WEBVTT - Building Profitable Business Models w/ Sherrell Dorsey 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:07.400 Afro Tech San Francisco, California. The Shana Mirror is the 0:00:07.440 --> 0:00:11.440 founder and CEO at Maven, a distribution technology company focused 0:00:11.480 --> 0:00:15.200 on the hair extension market, partnering with stylists who served 0:00:15.240 --> 0:00:18.960 as the salesforce. He's on the main stage being interviewed 0:00:18.960 --> 0:00:23.080 by Jeff Johnson discussing the wealth opportunity black puticians were 0:00:23.079 --> 0:00:26.160 missing out on by not taking advantage of their supply chain. 0:00:26.239 --> 0:00:29.280 But I saw specifically in the in the hair extension world, 0:00:29.720 --> 0:00:32.320 and which came to me via family member who is 0:00:32.320 --> 0:00:34.600 a hair stylist, asked me if I could get her 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:37.720 some hair extensions from China, and I did. Um, And 0:00:37.800 --> 0:00:39.680 next thing, you know, just because I wanted to make 0:00:39.720 --> 0:00:41.479 some money, I'm selling hair out the trunk of the 0:00:41.479 --> 0:00:45.160 car to all these hair salons. Um. And what struck 0:00:45.240 --> 0:00:49.920 me was that we're buying like nine billion dollars of 0:00:49.960 --> 0:00:54.280 hair products, um, but we don't sell any of it 0:00:55.000 --> 0:00:58.960 right literally. Uh. The customers that go across the street 0:00:59.160 --> 0:01:02.680 to the Korean in beauty supply store by the products 0:01:02.720 --> 0:01:04.800 and then come across the street bring it to the salon. 0:01:05.280 --> 0:01:07.560 So you have all this throughput of all of this 0:01:08.000 --> 0:01:14.399 you know, uh. Um, this commerce going through these salons 0:01:14.440 --> 0:01:18.360 but not capturing any of that revenue UM. And that 0:01:18.560 --> 0:01:21.800 is fundamentally what I wanted to change. I didn't know 0:01:21.840 --> 0:01:24.560 anything about hair extensions before I got into this business. 0:01:24.600 --> 0:01:28.680 To me, it was about the distribution of these products 0:01:28.720 --> 0:01:33.840 and who is getting what proportion of the margin. And 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:35.679 let's talk about that a little bit, because because part 0:01:35.720 --> 0:01:38.080 of your business model wasn't just about you making money, 0:01:38.680 --> 0:01:42.280 you one had a value proposition for hairstyle is and 0:01:42.360 --> 0:01:45.959 two had a model for creating wealth not just for you, 0:01:46.560 --> 0:01:49.440 but for a nation of people who were being left 0:01:49.440 --> 0:01:51.560 out of the equation. Why was that important for you? 0:01:51.840 --> 0:01:54.360 And then what was the process of ensuring that? Not 0:01:54.440 --> 0:01:56.840 on the business model was tight, but you literally were 0:01:56.920 --> 0:02:01.280 ensuring a shift in wealth creation for people who performed 0:02:01.400 --> 0:02:07.280 had no access. I mean fundamentally, what I saw and 0:02:07.360 --> 0:02:09.680 what I see in hair stylus and I see in 0:02:09.720 --> 0:02:14.840 hair salons UM is power and influence. I see power 0:02:14.880 --> 0:02:20.360 and influence in hair stylus. They are UM. They're influencing 0:02:20.360 --> 0:02:25.440 on a daily basis billions of dollars of purchasing decisions 0:02:25.520 --> 0:02:29.919 for what people are gonna buy UM and and their 0:02:30.080 --> 0:02:35.880 entrepreneurial I'm an entrepreneur um. I always want to support that, 0:02:36.440 --> 0:02:39.240 and so you know, when I saw that I could 0:02:39.240 --> 0:02:44.880 both create a business that both empowered other entrepreneurs in 0:02:45.000 --> 0:02:50.600 my community and be a big gas business, that's what 0:02:50.760 --> 0:02:56.000 drew me into it. I'm with Lucas Mrs Black Tech, 0:02:56.320 --> 0:02:58.880 Green Money. I'm gonna introduce you to some of the 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:02.239 biggest names, some of the brightest minds and brilliant ideas. 0:03:02.720 --> 0:03:05.120 If you're black, in building or simply using tech to 0:03:05.120 --> 0:03:13.400 secure your back, this podcast is for you. Charelle Dorsey 0:03:13.480 --> 0:03:16.280 is the founder and CEO of The Plug and subscription 0:03:16.320 --> 0:03:20.720 based digital news and insights platform covering the black innovation economy. 