WEBVTT - The Good Bootlegger: Roy Olmstead

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<v Speaker 1>Ridiculous crime. It's a production of iHeartRadio.

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<v Speaker 2>Zarin Elizabeth.

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<v Speaker 3>How are you?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm doing well.

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<v Speaker 3>How are you pal? I'm good good.

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<v Speaker 2>How is your heart good?

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<v Speaker 3>My heart is pumping full, it's working, it's full, it's rhythmic,

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<v Speaker 3>full of beans, full of vinegar. How's your heart?

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<v Speaker 2>None of those apply to hearts, But I like it.

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<v Speaker 2>You're creative.

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<v Speaker 3>I am full of it. I'm full of everything.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. My heart's just steady, working and trying to lay low.

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<v Speaker 3>My heart overflows.

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<v Speaker 2>It doesn't want to get an attitude like my kidneys.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, it's good. Our organs are all operating in good

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<v Speaker 3>working order.

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<v Speaker 2>That's what the doctor's say.

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<v Speaker 3>Congratulations, you know it's ridiculous.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm so glad you asked I do Oh good?

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<v Speaker 3>Please share.

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<v Speaker 2>Have you ever watched the TV show Webster, Yeah with

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<v Speaker 2>the Little Kid, Yeah, yeah, Manuel Lewis, Yes, yes, yes,

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<v Speaker 2>So do you know anything about the final episode of

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<v Speaker 2>that series? Final episode it was a crossover event The

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<v Speaker 2>Very Fast.

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<v Speaker 3>With Homicide Life on the Street.

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<v Speaker 2>Practically, no, no, it was not. But the last episode

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<v Speaker 2>of the sixth season was called web Trek because Webster

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<v Speaker 2>gets beamed aboard the US as Enterprise. What and there

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<v Speaker 2>he is the new one, the new like the new

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<v Speaker 2>Star Trek Next Generation Picard totally with Lieutenant Wharf, the

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<v Speaker 2>klingon with the wrinkled head. So Webster's chilling with him.

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<v Speaker 2>And yes, it's like a wait.

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<v Speaker 3>So that those universes overlap.

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<v Speaker 2>Apparently, so Webster is part of the official Star Trek

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<v Speaker 2>cannon because he was like there on like the bridge,

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<v Speaker 2>like he's not just like they don't come down to

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<v Speaker 2>visit him.

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<v Speaker 3>He goes, and then just the rest of his family

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<v Speaker 3>is like, I don't know what happened.

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<v Speaker 2>And then he gets like a featured like in the

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<v Speaker 2>Next Generation episode essentially because there's also it's like a

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<v Speaker 2>whole thing.

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<v Speaker 3>Well then they just kill them off. What happened after?

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know what happened. I want to know what

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<v Speaker 2>web because remember they're also in different centuries. So this

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<v Speaker 2>is like the second time Star Trek has gone back

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<v Speaker 2>to the eighties, because they do it in Star Trek

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<v Speaker 2>four with the Whales with the original cast and then

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<v Speaker 2>the new cast, like we're also going back to the

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<v Speaker 2>eighties and we're picking up a small black orphan.

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<v Speaker 3>You have to find this episode.

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<v Speaker 2>There you go. It's ridiculous.

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<v Speaker 3>That is ridiculous. That should be an episode us watching

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<v Speaker 3>that episode. Do you want to know what else is ridiculous?

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<v Speaker 2>Please?

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<v Speaker 3>The illusion of privacy? That's ridiculous. This is is ridiculous

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<v Speaker 3>crime A podcast about absurd and outrageous capers. Heis and

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<v Speaker 3>cons it's always ninety nine percent murder free and one

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<v Speaker 3>hundred percent ridiculous.

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<v Speaker 2>I know you heard that.

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<v Speaker 3>I know I told you recently about Popcorn Sutton. I

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<v Speaker 3>loved him down in Dirty Bootlegger Moonshine, Oh, I love it.

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<v Speaker 3>He was the best. He was a rascal went through

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<v Speaker 3>and that's par for the course when it comes to

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<v Speaker 3>like the bootlegging type. Sure, yeah, but not always all

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<v Speaker 3>always for book counts. I have a guy for you

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<v Speaker 3>today who runs that full Vonnegut story arc on the

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<v Speaker 3>chalkboard that used to do. His story is a roller

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<v Speaker 3>coaster and a study in human nature and redemption. Today,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm going to tell you all about Roy Olmsted So.

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<v Speaker 3>He was born in eighteen eighty six to a good

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<v Speaker 3>family in Beaver City, Nebraska.

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<v Speaker 2>Beaver City, Nebraska, beaver City, population fourteen Salt.

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<v Speaker 3>Of the Earth nineteen oh four. He's eighteen years old

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<v Speaker 3>and he picked up stakes, and he moved to Seattle. Why,

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<v Speaker 3>I don't know.

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<v Speaker 2>The railroad went there, sure.

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<v Speaker 3>And once there, well, I mean it was like he

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<v Speaker 3>was going to start the grunge movement. Yeah, he gets

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<v Speaker 3>there and he becomes a police officer, as you do.

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<v Speaker 2>So Seattle, which has a notoriously like suspect police department

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<v Speaker 2>at the time.

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<v Speaker 3>He was a cop in Seattle around the same time

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<v Speaker 3>my great great grandpa was a cop in San Francisco.

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<v Speaker 3>And so while my police organization, well my ancestor was

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<v Speaker 3>as crooked as they come, Olmsted was a straight arrow.

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<v Speaker 3>He worked his way up to lieutenant or as they say,

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<v Speaker 3>across the pond lieutenant. I just love saying that.

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<v Speaker 2>Also, by the way, on West coast police departments, you

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<v Speaker 2>ever wondered why there's not a lot of big mob

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<v Speaker 2>organization on the West Coast because the police were doing

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<v Speaker 2>They were in charge of the squad, in charge of

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<v Speaker 2>the vice.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, we got lock exactly. They're like, this is our turf.

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<v Speaker 3>The Seattle Post Intelligencer had this like later profile of him,

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<v Speaker 3>and they said he had quote a knack for police work,

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<v Speaker 3>and he impressed superiors with his professionalism and intelligence. He

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<v Speaker 3>dutifully participated in busts and raids of rum smugglers and

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<v Speaker 3>noted when members of the quote Dry Squad were arrested

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<v Speaker 3>for stealing from the confiscated goods or taking bribes, were saying, yeah,

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<v Speaker 3>so he squealed on his coworkers.

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<v Speaker 2>Well you know he got it, Rye squad.

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<v Speaker 3>I see who you are. He's a snitch. This is

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<v Speaker 3>before prohibition, mind you, because in nineteen sixteen Washington State

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<v Speaker 3>banned alcohol.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Early, they were early on.

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<v Speaker 3>The three years ahead of the curve.

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<v Speaker 2>So because those boomtowns, you know, they were.

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<v Speaker 3>Suffering through heavens. Yeah, So then prohibition kicked in nationwide

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<v Speaker 3>and that became Olmsted's like primary focus is a big job.

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<v Speaker 3>And sharing a border with Canada meant that Washington and

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<v Speaker 3>Seattle were a main point of entry for booze as

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<v Speaker 3>it made its way into the state.

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<v Speaker 2>All those waterways. Oh yeah, you can imagine.

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<v Speaker 3>So Olmsted saw what he was attempting to dismantle. So

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<v Speaker 3>there's this huge market willing to pay above top dollar

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<v Speaker 3>for liquor, and then the bootleggers are like kind of

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<v Speaker 3>disorganized and almost bumbling, and so we have this huge

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<v Speaker 3>treasure trove of high quality alcohol just miles away. He

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<v Speaker 3>couldn't help but see the situation and the opportunity. He

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<v Speaker 3>was organized, he's driven, he's creative in his thinking, like

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<v Speaker 3>he's the man for the job.

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<v Speaker 2>He's like, wait a minute, on the wrong.

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<v Speaker 3>Side of this, So he figures like I'm a dip

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<v Speaker 3>my toe in per the New Yorker quote. In nineteen twenty,

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<v Speaker 3>with the onset of prohibition, the thirty three year old

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<v Speaker 3>married father of two ventured to the other side of

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<v Speaker 3>the law, making midnight runs to retrieve imported Canadian liquor

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<v Speaker 3>from tugboats in the Puget Sound.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh there you go, so woo.

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<v Speaker 3>He's off to the races until he March twenty second,

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<v Speaker 3>nineteen twenty two months.

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<v Speaker 2>After prohibition at the beginning.

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<v Speaker 3>Into effect, he got busted.

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<v Speaker 2>Three months he had.

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<v Speaker 3>Managed to like skip around all these roadblocks that were

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<v Speaker 3>set up by the cops. But then he was eventually spotted, recognized, arrested.

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<v Speaker 2>Early because I mean, he's busting other people, and then

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<v Speaker 2>they make it officially. He's like, okay, let me get

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<v Speaker 2>in on this.

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<v Speaker 3>And now that it's a federal crime to get busted.

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<v Speaker 3>So he lost his job obviously, and he wound up

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<v Speaker 3>pleading guilty, had to pay a five hundred dollars fine,

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<v Speaker 3>and he may have lost his job and some cash,

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<v Speaker 3>but he gained the respect and admiration of the public

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<v Speaker 3>and he became a folk hero.

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<v Speaker 2>Really.

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<v Speaker 3>Everyone loved the fact that this cop flipped over and

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<v Speaker 3>was running booze. They're like, this is great. Yeah, and

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<v Speaker 3>a folk here working for us, Yes, and he can't

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<v Speaker 3>just abandon his calling, like what makes him the celebrity

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<v Speaker 3>he is, So he went all in. He headed up

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<v Speaker 3>to Canada to do some deals. Okay, so, thanks to

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<v Speaker 3>prohibition and like other economic forces, Canada and Mexico were

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<v Speaker 3>starting to establish trade relations and Olmsteed won it in

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<v Speaker 3>on that kind of He went up to Canada under

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<v Speaker 3>the pretense of buying liquor for import into Mexico. He

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<v Speaker 3>was going to be a middleman.

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<v Speaker 2>So they're cutting out the US and it'd be like,

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<v Speaker 2>we both still drink.

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<v Speaker 3>We're civilized, we can where adults were grown. Yeah, we

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<v Speaker 3>can handle our whiskey and tequila, right, And he's like, guys,

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<v Speaker 3>I'll be your import export dude, Like I'm your middleman

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<v Speaker 3>and I'm just trying to get Canada's quality stock to

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<v Speaker 3>the good folks down Mexico Way, and the Canadians are

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<v Speaker 3>like capital idea, let's do it. And then they all

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<v Speaker 3>high fived and signed the deal is amazing. So Olmsted

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<v Speaker 3>bought his cargo, had it loaded onto ships with manifests

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<v Speaker 3>indicating Mexico as the destination. And what I would imagine

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<v Speaker 3>was probably like port of Lazaro Cardenas in Machoicon. That's

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<v Speaker 3>like the big dog one down there. So as the

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<v Speaker 3>ships were heading out to the Pacific Ocean via the

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<v Speaker 3>Salish Sea, they made a detour and they would slip

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<v Speaker 3>into the Puget Sound under cover of darkness, never making

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<v Speaker 3>it to the open water the Pacific, never making it

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<v Speaker 3>south of Washington State, never went down to Mexico. The sound.

