1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,160 Speaker 1: I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing, 2 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: the oldest known recording of the country's oldest orchestra, the 3 00:00:15,560 --> 00:00:23,639 Speaker 1: New York Philharmonic. I'm no outside observer when it comes 4 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:26,360 Speaker 1: to the film. I'm on the board. I think it's 5 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:28,920 Speaker 1: central to the life of this city, and I believe 6 00:00:28,920 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 1: that today's guest has positioned it better than ever for 7 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 1: the challenging years ahead. When Alan Gilbert took over as 8 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:39,440 Speaker 1: conductor and music director in two thousand nine, he knew 9 00:00:39,479 --> 00:00:42,440 Speaker 1: the line he had to walk. Be new enough to 10 00:00:42,479 --> 00:01:08,120 Speaker 1: stay vital, traditional enough to stay solvent. A familiar Stravinsky 11 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 1: tour to Force, for example, tends to sell many more 12 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 1: tickets than a piece by a living composer. Frequent concert goers, 13 00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 1: after all, average sixty years old. Almost one third say 14 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:25,199 Speaker 1: they'd go less often if programs included more contemporary music. 15 00:01:25,880 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 1: If anyone could thread that needle, it was Gilbert, the 16 00:01:28,959 --> 00:01:33,000 Speaker 1: son of two former New York philm violinists. He'd literally 17 00:01:33,080 --> 00:01:36,480 Speaker 1: grown up with the institution, but his heart beats to 18 00:01:36,680 --> 00:02:00,360 Speaker 1: newer edgy or music that's legram macabre. Gilbert's first big 19 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:03,560 Speaker 1: project with the philm it was a hit, sold out 20 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:07,840 Speaker 1: the entire run huge reviews. He showed it was possible 21 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 1: the Philharmonic can evolve and triumph, but some of his 22 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:17,639 Speaker 1: later modern programs met with smaller crowds and internal opposition. 23 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: Last year, Gilbert announced he was phasing himself out of 24 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 1: the job. Directing an ensemble as technically perfect as the 25 00:02:25,840 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 1: philm poses at least one unexpected challenge. In a way, 26 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:32,800 Speaker 1: I would almost say that it's to keep them from 27 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:36,920 Speaker 1: being too professional to remember how how it feels to 28 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:39,920 Speaker 1: share the experience of playing music together, as if it 29 00:02:39,960 --> 00:02:41,840 Speaker 1: were the first time. I remember the first time I 30 00:02:41,840 --> 00:02:45,720 Speaker 1: played in an orchestra. It must have been dreadful. It 31 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:47,679 Speaker 1: was the Juilliard Pre College Orchestra and I was the 32 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:50,520 Speaker 1: last chair of second violinist. I just squeaked into the 33 00:02:50,520 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 1: best orchestra in pre College, and we were reading Bram's 34 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 1: Third Symphony for the first time. And it's one of 35 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:59,360 Speaker 1: the hardest pieces to play, and and it had to 36 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 1: have sounded, you know, wretched at this first reading, but 37 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: I was so thrilled. It was so exciting to hear 38 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:08,799 Speaker 1: the entire group playing the same piece, and I thought 39 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 1: it was probably the greatest thing that it ever happened, 40 00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:13,760 Speaker 1: as you know, in the history of orchestras, and that 41 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:18,840 Speaker 1: sense of enthusiasm and discovery and freshness is um is 42 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:21,840 Speaker 1: difficult to preserve. The schedule that the New York Philharmonic 43 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 1: maintains is just ridiculous. Do you recommendly do less, absolutely 44 00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:30,600 Speaker 1: less music, more time, more time off. It's kind of 45 00:03:30,639 --> 00:03:33,919 Speaker 1: like being on a hamster wheel um that just keeps 46 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:36,160 Speaker 1: keeps going on and on. And I've said this many 47 00:03:36,160 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 1: times and I really believe it. New York is the 48 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: toughest music market in the world and has a constant 49 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: parade of the greatest orchestras coming through and the next 50 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 1: greatest orchestras coming through, all bringing their a game. People 51 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 1: don't play in New York on tour unless they have 52 00:03:53,800 --> 00:03:56,040 Speaker 1: prepared as well as they possibly can. They play in 53 00:03:56,080 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 1: their programs, they try them in different venues. Finally they're 54 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 1: ready for the big time in New York. They play 55 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 1: in New York and they and they tried to knock 56 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:04,560 Speaker 1: it out of the park. The New York Philharmonic plays 57 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:09,880 Speaker 1: every week in New York normal for rehearsal, schedule, new 58 00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 1: program next week for rehearsals, new program. I guarantee you. 59 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:16,719 Speaker 1: If we gave the New York Philharmonic schedule book to 60 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:18,840 Speaker 1: any other orchestra in the world and say, okay, you 61 00:04:18,880 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 1: play this, people's perceptions of the relative merits of orchestras 62 00:04:23,839 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 1: would would shift. I mean, if you can achieve something 63 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:28,919 Speaker 1: incredibly artistic after a lot of hard, hard work, great 64 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:31,240 Speaker 1: more power to you. But the fact is that the 65 00:04:31,279 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 1: New York Philharmonic is playing under a much more challenging circumstances. 66 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 1: Why why is the Philharmonic so extensive? Why there are 67 00:04:38,160 --> 00:04:41,159 Speaker 1: a lot of challenges that are just inherent in the 68 00:04:41,240 --> 00:04:46,800 Speaker 1: in the situation that surrounds the New York Philharmonic. There's there, um, 69 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:50,800 Speaker 1: you know, their demands to generate revenue, to always have 70 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 1: ticket sales, and they're fixed costs that are are being 71 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:58,839 Speaker 1: paid all the time, whether or not the orchestra play 72 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 1: space of this space, and for the musicians themselves, and 73 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:08,000 Speaker 1: and and um it's I guess efficiency. You know, I'm 74 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:11,200 Speaker 1: not in the business office. Uh, you know, thankfully for 75 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:14,120 Speaker 1: you know, everyone involved. But um, but the fact is 76 00:05:14,200 --> 00:05:15,760 Speaker 1: that people look at the schedule and say, oh, look 77 00:05:15,800 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 1: at this law. We could do another concert here, So 78 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:19,479 Speaker 1: you know, let's see maybe this is the place we 79 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 1: could do a benefit concert, or maybe if we have 80 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 1: we have one rehearsal and one concert, what can we 81 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 1: do with one rehearsal one concert? And the idea is to, 82 00:05:26,520 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 1: you know, to use the orchestra to the extent possible 83 00:05:31,120 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 1: allowed by the contract. And when that kind of thinking starts, 84 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 1: to to forget to take over. But even creep in Um, 85 00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 1: the artistic health of the orchestra and the sort of 86 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:47,360 Speaker 1: call it esthetic integrity of the musicians is not the 87 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:49,680 Speaker 1: first These are not the first things that are being considered. 88 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 1: The number of notes that they played. We did dust 89 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:54,720 Speaker 1: Rheingold Complete. I mean, that's just like ridiculous. It's two 90 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 1: and a half hours of incredibly hard music. And then 91 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 1: we did Moller's Seventh Symphony, which is like unbelievable, be difficult. 