1 00:00:15,066 --> 00:00:15,506 Speaker 1: Pushkin. 2 00:00:19,176 --> 00:00:22,136 Speaker 2: Hey Lost Hills listeners, it's Dana. I wanted to let 3 00:00:22,156 --> 00:00:24,596 Speaker 2: you know that you can hear the entire new season 4 00:00:24,636 --> 00:00:28,446 Speaker 2: of Lost Hills ad-free along with other great binge listens 5 00:00:28,606 --> 00:00:32,486 Speaker 2: by becoming a Pushkin Plus subscriber. Find Pushkin Plus on 6 00:00:32,506 --> 00:00:35,506 Speaker 2: the Lost Hills show page in Apple Podcasts or at 7 00:00:35,626 --> 00:00:50,006 Speaker 2: pushkin.fm slash plus. Not too long ago, I met a 8 00:00:50,066 --> 00:00:54,006 Speaker 2: surfer named Denny Auberg. He lives in Santa Barbara now, 9 00:00:54,306 --> 00:00:56,766 Speaker 2: but he learned to surf in Malibu when the sport 10 00:00:56,806 --> 00:00:58,326 Speaker 2: was barely known on the mainland. 11 00:00:59,376 --> 00:01:03,696 Speaker 3: I still go surfing after about 62 years of surfing. 12 00:01:03,936 --> 00:01:06,556 Speaker 3: I go down to Rincon, I live close by, and 13 00:01:07,356 --> 00:01:08,496 Speaker 3: I still have the stoke. 14 00:01:10,256 --> 00:01:12,386 Speaker 2: Denny told me a story about one of his early 15 00:01:12,446 --> 00:01:16,566 Speaker 2: surf experiences, a day that made an indelible impression on him. 16 00:01:17,616 --> 00:01:17,836 Speaker 3: It was 1959. 17 00:01:17,816 --> 00:01:24,736 Speaker 2: He was 12. The waves at Malibu were huge, but 18 00:01:24,776 --> 00:01:27,896 Speaker 2: he and his friend decided to paddle out anyway. They 19 00:01:27,916 --> 00:01:30,426 Speaker 2: were kooks. They didn't know what they were doing. 20 00:01:32,256 --> 00:01:35,346 Speaker 3: So we were beginners, you know. We were down at Malibu, 21 00:01:35,366 --> 00:01:38,346 Speaker 3: and it was a big day, you know. But we 22 00:01:38,646 --> 00:01:41,266 Speaker 3: went out by the pier. When it gets real big, 23 00:01:41,286 --> 00:01:43,046 Speaker 3: you have to go way down by the pier to 24 00:01:43,166 --> 00:01:45,366 Speaker 3: paddle out. And so we'd jump in the water with 25 00:01:45,426 --> 00:01:46,306 Speaker 3: our boards, you. 26 00:01:46,186 --> 00:01:47,066 Speaker 4: Know, little skinny. 27 00:01:47,576 --> 00:01:52,926 Speaker 3: 12-year-olds, and started turning on little skinny arms, you know, 28 00:01:53,006 --> 00:01:54,766 Speaker 3: doing this kook paddle, trying to get out. And a 29 00:01:54,846 --> 00:01:57,406 Speaker 3: big set of waves, I mean, big waves came, like 30 00:01:57,446 --> 00:02:00,746 Speaker 3: a row of five or six waves out to sea. 31 00:02:02,046 --> 00:02:05,266 Speaker 3: I never forget the beauty of this wave coming. 32 00:02:06,616 --> 00:02:09,316 Speaker 2: As the wave approached, Denny saw there was a surfer 33 00:02:09,396 --> 00:02:09,616 Speaker 2: on it. 34 00:02:10,116 --> 00:02:13,236 Speaker 3: Just perfectly placed on this wave, just trimming at the 35 00:02:13,276 --> 00:02:16,886 Speaker 3: very top of the wave. And there's a precision. When 36 00:02:16,926 --> 00:02:19,786 Speaker 3: you trim, it means your board's flush sideways to the wave. 37 00:02:19,846 --> 00:02:22,306 Speaker 3: It's inside, and you're getting speed that way because it's 38 00:02:22,746 --> 00:02:25,576 Speaker 3: in the right position. The fin's just hanging on at 39 00:02:25,616 --> 00:02:28,176 Speaker 3: the top of the wave. And it's hand position, the 40 00:02:28,216 --> 00:02:30,716 Speaker 3: way he's kind of arching, and the little veils of 41 00:02:30,776 --> 00:02:33,636 Speaker 3: water coming off the nose. It was the most gorgeous thing. 42 00:02:33,676 --> 00:02:38,646 Speaker 3: You know, the colors. He's riding this wind-blowing spin drift back, 43 00:02:38,706 --> 00:02:40,446 Speaker 3: and we're just watching this thing. 44 00:02:40,586 --> 00:02:41,286 Speaker 5: Oh, my God. 45 00:02:43,866 --> 00:02:48,146 Speaker 3: But we realized he was coming right at us. We 46 00:02:48,186 --> 00:02:51,226 Speaker 3: were the kooks in his way, coming right at us. 47 00:02:53,346 --> 00:02:56,856 Speaker 3: So we had to turn sideways. It's hard to explain, 48 00:02:56,876 --> 00:03:00,056 Speaker 3: but when you turn broadside, you just get obliterated. It 49 00:03:00,576 --> 00:03:03,396 Speaker 3: just took our board. It just took us and blasted us, 50 00:03:03,816 --> 00:03:08,336 Speaker 3: churning into the whitewater, down into the pilings of the pier. 51 00:03:08,876 --> 00:03:10,806 Speaker 3: I really felt like I was going to drown. My 52 00:03:10,866 --> 00:03:13,046 Speaker 3: friend told me I almost drowned. I don't remember, but 53 00:03:13,906 --> 00:03:18,226 Speaker 3: I remember spitting out sand and just like, oh my God, 54 00:03:18,906 --> 00:03:19,766 Speaker 3: who was that guy? 55 00:03:22,746 --> 00:03:28,226 Speaker 2: Who was that guy? His name was Mickey Dora, also 56 00:03:28,286 --> 00:03:32,546 Speaker 2: known as the cat, also known as the Dark Prince 57 00:03:32,586 --> 00:03:37,496 Speaker 2: of Malibu. In the 1950s, as surfing spread from Hawaii 58 00:03:37,526 --> 00:03:41,516 Speaker 2: to California, Mickey gained a reputation as the most dynamic 59 00:03:41,616 --> 00:03:45,906 Speaker 2: and watchable surfer on the mainland. He was Malibu's first 60 00:03:45,966 --> 00:03:51,186 Speaker 2: homegrown celebrity and the surf world's first personality. He put 61 00:03:51,276 --> 00:03:56,856 Speaker 2: Malibu on the map. Mickey Dora was beautiful and charismatic, 62 00:03:57,416 --> 00:04:00,776 Speaker 2: but he was all shade. You don't earn that name, 63 00:04:01,036 --> 00:04:06,716 Speaker 2: the Dark Prince, for nothing. He represented Malibu's dark side, 64 00:04:07,556 --> 00:04:12,136 Speaker 2: what I think of as Malibu's true nature. He violently 65 00:04:12,196 --> 00:04:15,856 Speaker 2: opposed the happy, sun-drenched Malibu that would come to dominate 66 00:04:15,916 --> 00:04:19,866 Speaker 2: pop culture, starting with the Gidget movies in the late 50s, 67 00:04:20,416 --> 00:04:23,826 Speaker 2: Malibu Barbie in the 70s, and everything that came after that. 68 00:04:25,246 --> 00:04:29,306 Speaker 2: He hated Gidget and everything she stood for. New surfers, 69 00:04:29,706 --> 00:04:34,786 Speaker 2: girl surfers, surfers he thought didn't belong. He went to 70 00:04:34,846 --> 00:04:38,476 Speaker 2: war for the soul of Malibu, the soul of surfing. 71 00:04:39,936 --> 00:04:45,936 Speaker 2: Some days, I think he won. Mickey Dora was a 72 00:04:45,996 --> 00:04:51,676 Speaker 2: surfing Jesse James, an unrepentant outlaw, idolized by the so-called 73 00:04:51,976 --> 00:04:56,556 Speaker 2: wild kids of Malibu Beach. A scoundrel who people say 74 00:04:56,606 --> 00:05:00,566 Speaker 2: would screw them over for fun, scam them, steal from them, 75 00:05:00,966 --> 00:05:05,146 Speaker 2: and break their hearts. A rebel who made his own rules. 76 00:05:06,346 --> 00:05:10,566 Speaker 2: The legends were endless, mostly not fact-checkable. and Mickey was 77 00:05:10,586 --> 00:05:16,246 Speaker 2: their primary author. He stole Ringo Starr's snuffbox, or was 78 00:05:16,306 --> 00:05:21,276 Speaker 2: it John Lennon's lighter? He dated Cher before Sonny. He 79 00:05:21,336 --> 00:05:25,496 Speaker 2: knew who kidnapped Frank Sinatra Jr. He was a diamond smuggler, 80 00:05:25,796 --> 00:05:30,396 Speaker 2: a drug lord, a double agent, a European aristocrat, a 81 00:05:30,456 --> 00:05:36,456 Speaker 2: prophet of the coming apocalypse. He was an emotionally unstable man, 82 00:05:36,876 --> 00:05:40,876 Speaker 2: armed and dangerous. That one was courtesy of the FBI, 83 00:05:41,136 --> 00:05:44,106 Speaker 2: who tried to catch him for seven years. Because in 84 00:05:44,136 --> 00:05:47,026 Speaker 2: the early 70s, at the height of his fame, when 85 00:05:47,066 --> 00:05:49,086 Speaker 2: some of his bad deeds were catching up with him, 86 00:05:50,086 --> 00:05:54,486 Speaker 2: Mickey just disappeared. He went on the lam, leading law 87 00:05:54,506 --> 00:05:58,966 Speaker 2: enforcement on a goose chase that spanned the globe. But 88 00:05:59,006 --> 00:06:02,246 Speaker 2: while the law was hunting him, he was hunting something else. 89 00:06:03,846 --> 00:06:10,426 Speaker 2: The perfect wave. A once-in-a-century event. sometimes called the rogue wave, 90 00:06:10,756 --> 00:06:16,366 Speaker 2: or the episodic wave, or the ninth wave. Does that 91 00:06:16,386 --> 00:06:20,266 Speaker 2: sound familiar? If it does, that's because it's a lot 92 00:06:20,306 --> 00:06:24,856 Speaker 2: like the plot of Point Break, the cult classic from 1991. 