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Speaker 1: Hey, there, everybody, it's me Josh, and for this week's

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Speaker 1: SYSK Selects, I've chosen our twenty twenty one episode on Musak.

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Speaker 1: And you might ask, who could possibly like the noisome,

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Speaker 1: omnipresent annoyance that was Musak? Well me, I like Muzak.

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Speaker 1: So there. But if you're not over forty, you might

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Speaker 1: not even know that there was a time you couldn't

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Speaker 1: step out in public from department stores. Those are in

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Speaker 1: something we call malls to elevators without smalltzy string arrangements

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Speaker 1: of pop music pummeling you with their saccharine sound, and

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Speaker 1: you know what, you're the worst offtware not having experienced it. Instead,

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Speaker 1: you can experience this episode, and I hope you enjoy it.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark, and

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Speaker 1: there's Charles w You, Chuck Bryan over there, and there's Dave.

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Speaker 1: See Coustin. I said it right this time.

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Speaker 2: I thought it was Coustain.

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Speaker 1: No, if you're in France, that's how you would say it.

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Speaker 1: But here in the United States, you say Coustin.

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Speaker 2: Can I start this off by saying something, Oh.

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Speaker 1: Boy, I'm worried about what you're going to say about.

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Speaker 2: Okay, well, this episode is on muzak, and I started

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Speaker 2: thinking last night. I was thinking about your love of musak,

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Speaker 2: which is not at all ironic.

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Speaker 1: Not in the least, but you can't say that kind

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Speaker 1: of thing these days. People don't believe you.

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Speaker 2: I know it's true everyone. I know Josh very well,

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Speaker 2: and I was thinking of your and I like all

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Speaker 2: kinds of music too, but you know, at my heart,

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Speaker 2: I'm a rock and roll guy. Sure, And I was

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Speaker 2: thinking about your top musical genres that are above rock

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Speaker 2: and roll, and you're picking order, not in order. I

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Speaker 2: counted easy listening, musak, disco, art rock, crowd rock, and

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Speaker 2: I probably missed a couple.

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Speaker 1: Crowd rock is below rock and roll. I want to

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Speaker 1: like crowdrock, it just doesn't quite jibe with me. I

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Speaker 1: like some, but not all of it.

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Speaker 2: And then stuff I think art rock because it's just

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Speaker 2: sort of that avant garde, like I don't you don't

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Speaker 2: love Yoko, but you certainly are a bit of a

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Speaker 2: Yoko apologist. Sure, Grace Jones stuff like that, But I.

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Speaker 1: Love Grace Jones for sure. What about talking heads? They

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Speaker 1: go in there too, right, they'd probably be. I mean

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Speaker 1: they literally went to art school together.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean they kind of span from art rock

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Speaker 2: to new wave to like world music by the time

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Speaker 2: they finished.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I know, but uh yeah.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I certainly love the Talking Heads, but all

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Speaker 2: of those, for you are above good old fashioned rock

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Speaker 2: and roll.

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Speaker 1: I think, Yeah, you also left out nineties tech noo.

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Speaker 1: I've been listening to a lot of that accutely too,

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Speaker 1: like Alternate and the Prodigy and everything.

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Speaker 2: But you love music, you really do.

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Speaker 1: I do too.

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Speaker 2: Actually, I don't know, so I don't know how much

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Speaker 2: I like. I will listen to some of that stuff

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Speaker 2: and we'll talking about we'll talk about emo in here,

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Speaker 2: of course, old sourpust Brian Eno, but I love listening

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Speaker 2: to his ambient stuff, which he sort of wrote as

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Speaker 2: an antidote to music. Again. We'll talk about that more later.

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Speaker 2: But I do like in certain circumstances that music thing

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Speaker 2: is really great to have on in my house as

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Speaker 2: background music, and it's sorts that same purpose.

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Speaker 1: One of the big reasons why too, is because you

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Speaker 1: can get stuff done with it. Like lyrics can be

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Speaker 1: so distracting, they just latch onto your brain and say no, no,

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Speaker 1: pay attention to me. I'm I'm talking to you now.

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Speaker 1: Music does the opposite of that. It says, go be free,

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Speaker 1: but also enjoy this, Like there's there's like a whole

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Speaker 1: part of your brain that music can tap into that

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Speaker 1: doesn't require your conscious thought, but it still produces like

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Speaker 1: good feeling. And you know, like Peo, people just smack

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Speaker 1: music around like it's just it's so bland and it's

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Speaker 1: so soulless, and I totally disagree with that. Like if

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Speaker 1: you actually stop and listen to music, it's really really

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Speaker 1: technically proficient. It's frequently well done. It's often very clever

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Speaker 1: and creative and inventive, which is really saying something. Because

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Speaker 1: you're doing this when they in the confines of covering

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Speaker 1: an existing song in a way that makes it familiar

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Speaker 1: and easy to recognize but also takes away any intrusiveness

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Speaker 1: that it might have. It's tough to do. And I really,

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Speaker 1: I just I love music. You're absolutely right, Like I

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Speaker 1: listened to music this whole time. Yeah, not just when

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Speaker 1: we were when we were researching music today, but also

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Speaker 1: when I was researching the Havana syndrome, and I realized,

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Speaker 1: like this is my normal thing. This is the same

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Speaker 1: stuff I listen to when I'm researching anyway.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and we can go ahead and dispell a couple

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Speaker 2: of or not myths, but clear up a couple of

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Speaker 2: things right off the bat. First of all, Musak is

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Speaker 2: a name brand, and people can kind of collectively use

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Speaker 2: the term music or have collectively use that term for

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Speaker 2: what's called like potted plant music or elevator music or

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Speaker 2: shopping music. But it is actual actually a brand name,

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Speaker 2: which we'll get to the history of. And then the

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Speaker 2: second thing is it gets the name elevator music. Part

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Speaker 2: of the myth is that people said, well, they put

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Speaker 2: it on elevators because people were afraid to death of

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Speaker 2: elevators early on, and it calmed people down, or it

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Speaker 2: covered up the noise of the clanking elevators.

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Speaker 1: I'd never heard that before. You.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, neither one of those things are true. Total myth.

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Speaker 2: My guess is that it was played on elevators, and

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Speaker 2: because you're in such a closed little box that's usually quiet,

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Speaker 2: it just was way more noticeable than like in a

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Speaker 2: big office full of people working. So people call the

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Speaker 2: elevator music.

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Speaker 1: That's my guess, right, Yeah, I mean, yeah, there wasn't

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Speaker 1: music gone elevators before? Before several decades in the twentieth century, Like,

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Speaker 1: there weren't many elevators you could get on because people

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Speaker 1: didn't have elevators in their house. It was a public

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Speaker 1: building you were in where they weren't playing music of

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Speaker 1: some form very frequently music.

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Speaker 2: That Great Blues Brothers scene, Yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: Because they're they're going up to what the Cook County

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Speaker 1: Assessor's office and the like. There there's the entire Chicago

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Speaker 1: Police Department is after them, but they're forced to get

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Speaker 1: on this elevator and the girl from Ipanema is playing.

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Speaker 2: I think my favorite part of that scene is there's

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Speaker 2: just dozens and hundreds of cops and swat guys just

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Speaker 2: you know, hut when they're repelling and doing all this stuff.

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Speaker 2: And then there's the one shot of the lone guy

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Speaker 2: repelling down the side of the building and he's by

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Speaker 2: himself just going hut.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: That's a good one, so funny.

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Speaker 1: There's another scene from around the era a few years

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Speaker 1: later from Airplane two where it's like ripped Torn. I

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Speaker 1: believe it's Ripped Torn. The party from the Larry Sanders Show. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know the other guy he's talking to.

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Speaker 1: But anyway, they're walking and talking and they have to

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Speaker 1: get on an elevator and the elevator door opens and

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Speaker 1: it's just blaring, like ear drum shattering decibel MacArthur Park

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Speaker 1: and they have to get on. People are coming off

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Speaker 1: the elevator like with their hands and their ears like

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Speaker 1: with splitting headaches from this. But it's just completely the

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Speaker 1: opposite way elevator music's supposed to be like. But it's

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Speaker 1: a good little scene too, as far as elevator music

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Speaker 1: goes well.

