Speaker 1: Welcome to NFL Daily, where one of the hosts Today's
Speaker 1: preparation for NFL training Camp is very, very.
Speaker 2: Different than the other hosts. I'm Jordan Rodrig.
Speaker 1: Filling in, of course for the great Greg Rosenthal while
Speaker 1: he's on vacation. Joining me as co host today is
Speaker 1: my friend, one of my favorite people to speak to
Speaker 1: in general and certainly on this show. A long snapper
Speaker 1: heading into we've recently found out his nineteenth not eighteenth,
Speaker 1: nineteenth NFL season, host on Sirius XM and co host
Speaker 1: of the JJ and Luke podcast. It's JJ Jansen. Welcome back, JJ,
Speaker 1: I appreciate it.
Speaker 3: Thank you. I'm going to get full credit for every year.
Speaker 4: At this point long Snappers, they don't have a whole
Speaker 4: lot of stats, so years of service is definitely one
Speaker 4: of the most important ones that we've got, so we'll
Speaker 4: get full credit for that. But I'm so this is
Speaker 4: gonna be a blast. I'm so excited to be joining you.
Speaker 4: We've been friends for a long time. We love talking
Speaker 4: ball and just hanging out and all those things. One
Speaker 4: of the beauties of Beat reporters in the lockero, and
Speaker 4: there's a lot of back and forth and all that
Speaker 4: but you get to build relationships with the people covering
Speaker 4: you in so I know yours is a friendship I've
Speaker 4: enjoyed for a long time.
Speaker 1: And we've already covered you don't have many normy friends, JJ,
Speaker 1: you have a lot of athlete Hall of Famer type friends,
Speaker 1: and I'm very honored that I'm one of your normy friends.
Speaker 2: So how else would we have become.
Speaker 1: Normy friends without the beat writer player locker room situation.
Speaker 4: Basically, my friendship groups revolve around pro athletes and parents
Speaker 4: that their kids go to my kids' school. That's the
Speaker 4: phase of life that I'm currently in, and I always laugh.
Speaker 4: My oldest is thirteen, and when you have that conversation like, hey,
Speaker 4: you got to do well in school, you're probably not
Speaker 4: going to be a professional athlete, Like you have to
Speaker 4: do all that. When my dad gave me that talk,
Speaker 4: that made sense. I didn't know any professional athletes. My
Speaker 4: oldest son only knows professional athletes, so he thinks I'm crazy.
Speaker 4: So it's an interesting parenting dynamic trying to emphasize academics
Speaker 4: to kids that only know pro athletes hanging around their dads.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like that arrested development meme. Where it's like, well,
Speaker 1: it worked for those people, so it could work.
Speaker 4: It could work for me, right, Absolutely, He's he's full
Speaker 4: on board. All all of my kids think they are
Speaker 4: going to be in pro sports, which would do nothing
Speaker 4: but uh would make me feel really good. But uh,
Speaker 4: it is. It's a little bit of an interesting dynamic
Speaker 4: around here. But we have lots of normy friends. We
Speaker 4: know doctors and lawyers and architects.
Speaker 2: I believe you.
Speaker 4: One of my one of my best friends has a
Speaker 4: demo company, so it's it's all up and down the spectrum.
Speaker 4: So we got we got normy friends. You're a normy friend,
Speaker 4: but that's a good thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Hey, JJ has lawyer and doctor friends guys. Oh,
Speaker 1: normal normy friends.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe I believe you there, Jja.
Speaker 4: It's like like my lawyer friends are like real estate
Speaker 4: construction lawyers.
Speaker 3: Like it's it's kind.
Speaker 2: Of like the boring kind.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 4: I was an accounting major, so I feel like I'm
Speaker 4: pretty comfortable saying there are certain jobs that just aren't
Speaker 4: that exciting, and those are the people we'll I hang
Speaker 4: out with.
Speaker 3: So that's me.
Speaker 2: I love that for you.
Speaker 1: I have a question for you before we have a
Speaker 1: really exciting show coming up today. We're gonna do quote
Speaker 1: unquote most Interesting team Tiers, a completely subjective topic, by
Speaker 1: the way. So I'm just heading off at the past.
Speaker 1: All of the people who are going to be in
Speaker 1: our mentions yelling at us for not putting their teams
Speaker 1: in certain tiers. I bet they won't even be able
Speaker 1: to differentiate between like the level of quality between the tiers.
Speaker 1: It's just what we think is most interesting, right. So
Speaker 1: that's we're gonna get to that in a minute. And
Speaker 1: also we have some news we're gonna get to here
Speaker 1: in a moment. But as I was preparing for this show,
Speaker 1: I had this question, And every time I talk to you,
Speaker 1: I'm like, man, next time I talk to you them,
Speaker 1: I should really ask JJ this question. How does it
Speaker 1: make you feel that when you google your name, one
Speaker 1: of the top results that comes up is is JJ
Speaker 1: Jansen still on the Panthers.
Speaker 3: I didn't know that that was a thing. That doesn't
Speaker 3: surprise me. So I do a.
Speaker 4: Weekly spot here in show Arlotte with Mac and Bowe.
Speaker 4: You remember in wfn Z they're great guys.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And on.
Speaker 4: The weekly spot they do a segment of ask JJ
Speaker 4: Inevitably everyone asks me how old I am?
Speaker 3: This past week?
Speaker 4: You know, around July fourth, was was I there at
Speaker 4: the signing of the Declaration of Independence? So as a
Speaker 4: forty year old NFL player, I might as well be
Speaker 4: as old as Benjamin Franklin.
Speaker 3: So I've gotten used to it.
Speaker 4: But that doesn't Again, our stats are primarily longevity driven,
Speaker 4: so I take it as a term of endearment.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we could get into an entire other show of
Speaker 1: what advanced metrics could you be used to quantify talent
Speaker 1: among long snappers?
Speaker 2: At the lay person could understand.
Speaker 1: I'm sure that is some sort of genius investor project
Speaker 1: that you'll have going once you finally do decide to retire.
Speaker 2: I hope you keep playing forever.
Speaker 1: I hope you're ninety out there just spinning at fifteen
Speaker 1: yards back JJ. We'll start with the news today before
Speaker 1: we get to our segment. It is like some a
Speaker 1: couple serious topics. We've had a lot of sad news
Speaker 1: catch up this week. Earlier this week, Nick Schuk and
Speaker 1: I hosted a show. If the listeners haven't caught that yet,
Speaker 1: it was our Kids in Charge show. Greg is on vacation,
Speaker 1: so the kids are deciding you know who, you know
Speaker 1: how the house party works here, but some sad news
Speaker 1: and then continuation of more sad news. Marshawn Neeland was
Speaker 1: posthumously diagnosed with CTE. The Concussion and CTE Foundation announced
Speaker 1: this week. The former Dallas Cowboys defensive end of course,
Speaker 1: died by suicide last fall. He was just twenty four
Speaker 1: years old. The family has released a statement. While this
Speaker 1: diagnosis does not change the tragedy of his passing, it
Speaker 1: provides important context about some of the struggles he may
Speaker 1: have been facing. We continue to remember Marshaan with compassion
Speaker 1: for the person he was, rather than defining him by
Speaker 1: the final moments of his life. A really really sad situation.
Speaker 1: Our thoughts are with his family. Of course. JJ, you're
Speaker 1: a current player. You've been active with the NFLPA. I
Speaker 1: know you're active in discussions about, you know, how players
Speaker 1: could protect themselves. What this conversation is in locker rooms
Speaker 1: and outside of it. I just sort of want to
Speaker 1: get out of the way for you here. What is
Speaker 1: your reaction seeing this news?
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, it's a continuation of just sort of a
Speaker 4: sad story. I think that statement from their family is
Speaker 4: it's beautiful, right. You don't want anyone's life to be
Speaker 4: remembered in one moment or a tragic ending in any
Speaker 4: sort of way. So I think that's fantastic just how
Speaker 4: they're able to memorialize him and such sweetened and significant words.
Speaker 3: Look, we'd all be lying if we didn't think that.
Speaker 4: Football is a violent sport, and there are certain risks
Speaker 4: that come with the game. One of the things that
Speaker 4: I commend the NFL and then all of the trickle
Speaker 4: down through college and high school and into pop Warner
Speaker 4: is doing our very best to keep the essence of
Speaker 4: the game, it's physicality and toughness, while also taking away
Speaker 4: the unnecessary risks are associated with head traumas and head
Speaker 4: to head contact in any sort of way. And we
Speaker 4: certainly are well aware that head trauma concussions at all
Speaker 4: levels of sports and in all different kinds of sports
Speaker 4: are real and significant injuries. Whether you're talking about soccer
Speaker 4: or baseball, basketball, football, we have a lot of it.
Speaker 4: It's certainly not unique to our sport, though, And what
Speaker 4: I think I want to commend the NFL in and
Speaker 4: just the football in general, is, hey, look, how do
Speaker 4: we make our games safer that we can keep the
Speaker 4: essence of the physicality and the toughness, and hey, the
Speaker 4: toughest guys are playing at the NFL level, but also
Speaker 4: make this really a game that boys and girls can
Speaker 4: play at young ages with the flag football movements and
Speaker 4: things of that sort without incurring the same sort of risks.
Speaker 4: So at the NFL level, Look, we are all well
Speaker 4: aware of the risks. This information kind of come out.
Speaker 4: I don't want to say it's a surprise. It's certainly
Speaker 4: shocking and sad, but we know that these are part
Speaker 4: of the risks that come with the game, and everyone
Speaker 4: that plays does so willingly, and I think that's why
Speaker 4: you continue to see the league do everything it can
Speaker 4: to take out unnecessary head injuries. We've seen adjustments to
Speaker 4: the kickoff rules. We've seen adjustments in how defensive players
Speaker 4: are allowed to hit offensive players, protections of quarterbacks and
Speaker 4: things of that sort, the guardian caps and the improvement
Speaker 4: in the helmet. We know this is a significant and
Speaker 4: serious issue and we're continuing to work towards it, and
Speaker 4: these are just reminders of the work is still there
Speaker 4: to be done. But we've made incredible improvements and need
Speaker 4: to continue to do so.
Speaker 3: In the future.
Speaker 1: I think one of the things that really was surprising
Speaker 1: to me, not in a good or bad way, just
Speaker 1: came as a surprise to me is the duality by
Speaker 1: which NFL players do operate. And obviously I'm someone who
Speaker 1: never played the game, and certainly never played at a
Speaker 1: pro level. I think I would probably be like a
Speaker 1: right tackle, I would assume, but I feel like that
Speaker 1: that duality of we carry this awareness with us for
Speaker 1: the most part, the locker rooms are a range of humanity.
Speaker 1: I don't think people understand that enough. It is the
Speaker 1: widest range of human nature and opinion and perspective that
Speaker 1: you could find anywhere on the planet, and it's all
Speaker 1: condensed into like, you know, ninety seats inside of a room, right,
Speaker 1: And there's a duality among a lot of NFL players,
Speaker 1: certainly veterans too, who are thinking about life after football
Speaker 1: and what that will look like, of carrying that awareness
Speaker 1: with them while also committing fully to the game itself.
Speaker 1: And I know you've seen this and you also carry
Speaker 1: it with you. The complexity of what that really means
Speaker 1: and sort of like the nuance of what that really
Speaker 1: means as a player.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a big boy sport, and you have to
Speaker 4: handle a lot of different challenges, right, and I think
Speaker 4: we would be remiss if we didn't also talk about
Speaker 4: that there's a lot of mental health, yeah, things that
Speaker 4: need to be handled inside of an NFL locker room.
