Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here,
Speaker 1: and we here at Breaking Points, are already thinking of
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Speaker 1: Good morning everyone, Welcome to Breaking Points. Sober is out
Speaker 1: for the best of possible reasons. He is getting married
Speaker 1: this weekend. But we have a jam pack show. We
Speaker 1: got Ryan in the studio, we got Emily on the
Speaker 1: ground at the RNC. We're I'm Dave Weigel in the
Speaker 1: show later to break down a lot that is happening
Speaker 1: in Biden world. Dandie Vance made his debut last night.
Speaker 1: We've got polls showing actually interesting little post assassination movement.
Speaker 1: So the very certain predictions that this would have a
Speaker 1: huge impact on I should say post assassination attempt movement.
Speaker 1: Let's be clear here, but all those predictions seem not
Speaker 1: to have totally come to fruition. Biden has COVID, he
Speaker 1: also was saying, hey, if he's diagnosed with the medical condition,
Speaker 1: he might get out of the race, so kind of
Speaker 1: changing his tune there. There's a huge flood of pressure
Speaker 1: coming to bear on him right now, so a lot
Speaker 1: of things moving there as well. We also have new
Speaker 1: revelations about what the hell happened with regard to that
Speaker 1: assassination attempt. That really raised a lot of stunning question.
Speaker 1: Secret Service very much under pressure right now and morning
Speaker 1: Joe quite upset that they were pulled from the air
Speaker 1: on Monday.
Speaker 4: Great to see you guys.
Speaker 3: How are you both doing great? Doing great?
Speaker 5: And glad you're back and glad everything's well with your family.
Speaker 5: We were worried for you, but we're excited that things
Speaker 5: seem to be going in a positive direction.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if I can take a moment of personal privilege,
Speaker 1: I just want to thank all of you guys out
Speaker 1: there who sent your thoughts and your kind words our way.
Speaker 1: It was it's been a very difficult week, but thankfully
Speaker 1: my daughter she had to be rushed in for emergency surgery.
Speaker 1: She is doing much much better now, she is recovering.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much to Emily Ryan, you guys for
Speaker 1: stepping up Sager in particular, who has Heace Game married
Speaker 1: this week?
Speaker 4: His own grandfather just passed.
Speaker 1: He has a hell of a lot going on personally,
Speaker 1: really picked up the slack Griffin mac our entire team.
Speaker 1: And also, if I can, you know, I really want
Speaker 1: to send a shout out to the whole pediatric surgery
Speaker 1: team at VCU. They were incredible and truly I can
Speaker 1: never say enough about how amazing they were and how
Speaker 1: much they changed our family's lives. So thank you, guys.
Speaker 1: And with that out of the way, let me go
Speaker 1: ahead and get to the show.
Speaker 6: Emily.
Speaker 1: You're on the ground there at the RNC. Jd Vance
Speaker 1: made his sort of national debut there, big primetime speech
Speaker 1: last night just give us a sense of what the
Speaker 1: energy is there. And then we've also got a little
Speaker 1: bit of a clip from him that we can thrip to.
Speaker 7: Yeah, well it was very very let's say, relatively boring,
Speaker 7: given how crazy the news side. But jd Vance did
Speaker 7: basically what you would expect to hear from Jdvance. He
Speaker 7: actually tore into NAFTA, he tore into the Iraq War.
Speaker 7: And I went back and looked at the Republican National
Speaker 7: Convention in two thousand and four, So twenty years ago,
Speaker 7: and of course everybody knows who was on the ballot,
Speaker 7: that it was Dick Cheney, vice president in JD.
Speaker 6: Vance's slot, and George W. Bush.
Speaker 7: Arnold Schwarzenegger spoke at the two thousand and four Republican
Speaker 7: Convention and referred to people who were pessimistic about the
Speaker 7: American economy, especially as compared to the Chinese economy, as
Speaker 7: economic girly men. He was championing the war in Iraq,
Speaker 7: and so I look back at that not to just say, wow,
Speaker 7: this is a new Republican party, because JD. Vance obviously
Speaker 7: specifically tore into China and our sort of elites.
Speaker 6: He used the words ruling class.
Speaker 7: He actually described it as the ruling class, just like
Speaker 7: you would sort of about a conservative movement.
Speaker 6: Sort of organizational gathering.
Speaker 7: When he said that, he was talking about how a
Speaker 7: lot of our jobs have gone to China.
Speaker 6: And so that is a stark contrast with.
Speaker 7: The economic girly man sentiment of Arnold Schwarzenegger twenty years ago.
Speaker 7: And I say that not to you know, just be
Speaker 7: focused on the past, but also it made me wonder,
Speaker 7: what does the RNC look like in twenty twenty eight,
Speaker 7: What does it look like in twenty thirty two. Would
Speaker 7: you have Sean O'Brien, would you have the mayor of
Speaker 7: He's Palestine, And would you have JD Vance, you know,
Speaker 7: being cheered like this for lines about the kind of
Speaker 7: decadence of America's ruling class. And I don't think that's
Speaker 7: a settled question because this was a new version of JD.
Speaker 6: Vance in the.
Speaker 7: Extent that he's like talking about unity, he made a
Speaker 7: pitch to or on behalf of unity. He said that
Speaker 7: this is a party of a big tent and that
Speaker 7: everyone can you know, debate.
Speaker 6: And hash things out.
Speaker 7: I don't think he's ever said that to Mitch McConnell before,
Speaker 7: but now that he's the vice presidential nominee, he made
Speaker 7: that bench from the stage. But otherwise it just is
Speaker 7: very polished. It is buttoned up, and it's not, you know,
Speaker 7: like it doesn't feel like a reality television show except
Speaker 7: for one thing, which is nobody knows what Donald Trump
Speaker 7: is going to say.
Speaker 6: Really, nobody knows what Donald Trump is going.
Speaker 7: To say, and that is a huge outstanding factor in
Speaker 7: what happens at this convention.
Speaker 6: And we won't know until like ten PM.
Speaker 1: Let me go ahead and queue up, and then right
Speaker 1: I'll get you in on the other side. Let me
Speaker 1: go ahead and que up. The clip that we have
Speaker 1: of Jade Vance speaking talking about the opioid crisis and
Speaker 1: the impact it's had on communities like the one that
Speaker 1: he's from.
Speaker 4: Let's take a listen to that.
Speaker 8: My friends, things did not work out well for a
Speaker 8: lot of kids I grew up with. Every now and
Speaker 8: then I will get a call from a relative back
Speaker 8: home who asks, did you know so and so? And
Speaker 8: I'll remember a face from years ago, and then I'll
Speaker 8: hear they died of an overdose. As always, America's ruling
Speaker 8: class wrote the checks. Communities like mine paid the price
Speaker 8: for decades that divide between the few with their power
Speaker 8: and comfort in Washington and the rest of us only
Speaker 8: widened from Iraq to Afghanistan, from the financial crisis to
Speaker 8: the Great Recession, from open borders to stagnating wages. The
Speaker 8: people who govern this country have failed and failed again.
Speaker 8: Our movement is about single moms like mine who struggled
Speaker 8: with money and addiction but never gave up. And I'm
Speaker 8: proud to say that tonight my mom is here, ten
Speaker 8: years clean and sober.
Speaker 1: I love you, mom, Rian.
Speaker 4: You know the speech came the same day.
Speaker 1: I believe that we also heard Trump was considering Jamie
Speaker 1: Diamond for a Treasury secretary, So very different direction in
Speaker 1: terms of you know, that potential move. And so of
Speaker 1: course this raises the key question is this different rhetoric
Speaker 1: just rhetoric or does it symbolize some sort of actual
Speaker 1: shift in terms of policy, because we all know Ryan
Speaker 1: what the first Trump term looked like, in which his
Speaker 1: there were some shifts, especially on China that was a
Speaker 1: you know, significant change in direction. There were others, but
Speaker 1: his main achievement was a giant tax cut for the rich.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and on some level, rhetoric is real in the
Speaker 5: sense that you know, a lot of the things that
Speaker 5: he said on stage you just wouldn't have heard on
Speaker 5: a Republican stage twenty years ago. And there's something real.
Speaker 5: There has to be something real underneath that. It can't
Speaker 5: it can't just be taught, because why piss off all
Speaker 5: of your donors if you don't see at least some
Speaker 5: kind of cynical value in it.
Speaker 3: The hostility to the war, Like it's nice to see.
Speaker 5: That now from you know that getting some actual purchase
Speaker 5: inside the Republican Party, I get nervous that they'll become
Speaker 5: like liberals. A joke about liberals is that, you know,
Speaker 5: they're against every war except the current war. And so
Speaker 5: here you've got Republicans who are against the war from
Speaker 5: twenty years ago.
Speaker 3: Which, okay, that's that's better. It's better to be against
Speaker 3: it in real time.
Speaker 5: But you know, if it represents a kind of a
Speaker 5: going forward opposition to intervention, as it does for advance
Speaker 5: when at least when it comes to Ukraine, then that
Speaker 5: does seem like progress. But yeah, Emily, I'm curious from
Speaker 5: your perspective, because Crystal's question is the key one. The
Speaker 5: question has always been, is this is this like a
Speaker 5: feint towards the working class? Is this is this kind
Speaker 5: of is this is this fake? Is this just a
Speaker 5: tiny rump group that is kind of funded by Peter
Speaker 5: Teal with inside the Republican Party that doesn't actually represent
Speaker 5: a real faction, or is this becoming kind of a
Speaker 5: main a kind of mainstream through line of the new
Speaker 5: Republican Party And the fact that you've got you know,
Speaker 5: both members of the ticket at you know, espousing some
Speaker 5: elements of this, even as Trump still right exactly, says well,
Speaker 5: Jamie Diamond might be my tre secretary. I still want
Speaker 5: to take corporate taxes down to fifteen percent. If the
Speaker 5: oil companies will give me a billion dollars, they can
Speaker 5: have whatever they want. Like, you still have that whole
Speaker 5: thing at the same time you've got this, So color
Speaker 5: me confused, Like, what are you seeing out there in Milwaukee?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 7: I mean, color everyone confused, honestly, because this is clearly
Speaker 7: where the momentum is. If you're talking to people who
Speaker 7: are you know, just delegates, or if you're talking to
Speaker 7: the kind of movement conservative movement people who are here
Speaker 7: in Milwaukee.
Speaker 6: They love the JD Advance pick.
Speaker 7: You know, everyone I've talked to is extremely excited about it,
Speaker 7: save for a couple folks that I would say are
Speaker 7: more members of the Republican establishment.
Speaker 6: But they're not being.
Speaker 9: Loud about it.
Speaker 6: They're not out there, you know, being loud about.
Speaker 7: It, which I think raises one of the biggest points,
Speaker 7: which is is it durable beyond Trump? Is it just
Speaker 7: something that Donald Trump can get away with because he
Speaker 7: didn't have those pre existing so decades long relationships with
Speaker 7: conservative donors in the way that a lot of people
Speaker 7: who come through thenservative.
Speaker 6: Machine or the dem machine have.
Speaker 7: So is this just something that people really love when
Speaker 7: it comes attached to Donald Trump? And that's why I'm thinking,
Speaker 7: like rn C twenty twenty eight, they're really going.
Speaker 6: To have Sean O'Brien.
Speaker 7: Is Sean O'Brien really going to want to be there
Speaker 7: if Donald Trump isn't at the top of the ticket,
Speaker 7: which sort of dictates all of those kind of downstream
Speaker 7: trappings of what it means to be conservative in twenty
Speaker 7: twenty eight. And what's clear is that conservatives, people who
Speaker 7: vote Republican in this country, a lot of them love
Speaker 7: what Donald Trump says about China, They love what jd
Speaker 7: Vance says about the border.
Speaker 6: They love all of this.
Speaker 7: And so can the Republican Party sustain it? I think
Speaker 7: is an interesting question because certainly the sort of infrastructure
Speaker 7: of the right is not set up to sustain it.
Speaker 7: That's changing a little bit, but it can only change
Speaker 7: like that change has to last if they really want
Speaker 7: to be the party of the working party, beyond the
Speaker 7: Party of the working class, beyond just the rhetoric. So
Speaker 7: what Trump says tonight, I still think is like the
Speaker 7: huge outstanding variable.
Speaker 5: Here, Yeah, and that on that question real quick. On
Speaker 5: the on the billionaire infrastructure, I want to get your
Speaker 5: take on this. What has made the Democratic Party so
Speaker 5: fun to cover for me for the last like fifteen
Speaker 5: years is that the Democrats have their kind of values
Speaker 5: that they state and they've always claimed to be the
Speaker 5: party of the working class and of working people, of
Speaker 5: f FDR, LBJ, and then you can report on what
Speaker 5: they're actually doing and the gap between their values and
Speaker 5: their rhetoric and what they're actually doing. That's that's where
Speaker 5: they that's where the real good journalism lies. So what
Speaker 5: I love is to hear the same stuff from Trump
Speaker 5: and from jd Vance because then you can set the marker,
Speaker 5: all right, this is what they say they're going to
Speaker 5: do on X, y Z, here's what they're actually doing,
Speaker 5: and the journalism can live within that. But I'm curious
Speaker 5: on the billionaire infrastructure, and this kind of fits into that.
Speaker 5: Jd Vance's career has been has has been adjacent to
Speaker 5: these billionaires the whole time. You know, Peter Thield dropping
Speaker 5: was ten or twenty million, ten or twenty million dollars
Speaker 5: into his Senate superpack. And then as soon as Trump
Speaker 5: picks jd Vance as his VP. Elon Musk immediately is like,
Speaker 5: I'm in forty five million dollars a month. It certainly
Speaker 5: seemed like Tucker, Carlos and jd Vance the others that
Speaker 5: in that world were arguing strongly for jd Vance And
Speaker 5: when they got Advance, He's like, Okay, now the checks
Speaker 5: are coming.
Speaker 3: How do you square that with.
