1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:04,640 Speaker 1: Dear listener. This month, we're bringing you episodes of La Brega, 2 00:00:05,040 --> 00:00:09,360 Speaker 1: a special seven part mini series presented by Futuro Studios 3 00:00:09,640 --> 00:00:14,840 Speaker 1: and WNYC Studios, all about the Puerto Rican experience. Today's 4 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:20,759 Speaker 1: episode is an encyclopedia of betrayal, and if you'd like 5 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: to hear any of the episodes in Espanol, visit the 6 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:28,479 Speaker 1: La Brega feed wherever you listen to your podcasts. And 7 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:30,640 Speaker 1: now I'm going to hand things over to w n 8 00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: y c's Alna Casanova Verges, the host of La Brega. 9 00:00:36,159 --> 00:00:41,960 Speaker 2: Alana, let's go. Yeah, yeah, you don't want to me. 10 00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 3: Not long ago, Chris Gregory Rivera and our producergu Sandino 11 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 3: went to an office in sent Juan. They were there 12 00:00:49,800 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 3: to visit a stack of paper. Mama, more than paper, 13 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 3: it's a stack of folders. Really that was so heavy 14 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:05,120 Speaker 3: that it landed with a thud on the table. This 15 00:01:05,360 --> 00:01:08,600 Speaker 3: is a garbita. It just means folder in Spanish, but 16 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:12,440 Speaker 3: in Puerto Rico its meaning has a lot more weight. 17 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 2: So yeah, so this is it's like a you know, 18 00:01:15,480 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 2: some normal like office Manila folder with some pages in it, 19 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 2: some handwritten notes, but in here is a page that 20 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:25,440 Speaker 2: has basically a list of codes on the left and 21 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:28,360 Speaker 2: a list of names on the right, and it's the 22 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 2: list of agents, informants, and other collaborators of the police. 23 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 3: A garbite is a surveillance record from an illegal government 24 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 3: program that tracked Puerto Rico's independence movement, which for over 25 00:01:43,920 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 3: a century has fought for the island to leave control 26 00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:50,560 Speaker 3: of the United States. There have been attempts to suppress 27 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:54,080 Speaker 3: the movement since the beginning in the fifties. For example, 28 00:01:54,400 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 3: you could be jailed for flying a Puerto Rican flag. 29 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:01,200 Speaker 3: The files from this surveillance per date from the nineteen 30 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 3: forties to the eighties. It was carried out by a 31 00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:06,800 Speaker 3: secret police division that tracked over one hundred and fifty 32 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:11,359 Speaker 3: thousand people and created extensive files on JESHI of sixteen thousand. 33 00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 3: Chris has spent a lot of time with these garbeitas 34 00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 3: he's a photographer and six years ago he started documenting 35 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 3: these massive stacks and the people whose lives they catalog. 36 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 2: And on the left you have their code names. The agent, 37 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,120 Speaker 2: being like a paid member of the police force, tasks 38 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 2: with infiltrating a group and informants that were simply submitting 39 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:35,960 Speaker 2: information to the cops. 40 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:40,400 Speaker 3: Most of these records were compiled by local police officers, 41 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:44,240 Speaker 3: but the effort relied on Puerto Ricans informing on each other. 42 00:02:45,200 --> 00:02:49,959 Speaker 3: The FBI closely collaborated with the Police Intelligence Division, routinely 43 00:02:50,000 --> 00:02:53,440 Speaker 3: mining the garbitas for information, as well as compiling their 44 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 3: own files on independentiitas. The files reveal a web of 45 00:02:58,440 --> 00:02:59,600 Speaker 3: constant vigilance. 46 00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 2: Chris read some of the reports out loud. An eighteenth 47 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:11,239 Speaker 2: of September nineteen sixty seven, nine thirty in the morning, 48 00:03:11,320 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 2: the check was done on his residence, but the target 49 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 2: wasn't seen. 50 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 3: Time. Eleven in the morning, contact was made with the 51 00:03:20,080 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 3: informant on Madrid Street in Rio Piires. Twelve thirty in 52 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:27,280 Speaker 3: the afternoon, he was seen by the informant from the 53 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:29,040 Speaker 3: soda fountain in front of the. 54 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:37,120 Speaker 2: University Raaerente arauberre time from mantel. 55 00:03:37,760 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 3: There were informants everywhere. The neighbor the soda fountain, dude. 56 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 3: But the information is totally banal. It's just day to 57 00:03:45,720 --> 00:03:48,960 Speaker 3: day life. Chris says, that's part of what's so chilling. 58 00:03:50,080 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 3: The surveillance program in Puerto Rico was one of, if 59 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:57,480 Speaker 3: not the longest, continuous targeted surveillance program conducted on US 60 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 3: citizens by their own government. For Chris, one of the 61 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 3: worst things about the program was that it relied on 62 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:06,520 Speaker 3: Puerto Ricans spying on each other for the cops, with 63 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 3: betrayals happening within families and among friends. The history of 64 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:15,280 Speaker 3: surveillance is so embedded in the Puerto Rican consciousness that 65 00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:19,960 Speaker 3: it has its own verb to carbetier, to folder someone 66 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:23,360 Speaker 3: or be folded. Growing up in Puerto Rico, Chris heard 67 00:04:23,400 --> 00:04:24,279 Speaker 3: it all the time. 68 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 2: I wanted to be a foot journalist, so I would 69 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:28,560 Speaker 2: go out to protests and I would take pictures, and 70 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 2: my mom would always sort of tell me, you know, 71 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,240 Speaker 2: be careful. You know that macarpethia. They're going to like, 72 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:34,800 Speaker 2: they're going to create a file on you. 73 00:04:35,160 --> 00:04:38,600 Speaker 3: When your mom would say, what did you think? Was 74 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 3: it like rolling your eyes? Oh mom, come on, not 75 00:04:40,839 --> 00:04:43,360 Speaker 3: really or was it in any way real for you? 76 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 4: No? 77 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:45,799 Speaker 2: I mean, yeah it was. It was the boogeyman. 78 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,680 Speaker 3: The very idea of being watched in Puerto Rico was 79 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:52,720 Speaker 3: kind of a cuco. That's how we say boogeyman in Spanish. 