Speaker 4: There's a tremendous amount of pressure on players. There's a
Speaker 4: tremendous sense of identity and being a player, and when
Speaker 4: you are struggling, whether it's professionally or personally, and that
Speaker 4: identity is shook, it can cause a lot of potential issues.
Speaker 4: And so I think that's where the league is really
Speaker 4: good about adding to the player's dock at the ability
Speaker 4: to see healthcare professionals and things of that sort. But
Speaker 4: I would also say that one of the things that
Speaker 4: I hope that we can overtime continue to kind of
Speaker 4: get back to when I first got into the league.
Speaker 4: And this is a long time ago, so two thousand
Speaker 4: and eight, my mentor was John Casey. So John played
Speaker 4: in the era pre free agency, and then the era
Speaker 4: pre free agency. Mentoring was a really big deal because
Speaker 4: you were on a roster and without free agency, you
Speaker 4: would just stay on the same team basically until you retired,
Speaker 4: unless you got traded, which was pretty rare. So I
Speaker 4: got mentored by a guy that knew that as part
Speaker 4: of the culture. In today's sports landscape, people are constantly
Speaker 4: moving around and one of the things that I think
Speaker 4: we all should be mindful of is sometimes that creates
Speaker 4: a very lonely feeling for athletes, whether you're a college athlete,
Speaker 4: a high school athlete, a pro athlete.
Speaker 3: And so guys need mentors.
Speaker 4: Guys need people that they can confide in, and a
Speaker 4: lot of times it is away from an NFL locker room.
Speaker 4: It is away from the building because as a player,
Speaker 4: you're supposed to put on like your best self when
Speaker 4: you walk through there.
Speaker 3: At the end of the day.
Speaker 4: We say this all time, like nobody cares what you
Speaker 4: feel like, nobody cares how hurt you are. The expectations
Speaker 4: go on the field and perform and perform at your best.
Speaker 4: But we're still human beings, and so guys need to
Speaker 4: find those mentors outside the building. And I would just
Speaker 4: implore any veteran player or retired player, you know I'm
Speaker 4: a veteran player, like go mentor guys, because there is
Speaker 4: there's the physical, there's the emotional, there's the mental, and
Speaker 4: there's a lot of stuff and we're going to go
Speaker 4: to training camp in two or three weeks and it's
Speaker 4: all give you about football and we've got to be
Speaker 4: able to manage that, right, Marshaun Lynch, You know, handle
Speaker 4: handle your mental as well as you can. And I
Speaker 4: think that's something that players have to care for other
Speaker 4: players as much as anyone, because that's just the duality
Speaker 4: of our sport. It's intense, it's physical, but we're still
Speaker 4: human beings.
Speaker 1: Yeah, really, well said JJ. I think too before we
Speaker 1: put a ball on this topic. The the shortened the
Speaker 1: shortening of contract terms over time, the trends of three
Speaker 1: year deals, the trade market increasing.
Speaker 2: The way that it has.
Speaker 1: It exacerbates all of these things that you're talking about.
Speaker 1: That sense of never feeling settled two feet not firmly
Speaker 1: on the ground as much as you're putting in and
Speaker 1: committing to the building that you're in. That sort of
Speaker 1: constant rotation, certainly, the churn at the at the bottom
Speaker 1: of the roster, the thing about football that you love.
Speaker 1: And also it's very bittersweet, especially in conversations like this
Speaker 1: where a tragedy has occurred, is every little piece connects
Speaker 1: to everything else, and that's the nature of the sports schematically,
Speaker 1: that's the nature of what it is in side these buildings.
Speaker 1: Every it's a nature of the infrastructure of the sport.
Speaker 1: Now every little piece of it does connect to everything else.
Speaker 1: And I think these really homegrown and to your point,
Speaker 1: localized efforts to try to just pay attention to the
Speaker 1: little details of people when they're around you and vice
Speaker 1: versa are so so crucial in the sport and it
Speaker 1: really will lead to you know, healthy people and a
Speaker 1: healthy sport.
Speaker 2: Just a brief update.
Speaker 1: We have been updating as the situation has continued to
Speaker 1: unfold on with Terry and Arnold. He is a waiting
Speaker 1: trial on charges related to kidnapping and robbery. He was
Speaker 1: released by the Lions last week. Just as a small
Speaker 1: point of update on this ongoing story, he was not
Speaker 1: claimed on waivers. You would feel that that would be
Speaker 1: an obvious thing as this continues to the situation continues
Speaker 1: to be you know, litigated in court, but there has
Speaker 1: been some reporting by the insiders out there that a
Speaker 1: couple of teams express their interests in the corner.
Speaker 2: Will keep you posted.
Speaker 1: Before we get to our segment, We're going to take
Speaker 1: a quick break on the other side we do have
Speaker 1: a really fun segment for you guys, Most Interesting Team Tiers,
Speaker 1: a totally subjective arranging of NFL teams ahead.
Speaker 2: Of the twenty twenty sixth season.
Speaker 1: Welcome back. That's my Greg impression to NFL Daily. I'm
Speaker 1: here with JJ Jansen, one of my favorite people to
Speaker 1: talk to also to have on the show.
Speaker 2: JJ. We are very cautiously.
Speaker 1: Optimistic about this new segment that we're unrolling. This is
Speaker 1: a perfect segment to do without Greg because it is
Speaker 1: completely subjective, not at all based on data, although if
Speaker 1: you want to use data, you can't. You can do
Speaker 1: whatever the heck you want.
Speaker 3: You know, I love data, But this subjectivity is I
Speaker 3: know you.
Speaker 1: Have the angel on your shoulder and the demon on
Speaker 1: your shoulder at all all times. I am talking to the
Speaker 1: angel on your shoulder right now. Of subjectivity. So it's
Speaker 1: a combination of everything from vibes to rabbit hole topics
Speaker 1: to personal preferences. It's Most Interesting Team Tiers. So how
Speaker 1: this is gonna work is I'm going to introduce each
Speaker 1: tier as we go for the listener. There are five
Speaker 1: total tiers. JJ has been given these tiers in advance
Speaker 1: to sort the teams. We will discuss which teams we
Speaker 1: think should go into each tier, will either agree or
Speaker 1: argue our choices. Eric, I don't expect there to be
Speaker 1: any tiebreakers because that would just slow the show down.
Speaker 1: But you will break any tiebreakers. Eric, behind the glass,
Speaker 1: I am the one you have to see in person
Speaker 1: every day. So that's not a threat. I'm just noting that.
Speaker 1: I just want that said, and just a reminder for
Speaker 1: the listener. For the love of God, this is not
Speaker 1: an argument about quality, win or lost predictions whatever. They're
Speaker 1: not rankings. I can find a team like the Chiefs,
Speaker 1: who I think will be awesome this year, simply not
Speaker 1: that interesting. These are interest tears, JJ, what say you?
Speaker 3: I am first of all, I'm ready to go. Yes.
Speaker 4: Second of all, it's going to be really hard for
Speaker 4: me to not bring in analytics, but I am ready.
Speaker 2: You totally can if you, I probably will.
Speaker 4: I'm just I'm just giving you a heads up that
Speaker 4: I will probably have some sort of number in my
Speaker 4: head half the time, but I'll uh. I Also, it
Speaker 4: took me a little bit because we've talked about this before.
Speaker 4: I'm not super pop cultural ready, and so I had
Speaker 4: to dake. I had to do a little bit of
Speaker 4: googling to make sure I was up to date on
Speaker 4: what all these tiers actually mean. So I am ready,
Speaker 4: I'm ready to go, but I'm just letting you know
Speaker 4: that I'll probably beat you. But that's okay. I just
Speaker 4: want to clarify that that's all to say.
Speaker 1: At the end of the day, as long as we
Speaker 1: know it is a competition. Yes, And also this is
Speaker 1: the show idea and concept and also organizational chart that
Speaker 1: would make Greg literally all over and ceased to be.
Speaker 1: So I feel like this is the perfect time for
Speaker 1: us to be doing this.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 3: This is all about content, baby, yes.
Speaker 2: And subjectivity.
Speaker 1: We love that you can't argue with you can't argue
Speaker 1: with a moving target.
Speaker 3: There you go.
Speaker 1: So, okay, the first tier I'm calling Christopher Nolan movies.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 1: So these are teams of utmost interest, utmost complexity, or
Speaker 1: at most confusion in a good way. Who is your
Speaker 1: first team that you would put in Tier one?
Speaker 3: To me, this is the easiest one. The New York Giants.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 4: I don't know what's going on there, but I I'm
Speaker 4: here for I love it. Cam Skataboo and Jackson Dart,
Speaker 4: my kids call the Creating Cowboys. Those guys are nuts.
Speaker 4: They are a lot of fun. They've got a nasty defense,
Speaker 4: a new head coach, we had a little we had
Speaker 4: a little ota back and forth between the guys, and
Speaker 4: I just think it's gonna be fascinating. And not to mention,
Speaker 4: I think this is the analytic in me. I think
Speaker 4: they got the most wins baked into that roster. They
Speaker 4: were not a four and five win team last year.
Speaker 4: I thought Brian Dable actually did a pretty good job.
Speaker 4: They lost a couple of close games, and then they
Speaker 4: get a new head coach, a new energy, a new vibe.
Speaker 4: But I'm a big Jackson Dart fan. I think he's
Speaker 4: gonna be really good. Cam Scataboo will literally run through anything,
Speaker 4: and you know you and I know I'm a big
Speaker 4: Brian Burns fan. So they've got They've got good energy
Speaker 4: on both sides of the ball. I think I think
Speaker 4: that they're gonna be must see TV for seventeen weeks.
Speaker 1: I first of all, did not have the Giants anywhere
Speaker 1: in my tiers on accident, So.
Speaker 2: Good for you that you that you put them in here.
Speaker 1: Second, I think their offensive line is going to be
Speaker 1: better than people expected to be this year. They've done
Speaker 1: some reshuffling there and obviously it's a big time Jim
Speaker 1: Harbaugh or yet John Harbascu's me puts his identity on
Speaker 1: their draft class, bringing in guys that are sort of
Speaker 1: his guys.
Speaker 2: Though are they and what will they be? Really?
Speaker 1: And I think they're also a team that's going to
Speaker 1: load up in heavier personnel on offense. I do think
Speaker 1: that they could be a team of utmost complexity or
Speaker 1: utmost confusion, which is why I would probably agree with
Speaker 1: you that they can be our first The New York
Speaker 1: Giants can be our first team in Tier one. The
Speaker 1: next team that I'm going to the team that I'm
Speaker 1: going to nominate for Tier one is the Chicago Bears.
Speaker 1: First of all, I just think it's they're the utmost
Speaker 1: interest team. I think that they were riding sky high
Speaker 1: by the end of the year. They had some real
Speaker 1: low probability moments. Caleb Williams obviously the architect of those,
Speaker 1: and they were a pass defense heavy attack on the
Speaker 1: other side of the ball, which led to sort of
Speaker 1: splash plays or things that you don't necessarily need or
Speaker 1: depend on a pass rush, specifically to do they really
Speaker 1: were built to defend the past type of defense, so
Speaker 1: that can make fans really weary and worried.
Speaker 2: But then you'd get.
Speaker 1: These very highlight reel splash plays and make a difference plays,
Speaker 1: and then you'd also get Caleb Williams doing heroic things
Speaker 1: in the in the eleventh hour. The utmost interest and
Speaker 1: confusion relating to their stadium is also a big topic
Speaker 1: for me, and that entire saga continuing in their off season,
Speaker 1: and most of all for me, I really want to
Speaker 1: know what Ben Johnson is going to roll out.
