WEBVTT - Run the Jewels 0:00:08.640 --> 0:00:13.119 Welcome, Welcome, Welcome back to the Bob Left's podcast. Like 0:00:13.400 --> 0:00:17.920 yesterday is Run the Jewels, Yes, Killing Mike and Healthy Black. 0:00:17.960 --> 0:00:20.840 To have you here, Thank you to be here, man, 0:00:21.120 --> 0:00:24.079 thank to be here. Okay, you guys met through the 0:00:24.120 --> 0:00:28.880 Cartoon Network. Jason DeMarco at the Cartoon Network is a 0:00:29.000 --> 0:00:31.440 mutual friend of both of ours, and he gave me 0:00:31.480 --> 0:00:34.240 an opportunity to put out a solo record in conjunction 0:00:34.320 --> 0:00:38.440 with their former label, William Street Record when they reactivated it. 0:00:38.479 --> 0:00:40.320 And he said, essentially, I want this to be your 0:00:40.320 --> 0:00:43.479 opportunity to do your mayor, because most wanted a record 0:00:43.520 --> 0:00:45.400 where all you gotta do is be killing Mike, say 0:00:45.400 --> 0:00:47.640 whatever you want to say as many times as you 0:00:47.680 --> 0:00:49.120 want to say it to whoever you want to say 0:00:49.159 --> 0:00:51.760 it too. And originally was supposed to be three or 0:00:51.760 --> 0:00:55.080 four different producers. I collaborated with Jamie and I spent 0:00:55.120 --> 0:00:57.560 the day in the studio together and I told Jay 0:00:57.640 --> 0:01:00.040 he has to produce the whole record I want on 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:02.680 the thirty day campaign, aggravating the shoot out of Jamie 0:01:02.680 --> 0:01:06.200 to do the record, and Jason um when found the 0:01:06.240 --> 0:01:08.960 budget force and and it's a it's it's you know, 0:01:09.040 --> 0:01:11.759 it's it's love at first sound after that, and we've 0:01:11.800 --> 0:01:14.560 been pounding the pavement together ever since. Well, let's go 0:01:14.600 --> 0:01:16.960 a little bit slower. How did you know Jason from 0:01:17.000 --> 0:01:20.920 the cartoon network? Jason is Atlanta is a small town 0:01:20.920 --> 0:01:24.839 that masquerades is a big city. So Jason um had 0:01:24.880 --> 0:01:27.600 done something with These daya witch doctor who's who's also 0:01:27.800 --> 0:01:31.279 of the Dungeon family. I kind of knew the William 0:01:31.319 --> 0:01:33.959 Street angle, but he was doing something in particular with 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:36.959 Grand Hustle, And it was after I had separated from 0:01:36.959 --> 0:01:39.679 Big Boy's Purple Ribbon label and I was rolling with 0:01:39.800 --> 0:01:43.199 the TIA's label, Grand Hustle in my imprint grind Time. 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:45.600 That's why we were putting out Pledge three and the 0:01:45.640 --> 0:01:50.000 other mixtapes and street albums. And Um, Jason, we knew 0:01:50.040 --> 0:01:52.080 each other from a meeting that he had over there, 0:01:52.080 --> 0:01:54.360 and we just kept in contact. We both had a 0:01:54.400 --> 0:01:57.520 love of all muscle cars and um, we just kept 0:01:57.520 --> 0:01:59.880 talking around Atlanta stuff and just built a friendship. And 0:02:00.360 --> 0:02:01.920 the next thing you know, I got a call would 0:02:01.920 --> 0:02:04.880 you be interested in? And I accepted it. Jamie, how 0:02:04.920 --> 0:02:08.080 did you how did you hook up with Jason? I 0:02:08.160 --> 0:02:12.839 knew I knew Jay for years I had. I had 0:02:12.960 --> 0:02:16.400 founded a record label called Deaf Jokes, which I ran 0:02:16.560 --> 0:02:21.040 Definitive Jokes. It was it was Definitive Jokes after after death, 0:02:21.120 --> 0:02:24.359 Jan sent to cease and desist because they didn't see 0:02:24.400 --> 0:02:30.000 the joke. But but I I knew him because he 0:02:30.040 --> 0:02:33.280 was a fan of my music, and we had some 0:02:33.360 --> 0:02:37.240 mutual friends and we ended up um just getting to 0:02:37.280 --> 0:02:39.280 know each other. I started kind of giving him some 0:02:39.400 --> 0:02:43.560 music for interstitial stuff on on Adult Swim, and we 0:02:43.680 --> 0:02:46.799 ended up with my label doing a few um sort 0:02:46.840 --> 0:02:51.560 of free music compilations in conjunction with with Adult Swim 0:02:51.600 --> 0:02:54.359 and and and his label that he was doing. And 0:02:54.840 --> 0:02:56.800 we just built a relationship over the years. We just 0:02:56.840 --> 0:03:00.920 became friends. Um, he's just a wonderful guy. And so 0:03:01.040 --> 0:03:04.480 when he when he called me to do this the 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:06.360 you know, to see if I would like to get 0:03:06.360 --> 0:03:09.520 the studio of Mike, Um, I knew who Mike was. 0:03:09.600 --> 0:03:12.800 I had just sort of gotten familiar with my coincidentally, 0:03:12.840 --> 0:03:15.079 like I had just become a fan of Mike's I 0:03:15.800 --> 0:03:20.000 sort of missed sort of his debut album, but I 0:03:20.040 --> 0:03:22.480 had started to become a fan of Mix from his 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:25.639 um Pledge allegiance to the Grind series, which was a 0:03:25.680 --> 0:03:28.520 bunch of make safe that he put out um that 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:31.280 I that I started to catch onto And so probably 0:03:31.280 --> 0:03:33.840 about around the second one, I started to like be 0:03:33.960 --> 0:03:36.960 really listening to to Mike. And it was really around 0:03:36.960 --> 0:03:39.480 the same year, honestly that I started to really be 0:03:39.520 --> 0:03:42.880 really familiar and Jay asked me if I would come 0:03:42.880 --> 0:03:44.520 and meet him, and I was in I was in 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:47.440 the middle of sort of doing my I had just 0:03:47.480 --> 0:03:50.200 gotten a deal to do my next solo album to 0:03:50.840 --> 0:03:53.800 take me out of you know, destitution I had. My 0:03:53.920 --> 0:03:56.320 label had collapsed. Everything that I had worked for for 0:03:56.360 --> 0:03:59.280 ten years was gone. I was I had to move 0:03:59.280 --> 0:04:02.000 into a little hardman and need egg sandwiches for a year, 0:04:02.480 --> 0:04:05.400 and I didn't know what what For the first time 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:06.880 in my life, I didn't know what the hell I 0:04:06.920 --> 0:04:11.680 was gonna do and and and you know, so I said, Okay, sure, 0:04:12.080 --> 0:04:14.080 I'll come out and do you know, I can try 0:04:14.080 --> 0:04:16.480 and do a couple of songs with him. And I 0:04:16.520 --> 0:04:20.719 went out and met Mike and at the point being 0:04:20.760 --> 0:04:22.680 we were friend I was friends with Jay said Jay 0:04:22.760 --> 0:04:25.680 telling me you should you should meet this guy. That 0:04:25.760 --> 0:04:27.680 was a big deal to me, and I was like, Okay, Yes, 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:31.840 and I also appreciated Mike and from a distance, and 0:04:31.839 --> 0:04:34.840 when and when I got there, it was just clearly 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:39.359 magic immediately in terms of just the music and what 0:04:39.520 --> 0:04:42.160 was happening in the studio, and also I liked the guy. 0:04:42.400 --> 0:04:46.599 And and I went home and I started getting these 0:04:46.600 --> 0:04:50.320 phone calls from Jay, who was obviously getting phone calls 0:04:50.400 --> 0:04:52.600 from Mike, and then I get the phone calls from Mike, 0:04:52.800 --> 0:04:55.000 and it was always it was, you have to produce 0:04:55.040 --> 0:04:58.080 the whole record and I and I was just like, no, 0:04:58.360 --> 0:05:01.520 hell now, oh god, god, no, I'm not doing that 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:03.839 right now. I can't. I have to. I have to 0:05:03.880 --> 0:05:06.000 look after me. I have I've been spending my up 0:05:06.320 --> 0:05:09.920 the last decade of my life investing my time and 0:05:09.960 --> 0:05:12.279 other people's stuff, and I gotta do. I have to 0:05:12.360 --> 0:05:15.560 save myself. I have to do music. And you know, 0:05:16.120 --> 0:05:17.960 and they just wore me down. I mean, you know, 0:05:18.040 --> 0:05:20.600 they wore me down with the fact that it was magical. 0:05:21.120 --> 0:05:24.120 In any event, Jamie, you wanted to do your solo 0:05:24.200 --> 0:05:26.360 album and they want you to do the complete album 0:05:26.400 --> 0:05:30.400 for a killer Mike, and I said no, no, damn 0:05:30.400 --> 0:05:33.760 it no, And I just couldn't resist. I mean, like 0:05:34.279 --> 0:05:38.840 I you know, I think that it's it's just testimony 0:05:38.920 --> 0:05:43.000 to the fact that thinking that you know what is 0:05:43.040 --> 0:05:45.160 best for you is kind of a joke. Thinking that 0:05:45.240 --> 0:05:47.200 you can control the future is kind of a joke. 0:05:47.279 --> 0:05:50.120 And I sort of just I liked Mike. I just 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:53.359 liked him and and he and he got me. He 0:05:53.440 --> 0:05:56.400 got me as a producer, were the same age. He 0:05:56.560 --> 0:05:59.520 really got the references. You know, he knew exactly what 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:01.880 I was kind to do, and he was excited about 0:06:01.880 --> 0:06:05.039 the music, and I was just I just had a 0:06:05.200 --> 0:06:07.200 sort of a I just thought about it, and I 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:10.000 was like, you know what, fuck it, man, this guy 0:06:10.080 --> 0:06:13.440 is great, and who am I to You know, every 0:06:13.440 --> 0:06:15.599 plan that I've made over the past ten years is 0:06:15.640 --> 0:06:20.840 completely disintegrated and completely exploded in my face. Maybe it's 0:06:20.880 --> 0:06:23.440 time that I stopped, you know, trying to like, you know, 0:06:23.560 --> 0:06:25.520 control of this situation and just said, you know what, 0:06:25.600 --> 0:06:28.599 all right, let's go, let's do it. And so you 0:06:28.640 --> 0:06:31.520 agree to produce the album, At what point do you 0:06:31.560 --> 0:06:36.159 decide you're gonna work together as the act that came later? 0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:39.760 That came, that came. But we did the records. I mean, 0:06:39.800 --> 0:06:42.040 I did my solo album that I did his album 0:06:42.279 --> 0:06:45.560 same year. We were both on each other's albums. We 0:06:45.680 --> 0:06:49.040 both guest guested on each other's records, you know, um 0:06:49.360 --> 0:06:51.960 which we loved and we thought sounding great, And then 0:06:52.000 --> 0:06:56.000 we went on tour together. Um Our records surprisingly came out. 0:06:56.040 --> 0:06:57.840 We didn't plan it, but they ended up coming out 0:06:57.839 --> 0:07:00.320 a week apart from each other. So we were like, oh, ship, 0:07:00.400 --> 0:07:02.159 why don't we why don't we take this ack on 0:07:02.160 --> 0:07:04.400 the road? Why don't we want to be tour? And 0:07:04.520 --> 0:07:08.679 we did, and afterwards if we had a great time, 0:07:08.760 --> 0:07:10.920 I think both me and Mike felt like that we was. 0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:13.560 It was you know, for two guys who kind of 0:07:13.560 --> 0:07:16.320 were looking at down the barrel of obscurity, you know, 0:07:16.440 --> 0:07:20.000 and kind of wondering like, well, you know, maybe we'll 0:07:20.040 --> 0:07:22.080 just be we can just be happy just kind of 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:24.560 you know, playing four or five people at night and 0:07:24.840 --> 0:07:27.120 and working and doing the music we want to do. 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:29.520 And we had really like come to the same place 0:07:29.560 --> 0:07:32.640 at the same time, like not bitter, not and not 0:07:32.760 --> 0:07:35.240 giving up, but just basically being like, you know, this 0:07:35.320 --> 0:07:37.920 is good, this is what we could be happy this way. 0:07:38.080 --> 0:07:41.520 And after that happened, after we did the tour, and 0:07:41.600 --> 0:07:44.760 we had definitely grown tighter through touring and through performing 0:07:44.800 --> 0:07:47.239 together and you know already we're having a good time. 0:07:48.080 --> 0:07:51.320 I just sort of said, you know, Mike was like, 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:53.320 what are you gonna do after the tour? And I said, well, 0:07:53.360 --> 0:07:56.400 I think I'm gonna just go into the woods somewhere 0:07:56.400 --> 0:08:00.640 at some studio and take a bunch of mushrooms and 0:08:00.880 --> 0:08:03.320 make some music and maybe put something out for free 0:08:03.360 --> 0:08:06.200 to do, like a mixtape or something for free. And 0:08:06.240 --> 0:08:09.680 Mike just said outcome and and that was it. That 0:08:09.800 --> 0:08:11.800 was as much of a plan as we had. I mean, 0:08:11.840 --> 0:08:14.800 you know, there was no there was no master plan. 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:18.000 Bob Okay. So you live in New York State and 0:08:18.120 --> 0:08:21.360 Mike lives in hot Atlanta. When you say I'll come, 0:08:22.320 --> 0:08:24.440 is that does he literally say I'm gonna come to 0:08:24.560 --> 0:08:27.360 your house? That we didn't do it to my house. 0:08:27.400 --> 0:08:30.080 I found a place at uh en uugh State, New 0:08:30.160 --> 0:08:32.680 York that there was a studio in up state New York, 0:08:32.880 --> 0:08:35.960 and I had already booked the time and just to 0:08:36.000 --> 0:08:38.480 get out of the get out of my place and 0:08:38.960 --> 0:08:41.839 just go somewhere with no expectations. And he came in. 0:08:42.280 --> 0:08:45.520 He came to that studio. We spent about two weeks, 0:08:46.240 --> 0:08:51.480 me him, our tacot ak little Shalamar was now a 0:08:51.520 --> 0:08:54.959 co producer on all the records as well. UM and UM. 0:08:55.320 --> 0:08:58.240 We just hung out and drank and smoked meat and 0:08:58.240 --> 0:09:01.560 did mushrooms and joke for each other and somehow this 0:09:01.720 --> 0:09:05.000 record happened. And we don't even know how. It just 0:09:05.120 --> 0:09:07.400 was we you know, it was. It was more like 0:09:07.440 --> 0:09:08.719 I was going to do a record and he was 0:09:08.760 --> 0:09:10.439 going to have a couple of guests verses on it, 0:09:10.480 --> 0:09:12.079 and we just were having so much fun. We just 0:09:12.160 --> 0:09:14.360 kept going. By the time we had about six songs 0:09:14.679 --> 0:09:17.600 our friends and played it for Jason DeMarco and our 0:09:17.640 --> 0:09:21.200 front Taco. We were like, this is pretty good, isn't it. 0:09:21.240 --> 0:09:24.079 This is like actually this is you know, and they 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:26.360 were like, yeah, actually you should make an album. This 0:09:26.480 --> 0:09:29.120 is about four songs away from an album. Why don't 0:09:29.160 --> 0:09:32.199 you just making an album? And we were like, yeah, okay, cool, 0:09:32.880 --> 0:09:36.280 you know that was and that was it. Okay, So 0:09:36.520 --> 0:09:38.920 what is you've made a number of albums. What is 0:09:38.960 --> 0:09:41.640 the process literally when you go in the studio, how 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:44.080 much do you have prepared and what does each of 0:09:44.120 --> 0:09:47.040 you do in the studio? Oh no, I mean, you know, 0:09:47.200 --> 0:09:49.640 I I usually the way that we do it is 0:09:49.640 --> 0:09:52.160 that I kind of go in once we've agreed that 0:09:52.200 --> 0:09:55.080 we're gonna do another record, because sort of throughout this 0:09:55.080 --> 0:09:58.480 whole process, we've never been like, we're definitely doing another record. 0:09:58.559 --> 0:10:00.400 We've always asked each other, you know, I always just 0:10:00.440 --> 0:10:02.959 looked at each other, been like monitor on the record, 0:10:03.440 --> 0:10:05.920 and always just been like, Yeah, that was that was fun, 0:10:06.000 --> 0:10:07.800 Let's do it on the record. I mean that that 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:10.920 stopped around the time after Religiuals two. We knew that 0:10:10.960 --> 0:10:13.640 we were going to keep doing records, but Reliduls two 0:10:13.880 --> 0:10:16.680 was with that question. But usually what happens is that 0:10:16.760 --> 0:10:19.520 I go in for several months and just make a 0:10:19.559 --> 0:10:22.439 bunch of music, and then we we schedule a time 0:10:22.520 --> 0:10:25.480 to get together in the studio and I play Mike 0:10:25.640 --> 0:10:28.080 all of the stuff that I think is worthy of us, 0:10:28.080 --> 0:10:30.480 sort of all the music that is worthy of us 0:10:30.679 --> 0:10:33.559 getting on and and just sort of wait to see 0:10:33.640 --> 0:10:36.920 what what what inspires us. Um. I just you know, 0:10:37.000 --> 0:10:40.280 make sure that whatever I'm playing him is not is 0:10:40.320 --> 0:10:42.880 something that I can live with. And then and then 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:45.240 I just try and see when I see that mischievous 0:10:45.280 --> 0:10:47.400 glance in his eyes and he starts pacing around the 0:10:47.480 --> 0:10:50.280 room and sort of freestylen to himself. I'm like, Okay, 0:10:50.280 --> 0:10:53.240 it's it's happening. It's happening. But it's just that it's 0:10:53.280 --> 0:10:56.480 that process. Make the music, get up with my see 0:10:56.480 --> 0:10:59.720 what happens between us, and then based on what happens 0:10:59.760 --> 0:11:02.120 betwe you go back and tweak the music, and then 0:11:02.320 --> 0:11:04.320 we beat again and and then there's an all sort 0:11:04.320 --> 0:11:08.680 of repeating process. So Mike, do you prepare or you 0:11:08.760 --> 0:11:13.640 just come to the studio hot and ready? Um? I mean, 0:11:13.679 --> 0:11:15.560 I don't know what prepared means. I just come to 0:11:15.640 --> 0:11:17.920 the studio looking to be inspired because I'm working with 0:11:17.960 --> 0:11:21.600 the dopest producer, slash Rapper and all the lands, so 0:11:21.880 --> 0:11:24.960 you know, it's kind of like the preparedness is for 0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:27.560 me just I'm just always trying to outdo whatever I 0:11:27.600 --> 0:11:30.160 did the last time. So yeah, I'm always rather win 0:11:30.200 --> 0:11:33.760 another ring with them, you know. So um, I kind 0:11:33.800 --> 0:11:35.960 of you know this go around we were for we 0:11:36.040 --> 0:11:39.320 were like recording in upstate New York, and um, that 0:11:39.320 --> 0:11:41.560 can get kind of lonely when you got wife and kids. 0:11:41.559 --> 0:11:44.360 So this time I think we found a great Um, 0:11:44.480 --> 0:11:46.520 we found a great meeting and that we're recorded in 0:11:46.559 --> 0:11:49.520 Malibu at Shango Law and I got a chance to 0:11:49.559 --> 0:11:51.440 get back into l A as I needed it, just 0:11:51.520 --> 0:11:53.160 to kind of soak up some of the city and 0:11:53.200 --> 0:11:56.240 then take that inspiration back into a room. So I 0:11:56.240 --> 0:11:58.640 probably don't want to record in a rural area so 0:11:58.760 --> 0:12:01.280 much anymore. As much as I like, I like city 0:12:01.360 --> 0:12:03.800 lights and some of the excitement. But it's not it's 0:12:03.800 --> 0:12:07.600 not It's not hard to get inspired, Jamie makes I 0:12:07.679 --> 0:12:10.599 was born to rap over lpbat so that inspiration is 0:12:10.640 --> 0:12:12.880 always just a button or right, you just turn up 0:12:12.880 --> 0:12:16.439 the volume, you know. Okay, let's talk Mike. You graduate 0:12:16.559 --> 0:12:19.600 from high school? Is that at the end of your schooling? Now? 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:22.520 I did a year at more House, and then I decided, 0:12:22.600 --> 0:12:25.560 you know what I'm gonna I'm gonna take all this 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:28.160 pride my grandma has from me getting into the greatest 0:12:28.200 --> 0:12:31.040 song black Mail College and all the land, and I'm 0:12:31.040 --> 0:12:32.920 gonna say, you know what, I'm gonna be an artist, 0:12:33.120 --> 0:12:37.439 and I'll never forget my family just losing their fucking minds, 0:12:37.520 --> 0:12:40.240 you know what I mean. So I would have graduated 0:12:40.280 --> 0:12:42.040 around the same year I got a record deal, So 0:12:42.120 --> 0:12:43.920 that's the only regret I have. I wish I would 0:12:43.960 --> 0:12:45.920 have stayed in just to make her happy. But I 0:12:45.920 --> 0:12:48.080 brought her a Grammy. She was pretty happy about that. 0:12:48.160 --> 0:12:51.120 But I graduated high school, I tend More House. I 0:12:51.160 --> 0:12:54.920 meet big boys, little brother who attends Morris Brown. His 0:12:55.040 --> 0:12:57.800 best friend is a guy named Celo Reddick, not Celo 0:12:57.880 --> 0:13:01.240 Green from the Dungeon family, but Ready whose father is 0:13:01.280 --> 0:13:05.120 a prominent lawyer in Savannah. But CeeLo Um starts one 0:13:05.200 --> 0:13:08.920 half of the Beat Bullies who produced to hit record Kryptonite. 0:13:09.120 --> 0:13:11.720 And he introduced me the Big Boy and me him 0:13:11.760 --> 0:13:13.560 and a guy named Rocky who's the guy who brought 0:13:13.600 --> 0:13:16.480 Kryptonite to Big Boy, and a guy named Frank Goplins. 0:13:16.480 --> 0:13:18.679 Today we're just a little crew and we're big boys, 0:13:18.720 --> 0:13:21.560 little brothers, little crew. And he takes notice in me 0:13:21.600 --> 0:13:23.000 and tells me, I'm gonna give you a record deal 0:13:23.040 --> 0:13:26.040 one man. I shrug my shoulders like okay, And a 0:13:26.040 --> 0:13:29.199 few years later he makes true on his word. Okay, 0:13:29.440 --> 0:13:33.120 three years after you drop out of Morehouse. Yeah, what 0:13:33.160 --> 0:13:35.160 do you do to stay alive for those three years? 0:13:35.200 --> 0:13:37.040 Because you talk about being an artist, but usually there's 0:13:37.080 --> 0:13:40.600 a word that starts before that, starving artist. Yeah. Yeah, 0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:42.880 that's exact same thing my father told me, and I 0:13:42.880 --> 0:13:45.760 told him I was going to be an artist. Um, 0:13:45.920 --> 0:13:49.360 I know, and loved cars, so I worked fullshit, shitty 0:13:49.480 --> 0:13:51.920 jobs that I don't like in places like Advance and 0:13:52.320 --> 0:13:56.560 Auto Zone. I sell, um marijuana, pretty good marijuana, not 0:13:56.600 --> 0:14:00.240 bad marijuana. And then I stopped doing those things, and 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:02.800 for a couple of years I teach kids how to 0:14:02.920 --> 0:14:05.600 organize because as a child, I had learned how to organize. 0:14:05.640 --> 0:14:08.440 So I kind of put down, you know, put down 0:14:08.440 --> 0:14:10.439 the regular work and stiff gig because I was never 0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:13.000 really good for jobs. I was just stealing their money 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:15.240 whatever they were paying me an hour. I didn't work 0:14:15.280 --> 0:14:18.520 to expectations. I always told my managers I never would. 