93 00:06:24,856 --> 00:06:28,496 Speaker 2: In Point Break, Patrick Swayze plays a groovy surfer named Bodhi, 94 00:06:28,996 --> 00:06:31,316 Speaker 2: who robbed banks so he could travel the world and 95 00:06:31,356 --> 00:06:35,976 Speaker 2: find the perfect wave. Well, Mickey was a real-life Bodhi, 96 00:06:37,196 --> 00:06:38,416 Speaker 2: Minus the kumbaya. 97 00:06:38,616 --> 00:06:46,056 Speaker 6: He said, criminals break the laws. I live outside the law. 98 00:06:46,936 --> 00:06:54,486 Speaker 5: Mickey's aliases. Richard Austin Roach Jr. Miklos Dora. Mickey Dora. 99 00:06:54,846 --> 00:06:59,026 Speaker 3: It was a Swiss bank, and yeah, they found $ 400, 000 100 00:06:58,306 --> 00:06:59,126 Speaker 3: in the bank. 101 00:06:59,326 --> 00:07:00,406 Speaker 5: Alexander Dora. 102 00:07:00,526 --> 00:07:02,846 Speaker 3: Nobody knows exactly where it came from. There were all 103 00:07:02,886 --> 00:07:03,666 Speaker 3: sorts of theories. 104 00:07:03,986 --> 00:07:07,626 Speaker 5: Miklos Dora Cornell. Michael S. Chapin. 105 00:07:07,886 --> 00:07:14,006 Speaker 6: Australia, New Zealand, Bali, Thailand, Malaysia, India. I'm probably missing 106 00:07:14,066 --> 00:07:15,696 Speaker 6: a few. All of Europe. 107 00:07:16,216 --> 00:07:17,676 Speaker 5: Michael Spring Chapin. 108 00:07:18,056 --> 00:07:21,136 Speaker 3: He went to amazing places before anybody was doing that stuff. 109 00:07:21,476 --> 00:07:22,116 Speaker 7: By himself. 110 00:07:22,496 --> 00:07:26,256 Speaker 5: Mikkel Spring Chapin. Michael Stanley Chapin. 111 00:07:26,576 --> 00:07:28,936 Speaker 2: You don't have to be a conspiracy theorist to connect 112 00:07:28,956 --> 00:07:29,876 Speaker 2: the dots around this. 113 00:07:30,416 --> 00:07:31,556 Speaker 5: Alexander Miklos. 114 00:07:32,306 --> 00:07:34,246 Speaker 6: And I fell in love the minute he walked out 115 00:07:34,286 --> 00:07:34,806 Speaker 6: of the waters. 116 00:07:35,586 --> 00:07:38,626 Speaker 7: Until I realized he was a scoundrel at a road 117 00:07:39,546 --> 00:07:42,006 Speaker 7: and was training me to be an accomplice. 118 00:07:42,026 --> 00:07:45,466 Speaker 4: I'm going to get in big trouble for saying all this. 119 00:07:45,886 --> 00:07:51,446 Speaker 4: He was narcissistic, but also incredibly intelligent and also, I'd say, 120 00:07:51,466 --> 00:07:52,526 Speaker 4: a little bit sociopathic. 121 00:07:53,406 --> 00:07:56,566 Speaker 8: It just all gets darker and darker and darker until 122 00:07:56,806 --> 00:07:58,696 Speaker 8: I just want to sort of turn away from it. 123 00:07:58,696 --> 00:07:59,876 Speaker 7: I don't want to know about it anymore. 124 00:08:03,236 --> 00:08:07,046 Speaker 2: At its core, surfing is a counterculture. So Mickey being 125 00:08:07,086 --> 00:08:17,106 Speaker 2: an anti-hero, that just makes him surfing's hero. I'm Dana Goodyear, 126 00:08:17,586 --> 00:08:22,656 Speaker 2: and this is Lost Hills. Season 3, The Dark Prince. 127 00:08:39,456 --> 00:08:42,676 Speaker 2: Episode 1, The Legend of Mickey Dora. 128 00:08:49,876 --> 00:08:52,306 Speaker 1: Who's the best in the world? Who's the worst in 129 00:08:52,326 --> 00:08:52,706 Speaker 1: the world? 130 00:08:53,346 --> 00:08:54,326 Speaker 5: I don't give a fuck. 131 00:08:54,506 --> 00:08:56,906 Speaker 1: I don't give a damn. If people want to think 132 00:08:56,926 --> 00:08:58,906 Speaker 1: I'm any good, fine. If they don't think I'm any good, 133 00:08:59,446 --> 00:09:02,066 Speaker 1: I don't give a shit. I'm there to ride waves 134 00:09:02,166 --> 00:09:02,926 Speaker 1: and enjoy myself. 135 00:09:11,396 --> 00:09:15,766 Speaker 2: Mickey Dora died from pancreatic cancer in 2002. For reasons 136 00:09:15,786 --> 00:09:18,806 Speaker 2: I'll get into later, there are very few publicly available 137 00:09:18,866 --> 00:09:22,046 Speaker 2: recordings of him. What you're about to hear is probably 138 00:09:22,086 --> 00:09:25,736 Speaker 2: the longest and most revealing clip that's out there. It's 139 00:09:25,766 --> 00:09:29,976 Speaker 2: from a 1990 documentary called Surfers, the Movie. In it, 140 00:09:30,296 --> 00:09:32,616 Speaker 2: Mickey lays out his surfing philosophy. 141 00:09:32,636 --> 00:09:37,156 Speaker 1: My whole life is this escape. My whole life is 142 00:09:37,176 --> 00:09:40,276 Speaker 1: this wave I drop into. set the whole thing up, 143 00:09:40,516 --> 00:09:43,416 Speaker 1: pull up a bottom turn, pull up into it, and 144 00:09:43,436 --> 00:09:48,796 Speaker 1: shoot for my life. Going for broke, man. And behind me, 145 00:09:49,056 --> 00:09:50,496 Speaker 1: all this shit goes over my back. 146 00:09:55,336 --> 00:09:57,296 Speaker 9: He had been such a big part of surf history, 147 00:09:57,396 --> 00:09:59,566 Speaker 9: and as a kid, I soaked all that up. I 148 00:09:59,586 --> 00:10:02,236 Speaker 9: started surfing in the mid-70s, late 70s. 149 00:10:03,266 --> 00:10:07,246 Speaker 2: This is Kelly Slater, the 11-time World Surf League champion. 150 00:10:07,966 --> 00:10:11,976 Speaker 2: He's regarded as the greatest surfer of all time. When 151 00:10:12,016 --> 00:10:14,216 Speaker 2: he was in his 20s, Kelly had the chance to 152 00:10:14,256 --> 00:10:15,536 Speaker 2: spend time with Mickey Dora. 153 00:10:16,696 --> 00:10:17,836 Speaker 7: It was part of the experience. 154 00:10:18,076 --> 00:10:23,186 Speaker 9: It was essentially like a grassroots experience to be around 155 00:10:23,226 --> 00:10:27,326 Speaker 9: Mickey Dora in the surf world because he was a legend. 156 00:10:27,366 --> 00:10:30,246 Speaker 9: He was a living character. To us, to people in 157 00:10:30,286 --> 00:10:34,066 Speaker 9: my era and just before me, Mickey was, he's one 158 00:10:34,086 --> 00:10:37,846 Speaker 9: of the biggest names in surfing. And he did represent 159 00:10:37,886 --> 00:10:43,356 Speaker 9: the lifestyle and the freedom that surfers have. And, you know, 160 00:10:43,376 --> 00:10:45,236 Speaker 9: a means to an end to go travel around the 161 00:10:45,276 --> 00:10:45,856 Speaker 9: world and surf. 162 00:10:49,496 --> 00:10:53,546 Speaker 2: Mickey was one of the original California surfers, an innovator 163 00:10:53,726 --> 00:10:57,606 Speaker 2: who was among the few standout masters, certainly the most 164 00:10:57,686 --> 00:11:02,026 Speaker 2: notorious and memorable. At the moment that surfing exploded into 165 00:11:02,046 --> 00:11:07,926 Speaker 2: the mainstream, Mickey had an ideology about surfing. Casual surfers, 166 00:11:08,466 --> 00:11:11,646 Speaker 2: they should get out of his way. Or better yet, 167 00:11:12,086 --> 00:11:17,846 Speaker 2: stay out of Malibu altogether. Professionals like Slater, they were 168 00:11:17,866 --> 00:11:24,496 Speaker 2: defiling something sacred. Mickey's way was total commitment and total freedom. 169 00:11:25,356 --> 00:11:26,436 Speaker 6: No rules. 