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Speaker 1: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Less Sets podcast.

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Speaker 1: My guest today is the most powerful person in the

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Speaker 1: music business, the CEO and president of Live Nation, Michael Rappino. Michael,

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Speaker 1: good to have you on. Thank you, Bob Long. Also

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Speaker 1: to appreciate the time. Okay, I know you're a voracious

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Speaker 1: reader of business books. What are you reading right now?

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Speaker 1: Oh that's a good question. Um, what's my latest? Um,

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Speaker 1: I'm right now reading, but I'm actually, I won't want

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Speaker 1: to say i'm reading. I'm I'm pretty deep into podcast now,

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Speaker 1: so I'm I run every day and I'm podcast for

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Speaker 1: my game. Um. And I have found this very smart

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Speaker 1: Canadian guy, of course, uh Shane Parrish the Knowledge Project.

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Speaker 1: I find him fascinating. He goes very deep all amongst

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Speaker 1: a lot of different, uh kind of strains of life.

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Speaker 1: So he's he's been my latest obsession and I've been

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Speaker 1: going deep on him on YouTube and podcasts. What do

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Speaker 1: you learn from him? He's a real thinker. So his

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Speaker 1: whole his whole business is about The Knowledge Project is

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Speaker 1: just a lot about how do you make decisions? How

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Speaker 1: do you think about life? How do you how do

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Speaker 1: you make the tough uh life decisions, business decisions. So

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Speaker 1: he he kind of uses that framework amongst all the

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Speaker 1: different candidates whoever they they're interviewed. So I like his

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Speaker 1: real methodical thinking. Okay, there's been uh talk recently that

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Speaker 1: the head of Google the lays decisions to the company's detriment.

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Speaker 1: How do you make a decision? And how fast or

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Speaker 1: slow do you make a decision? Uh? No, that's I

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Speaker 1: think that's a really valid point I have. I've been

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Speaker 1: all about the speed of decisions since my early days.

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Speaker 1: I had a young as a young young executive, I

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Speaker 1: had a great mentor who really drilled in that idea

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Speaker 1: that you know, a seventy good fast decision moves the organization.

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Speaker 1: Um so so so do it. So I'm a pretty

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Speaker 1: good distiller. So I'm pretty obsessed with making fast, quick

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Speaker 1: decisions with enough information, enough detail, um to keep things moving.

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Speaker 1: So fully agree with you. That would be an ongoing

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Speaker 1: pet peeve of mind. Make make make enough, make the

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Speaker 1: decisions with enough information to keep things moving. We can

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Speaker 1: fail fast. What's the worst decision you've made? Probably the

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Speaker 1: same ones that I made too fast? Um listen, and

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Speaker 1: Italian blood inside of me gets the emotion going. So

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Speaker 1: I'm probably like everyone else. The decision I've made that

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Speaker 1: was probably fueled on emotion and didn't spend a few

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Speaker 1: extra hours or days um thinking that one through was

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Speaker 1: probably the ones that have gotten me in trouble. So

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Speaker 1: anything that was emotion driven and I didn't digest enough, uh,

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Speaker 1: is the ones that got me in trouble over my days.

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Speaker 1: And do you find you should trust your instincts or

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Speaker 1: after you gather more infer information, do you ultimately make

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Speaker 1: a different decision which is better? No? I think I

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Speaker 1: don't live in a lot of regrets, so I I

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Speaker 1: believe still in the end of the day, the speed

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Speaker 1: of the decision process wins out long term. We now

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Speaker 1: none of us hit you know, a hundred percent. So

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Speaker 1: if you get seventy percent of those decisions right, but

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Speaker 1: you're moving everyone forward. I mean my organization, the employees,

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Speaker 1: you see it. They just want decisions good, bad, or

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Speaker 1: and different. They want they want direction and decisions and

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Speaker 1: they want decision makers. And most of the time that's uh,

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Speaker 1: that's the part that that they look for. So jeez,

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Speaker 1: over the last eighteen months, it was all about decisions.

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Speaker 1: I didn't know which ones are going to be right,

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Speaker 1: and wrong, but they wanted answers and we had to

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Speaker 1: make decisions, and we got probably seventy percent of them. Right. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's talk about the last year and a half. What

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Speaker 1: do we know March Live Nation the long with the

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Speaker 1: stock market in general crashes, it ultimately rebounds, but then

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Speaker 1: it goes through the roof. But there were no shows.

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Speaker 1: Why does the stock go through the roof when there

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Speaker 1: are no shows and no income? Right? The great question? Right?

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Speaker 1: The uh, the the anticipation, you know, listen, I don't

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Speaker 1: want to get into all the math, but I think

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Speaker 1: the real reality was. You know, Live Nation has been

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Speaker 1: public for fifteen years, so I'm gonna say for ten

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Speaker 1: of those years we were eight dollars. People didn't quite

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Speaker 1: understand us. Um, they didn't get the market. And I

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Speaker 1: had been preaching experience economy for for many years and

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Speaker 1: how important the live show was and that that we

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Speaker 1: were this these social creatures and getting gathering for these

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Speaker 1: two hours were magical. Um. And only the last three

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Speaker 1: or four years did my start my stock start to

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Speaker 1: respond as we kind of produced good results in the market.

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Speaker 1: Went I get this thing called experience economy and live

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Speaker 1: the live events very powerful so we were already on

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Speaker 1: our way up, you know, seventies six or whatever before

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Speaker 1: the crisis. So we had already got good investor credibility

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Speaker 1: that we had delivered what we said we're going to deliver,

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Speaker 1: and they started to really understand this thing called live.

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Speaker 1: As you know, Bob, the market had talked about recorded

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Speaker 1: music for fifty years, so we were always kind of

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Speaker 1: the step child to the story. Only the last five

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Speaker 1: years I think that the market go. You know, this

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Speaker 1: thing called live at Live Nation is a is a

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Speaker 1: real credible big business and it's is important to the artist,

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Speaker 1: as is the record business. So we had already built

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Speaker 1: up the credibility. You're right, Mark, the market crashes, everybody

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Speaker 1: drops and we do no shows. So why does our

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Speaker 1: stock go up? Well at that point, you know, a

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Speaker 1: few interesting things happened. You know, when the when the

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Speaker 1: crisis happened, there were people on the wall street and

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Speaker 1: elsewhere that we're saying, oh my god, no one's gonna

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Speaker 1: ever gather again. It's over. We're all going to be,

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Speaker 1: you know, living in our houses forever. No one's going

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Speaker 1: to go to a movie, theater or a concert. And yeah,

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Speaker 1: I always remember it was the May long week end,

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Speaker 1: and there was the CNN reports from late I think

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Speaker 1: was the Ozak Lakes where everyone was partying like crazy

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Speaker 1: and in the middle of this crisis with no vaccine,

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Speaker 1: that that moment still showed that no matter how dangerous

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Speaker 1: it was, people still wanted to gather, people wanted to

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Speaker 1: get out. And so the market started to realize, Wow,

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Speaker 1: this is really gonna be a pent up demand situation.

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Speaker 1: When when we can gather, it's clear people want to gather,

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Speaker 1: They're gonna run back, They're gonna want to come back.

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Speaker 1: Two shows, um Disneyland, all the good things they do.

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Speaker 1: When when when knife normal? So I started, so we

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Speaker 1: started to see that. The second big news was when

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Speaker 1: the crisis happened. We modeled out probably fifty to seventy

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Speaker 1: percent refund rate. We assumed that the world was gonna

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Speaker 1: want their tickets back, given the economy was about to

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Speaker 1: take a hit again. Two months later, I got an

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Speaker 1: earnings call and I tell the Wall Street that we've

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Speaker 1: only had I think at that point was seven percent

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Speaker 1: refund rates. This idea that you would sell all these

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Speaker 1: tickets in the middle of a crisis, and people held

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Speaker 1: onto that ticket. That was probably the most important fact

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Speaker 1: that if you were an investor, you went, there must

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Speaker 1: be something magical about a live show that while everyone

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Speaker 1: is unemployed, sitting at home, worried about gathering there holding

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Speaker 1: onto that Billie Eilish ticket, they're not gonna sell it.

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Speaker 1: So this, this must be a magical moment in their lives.

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Speaker 1: This must be important to them, Um and um. So

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Speaker 1: you added that in that started to get investors realized.

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Speaker 1: You remember Wall Streets buying the future, not the present.

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Speaker 1: So you don't buy your stock today worried about what

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Speaker 1: my company is gonna do this month, you buy it there.

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Speaker 1: So if you're an investor looking at Live Nation, you

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Speaker 1: probably said, wow, I think this live experience business in

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Speaker 1: general is going to boom. We're seeing that happen. I

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Speaker 1: think that the low refund rate definitely delivers that factual story.

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Speaker 1: And then we did our own work. We went in

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Speaker 1: and cut a lot of costs, and we were able

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Speaker 1: to tell Wall Street that when we do come back,

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Speaker 1: we've had the luxury of having some time off, we're

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Speaker 1: gonna operate a bit more efficiently. We've We've said to

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Speaker 1: the Wall Street will will you know We'll still do

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Speaker 1: the same amount of shows but on a smaller cost basis.

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Speaker 1: So if you're an investor and you're already valued me

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Speaker 1: at seventy five dollars going into the crisis, you sat

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Speaker 1: here and said, what do I think about the future.

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Speaker 1: I think they're gonna be leaner than than they were

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Speaker 1: before they went in, so they'll make a bit more money.

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Speaker 1: I think there's a boom happening, and this thing called

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Speaker 1: live must be really really valuable to customers because there's

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Speaker 1: not even cashing it in in one of the greatest

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Speaker 1: crisis is in history. I want to bet on this category,

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Speaker 1: and I want to bet on the market leader, so

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Speaker 1: that I think of anything. Sometimes the digital reality of

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Speaker 1: everyone staying home had happened proved to a lot of

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Speaker 1: investors how important that the social uh concert experience really

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Speaker 1: is and how endearing it is to the customers. And

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Speaker 1: we're seeing that playoff. What do you think the value

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Speaker 1: of Live Nation is? Is her head room? Yeah, I've

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Speaker 1: always believed that, you know, we're we're this incredible listen.

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Speaker 1: I believe in Live for a long time. So I've

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Speaker 1: been saying this, you know, for many many years. Um,

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Speaker 1: I think recorded has its side of the world. But

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Speaker 1: I think live is is very very unique. It's if

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Speaker 1: you think about live music, it's the only unduplicate herble

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Speaker 1: asset that's really survived this entertainment revolution. Everything else is

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Speaker 1: pretty much got duplicated and digitized, UM and and and

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Speaker 1: that's great. But two hours, Bob as you know those

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Speaker 1: goose bumps you get when you watch the Eagles, um,

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Speaker 1: you don't get that on an iPad. So we have

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Speaker 1: this very unique industry that is non duplicatable um in

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Speaker 1: in a in a world where everything else has become duplicate,

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Speaker 1: herble and commoditized. I think this category has a long life.

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Speaker 1: It's been you know, since the Caveman days. We've been

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Speaker 1: dancing around music. I think my ten year old, my

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Speaker 1: eight year old can't wait to go to a concert.

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Speaker 1: And now they find them differently. They you know, the

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Speaker 1: YouTube TikTok, all the different ways they're discovering it has changed.

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Speaker 1: But they still want to go see post Malone um

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Speaker 1: at a live show. They still want to see it.

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Speaker 1: So I believe that the future of live is stronger

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Speaker 1: than ever two is. You know this from your record days.

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Speaker 1: Live was really unexploited because it wasn't a global business.

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Speaker 1: Live followed the record business, so for thirty or forty years,

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Speaker 1: you only toured where you sold records, which basically meant

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Speaker 1: you were a US Western Europe business. That's all the

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Speaker 1: labels cared about in generally for thirty or forty years.

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Speaker 1: The minute the Internet unlocked, the fan um was everywhere.

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Speaker 1: So Rihanna has two hundred million followers regardless of where

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Speaker 1: her record was sold. She's got, you know, thirty million

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Speaker 1: followers in Brazil, so now we can go to Brazil

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Speaker 1: and sell out stadiums. We weren't able to be a

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Speaker 1: global business before because we really could only go tour

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Speaker 1: where the record label was selling the record, promoting the album,

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Speaker 1: buying the airplay. Overnight that nineteen year old and Mala

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Speaker 1: and Cape Town uh Is discovered the artist on their own,

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Speaker 1: and now that fan is global. So our business has

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Speaker 1: been booming because as big as you think Live Nation is,

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Speaker 1: we're market share on a global basis. Were we got

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Speaker 1: lots of markets that are on fire and going to

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Speaker 1: grow over the next ten years that are just finally

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Speaker 1: getting great venues in South America, South Eastern Europe, Asia, UM,

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Speaker 1: so it'll be a global business. UM. Lots of growth

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Speaker 1: globally for the next you know, multiple years, as as

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Speaker 1: the infrastructure gets built and the artist goes global. So

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Speaker 1: this industry has got a lot of upside in it.

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Speaker 1: So who owns Live Nation stock? Can you break it

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Speaker 1: down us generally? Yeah, it's so it's obviously a public

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Speaker 1: company traded uh, you know, freely stock. The Liberty Media,

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Speaker 1: which the Liberty Media was an investor in I a c.

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Speaker 1: Which was ticket Master, so they owned fifteen percent of Ticketmaster.

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Speaker 1: When we merged with Ticketmaster, we uh we inherited the

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Speaker 1: Liberty Media, uh, which is John Malone, Greg Mfei. So

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Speaker 1: they've been there now the last I don't know eight

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Speaker 1: years or so. They've increased their stake and they currently

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Speaker 1: own thirty of Live Nation and then seventy percent of

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Speaker 1: Live Nation is freely traded amongst uh, you know, the

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Speaker 1: public and institutions. Okay Malone and the name of the

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Speaker 1: company has changed a few times, but he made his

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Speaker 1: money in the cable business and has had great success.

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Speaker 1: His right end person is Greg Maffey, who's chairman of

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Speaker 1: the Live Nation board. So what does he do or

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Speaker 1: what input would he might have that would influence the

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Speaker 1: direction of the company or you're thinking, well, listen, I

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Speaker 1: don't want to undersell or oversell. You know a board,

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Speaker 1: Liberty has been incredible shareholder and John Malone and Greg

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Speaker 1: I give them full credit because they play long um

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Speaker 1: and UM and they they always let the operator and

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Speaker 1: the CEE do his job. And John's history has been

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Speaker 1: clear on that. Whether you've seen the recent days David

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Speaker 1: zaslof move that John controls Mike Freeze most most of

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Speaker 1: his history is about backing good CEO s um and

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Speaker 1: letting them do what they do. So they've been incredible shareholders.

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Speaker 1: I mean again, when we were eight bucks and ten bucks,

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Speaker 1: not once would gregor John talk about the stock price.

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Speaker 1: So we just talked about how we're going to grow

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Speaker 1: the company. So they've been great, real long term shareholders.

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Speaker 1: That's the best thing you can help for in any

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Speaker 1: equity or any debt you have, is that they're playing

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Speaker 1: long along with you. UM. Given I'm playing long my

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Speaker 1: entire equity since I started this company fifteen years ago,

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Speaker 1: and what public has been about my equity, not my

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Speaker 1: pay So I'm only playing for long term equity, and

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Speaker 1: you want your shareholders playing for that. So they've been great.

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Speaker 1: Greg is is that. You know, we've had multiple chairman

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Speaker 1: now Greg has been the chairman. He's been very supportive UM.

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Speaker 1: But Liberty does not bother me in any operational part

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Speaker 1: at all, and and a board doesn't do that, that's

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Speaker 1: not their job. We we meet four times a year

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Speaker 1: and we talked about long term strategy. How are we

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Speaker 1: going to grow the company. What are the opportunities to

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Speaker 1: grow it? What do I need? What does the company need?

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Speaker 1: What resources? UM to help grow our vision? So we

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Speaker 1: set the strategy internal. We we show up at board

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Speaker 1: meetings with our vision, our long term plan, and their

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Speaker 1: job is to ask the tough questions to make it

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Speaker 1: a better plan and then ultimately support it. But zero

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Speaker 1: operation input, only long term resource input. Now, one thing

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Speaker 1: you know, we live in the era of disinformation and

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Speaker 1: misinformation is we've discussed previously, Liberty cannot literally take over

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Speaker 1: all the stock. There's a limit on their percentage. Can

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Speaker 1: you explain that? Yeah, I mean it's we We ended

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Speaker 1: up inheriting a shareholder agreement that was the Ticketmaster I

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Speaker 1: A C to sharehold agreement. So when we when they

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Speaker 1: merged in with us, we inherited it. Liberty two board

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Speaker 1: seats and maximum equity ownership UM. And that's that's kind

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Speaker 1: of where they are at, and we've been thrilled to

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Speaker 1: have them at that UM. So they can't buy more

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Speaker 1: stock in theory under the shareholder agreement UM. And that's uh,

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Speaker 1: you know that's kind of been in place now for

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Speaker 1: ten plus years and and we'll will exist as long

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Speaker 1: as as the board and and Liberty think it makes sense. Okay,

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Speaker 1: need let's just say Live Nation is a public company.

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Speaker 1: Do you do have quarterly earnings reports? To what? How

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Speaker 1: much of your time is based on servicing Wall Street?

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Speaker 1: Obviously you're on the calls, but and you have a CFO,

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Speaker 1: how much of your time does it take? Doesn't take

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Speaker 1: much of my time. I got a great team, and

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Speaker 1: you know, you build a great team around you. You know,

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Speaker 1: we've been public for fifteen years now, so this is

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Speaker 1: this is not a new skill to us, if you

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Speaker 1: want to call it. It's uh, it's baked into our

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Speaker 1: DNA and corporate staff. So Joe, Joe Burtof is my

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Speaker 1: president CFO. His team is amazing. They do all the

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Speaker 1: hard work, all the audit work, all of the financial work,

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Speaker 1: all the preparation for the reports. I have limited UM,

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Speaker 1: you know, input into all of that. In terms of

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Speaker 1: the governance of it. My job is to set the

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Speaker 1: vision and deal with the future of the business and

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Speaker 1: the strategy of the business. So it doesn't take a

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Speaker 1: lot of my time. It absolutely takes a lot of

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Speaker 1: their time. And if you worked in their department, they

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Speaker 1: would tell you that's a that's a lot of work.

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Speaker 1: But it's a contained corporate group that works with them

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Speaker 1: to get those reports done and are earning earning is done.

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Speaker 1: But you know, listen, a G I'm sure is no different.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure Phil is not letting them off the hook

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Speaker 1: very easily. I'm sure they're preparing week monthly and J

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Speaker 1: and others are answering to Denver and preparing um whatever

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Speaker 1: they've got to prepare in a monthly and a bi

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Speaker 1: monthly basis to to keep growing their business. So anytime

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Speaker 1: you get to a certain state big someone is asking

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Speaker 1: where the where the businesses and looking for ongoing reports.

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Speaker 1: So I just say that in the sense of I've

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Speaker 1: never I always have said I don't don't find public

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Speaker 1: being a negative on my business. I I've always said

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Speaker 1: I think being public has been a great, great advantage

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Speaker 1: to my business. For the last fifteen years, UM, because

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Speaker 1: it does take you out of the bubble that you

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Speaker 1: live in in the music business, and it makes you

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Speaker 1: better because ultimately, when you're dealing with Wall Street or investors, UM,

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Speaker 1: they don't care that I know, UM, you know, Bano.

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Speaker 1: What they care about is what's the business all doing?

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Speaker 1: What what what's the prospects of the business. How are

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Speaker 1: you going to grow the business. So it does get

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Speaker 1: you out of that bubble of music relevance that we

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Speaker 1: all think we live in. And then you have to

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Speaker 1: cross that street and talk to adults about what is

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Speaker 1: your really your business and what's the core of your

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Speaker 1: business and how are you going to grow your business?

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Speaker 1: And I think that's made us healthy because we've been

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Speaker 1: able to keep one ft in the core of what

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Speaker 1: the business is about, but also step outside of the

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Speaker 1: echo chamber of Hollywood and the music business and talk

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Speaker 1: about our business from a more strategic perspective. UM. And

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Speaker 1: I think that's made us good. UM. And also you know,

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Speaker 1: as you you've seen, we gotta wake up four times

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Speaker 1: a year and and deliver and talk out loud about

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Speaker 1: what we're gonna do and actually deliver that UM. So

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Speaker 1: that accountability um, his, I think made us, made us

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Speaker 1: a much better company. Okay, Now the average punter would say,

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Speaker 1: you want a company with no debt. I remember when

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Speaker 1: Irving was still working at Live Nations says, you know,

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Speaker 1: if you have no debt, you have a lazy balance

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Speaker 1: sheet and you're right for a takeover. How much debt

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Speaker 1: does Live Nation have? And what's its philosophy and debt?

