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Speaker 1: La Brega is back this season.

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Speaker 2: We're spending time with the people and symbols that represent

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Speaker 2: Puerto Rico.

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Speaker 1: We're proud Borricos and what does that mean? And we're

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Speaker 1: still terrified.

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Speaker 2: We're telling stories about champions from a place worth fighting for,

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Speaker 2: stories that will inspire you no matter.

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Speaker 1: Where you're from. Come okay, Wow, this is La Brega Campeones.

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Speaker 2: Listen early and ad free with Fuludo Plus.

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Speaker 1: It's Maria no Josa and I have a quick favor

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Speaker 1: to ask you. If you like listening to Latino USA

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Speaker 1: on Spotify, will you take a second and hit follow

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Speaker 1: us on the show page because I want to make

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Speaker 1: sure you don't miss a single episode and that you

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Speaker 1: don't waste time looking for episodes every week. And if

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Speaker 1: you found us through one of Spotify's daily mixes, following

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Speaker 1: the show directly is the best way to keep the episodes. Yes, Yes,

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Speaker 1: and here's the show. We should mention that parts of

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Speaker 1: this story might be disturbing for some of our listeners.

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Speaker 1: For decades, Caesar Chavez has been seen as a hero

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Speaker 1: of the US civil rights movement, as a man who

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Speaker 1: fought for justice for Latino farm workers. But yesterday an

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Speaker 1: investigation by The New York Times challenged that legacy. Werta

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Speaker 1: said she could no longer stay silent.

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Speaker 3: Fellow civil rights leader Dolores Werta is one of Chavez's accusers,

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Speaker 3: and she.

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Speaker 1: Just broke her silence. In a statement on social media.

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Speaker 3: The Caesar Shavez Foundation says it recently became aware of

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Speaker 3: allegations that he engaged in inappropriate sexual behavior with women

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Speaker 3: and minors while president of the UfW. In a statement,

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Speaker 3: the union said allegations that very young women or girls

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Speaker 3: may have been victimized are crushing.

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Speaker 1: The news has reverberated nationwide and around the world, but

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Speaker 1: especially in California, where you find Chaves's name everywhere on

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Speaker 1: street signs, blasts, as schools murals of him next to

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Speaker 1: a red flag with a white circle and a black

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Speaker 1: Aztec eagle in the middle. It's known as El Pao

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Speaker 1: de Lawelga, the Wilga bird. This is the symbol of

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Speaker 1: the United farm Workers Movement. In nineteen sixty five, Campsinos

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Speaker 1: stepped away from the fields to march over three hundred

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Speaker 1: miles from Delano, California, to the state's capital to protest

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Speaker 1: poor working conditions. By the time they reached Sacramento, the

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Speaker 1: number of protesters grew to over ten thousand.

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Speaker 2: He is responsible for organizing the Delano's Strike.

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Speaker 1: For many, Caesar Chavez was woven into the lived experience

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Speaker 1: of Chicano culture and what it means to resist, to organize,

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Speaker 1: and to stand up for your dignity. So the United

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Speaker 1: farm Workers Movement was not just about one man. It

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Speaker 1: was built by thousands. But there is another name that

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Speaker 1: echoes just as loudly throughout this history. Her name is

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Speaker 1: dolori Is Wertha.

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Speaker 4: On behalf of the National farm Workers' Association, its officers,

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Speaker 4: and its members, on.

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Speaker 1: Behalf of all of the farm workers.

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Speaker 4: Of this date, we unconditionally demand that the Governor of

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Speaker 4: this state, Edmund Brown, called him a special session of

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Speaker 4: the legislature to annect a collective bargaining law for the

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Speaker 4: farm workers of the state of California.

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Speaker 1: The name the Lord Is Wertha was not always as

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Speaker 1: amplified as much as Caesar Chavez, but her presence was

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Speaker 1: known as she stood shoulder to shoulder with him year

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Speaker 1: after year. Now the Lord Is Wertha is coming forward

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Speaker 1: saying she was sexually assaulted by Caesar Chavez twice, once

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Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty and then again in nineteen sixty six.

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Speaker 1: Her story is an example of what women were willing

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Speaker 1: to give up about their own pain kept in secret

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Speaker 1: to keep the movement and the resistance alive.

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Speaker 4: In my mind when people say why didn't you why

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Speaker 4: didn't you leave? Why didn't you tell people? Well, this

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Speaker 4: is why, because I felt that my coming out and

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Speaker 4: saying it would have hurt would it hurt the movement?

