WEBVTT - DAY 73, BROOKE-HUBBY: "BLOOD EVERYWHERE" NO ARREST 0:00:00.880 --> 0:00:09.280 Crime Stories with Nancy Grace bombshell tonight, young mom Brooke 0:00:09.440 --> 0:00:19.960 Hanlon's husband says, there's blood everywhere. No arrest. What no arrest? 0:00:20.360 --> 0:00:25.080 A young mother stabbed dead on the second floor of 0:00:25.120 --> 0:00:29.520 her suburban home and we don't have an arrest? What 0:00:29.680 --> 0:00:34.680 is there a serial killer wandering around that suburban neighborhood. 0:00:35.120 --> 0:00:38.120 Good evening, I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:40.000 want to thank you for being with us. 0:00:47.000 --> 0:00:47.400 I just. 0:00:50.440 --> 0:00:51.839 CPR, CPR. 0:00:52.600 --> 0:00:54.920 Okay, she's not breathing her conscious. 0:00:55.880 --> 0:00:59.000 Oh my god, there's a last. 0:01:00.960 --> 0:01:02.760 Okay, sir, very through one moment. 0:01:03.800 --> 0:01:04.880 We're gonna go up there. 0:01:05.000 --> 0:01:07.320 Just stand the line of needs for information. Okay. 0:01:10.160 --> 0:01:13.800 I don't know, but I need you need your media, sir. 0:01:14.800 --> 0:01:21.840 She is bleeding and she's not okay, okay, Oh, oh 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:25.640 my god, Oh my god. 0:01:26.480 --> 0:01:29.160 I'm curious about the fingernail scrapings. Was there signs of 0:01:29.200 --> 0:01:32.360 a struggle? Were their defense wounds on the on the victim? 0:01:32.440 --> 0:01:35.640 So a lot of value, a lot of evidentiary value 0:01:35.640 --> 0:01:36.760 coming out of this case. 0:01:37.360 --> 0:01:39.480 You're hearing a portion of that nine one one call. 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:42.600 We have combed over it over and over and over. 0:01:42.800 --> 0:01:48.640 Every single word, including the tone of his voice when 0:01:48.680 --> 0:01:55.240 it goes up to a falsetto curious, what if anything 0:01:55.280 --> 0:01:58.160 does it mean? Maybe nothing? And you were also hearing 0:01:58.640 --> 0:02:02.880 retired Deputy chief at the Hartford PD, Brian Foley with 0:02:02.960 --> 0:02:06.480 our friends at Fox News. What does it mean? This 0:02:06.560 --> 0:02:11.840 is what it means. No arrest. Listen to this. 0:02:12.120 --> 0:02:14.960 But it's been two months since thirty five year old 0:02:15.040 --> 0:02:17.840 Brook Hamlin was killed in her Chester, New Jersey home, 0:02:18.280 --> 0:02:20.600 and there's still not been an arrest. There has been 0:02:20.760 --> 0:02:23.920 very little information released about this case, which I think 0:02:24.639 --> 0:02:27.120 has left a lot of people wondering. Does that mean 0:02:27.160 --> 0:02:29.320 that they have someone that they have their eye on 0:02:29.360 --> 0:02:31.520 and they're building a case, or does it mean the 0:02:31.560 --> 0:02:34.440 exact opposite and they have no clue who did this? 0:02:34.880 --> 0:02:40.040 That is take true crime psycho ed. Let's focus on 0:02:40.120 --> 0:02:43.840 what we know tonight. Straight out to Vanessa Walt joining us. 0:02:43.880 --> 0:02:47.520 She is the star of Unmasked true crime that shot 0:02:47.600 --> 0:02:52.240 to the forefront during the Lynette Hooker debacle, who, I 0:02:52.320 --> 0:02:57.040 might add, still has not been found, no charges, no arrest. 0:02:57.160 --> 0:03:01.000 Wait a minute, Vanessa, maybe it's you because all of 0:03:01.000 --> 0:03:04.240 the cases you're investigating their dead wives and there's never 0:03:04.280 --> 0:03:08.359 an arrest, and there's never a resolution. We'll focus on 0:03:08.400 --> 0:03:13.600 that later. But Vanessa, where has the husband been? No suspects, 0:03:13.840 --> 0:03:17.480 no person of interest named. As of tonight, it's reported 0:03:17.520 --> 0:03:20.640 that after the murder that he did go to Massachusetts, 0:03:20.680 --> 0:03:22.280 where his parents are, for a while. 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:27.119 He did come back in mid July. He is reportedly 0:03:27.240 --> 0:03:30.639 back in Chester, New Jersey. Now, however, their one year 0:03:30.639 --> 0:03:34.320 old daughter, Avery is reportedly still staying with Brooks parents. 