0:03:21.120 --> 0:03:23.680 Prior to launching The Plug, she was a marketing manager 0:03:23.720 --> 0:03:27.440 for companies like Uber and Google Fiber. I should read 0:03:27.600 --> 0:03:31.360 about how to monetize content and starting your entrepreneurial journey 0:03:31.520 --> 0:03:34.720 with a bit of tinkering and experimentation. A lot of 0:03:34.760 --> 0:03:37.720 times we all have this really great idea for what 0:03:37.760 --> 0:03:39.600 we know is going to be like a million to 0:03:39.720 --> 0:03:42.680 billion dollar business, and I think as well, culture really 0:03:42.680 --> 0:03:45.320 pushes you to say, go out in the world and 0:03:45.360 --> 0:03:48.800 create something significant, raise a ton of money to do it, 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:52.760 and like that kind of seems you know, it's it's 0:03:52.760 --> 0:03:56.720 a very romantic ideal. Um for me, I wanted to 0:03:56.760 --> 0:03:59.000 be solid in what it was that I was creating 0:03:59.440 --> 0:04:02.800 first and kind of working through you kind of mature 0:04:02.880 --> 0:04:05.480 your idea as well as you as a as a 0:04:05.560 --> 0:04:08.640 leader and as a practitioner. You're maturing as well and 0:04:08.720 --> 0:04:11.760 kind of responding to the initial hypotheses that you have 0:04:11.960 --> 0:04:15.800 about is are are people interested in this? And so 0:04:16.200 --> 0:04:19.919 by kind of creating the plug under the guys of Hey, 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:22.640 you know, I've already kind of been freelancing and writing 0:04:22.680 --> 0:04:27.040 and sharing about what's taking shape them what we call 0:04:27.080 --> 0:04:31.040 the black tech ecosystem. Do people even want like a 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:35.279 daily edition of my findings and learnings and folks that 0:04:35.320 --> 0:04:37.960 I'm speaking to as well as um sort of a 0:04:37.960 --> 0:04:42.279 one stop shop for their day of figuring out among 0:04:42.320 --> 0:04:44.080 all the other things that they're reading that are gonna 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:47.800 center white guys and hoodies, do they actually want to 0:04:47.880 --> 0:04:51.039 see black and brown faces and voices as part of 0:04:51.040 --> 0:04:54.240 this entire narrative? And it turned out that yeah, a 0:04:54.240 --> 0:04:57.680 lot of people were really interested, and so so that 0:04:57.880 --> 0:05:00.560 kind of like as you we talk a lot about aislestones, 0:05:00.640 --> 0:05:03.159 particularly in tech or particularly in the space of building 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:06.760 a company. UM. But that kind of initial testing, you know, 0:05:06.880 --> 0:05:10.560 phase is really what you're kind of prototyping. And Eric 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:12.839 Reece says this a lot around the kind of lean 0:05:12.960 --> 0:05:17.000 startup methodology, like you're you're prototyping, you're testing. I think 0:05:17.040 --> 0:05:19.800 also it's a psychological trick, so that if you fail 0:05:19.880 --> 0:05:24.240 at it, you don't feel so correcting after her right now, 0:05:24.240 --> 0:05:27.680 I was just playing anyway, you know, And so it 0:05:27.760 --> 0:05:30.320 kind of it kind of deescalates some of the stress 0:05:30.320 --> 0:05:33.400 of feeling like you have to succeed versus this is 0:05:33.400 --> 0:05:35.840 an experiment. If it works, great, If it doesn't, all 0:05:35.839 --> 0:05:38.840 pivot and try something else. And so there's definitely been 0:05:39.080 --> 0:05:43.000 several different pivots around the way that we've delivered content, 0:05:43.120 --> 0:05:46.360 the way in which we've made assumptions about our audiences. 0:05:46.480 --> 0:05:49.479 And so for the most part, you know, going from 0:05:50.000 --> 0:05:52.880 the daily newsletter from for my part, it was just 0:05:53.040 --> 0:05:55.599 how do we stay consistent? Is there enough news and 0:05:55.640 --> 0:05:59.520 conversation happening to even do something Monday through Friday? Um? 