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:20.880 I remember a got autos Zone saying you could be 0:14:20.920 --> 0:14:23.280 a manager. I said, tell me how many spark plugs 0:14:23.320 --> 0:14:26.120 you need to sell this month to get your manager's bonus, 0:14:26.120 --> 0:14:27.720 and I'll make sure you make it every month. Just 0:14:27.720 --> 0:14:30.240 don't ever mention me being a manager again, you know. 0:14:30.840 --> 0:14:33.520 And I um. He stopped me years later and saying, man, 0:14:33.600 --> 0:14:35.720 you really did it. You became a rapper. I was like, ship, 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:37.440 you thought I was bullshit, and I want to build 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:40.960 the work of the autos Zone. So um, being an 0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:43.760 organizer and teaching kids to organize was a lot less 0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:47.600 dangerous than selling a little bit slower. What is an 0:14:47.720 --> 0:14:51.400 organizer and how do you monetize them? Well? As an organize, 0:14:51.400 --> 0:14:54.680 what you have is you have. UM. When I was 0:14:54.760 --> 0:14:58.120 fifteen years old, which was like thirty years ago, UM, 0:14:58.320 --> 0:15:01.120 we were a group of kids in Atlanta, and some 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:03.960 of the kids were doctors and lawyers kids. Some of 0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:06.080 the kids were just regular working steps kids, and some 0:15:06.120 --> 0:15:08.520 of the kids were gang members, members of the gangs 0:15:08.520 --> 0:15:11.440 of Disciples and particulars, and and and the crypts, and 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:14.520 kids were just getting counter funcked with by the transit 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:17.520 police and the kids who were members of street fraternities 0:15:17.600 --> 0:15:19.840 or what people call gangs. That started kind of pushing back. 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:22.960 So we arranged some meetings to meet with one another 0:15:23.000 --> 0:15:24.760 to settle some disputes, and then to meet with the 0:15:24.760 --> 0:15:27.320 police and settle some disputes. And that was the beginning 0:15:27.360 --> 0:15:30.880 of an organizing career because we organized ourselves to sit 0:15:30.920 --> 0:15:34.040 across the table from the transit authority and say, hey, 0:15:34.360 --> 0:15:37.040 you can't treat us this way, and here's why. Shortly 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:39.480 after that, we decided that a larger group of kids 0:15:39.480 --> 0:15:41.520 should be able to talk. And at the time and 0:15:41.640 --> 0:15:44.680 Drew young UM Ambassador Young just off the phone, was 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:47.520 actually on another interview. He was the mayor of Atlanta, 0:15:47.520 --> 0:15:49.080 and we sat them down and said, hey, we want 0:15:49.120 --> 0:15:51.560 you to give us the money so we can take 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:54.720 um collection of what kids have to say throughout Atlanta 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:57.960 in Fulton County and the only condition is adults going 0:15:58.040 --> 0:15:59.840 to be able to come. But you guys can't say anything. 0:15:59.840 --> 0:16:02.600 You just have to listen. That started an organization called 0:16:02.640 --> 0:16:06.280 Kids for a Change. That organization, along with an organization 0:16:06.280 --> 0:16:08.280 I belonged to called Black Team to Advancements, which is 0:16:08.360 --> 0:16:11.800 all boys. Organization, helped to broker not only a peace 0:16:11.800 --> 0:16:14.720 treaty between the Martyr Coops at that time and kids. 0:16:14.800 --> 0:16:17.960 They helped to bring out the voice of over. I 0:16:18.000 --> 0:16:21.040 think we did over a few thousand kids in Fulton 0:16:21.120 --> 0:16:23.600 County and give recommendations to the county for how to 0:16:23.640 --> 0:16:27.920 improve things such as education, um get you know, how 0:16:27.960 --> 0:16:30.760 to deal with what was the education? It was police 0:16:30.800 --> 0:16:33.520 harassment and endangement, and it was something else that we 0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:35.960 pointed out. We gave those recommendations to the county and 0:16:36.000 --> 0:16:38.600 then after it was over, we shrugged our shoulders and said, 0:16:38.600 --> 0:16:40.600 there it must be more stuff to organize around. So 0:16:40.640 --> 0:16:42.800 we would pick other things, and those things could be 0:16:42.920 --> 0:16:45.480 something that simple is helping out a homeless shelters or 0:16:45.520 --> 0:16:48.400 things more complex in terms of putting different syllabus is 0:16:48.440 --> 0:16:50.800 in school to represent things that were not exactly why 0:16:50.840 --> 0:16:53.600 the angles accident Protestants. Um, I did that for a 0:16:53.680 --> 0:16:55.720 number of years, and then I came back and I 0:16:55.760 --> 0:16:58.680 taught other kids how to do it. Okay, where did 0:16:58.680 --> 0:17:03.120 this entrepreneurial spirit had come from for me selling marijuana? 0:17:04.160 --> 0:17:11.040 I mean, your father was a policeman, and did your 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:13.919 mother work outside the home. My mother was an artist 0:17:13.920 --> 0:17:16.119 by nature. She was a florist by nature, and to 0:17:16.240 --> 0:17:18.520 be very honest and adamant, my mother and father had 0:17:18.560 --> 0:17:20.600 me as teenagers, so they were never married and never 0:17:20.640 --> 0:17:23.720 lived a very like lifestyle. At one point, I woke 0:17:23.800 --> 0:17:28.000 up at fifteen years old, two three weeks before before 0:17:28.119 --> 0:17:30.960 I was before my birthday, to see that a woman 0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:33.120 was arrested and Griffin Georgia for attempted to buy sing 0:17:33.200 --> 0:17:36.160 key laws um cocagne. That was my mother. My mother 0:17:36.600 --> 0:17:38.960 at one point could have been classified as a queen 0:17:39.000 --> 0:17:42.600 pan Her and her friends, which were considered my aunt's, 0:17:42.760 --> 0:17:46.200 all dated very successful drug dealers and they all lived 0:17:46.200 --> 0:17:48.840 a lifestyle that was in conjunction with that. So my 0:17:48.880 --> 0:17:53.040 mom um, I learned entrepreneurship from her and my grandparents. 0:17:53.160 --> 0:17:56.159 You know my mom, you know, my grandpa soul liquor, 0:17:56.280 --> 0:17:58.600 my uncle's you know, did things of that nature. So 0:17:58.920 --> 0:18:01.200 what I did know is I wasn't much good for working. 0:18:01.320 --> 0:18:04.320 So my dad even said, he said, I remember sending 0:18:04.359 --> 0:18:05.879 you out to the yard to reg leves as a 0:18:05.960 --> 0:18:08.000 kid and just looking out the window like my kids 0:18:08.040 --> 0:18:11.560 never gonna works. I knew. I knew I wasn't going 0:18:11.640 --> 0:18:13.919 to work. But what I did do very young was 0:18:13.960 --> 0:18:16.800 my mom gave me twenty bucks to kurt her grass. 0:18:16.960 --> 0:18:19.720 I took our lawnmowre, paid the kids next to me, 0:18:20.160 --> 0:18:22.200 next door to me ten bucks to cut the grass, 0:18:22.560 --> 0:18:25.000 and he did it so well. I marched us around 0:18:25.000 --> 0:18:27.399 the neighborhood and got five more yards to cut. I 0:18:27.480 --> 0:18:29.760 took ten off every yard, gave him the other ten 0:18:30.160 --> 0:18:33.040 and realized, as mom, as I had the lawnmore negotiation skills, 0:18:33.040 --> 0:18:35.080 that was a lot easier than pushing the lawnmore. So, 0:18:35.440 --> 0:18:37.800 I've probably been an entrepreneur, you know, since I was 0:18:37.840 --> 0:18:41.160 ten or eleven years old. Okay, and you say your 0:18:41.160 --> 0:18:45.760 parents never lived together. Do you have half siblings? I 0:18:45.760 --> 0:18:47.879 don't have any half siblings. All my siblings are my 0:18:47.920 --> 0:18:51.120 whole siblings. I have five sisters to my mother Boar 0:18:51.400 --> 0:18:53.840 Loving and Lashonda, and three my mom to or what 0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:56.960 people would call a stepmother board, and that's Sharika, Candide 0:18:57.000 --> 0:18:59.879 and Monique. And my family were blended from top to bottom. 0:19:00.119 --> 0:19:02.520 We don't use the term step or half. Those are 0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:05.800 just your sisters. Okay, where are you in the hierarchy? 0:19:06.080 --> 0:19:10.359 I'm the oldest and only boy, and usually well those 0:19:10.400 --> 0:19:13.480 two things combined. Usually the oldest has all the hopes 0:19:13.520 --> 0:19:16.240 and dreams of the family imbued in them, and in 0:19:16.320 --> 0:19:19.160 addition being a boy, it's like a double thing. Yeah, 0:19:19.160 --> 0:19:21.520 I've been told my entire life. You know, don't be 0:19:21.560 --> 0:19:23.760 a failure because you're an example for the five people 0:19:23.840 --> 0:19:26.280 under you. And your other job is to take care 0:19:26.359 --> 0:19:28.640 of your sisters. And that doesn't mean my sisters aren't 0:19:28.680 --> 0:19:31.800 independent and dynamic women, because they are. But I have 0:19:31.880 --> 0:19:34.879 a particular interest in making sure my sisters okay, and 0:19:34.920 --> 0:19:37.119 in tire my sisters do the same for me. You know, 0:19:37.480 --> 0:19:39.960 if my sisters see I've had a problematic day publicly, 0:19:39.960 --> 0:19:42.240 they're the first people to call me privately and encourage 0:19:42.280 --> 0:19:44.960 me if there are things that I'm not aware of 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:47.320 in regards to my children, because I'm traveling a touring. 0:19:47.760 --> 0:19:50.040 My sisters are the greatest aunties and that are there. 0:19:50.400 --> 0:19:53.040 So I'm very lucky that my grandparents raised me and 0:19:53.080 --> 0:19:55.680 my sisters to be very independent and to take care 0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:59.119 of one another. And do you financially support any of 0:19:59.160 --> 0:20:02.240 these members of your family? Know? What I do is 0:20:02.280 --> 0:20:05.560 I provide economic opportunity. So I've hired and fired my 0:20:05.600 --> 0:20:08.560 own son, I've hired and fired my own nephew. My 0:20:08.640 --> 0:20:11.000 niece is dynamic, so she has been hired and been 0:20:11.080 --> 0:20:13.280 kept and it's probably going to be running what we 0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:15.359 call a store. My wife and I own barbershops, to 0:20:15.440 --> 0:20:18.320 be calling stores because we participate in retail out of them. 0:20:18.440 --> 0:20:21.080 But my family, I've told all the boys in my family, 0:20:21.080 --> 0:20:23.440 should you choose to be a barber, um, I'll put 0:20:23.480 --> 0:20:25.440 you through trade school for free and you can come 0:20:25.480 --> 0:20:28.280 work for me. So I've given him the same opportunities 0:20:28.320 --> 0:20:30.639 that my uncle, who was an entrepreneur, gave me. My 0:20:30.720 --> 0:20:33.119 uncle who was a legitimate entrepreneur. My uncle's who were 0:20:33.119 --> 0:20:35.239 illegal entrepreneurs, they didn't give me that opportunity. I had 0:20:35.280 --> 0:20:38.600 to go things on my own. But um, yeah, my 0:20:38.600 --> 0:20:40.639 wife and I married a woman. My my wife is 0:20:40.680 --> 0:20:44.360 from housing projects. When y'am across village in Savannah, Georgia, 0:20:44.520 --> 0:20:47.880 and her grandmother ran ran a shot house. Her grandmother 0:20:47.920 --> 0:20:50.560 was very enterprising. So I married a woman who who 0:20:50.640 --> 0:20:52.920 thought and taught in numbers. And she's very intelligent. So 0:20:52.960 --> 0:20:55.920 I was smart enough to marry smart and Um, through 0:20:56.000 --> 0:20:57.960 through all of my ignorance and kind of terms of 0:20:58.000 --> 0:21:00.479 finance and stuff, she's been a guy in wasn't term 0:21:00.560 --> 0:21:05.120 to protecting my ass my assets literally and figured. Okay, Jamie, 0:21:05.520 --> 0:21:07.920 you graduate from high school. What does your life look like? 0:21:08.680 --> 0:21:11.640 I did not graduate from high school. Okay, well let's 0:21:11.680 --> 0:21:16.359 go back to the beginning. Your parents, your mother and father. 0:21:16.480 --> 0:21:20.680 What were their lives looking like? My father and mother 0:21:21.080 --> 0:21:25.240 UM split up when I was six. My father left 0:21:25.520 --> 0:21:30.000 the state. UM, Me and my mother and my two sisters, 0:21:30.080 --> 0:21:32.720 one of which was the child of my mother and 0:21:32.760 --> 0:21:34.560 my father, the other which was the child of my 0:21:34.680 --> 0:21:38.840 father who he left with us. UM who was my 0:21:38.920 --> 0:21:41.560 sister as far as I was concerned, But she she wasn't. 0:21:41.800 --> 0:21:45.520 She is UM my half sister, you know by blood 0:21:46.600 --> 0:21:50.320 we moved to Brooklyn. Um and um, you know, saying, 0:21:50.320 --> 0:21:54.720 well mom, household, three kids. Um, sort of moved around. 0:21:54.880 --> 0:21:57.160 Some good years, some bad years. You know. My mother 0:21:57.240 --> 0:22:01.480 was a writer. Um, she worked in advertising. Um and 0:22:01.800 --> 0:22:05.440 uh I got yeah, I ended up getting kicked out 0:22:05.440 --> 0:22:10.600 of high school. Um and you got kicked out of 0:22:10.640 --> 0:22:16.480 high school? Why you know this day, I don't really know, 0:22:16.720 --> 0:22:18.600 but I think it was because I was an asshole. 0:22:18.720 --> 0:22:22.439 I'm pretty sure. Um, well, we've all been too high school, 0:22:22.720 --> 0:22:25.280 and there are reasons to be an asshole, and we 0:22:25.320 --> 0:22:27.400 all try to contain us. But then there are some 0:22:27.480 --> 0:22:30.880 people who were just born to make trouble. Which which one? 0:22:30.880 --> 0:22:33.159 Where do you fall on that spectrum? I think that 0:22:33.240 --> 0:22:35.040 I have a little bit of both, a little bit 0:22:35.040 --> 0:22:36.720 of both. I think I was a little bit of 0:22:36.760 --> 0:22:40.159 a smartass, for sure, But um I also had a 0:22:40.240 --> 0:22:43.560 little bit of a rough you know, uh go of it, 0:22:43.600 --> 0:22:46.080 and I was angry. Um. You know, there have been 0:22:46.160 --> 0:22:49.920 some things and you know whatever in my in my 0:22:50.000 --> 0:22:53.200 childhood that probably lent themselves towards me being a little 0:22:53.200 --> 0:22:56.920 bit more of a uh fuck you kind of kid. 0:22:57.040 --> 0:22:59.439 You know, I wasn't. I thought I was smarter than 0:22:59.480 --> 0:23:01.800 everybody in the whole school. I thought I was smarter 0:23:01.880 --> 0:23:04.960 than the teachers and the staffs. Okay, okay, thirty thirty 0:23:05.040 --> 0:23:08.439 years later, were you smarter than everybody in the whole school? 0:23:09.160 --> 0:23:12.960 Absolutely not. But what I will say is that when 0:23:13.000 --> 0:23:17.640 I did get kicked out of school, and I had 0:23:17.640 --> 0:23:21.120 the choice, but my mother was very specific. She said, Okay, well, 0:23:21.520 --> 0:23:23.920 you're either going to become the type of person who 0:23:24.119 --> 0:23:27.440 can do this, can do school and I have to 0:23:27.520 --> 0:23:29.680 not being a problem, or you're going to figure out 0:23:29.800 --> 0:23:32.000 some other thing that you're going to do, because you're 0:23:32.000 --> 0:23:34.679 not going to just be some guy who just doesn't 0:23:34.680 --> 0:23:37.920 do anything. And I told her at sixteen, I said 0:23:38.359 --> 0:23:41.800 what every white mom wants to hear, which is I'm 0:23:41.800 --> 0:23:45.320 gonna be a rapper. And uh, mom, I'm going to 0:23:45.359 --> 0:23:48.359 be a rapper. And and she and you know, she 0:23:48.440 --> 0:23:50.320 knew that I was already making music. I mean, I 0:23:50.680 --> 0:23:53.280 had already been making music and trying to make demos 0:23:53.280 --> 0:23:59.600 and stuff since I was about twelve, and and so 0:23:59.680 --> 0:24:02.080 wasn't how much was shocked to her, but I'm sure 0:24:02.119 --> 0:24:03.800 it was a little bit of one. But she she 0:24:04.320 --> 0:24:07.080 what ultimately, ultimately what happened was I ended up getting 0:24:07.080 --> 0:24:10.360 my g E. D. And I went to Musical Engineering 0:24:10.400 --> 0:24:15.160 School at sixteen, which so Center for the Media Arts, 0:24:15.359 --> 0:24:18.480 which was in Manhattan, right near F I T which 0:24:18.600 --> 0:24:21.840 now no longer exists. Um and I was. I was 0:24:22.040 --> 0:24:24.720 the youngest dude in that school. I mean, how did 0:24:24.760 --> 0:24:27.600 you how did you pay for it? My mother paid 0:24:27.640 --> 0:24:31.040 for it. My mother paid for it. Yeah, it was. 0:24:31.119 --> 0:24:35.920 It was a two year course essentially, um and uh. 0:24:36.119 --> 0:24:41.439 And you know, I was all of a sudden, I 0:24:41.480 --> 0:24:44.359 was like I was a kid trying. I just wanted 0:24:44.359 --> 0:24:46.480 to be in the studio. I just wanted to learn 0:24:46.480 --> 0:24:47.800 what it was like to be in the studio. I 0:24:47.880 --> 0:24:49.480 knew I wanted to be a producer. I knew I 0:24:49.480 --> 0:24:52.400 wanted to experience that. Um, I didn't know what else 0:24:52.440 --> 0:24:56.040 to do. But once I got there, and I was 0:24:56.080 --> 0:24:59.040 mostly surrounded by like five to thirty five year old 0:24:59.080 --> 0:25:02.080 dudes who just kind of to be engineers, you know. Um. 0:25:02.200 --> 0:25:03.920 But I was only there. I knew I was only 0:25:03.920 --> 0:25:05.440 there just to learn some of the tools of the 0:25:05.480 --> 0:25:07.680 trade and and then to go on to be a musician. 0:25:08.080 --> 0:25:10.480 But once I got there, all of a sudden, all 0:25:10.520 --> 0:25:14.600 of my disinterests, all of my um, you know, malaise 0:25:14.680 --> 0:25:17.400 and disinterest in learning, UM and all of the things 0:25:17.400 --> 0:25:20.040 that I just couldn't force myself to do. I was 0:25:20.080 --> 0:25:22.360 really bad at making myself do things I didn't want 0:25:22.359 --> 0:25:24.679 to do, and you know, school being the obvious result, 0:25:25.080 --> 0:25:27.879 and UM that changed for me completely and all of 0:25:27.960 --> 0:25:31.200 a sudden, I was I was obsessed and excelled and 0:25:31.800 --> 0:25:35.119 you know, UM so, you know, getting around music and 0:25:35.119 --> 0:25:36.920 getting around the thing that I knew that I wanted 0:25:36.920 --> 0:25:39.160 to do completely changed my life. By the time I 0:25:39.200 --> 0:25:42.320 was able to go to college, I had gotten such 0:25:42.320 --> 0:25:44.040 a high score on my g D that I had 0:25:44.040 --> 0:25:47.160 basically gotten a free ride to a few different colleges 0:25:47.200 --> 0:25:49.760 of New York that that I was able to um 0:25:50.119 --> 0:25:52.520 pick from. Well, not a free ride, I gotta almost 0:25:52.560 --> 0:25:56.480 free rode because there's a there's like a there's a 0:25:56.560 --> 0:25:59.719 quotation of like, you know g D students that they 0:25:59.720 --> 0:26:02.000 had to let into these schools. So I ended up 0:26:02.000 --> 0:26:04.520 going to and I was at the top. So I 0:26:04.560 --> 0:26:08.280 ended up going to Hunter College for you know, a 0:26:08.320 --> 0:26:10.919 couple of semesters and it was just for me. I 0:26:11.080 --> 0:26:13.479 was like, you know, I was looking around and all 0:26:13.520 --> 0:26:15.920 of a sudden, I had been rejoined. I had rejoined 0:26:16.320 --> 0:26:18.880 my age group and all of these kids who were 0:26:18.920 --> 0:26:21.639 now getting in the in the college, and I'm standing 0:26:21.640 --> 0:26:24.000 there and I'm like, I don't, like, none of these 0:26:24.000 --> 0:26:25.880 people know what they want to do. I already I'm 0:26:25.880 --> 0:26:28.400 already doing what I want to do. I don't there's 0:26:28.440 --> 0:26:31.240 no way that I want to know about this. I 0:26:31.240 --> 0:26:34.199 don't want to take history right now. And uh, I 0:26:34.240 --> 0:26:36.280 got put my first record out that you know. I 0:26:36.359 --> 0:26:38.639 ended up putting my first record out at seventeen and 0:26:38.720 --> 0:26:41.520 just being like, or eighteen, I didn't made it when 0:26:41.560 --> 0:26:43.360 I was seventeen. That came out when I was a teen, 0:26:43.760 --> 0:26:45.679 right around my first year of college. So I was 0:26:45.760 --> 0:26:48.439 just like, I'm not I'm not doing this. I'm a 0:26:48.520 --> 0:26:52.680 rap star now. Okay, Deeples says, put school behind. When 0:26:52.720 --> 0:26:59.800 do you make some money? I didn't really beg buddy 0:27:00.040 --> 0:27:05.639 still until that I was living in in a loft 0:27:05.760 --> 0:27:08.480 with by with with the other guy in the first 0:27:08.480 --> 0:27:11.840 group that I had done called Company Flow, and we 0:27:11.840 --> 0:27:16.520 were working at Tower Records mail order department on Lafayette 0:27:16.560 --> 0:27:19.280 in New York. Okay, that begs the question how much 0:27:19.320 --> 0:27:23.880 did you steal? I saw everything that wasn't sucking tied 0:27:23.880 --> 0:27:32.879 down everything. Dude, you're the van for knowing that I've had, like, 0:27:33.400 --> 0:27:35.240 straight up, let me tell you a story. So here's 0:27:35.240 --> 0:27:38.480 the thing. So we worked in this fucking mail order department. Right, 0:27:38.920 --> 0:27:41.440 there's two sections of the mail order department. There's the 0:27:41.480 --> 0:27:43.439 mail order department in the front where you have to 0:27:43.480 --> 0:27:46.359 wear shitty slacks and and and and and a wedding 0:27:46.440 --> 0:27:49.520 shirt and then and you enter in the orders on 0:27:49.960 --> 0:27:52.639 because before the Internet, of course, everyone got their records 0:27:52.720 --> 0:27:55.639 from mail order and power records. Mail order was a 0:27:55.680 --> 0:28:00.240 big deal in that Areena and so my so my 0:28:00.320 --> 0:28:02.680 other partner, my my other partner in company Flow. But 0:28:02.760 --> 0:28:05.080 one of you know who became my partner in that group, 0:28:05.240 --> 0:28:07.080 he was in the front and he was wearing shitty 0:28:07.119 --> 0:28:10.000 slacks in the shirt and he had access to the computers. 0:28:10.760 --> 0:28:13.600 I was in the back with the work release program dudes, 0:28:14.000 --> 0:28:16.479 where there was absolutely no there was no you know, 0:28:16.560 --> 0:28:18.480 I just wasn't good enough to be in the front, 0:28:18.520 --> 0:28:20.320 So I was in the back. So I was actually 0:28:20.359 --> 0:28:23.400 boxing up the records. I'm personally responsible for sending out 0:28:23.440 --> 0:28:26.920 probably ten thousand Bone Thugs and Harmony CDs to to 0:28:27.400 --> 0:28:31.520 to to the Greater America. UM and we were working, 0:28:31.520 --> 0:28:33.800 we were taking our money and we would you know, 0:28:33.880 --> 0:28:35.520 pay our rent or whatever, and then we would at 0:28:35.840 --> 0:28:38.000 night we would go to the studio and we would 0:28:38.040 --> 0:28:43.480 record these songs. So around six when um we finally 0:28:43.760 --> 0:28:47.760 got a record pressed up um with eight songs on it. 0:28:48.280 --> 0:28:50.520 UM and it was because of a mistake at the 0:28:50.560 --> 0:28:53.160 record pressing plant. It cost about half as much as 0:28:53.200 --> 0:28:57.520 it was supposed to. And what we realized was if 0:28:57.640 --> 0:29:02.240 you punching this into the computer, then I do this. 0:29:03.240 --> 0:29:05.440 We can send all this ship out all across America 0:29:05.520 --> 0:29:08.440 for free. So my first group, the first one that 0:29:08.480 --> 0:29:10.560 put me on the map, that like made noise and 0:29:10.600 --> 0:29:14.280 got me into the business. We fucking we we literally 0:29:14.280 --> 0:29:17.120 did it all on the dime of power Mail Order Department. 