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Speaker 1: Today? The first interview with dorot Is Wertha hours after

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Speaker 1: the New York Times investigation revealed allegations that Caesar Chavis

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Speaker 1: sexually assaulted girls young women, and the Loti is wortha herself.

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Speaker 1: Lord is where that opens up about keeping her rape

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Speaker 1: a secret for decades, about how this affects the legacy

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Speaker 1: of the farm worker movement, and about her reaction when

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Speaker 1: she learned it was not just her case, but that

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Speaker 1: Caesar Chavis is accused of abusing others. Do lord is

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Speaker 1: where them has been at the front lines of some

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Speaker 1: of the most important labor battles of the country, and today,

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Speaker 1: at almost ninety six years old, she's finally speaking out

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Speaker 1: about the dark side of working with one of the

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Speaker 1: most prominent names in the movement. Caesar Chaves. We're going

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Speaker 1: to play you our conversation edited for time, and I

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Speaker 1: start by asking Dolores, how is she doing at this

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Speaker 1: particular moment.

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Speaker 4: Well, I'm getting so much support and love from everyone,

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Speaker 4: and I think that's helping me keep my balance, so

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Speaker 4: to speak. You know, it does hard for me, or

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Speaker 4: as it is for everybody else.

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Speaker 1: It's over. It's a hard time. According to the reporting

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Speaker 1: that came out in The New York Times, they wrote

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Speaker 1: that when you were told about the fact that Caesar

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Speaker 1: Chaves had assaulted girls at least two, one under the

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Speaker 1: age of twelve, the other one just over it said

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Speaker 1: that you broke down in tears. Can you take me

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Speaker 1: to that moment, the Lord Eskipaso, when you heard that

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Speaker 1: this is what Caesar Chavis had done, to learn that

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Speaker 1: he had assaulted young girls. And I mean, this is

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Speaker 1: just so devastating to think that somebody that we everybody

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Speaker 1: admired and respected and thought so highly of, that he would,

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Speaker 1: you know, do anything like that. That was just very

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Speaker 1: really hard to take and it's still very hard to process,

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Speaker 1: I think, not only for myself, but for everybody that

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Speaker 1: knew and respected Sessa volunteers so many people that sacrificed,

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Speaker 1: you know, to know that he had that dark side

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Speaker 1: of him, and I I think that just speaks to

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Speaker 1: the fact that you know, we have that there is

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Speaker 1: a lack of respect for women and girls in our

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Speaker 1: society and that this is so prevalent.

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Speaker 4: You know that in the.

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Speaker 1: Men get away with us all the time, and we

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Speaker 1: know that's something that needs to need to really be

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Speaker 1: addressed in our society. So the Lord is you and

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Speaker 1: I have not talked about this, but I'm a survivor

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Speaker 1: of rape that happened when I was sixteen, and you

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Speaker 1: are a survivor of rape twice. Can you just take

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Speaker 1: us into the heart of the Lord is that as

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Speaker 1: you realize that this is not only public, but it's

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Speaker 1: something so deeply personal and a secret you had kept

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Speaker 1: for over fifty years.

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Speaker 4: I just don't want to say that. I think the

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Speaker 4: fact that the women's survivors who had this happened to

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Speaker 4: them as they were girls, that they have had the

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Speaker 4: courage to come out, and God knows, I really applaud

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Speaker 4: them so much because I think, uh they they their

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Speaker 4: courage is given has given me the courage also to

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Speaker 4: be able to come out because in many instances, they

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Speaker 4: will want to blame the girls. So people will kind

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Speaker 4: of blame me, but they don't realize that. In Caesar

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Speaker 4: often refer to him as a genius because he did

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Speaker 4: so much, you know, in terms of inspiring leaders and

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Speaker 4: leading the movement, et cetera, et cetera. But I don't

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Speaker 4: think anybody knew that he that he would even do this.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you experienced Caesar Jovis's dark side, I guess, Uh,

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Speaker 1: Unfortunately I did.

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Speaker 4: I did, and uh I had to live with that.

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Speaker 4: I'd lived with it, and as I said before, because

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Speaker 4: I didn't want to disclose this to anybody, anybody, because

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Speaker 4: I just uh didn't want to hurt the work that

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Speaker 4: we were doing for far workers. Are you concerned that

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Speaker 4: people will say, how is it possible that the brilliant

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Speaker 4: is no Sloquinta that she didn't realize?