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Speaker 2: I mean that's kind of one of the points too,

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Speaker 2: is Musak has long been a movie trope and a

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Speaker 2: TV trope and then been lampooned and scenes just like

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Speaker 2: the Blues brother scene where there's something chaotic going on

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Speaker 2: and then you cut back to the sound of Musaic

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Speaker 2: playing wherever the other scene is setting. Right, Yeah, very

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Speaker 2: very fun stuff.

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Speaker 1: But that's started, a guess it started with The Blues Brothers,

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Speaker 1: which came out in nineteen eighty, But before that that

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Speaker 1: was like Musak was not really lampoon I mean, not

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Speaker 1: everybody liked it. It really kind of started to get

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Speaker 1: a little backlash in the late sixties early seventies, as

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Speaker 1: we'll see, but there was a very significant chunk of

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Speaker 1: the twentieth century again from maybe nineteen fifty to nineteen eighty.

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Speaker 1: We'll say where everywhere you went in public, including if

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Speaker 1: you took a Greyhound bus, or if you were on

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Speaker 1: a plane, or you happened to be an Air Force one,

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Speaker 1: or you were at the mall, in an elevator at

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Speaker 1: your office, everywhere muzak was playing. There was musach playing everywhere.

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Speaker 1: It was just a part of life that you was inescapable.

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Speaker 2: Actually. Yeah, so let's go back in time and talk

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Speaker 2: about the inventor of muzak. And this is sort of

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Speaker 2: a fun fact of muzak. The man's name is George Square.

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Speaker 2: It is spelled Squire, but he swears it's pronounced square.

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Speaker 1: I'm really impressed, man, I had not come up with.

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Speaker 2: That one or he swore it was pronounced square. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: this is kind of one of the funny jokes, like

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Speaker 2: the guy who invented mus x was Square. But Major

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Speaker 2: General George Square was born in eighteen sixty five, if

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Speaker 2: you believe that, And he is just a laundry list

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Speaker 2: of accomplishments as a human being. He was he earned

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Speaker 2: a doctorate from Johns Hopkins in electrical science. He was

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Speaker 2: an Army engineer with a PhD. I think the first one. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: and he was I believe the lead Signal Corps officer

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Speaker 2: for the Army as well.

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Speaker 1: He was. He also was inducted into the National Academy

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Speaker 1: of Sciences, which connects this episode to the other one today.

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Speaker 1: That's right, because he came up with something called a

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Speaker 1: tree telephone. He figured out how to use any tree,

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Speaker 1: but preferably one with fully leaved I guess, I don't

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Speaker 1: know what you'd call that as a as a receiver

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Speaker 1: and transmitter for radio signals. He figured out how to

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Speaker 1: use a tree, a living tree for that.

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Speaker 2: He was. Here's another fun fact. He was one of

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Speaker 2: the first airplane passengers ever because he was way into

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Speaker 2: human flight and got together with the Wright brothers and

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Speaker 2: a nineteen oh six, consulted with them, and they said, hey,

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Speaker 2: why don't you take a ride in our new little biplane.

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Speaker 2: You'll probably live right.

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Speaker 1: I looked at our I looked at the document for

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Speaker 1: our Wright Brothers episode, and he did not appear. I

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Speaker 1: don't think we mentioned him, but he might. He might

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Speaker 1: have been the first airline passenger from what I saw.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, where he really made a big name for himself

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Speaker 2: pre Musaic was this invention, which is what we call multiplexing,

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Speaker 2: which is he figured out or maybe wire wireless communications,

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Speaker 2: which is something he worked on with the Army. He

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Speaker 2: basically figured out how to get multiple uses out of

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Speaker 2: single telephone lines. Telephone wires were you know, there are

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Speaker 2: only so many, so you were really limited as to

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Speaker 2: what you could do with them and how many people

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Speaker 2: could use them. So he basically figured out a way

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Speaker 2: to increase their output and efficiency by multiplexing and by

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Speaker 2: sending super imposing high frequency radio signals over those low

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Speaker 2: frequency telegraph signals, basically just allowing you to use the

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Speaker 2: wire at the same time, the same wire.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's like, if you think of

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Speaker 1: like a wave, if it's low frequency, there's big, wide

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Speaker 1: gaps in between. You can fit a higher frequency that's

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Speaker 1: tighter and squished together in those gaps, and but you're

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Speaker 1: still using the same line. And you know, this was

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Speaker 1: the guy who came up with that. That's an enormous

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Speaker 1: advancement in telecommunications that were still put in use today

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Speaker 1: in some applications, but definitely helped like the early Internet along.

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Speaker 1: It was just a huge contribution to humanity, like forget

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Speaker 1: even just music, like just that alone would would probably

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Speaker 1: warrant like an episode for George Square.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think he was like, everyone should be

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Speaker 2: able to use this, So I'm going to open source

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Speaker 2: it and everyone can use this new multiplexing technology. AT

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Speaker 2: and T came along and said, we'll use it, and

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Speaker 2: then you know what, you've stole it from us.

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Speaker 1: Actually right, he came up with it, but since he

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Speaker 1: left it open, they decided to just take it from

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Speaker 1: him and sue him for it.

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Speaker 2: I think he sued them, but it didn't work.

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Speaker 1: That's right, you're right, so he but he still was

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Speaker 1: able to use this wire wireless technology with multiplexing. And

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Speaker 1: at the time people were starting to get into radio broadcasts.

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Speaker 1: But radio wireless radio like that you would just have

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Speaker 1: in your house. It's picking up radio waves at a

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Speaker 1: station that was not widespread at the time. So George

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Speaker 1: Square said, you know what, I understand people want music

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Speaker 1: in their house. I'm going to give it to them.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to use that multiplexing technology and I'm going

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Speaker 1: to run sound waves over the electrical wires that go

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Speaker 1: into the house, and I'm going to sell this it

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Speaker 1: is brilliant. I'm going to sell this service to people's

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Speaker 1: homes for a dollar fifty a month, about twenty dollars today,

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Speaker 1: and it's just part of your utility bill because it's

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Speaker 1: coming in through your electrical company. And there's actually a

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Speaker 1: section of Cleveland called the Lakewood I believe Lakewood area

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Speaker 1: that was the pilot for this wired wireless radio that

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Speaker 1: George Square invented. The problem was is, by the time

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Speaker 1: they deployed it, wireless radio was already a thing, and

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Speaker 1: so we had this really great idea that just no

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Speaker 1: longer had an application.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he was. He basically invented the first music subscription

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Speaker 2: service exactly.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. And he had multiple channels too, Like when you subscribed,

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Speaker 1: you got news, you got dance music. There was like

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Speaker 1: I think three different channels you could choose.

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Speaker 2: From Howard Stern.

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Speaker 1: Yep, Howard Stern was on back.

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Speaker 2: Then Baba Boobie. So he had that technology though, and

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Speaker 2: he said, you know what, this is a good idea,

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Speaker 2: though maybe I can think of how to use this

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Speaker 2: in offices and stores. And in nineteen thirty four he

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Speaker 2: looked up at Kodak, very successful corporation and said, I

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Speaker 2: love that name, and I love music. Let's just call

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Speaker 2: it music and history changed and maybe we should take

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Speaker 2: a break.

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Speaker 1: Okay, let's do it all right, We'll be right back. So,

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Speaker 1: in the parlance of today, Chuck George Square and his

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Speaker 1: Musak Corporation pivoted from home consumer markets to business markets.

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Speaker 1: And that just knocked it out of the park because

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Speaker 1: it turned out that there were a lot of companies, hotels, restaurants, clubs.

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Speaker 1: I think the Stork Club was an early customer that said,

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Speaker 1: you know what, it's really going to make our place

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Speaker 1: seem fancy if we've got music piping in all the time.

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Speaker 1: So yes, we would like to sign up for your service.

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Speaker 1: And that's really where music kind of started to take off.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so Musak, I mean we haven't even said what

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Speaker 2: it is, surely people know, but muzak are instrumental tracks.

