WEBVTT - Clay chats with Penn State HC James Franklin 0:00:02.080 --> 0:00:05.760 This is Wins and Losses with Clay Trevis, play talks 0:00:05.800 --> 0:00:09.879 with the most entertaining people in sports, entertainment and business. 0:00:10.160 --> 0:00:15.120 Now here's Clay Trevis. Welcome in Winson lost his podcast. 0:00:15.280 --> 0:00:18.480 We are off and rolling as we can roll into 0:00:19.280 --> 0:00:21.680 encourage you to check out all of these different interviews. 0:00:21.680 --> 0:00:23.880 But without any further ADO want to go ahead and 0:00:23.960 --> 0:00:28.520 jump in with Penn State football coach James Franklin and 0:00:28.640 --> 0:00:31.360 coach appreciate you coming on. If I had told you 0:00:31.440 --> 0:00:33.680 twenty five years ago that one day you would be 0:00:33.720 --> 0:00:37.479 introduced as Penn State football coach James Franklin, your response 0:00:37.479 --> 0:00:41.360 would have been, what, Yeah, I wouldn't have thought so 0:00:41.920 --> 0:00:44.160 for for a couple of reasons. You know, I set 0:00:44.159 --> 0:00:47.120 at my opening press conference that this was my dream job, 0:00:47.200 --> 0:00:50.360 being from Pennsylvania, growing up just outside of Philadelphia. But 0:00:51.040 --> 0:00:53.840 the reality is, I didn't really think it would be 0:00:54.000 --> 0:00:56.440 you know, attainable. Um. You know, I thought it would 0:00:56.480 --> 0:00:59.040 stay kind of within the family that had been here 0:00:59.160 --> 0:01:02.840 for the years. So um, you know, I just just 0:01:02.840 --> 0:01:05.040 didn't really feel like it was an option. But you know, 0:01:05.120 --> 0:01:08.320 when I when I had the opportunity, obviously it made 0:01:08.360 --> 0:01:11.560 a lot of sense. You wanted to play football at 0:01:11.600 --> 0:01:13.880 Penn State when you were growing up. What kind of 0:01:13.920 --> 0:01:16.520 athletes were you and when did you realize it might 0:01:16.560 --> 0:01:20.759 not happen, that that aspiration might not become a reality. Well, 0:01:20.800 --> 0:01:24.559 I actually came to camp here my junior year in 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:28.320 in high school, and um, you know, Jim called Well 0:01:28.440 --> 0:01:31.360 was the quarterbacks coach at the time, if I remember correctly, 0:01:32.240 --> 0:01:34.840 And um, you know, I ended up, you know, go 0:01:34.920 --> 0:01:38.280 into a division to school e Straussburg, had a great 0:01:38.319 --> 0:01:41.759 experience there. Went there thinking I was going to play 0:01:41.800 --> 0:01:44.840 in the NFL, um, which which makes no sense now, 0:01:45.240 --> 0:01:47.160 but went They're thinking I was going to do that. 0:01:47.480 --> 0:01:51.520 I had a really good college experience. Um, you know, 0:01:51.600 --> 0:01:54.200 played played in one of those European leagues when I 0:01:54.240 --> 0:01:56.840 got done, and then and then got into coach and 0:01:56.880 --> 0:01:59.160 you know, really got into coaching as a graduate assistant 0:01:59.200 --> 0:02:02.600 to get my master degree. Um, so it just kind 0:02:02.640 --> 0:02:05.480 of went from there. But um, but yeah, I I 0:02:05.600 --> 0:02:07.600 you know, I thought I was good enough to play 0:02:07.600 --> 0:02:11.119 at this level. You know, I realized probably after four 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:14.200 or five years out of college that I wasn't. Um 0:02:14.280 --> 0:02:16.120 And I went to the right place, in the right 0:02:16.200 --> 0:02:18.920 level and had a great college experience were you an 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:24.760 athlete growing up? Yeah, so I played baseball shortstop and 0:02:24.840 --> 0:02:28.320 picture and messed around a little bit with basketball, but 0:02:28.360 --> 0:02:31.560 I was more of a baseball football guy. In football, 0:02:31.600 --> 0:02:33.959 I played running back when I was young, and then 0:02:34.000 --> 0:02:39.840 trans trans uh you know, transition to quarterback in June 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:42.840 in middle school and like, uh, I guess probably seventh grade. 