1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of I Heart Radio. Welcome 2 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 1: back to the show Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always 3 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: so much for tuning in. Quick note before we begin, 4 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:40,199 Speaker 1: this episode touches on discrimination in a surprising way. We 5 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 1: just want you to be ready for that. Of course, 6 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,440 Speaker 1: we're going to approach it objectively and with empathy, as 7 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:50,160 Speaker 1: we do all of those dare I say, sticky topics. 8 00:00:50,840 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 1: There we go, dare you? Yeah, there's a question I've 9 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 1: been meaning to ask, but now you're astly right. And 10 00:00:58,800 --> 00:01:03,440 Speaker 1: it is surprising in that, like so many things in history, 11 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:07,920 Speaker 1: the most innocuous subjects can often be a breeding ground 12 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:13,559 Speaker 1: for very uninnocuous racism and and xenophobia and and weird stuff, 13 00:01:13,600 --> 00:01:17,760 Speaker 1: weird behavior, and oftentimes these things are tied to works 14 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:23,200 Speaker 1: of literature, inventions perhaps you know, or people that you 15 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 1: can't really always throw the baby out with the bathwater, 16 00:01:26,160 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 1: and today is a great example of that. We still 17 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:32,760 Speaker 1: use this product all the time, especially you know, if 18 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:35,800 Speaker 1: you're like a office worker, like you know, working at 19 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:39,720 Speaker 1: Kinkos or something, or an educator. What are we talking about. 20 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 1: We're talking about Scotch tape, um O G Scotch tape 21 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 1: from the Minnesota Mining and Manufacturing Company is now known 22 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: as three AM. I guess that's for Minnesota Mining and Manufacturing. 23 00:01:54,080 --> 00:01:57,400 Speaker 1: That is literally I learned something new today, and we 24 00:01:57,440 --> 00:01:59,480 Speaker 1: want to start out with a big shout out to 25 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 1: our or one and only super producer, Mr Max Williams. 26 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 1: Did you know? Did you know what three M stood for? 27 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 1: Absolutely not. I never even thought about it. I actually 28 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:13,760 Speaker 1: did just because of another show and because it's such 29 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 1: a huge company now. But I'm Ben your Knoll and 30 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 1: this is the weird, weirdly xenophobic history of Scotch tape, 31 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:25,720 Speaker 1: so we all know what we're talking about. I think, 32 00:02:26,520 --> 00:02:29,480 Speaker 1: especially as you get closer to holidays, a lot more 33 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 1: people are buying scotch tape for presents, right, and that's 34 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:38,320 Speaker 1: double sided that your thing. I don't can't stand the stuff. 35 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:39,840 Speaker 1: I guess I can see the value of it, but 36 00:02:39,880 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 1: I just tend to stick with regular scotch. I only 37 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:44,399 Speaker 1: just learned how to properly wrap a present like last year, 38 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 1: so you need to be you need a certain threshold 39 00:02:47,280 --> 00:02:51,200 Speaker 1: of skill in present rapping for double sided tape to matter. 40 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:54,680 Speaker 1: You know, I'm always impressed with it, But this stuff 41 00:02:55,280 --> 00:03:00,200 Speaker 1: cellophane tape. It's got that kind of eponymous trademark thing 42 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:03,040 Speaker 1: that happens. A lot of folks will call stuff that's 43 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 1: not branded scotch tape just scotch tape. It comes about 44 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:12,080 Speaker 1: from a time, comes about from a time when Scotch 45 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: was a an epithet derogatory term. It wasn't just describing 46 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 1: people from Scotland. It had the added connotation in the 47 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:27,239 Speaker 1: nineteen twenties of implying that they were cheap skates. So 48 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:31,519 Speaker 1: if something was Scotch, it was cheap, or people might 49 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:34,800 Speaker 1: even say, just hypothetically, they might say, you know, you 50 00:03:34,920 --> 00:03:38,480 Speaker 1: really scotched me on that one. Don't say that. To 51 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 1: the point about the unsavory origin of seemingly innocuous things, 52 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:46,680 Speaker 1: you'll find this in a lot of common freezes in 53 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:50,080 Speaker 1: American English, like don't say cow taw, trying to say 54 00:03:50,080 --> 00:03:54,120 Speaker 1: pow wow, or off the reservation, or of course mumbo jumbo, 55 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 1: all of which have these really messed up at amount 56 00:03:56,800 --> 00:04:01,760 Speaker 1: etymological origins. Definitely, I don't say wow wow or how Now, 57 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,760 Speaker 1: anything that rhymes is usually racist. I'm kidding, that's a joke, 58 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 1: that's not true. Rhyming is wonderful, but you're right. Then 59 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:11,119 Speaker 1: there's a lot of things that and and honestly, we've 60 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:17,240 Speaker 1: been called out sometimes on uh potentially shaky racist etymologies 61 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:20,640 Speaker 1: for phrases that are in fact innocuous that we have 62 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: then gone back to look into and investigates, you know, 63 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:27,480 Speaker 1: the accusations, uh and and found them to be more 64 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:31,800 Speaker 1: you know, rumor than than reality. So it's it's very interesting, 65 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 1: especially when you go back and you're using these kind 66 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:36,360 Speaker 1: of like dated phrases. But it's so interesting the way 67 00:04:36,400 --> 00:04:38,360 Speaker 1: these types of terms can kind of come in and 68 00:04:38,400 --> 00:04:41,719 Speaker 1: out of fashion and then in and out of like 69 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,800 Speaker 1: being considered offensive or not. An interesting one that I 70 00:04:45,920 --> 00:04:49,799 Speaker 1: just thought about is um a term that has definitely 71 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:53,440 Speaker 1: fallen out of out of political correctness, referring to the 72 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:56,839 Speaker 1: roma people. That also a form of it could have 73 00:04:56,880 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 1: been used to refer to somebody ripping you off or 74 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:02,800 Speaker 1: are you know chief skate kind of vibe, and that 75 00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:05,840 Speaker 1: term has become so kind of canceled that even a 76 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 1: moth named after this term, the Gypsy moth uh, was 77 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 1: renamed yeah recently. So these these things matter. They do 78 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: also shout out to a a poet uh MC and 79 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 1: musician that I absolutely love, who also changed her name 80 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:29,720 Speaker 1: as a result of learning that specific etymology. So no 81 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 1: name if you happen't her name was originally no name, 82 00:05:33,040 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 1: and then the other word. She just changed no names, 83 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 1: no name. If you're listening, I think you might made 84 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:42,039 Speaker 1: the right decision. Big fan here ridiculous history. I wonder 85 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:44,280 Speaker 1: what your opinion of Scotch tape is. And maybe at 86 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 1: the end of today's show, we're gonna ask how long 87 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:51,480 Speaker 1: it will be able to keep this name. Let's let's 88 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 1: talk about it. Though the tape is amazing, there's so 89 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:58,000 Speaker 1: many amazing inventions that we often take for granted because 90 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 1: we who are alive in two we're lucky enough to 91 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 1: grow up with them. But it turns out producing the 92 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:10,040 Speaker 1: first role of this cellophane tape, Scotch tape, it wasn't 93 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 1: just an uphill battle. It was kind of a feat 94 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 1: of engineering, especially if we look at the story of 95 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 1: the guy who created it. So there's this guy, a 96 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:23,880 Speaker 1: kid really, he's twenty three years old. His name is 97 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: Richard G. Drew Dick. To his friends. He is a 98 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:32,359 Speaker 1: research assistant at three n and he is uh. He 99 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: went to engineering school, but he dropped out. He wasn't 100 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:40,279 Speaker 1: the world's foremost expert on chemistry, but he is the 101 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:45,200 Speaker 1: guy who came up with masking tape, and masking tape 102 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:49,880 Speaker 1: is sort of the predecessor of transparent tape or Scotch 