1 00:00:06,360 --> 00:00:10,640 Speaker 1: A gorgeous young brunette beauty Heather Mac, age twenty five, 2 00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:15,160 Speaker 1: says she is afraid to come back to the US 3 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 1: from Bolly because of what her daughter, her little girl, 4 00:00:20,560 --> 00:00:24,440 Speaker 1: might find out about mommy's reputation, what it might say 5 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:27,920 Speaker 1: about her online. Well, you know what, Heather Mac, You 6 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:32,360 Speaker 1: should have thought about that before you murdered your mother 7 00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:38,840 Speaker 1: and stuffed her oozing body into a suitcase. Says nobody asked. 8 00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 1: That's my advice. Don't worry about your reputation. Now it's 9 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:46,559 Speaker 1: too late for that, Heather Mack, you better be worried 10 00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:51,120 Speaker 1: about hopefully getting out of jail someday from your Bolly 11 00:00:51,240 --> 00:01:04,320 Speaker 1: prison cell. Well, I'm afraid to tell you. Heather Mac 12 00:01:04,560 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 1: is set to walk free after brutally murdering her own mother, 13 00:01:10,360 --> 00:01:13,280 Speaker 1: who had done nothing but take care of her, doting 14 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:18,560 Speaker 1: on her, spoiling her her whole life, murders her, stuffs 15 00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:21,080 Speaker 1: her in a suitcase, leaves her out in front of 16 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:25,199 Speaker 1: a hotel for the bellboy to find, and now she's 17 00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 1: worried about her reputation. Okay, how did this whole thing 18 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:33,399 Speaker 1: get started? Take a listen to this. Two neighbors who 19 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:35,280 Speaker 1: did not want to go on camera, tell me that 20 00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:39,000 Speaker 1: Sheila von weis Mac lived inside this oak park Holm 21 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:42,399 Speaker 1: for many, many years, but she moved about a year ago, 22 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:46,200 Speaker 1: selling it to a developer. While this morning, neighbors here 23 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 1: are horrified to hear of her murder. Police officials say 24 00:01:50,080 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 1: the remains were stuff into a suitcase and found on 25 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:57,480 Speaker 1: the Indonesian resort island of Bali. The discovery was made Tuesday. 26 00:01:57,600 --> 00:02:00,559 Speaker 1: The body was inside the trunk of a taxi parked 27 00:02:00,560 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 1: in front of the upscale Saint Regis Hotel. She was 28 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: half naked with wounds to her head, according to police, 29 00:02:07,280 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 1: half naked, beaten about the head. Her bloody bodies crammed 30 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 1: into a suitcase and left outside of a hotel about 31 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:18,160 Speaker 1: the Saint Regis. Wasn't too happy to see a suitcase 32 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 1: with blood easing out. You were just hearing reporter Jessica 33 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 1: Dnofrio ABC seven. We're talking about the murdered victim. But 34 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:34,280 Speaker 1: who was the murdered victim in life? Sheila Vanuis Mack. 35 00:02:35,080 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at crime Online. Friends 36 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:39,400 Speaker 1: describe she live on weiss Mack as a lovely and 37 00:02:39,440 --> 00:02:43,160 Speaker 1: cultured woman, well connected politically. Before her marriage, she was 38 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 1: a political science student at Simmons College in Boston. She 39 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:50,040 Speaker 1: took a job working for Senator Ted Kennedy doing research 40 00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:53,079 Speaker 1: and other odd jobs. She told friends she even poured 41 00:02:53,120 --> 00:02:56,160 Speaker 1: tea for Rose Kennedy a time or two. After leaving 42 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:59,639 Speaker 1: Senator Kennedy's camp, Sheila went to work for Jackie Kennedy. 43 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:03,119 Speaker 1: While studying for a PhD at the University of Chicago, 44 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:06,680 Speaker 1: she was friends with famed novelist Saul Bellow, who was 45 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 1: awarded a Pulitzer Prize, the Nobel Prize for Literature, and 46 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:16,880 Speaker 1: the National Medal of Arts. Wow, that's pretty impressive. So 47 00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:19,640 Speaker 1: that's the mom has found stuffed in a suitcase. But 48 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:24,400 Speaker 1: who is Heather Mack's father? Listen to this? James Mack 49 00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 1: was a well known educator, composer, and arranger. He first 50 00:03:28,240 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 1: taught jazz studies at Crane Junior College, Chicago's oldest city college. 51 00:03:33,360 --> 00:03:35,840 Speaker 1: Mac is credited for teaching a generation of up and 52 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 1: coming musicians who would go on to become internationally famous, 53 00:03:39,840 --> 00:03:42,240 Speaker 1: including some of the founding members of Earth Wind and 54 00:03:42,320 --> 00:03:46,640 Speaker 1: Fire and others who were longtime session players for Muddy Waters, 55 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:50,680 Speaker 1: BB King, Phil Collins, and others. He also moonlighted as 56 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:54,480 Speaker 1: an arranger and producer for record labels including Chess Capital 57 00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: and Columbia, and served as a guest conductor for the 58 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 1: Chicago Synthhon New Orchestra. Mac already had a son and 59 00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 1: four daughters by two previous marriages when he married Sheila 60 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:08,680 Speaker 1: von Weiss, twenty two years his junior, at the age 61 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 1: of sixty six, despite having health problems, Mac became a 62 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:17,039 Speaker 1: new dad. Wow, so both parents brilliant in their own way. 63 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 1: She a very cultured, sophisticated, educated woman married too, a 64 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:28,560 Speaker 1: jazz star, a composer and arranger. You know, before I 65 00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:30,400 Speaker 1: introduced the whole panel, I just got to ask, is 66 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:33,839 Speaker 1: Cheryl McCollum, director of the Cold Case Restarch Institute and 67 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:40,479 Speaker 1: forensics expert, how can two such wonderful, brilliant parents have 68 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:45,559 Speaker 1: a devil spawn like Heather Mack? How does that happen? 69 00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:49,920 Speaker 1: This is a very unusual case. It's a very unusual situation. 70 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:53,600 Speaker 1: Normally you do not see this in a homicide case 71 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 1: of this magnitude. So we know about the mom, we 72 00:04:56,760 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 1: know about the dad. What about the area here? Did 73 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:02,920 Speaker 1: this child who turns into a killer? Let me tell 74 00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: you match side killing her mother is very, very rares, parenthicide. 