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<v Speaker 3>Puget Sound is full of islands and inlets and coats,

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<v Speaker 3>and some more difficult to access than others. So he

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<v Speaker 3>had crews at a bunch of locations all along the sound,

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<v Speaker 3>tucked in where like nosy, lookie louse couldn't see it.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, I mean, you know, it's like gray skies,

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<v Speaker 2>it's like lots of day.

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<v Speaker 3>And so they were there to intercept that Canadian liquor

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<v Speaker 3>for sale. And distribution right here in the US of A.

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<v Speaker 3>So Olmsted had this whole network of guys, rum runners

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<v Speaker 3>in their fast boats. He had heavies to carry the

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<v Speaker 3>boxes of booze from the boats to waiting cars and trucks,

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<v Speaker 3>drivers to speed down back roads. Workers on a farm

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<v Speaker 3>that served as a storage facility, loading and unloading the

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<v Speaker 3>disguised payload in the barns.

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<v Speaker 2>His distribution centers.

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<v Speaker 3>Say, insiders at bars and restaurants and speakeasies like get

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<v Speaker 3>up one to pay.

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<v Speaker 5>Oh.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah. He had lawyers, dispatchers, clerks. The ships had skippers

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<v Speaker 3>and navigators. There were bottlers for the wholesale purchases. He

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<v Speaker 3>was a systems loaders, drivers, deliveryment, bill collectors, salesmen, all

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<v Speaker 3>part of the Olmsted machine. And as Shirley Manson saying

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<v Speaker 3>in Garbage, I'm only happy when it rains. That was Olmsted, like.

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<v Speaker 3>He loved bad Seattle weather. That's his favorite, yeah, because

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<v Speaker 3>that's when the Coastguard was least likely to be on patrol.

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<v Speaker 3>And so one location he loved to use when the

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<v Speaker 3>weather was bad was Darcy Island, and it's in this

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<v Speaker 3>strait right off Vancouver Island. It was used as a

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<v Speaker 3>leper colony for Chinese immigrants up until nineteen twenty four,

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<v Speaker 3>and that's around when he's using it. So we call

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<v Speaker 3>leprosy Hanson's disease today. Yeah. In other words, a lazaretto

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<v Speaker 3>is what this was. And when they closed it, they

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<v Speaker 3>moved the last remaining five or so afflicted to another island,

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<v Speaker 3>and that one was tending to an outbreak of Hanson's

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<v Speaker 3>among duke Bores. You ever heard of them? No, you're

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<v Speaker 3>curious like I was when reading about this in an

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<v Speaker 3>old newspaper. Thanks to newspapers dot Com. Check this out.

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<v Speaker 3>So the duke Bors translates to spirit wrestlers, and they

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<v Speaker 3>are spiritual Christian ethno religious group of Russian origin, strict pacifists.

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<v Speaker 3>They believe in egalitarianism, They reject institutional church authority.

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<v Speaker 2>Were were they the Newdists?

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<v Speaker 3>No? No, So they ran from religious persecution in Russia

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<v Speaker 3>made their way to Western Canada around the turn of

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<v Speaker 3>the twentieth century. But they refused to take an oath

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<v Speaker 3>of allegiance to the British crown, and they didn't believe

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<v Speaker 3>in individual land ownership, just communal living. So they made

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<v Speaker 3>their way to the west coutine and boundary regions of

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<v Speaker 3>British Columbia where people would just leave alone. So then

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<v Speaker 3>they had this outbreak of leprosy of Hanson's disease, and

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<v Speaker 3>they had to be isolated and put on a lazaretto

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<v Speaker 3>on an island in the Sound. So back at Darcy Island,

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<v Speaker 3>I think Olmsted was using the island in the final

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<v Speaker 3>days of the colony and then after it shuttered, so

0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:29.200
<v Speaker 3>there would be all these row houses along the shore,

0:12:29.400 --> 0:12:33.720
<v Speaker 3>newly empty and like makeshift graves still fresh. Wow, and

0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:36.720
<v Speaker 3>these loading and people. I was reading up on the

0:12:36.720 --> 0:12:39.720
<v Speaker 3>island as part of my dedication to side Quest, and

0:12:39.800 --> 0:12:42.880
<v Speaker 3>I found this really interesting article in British Columbia magazine

0:12:43.040 --> 0:12:46.720
<v Speaker 3>about it. It's like it's a tragic place, obviously, and

0:12:46.760 --> 0:12:50.000
<v Speaker 3>the author even admits that it carries like a strange,

0:12:50.280 --> 0:12:54.960
<v Speaker 3>ominous energy to this day. But for our purposes here today,

0:12:55.080 --> 0:12:58.959
<v Speaker 3>this bit I found helpful. Quote. Below, the water around

0:12:59.040 --> 0:13:03.360
<v Speaker 3>the island's shores lurk numerous hazards, while above it erratic

0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:07.560
<v Speaker 3>moody currents break on reefs and shoals. George Mercer, who

0:13:07.600 --> 0:13:10.400
<v Speaker 3>was an ecologist with Parks Canada for more than three

0:13:10.480 --> 0:13:14.439
<v Speaker 3>decades before retiring in twenty twelve, knows Darcy Island. Well,

0:13:14.920 --> 0:13:17.440
<v Speaker 3>it's notorious. When there's a tide, you can see it

0:13:17.480 --> 0:13:20.160
<v Speaker 3>from the air, and it's just wild. You have ripped

0:13:20.160 --> 0:13:24.160
<v Speaker 3>tides all around, submerged rocks and powerful tides and currents.

0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:28.360
<v Speaker 3>Boaters and kayakers have to really choose their time. Mercer,

0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:30.679
<v Speaker 3>who has since retired, has now turned his hand to

0:13:30.720 --> 0:13:36.000
<v Speaker 3>writing popular mysteries based on some of these parks. Yeah, okay,

0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:39.040
<v Speaker 3>so that's so Darcy Island. It's super treacherous. But he's

0:13:39.040 --> 0:13:41.400
<v Speaker 3>got all these guys who know everything like the back

0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:43.679
<v Speaker 3>of their hands, and they're willing to go on to

0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:46.719
<v Speaker 3>this spooky island with terrible conditions.

0:13:46.800 --> 0:13:49.160
<v Speaker 2>Oh and it's not like the wet leprosy like there's bandages.

0:13:49.559 --> 0:13:51.880
<v Speaker 2>It's all past. So it's just no real danger to

0:13:51.920 --> 0:13:52.280
<v Speaker 2>the people.

0:13:52.520 --> 0:13:54.280
<v Speaker 3>At this point in the papers when I was looking

0:13:54.280 --> 0:13:56.360
<v Speaker 3>it up, they're like they had hit like a treatment

0:13:56.440 --> 0:13:59.240
<v Speaker 3>for it. Okay, And so that was what made a

0:13:59.240 --> 0:14:01.240
<v Speaker 3>big change why they were able to kind. But you

0:14:01.280 --> 0:14:04.520
<v Speaker 3>know the at Darcy Island when it was the Chinese

0:14:04.520 --> 0:14:07.679
<v Speaker 3>immigrants there, they people went once a year to give

0:14:07.720 --> 0:14:11.040
<v Speaker 3>them or twice a year something you had to supplies,

0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:13.000
<v Speaker 3>and then when they finally got a treatment, then they

0:14:13.080 --> 0:14:15.440
<v Speaker 3>dropped doctors and treated them, and then like you know,

0:14:15.480 --> 0:14:17.320
<v Speaker 3>we're able to kind of move forward. And like I said,

0:14:17.320 --> 0:14:19.760
<v Speaker 3>they took the last remaining people put them over in

0:14:19.760 --> 0:14:23.840
<v Speaker 3>the other lazaretto. But so we got Darcy Island and

0:14:23.880 --> 0:14:27.800
<v Speaker 3>there's Olmsted's gang unloading four thousand sacks of whiskey at

0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:31.160
<v Speaker 3>a time onto the shore, waiting for quick boats to

0:14:31.240 --> 0:14:35.360
<v Speaker 3>take smaller loads into Puget Sound. So everyone from his

0:14:35.480 --> 0:14:39.760
<v Speaker 3>fellow crooks to the federal agents pursuing him called Olmsted

0:14:40.160 --> 0:14:44.720
<v Speaker 3>quote the good bootlegger. Yeah, because he was as honest

0:14:44.720 --> 0:14:47.920
<v Speaker 3>a criminal as there could be. So he never watered

0:14:47.920 --> 0:14:50.280
<v Speaker 3>down his whiskey or blended it with cheap or like

0:14:50.360 --> 0:14:55.040
<v Speaker 3>poisonous filler. He stuck solely to running alcohol. More than

0:14:55.080 --> 0:14:59.080
<v Speaker 3>once he was offered entrance into other criminal enterprises drugs,

0:14:59.080 --> 0:15:03.680
<v Speaker 3>prostitution always declined. And what puts him in the ridiculous

0:15:03.720 --> 0:15:07.480
<v Speaker 3>crime Hall of Mummayhn is that he was never violent.

0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:10.720
<v Speaker 3>He told his men that if they were caught, they

0:15:10.760 --> 0:15:14.240
<v Speaker 3>needed to use bribes. No violence, It's like economic violence.

0:15:14.320 --> 0:15:16.400
<v Speaker 2>Okay. So he was just like Johnny applesy for liquor.

0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:19.800
<v Speaker 3>Yes, and he wouldn't let any of his organization carry weapons.

0:15:19.880 --> 0:15:22.720
<v Speaker 3>And he was known to say, quote, no amount of

0:15:22.760 --> 0:15:24.960
<v Speaker 3>money is worth a human life. That's what you would

0:15:25.000 --> 0:15:25.840
<v Speaker 3>tell him. Right.

0:15:26.520 --> 0:15:30.000
<v Speaker 2>So here here, mummy, yeah right.

0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:33.440
<v Speaker 3>So it's the early nineteen twenties. His business is booming.

0:15:33.640 --> 0:15:36.160
<v Speaker 3>Guys making two hundred grand a month. Do you want

0:15:36.200 --> 0:15:39.520
<v Speaker 3>me to blow your socks off, Sarian, that's almost four

0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:42.400
<v Speaker 3>million today a month a month.

0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:46.560
<v Speaker 2>Drug dealing, zim, Yeah, it is so drug deal.

0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:54.000
<v Speaker 3>It wasn't Harlem exactly. It wasn't surprising then that he

0:15:54.160 --> 0:15:57.400
<v Speaker 3>was one of the biggest employers in all of Seattle.

0:15:57.040 --> 0:15:59.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh magine, Washington state. Other than logging.