170 00:11:27,596 --> 00:11:32,136 Speaker 9: The cool thing about Mickey's story is there's always been 171 00:11:32,156 --> 00:11:33,826 Speaker 9: this sort of tinge of like a little bit of 172 00:11:33,866 --> 00:11:38,226 Speaker 9: an outlaw lifestyle or something, an expat, traveling person, somebody 173 00:11:38,246 --> 00:11:39,986 Speaker 9: who there's a little bit of mystery in their life 174 00:11:40,066 --> 00:11:42,746 Speaker 9: or whatever. That was really prominent back in the 50s 175 00:11:42,786 --> 00:11:46,766 Speaker 9: and 60s and 70s and surfing. And it really built 176 00:11:46,866 --> 00:11:51,376 Speaker 9: up the lore of mysterious characters around the world. I 177 00:11:51,416 --> 00:11:52,956 Speaker 9: don't know if all the stories I heard were true 178 00:11:53,016 --> 00:11:57,396 Speaker 9: or not, but that was the early days of like 007. 179 00:11:57,396 --> 00:12:00,116 Speaker 9: Maybe he pictured himself as like this kind of like 180 00:12:00,176 --> 00:12:02,496 Speaker 9: almost like a spy in this surf world or something. 181 00:12:02,566 --> 00:12:06,466 Speaker 9: And that was sort of celebrated to have this sort 182 00:12:06,506 --> 00:12:10,366 Speaker 9: of life at all costs and make it fun while 183 00:12:10,386 --> 00:12:10,836 Speaker 9: you're doing it. 184 00:12:18,686 --> 00:12:22,146 Speaker 2: I started surfing 10 years ago, and there's not another 185 00:12:22,186 --> 00:12:24,626 Speaker 2: way to say it. I fell totally in love with it. 186 00:12:25,386 --> 00:12:28,416 Speaker 2: The smell of the wax. The taste of salt, the 187 00:12:28,456 --> 00:12:32,036 Speaker 2: squinting into the sun, the scar I'll have forever from 188 00:12:32,076 --> 00:12:34,556 Speaker 2: the rock at low tide Malibu that cut through my 189 00:12:34,596 --> 00:12:38,766 Speaker 2: wetsuit and gashed my shin. I love the salty, shaggy 190 00:12:38,826 --> 00:12:41,846 Speaker 2: people who seem to congregate around the Southern California breaks. 191 00:12:42,846 --> 00:12:47,086 Speaker 2: People with stories from the not-that-distant past, when mainland surfing 192 00:12:47,106 --> 00:12:51,466 Speaker 2: was born. I got into surfing when I had a 193 00:12:51,506 --> 00:12:54,706 Speaker 2: newborn and a two-year-old, was writing a book and teaching 194 00:12:54,746 --> 00:12:57,526 Speaker 2: at a university and writing full-time for The New Yorker. 195 00:12:58,686 --> 00:13:03,136 Speaker 2: I was living in a world of obligations, deadlines, bedtimes, clocks, 196 00:13:03,856 --> 00:13:10,316 Speaker 2: a life measured out in teaspoons, very unfree. Surfing released 197 00:13:10,376 --> 00:13:14,846 Speaker 2: me temporarily from that identity. It let me drop out. 198 00:13:15,666 --> 00:13:20,496 Speaker 2: It let me live life by the tithes. This one day, 199 00:13:20,876 --> 00:13:23,616 Speaker 2: early in my time surfing, I was in the water 200 00:13:23,656 --> 00:13:27,486 Speaker 2: at sunset, a beginner's spot between Santa Monica and Malibu, 201 00:13:27,906 --> 00:13:30,726 Speaker 2: where you park along Pacific Coast Highway and scramble down 202 00:13:30,746 --> 00:13:34,266 Speaker 2: the rocks with your board. I was sitting there in 203 00:13:34,286 --> 00:13:38,046 Speaker 2: the long lag between sets of waves, bobbing, looking up 204 00:13:38,076 --> 00:13:42,516 Speaker 2: to the highway, watching all the cars streaming by. So 205 00:13:42,556 --> 00:13:44,856 Speaker 2: many times I'd been in my car on that stretch 206 00:13:44,896 --> 00:13:48,176 Speaker 2: of road. I'd glanced over at the surfers in the 207 00:13:48,216 --> 00:13:52,856 Speaker 2: water below. They had seemed scenic, a picturesque feature of 208 00:13:52,896 --> 00:13:56,816 Speaker 2: Los Angeles. But now I was in the waves, and 209 00:13:56,836 --> 00:14:00,496 Speaker 2: it was the opposite. The cars, the city clustered at 210 00:14:00,536 --> 00:14:08,296 Speaker 2: the ocean's edge. That was the backdrop. That world looked temporary, illusory. This, 211 00:14:09,086 --> 00:14:21,756 Speaker 2: out here, was real. To this day, Mickey Dora is 212 00:14:21,796 --> 00:14:25,296 Speaker 2: held up as an idol, many people's idea of a 213 00:14:25,376 --> 00:14:29,936 Speaker 2: pure surfer. That was the case for Denny Auberg, for sure. 214 00:14:30,836 --> 00:14:33,556 Speaker 2: He idolized Mickey as a kid on the beach in Malibu, 215 00:14:34,296 --> 00:14:37,496 Speaker 2: and you can hear it in his voice. He still does. 216 00:14:38,616 --> 00:14:40,976 Speaker 3: Mickey was 12 years older than me. He was a 217 00:14:41,036 --> 00:14:43,256 Speaker 3: man when we were kids, you know, 25, serious. 218 00:14:46,316 --> 00:14:49,056 Speaker 2: Denny's house has a simple wooden structure on his buddy's 219 00:14:49,156 --> 00:14:53,436 Speaker 2: avocado farm. The window ledges are lined with surf memorabilia. 220 00:14:54,236 --> 00:14:57,996 Speaker 2: Trophies and plaques and photos of Denny as a toe-headed teenager. 221 00:14:58,016 --> 00:15:00,056 Speaker 3: That's a picture of him. 222 00:15:00,336 --> 00:15:02,236 Speaker 2: This is you surfing Malibu? 223 00:15:02,256 --> 00:15:03,686 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's Mickey Dora next to me. 224 00:15:05,446 --> 00:15:09,066 Speaker 2: Your style's not totally different from Mickey's. 225 00:15:09,386 --> 00:15:12,686 Speaker 3: Yeah, we probably all copied Mickey, you know. He was 226 00:15:12,706 --> 00:15:15,586 Speaker 3: a big influence. That's another thing, you know. that people 227 00:15:15,646 --> 00:15:19,426 Speaker 3: copied his style and learned from him. He was a 228 00:15:19,486 --> 00:15:24,176 Speaker 3: teacher just by doing it. He taught us what to do, 229 00:15:24,696 --> 00:15:27,476 Speaker 3: how to ride a wave. Amazing. 230 00:15:29,456 --> 00:15:33,196 Speaker 2: The way Mickey surfed, it was poetic. No one who 231 00:15:33,236 --> 00:15:35,856 Speaker 2: saw it could forget it, and no one could match him, 232 00:15:36,256 --> 00:15:37,196 Speaker 2: though everyone tried. 233 00:15:37,916 --> 00:15:40,876 Speaker 3: His nickname was The Cat because he had feline grace 234 00:15:41,016 --> 00:15:44,006 Speaker 3: on a wave. The way he pussyfoot to the nose, 235 00:15:44,026 --> 00:15:46,666 Speaker 3: you know, boom, boom, real agile, you know. So they 236 00:15:46,706 --> 00:15:48,546 Speaker 3: call him the cat. That's why they named him that. 237 00:15:49,006 --> 00:15:51,486 Speaker 3: Not because he was a cat burglar, but I guess. 238 00:15:51,386 --> 00:15:51,916 Speaker 4: He was that, too. 239 00:15:54,866 --> 00:15:58,796 Speaker 2: Along with Mickey's unparalleled ability on a surfboard, his appearance 240 00:15:58,856 --> 00:16:02,116 Speaker 2: was unique on the beaches of Southern California. In a 241 00:16:02,196 --> 00:16:06,336 Speaker 2: sea of Boy Scout blondes, he was obsidian, dark hair 242 00:16:06,396 --> 00:16:10,216 Speaker 2: and eyes, and the kind of complexion people often call swarthy. 243 00:16:10,956 --> 00:16:15,036 Speaker 8: The fact that the guy who caught our attention the 244 00:16:15,136 --> 00:16:20,856 Speaker 8: most is this hairy, dark-haired guy who didn't look at 245 00:16:20,956 --> 00:16:23,096 Speaker 8: all like the archetype. I respond to that as well. 246 00:16:23,896 --> 00:16:27,466 Speaker 2: This is Matt Warshaw. He's a surf historian and the 247 00:16:27,526 --> 00:16:31,986 Speaker 2: curator of an incredible online resource called The Encyclopedia of Surfing. 248 00:16:33,846 --> 00:16:36,566 Speaker 8: In the surf world, you know, he looks so perfect 249 00:16:36,586 --> 00:16:39,776 Speaker 8: to be that person the way Bowie looks so good 250 00:16:39,816 --> 00:16:43,016 Speaker 8: to be the person for that period of glam rock, 251 00:16:43,076 --> 00:16:43,336 Speaker 8: you know. 252 00:16:44,546 --> 00:16:45,566 Speaker 7: It's not even the handsomeness. 253 00:16:45,586 --> 00:16:48,186 Speaker 8: The grin by itself, it's almost like this Cheshire Cap thing. 