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:01.000 And that was kind of the first question, And the 0:06:01.040 --> 0:06:05.400 second question was are people ready for rigorous, data driven 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:08.360 sort of journalism and news? Um? And I'll be honest, 0:06:08.560 --> 0:06:12.039 it's it's one of those spaces where you can kind 0:06:12.040 --> 0:06:15.560 of have kind of more of just a very information 0:06:15.680 --> 0:06:18.760 purposes sort of environment, which I think is very significant 0:06:18.760 --> 0:06:20.880 to the ecosystem. I think that, um, a lot of 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:23.720 folks do that well. Afrotech does that well. UM. And 0:06:23.880 --> 0:06:26.279 and then like, how do we differentiate ourselves as a 0:06:26.320 --> 0:06:29.080 media publication? And so for me, it was really leaning 0:06:29.120 --> 0:06:32.880 into the analytics of some of the reporting um, and 0:06:32.920 --> 0:06:36.200 then also wanting to tell a story that really responds 0:06:36.279 --> 0:06:40.000 to a question or a series of questions about what 0:06:40.080 --> 0:06:43.039 folks are building from a context of how does this, 0:06:43.200 --> 0:06:45.280 how does this fit in scope not just this one 0:06:45.400 --> 0:06:49.040 entrepreneur or this one opportunity to raise capital, but how 0:06:49.080 --> 0:06:51.440 does this fit into the larger picture about what's going 0:06:51.520 --> 0:06:54.479 on in the country, in the world in this particular frame. 0:06:54.680 --> 0:06:58.200 Even when we got into the paid membership component again, 0:06:58.360 --> 0:07:01.919 another opportunity to test for those who've been rocking with 0:07:02.000 --> 0:07:04.839 us for two three years, are they willing now to 0:07:04.960 --> 0:07:09.279 make an investment in having access to premium content? And 0:07:09.279 --> 0:07:11.600 and kind of so listening those folks early on so 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:13.680 that when we were ready to launch, and even when 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:16.720 I say ready, ready, wasn't complete tied up with the bow. 0:07:16.880 --> 0:07:20.200 It was like, you know, day one out the gate, 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:25.280 people's accounts like weren't registering. You know, you're kind of 0:07:25.320 --> 0:07:28.520 just like all right, you know, but because they've been 0:07:28.560 --> 0:07:31.600 following the work for so long, it was like a 0:07:31.680 --> 0:07:34.800 quick nice email, hey chrel like something when all my 0:07:34.960 --> 0:07:38.000 password you know, like you know, get to what you 0:07:38.040 --> 0:07:42.120 can understand. There's a ton of grace there. And so 0:07:42.400 --> 0:07:45.560 I think through that entire process, will I also try 0:07:45.680 --> 0:07:49.240 to bring people along for the journey and the ride 0:07:49.360 --> 0:07:52.760 and trying to describe and demonstrate like here's what I'm doing, 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:56.640 here's what's working, here's what's not really working, um, and 0:07:56.880 --> 0:07:59.640 just try to give myself grace in the process because 0:07:59.720 --> 0:08:02.800 it's just a process at the end of the day. Um. 0:08:02.920 --> 0:08:05.320 And and so yeah, that's that's kind of how I've 0:08:05.360 --> 0:08:08.040 thought about this the whole time. And that does not 0:08:08.120 --> 0:08:11.320 remove any stress, because you still want to have this 0:08:11.440 --> 0:08:15.080 tendency to want to deliver well and as best as possible. 0:08:15.160 --> 0:08:16.520 And they're just some things that are gonna be out 0:08:16.560 --> 0:08:18.040 of your control. There's some things you're just not going 0:08:18.120 --> 0:08:21.240 to know. And when you're first building your business sometimes 0:08:21.280 --> 0:08:25.080 it's just you and your WiFi, so you don't have 0:08:25.120 --> 0:08:28.760 a team to help create additional checks and balances or 0:08:28.920 --> 0:08:30.800 that you can lean on to do the work until 0:08:30.840 --> 0:08:34.160 you start to build up you know, those particular you 0:08:34.200 --> 0:08:37.679 know capacity opportunities. So you know, it's it's a journey. 