WEBVTT - 90 Million Problems… | MiniPod

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<v Speaker 1>Native Land Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership

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<v Speaker 1>with Reason Choice Media.

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<v Speaker 2>Well Come, Well Come, Well Come, Well come, well Come, Welcome, Welcome.

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<v Speaker 1>Home, everybody. This week's mini pod is something that Tip

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<v Speaker 1>brought up on our last show, which was talking about

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<v Speaker 1>the ninety million people who are eligible to vote in

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<v Speaker 1>this country but did not show up for the twenty

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<v Speaker 1>twenty four elections. There has to be some breakdown with

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<v Speaker 1>how we're being seen or not, whether we can feel

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<v Speaker 1>comfortable participating in a process that hasn't really represented our

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<v Speaker 1>interests or not. And we were talking about this in

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<v Speaker 1>the context of d NC party, the DNC, the RNC,

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<v Speaker 1>who each party represents in all of the people who

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<v Speaker 1>are falling somewhere in between are just falling through the cracks, period. So,

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<v Speaker 1>given the compassion and people that we are and in

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<v Speaker 1>some ways the ways that we completely align with the

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<v Speaker 1>folks who don't feel seen by either or anything in between,

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<v Speaker 1>we just wanted to have a conversation about that. So

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<v Speaker 1>she asked, what do you believe in? And I think

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<v Speaker 1>this is a really good question for those of you

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<v Speaker 1>who watch the show, listen to the show, and for

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<v Speaker 1>those of you who don't I'm really intrigued, y'all, honestly

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<v Speaker 1>about the people who we don't hear from regularly, who

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<v Speaker 1>don't feel seen, who don't even want to participate in

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<v Speaker 1>politics because they're like, it's not for me. I don't

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<v Speaker 1>get it when I do try, Andrew talked about on

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<v Speaker 1>the show too, When I do try, the folks who

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<v Speaker 1>I want to win don't win. So where we go

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<v Speaker 1>from here, y'all?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I'd love the conversation around what do we believe in?

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<v Speaker 3>Because I think if we just start small, right, and

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<v Speaker 3>if you tell somebody like, hey, you live on this block,

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<v Speaker 3>this is your neighborhood. And if you're responsible for these

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<v Speaker 3>five blocks, that means everybody paying you fifty dollars a month,

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<v Speaker 3>and you have to be responsible for the budget. You're

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<v Speaker 3>responsible for how these kid all the kids in the school, like,

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<v Speaker 3>how are they learning. You're responsible for what businesses can

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<v Speaker 3>operate in this store, You're responsible for zoning what houses

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<v Speaker 3>can look like, and you give people a sense of

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<v Speaker 3>their own agency about how they can construct democracy. I

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<v Speaker 3>think we have to start there, and I think this

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<v Speaker 3>is what the listener question was asking before about, like

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<v Speaker 3>civics lessons about even understanding how government works, to believe

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<v Speaker 3>in it. And I just think before we, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>ask people to do another inf and thing, if we

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<v Speaker 3>just take a step back and start there, that might

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<v Speaker 3>be a better way. Angela is something you said. I

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<v Speaker 3>wrote it down when you said it because I thought

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<v Speaker 3>it was so good. You said, there's always space for

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<v Speaker 3>our work and not space for our needs, and I

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<v Speaker 3>think that is kind of where I am right now.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm not really interested in upholding the White Man's democracy

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<v Speaker 3>as much anymore, but I am interested in protecting my people.

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<v Speaker 3>The challenging part is those two things go hand in hand.

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<v Speaker 3>Should this democracy fall, my people will fall first and

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<v Speaker 3>suffer the most. Should something bad happen.

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<v Speaker 2>It will be worse for us.

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<v Speaker 3>How we can meet in the middle. And the thing

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<v Speaker 3>is when we win, the country win. When we do well,

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<v Speaker 3>the country does well. And I haven't figured that out.

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<v Speaker 3>So I'm this conversation is a bit premature for me

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<v Speaker 3>because I haven't even been reading like I used to.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm telling y'all, I am so checked out. I can't

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<v Speaker 3>not read anything. So I might read two or three

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<v Speaker 3>things in the morning, but mainly it's like philosophical stuff,

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<v Speaker 3>think pieces like I'm not up to speed on what's

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<v Speaker 3>happening everywhere. I'm just like, who gives a shit whatever?