0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:04.240
<v Speaker 3>He had the mayor Doc Brown in his pocket. He

0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:08.800
<v Speaker 3>was buddies with the chief of Police Brown, Doc Brown. Yeah.

0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:11.160
<v Speaker 3>He could pretty much conduct business out in the open.

0:16:11.200 --> 0:16:13.080
<v Speaker 3>It was no big deal. And it got to the

0:16:13.080 --> 0:16:15.560
<v Speaker 3>point where he could like unload whiskey in the middle

0:16:15.600 --> 0:16:18.920
<v Speaker 3>of the day from trucks marked fresh fish. It didn't matter.

0:16:19.880 --> 0:16:26.520
<v Speaker 3>According to according to Seattle's NPR station k u o

0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:29.920
<v Speaker 3>W quote, he was very approachable if you saw him

0:16:29.960 --> 0:16:31.560
<v Speaker 3>on the street and wanted to talk to him. You

0:16:31.560 --> 0:16:34.000
<v Speaker 3>could stop and take a picture with you, or shake

0:16:34.040 --> 0:16:35.480
<v Speaker 3>your hand, chat with you for a bit.

0:16:36.080 --> 0:16:39.040
<v Speaker 2>Just a nice guy, an amiable officer, friendly who's now

0:16:39.080 --> 0:16:39.680
<v Speaker 2>a run runner.

0:16:40.240 --> 0:16:41.920
<v Speaker 3>No one got in his way, and not because he

0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:45.120
<v Speaker 3>was a tough guy. He was just charismatic, straightforward. He

0:16:45.200 --> 0:16:49.360
<v Speaker 3>knew what people wanted. Both booze and a legendary figure

0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:52.960
<v Speaker 3>to talk about. Back to k U O W quote.

0:16:53.120 --> 0:16:57.280
<v Speaker 3>The founders of a major airplane manufacturer were customers reputedly

0:16:59.000 --> 0:17:02.240
<v Speaker 3>at a prominent gentlemen's club in downtown Seattle. Was a

0:17:02.240 --> 0:17:05.960
<v Speaker 3>customer of Olmsted, as were speakeasies all over town, from

0:17:06.000 --> 0:17:08.360
<v Speaker 3>those in the central district to those in the city's

0:17:08.359 --> 0:17:12.359
<v Speaker 3>most exclusive neighborhoods. It really was. Olmsted really served a

0:17:12.400 --> 0:17:16.520
<v Speaker 3>clientele that covered the demographic bases of our city. Seattle

0:17:16.600 --> 0:17:19.359
<v Speaker 3>was a boomtown in the nineteen twenties. Oh yeah, oh yeah.

0:17:19.440 --> 0:17:21.399
<v Speaker 2>Have you ever seen the president of Seattle before it

0:17:21.440 --> 0:17:23.800
<v Speaker 2>was a town? These spikes of hills and they're not

0:17:23.880 --> 0:17:24.800
<v Speaker 2>like hills, are like.

0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:30.040
<v Speaker 3>Crazy, exactly exactly. Let's stop for a second. Imagine what

0:17:30.200 --> 0:17:34.480
<v Speaker 3>Seattle in the twenties must have been like spikes of hills, boomtown.

0:17:34.160 --> 0:17:36.920
<v Speaker 2>Log roll like the actual skid row. They had an

0:17:36.920 --> 0:17:38.080
<v Speaker 2>actual skid row.

0:17:38.240 --> 0:17:40.520
<v Speaker 3>So let's daydream a little and when we come back,

0:17:40.840 --> 0:18:07.200
<v Speaker 3>more of the Olmsted machine. Sarah Elizabeth, where was I?

0:18:08.400 --> 0:18:08.879
<v Speaker 2>Where were you?

0:18:09.160 --> 0:18:12.400
<v Speaker 3>I was Roy Olmstead. So he is a big deal

0:18:12.880 --> 0:18:16.440
<v Speaker 3>running a big operation. He had an office in downtown Seattle,

0:18:16.560 --> 0:18:17.960
<v Speaker 3>one block from the Federal Building.

0:18:18.080 --> 0:18:19.040
<v Speaker 2>M hm uh.

0:18:19.160 --> 0:18:22.320
<v Speaker 3>And there were three telephone lines installed in his office,

0:18:22.359 --> 0:18:25.280
<v Speaker 3>which was like a big deal totally. According to the

0:18:25.280 --> 0:18:28.920
<v Speaker 3>New Yorker quote, one of his men, a former taxi dispatcher,

0:18:29.280 --> 0:18:32.159
<v Speaker 3>sat during business hours at a roll top desk, taking

0:18:32.240 --> 0:18:36.679
<v Speaker 3>and making calls, keeping meticulous records of each transaction. If

0:18:36.720 --> 0:18:40.400
<v Speaker 3>a serious matter arose, such as an employee's arrest, Olmsted

0:18:40.520 --> 0:18:42.879
<v Speaker 3>himself called a friend on the Seattle Police Force to

0:18:42.920 --> 0:18:43.680
<v Speaker 3>have it squashed.

0:18:43.920 --> 0:18:46.560
<v Speaker 2>Of course, he's got tons of friends on these Yeah,

0:18:46.600 --> 0:18:48.440
<v Speaker 2>he is a former coworkers. I mean yeah. So it's

0:18:48.480 --> 0:18:50.000
<v Speaker 2>like and he didn't go out badly.

0:18:50.240 --> 0:18:53.719
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, well yeah, I got I like fire on police.

0:18:54.119 --> 0:18:56.200
<v Speaker 2>He didn't like beat anybody up. He didn't take anybody

0:18:56.240 --> 0:18:56.920
<v Speaker 2>down with him.

0:18:57.000 --> 0:18:59.080
<v Speaker 3>And you know they're all thinking the same thing, like

0:18:59.160 --> 0:19:00.000
<v Speaker 3>this is easy money.

0:19:00.320 --> 0:19:03.000
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it's just like there's some pool money.

0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:06.240
<v Speaker 3>So at this point he's only interacting with Seattle PD.

0:19:06.440 --> 0:19:10.040
<v Speaker 3>But then the Feds got window. There was just too

0:19:10.119 --> 0:19:14.359
<v Speaker 3>much alcohol flowing through Seattle like something had to be done,

0:19:14.520 --> 0:19:18.080
<v Speaker 3>and the FEDS loved busting guys like him, so the

0:19:18.119 --> 0:19:23.119
<v Speaker 3>Feds descended on Seattle. They had developed quite a wiretap

0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:26.640
<v Speaker 3>system by this point, and sometime in nineteen twenty four

0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:27.880
<v Speaker 3>they wired Olmsted.

0:19:27.960 --> 0:19:29.040
<v Speaker 2>Oh so we're still prehover.

0:19:29.359 --> 0:19:32.560
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, So a guy dressed in the uniform of a

0:19:32.560 --> 0:19:37.320
<v Speaker 3>telephone repairman went into Olmsted's office building. He got the

0:19:37.359 --> 0:19:40.560
<v Speaker 3>place all wired up and slipped out and they started

0:19:40.600 --> 0:19:45.640
<v Speaker 3>listening and listening, and then Mayor Doc Brown went out

0:19:45.680 --> 0:19:49.240
<v Speaker 3>of town for a week. Perfect opportunity. So the Feds

0:19:49.320 --> 0:19:52.800
<v Speaker 3>they got to acting Mayor Bertha Landis and pulled her

0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:56.919
<v Speaker 3>in on the operation. She fired the corrupt chief of

0:19:56.960 --> 0:19:59.919
<v Speaker 3>police and tried to close every single speakeasy.

0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:03.080
<v Speaker 2>I says, he's a real tea total I'll give you

0:20:03.119 --> 0:20:03.640
<v Speaker 2>the warrants.

0:20:03.800 --> 0:20:07.240
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. Then the Feds swooped in and went after every

0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:12.040
<v Speaker 3>illicit operation they could. Seattle's prohibition director, William Whitney, he

0:20:12.160 --> 0:20:17.000
<v Speaker 3>hired this freelance wire tapper, Richard Fryant, that's a job

0:20:17.040 --> 0:20:20.679
<v Speaker 3>to say you have freelance wire tapper. So after a

0:20:20.680 --> 0:20:24.520
<v Speaker 3>couple days, Fryant goes up to Olmsted, holds out this

0:20:24.600 --> 0:20:27.879
<v Speaker 3>heavy stack of paper and he's like, these are the

0:20:27.920 --> 0:20:32.000
<v Speaker 3>pages of verbatim transcripts of conversations from your office phone.

0:20:32.680 --> 0:20:34.600
<v Speaker 3>And Fryan's like, you can have them. This is the

0:20:34.600 --> 0:20:37.520
<v Speaker 3>only copy for ten grand. So it's like two hundred

0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:41.080
<v Speaker 3>thousand dollars today, and so he lets Olmsted flip through

0:20:41.119 --> 0:20:43.640
<v Speaker 3>to make sure they're the real deal. This is from

0:20:43.680 --> 0:20:46.600
<v Speaker 3>The New Yorker. A call from a cop to a

0:20:46.640 --> 0:20:50.600
<v Speaker 3>worker at Olmsted's headquarters down under Fifth Avenue Bridge is

0:20:50.640 --> 0:20:52.560
<v Speaker 3>a car with seven gallons of moonshine in it, and

0:20:52.600 --> 0:20:54.960
<v Speaker 3>I was wondering if it's yours. No, I don't think

0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:57.920
<v Speaker 3>it's ours, because we don't handle moonshine. A call from

0:20:57.960 --> 0:21:01.600
<v Speaker 3>Olmsted to the police station. Hello, Roy, what's on your mind?

0:21:01.960 --> 0:21:04.080
<v Speaker 3>One of your fellows picked up one of my boys.

0:21:04.119 --> 0:21:06.040
<v Speaker 3>I don't give a damn what they do, but I

0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:09.119
<v Speaker 3>wanted to know before he's booked. I'll take care of

0:21:09.119 --> 0:21:12.399
<v Speaker 3>it for you, Roy. A joking stange between Olmsted and

0:21:12.480 --> 0:21:16.679
<v Speaker 3>the dispatcher. The Federals will get you one of these days. No,

0:21:17.000 --> 0:21:20.640
<v Speaker 3>those sons are too slow to catch cold Olmsted equipped,

0:21:21.359 --> 0:21:24.359
<v Speaker 3>so he keeps as cool, right, he's reading on, reading on.

0:21:24.440 --> 0:21:27.480
<v Speaker 3>He's not ruffled because he'd been a cop. He knew

0:21:27.520 --> 0:21:30.840
<v Speaker 3>about evidence, and he knew what was admissible, and wire

0:21:30.840 --> 0:21:33.719
<v Speaker 3>tapping was illegal in the state of Washington. Oh really,

0:21:33.840 --> 0:21:36.840
<v Speaker 3>none of this would stick. Yeah, So he told Fryant

0:21:36.840 --> 0:21:38.800
<v Speaker 3>to kick rocks. Just get out of here, dude.