75 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,240 Speaker 1: Listen to this. The mac holme was well known by 76 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:16,760 Speaker 1: Oak Park Police. Between January two thousand and four and 77 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:21,120 Speaker 1: June twenty thirteen, officers responded to eighty six calls on 78 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:25,720 Speaker 1: a variety of charges, including domestic violence, theft, missing person, 79 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:29,760 Speaker 1: and nine hang ups. The relationship between mother and daughter 80 00:05:29,880 --> 00:05:33,599 Speaker 1: was tenuous. Coo County juvenile records show that Heathermack was 81 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:38,839 Speaker 1: arrested in December two eleven on domestic battery, aggravated battery, 82 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:42,919 Speaker 1: and battery charges involving violence against her mother. Many of 83 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:47,120 Speaker 1: the calls before this incidents included alleged physical violence against 84 00:05:47,240 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 1: she live on wis Mack, such as biting, punching, and hitting. 85 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: Reports say one incident caused the mom to break her arm. 86 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:58,880 Speaker 1: A guilty verdict lended heathermac in mandatory counseling with a 87 00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:04,960 Speaker 1: focus on your management. WHOA why did they call it 88 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 1: a tenuous relationship between mother and daughter? This girl was 89 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:15,240 Speaker 1: beating the hdble l out of her own mother. Did 90 00:06:15,240 --> 00:06:18,200 Speaker 1: you hear that? Eighty six calls to the home. And 91 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:21,479 Speaker 1: this is a very ritzy area. It's a mansion there, 92 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:25,480 Speaker 1: I said it beautiful area. No crime that we know 93 00:06:25,560 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 1: of eighty six called. And when you hear domestic matter, 94 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:34,480 Speaker 1: you usually think it's the husband or the male partner 95 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 1: beating up the wife. It's the daughter, Heather Mack beating 96 00:06:40,720 --> 00:06:44,880 Speaker 1: on mom. Let me introduce you our all star panel. 97 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:49,359 Speaker 1: Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author of Red Flags on Amazon. 98 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 1: You can find her at Wendy Patrick PhD dot com 99 00:06:53,040 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 1: or on Today with Doctor Wendy KCBQ in San Diego. 100 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:02,040 Speaker 1: Doctor Jory Cross in psychology, just Faculties, Saint Leo University, 101 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:09,160 Speaker 1: Research consultant, author of st Stop Officers Suicide. Cheryl McCollough, 102 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:13,840 Speaker 1: Founder Director, Coldcase Research Institute, forensics expert. You can find 103 00:07:13,840 --> 00:07:18,040 Speaker 1: her at Coldcase Crimes dot org. Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, 104 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:22,560 Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, 105 00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:26,480 Speaker 1: and star of a brand new hit series Piketon Massacre 106 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio. But first to Christie missouri Emmy Award winning 107 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:35,280 Speaker 1: investigative reporter joining us from Crime online dot com. Christy Missourich, 108 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:39,400 Speaker 1: why wait, let me understand this. So there have been 109 00:07:39,480 --> 00:07:42,840 Speaker 1: eighty six nine one one calls to this mansion where 110 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 1: the victim Sheilavon Wes Mac lives with the daughter, but 111 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:51,680 Speaker 1: the mom still wants to mend bridges with the devil 112 00:07:51,880 --> 00:07:55,680 Speaker 1: daughter and take her on an all expense paid trip 113 00:07:56,320 --> 00:08:03,080 Speaker 1: to Bali. What it true, Christy, Missouri that Sheila's friends said, 114 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:07,400 Speaker 1: don't take her on a vacation, don't be alone with her. 115 00:08:07,640 --> 00:08:13,320 Speaker 1: They were very concerned and family friends kept pleading with her, 116 00:08:13,800 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: keep her here in the States, let her walk away. 117 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:20,640 Speaker 1: She was eighteen years old at the time. Heather always 118 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 1: maintained it was her mother who created the dysfunctional, codependent 119 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:29,240 Speaker 1: love hate relationship. Really who had the broken arm? Right? 120 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: She blamed her mom for what she claims was drunken 121 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 1: squandering of her father's estate after he died from cancer 122 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:40,360 Speaker 1: when she was about ten years old. Oh because later 123 00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 1: on she claims her mother murdered her father. Correct, he 124 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:48,000 Speaker 1: died of cancer. Right. Take a listen to reporter Matt 125 00:08:48,040 --> 00:08:53,040 Speaker 1: Doran and Chris Hansen at Crimewatch Daily. She was becoming 126 00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:58,240 Speaker 1: very defiant and not wanting to listen to any rules. 127 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:02,760 Speaker 1: And Sheila and I had many, many talks, and you know, 128 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,760 Speaker 1: I said, you know, there's a reason the term trouble 129 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 1: teen is out there. But did Heather's troubles go beyond 130 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:12,319 Speaker 1: that of a normal teen. She started skipping school, hanging 131 00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:15,320 Speaker 1: out with a rougher crowd, and even began stealing large 132 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: sums of money from her own mom. What did Sheila 133 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:21,079 Speaker 1: tell you about what was going on behind Clestals, Well, 134 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:23,320 Speaker 1: she told me that she was being abused by Heather. 