WEBVTT - Gender-Based Violence is Solvable 0:00:15.076 --> 0:00:21.796 Bushkin. I may have Higgins and this is solvable. Interviews 0:00:21.876 --> 0:00:25.236 with the world's most innovative thinkers working to solve the 0:00:25.276 --> 0:00:30.276 world's biggest problems. My solvable is I want to change 0:00:30.316 --> 0:00:34.676 the way men and women see themselves through film. That's 0:00:34.876 --> 0:00:39.276 Charmine Obichnoi. She is a journalist, a filmmaker, and an activist, 0:00:39.636 --> 0:00:43.956 oh and a two time Oscar winner. Gender based violence 0:00:44.036 --> 0:00:48.196 happens in all societies, regardless of income, class, and culture, 0:00:48.756 --> 0:00:51.676 but Charmine is Pakistani and she makes much of her 0:00:51.716 --> 0:00:55.956 work there. Pakistan sees thousands of cases of violence against 0:00:55.956 --> 0:01:01.196 women every year, from rape and acid attacks to sexual assault, kidnappings, 0:01:01.236 --> 0:01:05.156 and so called honor killings. There's a growing movement to 0:01:05.196 --> 0:01:08.756 tackle this. The country's top judge announced earlier this year 0:01:08.796 --> 0:01:12.516 that more than one thousand courts dedicated to tackling violence 0:01:12.556 --> 0:01:15.316 against women are going to be set up. A pilot 0:01:15.356 --> 0:01:19.076 court of this kind was opened in twenty seventeen in Punjab, 0:01:19.396 --> 0:01:24.636 Pakistan's most populous province. Local High Court Chief Justice Monsour 0:01:24.756 --> 0:01:27.676 Ali Shah said at the time that women were the 0:01:27.716 --> 0:01:31.756 most vulnerable members of society and that one in every 0:01:31.836 --> 0:01:35.476 three had been a victim of physical or psychological violence. 0:01:36.556 --> 0:01:39.956 Our Guest Today shares the same goal as Judge Shah, 0:01:40.116 --> 0:01:43.036 changing the way women are treated in Pakistan, but she 0:01:43.236 --> 0:01:49.236 uses a different medium. Film. Charmine's films have been hugely influential, 0:01:49.516 --> 0:01:54.116 raising awareness and bringing about legislative change. In her Oscar 0:01:54.156 --> 0:01:57.436 winning film A Girl in the River, Charmine tells the 0:01:57.516 --> 0:02:01.876 story of Saba Quisera, a young woman who survived an 0:02:01.876 --> 0:02:05.396 attempted murder at the hands of her father. In her 0:02:05.436 --> 0:02:10.076 Oscar acceptance speech, Charmine held the then primestair of Pakistan 0:02:10.156 --> 0:02:13.676 to account for doing something about it, and that actually 0:02:13.756 --> 0:02:18.076 led to changes in laws protecting women. But Charmaine didn't 0:02:18.116 --> 0:02:22.116 just want like international audiences to understand the problem. She 0:02:22.236 --> 0:02:25.836 wanted to take it to the people most affected. Herself 0:02:25.836 --> 0:02:28.516 and her team have built a mobile cinema on a truck, 0:02:28.996 --> 0:02:32.356 and they drive it to communities throughout Pakistan, especially where 0:02:32.356 --> 0:02:36.356 honor killings are most prevalent, and they host screenings of 0:02:36.356 --> 0:02:39.476 A Girl in the River and they discuss the changes 0:02:39.516 --> 0:02:42.476 in the law and how women can advocate for themselves. 0:02:43.116 --> 0:02:46.836 They show other films too, films to tackle income inequality 0:02:47.116 --> 0:02:51.476 and climate change, and ethnic relations and religious tolerance as 0:02:51.516 --> 0:02:54.836 well as two Oscars. Charmaine has received six Emmys, and 0:02:55.036 --> 0:02:58.716 in twenty twelve, the government of Pakistan honored her with 0:02:58.756 --> 0:03:02.276 the Crescent of Excellence, which is the second highest civilian 0:03:02.356 --> 0:03:05.796 honor of the country, and Time magazine named her one 0:03:05.836 --> 0:03:08.956 of the one hundred most influential people in the world. 0:03:09.716 --> 0:03:13.356 Let's take a listen into her conversation with Ahmed Ali Akbar. 