254 00:16:48,226 --> 00:16:50,446 Speaker 8: Like sometimes when you think of Dora, it's like the 255 00:16:50,506 --> 00:16:52,346 Speaker 8: rest of him sort of fades away and it's just 256 00:16:52,386 --> 00:16:55,946 Speaker 8: this dark hair and that really sort of devilish grin. 257 00:16:56,906 --> 00:17:00,026 Speaker 2: But what really set Mickey apart was the persona he invented. 258 00:17:01,076 --> 00:17:05,576 Speaker 2: Mickey Dora was a character, a complex self-invention that was 259 00:17:05,616 --> 00:17:09,196 Speaker 2: meant to draw maximum attention and to throw people off 260 00:17:09,236 --> 00:17:09,656 Speaker 2: his trail. 261 00:17:10,686 --> 00:17:12,686 Speaker 8: Mickey seemed to have, I guess, what we would call 262 00:17:12,726 --> 00:17:15,346 Speaker 8: a brand. And I got the feeling that he dressed 263 00:17:15,546 --> 00:17:18,526 Speaker 8: sort of for us. He would show up in things 264 00:17:18,546 --> 00:17:20,806 Speaker 8: that you wouldn't expect a surfer to wear. He would 265 00:17:20,826 --> 00:17:23,716 Speaker 8: just wear a tennis sweater to the beach. I read 266 00:17:23,756 --> 00:17:26,456 Speaker 8: someone said that Mickey would show up with a starlet 267 00:17:27,056 --> 00:17:28,656 Speaker 8: one day and then he'd show up with two really 268 00:17:28,696 --> 00:17:29,896 Speaker 8: pretty boys. 269 00:17:29,516 --> 00:17:30,096 Speaker 7: The next day. 270 00:17:30,916 --> 00:17:35,016 Speaker 8: So I think that he was never not having fun 271 00:17:35,426 --> 00:17:38,926 Speaker 8: and sort of just enjoying himself, especially in these early years, 272 00:17:38,946 --> 00:17:42,186 Speaker 8: just sort of playing with the image of being a 273 00:17:42,706 --> 00:17:44,966 Speaker 8: surfer before anybody else was doing it. 274 00:17:49,286 --> 00:17:55,016 Speaker 2: The ocean is infinite, but waves, waves shaped for surfing, 275 00:17:55,616 --> 00:18:01,376 Speaker 2: with a face and room to play, are finite. The 276 00:18:01,516 --> 00:18:05,426 Speaker 2: deepest joy in surfing comes from a long, uninterrupted ride 277 00:18:06,326 --> 00:18:09,436 Speaker 2: That's the whole point, to be alone on a wave. 278 00:18:10,416 --> 00:18:13,836 Speaker 2: Or so I hear. I've been surfing in Los Angeles 279 00:18:13,876 --> 00:18:16,256 Speaker 2: for a decade, and I've rarely had a wave to 280 00:18:16,296 --> 00:18:20,296 Speaker 2: myself for more than a few seconds. There are too 281 00:18:20,336 --> 00:18:26,866 Speaker 2: many surfers and not enough waves. Denny Auberg remembers the 282 00:18:26,906 --> 00:18:32,196 Speaker 2: time before. the early 1950s, when Malibu was an undiscovered wave. 283 00:18:33,196 --> 00:18:35,916 Speaker 2: Most days, it was only Mickey Dora and one or 284 00:18:35,976 --> 00:18:37,036 Speaker 2: two others in the water. 285 00:18:40,656 --> 00:18:44,496 Speaker 3: And you had this wonderful wave to yourself, which makes 286 00:18:44,536 --> 00:18:47,496 Speaker 3: a big difference, because when you have a wave to yourself, 287 00:18:47,556 --> 00:18:49,646 Speaker 3: and a perfect wave, you get the ride of your life, 288 00:18:49,726 --> 00:18:52,946 Speaker 3: and nobody gets in your way, and it's just the 289 00:18:53,006 --> 00:18:55,526 Speaker 3: nature all around you, and it's yours, you know, and 290 00:18:55,586 --> 00:18:58,796 Speaker 3: it's a personal thing. connection with nature that is hard 291 00:18:58,816 --> 00:19:01,676 Speaker 3: to duplicate. You know, it's just nothing like it because 292 00:19:01,756 --> 00:19:04,806 Speaker 3: it's so gorgeous and the water and the wind blowing 293 00:19:04,826 --> 00:19:08,826 Speaker 3: the waves back and you're free. There's no distractions. You're 294 00:19:08,866 --> 00:19:09,946 Speaker 3: just you and the waves. 295 00:19:12,426 --> 00:19:16,416 Speaker 2: Malibu is a perfect, long, right-breaking wave that peels from 296 00:19:16,476 --> 00:19:19,876 Speaker 2: way off the point to the Malibu Pier. And Mickey 297 00:19:19,916 --> 00:19:22,916 Speaker 2: Dora owned it for about two decades, from the early 298 00:19:23,316 --> 00:19:26,816 Speaker 2: 50s to the early 70s. And because it was Malibu, 299 00:19:27,116 --> 00:19:30,296 Speaker 2: that meant that Mickey Dora stood for something, an attitude 300 00:19:30,386 --> 00:19:34,166 Speaker 2: that would spread through the culture. Here's how one of 301 00:19:34,206 --> 00:19:39,326 Speaker 2: his admirers wrote about Mickey's influence in an authorized biography. Quote, 302 00:19:40,186 --> 00:19:43,286 Speaker 2: He was our Elvis. There was no one else to 303 00:19:43,346 --> 00:19:47,786 Speaker 2: articulate the fundamental gestures of the sociopathic manifesto of a 304 00:19:47,846 --> 00:19:49,716 Speaker 2: coalescing youth consciousness. 305 00:19:50,836 --> 00:19:51,256 Speaker 4: Unquote. 306 00:19:52,676 --> 00:19:57,496 Speaker 2: The youth were sociopaths. and Mickey was their leader. Up 307 00:19:57,556 --> 00:20:03,136 Speaker 2: until 1974, when he vanished from Malibu. That's when he 308 00:20:03,196 --> 00:20:04,736 Speaker 2: became their god. 309 00:20:07,936 --> 00:20:10,936 Speaker 3: It was a mystery. It was kind of like, where's 310 00:20:10,976 --> 00:20:13,276 Speaker 3: Mickey Dora? And they still had his name on the wall. 311 00:20:14,076 --> 00:20:18,796 Speaker 3: Some guy's spray can, Dora lives, you know, on the wall. 312 00:20:19,316 --> 00:20:21,836 Speaker 3: It stayed there forever, you know, and it kind of 313 00:20:21,856 --> 00:20:24,416 Speaker 3: left us, he left his mark in that way, you know, 314 00:20:24,436 --> 00:20:27,096 Speaker 3: and people would wonder, where's Mickey? Nobody knew. It was 315 00:20:27,376 --> 00:20:31,136 Speaker 3: very much of a mystery for years. Because he was 316 00:20:31,196 --> 00:20:34,346 Speaker 3: on the run, you know, and kind of like Billy 317 00:20:34,386 --> 00:20:36,546 Speaker 3: the Kid, you know, he was gone. He's kind of 318 00:20:36,586 --> 00:20:41,386 Speaker 3: had this reputation. The bad boy on the run. The fugitive. 319 00:20:45,026 --> 00:20:46,546 Speaker 3: So it added to his reputation. 320 00:20:59,726 --> 00:21:03,346 Speaker 2: Mickey Dora was a born con man. He could talk 321 00:21:03,366 --> 00:21:07,506 Speaker 2: his way into anything, and out of almost everything. His 322 00:21:07,566 --> 00:21:11,346 Speaker 2: alleged scams ranged from petty and kind of ridiculous, like 323 00:21:11,426 --> 00:21:15,266 Speaker 2: renting out surfboards that didn't belong to him, to blatantly criminal. 324 00:21:16,136 --> 00:21:21,796 Speaker 2: Credit card fraud, fake plane tickets, stolen ski equipment, stolen antiques, 325 00:21:22,416 --> 00:21:27,896 Speaker 2: stolen passports. Eventually, his schemes would land him in federal prison. 326 00:21:29,016 --> 00:21:33,056 Speaker 2: You associated with him at your own risk. Denny Ahlberg 327 00:21:33,116 --> 00:21:35,406 Speaker 2: has a story about this, the kind of thing that 328 00:21:35,426 --> 00:21:38,286 Speaker 2: would happen on a typical day hanging out with Mickey. 329 00:21:40,686 --> 00:21:43,326 Speaker 2: In the early 70s, Denny was invited to Kauai by 330 00:21:43,346 --> 00:21:46,886 Speaker 2: a Hawaiian surfer named Joey Cabell. At the time, Mickey 331 00:21:46,906 --> 00:21:49,966 Speaker 2: was also in Hawaii. Cabell told Denny he'd like to 332 00:21:49,986 --> 00:21:50,726 Speaker 2: see Mickey, too. 333 00:21:51,386 --> 00:21:53,986 Speaker 3: So I called up Mickey and told him, Joey invited 334 00:21:54,026 --> 00:21:57,026 Speaker 3: you to come, and he came right over. He showed up. 335 00:21:57,146 --> 00:21:57,806 Speaker 3: It was amazing. 