WEBVTT - Show, Don’t Tell 0:00:01.000 --> 0:00:06.000 This is the most dramatic podcast ever and iHeartRadio podcast. 0:00:07.920 --> 0:00:10.319 Chris Harrison and Lauren Zema coming to you from the 0:00:10.360 --> 0:00:14.200 home office in Austin, Texas. I hope everybody's having a 0:00:14.200 --> 0:00:16.919 great week LZ. We just got back from Dad's weekend 0:00:17.480 --> 0:00:20.320 that you also attended at TCU. So much fun with 0:00:20.360 --> 0:00:24.439 their daughter, Taylor, and it was a great week. We 0:00:24.480 --> 0:00:25.320 had a great weekend. 0:00:25.560 --> 0:00:29.200 It's always awesome to see your kids thriving and wanting 0:00:29.240 --> 0:00:31.520 to share their life with you. We're so proud of Taylor. 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:34.519 The most important thing to me is that she has 0:00:34.560 --> 0:00:38.120 an incredible group of girlfriends around her. I think you know, 0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:41.159 when you are parenting in any way, that's what you 0:00:41.200 --> 0:00:43.480 want the most, is just for your kids to have 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:45.440 that group when they're away from you, to know they 0:00:45.440 --> 0:00:48.599 have that family of friends. And besides that, of course, 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:50.720 she's doing great in school, so you want that too. 0:00:50.760 --> 0:00:54.680 But it's just nice to see them feel secure and 0:00:54.800 --> 0:00:57.960 happy and successful. 0:00:58.320 --> 0:01:02.000 It is a week out from our presidential election where 0:01:02.080 --> 0:01:05.640 the United States elected Donald Trump the forty seventh President 0:01:05.640 --> 0:01:12.280 of the United States, and the subsequent chatter and everything 0:01:12.360 --> 0:01:15.080 has now kind of played out. We did a very 0:01:15.360 --> 0:01:18.959 highly listened to podcast immediately after the day after the election, 0:01:19.040 --> 0:01:21.840 where we talked about the media and their responsibility and 0:01:21.880 --> 0:01:24.280 how they were And now that we're a week out, 0:01:24.360 --> 0:01:27.720 l Z I wanted to go back because now we 0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:30.600 have the ratings. Now we have kind of the proof 0:01:30.319 --> 0:01:34.240 of everything and what played out. And the good news 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:37.800 is this is the good news. The media has done 0:01:37.800 --> 0:01:41.160 a full point eighty. They took a big gulp of 0:01:41.280 --> 0:01:45.120 humble pie. They have realized the error of their ways, 0:01:45.720 --> 0:01:50.600 and they have course corrected. And it is so refreshing 0:01:51.800 --> 0:01:57.120 to see how even the comedians have really learned a lot. 0:01:57.360 --> 0:01:59.640 Take for example, Jimmy. 0:01:59.360 --> 0:02:01.160 Kimmel being too dry with this. 0:02:01.840 --> 0:02:04.080 Take for example, Jimmy Kimmel who went on the next 0:02:04.200 --> 0:02:09.520 day and literally broke down in tears and told half 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:11.960 the country, oh, well over half the country, since Donald 0:02:12.000 --> 0:02:16.600 Trump won the popular vote, that everybody is wrong and 0:02:16.680 --> 0:02:20.360 whether you voted for him or not, you all lost 0:02:20.800 --> 0:02:23.120 and you made one of the biggest disastrous decisions of 0:02:23.160 --> 0:02:27.520 your lives. And everybody lost. As he broke down into tears, 0:02:27.960 --> 0:02:31.040 and I just thought, my god, Johnny Carson must be 0:02:31.160 --> 0:02:36.119 rolling over in his grave. The day was ripe for comedy. 0:02:37.000 --> 0:02:42.440 The country needed comedy. The jokes wrote themselves. They were 0:02:42.520 --> 0:02:46.080 so there was such low hanging fruit and America needed 0:02:46.120 --> 0:02:49.919 to finally just be galvanized and laugh. And Jimmy Kimmel 0:02:50.040 --> 0:02:53.919 took his time to cry on National TV. 0:02:54.320 --> 0:03:00.480 When did late night comedy shows become? Like, I think 0:03:00.560 --> 0:03:03.400 what happened. I remember reading that when Colbert moved over, 0:03:03.800 --> 0:03:06.160 that Kimmel's people were thinking he needed to become more 0:03:06.200 --> 0:03:08.639 political because Colbert was going to bring this daily show 0:03:08.680 --> 0:03:12.720 background and really get ratings by leaning into political comedy, 0:03:12.720 --> 0:03:14.359 and so they wanted Kimmel to do more of that. 0:03:15.760 --> 0:03:18.560 It's still a late night comedy show you and I 0:03:18.560 --> 0:03:20.960 think that's where they've lost their ways, by losing their 0:03:21.000 --> 0:03:24.760 brand of Like if you're doing silly celebrity interviews but 0:03:24.800 --> 0:03:28.959 then also using your monologue for a tear filled, scolding 0:03:29.760 --> 0:03:33.280 speech at your audience, this. 0:03:33.720 --> 0:03:40.720 Arrogant, condescending, laughable speech by Kimmel, I want it, I 0:03:40.760 --> 0:03:43.520 feel like honestly, and I like Jimmy. I've known him 0:03:43.520 --> 0:03:47.360 for years. He's lost himself, Like he's so like the 0:03:47.760 --> 0:03:50.760 I just wonder if they're in this echo chamber, if anybody, 0:03:50.800 --> 0:03:54.240 if any like normal person's behind the scenes going Jimmy, 0:03:54.960 --> 0:03:56.520 what are you doing like you got to go out 0:03:56.560 --> 0:03:57.440 and do a show tonight? 0:03:57.800 --> 0:03:59.640 I want to put We said this in the last 0:03:59.640 --> 0:04:01.960 episode and I'll say it again. What we're here to 0:04:02.000 --> 0:04:04.200 do is an the last episode where we talked about 0:04:04.200 --> 0:04:06.520 the election. What we're here to do is analyze the media. 0:04:07.080 --> 0:04:09.200 We are both members of the media. That's what we 0:04:09.240 --> 0:04:13.360 built our careers on. We interviewed celebrities. I won't say 0:04:13.360 --> 0:04:16.840 I am, but you are money a celebrity I'd never feel. 0:04:17.120 --> 0:04:19.880 We also love producing TV and you got it and 0:04:19.920 --> 0:04:22.719 how you produce TV to do what it's supposed to do, 0:04:22.760 --> 0:04:24.080 which is get ratings. 0:04:23.800 --> 0:04:27.120 So exactly, and that's I think the biggest reason why 0:04:27.160 --> 0:04:31.800 we've been so fascinated by this election cycle is you know, 0:04:31.880 --> 0:04:35.480 the media is and TV shows and news are supposed 0:04:35.520 --> 0:04:37.880 to play to audiences, right, You're supposed to get ratings. 0:04:38.839 --> 0:04:42.400 We are not here to and we never endorsed anybody 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:44.240 for president. We're not here to tell anybody who to 0:04:44.320 --> 0:04:47.480 vote for or look or to scold you for her 0:04:47.480 --> 0:04:50.360 you did vote for. We are here to talk about 0:04:50.400 --> 0:04:54.159 the way the media is handling this and that's where 0:04:54.160 --> 0:04:59.039 our interest and analysis lies. And the biggest thing to 0:04:59.120 --> 0:05:02.600 me when I see Kimmel crying or and I know 0:05:02.640 --> 0:05:07.480 you're going to get into Colbert. The popular vote also 0:05:07.600 --> 0:05:11.719 went to Donald Trump. So aren't you thinking about wanting 0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:15.960 more people to watch your show? You're yelling at your audience. 0:05:16.400 --> 0:05:19.080 And it's not just the late night hosts, it's news 0:05:19.760 --> 0:05:22.400 media too, and we'll get into that. So back to 0:05:22.480 --> 0:05:23.680 Kimmel and Colbert. 0:05:23.480 --> 0:05:26.279 And what I find interesting is, and we did this 0:05:26.320 --> 0:05:28.200 on the Battery, you did it on Entertainment tonight. You 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:31.520 would have these kind of you know, post mortems every quarter, 0:05:31.640 --> 0:05:35.120 every time ratings come out. And according to Nielsen, across 0:05:35.160 --> 0:05:39.200 the board, the late night shows are dropping viewers like flies, 0:05:39.720 --> 0:05:41.679 every one of them across the board. I just looked 0:05:42.040 --> 0:05:45.400 two minutes before we recorded this. I looked everybody as 0:05:45.480 --> 0:05:49.200 Nielsen ratings are down over Q one. So while they've 0:05:49.200 --> 0:05:52.520 been covering this election stuff, while they have been unabashedly 0:05:52.720 --> 0:05:56.160 just crushing one side and making this so political and 0:05:56.200 --> 0:06:00.000 not really making jokes, they've lost viewers. So if I'm 0:06:00.080 --> 0:06:02.440 in the rooms is an executive prision yeah, or if 0:06:02.480 --> 0:06:05.240 I'm at Kobert any of these, I'm like, okay, let's 0:06:05.279 --> 0:06:08.200 go out tonight and look, we don't need to praise Trump, 0:06:08.240 --> 0:06:10.760 we don't need to be someone we're not. But let's 0:06:10.760 --> 0:06:15.120 crack some jokes about the vaunted ground game of Kamala Harris. 0:06:15.279 --> 0:06:18.200 Just again, don't be mean. How wrong the polls, how 0:06:18.240 --> 0:06:20.520 wrong the polls were. Everybody thought it was a close call. 0:06:20.560 --> 0:06:23.080 You're right, the comedy was there. The comedy's there, and 0:06:23.120 --> 0:06:25.040 you don't have to be mean to anybody, but you 0:06:25.080 --> 0:06:29.760 can be funny because clearly one side could not have 0:06:30.080 --> 0:06:34.240 missed it worse, like make fun of MSNBC, make fun 0:06:34.279 --> 0:06:35.960 of CNN. Like you don't have to make fun of 0:06:36.000 --> 0:06:38.200 the actual candidate, but you can have so much fun 0:06:38.560 --> 0:06:41.120 with what just happened, and we can all, you know, 0:06:41.200 --> 0:06:44.839 cry together or laugh together or whatever. So that was Kimmel. 0:06:44.920 --> 0:06:48.760 Kimmel came out and instead of doing anything close to that, 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:52.000 he cried, literally cried, and told everyone how they lost. 0:06:52.320 --> 0:06:56.040 Stephen Colbert, who, as you said, did find an audience 0:06:56.080 --> 0:06:58.880 early on because he was so political and he's kind 0:06:58.880 --> 0:07:00.920 of stuck to it. But he came out and instead 0:07:00.960 --> 0:07:04.720 of doing something funny, he said, we still don't know 0:07:04.880 --> 0:07:08.960 the entire parade of clowns, degenerates and in laws that 0:07:09.000 --> 0:07:11.680 Trump will have running this country. But one guy we 0:07:11.840 --> 0:07:15.400 know we'll have a major role is RFK Junior. Now, 0:07:15.480 --> 0:07:18.400 if you're not familiar with him, it's probably because he 0:07:18.520 --> 0:07:20.480 ran for president and nobody cared. 0:07:20.960 --> 0:07:24.480 That's not even true. I mean, that's what's wild he had. 0:07:25.160 --> 0:07:27.520 If nobody cared, then how come it made a difference 0:07:27.560 --> 0:07:30.080 when RFK jumped in and brought his supporters over to Trump. 0:07:30.160 --> 0:07:31.760 Well, how come you're doing a stand up about it? 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:35.640 And by the way, Colbert, in the most typocritical way, 0:07:36.440 --> 0:07:39.840 has had RFK on several times and lauded over him 0:07:39.880 --> 0:07:41.440 and kissed up to him and told him how great 0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:41.880 he was. 0:07:43.320 --> 0:07:43.640 To me. 0:07:44.280 --> 0:07:48.800 When late night comedy, when SNL, when journalism as well, 0:07:48.840 --> 0:07:50.960 I'll throw it in there. When it's solid. Its most 0:07:51.000 --> 0:08:00.000 brilliant is when you are the middle ground, analyzing both sides. 0:08:00.000 --> 0:08:03.280 It's making fun of both sides, critiquing both sides. That's 0:08:03.320 --> 0:08:06.120 when I feel the most connected as a viewer, and 0:08:06.160 --> 0:08:09.880 I have the empathy. Of the problem we have is 0:08:09.920 --> 0:08:16.560 that the more clearly one sided properties like an MSNBC 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:19.720 Era A Fox have upped their ratings in recent years 0:08:19.720 --> 0:08:23.960 because people go to what they connect to. I guess 0:08:24.120 --> 0:08:25.880 it's people like kind of go to where they feel 0:08:25.880 --> 0:08:28.560 like they're hearing. They're hearing themselves, is what the ratings 0:08:28.600 --> 0:08:33.200 might show. But in the end, right one group's going 0:08:33.280 --> 0:08:35.840 to lose. Next time another group might lose. So to me, 0:08:36.080 --> 0:08:40.640 there's a smart business move in maintaining being that neutral 0:08:40.640 --> 0:08:43.720 ground over time. To me, it's the long game, it's 0:08:43.760 --> 0:08:46.839 the big picture. What do you think from a ratings perspective. 