0:21:38.840 --> 0:21:40.680
<v Speaker 2>But it's not gonna be stayed charges, right, It's gonna

0:21:40.680 --> 0:21:41.679
<v Speaker 2>be federal charges.

0:21:42.200 --> 0:21:44.159
<v Speaker 3>So he gets back to the office and he's like,

0:21:44.480 --> 0:21:46.199
<v Speaker 3>I don't know. I still not feeling good about this.

0:21:46.600 --> 0:21:48.840
<v Speaker 3>He shouldn't, so he hires a telephone guy to come

0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:51.720
<v Speaker 3>search the building for bugs. The guy finds three taps,

0:21:52.080 --> 0:21:56.320
<v Speaker 3>temporary ones, not like hardwired soldered in two in the basement,

0:21:56.400 --> 0:21:59.639
<v Speaker 3>one in the ladies room, and so they disconnected them

0:21:59.640 --> 0:22:02.520
<v Speaker 3>from the lines that were running through the ceiling. The

0:22:02.560 --> 0:22:05.320
<v Speaker 3>next day, Olmstead goes back and checks again. The taps

0:22:05.320 --> 0:22:09.960
<v Speaker 3>are back. Oh yeah, yeah. So he used a payphone

0:22:10.760 --> 0:22:13.520
<v Speaker 3>from then on to coordinate the arrival of boats and

0:22:13.560 --> 0:22:16.119
<v Speaker 3>Puget Sound, and like sometimes he would still use the

0:22:16.160 --> 0:22:18.160
<v Speaker 3>office phone, but he would do it to like fake

0:22:18.320 --> 0:22:23.520
<v Speaker 3>arrangements and insult the Prohibition director, William Whitney. So finally

0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:25.919
<v Speaker 3>it's like, yeah, get a load of this, write this

0:22:25.960 --> 0:22:30.080
<v Speaker 3>one down, Mayor. Doc Brown returns, right, he's only gone.

0:22:30.560 --> 0:22:33.440
<v Speaker 3>He's been a heck of a week. He reinstated the

0:22:33.480 --> 0:22:36.440
<v Speaker 3>police chief. Everything went back to normal. He's just like, no,

0:22:36.720 --> 0:22:39.560
<v Speaker 3>he knock this up, like interim mayor. Think was going

0:22:39.640 --> 0:22:41.960
<v Speaker 3>to go down, like she was going to win over

0:22:42.000 --> 0:22:45.080
<v Speaker 3>the city, the temperance movement. I guess, I don't know.

0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:48.400
<v Speaker 3>So Roy had been married to a woman named Viola,

0:22:48.600 --> 0:22:51.760
<v Speaker 3>and things were on the rocks. They divorced in August

0:22:51.760 --> 0:22:53.960
<v Speaker 3>of nineteen twenty four, and then he turned around and

0:22:54.000 --> 0:22:57.159
<v Speaker 3>married a woman named Elise Campbell. And it all happened

0:22:57.160 --> 0:22:59.000
<v Speaker 3>so fast that you can see why the marriage was

0:22:59.040 --> 0:22:59.679
<v Speaker 3>on the rocks.

0:23:00.119 --> 0:23:02.639
<v Speaker 2>Oh right, she Canadian with her last name Campbell.

0:23:02.680 --> 0:23:05.560
<v Speaker 3>No, she she was originally from England.

0:23:05.880 --> 0:23:07.080
<v Speaker 2>Oh what about her?

0:23:07.400 --> 0:23:11.280
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, England. In nineteen twenty two, she got a job

0:23:11.320 --> 0:23:15.000
<v Speaker 3>as a bookkeeper for Olmsted twenty two two, and then

0:23:15.119 --> 0:23:18.119
<v Speaker 3>she also at the same time became an informant for

0:23:18.200 --> 0:23:23.880
<v Speaker 3>the government against his bootlegging operation. But then she fell

0:23:23.880 --> 0:23:26.879
<v Speaker 3>in love with him. She quit her informant gig, the

0:23:26.920 --> 0:23:29.560
<v Speaker 3>divided loyalty, and they got married. They moved into this

0:23:29.640 --> 0:23:33.520
<v Speaker 3>place that they called snow White's Palace. That's not to

0:23:33.560 --> 0:23:36.520
<v Speaker 3>be confused with snow White's Cottage in Seattle, and that

0:23:36.600 --> 0:23:39.359
<v Speaker 3>was built after that and is like a novelty Disney

0:23:39.400 --> 0:23:42.199
<v Speaker 3>house that I think might be like an Airbnb. Now, okay,

0:23:42.280 --> 0:23:45.680
<v Speaker 3>Now this was his was a big house in the

0:23:45.720 --> 0:23:49.720
<v Speaker 3>posh Mount Baker neighborhood of Seattle. Four beds, three baths,

0:23:49.800 --> 0:23:52.680
<v Speaker 3>forty three hundred square feet. I found it on Zillo,

0:23:52.920 --> 0:23:55.560
<v Speaker 3>but there aren't any pictures because it hasn't been on

0:23:55.600 --> 0:23:58.240
<v Speaker 3>the market in the ages. So the couple, they're living

0:23:58.280 --> 0:24:03.240
<v Speaker 3>the dream. They even started a radio station called KFQX

0:24:03.760 --> 0:24:06.960
<v Speaker 3>in a spare room of their residence, okay, and it

0:24:07.040 --> 0:24:10.520
<v Speaker 3>was only on for four hours every evening. They did

0:24:10.560 --> 0:24:13.879
<v Speaker 3>news reports, weather stocks, that sort of thing. But the

0:24:13.920 --> 0:24:17.919
<v Speaker 3>most popular element was a show called Aunt Vivian. And

0:24:18.040 --> 0:24:21.840
<v Speaker 3>this is where Elise Olmsted would read children's bedtime stories

0:24:21.880 --> 0:24:27.480
<v Speaker 3>out loud. So Sarah, close your eyes, Oh yes, I

0:24:27.560 --> 0:24:35.880
<v Speaker 3>want you to picture it. You are a five year

0:24:35.920 --> 0:24:39.160
<v Speaker 3>old girl. An only child, you are doted on by

0:24:39.200 --> 0:24:42.159
<v Speaker 3>your parents. Your bedtime is seven pm, but on some

0:24:42.400 --> 0:24:44.919
<v Speaker 3>nights you're allowed to stay up a little later. On

0:24:45.040 --> 0:24:47.760
<v Speaker 3>those nights, at seven point fifteen, a show that you

0:24:47.920 --> 0:24:50.840
<v Speaker 3>love comes on the radio. Your papa likes to listen

0:24:50.880 --> 0:24:54.320
<v Speaker 3>to it too. It's Aunt Vivian. She tells the most

0:24:54.359 --> 0:24:58.360
<v Speaker 3>wonderful stories in such a gentle English accent. It may

0:24:58.560 --> 0:25:01.399
<v Speaker 3>kind of sound like a woman from California fighting for

0:25:01.440 --> 0:25:03.880
<v Speaker 3>her life to do. An English accent that's all over

0:25:03.920 --> 0:25:07.600
<v Speaker 3>the place and not grounded in any true location. An

0:25:07.640 --> 0:25:10.680
<v Speaker 3>accent that is offensive to the ears, if not the sensibilities.

0:25:11.119 --> 0:25:13.960
<v Speaker 3>I mean, that woman would know she's terrible with accents

0:25:13.960 --> 0:25:17.239
<v Speaker 3>and should just skip it. But yolo, baby, what does

0:25:17.280 --> 0:25:18.919
<v Speaker 3>all this chatter in your head? What does any of

0:25:18.920 --> 0:25:22.840
<v Speaker 3>this mean? Whatever? Your radio shows about to start, You

0:25:22.920 --> 0:25:25.119
<v Speaker 3>curl up on your father's lap as he sits in

0:25:25.160 --> 0:25:27.639
<v Speaker 3>his chair in the living room. He turns the knob

0:25:27.640 --> 0:25:29.040
<v Speaker 3>on the radio and a signal.

0:25:28.800 --> 0:25:29.280
<v Speaker 4>Comes to you.

0:25:29.960 --> 0:25:32.879
<v Speaker 3>The tinkling of the piano tells you that Aunt Vivian

0:25:32.960 --> 0:25:36.280
<v Speaker 3>is about to begin. Your father grabs his notepad and

0:25:36.320 --> 0:25:39.119
<v Speaker 3>pencil from the side table, like he always does. He

0:25:39.200 --> 0:25:41.719
<v Speaker 3>loves writing down bits from the story, the parts that

0:25:41.760 --> 0:25:44.280
<v Speaker 3>he really likes. He says he reads them back later

0:25:44.320 --> 0:25:46.480
<v Speaker 3>when he wants to remember what a good story it was.

0:25:47.040 --> 0:25:49.160
<v Speaker 3>You can't wait until you learn to read and write

0:25:49.160 --> 0:25:51.520
<v Speaker 3>so that you can do the same thing. Right now,

0:25:51.560 --> 0:25:53.800
<v Speaker 3>you can only pick out some of the words and numbers,

0:25:53.840 --> 0:25:55.680
<v Speaker 3>but you don't know how to write them yourself.

0:26:00.160 --> 0:26:04.639
<v Speaker 5>Hello, children, Tonight I have for you a story about

0:26:04.640 --> 0:26:08.600
<v Speaker 5>a beautiful maple tree. It is a story of hope

0:26:09.040 --> 0:26:13.920
<v Speaker 5>and delivery. Once there was a strong maple tree standing

0:26:14.080 --> 0:26:17.480
<v Speaker 5>mighty in the north. This was a special tree, for

0:26:17.800 --> 0:26:22.320
<v Speaker 5>its syrup was magical and very expensive. It was prized

0:26:22.400 --> 0:26:25.800
<v Speaker 5>throughout the land. The woodsmen would collect the syrup in

0:26:25.920 --> 0:26:28.480
<v Speaker 5>bottles and pack them up and send them out to

0:26:28.520 --> 0:26:32.760
<v Speaker 5>the people. But sometimes the evil wolves would swoop in

0:26:32.880 --> 0:26:36.320
<v Speaker 5>and grab the bottles of syrup, leaving nothing for all

0:26:36.359 --> 0:26:40.040
<v Speaker 5>the creatures in the forest. The otters got tired of this.

0:26:40.600 --> 0:26:43.000
<v Speaker 5>They'd heard that the bears who lived in the south

0:26:43.119 --> 0:26:46.359
<v Speaker 5>wanted some syrup. They said they would be brave and

0:26:46.480 --> 0:26:49.760
<v Speaker 5>fight the wolves. They just needed help on the waterways

0:26:49.760 --> 0:26:51.639
<v Speaker 5>from the otters and the cranes.

0:26:52.520 --> 0:26:55.280
<v Speaker 3>You close your eyes and envision these animals, each with

0:26:55.400 --> 0:26:58.600
<v Speaker 3>their own job and talent. Get on with it, your

0:26:58.680 --> 0:26:59.360
<v Speaker 3>dad mutters.

