1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:02,920 Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:10,000 Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you welcome to Stump Mom Never Told You? 3 00:00:10,200 --> 00:00:18,320 Speaker 1: From housetop works dot Com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. 4 00:00:18,440 --> 00:00:21,840 Speaker 1: I'm Kristen and I'm Molly. All Right, Molly, you and 5 00:00:21,880 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 1: I are talking about breasting plants today and sometimes and 6 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 1: sometimes we like to start off our podcast with a 7 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:33,519 Speaker 1: little personal anecdote about the subject you're talking about. But 8 00:00:33,560 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: you know what, Molly, I'm gonna spare you any breast 9 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:42,120 Speaker 1: related personal stories of mine because I'm not in the 10 00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:45,680 Speaker 1: mood for an awkward silence this morning. So I'm just 11 00:00:45,680 --> 00:00:47,560 Speaker 1: gonna dive, right, And I think it's safe to say 12 00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:51,280 Speaker 1: that when it comes to, uh, you know, the bus line, 13 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:55,520 Speaker 1: the conversation with our mom's probably extends to maybe getting training, 14 00:00:55,560 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 1: bra talking about sizes, you know, maybe consolation if they 15 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:04,120 Speaker 1: aren't growing too fast or too fast, whatever case. Maybe 16 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:09,200 Speaker 1: just kind of general stuff. Although breast implants are becoming 17 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:13,200 Speaker 1: a more common graduation present, that's true, So you might 18 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:15,080 Speaker 1: have the kind of mom who does discuss with you 19 00:01:15,160 --> 00:01:18,280 Speaker 1: breast implants. But my mom didn't back in the day, 20 00:01:18,319 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 1: I don't think yet. It was wasn't really an option 21 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:26,520 Speaker 1: on the table, so the operating table, nice pun, Molly. 22 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 1: But today breast implants are the most common cosmetic procedure, 23 00:01:31,520 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 1: followed up by rhinoplasty a k A. Nose jobs and liposuption. 24 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:40,480 Speaker 1: And speaking of breast and plants, well, I think this 25 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:41,760 Speaker 1: would be a good time for you to tell us 26 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 1: a little bit about Japanese prostitute. Right. That's not actually 27 00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:49,680 Speaker 1: as awkward to transition as it might sound at first, 28 00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:53,320 Speaker 1: because the whole story of breast implants started with Japanese 29 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:58,320 Speaker 1: prostitutes in the nineties. Uh. These women would inject substances 30 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:01,560 Speaker 1: like paraffin or sponge into their breast to increase the 31 00:02:01,640 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 1: size of their bust line because they're trying to appeal 32 00:02:05,120 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 1: to all the g I s who were overseas during 33 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:12,440 Speaker 1: World War Two. So we owe all of these um 34 00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 1: boob jobs for lack of a better word, to Japanese prostitutes. Yeah, 35 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:19,680 Speaker 1: so fast forwarding them to nineteen sixty two, we have 36 00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:23,800 Speaker 1: a little lady named Timmy Jean Lindsay who became the 37 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:29,359 Speaker 1: first woman to undergo breast augmentation surgery using silicone breast implants. 38 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 1: And from there the whole industry has evolved. Yeah, this 39 00:02:34,320 --> 00:02:35,960 Speaker 1: is kind of hard to talk about because people have 40 00:02:36,280 --> 00:02:38,480 Speaker 1: mixed feelings about this surgery. You know, there are plenty 41 00:02:38,480 --> 00:02:40,240 Speaker 1: of people who think that you should just embrace the 42 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:42,960 Speaker 1: way you are and be happy with that. There are 43 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:45,000 Speaker 1: plenty of people who will say, you know, the best 44 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:47,720 Speaker 1: augmentation surgery was the best thing that ever happened to them. 45 00:02:47,720 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 1: They have tons of confidence, they feel better about themselves. 46 00:02:51,160 --> 00:02:55,079 Speaker 1: It's very you know, people will find diseas as they 47 00:02:55,120 --> 00:02:57,120 Speaker 1: try and link this too. They'll try and find self 48 00:02:57,240 --> 00:02:58,920 Speaker 1: esteem as shoes they can link into. And that's kind 49 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 1: of what we wanted to talk about to day with 50 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:05,880 Speaker 1: a very scary question our breasts implants linked with suicide? 51 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: And this sounds sounds pretty doom and gloom. Uh sounds 52 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 1: and you can't get any worse, I think with side 53 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:16,160 Speaker 1: effects than suicide. Yeah, so the reason why we're asking 54 00:03:16,160 --> 00:03:20,640 Speaker 1: this question is, Uh, there was a study published in 55 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:24,120 Speaker 1: the August two thousand seven issue of the Annals of 56 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:28,519 Speaker 1: Plastic Surgery that found a pretty strong link between women 57 00:03:28,639 --> 00:03:33,360 Speaker 1: who get breast i plants and then later commit suicide. 