0:29:17.320 --> 0:29:22.080 I sent out thousands of these records to DJs all 0:29:22.080 --> 0:29:26.000 over the country overnight straight up to their like it was. 0:29:26.200 --> 0:29:29.080 It was. It was an amazing scam. And um yeah, 0:29:29.120 --> 0:29:32.600 so kudas to you for understanding that anybody who worked 0:29:32.600 --> 0:29:35.760 at Tire Records, you either either you were a life 0:29:35.960 --> 0:29:39.640 long like loser forever, you know, or you were scamming 0:29:39.680 --> 0:29:43.400 the place. And you know, absolutely, let's just go forward. 0:29:43.440 --> 0:29:46.480 You said, you know, you get a dark spot before 0:29:46.560 --> 0:29:50.320 you worked with Mike, where you were essentially broke? How 0:29:50.320 --> 0:29:55.080 did that happen? So I never took any money. I 0:29:55.120 --> 0:29:57.280 never took a salary or anything for this record label 0:29:57.280 --> 0:29:58.840 that we did. You know, we did. We created this 0:29:58.880 --> 0:30:01.440 record label. This was after my company Flow experience with 0:30:01.520 --> 0:30:04.720 Raucus Records, and I was kind of I and then 0:30:04.760 --> 0:30:06.720 company Flow broke up and I was trying to figure 0:30:06.720 --> 0:30:08.840 out my next move. I had fallen out of love 0:30:08.880 --> 0:30:11.040 with the Raucus situation. I didn't think that they were 0:30:11.080 --> 0:30:13.600 making the right moves, and I kind of felt like 0:30:13.600 --> 0:30:15.480 I knew how to do it better. Of course, you know, 0:30:15.640 --> 0:30:17.520 I didn't, but I thought I knew how to do 0:30:17.560 --> 0:30:20.840 it better, and I decided to start this record label. 0:30:21.400 --> 0:30:25.320 You know, ten years in, I still hadn't taken any money. Um, 0:30:25.360 --> 0:30:28.240 I hadn't taken a salary. I hadn't taken I hadn't 0:30:28.280 --> 0:30:31.880 you know, Um, I had sold my own record you know, 0:30:31.920 --> 0:30:33.960 I put my own records out on it a lot 0:30:34.000 --> 0:30:36.200 with a lot of other lecords that did well on 0:30:36.280 --> 0:30:38.040 an indie level. So and I did, and I had 0:30:38.080 --> 0:30:39.880 a career. I was doing show so I made money 0:30:39.920 --> 0:30:43.560 that way. But whenever the record label would hit a 0:30:43.640 --> 0:30:47.240 rough spot. I would take my money that I had 0:30:47.480 --> 0:30:51.040 and I would float the record label UM and this happened, 0:30:51.160 --> 0:30:52.640 and then I would get it back. You know, a 0:30:52.680 --> 0:30:54.480 couple of months, I get it back. We just need 0:30:54.480 --> 0:30:56.280 to get a you know, a hunder grand. We need 0:30:56.280 --> 0:30:58.080 a underground and that would be like all my money 0:30:58.080 --> 0:31:00.320 that I had, and I'd put it in and I 0:31:00.520 --> 0:31:02.560 hold my breath, and then the money will come back, 0:31:02.600 --> 0:31:03.960 and I'd be like, all right, cool, we lived to 0:31:04.000 --> 0:31:06.600 fight another day. And we did this a bunch of times. 0:31:06.960 --> 0:31:09.960 The last time that I did it, the money didn't 0:31:09.960 --> 0:31:13.600 come back, and and the whole thing collapsed and we 0:31:13.600 --> 0:31:18.280 we had. You know, what happened to us was what 0:31:18.320 --> 0:31:21.640 happened to a lot of indie record labels UM historically, 0:31:21.720 --> 0:31:24.680 and especially during the time in which the switch between 0:31:24.720 --> 0:31:27.880 the dropping physical and the profitability of streaming and all 0:31:27.960 --> 0:31:30.520 that was not leveled out. In other words, that we 0:31:30.600 --> 0:31:32.640 went from one year, you went from hundred a hundred 0:31:32.680 --> 0:31:35.200 thousands to the next year you you're sounding fifty thousand 0:31:35.280 --> 0:31:38.560 records label wyy. And but you did so well with 0:31:38.600 --> 0:31:40.920 a few records that you staffed up, You got bigger, 0:31:41.080 --> 0:31:44.360 you got an office. You gotta fucking Xerox machine, you know. 0:31:44.480 --> 0:31:47.320 And and you know, so we had a situation where 0:31:47.320 --> 0:31:50.360 we had a lot of overhead and we weren't we weren't. 0:31:50.400 --> 0:31:53.480 The physical had just been dropping, dropping and dropping, and 0:31:55.000 --> 0:31:58.200 so yeah, it just kind of collapsed out from under me. 0:31:58.440 --> 0:32:01.960 Um and and I was you know, when I look 0:32:02.000 --> 0:32:03.600 back on it now, I think it was probably the 0:32:03.640 --> 0:32:06.840 best thing that it could have ever happened for me personally, 0:32:06.840 --> 0:32:09.400 because I was miserable for a long time doing that. 0:32:09.520 --> 0:32:11.360 I wasn't happy doing it. I never wanted to be 0:32:11.360 --> 0:32:13.960 a record label guy. I just wanted to make music. 0:32:14.320 --> 0:32:16.600 I started a label because I thought it would be 0:32:16.600 --> 0:32:18.720 a cool way to work with people that I liked 0:32:18.720 --> 0:32:20.720 and put music out that I thought was good without 0:32:20.960 --> 0:32:23.400 having an audition it for the greater masses, you know, 0:32:23.560 --> 0:32:26.280 just say, hey, this is interesting, listen to it. But 0:32:26.440 --> 0:32:29.320 that's what happened. I just got I just lost my money. 0:32:29.520 --> 0:32:33.680 And where are you hundred k? That's a lot of money. 0:32:33.680 --> 0:32:38.640 Where'd you get a hundred k my royalties and touring? 0:32:38.760 --> 0:32:40.880 You know, I would I would just save my money 0:32:40.920 --> 0:32:43.960 and and and I you know, I had I had 0:32:44.440 --> 0:32:47.040 give or take. You know, you know that probably at 0:32:47.080 --> 0:32:48.880 the end that was probably that was all the money 0:32:48.920 --> 0:32:52.479 I had in the world. And um, but I had 0:32:52.520 --> 0:32:55.320 a good touring career, an indie touring career, but you know, 0:32:55.640 --> 0:32:59.200 and also we we did really well with my records. 0:32:59.480 --> 0:33:03.440 Um and for an indie label comparatively or overhead was 0:33:03.480 --> 0:33:05.840 really low obviously for you know, compared to like a 0:33:05.880 --> 0:33:09.000 major label or something. So when the operation was small 0:33:09.080 --> 0:33:11.760 and tight, I was making some money. And then the 0:33:11.840 --> 0:33:14.800 operation on the backs of those records that started to 0:33:14.880 --> 0:33:18.280 kind of get really big exposure and bow up, we 0:33:18.320 --> 0:33:20.800 started to get bigger. We started to add more people 0:33:20.920 --> 0:33:22.920 and more weight to the to the whole thing. And 0:33:22.920 --> 0:33:24.680 then it started to kind of be like, I'm not 0:33:24.760 --> 0:33:27.760 making I don't have a record label because I'm making records. 0:33:27.760 --> 0:33:30.800 I'm making records because I have a record label, like 0:33:31.160 --> 0:33:32.840 you know, And that wasn't what I wanted to do. 0:33:32.920 --> 0:33:35.719 It was very unhappy for me, and so I you know, 0:33:36.360 --> 0:33:39.000 I got myself into a situation where I lost it all. 0:33:39.040 --> 0:33:41.520 I didn't have two fucking pennies in my pocket for 0:33:41.560 --> 0:33:45.080 a minute, and um that that that was a tough 0:33:45.120 --> 0:33:47.000 period for me. But you know, I had I had 0:33:47.040 --> 0:33:49.560 been broke before. You know, I guess you know, when 0:33:49.600 --> 0:33:51.080 you start to make a little bit of money, you 0:33:51.120 --> 0:33:53.680 can forget what it's like to not have it. Um, 0:33:53.760 --> 0:33:56.200 And for me, money was never to be. I never 0:33:56.240 --> 0:33:58.200 had the type of money that I could buy things. 0:33:58.320 --> 0:33:59.840 I had the type of money where I could pay rent. 0:34:00.040 --> 0:34:01.800 Worried about it. You know, that was cool. That was 0:34:01.840 --> 0:34:07.200 my success and so in all classed underneath. And by 0:34:07.240 --> 0:34:10.640 the time Mike met me, UM, I had gone through 0:34:10.680 --> 0:34:13.279 all that. I had been humbled, a lot of relationships 0:34:13.280 --> 0:34:15.040 and a lot of things, and a lot of just 0:34:15.080 --> 0:34:19.360 sort of self regard that I had in relation to 0:34:19.400 --> 0:34:22.800 me not failing had had hit me. I had failed. 0:34:23.000 --> 0:34:25.839 There was no there was no getting around it. It was. 0:34:26.000 --> 0:34:28.239 It was gone. And I didn't know what I was 0:34:28.280 --> 0:34:30.160 gonna do. I had a lot of I had a 0:34:30.160 --> 0:34:33.520 lot of um fear. And for the first time insecurity, 0:34:33.520 --> 0:34:35.880 I mean, from sixteen on, I knew what I was 0:34:35.880 --> 0:34:37.520 gonna do, and I didn't know one had ever told 0:34:37.520 --> 0:34:39.440 me I wasn't gonna do it. And I did it, 0:34:39.560 --> 0:34:41.319 and I went out and I made it happen. And 0:34:42.120 --> 0:34:45.040 here I was, however, many years later, and for the 0:34:45.080 --> 0:34:48.840 first time that thought it occurred to me, this, this 0:34:49.360 --> 0:34:51.279 might not work now I might be, I might be 0:34:51.360 --> 0:34:57.080 over and and and then I got the deal for 0:34:57.080 --> 0:34:59.719 for the new solo record through Fat Possum Records, which 0:35:01.040 --> 0:35:04.600 changed everything for me because I um, I had a 0:35:04.640 --> 0:35:07.239 little bit of money and I finally again and I 0:35:07.280 --> 0:35:09.560 could you know, I could get an apartment that was 0:35:09.760 --> 0:35:12.440 you know that I could live in and and and 0:35:12.480 --> 0:35:14.400 that's it might meant me. Not long after that, to 0:35:14.400 --> 0:35:17.200 be honest, I was. I was right sort of starting 0:35:17.200 --> 0:35:20.000 that process of rebuilding myself, like refocused and being like, 0:35:20.040 --> 0:35:22.440 all right, I'm getting a second chance. I'm gonna I'm 0:35:22.440 --> 0:35:24.000 gonna do it right this time, and I'm gonna do 0:35:24.040 --> 0:35:25.879 it for the right reasons. And then I met Mike 0:35:25.960 --> 0:35:35.399 and everything all my all my plans changed. Okay, let's 0:35:35.400 --> 0:35:37.239 go back to Mike. So, Mike, how old you when 0:35:37.280 --> 0:35:40.880 you get married? Honestly, my wife and I have been 0:35:40.920 --> 0:35:44.840 married fourteen years this year, so it's thirty one years old. Okay, 0:35:44.840 --> 0:35:47.480 So you were estopped if you were making money when 0:35:47.480 --> 0:35:51.279 you got married, Uh, yeah, but I wasn't. So I 0:35:51.320 --> 0:35:54.520 got a major label deal first. Um was big Boy 0:35:54.600 --> 0:35:58.319 andre Um originally on Eric Quim and I Records, and 0:35:58.719 --> 0:36:00.880 I think he got like an eighties, was an advanced 0:36:00.960 --> 0:36:05.200 or whatnot? I already had two children at that point, 0:36:05.200 --> 0:36:07.680 in the third one coming, so a thirty one year old. 0:36:08.200 --> 0:36:11.960 Just just so I understand you had the children before 0:36:12.000 --> 0:36:15.920 you got married. Yeah, okay. How old were you when 0:36:15.920 --> 0:36:19.640 you had your first child? Nineteen years old? Okay? How 0:36:19.680 --> 0:36:22.279 the fund do you support? That kid? Oh? You sell 0:36:22.320 --> 0:36:31.080 the marijuana? I said, you're you established the marijuana industry 0:36:31.120 --> 0:36:36.719 that now corporations run. That's uh. You and you make 0:36:36.800 --> 0:36:41.080 good grades in school. That's okay. So the woman you're 0:36:41.080 --> 0:36:43.760 married to now your wife? How many of the kids 0:36:44.000 --> 0:36:47.560 is she the mother? We came as a package deal. Okay. 0:36:47.600 --> 0:36:49.960 She came without many and you came without many. Yeah, 0:36:50.000 --> 0:36:52.280 we cat you know, we I brought all the kids. 0:36:52.400 --> 0:36:55.680 Me and the kids came like, hey, dad loves you. 0:36:55.760 --> 0:36:59.960 Why don't you marry us? And there are five kids? 0:37:00.080 --> 0:37:03.359 You said, therefore, therefore, my wife tells people she has 0:37:03.360 --> 0:37:06.279 five children, including her husband. I get that. Let's go 0:37:06.360 --> 0:37:09.239 back to the muscle car thing. So when do you 0:37:09.280 --> 0:37:12.319 get into muscle cars? Oh? What have I not been 0:37:12.360 --> 0:37:14.400 in the muscle cars? So when I was when I 0:37:14.480 --> 0:37:17.640 was young, Um, my grandpa and grandma raised me. So 0:37:18.200 --> 0:37:20.279 my wife helped me realize I grew up rich, and 0:37:20.320 --> 0:37:22.160 I didn't know that. I always thought rich meant money, 0:37:22.160 --> 0:37:26.480 but rich really means experiences an opportunity. So my grandparents, Um, 0:37:26.480 --> 0:37:29.279 they kept the rental house, they owned the RV. They 0:37:29.320 --> 0:37:31.560 did old people ship, you know what I mean. We 0:37:31.600 --> 0:37:35.000 went on vacations, we fished, we hunted, we did old 0:37:35.080 --> 0:37:37.520 Southern people stuff that I didn't realize that the rest 0:37:37.520 --> 0:37:39.719 of the world didn't do. But one of those things 0:37:39.760 --> 0:37:44.200 was my grandfather believed in me having stuff that went fast. 0:37:44.480 --> 0:37:48.280 So he bought an old gold card and motor scooter 0:37:48.400 --> 0:37:50.680 from like the white guys he worked with. He worked 0:37:50.680 --> 0:37:52.680 in the brickyard Chattahoochee brick It was one of the 0:37:52.719 --> 0:37:55.359 more famous brick yards in Georgia. And I remember him 0:37:55.360 --> 0:37:58.000 bringing an orange gold card home and taking the old 0:37:58.040 --> 0:38:01.239 motor off and putting up plowd motor on it. So 0:38:01.280 --> 0:38:04.360 a plow motor is what she used to till the ground, 0:38:04.640 --> 0:38:06.160 or when you have a garden in a garden in 0:38:06.200 --> 0:38:07.879 the backyard. But I think this one might have been 0:38:07.960 --> 0:38:11.839 like either like four or five, four or six horsepower, 0:38:12.239 --> 0:38:13.840 and he tweaked it a little and make it a 0:38:13.880 --> 0:38:17.200 little faster. So by the time we finished building that 0:38:17.200 --> 0:38:19.479 thing and I was sipping up and down the church 0:38:19.560 --> 0:38:22.840 parking lot. Next we got a Honda Spree. I remember 0:38:22.840 --> 0:38:24.279 he got me the scooter and it was one of 0:38:24.320 --> 0:38:26.200 the lights were bent. We had to bend it back. 0:38:26.560 --> 0:38:28.680 He caught me trying to get on the Expressway at 0:38:28.719 --> 0:38:31.799 twelve years old, that with that Honda's free. I remember 0:38:31.880 --> 0:38:33.920 him just I remember, like literally from to get on 0:38:33.920 --> 0:38:35.920 the express I finally get to go fifty five and 0:38:36.040 --> 0:38:38.160 him like, god, damn it, what a man. I can 0:38:38.200 --> 0:38:40.120 hear him from them, just like, oh ship. I looked 0:38:40.160 --> 0:38:42.279 across the street and it was him. He made me 0:38:42.480 --> 0:38:44.440 take it back home, and he didn't let me drive 0:38:44.560 --> 0:38:49.600 it for like a month, but he let me borrow um. 0:38:49.640 --> 0:38:51.480 And I don't even think I had a license, you know. 0:38:51.520 --> 0:38:53.360 Oh people don't give a ship you can drive, you 0:38:53.360 --> 0:38:56.000 can drive. Let me. He let me borrow. When I 0:38:56.040 --> 0:38:59.560 got my learners and his Plymouth Vlaire which wasn't very 0:38:59.640 --> 0:39:02.799 fads but it was four doors. It was a car 0:39:02.960 --> 0:39:05.799 and Kesha Wilcox and it was a bench seat. She 0:39:05.920 --> 0:39:09.239 kissed me um, and it was after that I was 0:39:09.280 --> 0:39:11.560 just like, yo, I'm into this car. Thing, and next 0:39:11.640 --> 0:39:14.840 my grandma let me drive her Regal. But all my 0:39:15.000 --> 0:39:19.000 cousins had very fast cars. They had our rocks. My 0:39:19.040 --> 0:39:22.640 mom had a Firebird, my my I have a bio 0:39:22.760 --> 0:39:25.799 and a non bio dad. My bio dad, Big Mike, 0:39:26.200 --> 0:39:29.680 he drove a muscle car. He drove a Camaro. My 0:39:29.800 --> 0:39:33.480 non bio dad drove a four Galaxy five hundred. He 0:39:33.480 --> 0:39:35.600 had a chiveil. So I grew up in and I 0:39:35.600 --> 0:39:38.320 grew up going to drag strips and seeing races. And 0:39:38.440 --> 0:39:43.200 my grandpa ran shine. So he liked um, he liked contiacts. Um, 0:39:43.239 --> 0:39:45.520 he was into like the g T O s. He 0:39:45.600 --> 0:39:48.040 was into. He taught me to the pontiact. Judge was right. Now, 0:39:48.080 --> 0:39:50.799 I got a sixty nine Firebird. My wife has a 0:39:50.840 --> 0:39:54.360 sixty eight fire Bird. Yeah. Yeah, the Firebird with the 0:39:54.640 --> 0:39:59.400 uh the hood word Ramsey ran exactly exactly, so we 0:39:59.520 --> 0:40:01.880 all you know, I got I got l S three's, 0:40:01.880 --> 0:40:03.239 I got a l S seven in mine, I got 0:40:03.440 --> 0:40:05.960 LS three and her. So I just like going fast, 0:40:06.040 --> 0:40:08.200 you know, I like going right? Okay, that but that 0:40:08.239 --> 0:40:10.640 does beg How many cars are you on right now? 0:40:11.480 --> 0:40:14.879 I think I'm about tenants twelve? Okay, do you own 0:40:14.880 --> 0:40:19.319 a Tesla. No, I never would. No, you've been in 0:40:19.360 --> 0:40:22.239 a Tesla ass right, Yeah. I like the Tesla truck. 0:40:22.280 --> 0:40:25.799 Let me see this, not I've got very specific You 0:40:25.880 --> 0:40:28.960 like to go fast, do we know? I like the 0:40:29.000 --> 0:40:33.319 smell of gaseline and and oxygen mixing too. That's the 0:40:33.360 --> 0:40:36.040 only thing about a Tesla's you don't get the You 0:40:36.120 --> 0:40:40.319 don't get the raw smell of fuel burning. You don't 0:40:40.440 --> 0:40:43.160 get the subtle nuances like but I like them. I 0:40:43.239 --> 0:40:45.680 like the Tesla truck enough to buy, But I have 0:40:45.840 --> 0:40:49.120 not been captivated enough by Tesla car that I want 0:40:49.120 --> 0:40:51.560 to own. I already put my order in for the 0:40:51.600 --> 0:40:53.719 Tesla truck. By the way, i'd like to say that. Okay, wait, 0:40:53.760 --> 0:40:56.480 let's stay with the truck. You guys got past the 0:40:56.719 --> 0:41:01.359 how it looks. Yeah, yeah, you understand that, Bob. I'm 0:41:01.400 --> 0:41:04.560 not gonna miss out on my generation's DeLorean. Okay. It's 0:41:04.600 --> 0:41:08.000 the most ridiculous looking thing in the world, and I'm 0:41:08.040 --> 0:41:11.040 absolutely buying a ship. But I grew up on traum 0:41:11.080 --> 0:41:13.080 you know, things like that's like the low the low 0:41:13.200 --> 0:41:16.400 polygon shape. Yeah, that's that's taps right into my general 0:41:17.719 --> 0:41:21.160 How about you, Mike, who me the shape of the 0:41:21.160 --> 0:41:25.719 Tesla truck. The Tesla truck. What's crazy is I honestly 0:41:25.760 --> 0:41:28.880 think if you if you it, there's a car. I 0:41:28.880 --> 0:41:31.080 gotta remember that popped in my head the other day. 0:41:31.080 --> 0:41:34.680 I said, this son of a bitch elon musk It 0:41:34.440 --> 0:41:37.160 it is an eighties car of some type. It may 0:41:37.160 --> 0:41:40.600 even be the DeLorean turned backwards. So if you look 0:41:40.640 --> 0:41:43.279 at the Tesla truck, the front of it is the 0:41:43.360 --> 0:41:46.320 ass of a DeLorean. But if you turn it backwards. 0:41:46.320 --> 0:41:48.879 But yeah, I'm just it just looks like at any 0:41:48.960 --> 0:41:52.160 moment it's gonna turn into a Transformer. So I like 0:41:52.280 --> 0:41:55.160 it for the novelty. So but I drive with that said, 0:41:55.239 --> 0:41:58.160 my wife bought me a FOURD f to fifty super 0:41:58.239 --> 0:42:02.040 duty diesel for for my birthday. So again, man, I'm 0:42:02.080 --> 0:42:04.960 just a believer in Bernard fossil fuels, those dining staurs that. 0:42:05.719 --> 0:42:08.000 But I want to be specific. I drive a fossil 0:42:08.040 --> 0:42:13.799 fuel car myself. Yeah, but being in people's testlas, the 0:42:13.840 --> 0:42:18.759 acceleration is mind blowing crazy crazy. Yeah, no idea has 0:42:18.800 --> 0:42:21.759 a Tesla. But it's it's there's a certain there's a 0:42:21.800 --> 0:42:24.479 certain danger that you miss. Like I like the test flat, 0:42:24.520 --> 0:42:27.239 it's it pulls fast. I like the fact that you 0:42:27.280 --> 0:42:29.240 could don't have to drive it. You could get stone, 0:42:29.280 --> 0:42:32.040 gonna sleep and wake up in your home. The problem 0:42:32.200 --> 0:42:36.719 is driving my hellcat. Death is always next to me. 0:42:37.239 --> 0:42:39.920 The fact that the fact that I'm seven hundred and 0:42:39.960 --> 0:42:42.560 seven horse a hunted and I think I've gotten her 0:42:42.600 --> 0:42:44.359 up to a hundred and sixty four mile an hour 0:42:44.480 --> 0:42:47.400 on the regular street. The fact that I know this 0:42:47.520 --> 0:42:49.319 could be the moment to die, so me make sure 0:42:49.360 --> 0:42:52.240 you're listening to good music. That that danger. I'm missing 0:42:52.280 --> 0:42:54.960 a Tesla. It's kind of like driving a Vovo. It's 0:42:54.960 --> 0:42:59.040 it's just you're safe. Zack Zack dell Rocha has a 0:42:59.160 --> 0:43:05.160 Testla act and riding around in his Tetla, I don't. 0:43:05.200 --> 0:43:07.759 I rarely feel like I'm on a roller coaster. And 0:43:07.840 --> 0:43:09.759 when I'm in a car, like going from gero to 0:43:09.920 --> 0:43:13.319 sixty and however quickly that happens in a Tesla act, 0:43:14.160 --> 0:43:17.000 it's that ship feels dangerous. I have to admit I 0:43:17.000 --> 0:43:19.319 know it. I think so too. You know, I don't know. 0:43:19.640 --> 0:43:24.000 And it's silent. It's just a battery, you know. Okay, Okay, 0:43:24.080 --> 0:43:25.800 let's go back to Mike and you're talking to the 0:43:25.920 --> 0:43:28.080 LS three, the L seven, etcetera. But what do we know? 0:43:28.280 --> 0:43:31.080 The American cars are good in the street line, yeah, 0:43:31.680 --> 0:43:36.480 and the European The European cars he handled, generally speaking better. 0:43:36.560 --> 0:43:39.920 So is this a religious issue? It must be American? No. 0:43:40.280 --> 0:43:44.120 I I tell people I like American muscling, like German performance. 0:43:44.440 --> 0:43:47.759 So for my fiftieth birthday, I'm gonna I'm gonna, I'm 0:43:47.800 --> 0:43:49.959 gonna get it. I'm gonna get that Porsche. I'm gonna 0:43:50.000 --> 0:43:52.200 do what you're supposed to do when you're old. I 0:43:52.400 --> 0:43:54.880 get that, get to get a quarter million dollar Porsche. 