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Speaker 1: Are you concerned that that you're going to have to

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Speaker 1: answer that question? Well, I think that's pretty common.

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Speaker 4: I think that women when they do come forward with

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Speaker 4: their stories, that they instead of getting the kind of

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Speaker 4: support that they need, to get attacked, I mean, or

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Speaker 4: they're not believed that we've seen this happen throughout history,

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Speaker 4: and so I think we'll just have to deal with

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Speaker 4: that if it does happen. Hopefully it won't, but if

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Speaker 4: it does, we'll just have to deal with it. To

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Speaker 4: lot is, have you spoken to the two women who

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Speaker 4: were girls when they were assaulted by Caesar Jovis? Have

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Speaker 4: you been able to reach out to them and speak

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Speaker 4: to them?

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Speaker 1: No, I haven't.

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Speaker 4: I haven't, No, because this is all just happening right now.

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Speaker 4: You know, we're all learning all of this is as

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Speaker 4: we speak. So no, I haven't spoken to them.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, is there anything that you can tell us about

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Speaker 1: the two assaults, how they happened? What can you share

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Speaker 1: with us? Do Lots? I'm sorry, I don't mean to

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Speaker 1: be graphic, but in the sense of how you felt

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Speaker 1: vulnerable in those moments are pressured by Caesar Javis. Well,

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Speaker 1: in both cases, I felt like I was kind of trapped,

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Speaker 1: you might say, and I without expecting those incidents to happen,

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Speaker 1: I felt I was alone. I didn't really have anybody

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Speaker 1: close by that I could have called for help or

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Speaker 1: reached out to. And the way he set that up

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Speaker 1: it was to make sure that we were isolated pretty much,

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Speaker 1: you know. So, I mean that's pretty much what happened.

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Speaker 1: It never would have happened in the first place if

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Speaker 1: I had not had this quid admiration for him, and

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Speaker 1: he was my employer, he was my boss. You know,

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Speaker 1: did you share this with anyone at all? Door is.

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Speaker 4: No no.

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Speaker 1: Did you ever confront Caesar Chavis about his attacks on you?

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Speaker 1: You know what?

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Speaker 4: I never did, And I guess that's the one thing

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Speaker 4: that I'm sorry about, because God knows, had I done that,

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Speaker 4: maybe in some way it would have prevented other women

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Speaker 4: and girls. Who knows, you know, Dolortes.

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Speaker 1: You know, for many people, especially in the state where

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Speaker 1: you are now, in California, people who worked in the

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Speaker 1: fields the name of Caesar Chovis I mean for me

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Speaker 1: seeing Caesar Chavis and the UfW make frankly changing my life,

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Speaker 1: and you as the most important historical being that is

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Speaker 1: alive in the United States today, as a Latina who

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Speaker 1: made history in the United States, and we know that

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Speaker 1: you stood tall and proud next to Caesar Chovies for

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Speaker 1: a long time. For people who are struggling to understand

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Speaker 1: that kind of fidelity and support to Caesar chov Is,

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Speaker 1: how how can you explain that to them? Now when

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Speaker 1: they're struggling to understand this, well, I think the only

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Speaker 1: way that I can explain that is only have to

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Speaker 1: look at the see of all of the things that

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Speaker 1: we accomplish for farm workers. You know the fact that

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Speaker 1: they have the basic human needs when they're working. You know,

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Speaker 1: the things that they were deprived of, you know, the bathrooms,

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Speaker 1: the drinking water, the restperriors, you know, to be treated

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Speaker 1: as decent human beings out there in the fields. And

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Speaker 1: we're talking about millions of farm workers. And I think

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Speaker 1: my staying quiet and not revealing this. I don't know

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Speaker 1: if that contributed or didn't contribute, But in my mind,

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Speaker 1: when people say why didn't you, why didn't you leave?

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Speaker 1: Why why didn't you tell people? Well, this is why.

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Speaker 4: Because I felt that my coming out and saying that

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Speaker 4: would have hurt uh, would have hurt the movement. And

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Speaker 4: that's that's the only reason I can say. And how

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Speaker 4: are you understanding that decision?

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Speaker 1: Now?

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Speaker 4: Well, I I guess I have to take personal responsibility

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Speaker 4: for my decisions. I do believe that that, yeah, that

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Speaker 4: would have been the end of the movement pretty much

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Speaker 4: at the very very beginning. And I can see all

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Speaker 4: of the accomplishments. You know, the leadership that came out

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Speaker 4: of the movement, you know the millions of farm workers

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Speaker 4: that have been helped throughout the United States of America.