80 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:58,279 Speaker 3: Something there lurking just out of sight withou cuco or 81 00:04:58,320 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 3: not there at all. Just in your genation, you're paranoia. 82 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:06,200 Speaker 3: A story to scare the kids, a story to scare everyone. 83 00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:09,119 Speaker 3: Chris takes it from here. 84 00:05:10,160 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 2: In the course of my photo project about Ascarpeta's, I 85 00:05:12,720 --> 00:05:16,000 Speaker 2: became interested in one particular portrayal when they got me 86 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:19,160 Speaker 2: thinking about what the effects of surveillance are on society, 87 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 2: the wounds it leaves. So let's start the story here 88 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 2: with Nestor Nasario. Nestor has his scarpetta. A lot of 89 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:31,159 Speaker 2: people have their files. Actually more on that later, but 90 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 2: he told me that his adds up to eighteen hundred pages. 91 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:47,080 Speaker 2: Super His mother's file is even larger. He also has 92 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:50,040 Speaker 2: his father's. Storing them all requires a lot of space. 93 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 2: Nestor's is deep in a closet in his house. Last 94 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:56,680 Speaker 2: time I asked to see them, he told me it 95 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 2: would take a couple of days to find them all. 96 00:05:58,839 --> 00:06:00,640 Speaker 4: Then a Mariaco at temple. 97 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:04,679 Speaker 2: They yellow with age, he says. Nestor is a retired 98 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 2: academic researcher in economics and a lifelong activist for Puerto 99 00:06:08,279 --> 00:06:11,599 Speaker 2: Rican independence. In fact, he was raised in a family 100 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:15,719 Speaker 2: of independence activists. His mother is Brian known as Pupa. 101 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:19,720 Speaker 2: She co founded the Momento Independencia or the pro independence 102 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:23,240 Speaker 2: movement in Nessor's childhood home in Mais in nineteen fifty nine. 103 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:26,640 Speaker 2: It was a coalition between all the political parties and 104 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:30,200 Speaker 2: organizations advocating for independence at the time, and its creation 105 00:06:30,600 --> 00:06:34,040 Speaker 2: marked a renewed struggle for sovereignty in the sixties and seventies. 106 00:06:36,279 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 4: That the Vian home import can be parre. 107 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:44,479 Speaker 2: Big tim undercover police would be parked outside their house 108 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:48,880 Speaker 2: in eight hour shifts. Growing up in Independentista household, Nestor 109 00:06:48,880 --> 00:06:51,839 Speaker 2: got an early start in his own political activism. Even 110 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 2: in high school, he and some friends organized a pro 111 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:57,600 Speaker 2: independence group. Then in college at the University of Puerto 112 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:00,640 Speaker 2: Rico and San Juan, they would join LAFUPI, which stands 113 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:06,480 Speaker 2: for the Federation of Pro Independence University Students. The university 114 00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 2: and surrounding area of Rio Peiras during that time was 115 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 2: and in many ways still is ground zero for the 116 00:07:13,080 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 2: independence movement and the student group the FUPIE was at 117 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:19,239 Speaker 2: the center of it all. The FUPI became a place 118 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:23,320 Speaker 2: where real friendships formed, like minded students bonded beyond politics 119 00:07:23,360 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 2: and what they call lalucha or the struggle made He 120 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 2: and his friends would advocate for Independence, giving out flyers, 121 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:36,840 Speaker 2: organizing protests, but they'd also go bowling together. I mean 122 00:07:36,880 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 2: they were teenagers after all. Mister became close with a 123 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 2: fellow student who was also a part of the FUPIE 124 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 2: organizing committee and a spokesperson for the group. 125 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 5: His name was William Tabia Equane. 126 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:03,920 Speaker 2: Nestor describes William as being friendly. He was always telling 127 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 2: stories and jokes. He was really easy to get along with. 128 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:13,200 Speaker 2: He and Nestor led a creative protest they called Operaci 129 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:17,480 Speaker 2: and Bandea, Operation Lunch Trade. They would load up their 130 00:08:17,480 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 2: trades with food and just leave them at the checkout 131 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 2: counter as a way to fight back against a price 132 00:08:22,160 --> 00:08:26,520 Speaker 2: hike in the student cafeteria. Almost always the group of 133 00:08:26,560 --> 00:08:29,160 Speaker 2: friends either left from or ended up at Nestor's house. 134 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:33,720 Speaker 2: It was like the unofficial clubhouse. Friends like William even 135 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 2: became like family in the process and became very involved 136 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,280 Speaker 2: in helping BUPA with the official business of the pro 137 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:46,800 Speaker 2: independence movement. The constant surveillance that the group of friends 138 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:49,880 Speaker 2: experienced was something that they were used to at that point. 139 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 2: Nicola Sandreo was also among Nestor's college friends. They also 140 00:08:54,400 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 2: went to high school together and Nicolas's father co founded 141 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 2: a pron dapendens newspaper called Plaidad. Nicolas remembers tagging along 142 00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 2: with his dad to speaking engagements at hotels across the island. 143 00:09:18,600 --> 00:09:21,040 Speaker 2: Police used to write down the names of everybody attending 144 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:24,199 Speaker 2: these events on green index cards. If an individual had 145 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:27,199 Speaker 2: four of these cards, then they'd get their own carpeta. 146 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 2: Hundreds of thousands of people were cataloged this way, and 147 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 2: sometimes the surveillance was surreal. One neighbor told the cops 148 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:49,880 Speaker 2: that his family was communicating with Soviet submarines over the radio. 149 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:51,880 Speaker 2: So they said that because his grandmother had a short 150 00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:54,560 Speaker 2: wave Phillips radio that she listened to the BBC from 151 00:09:54,559 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 2: London on When the police came and inspected, they can 152 00:09:57,960 --> 00:10:17,679 Speaker 2: find any antenna, and at the university there were informants everywhere. 