Speaker 1: Hey, folks, it is Wednesday, June eighteenth. Today is day
Speaker 1: twenty sixth of the sixth week of testimony in the
Speaker 1: Diddy trial, and jurors keep making headlines. Welcome to this
Speaker 1: episode of Amy and TJ.
Speaker 2: We continue to be your.
Speaker 1: One stop shop to keep you updated on everything going
Speaker 1: on in the Diddy trial and Robes. I say, it's
Speaker 1: to day twenty sixth of testimony. But lo and behold,
Speaker 1: as we sit here, there will not be testimony today because.
Speaker 2: Of a juror.
Speaker 3: That's right, and it's not the juror that we thought
Speaker 3: might be causing all of the headlines. Initially, we were
Speaker 3: expecting that the judge may make his decision about Juror
Speaker 3: number seven, that's the second juror that potentially could have
Speaker 3: been removed from the jury because he was alleged to
Speaker 3: have been discussing the case with a work colleague. And
Speaker 3: so we didn't hear about that juror. Instead, we heard
Speaker 3: about a sick juror.
Speaker 1: Sick, like of all the things I was anticipating, today,
Speaker 1: no testimony. They will not have a day of the
Speaker 1: Diddy trial today because a juror is sick. Now I
Speaker 1: immediately thought, well, wait, what the hell.
Speaker 2: There's been so much.
Speaker 1: Weird stuff going on, so I thought something might be
Speaker 1: out something else strange.
Speaker 2: But this is pretty serious. If anybody has had.
Speaker 3: Vertigo, yes I've experienced it before. You have incredibly dizzy,
Speaker 3: you feel very nauseated. But the thing is, just because
Speaker 3: you have vertigo symptoms doesn't mean you have vertico. I mean,
Speaker 3: I'm imagining if you feel or if this juror felt
Speaker 3: that ill, or that unwell and that dizzy and nauseated,
Speaker 3: that juror probably needs to go to the doctor, maybe
Speaker 3: even the emergency room to rule out other more serious conditions,
Speaker 3: because that could be something much more significant. And so
Speaker 3: because of that, the judge even said in court today,
Speaker 3: I mean everyone was there, everyone showed up, they were
Speaker 3: all waiting. They're going to have to inquire further about
Speaker 3: the condition of this juror because is this a one
Speaker 3: time event, is this a today only issue, or is
Speaker 3: this something more serious going forward? Does this juror will
Speaker 3: this juror need to be ultimately replaced?
Speaker 4: Wow, for testimony to resume, we.
Speaker 1: Are talking now robes about the potential for now three
Speaker 1: of the twelve jurors who started in the Ditty trial
Speaker 1: might end up off the jury and three alternates put
Speaker 1: in that could change the demographics. It could change this
Speaker 1: makeup drastically.
Speaker 2: And who knows what.
Speaker 1: We know one black guy has been replaced by a
Speaker 1: white guy. We know that defense was fighting tooth and
Speaker 1: nail trying to keep that black guy who was a
Speaker 1: nineties hip hop fan on.
Speaker 2: I wonder why.
Speaker 1: But still this is just incredible to me now and
Speaker 1: the juror to your point. And look, if anybody I
Speaker 1: haven't had vertigo, I've been around people with it.
Speaker 2: It's debilitating.
Speaker 3: You can't function, No, you actually can't walk, you can't
Speaker 3: fund look straight. And again, for me, the nausea was
Speaker 3: so bad. I've had it twice in my life and
Speaker 3: the only thing that helped it was to take some dramamine,
Speaker 3: which usually knocks you out and makes you tired. But again,
Speaker 3: I really think unless this juror is someone who has
Speaker 3: experienced this multiple time in their lives, is going to
Speaker 3: have to do some further investigating as to what and
Speaker 3: why they're actually going through this.
Speaker 4: And we don't know anything about this.
Speaker 3: Juror, male, female, black, white, I don't I didn't see
Speaker 3: any details about specifically who this juror was they I.