0:43:55.280 --> 0:43:59.680 My wife, My wife, My wife drives. I bought her 0:43:59.719 --> 0:44:02.000 and that's five fifty that I drive like a fucking 0:44:02.080 --> 0:44:04.719 race car. Absolutely love. I wanted her to get to 0:44:04.960 --> 0:44:06.719 sixty three and as sixty five, and she was like 0:44:06.840 --> 0:44:10.279 absolutely not. Um So I'm a I'm a big fan 0:44:10.320 --> 0:44:12.560 of German cars. I'm a big fan of the performance 0:44:12.560 --> 0:44:15.680 she's I remember she had a little she had to 0:44:15.920 --> 0:44:18.319 m him four or five BMW. But I drove that 0:44:18.320 --> 0:44:20.200 god damn car like a race car. In fact, she 0:44:20.360 --> 0:44:23.239 had a Honda Accord V six that I drove on 0:44:23.239 --> 0:44:26.440 an everyday basis, just because I liked the acceleration of it. 0:44:26.520 --> 0:44:29.160 So no, it's not it's not American or nothing for me. 0:44:29.239 --> 0:44:31.840 But if someone's putting two cars on the headstone or 0:44:31.880 --> 0:44:35.040 a couple of companies, it's probably definitely gonna be Chevrolet 0:44:35.040 --> 0:44:37.759 and Mercedes bench through me. Okay, let's go to Let's 0:44:37.800 --> 0:44:39.919 go to Dodge, Let's go to the hell cap. How 0:44:39.960 --> 0:44:43.000 long do the tires last? I go through about it? 0:44:43.120 --> 0:44:46.200 I spent about two a month on top of go 0:44:46.239 --> 0:44:48.799 through about a new set about every thirty forty five days, 0:44:48.920 --> 0:44:51.560 every thirty or forty five days. Yeah, if I don't 0:44:51.560 --> 0:44:53.120 buy a pair of new ties a month, I just 0:44:53.120 --> 0:44:58.640 then drive a car a lot. Okay, let's go to you, Jamie. 0:44:59.040 --> 0:45:03.239 Mike is known as be very political. Are you political 0:45:03.400 --> 0:45:05.279 or did Mike make you political? Or you're more a 0:45:05.400 --> 0:45:09.879 political I'm just not as I'm just not as out 0:45:09.880 --> 0:45:12.319 there as Mike is in terms of actually literally being 0:45:12.320 --> 0:45:14.120 in the political spectrum. But I think that if you 0:45:14.160 --> 0:45:16.600 look back at my career in my catalog, and what 0:45:16.600 --> 0:45:19.080 I've been talking about is very consistent with what I 0:45:19.120 --> 0:45:22.280 do now, which is that I absolutely have been talking 0:45:22.320 --> 0:45:27.080 about um sort of macro political perspective stuff. Um, for sure, 0:45:27.239 --> 0:45:29.560 we just have a different um tack in the way 0:45:29.560 --> 0:45:32.359 that we approach it. And I really like Mike's tack. 0:45:32.440 --> 0:45:34.959 I really it's really cool to know, to be down 0:45:35.000 --> 0:45:36.719 with some Mike. What I'll tell you. I'll tell you 0:45:36.719 --> 0:45:39.279 what Mike did do for me, because when me and 0:45:39.320 --> 0:45:41.400 Mike met, we one of the things that we bonded 0:45:41.400 --> 0:45:45.600 on was that we had a very similar perspective political perspective, 0:45:45.640 --> 0:45:48.120 and that we had that we shared a few really 0:45:48.160 --> 0:45:52.440 fundamental ideas about the power structure in this world and 0:45:52.719 --> 0:45:55.279 about the abuses that that that come out of it, 0:45:55.719 --> 0:45:59.000 um and And there are a lot of differences in 0:45:59.080 --> 0:46:01.680 approach and experience in the way that we've looked at 0:46:01.719 --> 0:46:03.920 things UM and that translated in the way that we 0:46:04.000 --> 0:46:08.319 do what we do. I guess I've in records I 0:46:08.360 --> 0:46:11.560 am mostly philosophical about it, where it might tends to 0:46:11.640 --> 0:46:14.359 be very direct about it, and he gets you know, UM, 0:46:14.920 --> 0:46:18.040 but I think that we've discovered that together those perspectives 0:46:18.200 --> 0:46:21.759 work really well. Often, like you know, I'm I'm, I 0:46:21.880 --> 0:46:25.320 end up being macro and and and sort of um 0:46:25.320 --> 0:46:29.799 philosophical about the relationship between you know, people and the 0:46:29.800 --> 0:46:33.200 power structures that are and Mike gets into it UM 0:46:33.320 --> 0:46:35.040 from a sort of feed on the ground level, and 0:46:35.040 --> 0:46:37.440 it's made these it's it's kind of given us this 0:46:37.760 --> 0:46:40.160 really cool thing that neither of us had when we 0:46:40.160 --> 0:46:43.840 were making our music separately. But yes, I've been political 0:46:44.000 --> 0:46:49.080 in my perspective, but what Mike did for me in 0:46:49.200 --> 0:46:55.719 terms of literal politics in the sense that UM, well, 0:46:57.239 --> 0:46:59.440 a few things. But but it's really nice to know 0:46:59.560 --> 0:47:03.520 somebody who's who has genuinely been involved on on the 0:47:03.680 --> 0:47:06.959 technical level of politics. You know. For for for my life, 0:47:06.960 --> 0:47:09.240 it has never been about that. It's always been about 0:47:09.719 --> 0:47:11.880 my perspective. It's always been about what I read. It's 0:47:11.880 --> 0:47:13.560 always been about what I've seen, and so always been 0:47:13.600 --> 0:47:16.480 about how I felt about things. It hasn't necessarily been 0:47:16.520 --> 0:47:19.520 about UM. It hasn't been like Mike, where Mike is 0:47:19.560 --> 0:47:23.000 literally stumping for a presidential candidate. That's not where I 0:47:23.120 --> 0:47:26.920 have been and that's not where I leaned towards UM. 0:47:26.960 --> 0:47:29.600 So that's the answer to that question. But you know, 0:47:29.960 --> 0:47:32.960 there's the thing that worked with me and Mike was 0:47:33.000 --> 0:47:36.400 that we both did have long histories of writing about 0:47:38.040 --> 0:47:41.520 the dynamics of power and and that was something that 0:47:41.600 --> 0:47:45.640 we could find um uh common ground and in terms 0:47:45.640 --> 0:47:48.399 of making songs together because it's something that we both 0:47:48.440 --> 0:47:51.839 want to express and we just had our different ways 0:47:51.840 --> 0:47:54.319 of doing it. I really like the fact that I 0:47:54.360 --> 0:47:56.279 have might to balance me out, and I think that 0:47:56.320 --> 0:48:01.040 it works both ways a bit, you know. Um Yeah, Okay, Mike, 0:48:01.440 --> 0:48:03.440 that's it. That's all you wanted. I thought he wanted 0:48:03.480 --> 0:48:06.520 for me, Bob, than the answer to the question we 0:48:06.600 --> 0:48:12.480 go do with? You know, it's not like nor am 0:48:12.480 --> 0:48:21.040 I but I'm over here ordering a Tesla truck. What's 0:48:21.040 --> 0:48:23.440 the final number gonna be on that Tesla truck? They 0:48:23.480 --> 0:48:25.400 got it? The one I liked about sixty nine or 0:48:25.440 --> 0:48:29.960 probably costs about eighty. Is there a rebateing Georgia on 0:48:30.120 --> 0:48:33.600 electric cars? Yeah? That I think. I think they finally 0:48:33.640 --> 0:48:35.719 I think we finally got progressive enough to do that. 0:48:35.800 --> 0:48:38.320 I think we got u They got the best parking 0:48:38.360 --> 0:48:40.919 spots at all the fancy malls now, so there has 0:48:40.960 --> 0:48:43.040 to be some type of rebated rich people are buying 0:48:43.080 --> 0:48:47.080 them like that. Okay, Mike, let's say, as he seems 0:48:47.120 --> 0:48:53.360 to be saying, Trump does not leave office, what happens, Well, 0:48:53.400 --> 0:48:55.440 one or two things happens. Either we comply on the 0:48:55.520 --> 0:48:58.279 tyranny or we do what the founding forefathers of this 0:48:58.320 --> 0:49:01.840 country did, and we rebelled against it. It's it's not 0:49:01.280 --> 0:49:04.080 a not as hard, you know, it's not very difficult. 0:49:04.400 --> 0:49:07.399 The question is will we comply with tyranny or will 0:49:07.440 --> 0:49:09.920 we do what the principles of this nation require us 0:49:09.920 --> 0:49:13.000 to do? And that's um, you know, that's resists here 0:49:13.000 --> 0:49:17.200 and he had all costs. Well, what would that look like? Well, 0:49:17.200 --> 0:49:19.520 I don't know what it will look like. Um. On 0:49:19.520 --> 0:49:22.279 one hand, it could look like all workers refusing to 0:49:22.360 --> 0:49:25.560 produce or go into work and halting the country. On 0:49:25.600 --> 0:49:28.880 another hand, it could mean all consumers refused to participate 0:49:28.920 --> 0:49:31.960 in anything except food consumption or medicine buying. In the 0:49:31.960 --> 0:49:34.799 worst case scenario, we could mean the dire use of 0:49:34.800 --> 0:49:37.640 our Second Amendment rights and taking up farms versus the government. 0:49:38.000 --> 0:49:40.200 That's one that I don't wish to see, but I 0:49:40.239 --> 0:49:43.239 think that we should exhaust every means and measure before that. 0:49:43.560 --> 0:49:46.120 But I do believe in protecting that right since that's 0:49:46.200 --> 0:49:48.440 kind of what got us here. Well, if we look 0:49:48.440 --> 0:49:53.799 at George Floyd six months ago, there was spontaneous combustion, Okay, 0:49:53.920 --> 0:49:57.000 there were there we since Ferguson, there was heat etcetera. 0:49:57.480 --> 0:50:00.279 And it unexpectedly happened and then it spread it really 0:50:00.360 --> 0:50:03.640 around the world. Well, it's always it's always happening. I 0:50:03.680 --> 0:50:06.400 think that as important as a as a former activist 0:50:06.440 --> 0:50:09.960 and always advocate, it's important to note that this is 0:50:10.120 --> 0:50:15.080 always happening. In when the Los Angeles riots happening, rioting 0:50:15.239 --> 0:50:19.200 happened nationwide, didn't happen everywhere, but it happened in major 0:50:19.280 --> 0:50:23.280 hot spots. There were stuff popped up in Houston, Louisiana, Atlanta. 0:50:23.400 --> 0:50:26.000 I write it personally as a high school student. Right, 0:50:26.200 --> 0:50:28.040 we went to the foot lockers, sooking, we get some 0:50:28.080 --> 0:50:30.520 mair Force ones in their Jordan's you know, we did 0:50:30.600 --> 0:50:34.600 what what you did. When you compress pain and anguish 0:50:34.640 --> 0:50:37.440 and anxiety, it does explode. So I don't, you know, 0:50:37.560 --> 0:50:39.840 I don't. I don't think that, um, the sponineity we 0:50:39.840 --> 0:50:41.960 should be surprised by it, because people do a lot 0:50:42.239 --> 0:50:44.080 to kind of try to stay in line and believe 0:50:44.160 --> 0:50:46.840 that that that the that the ark of the universe 0:50:46.840 --> 0:50:50.560 bench towards justice, even when it feels like it doesn't. Um, 0:50:50.640 --> 0:50:54.399 you know, but I just and and okay, a couple 0:50:54.440 --> 0:50:56.160 of things and you can jump in here Jamie too. 0:50:56.160 --> 0:50:59.359 If you want, yes, I hear you that they were 0:50:59.400 --> 0:51:03.759 writing another place, uh writing demonstrating. They were demonstrating in 0:51:03.880 --> 0:51:07.040 Idaho trying. Let me tell you the most beautiful thing 0:51:07.080 --> 0:51:11.160 I saw, The most beautiful thing I saw because a 0:51:11.200 --> 0:51:13.520 lot of people don't understand that the Rainbow Coalition is 0:51:13.520 --> 0:51:16.120 something we've always heard Jesse Jackson talk about and it's 0:51:16.120 --> 0:51:19.280 been an abstract thing. But the Rainbow Coalition was started, 0:51:20.000 --> 0:51:23.719 was started, was started by Fred Hampton, twenty one year 0:51:23.760 --> 0:51:27.919 old christ like figure, amazing organizing educator in the Black 0:51:27.920 --> 0:51:31.120 Panther Party and the Check Illinois Chapter and um. The 0:51:31.239 --> 0:51:35.640 Rainbow Coalition brought everyone together, poor people, gay people, white people, 0:51:35.960 --> 0:51:38.879 and Native people, um Asian people. It was for all 0:51:38.920 --> 0:51:41.319 of us. The most beautiful I saw things I saw 0:51:41.360 --> 0:51:45.640 doing all these demonstrations riots were when Amish protesters showed up. 0:51:46.120 --> 0:51:48.920 When I saw the Amish show up, I literally wanted 0:51:48.920 --> 0:51:51.520 to say to the State of America, shame on you. 0:51:52.000 --> 0:51:56.279 These are probably the most enclosed, insulated people in these 0:51:56.400 --> 0:51:59.520 United States. And for them to show up on the 0:51:59.560 --> 0:52:02.800 behalf of a black man being killed by an agent 0:52:02.840 --> 0:52:06.600 of the state shows you that the propaganda that everything 0:52:06.719 --> 0:52:11.360 is okay it's bullshit. When the Amish, the fucking Amish, 0:52:11.400 --> 0:52:15.239 pop up buggies and horses and told, I imagine to 0:52:15.320 --> 0:52:18.400 say enough is enough. We as a country should know, Okay, 0:52:18.440 --> 0:52:20.720 we're sucking up. We need to reset this ship. Because 0:52:20.840 --> 0:52:23.279 they like the Amish, got big screen TVs watching, got 0:52:23.320 --> 0:52:25.799 d M, CNN every night. They got the word through 0:52:25.800 --> 0:52:27.719 a bird, you know what I mean. So I was 0:52:27.840 --> 0:52:30.239 really I would like to thank the Amish community and 0:52:30.239 --> 0:52:32.680 the Mennonite community out of Ohio, which one of my 0:52:32.719 --> 0:52:35.600 mentors is. But they have been amazing in this fight, 0:52:35.719 --> 0:52:38.960 protracted and and even in the short term, just them 0:52:39.040 --> 0:52:43.200 showing up has been an amazing thing. Okay, you're well 0:52:43.239 --> 0:52:47.600 known as a Bernie Sanders supporter. Bernie came very close in. 0:52:48.680 --> 0:52:51.200 I was a Warren person until she blew herself up 0:52:51.200 --> 0:52:55.040 on the healthcare and I was a Bernie person. I 0:52:55.120 --> 0:53:00.000 like Bernie, who I certainly voted for in the primary 0:53:00.040 --> 0:53:03.800 or whatever. Why did it not happen for Bernie? Two questions? 0:53:03.840 --> 0:53:07.360 Why did it generally not happen forgetting that the everybody 0:53:07.400 --> 0:53:12.200 coalescent dropped out and conspired with Biden, But why did 0:53:12.239 --> 0:53:16.160 the youth not come out? Well, the the youth. The 0:53:16.280 --> 0:53:20.120 youth I want to come out. They did come out, 0:53:20.880 --> 0:53:24.840 um in places that they felt heard and seen. I 0:53:24.960 --> 0:53:27.760 think that the South is I know that the South 0:53:27.840 --> 0:53:32.520 is fifty black. I wish that the Sanders campaign after 0:53:33.440 --> 0:53:36.799 would have kept representatives in South Carolina in particular, and 0:53:36.840 --> 0:53:39.200 in places like Georgia where they could have where we 0:53:39.239 --> 0:53:41.360 could flit the state. I wish that they would have 0:53:41.400 --> 0:53:43.640 worked the next three and a half four years, people 0:53:43.719 --> 0:53:47.120 like um Nina Turner, other people that were notable, like 0:53:47.200 --> 0:53:50.759 Cordell West, people that were a part of his campaign. 0:53:51.000 --> 0:53:54.239 Um my brother mar reached out in Georgia that ended up, 0:53:54.320 --> 0:53:56.600 you know, not coming back. I wish that they had 0:53:56.840 --> 0:53:59.440 had an opportunity or I wish this campaign would have 0:53:59.480 --> 0:54:02.520 understood the importance of three and three and a half 0:54:02.640 --> 0:54:07.520 years of relationship building because in the South we tend 0:54:07.520 --> 0:54:11.400 to be total line Democrats, because Democrats and the federal 0:54:11.440 --> 0:54:14.560 government have been the safe haven amidst some of the 0:54:14.600 --> 0:54:19.160 most dire racism and bigotry through legislation that you've ever seen. 0:54:19.600 --> 0:54:22.799 And it's very hard to trust the greater good, even 0:54:22.880 --> 0:54:25.719 though you know it's the greater good, when you have 0:54:26.120 --> 0:54:29.719 only been able to depend on one particular party and 0:54:29.760 --> 0:54:33.040 the federal government even more so than your local municipalities. 0:54:33.239 --> 0:54:36.400 So when that party says fall in line, your leadership 0:54:36.440 --> 0:54:38.359 tends to fall in line, and they tend to ask 0:54:38.440 --> 0:54:41.960 of you to fall in line, simply because even though 0:54:42.000 --> 0:54:45.160 you are what Bernie Sanders campaign was exactly what black 0:54:45.160 --> 0:54:47.920 people have asked for. It was exactly what the doctor 0:54:48.000 --> 0:54:50.560 King campaign of his last two years has said that 0:54:50.600 --> 0:54:53.959 we needed, including but not limited to once not being 0:54:54.000 --> 0:54:56.480 pro reparations, saying that he would be willing to sign 0:54:56.480 --> 0:55:00.520 the HR forty reparations bill to study reparations like Commers 0:55:00.560 --> 0:55:03.880 had tried to get past this nine including that that 0:55:03.960 --> 0:55:06.160 would have happened. But to be honest, it's just fear. 0:55:06.520 --> 0:55:09.879 There's fear mongering on both sides. Donald Trump is trying 0:55:09.920 --> 0:55:12.560 to win an election right now under law and order. 0:55:12.880 --> 0:55:15.239 If that's not one of the most fascist statements I've 0:55:15.280 --> 0:55:17.399 ever heard, I don't know what is law in order 0:55:17.400 --> 0:55:20.600 to think about that. Law and order over humanity, law 0:55:20.600 --> 0:55:24.160 and order over over over basic morality in this country, 0:55:24.239 --> 0:55:26.600 law and order over your rights. It is equivalent to 0:55:26.600 --> 0:55:29.359 see in the Seattle police officer ride over the head 0:55:29.440 --> 0:55:32.160 of a protester that's that's painted on a bicycle. So 0:55:32.480 --> 0:55:35.400 you know, with Sanders, I think that in the South, 0:55:36.200 --> 0:55:38.480 we could have had a better strategy or the campaign 0:55:38.520 --> 0:55:40.919 could have had a better strategy for how to get 0:55:40.960 --> 0:55:43.080 to know Mr Sanders better and how to get to 0:55:43.080 --> 0:55:46.200 know him more. I feel like they found or they 0:55:46.320 --> 0:55:50.040 made a caricature of him. The National Democratic Party, I think, 0:55:50.120 --> 0:55:52.680 and I think that there was some nefarious things that 0:55:52.719 --> 0:55:55.160 happened on the ground which I saw personally in terms 0:55:55.160 --> 0:55:58.000 of the national part of the undermining him. And I 0:55:58.040 --> 0:56:01.840 think that um and even in his absence, though locally 0:56:01.880 --> 0:56:04.680 he won. If you look at a place like Atlanta, Hartston, 0:56:04.719 --> 0:56:07.480 Georgia had a guy named Mayor Ted who was progressive 0:56:07.600 --> 0:56:11.279 enough to decriminalize marijuana before Atlanta, the Cab County or 0:56:11.280 --> 0:56:13.520 any of those other counties with black leadership and a 0:56:13.560 --> 0:56:16.719 majority black vote. Ted is now taking a six commissioned 0:56:16.719 --> 0:56:18.560 seat in the Cab County, one of the more powerful 0:56:18.560 --> 0:56:21.239 seats there. He was the only candidate in the local 0:56:21.239 --> 0:56:24.480 elections that I publicly endorsed. He won his candidacy, and 0:56:24.520 --> 0:56:26.480 we're going to see that that county, which is a 0:56:26.520 --> 0:56:29.879 soldad county, become an even more progressive County now under 0:56:29.920 --> 0:56:32.680 the leadership of Michael Thurman, the CEO there, who's a 0:56:32.719 --> 0:56:35.279 brother I like a lot, and Paple like Mayor Ted. 0:56:35.440 --> 0:56:39.160 So ultimately, I think Sanders did not lose because if 0:56:39.160 --> 0:56:41.560 you look at it around the around the country now 0:56:41.600 --> 0:56:44.120 I'm seeing more progressives get elected. But I wish I 0:56:44.160 --> 0:56:45.840 could have seen him take fellow office and be the 0:56:45.880 --> 0:56:48.560 President of the United States. Okay, let's just snap our 0:56:48.600 --> 0:56:52.160 fingers and Biden his president. That's a huge snap. But 0:56:52.200 --> 0:56:57.120 for the sake of this conversation, now, Okay, as someone 0:56:57.280 --> 0:57:03.040 who supported Sanders, if Biden's in there much better than Trump, 0:57:03.120 --> 0:57:05.680 and I will vote for Biden. But are the problems, 0:57:05.719 --> 0:57:10.200 the endemic problems of this country really going to be addressed? No, no, 0:57:10.400 --> 0:57:13.520 not unless we pushed the line. And the reason I 0:57:13.560 --> 0:57:15.719 say that is the endemic problems in this country are 0:57:15.719 --> 0:57:18.720 not going to be addressed because we've allowed lobbyists and 0:57:18.800 --> 0:57:21.480 money um to corrupt the political class for over a 0:57:21.520 --> 0:57:23.880 hundred years, and at some point we're going to have 0:57:23.920 --> 0:57:26.600 to take stock of that. There is there is there 0:57:26.680 --> 0:57:28.960 is trepidation that we move with as the people who 0:57:28.960 --> 0:57:31.000 pay our taxes, that we shouldn't move with. We should 0:57:31.040 --> 0:57:33.360 be bold in our moves. I met with the governor 0:57:33.400 --> 0:57:36.560 of Georgia UM a couple of weeks ago. Some people 0:57:36.640 --> 0:57:39.120 were encouraged by that, some people were not. Didn't matter 0:57:39.160 --> 0:57:40.840 to me much. I pay my taxes in the state 0:57:40.920 --> 0:57:43.080 of Georgia. I'm going to talk to the leader because 0:57:43.120 --> 0:57:44.720 I think that there are things that this state that 0:57:44.960 --> 0:57:47.760 used to better help my community. So no matter who 0:57:47.760 --> 0:57:50.600 becomes president, we must be prepared to push the line 0:57:50.920 --> 0:57:53.720 out of my meeting, seventy young black men out of 0:57:53.720 --> 0:57:55.840 my zip CO and women are going to be able 0:57:55.880 --> 0:57:58.640 to get a free trade school education. Out of my 0:57:58.760 --> 0:58:01.919 meeting with the governor who's Republican. That meeting, I get 0:58:01.960 --> 0:58:04.040 to talk to and help form a campaign that's gonna 0:58:04.080 --> 0:58:06.680 make your working class and poor kids get an opportunity 0:58:06.720 --> 0:58:08.480 to go to trade school because they aren't doing an 0:58:08.480 --> 0:58:11.000 effective job of talking to those And that happens out 0:58:11.000 --> 0:58:13.240 of that So and in matters of you know, what 0:58:13.360 --> 0:58:15.520 happens with Joe is like, what are we gonna push 0:58:15.560 --> 0:58:17.960 the Democrats in the Democratic Party to do if we 0:58:18.000 --> 0:58:21.640 flipped Georgia. We have more black legislators than any other 0:58:21.760 --> 0:58:24.840 state under under an old Gold Dome. But our legislation 0:58:24.880 --> 0:58:27.160 doesn't look like that. So we have to start to 0:58:27.280 --> 0:58:30.480 radically redefine how we do politics in this country. We 0:58:30.560 --> 0:58:32.760 have to bring politics back down to a very local 0:58:32.760 --> 0:58:35.640 and statewide level. We have to stop allowing big money 0:58:35.680 --> 0:58:39.520 to Trump, you know, contended the interests of the working 0:58:39.520 --> 0:58:42.320 classman and woman in this country, or we're going to 0:58:42.360 --> 0:58:44.600 give this country to the one percent for the rest 0:58:44.640 --> 0:58:47.040 of its existence. And we're gonna have to contend with 0:58:47.080 --> 0:58:49.320 the fact that we allowed that to happen on our watch, 0:58:49.600 --> 0:58:51.439 and we don't have to. You have to be more 0:58:51.440 --> 0:58:54.360 politically active than just voting. And I'm not saying that 0:58:54.440 --> 0:58:57.120 from a place on high as a celebrity that's smoking 0:58:57.160 --> 0:58:59.360 weed and going to strip clubs. I'm saying that as 0:58:59.400 --> 0:59:03.080 the five year child next to a woman from Tuskegee, Alabama, 0:59:03.160 --> 0:59:07.760 who drugged me to every political campaign from Carter to 0:59:08.000 --> 0:59:13.520 Reagan to versus Reagan to Mondale, versus Reagan to do Cacusa. 0:59:13.680 --> 0:59:16.800 But like I remember virtually every local campaign because my 0:59:16.840 --> 0:59:19.720 grandmother made sure I was there. And I'm thinking that 0:59:19.760 --> 0:59:22.560 we need a resurgence of that type of local fire. 0:59:22.880 --> 0:59:25.000 It isn't about how many less celebrities can do a 0:59:25.080 --> 0:59:27.439 drop and say come out. It's about that one lady 0:59:27.440 --> 0:59:29.480 that's making sure nine other people get to the polls. 