0:03:15.236 --> 0:03:17.956 So what is the problem for you and why is 0:03:17.996 --> 0:03:21.236 it something that you want to address the problem is 0:03:21.516 --> 0:03:25.556 that men don't see women as their equals, and I 0:03:25.596 --> 0:03:29.836 feel that film can change that. It can change their outlook, 0:03:29.876 --> 0:03:32.196 it can change the relationship between a man and a woman, 0:03:32.436 --> 0:03:34.876 it can change the way they see the potential of 0:03:34.916 --> 0:03:40.196 a woman. And bringing films into communities and opening up 0:03:40.476 --> 0:03:44.636 the minds of men and women to the potential of 0:03:44.676 --> 0:03:48.916 a woman, I feel cinema can change that. So tell 0:03:48.956 --> 0:03:52.996 me about the culture of honor killings in Pakistan. Pakistan 0:03:53.356 --> 0:03:59.236 is a deeply patriarchal, misogynistic country and you have forces 0:03:59.356 --> 0:04:02.356 that are pushing and pulling against each other. Now with 0:04:02.396 --> 0:04:06.916 this generation of young women who are educated, who want 0:04:07.356 --> 0:04:11.076 rights for themselves, who want to make decisions about their lives, 0:04:11.276 --> 0:04:13.676 and they don't want their fathers and their brothers and 0:04:13.716 --> 0:04:17.756 their husbands to do that for them, And so more 0:04:17.796 --> 0:04:21.476 and more women find themselves standing up and asking for 0:04:21.516 --> 0:04:24.636 their rights and saying no to things that they don't 0:04:24.636 --> 0:04:28.916 want to do, and the men, the old God is 0:04:29.196 --> 0:04:32.156 pushing back. They don't want to give up the space 0:04:32.196 --> 0:04:34.716 that they have, and so more and more women are 0:04:34.756 --> 0:04:39.956 finding themselves being victims of domestic violence or being killed 0:04:40.076 --> 0:04:43.436 in the name of honor. Honor is this word that 0:04:43.596 --> 0:04:47.796 is used and thrown a lot around a lot in Pakistan, 0:04:48.236 --> 0:04:51.156 and the concept is that the honor of a woman 0:04:51.316 --> 0:04:53.876 rests with the man, and there are all of these 0:04:53.956 --> 0:04:59.716 unwritten rules that if a woman transgresses some invisible line, 0:04:59.756 --> 0:05:02.996 that there will be repercussions for her. For example, a 0:05:03.076 --> 0:05:06.476 woman asking for a divorce her husband might think that 0:05:06.516 --> 0:05:09.996 she's dishonoring him and may kill her in the name 0:05:10.036 --> 0:05:13.276 of honor. A daughter decides to get married to a 0:05:13.356 --> 0:05:17.716 man of her own, choosing a father decides she's dishonoring 0:05:17.796 --> 0:05:22.516 him and kills her. So there is no one reason 0:05:22.556 --> 0:05:25.036 why women are killed in the name of honor. Women 0:05:25.036 --> 0:05:27.236 are killed in the name of honor because men decide 0:05:27.716 --> 0:05:31.156 that a woman has crossed a line and she deserves 0:05:31.196 --> 0:05:37.076 to be punished, and they're shot, dismembered, buried in unmarked 0:05:37.076 --> 0:05:40.756 graves and the names are forever forgotten. Tell me about 0:05:40.956 --> 0:05:43.276 what is it about this problem of honor killing that 0:05:43.316 --> 0:05:45.236 made you decide that you wanted to tackle it in 0:05:45.236 --> 0:05:48.916 your films. In order to change the way men see women, 0:05:49.316 --> 0:05:52.636 I wanted to bring films into the mix. I wanted 0:05:52.756 --> 0:05:56.916 men to see women not as victims, but as survivors, 0:05:56.956 --> 0:06:01.076 as heroes, as women in power, as women who fight back. 0:06:01.756 --> 0:06:03.996 And the story is a women that I've chosen to 0:06:04.036 --> 0:06:08.676 tell are exactly those sort of women. Women who are 0:06:08.796 --> 0:06:12.436 climb mountains, women who are part of the anti terrorism squad, 0:06:12.676 --> 0:06:17.476 women who have stood up against men and fought and one. 0:06:17.556 --> 0:06:20.236 And those are the stories that we're capturing on cinema. 