Speaker 2: I think that he is one.
Speaker 1: Of those guys that is a disruptor against the grain
Speaker 1: in the league, where he's going to run things that
Speaker 1: you think you are familiar with. The personnel is the
Speaker 1: heavier personnels especially, but then he's going to roll some
Speaker 1: wrinkle into it or like some fu energy into it
Speaker 1: that like you just do Nazee coming. I am so
Speaker 1: curious about this team. I would nominate the Bears for
Speaker 1: a Tier one team here.
Speaker 4: All right, So are we allowed to introduce some of
Speaker 4: the other tiers because I have I have a thought
Speaker 4: on the Bears here.
Speaker 3: Can I explain what the other tiers are?
Speaker 2: Yes?
Speaker 3: Okay, so if you can here, Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 4: Tier four is the Danny DeVito shaking his head, and
Speaker 4: the description is become invested and interested in this team
Speaker 4: may ultimately hurt me. I cannot help myself. So the
Speaker 4: Bears were my original Tier one team, so they are.
Speaker 4: Last year's Bears were what I think this year's Giants
Speaker 4: are going to be. I feel like it's Tier four,
Speaker 4: not the number, the Danny DeVito shaking his head, because
Speaker 4: I agree with everything you just said. I think that
Speaker 4: the Caleb Williams show is a fireworks show and he's
Speaker 4: going to be fantastic and then he's gonna be have
Speaker 4: a lot of what just happened. And I just think
Speaker 4: that the end of their season ends a little bit
Speaker 4: closer to we were so close, but I'm left shaking
Speaker 4: my head. I love Ben Johnson. I think Caleb Williams.
Speaker 4: We were talking about this on SIUs XM this week,
Speaker 4: like the sacks are way down, the splash plays are up.
Speaker 4: I love watching him play, but I feel like he's
Speaker 4: still got a little bit of that I'm just gonna
Speaker 4: do something wild and crazy and it's not going to
Speaker 4: work out, So I love it. It would have been
Speaker 4: my first one until I thought about Jackson Dart, but
Speaker 4: I probably keep it in the Danny DeVito, but I'm
Speaker 4: not going to argue with you. I just think there's
Speaker 4: a better spot for it.
Speaker 1: Well, I am also way lower on Jackson Dart overall
Speaker 1: than you are, but that was to me. The Giants
Speaker 1: are interesting enough without him, and.
Speaker 3: To making that was the goal interesting.
Speaker 1: So, okay, if I'm going to give you bears in
Speaker 1: tier four, which we could compromise on, I could give
Speaker 1: you be bears in tier four, And again tier four
Speaker 1: is Danny DeVito shaking his head dot Jeff becoming invested
Speaker 1: and interested in this team may ultimately hurt me, and
Speaker 1: yet I cannot help myself. I think that's fair. I
Speaker 1: think that's a good place to put the Bears. You
Speaker 1: then have to give me raiders in Tier one. Ut
Speaker 1: most interest, utmost interest, and confusion. This is tenant, right.
Speaker 1: This is not the Odyssey. This is it's kind of
Speaker 1: the odyssey. Honestly, this is not, you know, the Dark Knight.
Speaker 1: This is I don't know what the hell these guys
Speaker 1: are going to be, but I'm so interested in seeing
Speaker 1: what the hell these guys are going to be because
Speaker 1: I like the coach. I like Clint Kubiak, I like
Speaker 1: his system. I think that they're doing the right thing
Speaker 1: in terms of not rushing Fernando Mendoza.
Speaker 2: Into QB one stuff.
Speaker 1: I think that having the floor raising backup in Kirk
Speaker 1: Cousins is really really solid. I don't really care if
Speaker 1: he's a mentor to Fernando Mendoza or not. It's helpful
Speaker 1: to have somebody who's seen that much football in your
Speaker 1: quarterback room as you're breaking down week to week game
Speaker 1: plan and game film. And I think this defense, I
Speaker 1: think defense is going to improve. I thought they had
Speaker 1: a rock and off season, and I just think that
Speaker 1: the potential and the variance for this team is so
Speaker 1: all over the map, but it trends positively that I
Speaker 1: am going to insist that they are, that they are
Speaker 1: in Tier one.
Speaker 3: I have no argument with you.
Speaker 4: I thought they're twenty twenty four into twenty five offseason
Speaker 4: made no sense. I didn't understand the combat nation and
Speaker 4: it's sort of played out that way. This combination of coach, quarterback,
Speaker 4: and plan makes way more sense to me. They coming
Speaker 4: out of twenty four, their offensive line was not particularly good.
Speaker 4: They didn't improve the offensive line, and then drafted a
Speaker 4: running back in the top ten, an awesome running back,
Speaker 4: but they didn't improve the offensive line. This year, they
Speaker 4: go out and get Tyler Lindenbaum. They spend a bunch
Speaker 4: of money in free agency. They obviously draft Mendoza first overall.
Speaker 4: And I'm with you. I love Clint Kubiak. I think
Speaker 4: it fits well with what a young quarterback can do.
Speaker 4: Run the ball, keep everything simpler as a young guy
Speaker 4: is learning and developing. I'm still a big Kirk Cousins fan.
Speaker 4: Paying Kirk Cousins ten million dollars to play quarterback is
Speaker 4: way different than paying him forty.
Speaker 3: Yes, and so I think he's.
Speaker 2: Playing math JJ great math.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the math is mathing over here. You know as
Speaker 4: a Panther fan that when the Falcons signed Kirk Cousins
Speaker 4: and then draft Michael Pennox, I'm like, this is great.
Speaker 4: They're using all their resources on one position and there's
Speaker 4: a lot of chaos.
Speaker 3: I'm a huge Kirk Cousins fan.
Speaker 4: He played really well down the stretch, so if he's
Speaker 4: playing for them, he'll be in a good spot and
Speaker 4: he can certainly win games in the fourth quarter.
Speaker 3: For you.
Speaker 4: He did it last year helped us out in a
Speaker 4: big win at Tampa, So I'm with you. No argument
Speaker 4: for me on Christopher Nolan, and I get Chicago in
Speaker 4: my Dana DeVito category, so I'm win win.
Speaker 1: I kind of love that it's the Chicago the Bears
Speaker 1: are in the Danny. The more the more I think
Speaker 1: about it, the more I love it. Okay, I want
Speaker 1: your We now need a third team in Tier one
Speaker 1: if you have one. If you have another nomination for
Speaker 1: Tier one.
Speaker 4: I'm putting the Buffalo Bills. WHOA things changed for them
Speaker 4: very quickly. You know, there's a lot of Carolina connections.
Speaker 4: I was a huge Sean McDermott fan, still am huge
Speaker 4: Brandon Bean fan, Joe Brady, all the Carolina guys are
Speaker 4: up there.
Speaker 3: DJ Moore. I love so much of what they're doing.
Speaker 4: But they're in a position now where the stress is high. Right,
Speaker 4: you have a future Hall of Fame quarterback and you've
Speaker 4: now switched head coaches. You've given him the offensive coordinator
Speaker 4: as the head coach, and quietly and kind of without
Speaker 4: any real awareness, they went from running that division to
Speaker 4: the Patriots go and go to the super Bowl and
Speaker 4: they've got a rookie quarterback on a young deal and
Speaker 4: one of the very best head coaches in the league.
Speaker 4: So this is a big year for them. You can
Speaker 4: feel the pressure building up in Buffalo. But again, they
Speaker 4: got easily one of the top three players in the
Speaker 4: whole league. They got an offensive head coach now, and
Speaker 4: the pressure to win is now, but they've they've got
Speaker 4: the goods to go, so I think it's gonna be great.
Speaker 4: I'll be fascinating to see how the dynamic changes going
Speaker 4: from Sean McDermott to Joe Brady defensive coach to offensive coach.
Speaker 4: How does that unlock Josh Allen. That'll be very interesting
Speaker 4: to me. But I'm a big Bills fan, but my
Speaker 4: eyes are gonna be on them all season.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think this team gets Tier one for complexity in
Speaker 1: terms of will they or won't they, sort of energy
Speaker 1: and the dynamic and sort of the tightrope act that
Speaker 1: they're gonna have to watch the entire way through because
Speaker 1: the pressure is so intense up there with Josh Allen
Speaker 1: in his prime years. I really like Jim Leonard, the
Speaker 1: defensive coordinator. I like some of the things that staff
Speaker 1: wise that I think I was pleasantly surprised to see
Speaker 1: a coach as young as Joe Brady be able to
Speaker 1: assemble a staff that has like really really good reputation
Speaker 1: top to bottom across the league. Having some Sean Payton
Speaker 1: ties in there on offense, I think is really important,
Speaker 1: and then getting kind of like the defensive coordinator that
Speaker 1: a lot of people were trying to hire but just
Speaker 1: wasn't available for a few years. I thought that was
Speaker 1: important too. So yeah, I agree with you here, I
Speaker 1: put them here. I'm also gonna put the Eagles in
Speaker 1: Tier one. I feel like again in terms of utmost interest,
Speaker 1: and I think potential complexity, because is there a more
Speaker 1: like visibly complicated team in the NFL, like overtly audibly,
Speaker 1: visibly emotionally complicated team in the NFL. And and it's
Speaker 1: a huge year for Nick Sirianni. You know that building.
Speaker 1: They are not shy about making changes, maybe even before
Speaker 1: they need to make changes. Howie Roseman is the entire
Speaker 1: brand up there, and he has the utmost trust and
Speaker 1: and buy in from Jeffrey Lourie. This is a massive
Speaker 1: year for Jalen Hurts. I don't think that is a
Speaker 1: secret at all. Sean Mannion is there now, So this
Speaker 1: is really the first time we're going to see an
Speaker 1: offshooter a pollination of the really the Lafleur branch of
Speaker 1: the Sean McVay Kyle Shanahan's system, the Lafleur branch being
Speaker 1: i think a little bit even more tight end friendly
Speaker 1: before McVeigh became tight end friendly, pulling some of that
Speaker 1: old like Kubiak stuff, blending in some of that Rogers
Speaker 1: stuff that he learned in his first like sort of
Speaker 1: very compromised couple of seasons, uh, working with Aaron Rodgers
Speaker 1: there in Green Bay, and then Sean Mannion, really I
Speaker 1: think is going to be a gift for the receivers
Speaker 1: in the passing game, especially in terms of just some
Speaker 1: the layers that he wants to set up, and you
Speaker 1: hear really good things about just some of the ideas,
Speaker 1: and the receivers that are there now are talking about him.
Speaker 1: Obviously a lot of change in that room with aj
Speaker 1: Brown no longer there, and it's really going to be
Speaker 1: the first time we see one of these like very
Speaker 1: young pollinations of that system paired with the og VIC
Speaker 1: fangio like the OG knife in the heart defensive system.
Speaker 2: VIC Fangio. I love that.
Speaker 1: I'm so interested just as a geek, I'm so interested
Speaker 1: in that. I'm fascinated by that. I think that the
Speaker 1: Eagles have among the highest or the largest variants in
Speaker 1: terms of what they could be versus what they might be.
Speaker 1: So that's very interesting to me as well. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I emphatically nominate them for the Christopher Nolan. I'm doing
Speaker 1: a passive aggressive mom thing right now. I'm like, well,
Speaker 1: if you want, if you want dessert after dinner, you
Speaker 1: can't have a cookie, now, you know?
Speaker 3: Yeah? They at our house with our kids.
