1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:05,880 Speaker 1: Hi. This is Laura Vandercamp. I'm a mother of five, 2 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: an author, journalist, and speaker. And this is Sarah Hartunger. 3 00:00:10,480 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: I'm a mother of three, a practicing physician and blogger. 4 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 1: On the side, we are two working parents who love 5 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,320 Speaker 1: our careers and our families. Welcome to best of both worlds. 6 00:00:19,600 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: Here we talk about how real women manage work, family, 7 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 1: and time for fun, from figuring out childcare to mapping 8 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 1: out long term career goals. We want you to get 9 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:34,000 Speaker 1: the most out of life. Welcome to best of both worlds. 10 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: This is Laura. This is episode two hundred and twenty six, 11 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:39,320 Speaker 1: which is airing at the end of November of twenty 12 00:00:39,360 --> 00:00:42,960 Speaker 1: twenty one. Sarah is going to be interviewing Heidi Murkoff, 13 00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:46,239 Speaker 1: who many people know from the very popular What to 14 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:51,040 Speaker 1: Expect when You're Expecting book series, both about pregnancy, about 15 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:54,640 Speaker 1: the first year or two about trying to conceive. There 16 00:00:54,680 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 1: are titles that cover the whole range now but definitely 17 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 1: an iconic figure in child bearing and rearing. So we're 18 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 1: very excited to hear what they're going to talk about. So, Sarah, 19 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:09,319 Speaker 1: did you read a lot of books when you were 20 00:01:09,520 --> 00:01:12,320 Speaker 1: pregnant about what to Expect, even if you, I mean, 21 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 1: we probably read what to Expect, but other than what 22 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,640 Speaker 1: to Expect as well, Yes, totally read that. One read 23 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:20,160 Speaker 1: a lot of the standard ones. I think there was 24 00:01:20,200 --> 00:01:22,240 Speaker 1: one that was like your Baby's First Year, and it 25 00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 1: like goes in month by month. I think I was 26 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:27,840 Speaker 1: a little more into the baby books than the pregnancy books, 27 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:31,319 Speaker 1: but I certainly read both. And the most memorable book 28 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:33,120 Speaker 1: I read, like the one that stands out to me, 29 00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:35,760 Speaker 1: like I vividly remember turning the pages and devouring the 30 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:41,120 Speaker 1: content was bringing up Bibe, the book about like raising 31 00:01:41,160 --> 00:01:45,440 Speaker 1: your child like French parents do, which is so hilarious 32 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:48,920 Speaker 1: in retrospect because I don't think my style of child 33 00:01:49,000 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 1: rearing has any parrels. And I'm not saying that's good 34 00:01:53,320 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 1: or bad. I'm just saying, like I certainly did not 35 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:59,440 Speaker 1: hit the marks that were outlined in that book. I 36 00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:02,760 Speaker 1: should read the thing again. Law Yeah, I don't know. 37 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:06,480 Speaker 1: I'm I'm not generally prone to reading a whole lot 38 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:09,799 Speaker 1: of parenting books. I think Michael bought some of the 39 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:12,720 Speaker 1: baby books and read through them. We have a copy 40 00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 1: of a you know, the American Pediatrics Association Guide to 41 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:21,040 Speaker 1: Your Baby's first year, which occasionally some of the stuff 42 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:26,880 Speaker 1: was was helpful, like, for instance, that babies stop pooping 43 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:30,800 Speaker 1: frequently at some point, and if you haven't been around 44 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 1: a whole lot of babies, I mean I had baby 45 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 1: said a lot, so I just had some familiarity with 46 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:37,959 Speaker 1: with all of this. But you know, they go from 47 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 1: from pooping like constantly to then not, and a lot 48 00:02:41,440 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: of people assume that something went horribly wrong or there. 49 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 1: You know, babies like terribly constipated and go through all 50 00:02:46,720 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 1: this stuff to like try to get them to it's 51 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:51,240 Speaker 1: like no, they just you know, go from like multiple 52 00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:53,639 Speaker 1: times a day to like two three times a week 53 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 1: or something, and it's just like a huge sudden change 54 00:02:57,040 --> 00:02:59,800 Speaker 1: for many babies and it's nothing went wrong. It's just 55 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:03,639 Speaker 1: their GI system just changed them. So something like that 56 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:07,680 Speaker 1: might be helpful to know. But yes, yeah, so fun fact, 57 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 1: in many pediatrics residency programs, including ours, and I can 58 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:13,960 Speaker 1: give myself a tiny bit of credit for this, we 59 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:16,520 Speaker 1: actually offer a month of elective credit if you have 60 00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:18,919 Speaker 1: a baby, where you just learn about your own baby 61 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:21,280 Speaker 1: and all these kind of parenting stuff. Common questions that 62 00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:23,760 Speaker 1: you're going to be asked because truthfully, the experience of 63 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 1: parenting and all those things that you're going to look 64 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 1: up are things that you're going to need to know 65 00:03:27,840 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: for your clinical practice later. So yeah, it's like it's 66 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:34,360 Speaker 1: like a mini course in pediatrics. And sometimes those books 67 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: can help you along and sometimes when it's your fifth kid, 68 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 1: you probably would have just recognized that that's what happens, 69 00:03:40,440 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 1: just what happens. Yeah, yeah, I know, So that's uh, definitely, 70 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:47,480 Speaker 1: you know. And the funny thing about I mean, I know, 71 00:03:47,560 --> 00:03:50,280 Speaker 1: parenting books are very popular. It's fun to you know, 72 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:53,480 Speaker 1: get parenting tricks and hacks and things like that, But 73 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:55,760 Speaker 1: I mean, so much is about if by the time 74 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 1: you're reading a parenting book, you care about your kids 75 00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:02,240 Speaker 1: like you care about doing a good job, which means 76 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,360 Speaker 1: that your kids are most likely going to do great, 77 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:08,280 Speaker 1: like you know, anything that was within your control, you're 78 00:04:08,360 --> 00:04:10,360 Speaker 1: you're working on. And so you know, while there may 79 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:12,680 Speaker 1: be theories that are helpful for day to day life 80 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:16,480 Speaker 1: and management, you know, it's probably not what's going to 81 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 1: separate from your child being a total delinquent to being 82 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,240 Speaker 1: you know, a rock star. It's not that it was 83 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: something you read read in a book and decided to try. 84 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:28,440 Speaker 1: But you know, like I said, there can be good 85 00:04:28,480 --> 00:04:34,960 Speaker 1: hacks in terms of how to help encourage happiness about homework. 