Speaker 5: The kind of working class values that they're professing.
Speaker 3: I guess, like, how do they square that?
Speaker 7: Yeah, And as we discussed on yesterday's show, run Mark
Speaker 7: Andresen and Ben Horowitz immediately jumped from the vandwack this
Speaker 7: week two and so, yeah, I remember about this this morning. Actually,
Speaker 7: It's like there was this tug of war over the
Speaker 7: VP slot between the likes of Rupert Murdoch and then
Speaker 7: also sort of the VC Silicon Valley group.
Speaker 6: So are you replacing one group.
Speaker 7: Of billionaire with another group of billionaires and replacing one
Speaker 7: war with you know, hawkishness in another war. There were
Speaker 7: a lot of cheers for a student who came out
Speaker 7: and railed against Harvard. He's suing Harvard over allegations of
Speaker 7: Nancy Semitism. There were a lot of cheers for him.
Speaker 7: As I've said, there have been some Israeli flags that
Speaker 7: have been in the audience being waved. Nothing huge, but
Speaker 7: there were a lot of cheers for that young man
Speaker 7: last night.
Speaker 6: So yeah, it's just an open question.
Speaker 7: And one thing that's clear is that they can tap
Speaker 7: into those populist sentiments and do that in directions that
Speaker 7: many of us might not agree are populist at the
Speaker 7: end of the day. So a lot of energy around
Speaker 7: this stuff here. People are really excited about JD.
Speaker 6: Vance.
Speaker 7: Like I said, I'm really really excited about Jdvans. He
Speaker 7: feels young and fresh. His wife gave an excellent speech
Speaker 7: that was very well received last night when she introduced him.
Speaker 7: Everybody happy about it, except for a couple of kind
Speaker 7: of old GOP hands. But where it goes is a
Speaker 7: huge open question.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd love to see a Harvard student complaining about microaggressions.
Speaker 4: At the RNC.
Speaker 6: Why not?
Speaker 3: Why not?
Speaker 4: You know? In terms of JD.
Speaker 1: Vans on foreign policy, like, he's very pro Israel, tied
Speaker 1: into his religious beliefs. He is a dissident on the
Speaker 1: Ukraine War, but he always frames it in terms of
Speaker 1: because we need to focus on He doesn't say it
Speaker 1: exactly this way, but on the next war with China.
Speaker 1: So I don't think you can say he's anti intervention
Speaker 1: or anti war.
Speaker 4: He's just against this particular war.
Speaker 1: He's looking forward to a different, much larger war, and
Speaker 1: is also in favor of the other war that we're
Speaker 1: currently you know, proxy engaged in Israel. You know, I
Speaker 1: wanted to put up some slides from our friends jail
Speaker 1: partners that they asked voters what they.
Speaker 4: Think about JD. Vans. We can put the first one
Speaker 4: up on the screen.
Speaker 1: So overall people just don't know, right, he's not particularly
Speaker 1: well defined nationally. Literally, the biggest thing that people said
Speaker 1: about him is don't know. The next largest thing appears
Speaker 1: to be Republican. Then you have unknown Senator Trump, the
Speaker 1: sort of highest rated positive signifier here, you've got good,
Speaker 1: You've got smart among people who do know who he is,
Speaker 1: which I have to guess skews more Republican at this point.
Speaker 1: We can put the next piece up on the screen.
Speaker 1: Even within here, it's very vague. It's like Republican, Okay,
Speaker 1: Senator unknown, good, nothing, strong, smart, So he's very much
Speaker 1: undefined in the public view. And you know, I can
Speaker 1: tell you we can put this next reporting up on
Speaker 1: the screen from the Lever. There's already been a lot
Speaker 1: of reporting about his views on abortion. Now this piece
Speaker 1: of reporting from the Levers is jade Vance wants police
Speaker 1: to track people who have abortions. Basically, the Democrats tried
Speaker 1: to put into place a privacy rule that would bar
Speaker 1: law enforcement from having access to private information about whether
Speaker 1: people had an abortion or not. Jade Vance was opposed
Speaker 1: to that privacy rule and attempting to block it. There
Speaker 1: was also a new reporting from CNN about a twenty
Speaker 1: twenty two interview from jade Vance saying he would certainly
Speaker 1: like abortion to be illegal nationally. Was sympathetic to the
Speaker 1: view that a national ban was necessary to stop women
Speaker 1: from traveling across states to obtain an abortion. So emily,
Speaker 1: you know, the Democrats are certainly going to try to
Speaker 1: fill in the blanks for people real quick about who jd.
Speaker 1: Vance is talk to us about. You know, do you
Speaker 1: have a sense that there was an electoral calculus that
Speaker 1: went into this pick, because in other areas, Trump seemed
Speaker 1: to be very wary of picking a vice presidential candidate
Speaker 1: who had baggage on an issue that he knows is
Speaker 1: a key vulnerability and so what is your sense of
Speaker 1: this sort of strategy here or is the is it
Speaker 1: just the like Listen, I think we're going to win
Speaker 1: in a landslide, So I'm a pick whoever the hell
Speaker 1: I want to pick.
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's a great question from what I've been able
Speaker 7: to tell just talk you know, folks, and you know,
Speaker 7: having covered Donald Trump as we all have for a
Speaker 7: while now, is there are two things he really liked
Speaker 7: JD Vance's personal story, that kind of arc, and I
Speaker 7: think that was vindicated. That take was vindicated yesterday because
Speaker 7: it's a huge element of what Jade Vance talked about.
Speaker 7: We rolled that clip earlier of him celebrating his mom's
Speaker 7: ten years of sobriety and talking as a lot of
Speaker 7: millennials who come from you know, so called flyover country
Speaker 7: know about seeing those names come up and seeing the
Speaker 7: fentanyl overdoses time after time. I think that is really
Speaker 7: resonant with a lot of folks. And I think Donald
Speaker 7: Trump knows that JD. Vance's background is honestly just objectively
Speaker 7: impressive achievements, you know, being a marine and enlisting and
Speaker 7: then going to law school, basically coming from nothing and
Speaker 7: ending up where he is is really resonant with people.
Speaker 6: It's a good story.
Speaker 7: Donald Trump loves a narrative, There's no question about that.
Speaker 7: The other hand, he also not only does Jade Vance
Speaker 7: have that going for him, but he also is going
Speaker 7: to be loyal to Donald Trump.
Speaker 6: I think Donald Trump knows has sensed with jd. Vance
Speaker 6: that he's.
Speaker 7: Somebody who is a true believer, which was actually funny
Speaker 7: enough one of the left knocks against him.
Speaker 6: But jd. Vance has become a true believer to all
Speaker 6: of this.
Speaker 7: And if you're spending time with him and talk to him,
Speaker 7: even though he used to be really anti Trump, that
Speaker 7: is very clearly no longer the case. It's not cynical
Speaker 7: with him. He's really thought through these things from that
Speaker 7: sort of intellectual point of view and buys that kind
Speaker 7: of flight ninety three election mentality that a lot of
Speaker 7: people Claremont circles on the right and those the new
Speaker 7: right national conservative circles absolutely by into. So I think
Speaker 7: those are two critical factors for Donald Trump. I will
Speaker 7: say abortion has been conspicuously absent from this RNC that
Speaker 7: started with the platform, but you are.
Speaker 6: Just not hearing a lot about the issue at all.
Speaker 7: And one thing that I have heard is people think
Speaker 7: that jd Vance's kind of his statement right before he
Speaker 7: was picked on meph pristone that is sincerely something that's
Speaker 7: concerned a couple of people that I've chatted with that
Speaker 7: it signals that maybe Jadvance will be open to blowing
Speaker 7: along with the Trumpian wins kind of and will be
Speaker 7: easily sort of co opted by Trump's inner circle, which
Speaker 7: a lot of people in New Right circles don't trust.
Speaker 6: So there's just like a lot going on, but we
Speaker 6: will see.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I mean, if you're looking for somebody who's not going
Speaker 5: to change his position on something, jd Vance is not
Speaker 5: your man for sure. But I'm curious what the kind
Speaker 5: of talking point is going to be in response to
Speaker 5: what Crystal brought up, because that Lever story is one
Speaker 5: of the few kind of independent news scoops that wound
Speaker 5: up on MSNBC. Like Rachel matt I was like, I
Speaker 5: love Lever News, great scoop here from David Serota's team,
Speaker 5: and she was waving it around and saying, look, look
Speaker 5: at this letter that Jade Vance signed saying that he
Speaker 5: wants to know surveil you as you're going out of state.
Speaker 3: So you can so that the Mississippi.
Speaker 5: Can catch you, you know, trying to get an abortion
Speaker 5: out of state. And then there's that unearthed onearthed as
Speaker 5: it like the OPO team had it and like within
Speaker 5: an hour of him being named, the OPO team dumps
Speaker 5: it on somebody and it's unearthed, but it wasn't buried
Speaker 5: very long ago. We're just talking twenty twenty two. So
Speaker 5: what is the Republican response going to be? You think
Speaker 5: you think you're dead on that. The projection out of
Speaker 5: Milwaukee is just let's just not talk about it because
Speaker 5: we've got all eyes on us, not a lot of noormies, like,
Speaker 5: don't talk about it. But when they have to actually
Speaker 5: do combat, hand to hand combat where Democrats are saying,
Speaker 5: this is what you've said. Is there a line yet
Speaker 5: that Republicans are going to have in response or are
Speaker 5: they still is that still being fought over?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 7: I mean, I think sadly the kind of anti aborsion
Speaker 7: movement knows that the issue with as long as Donald
Speaker 7: Trump is at the helm of the Republican Party, which
Speaker 7: feels indefinite to be honest, the issue they have lost,
Speaker 7: you know that one on Dobbs and Row. But they've
Speaker 7: lost the sort of battle for what happens afterwards and
Speaker 7: how the Republican Party handles it. That's the sense that
Speaker 7: you pick up, and so, yeah, I think that that
Speaker 7: read on things basically that they're just not going to
Speaker 7: talk about it because Donald Trump. People may remember a
Speaker 7: couple of months ago, Donald Trump sort of unveiled rolled
Speaker 7: out his new kind of language, the way that he
Speaker 7: thinks Republicans should talk about abortion and what sort of
Speaker 7: policies should be off the table.
Speaker 6: Et cetera, et cetera. That that very much has won
Speaker 6: the day, and that's.
Speaker 7: Very much going to be how Jadie Vance is talking
Speaker 7: about the issue. I would expect for the next couple
Speaker 7: of months. Unless you know, someone gets him in a
Speaker 7: quiet moment talking about his Catholic beliefs on life or
Speaker 7: something like that, you know he's gonna be talking a
Speaker 7: lot in the next couple of months. I'm sure he'll
Speaker 7: have to answer these questions pretty often.
Speaker 6: My sense is that it'll be a punt.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's going to be interesting to watch out unfolds up.
Speaker 1: In my own sense of the choice for what it's worth,
Speaker 1: I have no inside knowledge here, but that you know,
Speaker 1: Trump feels very confident. Apparently the pitch was made from
Speaker 1: Tucker Carlson and others that this would make him quote
Speaker 1: assassination proof because maybe if it was Mark or Rubio,
Speaker 1: people would want amount of the way.
Speaker 4: I mean, that's a pretty dark way direction to go in.
Speaker 1: But you know, I think there was a thought that
Speaker 1: basically he bought into that logic.
Speaker 4: He liked JD.
Speaker 1: Vance personally, and JD has gone out of his way
Speaker 1: to say that if he didn't think that Mike Pence
Speaker 1: should have gone forward with the electoral count vote. And
Speaker 1: so to your point, Emily, I mean, it's strange from
Speaker 1: a guy who at one point one point said Trump
Speaker 1: maybe America's Hitler and who not that long ago. And
Speaker 1: this was also quote unquote unearthed this morning that Trump
Speaker 1: was a fraud he said on a podcast a few
Speaker 1: years back, and you know, made some very aggressively critical
Speaker 1: comments of this president. So it's odd that loyalty would
Speaker 1: be the thing that Trump was after in this pick.
Speaker 1: But I think because Vance has gone out of his
Speaker 1: way to say, you know, I even would have followed
Speaker 1: you into the breach in terms of stop the steal
Speaker 1: and throwing the whole country into chaos by not moving
Speaker 1: forward with the electoral account in the way that Mike
Speaker 1: that Mike Pence did. Mike fans like that, My brain
Speaker 1: is so addled this.
Speaker 4: Week, Guys, you gotta bear with me.
Speaker 1: That's true, But I think that was the key, a
Speaker 1: key part of this selection as well. We're going to
Speaker 1: get to more Biden news in a bit, but I
Speaker 1: wonder if that calculus would have been different if they
Speaker 1: were staring down the possibility of a different candidate at
Speaker 1: the top than Joe Biden, which may in fact be
Speaker 1: the case. But I want to move on to just
Speaker 1: quickly hear some of the polling that we've gotten post
Speaker 1: assassination attempt. Only I wanted to get some of your
Speaker 1: take on this. We can put this up on the
Speaker 1: screen now.
Speaker 4: Listen. Joe Biden was losing before.
Speaker 1: The assassination attempt, and he is still losing after the
Speaker 1: assassination attempt, but at least from the minimal pulling that
Speaker 1: we've seen so far, it didn't actually move the needle
Speaker 1: that much. And so there were a lot of confident
Speaker 1: punnet predictions of like, oh, it's over, and you know
Speaker 1: there's going to be this huge movement in Trump's direction.
Speaker 1: So far that hasn't really hasn't really shown up. And
Speaker 1: I wonder what you made of that, Emily, because my
Speaker 1: own thinking was that you'd already had a lot of
Speaker 1: movement away from Biden in the wake of his disastrous
Speaker 1: debate performance. And I'm just not sure, given how polarized,
Speaker 1: like partisan polarized, we are, how much more of a
Speaker 1: shift there can really be towards Trump among those who
Speaker 1: are on the fence, since a lot of that had
Speaker 1: already come right after the debate disaster for Biden.