153 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:21,680 Speaker 2: Almost every foopie meeting was documented in the carpetas Nico 154 00:10:21,720 --> 00:10:23,319 Speaker 2: told me that if you were a student like him 155 00:10:23,320 --> 00:10:25,920 Speaker 2: at the time, the police would visit your teachers, they 156 00:10:25,920 --> 00:10:28,319 Speaker 2: would even visit your neighbors and tell them this person 157 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:31,720 Speaker 2: is dangerous, this person is subversive, and you'd get ostracized 158 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 2: by those around you. Association with the independence movement would 159 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:37,920 Speaker 2: usually prevent you from getting a job, and if you 160 00:10:38,040 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 2: had a job, it could get you fired. The idea 161 00:10:44,840 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 2: of Puerto Rican independence has always been portrayed by the 162 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 2: local and US governments as its own kind of cuco, 163 00:10:51,000 --> 00:11:00,000 Speaker 2: a boogeyman. Depend Independence was something to be feared, authority said, 164 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 2: and would be plunged into unimaginable poverty without the financial 165 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:06,880 Speaker 2: support of the States. The US had a serious interest 166 00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:10,080 Speaker 2: in keeping Puerto Rico under its control. It was home 167 00:11:10,080 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 2: to one of the Navy's largest bases, and US companies 168 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,560 Speaker 2: were flocking to the island for cheap labor and to 169 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:20,560 Speaker 2: enjoy tax incentives. In nineteen sixty one, FBI Director Jayed 170 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:23,040 Speaker 2: Garhover sent a memo to his agents in San Juan 171 00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:26,120 Speaker 2: about why it was important to disrupt the activities of 172 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 2: the independence movement. Quote we must have information concerning their weaknesses, morals, 173 00:11:33,080 --> 00:11:38,280 Speaker 2: criminal records, spouses, children, family life, and personal activities other 174 00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:41,839 Speaker 2: than independence activities end quote. This was the middle of 175 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:45,319 Speaker 2: the Cold War, where hysteria about a communist takeover was 176 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:48,440 Speaker 2: rampant in the United States. The government was afraid of 177 00:11:48,480 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 2: exactly that kind of revolutionary sentiment, and it was simmering 178 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:57,000 Speaker 2: in Puerto Rico amongst Independentistas. The movement had been repressed 179 00:11:57,040 --> 00:12:01,440 Speaker 2: since its inception, often violently, and so while the struggle 180 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:05,439 Speaker 2: for independence was largely fought through legitimate political means, some 181 00:12:05,480 --> 00:12:08,560 Speaker 2: groups responded to government persecution with violence of their own. 182 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:11,719 Speaker 2: These groups often set off bombs on the island and 183 00:12:11,800 --> 00:12:15,400 Speaker 2: in the States. In many cases, these bombs were timed 184 00:12:15,400 --> 00:12:18,360 Speaker 2: to only harm property to send a message in response 185 00:12:18,400 --> 00:12:22,640 Speaker 2: to government actions that the groups opposed. In some cases, 186 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:27,920 Speaker 2: though there were both civilian and military casualties. On the 187 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:31,439 Speaker 2: other hand, the government was implicated in various extra judicial 188 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:41,439 Speaker 2: killings of activists. In nineteen sixty two, a bomb went 189 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:44,840 Speaker 2: off and the pharmacy Nestor's father owned and tuning the Pandistas, 190 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:51,160 Speaker 2: were killed. Nestor remembers it vividly how there was blood 191 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:57,320 Speaker 2: on the walls yare. Officials said his parents were building 192 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,680 Speaker 2: bombs for the movement and when exploded by accident, but 193 00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:04,160 Speaker 2: Nestor's family maintains that an undercover police officer had planted 194 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:08,079 Speaker 2: the bomb. No one was ever convicted for the explosion, 195 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:10,760 Speaker 2: and to this day the facts about this and so 196 00:13:10,880 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 2: much else during this time are unclear. And the reason 197 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,200 Speaker 2: I'm telling you. All of this is to underscore that 198 00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:23,199 Speaker 2: revolutionary groups did exist and they had ties to political groups, 199 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:27,320 Speaker 2: including the one. Nessor's family found it. But this surveillance 200 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 2: overwhelmingly cracked down on folks who supported peaceful protest, not violence. 201 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:35,640 Speaker 2: But back to Nestor and the student organization he was 202 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,079 Speaker 2: a part of the FUPIE. In the late nineteen sixties, 203 00:13:39,120 --> 00:13:41,800 Speaker 2: the biggest rift on campus was between the FUPIE and 204 00:13:41,840 --> 00:13:45,720 Speaker 2: the US Army Reserve Officer Training Corps the ROTC, which 205 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:48,920 Speaker 2: recruited on campus for the Vietnam War. For the FUPIE, 206 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 2: the idea of Puerto Rican bodies returning from a war 207 00:13:51,640 --> 00:13:53,439 Speaker 2: waged by the United States on the other side of 208 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:57,320 Speaker 2: the world was difficult to stomach, so Nestor, William and 209 00:13:57,360 --> 00:13:59,520 Speaker 2: the rest of the FUPIE called for protests to oust 210 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:01,600 Speaker 2: the rot from campus so. 211 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:03,800 Speaker 6: There is no tension on the island because people know 212 00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:05,920 Speaker 6: that the trouble, which has been brewing for some time, 213 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:07,959 Speaker 6: lies deeper than the ROTC. 214 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:10,960 Speaker 2: These protests were some of the most intense in the 215 00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 2: history of the University of Puerto Rico. 216 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:15,439 Speaker 6: The violence also spread to a business section of San Juan. 217 00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 6: Students broke windows, there was some looting, but only stores 218 00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 6: owned by state side companies were vandalized. 219 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:22,720 Speaker 2: The night after the. 220 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 6: Fighting, several homes displaying pro independence flags or symbols were burned. 221 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 2: In those years, many students were arrested and expelled for protesting, 222 00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 2: including Nestor and William. They fought the decision in one 223 00:14:34,760 --> 00:14:37,800 Speaker 2: years later, but others weren't able to return to their studies. 224 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:40,400 Speaker 2: The Fupie did get their OTC and the police banned 225 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,480 Speaker 2: from the university. It was a victory, at least on campus, 226 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 2: but in the end it costs lives. Over the course 227 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 2: of two years, two students, one of them a cadet, 228 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:53,560 Speaker 2: two police officers, and one civilian were killed in the clashes. 