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Speaker 2: And you did mention that there were no vocals, so

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Speaker 2: we kind of hinted the big one. Yeah, but there

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Speaker 2: are instrumental tracks that are cover songs of kind of

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Speaker 2: anything you can think of. I mean that have hearts,

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Speaker 2: some music of some heavy rock. It can be classical music,

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Speaker 2: it can be old standards. But the point is they

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Speaker 2: are instrumental versions that are re recorded. They don't just

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Speaker 2: take the vocals out. It's not carry oukay style, right,

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Speaker 2: It is re record arranged and recorded by professional, really

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Speaker 2: good musicians orchestras. Sometimes, Yeah, and it is, that's what

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Speaker 2: it is, and it's great the end.

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Speaker 1: And very very frequently it's it's made into a much

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Speaker 1: more mellow version of itself, Like any rough edges are

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Speaker 1: taken off. Since they take the vocals out, it's not

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Speaker 1: like there's no there that vocal melody is non existing

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Speaker 1: any longer. They just replace it with something else. So

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Speaker 1: if they're trying to go for something like a little

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Speaker 1: more upbeat or up tempo, they'll replace the vocals with,

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Speaker 1: say like a saxophone. If they're trying to do something

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Speaker 1: a little more mellow, they'll replace the vocals with a

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Speaker 1: string section.

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Speaker 2: Or harp perhaps.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. That's one of the things that that musaic is

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Speaker 1: very famous for, is like what's called masses of strings,

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Speaker 1: just strings upon strings. In fact, one of the early

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Speaker 1: I guess big name groups that produced musak was called

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Speaker 1: one hundred and one Strings. They probably were absolutely accurate

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Speaker 1: in that, like there's just a lot tons of strings everywhere, violins,

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Speaker 1: cello's violas, every string instrument you can throw at it.

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Speaker 1: They just layer upon layer in these songs. It's one

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Speaker 1: of the hallmarks of musak.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and there are many versions of Antonio Carlos Shobiam's

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Speaker 2: Go from Epanima, but the music version is one of

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Speaker 2: the most popular, and that one hundred and one strings

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Speaker 2: version is the most ubiquitous from that lot. I do

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Speaker 2: encourage people to go watch the YouTube though, of Frank

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Speaker 2: Sinatra and Joe Beim singing that song live on TV,

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Speaker 2: because it's great and every way they're just sitting next

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Speaker 2: to each other, and the shot isn't wide at first,

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Speaker 2: and they're just sort of singing back and forth to

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Speaker 2: each other and Frank Stone is saying, then it cuts

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Speaker 2: to the wide and Frank is like totally kicked back

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Speaker 2: with his legs crossed with a cigarette in his hand,

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Speaker 2: exactly like you would hope. But he looks like, I mean,

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Speaker 2: it looks like he just not rolled out of bed

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Speaker 2: because he's put together, but he looks like he rolled

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Speaker 2: from his wicker bag to his wicker chair right for

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Speaker 2: this performance.

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Speaker 1: Can I get some cocaine in here? Baby?

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Speaker 2: So it's Joe Piscopos, Frank Sinatra.

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Speaker 1: Do you ever listen to Joe beam stuff?

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, dude, I love that old lounge stuff. It's

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Speaker 2: really great Brazilian stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. His record Stone Flower is just a masterpiece from

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Speaker 1: beginning to end.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. But that's a good party music.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. That's another thing though too. It's like it's so

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Speaker 1: mellow that to take that kind of music and then

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Speaker 1: make it into musak is like it's almost like it

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Speaker 1: takes a certain amount of audacity, Like I was listening

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Speaker 1: to I found so there's want to I want to

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Speaker 1: point people the two different music records that are on YouTube.

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Speaker 1: One is called More Than Music, Period and Environment. It's

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Speaker 1: a nineteen eighty one musak record and it has a

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Speaker 1: version of Sailing Christopher Crosses Sailing.

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Speaker 2: One of the most area music sleep.

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Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. They figured out how to basically make you

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Speaker 1: lose control of your bladder listening to this exactly. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's a good one. And then the other one is

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Speaker 1: called the Blue Album, uh, and it is from nineteen

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Speaker 1: seventy four, I believe, And it's just both of them

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Speaker 1: are really great. That's good good introductions to musaic if

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Speaker 1: you're not into it already, all right.

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Speaker 2: So music is trucking along in the thirties. They get

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Speaker 2: to the forties and they think, you know what, we

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Speaker 2: need a better way to sell this stuff and to

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Speaker 2: pitch this to businesses and corporations. So why don't we

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Speaker 2: hire some people to research music and to figure out

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Speaker 2: what kinds of music keep people happy and working? And

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Speaker 2: because people, you know, they work hard in the morning,

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Speaker 2: and then they sort of lag a bit before lunch,

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Speaker 2: and then they really lag sort of a couple of

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Speaker 2: hours after lunch. So why don't we do this? So

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Speaker 2: why don't we study it? Let's call it stimulus progression.

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00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:28,639
Speaker 2: It's a bit pseudoscience. It makes sense it is in

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Speaker 2: that it's not been proven. It makes sense to everyone

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Speaker 2: who I feel like knows about it, Like sure, music

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Speaker 2: can pick you up and make you work harder, But

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Speaker 2: it's pseudoscience in that it's I don't think it's ever

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Speaker 2: been scientifically proven.

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Speaker 1: I gotcha, okay, yeah, because I keep seeing it just

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Speaker 1: like dismissed as pseudoscience. But then there were plenty of

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Speaker 1: early studies that were done by legitimate industrial psychologists and

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Speaker 1: other like efficiency experts, that kind of thing that showed

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Speaker 1: that there really was a significant like improvement and productivity

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Speaker 1: or less sick days, that kind of stuff in places

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Speaker 1: that have musaic compared to places that didn't have music

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Speaker 1: pumped into the office.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think maybe they're specific claims about a work day. Okay,

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Speaker 2: might have been a little I mean everywhere I read

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Speaker 2: said it was basically not a marketing scam, but a

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Speaker 2: marketing tool that they kind of invented.

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Speaker 1: I gotcha. But so one thing to say about this

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Speaker 1: we're going to talk about it in a second stimulus progression,

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Speaker 1: is that they did kind of plow money that they

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Speaker 1: were making. We're making a lot of money starting in

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Speaker 1: the late forties early fifties, they plowed it back into

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Speaker 1: research to basically come up with scientific evidence to back

383
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Speaker 1: up their claims, which you can really kind of see

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Speaker 1: the ghost of George Square still looming over the company,

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Speaker 1: you know, this decade or so after he died. That

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Speaker 1: it's always been this kind of science interested, if not

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00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:06,959
Speaker 1: science based company that's also been an early adopter of technology,

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Speaker 1: as we'll see.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that is certainly fair. It was never

390
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Speaker 2: just like, hey, we're just going to play a bunch

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Speaker 2: of what people might consider droll background music, like they

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Speaker 2: really did. I think I don't think it was a scam.

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Speaker 2: I think they really did try to study working environments.

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Speaker 2: And what they did with his stimulus progression was they

395
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Speaker 2: divided the work day into fifteen minute increments and basically

396
00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:37,679
Speaker 2: set a DJ playlist every fifteen minutes, and they assigned

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Speaker 2: a stimulus value from one to six, one being really

398
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Speaker 2: really mellow, six being you know, super up. And they

399
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:47,879
Speaker 2: basically went through and almost like a Pandora sort of

400
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Speaker 2: curated playlist type of thing to get people to work

401
00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 2: hard and efficiently throughout a day, and companies bought in,

402
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Speaker 2: including the US Army.

403
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think we're World War two is basically cited

404
00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,840
Speaker 1: as the moment when music kind of proved itself enough

405
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Speaker 1: at least to start being adopted by very large companies.