336 00:21:58,636 --> 00:22:01,616 Speaker 2: Cabell, who was in peak physical shape, proposed they hike 337 00:22:01,656 --> 00:22:04,436 Speaker 2: to a beach to spend the night. It was an 338 00:22:04,456 --> 00:22:06,756 Speaker 2: 11-mile hike, and not an easy one. 339 00:22:06,776 --> 00:22:10,676 Speaker 3: So I'm trudging along with Mickey Dora on this really 340 00:22:10,736 --> 00:22:13,476 Speaker 3: tough hike, you know, for us. And we're like city slickers. 341 00:22:14,396 --> 00:22:17,966 Speaker 3: Dora had these leather boots on, really the wrong equipment, 342 00:22:18,006 --> 00:22:20,406 Speaker 3: you know. And I was kind of feeling a little 343 00:22:20,466 --> 00:22:23,106 Speaker 3: sick myself. And it got dark on us, and we're 344 00:22:23,126 --> 00:22:27,026 Speaker 3: going through these canyons and pushing branches away. Mickey was tortured, 345 00:22:27,046 --> 00:22:27,386 Speaker 3: you know. 346 00:22:29,916 --> 00:22:33,776 Speaker 2: Finally, they arrived at the beach. They were exhausted, and 347 00:22:33,836 --> 00:22:35,736 Speaker 2: Denny was starting to feel really bad. 348 00:22:36,516 --> 00:22:38,756 Speaker 3: He passed out in some cave, you know. He woke 349 00:22:38,816 --> 00:22:42,276 Speaker 3: up in the morning, and Mickey could see that I 350 00:22:42,316 --> 00:22:45,736 Speaker 3: was a little sick. So his mind started working, like, 351 00:22:46,356 --> 00:22:48,836 Speaker 3: I can't hike back. I've got to figure something out. 352 00:22:49,486 --> 00:22:54,186 Speaker 3: He saw this helicopter go by. They had a tourist, 353 00:22:54,926 --> 00:22:56,066 Speaker 3: so Mickey had an idea. 354 00:22:57,186 --> 00:22:59,886 Speaker 2: Mickey slipped away and went down to the shoreline, where 355 00:22:59,906 --> 00:23:02,166 Speaker 2: he gathered up some rocks and used them to write 356 00:23:02,666 --> 00:23:04,586 Speaker 2: SOS in big letters. 357 00:23:05,346 --> 00:23:07,526 Speaker 3: The next day, I know the helicopter lands on this 358 00:23:07,586 --> 00:23:09,866 Speaker 3: pad down the beach, and Mickey goes up and talks 359 00:23:09,886 --> 00:23:12,326 Speaker 3: to the guy. I don't know what he was saying, 360 00:23:12,396 --> 00:23:14,306 Speaker 3: but apparently he was telling the guy, my friend's dying 361 00:23:14,346 --> 00:23:18,496 Speaker 3: on the beach. We need help. And the guy said, 362 00:23:18,536 --> 00:23:21,176 Speaker 3: I can't come back right now, but as soon as 363 00:23:21,196 --> 00:23:24,756 Speaker 3: I take these people. And right before dark, this guy 364 00:23:24,816 --> 00:23:31,606 Speaker 3: came back. And Mickey says, come on, that's it, let's go. Oh, okay, 365 00:23:31,626 --> 00:23:35,466 Speaker 3: so I start doing the 50-yard dash toward this helicopter 366 00:23:36,206 --> 00:23:38,246 Speaker 3: down the beach, and Mickey says, slow down, you gotta 367 00:23:38,326 --> 00:23:42,606 Speaker 3: act a little sicker, you know? We walk up to 368 00:23:42,656 --> 00:23:44,766 Speaker 3: the helicopter pilot, and he kind of looks at me, 369 00:23:44,806 --> 00:23:46,496 Speaker 3: and I was trying to act sicker, and he opens 370 00:23:46,536 --> 00:23:50,956 Speaker 3: the door. He let me in to the helicopter, and 371 00:23:50,996 --> 00:23:53,056 Speaker 3: Mickey starts to get in behind him, and the guy goes, 372 00:23:53,116 --> 00:23:54,856 Speaker 3: oh no, it's not you, it's just a sick guy, 373 00:23:54,876 --> 00:23:57,946 Speaker 3: you know? No, no. Mickey pulls out this little bottle. 374 00:23:57,966 --> 00:24:01,696 Speaker 3: He said, I'm having an asthma attack. I can't breathe. 375 00:24:02,436 --> 00:24:05,916 Speaker 3: My feet are bleeding. I can't walk. He just started crying, 376 00:24:05,936 --> 00:24:08,336 Speaker 3: the guy. You could tell the guy wasn't buying it, 377 00:24:08,356 --> 00:24:11,376 Speaker 3: but he let him in. So we got lifted off 378 00:24:11,416 --> 00:24:14,546 Speaker 3: the pad. It was the most beautiful, majestic thing. 379 00:24:14,586 --> 00:24:14,906 Speaker 4: I mean, the. 380 00:24:14,906 --> 00:24:17,946 Speaker 3: Serrated mountains, its colors, you know. And we're in this 381 00:24:17,986 --> 00:24:20,586 Speaker 3: little bubble up in the sky, and Mickey turns. He says, 382 00:24:20,966 --> 00:24:22,186 Speaker 3: our magic carpet ride. 383 00:24:27,526 --> 00:24:30,586 Speaker 2: When the helicopter landed in town, there were news reporters 384 00:24:30,706 --> 00:24:32,006 Speaker 2: and cameras everywhere. 385 00:24:32,026 --> 00:24:37,136 Speaker 3: They thought they were bringing the dead guy. We land, 386 00:24:37,176 --> 00:24:39,586 Speaker 3: and all these people kind of crowd around me, you know, 387 00:24:39,936 --> 00:24:42,356 Speaker 3: and as soon as I get out, they go, where's 388 00:24:42,376 --> 00:24:47,476 Speaker 3: the sick guy? Oh, that was me, and they're all disappointed, 389 00:24:47,496 --> 00:24:51,756 Speaker 3: you know, and they leave. Mickey has disappeared. He's nowhere around. 390 00:24:52,516 --> 00:24:54,796 Speaker 3: he disappeared on me. He left me holding the bag. 391 00:24:55,096 --> 00:24:58,556 Speaker 3: So he pulled this whole thing off. And I went 392 00:24:58,596 --> 00:25:00,656 Speaker 3: through and got checked out. I did have some little 393 00:25:00,736 --> 00:25:04,476 Speaker 3: dysentery thing. The cops had gone looking for Mickey and 394 00:25:04,496 --> 00:25:06,196 Speaker 3: they found him trying to rent a car at the 395 00:25:06,256 --> 00:25:09,136 Speaker 3: airport and they dragged him back, you know, and they 396 00:25:09,156 --> 00:25:10,956 Speaker 3: were trying to interview the guy and he's showing him 397 00:25:10,996 --> 00:25:14,016 Speaker 3: all these fake IDs. And one said Chapin and the 398 00:25:14,036 --> 00:25:16,906 Speaker 3: other one said Dora. Who are you? Are you Chapin 399 00:25:17,046 --> 00:25:20,986 Speaker 3: or Dora? And he's laughing. I'm Chapin Dora. You know, he, 400 00:25:22,116 --> 00:25:24,556 Speaker 3: And I don't know how it happened, but he got 401 00:25:24,636 --> 00:25:26,796 Speaker 3: out of the whole thing, and I was the fall guy. 402 00:25:30,326 --> 00:25:34,586 Speaker 2: To Mickey Dora, the highest value was freedom. And that, 403 00:25:34,726 --> 00:25:38,546 Speaker 2: to him, meant doing whatever served him best in any situation. 404 00:25:39,926 --> 00:25:43,676 Speaker 2: For Mickey, freedom took priority over any other moral or 405 00:25:43,756 --> 00:25:48,396 Speaker 2: ethical consideration. And he would do or say almost anything 406 00:25:48,576 --> 00:25:53,836 Speaker 2: to get what he wanted. In 1974, Mickey left Malibu 407 00:25:53,966 --> 00:25:56,816 Speaker 2: and set out on an adventure that took him all 408 00:25:56,926 --> 00:26:01,166 Speaker 2: over the world, searching for the perfect empty wave. He 409 00:26:01,206 --> 00:26:03,906 Speaker 2: didn't have the money to travel like this, but he 410 00:26:03,946 --> 00:26:07,666 Speaker 2: did it anyway, using blank airline tickets that he filled 411 00:26:07,766 --> 00:26:09,606 Speaker 2: out for whatever destination he wanted. 412 00:26:10,486 --> 00:26:13,066 Speaker 6: Mickey had a whole bunch from a woman who worked 413 00:26:13,106 --> 00:26:14,386 Speaker 6: at the Pan American office. 414 00:26:15,126 --> 00:26:19,326 Speaker 2: This is Linda Kai, Mickey's girlfriend and accomplice for much 415 00:26:19,366 --> 00:26:19,576 Speaker 2: of the 1970s. 416 00:26:21,416 --> 00:26:24,016 Speaker 6: You could actually write your own tickets back in those days. 417 00:26:24,536 --> 00:26:26,886 Speaker 6: They were paper tickets written on, and all you needed 418 00:26:26,926 --> 00:26:31,126 Speaker 6: to know was the mileage. And he had all the 419 00:26:32,166 --> 00:26:36,366 Speaker 6: paraphernalia to work it out. Now, I don't know who 420 00:26:36,386 --> 00:26:38,426 Speaker 6: the girl was that gave him this stuff. He must 421 00:26:38,486 --> 00:26:40,026 Speaker 6: have made it sweet, you know. 422 00:26:41,226 --> 00:26:44,806 Speaker 2: But you're flying on these sort of forged tickets. 