0:59:29.680 --> 0:59:31.360 How are we gonna help her? How are we going 0:59:31.400 --> 0:59:32.960 to make sure there's a van there for them in 0:59:33.040 --> 0:59:35.120 sandwiches and they got orange use and they don't have 0:59:35.160 --> 0:59:37.000 to stand in line for six hours. Those are the 0:59:37.040 --> 0:59:39.800 things we're gonna have to do to truly hold whoever 0:59:39.920 --> 0:59:43.000 is president accountable, because if we don't, we've just given 0:59:43.000 --> 0:59:51.600 this country over to the people that pay. Okay, both 0:59:51.640 --> 0:59:55.840 of you. In today's world, the internet rules. And if 0:59:55.880 --> 0:59:59.200 you go to Spotify, which is the largest streaming service, 0:59:59.600 --> 1:00:05.160 and you' of the Spotify top fifty dominated by hip hop. Okay, 1:00:06.400 --> 1:00:12.640 and as much as African Americans adopt hip hop culture, 1:00:12.720 --> 1:00:17.360 it's astounding how many whites adopt hip hop culture. You know, 1:00:17.480 --> 1:00:19.800 I grew up in an era where you literally could 1:00:19.800 --> 1:00:23.080 see in the sixties who were the Republicans. How do 1:00:23.160 --> 1:00:28.880 you explain that these people are fans of hip hop 1:00:29.000 --> 1:00:34.320 yet they vote for Trump. Cognitive dissonance, I think is 1:00:34.360 --> 1:00:38.160 what there's other words they're looking for. You know, um, 1:00:38.280 --> 1:00:43.479 I don't understand it personally, but I think that you're 1:00:43.520 --> 1:00:47.000 just also contending with the fact that hip hop is 1:00:47.080 --> 1:00:50.280 just that good, it's just that dominant, it's just that exciting, 1:00:50.360 --> 1:00:54.440 it's just become that ubiquitous, you know. I mean, it 1:00:54.480 --> 1:01:00.440 is the last uh you know, great um art form 1:01:00.600 --> 1:01:03.800 created in music that that you can that you can 1:01:03.840 --> 1:01:06.560 point to and say, this is new, this is a force. 1:01:07.040 --> 1:01:09.240 I mean, me and Mike grew up in a time 1:01:09.240 --> 1:01:12.640 where just telling people, just telling anyone over the age 1:01:12.680 --> 1:01:15.040 of thirty that you were going to be a rapper 1:01:15.160 --> 1:01:17.760 or do or be involved in hip hop music, you 1:01:17.800 --> 1:01:20.160 had to get the pre records in lecture about how 1:01:20.480 --> 1:01:23.560 it's just a fad, kid, it's just a fad like disco. 1:01:23.680 --> 1:01:26.040 Trust me, I was there. I saw it. You know, 1:01:26.320 --> 1:01:32.640 there was in We Gone in the year you know. So, 1:01:33.000 --> 1:01:35.880 I mean, you know, I I almost think that to 1:01:36.040 --> 1:01:40.760 some degree, it's it's it's a question that is rooted 1:01:40.800 --> 1:01:43.080 a little bit in the idea that it's still a 1:01:43.120 --> 1:01:46.000 surprise that hip hop is as such a dominant force 1:01:46.040 --> 1:01:49.480 in music as it is. But you know the truth 1:01:49.600 --> 1:01:52.040 is that we also contend with that. You know, we 1:01:52.120 --> 1:01:54.280 have people kind of you know, there are people that 1:01:54.400 --> 1:01:57.240 said us like, you know, I love I love you guys, 1:01:57.280 --> 1:02:00.360 but I don't agree with any your politics and it's 1:02:00.400 --> 1:02:03.960 just like wow, you know, you know, and your already 1:02:04.000 --> 1:02:07.880 response to that is like it's like, well a, thanks 1:02:07.960 --> 1:02:11.920 for the love and be I'm willing, I'm I'm okay 1:02:12.000 --> 1:02:14.400 for you to go listen to the music a little closer, 1:02:14.840 --> 1:02:17.840 and uh, it's okay with me if you change your 1:02:17.880 --> 1:02:21.520 mind there nobody UM not a big deal. We're pretty 1:02:21.520 --> 1:02:25.200 secure in our ship. So okay, let's talk about hip 1:02:25.240 --> 1:02:27.840 hop in general. You know, when pip hip hops really 1:02:27.880 --> 1:02:31.680 started to gain uh mainstream traction, there were a lot 1:02:31.680 --> 1:02:34.360 of samples, most of them not cleared, and there were 1:02:34.400 --> 1:02:36.440 a lot of lawsuits and a lot of issue and 1:02:36.480 --> 1:02:39.480 then we went to beat creation and for the last 1:02:40.040 --> 1:02:42.400 I'm teen years, we have the eight O eight, which 1:02:42.400 --> 1:02:46.080 I remembers being innovative in the eighties. What do you 1:02:46.160 --> 1:02:49.000 two guys think about? And it's a big field, but 1:02:49.080 --> 1:02:52.960 the general state of hip hop man um as a 1:02:53.000 --> 1:02:56.000 producer who started off just doing what everyone else is 1:02:56.880 --> 1:02:59.160 else did with hip hop us is just trying and 1:02:59.200 --> 1:03:01.920 find a cool roof and wrap over because you were 1:03:01.960 --> 1:03:03.920 a kid and nothing mattered and you never had a 1:03:03.920 --> 1:03:05.920 shot of making any money off of it anyway. And 1:03:05.920 --> 1:03:08.760 it was literally just a hobby, like someone would be 1:03:08.880 --> 1:03:12.360 drawing a picture in their bedroom, um, you know, uh 1:03:12.600 --> 1:03:16.400 to to then becoming a producer and putting records out 1:03:16.440 --> 1:03:20.240 that now years later I've had to re release because 1:03:20.280 --> 1:03:22.480 they were on streaming and I had to go back 1:03:22.640 --> 1:03:25.240 and clean up some of the sample, clear stuff or whatever, 1:03:25.720 --> 1:03:28.760 you know what I mean. It's interesting there's this intersection 1:03:28.800 --> 1:03:32.120 where spontaneity and creativity and then the reality of business, 1:03:32.320 --> 1:03:34.640 you know meat. But I think that um, you know, 1:03:34.760 --> 1:03:37.680 one thing that hip hop music and people who are 1:03:37.680 --> 1:03:40.840 involved in hip hop music has always been have always 1:03:40.840 --> 1:03:45.640 been a dept at it is um adapting um. And 1:03:45.880 --> 1:03:49.360 And you know, the point is is that is not 1:03:49.520 --> 1:03:52.480 about the point is not that all we have to sample. 1:03:52.760 --> 1:03:55.320 The point is not all we have to have money 1:03:55.320 --> 1:03:58.120 in order to afford to make music. The point is 1:03:58.160 --> 1:04:01.760 that we want to create music. Now. Hip hop sampling 1:04:01.920 --> 1:04:05.800 started because people didn't because Reagan cut the the arts 1:04:05.800 --> 1:04:09.440 funding in you know, in America, and all of a sudden, 1:04:09.560 --> 1:04:12.880 no one had any music classes, and people who wanted 1:04:12.880 --> 1:04:15.760 to be musicians, who were poor didn't have any access 1:04:15.800 --> 1:04:18.560 to music, and so they created music based on what 1:04:18.720 --> 1:04:20.880 was around in their living room, and the mother had 1:04:20.920 --> 1:04:24.440 a turntable, and they learned how to, you know, play 1:04:24.480 --> 1:04:26.640 with that and make that into something that they can 1:04:26.680 --> 1:04:30.400 make music with. And so it's invention and it's always 1:04:30.400 --> 1:04:33.440 going to be that um and so, you know, I 1:04:33.480 --> 1:04:37.440 think the state of hip hop personally is an amazing place, 1:04:37.680 --> 1:04:41.440 especially because of how huge it is and how many 1:04:41.480 --> 1:04:44.720 different ways there are now to approach it. Me and 1:04:44.760 --> 1:04:46.960 Mike came up at a time when everywhere every hip 1:04:47.000 --> 1:04:49.560 hop record that came out was a new advancement in 1:04:49.640 --> 1:04:51.480 the way that you could do it. Every time it 1:04:51.560 --> 1:04:53.320 came out, you ran. And this is why me and 1:04:53.360 --> 1:04:55.160 my bond we didn't grow up in the same city, 1:04:55.320 --> 1:04:57.360 but we were the same age, and we didn't grow 1:04:57.400 --> 1:04:59.680 up in the same community, but we were the same 1:05:00.560 --> 1:05:03.280 a level of obsessed with the music. And so every 1:05:03.280 --> 1:05:05.840 time a record came out, being Public Enemy came out, 1:05:06.240 --> 1:05:09.600 the BDP came out, you know, you know, all of 1:05:09.640 --> 1:05:11.440 these things. Every time you heard a new record, it 1:05:11.520 --> 1:05:14.160 was not only a new way to do hip hop music, 1:05:14.200 --> 1:05:17.000 but it was literally a new way to do music. 1:05:17.240 --> 1:05:19.680 And that's what's always been so exciting about hip hop 1:05:19.800 --> 1:05:23.400 is that it's so young, it's so fresh. It's absolutely 1:05:23.400 --> 1:05:26.040 writing its rules as it goes, and then that and 1:05:26.200 --> 1:05:29.880 those rules end up getting reflected for decades back on 1:05:29.960 --> 1:05:32.240 the rest of the world. I mean, you really consider 1:05:32.320 --> 1:05:35.680 how pop music and how pop culture has been has 1:05:35.800 --> 1:05:38.280 has been a reflection of what has been happening and 1:05:38.600 --> 1:05:41.680 what was the one point considered the small little community 1:05:41.680 --> 1:05:45.240 of musicians. It's incredible. You can't go on the radio 1:05:45.280 --> 1:05:48.280 and listen to an R and B song without seeing 1:05:48.320 --> 1:05:51.760 the connection to hip hop music. It cannot happen anymore. 1:05:51.800 --> 1:05:54.920 I remember when R and B records started to incorporate 1:05:54.920 --> 1:05:57.920 elements of hip hop. It was exciting. Now it's almost 1:05:58.000 --> 1:06:00.880 like you're interested to hear somebody like singing R and 1:06:00.920 --> 1:06:02.880 B record if they would put it on the radio 1:06:02.920 --> 1:06:06.240 if there weren't hip hop elements in the you know, okay, 1:06:06.240 --> 1:06:09.520 but let's flip the glass to half empty. There's certainly 1:06:09.520 --> 1:06:11.840 a lot of beefs in the hip hop world and 1:06:11.880 --> 1:06:18.520 their beasts against people like Little YACHTI and I don't 1:06:18.520 --> 1:06:20.360 know what I'm trying to say is you know there 1:06:20.360 --> 1:06:23.400 are people say, oh, it's too simplistic. You know, on 1:06:23.400 --> 1:06:25.800 one extreme we have Kendrick and the other one, what 1:06:25.840 --> 1:06:29.360 do you guys view about that hip hop, the hip 1:06:29.400 --> 1:06:32.200 to the hippity hip hip. Him, you don't talk, you know, 1:06:33.280 --> 1:06:35.480 you know you're talking to two dudes who don't have 1:06:35.520 --> 1:06:39.040 that perspective. You're not, We don't have that perspective. Like 1:06:39.280 --> 1:06:41.480 the way that I look at it. Man, anything someone 1:06:41.480 --> 1:06:43.960 who's young and excited about music wants to do that's 1:06:44.000 --> 1:06:47.200 funky that people like thumbs up, you know what I mean? Like, 1:06:47.400 --> 1:06:49.680 and I think that there's an old guard perspective. I 1:06:49.720 --> 1:06:51.160 think a lot of people who come out of it. 1:06:51.400 --> 1:06:53.760 You know, it's something that in me and Mike's generation, 1:06:54.400 --> 1:06:56.920 it's very common for people who are our as to 1:06:56.960 --> 1:06:59.479 be pretty fucking bitner about what the company. Well, well 1:06:59.560 --> 1:07:02.960 it's coming from your city, I will say. Coming from 1:07:03.000 --> 1:07:09.760 my region, it's not as common Bunby, is that Yeah? Yeah, Like, 1:07:09.760 --> 1:07:13.520 like I gotta say, in the South, sampling was important 1:07:13.520 --> 1:07:16.600 from the South for this reason. My mother when she 1:07:16.720 --> 1:07:19.280 left to marry my non bio dad, she left me 1:07:19.360 --> 1:07:22.320 with the record collection. Right, so I five six years old, 1:07:22.320 --> 1:07:26.080 you got just your mom's your mom's sucking one. She 1:07:26.160 --> 1:07:29.360 doesn't even It's more of a big sister little brother relationship. 1:07:29.760 --> 1:07:31.800 She teaches me how to put records on. I get 1:07:31.840 --> 1:07:35.560 to play the Osley Brothers, Curtis Mayfield, Willie Hutch. I'm 1:07:35.600 --> 1:07:40.960 playing these records and hip hop introduces my friends to 1:07:41.120 --> 1:07:43.560 these sounds that I now can tell my friends, Oh yeah, 1:07:43.560 --> 1:07:45.600 that's Oza Hayes. Let me let you listen to it 1:07:45.680 --> 1:07:49.080 after school. So Sampling, I just want to tell older 1:07:49.160 --> 1:07:52.640 musicians that didn't appreciate what Sampling brought because they were 1:07:52.680 --> 1:07:54.960 being robbed. They had been robbed by their record companies. 1:07:55.160 --> 1:07:58.120 We didn't understand that even after samples had to get clear, 1:07:58.240 --> 1:08:00.200 the money didn't go to the artist. Where does serve 1:08:00.320 --> 1:08:02.920 to go? It went to the people who owned the 1:08:03.000 --> 1:08:06.200 artist publishing. That's the greatest evil of it. So you know, 1:08:06.240 --> 1:08:08.040 not only do you have now an artists, it's like 1:08:08.040 --> 1:08:11.200 this little motherfucker ripped my ship. Then it's like, not 1:08:11.320 --> 1:08:13.040 only did he do it, now that he's getting paid, 1:08:13.120 --> 1:08:15.560 the motherfucker who ripped me off originally is getting paid. 1:08:15.600 --> 1:08:19.960 But Curtis Mayfield mentored outcast and what he taught outcasts 1:08:19.960 --> 1:08:24.960 and organized, nor he mentor organized a little bit slower. Literally, 1:08:25.000 --> 1:08:29.879 how did Curtis Mayfield uh mentor outcast? Not outcast directly, 1:08:29.920 --> 1:08:33.479 but organized noise. Who are the mentors and the founders 1:08:33.520 --> 1:08:38.519 of the sound of the Dungeon family, Patrick Brown, Ray Murray, 1:08:38.680 --> 1:08:42.000 Enrico Wade. These guys were working out of Mayfield Studio. 1:08:42.439 --> 1:08:44.639 They were working with when they were working with people 1:08:44.680 --> 1:08:47.880 like pimps and people um there were ex pimps that 1:08:47.920 --> 1:08:50.439 got into music and stuff. It really was a black 1:08:50.560 --> 1:08:55.679 waitation film. But he taught them that sampling, however, was good. 1:08:56.240 --> 1:08:59.599 That you could create the same vibe, you could create 1:08:59.640 --> 1:09:02.840 the same feeling. So when you listen to players ball, 1:09:03.439 --> 1:09:06.200 you're not listening to a sample as much as you're 1:09:06.240 --> 1:09:09.760 listening to someone that captured the feeling of what the 1:09:09.760 --> 1:09:12.800 black exquotation era and what that soul in that funk was. 1:09:13.040 --> 1:09:16.040 So sampling was important. But sampling in the South is 1:09:16.160 --> 1:09:20.280 radically different from Tennessee. Houston. Tennessee is more of a 1:09:20.320 --> 1:09:23.639 Willie Hug bop that three S has. If you're listening 1:09:23.680 --> 1:09:26.920 to say Houston music, you're listening to more of a 1:09:27.040 --> 1:09:30.120 slow down, a screwed, a more soulfl version. In Atlanta 1:09:30.160 --> 1:09:33.120 and Miami, at one point we're just fast like bouti Cheq. 1:09:33.280 --> 1:09:36.160 So sampling was important because to me it helped me 1:09:36.280 --> 1:09:40.320 understand what musicians were doing what before me. The reason 1:09:40.360 --> 1:09:42.720 I know Bob changed, the reason I know colonelist month. 1:09:42.800 --> 1:09:45.760 The reason I know this is because Sampling introduced me. 1:09:45.760 --> 1:09:47.760 I got the chance to look and see where it 1:09:47.800 --> 1:09:51.360 came from and in terms of how people view younger artists. Now, 1:09:51.920 --> 1:09:54.080 my thing with hip hop is just like what you like, 1:09:54.600 --> 1:09:57.320 because the beautiful thing about hip hop is there's always 1:09:57.360 --> 1:10:01.719 been everything for everybody. You know, people talk shit about 1:10:02.160 --> 1:10:05.280 how soft hip hop has gotten. Motherfucker p m Don 1:10:05.439 --> 1:10:09.160 was jamming. That's just a break, you know what I'm saying. 1:10:09.280 --> 1:10:11.479 And even though I was one to look no, kids 1:10:11.760 --> 1:10:14.160 kept trying to front on that ship at the school 1:10:14.280 --> 1:10:21.559 dance when that ship came on and cool J I 1:10:21.640 --> 1:10:26.439 need love songs of all time. But it was Llo 1:10:26.560 --> 1:10:29.840 cool J and he was hardest. It's hardest. It was 1:10:30.000 --> 1:10:33.920 incredible exactly. So for me, yeah, I don't shoot on 1:10:33.960 --> 1:10:37.120 the little kids. It's mental interesting you mentioned y'all. Y'alllly's 1:10:37.160 --> 1:10:39.760 father went to the same high school. He's older than me, 1:10:39.800 --> 1:10:43.120 but he's a prominent photographer in Atlanta. Um. He's just 1:10:43.240 --> 1:10:46.600 a great brother. So I've known Yadi since he was 1:10:46.720 --> 1:10:51.799 miles like little beautiful, awesome child Moles And the dopest 1:10:51.840 --> 1:10:55.200 thing about him is he's true to himself, and that's 1:10:55.240 --> 1:10:59.439 why he found audience. He found audience because my kids 1:10:59.520 --> 1:11:01.600 did not grow up with the same experience as me. 1:11:02.000 --> 1:11:04.439 So n w A hits my kids, even if they 1:11:04.479 --> 1:11:07.160 like it in a totally different way than it hit me. 1:11:07.200 --> 1:11:10.599 At twil the cops kicked my fucking ass. So fuk 1:11:10.680 --> 1:11:14.320 the police meant something different than when my my daughter, 1:11:14.439 --> 1:11:17.920 who's you know? Here's it now? It's a radically different 1:11:17.960 --> 1:11:20.960 reasons he writes it, But she understands the concept because 1:11:20.960 --> 1:11:24.000 of what she sees on television. Daddy understood the concept 1:11:24.040 --> 1:11:27.120 because the cops kicks Daddy's ass. I think that. I 1:11:27.160 --> 1:11:29.160 think that also when you get when when you find 1:11:29.160 --> 1:11:31.240 yourself getting a little bit older and you get that 1:11:31.280 --> 1:11:34.920 crossroads where you start um instinctively being a little bit 1:11:34.960 --> 1:11:37.439 bitter about whatever the new music is, you have to 1:11:37.479 --> 1:11:40.120 have a come to Jesus moment and ask yourself, Am 1:11:40.160 --> 1:11:44.280 I a music fan or a I nostalgic for the 1:11:44.320 --> 1:11:47.040 things that made me feel something at a time in 1:11:47.080 --> 1:11:50.679 which I was really feeling things? Are you still feeling things? 1:11:51.160 --> 1:11:53.840 Is it wrong that there are things out there that 1:11:53.880 --> 1:11:56.880 you're not feeling. Does that make those things inferior? Me 1:11:56.960 --> 1:11:59.880 and Mike are pretty clear about the fact that once 1:12:00.040 --> 1:12:02.679 you start thinking in that way, you're starting to get old. 1:12:02.800 --> 1:12:05.160 And I don't think that I don't think that that's 1:12:05.200 --> 1:12:08.200 the right way to look at things and listen. I 1:12:08.240 --> 1:12:10.200 would also like to point out real quickly on the 1:12:10.240 --> 1:12:15.120 production level and on the sampling issue or the sampling conversation, 1:12:15.720 --> 1:12:20.559 this was again necessity. These are musicians trying to express themselves, 1:12:20.720 --> 1:12:23.040 and there and there I have. Now we've gone pretty 1:12:23.080 --> 1:12:26.639 far through hip hop production, and what you have are 1:12:26.880 --> 1:12:30.439 and have emerged throughout it where different schools of approach, 1:12:30.680 --> 1:12:33.559 different schools of different types of sampling. I was sampling 1:12:33.560 --> 1:12:36.200 records really from the jump, but when I really started 1:12:36.200 --> 1:12:37.760 to get in my own and become known as a 1:12:37.760 --> 1:12:40.800 producer for having a sound, my approach to sampling was 1:12:40.920 --> 1:12:44.280 very different in the sense that I wasn't just looping records. 1:12:44.360 --> 1:12:49.360 I was using the sampler as my my, my, my paints. 1:12:49.600 --> 1:12:52.760 You know, Um, a sound became another sound. Um. You know. 1:12:52.840 --> 1:12:55.080 Hip hop is one of the first forms of music 1:12:55.120 --> 1:12:59.840 production in which you could turn something else into a baseline. 1:13:00.040 --> 1:13:02.280 You could turn something that was not supposed to be 1:13:02.320 --> 1:13:06.240 a guitar into a guitar. You could take recordings that 1:13:06.280 --> 1:13:08.920 were recorded in different studios and different errors by different 1:13:08.920 --> 1:13:11.680 people and smash them together and use a snare from 1:13:11.680 --> 1:13:14.240 one session and a kick from another session. It was 1:13:14.320 --> 1:13:16.840 collage art. It was mashing it all together, and it 1:13:16.880 --> 1:13:21.599 was beautiful and beyond all that. It takes real fucking 1:13:21.640 --> 1:13:24.720 creativity and real genius to turn that into something that 1:13:24.840 --> 1:13:29.320 is yours, and it has been the beginning point for 1:13:29.360 --> 1:13:33.840 a lot of producers that have ended up affecting the 1:13:33.880 --> 1:13:37.479 world of music in a huge fucking way. So you know, 1:13:38.080 --> 1:13:42.160 I always um, you know, I always understood and was 1:13:42.200 --> 1:13:47.120 aware of the perspectives on it. But it's like, look, man, 1:13:48.080 --> 1:13:50.519 I was a kid when I was stealing. Now I'm 1:13:50.520 --> 1:13:54.080 a fucking musician, you know. Now I'm a musician. Like 1:13:54.160 --> 1:13:56.760 I needed to I needed training wheels. But now with 1:13:56.920 --> 1:13:59.599 me and Mike sample, now it's on purpose. It's like, 1:13:59.640 --> 1:14:01.240 you know we're gonna do We did that with runn 1:14:01.280 --> 1:14:03.800 Jewels four. We were like, we're gonna sample. We're gonna 1:14:03.800 --> 1:14:06.880 just clearly sample, not just a little hidden things that 1:14:06.920 --> 1:14:09.240 are sprinkled about what you do and you're hiding. As 1:14:09.280 --> 1:14:12.519 part of the fun event, We're gonna loop some ship up, 1:14:12.760 --> 1:14:15.720 like as an homage to that part of what we 1:14:15.800 --> 1:14:18.400 love about hip hop music. Because it's time. It felt 1:14:18.400 --> 1:14:21.280 like there was time to references honorably and be like, 1:14:21.439 --> 1:14:23.559 we are doing this. It just so happens that me 1:14:23.600 --> 1:14:26.240 and Mike could this time afford to do it. You know. 1:14:26.360 --> 1:14:30.400 But it's an art, okay, So what's the dream for 1:14:30.760 --> 1:14:33.480 Run the Jewels? On some level, you're living the dream. 