Speaker 2: Give a juror number right when they were talking about
Speaker 2: on this one.
Speaker 3: We know duror number seven is potentially hanging in the balance.
Speaker 4: Durre number six is off. We don't know what number
Speaker 4: juror this one is.
Speaker 1: And again this is relevant for a number of reasons,
Speaker 1: as we just explained, But the one we haven't talked
Speaker 1: about yet is how big of a deal it is
Speaker 1: because of timing throughout. We're in week six and I
Speaker 1: think Robes, I go back to week two or some
Speaker 1: very early on when the prosecution said, hey, we are
Speaker 1: ahead of schedule. They've been talking about this for a while.
Speaker 1: We are doing good. We're ahead of schedule. We're going
Speaker 1: to be done this week. They told us last week
Speaker 1: they thought they were going to be done today, even
Speaker 1: that the prosecution was going to rest, if not today,
Speaker 1: they said on Friday. So now where do we find ourselves? Robes,
Speaker 1: no core today and it's June teenth tomorrow. They were
Speaker 1: already scheduled to be off, So they're missing two full
Speaker 1: days of testimony. What's that going to do to the timeline?
Speaker 1: How's it going to push it? How much farther back?
Speaker 3: Now? Well, we know that the state. It's not the
Speaker 3: state the fence at the prosecution has three more witnesses
Speaker 3: to call, and one of them is a doozy.
Speaker 4: It's Brendan Paul.
Speaker 3: In fact, all the photographers outside the courtroom this morning
Speaker 3: got pictures of him coming into court.
Speaker 4: He came in ready to testify.
Speaker 3: This is probably the big last star ish witness for
Speaker 3: the prosecution. He was Ditty's personal assistant up until he
Speaker 3: was arrested. Correct or what was his timeline as to
Speaker 3: when he was Ditty's assistant in up to last years?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was reason. But this is the guy a
Speaker 2: lot of people labeled as the drug mule.
Speaker 4: He's yes, that's a terrible aka the drug mule.
Speaker 3: But anytime you read about him in any publication, they
Speaker 3: refer to him as Ditty's drug mule, namely because he
Speaker 3: was a rest did around the same time did he
Speaker 3: was arrested after those raids on Ditty's mansions? And yes,
Speaker 3: he had drug charges hanging over his head. Those have
Speaker 3: all been removed. He is now not facing any charges
Speaker 3: and he is now testifying for the prosecution. I'm sure
Speaker 3: that is in exchange for testifying for the prosecution.
Speaker 1: Yes, and he's gotten an immunity deal already. The judge
Speaker 1: grannam immunity yesterday. But to your point, Ropes, everybody was
Speaker 1: suited and booted.
Speaker 2: They were ready to go this.
Speaker 1: Morning, and this came kind of out of nowhere. So
Speaker 1: I don't know how much time. I mean, they went
Speaker 1: longer with a summary witness yesterday than they thought they
Speaker 1: would go. How much will they go? How far would
Speaker 1: they go with Brendan Paul. He seems to be a
Speaker 1: very important witness. I can't imagine it going quickly. So
Speaker 1: to our point about the timeline, now, we could be
Speaker 1: going into next week that the prosecution is still putting
Speaker 1: on its case and its witnesses. The defense wants two
Speaker 1: to five days. They're predicting that's how long they will take.
Speaker 1: So we were talking earlier this week that while the
Speaker 1: jury's going to have this case by next week, now
Speaker 1: it looks like that is not as likely of a scenario.
Speaker 3: I have read that it is unlikely and certainly almost
Speaker 3: impossible that the prosecution would wrap its case on Friday.
Speaker 3: They say it is absolutely going to bleed over into
Speaker 3: next week for all that they have to do and
Speaker 3: think about it.
Speaker 4: We talked about how dry.
Speaker 3: But important, but maybe kind of boring. These summary witnesses
Speaker 3: have been, so you don't want to end.
Speaker 4: I wouldn't imagine.