229 00:14:57,760 --> 00:15:01,720 Speaker 2: Aqua Nesser says that while it might seem ridiculous now, 230 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:04,560 Speaker 2: he and other students in the movement felt like the 231 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 2: revolution was just around the corner. 232 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:11,720 Speaker 4: Afia Afer Cambrio A. 233 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:17,480 Speaker 2: The world seemed to be changing, turning towards the left, 234 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:21,880 Speaker 2: towards socialism, and that's because it actually was just the 235 00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:27,840 Speaker 2: stones throw away. In Cuba, in nineteen sixty nine, a 236 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 2: group of Foopie students were invited by the Cuban government 237 00:15:30,360 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 2: to come see what revolution looked like for themselves a 238 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:40,880 Speaker 2: that's Nico again. The delegation was twenty strong, including Nestor 239 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:44,040 Speaker 2: and William Tabia, but Cuba was a difficult place to 240 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:47,600 Speaker 2: visit as a US citizen. Because of the embargo, direct 241 00:15:47,640 --> 00:15:50,360 Speaker 2: flights to Cuba weren't permitted, so they had to go 242 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:52,400 Speaker 2: first to New York and then take a bus to 243 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:56,920 Speaker 2: Canada and then board a livestock ship to Cuba. Nestor 244 00:15:57,000 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 2: says they were there for a month and a half, 245 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 2: just traveling the island and getting to know Cuba well. 246 00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 4: If I might be go behind, the. 247 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:10,320 Speaker 2: Trip cemented the bonds of friendship between the young activists. 248 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:15,040 Speaker 2: Nestor didn't necessarily know it, but after Cuba, and over 249 00:16:15,040 --> 00:16:17,160 Speaker 2: the course of the seventies, as he took a job 250 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 2: at the university and continued to be an active member 251 00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:25,440 Speaker 2: of the movement, his garbeta continued to grow. He might 252 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:28,960 Speaker 2: have never learned his Garbetta even existed if it weren't 253 00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 2: for the events that took place on a mountaintop in 254 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 2: the center of the island in the late seventies. What 255 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 2: happened in Serra Maravillat changed the course of Puerto Rican 256 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:41,520 Speaker 2: history and ultimately led to the demise of the secret police. 257 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 2: What happened is this. In nineteen seventy eight, an undercover 258 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:51,080 Speaker 2: police agent befriended two university students active in the FUPI. 259 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:54,720 Speaker 2: The agent had been recruited by police when he was 260 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 2: just fifteen and infiltrated independence groups all throughout high school 261 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:04,520 Speaker 2: and college. To seem like a hard COREGN dipendentista. He 262 00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:06,680 Speaker 2: convinced the two students to go with him to blow 263 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:10,280 Speaker 2: up a radio tower on Seto Mount Avia with materials 264 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:14,800 Speaker 2: that he would provide. It made national news. Sixty Minutes 265 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:15,199 Speaker 2: covered it. 266 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:19,520 Speaker 6: July twenty fifth, nineteen seventy eight, marked the eightieth anniversary 267 00:17:19,520 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 6: of the US invasion of Puerto Rico. 268 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:23,840 Speaker 2: When they got to the radio tower, a group of 269 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:31,880 Speaker 2: ten officers ambushed the two students and killed them. 270 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:35,119 Speaker 6: Rosanno and Soto had been murdered, shot on their knees 271 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:36,359 Speaker 6: as they begged for mercy. 272 00:17:37,119 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 2: The Puerto Rican government, backed by the FBI, said that 273 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 2: the students were terrorists planning to blow up the facility. 274 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 2: They claimed that the police were defending themselves in shooting them. 275 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:48,960 Speaker 6: In fact, there was no clear evidence that they were 276 00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:51,119 Speaker 6: terrorists and there's no evidence at all that when they 277 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,000 Speaker 6: went up there they were want to blow up communications towers. 278 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:55,680 Speaker 3: They had no explosives with them, and they. 279 00:17:55,560 --> 00:18:01,480 Speaker 2: Could have done it. This all led to a scandal 280 00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:03,920 Speaker 2: that exposed a massive cover up by both the Puerto 281 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,680 Speaker 2: Rican government and the FBI. There were years of televised 282 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:11,280 Speaker 2: trials and investigations that slowly unraveled the story of what 283 00:18:11,320 --> 00:18:16,240 Speaker 2: really happened. The undercover agent was eventually acquitted on a 284 00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:19,800 Speaker 2: lesser charge after testifying against other police officers involved in 285 00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:25,560 Speaker 2: the murder. But two months after his acquittal, he was assassinated. 286 00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:29,679 Speaker 2: Anita Bernentista group took credit, though some speculate it was 287 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 2: actually retaliation by fellow police officers for snitching on them. 288 00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:39,680 Speaker 2: But why am I telling you all of this? Because 289 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:43,960 Speaker 2: this scandal sparked so much outrage that it was what 290 00:18:44,119 --> 00:18:48,160 Speaker 2: led to the revelation that there was secret surveillance happening 291 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,600 Speaker 2: at all. In nineteen eighty seven, during a heated discussion 292 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:54,159 Speaker 2: on a talk radio program about the settlement of a 293 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:59,520 Speaker 2: Ya murders, a police officer inadvertently spilt the beans. Everybody 294 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:01,879 Speaker 2: knows that they're files on the independent these Thus he said, 295 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:05,360 Speaker 2: all of a sudden, what had been dismissed for decades 296 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:09,479 Speaker 2: as paranoia as a cuco within independence circles, turned out 297 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:19,400 Speaker 2: to be very real. There really were informants everywhere. When 298 00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:21,720 Speaker 2: the surveillance program came to light, it at least a 299 00:19:21,800 --> 00:19:24,880 Speaker 2: debate over what to do with the files. That's garbadas 300 00:19:25,640 --> 00:19:28,360 Speaker 2: the government wanted to destroy them, but the courts did 301 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:31,959 Speaker 2: something unprecedented. They said the files should be saved and 302 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 2: returned to those who had been watched, return as their property. 