker 2: I've never heard of it.

742
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 1: You haven't, So that's the question is, like how widely.

743
00:39:20,280 --> 00:39:23,840
Speaker 4: Is it being spread? Hey, y'all, there's an economic blackout

744
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:26,160
Speaker 4: on the twenty eighth of February. If you're listening to

745
00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:31,520
Speaker 4: this on the day is released, Yeah, the part we're podcasts.

746
00:39:31,520 --> 00:39:32,680
Speaker 4: I don't know when this is going to be.

747
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:34,960
Speaker 3: So here's a little bit of information I just found. So,

748
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:38,200
Speaker 3: according to CBS, behind the boycott as a group called

749
00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:42,360
Speaker 3: the People's Union USA, a self described grassroots organization founded

750
00:39:42,360 --> 00:39:45,400
Speaker 3: by John Schwartz, a fifty seven year old dad from Queens,

751
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 3: New York, who said that he's been promoting the consumer

752
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,520
Speaker 3: blackout for weeks on social media. The People's Union says

753
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 3: it has no political affiliation, but focuses on quote fairness,

754
00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:57,320
Speaker 3: economic justice, and real systemic change. So the call to action,

755
00:39:57,680 --> 00:40:01,440
Speaker 3: or rather in action, is asking that American consumers refrain

756
00:40:01,520 --> 00:40:04,840
Speaker 3: from making any purchases at major retailers on Friday, February

757
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 3: twenty eighth. The protest comes as people continue to endure

758
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,560
Speaker 3: rising prices on everything from food to gas, to housing

759
00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:13,640
Speaker 3: and new utilities, epitomized by the soaring cost of eggs,

760
00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:16,640
Speaker 3: which in January averaged four to ninety five a dozen.

761
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 5: So, yeah, that is the information. If you're interested in participating.

762
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:23,239
Speaker 3: You can go online and find out more, but I

763
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:27,160
Speaker 3: understand because like again, like it for me, it's really

764
00:40:27,160 --> 00:40:31,680
Speaker 3: not about any one policy or store. It's like I

765
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:35,240
Speaker 3: do not want to continue to participate in an economic

766
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:39,319
Speaker 3: system that just continues to exploit me. And I understand that,

767
00:40:39,400 --> 00:40:41,319
Speaker 3: Like we're in capitalism, so what am I gonna do?

768
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:44,279
Speaker 3: But like I can do in small ways, I can

769
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:46,719
Speaker 3: opt out of that system more and more, like I've

770
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 3: been really you know, it's it sounds so small and stupid,

771
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:53,600
Speaker 3: and in some ways I understand that it is. But

772
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:56,839
Speaker 3: like I've been growing herbs on my balcony, so when

773
00:40:56,840 --> 00:40:59,120
Speaker 3: I need fresh herbs, I'm not running to Target. I

774
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:01,640
Speaker 3: just have them on my balcony. I've been cooking more

775
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:03,799
Speaker 3: at home. I've been like, rather than going on and

776
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,080
Speaker 3: buying new stuff, I'm like using free groups and like

777
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 3: you know things like that, of like I just want

778
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 3: to participate in this economy less and less because it

779
00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:17,160
Speaker 3: is just so exploitative, right, And just.

780
00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 4: Coming back on track onto all the information that you

781
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 4: are bringing us, like this is that conversation once again

782
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:26,359
Speaker 4: when I come back in the confused era of like

783
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:29,479
Speaker 4: DEI and why it's so offensive to people and why

784
00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:32,359
Speaker 4: they think is so harmful when in actuality it's not.

785
00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 3: Well, you know who definitely doesn't find it harmful, and

786
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:41,960
Speaker 3: that's Costco. So the same climate that had companies like

787
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:45,880
Speaker 3: Target abandoning their DEI initiatives and their inclusion work so quickly,

788
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:49,279
Speaker 3: Costco exists in that same environment and guess what, they

789
00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 3: didn't cave on anything.

790
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:51,440
Speaker 5: So to be.

791
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 3: Super clear, I know I've said this before, but DEI

792
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:56,560
Speaker 3: and inclusion is not just like the right thing to do.