406
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Speaker 1: And then within a few years after the war, by

407
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Speaker 1: like the very early fifties, they started to spread more

408
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:17,520
Speaker 1: and more to even smaller and smaller companies. And it

409
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Speaker 1: was this idea that if you played music and music's

410
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Speaker 1: you know, patented stimulus progression model, you know you're going

411
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Speaker 1: to avoid that mid morning slump that like every worker

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Speaker 1: goes through, you know, in productivity, and then the mid

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Speaker 1: afternoon slump. You could avoid that too, and think about

414
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Speaker 1: how many more widgets you could make if your employees don't,

415
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Speaker 1: you know, slack off productivity wise at ten, from ten

416
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Speaker 1: thirty to lunch, and then from like two thirty until

417
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Speaker 1: they go home. Like imagine if this this very pleasant

418
00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:53,720
Speaker 1: music is just kind of keeping them humming along what

419
00:23:54,240 --> 00:23:58,439
Speaker 1: people call a forward it's just an unconscious sense of

420
00:23:58,560 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 1: forward momentum. The tempo in your environment is moving subtly

421
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:10,120
Speaker 1: faster and faster, and so to keep people from going insane,

422
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:13,639
Speaker 1: part of the stimulus progression was that the songs in

423
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,479
Speaker 1: a fifteen minute increment would kind of go up in tempo,

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Speaker 1: and then you'd have a fifteen minute break of silence,

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Speaker 1: and then the music would come back on again. But

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Speaker 1: then this fifteen minutes their first song, the tempo of

427
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Speaker 1: their first song would probably start a little faster than

428
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Speaker 1: the tempo of the first song of the last fifteen minutes,

429
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Speaker 1: And so all of a sudden, next thing, you know,

430
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Speaker 1: you're making whidge. It's like a maniac because you're being

431
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:43,240
Speaker 1: manipulated by this stimulus progression model. At least again, according

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Speaker 1: to muzak I, get what you're saying. Like, it's not like,

433
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Speaker 1: you know, Harvard came along and said, yes, we've studied

434
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:52,840
Speaker 1: this thoroughly, and this is exactly what happens. This is

435
00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 1: you know, company claims, but it is intuitively sensible at least.

436
00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:01,359
Speaker 2: Well. Yeah, I mean you need only to host house

437
00:25:01,400 --> 00:25:06,719
Speaker 2: party and play music yourself to determine how music can

438
00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:09,879
Speaker 2: affect the mood of a group of people. Put on

439
00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:12,119
Speaker 2: groove is in the heart, and you know what's gonna happen.

440
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, everybody's gonna shake their groove thing.

441
00:25:14,760 --> 00:25:16,959
Speaker 2: Everyone's gonna shape their group thing, shake their group thing.

442
00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:21,399
Speaker 2: If you put in old sour pus. Brian ENO's music

443
00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:24,520
Speaker 2: for Airports not a good party thing.

444
00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:27,399
Speaker 1: No it's not. And since you brought him up for

445
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:31,080
Speaker 1: the second time, I say we discuss Brian you know

446
00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:32,879
Speaker 1: momentarily sure.

447
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:35,919
Speaker 2: I mean I love that record, and I love a

448
00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:42,240
Speaker 2: lot of his stuff, including his ambient music experimental records.

449
00:25:42,280 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 2: I think it's really really good stuff to have on

450
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 2: if it's a nice gray day outside and you're getting

451
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:51,920
Speaker 2: work done. I really enjoyed his background music, but it's

452
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:53,880
Speaker 2: definitely not up in any way.

453
00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:56,080
Speaker 1: You know, what I found is a really good one

454
00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:59,359
Speaker 1: for what you just described. You ever listen to Future

455
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:03,080
Speaker 1: Sound of lund No. They have an album, like a

456
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:07,400
Speaker 1: double album called life Forms, and it's it's about as

457
00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 1: amazing as ambient gets. So you should check that one out.

458
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,879
Speaker 2: Embly, Emily got me into ambient I call her Embly

459
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,480
Speaker 2: when she's listening to that stuff. She really got me.

460
00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:18,440
Speaker 2: She called it ambient groove. She really got me into

461
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:23,360
Speaker 2: that stuff. Over the years. Is that like like zero

462
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,879
Speaker 2: seven and you know, stuff that's she calls it ambient groovy,

463
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:30,880
Speaker 2: just sort of sort of mellow and groovy and like

464
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:34,639
Speaker 2: zero seven and more Chiba. And it was a certain

465
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:37,399
Speaker 2: era I think where that stuff peaked Massive Attack a

466
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:39,439
Speaker 2: little bit. Oh yeah, it's good stuff.

467
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you'd like life Forms then the Future

468
00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:44,680
Speaker 1: Sign of London stuff is normally at a little more

469
00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:47,600
Speaker 1: you know, it's super cerebral and intelligent, but it's also

470
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,800
Speaker 1: fairly dancy. Life Forms is way it's probably their most

471
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:52,120
Speaker 1: ambient stuff around.

472
00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 2: So Ino though, let's get back to him. He kind

473
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:57,440
Speaker 2: of came up with this as an as an antidote

474
00:26:57,440 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 2: to music, right.

475
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 1: Yes, if you like ambient music, you better thank your

476
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:06,119
Speaker 1: lucky stars for muzak because we're not for muzak. You

477
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:08,880
Speaker 1: might not have ambient music, at least not now. Maybe

478
00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:10,920
Speaker 1: it would becoming fifty years from now, who knows.

479
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:15,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, he said, I loved that. In this article, it says,

480
00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 2: as reported by Red Bull Music, Eno said this, and

481
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:21,520
Speaker 2: this was I think for the liner notes actually to

482
00:27:21,600 --> 00:27:25,080
Speaker 2: airport or music for airports. Whereas can music's intention is

483
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:28,000
Speaker 2: to brighten the environment by adding stimulus to it, ambient

484
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:31,159
Speaker 2: music is intended to induce calm and space into space

485
00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:35,360
Speaker 2: to think, ambient music must be able to accommodate many

486
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:38,320
Speaker 2: levels of listening attention without enforcing one. In particular, it

487
00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 2: must be as ignorable as it is interesting.

488
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:46,240
Speaker 1: So he hits on something though, that people would come

489
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:51,600
Speaker 1: to really resent about musak is not even just necessarily

490
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:55,639
Speaker 1: the syrupiness of the music itself, but the intent behind

491
00:27:55,680 --> 00:28:01,200
Speaker 1: the music. That it was always intended to basic manipulate

492
00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:04,560
Speaker 1: your mood into making you a better worker, a more

493
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:10,119
Speaker 1: docile consumer. That it was poking at your brain to

494
00:28:10,119 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 1: again to get you to do things that you may

495
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,600
Speaker 1: or may not want to do. Maybe you will be

496
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,280
Speaker 1: less likely to punch some guy on the bus because

497
00:28:18,320 --> 00:28:20,720
Speaker 1: there's musac playing, which is a good thing. We should

498
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:23,480
Speaker 1: not be punching other people on the bus. But the

499
00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:26,919
Speaker 1: point is that you're being mind controlled in a certain way.

500
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:29,920
Speaker 1: And eventually people got kind of resentful of that.

501
00:28:31,720 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that's true.

502
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:35,880
Speaker 1: We're not there yet, though. We're not there yet. Though.

503
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,120
Speaker 1: There was actually a point in time, though, Chuck, where

504
00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 1: musak and popular music were basically one and the same.

505
00:28:43,760 --> 00:28:47,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was sort of I mean, one of the

506
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 2: heydays of musac certainly was in that. When you know,

507
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,520
Speaker 2: when Glen the Glenn Miller Orchestra was pop music on

508
00:28:54,560 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 2: the radio. Music wasn't a far stretch from some of

509
00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:00,320
Speaker 2: that stuff, so it was sort of all one and

510
00:29:00,360 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 2: the same. I think it was as that as styles

511
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:06,800
Speaker 2: changed and the sixties and seventies start rolling along, that

512
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:10,120
Speaker 2: musaic became really sort of a bad word to a

513
00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:11,520
Speaker 2: lot of people, right.

514
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:14,080
Speaker 1: And one of the reasons I saw that really explained

515
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:17,600
Speaker 1: it to me, because you know, things change. The society

516
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:20,640
Speaker 1: just changed between the nineteen fifties and the nineteen sixties.