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:51.360 We can go further now and talk about the Nielsen ratings. 0:08:51.760 --> 0:08:54.040 As we were talking about, you know the fact that 0:08:54.080 --> 0:08:57.480 the election coverage on election night is the super Bowl, 0:08:57.480 --> 0:09:00.680 It's the biggest night for the press. And we've now 0:09:00.760 --> 0:09:07.000 gotten the Nielsen ratings for some of the media post election, 0:09:07.160 --> 0:09:10.079 so this last week and it's staggering. And now, look, 0:09:10.280 --> 0:09:14.640 I wanted to defend these numbers and the bleed off 0:09:14.640 --> 0:09:18.040 of these numbers because they are devastating. But remember if 0:09:18.080 --> 0:09:20.439 you just played in the super Bowl, that's Election night 0:09:21.000 --> 0:09:23.920 the next day, there is a hangover effect. There's a 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:27.600 fatigue in your audience. They are tired. They're not going 0:09:27.679 --> 0:09:30.720 to tune in in masks like they were. It would 0:09:30.760 --> 0:09:33.520 be like having the culmination in the final rows of 0:09:33.520 --> 0:09:36.600 The Bachelor and the next night doing another show. It's like, 0:09:36.600 --> 0:09:38.800 you've got to give people a break. So I want 0:09:38.800 --> 0:09:40.520 to say there is a little bit of a caveat 0:09:40.559 --> 0:09:43.320 with these numbers, But these numbers are so big that 0:09:43.440 --> 0:09:47.680 it is pretty breathtaking and it's pretty noticeable. Nielsen ratings 0:09:47.760 --> 0:09:52.559 plunge at MSNBC since Trump was elected the forty seventh 0:09:52.600 --> 0:09:56.800 president of the United States. One example, Wednesday to Friday, 0:09:56.880 --> 0:10:01.880 so obviously the election was super Tuesday. Joe his first hour, 0:10:01.960 --> 0:10:05.359 down forty percent, his second hour. This is Joe Scarborough 0:10:05.360 --> 0:10:09.400 and Mika down thirty seven percent, Andrew Mitchell down forty percent, 0:10:10.240 --> 0:10:15.560 Ari Melber down fifty percent, Joy Reid, who's been easily 0:10:15.559 --> 0:10:20.120 the most outspoken propaganda machine for the Democratic Party, down 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:24.720 fifty four point six percent, all in with Chris Hayes 0:10:24.760 --> 0:10:28.240 down forty seven percent, Alex Wagner tonight not sure what 0:10:28.280 --> 0:10:31.200 that is, but down fifty three percent, Lawrence o'donald down 0:10:31.440 --> 0:10:38.040 sixty percent, and Stephanie Rule down sixty seven percent. Even 0:10:38.080 --> 0:10:41.040 with the fatigue, as I try to give them an out, 0:10:41.400 --> 0:10:44.200 holy cow, that is no. 0:10:44.280 --> 0:10:47.560 Those numbers are staggering. And I think I mentioned earlier 0:10:47.600 --> 0:10:52.760 that some I mentioned that maybe CNN had done worse 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:55.800 than MSNBC on election night, and now there's like a 0:10:55.800 --> 0:10:57.520 little bit of back and forth about like the way 0:10:57.559 --> 0:11:02.160 that that was presented. No, no, I'm sorry. Okay, so 0:11:02.240 --> 0:11:07.080 on elections, Okay, let's go to Thursday. MSNBC brought in 0:11:07.320 --> 0:11:10.439 Thursday after election night only five hundred ninety six thousand 0:11:10.559 --> 0:11:14.240 total average daily viewers. CNN had just four hundred and 0:11:14.320 --> 0:11:19.440 nineteen thousand. I mean these numbers in comparison, Fox News 0:11:19.520 --> 0:11:23.560 number one with two point six million viewers. So I 0:11:23.600 --> 0:11:26.120 think that speaks a little bit to what you were 0:11:26.120 --> 0:11:29.520 just saying. Those numbers you just listed, those percentage drops 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:33.319 are staggering if you factor in. Okay, maybe there's fatigue, 0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:36.679 but then why on the Thursday after the election is 0:11:36.840 --> 0:11:41.199 Fox two point six million versus MSNBC five hundred ninety 0:11:41.200 --> 0:11:41.760 six thousand. 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:45.840 Let me just throw at this theory. When the Dallas 0:11:45.880 --> 0:11:49.360 Cowboys lose, and they lose badly like they did this week, 0:11:49.640 --> 0:11:52.480 I won't watch SportsCenter. I don't want to hear Steven A. 0:11:52.559 --> 0:11:55.280 Smith and all the pundits just rip on the Cowboys 0:11:55.280 --> 0:11:58.160 and tell me how bad my team sucks. So that's 0:11:58.240 --> 0:12:00.320 kind of what this is. Are you going to go 0:12:00.400 --> 0:12:02.600 back and just listen to how bad your team sucks 0:12:02.640 --> 0:12:04.959 and how bad you lost for the next week, or 0:12:04.960 --> 0:12:06.839 are you going to take a big break from that? 0:12:06.920 --> 0:12:08.880 And Fox people are like, oh good, I get to 0:12:08.920 --> 0:12:10.040 just hear people that's true. 0:12:10.080 --> 0:12:13.320 We're in the win. Yeah, revel the win on MSNBC, 0:12:13.480 --> 0:12:16.640 Like part of me wonders though, would you tune in 0:12:16.760 --> 0:12:18.760 and like you and I are not MSNBC watchers, We 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:21.240 just flip in and out on ye Election nights are 0:12:21.280 --> 0:12:24.120 a big political, big news moments between all the channels. 0:12:24.120 --> 0:12:31.319 But would you tune in to like feel like you're 0:12:31.320 --> 0:12:34.280 with your people still and to feel like maybe there's 0:12:34.360 --> 0:12:36.880 hope or to feel or to even wonder where did 0:12:36.920 --> 0:12:39.040 we go wrong? I don't know. Give me that sports 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:41.360 analogy back, like would you go and listen to a 0:12:41.400 --> 0:12:45.319 podcast about the Cowboys loss and wonder and people speculating 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:46.480 what do they do wrong and how can they do 0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:47.959 better in the future? Or would you just tune it 0:12:48.000 --> 0:12:48.280 all out? 0:12:48.360 --> 0:12:50.280 I think which to go? And there's a theme throughout 0:12:50.320 --> 0:12:54.000 this podcast the authenticity you're seeking authenticity and when you 0:12:54.000 --> 0:12:56.640 go see and I've I've watched MSNBC this week and 0:12:56.679 --> 0:12:58.959 I've watched CNN. I've watched them all and when you 0:12:59.000 --> 0:13:03.520 see Joy Reid not have any sort of her and 0:13:03.600 --> 0:13:09.200 Rachel Madda'll not have any sort of revelation or open, 0:13:09.360 --> 0:13:12.560 honest look in the mirror of what really went wrong. 0:13:12.600 --> 0:13:16.120 And now instead they're just doubling, tripling, quadrupling down on 0:13:16.160 --> 0:13:18.720 the same message they were giving you before. I think 0:13:18.720 --> 0:13:21.120 there is a fatigue there of like enough is enough. 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:24.200 And clearly, as I look at these numbers, people have 0:13:24.280 --> 0:13:26.320 said enough is enough and they are walking away from 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:29.480 that network in droves, and that those numbers can't just 0:13:29.520 --> 0:13:32.480 be explained by fatigue. That is, that is when you're 0:13:32.559 --> 0:13:34.640 up in the fifties and sixty percent of your audience, 0:13:34.679 --> 0:13:36.120 think about that, what's mass? 0:13:36.559 --> 0:13:40.760 That is scary over half your people? That's wild. I 0:13:41.320 --> 0:13:43.200 do want to look back. I don't have numbers, do 0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:46.920 you on how what they're how that compares to numbers 0:13:47.000 --> 0:13:51.440 like pre the past couple months, if you're comparing MSNBC 0:13:51.720 --> 0:13:54.000 just on an average month versus this had really been 0:13:54.040 --> 0:13:54.800 election season. 0:13:54.960 --> 0:13:57.839 Yeah, well, clearly, clearly, if they're down, you know, fifty 0:13:57.880 --> 0:14:00.000 sixty percent, you can just double those numbers to where 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:02.360 were pre And obviously again the lead up to the 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:04.560 super Bowl, and the super Bowl itself is huge, so 0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:06.640 those numbers are going to drop, but these were just 0:14:06.960 --> 0:14:09.439 so glaring and astronomical I wanted to bring them up. 0:14:09.720 --> 0:14:13.760 The only thing you can definitely be guaranteed in politics 0:14:13.760 --> 0:14:16.079 in the United States of America is the pendulum will swing. 0:14:16.520 --> 0:14:20.320 It always has. I've only been alive fifty three years, 0:14:20.520 --> 0:14:23.560 and i have seen it swing from Jimmy Carter to Reagan, 0:14:24.000 --> 0:14:26.720 back over to Obama and Clinton and back over to 0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:29.440 the Bushes and back over to you know, it will 0:14:29.480 --> 0:14:34.160 always swing and you don't ever need to worry about it. 0:14:34.200 --> 0:14:37.400 That's going to happen. I just I wonder, like, why 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:41.720 isn't anybody in the room saying, hey, let's go out 0:14:41.720 --> 0:14:44.840 and perform Jimmy or Steven, like, go out and be 0:14:44.960 --> 0:14:48.680 funny tonight, let's really let's let's be bigger than this 0:14:49.040 --> 0:14:52.920 and let's crush it. And the fact that they just can't, 0:14:52.960 --> 0:14:54.920 Like I would sit in that room and as an 0:14:54.960 --> 0:14:58.520 executive producer and say, you got to get over yourself. 0:14:59.000 --> 0:15:01.680 What you're telling me, and all you're saying is your feelings. 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:05.640 I feel this, I feel this. I don't mean to 0:15:05.680 --> 0:15:08.720 be cruel. But I don't care how you feel right now, Jimmy. 0:15:08.960 --> 0:15:10.800 What I want you to do is go perform. 0:15:11.080 --> 0:15:12.600 At the end of the day, you're a late night 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:15.200 comedyost instead of being a comedian. You went out there 0:15:15.200 --> 0:15:15.680 and you cried. 0:15:15.960 --> 0:15:17.560 This takes me back to whin. I got in a 0:15:17.600 --> 0:15:21.040 shouting match with an executive on my show. This is 0:15:21.120 --> 0:15:24.560 during the last campaign between Trump and Hillary Clinton, and 0:15:24.600 --> 0:15:27.480 we were doing a live a tape show and I 0:15:27.560 --> 0:15:31.960 got called off the set up and berated, very vocally 0:15:32.240 --> 0:15:34.880 abused in front of everyone in the control room because 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:38.120 I wouldn't make a Trump joke and I wouldn't basically 0:15:38.320 --> 0:15:41.360 support Hillary Clinton. And it wasn't that I didn't support 0:15:41.400 --> 0:15:44.120 Hillary Clinton, and it wasn't that I didn't love hate Trump. 0:15:44.920 --> 0:15:47.280 But I said, that's not who we are, that's not 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:49.600 what we do. The people that are tuning in on 0:15:49.680 --> 0:15:52.680 Monday night to watch the Bachelor Bacherette are not like man. 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:54.720 I hope they really get political tonight, and I hope 0:15:54.720 --> 0:15:59.080 they solve our political problems. They're escaping to us. When 0:15:59.120 --> 0:16:02.320 I watched Saturday Night Live, when I watch Jimmy Kimore Colbert, 0:16:02.760 --> 0:16:04.840 I just wanted to laugh. I want I tuned in 0:16:04.880 --> 0:16:08.040 and be like, oh my god, they're going to crush 0:16:08.080 --> 0:16:11.720 it tonight. Their monologues are going to be amazing. If 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:15.240 you're a comedy writer, this is manna from heaven. And 0:16:15.280 --> 0:16:19.080 they couldn't have failed and missed the mark more and 0:16:19.120 --> 0:16:21.720 it just it makes me sad for them. It makes 0:16:21.760 --> 0:16:25.120 me sad for the viewers they've killed. Late Night. The 0:16:25.200 --> 0:16:27.160 ratings have dropped across the board, you know, the number 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:32.360 one late night show in America. Greg Guttfeldt on Fox 0:16:32.440 --> 0:16:35.680 News By Far, I want to say three at least 0:16:35.800 --> 0:16:38.480 three x the ratings of all the other late night 0:16:38.560 --> 0:16:39.520 shows that considered. 