0:08:37.800 --> 0:08:41.120 It's a journey. One of the things we talk about 0:08:41.200 --> 0:08:44.720 often is, and we mean black people, it's like we 0:08:44.760 --> 0:08:47.560 don't pigeon ourselves into like the diversity conversation of the 0:08:47.600 --> 0:08:50.720 minority types of conversations, and for instance, like at the conference, 0:08:51.040 --> 0:08:54.240 you won't see like panels on diversity per se, but 0:08:54.679 --> 0:08:57.559 there is a meaningful activity from black people in business 0:08:57.640 --> 0:09:02.200 at large and from startup creation, venture funding, innovation and 0:09:02.240 --> 0:09:04.960 more so we're out here. Talk to me about your 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:07.719 take on the need for a broader narrative other than 0:09:07.840 --> 0:09:12.600 just you know, here's the diversity metrics, etcetera. You know, 0:09:12.640 --> 0:09:14.800 I think it's I think it's great and very commendable 0:09:14.880 --> 0:09:18.400 that that's not the focus, because I think everyone could 0:09:18.520 --> 0:09:21.600 has to be exhausted with the diversity conversation. And that's 0:09:21.640 --> 0:09:24.040 not to negate the work and the practitioners that are 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:26.800 in the space. It's very much needed. But I think 0:09:26.880 --> 0:09:29.480 in terms of when we're getting together and we're talking 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:34.400 about next generation technology, next generation leadership, and we're talking 0:09:34.440 --> 0:09:37.160 about the kinds of challenges that we have to solve, 0:09:37.160 --> 0:09:40.640 particularly for our communities. We can't stay stuck on the 0:09:40.679 --> 0:09:43.959 trauma because it is traumatic. It's hard to keep telling 0:09:44.000 --> 0:09:46.880 people I'm human and I exist, and I'm smart and 0:09:46.920 --> 0:09:49.920 I have I come from a family that that has 0:09:50.000 --> 0:09:52.800 love in it, or I come from you know, a 0:09:52.880 --> 0:09:57.160 community that you know has invested everything they couldn't into 0:09:57.200 --> 0:10:01.839 getting me to this point, Like it's it's it's frustrating 0:10:01.920 --> 0:10:04.400 to write, like it's really frustrating to continue to have 0:10:04.520 --> 0:10:07.839 to define your humanity for people who clearly if you 0:10:07.880 --> 0:10:10.319 don't get it by now in it's kind of like 0:10:10.960 --> 0:10:13.680 you're not that interested. And we shouldn't have to continue 0:10:13.720 --> 0:10:17.200 to do that emotional labor, especially not with each other. Right, 0:10:17.240 --> 0:10:19.600 I think that there are definitely some critical conversations that 0:10:19.679 --> 0:10:21.800 we need to have and not just like the value 0:10:21.800 --> 0:10:26.199 of diversity, but how from a tactical perspective we can 0:10:26.240 --> 0:10:29.080 do better, Like, Hey, black men, if you see that 0:10:29.240 --> 0:10:31.800 everyone on this tech panel is just black men, and 0:10:31.840 --> 0:10:35.320 you haven't invited any women, or you haven't invited any 0:10:35.400 --> 0:10:38.480 trans women into the conversation like, that's kind of a 0:10:38.559 --> 0:10:41.240 check and balance you should probably think about. And I 0:10:41.280 --> 0:10:43.480 think we don't need to have a whole host of 0:10:43.520 --> 0:10:45.520 conversations about it. I think we need to be able 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:48.720 to say it, iterate and move on um and some 0:10:48.760 --> 0:10:50.760 people need to process, and I think they're gonna be 0:10:50.800 --> 0:10:53.600 spaces for that. But any time that we get together, 0:10:53.720 --> 0:10:57.880 I feel like we should be thinking progressively. So alongside 0:10:58.480 --> 0:11:02.880 these personality driven store retelling thing that obviously has its place. 0:11:03.160 --> 0:11:06.280 Traditionally people will go to like the Census Bureau or 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:10.760 Nielsen defined data on like black consumer habits or population makeups. 