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Speaker 1: For those who really don't understand, can you play that

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Speaker 1: out a little bit right? Yeah? That was my famous

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Speaker 1: first earnings call when we went public in two thousand five,

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Speaker 1: I was and we spun out of clear channel. They

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Speaker 1: were gonna I remember going to add add four or

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Speaker 1: fion in debt to us, and I convinced Randall and

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Speaker 1: Mark May's that we didn't want that debt. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to start with a fresh, clean slate so we could

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Speaker 1: build our business. And Randall Mace was still on my

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Speaker 1: board was supportive. So I'm very proud that I have

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Speaker 1: no debt. And my first earnings call, an analyst gets

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Speaker 1: on and says, you have a lazy balance sheet, and

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Speaker 1: I had no idea what he was talking about. Only

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Speaker 1: on on the earnings call would you find out that

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Speaker 1: no debt was a bad thing. Um So, yes, that's

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Speaker 1: the famous lazy balance sheet. UM No. So you know

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Speaker 1: that the prospect of debt is simple. You're you're gonna

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Speaker 1: grow a company, um and you're gonna ultimately need to

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Speaker 1: borrow debt to grow your business as you're building your

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Speaker 1: business um. And you know, depending on what error you're

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Speaker 1: and what's the cost of debt, and debt historically has

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Speaker 1: been fairly cheap. So we look at we look at

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Speaker 1: Live Nation. Most companies look at what is your your

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Speaker 1: kind of your leverage rate against your profit, your ibada,

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Speaker 1: and you never want to be, you know, two over leveraged.

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Speaker 1: We've always been somewhere around three times leverage. So that

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Speaker 1: would mean whatever my IBADA is, we would have three

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Speaker 1: times that in debt. That would be considered a very

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Speaker 1: very safe balance sheet, a smart balance sheet because if

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Speaker 1: you could borrow to three dollars to help grow your

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Speaker 1: company and you can get a better return for that

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Speaker 1: debt than what the cost is, you should do that. UM.

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Speaker 1: So we've always been on that. We're living right now

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Speaker 1: even through this crisis, because we had a conservative balance

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Speaker 1: sheet going in. We're probably leveraged that four times and

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Speaker 1: at the time we get through twenty two twenty two,

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Speaker 1: will start putting paying back down our debt and will

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Speaker 1: live somewhere in the three times leverage debt, which would

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Speaker 1: be very very conservative. On Wall Street companies you hear

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Speaker 1: about that get in trouble would be seven eight time

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Speaker 1: leverage on their on their ebitda um. But we've always

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Speaker 1: been very conservad it Evan, we'll stay in that same range. Okay,

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Speaker 1: let's leave the finance behind for a moment and go

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Speaker 1: more down to the street and the consumer level. What

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Speaker 1: we hear is America's open for business. Live shows are returning.

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Speaker 1: Generally speaking, very few live shows have played of a

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Speaker 1: major caliber, not small club shows and not socially distant shows.

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Speaker 1: So we had the food fighters at MSG. Certainly Vegas

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Speaker 1: is open, but as we talk, the Delta variant is

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Speaker 1: raging now. Of the people who are getting that are

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Speaker 1: the unvaccinated. But the first question is when can we

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Speaker 1: expect or is it still in the balance full playing

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Speaker 1: of shows. Well, last weekend was really the start for us.

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Speaker 1: Our amphitheater season open last last Friday, so that would

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Speaker 1: have been you know, Jimmy Buffett's Luke Bryant sold out

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Speaker 1: Amphitheater shows from Boss then all the way down Nashville, etcetera.

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Speaker 1: So that that was our first weekend of full twenty seven.

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Speaker 1: Amphitheater tours started last weekend, so we're fully kind of

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Speaker 1: committed now on across the board. Amphitheater season is full open,

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Speaker 1: full capacity UM and our first big festival is in

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Speaker 1: two weeks that is Rolling Loud in Miami, a couple

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Speaker 1: hundred thousand people. So as of now we're fully open.

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Speaker 1: The UK opens on Monday, and we have eleven large

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Speaker 1: festivals happening in the UK in the month of August.

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Speaker 1: So aside from all of the Delta UH, recent news

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Speaker 1: UH seemed to be full, full steam ahead and in

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Speaker 1: all states and in the UK. The rest of the

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Speaker 1: world looks like it's gonna gonna be a few months

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Speaker 1: up until maybe six months behind, depending on where they are.

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Speaker 1: But we still still are unscheduled and opening up right

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Speaker 1: now across America. Okay, let's just say, if you print

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Speaker 1: a disclaimer, let's start from the threshold. Some of these

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Speaker 1: acts are printing disclaimers vaccinated people only. Okay, we all

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Speaker 1: know that in the honor system there are people who

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Speaker 1: slipped through. What is Live Nations feeling about this? And

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Speaker 1: where does the liability lie? You have lawyers who say,

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Speaker 1: ultimately your disclaimers work where they think they're gonna work,

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Speaker 1: or you buy insurance? Is it the act? Is it?

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Speaker 1: Live Nation? Amplify that please? I mean it's all it's

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Speaker 1: all new territory as you know, Uh, you know what

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Speaker 1: I what I like everyone to be vaccinated? Absolutely? Um?

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Speaker 1: Is it? Is it? As you know in America, no

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Speaker 1: simple system right now from federal to state. Everyone is

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Speaker 1: making their own decisions, um and um. And it's you know,

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Speaker 1: as you know, it started six months ago where we

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Speaker 1: thought everyone was gonna have to vaccine passport. May be

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Speaker 1: there're gonna be some minimum requirements to everyone just kind

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Speaker 1: of dropped, dropped all requirements and and in a in

429
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:10,200
Speaker 1: a state to open has opened. So right now we're

430
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:13,720
Speaker 1: we're in you know, we're following whatever the latest government

431
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:17,880
Speaker 1: state mandate is. Um. And also as you know, many

432
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:19,600
Speaker 1: of I work for the artist and many of them

433
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:23,080
Speaker 1: have some some have different opinions on what they want

434
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 1: or don't want in terms of vaccine requirements. UM. So

435
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 1: we've been we're open up now. We don't think that

436
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,159
Speaker 1: the liability is is going to be a factor. Um.

437
00:24:35,520 --> 00:24:39,000
Speaker 1: In the big picture, it's very very you know, everyone's vaccinated,

438
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 1: everyone has the opportunity to get vaccinated everyone. No one's

439
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:44,320
Speaker 1: forced to go to a concert. Um. All all of

440
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:48,359
Speaker 1: those things that happened at that concert or well well disclosed.

441
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:51,120
Speaker 1: So we don't think right now that there's any not any.

442
00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 1: We don't think there's large liability issues overall. Okay, who

443
00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 1: decides if it's vaccinated? Only show the artist or live

444
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:04,880
Speaker 1: nation or the building. Pretty much the states right now,

445
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:10,000
Speaker 1: so as you know, it's Florida, Texas, most states you

446
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:16,240
Speaker 1: can't demand vaccine requirements. Um. So other than right now

447
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,840
Speaker 1: New York and California, those are the only two states

448
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:25,800
Speaker 1: who are still some regulations over five thousand seats in

449
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 1: terms of vaccine. Every other state is pretty much open

450
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:34,800
Speaker 1: for business, not requiring passports, are not requiring vaccines for

451
00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:39,240
Speaker 1: for large events. So we're following whatever the state regulation

452
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 1: is is what we've been following. Okay, now talking about

453
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:51,960
Speaker 1: your SHED shows that played, how was attendance last weekend?

454
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 1: Was great? We were you know, we really saw after

455
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 1: July four any of the SHED stuff that wasn't popping

456
00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,680
Speaker 1: on the on sale really got a big kick after

457
00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:05,359
Speaker 1: July fourth, and we assume after everyone either saw it

458
00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:08,400
Speaker 1: on TV or felt they were opened up and saw

459
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:11,240
Speaker 1: the world opening up. That seemed to be kind of

460
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:14,480
Speaker 1: the next level of validation for customers saying this is real,

461
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,399
Speaker 1: the show is happening, buy a ticket. So last weekend

462
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:21,880
Speaker 1: we had a record uh kind of weekend, and um,

463
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,280
Speaker 1: we're seeing every day now the raps are doing better

464
00:26:24,280 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 1: and better on the amphitheater shows that were some of

465
00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 1: them were stalled, and I think that's a lot of

466
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:32,560
Speaker 1: confusion in the marketplace and customers weren't sure is it

467
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:35,000
Speaker 1: going to happen not I have to be vaccinated, don't

468
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:38,560
Speaker 1: So I think some of that confusion has slowly lifted

469
00:26:38,560 --> 00:26:41,440
Speaker 1: as these shows are actually playing now and people believe

470
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:44,639
Speaker 1: that there there, we are open for business and what

471
00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:47,440
Speaker 1: is the future of the shed. Certainly when you took

472
00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:50,120
Speaker 1: over and you inherited the buildings, a lot of them,

473
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 1: a lot of people felt that many of them were

474
00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 1: built on the cheap and they were tired. Where we

475
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:59,879
Speaker 1: at with this sheds, you know, they continue to be

476
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:03,520
Speaker 1: an incredible good experience. I mean, they're they're not a

477
00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:08,320
Speaker 1: billion dollar indoor arena like the latest San Francisco arena

478
00:27:08,359 --> 00:27:11,439
Speaker 1: by far. But they are a beautiful place for eighteen

479
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:14,639
Speaker 1: thousand people to sit outside under the stars and uh

480
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:17,919
Speaker 1: drink a beer and um smoke a joint if they

481
00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:20,920
Speaker 1: want and watch a show. So we still see the

482
00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:24,200
Speaker 1: vitality of the amphitheater has not waned at all. We've

483
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 1: had record years coming out of nineteen. Um, so we're

484
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 1: still you know, we we still believe our fifty amphitheaters

485
00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 1: are real vibrant. We did a lot of work. Really,

486
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 1: where we had to do the real work, Bob, was

487
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 1: the programming of them. We had to make sure that

488
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:41,359
Speaker 1: they weren't just old classic rock. Um. So, I don't know,

489
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:44,199
Speaker 1: five six years ago we made sure we really you know,

490
00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:48,119
Speaker 1: went after a younger artist, pop artist, hip hop artists,

491
00:27:48,200 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 1: make sure we expanded the portfolio and that was successful.

492
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:56,520
Speaker 1: The business has been strong and eighteen and nineteen were

493
00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:58,800
Speaker 1: record years and we assumed twenty two will be a

494
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,680
Speaker 1: record year. So um, they continue to be a strong

495
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:06,680
Speaker 1: piece of our business. Um overall, and we're still and

496
00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:08,600
Speaker 1: we're still and we're still opening them. I mean, we

497
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:12,440
Speaker 1: like developing them. They're they're they're good businesses. Okay, are

498
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:20,159
Speaker 1: those books nationally or locally? About seventy national local on

499
00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:24,520
Speaker 1: the amphitheaters, and then what about live nation in general?

500
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:30,240
Speaker 1: When is something book nationally and when is something book locally? Well,

501
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:33,760
Speaker 1: we have if you do macro numbers, we did about

502
00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 1: thirty thousand shows in forty countries in two thousand nineteen.

503
00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 1: If you just did a national versus local, you would

504
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:47,440
Speaker 1: have out of those thirty thousand shows, you'd only have

505
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:52,960
Speaker 1: six or seven thousand toured shows and about twenty five

506
00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:57,240
Speaker 1: thousand local booked. So it is still a local business. Globally,

507
00:28:57,840 --> 00:29:00,960
Speaker 1: you know, the Milan, Italy is the Spain, the Australia's

508
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 1: there's still the majority of that business is still a

509
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 1: local book business. The tours we do on the national level,

510
00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:13,520
Speaker 1: we would do, you know, we would only do uh,

511
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 1: we only do a few global tours a year. We

512
00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,120
Speaker 1: do a lot of US tours a year. But it's

513
00:29:21,160 --> 00:29:24,240
Speaker 1: still a local business, a national business, and and then

514
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 1: last a global business. All moving towards national and global.

515
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: In five years from now and ten years from now

516
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:32,520
Speaker 1: you and I will talk, those numbers will keep moving

517
00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:37,280
Speaker 1: to central as artists are now especially younger managers look

518
00:29:37,280 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 1: at the tour as something that they would want to

519
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 1: lock in on a national and global basis as a partner. Um.

520
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 1: So we're seeing a lot of that movement. Okay, tell

521
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 1: me about the revenue streams. How many revenue streams do

522
00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 1: you have at Live Nation? What's the great line that

523
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 1: one of the investors used were like a river of nichols. Um,

524
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,000
Speaker 1: you have of a lot, But I mean generally you're

525
00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 1: you know the business model is you we spend six

526
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 1: billion dollars a year at midnight for those thirty thousand shows.

527
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:10,360
Speaker 1: Those shows put a hundred million people through our through

528
00:30:10,360 --> 00:30:15,080
Speaker 1: the venues. UM. So once at that course six billion,

529
00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:18,960
Speaker 1: that return is the is the low margin piece. Artists

530
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 1: are making most of that money um. And then our

531
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:23,960
Speaker 1: job is to monetize the hundred million people that walk

532
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 1: through the door. So you have advertising as a big

533
00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:30,960
Speaker 1: business for us. Sponsorship advertising, um, that's a huge, big

534
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 1: business for us. You have the second biggest is just

535
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 1: all the incilliary revenue, whether it's the food, the beverage,

536
00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:42,080
Speaker 1: the parking, the rebates when we put shows in um

537
00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:44,560
Speaker 1: in arenas, we've got a rebate system if we put

538
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:47,120
Speaker 1: so many shows in a year, so putting shows in

539
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:50,920
Speaker 1: you're getting paid either in your building or someone else's um.

540
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 1: And and then three would be our service fees at

541
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 1: Ticketmaster would be our our our our third revenue stream.

542
00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 1: So those are the those are the three big pieces.

543
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 1: And how do they split up in terms of let's

544
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:06,760
Speaker 1: call it net in to those three streams, what they conduce,

545
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:12,720
Speaker 1: they're almost let's you could almost call them thirty three

546
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:18,880
Speaker 1: percent each in a macro level, they're they're all equally important. Ok, okay,

547
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 1: just thirty three percent for sponsorship, thirty three percent for

548
00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 1: ticket for the actual show, and the other thirty percent

549
00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: we would call ticket Master, Yeah, I ticket Master on

550
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:36,320
Speaker 1: site and sillerary revenue and thirty three advertising very small,

551
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:45,400
Speaker 1: very small percent at the door. What was the status

552
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:50,400
Speaker 1: of sponsorship when you took over fifteen years ago, and

553
00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 1: what is it today? And what does it look like

554
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:58,800
Speaker 1: and what are the opportunities? It's a great line. You know,

555
00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 1: I looked sponsorship. I mean, listen, I looked at Live

556
00:32:02,360 --> 00:32:06,160
Speaker 1: Nation at the time we were sponsorship was a uh,

557
00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:09,480
Speaker 1: you know, a banner at at an amphitheater. It was

558
00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,000
Speaker 1: a it was a you know, I think one of

559
00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 1: the things we did right at Live Nations, we we

560
00:32:13,840 --> 00:32:15,880
Speaker 1: took a lot of things away from the promoter in

561
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 1: a positive sense. Right, the promoter shouldn't be worried about

562
00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 1: sponsorship and venue management and websites. Here's a pee books

563
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:28,160
Speaker 1: and market shows. So when we put Russell and built

564
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: a sponsorship division, UM, I think that's that's why far

565
00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 1: been our biggest growth because today you know it is

566
00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:40,560
Speaker 1: servicing CMO CEO relationships. It's a we have an incredible

567
00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 1: ad network that we sell across our platform. We've got

568
00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:47,600
Speaker 1: a measurement system to sell it, to validate the sponsorship

569
00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:52,920
Speaker 1: on site offsite UM. We have incredible on site distribution

570
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:57,360
Speaker 1: system where you can talk to and target customers and

571
00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:01,280
Speaker 1: and UM and use segmentation to to look use our

572
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:05,240
Speaker 1: data to really narrow down exactly. So a very professionalized

573
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 1: business versus banners. I mean, our job is ultimately we're

574
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:11,200
Speaker 1: trying to sell an audience to a brand. And the

575
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 1: more you know about the audience and the more you

576
00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:15,680
Speaker 1: can convince them that you can target that audience and

577
00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:18,400
Speaker 1: measure it, the better you're going to do in advertising.

578
00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:21,200
Speaker 1: So we look at our business as a hundred million

579
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:25,800
Speaker 1: audience it's a huge audience. Advertisers, well, they spend a

580
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 1: lot of money on TV and digital, that's a different world.

581
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 1: They're always looking to say, well, how do I touch

582
00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:37,320
Speaker 1: customers directly, whether it's through music, sports, events, UM and

583
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:39,400
Speaker 1: if we can be the leader by saying listen, were

584
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 1: not not only want to uh be your partner, but

585
00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:46,800
Speaker 1: we know nineteen to twenty four year old, this demo,

586
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:50,720
Speaker 1: that knows this UM that has appeals to this target

587
00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:54,080
Speaker 1: and we can reach them on Thursdays at scale, we

588
00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 1: can help you sell Evolvo. I mean, the more targeted

589
00:33:56,560 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 1: and the more precise our data is, the better our

590
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:01,600
Speaker 1: businesses were with the brand. So that would be the

591
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 1: if you want to simplify it. That's the that's the

592
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 1: core why we're we we do so well in that

593
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,279
Speaker 1: space is we have a very smart data team, a

594
00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:13,200
Speaker 1: very smart segmentation team, and we're selling the audience, not

595
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:17,800
Speaker 1: the artist. So we can sell you enough scale to

596
00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:20,359
Speaker 1: UM to advertise on our platform, whether it's on site,

597
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,560
Speaker 1: whether it's through a digital through a email, touch through

598
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,760
Speaker 1: our app, through a through their app, through an event.

599
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:28,879
Speaker 1: You know, there's a host of ways we can reach

600
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 1: those hundred million people. For you. But most importantly advertising

601
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:34,880
Speaker 1: is do you know your customer? Can you tell us

602
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 1: who your customer is? And can we measure and monitor

603
00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:41,280
Speaker 1: if we're if we're really reaching them with success. Um.

604
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:45,520
Speaker 1: So that's our ongoing work and and and advancement and

605
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: that in that business. Okay, forty years ago this started

606
00:34:50,120 --> 00:34:52,719
Speaker 1: with the Rolling Stones and jove on what did jo

607
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 1: Van got? They got their name on the actual ticket.

608
00:34:56,000 --> 00:34:58,680
Speaker 1: Then we had a lot of money coming into sponsorship

609
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:03,399
Speaker 1: and then all Wa Baddison Avenue pulled back and said,

610
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:05,799
Speaker 1: we're not sure we're getting value for our money. If

611
00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 1: you have a car, CuPy, you have a deep pocket

612
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:13,839
Speaker 1: potential sponsor, what is the what are you selling them

613
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:20,200
Speaker 1: that really works? What works today? You know Jet Generally

614
00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:22,239
Speaker 1: a sponsor is gonna come to us, or brand's gonna

615
00:35:22,239 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 1: come to us and say I have a I need

616
00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:27,160
Speaker 1: to reach a target. They know who they want to

617
00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 1: reach obviously, So when a brand comes to us and says,

618
00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:31,720
Speaker 1: you know, we really are having a tough time reaching

619
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 1: you know, forty to fifty five year old boomers who

620
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: we think want to buy the Audi car, because there,

621
00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:40,880
Speaker 1: you know, this is our target. Can you reach them?

622
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,279
Speaker 1: That's how it would start right. Our job then is

623
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:46,440
Speaker 1: to say, well, actually, let us show you average customer

624
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 1: that goes to the Grateful Dead, but you know, we

625
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:50,440
Speaker 1: can give you a whole bunch of shows. We have

626
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:54,719
Speaker 1: sixteen point one million forty to fifty five year old

627
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:58,080
Speaker 1: customers that are showing up at our events in our database.

628
00:35:58,239 --> 00:36:00,799
Speaker 1: We could reach them. We want out. So that's the

629
00:36:00,800 --> 00:36:02,600
Speaker 1: first piece. Convince them that we have a big enough

630
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 1: audience that they care about that seems relevant to them.