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Speaker 4: And it was my personal pain with my personal problem,

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Speaker 4: and you know, I think it was worth it, you know,

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Speaker 4: because it was.

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Speaker 1: My cost of ward. I'm gonna say it that way.

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Speaker 1: I continue my conversation with the after the break.

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Speaker 2: Hey, it's Anna Sale, host of Death, Sex and Money,

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Speaker 2: the show from Slate about the things we think about

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Speaker 2: a lot and need to talk about more. Many of

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Speaker 2: us have something going going on behind closed doors, like

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Speaker 2: a listener we called Elizabeth, who told us she's a hoarder.

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Speaker 1: I see mess beyond probably what most people think of

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Speaker 1: when they think of mes.

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Speaker 2: We'll work through it all together on Death, Sex and Money.

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Speaker 2: Listen wherever you get podcasts.

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Speaker 1: It's Latino USA. I'm Maria no Josa. You're listening to

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Speaker 1: the first interview. That is word that did after The

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Speaker 1: New York Times revealed that she'd been raped by Caesar

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Speaker 1: Chavis and that the labor rights leader had also abused

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Speaker 1: girls and teenagers. Let's continue my conversation with the not

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Speaker 1: is word that reading this New York Times article. We

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Speaker 1: realized that you actually became impregnated both times that Caesar

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Speaker 1: Chavis raped you, and that you were able to hide

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Speaker 1: those pregnancies and the births. But can you just let

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Speaker 1: us know about how do you keep two pregnancy secrets?

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Speaker 4: Well, I guess I'm very fortunate that I did not

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Speaker 4: get very big when I had my pregnancies, and I

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Speaker 4: was pretty much able to hide them. They were raised earlier,

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Speaker 4: you know, by family members, and so they were not

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Speaker 4: given up. And the one thing I feel good about today,

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Speaker 4: I still have strong relationships with all of my children.

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Speaker 4: You know, they have went through a lot, all of them,

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Speaker 4: and U and I, and to this day I have

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Speaker 4: very very strong and power relationships of the two daughters

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Speaker 4: that came from from news incidents.

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Speaker 1: Possesses to load is what is your understanding of who

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Speaker 1: inside the organization may have had an inkling about this

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Speaker 1: dark side of Caesar actually in the power.

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Speaker 4: Cuisine and there were a lot of women that held

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Speaker 4: very high positions in the organization, and in fact sus

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Speaker 4: that was known for promoting women. You know, we had

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Speaker 4: women in charge of well his wifelam in charge of

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Speaker 4: the credit union. We would have women who were in

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Speaker 4: charge of field officers, women who ran the clinic, that

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Speaker 4: we had women as arbitrators. And people would say to Caesar,

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Speaker 4: why is it that you promote so many women and

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Speaker 4: have so many women that do the important work of

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Speaker 4: the union. And his answer was because they do the work. Okay,

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Speaker 4: be the common women to do the work. So when

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Speaker 4: you ask that question, I think I cannot think of

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Speaker 4: any single person and that may have known and should

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Speaker 4: have known. I really have to say, I can't think

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Speaker 4: of any one person in my mind that I knew

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Speaker 4: of or ever said anything to me about about what

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Speaker 4: he was doing.

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Speaker 1: We've talked a lot when I've interviewed you about your legacy.

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Speaker 1: How do we process the legacy of the work that

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Speaker 1: you've done within the context of the fact that there

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Speaker 1: was somebody who was very abusive at the top. Caesar

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Speaker 1: child is well.

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Speaker 4: I think we just have to look at the accomplishments

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Speaker 4: that were made, the things that part workers have to

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Speaker 4: day that they never had, the thing that inspired so

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Speaker 4: many people to get involved, you know, people that volunteered,

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Speaker 4: people who contributed the nineteen or so many millions of

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Speaker 4: people that didn't buy grapes to make it happen that

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Speaker 4: it was all of these people coming together at just

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Speaker 4: end up perform workers. And so we can't say, well

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Speaker 4: it SUSA did it at all because many people that

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Speaker 4: volunteered are the ones that made it happen, you know.

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Speaker 4: So I think that's what we have to look to.

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Speaker 4: Now we know that he had this dark side, but

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Speaker 4: at the same time, we do know that there were many,

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Speaker 4: many people who were helped.

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Speaker 1: You have always said crisis is an opportunity to organize.