0:02:43.360 --> 0:02:45.600 Were you good? I mean, obviously you played in college, 0:02:45.639 --> 0:02:47.480 but when you were playing when you were a kid, 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:49.919 were you the best player on the team? What kind 0:02:49.960 --> 0:02:53.560 of athlete would you describe yourself as as a kid? Yeah, 0:02:53.600 --> 0:02:55.720 at the time, I thought I was really good. Now 0:02:55.760 --> 0:02:58.160 looking back at it, I was. I was fairly average, 0:02:58.320 --> 0:03:01.320 but um, yeah, I was was one of the better teams. 0:03:01.360 --> 0:03:02.959 You know, excuse me, I was one of the better 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:05.480 players in the area, and you know, one of the 0:03:05.480 --> 0:03:07.640 better players in the region and that kind of stuff, 0:03:07.720 --> 0:03:10.560 and um, you know again, had had a had a 0:03:10.600 --> 0:03:12.920 really good high school career and then went on and 0:03:13.560 --> 0:03:16.040 I had a really good, you know, college career at 0:03:16.040 --> 0:03:19.360 the Division two levels. Um, you know, I actually was 0:03:19.400 --> 0:03:22.359 a it was a finalist for the Division to Heisman 0:03:22.520 --> 0:03:25.280 or you know, I guess, you know whatever, regional finalists 0:03:25.320 --> 0:03:27.360 or whatever it was. For the Division two Heisman. So 0:03:27.840 --> 0:03:30.160 I had had a really good college experience. My head coach, 0:03:30.240 --> 0:03:33.040 my college head coaches was kind of a legend. He was. 0:03:33.520 --> 0:03:35.680 He was at my college, I think as the head 0:03:35.680 --> 0:03:38.400 coach for like fifty two years or something like that. 0:03:39.160 --> 0:03:41.400 Um so, um, you know, it just was in a 0:03:41.600 --> 0:03:44.360 was in a very very good situation and and uh 0:03:44.480 --> 0:03:46.880 and had a great college experience. All right. When you 0:03:46.920 --> 0:03:49.160 go into coaching, you said you went in initially to 0:03:49.240 --> 0:03:52.160 get your master's degree. And I'm looking here and it 0:03:52.200 --> 0:03:55.640 says your first coaching job. And sometimes this is inaccurate 0:03:55.680 --> 0:03:58.600 on bios. Sometimes it doesn't catch. It was that Cutstown 0:03:58.680 --> 0:04:02.880 where you were a wide receiver coaches that right, it was. Yeah, 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:06.800 it's pronounced Kutztown, which is school. Yeah, yeah, I know, 0:04:06.920 --> 0:04:09.880 I get, I get. So what was what was your 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:12.120 salary when you were at how do you how do 0:04:12.120 --> 0:04:16.920 you pronounce it Kutztown Kottowns a Division two school here 0:04:16.920 --> 0:04:19.520 in the state of Pennsylvania. Um. I actually coached a 0:04:19.600 --> 0:04:22.880 tight ends, I think if I remember correctly, and I 0:04:23.080 --> 0:04:27.039 made fifteen hundred dollars for the year I lived in 0:04:27.960 --> 0:04:30.800 I lived in a local guys basement or not a 0:04:30.800 --> 0:04:34.039 basement kind of a side room named Joe Ludwig. I 0:04:34.040 --> 0:04:37.680 still talked to Joe. I rented the room for from him. 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:41.400 I filled soda machines up in the morning before before 0:04:41.520 --> 0:04:43.839 work and school started. The players used to make fun 0:04:43.839 --> 0:04:46.080 of me. I'll be driving this white band around campus 0:04:46.080 --> 0:04:48.400 film soda machines up. And then in the off season 0:04:48.920 --> 0:04:51.480 I barred he that on Sundays at a local at 0:04:51.480 --> 0:04:54.599 a local spot. So I made fifteen hundred dollars for 0:04:54.680 --> 0:04:59.160 the year. That is amazing. So so was this. And 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:02.640 just so you know, uh, Kutztown, there was a guy 0:05:02.680 --> 0:05:05.279 by name of John Mowdley who was there when I 0:05:05.320 --> 0:05:08.119 was there, who ended up being a really good player 0:05:08.120 --> 0:05:10.120 in the NFL for a number of years of linebacker 0:05:10.160 --> 0:05:12.760 with the Denver Broncos and and other places. Just a 0:05:12.760 --> 0:05:15.960 little piece of information there on Kutztown, which you pronounce 0:05:16.080 --> 0:05:18.560 is cutting down. I had no idea. Be sure to 