86 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:38,600 Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe I don't know anyone's come up 87 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 1: with that one. If you have, let me know, because yes, 88 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:44,719 Speaker 1: that'll be a future guest because I'm still working on that. See. Yeah, 89 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:46,560 Speaker 1: well and in our family. I mean, I'm saying a 90 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: lot of stuff is just like you have to learn 91 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:52,160 Speaker 1: from your own experience that all you know, you've coasted 92 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:54,160 Speaker 1: through school for a certain amount of time. You get 93 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:56,720 Speaker 1: to classes that are harder as you get higher up 94 00:04:56,760 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 1: in school, and then you have to learn how to study. 95 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:02,479 Speaker 1: And it probably isn't helpful to have mom telling you 96 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:04,520 Speaker 1: how to study because you think anything that mom's telling 97 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:06,960 Speaker 1: you is stupid and wrong. But when you figure it 98 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:10,520 Speaker 1: out on your own, then it works. So the question 99 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:13,039 Speaker 1: we can ask Heidi is also like, I think she 100 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:15,000 Speaker 1: does have some books for older kids, so maybe she 101 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 1: can give us some recommendations there, Yeah, exactly. All right, Well, 102 00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 1: let's hear what Heidi has to say. All right, I 103 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 1: am here with Heidi Markoff. I am so excited to 104 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:29,200 Speaker 1: introduce her to you. She is the author of the 105 00:05:29,560 --> 00:05:33,480 Speaker 1: iconic series of books What To expect, and Heidi go 106 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 1: ahead and introduce herself to our audience. Hey, I'm Heidi. 107 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 1: I'm a mom of two. I am also a grandmother 108 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: of two. I don't know when that happened, very suddenly, 109 00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: very suddenly. All I can say is, don't blank. Whatever 110 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:54,880 Speaker 1: you do, don't blank. So yeah, I'm all about what 111 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 1: to expect, a lot of what to expect things, what 112 00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 1: to expect dot com, what to expect, books, what to 113 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:07,680 Speaker 1: expect project. So yeah, happy to be here and I 114 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:10,680 Speaker 1: want to hear all about those. But let's take a 115 00:06:10,680 --> 00:06:13,800 Speaker 1: deep dive into the past. When you were writing your 116 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 1: very first book, can you tell our listeners, like a 117 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:20,400 Speaker 1: little bit about the story of how that came to be? Well, 118 00:06:20,880 --> 00:06:26,200 Speaker 1: funny story. I got knocked up, so what's you know? 119 00:06:26,279 --> 00:06:30,960 Speaker 1: We didn't see that coming. That tells you how clueless 120 00:06:30,960 --> 00:06:34,040 Speaker 1: I was at the time. But yeah, we got married 121 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:38,160 Speaker 1: three months later. Oops, I was pregnant. I ran out 122 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:41,719 Speaker 1: to the bookstore tried to find some books. There were 123 00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 1: a couple, but they didn't answer my questions, and I 124 00:06:45,640 --> 00:06:49,040 Speaker 1: found them uniformly terrifying. And yes, they hadn't been written 125 00:06:49,040 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 1: by anyone who had been pregnant before, so true story. 126 00:06:55,080 --> 00:06:58,880 Speaker 1: Two hours before I went into labor with Emma, I 127 00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:01,839 Speaker 1: delivered a for a book that would become What to 128 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 1: Expect when You're Expecting. So it was a very busy day, 129 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:10,600 Speaker 1: productive but busy, and I gave birth to Emma and 130 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:14,040 Speaker 1: What to Expect all within the space of those twenty 131 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 1: four hours. That is amazing. So how did you? How 132 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 1: did so? Then you had to write your book while 133 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 1: you had this new war, and how did that go? 134 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 1: I did so. I'm not quite sure how I did that. 135 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:31,280 Speaker 1: In retrospect, if I look back on it, it seems implausible. 136 00:07:31,360 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 1: But I did a lot of breastfeeding I was writing. 137 00:07:36,160 --> 00:07:39,040 Speaker 1: I probably breasted better around the clock just so that 138 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:43,840 Speaker 1: I could get some writing done. And but you know 139 00:07:44,120 --> 00:07:47,800 Speaker 1: the thing is, it wasn't about writing a book, writing 140 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:51,640 Speaker 1: a bestseller, becoming, you know, starting a brand, nothing about that. 141 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: It was just that I was a mom and a 142 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:58,000 Speaker 1: mission and the mission was to help other parents sleep 143 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 1: better at night than we had. And I figured if 144 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 1: a couple of parents read the book slept better at night, 145 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:07,640 Speaker 1: I would have accomplished what I set out to do. 146 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 1: So it's been a labor of look and the mission 147 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:17,520 Speaker 1: hasn't changed at all. It's just grown a lot, has 148 00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:20,440 Speaker 1: grown a lot. Yes, what do you think it is 149 00:08:20,480 --> 00:08:22,800 Speaker 1: about your writing and your book other than the fact 150 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 1: that you actually had a uterus and had a baby 151 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:27,960 Speaker 1: and we're writing from experience. Do you think that's why 152 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 1: it resonated or do you think there was also something 153 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:32,200 Speaker 1: else about the content you put out, like was it 154 00:08:32,240 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 1: more real? I know you're into TMI. It's like there 155 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: is no TMI with you, which is a good no TMI. No. 156 00:08:39,360 --> 00:08:41,040 Speaker 1: In fact, all you have to do is check my 157 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:44,120 Speaker 1: messages on Instagram and you will know there is no 158 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:47,480 Speaker 1: such thing as TMI. People write to me with everything, 159 00:08:47,520 --> 00:08:51,280 Speaker 1: and I answer every question I get. But I feel like, yes, 160 00:08:51,520 --> 00:08:54,319 Speaker 1: you have to put yourself in a pregnant woman's shoes 161 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:59,040 Speaker 1: or her uterus, you know, and know that her shoes 162 00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:01,920 Speaker 1: don't fit because her feet scholen. So yeah, I had 163 00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:04,640 Speaker 1: a slightly used uterus at the time. But I think 164 00:09:04,679 --> 00:09:08,760 Speaker 1: that was really helpful, not because I was writing from 165 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:13,360 Speaker 1: my own experience, because every pregnancy is different, every mom 166 00:09:13,440 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 1: is different, every woman is different, every baby is different, 167 00:09:17,320 --> 00:09:22,000 Speaker 1: every family is different. So your own personal experience will 168 00:09:22,040 