303 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:38,480 Speaker 2: It's the only such case in the world of original 304 00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:42,640 Speaker 2: surveillance files being returned directly to victims that could. 305 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:46,760 Speaker 4: Stay u Filano. 306 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:50,160 Speaker 2: So you have the pas of two or twice Liso. 307 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 2: That's a news report from nineteen ninety two when a 308 00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,320 Speaker 2: judge in Puerto Rico ruled that the surveillance had infringed 309 00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:59,000 Speaker 2: on the constitutional rights of those in the independence movement, 310 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:01,919 Speaker 2: and he ordered the names of the police informants involved 311 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:07,200 Speaker 2: in the program also be released. When the victims of 312 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:10,360 Speaker 2: surveillance were finally given their files in the early nineties, 313 00:20:10,600 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 2: to their surprise, the documents were completely unredacted published whole. 314 00:20:17,320 --> 00:20:21,320 Speaker 2: The files were an encyclopedia of betrayal, in some cases 315 00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:27,400 Speaker 2: documenting decades of deceit and relationships under false pretenses. As 316 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:29,560 Speaker 2: they read them, people found out that many of the 317 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:33,520 Speaker 2: reports had been filed not by strangers, but instead those 318 00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:36,560 Speaker 2: closest to them. And what Nestor and his group of 319 00:20:36,560 --> 00:20:44,520 Speaker 2: friends found out would be devastating for starters about that 320 00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 2: Cuba trip. 321 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:51,240 Speaker 4: And Binde, dos Hint and Kubielto. 322 00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 2: Of the group of twenty who went, two were undercover informants. 323 00:20:56,840 --> 00:20:59,359 Speaker 2: Nesser's friend Nico was the first in their group to 324 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:02,240 Speaker 2: get the Dakota list of informants from his carpeta. He 325 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:08,040 Speaker 2: recognized the name Jim, someone who was close to Nesta 326 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:10,120 Speaker 2: and Pupa practically family. 327 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 4: Here's Nestor casso avea persona. 328 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:22,160 Speaker 2: Someone who was a Fopie member who shared so much 329 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:24,159 Speaker 2: with them and yet was an agent. 330 00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:26,439 Speaker 4: He com. 331 00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:35,480 Speaker 2: He this person had filed fifty four reports against Nestor 332 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:39,800 Speaker 2: Ganas a PERSONA William Tapia. 333 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:52,400 Speaker 4: Yeah, William Tapia. 334 00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:52,880 Speaker 2: William Tapia, the easy going, funny friend, the FUPIE spokesperson 335 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:56,199 Speaker 2: who was arrested with Nestor for protesting the rotc who 336 00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 2: went to Cuba, who was a part of the struggle. 337 00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:05,480 Speaker 2: That William Tapia. 338 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:11,679 Speaker 3: When we come back the search for an informant. This 339 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 3: is La Brega, and we're back to La Brega. When 340 00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 3: we left off, Nestor Nasario Trabal just learned that one 341 00:22:28,840 --> 00:22:31,520 Speaker 3: of his close friends from the Puerto Rican Independence movement, 342 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 3: William Tapia, was actually collaborating with the secret Police. Chris 343 00:22:36,560 --> 00:22:38,360 Speaker 3: Gregory Rivera picks it up from here. 344 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:43,879 Speaker 2: In an interview in twenty sixteen, Nestor's mom told me 345 00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:49,320 Speaker 2: how close she was with William Tapia. I loved him 346 00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:52,080 Speaker 2: like a son. There was a time when her husband, 347 00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 2: Nessa's father was in the hospital. Tapia stayed with him overnight. 348 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:06,080 Speaker 2: William Bupa says she gave William his first car. She 349 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:08,439 Speaker 2: was a bridesmaid at his wedding. She took care of 350 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:10,920 Speaker 2: his first son while he worked and his wife studied. 351 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:14,119 Speaker 2: And so when she first learned that Tapia had been 352 00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:17,639 Speaker 2: an informant her son Nestor says, she took it really hard. 353 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:22,480 Speaker 2: She refused to believe it. Pupa later said that she 354 00:23:22,600 --> 00:23:25,560 Speaker 2: wanted to believe that Tapia would never hurt her, would 355 00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 2: never betray her, because she was so good to him. 356 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:33,120 Speaker 2: I had been hearing William Tapia's name from the subjects 357 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 2: I photographed for years. He was a visible figure in 358 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,919 Speaker 2: the independence movement. When the files came out, Gladidra, a 359 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:43,719 Speaker 2: pro independence newspaper on the island, published the famous Erista Dechotas, 360 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:48,480 Speaker 2: or List of Snitches. Each week they would profile one 361 00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:51,879 Speaker 2: of the informants discovered from the files. Dapia got his 362 00:23:51,920 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 2: own quarter page. Bupa has been pretty public about when 363 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 2: Tabia he comes up in her memoirs. She spoke about 364 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:05,919 Speaker 2: him in a documentary too. She came to believe that 365 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:08,760 Speaker 2: he was more than a mere informant, but an undercover 366 00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:12,159 Speaker 2: agent assigned to infiltrate her family and gain her trust. 367 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:16,240 Speaker 2: For decades, Tapiah has been silent, although I had heard 368 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:19,720 Speaker 2: from sources that when the newspaper list was first published, 369 00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:22,119 Speaker 2: he sent a letter to the editor trying to clear 370 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:26,919 Speaker 2: his name. I have had questions about William that have 371 00:24:26,960 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 2: been lingering for years now. What was his involvement exactly 372 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:34,480 Speaker 2: if he was an informant, why did he collaborate with 373 00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 2: the police, How did he defend his actions or did 374 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,000 Speaker 2: he dispute the story the independence movement had told about 375 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:49,439 Speaker 2: him for decades. Alana and I decided to look for 376 00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:51,880 Speaker 2: him and we found a social media profile. 