0:05:18.600 --> 0:05:21.560 catch live editions about kicked the coverage with Clay Travis 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:26.200 week days at six am Eastern, three am Pacific. So 0:05:26.279 --> 0:05:29.160 when you're when you're at Cootstown, I believe hopefully I'm 0:05:29.160 --> 0:05:32.680 getting closer there. You're making fifteen dollars you're driving around 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:36.200 filling up soda machines, Like, are you thinking to yourself 0:05:36.279 --> 0:05:38.240 someday I'm gonna be a head coach? Or what was 0:05:38.279 --> 0:05:40.080 your game plan at that point in time? Like how 0:05:40.120 --> 0:05:42.640 many hours do you think you were working a day? Uh? 0:05:42.640 --> 0:05:44.599 You know, fifteen dollars for the year is crazy. But 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:47.760 I always like to start with how people got their started, 0:05:47.800 --> 0:05:49.560 because I think there's a lot of people out there listening. 0:05:49.560 --> 0:05:51.600 And this is the Winds and Losses podcast. I'm Clay 0:05:51.600 --> 0:05:54.240 Travis talking with Penn State football coach James Franklin. Who 0:05:54.279 --> 0:05:56.600 come out of high school or come out of college 0:05:56.600 --> 0:05:58.480 more likely, and they're like, Oh, I'm twenty two or 0:05:58.520 --> 0:06:00.680 twenty three, I need to be made in fifty k. 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:02.760 I gotta have this job. I gotta have this car, 0:06:02.800 --> 0:06:05.440 I gotta have this apartment. And coaching is not like that. 0:06:05.480 --> 0:06:07.520 What I do for a living in sports media is 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:09.880 not like that. A lot of these places you have 0:06:09.960 --> 0:06:12.480 to literally start at the bottom or sometimes even below 0:06:12.520 --> 0:06:16.600 the bottom. Yeah yeah, so you know, for for me, 0:06:16.760 --> 0:06:18.839 I actually at that point still didn't even though I 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:21.680 wanted to coach. I just I got my undergraduate degree 0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:24.440 in psychology. I thought I was gonna get my doctorate 0:06:24.480 --> 0:06:27.599 in the psychology or psychiatry and kind of make a 0:06:27.640 --> 0:06:31.400 difference in people's lives that way. And UH did two 0:06:31.440 --> 0:06:35.200 internships at two psychiatric hospitals, an adult and the adolescent, 0:06:35.240 --> 0:06:37.760 and realized that's not what I wanted to do. And 0:06:37.760 --> 0:06:40.240 then when as I was coaching, I realized, Hey, this 0:06:40.360 --> 0:06:42.520 is something you know that I do really enjoy and 0:06:42.520 --> 0:06:45.080 this is something where I can still make a difference 0:06:45.080 --> 0:06:47.600 in people's lives. And at that level, you know, you're 0:06:47.839 --> 0:06:51.120 offering you know, partial scholarships to kids you know that 0:06:51.160 --> 0:06:53.560 maybe wouldn't have gone to college without it, you know, 0:06:53.720 --> 0:06:56.039 So it was it was very different, But yeah, I 0:06:56.080 --> 0:06:59.919 think to your point, I made my first year Kutztown. 0:07:00.720 --> 0:07:04.200 Then I went and played overseas for for six months, 0:07:04.200 --> 0:07:07.000 then went back to East Straullisburg as a graduate assistant 0:07:07.000 --> 0:07:11.240 for five thousand dollars for the year. Then the next year, UM, 0:07:11.680 --> 0:07:15.360 I went to James Madison, got my first big break, 0:07:15.680 --> 0:07:19.840 and that one I think I made UH thirteen thousand 0:07:19.880 --> 0:07:22.720 dollars for the year. And then I went to Washington 0:07:22.800 --> 0:07:24.920 State to work for Mike Price. Right after the Rose 0:07:24.960 --> 0:07:26.840 Bowl was Ryan Leaf. I was there when he was 0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:29.920 working out for UM pro day for you know, for 0:07:29.960 --> 0:07:32.720 the NFL, and I made five thousand dollars. I've been 0:07:32.720 --> 0:07:36.320 out of college four years and was making five thousand dollars. 