1:14:33.640 --> 1:14:38.080 You're making your art, You're making some money. But are 1:14:38.120 --> 1:14:40.880 you satisfied where you are? Do you want something in 1:14:40.920 --> 1:14:43.880 the future? What is your desire? It would be nice 1:14:43.880 --> 1:14:46.400 to do a show again, That would be fucking nice, Bob. 1:14:46.960 --> 1:14:50.360 We're all we're all laboring under those constructs. But in 1:14:50.479 --> 1:14:51.720 terms of quel let me let me put it in 1:14:51.760 --> 1:14:56.160 a different way. Okay. In the sixties in the eighties, 1:14:56.400 --> 1:14:59.360 there was a mono culture. There's an AM radio in 1:14:59.360 --> 1:15:02.080 the sixties, and there was MTV in the eighties, and 1:15:02.120 --> 1:15:07.559 if you were a successful record, literally everybody in America 1:15:07.600 --> 1:15:09.840 knew that record, whether they liked it or not, because 1:15:09.880 --> 1:15:13.160 they were exposed to it. Today today, you can take 1:15:13.640 --> 1:15:19.599 the number one record on Spotify and of Americans never 1:15:19.640 --> 1:15:24.599 even heard it, never mind how a judgment. So usually 1:15:24.640 --> 1:15:29.360 an artist, their number one goal is to reach more people. So, 1:15:30.160 --> 1:15:33.920 you know, artistically, in career wise, what are the desires 1:15:33.960 --> 1:15:37.360 of you guys personally? And I'll just say this and 1:15:37.439 --> 1:15:40.439 I'll have my answer. But that was never my goal. Um. 1:15:41.080 --> 1:15:44.080 It was always welcomed. It was always something that I 1:15:44.320 --> 1:15:48.120 wanted on some level, because that's what being an artist is. 1:15:48.200 --> 1:15:50.920 You want people to see what you do. Um. But 1:15:51.320 --> 1:15:54.360 my goal is to do what I love to do 1:15:56.160 --> 1:15:58.880 unhindered and to continue to be able to do it 1:15:58.960 --> 1:16:03.920 without without having an answer to anybody about it and um, 1:16:04.000 --> 1:16:07.240 and to continue to extract joy from it and and 1:16:07.240 --> 1:16:10.800 and you know, I love the idea of us being 1:16:11.520 --> 1:16:13.799 exposed to more people. And it has happened. It's happened 1:16:13.800 --> 1:16:16.760 for us in a big way. Um, you know, and 1:16:17.640 --> 1:16:20.200 that's amazing. The things that I love about it though, 1:16:20.280 --> 1:16:22.599 that we didn't change ourselves to get there, and by 1:16:22.640 --> 1:16:24.599 the time we finally get there, it was just us 1:16:25.080 --> 1:16:28.200 and there was we We lost our opportunity to be 1:16:28.240 --> 1:16:31.120 the assholes who have overnight successful long time ago. You know, 1:16:31.479 --> 1:16:34.400 I always I always lament that, like damn if I had, 1:16:34.560 --> 1:16:37.080 if I had gotten money, you know, and blew up 1:16:37.120 --> 1:16:39.360 when I was first starting, I you know, I could 1:16:39.400 --> 1:16:41.640 have been such an asshole. But it's a little too 1:16:41.720 --> 1:16:43.559 late for us. Man. We're we're we're just kind of 1:16:43.600 --> 1:16:46.800 who we are. And we were happy playing five person 1:16:46.920 --> 1:16:49.600 rooms because we were we were we were doing it 1:16:49.600 --> 1:16:52.120 on our turns. We loved each other, we loved the energy. 1:16:52.240 --> 1:16:54.439 It was fun and it was and we were able 1:16:54.479 --> 1:16:57.040 to sustain ourselves to keep doing it. And neither of 1:16:57.160 --> 1:16:59.200 us want to work a fucking day job, that's for sure. 1:16:59.520 --> 1:17:03.400 But in all honesty, not the fucking this is not 1:17:03.479 --> 1:17:06.559 the like the the you know, this is not the 1:17:06.600 --> 1:17:09.719 pseudo humble ship. In all honestly, all I ever wanted 1:17:10.200 --> 1:17:14.040 was to get the chance to do creative stuff on 1:17:14.080 --> 1:17:15.760 any level that I wanted to do. I think that 1:17:16.080 --> 1:17:17.680 me and might have a lot of things that we 1:17:17.720 --> 1:17:20.840 want to do together as creative partners, like a movie. 1:17:20.920 --> 1:17:23.679 We're we're working on what we're working on doing a movie. 1:17:23.800 --> 1:17:27.240 We want to get into that realm um, and you know, 1:17:27.560 --> 1:17:30.600 and but really just the ability to make music and 1:17:30.720 --> 1:17:33.320 keep doing what I love and not have to answer 1:17:33.439 --> 1:17:36.840 two assholes about it, um, not have to ask permission. 1:17:37.200 --> 1:17:41.439 And um, that's it, that's that's I'll die happy. Then 1:17:41.479 --> 1:17:43.400 I'll die happy if I could pay the rent make 1:17:43.400 --> 1:17:47.800 my weird ass music. I'm good, Mike, I'm minute for 1:17:47.840 --> 1:17:53.960 a hunt a million of better. Okay, but let's stop. Okay, 1:17:54.240 --> 1:17:59.560 let's just say tomorrow, tomorrow, will you lose your voice permanently? 1:18:00.160 --> 1:18:03.360 You got enough money to get to the end. Well, 1:18:03.720 --> 1:18:08.040 I live. I live at a means that I have 1:18:08.240 --> 1:18:11.160 the things that I've always wanted. So you're hearing me 1:18:11.200 --> 1:18:13.800 tell a joke I say about I have friends. I 1:18:13.840 --> 1:18:16.519 have three friends, now have two friends, now have three 1:18:16.560 --> 1:18:18.519 that are that are white folk rich. So in the South, 1:18:18.640 --> 1:18:20.400 you here, hey man, I'm need ro rich, you know, 1:18:20.520 --> 1:18:23.000 white folk rich. So I need grow rich, meaning I 1:18:23.080 --> 1:18:26.240 have enough to to to to to make it for 1:18:26.280 --> 1:18:29.479 the rest of my natural days, because I have invested 1:18:29.520 --> 1:18:33.200 in some enterprises that, in addition to music, provide away 1:18:33.240 --> 1:18:35.400 from me that doesn't you know, including to real estate, 1:18:35.439 --> 1:18:38.639 things that my wife did, barbershops, some other cool stuff. 1:18:38.760 --> 1:18:42.240 So and I live adam below the means that I've 1:18:42.240 --> 1:18:45.000 always thought was cool. I I could have bought a 1:18:45.120 --> 1:18:47.679 million and a half dollar house. I have a five 1:18:47.800 --> 1:18:50.879 hundred thousand dollar house. I could have moved to North Fulton, 1:18:51.000 --> 1:18:54.240 where the athletes who slam Dumpton run balls live. I 1:18:54.400 --> 1:18:57.559 live in South Fulton, where all the black retirees who 1:18:57.600 --> 1:19:00.400 are secretly millionaires live. You know what I mean. So 1:19:00.520 --> 1:19:03.519 it's I made the decisions my grandparents would have made, 1:19:03.880 --> 1:19:07.280 but for me. I'm not working for me at this point. 1:19:07.280 --> 1:19:11.000 I have children and my my my life has been 1:19:11.120 --> 1:19:15.120 under financial darrest because I chose to have children out 1:19:15.120 --> 1:19:16.880 of wetlock. And it does not mean in a bad way. 1:19:16.920 --> 1:19:19.519 That just means I've had to work with the knowledge 1:19:19.560 --> 1:19:22.280 of whatever I make while I'm here, it's going to 1:19:22.360 --> 1:19:24.760 be left or not left to someone, depending on the 1:19:24.840 --> 1:19:27.400 decisions I make. And I want to leave my children 1:19:27.400 --> 1:19:30.320 more than sneakers and muscle cars, just like my great 1:19:30.320 --> 1:19:33.160 grandparents who were sharecroppers and the children of people who 1:19:33.160 --> 1:19:36.799 were enslaved, left the farm that my family still profits 1:19:36.800 --> 1:19:38.800 from the day we all got a little five hundred 1:19:38.800 --> 1:19:41.600 dollar check from the timber company that grows timber on 1:19:41.640 --> 1:19:44.360 our land. I want to be able to win my 1:19:44.479 --> 1:19:48.400 absence for for for Malik and the Naya and Pony 1:19:48.439 --> 1:19:52.160 and Mikey's children, to say my grandfather. He sang, and 1:19:52.200 --> 1:19:54.439 he danced, He went in the Rock and Roll Hall 1:19:54.479 --> 1:19:57.720 of Fame. He left an incredible musical legacy. But more 1:19:57.760 --> 1:19:59.920 than that, he made sure that we each had a 1:20:00.080 --> 1:20:02.519 trust so that we didn't have to do things that 1:20:02.560 --> 1:20:06.040 were morally objective to out the way we were raised 1:20:06.080 --> 1:20:09.320 in order to pay for our school or for for 1:20:09.400 --> 1:20:12.080 our own children. I just want to do what my 1:20:12.160 --> 1:20:15.240 great grandparents did, and that's leaves something for them. So 1:20:15.560 --> 1:20:20.519 I am not satisfied with enough. And and I don't 1:20:20.560 --> 1:20:22.200 mean that I don't have enough because I'm not looking 1:20:22.240 --> 1:20:24.040 for a new house. I'm not trying to buy a 1:20:24.040 --> 1:20:26.599 new car, except for that test of truck you put 1:20:26.640 --> 1:20:28.240 me on. But what I but what I am going 1:20:28.280 --> 1:20:31.479 to make sure is that whichever one of my children 1:20:31.680 --> 1:20:34.400 you know, or all of them have grandchildren, that something 1:20:34.600 --> 1:20:37.160 from all this singing and dancing is going to give 1:20:37.240 --> 1:20:41.040 them an advance and stabilization, because, to be honest with you, 1:20:41.080 --> 1:20:42.760 people who look like me in this country have not 1:20:42.800 --> 1:20:46.559 had that. My wife Um really helped me realize how 1:20:46.640 --> 1:20:49.240 fortunate I am and how fortunate she is. My wife, 1:20:49.600 --> 1:20:52.240 her father is from the Gecheon Gala community. Her father 1:20:52.320 --> 1:20:55.720 is from Hilton Head Island. Her grandfather just received God 1:20:55.720 --> 1:20:58.439 Bless the Dead an award from the gechean Gala community 1:20:58.439 --> 1:21:01.480 there because he was one of the areg just landowners, 1:21:01.560 --> 1:21:04.720 had family, had commerce, and his family you can see 1:21:04.760 --> 1:21:07.479 on that side of her family is much tighter. They're 1:21:07.560 --> 1:21:10.760 much more stable, the children are more affluent and and 1:21:10.760 --> 1:21:13.800 and we're able. But she grew up in Savannah with 1:21:13.840 --> 1:21:16.760 her mother's family who was who was not as fortunate, 1:21:17.080 --> 1:21:18.960 but they had a lot of love and care. But 1:21:19.080 --> 1:21:21.920 my wife has really helped me to understand the importance 1:21:21.960 --> 1:21:24.599 of what economics means in the family. So as for me, 1:21:25.000 --> 1:21:27.240 in my half of Rue of the Jewels, I not 1:21:27.280 --> 1:21:29.120 only am having the time of my life, I have 1:21:29.160 --> 1:21:32.200 the greatest job on earth. I am always have to 1:21:32.280 --> 1:21:35.280 think with the perspective that, Michael, what you do today 1:21:35.400 --> 1:21:37.880 it's going to matter to people with your last name 1:21:38.120 --> 1:21:40.519 in fifty and sixty years, some who you may not see. 1:21:40.680 --> 1:21:42.439 So take the care of your ship and don't suck 1:21:42.439 --> 1:21:45.200 it up on drugs and strip clubs. Okay, but you 1:21:45.280 --> 1:21:47.800 mentioned the record, by the way, I'll take a hundred 1:21:47.840 --> 1:21:52.439 million to Yeah, yeah, that's we're gonna get that. My 1:21:52.520 --> 1:21:56.040 next question, how you get. How do you plan to 1:21:56.160 --> 1:21:59.040 get a hundred million? Well, you get, you get a 1:21:59.080 --> 1:22:02.400 hundred million magic, Johnson said, it takes the same amount 1:22:02.439 --> 1:22:04.200 of time to do a hundred million dollar deals a 1:22:04.240 --> 1:22:07.920 million allar deal. And we're the same group. We we 1:22:07.920 --> 1:22:11.000 We didn't go into this album like, man, we're gonna 1:22:11.040 --> 1:22:13.680 make more money. We went into this album like we're 1:22:13.680 --> 1:22:16.240 gonna top ourselves and we're gonna show our audience we 1:22:16.240 --> 1:22:19.479 can keep evolving, and um, if that works out cool 1:22:19.520 --> 1:22:21.960 and we play bigger shows, that will be cooler for 1:22:22.040 --> 1:22:25.400 us financially too. And that's what happened about proxy. We 1:22:25.439 --> 1:22:27.880 want to be the best we can possibly be, and 1:22:27.920 --> 1:22:31.439 by proxy, um in this cool system of making music, 1:22:31.479 --> 1:22:33.519 and if people enjoy it they buy ship from you, 1:22:33.960 --> 1:22:37.200 that equaled more money. But I can honestly say that, Um, 1:22:38.120 --> 1:22:40.639 the goal is always to be the best run the jewels. 1:22:40.800 --> 1:22:42.920 And what I do think we have to our advantage 1:22:43.000 --> 1:22:46.280 is we're honest and pure and our intentions. We love 1:22:46.400 --> 1:22:49.160 making music together. I honestly think we were born to 1:22:49.200 --> 1:22:51.920 make music together. And we just got a bunch of 1:22:51.960 --> 1:22:56.120 cool lass artistic people who follow us, who collaborate with us, 1:22:56.360 --> 1:22:58.920 who help us think things through, and I think that 1:22:59.200 --> 1:23:04.400 art um like Dolly, like Picasso, like henryoso our Tanner. 1:23:04.800 --> 1:23:07.519 I think that art has value to the human soul 1:23:07.560 --> 1:23:10.479 and spirit. So my hope is that we can keep 1:23:10.520 --> 1:23:15.200 creating art, both musically and visually in film and television, 1:23:15.560 --> 1:23:18.759 and that can be what we have offered to the culture, 1:23:18.880 --> 1:23:22.479 to this country, this worldwide culture of hip hop and music. 1:23:22.800 --> 1:23:25.400 And I hope that that value. Like bands I've loved, 1:23:25.400 --> 1:23:29.240 including led Zeppelin and Black Sabbath and Grateful Dead, n W, 1:23:29.280 --> 1:23:32.439 A Public Enemy, ice Cube, I hope that our value 1:23:32.479 --> 1:23:35.000 holds over the long term because of what we bring in, 1:23:35.000 --> 1:23:40.080 the inspiration we bring through. Dami, you're gonna say something, No, 1:23:40.240 --> 1:23:42.880 I mean everything he's saying is exactly how I feel. 1:23:42.920 --> 1:23:45.920 And you know for me, you know, I've always only 1:23:46.400 --> 1:23:49.760 been happy when I've been allowed to create. Okay, But 1:23:49.800 --> 1:23:53.040 let's say you're in you're in the studio, Okay. Do 1:23:53.080 --> 1:23:56.200 you consciously say I want to create a hit. Let 1:23:56.200 --> 1:24:00.200 me define this. Doesn't that, that doesn't mean it's that 1:24:00.280 --> 1:24:03.040 does not mean it's number one on the chart. Do 1:24:03.080 --> 1:24:06.480 you want to create something so good that it spreads 1:24:06.520 --> 1:24:09.280 because people can't get enough? Is that in your brain? 1:24:09.360 --> 1:24:13.040 It'll feel it. Yea, yes, but it's a different context. 1:24:13.120 --> 1:24:16.679 We want to create something. We want to create something 1:24:16.760 --> 1:24:20.759 that we know motherfucker's who feel like us are gonna 1:24:20.920 --> 1:24:23.920 have to smile and nod their head to no matter what, 1:24:24.360 --> 1:24:26.640 no matter if they've ever heard us and not. We 1:24:26.720 --> 1:24:29.720 know that there's something magical about the music that we 1:24:29.840 --> 1:24:32.599 love that if you get it right, it will put 1:24:32.600 --> 1:24:35.400 a fucking smile on somebody's face. And we do want 1:24:35.400 --> 1:24:37.720 to do that, or it will put a or put 1:24:37.720 --> 1:24:39.960 a thought into somebody's head. Yes, we want to make 1:24:40.000 --> 1:24:44.519 the most banging, undeniable music possible, But the hit word 1:24:44.680 --> 1:24:48.439 never comes into it. They hit own. It's only because A, 1:24:48.640 --> 1:24:52.320 we're too fu smart to know. We're too fu smart, Bob. 1:24:52.400 --> 1:24:56.519 We know we're not making hit. That's not that's not 1:24:56.640 --> 1:24:59.000 what Run the Jewels does. A hit for us, it's 1:24:59.080 --> 1:25:01.680 something that gets played on the radio. That's rare for us. 1:25:01.720 --> 1:25:03.320 We have we have some songs that are now getting 1:25:03.320 --> 1:25:06.680 played on the radio. But you know, for us, we 1:25:06.720 --> 1:25:09.840 want to make uh something that's undeniable and something that 1:25:09.920 --> 1:25:11.680 we can walk out of the studio and be like 1:25:12.960 --> 1:25:15.519 fuck you, fuck you. This is you know, like if 1:25:15.520 --> 1:25:17.960 you don't like it, fine, but we put everything we 1:25:18.040 --> 1:25:21.000 had into it. And you know now, but we don't 1:25:21.000 --> 1:25:22.479 think that. We don't think in terms of hit. We 1:25:22.520 --> 1:25:24.320 know who we are, what we're doing, and what I've 1:25:24.320 --> 1:25:27.960 been doing all my life, hopefully, and what I bring 1:25:28.080 --> 1:25:31.200 to the group, hopefully is engaging in the age old 1:25:31.240 --> 1:25:34.759 craft of making albums and trying to make real records 1:25:34.760 --> 1:25:38.240 that tying into each other and make real moments on 1:25:38.320 --> 1:25:40.920 records that are not looked at at sectioned off into 1:25:41.000 --> 1:25:43.240 little singles and they're not thought about in any terms 1:25:43.280 --> 1:25:45.920 that are economic, but that the first track in the 1:25:46.000 --> 1:25:48.080 last track relate to each other, and there's a point 1:25:48.120 --> 1:25:50.439 to it. And we want to make art. Me and Mike, 1:25:50.439 --> 1:25:52.760 we're both visual artists, were both you know, when we 1:25:52.760 --> 1:25:55.679 were kids. I wasn't probably as good as my we 1:25:55.680 --> 1:25:58.960 we we We were both avid comic book readers. We 1:25:58.920 --> 1:26:01.839 were both art fans. We're both movie heads. We were 1:26:01.880 --> 1:26:04.840 obsessed with art our whole lives. I just happened to 1:26:04.840 --> 1:26:07.200 be from the generation of people that still really wants 1:26:07.240 --> 1:26:10.200 to make a cohesive thing that starts from beginning to 1:26:10.320 --> 1:26:14.200 end and has a point and has a relationship internally 1:26:14.240 --> 1:26:16.880 to itself. I want to make this art. This art 1:26:16.920 --> 1:26:20.879 is my life. So in answering your other question again, 1:26:21.160 --> 1:26:23.120 what I would say is that all I really want 1:26:23.439 --> 1:26:25.600 is to get the chance to create things, and it 1:26:25.800 --> 1:26:27.640 is to get the chance to spread my wings. Is 1:26:27.680 --> 1:26:30.120 actually fit if I want to direct the movie someday, 1:26:30.160 --> 1:26:31.880 I want to be in a position where what I'm 1:26:31.920 --> 1:26:34.640 doing is successful enough to allow me that leeway to 1:26:34.760 --> 1:26:37.439 write and direct the movie. Um, this is what my 1:26:37.479 --> 1:26:39.840 whole life has has has only been. And that's the 1:26:39.880 --> 1:26:42.680 sixteen year old kid who didn't. I did not have 1:26:42.720 --> 1:26:45.800 any fucking plan. B I just didn't. I walked right 1:26:45.880 --> 1:26:48.879 I I out of high school. It was a failure, 1:26:49.040 --> 1:26:51.000 and it was like, this is all I'm all in, 1:26:51.160 --> 1:26:53.800 This is all this is all I have. So of 1:26:53.840 --> 1:26:57.000 course I want to you know, I'm a fucking you know, 1:26:57.080 --> 1:26:59.360 I'm a fucking man in this world. Of course I 1:26:59.400 --> 1:27:02.160 want to find actual security. But that doesn't play into 1:27:02.240 --> 1:27:05.080 us when we're in the studio, because the only thing 1:27:05.120 --> 1:27:08.120 that's ever been successful for us has us been completely 1:27:08.160 --> 1:27:10.920 ignoring all that ship and going directly with what our 1:27:10.960 --> 1:27:13.000 heart is about this music. That's it, that's the only 1:27:13.000 --> 1:27:16.759 reason why we're here. How was that of voters. Voters 1:27:16.840 --> 1:27:20.040 rally at t I S Trap Music Museum and we 1:27:20.120 --> 1:27:23.400 have a we have a business partnership around a fifty 1:27:23.439 --> 1:27:26.040 yard restaurant that we we we have a food truck 1:27:26.080 --> 1:27:30.439 run around promoter now called banc At Seafood. And I 1:27:30.600 --> 1:27:33.200 was I was talked. We were backstage before we walked 1:27:33.200 --> 1:27:35.080 out and just gave people, you know, the fire up 1:27:35.160 --> 1:27:37.920 to get out, make sure they get out and vote um. 1:27:38.080 --> 1:27:40.240 And it was like, what you're doing. I was like, yo, 1:27:40.400 --> 1:27:43.240 I'm I'm listening to my album, um, getting getting my 1:27:43.280 --> 1:27:46.400 memorization tightened up because we're gonna have to performance. And 1:27:46.439 --> 1:27:51.280 he was like, you memorize the whole album. I was like, well, 1:27:51.960 --> 1:27:56.040 I say, how do I explain this? I say, so, look, Um, 1:27:56.200 --> 1:27:58.160 you make a lot of money when you do shows 1:27:58.160 --> 1:28:02.360 because you have hit records. You have records that people say, man, 1:28:02.520 --> 1:28:04.880 I was at the prom making love to this record. 1:28:04.920 --> 1:28:07.519 I say, you got records that are burning the people's 1:28:07.560 --> 1:28:09.320 memory for the rest of their lives because you got it. 1:28:10.120 --> 1:28:12.040 And he looks at me like, yeah, that's natural. And 1:28:12.040 --> 1:28:16.240 I say, well, I make a bunch of money performing 1:28:16.360 --> 1:28:21.960 because I make albums that people experience life with with 1:28:22.080 --> 1:28:26.080 that album I say, so that gives me the value 1:28:26.160 --> 1:28:29.240 of having a hit, So I probably are never gonna 1:28:29.280 --> 1:28:31.760 have you can you can have whatever you like. But 1:28:31.920 --> 1:28:35.640 I got run to jewels too. We vote just irrupted 1:28:35.760 --> 1:28:38.640 laughter because I'm like, that's how we play festivals, and 1:28:38.640 --> 1:28:41.760 that's why we tour so much, because we don't go 1:28:41.880 --> 1:28:45.759 to make the hit, because don't play yourself chasing something. 1:28:46.000 --> 1:28:48.839 Realize what type of your what your strength is. Dennis 1:28:48.920 --> 1:28:51.439 Robbins one of the greatest basketball players on earth because 1:28:51.439 --> 1:28:54.479 he knew that if I play defense to to the 1:28:54.600 --> 1:28:57.040 to the tilt better than anyone else, and I get 1:28:57.120 --> 1:28:59.360 this ball in the hand of those shooters, I'm going 1:28:59.400 --> 1:29:01.720 to play. My part of this team is gonna win championships. 1:29:02.000 --> 1:29:05.120 Jamie and I understand that we are the last vestiges 1:29:05.439 --> 1:29:08.080 in hip hop um one of the last that are 1:29:08.200 --> 1:29:11.559 is prepared to give you a full musical experience in 1:29:11.600 --> 1:29:13.720 a way that that you don't have to in hip hop. 1:29:13.760 --> 1:29:16.120 To be very frank with you, you can have hit records, 1:29:16.200 --> 1:29:18.120 you could drop them, You can do that for twenty 1:29:18.200 --> 1:29:22.519 thirty years, but there's something about completing that record. There's 1:29:22.520 --> 1:29:26.040 something about following a group that takes you through that art. 1:29:26.360 --> 1:29:28.720 It pulls you back again and again. It is the 1:29:28.760 --> 1:29:31.439 reason I love Outcast. It is the reason I love 1:29:31.520 --> 1:29:34.160 Tribe Call Quest. It is the reason I love Gang Star. 1:29:34.439 --> 1:29:36.120 It is the reason I love you g K. If 1:29:36.160 --> 1:29:39.000 you haven't listened to you g K Ryan, Dirty, Miss 1:29:39.120 --> 1:29:43.080 get Stoned as Fun Bob and you g CA's riding 1:29:43.120 --> 1:29:46.800 Dirty because all the skits were done by Smoked, who 1:29:46.880 --> 1:29:51.000 was in jail. So he's he's talking you. You're hearing 1:29:51.040 --> 1:29:53.680 a real occurrence, like so those are the things to 1:29:53.800 --> 1:29:56.679 me Scarface Records. When you will hear j Prince talk 1:29:56.800 --> 1:29:59.040 at the beginning and end of the records, it was 1:29:59.080 --> 1:30:01.080 like going to the play as a kid. You hear 1:30:01.120 --> 1:30:03.479 that order, you set the scene for you just like 1:30:04.080 --> 1:30:08.320 uh yeah, back again and for the next hour, I 1:30:08.360 --> 1:30:10.320 just didn't give a ship what was happening outside of 1:30:10.360 --> 1:30:13.400 my room. So for for us, the hit is the 1:30:13.439 --> 1:30:17.479 record at giving you that full thirty forty fifty minute 1:30:17.520 --> 1:30:23.360 experience of cohesiveness and tapestry of the goods, the bads, 1:30:23.439 --> 1:30:26.719 the wins, the losses. It's you know, it's almost cliche 1:30:26.800 --> 1:30:29.240 to say a movie on audio, but it is a 1:30:29.320 --> 1:30:33.479 theatric experience on audio, and and that's what you try 1:30:33.520 --> 1:30:36.360 to master again and again and again. And you are 1:30:36.400 --> 1:30:38.920 talking to two guys who put who put every single 1:30:38.920 --> 1:30:40.880 record out, but we also give it away for free. 1:30:40.960 --> 1:30:43.960 So if we were completely obsessed with oh yeah, with money. 