Speaker 3: Again, I'm no lawyer here, but I do understand wanting
Speaker 3: to leave with an impression or at least something that
Speaker 3: has the jury's thinking and remembering what they last heard
Speaker 3: from the prosecution's case. And so someone like Brandon Paul
Speaker 3: would be that person. So you want to make sure
Speaker 3: you give the jury something to remember with one of
Speaker 3: your final witnesses.
Speaker 1: One im I say, I totally forgot the other thing.
Speaker 1: They're out today unexpectedly, they're off tomorrow for Juneteenth, and
Speaker 1: they're only doing a half day on Friday because one
Speaker 1: of the jurors another jury issue. They're letting a juror
Speaker 1: go to a graduate. I think, well, that makes sense,
Speaker 1: that does, and that's not I'm actually really pleased to
Speaker 1: see that a court, a federal court, will grant that.
Speaker 2: I'm okay with that.
Speaker 1: But so this is a week that we thought we
Speaker 1: were going to see a lot of testimony. We're not
Speaker 1: getting as much as we thought.
Speaker 3: So the prosecution may go into Tuesday with that kind
Speaker 3: of a schedule, and they have three more witnesses, and
Speaker 3: one of them we know is going to be a
Speaker 3: big deal for the prosecution. And because it's a big
Speaker 3: deal for the prosecution, the defense obviously is going to
Speaker 3: want to take their turn with brend and Paul as
Speaker 3: well to try and undo any damage he may do
Speaker 3: to Ditty's case or to Ditty's defense at least. So
Speaker 3: I think most people think this, yeah, we and then
Speaker 3: so we're pushing up against the fourth of July now
Speaker 3: for the defense to rest.
Speaker 1: Again on Friday with the half day still. We've seen
Speaker 1: a lot of times they come into court and they're
Speaker 1: arguing about something before court even gets started.
Speaker 2: They've been one.
Speaker 1: Day, they went two hours, yes, before the jury even
Speaker 1: came in.
Speaker 3: Now, the court did take care of business this morning
Speaker 3: while they were trying to figure out what they were
Speaker 3: going to do with the juror, and they were going
Speaker 3: back and forth again while the jury wasn't there, taking
Speaker 3: advantage of that to try and figure out whether or
Speaker 3: not certain text messages were admissible. These text messages the
Speaker 3: prosecution wanted in I believe it was an exchange between
Speaker 3: Diddy and an alleged drug dealer. The defense did not
Speaker 3: want those text exchanges in. But as we're on the
Speaker 3: subject of text messages, we found out a lot and
Speaker 3: it wasn't necessarily even what the prosecution was putting forward
Speaker 3: with the summary witness going over text, but it was
Speaker 3: what the defense was able to do with that witness
Speaker 3: and getting the federal agent to describe text messages that
Speaker 3: the prosecution was skipping over was leaving out during the
Speaker 3: testimony understandably. So when you heard what those text messages were,
Speaker 3: this was.
Speaker 1: All about, Okay, I keep going to the Washington Posts
Speaker 1: because they called the testimony dry.
Speaker 2: Was the line that they just try.
Speaker 1: You have to do this is not the stuff you
Speaker 1: see in movies and on TV. They only show you
Speaker 1: the very exciting ima.
Speaker 4: You can't handle the true thing.
Speaker 1: Yes, this was more of a yes. On that date,
Speaker 1: he traveled from here to there. As you can see
Speaker 1: by the credit card statement. The invoice suggests that that's
Speaker 1: what they've been listening to for a full day.
Speaker 3: And they've been listening to baby oil and sex parties
Speaker 3: and mail as scords.
Speaker 4: So that is a big departure, big departure.