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Speaker 1: What is the organizing that needs to happen after this crisis?

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Speaker 4: I think us stopping of the physical and sexual attacks

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Speaker 4: on women and children. And when I say that, I

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Speaker 4: mean also a young man, you know, a young man

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Speaker 4: and young girls. We got to put an end to that,

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Speaker 4: and we've got to address it because I think it's

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Speaker 4: more prevalent and widespread then what we think, you know,

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Speaker 4: So I think that should be a priority.

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Speaker 1: The Lord is and how are you taking care of yourself?

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Speaker 2: Now?

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Speaker 1: I mean, I I'm the fact that you have to

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Speaker 1: deal with this on your upcoming ninety six birthday. It

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Speaker 1: feels quite torturous. How are you taking care of yourself?

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Speaker 2: Well?

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Speaker 4: I think absolutely that anybody that has gone through a

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Speaker 4: similar situation that they should go into therapy right now,

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Speaker 4: I'm very fortunate that I have such a wonderful a

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Speaker 4: wonderful family. I'm gonna I'm gonna be okay because I

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Speaker 4: have such a strong support system in my family and

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Speaker 4: with friends that are supporting me, and we're gonna get

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Speaker 4: through this, I think, not only myself personally, but all

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Speaker 4: of us in our movement, because we know that we

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Speaker 4: are a resilient people and we're not going to let

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Speaker 4: anything stop our progress. That we're going to go continue

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Speaker 4: to go forward until we get to they respect and

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Speaker 4: the equity that our community and especially that women deserve.

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Speaker 4: And we know that uplifting and elevating women and doing

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Speaker 4: everything that we can do to cure this sickness that

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Speaker 4: we have in our society that women and girls and

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Speaker 4: and and boys, because this is all truth just about women,

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Speaker 4: it also affects boys, okay, that they need to be

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Speaker 4: protected and we've got to kind of attack this illness,

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Speaker 4: you know, and and try to eliminate it.

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Speaker 1: Thank you for continuing to be strong. But I'm I'm

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Speaker 1: hearing that your heart is broken.

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Speaker 4: We can hear it, Yeah, I think, and that's that

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Speaker 4: is going to apply to so many people that are

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Speaker 4: hearing this story, but the first time it's very, very hard,

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Speaker 4: hard to deal with.

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Speaker 1: Is please take care of yourself.

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Speaker 4: Look, thank you, Thank you, Maria.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what it is. Wear It's done. Civil

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Speaker 1: rights leader, feminist icon and survivor. In a Leadinthyace statement,

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Speaker 1: the Caesar Chavis Foundation said, the revelations about quote, the

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Speaker 1: sexual abuse of women and underage minors are shocking, incredibly disappointing,

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Speaker 1: and deeply painful. They say they believe the survivors, honor

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Speaker 1: their courage and apologize for the harm they carried so

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Speaker 1: long in the shadows. This episode of Latino US Say

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Speaker 1: was made by Dernanda Chavari, Bennie Ramirez, Monica Morreals Garcia,

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Speaker 1: Adriana Rodriguez, and Nancy Trujillo. Production assistants from Roxana Aguire

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Speaker 1: and Renaldo Leanuz Junior. It was mixed by Stephanie Lebau.

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Speaker 1: The Latino USA team also includes Julia Caruso, Rebeccae Barra,

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Speaker 1: Luis Luna Torni, Maad Marquez, Julieta Martinelli, and Nicole Rothwell.

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Speaker 1: Tnanda Echavari is our managing editor. Nancy Trujillo is our

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Speaker 1: production manager. Bennilee Ramirez and I are executive producers. I'm

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Speaker 1: your host Maria Jojosa. Latino USA is part of Iheart's

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Speaker 1: Michael Tura podcast Network. Executive producers that I heard are

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Speaker 1: Leo Gomez and Early in Santana and Don't forget Dear listener,

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Speaker 1: to join Futuro Plus, you can listen to all of

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Speaker 1: our shows at free, and by joining the support the

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Speaker 1: kind of reporting that makes episodes like this one possible.

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Speaker 1: Thank you note vayas Astella Brosima.

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Speaker 5: Latino Usa is supported by the Mellon Foundation. Melon makes

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Speaker 5: grants to support the visionaries and communities that unlock the

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Speaker 5: power of the arts and humanities to help connect us

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Speaker 5: all more at melon dot org. The John D. And

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Speaker 5: Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation and Druckenmiller Foundation