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<v Speaker 3>I need a break in January. I'll be back. But

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<v Speaker 3>I too am searching for what it is I believe it,

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<v Speaker 3>so I can't even tell y'all what to believe in.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm searching for what I believe in, and I'm asking

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<v Speaker 3>the viewers who are watching this, tell me what you

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<v Speaker 3>believe in, because I need to hear. I need community

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<v Speaker 3>right now to tell me, like Timdy, you don't have

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<v Speaker 3>a right to build this way, is what I believe in,

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<v Speaker 3>because there were people who had even less than you

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<v Speaker 3>that believed in something and kept going. So I would

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<v Speaker 3>kick the question to the audience. I would love to

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<v Speaker 3>hear from you all, what is keeping you going? What

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<v Speaker 3>do you believe in?

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<v Speaker 2>I want to double down on that because I do

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<v Speaker 2>think we are where we have to be now is

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<v Speaker 2>in the posture of receiving, of listening, of having ears

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<v Speaker 2>and hearts and minds that are open, an attitude of

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<v Speaker 2>curiosity and not judgment, a spirit of recognizing that we

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<v Speaker 2>don't have the monopoly on right, and the ability to

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<v Speaker 2>see very clearly that every single person is by and

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<v Speaker 2>large self motivated, that self interested in self motivated. And

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<v Speaker 2>what I mean by that is is I think I

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<v Speaker 2>used to carry more judgment about the fact that people

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<v Speaker 2>are going to do just what they want to do,

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<v Speaker 2>nothing more. And that's not necessarily a bad thing if

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<v Speaker 2>we understand the place that people are coming from. In fact,

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<v Speaker 2>I think all of us can respect it, because we're

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<v Speaker 2>actually doing the same damn things in our own lives.

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<v Speaker 2>It just looks more altruistic because more people appear to

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<v Speaker 2>be served by that. But in truth, the reason why Tiffany,

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<v Speaker 2>what you said is true is so true that when

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<v Speaker 2>black people do well, the country does well is because

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<v Speaker 2>we and this is where the exhaustion comes in. We

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<v Speaker 2>oftentimes have to fight the hardest and the longest for

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<v Speaker 2>what it is that we get, and when we do

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<v Speaker 2>get it, everybody else in the pecking order has already

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<v Speaker 2>gotten it first. We're just and should we be in

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<v Speaker 2>the fight for an expansion of rights, for an expansion

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<v Speaker 2>of opportunity that very rarely, if ever, are you going

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<v Speaker 2>to see that expansion be limited just to our munity.

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<v Speaker 2>In fact, I don't know a policymaker out there who's

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<v Speaker 2>going to say that the expansion is limited to just

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<v Speaker 2>that group. When we fight for it, and it's one,

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<v Speaker 2>it is a win that everyone gets to benefit in

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<v Speaker 2>the largest of take affirmative action, for instance. We may

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<v Speaker 2>have been on the front lines of that battle, absolutely

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<v Speaker 2>on the front lines of that battle. We however, were

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<v Speaker 2>not the greatest beneficiaries of it. In fact, the greatest beneficiaries.

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<v Speaker 2>I ain't never seen a town hall meet and talking

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<v Speaker 2>about defending it. I ain't never seen at the congressional

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<v Speaker 2>hearing talking about how much wealth was built from that opportunity. Never,

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<v Speaker 2>So it is in fact true. The reason why this

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<v Speaker 2>tide lifts all boats is because we're at the damn

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<v Speaker 2>crest of it, and so it dives down. They're at

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<v Speaker 2>the apex, they're at the peak of it. We're the

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<v Speaker 2>thing that dives in first. And so I understand the

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<v Speaker 2>exhaustion and the reason why people want to withdraw. And

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<v Speaker 2>what I would ask people in return is just examine,

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<v Speaker 2>for a moment, as you go throughout your day, how

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<v Speaker 2>many other people, how many other bodies, decision making bodies,

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<v Speaker 2>how many entities outside of yourself are really dictating your actions.