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 1: only get you so far because you can expect everybody 169 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:29,040 Speaker 1: else's experience is to be somewhat different. But it's having 170 00:09:29,360 --> 00:09:34,840 Speaker 1: perspective and empathy that I think matters the most, plus 171 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 1: just information that's easy to read, fun to read, hopefully, 172 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:44,920 Speaker 1: because if you can't laugh about pregnancy and being a parent, 173 00:09:45,320 --> 00:09:48,040 Speaker 1: you're kind of screwed right from the start, right you 174 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:50,720 Speaker 1: really have to be able to laugh at it, but 175 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:54,680 Speaker 1: also to hold hold parents' hands as they go through 176 00:09:54,720 --> 00:10:01,040 Speaker 1: this very exciting yet very terrifying experience. And it can 177 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:06,920 Speaker 1: be terrifying and exciting in the same breath. So I 178 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:11,080 Speaker 1: think having that perspective helps a lot, but also having 179 00:10:11,160 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 1: information that's accurate, that you can trust, it's easy to read, 180 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:19,000 Speaker 1: and it's funny because when What to Expect first came 181 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:23,920 Speaker 1: out in what nineteen eighty five, you know, it was 182 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:29,280 Speaker 1: way back in the day, the first edition, and I 183 00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:31,679 Speaker 1: went to an ACAP conference with my posher and they 184 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:36,000 Speaker 1: were giving out books and I literally heard two older 185 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:39,680 Speaker 1: men walking by the booth saying, what do women know 186 00:10:39,760 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 1: about pregnancy? I am not kidding. You can't make this 187 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:47,200 Speaker 1: stuff up. So that tells you a lot. How you 188 00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:51,520 Speaker 1: know about where we have come since that moment, in 189 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:56,440 Speaker 1: that this has become an experience that we own more 190 00:10:56,520 --> 00:10:59,840 Speaker 1: so than we used to that we're empowered about. That's 191 00:10:59,840 --> 00:11:02,920 Speaker 1: the whole point of What to Expect is to empower 192 00:11:03,800 --> 00:11:06,800 Speaker 1: parents as they go, and you know, the best way 193 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 1: to empower them is with knowledge. Knowledge is power, especially 194 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:12,559 Speaker 1: empowering when you're pregnant or you have a new baby 195 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:14,480 Speaker 1: who won't stop crying in the middle of the night. 196 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: So your daughter, who was just a baby when you 197 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:21,679 Speaker 1: were attending that conference and when you were writing that book, 198 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: is now a full grown adult with a baby of 199 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:28,680 Speaker 1: her own, is that correct? Actually she has two of them. 200 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 1: And if you look at the fifth edition of What 201 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:35,840 Speaker 1: to Expect When You're Expecting, you'll see her picture on 202 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:39,440 Speaker 1: the cover. So it has come full circle in every 203 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:44,120 Speaker 1: way possible. In fact, Lennox, who is her first baby's 204 00:11:44,240 --> 00:11:46,360 Speaker 1: on the cover of What to Expect the first year 205 00:11:47,520 --> 00:11:50,560 Speaker 1: when he was an eight month old and now he's 206 00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 1: eight years old, which is crazy, And Emma is older 207 00:11:55,320 --> 00:12:00,880 Speaker 1: than I am, so awkward for everybody. For funny, because 208 00:12:01,120 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 1: she did inspire what to Expect just by being in 209 00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 1: the right uterus at the right time. But of fun 210 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:11,480 Speaker 1: fact about Emma said, she doesn't listen to any of 211 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 1: my advice because I'm her mom, right, So who listens 212 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 1: to their mom? Like I sure didn't. But she she 213 00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:24,840 Speaker 1: talks a good game, she's she's amazing, and we've got 214 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:30,040 Speaker 1: to she's got to Sebbian and Lennox. Oh, that's amazing. 215 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 1: And you do have a podcast together, now, is that right? 216 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:38,760 Speaker 1: We do where we agree to disagree a lot, what 217 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:41,280 Speaker 1: to expect. Give me, give me some examples. I want 218 00:12:41,280 --> 00:12:44,839 Speaker 1: to hear some juicy, some juicy disagreements. It's funny that 219 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:50,520 Speaker 1: you actually she actually normally what happens is she asked 220 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:55,680 Speaker 1: for my advice, does the opposite, and then says, I 221 00:12:55,840 --> 00:12:58,679 Speaker 1: wish I had listened to your advice in the first place. 222 00:12:59,000 --> 00:13:03,400 Speaker 1: So yeah, it works out really well. So maybe I 223 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 1: told her to do her keegals and she said, mom, 224 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,720 Speaker 1: you're so embarrassing, and then on social media announced that 225 00:13:10,800 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 1: she should have done her keegels for obvious reasons. So yeah, 226 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 1: things like that, like not putting Lennox down for naps 227 00:13:18,400 --> 00:13:21,920 Speaker 1: and said, you know, letting him sleep on her until 228 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:24,120 Speaker 1: he was like two and a half, things like that, 229 00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:26,440 Speaker 1: and then she was like, why did I not listen 230 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:30,640 Speaker 1: to you? But you got to figure things out for 231 00:13:30,679 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 1: yourself and really when it comes down to it, there's 232 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:38,880 Speaker 1: no one right way to be a parent. And you know, 233 00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 1: with the exception of keeping your child healthy and safe, 234 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:47,160 Speaker 1: which she has done twice, they are both survivors of 235 00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:51,400 Speaker 1: her parenting. No I'm kidding. And yet you know, if 236 00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 1: you do that and love your child unconditionally, which of 237 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:58,199 Speaker 1: course she does, then you're a successful parent. And that's 238 00:13:58,240 --> 00:13:59,960 Speaker 1: what I tell parents all the time. There are lots 239 00:13:59,960 --> 00:14:02,679 Speaker 1: of good ways to do a good parent. You have 240 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:06,440 Speaker 1: to listen to that little voice inside you. And I 241 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:09,960 Speaker 1: think that that kind of like, hey, the most important 242 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:12,000 Speaker 1: part is the health and safety. And here's a bunch 243 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 1: of ideas, but it's going to be okay. Is kind 244 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 1: of the essence of some of your books, and I 245 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:21,680 Speaker 1: think what people really like about them. Yes, because this 246 00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:27,560 Speaker 1: is about supporting parents, not judging them. As you know, 247 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 1: we do a lot of judging a fellow mom's and 248 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:35,080 Speaker 1: we shouldn't because we all need each other. We're all 249 00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 1: in this together, literally, and we're never in a place 250 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:42,920 Speaker 1: where I think it probably SEMs from the fact that 251 00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: women in general, because I notice the dads don't do this. 252 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,640 Speaker 1: They can be super supportive of each other, but they 253 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:55,360 Speaker 1: they really don't judge each other's choices or parenting philosophies. 