135 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 1: I mean she was constantly being attacked physically, and he 136 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:31,080 Speaker 1: had an explosive temper, I mean no question about that. 137 00:09:31,360 --> 00:09:35,640 Speaker 1: Tim erupted at the slightest propagation. In fact, over a 138 00:09:35,679 --> 00:09:38,360 Speaker 1: ten year period, police were called here on reports of 139 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 1: domestic violence more than eighty times. She would bite Sheila, 140 00:09:43,920 --> 00:09:47,400 Speaker 1: she would hit her, and it was at the point 141 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 1: of she was sustaining serious injury. Well, Heather pushed her 142 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:53,200 Speaker 1: one time in the bathroom and she fell and broke 143 00:09:53,240 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: her arm. Crime stories with Nancy Grace. You know what 144 00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:08,560 Speaker 1: that shows me, Doctor Jerry Cross and psychologist faculty Saint 145 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:14,520 Speaker 1: Leo University. It shows me there's really no end to 146 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:19,960 Speaker 1: a mother's love. We do whatever it takes to help 147 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 1: our child. And here this poor mom was literally being 148 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:33,320 Speaker 1: beaten up by her daughter, Heather Mack. But instead of 149 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,160 Speaker 1: kicking her out, she decides to take her to mend 150 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:42,160 Speaker 1: Bridges on an all expense paid trip to BOLLI explain 151 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: that to me, doctor Jory, Mother's love is unconditional, boy, 152 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:50,559 Speaker 1: that's for sure, and unfortunately is deadly. You know, She's 153 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 1: trying to do the best she can as far as, 154 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:57,040 Speaker 1: like you say, mending that relationship and thinking, maybe if 155 00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,640 Speaker 1: I can just get away with her and relax and 156 00:10:59,679 --> 00:11:02,680 Speaker 1: spend some time with her and maybe talk things out. 157 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:08,319 Speaker 1: Following up on what doctor Joy Crossen just said, Mom, 158 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 1: Sheila trying desperately to get her daughter to a different environment. 159 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:18,559 Speaker 1: Some were beautiful, some are calming, relaxing, joyful. What's more 160 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:21,760 Speaker 1: beautiful than boy? I mean, I've never been there, but 161 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 1: I've looked at pictures and it just seems like heaven 162 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:30,320 Speaker 1: on earth. So she spends a ton of money to 163 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:35,920 Speaker 1: take her daughter away, just the two of them, mother daughter, 164 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:39,160 Speaker 1: It would be a great environment to start mending and 165 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:44,600 Speaker 1: starting the healing process in that relationship. Exactly. Well, she 166 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:47,760 Speaker 1: sure got a surprise when she got there. Take a 167 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:51,640 Speaker 1: listen to Chris Hanson a Crime Watch daily, So Sheila's 168 00:11:51,679 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 1: surprised less than two weeks into the trip. Tommy Shiver 169 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:58,320 Speaker 1: there's boyfriend suddenly arrived on the twelve thousand dollars flight 170 00:11:58,400 --> 00:12:02,640 Speaker 1: from Chicago. Has no idea Tommy was coming. In fact, 171 00:12:02,720 --> 00:12:05,360 Speaker 1: if anything, Sheila had wanted Heather to come on the 172 00:12:05,400 --> 00:12:09,400 Speaker 1: trip to get her away from people she considered bad influences. 173 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:11,920 Speaker 1: The last person in the world she wanted to say 174 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:15,079 Speaker 1: in Vali was him. And so then the question is, well, 175 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 1: how did he get there? I mean just twelve thousand 176 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:21,400 Speaker 1: dollars for an airplane take. But Sheila would soon find 177 00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:23,640 Speaker 1: out in addition to the room he had been saying, 178 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:27,080 Speaker 1: and Tommy's entire trip was being financed by a credit 179 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:30,720 Speaker 1: card Heather had taken from her mom. All accounts Sheila 180 00:12:30,880 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: was living and do you blame her? She was there 181 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:36,120 Speaker 1: to reconnect with her daughter, and all of a sudden 182 00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:40,840 Speaker 1: this boyfriend who she doesn't like shows up on her dime. 183 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:45,560 Speaker 1: That must have been infuriating. Who is this guy? Chrissy 184 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:48,800 Speaker 1: Missourich joining us in crime online dot com. Who is 185 00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 1: this guy? He is the love of Heather max life 186 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:56,840 Speaker 1: that would get her throne in jail. Tommy Schaeffer kind 187 00:12:56,840 --> 00:13:01,480 Speaker 1: of a street fog from He's It's from an affluent family, 188 00:13:01,480 --> 00:13:04,120 Speaker 1: but he like to hang kinda with some a foggy 189 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: type of people in downtown Chicago. I don't get that. 190 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 1: What is that, Sheryl McCallum. You and I have seen 191 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:12,679 Speaker 1: that many times. Let me go to Wendy Patrick, California 192 00:13:12,760 --> 00:13:15,800 Speaker 1: prosecutor or host, author of Red Flags and host of 193 00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:21,480 Speaker 1: Today with Doctor Wendy. Wendy, I've seen that where teens 194 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:24,319 Speaker 1: children are born with a silver spoon in their mouth. 195 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:27,040 Speaker 1: Their parents bend over backwards to do everything they can 196 00:13:27,200 --> 00:13:29,199 Speaker 1: for them, but they want to hang out with thugs 197 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:32,600 Speaker 1: and go get in trouble. That's more fun than going 198 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:37,360 Speaker 1: to a recital or a prayer meeting. No, they want 199 00:13:37,440 --> 00:13:41,320 Speaker 1: to hang out with the bad guys. Yeah, bad boys 200 00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:45,040 Speaker 1: and dark heroes and learning that bad company corrupts character, 201 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:47,720 Speaker 1: as we say, And you know, my parents used to say, 202 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:49,680 Speaker 1: show me your friends, and I'll show you your future. 203 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,200 Speaker 1: I think we should still see that today because this 204 00:13:52,320 --> 00:13:56,040 Speaker 1: kind of dynamic is very common, and it's not just 205 00:13:56,240 --> 00:13:59,000 Speaker 1: common with young teens. You know, we wish that this 206 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:01,559 Speaker 1: would be something and somebody would grow out of. What 207 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 1: cases like this illustrate is this permeates culture sometimes even 208 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:08,640 Speaker 1: when people are young adults and God forbid, even when 209 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:14,800 Speaker 1: we become adults, you mean, you gravitate toward that Bengali 210 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:18,640 Speaker 1: type person, the life of the party, the dangerous one. 211 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:21,400 Speaker 1: Is that something in human nature? You know, in human 212 00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:25,000 Speaker 1: nature we tend to see that in some types of personalities. 