0:16:39.520 --> 0:16:42.320 So I've seen little clips, but I've never fully watched it. 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:44.000 Is it like a comedic at all? 0:16:44.440 --> 0:16:46.800 He does a roundtable thing, he has consistent and gut 0:16:46.800 --> 0:16:49.360 Felt's very you know, whether you think he's funny or not, 0:16:49.400 --> 0:16:52.560 he's comedic. He writes his jokes and they're very you know. 0:16:52.720 --> 0:16:55.520 Like so it's more political, but a little. 0:16:55.360 --> 0:16:56.880 Comm tongue in cheek, lighthearted. 0:16:57.520 --> 0:16:57.720 Yeah. 0:16:57.760 --> 0:17:00.240 And the other one that had did go up, it's 0:17:00.320 --> 0:17:04.240 kind of skewed. Comedy Central's their their show has gone 0:17:04.280 --> 0:17:07.879 up because obviously the Daily Show on Comedy Central the 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:10.600 return of John Stewart was a big part of that. 0:17:11.000 --> 0:17:14.440 So those were skewed early. It's dropped since John Stewart's return, 0:17:14.520 --> 0:17:20.280 but Comedy Central is notably up as well. And the ratings, 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:25.840 and we'll get into this, that kind of momentum carried 0:17:25.880 --> 0:17:29.840 into election night as well. For and we we theorized 0:17:29.880 --> 0:17:32.239 and hypothesized of what we thought the ratings were going 0:17:32.280 --> 0:17:35.080 to be about network News versus cable, and we were right. 0:17:35.560 --> 0:17:38.760 We were right about network Everybody was down. The overall 0:17:38.800 --> 0:17:42.400 election coverage in our viewership was down. But who did 0:17:42.440 --> 0:17:48.280 well cable networks? Who was a disaster? The actual networks 0:17:48.320 --> 0:17:52.120 which is just such a again it's still partless, yes, 0:17:52.160 --> 0:17:54.959 and that's exactly what I'm talking about. It's ABC, NBC, 0:17:55.119 --> 0:17:59.320 CBS was barely on the board. And you know, ABC 0:17:59.560 --> 0:18:02.240 was the best of the worst than NBC, than CBS. 0:18:02.440 --> 0:18:06.800 But who led coverage? Fox, MSNBC, CNN. 0:18:06.760 --> 0:18:09.120 And I think CNN did the worst of those things. 0:18:09.160 --> 0:18:10.840 They were that they yeah, they were the worst of 0:18:10.880 --> 0:18:11.760 all those which. 0:18:11.520 --> 0:18:13.280 Look at Also, that's what it speaks to, is what 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:15.439 I just said. I mean, people do seem to want 0:18:15.480 --> 0:18:20.520 to go to where they're going to feel their opinions 0:18:20.560 --> 0:18:24.200 are matched, and that scares me. I don't think it's 0:18:24.200 --> 0:18:26.199 a good way to live. I've said this before. I 0:18:26.320 --> 0:18:29.480 try on social media to follow people I don't agree with. 0:18:29.920 --> 0:18:32.080 On election night, I flip back and forth between the 0:18:32.160 --> 0:18:35.000 channels because I want to be exposed to other voices 0:18:35.080 --> 0:18:41.000 to keep a good perspective. But you know, also there's 0:18:41.000 --> 0:18:44.879 something to like the importance of a talent that people 0:18:44.880 --> 0:18:47.080 connect with. People like to feel like, oh, I like 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:49.320 and trust Anderson Cooper, or I like and trust and 0:18:49.359 --> 0:18:51.679 watch you know, Brettbear, whoever it is. 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:06.000 And I guess that's what's crazy is when I grew up, 0:19:06.520 --> 0:19:09.160 it's just like I'm going to watch Dan rather I'm 0:19:09.200 --> 0:19:12.920 going to watch Tom Brokaw. The networks owned those faces 0:19:12.920 --> 0:19:16.040 and voices, and now I think, to your point, the 0:19:16.119 --> 0:19:18.960 cable news networks own those characters. 0:19:18.520 --> 0:19:21.199 That back then you went to those personalities because you 0:19:21.280 --> 0:19:25.280 felt you would get trusted news, and that now people 0:19:25.359 --> 0:19:27.200 feel they like the opinion. 0:19:27.640 --> 0:19:30.960 Yeah, yeah, I think that. I think the idea when 0:19:30.960 --> 0:19:36.000 I was younger was this is unbiased news, and now 0:19:36.040 --> 0:19:39.320 that we know that they are biased, I think people 0:19:39.320 --> 0:19:42.800 feel like, well, if I know George Stephanopolis does not 0:19:42.880 --> 0:19:46.480 have a journalistic take at all, Like he journalism's gone. 0:19:46.560 --> 0:19:49.960 So George Stephanopolis is just a mouthpiece for the Democratic Party. 0:19:50.200 --> 0:19:52.120 So if you're going to get a really bad take 0:19:52.160 --> 0:19:55.600 from George and ABC News, I'll just go to CNN 0:19:55.720 --> 0:19:59.399 and or MSNBC and really and really get like Rachel 0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:03.600 matt Hower read that a really propagandist or Tucker Carlson 0:20:03.720 --> 0:20:07.080 or whoever who's really in the propaganda of the right. 0:20:07.320 --> 0:20:09.040 You know, like, if you're going to go that way, 0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:10.320 I might as well just go all the way. 0:20:10.520 --> 0:20:12.960 I think you're right. I think that that's the problem 0:20:13.080 --> 0:20:18.919 is that the networks didn't stay, didn't keep that level 0:20:19.200 --> 0:20:25.159 of trust of being unbiased, of being if they'd maintain that, 0:20:26.200 --> 0:20:27.920 but I think they lost it the last time Trump 0:20:28.119 --> 0:20:31.400 and in twenty sixteen was when it became really evident 0:20:32.040 --> 0:20:35.399 how people felt, and that is I agree, that's the problem. 0:20:35.440 --> 0:20:39.160 Is it's not being clear because it's a lack of authenticity, 0:20:39.200 --> 0:20:41.440 and then it's a lack of trust. Like if you're 0:20:41.480 --> 0:20:44.480 gonna be someone who really stands one way, you have 0:20:44.520 --> 0:20:46.800 to be honest and own that and say I am 0:20:47.040 --> 0:20:50.200 an opinion journalist or whatever the phrase we want to 0:20:50.280 --> 0:20:52.320 use for it is. You can't say no, no, no, 0:20:52.400 --> 0:20:55.600 I'm a journalist when it's so clear that you feel 0:20:55.720 --> 0:20:57.439 one way like you have to own it or not 0:20:58.200 --> 0:21:01.520 one person. That's like and I think it all changed again. 0:21:01.800 --> 0:21:05.720 It leaned even more towards showing that this time because 0:21:05.760 --> 0:21:08.160 I think of the debate and David Muhr. I held 0:21:08.240 --> 0:21:11.840 David muirorup as someone who I thought he stayed pretty 0:21:12.040 --> 0:21:14.680 I did too straightforward. 0:21:13.920 --> 0:21:15.560 And I've heard nothing but good things about him. 0:21:15.720 --> 0:21:18.240 I was like, that man is an old school like 0:21:18.359 --> 0:21:20.960 he just reports the news and keeps it even. And 0:21:21.000 --> 0:21:22.879 then the way that he was in the debate of 0:21:22.960 --> 0:21:27.920 only fact checking Trump and not Harris, I thought wow. 0:21:27.960 --> 0:21:29.600 And then he tried to do we talked about on 0:21:29.600 --> 0:21:31.560 the podcast. He tried to do that apology tour the 0:21:31.560 --> 0:21:34.040 next day. I'm different, like I'm Live with Kelly and 0:21:35.080 --> 0:21:36.800 not really an apology tour, but sort of trying to 0:21:36.880 --> 0:21:38.920 justify the way he was. And I thought, no, you've 0:21:38.960 --> 0:21:40.639 lost me. I've seen big. 0:21:40.600 --> 0:21:44.000 Shadow of Dana Walden who runs ABC News, and that 0:21:44.200 --> 0:21:48.200 lauded over him as well. You know, I go back 0:21:48.240 --> 0:21:50.520 and this will be an interesting kind of if there 0:21:50.600 --> 0:21:52.960 was such a thing as self reflection, and clearly there's not. 0:21:53.200 --> 0:21:54.920 Is that this is the whole point of this podcast. 0:21:55.119 --> 0:21:58.960 There is zero self reflection from the media. And that's 0:21:58.960 --> 0:22:01.240 what I find fascinating. I go back to that Republican 0:22:01.240 --> 0:22:04.359 debate the first time. I remember, like Jeb Bush and 0:22:04.440 --> 0:22:06.000 who was like maybe Ted Cruz, I was trying to 0:22:06.000 --> 0:22:08.080 think he was in that debate when they debated Trump 0:22:08.080 --> 0:22:11.480 for the first time, and they went in for a 0:22:11.520 --> 0:22:16.560 presidential primary debate for the Republicans, and you know, Trump 0:22:16.640 --> 0:22:19.159 came in just like it was like so like like 0:22:19.240 --> 0:22:22.199 a college frat boy showed up and just like disrupted 0:22:22.200 --> 0:22:24.640 this tea party, and it was like nobody knew how 0:22:24.640 --> 0:22:26.920 to handle him. And I found that fascinating. I remember 0:22:26.960 --> 0:22:28.760 they were just like, you know, Jeb Bush, who was 0:22:28.760 --> 0:22:30.560 the heir apparent, I mean, he was a Bush and 0:22:30.960 --> 0:22:33.639 he's going to be our presidential nominee and he just 0:22:33.720 --> 0:22:37.639 fumbled and bumbled and he lost the primary to nobody 0:22:37.720 --> 0:22:40.639 knew how to handle him. Donald Trump was living rent 0:22:40.680 --> 0:22:44.000 free in all their heads. Everyone just was like befuddled 0:22:44.000 --> 0:22:46.000 on how to handle him. And I feel like the 0:22:46.040 --> 0:22:49.240 same thing happened to the media. At first. They treated 0:22:49.320 --> 0:22:51.520 him with kid gloves and a comedian. 0:22:51.640 --> 0:22:53.320 He was the guy from The Apprentice, right right, he's 0:22:53.359 --> 0:22:53.639 one of that. 0:22:53.840 --> 0:22:55.520 He had been on all these shows. He had been 0:22:55.560 --> 0:22:57.639 on the View, he went on Jimmy Fallon, he did 0:22:57.640 --> 0:22:59.840 all this stuff, and when he became a candidate, it 0:22:59.880 --> 0:23:01.720 was like, oh, this is going to be fun. We're 0:23:01.720 --> 0:23:04.879 going to do bits with Donald Trump because he's so comedic. 0:23:04.920 --> 0:23:06.719 He's really good at this stuff. That's why he's been 0:23:06.720 --> 0:23:08.320 on SNL. He's funny. 0:23:08.520 --> 0:23:10.560 Now Trump actually has good comedic timing. He does. 0:23:10.760 --> 0:23:12.840 But the problem is, all of a sudden there was 0:23:12.880 --> 0:23:16.199 a turn of like, oh crap, he's actually going to 0:23:16.240 --> 0:23:19.320 beat Hillary Clinton. We have aid it and embedded in 0:23:19.359 --> 0:23:22.920 all this what do we do? And then from there 0:23:22.960 --> 0:23:25.960 on there was this tipping point, as Malcolm Gladwell would say, 0:23:26.280 --> 0:23:30.199 where he has lived rent free in everybody's head and 0:23:30.240 --> 0:23:33.040 nobody no intellectuals. And there are so many smart people 0:23:33.040 --> 0:23:36.680 on both sides of the aisle, you know, opposed to 0:23:36.680 --> 0:23:39.240 what Jimmy Kimmel says, there's brilliant people on both sides 0:23:39.240 --> 0:23:42.520 of the aisle. Nobody's been able to crack the code 0:23:42.760 --> 0:23:45.120 of how do we handle this guy who's a bully 0:23:45.440 --> 0:23:49.600 he's bombastic. Yes, he tells very tall tales. As Joe 0:23:49.680 --> 0:23:51.840 Rogan says, he bobs and weaves, and he goes on 0:23:51.880 --> 0:23:54.080 these weird tangents about rockets and stuff. 0:23:54.119 --> 0:23:55.359 I think Trump says that about himself. 0:23:55.400 --> 0:23:58.400 Oh yeah. But nobody has cracked the code of how 0:23:58.400 --> 0:24:00.399 do we unpack this and how do we handle it? 0:24:00.600 --> 0:24:04.280 And my point was, don't feel bad because the Republicans 0:24:04.320 --> 0:24:06.639 couldn't figure it out either. They couldn't beat him in 0:24:06.680 --> 0:24:10.280 their own house. The media has just not been able 0:24:10.320 --> 0:24:12.800 to figure out how do we crack the code of 0:24:12.840 --> 0:24:13.760 how do we handle. 0:24:13.720 --> 0:24:17.960 It's the balance of how do we cover him? 0:24:18.080 --> 0:24:20.160 But you know what, and I don't have the answer. 