377 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:53,640 Speaker 3: Do you have the link? 378 00:24:53,680 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 2: Candy? 379 00:24:54,720 --> 00:24:56,280 Speaker 3: The question is is this the right guy? 380 00:24:56,760 --> 00:25:00,000 Speaker 2: I'm in? It all checks out. He was sharing messages 381 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,080 Speaker 2: critical of the physical Control Board in Puerto Rico and 382 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,920 Speaker 2: supportive of independence, along with family pictures and prayers. 383 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:09,800 Speaker 3: Does it mean anything to you that he's just hanging 384 00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:10,200 Speaker 3: out here. 385 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, it makes me feel like he's obviously somebody's father 386 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 2: and husband and all of these things. You have the 387 00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:23,120 Speaker 2: perspective of somebody who feels like they were wronged by 388 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 2: this person, or was betrayed perhaps, But you look at 389 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:28,879 Speaker 2: his face of a page. Now he's sharing, you know, 390 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,200 Speaker 2: like the weird stuff that your parents share, like these, 391 00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 2: like inspirational messages. It turned out Tapia was living in 392 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:42,200 Speaker 2: Puerto Rico, so I told him I wanted to talk 393 00:25:42,240 --> 00:25:46,000 Speaker 2: to him about his involvement within the Pendentistas. He didn't 394 00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:48,560 Speaker 2: agree to have our calls recorded, but he did agree 395 00:25:48,560 --> 00:25:52,320 Speaker 2: to meet so Lula William. He told me all about 396 00:25:52,320 --> 00:25:55,240 Speaker 2: a nonprofit he started that digs wells in rural communities 397 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:57,520 Speaker 2: on the island so they can have ready access to water. 398 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:01,359 Speaker 2: The years of militancy and the independence movement, he said, 399 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,760 Speaker 2: were formative to his work and life now, and he 400 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,480 Speaker 2: invited me to come check out his project and to 401 00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:21,480 Speaker 2: talk about his time in the movement. And I see 402 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 2: you and William Dabin We pulled over at a roadside restaurant. 403 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,120 Speaker 2: It was so early in the morning that it was closed. 404 00:26:28,720 --> 00:26:31,639 Speaker 2: He jumped out of Alexis suv to greet us. I 405 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:35,040 Speaker 2: bought it used, he reassured us later. Dapia has about 406 00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:38,920 Speaker 2: five foot seven, gregarious and tan. We first talked about 407 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,400 Speaker 2: water witching, a practice where people claim to be able 408 00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:45,000 Speaker 2: to divine where to find underground water. Turns out he 409 00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 2: witches for water to dig the wells. He gave me 410 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,840 Speaker 2: a demonstration right there in the parking lot. I have 411 00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,040 Speaker 2: to say I was taken aback by the fact that 412 00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:56,240 Speaker 2: the person I had heard and read so much about 413 00:26:56,440 --> 00:27:01,200 Speaker 2: was in front of me. Daby A declined to record 414 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:03,520 Speaker 2: an interview, but as I was heading home from spending 415 00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:06,399 Speaker 2: time with him that day, I called Ilana how to go? 416 00:27:08,880 --> 00:27:12,280 Speaker 2: It went well? I mean, I don't know if well 417 00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:16,560 Speaker 2: is the word. I don't know if I was expecting 418 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:19,440 Speaker 2: the answer that he gave us, and we asked him 419 00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:33,120 Speaker 2: about all of it. Dab I sached and I spent 420 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:35,720 Speaker 2: that entire day criss crossing the mountains in the center 421 00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,040 Speaker 2: of the island, looking at these community wells that he's 422 00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:41,800 Speaker 2: helping install. Over a coffee and banalie at one point, 423 00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:44,600 Speaker 2: at a roadside Kiosk, he opened up about his upbringing 424 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:47,320 Speaker 2: in a working class neighborhood of San Juan. He went 425 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:50,239 Speaker 2: to a Catholic school run by Spanish priests who had 426 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:54,560 Speaker 2: fled political persecution in Spain. They were the first to 427 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:58,160 Speaker 2: introduce him to radical politics, urging him to attend Communist 428 00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:01,879 Speaker 2: party meetings and discuss the ideas with them. His family, though, 429 00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:06,399 Speaker 2: was very conservative and pro statehood. His father had a 430 00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:09,920 Speaker 2: fifty first state bumper sticker on his car. He also 431 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:13,160 Speaker 2: opened up about his frustrations with the independence movement, how 432 00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 2: he wanted to double down on grassroots activism while others 433 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 2: were more engaged in theory and politics. To him, the 434 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:23,320 Speaker 2: movement was too hung up on convoluted intellectual ideas. That's 435 00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:26,040 Speaker 2: why he says he's digging wells today instead of sitting 436 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:29,800 Speaker 2: around and theorizing. He told me about this one time 437 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:32,680 Speaker 2: back when he was a member of the FUPI, where 438 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:36,040 Speaker 2: most of the meeting was spent discussing the philosophy around 439 00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:48,239 Speaker 2: the perfect placement of loudspeakers for speeches. Eventually at the 440 00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 2: top of a mountain with views of the entire north 441 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:53,240 Speaker 2: side of the island. I got the courage to ask 442 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:57,160 Speaker 2: him about his time being an informant. I knew you 443 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,360 Speaker 2: were going to ask me about that, he said. Said 444 00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:10,360 Speaker 2: it was true, but that he had only been an 445 00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 2: informant for about a year during college and stopped after 446 00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:17,400 Speaker 2: the trip to Cuba with Nestor and Nico. He also 447 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,120 Speaker 2: said that the allegations that he got close to Poupa 448 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,080 Speaker 2: for information and that he was a paid agent assigned 449 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 2: to her were also false, and on top of that, 450 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:29,720 