103 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:55,280 Speaker 1: brand transparent tape. Yeah, there's a great article on ACS 104 00:06:55,440 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 1: dot org, which is uh, American Chemistry Society their their 105 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:03,480 Speaker 1: their slogan is chemistry for Life. So I'm guessing that's 106 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:05,600 Speaker 1: what this means. But there's a really good, just kind 107 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 1: of play by play of this guy's life and the 108 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 1: history of Scotch tape. But that's right. This article also 109 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:16,440 Speaker 1: refers to him as a banjo player, as if that's 110 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:20,200 Speaker 1: like a term of abuse, you know, he said. They 111 00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:23,240 Speaker 1: say it was the brainchild of a banjo playing engineering 112 00:07:23,280 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 1: school dropout who had a limited background in chemistry that 113 00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 1: had no idea what he was getting into when he 114 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 1: told a client he could solve his problem. That is 115 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 1: where often the genius ideas come from. Yeah, problem to solve, 116 00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:39,000 Speaker 1: And I agree. I like the I like the idea 117 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:42,360 Speaker 1: of banjo playing as a condemnation. Like picture a bunch 118 00:07:42,360 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 1: of stuffy old patricians in a three m boardroom saying 119 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: this man dropped out of of engineering school. He knows 120 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:56,040 Speaker 1: nothing of chemistry and rumor has it he plays banjo 121 00:07:56,520 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 1: and everyone right. It also make it does make you think, 122 00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:04,360 Speaker 1: it gives you deliverance wipes U. I can also picture 123 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 1: these executives or somebody working like, well, he's in there 124 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:10,920 Speaker 1: in his office or his cubicle. What's that racket? Dicky 125 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:14,400 Speaker 1: gets out here? What is that thing? Get it out 126 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:16,680 Speaker 1: and they smash it in front of his eyes. Um, 127 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 1: you with your ham office, I'm taking too far, But 128 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:25,760 Speaker 1: where man, here's the thing. In the early nineteen twenties, 129 00:08:26,360 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 1: there was a style of like paint for cars that 130 00:08:30,760 --> 00:08:33,640 Speaker 1: was very popular. To tone. To tone things in general 131 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 1: were popular in the twenties and then thirties. You know, 132 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:40,640 Speaker 1: like think of like saddle shoes and uh saddle shoes yea, 133 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:45,960 Speaker 1: and example of saddle shoes. But it was difficult, right 134 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 1: because to get that two tone look you needed to 135 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:52,040 Speaker 1: have you need to make it so that the paint 136 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:55,960 Speaker 1: wouldn't bleed, you know, so you could like literally mask 137 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:59,160 Speaker 1: off one side from the other while you painted one 138 00:08:59,160 --> 00:09:01,440 Speaker 1: color and then you know, have this dividing line that 139 00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:05,320 Speaker 1: would be clean. Um. So this was a problem that 140 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:09,080 Speaker 1: hadn't really existed prior exactly. I mean, you know, there 141 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:11,280 Speaker 1: would be other things that this would solve as well. 142 00:09:11,640 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 1: But this kind of fashion conundrum led to some you know, 143 00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 1: folks at three M and probably other companies puting their 144 00:09:18,520 --> 00:09:20,680 Speaker 1: heads together to try to figure out what to do. 145 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:24,640 Speaker 1: There were some sort of life hackey examples that weren't 146 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 1: really that great. Yeah, the thing was people had had 147 00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 1: a mask off sections of whatever while painting things in 148 00:09:31,800 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: the past. But now this is such a common problem 149 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: that people are making their own cottage industry solutions. So automakers, 150 00:09:41,640 --> 00:09:45,720 Speaker 1: body shops, you know, these classic mcgivers of the car world. 151 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:49,240 Speaker 1: They improvised. They take old newspaper and they glue it 152 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:52,840 Speaker 1: over the body and the windows with sometimes homemade glue, 153 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:57,560 Speaker 1: sometimes medical grade surgical adhesive tape. And they did this 154 00:09:57,679 --> 00:10:00,880 Speaker 1: because if you're a fan of car from the twenties, 155 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 1: you know that you need that sharp line, that sharp 156 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:10,760 Speaker 1: border between the two different colors. But because they were improvising, 157 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: they weren't using stuff custom made for this purpose. Oftentimes 158 00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:19,840 Speaker 1: the pendulum of their solutions swung too far in the 159 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 1: wrong direction. This this glue, these adhesives would work so 160 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 1: well that trying to remove them messed up the paint job. 161 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,080 Speaker 1: Shout out to anyone who's had to paint a house 162 00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:33,079 Speaker 1: when they move in or move out. Around this time, 163 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: three M is already making a bunch of other stuff. 164 00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:38,920 Speaker 1: They make a lot of a braces, mainly sand paper. 165 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: Think of sand paper or for our second and third examples, 166 00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:46,480 Speaker 1: other kinds of sand paper. So this guy drew. One 167 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:50,080 Speaker 1: of his first jobs there was taking these samples of 168 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 1: a kind of waterproof sand paper three M made and 169 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,719 Speaker 1: bringing it to auto body shops to test it. So 170 00:10:57,600 --> 00:11:01,360 Speaker 1: picture this one morning. It's nineteen twenty three, Max whatever 171 00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:09,640 Speaker 1: our nineteen twenties music is here perfect. Drew walks into 172 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:16,400 Speaker 1: this job and he overhears this amazing cursing. Now you know, 173 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 1: the US or American English, i should say, is a 174 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:24,760 Speaker 1: beautiful language for profanity, and this guy is hearing an 175 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 1: artist in the world of profanity. And the reason the 176 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:33,480 Speaker 1: guy is so mad is because they're homemade painting Solutions 177 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:36,719 Speaker 1: had yet again messed up a paint job. And if 178 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:39,440 Speaker 1: you've ever been involved in auto body paint, you know 179 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:41,839 Speaker 1: it's the time intensive process and there are a lot 180 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 1: of things that could go wrong. So the guy who 181 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: had just messed this up. He is livid, and he's 182 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: just screaming, you know, to the universe, the gods and 183 00:11:51,559 --> 00:11:54,840 Speaker 1: everyone in the universe about the injustice of it all. 184 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:57,679 Speaker 1: And this is not the first time Drew seen this, 185 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:00,440 Speaker 1: but this is the first time he speaks up. So 186 00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 1: he comes in and he's like, what do you say, fella, 187 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:06,640 Speaker 1: if I told you I could make a tape that 188 00:12:06,679 --> 00:12:11,720 Speaker 1: will solve all your problems? And uh, here's the thing. 189 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:14,160 Speaker 1: And this goes back to this great A. C. S article. 190 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:19,480 Speaker 1: One historian notes Drew was kind of talking out the 191 00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:22,040 Speaker 1: side of his neck here. He did not know how 192 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:30,880 Speaker 1: to make this, He did not know how it could 193 00:12:30,920 --> 00:12:34,560 Speaker 1: be made. He just knew there had to be a 194 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:39,719 Speaker 1: better way allah television infomercial. And this historian said, he 195 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:42,840 Speaker 1: was just he was just optimistic because he was young 196 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:45,520 Speaker 1: in life, had not you know, sand papered him down 197 00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 1: as much as it does others. Ah, the optimism of 198 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:54,920 Speaker 1: youth eternal and strong and sometimes misplaced, but not in 199 00:12:54,960 --> 00:12:57,880 Speaker 1: this case, because honestly, you know, what was most important 200 00:12:57,880 --> 00:13:00,560 Speaker 1: here was that he identified a problem them that needed 201 00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,319 Speaker 1: to be solved, um anytime. I mean, that's really kind 202 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:06,760 Speaker 1: of the root of most kinds of innovation is you 203 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:09,240 Speaker 1: you you create something that people didn't even know they needed, 204 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:12,800 Speaker 1: you know, like like you've got people doing this process 205 00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 1: that's like literally ruining their their paint jobs, and they're thinking, 206 00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:18,079 Speaker 1: this is, this is the only way, and this is 207 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 1: We've just got to figure it out and deal with it. 208 00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:22,120 Speaker 1: And then someone comes along and says, but what if 209 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:26,360 Speaker 1: I could make a tape that isn't that sticky. What 210 00:13:26,440 --> 00:13:28,880 Speaker 1: if there were a tape that wouldn't ruin your paint 211 00:13:28,960 --> 00:13:31,079 Speaker 1: job and it wouldn't be you know, it's so funny. 