0:24:20.200 --> 0:24:21.760 I'm not brilliant. I don't have the answer, but I 0:24:21.840 --> 0:24:24.760 just know that what's happened has clearly not been the answer. 0:24:24.760 --> 0:24:26.479 Well, what has happened from a lot of media has 0:24:26.520 --> 0:24:30.560 been that they've you know, I mean MSNBC footage of 0:24:30.600 --> 0:24:35.760 his rally up against footage of Hitler's rally from Madison 0:24:35.760 --> 0:24:38.960 Square Garden. I mean, what has happened I think is 0:24:39.560 --> 0:24:42.359 last time it was more playful, and so this time 0:24:43.400 --> 0:24:46.199 they leaned so hard into like, no, he's this villain 0:24:46.720 --> 0:24:50.200 and however you feel whoever you voted for, the popular 0:24:50.280 --> 0:24:53.520 vote has shown that the country does not feel that way. 0:24:53.800 --> 0:24:56.040 And so again when you go back to that discussion 0:24:56.040 --> 0:24:59.920 of like how do you handle it? I believe journalists 0:25:00.040 --> 0:25:03.240 should be the voice for the voice of the people. 0:25:03.280 --> 0:25:05.880 I think they should critique across the board. I think 0:25:05.880 --> 0:25:08.160 if you're going to be a more opinionated journalist and 0:25:08.680 --> 0:25:10.600 be on a cable network that has more of a slant, 0:25:11.359 --> 0:25:14.280 you have to own that. And to me, the biggest 0:25:14.480 --> 0:25:17.960 you know, now we're in this election blame game, right 0:25:18.000 --> 0:25:21.080 and everyone in the in is analyzing and has their 0:25:21.119 --> 0:25:24.240 sources on and who's to blame? And as you pointed out, 0:25:24.240 --> 0:25:26.520 I think the biggest who's to blame meaning for the 0:25:26.560 --> 0:25:29.159 Harris loss. And I think, as you pointed out, the 0:25:29.160 --> 0:25:34.840 biggest thing that's not happening is that both media and 0:25:34.880 --> 0:25:36.359 I would say a lot of people in the Democratic 0:25:36.400 --> 0:25:39.639 Party aren't looking in the mirror. I think overall the 0:25:39.680 --> 0:25:43.800 biggest issue has been a lack of authenticity and a 0:25:43.880 --> 0:25:46.240 lack of connection to your audience. And I would say 0:25:46.280 --> 0:25:49.359 that to both the media and the Democratic Party. And 0:25:49.359 --> 0:25:50.960 I probably have to say that because I think there's 0:25:51.000 --> 0:25:54.359 a lot of overlap. The statistics just show the media 0:25:54.400 --> 0:25:56.439 is overwhelmingly democratic. 0:25:57.320 --> 0:25:59.760 Like well, that's why you know when you say that 0:26:00.320 --> 0:26:03.400 dominated the ratings, and they dominated election night ratings by far. 0:26:03.960 --> 0:26:07.920 There's only one network where where Republicans go. There's only 0:26:08.000 --> 0:26:12.640 there's out of ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, MSNBC, those are 0:26:12.680 --> 0:26:18.639 clearly hugely liberal Democratic staunch supporters, there's only one place. 0:26:18.720 --> 0:26:22.879 So all Republicans basically went to Fox News. So Fox 0:26:22.920 --> 0:26:26.760 gets thirteen million, and you know ABC got five million. 0:26:27.160 --> 0:26:30.280 So if Fox Fox News, a cable network, did over 0:26:30.359 --> 0:26:34.320 two x what Abc News did, a network with massively, 0:26:34.480 --> 0:26:38.160 massively more reach, that's what Fox did and they completely 0:26:38.200 --> 0:26:40.439 dominated the landscape. But again, there's only one place to 0:26:40.480 --> 0:26:43.320 go if you really want to hear your side, and 0:26:43.359 --> 0:26:45.520 you're on the right. So it is a little bit 0:26:45.560 --> 0:26:50.119 of misleading numbers because Democrats are spread across the board. 0:26:51.119 --> 0:26:53.720 And so when you look at the blame game, and 0:26:53.760 --> 0:26:57.320 this is what's interesting, and to expand on your point, 0:26:57.960 --> 0:27:00.400 if they really wanted to beat Donald Trump, if they 0:27:00.400 --> 0:27:03.760 really wanted to and when I say they, if I'm 0:27:03.720 --> 0:27:06.000 met CNN, MSNBC or whatever, and you really want to 0:27:06.000 --> 0:27:09.480 beat Donald Trump with which they do wholeheartedly. They would 0:27:09.480 --> 0:27:12.720 have not given him any oxygen. You just don't cover 0:27:12.800 --> 0:27:15.240 him and don't talk about him. That's how you treat 0:27:15.280 --> 0:27:17.320 a bully, right, If you have a bully and they've 0:27:17.320 --> 0:27:19.240 called him a bully many times, what would you do 0:27:19.320 --> 0:27:25.119 in school? Ignore? Don't give it oxygen. But here in 0:27:25.200 --> 0:27:29.640 lies the hypocritical problem. The best ratings in the world 0:27:29.760 --> 0:27:34.160 for MSNBC, CNN, all of them are with Donald Trump 0:27:34.560 --> 0:27:39.280 in the lead. So if Donald Trump went away, so 0:27:39.400 --> 0:27:42.680 do their ratings. This is really the best thing that's happened. 0:27:42.840 --> 0:27:45.119 They won't say this quiet part out loud, but the 0:27:45.160 --> 0:27:47.800 best thing they could have hoped for is Donald Trump. 0:27:48.280 --> 0:27:53.960 That gives Rachel mattout Joy read Anderson Cooper endless amounts 0:27:54.040 --> 0:27:55.439 like don't believe they're tears. 0:27:55.520 --> 0:27:57.720 Well, ratings when Trump was in the White House were 0:27:57.840 --> 0:28:00.520 way higher dar Biden was. Yet there's a lot of 0:28:00.600 --> 0:28:02.200 a lot of news happening. 0:28:01.920 --> 0:28:04.320 Yeah, and so in this will continue right now, they 0:28:04.359 --> 0:28:06.480 took a hit, But the best thing that happens for 0:28:06.520 --> 0:28:08.440 them is now they have news for the next four years. 0:28:08.440 --> 0:28:10.040 They can tell you what's wrong in the world. And 0:28:10.080 --> 0:28:13.320 that that is immediately you know, was there a Mara 0:28:13.440 --> 0:28:16.439 Kopa was there a about face of guys, this is 0:28:16.440 --> 0:28:21.080 what went wrong with our our plan with getting Biden 0:28:21.119 --> 0:28:23.480 out and getting Kamala in and not having an election. 0:28:23.640 --> 0:28:26.600 There was no primary. Nobody really elected her. Like there 0:28:26.640 --> 0:28:29.880 were so many things that went wrong on the Democratic side. 0:28:29.920 --> 0:28:32.280 There's a laundry list of problems. There wasn't one thing. 0:28:32.359 --> 0:28:35.239 There were a million things that went wrong. Instead of 0:28:35.240 --> 0:28:38.040 that laundry list, I think Bernie Sanders is anyone that's 0:28:38.080 --> 0:28:40.440 really kind of hit back. But there's a laundry list 0:28:40.480 --> 0:28:42.080 of things that went wrong. And instead of like, guys, 0:28:42.080 --> 0:28:44.680 this is what we did wrong, it's the first day 0:28:44.840 --> 0:28:47.680 was Trump Trump, Trump Trump. He still lives rent free 0:28:47.680 --> 0:28:49.800 in their head, but now he's going to help them 0:28:49.800 --> 0:28:52.960 pay the rent for another four years. So it's it's 0:28:53.000 --> 0:28:57.040 it is this kind of interesting. You know, they're really 0:28:57.080 --> 0:29:00.920 opposing feelings of God, do we want him to go away? God? 0:29:01.000 --> 0:29:03.040 We love it when he's in the White House. It's 0:29:03.320 --> 0:29:05.760 a tough it's a tough inner battle. But now they 0:29:05.840 --> 0:29:07.760 have something to talk about because if they had it 0:29:07.800 --> 0:29:10.280 their way, let's say they had the House, the Senate 0:29:10.320 --> 0:29:12.520 and Kamala Harris, what the hell are you going to 0:29:12.560 --> 0:29:16.280 talk about for four years, It's true, it's Trump's fault again. 0:29:17.360 --> 0:29:19.600 I mean, they spent the last four years blaming Trump. 0:29:19.760 --> 0:29:21.800 How could you spend the next four years. How could 0:29:21.800 --> 0:29:23.880 you spend the next four years the better part of 0:29:23.920 --> 0:29:26.800 a decade blaming someone who's not in office. They were 0:29:26.880 --> 0:29:29.440 kind of running out of rope there. So it is 0:29:29.600 --> 0:29:31.400 very interesting. So I'm just saying, be careful when you 0:29:31.400 --> 0:29:34.120 hear the when you see the crocodile tears, because they're 0:29:34.120 --> 0:29:35.480 also laughing their way to the bank. 0:29:35.560 --> 0:29:38.080 Well, you're pointing to the conflict of on the one 0:29:38.120 --> 0:29:41.080 hand that we heard from a lot of media, like 0:29:41.520 --> 0:29:46.959 you know, critiquing Trump and Trump is is evil and so, 0:29:47.280 --> 0:29:50.600 and the promoting of Kamala Harris and that. I mean, look, 0:29:51.120 --> 0:29:55.480 I'll take Time magazine, for example, without an interview from her, 0:29:55.800 --> 0:29:58.640 they put her on the cover with the headline her moment, 0:29:59.440 --> 0:30:04.280 no critique, just an article when Trump. When the assassination 0:30:04.320 --> 0:30:07.520 attempt on Trump happened, I watched Times Instagram they first 0:30:07.840 --> 0:30:10.560 posted their cover and it was the photo of him 0:30:10.640 --> 0:30:13.480 with his fist in the air, and I was like, wow, 0:30:13.520 --> 0:30:15.640 what a poignant cover that. You know, We'll go down 0:30:15.680 --> 0:30:19.400 in history an assassination attempt on a former president. At 0:30:19.440 --> 0:30:22.640 some point they changed the cover. They changed it to 0:30:22.680 --> 0:30:25.040 a different photo where he was lying on the ground, 0:30:25.440 --> 0:30:28.280 and I thought, wow, who made the call and said, hey, 0:30:28.320 --> 0:30:31.160 that photos like makes him look too powerful. You need 0:30:31.200 --> 0:30:32.840 to change it. There's no other way to read that 0:30:32.880 --> 0:30:40.200 to me. And so they're stuck between do we, you know, 0:30:40.440 --> 0:30:45.640 promote and help and support Kamala Harris becoming the president 0:30:45.680 --> 0:30:48.560 because so many of us we are so democratic, that's 0:30:48.640 --> 0:30:52.600 the way we all lean and you know, that's not 0:30:52.640 --> 0:30:54.880 even getting into like who's paying the bills and everything, 0:30:55.360 --> 0:30:58.200 or we also do want Trump in the White House 0:30:58.200 --> 0:31:00.640 because of the ratings and oh also so we have 0:31:00.680 --> 0:31:05.160 to kind of appear like we're like, we're not so 0:31:05.240 --> 0:31:09.600 biased and we're critiquing both sides. And what all that 0:31:09.800 --> 0:31:12.560 boils down to to me is what I just said 0:31:12.560 --> 0:31:17.440 a few minutes ago. A lack of authenticity. That's where 0:31:18.200 --> 0:31:21.640 they've lost their way own what you are as a brand, 0:31:21.800 --> 0:31:23.280 be who you are as a brand. It's just what 0:31:23.320 --> 0:31:25.040 you were talking about with The Bachelor, where you're like, 0:31:25.080 --> 0:31:27.720 this isn't what we are as a brand. When you're 0:31:27.760 --> 0:31:31.880 trying to appease too many parties. When you're trying to 0:31:31.960 --> 0:31:34.240 check too many boxes, when you're listening to everybody on 0:31:34.280 --> 0:31:37.479 Twitter and you have your advertisers, and you have your 0:31:37.480 --> 0:31:39.640 own personal feelings and you've got to appear like your 0:31:40.720 --> 0:31:45.360 that's when it's going you're losing because you're trying to 0:31:45.400 --> 0:31:46.440 do too much at once. 0:31:46.600 --> 0:31:48.560 Well, the old saying is if you try to please everybody, 0:31:48.840 --> 0:31:49.680 you please nobody. 0:31:49.760 --> 0:31:51.880 Right, if you stand for everything, you stand for nothing. 0:32:03.880 --> 0:32:06.160 I think when you look at what people will probably 0:32:06.160 --> 0:32:10.400 call this the podcast election, the rise of the podcast Election, 0:32:11.560 --> 0:32:15.880 Joe Rogan was simple and clear. He had Trump in 0:32:16.360 --> 0:32:19.400 for three hours in his studio, that's his brand. Did 0:32:19.440 --> 0:32:22.320 he grill Trump as much as and Anden? Did he 0:32:22.400 --> 0:32:24.840 push him as much as you know, maybe a classic 0:32:24.920 --> 0:32:28.040 journalist would have no, but that wasn't his brand. And 0:32:28.080 --> 0:32:30.160 he said he would have done the same thing for Harris. 0:32:30.520 --> 0:32:32.000 She didn't end up wanting to do it, and he 0:32:32.000 --> 0:32:34.720 has later come out and revealed well, also part of 0:32:34.720 --> 0:32:36.240 that was she didn't want to come to his studio 0:32:36.720 --> 0:32:39.120 and she only wanted to get forty five minutes, and 0:32:39.880 --> 0:32:42.200 her team wanted some editing power, and he said no 0:32:42.280 --> 0:32:45.280 to all those things. He stuck to his brand. Instead 0:32:45.280 --> 0:32:47.280 of getting what could have been, Oh, Harris could be 0:32:47.320 --> 0:32:50.239 a big get, he stuck to his brand and I 0:32:50.280 --> 0:32:52.760 think that that is that has meant something. 