92 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:04,839 Speaker 1: And then we just jumped immediately into Um into the 93 00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 1: Parks program, which is also hard. Divorce a New World 94 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:11,159 Speaker 1: and symphonic dances from West Side Story sounds easy when 95 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:12,920 Speaker 1: the sourcier plays it. It's one of the hardest pieces 96 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:15,320 Speaker 1: to play. Gershwin in American in Paris, and we also 97 00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:17,320 Speaker 1: had a concert up at St. John the Divine for 98 00:06:17,520 --> 00:06:20,480 Speaker 1: Memorial Day mall or fourth Symphony thrown in. I mean 99 00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 1: it's it's it's yeah, it's hard now. Um obviously, um, 100 00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:28,920 Speaker 1: everybody knows your story, first native New Yorker to lead 101 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: the orchestra, and your family and your mom and dad 102 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 1: being the orchestra, you being the little kid with the 103 00:06:35,240 --> 00:06:39,159 Speaker 1: banning everybody's passports. Go ahead, No, no, no, it's just 104 00:06:39,240 --> 00:06:42,880 Speaker 1: I've just fond memories when I when I think back, 105 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:45,599 Speaker 1: I knew everybody in the orkstra and you everybody's name, 106 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:48,919 Speaker 1: and uh, I remember sitting on the plane. Do you 107 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:53,320 Speaker 1: remember Mattel Electronics Football? That was like the first video game, 108 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:55,559 Speaker 1: and it was like these little red blips that didn't 109 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 1: even move, but the next one would light up as 110 00:06:57,279 --> 00:07:00,919 Speaker 1: the ball went and stuff. It was certain, by today's standards, 111 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: unbelievably rudimentary, but I love that game, and so did 112 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,680 Speaker 1: Roland coll Off. He was the principal timpanist, so he 113 00:07:06,839 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 1: we would play this game together and then later on 114 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:11,960 Speaker 1: it became the Rubik's Cube, and and uh, you know, 115 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: I would hang out with with the orchestra, and it's 116 00:07:14,120 --> 00:07:16,560 Speaker 1: amazing to think that it's come to this. You started 117 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:21,320 Speaker 1: playing an instrument, you were how old. Um, I always 118 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 1: had a violin Um from the time I was really 119 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 1: really little. West or other people. Well, you know, we 120 00:07:29,160 --> 00:07:33,760 Speaker 1: have a kind of violent, happy family. Um. My parents 121 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 1: were both are both violinists, and my father's father was 122 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 1: a violinist, and and his brother is a horn player, 123 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 1: but he also studied the violin, and his sister as 124 00:07:44,400 --> 00:07:46,600 Speaker 1: a pianist, but she also studied the violin. And my 125 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 1: sister is a violinist. It's a bit let's not even 126 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:51,960 Speaker 1: get into it. It's you know, it's it's. It is 127 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:56,880 Speaker 1: what it is. But I did not want it. I mean, 128 00:07:56,920 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 1: kids don't just take up an instrument for the most 129 00:07:59,560 --> 00:08:03,320 Speaker 1: part when they're really little, unless their parents try to 130 00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:07,800 Speaker 1: try to set up something. But it's it's. Um. I 131 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 1: think it's cuts both ways. It's certainly helpful, and I 132 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 1: think it's served me very well to have come from 133 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:15,880 Speaker 1: a musical family and to have been around the world 134 00:08:15,920 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 1: that I actually inhabit full time now. But that was 135 00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 1: that was what I knew growing up. But if you 136 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: are self motivated and have to do it on your own, 137 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: that also can lead to a certain kind of strength. 138 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:28,720 Speaker 1: When did you understand that you were good, that you 139 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 1: could really really play. How old we when someone said 140 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 1: to you, you really good? You know. I went to 141 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 1: Juilliard pre college. Certainly they were more dazzling violinists around, 142 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 1: so I never thought I was one of the best. 143 00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:43,200 Speaker 1: But I could play, and and I knew that, you know, 144 00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:46,480 Speaker 1: if I wanted to, I could become a professional violinist. 145 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 1: That was something that, yeah, I knew I was good 146 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:52,120 Speaker 1: enough to earn a living. And the one difference I've 147 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:55,360 Speaker 1: noticed more than anything with between people who come from 148 00:08:55,400 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 1: musical families and people who come from families in which 149 00:08:57,679 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 1: nobody is a musician is many of those people are 150 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:05,079 Speaker 1: told by their parents, Oh, it's a it's a risky profession. 151 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,000 Speaker 1: You know, you should go into something that's more secure, 152 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 1: more where you know, income is more guaranteed, you know, 153 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:14,560 Speaker 1: don't you know They imagine the life of bohemian musician 154 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:17,280 Speaker 1: who's you know, scraping to get by just from day 155 00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 1: to day. I never once doubted that I could make 156 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:25,840 Speaker 1: a living, at least to get by as a musician, 157 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:27,760 Speaker 1: because I saw what my parents didn't. It just didn't 158 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:31,080 Speaker 1: occur to me that music wasn't a viable profession. If 159 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:33,440 Speaker 1: you see what I mean, to Fields. Well, I went 160 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 1: to Fieldston, but Juilliard pre College was a Saturday weekend program. Um. 161 00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:39,920 Speaker 1: So when you leave Fieldston, where do you go? I 162 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:46,560 Speaker 1: went to Harvard I um, um, not no, not, I 163 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:49,040 Speaker 1: just went for Harvard. I you know, I wanted to 164 00:09:49,040 --> 00:09:51,640 Speaker 1: go and I thought it would be an exciting place 165 00:09:51,679 --> 00:09:54,200 Speaker 1: to be. And it was because there there are a 166 00:09:54,200 --> 00:09:57,400 Speaker 1: lot of very passionate people who were you know, whatever 167 00:09:57,480 --> 00:10:00,120 Speaker 1: they're doing, they're doing it because they're really interested and 168 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:02,600 Speaker 1: in you. The conversations you would hear at the in 169 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:07,800 Speaker 1: the dining room were about anything, you know, ranging well, 170 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,840 Speaker 1: I was. I finally graduated as a music concentrator, but 171 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:15,920 Speaker 1: that was more convenience than than the fact that it 172 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:17,839 Speaker 1: was really what I wanted to study. At Harvard, I 173 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:22,400 Speaker 1: did get a good education in music theory and composition 174 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:25,600 Speaker 1: and history and things like that. Um, it's almost not 175 00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: at all performance at Harvard. Um. You know, people would 176 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:33,000 Speaker 1: joke with a certain degree of accuracy that at Harvard 177 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:36,319 Speaker 1: music was meant to be um seen and not heard. 178 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: But I was also studying violent and we organized many concerts. 179 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 1: But I was what I really was interested in was 180 00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:47,679 Speaker 1: English and poetry, and I took as many courses in 181 00:10:47,679 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 1: in in those subjects as I could. Finally, since I 182 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:54,440 Speaker 1: was just because of the distribution and because I was 183 00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:56,840 Speaker 1: pretty lazy student, actually, it just made more sense to 184 00:10:56,840 --> 00:11:01,400 Speaker 1: graduate as a as a music concentrator. Curtis exactly right. 185 00:11:01,600 --> 00:11:04,199 Speaker 1: And all this time you're still performing, You're still playing 186 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:07,199 Speaker 1: the violin, and you have a sense at some point 187 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:09,319 Speaker 1: that you you said that, you know, although you knew 188 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:11,160 Speaker 1: you could make a living at him and get a 189 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:14,440 Speaker 1: seat at some ensemble around the world, that you knew 190 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:19,599 Speaker 1: you weren't the greatest wind does conducting enter the conversation? 191 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:23,960 Speaker 1: My dad is a good conductor, and um, you shouldn't 192 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:27,560 Speaker 1: get the idea that he was this kind of fierce, 193 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:31,800 Speaker 1: you know, tiger dad, you know, compelling me to pursue conducting, 194 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:33,560 Speaker 1: because it wasn't like that at all. But he did 195 00:11:33,640 --> 00:11:36,640 Speaker 1: show me certain basics of conducting technique, the patterns of 196 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:39,120 Speaker 1: moving your arms for beating four and in three, and 197 00:11:39,160 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 1: how to start beethoven Fifth Symphony, which is a challenging 198 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:44,600 Speaker 1: start because it starts with the rest. There's the first 199 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:48,440 Speaker 1: impulses of silence, you know, pop up up that there's 200 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:51,200 Speaker 1: a impulse. That's a tricky thing to conduct actually, even 201 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 1: though it's you know, the iconic moment in music UM, 202 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:56,720 Speaker 1: so I had some sense of what conducting was about. 