254 00:14:56,040 --> 00:15:00,040 Speaker 1: We women tend to judge ourselves so harshly, and I 255 00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:03,920 Speaker 1: that's why, you know, because we judge ourselves and we 256 00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 1: find it, you know, somehow easy to judge one another. 257 00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:12,120 Speaker 1: But in fact, it should all be about supporting one 258 00:15:12,160 --> 00:15:16,720 Speaker 1: another because you'll need that. I wonder if some of 259 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: that judgment comes from a place of like, am I 260 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 1: doing this right? Well? If that's the wrong way, then 261 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:24,520 Speaker 1: I guess I feel better at myself about myself because 262 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 1: it's the right way for hers. And there are so 263 00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: many different parenting philosophies, so many different camps. But it's 264 00:15:31,680 --> 00:15:35,200 Speaker 1: not necessarily about being in a camp and picking a camp. 265 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:39,080 Speaker 1: It's about doing what feels right for you and for 266 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: your baby, for your body, whether it's getting an epidural 267 00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:49,040 Speaker 1: or not, whether it's breastfeeding for tea years or just 268 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:54,440 Speaker 1: breastfeeding for two weeks, whatever you know works. Here's all 269 00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:57,560 Speaker 1: the information, here's all the tips, and you pick and 270 00:15:57,680 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 1: choose what works for you. And what works for you. 271 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:04,840 Speaker 1: Is it necessarily going to work for the mom on 272 00:16:04,880 --> 00:16:08,000 Speaker 1: your message boards, or the mom down the street, or 273 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 1: a mom around the world. Or a Mike might not 274 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:13,480 Speaker 1: even work for you for your next kid. Well that's 275 00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: and it might not even work for you on the 276 00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 1: same kid day to day or from warning to afternoon. 277 00:16:21,720 --> 00:16:23,720 Speaker 1: You know, there's got to be a lot of flexibility 278 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:26,440 Speaker 1: and a sense of humor built into the whole process. 279 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:30,320 Speaker 1: But not judging yourself and not judging others. That's the 280 00:16:30,360 --> 00:16:35,200 Speaker 1: fundamental foundation of what to expect. I love that. Are 281 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:37,640 Speaker 1: we going to take a very quick ad break and 282 00:16:37,680 --> 00:16:53,680 Speaker 1: then we'll be right back. Okay, we are back, and 283 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:55,800 Speaker 1: I want to ask you about a topic that I 284 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:58,600 Speaker 1: saw on your podcast recently that I think would resonate 285 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 1: with our listeners, and that's about mom guilt. Oh, tell 286 00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:06,399 Speaker 1: me about that episode. How it went. I'm so curious. 287 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 1: I think, get to listen to it in its entirety. 288 00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:10,280 Speaker 1: So want I want the click notes, and I want 289 00:17:10,280 --> 00:17:13,879 Speaker 1: your thoughts on the whole topic. Well, you know, guilt 290 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:17,440 Speaker 1: comes with the territory. It's sort of in our job description. 291 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:21,800 Speaker 1: I think it's impossible to avoid altogether. And there are 292 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:24,600 Speaker 1: good things about guilt, like it really keeps you on 293 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 1: your toes. It gets you to look at what you've 294 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:32,119 Speaker 1: been doing and see, well, can I do better, that's fine, 295 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:36,719 Speaker 1: But when it becomes all consuming or it keeps you 296 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:42,479 Speaker 1: from enjoying the journey, then it's way too much. Or 297 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:46,360 Speaker 1: when it turns get turns around and is directed at others, 298 00:17:47,080 --> 00:17:49,880 Speaker 1: so we tend to feel guilty, but then we also 299 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 1: tend to shift guilt onto other people. Hey, listen, it's 300 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:58,920 Speaker 1: been passed from generation to generation, mom to daughter, daughter 301 00:17:59,040 --> 00:18:03,800 Speaker 1: to daughter and so on, and you know it's inevitable 302 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:08,000 Speaker 1: to a certain extent, but you have to cut yourself 303 00:18:08,040 --> 00:18:13,440 Speaker 1: a lot of slack. There are so many expectations, unrealistic 304 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 1: expectations put on moms these days, by social media, by influencers, 305 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 1: and it's really hard to live up to. But you've 306 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,480 Speaker 1: got to remember, you're the best mom for your baby, 307 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:32,159 Speaker 1: and you know that's something you can't let go of. 308 00:18:32,960 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 1: You're the best mom your baby ever had. I mean, 309 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:39,680 Speaker 1: it's true, but that's how you You're not going to 310 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 1: avoid all the guilt, but it is important to put 311 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 1: it in perspective and cut yourself a whole lot of 312 00:18:46,359 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 1: slack because this is hard. Growing a baby is hard, 313 00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:52,960 Speaker 1: Being a mom is hard, and it's only become harder 314 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:56,760 Speaker 1: over the generations. I mean, here we have you know, 315 00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:01,639 Speaker 1: we're juggling babies and careers in school and so many 316 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:08,040 Speaker 1: things that perhaps our grandmothers didn't have to juggle, So 317 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:10,159 Speaker 1: it's a lot more demanding. And then we have the 318 00:19:10,680 --> 00:19:14,520 Speaker 1: unrealistic expectations that are placed on us and that we 319 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:19,480 Speaker 1: place on ourselves. So yeah, too much of a good 320 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:24,439 Speaker 1: thing sometimes, Yeah, yeah, I think that a lot of 321 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:26,959 Speaker 1: that resonated with me and I'm sure will resonate with 322 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:30,680 Speaker 1: our listeners about you know, the highlight reels that we view, 323 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:34,480 Speaker 1: and then how we might choose to or just subconsciously 324 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 1: judge ourselves based on what we see is what's supposed 325 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 1: to be happening when your point before about like your 326 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:43,160 Speaker 1: main job is to make sure your kids are loved 327 00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:45,359 Speaker 1: and safe. Like none of that has to do with 328 00:19:45,440 --> 00:19:50,440 Speaker 1: matching outfits in Instagram pictures exactly, And those matching outfits 329 00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:53,399 Speaker 1: we're gonna have split up all over them anyway, So 330 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:57,400 Speaker 1: it's kind of pointless from the get go. But yeah, 331 00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:00,640 Speaker 1: I mean, the expectation that we can do it all 332 00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:04,800 Speaker 1: and do it all, well, it's just I'm not buying that. 333 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: It's not possible, and so you have to prioritize what 334 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:13,320 Speaker 1: really matters and your mental health matters. We don't