631
00:36:06,040 --> 00:36:09,040
Speaker 1: Now too is then let's develop a program that can

632
00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 1: hit those sixty million customers. That's that's good for you

633
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:15,879
Speaker 1: in the brand. And that's where whether it's as lame

634
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:19,040
Speaker 1: is putting the car on site, the simplest idea to

635
00:36:19,680 --> 00:36:22,160
Speaker 1: We're gonna email all of those customers. We're gonna offer

636
00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:25,280
Speaker 1: them every time you come in for a free demo

637
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:28,920
Speaker 1: at the audi dealer, you're gonna get a first access

638
00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:31,840
Speaker 1: to a concert ticket. You're gonna get a access to

639
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:34,400
Speaker 1: a show, you're gonna get a free ticket. There's a

640
00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:37,400
Speaker 1: hundred different programs you're gonna create the real magic. And

641
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:39,480
Speaker 1: what we do is we've got a great team in

642
00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:43,239
Speaker 1: New York Customer under Darren Wolfe, who is creating these

643
00:36:43,280 --> 00:36:48,480
Speaker 1: programs to meet that brand's need. So it's every brand's

644
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: gonna be slightly different. They're all got some idea reaching

645
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:56,680
Speaker 1: customers in the music space on site, uh, in a

646
00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,680
Speaker 1: live environment, and then they want to create some branded

647
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:03,160
Speaker 1: program ROMP for it, and that's what we're we're best

648
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:07,560
Speaker 1: at doing for them. Needles just say big Star, certainly superstars.

649
00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:12,040
Speaker 1: They say the tour is sponsored by ex company. Do

650
00:37:12,160 --> 00:37:15,920
Speaker 1: they bring that to you or do you sometimes bring

651
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,920
Speaker 1: that sponsor to them? How does that work? I would

652
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 1: that would be separate. And you're right where you're referring

653
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:28,279
Speaker 1: to earlier was every brand manager or CMO probably got

654
00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:32,240
Speaker 1: burnt by doing an artist sponsorship a tour deal, probably

655
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,840
Speaker 1: didn't get the value they wanted because it's hard to

656
00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:39,759
Speaker 1: do a tour deal and one tour um and put

657
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 1: some signs up in the in the boardwalk and signs

658
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,440
Speaker 1: in the in the in the VIP gallery and do

659
00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:47,560
Speaker 1: some meet and greets and think that's a lot of value.

660
00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:50,360
Speaker 1: That's not, you know, not reaching a lot of customers.

661
00:37:50,760 --> 00:37:53,360
Speaker 1: So you saw brand brand's kind of went two ways.

662
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:56,640
Speaker 1: The either went really deep with an artist and did

663
00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:59,680
Speaker 1: a real image program where they really got you know,

664
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:03,080
Speaker 1: a d doesn't Beyonce where they really integrated the artists

665
00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:06,000
Speaker 1: into their brand and um and those are you know,

666
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:10,000
Speaker 1: very deep relationships and and and let's call those um

667
00:38:10,040 --> 00:38:12,200
Speaker 1: you know those artists direct. We don't have anything to

668
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:14,880
Speaker 1: do with those. The the the artist and the brand

669
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: come together and a bigger and a bigger deal and

670
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 1: hopefully that works for them. If the brand wants to

671
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 1: be in the live business, they probably have ended up

672
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:27,879
Speaker 1: coming to UH to Live Nation or a promoter and said,

673
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:30,400
Speaker 1: you know what, I don't want one event, I want scale.

674
00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:33,480
Speaker 1: So that's why we did a good job over these

675
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:35,800
Speaker 1: last few years. If we don't sell the artists tour,

676
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:37,879
Speaker 1: we sell the fact that we have a hundred million

677
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:40,719
Speaker 1: people coming to a to our audience where the you know,

678
00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:43,080
Speaker 1: let's call it the NFL. We have a large audience,

679
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: so we can deliver your message multiple times to a

680
00:38:46,239 --> 00:38:49,520
Speaker 1: large audience space. And that's the only way, you know,

681
00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:52,880
Speaker 1: you tend to win. And advertising is large reach with

682
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:56,560
Speaker 1: good impact and direct messaging. So we end up never

683
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:59,360
Speaker 1: selling one tour that's probably not going to be efficient.

684
00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:02,760
Speaker 1: We're going to sell you a summer six month program,

685
00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:05,479
Speaker 1: a two month, a five year program. We're gonna sell

686
00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:08,920
Speaker 1: you a lot of customers over time that your program

687
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:14,279
Speaker 1: can touch and and deliver against. That's where really we've

688
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:16,799
Speaker 1: turned it from a one off business to a credible

689
00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 1: sales channel that brands say, Okay, I can I can

690
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 1: use Live Nation. I can put an advertising program together

691
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:25,919
Speaker 1: and I'm going to reach a large audience base over

692
00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:29,239
Speaker 1: the summer. That's an efficient buy for me. Um and

693
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:33,280
Speaker 1: I'll add that to my marketing mix. Okay. This suddenly

694
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:37,520
Speaker 1: drifts into ticketing because certainly for the big acts, they

695
00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:41,000
Speaker 1: have deals with m X or maybe City where people

696
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 1: can get tickets, card members can get tickets early. Now

697
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:47,359
Speaker 1: this of course involves Ticketmaster. Let's say it's a Live

698
00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:52,560
Speaker 1: Nation show. How does this all work out? Yeah? I

699
00:39:52,560 --> 00:39:55,840
Speaker 1: think for the last ten years, I think American Express

700
00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:58,439
Speaker 1: God Blessing, they created that program called Front of the Line.

701
00:39:58,440 --> 00:39:59,920
Speaker 1: I give them full credit because it's one of the

702
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: you programs that probably has lived this long. Now. It's

703
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:06,960
Speaker 1: been replicated by most credit card companies. Um And I

704
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:10,319
Speaker 1: think every credit card company probably has some relationship with

705
00:40:10,400 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 1: some sports team and our promoter. UM And I think

706
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:19,160
Speaker 1: the access to tickets, it's probably the biggest value a

707
00:40:19,239 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 1: customer wants, right, the hardest thing to do is to

708
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:24,319
Speaker 1: get a great ticket to a show because there's such

709
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:28,320
Speaker 1: a big demand and limited supply. So pre sales became

710
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:32,640
Speaker 1: a big um item for brands that we're willing to pay, uh,

711
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:37,759
Speaker 1: sponts willing to pay promoters, artists venues for access to

712
00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:42,359
Speaker 1: tickets for their fan base in exchange for a sponsorship check.

713
00:40:42,719 --> 00:40:46,239
Speaker 1: So uh, we're we've all participated in it. It's a

714
00:40:46,280 --> 00:40:49,840
Speaker 1: good revenue stream um for US. Live Nation has it

715
00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:55,560
Speaker 1: for some of our shows. Sometimes artists have it directly, promoters, festivals,

716
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 1: sports teams. So pre sales has been a really defined

717
00:41:00,640 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 1: category of sponsorship, if you want to call it um,

718
00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:07,320
Speaker 1: started by American Express and now used by most brands

719
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 1: as a value to the sponsorship package. Okay, dirty little

720
00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:15,120
Speaker 1: secret of the business is that on the on sale

721
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:18,480
Speaker 1: it could be a twenty thousand seat arena, and on

722
00:41:18,520 --> 00:41:22,359
Speaker 1: the on sale date fewer than a thousand tickets are

723
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: ultimately available. Then who decides on all the varying levels

724
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:31,120
Speaker 1: of pre sale? Why does that exist? Why are we

725
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:36,200
Speaker 1: in this world? Yeah? I wouldn't say that's the case anymore.

726
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:39,040
Speaker 1: That that models flushed out over the years, you don't

727
00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:43,640
Speaker 1: have any more of these UM's not anymore. But the

728
00:41:43,760 --> 00:41:47,319
Speaker 1: no comp tour is pretty much standard now. If you're

729
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,960
Speaker 1: running a big tour and you're the tour accountant, you

730
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:54,600
Speaker 1: ain't given record, label, sponsor, you're not giving anyone anything

731
00:41:54,600 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 1: for free. UM. So that changed over the last five

732
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 1: six years, if you want to call it. Most tours

733
00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 1: now are a no cop tour meeting. Unless I'm proving

734
00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:09,799
Speaker 1: to that artist that I'm taking tickets and delivering them

735
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:14,399
Speaker 1: to a sponsor media property and getting something in return. Uh,

736
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 1: they're not getting tickets anymore. And if the label needs them,

737
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:20,000
Speaker 1: the labels buying them. So I would say that that

738
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:24,400
Speaker 1: isn't really the challenge anymore. Most of the tickets that

739
00:42:24,440 --> 00:42:27,000
Speaker 1: are going to go on sale at ten o'clock, a

740
00:42:27,280 --> 00:42:30,920
Speaker 1: very small you know what would be a percent small

741
00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:36,520
Speaker 1: percent is held for UM for anything other than now,

742
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:39,600
Speaker 1: if there's a sponsor involved, maybe they've done a big

743
00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:43,440
Speaker 1: sponsorship deal. Maybe there's a thousand tickets, two thousand tickets,

744
00:42:43,440 --> 00:42:47,960
Speaker 1: ten but there wouldn't be. There would be most most shows,

745
00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:52,960
Speaker 1: most tickets, large majority are going to be available on

746
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:57,359
Speaker 1: on pre sale slash on sale, Okay, let me, Yeah,

747
00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:00,200
Speaker 1: you entered the point. I was actually more interest did

748
00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:02,279
Speaker 1: less than the no comp I'm glad you covered that.

749
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:06,560
Speaker 1: But with many acts, there are different levels of pre sale,

750
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:09,799
Speaker 1: such when the general public gets a bite, most of

751
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:12,000
Speaker 1: the tickets have already been sold. I'm not talking about

752
00:43:12,000 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 1: any neferious activity. But there's the credit card, there's the

753
00:43:16,719 --> 00:43:20,000
Speaker 1: fian club. How does that come about in what's the

754
00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:25,319
Speaker 1: status of that today? But again, let's not use one

755
00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:27,840
Speaker 1: brush to paint the business. Right, there's you know this,

756
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:30,759
Speaker 1: this business always gets talked about at the time. There's

757
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:34,200
Speaker 1: there's ten artists that can make the rules different. Then

758
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 1: there's the rest of us. Right, So most shows, you know,

759
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 1: I look at my pre sales on most tours. You know,

760
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:45,920
Speaker 1: there's a very small amount of states that a pre

761
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:48,439
Speaker 1: sale will go real clean and sell four or five

762
00:43:48,440 --> 00:43:51,200
Speaker 1: thousand tickets on a pre sale before the on sell

763
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:54,160
Speaker 1: on the Saturday. You know that's that's that's the one

764
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:57,920
Speaker 1: percent rule most of the time a pre sale. If

765
00:43:57,920 --> 00:43:59,680
Speaker 1: you do a pre sale and you do a thousand

766
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:03,160
Speaker 1: tick kits are two thousand tickets, you're happy, um, and

767
00:44:03,200 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 1: you'll you're you'll gladly exchange some of that direct marketing

768
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:09,240
Speaker 1: that that brand used to help you sell some tickets.

769
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:11,839
Speaker 1: I mean, Bob, you know this. Most shows don't sell out.

770
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:15,640
Speaker 1: Nine shows don't sell out. So most of the time

771
00:44:15,680 --> 00:44:18,440
Speaker 1: our challenge isn't that we sold out and don't have tickets.

772
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:21,560
Speaker 1: Most of the time is is it's not sold. We

773
00:44:21,560 --> 00:44:23,839
Speaker 1: don't have a ton of marketing and concert promotion as

774
00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:26,040
Speaker 1: you know. This is you know, in a big world

775
00:44:26,120 --> 00:44:29,520
Speaker 1: of all the marketing messages out there. Um, we have

776
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:33,239
Speaker 1: a very small marketing budget per show, per tour in

777
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:36,759
Speaker 1: retrospect to the amount of noise in the marketplace. So

778
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:40,400
Speaker 1: we're always going to find and look for any trick

779
00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:45,200
Speaker 1: sponsor pre sale media. Well well look, well we're probably

780
00:44:45,200 --> 00:44:47,200
Speaker 1: going to resort to many tricks to try to get

781
00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:49,080
Speaker 1: a little bit of news or a little bit of

782
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:53,359
Speaker 1: noise around a on sale or pre sale. Um, just

783
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:56,319
Speaker 1: because it's it's it's so tough to break clutter on

784
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 1: you know, when you're forget if you're you know Taylor Swifter,

785
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:03,000
Speaker 1: you know, the Beyonces of the world, the rest of

786
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:05,680
Speaker 1: the businesses. God, I'm going on sale on Saturday, is

787
00:45:05,960 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 1: seven others going on sale. I got a thirty thousand

788
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:12,959
Speaker 1: dollar budget per city. Um, I got forty thousand spend

789
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:16,160
Speaker 1: in Los Angeles, which buys you, you know what, nothing.

790
00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 1: So you're trying to break a little clutter on a

791
00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:22,120
Speaker 1: Saturday morning. So you'll take that pre sale when you

792
00:45:22,239 --> 00:45:24,560
Speaker 1: when when a commerce or a credit cards going to

793
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 1: talk direct to their probably targeted fan that wants to

794
00:45:28,680 --> 00:45:33,840
Speaker 1: buy a ticket. Um, So I would say to you Macro,

795
00:45:34,080 --> 00:45:37,960
Speaker 1: I don't believe pre sales are the problem with the customer. Um.

796
00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:39,759
Speaker 1: You know, we can get into scalpers at some point,

797
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:41,919
Speaker 1: but the real problem on a Saturday at ten isn't

798
00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:44,880
Speaker 1: that the tickets are sold two pre sales. The problem

799
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 1: at ten o'clock is the tickets are sold because the

800
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:52,160
Speaker 1: secondary markets very vibrant. Okay, what actually works instead of

801
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:58,359
Speaker 1: in terms of promoting a show, I mean print, TV, Facebook, online. Yeah,

802
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:06,120
Speaker 1: it's been um to to changes. Ultimately, the none of

803
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:10,440
Speaker 1: the mainline advertising tends to work anymore. You know, there's

804
00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:12,759
Speaker 1: it's a direct business now. So the best way to

805
00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:15,799
Speaker 1: sell a ticket is to use the artist socials they have.

806
00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:18,160
Speaker 1: They are direct to consumer brands now, as you know.

807
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:21,080
Speaker 1: So you want to find a fan, go on their

808
00:46:21,080 --> 00:46:25,080
Speaker 1: Instagram and they probably got twenty million followers or however

809
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:27,200
Speaker 1: many some of them have a hundred millions. So you're

810
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:29,719
Speaker 1: gonna sell a fan a ticket, probably start with their

811
00:46:29,719 --> 00:46:33,480
Speaker 1: own their their brands, their social networks. Uh So if

812
00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 1: you go and look at our database, Live Nation's database

813
00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:42,680
Speaker 1: of ticket buyers, and the and the artist database, those

814
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:45,719
Speaker 1: are probably your two best places you're gonna start. If

815
00:46:45,760 --> 00:46:50,040
Speaker 1: I advertise against that those two databases, you're probably going

816
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:53,800
Speaker 1: to find out most of your customers are there. Uh. Second,

817
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:57,840
Speaker 1: then you're right, we do spend a lot on Facebook, Instagram.

818
00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:00,400
Speaker 1: Uh those those are those are the best kind of

819
00:47:00,440 --> 00:47:04,799
Speaker 1: response tools for an event. Um. So that that's kind

820
00:47:04,800 --> 00:47:08,359
Speaker 1: of the the two places to spend digital online and

821
00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:13,240
Speaker 1: start with the digital online on the artist's main network,

822
00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:17,040
Speaker 1: and then anyone else's databased like Live Nations or probably

823
00:47:17,080 --> 00:47:19,560
Speaker 1: a E G. S or American suppress whoever has a

824
00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:24,239
Speaker 1: large customer database of ticket purchased purchasers um that are

825
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:28,279
Speaker 1: like minded or pass buyers. So all online, all digital now,

826
00:47:28,719 --> 00:47:32,360
Speaker 1: all anything radio print, TV we do is probably just vanity.

827
00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:35,719
Speaker 1: It's not probably going to convert. It's too wide. We

828
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:38,160
Speaker 1: can go targeted now and reach you know, you only

829
00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:41,959
Speaker 1: have to find thirteen or fourteen thousand fans in Los

830
00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:44,719
Speaker 1: Angeles to fill a Staples Center. So you don't need

831
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:48,200
Speaker 1: a billboard on sunset when you're trying to find thirteen

832
00:47:48,239 --> 00:47:53,040
Speaker 1: thousand people and a ten million population. You don't actually

833
00:47:53,080 --> 00:47:55,680
Speaker 1: want to shoot a shotgun. You wanna you want to.

834
00:47:55,719 --> 00:47:57,360
Speaker 1: You want to be very targeted. You want to find

835
00:47:57,600 --> 00:48:00,520
Speaker 1: those fans that went before, fans look like they want

836
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:05,040
Speaker 1: to go um or existing fans. So more digital we span,

837
00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:08,600
Speaker 1: the more target and we spend, the more efficient it is. Okay,

838
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:11,280
Speaker 1: you mentioned the scalpers, you mentioned the on sale time,

839
00:48:11,320 --> 00:48:15,160
Speaker 1: the bots, etcetera. Hey, what is the status of that?

840
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:19,520
Speaker 1: And be will they pretty much buy anything or only

841
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:22,960
Speaker 1: the hot tours? Uh? Well, let me let me just

842
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:24,840
Speaker 1: after one. Let me just say one thing before we

843
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 1: jump to it. You know, one of the things we

844
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:28,920
Speaker 1: see in conscious though, I would say to you is

845
00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:33,400
Speaker 1: I don't think we have an awareness program problem. Most

846
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,279
Speaker 1: of the time the artist, uh that And as much

847
00:48:37,320 --> 00:48:40,640
Speaker 1: as people think that's an awareness problem, you only go

848
00:48:40,719 --> 00:48:42,640
Speaker 1: to one or two shows a year. I've said this before.

849
00:48:42,640 --> 00:48:44,759
Speaker 1: I'm gonna forget you know, Yes, if you're nineteen to

850
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:46,640
Speaker 1: twenty four, you're gonna go to six or seven. But

851
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:49,680
Speaker 1: generally this is not a This isn't like you're in

852
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:52,440
Speaker 1: the supermarket and you see something at the check oudisle

853
00:48:52,480 --> 00:48:55,200
Speaker 1: and you buy it. Going to show is a committed game.

854
00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:57,600
Speaker 1: You have to find four other people that even like

855
00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:00,480
Speaker 1: the band. You've got to commit in ahead, got to

856
00:49:00,520 --> 00:49:03,520
Speaker 1: find a babysitter, you gotta go. Let's it's a many

857
00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:07,359
Speaker 1: travel experience. So going to show is that we we've

858
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:09,560
Speaker 1: done our research is about a two week two week

859
00:49:09,640 --> 00:49:13,200
Speaker 1: process before you buy the ticket. So it's a committed game.

860
00:49:13,280 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 1: So it's not as if you're you're you know, you

861
00:49:15,760 --> 00:49:18,720
Speaker 1: just found out about it and uh and I decided

862
00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 1: to go. I say that in that most of our

863
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:23,520
Speaker 1: research will tell you the reason I don't go isn't

864
00:49:23,560 --> 00:49:26,359
Speaker 1: because I didn't know about the show. Most of the time,

865
00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:29,600
Speaker 1: it's probably gonna be about pricing. So I always remind

866
00:49:29,640 --> 00:49:31,319
Speaker 1: my team we don't have an awareness problem. We have

867
00:49:31,320 --> 00:49:34,240
Speaker 1: a pricing problem. So I may know about the show,

868
00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:36,680
Speaker 1: but you know what, do I want to go again?

869
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:39,880
Speaker 1: I've been twice, I've seen the band. The minute we

870
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:43,560
Speaker 1: send them a price offer, we see big, big action.

871
00:49:44,040 --> 00:49:47,680
Speaker 1: And that's typical of you know, travel hotels. Any of

872
00:49:47,719 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 1: these kind of businesses where you know it's a depreciating asset.

873
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:55,120
Speaker 1: Generally you can motivate people by price. So you see

874
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:58,040
Speaker 1: a lot of that happening, or you'll that's best. The

875
00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:01,360
Speaker 1: best way to move a ticket probably is because we

876
00:50:01,360 --> 00:50:06,120
Speaker 1: were overpriced it, um and um, and that's that's usually

877
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:08,440
Speaker 1: the best way to kind of kick ticket sales versus

878
00:50:08,719 --> 00:50:13,080
Speaker 1: pounding some more advertising on a on an Instagram ad

879
00:50:13,320 --> 00:50:16,040
Speaker 1: um not so. So that's just a side note. Is

880
00:50:16,120 --> 00:50:18,560
Speaker 1: it's not only just do I know about the tour,

881
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:21,600
Speaker 1: but can I afford to go to the tour this time?