203 00:11:56,800 --> 00:11:58,599 Speaker 1: And when I was in pre College, because I was 204 00:11:58,640 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 1: the concertmaster in my senior year UM, there were rehearsals 205 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:07,400 Speaker 1: that uh, the conductor asked me to take over, so 206 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:10,920 Speaker 1: I did string sectionals conducting the orchestra. It was kind 207 00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:13,120 Speaker 1: of lucky the way I first actually student. At the 208 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:15,839 Speaker 1: time I first stood in front of an orchestra, there 209 00:12:15,880 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 1: was a guest conductor for one of the programs at 210 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:20,720 Speaker 1: the Pre College orchestra did and it was conducted by 211 00:12:20,720 --> 00:12:25,319 Speaker 1: a guy by the name of Ronald Bronstein. And because 212 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:29,720 Speaker 1: of scheduling issues or for whatever reason, the next rehearsal 213 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:32,600 Speaker 1: after his concert, in other words, the first rehearsal of 214 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 1: the next cycle for the next for the next program 215 00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 1: was going to be conducted by our regular conductor, Roger 216 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:42,720 Speaker 1: Nirenberg Um, but he couldn't get back for that one rehearsal. 217 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:48,400 Speaker 1: So Ronald Um, instead of starting to rehearse Rogers program, 218 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:50,800 Speaker 1: decided to give some of the students in the orchestra 219 00:12:50,880 --> 00:12:54,400 Speaker 1: the chance to conduct. And it happened that my sister 220 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:57,960 Speaker 1: was walking down Broadway and ran into him and he 221 00:12:58,080 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: told her what he was planning to She was all 222 00:13:00,040 --> 00:13:02,839 Speaker 1: in the orchestra and um, she said, oh, I bet 223 00:13:02,880 --> 00:13:06,160 Speaker 1: my brother would be interested in that. Just this is 224 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 1: your Bernstein Carnegie Hall moment, well in a way, on 225 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:13,319 Speaker 1: an incredibly small scale, and uh, you know, I gave 226 00:13:13,400 --> 00:13:15,640 Speaker 1: him a call and he said, yeah, okay, you're lucky. 227 00:13:15,640 --> 00:13:17,760 Speaker 1: There's one more slot you can prepare the first moment 228 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:21,000 Speaker 1: of Divortox six Symphony. And I worked with my dad 229 00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 1: for two or three days and I had my moment 230 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:27,000 Speaker 1: in front of the orchestra and it was completely new 231 00:13:27,000 --> 00:13:33,240 Speaker 1: and completely terrifying. And after that, you know, sometimes these 232 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:36,760 Speaker 1: first moments with with a new experience are so crucial 233 00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:39,720 Speaker 1: and they really determine the direction that you end up going. 234 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 1: Could either go, you know, one direction, or if it doesn't, 235 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 1: if the experience is negative or difficult or scary in 236 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 1: the wrong way, you end up completely giving up. But 237 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:53,120 Speaker 1: he said something to me after, and I don't know, 238 00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 1: I'm sure it was hyperbole or just kind of he 239 00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:57,559 Speaker 1: was throwing words around, and he said, you know, if 240 00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,720 Speaker 1: I had my way, I'd kick out the entire class 241 00:13:59,720 --> 00:14:02,720 Speaker 1: at Yard and I'd put you in the conducting class there. 242 00:14:03,280 --> 00:14:05,439 Speaker 1: He said, you have talent, and I was like wow. 243 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:08,080 Speaker 1: So when I went to Harvard, then I had had 244 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:11,840 Speaker 1: this experience of of conducting, and almost right away when 245 00:14:11,880 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 1: I got there, I auditioned to be assistant conductor of 246 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 1: the Harvard Back of Orchestra, which I got. I think 247 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 1: I was lucky. It was unusual for a freshman to 248 00:14:19,320 --> 00:14:21,840 Speaker 1: get a position like that. But because of that, I 249 00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:24,360 Speaker 1: actually got to conduct the orchestra and performance and do 250 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:28,720 Speaker 1: rehearsals and things, and using the videotape from one of 251 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:33,400 Speaker 1: those performances, I applied to Tanglewood for the summer conducting 252 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:38,400 Speaker 1: program at Tanglewood with Sachos and Gustav Meyer, and I 253 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 1: got in, and uh so I was able to start 254 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: studying there. The big crossroads for me came when I 255 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:46,160 Speaker 1: was getting ready to graduate from college and I was 256 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:48,280 Speaker 1: planning to go to a conservatory, and I had to 257 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 1: really decide while I go as a violence or as 258 00:14:50,600 --> 00:14:55,160 Speaker 1: a conductor um And I decided to apply as a 259 00:14:55,200 --> 00:14:58,920 Speaker 1: conductor because I figured sort of what I already had thought. 260 00:14:58,920 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 1: I you know, I'm a decent violinist. I could I 261 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:05,400 Speaker 1: could make a living as a violinist, even if I 262 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:08,640 Speaker 1: don't go study at a conservatory. Now, um, let's just 263 00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 1: see how how the conducting thing goes. So I ended 264 00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:15,240 Speaker 1: up getting into Curtis and I went to Curtis for 265 00:15:15,280 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 1: three years, and then I continued with the same teacher 266 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:21,680 Speaker 1: otto Vene Mueller at Juilliard. I got my master's degree. Um, 267 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:26,000 Speaker 1: so Curtis and then Juilliard after that. Yeah, I can't 268 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 1: complain about my education, and I have no academic stone unturned. Yeah, 269 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 1: I was conducting during those two periods as well. Yeah, 270 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 1: Curtis and and drew itard. Although I did study violin, 271 00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 1: it was it was wonderful. I got to a new 272 00:15:37,880 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 1: steer sharply in the direction of conducting. And I was 273 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 1: Curtis and Juilliard. I was a conducting conducting student. But 274 00:15:43,280 --> 00:15:47,200 Speaker 1: while I was at Curtis, I studied violin with Yosha Brodsky, 275 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:49,360 Speaker 1: one of the great violent teachers who was there at 276 00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:53,280 Speaker 1: the time. And I also um auditioned to be on 277 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 1: the Philadelphia Orchestra substitute musician lists. And just because of 278 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 1: the way things were the those years, there were a 279 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 1: lot of openings. I think a couple of people were 280 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:08,160 Speaker 1: on sick leave. There were people out on maternity leave 281 00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 1: or whatever. And I played basically full time in the 282 00:16:10,440 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 1: Philadelphia Orchestra while I was studying at Curtis as a violinist, 283 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:17,120 Speaker 1: you know, for me, as a non pro if you will, 284 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 1: but a devoted fan of that music, someone will play 285 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,320 Speaker 1: the fourth movement of the mallor ninth almost three minutes 286 00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 1: longer than someone. I mean, some people just squeeze the 287 00:16:27,520 --> 00:16:30,640 Speaker 1: hell out of the adagios and so forth. In my mind, 288 00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:33,560 Speaker 1: what a conductor does only only based it on that, 289 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:37,720 Speaker 1: on that information and those numbers, on those downloads that 290 00:16:37,800 --> 00:16:40,640 Speaker 1: you decide the pace that it's played, Is that correct? You? 291 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:44,520 Speaker 1: You play it your way. I think that tempo is 292 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:51,480 Speaker 1: the single most important attribute or characteristic of an interpreterpretation. 