put 335 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 1: enough emphasis on how mom feels after she gives birth 336 00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:23,840 Speaker 1: and her her mental health impacts you know, her recovery 337 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:28,800 Speaker 1: but also impacts her baby, and so we have to 338 00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:34,639 Speaker 1: you know, but making those kinds of that kind of 339 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:39,720 Speaker 1: support system available for every mom is super important as well. Absolutely, 340 00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:43,280 Speaker 1: And I know your books contain sections specifically, and I 341 00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:46,199 Speaker 1: remember that on addressing mental health after the birth and 342 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,800 Speaker 1: making that just an important part of the recovery process 343 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:52,320 Speaker 1: and before the birth as well. By the way, because 344 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:56,360 Speaker 1: you know we have postpart and depression. We don't think 345 00:20:56,400 --> 00:21:01,640 Speaker 1: about pregnancy mood disorders as much, but they exists as 346 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:06,239 Speaker 1: mood disorders do in the general population. It's just that 347 00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:09,640 Speaker 1: those kinds of conditions put you a greater risk postpartum 348 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:13,119 Speaker 1: but also during pregnancy. And it's not limited to depression. 349 00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:18,840 Speaker 1: There's anxiety disorder. There's even PTSD if you've had a 350 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:24,600 Speaker 1: previous traumatic pregnancy or a very complicated one oh CD. 351 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 1: There's lots of ways that it can manifest. But the 352 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,120 Speaker 1: one thing that you need to know is sometimes being 353 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 1: strong means asking for help, and we can all do 354 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:37,680 Speaker 1: that for each other. We must, We have to it's 355 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,879 Speaker 1: really important. So I think that kind of reminds me 356 00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:44,600 Speaker 1: of some of the outreach work that you're doing to 357 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:48,160 Speaker 1: help moms learn these very important things and pay attention 358 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,600 Speaker 1: to these very important topics. Can you tell our listeners 359 00:21:51,640 --> 00:21:53,960 Speaker 1: about the What to Expect Project and your work in 360 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:58,880 Speaker 1: that realm? Well, we actually the epiphany for the project 361 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:02,520 Speaker 1: came about when I I, way way way back, when 362 00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:06,240 Speaker 1: I was invited to do a kind of Q and 363 00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:09,760 Speaker 1: a session meet and greet with pregnant inmates at Riker's 364 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:14,240 Speaker 1: Island Prison. And the first thing I went in not 365 00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:18,760 Speaker 1: knowing what to expect broom. But I walked in and 366 00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:22,639 Speaker 1: you know, brought books with me, and what sort of 367 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:26,560 Speaker 1: the light bulb went off that every mom wants the 368 00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:30,520 Speaker 1: best for a baby. Every mom, no matter what her challenges, 369 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:35,920 Speaker 1: her circumstances, wants her baby to be healthy and nurtured 370 00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 1: and have a healthy future. And so with that, I 371 00:22:40,920 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 1: realized that a lot of moms weren't getting the basic 372 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:47,639 Speaker 1: information that they needed to have a healthy pregnancy or 373 00:22:47,680 --> 00:22:51,280 Speaker 1: the support because really, you can't be an effective nurture 374 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:57,920 Speaker 1: unless someone nurtures you body and mind. So we started 375 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 1: a program called Basics, which is a pregnancy guy that 376 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,719 Speaker 1: we've given away about a million copies in English and 377 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 1: Spanish and Chinese for women who couldn't afford a book 378 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:14,959 Speaker 1: and who didn't necessarily have the literacy skills necessary to 379 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:17,639 Speaker 1: read a book like What to Expect. So that was 380 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:20,280 Speaker 1: the first thing. We do a program with a Military 381 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:25,159 Speaker 1: Special Delivery where I host baby showers around the world 382 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 1: for military moms, so about probably so far three hundred 383 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:35,800 Speaker 1: baby showers and places from Korea, Japan, Kansas, Alaska. And 384 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:39,920 Speaker 1: that's really special because these moms are so far from 385 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:43,800 Speaker 1: their family and friends and their network of support. They 386 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 1: need that support and to serve that support, but there's 387 00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: a fundamental lack of awareness of what military moms go through. 388 00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:57,000 Speaker 1: So that's Special Delivery. We have a program in Bangladesh 389 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:02,200 Speaker 1: and Liberia, and we're starting when in Nigeria a basics 390 00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 1: program as well. Because we've traveled to South Sudan a 391 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:11,440 Speaker 1: couple of times, to Sierra Leone, to Bangladesh and India. 392 00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:19,639 Speaker 1: Refugee camps were Syrian refugee Somali refugee camps, and again, 393 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 1: motherhood is the ultimate sisterhood. No matter where I go 394 00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:27,240 Speaker 1: in the world and no matter how many hugs I give, 395 00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 1: and you know, for me, hugs are the universal language. 396 00:24:31,359 --> 00:24:34,720 Speaker 1: But everyone wants a healthy future for a baby, and 397 00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:38,120 Speaker 1: I feel like it's up to us to help her 398 00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:43,200 Speaker 1: provide that nurture the nurtures of the world. That's amazing. 399 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:45,639 Speaker 1: I was just struck by the idea that, like, there 400 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:47,960 Speaker 1: are some questions that you probably get that are like 401 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,000 Speaker 1: the same, like, no matter who it is, they're asking 402 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 1: completely and that Yeah, when I went to Rikers Island 403 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:58,760 Speaker 1: and spoke to those pregnant women who were inmates, I 404 00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:02,320 Speaker 1: got the question, you know, so I have a toothache, 405 00:25:02,480 --> 00:25:04,200 Speaker 1: is it's safe to go to the clinic to get 406 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 1: an X ray? And I think our assumption is always, 407 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:11,919 Speaker 1: unfortunately in our society, is that moms who you know 408 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,359 Speaker 1: end up in prison, well they had it coming, or 409 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 1: they don't care about their babies. No, there are harsh 410 00:25:17,359 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 1: realities in this world that we can't judge because we 411 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:25,920 Speaker 1: don't ourselves face them. The same thing in a refugee camp, 412 00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:29,080 Speaker 1: I hear this. I was sitting there on the floor 413 00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:33,439 Speaker 1: with a bunch of Syrian refugee moms who wanted birth 414 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:38,720 Speaker 1: control so badly, but it was taboo and their culture 415 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,000 Speaker 1: so they needed the mean I see this all over 416 00:25:42,000 --> 00:25:44,360 Speaker 1: the world, but they needed the permission of their partner. 