213 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:28,120 Speaker 1: It is certainly not something universal that everybody needs to 214 00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:31,280 Speaker 1: worry about. But when you see this kind of a pattern, 215 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:33,640 Speaker 1: and when you see this kind of a pattern dispite 216 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:37,120 Speaker 1: the upbringing that this young woman had, you have to 217 00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 1: wonder how did this start? What ll did you know 218 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:43,080 Speaker 1: the socialization process play in it? Or is this just 219 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 1: somebody who preferred that kind of a dangerous, living on 220 00:14:47,120 --> 00:14:50,800 Speaker 1: the edge lifestyle. Whatever the explanation is, we certainly know 221 00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 1: how it turned out here. You know, Schryl McCollum. You 222 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:55,520 Speaker 1: and I have been in court a lot of times together, 223 00:14:56,240 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: and I have sayen where children, teens, adults, with every 224 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:08,760 Speaker 1: advantage in the world gravitate toward what is dark and 225 00:15:09,000 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 1: evil and end up getting dragged down with it. No question, 226 00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:18,360 Speaker 1: Sometimes that criminal element it's just sexier, it's a more 227 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: interesting story. It's kind of living on the edge, and 228 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: it's got this thrill to it. I mean, a lot 229 00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 1: of people get kind of sucked into that. But I 230 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:30,680 Speaker 1: think it's important to talk about the eighty six times 231 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 1: police were involved. This has nothing to do with the boyfriend. 232 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:37,080 Speaker 1: This is her nancy. If you were talking about eighty 233 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 1: six robberies or eighty six VUIs, we would be losing 234 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:44,240 Speaker 1: our mind. While this person was not in jail. I'll 235 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: tell you why she wasn't in jail. The mother would 236 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 1: never wanted her prosecuted. She would beat the mother up, 237 00:15:50,400 --> 00:15:56,680 Speaker 1: This wealthy, cultured, educated mom. Her daughter would beat her 238 00:15:56,680 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 1: to smithers, but she didn't want her daughter to have 239 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 1: a jail record. Finally, the police insisted and she was 240 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 1: found guilty of abusing her own mother. Oh, I'm not 241 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 1: putting the onus on the boyfriend. She saw this out herself, 242 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:20,280 Speaker 1: and you're right, she had horns sprouting from day one 243 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 1: before she met the boyfriend. But it is quite the 244 00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:28,960 Speaker 1: Coinkie Dan right that just ten hours after the boyfriend's 245 00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 1: plane touches down, we got problems. Take a listen to 246 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 1: Matt Doran and Chris Hansen Crime Watched Daily. Ten hours 247 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,160 Speaker 1: after the wheels of Tommy's plane hit the ground in Bali, 248 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: surveillance cameras capfter him entering Sheila's hotel room with a 249 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 1: handle of a middle fruit bowl stuffed under his shirt. 250 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:53,000 Speaker 1: About an hour after that, Heather and Tommy are seen 251 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 1: heading to the lobby with a silver suitcase, which they 252 00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:59,560 Speaker 1: placed in the back of attachee before running off. It's 253 00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: not all the driver takes the abandoned luggage to the 254 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 1: police station that they find out what's inside the bloodied, 255 00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:10,520 Speaker 1: half naked body of Sheila Vanui Smack. She had been 256 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:16,920 Speaker 1: blooded repeatedly before asphyxiating on her own blood. So where 257 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:20,040 Speaker 1: were Tommy and Heather? For just less than a day? 258 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:22,840 Speaker 1: The media painted this pair as a modern day Bonnie 259 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 1: and Clyde, young American fugitives wanted for a particularly brutal murder, 260 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,400 Speaker 1: but their time on the run would end here at 261 00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:33,200 Speaker 1: this budget motel less than a mile from the crime scene. 262 00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:36,760 Speaker 1: Staff alerting police after becoming suspicious that the lovers had 263 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:49,840 Speaker 1: checked in without any luggage. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace 264 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 1: to Joscot Morgan, professor Forresick Shacksville State University and author 265 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:59,520 Speaker 1: of Blood Beneath My Feet Joscott, how did this loving 266 00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:05,280 Speaker 1: mother who sacrificed so much, how does she actually die? 267 00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:06,800 Speaker 1: And then I want to talk to you about the 268 00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: phenomena that you and I have encountered many times, if 269 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:15,200 Speaker 1: stuffing bodies in suitcases. Yeah, let me paint a picture 270 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 1: for you, Nancy, in the report that was given forth 271 00:18:19,119 --> 00:18:23,120 Speaker 1: by the forensic expert at the hospital. And keep in mind, 272 00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:26,480 Speaker 1: this is not like being in America. They're in Bali, okay. 273 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:31,879 Speaker 1: But the report that came from there states that not 274 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:36,200 Speaker 1: only was she beaten about the head, Nancy, she's beaten 275 00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:38,439 Speaker 1: about the face. And you want to know what that 276 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 1: says to me? She saw this coming, she was looking. 277 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:45,399 Speaker 1: She was looking for as long as she could. She 278 00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:49,600 Speaker 1: probably wound up being blinded, either by her own blood 279 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:55,479 Speaker 1: or maybe maybe her optic nerves became dislodged. But she 280 00:18:55,560 --> 00:18:59,680 Speaker 1: had an awareness. Her facial bones were fractured, her skull 281 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:02,720 Speaker 1: has been fractured. And Nancy, I'll tell you how else. 282 00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:07,200 Speaker 1: I know that she had an awareness. She had fractures 283 00:19:07,240 --> 00:19:11,520 Speaker 1: on her arms and her hands, multiple contusions otherwise known 284 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:16,119 Speaker 1: as bruising. And her cause of death, remember what was 285 00:19:16,200 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 1: just said, she actually suffocated, Nancy. When she suffocated, more 286 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 1: than likely, and this is just MEO Pine in here. 287 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:28,400 Speaker 1: Her facial bones were fractured, so she would have literally 288 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 1: inhalated the bone and the blood that we can normally, 289 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,760 Speaker 1: you know, we can normally process something that it might 290 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 1: be in our mouth and our airway. We can. But 