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<v Speaker 2>When you're working, you're working to pay a bill to

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<v Speaker 2>somebody when you're at the when you're exhausted by the

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<v Speaker 2>fact that there's not a grocery store local and so

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<v Speaker 2>you're spending more gas to travel across the town just

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<v Speaker 2>to get to a decent grosser Consider all the people

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<v Speaker 2>who are making decisions about the things that you and

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<v Speaker 2>I do every single day outside of us. And then

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<v Speaker 2>the reason why Tiffany I say, don't rush back into

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<v Speaker 2>the news in the day of and what's happening right

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<v Speaker 2>now is because our focus and emphasis on the what's

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<v Speaker 2>happening from moment to moment extracts us from the place

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<v Speaker 2>where we really need to be, which is in a

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<v Speaker 2>place of thought and maybe in a place of imagination

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<v Speaker 2>and a place of curiosity, because we're only dealing with

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<v Speaker 2>the brass tacks. And the way that we I think,

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<v Speaker 2>re engage people is by allowing us together, first individually

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<v Speaker 2>and then collectively to dream and more dreams then beget

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<v Speaker 2>more beliefs, then beget more tactical things to do, then

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<v Speaker 2>begets more actions. And so I right now the posture

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<v Speaker 2>has to be I think, listening, and then I think

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<v Speaker 2>it has to be walking away with a much clearer

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<v Speaker 2>understanding of where people are and from their build an

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<v Speaker 2>agenda and a plan of action that gets us to free.

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<v Speaker 1>I think that's so good. I'm stuck on when you

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<v Speaker 1>said people are largely self interested and self motivated. And

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<v Speaker 1>I'm stuck there because you know, we also did a

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<v Speaker 1>mini pod on like convincing, like if you're trying to

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<v Speaker 1>convince or not, I'm always trying to convince, even even

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<v Speaker 1>be dead wrong. And I'm still going trying to convince

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<v Speaker 1>you to my position till I figure out I'm ry

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<v Speaker 1>and be like my bad. But the thing that I'm

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<v Speaker 1>stuck on is this idea of people being largely self

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<v Speaker 1>interested and self motivated. Because I was raised with the understanding,

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<v Speaker 1>well the belief that we are all inextricably linked, and

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<v Speaker 1>I was thinking about this conversation we had in Tunica, Mississippi.

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<v Speaker 1>The CBC Institute convence there every year, and during the

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<v Speaker 1>policy conference, we did a showing of Parchment, the Parchment documentary,

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<v Speaker 1>and the mayor in that area I'm sorry, he was

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<v Speaker 1>a state legislator in that area did a panel with us,

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<v Speaker 1>and afterwards what we talked about was industry going into

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<v Speaker 1>the Mississippi Delta so that people wouldn't have to work

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<v Speaker 1>at Parchment Prison And why were we having that conversation. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>this elected official was saying to us that he cannot

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<v Speaker 1>support the closing of this prison where you know, folks'

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<v Speaker 1>rights have been violated day after day, there's been death

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<v Speaker 1>after death, deplorable, horrible, awful, inhumane conditions. But he can't

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<v Speaker 1>support the closing of that because the delta is already

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<v Speaker 1>poor and there was nowhere for people to go. And

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<v Speaker 1>so you understand that, but it's like at what cost.

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<v Speaker 1>Like we're talking about jobs versus life or death, and

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<v Speaker 1>he's talking about if they're not working, then hunger then whatever.

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<v Speaker 1>It could also lead to death. And so there's this

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<v Speaker 1>hierarchy that we often are moving through through and we

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<v Speaker 1>flatten these conversations so much so that they're black or

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<v Speaker 1>white and there's no gray, and there always is gray.

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<v Speaker 1>But andrew to the point of imagination. There was no imagination.

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<v Speaker 1>It was like parchment or bust. It was like that

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<v Speaker 1>is the only pathway.

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<v Speaker 2>Imagination is a privilege.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, oh wow, imagination is a privilege. Yeah wow, yeah

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<v Speaker 3>it is. I just want to punctuate that context because

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<v Speaker 3>everybody may not be familiar with the lack of humanity

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<v Speaker 3>that was happening at Parchman is. If you haven't seen

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<v Speaker 3>a documentary is happening, Thank you is happening. I encourage

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<v Speaker 3>you to watch that documentary because when you have somebody

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<v Speaker 3>in your own community who looks like us, who saying no,

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<v Speaker 3>I have to keep up this institution, a black oppression

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<v Speaker 3>and enslavement, living in the worst possible conditions, because the

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<v Speaker 3>overseers will lose their job and that will lead to more.