882
00:50:21,640 --> 00:50:24,399
Speaker 1: Maybe you know there's some things are price resistant, but

883
00:50:24,960 --> 00:50:28,319
Speaker 1: um um. Sometimes that that tends to be our best

884
00:50:28,440 --> 00:50:35,239
Speaker 1: lever is promotion. Um so so scalping you you you uh,

885
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:38,200
Speaker 1: you know it's ironic, right we we are the only

886
00:50:38,280 --> 00:50:41,520
Speaker 1: product in the world it's worth worth more of the

887
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:46,360
Speaker 1: second it's sold. That's that kind of goes against business sense. Um.

888
00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:49,560
Speaker 1: Maybe sneakers are becoming that now, but generally the way

889
00:50:49,600 --> 00:50:54,560
Speaker 1: business works as you try to match market pricing to supply. Right,

890
00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:57,000
Speaker 1: if you and I owned a company and the and

891
00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:59,279
Speaker 1: we found out that it's sold out every second that

892
00:50:59,280 --> 00:51:01,160
Speaker 1: we put it on see we'd probably say we should

893
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:05,080
Speaker 1: increase the price UM. And that's how the traditional businesses

894
00:51:05,080 --> 00:51:09,239
Speaker 1: all work. They find that price resistance sweet spot where

895
00:51:09,280 --> 00:51:12,759
Speaker 1: there's enough demand UM to meet the need, but it's

896
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:17,319
Speaker 1: price properly. So we're in this tough industry where the

897
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:21,200
Speaker 1: artist is an incredible brand manager, play him long, and

898
00:51:21,440 --> 00:51:25,280
Speaker 1: he smartly doesn't want to just take that one show

899
00:51:25,360 --> 00:51:28,480
Speaker 1: and price it to perfection. He wants to price it

900
00:51:28,520 --> 00:51:31,120
Speaker 1: to what he thinks is affordable and right for the fan,

901
00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:35,160
Speaker 1: UM for the long term. So it does create though,

902
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:38,840
Speaker 1: a big challenge because anytime you have an eight to

903
00:51:38,960 --> 00:51:42,960
Speaker 1: ten billion dollar industry called secondary UM, it's gonna be

904
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:45,680
Speaker 1: get it's gonna get very professionalized. It's a real business

905
00:51:45,880 --> 00:51:49,919
Speaker 1: and it's legal in America UM and endorsed, so it's

906
00:51:49,960 --> 00:51:52,920
Speaker 1: not it's not the hideaway business anymore. It's not a

907
00:51:52,960 --> 00:51:55,360
Speaker 1: bad business. It's a real business. It's called you know,

908
00:51:55,480 --> 00:52:00,239
Speaker 1: reselling tickets and it's been legitimized and UM, so it's

909
00:52:00,239 --> 00:52:04,279
Speaker 1: it's professionalized and it's real as the reality. UM. Some

910
00:52:04,360 --> 00:52:07,319
Speaker 1: countries around the world have you know, put caps on

911
00:52:07,360 --> 00:52:09,040
Speaker 1: it and you can only resell a ticket for ten

912
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:13,120
Speaker 1: percent and fifteen and they've reacted differently, and I kind

913
00:52:13,120 --> 00:52:15,319
Speaker 1: of like some of that thinking. But the real in

914
00:52:15,360 --> 00:52:20,760
Speaker 1: America is the sports business legitimized scalping long before the

915
00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:25,120
Speaker 1: before US meaning the music business, So it's professionalized. The NFL,

916
00:52:25,239 --> 00:52:29,080
Speaker 1: the NBA, the NHL. Every team has its own exchange.

917
00:52:29,640 --> 00:52:31,600
Speaker 1: He saw the Dodgers a couple of years ago did

918
00:52:31,600 --> 00:52:35,160
Speaker 1: an RFP for their secondary tickets, got like seventy six million.

919
00:52:35,800 --> 00:52:38,480
Speaker 1: So the biggest question I always get from artists is

920
00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:40,799
Speaker 1: why are all my tickets on the secondary? Well, the

921
00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:43,840
Speaker 1: reality is that venue you're playing in probably has a

922
00:52:43,880 --> 00:52:48,319
Speaker 1: sports team and probably has a secondary deal. And you know,

923
00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:51,080
Speaker 1: most sports teams don't sell out on a Monday night.

924
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:55,080
Speaker 1: For every hot hockey team or basketball or baseball. You

925
00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:57,480
Speaker 1: if you owned a team, you probably got some suits

926
00:52:57,520 --> 00:52:59,560
Speaker 1: and a bunch of Tuesday nights not selling out. So

927
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,799
Speaker 1: you've done a secondary deal with somebody, and as part

928
00:53:02,840 --> 00:53:05,040
Speaker 1: of that deal, you've probably given them a suite or

929
00:53:05,160 --> 00:53:08,360
Speaker 1: access to um good seats when the concerts come to

930
00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:11,959
Speaker 1: that venue too. Um so we're already starting every show

931
00:53:12,080 --> 00:53:15,880
Speaker 1: is starting with probably season tickets or some level tickets

932
00:53:16,320 --> 00:53:20,560
Speaker 1: sold or packaged in a sports secondary deal in that venue.

933
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:23,520
Speaker 1: So you've you've started already with you know, the the

934
00:53:23,640 --> 00:53:26,480
Speaker 1: artist probably has or some of those seats are already

935
00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:31,040
Speaker 1: been been bought up or or purchased UM. And they're

936
00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:35,279
Speaker 1: they're incredible price um price managers. They know how to

937
00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:38,480
Speaker 1: buy a lot of inventory. They lose on some and

938
00:53:38,520 --> 00:53:40,759
Speaker 1: make make on the others, and are very good at

939
00:53:41,120 --> 00:53:44,160
Speaker 1: at figuring out the whole macro version of what to

940
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:47,680
Speaker 1: buy from Saturday night basketball to baseball to concert seats.

941
00:53:47,719 --> 00:53:52,040
Speaker 1: So very professionalized, very software driven, data driven. A lot

942
00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:54,760
Speaker 1: of these companies. So this is this is a real business.

943
00:53:54,840 --> 00:53:57,400
Speaker 1: And I only say that because you know, sometimes in

944
00:53:57,440 --> 00:53:59,319
Speaker 1: the space we get a lot of a lot of

945
00:53:59,400 --> 00:54:01,479
Speaker 1: a lot of talk about it and and and until

946
00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 1: we recognize it's a real legitimate industry StubHub see geek ve.

947
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:10,960
Speaker 1: These are professional companies, public companies now UM. The reselling

948
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:13,400
Speaker 1: of a ticket has been a you know, into unless

949
00:54:13,440 --> 00:54:15,839
Speaker 1: someone wants to wake up and do some legislation or

950
00:54:16,040 --> 00:54:20,040
Speaker 1: or try to do something different. It's a legitimate business UM,

951
00:54:20,080 --> 00:54:22,719
Speaker 1: and it's part of the system. I think I try

952
00:54:22,760 --> 00:54:24,759
Speaker 1: to convince artists every now and then that it's not

953
00:54:24,800 --> 00:54:27,400
Speaker 1: the boogeyman, because it's real and it does live. It

954
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:30,520
Speaker 1: is existence, so we should think about it now. If

955
00:54:30,520 --> 00:54:32,360
Speaker 1: you want to solve it, the best way to do

956
00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:35,040
Speaker 1: is to price your product differently. But if you don't

957
00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:38,160
Speaker 1: price your product differently, you're probably going to be um

958
00:54:38,200 --> 00:54:40,800
Speaker 1: at some point. There's no way around it. The secondary

959
00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:45,200
Speaker 1: market will exist. Okay, but let's talk about the on

960
00:54:45,400 --> 00:54:49,000
Speaker 1: sale availability. Uh, no one knows. You might know the

961
00:54:49,040 --> 00:54:53,440
Speaker 1: exact numbers of tickets that go to spot you are

962
00:54:53,520 --> 00:54:56,840
Speaker 1: acquired via box and go to scalpers as opposed to

963
00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:01,400
Speaker 1: regular customers. Forget the reselling of that ticket. What percentage

964
00:55:01,400 --> 00:55:05,719
Speaker 1: on a sellout show end up in the hands of

965
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:11,760
Speaker 1: the secondary market essentially from the on sale date. Well, again,

966
00:55:11,800 --> 00:55:15,480
Speaker 1: I don't want to paint one picture because again you know,

967
00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:19,200
Speaker 1: shows aren't selling out and don't have a hot on sale.

968
00:55:19,480 --> 00:55:21,640
Speaker 1: So I don't want to paint one number and say, oh,

969
00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:24,560
Speaker 1: you know, every concert goes, but you are, you know,

970
00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:27,960
Speaker 1: on the ones that get the press, the the bts

971
00:55:28,080 --> 00:55:30,360
Speaker 1: is of the world, the ones where the where the

972
00:55:30,400 --> 00:55:32,759
Speaker 1: family members trying to buy that ticket for their their

973
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:35,960
Speaker 1: their their daughter or son. The hot ticket you're gonna,

974
00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:39,080
Speaker 1: you know, we're gonna. I looked at a number, you know,

975
00:55:39,120 --> 00:55:42,520
Speaker 1: we've we've stopped over thirty billion bots over the last while,

976
00:55:42,640 --> 00:55:47,320
Speaker 1: I mean Saturday morning on sale bots trying to steal

977
00:55:47,360 --> 00:55:51,640
Speaker 1: tickets or grab tickets UM is a is the biggest

978
00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:54,440
Speaker 1: challenge in our space. So when you hit a hot

979
00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:58,200
Speaker 1: on sale UM on a marketplace on a Saturday morning,

980
00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:00,719
Speaker 1: you know you're you're gonna get a high percentage of

981
00:56:00,719 --> 00:56:05,480
Speaker 1: those tickets are going to be acquired by bots slash

982
00:56:05,520 --> 00:56:09,680
Speaker 1: scalpers at ten ten between ten and ten oh five, right,

983
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:14,320
Speaker 1: we're always living that. By ten oh five, somebody's mad

984
00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:16,799
Speaker 1: that they think Ticketmaster must have given tickets to the

985
00:56:16,840 --> 00:56:20,520
Speaker 1: scalper because there's ten pages of bots of us pages

986
00:56:20,560 --> 00:56:24,280
Speaker 1: on Google saying they've got tickets available. But they're they're

987
00:56:24,280 --> 00:56:26,879
Speaker 1: fast and they can eat up ticket inventory very very

988
00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:30,640
Speaker 1: fast with the computerized bots. So it's a big problem

989
00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:34,920
Speaker 1: ten o'clock or on sales in general being being scooped

990
00:56:35,000 --> 00:56:38,080
Speaker 1: up by by bots. Um is a big part of

991
00:56:38,080 --> 00:56:40,800
Speaker 1: the what makes the experience of ten buying a ticket

992
00:56:41,320 --> 00:56:44,120
Speaker 1: uh not great for a fan. They're they're confused on

993
00:56:44,360 --> 00:56:46,040
Speaker 1: why it's sold up in a minute, and why there's

994
00:56:46,440 --> 00:56:50,480
Speaker 1: pages of self helpers with tickets available, and what are

995
00:56:50,520 --> 00:56:55,160
Speaker 1: the strategies at your company to combat that. Well, we're

996
00:56:55,360 --> 00:56:59,160
Speaker 1: you know, as I remind people, Ticketmaster would spend the

997
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:01,560
Speaker 1: most of any buddy. There's there's were brought the only

998
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:04,040
Speaker 1: one that's spending any money, right, Yeah, there's no one

999
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:06,520
Speaker 1: else is waking up trying to stop a secondary buy

1000
00:57:06,600 --> 00:57:10,040
Speaker 1: on a ten o'clock Um so, so Ticketmaster has you know,

1001
00:57:10,160 --> 00:57:12,440
Speaker 1: huge security department. We're gonna spend tens and tens of

1002
00:57:12,480 --> 00:57:15,640
Speaker 1: millions a year on software and bots and trying to

1003
00:57:15,680 --> 00:57:18,320
Speaker 1: find bad actors. And is that Bob Luffett's trying to

1004
00:57:18,320 --> 00:57:20,720
Speaker 1: buy a ticket or is it an I P? But

1005
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:22,440
Speaker 1: you know this is it's an arms race. These are

1006
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:26,240
Speaker 1: professional businesses. This isn't like, you know, an easy I

1007
00:57:26,360 --> 00:57:29,080
Speaker 1: P to trace and stop it. So we do our

1008
00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:32,040
Speaker 1: best to try to deliver an on sale that a

1009
00:57:32,080 --> 00:57:34,000
Speaker 1: fan has a shot at buying a ticket at the

1010
00:57:34,040 --> 00:57:37,760
Speaker 1: regular price. But the reality is, you know, the business,

1011
00:57:37,760 --> 00:57:40,320
Speaker 1: that the business. There's no one else out there spending

1012
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:44,200
Speaker 1: a dollar trying to stop a bought at ten o'clock. StubHub,

1013
00:57:44,280 --> 00:57:48,200
Speaker 1: seek geek Um, access tickets, the sports. I mean, there's

1014
00:57:48,240 --> 00:57:50,800
Speaker 1: no one else spending a dollar trying to stop an

1015
00:57:50,800 --> 00:57:54,200
Speaker 1: on sale Um, so we're we are as big as

1016
00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:58,040
Speaker 1: Ticketmaster is. It's still in a ten billion dollar arms race.

1017
00:57:58,080 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 1: It's a tough business to be able to develop any

1018
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:05,960
Speaker 1: any stoppage against ten o'clock on sale at that level,

1019
00:58:06,600 --> 00:58:09,760
Speaker 1: when when there's that much money involved. Okay, let's just

1020
00:58:09,800 --> 00:58:13,000
Speaker 1: look at the take the long view. As you mentioned earlier.

1021
00:58:13,240 --> 00:58:18,000
Speaker 1: I remember forty years ago cable TV, if you wanted

1022
00:58:18,040 --> 00:58:21,120
Speaker 1: to get a channel for free, you could go to

1023
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:24,360
Speaker 1: the actual cable. They put these filters on. You remove

1024
00:58:24,440 --> 00:58:28,160
Speaker 1: the filter, you got the page channel for free. Then

1025
00:58:28,320 --> 00:58:33,800
Speaker 1: they digitized everything. There was no theft. Needless to say,

1026
00:58:34,240 --> 00:58:38,720
Speaker 1: you know, we're going to move from hard tickets two

1027
00:58:38,720 --> 00:58:44,080
Speaker 1: tickets on the device in this product progress, is there

1028
00:58:44,120 --> 00:58:48,040
Speaker 1: a way that's actually hurt the box and hurt the scalpers.

1029
00:58:49,840 --> 00:58:53,240
Speaker 1: You know, we're we're digitizing our ticket the last couple

1030
00:58:53,240 --> 00:58:55,720
Speaker 1: of years, and you're right, when you move from a

1031
00:58:55,760 --> 00:59:00,360
Speaker 1: PDF to a digital ticket, you in theory can could

1032
00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:07,040
Speaker 1: imply some control. Um, But in America, UM, you know,

1033
00:59:07,080 --> 00:59:10,000
Speaker 1: there's no political will to put any rules in place

1034
00:59:10,040 --> 00:59:15,840
Speaker 1: to limit um those those those uh, those those controls.

1035
00:59:16,480 --> 00:59:20,240
Speaker 1: So we have a digital ticket, we could in theory

1036
00:59:20,360 --> 00:59:23,560
Speaker 1: say that you bought a ticket to the Jimmy Buffett Show,

1037
00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:26,440
Speaker 1: you can't resell it. You can only resell it with

1038
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:31,480
Speaker 1: a ten percent uplift. UM. But if we try to

1039
00:59:31,560 --> 00:59:36,200
Speaker 1: impose any kind of controls on that, you know, scalpers

1040
00:59:36,200 --> 00:59:38,320
Speaker 1: and others are pretty good at lobbyists and getting someone

1041
00:59:38,360 --> 00:59:41,480
Speaker 1: cranked up that there's a free marketplace and who owns

1042
00:59:41,520 --> 00:59:43,040
Speaker 1: that ticket and I should be able to do whatever

1043
00:59:43,080 --> 00:59:46,640
Speaker 1: I want with that ticket and controls by anyone are allowed.

1044
00:59:47,080 --> 00:59:51,840
Speaker 1: So we don't see the marketplace. We're looking to try

1045
00:59:51,880 --> 00:59:55,080
Speaker 1: to control the sale of the ticket. That's our challenge.

1046
00:59:55,160 --> 00:59:57,560
Speaker 1: We we believe that there could be controls. You could

1047
00:59:57,560 --> 01:00:01,120
Speaker 1: do it tomorrow, um, but there isn't there. There isn't

1048
01:00:01,240 --> 01:00:05,080
Speaker 1: the political appetite both in sports most artists want to

1049
01:00:05,080 --> 01:00:08,640
Speaker 1: clean on sale at ten o'clock is a reality. UM.

1050
01:00:08,680 --> 01:00:11,160
Speaker 1: So we don't see We don't see it as a

1051
01:00:11,200 --> 01:00:13,480
Speaker 1: way to you know, uh, we don't see it as

1052
01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:16,320
Speaker 1: something that will come into effect and make a difference.

1053
01:00:16,680 --> 01:00:20,720
Speaker 1: We think that the market um StubHub and others have

1054
01:00:20,720 --> 01:00:24,400
Speaker 1: have done a good job of convincing everyone in Congress

1055
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:27,760
Speaker 1: and I otherwise that a ticket should be freely traded.

1056
01:00:27,800 --> 01:00:30,840
Speaker 1: I mean, you look you got Bill Pascal. Look at

1057
01:00:30,840 --> 01:00:34,560
Speaker 1: his boss act. He's he actually wants the irony is

1058
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:38,040
Speaker 1: he's doing. His boss act is about making sure that

1059
01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:42,400
Speaker 1: the scalper has free controlled access to every ticket that I,

1060
01:00:42,600 --> 01:00:44,920
Speaker 1: Ticketmaster and others when you put a ticket on sales

1061
01:00:44,920 --> 01:00:48,800
Speaker 1: should make our platform freely UM available that if you

1062
01:00:48,840 --> 01:00:50,960
Speaker 1: buy it on any secondary site, that I can walk

1063
01:00:50,960 --> 01:00:54,040
Speaker 1: in the building and have free access and free free

1064
01:00:54,040 --> 01:00:57,400
Speaker 1: distribution and control, so that that shows you where the

1065
01:00:57,400 --> 01:01:00,720
Speaker 1: where the marketplace is um. So we we believe that

1066
01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:03,760
Speaker 1: listening to digital tickets good for Live Nation and ticket

1067
01:01:03,760 --> 01:01:07,439
Speaker 1: Master from a from a business perspective, because going back

1068
01:01:07,440 --> 01:01:10,920
Speaker 1: to my earlier story about sponsorship, the more I know

1069
01:01:10,920 --> 01:01:13,720
Speaker 1: who Bob Luffitz is that walked in the building, that's

1070
01:01:13,720 --> 01:01:15,800
Speaker 1: a big advantage to me just from doing a better

1071
01:01:15,880 --> 01:01:18,880
Speaker 1: job in my marketing talking to you next time, up

1072
01:01:18,920 --> 01:01:22,160
Speaker 1: selling you. So for me, it's just good to turn

1073
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:25,040
Speaker 1: a PDF into a piece of data, and the better

1074
01:01:25,080 --> 01:01:28,000
Speaker 1: I can use that data to sell more tickets, up

1075
01:01:28,040 --> 01:01:30,919
Speaker 1: sell and have a better relationship with the customer. It's

1076
01:01:30,920 --> 01:01:33,560
Speaker 1: good for us turning those hundred million people to walk

1077
01:01:33,600 --> 01:01:37,320
Speaker 1: in the door from a PDF into it actual segment

1078
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:40,800
Speaker 1: of digital human file is much better for our business.

1079
01:01:41,000 --> 01:01:44,560
Speaker 1: I don't think though, we're going to be successful imposing

1080
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:48,560
Speaker 1: restrictions on the on the business and the distribution of

1081
01:01:48,600 --> 01:01:52,120
Speaker 1: that ticket or the transfer ability of that ticket. I

1082
01:01:52,120 --> 01:01:55,200
Speaker 1: don't think there's the political will to limit any of it.

1083
01:01:55,880 --> 01:01:58,720
Speaker 1: Part of what we got into um with some of

1084
01:01:58,760 --> 01:02:00,960
Speaker 1: these centators was just you know, our ticket and is

1085
01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:04,600
Speaker 1: it really transferable? And a lot of the them of

1086
01:02:04,640 --> 01:02:07,320
Speaker 1: the stuff you you read about was about was were

1087
01:02:07,320 --> 01:02:09,840
Speaker 1: we going to limit the distribution of our ticket? Where

1088
01:02:09,840 --> 01:02:12,520
Speaker 1: we're gonna make you buy a ticket a ticket Master

1089
01:02:13,320 --> 01:02:15,520
Speaker 1: as a digital ticket and the only way you could

1090
01:02:15,520 --> 01:02:19,439
Speaker 1: resell it was at the Ticketmaster resale um. And that's

1091
01:02:19,600 --> 01:02:22,160
Speaker 1: that was kind of the big basis of a closed

1092
01:02:22,200 --> 01:02:26,880
Speaker 1: platform that the scalpers and others had excited some of

1093
01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:30,000
Speaker 1: the Congress about. We had never planned on doing that.