212 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 1: I mean, masking tape is useless for for like actually 213 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: sticking things to walls for long. Uh, it's pretty useless 214 00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,160 Speaker 1: for a lot of things. But it's lack of stickiness, 215 00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 1: or it's sort of mid level stickiness is what really 216 00:13:45,040 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 1: makes it work. So when Drew grew up in St. Paul, Minnesota, 217 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,200 Speaker 1: one of the Twin Cities, he spent a lot of 218 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:54,560 Speaker 1: time honing his band just skills and playing in local 219 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:58,320 Speaker 1: like dance kind of bands that would basically essentially you know, 220 00:13:58,800 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 1: gig playing at parties and sock hops. In the life. 221 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 1: He actually got enough money to pay his way into 222 00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:10,679 Speaker 1: the university of Minnesota, but just at the top of 223 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 1: the show he found to be a little too difficult. 224 00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 1: He'd rather be playing banjo um, so he dropped out 225 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 1: after only eighteen months. Instead decided to take a correspondence 226 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:27,320 Speaker 1: course in machine design, which was enough, apparently to get 227 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 1: him noticed and hired by three M. And that is 228 00:14:31,080 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 1: what led him to this moment that we are describing, 229 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:37,280 Speaker 1: this moment of I'm gonna make a promise that I 230 00:14:37,320 --> 00:14:39,320 Speaker 1: don't know if I could necessarily follow through with, but 231 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 1: I feel like between me and and my colleagues and 232 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 1: you know, the know how a three M and all 233 00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 1: the stuff that we've already made, and all the chemicals 234 00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:51,120 Speaker 1: we have at our disposal, surely there's there's a solution 235 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,200 Speaker 1: here somewhere. Yeah. He was saying, Look, if the first 236 00:14:54,360 --> 00:14:56,600 Speaker 1: M doesn't get it, we got three other ends we 237 00:14:56,640 --> 00:15:00,000 Speaker 1: can apply to the problem. He also had the support 238 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 1: of his bosses at the company in general. They were 239 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:08,000 Speaker 1: just looking to diversify their products, so they said, okay, 240 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 1: this is a good idea. Like I've always said, you know, 241 00:15:11,520 --> 00:15:16,160 Speaker 1: probably ninety eight per cent of the of the trick 242 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: to making a good invention is asking the right question, 243 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:25,480 Speaker 1: identifying the problems. So so he starts with waterproof sand paper. 244 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 1: Three m already makes it. He's got experience with it. 245 00:15:28,760 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 1: They use an adhesive to get the grit right on 246 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,560 Speaker 1: their paper base. He starts experimenting. This takes him two years. 247 00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 1: He goes through vegetable oil, different kinds of resin, chick 248 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 1: l the stuff from which chick lit gum derives glue, glycerin, 249 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:49,320 Speaker 1: and so eventually about two years later, he makes this 250 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: formula that uses cabinet maker's glue and glycerin, and adding 251 00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:59,000 Speaker 1: the glycerin to the glue keeps the stuff sticky. And 252 00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:02,040 Speaker 1: he treats crepe paper that's going to be his base. 253 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 1: He creates this product called Scotch Brand masking tape. It 254 00:16:07,800 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 1: it hears pretty well, but when you pull it off, 255 00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 1: this is the key. It doesn't muck up the stuff 256 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 1: it was adhering to. So this is the origin of 257 00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:21,600 Speaker 1: what is called Scotch Brand tape. Now, but this isn't 258 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 1: the famous one. It was the second one he made 259 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:30,760 Speaker 1: that people really grabbed onto. It was he this is funny. 260 00:16:30,880 --> 00:16:35,040 Speaker 1: He would later say. This was serendipity, which he defines 261 00:16:35,080 --> 00:16:37,960 Speaker 1: as the gift of finding something valuable and something not 262 00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 1: even sought. Yeah, it's just that, you know, not not 263 00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:44,680 Speaker 1: even knowing that he needed something and then figuring it 264 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 1: out serendipity. I think I figure out the fourth M 265 00:16:47,720 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: and three. Uh you know there's a fourth the magic 266 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 1: it's it's MOXI. Maybe it also could be magic. Um. 267 00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:57,040 Speaker 1: I completely agree. But I just want to point out, 268 00:16:57,080 --> 00:17:01,280 Speaker 1: like two years working with vegetable oils. I mean, it 269 00:17:01,320 --> 00:17:03,560 Speaker 1: wasn't like he just went right back to the shop 270 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:05,520 Speaker 1: and just like whipped this thing out. I mean, this 271 00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:07,719 Speaker 1: is definitely you know, because it mattered, like you had 272 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 1: to get these things balanced out right where it would 273 00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:13,880 Speaker 1: stick just enough, but not specifically with paint. Probably had 274 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:15,879 Speaker 1: to do with you know, what kind of materials won't 275 00:17:15,920 --> 00:17:18,879 Speaker 1: like bind with the paint and therefore ripped the paint off, 276 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:23,040 Speaker 1: et cetera. So very very interesting and a lot of 277 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:28,680 Speaker 1: stick tuitiveness. Always say but yeah, yeah, okay, thanks Max, 278 00:17:28,720 --> 00:17:33,160 Speaker 1: I appreciate that. But yeah, serendipity indeed, um, And he 279 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:37,880 Speaker 1: decided that there was in fact another use for that 280 00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:42,200 Speaker 1: two years of toiling, uh you know, over various oils 281 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:45,600 Speaker 1: and and and resins. He started looking for that thing 282 00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:50,640 Speaker 1: in nineteen nine, full four years after Scotch brand masking 283 00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:55,400 Speaker 1: tape hit the market. Yeah, yeah, this is where we 284 00:17:56,080 --> 00:18:02,160 Speaker 1: introduce flex Linum company. I love old school company names. 285 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 1: It's fabulous. Yeah, it's like it's like Globo cap that 286 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:11,000 Speaker 1: sounds made up. It's fabulous. I guess know what Colliquico is. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 287 00:18:11,200 --> 00:18:15,080 Speaker 1: So they they had a video game councils in the 288 00:18:15,080 --> 00:18:19,280 Speaker 1: there were a Connecticut Leather and Latex company. I'm trying 289 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:21,120 Speaker 1: to remember off the top of my my head, but they 290 00:18:21,160 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 1: owned video game councils in the seventies and eighties and 291 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:28,200 Speaker 1: competing with Atari. And then they were like, oh yeah, 292 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:30,200 Speaker 1: we don't like to send a street Let's go buy 293 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:34,760 Speaker 1: these uh like toys and these dolls in Georgia. And 294 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:39,400 Speaker 1: so then they own Cabbage Patch Kids Connecticut Leather Company, 295 00:18:39,480 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 1: and they've got a creepy, creepy, uh creepy Cabbage Patch 296 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:47,879 Speaker 1: headquarters here in Georgia. Worth of visit worth the secret 297 00:18:47,960 --> 00:18:51,440 Speaker 1: ingredient their Max's money. Oh yeah, you can. You can 298 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:54,240 Speaker 1: go in whatever direction you want if you start early 299 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:57,199 Speaker 1: enough and have enough money. Check out some of the 300 00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:01,000 Speaker 1: earlier car stuff episodes on the ore gen of automaker 301 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:03,359 Speaker 1: companies and coach builders. A lot of them were in 302 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 1: other businesses well before autos, just like how Nintendo