Speaker 4: It usually under chaos just breaks out and desserts happening before, after,
Speaker 4: and during dinner. I was struggling with where to put
Speaker 4: the Eagles because, uh, I'm not going to argue with you.
Speaker 4: I think the the reason I've struggled to emphatically put
Speaker 4: them into Tier one was I feel like so much
Speaker 4: of the complexity revolved around aj Brown, Like, what is
Speaker 4: aj Brown and Jalen Hurts connection, How are they feeling
Speaker 4: about things? How does that relate to Nick Sirianni, what's
Speaker 4: Big Dom's role in all of this? Like, I think
Speaker 4: that added to a lot of the complexity. I think
Speaker 4: with the trade and they get the first round pick
Speaker 4: back and a fifth rounder, I feel like things have
Speaker 4: settled a little bit. I think there's some of the
Speaker 4: tension is gone, but you hit it right on the screw,
Speaker 4: like it is a unique environment up in Philly, like
Speaker 4: clearly one of the few places that the general manager
Speaker 4: is running the team and makes it very well known
Speaker 4: that is a unique environment. I've always thought that when
Speaker 4: the head coach runs the show and the GM's kind
Speaker 4: of the number two, that was the healthiest environment. Philly
Speaker 4: has been able to buck the trend. Nick Sirianni's a
Speaker 4: super Bowl winning head coach, but everyone talks about Howie
Speaker 4: Roseman first and Nick Sirianni's second. So that's an element
Speaker 4: of complexity for them. And again you said it right,
Speaker 4: it's a big year for Jalen Hurts. It was up
Speaker 4: and down last year. He certainly has all the talent
Speaker 4: around him that he's had, but that offensive line is
Speaker 4: getting a little bit older and got a little more
Speaker 4: beat up. Things have changed there. And then the NFL,
Speaker 4: you are constantly having to evolve, and I think they
Speaker 4: saw a big jump, you know, in the Super Bowl
Speaker 4: years with Jalen Hurts. Now we're asking him to make
Speaker 4: another big jump in a division with Jayden Daniels and
Speaker 4: Dak Prescott and Jackson Dart So I couldn't really find
Speaker 4: a spot to put him. So I'm not gonna argue
Speaker 4: with you there. I think whenever Philadelphia is on the scene,
Speaker 4: they're gonna be of interest, and I think this year
Speaker 4: will be no different.
Speaker 1: So we've got the Giants, the Raiders, the Bills, and
Speaker 1: the Eagles so far in Tier one Teams of utmost interest,
Speaker 1: complexity or confusion in a good way.
Speaker 2: Quickly.
Speaker 1: Do you have other nominations here? You can throw a
Speaker 1: boat me at once. I'll do the same. We got
Speaker 1: to fill out tier one before we jump to Tier
Speaker 1: two here.
Speaker 3: All right.
Speaker 4: The last one that I was really feeling pretty good
Speaker 4: about was the Minnesota Vikings. Oh so here's my reasons
Speaker 4: for this. Obviously, we have a quarterback controversy. But that
Speaker 4: being said, Kyler Murray JJ McCarthy, like, I think it's
Speaker 4: kind of interesting.
Speaker 3: They went nine to eight last year and.
Speaker 4: Basically had a dysfunctional quarterback room.
Speaker 3: Just all of the things.
Speaker 4: And I'm not commenting on JJ McCarthy or or anyone
Speaker 4: else that played like it was just dysfunction. They go
Speaker 4: from Sam Darnold, who wins fourteen games, he's leading Seattle
Speaker 4: to a super Bowl, and you're like, oh, man, the
Speaker 4: Vikings are a mess. And then you wake up and
Speaker 4: they're nine to eight and they had the seventh best
Speaker 4: record in the NFC. Obviously they didn't make the playoffs,
Speaker 4: but they've got that and that Brian Flores defense is nasty.
Speaker 4: They continue to be really good. I think Kevin O'Connell
Speaker 4: is one of the very best. So to me in
Speaker 4: a vision that there's a lot of good football teams,
Speaker 4: but if Kyler Murray, I'm assuming he's going to win
Speaker 4: the job. If Kyler Murray had a million dollars can
Speaker 4: play good football with that defense, and you have Justin
Speaker 4: Jefferson and you have Kevin O'Connell pulling the strings, I
Speaker 4: think they could get back to having a really good year.
Speaker 4: I think it's interesting in a guy like Kyler Murray's like, man,
Speaker 4: he struggled in Arizona, but the reality was he was
Speaker 4: like ten games under five hundred. He was thirty eight
Speaker 4: and forty eight as a starter in Arizona in his
Speaker 4: seven years. Everybody else was five and twenty five, Arizona
Speaker 4: has really struggled, and the biggest criticism of Kyler Murray
Speaker 4: is well, he's not a great leader.
Speaker 3: Well, when you show up to a new team, you're
Speaker 3: not being asked to be a leader.
Speaker 4: He just asked to play quarterback, and so I think
Speaker 4: that's going to be a really good fit. They've got
Speaker 4: a ton of good pieces, they got great coaching on
Speaker 4: both sides of the ball, and so I think there's
Speaker 4: going to be a complex element. Like Brian Flores has
Speaker 4: been running one of the very best defenses for the
Speaker 4: last three or four years, and all the attentions over
Speaker 4: right now on the offense and getting that fixed.
Speaker 3: If that works out, it's going to be really good.
Speaker 4: If not, does that turn into like the Baltimore Ravens
Speaker 4: of the two thousands, where it's like the defense is
Speaker 4: unbelievable and their top three every year. If you just
Speaker 4: fix the offense, we win fourteen games and we go
Speaker 4: to a to an NFC championship game. So I think
Speaker 4: that's where the complexity comes in. And then, hey, the
Speaker 4: last piece of confusion. JJ McCarthy Top ten pick, what
Speaker 4: is He's been a lot of quessiuh used a ton
Speaker 4: of draft capital. There got a salvage it. There's a
Speaker 4: lot of layers to that. So I put the Vikings
Speaker 4: in tier one.
Speaker 2: Wouldn't you.
Speaker 1: Potentially agree though, that everything you just said belongs to
Speaker 1: the Danny DeVito shaking his head dot Jiff category, Because
Speaker 1: now listen, I know I you know, I have more
Speaker 1: Normy friends than you. Some of these are Vikings fans, okay,
Speaker 1: And I'm just telling.
Speaker 2: You the the vibe.
Speaker 1: And my colleague Alex Lewis just did a great fan
Speaker 1: survey over at the Athletic and the number one catch
Speaker 1: phrase that he saw was pessimistically optim And so I think,
Speaker 1: for example, that becoming invested and interested in this team
Speaker 1: may ultimately hurt me. That is what I think about
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty six Minnesota Vike is because because JJ
Speaker 1: I agree with you, I agree with you.
Speaker 2: I think Kyler Murray.
Speaker 1: Is going to be great with Kevin O'Connell. I love
Speaker 1: Brian Flores's defense. I also love the retaining Brian Flores
Speaker 1: and continuing to let him basically just hole up on
Speaker 1: one side of the building and cook and bring these
Speaker 1: like master schematic advantages out of his players and collaborate
Speaker 1: like the total mad scientists. We rarely get to see
Speaker 1: that in the professional sport anymore. I absolutely love that
Speaker 1: new GM. I really like Nolan Teasley. I just I
Speaker 1: don't really know yet. First of all, how much weight
Speaker 1: he is going to carry in terms of that power infrastructure.
Speaker 2: Now, that might work for the better. As you said,
Speaker 2: I agree with you.
Speaker 1: I think a lot of times works really well when
Speaker 1: the head coach is the dominant voice in that particular relationship.
Speaker 1: But I don't know if I can put my faith
Speaker 1: into this team without getting hurt because all that has
Speaker 1: happened over the last oh, I don't know, thirty years.
Speaker 2: That's true, is that I will only.
Speaker 3: Get You're looking by this historical Vikings.
Speaker 4: You're right, that does feel like I'm thinking twenty twenty
Speaker 4: six Vikings.
Speaker 2: But all I have is data. All I have is data, right, I.
Speaker 4: Bet you most Vikings fans are putting it in Tier
Speaker 4: four Vikings fans.
Speaker 1: So how about so how about you give me? You
Speaker 1: give me the Vike. I gave you the Bears, you
Speaker 1: give me the Vikings in Tier four. Danny DeVito shaking
Speaker 1: his head. Dot Jeff becoming invested interested in this team
Speaker 1: may ultimately hurt me, and yet I cannot help myself decision.
Speaker 1: I'm going to throw two more. Well, I'm going to
Speaker 1: throw three three teams at you. You can say yes, no,
Speaker 1: I'm not going to go into a ton of explanation
Speaker 1: for time. We're going to get to Tier two here
Speaker 1: in a second, I'm going to throw three more that
Speaker 1: I had as potential Tier one of dates.
Speaker 2: Now you can you can just.
Speaker 1: Auto veto or auto agree with with any of these, right,
Speaker 1: I so bestow that power unto you. Okay, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: put the Detroit Lions in Tier one. I think they're
Speaker 1: one of the most interesting stories in the NFL this year.
Speaker 1: Bounce back year absolutely necessary, entering Jerragop's primeiers new coordinator
Speaker 1: Andrew Petsing, who I absolutely love and think that uh again,
Speaker 1: similar to Kyler just Arizona that funk just could not
Speaker 1: could not shake some of that funk.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: Defense has to get better. Obviously, they're dealing with some
Speaker 1: off the field personnel situations here.
Speaker 2: Past rush has to get better.
Speaker 1: This is a team where Dan Campbell literally said I
Speaker 1: had to burn myself to ash in order to like
Speaker 1: quoting nietzschee to to. That's like a you know normy
Speaker 1: literature reference.
Speaker 3: That was more in the Jesuit high school that I
Speaker 3: went to.
Speaker 2: Trophy Prep.
Speaker 1: Yeah, shout out Phoenix, Arizona. I would put the Lions
Speaker 1: in this category, and I'll just give you all three.
Speaker 1: I would put the Chargers in the utmost interest category
Speaker 1: because Mike McDaniel, Come on, Mike McDaniel getting these two
Speaker 1: tackles back, and that run game and the absolute sheer
Speaker 1: like size, speed, power, and then, by the way, factor
Speaker 1: in the quarterback who is living his best life. And
Speaker 1: I always think you get a bump if you're living
Speaker 1: your best life as the quarterback. And then I also
Speaker 1: put the Cowboys here. I love what Clayton Adams does
Speaker 1: as the offensive coordinator. I think he is so underrated
Speaker 1: across the league.
Speaker 2: The Cowboys.
Speaker 1: Bran Schottenheimer did a really smart thing when he hired
Speaker 1: an offensive line oriented offensive coordinator, knowing that he'd get
Speaker 1: maybe at least another year with this guy before he'd
Speaker 1: begetting head coaching traction, because OL coaches never get the
Speaker 1: head coaching traction. Christian Parker, to me, is going to
Speaker 1: be a home run higher. He is the number one
Speaker 1: vic Fangio disciple here. He's the guy Vicfangio tried to
Speaker 1: bring with him at every stop for several years, and
Speaker 1: I just I really really like the potential. We saw
Speaker 1: the defense come back together and play pretty well at
Speaker 1: the end of last season. I like the moves they
Speaker 1: made this offseason. I like their passing game. I like
Speaker 1: their running game. I like their offensive line. I love
Speaker 1: their quarterback. So I'm gonna put in terms of utmost interest,
Speaker 1: those three teams I would I would propose as Tier
Speaker 1: one teams.