517
00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:27,320
Speaker 1: It just abruptly changed. But that doesn't fully explain why

518
00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:31,760
Speaker 1: musaic just was suddenly looked down upon. A good explanation

519
00:29:31,840 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 1: I saw is that lyrics became really really important in

520
00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 1: the late sixties. People had something to say, and music

521
00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:44,720
Speaker 1: does not include lyrics. It completely undermines the point of

522
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:47,200
Speaker 1: music if you put lyrics in, or don't you know,

523
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:51,960
Speaker 1: don't rearrange the lyrics with strings. So music kind of

524
00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: couldn't couldn't keep up with that. It's not like it

525
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,280
Speaker 1: went away, it doubled down. It kept doing what it

526
00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:59,280
Speaker 1: was doing. And in fact, it would take some of

527
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:04,080
Speaker 1: those pop hits that had really monumentally important lyrics and

528
00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 1: just take the lyrics out and replace it with a

529
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:06,960
Speaker 1: saxophone or something like that.

530
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:09,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, they didn't think do that. I think it's interesting.

531
00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:11,200
Speaker 2: They could have had a really mellow singer at a

532
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 2: certain point come in and they I really respect the

533
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 2: fact that they were like, Nope, the singer is a

534
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:20,240
Speaker 2: violin and I don't want to hear it anymore. Right.

535
00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 1: But a lot of these songwriters, in particular, like I

536
00:30:22,880 --> 00:30:31,400
Speaker 1: think Joan Baez, Bruce Springsteen, Boz Skaggs, all of them

537
00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 1: refused to let their music be covered by MUSAK or

538
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:39,720
Speaker 1: any of its competitors. But Paul Simon I saw, said

539
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 1: he always knew he had a hit when he heard

540
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:43,920
Speaker 1: a musaic version of it like at the mall or

541
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,840
Speaker 1: something like that, which it's kind of like weird Al

542
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:51,000
Speaker 1: covering Nirvana, Like Cobain said that he knew that Nirvana

543
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:54,240
Speaker 1: had made it when weird Al covered smells like teen Spirit.

544
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 1: I think it's basically the same thing. Oh.

545
00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:02,080
Speaker 2: I think most musicians, unless you're a Ted Nugent who

546
00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 2: uh And we'll get to that. But very famously sort

547
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 2: of offered to buy music when they fill upon hard

548
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,400
Speaker 2: times so he could basically burn it to the ground.

549
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 2: I think most musicians deep down think it's kind of

550
00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:16,440
Speaker 2: an honor when one of their songs is musicified.

551
00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 1: It's got yeah, you'd have to play right. I just

552
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 1: want to find out what somebody's going to do with it, because,

553
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:23,560
Speaker 1: like I was saying at the beginning, like it really

554
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:27,000
Speaker 1: takes some creativity to come up with, Okay, what can

555
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 1: I replace this with that's not just completely predictable or boring,

556
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:34,160
Speaker 1: but also isn't going to grab everybody's attention, because that's

557
00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 1: again not the point of music. It's it's one of

558
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:40,640
Speaker 1: the the I don't know if it was a slogan

559
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,800
Speaker 1: of the Musaic Corporation or not, but they basically said

560
00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 1: that they fill in the awkward pauses in life m

561
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 1: to where it's, yeah, you don't like It's like you

562
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:53,520
Speaker 1: were saying at the party, if you're at a party

563
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,840
Speaker 1: that doesn't have any music on, you just probably just

564
00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:59,640
Speaker 1: get smashed out of your skull because you're just trying

565
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,680
Speaker 1: to lose kate the social situation so much. Whereas if

566
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:04,640
Speaker 1: you put on music, it's like it takes a lot

567
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 1: of that edge off. That was one of the points

568
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:09,560
Speaker 1: too with Musak, and then also to kind of get

569
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:12,600
Speaker 1: you to linger a little longer when you were shopping

570
00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:15,880
Speaker 1: in a store that was part of it as well.

571
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:20,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean music. We almost always have music on

572
00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:23,719
Speaker 2: in our house unless you know, it's night and we're watching,

573
00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:26,320
Speaker 2: you know, a movie or watching something on TV. But

574
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:30,360
Speaker 2: it almost all waking hours we have music playing in

575
00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 2: our home, and it just feels weird and quiet and

576
00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:38,000
Speaker 2: not full of life when it's when there's no music happening, Right,

577
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,479
Speaker 2: It's strange. It can be strange for sure. Should we

578
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 2: take a break?

579
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:47,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're we have reached basically the early seventies when

580
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:50,840
Speaker 1: it is Musak's first crisis point, and we'll come back

581
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 1: to that after this.

582
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 2: All right, So I'm born in nineteen seventy one, and

583
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 2: muzak starts to die a little bit because a real

584
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:32,360
Speaker 2: rock and roller came into the world.

585
00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:36,120
Speaker 1: That's right, born with a gene jacket with the Van

586
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,560
Speaker 1: Halen logo on marker in the back.

587
00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,280
Speaker 2: It did not go away completely though, it was just

588
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:45,960
Speaker 2: sort of, I guess, the beginning of the end. But

589
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,440
Speaker 2: that didn't mean there wasn't still a business model for

590
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 2: musak because music was never about its popularity.

591
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:54,360
Speaker 1: No, but there was a time where it was popular.

592
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:58,000
Speaker 1: Like JFK had it on Air Force one, Eisenhower had

593
00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 1: it piped into the White House, it was playing on

594
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 1: board Apollo eleven. Yeah, like it was like it was everywhere.

595
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 1: Like it's really hard to get across how ubiquitous it was.

596
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: But I found a quote from a guy named Professor

597
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:16,600
Speaker 1: Gary Gumpert of Queens College in New York.

598
00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:17,120
Speaker 2: Nice.

599
00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:21,200
Speaker 1: He said that that at the time, music was just

600
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:25,839
Speaker 1: kind of amniotic fluid that surrounds us. It never startles us.

601
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:28,200
Speaker 1: It is never too loud, it's never too silent. It's

602
00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:30,680
Speaker 1: always there. And that was what it was like. You

603
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:34,440
Speaker 1: were just kind of moving from one placid bucolic field

604
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,320
Speaker 1: to the next, going from mall to mall, store to store,

605
00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:40,920
Speaker 1: elevator to elevator, bus ride to bus ride. It was

606
00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 1: just absolutely everywhere. So compared to that, the idea that

607
00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 1: it's absolutely everywhere unquestioned. Yeah. It really kind of started

608
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:51,040
Speaker 1: to take a bit of a downturn in the seventies,

609
00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 1: but it just didn't go anywhere yet. It took decades

610
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:55,399
Speaker 1: for it to really take a hit. Yeah.

611
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:57,759
Speaker 2: I mean even in the eighties, that was syndicated in

612
00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:01,640
Speaker 2: nineteen countries. There were eighty million people listening, whether or

613
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:04,759
Speaker 2: not they wanted to or not, listening to music every day. Yeah,

614
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:06,960
Speaker 2: And the company ended up being bought and sold a

615
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:10,280
Speaker 2: couple of times over the years. I think in eighty

616
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:15,319
Speaker 2: one or in seventy two, a company called Teleprompter owned it, Yeah,

617
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:19,000
Speaker 2: and eighty one Westinghouse bought it. And I don't know

618
00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:22,600
Speaker 2: if I believe this. The story goes that Westinghouse learned

619
00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:26,800
Speaker 2: later on when they were buying Teleprompter that they owned music,

620
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 2: and apparently they didn't know that.

621
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 1: That's what funding Universe dot Com says.

622
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:33,759
Speaker 2: I don't know, I mean, who doesn't. Maybe back then

623
00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:37,319
Speaker 2: they didn't do research into purchasing entire corporations, but they.

624
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 1: Were on a lot of Scotch at the time.

625
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:43,080
Speaker 2: Man, although we've had companies that bought websites. And then

626
00:35:43,120 --> 00:35:45,400
Speaker 2: they learned there was a podcast program attached.