1094
01:02:30,080 --> 01:02:33,320
Speaker 1: We don't believe in a closed platform that market is

1095
01:02:33,360 --> 01:02:36,280
Speaker 1: long sled. We're we're we're I've got an open platform

1096
01:02:36,320 --> 01:02:39,840
Speaker 1: to date UM. But that shows you that that's kind

1097
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:43,560
Speaker 1: of the the the the the intent of the lobbyists

1098
01:02:43,600 --> 01:02:46,800
Speaker 1: and what their concerns were that that anyone would imply

1099
01:02:46,920 --> 01:02:52,000
Speaker 1: any kind of control or rules on the ticket. Prior

1100
01:02:52,080 --> 01:02:54,720
Speaker 1: to the shutdown, there was a lot of noise your

1101
01:02:54,760 --> 01:02:58,800
Speaker 1: company about the verified m what's the status of that

1102
01:02:58,920 --> 01:03:05,120
Speaker 1: now and was it effective? You know? I think we

1103
01:03:06,440 --> 01:03:09,520
Speaker 1: I think prior you know. The good news is the

1104
01:03:09,520 --> 01:03:12,600
Speaker 1: shutdown gave us a lot of time to rethink what

1105
01:03:12,800 --> 01:03:15,160
Speaker 1: is it we want to get done uh in our

1106
01:03:15,200 --> 01:03:19,200
Speaker 1: ticketing strategy. Um And I think we. I think we

1107
01:03:19,200 --> 01:03:22,400
Speaker 1: were fighting the fight with some band aids that probably

1108
01:03:22,400 --> 01:03:27,120
Speaker 1: weren't effective enough overall to make a difference. Um. So,

1109
01:03:27,160 --> 01:03:30,200
Speaker 1: I think we've learned that verified fan is another tool

1110
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:32,800
Speaker 1: in the toolbox. Is it a good idea? Yes, it's

1111
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:34,440
Speaker 1: a great idea, Bob that if I'm going to go

1112
01:03:34,480 --> 01:03:37,920
Speaker 1: on sale, that I can get verified fans registered in advance,

1113
01:03:38,480 --> 01:03:40,480
Speaker 1: so I at least have a shot on the on

1114
01:03:40,600 --> 01:03:43,320
Speaker 1: sale of saying Bob Left is registered and now we

1115
01:03:43,360 --> 01:03:45,440
Speaker 1: can sell you a ticket on Friday. It's a great

1116
01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:48,280
Speaker 1: system to take a little bit of load off the

1117
01:03:48,360 --> 01:03:51,400
Speaker 1: on sale and distribute it through the week prior to

1118
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:54,880
Speaker 1: So it's a good tool. Some bands, as you know,

1119
01:03:54,960 --> 01:03:57,200
Speaker 1: are very obsessed with I want to do everything I

1120
01:03:57,240 --> 01:04:00,520
Speaker 1: can to make sure the fan buys my ticket and

1121
01:04:00,560 --> 01:04:02,960
Speaker 1: no one else does and at Ticketmaster, we gotta have

1122
01:04:03,000 --> 01:04:07,360
Speaker 1: those tools and um and we'll have them. I would

1123
01:04:07,360 --> 01:04:10,280
Speaker 1: just say I think we're probably less obsessed with trying

1124
01:04:10,320 --> 01:04:13,960
Speaker 1: to roll out verified fan as we are at rolling

1125
01:04:13,960 --> 01:04:17,280
Speaker 1: out digital ticketing, which is more important overall, and that

1126
01:04:17,400 --> 01:04:20,479
Speaker 1: with the more we get the ticket digitized, the better

1127
01:04:20,520 --> 01:04:22,760
Speaker 1: the experiences for everybody, and the better it is for

1128
01:04:22,800 --> 01:04:32,480
Speaker 1: our overall business. Okay, let's talk about pricing. Pricing is

1129
01:04:32,600 --> 01:04:35,000
Speaker 1: very different than it used to be used to. If

1130
01:04:35,000 --> 01:04:37,880
Speaker 1: you had an expensive just you know, use round numbers.

1131
01:04:38,160 --> 01:04:41,240
Speaker 1: If the best seats were two hundred dollars, the seats

1132
01:04:41,240 --> 01:04:44,520
Speaker 1: and the rafters were a hundred, what do we know

1133
01:04:45,000 --> 01:04:47,480
Speaker 1: the seats and the raffers have. Rafters have gone down

1134
01:04:47,480 --> 01:04:50,320
Speaker 1: to fifty in many cases, and the seats up front

1135
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:53,240
Speaker 1: of gone to five hundred with what is conventionally known

1136
01:04:53,280 --> 01:04:56,040
Speaker 1: as platinum. So what is the the You know, this

1137
01:04:56,160 --> 01:04:59,200
Speaker 1: is always a game other than the stones have their

1138
01:04:59,200 --> 01:05:03,360
Speaker 1: own style. Uh, it's always a game of pricing. What

1139
01:05:03,560 --> 01:05:05,960
Speaker 1: is you now? And ticket Master and Live Nation are

1140
01:05:05,960 --> 01:05:08,040
Speaker 1: the experts because they see this every day. Whereas an

1141
01:05:08,040 --> 01:05:10,800
Speaker 1: act only goes on tour maybe once every other year.

1142
01:05:11,600 --> 01:05:16,800
Speaker 1: What do you tell acts in terms of pricing these days, Well,

1143
01:05:16,960 --> 01:05:19,080
Speaker 1: two things, going back to our first point. You know

1144
01:05:19,080 --> 01:05:24,480
Speaker 1: there's still billions of dollars in secondary and business out there,

1145
01:05:24,480 --> 01:05:26,400
Speaker 1: so we know we're not pricing the house right, so

1146
01:05:26,440 --> 01:05:29,480
Speaker 1: we have opportunity to at least gap to get some

1147
01:05:29,560 --> 01:05:33,480
Speaker 1: of that front of the house economics for the artist.

1148
01:05:34,080 --> 01:05:37,440
Speaker 1: And again going back to what we said, the shows

1149
01:05:37,560 --> 01:05:40,240
Speaker 1: I'm dealing with in life are not selling out, so

1150
01:05:40,440 --> 01:05:42,640
Speaker 1: I don't ever have a problem selling the front part

1151
01:05:42,640 --> 01:05:44,640
Speaker 1: of the house. I do have a problem selling the

1152
01:05:44,640 --> 01:05:47,160
Speaker 1: back part. Go to my other point on why is

1153
01:05:47,200 --> 01:05:51,360
Speaker 1: the problem pricing not awareness, So I'm always going to

1154
01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:55,320
Speaker 1: convince an artist to redistribute the pricing and how low

1155
01:05:55,400 --> 01:05:57,720
Speaker 1: can we get the back end of the house and

1156
01:05:57,800 --> 01:05:59,760
Speaker 1: probably subsidize the back end of the house on the

1157
01:05:59,760 --> 01:06:01,920
Speaker 1: front up front of the house. So if we can

1158
01:06:01,920 --> 01:06:04,720
Speaker 1: get that perfect sell out, we want to make sure

1159
01:06:04,760 --> 01:06:07,800
Speaker 1: that we have you know, affordable seats in the back

1160
01:06:07,920 --> 01:06:10,880
Speaker 1: last row that's sell out. And if you've got to

1161
01:06:10,920 --> 01:06:13,960
Speaker 1: take twenty dollars off the back row ticket, I'd rather

1162
01:06:14,040 --> 01:06:15,640
Speaker 1: add it to the front row to still get the

1163
01:06:15,680 --> 01:06:19,680
Speaker 1: same gross but but price it properly um with the

1164
01:06:19,720 --> 01:06:23,000
Speaker 1: back end. So artists, you know, listen, We're we were

1165
01:06:23,040 --> 01:06:25,720
Speaker 1: a business that was very very rudimentary for years. As

1166
01:06:25,760 --> 01:06:28,280
Speaker 1: you know, we had three scalings, was you know, a

1167
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:32,480
Speaker 1: hundred seventy nine and forty nine and forty dates were

1168
01:06:32,480 --> 01:06:34,360
Speaker 1: the same whether it was a Friday in New York

1169
01:06:34,480 --> 01:06:37,920
Speaker 1: or Tuesday in Pittsburgh. So you know, I would say

1170
01:06:38,160 --> 01:06:40,880
Speaker 1: in general, we've We've been talking to artists for the

1171
01:06:40,960 --> 01:06:44,240
Speaker 1: last five years just about nobody prices their product that

1172
01:06:44,280 --> 01:06:46,960
Speaker 1: way anymore. You know, you got a price to the market.

1173
01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:49,640
Speaker 1: You know that the aisle seat is worth more than

1174
01:06:49,680 --> 01:06:52,680
Speaker 1: the middle seat, Friday night's worth more than Monday night.

1175
01:06:53,280 --> 01:06:55,720
Speaker 1: New York is going to be more expensive than Pittsburgh.

1176
01:06:56,000 --> 01:06:58,280
Speaker 1: So I would say that we have, you know, worked

1177
01:06:58,320 --> 01:07:00,720
Speaker 1: hard on a pricing model over all to say what's

1178
01:07:00,720 --> 01:07:03,880
Speaker 1: the best way to price your tour depending on what city,

1179
01:07:03,920 --> 01:07:06,640
Speaker 1: what date. Is it three prices or is there five

1180
01:07:06,760 --> 01:07:10,560
Speaker 1: or six price points that are better for the house? Um?

1181
01:07:10,640 --> 01:07:13,680
Speaker 1: So yeah, I I every year the artists are getting better,

1182
01:07:14,520 --> 01:07:17,520
Speaker 1: We're getting better at price in the house to sell

1183
01:07:17,560 --> 01:07:21,360
Speaker 1: it out, maximize the gross take a little bit of

1184
01:07:21,360 --> 01:07:24,640
Speaker 1: that secondary money off the table that that they weren't

1185
01:07:24,640 --> 01:07:27,760
Speaker 1: participating in, but still find that fine line, whether it's

1186
01:07:27,760 --> 01:07:31,320
Speaker 1: still accessible enough that it sells through. And that's been

1187
01:07:31,360 --> 01:07:33,520
Speaker 1: the kind of the science and art over the last

1188
01:07:33,560 --> 01:07:35,640
Speaker 1: five years and a lot of why the grosses have

1189
01:07:35,720 --> 01:07:38,440
Speaker 1: continually go up and grossers will go up for the

1190
01:07:38,480 --> 01:07:42,160
Speaker 1: next you know, five six years, because we're still dramatically

1191
01:07:42,240 --> 01:07:46,240
Speaker 1: under priced across the board. Now, speaking of that, what

1192
01:07:46,360 --> 01:07:49,440
Speaker 1: we know is the hardcore fans will pay the most,

1193
01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:52,720
Speaker 1: whether it be a platinum ticket or whether it be

1194
01:07:52,760 --> 01:07:56,320
Speaker 1: a ticket that's purchased on a secondary market. They'll pay

1195
01:07:56,360 --> 01:07:58,560
Speaker 1: four hundred and fifty dollars to sit in the first

1196
01:07:58,560 --> 01:08:03,280
Speaker 1: fifteen rows and are thrilled. Okay, yes, some New York

1197
01:08:03,360 --> 01:08:05,880
Speaker 1: City Los Angeles shows you have fat cats who just

1198
01:08:05,920 --> 01:08:08,360
Speaker 1: want to be there, But generally speaking, that is not

1199
01:08:08,440 --> 01:08:13,080
Speaker 1: the case in every market. So these are high demand items.

1200
01:08:13,400 --> 01:08:16,360
Speaker 1: Will we ever get to the point where acts will

1201
01:08:16,439 --> 01:08:21,040
Speaker 1: realize that maybe it's just a perception from the seventies

1202
01:08:21,479 --> 01:08:24,519
Speaker 1: and reality, we should price the tickets at what their

1203
01:08:24,640 --> 01:08:30,200
Speaker 1: value truly is. Oh yeah, that that's gonna happen. I

1204
01:08:30,240 --> 01:08:33,320
Speaker 1: think you're gonna see the you know, like you said,

1205
01:08:34,439 --> 01:08:36,439
Speaker 1: we we do a bad job on pr as an

1206
01:08:36,479 --> 01:08:39,840
Speaker 1: industry because it's a very a concert ticket is still

1207
01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:42,919
Speaker 1: very affordable overall, if you go look at average ticket prices,

1208
01:08:43,479 --> 01:08:48,160
Speaker 1: forget the high ones, just average for sports concerts still affordable.

1209
01:08:48,479 --> 01:08:52,639
Speaker 1: And you are right, there is somehow the NBA gets

1210
01:08:52,720 --> 01:08:56,599
Speaker 1: gets to write press releases about the hundred thousand dollar

1211
01:08:56,760 --> 01:09:02,200
Speaker 1: front row as a positive. Um and this business. If

1212
01:09:02,200 --> 01:09:04,840
Speaker 1: Bruce charges more than a hundred and fifty, you know,

1213
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:07,760
Speaker 1: it's it's it's a story. So you're right. I think

1214
01:09:07,760 --> 01:09:11,920
Speaker 1: that slowly, the artist of today, the next generation artist

1215
01:09:12,200 --> 01:09:14,639
Speaker 1: is going to look at the tour and realize that

1216
01:09:14,720 --> 01:09:18,640
Speaker 1: their fans, that they want to sell directly to their fans,

1217
01:09:18,680 --> 01:09:22,320
Speaker 1: that some fans will spend more for that experience, and

1218
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:26,280
Speaker 1: they're better off having that experience and taking that dollar

1219
01:09:26,640 --> 01:09:30,599
Speaker 1: into their growth than someone else. Um and and and

1220
01:09:30,600 --> 01:09:34,280
Speaker 1: and compared to other things, it's still wildly affordable. I mean,

1221
01:09:34,680 --> 01:09:37,880
Speaker 1: I took my boys to Disney World. I mean, geez uh,

1222
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:41,559
Speaker 1: that's not a cheap day. Um So most of the

1223
01:09:41,560 --> 01:09:44,920
Speaker 1: other things that are this valuable in life. You know,

1224
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:48,080
Speaker 1: you don't go to eighty concerts a year, like sports teams.

1225
01:09:48,080 --> 01:09:50,479
Speaker 1: There's you know, that band comes to town maybe what

1226
01:09:50,640 --> 01:09:53,880
Speaker 1: once every three years, to Los Angeles. That's a high

1227
01:09:53,960 --> 01:09:56,760
Speaker 1: demand product. That's an incredible experience. You can see it

1228
01:09:56,840 --> 01:09:59,720
Speaker 1: once every three years. That's gonna be worth a lot

1229
01:10:00,160 --> 01:10:03,040
Speaker 1: more than you know, eighty games a year for a

1230
01:10:03,120 --> 01:10:05,920
Speaker 1: sports team that you can see every year. So yeah,

1231
01:10:05,960 --> 01:10:10,320
Speaker 1: we were still completely underpriced. I think this next generation

1232
01:10:10,320 --> 01:10:12,880
Speaker 1: will will come to reconcile that they don't have to

1233
01:10:12,880 --> 01:10:17,360
Speaker 1: be ashamed of how spectacular that experience on stages. There's

1234
01:10:17,400 --> 01:10:21,360
Speaker 1: spending a fortune these artists on the production. Now you

1235
01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:25,479
Speaker 1: mean fifty forty seventy trucks at stadiums. They're putting these

1236
01:10:25,479 --> 01:10:29,120
Speaker 1: incredible shows on. So um, I think that pricing will

1237
01:10:29,160 --> 01:10:32,519
Speaker 1: start to reflect the demand over time. It's the best

1238
01:10:32,560 --> 01:10:35,880
Speaker 1: way to address the market. Let's talk about the Stones

1239
01:10:35,960 --> 01:10:40,360
Speaker 1: inflex pricing. That's not your company, that's Concerts West. But

1240
01:10:41,439 --> 01:10:45,040
Speaker 1: essentially there's no scalping because they change the price based

1241
01:10:45,040 --> 01:10:47,400
Speaker 1: on demand and conventionally you get a ticket day of

1242
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:52,960
Speaker 1: Is that the future? Is that really only for the Stones? Well,

1243
01:10:53,000 --> 01:10:55,800
Speaker 1: I listen, I do give. I've always given, you know,

1244
01:10:55,840 --> 01:10:58,200
Speaker 1: I think Mixed just a genius business manager. We did this,

1245
01:10:58,760 --> 01:11:02,320
Speaker 1: We did the show at the Hollywood Bowl and I

1246
01:11:02,360 --> 01:11:04,720
Speaker 1: remember it was I don't know, I'm gonna get the

1247
01:11:04,760 --> 01:11:06,639
Speaker 1: exact math wrong, but it might have been a forty

1248
01:11:06,720 --> 01:11:10,040
Speaker 1: year anniversary and he had charged six dollars forty years

1249
01:11:10,040 --> 01:11:12,439
Speaker 1: ago and it was six d this time. And he said,

1250
01:11:12,479 --> 01:11:16,080
Speaker 1: you know, the the sett list hasn't changed, just the price.

1251
01:11:16,439 --> 01:11:19,160
Speaker 1: So I think, Uh, he's done a fabulous job from

1252
01:11:19,240 --> 01:11:21,639
Speaker 1: day one of being about the business and and uh

1253
01:11:21,680 --> 01:11:23,880
Speaker 1: and being that's been accepted as part of his brand.

1254
01:11:23,920 --> 01:11:28,280
Speaker 1: So I think the Stones are incredible success story. Um,

1255
01:11:28,320 --> 01:11:30,200
Speaker 1: but you're right, it's gonna take more artists like that

1256
01:11:30,200 --> 01:11:33,000
Speaker 1: that are gonna say I have a product that should

1257
01:11:33,040 --> 01:11:38,000
Speaker 1: be dynamically priced and should match demand. And we're seeing

1258
01:11:38,040 --> 01:11:40,760
Speaker 1: that from I would say when you talked to new

1259
01:11:41,360 --> 01:11:45,960
Speaker 1: younger managers of today thinking about touring there, they come

1260
01:11:46,000 --> 01:11:48,000
Speaker 1: at it in a in a more fresh way that

1261
01:11:48,040 --> 01:11:50,000
Speaker 1: way on why why am I not going to charge

1262
01:11:50,080 --> 01:11:53,519
Speaker 1: the right price? Why is scuppers? Why wouldn't I price

1263
01:11:53,560 --> 01:11:56,240
Speaker 1: a house differently? So I think there's a there'll be

1264
01:11:56,280 --> 01:12:00,479
Speaker 1: a new generation of pricing that comes up through through

1265
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:04,160
Speaker 1: the next ten years. Okay, let's switch to the fees.

1266
01:12:04,760 --> 01:12:07,200
Speaker 1: You and me both know the inside the history of

1267
01:12:07,240 --> 01:12:10,720
Speaker 1: the fees whatever, but the public really can't get it,

1268
01:12:12,280 --> 01:12:19,360
Speaker 1: can you explain how Ticketmaster doesn't get the entire fee. Yeah,

1269
01:12:19,720 --> 01:12:23,040
Speaker 1: I mean again, the fee was part of the original

1270
01:12:23,680 --> 01:12:29,840
Speaker 1: um price UM that Fred Rosen when he started ticket Master.

1271
01:12:30,400 --> 01:12:35,280
Speaker 1: You know, to have an exclusive ticketing service in your building. UM.

1272
01:12:35,320 --> 01:12:38,439
Speaker 1: You you charged a service fee to execute the business.

1273
01:12:39,000 --> 01:12:41,320
Speaker 1: And you know, it started at one or two dollars.