0:11:11.320 --> 0:11:15.360 What is the unique value that information coming from us, 0:11:15.400 --> 0:11:18.520 that that information comes from a source that is a 0:11:18.520 --> 0:11:23.600 member of these communities. That is the deepest question. Will 0:11:23.720 --> 0:11:27.800 um one that one that I'm sure has just a 0:11:27.800 --> 0:11:31.080 ton of different kind of responses. I think Number one, 0:11:31.240 --> 0:11:37.000 it speaks to the history of funding discrimination. Right. You 0:11:37.080 --> 0:11:41.960 can't go to any institution and not find a black 0:11:42.040 --> 0:11:46.920 PhD that has not tried to make the research and 0:11:47.000 --> 0:11:50.920 discovery of what's happening in terms of black innovation a 0:11:50.960 --> 0:11:53.760 core part of their research and their work. But they 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:56.080 did not get access to the funding that they needed 0:11:56.120 --> 0:11:58.280 because you have to prove to too many people that 0:11:58.320 --> 0:12:00.120 it matters, and a lot of people are like, oh, no, 0:12:00.320 --> 0:12:02.360 you can get it, you know in the aggregate. You 0:12:02.400 --> 0:12:05.200 don't need it on a granular level. And so there 0:12:05.200 --> 0:12:07.800 are so many folks that I've had the privilege of 0:12:07.880 --> 0:12:11.040 talking to who were all centered around this idea of 0:12:11.240 --> 0:12:15.160 better and stronger data collection. And when it does come 0:12:15.200 --> 0:12:17.920 from your community, it makes a core difference in the 0:12:17.960 --> 0:12:19.760 way that you look at it, because numbers can just 0:12:19.800 --> 0:12:22.439 look like numbers to anyone, right, we we quote numbers 0:12:22.440 --> 0:12:24.920 all the time. We don't really know how the methodology 0:12:25.120 --> 0:12:28.400 was was extracted, you know. I think it's it's the 0:12:28.480 --> 0:12:31.079 challenge with the p p P program too. I'm sure 0:12:31.120 --> 0:12:33.080 that on the onset it looked like, oh, we're gonna 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:35.560 save small businesses, but we didn't dive into well, which 0:12:35.600 --> 0:12:39.319 zip codes are we serving, you know, which particular communities 0:12:39.360 --> 0:12:42.280 are in a rule, who actually listen those communities? And 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:45.400 so then you see that what ent of most p 0:12:45.400 --> 0:12:49.160 p P lending went to majority white businesses or something 0:12:49.240 --> 0:12:51.720 like that, right, and a lot of those being affluent 0:12:51.800 --> 0:12:55.960 businesses that were not small businesses. So when it comes 0:12:56.000 --> 0:13:00.200 from us, UM, ideally right for for folks who who 0:13:00.240 --> 0:13:03.640 have some kind of understanding of doing UM sociology rooted 0:13:03.679 --> 0:13:06.960 work around black communities. When it comes from us, we're 0:13:07.040 --> 0:13:09.200 leading with that in mind, even in the way in 0:13:09.200 --> 0:13:12.560 which we interview people, even in the way in which 0:13:12.600 --> 0:13:17.680 we build relationships with communities. UM. And so I I think, 0:13:17.720 --> 0:13:20.600 of course that again that the response really warnants a 0:13:20.640 --> 0:13:24.080 look at we traditionally haven't had the resources to do 0:13:24.120 --> 0:13:27.280 our own research, and we traditionally haven't had the backing 0:13:27.320 --> 0:13:31.320 of institutions that trust us to do our own research 0:13:31.559 --> 0:13:35.240 in our own work. So yeah, I mean it's it's 0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:41.000 it's a challenge, UM, when you are deep into the 0:13:41.080 --> 0:13:43.400 numbers on a lot of these things. And I remember 0:13:43.920 --> 0:13:46.640 UM hearing an interview I don't remember who gave the interview, 0:13:46.640 --> 0:13:49.439 but they asked a black woman who raised over a 0:13:49.480 --> 0:13:51.640 million dollars, you know, you're one of the you know, 0:13:51.720 --> 0:13:54.600 less than ten black women who have raised over my knowledge, 0:13:54.600 --> 0:13:57.600 and she was like, no, there's dozens of black women 0:13:57.640 --> 0:14:01.280 who have raised over a million hours. But one of 0:14:01.320 --> 0:14:04.880 the issues with that is we don't always get that 0:14:05.000 --> 0:14:07.880 kind of data in mainstream news. So talk to me 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:11.320 about what are like the trends that you see regards 0:14:11.320 --> 