627
00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:47,839
Speaker 1: I think I've heard of that Things You Should Do

628
00:35:48,040 --> 00:35:48,879
Speaker 1: or something like that.

629
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:51,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was actually that could happen now that I

630
00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:53,080
Speaker 2: think about it, that's right.

631
00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:56,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, I kind of actually felt a deeper affinity for

632
00:35:56,640 --> 00:35:58,600
Speaker 1: music when I learned how many times they've been passed

633
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: around corporation by corporation.

634
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,200
Speaker 2: And then I think in the I think it was

635
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:06,240
Speaker 2: was when did Yesco come along? Was that the nineties?

636
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:10,320
Speaker 1: So Yesco was around from the sixties.

637
00:36:10,200 --> 00:36:12,480
Speaker 2: Well when they finally came together though, right.

638
00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:15,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, but they were early competitor, no, I guess that

639
00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 1: kind of a mid midlife competitor to Musak. But by

640
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:26,000
Speaker 1: the eighties Yesco had established a name for itself by

641
00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:30,319
Speaker 1: doing basically the opposite of what Musak did. Rather than

642
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:36,160
Speaker 1: making you know, covers of canned music without lyrics, they

643
00:36:36,200 --> 00:36:38,600
Speaker 1: would just go get the licenses of like the hot

644
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:42,440
Speaker 1: new song of the of the moment and play those

645
00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 1: and so rather than background music, which is what Musac's

646
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:50,000
Speaker 1: whole jam was, these guys were pioneering foreground music. And

647
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,839
Speaker 1: they were just a small little outfit from Seattle that

648
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:56,160
Speaker 1: you know. It was kind of like the little engine

649
00:36:56,160 --> 00:37:01,279
Speaker 1: that could. And they changed the entire landscape audio landscape

650
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:05,400
Speaker 1: of the United States just by being persistent by getting

651
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:09,960
Speaker 1: that word out that, hey, now, foreground's the way to go,

652
00:37:10,120 --> 00:37:11,840
Speaker 1: not background, that's old stuff.

653
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think that's why today when you go

654
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:17,400
Speaker 2: into publics to do your grocery shopping, you'll hear Christopher

655
00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:20,960
Speaker 2: Cross singing sailing instead of the music version of sailing.

656
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:23,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, can't we just get both? Though?

657
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:25,239
Speaker 2: Sure do we.

658
00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:26,000
Speaker 1: Have to choose?

659
00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:29,840
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm a big Christopher Cross fan. You're not

660
00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 2: going to find a bigger fan than me.

661
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 1: For real. You like him that much.

662
00:37:33,480 --> 00:37:37,200
Speaker 2: He's great. I got his two big albums I still

663
00:37:37,239 --> 00:37:38,000
Speaker 2: have on my shelf.

664
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:40,719
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, well he's sitting in the other room at

665
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:41,760
Speaker 1: my house right now.

666
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:45,520
Speaker 2: I guess you're the bigger fan. Yeah, you're like, no, no, no,

667
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:46,680
Speaker 2: he's just tied up.

668
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:49,560
Speaker 1: Well, I was gonna say he's not here on his

669
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:52,640
Speaker 1: will and his own will. In fact, you could make

670
00:37:52,680 --> 00:37:54,880
Speaker 1: a pretty strong cases here against his will.

671
00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:58,880
Speaker 2: But so in nineteen eighty four of those when Yesco

672
00:37:59,280 --> 00:38:05,399
Speaker 2: got officially involved with Musak. I think Muzak was did

673
00:38:05,400 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 2: they actually file for bankruptcy or were they just at

674
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 2: that sort of Mount precipice.

675
00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:11,880
Speaker 1: Not yet, they were teetering right there on the edge.

676
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 1: And it was actually they were bought by the Fields Company,

677
00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:17,359
Speaker 1: the company that owns Marshall Field. So Chicago makes another

678
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:21,600
Speaker 1: appearance and the Fields Company said, we like where this

679
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,719
Speaker 1: Yesco group is going, We're going to merge with them.

680
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:29,719
Speaker 1: So Musak actually merged with Yesco, the smaller company, but

681
00:38:29,760 --> 00:38:33,520
Speaker 1: then ended up moving to Seattle right before the grunge

682
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:38,239
Speaker 1: movement hit. So Seattle's big musical contribution before Grunge was

683
00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: Musak exactly.

684
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 2: I remember seeing the I remember seeing that logo. I

685
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:47,320
Speaker 2: mean you'd probably seen the vans around before and really

686
00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,040
Speaker 2: not known it's that m with the circle around it, right.

687
00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:51,800
Speaker 2: I remember when I first saw that, I was like,

688
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:54,520
Speaker 2: wait a minute, is that the Musac that's it?

689
00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:56,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, And that was a big update. They apparently went

690
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:58,680
Speaker 1: with some design group I can't remember the name of

691
00:38:58,719 --> 00:39:02,959
Speaker 1: it that just completely invented the brand because they went

692
00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:07,839
Speaker 1: from being in the background to manipulating your mood using

693
00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 1: stimulus progression to this other thing, this new sound made

694
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 1: up sounding thing called what's it called quantum physics mechanics.

695
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:22,600
Speaker 1: So keep guessing what else?

696
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 2: Realm leap? Those are all the quantums.

697
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:31,040
Speaker 1: I know there's got to be another one, Chuck, because

698
00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:35,560
Speaker 1: I'm still looking. Sorry, is that thing called it's called

699
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,719
Speaker 1: it's quantum leap? What was this called it? Quantum leap? Sure,

700
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:43,880
Speaker 1: So with this quantum leap thing that they had going on,

701
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:49,880
Speaker 1: the Bacula effect, quantum modulation, the Bacula effect, quantum modulation. Okay, okay,

702
00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:55,160
Speaker 1: I like Bacula effect, that's a great one. With quantum modulation,

703
00:39:55,680 --> 00:40:02,399
Speaker 1: it was we are evoking an emotion that is now

704
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:06,400
Speaker 1: tied forever to this the brand that you're shopping, your store,

705
00:40:06,440 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 1: you're shopping and yeah, yeah, sure, so like this this one.

706
00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:13,440
Speaker 1: So they hire people who make playlists, who curate these

707
00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:19,359
Speaker 1: playlists that are start to finish. They all share this

708
00:40:19,440 --> 00:40:22,440
Speaker 1: one theme. They all kind of have this one like cool,

709
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:29,600
Speaker 1: not scary, uh, super hip, beachy, you know, spring Break

710
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:35,440
Speaker 1: two thousand and eight, whatever, the best, So that like

711
00:40:35,520 --> 00:40:37,920
Speaker 1: a company will will say this is this is what

712
00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 1: our brand is all about. Give us playlists that fit this.

713
00:40:40,760 --> 00:40:43,760
Speaker 1: And so now you're you're kind of like you feel

714
00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:46,920
Speaker 1: cool because of the music of where you're shopping, and

715
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,360
Speaker 1: so that makes you want to shop and associate yourself

716
00:40:49,400 --> 00:40:52,359
Speaker 1: with that place even more. That's what musak, That's what

717
00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 1: the what's called neo musak is all about. That's that's

718
00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 1: the current state of affairs and the industry.

719
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, like take if you want to use Armani Exchange

720
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:07,480
Speaker 2: as an example, what they'll do is they will literally

721
00:41:07,880 --> 00:41:10,399
Speaker 2: try and make like a DJ mix with that has

722
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:13,440
Speaker 2: beat matches and it doesn't break the momentums and it's

723
00:41:13,480 --> 00:41:16,920
Speaker 2: all cross faded. Whereas if Ann Taylor calls them up,

724
00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 2: they don't want a cross fade. They want Selene Dion

725
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 2: songs and then a little bit of a small break

726
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:25,280
Speaker 2: and then a sting song coming on and these gentle

727
00:41:25,280 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 2: fades in and fades out, and you know, it's the

728
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:32,719
Speaker 2: same sort of stuff as just curated foreground music. What

729
00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:36,400
Speaker 2: I love about music is in the end, when they

730
00:41:36,400 --> 00:41:41,080
Speaker 2: were finally acquired, they had one point five million commercially

731
00:41:41,120 --> 00:41:44,520
Speaker 2: recorded songs in their catalog and they call that the Well,

732
00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:48,960
Speaker 2: that's amazing, almost eight hundred Beatles songs it is.