0:06:20.276 --> 0:06:23.516 And we've built a mobile cinema in Pakistan to take 0:06:23.556 --> 0:06:26.916 those stories into towns and villages who will never have 0:06:27.036 --> 0:06:30.316 access to those kind of films. In order to change 0:06:30.356 --> 0:06:32.876 the way men see women, in order to change the 0:06:32.956 --> 0:06:36.356 way women are treated, you have to get men to 0:06:36.476 --> 0:06:38.756 accept women as their equal. You have to get them 0:06:38.756 --> 0:06:41.916 to look at them and see their worth. And film 0:06:41.996 --> 0:06:44.756 is one way of opening their eyes to it. And 0:06:44.796 --> 0:06:47.076 we're starting at a very young age. We're starting with 0:06:47.116 --> 0:06:50.236 schools and you know, with community centers, and then into 0:06:50.316 --> 0:06:53.996 villages and then into towns. And with each film screening 0:06:54.036 --> 0:06:57.036 that we do, we ask the question, do you think 0:06:57.036 --> 0:06:58.956 women should go out and work? Do you think women 0:06:58.996 --> 0:07:01.676 should study? Do you think your mother has the right 0:07:02.116 --> 0:07:04.876 at home? Do you think your sisters should have the 0:07:04.956 --> 0:07:07.356 right to choose a man to marry? You know, these 0:07:07.356 --> 0:07:09.836 are questions which might seem to the rest of the 0:07:09.876 --> 0:07:13.156 world is so basic, but so important to ask in 0:07:13.196 --> 0:07:16.676 a country like Pakistan, because change is not going to 0:07:16.676 --> 0:07:20.076 come with simply just changing laws. Change is going to 0:07:20.196 --> 0:07:23.316 come when you change the way people see things and 0:07:23.436 --> 0:07:26.316 accept things. So you were able to actually show your 0:07:26.396 --> 0:07:29.716 film A Girl on the River with navashar If, previous 0:07:29.756 --> 0:07:32.356 Prime Minister of Pakistan. Can you talk to me about 0:07:32.396 --> 0:07:35.236 what that was like taking your story to the highest 0:07:35.276 --> 0:07:37.716 level of government and sort of what impact and conversations. 0:07:37.716 --> 0:07:41.116 It started in twenty sixteen when I did A Girl 0:07:41.116 --> 0:07:43.076 in the River The Price of Forgiveness, which was a 0:07:43.076 --> 0:07:45.996 film about honor killings. The film was nominated for an 0:07:45.956 --> 0:07:49.196 Academy Award and the Prime Minister, as part of his 0:07:49.316 --> 0:07:53.036 congratulatory note to me, said that he would love to 0:07:53.036 --> 0:07:56.756 screen the film in his office, and so I've immediately 0:07:56.836 --> 0:08:00.156 jumped at the opportunity because as a filmmaker, we were 0:08:00.196 --> 0:08:03.396 desperately my team and I were trying to change and 0:08:03.516 --> 0:08:06.236 impact a loophole in the law in the honor killing 0:08:06.316 --> 0:08:08.356 law in Pakistan, and so we felt that if we 0:08:08.356 --> 0:08:10.396 were to screen for the Prime Minister, the right kind 0:08:10.436 --> 0:08:12.876 of attention would be given to the subject of the 0:08:12.876 --> 0:08:16.636 film and perhaps help us get the lakoon and the 0:08:16.676 --> 0:08:21.116 law closed. And so I accepted, and I went to 0:08:21.156 --> 0:08:24.156 see the Prime Minister and we had a conversation and 0:08:24.196 --> 0:08:27.076 he said, why don't we screen the film after the 0:08:27.116 --> 0:08:29.396 Academy Awards. And I thought to myself, well, if I 0:08:29.436 --> 0:08:32.796 don't win, this might never happen. So I pushed for 0:08:32.996 --> 0:08:34.996 the screening of the film to take place before I 0:08:35.076 --> 0:08:38.236 left for La, and he screened for his entire cabinet, 0:08:38.476 --> 0:08:41.836 and at the screening he said something very important which 0:08:41.956 --> 0:08:46.236 was televised live across the country, that there is no 0:08:46.316 --> 0:08:49.916 honor and honor killing, and he pledged to change the 0:08:49.996 --> 0:08:53.836 law on it. And I went off to La and 0:08:53.916 --> 0:08:58.276 we won the Academy Award, and then in my acceptance speech, 0:08:58.476 --> 0:09:01.876 I told the billion people watching that the Prime Minister 0:09:01.916 --> 0:09:04.516 of Pakistan had pledged to change the law. Because nothing 0:09:04.556 --> 0:09:06.996 like holding the prime minister accountable in front of billions 0:09:07.076 --> 0:09:10.956 of people. So when I came back to Pakistan, I 0:09:10.996 --> 0:09:13.956 worked with the government and with the other activists who 0:09:13.996 --> 0:09:17.836 had been laying the groundwork for