293 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 1: Early on, there was no separate profession of conductor. Very 294 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:01,200 Speaker 1: often the composer would lead the performance, or maybe the 295 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:05,879 Speaker 1: first violinist. The concertmaster would guide things along, but essentially, 296 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:10,960 Speaker 1: if a pulse was kept, people could play along. Jean 297 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:15,440 Speaker 1: Baptiste Lulli, the French composer, actually famously killed himself, supposedly, 298 00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:17,679 Speaker 1: so the story goes, because what they did is not 299 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:19,920 Speaker 1: wave a stick in the air, but actually he beat 300 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:23,919 Speaker 1: a beat his staff on the floor and apparently he 301 00:17:24,200 --> 00:17:27,439 Speaker 1: missed and impaled his foot with the staff and he 302 00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:32,200 Speaker 1: contracted and he ended up. Yes, so it's a hazardous 303 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:34,440 Speaker 1: profession even today. But back then I guess it could 304 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:38,119 Speaker 1: have been worse. But as music got more complicated, it 305 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:40,840 Speaker 1: became more useful and maybe even necessary for there to 306 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:43,040 Speaker 1: be an outside person who was not playing an instrument, 307 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 1: could listen, who could listen and guide everybody. And the 308 00:17:46,440 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 1: idea of a modern conductor with that kind of mythical status, 309 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 1: this kind of mystical presence, who would shape the music 310 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:58,520 Speaker 1: and come up with an interpretation. Um, you know, when 311 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:00,240 Speaker 1: it was the composer himself in the idea was to 312 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:03,879 Speaker 1: present the piece. But then when when you know, Mendelssohn 313 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 1: started performing the music of Bach, and when list started 314 00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:09,879 Speaker 1: doing other composers music, the idea was to come up 315 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:15,280 Speaker 1: with a personal take, and and it became a thing. Um. 316 00:18:15,359 --> 00:18:18,919 Speaker 1: And now obviously with some very complicated music, tricky meters 317 00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:21,320 Speaker 1: and stuff, the idea of you know, just giving people 318 00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:27,199 Speaker 1: an indication of where the is, for example, I mean, 319 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 1: that's that would be really really hard for an orchestra 320 00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:32,159 Speaker 1: to do. If not impossible without a conductor, and it 321 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:37,040 Speaker 1: becomes an esthetic even philosophical question, what an interpretation is? Um? 322 00:18:37,600 --> 00:18:42,200 Speaker 1: I try to find the right tempo at every moment, 323 00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:45,000 Speaker 1: right tempo? What is the right tempo? You're you know, 324 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,879 Speaker 1: you're pointing out that there are many different ways you 325 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:50,200 Speaker 1: can do it, but something it's different for different people. 326 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,680 Speaker 1: It's different for different situations. Since there's a better way 327 00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:56,439 Speaker 1: to play it, well, you have to find the tempo 328 00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,480 Speaker 1: that's absolutely right for you, that is completely organic for 329 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:02,199 Speaker 1: your relationship with the piece. And that's what I do 330 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: when I study. I'm trying to digest the music to 331 00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:07,879 Speaker 1: the point where if I open the score randomly to 332 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:10,800 Speaker 1: any page, I get an immediate and visceral kind of 333 00:19:10,880 --> 00:19:12,800 Speaker 1: reaction to the notes I see on the page, and 334 00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:14,399 Speaker 1: I have the sense that this is how they have 335 00:19:14,480 --> 00:19:16,080 Speaker 1: to go. And then you have to sell it to them, 336 00:19:16,400 --> 00:19:18,840 Speaker 1: and then well what happens is it's interesting when you 337 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:21,719 Speaker 1: know a piece that well, as you're conducting it, you 338 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 1: don't have to consciously do anything. It comes out that way. 339 00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:30,280 Speaker 1: The gesture takes care of itself. Yeah, and that's what 340 00:19:30,320 --> 00:19:32,399 Speaker 1: you were or in rehearsal. Do they ever say to 341 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:34,280 Speaker 1: you we would, I would like to play it another way. 342 00:19:34,320 --> 00:19:36,679 Speaker 1: They don't do that. Sure, they do that absolutely, especially 343 00:19:36,680 --> 00:19:39,359 Speaker 1: if there's a solo. And that's what makes it fun 344 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,480 Speaker 1: because the chemistry and the kind of give and take 345 00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:44,479 Speaker 1: of you know, it's like a it's like a vessel 346 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 1: with with two two chambers, and the kind of the 347 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 1: fluid can kind of shift back and forth. And the 348 00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:52,000 Speaker 1: idea is sometimes you give you give over a little 349 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:55,000 Speaker 1: bit of the lead to the soloist who's playing a solo, 350 00:19:55,600 --> 00:19:58,359 Speaker 1: and you react to it. But it's all together, and 351 00:19:58,359 --> 00:20:01,119 Speaker 1: that solos will feel differently about the solo, even if 352 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:04,320 Speaker 1: they have their own interpretation, if you will, based on 353 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:07,840 Speaker 1: your presence and your physicality. And so it's if you see, 354 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,680 Speaker 1: you know, great jazz combo playing like we just had 355 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:13,639 Speaker 1: Winton the other day and was so interesting to watch 356 00:20:13,960 --> 00:20:16,239 Speaker 1: them play together because you can tell that even though 357 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 1: they're improvising, they're completely affecting each other. And when one 358 00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:22,280 Speaker 1: person does something, they react to it and they emphasize 359 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,639 Speaker 1: a certain impulse or you know, clicking the beat, and 360 00:20:25,680 --> 00:20:30,320 Speaker 1: then that intern inspires the one who made the first move, 361 00:20:30,400 --> 00:20:33,399 Speaker 1: and it's this constant feedback loop that also happens with 362 00:20:33,480 --> 00:20:36,399 Speaker 1: music that's written down. I've done the same piece with 363 00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 1: two different orchestras in consecutive weeks, and although my interpretation 364 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 1: hasn't dramatically changed, the way the piece ends up coming 365 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:49,160 Speaker 1: out is very different. Is everybody doing the exact same thing, 366 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:51,639 Speaker 1: but in their own way. Some of them seem to 367 00:20:51,640 --> 00:20:52,800 Speaker 1: be ahead of the beat and some of them need 368 00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,000 Speaker 1: to be on the beat. Yeah, that's a very that's 369 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: a very interesting observation because it's it's absolutely true with 370 00:20:59,080 --> 00:21:02,640 Speaker 1: some conductors orchestras will tend to make a sound that's 371 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:04,920 Speaker 1: closer to where it seems as if the it's called 372 00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:06,960 Speaker 1: the ixtus of their beat. That's sort of the click 373 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:11,399 Speaker 1: where the beat actually happens. There's there's either greater or 374 00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:15,000 Speaker 1: lesser delay from that. It depends on the the quality 375 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 1: of the gesture. And it's very hard to describe why 376 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:21,720 Speaker 1: that works and how that works. It's also according to 377 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:24,680 Speaker 1: the orchestra, certain orchestras play closer to the beat than 378 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:28,200 Speaker 1: than than others. Like the Cleveland Orchestra, for example, tends 379 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 1: to play closer to the visual you know, where the 380 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:33,560 Speaker 1: beat looks as if it is than the New York Philharmonic. 381 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:36,520 Speaker 1: A lot of European or German rictors just play even 382 00:21:36,560 --> 00:21:39,880 Speaker 1: more behind the beat. And this is where it gets 383 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:42,680 Speaker 1: interesting because it's about tempo, it's about rhythm. It's also 384 00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:46,360 Speaker 1: about sound quality. If you imagine a sound that goes 385 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:50,760 Speaker 1: that's like right there, there's no delay, yeah, or if 386 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 1: it's that you know that there's a kind of delay 387 00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:58,520 Speaker 1: and it can't it can't possibly start edit such a 388 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:02,680 Speaker 1: determinate time. Um. I remember when I first played in 389 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:07,080 Speaker 1: the Philadelphia Orchestra. I was early. I came in my 390 00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:09,880 Speaker 1: I made a sound before the other musicians because there 391 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:12,640 Speaker 1: is more delay there. So I would see Ricardo Boud 392 00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:14,480 Speaker 1: you give a gesture and you go boom, and I'll 393 00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:17,359 Speaker 1: go boom right there, and everyone else would wait and 394 00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 1: the sound would would come out later and uh, after 395 00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 1: a while, I didn't have to make that that calculation 396 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,000 Speaker 1: and that adjustment. And it's different from the New York 397 00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:30,479 Speaker 1: Film Institutional. Yeah, it's not a conscious thing. It's not 398 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 1: that it's not like they talk about it. But it's 399 00:22:32,240 --> 00:22:35,040 Speaker 1: the culture of sound. It's the tradition of of the 400 00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:40,240 Speaker 1: way they they collectively create rhythm and sound. I remember 401 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 1: seeing Herbert from Cary on conduct the Vienna Philharmonic, and 402 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 1: it was und I've never seen anything like this. How 403 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:50,680 Speaker 1: far ahead of the sound his beat was. It looked 404 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:53,080 Speaker 1: like he was almost in the next measure they were playing. 