0:32:53.000 --> 0:32:55.920 The comedian Theovonn who also Trump, went on his podcast 0:32:55.960 --> 0:32:58.480 said the exact same thing that the Harris campaign asked 0:32:58.480 --> 0:33:01.400 about editing rights, and they both said the same thing. No, 0:33:01.440 --> 0:33:03.800 we we don't do that. We tape. This is like 0:33:04.000 --> 0:33:06.960 what podcasts are is kind of that live radio feel. 0:33:07.000 --> 0:33:09.120 It is AM radio. You're just you are coming on. 0:33:09.720 --> 0:33:17.680 And this isn't a clean, edited, polished propaganda advertisement. And 0:33:17.960 --> 0:33:21.040 so you know, to your point when people said, well, well, 0:33:21.080 --> 0:33:24.960 two things that I find very funny. One, immediately people 0:33:25.000 --> 0:33:28.080 came out and Democrats and liberals said we need our 0:33:28.240 --> 0:33:31.680 version of Joe Rogan. Guys, I hate to break this 0:33:31.760 --> 0:33:35.560 to you, Democrats, you had him. He was a liberal, 0:33:35.640 --> 0:33:37.240 he's a Democrat. 0:33:38.720 --> 0:33:41.640 A Democratic, and he was a Bernie Sanders fan. 0:33:41.800 --> 0:33:44.240 There Democrats pushed him away and pushed him out of 0:33:44.240 --> 0:33:46.920 the party. It's so funny. I was just like, man, 0:33:47.080 --> 0:33:49.680 could you be more blind to what's going on? He 0:33:49.920 --> 0:33:53.600 was a die hard Democrat. He has ripped both sides, 0:33:53.640 --> 0:33:56.240 but he definitely leaned on that liberal side. But the 0:33:56.280 --> 0:33:58.520 other thing is people said, well, you know, she did 0:33:58.560 --> 0:34:02.080 go on Call Her Daddy Alex Cooper, and this is 0:34:02.200 --> 0:34:04.440 nothing against Alex Cooper or Call Her Daddy. It's a 0:34:04.520 --> 0:34:11.680 hugely successful, huge money revenue making podcast. But that was 0:34:11.719 --> 0:34:14.320 not I think people give too much credit to Joe Rogan, 0:34:14.320 --> 0:34:16.360 and I really I'm a fan of Joe Rogan. But 0:34:16.440 --> 0:34:18.279 it didn't have to be Joe Rogan. It could have 0:34:18.280 --> 0:34:22.480 been anybody because the huge difference was podcast A we'll 0:34:22.480 --> 0:34:26.280 call it Joe Rogan was open, you could say anything. 0:34:26.360 --> 0:34:30.479 It was unedited. They talked about crazy stuff, they talked 0:34:30.480 --> 0:34:33.680 about serious stuff. To Call Her Daddy was clearly a 0:34:33.800 --> 0:34:38.879 scripted moment. It was Kamala Harris going in giving her 0:34:38.920 --> 0:34:42.239 talking points. There was no follow up, there was no creativity. 0:34:42.360 --> 0:34:44.160 That's what I'm talking about, is the inauthentic thing. 0:34:44.239 --> 0:34:46.279 Yeah, and so that's what that goes to my point 0:34:46.280 --> 0:34:50.840 of like it just you're comparing apples and oranges. Those 0:34:50.880 --> 0:34:54.280 podcasts weren't the same because she didn't go do a podcast. 0:34:54.400 --> 0:34:57.760 She went and taped a commercial with Alex Cooper. 0:34:57.920 --> 0:35:00.000 Well, let's think about it, like this, Call Her Daddy 0:35:00.640 --> 0:35:04.440 is known. How it started was a very sex focused podcast. 0:35:05.200 --> 0:35:08.200 She's expanded from that, but there's still every time she 0:35:08.280 --> 0:35:11.040 has like a Katy Perry or Gwyneth Paltrow on, there's 0:35:11.040 --> 0:35:13.560 a couple sex questions out there. From what I saw, 0:35:13.560 --> 0:35:15.680 I don't think they got into sex at all. So 0:35:15.840 --> 0:35:18.200 and look, by the way, I'm not saying you should 0:35:18.239 --> 0:35:21.480 you're a presidential candidate, but what is Call Her Daddy? 0:35:21.560 --> 0:35:25.120 I think that's why in part that, I mean, you 0:35:25.120 --> 0:35:26.920 could argue it was whether people wanted to hear from 0:35:26.960 --> 0:35:28.560 Kamala Harris or not. But I think at least in 0:35:28.600 --> 0:35:32.160 part why it wasn't as Gangbuster's numbers, as even a 0:35:32.200 --> 0:35:35.200 typical Call Her Daddy episode, it wasn't what Call Her 0:35:35.239 --> 0:35:38.480 Daddy was. It wasn't even the same set. It's now 0:35:38.520 --> 0:35:43.680 come out from Harris's FEC filings that they paid one 0:35:43.800 --> 0:35:47.840 hundred thousand dollars to build a fake Call Her Daddy 0:35:47.960 --> 0:35:50.160 set for her to do that interview in a hotel 0:35:50.239 --> 0:35:52.920 room somewhere. I think because she said she couldn't leave Washington. 0:35:54.000 --> 0:35:56.000 And also I've worked on a lot of sets in 0:35:56.040 --> 0:35:59.640 different newsrooms, from startups to bigger. That was not on 0:35:59.640 --> 0:36:01.160 a hundred one thousand dollars. I don't know where that 0:36:01.200 --> 0:36:03.640 money went, but two chairs and a table and like 0:36:04.360 --> 0:36:06.680 a little signage and some picture frames. That was not 0:36:06.719 --> 0:36:08.919 one hundred grand, That was a couple thousand dollars max. 0:36:09.000 --> 0:36:11.400 So whoever you pay to do that, that money was 0:36:11.400 --> 0:36:15.520 not you were ripped off. Well, but it wasn't authentic. 0:36:15.680 --> 0:36:19.200 Yeah, and you're right, the authenticity of everything. And now 0:36:19.239 --> 0:36:22.360 that things are coming out, and you know, Kamala Harris 0:36:22.520 --> 0:36:24.279 one thing you have to give credit for. She came 0:36:24.320 --> 0:36:29.800 in late and she raised a billion dollars. A billion dollars. 0:36:30.400 --> 0:36:33.080 That is staggering, staggering, staggering. 0:36:33.400 --> 0:36:37.759 No matter how you feel politically, it sickens me on 0:36:37.800 --> 0:36:40.000 some level how much our country spells on elections. The 0:36:40.040 --> 0:36:42.760 problem is, I guess you have to. But god, it's. 0:36:42.600 --> 0:36:45.560 Now come out that she spent more than a billion 0:36:45.600 --> 0:36:49.200 dollars in that they are either somewhere between eighteen to 0:36:49.239 --> 0:36:52.799 twenty million dollars in debt, so they spent over a 0:36:52.920 --> 0:36:56.120 billion dollars. They couldn't even balance their own budget, which 0:36:56.160 --> 0:36:59.280 is kind of laughable, but they spent over a billion dollars. 0:36:59.840 --> 0:37:02.960 And then the story came out one of the big 0:37:03.000 --> 0:37:06.239 celebrity endorsers. And you know there's another thing where we 0:37:06.320 --> 0:37:08.880 talked about the day after in the last podcast we 0:37:08.880 --> 0:37:10.960 did about celebrity endorsements. 0:37:11.000 --> 0:37:12.680 There were whether they're worth anything? 0:37:13.000 --> 0:37:16.200 Yeah, And I think you and I both agree they 0:37:16.400 --> 0:37:18.560 they didn't. They don't move the needle to the good. 0:37:19.000 --> 0:37:20.880 But I do not think they moved the needle to 0:37:20.920 --> 0:37:24.000 the bad. Like were the Avengers and that video cringe worthy? 0:37:24.120 --> 0:37:27.640 And were they ineffective? Yes? Are they laughable sometimes? Yeah? 0:37:27.840 --> 0:37:29.680 But I don't think they I don't think anybody in 0:37:29.680 --> 0:37:31.680 a sase you're deterred, right, I don't think anybody in 0:37:31.680 --> 0:37:34.600 Pennsylvania's like Scarlet Johannes. 0:37:34.719 --> 0:37:37.040 For I'm not going to agree. I don't think that happened. 0:37:37.040 --> 0:37:39.160 I don't think it matters. I don't think Taylor Swift 0:37:39.320 --> 0:37:42.719 hurt anybody by saying she loved Kamala and if it 0:37:42.719 --> 0:37:44.640 made her feel better, great, So I don't think they 0:37:44.640 --> 0:37:46.359 matter one way or the other. But one thing I 0:37:46.400 --> 0:37:52.000 will say I find very disheartening is now that all 0:37:52.040 --> 0:37:54.399 the filings and all the truth has to come out 0:37:54.520 --> 0:37:58.359 as far as financials, Kamala raised a billion dollars. That's great. 0:37:59.120 --> 0:38:02.520 Now it comes out that Oprah Winfrey. Her, you know, 0:38:02.680 --> 0:38:06.360 arguably the biggest interview in the world that you can get, 0:38:06.800 --> 0:38:11.880 was paid a million dollars. Oprah took a million dollar 0:38:11.960 --> 0:38:16.160 paycheck to interview Kamala in what seemed like a very 0:38:16.200 --> 0:38:20.319 friendly town hall. This is my girl. I got my 0:38:20.440 --> 0:38:23.759 arm around her. I'm endorsing her. This is just me 0:38:23.960 --> 0:38:27.200 being me Oprah, you know, the most genuine face that 0:38:27.280 --> 0:38:32.799 we all trusted. Does it tarnish that feeling of love 0:38:32.840 --> 0:38:36.160 and unity when you realize Oprah took a million dollars 0:38:36.200 --> 0:38:39.600 to do that in ah centic? 0:38:39.840 --> 0:38:44.200 Yeah, that, again, I think is where people are now. 0:38:44.600 --> 0:38:48.239 Media are blaming this group or that group, and that 0:38:48.440 --> 0:38:51.040 just disgusts me. To do that too, is like to 0:38:51.080 --> 0:38:53.839 place the blame back on different groups of people who 0:38:53.920 --> 0:38:58.279 allegedly didn't show up. It's not to turn around and 0:38:58.320 --> 0:39:03.200 blame the average person. These are our elected officials or 0:39:03.200 --> 0:39:07.720 hopeful elected officials. Do your job to win the people over. 0:39:06.680 --> 0:39:10.600 I I really can't handle the media blaming. And again, 0:39:10.640 --> 0:39:14.000 it's bad business blaming their own audiences for whether someone 0:39:14.040 --> 0:39:16.200 won an election. That's a quick way to get people 0:39:16.200 --> 0:39:16.959 to turn off the TV. 0:39:17.920 --> 0:39:19.920 You're all you're all stupid, We're smart. 0:39:19.760 --> 0:39:23.560 Honestly so on the celebrity endorsement thing and the oprun 0:39:23.600 --> 0:39:28.239 the one million and authentic, right. I think now we 0:39:28.400 --> 0:39:30.880 spent at the last podcast we asked, is the celebrity 0:39:30.920 --> 0:39:33.440 endorsement dead? I think it might now be buried with 0:39:33.520 --> 0:39:34.640 some of these numbers. 0:39:35.040 --> 0:39:36.759 Well, I can't wait to see more will come out, 0:39:36.800 --> 0:39:38.400 like did what did you know there was one hundred 0:39:38.400 --> 0:39:40.839 thousand dollars spent on the call her daddy? Did Alex 0:39:40.920 --> 0:39:43.920 Cooper get a paycheck? Did Beyonce get a paycheck to 0:39:43.960 --> 0:39:46.200 show up? You know? Did all these people? 0:39:46.320 --> 0:39:49.839 Has come out that the concerts were paid for? They 0:39:49.880 --> 0:39:56.760 had different people perform, like Katy Perry, Megan thee Stallion. 0:39:57.719 --> 0:39:59.799 So I think it's come out the concerts were paid 0:39:59.840 --> 0:40:04.400 for and I won. I was like, I kind of 0:40:04.400 --> 0:40:07.120 thought that's something that I don't know the law on it. 0:40:07.960 --> 0:40:09.839 I guess I'm naive. I would have thought that would 0:40:09.880 --> 0:40:12.319 have been something that you would have had to disclose 0:40:12.680 --> 0:40:14.879 if Oprah was paid to do that interview, But I'm wrong. 0:40:14.920 --> 0:40:16.680 I guess I guess you didn't have to and all 0:40:16.719 --> 0:40:17.640 from the beginning. 0:40:17.360 --> 0:40:21.680 I'll be very interested to find out. On the flip side, 0:40:21.960 --> 0:40:25.759 you know, did did the Trump administration or campaign did 0:40:25.800 --> 0:40:28.880 they pay people to do certain things? I did a 0:40:29.040 --> 0:40:33.080 little research and a friend of mine Sage Steele, and 0:40:33.360 --> 0:40:36.840 she won't mind me telling this. I asked her because 0:40:37.280 --> 0:40:40.000 she had been hosting town hall meetings and doing basically 0:40:40.000 --> 0:40:42.279 what Oprah was doing, but for doing it in the 0:40:42.320 --> 0:40:45.840 Trump campaign, for Jade Vance, for Tolsey Gabbard, Danica Patrick, 0:40:45.880 --> 0:40:48.400 all these people. And I asked, you know, are you 0:40:48.480 --> 0:40:52.759 getting paid to do this? And she said, no, absolutely not. 0:40:52.960 --> 0:40:55.440 And she's like, as far as I know, nobody is. 0:40:55.480 --> 0:40:56.880 And I said, are you sure. She's like, as far 0:40:56.920 --> 0:40:59.160 as I know. And that's so it's only one that 0:40:59.840 --> 0:41:02.200 is not scientific. And as a journalist I need at 0:41:02.320 --> 0:41:04.800 least two more sources. But at least that source material 0:41:04.840 --> 0:41:07.600 told me we're here on our own volition because we 0:41:07.680 --> 0:41:10.480 believe in this. And again it goes back to your 0:41:10.520 --> 0:41:14.000 word authentic. These people, whether you like them or not, 0:41:14.680 --> 0:41:16.960 are authentic in their belief and why they're there. And 0:41:17.000 --> 0:41:18.600 that comes across. 