the passage of the law. 0:09:18.596 --> 0:09:22.076 And I think our film played a small role in 0:09:23.036 --> 0:09:29.156 lighting kind of having this lightning rod effect in pushing 0:09:29.196 --> 0:09:33.396 this legislation forward. And in October twenty sixteen, the lacuna 0:09:33.396 --> 0:09:37.356 and the law that we wanted changed closed so that 0:09:37.516 --> 0:09:41.836 men could no longer be forgiven if they committed on 0:09:41.956 --> 0:09:44.116 our killings that they would have to spend a lifetime 0:09:44.156 --> 0:09:47.676 in jail. And of course it was a great victory 0:09:47.676 --> 0:09:50.196 for us, but the very next day a woman was 0:09:50.276 --> 0:09:52.676 killed in the name of honor, and then another and another, 0:09:52.716 --> 0:09:55.676 and we began to think about the fact that passage 0:09:55.676 --> 0:09:58.036 of the law was one thing, but we really needed 0:09:58.076 --> 0:10:01.436 to work on changing the way men saw women and 0:10:01.596 --> 0:10:05.876 changing the way people saw on our killings. Wow, and 0:10:06.116 --> 0:10:10.636 that's shocking considering the movement that the anti honor killing 0:10:10.836 --> 0:10:14.676 activism has made in the law that in a practical level, 0:10:14.956 --> 0:10:17.956 the effect is not being felt for the women of Pakistan. 0:10:18.876 --> 0:10:24.396 You cannot change things simply by changing laws. You have 0:10:24.476 --> 0:10:28.956 to change people's mindsets. You have to change the entire 0:10:29.076 --> 0:10:33.396 culture of who a woman is, what is her place 0:10:33.436 --> 0:10:38.196 in society, what is her worth. We still have young 0:10:38.276 --> 0:10:41.676 girls in homes who are fed food after the young 0:10:41.796 --> 0:10:44.996 boys are fed food. You still have young girls staying 0:10:45.036 --> 0:10:47.516 home so that their brothers can go to school. You 0:10:47.596 --> 0:10:52.196 still have young girls being married off when they're literally children. 0:10:52.836 --> 0:10:55.876 So when you have a society which doesn't value a 0:10:55.916 --> 0:10:58.796 woman's life, when you have a society which thinks that 0:10:58.876 --> 0:11:02.796 women are expendable, then honor killings will of course take 0:11:02.876 --> 0:11:05.996 root in that kind of a society. And you can 0:11:06.036 --> 0:11:09.596 make as many laws as possible, But unless you address 0:11:09.196 --> 0:11:13.476 the issue of how men see women and how women 0:11:13.516 --> 0:11:16.956 see themselves, women have to see that they too can 0:11:16.996 --> 0:11:19.316 fight back, that they too have a voice, that they 0:11:19.356 --> 0:11:23.116 too have the courage to stand up and be part 0:11:23.156 --> 0:11:27.516 of a movement that makes them feel that they are worthwhile, 0:11:27.556 --> 0:11:31.316 that they're not expendable. So many women in Pakistan do 0:11:31.356 --> 0:11:34.236 not report violence because they think that nothing is going 0:11:34.276 --> 0:11:38.036 to happen if they report it. That mindset has to change, 0:11:38.956 --> 0:11:41.596 and in order to do that, you have to change 0:11:42.316 --> 0:11:45.916 popular culture. You have to invest yourself on the grassroots 0:11:45.956 --> 0:11:50.036 in order to bring about a change in thinking. And 0:11:50.476 --> 0:11:53.076 it's great that we have laws now that protect women, 0:11:53.396 --> 0:11:55.796 but the people who implement those laws need to know 0:11:55.836 --> 0:11:58.236 about them, and more and more men need to be 0:11:58.276 --> 0:12:00.716 sent to prison so that they can be made examples 0:12:00.716 --> 0:12:03.516 of If a man kills a woman in a town 0:12:03.916 --> 0:12:06.476 and the neighbors know about it, that he's not gone 0:12:06.476 --> 0:12:09.276 to jail, there'll be other men who will feel embolded 0:12:09.316 --> 0:12:11.596 to carry on in his footsteps because they know that 0:12:11.636 --> 0:12:15.436 this is not a crime punishable by law. So what 0:12:15.516 --> 0:12:18.236 are some things that can be done to actually reduce 0:12:18.356 --> 0:12:22.196 this level of threat towards women. I think change does 0:12:22.276 --> 0:12:26.396 not come overnight, and it takes a long time. When 0:12:26.436 --> 0:12:30.396 women are empowered, when they're educated, when they know their rights, 0:12:30.796 --> 0:12:34.236 they have a voice and can fight back. And now 0:12:34.276 --> 0:12:37.396 you find that more and more women are choosing to 0:12:37.436 --> 0:12:39.956 do that. They are choosing to stand up both online 0:12:39.956 --> 0:12:43.036 and offline, to ask for their rights. They are choosing 0:12:43.036 --> 0:12:46.596 to say that no, this will not happen under my watch. 