0:07:36.360 --> 0:07:39.440 Then I got my first big break at Idaho State 0:07:39.520 --> 0:07:43.040 in Pocatello, Idaho, making twenty three three, and Clay, you 0:07:43.040 --> 0:07:45.320 couldn't tell me nothing. I thought I was you thought 0:07:45.320 --> 0:07:49.440 you were loaded at living in Pocatello, Idaho, had my 0:07:49.480 --> 0:07:53.080 own little apartment, my actually my special teams coordinator. Now 0:07:53.240 --> 0:07:55.880 Joe Lord was my college roommate. We split a room 0:07:55.920 --> 0:07:59.840 there and uh we were living good Man twenty three 0:07:59.840 --> 0:08:04.080 and Hotel Idle, and uh we were living good and 0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:06.920 and and and feeling good. I also see on a 0:08:06.960 --> 0:08:09.400 resume here that did you coach in Denmark? Did you 0:08:09.440 --> 0:08:13.160 coach football and Denmark? Yeah? So, so when I got 0:08:13.200 --> 0:08:18.080 done at Kutztown UM for the spring, I went and 0:08:18.400 --> 0:08:24.200 was the quarterback and offensive coordinator in Roskilde, Denmark for 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:26.320 six months. Which it was a great experience for me 0:08:26.400 --> 0:08:29.720 because I, you know, I made the decision to do it, 0:08:29.840 --> 0:08:31.800 hadn't really thought it all through, and got on a 0:08:31.840 --> 0:08:34.280 plane for thirteen hours to a country where I didn't 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:36.400 know anybody and didn't speak the language. It was one 0:08:36.400 --> 0:08:40.440 of the more difficult dialects for English speaking people to learn. Um, 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:42.600 I was able to be the offensive coordinator. They had 0:08:42.640 --> 0:08:46.400 never been very good. Um. You know, my contract ended 0:08:46.440 --> 0:08:50.160 at the end of the regular season. We ended up 0:08:50.200 --> 0:08:53.800 making it to the national championship game, but my contract 0:08:53.880 --> 0:08:57.400 ran out and I had um agreed to be a 0:08:57.440 --> 0:09:00.240 graduate assistant back at EA Stroudsburg. So I actually low 0:09:00.320 --> 0:09:03.440 back at the end of the season, flew back, went 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:06.520 to school for a week, started grad school with East Straussburg, 0:09:06.640 --> 0:09:11.800 flew back thirteen hours, flew back that weekend on Friday, 0:09:11.840 --> 0:09:14.439 played in the National Championship game on Saturday, won the 0:09:14.520 --> 0:09:18.920 National championship on Saturday, then flew back for school on 0:09:18.960 --> 0:09:22.079 Monday again. So you won a national championship in Denmark. 0:09:23.080 --> 0:09:25.240 In Denmark, Yeah, it was amazing too, because if I 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:26.920 remember when I got there, I got to the first 0:09:26.960 --> 0:09:29.920 meeting and all the guys they have three Americans on 0:09:29.960 --> 0:09:33.120 each team and everybody else kind of just paid their 0:09:33.160 --> 0:09:34.839 own way. So you get there and there's all these 0:09:34.840 --> 0:09:38.040 guys that are smoking cigarettes and drinking beer, and uh, 0:09:38.360 --> 0:09:40.760 you know, it was it was and like our uniforms 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:45.239 looked like NASCAR. There was like advertising all over our uniforms, 0:09:45.240 --> 0:09:47.520 so it was it was an interesting deal. Had you 0:09:47.559 --> 0:09:49.800 ever been to Europe before you ended up playing and 0:09:49.840 --> 0:09:54.120 coaching in Denmark? Yeah? So, so you know, my my 0:09:54.200 --> 0:09:57.840 dad was in the Air Force and was stationed in Manchester, England, 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:00.880 met my mom, they eloped to Ireland. He brought her 0:10:00.920 --> 0:10:03.920 back to this really romantic city called Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, and 0:10:03.920 --> 0:10:08.640 they started popping out beige babies, me and my sister. Um. So, 0:10:08.640 --> 0:10:11.360 so I've been to England a few times visiting family, 0:10:11.440 --> 0:10:14.240 so everybody on my mom's side of the family isn't 0:10:14.360 --> 0:10:16.360 is in England. And then my dad got a job 0:10:17.120 --> 0:10:20.200 in Trenton, New Jersey, working for a General Motors plant 0:10:20.280 --> 0:10:22.800 and we moved there. Um and kind of that's where 0:10:22.800 --> 0:10:25.679 I was raised, just outside of Philadelphia. So that had 0:10:25.679 --> 0:10:27.360 to be pretty cool. And I think I'm not messing 0:10:27.440 --> 0:10:29.960 up right. Didn't Penn State play overseas? Didn't you guys 0:10:29.960 --> 0:10:32.360 play in uh In? Didn't you guys play in the 0:10:32.440 --> 0:10:38.040 in Ireland? Yeah? So my first game was a total nightmare. Um. 0:10:38.080 --> 0:10:41.560 We opened the season in Dublin, Ireland against Central Florida. 