0:14:16.120 to black people in their ability to be successful in technology. Yeah, 0:14:16.360 --> 0:14:20.160 I think, Um, I think at the end of the day, 0:14:20.200 --> 0:14:23.040 like there's a lot of quiet work. And I can 0:14:23.120 --> 0:14:27.400 understand because to really be great at what you do 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:31.240 and to really be invested in what you do, you 0:14:31.640 --> 0:14:34.920 aren't necessarily I mean, like all of the incredible technologies 0:14:35.000 --> 0:14:38.280 that I know that are building really dope ship. Um. 0:14:38.320 --> 0:14:43.120 I mean, they they don't have social media profiles, you know, 0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:46.960 like they're not trying to get famous. They're too busy 0:14:47.000 --> 0:14:50.320 being nerds, you know what I'm saying. Like they're like 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:53.840 building three D models on the weekends and like teaching 0:14:53.840 --> 0:14:57.160 themselves machine learning and creating deep fakes just for fun. 0:14:57.800 --> 0:15:00.320 Um and and you you'll see that lot with a 0:15:00.360 --> 0:15:03.640 lot of computer scientists. Like they just don't have those profiles. 0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:06.640 I mean, they may have what they need for work purposes, 0:15:06.680 --> 0:15:09.600 but there's not a ton of investment in these things 0:15:09.640 --> 0:15:13.040 because they're invested in the actual learning of the technology. 0:15:13.160 --> 0:15:16.880 And even though we see less representation in comparison to 0:15:16.920 --> 0:15:19.960 white populations, at the end of the day, like there 0:15:19.960 --> 0:15:22.480 are people there that exist in these spaces that are 0:15:22.520 --> 0:15:26.080 doing well, of course there has to be some infrastructure 0:15:26.160 --> 0:15:30.360 changes around when do these folks get promoted? Right? You 0:15:30.400 --> 0:15:33.120 have the CEO of of Zoos who just you know, 0:15:33.560 --> 0:15:36.520 was kind of the face of this initiative around Amazon 0:15:36.600 --> 0:15:39.600 purchasing the company for over one billion dollars, And like, 0:15:39.680 --> 0:15:42.720 my question is, like, when's the next black woman of 0:15:42.720 --> 0:15:46.880 a tech company who is going to be leading a 0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:50.680 billion dollar sale? Right? I mean, we know Stacy Brown, 0:15:50.680 --> 0:15:53.600 Philip hop from task Rabbit has recently stepped down after 0:15:53.600 --> 0:15:57.680 selling the company to Ikea, And so like, are we 0:15:57.760 --> 0:16:02.840 growing in that pipeline the next whomever? Right? Um? And 0:16:02.920 --> 0:16:05.640 so I think I think when it comes to that 0:16:05.880 --> 0:16:09.640 data conversation, because we traditionally haven't had the funding to 0:16:09.720 --> 0:16:12.760 do the extraction of that information, or we haven't even 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:16.200 just in the newsroom, have put the resources forward to 0:16:16.240 --> 0:16:19.200 make that happen, we're gonna get a lot of like 0:16:19.720 --> 0:16:23.840 misused dirty data, you know, because if only we know 0:16:23.920 --> 0:16:27.120 of twenty seven black women that raise over a million dollars, 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:30.200 that's all that we could count. But that doesn't that 0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:34.240 doesn't look historically, you know, beyond you know, beyond even 0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:38.240 just venture capital. Um, we're gonna get these faulty numbers 0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:41.160 that we quote and then we turn into like policy. Now, 0:16:41.160 --> 0:16:42.880 there's some great things that come out of it, right 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:44.880 as this rush to urgency of like, oh my gosh, 0:16:44.880 --> 0:16:47.360 only tend black women have raised X y Z. Well, 0:16:47.440 --> 0:16:49.120 let's put some more money so that we can get 0:16:49.160 --> 0:16:51.800 more and like, okay, Like that's probably one of the 0:16:51.840 --> 0:16:56.080 positive outcomes. But at the same time, I