Speaker 2: that he didn't inform for money or because he wanted 451 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 2: to hurt the cause, but because he actually saw an 452 00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:36,520 Speaker 2: opportunity to help the movement. A relative who was an 453 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,880 Speaker 2: officer in the intelligence division had asked him to file 454 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:44,280 Speaker 2: reports Sanni dependentist. Thus, according to him, he then went 455 00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:46,800 Speaker 2: to Manuel de jot A Gonzalez, who was the then 456 00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 2: president of the FUPIE, and hatched a plan. He would 457 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:54,360 Speaker 2: become an informant and feed the cops harmless information to 458 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:58,160 Speaker 2: see if they could get valuable information. To return, he 459 00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:05,680 Speaker 2: would become a double agent. Typically informants like him were 460 00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:08,800 Speaker 2: either coursed or paid, but he maintains that he never 461 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 2: took any money. William says dos at the beginning of 462 00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:17,840 Speaker 2: this episode, as Again and I were in manuel Le 463 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:21,880 Speaker 2: Rota Gonzadas's office looking at his carpeta. We were trying 464 00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:24,600 Speaker 2: to confirm Dapia's timeline that he had only been an 465 00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:28,080 Speaker 2: informant for about a year. From these files, at least, 466 00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:30,880 Speaker 2: it doesn't seem to be the decades long collaboration with 467 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:33,720 Speaker 2: the cops that the movement has alleged. But the files 468 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:35,960 Speaker 2: don't reveal anything about William's claim that he was a 469 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,760 Speaker 2: double agent. So I asked Manuel Jrota Gonsadez about that. 470 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 2: That's the feel good Oh yeah, he told me. Obviously 471 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:52,040 Speaker 2: it's a lie that he never directed William to infiltrate 472 00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:55,640 Speaker 2: the police. And as for that supposedly harmless information that 473 00:30:55,680 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 2: he fed the cops, Nesser says that one of the 474 00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:01,400 Speaker 2: most damning reports in his carpetta was in fact provided 475 00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:05,320 Speaker 2: by William. Nestor was briefly declared a fugitive for leaving 476 00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,760 Speaker 2: the island to cool off when he faced charges linked 477 00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:11,640 Speaker 2: to the ROTC protests. He says William gave up his whereabouts, 478 00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:15,160 Speaker 2: which could have landed Nestor in jail. William told me 479 00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:19,239 Speaker 2: that Nestor's whereabouts were public knowledge at the time. Later on, 480 00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:22,360 Speaker 2: Dabia was convicted in connection with the bomb planted by 481 00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:25,480 Speaker 2: the movement in a federal building in nineteen seventy one. 482 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:28,560 Speaker 2: His arrests made front page news, and the movement rallied 483 00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 2: for his release. He spent seven years fighting the charges 484 00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:36,560 Speaker 2: and was convicted anyway, but he never actually served his 485 00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:40,520 Speaker 2: sentence in prison. On the one hand, what kind of 486 00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:43,800 Speaker 2: police informant would go through seven years of appeals just 487 00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:47,280 Speaker 2: to end up convicted. But on the other hand, the 488 00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:49,120 Speaker 2: fact that he got out of going to prison for 489 00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:53,160 Speaker 2: serious criminal offenses seemed suspicious to many in the movement, 490 00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 2: and they believe that it's all part of his cover 491 00:31:56,320 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 2: as an agent. Was William an informant or an agent 492 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:07,640 Speaker 2: assigned to PUPA. Was he part of revolutionary forces or 493 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 2: even independentista at all? Or was he just playing both 494 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,400 Speaker 2: sides and got in over his head. You could argue 495 00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:19,440 Speaker 2: that this confusion is part of a larger plan. Manuel 496 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:25,880 Speaker 2: Gonzada says, all this surveillance wasn't done to uncover revolutionary groups. 497 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,160 Speaker 2: It was done to destroy them, to turn them against 498 00:32:31,160 --> 00:32:48,320 Speaker 2: each other. Even collaborators were victims, he says. Also from 499 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:57,880 Speaker 2: vo some were unremorseful, but others not so much. They 500 00:32:57,880 --> 00:33:03,320 Speaker 2: have to live carrying that weight on their content. Maybe 501 00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:14,400 Speaker 2: Dapia is one of them, he said, who knows. For 502 00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 2: his part, Tapia says he feels just as betrayed by 503 00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:21,560 Speaker 2: his friends as they feel betrayed by him. When the 504 00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:25,960 Speaker 2: garbetas came out and he proclaimed his innocence, nobody believed him. 505 00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:28,920 Speaker 2: He felt like the movement turned their backs on him. 506 00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:31,560 Speaker 2: He told me. The way he sees it is that 507 00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:38,520 Speaker 2: he freed himself with the people that didn't truly know him. 508 00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:42,640 Speaker 2: As for Nester, he isn't interested in hearing about or 509 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:54,520 Speaker 2: from William ever familiar among family. It doesn't matter if 510 00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 2: you have different views. You can share ideas, talk, argue, 511 00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:05,480 Speaker 2: take it. But the traders, people who betrayed you, that's 512 00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:17,239 Speaker 2: another thing. Is a Puerto Rican social and political psychologist 513 00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 2: at NYU. He says that part of the reason it's 514 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:23,280 Speaker 2: so hard to untangle what actually happened in this period 515 00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:25,960 Speaker 2: of history has to do with the way that carpetas 516 00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:29,960 Speaker 2: were returned. The government basically said, come get your file 517 00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:32,359 Speaker 2: and deal with what happened on your own. 518 00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:38,959 Speaker 7: It led to individual process of reconciliation and remembering, which 519 00:34:39,200 --> 00:34:39,640 Speaker 7: led to. 520 00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:42,399 Speaker 4: A process of. 521 00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:47,319 Speaker 7: Forgetting in the collective sense of it. 522 00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:51,720 Speaker 2: There was never a collective process to understand what happened 523 00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:54,279 Speaker 2: like there was in East Germany or after many of 524 00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:58,279 Speaker 2: the South American dictatorships with similar secret police programs. And 525 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:01,719 Speaker 2: there is no single place you can go to see 526 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,759 Speaker 2: all of the garbedas. Some are in people's closets and garages, 527 00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:09,200 Speaker 2: the rest are in a poorly funded national archive. And 528 00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:12,680 Speaker 2: because there is no complete archive, there is no cohesive 529 00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:15,759 Speaker 2: way to remember or interpret all of this history or 530 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:20,200 Speaker 2: definitively understand the roles of people like Tapia and others 531 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:23,680 Speaker 2: who are involved. But it's not like a national reckoning. 