793
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 3: It is profitable. It makes companies money, you know, just

794
00:42:00,120 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 3: like that Target executive saying that supporting inclusion in twenty

795
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,680
Speaker 3: twenty made the company money. Being able to cast a

796
00:42:05,719 --> 00:42:08,000
Speaker 3: wide net when you're doing things like hiring and being

797
00:42:08,040 --> 00:42:10,640
Speaker 3: able to attract all different kinds of people who want

798
00:42:10,640 --> 00:42:13,840
Speaker 3: to spend money with your brand is good business. So

799
00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 3: Costco got approached by the Trump administration and was trying

800
00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:21,880
Speaker 3: to be They were trying to pressure Costco into dropping

801
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:24,279
Speaker 3: their DEI programs, and Costco basically was like, no, our

802
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:28,920
Speaker 3: programs are fine, y'all can kick rocks. Nineteen attorneys general

803
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 3: led by Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton, which by the way,

804
00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:35,279
Speaker 3: he's a real piece of work. Google him if you've

805
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:37,040
Speaker 3: got a Sabera minut, because he's a real piece of work.

806
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:41,200
Speaker 3: And Iowa Attorney General Brenna BirdAir are currently trying to

807
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:44,920
Speaker 3: pressure Costco into abandoning their DEI initiatives. They sent Costco

808
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 3: a letter saying, with three hundred thousand employees, Costco likely

809
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 3: has at least two hundred thousand employees who are potentially

810
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:54,400
Speaker 3: victims of a legal discrimination because they are white, Asian

811
00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:56,640
Speaker 3: mail or straight. Even if only a fraction of those

812
00:42:56,640 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 3: employees were to file suit and only some of these

813
00:42:58,960 --> 00:43:01,920
Speaker 3: proof successful, the cost to Costco could be tens of

814
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:05,680
Speaker 3: billions of dollars. So that's like pretty clearly a threat

815
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:11,880
Speaker 3: to essentially extort Costco. Costco's board's response was, our board

816
00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:14,279
Speaker 3: has considered this proposal and believe that our commitment to

817
00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:18,040
Speaker 3: an enterprise rooted in respect and inclusion is appropriate and necessary.

818
00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:21,360
Speaker 3: The report requested by this proposal would not provide meaningful

819
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:24,960
Speaker 3: additional information to our shareholders, and the board thus unanimously

820
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:27,520
Speaker 3: recommends a vote against this proposal.

821
00:43:30,880 --> 00:43:33,200
Speaker 4: First of all, I hate that they included as but

822
00:43:33,200 --> 00:43:35,680
Speaker 4: I know they do, but like I'm still like, ah,

823
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 4: it's not that. But all these things I will say

824
00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 4: on a good note because there was a moment where

825
00:43:41,080 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 4: I was iffy with Costco for a split second. I

826
00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:45,960
Speaker 4: was like, I can't go nowhere because there had an

827
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:51,040
Speaker 4: almost union strike. However, before it could go down, Costco

828
00:43:51,560 --> 00:43:55,040
Speaker 4: followed the lead and actually worked with the unionized members

829
00:43:55,160 --> 00:43:57,080
Speaker 4: and gave them the raises that they deserved.

830
00:43:57,280 --> 00:43:59,200
Speaker 1: So kudos. It worked out.

831
00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:01,560
Speaker 4: It took a little pressuring, but I'm glad to know

832
00:44:01,640 --> 00:44:05,800
Speaker 4: that they're not anti union, so that is a plus

833
00:44:05,800 --> 00:44:07,759
Speaker 4: BT dubs, because that's one of the big questions. Like

834
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:10,239
Speaker 4: the last five years, I feel like I've just seen

835
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:14,000
Speaker 4: more and more conversations about whether it's DEI or it's

836
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:15,759
Speaker 4: anti union, and I'm like, why do you have to

837
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 4: be so mean to your people's But like seeing that

838
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:21,760
Speaker 4: they were able to actually be on top of it

839
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:24,080
Speaker 4: is nice, nicest, not on top of it, but finally

840
00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:28,640
Speaker 4: like understanding everything from every aspect. It felt like, Okay,

841
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:31,440
Speaker 4: maybe I need to buy a freezer from them so

842
00:44:31,480 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 4: I can store the large amounts of food that they sell.

843
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:38,560
Speaker 3: I mean, I find there one dollar fifty cents hot

844
00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:42,000
Speaker 3: dogs delightful and my late father rest his soul. He

845
00:44:42,560 --> 00:44:44,640
Speaker 3: loved to brag about how you could return anything to

846
00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:47,160
Speaker 3: Costco for cash no matter what. He was like a

847
00:44:47,640 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 3: real abuser of that policy.