0:03:35.080 --> 0:03:38.960 To Mark Astor joining us high profile lawyer out of 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:44.960 Boca Raton, Florida. He founded the Astor Simovich Law Group 0:03:45.080 --> 0:03:51.200 and he is a star of the journey by Mark Astor. Astor, 0:03:52.680 --> 0:03:56.320 thank you for being with us tonight. In this case, 0:03:56.440 --> 0:04:00.920 of course, the husband has not been named, has not 0:04:01.040 --> 0:04:02.640 been named a person of interest. 0:04:03.440 --> 0:04:06.080 Well, I appreciate what you're saying, Nancy, but it's not 0:04:06.160 --> 0:04:08.080 like he got on a plane and flew to Europe 0:04:08.360 --> 0:04:11.200 or somewhere else where where there's no jurisdiction over him. 0:04:11.440 --> 0:04:13.640 I mean, he went to his parents. So what are 0:04:13.640 --> 0:04:15.680 we going to read into that and say, well, he 0:04:15.800 --> 0:04:18.040 must be guilty because he went to mommy and daddy's house. 0:04:18.440 --> 0:04:22.200 I don't think that's any evidence, frankly, of anything. In fact, 0:04:22.279 --> 0:04:25.080 as you pointed out, it's been seventy plus days since 0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:29.080 this occurred. If law enforcement had probable cause to arrest him, 0:04:29.279 --> 0:04:31.200 they would have done it, or they would have gone 0:04:31.200 --> 0:04:33.040 to a judge and said, your honor, he is an 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:36.520 application for an arrest warrant. Please sign off on this 0:04:36.560 --> 0:04:39.120 so we can go and arrest this person. So that 0:04:39.200 --> 0:04:41.479 hasn't happened. So the fact that he went to his parents, 0:04:41.720 --> 0:04:44.039 I don't read anything into that at all. And he 0:04:44.160 --> 0:04:47.400 came back, So what what does that tell us? That's 0:04:47.400 --> 0:04:50.760 not evidence. We're lawyer's former prosecutors. We rely on evidence. 0:04:51.440 --> 0:04:53.400 I don't see that as evidence of anything. 0:04:53.960 --> 0:04:57.119 Oh wow, you really letting me have it. Of course, 0:04:57.120 --> 0:04:58.839 it's not evidence probative in court. 0:04:59.040 --> 0:04:59.360 You know what. 0:04:59.440 --> 0:05:03.040 I'm not a shre to doctor Bethany Marshall joining us 0:05:03.120 --> 0:05:07.000 renowned psychoalyst out of the LA jurisdiction. She is the 0:05:07.040 --> 0:05:11.240 author of deal Breaker. You can see her on Hulu, 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:14.880 on Peacock, on Netflix, and she's a star of a 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:18.159 Hitting You podcast on the Couch with doctor Bethany Marshall. 0:05:18.240 --> 0:05:23.000 Doctor Bethany, of course, it's not probative that he did anything, 0:05:23.680 --> 0:05:28.159 but I think it tells me something about his priorities. 0:05:30.360 --> 0:05:36.000 Leaving your wife's only child, who has gone through her 0:05:36.080 --> 0:05:38.400 own trauma, what did you hear? What did you see? 0:05:38.400 --> 0:05:41.000 I don't know that it's poby all locked up here 0:05:41.000 --> 0:05:44.680 in that child's head, But leaving her and going to 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:49.240 mommy and daddy's house while your daughter is alone with 0:05:49.279 --> 0:05:53.520 the grandparents, no mom and no dad. That tells me something. 0:05:53.520 --> 0:05:56.080 I'm not quite sure what, Nancy. 0:05:56.120 --> 0:05:59.640 It may not be hard evidence, but it's behavioral evidence, 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:03.200 which tells us a lot. And in many cases, it's 0:06:03.240 --> 0:06:06.200 not what we see, it's what we don't see. 0:06:07.200 --> 0:06:09.800 Man, I could analyze that none on one call all 0:06:10.000 --> 0:06:15.599 day long. I'm also curious about what former Deputy Chief 0:06:15.760 --> 0:06:21.760 of Hartford PD, Brian Foley said about fingernail scrapings. Back 0:06:21.760 --> 0:06:25.240 to Vanessa Walsh joining a start of Unmasked True Crime, 0:06:25.600 --> 0:06:29.240 what can you tell me about the discoveries made at 0:06:29.279 --> 0:06:32.839 the scene. What do we know about any potential forensics? 