532 00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:28,400 Speaker 2: Isn't possible or hasn't happened before. In Puerto Rico, Serro Maravilla, 533 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,200 Speaker 2: where the two students were murdered, is more widely known 534 00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:31,920 Speaker 2: and understood. 535 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:33,520 Speaker 4: I don't think we're there. 536 00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:37,800 Speaker 7: Yeah, we lost garpetas because there was never a process 537 00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:41,080 Speaker 7: like the one in Settra Madavia was the worst trials 538 00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:44,319 Speaker 7: after trials. In every instance of the news that was 539 00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:45,520 Speaker 7: the main topic. 540 00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:50,520 Speaker 2: There was an actual national conversation. People couldn't not have 541 00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 2: an opinion about it. But the garbetas are a different story. 542 00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:59,280 Speaker 2: They're seldom taught in school today, so many years later 543 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:03,800 Speaker 2: they become a kind of folklore without garpetia, like my 544 00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:06,280 Speaker 2: mom used to warm me when I would go cover protests. 545 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:10,759 Speaker 2: And even though Governor Perro Rosello formally outlawed carpetio of 546 00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:14,080 Speaker 2: any kind in nineteen ninety four, many of us still 547 00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:25,839 Speaker 2: believe deep down were being watched, and that threat came 548 00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:29,239 Speaker 2: back into sharper focus just last year when we learned 549 00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:33,200 Speaker 2: of another example of authorities surveilling activists challenging the government. 550 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:37,000 Speaker 2: A video of a student protest at the university had 551 00:36:37,000 --> 00:36:40,640 Speaker 2: been live streamed on Facebook. Puerto Rican police then got 552 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:44,320 Speaker 2: personal information and messages from the more than five thousand 553 00:36:44,400 --> 00:36:47,600 Speaker 2: people who had interacted with the student newspaper pages where 554 00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:52,400 Speaker 2: the video appeared. That led to criminal charges for seven 555 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,799 Speaker 2: of the students involved in the protest, which they've been 556 00:36:55,840 --> 00:37:02,120 Speaker 2: fighting in court since twenty seventeen. Protesters of this surveillance 557 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:05,799 Speaker 2: have called it digital garbadeo, a stark reminder that this 558 00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:12,440 Speaker 2: practice is not over the result of all of this 559 00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:16,160 Speaker 2: surveillance is the fear that was instilled in Puerto Ricans. 560 00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:20,680 Speaker 2: Fear of the government, fear of each other, fear of 561 00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:27,719 Speaker 2: imagining an alternative political reality. Ultimately, the problem with surveillance 562 00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:31,960 Speaker 2: goes beyond the information that was collected. It's about how 563 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:35,160 Speaker 2: you might conjure up the boogeyman, the gougle if you 564 00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:39,680 Speaker 2: dare express yourself freely, and maybe that's what the government 565 00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:44,400 Speaker 2: intended all along. Even though the Secret Police was disbanded 566 00:37:44,440 --> 00:37:48,080 Speaker 2: over thirty years ago, for many Puerto Ricans, that google 567 00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:50,920 Speaker 2: that they unleashed still lives on. 568 00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:12,600 Speaker 3: Chris Gregory Rivera is a photographer from San Juan. If 569 00:38:12,600 --> 00:38:15,360 Speaker 3: you want to see Chris's photographs of Las Carbetas and 570 00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:17,880 Speaker 3: photos the police took as part of their surveillance, you 571 00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:21,520 Speaker 3: can head over to Chris Gregory dot co. That's dot co. 572 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:27,280 Speaker 3: Laverega is a co production of WNYC Studios and Fuburo Studios. 573 00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,840 Speaker 3: This episode is available in Spanish as well, and you 574 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,319 Speaker 3: can listen to either wherever you hear your podcasts through 575 00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:39,879 Speaker 3: Leaverega's podcast feed. This episode was produced by Esquirorigua Sandino 576 00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:43,239 Speaker 3: and by me with help from Mark Pagan. It was 577 00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:46,560 Speaker 3: edited by Marlon Bishop. Fact checking was by Istra Pacheco, 578 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:51,960 Speaker 3: engineering by Stephanie Leveau, Lea Sha Damren, Rosanna Caban, Garrie 579 00:38:52,040 --> 00:38:56,319 Speaker 3: La Vais and Alicia ba Etube. Original music for Laverega 580 00:38:56,360 --> 00:39:00,120 Speaker 3: was composed by Balloon and our theme song is by EFE. 581 00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:04,360 Speaker 3: Art for this piece was done by Fernando Nora. Leadership 582 00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:07,160 Speaker 3: support for La Brega is provided by the Jonathan Logan 583 00:39:07,239 --> 00:39:10,800 Speaker 3: Family Foundation and the john S and James L. Knight Foundation, 584 00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:15,680 Speaker 3: with additional support provided by Amy Liss. Deep gratitude to 585 00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:21,560 Speaker 3: Lucilla Risari, Joel Rivera Blanco, Mario rocce Osvaldo Rivera Soto, 586 00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:28,480 Speaker 3: Charlie Glesias, Emily Botine, Adrian Florido, Rika Rodriguez, and Ilcia. 587 00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:35,200 Speaker 2: Latino USA is made possible in part by the chan 588 00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:40,600 Speaker 2: Zuckerberg Initiative, the Ford Foundation, working with visionaries on the 589 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:46,040 Speaker 2: front lines of social change worldwide, and funding for Latino 590 00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:49,040 Speaker 2: USA is. Coverage of a Culture of Health is made 591 00:39:49,120 --> 00:39:51,520 Speaker 2: possible in part by a grant from the Robert Wood 592 00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:52,520 Speaker 2: Johnson Foundation.