0:12:46.836 --> 0:12:49.716 I do not agree with this. They're making themselves more 0:12:49.716 --> 0:12:53.396 aware of their potential and what they can go forward 0:12:53.436 --> 0:12:58.076 and do. It's not going to happen overnight, but film 0:12:58.356 --> 0:13:01.916 will play a pivotal role in the way women see 0:13:01.916 --> 0:13:06.596 their potential. Television in Pakistan the mobile phone, which has 0:13:06.636 --> 0:13:11.196 streaming films and televison shows. More and more women have 0:13:11.276 --> 0:13:13.876 access to that now and they've a window to the 0:13:13.916 --> 0:13:17.716 outside world, and that is really helping the way they 0:13:17.756 --> 0:13:22.356 see themselves. The Internet is an equalizer and it's allowing women, 0:13:22.916 --> 0:13:25.356 even in small towns and villagers, to have conversations with 0:13:25.396 --> 0:13:28.556 other women about what's happening in their homes, what's happening 0:13:28.556 --> 0:13:31.836 around them, asking for advice on what to do, on 0:13:32.676 --> 0:13:36.356 how to get out of a situation. Facebook groups are starting, 0:13:36.996 --> 0:13:39.756 chat rooms are starting where women are conversing with each 0:13:39.796 --> 0:13:43.356 other and that has never happened before. And it's going 0:13:43.396 --> 0:13:45.756 to be a while before you see the reduction in numbers, 0:13:45.876 --> 0:13:48.436 but I think that we've taken a first, very important 0:13:48.476 --> 0:13:52.396 step in getting women aware that they can fight back. 0:13:53.276 --> 0:13:57.156 One really amazing thing that you do is these mobile 0:13:57.196 --> 0:14:00.156 cinemas you set up. Tell me about the process of 0:14:00.316 --> 0:14:03.436 putting together these mobile cinemas and the impact they've had. 0:14:03.676 --> 0:14:07.036 I've been making films for well over two decades, and 0:14:07.196 --> 0:14:09.836 I began to think a few years ago about who 0:14:09.876 --> 0:14:13.116 was watching these films. Were the people who needed to 0:14:13.156 --> 0:14:16.196 watch it the most? Did they have access to these films? 0:14:16.436 --> 0:14:20.476 Would they understand those are the people that needed to 0:14:20.716 --> 0:14:24.436 watch these women champions? They were the people who needed 0:14:24.476 --> 0:14:27.876 to watch men championing women in these films. And so 0:14:27.956 --> 0:14:30.596 how would I be able to get into towns and 0:14:30.796 --> 0:14:34.436 villagers to host screenings and take my work there and 0:14:34.476 --> 0:14:38.516 take the work of other filmmakers there. And after months 0:14:38.516 --> 0:14:42.076 of brainstorming, we came up with designing a mobile cinema, 0:14:42.196 --> 0:14:45.596 a large truck that's outfitted with the screen that lights 0:14:45.676 --> 0:14:49.236 up the night sky and brings people out together in 0:14:49.276 --> 0:14:53.636 the evenings to watch content together and to have discussions 0:14:53.676 --> 0:14:58.076 around it. But Pakistan is a country where you know, 0:14:58.116 --> 0:15:00.156 in some areas men and women can sit down and 0:15:00.156 --> 0:15:02.756 watch films together, but in other areas they cannot. And 0:15:02.836 --> 0:15:06.076 so inside the truck we outfitted it with seats and 0:15:06.196 --> 0:15:10.156 another screen so that if we were a screening in 0:15:10.196 --> 0:15:13.556 a conservative area, women could actually watch inside the truck 0:15:13.796 --> 0:15:16.396 while the men could be watching outside and we could 0:15:16.396 --> 0:15:20.276 be showing two totally different films to two totally different audiences. 