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Speaker 1: Welcome to How to Money. I'm Joel and I am Matt,

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Speaker 1: and today we're talking about preparing for a layoff title wave.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and maybe we're being hyperbolic here when we say

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Speaker 2: tidle wave, but really we chose title wave because I

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Speaker 2: know that you like title waves. Joel, do you talk

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Speaker 2: You mentioned still how I want to die. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: you mentioned how that is how you want to go,

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Speaker 2: except for the last time. Well I pointed out the

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Speaker 2: fact that then I would drown there are really tidal ways,

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Speaker 2: or you mentioned tsunamis, and I'm like, dude, tsunamis are

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Speaker 2: just kind of like the gradual. We're not gradual, but

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Speaker 2: it's a quickly raising of water off if there's is

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Speaker 2: caused by the earthquake, giant title wave. I don't want

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Speaker 2: to die by driving thinking of it slams me to

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Speaker 2: the ground, and that's how I go. That's what I want.

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Speaker 2: You wouldn't get coop slammed. Yes, it's hundred percent. You

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Speaker 2: don't want that, dude, that's terrible. No, no, no, You're

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Speaker 2: you're thinking of what was it Interstellar which space movie

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Speaker 2: and the landing on the planet and they're looking for

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Speaker 2: the mountains and there were not mountains that like that

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Speaker 2: that whole scene and they're just like thousands of feet tall.

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Speaker 2: That scene kind of blew my mind. But that's what

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Speaker 2: you're thinking of, that's the way to go. No, we

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Speaker 2: are going to talk about preparing for potentially getting laid off.

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Speaker 2: There's a lot that's happening in our current labor market.

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Speaker 2: There have been some rumblings, and we're going to get

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Speaker 2: to those and uh, specifically the steps that you need

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Speaker 2: to take both with your career but also with your

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Speaker 2: finances to make sure that you are ready to weather

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Speaker 2: that storm. Yeah, when it does arrive.

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Speaker 1: For sure. Okay, quick question for you before we get

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Speaker 1: to that. The other day, so Selma, my nine year old,

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Speaker 1: she we talk about money here and there and kind

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Speaker 1: of trying to help her understanding as she grows up, spending, saving,

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Speaker 1: even starting to talk about investing too. But the other day,

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Speaker 1: randomly at breakfast, she was like, so, how much money

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Speaker 1: do we have?

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Speaker 2: Dad?

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Speaker 1: Like overall, not like how much is in your wallet

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Speaker 1: or but like like what is your network? She was

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Speaker 1: asking She didn't have that terminology, but that's basically what

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Speaker 1: she was asking me, and I was to give her

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Speaker 1: a number. Yeah, I would have been hesitant took toy

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Speaker 1: didn't but okay, I'm curious that you didn't do it.

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Speaker 1: How would you respond to that question.

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Speaker 2: I would not have given it either. So I don't

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Speaker 2: see there being much good coming from a kid and

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Speaker 2: knowing how much money you got in the bank. Okay,

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Speaker 2: so I think I would be funny about it. I'd

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Speaker 2: be like, oh, we got ten million dollars in the bank,

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Speaker 2: which by the way, is not anywhere near accurate.

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Speaker 1: Sound that sounds right from what I've seen.

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Speaker 2: But no, I think, like, honestly, I question like that.

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Speaker 2: Maybe it's born out of curiosity, but I think oftentimes,

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Speaker 2: like kids are talking at school and maybe there's like

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Speaker 2: this dumb competition and kid they're trying to like one

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Speaker 2: up each other, and I don't see that leading to

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Speaker 2: anywhere good necessarily. And we've talked about how leaving a

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Speaker 2: fortune to your kids and how like more and more

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Speaker 2: I'm thinking that that is not something I want to

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Speaker 2: do because of the sense of entitlements and the ability,

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Speaker 2: the potential ability for that to keep your kids from

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Speaker 2: like becoming their own person and like going out and

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Speaker 2: making something taking risks that whole thing. I feel like

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Speaker 2: it could stemy their personal growth, is what I'm saying.

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Speaker 1: I don't remember who I was talking to, but I

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Speaker 1: was talking to someone the other day and we were

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Speaker 1: discussing how the best time for a parent to give

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Speaker 1: their kids money is in their thirties, like mid thirties

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Speaker 1: in particular, when they're having kids, buying a house, all

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Speaker 1: that kind of stuff, and by then, hopefully they're solidified

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Speaker 1: in their career and kind of in their their look.

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Speaker 1: E think they're the kind of person they're going to be,

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Speaker 1: and so it's not some sort of massive endowment or

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Speaker 1: bequeathments of like millions of dollars down the road when

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Speaker 1: that person is fifties sixties, it really helps them in

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Speaker 1: a time where that money is most useful.

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Speaker 2: But it's basically like some down payment money for that house,

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Speaker 2: that first house. Yeah, see that being pretty helpful.

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Speaker 1: But it's also staving off entitlement, right like where if

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Speaker 1: you give it to too early, maybe they miss out

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Speaker 1: on some of that. But yeah, you're right, No.

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Speaker 2: That's what I'm thinking of it. And even just knowing

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Speaker 2: that that money is there, I think could potentially keep

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Speaker 2: kids from really going out there doing something awesome with it.

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Speaker 1: So I think the key is, like you said, like

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Speaker 1: kind of to be coy about it and not reveal

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Speaker 1: a whole lot of information, like, hey, we have enough,

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Speaker 1: We've got a roof over our head. That was the

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Speaker 1: kind of the discussion that we like, you don't think

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Speaker 1: you shouldn't have to worry you, you don't need to

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Speaker 1: worry about anything.

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Speaker 2: Totally, we were doing great.

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Speaker 1: But at the same time, like, I don't want her

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Speaker 1: to think that we've got you know, millions in the

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Speaker 1: bank to even though we have billions.

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Speaker 2: Right exactly, Well, no, I totally agree. I think it

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Speaker 2: is important to make sure that they understand that they're

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Speaker 2: cared for, that they are being provided for specifically right

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Speaker 2: and so not only in the time and the intention

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Speaker 2: that we give them, but also the amounting the amount

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Speaker 2: of money that that we have on hand, providing that stability.

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Speaker 2: I think that's definitely a very important thing to communicate.

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Speaker 1: Good question, so exactly, you know, I love that she

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Speaker 1: asked it, and I don't want to shame her shut

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Speaker 1: her down with ye which, like it provides another chance

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Speaker 1: to have a conversation, even if I'm not giving her

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Speaker 1: the direct answer.

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Speaker 2: That she's hoping for.

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Speaker 1: So all those little money combos with your kids matter

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Speaker 1: and involving them more in those money decisions. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: maybe we should do a whole other episode soon about

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Speaker 1: how we talk to kids about money. It's been a minute, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but Matt, let's mention the beer that we're having on

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Speaker 1: this episode. This one is called Absolute Brightness. It's Biology

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Speaker 1: Brewing out of Tampa. Big thanks to Jamie and her

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Speaker 1: husband for sending us a couple beers. We appreciate it.

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Speaker 2: That's right. Looking forward to sharing our thoughts on this

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Speaker 2: one at the end of the episode. I kind of

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Speaker 2: I dig the label. It's super basic, but it reminds

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Speaker 2: me of a Tycho album cover. You ever listen to Taiko,

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Speaker 2: Not really but electronic ambient artist, But it's got that

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Speaker 2: vibe for sure. Yeah. And it's like a digital analog

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Speaker 2: look going on, which, yeah, it kind of summarizes my

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Speaker 2: style perhaps. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Well, and if you follow us on Instagram at how

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Speaker 1: to Money Pod, you can you can see all of

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Speaker 1: our beer cans, label labels, all the stuff we're drinking,

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Speaker 1: amongst other things. We've been creating a lot more content

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Speaker 1: on Instagram, by the way, it's not just beer cans. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's actual money content. There's actually some yeah that can

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Speaker 1: helpup full infographics up there as well, instead of following

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Speaker 1: people taking fake pictures on private jets, and you can

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Speaker 1: follow us for actual money saving info there. But let's

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Speaker 1: get onto the subject of handmat. We're talking about preparing

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Speaker 1: for a potential layoff, and I was just talking about

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Speaker 1: Selma and it actually prepared for this episode made me

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Speaker 1: think about how each of the kids I have, they're

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Speaker 1: all unique, and I think you have it in your

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Speaker 1: mind that you're going to be able to have a

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Speaker 1: big impact over how they turn out. And I don't

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Speaker 1: want to say that you don't have any impact over

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Speaker 1: how they turn out, but it's amazing how each kid

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Speaker 1: comes with its own their own distinct personality built in

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Speaker 1: kind of baked in the genes from the get go,

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Speaker 1: and they just have like certain hardwired predilections right that

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Speaker 1: we can't quite override. And so even though Emily and

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Speaker 1: I were trying to be intentional about what we're teaching them,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't mean that we can mold them in a

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Speaker 1: way that's kind of antithetical to that nature that they're

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Speaker 1: born with, and that nature versus nurture debate is endlessen

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Speaker 1: It's hard to know exactly how much can be chalked

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Speaker 1: up to either one of those things. But even given

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Speaker 1: kind of their their disposition, when they you know, kind

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Speaker 1: of come on the scene, we still have the ability

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Speaker 1: to mold them in some ways, in important ways. And

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Speaker 1: so there's a lot that I want my kids to

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Speaker 1: know before they fly the coop, before they head out

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Speaker 1: on their own. I want to prepare them for a

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Speaker 1: variety of circumstances that they might face. And even if

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Speaker 1: that process is vastly different than like updating a software package, right,

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Speaker 1: it's it takes so much more intentionality and effort. Only

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Speaker 1: it was that easy, I know, right, kind of like

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Speaker 1: Neo and the Matrix and you upload something new and

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Speaker 1: then they just like.

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Speaker 2: Boom, they get it. You're talking back, What do you

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Speaker 2: just get over here? Let me plug you in, press

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Speaker 2: a couple of buttons and fix you up. I mean,

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Speaker 2: those lessons like my input Emily and ized input, It's

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Speaker 2: still it still matters. And so yet the same thing

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Speaker 2: is true. I would say, when someone loses a job,

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Speaker 2: it's hard to know when or if it's coming, but

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Speaker 2: we still have the ability to prepare. There's like kind

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Speaker 2: of this element that's out of our control, this element

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Speaker 2: that's in our control, and we want to talk about

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Speaker 2: the element that's in our control today. That's right. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: And we have a limited timeframe, right, Like we have

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Speaker 2: this window where we do have that input. This actually,

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Speaker 2: it kind of reminds me of my favorite parenting adage,

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Speaker 2: which is to prepare the kid, or prepare the child

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Speaker 2: for the road. Don't prepare the road for the child.

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Speaker 2: And we don't know exactly like deep sun, you like that?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Have you have you heard that before? Oh? Really, it's like,

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Speaker 2: I don't know where it came from. It's not like

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Speaker 2: an individual. I think it comes from like culture specifically.