58 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:36,920 Speaker 1: Write what they did in this experiment. They followed about 59 00:03:36,960 --> 00:03:40,240 Speaker 1: thirty five hundred Swedish women who had had breast enhancement 60 00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:45,000 Speaker 1: procedures between nineteen sixty five and n and you know, 61 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 1: they ignored women who needed reconstructive surgeries. But we're choosing 62 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,800 Speaker 1: to augment their breast for purely cosmetic reasons. They were 63 00:03:52,840 --> 00:03:55,760 Speaker 1: just dissatisfied with their bus size. And so out of 64 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: that thirty d well three thousand, five d seven women 65 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 1: to be exact, twenty four committed suicide down the road. 66 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 1: And this was the study tracked them from nineteen sixty 67 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 1: five to nine, and uh, that suicide rate is three 68 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 1: times higher then among the general population, sort of startling 69 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:19,160 Speaker 1: three times that's pretty that's pretty huge. That's pretty huge. 70 00:04:19,160 --> 00:04:21,000 Speaker 1: But the reason it's important that they followed them for 71 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 1: so long is they wouldn't commit suicide until ten years 72 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 1: after they had the surgery, exactly. It wasn't like they 73 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:30,039 Speaker 1: were going getting their breasts augmented, coming home, recovering, and 74 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 1: then killing themselves. It was much more nuanced than that. 75 00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:36,920 Speaker 1: Right ten to nineteen years after the surgery, the suicide 76 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:39,480 Speaker 1: rate was about four point five times greater than women 77 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:42,360 Speaker 1: in the general population, and then twenty years or more 78 00:04:42,440 --> 00:04:45,640 Speaker 1: it becomes six times higher. So it's basically, as time 79 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 1: goes on, these women are committing suicide. Why would that 80 00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:52,039 Speaker 1: be Well, Molly, I think that you have to take 81 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:56,279 Speaker 1: into account other factors in these women's lives. I don't 82 00:04:56,279 --> 00:04:58,919 Speaker 1: think you know, it's this whole issue of correlation is 83 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:02,159 Speaker 1: not causation. It's not saying that, you know, maybe the 84 00:05:02,200 --> 00:05:05,280 Speaker 1: silicone in these breasts implants was leaking to their brains 85 00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 1: causing to commit suicide or anything like that. Um. For instance, 86 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 1: fourteen women in the study died from drug or alcohol abuse, 87 00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:17,040 Speaker 1: which indicates there might have been some more deep seated 88 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: problems going on, right, And that rate, it's only fourteen women, 89 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 1: but within that control group, that's three times higher than 90 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:27,040 Speaker 1: the average of the general population. So just these very 91 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 1: small numbers represent huge leaps above what the general populations 92 00:05:31,360 --> 00:05:33,960 Speaker 1: got going on. Yeah, and you might be thinking, Okay, 93 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:38,040 Speaker 1: this is one study isolated to Sweden. I mean, are 94 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:41,920 Speaker 1: we just blowing this way out of proportion. Well, it 95 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:45,000 Speaker 1: wasn't just one study. There are actually five other studies 96 00:05:45,040 --> 00:05:47,159 Speaker 1: in addition to the one that we were talking about, 97 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 1: that consistently found this link between breasts implants and a 98 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,400 Speaker 1: higher suicide rate. Suicide rate between two and three times 99 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 1: higher than than the general population. And within all of 100 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 1: these these researchers found that the women with breasts implants 101 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:06,160 Speaker 1: more often had problems with alcohol and drugs, and were 102 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:09,120 Speaker 1: more likely to be divorced, which are all factors that 103 00:06:09,160 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: can contribute to suicide, right And interestingly to me, compared 104 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 1: to one who get other cosmetic procedures, you know, such 105 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:19,160 Speaker 1: as the nose job, women who receive breast implants are 106 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 1: almost twice as likely to have been admitted to a 107 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:24,359 Speaker 1: psychiatric hospital at some point. But like you mentioned earlier, 108 00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:27,719 Speaker 1: plenty of women who get breasts implants will report that 109 