405 00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:55,639 Speaker 1: They were playing schubert Unfinished Symphony. He was beating along, 406 00:22:55,880 --> 00:23:01,639 Speaker 1: and I swear I couldn't see any connection between Yeah, 407 00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:03,439 Speaker 1: he was like, you know, he was already on the 408 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,720 Speaker 1: plane and they were still getting to the airport or something. 409 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:09,479 Speaker 1: It was so bizarre, but they played so beautifully. So 410 00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:12,639 Speaker 1: an orchestra that has a kind of more precise way 411 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:16,360 Speaker 1: of making sound will tend not to play so far 412 00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:20,600 Speaker 1: behind the beat. Generally speaking, orchestras and France, which were 413 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,800 Speaker 1: very precise in the way they approach with them and 414 00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:26,320 Speaker 1: maybe not quite as as voluptuous in the sound quality 415 00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 1: that they make essay for example, a German orchestra, they 416 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:31,719 Speaker 1: tend to play closer to the beat. And then when 417 00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:34,200 Speaker 1: I first conducted the Philadelphia Orchestra, the first beats I 418 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:36,440 Speaker 1: conducted with the Philadelphia Orchestra, the sound came so much 419 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:38,600 Speaker 1: later than I expected. I almost fell off the stage 420 00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:40,280 Speaker 1: because it was such a shock. I gave a beat 421 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,720 Speaker 1: and they didn't play. And then what seemed like an eternity. 422 00:23:43,880 --> 00:23:46,879 Speaker 1: Later the sound came back to me perfectly together. It 423 00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:50,359 Speaker 1: was really bizarre. When you do this kind of work, 424 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:53,480 Speaker 1: you have to have this keen, almost mathematical aptitude just 425 00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:57,040 Speaker 1: to fit all these scrabble tiles in your skull every 426 00:23:57,119 --> 00:24:00,520 Speaker 1: day of all these notes. And when you talked about entrances, 427 00:24:01,119 --> 00:24:02,680 Speaker 1: you know, I think to myself, what if there's more 428 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 1: than one entrance, or what are the entrances all fall 429 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,359 Speaker 1: on top of each other? Who gets picked? You know, 430 00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,439 Speaker 1: they make their entrances whether you give them a or not, 431 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,120 Speaker 1: because you know they know where they are and they're 432 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:15,080 Speaker 1: counting you being an entrance for it's from multiple they 433 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:16,679 Speaker 1: know it's for all of it. It's not it's not 434 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,040 Speaker 1: to make sure that they play. It's to help them 435 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:23,040 Speaker 1: enter in the way that you want them to and 436 00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:25,200 Speaker 1: with the spirit and with the character that you want. 437 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:27,280 Speaker 1: But they don't. You don't need to look at them 438 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:29,240 Speaker 1: to play, and there's no way you don't always even 439 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,600 Speaker 1: even certain entrances from one concert to the next, you'll 440 00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: either give you'll give them a look or not. Um 441 00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:38,439 Speaker 1: it's very comforting if a player is counting a lot 442 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:40,480 Speaker 1: of rest to get your eye, a couple of measures 443 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:44,040 Speaker 1: before and then confirmation that it's time for them to 444 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:46,520 Speaker 1: play at at A at A at the correct moment. 445 00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:52,480 Speaker 1: Outgoing New York Philharmonic conductor Alan Gilbert, this is not 446 00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 1: like Baldwin and you're listening to. Here's the thing, one 447 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,560 Speaker 1: of the living composers who's work Gilbert brought to New 448 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:05,320 Speaker 1: York audiences is that's a peck of Solmonon. The concert 449 00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:09,560 Speaker 1: this spring where Gilbert conducted solon In's l A Variations 450 00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 1: is just one example of his difficult balancing act. Slonon 451 00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:26,160 Speaker 1: is a great conductor in his own right too, currently 452 00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:29,560 Speaker 1: at the Philharmonia or Orchestra in London. But on here's 453 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,199 Speaker 1: the thing. He told me he's frustrated that there's so 454 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:36,280 Speaker 1: much more attention paid to conductors than two composers. I 455 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 1: had a really kind of illuminating experience in l A 456 00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:41,040 Speaker 1: some years ago. I was I was at Starbucks, actually 457 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: queuing from a coffee, and there was a guy in 458 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:45,760 Speaker 1: front of me who asked whether I was so and so, 459 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:47,760 Speaker 1: and I said, yes, I am, and he said he 460 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:49,800 Speaker 1: was also a composer. And he told me that he 461 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 1: had written a couple of songs from Madonna and you know, 462 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:57,639 Speaker 1: these huge names and his name doesn't appear anywhere, and 463 00:25:57,680 --> 00:25:59,960 Speaker 1: I thought, so, it's not only a classical music book 464 00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,720 Speaker 1: on here more stories from my talk with that's a 465 00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:10,439 Speaker 1: peka salon and had here's the thing dot Org. A 466 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:13,840 Speaker 1: few years ago, I collaborated with Alan Gilbert on a 467 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:18,080 Speaker 1: program where the Philharmonic performed famous film scores live to picture. 468 00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:34,320 Speaker 1: It was exhilarating from me, but I worried it would 469 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,960 Speaker 1: feel like just another concert for Gilbert. I needn't have. 470 00:26:39,200 --> 00:26:40,879 Speaker 1: I had never done that, and that was that was 471 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:42,800 Speaker 1: so great. We were terrified to pitch that to you. 472 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:47,920 Speaker 1: By the way, well, I'm happy with the ones I 473 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,880 Speaker 1: chose to do. I mean, certainly the two. And then 474 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,440 Speaker 1: I mean, there's such great films, first of all, and 475 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,679 Speaker 1: the way music is used is so integral to the 476 00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: whole artistic product. Two thousand mom was great. It was, 477 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:01,720 Speaker 1: I mean, and it was one of the hardest things 478 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:07,800 Speaker 1: that I've ever done, because essentially you have to coordinate 479 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:09,720 Speaker 1: because Kubrick was such a genius. I mean, it was 480 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:13,560 Speaker 1: no accident when certain moments in the film visually happened 481 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:16,040 Speaker 1: in relation to the music. You know, when the spaceship 482 00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:18,400 Speaker 1: shows up, you know, the boom, something has to happen there, 483 00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:21,159 Speaker 1: and if you're not, if you don't hit that that 484 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:24,320 Speaker 1: mark mark exactly right, you you know, you're taking away 485 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:27,320 Speaker 1: from the from the impact and the value of the film. 486 00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:30,200 Speaker 1: So I really worked very hard. And whoever had prepared 487 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,440 Speaker 1: the score, maybe it worked for them, but they were 488 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:36,879 Speaker 1: there were time marks all through the score, but they 489 00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:43,080 Speaker 1: weren't right actually, So I literally spent act going through 490 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:46,840 Speaker 1: and figuring out how how to mark my score, and 491 00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:48,880 Speaker 1: I tried to the best of my ability. I mean, 492 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,400 Speaker 1: I'm no professional in the world of cinema, but I 493 00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 1: tried to really identify which moments were crucial and which 494 00:27:55,800 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: moments there was some play because you know, if if 495 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:02,320 Speaker 1: you know, if you have one moment where I say, 496 00:28:02,560 --> 00:28:04,639 Speaker 1: you know, horn starts to play and that's where you know, 497 00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:07,680 Speaker 1: the sun shows up or whatever, and the uh in 498 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 1: in in the movie, Okay, you know you have to 499 00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:12,159 Speaker 1: hit that. But then there may be you know, twenty 500 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:16,680 Speaker 1: seconds in which is not so crucial. And that made 501 00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:20,840 Speaker 1: it possible to figure out how to paste those say 502 00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,920 Speaker 1: twenty seconds in order to end up at the right 503 00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:28,320 Speaker 1: place without it feeling too metronomic. It's difficult. You want 504 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:30,000 Speaker 1: it to sound natural and you want it to sound 505 00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 1: as if it's your own interpretation. Um, but it also 506 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:36,840 Speaker 1: has to fit with the film. And what I had 507 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:40,520 Speaker 1: to practice during the rehearsals was how to either make 508 00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:45,400 Speaker 1: up time or give time back, because, um, you know, 509 00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:47,800 Speaker 1: sometimes you're ahead, you know there are time marks, and 510 00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:49,480 Speaker 1: you say, okay, I'm a little bit ahead, and the 511 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:51,120 Speaker 1: ones where it doesn't matter, then you know you have 512 00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,080 Speaker 1: to slow it down. You can't just suddenly slow it down, 513 00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,280 Speaker 1: because then it will sound like a discontinuity in the music. 