0:41:18.440 --> 0:41:20.600 And you know the let me let me make the 0:41:20.640 --> 0:41:24.160 smallest comparison here, huh. If you do an ad on Instagram, right, 0:41:24.440 --> 0:41:28.320 you have to do hashtag ad hashtag sponsored for this product. 0:41:28.360 --> 0:41:29.320 Yeah, good point. 0:41:29.560 --> 0:41:33.920 Why if Oprah is getting paid to do a town 0:41:34.000 --> 0:41:36.840 hall with Kamala Harris, does that not have to be 0:41:36.960 --> 0:41:40.200 disclosed right from the beginning when this is for a 0:41:40.280 --> 0:41:44.600 presidential election for the American people. That kind of blows 0:41:44.640 --> 0:41:48.200 my mind. And I'm not saying that Oprah's job isn't 0:41:48.200 --> 0:41:52.640 worth being paid for. Well, yeah, obviously she's the you know, 0:41:53.120 --> 0:41:58.319 interviewer of our time, right, but it certainly was portrayed 0:41:58.520 --> 0:42:02.520 as if she was just in support of Kamala Harris 0:42:02.600 --> 0:42:07.440 and this is just what she believed in. And if 0:42:07.480 --> 0:42:09.560 I were in that position, if I was going to 0:42:09.600 --> 0:42:11.759 be at the position of I don't know, I would 0:42:11.800 --> 0:42:13.239 have just made it clear from the start, Like I 0:42:13.239 --> 0:42:15.880 would have come out and said, hey, everybody, you know, 0:42:15.920 --> 0:42:18.880 I'm here doing my job tonight. And if she was 0:42:18.920 --> 0:42:20.680 getting paid for it, well then maybe I would have 0:42:20.880 --> 0:42:25.760 taken my job very seriously and asked some really probing questions. 0:42:25.760 --> 0:42:27.359 Well, it's funny you just took kind of my thought 0:42:27.680 --> 0:42:31.080 is like, I really respect Oprah. She's brilliant. Again, whether 0:42:31.120 --> 0:42:32.920 you're a fan of her or not, you cannot deny 0:42:33.200 --> 0:42:35.960 her success. Her success and what she's accomplished she's amazing, 0:42:37.360 --> 0:42:41.400 and I agree with how smart she is, and I 0:42:41.440 --> 0:42:43.840 know she has brilliant people around her. I can't fathom 0:42:44.160 --> 0:42:46.880 that Oprah didn't know this would get out, because you 0:42:46.920 --> 0:42:49.640 have to file this stuff. This all comes out, so 0:42:49.719 --> 0:42:51.759 you know what's going to come out, and it did 0:42:51.800 --> 0:42:55.080 come out. TMZ caught up with Oprah and got a 0:42:55.120 --> 0:42:57.279 comment on this. She looked like she was on her 0:42:57.320 --> 0:42:59.759 morning walk there in Montecito before she was getting in 0:42:59.800 --> 0:43:03.200 her range Rover, and they asked her about taking a 0:43:03.200 --> 0:43:08.440 payment from Harris and receiving this million dollar payout. She 0:43:08.560 --> 0:43:16.520 denied it. She said, absolutely not true. Didn't happen, now, Oprah. 0:43:16.640 --> 0:43:19.960 This is where it gets interesting. Technically, did Kamala Harris 0:43:20.040 --> 0:43:23.680 pay Oprah a million dollars? Well, maybe not, but this 0:43:24.120 --> 0:43:29.839 has definitely happened. Two payments to Winfrey's production company, Harpo Productions, 0:43:30.440 --> 0:43:34.560 can be found under the Harris campaign's disbursements on the 0:43:34.600 --> 0:43:38.840 Federal Election Committee website. This is fact, it did happen. 0:43:39.320 --> 0:43:43.920 The payments of five hundred thousand dollars each were made 0:43:43.920 --> 0:43:49.799 on October fifteenth and are marked as event production. So 0:43:50.120 --> 0:43:50.960 very slippery. 0:43:51.040 --> 0:43:54.359 And here's what my speculation is there. Yes, I think 0:43:54.400 --> 0:44:00.600 Oprah said no, absolutely, not in a again i'mating, but 0:44:00.640 --> 0:44:02.799 I think she's saying that answer and like a get 0:44:02.880 --> 0:44:05.799 kind of around the around the semantics kind of way, 0:44:06.239 --> 0:44:08.800 because you could say, oh, well, that was a production 0:44:08.960 --> 0:44:12.040 fee or like that was like for the setup or whatever. 0:44:12.440 --> 0:44:15.279 But I looked at that town hall, I don't know 0:44:15.320 --> 0:44:17.960 what a million dollars. I mean it was a studio 0:44:18.080 --> 0:44:20.680 with audience members, and I mean, at the end of 0:44:20.719 --> 0:44:25.359 the day, I think that we have to acknowledge. I've 0:44:25.360 --> 0:44:27.960 heard us say this other members of the media podcast 0:44:28.040 --> 0:44:31.840 I listened to. I feel naive, but I was shocked 0:44:32.160 --> 0:44:36.280 to find out that Oprah would even take an event 0:44:36.360 --> 0:44:38.239 fee or whatever you want to call that. I was 0:44:38.280 --> 0:44:42.400 shocked to find out that these people playing concerts for 0:44:42.480 --> 0:44:46.520 the Harris campaign were paid millions of dollars. To Megan 0:44:46.560 --> 0:44:50.040 the Stallion, to Katie Perry. I thought they were doing 0:44:50.080 --> 0:44:53.120 it like for the campaign. I really thought it was 0:44:53.160 --> 0:44:55.920 a oh, we endorse you and we support you kind 0:44:55.920 --> 0:44:56.239 of a thing. 0:44:57.160 --> 0:45:00.560 This report also came out. It has hit several different sites. 0:45:01.000 --> 0:45:03.759 I tried to do a deep dive on this. I've 0:45:03.760 --> 0:45:06.239 looked at several other sources. I can't source it enough 0:45:06.280 --> 0:45:09.080 to call it fact, and you know, I do take 0:45:09.080 --> 0:45:13.080 our journalism serious. But the alleged reports are that Kamala 0:45:13.160 --> 0:45:16.719 Harris gave Beyonce a ten million dollars to speak. She 0:45:16.800 --> 0:45:20.000 didn't sing ten million dollars to speak, and for her endorsement, 0:45:20.360 --> 0:45:23.160 five million went to Megan thee Stallion for the Torking incident, 0:45:23.480 --> 0:45:26.000 three million to Lizzo, one point eight million to eminem 0:45:26.080 --> 0:45:29.240 and a million to Oprah. We can absolutely and equivocally 0:45:29.360 --> 0:45:32.360 verify two five hundred thousand dollars payments did go to 0:45:32.360 --> 0:45:35.279 Harpo production, so that did happen. The rest, I have 0:45:35.320 --> 0:45:40.200 to say alleged, but these are all very specific that 0:45:40.320 --> 0:45:43.240 somebody if it was just made up. It's very specific. 0:45:43.320 --> 0:45:46.760 So it is something that we all have to grapple 0:45:46.800 --> 0:45:49.520 with when you thought that something was so sincere and 0:45:49.600 --> 0:45:51.960 so honest and we were just behind this candidate, and 0:45:51.960 --> 0:45:55.759 then you find millions of dollars and look, over a 0:45:55.800 --> 0:45:59.319 billion dollars went somewhere. We know that she raised over 0:45:59.360 --> 0:46:01.760 a billion dollars and now she's eighteen to twenty million 0:46:01.800 --> 0:46:05.640 dollars in debt, So it just it's such a bad look. 0:46:05.719 --> 0:46:10.160 It's definitely the nail in the coffin on the celebrity endorsement, 0:46:10.239 --> 0:46:14.720 because I think people found celebrity endorsements annoying enough when 0:46:15.520 --> 0:46:18.960 they're watching this multimillionaire tell them how to vote to 0:46:19.120 --> 0:46:23.719 then find out that the multimillionaire was paid to do that, 0:46:24.239 --> 0:46:27.840 to make those appearances and paid with campaign money that 0:46:28.360 --> 0:46:36.279 potentially the average person donated is striking. I think that 0:46:36.360 --> 0:46:38.200 says all we're going to say about whether a celebrity 0:46:38.239 --> 0:46:44.360 endorsement is valuable. And I think people are also finding 0:46:44.360 --> 0:46:49.680 an insincere because you heard celebrities really sounding the alarm 0:46:49.880 --> 0:46:53.480 on what a Trump presidency would mean, making it seem 0:46:54.400 --> 0:46:57.880 like the world's going to collapse if Trump becomes president. 0:46:58.960 --> 0:47:02.120 But you were I'm so worried about the future of 0:47:02.160 --> 0:47:04.800 our country that you were okay with taking a payment 0:47:04.880 --> 0:47:08.719 for it. That doesn't look good. I mean, you and 0:47:08.760 --> 0:47:13.759 I have done many many charity events. I have you. Ever, 0:47:13.960 --> 0:47:15.400 we've never taken money for charity. 0:47:15.440 --> 0:47:17.520 No, I have taken in full disclosure, I've taken money 0:47:17.520 --> 0:47:19.680 for corporate events, for sure, when I'm paid by a 0:47:19.719 --> 0:47:22.319 company to come in and host something that is specifically 0:47:22.360 --> 0:47:26.160 for a company, but never for coming in and for 0:47:26.200 --> 0:47:26.720 a charity. 0:47:26.719 --> 0:47:29.440 Absolutely not, And I sort of thought it was like 0:47:30.120 --> 0:47:34.799 some people take I could never but I kind of assumed, well, 0:47:35.000 --> 0:47:37.520 if this is like a cause, you believe it, it's 0:47:37.560 --> 0:47:38.840 along those same lines. 0:47:39.440 --> 0:47:41.839 Well, just the numbers are so staggering. When you are, 0:47:42.600 --> 0:47:46.719 you know, the party of the working man and the 0:47:46.760 --> 0:47:49.640 inflation and all this, and when there are tens of 0:47:49.640 --> 0:47:53.799 millions of dollars going to celebrities, it's just such a 0:47:53.840 --> 0:47:56.880 gross look. It's a really really bad look. And I 0:47:56.920 --> 0:47:59.360 don't know if the media, that's the tough part, is 0:47:59.640 --> 0:48:02.040 so much the media is slanted. Will they dive in 0:48:02.080 --> 0:48:05.000 and try and unearth this, I know some will. Will 0:48:05.000 --> 0:48:08.880 it get any footing, I don't know, but it's definitely 0:48:08.960 --> 0:48:11.640 as this unravels, and that's what this whole podcast is about. 0:48:11.640 --> 0:48:14.200 As things unravel, that is one of the things that 0:48:14.239 --> 0:48:16.840 is quickly unraveling is these endorsements and the payola that 0:48:16.880 --> 0:48:17.600 went along with it. 0:48:17.880 --> 0:48:20.799 Well, and you know, you have to like bring in 0:48:22.080 --> 0:48:26.440 I mean, interestingly, Trump being a candidate being president for 0:48:26.480 --> 0:48:30.160 the past eight years or whatever it's been has been 0:48:30.160 --> 0:48:34.480 really interesting from the Hollywood perspective because he was a 0:48:34.600 --> 0:48:36.000 member of Hollywood, you know, I. 0:48:35.920 --> 0:48:38.239 Mean He's a Hollywood darling on. 0:48:38.320 --> 0:48:42.960 The Apprentice, in movies like Home Alone two on Saturday 0:48:43.040 --> 0:48:47.520 Night Live for years, very friendly with people like Oprah 0:48:47.560 --> 0:48:50.000 on Oprah's Shosh. There's past clips of her asking him, well, 0:48:50.000 --> 0:48:52.480 would you ever run for president? One day? On the 0:48:52.600 --> 0:48:55.720 view in the past, like he was in that world. 0:48:56.280 --> 0:48:58.399 And what's really interesting to me now when you think 0:48:58.440 --> 0:49:04.160 about like the celebrity endoor factor is Trump? Like when 0:49:04.239 --> 0:49:06.279 I look at the way Trump is a lot of 0:49:06.280 --> 0:49:12.880 the time, my my sense goes off of like he's 0:49:13.520 --> 0:49:18.200 coming at politics from the perspective of an entertainer. Like 0:49:18.280 --> 0:49:20.280 when he's saying a lot of the things he says, 0:49:20.400 --> 0:49:23.880 I'm like, oh, that's because he's used to like creating 0:49:23.920 --> 0:49:26.280 teases for The Apprentice years ago. You know. He speaks 0:49:26.320 --> 0:49:30.560 in these big ways and makes these wild statements that 0:49:30.719 --> 0:49:34.319 get attention. And I'm hearing a lot of media analyze 0:49:34.400 --> 0:49:37.680 now just like how like I think what ended up 0:49:37.680 --> 0:49:41.000 happening actually is the Democratic campaign tried to bring in 0:49:41.239 --> 0:49:45.600 other celebrities, but it's like Trump is a celebrity on 0:49:45.640 --> 0:49:49.720 his own. So it's just interesting the back and forth 0:49:49.760 --> 0:49:52.160 of like trying to combat those two things in the 0:49:52.200 --> 0:49:55.000 earned media that you get out of big moments like 0:49:55.040 --> 0:49:57.440 Beyonce speaking was supposed to be this really big moment, 0:49:57.680 --> 0:50:00.000 but it backfired because I think people thought she would 0:50:00.120 --> 0:50:01.600 going to sing and there were headlines about how she 0:50:01.640 --> 0:50:03.840 was going to sing, and then you kind of have 0:50:03.920 --> 0:50:07.720 Trump just creating these moments for a much cheaper price. 