Speaker 1: So the defense, I excuse me, the prosecution who put
Speaker 1: this witness up has been trying to and has been
Speaker 1: going through, yes, a lot of that meticulous stuff, but
Speaker 1: also going through a lot of text message exchanges, again
Speaker 1: trying to bolster the claim that Cassie and others were
Speaker 1: not consensual partners in all this. Now, they used the
Speaker 1: prosecution some really damning text messages that Cassie was writing
Speaker 1: at the time. But the prosecution finishes up. The defense
Speaker 1: gets up there and starts asking about other text messages
Speaker 1: as well, and then ask the guy, Okay, you didn't
Speaker 1: why didn't you mention this one when the prosecution was
Speaker 1: talking to you. The point there being the defense got
Speaker 1: up there and used this witness to highlight a bunch
Speaker 1: of positive text messages in fact, that Cassie had sent
Speaker 1: to Diddy.
Speaker 2: We willes. I'm going to start here with what do
Speaker 2: you want to do? The good ones are the bad ones? First?
Speaker 4: Well, let's start.
Speaker 3: I always like the bad news first and then the
Speaker 3: good news at the end. But when we say bad
Speaker 3: news for Ditty, good news for Ditty, So whatever side
Speaker 3: of the venture on, I don't want to make it
Speaker 3: seem as though we're saying one's good ones.
Speaker 2: Using the ugly ones.
Speaker 3: We want to use the Let's start with the prosecution
Speaker 3: the prosecution had their witness read aloud some of these
Speaker 3: text exchanges that are very damning towards Diddy did He writes, Baby,
Speaker 3: I can't say it enough. I'm so sorry.
Speaker 1: Now this yes, very important. I think you're about to
Speaker 1: say the same thing. This is all these we were
Speaker 1: talking about. Here are around that time of that video
Speaker 1: we've all seen now from the hotel in which he
Speaker 1: was dragging, beating, kicking Cassie in the hallway of the hotel.
Speaker 1: But these are some of the exchanges they were they
Speaker 1: shared about.
Speaker 3: That, and this is fascinating because this is in the
Speaker 3: aftermath of all of that. Yes, so, Cassie writes back,
Speaker 3: I still have crazy bruising from Friday. I would be
Speaker 3: a dummy to subject myself to that possibly happening again.
Speaker 3: When you get fucked up the wrong way, you always
Speaker 3: want to show me that you have the power and
Speaker 3: you knock me around. I'm not a rag doll. I'm
Speaker 3: someone's child.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 1: That is uh, that's a tough one, and I don't know.
Speaker 1: I say it's a tough one in that she recognized
Speaker 1: she didn't need to be where she was exactly, and
Speaker 1: she stayed and stayed. Look all reasons that Okay, please,
Speaker 1: nobody take what we just said there as us in
Speaker 1: some way blaming her, nothing like that. But she was aware,
Speaker 1: and it's very very she laid out the way all
Speaker 1: of us think when we saw.
Speaker 2: That video, how could you do this? She should never
Speaker 2: deal with him again.
Speaker 1: He must be out of his mind. And this is
Speaker 1: somebody's child. She is not your place. That we all
Speaker 1: have the same and her line, I would be crazy
Speaker 1: to subject myself to.
Speaker 3: That again, and I and honestly that it makes you feel.
Speaker 3: It's very relatable because she's acknowledging it. She knows it
Speaker 3: deep down, she knows that it's wrong. She knows that
Speaker 3: she shouldn't continue to put herself in his.
Speaker 4: Path basically, so to speak.
Speaker 3: But she loves him, or she needs him, or she
Speaker 3: felt like she was financially.
Speaker 1: There you go, that's the prost without him coursed co worst.
Speaker 3: Yes, So Cassie also texted him this around the same time.
Speaker 3: Nothing good comes out of freak offs anymore. You treat
Speaker 3: me like Ike Turner's.
Speaker 1: Again, another damning message that they went through exactly.
Speaker 3: And then the final fairly damning text that she wrote
Speaker 3: to Ditty And we all know about this because we've
Speaker 3: heard testimony around this big movie premiere that she had
Speaker 3: in the days following the beating that we saw.
Speaker 4: On that video.
Speaker 3: She writes to Ditty, I have a premiere Monday for
Speaker 3: the biggest thing I have ever done in my life.