514 00:28:56,320 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 1: You have to know, Okay, if I slow down this much, 515 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 1: then I'll and by the time, you know, five measures later, 516 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 1: then we'll be able to hit hit the next mark. 517 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 1: And that sort of interaction is completely different from what 518 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:10,200 Speaker 1: we do usually. Because you know, something slows down a 519 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 1: little bit in the concert, that's okay, that's what happened, 520 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:14,040 Speaker 1: and you don't have to try to make it up. 521 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:16,760 Speaker 1: You know, you're not trying to end the piece in 522 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:19,040 Speaker 1: the exact same amount of time that you did it 523 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:21,680 Speaker 1: the night before. If it's a little slower the next night, 524 00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 1: no big deal. But that doesn't work with the movie 525 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:27,400 Speaker 1: You Can't End. Two minutes later in the movie right 526 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 1: hit four of the big five orchestras in my development, 527 00:29:29,960 --> 00:29:32,800 Speaker 1: I was really really lucky to see how these all 528 00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,480 Speaker 1: wonderful orchestras were worked so differently from each other. And 529 00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:39,440 Speaker 1: then your first major appointment is in Sweden. Was in Sweden, 530 00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:43,720 Speaker 1: I started working as a guest conductor um and uh 531 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 1: Stockholm Royal Stockholm Filharmonic was looking for a chief conductor 532 00:29:47,120 --> 00:29:49,280 Speaker 1: and I didn't even know it at the time, and 533 00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:52,680 Speaker 1: I conducted the orchanal. They invited me back for a 534 00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 1: essentially a tryout week because I hadn't worked with There 535 00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,160 Speaker 1: were a lot of regular musicians who didn't play my concert. 536 00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:01,120 Speaker 1: It was a summer concert, so people were on leave, 537 00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:03,640 Speaker 1: and so they brought me back as soon as possible, 538 00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:05,440 Speaker 1: which was earlier the next season, and I did a 539 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:10,760 Speaker 1: huge program. We did a done Juan of Strauss and Mozart, 540 00:30:10,760 --> 00:30:14,160 Speaker 1: Obo Control and the writer Spring in fact, and uh, 541 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:15,920 Speaker 1: I guess that went well enough that they asked me 542 00:30:15,960 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: to be their chief conductor. So I took out a 543 00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,480 Speaker 1: position there and I was there for eight years and 544 00:30:20,720 --> 00:30:24,160 Speaker 1: uh yeah, then landed in New York. Who contacts who 545 00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,880 Speaker 1: says to you, we'd like to talk to you. Um. 546 00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 1: There were conversations kind of um before I was invited 547 00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:39,320 Speaker 1: to be music director about a completely different setup that 548 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:43,560 Speaker 1: was being imagined, involving another conductor who would have been 549 00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:46,600 Speaker 1: the music director and and what what I would have 550 00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:51,440 Speaker 1: been as some kind of principal conductor or some other 551 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 1: lesser title. But the idea was that there would be 552 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:59,720 Speaker 1: two of us, and and I would have conducted a 553 00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:01,520 Speaker 1: lot of Was that a conductor that they talked about, 554 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:03,840 Speaker 1: somebody who liked it, admired and you would comolutely know 555 00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:05,640 Speaker 1: we we we And it was It was a very 556 00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:08,560 Speaker 1: exciting opportunity for me because I wasn't angling to become 557 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:11,760 Speaker 1: music director of the your flow. What happened, Um, well, 558 00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:16,400 Speaker 1: that fell apart. They couldn't afford that person. No, just 559 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:20,960 Speaker 1: let's leave it at it fell apart, um, And so 560 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:22,320 Speaker 1: then you know, I guess they went back to the 561 00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 1: drawing board. And sometime later they you know, they called 562 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:27,479 Speaker 1: zarn Mate called me up and who made that? It 563 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:30,120 Speaker 1: was a czarin who drove that? Who drove that? You know, 564 00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: I don't know the internal workings, They don't know one 565 00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:34,080 Speaker 1: about it to tell you, well, I mean, did you 566 00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:37,120 Speaker 1: want to know. Essentially, the way it works is that 567 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:39,920 Speaker 1: a lot of people get together and there's a search 568 00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,880 Speaker 1: committee that's made up of musicians and board members and 569 00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:47,680 Speaker 1: administrators and sometimes some outside people. Um. I don't actually 570 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:49,960 Speaker 1: know exactly who was on the search committee that ended 571 00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:54,200 Speaker 1: up choosing me, but obviously there was a critical mass 572 00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:59,600 Speaker 1: of consensus that was your champion. Yeah, apparently, which I 573 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:03,360 Speaker 1: will always always appreciate and I'll never forget the the 574 00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:05,719 Speaker 1: phone call. And this is an absolutely true story. I 575 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:08,480 Speaker 1: was traveling in Japan with my family and I had 576 00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:11,840 Speaker 1: at the time two young children. Um, it was eight 577 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 1: years ago, so Estro was three. I think it was 578 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:17,520 Speaker 1: nine years ago, so he was even two, and knowing 579 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:20,360 Speaker 1: it was three year or something like that, and they 580 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:24,040 Speaker 1: had finally fallen asleep. We had had a torturous night, 581 00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:25,800 Speaker 1: you know how it is with jet lag, just you know, 582 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:28,440 Speaker 1: for for us, but for little kids it's impossible. And 583 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:31,160 Speaker 1: they had finally fallen asleep, and I got a call 584 00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,640 Speaker 1: from Zarin Maytown just after they had fallen asleep, and 585 00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,280 Speaker 1: he said, well, Alan, i'd you know, like to invite 586 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:38,840 Speaker 1: you to be our next music director. And I said, 587 00:32:38,880 --> 00:32:41,000 Speaker 1: that's great, Sar but my kids just fell asleep. I 588 00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:43,640 Speaker 1: can't talk to you now, and thought it was it 589 00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 1: was my mind, but my wife and I were so 590 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:48,640 Speaker 1: happy that they had fallen asleep, and and so I 591 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 1: just you kno, hang up, and I said, guess what. 592 00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 1: They just asked me to be music director. And we 593 00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,840 Speaker 1: were like trying to contain ourselves. But yeah. Then I 594 00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:57,760 Speaker 1: called him back and we had a scene in a 595 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 1: movie where guys like, more than being the music director 596 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:04,080 Speaker 1: of the Philharmonic, I want my kids to go to sleep. Totally. Well, 597 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:05,720 Speaker 1: we all know the madness of that moment of that. 598 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:08,480 Speaker 1: How did you feel? You know, I had a sense 599 