1274
01:12:41,360 --> 01:12:43,720
Speaker 1: And Fred would tell you the story. Every year when

1275
01:12:43,720 --> 01:12:46,439
Speaker 1: he went to renew that venue, would say, great, just

1276
01:12:46,479 --> 01:12:50,360
Speaker 1: add another dollar, add another dollar, and and it got

1277
01:12:50,400 --> 01:12:53,720
Speaker 1: at it for many years. UM. And it used to

1278
01:12:53,800 --> 01:12:57,519
Speaker 1: be you know, six dollars, seven dollars, eight dollars, and

1279
01:12:57,560 --> 01:13:00,439
Speaker 1: it was split probably fifty fifty back in the day

1280
01:13:00,439 --> 01:13:05,240
Speaker 1: ticket Master in the venue. UM. And then ultimately venues

1281
01:13:05,320 --> 01:13:08,439
Speaker 1: continue to uh to uh kind of gets hooked on

1282
01:13:08,479 --> 01:13:12,280
Speaker 1: the drug of the service fee, and ultimately, you know,

1283
01:13:12,400 --> 01:13:16,559
Speaker 1: today you look at service fees and venues UM, it

1284
01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:19,360
Speaker 1: does becomeing a very important part of P and L

1285
01:13:20,200 --> 01:13:23,920
Speaker 1: UM in that venue, and it's the high margin piece

1286
01:13:23,960 --> 01:13:27,360
Speaker 1: of the business. As a revenue stream UM that you

1287
01:13:27,360 --> 01:13:29,559
Speaker 1: you know, you're you're used to having and part of

1288
01:13:29,560 --> 01:13:33,840
Speaker 1: financing your building and your operations. As talent costs or

1289
01:13:34,240 --> 01:13:38,920
Speaker 1: in sports for sports business athletes or however, their bills

1290
01:13:38,920 --> 01:13:42,760
Speaker 1: have gone up, so it has become a very lucrative

1291
01:13:43,040 --> 01:13:46,360
Speaker 1: piece of business for venues. Now, you're right, in a

1292
01:13:46,720 --> 01:13:52,960
Speaker 1: typical venue, in a sports venue, a sports ticket, the

1293
01:13:53,000 --> 01:13:56,960
Speaker 1: team and the venue are probably getting of the service fee.

1294
01:13:57,439 --> 01:14:00,720
Speaker 1: So if it's a thirty forty dollar service be um,

1295
01:14:00,760 --> 01:14:05,320
Speaker 1: they're gonna get it. In a concert ticket and a

1296
01:14:05,360 --> 01:14:09,800
Speaker 1: typical big arena show, um, ticketmaster's gonna get the same thing.

1297
01:14:09,960 --> 01:14:13,000
Speaker 1: We're gonna get two bucks, three bucks out of that

1298
01:14:13,040 --> 01:14:15,439
Speaker 1: forty or forty five dollar service fee. The rest would

1299
01:14:15,479 --> 01:14:19,400
Speaker 1: go to the venue. UM. So it's you're right. We

1300
01:14:19,520 --> 01:14:23,440
Speaker 1: we have a you know, a challenge where the ticketmaster

1301
01:14:23,600 --> 01:14:27,320
Speaker 1: takes the punch in the head for the no tickets

1302
01:14:27,320 --> 01:14:30,200
Speaker 1: available at ten am and a thirty five dollar service fee,

1303
01:14:30,680 --> 01:14:33,200
Speaker 1: two things we really have no control over. One we're

1304
01:14:33,200 --> 01:14:36,519
Speaker 1: not making thirty five and two week we can't control

1305
01:14:36,560 --> 01:14:39,439
Speaker 1: that the market gets bought up by secondary business because

1306
01:14:39,439 --> 01:14:42,479
Speaker 1: of underpriced industry. So you're right, it's a tough it's

1307
01:14:42,479 --> 01:14:46,720
Speaker 1: a tough pr hit to handle, um and and um,

1308
01:14:46,760 --> 01:14:49,280
Speaker 1: and it's kind of been part of now a historic

1309
01:14:49,360 --> 01:14:53,920
Speaker 1: revenue stream that that that seems to be uh here

1310
01:14:53,960 --> 01:14:57,200
Speaker 1: to stay as as as venues and sports and music

1311
01:14:57,840 --> 01:15:02,519
Speaker 1: costs of risen. So what percentage of ticket Master's ticket

1312
01:15:02,600 --> 01:15:08,040
Speaker 1: sales and or revenue are contracts as opposed to sports

1313
01:15:08,040 --> 01:15:14,960
Speaker 1: another verticals? Um? What would be the off? You know,

1314
01:15:15,160 --> 01:15:25,719
Speaker 1: roughly ticket Master sold about five million tickets last year globally. Um,

1315
01:15:26,040 --> 01:15:32,280
Speaker 1: sports would be sports would be of that business from

1316
01:15:32,280 --> 01:15:37,639
Speaker 1: a sales perspective. Um. So yeah, that's about the split.

1317
01:15:37,680 --> 01:15:39,559
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm gonna we do a ton of season

1318
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:42,760
Speaker 1: tickets involved where we make no fees. Um. So those

1319
01:15:42,800 --> 01:15:45,080
Speaker 1: are kind of called no feed, no tickets. But what

1320
01:15:45,280 --> 01:15:47,479
Speaker 1: sixty or seventy percent of the business would be sports

1321
01:15:47,479 --> 01:15:50,920
Speaker 1: in general? But we make more money on our concert

1322
01:15:50,960 --> 01:15:55,679
Speaker 1: on the concert business than the sports business. Um. Because

1323
01:15:55,720 --> 01:15:58,799
Speaker 1: obviously Live Nation happens to be a ticket a concert

1324
01:15:58,800 --> 01:16:03,160
Speaker 1: provider or concert venue. You where we're uh, we're servicing ourselves,

1325
01:16:04,120 --> 01:16:08,360
Speaker 1: okay forgetting making an exclusive deal with the building. Why

1326
01:16:08,360 --> 01:16:15,200
Speaker 1: should someone use Ticketmaster as opposed to one of its competitors. Well,

1327
01:16:15,240 --> 01:16:18,800
Speaker 1: if you're you know, there's there's there's almost there's two

1328
01:16:18,840 --> 01:16:25,160
Speaker 1: businesses and ticketing. Right, there's the non sports venue and

1329
01:16:25,200 --> 01:16:27,679
Speaker 1: then there's a sports venue. There's let's call it reserve

1330
01:16:27,760 --> 01:16:32,160
Speaker 1: tickets versus single tickets. If you're in the single ticket business,

1331
01:16:32,200 --> 01:16:37,920
Speaker 1: event right business, festival business, UM, that's not a hard

1332
01:16:38,000 --> 01:16:41,760
Speaker 1: business to solve in terms of software. So they all

1333
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:43,439
Speaker 1: do a great job and we do a good job

1334
01:16:43,439 --> 01:16:46,599
Speaker 1: in it. Ticketmaster has done a great job for many

1335
01:16:46,680 --> 01:16:52,839
Speaker 1: years in servicing sports teams. Sports teams are incredibly high demand.

1336
01:16:53,520 --> 01:16:57,120
Speaker 1: So when you're doing UM, when you're servicing the sports

1337
01:16:57,240 --> 01:17:01,840
Speaker 1: NFL team, NBA team, NHL team, you know, we did

1338
01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:05,920
Speaker 1: an audit recently. We'll run over two to three hundred

1339
01:17:06,080 --> 01:17:12,360
Speaker 1: different programs products for all of those teams, reports, UM,

1340
01:17:12,479 --> 01:17:17,479
Speaker 1: transfer ability, season tickets, sports. So that the biggest success

1341
01:17:17,520 --> 01:17:20,280
Speaker 1: the ticket Master has had is if you're going to

1342
01:17:20,360 --> 01:17:22,680
Speaker 1: be if you're if you're a big sports team and

1343
01:17:22,720 --> 01:17:25,439
Speaker 1: you have a season ticket based in a single taste base,

1344
01:17:25,960 --> 01:17:29,400
Speaker 1: you need you need software to service all of that. UH.

1345
01:17:29,479 --> 01:17:33,000
Speaker 1: Ticket Master has two great platforms, Arctics and Hosts, which

1346
01:17:33,000 --> 01:17:35,559
Speaker 1: service your season tickets as well as your single tickets

1347
01:17:36,120 --> 01:17:40,759
Speaker 1: all together, manage all of those transfer those, provide audits

1348
01:17:40,800 --> 01:17:45,799
Speaker 1: for you, sell your tickets for you, cancel them, manage

1349
01:17:45,800 --> 01:17:48,920
Speaker 1: your box office. All of the infrastructure needed to be

1350
01:17:48,960 --> 01:17:54,000
Speaker 1: a great enterprise platform for season and UM single tickets.

1351
01:17:54,439 --> 01:17:57,400
Speaker 1: That's a complex business to manage, and every team has

1352
01:17:58,080 --> 01:18:00,680
Speaker 1: twenty different customized things they on it to do. I

1353
01:18:00,720 --> 01:18:03,120
Speaker 1: wanted to talk to this, I wanted to do this

1354
01:18:03,160 --> 01:18:05,160
Speaker 1: with a sponsor. I wanted to do this with the

1355
01:18:05,200 --> 01:18:07,680
Speaker 1: Hall of Famer. So it's a real it's a real

1356
01:18:07,840 --> 01:18:11,000
Speaker 1: hard model to scale ticketing at the level it is

1357
01:18:11,120 --> 01:18:15,320
Speaker 1: and be absolutely customizable to such level. So that's really

1358
01:18:15,320 --> 01:18:17,840
Speaker 1: where its strength has been. When we launched our own

1359
01:18:17,840 --> 01:18:20,800
Speaker 1: ticketing company, we thought we would be able to do it,

1360
01:18:20,840 --> 01:18:23,120
Speaker 1: and we really realized that there was a hundred I

1361
01:18:23,120 --> 01:18:25,240
Speaker 1: had an audit company come and look at Live Nation

1362
01:18:25,280 --> 01:18:28,439
Speaker 1: ticketing versus Ticketmaster, and there was like a hundred nine

1363
01:18:28,680 --> 01:18:31,559
Speaker 1: seven things that Ticketmaster did for the venue that we

1364
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:35,080
Speaker 1: couldn't even do. So it was all of this years

1365
01:18:35,120 --> 01:18:38,840
Speaker 1: of customization for Broadway for the venues UM that have

1366
01:18:38,920 --> 01:18:43,120
Speaker 1: made that platform very very viable UM and and UM

1367
01:18:43,160 --> 01:18:45,160
Speaker 1: and useful for the venue. So you have two things

1368
01:18:45,160 --> 01:18:48,160
Speaker 1: that Ticketmaster does better than most people. It's got a

1369
01:18:48,280 --> 01:18:52,639
Speaker 1: highly scalable platform, meaning it can handle billions of bots

1370
01:18:52,640 --> 01:18:56,320
Speaker 1: at ten am. We'll still customize it to your needs.

1371
01:18:56,360 --> 01:18:59,320
Speaker 1: When you say I'm a a football team that needs

1372
01:18:59,320 --> 01:19:01,240
Speaker 1: you to do this on a Sunday with the church

1373
01:19:01,560 --> 01:19:06,000
Speaker 1: for a benefit form for an exhibition game. Very very

1374
01:19:06,080 --> 01:19:09,600
Speaker 1: hard problems to solve at scale. The second thing that

1375
01:19:09,640 --> 01:19:11,639
Speaker 1: has done really well when we broke the company too,

1376
01:19:11,680 --> 01:19:15,040
Speaker 1: is it still happens to be incredible big e commerce marketplace.

1377
01:19:15,600 --> 01:19:18,799
Speaker 1: If you look at putting your if we're gonna service

1378
01:19:18,840 --> 01:19:21,280
Speaker 1: you as the venue, the biggest value you're gonna get

1379
01:19:21,280 --> 01:19:23,800
Speaker 1: is we're gonna sell your ticket at our marketplace where

1380
01:19:23,800 --> 01:19:26,880
Speaker 1: a majority of customers go to still buy their tickets,

1381
01:19:26,880 --> 01:19:29,160
Speaker 1: where it has the highest um you know, the e

1382
01:19:29,240 --> 01:19:34,200
Speaker 1: commerce scores of ticket sales. So one, we're gonna, you know,

1383
01:19:34,240 --> 01:19:36,479
Speaker 1: do two things. We're gonna have a great platform that's

1384
01:19:36,479 --> 01:19:40,400
Speaker 1: scalable yet customizable, and to we're gonna have the best

1385
01:19:40,439 --> 01:19:42,760
Speaker 1: marketplace to put that ticket for sale, help you sell

1386
01:19:42,760 --> 01:19:45,479
Speaker 1: that ticket, use our database, sell you more tickets, and

1387
01:19:45,520 --> 01:19:47,960
Speaker 1: we can we prove over and over if you leave

1388
01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:51,679
Speaker 1: our platform, odds are your ticket sales will go down

1389
01:19:51,720 --> 01:19:54,960
Speaker 1: just because we happen to have a big audience. Um.

1390
01:19:55,080 --> 01:19:58,280
Speaker 1: So we're we're we've been you know, successful at keeping

1391
01:19:58,320 --> 01:20:02,360
Speaker 1: both of those plates mean well, lots of engineers every

1392
01:20:02,439 --> 01:20:07,720
Speaker 1: day customizing our main platform and great e commerce people

1393
01:20:07,760 --> 01:20:11,320
Speaker 1: thinking about how we keep putting mor um, fixing our ux,

1394
01:20:11,400 --> 01:20:14,120
Speaker 1: getting to the app, making sure we can sell tickets

1395
01:20:14,120 --> 01:20:16,599
Speaker 1: better than anyone else when it comes to that seat

1396
01:20:16,640 --> 01:20:19,320
Speaker 1: map and I want to ticket um to my football

1397
01:20:19,360 --> 01:20:22,599
Speaker 1: game or my my one off game. So still too

1398
01:20:22,640 --> 01:20:26,120
Speaker 1: great skills and global that have been able to uh

1399
01:20:26,160 --> 01:20:30,000
Speaker 1: to to lead the pack there. Okay, if Live Nation

1400
01:20:30,040 --> 01:20:35,720
Speaker 1: hast of the concert market internationally, what percentage does Ticketmaster

1401
01:20:35,880 --> 01:20:40,120
Speaker 1: have domestically and Live Nation associated ticketing platforms around the

1402
01:20:40,120 --> 01:20:47,120
Speaker 1: world have internationally well Globally, the ticket team business is

1403
01:20:47,160 --> 01:20:51,400
Speaker 1: still fairly fragmented, So I don't know if we have

1404
01:20:51,520 --> 01:20:57,280
Speaker 1: that number there would be I wouldn't be a big

1405
01:20:57,360 --> 01:21:01,600
Speaker 1: number globally because his markets are still fragmented. Um and

1406
01:21:01,640 --> 01:21:06,720
Speaker 1: in the US again, you know the business of ticketing

1407
01:21:06,920 --> 01:21:10,880
Speaker 1: globally and ticketing in the US when you add when

1408
01:21:10,920 --> 01:21:13,400
Speaker 1: you look at the market of ticketing, we do a

1409
01:21:13,439 --> 01:21:18,679
Speaker 1: great job on one segment called arenas and uh and

1410
01:21:18,680 --> 01:21:22,000
Speaker 1: and amphitheaters, but you know, there's a whole world of

1411
01:21:22,040 --> 01:21:24,960
Speaker 1: ticketing that we don't participate in or don't have a

1412
01:21:25,000 --> 01:21:27,320
Speaker 1: high score. Whether it's you know, all the college businesses

1413
01:21:27,400 --> 01:21:31,519
Speaker 1: that Paciolan do the secondary business now sec of Sports

1414
01:21:31,600 --> 01:21:35,880
Speaker 1: seek geeks and Vivid's okay. Now you have an act

1415
01:21:36,320 --> 01:21:38,920
Speaker 1: that wants to go on the road, how do you

1416
01:21:38,920 --> 01:21:41,160
Speaker 1: convince them to come to Live Nation as opposed to

1417
01:21:41,160 --> 01:21:43,479
Speaker 1: a competitor. And at the end of the day, does

1418
01:21:43,520 --> 01:21:48,400
Speaker 1: it really just come down the money? Uh, you know

1419
01:21:48,479 --> 01:21:51,360
Speaker 1: it's it's never about the money. But it's always about

1420
01:21:51,400 --> 01:21:55,519
Speaker 1: the money, as they say. You know, listen, you still

1421
01:21:55,520 --> 01:21:58,080
Speaker 1: have to have the infrastructure to get the job done right.

1422
01:21:58,439 --> 01:22:01,080
Speaker 1: You can, you can win anything. It's it's the repeat

1423
01:22:01,120 --> 01:22:05,800
Speaker 1: business that matters. So you know the big piece of

1424
01:22:05,800 --> 01:22:10,320
Speaker 1: our businesses. We have a hundred offices in forty countries,

1425
01:22:10,360 --> 01:22:13,360
Speaker 1: so you know, think about it. Ultimately, we're a huge

1426
01:22:13,400 --> 01:22:16,479
Speaker 1: distribution company as well as a financing company, so you

1427
01:22:16,520 --> 01:22:18,320
Speaker 1: have to do both things. You have to make sure

1428
01:22:18,400 --> 01:22:23,160
Speaker 1: that you have the best financial incentives to win the business. Um.

1429
01:22:23,280 --> 01:22:26,120
Speaker 1: And whether it's a tour or it's local, but ultimately

1430
01:22:26,120 --> 01:22:29,080
Speaker 1: you've got to make sure you can execute the show. Um,

1431
01:22:29,120 --> 01:22:31,840
Speaker 1: you have the best economics for the band, whether they

1432
01:22:31,880 --> 01:22:37,600
Speaker 1: show up in Milan, Pittsburgh, Toronto, or um or Australia.

1433
01:22:37,760 --> 01:22:41,280
Speaker 1: So you know, our our strength has always been go global.

1434
01:22:41,880 --> 01:22:44,920
Speaker 1: A global business is what the artist needs today. Have

1435
01:22:45,200 --> 01:22:48,719
Speaker 1: offices and all the main cities, have the best marketing staff,

1436
01:22:48,800 --> 01:22:53,920
Speaker 1: production venue deals, marketing deals, sponsorship deals, um. And that

1437
01:22:54,000 --> 01:22:56,599
Speaker 1: ends up being you know kind of the business. If

1438
01:22:56,600 --> 01:22:58,559
Speaker 1: we can have the best players and most of the

1439
01:22:58,600 --> 01:23:01,720
Speaker 1: markets around the world, we can convince any artists that

1440
01:23:01,760 --> 01:23:04,240
Speaker 1: we can take care of their tour market at the best,

1441
01:23:04,560 --> 01:23:07,479
Speaker 1: execute at the best, get the best venue rates, get

1442
01:23:07,520 --> 01:23:10,759
Speaker 1: the best production rates, as well as pay the proper

1443
01:23:10,920 --> 01:23:14,840
Speaker 1: financing deal to to secure the deal because of your

1444
01:23:14,840 --> 01:23:17,920
Speaker 1: other revenue streams. Do you find if there's a competition

1445
01:23:18,360 --> 01:23:24,280
Speaker 1: live nation, if it chooses to can always pay more. Now,

1446
01:23:24,400 --> 01:23:28,559
Speaker 1: I mean you know most most of the ultimately you know,

1447
01:23:28,720 --> 01:23:32,439
Speaker 1: the tour that the local business is still a dog

1448
01:23:32,479 --> 01:23:35,439
Speaker 1: fight as you know, you know denver you're fighting. You

1449
01:23:35,439 --> 01:23:39,759
Speaker 1: know your guys versus uh guys. Everyone's got similar revenue streams,

1450
01:23:39,760 --> 01:23:42,920
Speaker 1: so tends to be the same same. No, we don't

1451
01:23:42,920 --> 01:23:45,640
Speaker 1: have any new tricks that the others don't have. So

1452
01:23:45,680 --> 01:23:48,240
Speaker 1: we've all got the same revenue streams. And if it's

1453
01:23:48,240 --> 01:23:51,280
Speaker 1: a tour, it's us versus a g um. They've got

1454
01:23:51,320 --> 01:23:53,719
Speaker 1: similar revenue streams. As you know, they own the buildings,

1455
01:23:53,760 --> 01:23:56,519
Speaker 1: they have the sponsorship, so we all have the same

1456
01:23:56,560 --> 01:23:59,360
Speaker 1: revenue streams to to use to win the tour or

1457
01:23:59,400 --> 01:24:01,880
Speaker 1: the local day eight. We just happen to think that,

1458
01:24:01,920 --> 01:24:05,759
Speaker 1: you know, Uh, I've always believed that it's a local business,

1459
01:24:05,800 --> 01:24:09,120
Speaker 1: and I think that's our competitive advantage very Having a

1460
01:24:09,240 --> 01:24:14,120
Speaker 1: hundred offices and thirty thousand staff executing your tour is

1461
01:24:14,200 --> 01:24:17,280
Speaker 1: a is a big investment to make, but it ultimately

1462
01:24:17,280 --> 01:24:19,720
Speaker 1: makes a difference when you're looking at that band and

1463
01:24:19,720 --> 01:24:21,799
Speaker 1: and talking about do you have boots on the ground

1464
01:24:22,120 --> 01:24:26,479
Speaker 1: to to make that happen. Now, you also have touring deals.