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Speaker 2: The thing is like, we don't know exactly the types

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Speaker 2: of different crazy things that our kids are going to

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Speaker 2: encounter in the world. But the time to equip them

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Speaker 2: is now. And the truth is that layoffs are happening,

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Speaker 2: and the time to prepare for that tidal wave, the

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Speaker 2: potential tidal wave is now. The FED rate hikes they

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Speaker 2: have continued to create more tightness in the economy. The

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Speaker 2: labor market. It's been pretty resilient for a long time, honestly,

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Speaker 2: but that booming job market might be coming to an end.

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Speaker 2: Maybe not abruptly, but it might kind of fizzle out

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Speaker 2: a little bit, you know, like these all time unemployment lows.

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Speaker 2: They can't continue forever basically, but that could potentially lead

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Speaker 2: to you being without a job. The R word recession,

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Speaker 2: like that's being thrown around again as well. So will

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Speaker 2: it won't it? Is it gonna be a soft landing?

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Speaker 2: Who actually knows?

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Speaker 1: I don't think you can actually say the R word matter.

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Speaker 1: It's kind of like Valdimore. You're not supposed to say

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Speaker 1: it all the way out. That's your contrary.

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Speaker 2: It's funny. It's funny that you mentioned that because literally

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Speaker 2: that's we are at that part in book seven. So

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Speaker 2: longtime listeners will know. We've been reading through all seven

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Speaker 2: books out loud with the kids, and they just discovered

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Speaker 2: that taboo of saying his name in the seventh book

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Speaker 2: and where it's times from. Well, no, like in the

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Speaker 2: earlier books, they don't like saying his name, but in

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Speaker 2: book seven, literally if you say it, it it lets

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Speaker 2: the death leaders know where he is. Such a slight

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Speaker 2: spoiler if you read the book, doesn't ruin anything, so

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Speaker 2: you'll get there. But you know, even if the economy

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Speaker 2: as a whole. Even if it doesn't tank anytime soon,

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Speaker 2: there is always the possibility that your company or even

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Speaker 2: your specific department, that they could be looking to cut back.

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Speaker 2: And so we're gonna offer our thoughts on what it

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Speaker 2: looks like to prepare now making yourself not necessarily lay

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Speaker 2: off proof, but kind of like like layoff resistant, right.

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Speaker 1: I like that makes me think of like waterproof versus

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Speaker 1: water resistant. It's like two different terming out, Like if

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Speaker 1: you have to watch it's waterproof, it's like IP six

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Speaker 1: rated or whatever. You can die like its way down

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Speaker 1: deep and it's going to be fine, right, But if

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Speaker 1: you have one of the water resistance and you try

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Speaker 1: to like scuba die with it, a thing's going.

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Speaker 2: To be It's like, no, you're broke. As a joke,

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Speaker 2: you're only good for your thirty minutes at three feet.

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Speaker 1: Yes, sorry right, well yeah, and so it's important to

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Speaker 1: note that yet this isn't going to lay off proof

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Speaker 1: your abil, but it is going to make you more

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Speaker 1: less likely to be the first person on the chopping block.

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Speaker 1: But it's also going to make it so if you

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Speaker 1: do get laid off, hopefully the things we talk about

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Speaker 1: in this episode, so you're more prepared to handle it.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know, maybe there are some jobs that

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Speaker 1: are actually layoff proof Matt, like tenured professors in combat

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Speaker 1: congress people. Those are people that I think, but there

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Speaker 1: aren't many jobs like that that there's very almost no

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Speaker 1: potential for you to lose your job. But let's talk

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Speaker 1: about which industries are most at risk right now. This

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Speaker 1: can act like an additional heads up for some folks.

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Speaker 1: And so according to think tank the Conference Board, IT jobs,

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Speaker 1: transportation and warehousing, and construction are the sectors most at

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Speaker 1: risk of layoffs right now. And beyond that, the tech

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Speaker 1: sector has already been slashing its workforce in a big way,

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Speaker 1: and there might be even more to comme It looks

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Speaker 1: like there's there's even been more recent movements in the

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Speaker 1: tech sector to eliminate jobs. So yeah, if you if

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Speaker 1: you're in one of these arenas, you should probably be

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Speaker 1: even more aware of the possibility of a layoff coming

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Speaker 1: down the pike.

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Speaker 2: Specifically in IT and technology right like didn't Meta call

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty three the Year of Efficiency made investors happy

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Speaker 2: because they had been taking on so many new employees

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Speaker 2: massive losses. Yeah, so after you know, like it was

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Speaker 2: basically like a post pandemic hiring boom, where like there

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Speaker 2: were a lot of folks who apparently were on the

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Speaker 2: payroll without actually having to, you know, anything to do,

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Speaker 2: and like, these are folks and they admitted to that.

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Speaker 1: Well, some of them were crazy posting videos about here's

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Speaker 1: what I do when I get to work. I get

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Speaker 1: my latte, but not really actually doing anywhere. We've got

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Speaker 1: like a place you can a massage or like, And

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Speaker 1: I was, what are these what are the people at

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Speaker 1: Twitter doing all day? And no wonder it can survive

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Speaker 1: with so many less employees, That's right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So all of these different tech companies with way

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Speaker 2: too much money, they're finally cutting back. Google they recently

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Speaker 2: cut twelve thousand jobs. Amazon they're laying off twenty seven

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Speaker 2: thousand numbers of their team. Ten thousand folks are being

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Speaker 2: laid off from Microsoft and Boeing and those are some

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Speaker 2: hard numbers. But then like Ernst and Young Accenture, Disney

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Speaker 2: they just announced that there are going to be massive

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Speaker 2: layoffs coming here soon as well. How to money, they're

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Speaker 2: even laying off a couple guys, just one of THO hosts.

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Speaker 2: I'm not sure what you shoot one of us has

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Speaker 2: to outrund the other one. Hopefully hunger games, we'll get

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Speaker 2: to keep our jobs. But essentially the question here is,

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Speaker 2: are these tech companies the canary and the coal mine? Right?

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Speaker 2: Are they the cutting are they the leading edge of

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Speaker 2: more job losses that are likely going to come? Well

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Speaker 2: it's hard to say, but again, a record low three

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Speaker 2: and a half percent unemployment rate, it is not likely

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Speaker 2: going to last forever. That's why we want to make

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Speaker 2: sure that you are thinking ahead to this.

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Speaker 1: Now, well, let's talk too about the ever changing reality

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Speaker 1: of what layoffs look like, Matt, because the way they're

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Speaker 1: being conducted has changed massively, really just in the past

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Speaker 1: three years. And oh yeah, virtual layoffs happening more and more.

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Speaker 1: Those twelve thousand Google jobs, for instance, those folks found

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Speaker 1: out via an email, which like just didn't really happen

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Speaker 1: ten years ago, and some of those people had worked

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Speaker 1: at Google for decades. Can you imagine how demoralizing that

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Speaker 1: would be to be somewhere for twenty years? You can

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Speaker 1: you wake up to an email and you're like, oh,

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Speaker 1: I guess I'm out of a job.

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Speaker 2: Like that sucks. That sucks. That shows a last one

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Speaker 2: thing if you'd just been hired like six months ago,

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Speaker 2: Like maybe I get it, but I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, shows a lack of appreciation for the people who

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Speaker 1: have helped you get where you are. Sure, it's just

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Speaker 1: not cool, and it's especially in Google's case, it might

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Speaker 1: be a little evil, which is kind of what their

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Speaker 1: whole thing is against their own mantra. It used to

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Speaker 1: be their mantra, used to be the slow So yeah,

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Speaker 1: they've changed it now. It's understandably, so it's okay to

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Speaker 1: be a little evil, Yeah, because it sounds like they

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Speaker 1: are going down that path. But layoffs are just happening

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Speaker 1: in a more impersonal way, which kind of makes sense

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Speaker 1: given the work from home environment that we're in. When

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Speaker 1: you're hired remotely, you're gonna be fired remotely, Like no

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Speaker 1: one's gonna hop a plane show up at your door

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Speaker 1: and tell you that you're losing your job. It can

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Speaker 1: I think you can feel like it's adding insult to injury,

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Speaker 1: which can make it more of an emotional experience than

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Speaker 1: it already would be though, And so dealing with the

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Speaker 1: aftermath of a layoff when you're also kind of emotionally

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Speaker 1: reeling can be can be a really difficult thing to do.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And then like, I don't want to be a

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Speaker 2: doomsayer here, but we're not even talking about what AI

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Speaker 2: or like the large language models might do to the

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Speaker 2: tech industry right when it comes like programmers, Like why

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Speaker 2: would you hire ten programmers when you can just get

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Speaker 2: the code you need in the blink of an eye.

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Speaker 1: Perhaps, Well, and there's just a whole lot of predictions

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Speaker 1: about what AI is going to do to work moving forward.

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Speaker 2: Ye, a whole lot of yes, I swear. So, even

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Speaker 2: aside from the tech sector, this is something that I

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Speaker 2: think a lot a lot of us, even you and

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Speaker 2: I should be there should be something that we are

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Speaker 2: thinking about.

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Speaker 1: Sure. Yeah, it makes me think of a great quote

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Speaker 1: I saw from Alison Schreger recently, former guest of the show.

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Speaker 1: She was specifically talking about kind of the impact of

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Speaker 1: AI on the workforce moving forward, and I thought this

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Speaker 1: was what I thought, this was brilliant. She said, if

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Speaker 1: the past is an indication of the future, big new technology,

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Speaker 1: she tends to come for the mediocre first, so it's

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Speaker 1: critical to add some human element and be good at it.

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Speaker 1: She said, I anticipate that in person skills will be

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Speaker 1: super valuable. And so well knowing how to think, and

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Speaker 1: so I yeah, if you want to beat what AI

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Speaker 1: has coming for us, and it's coming, I think being

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Speaker 1: better at what we do is going to be of

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Speaker 1: massive importance as we try to stave off AI coming

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Speaker 1: for our stuff.

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Speaker 2: But simultaneously, this is where I feel like we might

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Speaker 2: be getting a little like we might be jumping the

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Speaker 2: gun a little bit, because folks were also saying that

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Speaker 2: about like when the lockdowns were happening during the pandemic,

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Speaker 2: Basically everyone was saying that, like we're never going to

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Speaker 2: be hanging out in person again, like all offices are

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Speaker 2: shut down, virtual learning, virtual doctors. In fact, is we're

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Speaker 2: all going to move to the metaverse and Facebook. They

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Speaker 2: double down on that, didn't they, And that's actually that

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Speaker 2: hasn't been the case. So yeah, it'll be interesting to

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Speaker 2: see what actually appans own.