291 00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: she was so debilitated but still clinging to life. And 292 00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:45,200 Speaker 1: so when they went to do the autopsy on her 293 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 1: and they opened up her airway, Nancy, her lungs would 294 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:53,199 Speaker 1: not only have been filled with her own blood in 295 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 1: the tiny little air sacks, you would have sent fragmented 296 00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:59,399 Speaker 1: pieces of bone in there potentially as well. It would 297 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:04,600 Speaker 1: have been an excruciy, excruciating way to die. It is 298 00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:07,919 Speaker 1: just beyond the pale. This gives an indication of the 299 00:20:08,119 --> 00:20:11,840 Speaker 1: level of violence, and Nancy, I'm gonna I don't want 300 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:13,639 Speaker 1: to bury the lead here, but I gotta tell you 301 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:16,320 Speaker 1: I know where you're going with this. He came down 302 00:20:16,359 --> 00:20:19,480 Speaker 1: there with specific intent. He flew down there. They had 303 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:22,600 Speaker 1: a plan. This was premeditated. He went down there as 304 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:27,920 Speaker 1: an assassin. He assassinated this poor little woman, Yes he did, 305 00:20:28,600 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 1: with her own daughter leading the attack. And then the 306 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:39,200 Speaker 1: horror of you know what. I remember going to a 307 00:20:39,320 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 1: circus with the twins, the big one Barnem Barnum and 308 00:20:47,040 --> 00:20:52,440 Speaker 1: Bailey and there was a contortionist. There were two of them. 309 00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:55,560 Speaker 1: I think they were sisters, and they could wrap their 310 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:59,159 Speaker 1: bodies like they would fold them up. They'd fold up 311 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 1: their body and in a suitcase and close the suit 312 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 1: It was a box, a suitcase, and we couldn't believe 313 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:11,080 Speaker 1: it because it's very small. And I remember thinking, how 314 00:21:11,080 --> 00:21:15,240 Speaker 1: did she do that? And now I'm thinking about this 315 00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 1: mom her body being crunched and folded over and crammed 316 00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: into a suitcase. How did that happen? Listen to Alex 317 00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:33,000 Speaker 1: Perez GMA. This morning, a gruesome discovery near the upscale 318 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:36,960 Speaker 1: Saint Regis Resorts in Bali is sending shockwaves from there 319 00:21:37,000 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 1: all the way here to Chicago about the authorities finding 320 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,280 Speaker 1: the body of vacationing American at the Sheila Vanus Mack 321 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:47,480 Speaker 1: stuffed inside this silver suitcase. The luggage left in the 322 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:52,040 Speaker 1: trunk of this cab contained for questioning. Now came Mac's 323 00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:56,440 Speaker 1: own nineteen year old daughter, Heather and her boyfriend Tommy Schaeffer. Heather, 324 00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:59,400 Speaker 1: Mac and Shaeffer were arrested Wednesday at a hotel about 325 00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:02,800 Speaker 1: six miles away from the resorts, telling investigators they had 326 00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 1: escaped after being kidnapped by armed gang members who murdered 327 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:10,400 Speaker 1: her mother, but investigators say surveillance video shows the mother 328 00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 1: and daughter arguing in the hours before the murderer. Later, 329 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,680 Speaker 1: police ate the young couple called for a taxi, placing 330 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:20,399 Speaker 1: several suitcases inside before going back in the hotel to 331 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:24,119 Speaker 1: check out. They said when they didn't return, hotel security 332 00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:29,440 Speaker 1: discovered the suitcase, so they put their mom's body crunched up, 333 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:33,080 Speaker 1: folded up into a suitcase, stick it in, leave it 334 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,360 Speaker 1: out front for a taxi to put into the taxi, 335 00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:39,679 Speaker 1: and then they go into check out and run. My 336 00:22:39,800 --> 00:22:44,359 Speaker 1: understanding is I guess through the woods to get away 337 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:48,399 Speaker 1: out in the back door, literally running out the back 338 00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:53,440 Speaker 1: door to get away to you. Cheryl McCollum, director of 339 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:58,080 Speaker 1: the Cold Case Research Institute. The way they treated her body, 340 00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 1: folding her up, literally folding her up and stuffing her 341 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,880 Speaker 1: into suitcase. I wonder if Heather Max sat on top 342 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:09,199 Speaker 1: of it while the boyfriend managed to close it. It 343 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:13,119 Speaker 1: is more grotesque than that. They used tape to wrap 344 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,720 Speaker 1: around her to hold her in place so that she 345 00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 1: would fit. So this took some time and it was bloody. 346 00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 1: It was a horrific scene. You can even see on 347 00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: the outside of the luggage when they take the garbage 348 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 1: bag off, it's just saturated with her blood. You know, 349 00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:39,760 Speaker 1: we're so used to analyzing evidence, Wendy Patrick, that when 350 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:43,360 Speaker 1: you hear a comment like that the suitcase was saturated 351 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 1: with the mother's blood, a lot of times we just 352 00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:49,359 Speaker 1: make a note of it because we're going to use 353 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:53,639 Speaker 1: that in a closing statement. Think about that for a moment, though, Wendy. 