was 303 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:13,119 Speaker 1: a playing card company. True story. So this place, flax 304 00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:17,880 Speaker 1: Lenum Company, they make insulation out of St. Paul and 305 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:21,679 Speaker 1: they said, look, we are we got a deal to 306 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 1: insulate hundreds of refrigerator cars for the railroads. But we 307 00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:32,320 Speaker 1: have a complication. These insulated areas. They need to be 308 00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:37,679 Speaker 1: wrapped and sealed with something moisture proof. And they said, okay, 309 00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:42,280 Speaker 1: maybe Scotch brand masking tape will work, but it didn't. Meanwhile, 310 00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:45,400 Speaker 1: in just that four year span we're talking about, our 311 00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:49,200 Speaker 1: boy Drew has become the technical director of three MS 312 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:54,280 Speaker 1: Product Fabrication Laboratory. Cool. He earned his stripes. So they 313 00:19:54,359 --> 00:19:57,080 Speaker 1: work around the clock, well not around the clock, but 314 00:19:57,119 --> 00:19:59,160 Speaker 1: they definitely put in more than forty hours a week 315 00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:03,120 Speaker 1: on this and they can't come up with anything bub gets. 316 00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:07,680 Speaker 1: They couldn't make something water tight. But then they realized 317 00:20:07,720 --> 00:20:11,359 Speaker 1: they're not operating in a vacuum. No one is. Another 318 00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:15,480 Speaker 1: company you may have heard of, the famously evil DuPont Company, 319 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:20,600 Speaker 1: had developed cellophane, and cellophane is dope because it's moisture proof, 320 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:23,400 Speaker 1: and they thought of it as just like a packaging material. 321 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 1: But another guy at three M thought about this and 322 00:20:29,160 --> 00:20:32,640 Speaker 1: showed a sample of cellophane to Drew, and Drew had 323 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:35,800 Speaker 1: that Eureka moment you know what I mean, Uh, all 324 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:38,880 Speaker 1: trumpets and angel farts and the sky opens up and 325 00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:43,280 Speaker 1: he goes, there it is. He started testing cellophane and 326 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:46,920 Speaker 1: he said, look, this will work for our pressure sensitive 327 00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:51,520 Speaker 1: removable tape. He finds a lead finally, after after butting 328 00:20:51,560 --> 00:20:56,440 Speaker 1: his head against so many not sticky enough solutions, and 329 00:20:56,480 --> 00:20:58,840 Speaker 1: they say, look we have figured out the answer for you, 330 00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 1: flax Let them. But flax lit Them was no longer interested, 331 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:06,560 Speaker 1: so that deal wouldn't work out. They has spent so 332 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 1: much time trying to figure out this solution and now 333 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: they had it all too late. But it was only 334 00:21:14,359 --> 00:21:16,960 Speaker 1: too late for flax Let Them. There were all kinds 335 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 1: of other people who said this will be perfect for us, 336 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:23,399 Speaker 1: a lot of food industry folks. Well sure, I mean. 337 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,040 Speaker 1: The idea was to be able to use this tape 338 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:30,800 Speaker 1: for tape like uses in um conditions that maybe were 339 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 1: higher moisture, like like what do we say, refrigerated cars 340 00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:35,760 Speaker 1: and all of that stuff. So while flax Let Them 341 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:39,680 Speaker 1: may have presented the problem that needed solving. There were 342 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:42,639 Speaker 1: other you know clients for this thing. I mean, they 343 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:44,280 Speaker 1: were not the only one, So it wasn't like they 344 00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:48,040 Speaker 1: were making this specifically as a single client for a 345 00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:50,080 Speaker 1: single company. I mean they just kind of gave them 346 00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:53,280 Speaker 1: the the impetus to reach out and and and figure 347 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:56,680 Speaker 1: this thing out. So by this point, cellophane was hot. 348 00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:59,560 Speaker 1: It was big, it was it hit the scene. It 349 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:03,040 Speaker 1: was being you know, adopted big time in the industries 350 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:06,040 Speaker 1: specifically like meat packing, you know things, and same things 351 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:09,040 Speaker 1: we use it for today, grocers, you know, for like uh, 352 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 1: imagine bags you know, cell fate type bags for produce 353 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:17,199 Speaker 1: and all of that. Baker's candlestick makers perhaps I'm not 354 00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:20,120 Speaker 1: sure about that one specifically, but it was an important 355 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:23,880 Speaker 1: innovation because it was a moisture proof way of sealing 356 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:28,080 Speaker 1: things in, you know, and keeping things fresh. So Drew 357 00:22:28,320 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: now being the you know, basically the head developing guy 358 00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:34,399 Speaker 1: at three m Um, He's got like a you know, 359 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:38,560 Speaker 1: a team under him, and they press on. It took 360 00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:44,320 Speaker 1: them just about another year to make their first marketable product. Uh. 361 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 1: And it was called within the industry and again this 362 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 1: uh a cs dot org article refers to it as 363 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:55,159 Speaker 1: quote the longest and most discouraging months in three M history. 364 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:57,359 Speaker 1: They just couldn't crack the thing. It couldn't crack it 365 00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:01,800 Speaker 1: sell thing. We're getting near heat and it would curl up. 366 00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 1: Or you would try to do some machine coding and 367 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:09,359 Speaker 1: the stuff would split everywhere. It broke, it tore. You 368 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 1: couldn't even get a full roll of the stuff coded. Uh. 369 00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:16,720 Speaker 1: If you did manage to get it coded by some miracle, 370 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 1: then the adhesive would be uneven, would be gunky in 371 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:25,760 Speaker 1: some places and barely there and others. Also, it looked bad. 372 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 1: It was a dark amber adhesive. It spoiled one of 373 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:34,120 Speaker 1: the selling points, which was this stuff was transparent. We're 374 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:37,840 Speaker 1: gonna find out how important color is in another episode 375 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,800 Speaker 1: on Ketchup, by the way, so stay tuned for sure, 376 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:43,480 Speaker 1: we don't we just just a little tease on that. 377 00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: I mean, we know that one of the reasons like 378 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 1: McDonald's uses yellow and red as their primary branding colors, 379 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,800 Speaker 1: as those are colors that psychologically tend to make people hungry. 380 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:58,040 Speaker 1: There's a lot of science and psychology behind color. And again, 381 00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:01,119 Speaker 1: like this is so interesting because who cares if it 382 00:24:01,160 --> 00:24:03,080 Speaker 1: looks crappy as long as it does the job well, 383 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:07,119 Speaker 1: I'll tell you cares is the consumer cares. The aesthetics matter, 384 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:09,680 Speaker 1: and then you want some that comes out looking neat 385 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:13,359 Speaker 1: and tidy, and and that's why so much energy and 386 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:16,280 Speaker 1: research and development money is spent on figuring out how 387 00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:20,200 Speaker 1: to package things. Literally, stuff that you instantly throw away 388 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:23,000 Speaker 1: is what separates the thing that you buy from the 389 00:24:23,040 --> 00:24:25,960 Speaker 1: thing you don't buy. You know, That's why a label matters. 390 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:30,119 Speaker 1: Why beer art, for example, is so very important, because 391 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:34,000 Speaker 1: you know, not everyone's a connoisseur of of of find 392 00:24:34,800 --> 00:24:37,919 Speaker 1: boozes and spirits. So I mean that the choice often 393 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:39,919 Speaker 1: be between one or the other, which one has the 394 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:42,639 Speaker 1: flashiest logo. I gotta tell you, I'm gonna be honest, 395 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:48,480 Speaker 1: Noel Max, all our fellow ridiculous historians. I'm confessing to 396 00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,879 Speaker 1: millions of people now. I buy wine based on the 397 00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:54,639 Speaker 1: stories I make up in my head about the background 398 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:58,280 Speaker 1: of the label. Like I roughly know a little bit 399 00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:00,359 Speaker 1: about wine, but not very much at all. There's a 400 00:25:00,400 --> 00:25:03,920 Speaker 1: cool bottle, I'm on board with you. I only buy 401 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 1: wine from Francis Ford Coppola's private vineyard because that's what 402 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:10,840 Speaker 1: that's what you get when you buy Coppola wine. Well, Francis, 403 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:13,600 Speaker 1: I will be a great customer if you can come 404 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:18,040 Speaker 1: up with really enigmatic, fertile for story looking branding, Like 405 00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:20,840 Speaker 1: I picked up a wine called Chaos Theory just because 406 00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:23,879 Speaker 1: I thought this would be a great movie, and in 407 00:25:23,880 --> 00:25:27,399 Speaker 1: in my head the cashier was not impressed with my pitch. 