0:27:00.280 --> 0:27:04.480
<v Speaker 5>On this day, a beautiful autumn evening, the third Sunday

0:27:04.560 --> 0:27:08.760
<v Speaker 5>in September, the woodsmen stacked their bottles of syrup into

0:27:08.800 --> 0:27:11.879
<v Speaker 5>crates before the wolves could come and steal them. The

0:27:11.880 --> 0:27:15.840
<v Speaker 5>otters slipped four cases down to the water's edge.

0:27:16.440 --> 0:27:18.880
<v Speaker 3>Your father's scribbles on his pad. You can't read much

0:27:18.920 --> 0:27:20.840
<v Speaker 3>of it, but you do see the number four and

0:27:20.880 --> 0:27:21.560
<v Speaker 3>two zero's.

0:27:22.720 --> 0:27:27.320
<v Speaker 5>Pulling the crates onto their bellies, the otters glided through

0:27:27.359 --> 0:27:31.600
<v Speaker 5>the water on their backs, transporting the crates past a

0:27:31.720 --> 0:27:35.919
<v Speaker 5>harbor of oaks, a bank of green, and finally to

0:27:36.040 --> 0:27:38.000
<v Speaker 5>a beach filled with sunlight.

0:27:38.840 --> 0:27:42.639
<v Speaker 3>Beside you, your father's scribbles furiously on his notepad. Oak harbor,

0:27:42.760 --> 0:27:44.160
<v Speaker 3>green bank, sunlight beach.

0:27:45.200 --> 0:27:48.440
<v Speaker 5>At this beach, the bears were waiting in a big

0:27:48.600 --> 0:27:52.199
<v Speaker 5>green boat. They jumped to the shore and ran to

0:27:52.280 --> 0:27:56.360
<v Speaker 5>the otters. Oh how they gamboled and skipped. They took

0:27:56.440 --> 0:27:59.600
<v Speaker 5>the crates from the otters and gave them five large

0:27:59.720 --> 0:28:04.359
<v Speaker 5>cabin in return. The otters waved goodbye and headed back home.

0:28:04.960 --> 0:28:08.160
<v Speaker 5>The bears loaded everything into their boat and made their

0:28:08.200 --> 0:28:11.320
<v Speaker 5>way through the dark waters, careful not to be seen.

0:28:12.119 --> 0:28:15.439
<v Speaker 5>They knew that there were wolves that hide by the lighthouse.

0:28:16.040 --> 0:28:19.560
<v Speaker 5>The bears asked themselves, is there a point? No, there

0:28:19.640 --> 0:28:22.200
<v Speaker 5>is no point, But they took the boat ride anyway.

0:28:22.600 --> 0:28:24.320
<v Speaker 5>Those bears are so silly.

0:28:24.920 --> 0:28:28.679
<v Speaker 3>Your father scratches into his pad. Point no point, lighthouse sads.

0:28:29.840 --> 0:28:32.520
<v Speaker 5>When they got to land, the bears shared the syrup

0:28:32.720 --> 0:28:35.840
<v Speaker 5>with all of the creatures and the children. They threw

0:28:35.880 --> 0:28:41.040
<v Speaker 5>a big pancake breakfast to celebrate evading the wolves. Every

0:28:41.200 --> 0:28:44.800
<v Speaker 5>bear who helped save the syrup was rewarded with six

0:28:45.160 --> 0:28:46.680
<v Speaker 5>silver dollar pancakes.

0:28:47.200 --> 0:28:50.520
<v Speaker 3>Your dad raises his eyebrows and whistles. Is that a lot?

0:28:50.560 --> 0:28:54.120
<v Speaker 3>You ask him? Sure is, darling, And now.

0:28:54.040 --> 0:28:57.760
<v Speaker 5>Children are time is up. Go to sleep, little dreamers,

0:28:58.240 --> 0:29:01.920
<v Speaker 5>and remember to be good little boys and girls. Mind

0:29:01.960 --> 0:29:04.800
<v Speaker 5>your parents and always do the right thing.

0:29:05.280 --> 0:29:10.320
<v Speaker 3>Good Night, you tell the radio lady goodnight. Your mother

0:29:10.400 --> 0:29:13.240
<v Speaker 3>comes and tells you it's time for bed. Daddy has

0:29:13.280 --> 0:29:15.800
<v Speaker 3>to work now. Your father comes to kiss you on

0:29:15.840 --> 0:29:18.200
<v Speaker 3>the forehead as he shrugs into an old weather coat

0:29:18.280 --> 0:29:21.360
<v Speaker 3>that smells of salt and sea air. Be a good

0:29:21.360 --> 0:29:23.480
<v Speaker 3>girl now and go to bed, he tells you. You

0:29:23.520 --> 0:29:26.880
<v Speaker 3>pad to your room, visions of bears and syrup in

0:29:26.920 --> 0:29:29.719
<v Speaker 3>your head, the heavy footfall of your dad's work boots

0:29:29.920 --> 0:29:34.560
<v Speaker 3>stopping out the back door, and that zaren is how

0:29:34.560 --> 0:29:38.080
<v Speaker 3>Olmsted and his wife sent coated messages to the rum runners.

0:29:38.200 --> 0:29:43.920
<v Speaker 2>I absolutely love this. I mean, using children's bedtime stories

0:29:43.920 --> 0:29:47.720
<v Speaker 2>to pass your rum running bootlegging plans to your confederates

0:29:47.760 --> 0:29:53.280
<v Speaker 2>and like having bears.

0:29:49.360 --> 0:29:54.120
<v Speaker 3>And all around Seattle. Kids are listening to these stories,

0:29:54.200 --> 0:29:56.800
<v Speaker 3>but so are the rum runners in there bus, and

0:29:56.840 --> 0:29:59.240
<v Speaker 3>the stories told them when and where to drop the

0:29:59.400 --> 0:30:03.640
<v Speaker 3>alcohol shipments. Now, there aren't any existing tapes of her recording,

0:30:04.320 --> 0:30:07.800
<v Speaker 3>so it's not known exactly how the coded messages were done.

0:30:07.960 --> 0:30:11.960
<v Speaker 3>I just took a stab at it. But it did inspire,

0:30:12.880 --> 0:30:15.880
<v Speaker 3>thank you. I should try that for real. But it did.

0:30:16.120 --> 0:30:18.160
<v Speaker 3>What if? What if most of what I say this.

0:30:18.160 --> 0:30:19.680
<v Speaker 2>Was actually a code?

0:30:20.720 --> 0:30:24.080
<v Speaker 3>Maybe we'll never know. It did inspire the Feds to

0:30:24.160 --> 0:30:26.640
<v Speaker 3>broaden their net and then tap the phones at the

0:30:26.640 --> 0:30:29.960
<v Speaker 3>Olmsted house, so they couldn't really figure out what was

0:30:30.000 --> 0:30:32.320
<v Speaker 3>going on in the broadcast, but the radio stations at

0:30:32.320 --> 0:30:33.480
<v Speaker 3>the house so they figured and.

0:30:33.480 --> 0:30:35.640
<v Speaker 2>They didn't learn from any confederates who got caught that,

0:30:35.800 --> 0:30:37.960
<v Speaker 2>like you need to check the radio that stuffs tanky

0:30:38.000 --> 0:30:38.280
<v Speaker 2>as well.

0:30:38.320 --> 0:30:42.280
<v Speaker 3>Well, no, everyone zips it. Let's take a break when

0:30:42.280 --> 0:31:07.080
<v Speaker 3>we come back. More wire tapping, all right, zaren Elizabeth

0:31:07.120 --> 0:31:12.400
<v Speaker 3>roy Olmstead. So the Feds tapped his house and his

0:31:12.480 --> 0:31:15.320
<v Speaker 3>office one more time, and I need to make it

0:31:15.320 --> 0:31:17.760
<v Speaker 3>crystal clear that they never got a warrant for any

0:31:17.800 --> 0:31:22.280
<v Speaker 3>of these wire taps. Wait, they also they found that

0:31:22.400 --> 0:31:25.520
<v Speaker 3>farm that he was using for storage, distributing center rated it.

0:31:26.040 --> 0:31:28.240
<v Speaker 3>They came away with one hundred and fifty one cases

0:31:28.280 --> 0:31:29.800
<v Speaker 3>of whiskey, gin and champagne.

0:31:29.840 --> 0:31:31.960
<v Speaker 2>Oh they didn't just break it open the axis.

0:31:31.680 --> 0:31:34.239
<v Speaker 3>And they may have, but that's how that's how much

0:31:34.280 --> 0:31:37.440
<v Speaker 3>they found there. Okay, a couple months later, which again

0:31:37.680 --> 0:31:40.440
<v Speaker 3>is so wasteful to see those Why.

0:31:40.280 --> 0:31:42.040
<v Speaker 2>Can't you just sell that to people who do drink

0:31:42.080 --> 0:31:44.480
<v Speaker 2>him braise a little money for the crime fighting or whatever.

0:31:44.600 --> 0:31:48.280
<v Speaker 3>Correctly, how about just abandon the whole effort. All it did.

0:31:48.800 --> 0:31:53.400
<v Speaker 3>All prohibition did was like create more criminal networks in

0:31:53.440 --> 0:31:57.920
<v Speaker 3>this country. It created new ones and it reinforced existing ones.

0:31:58.080 --> 0:32:01.160
<v Speaker 2>It's generally what happened. And he tried to legislate morality.

0:32:00.800 --> 0:32:04.200
<v Speaker 3>Exactly because exactly people are going to work around and.

0:32:04.160 --> 0:32:05.920
<v Speaker 2>Where there's a will, there's going to be away. So

0:32:06.120 --> 0:32:07.840
<v Speaker 2>now you just incentivized the word.

0:32:07.840 --> 0:32:10.719
<v Speaker 3>Well, since the dawn of time, people have been fermenting

0:32:11.280 --> 0:32:12.640
<v Speaker 3>making drinking.

0:32:12.920 --> 0:32:15.160
<v Speaker 2>I think we made beer a thousand years before he

0:32:15.200 --> 0:32:15.680
<v Speaker 2>made bread.

0:32:15.760 --> 0:32:17.800
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, So I mean here's the thing, Like, you know,

0:32:17.920 --> 0:32:20.760
<v Speaker 3>I don't drink, and I know people where the drink

0:32:20.800 --> 0:32:23.960
<v Speaker 3>has ruined their lives. Oh yeah, figuratively and literally.

0:32:24.120 --> 0:32:25.880
<v Speaker 2>But in all cases the dose makes the poison.

0:32:25.920 --> 0:32:29.560
<v Speaker 3>But exactly. And you can't, like I also know people

0:32:29.600 --> 0:32:32.160
<v Speaker 3>who my brother makes the livelihood out of it in

0:32:32.280 --> 0:32:36.440
<v Speaker 3>his bar and like you can be enjoyed and be

0:32:36.480 --> 0:32:39.640
<v Speaker 3>a wonderful thing, moderation and whatnot right because you can't.

