WEBVTT - A Push & A Push Back.  Lanhee Chen Talks To Armstrong & Getty

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<v Speaker 1>Now, if I were if in Texas, I may say

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<v Speaker 1>he's Donald Trump is scared as a cat at the dogtown.

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<v Speaker 1>But since I'm from New York, I put it this way.

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<v Speaker 1>We're scaring the living hell out of him, and we're

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<v Speaker 1>just starting right now. Well, he's like a charisma black hole.

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<v Speaker 1>He not only has no charisma, he sucks charisma out

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<v Speaker 1>of other people. That hurt me. That was Do we

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<v Speaker 1>have the other one? At least is better delivered. The

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<v Speaker 1>jackass one reminds me of Sam Raybert's saying that you

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<v Speaker 1>might know, any jackass can kick down a barn, but

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<v Speaker 1>it takes a good carpenter to build one. That betrays

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<v Speaker 1>either a gross lack of knowledge about jackasses, barnes, or both.

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<v Speaker 1>You need a gigantic jacks as a tiny barn or

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<v Speaker 1>barn that is not of the code. We're right, not

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<v Speaker 1>of anybody's code. What's going on here? Lana heat Chen

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<v Speaker 1>is the David and Diane Staffy Research Fellow too Over Institution,

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<v Speaker 1>also director of Domestic Policy Studies at Stanford University, hosted

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<v Speaker 1>the podcast Crossing Lines with lan Hea Chen. A lot ye,

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<v Speaker 1>how are you, sir? Oh? I'm fine. I'm just trying

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<v Speaker 1>to find some charisma all that and this is this

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<v Speaker 1>is this entire lead up you heard from us is

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<v Speaker 1>very similar to what you get on Fascination, isn't it.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, this has been the issue with Bloomberg all along.

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<v Speaker 1>I think you know, I mean, the reason why he

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<v Speaker 1>is not the presumptive favorite of the establishment is precisely

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<v Speaker 1>because of the two clips you just played. I mean, well,

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<v Speaker 1>I I think so. I mean, look, I mean, look

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<v Speaker 1>at all the things objectively right, the guy's got a

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<v Speaker 1>ton of money. He's willing to put a lot more

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<v Speaker 1>of it into the race. He's had a pretty good

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<v Speaker 1>record as uh as mayor of New York, with the

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<v Speaker 1>exception of the whole stop and frisk controversy, which is

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<v Speaker 1>it's a big deal to summon the Democratic Party. I

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<v Speaker 1>get that, But if you look at the guy's record,

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<v Speaker 1>what's pretty clear is he's probably the Democrat who is

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<v Speaker 1>going to be able to attract the support of anyone,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, in the center or center right. So the

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<v Speaker 1>establishment should love this guy. I think the challenges that

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<v Speaker 1>he just as you as you've said, he has zero charisma.

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<v Speaker 1>Now we have been pronouncing that it seems clear the

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<v Speaker 1>establishment has gotten behind the guy judging by you know,

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<v Speaker 1>the the MSNBC's and CNN's of the world, that can

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<v Speaker 1>couple of guys from the Congressional Black Caucus coming out

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<v Speaker 1>and saying, yeah, don't worry about that racial stuff. He's fine,

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<v Speaker 1>we love him. So are you saying they're they're they're

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<v Speaker 1>not latching onto him or just taking a cautious look

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<v Speaker 1>or where do you think it stands? I think they're cautiously.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, he's kind of like the the you know,

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<v Speaker 1>the thing you've got in your back pocket in case

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<v Speaker 1>everything sort of goes goes badly. It is here's someone

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<v Speaker 1>who could be credible badly well that maybe maybe it's

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<v Speaker 1>time to break the glass. I mean, I think, look,

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<v Speaker 1>I think there's still some discomfort with him for a

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<v Speaker 1>variety of different reasons, you know, the stop and first

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<v Speaker 1>pieces one of it. I think I think that the

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<v Speaker 1>fact that he is somebody who is perceived as being,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, willing to spend whatever it takes at a

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<v Speaker 1>time when the party itself, uh, you know, seems to

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<v Speaker 1>be be trying to take a more populous route. I

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<v Speaker 1>think for all these reasons, he hasn't been fully embraced.