408 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,920 Speaker 1: And the speaking of packaging too, that's great. You're also 409 00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,840 Speaker 1: a very imaginative person, and uh, I can see I 410 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:36,960 Speaker 1: guess this is being good fodder for for short story 411 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:41,520 Speaker 1: writing for you. But uh, speaking of packaging, Coppola's wine 412 00:25:41,560 --> 00:25:46,800 Speaker 1: brand actually has a juice box looking I believe rose 413 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,760 Speaker 1: that's called Sophia, I think, named after his his daughter, 414 00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 1: the also incredible, so great childhood director Sofia Coppola not 415 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:58,040 Speaker 1: so good in The Godfather Part three, but we'll give 416 00:25:58,040 --> 00:25:59,399 Speaker 1: her a pass on that because we went on to 417 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:02,080 Speaker 1: have a very worried and uh an excellent directing career 418 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:04,200 Speaker 1: that goes strong to this day. But yeah, it's it's 419 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:06,760 Speaker 1: like a juice box of rose one and it sells 420 00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: like hot cakes, those those Brooklyn you know, wine moms 421 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:12,639 Speaker 1: love the stuff because you can carry it around to 422 00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:14,239 Speaker 1: the park, you can hide it in your in your 423 00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:16,439 Speaker 1: baby bag, even, Um, you don't have to look like 424 00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 1: a lush you just look you're drinking like a little 425 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:23,800 Speaker 1: juice box. But packaging matters. Color matters. This dark amber adhesive, 426 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:26,760 Speaker 1: you know, looking all splotchy and gross. Matter. They had 427 00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 1: to figure out another. They had to get back to 428 00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,199 Speaker 1: the to the drawing board, back to experimenting with the 429 00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,199 Speaker 1: oils and the resins and the and those cements and 430 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:39,040 Speaker 1: all of that stuff, trying to write new machine. They 431 00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:43,840 Speaker 1: were basically trying to figure out how to keep that 432 00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:48,960 Speaker 1: that selling point of cellophane, the cellophaning point. Now take 433 00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:50,880 Speaker 1: that out, Max, Do you don't, It's just too late 434 00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:54,439 Speaker 1: that the damage has been done. Um, keep it, you know, solid, 435 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:59,719 Speaker 1: Keep it transparent. They wanted their additions to be literally transparent, 436 00:26:59,840 --> 00:27:02,720 Speaker 1: and no one even could tell the difference. They found though, 437 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:06,560 Speaker 1: that that through the experimentation using a primer helped the 438 00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:13,680 Speaker 1: sticky stuff hold evenly along the backing of the cello tape. Also, 439 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:15,879 Speaker 1: before we move on, I do have the pop Ben's 440 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:19,320 Speaker 1: bubble real quick. So in two thousand seven, there is 441 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:24,640 Speaker 1: a movie rate PG Releases called Chaos Theory. Watch it. 442 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:28,720 Speaker 1: It's starring Ryan Reynolds, Emily Mortimer, and Sarah Chalk. So, 443 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:31,560 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Ben, but you're just doing this to put 444 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:42,280 Speaker 1: Max with the facts in there. That s enough, right now, 445 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:51,200 Speaker 1: Sarah Chalk from from Scrubs, Fame and Rick and Morty. Yeah, 446 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:55,600 Speaker 1: always lights, Sarah. Also, I'm I'm guessing that this is 447 00:27:55,640 --> 00:28:00,719 Speaker 1: probably a low rent like Ian Malcolm kind of vibe. 448 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:05,280 Speaker 1: You know. Wasn't that his whole deal chaos theory? I yeah, right, 449 00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 1: I like them. I like the idea that I had, 450 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:12,119 Speaker 1: But of course I'm not gonna ding anybody. It's just 451 00:28:12,160 --> 00:28:14,600 Speaker 1: a great name. You know. It's sold a bottle of 452 00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:18,440 Speaker 1: wine to me as um as an absolute philistine when 453 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,800 Speaker 1: it comes to wine. We should also look into the 454 00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 1: origins of the word philistine, like our in our leud 455 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:27,679 Speaker 1: Eyed episode. But first, the tape, right, we're on tape 456 00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:30,760 Speaker 1: talking about tape. Not really. This is a digital recording, 457 00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:34,000 Speaker 1: but one day we'll do analog. So it's September eight. 458 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:38,840 Speaker 1: They've just gotten through one of the most depressing times 459 00:28:38,840 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 1: in three M history as far as the nineties go, 460 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:46,760 Speaker 1: and they sent their first role of look we did 461 00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:50,280 Speaker 1: it sell aphane tape to a client. The client loved 462 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:57,480 Speaker 1: it over the moon. But this still might not make 463 00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 1: for Scotch tape history Bigus du pont who helped give 464 00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:06,320 Speaker 1: them this original innovation. Du Ponts have been working on 465 00:29:06,360 --> 00:29:09,360 Speaker 1: their own stuff too. They made a heat ceiling process 466 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:15,000 Speaker 1: for cellophane, and this heat ceiling process greatly reduced just 467 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:20,840 Speaker 1: the demand for tape as a package seler. This is also, 468 00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 1: of course, to the earlier point about things not occurring 469 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 1: in a vacuum. This is the first full year of 470 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:31,200 Speaker 1: what will be later called the Great Depression, not the 471 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:35,520 Speaker 1: best time to introduce a brand new, shiny thing, but 472 00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:39,800 Speaker 1: it's still weather the depression, And this is where we 473 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:50,520 Speaker 1: get a little bit to the xenophobia. So how did 474 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:54,720 Speaker 1: the term scotch get associated with this masking tape and 475 00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:59,720 Speaker 1: the cellulose tape. Well, when they were back back in 476 00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:03,280 Speaker 1: the car painter shops, when Drew and the team we're 477 00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:08,360 Speaker 1: testing this masking tape, one painter complained about the lack 478 00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:13,640 Speaker 1: of adhesive, and according to one urban legend, this painter said, 479 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:17,160 Speaker 1: why are you so scotch with the adhesive? Meaning why 480 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:20,560 Speaker 1: are you such a cheap skate with the adhesive? And 481 00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:24,440 Speaker 1: the other story, which is a little more directly aimed 482 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 1: at people, says that the painter instead told Drew, you 483 00:30:29,040 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 1: take this back to your Scotch bosses and tell them 484 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:34,920 Speaker 1: to put more adhesive on it. This painter, I guess, 485 00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 1: hated Scottish people. Is that is that what we are 486 00:30:38,280 --> 00:30:41,120 Speaker 1: to take this is like based on an insult about 487 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:44,200 Speaker 1: the product in addition to an insult towards the people 488 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:48,440 Speaker 1: of Scotland. Yeah, it, which seems so. And the term 489 00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 1: I think, you know, it was just part of kind 490 00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:54,040 Speaker 1: of the parlance of the time, to to quote the 491 00:30:54,080 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 1: big Lebowski, Uh, Scotch was a racial slang that was 492 00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,960 Speaker 1: thrown around refer any people being stingy or or cheap. 