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:30,279 Speaker 1: they feel a lot better about themselves, they have a 110 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:34,640 Speaker 1: more positive self image, So certainly we can't conclude that 111 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 1: breast implants are some totally evil, evil things that women 112 00:06:39,080 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 1: are doing to themselves, right. So what studies like these 113 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:46,120 Speaker 1: have demonstrated to doctors and people in the field is 114 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 1: that perhaps we need better screening before women can have 115 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: these procedures, because even if they hadn't gotten the procedure, 116 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:57,159 Speaker 1: they may have still committed suicide. And I think what 117 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 1: they're trying to look into is what uh body image 118 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:03,360 Speaker 1: issues did these women have? What self esteem issues? Might 119 00:07:03,360 --> 00:07:06,960 Speaker 1: they have had that would have led them to commit suicide, right, Molly. 120 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 1: I think it's important when we're talking about these psychological 121 00:07:09,640 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 1: issues surrounding plastic surgery, we can't project the mental health 122 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:23,360 Speaker 1: issues of individuals to the entire population of breast implant patients. UM, 123 00:07:23,480 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: we do have to point out that statistically, around fifteen 124 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 1: pc of people who do get elective plastic surgeries suffered 125 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 1: from something called body dysmor fit disorder, which causes you 126 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: to obsess over specific body parts and have an have 127 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 1: an unhealthy perception of your body. Right, and so I 128 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,600 Speaker 1: can you know, you just think you're uglier disfasure, which 129 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 1: might be what leads you to get the cosmetic surgery, 130 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:49,120 Speaker 1: but it's not going to fix that sort of you know, 131 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 1: thing in your brain that's telling you, you know, that 132 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:55,679 Speaker 1: things aren't right, which maybe why there's that tenure gap 133 00:07:55,720 --> 00:07:57,560 Speaker 1: that we were talking about when we were you know, 134 00:07:57,640 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: emphasizing the fact that was ten years later and maybe 135 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:03,679 Speaker 1: that these surgeries made women feel better for a short time, 136 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 1: but they still couldn't overcome that negative self image. Right. 137 00:08:06,440 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 1: It was just sort of like a temporary band aid 138 00:08:08,280 --> 00:08:10,520 Speaker 1: that you know that wasn't gonna last, and I think 139 00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:13,560 Speaker 1: it's important to bring up as well a study on 140 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:16,480 Speaker 1: breast implant psychology that was conducted by a professor of 141 00:08:16,520 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 1: surgery at the University of California that sort of debunked 142 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 1: this idea of breast implant patients having some kind of 143 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:30,920 Speaker 1: pathological psychological disorder. The researcher found that as a whole, 144 00:08:32,040 --> 00:08:36,040 Speaker 1: breast implant patients don't have a lower body image than 145 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:40,080 Speaker 1: the general population. They just have maybe more dissatisfaction with 146 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:42,559 Speaker 1: with their bus lines, just are really hung They might 147 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:44,160 Speaker 1: like their legs, they might think they have a really 148 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: cute face, but they just, you know, they just feel 149 00:08:46,520 --> 00:08:48,960 Speaker 1: too small. Right. So we're not saying everyone who gets 150 00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:51,240 Speaker 1: this surgery is depressed and it's going to commit suicide. 151 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: That's not what we're endorsing today. But what the Swedish 152 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 1: study that we were talking about earlier has led people 153 00:08:56,880 --> 00:08:58,320 Speaker 1: to think is that there just needs to be better 154 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:01,800 Speaker 1: screening before women are dergo plastic surgery. Right. I think 155 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 1: most of the the most important outcome of all these studies, 156 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:10,520 Speaker 1: like you said, is um recognizing this need for pre 157 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:14,720 Speaker 1: surgery psychological screens and also following these women after surgery. 