0:15:20.716 --> 0:15:23.996 And over the last two years, my mobile cinema has 0:15:24.036 --> 0:15:29.236 gone to over four hundred locations across Pakistan and we've 0:15:29.276 --> 0:15:34.476 had incredible feedback from the communities that we've been showing 0:15:34.476 --> 0:15:37.316 the films in. We've been invited back again and again, 0:15:37.836 --> 0:15:40.436 and even in communities where there's been a pushback where 0:15:40.436 --> 0:15:42.156 they have said that we don't want our women to 0:15:42.236 --> 0:15:45.516 watch these films because we don't want them to know 0:15:45.556 --> 0:15:48.716 about their rights, there have been other people who've stepped 0:15:48.756 --> 0:15:51.396 up and said no, it's important to educate our women 0:15:51.396 --> 0:15:55.236 and our children and even our men. And we found 0:15:55.276 --> 0:15:58.116 that one mobile cinema is not enough. That we need 0:15:58.196 --> 0:16:01.916 dozens of these cinemas across the country because people are 0:16:01.956 --> 0:16:06.476 beginning to realize that these vehicles open up the entire 0:16:06.516 --> 0:16:09.716 world to them. So, when you're in those situations where 0:16:09.756 --> 0:16:12.956 you know men are pushing back against the mobile cinemas 0:16:12.996 --> 0:16:17.076 and the information you're giving to women about their rights 0:16:17.076 --> 0:16:20.676 and their value, how do you address that. I've always 0:16:20.676 --> 0:16:23.756 found that communities have to accept you in order for 0:16:23.836 --> 0:16:27.076 you to bring change, in order for you to introduce 0:16:27.196 --> 0:16:29.316 films in order for you to bring the mobile cinema. 0:16:29.396 --> 0:16:32.116 And so when a community decides that they don't want 0:16:32.196 --> 0:16:36.716 us there, we try and work with partners, nonprofits that 0:16:36.756 --> 0:16:40.036 may have worked in that community before, or a community 0:16:40.116 --> 0:16:43.036 leader that might be more open to us coming in, 0:16:43.316 --> 0:16:48.276 and we use that vehicle to get into that community. 0:16:48.356 --> 0:16:53.116 So we have had, you know, situations where the team 0:16:53.116 --> 0:16:55.636 has been asked to leave, but other people have stepped 0:16:55.676 --> 0:16:58.716 in and said, let's screen, or we've been asked to 0:16:58.796 --> 0:17:00.836 leave and we've left that day, you know, to fight 0:17:00.876 --> 0:17:03.956 the battle another day. The idea is to make the 0:17:03.996 --> 0:17:07.756 community comfortable, to make them understand that what we're doing 0:17:07.756 --> 0:17:12.436 will benefit the children because we're showing them films about 0:17:12.596 --> 0:17:16.116 how to become a firefighter, or what the world looks 0:17:16.156 --> 0:17:19.716 like outside their tiny village. We're showing them films that 0:17:20.076 --> 0:17:25.596 talk about rights and equality, about climate change, about science, 0:17:25.676 --> 0:17:29.316 about travel, films that they wouldn't normally watch. And so 0:17:29.596 --> 0:17:31.676 some of these ideas are new to them and ideas 0:17:31.716 --> 0:17:34.636 that they're afraid of. But if you spend enough time 0:17:34.676 --> 0:17:37.836 with them, you convince a few people in the community 0:17:38.276 --> 0:17:42.516 that matter. In the community. The mobile cinema is eventually 0:17:42.596 --> 0:17:46.796 always allowed back in. Do you plan out discussions or 0:17:47.236 --> 0:17:50.356 do you sort of let them happen naturally. I have 0:17:50.516 --> 0:17:54.076 this wonderful team of young men actually who travel with 0:17:54.116 --> 0:17:57.796 the Mobile Cinema and who are committed to going from 0:17:57.836 --> 0:18:00.796 town to town and village to village. They carry with 0:18:00.876 --> 0:18:03.676 them these feedback forms that are designed so that they 0:18:03.716 --> 0:18:06.956 can ask the participants who have been their random sampling 0:18:06.956 --> 0:18:10.076 of them, you know, about the content that they've seen, 0:18:10.276 --> 0:18:13.476 about some of the messaging in the films, about the 0:18:13.516 --> 0:18:16.236 way they see the world. And