1:30:44.600 --> 1:30:46.439 Actually I want to I want to get to that, 1:30:46.479 --> 1:30:49.000 but I want to stop one spot before because you're 1:30:49.000 --> 1:30:52.160 talking about movies, Mike, what did you learn about doing 1:30:52.200 --> 1:30:55.799 your Netflix show man? What I learned was it's not easy, 1:30:55.880 --> 1:30:58.080 all right, So television not easy. Anybody can't just get 1:30:58.120 --> 1:30:59.920 on TV and be a star, no matter how cares 1:31:00.000 --> 1:31:03.799 attic you are. I don't want to work for sixteen 1:31:03.840 --> 1:31:07.320 hour days anymore unless um the money is life changing, 1:31:07.439 --> 1:31:10.480 but the show of life changing. So I have no regrets. 1:31:10.920 --> 1:31:14.280 I learned that, Um did I have a talent for television, 1:31:14.400 --> 1:31:16.960 and you're more likely than not gonna see me on 1:31:17.000 --> 1:31:19.360 television a lot more if I have anything to do 1:31:19.439 --> 1:31:23.040 with it. Um. I have loved hip hop and television 1:31:23.080 --> 1:31:26.200 since I was a child. Um, And unlike working four 1:31:26.320 --> 1:31:29.240 or five hours at UPS or AutoZone, I could work 1:31:29.320 --> 1:31:32.320 sixteen or twenty hours and wouldn't flinch. I would love it, 1:31:32.400 --> 1:31:35.280 and I would hate every minute I was doing anything 1:31:35.400 --> 1:31:38.160 that was not artistic and creative by way of music 1:31:38.240 --> 1:31:42.240 or television, and I'm absolutely obsessed with doing more of it. Okay, 1:31:42.240 --> 1:31:45.360 what did you literally learn from doing the show? I 1:31:45.439 --> 1:31:49.360 learned that people are always going to well, not always. 1:31:49.560 --> 1:31:53.120 I learned that celebrity is probably the most powerful piece 1:31:53.120 --> 1:31:57.000 of propaganda, um in this country. On the last episode, 1:31:57.040 --> 1:32:00.960 there was a young woman who was just more qualified 1:32:00.960 --> 1:32:03.559 to lead than me. She had worked with the people, 1:32:03.600 --> 1:32:05.640 she had walked amongst them. She knew the issues and 1:32:05.680 --> 1:32:08.840 the concerns and the campaigns that they wanted waged, and 1:32:08.840 --> 1:32:10.680 they still voted for me at the end because the 1:32:10.760 --> 1:32:13.880 perception was it was my show. The perception was I 1:32:13.920 --> 1:32:16.519 had more money, and the perception was that I was 1:32:16.560 --> 1:32:20.479 more popular. Um. That's when, on a Marie micro level, 1:32:20.920 --> 1:32:24.120 I understood what's happening in this country now. Um. The 1:32:24.160 --> 1:32:27.240 reason that we have someone who's potentially a tiring or 1:32:27.280 --> 1:32:30.599 despot in this country is because over the last thirty years, 1:32:30.600 --> 1:32:34.680 they they crafted him. Um or he's he's been in 1:32:34.720 --> 1:32:40.280 your living room via WWF wrestling, via his own television shows. 1:32:40.600 --> 1:32:44.160 He's one of the most mentioned people in rap songs. UM. 1:32:44.240 --> 1:32:47.200 So I learned the power of celebrity and and and 1:32:47.240 --> 1:32:50.160 which makes me far more cautious was how I use 1:32:50.200 --> 1:32:53.600 it and who I stand next to um, Because celebrity 1:32:53.640 --> 1:32:56.879 can be the most powerful piece of propaganda the capitalistic society, 1:32:57.240 --> 1:32:59.320 and it could lead us all down hallways. I don't 1:32:59.320 --> 1:33:01.280 think you need to go Okay, let's go back to 1:33:01.320 --> 1:33:06.679 the records. In terms of your income file, how much 1:33:06.760 --> 1:33:09.639 comes from recordings, how much you know you know before 1:33:09.680 --> 1:33:12.840 this crazy pandemic stuff, how much comes to recording, how 1:33:12.920 --> 1:33:15.479 much comes from live, how much comes from merch or 1:33:15.520 --> 1:33:19.440 if you have another revenue stream. I would sly live first. 1:33:19.600 --> 1:33:22.640 Live has traditionally been one of the biggest sources of 1:33:22.760 --> 1:33:25.439 gonna come for us. I mean, we've toured obsessively like 1:33:25.479 --> 1:33:27.160 a rock band. When we got the chance to tour 1:33:27.240 --> 1:33:29.200 for a year and a half straight, we toured for 1:33:29.200 --> 1:33:31.160 a year and half straight, and damn there fucking broke 1:33:31.200 --> 1:33:34.000 our spirits. But we were we we knew that this 1:33:34.080 --> 1:33:36.920 was a rare opportunity that people still wanted us to 1:33:36.920 --> 1:33:39.040 tour even a year and a half after our records. 1:33:39.400 --> 1:33:41.920 We we've we've got in a reputation for our live 1:33:41.960 --> 1:33:44.280 show and then has catapulted us up into the upper 1:33:44.280 --> 1:33:47.519 Aschlans where our font size has grown from. You have 1:33:47.560 --> 1:33:50.120 to have a magnifying glass too. It's at the top, 1:33:50.320 --> 1:33:54.400 you know, And that's an amazing thing to accomplish for us. Traditionally, 1:33:54.479 --> 1:33:56.760 that's really been where we made the money. And I 1:33:56.840 --> 1:33:58.679 think that we have we have a lot of we 1:33:58.560 --> 1:34:00.080 and we and we do well with merch and we 1:34:00.160 --> 1:34:03.480 do well with licensing. We get a lot of licensing. 1:34:03.800 --> 1:34:06.760 People love our music for film and tv UM, which 1:34:06.760 --> 1:34:10.240 has been amazing for us UM. And I think that 1:34:10.280 --> 1:34:12.280 one of the one of the calculations that we made 1:34:12.280 --> 1:34:16.080 originally was when we did this, was it was sort 1:34:16.120 --> 1:34:18.400 of not a genuine calculation, but it was more of 1:34:18.439 --> 1:34:20.880 a spiritual calculation where we were like, well, let's give 1:34:20.960 --> 1:34:22.880 this ship away for free because we don't have any 1:34:22.880 --> 1:34:25.000 money behind us. Let's see if we can get the 1:34:25.040 --> 1:34:27.160 hearts in the minds of people because the music is 1:34:27.160 --> 1:34:29.160 going to react. Uh, they're going to react to the 1:34:29.240 --> 1:34:31.080 music in a positive way. We didn't know what was 1:34:31.080 --> 1:34:33.920 gonna happen. We just thought it was a gesture. We 1:34:33.960 --> 1:34:36.160 figured we want to have a relationship with people, so 1:34:36.240 --> 1:34:38.479 let's see if we don't put a wall between them 1:34:38.479 --> 1:34:41.160 and and having this music. If someone doesn't have to 1:34:41.200 --> 1:34:44.360 have a subscription to some streaming service, or if someone 1:34:44.439 --> 1:34:47.559 can't afford something that they don't know about, they're probably 1:34:47.600 --> 1:34:49.840 not going to buy it. Um. So we put it 1:34:49.840 --> 1:34:53.360 out there for free, and we assumed correctly that if 1:34:53.400 --> 1:34:55.840 people liked it, we get the chance to perform, and 1:34:55.920 --> 1:34:58.120 if people came to the show, then we can make 1:34:58.160 --> 1:35:00.040 a living and we could sell some merch And it 1:35:00.160 --> 1:35:02.400 was kind of as as as complicated as a god 1:35:02.439 --> 1:35:05.160 when we first started. We just didn't know what was 1:35:05.200 --> 1:35:07.800 gonna happen. We've been very lucky. We've we've got the 1:35:07.880 --> 1:35:11.600 chance to do a lot of business based around this 1:35:11.840 --> 1:35:16.200 and still maintain our ability to to adhere to that 1:35:16.280 --> 1:35:20.280 principle of giving people something. And our thought behind that is, look, 1:35:20.360 --> 1:35:22.920 we want your heart and your mind. We want to 1:35:22.960 --> 1:35:26.439 earn um. We want to earn this and and when 1:35:26.439 --> 1:35:28.760 we do earn it, when you do finally spend that 1:35:28.800 --> 1:35:31.120 buck with us. We wanted to be because you just 1:35:31.160 --> 1:35:33.400 decided you had to. You like these guys, you like 1:35:33.520 --> 1:35:36.760 this music, You're gonna spend this book because you got 1:35:36.760 --> 1:35:38.679 the chance to think about it. It didn't we didn't 1:35:38.720 --> 1:35:40.800 trick you into buying an album because we had one 1:35:40.800 --> 1:35:44.000 hot single, here's the fucking album. And when we first 1:35:44.040 --> 1:35:47.400 started that ship, when we would go to distribute distribution 1:35:47.479 --> 1:35:49.519 companies or labels or whatever, they looked at us like, 1:35:49.560 --> 1:35:51.920 we were fucking crazy, what are you talking about. You're 1:35:51.920 --> 1:35:53.880 not going to give the record away for free? And 1:35:53.920 --> 1:35:56.439 we said, no, actually, we are doing that, and if 1:35:56.439 --> 1:35:58.360 you'd like to, you know, get a business with us, 1:35:58.400 --> 1:36:00.760 you can do that too. But time we got around 1:36:00.760 --> 1:36:02.960 a run until three, everybody was like, so, we're giving 1:36:03.000 --> 1:36:06.120 it away for free, right, you know, you know, and 1:36:06.160 --> 1:36:07.880 we were like, yeah, we're gonna give it away for free. 1:36:07.920 --> 1:36:11.200 Minute now, give us this check, you know, and you know, 1:36:11.600 --> 1:36:14.680 so it's been a very organic approach to us. You know, 1:36:14.720 --> 1:36:17.240 it's been a leap of faith the whole time. Um. 1:36:17.280 --> 1:36:18.960 And the one thing that we knew was that if 1:36:19.000 --> 1:36:20.960 we you know, going back to the shell thing, you know, 1:36:21.040 --> 1:36:24.439 like we fucking work our asses off to de great 1:36:24.479 --> 1:36:27.360 performers and the kid pit shows, and and that is 1:36:27.400 --> 1:36:29.400 something that we take really seriously because we knew it 1:36:29.479 --> 1:36:31.480 was one of the only things that at our disposal 1:36:31.560 --> 1:36:34.439 that we could really control that levels the playing field. 1:36:34.760 --> 1:36:37.639 We we we never had a ship hunt of money 1:36:37.640 --> 1:36:39.479 behind us. We never had a ship to the promotion 1:36:39.520 --> 1:36:42.080 behind us, but you were not going to see a 1:36:42.160 --> 1:36:44.200 show like you're gonna see when you see our show. 1:36:44.520 --> 1:36:48.559 This is we are in a different category on purpose, 1:36:48.600 --> 1:36:51.280 We're in a different category of performance when it comes 1:36:51.320 --> 1:36:53.639 to you know, the ship around us. Not to say 1:36:53.640 --> 1:36:55.559 we're the best performers in the world and no one 1:36:55.600 --> 1:36:58.720 else is. Every there's amazing performers out there. We just 1:36:58.840 --> 1:37:02.439 knew that we wanted to if we got that chance 1:37:02.439 --> 1:37:03.760 to get in front of people, that we were going 1:37:03.800 --> 1:37:06.120 to give them an experience that where they knew we 1:37:06.120 --> 1:37:08.679 were taking a ship seriously, like he goes are Michael 1:37:08.760 --> 1:37:13.120 Jackson kicks though, I think for a big I think 1:37:13.160 --> 1:37:19.000 I think that that's what really pushed us over the edge. Yeah, okay, 1:37:19.120 --> 1:37:22.600 just staying on that same tip, Kanye has been on 1:37:22.880 --> 1:37:27.880 wild about the traditional major label business. And you know, 1:37:27.920 --> 1:37:32.360 the unfortunate thing with Kanye is he's literally ill, irrelevant. 1:37:32.439 --> 1:37:35.280 You know, he's bipolar. Anybody who's dealt with him, you 1:37:35.320 --> 1:37:39.200 know he's not the usual customer. Shall I say, is 1:37:39.240 --> 1:37:42.479 this something you see as a side show for you 1:37:42.960 --> 1:37:45.400 that you were doing your own thing, or is this 1:37:45.479 --> 1:37:50.280 something you have of you point on, just because you're 1:37:50.320 --> 1:37:54.599 ill doesn't mean you're dumb. No. I first, he's brilliant. Yeah, 1:37:54.920 --> 1:37:56.680 so I love me just as a son of a 1:37:56.720 --> 1:38:00.200 manic depressed My mother was brilliant. But like you say, 1:38:00.240 --> 1:38:01.600 it could be, it could be, it could be a 1:38:01.640 --> 1:38:05.160 little madness around the brilliance. But Jamie has had an 1:38:05.200 --> 1:38:08.320 answer um over the years that that makes so much sense. 1:38:08.360 --> 1:38:12.519 It's it's it's it's really in whatever works best for you. Now, 1:38:12.680 --> 1:38:15.280 you know it's wrong to trick artists how the masters 1:38:15.320 --> 1:38:17.600 and publishing, and think what's wrong for us not to 1:38:17.640 --> 1:38:20.000 share some some of mastering to be able to control 1:38:20.280 --> 1:38:22.400 if it's wrong the trick artists out of publishing, which 1:38:22.439 --> 1:38:25.400 we know happened in the thirties, forties, fifties, sixty, seventies, eighties. 1:38:25.840 --> 1:38:28.320 You know, we know that. But it's also you know, 1:38:28.439 --> 1:38:32.200 once educated and once you know, once people know certain deals, 1:38:32.280 --> 1:38:33.960 you know what I mean, it's it's gonna be you 1:38:34.000 --> 1:38:37.479 to decide. Jamie and I could have did bigger deals 1:38:37.560 --> 1:38:41.240 than the big deal we did. We chose to remain 1:38:41.479 --> 1:38:44.559 and keep some of our autonomy, so we took less 1:38:44.600 --> 1:38:48.120 of things in order to be more of us. Because 1:38:48.880 --> 1:38:51.080 once you marriage and married, and it's hard to get 1:38:51.080 --> 1:38:53.280 out of a marriage, you know what I mean. So, UM, 1:38:53.520 --> 1:38:56.639 I respect his words, like in terms of I don't 1:38:56.680 --> 1:38:59.800 have any say on whether I'm arguing for against or 1:38:59.800 --> 1:39:02.800 what them, but I respect someone who says something and 1:39:02.840 --> 1:39:07.000 then the next day says, I'm giving Artist of Theirs back, 1:39:07.280 --> 1:39:11.519 because that's beyond saying that's doing. Everything Kanye is saying 1:39:11.720 --> 1:39:15.040 is right, It's just it's caught up in the history 1:39:15.160 --> 1:39:18.639 of everything else he's doing, like running for president, and said, yeah, 1:39:18.720 --> 1:39:22.759 but he's doing it also, Darren lasted difference, lasts of difference, 1:39:22.760 --> 1:39:25.960 you know, like the correction Mike, he's not saying and 1:39:26.000 --> 1:39:29.200 I don't like talking about other people because it always 1:39:29.240 --> 1:39:32.880 becomes sensationalized. But what he's actually saying and people are 1:39:32.920 --> 1:39:36.720 interpreting and is like he's giving them fifty back. What 1:39:36.840 --> 1:39:40.559 he's saying is I'm giving them my steak exactly. Yeah, 1:39:40.720 --> 1:39:42.720 I was gonna saying he's not giving my fifty that 1:39:42.880 --> 1:39:46.759 all I'm giving them what I get. Yeah, And you know, hey, 1:39:46.800 --> 1:39:51.920 great listen. You know for us, you know I think that, Um, 1:39:52.040 --> 1:39:54.720 we walk into everything with our eyes open and we're 1:39:54.800 --> 1:39:57.639 very deliberate about what we're doing, you know, business wise, 1:39:57.800 --> 1:40:00.920 and and like he said, we made our decision based 1:40:00.960 --> 1:40:04.400 on what we believe we need in terms of autonomy. 1:40:04.439 --> 1:40:07.559 For instance, um, we could have had you know, there 1:40:07.560 --> 1:40:09.519 are different deals that we could have taken, but what 1:40:09.600 --> 1:40:11.920 we wanted was to do a deal where we didn't 1:40:11.920 --> 1:40:14.839 know someone more than one record. That was very important 1:40:14.880 --> 1:40:16.960 to us. UM. That came out of a lot of 1:40:17.000 --> 1:40:19.120 experience over the years, and that came out of us 1:40:19.280 --> 1:40:22.439 understanding the importance of being able to bargain and also 1:40:22.479 --> 1:40:24.920 the importance of being able to hold the people that 1:40:25.000 --> 1:40:27.639 you're working with to some sort of standard. I think 1:40:27.640 --> 1:40:29.759 that it is a mistake for people to get into 1:40:30.200 --> 1:40:33.400 um my personal thought is that it was a mistake 1:40:33.479 --> 1:40:35.799 for us. I'm not able to say people it's a mistake. 1:40:35.800 --> 1:40:37.280 It was. It would be a mistake for us to 1:40:37.280 --> 1:40:41.400 get into some long protracted contractual thing with anybody who 1:40:41.479 --> 1:40:44.320 we don't know are going to go to bad for us. 1:40:44.640 --> 1:40:46.840 And if you do go to bad for us, you 1:40:46.920 --> 1:40:51.160 get rewarded with a relationship. And we're very you know, 1:40:51.320 --> 1:40:54.840 we're very real about that. UM. So I think that 1:40:54.960 --> 1:40:59.080 um uh. For me and Mike, we look at everything 1:40:59.240 --> 1:41:01.680 and just us everything in every mood that we make 1:41:02.040 --> 1:41:04.880 really as a part of how we see what are 1:41:04.920 --> 1:41:07.720 what we want our options to be. Um, it can 1:41:07.760 --> 1:41:10.120 be restricted because it doesn't mean that you don't It 1:41:10.160 --> 1:41:12.360 means that we're not going out there and getting you know, 1:41:12.920 --> 1:41:15.320 you know several you know, like you know, we're not 1:41:15.360 --> 1:41:17.679 going out there and getting a fifteen million dollar recording 1:41:17.720 --> 1:41:21.120 contract because we don't want you, um, we don't want 1:41:21.120 --> 1:41:25.599 to give away in the next four albums, you know. Um. Okay, 1:41:25.640 --> 1:41:27.439 So you two guys, you make a lot of money 1:41:27.479 --> 1:41:30.760 from going on the road. There's a long history of 1:41:30.800 --> 1:41:35.040 African Americans on the road and racism and even white 1:41:35.080 --> 1:41:38.640 people who have traveled with African Americans. You're sort of 1:41:38.640 --> 1:41:41.720 a unique act. There are other multiracial acts, but in 1:41:41.760 --> 1:41:45.439 your particular case, there's only two guys. Do you guys 1:41:45.680 --> 1:41:52.080 experience racism? I'm talking about you. I know, I know, Mom, 1:41:52.080 --> 1:41:54.479 I know, Michael say general there's racing on the road 1:41:54.960 --> 1:41:57.360 and you know and Jamie are there are times you 1:41:57.400 --> 1:41:59.720 say that people people will talk to you as a 1:41:59.800 --> 1:42:03.920 poe us to talk to Mike, or they'll treat you differently. No, No, 1:42:04.040 --> 1:42:06.040 I haven't. I haven't quite noticed that But what I 1:42:06.080 --> 1:42:08.040 have noticed is that there's this there's this thing that 1:42:08.160 --> 1:42:11.479 there's this dynamic between me and Mike that that puts 1:42:11.520 --> 1:42:14.000 people in this awkward position because what a lot of 1:42:14.000 --> 1:42:17.679 people want to ask us, but they can't because they're 1:42:17.720 --> 1:42:21.080 too conflicted and constricted in themselves. And we've called people 1:42:21.080 --> 1:42:22.920 out on it and been like just to ask man 1:42:23.120 --> 1:42:26.439 just had what we do experience as this multi racial 1:42:26.680 --> 1:42:28.880 group of friends who go out on the road, is 1:42:28.920 --> 1:42:32.880 that when we talk to people, people just want to ask, 1:42:33.560 --> 1:42:37.439 how is it possible that your friends, uh, you know? 1:42:37.600 --> 1:42:39.679 And they just don't. They just want to know they 1:42:39.560 --> 1:42:42.040 they don't know because they don't have that same experience. 1:42:42.240 --> 1:42:44.120 I grew up in New York City. I grew up 1:42:44.120 --> 1:42:47.240 in a very multicultural in New York City. Um it 1:42:47.400 --> 1:42:51.559 was um and I I thought New York was it 1:42:51.600 --> 1:42:53.360 was like a micro causem of the world when I 1:42:53.400 --> 1:42:55.000 was when I was a kid, I just assume that 1:42:55.080 --> 1:42:57.800 because I grew up in New York that that I 1:42:58.240 --> 1:43:00.320 that I knew how the world worked, and I prepared 1:43:00.400 --> 1:43:02.400 me for going everywhere. And you know that I prepared 1:43:02.439 --> 1:43:04.759 me for getting everywhere. And what I realized I didn't 1:43:04.760 --> 1:43:07.280 really get to see America. Until I started touring, I 1:43:07.320 --> 1:43:09.519 didn't get you know, and I started touring in my 1:43:09.600 --> 1:43:12.679 early pointies, I didn't get to see. I didn't know 1:43:12.960 --> 1:43:15.600 that not only was what I said wrong, but it 1:43:15.680 --> 1:43:18.160 was actually in verse. And actually growing up in New 1:43:18.200 --> 1:43:20.240 York was one of the biggest handicaps you could ever 1:43:20.280 --> 1:43:23.479 fucking have when it comes to the Greater America. And 1:43:23.600 --> 1:43:27.000 I was shocked to see the And yes there had 1:43:27.040 --> 1:43:29.680 I have been in situations where people that I was 1:43:29.720 --> 1:43:31.800 with who were black, or people that I was with 1:43:31.920 --> 1:43:35.680 who were Asian, or people that UM had It's like 1:43:35.960 --> 1:43:38.800 right in front of my face. Absolutely experienced crazy, like 1:43:38.880 --> 1:43:42.559 crazy ship like you know, very obvious racism for sure. 1:43:42.800 --> 1:43:44.439 I think that me and Mike were were at what 1:43:44.560 --> 1:43:48.280 we experienced is more like a discomfort in people who 1:43:48.360 --> 1:43:51.040 you know, want to get to the bottom of this thing, 1:43:51.160 --> 1:43:53.360 like they talked to us and you know, and they're 1:43:53.400 --> 1:43:56.439 just like they want so desperately to ask the question, 1:43:56.560 --> 1:43:58.720 like I don't you know, I'm just to say I 1:43:58.720 --> 1:44:02.400 don't understand. It's like it's cool, man, we get that 1:44:02.520 --> 1:44:04.840 it's cool. You can say it just as just ask, 1:44:05.080 --> 1:44:08.160 you know, But that particular scenario that you're describing where 1:44:08.200 --> 1:44:10.320 like I'm getting treated well and Mike isn't getting treated 1:44:10.360 --> 1:44:13.040 well because to my knowledge, I don't remember that we 1:44:13.200 --> 1:44:16.360 directly encountered that very obviously, but maybe Mike can illuminate 1:44:16.400 --> 1:44:19.639 me to that you have a prospective on this life 1:44:19.640 --> 1:44:22.519 perspect I'm a black man, just you know, you see 1:44:22.560 --> 1:44:28.439 this ship everywhere, so it's like, but it's it's not. 1:44:28.640 --> 1:44:30.840 I grew up in the South, So I took my 1:44:30.880 --> 1:44:33.920 wife to the Florida Panhandle a few weeks back, and 1:44:33.960 --> 1:44:36.719 we grow through George, Alabama, and Florida, and every state 1:44:36.800 --> 1:44:39.360 had still has their version of the Confederate flag as 1:44:39.439 --> 1:44:42.400 the state flag. So it's not like something that I 1:44:42.439 --> 1:44:45.960 haven't learned to live with. But I grew up the 1:44:45.960 --> 1:44:50.080 opposite of Jamie. I grew up in a totally black environment. 1:44:50.600 --> 1:44:53.000 My side of town was black, my neighborhood was black. 1:44:53.320 --> 1:44:55.519 My schools were black. They were named for black people. 1:44:55.600 --> 1:44:58.920 The principal was black, the superintendent was black, my mayor 1:44:59.080 --> 1:45:02.160 was black. So I grew up um and it was 1:45:02.200 --> 1:45:05.040 easy for me to be friends with Jamie because all 1:45:05.080 --> 1:45:07.920 of my heroes and villains looked like me. So what 1:45:08.080 --> 1:45:10.600 Dr King said about judging people by the content of 1:45:10.640 --> 1:45:13.679 their character was something that I got to do pretty 1:45:13.720 --> 1:45:17.439 easily because again, all the good people and assholes in 1:45:17.479 --> 1:45:20.479 my life had been black people, so I understood that, 1:45:20.880 --> 1:45:23.800 like James Baldwin tried to help people understand, we can 1:45:23.840 --> 1:45:25.439 be all those things. We can be sinner as we 1:45:25.439 --> 1:45:27.120 can say so, we could be good, we could be bad. 1:45:27.360 --> 1:45:29.719 So it was a lot easier for me to get 1:45:30.000 --> 1:45:34.040 to to not engage in the all white people are 1:45:34.040 --> 1:45:38.160 are are diametrically opposed to me. You know, as I 1:45:38.200 --> 1:45:40.400 got older and understand a little nuanced, I was like, 1:45:40.439 --> 1:45:42.200 you know, some white people are just too quiet at 1:45:42.200 --> 1:45:44.840 the wrong times, and that's that's not the same thing 1:45:44.880 --> 1:45:47.280 as being evil, but you do got a bump them like, hey, 1:45:47.479 --> 1:45:50.360 you should fucking say something right now, you know. But 1:45:50.600 --> 1:45:53.600 as a band, we do not go out and experience 1:45:53.840 --> 1:45:57.599 terrible amounts of racism. We've we've we've had subtle ship 1:45:57.760 --> 1:46:00.920 happened at Hotel check Is where they are realize that 1:46:01.120 --> 1:46:03.639 our white road managers working for both of us. As 1:46:03.640 --> 1:46:06.960 they're telling me the hold we've had, you know, German 1:46:06.960 --> 1:46:09.599 police officers opened the door, you know what I'm saying. 