354 00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:59,640 Speaker 1: The suitcase was saturated with her mother's blood. She bound 355 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:03,320 Speaker 1: her mother with a duct tape, her body folded over 356 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:06,919 Speaker 1: and contorted to fit into a suitcase. Yeah, you know 357 00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:09,000 Speaker 1: what that tells me. And what you know, even as 358 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:11,639 Speaker 1: the human being haven't been a prosecutor for so many years, 359 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 1: is the amount of time that the mother suffered. I 360 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:19,200 Speaker 1: don't think anyone can think through what happened here, even 361 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 1: if you were just to hear about the injuries and 362 00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 1: not feel how long that mother suffered, and at the 363 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:31,040 Speaker 1: hands of her own daughter, who she loved enough to 364 00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:34,200 Speaker 1: forgive all of those years of abuse, the eighty six 365 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:37,639 Speaker 1: calls to the house. You know, the mother's love, the 366 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:41,200 Speaker 1: family first mentality for this mother ended up being fatal 367 00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:48,360 Speaker 1: to you. Doctor Joy cross In psychologist faculty Saint Leo author, 368 00:24:49,440 --> 00:24:53,879 Speaker 1: doctor Joy. What does that tell you about how she 369 00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:59,400 Speaker 1: considered her mother? But you know the level of violence, 370 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:02,000 Speaker 1: there's always the close relationship. I mean, you can just 371 00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: about there's been a lot of research to the show 372 00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 1: that you know, the more violence, the closer the relationship. 373 00:25:07,840 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 1: I agree with Joe that you know, the boyfriend showed 374 00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 1: up over there with a plan to killer and when 375 00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:19,919 Speaker 1: they got together, Heather and the boyfriend, you know, there's energy, 376 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,480 Speaker 1: but there's also what's called synergy. I mean, it just 377 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:28,920 Speaker 1: synergizes this level of violence, and it's documented in all 378 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:33,280 Speaker 1: the wounds to the body and how vicious the attack was. 379 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:36,439 Speaker 1: And I want to go to you, just Scott Morgan. 380 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:42,919 Speaker 1: Patricide is very very rare, actually, especially the murder of 381 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 1: your own mother. Yeah, yeah, it is, and it's not 382 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,960 Speaker 1: something that you come across every day. I've worked cases 383 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 1: in my career, and you know, Nancy, I've got to 384 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:55,760 Speaker 1: tell you those cases that I have worked when you 385 00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: begin to rate them, and this is only my little 386 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:02,159 Speaker 1: slice of the world, but from what I have observed, 387 00:26:02,880 --> 00:26:06,760 Speaker 1: those were traditionally some of the most violent cases that 388 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,639 Speaker 1: I ever encountered, and I think a lot of it 389 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:23,040 Speaker 1: has to do with anger climb stories with Nancy Grace 390 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:28,840 Speaker 1: match aside, The murder of your own mother makes up 391 00:26:29,119 --> 00:26:35,680 Speaker 1: a little less than two percent of all homicides. It 392 00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:40,679 Speaker 1: is very very rare, even for people that's for some 393 00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:47,400 Speaker 1: reason hate their mother. To kill your mother, very very rare. 394 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:52,359 Speaker 1: This with the shocking development that Heather mac is about 395 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:56,240 Speaker 1: to walk free. So how has she been spending her 396 00:26:56,280 --> 00:27:01,120 Speaker 1: time behind bars? Take a list to our friends at 397 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 1: Inside Edition. Not exactly hard time, is it? That's mom 398 00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 1: killer Heather Matt having fun dancing while she's in prison 399 00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:18,240 Speaker 1: on the island paradise of Bali. Heather is wearing makeup 400 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:21,120 Speaker 1: and books Happy Go Lucky as she playfully sticks her 401 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:24,119 Speaker 1: tongue out. And here's the twenty year old Chicago raised 402 00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 1: Harris in trendy shades, a big smile on her face. 403 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:31,200 Speaker 1: Heather and her boyfriend Tommy Shaffer were convicted of murdering 404 00:27:31,200 --> 00:27:34,760 Speaker 1: her mother and stuffing the body into a suitcase during 405 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: a vacation in Bali last year. Japer is doing eighteen years, 406 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:42,760 Speaker 1: Heather got ten. The young lover's daughter, Stella, was born 407 00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 1: in prison and is now six months old. This video 408 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 1: shows Shaeffer cradling Stella while mom was DANCINGO. The prison 409 00:27:57,359 --> 00:27:59,560 Speaker 1: where Heather and her boyfriend are being held has been 410 00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:02,960 Speaker 1: destroyed as a hell hole, but it sure doesn't look 411 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 1: like that in this new video. Okay, I don't understand 412 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:11,679 Speaker 1: Christy Zurich. How is she wearing makeup and dancing and 413 00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:18,200 Speaker 1: mugging at a camera with her baby behind bars? So 414 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:23,080 Speaker 1: in Indonesia, moms can stay with their kids behind bars 415 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,760 Speaker 1: for up to two years. Also, what I've heard from 416 00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: some of my sources is that Heather has taken some 417 00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 1: of her mom's money to pay off prison guards relaxed rules. Okay, 418 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:42,040 Speaker 1: you know, it reminds me of You're in Vandersleet Wendy Patrick, 419 00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:48,160 Speaker 1: who somehow has drugs and booze and got someone pregnant 420 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 1: behind bars after he murdered Natalie Holloway and Stephanie Tassiano 421 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:59,160 Speaker 1: Flores in Lima. Yeah, she's having a party. Yeah. You know, 422 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 1: sometimes when we hear that somebody's in prison, the mental 423 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,800 Speaker 1: imagery that comes to mind is very far from reality, 424 00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:08,120 Speaker 1: and that appears to be the case here. I have 425 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:10,520 Speaker 1: to tell you, Nancy, more and more frequently we are 426 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:14,160 Speaker 1: getting this glimpse unfortunately in a sense, into what goes 427 00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:17,120 Speaker 1: on behind bars because of the amount of contraband phones 428 00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:20,360 Speaker 1: that are behind bars. So every time I see footage 429 00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:24,600 Speaker 1: somehow captured in a high security facility of wherever it 430 00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,520 Speaker 1: is in the world, that also tells me the contraband 431 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,920 Speaker 1: issue that goes on, where all of these phones and 432 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:33,400 Speaker 1: waves to capture footage like this. If that's the way 433 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,280 Speaker 1: it was done, I don't know is even possible, but 434 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:39,480 Speaker 1: I suppose on the bright side, it gives us somewhat 435 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:41,959 Speaker 1: of an idea as to what prison life is like 436 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:44,200 Speaker 1: in order for us to make the corrections that we 437 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:47,600 Speaker 1: need to. Well, all I know is she is not 438 00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:53,240 Speaker 1: roughing it behind bars at all. She's got makeup music, 439 00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:57,880 Speaker 1: she's dancing, she's got contraband, she's got her daughter, And 440 00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 1: now she's worried about coming home to the US because 441 00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:04,080 Speaker 1: her daughter might find out she's a murderer. First of all, 442 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 1: why should she have the baby? How would you grow 443 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 1: and flourish with Heather mac as your mother. Well that's 444 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:16,360 Speaker 1: not all. Take a listen to Less Trent from Inside Edition. 