417 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,000 Speaker 1: And we were talking about different forms of birth control 418 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 1: and passing around an IUD. And again, knowledge is power. 419 00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 1: It's incredibly powerful to these women who have not been empowered. 420 00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:02,680 Speaker 1: So to take control of their reproductive life and their 421 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:05,959 Speaker 1: health and their family self is what it's all about. 422 00:26:06,640 --> 00:26:08,879 Speaker 1: But I do hear the same questions. And I in 423 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:14,840 Speaker 1: a little village in sarah Leone, they brought mothers from 424 00:26:14,880 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: all over the surrounding villages. They meet under a tree. 425 00:26:18,760 --> 00:26:22,440 Speaker 1: That's their clinic is under the biggest tree in the village, 426 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:26,200 Speaker 1: and all these moms gathered around with their babies. And yes, 427 00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:31,879 Speaker 1: they asked exact same questions. Because we are in this 428 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:36,280 Speaker 1: boat together, you know, we do face as different as 429 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 1: our challenges are, you know, our goals are the same. 430 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:46,639 Speaker 1: Healthy happy baby, healthy happy mom exactly, and that's our mission. 431 00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:50,119 Speaker 1: That's amazing. That is so cool that you're able to 432 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,119 Speaker 1: spread all this knowledge and that you've been able to 433 00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:55,200 Speaker 1: bring it to these communities. And I love the idea 434 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,760 Speaker 1: of like a basics book, because it's true. Just handing 435 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 1: out copies of your book would have been easier, but 436 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:03,639 Speaker 1: to make a version to try to make it as 437 00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:07,399 Speaker 1: accessible as possible is a really great idea. Accessible and 438 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:11,280 Speaker 1: also that you know, the realities of your health care 439 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:15,920 Speaker 1: may be completely different. You're working a system that those 440 00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:19,479 Speaker 1: who are privately ensured don't have to work. Makes it 441 00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:23,960 Speaker 1: very complicated. So there's a lot of a lot of 442 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:26,320 Speaker 1: things that don't necessarily apply, a lot of things that 443 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:30,479 Speaker 1: do apply. Access to good nutrition, it's not a given, 444 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:33,800 Speaker 1: it's not you know, you may not have well you 445 00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,280 Speaker 1: certainly can't afford and you probably don't have the whole 446 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:39,080 Speaker 1: foods in your neighborhood, so you know, forget about that. 447 00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:42,680 Speaker 1: How do you feed your baby wealth in the reality 448 00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:46,760 Speaker 1: of your world, and that goes you know, for around 449 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:50,120 Speaker 1: the world. Those challenges exist, and how can you help 450 00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:53,120 Speaker 1: moms have healthier babies no matter where in the world 451 00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:57,480 Speaker 1: they live, no matter what their socioeconomic, religious, racial, cultural, 452 00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,960 Speaker 1: political profile. And something else we do a lot is 453 00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:07,720 Speaker 1: advocacy in Congress. We recently passed helped pass a piece 454 00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:12,280 Speaker 1: of legislation that was in the National Defense Authorization Act 455 00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:17,480 Speaker 1: this year, having tricare cover duelists for every military mom 456 00:28:17,600 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 1: and lactation support for every military mom. So there's many 457 00:28:22,119 --> 00:28:24,200 Speaker 1: things that we can do. There are lots of problems 458 00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,879 Speaker 1: in the world, but if we don't take care of 459 00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:32,600 Speaker 1: our moms, that's the foundation of everything else. If moms 460 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 1: in a society are not healthy, then their babies aren't healthy, 461 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,800 Speaker 1: then the future of that country is not healthy economically 462 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,479 Speaker 1: or socially or in any way. So it really is 463 00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:50,360 Speaker 1: the foundation of a healthy future. I love it. Okay, 464 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: So if you were going to let's say you're like 465 00:28:53,440 --> 00:28:57,280 Speaker 1: at a party and your friend's daughters having her first baby, 466 00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:00,960 Speaker 1: and she's like in two minutes, like, what would be 467 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 1: the biggest piece of advice you could give me from 468 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,680 Speaker 1: the guru of what to expect I am expecting, tell 469 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:08,800 Speaker 1: me the essence of what I need to know. What 470 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 1: would you say, Well, first of all, I mean I've 471 00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:15,520 Speaker 1: got a couple of things. One is that there's no 472 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:18,960 Speaker 1: such thing as a perfect parent a perfect mom, so 473 00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:22,640 Speaker 1: don't even try, like it's it's kind of the definition 474 00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:29,680 Speaker 1: of impossible. But more importantly is that you got to 475 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:33,160 Speaker 1: stop and smell the babies. If I have one piece 476 00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 1: of advice that I give over and over and over again, 477 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 1: don't sweat the small stuff, except for that small stuff 478 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:45,400 Speaker 1: like stop and smell that baby and remember that. You know, 479 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:48,840 Speaker 1: like they say that, the days are long, the years 480 00:29:48,960 --> 00:29:51,760 Speaker 1: fly by, and all of a sudden you've got an 481 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:55,440 Speaker 1: adult child in your life with children of her own. 482 00:29:55,720 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 1: But it's so you know, I wish I had followed 483 00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:02,360 Speaker 1: my own advice, but I didn't have it at that 484 00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:09,000 Speaker 1: point to just you know, slow down and just savor 485 00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: that sweetness, every moment of that sweetness that you can 486 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:15,280 Speaker 1: even the calla key ones, because hey, I was two 487 00:30:15,320 --> 00:30:17,360 Speaker 1: for two with colic. I mean, what are the odds? 488 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, I don't think we dealt with colic, 489 00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:24,080 Speaker 1: but we had other we had other fun stuff, and 490 00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:26,360 Speaker 1: that that stuff is going to happen, and there are 491 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:29,240 Speaker 1: going to be days when you just don't love being 492 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,560 Speaker 1: a mom. It's just really really hard, and it's hard 493 00:30:32,600 --> 00:30:35,680 Speaker 1: to get through the day. But then you look at 494 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 1: that baby and you know, take a sniff and remember 495 