Speaker 7: Yeah, you know, I've always thought Donald Trump had a ceiling,
Speaker 7: and I think most people have made the same assumption
Speaker 7: that you know, and they're numbers, by the way, two
Speaker 7: on two. You know, nobody's really ever getting over fifty percent.
Speaker 7: I think Biden may have in his favorability at the
Speaker 7: beginning of his presidency, but obviously polarization makes that such
Speaker 7: that it feels like anybody with the sort of r
Speaker 7: D next to their name and the presidential ticket is
Speaker 7: going to have a ceiling. And does Donald Trump, you know,
Speaker 7: sort of rising after taking a bullet to the ear,
Speaker 7: change that maybe a little, but I don't think significantly.
Speaker 7: There's just any room for that in American politics now.
Speaker 7: But I will say, uh, the RNC people here are
Speaker 7: projecting confidence.
Speaker 6: And I think JD. Vance, the pick of JD. Vans
Speaker 6: is a projection of confidence.
Speaker 7: He Donald Trump didn't pick someone who would, you know,
Speaker 7: bring in a critical swing state, didn't bring someone who
Speaker 7: would shore up support among a demographic. You know, maybe
Speaker 7: the logic was that Tim Scott could help continue to
Speaker 7: eat away at Democrats' margins with the black vote in
Speaker 7: an election where that will matter.
Speaker 6: A whole lot. That's what he did with JD. Vance.
Speaker 7: And so I do think there's a sense of confidence
Speaker 7: in shifting priorities. But you know, there's also a let's
Speaker 7: see av an attempted pivot to boringness. You know, that's
Speaker 7: kind of what I meant earlier about JADU Vance, that
Speaker 7: it is just it was very buttoned up and contained,
Speaker 7: and I think they want to Biden now to be
Speaker 7: the chaos candidate, and that's what Republicans are going for.
Speaker 7: But I think even that in and of itself speaks
Speaker 7: to the fact that everyone has a ceiling, which is
Speaker 7: a little bit of wiggle room where independents are involved
Speaker 7: and turnout is involved, and that's where the fight really
Speaker 7: is from now until November, right.
Speaker 1: I wanted to get your take on this pole if
Speaker 1: we can put this next one up on the screen,
Speaker 1: because you know, Republicans have been aggressively making the case
Speaker 1: JD fans in particular, that Democratic rhetoric is to blame
Speaker 1: the root cause of Trump shooting, the attempted assassination, and
Speaker 1: I'm not sure that that was really a smart direction
Speaker 1: for them to go in, because if you're fighting an
Speaker 1: election on the grounds of which party has more sort
Speaker 1: of inflammatory and divisive rhetoric, that's just not really the
Speaker 1: rep that Joe Biden has at this point. So the
Speaker 1: number one route cause that people point to is Durin shooter,
Speaker 1: which we have some new reporting will get to you
Speaker 1: later about what he was searching for. That I think
Speaker 1: very much matches that root cause determination. The next highest,
Speaker 1: just barely behind that, was Trump and his own rhetoric,
Speaker 1: and then you get to the rhetoric of Biden and
Speaker 1: Democrats at just thirteen percent of people who are putting
Speaker 1: the blame there. So you kind of reminded me, in
Speaker 1: a bizarre way, Ryan of when Biden gave that disastrous
Speaker 1: debate answer about abortion where Democrats were like, oh, this
Speaker 1: is easy. You knock this out of the park, and
Speaker 1: then he turns the conversation immediately to an undocumented immigrant
Speaker 1: raping and murdering someone. You're like, why would you ever
Speaker 1: bring this up? Because this is the worst possible landscape
Speaker 1: for you to fight on. I sort of feel like
Speaker 1: that with Republicans and now wanting to fight on the
Speaker 1: ground of like which party is more buttoned up and
Speaker 1: responsible with the nature of their rhetoric at this point.
Speaker 5: Yes, and that poll is done Harris X, which is
Speaker 5: a terrible polster, but lean's very Trumpian, and so you know,
Speaker 5: if those are the results that they get, you can
Speaker 5: you can you can pad them. Actually probably a little
Speaker 5: bit higher in that direction. I think I think it
Speaker 5: might have mattered if the shooter's motivations had been different. Like,
Speaker 5: let's say we turned out it's some Antifa kid, you know,
Speaker 5: who was you know, really out there to like stop
Speaker 5: Trump from becoming present again, Like for a second, that's
Speaker 5: what it's you know, that's what the right thought they
Speaker 5: had with this. They started blaming this poor Italian guy
Speaker 5: who was asleep at the time. If if that had
Speaker 5: proven to be the case, maybe the numbers move slightly
Speaker 5: in there and you get some kind of bump one,
Speaker 5: you know, towards towards Trump. But when it when it
Speaker 5: emerged that and it's also kind of a sad testament
Speaker 5: to American culture that we were so quickly able to
Speaker 5: code this shooter. Like we started hearing from his fellow students,
Speaker 5: and we started, you know, understanding just the basics of
Speaker 5: him and seeing him, and we're like, oh, this is
Speaker 5: a standard issue school shooter who we don't know a
Speaker 5: whole lot about because so many of them just die,
Speaker 5: but so many people have known them before they carried
Speaker 5: out the school shooting that it's a loner. It's somebody
Speaker 5: miserable and depressed going through a mental health crisis and
Speaker 5: combined with some psychosis that leads them to want to
Speaker 5: kind of go out of this world in this like
Speaker 5: blaze of bizarre glory. And once I think American people
Speaker 5: were like, oh, that's what happened here, then it just
Speaker 5: doesn't have any political balance anymore. And the idea that
Speaker 5: that person is going to be inspired by Joe Biden,
Speaker 5: you know, saying the word bullseye in a private donor
Speaker 5: call is too absurd, I think to latch on anywhere.
Speaker 5: The most thought provoking comment that I saw from anybody
Speaker 5: on the day of the shooting was I forget who
Speaker 5: posted at this point, but they said, this might sound crazy,
Speaker 5: but in two weeks we will have metabolized this and
Speaker 5: completely forgotten about it. And I saw that, I was like,
Speaker 5: that's crazy, And then I started think, is that crazy?
Speaker 5: Like we're in such a fast moving, polarized, crazy world
Speaker 5: that it's quite possible two weeks from now we haven't
Speaker 5: forgotten it. Well, we'll know what happened, but it won't
Speaker 5: have kind of left a mark on our kind of
Speaker 5: culture the way that it would have, you know, fifty
Speaker 5: years ago, forty years ago.
Speaker 1: Yeah, to be honest, that's my sense of things as well.
Speaker 1: I mean, you can look at our own show and
Speaker 1: the fact that this is the latest details of the massive,
Speaker 1: astonishing security failures are towards the end of the show
Speaker 1: to show you how quick the news is moving at
Speaker 1: this point. But Emily, I wonder what you make of
Speaker 1: any or all of this.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean it's I think a lot of this
Speaker 7: depends on a couple of moving parts right now. One
Speaker 7: just in the last twenty four hours, it has looked
Speaker 7: like we are getting signals from Joe Biden's camp, although
Speaker 7: they are still vehemently denying them publicly, that lay the
Speaker 7: groundwork for a potential dropout. So it started with I
Speaker 7: think it was Jeff Zeleny who said that a senior
Speaker 7: Democratic advisor said Biden may now be opened to dropping
Speaker 7: out of the race. And then Biden himself was diagnosed
Speaker 7: with COVID and is looking rather feeble in some of
Speaker 7: the videos of him getting on and off the plane
Speaker 7: into a car. So I mean it was this entire
Speaker 7: RNC against the ghost, as my old editor Tim Carney
Speaker 7: put it a Washington Examiner, because Biden himself has figured
Speaker 7: heavily into it. They were chanting constant chance last night
Speaker 7: of Joe must go from the delegates on.
Speaker 6: The floor, a b sign and a lot of Democrats
Speaker 6: would co sign it too, and.
Speaker 7: That may all be for that may but I'll be
Speaker 7: a moot point.
Speaker 6: Not so long in the future.
Speaker 7: So I think that depends les Pens really heavily on that.
Speaker 7: Because Trump with his fists in the air jexaposed with
Speaker 7: some of the memes of like Biden tripping up the
Speaker 7: Air Force one stairs, that I think does give some
Speaker 7: power to what Donald Trump went through and the second one.
Speaker 7: We keep coming back to this, but it's what Donald
Speaker 7: Trump says tonight, And we have basically no indication of
Speaker 7: what Donald Trump is going to say other than he
Speaker 7: swapped out what he called a.
Speaker 6: Real rip roarer for a new speech. But we don't
Speaker 6: know what that means, and we still don't fully know.
Speaker 7: Donald Trump has been very consciously stoic all week. You
Speaker 7: see him, I'm been looking down at him during every speech,
Speaker 7: like focused on his reactions.
Speaker 6: He has not been giving a lot of reaction.
Speaker 7: And so how he handles this personal trauma, honestly and
Speaker 7: kind of a national trauma for everybody too. How he
Speaker 7: handles that, I think is still an open question. And
Speaker 7: how it might affect numbers going forward I think does
Speaker 7: kind of depend on both of those two things a lot.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean again, let me be clear, Joe Biden
Speaker 1: is losing this race. He's losing every battleground state.
Speaker 9: You know.
Speaker 1: He we already had all the images of him being
Speaker 1: incredibly feeble. We've got a new one we can show
Speaker 1: you today of him like having to be helped into
Speaker 1: his car seat by his aides, and he was just
Speaker 1: diagnosed with God mean, all of that is already there.
Speaker 1: It's just it's not that surprising to me that it
Speaker 1: didn't move the numbers even more against Joe Biden. But Emily,
Speaker 1: thank you so much. You're doing a fantastic job on
Speaker 1: the ground there. We're so lucky to have you on
Speaker 1: the ground. Brands reporting from the RNC, and you know,
Speaker 1: I'm sure we will be talking to you more about
Speaker 1: what Trump does have to say when he speaks primetime tonight.
Speaker 6: Thanks guys.
Speaker 7: Yeah, they actually brought the old breaking Points set to Wisconsin.
Speaker 6: So it's nice to be comfortable prison.
Speaker 7: No, I will never escape it, all right, lovea Emily,
Speaker 7: so you.
Speaker 6: Soon, Thanks guys.
Speaker 1: So a whole lot going on with Joe Biden this morning.
Speaker 1: He has now been diagnosed with COVID. There is a
Speaker 1: now very public effort to pressure him out coming from
Speaker 1: the top echelons of Democrats. We're talking Schumer, Pelosi, Jeffries,
Speaker 1: et cetera. But Ryan, before we jump into that, just
Speaker 1: a reminder to all of you guys that Ryan just
Speaker 1: launched drop site News Understanding.
Speaker 4: The launch has gone fantastic.
Speaker 1: There's been big support from the Breaking Points and Counterpoints universe,
Speaker 1: and you've got a discount going right, Ryan, Yes.
Speaker 5: For Breaking Points and Counterpoints of viewers, you guys can
Speaker 5: get twenty percent off your subscriptions. That's what the journalism
Speaker 5: will remain free, but it's the subscriptions that make the
Speaker 5: investigative work possible. So it's dropsiteews dot com slash Counterpoints.
Speaker 5: We'll put the link down there, but just go to
Speaker 5: that URL and you'll get twenty percent off your subscription.
Speaker 5: And thanks everybody for the support the first week and
Speaker 5: a half. It's been really gratifying. I think I think
Speaker 5: we're in liftoff, Like I think I think we're going
Speaker 5: to make it, and I think we're going to be
Speaker 5: around for a long time to come, doing a lot
Speaker 5: of doing a lot of damage. Thanks and Crystal, Thanks
Speaker 5: to Thanks to you guys too. The Breaking Points community
Speaker 5: has really come out for it, which is that's who
Speaker 5: you want to be beholden to, Like, if you've got
Speaker 5: to be behold of somebody, if you got to starve somebody,
Speaker 5: that's who you want to serve.
Speaker 4: I could not possibly disagree with that. So guys, go
Speaker 4: ahead and do that.
Speaker 1: Ryan and Jeremy have already broken some incredible stories just
Speaker 1: in the first what are you a week into this,
Speaker 1: a little more than a week into this and already
Speaker 1: have made some major news. So it's definitely worth you
Speaker 1: guys giving your support if you're able. Let's go ahead
Speaker 1: and get to the news. With regards of Biden, we
Speaker 1: can put this tear sheet up on the screen, so
Speaker 1: he has tested positive for COVID nineteen. He's having to
Speaker 1: cancel events because of this diagnosis. We can also put
Speaker 1: this video up on the screen, just continuing to show
Speaker 1: how feeble he is at this point in his life.
Speaker 1: You can see there through the window him really having
Speaker 1: to be assisted, almost like lifted into the car. You
Speaker 1: can sort of make that out through the rain from
Speaker 1: the side here see him being put in. And part
Speaker 1: of why this is so significant is because let's go
Speaker 1: and put the next piece up on the screen. Diagnosis
Speaker 1: is significant because it came right after news leaked that
Speaker 1: Biden had privately said he might quit the presidential race
Speaker 1: if a medical condition emerged. Now I don't know that
Speaker 1: COVID was the medical condition that he was referring to there,
Speaker 1: but this was in an interview with bet He was asked,
Speaker 1: is there anything that you would look to you personally
Speaker 1: to say if I see that I will reevaluate, And
Speaker 1: Biden said, quote, if I had some medical condition that emerged,
Speaker 1: if somebody, if doctors came to me and said you
Speaker 1: got this problem, that problem, Biden indicated that he would
Speaker 1: be receptive to getting out of the race.
Speaker 4: Ryan, this comes.