Speaker 4: I have a black and a fat lip.
Speaker 3: You are sick for thinking it's okay to do what
Speaker 3: you have done.
Speaker 1: To read her words are chilling in the moment. These
Speaker 1: text messages are i mean, ten plus years old. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's just chilling to you know what you hear in
Speaker 1: these At least she sounds calm, She seems reasonable, she
Speaker 1: seems clear about what's happening and what she needs to do.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, so you hear that. The jury's thinking, wow, okay,
Speaker 3: the prosecution is bolstering its case. I'm hearing from Cassie
Speaker 3: from ten years ago to your point where this isn't
Speaker 3: her remembering it or reflecting on it. This was her
Speaker 3: in the moment, And they're damning. But then the defense says, hey,
Speaker 3: I think you missed a few texts, and has the
Speaker 3: witness read texts that sound very different.
Speaker 1: All this was about is to from the prosecution side,
Speaker 1: you're trying to convince the jury like, here is all
Speaker 1: of it evidence that he paid for this stuff and
Speaker 1: she was being manipulated by him. The defense's job is
Speaker 1: to show that she's a willing participant in all of this.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, they go through the text message that
Speaker 1: prove one thing. I don't know, Rose, what is it
Speaker 1: supposed to prove this other side these other text message
Speaker 1: it suggests a different relationship than the one we've been hearing.
Speaker 4: So much about this.
Speaker 3: So let's read them, and you the listener, can decide.
Speaker 3: But it is confusing, and I can't imagine being a
Speaker 3: juror hearing both of these types of text messages saying
Speaker 3: very different things. So in one of the texts, Cassie
Speaker 3: writes to Diditty, I love you so much. You make
Speaker 3: me a better woman, daughter, sister.
Speaker 1: And keep in mind, folks, these are not like in
Speaker 1: the first couple of weeks or months that they were
Speaker 1: full in freak off mode.
Speaker 2: When these texts are.
Speaker 3: Being well, speaking of one of the other texts, she wrote,
Speaker 3: I'm always ready for a freak off again.
Speaker 1: The proscius will say she was only doing that to
Speaker 1: make him happy, and she's only saying that stuff because this.
Speaker 2: Is what he wanted.
Speaker 3: Then she texts, I'll be the nastiest freak bitch again.
Speaker 2: These are for the defense.
Speaker 1: They will say, see, look she's willing prosecution. Same argument,
Speaker 1: She's just trying to make them happy.
Speaker 3: Next text, I bought the sexiest outfit for later. Okay,
Speaker 3: I've been really horny. And then she even references role playing,
Speaker 3: where she texts Ditty this the game starts at ten pm.
Speaker 4: No texting after this.
Speaker 3: I am not Cassie and you are not Sean.
Speaker 2: They were into some different stuff.
Speaker 3: Okay, but you just said they were into they different stuff,
Speaker 3: and so when you say they are into different stuff,
Speaker 3: it really does raise a question about what her level
Speaker 3: of willing participation was. From those texts, it certainly sounds
Speaker 3: like whether she was trying to make him happy or not,
Speaker 3: she certainly was letting him know that she was into it.
Speaker 3: So you could argue that Diddy didn't know she was
Speaker 3: just saying those things to make him happy. He could
Speaker 3: reasonably read those texts and think she was genuinely into it.
Speaker 4: How was he supposed to know?
Speaker 1: I think I asked you this question yesterday or the
Speaker 1: day before, and we've been talking so many conversations about
Speaker 1: this and the complexity of this case, and I think
Speaker 1: complexity of relationships. But okay, is it still possible that
Speaker 1: she could have genuinely meant every word she read or
Speaker 1: every word you read in those text messages? She wants
Speaker 1: to be nasty, got a nice outfit, and she's genuinely excited. Sure,
Speaker 1: but does that mean she is disqualified from being a
Speaker 1: victim on later occasions? Right, and she's not. But for
Speaker 1: a juror deciding whether or not to put a man
Speaker 1: in prison for the rest of his life, that's a
Speaker 1: tough question they got to deal with.