0:06:33.120 --> 0:06:36.680 What we do know is when first responders did arrive, 0:06:37.279 --> 0:06:40.600 they immediately within two minutes, knew that the scene looks 0:06:40.640 --> 0:06:44.440 suspicious and at four forty two, so just thirteen minutes 0:06:44.520 --> 0:06:48.080 after Connor's nine one one call, they had deemed Brokes 0:06:48.200 --> 0:06:51.280 death as suspicious and called in the Major Crimes Unit. 0:06:51.680 --> 0:06:53.560 All right, the parados have been said to stay on 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:59.680 the line. Yeah yeah, what if there's a defibulator available? 0:06:59.680 --> 0:07:01.080 Sense and to get in now and tell me when 0:07:01.080 --> 0:07:01.600 you have it, sir. 0:07:01.839 --> 0:07:02.720 No, I don't have one. 0:07:02.720 --> 0:07:05.839 I don't not available. Okay, I don't know what to do. 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:07.840 I don't know what Okay. Please put your phone off 0:07:08.200 --> 0:07:10.840 speaker so your hands are free to helpers on speaker. 0:07:10.960 --> 0:07:15.880 On speaker, I did not moment no, please one moment no. 0:07:17.080 --> 0:07:19.360 Listen carefully and I'll tell you how to do chest compression. Sir. 0:07:19.400 --> 0:07:21.440 Place the keel of your hand on the breastbone in 0:07:21.480 --> 0:07:23.600 the center of the chest, right between the. 0:07:25.080 --> 0:07:25.600 Cut. 0:07:26.440 --> 0:07:28.640 I'm sorry, what was that, sir? 0:07:29.960 --> 0:07:30.960 There's blood everywhere. 0:07:31.280 --> 0:07:33.680 We're gonna do this six hundred times or until help 0:07:33.720 --> 0:07:37.200 can take over. Okay, count out loud so I can 0:07:37.200 --> 0:07:42.640 count with you. Okay. But one one two three four, 0:07:43.080 --> 0:07:49.360 one two three four one two three one two three 0:07:49.760 --> 0:07:55.840 four one two three four one two three four keep 0:07:56.120 --> 0:07:58.000 keep going so you're doing great. We're gonna do this 0:07:58.040 --> 0:08:01.760 six hundred times or until help can take over, or okay, 0:08:02.240 --> 0:08:07.720 two three four one two three four help us on 0:08:07.760 --> 0:08:10.360 the water. Keep going, I need you try and take 0:08:10.400 --> 0:08:15.880 a deep breather, sir, three four one, number one. 0:08:17.480 --> 0:08:17.760 Four. 0:08:18.080 --> 0:08:19.160 Where are you in the house? 0:08:20.080 --> 0:08:20.560 Second floor? 0:08:20.960 --> 0:08:25.760 Second floor? Okay, okay, keep going one two three four. 0:08:26.120 --> 0:08:30.080 And speaking of the second floor, I'm not the only 0:08:30.200 --> 0:08:33.840 one who noticed this clue. 0:08:34.200 --> 0:08:37.840 Here are three interesting facts regarding the Brooke Handling case 0:08:37.840 --> 0:08:40.800 that a lot of people are not considering. Number One, 0:08:40.960 --> 0:08:45.000 this happened in broad daylight on the second floor of 0:08:45.080 --> 0:08:48.480 her home. Guys, she didn't live on a busy road. 0:08:48.559 --> 0:08:50.439 She lived like in the woods. You got to take 0:08:50.440 --> 0:08:52.720 a long driveway and a long path to get to 0:08:52.800 --> 0:08:55.959 her house. So someone doing that has to know exactly 0:08:56.040 --> 0:08:58.640 where she lives and know where that path would lead to. 0:08:59.080 --> 0:09:01.679 And then up on the second floor in broad daylay. 0:09:01.920 --> 0:09:04.199 That either means she was being chased and she's succumbed 0:09:04.240 --> 0:09:06.800 to the injuries up there, or someone knew exactly where 0:09:06.800 --> 0:09:10.079 to find her. So that's just number one, broad daylay 0:09:10.160 --> 0:09:11.360 and on the second floor. 