423 00:26:44,886 --> 00:26:45,826 Speaker 6: Everything was fake. 424 00:26:46,966 --> 00:26:50,796 Speaker 2: They shopped and dined and stayed in nice hotels. All 425 00:26:50,836 --> 00:26:55,096 Speaker 2: of it, according to Linda, on forged credit cards. And 426 00:26:55,276 --> 00:26:58,196 Speaker 2: all while being tracked from surf spot to surf spot 427 00:26:58,456 --> 00:27:01,476 Speaker 2: by baffled agents of the FBI and Interpol. 428 00:27:02,836 --> 00:27:06,016 Speaker 6: Back in the day, credit cards were plastic, of course, 429 00:27:06,486 --> 00:27:09,446 Speaker 6: but they didn't have the strips on the backs like 430 00:27:09,486 --> 00:27:13,126 Speaker 6: they do now. They had numbers and dates. I was 431 00:27:13,186 --> 00:27:17,206 Speaker 6: assigned to take a little razor blade and change some numbers. 432 00:27:18,886 --> 00:27:21,226 Speaker 6: And we did. And, um, and make it good for 433 00:27:21,286 --> 00:27:21,826 Speaker 6: another month. 434 00:27:23,446 --> 00:27:27,166 Speaker 2: Mickey had a way of justifying all this theft and deception. 435 00:27:28,226 --> 00:27:32,446 Speaker 6: Mickey described it once as, he says, I'm not a criminal. 436 00:27:32,986 --> 00:27:36,126 Speaker 6: He says, I don't commit crimes. He says, I'm an outlaw. 437 00:27:36,906 --> 00:27:38,086 Speaker 6: He says, and there's a difference. 438 00:27:38,986 --> 00:27:39,566 Speaker 9: Did you buy it? 439 00:27:39,826 --> 00:27:40,106 Speaker 4: Yes. 440 00:27:42,566 --> 00:27:43,086 Speaker 6: I still do. 441 00:27:46,286 --> 00:27:48,866 Speaker 4: One of the great accomplishments that Mickey set out and 442 00:27:49,046 --> 00:27:53,116 Speaker 4: probably was successful at was never working a day in 443 00:27:53,156 --> 00:27:56,836 Speaker 4: his life. That was his real goal, and he accomplished it. 444 00:27:57,446 --> 00:27:59,866 Speaker 4: I don't know if he ever actually had a job. 445 00:28:00,846 --> 00:28:03,666 Speaker 2: Jim Kempton used to be the editor of Surfer magazine, 446 00:28:04,046 --> 00:28:07,656 Speaker 2: and these days he runs the California Surf Museum. He 447 00:28:07,696 --> 00:28:09,996 Speaker 2: knew Mickey pretty well in the 70s, when they were 448 00:28:10,036 --> 00:28:12,456 Speaker 2: both living in a surf town in the south of France. 449 00:28:13,316 --> 00:28:16,496 Speaker 2: In fact, Mickey crashed at his place a lot, used 450 00:28:16,536 --> 00:28:20,076 Speaker 2: his shower and his kitchen. One day, Jim noticed his 451 00:28:20,166 --> 00:28:21,126 Speaker 2: passport was missing. 452 00:28:22,236 --> 00:28:24,546 Speaker 4: And then sitting on the beach, you know, maybe two 453 00:28:24,566 --> 00:28:28,406 Speaker 4: weeks later, I see this South African guy, looks sort 454 00:28:28,426 --> 00:28:31,406 Speaker 4: of like me, and there's my passport. 455 00:28:31,646 --> 00:28:32,446 Speaker 2: Mickey sold it to him? 456 00:28:32,706 --> 00:28:34,826 Speaker 4: I'm sure he did. I don't have, I mean, how 457 00:28:34,846 --> 00:28:37,706 Speaker 4: would you ever prove that, right? Unless you arrested them both, 458 00:28:37,746 --> 00:28:38,426 Speaker 4: which I was not. 459 00:28:38,326 --> 00:28:38,746 Speaker 1: Going to do. 460 00:28:39,886 --> 00:28:40,496 Speaker 4: In any event. 461 00:28:41,546 --> 00:28:43,136 Speaker 2: Did you ever say anything to Mickey about it? 462 00:28:43,316 --> 00:28:43,516 Speaker 3: No. 463 00:28:44,856 --> 00:28:48,016 Speaker 2: In the surf world, it was almost currency to be 464 00:28:48,076 --> 00:28:51,216 Speaker 2: scammed by Mickey. He'd come away from the experience with 465 00:28:51,296 --> 00:28:55,486 Speaker 2: a story to dine out on for years. Mickey's appeal 466 00:28:55,586 --> 00:28:58,826 Speaker 2: was not in spite of his criminality, but because of it. 467 00:29:00,626 --> 00:29:04,546 Speaker 4: There's a lot of people who love the outlaw, who 468 00:29:04,606 --> 00:29:07,516 Speaker 4: love getting away with it. It's something that, for many people, 469 00:29:07,576 --> 00:29:11,416 Speaker 4: is a great satisfaction to them to see people be 470 00:29:11,456 --> 00:29:14,696 Speaker 4: able to accomplish that. And Mickey, for a long time, 471 00:29:15,136 --> 00:29:19,136 Speaker 4: was able to do that without payment. we tend to 472 00:29:19,416 --> 00:29:23,496 Speaker 4: idolize our outlaws. Jesse James, Pretty Boy Floyd, you know, 473 00:29:23,886 --> 00:29:26,406 Speaker 4: you hear those stories about them, you'd think that those 474 00:29:26,466 --> 00:29:31,266 Speaker 4: guys were somehow like heroic. They were sociopathic killers, every 475 00:29:31,346 --> 00:29:34,806 Speaker 4: one of them, you know, that murdered people in cold blood. 476 00:29:35,126 --> 00:29:39,156 Speaker 4: And yeah, did they give to the poor? Yeah, they did. Mostly, though, 477 00:29:39,176 --> 00:29:41,936 Speaker 4: to make sure that they didn't tell the cops where 478 00:29:42,116 --> 00:29:48,966 Speaker 4: they were. We definitely idolize our outlaws. That's just something 479 00:29:49,126 --> 00:29:51,766 Speaker 4: that is, I think, baked into the American psyche. 480 00:29:52,486 --> 00:29:55,066 Speaker 2: And it's very prominent in surf culture. 481 00:29:56,656 --> 00:30:00,636 Speaker 4: Very few nice guys are as idolized as the bad 482 00:30:00,676 --> 00:30:01,156 Speaker 4: boys are. 483 00:30:01,976 --> 00:30:05,096 Speaker 2: And is Mickey Dora the most idolized of the bad boys? 484 00:30:05,116 --> 00:30:05,186 Speaker 7: Yes. 485 00:30:05,496 --> 00:30:07,036 Speaker 4: He's not only the most idolized of the bad boys, 486 00:30:07,056 --> 00:30:09,076 Speaker 4: he's also the most bad guys of the bad guys. 487 00:30:12,216 --> 00:30:15,226 Speaker 2: The darkest parts of Mickey Dora, though, don't have anything 488 00:30:15,256 --> 00:30:18,206 Speaker 2: to do with his hustles and his cons, or even 489 00:30:18,246 --> 00:30:21,466 Speaker 2: with the more serious fraud for which he eventually served time. 490 00:30:22,566 --> 00:30:24,766 Speaker 2: The darkest parts of Mickey have to do with his 491 00:30:24,846 --> 00:30:29,826 Speaker 2: soul and the attitudes he harbored there of exclusion, racism, 492 00:30:30,006 --> 00:30:33,946 Speaker 2: and xenophobia. a pattern of hate that maps onto the white, 493 00:30:34,066 --> 00:30:38,306 Speaker 2: white world of mainland surfing, where he was Malibu's superstar 494 00:30:38,546 --> 00:30:42,946 Speaker 2: in his sunglasses with his Cheshire Cat smile, showing all 495 00:30:43,006 --> 00:30:45,406 Speaker 2: the little sociopaths how it was done. 496 00:30:56,536 --> 00:31:02,456 Speaker 10: Mickey Dora was a secret key to California culture and 497 00:31:02,636 --> 00:31:05,216 Speaker 10: an invisible thread that wound up running through much of 498 00:31:05,296 --> 00:31:08,796 Speaker 10: what we know is modern California culture. You look at 499 00:31:08,836 --> 00:31:13,036 Speaker 10: how California culture has affected America's culture and how America's 500 00:31:13,116 --> 00:31:16,336 Speaker 10: culture has gone on to affect the world. And you 501 00:31:16,416 --> 00:31:18,556 Speaker 10: can kind of draw a line back to Dora on 502 00:31:18,596 --> 00:31:20,316 Speaker 10: a number of different things. 503 00:31:21,296 --> 00:31:24,886 Speaker 2: D.V. DeVicentis is a film and television writer who back 504 00:31:25,106 --> 00:31:27,566 Speaker 2: in 2004 was hired to write a movie about Mickey. 505 00:31:29,006 --> 00:31:33,536 Speaker 10: I was approached by Appian Way, which is Leonardo DiCaprio's company. 