1465
01:24:26,520 --> 01:24:28,240
Speaker 1: I remember talking to you one day there was a

1466
01:24:28,280 --> 01:24:31,920
Speaker 1: relatively nason act with some action and you made an

1467
01:24:31,920 --> 01:24:35,800
Speaker 1: overall touring deal. So how prevalent are those and what's

1468
01:24:35,840 --> 01:24:42,040
Speaker 1: the philosophy behind that? Well, you know, touring deals, let's go.

1469
01:24:43,560 --> 01:24:46,720
Speaker 1: You know, ten twelve years ago was not It was

1470
01:24:46,760 --> 01:24:49,840
Speaker 1: not the norm. And I think every year you've seen

1471
01:24:49,840 --> 01:24:53,599
Speaker 1: more and more artists look at kind of uh looking

1472
01:24:53,640 --> 01:24:58,439
Speaker 1: for a partnership with someone us a g um and um,

1473
01:24:58,960 --> 01:25:00,600
Speaker 1: and I think they become more or of the of

1474
01:25:00,640 --> 01:25:03,960
Speaker 1: the norm, which would make sense because you know, I

1475
01:25:04,280 --> 01:25:08,000
Speaker 1: always remind artists or managers and agents that you know

1476
01:25:08,320 --> 01:25:10,599
Speaker 1: the same reason why you have a record deal. You didn't.

1477
01:25:10,600 --> 01:25:13,479
Speaker 1: You didn't sell off your record by by record store

1478
01:25:13,600 --> 01:25:16,240
Speaker 1: by city. You probably did a record deal because you

1479
01:25:16,280 --> 01:25:18,599
Speaker 1: want one partner thinking about your business on a longer

1480
01:25:18,720 --> 01:25:22,800
Speaker 1: term basis, on a marketing basis. So I truly believe

1481
01:25:22,840 --> 01:25:26,320
Speaker 1: that if you have a tour partner thinking about your

1482
01:25:26,320 --> 01:25:29,120
Speaker 1: tour on a global basis, you might not you know,

1483
01:25:29,200 --> 01:25:33,280
Speaker 1: make money and Denver, but you might make make money

1484
01:25:33,320 --> 01:25:35,680
Speaker 1: in Argentina and South America. You're going to make a

1485
01:25:35,720 --> 01:25:38,840
Speaker 1: different investment basis if it's spread over time and you

1486
01:25:38,840 --> 01:25:41,280
Speaker 1: can play together and you're gonna try to build a

1487
01:25:41,320 --> 01:25:44,599
Speaker 1: pot together. So I think I think an artist today,

1488
01:25:44,840 --> 01:25:48,000
Speaker 1: I think a manager today has a whole new business

1489
01:25:48,040 --> 01:25:50,600
Speaker 1: than he did of the old management system. Right, the

1490
01:25:50,600 --> 01:25:52,479
Speaker 1: old manager had to get you a record deal and

1491
01:25:52,520 --> 01:25:55,120
Speaker 1: a tour deal. The new manager today has got a

1492
01:25:55,160 --> 01:25:58,280
Speaker 1: whole new world to think about on influencers and how

1493
01:25:58,280 --> 01:26:00,080
Speaker 1: he's going to build his brand and what they going

1494
01:26:00,120 --> 01:26:01,920
Speaker 1: to do with that artist. I think when it comes

1495
01:26:01,920 --> 01:26:05,000
Speaker 1: to touring, I don't think it's that complex. In the end,

1496
01:26:05,040 --> 01:26:07,519
Speaker 1: I think he wants to meet with his agent talk

1497
01:26:07,560 --> 01:26:10,679
Speaker 1: about his tour plans and find a good, committed partner

1498
01:26:10,720 --> 01:26:13,200
Speaker 1: that's going to pay market rate with great marketing and

1499
01:26:13,280 --> 01:26:16,160
Speaker 1: support and get that done. I don't think there's a

1500
01:26:16,360 --> 01:26:21,040
Speaker 1: they are obsessed, um with what exact artist or what

1501
01:26:21,560 --> 01:26:25,200
Speaker 1: promoter and spain is doing the deal. I think they're

1502
01:26:25,200 --> 01:26:28,479
Speaker 1: more obsessed with who's my promoter? And I've got to

1503
01:26:28,520 --> 01:26:30,839
Speaker 1: think about that, just like I thought about my record partner.

1504
01:26:31,200 --> 01:26:33,160
Speaker 1: I want to play with a partner that's thinking long

1505
01:26:33,280 --> 01:26:35,479
Speaker 1: term with me. So we've seen that more and more

1506
01:26:36,439 --> 01:26:39,639
Speaker 1: um an artist looking for bigger deals, longer term deals.

1507
01:26:41,000 --> 01:26:43,960
Speaker 1: So what does a tour deal look like in what

1508
01:26:44,160 --> 01:26:46,559
Speaker 1: percentage of your business is that? Or to put another way,

1509
01:26:46,600 --> 01:26:52,240
Speaker 1: how many of you have? Well, because on a global basis,

1510
01:26:52,320 --> 01:26:54,920
Speaker 1: you know we you know I mentioned earlier we did

1511
01:26:54,960 --> 01:26:57,240
Speaker 1: thirty thousand shows. We might have five thousand of those

1512
01:26:57,240 --> 01:26:59,599
Speaker 1: would be a tour deal. A tour deal could be

1513
01:27:00,560 --> 01:27:04,360
Speaker 1: forty dates in America, could be a hundred dates globally,

1514
01:27:04,479 --> 01:27:07,479
Speaker 1: could be one year deal, could be three year deals

1515
01:27:07,520 --> 01:27:10,240
Speaker 1: depending if the artist is on cycle or once a

1516
01:27:10,280 --> 01:27:13,120
Speaker 1: couple of cycle deal or a certain amount of shows.

1517
01:27:13,400 --> 01:27:17,240
Speaker 1: So somewhere between you know, one cycle and three cycles

1518
01:27:17,240 --> 01:27:20,360
Speaker 1: maybe a tour deal. Okay, what's the future of the

1519
01:27:20,400 --> 01:27:23,880
Speaker 1: agency business If we're looking from the agency side. Music

1520
01:27:23,920 --> 01:27:28,360
Speaker 1: representation is a small revenue share of these giant agencies,

1521
01:27:28,840 --> 01:27:32,840
Speaker 1: and certainly when you have the monster acts, do they

1522
01:27:32,960 --> 01:27:35,679
Speaker 1: really need an agent at all? So what's your thought

1523
01:27:35,760 --> 01:27:41,400
Speaker 1: about where that's all going. Well, you know, I think anyone,

1524
01:27:41,560 --> 01:27:44,879
Speaker 1: I think we've all got squeezed in the business. Right. Ultimately,

1525
01:27:44,920 --> 01:27:48,280
Speaker 1: the artist has done a great job of building their

1526
01:27:48,320 --> 01:27:51,919
Speaker 1: business over time, and the manager, the agent, the promoter,

1527
01:27:52,200 --> 01:27:56,880
Speaker 1: everyone ultimately had gotten squeezed over time. Promoter, I know

1528
01:27:57,040 --> 01:27:58,719
Speaker 1: used to be it used to be what a fifty

1529
01:27:58,760 --> 01:28:03,240
Speaker 1: fifty eight twenty manager used to get paid on gross

1530
01:28:03,400 --> 01:28:05,960
Speaker 1: versus net, And an agent's gotten squeezed. So I think

1531
01:28:06,000 --> 01:28:09,439
Speaker 1: we're all in the same business. The middleman ultimately gets

1532
01:28:09,479 --> 01:28:12,280
Speaker 1: squeezed over time if you don't reinvent your business or

1533
01:28:12,360 --> 01:28:15,639
Speaker 1: diversify it. I as a promoter, knew that we wouldn't

1534
01:28:16,040 --> 01:28:19,599
Speaker 1: we couldn't exist. Just as a promoter fifteen years ago

1535
01:28:19,640 --> 01:28:21,920
Speaker 1: when I was you know, looked at Live Nation, it

1536
01:28:22,080 --> 01:28:24,679
Speaker 1: was that to me was just one piece of the business.

1537
01:28:24,720 --> 01:28:27,320
Speaker 1: You had to build a much more diversified business model

1538
01:28:27,760 --> 01:28:31,040
Speaker 1: over time. To win, which we worked on. I think

1539
01:28:31,080 --> 01:28:33,320
Speaker 1: the agents have done the same thing. I think whether

1540
01:28:33,360 --> 01:28:36,400
Speaker 1: you're William Morris or c A A, they've all you know,

1541
01:28:36,880 --> 01:28:39,680
Speaker 1: William Morris obviously very different with UFC and others, but

1542
01:28:40,160 --> 01:28:42,839
Speaker 1: I think they looked at it as a macro business

1543
01:28:42,880 --> 01:28:46,280
Speaker 1: and they've diversified into other businesses to build around it

1544
01:28:46,880 --> 01:28:49,000
Speaker 1: UM so they can try to offer value to those

1545
01:28:49,240 --> 01:28:53,360
Speaker 1: artists and clients, UM beyond just their you know, the

1546
01:28:53,479 --> 01:28:56,559
Speaker 1: historic business model. So I think they'll I think that listen,

1547
01:28:56,600 --> 01:29:00,599
Speaker 1: they're great brands at the car CEA William Morris case

1548
01:29:00,640 --> 01:29:02,719
Speaker 1: you now joining. I think the role of an agent

1549
01:29:03,600 --> 01:29:06,160
Speaker 1: UH is a is a good check and balance for

1550
01:29:06,240 --> 01:29:09,839
Speaker 1: the manager UM. And I think the agent will continue

1551
01:29:09,880 --> 01:29:14,439
Speaker 1: to evolve their services UM, much like the labels have evolved.

1552
01:29:14,520 --> 01:29:16,960
Speaker 1: Right everyone looked at the labels and all of a

1553
01:29:17,000 --> 01:29:19,439
Speaker 1: sudden they're making money on Peloton that no one predicted.

1554
01:29:19,840 --> 01:29:21,720
Speaker 1: So I think the artists are gonna make a lot

1555
01:29:21,760 --> 01:29:24,960
Speaker 1: of money there direct to consumer brands. Right now, every

1556
01:29:25,080 --> 01:29:29,920
Speaker 1: artist wants his own vodka is tequilas, Monetizing his Instagram

1557
01:29:30,120 --> 01:29:33,320
Speaker 1: is TikTok. There's lots of ways to monetize these artists.

1558
01:29:33,680 --> 01:29:37,760
Speaker 1: Outside of the tour alone. The agents are all looking

1559
01:29:37,800 --> 01:29:39,800
Speaker 1: at how do we how do we add more value

1560
01:29:39,840 --> 01:29:42,479
Speaker 1: to the to the UH, to the to the artist.

1561
01:29:42,560 --> 01:29:44,880
Speaker 1: How do we get them into venture deals together, how

1562
01:29:44,960 --> 01:29:48,880
Speaker 1: do we monetize their privates? How do we ponetize um

1563
01:29:49,120 --> 01:29:52,000
Speaker 1: affairs and festivals. So still a big piece of the

1564
01:29:52,040 --> 01:29:54,479
Speaker 1: business and and a whole new world for the agents

1565
01:29:54,520 --> 01:29:57,800
Speaker 1: that they keep evolving their skill set. One thing we

1566
01:29:57,960 --> 01:30:03,920
Speaker 1: know is the traditional let's put the traditional major label

1567
01:30:03,960 --> 01:30:05,800
Speaker 1: business is very different from it used to use. Some

1568
01:30:05,880 --> 01:30:10,000
Speaker 1: major labels controlled most of the market place, certainly in

1569
01:30:10,000 --> 01:30:12,840
Speaker 1: the era of physical distribution, and those were the acts

1570
01:30:12,920 --> 01:30:15,760
Speaker 1: that sold the tickets. Now more than ever, if you

1571
01:30:15,800 --> 01:30:18,160
Speaker 1: look at pole Star, you look at grosses, it could

1572
01:30:18,200 --> 01:30:22,360
Speaker 1: be completely different from the Spotify top fifty. So in

1573
01:30:22,479 --> 01:30:25,439
Speaker 1: a music level, what is going on in general? What

1574
01:30:25,520 --> 01:30:30,800
Speaker 1: do you see in the marketplace? Yeah, you know, but

1575
01:30:30,920 --> 01:30:33,840
Speaker 1: I saw that that that's been consistent for quite a while.

1576
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:38,400
Speaker 1: I mean, even pop music that charts, we're not always

1577
01:30:38,479 --> 01:30:42,479
Speaker 1: reflective of the sale on the venue, so that that's

1578
01:30:42,520 --> 01:30:46,160
Speaker 1: not new to me. UM. We we've seen that disconnect

1579
01:30:46,720 --> 01:30:50,320
Speaker 1: from disco days onward. It didn't always mean that you

1580
01:30:50,360 --> 01:30:54,479
Speaker 1: could sell tickets. So, um, you know, I I don't

1581
01:30:54,560 --> 01:30:58,439
Speaker 1: see that as uh is anything that affects the business differently,

1582
01:30:59,000 --> 01:31:01,479
Speaker 1: you know, I do think that you look at the business,

1583
01:31:01,880 --> 01:31:03,920
Speaker 1: you know, it's a day and you look at hip

1584
01:31:03,960 --> 01:31:06,439
Speaker 1: hop businesses as you know, let's call that the new

1585
01:31:06,560 --> 01:31:08,919
Speaker 1: rock and roll or the rock and roll of today's generation.

1586
01:31:09,479 --> 01:31:12,680
Speaker 1: That's vibrant and big as ever Travis Scott do you

1587
01:31:12,840 --> 01:31:16,519
Speaker 1: name them are selling out and driving driving venues like

1588
01:31:16,880 --> 01:31:19,680
Speaker 1: the rock and roll of the past. So that's relevant

1589
01:31:19,720 --> 01:31:22,800
Speaker 1: and bigger than ever. Um So I don't, I don't.

1590
01:31:22,840 --> 01:31:26,360
Speaker 1: I don't think the the charts reflective on the ticket

1591
01:31:26,400 --> 01:31:29,280
Speaker 1: sales is a new disconnect. I think that's been happening

1592
01:31:29,360 --> 01:31:33,800
Speaker 1: for for a long time. Okay, so what do we know?

1593
01:31:33,960 --> 01:31:36,200
Speaker 1: You're in this business three d in sixty five days

1594
01:31:36,240 --> 01:31:39,800
Speaker 1: a year. Certainly new managers they may only have one

1595
01:31:39,880 --> 01:31:43,920
Speaker 1: act and are wept behind the year. So what do

1596
01:31:44,040 --> 01:31:47,360
Speaker 1: you say to new managers who have a successful act,

1597
01:31:47,439 --> 01:31:50,240
Speaker 1: it's got some action. What lessons do they need to learn?

1598
01:31:50,280 --> 01:31:52,960
Speaker 1: What do they have to wake up to? Wow, it's

1599
01:31:52,960 --> 01:31:55,080
Speaker 1: a great it's a great one. You know, I think

1600
01:31:55,120 --> 01:32:00,559
Speaker 1: they're you know that you see the the chain happening

1601
01:32:00,600 --> 01:32:04,880
Speaker 1: in this new era of managers um in that there

1602
01:32:05,880 --> 01:32:10,759
Speaker 1: they're driving their artists. Probably is celebrities more than artists

1603
01:32:10,800 --> 01:32:14,120
Speaker 1: at times. Um And I do think that, you know,

1604
01:32:14,240 --> 01:32:16,640
Speaker 1: we we often remind them that even though they may

1605
01:32:16,720 --> 01:32:19,360
Speaker 1: be able to get a vodka line or sell some

1606
01:32:19,479 --> 01:32:23,240
Speaker 1: Instagram ads, longevity means you've got to have hits and

1607
01:32:23,320 --> 01:32:26,320
Speaker 1: you've got to apprentice yourself on that road and connect.

1608
01:32:26,960 --> 01:32:30,240
Speaker 1: Uh So I would say sometimes, you know, I was

1609
01:32:30,320 --> 01:32:33,479
Speaker 1: with a manager and we had a tour that wasn't

1610
01:32:33,520 --> 01:32:35,920
Speaker 1: selling well, and I said to what what are we

1611
01:32:35,960 --> 01:32:40,320
Speaker 1: gonna do? And and he said, well, you know, we're

1612
01:32:40,320 --> 01:32:43,000
Speaker 1: getting paid for privates and we're gonna launch a hot

1613
01:32:43,080 --> 01:32:48,080
Speaker 1: sauce because we have a lot of followers. And I thought, wow, Now,

1614
01:32:48,160 --> 01:32:51,160
Speaker 1: for thirty years, Bob, that answer would have been, you know,

1615
01:32:51,200 --> 01:32:52,720
Speaker 1: we're gonna get in the art we're gonna get in

1616
01:32:52,760 --> 01:32:54,760
Speaker 1: the studio, we've got a single coming, and we're gonna

1617
01:32:54,800 --> 01:32:59,560
Speaker 1: sell some tickets. Um So, I do think that, you know,

1618
01:32:59,680 --> 01:33:01,840
Speaker 1: over night, now if you have twenty million followers, you

1619
01:33:01,920 --> 01:33:05,160
Speaker 1: can sell some Instagram ads and make a living. Um So,

1620
01:33:05,280 --> 01:33:08,160
Speaker 1: I think that they have to watch that fine line

1621
01:33:08,200 --> 01:33:13,360
Speaker 1: between driving their brand monetizing their brand. But ultimately, if

1622
01:33:13,360 --> 01:33:15,920
Speaker 1: they're gonna play long, they've still got to put those hits.

1623
01:33:16,680 --> 01:33:18,439
Speaker 1: They've got to have the playlist, and they've got to

1624
01:33:18,479 --> 01:33:22,040
Speaker 1: be be able to connect on stage and sell arenas.

1625
01:33:22,040 --> 01:33:24,559
Speaker 1: I mean, i'd always tell that artist, sell the arena,

1626
01:33:25,120 --> 01:33:29,040
Speaker 1: sell the amphitheater. If you can sell the stadium, then

1627
01:33:29,160 --> 01:33:33,320
Speaker 1: start the monetization because you'll never you'll never get that

1628
01:33:33,560 --> 01:33:36,360
Speaker 1: chance to get that run and build that business. But

1629
01:33:36,520 --> 01:33:39,760
Speaker 1: once you stand on stage as a stadium act and

1630
01:33:39,920 --> 01:33:43,760
Speaker 1: get that rarefied air, the next the next thirty or

1631
01:33:43,800 --> 01:33:46,280
Speaker 1: forty years are set. But you've got to get there.

1632
01:33:46,320 --> 01:33:48,840
Speaker 1: That you're you're you're defined as an artist on what

1633
01:33:48,960 --> 01:33:51,320
Speaker 1: you do on stage, and if you can get to

1634
01:33:51,400 --> 01:33:55,920
Speaker 1: that rarefied stadium, even that sell outs arena business, you

1635
01:33:56,120 --> 01:34:00,760
Speaker 1: become an artist of a different caliber and then you're

1636
01:34:00,800 --> 01:34:03,320
Speaker 1: probably going to be able to have a career, even

1637
01:34:03,400 --> 01:34:06,959
Speaker 1: if it's a diminishing career of casinos and fairs eventually,

1638
01:34:07,439 --> 01:34:11,320
Speaker 1: but the more people you can perform to and really

1639
01:34:11,840 --> 01:34:15,479
Speaker 1: live is where you make fans on on on you know,

1640
01:34:15,600 --> 01:34:18,479
Speaker 1: on Spotify is where you you sell some some streams,

1641
01:34:18,600 --> 01:34:22,200
Speaker 1: but but you you you cement long term fans when

1642
01:34:22,240 --> 01:34:25,080
Speaker 1: they see you live. Um. And the more you do

1643
01:34:25,240 --> 01:34:26,840
Speaker 1: that and you put all that hard work in and

1644
01:34:26,920 --> 01:34:30,559
Speaker 1: go global and go play some festivals, solidify that fan

1645
01:34:30,720 --> 01:34:34,920
Speaker 1: base and then and then the monetization will come. Versus

1646
01:34:35,200 --> 01:34:38,599
Speaker 1: you get monetize it too fast and early, that artist

1647
01:34:38,640 --> 01:34:40,200
Speaker 1: isn't gonna want to get on that plane and go

1648
01:34:40,320 --> 01:34:43,160
Speaker 1: all the way to Belgium to play that festival, or

1649
01:34:43,720 --> 01:34:46,840
Speaker 1: build that build that road show. So you know I'm

1650
01:34:46,920 --> 01:34:49,800
Speaker 1: biased because I live and live, but we've seen it

1651
01:34:49,880 --> 01:34:52,160
Speaker 1: over and over. If you build a live audience, you

1652
01:34:52,240 --> 01:34:55,160
Speaker 1: build a fan base live. That magic that you make

1653
01:34:55,240 --> 01:34:57,439
Speaker 1: with that fan in that field or in that stadium

1654
01:34:57,520 --> 01:35:01,840
Speaker 1: or that festival carries your brand for long time. And

1655
01:35:02,000 --> 01:35:05,160
Speaker 1: what is the status of Live Nations management company? Is

1656
01:35:05,240 --> 01:35:07,439
Speaker 1: that a future business? When we see that fade away

1657
01:35:07,560 --> 01:35:11,320
Speaker 1: sold off? No, No, we we like we like it

1658
01:35:11,560 --> 01:35:16,280
Speaker 1: um Um. You know, it started organically, so it's not

1659
01:35:18,120 --> 01:35:20,639
Speaker 1: it's not meant to be uh, anything more than than

1660
01:35:20,720 --> 01:35:23,080
Speaker 1: the obvious. We started with jay Z and rock Nation

1661
01:35:23,200 --> 01:35:25,880
Speaker 1: and it was our kind of our first shot at

1662
01:35:25,920 --> 01:35:29,280
Speaker 1: being in business with an artist and a manager company. Um.