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<v Speaker 1>But you're right. The reason you're seeing more and more

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<v Speaker 1>positive information flow on him is precisely because, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I think the Democratic establishment wants a place to go

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<v Speaker 1>when Biden doesn't perform the way that Biden you know,

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<v Speaker 1>thought he would, and you know, arguably we're there. I

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<v Speaker 1>think South Carolina and Nevada will be telling um, I

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<v Speaker 1>don't think you're going to see any large scale movement

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<v Speaker 1>until after South Carolina. Fair enough, We'll wait and see. Then, Hey,

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<v Speaker 1>an he come in on the William Barr telling the

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<v Speaker 1>President to stop tweeting story we were talking about in

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<v Speaker 1>the last segment. I mean, it's obviously a notable thing

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<v Speaker 1>for an attorney general to essentially send a rhetorical shout

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<v Speaker 1>across the president's bow and a threat to resign. It

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<v Speaker 1>sounded like us. Well, you know, I think a couple

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<v Speaker 1>of things. First of all, bar bar happens to be right,

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<v Speaker 1>which is that you know, he's he's got to do

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<v Speaker 1>a job, and you know, I think the President is

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<v Speaker 1>probably making it a little harder for him to do

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<v Speaker 1>that job. Well with all of the commentary and tweeting

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<v Speaker 1>that aside, I think it is quite remarkable how this

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<v Speaker 1>kind of came out of out of left field. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>it seemingly came out of nowhere. It's not like bar

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<v Speaker 1>had given a few interviews where he was like, well, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, maybe it's not the best thing. He just

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<v Speaker 1>sort of came out guns blazing, and and the the speculation.

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<v Speaker 1>The big question is to what extent did he give

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<v Speaker 1>the president heads up? To what extent did he say

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<v Speaker 1>to to to the even senior White House team. Look, uh,

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<v Speaker 1>this is starting to get really hard for me. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>going to have to say something to cover myself and

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<v Speaker 1>to cover you know, what we're trying to do. Um. So,

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<v Speaker 1>I think that's a big question, but it was. I

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<v Speaker 1>was quite surprised, not not at the fact that he said,

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<v Speaker 1>but in the words he used. The words he used

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<v Speaker 1>were pretty sharp, right Well, you know Bill Barr's career

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<v Speaker 1>in history and everything like hett, He's a serious man,

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<v Speaker 1>and I don't think he appreciated anybody, including the potus

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<v Speaker 1>giving fuel, giving you know, energy, to his opponents for

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<v Speaker 1>calling him a hack. He doesn't like being called the hack,

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<v Speaker 1>right well, and I mean he's he's not. If you

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<v Speaker 1>look at his career and you look at all that

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<v Speaker 1>he's done, he has, he served a number of presidents.

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<v Speaker 1>He's been uh, you know, a guy who's always been

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<v Speaker 1>well regarded, and so, you know, I do think it's

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<v Speaker 1>some level part of this is Bill Barr trying to

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<v Speaker 1>stick up for himself a little bit and saying, look,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, for for all the things that the president

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<v Speaker 1>is saying and doing, I'm trying my best to hold

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<v Speaker 1>things together. Now, that may not be a credible argument

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<v Speaker 1>in fight, I don't think. I think the left now

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<v Speaker 1>is completely uh you know, sort of on the anti

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<v Speaker 1>bar bandwagons. It doesn't really matter what bar does at

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<v Speaker 1>the end of the day. So that's in their interesting question,

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<v Speaker 1>which is if he wasn't going to be able to

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<v Speaker 1>change the media narrative, why come out and do this

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<v Speaker 1>in a way that potentially would offend President Trump. That

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<v Speaker 1>having been said, I think part of it is Bill

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<v Speaker 1>Barr wanting to set the record straight about himself and

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<v Speaker 1>and just for posterity's sake, you know, I was looking

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<v Speaker 1>at texts we got. We read the Bloomberg article in

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<v Speaker 1>g Q. I don't know if you saw that. They

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<v Speaker 1>came out yesterday. Bloomberg and g Q are two things

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<v Speaker 1>that don't usually go together. But okay, now they had

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<v Speaker 1>an article that the title of it was why is

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<v Speaker 1>Bloomberg Sexual history not being discussed? And it basically goes

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<v Speaker 1>through a whole bunch of different stories that have been

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<v Speaker 1>out there, and some of them I remembered when I

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<v Speaker 1>was reminded of them at a little Trump esque that's

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<v Speaker 1>hanging out there. So it's gonna be fun to watch

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<v Speaker 1>that and see how it plays out. Yeah, and and

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<v Speaker 1>in a Democratic primary that has a lot more salience

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<v Speaker 1>than than in the Republican primary, I'd argue, right, I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>if if you think back to all the accusations lobbed

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<v Speaker 1>against Trump, many of them quite serious, the the way

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<v Speaker 1>in which they were able or not able to gain

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<v Speaker 1>traction in Republican primary, I think in a Democratic primary

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<v Speaker 1>the context could be very different. Yeah, I would agree,

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<v Speaker 1>Although you know, from my perspective, and I've argued this

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<v Speaker 1>many times when we discussed Trump's various sins and idiosyncrasies,

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<v Speaker 1>is it's still a binary choice. And if I'm, for instance,