0:32:39.720 --> 0:32:41.680
<v Speaker 3>Oh god, it just irritates.

0:32:41.200 --> 0:32:45.760
<v Speaker 2>Men into problem or just like I can't say.

0:32:45.640 --> 0:32:47.520
<v Speaker 3>No, it's all about the middle path, zon.

0:32:47.960 --> 0:32:52.080
<v Speaker 2>What do we like a couple of Buddhist hit the.

0:32:53.600 --> 0:32:53.719
<v Speaker 5>No.

0:32:53.800 --> 0:32:55.480
<v Speaker 3>But I mean it's every time we do one of

0:32:55.520 --> 0:32:58.200
<v Speaker 3>these prohibition stories, it irritates me because it was just

0:32:58.240 --> 0:33:02.120
<v Speaker 3>like everything so much, so much waste in like the

0:33:02.160 --> 0:33:06.600
<v Speaker 3>time of federal employees, and then what happens is that

0:33:06.600 --> 0:33:09.040
<v Speaker 3>then okay, then we lift it and now you have

0:33:09.040 --> 0:33:10.880
<v Speaker 3>all these criminal networks that are like well, let's do

0:33:10.960 --> 0:33:14.400
<v Speaker 3>other stuff's really lean into the old hair earning exactly.

0:33:14.520 --> 0:33:17.360
<v Speaker 2>And then also people you're like, okay, that was silly,

0:33:17.640 --> 0:33:19.760
<v Speaker 2>and then what are you supposed to just like forgive

0:33:19.760 --> 0:33:22.000
<v Speaker 2>everyone people don't get all let out of jail and everything.

0:33:22.120 --> 0:33:25.600
<v Speaker 3>I mean, what they're doing with marijuana exactly, Zam and

0:33:25.640 --> 0:33:28.480
<v Speaker 3>I could go on and I'm all right, so what

0:33:28.760 --> 0:33:31.720
<v Speaker 3>were we? Oh? So the Feds they raided the barn,

0:33:32.000 --> 0:33:34.880
<v Speaker 3>and a couple months later they show up at Olmsted's

0:33:34.920 --> 0:33:38.280
<v Speaker 3>house while he's having a party. There wasn't any booth,

0:33:39.480 --> 0:33:43.120
<v Speaker 3>no booze there, but they did find like paperwork, keys, receipts,

0:33:43.160 --> 0:33:46.280
<v Speaker 3>like they're like, you know, raiding the joint. I think.

0:33:46.320 --> 0:33:49.840
<v Speaker 3>So one of the FEDS, the assistant Prohibition director for

0:33:50.040 --> 0:33:54.000
<v Speaker 3>Washington State, this guy named William Whitney, along with his wife.

0:33:54.440 --> 0:33:57.160
<v Speaker 3>He brought his wife and they pretended to be the

0:33:57.160 --> 0:34:02.160
<v Speaker 3>Olmsteds and they called some of Roy's buddies and were like, hey,

0:34:02.240 --> 0:34:04.880
<v Speaker 3>come over with whiskey right now. And they arrived and

0:34:04.920 --> 0:34:07.160
<v Speaker 3>they were just arresting the guys who would show up.

0:34:07.360 --> 0:34:10.920
<v Speaker 3>Oh wow, yeah, so Olmsted he got caught in nineteen

0:34:10.960 --> 0:34:14.680
<v Speaker 3>twenty four by the Prohibition Bureau thanks to surveillance informants

0:34:14.800 --> 0:34:19.320
<v Speaker 3>wiretap information. January nineteen twenty five, the federal grand jury

0:34:19.520 --> 0:34:23.520
<v Speaker 3>returned a two count indictment against Olmsted and eighty nine

0:34:23.560 --> 0:34:27.960
<v Speaker 3>other defendants. Huge so the case was referred to as

0:34:28.000 --> 0:34:31.520
<v Speaker 3>the Whispering Wires case, and this was the first time

0:34:31.640 --> 0:34:35.080
<v Speaker 3>the then new technology of wiretapping was used as evidence

0:34:35.120 --> 0:34:37.839
<v Speaker 3>in a trial. Really, Yeah, it's a long way from

0:34:37.880 --> 0:34:44.000
<v Speaker 3>there to Anthony pelicanum so per Seattle's Museum of History

0:34:44.000 --> 0:34:47.520
<v Speaker 3>and Industry quote. The trial began in nineteen twenty six

0:34:47.600 --> 0:34:51.200
<v Speaker 3>and was the largest in the country's history of liquor violations,

0:34:51.200 --> 0:34:55.920
<v Speaker 3>with forty seven original defendants. Elise was eventually acquitted, but

0:34:56.160 --> 0:34:58.880
<v Speaker 3>Roy was convicted and sentenced to four years in prison

0:34:58.960 --> 0:35:03.080
<v Speaker 3>and find dollars. He appealed his conviction in a nineteen

0:35:03.120 --> 0:35:05.880
<v Speaker 3>twenty eight landmark case on the grounds that wire tapping

0:35:06.239 --> 0:35:10.080
<v Speaker 3>was unconstitutional based on the Fourth and Fifth Amendments. Oh okay,

0:35:10.880 --> 0:35:13.600
<v Speaker 3>it went all the way to the United States Supreme Court.

0:35:13.960 --> 0:35:14.520
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

0:35:14.640 --> 0:35:18.240
<v Speaker 3>Olmsted versus the United States Taste Law Yeah, was decided

0:35:18.360 --> 0:35:21.120
<v Speaker 3>in February of nineteen twenty eight. It was a five

0:35:21.160 --> 0:35:26.200
<v Speaker 3>to four decision. The court upheld Olmsted's conviction. Per the

0:35:26.239 --> 0:35:30.560
<v Speaker 3>New Yorker, quote, Chief Justice William Howard Taft, speaking for

0:35:30.600 --> 0:35:35.720
<v Speaker 3>the majority, recognized the murky morality of wire tapping. Nevertheless,

0:35:35.840 --> 0:35:38.799
<v Speaker 3>he argued that the practice served a greater good. A

0:35:38.840 --> 0:35:42.960
<v Speaker 3>standard which would forbid the reception of evidence, if obtained

0:35:43.040 --> 0:35:47.120
<v Speaker 3>other than nice ethical conduct by government officials, would make

0:35:47.200 --> 0:35:51.719
<v Speaker 3>society suffer and give criminals greater immunity than has been known. Heretofore,

0:35:51.880 --> 0:35:55.640
<v Speaker 3>he wrote, he rejected the heart of Olmsted's case, insisting

0:35:55.680 --> 0:35:58.800
<v Speaker 3>that the amendment does not forbid what was done here.

0:35:59.000 --> 0:36:02.600
<v Speaker 3>There was no search, there was no seizure. The reasonable

0:36:02.680 --> 0:36:05.480
<v Speaker 3>view is that one who installs in his house a

0:36:05.520 --> 0:36:09.440
<v Speaker 3>telephone instrument with connecting wires intends to project his voice

0:36:09.480 --> 0:36:10.880
<v Speaker 3>to those quite outside.

0:36:11.160 --> 0:36:14.240
<v Speaker 2>So it's kind of like the writes about your trash.

0:36:14.280 --> 0:36:16.920
<v Speaker 2>Once you put your trash out, it's now public exactly,

0:36:16.920 --> 0:36:19.120
<v Speaker 2>and you people cops can come along and gather your

0:36:19.120 --> 0:36:20.800
<v Speaker 2>trash from right in front of your house.

0:36:20.680 --> 0:36:25.879
<v Speaker 3>Right right. So Judge Lewis Brandeis, Oh wow. Brandeis wrote

0:36:25.920 --> 0:36:28.920
<v Speaker 3>the Descent, and here's an excerpt from it. When the

0:36:29.040 --> 0:36:32.440
<v Speaker 3>fourth and fifth amendments were adopted. Quote the form that

0:36:32.520 --> 0:36:36.720
<v Speaker 3>evil had thereto fortaken end quote had been necessarily simple.

0:36:37.280 --> 0:36:40.440
<v Speaker 3>Force and violence were then the only means known to

0:36:40.520 --> 0:36:44.080
<v Speaker 3>man by which a government could directly affect self incrimination.

0:36:44.880 --> 0:36:48.800
<v Speaker 3>It could compel the individual to testify, a compulsion affected,

0:36:48.880 --> 0:36:52.360
<v Speaker 3>if need be, by torture. It could secure possession of

0:36:52.440 --> 0:36:55.799
<v Speaker 3>his papers and other articles incident to his private life,

0:36:56.239 --> 0:36:59.440
<v Speaker 3>a seizure affected, if need be, by breaking an entry.

0:37:00.080 --> 0:37:04.160
<v Speaker 3>Protection against such invasion of quote the sanctities of a

0:37:04.200 --> 0:37:07.440
<v Speaker 3>man's home and the privacies of life end quote was

0:37:07.480 --> 0:37:10.920
<v Speaker 3>provided in the Fourth and fifth Amendments by specific language.

0:37:11.360 --> 0:37:15.360
<v Speaker 3>But quote time works changes brings into existence new conditions

0:37:15.360 --> 0:37:19.880
<v Speaker 3>and purposes end quote. Subtler and more far reaching means

0:37:19.880 --> 0:37:23.960
<v Speaker 3>of invading privacy have become available to the government. Discovery

0:37:24.000 --> 0:37:26.920
<v Speaker 3>and invention have made it possible for the government, by

0:37:27.040 --> 0:37:30.160
<v Speaker 3>means far more effective than stretching upon the rack, to

0:37:30.239 --> 0:37:33.520
<v Speaker 3>obtain disclosure in court of what is whispered in the closet.

0:37:34.000 --> 0:37:38.680
<v Speaker 2>So, essentially, the fourth with its search and seizure like provisions,

0:37:39.320 --> 0:37:41.480
<v Speaker 2>he's saying like technology is caught up, and sometimes the

0:37:41.520 --> 0:37:47.440
<v Speaker 2>government has to do bad to do good. Essentially, so TAFT.

0:37:47.200 --> 0:37:49.799
<v Speaker 3>Is being like an originalist saying we have to go

0:37:49.920 --> 0:37:51.440
<v Speaker 3>exactly by the letter, and.

0:37:51.320 --> 0:37:53.360
<v Speaker 2>Also that you can occasionally do a little bad to

0:37:53.400 --> 0:37:54.560
<v Speaker 2>do good any kind.

0:37:54.800 --> 0:37:57.600
<v Speaker 3>And brand is saying this is a living document and

0:37:57.680 --> 0:37:59.960
<v Speaker 3>this has to evolve as the way with the technology.

0:38:00.600 --> 0:38:02.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, because we didn't used to be able to

0:38:02.120 --> 0:38:03.520
<v Speaker 2>do this now exactly.