0:09:11.800 --> 0:09:15.800 That from at Laugh and Grind official TikTok he noticed 0:09:15.800 --> 0:09:19.840 it straight out to Lisa J. Miller, former detective, former 0:09:19.920 --> 0:09:25.520 chief investigator, senior executive Colorado AG's office. Lisa, thank you, 0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:30.840 for being with us. Let's address his observation that she 0:09:31.120 --> 0:09:33.960 was tucked away up on the second floor, which means 0:09:34.000 --> 0:09:36.280 an intruder would have to come in, no fourth entry, 0:09:37.120 --> 0:09:40.960 not setting off a burglar alarm, make their way up 0:09:41.000 --> 0:09:45.360 to the second floor and find her. There's no sex attack, 0:09:45.440 --> 0:09:50.079 there's no robbery, there's no burglary. Find her and murder 0:09:50.160 --> 0:09:53.480 her and get out before the husband could get back 0:09:53.520 --> 0:09:58.800 from buying an auto part. What does that say? What 0:09:58.960 --> 0:10:03.439 inference can we draw from that? What if anything doesn't 0:10:03.440 --> 0:10:06.319 prove you're seeing the home? From our friends at Fox 0:10:06.480 --> 0:10:09.040 News hit it, Lisa, Well, we. 0:10:09.040 --> 0:10:11.800 Can't make a lot of inferences here because there's a 0:10:11.800 --> 0:10:15.280 lot of facts. We don't know her being located in 0:10:15.320 --> 0:10:19.160 the bedroom. What would make me wonder and start asking questions? 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:24.080 And I'm sure investigators are doing all these things. The 0:10:24.160 --> 0:10:26.760 sad part of this is right now is those of 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:29.439 us out here in the public sphere, we just don't 0:10:29.480 --> 0:10:33.040 have a lot to go on. We can speculate about 0:10:33.080 --> 0:10:35.520 a lot of things here, but we just don't have 0:10:35.600 --> 0:10:39.360 a whole lot of things to look at and judge 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:45.840 from facts because we're not getting facts. 0:10:49.400 --> 0:10:55.839 Crime stories with Nancy Grace straight out to Dave Mac 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:59.360 joining US Crime Stories investigative reporter, Dave Matt, it was 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:03.600 my understanding that there was no forced entry. No burglar 0:11:03.679 --> 0:11:06.720 alarm went off. Nine on one was called. I mean 0:11:08.160 --> 0:11:11.280 two plus two still legals four, doesn't it, Jackie, Yeah, okay, 0:11:11.320 --> 0:11:15.080 it does. Nothing changed overnight he called nine one one, 0:11:15.600 --> 0:11:22.440 No burglar alarm was activated. Nothing was tripped to call 0:11:23.160 --> 0:11:26.680 investigators or police to the scene. So no burglar alarm 0:11:26.760 --> 0:11:31.320 went off. We understand there was no forced entry, and 0:11:32.679 --> 0:11:39.520 the autopsy is done. Nothing was stated about a sex attack. Also, 0:11:39.840 --> 0:11:43.120 from what we are learning, there was no struggle in 0:11:43.200 --> 0:11:46.640 the foyer or the entrance. Let's see the picture or 0:11:46.640 --> 0:11:49.160 the video of the home again where you come in 0:11:49.240 --> 0:11:54.000 the front door. Nothing seemingly was a miss there. As 0:11:54.080 --> 0:11:58.840 you see, the glass is not busted, there's no pride 0:11:58.840 --> 0:12:02.360 marks on the door. We don't have fingerprint dust, the 0:12:02.520 --> 0:12:06.760 dark fingerprint powder all over the door, the handle to 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:09.600 find out who came in because there was no forced entry, 0:12:09.960 --> 0:12:11.959 Dave Mac, that's what. 0:12:11.920 --> 0:12:14.280 We have right now. And see, when we first started 0:12:14.280 --> 0:12:17.880 covering this, Nancy, I was looking at the entry, you know, 0:12:18.000 --> 0:12:21.360 because I thought if it was an attack from somebody 0:12:21.440 --> 0:12:26.160 she didn't know then maybe she was fleeing upstairs because 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:29.160 she was found upstairs in the master bedroom. But Nancy, 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:32.080 when you get down to this, you've got blood just 0:12:32.200 --> 0:12:33.920 up in the master bedroom. We're not told of it 0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:36.560 being anywhere else. And as you mentioned, there's no sign 0:12:36.640 --> 0:12:39.880 of any kind of a scuffle happening in the entryway. 