Speaker 1: We've got like a whole slough of Biden developments that
Speaker 1: we're going to get to. As I said, you've got
Speaker 1: now Pelosi and Schumer really making more public their desires
Speaker 1: to push him out. You have him seemingly more open
Speaker 1: to the conversation. Not that he's saying he's going to
Speaker 1: get out, but he's not just like out and out
Speaker 1: ruling it out. What do you make of these most
Speaker 1: recent developments.
Speaker 5: Well, he had also said that he would only take
Speaker 5: advice on this question from the Almighty, So you can
Speaker 5: read into that what you want about the timing of this.
Speaker 5: Right after he says medical condition, I looked it up.
Speaker 5: The last time that he had COVID, he was in
Speaker 5: isolation for sixteen days, which is with CDC recommendation is
Speaker 5: like five minutes at this point, So you know, sixteen
Speaker 5: days when you have just a few days left of
Speaker 5: the entire presidential campaign, and this pushes you close to
Speaker 5: the Democratic National Convention does put I think, you know,
Speaker 5: extra pressure, especially as Democrats are, and we're going to
Speaker 5: talk about this, getting much more public and vocal about
Speaker 5: the pressure that they're putting on him. And not just Democrats,
Speaker 5: not just the two thirds of Democratic voters who say
Speaker 5: they want him to step down, but the most powerful
Speaker 5: Democrats aside from the President in the country are now
Speaker 5: telling him, very directly into his face, exactly what the
Speaker 5: RNC crowd was chanting.
Speaker 3: You know, Joe must go.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it could have been Nancy Pelosi in the crowd,
Speaker 1: leaving those chances. Well, I mean, the COVID diagnosis it
Speaker 1: kind of cuts both ways, doesn't it, Because on the
Speaker 1: one hand, it's another indication of like, hey, the Almighty
Speaker 1: might be sending you those signals, buddy. And also, listen,
Speaker 1: everybody gets sick, but you know, at his age, it
Speaker 1: once again raises the specter. Okay, this is a much
Speaker 1: more serious illness for someone at his age and in
Speaker 1: his whatever his health condition is. But the COVID diagnosis
Speaker 1: also gives him an excuse to stop doing the interviews
Speaker 1: and appearances he has been doing that have not been
Speaker 1: going particularly well. We have a little bit of a
Speaker 1: mashup of his appearance at the ENDABACP and this was
Speaker 1: put together and you can see, even on a teleprompter,
Speaker 1: he's struggling to complete sentences, finish his thoughts, and is
Speaker 1: completely oblivious to his own major policy announcement with regard
Speaker 1: to housing. He means to say at one point that
Speaker 1: he's going to cap rent increases at five percent, and
Speaker 1: says he says he's going to cap rent at fifty
Speaker 1: five dollars. So just you know, a horrific blunder, which
Speaker 1: in other conditions maybe say, are I really just screwed
Speaker 1: up once? But obviously this is not just a one
Speaker 1: time screw up. Let's take a listen to a little
Speaker 1: bit of how this appearance went.
Speaker 10: I know, I know't say, Joe, you may not have
Speaker 10: a Congress. Well, guess what y'all told me. I couldn't
Speaker 10: pass the Inflation Reduction Act. Y'all told me I couldn't
Speaker 10: face it.
Speaker 11: Anyway, we did it.
Speaker 10: We're gonna bring rents down, as I said, We're gonna
Speaker 10: build two million affordable homes. The cap rent increases of
Speaker 10: five percent a year, So corporate landlord can't God.
Speaker 4: Anyway, I don't wanna get going.
Speaker 10: I'm gonna get very upset.
Speaker 9: But but there's gouging in America.
Speaker 10: By the way, not only saves lives, we'll save taxpayers.
Speaker 10: Just what I did on the first round on Daln Medicare.
Speaker 10: It saves the taxpayer one one hundred and sixty billion
Speaker 10: dollars because they don't have to pay these exorbitant prices
Speaker 10: to these anyway, the idea, the idea, the corporate owned
Speaker 10: housing is able to raise your rent three four hundred
Speaker 10: bucks a month or something under what I'm about to announce,
Speaker 10: they can't raise it more than fifty five dollars.
Speaker 1: I mean, you can just see the confused look on
Speaker 1: his face in that last part as he leans in.
Speaker 1: This is off a teleprompter, Ryan, this is the one
Speaker 1: thing we thought maybe he could still sort of like
Speaker 1: you know, stumble his way through.
Speaker 5: It's you know, and just wanted to confirm this. On
Speaker 5: my keyboard, the percentage sign is above the five. Like
Speaker 5: did some intern write fifty five and forget to hit
Speaker 5: the hit the shift key and so it says fifty five.
Speaker 5: But if you're the president, you got to know your
Speaker 5: own policy. It makes no sense like there's no democratic
Speaker 5: policy it's going to say that rent can't go up
Speaker 5: by more than fifty five dollars, Like, no matter what
Speaker 5: your rent already was, Like, if your rent is one
Speaker 5: hundred dollars, you can still go up by fifty five
Speaker 5: ors if it's five thousand, goes come on, like, like,
Speaker 5: your mind has to be able to say, even if
Speaker 5: it was a typo on the teleprompt, your mind has
Speaker 5: to be able like, oh, I know what my policy is.
Speaker 5: It's five percent, yeah, five percent increase.
Speaker 1: As people who read off teleprompters sometimes sometimes, especially because
Speaker 1: we write our own stuff, so obviously got to be
Speaker 1: aware enough when we're reading it to be like, wait
Speaker 1: a minute, that's not the shit that I'm meant.
Speaker 3: To say, Yes, yes, exactly.
Speaker 5: It can't be like, oh, well, I guess, I guess
Speaker 5: the new policy is fifty five dollars. I wish though,
Speaker 5: that that was the rule that like, whatever the president
Speaker 5: says goes. He said it, and the crowd ratified it
Speaker 5: by cheering, that's the new law done.
Speaker 4: That's it, that's happening.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 1: It's also interesting because just before the assassination attempt on,
Speaker 1: Trump completely shifted the conversation and sort of put the
Speaker 1: Biden drop out conversation on hold at least for a
Speaker 1: few days. You had reporting about this disastrous zoom call
Speaker 1: that he had with this group of moderate Democrats. You
Speaker 1: can put this up on the screen because we now
Speaker 1: have the leak to audio. I knew it was going
Speaker 1: to come out, the leaked audio of this video. And
Speaker 1: he in particular goes after this Democratic representative, Jason Crowe,
Speaker 1: who is a military veteran. And they say in this reporting,
Speaker 1: right before the Trump rally, Butler Pennsylvania, group of moderate
Speaker 1: Hill Democrats had a tense zoom call to express concern.
Speaker 1: According to one of the participants, they said the call
Speaker 1: was even worse than the debate.
Speaker 4: He was rambling.
Speaker 1: He'd start an answer and then lose his train of thought.
Speaker 1: Then when just say whatever, sort of like that clip
Speaker 1: we just showed you where when his mind wanders off,
Speaker 1: he just says anyway to get out of the fact
Speaker 1: that he has no idea where a sentence is going.
Speaker 1: He really couldn't complete an answer. They go on to say,
Speaker 1: I lost a ton of respect for him. Another participant
Speaker 1: in the call confirmed that characterization was rambling, dismissive, of
Speaker 1: concerns unable or unprepared to present a campaign strategy. Had
Speaker 1: a particularly troubling exchange with Jason crow saying to him, quote,
Speaker 1: tell me something you've never done with your bronze star,
Speaker 1: like my son, this member of Congress told me, had
Speaker 1: the assassination attempt not occurred? An hour later, I imagine
Speaker 1: fifty people on that zoom were ready to come out
Speaker 1: publicly against him. And you know that comment to Jason
Speaker 1: Crowe to Congress and Crowe Ryan, it kind of has
Speaker 1: it all because it's got this like tone of disrespect
Speaker 1: and belligerence, but is also a completely incoherent sentence.
Speaker 5: Right, And it has the public has finally gotten to
Speaker 5: see what his ex staffers have been saying about him
Speaker 5: for fifty years, which is that he's not the happy Joe,
Speaker 5: the happy warrior. Internally with staff, he's very short tempered,
Speaker 5: and his ego and his arrogance get the better of him,
Speaker 5: and he lashes out at people in really cutting in
Speaker 5: and nasty ways. And you could not have a better
Speaker 5: example of that than incoherently attacking a guy over his
Speaker 5: bronze star, like exactly like you said, Like, what are
Speaker 5: you even saying here? Are you criticizing him for it?
Speaker 5: But you're not because you're saying, like your son had
Speaker 5: it also. But and then that same answer is where
Speaker 5: he went on this like tirade about how he had
Speaker 5: brought together Alcus and all of the foreign policy work
Speaker 5: that he had done in the Indo Pacific, and he's
Speaker 5: also the guy that brought together NATO. Nobody else can
Speaker 5: make that argument to the American public Alcus Alcus Aucus.
Speaker 5: And it's like, what do you, like, you are supposed
Speaker 5: to be a good politician with your finger on the pulse,
Speaker 5: Like find me a single voter anywhere in the country
Speaker 5: who does not have as his job like working for
Speaker 5: a foreign agent, who's like involved with this kind of
Speaker 5: security packed in the Indo Pacific, who cares about that?
Speaker 5: And Jason Crow said that Jason grows like that that's
Speaker 5: not breaking through, mister President, and Biden, according to that audio,
Speaker 5: was like, well, I'm tired of this crap, Like this
Speaker 5: is not doing it man.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Well it is interesting.
Speaker 1: It goes back to the decision that his team made
Speaker 1: to have his big boy press conference be about NATO,
Speaker 1: because that's clearly the area where he's still the most comfortable,
Speaker 1: most codent, I mean the borderline obsession, and that was
Speaker 1: that was.
Speaker 5: Smart, because you don't have to be remotely smart on
Speaker 5: foreign policy to impress Western journalists. All you have to
Speaker 5: do is name the countries correctly half the time. Because
Speaker 5: he got them wrong the other half the time. But
Speaker 5: at least he got them like, he was able to
Speaker 5: name them, and it's like, oh wow, okay, that's pretty good.
Speaker 5: Those those are foreign countries and he said their names
Speaker 5: and probably knows the capitals.
Speaker 3: That's impressive.
Speaker 4: The irony here is listen.
Speaker 1: You know, before or Joe Biden was complicit involved in
Speaker 1: funding and committing a genocide, I was making the case
Speaker 1: for his domestic policy because there are genuinely things there
Speaker 1: that are worth talking about and celebrating. And you know,
Speaker 1: this is why I think Bernie and AOC and others
Speaker 1: foolishly and you know, without any sort of moral character
Speaker 1: are his jauntest allies at this point. But if you
Speaker 1: look at anti trust, if you look at labor, it
Speaker 1: is a break in a major improvement from Obama. But
Speaker 1: you know, if you support those sorts of policies, it
Speaker 1: makes no sense to try to push them through such
Speaker 1: a damaged vessel that it's going to do nothing but
Speaker 1: undercut the power of that sort of politics, because people
Speaker 1: will say, hey, Joe Biden ran on you know, rent
Speaker 1: control and ran on anti trust in this program, you
Speaker 1: guys won, and he got absolutely wiped out across the country.
Speaker 1: So I think it's an incredibly foolish direction to go.
Speaker 1: And I have a couple of poles I just want
Speaker 1: to put up to before we bring in Dave Weigel
Speaker 1: to talk about this sort of you know, major Democratic
Speaker 1: elite push to get him out, because I don't want
Speaker 1: people to have the impression that this is just an
Speaker 1: elite push to get him out.
Speaker 4: Let's put this up on the screen.
Speaker 1: Seventy percent of the country in a new poll says
Speaker 1: they want Joe Biden to withdraw from the presidential race.
Speaker 4: And oh, by the way, that includes sixty.
Speaker 1: Five percent of Democrats and seventy seven percent of Independence.
Speaker 1: By the way, fifty seven percent of the country also
Speaker 1: wants to Donald Trump to withdraw, in a sign of
Speaker 1: how not enamored the country is with having these two
Speaker 1: men engage in a rematch.
Speaker 2: Here.
Speaker 1: And then let's put this next piece up on the
Speaker 1: screen from Politico, because this is also interesting, you know,
Speaker 1: Biden is. Biden indicated that if he could be convinced
Speaker 1: that he couldn't win and someone else could, then maybe
Speaker 1: that would be a factor in consideration. Well, you've got
Speaker 1: new polling that looks at a range of alternative Democratic candidates.
Speaker 1: They all run ahead of Biden by an average of
Speaker 1: three points across battleground states. Now it's interesting here, though,
Speaker 1: Ryan is that and this won't be a really surprise
Speaker 1: to us, But Vice President Kamala harrisil runs better than Biden,
Speaker 1: but he's the weakest of the potential alternatives. And effectively,
Speaker 1: the more closely tied you are to the Biden administration,
Speaker 1: the worse you perform. So the strongest potential candidates were
Speaker 1: Senator Mark Kelly of Arizona and Maryland Governor Wes Moore,
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro, and Michigan Governor Gretchen Wimer, all
Speaker 1: for out paced Biden by roughly five points across battleground states.
Speaker 1: So you can see this pulling and it being leaked
Speaker 1: to Politico Playbook, which is the ultimate you know, DC
Speaker 1: insider group. You could see this also as a play
Speaker 1: against Kamala Harris of making the accurate case that Listen,
Speaker 1: if you really are prioritizing defeating Donald Trump, and you're
Speaker 1: willing to push out Joe Biden to do it, why
Speaker 1: are you then going to go automatically for the next
Speaker 1: weakest possible candidate here in Kamala Harris.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and putting in.
Speaker 5: The astronaut hero Mark Kelly feels a little bit too
Speaker 5: nineteen nineties, but of course, yeah, like all of them
Speaker 5: are going to outperform Kamala Harris. I feel terrible saying
Speaker 5: it to the our coconut pilled audience, who is really
Speaker 5: rallied behind her.
Speaker 3: But yeah, she's not. She's not the most electable of
Speaker 3: that bunch.