Speaker 4: It is tough.
Speaker 3: And when we were discussing this off, Mike, you mentioned
Speaker 3: can someone have consensual sex with someone to twenty times
Speaker 3: and the twenty first time it'd be rape? And the
Speaker 3: answer is yes, So that is also something to consider.
Speaker 3: I don't envy the jury with this. I think this
Speaker 3: is an incredibly, as you said, complicated, complex, confusing, even
Speaker 3: situation where it's hard to know because if you take
Speaker 3: her for her word when she says I'm somebody's daughter,
Speaker 3: you treat me like I turn her. How do you
Speaker 3: then not also take her at her word when she
Speaker 3: writes I'm ready for a freak off.
Speaker 1: The prosecution argument is that she was doing that to
Speaker 1: make him happy, is their argument throughout. It's how many
Speaker 1: alternates are they speaking?
Speaker 3: I think we said we believe there were six. They've
Speaker 3: got enough, do they?
Speaker 1: Let's hope, because they could literally by this time next
Speaker 1: week could be down three the down one now, a
Speaker 1: second one's on the fence, a third one might be
Speaker 1: in the hospital by this time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, in a couple of days.
Speaker 3: The judge did not mention at all this Juror number seven,
Speaker 3: did he? Because he was going to address that. But
Speaker 3: obviously this new drama, this breaking news of this sick
Speaker 3: juror now probably usurped anything he was considering ruling on.
Speaker 2: Wait, what happened to you?
Speaker 1: Remember he said he was going to address it at
Speaker 1: the end of the day yesterday. We're expecting him to
Speaker 1: address it this morning. What is going on with Juror
Speaker 1: number seven? He keeps kind of kicking the can.
Speaker 3: Well, he kicked the can for Juror number six. He
Speaker 3: let that go on for a couple of days. Maybe
Speaker 3: he was taking time to consider that's fair and weighing
Speaker 3: what each side has said.
Speaker 4: I don't even do you know if the.
Speaker 3: Prosecution how they feel on this or the defense what
Speaker 3: their take is on juror number seven.
Speaker 1: I haven't heard who's fighting to possibly keep them.
Speaker 3: Because it could work against both of their cases. We
Speaker 3: don't know what he said, and I don't know if
Speaker 3: the judge has access to what because one would have
Speaker 3: to assume that whoever he told either told the court
Speaker 3: or he told someone who told someone and it got
Speaker 3: to the court that way. But if they were alerted
Speaker 3: that he was discussing it, the question would be in
Speaker 3: what vain was he discussing it? Was he saying he
Speaker 3: was this or that? And so that could put a
Speaker 3: spotlight on where that juror was thinking, and that could
Speaker 3: cause problems. So I don't know if the defense or
Speaker 3: the prosecution how they feel about this juror.
Speaker 1: You know, that's right, he should take all the time.
Speaker 1: He can't after all this this trial. Who knows how
Speaker 1: many millions of dollars has cost taxpayers on this to
Speaker 1: have to start it over. You don't want to mistrial,
Speaker 1: You don't want to run out of jurors, and you
Speaker 1: don't actually you also don't want to set up something
Speaker 1: for an easy appeal. So the judge has a difficult
Speaker 1: job for By all accounts, it seems like he's doing
Speaker 1: a good job throughout this case, but he has a
Speaker 1: difficult job and he does it. He wants a decision
Speaker 1: from this jury. That's his number one goal is for
Speaker 1: justice in this thing, and jurors keep making headlines.
Speaker 3: What's next, well, we shall see, but certainly we will
Speaker 3: be on top of it. Any new developments, we will
Speaker 3: bring them to you. But thank you all for listening
Speaker 3: in and coming along with us for this very adventurous trial,
Speaker 3: nonel like we've ever seen before. But we appreciate your
Speaker 3: time with us, and we hope you all have a
Speaker 3: wonderful day today.