506 00:31:34,676 --> 00:31:37,256 Speaker 2: The movie never happened, but it was supposed to star 507 00:31:37,296 --> 00:31:40,836 Speaker 2: DiCaprio as Da Cat, just two years after he played 508 00:31:40,856 --> 00:31:43,576 Speaker 2: the con artist Frank Abagnale Jr. in Catch Me If 509 00:31:43,616 --> 00:31:47,776 Speaker 2: You Can. DV ended up spending a lot of time 510 00:31:47,836 --> 00:31:49,016 Speaker 2: thinking about Mickey Dora. 511 00:31:50,266 --> 00:31:53,166 Speaker 10: He embodied... in both his thinking and his actions, the 512 00:31:53,206 --> 00:31:57,926 Speaker 10: contradiction between not being a native to somewhere and somehow 513 00:31:57,986 --> 00:32:01,026 Speaker 10: feeling proprietary about that place. 514 00:32:03,086 --> 00:32:08,336 Speaker 2: Surfing is supposed to be a feel-good sport, right? Wrong. 515 00:32:09,416 --> 00:32:12,876 Speaker 2: Surfing is a club, and the membership is capped. 516 00:32:13,976 --> 00:32:16,776 Speaker 10: Everybody's getting pissed off about being displaced, and everybody's getting 517 00:32:16,796 --> 00:32:19,306 Speaker 10: pissed off about being commodified, and everybody's being pissed off 518 00:32:19,326 --> 00:32:23,206 Speaker 10: about sharing resources and sharing territory and it just never ends. 519 00:32:23,286 --> 00:32:25,866 Speaker 10: And it's still, it just goes on to today. So 520 00:32:26,446 --> 00:32:32,006 Speaker 10: you have people like Mickey who have picked a spot 521 00:32:32,606 --> 00:32:35,786 Speaker 10: where it's supposed to be and nobody else is supposed 522 00:32:35,806 --> 00:32:39,756 Speaker 10: to show up. I think that Mickey himself was very 523 00:32:39,816 --> 00:32:43,716 Speaker 10: aware of the fact that he was excusing himself from 524 00:32:44,116 --> 00:32:48,756 Speaker 10: any prosecution for being an invader. And it was just like, yeah, yeah, 525 00:32:48,876 --> 00:32:51,396 Speaker 10: I know I am too, but but we're done now. 526 00:32:51,876 --> 00:32:52,756 Speaker 10: No more after me. 527 00:32:55,276 --> 00:32:57,976 Speaker 2: The way Mickey Dora saw the world, I have no 528 00:32:58,036 --> 00:33:03,796 Speaker 2: business surfing. And neither do you. Not at Malibu. Not anywhere. 529 00:33:10,686 --> 00:33:13,306 Speaker 2: Knowing of my interest in the dark side of Malibu, 530 00:33:13,786 --> 00:33:17,146 Speaker 2: a friend of mine, a fifth-generation Californian who grew up 531 00:33:17,206 --> 00:33:20,406 Speaker 2: surfing in Santa Monica and Venice, turned me on to 532 00:33:20,446 --> 00:33:24,066 Speaker 2: an essay that ran in the June-July 1976 issue of 533 00:33:24,106 --> 00:33:29,616 Speaker 2: Surfer magazine. It was called The Curse of the Chumash. Subtitle, 534 00:33:30,116 --> 00:33:35,776 Speaker 2: Malibu is a land of strange occurrences and contrast. This 535 00:33:35,896 --> 00:33:38,536 Speaker 2: was right up my street. I bought a copy of 536 00:33:38,576 --> 00:33:42,206 Speaker 2: the magazine on eBay. It turned out to be an 537 00:33:42,406 --> 00:33:47,056 Speaker 2: odd piece of work. a pseudo-history of Malibu told through 538 00:33:47,076 --> 00:33:50,516 Speaker 2: the vibrant surf culture that flourished there and apparently died 539 00:33:50,616 --> 00:33:55,596 Speaker 2: circa 1976 with the introduction of Malibu Barbie. The piece 540 00:33:55,656 --> 00:33:59,856 Speaker 2: was peppered with arcane references to Mickey Dora, his antics, 541 00:34:00,096 --> 00:34:04,476 Speaker 2: and his self-imposed exile. He was obviously the star of 542 00:34:04,516 --> 00:34:09,016 Speaker 2: the article, of the place, and of the time. I 543 00:34:09,056 --> 00:34:13,616 Speaker 2: flipped through it, studying the grainy photographs. On one page, 544 00:34:13,656 --> 00:34:16,236 Speaker 2: there were several pictures of Mickey going down the line 545 00:34:16,276 --> 00:34:19,576 Speaker 2: at Malibu. And on the facing page, there was a 546 00:34:19,616 --> 00:34:23,006 Speaker 2: picture of Mickey in a dinner jacket, sunglasses, and maybe 547 00:34:23,046 --> 00:34:26,266 Speaker 2: a wig, holding a surf contest trophy in one hand 548 00:34:26,726 --> 00:34:29,926 Speaker 2: and a baby doll in the other. He's standing in 549 00:34:29,966 --> 00:34:33,326 Speaker 2: front of a sign for Camarillo State Hospital, a mental 550 00:34:33,366 --> 00:34:37,226 Speaker 2: institution that some say was the Hotel California the Eagles 551 00:34:37,296 --> 00:34:40,256 Speaker 2: sang about, the one you could check out from but 552 00:34:40,336 --> 00:34:44,646 Speaker 2: never leave. In the image, Mickey also has a surfboard 553 00:34:44,686 --> 00:34:47,806 Speaker 2: with him, angled away from the camera, so it dominates 554 00:34:47,886 --> 00:34:50,826 Speaker 2: the lower half of the frame. And on the bottom 555 00:34:50,866 --> 00:34:57,856 Speaker 2: of the board is an enormous swastika. Who wrote this thing? 556 00:34:57,876 --> 00:35:05,676 Speaker 2: I flipped back to the byline. Carlos Aizan. Aizan is 557 00:35:05,716 --> 00:35:09,296 Speaker 2: an unusual name. It took me a second to realize 558 00:35:09,336 --> 00:35:14,486 Speaker 2: that it was a pseudonym. Aizan is Nazi, spelled backwards. 559 00:35:17,606 --> 00:35:20,726 Speaker 2: My friend who'd recommended this essay is Jewish and not 560 00:35:20,856 --> 00:35:24,316 Speaker 2: in any way sympathetic to this kind of stuff. He's 561 00:35:24,356 --> 00:35:27,576 Speaker 2: just into the Malibu lore, like I am, and probably 562 00:35:27,636 --> 00:35:32,096 Speaker 2: hadn't read the piece since it came out in 1976. 563 00:35:32,756 --> 00:35:34,916 Speaker 2: But looking at it now, I felt a kind of 564 00:35:35,116 --> 00:35:43,366 Speaker 2: uncomfortable recognition. Something, unfortunately, was starting to make sense. Much 565 00:35:43,426 --> 00:35:46,146 Speaker 2: as I love surfing, there are things about it I 566 00:35:46,186 --> 00:35:49,656 Speaker 2: have to suppress in order to keep enjoying it. Signals 567 00:35:49,716 --> 00:35:53,656 Speaker 2: that there is something rotten there. There's the sign at 568 00:35:53,696 --> 00:35:56,476 Speaker 2: my local break that warns kooks to stay off the 569 00:35:56,516 --> 00:36:00,206 Speaker 2: main takeoff spot. There's the scarcity of black surfers in 570 00:36:00,246 --> 00:36:03,606 Speaker 2: the water. There are the reports year after year of 571 00:36:03,666 --> 00:36:07,686 Speaker 2: swastikas and Heil Hitlers and anti-Semitic flyers in beach towns 572 00:36:07,746 --> 00:36:13,566 Speaker 2: across Southern California. In 2021, in Manhattan Beach, a coastal 573 00:36:13,606 --> 00:36:17,036 Speaker 2: city in L.A. County, an older white surfer was filmed 574 00:36:17,096 --> 00:36:19,796 Speaker 2: yelling the N-word at two young Black men in the water. 575 00:36:20,656 --> 00:36:23,776 Speaker 2: A nearby teenager told them, this is a local's beach. 576 00:36:25,756 --> 00:36:30,176 Speaker 4: Hateful, racist, and anti-Semitic messages spray-painted all over the playground 577 00:36:30,216 --> 00:36:31,676 Speaker 4: of a South Bay elementary school. 578 00:36:31,816 --> 00:36:33,586 Speaker 8: Yeah, and this is not the first time. 579 00:36:33,986 --> 00:36:34,926 Speaker 4: Or even the second time. 580 00:36:35,286 --> 00:36:38,746 Speaker 2: And this was just in 2022, within a couple miles 581 00:36:38,846 --> 00:36:39,726 Speaker 2: of that same beach. 582 00:36:40,376 --> 00:36:44,196 Speaker 4: A photo of a giant swastika, which we've blurred, spray-painted 583 00:36:44,316 --> 00:36:46,566 Speaker 4: in the middle of the playground, and you could see 584 00:36:46,606 --> 00:36:47,946 Speaker 4: some kids playing nearby. 