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Speaker 1: I will say Allison was not dooming gloom in that

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Speaker 1: newsletter she sent out, and a lot of it she

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Speaker 1: was saying, we adapt as humans, and I think this

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Speaker 1: is actually going to be for the best positive. I

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Speaker 1: think she's right on that too. But I do think

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Speaker 1: that the better we are at our jobs, the more

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Speaker 1: it's going to help us when we try to avoid

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Speaker 1: getting laid off, especially when AI can maybe do something

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Speaker 1: cheaper and better.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and regarding the you know, you kind of touched

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Speaker 2: on this, but regarding the like the virtual layoffs, I

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Speaker 2: don't think it's the fact that they're virtual that I

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Speaker 2: have a problem with. It's the fact that they're letting

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Speaker 2: like hundreds and even like thousands of people go like

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Speaker 2: at the same time on the same call. Like, that's

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Speaker 2: the part of it that feels inhumane as opposed to

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Speaker 2: the virtual. Because what you said I think is true,

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Speaker 2: which is if you're hired virtually, I think it's okay

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Speaker 2: that you're fired virtually because it doesn't make sense necessarily

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Speaker 2: for you to be called into the office that you've

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Speaker 2: never been to before and they're going to take all

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Speaker 2: of this time and you have to find a suit

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Speaker 2: or at least some khakis or something in order to

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Speaker 2: be presentable and around other employees. But it's it's less that,

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Speaker 2: and it's it is it is more the mass aspect

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Speaker 2: of it, right, Like it makes me think of food,

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Speaker 2: like farming or like if you are a homesteader and

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Speaker 2: you're raising chickens or a cow or or something like

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Speaker 2: that it's okay to humanely slaughter an animal, like that's

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Speaker 2: how we go about eating meat. But there's a big

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Speaker 2: difference between that and like what Upston Sinclair wrote about

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Speaker 2: in the Jungle, Yes, right, with like the meat industry

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Speaker 2: and some of these mass layoffs, it feels more like that, yes,

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Speaker 2: versus the humane kind way of going about raising animals exactly.

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Speaker 1: And if you can get hired remotely, you're gonna get

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Speaker 1: you're gonna get let go remotely. I think it just

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Speaker 1: makes sense. But you're right, there's a human way to

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Speaker 1: do it, and then there's like a really crummy way

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Speaker 1: to do it. And hopefully I feel like we a

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Speaker 1: lot of these employers who have handled it poorly are

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Speaker 1: getting written up in kind of major publications about their

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Speaker 1: firing processes, and they deserve to kind of get raked

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Speaker 1: over the coals to a certain degree, and hopefully it

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Speaker 1: puts other people on notice before they start applied to

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Speaker 1: that company in the future. Like wait a second, maybe

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Speaker 1: they don't treat their employees all that well, so but

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Speaker 1: real quickly. Matt also wanted to mention this talking about

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Speaker 1: layoffs and the impact that I can have. I have

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Speaker 1: personal experience with this and not from me getting lad on,

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Speaker 1: for from when my dad got laid off when I

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Speaker 1: was a kid, and it was just such a tough

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Speaker 1: time for our family. And I think there are ways

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Speaker 1: that by pre planning, thinking about it with some foresight,

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Speaker 1: it could have made that landing a whole lot softer.

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Speaker 1: But instead it was really difficult, and it felt like

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Speaker 1: it had a reverberating impact for years and even decades.

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Speaker 1: So I think like a layoff can be one of

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Speaker 1: those things that just shocks your family to the core.

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Speaker 1: And I don't want that to be the case. For

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Speaker 1: anybody out there who's listening. I want you to do

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Speaker 1: the proper prep so that you are ready should the

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Speaker 1: worst case scenario happen. Like layoffs, they're never fun, but

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Speaker 1: if you're in a solid financial position, it can feel

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Speaker 1: more like a blip in your career than even something catastrophic.

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Speaker 1: Like I was mentioning, but we're jumping ahead. We're going

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Speaker 1: to talk about steps you can take to prevent getting

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Speaker 1: laid off. We want to talk about that, and then

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Speaker 1: later we're also going to talk about what you need

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Speaker 1: to do if you're in the middle of getting laid off.

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Speaker 1: We'll give our thoughts on all that stuff.

432
00:18:56,000 --> 00:19:07,320
Speaker 2: Right after this, all right, we are back and man,

433
00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:10,720
Speaker 2: you know we've just talked about why thinking through layoffs,

434
00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:12,840
Speaker 2: why that should be something that is on your radar.

435
00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:17,119
Speaker 2: Now let's talk about career steps to take prior to

436
00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:21,040
Speaker 2: a layoff. And hopefully you are still gainfully employed, and

437
00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:23,680
Speaker 2: if so, it is now time to make some hay

438
00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:26,280
Speaker 2: while that sun is shining, and a part of making

439
00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:29,880
Speaker 2: that hay is becoming more valuable to your current employer.

440
00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:31,240
Speaker 1: By the way, can you not make hay when the

441
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:32,160
Speaker 1: sun is not around?

442
00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:34,919
Speaker 2: Is that the thing not according to the old braide

443
00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:37,800
Speaker 2: I standing, Or actually it's not about making hay while

444
00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:40,520
Speaker 2: the sun still shining, because that assumes that at some

445
00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:43,880
Speaker 2: point the sun's gonna go down, which obviously it does

446
00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:45,840
Speaker 2: in life. But what we're saying is, le let's find

447
00:19:45,840 --> 00:19:47,840
Speaker 2: a way to keep that sun in the sky. If

448
00:19:47,880 --> 00:19:49,720
Speaker 2: you're wanting to stay at your current employer so that

449
00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:53,439
Speaker 2: you can continue making hay that day, you want it

450
00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:54,960
Speaker 2: to be like we're running with that metaphor a little

451
00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:55,560
Speaker 2: too little to be.

452
00:19:55,520 --> 00:19:58,520
Speaker 1: Like Norway in the summer when the sun never goes down.

453
00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:02,280
Speaker 2: That's right, Yeah, this could help you to avoid unemployment altogether.

454
00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:05,400
Speaker 2: And so by making yourself more valuable, what that means

455
00:20:05,480 --> 00:20:07,399
Speaker 2: is just stepping up. It means taking on new roles

456
00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:11,639
Speaker 2: at work. We essentially want you to be indispensable. Basically,

457
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:13,440
Speaker 2: we want you to be the person that your boss

458
00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:16,760
Speaker 2: can't live without. And honestly, if you really like your job,

459
00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:18,560
Speaker 2: the best role might be the one that you already have.

460
00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:22,000
Speaker 2: And so it's not about finding greener pastures. It's about

461
00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:26,160
Speaker 2: staying put and maintaining those relationships and maintaining that career path.

462
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:28,520
Speaker 2: And again we sort of mentioned this before, but you

463
00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:31,439
Speaker 2: can't guarantee that you're going to be invincible by becoming

464
00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:35,480
Speaker 2: more valuable. But you can make yourself way more layoff resistant.

465
00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,880
Speaker 1: Yes, yes you can. And for virtual workers, by the way,

466
00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:41,199
Speaker 1: this might be harder to do again because of the

467
00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:44,040
Speaker 1: new work environment and so many more people working from

468
00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:47,199
Speaker 1: home coming in less or hybrid work. Even it can

469
00:20:47,240 --> 00:20:49,359
Speaker 1: be the case that you're out of sight, out of mind,

470
00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:50,960
Speaker 1: and that is not the place you want to be

471
00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:53,919
Speaker 1: in because that makes you easier to chop right. And

472
00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:55,679
Speaker 1: so if you're never in the office, it might be

473
00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,320
Speaker 1: a good idea to get in there more. If you're

474
00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:01,639
Speaker 1: doing video conferencing regularly with other people that you work with,

475
00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,159
Speaker 1: in particular people that are higher up, hop on the

476
00:21:04,160 --> 00:21:06,520
Speaker 1: call a little early. I think it shows intentionality and

477
00:21:06,520 --> 00:21:10,560
Speaker 1: it's a good way to get FaceTime with bosses and management.

478
00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:13,400
Speaker 1: Makes me think of our conversation with Alex about negotiation,

479
00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:16,040
Speaker 1: Matt and she said, Alex Carter, Yeah, she called it

480
00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:18,200
Speaker 1: the meeting before the meeting, and that you can have

481
00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:22,160
Speaker 1: a meaningful impact on how other people perceive and view

482
00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:24,760
Speaker 1: you and view your work just by being more present

483
00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:25,440
Speaker 1: in those spaces.

484
00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:27,479
Speaker 2: That's true. Yeah, just the ability to get on there

485
00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:29,600
Speaker 2: and joke around a little bit, as opposed to getting

486
00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:32,399
Speaker 2: on right when the meeting starts, where folks are immediately

487
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:34,720
Speaker 2: getting down to business. Yeah. And a part of making

488
00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:38,960
Speaker 2: yourself more valuable is acquiring new skills, because you know,

489
00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:41,040
Speaker 2: employers are going to be less likely to let an

490
00:21:41,040 --> 00:21:43,440
Speaker 2: employee EGO who just went through a series of expensive

491
00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 2: training right because well, one like it's it's likely cost

492
00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:49,560
Speaker 2: them some money. So you can essentially use the sunt

493
00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:52,639
Speaker 2: cost fallacy to your advantage here. But two, like forget

494
00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,320
Speaker 2: what your employer you know, just pay like forget the past,

495
00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:58,360
Speaker 2: Like you are literally becoming more valuable.

496
00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:00,679
Speaker 1: To them them and on the open market, if you know,

497
00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 1: for everybody.

498
00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:03,840
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, but I mean just moving forward and looking

499
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:05,840
Speaker 2: to the future, you're likely going to cause your employer

500
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:07,760
Speaker 2: to be more profitable, and so they're going to want

501
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:10,600
Speaker 2: to keep you on. You know, if this is something

502
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:14,000
Speaker 2: that your employer offers, if they offer career advancement perks,

503
00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:17,199
Speaker 2: take advantage while you've still got access to those perks.

504
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 2: And this is I think the right attitude to take.

505
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:24,040
Speaker 2: Even if your employer isn't looking to fire folks, the

506
00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:27,280
Speaker 2: ability to become more valuable, perhaps a vie for a

507
00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 2: new position they're at your company, to potentially get a raise.

508
00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:31,239
Speaker 2: These are all the kind of steps that we want

509
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:32,040
Speaker 2: you taken regardless.

510
00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:34,959
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And so think about somebody doing the barista

511
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,760
Speaker 1: thing at Starbucks, Matt, and they have access to a

512
00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:43,480
Speaker 1: completely free education at Arizona State University online, doesn't matter

513
00:22:43,480 --> 00:22:45,800
Speaker 1: where you live in the country, and you could just

514
00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:47,840
Speaker 1: kind of say, eh, that sounds like a nice perk,

515
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:50,159
Speaker 1: but I'm not going to take advantage. Or you can

516
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: make yourself more valuable to Starbucks by getting that education.