Speaker 5: I don't think now she might have it locked up anyway,
Speaker 5: Like that be just because of the nature of the
Speaker 5: Democratic Party establishment that you know, they're only willing to
Speaker 5: kind of rock the boat so much.
Speaker 3: On the other hand, like if.
Speaker 5: You're rocking the boat so much that you're ousting your
Speaker 5: presumptive nominee two months before the election, like you're in
Speaker 5: revolutionary time, just go all the way, like take the
Speaker 5: final step and open the process up and let these
Speaker 5: candidates compete and see who wins. And if Kamala Harris wins,
Speaker 5: then great, she shouldn't just fall out of a coconut tree, right.
Speaker 4: That's right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think there's a chance she would win
Speaker 1: in that open process that you know, quote unquote open process. Listen,
Speaker 1: we're at a place where the chance for a truly
Speaker 1: democratic process unfortunately has passed, and that is the fault
Speaker 1: of Joe Biden, his aides and democratic elites who closed
Speaker 1: down really a primary process. I mean, in some cases literally,
Speaker 1: first of all, they had no debates. Second of all,
Speaker 1: in certain states they literally did not have a primary
Speaker 1: agents pulled everybody off the ballot. So, you know, the
Speaker 1: chance to have a truly dramacratic process has unfortunately passed.
Speaker 1: But I agree with your assessment that even through an
Speaker 1: open convention process, where you have a public watching these
Speaker 1: beaches and watching this all unfold, sort of celebrity Apprentice style,
Speaker 1: it could create a lot of energy and excitement, and
Speaker 1: I think really could be a problem for the Trump
Speaker 1: vance ticket, who right now think that they are you know,
Speaker 1: sailing free and clear and are on their way to
Speaker 1: a historic landslide in which they're very likely to take
Speaker 1: the I mean, they're almost definitely going to take this
Speaker 1: at it and very likely to take the house along
Speaker 1: with them.
Speaker 5: Yeah, you get a Bravo production crew and you put
Speaker 5: the cameras around each one of these jab pritz Kershapiro, Whitmer.
Speaker 3: All of them.
Speaker 5: You have them them follow them around just like their
Speaker 5: reality TV stars. You edit that, you roll the episodes out.
Speaker 5: You've got to have meach do confessionals, you know, talking
Speaker 5: about how they're thinking about each each scene.
Speaker 3: Then you roll that through the convention.
Speaker 5: You will have a public I'm half choking, but not
Speaker 5: really like you will like you will have a public
Speaker 5: that is actually connected to you as a political party.
Speaker 5: Like imagine that a sense of legitimacy between the public.
Speaker 5: The public feels like there is a sense of legitimacy
Speaker 5: between themselves and these reality TV empires that have have
Speaker 5: grown up, like they feel like their sentiments are democratically
Speaker 5: represented on the screen because the way that they feel,
Speaker 5: the way that they post on on social media, is
Speaker 5: then reflected back to them in the show. As people
Speaker 5: respond to that and feel the heat that is American
Speaker 5: culture now. And whichever political party recognizes that first, it
Speaker 5: is going to be the one that makes a real
Speaker 5: connection with the American public and the current Republican Party
Speaker 5: is led by a reality TV star. He happens to
Speaker 5: be a deranged one. So that's the only thing that
Speaker 5: gives the Democratic Party an opening. But it's right there
Speaker 5: for the taking if they would just, you know, open
Speaker 5: up their imaginations.
Speaker 9: A little bit.
Speaker 4: Yeah, let's build some parasocial relationships with.
Speaker 1: Jamie Mark, Kelly Crest, Whitmer, Gavin Newsom, the whole, the.
Speaker 4: Whole lot of them.
Speaker 3: Got to be first name with all of them. And
Speaker 3: that's right, JB.
Speaker 4: Yeah, all right, Ryan, let's go ahead and get to
Speaker 4: Dave Wigel.
Speaker 5: Joining us from her home Crystal Ball and joining us
Speaker 5: from Milwaukee, Dave Weigel, Dave, welcome to the program.
Speaker 9: It's gonna be bad. I have all my lanyards today.
Speaker 3: Excellent.
Speaker 5: I would love it if you were like one lanyard
Speaker 5: short and live during the interview. You just get dragged,
Speaker 5: drag you out, kicking and screaming before we start real quickly. Uh,
Speaker 5: as I told all of you, Jeremy and I launched
Speaker 5: drop site news last week. Breaking points viewers can get
Speaker 5: a discount code for that uh drop site news dot
Speaker 5: com slash counterpoints for that code. I actually interviewed Dave
Speaker 5: Weigel last week about that he got to see our
Speaker 5: little like we had a whole what do you call
Speaker 5: that thing where it's a giant banner that has the
Speaker 5: logo I called.
Speaker 9: The steppen repeat.
Speaker 6: It.
Speaker 3: That's right.
Speaker 12: They take the photos of what they're wearing and then
Speaker 12: they walked the next thing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, carpet situation, Dave.
Speaker 5: Dave and I did the red carpet in front of
Speaker 5: the drop site logo. We were both looking very good.
Speaker 5: But so thanks thanks for joining us from Milwaukee. Let's
Speaker 5: let's first roll Jonathan Carl from last night with some
Speaker 5: with some exclusive reporting here. Good nice little get from
Speaker 5: Jonathan Carl about the pressure that Democratic Party leaders are
Speaker 5: putting directly on Biden, and.
Speaker 13: I am told that the pressure from Democratic leaders for
Speaker 13: Biden to get out of the race is intensifying. In fact,
Speaker 13: one person who has been out there publicly defending Biden
Speaker 13: told me just a short while ago, Biden is going
Speaker 13: to see the whole house of cards come down soon.
Speaker 13: As for that meeting in Rehoboth, Delaware, I am told
Speaker 13: that this was a one on one meeting just the
Speaker 13: Senate leader and the president and the Chuck Schumer forcefully
Speaker 13: made the case that it would be better for Biden,
Speaker 13: better for the Democratic Party, and better for the country
Speaker 13: if he were to bow out of the race. And David,
Speaker 13: when I went to Schumer's office to ask them about
Speaker 13: to tell them I was in to report this and
Speaker 13: tell you this tonight, absolutely no denial from Senator Schumer's office.
Speaker 13: They only said this Leader Schumer conveyed the views of
Speaker 13: his caucus, in other words, the views of Democratic senators.
Speaker 13: I am also told that Jakim Jeffreys, the Democratic leader
Speaker 13: in the House, has expressed similar views directly to the president.
Speaker 5: Now, Dave, the Democratic leaders would probably prefer to do
Speaker 5: this quietly. The fact that it leaking out tells us
Speaker 5: what about how this situation is unfolding.
Speaker 12: Yes, and it was frozen for really maybe forty eight hours,
Speaker 12: and then I've gotten corked again over the week.
Speaker 9: I remember talking to people in the Trump.
Speaker 12: Campaign in Milwaukee on Monday evening, and one point they.
Speaker 9: Made was this is good.
Speaker 12: The current climate is good for us, as horrible as
Speaker 12: it is what happened in Butler, because Democrats are frozen
Speaker 12: and they're stuck with Biden. And they started thawing out
Speaker 12: hours later, really the next day, they're getting data all
Speaker 12: the time. I've we've a lot of us are recovering this,
Speaker 12: are sent screenshots of data, recaps of conversations, polling. There
Speaker 12: has been nothing that suggests that Biden to recover his position.
Speaker 12: He's been doing poorly generally in interviews since then. And yes,
Speaker 12: the timing is interesting. It feels like from what we know,
Speaker 12: Democrats were talking to Biden on Saturday. Had the shooting
Speaker 12: not happened, we might be seventy two hours ahead. What's
Speaker 12: happening right now with a lot of Democrats being willing
Speaker 12: to call on him to leave.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's not just Schumer in that reported conversation.
Speaker 1: We can put a next piece up on the screen.
Speaker 1: Adam Schiff came forward publicly and called on Biden to
Speaker 1: drop out, citing serious concerns he can't win. SHIFT being
Speaker 1: a very close ally of Nancy Pelosi, and this being
Speaker 1: seen sort of in the same way that Clooney was
Speaker 1: seen as like a proxy for Obama, Shift is seen
Speaker 1: as being a proxy for Nancy Pelosi. But we also
Speaker 1: have news specifically with regard to Pelosi we can put
Speaker 1: up on the screen. DEM's are calling her with concerns
Speaker 1: she's taking detailed notes, they say, of district polls. In
Speaker 1: one call, she gave a clear indication she wanted Biden
Speaker 1: off the ticket. One dem who spoke to her said
Speaker 1: she's the political voice of the dem caucus right now.
Speaker 1: We also have reporting with regards to Hakeem Jeffries making
Speaker 1: these having direct conversations as well, and also indicating the
Speaker 1: deep concerns of himself and his caucus. So, Dave, it
Speaker 1: seems like there's been sort of like closing of the ranks,
Speaker 1: and perhaps while the conversation was frozen in the wake
Speaker 1: of that assassination attempt, there was a lot happening behind
Speaker 1: the scenes that we weren't aware of.
Speaker 12: Yes, there was Pelosis and key figure in this publicly
Speaker 12: if you went on Morning Joe. And the way the
Speaker 12: Democrats talk about the decision has been fascinating because Biden
Speaker 12: has made a public decision, and they keep repeating this
Speaker 12: mantra that he needs time to make make a decision
Speaker 12: meaning the other one meaning that he needs to come
Speaker 12: come around and leave and leave and leave the race. Yes,
Speaker 12: the fact that she has been mobilizing people who are
Speaker 12: worried about saving their seats says everything, and it is a.
Speaker 9: It's even the conspiracy is a little bit too messy
Speaker 9: for that.
Speaker 12: Here's another example of I was working, uh the idea
Speaker 12: of this virtual vote to be held as early as
Speaker 12: possible before the convention because of state vaalid deadlines, state
Speaker 12: out deadlines that are not necessarily more because they got
Speaker 12: changed even this week that was getting that was getting moved,
Speaker 12: and Democrats we run able to keep a story straight
Speaker 12: on it.
Speaker 9: I was talking to them yesterday or sorry, two days ago.
Speaker 12: Their argument was they needed at a press conference in Milwaukee,
Speaker 12: even the chair of the Democrat part Milwaukee all saying
Speaker 12: we need to have a virtual vote early, probably in July,
Speaker 12: to get over these deadlines. A day later, the DNC's
Speaker 12: rules committee says, all right, we still want to do
Speaker 12: a virtual vote.
Speaker 9: We want to do it in August. That was another move.
Speaker 12: It was a much more wonky inside baseball move, but
Speaker 12: something the party was confidently talking about doing as early
Speaker 12: as next week. They're now saying they're going to do
Speaker 12: in August. And that is all to make space for
Speaker 12: Biden to make this other decision and.
Speaker 9: Not to run.
Speaker 12: They're really trying to phone the runway for Biden to
Speaker 12: leave and for the Party, the delegates that are all
Speaker 12: almost all committed in ninety nine percent of them to
Speaker 12: get used to the idea that for the good of
Speaker 12: the country they had to dump them.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and the reporting is that it came Jefferies and
Speaker 5: Chuck Schumer directly weighed in to push this deadline back,
Speaker 5: while that while the Jamie Harrison and Biden administrator trying
Speaker 5: to trying to cling to it because they they somehow
Speaker 5: keep thinking that something is going to save them and
Speaker 5: change change the reality. We've got Chris armand did you
Speaker 5: did you put up C three this tweet on? Yeah,
Speaker 5: so you can put up C three. That's which is
Speaker 5: reporting showing basically what I was just saying that Schumer
Speaker 5: so and shoot, that Schumer and Jeffreys were responsible for this.
Speaker 5: If you move on then to see four, David want
Speaker 5: to get your get your take on the whole kind
Speaker 5: of Bernie and AOC world standing so firmly behind him.
Speaker 3: Great.
Speaker 5: Isaac Chatner interview with Bernie Sanders. His argument, it's it's
Speaker 5: it's worth reading this as C four, he says, responding
Speaker 5: to you know whether or not Biden is a good
Speaker 5: Kennedy said, I'm not aware that anyone thinks maybe Dave
Speaker 5: can do a better Bernie, I'm not aware that anyone
Speaker 5: thinks that Joe Biden is the best candidate in the
Speaker 5: history of the world, or that he's an ideal candidate.
Speaker 5: And nobody will argue with you that he has a well,
Speaker 5: he had admitted it. Sometimes he gets confused about names.
Speaker 5: You're right, Sometimes he doesn't put three sentences together. It
Speaker 5: is true, but the reality of the moment is, in
Speaker 5: my view, he is the best candidate that Democrats have
Speaker 5: for a variety of reasons, and trying in an unprecedented
Speaker 5: way to take him off the ticket would do a
Speaker 5: lot more harm than good. So Dave, there's an incredible
Speaker 5: argument there. I would rather have a present. He doesn't
Speaker 5: put three sentences together, but he's still the man.
Speaker 3: What's going on here?
Speaker 8: Yeah?
Speaker 9: Yeah, that journey has been, as usual consistent on this.
Speaker 12: I followed him in Wisconsin right after the debate, and
Speaker 12: his arguments to me there was Biden's not the best debater,
Speaker 12: he might not even be the best speaker, but he's
Speaker 12: the nominee and he is worried about replacing him. There's
Speaker 12: something you hear, especially from older Democrats who have memories
Speaker 12: in the sixties and the seventies that it would be
Speaker 12: so chaotic the base witch Biden that it wouldn't be
Speaker 12: worth it. And I've talked to him Bolster, you say
Speaker 12: the same thing. We look at the data. The incumbency
Speaker 12: advantage is so powerful that if you replace that with chaos,
Speaker 12: you're going to be worse off. I don't I didn't
Speaker 12: read this as Biden worrying about Tamal Arris. I do
Speaker 12: know people on the left who are worried about that,
Speaker 12: who say that Biden has had incredibly strong pro labor, instance,
Speaker 12: anti trust instincts, anti monopoly instincts, getting out of afghanistank
Speaker 12: consistant that she might bring in different people who are
Speaker 12: more friendly to Silicon Valley and into big tech, and
Speaker 12: I had that was not the same. That's not been
Speaker 12: the Sanders argument out loud. I don't think that's much
Speaker 12: from the left. You see what the left is doing
Speaker 12: right now of getting more concessions from Biden on what
Speaker 12: he's running on.