0:12:40.280 --> 0:12:42.680 So we're just up on the second floor of a 0:12:42.720 --> 0:12:46.760 house that's not like sitting side by side with other homes. 0:12:46.800 --> 0:12:50.280 You had to know where it is. And again, nothing 0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:55.200 stolen either. It isn't a robbery gone wrong. This is 0:12:55.280 --> 0:13:00.120 actually he'd say, but targeted. It had to be, And 0:13:00.200 --> 0:13:03.559 we've got Connor Handlon, which we still don't know exactly 0:13:03.640 --> 0:13:05.960 when he left to go to the auto party store. 0:13:06.480 --> 0:13:09.000 We don't know exactly when he returned. We just know 0:13:09.400 --> 0:13:12.120 that he called nine one one at four twenty nine. 0:13:12.440 --> 0:13:15.200 Let me see that aerial view you were just showing me. 0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:20.960 It's a heavily wooded area and as we were hearing earlier, 0:13:22.280 --> 0:13:26.600 there are trails leading to this home through the woods. 0:13:26.840 --> 0:13:29.480 You kind of have to you kind of have to 0:13:29.559 --> 0:13:32.760 know where you're going to find it. Let's see the 0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:38.560 overhead view. There you go see her home in the 0:13:38.600 --> 0:13:41.840 midst of all of those trees. Who would have the 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:46.679 motive to go through those trees to get to Brook 0:13:46.760 --> 0:13:50.000 Hanlon up in her room on the second floor of 0:13:50.000 --> 0:13:53.640 the home and kill her, Dave mac isn't it true 0:13:53.840 --> 0:13:57.440 that there is a room in the basement. I wonder 0:13:57.440 --> 0:14:00.520 if there's an entry there that is the same level 0:14:00.640 --> 0:14:03.080 as the garage in the home. Dave, let's take a 0:14:03.080 --> 0:14:04.800 look at that picture again of the home. 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:10.839 Wow, that's amazing. You're right, there is a possible entry 0:14:11.360 --> 0:14:17.320 into that basement that somebody who again you mentioned the pathways, Nancy, 0:14:17.840 --> 0:14:22.960 whoever did this knew where they were going and knew 0:14:23.000 --> 0:14:25.760 what they were getting into. So yeah, they could have 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:29.400 gotten inwn from the basement and gone up as maybe 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:32.480 they were lying in wait until Connor left. 0:14:35.240 --> 0:14:39.400 Doctor Kendall Crown's joining US Chief Medical Examiner Terrance County. 0:14:39.480 --> 0:14:41.560 That's Fort Worth and he's the star of Mayhem and 0:14:41.600 --> 0:14:45.120 the Morgue, a hit podcast. Also, he is the esteemed 0:14:45.240 --> 0:14:49.000 lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU. He 0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:54.640 has performed literally thousands of autopsies. What is your analysis 0:14:54.720 --> 0:14:57.240 of the wound to Brook Hanlon? 0:15:00.400 --> 0:15:02.760 So the information we have at the present time is 0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:06.120 the husband stating that it's a laceration on the chest. 0:15:06.320 --> 0:15:11.320 Now people call lacerations are actually lacerations are caused by 0:15:11.320 --> 0:15:14.920 blunt force trauma, but people often confuse them with stab 0:15:14.960 --> 0:15:17.760 wounds or in size wounds, which is caused by sharp 0:15:17.840 --> 0:15:21.280 force trauma, which is what her cause of death was made. 0:15:21.720 --> 0:15:25.440 So if she has a laceration on her chest, it's 0:15:25.520 --> 0:15:29.720 probably a stab wound that he misinterpreted as a laceration 0:15:30.280 --> 0:15:34.120 from a knife being plunged into her chest at about 0:15:34.160 --> 0:15:37.360 heart level and going through her heart or lungs and 0:15:37.400 --> 0:15:38.960 then she bled out. 