we use these feedback 0:18:16.316 --> 0:18:19.676 forms and collate the data from it to see and 0:18:19.796 --> 0:18:24.956 track what content has resonated with the participants and the people, 0:18:25.356 --> 0:18:28.436 what films have opened up their eyes, which films may 0:18:28.476 --> 0:18:31.396 have not had the same impact that we thought that 0:18:31.436 --> 0:18:33.756 they would. It's you know, it's for us. It's a 0:18:33.836 --> 0:18:37.276 learning mechanism as well. It's not something that we have 0:18:37.956 --> 0:18:41.276 you know known, you know, this is uncharted territory for 0:18:41.356 --> 0:18:44.596 us as well. We're learning as we go along. We're 0:18:44.636 --> 0:18:48.676 creating films as we go along, We're changing the feedback 0:18:48.716 --> 0:18:52.476 forms as we go along, and so with each screening 0:18:52.476 --> 0:18:55.076 we learned something new. Initially, it was hard for us 0:18:55.116 --> 0:18:57.236 to screen for women. You know, we wanted to get 0:18:57.236 --> 0:18:58.916 into the community and screen for the men and the 0:18:58.996 --> 0:19:02.396 children first gain their trust, then ask the women in 0:19:02.436 --> 0:19:05.316 the community to come out and watch the films. You know, 0:19:05.396 --> 0:19:08.796 I live in work in Pakistan. My end game is forever, 0:19:09.756 --> 0:19:12.876 and so I need to make sure that I build bridges, 0:19:13.676 --> 0:19:17.036 that I work with communities that trust me and my team, 0:19:17.396 --> 0:19:20.076 and that's very important to do. So. I found the 0:19:20.116 --> 0:19:23.956 guides that you made really informative. You created fourteen of them. 0:19:24.196 --> 0:19:26.956 How did you decide which topics to choose? When we 0:19:26.996 --> 0:19:30.356 began to think about agahi, which means awareness the series 0:19:30.396 --> 0:19:32.396 as a whole, we wanted to start from the basic 0:19:32.436 --> 0:19:35.476 to the most complex, and so our very first video 0:19:35.636 --> 0:19:38.676 was how to file a police report, and then we 0:19:38.716 --> 0:19:43.996 began to think about other topics domestic violence, inheritance, acid violence, 0:19:44.156 --> 0:19:49.716 honor killing, sexual harassment, and each video was building upon 0:19:49.916 --> 0:19:53.276 the previous video. We wanted to introduce different facets to women, 0:19:53.476 --> 0:19:57.076 and it's an ongoing project. While we've created fourteen films, 0:19:57.276 --> 0:20:01.916 we're looking at other topics that women may want help about, 0:20:02.316 --> 0:20:05.836 may not have clarity about, and it is important for 0:20:05.996 --> 0:20:08.836 women to know what their legal rights are. So at 0:20:08.956 --> 0:20:11.356 least that they're aware of their legal rights and where 0:20:11.396 --> 0:20:13.156 they can go to get help if they need to. 0:20:13.476 --> 0:20:16.756 And that series has been distributed for free across the country, 0:20:17.796 --> 0:20:20.596 and we're showing those films two other young women because 0:20:20.636 --> 0:20:24.276 young women need to see themselves reflected on screen. They 0:20:24.316 --> 0:20:27.356 need to see their potential. They need to know that 0:20:27.396 --> 0:20:29.956 other women have done this so I too can do this, 0:20:30.676 --> 0:20:34.716 and that is very important. We've also made the videos 0:20:34.716 --> 0:20:37.316 such that if women are not literate, they just have 0:20:37.396 --> 0:20:40.836 to hear something and take things away from it. The 0:20:40.916 --> 0:20:45.076 films have been screening across the country in schools and colleges, 0:20:45.156 --> 0:20:49.036 and earlier this year, at a women's march to mark 0:20:49.276 --> 0:20:52.556 International Women's Day in Karachi, a young woman came up 0:20:52.556 --> 0:20:55.476 to me and said that a video that we had 0:20:55.556 --> 0:21:00.236 done about domestic violence had saved her life and that 0:21:01.916 --> 0:21:04.276 she had finally known that she could go and ask 0:21:04.316 --> 0:21:09.396 for divorce. And that's what we're hoping to do, just 0:21:09.436 --> 0:21:12.396 hoping to use these films to educate