1663
01:35:29,600 --> 01:35:33,400
Speaker 1: And then we've expanded slowly over time. Obviously, what Irvan

1664
01:35:33,479 --> 01:35:35,439
Speaker 1: was was here for a bit and gone and we

1665
01:35:35,520 --> 01:35:39,320
Speaker 1: have our seventeen management companies. Now we'd be investors in UM.

1666
01:35:39,800 --> 01:35:44,280
Speaker 1: I love that division Artist Nation. UH. It's great to

1667
01:35:44,320 --> 01:35:47,080
Speaker 1: be that connected to the artist and the manager to

1668
01:35:47,160 --> 01:35:49,680
Speaker 1: see the world from their view here what's going on

1669
01:35:49,880 --> 01:35:52,800
Speaker 1: from the record deals to the uh to to the

1670
01:35:52,920 --> 01:35:57,160
Speaker 1: madness and and and selling off their records and publishing

1671
01:35:57,240 --> 01:36:00,679
Speaker 1: rights and and obviously it helps drive our core business.

1672
01:36:00,800 --> 01:36:04,280
Speaker 1: Is if if you're if you're building those relationships, it

1673
01:36:04,400 --> 01:36:06,880
Speaker 1: does it does ultimately get you to win a few

1674
01:36:06,960 --> 01:36:10,040
Speaker 1: jump balls, um when you're battling for the tour. So

1675
01:36:10,560 --> 01:36:13,800
Speaker 1: we just you know, concluded a deal recently. Well we'll

1676
01:36:13,840 --> 01:36:16,360
Speaker 1: keep building that division. UM. We think it's a good

1677
01:36:16,400 --> 01:36:19,760
Speaker 1: adjacent business to our core business, high margin compared to uh,

1678
01:36:19,920 --> 01:36:24,519
Speaker 1: the concert business. So we like it, okay. And what's

1679
01:36:24,560 --> 01:36:27,680
Speaker 1: the status of festivals both domestically and worldwide? What do

1680
01:36:27,760 --> 01:36:29,840
Speaker 1: we know? There were a few then there were too

1681
01:36:29,920 --> 01:36:34,720
Speaker 1: many where we at now you know, there's a I

1682
01:36:34,840 --> 01:36:37,839
Speaker 1: think a little bit of a shakeout happened. Probably obviously

1683
01:36:37,960 --> 01:36:40,400
Speaker 1: COVID did did help. We've we even struck out a few.

1684
01:36:40,439 --> 01:36:44,000
Speaker 1: I think we I think we shut down twelve that

1685
01:36:44,080 --> 01:36:47,680
Speaker 1: weren't working that we didn't love over over our festival portfolio.

1686
01:36:48,240 --> 01:36:52,679
Speaker 1: Um So, I I think you're seeing the bars getting higher,

1687
01:36:53,120 --> 01:36:56,440
Speaker 1: which is um to kind of make make a successful

1688
01:36:56,520 --> 01:36:59,680
Speaker 1: festival work. Um So, if you're lucky enough to be

1689
01:36:59,800 --> 01:37:03,320
Speaker 1: in space like Lalla Palooza is, or Coachella or Bonnaroo

1690
01:37:03,439 --> 01:37:06,280
Speaker 1: or a c l um where you seem to be

1691
01:37:06,400 --> 01:37:11,160
Speaker 1: passage of right in in that consumer space, they're fabulous businesses.

1692
01:37:11,400 --> 01:37:13,800
Speaker 1: I mean, Lola Palooza is. You know, I can't take

1693
01:37:13,840 --> 01:37:15,479
Speaker 1: any of the credit. It was everyone else. But you

1694
01:37:15,479 --> 01:37:17,800
Speaker 1: know what a brand they built that we're now sitting

1695
01:37:17,840 --> 01:37:21,080
Speaker 1: in all of these festivals in South America, over in Europe.

1696
01:37:21,160 --> 01:37:25,320
Speaker 1: It's through traveling festival brand that that's worked well. So

1697
01:37:26,040 --> 01:37:29,400
Speaker 1: festivals are still you know, consumers love them to death

1698
01:37:29,720 --> 01:37:32,920
Speaker 1: on a global basis. We have a couple hundred of

1699
01:37:33,000 --> 01:37:35,799
Speaker 1: them and I love them still, whether they're boutique ideas

1700
01:37:36,200 --> 01:37:39,880
Speaker 1: like we're doing in England too big ideas. Um I

1701
01:37:39,920 --> 01:37:43,120
Speaker 1: think there's still vibrant, still lots of landscape. I think

1702
01:37:43,240 --> 01:37:44,720
Speaker 1: you know, you and I've talked about it. I think

1703
01:37:44,760 --> 01:37:46,800
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think all of a sudden you

1704
01:37:46,880 --> 01:37:50,479
Speaker 1: can just launch a mainline festival with you know, three

1705
01:37:50,520 --> 01:37:53,080
Speaker 1: different genres of music over the weekend and expect a

1706
01:37:53,160 --> 01:37:57,080
Speaker 1: hundred thousand anymore. I think they become like any industry.

1707
01:37:57,200 --> 01:38:01,160
Speaker 1: They went out wide, then they the big ones survived,

1708
01:38:01,280 --> 01:38:05,000
Speaker 1: and then the niche one started to create their own space.

1709
01:38:05,120 --> 01:38:09,080
Speaker 1: So we see it happening now, a niche idea in

1710
01:38:09,160 --> 01:38:13,000
Speaker 1: a good location against a certain genre of music or

1711
01:38:13,000 --> 01:38:15,840
Speaker 1: a certain theme. Look look at Eddie's festival we're doing

1712
01:38:15,920 --> 01:38:19,320
Speaker 1: in uh Down near San Diego on the ocean, a

1713
01:38:19,400 --> 01:38:24,880
Speaker 1: real beach theme, and of UM sold out obviously through COVID,

1714
01:38:24,960 --> 01:38:27,320
Speaker 1: sold out. But so I like the I like the

1715
01:38:27,439 --> 01:38:30,599
Speaker 1: super served ideas where they're hitting a certain target, certain

1716
01:38:30,680 --> 01:38:35,759
Speaker 1: location um, and they're less They're almost less talent reliant

1717
01:38:35,840 --> 01:38:38,200
Speaker 1: because they have more of a thematic and soul to them,

1718
01:38:38,680 --> 01:38:40,880
Speaker 1: and those ones tend to work, and the band is

1719
01:38:40,920 --> 01:38:45,080
Speaker 1: the compliment to the theme, not just a bad line

1720
01:38:45,240 --> 01:38:48,000
Speaker 1: or typically we have a good lineup with a bad

1721
01:38:48,160 --> 01:38:50,600
Speaker 1: name and we think it's a festival, but it's not.

1722
01:38:51,040 --> 01:38:53,840
Speaker 1: It's got no soul, no no, no, no real reason

1723
01:38:53,920 --> 01:38:56,800
Speaker 1: for existing other than the lineup. So I think those

1724
01:38:56,840 --> 01:38:59,200
Speaker 1: are gone. We don't green light many of those anymore.

1725
01:38:59,600 --> 01:39:02,680
Speaker 1: If you've had a good idea or a great location. Uh,

1726
01:39:02,800 --> 01:39:06,680
Speaker 1: those seem to be working well. Okay, if you use

1727
01:39:06,760 --> 01:39:10,920
Speaker 1: Elton John's song, I'm still standing. You look at your

1728
01:39:11,000 --> 01:39:12,920
Speaker 1: tenure at Live Nation. There are a lot of people

1729
01:39:12,960 --> 01:39:16,360
Speaker 1: in power that are no longer there. You have remained.

1730
01:39:17,439 --> 01:39:21,200
Speaker 1: What makes you successful both from the beginning and now

1731
01:39:21,360 --> 01:39:26,479
Speaker 1: you personally. Oh jeez, I know you have to kind

1732
01:39:26,520 --> 01:39:29,360
Speaker 1: of my therapy session on Thursdays to dig into that

1733
01:39:29,479 --> 01:39:33,840
Speaker 1: one as we're as we're strying to solve that. You know,

1734
01:39:33,960 --> 01:39:36,320
Speaker 1: I don't know, none of us can understand what are

1735
01:39:36,439 --> 01:39:40,599
Speaker 1: superhuman power is. But uh um, you know, I think

1736
01:39:40,640 --> 01:39:44,880
Speaker 1: I got lucky early in life that I really really

1737
01:39:45,040 --> 01:39:48,920
Speaker 1: loved live entertainment and I found a passion early. So

1738
01:39:49,000 --> 01:39:51,240
Speaker 1: I do think that's been part of the success, right

1739
01:39:51,280 --> 01:39:55,240
Speaker 1: because from my early days this was what I wanted

1740
01:39:55,280 --> 01:39:58,679
Speaker 1: to do. So I was very focused, been very focused

1741
01:39:59,120 --> 01:40:03,720
Speaker 1: on building this kind of business in this space. Um uh.

1742
01:40:04,160 --> 01:40:06,879
Speaker 1: And I do think that's the real reason I'm successful.

1743
01:40:06,880 --> 01:40:08,599
Speaker 1: I didn't want to run a record label, I didn't

1744
01:40:08,600 --> 01:40:10,920
Speaker 1: want to run anything else, but I wanted to build

1745
01:40:10,960 --> 01:40:13,920
Speaker 1: a live concert company. And I think my focus and

1746
01:40:14,000 --> 01:40:16,800
Speaker 1: a little bit of my Thunderbay Warrior in me Um.

1747
01:40:17,400 --> 01:40:20,960
Speaker 1: And that grit added together with that complete focused agenda

1748
01:40:21,479 --> 01:40:23,599
Speaker 1: is how we ended up kind of staying on course here.

1749
01:40:24,080 --> 01:40:26,240
Speaker 1: Most people that I was battling with the most things

1750
01:40:26,280 --> 01:40:29,840
Speaker 1: I've been through, they didn't have the obsessive focus I

1751
01:40:29,960 --> 01:40:32,320
Speaker 1: had on a live event business. I mean, they might

1752
01:40:32,360 --> 01:40:33,960
Speaker 1: have wanted to be in business, they might have wanted

1753
01:40:34,000 --> 01:40:37,240
Speaker 1: a music's business, they might have other agendas. But you

1754
01:40:37,320 --> 01:40:39,120
Speaker 1: had to wake up early and go to bed late

1755
01:40:39,200 --> 01:40:42,200
Speaker 1: to beat me on this core business idea because this

1756
01:40:42,360 --> 01:40:45,800
Speaker 1: is this is what I think about nightly daily. Yeah,

1757
01:40:45,880 --> 01:40:48,519
Speaker 1: but knowing a little bit more than we've talked about

1758
01:40:48,600 --> 01:40:51,120
Speaker 1: here so far, going back to the top. You were

1759
01:40:51,200 --> 01:40:54,839
Speaker 1: working for Lobat. They had a company library. You literally

1760
01:40:55,000 --> 01:40:59,000
Speaker 1: read every book in the library. Yeah, you can say grip,

1761
01:40:59,040 --> 01:41:02,559
Speaker 1: but there's more of a dedication, more of an effort.

1762
01:41:02,720 --> 01:41:10,080
Speaker 1: Obviously an intelligence point too, that is really a key component. Yeah,

1763
01:41:10,240 --> 01:41:15,120
Speaker 1: you know, Um, maybe it's small town values. There's a

1764
01:41:15,160 --> 01:41:16,880
Speaker 1: little bit of Canadian and you when you when you

1765
01:41:16,960 --> 01:41:20,200
Speaker 1: grow up in Canada, um and you're you know, you're

1766
01:41:20,240 --> 01:41:23,479
Speaker 1: you're looking at ABC and CBS every day and looking

1767
01:41:23,479 --> 01:41:27,160
Speaker 1: at this big, big country called America, telling you how

1768
01:41:27,200 --> 01:41:29,080
Speaker 1: great they are you. You definitely don't grow up in

1769
01:41:29,160 --> 01:41:31,760
Speaker 1: Canada thinking that you have any of the answers. You

1770
01:41:31,800 --> 01:41:34,080
Speaker 1: don't think you're the smartest on the block. You think

1771
01:41:34,120 --> 01:41:36,120
Speaker 1: you have a lot to prove and a lot to learn.

1772
01:41:36,720 --> 01:41:40,280
Speaker 1: So I would say from from my insecure, small thunder

1773
01:41:40,360 --> 01:41:44,640
Speaker 1: Bay roots, um, you know, my obsession with learning and

1774
01:41:45,000 --> 01:41:48,880
Speaker 1: trying to outwork and outlearn the other guy still exists today.

1775
01:41:49,400 --> 01:41:51,800
Speaker 1: So I think that that tenacity of I'm going to

1776
01:41:52,600 --> 01:41:55,840
Speaker 1: work harder and because I'm not the smartest guy in

1777
01:41:55,840 --> 01:41:59,240
Speaker 1: the room, I better read and understand and and and

1778
01:41:59,439 --> 01:42:02,000
Speaker 1: and kind of figure out every angle to the the

1779
01:42:02,080 --> 01:42:06,439
Speaker 1: equation um to get this job done. So absolutely that

1780
01:42:06,800 --> 01:42:13,800
Speaker 1: that that burning desire to learn, observe, digest um has

1781
01:42:13,920 --> 01:42:16,040
Speaker 1: has stayed with me. I still don't think I've arrived.

1782
01:42:16,080 --> 01:42:17,960
Speaker 1: I don't think I got it figured out yet. I don't.

1783
01:42:18,320 --> 01:42:20,960
Speaker 1: I'm not resting on my laurels. So that tenacity to

1784
01:42:21,120 --> 01:42:24,920
Speaker 1: keep keep striving to be better having arrived yet has

1785
01:42:25,000 --> 01:42:28,599
Speaker 1: been I guess probably a good a good thing. Okay,

1786
01:42:28,640 --> 01:42:31,240
Speaker 1: in the live side of the business. Uh, it's not

1787
01:42:31,439 --> 01:42:33,479
Speaker 1: like the way they used to shuffle the decks at

1788
01:42:33,560 --> 01:42:36,040
Speaker 1: record companies, which they've done a little bit less of now,

1789
01:42:36,920 --> 01:42:42,240
Speaker 1: and there are lifers, you know, Louis Messina, you know

1790
01:42:42,439 --> 01:42:44,160
Speaker 1: a lot of other ones. How long do you plan

1791
01:42:44,280 --> 01:42:48,280
Speaker 1: to do this? You know, I would say what I

1792
01:42:48,400 --> 01:42:54,240
Speaker 1: love about the live business very different than the record business. Um. Now,

1793
01:42:54,320 --> 01:42:57,719
Speaker 1: the record business has not produced a lot of entrepreneurs overall.

1794
01:42:58,200 --> 01:43:00,479
Speaker 1: You know, there's been a few big winners, obviously Geffen

1795
01:43:00,600 --> 01:43:04,920
Speaker 1: and you know, Jimmy and Clive um. But generally they're

1796
01:43:05,080 --> 01:43:07,640
Speaker 1: they're they're like the movie studios. They work within an

1797
01:43:07,680 --> 01:43:11,200
Speaker 1: existing system. UM. I love the live business because it

1798
01:43:11,400 --> 01:43:16,479
Speaker 1: is filled with characters and entrepreneurs still to date. So

1799
01:43:16,960 --> 01:43:19,160
Speaker 1: I I do believe one of the strengths of Live

1800
01:43:19,280 --> 01:43:23,160
Speaker 1: Nation is we've just been continually able to reinvent ourselves

1801
01:43:23,240 --> 01:43:26,720
Speaker 1: because you know, the the innovator's dilemma is always how

1802
01:43:26,760 --> 01:43:29,760
Speaker 1: do you keep making your big company innovative? Well, you've

1803
01:43:29,760 --> 01:43:32,400
Speaker 1: got to keep injecting it with some of the craziest right,

1804
01:43:32,400 --> 01:43:35,960
Speaker 1: You've got to inject it with entrepreneurship. Um. And and

1805
01:43:36,200 --> 01:43:38,599
Speaker 1: every day we're waking up doing a new joint venture

1806
01:43:38,680 --> 01:43:45,160
Speaker 1: with the latest you know, um, festival hustler, entrepreneur, venue operator, promoter,

1807
01:43:45,600 --> 01:43:47,680
Speaker 1: My company is filled with them. We have hundreds of

1808
01:43:47,800 --> 01:43:51,280
Speaker 1: joint ventures. UM. So I do find that we've been

1809
01:43:51,320 --> 01:43:56,000
Speaker 1: able to although run a very big public company, uh

1810
01:43:56,280 --> 01:44:00,559
Speaker 1: the entrepreneurial flair and me still gets fed uh daily

1811
01:44:00,840 --> 01:44:02,760
Speaker 1: and I get the deal and live with some of

1812
01:44:02,800 --> 01:44:08,000
Speaker 1: the greatest entrepreneurs, the crazies, the fun the big thinkers.

1813
01:44:08,520 --> 01:44:11,360
Speaker 1: None of these guys in the entertainment space in theory

1814
01:44:11,439 --> 01:44:14,080
Speaker 1: have worked for a company. As you know, the messina is,

1815
01:44:14,160 --> 01:44:18,560
Speaker 1: the Focals, the Dennis Desmond's, the c three guys, the

1816
01:44:18,960 --> 01:44:23,920
Speaker 1: insomniac Pascals, the Ron Lafittes, all the managers. None of

1817
01:44:23,960 --> 01:44:26,160
Speaker 1: them think they work for me. They don't work for

1818
01:44:26,240 --> 01:44:30,640
Speaker 1: a company. We're a federation. So I do find that exhilarating.

1819
01:44:30,680 --> 01:44:34,320
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be able to work in a traditional business

1820
01:44:34,439 --> 01:44:37,040
Speaker 1: like lebat and others, where it was just kind of

1821
01:44:37,120 --> 01:44:41,080
Speaker 1: filled with a line workers. I do love the entrepreneurship

1822
01:44:41,200 --> 01:44:45,240
Speaker 1: that that the live business feeds um and reinvents itself

1823
01:44:45,320 --> 01:44:47,800
Speaker 1: and overnight there's a new entrepreneur. As you know, if

1824
01:44:47,840 --> 01:44:50,920
Speaker 1: he if he finds the right field with the right idea,

1825
01:44:51,360 --> 01:44:54,280
Speaker 1: he can be the next Paul Tollett. Right, So we're

1826
01:44:54,280 --> 01:44:56,920
Speaker 1: always on pursuit of kind of like America's got talent,

1827
01:44:57,000 --> 01:44:59,640
Speaker 1: we're always looking for new talent. Um. We read a

1828
01:44:59,680 --> 01:45:02,080
Speaker 1: fine your self by it and uh and I love

1829
01:45:02,360 --> 01:45:05,160
Speaker 1: being part of that and and um. So that's that's

1830
01:45:05,240 --> 01:45:07,400
Speaker 1: what finds it exciting. So it's it's far from a

1831
01:45:07,479 --> 01:45:10,040
Speaker 1: job to me. As you know, you've got lucky every

1832
01:45:10,080 --> 01:45:13,160
Speaker 1: now and then, find your passion, do it with great people,

1833
01:45:13,280 --> 01:45:17,040
Speaker 1: have success. I'll run this one as as long as

1834
01:45:17,120 --> 01:45:21,040
Speaker 1: it's still exciting and fun. Okay, thank you, Michael. This

1835
01:45:21,120 --> 01:45:24,160
Speaker 1: has been so great. Thanks for talking to our own audience.

1836
01:45:24,240 --> 01:45:28,360
Speaker 1: Really appreciate it. Thank you, Bob appreciated. Until next time.

1837
01:45:28,560 --> 01:45:29,800
Speaker 1: This is Bob Left Sense