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,840 Speaker 1: what's important and remember not to be so hard on yourself, 496 00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:48,080 Speaker 1: take time to savor some of those moments they stop 497 00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:51,800 Speaker 1: and smell the babies. Yep, I love it. Well. We 498 00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:55,000 Speaker 1: always end our episodes with a love of the week, 499 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:57,880 Speaker 1: So I didn't really prepare you. But that's okay. It 500 00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:00,200 Speaker 1: can be it can be anything. It could ye a 501 00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:01,960 Speaker 1: book you love. It could be like Ameli, you ate 502 00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:03,840 Speaker 1: last week, that was amazing. It could just be like 503 00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 1: the weather is great. I'm gonna go first. That'll give 504 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:09,480 Speaker 1: you time to think. Yeah. So my love of the 505 00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:12,120 Speaker 1: week is actually not my own love of the week. 506 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:15,959 Speaker 1: This is via report of one of my best friends 507 00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 1: who had a baby a few months ago, and she 508 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:21,480 Speaker 1: told me that the baby Buddha pump is very much 509 00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:26,080 Speaker 1: worth checking out asap. It is tiny, it is mighty, 510 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,480 Speaker 1: and it definitely didn't exist when I had my last baby, 511 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:32,040 Speaker 1: which was not that long ago. So it just amazes 512 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:34,080 Speaker 1: me how many new things are on the market all 513 00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:38,320 Speaker 1: the time. Oh yeah, no, that's that's a fact. I 514 00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:42,360 Speaker 1: would have to say that my love every week is hugs. 515 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:47,000 Speaker 1: You can't buy am but I have missed them so 516 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:51,200 Speaker 1: much over the last oh what twenty one months of 517 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:55,640 Speaker 1: pandemic parenting. You know, our baby showers have gone virtual. 518 00:31:56,320 --> 00:32:00,120 Speaker 1: We just started them back up again with hugs, and 519 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,320 Speaker 1: I can't tell you, I mean, there are times when 520 00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:05,680 Speaker 1: I feel like I just can't let go. That for me, 521 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:10,320 Speaker 1: is the most precious commodity of all. So the baby 522 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:13,760 Speaker 1: Buddha sounds amazing. But give me a head a hug 523 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:17,200 Speaker 1: any day of the week and I'm a happy, happy camper. 524 00:32:18,280 --> 00:32:21,200 Speaker 1: I love it. Yes, and you're right. The pandemic probably 525 00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 1: made us all realize how important that is. When you 526 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:25,959 Speaker 1: take something away and you get it back, it's like 527 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:29,320 Speaker 1: all that more exciting and sweet. No, it definitely is. 528 00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:33,200 Speaker 1: And hugs are that for sure? Awesome? What was so 529 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:37,120 Speaker 1: wonderful having you on What an honor? I am sure 530 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:39,840 Speaker 1: our readers know where to find your books, but where 531 00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,479 Speaker 1: else can they find you? Hey, you can find me 532 00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 1: at Heidi Murkoff, just that anywhere you do your social media, 533 00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:52,160 Speaker 1: so that would be Twitter, Facebook, Instagram. And when I 534 00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 1: say I answer every question I get, I mean it. 535 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:58,600 Speaker 1: So middle of the night you may find me on 536 00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:03,600 Speaker 1: my iPad half falling asleep and you know, putting a 537 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:08,800 Speaker 1: role of unintentional letters accidentally and then waking up and 538 00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 1: realizing I got to finish that sentence. Yeah, that's me. 539 00:33:13,120 --> 00:33:16,120 Speaker 1: That is truly amazing. I can't imagine any moms, and 540 00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:20,520 Speaker 1: I'm there to support you, all of you. I love 541 00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 1: it well, thank you so much. It was a pleasure. 542 00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:27,520 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. All Right, well, that was fascinating, 543 00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:30,720 Speaker 1: so great to hear from Heidi Murkoff. So our question 544 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:35,400 Speaker 1: this week comes from a listener who is looking forward 545 00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 1: to camp. So we have all sorts of ambitious and 546 00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:45,479 Speaker 1: productive people listening to this podcast who are already thinking 547 00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:49,440 Speaker 1: about summer camp, and so our listener asks, is there 548 00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:54,280 Speaker 1: some secret code to figuring out which ones will function effectively? 549 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: Like childcare? I have been looking around at the camp 550 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:00,760 Speaker 1: options for the area, and it is really hard to 551 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:04,320 Speaker 1: tell at first glance which ones cover enough hours with 552 00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:07,640 Speaker 1: aftercare or longer days and don't, for example, ask you 553 00:34:07,680 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: to pick up your kids because the weather is bad, 554 00:34:10,120 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 1: which is what some of the outdoor day camps do. 555 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:14,440 Speaker 1: The answer may be that I just need to talk 556 00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:16,319 Speaker 1: to other parents and really dig through the website and 557 00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:20,600 Speaker 1: camp calendars, that I am finding the options overwhelming. So Sarah, 558 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:24,840 Speaker 1: what recommendations do you have here? My recommendation would be 559 00:34:24,880 --> 00:34:29,200 Speaker 1: to go with camps that are based at schools or 560 00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:34,480 Speaker 1: childcare settings. So, for example, in our area, many of 561 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:38,880 Speaker 1: the private schools offer camps so and many of the 562 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:41,240 Speaker 1: campers are kids who do not go to those private schools, 563 00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:44,600 Speaker 1: so they're open to everyone, and most of those schools 564 00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:48,200 Speaker 1: already have a functioning like before care and aftercare system, 565 00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:51,400 Speaker 1: because hey, private schools are expensive, so a lot of 566 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,040 Speaker 1: these families do have to working parents, believe it or not, 567 00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:58,320 Speaker 1: and so I think that is a great route to 568 00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:00,520 Speaker 1: go in. I know in our area that every private 569 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,319 Speaker 1: school camp that I know of offered beforecare aftercare and 570 00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:05,640 Speaker 1: would never have called I mean unless we were having 571 00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:08,359 Speaker 1: a hurricane or something. They weren't going to cancel things. 