517
00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:54,760
Speaker 1: But at the same time, while they're putting the bill,

518
00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:57,640
Speaker 1: if for some reason Starbucks says it's a layoff time,

519
00:22:57,920 --> 00:23:00,920
Speaker 1: and you are one of those people that gets asked, well,

520
00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,400
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, you're more valuable too to anybody

521
00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:06,840
Speaker 1: else out there, any other employer, because you've taken advantage

522
00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:10,000
Speaker 1: of that perk. It was free, and you gained yourself

523
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:13,520
Speaker 1: a whole lot more in skills and knowledge. That just

524
00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:15,960
Speaker 1: makes you more valuable. It beefs up your resume. And

525
00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:18,439
Speaker 1: so that's the next thing that people need to think

526
00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:21,119
Speaker 1: about when they're trying to prepare themselves in advance for

527
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:23,160
Speaker 1: a potential layoff, is to get their resume in order.

528
00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:27,040
Speaker 1: Do it before the layoff happens. The same thing with

529
00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:30,240
Speaker 1: your LinkedIn. Start beefing that up. Start making some changes

530
00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:32,840
Speaker 1: and improvements and updating things before you get into a

531
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:37,720
Speaker 1: situation where you are scrambling because now you're out of

532
00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:39,680
Speaker 1: a job and you're trying to fix all these things

533
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:42,760
Speaker 1: on the fly. And so why wait until you need

534
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:44,879
Speaker 1: a job to get those things up to stuff a

535
00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:47,960
Speaker 1: couple of evenings working hard and maybe starting to post

536
00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:52,080
Speaker 1: weekly little things on LinkedIn, becoming kind of an influencer

537
00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:55,040
Speaker 1: of sorts in your space. Right, I don't mean influencer

538
00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:57,200
Speaker 1: in the way that you're buying Gucci handbags and talking

539
00:23:57,240 --> 00:24:00,000
Speaker 1: about them or whatever. But like you can up your visability,

540
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:02,119
Speaker 1: that's your business. If that's your business, that's fine. Like

541
00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:04,879
Speaker 1: if you are like a fashion fashionista fashion like on

542
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 1: that's cool. But upping your visibility to people who are

543
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,480
Speaker 1: in your realm, in your sphere can help you out

544
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:13,520
Speaker 1: in a big way. And so The Wall Street Journal

545
00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:16,520
Speaker 1: recently had an article about whether a resume passes the

546
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:19,199
Speaker 1: six second test is what they called it. Yeah, they

547
00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,240
Speaker 1: basically said, that's how long you have to make an impression,

548
00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:24,240
Speaker 1: and so don't be dull. Use bullet points to highlight

549
00:24:24,280 --> 00:24:29,040
Speaker 1: the absolute must knows about you. Single spacing your resume

550
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 1: is going to get it tossed in the trash can

551
00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:35,679
Speaker 1: along with a bunch of others. Make it spicy and interesting.

552
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:39,560
Speaker 1: I'm not talking in like George Santo's esque, lying about

553
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,000
Speaker 1: what you've accomplished, but I am saying, present the most

554
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:45,360
Speaker 1: interesting information first in a very readable formatted way.

555
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:49,159
Speaker 2: I found it a nonprofit that saves dogs or whatever.

556
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: It's so many lives, so many lives.

557
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,639
Speaker 2: A liar. And they also mentioned too leaving out the

558
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,919
Speaker 2: professional summary, like the introductory paragraph two versus just like

559
00:24:57,000 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 2: getting down to the facts finding ways to defy your

560
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:04,439
Speaker 2: achievements as opposed to more flowery language that describes all

561
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 2: your different skill sets. But yes, definitely you want to

562
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:08,960
Speaker 2: get your resume in order. After that, you want to

563
00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 2: make sure that your network is solid as well. Friend

564
00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:14,679
Speaker 2: of the show Jordan Harbinger, he says, to dig the

565
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:18,160
Speaker 2: well before you're thirsty. That's the best way to think

566
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 2: about your how you should be approaching your network.

567
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,160
Speaker 1: By the way, I love that quote because think about

568
00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:25,800
Speaker 1: when you're thirsty or when you're angry or something. All right,

569
00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:27,679
Speaker 1: Like the things that you will do to score some

570
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:30,280
Speaker 1: food or to score some water are vastly different than

571
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,880
Speaker 1: when you're not thirsty, and so true. It just changes

572
00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 1: your whole approach to it. You're likely to do better

573
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:36,880
Speaker 1: work and you're likely to be a less frantic.

574
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:40,040
Speaker 2: So yeah, it just makes sense to change the dynamic. Yeah,

575
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 2: before the catastroh hit. We love it. Yeah, So what

576
00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 2: that means is just reaching out to folks in your

577
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:45,800
Speaker 2: network who could help you in case of a work

578
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,960
Speaker 2: emergency before you're in one. That is incredibly important. Just

579
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:51,439
Speaker 2: simply connecting with other folks who you respect who are

580
00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 2: doing some really cool stuff, send an email, offer a compliment,

581
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:57,760
Speaker 2: because you never know the impact of just something really

582
00:25:57,800 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 2: small like that. Again with Alex Carter with her recently,

583
00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:02,159
Speaker 2: so I think a lot of what she said is

584
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:04,520
Speaker 2: fresh on her minds. But in that conversation she talked

585
00:26:04,520 --> 00:26:07,439
Speaker 2: about how she knows not just names and what people do,

586
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:11,480
Speaker 2: but birthdays. She knows kids' names of different folks in

587
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 2: her network. She's not just friendly and amicable, She's found

588
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:17,680
Speaker 2: a way to make these folks friends. And I think,

589
00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:20,200
Speaker 2: especially for a lot of folks who might be introverted,

590
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 2: you might be thinking, dude, there's no way I'm going

591
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 2: to do this. This is like so smarmy. Yes, but

592
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 2: this is why we're saying to do this now before

593
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:31,000
Speaker 2: you are in need, because what feels more desperate, what

594
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:34,120
Speaker 2: feels grosser just reaching out to a bunch of randoms

595
00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:36,640
Speaker 2: when you truly are in need, or just reaching out

596
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 2: to them and being friendly. We're truly you are just

597
00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 2: reaching out to connect. Who knows you really might end

598
00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:43,919
Speaker 2: up being friends with these folks, but you don't know

599
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:46,119
Speaker 2: because you haven't even given it a shot. Like we

600
00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:47,800
Speaker 2: want you to be adventurous. It makes me. Think about

601
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:51,439
Speaker 2: like foods. If you never try a different food, well,

602
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,040
Speaker 2: how do you know you don't like it? You got

603
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,919
Speaker 2: to give it a shot. And so I think the

604
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,280
Speaker 2: same thing can be true when it comes to how

605
00:26:57,320 --> 00:26:58,960
Speaker 2: it is that you approach your network. I think you're right.

606
00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:01,040
Speaker 1: And I think a lot of people void networking because

607
00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:05,880
Speaker 1: they think it is this smarmy, slick political style interaction

608
00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:07,360
Speaker 1: that they have to have or they're trying to get

609
00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 1: something from somebody else. I think the exact opposite true

610
00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:13,040
Speaker 1: is true. You can be genuine, you can be authentic,

611
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:15,240
Speaker 1: and you can just connect with people who are doing

612
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:17,720
Speaker 1: cool stuff, who you like and respect. It doesn't have

613
00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:19,840
Speaker 1: to be and there don't have to be ulterior motives,

614
00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:23,480
Speaker 1: and that is what makes networking so great and so powerful.

615
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,000
Speaker 2: Especially on the front end. Yes, exactly, you're in need.

616
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,760
Speaker 1: Exactly, and so you're building that network over time hoping

617
00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 1: that you don't ever have to tap it in need,

618
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:32,640
Speaker 1: but it will be there for you then if you're

619
00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 1: in need, because you have built something based on mutual

620
00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:36,720
Speaker 1: respect and admiration.

621
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 2: Totally all right.

622
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:39,760
Speaker 1: So those are some of the career steps that you

623
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 1: need to take to prepare yourself for a potential layoff. Well,

624
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:45,000
Speaker 1: let's talk about some of the financial moves too, Matt,

625
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:48,399
Speaker 1: because obviously how to money, we got to talk about

626
00:27:48,560 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 1: the specifically money side of things as well, and I

627
00:27:51,520 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 1: think following through on some of the suggestions we just

628
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:57,120
Speaker 1: talked about will likely impact people's career even if they

629
00:27:57,119 --> 00:27:57,840
Speaker 1: never get laid off.

630
00:27:57,880 --> 00:27:59,719
Speaker 2: By the way, like, yeah, just generally speaking, these are

631
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:01,240
Speaker 2: good things. These are good practices.

632
00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:03,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it doesn't hurt to kind of do all

633
00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:05,680
Speaker 1: those things even if you never get laid off. It's

634
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:07,240
Speaker 1: kind of like buying life insurance. You're like, ah, but

635
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:09,399
Speaker 1: I didn't die. What a waste of money, And it's like, well, no,

636
00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:11,000
Speaker 1: these are all good moves. These are actually going to

637
00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:13,440
Speaker 1: pay off more than that life insurance policy if you

638
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:15,840
Speaker 1: don't croak. But let's talk about some of those general

639
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 1: financial steps that folks can take, and the first one

640
00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:20,400
Speaker 1: is to make sure you have a fully funded emergency

641
00:28:20,440 --> 00:28:24,520
Speaker 1: fund on hand. We talk about the very first money

642
00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:27,679
Speaker 1: gear we discussed is having twenty four hundred and sixty

643
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 1: seven dollars in the bank, which is a good first

644
00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:32,040
Speaker 1: step to strive for if you're not there yet. But

645
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:34,760
Speaker 1: then we want people to actually have more money than

646
00:28:34,760 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 1: that on hand, because that means less stress if paychecks

647
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,680
Speaker 1: stop coming. So if you're worried that a layoff could

648
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 1: be in your near term future, it might make sense

649
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:47,040
Speaker 1: to dial back on retirement savings, even to beef up

650
00:28:47,160 --> 00:28:50,800
Speaker 1: the amounts that you have in liquid savings in just

651
00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:53,400
Speaker 1: a high yield savings account. And also one of the

652
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,000
Speaker 1: things I think that this does that's so powerful is

653
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,720
Speaker 1: if you do get laid off, the more money you

654
00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 1: have on hand, the more months of living expenses that

655
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:03,800
Speaker 1: you can fund. It means the more picky you can

656
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,720
Speaker 1: be about potential jobs that you might take. And I

657
00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 1: think some people when they get laid off, they're so

658
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:11,640
Speaker 1: itchy to get the next job and they take maybe

659
00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:14,520
Speaker 1: an offer that's below them or they could have held

660
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,120
Speaker 1: out for something better, but they just didn't have the

661
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 1: financial backing to make that a possibility.

662
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 2: That's right. You have more cash in the bank means

663
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:23,360
Speaker 2: that gives you a leg up when it comes to

664
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:26,240
Speaker 2: negotiating some of the benefits that you might be able

665
00:29:26,320 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 2: to score with that new employer.

666
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:30,480
Speaker 1: And some people really even it alters their whole career

667
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 1: because they didn't have enough money and they.

668
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 2: Had inflection point where things kind of went south after that.