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<v Speaker 3>I mean that showed you how truly.

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<v Speaker 2>Because us we have to eat the because the because

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<v Speaker 2>I have to put food on the table, I have

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<v Speaker 2>to pay the bills. And while I have compassion for

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<v Speaker 2>those people, this is the self interested piece that I mentioned,

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<v Speaker 2>and all of us have it. We have to eat first.

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<v Speaker 2>We have to eat first. I cannot feed you. We

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<v Speaker 2>have to eat first. Why because our body will demand it,

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<v Speaker 2>will it will force us to do it. This is

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<v Speaker 2>what Maslow's hierarchy of needs is all about. Right, food, shelter, safety, security,

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<v Speaker 2>You will do those things before I can ever step

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<v Speaker 2>outside to care for you. You will do that for

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<v Speaker 2>yourself first. It's so it is not only a privilege

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<v Speaker 2>to sort of imagine, but it is also a privilege

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<v Speaker 2>to be able to think outside of yourself, to have

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<v Speaker 2>considerations outside of yourself, and then next to yourself, your

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<v Speaker 2>house and home.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's not Imagination is absolutely a privilege. It was

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<v Speaker 1>chilling when you said that, But it's also necessary, Like,

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<v Speaker 1>there is no way for us to be a truly

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<v Speaker 1>liberated people without imagination. We have to believe there is

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<v Speaker 1>another way. We have to There's a book called how

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<v Speaker 1>to Get to Yes. We have to get to Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>and I know it is so hard when systemically you

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<v Speaker 1>see over and over, we see over and over there

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<v Speaker 1>is no other way out our freedom. I was talking

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<v Speaker 1>to my book editor yesterday, but our freedom is literally

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<v Speaker 1>the way that we view freedom as black people. When

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<v Speaker 1>I say we am talking about black folks, we see

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<v Speaker 1>it within the context of oppression. We don't see freedom

0:13:45.040 --> 0:13:48.360
<v Speaker 1>outside of I just want to live. I just want

0:13:48.360 --> 0:13:51.240
<v Speaker 1>to survive. I just want to be left alone. You know,

0:13:51.440 --> 0:13:53.720
<v Speaker 1>even in the moments where our freedom has just been

0:13:54.040 --> 0:13:57.320
<v Speaker 1>leaving us alone, that has been in the context of

0:13:57.360 --> 0:14:02.120
<v Speaker 1>the trauma that is resulting from slavery and oppression of

0:14:02.200 --> 0:14:05.640
<v Speaker 1>being a stolen people. So it's hard to talk about

0:14:06.600 --> 0:14:10.440
<v Speaker 1>imagination when our existence has been shaped through the lens

0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:12.000
<v Speaker 1>of trauma.

0:14:12.040 --> 0:14:16.400
<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, and the contrast to what's different is always going

0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:19.600
<v Speaker 2>to be toy by the means of what he already acts.

0:14:20.360 --> 0:14:23.000
<v Speaker 2>So your ability to think about what's different is almost

0:14:23.040 --> 0:14:26.880
<v Speaker 2>always going to be juxtaposed to what exists versus what

0:14:26.920 --> 0:14:30.160
<v Speaker 2>if we had a blank slab, what if there was

0:14:30.280 --> 0:14:35.000
<v Speaker 2>no before this? And then what might I create? Because

0:14:35.040 --> 0:14:37.720
<v Speaker 2>I might not have a five day work week, if

0:14:37.760 --> 0:14:42.480
<v Speaker 2>I were dealing from scratch, I might not the world

0:14:42.600 --> 0:14:45.240
<v Speaker 2>might not exist. That my healthcare be tied to a

0:14:45.320 --> 0:14:49.320
<v Speaker 2>job that I have, that my retirement and pension is

0:14:49.400 --> 0:14:53.720
<v Speaker 2>tied to a place where I work, versus my existence

0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:56.440
<v Speaker 2>on this earth entitles me to a certain set of things,

0:14:57.720 --> 0:15:00.320
<v Speaker 2>and then a structure gets built to then support that.