Speaker 9: That is the progressive game here and again, Brady's done
Speaker 9: this forever. This.
Speaker 12: Bardian's argument sixteen and twenty when he had influence on
Speaker 12: the platform was to excite people and to give them
Speaker 12: a positive reason of book for you. You need to
Speaker 12: get off of Trump fashion and you need to talk
Speaker 12: about progressive things you can do for people that improve
Speaker 12: their lives. So he's been successful with this mediatory in
Speaker 12: doing that, where he departs from a lot of the party,
Speaker 12: including a lot of senators, is thinking Biden is southigible
Speaker 12: enough that he can he can deliver that. A lot
Speaker 12: of them think they distn't disagree, all right, the party
Speaker 12: should be talking more about Medicare, price caps, affordable housing,
Speaker 12: rent caps, et cetera.
Speaker 9: But Biden can't do it.
Speaker 12: Biden tried to do it at the end of a
Speaker 12: doubcapty event this week you saw in Las Vegas, and
Speaker 12: couldn't state properly the rent control policy like that.
Speaker 9: That's the disagreement, right.
Speaker 1: Whereas on NATO, you know, we talked earlier about this
Speaker 1: leaked call with the moderate Democrats where when he's really
Speaker 1: forcefully trying to make his case, it's all about NATO
Speaker 1: and what he's done in the Asian Pacific and things
Speaker 1: that you know, frankly, middle class American the working class
Speaker 1: Americans really don't care about.
Speaker 4: But that's his that's what is ossified there.
Speaker 1: That's what remains in terms of what he can make
Speaker 1: the most forceful case on I saw the podse Bros.
Speaker 1: Saying yeah, Project twenty twenty five, that's you know, it's bad.
Speaker 1: It's too bad that the president of the United States
Speaker 1: and the Democratic nominee never brings it up or mentions it,
Speaker 1: or talks about it, or seems capable of, you know,
Speaker 1: articulating that argument against the Republican Party. Dave, I wonder
Speaker 1: what you make of some of the sort of tea
Speaker 1: leaves reading and reporting that we're getting of Biden being
Speaker 1: a little more open to the conversation. He made these
Speaker 1: comments to be et about, Hey, if I got a
Speaker 1: medical diagnosis, then maybe I'd changed my mind. Of course
Speaker 1: he got diagnosed with COVID, but I don't think that
Speaker 1: was necessarily the medical diagnosis he was talking about. You
Speaker 1: also had some of this behind the scenes reporting that
Speaker 1: now rather than just saying, you know, I'm in and
Speaker 1: that's it, he's saying, well, do you think Kamala can win?
Speaker 1: He's more open to seeing some of the polling and
Speaker 1: the data in that direction. You know, do you what
Speaker 1: are you hearing and what do you make of those indications?
Speaker 12: Well, if you listened about Biden's statements, especially interviewers were
Speaker 12: pressing him on the polling and electability.
Speaker 9: He'd often just see the polls are wrong.
Speaker 12: He could say that he was often polls where every
Speaker 12: public piece of data said that he wasn't. And that
Speaker 12: was that was a result of in getting different feedback,
Speaker 12: different information from a close circle of advisors and Steve
Speaker 12: Schetty from Valerie Biden. It became clear to Democrats that
Speaker 12: he was very poistered and being told just different things
Speaker 12: that they were seeing. This is it is very data driven,
Speaker 12: this attempt to get him off the ticket, because what
Speaker 12: Pelosi and other Democrats are using is their own polling
Speaker 12: that says, no, we are now underwatering districts that Biden
Speaker 12: won by fifteen points, and that's we can't possibly win
Speaker 12: the election. We're now underwater Wisconsin. They still have polling
Speaker 12: that says their Senate cans a running ahead. But they
Speaker 12: realized that was not what Biden was reading. Biden was
Speaker 12: just in disbelief. Briden would go to Wisconsin get a
Speaker 12: good crowd in Madison, which not not to be too disparaging.
Speaker 9: The Democrats should get a good crowd in Madison.
Speaker 12: It should be a place where you can get a
Speaker 12: Democratic crowd and came away saying, oh, I'm still popular
Speaker 12: in Wisconsin, but all of their data outside that that
Speaker 12: wasn't getting to him.
Speaker 9: Said, no, he's not.
Speaker 12: It is a winnable state where our message resonates and
Speaker 12: not with him because of the age question.
Speaker 9: So that's part of what they're doing here.
Speaker 12: He has been he has been getting information from close
Speaker 12: friends and Biden loyalists who were were with him when
Speaker 12: he was losing forty years ago.
Speaker 9: That was wrong. That was not what the data they
Speaker 9: were seeing.
Speaker 12: And as when it comes to the common stuff they're
Speaker 12: trying to get him at, there's data all the time
Speaker 12: that says even though the vice president is not popular,
Speaker 12: that she doesn't have the age problem and that she
Speaker 12: performs him by two three points in polls. Mean you
Speaker 12: really did see this the importance the New York Times
Speaker 12: Ciena Pool, which we were all got familiar with in
Speaker 12: twenty twenty, when it came out saying Biden was more
Speaker 12: electable in.
Speaker 9: Swing states than Bernie and especially than Larren. That was important.
Speaker 9: The Democrats read that too. Democrat members read that too.
Speaker 12: Sienna comes out and says, Harris is in the scoring
Speaker 12: position and Biden isn't.
Speaker 9: And that's the kind of data they went him to see.
Speaker 5: Interesting on the spectrum of whether it will be Harris
Speaker 5: or whether it will go to an open convention. If
Speaker 5: like ten is like, certainly it would be Harris. If
Speaker 5: Biden steps aside, zero is like, it would definitely go
Speaker 5: to an open convention. What's your sense of the conventional
Speaker 5: wisdom among kind of Democrats at this point of you
Speaker 5: know where where we are on that spectrum.
Speaker 12: Oh, it's like nine that it would be Harris and
Speaker 12: it would be a different running mate, which if you
Speaker 12: saw yesterday, Republicans are sort of making fun of that
Speaker 12: and not agreeing to the VP debate because they said
Speaker 12: it be they named you know, JB. Pritzker and a
Speaker 12: bunch of other Democrats is the likely person. Devance is
Speaker 12: going to debate.
Speaker 9: No Democrats apart from outside.
Speaker 12: Strategists who just doesn't know that the vice president is
Speaker 12: not that popular and they think Democrat acts to do better,
Speaker 12: which isn't crazy inside the party, just delegates.
Speaker 9: Again, we're bround to the Biden Harris ticket.
Speaker 12: Really liked Kamala Harris and like the idea of mobilizing
Speaker 12: behind the first female president in a high state scenario
Speaker 12: where they're bigger underdogs they were in twenty sixteen. But
Speaker 12: the idea of pushing her aside for a this has
Speaker 12: been the problem for six months. Right for vision her
Speaker 12: aside for somebody who is not a black female vice president,
Speaker 12: you would also be saying the entire four year Biden
Speaker 12: administration cannot cannot be defended to both members of it
Speaker 12: who got elected. Sorry, she's not popular. There's not a
Speaker 12: reason that to keep her off the ticket. Apart from polling.
Speaker 12: There are two reasons keep Biden off polling, an age
Speaker 12: which suggest that he can never recover from a polling
Speaker 12: for her is that she is not popular now. But
Speaker 12: if she just gets there and articulates even the message
Speaker 12: of Biden is supposed so should be better. So I
Speaker 12: have not I have not heard from people actually involved
Speaker 12: in democratic politics closely as opposed to people who just
Speaker 12: talk about it or donate. I've not heard we need
Speaker 12: to dumb Harris and replace somebody else. It would be
Speaker 12: we need to stage manage this so that Biden finds
Speaker 12: a way to say I cannot continue this, but to
Speaker 12: pass the literally pass the torch, and the group passed
Speaker 12: the torch Progressive group of what wasn't this day? Want Harris,
Speaker 12: I will pass the torch to my vice president, defend
Speaker 12: our record, remind voters of how great this record is,
Speaker 12: and get past the Republican lies about it, which are fair.
Speaker 9: For example, I heard Republican.
Speaker 12: Convention last night the wages are down and oil production
Speaker 12: is down, which are not true. You have to do
Speaker 12: that with Harris and then a governor. That's where the
Speaker 12: party moved to.
Speaker 1: So Dave bottom line it for us if you could, like,
Speaker 1: what are the odds at this point that Biden is
Speaker 1: going to drop when you've got Obama, Schumer, Pelosi, Jeffrey's
Speaker 1: most Democratic donors moving against him.
Speaker 4: Is that enough to push him out?
Speaker 1: Or can he just you know, him and Hunter and
Speaker 1: Jill and Raschetti and Donalin just hang on for dear
Speaker 1: life and grind it down, as I think you said
Speaker 1: to us last time.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I moved to fifty to fifty, which feels a
Speaker 9: little coward.
Speaker 12: I mean, really, just if Biden doesn't want to give
Speaker 12: this up and become a lame duct if he cannot
Speaker 12: be convinced that he would be a great figure in
Speaker 12: the party if he was willing to give give this
Speaker 12: up for a chance to win, then no, no one
Speaker 12: can force him to. People always ask me, what about
Speaker 12: the delic rules? Is their way to force him out?
Speaker 12: If you handle those rules, it is clear he's the
Speaker 12: only person who can say Joe Biden's not running for
Speaker 12: president anymore.
Speaker 9: But I think it's fifty to fifty because he is
Speaker 9: getting this data and.
Speaker 12: The message they're trying to import to impart to him
Speaker 12: is you have the choice of a one legacy of
Speaker 12: a term in passing the baton to vice president. And
Speaker 12: it was always very important to him that he was
Speaker 12: a vice president for the verse black president. He said that,
Speaker 12: Or you can be the guy who handed the keys
Speaker 12: back to Donald Trump and a Republican majority Republican Supreme Court.
Speaker 12: If they impress that on him and he buys it,
Speaker 12: then that's why he goes. But I do think that's
Speaker 12: only fifty to fifty.
Speaker 1: Imagine how pissed the Republicans would be if they've done
Speaker 1: a whole convention against the wrong candidate.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 12: I was talking to Charlie Kirk on the floor last
Speaker 12: night and he was saying he was saying, he's trying
Speaker 12: to get the word to Trump, please put more Kamala
Speaker 12: in your speech on Thursday, because he's very work It
Speaker 12: wouldn't say he's worried he thinks they can beat Kamala.
Speaker 9: He was a little bit worried.
Speaker 12: Yeah, as you said, the RNC was very Biden focused
Speaker 12: and a lot of that messaging would go out the
Speaker 12: door and they need to reboot, so they definitely the
Speaker 12: vibe I get in our Milwaukee is probablycause it's still
Speaker 12: rather run against Biben.
Speaker 1: Gotcha all right, Dave, thank you so much for your
Speaker 1: time and giving us some reporting there from on the
Speaker 1: ground in Milwaukee as well.
Speaker 4: It's great to see you.
Speaker 9: Thank you great to be here.
Speaker 1: So we have a lot of updates about possible motivations
Speaker 1: of the shooter or lack thereof. We have lots of
Speaker 1: updates with regard to just what is an increasingly mind
Speaker 1: blowing security failure finger pointing between the Secret Service in
Speaker 1: the local police who were involved in attempting to protect
Speaker 1: the president in Butler, Pennsylvania.
Speaker 4: But let's start with this.
Speaker 1: We had the FBI briefing members of Congress on what
Speaker 1: they were able to find on the shooter's phone and
Speaker 1: his electronic devices, and apparently he had searched along with
Speaker 1: things like major depressive disorder. He had also searched images
Speaker 1: of a variety of public figures, including Trump and Biden,
Speaker 1: along with dates of Trump appearances and the DNC in Chicago.
Speaker 1: According to a person who was on the call, Ryan,
Speaker 1: you had some interesting commentary earlier in the show about
Speaker 1: you know, the profile that is emerging of the attempted
Speaker 1: assassin at this point.
Speaker 5: Yeah, the people's first impression, I think of this of
Speaker 5: this guy once they started to get just a little
Speaker 5: bit of information, was that it's this he is a
Speaker 5: standard issue school shooter, which is the fact that such
Speaker 5: a thing exists is maybe the fiercest indictment of contemporary
Speaker 5: American culture that you can come up with. So it
Speaker 5: appears that he had some depressive personality and was just
Speaker 5: searching around for, you know, the locations of Biden and Trump.
Speaker 5: You know, Biden, you know, by not really campaign, not
Speaker 5: going not really going out in the public, may have
Speaker 5: saved himself here. But imagine Trump's like, horrible luck that
Speaker 5: you've got this depressive, intelligent, you know, twenty year old
Speaker 5: who is just looking to go out in a blaze
Speaker 5: of glory. He's searching around for you know, famous figures
Speaker 5: and celebrities, and it's like, oh wow, Donald Trump is
Speaker 5: coming to Butler, Pennsylvania. And then further like there's a
Speaker 5: ladder is leading up to this low roof that is
Speaker 5: just one hundred and fifty yards away from where he's
Speaker 5: going to be, and oh look at that. Nobody's going
Speaker 5: to be guarding. It just literally unbelievable.
Speaker 4: Actually, yeah, no, it truly is.