0:50:07.760 --> 0:50:12.600 So it's interesting combating celebrity endorsements with a celebrity candidate. 0:50:12.800 --> 0:50:15.600 Here's the funniest irony of it all. Maybe the most 0:50:15.800 --> 0:50:20.279 authentic celebrity is the one that's being blamed for this, 0:50:20.320 --> 0:50:23.400 and the one that's being ripped on George Clooney. The 0:50:23.480 --> 0:50:27.480 Daily Beast wrote an article blaming George Clooney, or is 0:50:27.520 --> 0:50:30.640 George Clooney to blame? Because back in July, there was 0:50:30.680 --> 0:50:33.000 this huge fundraiser in New York and they were raising 0:50:33.239 --> 0:50:36.520 tens of millions of dollars and George Clooney was on stage, 0:50:36.560 --> 0:50:39.799 had his arm around Biden, was touting Joe Biden, how 0:50:39.800 --> 0:50:42.360 great he is, how great he is. Well in July, 0:50:43.440 --> 0:50:47.000 after that event, George Clooney noticed something. He noticed something 0:50:47.000 --> 0:50:48.760 that we had all noticed for the last two years. 0:50:49.280 --> 0:50:53.040 Joe Biden's in serious mental and physical decline. He's not 0:50:53.160 --> 0:50:55.600 up to the job, according to George Clooney, and he 0:50:55.640 --> 0:50:57.799 wrote an op ed in The New York Times of 0:50:58.560 --> 0:51:01.920 I love you Joe, but it's time to step down. 0:51:02.520 --> 0:51:04.560 And that was the beginning of the end of Joe Biden. 0:51:05.000 --> 0:51:07.840 And it was the rise of Kamala. 0:51:07.480 --> 0:51:10.080 Harris and was a major term. 0:51:10.160 --> 0:51:14.400 Yes, that was a huge because then everybody it legitimized, 0:51:14.400 --> 0:51:17.360 it had the ability to speak their mind and start 0:51:17.360 --> 0:51:19.480 talking about what we've all been witnessing and what we've 0:51:19.480 --> 0:51:20.160 all been watching. 0:51:21.120 --> 0:51:23.760 And then that led to the no primary Kamala Harris 0:51:23.800 --> 0:51:28.359 is installed, et cetera, and the debacle that followed clearly now, 0:51:28.680 --> 0:51:32.960 so that's what's interesting is maybe the most authentic celebrity 0:51:32.960 --> 0:51:37.080 who spoke his mind is now being blamed for the downfall. 0:51:36.440 --> 0:51:38.880 Not only I don't think took any paychecks, but was 0:51:38.880 --> 0:51:40.160 helping raise the money I mean. 0:51:40.280 --> 0:51:42.879 And he has since backed away and walked away from 0:51:42.960 --> 0:51:43.319 all of this. 0:51:43.400 --> 0:51:45.680 Well, I haven't really heard from him. There's an article 0:51:45.719 --> 0:51:50.200 in Variety. The headline is stop blaming celebrity endorsements for 0:51:50.280 --> 0:51:53.960 Kamala Harris loss. We need to hear from artists now 0:51:53.960 --> 0:51:56.840 more than ever. Now, I'll be honest, I started reading 0:51:56.840 --> 0:51:59.359 this article and it is so long, and I just 0:51:59.440 --> 0:52:03.839 couldn't get through it. I read it as well, Well, 0:52:03.840 --> 0:52:05.239 then maybe if you read the whole thing, maybe you 0:52:05.239 --> 0:52:05.680 can weigh more. 0:52:05.760 --> 0:52:08.080 For you, it doesn't get better read it, It gets 0:52:08.080 --> 0:52:09.360 worse as you read it. 0:52:08.800 --> 0:52:12.719 It just wasn't that captivating. But if I just look 0:52:12.719 --> 0:52:16.120 at the headline, I agree with the first half of 0:52:16.160 --> 0:52:19.160 the headline. Stop blaming celebrity endorsements for Kamala Harris loss. 0:52:19.760 --> 0:52:22.480 Blame a million other things. Blame the way the campaign 0:52:22.560 --> 0:52:24.600 was run, the way that they use their money, how 0:52:24.600 --> 0:52:27.279 long she had, the administration she was coming out of. 0:52:27.320 --> 0:52:29.600 There are like a million other things to blame before that. 0:52:30.280 --> 0:52:33.560 But we need to hear from artists now more than ever. 0:52:34.280 --> 0:52:38.880 I mean, obviously, Variety is a Hollywood publication, That's what 0:52:38.920 --> 0:52:42.279 it does, so they're gonna it's in Variety's interest to 0:52:42.440 --> 0:52:46.360 protect me artists because that's who they cover. But I 0:52:46.400 --> 0:52:48.120 don't know if we need to hear from artists now 0:52:48.120 --> 0:52:50.759 more than ever. I think that what this election has 0:52:50.880 --> 0:52:55.400 proven is that the celebrity endorsement does not help. Again, 0:52:55.800 --> 0:52:58.880 Kamala Harris had Taylor Swift, the biggest artist in the world, 0:52:58.920 --> 0:53:02.720 endorsing her she lost in a landslide. It does not help, 0:53:03.640 --> 0:53:06.919 and I don't think it helps celebrities themselves. I don't 0:53:07.280 --> 0:53:09.400 what career benefit are you getting out of this. 0:53:09.640 --> 0:53:12.640 If I could rewrite the headline for Variety, and Lord 0:53:12.719 --> 0:53:18.440 knows they need help, I would say, don't blame celebrities 0:53:18.840 --> 0:53:22.480 for this. There is zero blame. And George Clooney, you're 0:53:22.600 --> 0:53:26.680 up there, man. You have no blame, no culpability in this. 0:53:27.640 --> 0:53:31.839 We need to hear and see your art. Yes, more 0:53:31.880 --> 0:53:36.840 than ever, art needs to be created the theater, music, comedy. 0:53:37.400 --> 0:53:41.359 We've never This goes back to summizing this entire thing 0:53:41.400 --> 0:53:44.200 and how we started this. We've never needed your art more. 0:53:44.480 --> 0:53:49.160 Stephen Colbert, Jimmy Kimmel, John Stewart, we want you to 0:53:49.160 --> 0:53:54.440 promote Perry Beyonce, Oprah. We've never needed your talents more 0:53:54.760 --> 0:53:58.319 this country. One of the things we're known for, and 0:53:58.360 --> 0:54:00.239 you actually brought this up the other day, of the 0:54:00.239 --> 0:54:04.719 shining beacons on the Hill of America is Hollywood movies. 0:54:04.840 --> 0:54:08.799 Everywhere I've traveled around the world with the Bachelor Bacherette, 0:54:09.000 --> 0:54:12.040 we kind of represent that right with they think, oh Hollywood, 0:54:12.040 --> 0:54:15.960 Hollywood's here. It's no matter where you go. John Wayne 0:54:16.040 --> 0:54:18.879 was huge. People still talk about him. Cline Eastwood, our 0:54:18.960 --> 0:54:22.560 movie stars are huge, Tom Cruise, and I mean that's 0:54:22.560 --> 0:54:25.360 why our movies are massive in China, they're massive in Russia. 0:54:25.680 --> 0:54:30.919 We are the arts of the world. And Variety came 0:54:31.000 --> 0:54:33.840 so close to writing a good article. But that is 0:54:33.880 --> 0:54:36.160 what I would have taken. That is, we've never needed 0:54:36.160 --> 0:54:39.760 your talents and your art more. Go back on stage, 0:54:40.480 --> 0:54:42.560 go back. We don't need you to rail against half 0:54:42.560 --> 0:54:44.920 the country. We don't need you to rail against the president. 0:54:45.280 --> 0:54:48.080 And I'm not saying shut up and dribble, shut up 0:54:48.120 --> 0:54:51.640 and seeing. I respect your opinions, I respect your feelings, 0:54:52.120 --> 0:54:55.359 but at the same time, go kick ass at what 0:54:55.440 --> 0:54:57.279 you do, and we love you for that. 0:54:57.640 --> 0:55:00.440 What you're talking about is something we learned in journalist school, 0:55:00.440 --> 0:55:04.960 which is show, don't tell show the story, don't tell 0:55:05.000 --> 0:55:07.160 people how to feel. And I think it applies to 0:55:07.239 --> 0:55:13.800 journalism and it applies to movies, film, TV music. Quote 0:55:14.000 --> 0:55:17.040 from this headline. We need to hear from artists now 0:55:17.040 --> 0:55:19.319 more than ever. I think we need to hear from 0:55:19.360 --> 0:55:22.719 them with their art. That's what you're saying. It's I 0:55:22.719 --> 0:55:27.200 think what this has proven is people don't feel people 0:55:28.480 --> 0:55:33.040 will feel so much from a Beyonce song. They did 0:55:33.040 --> 0:55:35.520 not feel so much from Beyonce standing on that stage 0:55:35.520 --> 0:55:39.080 for Kamala Harris and telling them because they know, at 0:55:39.080 --> 0:55:40.719 the end of the day, this is someone who's a 0:55:40.800 --> 0:55:44.319 multi millionaire, who's living a totally different life than me. 0:55:44.960 --> 0:55:47.600 And it applies, and you can be powerful and you 0:55:47.640 --> 0:55:51.880 can affect change with your art, with your music. In 0:55:51.920 --> 0:56:03.840 all those ways. 0:56:04.640 --> 0:56:09.840 Times of great strife and oppression and anger and war 0:56:10.080 --> 0:56:14.120 have always well, it's always created the best art. Some 0:56:14.200 --> 0:56:16.640 of the best art came out of the World War 0:56:16.719 --> 0:56:19.960 two era, the like you think of like the artists 0:56:19.960 --> 0:56:22.520 and the people, the great art of Europe and all that. 0:56:23.000 --> 0:56:25.919 A lot of that came from that time. And it's 0:56:25.960 --> 0:56:28.200 always been like that. Look at the great music that 0:56:28.320 --> 0:56:32.120 came out of the rebellion and civil rights and the 0:56:32.400 --> 0:56:35.440 hippie era and all that. So much great music that 0:56:35.600 --> 0:56:37.440 kids are still singing today. They may not know what 0:56:37.440 --> 0:56:40.880 it stands for, but great music comes on right and 0:56:41.560 --> 0:56:46.160 you think, oh man, this is so write music. Taylor 0:56:46.200 --> 0:56:51.720 Swift writes the greatest breakup songs ever. Her greatest gift 0:56:51.760 --> 0:56:54.440 has been picking the wrong guy and writing music about it. 0:56:54.440 --> 0:56:58.120 That's her brilliance, right, write about this, Go make a 0:56:58.160 --> 0:57:00.719 great song and let us listen to it, and let 0:57:00.840 --> 0:57:04.680 us empathize and sympathize with you through your art. And 0:57:04.719 --> 0:57:07.439 again I'm not saying don't ever speak your mind. 0:57:07.480 --> 0:57:09.759 Well, Hollywood wasn't always like this, right, it used to be. 0:57:09.760 --> 0:57:13.560 It wasn't that long ago that. Like when Michael Moore 0:57:13.640 --> 0:57:15.719 got up and I forget which awards show and he 0:57:15.840 --> 0:57:19.720 critiqued Bush, people were booing him from the audience and 0:57:19.720 --> 0:57:22.000 people were like, this isn't what our awards shows are about, 0:57:22.280 --> 0:57:23.200 and it's gotten. 0:57:23.400 --> 0:57:24.920 So now if you don't do. 0:57:24.920 --> 0:57:26.600 That, if you don't do that, then you're messing up 0:57:26.600 --> 0:57:29.760 your silence is definitely and I think we've had enough 0:57:29.880 --> 0:57:33.280 awards shows and ratings and all that to prove that 0:57:33.440 --> 0:57:37.880 is not what people at home want. They want to 0:57:38.160 --> 0:57:40.760 escape with this or they want to feel thought provoked, 0:57:40.760 --> 0:57:43.960 but like able to sit and discuss those thoughts, not 0:57:44.040 --> 0:57:46.320 to be told how to take the arts, not to 0:57:46.360 --> 0:57:49.440 be told how to feel. And like I said, that's 0:57:49.440 --> 0:57:52.720 a phrase from journalism show don't tell. I think it's 0:57:52.720 --> 0:57:55.800 the same with the media. I think that right now 0:57:55.840 --> 0:58:00.160 the media needs to take a step back, ask what 0:58:00.240 --> 0:58:02.960 their audience wants, not what they want to tell their audience. 0:58:03.360 --> 0:58:07.480 And I think that media personalities have gotten kind of 0:58:07.520 --> 0:58:10.400 on that level of like movie stars and singers and stuff, 0:58:10.440 --> 0:58:14.400 in terms of their disconnection from their audience. This week 0:58:14.440 --> 0:58:19.560 on MSNBC, Joe Scarborough starts talking about the results and 0:58:20.640 --> 0:58:22.800 they're talking about this thing. It's like he can't believe 0:58:22.840 --> 0:58:25.760 that people voted in part because of how expensive groceries are. 0:58:26.680 --> 0:58:29.680 And his wife, who co hosts a show with him, 0:58:29.680 --> 0:58:30.280 I always say. 0:58:30.160 --> 0:58:32.040 Her name on it, don't make it present. I don't 0:58:32.040 --> 0:58:32.840 know if they're still together. 0:58:33.040 --> 0:58:34.200 Oh I thought they were. I don't be wrong. 