1:46:09.680 --> 1:46:12.559 And my wife, you know, um, my wife put all 1:46:12.560 --> 1:46:14.680 the full Muslim guards so that they don't funk with 1:46:14.720 --> 1:46:16.760 her because they don't want that bad. But in terms 1:46:16.800 --> 1:46:18.800 of me, they searched to shoot out of me, like 1:46:19.200 --> 1:46:22.479 I come breaking on into the country. But we we 1:46:22.600 --> 1:46:26.080 have been lucky in that when people physically see us too, 1:46:26.479 --> 1:46:28.960 they see that there's a harmony there, even on our 1:46:29.000 --> 1:46:31.000 worst days. This is my brother's my friend. I love 1:46:31.080 --> 1:46:33.120 my friend and brother. So when we hit the streets 1:46:33.160 --> 1:46:35.559 like we're two Americans, you know, if we're out of 1:46:35.560 --> 1:46:37.720 the country, looking over each other's shoulders, making sure each 1:46:37.760 --> 1:46:40.000 other's okay, And if we're in America, I'm making sure 1:46:40.080 --> 1:46:43.160 Jamie's okay, He's making sure I'm okay. So what we represent, 1:46:43.280 --> 1:46:46.120 before one world gets told is a friendship and the 1:46:46.240 --> 1:46:50.040 possibility to have people that are friends, that are not 1:46:50.120 --> 1:46:53.120 from the same place, not culturally or ethnically the same, 1:46:53.360 --> 1:46:56.479 and yet somehow enjoy balance and the kinship. And I 1:46:56.520 --> 1:46:58.720 love the fact that our friendship just shows that, so 1:46:58.760 --> 1:47:00.960 we don't have to say it a lot, you know, 1:47:01.520 --> 1:47:06.240 forgetting color. Okay. The music world is littered with people 1:47:06.240 --> 1:47:10.719 who couldn't stand each other. All of the South, south 1:47:10.720 --> 1:47:15.479 of the Everly Brothers couldn't stand each other. Bands break 1:47:15.560 --> 1:47:18.479 up because they couldn't stand each other. You're in the reno, 1:47:18.960 --> 1:47:21.439 you're in the bus. You know, you played then X 1:47:21.520 --> 1:47:23.200 number of people, you're god. Then you're with the same 1:47:23.240 --> 1:47:26.519 asshole that you know every day. So my question is, 1:47:27.280 --> 1:47:29.680 do you really like each other? You're really friends? And 1:47:29.720 --> 1:47:32.960 do you have blow ups or you know, what's the status? 1:47:33.000 --> 1:47:37.360 Here's the answer On the end of our album. There's 1:47:37.360 --> 1:47:42.559 a skit right and and and it's a and it's 1:47:42.600 --> 1:47:45.800 a sort of it's a sort of an homage to 1:47:45.880 --> 1:47:48.320 like the eighties action TV shows to me and I 1:47:48.320 --> 1:47:51.800 grew up on like Dukes of Hazard, night Rider. You know, 1:47:54.600 --> 1:47:57.719 we got all that called Yankee and the Brave and 1:47:57.720 --> 1:48:02.360 and in the in the Skin the Narrow says they 1:48:02.880 --> 1:48:06.240 they friends exactly, these guys have a better chance of 1:48:06.320 --> 1:48:10.720 killing each other. Right, Uh, then what is it these 1:48:10.760 --> 1:48:14.640 guys brothers killing And they said, these guys have a 1:48:14.640 --> 1:48:17.640 better chance of killing each other than something something and 1:48:17.680 --> 1:48:20.320 then and then and then and then an area says, no, sir, 1:48:20.439 --> 1:48:24.800 their brothers, And um, I think that that's the truth. Look, 1:48:24.840 --> 1:48:26.760 me and Mike do have boops. Me and Mike do 1:48:26.960 --> 1:48:29.679 have issues with each other that we end up ironing out. 1:48:30.040 --> 1:48:33.360 But we have real personality conflicts, and we have conflicts 1:48:33.439 --> 1:48:36.559 that come with being in close quarters and someone. We 1:48:36.640 --> 1:48:39.920 have conflicts that come with you know, years and years 1:48:39.960 --> 1:48:42.759 of wanting something from someone and and and and trying 1:48:42.760 --> 1:48:45.479 to trying to make their personality fit what you want 1:48:45.680 --> 1:48:48.160 it to be versus what it really is. And and 1:48:48.240 --> 1:48:49.920 at the end of the day, the reason that we 1:48:50.000 --> 1:48:52.840 keep going is because we just fucked up and fell 1:48:52.880 --> 1:48:55.560 in love with each other and became a family. And 1:48:55.560 --> 1:48:58.799 and you know, you don't walk away from family and easily, 1:48:58.920 --> 1:49:01.639 you don't. You know you this, you know, and it's 1:49:01.640 --> 1:49:05.120 a different criteria. And yes, we're friends too, and and 1:49:05.160 --> 1:49:08.200 when we're at our best, we're great friends. And there 1:49:08.240 --> 1:49:10.720 are lots of times when we're not feeling each other. 1:49:10.760 --> 1:49:12.920 It's just a fact, like me and might have known 1:49:12.960 --> 1:49:16.120 each other now for enough time to get over the honeymoon. 1:49:16.479 --> 1:49:19.599 And look, man, most people don't survive past the honeymoon. Usually. 1:49:19.760 --> 1:49:22.920 Usually that's like the honeymoon is over, the group is over, 1:49:23.320 --> 1:49:27.160 and we have survived passed the honeymoon to the point 1:49:27.200 --> 1:49:29.679 where we can genuinely say that we look, I don't 1:49:29.680 --> 1:49:32.479 consider people my real friend until I can tell them 1:49:32.520 --> 1:49:36.960 genuinely to go funk themselves, like like you know, like 1:49:37.000 --> 1:49:39.439 a friend is a motherfucker. You can tell go fund 1:49:39.479 --> 1:49:41.200 yourself and you know that you're gonna be able to 1:49:41.200 --> 1:49:44.760 call tomorrow. And and it's not easy, and it's not 1:49:45.120 --> 1:49:47.880 but but we've been around long enough, man. We constantly 1:49:47.920 --> 1:49:51.519 remind each other that, you know, the truth is that 1:49:51.760 --> 1:49:54.200 we have to completely can we have to We have 1:49:54.280 --> 1:49:57.320 to constantly earn each other. That's a fact. Like it's 1:49:57.320 --> 1:49:59.320 not something you can take for granted. It's not like, oh, 1:49:59.360 --> 1:50:01.719 you can do any thing and it's just cool because 1:50:01.720 --> 1:50:03.960 we'll job just be there tomorrow. We we we we 1:50:04.040 --> 1:50:08.120 know that we've got to earn each other. But the 1:50:08.160 --> 1:50:10.599 fact of the matter is that we've seen things. We've 1:50:10.600 --> 1:50:13.240 seen good things go bad. We were old enough to 1:50:13.360 --> 1:50:16.240 have seen good situations go the wrong way and for 1:50:16.280 --> 1:50:19.880 people to lose out on stuff because they weren't emotionally 1:50:19.920 --> 1:50:23.040 mature enough to at least take a step back and say, 1:50:23.439 --> 1:50:25.479 let's talk about this before and this gets any further. 1:50:25.920 --> 1:50:28.400 And I think that if running Jewels had happened in 1:50:28.479 --> 1:50:31.200 an earlier time in our lives, me and I probably 1:50:31.200 --> 1:50:34.400 wouldn't have been on running jewels for we probably would 1:50:34.400 --> 1:50:36.320 have just, you know, done a couple of records and 1:50:36.400 --> 1:50:41.519 been out because it can get tough, and it's constantly something. 1:50:41.560 --> 1:50:44.960 It's constantly something that we talked about in the context 1:50:45.080 --> 1:50:49.040 of making sure if all us fails, if we're sucking 1:50:49.040 --> 1:50:53.200 not feeling each other, we at least do know logically 1:50:53.840 --> 1:50:56.160 that this is the same old story that we've seen 1:50:56.200 --> 1:50:58.960 happen to other people. And if we know that logically, 1:50:59.280 --> 1:51:01.360 then we can get to the end of this, which 1:51:01.400 --> 1:51:03.720 is the happy ending, and work our way backwards. And 1:51:03.760 --> 1:51:07.280 that's what we're trying and do. That's so so, Mike, 1:51:07.400 --> 1:51:10.120 you let the Jamie get the last word. You're happy 1:51:10.160 --> 1:51:13.120 with that. I love it, man. I just a couple 1:51:13.120 --> 1:51:15.639 of words of wisdom. My wife reminds me a lot um. 1:51:15.680 --> 1:51:18.559 If you check my bios, it says um Shea's husband 1:51:18.560 --> 1:51:20.960 in one half of one of the Jews. She reminds me, 1:51:21.000 --> 1:51:25.120 I'm in two marriages and marriage is not easy. Marriage 1:51:25.120 --> 1:51:29.479 is not the honeymoon period, but marriage is worth it. Um. 1:51:29.640 --> 1:51:34.920 I feel about this group, all the excitement, all the getty, 1:51:34.960 --> 1:51:38.719 nervous anxiety that I felt about rap music at twelve 1:51:38.760 --> 1:51:40.400 years old, when I was a kid that just wanted 1:51:40.439 --> 1:51:44.000 to do it. And I'm old enough now to understand 1:51:44.000 --> 1:51:47.000 when my egos getting in the way, or when apathy 1:51:47.040 --> 1:51:49.519 maybe getting in the way, or maybe I'm just fucking 1:51:49.560 --> 1:51:51.919 tired of being on a goddamn bust and there's nobody 1:51:51.960 --> 1:51:56.040 else to grind the gifts with my partner. I'm I'm 1:51:56.080 --> 1:51:57.920 old enough now to kind of stand outside of me 1:51:57.960 --> 1:51:59.640 and be like, you know, well, this is what it is. 1:51:59.680 --> 1:52:04.240 We're also both love this group enough to take Jamie 1:52:04.240 --> 1:52:07.000 and Mike the human beings away and just have talks, 1:52:07.160 --> 1:52:09.320 you know, with one another. And I'm and I'm glad 1:52:09.439 --> 1:52:12.760 because i they're you know, their groups that hate each 1:52:12.800 --> 1:52:14.800 other that's still tour and and give the fans what 1:52:14.840 --> 1:52:17.479 they want their tours. That their groups that still have 1:52:17.680 --> 1:52:19.720 genuine love for each other but refused to get on 1:52:19.760 --> 1:52:23.440 the stage, which robs the fans. And ultimately, this relationship 1:52:23.479 --> 1:52:27.000 is more than Jamie and Mike. People invested into us, 1:52:27.040 --> 1:52:30.720 The fans really invested into us. I always wanted to 1:52:30.800 --> 1:52:33.560 be as big as we are, and bigger as a 1:52:33.640 --> 1:52:36.880 rapper because I first saw rap with run DMC. I 1:52:36.920 --> 1:52:39.400 saw rapp in the arenas I didn't see rapping the club. 1:52:40.160 --> 1:52:42.839 So I want to be on the stage with Jamie 1:52:42.840 --> 1:52:45.920 when I have silver hair and black denim outfits on 1:52:46.040 --> 1:52:48.200 running around that motherfucker like a hip hop a C 1:52:48.360 --> 1:52:51.680 d C. But the only way that happens like I 1:52:51.720 --> 1:52:54.800 wanted to happen is if I'm constantly working on the 1:52:54.840 --> 1:52:58.400 relationship with my friend and brother too. So as much 1:52:58.439 --> 1:53:02.719 as we do dope music together, UM, still a big 1:53:02.760 --> 1:53:07.040 part is just talking and just um having honest conversations 1:53:07.080 --> 1:53:10.360 about us and what's going on. And you know, ship man, 1:53:10.400 --> 1:53:12.280 I went to see a therapist, fucked man with the 1:53:12.560 --> 1:53:15.360 I may lead a fucking country. Fuck this ship. I'm 1:53:15.400 --> 1:53:17.840 just calling to check on you. You know, those type 1:53:17.840 --> 1:53:20.200 of things you shouldn't lose, And sometimes you just need 1:53:20.280 --> 1:53:22.520 to drop off the grid for a month and allow 1:53:22.640 --> 1:53:25.800 each other to have vacation with wife and family. And 1:53:25.840 --> 1:53:29.600 I think that what we understand like a marriage is balanced. 1:53:30.080 --> 1:53:33.040 They're just gonna be times where we balance and counterbalancing 1:53:33.080 --> 1:53:36.160 each other. And if we focus on staying balanced, I 1:53:36.200 --> 1:53:39.080 don't think we ever get unbalanced enough to be as 1:53:39.080 --> 1:53:42.479 shaky as we were, because there's a place where even 1:53:42.720 --> 1:53:47.599 the drama of solving drama becomes something that you don't 1:53:47.640 --> 1:53:50.840 feel like going through. I know certain parts, and when 1:53:50.920 --> 1:53:54.000 you know certain parts, you just evade it by doing 1:53:54.040 --> 1:53:56.599 this because it avoids that part and we can get 1:53:56.640 --> 1:53:58.479 to growing in other parts, you know what I mean. 1:53:58.520 --> 1:54:00.960 And and I feel like I feel like we're we're 1:54:01.000 --> 1:54:04.080 evolving with each album and each year a friendship. So 1:54:04.520 --> 1:54:06.760 it's something that I'm still very excited about in terms 1:54:06.800 --> 1:54:09.960 of not only making music, but just evolving a kinship 1:54:09.960 --> 1:54:12.760 and a friendship with someone who is exactly the same 1:54:12.800 --> 1:54:15.920 age as me. We grew up seeing exactly the same things. 1:54:16.320 --> 1:54:19.800 And it makes this spin around, you know, this lifetime 1:54:19.880 --> 1:54:22.280 a lot less lonely because you know, my wife's a 1:54:22.360 --> 1:54:24.760 younger woman than me. She's a woman. I love being 1:54:24.800 --> 1:54:27.800 married to her. But she's never gonna understand what the 1:54:27.800 --> 1:54:29.800 funk it sounded like the first time you heard b 1:54:29.920 --> 1:54:33.040 DP or two short. You know, she's never gonna understand 1:54:33.520 --> 1:54:37.160 you know what organized what what Organized Noise did by 1:54:37.280 --> 1:54:41.280 opening up Atlanta and having someone in tight kinship with 1:54:41.360 --> 1:54:44.040 like Jamie too. To have that and share that with 1:54:44.160 --> 1:54:46.600 means a lot to me. So the relationship is always 1:54:46.640 --> 1:54:50.360 worth working on. It is and the deeper. The deeper 1:54:50.400 --> 1:54:53.400 we go, the harder the deeper the you know, you 1:54:53.800 --> 1:54:57.000 travel along the path with somebody and you know, the 1:54:57.160 --> 1:55:05.120 more and the issues become sometimes deeper, you know what 1:55:05.160 --> 1:55:07.840 I mean, they get they get harder, something like you 1:55:07.880 --> 1:55:10.720 would think it gets easier, and it does to some degree. 1:55:10.720 --> 1:55:14.080 What I think happens is that it's less ship. And 1:55:14.080 --> 1:55:16.880 then when the ship does pop up, it's deep ship 1:55:17.680 --> 1:55:20.240 and it's like and and and it's shipped. That like 1:55:20.320 --> 1:55:23.920 requires attention. And it doesn't mean that we're always victorious 1:55:23.920 --> 1:55:27.360 in the sense that we can avoid the moment of 1:55:27.480 --> 1:55:30.560 blow up or avoid the moment of pain, you know. 1:55:31.000 --> 1:55:33.880 But again, at the end of the day, we've done 1:55:33.920 --> 1:55:36.200 a good job of trying our best to make sure 1:55:36.240 --> 1:55:39.280 that we don't fucus up. And you know, we already 1:55:39.280 --> 1:55:41.320 fell in love with each other. We know that when 1:55:41.320 --> 1:55:43.680 you know the ending, you know, it makes you try 1:55:43.800 --> 1:55:46.840 harder to to to justify it. It's like, all right, 1:55:46.920 --> 1:55:49.400 I know that the ending is happy, So how do 1:55:49.520 --> 1:55:54.520 we how do we get there? You know? Though I 1:55:54.560 --> 1:55:57.920 love this group alpha ever love them, but man, but 1:55:58.040 --> 1:56:00.720 I saw Italica going to therapy, I just like get 1:56:01.040 --> 1:56:03.680 like I wanted Metallica to go into therapy to be happy, 1:56:03.840 --> 1:56:05.520 but I didn't want to see it, so I promised 1:56:05.560 --> 1:56:08.640 with me and Jamie du group there, we won't put 1:56:08.640 --> 1:56:13.560 it out. Uh. It was like watching your fucking heroes 1:56:13.600 --> 1:56:15.520 talk to the principle. I'm like, why am I the 1:56:15.600 --> 1:56:17.320 only Why am I? They hold on? Why am I 1:56:17.320 --> 1:56:19.800 the only person in the world who didn't like Metallica 1:56:19.920 --> 1:56:23.920 until that? Like I literally like watching that movie, hold on, 1:56:23.960 --> 1:56:25.720 hold on, hold on. Let me just say this. Let 1:56:25.760 --> 1:56:28.280 me just say that watching that movie, I felt like 1:56:28.320 --> 1:56:31.320 watching Spinal Tap. And if you can watch Spinal Tap 1:56:31.400 --> 1:56:34.080 and not like the main characters of Spinal Tap after 1:56:34.120 --> 1:56:37.080 the movie's done, I don't understand you. Like I thought 1:56:37.080 --> 1:56:41.160 this ship was hilarious and fucking endearing. Man, I was like, 1:56:41.640 --> 1:56:46.320 it was just that four minutes, just like James Laws, like, 1:56:46.720 --> 1:56:51.000 like you're human being, you know, and knowing those guys 1:56:51.080 --> 1:56:53.600 and being close to that camp and knowing them before 1:56:53.640 --> 1:56:56.320 the movie. You know, James used to be a drinker, 1:56:56.640 --> 1:57:00.520 and once once he stopped drinking, he was totally different. 1:57:00.920 --> 1:57:02.520 You know. It used to be in his presence and 1:57:02.560 --> 1:57:05.320 it'd be kind of intense, and now he's like a 1:57:06.080 --> 1:57:08.640 you know, a puppy dog. I saw James and a 1:57:08.720 --> 1:57:11.880 hot rod and oh it was old roach style. It was. 1:57:12.120 --> 1:57:14.200 It was low to the ground, it was badass, all 1:57:14.240 --> 1:57:16.640 type of betina. And when he waved at me that 1:57:16.960 --> 1:57:20.040 and Lar's actually coming and standing side stage in our 1:57:20.080 --> 1:57:24.160 show just for me, I just tell him I love him. 1:57:24.200 --> 1:57:27.720 Thank them for making me feel badass as a kid. Man. 1:57:29.240 --> 1:57:31.120 I just watched that movie and I thought that they 1:57:31.160 --> 1:57:35.839 were just I just thought it was great. I was like, great, Well, 1:57:36.040 --> 1:57:38.000 one thing you did is keep the band together. We 1:57:38.040 --> 1:57:41.520 know you guys are gonna be together. Uh, you know, literally, 1:57:41.600 --> 1:57:44.040 we could go on for hours. I got so much 1:57:44.040 --> 1:57:46.720 more to ask, but uh, we're coming to the end 1:57:46.720 --> 1:57:50.080 of the feeling we've known on this one. So gentlemen, 1:57:50.160 --> 1:57:52.520 thanks so much for doing this. Thank you Bob, Thanks 1:57:52.560 --> 1:57:54.520 for having us. Man, it's been a pleasure. And by 1:57:54.560 --> 1:57:56.640 the way, I just want to tell you something. So 1:57:56.680 --> 1:57:59.960 I've been I get your letter and I've been watch 1:58:00.120 --> 1:58:05.000 tweted me. You once tweeted me to give me ship. Yeah, 1:58:05.440 --> 1:58:07.920 I remember, I was wondering my personality was going to 1:58:08.000 --> 1:58:11.080 be like I was wondering if you remember that I 1:58:11.160 --> 1:58:13.040 was just working with you. Man, I get your letter, 1:58:13.040 --> 1:58:15.120 and I've gotten your letter for years and years and years, 1:58:15.360 --> 1:58:19.640 and I was reading your letter every day. And when 1:58:19.720 --> 1:58:23.040 Run the Jewels to drop, I got your letter and 1:58:23.080 --> 1:58:25.160 you talked about Run the Jewels in it, and you 1:58:25.280 --> 1:58:27.880 talked about how we had done the you know, the uh, 1:58:28.320 --> 1:58:31.200 the fake um like the joke sort of like album 1:58:31.240 --> 1:58:33.600 packages or whatever. And I just want to say that 1:58:33.800 --> 1:58:35.440 that was a proud day in my life. I just 1:58:35.480 --> 1:58:37.960 wanted to know that that was that was a problem 1:58:38.080 --> 1:58:40.360 I was. I was like, damn, this is great because 1:58:40.360 --> 1:58:42.080 I didn't expect it, and I just I just read 1:58:42.120 --> 1:58:44.760 your ship every day and it was like, all right, yeah, 1:58:45.000 --> 1:58:48.240 so sorry. I fund with you on Twitter. You got 1:58:48.320 --> 1:58:50.720 only the only thing about working with me on Twitter 1:58:50.800 --> 1:58:52.920 is I can handle. People are working with me all 1:58:53.040 --> 1:58:55.680 day long. You know, every day I wake up and 1:58:55.720 --> 1:58:57.880 people are telling me God, I'm God, and people tell 1:58:57.960 --> 1:59:00.240 me I'm a ship head. You know, I could will 1:59:00.280 --> 1:59:05.320 whole Here's the story. Ten of the of of people 1:59:05.360 --> 1:59:11.280 on the planet are certifiably insane. The only problem is 1:59:11.280 --> 1:59:14.280 is you don't know what ten percent it is. It's 1:59:14.320 --> 1:59:17.360 like people who are like, oh, they seem totally reasonable, 1:59:17.560 --> 1:59:20.400 and then they like they get totally out of control. 1:59:20.480 --> 1:59:22.200 I mean, I can tell you a story after story 1:59:22.280 --> 1:59:24.240 after story, and you get to the point where you 1:59:24.320 --> 1:59:27.680 have to put a mode around yourself because you've had 1:59:27.720 --> 1:59:30.440 too many bad experiences. Either they have to be a 1:59:30.440 --> 1:59:33.080 famous person I know them or someone else knew them. 1:59:33.160 --> 1:59:38.960 Otherwise just too risky. And social media is the magnifying 1:59:39.040 --> 1:59:41.960 glass on the heat, you know, you know, intensifying the 1:59:42.000 --> 1:59:45.320 heat ray of insanity. Um, what did I feel like? 1:59:45.320 --> 1:59:48.520 I said, like, what is Bob leftarts think about? No, 1:59:48.720 --> 1:59:50.960 you gave me more direct ship without looking up. But 1:59:51.040 --> 1:59:54.840 the only reason it's important is not that ship, is 1:59:54.960 --> 1:59:59.040 that I assumed you'd be a dick on the screen 2:00:00.480 --> 2:00:12.040 and you're anything but understand like you know, you know, 2:00:12.200 --> 2:00:13.960 you know, I've been getting that my whole life. Man, 2:00:18.400 --> 2:00:22.280 So I do apologize. I don't have to apologize. People 2:00:22.280 --> 2:00:24.200 have said things they need to apologize for that was 2:00:24.240 --> 2:00:27.120 not you're expressing them being given me ship. It goes on, 2:00:27.440 --> 2:00:30.840 but as I say, completely in real life, a completely 2:00:30.880 --> 2:00:33.600 different person. It's like just you know, we could talk 2:00:33.640 --> 2:00:36.040 TV out infinitum. But I don't know. If you watch Bosch, 2:00:36.640 --> 2:00:40.720 this guyever, he's the story. He's really intense on the show. 2:00:41.240 --> 2:00:43.480 So I'm talking to him. I got you know, the 2:00:43.480 --> 2:00:45.480 guy was like a regular guy. I'm not saying he 2:00:45.640 --> 2:00:48.160 was wimpy whatever, but you can talk just like a 2:00:48.240 --> 2:00:50.840 talk to these people. It's just so funny how people 2:00:50.880 --> 2:00:53.240 are different. And then you know, then there are people 2:00:53.280 --> 2:00:56.200 who have a reputation for being assholes who are really assholes, 2:00:56.240 --> 2:01:01.120 but you don't cover that, certainly not. I'm like, Okay, 2:01:01.160 --> 2:01:05.360 thanks again guys for doing this. Okay, until next time. 2:01:05.440 --> 2:01:06.680 This is Bob Left sex