women so that 0:21:12.436 --> 0:21:15.356 they can understand what their way out is, what their 0:21:15.436 --> 0:21:18.596 rights are, what they can do. So many young women 0:21:18.636 --> 0:21:20.596 that we've shown the film too had no idea what 0:21:20.636 --> 0:21:25.116 their marriage contract is about In Pakistan, when you sign 0:21:25.596 --> 0:21:29.196 your marriage certificate, at most times the right of divorce 0:21:29.356 --> 0:21:32.236 is scratched out and taken away from a woman, which 0:21:32.396 --> 0:21:36.076 is actually against the law. And so when we made 0:21:36.076 --> 0:21:39.556 a film about the rights of marriage, we made sure 0:21:39.596 --> 0:21:43.076 to tell women that when they sign their marriage certificate 0:21:43.076 --> 0:21:46.396 that they should retain the right to divorce. And most 0:21:46.436 --> 0:21:48.196 women have thought that they didn't even have the right 0:21:48.236 --> 0:21:50.756 to divorce or that it was automatically taken away from them. 0:21:51.076 --> 0:21:55.156 And so educating young girls, especially about these things will 0:21:55.236 --> 0:21:58.996 change the way they see themselves and the way they 0:21:59.076 --> 0:22:02.676 interact with people around them. So what are some takeaways 0:22:02.676 --> 0:22:05.396 of things that listeners can do. I would love to 0:22:05.476 --> 0:22:11.996 replicate the mobile cinema, both in Pakistan but also outside 0:22:11.996 --> 0:22:15.836 of Pakistan. So if anybody has a community an area 0:22:15.876 --> 0:22:18.676 where they think that the mobile cinemas needed, I would 0:22:18.796 --> 0:22:22.276 love to bring the idea, the blueprint and transfer that 0:22:22.396 --> 0:22:24.196 to them. And I think that that would be a 0:22:24.236 --> 0:22:28.276 wonderful way to take our learnings and to take that 0:22:28.316 --> 0:22:31.996 to other places. I would love people to watch my 0:22:32.076 --> 0:22:35.076 films and share the messages of the films and the 0:22:35.116 --> 0:22:37.076 stories that come out of it. But there's so many 0:22:37.076 --> 0:22:40.316 other activists around the world, including Pakistan, who are pushing 0:22:40.316 --> 0:22:45.316 the envelope and learn about their work. Learn about the 0:22:45.356 --> 0:22:50.516 work of Rakshandanas who is changing child marriage in Pakistan. 0:22:51.196 --> 0:22:54.996 Learn the work about Summer Manella who's working on issues 0:22:55.076 --> 0:22:59.876 about the girl child Malala and the work that she's 0:22:59.916 --> 0:23:04.436 doing on girl's education, and the bassamad Nan who's working 0:23:04.436 --> 0:23:08.636 on domestic violence and women in Pakistan in the northern areas. 0:23:09.836 --> 0:23:12.636 Another takeaway that I would love people to go with 0:23:13.156 --> 0:23:17.036 is that never underestimate the power of cinema and the 0:23:17.076 --> 0:23:20.356 way it can change the way children see the world. 0:23:20.796 --> 0:23:23.916 So take films out into communities, take them to a 0:23:23.956 --> 0:23:26.956 local school which is less privileged, take them to a 0:23:26.956 --> 0:23:30.196 community center, spend time with the children, show them films 0:23:30.236 --> 0:23:32.396 that will open up their minds and their ideas to 0:23:32.436 --> 0:23:35.276 the potential of the world. Because I've seen in my 0:23:35.316 --> 0:23:38.476 own life and in my own career how that has happened, 0:23:39.356 --> 0:23:42.876 and it can change the way the entire world works. 0:23:44.556 --> 0:23:49.276 Charmaine obeyed Tony and her incredible work making and distributing 0:23:49.396 --> 0:23:52.596 life changing films, and if you missed it before, as 0:23:52.596 --> 0:23:55.756 she said, you can see and share her work yourself. 0:23:56.156 --> 0:24:00.076 As well as other brilliant communicators working in the same area. 0:24:00.796 --> 0:24:03.676 Her Mobile Cinema has toured some of the most remote 0:24:03.756 --> 0:24:08.356 and poverty stricten regions of Pakistan, with particular focus on 0:24:08.516 --> 0:24:14.236 accessing conflict prone regions and the most vulnerable communities. The 0:24:14.356 --> 0:24:17.316