0:38:04.480 --> 0:38:07.440
<v Speaker 3>And I have to say the Descent is so well

0:38:07.480 --> 0:38:13.319
<v Speaker 3>written and beautifully constructed that like it's fascinating reading. So

0:38:13.840 --> 0:38:16.840
<v Speaker 3>with his appeal lost at this point, Almsted served his

0:38:16.960 --> 0:38:21.400
<v Speaker 3>time at McNeil Island Penitentiary and he was released May eleventh,

0:38:21.480 --> 0:38:25.320
<v Speaker 3>nineteen thirty one. While he was inside, he found religion.

0:38:25.800 --> 0:38:29.640
<v Speaker 3>He converted to the Christian Science faith. He came to

0:38:29.680 --> 0:38:34.000
<v Speaker 3>believe that alcohol was purely destructive. I mean it had

0:38:34.040 --> 0:38:35.440
<v Speaker 3>been for him, and not in the way that we're

0:38:35.520 --> 0:38:36.080
<v Speaker 3>used to seeing.

0:38:36.400 --> 0:38:36.720
<v Speaker 2>Sure.

0:38:37.120 --> 0:38:40.600
<v Speaker 3>He spent the rest of his life in service, though,

0:38:40.640 --> 0:38:44.600
<v Speaker 3>so he counseled people, He taught Bible study, He set

0:38:44.680 --> 0:38:47.840
<v Speaker 3>up rehab services for inmates in the Puget Sound area.

0:38:48.280 --> 0:38:52.080
<v Speaker 3>He got a job as a fumigator like pest control.

0:38:53.239 --> 0:38:56.840
<v Speaker 3>He taught Sunday school. He visited prisoners every Monday morning

0:38:56.880 --> 0:38:58.000
<v Speaker 3>at the King County Jail.

0:38:58.160 --> 0:38:59.959
<v Speaker 2>You think being locked up. He was with a bunch

0:38:59.920 --> 0:39:02.279
<v Speaker 2>of like criminal drunks in a.

0:39:02.239 --> 0:39:04.719
<v Speaker 3>Sense, I saw what it was, I think so and.

0:39:04.800 --> 0:39:06.239
<v Speaker 2>Then he realized, oh, I'm part of this.

0:39:06.320 --> 0:39:09.600
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, exactly exactly. And so once again he's a fixture

0:39:09.680 --> 0:39:11.880
<v Speaker 3>in the community, but not as a folk hero, just

0:39:11.920 --> 0:39:15.040
<v Speaker 3>a hero, you know, and he's just service is his

0:39:15.080 --> 0:39:15.480
<v Speaker 3>big thing.

0:39:15.560 --> 0:39:18.200
<v Speaker 2>He goes being a cop essentially a public service pretty.

0:39:18.000 --> 0:39:20.120
<v Speaker 3>Much, yeah, what you really should to protect and serve.

0:39:20.760 --> 0:39:24.080
<v Speaker 3>He became friends with the judge who sent him to prison,

0:39:24.200 --> 0:39:27.600
<v Speaker 3>Jeremiah Netterer. They had this like lighthearted back and forth.

0:39:27.640 --> 0:39:30.160
<v Speaker 3>They palled around, but they would also have these really

0:39:30.200 --> 0:39:33.720
<v Speaker 3>deep philosophical discussions about the nature of man and the world.

0:39:34.520 --> 0:39:38.240
<v Speaker 3>Who's a deep thinker? Olmstead. You know, he served a sentence,

0:39:38.280 --> 0:39:42.040
<v Speaker 3>but he was later granted a presidential pardon by Franklin

0:39:42.160 --> 0:39:46.319
<v Speaker 3>Delano Rosevel FDR. Christmas Eve of nineteen thirty five, and

0:39:46.360 --> 0:39:49.160
<v Speaker 3>that restored all of his rights as a citizen and

0:39:49.280 --> 0:39:53.080
<v Speaker 3>canceled the fine that he still owed. And so, you know,

0:39:53.280 --> 0:39:56.480
<v Speaker 3>FDR was really impressed by his redemption. Arc was this

0:39:56.560 --> 0:39:59.920
<v Speaker 3>whole thing, so Roy Olmstead. He died April thirtieth, nineteen

0:40:00.120 --> 0:40:03.239
<v Speaker 3>sixty six at the age of seventy nine. But then

0:40:03.280 --> 0:40:07.160
<v Speaker 3>there's this. Just one year later, the Supreme Court heard

0:40:07.160 --> 0:40:11.480
<v Speaker 3>a case Cats versus the United States. Charles Katz was

0:40:11.520 --> 0:40:15.359
<v Speaker 3>convicted of illegal gambling after the FBI recorded his phone

0:40:15.400 --> 0:40:19.040
<v Speaker 3>conversations from a public telephone booth using an electronic listening

0:40:19.120 --> 0:40:22.280
<v Speaker 3>device that was attached to the outside of the phone booth.

0:40:22.960 --> 0:40:26.600
<v Speaker 3>So Katz argued that the recordings were obtained in violation

0:40:26.840 --> 0:40:30.680
<v Speaker 3>of his Fourth Amendment right against unreasonable search and seizure. Sure,

0:40:31.040 --> 0:40:34.480
<v Speaker 3>so the Supreme Court here's his case. They ruled seven

0:40:34.560 --> 0:40:38.719
<v Speaker 3>to one in Katz's favor, holding that the warrantless wiretap

0:40:38.800 --> 0:40:42.480
<v Speaker 3>was unconstitutional. Because the FBI didn't get a warrant, the

0:40:42.520 --> 0:40:46.280
<v Speaker 3>evidence couldn't be used against him. In Olmstead, the Supreme

0:40:46.320 --> 0:40:50.359
<v Speaker 3>Court ruled that wiretapping telephone lines didn't constitute a Fourth

0:40:50.400 --> 0:40:54.520
<v Speaker 3>Amendment search. And then that's what Chief Justice Taft's majority

0:40:54.560 --> 0:40:58.160
<v Speaker 3>opinion rested on. He's like two pillars. There was the

0:40:58.160 --> 0:41:01.920
<v Speaker 3>physical trespass requirement, said, the Fourth Amendment only applied when

0:41:01.920 --> 0:41:07.320
<v Speaker 3>there was an actual physical intrusion into like a constitutionally

0:41:07.320 --> 0:41:12.640
<v Speaker 3>protected space, you say, like a house, paper person. Yeah,

0:41:12.680 --> 0:41:15.799
<v Speaker 3>And because the FBI had tapped wires outside of Olmsted's

0:41:15.800 --> 0:41:18.800
<v Speaker 3>home without physically entering it, no search had occurred, according

0:41:18.840 --> 0:41:22.360
<v Speaker 3>to Tap, and then his other pillar in his majority

0:41:22.400 --> 0:41:27.280
<v Speaker 3>opinion was that there was the tangible property focus. Since

0:41:27.360 --> 0:41:31.840
<v Speaker 3>only intangible conversations, not physical items, were seized, the Amendment

0:41:31.880 --> 0:41:37.840
<v Speaker 3>didn't apply. And stuff yeah was like, hey, no trespass,

0:41:37.920 --> 0:41:42.400
<v Speaker 3>No Fourth Amendment problem grew. So Cats, though dismissed both

0:41:42.440 --> 0:41:46.239
<v Speaker 3>of those pillars. It rejected the trespass doctrine, and they

0:41:46.239 --> 0:41:49.560
<v Speaker 3>held that the Fourth Amendment is not limited to physical intrusions.

0:41:50.320 --> 0:41:53.759
<v Speaker 3>The FBI and Cats never touched the phone booth, but

0:41:53.920 --> 0:41:59.960
<v Speaker 3>a constitutional violation still occurred. It extended protection to intangible

0:42:00.160 --> 0:42:03.960
<v Speaker 3>things like spoken words conversations, not just physical objects. And

0:42:04.040 --> 0:42:08.239
<v Speaker 3>it shifted this whole framework from places and property to

0:42:08.440 --> 0:42:11.920
<v Speaker 3>people and like reasonable expectations of privacy, There you go.

0:42:12.520 --> 0:42:18.279
<v Speaker 3>Justice Brandeis had presently dissented in Olmsted, and his arguments

0:42:18.560 --> 0:42:21.359
<v Speaker 3>were that the Constitution has to adapt to new technologies,

0:42:21.360 --> 0:42:23.759
<v Speaker 3>that we're saying like it's a living thing, and that

0:42:23.920 --> 0:42:27.120
<v Speaker 3>the right to be let alone was the most fundamental

0:42:27.160 --> 0:42:32.080
<v Speaker 3>of rights. So forty years after that, Katz essentially vindicated.

0:42:32.320 --> 0:42:39.719
<v Speaker 3>Roy Olmsted Katz remains the cornerstone of modern Fourth Amendment jurisprudence.

0:42:40.040 --> 0:42:43.919
<v Speaker 3>It's routinely applied to contemporary things like digital surveillance, cell

0:42:43.920 --> 0:42:49.160
<v Speaker 3>phone tracking, internet privacy. Now, whether internet privacy actually exists anymore,

0:42:49.719 --> 0:42:52.680
<v Speaker 3>who's to say, but by law, we have a right

0:42:52.760 --> 0:42:56.400
<v Speaker 3>to it. Okay, so zaren, what's your ridiculous takeaway?

0:42:56.960 --> 0:43:00.279
<v Speaker 2>Ah, the presumption of our rights at this point, I

0:43:00.360 --> 0:43:03.280
<v Speaker 2>try to presume them in good faith, but so often

0:43:03.280 --> 0:43:05.680
<v Speaker 2>you find they're like, oh, those don't apply unless you're

0:43:05.680 --> 0:43:08.239
<v Speaker 2>the president. I'm like, oh, I don't get rights.

0:43:08.440 --> 0:43:10.479
<v Speaker 3>Well, I think too with Like when we talk about

0:43:10.520 --> 0:43:15.760
<v Speaker 3>internet privacy, we sign away that right all the time.

0:43:15.640 --> 0:43:16.839
<v Speaker 2>In agreements we never read.

0:43:16.960 --> 0:43:19.200
<v Speaker 3>We never read them. So, you know, you get your phone,

0:43:19.239 --> 0:43:21.160
<v Speaker 3>Like I just got a new phone because my other

0:43:21.200 --> 0:43:23.640
<v Speaker 3>one got I'll bust it up. And so I'm setting

0:43:23.719 --> 0:43:25.200
<v Speaker 3>these things up and it's like, do you want to

0:43:25.200 --> 0:43:27.680
<v Speaker 3>read this agreement? I'm like, not really, And I know

0:43:27.880 --> 0:43:30.600
<v Speaker 3>as I'm clicking, except I'm like, you're a dumb, dumb

0:43:30.719 --> 0:43:34.759
<v Speaker 3>lawyer's daughter. Yeah, here, open my life to you. There

0:43:34.800 --> 0:43:37.640
<v Speaker 3>you go, And like all these websites that we use,

0:43:37.920 --> 0:43:41.200
<v Speaker 3>you know, those social media ones. We have a contract

0:43:41.200 --> 0:43:43.319
<v Speaker 3>with them, and they have all this small print that

0:43:43.360 --> 0:43:49.400
<v Speaker 3>they own images, they own, statements, what you produce every time.