00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:11,040 Speaker 1: that it was it was in the air, but I 600 00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:14,160 Speaker 1: absolutely didn't expect it, and you can't. You can hope 601 00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 1: for something like that, but you you know, it's ridiculous 602 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:20,720 Speaker 1: to expect it. Um. I was thrilled because obviously it's 603 00:33:20,720 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 1: a great orchestra and it's my hometown orchestra. And to 604 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,520 Speaker 1: be able to work with them on a regulation home 605 00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:28,840 Speaker 1: as well, because both your parents. So when you arrive 606 00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:33,080 Speaker 1: and you begin, whether you had any preconceptions or not, 607 00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,960 Speaker 1: what reality sinks in once you have the job, you 608 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 1: get the job, and you come and then what I 609 00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:42,440 Speaker 1: have to say, I was pretty prepared, um because of 610 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:46,840 Speaker 1: my very close connection and knowledge of the orchestra over 611 00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:50,560 Speaker 1: the years, and I pretty well, I mean I'm not 612 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,040 Speaker 1: just patting myself on the back about this, but I 613 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,560 Speaker 1: I called it pretty well what the trajectory of my 614 00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:00,920 Speaker 1: time at the Philharmonic would would be. I did to 615 00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:03,520 Speaker 1: to Kisa eight years when when we started, it's turned 616 00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:06,080 Speaker 1: out to be exactly eight years um. And I knew 617 00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:08,600 Speaker 1: that there would be ups and downs and and some 618 00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:14,440 Speaker 1: some more challenging periods. Um. What was what was nice 619 00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 1: and and surprising in a good way was that some 620 00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:19,720 Speaker 1: of the kind of call it out of the box 621 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:24,880 Speaker 1: initiatives that I started, we're really accepted by the orchestra 622 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:28,360 Speaker 1: and by the community around the orchestra, things like the 623 00:34:28,400 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 1: Contact series and the the production of Grahama Cora that 624 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:33,960 Speaker 1: we did in my first season. I mean that was 625 00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,839 Speaker 1: completely news. It was like nothing the orchestra had had 626 00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:42,320 Speaker 1: done or tried trying before. And that was really important 627 00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:45,560 Speaker 1: for me to have a success with those things early on, 628 00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,480 Speaker 1: because that gave me, that bought me time, that gave 629 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:51,240 Speaker 1: me cred um, and it made it possible to continue 630 00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:53,799 Speaker 1: to try to do other things, not for people who 631 00:34:53,880 --> 00:34:58,759 Speaker 1: don't understand this completely. What the orchestra plays. There's a 632 00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:01,839 Speaker 1: committee that this, it's that, or you decided both. At 633 00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,759 Speaker 1: the end of the day. You could sort of simplify 634 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:09,239 Speaker 1: the the equation and say that I decide. Theoretically, as 635 00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:13,200 Speaker 1: music director, I have the power to decide everything. Um. 636 00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:14,560 Speaker 1: I don't think that would be a good way to 637 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:17,000 Speaker 1: go about it for a lot of reasons. It's too 638 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:20,879 Speaker 1: difficult to take, take too much time. Uh, it's too 639 00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:23,919 Speaker 1: complicated because so many pieces have to fall into place. 640 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:26,120 Speaker 1: If you have guests and artists involved, and you almost 641 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,000 Speaker 1: always do, they have to be engaged. The contract has 642 00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:32,239 Speaker 1: to be written, the schedule has to be organized. Guest 643 00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:35,759 Speaker 1: factor and what they want to play absolutely guest conductors. 644 00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,160 Speaker 1: So when Yo Yo or somebody like that comes here, 645 00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:39,759 Speaker 1: you don't say to them you're gonna play this. They 646 00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:41,759 Speaker 1: tell you what they like to play. Well, it's not 647 00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,840 Speaker 1: that simple. I mean, it's a conversation with someone like 648 00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:45,439 Speaker 1: yo Yo, who's a good friend of mine. We'll talk 649 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:47,520 Speaker 1: about it and and I'll say, hey, would you think 650 00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:50,839 Speaker 1: about you know, playing this piece? And He'll say, either, yes, 651 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,040 Speaker 1: for sure, I'd love to do that, or I'm not 652 00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,600 Speaker 1: so interested in doing that, you know, would you consider this? 653 00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:58,400 Speaker 1: Or it's a give and take. Um, at the end 654 00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:01,279 Speaker 1: of the day, you want people to be happy about 655 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:05,000 Speaker 1: what they're doing here. Different music directors function in different ways, though, 656 00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:08,600 Speaker 1: I've guess conducted at certain orchestras where the music director 657 00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:10,920 Speaker 1: will say, hey, do whatever you want, and so I'll 658 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,440 Speaker 1: suggest a program and if it works with their season, 659 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 1: and if it's a piece that they haven't played too recently, 660 00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:20,160 Speaker 1: they'll accept it. Other music directors will say, no, guest 661 00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:23,399 Speaker 1: conductor can do broms. I'm the only conductor who will 662 00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:25,799 Speaker 1: do broms with the orchestra, for example, or all the 663 00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:29,719 Speaker 1: Maller symphonies are just saved for me. And that's not 664 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:33,560 Speaker 1: it's not you that I've never operated that way. I 665 00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:37,920 Speaker 1: think it's good for for the orchestra to experience music. Um, 666 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:40,640 Speaker 1: you know, similar music with different points of view. But 667 00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:45,320 Speaker 1: just as I, just as I don't favor or classical repertoire, 668 00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:48,200 Speaker 1: equally I'm assuming you don't either. And is there a 669 00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:51,600 Speaker 1: point where you're scripting and you're writing the program for 670 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:54,120 Speaker 1: the year that you sit there and say, man, I'm 671 00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:55,960 Speaker 1: not really to feel that great about this, but something 672 00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:59,359 Speaker 1: we should play. Absolutely, you're in the fortunate position as 673 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:01,239 Speaker 1: music director that you don't have to do anything you 674 00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:03,680 Speaker 1: don't want to do. But but the way I've tried 675 00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:07,600 Speaker 1: to program is to combine things in meaningful ways, to 676 00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:11,800 Speaker 1: create fresh contexts for pieces to shine with the greatest 677 00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:17,640 Speaker 1: possible residence. And I happen to believe that UM showing connections, 678 00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:21,839 Speaker 1: for example, between Beethoven and music that was written centuries later, 679 00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:27,040 Speaker 1: can be illuminating. Another thing that I noticed, you know 680 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:29,960 Speaker 1: as a as a as a concert goer, is that 681 00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:33,319 Speaker 1: there's times that the maestro yourself included obviously, is on 682 00:37:33,360 --> 00:37:35,400 Speaker 1: the podium with no sheet music. And do do you 683 00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:38,959 Speaker 1: conduct with no score because you just know it so well? 684 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:42,719 Speaker 1: Is that what the difference? Yeah, I mean there's there's 685 00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:44,960 Speaker 1: a lot of music that I can do without the score, 686 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:46,520 Speaker 1: and I in a way I would have to say 687 00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:49,480 Speaker 1: I prefer to do music without the score. UM, but 688 00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:53,000 Speaker 1: I don't feel compelled to do music without the score. 