Speaker 2: What say you?
Speaker 3: All right?
Speaker 4: So the Chargers are in, I'm with you. I'm all
Speaker 4: in on Mike McDaniel Jim Harbaugh. I can't imagine the
Speaker 4: conversations that are happening. I feel like, was that Joey
Speaker 4: Mullen arrow Like. I feel like all season long there's
Speaker 4: gonna be spoofs on the Harbaugh Mike McDaniel conversations. I
Speaker 4: can only imagine how good that's gonna be. So no
Speaker 4: argument from me on the Chargers. I would put the
Speaker 4: Lions down a tier in that second cup of coffee
Speaker 4: that we're gonna get you in a second. I find
Speaker 4: them to be a really good team. That's that's a
Speaker 4: little little boring, right like and that's not a criticism.
Speaker 4: They've been able to be very consistent, Like you know,
Speaker 4: where are we now in twenty twenty six. The Detroit
Speaker 4: Lions are a consistent football team and they've done this
Speaker 4: for the last handful of years. They have a great culture,
Speaker 4: But to me, it's not particularly interesting. Ben Johnson was
Speaker 4: the one that I always thought was kind of the
Speaker 4: interesting factor in that whole place, the way the offense went. Certainly,
Speaker 4: Dan Campbell's one of the top five head coaches in
Speaker 4: the NFL. The culture, the personality, the game management and
Speaker 4: decision making. But to me, I kind of know what
Speaker 4: the Lions are. There's no confusion for me of what
Speaker 4: they are. They're a really good team that's probably gonna
Speaker 4: win between ten and twelve games, and you're not gonna
Speaker 4: want to play them, and so I put them there.
Speaker 4: The Cowboys is the one where I'm struggling because I
Speaker 4: feel like the Cowboys get a lot of national at tension.
Speaker 4: We all know that. I don't just feel it, we
Speaker 4: know that. But they're kind of they're having a little
Speaker 4: bit more of a quieter season, and maybe that's just
Speaker 4: because they're not trading Mikey Caa Parsons this year.
Speaker 2: But it just God, you can only do that once, right, you.
Speaker 3: Can only do that once? And so.
Speaker 4: I that would be the one where I'm willing to
Speaker 4: defer to you on that one.
Speaker 2: Wait, can you just say that. I just want to
Speaker 2: hear you say that one.
Speaker 3: I'm willing to defer to you on that one.
Speaker 4: That's about as passive of an acceptance as you can
Speaker 4: possibly have. So that's like what we say to our kids,
Speaker 4: like I'm willing to defer to the idea that you
Speaker 4: might want to stay up thirty minutes later to watch
Speaker 4: to watch one more Dude perfect or something like that.
Speaker 4: So anyways, say we'll put Dallas and we'll put the
Speaker 4: Chargers in, but I want to I'll bump the Lions down.
Speaker 2: Okay, I could get behind that totally.
Speaker 1: So Tier one again, just to recap Tier one, We've
Speaker 1: got the Giants, the Raiders, the Bills, the Eagles, the Chargers,
Speaker 1: and the Cowboys, and we are going to take a
Speaker 1: quick break because we've got more tiers and we've also
Speaker 1: got to move, so we're going to take a quick
Speaker 1: break and then we're going to speed tier the rest
Speaker 1: of these. I am having a blast doing this.
Speaker 2: Far with you.
Speaker 1: Thanks, JJ, Welcome back again to remind the listener, we
Speaker 1: are doing the most interesting team Tiers, a totally subjective
Speaker 1: arranging of NFL teams ahead of the twenty twenty sixth season,
Speaker 1: and I am joined by the great JJ Janssen here
Speaker 1: as my co host. Today, JJ, we have Tier one set.
Speaker 1: We have a couple of teams and other tiers for
Speaker 1: the listener so that we can get reorganized. I'm going
Speaker 1: to introduce what the rest of the tiers are now
Speaker 1: we know the Tier four already is Danny DeVito shaking
Speaker 1: his head, Don Jeff. So we have a couple of
Speaker 1: teams in there already. Tier two, which we're going to
Speaker 1: get to next, is called Second Cup of Coffee, and
Speaker 1: it is teams you need a little run up to,
Speaker 1: You need to talk about a little bit to get
Speaker 1: into the rhythm. Once you get there, you're feeling really
Speaker 1: really interested in them.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Actually this is fantastic. I feel awesome that second cup
Speaker 1: of coffee energy. That's what Tier two will be. The Lions,
Speaker 1: as you have very well argued, are in this Tier two.
Speaker 1: They're our first team of Tier two. Tier three is
Speaker 1: the Larry David shrugging Dot Jeff you know, just yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess I could get into this. I think I
Speaker 1: can talk myself into this. We don't have any teams
Speaker 1: there yet, so just be aware that tier is.
Speaker 2: Available to you.
Speaker 1: Tier four of course, Danny DeVito shaking his head, dot
Speaker 1: Jiff becoming invested and interested in this team may ultimately
Speaker 1: hurt me, and yet I cannot help myself.
Speaker 2: So far.
Speaker 1: We have the Bears and the Vikings in that tier.
Speaker 1: And of course Tier five is damon. Something is way
Speaker 1: off here. I crossed the street and avoid eye contact
Speaker 1: even though they're smiling at me, like really really intensely.
Speaker 2: That's Tier five.
Speaker 1: So know that those tiers are available to listeners if
Speaker 1: you have tier suggestions as well for teams in these categories.
Speaker 1: Would love to hear from you. Again, you cannot argue
Speaker 1: with the moving target, but I would love to hear.
Speaker 2: Would love to hear your tiers. JJ.
Speaker 1: I would like actually from you. So we have the
Speaker 1: Lions in tier two. I would like two teams that
Speaker 1: you would put into tier two.
Speaker 4: Okay, so I think this is actually a cool combination.
Speaker 4: The two teams I'd put in are my Carolina Panthers
Speaker 4: and the Houston Texans, both teams a little bit different.
Speaker 4: Both teams have got a fourth year quarterback, you know,
Speaker 4: Bryce Young number one overall, c J. Stroud number two overall.
Speaker 4: These are big years for these teams, but there's been
Speaker 4: some struggles.
Speaker 1: C J.
Speaker 4: Stroud gets out early first year, winning a ton of
Speaker 4: games and was outstanding, and then as we got closer
Speaker 4: to the end of year three, it was clunky in
Speaker 4: the playoffs. But that defense is nasty. They got Danil
Speaker 4: Hunter on one end, Will Anderson on the other. That's
Speaker 4: as good of a defense as there was in the
Speaker 4: NFL last year. If they can kind of fix Stroud
Speaker 4: and he can and he can find his pathway, that
Speaker 4: team's going to be really, really good. But it doesn't
Speaker 4: come off the page as some sort of dynamic team.
Speaker 4: But then you watch three or four quarters of that
Speaker 4: defense playing like hey, they can win any single Sunday.
Speaker 4: On the other side, the Panthers, my Panthers, like we were.
Speaker 3: Eight and nine last year.
Speaker 4: We win the division in sort of this clunky back
Speaker 4: doorway with the Falcons beating the Saints. But Bryce Young
Speaker 4: really came on. We saw how well he played in
Speaker 4: the playoff game versus the Rams.
Speaker 3: He beat the Rams earlier in the year.
Speaker 4: Some fourth quarter comebacks have sort of been the trademark
Speaker 4: of his career, and it feels like he is a
Speaker 4: quarterback on the ascension Hetero McMillian Offensive Rookie of the Year,
Speaker 4: and the defense continues to get improved Devin Lloyd at
Speaker 4: Jalen Phillips, amongst others.
Speaker 3: So those are the two teams.
Speaker 4: I think they don't jump off the pages super interesting
Speaker 4: to start, but as you start to think about what's
Speaker 4: to come in the twenty twenty sixth season, I think
Speaker 4: they are going to be two teams that are going
Speaker 4: to kind of captivate the league just in terms of
Speaker 4: are they going up, are going down?
Speaker 3: Where are they in their path?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Actually both my choices too.
Speaker 1: I had them in this tier because first of all,
Speaker 1: you know me, I love the Panthers. I think they're interesting,
Speaker 1: but you have to almost go beyond surface level or
Speaker 1: beyond what they've been on paper in terms of win
Speaker 1: loss to actually understand, like pop the hood and see
Speaker 1: what they're doing, and it is really really interesting stuff
Speaker 1: that's happening over there in Carolina. And similar to the Texans,
Speaker 1: you know they run. Their defense is the most badass
Speaker 1: defense in the NFL, and I don't expect them to
Speaker 1: regress a ton because of the talent, but.
Speaker 2: Also the simplicity by which they operate.
Speaker 1: They have a very specific set of rules for their defense,
Speaker 1: and they just have better dudes than everybody else, and
Speaker 1: they're just freaking good, right, And I think that improvements
Speaker 1: to the offensive line, I don't buy it as much
Speaker 1: as I think there's like a national criticism of c J.
Speaker 2: Stroud.
Speaker 1: I think that so much of what hurt him was
Speaker 1: his run game. I think you look at his explosive
Speaker 1: play rate, his downfield passing rate, his efficiency when he
Speaker 1: was able to either work out of structure, within the play,
Speaker 1: within the infrastructure of the offense, but then also when
Speaker 1: he was able to actually get into rhythm, and he
Speaker 1: to me, did not take as far as step back.
Speaker 1: I think the last couple of games were outliers, and
Speaker 1: I think he will again bounce back to what we
Speaker 1: know him to be and what he really played like
Speaker 1: for most of the season last year, just totally hampered
Speaker 1: by one of the worst run games in the NFL.
Speaker 1: Last season, they've done they've taken steps to address that,
Speaker 1: obviously bringing over David Montgomery and then readdressing their offensive
Speaker 1: line center is a position battle they're still working through
Speaker 1: and will do so still through training camp. But like,
Speaker 1: this is a team full of badasses, and they're interesting
Speaker 1: to me, and they're going to be interesting to me
Speaker 1: because I also I had them picked as a super
Speaker 1: Bowl favorite last season. I'm interested enough still that I
Speaker 1: am going to do that again this season. I just
Speaker 1: I really buy high on them. Other two teams that
Speaker 1: I had in this category. What do you think about
Speaker 1: this Ravens in this category? Because when you think about
Speaker 1: what they've been through almost but not quite for so
Speaker 1: many years, you're like, okay, and then you know, change
Speaker 1: over and head coach Jesse Minter's over there. Then you
Speaker 1: think about jesse Minter, his scheme, what he's able to do,
Speaker 1: and where their biggest issues were defensively last season, and
Speaker 1: you think, Okay, I could really get into this. Then
Speaker 1: you think about like Declan Doyle, who despite his name
Speaker 1: being Declan, is like really really getting like some rave
Speaker 1: reviews across the NFL and also by his players. Coaches
Speaker 1: I talk to are really high on him, very very
Speaker 1: interested to see what he's going to do. And oh yeah,
Speaker 1: they have Lamar Freakin Jackson on their team. And the
Speaker 1: other team that I wanted to suggest for this tier
Speaker 1: are the Green Bay Packers because they are another team
Speaker 1: that's sort of just fallen short of expectations every season.
Speaker 1: And then you remember, oh, they didn't have Tucker Craft.
Speaker 1: Oh they didn't have Micah Parsons. Oh, their defensive coordinator
Speaker 1: now is Jonathan Gannon, and he's going to do some
Speaker 1: really interesting odd front stuff and some interesting stuff with
Speaker 1: the coverage which they really badly needed to address. Oh
Speaker 1: you know, their offensive line, you know, not as good
Speaker 1: as it has been in past years of that reputationally
Speaker 1: for Green Bay.