669
00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 1: I've known friends that that happened to, and it's just like,

670
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:40,800
Speaker 1: if they had had three months worth of expenses on

671
00:29:40,840 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 1: hand and they could little bit more, whether that storm

672
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 1: a little bit longer, they wouldn't have taken that first

673
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 1: job that came along.

674
00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, So a friend of mine, he actually recently was

675
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 2: laid off, and he actually was lucky, and he did

676
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,760
Speaker 2: have six months worth of living expenses on hand. But

677
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:56,800
Speaker 2: even after he got a new job, even after he

678
00:29:56,840 --> 00:29:59,239
Speaker 2: had an awesome offer, I was talking to him about it,

679
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 2: and he said, you know, I kind of wish that

680
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:04,320
Speaker 2: I would have had even more padding. He said that

681
00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 2: he wishes he would have even had closer to twelve

682
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:08,680
Speaker 2: months worth of living expenses on hand. And so I

683
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,960
Speaker 2: think it is important to know your personal appetite for risk, essentially,

684
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:14,520
Speaker 2: because different folks are going to find themselves at different

685
00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:17,720
Speaker 2: ends of what a fully funded emergency fund is. But

686
00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:19,880
Speaker 2: I found that really interesting that even after he kind

687
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:21,680
Speaker 2: of came out through the other side. You would think

688
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 2: that you would quickly forget that, right, Like you'd be like, oh, yeah,

689
00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 2: it was fine. I always knew it was going to

690
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:27,480
Speaker 2: be fine. But he was just like, you know, that

691
00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:30,200
Speaker 2: kind of it put us in an uncomfortable position, and

692
00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:32,440
Speaker 2: I think he's probably going to air more on having

693
00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:34,800
Speaker 2: closer to that nine to twelve months as opposed to

694
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:37,920
Speaker 2: that three to six side of fully funded emergency fund

695
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:40,880
Speaker 2: makes sense to me. Yeah, And so the next basic

696
00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 2: general financial move that we want folks to make is

697
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:47,480
Speaker 2: to create a bare bones budget. This is a topic

698
00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:50,280
Speaker 2: that we dedicated an entire episode too, back in episode

699
00:30:50,280 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 2: three sixty two. But this is just an awesome exercise

700
00:30:53,520 --> 00:30:56,920
Speaker 2: in prioritizing your needs and cutting your once out of

701
00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 2: the equation. Because having a plan now for how it

702
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:01,880
Speaker 2: is that you're going to slash your budget in the

703
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,200
Speaker 2: event of a layoff, that can help you to see

704
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:07,320
Speaker 2: how that savings might be able to stretch even further.

705
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:09,920
Speaker 2: And then just having it already created means that you

706
00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,040
Speaker 2: can just flip the switch, right, You can just hop

707
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 2: on over to that new, much trimmer budget and in

708
00:31:14,960 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 2: a moment's notice. And I think this is kind of

709
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 2: going back to what we were just saying, this is

710
00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 2: an easy way to transform six months worth of living

711
00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:25,600
Speaker 2: expenses to twelve months, yes, right, like it effectively, even

712
00:31:25,640 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 2: though like the dollar amount hasn't changed. Well, if you

713
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 2: change how much how much money you're hemorrhaging every single month, well,

714
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 2: it effectively does turn that into a twelve months worth

715
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 2: of living expensive.

716
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, And trying to create that bare bones budget when

717
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,680
Speaker 1: you're emotionally in an emotional upheaval after being let go,

718
00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:45,680
Speaker 1: that's tough. But having the plan created beforehand and then

719
00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 1: just implementing is so different than trying to figure it

720
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:50,400
Speaker 1: out on the fly when you're in the midst of

721
00:31:50,480 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 1: like a financial fiasco, where you might even overcorrect. Yes,

722
00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:57,680
Speaker 1: like if you're feeling the weight of that layoff more emotionally,

723
00:31:58,160 --> 00:32:00,560
Speaker 1: you might say it takes some like crazy the drastic

724
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,600
Speaker 1: cuts that might be a little near sighted to the top.

725
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:05,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly. All right.

726
00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:08,880
Speaker 1: So another general financial move for folks who at least

727
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 1: own a home is to open a helock, a home

728
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:13,480
Speaker 1: equity line of credit. And this isn't something we want

729
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:16,000
Speaker 1: you to use necessarily, right, but if you've got to

730
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,400
Speaker 1: put food on the table, it's probably better to take

731
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:20,520
Speaker 1: money from the helock than to charge things up on

732
00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 1: your credit card. Especially with what's happened with credit card

733
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,200
Speaker 1: interest rates, right, you're likely not going to be able

734
00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:29,959
Speaker 1: to get that helock though, if you don't have a job,

735
00:32:30,400 --> 00:32:32,840
Speaker 1: So this is again a preventative measure. This is something

736
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,840
Speaker 1: you can't do after the fact. You can usually open

737
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:38,600
Speaker 1: one at a credit union with no closing costs, and

738
00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:41,200
Speaker 1: it's this financial release valve that can provide peace of

739
00:32:41,240 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 1: mind for you in case of emergency. It's kind of

740
00:32:44,120 --> 00:32:46,680
Speaker 1: like one of those break glass in case of emergency scenarios,

741
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:49,000
Speaker 1: like you want access to it, you want access, you

742
00:32:49,000 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 1: want to be there. The fire is thing, we sure,

743
00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:53,480
Speaker 1: but you'll break the glass until the fire is actually happening.

744
00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:54,959
Speaker 1: And that's what a helock can be for a lot

745
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:57,240
Speaker 1: of people. I think if you're a homeowner having a helock,

746
00:32:57,320 --> 00:32:59,680
Speaker 1: there's very little downside as long as you can prevent

747
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:02,320
Speaker 1: yourself from tapping it until it's absolutely necessary.

748
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:04,320
Speaker 2: Yeah. Kind of makes me think of like air bags

749
00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:07,040
Speaker 2: in a car, because when you and I talked about this,

750
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 2: because you know recently when you got rear ended, I

751
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 2: was like, wait a minute, did the air bags not

752
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,160
Speaker 2: deploy when yall cause y'all got hit pretty hard, But

753
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:15,600
Speaker 2: because I guess you're a hit from behind, the air

754
00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:16,760
Speaker 2: bags didn't deploy.

755
00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:19,360
Speaker 1: But I'll stay to round us that that hard from

756
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 1: the front.

757
00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,080
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, they throw it sure would have deployed, but

758
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,480
Speaker 2: I was thinking through that because I thought that they

759
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,480
Speaker 2: would have. Typically that adds a lot more expense to

760
00:33:26,640 --> 00:33:30,440
Speaker 2: repairing a vehicle because it kind of destroys your interior,

761
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 2: right like the like the dashboard, the steering wheel. It's

762
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: just it's like exploded to shreds in order for that

763
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:38,760
Speaker 2: airbag to get out, and not to mention like you know,

764
00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 2: newer cards got like the side curtained airbags, So there

765
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:42,800
Speaker 2: are a lot of parts that have to be replaced.

766
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:45,480
Speaker 2: And of course if you were in a head on collision,

767
00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 2: you are so glad that you've got that there, but

768
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 2: you're not looking for those airbags to go off just

769
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,240
Speaker 2: willy nilly while you're driving around. It's not something that

770
00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:56,160
Speaker 2: you're voluntarily looking to do. But we also want to

771
00:33:56,160 --> 00:33:59,120
Speaker 2: recommend for folks to consider diversifying their income as well,

772
00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 2: and is not advice for everyone actually, because like you,

773
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,480
Speaker 2: depending on your situation, you might find yourself overwhelmed with

774
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:09,160
Speaker 2: a day job, one that requires maybe quite a bit

775
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:11,040
Speaker 2: of time and effort. As well as maybe you've got

776
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 2: a big family, maybe you've got a lot of kids,

777
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:15,880
Speaker 2: but if you're worried that your job might not be

778
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,880
Speaker 2: long for this world. Other streams of income, even if

779
00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:21,120
Speaker 2: they're quite a bit smaller, right, but even still, they

780
00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 2: can provide at least some additional income. It can provide

781
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:26,800
Speaker 2: a little more cushion if a layoff hits your family.

782
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:29,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, and those things aren't created overnight. This is another

783
00:34:29,120 --> 00:34:31,040
Speaker 1: thing where you've got to be intentional on the front

784
00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:33,920
Speaker 1: end to kind of create that other stream of income.

785
00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:37,120
Speaker 1: Starting a side hustle or a side business, even if

786
00:34:37,160 --> 00:34:39,560
Speaker 1: it's stay small though, can give you something to pour

787
00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:43,880
Speaker 1: your energy into, maybe becoming your full time thing eventually

788
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:46,680
Speaker 1: if you do get laid off. I like that as

789
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: like an outlet to pour some of your effort into.

790
00:34:50,200 --> 00:34:52,319
Speaker 1: Maybe you could ramp it up really quickly if you

791
00:34:52,400 --> 00:34:54,759
Speaker 1: lose your job. And investment property, by the way, like

792
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 1: if you're so inclined, can have a similar sort of

793
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 1: impact bolstering your personal finances having money still coming in

794
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:02,880
Speaker 1: even though you don't have the paycheck. And so when

795
00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 1: you do this, you're making a conscious choice not to

796
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:07,400
Speaker 1: put all of your eggs in that W two income basket,

797
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 1: which I think is really smart.

798
00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:11,920
Speaker 2: That's true. Yeah, So as we have said all of

799
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:14,880
Speaker 2: these different steps that we want you to at least consider,

800
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:19,000
Speaker 2: if not take simultaneously. This is gonna be difficult to do,

801
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:20,879
Speaker 2: but at the same time, we don't want you to

802
00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:26,239
Speaker 2: get distracted from the golden goose that's currently laying the eggs. Right, Like,

803
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:28,879
Speaker 2: there's a chance that you may not get laid off.

804
00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:30,920
Speaker 2: But if all of your additional and all of your

805
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 2: creative energy, if it's going towards figuring out where you're

806
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:37,040
Speaker 2: gonna land, if layoffs do start coming down the pike,

807
00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:39,799
Speaker 2: then that could actually make you less attractive as an

808
00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,239
Speaker 2: employee and more likely that you're gonna get fired. So

809
00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:44,120
Speaker 2: just keep that in mind. Right, You got to kind

810
00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:46,440
Speaker 2: of find that balance, because if you're using company time

811
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 2: and assets to find the next gig when instead you

812
00:35:49,080 --> 00:35:51,239
Speaker 2: should be serving the company, well that's not going to

813
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 2: bode Well.

814
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:53,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, your boss comes in the room while you're working

815
00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: on your resume, that never is good. They're like, oh, oh,

816
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:57,560
Speaker 1: they're looking for other stuff, and you're like, no, I'm

817
00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,480
Speaker 1: just trying to prepare because the things all look so

818
00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:00,080
Speaker 1: hot around here.

819
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:01,359
Speaker 2: Now you need to do that on your own time.