445 00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:19,880 Speaker 1: Don't regret killing my mother, And as evil as that 446 00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,600 Speaker 1: may sound, that's my reality. A chilling confession from behind 447 00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:27,280 Speaker 1: bars by the American heiress who murdered her wealthy mother 448 00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:31,160 Speaker 1: on vacation in Bali. I made it up in my heart, 449 00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:41,200 Speaker 1: my mind, my soul, my blood, oxygen running through my body. 450 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:44,040 Speaker 1: But I wanted to kill my mother. Now listen to why. 451 00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:46,959 Speaker 1: Twenty one year old Heather Mack says she beat her 452 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,920 Speaker 1: mom to death and stuffed her body in a suitcase. 453 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 1: When I was ten, my mother killed my father in 454 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:57,239 Speaker 1: a hotel in Athens, Greece. Could Heather be making up 455 00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:00,440 Speaker 1: the story? We spoke to family friend Elliott Jacobson, who 456 00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:04,280 Speaker 1: says Heather's claims are nonsense. It's a kind of statement 457 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 1: that doesn't even warrant the response. It's such an absurdity. 458 00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:12,480 Speaker 1: He showed me this death certificate for Heather's father, Jane's Mack. 459 00:31:12,840 --> 00:31:16,240 Speaker 1: It gives the cause of death as pulmonary embolism, a 460 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,720 Speaker 1: blood clot in the lungs. You were hearing not only 461 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:23,080 Speaker 1: our friend less trended Inside Edition, but you're hearing Heather 462 00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:26,880 Speaker 1: Max saying she does not regret murdering her mother. She 463 00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:31,400 Speaker 1: gives justification that her mother murdered her father when she 464 00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:34,480 Speaker 1: was ten in Athens, Greece. That could not be further 465 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:38,280 Speaker 1: from the truth. You hear the family friend, Elliott Jacobson 466 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:41,520 Speaker 1: saying that that was not his cause of death. The 467 00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,840 Speaker 1: father's cause of death was a pulmonary embolism, a blood 468 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:49,600 Speaker 1: clot in the lungs brought about through a battle with cancer. 469 00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:57,880 Speaker 1: So even now she's fabricating stories to justify murdering her mother. 470 00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:03,040 Speaker 1: It shows me that there is no remorse, no acceptance 471 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:06,200 Speaker 1: of her crime. But yet she's still going to walk free. 472 00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:10,440 Speaker 1: Christy Masseric, that is what I'm hearing. She's expected to 473 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,720 Speaker 1: be released from the prison in Volley in October, three 474 00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:16,920 Speaker 1: years early for good behavior. I mean, this is a 475 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:22,440 Speaker 1: woman facing death by firing squad. Okay, let's take a 476 00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 1: listen to more of what we've learned. Here's Matt Duran 477 00:32:24,480 --> 00:32:27,680 Speaker 1: and Chris Hansen it Crime Watch Daily. Does the evidence 478 00:32:27,680 --> 00:32:31,320 Speaker 1: support Heather is a version of events. It's one thing, 479 00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:35,040 Speaker 1: in the heat of the moment, in a violent exchange, 480 00:32:35,440 --> 00:32:38,680 Speaker 1: to kill your own mother, But it's another thing entirely 481 00:32:39,160 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 1: to map it out and for this to have been premeditated. 482 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 1: So which was it? In my head? I actually happen? 483 00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 1: The police say there's a series of text messages Heather 484 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,600 Speaker 1: which show that which go to that very motive premeditation. 485 00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:09,000 Speaker 1: I'm sure, yes, of course you want to call me back. 486 00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:13,160 Speaker 1: That call never came. We would lose contact with Heather 487 00:33:13,360 --> 00:33:19,120 Speaker 1: after those final words. It shows premeditation. Cheryl McCullum the 488 00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 1: text message between her and her boyfriend, it's just like 489 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:26,719 Speaker 1: doctor Jory said, he came there as an assassin, and 490 00:33:26,800 --> 00:33:29,160 Speaker 1: now she's going to walk free. I only worry about 491 00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 1: what's going to happen to the baby. Well, let's talk 492 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,160 Speaker 1: about that, Nancy, because I think that's a lot of 493 00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:37,080 Speaker 1: her motivation. So she originally tried to ask her boyfriend, hey, 494 00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:38,800 Speaker 1: do you know somebody that can kill my mother for 495 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,080 Speaker 1: fifty thousand dollars. Then I think the two of them decided, hey, 496 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:44,680 Speaker 1: we can say fifty grain and do it ourselves and 497 00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:49,640 Speaker 1: collect everything all the inheritance. She right now she wants 498 00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:53,600 Speaker 1: that baby back with her. She's lying when she says 499 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 1: she's worried that the baby's going to find out why 500 00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,080 Speaker 1: she's in prison. The baby visits both of her parents 501 00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,440 Speaker 1: in separate prison for murder. The baby's gonna know while 502 00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,320 Speaker 1: they were there. That's a given. And this is what. 503 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:08,640 Speaker 1: I think she won't that baby back at Chicago with 504 00:34:08,719 --> 00:34:15,719 Speaker 1: her because her daughter inherited her mother's estate. Guys, take 505 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:19,920 Speaker 1: a listen to our friends at NBC five Chicago. The 506 00:34:20,000 --> 00:34:22,120 Speaker 1: twenty five year old Mac is due to be released 507 00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:25,480 Speaker 1: three years early for good behavior. Saint Charles based attorney 508 00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:29,359 Speaker 1: Vanessa Favia has represented Mac and Stella. She's definitely more 509 00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:33,600 Speaker 1: mature now and being a mother has changed her drastically, 510 00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 1: So I think she's going to come back with a 511 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:39,640 Speaker 1: new lease on life and definitely a better person all around. 