572 00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:12,280 Speaker 1: I do. On the other hand, know that, for example, 573 00:35:13,040 --> 00:35:15,200 Speaker 1: if you do a specific sports camp that's run by 574 00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:17,120 Speaker 1: maybe a small company where they do lessons and they're 575 00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:18,840 Speaker 1: kind of turning it into a camp for the summer, 576 00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:21,799 Speaker 1: those are the ones where they probably don't offer a 577 00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:25,279 Speaker 1: lot of options and they I didn't enroll my child 578 00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:28,280 Speaker 1: in this camp, but somehow got in there, like text listserve, 579 00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:31,400 Speaker 1: and I kept getting like inclement weather camp is canceled, 580 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:35,600 Speaker 1: and I remember thinking to myself, well that's rough. So 581 00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,440 Speaker 1: I would be careful with the like really small singular 582 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 1: activity ones that are only based outdoors. I mean, I 583 00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:43,840 Speaker 1: guess it depends on where you live. Perhaps there are 584 00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,200 Speaker 1: parts of California that can get away with an outdoor 585 00:35:46,239 --> 00:35:49,960 Speaker 1: camp where there's no shelter that's reliable, but down here 586 00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:53,600 Speaker 1: that would never work. Camp would be canceled daily as 587 00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:57,840 Speaker 1: we have afternoon thunderstorms roll in basically like clockwork every afternoon. 588 00:35:57,960 --> 00:36:01,600 Speaker 1: So yeah, but I think looking towards schools and other 589 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:04,600 Speaker 1: childcare facilities and seeing what they offer and believe it 590 00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:06,200 Speaker 1: or not, you know, some of them have people on 591 00:36:06,320 --> 00:36:08,279 Speaker 1: staff that work for the camp all year long. So 592 00:36:08,320 --> 00:36:10,560 Speaker 1: you could call now and find out what they've done 593 00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:12,400 Speaker 1: in the past and what they're planning on offering in 594 00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:16,279 Speaker 1: the future. Yeah, I would. I would definitely suggests something 595 00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:19,600 Speaker 1: like if you have a local YMCA that those offer 596 00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:22,680 Speaker 1: do offer you know, before care and aftercare during the 597 00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:25,640 Speaker 1: school year, and part of their function is to serve 598 00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:28,680 Speaker 1: you know as wrap around childcare for the school year, 599 00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,480 Speaker 1: and so then theirs summer camps are designed to you know, 600 00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:34,799 Speaker 1: provide the same coverage that people would get through the 601 00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:39,440 Speaker 1: beforecare and aftercare for the whole day. They are aimed 602 00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:43,319 Speaker 1: at providing childcare, and the fun is obviously part of it, 603 00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:46,840 Speaker 1: like they're you know, doing classes and games and outdoor 604 00:36:46,880 --> 00:36:50,120 Speaker 1: time and whatever else. But they've been set up primarily 605 00:36:50,200 --> 00:36:53,320 Speaker 1: as childcare and so that is the function they are serving, 606 00:36:53,920 --> 00:36:57,239 Speaker 1: whereas a camp that's yeah, Sarah was saying primarily about 607 00:36:57,280 --> 00:37:00,000 Speaker 1: teaching you soccer. Well, they're there to teach you soccer, 608 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:02,720 Speaker 1: and they're not necessarily they may offer a little before 609 00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:05,480 Speaker 1: care or aftercare, but their primary function is not to 610 00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:08,320 Speaker 1: enable you to get to work for the day. So 611 00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:13,400 Speaker 1: that's that's something to consider with that. But yeah, your 612 00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:15,600 Speaker 1: question just asking other parents, you know, if you have 613 00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:18,759 Speaker 1: other families who are similar situations to you, you know, 614 00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:23,320 Speaker 1: to working parents, need full time coverage before care, aftercare, 615 00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:27,759 Speaker 1: ask what they've done, you know, and probably whatever those 616 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:31,680 Speaker 1: families have done is something that you could consider doing too, 617 00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:34,719 Speaker 1: you know. But like everything, you're going to need some 618 00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:38,359 Speaker 1: sort of backup option as well, as we've talked about 619 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:43,279 Speaker 1: with layered childcare. Any situation can go wrong. My kids 620 00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:46,600 Speaker 1: were in a camp this summer where one day, like 621 00:37:46,920 --> 00:37:52,239 Speaker 1: the electricity went out at the camp and so you know, 622 00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:55,520 Speaker 1: the air conditioning wasn't working. The plumbing stops working. Eventually 623 00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:57,960 Speaker 1: when you've got it's going to be a bad situation 624 00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:00,920 Speaker 1: with hundreds of kids if the plumbing isn't working. So 625 00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:03,040 Speaker 1: you know, they were shut they were shut for the day. 626 00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:07,880 Speaker 1: And you just can't anticipate everything like that. So same 627 00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:10,480 Speaker 1: as if school is your primary childcare during the year, 628 00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:12,279 Speaker 1: it just sounds like it is, you're gonna need some 629 00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:14,800 Speaker 1: situation to cover it. Now if your kids are older, 630 00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:16,640 Speaker 1: like they're all in school, maybe it's just that you 631 00:38:16,680 --> 00:38:18,680 Speaker 1: can personally work from home if you need to, or 632 00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:21,000 Speaker 1: your partner can work from home, and so if there 633 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,560 Speaker 1: was an issue we camp wasn't open, you could just 634 00:38:23,600 --> 00:38:25,239 Speaker 1: have the kids at home running around the backyard and 635 00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:27,080 Speaker 1: watching movies all day while you still, you know, do 636 00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:30,360 Speaker 1: your meetings by zoom and that could function as your layer. 637 00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:32,880 Speaker 1: But you know, obviously you don't want to be driving 638 00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:34,959 Speaker 1: kids at nine thirty and picking them up at two 639 00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:37,000 Speaker 1: thirty if that's the case, you know with the camp, 640 00:38:37,040 --> 00:38:40,720 Speaker 1: So you want to have your primary one be something 641 00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:42,719 Speaker 1: that would be there for the full time hours. And 642 00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:44,920 Speaker 1: then even if you could work from home with the 643 00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 1: kids entertaining themselves, that would be the backup for that. Well, 644 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:51,840 Speaker 1: this has been best of both worlds. Sarah was interviewing 645 00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:55,160 Speaker 1: Heidi murcaff about what to expect while you're expecting, but 646 00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:57,600 Speaker 1: other things too. They talked a lot about other things 647 00:38:57,640 --> 00:39:00,000 Speaker 1: as well. We will be back next week with more 648 00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:04,840 Speaker 1: on making work and life fit together. Thanks for listening. 649 00:39:05,080 --> 00:39:08,160 Speaker 1: You can find me Sarah at the shoebox dot com 650 00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:12,040 Speaker 1: or at the Underscore Shoebox on Instagram, and you can 651 00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:16,319 Speaker 1: find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This has 652 00:39:16,400 --> 00:39:19,680 Speaker 1: been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please join us 653 00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:23,080 Speaker 1: next time for more on making work and life work together.