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:43.280 I'm curious if there were multiple stab wounds or one 0:15:43.400 --> 0:15:49.520 stab wound. Doctor Kendall Crowns, can you describe what a 0:15:49.640 --> 0:15:54.600 medical examiner would see if there were overlapping stab wounds 0:15:54.640 --> 0:15:57.680 that seem that appear to be one stab wound? How 0:15:57.720 --> 0:15:58.480 does that happen? 0:16:00.840 --> 0:16:03.480 So you can have in a stab wound situations where 0:16:03.520 --> 0:16:07.960 the individual stabs the person and then pulls the knife down, 0:16:08.200 --> 0:16:11.720 creating a bigger, gaping wound. You can also have where 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:14.800 they stab into the individual and then don't pull the 0:16:14.840 --> 0:16:17.080 knife all the way out and stab again, so you 0:16:17.120 --> 0:16:20.920 get two separate wound tracks from one knife wound. Then, 0:16:20.960 --> 0:16:24.000 of course, when you have clusters of stab wounds where 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:26.880 they're stabbing over and over and over into the same 0:16:27.040 --> 0:16:30.880 kind of tight circle area, you get multiple stabs in 0:16:30.960 --> 0:16:34.960 a specific spot, and then all those wound tracks kind 0:16:35.000 --> 0:16:39.320 of go together and aggregate, basically ripping apart whatever is 0:16:39.400 --> 0:16:42.680 underneath them. And you see these a lot in especially 0:16:42.760 --> 0:16:45.960 when someone's incredibly angry at the individual that they're stabbing, 0:16:46.400 --> 0:16:50.600 and it's a term that we call overkill where they 0:16:50.640 --> 0:16:53.240 just continue to stab even though they've gone past the 0:16:53.320 --> 0:16:56.320 point of where that stab wound would have killed them, 0:16:56.640 --> 0:16:59.600 and they keep stabbing and stabbing and stabbing over and over. 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:03.520 You see this in domestic cases or intimate partner violence, 0:17:03.840 --> 0:17:06.240 and you also see it in situations like with Brian 0:17:06.359 --> 0:17:09.600 Kolberger where he just kept stabbing those individuals. 0:17:10.520 --> 0:17:14.200 Doctor Crowns, I look back at my notes and they 0:17:14.240 --> 0:17:18.359 say that there were multiple stab wounds in the chest 0:17:18.760 --> 0:17:25.679 and body, chest and body. Now, it seems to me 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:30.399 if the purpose coming into maybe they saw the husband 0:17:30.520 --> 0:17:32.760 leaving to go get the auto parts and thought, oh, 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:36.280 nobody's home. I'll go in and what take the TV 0:17:36.600 --> 0:17:40.920 or the VCR? They go in they see her. Now 0:17:40.960 --> 0:17:45.160 this is anecdotal, doctor Crowns, but in my experience, when 0:17:45.160 --> 0:17:49.320 a burglar breaks in, they see a person, they leave, 0:17:49.359 --> 0:17:52.879 they run and pray to God they don't get identified. 0:17:53.880 --> 0:17:57.719 It's very rare when a burglar, a true burglar comes 0:17:57.760 --> 0:18:01.280 in and stabs the victim and they are found. So 0:18:01.840 --> 0:18:06.680 they coming in to burgle, finding a victim at home 0:18:06.800 --> 0:18:10.520 and then taking time to kill them much less multiple 0:18:10.560 --> 0:18:14.080 stab wounds all over the body and chest. I want 0:18:14.080 --> 0:18:16.600 to hear what you make of it, and we're most 0:18:16.960 --> 0:18:19.800 likely the stab wounds are to her body. 0:18:23.320 --> 0:18:26.080 Okay, Well, again, you've shown pictures of the house. It's 0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:28.240 out in the middle of nowhere in the woods. It'd 0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:30.880 be odd for someone to be sitting out there watching 0:18:30.920 --> 0:18:33.639 and waiting for that moment to break in and steal things. 0:18:34.000 --> 0:18:37.120 I would think people would notice some unusual car out 0:18:37.119 --> 0:18:41.119 there sitting around, they pick up on it and spot it. 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:44.919 So it's a very odd situation. You're correct. Often with 0:18:45.040 --> 0:18:47.800 burglary they don't kill the individual. If they are a 0:18:47.920 --> 0:18:50.159 person's in the house, they just get out of there 0:18:50.200 --> 0:18:52.080 and run because they don't want to go to prison. 