512 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:42,920 Speaker 1: Max's uncle Bill Weees tells NBC five he has not 513 00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:45,759 Speaker 1: had contact with Heather and does not want to, and 514 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:48,560 Speaker 1: he says he believes Heather's original ten year sentence was 515 00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:51,879 Speaker 1: a travesty of justice. Still, he says the family's hearts 516 00:34:51,920 --> 00:34:54,400 Speaker 1: continue to go out to Stella and they hope she 517 00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:58,200 Speaker 1: can be raised in a safe and loving environment. Meanwhile, 518 00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 1: Thavias says Mac is seriously considering bringing Stella to the US. 519 00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:05,400 Speaker 1: I think the fear is related to just the unknown. 520 00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:08,160 Speaker 1: She hasn't been here in so long, she doesn't know 521 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:11,840 Speaker 1: what to expect her who's really still here in supporting 522 00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,840 Speaker 1: of her, So that's a big part of the fear. 523 00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:19,279 Speaker 1: Everyone she would know in America now was friends with 524 00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 1: her mother that she murdered. I can't believe they're going 525 00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:26,760 Speaker 1: to let her take this baby. She is a killer. 526 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:30,680 Speaker 1: We can't control what they do in Bali. And as 527 00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:33,960 Speaker 1: far to you, Jessica Morgan, I don't know how she 528 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:37,200 Speaker 1: sleeps at night thinking back on the way she murdered 529 00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:40,440 Speaker 1: her mother, duct taped her body into a ball to 530 00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:43,440 Speaker 1: stick her into a suitcase. Why should she raise a 531 00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 1: baby girl. I have no idea because you know what, 532 00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,799 Speaker 1: I'd see her cycling back into violence. This is not 533 00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:53,600 Speaker 1: like something that just fell from lightning, like lightning from heaven. 534 00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:59,359 Speaker 1: This is a premeditated event. This woman is evil. Nance Well, 535 00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:02,200 Speaker 1: there were the eight six phone calls to police. Those 536 00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:04,440 Speaker 1: were just the cost to police. How many other times 537 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,320 Speaker 1: did she batter her mother? And as far as maturing 538 00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:10,919 Speaker 1: behind bars doctor Jerry Cross and she says, I don't 539 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:14,000 Speaker 1: regret murdering my mother, then makes up a story that 540 00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:16,720 Speaker 1: her mom is a killer, that it's her mother's fault. 541 00:36:16,800 --> 00:36:20,160 Speaker 1: She's dead in a suitcase. That's all. That's all justification 542 00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:23,360 Speaker 1: for her, That's that's all that is. I mean, she 543 00:36:23,560 --> 00:36:26,759 Speaker 1: is not mature, she's still lying about it. Why is 544 00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:29,520 Speaker 1: she getting out three years early and taking this little, 545 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:35,080 Speaker 1: helpless baby with her. I think I think that has 546 00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:37,919 Speaker 1: a lot to do with money and payoffs in the 547 00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 1: prison system and the whole legal system in Indonesia. Jump in, Cheryl. 548 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,800 Speaker 1: One way that prison is easy for people and enjoyable 549 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:48,840 Speaker 1: for you know people, is that they're the baddest soob 550 00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,719 Speaker 1: in that place. I think her violence went with her 551 00:36:51,719 --> 00:36:54,600 Speaker 1: into that prison. I think she's controlling an abusive to 552 00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:56,960 Speaker 1: people there, and I think when she gets out, her 553 00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:59,600 Speaker 1: lifestyle is not going to change at all. Take a 554 00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:03,280 Speaker 1: listen into our longtime frim Jim Moray an inside edition. 555 00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:06,920 Speaker 1: She looks like any other doting mom with her adorable child. 556 00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:10,640 Speaker 1: But this is Heather mac the American heiress who killed 557 00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:13,960 Speaker 1: her mother stuffed the body into a suitcase while vacationing 558 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:17,239 Speaker 1: at a ritzy resort in Bali. The new photos come 559 00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:20,720 Speaker 1: as Heather learned she's being released from prison early. Forget 560 00:37:20,760 --> 00:37:24,520 Speaker 1: this good behavior. She's excited, She's excited to know this. 561 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:28,640 Speaker 1: Journalist Andrea Dixon interviewed the so called suitcase killer, who 562 00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:33,360 Speaker 1: said to be freed this October. She will be automatically deportioned. 563 00:37:33,640 --> 00:37:36,080 Speaker 1: She doesn't have a choice in that. Weighing heavily on 564 00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:40,000 Speaker 1: Heather's mind, she says, is whether to return to Chicago alone, 565 00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:42,520 Speaker 1: leave her six year old daughter, Sella with the foster 566 00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:45,320 Speaker 1: family who's been raising her since she was two years old. 567 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:49,120 Speaker 1: Heather is worried about the focus and the media attention 568 00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:53,279 Speaker 1: that she and her adorshable get. She hasn't experienced any 569 00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,279 Speaker 1: of that in Bali. People don't actually know who Stella is. 570 00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:59,640 Speaker 1: She's just a normal key. Andrea Dixon says, Heather knows 571 00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,759 Speaker 1: her return to the US will falls a big stir. 572 00:38:03,360 --> 00:38:06,839 Speaker 1: She's prepared to face the music. Sounds like she's more 573 00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:10,319 Speaker 1: concerned about herself than she is about her six year 574 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:15,279 Speaker 1: old little girl, Stella, but can only pray Stella, it's 575 00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:20,279 Speaker 1: never in the clutches of her mother. Nancy Grace Crime 576 00:38:20,360 --> 00:38:22,439 Speaker 1: Story signing off Goodbye frid