585 00:36:48,426 --> 00:36:52,866 Speaker 2: Whatever's going on here, call it surfing's Nazi problem, it 586 00:36:52,906 --> 00:36:58,446 Speaker 2: goes back decades. Mickey didn't invent this, but he played 587 00:36:58,496 --> 00:37:04,376 Speaker 2: the supremacist to the hilt. Malibu belonged to him. Some 588 00:37:04,416 --> 00:37:09,036 Speaker 2: called him the Dark Prince. He called himself Malibu's, quote, 589 00:37:09,486 --> 00:37:14,526 Speaker 2: rightful king. He believed himself to be superior, and everyone 590 00:37:14,566 --> 00:37:18,246 Speaker 2: around him told him he was right. As surfing was 591 00:37:18,286 --> 00:37:21,046 Speaker 2: discovered and began to be widely popular in the 60s, 592 00:37:21,506 --> 00:37:25,816 Speaker 2: he railed that Malibu was being overrun with, quote, kooks 593 00:37:25,856 --> 00:37:29,156 Speaker 2: of all colors, fags and finks, and a thousand other 594 00:37:29,276 --> 00:37:34,526 Speaker 2: social deviations, unquote. He railed against the Gidget movies that 595 00:37:34,566 --> 00:37:37,606 Speaker 2: had exposed Malibu to the masses and He let it 596 00:37:37,646 --> 00:37:40,126 Speaker 2: be known that this was why he had to leave. 597 00:37:41,096 --> 00:37:45,776 Speaker 2: Too many people who didn't belong were ruining his wave. 598 00:37:47,156 --> 00:37:52,796 Speaker 2: And everywhere he went, Mickey stoked conflict, feeding surfing's rebellious 599 00:37:52,856 --> 00:37:56,806 Speaker 2: young with stories of his exile and all those who'd 600 00:37:56,906 --> 00:37:57,766 Speaker 2: done him wrong. 601 00:38:01,006 --> 00:38:03,346 Speaker 8: There's a lot of faults I can find with this 602 00:38:04,206 --> 00:38:07,896 Speaker 8: culture that, I was in the middle of for 40-something years, 603 00:38:07,916 --> 00:38:09,916 Speaker 8: and arguably still am, but I'm no longer sort of 604 00:38:11,036 --> 00:38:15,366 Speaker 8: here to defend it. So putting Dora into all that, 605 00:38:15,426 --> 00:38:18,726 Speaker 8: you know, there's just a lot about it that isn't great, 606 00:38:18,986 --> 00:38:21,506 Speaker 8: and Mickey on his bad days is right at the 607 00:38:21,546 --> 00:38:22,366 Speaker 8: center of all that. 608 00:38:23,086 --> 00:38:26,306 Speaker 2: Matt Warshaw, the surf historian, remembers being a kid and 609 00:38:26,346 --> 00:38:29,206 Speaker 2: seeing this famous photo shoot of Mickey Dora that was 610 00:38:29,266 --> 00:38:32,946 Speaker 2: printed in Surfer magazine in 1969. 611 00:38:32,946 --> 00:38:35,566 Speaker 8: And there was a three shot sequence of him surfing 612 00:38:35,726 --> 00:38:38,446 Speaker 8: where he comes down the wave. It's Malibu. He's dropping in. 613 00:38:38,766 --> 00:38:41,126 Speaker 8: You can see a surfer in front of him. And 614 00:38:41,146 --> 00:38:43,486 Speaker 8: the next picture, Mickey's doing a turn off the bottom 615 00:38:44,326 --> 00:38:45,606 Speaker 8: and the surfer in front of him is kind of 616 00:38:45,626 --> 00:38:49,746 Speaker 8: looking back. And the third shot is Mickey's just shot 617 00:38:49,786 --> 00:38:51,606 Speaker 8: his board right at the guy. 618 00:38:51,666 --> 00:38:53,746 Speaker 7: And it's just gone right across his chest and knocked 619 00:38:53,786 --> 00:38:54,966 Speaker 7: him off his feet. 620 00:38:55,046 --> 00:38:59,166 Speaker 8: Right. And at nine, because I served Malibu, I was 621 00:38:59,186 --> 00:39:02,556 Speaker 8: going to serve Malibu and I just, It's so bought 622 00:39:02,596 --> 00:39:04,676 Speaker 8: into kooks go home kind of thing. 623 00:39:05,716 --> 00:39:08,116 Speaker 7: This was Dora regulating. Look what he's doing. 624 00:39:08,136 --> 00:39:09,456 Speaker 8: You know, he's doing what needs to be done to 625 00:39:09,496 --> 00:39:10,956 Speaker 8: get rid of the kooks. That guy dropped in in 626 00:39:10,976 --> 00:39:12,896 Speaker 8: front of Mickey Dora, you know, get out of here, kook, 627 00:39:12,936 --> 00:39:15,446 Speaker 8: and da-da-da. And so as a kid, I thought that 628 00:39:15,486 --> 00:39:17,546 Speaker 8: was kind of cool. And now I look at that now, 629 00:39:17,566 --> 00:39:19,346 Speaker 8: and I go, they put that porn right through that 630 00:39:19,386 --> 00:39:20,186 Speaker 8: guy's back. 631 00:39:20,266 --> 00:39:21,866 Speaker 7: And it was terrible to me. 632 00:39:23,186 --> 00:39:27,196 Speaker 2: Mickey Dora presents a conundrum for surfers and anyone brought 633 00:39:27,256 --> 00:39:31,136 Speaker 2: up on the California youth culture he so heavily influenced. 634 00:39:31,136 --> 00:39:33,956 Speaker 8: If I see a clip of Mickey surfing for a 635 00:39:33,956 --> 00:39:37,396 Speaker 8: few seconds at Malibu, my heart as a surfer, just, 636 00:39:38,316 --> 00:39:41,136 Speaker 8: it just melts, you know. If I just see a 637 00:39:41,196 --> 00:39:44,196 Speaker 8: picture of him with that grin, there's something about that 638 00:39:44,256 --> 00:39:49,036 Speaker 8: that speaks to my depths as a surfer. He's unresolved 639 00:39:49,076 --> 00:39:52,496 Speaker 8: for me almost on a weekly basis. Like, if some 640 00:39:52,536 --> 00:39:56,466 Speaker 8: days I'm very much on Team Mickey and some days 641 00:39:56,526 --> 00:39:59,646 Speaker 8: I go, This guy's a really terrible human being. We 642 00:39:59,686 --> 00:40:03,256 Speaker 8: need to put attention on and think about and talk 643 00:40:03,296 --> 00:40:06,776 Speaker 8: about somebody else. Anytime I sort of spend enough time 644 00:40:07,256 --> 00:40:10,296 Speaker 8: in his life looking at how he treated people and 645 00:40:10,616 --> 00:40:14,736 Speaker 8: things that he said, I just start pulling away. How 646 00:40:14,776 --> 00:40:17,456 Speaker 8: do I feel about Mickey Doro? It depends on what 647 00:40:17,476 --> 00:40:18,076 Speaker 8: day you ask me. 648 00:40:20,316 --> 00:40:23,656 Speaker 2: It seems like the surfing world is still not ready 649 00:40:23,736 --> 00:40:25,316 Speaker 2: to have the Mickey Doro conversation. 650 00:40:26,136 --> 00:40:27,636 Speaker 7: Part of me is just saying, God, stay away from this. 651 00:40:29,356 --> 00:40:30,916 Speaker 2: But it seems to me that if I can make 652 00:40:30,976 --> 00:40:33,996 Speaker 2: sense of Mickey Dora, who he was and what he did, 653 00:40:34,496 --> 00:40:37,756 Speaker 2: what he means to people, still, I'll get closer to 654 00:40:37,796 --> 00:40:42,276 Speaker 2: the heart of this strange place, Malibu, where the central 655 00:40:42,336 --> 00:40:48,456 Speaker 2: question is about belonging, insiders versus outsiders. Mickey was both. 656 00:40:49,306 --> 00:40:51,806 Speaker 2: He was a shapeshifter and a con man with a 657 00:40:51,886 --> 00:40:57,926 Speaker 2: cruel and narcissistic streak. entitled, charming, and living entirely for himself. 658 00:40:59,806 --> 00:41:03,626 Speaker 2: Is Mickey the secret key to California? If he is, 659 00:41:04,126 --> 00:41:08,076 Speaker 2: it all begins in Malibu, on the beach where Mickey 660 00:41:08,436 --> 00:41:18,916 Speaker 2: became famous. On the next episode of Lost Hills, a 661 00:41:18,976 --> 00:41:22,126 Speaker 2: suspicious death sets Mickey on a strange new path. 662 00:41:23,766 --> 00:41:25,566 Speaker 8: At some point, he was down in Mexico, I think, 663 00:41:25,646 --> 00:41:30,286 Speaker 8: fishing and trying to not drink. He was going to 664 00:41:30,346 --> 00:41:33,506 Speaker 8: row a dinghy out to a friend's boat, and the 665 00:41:33,546 --> 00:41:35,046 Speaker 8: body turned up five days later. 666 00:41:36,426 --> 00:41:43,126 Speaker 2: That's next in Episode 2, Death in Mexico. Lost Hills 667 00:41:43,186 --> 00:41:46,796 Speaker 2: is written and reported by me, Dana Goodyear. It's created 668 00:41:46,856 --> 00:41:50,116 Speaker 2: by me and Ben Adair and produced by Western Sound 669 00:41:50,316 --> 00:41:54,206 Speaker 2: and Pushkin Industries. Subscribe to Pushkin Plus and you can 670 00:41:54,256 --> 00:41:58,756 Speaker 2: binge the entire season right now, ad-free. Find Pushkin Plus 671 00:41:58,876 --> 00:42:01,456 Speaker 2: on the Lost Hills show page in Apple Podcasts or 672 00:42:01,476 --> 00:42:04,336 Speaker 2: at pushkin.fm slash plus.