0:43:49.200 --> 0:43:51.640
<v Speaker 2>People, Is it co own or do they own?

0:43:51.880 --> 0:43:53.799
<v Speaker 3>They own a lot of these things. It's like once

0:43:54.400 --> 0:43:57.359
<v Speaker 3>co owner. Probably No, I don't think it is. But

0:43:57.440 --> 0:44:01.400
<v Speaker 3>you know everyone uploads those photos onto websites to like

0:44:01.480 --> 0:44:05.200
<v Speaker 3>see what you look like as you were aged or whatever. No,

0:44:05.320 --> 0:44:07.879
<v Speaker 3>because all that is is just gathering your information. That's

0:44:07.880 --> 0:44:13.080
<v Speaker 3>how they train and like facial recognition stuff. It's like

0:44:13.160 --> 0:44:16.000
<v Speaker 3>we hand it over to them. So I don't think

0:44:16.000 --> 0:44:18.960
<v Speaker 3>that there's any privacy because we've just opened it up

0:44:18.960 --> 0:44:20.239
<v Speaker 3>to them, like here, take it.

0:44:20.400 --> 0:44:20.520
<v Speaker 4>Well.

0:44:20.600 --> 0:44:24.000
<v Speaker 2>I think the presumption of privacy has shifted with technology

0:44:24.040 --> 0:44:26.640
<v Speaker 2>to the being. As I said earlier, come on, you

0:44:26.680 --> 0:44:28.800
<v Speaker 2>don't really presume you have that type of presice.

0:44:29.840 --> 0:44:32.279
<v Speaker 3>You and I have both experienced recently a lot of

0:44:32.280 --> 0:44:36.120
<v Speaker 3>friends who have where there's something that you speak to

0:44:36.160 --> 0:44:38.800
<v Speaker 3>someone about, only you don't look it up on the

0:44:39.040 --> 0:44:43.160
<v Speaker 3>online on your phone, you don't stumble across it somewhere.

0:44:43.160 --> 0:44:46.239
<v Speaker 3>It's just spoken and then it starts popping up in

0:44:46.400 --> 0:44:47.360
<v Speaker 3>like your algorithm.

0:44:47.480 --> 0:44:49.200
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, at this point, I do it to make

0:44:49.239 --> 0:44:51.960
<v Speaker 2>your Instagram algorithm go weird does when I see you,

0:44:52.360 --> 0:44:54.759
<v Speaker 2>I say things that I know you haven't looked up,

0:44:55.000 --> 0:44:58.120
<v Speaker 2>that I haven't typed into anything online, just to make

0:44:58.160 --> 0:44:59.840
<v Speaker 2>it pop up. Like I'm like, this is gonna be

0:44:59.840 --> 0:45:01.360
<v Speaker 2>fun and this tomorrow.

0:45:01.440 --> 0:45:03.759
<v Speaker 3>But that's the thing is we sound like we're paranoid

0:45:03.840 --> 0:45:04.880
<v Speaker 3>weird like you.

0:45:07.480 --> 0:45:09.360
<v Speaker 2>But it's true.

0:45:09.600 --> 0:45:12.279
<v Speaker 3>Loan Gunman, Yeah exactly. But I feel like that all

0:45:12.320 --> 0:45:15.080
<v Speaker 3>the time now because I'm just like, yeah, everything's in operation.

0:45:15.560 --> 0:45:16.560
<v Speaker 3>Everything is like.

0:45:16.880 --> 0:45:18.920
<v Speaker 2>No normies say this stuff to me and they're not

0:45:19.080 --> 0:45:20.680
<v Speaker 2>just like wackos like you and me.

0:45:22.960 --> 0:45:23.120
<v Speaker 5>Don't.

0:45:23.239 --> 0:45:26.080
<v Speaker 3>I don't trust anybody or anything. And that's that's my take.

0:45:26.480 --> 0:45:28.120
<v Speaker 2>This is you being raised by a lawyer, me being

0:45:28.160 --> 0:45:29.359
<v Speaker 2>raised by a gangster. We're both.

0:45:29.719 --> 0:45:34.200
<v Speaker 3>I don't trust, don't trust anybody, that's right. Do you

0:45:34.280 --> 0:45:36.160
<v Speaker 3>want to talk back because I think I need to

0:45:36.200 --> 0:45:36.719
<v Speaker 3>talk back.

0:45:39.080 --> 0:45:52.920
<v Speaker 4>Oh my god, I want you, Darren Elizabeth, producer Dave Interns, Hello,

0:45:53.200 --> 0:45:54.440
<v Speaker 4>I have a funny, quick.

0:45:54.239 --> 0:45:58.240
<v Speaker 6>Story to tell you. Junior year of high school, I

0:45:58.280 --> 0:45:59.440
<v Speaker 6>was I'm an Alta with my.

0:45:59.440 --> 0:46:02.560
<v Speaker 7>Mom and the song love Fool by the Cardigans came

0:46:02.600 --> 0:46:04.640
<v Speaker 7>on and I love that song, and my mom was

0:46:04.680 --> 0:46:06.920
<v Speaker 7>having a pretty rough day, so I decided to cheer

0:46:07.000 --> 0:46:10.680
<v Speaker 7>up by awkwardly dancing and singing in the Alta, and

0:46:10.960 --> 0:46:13.799
<v Speaker 7>a woman who worked there came up to me and said,

0:46:14.160 --> 0:46:16.400
<v Speaker 7>excuse me, ma'am, there's no dancing in the store.

0:46:16.600 --> 0:46:22.520
<v Speaker 6>And I thought that was ridiculous. Hello, it's me again,

0:46:22.680 --> 0:46:27.000
<v Speaker 6>the awkward dancing girl from Alta. Just wanted to say, sence,

0:46:27.120 --> 0:46:30.560
<v Speaker 6>this goes by so fast, only thirty seconds. Really loved

0:46:30.600 --> 0:46:30.919
<v Speaker 6>the show.

0:46:31.000 --> 0:46:31.840
<v Speaker 7>My brother and I.

0:46:31.800 --> 0:46:35.080
<v Speaker 6>Listen to you guys all the time and we always

0:46:35.160 --> 0:46:35.560
<v Speaker 6>quote the.

0:46:35.520 --> 0:46:39.360
<v Speaker 7>Bobbing up whenever we're making a phone call or have

0:46:39.640 --> 0:46:42.799
<v Speaker 7>a story that involves a phone call. So thank you

0:46:42.880 --> 0:46:45.520
<v Speaker 7>so much for bringing so much joy into our lives.

0:46:45.560 --> 0:46:46.560
<v Speaker 6>And really love the show.

0:46:47.239 --> 0:46:49.520
<v Speaker 3>Oh thank you, Hey, you're giving me joy. First of all,

0:46:49.760 --> 0:46:52.879
<v Speaker 3>I'm sorry there's no dancing in the Alta. Like you're

0:46:52.880 --> 0:46:57.600
<v Speaker 3>a knockoff Sephora step back, like it's all twelve year

0:46:57.600 --> 0:47:01.239
<v Speaker 3>old girls using the lipstick. Don't give me started on Alta.

0:47:01.480 --> 0:47:03.640
<v Speaker 3>I love that you were first of all. I love

0:47:03.680 --> 0:47:07.239
<v Speaker 3>that you were cheering your mom up. Yeah, dance brilliant, amazing,

0:47:07.680 --> 0:47:09.920
<v Speaker 3>perfect thing to do. And now I need to go

0:47:10.000 --> 0:47:12.120
<v Speaker 3>down to the Alta and just like bust to move

0:47:12.719 --> 0:47:14.359
<v Speaker 3>and see if I get told to stop, and then

0:47:14.400 --> 0:47:16.720
<v Speaker 3>I'm like, uh uh no, I'm gonna dance like nobody's

0:47:16.760 --> 0:47:20.279
<v Speaker 3>watching live, laughlove, and then kick over like a like

0:47:20.320 --> 0:47:26.760
<v Speaker 3>a sparkly powdered spline. Oh my gosh, you guys are amazing.

0:47:27.120 --> 0:47:28.200
<v Speaker 2>Your dudes are amazing.

0:47:29.440 --> 0:47:34.200
<v Speaker 3>Yes, yes, all right, So that is it for today.

0:47:34.760 --> 0:47:37.520
<v Speaker 3>You can find us online at ridiculous Crime dot com.

0:47:37.640 --> 0:47:40.960
<v Speaker 3>We're at Ridiculous Crime on Blue Sky and Instagram. We

0:47:41.000 --> 0:47:46.080
<v Speaker 3>do have that YouTube account, Ridiculous Crime Pod, but they've

0:47:46.120 --> 0:47:48.640
<v Speaker 3>put a little pause on it, so there are no

0:47:48.760 --> 0:47:51.719
<v Speaker 3>new episodes coming on there, and we apologize for that,

0:47:51.800 --> 0:47:54.640
<v Speaker 3>but it's out of our hands. You can email us

0:47:54.640 --> 0:47:57.080
<v Speaker 3>at ridiculous Crime at gmail dot com. You can leave

0:47:57.120 --> 0:48:00.319
<v Speaker 3>a talk that please like that on the I heart

0:48:00.360 --> 0:48:06.360
<v Speaker 3>app reach out. Ridiculous Crime is hosted by Elizabeth Dutton

0:48:06.400 --> 0:48:09.319
<v Speaker 3>and Zaren Burnett, produced and edited by King of the

0:48:09.360 --> 0:48:14.160
<v Speaker 3>Bootleg Bootcut Jeans Dave Cousten. Our ridiculous assistant is Sea

0:48:14.200 --> 0:48:18.160
<v Speaker 3>Otter carrying a load of seagrums to the party. Terry Maldonado.

0:48:18.160 --> 0:48:22.319
<v Speaker 3>Fong research is by Suspicious lighthouse keeper Marisa Brown. The

0:48:22.320 --> 0:48:25.680
<v Speaker 3>theme song is by Selfless Maple Tree, Thomas Lee and

0:48:25.800 --> 0:48:29.520
<v Speaker 3>Bear covered in syrup. Travis Dutton. Host wardrobe is provided

0:48:29.560 --> 0:48:33.040
<v Speaker 3>by Botany five hundred producer Dave Coustin's wardrobe by Mister

0:48:33.080 --> 0:48:36.680
<v Speaker 3>Guy of Beverly Hills. Guest hair and makeup by Sparkleshot

0:48:36.719 --> 0:48:41.040
<v Speaker 3>and mister Andre. Executive producers are Ruthless Federal Agents Ben

0:48:41.160 --> 0:48:42.760
<v Speaker 3>Boleen and Noel Brown.

0:48:47.719 --> 0:48:53.440
<v Speaker 7>Reds Quime Say It One More Times Crime.

0:48:54.520 --> 0:48:57.920
<v Speaker 1>Ridiculous Crime is a production of iHeartRadio four more podcasts.

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<v Speaker 1>My heart Radio visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or

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