think the 0:16:56.680 --> 0:17:00.360 greater question is how do we start to dock You meant, 0:17:00.400 --> 0:17:04.960 these successes wildly, widely and frequently, how do we make 0:17:05.000 --> 0:17:06.600 this a part of the work. And I mean that's 0:17:06.640 --> 0:17:08.560 honestly what we do at the plug is like I'm 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:10.959 trying to make this a part of our practice and 0:17:11.040 --> 0:17:15.160 our work in a substantive way. And this is also 0:17:15.400 --> 0:17:19.320 it has to be the work in the in the 0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:23.359 the mission as well. For all of these think tanks 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:27.480 and all of these like Institute for Black Research, what 0:17:27.600 --> 0:17:30.480 have you, Like you have poverty institutes, which is interesting 0:17:30.520 --> 0:17:33.600 to me, but like who has like progress? I mean, 0:17:33.640 --> 0:17:37.560 obviously there's an Institute of Progressive Policy, but but like 0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:40.280 when it comes to research on black and brown communities, 0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:43.800 there aren't as many people represented. Um, I'm not sure 0:17:43.800 --> 0:17:48.280 if you listen to the NPR episode with economist Lisa D. 0:17:48.400 --> 0:17:50.639 Cook Like she's one of like I think less than 0:17:50.720 --> 0:17:55.600 ten black economists pH ds that are at institution. Oh, 0:17:55.640 --> 0:17:57.560 this has come out a couple of days ago. About 0:17:57.720 --> 0:18:01.440 the yes, I did see that. It was a couple 0:18:01.480 --> 0:18:03.439 of weeks ago. And it's just like, you know, I 0:18:03.480 --> 0:18:06.440 follow a lot of Lisa's work, and it's like even 0:18:06.480 --> 0:18:10.159 before she could even complete what she was trying to accomplish, 0:18:10.200 --> 0:18:12.439 she had to kind of go back and redocument and 0:18:12.520 --> 0:18:18.000 understand in terms of history why patents fell off and 0:18:18.080 --> 0:18:21.000 sort of that kind of Jim Crow read all of 0:18:21.040 --> 0:18:24.399 these kind of narratives and historical domestic people didn't trust 0:18:24.400 --> 0:18:29.800 the government to protect them, regardless of why. Absolutely, yeah, 0:18:29.920 --> 0:18:34.680 and so I think that, like, imagine, imagine if there 0:18:34.760 --> 0:18:40.199 are fifty times more you know, Lisa D. Cooks working 0:18:40.200 --> 0:18:43.440 in institutions and bringing this research forward. And one of 0:18:43.480 --> 0:18:47.920 the most distinctive parts of that particular episode was Lisa's 0:18:48.000 --> 0:18:51.880 publishing of this particular research should have been completed within 0:18:51.920 --> 0:18:55.320 about a year or two, and because of how systemic 0:18:55.400 --> 0:18:59.240 racism works, literally it took her I think it's said 0:18:59.280 --> 0:19:03.000 like five, six or seven years because she was dealing 0:19:03.000 --> 0:19:05.680 with all the bus around, like folks didn't want to 0:19:05.680 --> 0:19:08.679 see this stuff come to light. So even just getting 0:19:08.960 --> 0:19:11.840 basic research with the data, like sometimes the data it 0:19:11.840 --> 0:19:14.280 doesn't even matter if you've collected it well or not. 0:19:15.040 --> 0:19:18.080 The reality is like there's still are kind of these roadblocks, 0:19:18.240 --> 0:19:22.159 especially because and and why it's so significant is because 0:19:22.720 --> 0:19:27.480 you know, once this stuff is published, it's transformative, right, 0:19:27.840 --> 0:19:30.680 and like then people have to really like pay attention. 