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:44.439 Georgio Leary was the head coach. It was perfect at 0:10:44.480 --> 0:10:47.160 that time because it was Georgio Leary first, Bill O'Brien 0:10:47.240 --> 0:10:51.240 so too, two good Irish boys Dublin. It didn't turn 0:10:51.280 --> 0:10:53.959 out that way when Billy left and and I showed up. 0:10:54.040 --> 0:10:57.240 But yeah, it was you know, Central Florida. How to 0:10:57.280 --> 0:11:00.960 buy the next week, We didn't, so we've you back Sunday, 0:11:01.000 --> 0:11:04.079 got back like four in the morning, had practiced that day. 0:11:04.360 --> 0:11:08.240 It wasn't an ideal situation. Um our equipment guy had 0:11:08.280 --> 0:11:10.800 retired like a month before two games, so trying to 0:11:10.840 --> 0:11:12.319 get all because you gotta remember, you're going to a 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:14.120 country who doesn't have football, so you have to take 0:11:14.280 --> 0:11:18.240 everything with you. So it was it was. It was 0:11:18.280 --> 0:11:20.320 an interesting trip, but we were able to win that 0:11:20.400 --> 0:11:23.800 game with the last second field goal and and um 0:11:23.880 --> 0:11:25.640 you know that was when we first got the job, 0:11:25.800 --> 0:11:28.240 you know, after you know, pretty challenging time and Penn 0:11:28.280 --> 0:11:30.880 State's history, all right, So this is interesting because you're 0:11:30.880 --> 0:11:34.240 talking about all the logistics involved in making a travel situation. 0:11:34.360 --> 0:11:36.000 I know you pretty well and I remember one of 0:11:36.040 --> 0:11:39.440 the first times I met you at Vanderbilt. You were 0:11:39.600 --> 0:11:42.480 going through looking at the photos that have been taken 0:11:42.800 --> 0:11:45.440 to decide like what the senior photos were gonna be 0:11:45.480 --> 0:11:47.720 that we're gonna be in a pamphlet or something. Right 0:11:47.760 --> 0:11:51.120 of the players, you're very hands on with a ton 0:11:51.160 --> 0:11:54.840 of the details they go on at every program. Did 0:11:54.880 --> 0:11:58.400 you always be that? Were you always that way in 0:11:58.520 --> 0:12:00.400 terms of having your hand in you know, when you're 0:12:00.400 --> 0:12:02.400 at Vanderbilt marketing, I know you do it at Penn 0:12:02.440 --> 0:12:04.160 State now in fact that I'll just say it, like 0:12:04.480 --> 0:12:06.760 right after we went up and watched a couple of 0:12:06.840 --> 0:12:08.760 year games we've been up for, and one of the 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:10.560 things you ask is what was the environment, Like, what 0:12:10.600 --> 0:12:13.240 did you think of the experience? A lot of coaches 0:12:13.280 --> 0:12:16.160 are just football guys. You're not just a football guy. 0:12:16.200 --> 0:12:18.800 Do you attribute that maybe to coming up through some 0:12:18.920 --> 0:12:21.840 of these schools that are not you know, I would 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:24.200 say like sort of the name brand schools where you 0:12:24.240 --> 0:12:26.280 have to work to get attention or do you think 0:12:26.280 --> 0:12:28.000 you would have done that even if you had started 0:12:28.000 --> 0:12:30.720 off at the Alabama's and the Michigan's and the Penn 0:12:30.800 --> 0:12:35.120 States of the world. That's still just your personality. Well, 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:38.120 I think it is my personality, There's no doubt about it. Um. 