Speaker 2: But then you think, oh.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they have freaking Jordan Love who's capable of making
Speaker 1: some of the highest ceiling throws that we see in football,
Speaker 1: and on paper you look at kind of their the
Speaker 1: way they've stalled over the last couple of years. When
Speaker 1: you talk yourself into this team, it always starts with
Speaker 1: the guys that they will be getting back at least
Speaker 1: by October. That's when, as you know, real football starts,
Speaker 1: and if not November, and that's when I think you
Speaker 1: can really get excited and have your second cup of
Speaker 1: coffee with the Green Bay Packers so I would suggest
Speaker 1: Tier two Lions, Panthers, Texans, Ravens, Packers.
Speaker 2: What do you think?
Speaker 3: I like that?
Speaker 4: Again, I feel like the Danny DeVito tier keeps pulling
Speaker 4: me back.
Speaker 3: So I I loved the argument.
Speaker 2: Must be a generational thing, you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, But to me, Baltimore is either Tier two or
Speaker 4: Tier four, right. I'm a big fan of the Ben
Speaker 4: Johnson tree that's beginning to develop, you know, I'm a
Speaker 4: big fan of Ben Johnson. I also think Deklan Doyle's
Speaker 4: got a unique advantage in that he just watched Ben
Speaker 4: Johnson go through a season with Caleb Williams. Right, Jared
Speaker 4: Goff is very different than Caleb Williams. Lamar Jackson is
Speaker 4: uniquely a unique talent, right, And one of the things
Speaker 4: we saw in Chicago this past year was how do
Speaker 4: you get the quarterback to play with instructure until it's
Speaker 4: time for him to take over the game. And I
Speaker 4: think that's the biggest concern I would just have for
Speaker 4: Baltimore is as we get closer to the playoffs, Lamar Jackson,
Speaker 4: the reputation is that he struggles. That's not actually what's
Speaker 4: going on. He's played quite well in the playoffs. Who
Speaker 4: was in Baltimore two years ago, leading them on a comeback. Obviously,
Speaker 4: there was the fumble or the drop pass that goal line. Look,
Speaker 4: Lamar played well. He had a few like oh plays,
Speaker 4: but he played well. But the reputation of him not
Speaker 4: showing up in the playoffs is a storyline that just
Speaker 4: continues to follow him until he breaks through. I think
Speaker 4: there's this feeling of is he going to hurt me
Speaker 4: in the playoffs. The regular season, He's been one of
Speaker 4: the very best, a Hall of Famer for sure. I
Speaker 4: would just worry about Baltimore getting over that last hump.
Speaker 4: So I'm not going to argue too much with Tier two,
Speaker 4: but I might slide them down to four. And we
Speaker 4: played Green Bay last year. They are as talented as
Speaker 4: any team in the NFC. They were the number one
Speaker 4: seed when the Panthers went in there. We won in
Speaker 4: a like a low scoring, low possession game. I think
Speaker 4: one of the things that I'd like to continue to
Speaker 4: see out of Green Bay is trusting Jordan Love. He'll
Speaker 4: throw some interceptions, he'll throw some big plays, but felt
Speaker 4: like they they didn't let him throw the ball in
Speaker 4: advantageous situations enough for a player of his talent.
Speaker 3: I don't know what that is.
Speaker 4: I don't know if that's Lafloor trying to manage the
Speaker 4: game and keep things on to wraps, but I know
Speaker 4: we certainly saw it when we went we went there
Speaker 4: in Carolina, we were the underdog, I think, like an
Speaker 4: eight or ten point underdog, and we only played a
Speaker 4: seven possession game and it was like the whole time,
Speaker 4: I'm sitting on the sideline going this is playing into
Speaker 4: our hands, and we were able to hit a field
Speaker 4: goal at the end of the game. There's a little
Speaker 4: bit of the if you've got the guy that you
Speaker 4: have a fifty five million dollars in Jordan Love, let
Speaker 4: him go take over the game, don't ask don't ask
Speaker 4: him to sort of manage the game, and at the
Speaker 4: end try to turn him loose.
Speaker 3: So that would be my little issue. But I'm with you.
Speaker 4: Second cup of coffee on the packers for sure, Baltimore.
Speaker 4: I'm not gonna I'm not gonna fight you, but it
Speaker 4: could be a Tier four like they might hurt me.
Speaker 1: Well, I've got a banger for you for Tier four.
Speaker 1: So if you give me Ravens in Tier two, I
Speaker 1: promise that this will work out.
Speaker 2: In your favor.
Speaker 1: For tier four, another great Danny DeVito pick. So, okay,
Speaker 1: so I think that could close Tier two for us.
Speaker 1: It'll be Lions, Panthers, Texans, Ravens, Packers, and again tier
Speaker 1: two teams you need a little run up to statially,
Speaker 1: to like get fired up if you're not a fan. Okay,
Speaker 1: we're not talking about fans subjectively. If you are talking
Speaker 1: about them, once you really get in the weeds on them,
Speaker 1: you're really interested in them and what they can be
Speaker 1: in twenty twenty six, and you're thinking, yeah, this could
Speaker 1: be pretty great. The Larry David shrugging dot Jiff that
Speaker 1: is tier three. I think we can roll through this
Speaker 1: pretty quickly because for me, these are teams like, yeah,
Speaker 1: obviously I'm interested in these teams, right, but we talk
Speaker 1: about them all the time, and like I'm more interested
Speaker 1: in like the variants of some other teams and other
Speaker 1: tiers around this.
Speaker 2: Like, for example, I put some of the.
Speaker 1: Absolute studs of the NFL in this category. I not
Speaker 1: only have the Chiefs in this category, I have the
Speaker 1: Rams in this category. I have the Seahawks in this category.
Speaker 1: I have the forty nine ers in this category. I
Speaker 1: have the Broncos in this category. Now, this wasn't just
Speaker 1: for timing and ease, although those are important things. If
Speaker 1: I have Greg Rosenthal on my ear, this is actually
Speaker 1: like I just I feel like I know what these
Speaker 1: teams are. I feel like I know what these teams are.
Speaker 1: They are the absolute bona fides of the NFL going
Speaker 1: into the season. There are very few questions in my
Speaker 1: opinion about these teams. Yeah, there's been some injury issues,
Speaker 1: all of those things, but these are teams to me
Speaker 1: that I feel really really good about just being like, yeah,
Speaker 1: in a case of tiering into most interesting teams or
Speaker 1: least interesting teams, to me, I'm good with this being
Speaker 1: the Larry David Dutchiffs category. I'm good with these teams
Speaker 1: being there.
Speaker 3: I think those are all good.
Speaker 4: I would just feel bad if I was a Cardinal fan,
Speaker 4: because you clearly put the whole NFC West into Tier three,
Speaker 4: which means.
Speaker 2: Well, that is the life of the Cardinals.
Speaker 4: I mean really, as a lifelong Cardinal fan growing up
Speaker 4: in Phoenix, I feel like they are destined for Tier five.
Speaker 4: Demon Like, I guess it felt bad for them as
Speaker 4: you listed off the entire NFC West and kind of
Speaker 4: knowing the Cardinals did not fit that same profile. So
Speaker 4: that makes me a little sad. I'm again, I am
Speaker 4: a Cardinal fan at heart. The little boy and me
Speaker 4: growing up in Phoenix, Arizona is a Cardinal fan at heart.
Speaker 3: But I just felt bad for them.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we know what these teams are, like, we know
Speaker 4: that these guys are going to be in it at
Speaker 4: the end.
Speaker 3: Again.
Speaker 4: I would just the Rams have been so close the
Speaker 4: last couple of years. I would just as a fan
Speaker 4: of theirs, or watch them. They're gonna break our heart
Speaker 4: at the end again, Like they've been so close here.
Speaker 4: Obviously McVeigh has has one one, he's been to another.
Speaker 4: But I think that's I think that's the nature of
Speaker 4: being a fan of any team that's in it. A
Speaker 4: lot is as much jubilation as there is. There's this
Speaker 4: fear of like heartbreak. So I put the Rams clearly
Speaker 4: in Tier three. But I think any Rams fan would
Speaker 4: tell you like, is there gonna be another special teams blunder?
Speaker 4: Is there going to be another something at the very
Speaker 4: end because they're you know, we played them last year
Speaker 4: in the playoffs and I remember thinking, like, man, these
Speaker 4: guys had won like thirteen games. They really could one
Speaker 4: fifteen sixteen, like they were so good last year and
Speaker 4: I would expect them to be good again.
Speaker 2: So famous of special ties.
Speaker 3: That's right. Well, you know, we don't have to.
Speaker 2: Get too much to get the sense out.
Speaker 3: I will say this. I wanted to add one. I didn't.
Speaker 4: I didn't see the tears quite the same you did
Speaker 4: as you did. I would put the Falcons in Tier three,
Speaker 4: David Larry David shrugging. Here's the reason why. Like what
Speaker 4: what Tua did in Miami with Mike McDaniel early on
Speaker 4: was really good, right. The pieces around to it were
Speaker 4: all there, right, and he and he had a lot
Speaker 4: of success. And when it got in the playoffs and
Speaker 4: it got cold as a smaller quarterback, it didn't work out.
Speaker 4: But now he's in a dome, he's in the NFC South,
Speaker 4: that division. I'm in that division like it's up for
Speaker 4: the taking. There's a lot going on, and as he
Speaker 4: comes in, he's not getting paid anything by the Falcons.
Speaker 4: They've paid Drake London that they've paid Kyle Pitts. Bjon
Speaker 4: Robinson is as electric as there is there in the
Speaker 4: entire NFL. There's a lot of pieces and I've always
Speaker 4: been a big fan of Kyle or Kevin Stefanski. I've
Speaker 4: always been a big fan of his, and so I'd
Speaker 4: be very curious if you're a Falcons fan, to go, hey,
Speaker 4: what could this be? We've got We've got a lot
Speaker 4: of high end draft picks, we're basically paying our quarterbacks
Speaker 4: between Pennix and two almost nothing at this point.
Speaker 3: And we've got an offensive head.
Speaker 4: Coach that's got a lot of juice in some creativity,
Speaker 4: especially if you go back and look those first three
Speaker 4: years or so in Cleveland. So I'd put Atlanta in
Speaker 4: there a little bit different than all the all the
Speaker 4: big boys that you put in Tier three, but I
Speaker 4: think Atlanta's got a real real shot to be pretty
Speaker 4: interesting this year.
Speaker 2: I'm glad you did that.
Speaker 1: I would I would agree with you on that, and
Speaker 1: I like putting them in here because I also have
Speaker 1: some maybe unexpected or surprising ones I would like to
Speaker 1: add as well to this tier. And I agree with you.
Speaker 1: I think that it's you can You're like, I mean,
Speaker 1: it really is. I mean I keep doing for viewers,
Speaker 1: I keep literally doing the thing like I keep literally
Speaker 1: doing the tier of the shrug for me. I'd also
Speaker 1: put the Jaguars here because I, first of all listeners
Speaker 1: to the show know how big of a fan I
Speaker 1: have of what they're building over there. I think I
Speaker 1: know what they are and I think I know what
Speaker 1: their progression is going to be. Because Liam Cohen is
Speaker 1: of the coaching tree that I have most closely covered
Speaker 1: in my career. I think I know how they're going
Speaker 1: to do things in their front office. I think it's
Speaker 1: interesting to me. They are a high floor team, which
Speaker 1: is why I'm like, yeah, I'd put him in here
Speaker 1: with some of the big boys as well. I'd also
Speaker 1: put the Patriots and the Dolphins in here. Now, the
Speaker 1: Patriots I just can't get interested in, truly, but so.