0:18:52.600 --> 0:18:55.679 But of course occasionally they do stay and kill people. 0:18:56.359 --> 0:18:58.480 But it's the use of a knife is odd to 0:18:58.560 --> 0:19:01.639 me because most of the burglars go in, they have 0:19:01.720 --> 0:19:04.280 their cheap gun or they'll beat you to death with 0:19:04.359 --> 0:19:07.560 something that's at hand, but they don't use a knife. Now, 0:19:07.680 --> 0:19:10.600 as far as stab wounds all over the body, the 0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:12.840 thing about a stab wound is you can't kill a 0:19:12.880 --> 0:19:16.240 person instantaneously with a stab wound. You don't have that 0:19:16.359 --> 0:19:19.760 kinetic energy like you have with a bullet, so the 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:23.560 person will continue to run around and try and fight back. 0:19:23.680 --> 0:19:26.400 So you'll get injuries to the hands and arms, which 0:19:26.400 --> 0:19:29.399 you are defensive wounds. Then you'll get multiple stabs at 0:19:29.440 --> 0:19:32.920 different locations of the body as the person's moving and 0:19:32.960 --> 0:19:36.399 then eventually dying. So you probably have multiple wounds to 0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:40.080 the chest, hitting lungs and heart, wounds to the abdomen, 0:19:40.160 --> 0:19:43.480 hitting the liver and the intestines. It's just difficult to 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:46.840 say how many and where they're at what exactly got hit. 0:19:47.280 --> 0:19:49.960 But all we do know is there's sharp horse injuries 0:19:50.040 --> 0:19:50.879 and she's dead. 0:19:52.680 --> 0:19:55.280 I would agree with you, doctor, because if she was 0:19:55.320 --> 0:19:58.800 stabbed in the chest, it makes more sense for the 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:01.720 other bodily stab to be on the front of the body. 0:20:01.760 --> 0:20:07.880 Such as the arms, the abdomen joining us now Carl Defasio, 0:20:08.840 --> 0:20:15.280 former NYPD detective pi at Carl Defasio private investigations in 0:20:15.680 --> 0:20:20.480 New Jersey. Carl, thank you for being with us. I'm 0:20:20.680 --> 0:20:23.600 curious about why this has been kept under wraps. You know, 0:20:23.680 --> 0:20:29.440 they went three weeks without even releasing Brooke's name. I've 0:20:29.440 --> 0:20:33.600 never heard of that. Nothing, not a zilch zero, What 0:20:33.680 --> 0:20:34.000 the hey? 0:20:34.600 --> 0:20:36.840 Yeah, Nancy, I agree with the doctor you had on 0:20:36.920 --> 0:20:39.639 previously about the conditions of the stab wounds and all that, 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:43.840 But I'm looking at this from a different perspective. Why 0:20:43.920 --> 0:20:47.520 is this any different? Why is it being handled anything 0:20:47.600 --> 0:20:51.639 different than another homicide that happens and unfortunately in this 0:20:51.720 --> 0:20:55.520 country quite often. Why are we investigating this differently? 0:20:55.680 --> 0:20:56.560 What are we missing? 0:20:57.040 --> 0:20:57.159 Right? 0:20:57.200 --> 0:20:59.840 Why an't the police doing this basically the way they 0:20:59.840 --> 0:21:03.399 do in every other celebrity or non celebrity murder. 0:21:03.560 --> 0:21:03.760 Right? 0:21:04.080 --> 0:21:06.600 What's going on? Right to your point? Why is it 0:21:06.640 --> 0:21:09.040 three weeks? Why did it take so lung to invest 0:21:09.200 --> 0:21:12.280 to interview the neighbors? What about the crime scene? Was 0:21:12.320 --> 0:21:17.040 there a weapon found? Was it a household weapon? It's 0:21:17.040 --> 0:21:22.520 a big difference between lacerations and stab wounds, and it's unfortunately, 0:21:22.680 --> 0:21:25.440 Well fortunately, I guess it's not easy to kill yourself 0:21:25.920 --> 0:21:28.520 or kill someone unless you're in a fit of rage 0:21:28.680 --> 0:21:31.280 or or professionally you know what you're doing. So I 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:34.560 don't think it's a burgley. Is there any signs of burgley? 