0:58:34.320 --> 0:58:36.000 Yeah, okay, I know they were married at one time. 0:58:36.000 --> 0:58:36.800 I don't know if they still are. 0:58:36.800 --> 0:58:41.040 But but she goes, well, butter costs seven dollars right now, 0:58:41.120 --> 0:58:43.880 and he goes what he goes, what is it made 0:58:43.920 --> 0:58:47.400 of gold? And I'm like, dude, you just outed yourself. 0:58:47.720 --> 0:58:50.320 You don't even You're sitting here talking about how you 0:58:50.360 --> 0:58:53.360 can't believe people voted based on groceries and you don't 0:58:53.400 --> 0:58:56.600 know how much the groceries costs. Like, do their research, 0:58:56.720 --> 0:58:58.920 do the work, Be in touch with your audience, know 0:58:59.040 --> 0:59:02.080 your audience and what they want. That is part of 0:59:02.280 --> 0:59:05.240 your job. If you want people to tune into you, 0:59:05.640 --> 0:59:08.200 then be in touch with them. And I think that 0:59:08.360 --> 0:59:13.080 media personalities have gotten so overpaid and out of touch 0:59:13.320 --> 0:59:18.280 clearly that that's part of the problem. Yeah, so in authenticity, 0:59:18.640 --> 0:59:22.040 a lack of connection to your audience, a lack of trust. 0:59:22.160 --> 0:59:24.800 I mean, we were talking about how Rogan and Vaughn 0:59:25.320 --> 0:59:28.280 were saying that Kamala Harris's team wanted editing power and 0:59:28.280 --> 0:59:30.920 they wouldn't give it. I go back to that CBS 0:59:30.960 --> 0:59:35.320 sixty minutes interview. I would have loved to see CBS 0:59:35.320 --> 0:59:37.720 interview Trump as well, and I would have loved for 0:59:37.840 --> 0:59:42.920 CBS to air both interviews unedited or as we all 0:59:42.960 --> 0:59:45.720 wanted them to do. After the controversy about the Harris 0:59:45.720 --> 0:59:48.000 interview and how it was edited came out, drop the 0:59:48.040 --> 0:59:51.880 full transcript. This election has also clearly changed the game 0:59:51.920 --> 0:59:56.320 on when you have podcasters doing three hour interviews with 0:59:56.720 --> 0:59:59.600 presidential candidates, the media is going to have to step 0:59:59.680 --> 1:00:03.080 up the game their game with that and be authentic. 1:00:03.160 --> 1:00:05.240 You know, it makes me think of call her Daddy. 1:00:06.320 --> 1:00:10.000 Was that edited and who had the editing rights over that? 1:00:10.080 --> 1:00:12.720 And all of all the things she did. Uh. There 1:00:12.760 --> 1:00:15.920 is a lot to learn and take from this, but 1:00:16.520 --> 1:00:18.720 again I'll urge I'll start with the late night guys. 1:00:19.160 --> 1:00:22.520 Go on the show tonight and be funny. Go do 1:00:22.640 --> 1:00:24.520 you you guys are good? You got you got the 1:00:24.600 --> 1:00:28.640 job for a reason years ago? Remember that, Remember how 1:00:28.640 --> 1:00:30.880 funny you used to be? The bits on Kimmel that 1:00:30.960 --> 1:00:32.640 I had a part of many of those. 1:00:32.920 --> 1:00:36.320 And then remember when SNL years ago did a they 1:00:36.360 --> 1:00:38.760 did a bit like the Whole Sketch where they mocked 1:00:38.800 --> 1:00:41.560 the debate, but they had they were in personing both 1:00:41.560 --> 1:00:44.200 Trump and Clinton. I remember that being really funny. 1:00:44.280 --> 1:00:46.280 I merry and we watched, like many people, we watched 1:00:46.320 --> 1:00:48.600 Saturday Night Live, and I'm like, oh, you know, Bill 1:00:48.640 --> 1:00:51.800 Burr was on, and I think he's really funny. He's 1:00:51.800 --> 1:00:54.320 pretty clever. He tried to go both sides. I think 1:00:54.360 --> 1:00:56.680 he's pretty you know, down the middle with his comedy. 1:00:56.880 --> 1:00:58.640 But I was watching and I was like, okay again, 1:00:59.520 --> 1:01:01.480 like the weekend update, like this is going to be funny, 1:01:01.680 --> 1:01:04.960 Like this again, there's the low hanging fruit is just there. 1:01:05.080 --> 1:01:08.480 The writers can just have so much fun with this 1:01:08.520 --> 1:01:12.560 and we can all laugh. Oh, and it just missed 1:01:12.880 --> 1:01:15.720 so poorly. Go back to doing what you do. 1:01:15.640 --> 1:01:18.640 So well, making fun of everybody, making fun. 1:01:18.520 --> 1:01:22.000 Of everybody, and be funny and be talented and show 1:01:22.040 --> 1:01:27.600 your art off and be authentic. Be authentic. 1:01:27.800 --> 1:01:31.600 If anyone is looking for some new media sources to follow, 1:01:32.280 --> 1:01:35.560 I will say I've used Twitter quite a lot just 1:01:35.600 --> 1:01:38.240 following the news on the selection, the selection cycle, probably 1:01:38.280 --> 1:01:42.920 more than anything. One person I've found is Mark Halprin. 1:01:43.880 --> 1:01:48.600 He was I think on ABC at ABC and maybe 1:01:48.600 --> 1:01:50.640 at time for a long time. He's now launched his 1:01:50.680 --> 1:01:53.160 own thing, but he was the first person to break 1:01:53.200 --> 1:01:55.920 the news that Biden was stepping down. So he's deeply 1:01:56.000 --> 1:02:00.320 sourced in Washington, and I always felt like he was 1:02:00.800 --> 1:02:02.680 as I was watching him, I felt like he was 1:02:02.720 --> 1:02:06.320 giving pretty middle of the road, like solid old school 1:02:06.320 --> 1:02:08.200 type of reporting. So just to shout out to Mark 1:02:08.200 --> 1:02:09.600 Calburn because I thought he did a really good job 1:02:09.640 --> 1:02:09.960 covering it. 1:02:10.160 --> 1:02:12.560 You know, I listen to Breaking Points as well. I 1:02:12.560 --> 1:02:13.960 think they do a good job. They kind of go 1:02:14.000 --> 1:02:16.760 back and forth, they have really good interviews, and they 1:02:16.880 --> 1:02:18.080 really cover both sides. 1:02:18.120 --> 1:02:20.000 Oh yeah, but we both like that podcast. 1:02:20.320 --> 1:02:23.560 It's just good. There's media out there, and again I 1:02:23.600 --> 1:02:26.120 think that's the big problem is even on election night 1:02:26.720 --> 1:02:30.560 when we saw such drastic numbers. I actually had the numbers. 1:02:30.600 --> 1:02:32.840 I never really got into how big of a fall 1:02:32.880 --> 1:02:38.080 it was, but it was really a drastic turn of events. 1:02:38.600 --> 1:02:43.840 According to Nielsen, there was How crazy is this? There's 1:02:43.880 --> 1:02:46.040 forty two million people overall watching the election? 1:02:46.320 --> 1:02:49.080 Does this mean broadcasting the cable network was broadcasting cable. 1:02:50.200 --> 1:02:53.960 That's down from fifty seven million who watched in twenty twenty. 1:02:54.720 --> 1:02:58.400 That is down from seventy one million that watched in 1:02:58.440 --> 1:03:04.040 twenty sixteen. Wow, that is thirty million, almost thirty million viewers. 1:03:04.640 --> 1:03:07.600 You've lost, and a lot of that can be attributed 1:03:07.680 --> 1:03:13.480 to the decline of TV in general, terrestrial TV. But 1:03:13.760 --> 1:03:15.760 there's other options like you and I like, we listen 1:03:15.840 --> 1:03:16.760 to other people now. 1:03:17.280 --> 1:03:19.080 Well, no, I think that's exactly it. I don't think 1:03:19.120 --> 1:03:21.080 those numbers being down as a reflection of people not 1:03:21.120 --> 1:03:22.040 caring about the election. 1:03:22.160 --> 1:03:25.160 Yeah. I think to the contrary, more people care and 1:03:25.240 --> 1:03:29.200 more people are seeking out voices that they want to 1:03:29.240 --> 1:03:31.520 listen to or can listen to and feel like they're 1:03:31.520 --> 1:03:32.480 getting news. 1:03:32.800 --> 1:03:35.680 And if I can actually even specify when you said 1:03:35.680 --> 1:03:38.560 a little more, to be clear, I don't think it's 1:03:38.600 --> 1:03:42.600 that people are seeking out like alternate voices for different opinions. 1:03:43.120 --> 1:03:46.080 I think it's alternate sources and they're looking for more 1:03:46.120 --> 1:03:48.800 of what they can trust. That's just my gut on 1:03:48.840 --> 1:03:51.320 what it is. I think those numbers being down as 1:03:51.320 --> 1:03:55.880 a reflection of I don't trust the TV media anymore 1:03:56.200 --> 1:03:58.880 and they're seeking their news out elsewhere. Now, I will 1:03:58.920 --> 1:04:02.840 say a lot of the Twitter news like it's sort 1:04:02.880 --> 1:04:06.040 of dependent on big media because a lot of you 1:04:06.080 --> 1:04:08.000 got to find it well well, I mean a lot 1:04:08.040 --> 1:04:11.360 of Twitter news and coverage is like accounts that pull 1:04:11.440 --> 1:04:15.440 little clips from CNN or MSNBC or whatever, and then 1:04:15.480 --> 1:04:17.920 that spurs discussion. Then they add on reportings. So it's 1:04:17.960 --> 1:04:21.000 almost like the new media needs the old media to 1:04:21.080 --> 1:04:24.680 have something to talk about a little bit. But I 1:04:24.760 --> 1:04:27.360 do think those numbers being down as reflective of people 1:04:27.840 --> 1:04:34.560 using podcasts, using Twitter, using newsletters for other forms of coverage. 1:04:34.760 --> 1:04:37.080 Yes, it was fascinating. It was fascinating to see all 1:04:37.080 --> 1:04:39.480 this play out of the last week, even since we 1:04:39.520 --> 1:04:40.640 talked about it the first time. 1:04:41.400 --> 1:04:43.200 Well, I'm predicting. I think we're going to see some 1:04:43.240 --> 1:04:47.040 layoffs in media because those numbers are way down and 1:04:47.120 --> 1:04:50.120 you can always rely on an election for numbers to 1:04:50.160 --> 1:04:53.640 be up. Well, now, yeah, my prediction would be we 1:04:53.680 --> 1:04:54.520 see some layoffs happening. 1:04:54.600 --> 1:04:57.200 This is their super Bowl, this is this is the 1:04:57.240 --> 1:04:59.400 new super Bowl. Yeah, your super Bowl is over now 1:04:59.440 --> 1:05:01.520 for another I mean two years. You have you have 1:05:01.560 --> 1:05:04.920 the midterms. That's not that's like the playoffs. You know, 1:05:05.080 --> 1:05:07.440 the election of the President of the United States is 1:05:07.520 --> 1:05:11.880 the super Bowl for news and you lost. Right, that 1:05:11.960 --> 1:05:13.800 was a big l You'd have to look at it 1:05:13.840 --> 1:05:17.480 as far as advertisers go, money raise, getting the key 1:05:17.520 --> 1:05:20.880 demographics in it was a big failure. And if you 1:05:21.000 --> 1:05:24.240 are not as a news director and a president of 1:05:24.280 --> 1:05:29.680 a network reorganizing, rethinking, figuring out how we can adjust 1:05:29.960 --> 1:05:33.720 course to the wins of change, you're going to be obsolete. 1:05:34.120 --> 1:05:38.240 The late night shows, you are almost already obsolete. You 1:05:38.440 --> 1:05:41.600 got a course correct here, Try something different because what's 1:05:41.640 --> 1:05:44.000 going on is not working. And I want these people 1:05:44.040 --> 1:05:46.080 to succeed. I'm a big fan of a rising tide 1:05:46.080 --> 1:05:49.240 lifts all boats. I want Jimmy Kimmel to succeed. I 1:05:49.240 --> 1:05:51.800 don't dislike Jimmy. I don't just I've never met Kobeir. 1:05:52.040 --> 1:05:54.840 I'm sure he's fine, but I you know, I like 1:05:54.880 --> 1:05:59.000 it when TV people succeed, because then we all succeed 1:05:59.040 --> 1:06:01.400 in this business and more people give money to advertisers, 1:06:01.440 --> 1:06:04.200 et cetera. So I don't root against any of these people. 1:06:04.240 --> 1:06:07.240 Same thing for the news industry. I want my friends 1:06:07.240 --> 1:06:10.720 in the news industry to succeed. But gosh, you got 1:06:10.720 --> 1:06:13.240 to do better. You can't keep you know, it's that 1:06:13.440 --> 1:06:16.760 old definition of insanity. You can't keep doing the same 1:06:16.800 --> 1:06:19.439 thing and expect to different results. And we've been doing 1:06:19.480 --> 1:06:21.280 the same thing now for the better part of a 1:06:21.320 --> 1:06:24.160 decade and we're getting the same result, and that result 1:06:24.240 --> 1:06:27.880 is not good. So let's change. Let's be authentic, and 1:06:27.920 --> 1:06:30.600 let's find our voices and find our talent again, because 1:06:30.600 --> 1:06:33.880 it's out there and that's what we're yearning for. Thank 1:06:33.920 --> 1:06:36.000 you for listening, Thank you for being here. We'll do 1:06:36.040 --> 1:06:38.200 it again next time because we have a lot more 1:06:38.280 --> 1:06:41.360 to talk about. Thanks for listening. Follow us on Instagram 1:06:41.400 --> 1:06:43.880 at the most dramatic pod ever and make sure to 1:06:43.880 --> 1:06:46.600 write us a review and leave us five stars. I'll 1:06:46.640 --> 1:06:47.480 talk to you next time.