820
00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 2: Are like, well, we weren't planning firing you. But no,

821
00:36:04,840 --> 00:36:06,879
Speaker 2: you've just kind of risen to the top exactly. Yes,

822
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:08,719
Speaker 2: But Joel, right after the break, we're going to get

823
00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:11,160
Speaker 2: to some final things that we want folks to consider,

824
00:36:11,239 --> 00:36:14,200
Speaker 2: specifically if they find themselves in the middle of getting

825
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:16,520
Speaker 2: laid off. We'll get to those right after this.

826
00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:28,120
Speaker 1: All right, Matt, we are back. We were talking a

827
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:32,200
Speaker 1: lot about how to prepare for a potential layoff. Now

828
00:36:32,239 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 1: let's talk about what happens when the ish hit the fan, right, So, like,

829
00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:38,440
Speaker 1: when you actually do get laid off, there's a whole

830
00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 1: lot of things happening that you need to consider and

831
00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:44,799
Speaker 1: that you need to some things, some steps you need

832
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:49,000
Speaker 1: to take in the middle of an uncomfortable situation, and

833
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:51,320
Speaker 1: hopefully your employer handles it well. Hopefully they're not the

834
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:54,279
Speaker 1: kind of folks sending just a crummy mass email to

835
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 1: like thousands of people at one time, or putting you

836
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:00,200
Speaker 1: on some sort of mass zoom call. But those which

837
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:02,440
Speaker 1: actually makes you think that the layoffs, the way they

838
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:04,319
Speaker 1: went down in office space, they don't seem so bad

839
00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:05,600
Speaker 1: in retrospect, right, Like.

840
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:09,440
Speaker 2: It seems quite kind and humane. Yes, even what folks

841
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:10,520
Speaker 2: are dealing with them, Yeah, even.

842
00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:12,440
Speaker 1: Those guns for hire coming in like somebody you've never

843
00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:14,719
Speaker 1: seen before. Well, at least it's interpersonal and it's one

844
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 1: on one. But however it shakes out. Even while you

845
00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 1: might find yourself in a hyper emotional state, which makes sense,

846
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 1: like it's never fun and it's disorienting to get laid off,

847
00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,000
Speaker 1: to lose your job, you still need to make sure

848
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:31,040
Speaker 1: that you maintain your professionalism. So here is a thing.

849
00:37:31,200 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people, in the heat of

850
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:36,000
Speaker 1: the moment, they act poorly. They burn bridges, And at

851
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:38,920
Speaker 1: the end of the day, if you're let go, handling

852
00:37:39,000 --> 00:37:41,799
Speaker 1: it in a cordial manner and maintaining a dialogue with

853
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:45,240
Speaker 1: your direct supervisor and your employer is really really important.

854
00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:48,879
Speaker 1: You never know that your immediate boss might be flying

855
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:50,640
Speaker 1: the coop too. They might be getting let go as well,

856
00:37:50,640 --> 00:37:53,080
Speaker 1: but they might have a landing pad somewhere else and

857
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:55,879
Speaker 1: they're like you know what, Sue or Jim like, man,

858
00:37:55,920 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 1: they handled that so well. They've been a great employee

859
00:37:57,640 --> 00:37:58,600
Speaker 1: for a long time. I'm gonna take them with me.

860
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:00,200
Speaker 1: I want to see if there's a spot for them too.

861
00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:01,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, but if you how many.

862
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 1: Suits form out in a bunch of curse words, sort

863
00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:06,839
Speaker 1: of thing, like you might ruin that opportunity you said.

864
00:38:06,880 --> 00:38:08,479
Speaker 2: I was gonna make fun of you for saying Sue.

865
00:38:08,480 --> 00:38:10,680
Speaker 2: How many sus do you actually know? Boy name Sue?

866
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 2: I know a boy name Sue. Okay, if you're gonna

867
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:15,880
Speaker 2: say Jim, you should say Pam. Yeah. Probably. Yeah.

868
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:18,520
Speaker 1: Well even if you feel slighted though, I think and no,

869
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:20,759
Speaker 1: it's true, which is true, Like it's hard not to

870
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:22,760
Speaker 1: feel slighted, not to feel like you don't want me anymore?

871
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 1: Like what's wrong with you being a jerk? Isn't going

872
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:27,399
Speaker 1: to help you or your future prospects. And it makes

873
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:29,279
Speaker 1: me think of Matt. We had a friend who during

874
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:32,160
Speaker 1: the pandemic, like Delta, big employer here in Atlanta, they

875
00:38:32,360 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 1: eliminated a lot of positions and a lot of people.

876
00:38:35,080 --> 00:38:38,080
Speaker 1: I think it was that was hard, But they brought

877
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:40,400
Speaker 1: a lot of those people back when the air travel

878
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:43,239
Speaker 1: resurgens happened. But my guess is they didn't reach out

879
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:45,359
Speaker 1: to some folks, But the folks that had handled it

880
00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:47,680
Speaker 1: really well and who had been good employees for a

881
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:49,719
Speaker 1: long time, they probably reached back out with some pretty

882
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 1: sweet offers. So those are the kind of things that

883
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:55,080
Speaker 1: happen in business, and the more you kind of are

884
00:38:55,480 --> 00:39:00,200
Speaker 1: emotional reactionary and casting throwing stones at your employee or

885
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 1: your boss, the worst it's gonna shake out for you

886
00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:04,320
Speaker 1: when it comes to getting a reference in the future.

887
00:39:04,440 --> 00:39:06,319
Speaker 1: We're getting another job offer, that's right.

888
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:09,640
Speaker 2: So severance, that's the that's the next item on the docket,

889
00:39:09,960 --> 00:39:13,480
Speaker 2: because months of pay without having to actually work, that's

890
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:15,880
Speaker 2: probably the biggest thing that you're gonna want to pay

891
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:18,839
Speaker 2: attention to next. And it is definitely worth trying to

892
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:22,600
Speaker 2: negotiate more than the initial offer, especially if you feel

893
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 2: that the amount that they're that they're giving you is paltry.

894
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:27,120
Speaker 2: For instance, if they're offering one week of pay salary

895
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:29,960
Speaker 2: per year that you've worked there versus two, that would

896
00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:33,279
Speaker 2: make a massive stinking difference were you to push back

897
00:39:33,320 --> 00:39:36,800
Speaker 2: a little bit. Ingranted, oftentimes you're not necessarily in a

898
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 2: super strong position of you know, to negotiate. But again,

899
00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:43,520
Speaker 2: going back to Alex Carter, she talked about the ability

900
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:45,279
Speaker 2: to negotiate severance on the front and.

901
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:47,160
Speaker 1: So but eat on the back end. It's a question

902
00:39:47,200 --> 00:39:50,080
Speaker 1: you could ask. You can always always ask, hey, industry standards,

903
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:51,840
Speaker 1: two weeks, why are you guys only offering one and

904
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:54,840
Speaker 1: can how can we how can we make this severance

905
00:39:54,840 --> 00:39:56,040
Speaker 1: more palatable to both of us?

906
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:57,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, we don't want that to be something that you

907
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:00,239
Speaker 2: agree to right away, Like, don't sign right away. Take

908
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:03,279
Speaker 2: the time, think through it, and buy yourself a little

909
00:40:03,280 --> 00:40:06,360
Speaker 2: bit of additional time to ask for better terms. You

910
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:08,839
Speaker 2: can also negotiate some other things in this process too, right,

911
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:11,880
Speaker 2: like perhaps getting paid for some vacation days that you

912
00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:16,200
Speaker 2: haven't taken. Leave no stone unturned. You're now ex employer.

913
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:18,239
Speaker 2: They might you know, maybe they might even be able

914
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:20,600
Speaker 2: to help you to find a new job if they

915
00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:22,400
Speaker 2: happen to know that. Like, hey, look, this is a

916
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:25,680
Speaker 2: difficult position that we are finding ourselves in the industry wide.

917
00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:29,160
Speaker 2: Though things are looking good, let's make an introductory phone

918
00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:31,759
Speaker 2: call with you and so and so at this neighboringcome That.

919
00:40:31,719 --> 00:40:34,839
Speaker 1: Kind of stuff can be massive, right, and yet oftentimes

920
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:38,200
Speaker 1: in our emotional state, we don't do some of those

921
00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:41,240
Speaker 1: steps that could potentially help us. Land the next thing totally.

922
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: Healthcare is another thing that you can potentially negotiate your company.

923
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,280
Speaker 1: They might be willing to put the bill for Cobra

924
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:48,719
Speaker 1: coverage for a full six months or something like that.

925
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 1: Like at least ensuring that if you've got an ongoing

926
00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:53,399
Speaker 1: health condition you're taking care of, you can go see

927
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:55,799
Speaker 1: your doctor. That could be a big thing. Cobra is

928
00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:59,200
Speaker 1: very expensive to the tune. Depending on family size and

929
00:40:59,239 --> 00:41:00,640
Speaker 1: all that kind of stuff, it could be a couple

930
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 1: grand a month or more. And so that's one of

931
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 1: those things that you might be able to negotiate when

932
00:41:05,200 --> 00:41:07,479
Speaker 1: you're talking severance with your employer on the way out

933
00:41:08,120 --> 00:41:11,720
Speaker 1: and Matt, we actually talked about proactively starting a severance

934
00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:15,520
Speaker 1: conversation negotiating your own layoff with Sam from Financial Samurai

935
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 1: back in episode five thirty five. I actually used some

936
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:20,279
Speaker 1: of his techniques back in the day when I was

937
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 1: ready to leave a job and I saw the writing

938
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 1: on the wall they were trying to let people go.

939
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:25,360
Speaker 1: I said, hey, I'm going to raise my hand. You

940
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:27,399
Speaker 1: might want to let me go, and I was able

941
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,239
Speaker 1: to negotiate a severance kind of proactively get laid off,

942
00:41:30,239 --> 00:41:32,719
Speaker 1: which sounds weird, but that is that is something that

943
00:41:32,760 --> 00:41:35,600
Speaker 1: I think if you are in the financial position and

944
00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:38,040
Speaker 1: you really want to pursue something else, you might be

945
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 1: able to take advantage of an industry wide layoff or

946
00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 1: something like that. And volunteer yourself as tribute in a

947
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 1: way to get something like a six month severance.

948
00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 2: Pay and gotten a s Everden style.

949
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:52,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, And I think that that can for some

950
00:41:52,719 --> 00:41:55,440
Speaker 1: people who really are ready to make a transition, who

951
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:57,400
Speaker 1: have their financial ducts in a row, that can be

952
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:01,120
Speaker 1: another strategy that happens if layoff, a layoff tidal wave

953
00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 1: does really come about.