Speaker 2: That's kind of I just throw them in here.
Speaker 1: The Dolph and they have one of the best young
Speaker 1: quarterbacks in the NFL, so you got to put them
Speaker 1: with some real contenders here. The Dolphins I put in
Speaker 1: there because my description of the Larry David shrugging Dot
Speaker 1: Jiff is Yeah, I guess I could get into this.
Speaker 1: I think I can tuck myself into this, and the
Speaker 1: point in question for me is not what they're going
Speaker 1: to be this year, but what they are building into
Speaker 1: being in this sprint rebuild. We've talked a lot about
Speaker 1: it on the show. Listeners are probably tired of me
Speaker 1: using the phrase sprint rebuild, but the the I think
Speaker 1: they will be better than expected, especially by the middle
Speaker 1: to end of the season. And I think their build
Speaker 1: it really makes sense to me what John Eric Sullivan
Speaker 1: is doing over there. I really understand that they're trying
Speaker 1: to establish a couple of weight bearing walls, raise the
Speaker 1: floor with some of those players, and draft like crazy
Speaker 1: do And I know you love this phrase.
Speaker 2: A lot of dart throws in.
Speaker 3: The draft, that's right. May twelve draft Pickture.
Speaker 2: I think thirteen, the most in the in the NFL
Speaker 2: this season.
Speaker 3: And favorite player in the draft Jacob rod Regaz.
Speaker 2: Yes, I listened to that on the JJ and Luke podcast.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we talked to him.
Speaker 4: We talked about him a lot, and when he went
Speaker 4: whatever that was forty one or forty two, there was
Speaker 4: an audible game inside the Jansen household because we were
Speaker 4: hoping maybe he'd follow to us because that was a
Speaker 4: that was a Keykle favorite.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I just think that they are going to
Speaker 1: in a shorter timeframe, be better than people expect them.
Speaker 1: To be, even if it is like a really questionable
Speaker 1: on paper roster over this neck these next couple of
Speaker 1: months training camp is a little unsteady, Like I just
Speaker 1: it's they what they're doing reminds me a lot of
Speaker 1: what we've seen the forty nine ers do in the past,
Speaker 1: what we've seen the Bucks do in the past, what
Speaker 1: we've seen the uh the Rams do in the past.
Speaker 2: In terms of that sprint.
Speaker 1: Rebuild, I think I want to get to our our
Speaker 1: favorite O what I think will be our favorite too,
Speaker 1: really in a sick and twisted way, our favorite two tiers.
Speaker 1: I want to say, are you okay with Tier three?
Speaker 1: Larry David shrugging, dot Jeff.
Speaker 3: I'mna add one?
Speaker 2: Okay?
Speaker 3: Sounds Bengals.
Speaker 2: The Bengals ooh interesting? Tell me why?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: I I am put me on the list of guys
Speaker 4: that think Joe Burrow.
Speaker 1: You don't think they're a team that will eventually hurt you.
Speaker 3: No, because I actually I like Burrow.
Speaker 4: The later in the season it goes, they might feel
Speaker 4: like it's kind of interesting, like I would have put
Speaker 4: Miami in Tier five. Like they are rebuilding, they are
Speaker 4: pairing it all down. They are uninteresting to me.
Speaker 3: This year. To me, they're interesting.
Speaker 4: The interesting parts of them are free agency, in the draft,
Speaker 4: and what are they developing. I'm not particularly curious about what.
Speaker 1: They do in the regular that's a part of what
Speaker 1: the team is JJ is their infhastri That's that's already happened.
Speaker 4: Unless they're tanking. There's no two of the tank for
Speaker 4: I guess you're you're you're tanking for arts. But they
Speaker 4: got Malik Will It's like, I don't know what they
Speaker 4: are that. I'm not gonna argue with you, but I
Speaker 4: would put the Bengals in because they are trying to
Speaker 4: figure out in today's NFL, can I just score forty
Speaker 4: five points against everybody. They continue to put all their
Speaker 4: money and time and energy into their offense, and it's awesome,
Speaker 4: and they are they have been fantastic, but they still
Speaker 4: haven't figured out the defense. Hendrickson leaves like they are
Speaker 4: continuing this pathway of you know, I think it's We
Speaker 4: talked about it a little bit during the year on
Speaker 4: players point on sirious, like the the Bengals basically said, hey,
Speaker 4: Joe Burrow, like Joe Burrow talked him into everything, right,
Speaker 4: all those things about hey, you can move the cap
Speaker 4: number around and you can. You can get all this
Speaker 4: GM talk, and he got all of his guys paid.
Speaker 4: But at the end of the day, like they don't
Speaker 4: have any money really spend on defense, and it puts
Speaker 4: a tremendous amount of pressure. Like it's totally the opposite
Speaker 4: of like the New England Patriots with Tom Brady. He's
Speaker 4: taking less, the defense is loaded. We talked, you know,
Speaker 4: we've talked about in the past, like what New England's
Speaker 4: doing right now. Drake Mape gets paid nothing. AJ Brown's
Speaker 4: got a low cap and eight of the ten highest
Speaker 4: paid players are on defense. Like the Bengals are going
Speaker 4: to try to outscore everybody, and I think that I
Speaker 4: think that they can do it. But it's a very
Speaker 4: unique strategy, especially coming off of like watching the Seahawks
Speaker 4: win the Super Bowl with a defense that's just nasty.
Speaker 4: So yeah, I put them in there. I can get
Speaker 4: into this. It's still the Bengals, But I love Burrow
Speaker 4: and Jamar Chases.
Speaker 3: As good as anyone in the league. Tea Higgins as well.
Speaker 1: I will give you this one because you have generously,
Speaker 1: I think, given me more than what I've deserved here.
Speaker 2: But I will give you this one.
Speaker 1: I had them in my Danny DeVito category Tier four
Speaker 1: because I just feel like they just they're just They're
Speaker 1: built to hurt you in the end, right. But I
Speaker 1: love the Dexter Lawrence trade. I am someone there was
Speaker 1: a lot of mixed opinions in this studio about that trade.
Speaker 1: I am a huge fan of I thought it was
Speaker 1: the right thing to do. This is a team where
Speaker 1: when I wrote about team building buckets earlier in the
Speaker 1: off season, I had them in a must win sort
Speaker 1: of category where they were sort of desperate and then
Speaker 1: trying to make these moves that then petered out in
Speaker 1: the middle of free agency, and I think they win.
Speaker 1: If I were to recategorize the Bengals, I would have
Speaker 1: put them then in win now, which was an entirely
Speaker 1: different bucket, meaning you're making the moves that make you
Speaker 1: a true contender or make you believe you are a
Speaker 1: true contender because.
Speaker 2: Of the aggression level of your move. So this here.
Speaker 4: We have.
Speaker 1: We already have the Bears and the Vikings in Tier four.
Speaker 1: As a reminder of the listener, Tier four is the
Speaker 1: Danny DeVito shaking his head, Dot Jiff becoming invested and
Speaker 1: interested in the team may ultimately hurt me, and yet
Speaker 1: I cannot help myself. And then Tier five is our
Speaker 1: last tier.
Speaker 2: Demon something is way off here.
Speaker 1: I cross the street and avoid eye contact even though
Speaker 1: they're smiling at me, like really, really intensely. So we
Speaker 1: have the Bears and the Vikings in tier four. This
Speaker 1: is my Danny DeVito banger that I want to put
Speaker 1: in here because this team has done this to me
Speaker 1: many many times, and I'm very disappointed them.
Speaker 2: I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.
Speaker 1: The Tampa Bay Buccaneers are going in my Danny DeVito category.
Speaker 1: I love the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. I'm sorry to say
Speaker 1: this to you while you're on screen. I think Baker
Speaker 1: Mayfield is one of the most exciting players in football
Speaker 1: when he's on I love their receiving corps. I think
Speaker 1: their defense is going to be fine. I like what
Speaker 1: they did in the dr at Jason Light is one
Speaker 1: of my favorite gms. However, by God, they hurt me
Speaker 1: every time. I'm not doing it.
Speaker 2: This year.
Speaker 1: I'm just not gonna do it, and maybe me unclenching
Speaker 1: a little bit is exactly what they need, just karmically
Speaker 1: to finally move forward. So I'm putting the Bucks in
Speaker 1: Tier four. I want two Tier t two Tier four
Speaker 1: teams from you. JJ. I know I'm putting you through
Speaker 1: some gymnastics here, but like you went to Brophy Prep
Speaker 1: and Notre Dame, so probably you probably can handle it.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 4: I would say that I hope that the Bucks break
Speaker 4: your heart again. That would be fantastic as a as
Speaker 4: a panther, I put the Colts in this category me too.
Speaker 4: I think that you know, Daniel Jones is a Charlotte kid, Like,
Speaker 4: I'm a big fan of his. What's that recovery going
Speaker 4: to look like? Where are they going to be? Certainly,
Speaker 4: their run game in the first you know, two and
Speaker 4: a half three months was electric. I've I've been a
Speaker 4: big fan of Shane Stikeen going all the way back
Speaker 4: to when he was with the Chargers, then obviously the Eagles.
Speaker 4: I think his offenses are creative, but they petered out
Speaker 4: last year. You know, it's sort of it's sort of funny,
Speaker 4: like the AFC South was everyone sort of laughing stocked out,
Speaker 4: and the NFC South and then all of a sudden,
Speaker 4: the Jaguars are fantastic, win thirteen games. Houston was as
Speaker 4: good as anybody, and we forget through ten games. The
Speaker 4: Colts were eight and two and kind of running away
Speaker 4: that they had the Sauce Gardener trade all all dialed up,
Speaker 4: and then it kind of fell apart on them. So
Speaker 4: I put I put Indy in this category as well,
Speaker 4: did I get does Tampa Bay count for me?
Speaker 3: Or do I owe you one more?
Speaker 2: You owe me one more?
Speaker 3: All right?
Speaker 4: Like I'm looking through this, I think Washington is in
Speaker 4: this category. I think I think Jayden Daniels had a
Speaker 4: great year one. Year two was a mess. Obviously there
Speaker 4: were some injuries as well.
Speaker 3: There.
Speaker 4: I'm a big fan of dan Quinn, but they went
Speaker 4: all in after year one, signed a bunch of guys,
Speaker 4: a bunch of big money and and I if I
Speaker 4: remember correctly, like they've kind of burned through a lot
Speaker 4: of their cap space. Like so they went into win
Speaker 4: now mode, didn't win and you look back, so much
Speaker 4: of the twenty four season was high variant stuff.
Speaker 3: They were unbelievable on fourth down. Dan Quinn went forward
Speaker 3: a ton.
Speaker 4: I think they were like eighty three or eighty four
Speaker 4: percent conversion on fourth down. So they were kind of
Speaker 4: in that Dan Campbell Lions mode and they were hitting
Speaker 4: on a lot of it carries them to twelve or
Speaker 4: thirteen wins and then obviously getting all the way to
Speaker 4: the NFC Championship game, losing to the Eagles, and they
Speaker 4: went all in and they traded for Debo and they
Speaker 4: traded for Laramy Tunsel, and they spent a ton of
Speaker 4: money in cap cap space on veterans and win now.
Speaker 3: Mode, and it didn't really work out for him.