Speaker 1: I mean, as far as we can tell at this point,
Speaker 1: it's everyone. And of course immediately passes through his any
Speaker 1: political background leanings. You had some reporting about this scam
Speaker 1: pack Democratic scam pack that he gave fifteen dollars to
Speaker 1: on Joe Biden's inauguration day. But then on the other hand,
Speaker 1: he's a registered Republican and so based on this search history, yeah,
Speaker 1: portrait really starts to emerge of someone who I think,
Speaker 1: you know, the portrait of a school shooter is exactly correct.
Speaker 1: Just it's almost like suicide by cop. Wanted to be notorious,
Speaker 1: wanted to be known in the history books, and was
Speaker 1: looking for any opportunity to do so, whether it was Trump, Biden,
Speaker 1: or some other famous political or other figure that he
Speaker 1: was going to try to take out, and then you know,
Speaker 1: the mounting information about the stunning nature of this security
Speaker 1: failure is really is mind blowing. One of the latest
Speaker 1: comments from the Secret Service director Kimberly cheatles she was
Speaker 1: pressed on why no one was stationed on this roof,
Speaker 1: which seemed like a you know, very basic obvious. You
Speaker 1: don't want someone to have a clear line of sight
Speaker 1: at the former president's head from within very easy striking distance.
Speaker 1: Why wasn't there anyone on the roof? She says that
Speaker 1: it was a little sloped, so it may have been
Speaker 1: a security concern.
Speaker 4: Let's take a listen to that.
Speaker 3: When you saw the events unfold on Saturday, shock.
Speaker 14: And then concern obviously for the former president.
Speaker 15: Investigators now trying to determine whether roof access had been
Speaker 15: properly locked down. The shoulder climbing up seemingly unimpeded about
Speaker 15: four hundred feet from the stage with a direct line
Speaker 15: of sight on the former president.
Speaker 3: Should that roof have been secure? Period?
Speaker 14: That building in particular has a sloped roof at its
Speaker 14: highest point, and so you know, there's a safety factor
Speaker 14: that would be considered there that we wouldn't want to
Speaker 14: put somebody up on a sloped roof, and so you know,
Speaker 14: the decision was made to secure the building from inside.
Speaker 1: This is of course being roundly mocked, as it should be,
Speaker 1: because even if I mean, first of all, the safety concern, okay,
Speaker 1: the safety concern you're supposed to be concerned with is
Speaker 1: protecting the former president of the United States and the
Speaker 1: Republican presidential nominee. And second of all, Ryan, you look
Speaker 1: at that rub and it's also barely sloped, so it's
Speaker 1: just an utterly mockable, preposterous dodge here from the Secret
Speaker 1: Service director.
Speaker 5: It would be like saying, you know, why did you
Speaker 5: leave him exposed to the shooter for so long? And
Speaker 5: it's like, well, you know, you know, bullets can kill people,
Speaker 5: and so if our agents would have, you know, covered
Speaker 5: the president while he was being shot, you know that
Speaker 5: that's a real security concern because the agents, you know,
Speaker 5: could have been shot, which is true, but also that's
Speaker 5: the job of the Secret Service. And also that's like
Speaker 5: a two degree slope, like it's okay, like you're you're
Speaker 5: gonna you're gonna be okay, uh, And the inside versus
Speaker 5: outside is also you know, completely preposterous. How do you
Speaker 5: secure the roof? Of a building from inside of it.
Speaker 5: I mean you don't obviously, but like that that that
Speaker 5: this executive director or whatever title is, it's still in
Speaker 5: her role, is itself shocking?
Speaker 6: It truly?
Speaker 1: Is?
Speaker 7: It?
Speaker 1: Truly is at this point because the basics of the
Speaker 1: failures here, the more we learn about how long they
Speaker 1: had identified the shooter and flagged him as suspicious because
Speaker 1: he tried to bring a rangefinder into the secure area,
Speaker 1: so he was flagged and identified, and then they just
Speaker 1: lost sight of him. You had local police, you had
Speaker 1: him identified thirty minutes before the shooting occurred. You had people,
Speaker 1: local residents on the ground saying we see this guy
Speaker 1: bear crawling up the roof with a gun. You see
Speaker 1: people on the ground at the rally. There's videos that
Speaker 1: we see him. He's got a gun, and Trump is
Speaker 1: still allowed to go out and give his rally speech
Speaker 1: and come within millimeters of this bullet completely.
Speaker 4: Taking him out.
Speaker 1: I mean, if you've looked at these animations, it's utterly insane.
Speaker 1: The Secret Service director was also grilled by a CNN
Speaker 1: reporter about how this rooftop was unsecured and how small
Speaker 1: the protect perimeter ultimately was.
Speaker 4: Let's take a listen to this as well.
Speaker 16: The Secret Service increased security for former President Trump because
Speaker 16: of a credible threat from Oran. You know, I've spoken
Speaker 16: with several people who look at the perimeter hearing that news,
Speaker 16: look at the perimeter and say, how, knowing that there
Speaker 16: was a credible threat against the former president, how could
Speaker 16: that perimeter be so small that it excluded a building
Speaker 16: just one hundred and fifty yards away from the pobium.
Speaker 17: I can't get into the specifics of any threats, but obviously,
Speaker 17: with all of our protectees, we're constantly monitoring the threats
Speaker 17: that are out there, and we design our security plans
Speaker 17: based on that.
Speaker 6: Also depending on the.
Speaker 17: Venue and the environment that we're in, and on that
Speaker 17: particular day, a full advance had been completed. But this
Speaker 17: is also why we are doing an internal review, and
Speaker 17: we look forward to the external review as well. And obviously,
Speaker 17: if you know, there are things that we need to
Speaker 17: change about our policies or our procedures or our methods,
Speaker 17: we are certainly going to do so.
Speaker 16: Was that perimeter too small?
Speaker 17: The perimeter encompassed the area that we needed to secure
Speaker 17: for the event that we had on that day. What
Speaker 17: happened is a terrible incident and should never happen, and
Speaker 17: we are obviously going to make sure that moving forward
Speaker 17: we take whatever lessons that come out of this and
Speaker 17: adjust accordingly.
Speaker 16: Was every element, every part of his from the intelligence
Speaker 16: to the counter assault team, to the detail agents, the
Speaker 16: shift agents, I mean, every element top to bottom of
Speaker 16: the advance in the operation. Was every element increased after
Speaker 16: you learned of this credible threat.
Speaker 17: What we increased was what we felt was appropriate for
Speaker 17: the former president and for that particular event on that day.
Speaker 17: We have been increasing the assets and the resources and
Speaker 17: the staffing that we have been providing to the former
Speaker 17: president since he was a presidential candidate and then the
Speaker 17: presumptive nominated.
Speaker 9: That's what I can tell you.
Speaker 4: That sounds like a no.
Speaker 17: I am not saying I know at all. I'm saying
Speaker 17: that we have continued to increase the resources that we've
Speaker 17: been providing to the former president.
Speaker 4: So you've got the slope roof excuse.
Speaker 1: You've got here a whole bunch of non answers effectively,
Speaker 1: and then the other effort from the Secret Service has
Speaker 1: been to put the blame on the local police who
Speaker 1: were enlisted in the protection effort. And there may be
Speaker 1: some blame to be laid there by the way, but
Speaker 1: let's put this up on the screen.
Speaker 4: New reporting.
Speaker 1: Apparently the local police had alerted the Secret Service before
Speaker 1: Trump's rally on Saturday that they lacked the resources to
Speaker 1: station a patrol car outside a key building where that
Speaker 1: gunman later positioned himself and shot at Trump. This was
Speaker 1: confirmed by the way by the Secret Service that the
Speaker 1: local police department did not have the manpower to assist
Speaker 1: in securing that building. So what it appears from this
Speaker 1: account is that the Secret Service asked them to secure it,
Speaker 1: they said, no, we can't. We just literally don't have
Speaker 1: the resources, and then it wasn't secured. We also have
Speaker 1: more reporting in this article about the early warnings with
Speaker 1: regard to this shooter being identified. Local media reported that
Speaker 1: before the shooting, a municipal counter sniper had called in
Speaker 1: with a report and a photograph of that man, who
Speaker 1: turned out to be crooks acting suspiciously. Another local news
Speaker 1: station reported that officer called in around five forty five pm,
Speaker 1: that is, twenty six minutes before crooks opened fire from
Speaker 1: the roof, and a local newspaper in Beaver County, Pennsylvania
Speaker 1: also reported similarly that that counter sniper Gregory Nicoll made
Speaker 1: a warning of this kind just astonishing.
Speaker 3: Ryan, Yeah, it really is.
Speaker 5: And my early speculation was that perhaps the local police
Speaker 5: that were supposed to secure this building got lazy and
Speaker 5: it was just too hot in the parking lot and
Speaker 5: went inside of the building.
Speaker 3: But it sounds like no, can't even can't even blame
Speaker 3: him for that.
Speaker 5: They said, look, we don't have the manpower to do this,
Speaker 5: and the Secret Service did not respond by then filling
Speaker 5: the gap, which is their job. The answers from the
Speaker 5: secret Secret Service chief just utterly ridiculous.
Speaker 3: Was the perimeter too small?
Speaker 5: She responds by saying, well, the perimeter was the area
Speaker 5: that we were defending. Like stop just giving us definitions
Speaker 5: of things like we know that, but you know you
Speaker 5: were one hundred and fifty yards away. There's a guy
Speaker 5: scampering up a roof and squeezing off like eight shots
Speaker 5: or whatever at the president of the United form president
Speaker 5: of the United States. Just complete and utter failure. And
Speaker 5: it's really impossible to blame Trump supporters who look at
Speaker 5: that and think like they didn't care, like either they
Speaker 5: were actively involved in this or they or they wanted
Speaker 5: it to succeed and so they didn't. They didn't give
Speaker 5: him the resources that he needed. And that was the
Speaker 5: question that the CNN reporter asked there. It's like, Okay,
Speaker 5: the reporting here is that you're claiming I think this
Speaker 5: is I don't believe the reporting on this, but they're
Speaker 5: saying that Iran, you know, there's recent threats that that
Speaker 5: you know, that Iran wants to take out Donald Trump
Speaker 5: in response for him killing Costum SOLMANI. You know, who
Speaker 5: knows if that intel is remotely act or not. But
Speaker 5: if that's the case, that the Secret Service was told
Speaker 5: there's a heightened risk on President Trump.
Speaker 1: And.
Speaker 5: As you can tell from her answer, that they did
Speaker 5: not up the resources that were going to him in
Speaker 5: every in every capacity. You know, she used this kind
Speaker 5: of present tense, like we were increasing the resources that
Speaker 5: we were offering, which suggest that maybe they were pretending
Speaker 5: that they were going to do it in the future.
Speaker 5: You can't really blame Republicans for being paranoid and asking
Speaker 5: questions about, you know, how how firm the Secret Services
Speaker 5: commitment was to this. Now, you know, I still think
Speaker 5: that you know, in competence, but is there some malicious
Speaker 5: incompetence here?
Speaker 3: It's impossible to.
Speaker 4: Say, yeah, I agree with you. There's plenty here too.
Speaker 1: If you're inclined to think that there is some sort
Speaker 1: of conspiracy or, as you put it, very optly malicious incompetence,
Speaker 1: there's plenty of fuel for that narrative.
Speaker 4: There's no doubt about it.
Speaker 1: And we also have an interview with local police talking
Speaker 1: about because one of the things we've also learned is
Speaker 1: that local police had responded to these indications from normal
Speaker 1: citizens on the ground, Hey there's a guy up on
Speaker 1: that roof. They went and attempted to climb up on
Speaker 1: the roof. Then the shooter points at the local police officer,
Speaker 1: he drops to the ground, and then the shooter takes
Speaker 1: aim at the former president at that point, so, you know,
Speaker 1: learning this was part of like, well, what the hell
Speaker 1: you just let him take shots at the former president?
Speaker 1: What the hell happened? Here we have their side of
Speaker 1: the story of how this all unfolded. Let's take a
Speaker 1: listen to that.
Speaker 11: In fact, see an individual on the roof with.
Speaker 3: A weapon, he saw the shooter. He did.
Speaker 18: Your officers are on patrol, they hear that there is
Speaker 18: a suspicious person on the rooftop.
Speaker 6: What did your officers do so.
Speaker 11: Our officers in the area started to converge on the
Speaker 11: building by understanding as they did a full perimeter walk
Speaker 11: of the building, weren't able to see up on the roof.
Speaker 11: Two of the officers went to what appeared to be
Speaker 11: the lowest point from ground to roof. One of the
Speaker 11: officers actually boosted the second officer up high enough for
Speaker 11: him to grab hold of the roof. When he was
Speaker 11: able to pull his head up over the roof, he did,
Speaker 11: in fact see an individual on the roof with a weapon.
Speaker 6: He saw a shooter, he did, and what did the
Speaker 6: shooter do?
Speaker 11: Turned towards him, had the barrel of his weapon pointed
Speaker 11: at the.
Speaker 18: Officer at that point the officers hanging on to the
Speaker 18: side of the roof.
Speaker 3: Yes, unable to pull a gun out, unable.
Speaker 6: To unable to defend himself, unable.
Speaker 18: To reach his radio, any of that.
Speaker 11: Yeah, Yeah, strictly defensive movement for him to lower his head.
Speaker 11: Duck lost his own grip right, fell approximately eight feet
Speaker 11: to the ground. It's a steep drop, that's a good drop.
Speaker 6: Yes.
Speaker 9: Did he get hurt? He did?
Speaker 6: In that moment.
Speaker 18: Did they realize there's a threat right now? To the
Speaker 18: former president.
Speaker 11: They did so, both the boosting officer and the officer
Speaker 11: that fell were both on the radio, indicating that there
Speaker 11: was an individual on the roof that did in fact
Speaker 11: have a weapon.
Speaker 4: Who did they radio?
Speaker 11: So there was a blanket tactical channel. Everyone everyone it
Speaker 11: was on that tackle channel heard it.
Speaker 18: Yes, how much time between that radio communication and the
Speaker 18: gun being fired at the former president?