0:21:34.600 --> 0:21:37.240 Is there any signs of break in? That's the point 0:21:37.240 --> 0:21:39.440 where I'm getting to, why is it not out there 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:42.320 that this isn't a break in? No signs of break in, 0:21:42.480 --> 0:21:44.919 no signs of this. They're not giving us anything, So 0:21:45.000 --> 0:21:49.000 that tells me they're holding something back. Now. Is it 0:21:49.040 --> 0:21:51.879 something that the family agreed upon they don't want out there? 0:21:52.080 --> 0:21:55.320 These are all speculations. On my point is on my behalf. 0:21:55.640 --> 0:21:58.240 Is it something that they don't want out there for 0:21:58.560 --> 0:22:01.919 the sake of, you know, embarrassing the family or whatever. 0:22:02.080 --> 0:22:06.119 The husband's not a person of interest or suspect nothing. 0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:07.720 Why is this any. 0:22:07.560 --> 0:22:10.399 Different than anything else. We're missing something and they know 0:22:10.440 --> 0:22:13.960 what that something is. That meme's report will speak volumes. 0:22:14.000 --> 0:22:18.400 That's that that's key to me. That is it lacerations? 0:22:18.680 --> 0:22:23.520 Was an a order punctured? Whether were there any defensive wounds? 0:22:23.520 --> 0:22:25.919 Like your previous caller said, I don't know, you know, 0:22:26.000 --> 0:22:28.919 these are things that that's report. What actually was the 0:22:28.960 --> 0:22:32.080 cause of death? Did she believe the death or did 0:22:32.119 --> 0:22:35.040 she puncture her carotid artery with the knife or did 0:22:35.119 --> 0:22:38.520 someone puncture it? You know who benefits by this girl's death? 0:22:39.320 --> 0:22:40.280 I would check everything. 0:22:40.320 --> 0:22:43.320 That's what a basic investigator does. Who's on the will, 0:22:43.400 --> 0:22:46.280 who's on the insurance, who's the last person to talk 0:22:46.320 --> 0:22:47.359 to her, who's in the house. 0:22:47.840 --> 0:22:52.920 Carl Defasia, former NYPD detective pi at Carl Defasio private 0:22:53.000 --> 0:22:56.800 investigations in New Jersey joining us tonight, doctor Bethany in 0:22:57.040 --> 0:23:02.080 a home that is surrounded by DNTs woods. I want 0:23:02.080 --> 0:23:05.320 to talk to you about the attack on her body. 0:23:05.640 --> 0:23:09.560 What does that mean when a woman victim is stabbed 0:23:09.600 --> 0:23:13.880 across her body, potentially the face, the breast, I don't 0:23:13.920 --> 0:23:14.440 know where else. 0:23:15.440 --> 0:23:19.040 Well, it's up close and personal, all right, it's usually 0:23:19.320 --> 0:23:23.200 rage or overkill. If it was a serial killer, let's 0:23:23.240 --> 0:23:26.320 just go without for a second, somebody who emerged from 0:23:26.400 --> 0:23:28.960 the woods one of those five trails that led to 0:23:29.280 --> 0:23:33.080 a meeting point behind her house, the type of killing 0:23:33.119 --> 0:23:38.199 would be very different, usually strangulation than dismemberment. 0:23:37.680 --> 0:23:38.520 Of the face. 0:23:38.760 --> 0:23:42.920 Okay, And there would have been similar incidents in nearby 0:23:42.960 --> 0:23:46.359 communities or states. Let's say the overkill is from meth, 0:23:46.520 --> 0:23:48.800 that's one of the things we frequently see and somebody 0:23:48.840 --> 0:23:52.399 wandered in. If that was the case, that person would 0:23:52.400 --> 0:23:57.520 still be in the vicinity, disorganized, easily found. What I 0:23:57.960 --> 0:24:03.320 see with this is a hazard attempt to kill somebody 0:24:03.520 --> 0:24:07.440 without much knowledge of what it takes to kill somebody. 0:24:10.359 --> 0:24:14.120 To former detective, former chief investigator, senior executive called OUDO 0:24:14.200 --> 0:24:18.520 AG's office Lisa Miller with us tonight, Lisa, I'd like 0:24:18.600 --> 0:24:21.120 to hear your thoughts on the husband's alibi. 0:24:22.000 --> 0:24:24.320 You know, on the face of this, with the reporting 0:24:24.359 --> 0:24:28.560 that he was headed off to a store, we have 0:24:28.640 --> 0:24:33.000