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.439 It's funny, you know, I would I would describe myself 0:12:41.440 --> 0:12:43.680 as a micro manager, and I would say a lot 0:12:43.760 --> 0:12:46.839 of times it's funny because what I think drives people 0:12:46.840 --> 0:12:49.040 crazy is when you say you're not a micro manager 0:12:49.080 --> 0:12:51.319 and then you show up and the person is, you know, 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:53.800 I'm a micro manager, but I don't want to be. 0:12:53.880 --> 0:12:55.599 So what I mean by that is, I'm gonna be 0:12:55.679 --> 0:12:57.640 a micro manager until you show me you can do 0:12:57.679 --> 0:12:59.560 the job, and then once you do the job, I'm 0:12:59.600 --> 0:13:02.440 stepping way. But ultimately I'm gonna be held responsible, so 0:13:02.480 --> 0:13:04.400 I'm gonna make sure it's done the way we want 0:13:04.440 --> 0:13:06.320 it done. But I do think your point is a 0:13:06.320 --> 0:13:09.280 good one. Is when you're at small schools and you 0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:12.000 have to wear a lot more hats, um, and even 0:13:12.000 --> 0:13:14.080 at a place like Vanderbilt in the SEC where you 0:13:14.120 --> 0:13:17.480 don't have maybe um a lot of the infrastructure that 0:13:17.520 --> 0:13:19.840 maybe the other schools do, you have to do it 0:13:19.920 --> 0:13:21.880 and you have to do it all. And I think 0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:23.840 at the end of the day, you know, I'm a 0:13:23.880 --> 0:13:27.160 big believer that the details matter and the consistency in 0:13:27.240 --> 0:13:31.360 your message matters. So um, you know, I'm gonna be 0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:35.200 all over everything, um until I know someone's gonna do 0:13:35.320 --> 0:13:37.640 things the way the way you know we need them 0:13:37.679 --> 0:13:40.120 to be done. And that's where I'm fortunate to have 0:13:40.160 --> 0:13:42.000 a guy like Dwight Galton, who has been with me, 0:13:42.200 --> 0:13:44.760 you know, since since two thousand, our strength coach, and 0:13:45.200 --> 0:13:47.559 you know Andy Frank, who runs our recruiting, has been 0:13:47.600 --> 0:13:50.319 with me my entire head coach career. And Michael Hazel, 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:53.280 one of our ops guys, and Kevin Threlko. Those guys 0:13:53.280 --> 0:13:54.920 have been with me ever since the first day at 0:13:54.960 --> 0:13:56.800 Vanderbilt and all the way all the way to now 0:13:56.840 --> 0:13:58.920 here at Penn State. So there's value. And that my 0:13:58.960 --> 0:14:02.480 defensive coordinators with me the whole time. So, UM, you know, 0:14:02.520 --> 0:14:05.680 there's there's tremendous value in that. UM, no doubt about it, 0:14:05.720 --> 0:14:09.200 because those guys know how we operate. What did Maryland 0:14:09.200 --> 0:14:12.199 mean for you? You You talked about making three living in 0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:14.760 I think Postcatello, Idaho. You keep naming places that I 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:17.000 don't even know that I've ever said before. Uh. And 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:19.680 then you get a gig at Maryland and you come 0:14:19.760 --> 0:14:21.480 all the way back across the country. You're back on 0:14:21.520 --> 0:14:23.040 the East Coast where you spend a lot of time 0:14:23.080 --> 0:14:25.640 growing up. What did getting that job with the terms 0:14:25.720 --> 0:14:29.240 do for your career? Well, Maryland was my my first 0:14:29.280 --> 0:14:32.400 big break. Maryland was my first big break in the profession, 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:36.240 big time football. Um. Again, you know, it's like a 0:14:36.240 --> 0:14:38.600 lot of things, you know, I was. I was lucky 0:14:38.640 --> 0:14:41.240 in some ways. So my buddy coach there, and he 0:14:41.320 --> 0:14:44.000 called me and said, hey, the receiver's coach, Craig Johnson 0:14:44.480 --> 0:14:46.360 was leaving to go to the Titans, I think at 0:14:46.360 --> 0:14:49.560 the time, and UM said, you know, um, I'm gonna 0:14:49.560 --> 0:14:51.640 try to get you involved in this job. Well, I 0:14:51.760 --> 0:14:53.640 happened to be home, and I think it was spring break, 0:14:53.680 --> 0:14:55.600 and I happened to be home in Philly because they're 0:14:55.600 --> 0:14:58.000 probably not gonna fly a guy in from pocatah idah. 0:14:58.120 --> 0:14:59.560 So I talked to the head coach and he said, hey, 0:14:59.600 --> 0:15:02.120 why don't you why don't you drive up and spend 0:15:02.160 --> 0:15:04.840 the day with us, And um, it was able to 0:15:04.880 --> 0:15:07.320 get the job. Ron vander Linden was the head coach 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:10.600 at the time. I got my first big break, went really, 0:15:10.720 --> 0:15:13.120 you know, went really well. Was excited about it. Well, 0:15:13.200 --> 0:15:16.480 at the end of that season, I'm driving across um 0:15:16.480 --> 0:15:19.680 a bridge from Pennsylvania into New Jersey. My phone rings 0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:21.480 and it's one of my players and he said, hey, coach. 0:15:21.480 --> 0:15:23.640 Are you okay? His name is Jeffar Williams and now 0:15:23.760 --> 0:15:25.720 coaches at Virginia Tech. He's like, are you okay? And 0:15:25.720 --> 0:15:27.680 I'm like, what do you mean? I'm like okay. He's like, 0:15:27.720 --> 0:15:30.640 you guys just got fired. I'm like, what. Pull over 0:15:30.720 --> 0:15:32.240 to the side of the road. That's how I found 0:15:32.240 --> 0:15:34.560 out about it, and then I was fortunate Ralph Regan 0:15:34.680 --> 0:15:37.560 came in uh and retained me, and we went on 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:40.880 a pretty historic run there at Maryland went three games, 0:15:41.480 --> 0:15:44.000 uh three years, we won ten games or more, one 0:15:44.040 --> 0:15:47.200 a SEC championship, played in the BCS Orange Bowl, and 0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:50.400 and my my kind of career prop propelled from there. 0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:53.640 So I'm very appreciative of my time that Maryland and 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:56.840 Ralph region had a huge impact on my career. The 0:15:56.840 --> 0:15:58.960 funny thing is Ron Vanderlin, who was the head coach 0:15:58.960 --> 0:16:03.640 at Maryland. He retired here in State College, Pennsylvania day 0:16:03.760 --> 0:16:06.840 speaking at our clinic next week. Fox Sports Radio has 0:16:06.880 --> 0:16:09.800 the best sports talk lineup in the nation. Catch all 0:16:09.840 --> 0:16:13.200 of our shows at Fox sports Radio dot com and 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:15.840 within the I Heart radio apps. Search f s R 0:16:15.920 --> 0:16:19.600 to listen live. So we're talking to penn State football 0:16:19.600 --> 0:16:22.240 coach James Franklin, I'm Clay Travis is wins and losses. 0:16:22.680 --> 0:16:25.600 When you're at Maryland and you start recruiting a higher 0:16:25.680 --> 0:16:28.440 level of player, I think it's probably fair to say 0:16:28.600 --> 0:16:32.040 did your recruiting methods change? And and one thing I'm 0:16:32.080 --> 0:16:35.280 kind of fascinated by is how do you develop your 0:16:35.360 --> 0:16:38.600 recruiting pitch? For lack of a better term, Right, Like 0:16:38.840 --> 0:16:41.040 you're basically in the sales business. You have to be 0:16:41.080 --> 0:16:44.320 able to go out and convince sixteen seventeen, eighteen year 0:16:44.360 --> 0:16:47.560 olds that you can take them to another level in football, 0:16:47.640 --> 0:16:50.840 academics and everything else. Did it come naturally? Did you 0:16:50.920 --> 0:16:53.880 watch the way other people recruited? How do you become 0:16:54.360 --> 0:16:58.120 a good recruiter? Well? I think, first of all, I 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:01.400 have a very curious personality. I'm very curious about a 0:17:01.400 --> 0:17:05.439 lot of different things. Um, I'm a sponge in terms 0:17:05.520 --> 0:17:08.760 of trying to gain as much information as I cancel. Yeah, 0:17:08.840 --> 0:17:11.440 it's it's like you described. I think, in any business, 0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:13.200 what do you do? You get your foot in the door, 0:17:13.280 --> 0:17:15.840 and then you try to find who are the guys 0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:20.240 on that staff or within that industry that are really good? 0:17:20.560 --> 0:17:22.920 Um at it? So you know I was coaching receivers. 