954
00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:04,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can negotiate a longer period that you have

955
00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:07,240
Speaker 2: that money flowing in. But yeah, you get to essentially

956
00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:09,520
Speaker 2: play the part of the hero a little bit where

957
00:42:09,560 --> 00:42:11,479
Speaker 2: it's a win win. It works out for you because

958
00:42:11,480 --> 00:42:14,320
Speaker 2: maybe you're looking to move on to something more exciting,

959
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:16,960
Speaker 2: or maybe you're tech, maybe you're even like financially independent

960
00:42:16,960 --> 00:42:19,000
Speaker 2: and you're just looking to man, I've been looking for

961
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 2: a reason to just get out of here. Yeah, it

962
00:42:21,800 --> 00:42:24,600
Speaker 2: could work out for everybody. But maybe you are laid off,

963
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,880
Speaker 2: make sure that you file for unemployment because the longer

964
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:29,880
Speaker 2: that you wait to file for this, the longer it's

965
00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:31,920
Speaker 2: going to take for that first unemployment check to hit

966
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 2: your account. And if you've got a bunch of expenses

967
00:42:35,000 --> 00:42:37,360
Speaker 2: that you got to pay without a whole lot of margin,

968
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:39,080
Speaker 2: you're going to be in a tough spot, so don't

969
00:42:39,080 --> 00:42:41,840
Speaker 2: delay on this one. Go ahead, gather the necessary paperwork

970
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:45,080
Speaker 2: file for unemployment on your state's Department of Labor website.

971
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 2: And by the way, this we want to make sure

972
00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:50,520
Speaker 2: that folks are thinking about this correctly, because I feel

973
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:52,920
Speaker 2: like we are very much. We tend to walk the

974
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:56,680
Speaker 2: line of independence and self reliance. But this isn't a handout.

975
00:42:56,800 --> 00:42:59,479
Speaker 2: This is basically insurance that you've been paying into four years.

976
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 2: It's literally called unemployment insurance. And so don't feel bad

977
00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:05,520
Speaker 2: about taking it. Yeah, some people have a m when

978
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:07,600
Speaker 2: it comes to employed and there shouldn't be. There shouldn't

979
00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:10,160
Speaker 2: because you are funding it in large part you and

980
00:43:10,280 --> 00:43:12,759
Speaker 2: your employer m H. At the same time, take that

981
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 2: money because that is insurance that you have contributed to,

982
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 2: So don't feel bad about it. Also, now is the

983
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:22,160
Speaker 2: time now to not just have made that bare bones budget,

984
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:24,319
Speaker 2: but to implement it. If you are like right, when

985
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:25,719
Speaker 2: you go through a layoff, this is the time to

986
00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:28,840
Speaker 2: shift and to say this is my new budget. And

987
00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:31,279
Speaker 2: so unemployment and severance they can be burned through really

988
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:34,000
Speaker 2: quickly in order to stretch that money and the savings

989
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,719
Speaker 2: you currently have. The money you have on hand and

990
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:40,160
Speaker 2: like liquid, cut back on expenses until you're able to

991
00:43:40,239 --> 00:43:43,320
Speaker 2: secure another job. That's where the BBB comes in. You

992
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:46,480
Speaker 2: implement it in case of an emergency. That's why you

993
00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:48,360
Speaker 2: made it in the first place. That's right, man, And

994
00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:50,880
Speaker 2: as folks are in the middle of this turmoil, we

995
00:43:51,040 --> 00:43:53,799
Speaker 2: want you to not get down about things. We want

996
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:55,880
Speaker 2: you instead, we want you to think think outside the

997
00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,759
Speaker 2: box because this layoff, this might be the best thing

998
00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:01,360
Speaker 2: that's ever happened to you from a career standpoint. Instead,

999
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:03,919
Speaker 2: we want you to think through like what new opportunities

1000
00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 2: could actually come knocking because you now have the ability

1001
00:44:07,080 --> 00:44:10,560
Speaker 2: to take on something else and specifically having meaningful financial

1002
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:13,040
Speaker 2: margin that helps to be able to have a brighter

1003
00:44:13,040 --> 00:44:14,640
Speaker 2: outlook as well. But this is why we love the

1004
00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:17,239
Speaker 2: idea of folks having multiple streams of income. We touched

1005
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:19,200
Speaker 2: on this earlier as well, But even just having a

1006
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:22,600
Speaker 2: super small side hustle that can mean a continued flow

1007
00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:26,040
Speaker 2: of some money coming in after a layoff, and it

1008
00:44:26,120 --> 00:44:29,240
Speaker 2: can give you the ability to pour more hours into

1009
00:44:29,880 --> 00:44:33,200
Speaker 2: that solopreneur business to see if it, you know, could

1010
00:44:33,200 --> 00:44:37,160
Speaker 2: potentially sprout wings and fly off. While you are simultaneously

1011
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:41,040
Speaker 2: weighing some some other job offers, and so it's yeah,

1012
00:44:41,640 --> 00:44:43,359
Speaker 2: it can be easy to kind of take the woe

1013
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:46,680
Speaker 2: as me stance, but instead we want you to you know,

1014
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:49,080
Speaker 2: this is where just thinking a little bit more optimistically

1015
00:44:49,280 --> 00:44:50,239
Speaker 2: we think is going to pay off.

1016
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,440
Speaker 1: And I think it's true. Man, a lot of people too.

1017
00:44:52,520 --> 00:44:55,239
Speaker 1: They also they see a layoff as a judgment on

1018
00:44:55,560 --> 00:44:58,600
Speaker 1: themselves as an individual human or as a as a worker.

1019
00:44:59,200 --> 00:45:01,719
Speaker 1: It's not always is a referendum on how good you

1020
00:45:01,800 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 1: are at your job or how decent of a human

1021
00:45:03,520 --> 00:45:05,680
Speaker 1: being you are, and usually it's not. Usually it's more

1022
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 1: of a function, like a macroeconomic function that influences a

1023
00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:10,359
Speaker 1: lot of people on a micro level.

1024
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 2: Right, And so there's ten thousand people that bowing yeah.

1025
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:15,000
Speaker 1: Or all those people like it's it's the year of

1026
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:17,680
Speaker 1: efficiency that's going on. It's not about like, hey, you

1027
00:45:17,719 --> 00:45:20,120
Speaker 1: suck at your job, and so don't take it that way.

1028
00:45:20,280 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 1: If you and I get it's hard to dissociate those

1029
00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 1: two things. But we have to in order to, I think,

1030
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:28,360
Speaker 1: to be able to retain our confidence and our abilities

1031
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:31,040
Speaker 1: as we try to move forward in our careers post layoff.

1032
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:33,719
Speaker 1: And if you do get laid off, on that note, Matt,

1033
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:36,440
Speaker 1: start looking for work quickly. That's what we would that's

1034
00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:39,120
Speaker 1: what we would encourage. Don't take eight weeks off and

1035
00:45:39,160 --> 00:45:41,719
Speaker 1: then start looking or whatever. Like h I get the

1036
00:45:42,080 --> 00:45:44,520
Speaker 1: kind of the desire. Take a few days, right, sure,

1037
00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:45,920
Speaker 1: but not eight weeks. You want to You want to

1038
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:49,719
Speaker 1: process things and be in a healthy mental local state. Yeah,

1039
00:45:49,719 --> 00:45:51,640
Speaker 1: and you might feel a little manic if you start

1040
00:45:51,719 --> 00:45:53,800
Speaker 1: job hunting that very evening or something like that. But

1041
00:45:54,320 --> 00:45:56,359
Speaker 1: now is the time to utilize the network that you've

1042
00:45:56,360 --> 00:45:58,600
Speaker 1: successfully built to help you as well. That's what it's

1043
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:00,880
Speaker 1: there for. And so I think the ways to do this,

1044
00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:03,440
Speaker 1: by the way, or to simply let folks out there

1045
00:46:03,560 --> 00:46:05,680
Speaker 1: in your network know that you're looking for a job.

1046
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:08,800
Speaker 1: Remain upbeat and positive. Talk about your former employer in

1047
00:46:08,840 --> 00:46:10,760
Speaker 1: a good light, because if you don't, think it reflects

1048
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:12,240
Speaker 1: more on you than it does on your employer.

1049
00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:13,560
Speaker 2: But make it.

1050
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:16,399
Speaker 1: Create a post on LinkedIn and talk about how you're

1051
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 1: sad that all those years this wonderful employer have come

1052
00:46:19,200 --> 00:46:21,200
Speaker 1: to an end. That kind of puts the notice out. Hey,

1053
00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:25,359
Speaker 1: guess what, I'm a free agent. And you can also

1054
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 1: email some specific people in your network directly. Don't do

1055
00:46:29,040 --> 00:46:31,479
Speaker 1: it in some sort of a bulk email address people

1056
00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:34,960
Speaker 1: as individuals, but I think sending notes and message asking

1057
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:38,000
Speaker 1: for advice and telling people thank you, not asking for

1058
00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:41,239
Speaker 1: jobs specifically, but that just again puts it on the radar. Hey,

1059
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:44,080
Speaker 1: I'm a free agent, I'm open for work, and I

1060
00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:46,839
Speaker 1: think that is what gets the network going to kind

1061
00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:48,680
Speaker 1: of like advocate on your behalf, or to send you

1062
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:51,279
Speaker 1: job offerings or yeah, to maybe even bring you in

1063
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:53,320
Speaker 1: for an interview if you know somebody who's in that

1064
00:46:53,400 --> 00:46:53,920
Speaker 1: kind of position.

1065
00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:56,560
Speaker 2: Totally yeah. And you said to not necessarily ask for

1066
00:46:56,600 --> 00:46:59,480
Speaker 2: a job. I think there's a difference between stating clearly

1067
00:46:59,520 --> 00:47:02,359
Speaker 2: what it is you're looking for versus begging for a job,

1068
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 2: which is maybe I think maybe what you're getting at,

1069
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:07,080
Speaker 2: because I think it's okay to state clearly the kind

1070
00:47:07,120 --> 00:47:09,160
Speaker 2: of position that you're looking for, the type of role,

1071
00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:12,239
Speaker 2: the type of company, as opposed to just being like, hey,

1072
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:16,440
Speaker 2: what's going on? Have got anything for me? Because if

1073
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:18,840
Speaker 2: you're just hanging out on LinkedIn all of a sudden

1074
00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:20,920
Speaker 2: and not clearly stating, I guess what it is that

1075
00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:23,160
Speaker 2: you're looking for, I don't. I guess what I'm thinking

1076
00:47:23,239 --> 00:47:25,120
Speaker 2: of is like maybe folks who are later in their careers,

1077
00:47:25,320 --> 00:47:27,799
Speaker 2: I don't think folks would necessarily assume that you're looking

1078
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:30,880
Speaker 2: for a new job, because, in particular, if you've handled

1079
00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:33,719
Speaker 2: your money well, you literally could be financially independent. And

1080
00:47:33,760 --> 00:47:36,200
Speaker 2: folks might think that, well, maybe he's looking for a position,

1081
00:47:36,280 --> 00:47:38,520
Speaker 2: but I don't know, he hasn't really stated clearly what

1082
00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:40,520
Speaker 2: he's looking for. So I think it is important to

1083
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:44,640
Speaker 2: communicate in an effective way. Whereas maybe if somebody who's

1084
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 2: in their twenties or thirties, it's like, Okay, yeah, they're

1085
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:49,560
Speaker 2: probably looking for another position. But for those who are

1086
00:47:49,560 --> 00:47:53,359
Speaker 2: maybe a little more mature and aged, Joel, those folks

1087
00:47:53,440 --> 00:47:55,160
Speaker 2: might be actually looking to step out of the workforce

1088
00:47:55,200 --> 00:47:57,440
Speaker 2: all together. Well, I think either way, you need to

1089
00:47:58,320 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 2: try to be sensitive to our older sure, and as

1090
00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:02,920
Speaker 2: I'm now a man in his forties, I hear you.