848
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:52,440
Speaker 1: You know what I do, what you gotta do.

849
00:44:53,400 --> 00:44:55,520
Speaker 3: And you know, am I saying this because I think

850
00:44:55,520 --> 00:44:59,480
Speaker 3: that like Costco is some like idealist crusader. Ally I'm

851
00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:02,000
Speaker 3: sure they're vorable in a million other ways, But I

852
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:05,680
Speaker 3: think that they are a company that likes making money,

853
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:08,000
Speaker 3: and they have done the math and they have probably

854
00:45:08,040 --> 00:45:12,840
Speaker 3: realized that their DEI and inclusion policies help them make money.

855
00:45:13,120 --> 00:45:14,920
Speaker 3: And it seems like, honestly, I have to say like,

856
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:19,279
Speaker 3: it does seem like Target is experiencing some financial consequences here.

857
00:45:19,640 --> 00:45:22,919
Speaker 3: To be clear, retail shopping is down generally in part

858
00:45:22,920 --> 00:45:25,600
Speaker 3: I think because of things like inflation and rising prices

859
00:45:25,640 --> 00:45:30,040
Speaker 3: and economic uncertainty and like changing consumer habits. But Target

860
00:45:30,040 --> 00:45:33,360
Speaker 3: and Walmart both saw their retail numbers fall in the

861
00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:37,479
Speaker 3: wake of pulling their DEI initiatives, while Costco did not. Again,

862
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 3: I don't specifically know if this is because of the

863
00:45:39,520 --> 00:45:42,560
Speaker 3: boycott or because of DEI, but this is according to

864
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:46,320
Speaker 3: retail brew foot traffic is down at Target stores. According

865
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:49,359
Speaker 3: to data from placer Ai prepared exclusively for retail brew

866
00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:52,400
Speaker 3: In the week that began January twenty seven, foot traffic

867
00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:56,120
Speaker 3: fell four percent, then fell eight point six percent the

868
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,120
Speaker 3: week beginning February third, and three point nine percent the

869
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:01,719
Speaker 3: week beginning February tenth. This was the first drop in

870
00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:04,360
Speaker 3: traffic this year for Target, with foot traffic for the

871
00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:06,960
Speaker 3: first four weeks of twenty twenty five up between five

872
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:08,680
Speaker 3: percent and eleven point eight percent.

873
00:46:09,080 --> 00:46:14,280
Speaker 5: Walmart was the same. Meanwhile, Costco has seen traffic rise

874
00:46:14,400 --> 00:46:16,719
Speaker 5: for the same three week period, up by five point

875
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:19,480
Speaker 5: eight percent on the week beginning January twenty seven, five

876
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:21,759
Speaker 5: point seven percent on the week beginning February third, and

877
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:24,760
Speaker 5: four point six percent on the week beginning February tenth.

878
00:46:25,160 --> 00:46:29,640
Speaker 5: So is this the result of like people boycotting Target,

879
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:32,200
Speaker 5: not going to Target, you know, not wanting to shop

880
00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:33,920
Speaker 5: at places that have these kinds of policies.

881
00:46:34,360 --> 00:46:34,839
Speaker 3: I don't know.

882
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 5: But what I do know is that women have money.

883
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:42,799
Speaker 3: In fact, most financial decisions being made in households are

884
00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:46,080
Speaker 3: being made by women. Black people have money, Queer people

885
00:46:46,160 --> 00:46:49,120
Speaker 3: have money, trans people have money. We spend money. We

886
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 3: have real economic power. And I think all of us

887
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:54,560
Speaker 3: really have to understand that. And like understand what that means,

888
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:58,160
Speaker 3: that it matters where we put our money, it matters

889
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 3: who we choose to financially support, and like, and I

890
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:04,520
Speaker 3: agree with that person's comment on Reddit that like the

891
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:06,560
Speaker 3: fact that they keep trying to convince us that it's

892
00:47:06,640 --> 00:47:08,799
Speaker 3: not powerful, it doesn't matter, should be a signal to

893
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:10,000
Speaker 3: all of us that it actually does.