Speaker 4: And I think a little bit of that is you
Speaker 4: can fool yourself a little bit with the high variants
Speaker 4: fourth down stuff. It's a good part to play, but
Speaker 4: as we've seen with the Lions and others like it is.
Speaker 4: It is a high wire act. I'm a big fan
Speaker 4: of it. I think teams should aggressively pursue it, but
Speaker 4: it also can be one of those things where you
Speaker 4: can think you're better than you really are, and they've
Speaker 4: put themselves in a tough spot.
Speaker 3: Again.
Speaker 4: I'm a big Dan Quinn and Jayden Daniels fan, but
Speaker 4: in that division with Philly, I'm with you. I like Dallas,
Speaker 4: I think they're a good team, and obviously I let
Speaker 4: off with the Giants. I think that's gonna be a
Speaker 4: tough division for them to kind of work their way
Speaker 4: through without maybe the resources that you'd hope to have
Speaker 4: with a quarterback.
Speaker 3: Going into year three.
Speaker 1: I had Commanders in demon category because I just think
Speaker 1: they're still just way too variant and top heavy, and
Speaker 1: I don't I would like to see proof, more proof
Speaker 1: that this can this team can right the ship. I
Speaker 1: love Jayden Daniels, Go Sun Devils, but I just think
Speaker 1: that there's been such a the draft classes have not
Speaker 1: been there for Adam Peters yet, and so I just
Speaker 1: think that it's I just would like to see more
Speaker 1: team building that translates onto the field, that's not investing
Speaker 1: or overpaying for veterans. You get one or two year
Speaker 1: to your point, you one or two years where you
Speaker 1: can do that. Take the Panthers model for example, one
Speaker 1: year maybe in this most recent build that and.
Speaker 3: You gotta hit and got it exactly.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: The other two teams before we get to the final
Speaker 1: category of demon the the other two teams I had
Speaker 1: in the Danny DeVito shaking his head dut Chiff were
Speaker 1: the Jets because their fan base is a bunch of diehards,
Speaker 1: and yet they they will be hurt and I cannot
Speaker 1: help but be interested in the journey for them, and
Speaker 1: then also the Titans, because I do think, you know,
Speaker 1: I love cam Ward and I do think that the
Speaker 1: Titans made some floor raising moves. I am in terms
Speaker 1: of interest level, I am so interested to see how
Speaker 1: the dynamics between Robert Sala and Brian Dable, two head
Speaker 1: coach figures who are not both head coaches. Now Robert
Speaker 1: Sala is in charge. I'm so so interested to see
Speaker 1: how that works. So subjectively speaking, I understand that their
Speaker 1: fans will probably get their expectations up and will be hurt. Myself,
Speaker 1: in committing too hard to either of these teams, would
Speaker 1: expect myself to also get hurt in the end. But
Speaker 1: I am interested. I can't It's like I have to
Speaker 1: watch it. I can't, can't look away from It's like
Speaker 1: when someone steps in gum, I want to see how
Speaker 1: long the gum sticks.
Speaker 2: To their shoe.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 3: I I won't argue with you in Tennessee.
Speaker 4: Although I probably would have put them in my demon category,
Speaker 4: I think they're I need you, I.
Speaker 2: Need you to emphasize. You know there is punctuation.
Speaker 3: Come on, oh demon?
Speaker 4: Yeah, the Jets are clearly in demon for me, So
Speaker 4: I'm gonna move them down.
Speaker 2: Okay, sounds good.
Speaker 3: Yeah, but but it was interesting, like talking.
Speaker 4: I got a chance to talk to Kyle van Noy
Speaker 4: a couple of days ago, and he was really high
Speaker 4: on the Jets. So I guess it has a little
Speaker 4: bit to do with how do you see them sort
Speaker 4: of projecting going forward? But there's controversy there at the
Speaker 4: quarterback position.
Speaker 3: What is that going to be?
Speaker 4: They had three draft picks, They've got a ton of
Speaker 4: stuff moving forward. They're in a good spot moving forward,
Speaker 4: but most of their top players have now been traded
Speaker 4: away or let go. You know, they keep Bresee Hall,
Speaker 4: but you know, I'm an analytics guy, like, great, you
Speaker 4: kept a high paid running back, But I don't know
Speaker 4: that that really matters if you're down twenty one to ten.
Speaker 4: So you know, that's been my biggest criticism what they did.
Speaker 4: They they had a corner, they had an interior alignment.
Speaker 4: They traded them. I didn't I didn't mind it because
Speaker 4: they got so much back for those guys, but then
Speaker 4: you paid the running back, Like I, that's not the
Speaker 4: way I build a team. Running Backs hate me when
Speaker 4: I say that sort of thing, but that's kind of
Speaker 4: where I land on it, and and look, if you're
Speaker 4: a defensive head coach, Mike McDonald definitely didn't seattle. But like,
Speaker 4: I think, the standard for how good you are as
Speaker 4: a coach has to come out early, and so Aaron Glenn,
Speaker 4: this is a big start.
Speaker 3: It was choppy at best last year.
Speaker 4: And as a defensive coordinator, the standard and like the
Speaker 4: ex you got to meet those expectations.
Speaker 3: Early because you're not going to get a lot of
Speaker 3: time in this.
Speaker 4: League as a defensive head coach because all of those
Speaker 4: big names that you've talked about, all that, you know,
Speaker 4: the entire Sean McVay, Tree, it's all offensive guys. So
Speaker 4: they got to come out early, and I don't know
Speaker 4: that they got the juice to do it. So that's
Speaker 4: where I put them down there in Tier five. But
Speaker 4: that being said, I'll go with you on. I'll go
Speaker 4: with you on Tennessee. I like the coaching dynamics there
Speaker 4: with last year's number one cam Ward cool. I, this
Speaker 4: is awesome.
Speaker 1: This is all shaking out right into my hands, you know,
Speaker 1: just kidding, just kidding, Okay, So Tier four, just to
Speaker 1: recap Bears, Vikings, Bucks, Colts, Commander's Titans, I think we
Speaker 1: can agree on tier four there my tier five. Just
Speaker 1: to remind the listener, tier five is demon something is
Speaker 1: way off here. I crossed the street and avoid eye
Speaker 1: contact even though they're smiling at me, like really really intensely.
Speaker 2: So I agree that we could put the Jets here.
Speaker 1: They were in my tier four, but I do agree
Speaker 1: with you that they could be certainly argued for and
Speaker 1: in tier five. You like how I hedged. That's like
Speaker 1: how you talk to your you're talking to your kids
Speaker 1: about their red time. I my picks for tier five
Speaker 1: are the Steelers because to me, it's all about the
Speaker 1: quarterback here. I think they have a good team. I
Speaker 1: think they have a good roster. I think that going
Speaker 1: all out and being so obvious and so just everything
Speaker 1: on pause while we go out and try to get
Speaker 1: this quarterback who did not even play very well last
Speaker 1: year and who knows how he's going to be this year,
Speaker 1: to me, was was so anti what you would think
Speaker 1: the Steelers would do, just with their history and it
Speaker 1: just it's sort of just it's the vibes were just
Speaker 1: not It just sort of reaked to me a little
Speaker 1: bit of desperation and just not very not a team
Speaker 1: that is built to me, the rest of the roster
Speaker 1: is very solid. But I could also argue for them
Speaker 1: in Tier four, as they will hurt me. I also
Speaker 1: have the Cardinals and the Browns in here. I don't
Speaker 1: think I really need to go too far into detail
Speaker 1: about that, but I want to ask you about the
Speaker 1: Steelers because I know I threw I sort of threw
Speaker 1: them in at the end here. I'm going to kind
Speaker 1: of give this to you. Where are you going to
Speaker 1: put the Steelers? I will give that.
Speaker 2: I'll give the Steelers to you.
Speaker 3: I don't I don't mind the Steelers in the demon category.
Speaker 3: Did did? I did that? Well? He did agree.
Speaker 4: I just I just I just don't think they're particularly interesting.
Speaker 4: I think they will be fine. I you know, I
Speaker 4: was in Green Bay when Aaron was a starter for
Speaker 4: the first time with Mike McCarthy. I think it's gonna
Speaker 4: be a it's gonna be a fine working relationship.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: One of the interesting things getting to talk to Aaron
Speaker 4: a little bit last year was he spoke so highly
Speaker 4: of Mike Tomlin, and he equated it to playing for
Speaker 4: Mike McCarthy. He has a lot of respect for Mike McCarthy.
Speaker 4: He's like, it's very uh, there's a lot of trust
Speaker 4: that goes to the veteran leaders. So it doesn't surprise
Speaker 4: me that that's a marriage that that came to be
Speaker 4: this offseason because he had a lot of respect for
Speaker 4: Mike McCarthy as he was sort of speaking so highly
Speaker 4: of Mike Tomlin, I thought Aaron played okay last year.
Speaker 4: You know you're not You're not paying Aaron forty five
Speaker 4: to fifty million dollars. So like, I just don't know
Speaker 4: that the team's all that interesting, especially when you consider
Speaker 4: that division's also got the Bengals and and the and
Speaker 4: the and the Ravens. We talked about it a lot
Speaker 4: last year. I think I still feel like they're a
Speaker 4: nine to eighteen. They're gonna be some teams that they
Speaker 4: shouldn't and they're going to lose some games that they shouldn't.
Speaker 4: I would certainly trust the ball in Aaron's hand in
Speaker 4: the fourth quarter, but I just I just it's sort
Speaker 4: of just an uninteresting nine and eight, ten and seven,
Speaker 4: seven and ten kind of team for me. So I
Speaker 4: put them in Tier five. It's a little weird, it's
Speaker 4: a little clunky, but I think they'll be fine.
Speaker 2: I love this. I enjoyed doing this.
Speaker 1: You know, normally, at this point in the show, JJ,
Speaker 1: we would go through tier by tier and give the
Speaker 1: listeners a recap of everything we had just talked about. However,
Speaker 1: as I've said multiple times in the show, you can't
Speaker 1: hit a moving target. So if they were not if
Speaker 1: they are not tracking it, they cannot argue with it
Speaker 1: either way.
Speaker 2: And I'm for the listeners.
Speaker 1: I do want to hear your tiers and where you
Speaker 1: would put your teams within the context of these now
Speaker 1: copyrighted tiers, which I think are going to usher in
Speaker 1: a new way of how we think about deep, deep,
Speaker 1: deep off season football. JJ, You're going to camp in
Speaker 1: two weeks, Buddy, year nineteen.
Speaker 2: This is so exciting.
Speaker 1: I'm so honored and glad that you joined us on
Speaker 1: NFL Daily. This is becoming a tradition for us that
Speaker 1: you're my co host for a summer episode of NFL Daily.
Speaker 1: I'm just really grateful to you, and you know, thanks
Speaker 1: for fighting with me a little bit, but like more
Speaker 1: often than not, conceding to my arguments.
Speaker 4: Thank you for that playful banter as good as you know,
Speaker 4: that's one of my keys to long Jevit in the
Speaker 4: NFL is playful, banter in the cafeteria, in the locker room,
Speaker 4: builds camaraderie amongst teammates.
Speaker 3: So it's right up my alley.
Speaker 2: Awesome, Well, we are going to be back in your
Speaker 2: feed later this week.
Speaker 1: We've got Patrick Claybond, the great NFL Daily superstar. I
Speaker 1: am the chairman of the Clay Bonnie Bears his fan club.
Speaker 2: I see him laughing behind the glass. For JJ Jansen,
Speaker 2: I'm Jordan Rodrie. Thanks for listening today. This is NFL
Speaker 2: Daily