1091
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:06,120
Speaker 1: Well, I think either way, you want to make sure

1092
00:48:06,160 --> 00:48:08,560
Speaker 1: that your network knows that you're on the hunt, that

1093
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:11,920
Speaker 1: you're looking. And that is where like public posting about

1094
00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:14,400
Speaker 1: it makes sense because you never know who's going to

1095
00:48:14,440 --> 00:48:16,000
Speaker 1: come through in the clutch or who's going to see

1096
00:48:16,040 --> 00:48:18,759
Speaker 1: that and say, oh, I didn't realize that Pam or

1097
00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:22,520
Speaker 1: Jim was available now that they were no longer deployment. Man,

1098
00:48:22,560 --> 00:48:24,520
Speaker 1: they did such a great job. Man, I didn't they'd

1099
00:48:24,560 --> 00:48:26,120
Speaker 1: be such an asset to our company. But if you

1100
00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:28,000
Speaker 1: don't post it and they don't know it, then they

1101
00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:30,120
Speaker 1: can't link you up to that opportunity that exists, and

1102
00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:32,600
Speaker 1: so you do have to make it public knowledge. While

1103
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:35,239
Speaker 1: at the same time I'm begging for work, right, that's true. Yes,

1104
00:48:35,480 --> 00:48:36,040
Speaker 1: I will say too.

1105
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:39,120
Speaker 2: My buddy who was recently laid off, but then Landa

1106
00:48:39,160 --> 00:48:42,160
Speaker 2: did a great job, a great gig. One of the

1107
00:48:42,200 --> 00:48:44,440
Speaker 2: things he mentioned he was that he was shocked at

1108
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:49,040
Speaker 2: how supportive and how great all his previous coworkers and

1109
00:48:49,080 --> 00:48:51,480
Speaker 2: colleagues not coworkers I guess at the current company he

1110
00:48:51,560 --> 00:48:53,279
Speaker 2: was at, but just folks who he had worked with

1111
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:56,239
Speaker 2: in the past were when it came to, hey, let

1112
00:48:56,280 --> 00:48:58,320
Speaker 2: me make an introductory email. Oh let me get you

1113
00:48:58,400 --> 00:48:59,760
Speaker 2: lined up with this company over here.

1114
00:48:59,800 --> 00:49:01,920
Speaker 1: And Matt to kind of wrap things up, we talked

1115
00:49:01,960 --> 00:49:06,760
Speaker 1: about earlier water proof versus water resistance, and the layoffs.

1116
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:07,400
Speaker 2: Same thing.

1117
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,040
Speaker 1: We want people to be layoff resistant. It's becoming layoff

1118
00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:13,399
Speaker 1: proof is basically impossible even for folks who like yeh

1119
00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:16,319
Speaker 1: us who run our own business. But I think it's

1120
00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:19,319
Speaker 1: important to make yourself as layoff resistant as possible, as

1121
00:49:19,520 --> 00:49:22,960
Speaker 1: financially resilient should a layoff come down the pike as possible.

1122
00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:25,440
Speaker 1: And I think for some people it really could be

1123
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:27,040
Speaker 1: the best thing that ever happened to them. I know

1124
00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:31,000
Speaker 1: multiple friends where like they it gave them the chance

1125
00:49:31,040 --> 00:49:35,200
Speaker 1: to pursue something better, something even more lucrative, And they

1126
00:49:35,239 --> 00:49:37,799
Speaker 1: wouldn't have left their current job if they hadn't been

1127
00:49:37,800 --> 00:49:39,960
Speaker 1: forced out, And so it was. I wouldn't say it

1128
00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:42,200
Speaker 1: was like easy. It was a tumultuous experience for them,

1129
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:44,440
Speaker 1: but they've landed in a much better place, and so

1130
00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:47,640
Speaker 1: it's so easy to think about layoffs as purely negative.

1131
00:49:47,680 --> 00:49:49,040
Speaker 1: But if we can change the way we think about it,

1132
00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:51,600
Speaker 1: and we can be more prepared for a potential one

1133
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:54,600
Speaker 1: to come along, then I think it's all good. And

1134
00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:57,080
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be nearly as much of like

1135
00:49:57,160 --> 00:49:59,799
Speaker 1: a disaster scenario as we might have built it up

1136
00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 1: to be in our minds.

1137
00:50:00,719 --> 00:50:03,239
Speaker 2: Most definitely, Man, all right, let's shift gears. Get back

1138
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:05,640
Speaker 2: to the beer that you and I enjoyed during this episode.

1139
00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:10,080
Speaker 2: This was an absolute brightness biology and this is specifically

1140
00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:13,520
Speaker 2: the ology out of Tampa, So I think they used

1141
00:50:13,560 --> 00:50:17,000
Speaker 2: to be or primarily they were founded and based in Tallahassee.

1142
00:50:17,520 --> 00:50:19,719
Speaker 2: And Jamie, who's a long time listener, she sent us

1143
00:50:19,840 --> 00:50:21,600
Speaker 2: this beer as well as the beer we had on Monday,

1144
00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:26,239
Speaker 2: and her husband specifically opened the Tampa location. But what

1145
00:50:26,400 --> 00:50:30,320
Speaker 2: your thoughts on this hazy double India pale ale, which is,

1146
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:32,279
Speaker 2: by the way, what IPA stands for. We never say

1147
00:50:32,320 --> 00:50:35,759
Speaker 2: India pale ale, but that's what i PA. Everybody knows, right, right,

1148
00:50:36,040 --> 00:50:38,520
Speaker 2: most folks do, so, at least people listening to this show. Well,

1149
00:50:38,920 --> 00:50:41,200
Speaker 2: do you think more folks know what IRA stands for?

1150
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:41,799
Speaker 2: I PA?

1151
00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:44,759
Speaker 1: Well, now they're confused because IRA Inflation Reduction Act or

1152
00:50:45,080 --> 00:50:46,080
Speaker 1: Individual Retirement again?

1153
00:50:46,160 --> 00:50:46,319
Speaker 2: Yeah?

1154
00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:47,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, which one was it?

1155
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:49,760
Speaker 2: Well? Should we have a T shirt that's like IRA

1156
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:52,480
Speaker 2: or IPA both? We could?

1157
00:50:52,600 --> 00:50:54,160
Speaker 1: We should. Well, we need to do merchant. We haven't

1158
00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:57,080
Speaker 1: done it because we're lazy. But this beer, Matt was

1159
00:50:58,080 --> 00:50:59,720
Speaker 1: really really delightful.

1160
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:00,400
Speaker 2: This is tasty.

1161
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:04,719
Speaker 1: It was like packed with juice, juicy punch. But it's like,

1162
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:07,640
Speaker 1: all it's not fake juice. It's all like just amazing

1163
00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:11,520
Speaker 1: hop juice. Right, And so that's what makes a great IPA.

1164
00:51:11,960 --> 00:51:14,640
Speaker 1: A great one is because all those juicy vibes come

1165
00:51:14,760 --> 00:51:17,120
Speaker 1: from the selection of hops that are included and just

1166
00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:20,359
Speaker 1: from like a pristine brewing process. So this one had

1167
00:51:21,000 --> 00:51:23,440
Speaker 1: four different kinds of hops in it, all right, and

1168
00:51:23,680 --> 00:51:26,400
Speaker 1: it taste you can taste that dry hop sort of

1169
00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:28,160
Speaker 1: like funk, that edge, that bite.

1170
00:51:28,440 --> 00:51:30,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I loved it. It's so good. Yeah, this is

1171
00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:32,040
Speaker 2: a really good one. I love that you talked about

1172
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:35,520
Speaker 2: the fruity juiciness, but not because they're adjuncts in this beer,

1173
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:38,960
Speaker 2: but because they're able to coax those flavors out of

1174
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:42,160
Speaker 2: the hops. That's what you get with a delicious, hazy IPA.

1175
00:51:42,600 --> 00:51:46,800
Speaker 2: This absolute brightness was an absolute winner in my book. Jamie,

1176
00:51:46,840 --> 00:51:49,279
Speaker 2: thank you for sending this one out away. And I'm

1177
00:51:49,320 --> 00:51:51,840
Speaker 2: glad too, because we've never had any Ology beers on

1178
00:51:51,920 --> 00:51:54,080
Speaker 2: the show before, so I don't even I'm not even

1179
00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:56,440
Speaker 2: sure if I've ever had any in I r L

1180
00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:58,359
Speaker 2: in real life, as I don't think they had either,

1181
00:51:58,440 --> 00:52:00,560
Speaker 2: so I've seen them, seen them around before, but it

1182
00:52:00,719 --> 00:52:02,719
Speaker 2: was good to finally see what it is that they

1183
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:03,160
Speaker 2: had to offer.

1184
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 1: So yeah, Well, if any of the rest of the

1185
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:08,440
Speaker 1: lineup is it tastes like the ones that we've had already,

1186
00:52:08,560 --> 00:52:11,360
Speaker 1: this one or was it Rainbow color glasses? Yeah, then

1187
00:52:11,360 --> 00:52:14,960
Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure ology is made good. So fantastic, delightful beer.

1188
00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:17,640
Speaker 1: So yeah, very very delicious. Thank you, Jamie. Thank you

1189
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:18,839
Speaker 1: to Jamie's husband as well.

1190
00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:19,640
Speaker 2: I don't know his name.

1191
00:52:19,640 --> 00:52:22,200
Speaker 1: She didn't mention it, but by the way, that's going

1192
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:23,560
Speaker 1: to do it for this episode. We hope that you

1193
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:25,600
Speaker 1: learned a lot, and we'll have links to some of

1194
00:52:25,600 --> 00:52:27,680
Speaker 1: the things that we mentioned in the show notes up

1195
00:52:27,680 --> 00:52:29,319
Speaker 1: on our website at how to money dot com.

1196
00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:31,320
Speaker 2: That's right, and if you have been listening to the

1197
00:52:31,360 --> 00:52:33,520
Speaker 2: show for a while you have found this episode helpful,

1198
00:52:33,640 --> 00:52:35,000
Speaker 2: we would love it if you were to leave us

1199
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:37,920
Speaker 2: a solid review wherever it is that you leave the review.

1200
00:52:38,000 --> 00:52:42,479
Speaker 2: It's really helpful and helping others to discover how to money. Joel,

1201
00:52:42,560 --> 00:52:44,120
Speaker 2: that's going to be it for this episode, Buddy. Until

1202
00:52:44,200 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 2: next time, Best Friends Out, Best Friends Out.