0:19:30.720 --> 0:19:32.919 How how do we get almost anything done in the 0:19:33.000 --> 0:19:36.760 last five years, particularly it pertains to black tech ecosystem 0:19:37.160 --> 0:19:40.280 is because of having to publish research to prove to 0:19:40.320 --> 0:19:43.840 the powers that be that we have been disenfranchised, we 0:19:43.960 --> 0:19:47.479 have been underfunded, we've been discriminated against. We constantly have 0:19:47.560 --> 0:19:53.080 to prove our our humanity try but you know, but 0:19:53.240 --> 0:19:55.639 like but like that's the name of the game. And 0:19:55.720 --> 0:19:58.399 it goes back to to Tony Morrison's whole thing on 0:19:58.560 --> 0:20:03.640 like the very nature of racism is distraction, Like it's 0:20:03.800 --> 0:20:05.720 if it takes you seven years to get this work 0:20:05.760 --> 0:20:09.160 done to start changing patent policies for the us UM 0:20:09.480 --> 0:20:12.399 House of Business and Business and their last their last 0:20:12.600 --> 0:20:16.320 hearing on why we need to collect data and provide 0:20:16.320 --> 0:20:23.560 more resources to black owned businesses seven years. Imagine if two, 0:20:23.680 --> 0:20:26.120 if if five years ago that was done, we could 0:20:26.119 --> 0:20:28.080 have been had this conversation, you know what I'm saying. 0:20:28.080 --> 0:20:33.359 So so I think about UM. Last year at the conference, 0:20:33.359 --> 0:20:35.920 I talked to Charles Hudson, who was a venture capitalist. 0:20:36.000 --> 0:20:40.080 I think you said, uh, precursors, And I asked Morgan 0:20:40.200 --> 0:20:42.320 the same question you know about. It was about when 0:20:42.400 --> 0:20:44.720 you're at the only one in the room. So when 0:20:44.760 --> 0:20:46.800 you go through a conference that's not like afro tech, 0:20:46.880 --> 0:20:49.560 but when you are a VC like in Charles's position, 0:20:49.560 --> 0:20:52.199 and you go to any other conference and you're like 0:20:52.240 --> 0:20:56.240 the only black VC in the room, anybody who's black 0:20:56.280 --> 0:20:58.719 that's there wants to come see you because you're the 0:20:58.760 --> 0:21:02.000 only one, and they like they're gonna get their plight right. 0:21:02.480 --> 0:21:05.240 And so I wonder, what did you see that's encouraging 0:21:05.240 --> 0:21:09.760 about the numbers of black venture capitalists who have more 0:21:09.840 --> 0:21:14.000 ability who are number one getting the jobs, but number 0:21:14.040 --> 0:21:18.439 two have more ability to fund companies from communities that 0:21:18.480 --> 0:21:23.320 look like ours. So what's encouraging about our trajectory? If 0:21:23.359 --> 0:21:26.359 there's anything encouraging about it to you? Honestly, that's what 0:21:26.440 --> 0:21:29.480 attracts me. To this space because it gives me hope. 0:21:30.200 --> 0:21:32.119 You know, it's like an amid all the tragedy, and 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:36.000 you alluded to this earlier to Will, just like there's 0:21:36.160 --> 0:21:40.119 so much happening, there's so much friction intention there's so 0:21:40.200 --> 0:21:45.240 much tragedy and death, and you know, it's like you 0:21:45.320 --> 0:21:49.680 grow up with the stories of my grandfather's from Birmingham, Alabama. 0:21:49.720 --> 0:21:52.480 He left when he was thirteen. He didn't go back 0:21:53.200 --> 0:21:56.320 to visit until maybe his eighties, and that was at 0:21:56.359 --> 0:22:01.639 the behest of like my dying um great aunt. And 0:22:01.720 --> 0:22:04.959 he doesn't talk about it. He doesn't talk about what 0:22:05.000 --> 0:22:07.239 it was like to grow up in an environment that 0:22:07.320 --> 0:22:09.480 was violent and that you know, bombed a church be 0:22:09.560 --> 0:22:12.600 four little black girls. You know what I'm saying, Like, 0:22:12.600 --> 0:22:14.840 like when you grow up with that kind of tragedy 0:22:15.040 --> 0:22:17.719 and those kind of stories and in the struggle and 0:22:18.119 --> 0:22:20.600 the books and the Baldwins and the Angelus, you know 0:22:21.000 --> 0:22:26.359 on your bookshelf, you you know what kind of a 0:22:26.440 --> 0:22:31.840 resilient space and and um foundation you have, but you're 0:22:31.880 --> 0:22:38.480 always hyper aware that struggle is imminent right especially in 0:22:38.520 --> 0:22:42.760 this country. And so for me, I mean, like I 0:22:42.880 --> 0:22:45.439 learned coding and things like that in high school in 0:22:45.480 --> 0:22:49.360 Seattle from black women engineers and my cousins who went 0:22:49.400 --> 0:22:52.919 to more House and and Clark and Spellman and you know, 0:22:52.960 --> 0:22:55.120 will come home and you know, they bought their first 0:22:55.160 --> 0:22:58.080 properties at nineteen and we're talking about wealth building and 0:22:58.080 --> 0:23:00.639 and they were black as hell, you know, and they 0:23:00.680 --> 0:23:03.400