158 00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 1: I mean if you have a patient who is continually 159 00:09:17,120 --> 00:09:19,920 Speaker 1: coming in for more and more procedures, there might be 160 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:23,199 Speaker 1: a pretty big red flag that something else is going on, 161 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: that this person is actually endangering themselves. So on that 162 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:31,120 Speaker 1: sobering note, if you do want to learn more about 163 00:09:31,559 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 1: breast implants, we have a wonderful article how breast implants work. 164 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:38,400 Speaker 1: It is very detailed as many pictures. We were going 165 00:09:38,440 --> 00:09:41,079 Speaker 1: to discuss how breast implants a prens body, but you've 166 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:44,200 Speaker 1: got to see these pictures. I'm a visual learner. They helped. 167 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:45,800 Speaker 1: They might not be safe for work, but all the same, 168 00:09:45,840 --> 00:09:48,920 Speaker 1: they're on our site. And the article our breast implants 169 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:51,800 Speaker 1: linked to suicide, written by Jacob Silverman, is also at 170 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:54,839 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com. But morely, before we go, 171 00:09:55,720 --> 00:10:00,160 Speaker 1: I think we need to read some really happy your 172 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 1: email to to sort of balance out this sort of 173 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: sobering a more depressing podcast episode. Yeah, we've got some 174 00:10:10,320 --> 00:10:12,560 Speaker 1: happy listener mail to share with you today. Yeah, we 175 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:17,560 Speaker 1: need to offer our congratulations to our listener Shane, who 176 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:21,199 Speaker 1: is getting married this month, and he wrote in after 177 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:25,439 Speaker 1: listening to our podcast on diamonds and he wanted to 178 00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:29,840 Speaker 1: tell us a very sweet story about how he designed 179 00:10:30,520 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: a one of a kind engagement ring for his soon 180 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 1: to be wife. Right, so, Shane listened to our Diamonds 181 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:38,480 Speaker 1: really a Girl's best Friend, and before he was going 182 00:10:38,520 --> 00:10:40,480 Speaker 1: to pop the question, he knew he needed a ring, 183 00:10:40,559 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 1: but he didn't think that diamonds were a girl's best friend. 184 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:46,439 Speaker 1: He thought they were very impersonal, boring. You know. He 185 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:48,240 Speaker 1: was on track with what we were talking about on 186 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 1: that podcast. So what he did, he wanted something more personal, 187 00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:55,400 Speaker 1: and he and his fiance like hiking, so they had 188 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:59,559 Speaker 1: gone to uh moab Utah to climb together, and then 189 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:02,240 Speaker 1: without her knowing, he climbed back up the hill and 190 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:04,960 Speaker 1: got a rock from the tower they had climbed, and 191 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 1: he took it to a jeweler. Yeah, I'm picking it 192 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:10,360 Speaker 1: up in there. I'll pick it up from here. Um. 193 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:12,520 Speaker 1: So he took the rock to a jeweler, and at 194 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 1: first Shane was upset because he wanted to get a 195 00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:19,000 Speaker 1: piece of calcite out of the rock, but the jewelers 196 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:22,400 Speaker 1: said that calcite was too soft, and then uh the 197 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:25,120 Speaker 1: rock also could stain some sandstone, which was also too 198 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:26,959 Speaker 1: soft to make a ring out of it. So the 199 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:29,199 Speaker 1: jeweler said that he would grind the rock down and 200 00:11:29,240 --> 00:11:32,360 Speaker 1: see if there was anything hard inside of it, and 201 00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:37,079 Speaker 1: lo and behold there was a layer of natural onyx 202 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:40,040 Speaker 1: that was usable for a ring. And so he got 203 00:11:40,080 --> 00:11:44,079 Speaker 1: the onyx, set it in white gold, and then repelled 204 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:47,319 Speaker 1: out of the rafters of the dance club that his 205 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 1: fiance DJs at and proposed to her. It's it's a 206 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 1: really cool story, and she said, yes I would after 207 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:56,880 Speaker 1: all that. Yeah, And he sent us a photo of 208 00:11:56,920 --> 00:12:00,600 Speaker 1: the ring, and Shane, if you're listening, hit us gorgeous. 209 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:04,240 Speaker 1: So congratulations to Shane. Shane is living proof that more 210 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:07,000 Speaker 1: than diamonds can be a girl's best friend. Nice one, Molly, 211 00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:11,720 Speaker 1: So if you have any questions, comments, or colorful anecdotes 212 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 1: you would like to send our way, feel free to 213 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:16,760 Speaker 1: email me and Molly at mom stuff at how stuff 214 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:23,319 Speaker 1: works dot com for moral thiss and thousands of other topics. 215 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 1: Is it how stuff works dot com brought to you 216 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 1: by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. It's ready, Are 217 00:12:33,960 --> 00:12:34,120 Speaker 1: you