894
00:47:11,239 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're right, with all the misinformation and disinformation that

895
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:18,040
Speaker 4: we get, it wouldn't be surprising that corporate people would

896
00:47:18,080 --> 00:47:19,800
Speaker 4: want us to think this doesn't work so that we

897
00:47:19,840 --> 00:47:21,240
Speaker 4: would stop doing it.

898
00:47:22,560 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 3: Exactly.

899
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:28,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, like, no, I you haven't hurt me at all,

900
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:37,200
Speaker 2: And secretly they're getting those numbers. Oh no, Yeah, Yeah,

901
00:47:37,480 --> 00:47:40,440
Speaker 2: it'll be interesting to see what happens. And I know,

902
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:45,040
Speaker 2: I know for a lot of us, US and our listeners,

903
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:47,560
Speaker 2: it is something that we're all wrestling with these ways

904
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:52,839
Speaker 2: we can make these changes in this system, and there's

905
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:55,400
Speaker 2: so many different factors to it. But yeah, I definitely

906
00:47:55,400 --> 00:47:57,719
Speaker 2: where you put your money and who you choose to

907
00:47:57,920 --> 00:48:01,000
Speaker 2: support with your money, that's a big one. That's a

908
00:48:01,040 --> 00:48:02,760
Speaker 2: big one, very.

909
00:48:02,600 --> 00:48:07,120
Speaker 3: Important, especially now like this is the tapic And again

910
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:09,000
Speaker 3: just I think I've said this, but I want to

911
00:48:09,000 --> 00:48:11,520
Speaker 3: pay it clearly, like easy for me to say, I

912
00:48:11,560 --> 00:48:13,839
Speaker 3: am a I'm not a parent. I live in an

913
00:48:13,880 --> 00:48:18,040
Speaker 3: easily walkable community, you know, I am able bodied, like

914
00:48:18,120 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 3: easy for me to say. But like if you're someone

915
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:22,480
Speaker 3: for who that is the case, you can, you can,

916
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:25,120
Speaker 3: you know, be choosy about how and where you spend

917
00:48:25,160 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 3: your money. Not everybody has that luxury. And if you

918
00:48:27,239 --> 00:48:29,759
Speaker 3: are somebody who's listening who does, that's great, Like we

919
00:48:29,800 --> 00:48:32,200
Speaker 3: should be the people who are making those kinds of decisions.

920
00:48:33,360 --> 00:48:39,440
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, well, thank you so much, Bridget. We're so

921
00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:42,080
Speaker 2: happy to have you back on. It was so good

922
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:45,360
Speaker 2: to talk with you. Where can the good listeners find you?

923
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:49,279
Speaker 3: Ah, this has been a pleasure. I miss shooting the

924
00:48:49,480 --> 00:48:53,480
Speaker 3: s with you all. And if you want to shoot

925
00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:55,400
Speaker 3: the s with me, you can listen to my podcast

926
00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:57,239
Speaker 3: or our girls on the internet or follow me on

927
00:48:57,280 --> 00:48:58,600
Speaker 3: Instagram at Bridget Marie and DC.

928
00:48:59,440 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 2: Yes, yes and go do that listeners, And if you

929
00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:05,680
Speaker 2: would like to contact us you can you can email

930
00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:07,880
Speaker 2: us at hello at Stuffwenever Told You dot com. You

931
00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:09,840
Speaker 2: can find us on Blue Sky at mom Stuff podcast,

932
00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:12,040
Speaker 2: or in Instagram and TikTok at stuff w Never Told You.

933
00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:14,239
Speaker 2: We're also on YouTube we have tea public store, and

934
00:49:14,280 --> 00:49:15,520
Speaker 2: we have a book you can get wherever you get

935
00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:17,760
Speaker 2: your books. Thanks as always to you our super producer Coustenior,

936
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:19,760
Speaker 2: Exective Producer Maya and your contributor Joey.

937
00:49:19,840 --> 00:49:20,239
Speaker 1: Thank you.

938
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:22,239
Speaker 2: Thanks to you for listening stuff I never told you

939
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:23,759
Speaker 2: the production of My Heart Radio. For more podcast from

940
00:49:23,760 --> 00:49:25,160
Speaker 2: my Heart Radio, you can check out the iHeart Radio

941
00:49:25,200 --> 00:49:27,239
Speaker 2: Appple podcasts wherever you listen to your favorite ship.