0:15:02.640 --> 0:15:10.200
<v Speaker 2>So you're so right about the hostage, but also the

0:15:10.280 --> 0:15:15.680
<v Speaker 2>imprisonment of our minds that exists and without even our knowing,

0:15:16.600 --> 0:15:20.640
<v Speaker 2>without us being conscious to the imprisonment. It was Cartagie

0:15:20.640 --> 0:15:23.320
<v Speaker 2>Woodson who says, you know, if you tell a man

0:15:23.360 --> 0:15:27.040
<v Speaker 2>to go to the back door, and if he goes

0:15:27.080 --> 0:15:29.080
<v Speaker 2>to the back door and there is no back door,

0:15:29.080 --> 0:15:32.760
<v Speaker 2>he will cut one out for its special purpose. Why,

0:15:33.320 --> 0:15:37.560
<v Speaker 2>because it's education makes it necessary. This was him framing

0:15:37.600 --> 0:15:40.160
<v Speaker 2>the black man. Right, we know to go to the

0:15:40.160 --> 0:15:42.120
<v Speaker 2>back door, and if there is no back door, we

0:15:42.160 --> 0:15:46.440
<v Speaker 2>will cut one out create that back door there. Because

0:15:46.680 --> 0:15:50.160
<v Speaker 2>our education, the way we have been taught through life,

0:15:50.160 --> 0:15:52.800
<v Speaker 2>through generation, through the ancestor, is this is our this

0:15:52.880 --> 0:15:56.000
<v Speaker 2>is our proper place. And if we have the ability,

0:15:56.040 --> 0:16:01.800
<v Speaker 2>the freedom to extricate ourselves from that and to imagine

0:16:01.800 --> 0:16:05.920
<v Speaker 2>not in juxtaposition to the conditions that we have lived in,

0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:11.680
<v Speaker 2>but in relationship to nothing except our highest hopes and

0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:15.720
<v Speaker 2>dreams for ourselves, and let it go from there. And

0:16:15.760 --> 0:16:18.720
<v Speaker 2>there's still there's still extrication that will have to be done,

0:16:18.840 --> 0:16:23.840
<v Speaker 2>even at that point, because the bonds, the blood is

0:16:23.880 --> 0:16:31.320
<v Speaker 2>so deep, the soil is it is, it's wet from

0:16:31.320 --> 0:16:36.880
<v Speaker 2>the blood of our ancestors. Even still, so it's deep,

0:16:37.240 --> 0:16:39.960
<v Speaker 2>you know, the like we talk about generational trauma. We

0:16:39.960 --> 0:16:42.400
<v Speaker 2>can't even name the thing that happened, but we're still

0:16:42.440 --> 0:16:48.320
<v Speaker 2>reeling from it, right, it's wild. Well, we so listening,

0:16:48.360 --> 0:16:49.600
<v Speaker 2>I think, is where we are, y'all.

0:16:49.680 --> 0:16:51.600
<v Speaker 1>Well, we still have to listen. We want to hear

0:16:51.640 --> 0:16:54.920
<v Speaker 1>from you all. This is so deep. We you know,

0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:58.280
<v Speaker 1>we don't have enough time to We barely scratch the surface,

0:16:58.280 --> 0:17:01.120
<v Speaker 1>but it's an ongoing conversation. All of us in our

0:17:01.200 --> 0:17:05.000
<v Speaker 1>individual chat were talking about it when we are, you know,

0:17:05.080 --> 0:17:07.520
<v Speaker 1>with our family members and friends. We're talking about it,

0:17:07.520 --> 0:17:09.359
<v Speaker 1>and we're certainly talking about it with you all and

0:17:09.440 --> 0:17:14.320
<v Speaker 1>want to continue to explore this with our Native lamppodfam.

0:17:14.440 --> 0:17:15.240
<v Speaker 1>So thank you so much.

0:17:15.359 --> 0:17:16.560
<v Speaker 2>Welcome home All us run.

0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:33.439
<v Speaker 1>Native Lampod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership with

0:17:33.600 --> 0:17:37.439
<v Speaker 1>Reason Choice Media. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the

0:17:37.440 --> 0:17:41.200
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