733
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 1: I think that's why they never fully went under is

734
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 1: that catalog kept them commercially viable for sale.

735
00:41:54,719 --> 00:41:55,920
Speaker 2: Super valuable. It's got to be.

736
00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 1: Yeah. So they were bought and I think two thousand

737
00:41:59,560 --> 00:42:04,720
Speaker 1: and nine maybe by a group called Mood Music twenty eleven,

738
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:07,879
Speaker 1: and then two years later they retired the music name

739
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 1: forever just couldn't do anything with it. So now it's

740
00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:15,239
Speaker 1: Mood Music is the company that owns the well. But

741
00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:18,400
Speaker 1: they're doing that whole four okay, they're doing that whole

742
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:23,520
Speaker 1: foreground music quantum modulation type thing where you know, you

743
00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:26,280
Speaker 1: just associate a brand with a certain kind of music.

744
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:29,399
Speaker 1: Like you would walk into that Armani Exchange and hear

745
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 1: you know, Simon yeah, Christopher Cross, You'd be like, something's

746
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:38,280
Speaker 1: off here? The mood mood what is it? Mood media?

747
00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:40,960
Speaker 1: Their their job is to make sure that there's nothing

748
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:43,040
Speaker 1: off while you're in that store, that it all just

749
00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:45,919
Speaker 1: kind of fits together and you feel good about where

750
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:46,600
Speaker 1: you're shopping.

751
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:48,480
Speaker 2: I don't know, though, Man, you want to you want

752
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:51,080
Speaker 2: to move some Harmoni gear put on, you can call

753
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,160
Speaker 2: me out. Just it fly off, man.

754
00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 1: Those kids would freak out there. Their frosted tips would

755
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:01,040
Speaker 1: stand up on and.

756
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:03,640
Speaker 2: Then and then they're like what is this. This is amazing.

757
00:43:03,880 --> 00:43:05,160
Speaker 1: I've never felt more alive.

758
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:06,799
Speaker 2: Why is Chevy Jason here?

759
00:43:08,239 --> 00:43:08,920
Speaker 1: Oh Man.

760
00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:11,359
Speaker 2: A really cool thing though, is what you were talking

761
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:15,680
Speaker 2: about with Musaic being on the tech forefront. It's really

762
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:18,680
Speaker 2: cool that over the years they were always early adopters

763
00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 2: of tech, and it's funny to think about them that way,

764
00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:24,160
Speaker 2: but they were always on the leading edge and the

765
00:43:24,160 --> 00:43:26,360
Speaker 2: forefront of what technology was doing.

766
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:30,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, so they I don't know if they invented them,

767
00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:33,560
Speaker 1: but they certainly were early adopters, if not pioneers in

768
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:37,359
Speaker 1: vinyl records. People were not using vinyl at the time.

769
00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:41,040
Speaker 1: Then they eventually ditched the vinyl records in favor of

770
00:43:41,520 --> 00:43:45,680
Speaker 1: an electronic brain called mater m the number eight and

771
00:43:45,760 --> 00:43:50,759
Speaker 1: the letter R, which basically was a big deck of

772
00:43:50,920 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 1: real the real tapes. They had a bunch of different

773
00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:57,480
Speaker 1: songs on it, but they had different inaudible pulses that

774
00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 1: would trigger a different one to come on next. You

775
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:03,120
Speaker 1: could curate lists on these huge reel to reels. It

776
00:44:03,160 --> 00:44:05,840
Speaker 1: was just amazing. They were using this thing starting in

777
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:09,960
Speaker 1: the fifties, so the whole thing became automated. They launched

778
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:12,760
Speaker 1: their own satellite in the seventies. They had a computer

779
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:16,920
Speaker 1: database in the seventies. Like they were very much pioneers

780
00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:19,360
Speaker 1: and early adopters of a lot of different technology that

781
00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:20,600
Speaker 1: we take for granted today.

782
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that you could make an argument that

783
00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:26,319
Speaker 2: they were doing the Pandora Spotify think decades before they

784
00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:26,840
Speaker 2: were doing it.

785
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:30,919
Speaker 1: Absolutely. Yeah. I mean the whole point of it too,

786
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 1: was virtually unchanged. I mean, it's not necessarily to make

787
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:39,440
Speaker 1: you a docile shopper anymore, but it's like they're trying

788
00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 1: to make you feel like that brand is part of

789
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:47,239
Speaker 1: your identity by evoking memories in you using songs to

790
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:51,960
Speaker 1: unlock them. Totally pretty interesting stuff.

791
00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:54,279
Speaker 2: Man, I'm going to go, what were those two records again?

792
00:44:54,320 --> 00:44:55,200
Speaker 2: I want to write this down.

793
00:44:55,520 --> 00:45:00,480
Speaker 1: Okay, one is more than music period and environment nineteen

794
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:04,480
Speaker 1: eighty one musak record that has not just sailing on

795
00:45:04,560 --> 00:45:10,480
Speaker 1: It has Olivia Newton John's Magic has take your Time,

796
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:13,440
Speaker 1: Do It Right, which I don't care if the lyrics

797
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:15,000
Speaker 1: are there or not. If you're sitting next to your

798
00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:18,040
Speaker 1: mom in a doctor's office and baby, you can do it.

799
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,399
Speaker 1: Take your Time, Do It Right comes on. You both

800
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:23,960
Speaker 1: know what that song's about. You know it may even

801
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:27,160
Speaker 1: be more uncomfortable in that situation, and then it ends

802
00:45:27,160 --> 00:45:30,600
Speaker 1: with funky Town Nice. It's a good one. The other

803
00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:33,480
Speaker 1: one is called the Blue Album. It's a complete stimulus

804
00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:36,240
Speaker 1: progression album, and it has a bunch of good songs

805
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:40,480
Speaker 1: on it, including Orlean's Dance with Me, which is, if

806
00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:43,880
Speaker 1: you ask me, the musaic covers way better than the original.

807
00:45:43,880 --> 00:45:47,400
Speaker 2: So not to be confused with Weezer's Blue Album.

808
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:51,239
Speaker 1: No, that's a little different. And then if you're like, oh,

809
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:54,840
Speaker 1: it's music's floating my boat, go start looking up Ronnie Aldrich,

810
00:45:55,400 --> 00:46:00,759
Speaker 1: Frank Checksfield, Montevanni, and just start yeah.

811
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:04,759
Speaker 2: And if eventually you're like, I'm feeling really goosey, how

812
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:08,560
Speaker 2: about some actual vocalists going on? And then you'll just

813
00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:11,439
Speaker 2: go right into Josh's other favorite, which is yacht rock,

814
00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:12,280
Speaker 2: easy listening.

815
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:15,279
Speaker 1: I like yacht rock a lot too. I'm super right

816
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:22,839
Speaker 1: now into West Coast cool jazz. Stan Getz chet Baker. Yeah, oh,

817
00:46:22,920 --> 00:46:25,000
Speaker 1: I can't remember. I can't remember his name, but I

818
00:46:25,200 --> 00:46:27,960
Speaker 1: just got into him. He's a great jazz pianist from

819
00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:32,080
Speaker 1: that era. Bill Evans, the Bill Evans Trio, Oh love

820
00:46:32,080 --> 00:46:34,480
Speaker 1: Bill Evans. You're just getting into Bill Evans. Yeah, I

821
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:37,839
Speaker 1: just just started getting into him. I started with Chet

822
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:39,799
Speaker 1: Baker and just started working my way out.

823
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:41,960
Speaker 2: Vincecaraldi is another great one. And I know he's known

824
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:44,359
Speaker 2: for the Charlie Brown stuff, but all of Vincecaraldy is great.