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:25.200 You're gonna find the best receivers coaches in the country, 0:17:25.240 --> 0:17:27.760 and you know you're gonna go visit those guys. Jerry 0:17:27.800 --> 0:17:29.879 Sullivan was one of the top receivers coaches in the 0:17:29.880 --> 0:17:32.960 country's time in NFL. I went and visited him. Um 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:36.920 in Arizona the Cardinals. Um on my staff a guy 0:17:36.960 --> 0:17:40.040 by named Mike Locksley is now the head coach at Maryland. Uh, 0:17:40.080 --> 0:17:42.679 he was a great recruiter. So I kind of, you know, 0:17:42.720 --> 0:17:45.560 watched him and studied him and other guys, and then 0:17:45.600 --> 0:17:46.720 you know, and then when you're on the road, the 0:17:46.800 --> 0:17:49.760 same thing when you when you see another college coach 0:17:49.840 --> 0:17:51.600 in a high school and how he's interacting with the 0:17:51.640 --> 0:17:54.359 high school coaches and how he is with it with 0:17:54.400 --> 0:17:57.520 the players, and you're learning and asking a lot of questions. 0:17:57.600 --> 0:17:59.119 And I think at the end of the day, all 0:17:59.119 --> 0:18:01.639 those things are great. Ultimately, you better be authentic and 0:18:01.720 --> 0:18:04.439 you better be true to who you are, because um, 0:18:04.480 --> 0:18:06.920 that's what people want, you know, they want they want 0:18:06.920 --> 0:18:09.399 people that are comfortable in their own skin and authentic 0:18:09.440 --> 0:18:12.960 and gonna be honest and transparent. So um, that's that's 0:18:12.960 --> 0:18:14.720 what I tried to do, and I was able to 0:18:14.800 --> 0:18:16.760 learn a lot in a in a short period of tone. 0:18:17.119 --> 0:18:20.360 How many hours on an average week do you think 0:18:20.400 --> 0:18:24.439 you spend either recruiting, preparing for recruiting, watching film. I 0:18:24.440 --> 0:18:27.440 know it probably varies based on the time of the year, 0:18:27.800 --> 0:18:30.960 but what percentage of your day to day is focused 0:18:30.960 --> 0:18:33.320 on recruiting As a head football coach at Penn State, 0:18:34.320 --> 0:18:36.920 I think it's it's probably fifty percent of my time. So, 0:18:37.119 --> 0:18:40.320 you know, fifty percent of my time is some form 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:43.480 of recruiting UM, you know, and then you got you know, 0:18:43.560 --> 0:18:46.000 the rest of your time is on football. But then 0:18:46.600 --> 0:18:50.040 both of those situations you kind of get pulled in 0:18:50.160 --> 0:18:52.720 a bunch of different directions. So you know, if there's 0:18:52.720 --> 0:18:54.600 an issue that comes up that you have to deal with, 0:18:54.680 --> 0:18:57.240 you're getting pulled out, you know, whatever the situation maybe 0:18:57.359 --> 0:19:00.359 that you're having to deal with UM players. You know, 0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:03.040 a player's girlfriend breaks up with him and he's heartbroken 0:19:03.040 --> 0:19:06.359 over that, or or you know, parents are getting divorced 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:09.159 or whatever it may be. You know, as a you know, 0:19:09.240 --> 0:19:12.680 college is very different than the NFL. NFL is football 0:19:12.720 --> 0:19:17.960 and football UM scheme and fundamentals and technique and things 0:19:18.000 --> 0:19:19.760 like that. Where in college you wear you wear a 0:19:19.840 --> 0:19:23.239 lot more hats. You know, you're a fundraiser. Um, you 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:26.080 know you're a recruiter. You know you're a schemer, you're 0:19:26.080 --> 0:19:29.240 a fundamentalists as well. Um, you're doing a lot of 0:19:29.280 --> 0:19:31.760 different things. You're a mentor, you're a big brother, your 0:19:31.800 --> 0:19:34.880 father figure to these guys. Um, you're just you're You're 0:19:34.880 --> 0:19:37.280 wearing a lot more hats than you do it than 0:19:37.359 --> 0:19:40.480 you do in the NFL. What's the best recruit tape 0:19:40.520 --> 0:19:43.440