Speaker 11: I don't have that information.
Speaker 1: I mean, it really is like a Keystone Cops type
Speaker 1: of situation that he's spelling out here where they're getting
Speaker 1: these reports or someone on the roof boosting each other
Speaker 1: on their shoulders to get up there, dropping to the ground,
Speaker 1: completely failing to prevent the threat. And then that key
Speaker 1: question at the end of okay, well, when you put
Speaker 1: this notice out to the blanket tactical channel that everyone
Speaker 1: had access to, how long between then and when shots
Speaker 1: are fired?
Speaker 4: And he doesn't have an answer to that one.
Speaker 5: That's the key question. The reporting is that it's just
Speaker 5: kind of seconds, but that is a key question. If
Speaker 5: there's anything more than seconds involved there then because at
Speaker 5: the same time, the counter sniper for the Secret Service
Speaker 5: had identified and was in communication with leaders at that
Speaker 5: moment and they're saying, no, you don't have authorstion to
Speaker 5: to take this to take this shot. And then that's
Speaker 5: why the counters ever was able to, you know, take
Speaker 5: take the shooter out within seconds of him starting. But
Speaker 5: then it raises the question of just why not get
Speaker 5: Trump down? Okay, let's you don't have to necessarily blow
Speaker 5: the guy's brains out if you're if you're not one
Speaker 5: hundred percent certain of what's going on here. But what's
Speaker 5: so eerie about all of these videos of the crowd
Speaker 5: yelling you know the gun on the roof is you
Speaker 5: can hear Trump speaking in the background. It's like, just
Speaker 5: tackle the guy, take him down, and then if you
Speaker 5: screwed up and it's a false alarm, it's okay, like
Speaker 5: the old man, I'll have a couple of bruises, but
Speaker 5: then he can get back.
Speaker 3: Up and continue delivering his speech.
Speaker 5: So that that is really the moment where kind of
Speaker 5: they're their their refusal to kind of act leave so
Speaker 5: much responsibility on them. It's because we're not expecting them
Speaker 5: to be like Tom Cruise or Jason Bourne and like
Speaker 5: hold onto the roof with one hand and duck down
Speaker 5: and grab their weapon and like shoot behind their back
Speaker 5: or whatever like that. This is not Hollywood, but you
Speaker 5: can like surround the president and protect him right well?
Speaker 1: You also, I mean you would think as a lay
Speaker 1: person they would have some ability to get on the
Speaker 1: roof in a way that if there is you're being
Speaker 1: told there's a credible threat.
Speaker 3: But you got up there. This twenty year old kid
Speaker 3: got up there, right and you're not.
Speaker 1: Able to approach this in any sort of manner other
Speaker 1: than getting boosted on someone's shoulders and then falling to
Speaker 1: the ground. I mean, it's just that's insane. And then
Speaker 1: the fact that we know that there were reports of
Speaker 1: the shooter being suspicious and trying to come in with
Speaker 1: a rangebinder, and then they lose sight of him twenty
Speaker 1: six minutes before Trump goes on. It also raised the
Speaker 1: question why was he allowed to go on stage at
Speaker 1: all when there were such questions being raised and such
Speaker 1: concerns being raised. So I agree with you, it is
Speaker 1: absolutely insane. The Secret Service director is still in place.
Speaker 1: I cannot imagine how that is the case. The slope
Speaker 1: roof thing is utterly preposterous. Non answers and obvious failures,
Speaker 1: utterly preposterous. Like I said, I don't think the local
Speaker 1: police are off the hook here, but if they told
Speaker 1: the Secret Service, we can't. We don't have the manpower
Speaker 1: to secure this roof. The Secret Service was just like,
Speaker 1: I'm sure it's fine, I have will to deal with.
Speaker 1: It's no big deal. Just go inside and you know,
Speaker 1: stay cool inside the building that is supposed to be secured.
Speaker 1: It truly, is it truly is astonishing?
Speaker 3: Yeah, very much.
Speaker 1: All right, Let's get onto the least important story of
Speaker 1: the Morning. The crew over at Morning Joe very incensed
Speaker 1: being taken off the air on Monday because of concerns
Speaker 1: that they may say something inappropriate, inflammatory, et cetera, either
Speaker 1: them or their large panel of guests. They responded to
Speaker 1: this on the air, let's take a listen.
Speaker 19: I wanted to briefly talk to our friends and viewers
Speaker 19: that watch us every day and.
Speaker 3: Talk about what happened yesterday.
Speaker 19: We were told in no uncertain terms on the Sunday
Speaker 19: evening that there was going to be one news feed
Speaker 19: across all NBC News channels yesterday, the Today's Show would
Speaker 19: be Lester hold other people that what you worked with
Speaker 19: on Sunday, and that that was going to be one
Speaker 19: news feed across all NBC News channels, that we were
Speaker 19: going to stay as a network in breaking news mode
Speaker 19: throughout all day yesterday. That did not happen. We don't
Speaker 19: know why that was didn't happen. Our team was not
Speaker 19: given a good answer as to why that didn't happen,
Speaker 19: But it didn't happen. We were also told it was
Speaker 19: going to happen throughout the day, and I guess after
Speaker 19: there was such a strong blowback about yesterday morning, I
Speaker 19: guess they changed their plans and so those plans changed
Speaker 19: as well. So it didn't And you know, we've talked
Speaker 19: about it off the air, We'll talk about it on
Speaker 19: the air, because as we talked about everything on the air,
Speaker 19: we were very surprised, we were very disappointed. And if
Speaker 19: we had known that there wasn't going to be the
Speaker 19: one news feed from NBC News across all NBC News channels, Willie,
Speaker 19: we obviously would have been in yesterday morning.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we al wish we would have been here yesterday.
Speaker 11: We were still or would like to.
Speaker 19: We'd like to figure out exactly why there wasn't that
Speaker 19: one news feed.
Speaker 20: And I think the reason why is this show began
Speaker 20: and continue seventeen years later on being the place where
Speaker 20: you can go to have the hard conversations in a
Speaker 20: civil way. And so it seemed like now more than
Speaker 20: ever is a day time that we would like to
Speaker 20: be on, and I think our viewers agree with that.
Speaker 20: So we continue. We are five minutes past the top
Speaker 20: of the hour.
Speaker 19: And let me just say we next time we're told
Speaker 19: there's going to be a news feed replacing us, we will.
Speaker 13: Be in our chase sitting here, yeah, and the news
Speaker 13: feed will be us, or they can get somebody else
Speaker 13: sitting here.
Speaker 1: Their audience of one Joe Biden is very upset. I'm
Speaker 1: sure that they were taken off there for this day,
Speaker 1: but Ryan, what did you make this whole situation?
Speaker 5: And so what happens if they show up in their
Speaker 5: chairs but nobody turns the cameras on, because I think
Speaker 5: you have to do more than just sit in the chairs.
Speaker 5: But that would be amazing if they sat in their
Speaker 5: chairs and kind of set up a tripod with their
Speaker 5: phones and just went live on his periscope, still a thing.
Speaker 5: It'd be whatever whatever they are like comfortable with at
Speaker 5: that moment. I'm trying, I'm trying to think, like what
Speaker 5: kind of event could make it so that we're like,
Speaker 5: oh man, we can't have Crystal on tomorrow morning.
Speaker 3: It's couldn't go to say or me or Emily or Sagar.
Speaker 5: But it certainly is not a sign of confidence in
Speaker 5: your report, in your team of quote unquote journalists, if
Speaker 5: when things are sensitive you can't actually trust them to
Speaker 5: not embarrass you, or you know the other thing that
Speaker 5: it's possible here that's going on. MSNBC is part of
Speaker 5: a gigantic corporate conglomerate which is susceptible to government action
Speaker 5: and government in action. And it doesn't necessarily mean congressional
Speaker 5: There are a lot of you know, administrative actions that
Speaker 5: that a avengeful government could take that would influence all
Speaker 5: the different tentacles corporate tentacles that the parent company of
Speaker 5: MSNBC has, And maybe they're looking at the polls and seeing,
Speaker 5: oh man, you know, it looks like Trump is coming back.
Speaker 5: Trump is known to be, you know, a man that
Speaker 5: has a long memory when it comes to slights, and
Speaker 5: so we needed to start closing up to him. Now
Speaker 5: that is that that is probably more likely than them
Speaker 5: being concerned about them saying something that would anger like viewers.
Speaker 3: So I don't think. I don't think this was about
Speaker 3: a viewership.
Speaker 5: I think this was a kind of straight up kind
Speaker 5: of political you know, lack of power play.
Speaker 1: Were like asking what is it that they thought that
Speaker 1: they would say that would be so unacceptable because.
Speaker 4: Like it's got to be you're worried about.
Speaker 5: Yeah, like just speculating about or even just like openly
Speaker 5: talking about, well, what if he had been hit and
Speaker 5: how would that play? Like, yeah, what else can what
Speaker 5: else could they be afraid of? That's because you're right,
Speaker 5: this this doesn't seem like a particularly difficult news environment
Speaker 5: to broadcast into.
Speaker 1: Right, It's all you have to do is say political
Speaker 1: violence is wrong, even if it's someone I don't support
Speaker 1: as a candidate. It's you know, you would think that
Speaker 1: they could be trusted just to handle the basics.
Speaker 5: Of that, you would think, But apparently not, because I
Speaker 5: can't think of anything else that they would say that
Speaker 5: would get them in that kind of hot water.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and just to take people like a little bit
Speaker 1: behind the scenes from my now dated cable newsic experience,
Speaker 1: but it's not unusual to have a show that's more
Speaker 1: of an opinion show be preempted by like, you know,
Speaker 1: what's considered sort of the hard news reporters you stick
Speaker 1: a luster hold or whoever their go to now is
Speaker 1: in these breaking news situations. And so it's not like
Speaker 1: that's that crazier than usual, but it sure seems like
Speaker 1: they lied to the Morning Joe people who are like, yeah,
Speaker 1: we're just doing rolling coverage and so we're preempting everyone,
Speaker 1: when really they just were preempting them because they had
Speaker 1: specific concerns about this group. And so, you know, the
Speaker 1: last comments there from Joe basically like we're not doing
Speaker 1: that again, and they're going to have to, you know,
Speaker 1: pry this camera off my face with their cold dead
Speaker 1: hands or whatever. It's kind of a shot at the
Speaker 1: NBC bosses and also an indication of them feeling like,
Speaker 1: especially because of their cozy relationship with this president and
Speaker 1: being his official mouthpieces at this point, that they actually
Speaker 1: have more power in this situation than the NBC bosses do.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and in fact, specifically in this situation, Mike dropsite
Speaker 5: College Jeremy Scahill was scheduled to be interview by Aimin
Speaker 5: at I think seven forty that evening because Amen has
Speaker 5: his opinion show basically on the on the weekend. He
Speaker 5: was going to talk about this new interview he'd done
Speaker 5: with the Palestinian Islamic Jahad second in command, And as
Speaker 5: soon as the shooting happened, I told him, you know,
Speaker 5: use the MSMZ term you're off the hook, Like that's
Speaker 5: what they always tell you when you're canceled, you're off
Speaker 5: the hook. Like and sure enough, like about fifteen minutes later,
Speaker 5: he got an email from the producer like, Yeah, we're
Speaker 5: obviously not going to be talking about to Jeremy Scale
Speaker 5: about this interview that he did. It's just walla wall
Speaker 5: news now about the assassination. That is that is a
Speaker 5: normal thing, but your main show, you know, ought to
Speaker 5: be able to handle news. Like that's the weirdest part.
Speaker 5: And also two days later, we're talking Monday morning, it's
Speaker 5: not as if it's not as if it happened like
Speaker 5: an hour before they went on air, and they're like, oh,
Speaker 5: they'll have time to get their heads right and they're
Speaker 5: going to say something crazy like they had two days
Speaker 5: to cool down.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a great point too. That's amazing that Amon
Speaker 1: wasn't even going to have Jeremy on, to be honest
Speaker 1: with you, Aman's great. Yeah, full disclay. Aman's an old
Speaker 1: like one of the few people and some REMMBC days,
Speaker 1: and it's shown a lot of courage, especially in the
Speaker 1: face of many being let go clearly for his views
Speaker 1: on Israel Palestine and his willingness to conduct difficult interviews.
Speaker 1: So Aimon being willing to host Jeremy for this conversation
Speaker 1: he had with Palestinian Islamic jihad leaders is good on
Speaker 1: him for that one, and hopefully he'll he'll be able
Speaker 1: to get Jeremy back on to.
Speaker 4: Have some of those conversations.
Speaker 3: Actually it might have been about Thamas Fishers. I don't
Speaker 3: think his Pija.
Speaker 5: Interview was out yet, but either way, I hope, I
Speaker 5: hope that our kind words about Aimin are not used
Speaker 5: against him in ternally.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we hate it.
Speaker 1: He's terrible, all right, Ryan, thank you so much for
Speaker 1: helping me out with the show this morning. It's always
Speaker 1: great to hear your thoughts and insights on all of
Speaker 1: these issues, so I'm really grateful to you for that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's just a pleasure to be here. And we
Speaker 5: don't we don't get to do this enough because it's
Speaker 5: what I'm feeling. I'm filling in for you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's great chance for the left wing dominance of
Speaker 3: the show today.
Speaker 4: That's right.
Speaker 1: We did get Emily in there at the top, so
Speaker 1: people got their their dose of right wingness into the
Speaker 1: show as well. Canvas Dot on that all right, guys,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for watching, bearing with us and
Speaker 1: what has been a very tumultuous personal week both for
Speaker 1: myself and for soccer. We're going to continue to have
Speaker 1: breaking news updates for you as things unfold with Trump's
Speaker 1: speech tonight and god knows what's going on with the
Speaker 1: Biden campaigns. Will be watching that as we all also
Speaker 1: head two soccer speading, so that'll be interesting, and we
Speaker 1: will see you back here next week