493 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:06,680 Speaker 1: And it was so such a known term that Drew 494 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,480 Speaker 1: felt this would be good branding and you know, ultimately 495 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,840 Speaker 1: applied this term to to the brand of the tape, 496 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:18,040 Speaker 1: initially the masking tape, and then it carried on and 497 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:20,440 Speaker 1: as we mentioned at the top of the show, or 498 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:24,520 Speaker 1: as you probably know if you've bought tape anytime recently, 499 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,640 Speaker 1: this is still a thing and a little part of 500 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:29,640 Speaker 1: the tape that you like rip off that sort of 501 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:32,800 Speaker 1: keeps it from you know, losing its edge, you know, 502 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:35,920 Speaker 1: to like to unfurl the tape from the spool. It's 503 00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 1: got a little Scottish tartan thing on it, you know, 504 00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 1: like the like the nesty hat, you know what I mean, 505 00:31:41,240 --> 00:31:45,280 Speaker 1: like that that pattern that that checkered black and red patterns. 506 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:47,840 Speaker 1: So they're kind of still leaning into it. Maybe that's 507 00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:49,960 Speaker 1: their attempt to just maybe no, no, no, no, let's 508 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:52,560 Speaker 1: just erasure, you know, and be like no, we just 509 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:55,720 Speaker 1: we just think the Scottish people are great. We want 510 00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 1: to we want to honor them and their culture with 511 00:31:58,080 --> 00:32:01,840 Speaker 1: this tiny tartan on our rolls of tape. But yeah, 512 00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,760 Speaker 1: it seems more like a marketing ploy to to step 513 00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,240 Speaker 1: away from this legacy. But I can't say that for sure. 514 00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:11,280 Speaker 1: But to your point, been based on our conversation about 515 00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:13,880 Speaker 1: these kind of pejoratives, you know, and like the moth 516 00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,280 Speaker 1: that's name has been changed, is this are we in 517 00:32:17,520 --> 00:32:22,040 Speaker 1: sports team territory where things get so kind of like 518 00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:25,280 Speaker 1: backlashy that that the team might have to change its 519 00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:29,600 Speaker 1: name the three m sticky ahasive thing, like like like 520 00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:32,560 Speaker 1: how the Washington team did their name for two seasons 521 00:32:32,600 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 1: before settling for Commanders, which was somehow worse. It does 522 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 1: I always thought that they also had a mascot originally 523 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:45,040 Speaker 1: Scottie mctape true story cartoon and boy wearing a kilt. Uh, 524 00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:48,560 Speaker 1: he was true. Yeah, it's true. Scot tape ye first 525 00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:51,800 Speaker 1: appeared in nineteen forty four, right before the tart and 526 00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:55,400 Speaker 1: design and he was the mascot for two decades. I 527 00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:59,600 Speaker 1: think so. Uh. They like, if you weren't around then, 528 00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:02,880 Speaker 1: you probably believe wouldn't have seen that unless you had, 529 00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:06,400 Speaker 1: you know, unless you have very thrifty, elderly family members 530 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 1: who managed to keep ahold of their original Scotch tape 531 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:13,880 Speaker 1: without using it all. It's weird. Though. You won't find 532 00:33:14,080 --> 00:33:17,360 Speaker 1: a lot of this history on three MS official website. 533 00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:20,200 Speaker 1: If you go there, you'll see that they talk about 534 00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:24,920 Speaker 1: Richard Drew and they talk about how important that tape 535 00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:28,440 Speaker 1: became during the Great Depression. This is true. It made 536 00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:31,760 Speaker 1: they were able to make simple repairs to household items. 537 00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:35,440 Speaker 1: You know, you were mending things because you couldn't buy them. Uh. 538 00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:39,760 Speaker 1: And if you look at the website, they do describe 539 00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:42,239 Speaker 1: him as a banjo player. Again, there must have been 540 00:33:42,240 --> 00:33:46,080 Speaker 1: a weird moment in their boardroom. But three M itself 541 00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 1: is not a Scottish company, like we said. It started 542 00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:53,760 Speaker 1: in northern Minnesota and Drew himself. We don't think he's 543 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:56,880 Speaker 1: of Scottish ancestry, or at least not enough that he 544 00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:00,880 Speaker 1: noted it. It wasn't like he was reclaiming anything. And 545 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:06,840 Speaker 1: so if you read the somewhat sanitized version from three M, 546 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:12,400 Speaker 1: you'll see that they they mainly they mainly emphasized the 547 00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:17,200 Speaker 1: part where uh Drew and co. Sent this tape to 548 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:21,000 Speaker 1: this company that made bakery products and their response was 549 00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:24,560 Speaker 1: put it on the market. You can now see that 550 00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:30,240 Speaker 1: three M has used this Scotch branding for magnetic tape 551 00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:34,040 Speaker 1: products for audio visual stuff up until the nineteen nineties 552 00:34:34,960 --> 00:34:38,720 Speaker 1: and after the nine nineties. Around that time their tapes 553 00:34:38,800 --> 00:34:42,320 Speaker 1: just got branded with the three M logo. And now 554 00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:46,520 Speaker 1: as of three M does not sell magnetic tapes. I 555 00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:48,960 Speaker 1: think they sold off that part of the business, but 556 00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:51,840 Speaker 1: they still have other things. They have Scotch Guard, remember 557 00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:56,759 Speaker 1: Scotch Guard, Scotch Bright, and Scotch Light. I don't remember 558 00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 1: what Scotch light is. Yeah, it's funny again. As a 559 00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:02,839 Speaker 1: as a audio nerd um if you're into like real 560 00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:05,759 Speaker 1: too real recording or like actually recording on tape. There 561 00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:08,800 Speaker 1: are still quite a few companies that make magnetic tape, 562 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:11,280 Speaker 1: but three M is not one of them. But certainly 563 00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:13,880 Speaker 1: we're early on and like you know, there are folks 564 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:17,800 Speaker 1: uh in production and an audio production swear by certain 565 00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:21,200 Speaker 1: manufacturers and things like that, which is interesting. Um, but yeah, 566 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:25,000 Speaker 1: it's uh, it's very it's a very interesting thing to 567 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,799 Speaker 1: get in on the ground floor of because what we're 568 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:31,440 Speaker 1: talking about essentially is like a company that was around 569 00:35:31,480 --> 00:35:35,880 Speaker 1: long enough to like see a need in in just 570 00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:39,080 Speaker 1: you know, humanity, kind of emerge and fill that need 571 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:42,080 Speaker 1: and be sort of the first to market, have that 572 00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:44,640 Speaker 1: brand recognition that really just carries on and you can't 573 00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 1: really buy that kind of that kind of brand awareness. 574 00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:50,880 Speaker 1: I have a theory, by the way, about the banjo playing. 575 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:53,279 Speaker 1: Why they keep mentioning it every time? I think it's 576 00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:56,120 Speaker 1: just like this guy was a little kookie. He was 577 00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: outside of the box, you know, he played the banjo 578 00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:01,040 Speaker 1: for crying out loud. I mean, this guy was a 579 00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:08,520 Speaker 1: real maverick. Um. That's my that's my theory. Humanizes him 580 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:12,920 Speaker 1: a little too, uh so more so than that awesome 581 00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:14,560 Speaker 1: joke I made that we had to cut because we're 582 00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:18,719 Speaker 1: family show. But the there's there's something else here. Um, 583 00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:22,520 Speaker 1: we should talk about what made it so popular, Like 584 00:36:22,640 --> 00:36:28,200 Speaker 1: why why it became so common during the Depression, you know, 585 00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:30,920 Speaker 1: when a lot of people couldn't afford to buy cars, 586 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:34,640 Speaker 1: much less get them custom painted into a two tone design. 587 00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:39,280 Speaker 1: Scotch tape was used to mend pages of books, sheet music, 588 00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:44,759 Speaker 1: even rips and clothing or window curtains. Bankers, because this 589 00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:46,799 Speaker 1: will give you a sense of how rough things were 590 00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:50,120 Speaker 1: during the Great Depression. Even bankers were using tape if 591 00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:53,360 Speaker 1: paper currency was torn up. You know, this was a 592 00:36:53,400 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: time where like, if someone needed fifty cents, they might 593 00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:59,000 Speaker 1: just rip a dollar in half and say, like good enough. 