825
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:46,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, he is. You can tell just by the Charlie

826
00:46:46,600 --> 00:46:51,040
Speaker 1: Brown album that he's an amazing jazz good stuff. So, Chuck,

827
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:53,479
Speaker 1: I have one more thing. There's you know, people hate

828
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 1: music a lot, so there's some artists who have like

829
00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,439
Speaker 1: tried to a lot of artists have tried to make

830
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:03,200
Speaker 1: hey out of the whole thing. But one guy, David Schaeffer,

831
00:47:03,360 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 1: had something from back in two thousand or two thousand

832
00:47:05,440 --> 00:47:09,359
Speaker 1: and two something. He had X ten R Dot one

833
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:12,759
Speaker 1: and X ten R Dot two, these two CDs that

834
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:19,880
Speaker 1: he released that were basically his weird unnerving remixes of

835
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:23,959
Speaker 1: Musak that just turns the whole thing on its head

836
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:25,919
Speaker 1: so much so that like you may laugh out loud

837
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:29,040
Speaker 1: when you first hear them. And I believe they're on

838
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:32,120
Speaker 1: his website, but it's like a it's like Musak, but

839
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:36,320
Speaker 1: what you would hear in your nightmares. Okay, it's really good,

840
00:47:36,719 --> 00:47:38,440
Speaker 1: and I believe he's got it on his website to

841
00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:40,120
Speaker 1: go listen to and I think you can buy the

842
00:47:40,160 --> 00:47:42,040
Speaker 1: CDs too, so check that out.

843
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:42,839
Speaker 2: We'll check it out.

844
00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:45,360
Speaker 1: Okay, Well, if you want to know more about Musak,

845
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:49,319
Speaker 1: just start listening and loving. Just just don't prejudge. How

846
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:52,799
Speaker 1: about that? And since I said don't prejudge everybody, that

847
00:47:52,840 --> 00:47:54,319
Speaker 1: means it's time for listener male.

848
00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 2: I'm gonna call this from Lauren. Hey, guys, a man

849
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:03,200
Speaker 2: walks down the street and says, why am I soft

850
00:48:03,239 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 2: in the middle? The rest of my life is so hard?

851
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:07,239
Speaker 2: Oh wait a minute, Sorry.

852
00:48:07,280 --> 00:48:09,680
Speaker 1: What a perfect email for this one.

853
00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:14,240
Speaker 2: I was reading my forearm tattoo by accident. Hey, guys,

854
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:16,080
Speaker 2: been listening to stuff you should know for a few years.

855
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:18,240
Speaker 2: Off and turn up the volume and play an episode

856
00:48:18,239 --> 00:48:20,480
Speaker 2: while I cooked dinner. My seven year old daughter Lila

857
00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:23,719
Speaker 2: used to complain, oh, you're listening to this again. But

858
00:48:23,760 --> 00:48:26,440
Speaker 2: I recently caught her singing the beat to the intro music,

859
00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:29,360
Speaker 2: and she'll casually mention things she's heard from time to time.

860
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:33,560
Speaker 2: I suspect she's fond of the animal episodes. Anyway, you'll

861
00:48:33,680 --> 00:48:36,680
Speaker 2: jokingly sometimes say Jerry, well, you have to edit that.

862
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 2: You're gonna have to edit that part out, and it

863
00:48:39,120 --> 00:48:41,839
Speaker 2: has me curious how often things are cut from an

864
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:44,919
Speaker 2: episode and why bad jokes too long? Have you ever

865
00:48:45,120 --> 00:48:47,919
Speaker 2: had to completely redo one? I think it'd be really

866
00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:49,680
Speaker 2: interesting to know, and I bet Lilah would find it

867
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:52,479
Speaker 2: encouraging since she likes to make videos of herself singing

868
00:48:52,520 --> 00:48:55,919
Speaker 2: and dancing for the record, y'all make it effortless and

869
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:58,080
Speaker 2: see effortless and it's always a joy to listen to.

870
00:48:58,200 --> 00:49:05,839
Speaker 2: That is Lauren from Montablo, Alabama, and she said, yes that. Yeah,

871
00:49:05,840 --> 00:49:06,520
Speaker 2: you're probably right.

872
00:49:06,760 --> 00:49:08,600
Speaker 1: You put a little too much mustard on there.

873
00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:11,000
Speaker 2: She says, ps, how cool if a mom would I

874
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:12,920
Speaker 2: be if my daughter heard her names on the podcast?

875
00:49:13,239 --> 00:49:13,920
Speaker 1: Yeah? Cool?

876
00:49:13,920 --> 00:49:17,080
Speaker 2: So there you go, Lauren and Lilah. The answer is.

877
00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:21,880
Speaker 1: Very little gets edited out, just the singing and dancing.

878
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:23,360
Speaker 2: Like that siren in the background.

879
00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:26,160
Speaker 1: We'll probably just leave that into proven leave that in.

880
00:49:26,640 --> 00:49:29,680
Speaker 2: No, we don't edit a lot out occasionally, like we

881
00:49:29,760 --> 00:49:32,680
Speaker 2: found out when we said this before. Early on, we

882
00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:34,719
Speaker 2: left in the words stumbles and the ums and the

883
00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:37,520
Speaker 2: uzz and just because it's a conversation and we didn't

884
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:40,520
Speaker 2: want to make it seem too scripted because it's not,

885
00:49:40,840 --> 00:49:43,879
Speaker 2: or canned because it's not. And so we just left

886
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:48,160
Speaker 2: that stuff in there. And the only time, like like

887
00:49:48,239 --> 00:49:50,160
Speaker 2: I think today you had to look something up real quick.

888
00:49:50,160 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 2: But that doesn't happen much.

889
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:52,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, I had to poke my head out of the

890
00:49:52,960 --> 00:49:55,400
Speaker 1: studio and look at my record collection to come up

891
00:49:55,440 --> 00:49:56,480
Speaker 1: to Evans name.

892
00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:59,960
Speaker 2: So I mean that's gone now, but very little is

893
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:02,480
Speaker 2: edit it out. It's especially after this many years. It's

894
00:50:03,040 --> 00:50:05,840
Speaker 2: we're not one take wonders, but it's Cherry doesn't have

895
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:06,879
Speaker 2: the harness job in the world.

896
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:12,359
Speaker 1: You know, we've taken it easy on her for years. Yeah, yeah,

897
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:14,719
Speaker 1: that's about it, Chuck. I can't think of anything else

898
00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:15,640
Speaker 1: we really added out.

899
00:50:16,400 --> 00:50:19,760
Speaker 2: But that's not to say that shows that are heavily

900
00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:22,879
Speaker 2: edited and varies kind of scripty and slick, like there's

901
00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 2: a room for those two. Oh yeah, we're not the

902
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:27,080
Speaker 2: only way to do it now.

903
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:29,839
Speaker 1: We're like the Musac of podcasts. There's other people who

904
00:50:29,880 --> 00:50:32,359
Speaker 1: are all like the Ted NuGen of podcasts, and there's

905
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:33,080
Speaker 1: room for both.

906
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:35,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, like Roman Mars, the Ted NuGen of podcasting.

907
00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:38,960
Speaker 1: That's right, man, that guy's always wearing like a studded

908
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:40,680
Speaker 1: leather wrist band and stuff.

909
00:50:40,800 --> 00:50:42,839
Speaker 2: I keep waiting on Roman to text me and being

910
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:45,560
Speaker 2: like you guys are consistently talking smack about me.

911
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:49,280
Speaker 1: He doesn't listen, and no one he knows listens listens.

912
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:56,560
Speaker 1: That's impossible, So who is that? Lila and Lauren correct nice. Well,

913
00:50:56,560 --> 00:50:58,720
Speaker 1: thank you very much for writing in hope. We answered

914
00:50:58,719 --> 00:51:01,640
Speaker 1: your question, and if you want to get in touch

915
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:04,799
Speaker 1: with us, like Lila and Lauren did, you can send

916
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:08,080
Speaker 1: us an email. Send it off to stuff podcast at

917
00:51:08,080 --> 00:51:14,040
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio dot com. Stuff you Should Know is a production

918
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:17,600
Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the

919
00:51:17,640 --> 00:51:20,920
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

920
00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:21,720
Speaker 1: favorite shows.