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<v Speaker 1>a Midwestern evangelical and I might personally be offended by

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<v Speaker 1>Trump's conduct and I brought up my kids not to

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<v Speaker 1>act that way, etcetera, etcetera, I still am looking at

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<v Speaker 1>Supreme Court nominees. I'm looking at the you know, the

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<v Speaker 1>judiciary from top to bottom. I'm looking at, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>finally enforcing immigration policy. And look, I might hold my

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<v Speaker 1>nose and vote, but I'm sure it's heck not going

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<v Speaker 1>to vote for Bernie or somebody like him. Right, And

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<v Speaker 1>by the way, the same logic might apply for a Democrat,

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<v Speaker 1>sure progressive looking at looking at Bloomberg and saying I

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<v Speaker 1>don't like the stop and frisk thing. I don't like

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<v Speaker 1>the fact that he seems to be a billionaire that's

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<v Speaker 1>out of touch. I don't like blah blah blah. But

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<v Speaker 1>at the end of the day, I want to be Trump.

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<v Speaker 1>And if I want to be Trump and Bloomberg is

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<v Speaker 1>willing to spend a billion dollars to beat him, will heck,

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<v Speaker 1>you know that that's a bandwagon I'm willing to jump on.

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<v Speaker 1>So I think that that analogy is very apt. You

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<v Speaker 1>may have missed this, but this was the most interesting

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<v Speaker 1>punditry I saw in the last week after the debate.

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<v Speaker 1>Friday Night, Chris Matthews is on MSNBC and he said,

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<v Speaker 1>I want to know if Bernie is a Castro socialist

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<v Speaker 1>or a Sweden socialist, which is he is he with

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<v Speaker 1>Castro because of the socialist school to one when I

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<v Speaker 1>was young, I have been shot in Central Park. I

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<v Speaker 1>want to know which one he is. And I thought

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<v Speaker 1>that is an interesting of view. By the way, Chris

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<v Speaker 1>Matthews was not seen again that night on MSNBC. Yeah, well,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, it's it's a good point. I don't know

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<v Speaker 1>that people. I think the way this race is shaping up,

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<v Speaker 1>it almost doesn't matter though. I mean, he being branded

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<v Speaker 1>a socialist, whether you're a Castro socialist or a nice

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<v Speaker 1>clean Swedish socialist, I don't think it really matters. I

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<v Speaker 1>think a socialist as a socialist as a socialist our

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<v Speaker 1>in our current dialogue, in our current dialogue, and uh,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, I think, look, Trump is gonna gonna make

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<v Speaker 1>mincemeat out of the guy. So you know, if the

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<v Speaker 1>Democrats really want to have a shot, they gotta wake

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<v Speaker 1>up and smell the coffee. Which is why Bloomberger is

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<v Speaker 1>willing to spend a billion dollars because he believes that

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<v Speaker 1>exactly he ought to spend a million on a Charisma transplant.

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<v Speaker 1>Is that a thing? God, you go to like David

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<v Speaker 1>Lee Roth or I don't know. Some aging movie star

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<v Speaker 1>and and and get their charisma and planted. It's like, exactly,

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<v Speaker 1>there's a good for instance, he's not using it for

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<v Speaker 1>anything good. It's like those poop transplants people get to

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<v Speaker 1>get their digestive system going. I'll tell you what. It

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<v Speaker 1>wouldn't be a very good look for the world's oldest

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<v Speaker 1>democracy and most powerful country to have two billionaire old

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<v Speaker 1>white men from the same neighborhood running against each other

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<v Speaker 1>for president. Yeah. Well, this is the America we live

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<v Speaker 1>in now. It's our politics, you know, it's it's gotten

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<v Speaker 1>well passed trying to predict what's going on. I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>I think I think I told you guys, I thought

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<v Speaker 1>Biden what was was probably going to be the nominee.

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<v Speaker 1>And I just it's staggering to me how poorly he's done.

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<v Speaker 1>It's really staggering. And we will we will end on

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<v Speaker 1>staggering Joe Biden as we are up against a hard break.

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<v Speaker 1>But la Chan with the Hoover Institution, Stanford University crossing

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<v Speaker 1>lines with long heat Chen it's always too short, but

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<v Speaker 1>it's it's great fun to talk on. He will do

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<v Speaker 1>it against soon, all right, thanks, good, Thanks, This podcast

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<v Speaker 1>is crossing lines with long heat chan if you want

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<v Speaker 1>to check that out sometime. Yeah, it's good. It's just

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<v Speaker 1>clear eyed realism. Um, you know, looking at politics. What

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<v Speaker 1>he said there at the end, you got to get

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<v Speaker 1>out of the prediction business. No precedent matters and getty