594 00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:03,319 Speaker 1: Bankers would tape this stuff back together. Secretaries patched their 595 00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:07,279 Speaker 1: fingernails with it. Farmers. I did not know this when 596 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:10,880 Speaker 1: farmers could even use it to seal up cracked eggs, 597 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:14,760 Speaker 1: which doesn't Yeah, that seems weird to me. I wonder 598 00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:18,000 Speaker 1: if the if they just sold the eggs afterwards. I 599 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 1: don't know, but Goodyear used the tape on its dirigibles, 600 00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:26,040 Speaker 1: which I think speaks for the quality of the product. Well. 601 00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:29,799 Speaker 1: I wonder, maybe are they sealing cracked eggs to keep 602 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:35,240 Speaker 1: them structurally sound because they're hatching chicks out of them? 603 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,279 Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean they would have to be 604 00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:39,560 Speaker 1: incubated and all that, and maybe the heat would would 605 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:42,600 Speaker 1: melt the heat he's ever be a problem, but I certainly. 606 00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:44,560 Speaker 1: But you know, it was a time of austerity, so 607 00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:46,560 Speaker 1: when wee folks were more likely to be willing to 608 00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:50,680 Speaker 1: buy an egg with a piece of scotch tape on it. Um, 609 00:37:51,239 --> 00:37:54,360 Speaker 1: you know, we think of scotch tape or the This 610 00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:57,759 Speaker 1: type of celli fade tape is mainly being used with 611 00:37:57,880 --> 00:38:02,359 Speaker 1: paper products, you know, um to tape things up on 612 00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:06,000 Speaker 1: bullets and boards perhaps, but also the stuff is can 613 00:38:06,080 --> 00:38:09,160 Speaker 1: be a little insidious, you know, the residue at least 614 00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:12,800 Speaker 1: behind or having to kind of pick off the bits 615 00:38:12,840 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 1: of tape that sort of got ripped and sometimes can 616 00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 1: never come off. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean there are 617 00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:23,640 Speaker 1: there are things that you shouldn't apply this adhesive to, right, 618 00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:27,400 Speaker 1: and I think everybody has probably experienced that, even you 619 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:30,840 Speaker 1: know what, back to the original conversation, even wrapping presents, 620 00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:35,280 Speaker 1: if you're like me and you're not the world's uh 621 00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:38,359 Speaker 1: you're not an Olympic level present rapper, then you know, 622 00:38:38,440 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 1: if you try to redo the tape, you can pull 623 00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:45,880 Speaker 1: off some of the decorative surface of of wrapping paper, 624 00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:49,400 Speaker 1: which is why also i've like wrap stuff in pillowcases 625 00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:54,680 Speaker 1: aluminum foil newspaper, like be a little creative with it. Well, 626 00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:58,239 Speaker 1: And there are different strengths of the stuff, right, Like 627 00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:01,919 Speaker 1: we would maybe call pack tape um, which would be 628 00:39:02,080 --> 00:39:06,440 Speaker 1: a stronger cell a cellulose plastic e type, you know, 629 00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:09,600 Speaker 1: material that you can't really just rip with your hands. 630 00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:12,360 Speaker 1: You really you need like a really a sharp blade, 631 00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:16,120 Speaker 1: which on those packing tape kind of dispensers, those can 632 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:19,080 Speaker 1: be a little bit, uh, a little bit dangerous if 633 00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:23,080 Speaker 1: if wielded without the proper respect. I also do want 634 00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:26,040 Speaker 1: to point out to that the Tartan branding that we 635 00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:28,319 Speaker 1: were talking about, it's not just a little the little 636 00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:30,640 Speaker 1: nubbin that you rip off. It's like on the outside 637 00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:32,279 Speaker 1: of the of the tape to the the you know, 638 00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,560 Speaker 1: the little tape dispenser. It's green and black. Actually maybe 639 00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:39,040 Speaker 1: there's uh maybe there's a different color way for it 640 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:42,120 Speaker 1: on the little thing that you rip off. I've seen 641 00:39:42,239 --> 00:39:46,080 Speaker 1: some a blue and black version of that design. I 642 00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:50,120 Speaker 1: mean also, this is not related to a specific Scottish 643 00:39:50,160 --> 00:39:53,839 Speaker 1: clan either, in case anybody is wondering, But but there 644 00:39:53,920 --> 00:39:56,279 Speaker 1: is which to well just just a dull on that 645 00:39:56,719 --> 00:40:00,520 Speaker 1: you mean, Really, a tartan is almost like a an 646 00:40:00,600 --> 00:40:03,160 Speaker 1: identify her. It's like a certain pattern on a certain 647 00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:05,960 Speaker 1: color scheme that would identify like a family lineage, like 648 00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:11,120 Speaker 1: in Scotland. Yeah, the earliest known tartan can be dated 649 00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:14,640 Speaker 1: to the third or fourth century a d. So it's 650 00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:16,800 Speaker 1: been around for a while. Wasn't their original idea of 651 00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:20,960 Speaker 1: this pattern, but there's something neat and I'd like to 652 00:40:20,960 --> 00:40:23,800 Speaker 1: walk through this. I don't want to defend the pejorative stuff, 653 00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:27,719 Speaker 1: but I do want to point out that from the 654 00:40:27,840 --> 00:40:30,840 Speaker 1: corporate perspective, you can see why they would want to 655 00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:35,120 Speaker 1: lean into this idea of thrifty nous, regardless of how 656 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:40,839 Speaker 1: problematic everybody in the United States, well virtually everybody, nine 657 00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:44,240 Speaker 1: point eight percent of everybody in the United States had 658 00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:47,319 Speaker 1: to be incredibly thrifty, more so than they have been 659 00:40:48,200 --> 00:40:52,120 Speaker 1: at other points in history. So it made sense. It 660 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:54,600 Speaker 1: seemed like you were identifying with the common person, at 661 00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:57,480 Speaker 1: least in the boardroom. But those guys hated banjo, don't 662 00:40:57,480 --> 00:41:02,560 Speaker 1: trust them as And here's the inspiring thing. Three M 663 00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:06,520 Speaker 1: during the Great Depression was one of the few companies 664 00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:09,279 Speaker 1: in the world not just in the US, but in 665 00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:12,920 Speaker 1: the entire world that did not layoff employees during this 666 00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:18,439 Speaker 1: time period because they prospered with Scotch tape and they 667 00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:21,479 Speaker 1: took it, they ran with it. You know, they made 668 00:41:21,520 --> 00:41:24,960 Speaker 1: more and more specialized kind of tapes for industrial use 669 00:41:25,040 --> 00:41:30,040 Speaker 1: and for just regular regular folks in their houses. And 670 00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:35,319 Speaker 1: I believe it was World War two when almost all 671 00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,720 Speaker 1: of their tape production went straight to the war effort, 672 00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:43,759 Speaker 1: just like automakers started making working for Yeah, or any 673 00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:48,360 Speaker 1: of any number of other giant manufacturing um corporations. I 674 00:41:48,400 --> 00:41:50,040 Speaker 1: think it's so interesting, and it was. It was a 675 00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:54,560 Speaker 1: lot more common people realized, like diverting their production facilities, 676 00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:57,839 Speaker 1: going from making tape to making you know, hand gar names. 677 00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:00,920 Speaker 1: Obviously not that exactly. You have to, you know, have 678 00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:03,800 Speaker 1: the infrastructure in place to make a type of product 679 00:42:04,120 --> 00:42:06,320 Speaker 1: that was close enough to what you were making before. 680 00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:11,040 Speaker 1: So I would imagine maybe they focused more on that 681 00:42:11,120 --> 00:42:15,760 Speaker 1: magnetic tape for communications, perhaps um or you know, other 682 00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:19,040 Speaker 1: types of industrial solvents or things that would be useful 683 00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:22,400 Speaker 1: in the war effort. But like with these auto manufacturing facilities, 684 00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:26,680 Speaker 1: they were literally able to make like not maybe not tanks, 685 00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:33,080 Speaker 1: but like military vehicles exactly. Yeah, and they would go 686 00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:35,680 Speaker 1: on to make over a hundred different types of tape 687 00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:40,160 Speaker 1: to solve specific production problems during the war, even stuff 688 00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:43,920 Speaker 1: down to like how do you label parts correctly and efficiently. 