689 00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 1: There's there's some conductors who, maybe just because I can, 690 00:37:56,840 --> 00:37:59,279 Speaker 1: or maybe because I think it's important, UM, insist on 691 00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:03,800 Speaker 1: doing everything without the score. It shouldn't matter just because 692 00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:05,480 Speaker 1: you have the score there doesn't mean that you don't 693 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:07,480 Speaker 1: have to know it as well, but you have to 694 00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:09,160 Speaker 1: know it in a different way. If you're going to 695 00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:10,920 Speaker 1: conduct without the scores, you have to make sure you're 696 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:13,000 Speaker 1: not going to make mistakes and you really remember what's 697 00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:16,399 Speaker 1: what's going on. Um. I'm lucky I'm able to learn 698 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:19,319 Speaker 1: pieces easily and conduct without the score. But I do 699 00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:21,680 Speaker 1: so much music. Sometimes it's just more comfortable to have 700 00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:24,160 Speaker 1: the music there. Now I'll be there and I'll watch 701 00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:28,080 Speaker 1: this music performed by whoever is conducting, whoever the ensembles, 702 00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:30,920 Speaker 1: and it means that sometimes it crushes me, just overwhelms me. 703 00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:33,720 Speaker 1: Does that happen to you? Do you ever perform music? 704 00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:37,280 Speaker 1: And not that you have that kind of um plainly 705 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:42,719 Speaker 1: visible reaction, but just sometimes does it just overwhelm you? Absolutely? Absolutely, 706 00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:45,520 Speaker 1: I mean there are times when I really, I mean, 707 00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:48,600 Speaker 1: I'm in the middle of um conducting Divorce, our New 708 00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:51,960 Speaker 1: World Symphony, which we've all done how many good scenes 709 00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:55,799 Speaker 1: sometimes and it's just such a fantastic piece. It's just 710 00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:00,040 Speaker 1: so exciting and so natural and heartfelt and beautiful and 711 00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:03,480 Speaker 1: so well written for the orchestraener saying, damn, this is 712 00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:54,480 Speaker 1: unbelievable that we get to do this. And then we 713 00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:57,080 Speaker 1: did the symphonic dances from West Side Story by Bernstein, 714 00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:02,400 Speaker 1: one of the greatest composition of the twentieth century, you know, 715 00:40:02,480 --> 00:40:04,520 Speaker 1: and then in American Parents, as I said, these are 716 00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:08,279 Speaker 1: three pieces that were premiered by the New York Philharmonic. 717 00:40:09,000 --> 00:40:11,160 Speaker 1: How cool is that? I mean, how what Orkstra can 718 00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:15,280 Speaker 1: say that? It's just, you know, three iconic works, all 719 00:40:15,719 --> 00:40:17,880 Speaker 1: brought to life by the New York Philharmonic, And here 720 00:40:17,920 --> 00:40:20,279 Speaker 1: I am conducting the New York Philharmonic in those very 721 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:24,919 Speaker 1: three pieces. Now, music directors most nights of the year, 722 00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:29,040 Speaker 1: it's very difficult to him this, this this last stretch 723 00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:31,440 Speaker 1: leading up to you know, these last concerts that I'm 724 00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:34,200 Speaker 1: doing in New York City have been crazy. They've been tributes, 725 00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:38,280 Speaker 1: and I've been out just about every single night. And 726 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:41,640 Speaker 1: you know, my kids understand what's going on. But you know, 727 00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:44,160 Speaker 1: they say, very recently they said, you know, when are 728 00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:46,120 Speaker 1: you not going to be going out? You know, are 729 00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:48,640 Speaker 1: you going out again? And it's not only the nights, 730 00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:51,080 Speaker 1: it's just everything else. There's so many things that go 731 00:40:51,160 --> 00:40:58,200 Speaker 1: along with the responsibilities of being a music director. Meetings, planning, things, 732 00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:02,400 Speaker 1: and and just like unlike least stuff, you know, decide 733 00:41:02,440 --> 00:41:04,879 Speaker 1: you know, writing a letter to this person or or 734 00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:09,480 Speaker 1: or thanking this donor. I'm all really worthwhile things that 735 00:41:09,640 --> 00:41:13,160 Speaker 1: obviously have to be done. Um. But with American Orchestra, 736 00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:16,279 Speaker 1: the music director, Frankly has so much power that there's 737 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:20,160 Speaker 1: certain things that won't happen unless I weigh in on them. 738 00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:22,760 Speaker 1: So it really gums up the works if I don't 739 00:41:23,560 --> 00:41:25,960 Speaker 1: if I don't act on things. So there's a kind 740 00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:30,160 Speaker 1: of constant drip of just little things that have to 741 00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:32,880 Speaker 1: be taken care of. And I'm really not going to 742 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,800 Speaker 1: miss that. Um and then I'll but I'll be around. 743 00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:39,120 Speaker 1: I'm connecting the Juilliard Orchestra in a concert and sometime 744 00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:43,239 Speaker 1: maybe January, and I'll be here just about every month, uh, 745 00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:45,879 Speaker 1: teaching at Juilliard for a few days at a time. 746 00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,120 Speaker 1: And uh, I mean I'm a New York, New Yorker 747 00:41:49,120 --> 00:41:50,839 Speaker 1: at Hart and stuff, you know. I actually I am 748 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:55,560 Speaker 1: not happy about about the move. Nora's Kaisa. Kaisa has 749 00:41:55,600 --> 00:41:57,720 Speaker 1: become more a New Yorker than I think I am. Actually, 750 00:41:57,760 --> 00:41:59,880 Speaker 1: she's she's really taken to the city and loves it, 751 00:41:59,880 --> 00:42:01,879 Speaker 1: and I think she'll miss it, maybe even more than 752 00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:04,759 Speaker 1: she realizes. People have written some very very kind things 753 00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,440 Speaker 1: about you and your revolution in this job. Yeah, they 754 00:42:08,440 --> 00:42:10,480 Speaker 1: had the smart one with the brilliant critics. Yeah, the 755 00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:13,000 Speaker 1: only ones with with with dealing with women, and and 756 00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:14,799 Speaker 1: they and all of them used the same kind of 757 00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:17,160 Speaker 1: hot buns, grand macab and things you tried that they 758 00:42:17,200 --> 00:42:19,840 Speaker 1: thought were very admiring of and your devotion to new music. 759 00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:23,359 Speaker 1: And they said some very very kind things about you. 760 00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:27,400 Speaker 1: And when you leave here, what's your feeling like if 761 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:29,520 Speaker 1: you had just in a in a in a paragraph 762 00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:31,719 Speaker 1: you look back on it and it was what to you? 763 00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:36,040 Speaker 1: I think the orchestra is playing better than every I 764 00:42:36,080 --> 00:42:39,399 Speaker 1: think they sound incredible. I think I can take some 765 00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:43,879 Speaker 1: credit for that. And there's a kind of kind of 766 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:48,359 Speaker 1: attitude about the shared experience that the musicians have really 767 00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:51,239 Speaker 1: cooperating and supporting each other and helping each other to 768 00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:55,360 Speaker 1: sound as good as possible. A spirit of collegiality and 769 00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,080 Speaker 1: mutual support that is fresh. I didn't I don't think 770 00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:02,400 Speaker 1: it was as strong before um and the willingness of 771 00:43:02,440 --> 00:43:06,520 Speaker 1: the musicians to take risks and go outside of the 772 00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:10,879 Speaker 1: usual box of what is asked of musicians has been 773 00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:15,560 Speaker 1: incredible and really gratifying. I mean, the things that we've 774 00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:18,319 Speaker 1: been doing that they do without batting an eye now 775 00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,520 Speaker 1: would have been unthinkable. And not that that what was 776 00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,000 Speaker 1: before was was bad or not, you know, or anemic 777 00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:26,120 Speaker 1: in any way. You left the institution in better shape 778 00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:29,000 Speaker 1: artistically than when you found. It means a lot to 779 00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:34,839 Speaker 1: hear you say that, Alec. I think what all arts organizations, 780 00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:38,040 Speaker 1: orchestras for sure, but not just orchestras, need to do 781 00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:41,920 Speaker 1: is to really think hard about what their purpose is 782 00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:44,879 Speaker 1: and what we're trying to accomplish and what we stand for. 783 00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:49,279 Speaker 1: And if you really believe strongly enough, then then you 784 00:43:49,280 --> 00:43:52,520 Speaker 1: should find the courage to make it happen and take 785 00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:56,359 Speaker 1: whatever risks are necessary because it is. It is about art, 786 00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:58,440 Speaker 1: and it is about the human condition. And these are 787 00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:00,880 Speaker 1: very lofty things to say, but really that's why we 788 00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:24,920 Speaker 1: do it. Alan Gilbert, the New York Philharmonic's groundbreaking former 789 00:44:25,080 --> 00:45:05,880 Speaker 1: music director, I'm Alec Baldwin, and you're listening to here's 790 00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:06,279 Speaker 1: the thing