689 00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:49,359 Speaker 1: This is also the time that material shortages forced them 690 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:54,320 Speaker 1: to switch to synthetic ac relate adhesives. They were running 691 00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:57,480 Speaker 1: out a rubber essentially. I mean during World War Two, 692 00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:04,400 Speaker 1: global supply chains collapsed and this accrelate adhesive wasn't as strong, 693 00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:08,160 Speaker 1: but it had a need advantage. It aged better over time, 694 00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:11,719 Speaker 1: it stayed clear while the rubber based adhesives would turn 695 00:43:11,920 --> 00:43:15,000 Speaker 1: yellow and brittle. And if you've ever seen old tape, 696 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:17,160 Speaker 1: you know what we're what we're talking about. It it it 697 00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:20,560 Speaker 1: gets kind of cloudy, right, and even cracks kind of right, 698 00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:23,000 Speaker 1: It'll start to like kind of break apart. Yeah, it's 699 00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:27,920 Speaker 1: super brittle. And this leads to the creation of Scotch 700 00:43:28,200 --> 00:43:31,400 Speaker 1: Magic Tape. It's the first tape you could ride on 701 00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:34,640 Speaker 1: with a pen, pencil or marker. Yeah, which is cool. 702 00:43:34,680 --> 00:43:37,440 Speaker 1: I guess um, you know you can use it to 703 00:43:37,480 --> 00:43:40,880 Speaker 1: make fun little stickers. I'm not sure what is the 704 00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:44,360 Speaker 1: I mean for labeling. I guess it would be helpful, sure, Yeah, totally, 705 00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:51,480 Speaker 1: and now Scotch tape is still being made by three M. 706 00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:56,279 Speaker 1: Three M is a multibillion dollar global company, but it 707 00:43:56,480 --> 00:44:01,759 Speaker 1: never forgot how it managed to grow to much ginormous proportions. 708 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:04,080 Speaker 1: It's due in large part to what they call Scotch 709 00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:09,560 Speaker 1: or magic tape. And right now more than of homes 710 00:44:09,640 --> 00:44:15,120 Speaker 1: in the US have some form of transparent tape. It's 711 00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:18,000 Speaker 1: been all over pop cultures, even on Saturday Night Live, 712 00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:21,360 Speaker 1: and in history is so much closer than we we 713 00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:25,359 Speaker 1: might assume. You know, Drew himself died in nineteen eighty 714 00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:30,759 Speaker 1: at the age of eighty one, and essentially the entirety 715 00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:36,440 Speaker 1: of his career was spent tinkering on improving these concepts 716 00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:40,799 Speaker 1: and specializing these things. Yep and lo, these many years later, 717 00:44:40,840 --> 00:44:46,279 Speaker 1: the idea has just absolutely become a mainstay of American society. 718 00:44:46,600 --> 00:44:50,600 Speaker 1: Like you said, the company's worth GA jillions. The stuff itself. 719 00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:53,200 Speaker 1: The tape has actually been to the Moon, who was 720 00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:57,520 Speaker 1: used to create an insulation layer for a lunar lander. 721 00:44:57,840 --> 00:45:02,480 Speaker 1: It's just kind of become immortal in pop culture and art, 722 00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:04,560 Speaker 1: just the branding of it. It's like the kind of 723 00:45:04,600 --> 00:45:07,200 Speaker 1: thing Andy Warhol would have, like, you know, painted like 724 00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:09,719 Speaker 1: like Campbell soup cans. I mean, it really is about 725 00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:13,920 Speaker 1: as American as apple pie. That being said, though, we 726 00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:18,680 Speaker 1: do have some parallel kind of production happening over in 727 00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:24,080 Speaker 1: the u K with Cello tape. Yeah, yes, E L 728 00:45:24,400 --> 00:45:27,520 Speaker 1: L O T A p E. Because again, I mean 729 00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:30,600 Speaker 1: sometimes I don't know, it's it's hard to say. Sello 730 00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:38,480 Speaker 1: tape came out in Um the nineteen thirties. The company 731 00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:42,080 Speaker 1: was founded in nineteen the nineteen thirties. So it was 732 00:45:42,200 --> 00:45:46,319 Speaker 1: created nineteen thirty seven by uh, Colin kin a Month 733 00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:50,880 Speaker 1: and George Gray in a suburb of West London called 734 00:45:50,920 --> 00:45:55,120 Speaker 1: actin Um, and it was, you know, not particularly creative branding, 735 00:45:55,120 --> 00:45:57,040 Speaker 1: but they took cell of Fame, which again had been 736 00:45:57,280 --> 00:46:00,960 Speaker 1: hitting you know, hitting uh like Gangbusters, and they replaced 737 00:46:00,960 --> 00:46:03,919 Speaker 1: the sea with an S. So over in the UK, 738 00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:07,239 Speaker 1: they don't use Scotch tape. They use sellotape. And while 739 00:46:07,280 --> 00:46:10,359 Speaker 1: I think Scotch tape was first to market being maybe 740 00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:13,359 Speaker 1: correct me if I'm wrong there, Sello tape was close 741 00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:16,759 Speaker 1: enough that it has its own kind of legacy and 742 00:46:16,840 --> 00:46:21,480 Speaker 1: reputation across the pond. Yeah, yeah, you're correct, because it 743 00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:26,000 Speaker 1: also has become that genericized trademark, people will just call 744 00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:30,319 Speaker 1: anything sellotape and also be much closer to Scotland, you 745 00:46:30,320 --> 00:46:33,040 Speaker 1: can see how uh, they would probably be looking for 746 00:46:33,080 --> 00:46:37,719 Speaker 1: something that didn't immediately insult people if people are insulted there. 747 00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:41,960 Speaker 1: I also want to shout out, you know what, Drew 748 00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:46,240 Speaker 1: made it into the National Inventors Hall of Fame posthumously 749 00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:50,319 Speaker 1: as many do, in two thousand and seven, and he 750 00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:56,000 Speaker 1: never ever forgot the sandpaper that he feels changed his life. 751 00:46:56,360 --> 00:47:00,480 Speaker 1: So maybe we end on this quote from him. Would 752 00:47:00,520 --> 00:47:03,680 Speaker 1: there ever have been any masking or cellophane tape if 753 00:47:03,719 --> 00:47:07,239 Speaker 1: it hadn't been for earlier three M research on adhesive 754 00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:12,040 Speaker 1: binders for abrasive paper, Probably not so good for you. Drew. 755 00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:14,359 Speaker 1: Credit where it's due, but you know, don't be too 756 00:47:14,360 --> 00:47:18,160 Speaker 1: hard on yourself. Man. You taped together the world. He 757 00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:21,680 Speaker 1: didn't say that, that's just and he taught the world 758 00:47:21,719 --> 00:47:25,360 Speaker 1: to sing and play the banjo and play the banjo. 759 00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:32,160 Speaker 1: So thank you so much, so thank you so much, 760 00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:35,960 Speaker 1: Max for advertising Deliverance, which is a great novel uh 761 00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:38,439 Speaker 1: and a harrowing film h And thank you for being 762 00:47:38,440 --> 00:47:42,040 Speaker 1: our super producer. Thanks also to our research associate Jeff Bartlett. 763 00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:45,839 Speaker 1: Speaking of harrowing films, um as want a point out, 764 00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:50,040 Speaker 1: and also Burt Reynolds. UM. I rewatched the movie Boogie 765 00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:53,640 Speaker 1: Nights over this past week. It was the twenty five anniversary, 766 00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:56,319 Speaker 1: and I just want to say, I'm sure this isn't 767 00:47:56,360 --> 00:47:59,160 Speaker 1: This isn't a hot fake. That is an American classic, 768 00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:02,160 Speaker 1: Like every thing about that movie hits and it is 769 00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:04,919 Speaker 1: just it is. Everything is in its right place. There 770 00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:08,080 Speaker 1: is nothing about it that is out of place. Every choice, 771 00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:13,240 Speaker 1: every cinematographic you know, style move, it's just absolutely perfect. 772 00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:15,560 Speaker 1: So kudos to you. Paul thought was entered. He made 773 00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:18,920 Speaker 1: that movie. He was twenty six years old, the jerk. Uh. 774 00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:24,120 Speaker 1: And then Burt Reynolds apparently hated it. Yeah, yeah, but 775 00:48:24,520 --> 00:48:27,880 Speaker 1: they managed to uh, they managed to keep it together 776 00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:31,160 Speaker 1: long enough as though they had their relationship mended with 777 00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:35,560 Speaker 1: tape to make to make an amazing film. I want 778 00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:41,440 Speaker 1: to thank also UH our nemesis Jonathan Strickland, Eve's Jeff Coat, 779 00:48:41,600 --> 00:48:44,440 Speaker 1: let's see oh, Alex Williams who composed this slap and 780 00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:47,960 Speaker 1: bop Let's see who else who else? Well, we would 781 00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:52,040 Speaker 1: also like to thank christoprostiotis here in Spirits, UH super 782 00:48:52,040 --> 00:48:54,000 Speaker 1: producer Max Williams. Of course you already said that, but 783 00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:57,040 Speaker 1: I'm saying it again. Ben. Thanks to you, the Dirk 784 00:48:57,120 --> 00:49:01,880 Speaker 1: Diggler to my chest, Rockwell oh Boy or whatever uh 785 00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:05,600 Speaker 1: it might be, And thanks to you, we'll see you 786 00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:15,040 Speaker 1: next time. Books. For more podcasts for My Heart Radio, 787 00:49:15,160 --> 00:49:17,760 Speaker 1: visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever 788 00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:19,480 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.